# Budgeting tips and personal austerity measures for expats??



## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

The news just seems to get worse and worse doesn't it? Spain announced it's austerity measures and now the UK will be announcing an emergency budget in a couple of weeks' time...there's far worse to come, as has been predicted for a long long time now and it seems that it will take years for the economy to recover. In fact they are saying in the UK that things will never be the same again...

A lot of the economies of old no longer exist - the cost of labour has long since overtaken the cost of the mass produced componentry and complete assemblies so that repairing your product is no longer a real option and is cheaper to throw away and buy new. This element of the consumer society will be very difficult to get away from and the only thing that is keeping it viable in today's crisis still is that the reduction of the consumer spending power is forcing costs down and making the unbranded goods market so much bigger, hence the emerging economies' (China for example) growth figures at a time when the western world's output figures are down the toilet. So no saving money fixing the old telly then. 

The newspapers have recently announced that public transport has seen a big increase in use. Clearly some people are saving on motoring costs. However, some of us out in the country have to use the car, albeit less of the pleasure driving especially things like driving somewhere to go for a walk - instead just go for that walk locally. The price of petrol/diesel is a bit of a mystery - not too long ago, the barrel of oil was at a similar price to today but petrol/diesel were 20%-30% less than today. So what's going on there then? This doesn't only ****** up my leisure drives, but is bound to sooner or later put pressure on the logistics costs of everything including food. Many reports already out about dairy farmers and fresh produce farmers who are barely breaking even. With additional costs of transport, pushing costs higher and supermarkets keeping prices low for the broke consumer to be attracted, it can only be a matter of time until productivity becomes negative and the farmers give up the ghost and join the dole queue. I personally believe this is the time when we will start seeing some real pain.....when prices simply have to go up in order for someone to produce/grow something.

So, how do we cope as expats on a day to day basis? Have your lives been affected and how are you managing to deal with running a home/family/work (if any) at the moment? Have you had to really tighten the purse strings and look perhaps to the way a couple of generations ago (post war perhaps) people tried to budget to make things go a little further in their struggles to keep a home? It may be that you bulk buy; you're shopping around for the best bargains you can possible find; simply doing without things that once you took for granted; having to change your lifestyle dramatically so that you can derive some pleasures albeit for little or no money?

Any tricks or tips you'd like to share?



Tallulah.x


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2010)

I have to say nothing seems to have changed for us, if anything life is getting better. New bars and restaurants seem to be opening locally, the newspapers have loads more jobs in them, people I talk to seem happier and claiming to be in similar situations. The amount of people out and about in the evening seems better than ever and all the bars/restaurants are jammed full of people.

I don't know what the fuss is all about


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2010)

I don't drive smoke drink nor work I have been aware of fluctuating prices in my local supermarkets which I go to by bicycle. I am buying less and throwing away less. My cava, cavair and prawns are still available so no worries lol

I do worry about the future, I do not know what will be yet so I may be in for a shock ! House manitenance that I cannot do may have to reply on relatives when they come down for holidays, they have seen the last of free ones. Work for their keep.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

ShinyAndy said:


> I have to say nothing seems to have changed for us, if anything life is getting better. New bars and restaurants seem to be opening locally, the newspapers have loads more jobs in them, people I talk to seem happier and claiming to be in similar situations. The amount of people out and about in the evening seems better than ever and all the bars/restaurants are jammed full of people.
> 
> I don't know what the fuss is all about


I have to say I agree with you Andy, maybe its a blip or maybe its the area we live in (which isnt far from you really) but in Alhaurin de la Torre, there are several new shops and bars opening up and a really great ice cream cafe which is to die for!!!! The town is heaving in the evenings with folk out and the bars full. My estate agent friends have just moved premises and have taken on a new chap as business seems to be picking up - its weird really when you read and here about these austerity measures and all around you seem to be saying something else????? That said, the schools around here are all closed tomorrow due to the civil servants strike, but Rubys teacher told the class that they're only doing it cos they want a day off????????

Jo xxxx


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

When we decided to move to Spain we did a 'worst case scenario' and based our plans on a 1:1 £/euro scenario so the current (but I fear temporary) surge in the £ has come as a pleasant surprise.
Our main expenditure is on rent for our villa as living in a rented house we could never want or afford to buy is our chief source of lifestyle pleasure and enjoyment here. We see that as a permanent luxury holiday so the other costs of living aren't as important as our rent which we managed to negotiate a 500 euro pcm cut in because of the rental property situation on the CDS. 
We do rely on our trusty 4x4 but don't really make long journeys so if we fill up in Gibraltar the tank will last six weeks or even more.
As for food.....if you are prepared to buy local produce and spend some time in the kitchen on preparation and cooking you can eat very well for a reasonable cost.
We rarely eat out as I am of the opinion that unless the restaurant is really really good then why not entertain yourselves and guests at home... but we have frequent guests who take us out to dinner. (We could be described as cheapskates I suppose).
We used to go to the cinema, to concerts and the opera very regularly in Prague but then it was comparatively cheaper there -best seats in the opera house £25!!!!) and a short journey away whereas here it would involve hours of travel to get entertainment of that quality. We compensate by spending a lot on tv and buying cheap new and second-hand books from Amazon. Reading by the pool is a great and reasonably inexpensive way to spend your time.
The real problem for us is low UK interest rates as this is THE major factor affecting our income. TBH what is bad for the UK is good for us. We need a strong £ and high interest rates which are the last thing the UK economy needs at this time. Self versus altruism.....
I feel for the many British immigrants here who are clearly suffering the double-whammy. It only goes to show the importance of very careful planning before deciding to move to Spain or anywhere outside the UK for that matter. 
We decided to live in the best house we could afford but if belts have to be tightened we have room to manoeuvre downwards and if push came to shove there are houses similar or better to the one we currently live in for a third of the rent we now pay in the region north-east of Malaga, which from what I've seen of it is beautiful. 
Tallulah's depiction of the current and future socio/economic scene is accurate but I would add a note of cautious optimism and say that the crash of 1929 and the immediate pre-war period was in most people's eyes far worse and much more hopeless as there was much less global co-operation and fewer sophisticated means of economic co-ordination. No IMF, G20, World Bank etc.
There is an old Chinese wish :'May you live in interesting times'. Well, you can say that again, although many people will be wishing that their lives would be less interesting and much more predictable and stable.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Some _slightly_ reassuring figures:

Ratio of debt to GDP 2009/10

UK..............................68%
Germany....................73%
France........................77%

UK average debt /GDP in the years 1900 - 1999...........................87%

And.....the current deficit stands at £156 bn but is £20bn less than predicted before the election.
£20bn is not an inconsiderable sum.....around 8%.


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2010)

Quite frankly, I'm nervous. We're a young couple just starting out and all this panic in the media is making me feel worse.

I'm on a three-figure-but-livable grant from October-May in Spain. My OH is a teacher, but unfortunately still just on the substitutions list. We were incredibly lucky this year as he managed to get a year-long maternity leave, but who knows what next year will bring us? Will he be "en paro" or working? We'll see. Either way, once we're into our apartment, we're really going to have to budget. Luckily, I like the taste of many of Dia's store brand products. (I'm fairly sure I don't want to know what's in them, though.) This year we've been going out to dinner on the weekends with his friends, but I'm thinking we've got to cut that back now that his salary has been cut. I haven't been clothes shopping but once this year. My big problem is my friend is getting married this summer, I'm in the wedding, and it's looking like it's going to be really expensive.  

I guess there is some good in this: If we ever make it out of this "fun" economic situation, I'll have learned some good budgeting skills in future good times!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

We're a young couple[just starting out and all this panic in the media is making me feel worse QUOTE

*That's understandable. One of the really tragic things about this recession is that your generation is going to pay for the excesses of my generation...the extravagant mortgages to buy unaffordable homes, the second mortgages to buy the fancy car or new kitchen, the wild weekends in Barcelona, New York etc. on the plastic....
(I hasten to say that I didn't partake in most of those things and anyway I've paid for what I consumed!!). 
The concept of a career or even secure job for life is a thing of the past for most people whether skilled artisan or professional*.



I guess there is some good in this: If we ever make it out of this "fun" economic situation, I'll have learned some good budgeting skills in future good times![/quote]

*And we may all come to realise that whilst a hair-shirt lifestyle has appeal to a very small number of fanatics, a good life can be had with a sense of moderation in our consumption and a knowledge that some of the best things in life really are free....or almost.*


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## jb44 (May 21, 2010)

Think most people will be looking at worst case scenario and what that will be,my guess OAP bus passes finished,winter fuel allowance finished along with tuition grants,maternity grants scaled back drastically,public sector pay,pensions all scaled back by a third,commutable pensions taxed at 40%,housing grants cut by a third...and here I am in Thailand where the buzz of the day if your over 65 and marry a Thai national,the British govt will give you a weekly grant of £56 a week,seems crazy.
When I lived in other countries I used to observe lessons being conducted by the locals on what benefits could be applied for on arrival in the UK,made me want to spit(on them too).That would be a good saving,stop giving any money to any immigrant,period.
As a future resident in Spain,and yes I speak Spanish,I'm looking forward to ending my days there (if I can afford it).


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

jb44 said:


> Think most people will be looking at worst case scenario and what that will be,my guess OAP bus passes finished,winter fuel allowance finished along with tuition grants,maternity grants scaled back drastically,public sector pay,pensions all scaled back by a third,commutable pensions taxed at 40%,housing grants cut by a third...and here I am in Thailand where the buzz of the day if your over 65 and marry a Thai national,the British govt will give you a weekly grant of £56 a week,seems crazy.
> When I lived in other countries I used to observe lessons being conducted by the locals on what benefits could be applied for on arrival in the UK,made me want to spit(on them too).That would be a good saving,stop giving any money to any immigrant,period.
> As a future resident in Spain,and yes I speak Spanish,I'm looking forward to ending my days there (if I can afford it).


Can you give me the name of the piece of legislation/welfare measure that gives Brits £56 a week for marrying a Thai national? I can't find anything about it on the net... Or are you referring to the additional married pensioners' allowance which you would get regardless of the nationality of the spouse?
You say that no money should be 'given ' to immigrants...to the best of my knowledge immigrants receive benefits only after working and earning NI contributions. And EU immigrants have the right to live in the UK just as you and I have the right to be an immigrant in Spain and you now have the right to be an immigrant in Thailand. Asylum seekers (and there's an issue that needs looking into as it is much abused) receive a basic living allowance as they are banned from employment pending the hearing of their cases.
In fact, net migration from the UK exceeds immigration into the UK. There is also the not inconsiderable point that to meet the pension and health needs of our ageing population we require working persons to pay taxes to fund these future requirements.
I wonder if you feel as strongly about the £billions owed in taxes and uncollected by HMRC?
As a past business owner and personal/corporate taxpayer I feel equally angry about benefit fraud and tax avoidance.
It's important to get facts right on this and other economic issues so I'd be interested in that £56 grant you mention. Does it only apply to British immigrants to Thailand and if so, why? What if a British citizen marries a citizen of, say, Sri Lanka? Does/he receive this benefit, do you know?


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## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

interesting topic .... I'll be back!


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## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

We are the creatures of our own (self) destruction. Britain didn't come out of the post war recession till the early sixties and then BOOOM! ... Beatles, Carnaby Street, television, advertising, mass consumerism ... and we haven't looked back.
It's a fact that one gets used to a certain 'standard' of living and, when a financial crisis hits you it's difficult to cut back (... not go to the bar for a drink? what would the neighbours think?...). 
In the good old days people would make their own preserves, but then it became easier (more convenient (!)) to buy it at the local supermarket. Now those skills have to be relearnt.
What about knitting & darning? It used to be a common occupation but now people would look down at you - as if massed produced stuff is better.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Tallulah said:


> A lot of the economies of old no longer exist - the cost of labour has long since overtaken the cost of the mass produced componentry and complete assemblies so that repairing your product is no longer a real option and is cheaper to throw away and buy new. This element of the consumer society will be very difficult to get away from and the only thing that is keeping it viable in today's crisis still is that the reduction of the consumer spending power is forcing costs down and making the unbranded goods market so much bigger, hence the emerging economies' (China for example) growth figures at a time when the western world's output figures are down the toilet. So no saving money fixing the old telly then.
> 
> Tallulah.x


Yes, the idea of repairing is getting very old fashioned, although it might be making a comeback with the crisis??? Certainly it's been mentioned on tv many a time that the places where you take clothes to altered are doing well, and also shoe repairers. In parts of Madrid, and in Bilbao in general you still get lots of repair shops. Over the years we've had a wallet sewn back up, the zip in a suitcase renewed, a moth eaten collar repaired, a smashed bone china ornament glued back together, a cool bag stitched up, an umbrella repaired...
This is a link to a talk about stuff, in general, and mentions the fact that nothing is built to last now, on purpose. It's very American (sorry halydia), and is obviously very biased, but it's interesting and entertaining too!
The Story of Stuff


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

mrpg9, that is available to anyone over 65 who has a wife under 50, I believe, even in the UK. i've seen reference to it on quite a few occasions most recently in the last 2 weeks . what it is / for I've no idea , but it definitely exists. I'll have a rummage around & see what I can find. 

I still think all benefits should be taxed after allowances of personal deductions, as they are here in Spain. As I've posted before why should someone working & on a low wage have to pay full council tax when his neighbour , on benefits of probably more, pay nothing ? 


This is it but it's being stopped from 2020 & the last claim had to be in by april 5th.

Men aged 65 or more who have a dependent wife under pension age have just a few weeks to claim an extra £57.05 a week. The claim must be in by April 5, 2010 to qualify. This Adult Dependency Increase will end in April 2020, but those who claim it now could get up to £30,000 in the 10 years that remain. You cannot claim for a wife who has any other state benefit or who has earnings, a personal pension or one from her job which total more than £64.30 a week. Download form BF225 at www. direct.gov.uk (put 'BF225' in search box)

From here ; Pension revolution: part one of a two-part special - Saga


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

gus-lopez said:


> mrpg9, that is available to anyone over 65 who has a wife under 50, I believe, even in the UK. i've seen reference to it on quite a few occasions most recently in the last 2 weeks . what it is / for I've no idea , but it definitely exists. I'll have a rummage around & see what I can find.
> 
> I still think all benefits should be taxed after allowances of personal deductions, as they are here in Spain. As I've posted before why should someone working & on a low wage have to pay full council tax when his neighbour , on benefits of probably more, pay nothing ?
> 
> ...


Thanks for that, gus. Presumably younger wives are high-maintenance...
I agree with you about taxing benefits. I just wish that HMRC would show a little more willingness to track down tax evaders...


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## owdoggy (Jul 23, 2008)

Oh please no!......... just get it spent!....enjoy yersel fer gawds sake!
How long have we got?.........we don't know...... it could be tomorrow (god forbid) so if you've got enough just to survive (even if you have to throttle back a tad) then look where you are & count your blessings......... and if you're lucky enough to have a bit spare..... then get out & enjoy yersel.

Eat, drink & be merry (or Mary....if that's your thing) for tomorrow we........well, who knows

Knitting? Repairing? ........ & the worst.....even gardening!!

No,no & thrice no!



Doggy


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

owdoggy said:


> Oh please no!......... just get it spent!....enjoy yersel fer gawds sake!
> How long have we got?.........we don't know...... it could be tomorrow (god forbid) so if you've got enough just to survive (even if you have to throttle back a tad) then look where you are & count your blessings......... and if you're lucky enough to have a bit spare..... then get out & enjoy yersel.
> 
> Eat, drink & be merry (or Mary....if that's your thing) for tomorrow we........well, who knows
> ...


That's a great philosophy if you've some dosh to start with, but if you haven't it's reckless. Some people have seen their pensions go down by almost _*two thirds*_. That can't be easy to live on, nor to live with.
It's no good crying over spilt milk, make hay while the sun shines, don't look a gift horse in the mouth (that's got nothing to do with anything by the way, but I just thought I'd throw it in!!) but don't be numpty about it


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> Thanks for that, gus. Presumably younger wives are high-maintenance...
> I agree with you about taxing benefits. I just wish that HMRC would show a little more willingness to track down tax evaders...


& do something about those who use,legally, tax avoidance schemes when they are sometimes taking billions every year & paying nothing.

Getting back on topic, yes since I haven't been working we've watched what we spend. We never went mad before but now I think about anything I want to spend on & as mary said the fact that there's no income on savings worth talking about & without income or a pension we're spending capital. Fortunately I worked on that assumption before we came out but what I didn't anticipate was the fact that the retirement ag might be raised !  Still as owdoggy says thare's no point worrying over something I can't control.


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## owdoggy (Jul 23, 2008)

Pesky Wesky said:


> That's a great philosophy if you've some dosh to start with, but if you haven't it's reckless. Some people have seen their pensions go down by almost _*two thirds*_. That can't be easy to live on, nor to live with.
> It's no good crying over spilt milk, make hay while the sun shines, don't look a gift horse in the mouth (that's got nothing to do with anything by the way, but I just thought I'd throw it in!!) but don't be numpty about it


But that's exactly my point, it's not reckless....it's a state of mind. A brief survey of most of the posters on here would throw up many things but reckless wouldn't be one of them. Most of you are intelligent folks (more than me) who are not going to drop yersels in it (innit.....sorry) but to be honest, sometimes, you seem to get so bogged down in the why's, wherefore's & what if's that enjoying what you've got seems to take a back seat when, and this is the kicker, you don't need dosh to do that.

& so endeth today's sermon.......I shall bid you all a good night and may fortune smile on you tomorrow........ & if it doesn't then tell it to f*** off & enjoy yourselves anyway.


Doggy


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## MaidenScotland (Jun 6, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Yes, the idea of repairing is getting very old fashioned, although it might be making a comeback with the crisis??? Certainly it's been mentioned on tv many a time that the places where you take clothes to altered are doing well, and also shoe repairers. In parts of Madrid, and in Bilbao in general you still get lots of repair shops. Over the years we've had a wallet sewn back up, the zip in a suitcase renewed, a moth eaten collar repaired, a smashed bone china ornament glued back together, a cool bag stitched up, an umbrella repaired...
> This is a link to a talk about stuff, in general, and mentions the fact that nothing is built to last now, on purpose. It's very American (sorry halydia), and is obviously very biased, but it's interesting and entertaining too!
> 
> The Story of Stuff[/QUO
> ...


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## jb44 (May 21, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> Can you give me the name of the piece of legislation/welfare measure that gives Brits £56 a week for marrying a Thai national? I can't find anything about it on the net... Or are you referring to the additional married pensioners' allowance which you would get regardless of the nationality of the spouse?
> You say that no money should be 'given ' to immigrants...to the best of my knowledge immigrants receive benefits only after working and earning NI contributions. And EU immigrants have the right to live in the UK just as you and I have the right to be an immigrant in Spain and you now have the right to be an immigrant in Thailand. Asylum seekers (and there's an issue that needs looking into as it is much abused) receive a basic living allowance as they are banned from employment pending the hearing of their cases.
> In fact, net migration from the UK exceeds immigration into the UK. There is also the not inconsiderable point that to meet the pension and health needs of our ageing population we require working persons to pay taxes to fund these future requirements.
> I wonder if you feel as strongly about the £billions owed in taxes and uncollected by HMRC?
> ...




Sorry I did not get back to you sooner but internet connection went down. Think your question regarding the name of the benefit has been answered,I avoided marriage here in Thailand simply because it would upset my other 10 Thai girlfriends,now there's devotion.
You think there exits a level playing field when another EU national applies for benefits/housing in another EU country?,think I would investigate that further.

As for non-paying tax I would say good luck to them if they are smart enough to get away with it,least it stops all the spongers arriving in the UK getting it.

I think the Euro is finished,and the EU will unwind itself in a few more years to come,and that will be a better thing that exists now,back to a visa regime where you have to provide proof of income/work to live in that country.

Immigrants as you put it are entiltled to benefits after 12 months,not if they arrive with bag and baggage ie wife and children get it from day one. Now 30 years is what it takes to get get full OAP benefits not 44 years for a man (40 for a woman),that benefits new arrivals.

I am not an immigrant in Thailand ,I have to have a visa,that in itself is insettling,just wish the east Europeans in the UK had to have one,I find the further you proceed east into the EU the bigger the pig gets,and as you state immigration and migration are balancing out,but look who are the net arrivals into the UK ,yes the pigs,when I look at the court appearances in my own town in the UK it comprises of virtually 50% of people with east European names

I could go on and on,but lets cut this short,for an aging population I find the Thais and Filipinos are the worlds best,and intend to export a couple to look after my aging body eventually in Spain if I am allowed.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

I think a beastie from Harry Potter has wandered on this thread...


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

jb44 said:


> As for non-paying tax I would say good luck to them if they are smart enough to get away with it,least it stops all the spongers arriving in the UK getting it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




So you want to be an immigrant in Spain? And bring some of these useful little people with you? Now why didn't we all think of that?
Don't you see the irony in what you are saying? You go as an immigrant to a poor country where a few £ make you the big man and buy the locals to wipe your dribble when you're old and feeble but you object to people coming to the UK,working and contributing to your pension...???
And what's the difference between cheating on tax and cheating on benefits?

As for your statement that East Europeans make up 50% of court appearances....I doubt very much that it's that high. Most will be for comparatively minor offences. Now, tax avoidance, which you think is OK, is a much more serious offence. 

Thailand has more than its fair share of immigrant sleazeballs. Gary Glitter springs to mind. Whenever I think of these countries (Philipines, Thailand) I think of sex tourism and sad old men buying young women who wouldn't look at them twice if they weren't so poor.
Ugh


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Oh please no!......... just get it spent!....enjoy yersel fer gawds sake!
How long have we got?.........we don't know...... it could be tomorrow (god forbid) so if you've got enough just to survive (even if you have to throttle back a tad) then look where you are & count your blessings......... and if you're lucky enough to have a bit spare..... then get out & enjoy yersel. QUOTE: Doggy

I agree with you in theory but childhood memories of watching my widowed mum having to count the pennies tend to bring out feelings of prudence....
I posted last year about my Auntie Nellie in Canada, now 86 and living like a 60-year-old. When my Uncle Earl retired they sold their large home, rented a nice apartment and embarked on a European tour. That was over twenty years ago and was quite revolutionary then. But their children, my two cousins, both had homes and careers of their own and didn't need or expect an inheritance.
That's what we've done - sold all our property and are spending it before we pop off. I don't approve of large inheritances -where's the incentive to improve yourself? 
The 'problem' with mending, making cakes etc. is that in richer countries it's often cheaper to buy new or ready-made as labour costs are high. Our economies depend on throw-away and buy new, as Taly said.
Quality of life, real quality, often comes if not for free then as an add-on, I've found. We sit on our terrace late in the evening after walking Our Little Azor by the rio (now rapidly becoming an arroyo), inhale the scent of the flowers in the garden and look out over the pool and the lawn towards the sea, hearing the family chatter of our neighbours...
OK, we had to spend more on rent to get all this but to us it means more than having more disposable income to spend on a flash new convertible, new designer gear every other week and expensive nights out in clubs, bars and restaurants.
We had enough of the rat race in the UK and the day we left all that behind was the best day of my life.
Viva Espana indeed!!!!


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## Nignoy (Jun 4, 2010)

*not a legislation*



mrypg9 said:


> Can you give me the name of the piece of legislation/welfare measure that gives Brits £56 a week for marrying a Thai national? I can't find anything about it on the net... Or are you referring to the additional married pensioners' allowance which you would get regardless of the nationality of the spouse?
> You say that no money should be 'given ' to immigrants...to the best of my knowledge immigrants receive benefits only after working and earning NI contributions. And EU immigrants have the right to live in the UK just as you and I have the right to be an immigrant in Spain and you now have the right to be an immigrant in Thailand. Asylum seekers (and there's an issue that needs looking into as it is much abused) receive a basic living allowance as they are banned from employment pending the hearing of their cases.
> In fact, net migration from the UK exceeds immigration into the UK. There is also the not inconsiderable point that to meet the pension and health needs of our ageing population we require working persons to pay taxes to fund these future requirements.
> I wonder if you feel as strongly about the £billions owed in taxes and uncollected by HMRC?
> ...


If you have been legally married to a foreign bride for a minimum of 3years no matter what country you are living in, it is an additional pensioners spousal allowance, it is not easy to migrate to thailand, unless you have a thai partner, even then you must have a permanent 6500 pound deposit in a thai bank account, you are not allowed to buy a house or a car it usually gets registered in your partners or a limited thai company of which you own shares, you have no rights as a foreign national living in thailand, you are seen as milk cow for the thai authorities especially the police, but enuf about wonderful thailand, I lived there for a total of 6 years , as far as benefit fraud goes look a bit nearer home there are literally 10,s of thousands living and working overseas and claiming full benefits as unemployed from the UK, I dont know how it is for genuine age pensioners in spain ,but uk pensioners registered as living in countries like australia ,thailand or malaya, have 
their pensions frozen at the basic rate from day, no extras no raise to counter the rise in the cost of living, there are pensioners registered as living in uk , running flourishing housesitting and maintenance company,s in spain france and portugalit is always the genuine pensioners who have worked all their lives and do everything by the book who seem to have to suffer because of the cheats


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## jb44 (May 21, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> [/I][/B]
> 
> So you want to be an immigrant in Spain? And bring some of these useful little people with you? Now why didn't we all think of that?
> Don't you see the irony in what you are saying? You go as an immigrant to a poor country where a few £ make you the big man and buy the locals to wipe your dribble when you're old and feeble but you object to people coming to the UK,working and contributing to your pension...???
> ...




Do you see the irony in what WHAT you are saying?you seem to paranoid about tax avoidance,good for you,do something about it then, more openly ,write to the press etc instead of letting off steam on web sites that probably attract a couple of dozen peepers at most .



Personally I do not give a hoot what a decripit old git thinks of Thailand or anywhere else for that matter,tax included, if you want to dribble dribble wherever ,not bothered,
Yes a few £s goes a long way here,but not the reason I'm here,when you say sad,I have to admit I have not seen one sad old man in all the time I have been here,fact is they all seem to be having a ball and good for them,we only live once,go on enjoy it,do not go to your grave anguishing over lost tax receipts,by the way I retired at 49 years of age,now try living in the UK for any length of time after that,not for me,thank you.
If sex tourism is the first thing that springs to your mind when countries such as Thailand or the Philippines are mentioned then its you that's the sad old git,you obviously have never been to these countries,and obviously believe everything you read!!,good on you. Me ,I enjoy every day I'm here,but I would not call this a sustainable place,Spain would be where I would put roots down ,and yes if possible I would bring some of these lovely ladies with me.

Again about east Europeans,if you care to read todays newspapers talk of
a block put on them in the future coming to the UK I wonder why that is?,but oh dear ! I'm reading it,better watch my pension .

Have a good day, but somehow I do not think you will LOL


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Where's that poster from Shinyandy
Don't feed the troll...


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## jb44 (May 21, 2010)

Nignoy said:


> If you have been legally married to a foreign bride for a minimum of 3years no matter what country you are living in, it is an additional pensioners spousal allowance, it is not easy to migrate to thailand, unless you have a thai partner, even then you must have a permanent 6500 pound deposit in a thai bank account, you are not allowed to buy a house or a car it usually gets registered in your partners or a limited thai company of which you own shares, you have no rights as a foreign national living in thailand, you are seen as milk cow for the thai authorities especially the police, but enuf about wonderful thailand, I lived there for a total of 6 years , as far as benefit fraud goes look a bit nearer home there are literally 10,s of thousands living and working overseas and claiming full benefits as unemployed from the UK, I dont know how it is for genuine age pensioners in spain ,but uk pensioners registered as living in countries like australia ,thailand or malaya, have
> their pensions frozen at the basic rate from day, no extras no raise to counter the rise in the cost of living, there are pensioners registered as living in uk , running flourishing housesitting and maintenance company,s in spain france and portugalit is always the genuine pensioners who have worked all their lives and do everything by the book who seem to have to suffer because of the cheats


..but foreigners do buy houses and cars in Thailand,they bend the rules,but that is up to them,you can certainly buy a condo in a foreign name,and as for frozen pensions,get an out of season cheap flight to the UK,set foot in the UK,show the DSS your'plane ticket and get the uplift to whatever is the present rate.

I have had enough of living in the far east now anyway India Vietnam Malaya are all good for a year or two,def do not want to return to the UK,but may try Florida,but visa issue is the problem there.


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

c'mon let's not be harsh with each other here. I'm certain Mary did not mean it in that way at all - it's been quite a hot topic in the past on the forum, tax issues, and I think that was what she was referring to in her post really.

Let's be nice cos the weather is crap.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Nignoy said:


> If you have been legally married to a foreign bride for a minimum of 3years no matter what country you are living in, it is an additional pensioners spousal allowance, it is not easy to migrate to thailand, unless you have a thai partner, even then you must have a permanent 6500 pound deposit in a thai bank account, you are not allowed to buy a house or a car it usually gets registered in your partners or a limited thai company of which you own shares, you have no rights as a foreign national living in thailand, you are seen as milk cow for the thai authorities especially the police, but enuf about wonderful thailand, I lived there for a total of 6 years , as far as benefit fraud goes look a bit nearer home there are literally 10,s of thousands living and working overseas and claiming full benefits as unemployed from the UK, I dont know how it is for genuine age pensioners in spain ,but uk pensioners registered as living in countries like australia ,thailand or malaya, have
> their pensions frozen at the basic rate from day, no extras no raise to counter the rise in the cost of living, there are pensioners registered as living in uk , running flourishing housesitting and maintenance company,s in spain france and portugalit is always the genuine pensioners who have worked all their lives and do everything by the book who seem to have to suffer because of the cheats


I agree 100% with what you have said about benefit cheats in Spain. I personally know of an able-bodied British person who is claiming invalidity benefit . He travels regularly to the UK for appointments with the relevant agencies and finances these trips by selling tobacco etc. purchased in Gibraltar.
His benefit income is supplemented by work on the black economy. It would seem thare are tens of thousands of these spongers in Spain and doubtless elsewhere.
And yes, it is scandalous that the pensions of people living in former Commonwealth countries are frozen. That should be brought in line with others NOW.
So far as I am aware there is no rule -or indeed reason -preventing people who have retired and receive a basic state pension from working in Spain or indeed anywhere. Basic pension is a paid-for entitlement not a hand-out, as is SERPS. Extra benefits such as housing benefit are a different matter and if people are claiming whilst working then yes, that is fraud, whether in the UK or elsewhere..
I know of people in the UK who have retired at age 60 and receive a Basic State Retirement pension plus private occupational pension who are still working and why not? If they are in the public sector there will be a limit to what they can earn as additional income after which their occupational pension will be affected. They will be taxed on their incomes like everyone else.
Pensions are after all deferred income and not at all in the same category as other benefits such as Housing Benefit, Child Benefit etc.
As for wonderful Thailand......I know many British people, professionals and business people, are successful -legally -and contribute to the well-being of the Thai economy as well as themselves. But Thailand has acquired an unfortunate image as a sex tourism destination where the desperate and the perverted can buy their pleasures for the equivalent of a few £. You can't blame the Thai authorities for taking measures to protect themselves. £6500 is not a great amount of money these days, really. 
Some EU countries -and non-EU countries -impose similar requirements on would-be immigrants. I had to prove sufficient income and capital before I was given residence in the Czech Republic. I bought a property in Canada...but that did not give me right of permanent abode and I doubt whether I would have got it as although I have family and am fluent in French I don't possess the skills that are in short supply there.
The UK, along with ROI, were the only two EU states to allow unlimited immigration from the new EU entrants in 2004. Why? Because of pressure from employers. Employers and middle-class people have benefitted from the cheap, skilled industrious Poles and other Eastern Europeans. The Polish plumber, Slovak nanny, Czech electrician have all made life easier and cheaper for the middle classes. Low wages for willing workers have benefitted employers especially in the agricultural sector.
The losers are, as always, low paid working-class people whose wages have been undercut and whose towns and public services have been changed beyond recognition. Nasty parties like the BNP and misguided ill-informed individuals blame the immigrants and not the system that encouraged it.
A cap has now been put on the newest EU arrivals -Bulgaria, Romania etc. When there are 5 million UK citizens economically inactive it's time some of them at least were compelled to get off benefits and do the work.


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

well, the weather is cold and wet so in true austerity measure form I shall be making an enormous batch of soup for lunch and freezing the rest.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Tallulah said:


> well, the weather is cold and wet so in true austerity measure form I shall be making an enormous batch of soup for lunch and freezing the rest.


Its a beautiful day here, altho there is heavy rain forecast for tomorrow - Most of Spain is gonna be getting it over the next 48 hours apparently!???

Jo xxx


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

They were saying on 1 this morning that there's a 20 degree difference between this week and last week all over Spain. I might just have to put the fire on!!

xxx


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

jb44 said:


> ..but foreigners do buy houses and cars in Thailand,they bend the rules,but that is up to them,you can certainly buy a condo in a foreign name,and as for frozen pensions,get an out of season cheap flight to the UK,set foot in the UK,show the DSS your'plane ticket and get the uplift to whatever is the present rate
> .


Says it all. Troll poster, Andy!!!
Tally....it's 33C plus in the shade just south of Marbella..../


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Hey you lot, how about we stick to the topic subject and keep our dignity??? With respect I dont give a hoot what goes on in Thailand, neither, I'm sure does the OP!!! There is a Thailand section on the forum you know??!!

Jo xxx


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

...... in case you havent guessed, I'm having a grumpy day today 

Jo xxx


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

Tallulah, on the one hand I can see where andy & jo are coming from when they say that there doesn't seem to be much change in the situation. It's similar here where although some business's are closing there are just as many opening & out & about recently I've paid particular attention to this & there are just as many people spending as before . I've also been quite surprised at how many people are in the car dealers here ! Makes me wonder whether it's the 54 billion of black money they're all spending. Even my neighbours , whilst telling you how bad it is are still investing money in new tractors, + all the equipment to go with it , building a new apartment for the daughter ( & I'm getting some work out of it :clap2: ) & 2 of the sons & the daughter are autonomo & have no work whilst dad is a pensioner !!

Mary, whilst searching for that info. yesterday I came across some more unbelievable info. in that if you are a man, younger than 60, of any age , married to a woman who is in receipt of a state pension , you can legally retire & they will make the pension up in tax credits to approx. 200 pounds a week !! I stumbled across a man of 57 who had been made redundant & was receiving 60 pounds a week , job seekers allowance whilst looking for non-existant jobs who discovered this info. & tackled the staff @ the job centre who told him that yes it was true but that they were not allowed to tell people. So now he's legally retired & his wifes basic pension has been increased to 202 a week to support him.


I should have married an older woman! hwell:


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Right! You are supposed to be adults. I'm closing this thread cos its disappearing into the do's and dont's of Thailand!

Sorry Tally

Jo


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