# How many people are actually unsuccessful in securing a relevent job AT ALL?



## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

With all the negativity floating around the forum about how abysmal the job market in Australia is (especially for IT), I'm starting this thread to get an idea of how bad the situation actually is. I'm about to move next month, and would like to have alternate plans as well. I suppose it would help other forum members who are planning to immigrate in the near future. I'm by no means suggesting that the good folk here are lying or exaggerating, so please don't accuse me of doing that.

If you or someone you know experienced any of the following, please post here and describe what happened. 

1) Failed a to get a job in your (or their) area of expertise so took up a casual job, and have no plans of going back to your original profession.
2) Was particular about a job in your (or their) own field, was unable to get one, so returned to your (or their) home country.
3) The sorry state of the job market took such a toll on you (or them) that you (or they) attempted suicide, lost your sanity, went into depression etc.
4) Changed your (or their) profession and are now satisfied. 

I am personally considering only the above scenarios as 'failures' (4th point, not so much). Feel free to add something else, if you or someone you know went through it.


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## Varunmalhotra24 (Jan 28, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> With all the negativity floating around the forum about how abysmal the job market in Australia is (especially for IT), I'm starting this thread to get an idea of how bad the situation actually is. I'm about to move next month, and would like to have alternate plans as well. I suppose it would help other forum members who are planning to immigrate in the near future. I'm by no means suggesting that the good folk here are lying or exaggerating, so please don't accuse me of doing that.
> 
> If you or someone you know experienced any of the following, please post here and describe what happened.
> 
> ...


Apprecaite you starting this thread funkyzoom! I am as eager as you to hear people's experiences. I'm reaching Sydney in mid june and will start my job hunt then. Cheers!


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

Varunmalhotra24 said:


> Apprecaite you starting this thread funkyzoom! I am as eager as you to hear people's experiences. I'm reaching Sydney in mid june and will start my job hunt then. Cheers!


I appreciate your appreciation! 

I wanted to start this thread quite long back, but held the idea back until my tickets were booked. 

The opinions on the job market seems to be highly polarized, so I just want to know the EXTENT to which the state of the job market is affecting the concerned people.


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## rahulsingh$ (Jun 12, 2014)

I have been to Brisbane few months back and returned back to.India becoz of no.suitable job.I was in manufacturing industry in India.I was so much depressed with job scenario that I decided to return back.They want Australian experience.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

rahulsingh$ said:


> I have been to Brisbane few months back and returned back to.India becoz of no.suitable job.I was in manufacturing industry in India.I was so much depressed with job scenario that I decided to return back.They want Australian experience.


That's really sad to hear. Were you on a190 visa, which prevented you from trying for jobs in other states? Were you able to get interviews scheduled and then got rejected, or were you unsuccessful in getting interviews scheduled?


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## rahulsingh$ (Jun 12, 2014)

Actually I was on 489/visa.It was regional Queensland.I applied through seek,Gumtree and also by visiting personally. But, there was no response.I.have so many email received which says your application for job was unsuccessful. People change their name in Australia to find job.Australian employer want local experience and local names.But, I can't change my name.Its my identity.I have ielya score of 7.5.


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## rahulsingh$ (Jun 12, 2014)

And there is no such shortage of professions which they put on SOL.I was production manager in India and I applied 489/visa.But, there are no factories in Regional Qld.


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## BngToPerth (Apr 6, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> With all the negativity floating around the forum about how abysmal the job market in Australia is (especially for IT), I'm starting this thread to get an idea of how bad the situation actually is. I'm about to move next month, and would like to have alternate plans as well. I suppose it would help other forum members who are planning to immigrate in the near future. I'm by no means suggesting that the good folk here are lying or exaggerating, so please don't accuse me of doing that.
> 
> If you or someone you know experienced any of the following, please post here and describe what happened.
> 
> ...


When i was in 457 and working in Perth a year back. One of my room mate and couple of his friends were so frustrated that they are back after two years. While i will be going back in july on PR. Few things i observed in there case.

1) Don't start with places like Perth and South (especially if you are from IT) . Unless you are already getting some offer or you are from some domain like mining/ oil and gas.
2) IT jobs especially common niche area like Java, C# have plenty of the competition. So if you don't have any substantial thing to differentiate between yourself and others you will not get the job.
3) They had the casual jobs but the nature of casual jobs wont help you much and you will never feel settled.

On other side i have seen many people were able to get the job in my firm even though the company preferred the 457 guys, i found people joining in PR role in permanent positions. I tried to forward there resumes but they couldn't get the call because of domain issue.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

rahulsingh$ said:


> Actually I was on 489/visa.It was regional Queensland.I applied through seek,Gumtree and also by visiting personally. But, there was no response.I.have so many email received which says your application for job was unsuccessful. People change their name in Australia to find job.Australian employer want local experience and local names.But, I can't change my name.Its my identity.I have ielya score of 7.5.


I have heard people say that usually the recruiters and employers prefer Permanent Residents or Australian citizens over other types of candidates. Maybe that was the reason why you faced issues.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

BngToPerth said:


> When i was in 457 and working in Perth a year back. One of my room mate and couple of his friends were so frustrated that they are back after two years. While i will be going back in july on PR. Few things i observed in there case.
> 
> 1) Don't start with places like Perth and South (especially if you are from IT) . Unless you are already getting some offer or you are from some domain like mining/ oil and gas.
> 2) IT jobs especially common niche area like Java, C# have plenty of the competition. So if you don't have any substantial thing to differentiate between yourself and others you will not get the job.
> ...


Thanks for sharing this! Much appreciated!
So how important is domain knowledge? I work in a startup where I don't have the luxury of sticking to a domain, since I have to do whatever my manager asks me to (irrespective of domain). As a result, I have now worked successfully on over 20 projects, most of them in different domains.
Most of the projects I worked on, had only 2 team members - a developer (me) and a tester. The load on me was immense. I was usually responsible for front end design, coding of business logic, database implementation and sometimes even unit testing. The tester handled integration testing, deployment and browser compatibility.


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## BngToPerth (Apr 6, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> Thanks for sharing this! Much appreciated!
> So how important is domain knowledge? I work in a startup where I don't have the luxury of sticking to a domain, since I have to do whatever my manager asks me to (irrespective of domain). As a result, I have now worked successfully on over 20 projects, most of them in different domains.
> Most of the projects I worked on, had only 2 team members - a developer (me) and a tester. The load on me was immense. I was usually responsible for front end design, coding of business logic, database implementation and sometimes even unit testing. The tester handled integration testing, deployment and browser compatibility.


I think you must show that as your plus points. If you have worked on the entire project from scratch to end, you can sell yourself as the person with individual contributor role. 
I think you should head to NSW and try your luck in some real good tech firms there looking for people like you.
You must be prepared for a intensive tech interview as you will be focusing on one .
Do you have evidences to support your claim like public git repo or your own tech blog. Participation in some hackathons or may be stackoverflow contributor kind of guy. 
Many people here are 10+ experience and are looking for domain + not so intensive tech role, more of services kind of work. Which gets outsourced to place we are coming from. So if you are really techie few firms would be interested in you irrespective of what this forum and people say.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

BngToPerth said:


> I think you must show that as your plus points. If you have worked on the entire project from scratch to end, you can sell yourself as the person with individual contributor role.
> I think you should head to NSW and try your luck in some real good tech firms there looking for people like you.
> You must be prepared for a intensive tech interview as you will be focusing on one .
> Do you have evidences to support your claim like public git repo or your own tech blog. Participation in some hackathons or may be stackoverflow contributor kind of guy.
> Many people here are 10+ experience and are looking for domain + not so intensive tech role, more of services kind of work. Which gets outsourced to place we are coming from. So if you are really techie few firms would be interested in you irrespective of what this forum and people say.


Thanks for the input!
Unfortunately, I don't have any of those you mentioned, to prove my skills. All I have are Microsoft certifications (I'm a.NET developer)and a referral letter from my employer (which i got for ACS assessment) which states that I do end-to-end development. 
My Microsoft certifications do cover several different aspects of development, so I just hope they can bail me out.


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## atmahesh (Apr 9, 2014)

subscribing.


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## Ben-HH (Jan 8, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> With all the negativity floating around the forum about how abysmal the job market in Australia is (especially for IT), I'm starting this thread to get an idea of how bad the situation actually is. I'm about to move next month, and would like to have alternate plans as well. I suppose it would help other forum members who are planning to immigrate in the near future. I'm by no means suggesting that the good folk here are lying or exaggerating, so please don't accuse me of doing that.
> 
> If you or someone you know experienced any of the following, please post here and describe what happened.
> 
> ...


Hey Funky

what a sad and discouraging thread. I think I know from your previous threads/posts that you are quite nervous/desperate about your job hunt but what is the point in sharing the bad news? I do not really get it. If I would be in your shoes I would start a "positive thread" asking who has been SUCCESSFUL in securing a job and try to find out how and why...

Anyway, just a thought


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

Ben-HH said:


> Hey Funky
> 
> what a sad and discouraging thread. I think I know from your previous threads/posts that you are quite nervous/desperate about your job hunt but what is the point in sharing the bad news? I do not really get it. If I would be in your shoes I would start a "positive thread" asking who has been SUCCESSFUL in securing a job and try to find out how and why...
> 
> Anyway, just a thought


Please don't get me wrong. I'm still positive. Actually, this thread was meant as a sarcastic reply to all those members here who spread negativity all around and claim to be realistic. I wanted to see to what extent these people were affected. But as you see, hardly anyone who are famous for negative posts here, have replied to this thread! 

Also, since I only have very few days before I immigrate, I admit that I'm slightly nervous and pessimistic, although my enthusiasm still remains the same. Perhaps my current state of mind was also partially responsible for me starting this thread, but that may be just around 5%. My main goal was definitely to be sarcastic, and also see if the so called people who suffered without jobs for months or years, would actually care to post here. As we can see, until now they haven't, and I doubt if they ever will!

P.S. I'm talking about the 'habitual' pessimists here, not the couple of people who have posted issues.


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## Ben-HH (Jan 8, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> Please don't get me wrong. I'm still positive. Actually, this thread was meant as a sarcastic reply to all those members here who spread negativity all around and claim to be realistic. I wanted to see to what extent these people were affected. But as you see, hardly anyone who are famous for negative posts here, have replied to this thread!
> 
> Also, since I only have very few days before I immigrate, I admit that I'm slightly nervous and pessimistic, although my enthusiasm still remains the same. Perhaps my current state of mind was also partially responsible for me starting this thread, but that may be just around 5%. My main goal was definitely to be sarcastic, and also see if the so called people who suffered without jobs for months or years, would actually care to post here. As we can see, until now they haven't, and I doubt if they ever will!
> 
> P.S. I'm talking about the 'habitual' pessimists here, not the couple of people who have posted issues.


Good luck for your job hunt! Have you set yourself a time limit?


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

Ben-HH said:


> Good luck for your job hunt! Have you set yourself a time limit?


Thank you!

Yeah, my time limit is 2 months, because I only have enough savings to last me 2 months in Oz. Also, my unpaid leave is only for 2 months. If I try hard, it may be possible to extend the unpaid leave by one more month, and also stretch the money to last for that extra month.


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## Expecting189 (Oct 12, 2014)

funkyzoom said:


> Please don't get me wrong. I'm still positive. Actually, this thread was meant as a sarcastic reply to all those members here who spread negativity all around and claim to be realistic. I wanted to see to what extent these people were affected. But as you see, hardly anyone who are famous for negative posts here, have replied to this thread!
> 
> Also, since I only have very few days before I immigrate, I admit that I'm slightly nervous and pessimistic, although my enthusiasm still remains the same. Perhaps my current state of mind was also partially responsible for me starting this thread, but that may be just around 5%. My main goal was definitely to be sarcastic, and also see if the so called people who suffered without jobs for months or years, would actually care to post here. As we can see, until now they haven't, and I doubt if they ever will!
> 
> P.S. I'm talking about the 'habitual' pessimists here, not the couple of people who have posted issues.


Hey Funkyzoom,

Appreciate the thought behind the thread, subscribing now!
Wish you all the best for your job hunt.
Get a job soon and prove the Cynics wrong once and for all, God Bless.


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## tdotguy (May 22, 2015)

I wanted to give a different spin to all the negativity I hear around here.

I'm from Canada, IT is hugely saturated here as well, with a lot of immigrants applying for IT jobs. I am a Lead Architect and am highly involved in the hiring process at my company. I sit in on interviews and developed both a coding test and a written test for candidates. I've been doing this for at least 2 years. Here is what it looks like from the viewpoint from someone who does the hiring:

- We get a lot of resumes for any open position we list. We're talking like 50+ resumes for an open position, all within a week of posting. Of these 50, we might get 3 - 5 that we deem "relevant". If you look at the Department of Industry Guide for 2015-2016:

http://www.industry.gov.au/industry/Office-of-the-Chief-Economist/SkilledOccupationList/Documents/2015Submissions/Department-of-Employment.pdf

The numbers numbers very closely correspond to the Australian job market for ICT. My first advice is to make sure your resume is up-to-date, and make sure it is relevant for what you are applying to. If it's not, it will more than likely go to the discard pile right away. We will put out a position such as ASP.NET MVC developer and we will get resumes with only C++ or SQL experience. 

- Also related to resume writing, we see tons of resumes. They all look the same. If you can make your resume stand out with a nice layout without being too distracting, this will help catch our eye. Also, make sure you proof your resume! Nothing worse than seeing spelling and grammatical errors. If we can spend time looking at resumes, you can spend time reviewing yours to make sure it doesn't contain these type of errors.

- If you're asked to code something, make sure it is code you would consider "production"-ready. I get so many coding solutions that have no comments, contain no logging, or are just completely un-organized/lazy junk code. These are immediately discarded as well.

- During the interview, we ask technical questions relevant to the open position. We get an awful lot of answers that show us that you are either:

a) Not prepared for the interview
b) Lying about your job duties on your resume
c) Not good at explaining technical stuff

All these are bad in their own way. a) is obviously very bad. Do some review prior to the interview, being prepared is the easiest thing you can do for an interview. b) is just as bad as a), if you lie, you might as well come clean. At least we will respect you. If you don't come clean, trust us, we will know. For c), this is bad because you need to be able to communicate in your day-to-day duties. If you cannot explain what you are doing, we don't want you. Sorry, but this is reality.

In general, in the interviews, we want you to relax, we want to see a passion for what you are doing, and we are looking for exceptional communication skills. We get a lot of immigrants for interviews, and I would say, one weakness is communication skills. We don't care about accents or where you are from, but we need to be able to understand what is going on in your brain. If you can't easily convey your thoughts, this is a huge deterrent for getting your job done.

I'm not saying there is a direct correlation to the Austrailian ICT market, but there are going to be an awful lot of similarities. While I would imagine, local experience is a huge asset in the ICT market, there are other factors involved in giving out interviews and jobs. You should re-assess your job hunting process and see if there is something you can do to enhance your chances.

I do not work for any type of recruitment company, I am in the same boat as many of you, attempting to immigrate to Australia as a Software Engineer. I just thought this might give a different perspective to job seekers.

Good luck with your job hunting!


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

Expecting189 said:


> Hey Funkyzoom,
> 
> Appreciate the thought behind the thread, subscribing now!
> Wish you all the best for your job hunt.
> Get a job soon and prove the Cynics wrong once and for all, God Bless.


Thank you for your encouraging words! I managed to get around 10 initial responses (calls/emails) within a fortnight of applying from India, and that too with an Indian number. None of them materialized into interviews for reasons beyond my control. 

But I suppose this is an encouraging sign, so I may be able to secure a job soon after moving to Oz.


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## zector (Oct 19, 2014)

Thanks tdotguy for sharing, I find this very helpful


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## Varunmalhotra24 (Jan 28, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> Thank you for your encouraging words! I managed to get around 10 initial responses (calls/emails) within a fortnight of applying from India, and that too with an Indian number. None of them materialized into interviews for reasons beyond my control.
> 
> But I suppose this is an encouraging sign, so I may be able to secure a job soon after moving to Oz.


Thats indeed a good sign funkyzoom, Im sure you will secure a job soon enough Good luck!


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## BngToPerth (Apr 6, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> Thanks for the input!
> Unfortunately, I don't have any of those you mentioned, to prove my skills. All I have are Microsoft certifications (I'm a.NET developer)and a referral letter from my employer (which i got for ACS assessment) which states that I do end-to-end development.
> My Microsoft certifications do cover several different aspects of development, so I just hope they can bail me out.


(.NET) is in good demand here, Since you are getting calls that means you have prepared resume in good way. All the best


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

tdotguy said:


> I wanted to give a different spin to all the negativity I hear around here.
> 
> I'm from Canada, IT is hugely saturated here as well, with a lot of immigrants applying for IT jobs. I am a Lead Architect and am highly involved in the hiring process at my company. I sit in on interviews and developed both a coding test and a written test for candidates. I've been doing this for at least 2 years. Here is what it looks like from the viewpoint from someone who does the hiring:
> 
> ...


Thanks a lot, these tips are massive! I'm pretty sure that irrespective of the ICT hiring process in Australia, these are general tips which are likely to be applicable anywhere in the world. 

I suppose this ridiculous 'lack of local experience' is my Achilles heel. Need to find a way to work around that, then I suppose I'm good to go!


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

Varunmalhotra24 said:


> Thats indeed a good sign funkyzoom, Im sure you will secure a job soon enough Good luck!


Thanks a lot! Much appreciated!


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

BngToPerth said:


> (.NET) is in good demand here, Since you are getting calls that means you have prepared resume in good way. All the best


Thank you! Yes, I do suppose my CV is attracting recruiters. I just hope I can get interviews scheduled, once I move!


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## josh.machine (Aug 4, 2011)

Well my inputs..
I am a PM who came here on a onsite deputation. I do get couple of contracting calls once in a while which i ignore as I am looking for a perm role.
I know couple of PM's who have struggled to find a job for the last one year in Brisbane and Sydney.
I am aware of a .Net developer who got a job within 1-2 months of arrival in Sydney.
I know a EDW, BI developer/analyst who found it hard to find a role for more than 6 months.
I know a PM with extensive local experience in Melbourne who struggled to find a role in 2013 for more than 10 months.


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## ajji117 (Apr 28, 2015)

Hi all,

May i know how is job market for SAP BI/BO 4.0, BODI 4.0 and Informatica 9.5.
I am having overall exp of 6yrs. 
My main exp is in SAP BI/BO reports development of 5yrs, 1 yr in ETL tools like BODI, Informatica.

thanks,
aj


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## josh.machine (Aug 4, 2011)

Not sure how to edit my previous post,
I know a SAP guy who has to keep moving between all major cities in Australia for 3-6 months contract which he seems to easily get as long as he is ready to keep moving.


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## BngToPerth (Apr 6, 2015)

josh.machine said:


> Not sure how to edit my previous post,
> I know a SAP guy who has to keep moving between all major cities in Australia for 3-6 months contract which he seems to easily get as long as he is ready to keep moving.


As per my experience all the mid developer role 5 - 8 years with some domain knowledge are easier to get than the roles like PM and Infra. The pay though is meager. And yes most of them are contract based.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

josh.machine said:


> Well my inputs..
> I am a PM who came here on a onsite deputation. I do get couple of contracting calls once in a while which i ignore as I am looking for a perm role.
> I know couple of PM's who have struggled to find a job for the last one year in Brisbane and Sydney.
> I am aware of a .Net developer who got a job within 1-2 months of arrival in Sydney.
> ...


I suppose it gets harder with seniority. It's usually quite tough for PMs to find a similar role in Oz. They need to settle for a designation below that, and work their way up from there.


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## josh.machine (Aug 4, 2011)

funkyzoom said:


> I suppose it gets harder with seniority. It's usually quite tough for PMs to find a similar role in Oz. They need to settle for a designation below that, and work their way up from there.


The lower role thing is only possible for people who are either playing dual roles or have been recently promoted. People like myself and other whom I know who have 4-5 years of PM experience cannot just go back to a lower role even if we wanted because we have simply lost touch!

Infact worse off are the students who come here for their Masters but never find a job after course completion and end up doing casual jobs in search of their elusive PR's.


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## JK684 (Apr 2, 2015)

Guys, any idea about the openings for DevOps engineers ?


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## ausmover (Oct 15, 2012)

1. I got my 1st job in Australia after 2 months, in the same domain as earlier, but it was a completely different skillset/ profile. My 2nd job is now a completely different domain, but skillset is "somewhat relevant" to my core skillset/ profile. 

Overall, I would still say I am not doing exactly what I wanted to do after coming here, and still need to re-align. But good news is that it is not a 180 degree misalignment to what I want to do, probably a 45 degree misalignment! 

Apart from mine, real stories from other friends I know:

Friend 1: He had J.P. Morgan experience from India and had niche skills in legal department of corporate banking. Got a permanent job in 3 weeks time at NAB! 

Friend 2. He is a Senior BA, and one of the best skilled people in his area, that I know of. Got a job in the 4th month. 

3: He is from Telecom BA domain with top Indian MNC experience. Tried to find job for 3 months, didn't succeed and then had to finally return back to India. 

4: Another Telecom Consultant: Got first job after 7 months! This friend showed a lot of courage, stuck around for 7 months somehow with all his savings on stake, managed to find a job and currently working for Telstra.

5. Another Senior Project Manager: Got a job in the Australian office of an Indian MNC, but now is being forced to return back to India as no projects for him in Australia.

So, we can see mixed experiences and it all depends from person-to-person.

Cheers
Ausmover


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## zector (Oct 19, 2014)

Congrats ausmover!
Mind if I ask what's your occupation? 
And how many interviews/calls did you get from how many companies?


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## josh.machine (Aug 4, 2011)

Forgot to add, 
Telecom Domain OSS BA/SA profile. Spent 2 months looking for a job and went back to his Indian job where he had taken log leave.


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## ausmover (Oct 15, 2012)

zector said:


> Congrats ausmover!
> Mind if I ask what's your occupation?
> And how many interviews/calls did you get from how many companies?


Hi Zector,

I am a Technical Business Analyst, primarily from Telecom domain background, but currently working in the Health & Medical domain.

For my 1st job in Australia, I managed to secure 5 interview calls in 2 months time but was able to convert only the 5th one. 

For my 2nd job, I got 1 interview call and secured it. 

Cheers
Ausmover


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## zector (Oct 19, 2014)

Thanks for the info Ausmover.
Hope I'll be as lucky as you when I do migrate


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## ausmover (Oct 15, 2012)

zector said:


> Thanks for the info Ausmover.
> Hope I'll be as lucky as you when I do migrate


All the best Zector!  .... Just be prepared, and have fall-back plans in place if things do not work out.

Cheers!


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## Alena123 (Mar 7, 2015)

How about indian CAs..accounting audit consultant finance accounts

I m making 15 lac here in india in a not much effort kind of job

I got experience with global names 

How it would b in Australia sydney

How much salary can I expect there


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## BngToPerth (Apr 6, 2015)

I went ahead and met my roomie from Australia who was back last month, to my surprise he says that he is just back for two months and will be heading back and he is into Healthcare and never liked IT (may be his words) , And earning better than IT salary that I was working on till last year.

So i have knowledge of 5 of my friends including him who are settled, rest 4 of them were from development background and had worked in 457 like me and went for a PR later.

All of them got jobs within two months in banks like CBA and NAB with development profile and similar domain.

Heading next month lets see what is stored for me.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

ausmover said:


> 1. I got my 1st job in Australia after 2 months, in the same domain as earlier, but it was a completely different skillset/ profile. My 2nd job is now a completely different domain, but skillset is "somewhat relevant" to my core skillset/ profile.
> 
> Overall, I would still say I am not doing exactly what I wanted to do after coming here, and still need to re-align. But good news is that it is not a 180 degree misalignment to what I want to do, probably a 45 degree misalignment!
> 
> ...



Exactly, every person's experiences varies. And I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that 'luck' is also a major factor!


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## josh.machine (Aug 4, 2011)

Luck is always a factor anywhere in the world in any phase of your life.


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## mujyaki (Dec 11, 2013)

josh.machine said:


> Luck is always a factor anywhere in the world in any phase of your life.


Good timing helps, but part of it is making your own luck. As one of my friends used to say - "you're always in the right place at the right time."

Great thread- my potential grant is on hold as it appears they're out of visas for this fiscal year. I'm hoping for good news in July, and would then plan on heading to Melbourne in November. I'd be happy with contract positions to start, as I like the flexibility. Perhaps I'd look for a perm role eventually.


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## Expecting189 (Oct 12, 2014)

BngToPerth said:


> I went ahead and met my roomie from Australia who was back last month, to my surprise he says that he is just back for two months and will be heading back and he is into Healthcare and never liked IT (may be his words) , And earning better than IT salary that I was working on till last year.
> 
> So i have knowledge of 5 of my friends including him who are settled, rest 4 of them were from development background and had worked in 457 like me and went for a PR later.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the input, it is really good to hear something other than Doom and Gloom!
Wish you all the best for your job hunt next month, keep us posted.


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## tdotguy (May 22, 2015)

Have always believed that myself. You make your own luck. The people who seem to be in "the right place at the right time", put themselves in that position. Luck is only an illusion for timing.



mujyaki said:


> Good timing helps, but part of it is making your own luck. As one of my friends used to say - "you're always in the right place at the right time."
> 
> Great thread- my potential grant is on hold as it appears they're out of visas for this fiscal year. I'm hoping for good news in July, and would then plan on heading to Melbourne in November. I'd be happy with contract positions to start, as I like the flexibility. Perhaps I'd look for a perm role eventually.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

tdotguy said:


> Have always believed that myself. You make your own luck. The people who seem to be in "the right place at the right time", put themselves in that position. Luck is only an illusion for timing.


Well....'making our own luck' doesn't really work when employers are demanding 'local experience', especially when it is not at all needed for that particular role. I mean...no one can 'manufacture' local experience. Without getting hired, candidates can't get local experience. And without local experience, they can't get hired. In IT terms, it's similar to an infinite loop, with no specified exit condition! 

Of course, I didn't intend to be pessimistic, and I also know very well that local experience is usually not the deal breaker that it is made out to be.


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## Expecting189 (Oct 12, 2014)

Disclaimer: I am still in India, hundreds of miles away from where these discussions are focused at. I am not an authority on this subject, so anyone who knows / claims to know better please don't read any further.



funkyzoom said:


> ....and I also know very well that local experience is usually not the deal breaker that it is made out to be.


I agree with what you mentioned here. From all that I have read and learned from friends, acquaintances, etc. it seems that quite often 'lacking local experience' is a sugar coated way for the recruiter saying 'we found a better candidate' or 'you were not as good as your resume stated'. Had 'Local Experience' really been a deal breaker no migrant would have ever got a job.

I personally know of people who have got jobs in testing, .Net, Java, networking, etc. Some got it within few weeks while many had to struggle. I also know of some who are still struggling. 
Most of the ones who got a job early were through 'referrals' (nothing new here). 
I recently got to know of an interesting case. Someone, who I know is technically quite strong, is still struggling (its been almost three months now) and another guy (not sure about his technical acumen) has got a job within a month (both have similar profiles). Call it 'Luck', 'Talent', 'Marketing / Presentation skills' or whatever, the fact is that some are getting jobs whereas some are not.
It is the classic case of 'call the glass half empty or half full' .....your call!


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

Expecting189 said:


> Disclaimer: I am still in India, hundreds of miles away from where these discussions are focused at. I am not an authority on this subject, so anyone who knows / claims to know better please don't read any further.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, correct! References do play a huge role, but I don't suppose it is 'impossible' even without references. 
If local experience is really an issue, why would employers/recruiters even bother calling the candidate or scheduling an interview, when the CV clearly mentions that he/she only has overseas work experience? If local experience is that important, they can simply choose to ignore the CV. So like you said, it just means the recruiter/employer is trying to be 'polite' by hiding the actual reason.
A classic example of this, would be a person with average English communication skills, paying to get his resume written professionally. The recruiters may be satisfied by his resume, but after meeting him in person they realize that his communication skills aren't good, and hence reject him for 'lack of local experience'.


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## kettlerope (Aug 12, 2014)

funkyzoom said:


> With all the negativity floating around the forum about how abysmal the job market in Australia is (especially for IT), I'm starting this thread to get an idea of how bad the situation actually is. I'm about to move next month, and would like to have alternate plans as well. I suppose it would help other forum members who are planning to immigrate in the near future. I'm by no means suggesting that the good folk here are lying or exaggerating, so please don't accuse me of doing that.
> 
> If you or someone you know experienced any of the following, please post here and describe what happened.
> 
> ...


Funkyzoom,

Most common scenario among people here is missing among the cases you listed above:

5) Tried for a job in your field for months and still fighting with not many hopes. Casual job is not an option in this case.


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## kettlerope (Aug 12, 2014)

funkyzoom said:


> Thank you for your encouraging words! I managed to get around 10 initial responses (calls/emails) within a fortnight of applying from India, and that too with an Indian number. None of them materialized into interviews for reasons beyond my control.
> 
> But I suppose this is an encouraging sign, so I may be able to secure a job soon after moving to Oz.


You really seem to have some exceptional and rare skills. This isn't happening with anyone even in IT sector; I mean it's quite unheard of in the current job market for several reasons.


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## kettlerope (Aug 12, 2014)

funkyzoom said:


> I suppose it gets harder with seniority. It's usually quite tough for PMs to find a similar role in Oz. They need to settle for a designation below that, and work their way up from there.


Most of the HR managers don't hire you for positions much below levels since they feel insecure about your stability in the job. Also, on the other hand, you wouldn't like to falsify your resume so much to show that you never worked at a senior level when you actually did.


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## kettlerope (Aug 12, 2014)

mujyaki said:


> Good timing helps, but part of it is making your own luck. As one of my friends used to say - "you're always in the right place at the right time."


Well said. I generally have faith in this thought as well, but here in this situation, I fail to believe in it. Just imagine a situation that we are in. We are here in Australia when there are 20,000 skilled migrants (and their spouses) entering Australia every month (plus 457 visa holders, plus other visa holders such as 489, holiday working and so on, plus graduating local and international students in huge numbers) and on the other hand, there's hardly any new job creation as a percentage of these numbers in most of the fields which supposedly have 'shortage' of manpower and even government doesn't seem to be doing anything about curbing new influx. In this very situation, which can be the worst in the recent times, how can we say that we are in the right place in the right time??!! As I mentioned, I would tend to believe in it in the normal scenario, but I can't after seeing the situation here. Forget about practical experience of your being in Australia and trying for a job.. even a simple math of the numbers I mentioned above (that I haven't created myself) tells you that there's something seriously wrong with the job market and it's going to worsen fast unless it gets corrected sooner than later. I am not blaming anyone here nor I am exaggerating the situation even a bit. If you look around and speak to recruiters or HR managers or even read articles online, you will get enough proofs for the same - you just don't have to believe my words. 

Now, in the context of the forum, a lot of people will call it negativity since they believe, and rightfully so, that i) Negativity should be suppressed and discouraged and ii) We shouldn't even discuss the topics which are negative or beyond our control such as changes in migration policy or economic measures being undertaken to improve the situation. I personally don't agree with both of these beliefs as you must have seen in some other posts as well. In the current situation, I would label even 'conservative optimism' as 'too much optimism' because the market is really bad and it's gonna disappoint many of us eventually if we had too high hopes. Why not accept the facts beforehand as they are though it doesn't mean that we run away from the situation or don't try at all? Fake positivity or pretense is no good here. People come with high hopes and end up wasting significant amounts of money for months since even casual jobs are too competitive these days. And frankly, it's not even a question of competition, rather it's just a lack of jobs. I wonder what sort of competitive skills a person will need to work at Coles or Woolworths as a helper, which any of us skilled migrants with good English won't have!! Why can't an accountant or an IT engineer get even a data entry job despite tens of applications? I have no answers. The only answer I can think of is 'severe lack of jobs' in general. And if it is so, why fake optimism and running away from reality which is incidently negative in the current moment?? 

Media is gloomy about the economy too and amidst this all, it feels so good when we hear about things like 'Australia's free trade agreement with China' and so on.. stuff like this shows us a ray of hope! While we can't influence the government, small observations like this as to which steps are being taken to come outta the current situation, will really motivate many of us new migrants. It might sound a bit harsh, but honestly, I would expect visa caps for skilled migrants and students to get drastically reduced in the next years if the job market is to improve. Unless the influx of job seekers gets curbed, positivity and efforts alone won't help us all land with the jobs. Some of us will end up getting jobs in their field and keep clapping like they do, but the majority would keep struggling. It's no good for the migrants (and of course locals) as a whole. The reason is simple - increase in population seeking jobs can't go on without enough new jobs creation. Do I still sound negative? Come on, let's be logical. To put it in a rather simplistic manner, there should be at least 35 new jobs, if not more, for every new 100 migrants, which may still leave a whopping 65% of people unemployed but I wouldn't hesitate to call it a healthy competition for time being. We are currently nowhere even close to it from what I read and experience. Both ratios are extremely skewed. Jobs created are very few and job seekers are many and ever increasing, including me and you and all others here. I hope positivity can tackle this situation by itself. 

*PS: These are purely my observations and take them with a pinch of salt.*


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

kettlerope said:


> You really seem to have some exceptional and rare skills. This isn't happening with anyone even in IT sector; I mean it's quite unheard of in the current job market for several reasons.


I just got initial calls/email from recruiters. That's it. It just means my CV was good enough to attract their attention. 

My skills are neither rare nor exceptional, by the wildest stretch of imagination. They're pretty common. But I do have a dozen vendor certifications (not all of them are relevant) and a number of skills, which may probably set me apart.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

kettlerope said:


> Well said. I generally have faith in this thought as well, but here in this situation, I fail to believe in it. Just imagine a situation that we are in. We are here in Australia when there are 20,000 skilled migrants (and their spouses) entering Australia every month (plus 457 visa holders, plus other visa holders such as 489, holiday working and so on, plus graduating local and international students in huge numbers) and on the other hand, there's hardly any new job creation as a percentage of these numbers in most of the fields which supposedly have 'shortage' of manpower and even government doesn't seem to be doing anything about curbing new influx. In this very situation, which can be the worst in the recent times, how can we say that we are in the right place in the right time??!! As I mentioned, I would tend to believe in it in the normal scenario, but I can't after seeing the situation here. Forget about practical experience of your being in Australia and trying for a job.. even a simple math of the numbers I mentioned above (that I haven't created myself) tells you that there's something seriously wrong with the job market and it's going to worsen fast unless it gets corrected sooner than later. I am not blaming anyone here nor I am exaggerating the situation even a bit. If you look around and speak to recruiters or HR managers or even read articles online, you will get enough proofs for the same - you just don't have to believe my words.
> 
> Now, in the context of the forum, a lot of people will call it negativity since they believe, and rightfully so, that i) Negativity should be suppressed and discouraged and ii) We shouldn't even discuss the topics which are negative or beyond our control such as changes in migration policy or economic measures being undertaken to improve the situation. I personally don't agree with both of these beliefs as you must have seen in some other posts as well. In the current situation, I would label even 'conservative optimism' as 'too much optimism' because the market is really bad and it's gonna disappoint many of us eventually if we had too high hopes. Why not accept the facts beforehand as they are though it doesn't mean that we run away from the situation or don't try at all? Fake positivity or pretense is no good here. People come with high hopes and end up wasting significant amounts of money for months since even casual jobs are too competitive these days. And frankly, it's not even a question of competition, rather it's just a lack of jobs. I wonder what sort of competitive skills a person will need to work at Coles or Woolworths as a helper, which any of us skilled migrants with good English won't have!! Why can't an accountant or an IT engineer get even a data entry job despite tens of applications? I have no answers. The only answer I can think of is 'severe lack of jobs' in general. And if it is so, why fake optimism and running away from reality which is incidently negative in the current moment??
> 
> ...


Well....to be frank, what you say here may be accurate for the situation in Australia a few months ago. But the people in Australia (not a lot of them, though) have been mentioning the the IT job market is gaining momentum, and the signs are positive. There are a lot of people actually quitting permanent IT jobs to seek better jobs (in IT itself), which means there are jobs being created.
And it is not usually true that PRs are competing with 457 and 489 Visa holders. My friend in Melbourne was rejected for several jobs ONLY because he didn't have a PR (He was on a graduate Visa). He did manage to eventually get a job, though. And he is yet to get his PR. I know of several other instances too, where PRs were preferred. The types of jobs for temporary Visa holders and PRs are, to a large extent, mutually exclusive. It is very unlikely that they have to 'compete' with each other. 

Of course, this is just my observation. I may be wrong, but I'd like to believe I'm right, at least until I have landed in Australia and have seen for myself, what the situation is like.


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## josh.machine (Aug 4, 2011)

funkyzoom you are right, I have especially seen an upswing in Sydney in the last 2 months. And yes PR holders do not compete with 457 but 457 does eat into a lot of jobs which would had gone to PR holders without competition.


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## JK684 (Apr 2, 2015)

I am yet to get the grant. But I applied for 3-4 jobs through Seek and mentioned in the resume that I will get PR grant soon , one recruiter contacted me through e-mail and told me to contact her once I get the PR, 

and she was also asking if I am planning to come to Australia once I get the PR or search jobs from India.


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## HarishNair2015 (Feb 23, 2015)

Mind telling me your skillset? 



JK684 said:


> I am yet to get the grant. But I applied for 3-4 jobs through Seek and mentioned in the resume that I will get PR grant soon , one recruiter contacted me through e-mail and told me to contact her once I get the PR,
> 
> and she was also asking if I am planning to come to Australia once I get the PR or search jobs from India.


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## Appi (Jan 10, 2015)

May i ask the members posting here as to what is the situation of jobs for Electrical Engineers ?? I am hoping of getting my PR in next month and planning to move to perth. I have 5 years of experience in my field, What are the chances for getting a job in my stream ?? Which part is best for electrical engineers ?? 
As of now, Australia seems to have been invaded by IT, account and healthcare personal and have tough competition, what is the situation for other jobs here?


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## santoshpatil (Feb 4, 2014)

I do agree that when it comes to IT then there are opportunities out there (but of course competition as well)...but I don't know if it's the same for other sectors like accountants, construction, manufacturing etc.

And yes, I do see most of the job postings strictly looking for PR holders/citizens...so obviously the preference if to create jobs for people who are citizens/potential citizens. Every strong economy tries to achieve a balance between outsourcing and local job creation as outsourcing can neither be completing finishing nor can be relied too much upon.



josh.machine said:


> funkyzoom you are right, I have especially seen an upswing in Sydney in the last 2 months. And yes PR holders do not compete with 457 but 457 does eat into a lot of jobs which would had gone to PR holders without competition.


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## JK684 (Apr 2, 2015)

HarishNair2015 said:


> Mind telling me your skillset?


I am into DevOps consulting.


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## Arweny (May 29, 2015)

Thanks for all the responses here, very useful to see how job hunting really goes.
I am especially interested in the experience of BAs. I am planning to move in November as a BA with 7 years of experience. 
It would also be good to know how much time and effort people put into their job search, e.g. when someone got a job in 2 months, did they spend that 2 months with full-time job hunt? How many positions they applied for and how many interviews secured? I think that might be a better measure than the number of months.


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## santoshpatil (Feb 4, 2014)

Sorry to disappoint you, but November does not look to be good time to move to Australia. Dec-Jan is vacation time in Australia and recruitment is very less. You might need to re-think your travels to work around the Australian vacation time.



Arweny said:


> Thanks for all the responses here, very useful to see how job hunting really goes.
> I am especially interested in the experience of BAs. I am planning to move in November as a BA with 7 years of experience.
> It would also be good to know how much time and effort people put into their job search, e.g. when someone got a job in 2 months, did they spend that 2 months with full-time job hunt? How many positions they applied for and how many interviews secured? I think that might be a better measure than the number of months.


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## mujyaki (Dec 11, 2013)

santoshpatil said:


> Sorry to disappoint you, but November does not look to be good time to move to Australia. Dec-Jan is vacation time in Australia and recruitment is very less. You might need to re-think your travels to work around the Australian vacation time.


This is a good point - I too was considering heading to Australia in November - I may need to rethink this. I've heard July is a good time, as that's the new fiscal year and companies will have new budgets. That will be too early for me - the earliest I'd be able to make it down is early/mid September.


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## Arweny (May 29, 2015)

santoshpatil said:


> Sorry to disappoint you, but November does not look to be good time to move to Australia. Dec-Jan is vacation time in Australia and recruitment is very less. You might need to re-think your travels to work around the Australian vacation time.


Thanks for the advice, I will consider it.
I probably won't be in a hurry to get a job, as I accepted and planned for up to 3-6 months of job hunt.
As my partner works in a completely different area (he is a chef), we expect him to get a job easier before Christmas / summer time, even if only temporary. These are just assumptions we are making, so it is good to hear advice from people who actually have experience.


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## deepgill (May 30, 2015)

Please, could anybody tell me about the jobs in Albury Nsw for 489 visa ?


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## JayBhatt (May 31, 2015)

tdotguy said:


> I wanted to give a different spin to all the negativity I hear around here.
> 
> I'm from Canada, IT is hugely saturated here as well, with a lot of immigrants applying for IT jobs. I am a Lead Architect and am highly involved in the hiring process at my company. I sit in on interviews and developed both a coding test and a written test for candidates. I've been doing this for at least 2 years. Here is what it looks like from the viewpoint from someone who does the hiring:
> 
> ...



Hi tdotguy,

Thanks for a detailed description. One quick question. 

*Do I need to show a demo of the projects that I have done so far to improve my chances?*

I have done many difficult projects at my previous jobs but I can't show some due to NDAs and others as they were really large systems and I can't actually host them anywhere. Also for some of the projects I was asked to keep the UI same and very simple (just a header, footer and a menu).

For these reasons I can't show most of my work. Will this effect my chances in anyway? or will my technical knowledge of various technologies will be enough?

I can do really well in written and verbal technical tests but worried about showing work.

Thanks for your help in advance.

Jay


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## aditude (Jun 2, 2015)

Hi guys
I have been a silent reader and follower of this forum...you guys are doing a wonderful job though there are a few times where discussions go off-topic but on the whole it is worth reading and more importantly its worth understanding the state of mind of a fellow migrant or an aspiring one..

Time to break the ice...
I am a believer and a dreamer above all and so is every one who decides to take a leap of faith towards this new journey...

I am very comfortable and leading a cushy life in India for a while now...which most can envy but I want a challenge and I am in search of a better life among people with better thinking and better basic understanding ... 

I am not saying that people arn't good here back home but you know what I mean now...I know Aus has this to offer if not monetary compensation which is the general air around this forum... 
I am submitting my visa application this week for a 189...hopefully by july end I should be granted 1.
I am optimistic about migrating to Oz and finding a new life for myself and am not unware of the hardships I am about to face with the new found knowledge you guys have given me.

All I can say is that as I embark to this new land I hope to be among people who are sincere, truthful and morally upright... I faced ethical issues here in India and I know most of you from the developing economies have faced this more than the ones who come from their developed counterparts...

Thank you for reading...
Adi


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## aditude (Jun 2, 2015)

Let me share an experience of a friend who is in Aus now on a partner visa but was there for his studies in the past...
Once he came back from Aus he applied to the company where I worked and I can tell you for a fact coz I know he wasn't even offered a 15k INR that's like 300 AUD a month..
He went back to Aus and has a 50k AUD pa job straight away... He had completed his Btech from Aus but tech...was never his thing..
Anyways I am just saying for a person of that caliber who cannot compete with the normal folks back home is leading a decent life in Aus...
So, I can clearly say that since Aus is not a very technically sound country and it outsources most of the work to countries such as ours...
And hence if you wish to land a job in ICT you really need to stand apart not only with your exceptional and niche IT skills but also your presentibility and your ability to communicate clearly and effectively...the key word here is *effective*..
This is what I have gathered from reading and researching online plus interacting with migrants in Aus...
I am gonna look for a sales and marketing role in any sector though IT would be preferred...coz I am a software engg...and I understand ICT and have given training on it as well...

If any of you have any idea as to what are the job prospects for such a role... and has anybody got it yet.. coz i am of the belief that in Aus only the local guys get sales and mkt roles...is it that true or just an assumption that no body has challenged...
Advise appreciated...
Cheers!
Adi


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

aditude said:


> Let me share an experience of a friend who is in Aus now on a partner visa but was there for his studies in the past...
> Once he came back from Aus he applied to the company where I worked and I can tell you for a fact coz I know he wasn't even offered a 15k INR that's like 300 AUD a month..
> He went back to Aus and has a 50k AUD pa job straight away... He had completed his Btech from Aus but tech...was never his thing..
> Anyways I am just saying for a person of that caliber who cannot compete with the normal folks back home is leading a decent life in Aus...
> ...


Very informative post!
One thing I wanted to clarify. You mentioned that Australia is not that good technically, and you also mentioned that one needs to have exceptional technical skills to get an ICT job in Australia. So aren't these statements somewhat contradictory?
Pardon me if I read your post wrongly, but this is what I understood!


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## aditude (Jun 2, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> Very informative post!
> One thing I wanted to clarify. You mentioned that Australia is not that good technically, and you also mentioned that one needs to have exceptional technical skills to get an ICT job in Australia. So aren't these statements somewhat contradictory?
> Pardon me if I read your post wrongly, but this is what I understood!


I meant from the job perspective...
In any way what I understand is that either people- local or otherwise are excellent in it...top of the line but numbers are few or completely non-technical rest of the population...hence this derivation

This is the main reasons for our flourishing tech support market...


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

aditude said:


> I meant from the job perspective...
> In any way what I understand is that either people- local or otherwise are excellent in it...top of the line but numbers are few or completely non-technical rest of the population...hence this derivation
> 
> This is the main reasons for our flourishing tech support market...


Alright!
And do you have any idea about how technical interviews are conducted there? I hope it's not like in India, where the interviewers view the candidates' credentials with suspicion, and it becomes more of an interrogation than an interview!


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## BngToPerth (Apr 6, 2015)

aditude said:


> I meant from the job perspective...
> In any way what I understand is that either people- local or otherwise are excellent in it...top of the line but numbers are few or completely non-technical rest of the population...hence this derivation
> 
> This is the main reasons for our flourishing tech support market...


I dont agree with your points regarding technical incompetency within Australians. 

I really valued my Aussie colleagues and admired there skills. Few of them were of my age ie less than 30 and have been highly regarded in technical arena,Some of them had even earned Microsoft MVP tags at this age.

They have a real good way of conducting interview, I know of few other companies even mine conduct interview in this fashion ( Remind you we are deep into technology and are a Financial Product based firm but not as a Sole Technology Firms )
There is a Problem given to you and you need to come up with a working model in say two days (basically this is a web based module) where you need to use your C#/Java (your skills) with considerations of design that is going to be changed in near future.
They believe in the work you have done and most of time there wont be a interview round like ones we have in India where Interviewer is trying to judge candidate based on his knowledge. SO questions would be based on what you have done, 

If these are start up they will be interested in some work which you can project and showcase them. (I have not been part of the interview in these start up firms but have real good friends who told me the events)

Behavioral Round is something unique, These are situation based and will judge your handling abilities again if one try to project some one else there is knack among Aussies to catch him so beware.

But they value your core technical competencies at least when it comes to a developer role and they know whom they are dealing with, so if you consider them to be technically incompetent then be prepared for a surprise


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## aditude (Jun 2, 2015)

BngToPerth said:


> I dont agree with your points regarding technical incompetency within Australians.
> 
> I really valued my Aussie colleagues and admired there skills. Few of them were of my age ie less than 30 and have been highly regarded in technical arena,Some of them had even earned Microsoft MVP tags at this age.
> 
> ...



Hey
I never said they are incompetent infact I have said that there is a small percentage of the population which is top notch and the rest are non technical...And this is in reference to countries such as India.. Because IT is not Aus real source towards their GDP....hence the dearth of technical skills thats one of the reasons why IT-BA and system analyst roles get filled up before the term ends in their skill migration program... and I mentioned no dis-respect intended...
Cheers!


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

BngToPerth said:


> I dont agree with your points regarding technical incompetency within Australians.
> 
> I really valued my Aussie colleagues and admired there skills. Few of them were of my age ie less than 30 and have been highly regarded in technical arena,Some of them had even earned Microsoft MVP tags at this age.
> 
> ...


Excellent inputs!


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## bournejason (Apr 9, 2015)

I am a C++ developer with some web development experience which was way back. One of my queries is about the demand for people with C++ experience in the Australian IT market?

I have also acquired a lot of new skills like big data techoologies, cloud technologies and learnt some web technologies like python, Ruby on rails(ROR), Node, angular...and some more. My query is that with my C++ development experience and good knowledge of web technologies would I be able to seek a job in these new web technologies? Or is it that unless I have some formal experience in ROR/python I wont be able to work on them?

Your inputs will really help


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

bournejason said:


> I am a C++ developer with some web development experience which was way back. One of my queries is about the demand for people with C++ experience in the Australian IT market?
> 
> I have also acquired a lot of new skills like big data techoologies, cloud technologies and learnt some web technologies like python, Ruby on rails(ROR), Node, angular...and some more. My query is that with my C++ development experience and good knowledge of web technologies would I be able to seek a job in these new web technologies? Or is it that unless I have some formal experience in ROR/python I wont be able to work on them?
> 
> Your inputs will really help


You have a reasonably good chance of securing a job with your C++ experience alone. The other skills you have acquired, can boost your CV by giving you an edge over other candidates.


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## santoshpatil (Feb 4, 2014)

I too am working on C++ and a tad nervous about getting a job just on the basis of my C++ experience given that its not a niche skill and I assume there would be a LOT of applicants fighting for the same position.....if my experience would have been in domains like finance or banking then I would not have to worry so much but unfortunately that's not the case



funkyzoom said:


> You have a reasonably good chance of securing a job with your C++ experience alone. The other skills you have acquired, can boost your CV by giving you an edge over other candidates.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

santoshpatil said:


> I too am working on C++ and a tad nervous about getting a job just on the basis of my C++ experience given that its not a niche skill and I assume there would be a LOT of applicants fighting for the same position.....if my experience would have been in domains like finance or banking then I would not have to worry so much but unfortunately that's not the case


C++ has now been 'almost' pushed into the 'niche' category, at least to a certain extent. You don't find too many C++ developers around these days, so the competition may not be as much as you think.


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## santoshpatil (Feb 4, 2014)

I will be glad if that turns out to be the case 



funkyzoom said:


> C++ has now been 'almost' pushed into the 'niche' category, at least to a certain extent. You don't find too many C++ developers around these days, so the competition may not be as much as you think.


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## bournejason (Apr 9, 2015)

That is encouraging to hear, gives me a little confidence going forward



funkyzoom said:


> C++ has now been 'almost' pushed into the 'niche' category, at least to a certain extent. You don't find too many C++ developers around these days, so the competition may not be as much as you think.


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## gursharan_007 (Jun 18, 2015)

funkyzoom said:


> Please don't get me wrong. I'm still positive. Actually, this thread was meant as a sarcastic reply to all those members here who spread negativity all around and claim to be realistic. I wanted to see to what extent these people were affected. But as you see, hardly anyone who are famous for negative posts here, have replied to this thread!
> 
> Also, since I only have very few days before I immigrate, I admit that I'm slightly nervous and pessimistic, although my enthusiasm still remains the same. Perhaps my current state of mind was also partially responsible for me starting this thread, but that may be just around 5%. My main goal was definitely to be sarcastic, and also see if the so called people who suffered without jobs for months or years, would actually care to post here. As we can see, until now they haven't, and I doubt if they ever will!
> 
> P.S. I'm talking about the 'habitual' pessimists here, not the couple of people who have posted issues.


In direct grant , did they do any reference check


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## ArchV (Aug 25, 2013)

subscribing


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## vchandwani (May 7, 2015)

Hi All ,

I am Web Developer (Php), can anyone let me the job Market for Php and web development in Sydney.


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## BNK0212 (Mar 29, 2015)

Hello Varun,

You can check it for yourself on SEEK - Australia's no. 1 jobs, employment, career and recruitment site. It Looks good btw . All the BEST!

SEEK - Australia's no. 1 jobs, employment, career and recruitment site


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## farerpark (Dec 4, 2012)

kettlerope said:


> Well said. I generally have faith in this thought as well, but here in this situation, I fail to believe in it. Just imagine a situation that we are in. We are here in Australia when there are 20,000 skilled migrants (and their spouses) entering Australia every month (plus 457 visa holders, plus other visa holders such as 489, holiday working and so on, plus graduating local and international students in huge numbers) and on the other hand, there's hardly any new job creation as a percentage of these numbers in most of the fields which supposedly have 'shortage' of manpower and even government doesn't seem to be doing anything about curbing new influx. In this very situation, which can be the worst in the recent times, how can we say that we are in the right place in the right time??!! As I mentioned, I would tend to believe in it in the normal scenario, but I can't after seeing the situation here. Forget about practical experience of your being in Australia and trying for a job.. even a simple math of the numbers I mentioned above (that I haven't created myself) tells you that there's something seriously wrong with the job market and it's going to worsen fast unless it gets corrected sooner than later. I am not blaming anyone here nor I am exaggerating the situation even a bit. If you look around and speak to recruiters or HR managers or even read articles online, you will get enough proofs for the same - you just don't have to believe my words.
> 
> Now, in the context of the forum, a lot of people will call it negativity since they believe, and rightfully so, that i) Negativity should be suppressed and discouraged and ii) We shouldn't even discuss the topics which are negative or beyond our control such as changes in migration policy or economic measures being undertaken to improve the situation. I personally don't agree with both of these beliefs as you must have seen in some other posts as well. In the current situation, I would label even 'conservative optimism' as 'too much optimism' because the market is really bad and it's gonna disappoint many of us eventually if we had too high hopes. Why not accept the facts beforehand as they are though it doesn't mean that we run away from the situation or don't try at all? Fake positivity or pretense is no good here. People come with high hopes and end up wasting significant amounts of money for months since even casual jobs are too competitive these days. And frankly, it's not even a question of competition, rather it's just a lack of jobs. I wonder what sort of competitive skills a person will need to work at Coles or Woolworths as a helper, which any of us skilled migrants with good English won't have!! Why can't an accountant or an IT engineer get even a data entry job despite tens of applications? I have no answers. The only answer I can think of is 'severe lack of jobs' in general. And if it is so, why fake optimism and running away from reality which is incidently negative in the current moment??
> 
> ...



Did you mean to type 2000 or 20,000. ?

20,000 does not sound right . Only 2000 invites are rolled out by DIBP per month. Double that to account for spouses (although there should be many single applicants in every lot). Add another 1000 for non PR categories. Comes to about 5000 per month. Who would be other 15,000?


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## Sandeep2m (Oct 6, 2012)

subscribing


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## farerpark (Dec 4, 2012)

farerpark said:


> Did you mean to type 2000 or 20,000. ?
> 
> 20,000 does not sound right . Only 2000 invites are rolled out by DIBP per month. Double that to account for spouses (although there should be many single applicants in every lot). Add another 1000 for non PR categories. Comes to about 5000 per month. Who would be other 15,000?



And there is other side to consider (you need to in +ve frame of mind to think this  ).
While there is constant immigration, please consider constant emigration as well. People are leaving all the time for various reasons. And obviously people are retiring. There are thousands of female employees who are taking break from work to attend to motherly duties. All these factors should help job seekers.

Net population addition per year is only 400,000 for Australia. it will take twenty years to increase population by 1 crore at this rate. (just for giving a comparative idea, India is adding 20 crore people every 10 years) . 

I don't mean to blow away the concerns you have raised. They are legitimate. I am only adding some positives to consider alongside not so positives.


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