# Electric bills



## Toyzone (Apr 24, 2021)

Hi All, my husband and I are looking to retire to Pinoso, the property would be a new build and quite large about 245sq m, I was wondering what sort of energy consumption a place like this might use.

Thanks


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

That's like asking how much fuel a random car might use.

Just lighting?

water heating?

Space heating and cooling?

Cooking?

Then think about the efficiency of each step. You can't buy old style light bulbs anymore so that's not the issue it used to be. But everything else can vary depending on what you buy.


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## MataMata (Nov 30, 2008)

While the unit price of electricity in Spain is higher than in the UK when compared including standing charges and taxes etc. they work out to be almost identical. As in UK 3rd party provider deals can be had. 

Electricity price statistics - Statistics Explained


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Lighting accounts for just a tiny proportion of electricity consumption - using LEDs might save you two or three euros a month. Heating in winter, air-conditioning in the summer are what make the big difference. If your house is insulated that will make a difference, but few are. You have to get used to adapting your clothing to suit the temperature, rather than the other way round, and just heat the room you are in rather than the whole house. Pull down the blinds when it's hot, and use thermal curtains, rather than turning on the air-con. Cooking stews etc on the stove-top with a pressure cooker rather than using the oven is another trick you can copy from the Spanish.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> Lighting accounts for just a tiny proportion of electricity consumption - using LEDs might save you two or three euros a month. Heating in winter, air-conditioning in the summer are what make the big difference. If your house is insulated that will make a difference, but few are. You have to get used to adapting your clothing to suit the temperature, rather than the other way round, and just heat the room you are in rather than the whole house. Pull down the blinds when it's hot, and use thermal curtains, rather than turning on the air-con. Cooking stews etc on the stove-top with a pressure cooker rather than using the oven is another trick you can copy from the Spanish.


Agree totally with the clothes part! When we reformed our house, we had to replace all of the interior walls and we had them insulated as well as a new ceiling with at least 10cm of insulation and it really makes a difference. Likewise, we use gas for cooking and although we had wiring put in for an electric oven, we decided to try a gas one for a few years and we are very happy with the consumption (although the lack of a thermostat and even cooking associated with an electric fan oven took some getting used to!).


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

My oven, gas, has a thermostat and an even cook. Bought it from Portugal... Love it,


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Megsmum said:


> My oven, gas, has a thermostat and an even cook. Bought it from Portugal... Love it,


Oh how posh!

Well actually, mine is a cheapy one. We reformed the whole house but not the kitchen as it was acceptable and we wanted to wait and incorporate it with some structural changes later. So, we bought temporarily a gas stove/oven all in one unit as a temporary measure but ended up hanging on to it because its so cheap to run... but no thermostat!


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

xicoalc said:


> Oh how posh!
> 
> Well actually, mine is a cheapy one. We reformed the whole house but not the kitchen as it was acceptable and we wanted to wait and incorporate it with some structural changes later. So, we bought temporarily a gas stove/oven all in one unit as a temporary measure but ended up hanging on to it because its so cheap to run... but no thermostat!


Lol 😃 I hadn't old one like yours probably for five years. Cakes were either burnt or raw... I missed my range from the UK do treated myself.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

How do you run a gas oven on a butano cylinder? I’d be worried about it running out half way though a bake!


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> How do you run a gas oven on a butano cylinder? I’d be worried about it running out half way though a bake!


It goes on for ages. You get signs well before the bottle goes... The flame dropping intensity a little. We always keep a spare bottle beside it. If i think its getting a bit light wr swap it to the new one for long oven jobs.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Megsmum said:


> Lol 😃 I hadn't old one like yours probably for five years. Cakes were either burnt or raw... I missed my range from the UK do treated myself.


Im not much of a baker anyway. Most of my oven work is roasting things so the hotter the better!

It will be changed eventually for electric. But ill always stick to a gas hob. I much prefer them.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Gosh it ea. Prefer gas hob


Alcalaina said:


> How do you run a gas oven on a butano cylinder? I’d be worried about it running out half way though a bake!


You learn to spot the signs 



xicoalc said:


> Im not much of a baker anyway. Most of my oven work is roasting things so the hotter the better!
> 
> It will be changed eventually for electric. But ill always stick to a gas hob. I much prefer them.


Off grid electric oven impossible. Prefer, like you a gas hob. Happy cooking


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Megsmum said:


> Gosh it ea. Prefer gas hob
> You learn to spot the signs
> 
> 
> ...


Ah. Well off grid id always go for gas obviously. 

We lucky to have electric (that sounds quite archaic, but our house is campo campo campo, but fully connected thankfully, except mains gas and sewers obviously) so it will be eventually an electric oven.

Then i can get a bun in the oven so to speak and practice for bake off!

Until then, roast potatoes and piiza


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## Toyzone (Apr 24, 2021)

NickZ said:


> That's like asking how much fuel a random car might use.
> 
> Just lighting?
> 
> ...


All of the above, we may be buying a new build with an A or B energy rating my house in the uk is half the size of the one we may be buying in spain and our gas and electric combined costs us about £160 per month, but with a property twice that size and using air con I'm trying to ascertain what all of our outgoings may be.

Would hate to buy our dream home only to find we can't afford to run it.


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

Each element of the systems should have estimated consumption figure. Heating/cooling , water heater etc. Often in KW/h. Multiply those numbers by the cost you might be paying. I tend to increase the cost just to create a cushion. It's okay if my bills are less than I'd planned.

The official numbers are I think aimed at central Europe (Paris or Berlin) that means you'd spend less on heating but more on cooling.

Outside of hiring an engineer to check out the property that's likely the best you can do. Windows (Not just quality but size,location and number) plus insulation can really change things. If your house has a large wall facing south it'll be warmer in the winter and in the summer. OTOH if your house mainly faces North you'd have the opposite problem.

But the problem always ends up being we're all different. I used to have a neighbor that would turn on the A/C the moment the heat went off. Everybody else just opened the windows.

I have no problem with mid to high 20s during the summer. Others want to be closer to 20. I can handle cooler during the winter. Some people will want to stay warmer.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

We've just had our electricity bill for March (a fairly average month, neither hot not cold), €104 of which €21 was the standing charge. Add on two gas bottles for heating and hot water at €11.50 each. Two people in a 140m2 uninsulated detached house. In midwinter and midsummer it can be up to €200 but we use very little gas in summer. Hope that helps.


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## stevec2x (Mar 24, 2012)

Going off topic just a little - we recently bought an air fryer, primarily for cooking chips. I've long been very cynical about chips in an air fryer, but my gast is well and truly flabbered, its fab! Then I realised that the "air fryer" is actually just a very small fan assisted oven - and so I use it to oven cook anything small enough to fit in it! I can't quantify any savings on electricity, but its very quick!


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## Barriej (Jul 23, 2012)

stevec2x said:


> Going off topic just a little - we recently bought an air fryer, primarily for cooking chips. I've long been very cynical about chips in an air fryer, but my gast is well and truly flabbered, its fab! Then I realised that the "air fryer" is actually just a very small fan assisted oven - and so I use it to oven cook anything small enough to fit in it! I can't quantify any savings on electricity, but its very quick!


We have a Ninja Foodi its the same but also steams, pressure cooks, roasts, bakes and is an air fryer. We use it for almost everything, its about half the KW of the oven and being smaller uses less power anyway. Had jacket spuds tonight.
18m on pressure cook, 20 on air fry and done perfectly moist inside, crispy outside.

You can do Churros in it as well. No need to deep fry and they taste just a good as the ones from the market. 

Anyway back to the topic.

Air con units are more efficient than others types of heating (oil filled rad, convection heaters) in the way they work. But you have to aim the air output in the right direction. The one in the living area is above the front door and there was a gale blowing under it, which deflected the warm air from the heater.
We shut all the doors to rooms we were not using in the evening and just heated (with the air con) where we were. Problem is, we have an open plan living/kitchen so can only close off the 3 bedrooms and both bathrooms.

Insulation is the biggest issue here, most houses and flats have nothing, we have double glazed aluminium windows and they are badly fitted and the shutter cassette is built into the frame, so all the heat just goes out that way. And the air gap in the panes is around 6mm (in the uk the gap was 25mm)

Im planning on removing the cassette this year and making an insulated panel, to fit inside, that and adding heat reflecting foil (its like a plastic sheet that is see through but reduces the heat loss through the glass)


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

stevec2x said:


> Going off topic just a little - we recently bought an air fryer, primarily for cooking chips. I've long been very cynical about chips in an air fryer, but my gast is well and truly flabbered, its fab! Then I realised that the "air fryer" is actually just a very small fan assisted oven - and so I use it to oven cook anything small enough to fit in it! I can't quantify any savings on electricity, but its very quick!


Ooh, I love my little air frier. Not just chips but proper Welsh rarebit, and roasted red peppers. Good for reheating empanadas too.


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## MataMata (Nov 30, 2008)

Toyzone said:


> All of the above, we may be buying a new build with an A or B energy rating my house in the uk is half the size of the one we may be buying in spain and our gas and electric combined costs us about £160 per month, but with a property twice that size and using air con I'm trying to ascertain what all of our outgoings may be.
> 
> Would hate to buy our dream home only to find we can't afford to run it.


WOW £160/mth, am I really that out of touch with the cost of living in UK?

In Spain and with an A or B rated new property I think you'd have to be pretty profligate and wasteful to spend anything remotely approaching that.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

MataMata said:


> WOW £160/mth, am I really that out of touch with the cost of living in UK?
> 
> In Spain and with an A or B rated new property I think you'd have to be pretty profligate and wasteful to spend anything remotely approaching that.


I agree. I have a campo which is exposed on all sides. Was rated E i believe when we bought it. We have done work though. It has new windows, all internal walls have been insulated and new insulated ceiling. We use gas to cook but electric for everything else.. Water, heating, air conditioning and lots of lights outside. We use washing machine 3 times a week minimum, dishwasher most days and tumble dryer too. We have 5.75 contracted and no special horario for electric, just flat rate standard tariff. 

Average monthly bill is about 100 euros for electricity and one bottle of gas lasts us between 4 and 6 weeks. The worst bill was January when we had that very cold spell and we had a lot of heating on and we spend 200 but thats exceptionally rare and really was a one off.


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## MataMata (Nov 30, 2008)

My average monthly bill for electricity and water is €107


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

I saw a Eurostat report that’s showed Spain’s electric was one of the more expensive in Europe but it was some time ago, could have changed. 
we changed from electric to gas in Spain because at peak times there was a voltage reduction, put the oven on and the lights went dim. 
it is impossible to compare bills as some are high users and others seem to get by using next to nothing.


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## kaipa (Aug 3, 2013)

The easiest way to assess the price of electricity is to look into a Spanish house. Dark as caves. Blinds closed in summer and only doors open. In winter pitch black inside with the only light from a TV. A butane fire in middle of sitting room. Yep, electricity is expensive and the only way you live with it is by essentially hardly ever using it.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

kaipa said:


> The easiest way to assess the price of electricity is to look into a Spanish house. Dark as caves. Blinds closed in summer and only doors open. In winter pitch black inside with the only light from a TV. A butane fire in middle of sitting room. Yep, electricity is expensive and the only way you live with it is by essentially hardly ever using it.


Well, does depend. As i said, we use about 100 euros a month on average. But certainly don't sit in darkness to that degree. We do use mantas in the winter though at night when watching TV and wear an extra layer.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

kaipa said:


> The easiest way to assess the price of electricity is to look into a Spanish house. Dark as caves. Blinds closed in summer and only doors open. In winter pitch black inside with the only light from a TV. A butane fire in middle of sitting room. Yep, electricity is expensive and the only way you live with it is by essentially hardly ever using it.


It’s true most Spanish households have the lowest/cheapest potencia contract but I haven’t noticed anyone sitting the dark. They do cook on top of the stove (using bottled gas) rather than using the oven though. In fact many of my neighbours don’t even have ovens.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Alcalaina said:


> It’s true most Spanish households have the lowest/cheapest potencia contract but I haven’t noticed anyone sitting the dark. They do cook on top of the stove (using bottled gas) rather than using the oven though. In fact many of my neighbours don’t even have ovens.


A lot of the apartments we looked at before buying this one didn't have ovens (and nor did this one until we reformed the kitchen).

Our apartment is all electric, my largest bill last year was €76 for one month (December) and the cheapest €46 (August), and we don't spend anything on butano. We don't have the lights on when watching TV at night, never have done. We use the aircon for heating and have never wrapped ourselves in blankets to keep warm. The washing machine is used 4 or 5 times a week and the dishwasher twice, we don't run it until it's full (never did when we had one in the UK either). I don't have a day/night tariff as I don't want to be organising my life around how much electricity costs.

I find the cost reasonable compared to what I used to pay for electricity and gas (and what family and friends tell me they pay now) when I lived in the UK.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

kaipa said:


> The easiest way to assess the price of electricity is to look into a Spanish house. Dark as caves. Blinds closed in summer and only doors open. In winter pitch black inside with the only light from a TV. A butane fire in middle of sitting room. Yep, electricity is expensive and the only way you live with it is by essentially hardly ever using it.


Seriously!


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

You can buy 7 watt LED light bulbs. But even a 20 watt bulb would take 50 hours to use one 1kw/h. Even at 30 cents a KW/h that's a fraction of a cent per hour of use. 

Six hours a night during the winter? 180 a month. Basically one € for lighting.

With a seven watt LED bulb you'd get three months from that single €

If you're hiding in the dark to save on your electrical bill it's not the best choice.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

NickZ said:


> You can buy 7 watt LED light bulbs. But even a 20 watt bulb would take 50 hours to use one 1kw/h. Even at 30 cents a KW/h that's a fraction of a cent per hour of use.
> 
> Six hours a night during the winter? 180 a month. Basically one € for lighting.
> 
> ...


We certainly don't turn the lights off when watching TV to save money, we just find it pointless to have them on and never had the lights on when watching TV when we lived in the UK either.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Lynn R said:


> We certainly don't turn the lights off when watching TV to save money, we just find it pointless to have them on and never had the lights on when watching TV when we lived in the UK either.


I prefer the lights off when watching tv. But depends what we are watching i guess and the general mood. The days of turning lights out to be all romantic are long gone. Now if i turn them off he usually complains that he cannot see to pick his toe nails. Married life. Bliss jaja


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Lynn R said:


> We certainly don't turn the lights off when watching TV to save money, we just find it pointless to have them on and never had the lights on when watching TV when we lived in the UK either.





xicoalc said:


> I prefer the lights off when watching tv. But depends what we are watching i guess and the general mood. The days of turning lights out to be all romantic are long gone. Now if i turn them off he usually complains that he cannot see to pick his toe nails. Married life. Bliss jaja


Yes. Depends what we are watching. Equally we close windows and blinds in the summer to protect from heat. We are on solar so particularly careful about power usage but even then we don't voluntarily sit perched in the dark all day... With just the TV for light 
😂😂😂😂
,


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

We find the electric much cheaper in the UK before the expected hike/restrictions in Spain. That's based on spending time in both countries over the last four years, mainly winter UK and no aircon in Spain. But other things balance that out, like rates etc


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Megsmum said:


> Yes. Depends what we are watching. Equally we close windows and blinds in the summer to protect from heat. We are on solar so particularly careful about power usage but even then we don't voluntarily sit perched in the dark all day... With just the TV for light
> 😂😂😂😂
> ,


Welcome to spain... Where the locals all sit wrapped in blankets with a candle or maybe just the tv for light. All stumbling around in the dark for the toilet whilst hoping their pee doesn't freeze as it comes out... Where all the residents look happy for the tourists by day but at night sit in darkness worrying about thr 12w bulb being on in thr hallway 


Its not quite that bad jajaja


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

xicoalc said:


> Welcome to spain... Where the locals all sit wrapped in blankets with a candle or maybe just the tv for light. All stumbling around in the dark for the toilet whilst hoping their pee doesn't freeze as it comes out... Where all the residents look happy for the tourists by day but at night sit in darkness worrying about thr 12w bulb being on in thr hallway
> 
> 
> Its not quite that bad jajaja


If they're that hard up, how come they can all afford a TV, that's what I'd like to know.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Lynn R said:


> If they're that hard up, how come they can all afford a TV, that's what I'd like to know.


Radio rentals. We put a shilling in ours every 3rd Tuesday  its colour!


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