# Pronunciation



## Helenameva (Aug 15, 2014)

Just want to gauge other people's reactions to how they pronunciate things over here.

1. When speaking in English, do you find yourself pronunciating names in a Spanish way (e.g. Te-nu-reef or Te-ne-ri-fay, Se-vee Bal-u-ste-ros or Se-be Bay-u-ste-rrros)? 

1. When speaking in Spanish do you say English names the English way, and if so is it understood, or the Spanish way? (My-kul Jak-sun or Mi-kel Hjhak-son?)

1. Do you separate them out and speak the English way in English and Spanish way in Spanish, if so why? To make yourself understood? To avoid sounding pretentious?


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

Very good and interesting question. and not easy to answer.

It's probably a bit of a mixture with place names - sort of Anglicised Spanish,

In English definitely 'tenner-REEF'. That is a well known English word with a definite English pronunciation. 

But Marbella I would pronounce mar-BAY-a (not Andaluz mar-BAY-dja) and not with a rolled R. And definitely not mar-BELL-a (which I've heard)

In Spanish I would pronounce an English personal name the English way(usually, I think).

Although when saying my name or my wife's to a Spanish person I usually use the Spanish way so it's not cut and dried.

Also, when working out how to pronounce a word I'm not sure of in whatever language (including English) I tend to use Spanish pronunciation rules. I have found myself pronouncing words wrongly in English and getting odd looks.

Frankly, dropping Spanish pronounced words into an English conversation does come over as pretentious.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

jimenato said:


> Frankly, dropping Spanish pronounced words into an English conversation does come over as pretentious.


If I'm talking to my in - their - 80's parents there's little point using Spanish pronunciation of anything.
If I'm talking to a bunch of native English speakers who've lived in Spain for some while it sounds pretty silly, as opposed to pretentious, to talk about _Seville_ and the _Town Hall _when everyone knows you're talking about Sevilla and the Ayuntamiento.
So, like anything I'd say it depends, and here it depends on your audience.

You said about pronuncing English things in a Spanish way... I have word blocks where I can't remember either the English word or Spanish word (like most people) but one thing I've found when I'm in England is that Thankyou, especially in shops, and Goodbye, just automatically slip out as Gracias and Adios after a perfectly fluent conversation in English, leaving the shop assistant, and myself completely bewildered!


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

I pronounce names the Spanish way when I'm talking in Spanish, and the English way when I'm talking in English. It just sounds more natural.

However if I use Spanish words like _ayuntamiento _while speaking in English I don't anglicise them.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

As always, in any form of verbal communication, I always use the form that the intended recipient will understand best otherwise I don't "communicate". The only variation in this is that when speaking Spanish, I will frequently use the Andalu' version because that is the version understood by the majority of those with whom I am speaking.


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## alborino (Dec 13, 2014)

Pesky Wesky said:


> You said about pronuncing English things in a Spanish way... I have word blocks where I can't remember either the English word or Spanish word (like most people) but one thing I've found when I'm in England is that Thankyou, especially in shops, and Goodbye, just automatically slip out as Gracias and Adios after a perfectly fluent conversation in English, leaving the shop assistant, and myself completely bewildered!


I can't stop myself doing that  

And also firing Spanish at brits and english at spaniards when in mixed company and being baffled why they don't understand .


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

No matter which language I'm speaking I will generally say a person's name as it would be said in 'their' language... it's a major pet hate of mine when English people 'Spanishify' their names - you know, when Bob becomes Roberto 

Cities - if I'm speaking Spanish & there's a Spanish version, such as with Londres / London I'll use the Spanish version & if speaking English I'd say Seville rather than Sevilla, as a rule

I do find that more & more I'm forgetting the English word for something though, & find myself speaking Spanglish a lot 

When talking about things like the _centro de salud _or the _ayuntamiento _I tend to use the Spanish word no matter which language I'm speaking, simply because that is what they are called here, & the sooner someone new to the country learns things like that, the easier life will be for them!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> No matter which language I'm speaking I will generally say a person's name as it would be said in 'their' language... it's a major pet hate of mine when English people 'Spanishify' their names - you know, when Bob becomes Roberto


Hate the name thing, hate it when my students call themselves Henry instead of Enrique, but I don't say anything. If that's what they want to do, well fine.
I remember in Colombia a Colombian teacher decided to call me Juana, I think in an affectionate way, but I really didn't like it. It's not my name and also I'm not sure if it was just that she couldn't be bothered to get her head round my "very difficult" name of Jane.
I know, it's probably just me...


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

I say names the Spanish way when speaking in Spanish, otherwise I'm not understood. My own name is Spanish (Cristina) and they can't understand my name in English. This goes for all English words - not just names. Google is Goo-gleh. Skype is Skip-eh. So not only do I have to learn Spanish, but I have to learn English all over again, including my own name.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Hate the name thing, hate it when my students call themselves Henry instead of Enrique, but I don't say anything. If that's what they want to do, well fine.
> I remember in Colombia a Colombian teacher decided to call me Juana, I think in an affectionate way, but I really didn't like it. It's not my name and also I'm not sure if it was just that she couldn't be bothered to get her head round my "very difficult" name of Jane.
> I know, it's probably just me...


absolutely not just you 

my younger daughter's name does lend itself to the Spanish pronunciation though, & when she was little she would answer to that more than the English way of saying it 

my older daughter has Spanish friends with the same name as her - but she prefers a shortened version of it & has even taught the teachers at school to say it the English way  

my name is easy for anyone to say & I haven't met anyone who has managed to Spanishify it yet


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

My surname gives the Spanish headaches "Bowman" is just not in their vocabulary, but explain that, in Spanish, it would be _arquero_ and they are happy. My first forename William I rarely use but the Spanish do and I spent 10 minutes explaining to one of the girls in the farmacia that it is not pronounced 'gwilium' - she can manage it now, the others in there have no problem but I do prefer to be known by my second forename Alan which I tend to pronounce for their benefit as two clearly separate syllables.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

The biggest problem is should place names be pronounced as they are in their native language or in the idiom of the foreigner. For example: should it be London or Londres, Paris or Paree, Rome or Roma, etc?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> I say names the Spanish way when speaking in Spanish, otherwise I'm not understood. My own name is Spanish (Cristina) and they can't understand my name in English. This goes for all English words - not just names. Google is Goo-gleh. Skype is Skip-eh. So not only do I have to learn Spanish, but I have to learn English all over again, including my own name.


Fairly early on in our relationship OH and I tried to have a conversation about music... It was THE most confusing conversation I've ever had except possibly when my sister and I had a very interesting conversation in which there was confusion about a glass (as in drink) and glasses (as in for reading)!! Both conversations ended up with the participants rolling about laughing so, not a bad experience all in all.
With OH the music we were talking about was stuff like the Rolling Stones, Peter Gabriel, U2, Genesis. You try talking to a non English speaking Spaniard about this! I guarantee you'll not understand a word and therefore the Spaniard insists, "But they're British!" And you say "Never heard of them!"
I also remember trying to buy Marlborough ciggies - a bit of a trial too. As AllHeart says, you have to learn English all over again, even your name!


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> I also remember trying to buy Marlborough ciggies - a bit of a trial too.


That takes me back to Colombia where they are classed as contraband. You could buy them from kids and others at traffic lights but most shops would deny having them. In some cases you might be able to buy one packet of 20 but ask for more and... I used to buy 200 at a time (for non-smokers, that is an outer of ten packs of 20). I usually made my purchase at a liquor store on Avenida 19 without any problem but, one day, there was somebody different behind the counter. I got the reply that Sorry, but they didn't sell Marlboro. A voice came from out back (presumably somebody who either recognised my voice or who could see through a peephole or two way mirror) "It's Ok, he can have them."


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

The Spanish have a real problem with my name which is Mervyn. For many I tell them my second name which is Robert (so Reberto is what they use). Good friends have tried and now learnt how to pronounce my first name properly.

I'm sure many people call me other things but I have had to learn to respond to both names now


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## Pokerface (Dec 22, 2014)

When speaking to a Spaniard, I would use the "English" way but I would say it louder...just so they understand


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

baldilocks said:


> The biggest problem is should place names be pronounced as they are in their native language or in the idiom of the foreigner. For example: should it be London or Londres, Paris or Paree, Rome or Roma, etc?


My answer to that is, like names and words, you always say it like the locals, because otherwise you can't communicate. I take it to the extreme in thinking about my mother. She was a linguist fluent in eight languages, and she said everything perfectly in whatever language the word came from. Oh, the trauma of confusion!  At the very least, to my ears, it sounds pompous.



snikpoh said:


> The Spanish have a real problem with my name which is Mervyn. For many I tell them my second name which is Robert (so Reberto is what they use). Good friends have tried and now learnt how to pronounce my first name properly.
> 
> I'm sure many people call me other things but I have had to learn to respond to both names now


Mervyn? OMG, the poor Spaniards trying to figure that one out! There must be so many variations you've heard. Want to share your trauma?  

I feel so fortunate to have a Spanish name in Spain. My middle name is even Spanish - Aurelia - which was always a stumper in Canada. Cristina was complicated in Canada too, because Cristina has so many ways to be spelled. But here in Spain, they just automatically spell Cristina the Spanish way. My last name is also typically Spanish. So other than having to learn how to properly pronounce my name, it's easier here. I'm glad I wasn't named Mervyn or Jill.


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

My surname is Haigh. Spaniards pronounce it a bit like this... uke:


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## Helenameva (Aug 15, 2014)

My first name is Nigel, a name nobody has heard of here so have no idea how to pronounce it. I've heard it said every way but the right way. Even when I say it for them they still repeat it wrong. And if I say Birmingham in my normal accent they think I've switched to another language.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Mine is Claire which becomes Cla-EE-ray. So I switched to Clara, but this seems to have metamorphosed into Blanca in the local shop. 

There is a Columbian footballer playing for RM called James Rodriguez. They pronounce it "Hamm-ess". Gareth Bale's surname occasionally rhymes with "valet" depending who is commentating. And as for Andy Moo-rrray, it has me in stitches every time I hear it.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> Mine is Claire which becomes Cla-EE-ray. So I switched to Clara, but this seems to have metamorphosed into Blanca in the local shop.
> 
> There is a Columbian footballer playing for RM called James Rodriguez. They pronounce it "Hamm-ess". Gareth Bale's surname occasionally rhymes with "valet" depending who is commentating. And as for Andy Moo-rrray, it has me in stitches every time I hear it.


do you mean Colombian or ColOOmbian?


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

baldilocks said:


> do you mean Colombian or ColOOmbian?


Oops!


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## IanB (Feb 11, 2013)

I'm glad its not just me!

Amongst my interests I belong to an international e-mail group run from the University of Texas concerning a common interest in aspects of Mexico's past. I get terribly envious of the fact that a lot of the guys and gals on there converse seamlessly in both Spanish and English ( or should that be American -- ahem)

In my self teach Spanish studies my son bought for me a course which came from America. i note that the pronunciation is somewhat different in places and the inflexions (as they appear to me) could lead to shall we say mildly embarrassing moments?

Is this really true?

regards
Ian


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Alcalaina;6436874
There is a Columbian footballer playing for RM called James Rodriguez. They pronounce it "Hamm-ess".[/QUOTE said:


> In all fairness they pronounce it "HAM es" because that's how he says it himself


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

IanB said:


> I'm glad its not just me!
> 
> Amongst my interests I belong to an international e-mail group run from the University of Texas concerning a common interest in aspects of Mexico's past. I get terribly envious of the fact that a lot of the guys and gals on there converse seamlessly in both Spanish and English ( or should that be American -- ahem)
> 
> ...


If you mean South American Spanish V European Spanish, yes there are differences in vocabulary and accent more than anything to about the same degree as American V British English


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> If you mean South American Spanish V European Spanish, yes there are differences in vocabulary and accent more than anything to about the same degree as American V British English


and it varies a lot between the various Latin American countries. So it is more complex than just American versus English.

The Spanish one finds in the USA (I refrain from saying "North" America because that is where Mexico is situated) is very much a mishmash and varies according to which enclave one is in, from Mexican to Cuban to Puerto Rican to Colombian (PLEASE NOTE the spelling) to Chilean to Venezolano, to Argentinian to...

In fact about the purest Spanish, you are likely to find, is in parts of Colombia (rather like the purest English is to be found in Inverness). Since many of the Conquistadors originated from Andalucía, taking their language with them, it would seem that the more correct Spanish is possibly that to be found in Andalucía.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> If you mean South American Spanish V European Spanish, yes there are differences in vocabulary and accent more than anything to about the same degree as American V British English


As indeed there are differences in vocabulary and accent between the Spanish regions. It's often remarked that people from the north of Spain can't understand the _gaditanos_ in Cádiz. (Makes me feel a whole lot better because I can't either!)


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> and it varies a lot between the various Latin American countries. So it is more complex than just American versus English.
> 
> The Spanish one finds in the USA (I refrain from saying "North" America because that is where Mexico is situated) is very much a mishmash and varies according to which enclave one is in, from Mexican to Cuban to Puerto Rican to Colombian (PLEASE NOTE the spelling) to Chilean to Venezolano, to Argentinian to...
> 
> In fact about the purest Spanish, you are likely to find, is in parts of Colombia (rather like the purest English is to be found in Inverness). Since many of the Conquistadors originated from Andalucía, taking their language with them, it would seem that the more correct Spanish is possibly that to be found in Andalucía.





Alcalaina said:


> As indeed there are differences in vocabulary and accent between the Spanish regions. It's often remarked that people from the north of Spain can't understand the _gaditanos_ in Cádiz. (Makes me feel a whole lot better because I can't either!)


Yes, you're right. I was being a bit lazy and going for the short answer 
And PS Some Andaluces might find Gallegos difficult to understand too


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Hey.... You're forgetting about Canada in this discussion, so I'll just bust in here. Our English is very different from the Americans and Brits too. We also have a lot of variation of English within the country. There's also a big difference in our French compared to France. So here are a couple of videos to explain what I mean. 

The first video compares Canadian French with Parisian French. I find this hilarious, in a subtle, kind of British way. 






This second video is a person from Newfoundland giving directions. Can you understand this?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> This second video is a person from Newfoundland giving directions. Can you understand this?
> 
> newfoundland accent - YouTube


Sounds like Australian mixed with good ol' Zummerzet to me


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Sounds like Australian mixed with good ol' Zummerzet to me


So is that a yes - that you actually understand that? :shocked:


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## IanB (Feb 11, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Sounds like Australian mixed with good ol' Zummerzet to me


Oh No, I don't know why I remember such drivel but do you remember the "Eagle" comic?

It was the only one allowed in our house when I was a kid. Well Eagle Annual Number 10 had a story in it whereby one of the characters likened the Australian accent to that of the "sing song whine of a Cockney Welshman"


Wouldn't get away with THAT with the PC mob these days.

"Sacred Blue Mez Amiz" as Sergeant Luck of the Legion would say.

:banplease:

regards
Ian


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

IanB said:


> Oh No, I don't know why I remember such drivel but do you remember the "Eagle" comic?
> 
> It was the only one allowed in our house when I was a kid. Well Eagle Annual Number 10 had a story in it whereby one of the characters likened the Australian accent to that of the "sing song whine of a Cockney Welshman"
> 
> ...


I remember The Eagle (started by an anglican priest - Marcus Morris) Dan Dare and the Mekon and all that. By that time I preferred Champion and Hotspur (fewer pictures and more reading).


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