# Target earning level



## Designer023

Hi,

I will be moving to Egypt next year (July/August) and am planning to freelance as a designer/developer over the internet using freelance sites. I have a general question about how much I realistically need to earn to live comfortably. I have read some posts that suggest about £3000EGP is a good wage for locals. This works out about £300GBP. I know there are a lot of price differences in living expenses but I want to know if I should aim to be getting much more than this to be able to live well and maybe even make some savings.

I would ideally like to be able to go out and do things, take trips to Sharm (Diving), back to Europe (Skiing) and other places around Egypt such as Alexandra. I also would like to go out and about in Cairo, buy clothes, dvds, and bits of tech etc. I have been to Cairo before so I'm aware that international brands are approx the same price as the UK, but it's the other living aspects i'm not 100% on. To me £300GBP sounds way to low, but I could be wrong. 

Hopefully you guys can point me in roughly the right direction. Any info you need just ask 

Thanks,

Carl


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## txlstewart

A local wage isn't doable for many Egyptians, let alone expats.


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## MaidenScotland

Hello and welcome to the forum

The minimum wage here is now 700le and they are demonstrating/striking for it to be raised to 1700... 

Quite simply earning a local wage means you will not be able to do any of the things that you want, would you really want to move overseas and lower your standard of living?

Maiden


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## hurghadapat

Designer023 said:


> Hi,
> 
> I will be moving to Egypt next year (July/August) and am planning to freelance as a designer/developer over the internet using freelance sites. I have a general question about how much I realistically need to earn to live comfortably. I have read some posts that suggest about £3000EGP is a good wage for locals. This works out about £300GBP. I know there are a lot of price differences in living expenses but I want to know if I should aim to be getting much more than this to be able to live well and maybe even make some savings.
> 
> I would ideally like to be able to go out and do things, take trips to Sharm (Diving), back to Europe (Skiing) and other places around Egypt such as Alexandra. I also would like to go out and about in Cairo, buy clothes, dvds, and bits of tech etc. I have been to Cairo before so I'm aware that international brands are approx the same price as the UK, but it's the other living aspects i'm not 100% on. To me £300GBP sounds way to low, but I could be wrong.
> 
> Hi...and welcome to the forum.
> Personally i would think that 3000Le is not enough to give you the life style you seem to want...assuming that you are talking about per month !! That will probably just about cover the cost of your rent.Hopefully some of the other forum members who live in Cairo will be able to give you a more realistic idea of what you will require to give you a reasonable lifestyle.


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## canuck2010

£3000EGP .... 3000 UK pounds ought to do it.


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## MaidenScotland

canuck2010 said:


> £3000EGP .... 3000 UK pounds ought to do it.


People don't seem to realise how expensive it is here unless of course you live on fuul etc


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## CAIRODEMON

Designer023 said:


> Hi,
> 
> I will be moving to Egypt next year (July/August) and am planning to freelance as a designer/developer over the internet using freelance sites. I have a general question about how much I realistically need to earn to live comfortably. I have read some posts that suggest about £3000EGP is a good wage for locals. This works out about £300GBP. I know there are a lot of price differences in living expenses but I want to know if I should aim to be getting much more than this to be able to live well and maybe even make some savings.
> 
> I would ideally like to be able to go out and do things, take trips to Sharm (Diving), back to Europe (Skiing) and other places around Egypt such as Alexandra. I also would like to go out and about in Cairo, buy clothes, dvds, and bits of tech etc. I have been to Cairo before so I'm aware that international brands are approx the same price as the UK, but it's the other living aspects i'm not 100% on. To me £300GBP sounds way to low, but I could be wrong.
> 
> Hopefully you guys can point me in roughly the right direction. Any info you need just ask
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Carl


Hi Carl,

Welcome. It may be stating the obvious, but your living costs will be entirely dependent upon your chosen life style. If you wish to live like a middle class Egyptian then LE 3,000 will be adequate, however, the closer you get to a European /Expatriate way of life the more you will need to spend. I would take issue with your contention that international brands are about the same cost wise, certainly not as regards foodstuff, and the difference will probably increase further since they are looking at increasing import duties on what are deemed to be luxurious items, however most of these things are discretionary, and there is often a perfectly adequate locally produced alternative.

The costs of the major items such as accommodation, transport etc are very variable, but I would think that to live the lifestyle that you aspire to you would need an income of at least $3,500 possibly $4,000.

To be honest, you won't really know until you do it, but do not let that put you off from giving it a go.

Best of luck


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## Whitedesert

Carl,

It depends on lifestyle off course, but I would not stay for all the money in China in a Cairo (I assume furnished) apartment of 3,000Le. That does not mean that I am relating your needs to what I pay for my apartment as a yardstick, but from what you say you are an average normal Englishman, which I am o/k with, Lol, but that means you need a minimum income of about $3000 to 3500 US dollars per month, and even then you may not be able to do everything you want to in the time you would want to do it! Also make sure the work is available, I an not sure it is.:ranger:


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## CAIRODEMON

Whitedesert said:


> Carl,
> 
> It depends on lifestyle off course, but I would not stay for all the money in China in a Cairo (I assume furnished) apartment of 3,000Le. That does not mean that I am relating your needs to what I pay for my apartment as a yardstick, but from what you say you are an average normal Englishman, which I am o/k with, Lol, but that means you need a minimum income of about $3000 to 3500 US dollars per month, and even then you may not be able to do everything you want to in the time you would want to do it! Also make sure the work is available, I an not sure it is.:ranger:


Good point, there will be work but also plenty of competent competition.

"Average normal Englishman" What's one of those?


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## Biffy

Forget $3,000 - not enough!!

You will need at least 3,000 sterling to come close to the way you seem to want to live!
Food - unless you wish to eat like the average EGyptian - foul, tamiyah, kushary, lots of eggs and aish (bread) then you will spend more - brands that you like at home are very much more expensive!

Electronic / electricals - alot are proboaly more expensive and of an inferior quality.

Cars - if you decide to purchase one are extraordinarily more expensive than the UK - the amount of tax they levy on them is punishing.

House - you can get housing from as cheap as you want to as much as you want to pay - but it is all about the area they are in - and I am sure that the cheaper places will not suit you - but to find 1/2 bedrooms nice area maybe furnished - is more than you think!

Clothes - international brands (next, gap, m&s, etc.) - unbelievably more expensive (Next is double the price than in the UK - you know because they like to insult your intelligence by not removing the UK prices from the tags) - bring them with you!

DVD's, books, etc. - again Wow - expensive.

ANd to make savings with all the travelling that you seem to wish to do whilst you are living here - even 3,000 sterling may not be enough!!

But again it all depends on how you wish to live whilst you are here!!!


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## Whitedesert

CAIRODEMON said:


> Good point, there will be work but also plenty of competent competition.
> 
> "Average normal Englishman" What's one of those?


 He, he, well, those not too superior representatives of the "empire" who at least dont tattoo their favourite soccer (football) clubs name on their you know what, and knows that some of their best cricket players comes from the southern hemisfere...


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## expatagogo

3000 LE is not nearly enough to do/have/see the things/places you would like.

20 LE for a kilo of plums
5 LE for a kilo of tomatoes
70+ LE for a kilo of beef
38 LE for a jar of that crappy Nescafe instant coffee
1 LE for two pieces of bread

No, 3000 LE will give you a fuul and falafel lifestyle, considering rent, utilities, mobile service, etc.

Then there's always the "foreigners pay more" attitude. With that, you can expect a 0 to be added to the price an Egyptian would pay.


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## MaidenScotland

expatagogo said:


> 3000 LE is not nearly enough to do/have/see the things/places you would like.
> 
> 20 LE for a kilo of plums
> 5 LE for a kilo of tomatoes
> 70+ LE for a kilo of beef
> 38 LE for a jar of that crappy Nescafe instant coffee
> 1 LE for two pieces of bread
> 
> No, 3000 LE will give you a fuul and falafel lifestyle, considering rent, utilities, mobile service, etc.
> 
> Then there's always the "foreigners pay more" attitude. With that, you can expect a 0 to be added to the price an Egyptian would pay.




I actually bought tomatoes this morning.. something I never buy.. I paid 9le a kilo in Zamalek,


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## MaidenScotland

expatagogo said:


> 3000 LE is not nearly enough to do/have/see the things/places you would like.
> 
> 20 LE for a kilo of plums
> 5 LE for a kilo of tomatoes
> 70+ LE for a kilo of beef
> 38 LE for a jar of that crappy Nescafe instant coffee
> 1 LE for two pieces of bread
> 
> No, 3000 LE will give you a fuul and falafel lifestyle, considering rent, utilities, mobile service, etc.
> 
> Then there's always the "foreigners pay more" attitude. With that, you can expect a 0 to be added to the price an Egyptian would pay.



and we are talking crappy beef.. I never buy meat as looking at it hanging outside the shop covered in flies is enough to put me off beef for life,


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## expatagogo

MaidenScotland said:


> I actually bought tomatoes this morning.. something I never buy.. I paid 9le a kilo in Zamalek,


Must be the added cost of getting them over to the island and nothing to do with you being foreign.

I've seen tomatoes in the souk for 1 LE/kilo, but they were so nasty I don't see how they could be edible.


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## expatagogo

MaidenScotland said:


> and we are talking crappy beef.. I never buy meat as looking at it hanging outside the shop covered in flies is enough to put me off beef for life,


That's why I stick to chicken.

Eating beef after flies have had their fill is so unappetizing.


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## MaidenScotland

expatagogo said:


> That's why I stick to chicken.
> 
> Eating beef after flies have had their fill is so unappetizing.




I have stopped eating chicken...as it is so full of antibiotics.. 

I so long for a big juicy organic steak..


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## expatagogo

MaidenScotland said:


> I have stopped eating chicken...as it is so full of antibiotics..
> 
> I so long for a big juicy organic steak..


Oh, I know someone that has an organic farm - it's the best place for chickens and such.

If you'd like, I'll pm you her facebook page/web site.

She delivers, too!


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## expatagogo

Or am I allowed to post the link on the board?


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## MaidenScotland

expatagogo said:


> Oh, I know someone that has an organic farm - it's the best place for chickens and such.
> 
> If you'd like, I'll pm you her facebook page/web site.
> 
> She delivers, too!




You can post the link on here... you are a regular contributor the forum, it is people who have joined to push a link that get the post deleted,


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## expatagogo

Her web site: rouqayahsranch.com

I highly recommend the fig and ginger jam. I could eat it with a spoon!


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## hurghadapat

expatagogo said:


> Her web site: rouqayahsranch.com
> 
> I highly recommend the fig and ginger jam. I could eat it with a spoon!


Not a big jam eater but ginger preserve i do love and also fig but fig not easy to find in the UK...so possibly one thing i do miss about egypt ...but fig and ginger together i have never had but sounds interesting if a little unusual.


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## MaidenScotland

hurghadapat said:


> Not a big jam eater but ginger preserve i do love and also fig but fig not easy to find in the UK...so possibly one thing i do miss about egypt ...but fig and ginger together i have never had but sounds interesting if a little unusual.




Rhubarb and ginger for me,


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## Designer023

Wow, first off I would like to thank you all. You guys are a great community. 
I clearly haven't looked into the costs enough, so might have to assess how much I will have to work, considering my typical English man lifestyle. I was planning on taking it much easier than the uk and still living like the UK, but I guess it's not going to be that much different in costs to be able to do that as much as I thought. No biggie! You have given me some things I will need to plan for and work out.

£3000 GBP a month does seem to be a lot to aim for since I'm not even earning that in the UK, not that I'll complain if I can get that much. I had planned on ramping up my freelance web work as much as I could before I went but had plans to limit it to about £1500GBP as I thought that might be enough. I'll probably have to aim for $3000-$3500 as a base rate to live off and do some things, not all. If I can get that in £GBP all the better! No harm in more as I can always spend it if I don't need it 

And I also now now to stay away from the beef! (except the organic beef!)

Should be interesting however this works out


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## CAIRODEMON

Whitedesert said:


> He, he, well, those not too superior representatives of the "empire" who at least dont tattoo their favourite soccer (football) clubs name on their you know what, and knows that some of their best cricket players comes from the southern hemisfere...


Didn't know that we had any Aussies or Kiwis. On second thoughts though, bearing in mind our recent efforts, maybe we should recruit a few.


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## Whitedesert

CAIRODEMON said:


> Didn't know that we had any Aussies or Kiwis. On second thoughts though, bearing in mind our recent efforts, maybe we should recruit a few.


 Actually had Kevin Pietersen in mind...who is neither an Aussie nor a Kiwi...


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## CAIRODEMON

Whitedesert said:


> Actually had Kevin Pietersen in mind...who is neither an Aussie nor a Kiwi...


But he was obviously a long term sleeper, part of a plan to de-stabilize our team. Never thought that Afrikaners could play the long game or be so subtle!


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## Whitedesert

CAIRODEMON said:


> But he was obviously a long term sleeper, part of a plan to de-stabilize our team. Never thought that Afrikaners could play the long game or be so subtle!


Pietersen is the English speaking South African variety, and strangely enough the Afrikaans speaking guys was thinking the same as you about him...


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## expatagogo

hurghadapat said:


> Not a big jam eater but ginger preserve i do love and also fig but fig not easy to find in the UK...so possibly one thing i do miss about egypt ...but fig and ginger together i have never had but sounds interesting if a little unusual.


I don't even like figs, but this jam is her own special recipe so I thought I would give it a try and WOW it is so good.

So's the lamb ... and the chickens ... and the eggs are clean (!).

Okay, back to topic.

:focus:


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## hurghadapat

expatagogo said:


> I don't even like figs, but this jam is her own special recipe so I thought I would give it a try and WOW it is so good.
> 
> So's the lamb ... and the chickens ... and the eggs are clean (!).
> 
> Okay, back to topic.
> 
> :focus:


Lol...give over as that's mine or Maidens job to wave that flag


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## expatagogo

hurghadapat said:


> Lol...give over as that's mine or Maidens job to wave that flag


Sometimes I just have to keep myself in line.


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