# EEA Family Permit - Visa Denied help needed



## Nickm98 (Oct 22, 2012)

Hi, 

My wife, two of her kids and I are currently living in the UK but my wife's eldest daughter remains in Spain and has had her EEA visa denied twice. We are looking to appeal the decision because we believe it is not correct but wanted some advice about how to go about it because we have already been through the appeal process once, via a paper hearing and this time intend to use an oral hearing. 

My step daughter is now 23 and is still eligible for a visa based on the fact she is a dependent, the problem we are having is proving that. 

She was living with us in Madrid for 5 years.

The first appeal was turned down because we supposedly didn't demostrate that she was dependent partly because she had worked for 4 days during those 5 years and also because there were no demonstrable exchanges of money for the 2-3 months once we had moved to the UK. 

The 4 days that she worked during the 5 year period was part of a hairdressing course which we now have a certificate to prove. 
We have also have been sending money for the past 5 months because she has no income and the money left (in cash) when we departed has been spent.

The EEA visa has been denied for a 2nd time even though we included the certificate demonstrating that the 4 days work were part of a hairdressing course and that for the past few months we have been supporting he financially. The reason for the denial is that they are still not satisfied that she is dependent on us. I do not have the exact explanation to hand right now but am looking to get some advice as to what we can do.

As part of the 2nd visa application we included the following documents to demonstrate her dependency:

- Monthly bank transfers 
- Certificate that shows her registered as living with us in Madrid. (In Spanish it is called Empadronamiento)
- Certificate showing that the 4 days worked were as part of a course (plus no one can survive 5 years on 4 days work without benefits)
- Certificate from the Social Security in Spain that shows she has only worked for 4 days based on her National Insurance contributions. 
- Certificate of unemployment

Based on this evidence I cannot see what they are looking for in order to demonstrate her dependency on us. I can't think of anything else I could send to them or provide that will help because as far as I am aware she has no old mobile phone bills or statements with our old address in Madrid. 

Any help you can provide will be gratefully accepted.


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## AmyD (Jan 12, 2013)

Well 23 is quite old to be dependent on your parents unless there is some mental or physical disability. The fact that she completed a hairdresser course says she's at least competent enough to work as a hairdresser. My guess is that they simply don't believe a 23 year old is 100% dependent on you. I don't have any great ideas about what to send, but maybe if you look at it from their point of view, you could figure out how to explain the situation better.


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## Nickm98 (Oct 22, 2012)

Hi Amy,

Thanks for the quick reply. I would agree with you but I think you have to understand the economic situation in Spain right now where overall unemployment is over 26%, or 1 in 4 if you prefer and over 56% for the ages of 18 to either 30 or 40, not sure which but that is essentially over 1 in 2 for my step daughter's age group. 

Obviously my step daughter is socially independent but financially she is not which is what it should all boil down to. University graduates are still having to live at home with their parents. One of my friend's has two masters degrees, doesn't have a proper job and lives at home with his parents, he is 39. 

Anyway if you or anyone else can think of a way to swing this in our favour I would be grateful.
Thanks,
Nick


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## AmyD (Jan 12, 2013)

I know it is tough; the employment situation is bad all over.

Okay, maybe go into detail about your daughter's job hunt. Discuss any interviews she's had, how many places she's looked, etc. Maybe if you give some context to the situation it could help.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Perhaps you should send her typical monthly income and expenditure, and show how, without a *substantial *input from you, she won't be able to survive on what she is earning. The fact she is no longer living with you but has formed an independent living unit may be working against dependency.


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## Nickm98 (Oct 22, 2012)

Hi Joppa, 

Thanks for the reply. The issue is that her only income is what we provide. There is no unemployment benefit, no housing benefit etc. 

She is living independently because her initial visa was turned down because my wife was asked if her daughter was working and she replied that she had worked which they used that answer to classify my step daughter as independent. We have since demonstrated that it was only 4 days and was part of a course but has not had a proper job since finishing it but they are still refusing to give her a visa. 

She has had no choice but to live independently because we moved to the UK confident that her visa would be given because they had already given her one a year earlier.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

The thing is, with your adult stepdaughter, she has no automatic right to EEA family permit (i.e. derived right from EEA citizen) but has to prove financial dependency. The EU doesn't give exact details of what constitutes dependence, hence member countries interpret them in a way they think fit. So there is always an element of subjective judgement. All you can do is keep re-applying with detailed evidence. The fact that Spain has huge youth unemployment means most young adults can't survive without parental help, making them dependants, so they may be looking for something beyond the ordinary. As stated, evidence of her jobseeking efforts without success may help.


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## Nickm98 (Oct 22, 2012)

Ok. Thanks for your help we will try and see if we can do something to try and prove that somehow.


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## Jrge (Mar 22, 2011)

Hi,


Nickm98 said:


> Ok. Thanks for your help we will try and see if we can do something to try and prove that somehow.


The main "problem" as I see it, it's the fact that she is 23, and she's considered "other relative".

What you might have to do is this:

* Gather all the money transfers you have made
* Gather all her statements showing the incomings
* Prepare an informal ledger, incomings - outgoings, left over
* Double check what supporting documents you are submitting as EU-National. For example: Are you a British Citizen trying to sponsor her under Surinder Singh? Did you all live in the same household whilst in Spain?
* Will she become a full time student, worker? How can you prove this?
* Have you included a copy of the prior EEA Family Permit with these failed applications?
* For how many years have you been the primary "giver/carer" of her? Did you mention this in the cover letter?
* Prove that she's living alone, not by choice but due to the fact that she can't be y'all.

Animo
(Cheers)


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