# Graduating from State School



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Yesterday my daughter graduated from her state secondary school (note the pride in my voice here, and a certain tremor of emotion)
What an emotional evening! Not so much for the fact that she had a piece of paper in her hand that she'd given her all to get, but what that paper symbolised - especially in these times.
It was very emotional to see all these young adults, spruced up in their suits and posh dresses. Heels at a minimum of 7cm, but more likely to be 15!!  All ready to go out and get the world, if the world will let itself be got.
Reference was made to these young people belonging to the best educated generation that Spain has seen yet, but ironically with very low employment expectations. They were reminded that their parents in many cases had fought for the basic education which was the right of all Spaniards today, but that is being eroded away by what is happening in now. They were encouraged to fight, to not be beaten down, and to still persue their dreams, even they were going to have it tougher than ever in some ways.
On a more personal level, talking about this particular institute, we were reminded how apprehensive we'd been when our kids started there. The institute hadn't been long open and there's another older institute in the town, but for some reason we plumped for this one. It didn't have a good reputation. It was covered in grafitti; it was a risk. However on the initial visits the staff convinced us, and much more so than the other institute.
In the first year my daughter had appendicitis, a bad case, and was off school for 6 weeks. Even then she had to go to have the wound cleaned every day. When I saw how the school reacted to that, I knew I'd got the right school (with the exception of one teacher who was a complete gillipollas). They were helpful, considerate and professional.
6 years later I can say the majority of her teachers have been good and every year we've had some excellent teachers. There have also been some terrible teachers it has to be said, but few. I wasn't always happy with the content of subjects in a Spanish school and the way they were taught, but within the Spanish sytem I am sure that my daughter has been to one of the best schools there is. 
Perhaps more important has been the "feeling" to the school. The general atmposphere is busy and happy. I was always well received and well treated. The relationship between the staff and the pupils is exceptional. They meet for breakfast. They all went off for dinner together last night. One of the porters has become a close friend of my daughter's. She was in tears last night saying goodbye to them. The head of the school is marvellous, really an inspiring person.
I wanted to write this to give an account of my experience of state school. Far from perfect, but still a worthy and gratifying education.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

well done Baby PW and congratulations proud mummy

Jo xxxxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

congrats to you all I reckon


& you either spelled that wrong or I need to update the sweary filter 

it's very much like our experience, too

when we decided that we were staying, we took our girls out of the International school & put them into the local state primary school


this school was so new it wasn't even built yet - they were all in portacabins in a car park!! - but by the next September they had a wonderful brand new building (the leaky roofs & malfunctioning heating were mended reasonably quickly )

it wasn't without problems - no school is - & it too went through a time when it had a bad reputation - entirely caused by the then head of AMPA who was a bit power crazy & wanted to get rid of the head....... he didn't win, thankfully

when she eventually retired at the end of last year there were tears all round - literally - & tons of her former pupils turned up at the end of year fiesta to say goodbye

the secondary school both my girls go to sounds like your daughter's too - a lovely bustling atmosphere, some great teachers, some not so - probably like any school in the entire world - but overall they do a good job

the teachers make the effort to get to know the parents too - I'm on first name terms with some including the deputy head, & they know my name too 

when my husband died a few months ago they were brilliant & still are supporting the girls, emotionally as well as in practical ways - some teachers better than others to be fair - & there's at least one _gp_ who is a bit 'so what?' about it 

but on the whole a good school - & I speak as a parent who has dealt with schools in 3 countries on 2 continents


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## Calas felices (Nov 29, 2007)

*Graduation*

Congratulations to your daughter, pesky wesky. Could you tell us a little more about the Spanish system? You say graduation - is that not the same as leaving school then? and the piece of paper you mention, is this some special achievement or like a list of qualifications or like the French Baccalaureate. Probably most importantly does she now go on to University or what? If not I hope your prospect of employment is better than the news leads us to believe.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Calas felices said:


> Congratulations to your daughter, pesky wesky. Could you tell us a little more about the Spanish system? You say graduation - is that not the same as leaving school then? and the piece of paper you mention, is this some special achievement or like a list of qualifications or like the French Baccalaureate. Probably most importantly does she now go on to University or what? If not I hope your prospect of employment is better than the news leads us to believe.



I don't know the age of Pesky's daughter but she graduated form her 'state secondary education' so I guess she's 16. Having completed ESO, she would be awarded with a Secondary Education Certificate.

She then has a choice, get a job, take up vocational training or go to bachi prior to going on to University. 

French Baccalaureate is equivalent to the Spanish Baccalaureate which is roughly the same as A levels in UK.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Congratulations to your daughter for her achievement...and to you and your family, PW, because anyone who has been involved in education knows that the family background, values and encouragement are so important in academic and any other kind of success in the adult world.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Many, many thanks for your likes and congratulations!

My daughter has worked very hard, not always successfully, and unfortunately not always on something that I feel has been "useful" or "rewarding". But, I'm not ready to buck the system completely and there's been plenty more positive than negative.

The end to this story of graduation night came this morning. My daughter had already informed me not to worry about where she was going to sleep that night 'cos the plan was not to sleep. At 7:30 I phoned her and they were in the town square and were going to have breakfast at school because they'd been promised chocolate y churros in the school cafeteria! That seemed so Spanish to me, the staying out all night and chocolate and churros in their school with their friends and teachers!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> I don't know the age of Pesky's daughter but she graduated form her 'state secondary education' so I guess she's 16. Having completed ESO, she would be awarded with a Secondary Education Certificate.
> 
> She then has a choice, get a job, take up vocational training or go to bachi prior to going on to University.
> 
> French Baccalaureate is equivalent to the Spanish Baccalaureate which is roughly the same as A levels in UK.


she has just finished her Bachilerato - she's 18

my 16yr old dd will 'fingers crossed' be getting her secondary education cert. this summer - fingers crossed because both girls missed most of the second term/exam period so have 'make up' exams as well as the usual ones this term - so the pressure is on atm


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Calas felices said:


> Congratulations to your daughter, pesky wesky. Could you tell us a little more about the Spanish system? You say graduation - is that not the same as leaving school then? and the piece of paper you mention, is this some special achievement or like a list of qualifications or like the French Baccalaureate. Probably most importantly does she now go on to University or what? If not I hope your prospect of employment is better than the news leads us to believe.


My daughter is 18. She has just finished the 2 year course called Bachillerato which is equivalent to A level in the UK.

I have written ad nauseum about education on the forum as it is one of my passions. Here's a bit about bachillerato



> These are the two years education following on from obligatory education which finishes at 16. These are the years that in England pupils are preparing A levels and are at 6th form or smth similar. So in both cases we are talking about further education which may lead to university, other kinds of further education or leaving the education system, but this is where the similarities end.
> 
> In England pupils normally study 2 or 3, perhaps 4 A levels. My daughter is studying at least 9 subjects (I did a recount and I'm not sure if I left anything out, so it may be 10 or 11). This year she still has PE for example, which I'm glad about. Smth else that's different is that philosophy is compulsory for all in both years of bachillerato.
> 
> ...


and 



> It wasn't until my daughter started on her course that I realised it was so different from the UK way. As you say, both systems have got their pros and cons. Cons for the Spanish educational system include, as Steve has said, the workload. That's not to say you don't have to work in the English system, but in the Spanish system you're still struggling with _*subjects *_you didn't actually choose to do, but that are in the _*area *_that you chose. Plus there are mandatory subjects that are also subjects that you don't pick yourself like philosophy. However, like you, I quite like the idea that the learning experience is still very varied.


I


> would agree with you - UK education has definitely lost the plot and I don't know how, 'cos the teachers get far more preperation than the teachers here. And just before anybody says "Why do some Brits abroad always run down the UK???" I'm not putting the Spanish educational system up as the answer to educational problems. Both systems churn out uneducated, ill prepared young adults who are quite often completely unable to cope with today's world


Primary



> BTW - My experience of primary schools was similar to yours - very little creativity, absolutely no painting or fun stuff, no group work, just get your book out and turn to page XX. The secondary school has been much better although still lacking. However, I don't see anything good coming out of British schools either, but you've got much more experience than I have on that.


So not always complimentary, but as you can see, on the whole satisfied


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> she has just finished her Bachilerato - she's 18
> 
> my 16yr old dd will 'fingers crossed' be getting her secondary education cert. this summer - fingers crossed because both girls missed most of the second term/exam period so have 'make up' exams as well as the usual ones this term - so the pressure is on atm


Lots of luck to you and the girls over this exam period
XXXXXXXXXX


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> My daughter is 18. She has just finished the 2 year course called Bachillerato which is equivalent to A level in the UK.
> 
> I have written ad nauseum about education on the forum as it is one of my passions. Here's a bit about bachillerato
> 
> ...


so what are you going to talk about now 


what happens now with your daughter - has she finished with school & gets a longer summer before uni?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Lots of luck to you and the girls over this exam period
> XXXXXXXXXX


thanks - _*I*_ need it 

grumpy teen hormones + extra exams 

x2


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> so what are you going to talk about now
> 
> 
> what happens now with your daughter - has she finished with school & gets a longer summer before uni?


We have the dreaded "selectividad" to worry about

For those who don't know...

Selectividad refers to the university entrance exams which will be sat in the first weeks of June. It's not actually called selectividad any more; it's PAU (pronounced POW), but I expect it will still be called selectividad for a good 20 years more . 

So I guess I'll talk about universities, because I'm sure she'll pass!

After that she goes to Magaluf with a group of friends. This will cause infinite amounts of worry to her poor mother who knows only too well the stories of pissed out of their brains Brits doing exceptionally stupid things. It seems no Spaniards know anything about this bizarre behaviour and have no qualms about sending their innocent young country bumpkins off to sure corruption.

Please do NOT post any Magaluf horror stories on here until the end of June.

I'M SERIOUS!!!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> We have the dreaded "selectividad" to worry about
> 
> For those who don't know...
> 
> ...


it's not just Brits - & not just in Magaluf...................

if the Spanish parents of the rest of the group my dd went on the exchange to Munich had the slightest idea of half of what they got up to 

one parent at the meeting last week was incensed that his daughter hadn't been at school for 6 hours every day & that they had been allowed out shopping without the teachers supervising...........even the teachers don't know what went on the first weekend........ - but the kids were there to experience life with German teens - & that's what they did 


I somehow think the German kids when they come here in a few weeks will think we're a right boring lot in Spain


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> it's not just Brits - & not just in Magaluf...................
> 
> if the Spanish parents of the rest of the group my dd went on the exchange to Munich had the slightest idea of half of what they got up to
> 
> ...


Or not xabia, or not...

My daughter's introduction to nightclubs and a long etc was when the Slovenians came over on their exchange trip, so get ready!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Or not xabia, or not...
> 
> My daughter's introduction to nightclubs and a long etc was when the Slovenians came over on their exchange trip, so get ready!


where we live though, the public transport is pretty non-existent, so they'll be relying on the parents to take them anywhere in the evenings & since most of them live 'in them thar hills' they will need to be transported - these parents are all pretty strict & don't let their kids out - they said as much at the last meeting, they don't give their children the freedom

one of them, a 17 year old girl, lives a 3 minute walk from us & has been round here quite a bit since the exchange


she has to bring school books with her, so that her father thinks she's studying with my dd.............. & her mum rang her at 9:01 one evening because she was a minute late!!

her father has now discovered that my dd isn't in the same year as his - so has put a stop to her coming round - how can they study together if they aren't in the same class........... it doesn't occur to him that they might just want to chat


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## Seb* (Mar 22, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> her father has now discovered that my dd isn't in the same year as his - so has put a stop to her coming round - how can they study together if they aren't in the same class........... it doesn't occur to him that they might just want to chat


wow ... just wow. You wouldn't think something like that possible today.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Seb* said:


> wow ... just wow. You wouldn't think something like that possible today.


& he's not the only one

she _is_ being allowed to come here for a bbq with all the other Spanish kids tomorrow - I think


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## leedsutdgem (Jun 3, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> We have the dreaded "selectividad" to worry about
> 
> For those who don't know...
> 
> ...


Well done to your daughter PW. Its lovely to hear a story like yours as i will eventually be going through the same thing with my 2.

Re: magaluf funny enough i was there last weekend. Well we were in palmanova staying and took a walk along the strip. Im saying nothing .......


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Pesky Wesky said:


> So I guess I'll talk about universities, because I'm sure she'll pass!
> 
> After that she goes to Magaluf with a group of friends. This will cause infinite amounts of worry to her poor mother who knows only too well the stories of pissed out of their brains Brits doing exceptionally stupid things. It seems no Spaniards know anything about this bizarre behaviour and have no qualms about sending their innocent young country bumpkins off to sure corruption.
> 
> ...


 Your daughter will look at those "holidaying" in Magaluf and will be glad that she is who she is. Dont worry, its not contagious!!!

Jo xxx


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

jojo said:


> your daughter will look at those "holidaying" in magaluf and will be glad that she is who she is. Dont worry, its not contagious!!!
> 
> Jo xxx



xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Seb* said:


> wow ... just wow. You wouldn't think something like that possible today.


it gets better..... or is that worse :confused2:


I had to leave last week's meeting early for a class, so missed this bit..................... we have another meeting next week & top of the agenda is that all of us parents agree on a curfew :flypig:


I'm so looking forward to that one











:lie:


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## Seb* (Mar 22, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> it gets better..... or is that worse :confused2:
> 
> 
> I had to leave last week's meeting early for a class, so missed this bit..................... we have another meeting next week & top of the agenda is that all of us parents agree on a curfew :flypig:
> ...


lol :eyebrows:


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Seb* said:


> lol :eyebrows:


I shall report back after the meeting on Monday evening...............


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

jojo said:


> Your daughter will look at those "holidaying" in Magaluf and will be glad that she is who she is. Dont worry, its not contagious!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


Your wise comment helped me tremendously Jojo, so I thank you for that.

Well, I just thought I'd fill in the blanks- she's back!! She survived, and doesn't seem to be scarred 
Interestingly, we found out the day before that their hotel was going to be used almost exclusively by Spanish youngsters. The Germans and the Brits were going to be in another, so that was good news from my point of view. 
I had already prepared her by telling her that she was going to see bums galore and lots of piles of unpleasant stuff on the pavements, but I'd forgotten about the penchant that some people have for dressing up in ridiculous costumes the moment they cross a border, and she was "flipando". I'd also told her about how balconies seem to score high on entertainment value for a certain set of people.
Anyway, they met another group from the Madrid area and there were several groups from our town too and a good time was had by all.
They bought a disco pass which was 70 euros for three nights in different clubs, transport, 1 free drink and a free t shirt or similar. I thought it was quite a good deal and a safe way to travel around too.


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Your wise comment helped me tremendously Jojo, so I thank you for that.
> 
> Well, I just thought I'd fill in the blanks- she's back!! She survived, and doesn't seem to be scarred
> Interestingly, we found out the day before that their hotel was going to be used almost exclusively by Spanish youngsters. The Germans and the Brits were going to be in another, so that was good news from my point of view.
> ...


All part of the growing up process - for you and for her! You're just at the point of learning that keeping them safe and guiding them well was actually a doddle when they were little kids - the job just gets harder over the next few years! 

Hope the Uni exam went well, too.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

brocher said:


> All part of the growing up process - for you and for her! You're just at the point of learning that keeping them safe and guiding them well was actually a doddle when they were little kids - the job just gets harder over the next few years!
> 
> Hope the Uni exam went well, too.


We'll see!
Exam results out 21st of this month.
Watch this space!

Xabia, how are your girls doing?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> We'll see!
> Exam results out 21st of this month.
> Watch this space!
> 
> Xabia, how are your girls doing?


no school reports yet until the 26th - but school finished today  tomorrow they can go in & play games if they want to 

some of the teachers didn't get their acts together to arrange the promised extra exams to cover the second trimestre which they had effectively missed 

.........so there will be some resits in September - although in all honestly the ones they know they have passed (the ones where the teachers gave 'make up' exams) they have passed with incredibly good grades from what the teachers have told them

in a way it takes a bit of pressure off - they have the summer to study/revise those which they need to redo

dd1 has put in her bachi forms - the 'cap d'estudies' (jefe de estudias/head of studies) is confident she'll pass & start in September

so the waiting will continue til September......

where does your daughter want to study - & what?

dd1 plans on philology


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> no school reports yet until the 26th - but school finished today  tomorrow they can go in & play games if they want to
> 
> some of the teachers didn't get their acts together to arrange the promised extra exams to cover the second trimestre which they had effectively missed
> 
> ...


There's pros and cons to everything, but I think it's probably better that there are some exams in Sept (hardly resits 'cos the first time round your girls weren't really there, were they?) as it spreads the load a bit and the school holidays are long enough for them to relax and study, and your two are responsible learners, aren't they?
Just one thing. The exams for September should be written and filed away before the teacher leaves at the end of the term if the teacher is not "fijo". If not, a new teacher who starts in September may end up writing the exam, or another teacher from the department that hasn't taught the course and doesn't know what the class covered. In theory it shouldn't matter, but it may. So, if the teacher isn't fijo (I think the fijos can perhaps write the exam in September) you may want to ask who is going to write the exam and if your daughter should be expected to study anything "special".
My daughter wants to teach preschool. There are only 2 bilingual courses in universities around here which is surprising considering the amount of state bilinguals that there are. They are Alcala de Henares and Vicálvaro - miles away from us, but just about doable depending on time tables...


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> There's pros and cons to everything, but I think it's probably better that there are some exams in Sept (hardly resits 'cos the first time round your girls weren't really there, were they?) as it spreads the load a bit and the school holidays are long enough for them to relax and study, and your two are responsible learners, aren't they?
> Just one thing. The exams for September should be written and filed away before the teacher leaves at the end of the term if the teacher is not "fijo". If not, a new teacher who starts in September may end up writing the exam, or another teacher from the department that hasn't taught the course and doesn't know what the class covered. In theory it shouldn't matter, but it may. So, if the teacher isn't fijo (I think the fijos can perhaps write the exam in September) you may want to ask who is going to write the exam and if your daughter should be expected to study anything "special".
> My daughter wants to teach preschool. There are only 2 bilingual courses in universities around here which is surprising considering the amount of state bilinguals that there are. They are Alcala de Henares and Vicálvaro - miles away from us, but just about doable depending on time tables...


yes, the resits are set before they give out the reports - going by the ones dd1 had to do last year (she missed a lot because she was so ill, if you remember.......( it has been quite a rough couple of years one way or another ) - the timetable for resits & a study guide will be given out with the reports

they _are _pretty responsible with their studying - although both seem have to have a last minute 'cram' in addition to the regular studying they will be doing

dd1 also wants to teach - English - so it should be a bit of a walkover for her!!

she _really_ still wants to be a film director...... but she knows that it's best to do something 'sensible' to fall back on to start with - the cap d'estudis has had long chats with her over the past few weeks


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> We'll see!
> Exam results out 21st of this month.
> Watch this space!
> 
> Xabia, how are your girls doing?


I'd like to make a complaint.

Where is the smilie that depicts a mother bursting with pride and falling over from stress that's leaving her body in a _*woooosh*_!!???? Eh? Where is it????

The final final grade of selectividad/ PAU exams with the marks gained over the 2 years of bachillerato is a whopping
*9.3 over 12*
which is about 76/ 77 percent???

A very respectable mark which she fully deserved, if not more

And today she was offered a job looking after a 3 year old every Saturday over the holidays, which is perfect as she wants to study infant teaching at uni.

Sorry to go on. I know it's boring, but the intial point of this thread was to bring some Real Life Upper School experience to the forum and it just degenerated into mother's drivel. Don't forget you can unsubscribe from the thread


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> I'd like to make a complaint.
> 
> Where is the smilie that depicts a mother bursting with pride and falling over from stress that's leaving her body in a _*woooosh*_!!???? Eh? Where is it????
> 
> ...


77.5%  :clap2: 

will this one do?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> 77.5%  :clap2:
> 
> will this one do?


Not bad xabia. I'll give you a 77.5% for that!!!


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## Solwriter (Jan 10, 2012)

Pesky Wesky said:


> I'd like to make a complaint.
> 
> Where is the smilie that depicts a mother bursting with pride and falling over from stress that's leaving her body in a _*woooosh*_!!???? Eh? Where is it????
> 
> ...


Sorry I cant help with the _*woooosh*_ smiley, but I'm very pleased for your daughter. 
:thumb: :clap2: :dance: :cheer2: :dance: :cheer2: :dance: :clap2: :thumb:


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Thanks everyone!!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Sooo.
Official entrance exams (selectividad AKA PAU) to university done, we are now on requirements individual universities might have and pre inscription and inscription.
A bit of a nightmare to be honest. I won't go into too much detail as I don't think many people will be sending their kids to uni here, but things that have to be taken into account include:


 When you are doing this ie late June early July - it's freaking hot out there and in many of these places they don't have or they have pulled the plug on air con. Add in huge concrete spaces devoid of any shade or human kindness, enormous campuses...
 A total inability to sumarise _*what*_ you need, _*when*_ you need it and _*where*_ to present it.
 Factor in hundreds of young adults, a few anxious parents, a dollop of stress, a number of wrong rooms being posted, a lack of photocopiers and reams of papers to be filled in and stamped, normally BEFORE 2 O' CLOCK TODAY, queues in sun baked corridors...
 I am exhausted


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## Solwriter (Jan 10, 2012)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Sooo.
> Official entrance exams (selectividad AKA PAU) to university done, we are now on requirements individual universities might have and pre inscription and inscription.
> A bit of a nightmare to be honest. I won't go into too much detail as I don't think many people will be sending their kids to uni here, but things that have to be taken into account include:
> 
> ...


When I helped my daughters with their Uni applications in the UK that was stressful enough, but this system seems much worse.
And certainly more confusing!
(or maybe it's just the heat...)


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Solwriter said:


> When I helped my daughters with their Uni applications in the UK that was stressful enough, but this system seems much worse.
> And certainly more confusing!
> (or maybe it's just the heat...)


it does seem long winded & last minute, doesn't it??


iirc, in the UK you apply for individual unis & have interviews quite some time before you actually do your A levels - you are then usually offered a place on condition you gain certain exam results

then if you don't, there's the last minute UCAS bunfight for a place


if I'm understaning this correctly, here you do your Bachi - then selectividad - & only when you have those results do you apply for individual unis???

I am particularly interested because







my elder dd will be doing it in 2 years from now


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> it does seem long winded & last minute, doesn't it??
> 
> 
> iirc, in the UK you apply for individual unis & have interviews quite some time before you actually do your A levels - you are then usually offered a place on condition you gain certain exam results
> ...





... and our eldest son - all seems very confusing!

Having just passed all his exams in 4th ESO - shouldn't he get a certificate or something to prove that he has passed? I know he has his exam grades but is there nothing else like a 'Secondary Education Certificate' or 'Spanish School Leaving Certificate (ESO)'?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> ... and our eldest son - all seems very confusing!
> 
> Having just passed all his exams in 4th ESO - shouldn't he get a certificate or something to prove that he has passed? I know he has his exam grades but is there nothing else like a 'Secondary Education Certificate' or 'Spanish School Leaving Certificate (ESO)'?


Yes, he should get a certificate. (Didn't realise you had children this age!) I've just looked at my daughter's and the date of issue is 22nd July. I think she actually picked it up in September when she went back. If you're not going back, perhaps you have to go in and pick it up, (don't forget the office staff are working the whole month of July) or they post it to you?? Or probably each school has an intricate individual way of doing this, only known to them


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Yes, he should get a certificate. (Didn't realise you had children this age!) I've just looked at my daughter's and the date of issue is 22nd July. I think she actually picked it up in September when she went back. If you're not going back, perhaps you have to go in and pick it up, (don't forget the office staff are working the whole month of July) or they post it to you?? Or probably each school has an intricate individual way of doing this, only known to them


they handed them out at the end of year 'prizegiving show' at my dd's school on the evening of the last day of school


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> it does seem long winded & last minute, doesn't it??
> 
> 
> iirc, in the UK you apply for individual unis & have interviews quite some time before you actually do your A levels - you are then usually offered a place on condition you gain certain exam results
> ...


Well, as there are a couple of people interested I'll elaborate a little. 
AFAIK you can't do anything to further your university application until you have the results of PAU. Pau is taken around the 6th 7th 8th of June, maybe at the end of May depending on the region. Later is better 'cos first they finish school exams then they have some time to study for PAU.
(An aside. My Basque nephew came to Madrid to do his PAU as he goes to an American school in the Bilbao region. Why not there or in Cantabria is a mystery, but anyway he did it about a week before my daughter who lives in Madrid comunidad.¿¿ :confused2:??)
Then, about 2 weeks later they get the results. 
Of course a British child would have been convinced by her parents to have the choice of university taken and the requirements for that university known. Not my child.
I must admit it's very difficult, firstly because all their energy is being focussed into studying and secondly because you have factor in things that are not easy for young people to get their heads round like transport to said uni. My daughter, like most of her companions will be living at home, not at the uni and that kind of resticts your choice a lot.
And you've got to wrestle with new vocabulary like Rectorado and you don't know if you're doing an inscripción or matricula or qué and then you've got The Website - not easy to find information on some of these sites.
Anyway, in the end, after 3 emails and 2 attempted phonecalls OH gets on the phone to try to clear up a few things. This was on Tuesday. We were told that it was the last day for presenting papers, that the uni was closed in the afternoon and perhaps we could do it in I don't know where in Madrid. AND, as she wants to do a bilingual degree there was an English test on Thursday.
Result - one 18 year old dissolves into tears saying "It's all my fault" (in part it was) and mother and father working out plan B. As OH knows the education offices in Madrid like the back of his hand, he knew where to go and volunteered to do the first shift. So he accompanies her to Madrid at 6 o' clock in the afternoon on one of the hottest day in June on record!!
Mother will do the Vicálvaro, English test, shift on Thursday. This is the uni she wants/ we want her to go to. I wanted to go with her because although we had given the papers in on time, how were they going to get her on a list from Tuesday evening to Thursday morning? Anticipating problems I go along with her. This is where we get the baking corridors lined with nervy young men and women, where they kept us waiting ON OUR FEET for half an hour. They started calling the register which was supposedly in alphabetical order - we're waiting for Giménez and they start with Gracia, then I hear Guerrero... Other girls start looking worried. We ask, we rush off to look at the room allocation again. We're told to go to another building. We run across the concrete patio with the sun beating down. etc etc.
She finally did the stupid exam (why doesn't the exam for PAU count???). But she wasn't on the list of course, so we were advised to go to Mosteles (the central offices for this uni) the next day, as it was THE LAST DAY (again?) 
So off we go to Mostoles the next day with the stress and the heat. We're doing all this in public transport and both journeys include bus, train and metro and take over an hour. Huge queue of people again, people asking where did you get that form?/ the photocopy place is three buildings away/ do I need a copy of?/ is this the right queue for bla bla bla
The woman who attended us said "No you can't give this in here because if we receive the copy you gave in in Madrid we'll have 2 copies so they cancel each other out. If your name doesn't appear when the results come out, or there's any problem, you'll need to make a complaint (I mean reclamar) on such and such a date...
To be continued...

PS. So my advice would be to try to decide which university earlier on. Then you and the child go in the space when you're waiting for the PAU results to get a list of all requirements, the dates, the place for handing in documents, find out if there are any _special_ requirements and what the vice rector has for breakfast on Tuesdays etc.
Don't rely on emails, the website or phone calls, although out of those 3, phone calls are the best way of comunicating.


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## agua642 (May 24, 2009)

Hi. My daughter has also just finished Spanish state school 4t IES, I've had to ask for an Academic Certification of her results, I've been told that they get given iBook (LOE) but that's it! there is no certificates like GCSE certificates. Is this how it is? Daughter going to continue BATX in Denia and then UNI in Spain hopefully, UK UNI I cant even begin to consider due to high cost!
I would like to get her exams accessed into equivalent in English but without any certificates don't see how I can do this? Have I missed a step!?

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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

agua642 said:


> Hi. My daughter has also just finished Spanish state school 4t IES, I've had to ask for an Academic Certification of her results, I've been told that they get given iBook (LOE) but that's it! there is no certificates like GCSE certificates. Is this how it is? Daughter going to continue BATX in Denia and then UNI in Spain hopefully, UK UNI I cant even begin to consider due to high cost!
> I would like to get her exams accessed into equivalent in English but without any certificates don't see how I can do this? Have I missed a step!?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using ExpatForum


They get given a book?


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## agua642 (May 24, 2009)

Yes a Libro de education, it apparently has all there Academic education results in it. 
But I haven't heard anything about certificates for exams and she passed all of them
Like i said am I missing a step ?
And if so where & how do I get certificates from,
She studied in IES Pedreguer

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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

agua642 said:


> Yes a Libro de education, it apparently has all there Academic education results in it.
> But I haven't heard anything about certificates for exams and she passed all of them
> Like i said am I missing a step ?
> And if so where & how do I get certificates from,
> ...


Ah yes, you're right. We saw it for the first time when she left this May. She also has a certificate, but I suppose what counts is the book like the libro de famila is where all the family stuff is.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> They get given a book?


not at my dd's school :confused2:


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

agua642 said:


> Yes a Libro de education, it apparently has all there Academic education results in it.
> But I haven't heard anything about certificates for exams and she passed all of them
> Like i said am I missing a step ?
> And if so where & how do I get certificates from,
> ...


oh I see what you mean - it's just one certificate

the book has all the info


one of my dd's classmates is going back to the UK this summer & the college there has said that each subject she passes here counts as a GCSE

so she apparently has 8 GCSEs............... even though she didn't actually 'graduate' here ...... because she needed to pass 10 subjects of the 12 in order to do so

that doesn't sound right to me:confused2:


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Well, as there are a couple of people interested I'll elaborate a little.
> AFAIK you can't do anything to further your university application until you have the results of PAU. Pau is taken around the 6th 7th 8th of June, maybe at the end of May depending on the region. Later is better 'cos first they finish school exams then they have some time to study for PAU.
> (An aside. My Basque nephew came to Madrid to do his PAU as he goes to an American school in the Bilbao region. Why not there or in Cantabria is a mystery, but anyway he did it about a week before my daughter who lives in Madrid comunidad.¿¿ :confused2:??)
> Then, about 2 weeks later they get the results.
> ...


that sounds like an absolute nightmare 

so can they not apply for more than one uni?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> that sounds like an absolute nightmare
> 
> so can they not apply for more than one uni?


Uhmmm.
On the form they have to fill in, in Madrid anyway, at the end they have to put the code of UP TO 12 universities. Now, I don't know how that works really because imagine my daughter put the Complutense first (not bilingual) and didn't get in for what ever reason, and put Vicálvaro second. Vicálvaro requires that extra English exam, so how would they deal with that as the exam has already been administered?

But as far as I can make out you can't apply for more than one university at a time, if that's what you're asking - or maybe you can???


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