# Is This Job Offer a Scam?



## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

Ok I have been offered a job at a school in Spain. I am American. There is a 250 Euro orientation fee that has to be processed before the school begins work on paying my visa. The money is for training material for teaching. I guess I could see a school wanting an applicant to pay because they are going to spend up front money on the visa processing. The school has a web page. There is just one email on the page which I wrote to but was not replied to. The person doing the hiring says he is waiting for the principal to return and they will call me or do a Skype. I want a video Skype call. At some point you have to decide to pay the money or not. Could really use some input here.

Thanks,
Jeff


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

flacoflaco said:


> Ok I have been offered a job at a school in Spain. I am American. There is a 250 Euro orientation fee that has to be processed before the school begins work on paying my visa. The money is for training material for teaching. I guess I could see a school wanting an applicant to pay because they are going to spend up front money on the visa processing. The school has a web page. There is just one email on the page which I wrote to but was not replied to. The person doing the hiring says he is waiting for the principal to return and they will call me or do a Skype. I want a video Skype call. At some point you have to decide to pay the money or not. Could really use some input here.
> 
> Thanks,
> Jeff


sounds like a scam really

you need a work visa to be able to work here - in order to get one for you they would have to be able to prove that there were no EU citizens qualified to do the job......... so unless you have some really unique skill I think that's unlikely?

is it by any chance a position teaching English? There are hundreds if not thousands of qualified native English speakers looking for work in Spain atm

only you can decide, but I certainly wouldn't be parting with any money - even if there was a 'firm job offer' - because no offer can be 'firm' until you have that work visa in your hand, & if they really want you they'll pay the fees


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Just out of interest, Spanish schools are closed for the summer. Maybe they have some staff around, but IME, the staff dont hang around once school breaks up??!

It also sounds pretty dumb that they would want you to go thru the process of visa payments etc when they havent even seen/spoken to you???!! 

Sounds scammy to me. Simply tell them that you'll reimburse them for the visa once you have started the job??
Jo xxx


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## sadlybroke (Jun 19, 2012)

I assume they contacted you by email. Is it a free email address (Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, etc) or does it have school's domain name in it?


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Looks iffy to me. Some useful info here:

Detecting and reacting to false job offers and other scams - ProZ.com Wiki


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

*Scam?*

Thanks all. They have sent me a contract. The offer doesn't start until August when school resumes. Here is the text of a letter they sent. Note the email address they provide. Does anyone know about the legitimacy of this link?

Here is what the person who says they are hiring me, said to me. 

_ Goodday to you and thanks for answering your chosen questions perfectly. We would like to use this opportunity to express our sincere appreciation for your continuous patience regards to the on-going recruitment exercise. However, We also like to announced it to you that your application was among the final shortlisted candidates for the English vacant position outcome this morning of 6Th of July 2012 (Friday) This means, You are now officially employed by the school. The selection was base on the assessment on your resume/C.Vs and the Theoretical questions answered perfectly. 

Right at this moment, we wouldn't want to waste much time since we are having a very limited time in concluding the recruitment exercise. A contract agreement has been attached to this message. Kindly go through it thouroughly before making your final decision in joining the school. You will only need to fill in the appropriate portions of the contract and forward it back to us. You do not need to sign at the end of the contract until you arrived to the school to sign officially with the board of directors.

More also, since you are in need of a work visa, You will need to contact the European Immigration Service to start with the work permit/visa transition immediately. They are expert in immigration cases and also handle other visa related issues for foreigners. They will also register you for an orientation program which you will need to participate in before resuming duty with the school. The contact is (europe dot immigrationservice at consultant dot com ) Note that the orientation training attract a fees of 250 Euros which will be paid to the Immigration agency. The fees charge is to provide you with the training materials, e.g, 2 T-shirts, 2 pairs of boxer short, 1 snicker shoes and a face cap. It will also cover the transportation fare through out the period of the orientation. 

Kindly get back to us and confirm the receipt of this message and also let us know about your decision in working with the school. If accepting, kindly forward your current address, nationality, two self photos and all accompanies photos and their relationship details with you. Thank you once again for your patience. We look forward to hearing from you soonest_. 


Ok what do you guys think?


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## sadlybroke (Jun 19, 2012)

flacoflaco said:


> Thanks all. They have sent me a contract. The offer doesn't start until August when school resumes. Here is the text of a letter they sent. Note the email address they provide. Does anyone know about the legitimacy of this link?
> 
> Here is what the person who says they are hiring me, said to me.
> 
> ...


100% SCAM

I deal with these every day. If you can get hold of the IP address, it would probably point to an internet cafe in Lagos, Nigeria.


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

*Scam?*



sadlybroke said:


> I assume they contacted you by email. Is it a free email address (Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, etc) or does it have school's domain name in it?


It is not a Hotmail, gmail or Yahoo address. It does have the school's name in the title as well as director. 

I hope we can solve this mystery. Don't want to let a legitimate opportunity go by. And I am coming down on the side of this being real at this point. The number of times this "employer" and I have spoke gives some credence to the veracity of the offer I think. Each time he is in contact is another time to get caught or another expenditure of his time and effort without being paid. I feel bad for being so suspicious.


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

*Scam?*



sadlybroke said:


> I assume they contacted you by email. Is it a free email address (Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, etc) or does it have school's domain name in it?


It is not a Hotmail, Gmail or Yahoo address. It does have the school's name in the title as well as director. 

I hope we can solve this mystery. Don't want to let a legitimate opportunity go by. And I am coming down on the side of this being real at this point. The number of times this "employer" and I have spoke gives some credence to the veracity of the offer I think. Each time he is in contact is another time to get caught or another expenditure of his time and effort without being paid. I feel bad for being so suspicious.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

flacoflaco said:


> Thanks all. They have sent me a contract. The offer doesn't start until August when school resumes. Here is the text of a letter they sent. Note the email address they provide. Does anyone know about the legitimacy of this link?
> 
> Here is what the person who says they are hiring me, said to me.
> 
> ...



is that a copy/paste from the e-mail? (shouldn't let you post it really but I'll let it pass this time)

if so it's barely in English......

the European Immigration Service would appear to be a private company (it's certainly not any govt agy ) - so I'm even more convinced that it's a scam 

what's the school/company name?


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

*Scam?*



xabiachica said:


> sounds like a scam really
> 
> you need a work visa to be able to work here - in order to get one for you they would have to be able to prove that there were no EU citizens qualified to do the job......... so unless you have some really unique skill I think that's unlikely?
> 
> ...


I wonder about that too. I am a native English speaker, but speak Spanish well. I have taught in more than 10 different countries and I think the argument could be made those are my unique skills. I have a post-graduate degree. 

I read what it was that allows some Americans to work in Spain. Usually it was someone writing a thesis or dissertation about how to improve the school in Spain, or something along those lines. 

I have taken contract jobs abroad before. In one of those I had to spend up front money to an agency for my own visa and it worked out fine. 

Should I ask the school, you know, what is it about me that you are going to tell the visa people makes me an exception here?


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## sadlybroke (Jun 19, 2012)

flacoflaco said:


> It is not a Hotmail, gmail or Yahoo address. It does have the school's name in the title as well as director.


It is a free email address though... Go to mail.com, you can pick a domain name, such as consultant.com for your email address. You can put anything you want before the '@', e.g. name of a school headmaster you find on a web page of a school somewhere in Spain... 



flacoflaco said:


> I hope we can solve this mystery. Don't want to let a legitimate opportunity go by. And I am coming down on the side of this being real at this point. The number of times this "employer" and I have spoke gives some credence to the veracity of the offer I think. Each time he is in contact is another time to get caught or another expenditure of his time and effort without being paid. I feel bad for being so suspicious.


It's not a mystery, I am 100% sure it is a scam. As I said, I deal with very similar emails on daily basis. My company runs a few websites within the cruise line employment sector and I hear from people who got nearly identical emails and paid hundreds of $$$ to the scammers with email addresses such as royal.caribbean AT consultant.com, etc.

Do not respond to their emails, ignore them, move on... If it sounds too good to be true, it probably isn't true.


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

*Scam?*



sadlybroke said:


> 100% SCAM
> 
> I deal with these every day. If you can get hold of the IP address, it would probably point to an internet cafe in Lagos, Nigeria.




Does the email I included lead anywhere?


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## sadlybroke (Jun 19, 2012)

flacoflaco said:


> Does the email I included lead anywhere?


No, not the email. You may get some info from the email header (IP address) but it will not tell you much. 

These scammers used to set up websites and we used to hunt them and close the sites. A few years ago they changed the tactics, now they steal a real person's identity and pretend to represent an established company. They are usually based in Nigeria, sometimes in Malaysia, Romania, UK, USA and Canada.


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

The school does exist though. They have a pretty extensive website. What do you make of that?


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

flacoflaco said:


> The school does exist though. They have a pretty extensive website. What do you make of that?


You could put a website together over night. What does that prove?

It's already been mentioned the fact they want you to contact an "European Immigration Service" is likely the real scam. You'll pay €xxxx and in the end they'll say so sorry no visa.

Honestly it sounds like the old modeling scam except with a twist.


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## sadlybroke (Jun 19, 2012)

flacoflaco said:


> The school does exist though. They have a pretty extensive website. What do you make of that?


Microsoft is a real company with a very nice website. I could create an email address _bill.gates.microsoft AT consultant.com_. If I sent you an email offering you a well paid job at Microsoft, after you pay a small fee for your medical exams (etc.), it wouldn't mean the job offer is real.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

flacoflaco said:


> The school does exist though. They have a pretty extensive website. What do you make of that?


are you sure??

what's the name of the school?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

NickZ said:


> You could put a website together over night. What does that prove?
> 
> It's already been mentioned the fact they want you to contact an "European Immigration Service" is likely the real scam. You'll pay €xxxx and in the end they'll say so sorry no visa.
> 
> Honestly it sounds like the old modeling scam except with a twist.


exactly .....


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

It seems like if anyone knew if 
"europe dot immigrationservice at consultant dot com"
actually existed I could better determine. I am pretty sure know with the consensus of you all that it is fake. I went through another recruiting process like this but the person let me talk to him on the phone. The agency who processed my visa, did process it and there was a job waiting. I couldn't talk to the processor before I sent my money. But they did the job. Here the person is not talking to me on the phone. They gave me a Skype address, but never met me there. What a crap world.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

flacoflaco said:


> It seems like if anyone knew if
> "europe dot immigrationservice at consultant dot com"
> actually existed I could better determine. I am pretty sure know with the consensus of you all that it is fake. I went through another recruiting process like this but the person let me talk to him on the phone. The agency who processed my visa, did process it and there was a job waiting. I couldn't talk to the processor before I sent my money. But they did the job. Here the person is not talking to me on the phone. They gave me a Skype address, but never met me there. What a crap world.


when you google it, you get nothing

when I tried to get to it via my browser, I got a 'don't go there' warning


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

flacoflaco said:


> I went through another recruiting process like this



In Europe?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Whats the school called?? I know of a couple of scams re a "so called" education establishment (that doesnt exist} on the costa del sol. They've got an amazing website too. But a scam they most certainly are

Jo xxx


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## Solwriter (Jan 10, 2012)

jojo said:


> Whats the school called?? I know of a couple of scams re a "so called" education establishment (that doesnt exist} on the costa del sol. They've got an amazing website too. But a scam they most certainly are
> 
> Jo xxx


It is very easy to build a good and legitimate-looking website. And even with the name of an actual school. All the scammer needs to do is pick up a domain name for it. If the school has the .es, they could pick up the dot com, or dot net. Dot org is usually a good one for educational establishments too.

So with a website, always look at the WHOIS


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Whats the name of this place?

Jo xxx


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

Even if the school and website are legit it could be a scam.

The school could be getting kickbacks from the visa company.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

the OP & I have now discussed this by PM

it IS a real school, but a state school with a free website - one of our local state schools actually uses the same 'freebie' - but as we know, state schools don't recruit directly

that would also explain why his e-mail to the school went unanswered

IMO the scam is, as was suggested, the so-called immigration company


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## flacoflaco (Jul 12, 2012)

*Scam*

No one seems to have anything good or bad to mention about the "immigration experts" probably mean no one has heard of them. With a name as up front as "Europe Immigration" or however I listed it in an earlier post (can't view it from this page) wouldn't someone here have said by now, "Oh I used them they were good." Anyone used this company. And again the claim here is they are not processing my visa. It is an orientation providing teaching materials. I could almost go along with that. The letter seems unprofessional and even ridiculous by explaining I will get a candybar and some boxers. But maybe that is just part of a real deal. Never can account for another's outlook on the world by judging them on the simplistic way they seem to express these views. 



xabiachica said:


> the OP & I have now discussed this by PM
> 
> it IS a real school, but a state school with a free website - one of our local state schools actually uses the same 'freebie' - but as we know, state schools don't recruit directly
> 
> ...


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## neddie (Jun 11, 2012)

....in your original posting, #1, you said you were _offered_ a job.....did they find you or did you apply for the job i.e. did you respond to an ad. ?

....i have read the letter in your posting #6 three times. If it was written by someone who is supposedly responsible for hiring, i would be disgusted at the quality of it and run the other way. The bit about the 'training materials' is just too much for me !!!

......to answer your question, i think it is a scam. At the end of the day it is your decision.


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## JulyB (Jul 18, 2011)

'Training materials' costing 250E and consisting of '2 T-shirts, 2 pairs of boxer short, 1 snicker shoes and a face cap' 

Really? What do they plan to train you to do with this bounty? Sorry, but if the school is a state institution they will not be hiring you this way. This so called immigration service is trying to steal your money, and you might not be able to do anything about it because they can argue that you paid the cash for the clothes. 

What was this about 'chosen questions' that you answered 'perfectly' - did you really choose them? They say you're 'officially employed by the school', but they also say you're on the shortlist - classic scam language. 

My grandmother gets this stuff all the time, (It goes - 'You've won £10,000... you've been chosen for the next round where you could win £10,000... all you have to do to claim your prize is to fill in all the forms and send them a £250 processing fee for which they will send you a book/t-shirt/pen... to be admitted to the next level...' and is written in about as good English as this email, to make it more confusing).

Do NOT feel guilty about being suspicious, and do NOT give them a single penny.

And yes, how did you hear about this job? Did they email you, or did you contact them?


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

neddie said:


> ....in your original posting, #1, you said you were _offered_ a job.....did they find you or did you apply for the job i.e. did you respond to an ad. ?
> 
> ....i have read the letter in your posting #6 three times. If it was written by someone who is supposedly responsible for hiring, i would be disgusted at the quality of it and run the other way. The bit about the 'training materials' is just too much for me !!!
> 
> ......to answer your question, i think it is a scam. At the end of the day it is your decision.




Just what I was thinking. If you've really been offered a job, have you not had an interview already?

What are these tests you've passed?

None of this sounds like a normal recruitment process for a proper teacher's job.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> the OP & I have now discussed this by PM
> 
> it IS a real school, but a state school with a free website - one of our local state schools actually uses the same 'freebie' - but as we know, state schools don't recruit directly
> 
> ...


flacoflaco,
there can be no doubt that a state school does not, indeed CAN not recruit in this way. All full time, full teachers (as opposed to language assistants) have to take state exams and are then awarded a place at a school using the grade obtained from this exam. They do NOT interview and people do NOT apply for jobs. They do the exam and are told which job is available for them.
I know several teachers in the state sytem, including my husband who has been teaching for about 15 years now.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> flacoflaco,
> there can be no doubt that a state school does not, indeed CAN not recruit in this way. All full time, full teachers (as opposed to language assistants) have to take state exams and are then awarded a place at a school using the grade obtained from this exam. They do NOT interview and people do NOT apply for jobs. They do the exam and are told which job is available for them.
> I know several teachers in the state sytem, including my husband who has been teaching for about 15 years now.


PS - Jobs in state schools are not advertised as the people (opositores) who have done the exams (oposiciones) are called by the education authorities to a meeting where people are assigned their school.
PPS - The schools are closed in August although the office staff work in July.


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## neddie (Jun 11, 2012)

...flacoflaco....i can't help feeling that with all the negative comments (you asked for comments  ) that have been given you probably feel somewhat 'deflated'. All that i can add at this stage is don't give up on your quest for a job. Have you thought of private schools e.g. an American or British school or even something like a 'church' school.... that's if they have them in Spain. Another alternative maybe a private tutoring to some 'poverty stricken' sherry baron in somewhere like Jerez de la Frontera....in the old days they used to send their kids to private Catholic schools in Ireland but money is a bit tight these days !!!!!

Good luck


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

neddie said:


> ...flacoflaco....i can't help feeling that with all the negative comments (you asked for comments  ) that have been given you probably feel somewhat 'deflated'. All that i can add at this stage is don't give up on your quest for a job. Have you thought of private schools e.g. an American or British school or even something like a 'church' school.... that's if they have them in Spain. Another alternative maybe a private tutoring to some 'poverty stricken' sherry baron in somewhere like Jerez de la Frontera....in the old days they used to send their kids to private Catholic schools in Ireland but money is a bit tight these days !!!!!
> 
> Good luck


he'd still need a work permit..............


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

neddie said:


> ...flacoflaco....i can't help feeling that with all the negative comments (you asked for comments  ) that have been given you probably feel somewhat 'deflated'. All that i can add at this stage is don't give up on your quest for a job. Have you thought of private schools e.g. an American or British school or even something like a 'church' school.... that's if they have them in Spain. Another alternative maybe a private tutoring to some 'poverty stricken' sherry baron in somewhere like Jerez de la Frontera....in the old days they used to send their kids to private Catholic schools in Ireland but money is a bit tight these days !!!!!
> 
> Good luck


Church schools in Spain? - you might still find a few. They were one of the things that sparked the Republic. Girls had little or no education at all and most boys didn't get much beyond the age of 13 (there is a significance in that!). Taking education out of the hands of the church and religious groups enabled Spain to come out of the Middle Ages. Many of my older neighbours can barely read or write and some we have to read important mail for them.


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