# Sold price register?



## lma (Apr 22, 2014)

In the UK and Ireland, once a property sale has completed, people can go online and look up the true and final selling price. Is there any similar system for Spain/the Canaries? I have searched Google for hours, but come up completely blank.

I have looked at the Kyero Price Index, but it's not really very helpful since asking prices vary from complex to complex, even for the same type of apartment. I am wondering if the asking prices on these properties are close to what vendors are achieving, or if the majority of properties are selling for above, below, or around asking price to help us tailor our offer. 

The estate agent is, of course, asking for the vendor, so I do not expect to get an truly honest answer from them. I was wondering if there was anywhere I could find factual information on what other properties in the complex have sold for, so we could make an offer close to that price and hopefully get an agreement and finalize the sale quickly.

Is there any register accessible from online of the actual price achieved for recent sales?


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## emlyn (Oct 26, 2012)

lma said:


> In the UK and Ireland, once a property sale has completed, people can go online and look up the true and final selling price. Is there any similar system for Spain/the Canaries? I have searched Google for hours, but come up completely blank. I have looked at the Kyero Price Index, but it's not really very helpful since asking prices vary from complex to complex, even for the same type of apartment. I am wondering if the asking prices on these properties are close to what vendors are achieving, or if the majority of properties are selling for above, below, or around asking price to help us tailor our offer. The estate agent is, of course, asking for the vendor, so I do not expect to get an truly honest answer from them. I was wondering if there was anywhere I could find factual information on what other properties in the complex have sold for, so we could make an offer close to that price and hopefully get an agreement and finalize the sale quickly. Is there any register accessible from online of the actual price achieved for recent sales?


I've searched as well and drawn a blank,hopefully someone on the forum may know.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

there isn't as far as I'm aware

you can find out the 'catastral value' of a property - but that might bear no resemblance to what it last sold for


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

Old prices are not made public in Spain. Apparently you can pay the council to get the sold price for a particular property. Best bet is to ask the consierge if there is one - they tend to know these things.


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## lma (Apr 22, 2014)

Bad news, but thanks very much for clearing it up for me. Can't understand why this isn't made public! I guess I'm too used to the systems at home-- I would have kept looking if someone hadn't been able to tell me that there was no joy to be had.

Very difficult to tell from this is the seller is just chancing their arm or not regards the price, but I guess I'll just have to muddle on without any kind of guide.

Thanks again for the clarification.


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

lma said:


> Bad news, but thanks very much for clearing it up for me. Can't understand why this isn't made public! I guess I'm too used to the systems at home-- I would have kept looking if someone hadn't been able to tell me that there was no joy to be had.
> 
> Very difficult to tell from this is the seller is just chancing their arm or not regards the price, but I guess I'll just have to muddle on without any kind of guide.
> 
> Thanks again for the clarification.


It's one of the biggest problems when it comes to buying in Spain, and yes most asking prices are way too high. Nobody knows what the market value is. Another option is simply to save a load of properties in your target area as favourites on idealista or fotocasa, and wait to see what is selling.


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## Justina (Jan 25, 2013)

*Property*



Chopera said:


> It's one of the biggest problems when it comes to buying in Spain, and yes most asking prices are way too high. Nobody knows what the market value is. Another option is simply to save a load of properties in your target area as favourites on idealista or fotocasa, and wait to see what is selling.


Try offering 20 or 30 per cent less and wait for the reaction.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Offering 20/30% lower than asking can now and then get you a purchase


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

Start low, decide the max you would be willing to pay and bargain up the way. Be prepared to walk away. Try to get to know some local people (expats or not) they might be able to shed some light on values in your street/area.


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## Kyero (Jul 31, 2015)

Hi, Martin from Kyero here. Unfortunately there is no public data about sold prices available in Spain. The government does publish provincial averages but they're close to useless for your purposes. My personal opinion is that there's almost always some wiggle room on the asking price. There's no harm in making a cheeky offer and negotiating. Sorry it's not the answer you're looking for, but there's no reliable data out there to know what price you should be offering. It would be so much more simple buying in Spain if there were.


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## lma (Apr 22, 2014)

Thank you all very much for your helpful and informative replies. I really appreciate it!

Of course this is not the news we were hoping for, but it's good to know all the same. 

We will follow the advice suggested and see how we get along. This is our second time trying for a property-- last time we had to pull out because the vendor would not shift one penny from the asking price, which is why we were hoping to go forward a little better armed this time. 

I suppose we can only try our luck and see what happens. Thank you all once again-- this forum is wonderful, and it is great to be able to get advice here. So many forums have died off because of Facebook, but sometimes you do not want all your work colleagues and neighbours knowing your business before you know it yourself, and posting somewhere like this is far better. It's a great resource, and I really do appreciate all of you taking the time to comment here.


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## evertheoptimist (Apr 4, 2013)

*Offers*



lma said:


> Bad news, but thanks very much for clearing it up for me. Can't understand why this isn't made public! I guess I'm too used to the systems at home-- I would have kept looking if someone hadn't been able to tell me that there was no joy to be had.
> 
> Very difficult to tell from this is the seller is just chancing their arm or not regards the price, but I guess I'll just have to muddle on without any kind of guide.
> 
> Thanks again for the clarification.


I would just put in a really low offer and then work my way up to my estimated valuation of the property.


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## red52 (Aug 1, 2015)

Controversial but maybe you should offer what you think it is worth?
If you don't think the seller's price is justifiable it's simple; don't express an interest or be up front about you intention regarding the price


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## Simon22 (May 22, 2015)

Several places we viewed were way over valued, all were being sold by Brits trying to get their money back.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Simon22 said:


> Several places we viewed were way over valued, all were being sold by Brits trying to get their money back.


Genuine question - how do you know that they are overpriced? Given that you (sometimes) can't judge one property against the next as they are so individual and also given that there is no database of house prices, who can say what their vaue truly is.


I've always said that a property is only worth what someone is willing to pay.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Judging by the people I know who have had their houses on the market for years and still not sold them, they are not so much trying to get their money back, because they bought them well before the crash at prices lower than they would sell for now, but they still expect to make a profit and, most importantly, they see how much they would have to pay for a property back in the UK and expect that to make a difference to how much their house in Spain should sell for - which of course it won't.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Good advice Snikpoh

As my grandad used to say - it doesn't matter if you're cold and wet, as long as you're warm and dry


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## red52 (Aug 1, 2015)

Simon22 said:


> Several places we viewed were way over valued, all were being sold by Brits trying to get their money back.


Just curious why you viewed them if they were way overvalued, surely you new the price, location, condition etc before the viewing?

Or were they simply asking for more than you wanted to pay?


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## lma (Apr 22, 2014)

red52 said:


> Controversial but maybe you should offer what you think it is worth?
> If you don't think the seller's price is justifiable it's simple; don't express an interest or be up front about you intention regarding the price


The difficulty is, I have no idea what the property is worth. Without concrete facts to go on (i.e., knowing a comparable property in the area sold for more/less recently), you're really just taking shots in the dark. Something could be more than I'm willing to pay and still be a good deal for somebody else. My idea of a bargain could be someone else's grossly overpriced. 

Like any buyer, I want to pay no more than the absolute lowest price the seller will accept. I guess what I'm hoping to do is find out if there's a general trend with the asking price being close to that figure, or whether most sellers are putting their properties on the market for a lot more than they expect to achieve in reality hoping that someone will come in and offer the asking price.

I will definitely make a first offer at about 15% below asking price and see where that gets me. Thanks again for all the advice, folks.


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

I would start lower than 15% under.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Lynn R said:


> Judging by the people I know who have had their houses on the market for years and still not sold them, they are not so much trying to get their money back, because they bought them well before the crash at prices lower than they would sell for now, but they still expect to make a profit and, most importantly, they see how much they would have to pay for a property back in the UK and expect that to make a difference to how much their house in Spain should sell for - which of course it won't.


Yes and now the pound is higher they will take another hit. The CDS market is strange, many seem not to care if they sell or not. Some seem hopelessly overvalued others a bargain. I know someone who couldn't believe their luck when a green Brit came along and offered a couple of thousand less than asking price, they were expecting to reduce a lot more. The best way to know the value is if you know someone not connected to the property market who knows a small area well.


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## Simon22 (May 22, 2015)

snikpoh said:


> Genuine question - how do you know that they are overpriced? Given that you (sometimes) can't judge one property against the next as they are so individual and also given that there is no database of house prices, who can say what their vaue truly is.
> 
> 
> I've always said that a property is only worth what someone is willing to pay.


The area we were looking at had a type of house, which was the same throughout the area, there were modifications you could make and as such you could price the places according to the spec and location. We saw many variants and many prices but the very top range were the British owned ones, which needed at least as much work as the cheaper ones but they had paid a high price and are not willing to compromise. 

We actually offered within 2000e of their asking price (not the listed price) and they would not budge. The one next door came up at 10,000 less and and sold very quickly. The other is still for sale and they are now back in the UK and we have moved on.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

If/ when I get round to making a Spanish purchase after research of similar properties etc I will offer around 15% less than asking price- to cover my buying costs

Therefore currently when we look at prices online we envisage the price advertised as being our total outlay.


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## Simon22 (May 22, 2015)

Rabbitcat said:


> If/ when I get round to making a Spanish purchase after research of similar properties etc I will offer around 15% less than asking price- to cover my buying costs
> 
> Therefore currently when we look at prices online we envisage the price advertised as being our total outlay.


We agreed on ours at 12.5% off the advertised price, we are also getting the furniture and white goods included.


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

I have a house we are interested in and its around 160k which we would like to get for around 140k I think that would be a fair offer as its only been on for a couple of months. I can and will watch it for a while before we make an offer and if it goes, well there are plenty more on the market.

Do others think this is realistic?


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## emlyn (Oct 26, 2012)

Roy C said:


> I have a house we are interested in and its around 160k which we would like to get for around 140k I think that would be a fair offer as its only been on for a couple of months. I can and will watch it for a while before we make an offer and if it goes, well there are plenty more on the market. Do others think this is realistic?


Difficult to say without knowing more about it.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Roy C said:


> I have a house we are interested in and its around 160k which we would like to get for around 140k I think that would be a fair offer as its only been on for a couple of months. I can and will watch it for a while before we make an offer and if it goes, well there are plenty more on the market.
> 
> Do others think this is realistic?


I suppose I would need to know more about the house- and especially how much you want it. For what its worth my own opinion is at 160k an offer of 140k in the current climate of a buyers market- is more than fair.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Isobella said:


> The CDS market is strange, many seem not to care if they sell or not. Some seem hopelessly overvalued others a bargain. .


It's just the same here-

As an example, some people we know have had their house on the market for 3 years. It's an old townhouse in the centre of town, hallway, kitchen, living room (which has no windows and there's no room for a dining table other than a folding one they sometimes use in the hall), 3 beds, 3 baths, patio with a couple of storerooms off, roof terrace which has no views as it's low down in the town and surrounded by buildings, directly opposite the house is a vacant building plot with an ugly breezeblock wall around it which the house looks onto, no garage and you can't even park outside since the Council made the street a no-parking zone. They have it on the market for €250,000.

By contrast, I noticed another house advertised for the first time a couple of weeks ago (no idea who it belongs to). It's higher up so has lovely views, has 2 living rooms, kitchen, 5 bedrooms, 3 bathrooms, a patio with a jacuzzi (not something I'd want but somebody else might), a number of terraces, storerooms and a double garage (quite rare so houses with them tend to sell quicker). The asking price is €129,000.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

I am always intrigued by the brits and the statement 



> It was way overvalued


Its worth what someone will pay. Again it goes back to the old chestnut are you buying a home or an investment. Whilst no one wants to sell later down the line and loose money that can happen anywhere. In Spain it seems to me, its not what it will sell for its how long it will take, if a house has been on the market for years it could still be worth that money, its just thats theres no takers. Houses are so persona. When we moved here last year we had a set budget. The house had to fall into that budget. IF it was ready to go go go then we were happy to offer higher, If we had work to do ( which in this case we did) we offered what we thought was a fair price to us allowing for the said works to be completed. We never looked at properties way above our price range. This particular house was on the market for a few years. It was on for approx €110K its a decent house with a hectare of land but to us it was not work that amount. We offered well below that with a list of why we were offering that amount. The seller rejected the first offer, we countered by 750€ and it was accepted. We have seen other properties cheaper than this and way more expensive BUT this was our house, this was exactly what we wanted. Having said that we would not have made another increased offer because it was not worth it too us. Obviously to the seller it was. Bit rambling sorry


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## Simon22 (May 22, 2015)

In our case we viewed five identically built houses, being sold unfurnished with minor differences (gas or electric hot water etc) but the asking price was 49,000e up to 63,000e. Some had been upgraded and had new (extended) kitchens and bathrooms and these were still around 58,000. So the old unimproved ones at 60,000+ are not going to sell while the cheaper ones are on the market. 
Granted, eventually they will have sold and then people might look at the dearer ones but for now there is a steady stream of cheaper ones.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

It is useful to do a bit of research before deciding on an offer. Ones that have been on the market years may have already reduced by as much as 40% and it is their bottom price. Others that have only been on the market a couple of months may be at top price and more room for offers. I have noticed that most start high and price reduces after a few months. Same in the UK.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

What really grinds my gears is the different prices being quoted by different agents for the same house- in one case a property we like is 40k different between agents


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Isobella said:


> It is useful to do a bit of research before deciding on an offer. Ones that have been on the market years may have already reduced by as much as 40% and it is their bottom price. Others that have only been on the market a couple of months may be at top price and more room for offers. I have noticed that most start high and price reduces after a few months. Same in the UK.


I saw one house on a website that I liked the look of, the price was shown as €170,000 (reduced from €190,000). However, at the end of the details the price history was shown - it had first been on at €158,000, then within a couple of months went up to €170,000, after a year went UP to €190,000 then shortly afterwards down to €170,000 again. I reckon they only put the price up just to be able to say it had been reduced.


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## Simon22 (May 22, 2015)

Lynn R said:


> I reckon they only put the price up just to be able to say it had been reduced.


Well shops do exactly that so why not estate agents?


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Simon22 said:


> Well shops do exactly that so why not estate agents?


It's rather stupid when any prospective purchaser can see it set down in black and white though. If I were interested I'd print a copy off and tell the agent I regarded €158,000 as the real asking price for that house, and make an offer at least 10% below that.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

I think what happens is that some Agents "steal" property listings from other Agents and then add more on because they will probably have to share the commission. It happened to us. Saw our house advertised in a window for much more than we had asked. I went in and asked on whose instruction they had to sell the house and told them to take it out of window. We have always been very clear and signed a contract with the Agent to sell on our behalf.

In defence of other Agents some sellers may reduce but forget to tell if they have it listed with a few.


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

Isobella said:


> I think what happens is that some Agents "steal" property listings from other Agents and then add more on because they will probably have to share the commission. It happened to us. Saw our house advertised in a window for much more than we had asked. I went in and asked on whose instruction they had to sell the house and told them to take it out of window. We have always been very clear and signed a contract with the Agent to sell on our behalf.
> 
> In defence of other Agents some sellers may reduce but forget to tell if they have it listed with a few.


Yes it happens a lot. Unlike the UK the contract between the seller and the agent appears not be so exlusive, and other agents quite happily advertise properties taken from other agents. If a potential buyer contacts them they then go to the genuine agent (who has the keys) and try to negotiate a viewing. I guess if the genuine agent says "no" the other agent can go back to the potential buyer and tell them the property is sold.


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