# Duty and Vat: Shipping Household Goods from Non-EU Countries



## Larry and Arlene

We have been living as Elective Residents in Ascoli Piceno for almost three years. We chose to have a few remaining household items, furniture and kitchenware, etc, keep in storage should we decide to return to the U.S. But the main issue was we weren't certain what we would find in the way of accommodations. We have now decided to stay here indefinitely.
In looking into shipping some of our items to us, it seems there is an only six month window after taking up residence in Italy to waive import duty on personal household items that had been in your possession for a year prior to departure. Not only would our effects be subject to import duty, but also Value Added Tax (VAT) would apply apparently based on cost plus insurance and cost of shipping. Considering some of the furniture is over 25 years old, this is pain we hadn't counted on. We are still researching but the inability to get definitive answers is maddening.
The purpose of this post is primarily to alert fellow Expats heading this way to research this issue carefully in your planning. We love Italy but the labyrinth of the Italian Bureaucracy makes the Divine Comedy look like advertising for a vacation spot.


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## NickZ

I'm not sure what the issue is but importing isn't any different then any other country . 

You've got a few things going against you. Much of the imports in Italy are coming from the EU or other duty free zones. 

The other issue is you don't need to consider the location of the good but the place of it's manufacture. 


On used goods I'd be surprised if it's based on cost. It's likely on value. 

What shipping company do you intend to use? They should have the info at hand.

But start here

Buying goods online coming from a non-European Union country - European Commission

TARIC Consultation

You may find paying the shipper to fill out the paperwork etc worth it. OTOH they might not pick the most advantageous class for each item.


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## Larry and Arlene

Ciao Nick. Thanks for the response. The issue simply is the import duty and VAT (IVA) procedures are naturally concerned with commercial and re-sale transactions. Retirees coming from outside the EU are sufficiently below the noise threshold there is little clear information available. We realize coming from the U.S. is not a factor and our well-used goods are of U.S. domestic origin. As we are not attempting to import anything embargoed or items the Italians are in an import duty war over, we don't see country of origin to be an issue. As in most things in Italy, particularly on administrative matters, for every five officials you talk to or web sites you consult there are at least ten interpretations with no one having any idea who has the definitive word. The Agenzia dell Dogane and Entrate sites are silent on the treatment of used personal effects not intended for resale or containing any contraband items. What out shipping contacts tell us that much is left up to the discretion of the customs and tax people handling the particular import at the port of arrival. And that seems to make us nervous. My main intent was to encourage people coming this way to give this issue some thought as it appears, as usual, little is very definitive. Thanks very much again for the appreciated input.


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## NickZ

It doesn't matter if it's used or not. It doesn't matter if it's for resale. It just makes it harder to come up with a value. I'd expect them to go with the insurance amount.

Country of manufacturer matters because the duty rates depend on that. For example next year the EU/Canada FTA is supposed to go into effect. Some thing made in Canada might be duty free next year OTOH the same item made in the US wouldn't be. 

You don't need to rely on the Italian websites. Duty is EU wide. The EU websites I posted are in English. The UK websites are also. You'll need to browse the listings to find the best class for each good.

There are only three VAT levels in Italy. It's almost certain the goods you're bringing in are at the top VAT level.


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## Larry and Arlene

Thank you very much Nick for the very helpful responses. We have yet to hear from some shipping sources in the U.S. to get more refined estimates. An unfortunate reality seems to be the the majority of people arriving in Italy as Expats appear to be from EU countries. Here east of the Apennines, there a a few Americans scattered about but by far, the majority of the English speakers are from the UK for obvious reasons.
Part of our concerns have been fueled by the experiences of some non-EU people who seem to have encountered some degree of arbitrariness on Duty and VAT issues. We understand that some hope for standardization exists within the EU framework, but regrettably, that does not always seem to filter down to the local Italian implementation level. Many thanks again.




NickZ said:


> It doesn't matter if it's used or not. It doesn't matter if it's for resale. It just makes it harder to come up with a value. I'd expect them to go with the insurance amount.
> 
> Country of manufacturer matters because the duty rates depend on that. For example next year the EU/Canada FTA is supposed to go into effect. Some thing made in Canada might be duty free next year OTOH the same item made in the US wouldn't be.
> 
> You don't need to rely on the Italian websites. Duty is EU wide. The EU websites I posted are in English. The UK websites are also. You'll need to browse the listings to find the best class for each good.
> 
> There are only three VAT levels in Italy. It's almost certain the goods you're bringing in are at the top VAT level.


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## orvinio

*don't ship*



Larry and Arlene said:


> We have been living as Elective Residents in Ascoli Piceno for almost three years. We chose to have a few remaining household items, furniture and kitchenware, etc, keep in storage should we decide to return to the U.S. But the main issue was we weren't certain what we would find in the way of accommodations. We have now decided to stay here indefinitely.
> In looking into shipping some of our items to us, it seems there is an only six month window after taking up residence in Italy to waive import duty on personal household items that had been in your possession for a year prior to departure. Not only would our effects be subject to import duty, but also Value Added Tax (VAT) would apply apparently based on cost plus insurance and cost of shipping. Considering some of the furniture is over 25 years old, this is pain we hadn't counted on. We are still researching but the inability to get definitive answers is maddening.
> The purpose of this post is primarily to alert fellow Expats heading this way to research this issue carefully in your planning. We love Italy but the labyrinth of the Italian Bureaucracy makes the Divine Comedy look like advertising for a vacation spot.


 We are now in the fourth month of a very expensive shipping of 3540 ponds of stuff. And now the but. $8800 and still counting not including vat etc..You can refurnish your home for $8800 don't do it We hired an attorney or it would have been longer and more costly. We have to have a bonded trucker, I happened to be a bonded trucker in america, and I never received $4 per mile . VAT/duty is very arbitrary, plus we are now at 150 pages of paperwork. My wife is an EU national does not make any difference and speaks fluent Italian. Don't do it. Italian furniture is great as is the clothing. Make new memories with your new stuff


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## orvinio

orvinio said:


> We are now in the fourth month of a very expensive shipping of 3540 ponds of stuff. And now the but. $8800 and still counting not including vat etc..You can refurnish your home for $8800 don't do it We hired an attorney or it would have been longer and more costly. We have to have a bonded trucker, I happened to be a bonded trucker in america, and I never received $4 per mile . VAT/duty is very arbitrary, plus we are now at 150 pages of paperwork. My wife is an EU national does not make any difference and speaks fluent Italian. Don't do it. Italian furniture is great as is the clothing. Make new memories with your new stuff


Permesso di soggiorno took 9 months and 1 day, We had planned on bringing our vehicles over. Impossible to register for the road. You need a european certificate of conformity, Gas engine toyota pickups and gas engine subarus do not have cerificates. We gave up when basic paperwork and shipping was going to top $10000 per vehicle. The fact we bought a house in my wifes home town made no change. I have my own health coverage still all a big pain. I love living here but none of the guidebooks tell the whole story. I can drive for a while until I need to take the test in Italian then its someone else driving.


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## Italia-Mx

orvinio said:


> We are now in the fourth month of a very expensive shipping of 3540 ponds of stuff. And now the but. $8800 and still counting not including vat etc..You can refurnish your home for $8800 don't do it We hired an attorney or it would have been longer and more costly. We have to have a bonded trucker, I happened to be a bonded trucker in america, and I never received $4 per mile . VAT/duty is very arbitrary, plus we are now at 150 pages of paperwork. My wife is an EU national does not make any difference and speaks fluent Italian. Don't do it. Italian furniture is great as is the clothing. Make new memories with your new stuff


I totally agree. It's not worth bringing household goods from the US to Italy. If you can't separate yourself from your American things, maybe you shouldn't be leaving America. In addition, they just won't "fit in" over here. We have great furniture and appliances in Italy in all price ranges and you can make a home look totally fabulous for way less than it would cost you in the US.


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## orvinio

Where were you before. I enjoy living in Italy Our stuff has been in storage for 5 years. we don't even remember some of the items. we bought a fiat panda great car . For my partner it is not a change to live here for me the only problems have been paperwork but as we close in on the end it is getting easier.


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## Italia-Mx

I spent most of my life on the East coast. Last ten years of my career, I spent in Austin, TX. From there I moved to Mexico but only stayed 18 months because I learned I was an Italian citizen so I obtained my passport and came to live in Abruzzo, my ancestral homeland and have been here 15 years. I did take an extended vacation back in Mexico after I had been in Italy for nearly ten years and I can tell you life is so much better in Italy than in Mexico. Really there is no comparison.

Also, my companion, who also obtained his Italian passport, joined me in Italy five years ago. He emptied out his house in the US and of course, put things in storage, just in case he didn't "like" Italy. He hasn't seen or needed those things the entire five years so he recently had a kind relative empty out the unit so he could stop paying the monthly charge and the relative disposed of everything as he saw fit. They're only things and they're replaceable with, in my opinon, much nicer things to buy in Italy or in other EU countries.


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## Larry and Arlene

orvinio said:


> Where were you before. I enjoy living in Italy Our stuff has been in storage for 5 years. we don't even remember some of the items. we bought a fiat panda great car . For my partner it is not a change to live here for me the only problems have been paperwork but as we close in on the end it is getting easier.


I think we would like to reaffirm our original intent of posting this thread. With all the research we did prior to making the ExPat to Italy move, we missed the 6 month window for avoiding duty on shipping household effects. The sole purpose in posting the thread was to make other people aware of it for their planning.

Somewhere along the line, we figured out there are so many unique circumstances in other people's lives that determine their priorities. So we choose to decline making pronouncements on what everyone else should do. What we have tried to offer is simply to say what we have done so others can decide for themselves what would work best for them.

To answer your question, when we left, we kept a small 'stash' of items in case we decided to retreat if things didn't work out. After three years, we have decided that returning is far less likely so paying monthly storage as a premium on just-in-case returning insurance while stuff deteriorates and isn't being used, is making less sense. Every year the storage rate has gone up. After awhile, storage fees offset shipping costs.

We are soon going back to clean out the storage and get rid of more stuff that we don't see using again. There will be items of sentimental value that would be impossible to replace that we will ship. The cost benefit analysis of what makes sense to us is, when all is said and done, a totally individual decision on our part. That is a decision everyone has to reach on their own.


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## sancerre

When does the "6 month window" begin? From the date you enter Italy, or the date you receive your Pds? I will have the same situation (leaving some things behind in storage). Thank you.


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## BBCWatcher

Given those two choices, it'd have to be the former. The latter is fairly unpredictable.


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## Larry and Arlene

sancerre said:


> When does the "6 month window" begin? From the date you enter Italy, or the date you receive your Pds? I will have the same situation (leaving some things behind in storage). Thank you.


Our experience is that entering on the basis of an 'Elective Residence Visa' the clock on start of residency processing starts for administrative purposes on the date you enter as stamped in your passport.

ON THAT NOTE: BE CERTAIN THE IMMIGRATION OFFICER STAMPS YOUR PASSPORT AS ENTERING ITALY WHEN YOU ARRIVE. In this day of electronic scanning of passports, there are instances when they do not stamp passports because their record is electronic. But in processing for the Permesso, they will want to see a date stamped in your passport because you have eight days from arrival to start your processing.

Italy being Italy, the date shown on your Permesso de Soggiorno is the date your application was submitted as indicated by the receipt from the postal authorities. No matter how long it takes to be issued. Ours was issued in something like under 90 days first time less than 60 on renewal. So in all things here, most things 'depend.' But for safety, take the date stamped on arrival for start of the process of residency.

The best advice we got in retaining any vestige of sanity is, DO NOT ATTEMPT TO BRING AMERICA TO ITALY. THIS IS A DIFFERENT PLACE AND THEY DO THINGS THEIR WAY. WHAT YOU ARE USED TO HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT YOU WILL HAVE TO LIVE WITH.


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## orvinio

Now as of may 25 2016 the balance is $9700 for 3540 lbs of stuff. Don't start me about shipping insurance, many conditions. Think about are your memories worth $10000.


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## orvinio

If I am repeating myself It is my fault I am new to expat chat. we are now as of may 25 2016 up to$10000 yup the price of a new panda in italy. Is your stuff worth 10 grand?


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## RachelGiada

Sometime back I had decided to let go of the items I wanted to bring with me, furnishings, etc. 

You ae getting some great advice here from many people, take advantage of it please. 

I decided when our hose sold all the furniture would go to whomever wanted it in the family the rest I donated to the needy. Having to part with 3 wine refrigs and all the wine was heartbreaking. The family made out like bandits  

It was hard to part with stuff but I also knew it was for the best. I am now living in a furnished house preparing to come over in September to get my citizenship done, I have no plans of coming back except for the Christmas holidays. I did keep about 400 pounds of personal stuff, glassware, silverware from my moms time, pictures and one telescope that weighs in at 125 pounds. I am selling my car, it is not worth paying to have it shipped. 

Sometimes you just need to let things go and start new. So if you have family and friends that can go through your storage then its time to let go?

All the best to you!

Rachel Giada


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## PauloPievese

Back at the top of this thread there is the statement "there is an ...six month window after taking up residence in Italy to waive import duty." Is this correct?


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## KenzoXIV

RachelGiada said:


> Sometime back I had decided to let go of the items I wanted to bring with me, furnishings, etc.
> 
> You ae getting some great advice here from many people, take advantage of it please.
> 
> I decided when our hose sold all the furniture would go to whomever wanted it in the family the rest I donated to the needy. Having to part with 3 wine refrigs and all the wine was heartbreaking. The family made out like bandits
> 
> It was hard to part with stuff but I also knew it was for the best. I am now living in a furnished house preparing to come over in September to get my citizenship done, I have no plans of coming back except for the Christmas holidays. I did keep about 400 pounds of personal stuff, glassware, silverware from my moms time, pictures and one telescope that weighs in at 125 pounds. I am selling my car, it is not worth paying to have it shipped.
> 
> Sometimes you just need to let things go and start new. So if you have family and friends that can go through your storage then its time to let go?
> 
> All the best to you!
> 
> Rachel Giada


100% agree! Travel light! Stuff to remain attached to should be small, everything else disposible! It can be hard to let go if you have built up over many years but unfortunately the cost of moving stuff normally outweighs the true value of it.

Kenzo


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