# Child in front seat



## Flavos (Mar 6, 2014)

HI can anyone advise on the law in relation to a child being in the front passenger seat, if the vehicle doesn't have airbags and the child is in a childseat etc, thanks


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

Minimum age for a child to be in the front seat is 12 years and they have to be a minimum height of (I think) 135 cms). Less than 135 cms then they must be in the back in a booster seat or approved child seat.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Flavos said:


> HI can anyone advise on the law in relation to a child being in the front passenger seat, if the vehicle doesn't have airbags and the child is in a childseat etc, thanks


I don't think there's a difference between with airbag as opposed to without - but children under 12 or if they are shorter than 135cm, can sit in the front seat if they are in an approved carseat - in fact _anyone_ shorter than 135cm is supposed to use a special carseat, wherever they sit in the car!

Sillas para niños en coches - Seguridad Vial Infantil


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

I'm not sure if that is correct. Good news for our friend who was fined for having her 9 year old in the front seat in an approved car seat. The Guardia traffico told her in no uncertain terms, under 12 back seat, no exceptions. But then this is Spain so maybe different areas have different interpretations??


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

thrax said:


> I'm not sure if that is correct. Good news for our friend who was fined for having her 9 year old in the front seat in an approved car seat. The Guardia traffico told her in no uncertain terms, under 12 back seat, no exceptions. But then this is Spain so maybe different areas have different interpretations??


I thought that was the case as well - & to be on the safe side I'd go with it


this quotes from the national law though 


> *Queda prohibido circular con menores de 12 años situados en los asientos delanteros del vehículo,* salvo que utilicen dispositivos homologados al efecto. Excepcionalmente, cuando su estatura sea igual o superior a 135 centímetros, los menores de doce años podrán utilizar como tal dispositivo el propio cinturón de seguridad para adultos de que estén dotados los asientos delanteros.



& it's mentioned several times on the DGT website that under 12 /135cm is OK as long as they are in an approved seat

Se intesifican los controles sobe el uso de cinturón y SRI


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

The airbag thing is important when referring to babies


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Pesky Wesky said:


> The airbag thing is important when referring to babies


Not really because they are not allowed in the front.

I agree with Thrax, I recall a change in law earlier this year stating that under 1.35m or under 12's MUST only sit in the back of a car. (I could be wrong, of course.)


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> Not really because they are not allowed in the front.
> 
> I agree with Thrax, I recall a change in law earlier this year stating that under 1.35m or under 12's MUST only sit in the back of a car. (I could be wrong, of course.)


according to the DGT the only change as far as car seats & children are concerned was this 



> *Se inmovilizará el coche sin sillita.* Aumentan los casos de inmovilización del vehículo: por no hacer uso del dispositivo de retención infantil; por incumplir las condiciones de la autorización que habilita la circulación; y por conducir un vehículo para el que se exige permiso de las clases C o D, careciendo de autorización. Los gastos de inmovilización correrán a cargo del conductor.



which essentially just says that they can stop you driving your car if you don't have the correct car seat for a child

Reforma de la Ley de Seguridad Vial


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## marthassos (Jan 13, 2014)

This is a very interesting topic. My daughter is 9 and is 140cm's so essentially in the UK she can ride up front without her booster seat.

I've just let her know that when we make the move in 45 days (I'm not counting, honest!) she will be firmly downgraded to the back seats.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> Not really because they are not allowed in the front.
> 
> I agree with Thrax, I recall a change in law earlier this year stating that under 1.35m or under 12's MUST only sit in the back of a car. (I could be wrong, of course.)


But they are.
What you have to do is disconnect the airbag and use the correct seat.
From the Mapfre web page called _How a new born should travel in a car_

*LO QUE DEBES SABER... WHAT YOU SHOULD KNOW* 

*Fundamental: *desconecta el airbag del pasajero si tienes que colocar la silla delante. *FUNDAMENTAL: *Disconnect the the passenger airbag if you have to put the seat in the front of the car.

Jan 2014
Cómo debe ir en el coche un bebé recién nacido - Cómo debe ir en el coche un bebé recién nacido


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> But they are.
> What you have to do is disconnect the airbag and use the correct seat.
> From the Mapfre web page called _How a new born should travel in a car_
> 
> ...


thanks - I was beginning to think I was going mad!


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Pesky Wesky said:


> But they are.
> What you have to do is disconnect the airbag and use the correct seat.
> From the Mapfre web page called _How a new born should travel in a car_
> 
> ...



Hmmm. Just because an insurance company says something doesn't make it correct . 

I'll have to see if I can find what I thought I'd read somewhere.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> Hmmm. Just because an insurance company says something doesn't make it correct .
> 
> I'll have to see if I can find what I thought I'd read somewhere.
> 
> /SNIP/http://www.tumbit.com/news/articles/8853-20-new-rules-for-spains-road-users.html


Mapfre is one of the biggest if not the biggest insurance company in Spain. If that information, that has been on its page since January, was wrong they could have been taken to court and sued hundreds of times and their business would have probably collapsed. Anyway, if you're still not convinced, try this from the DGT itself.
La DGT intensifica la vigilancia del uso del cinturón de seguridad y los sistemas de retención infantil


> Cuando se adquiera un sistema de retención infantil es importante comprobar que la silla es homologada y que la instalación de la misma en el vehículo es la correcta. La mejor opción es el anclaje mediante el sistema ISOFIX. Una sillita mal colocada multiplica por cuatro el riesgo de muerte infantil en caso de accidente de tráfico.
> Desactivar el airbag cuando se coloca la silla en el asiento delantero, en sentido contrario a la marcha.


Followed by this
​ *Asientos delanteros*​ *Asientos traseros*​ *Responsable*​ *Menores de 12 años*​ Queda prohibido circular con menores de 12 años situados en los asientos delanteros del vehículo, salvo que utilicen dispositivos homologados al efecto.​ Los menores de 12 años cuya estatura no alcance los 1,35m, deberán utilizar obligatoriamente un dispositivo de retención adaptado a su talla y peso​ El conductor​ *Menores de 12 años de estatura igual o superior a 1,35m*​ Excepcionalmente, cuando su estatura sea igual o superior a 1, 35 m, los menores de 12 años podrán utilizar el cinturón de seguridad para adultos de que estén dotados los asientos.​ Se podrá utilizar indistintamente un dispositivo de retención homologado adaptado a su talla y peso o el cinturón de seguridad para adultos​ El conductor​
I think the problem we are having with this may be twofold
A) When you look at the legislation in detail it does say something about if all the back seats are taken up by people under 1,35 or under 12's that an under 12 year old or under 1,35 can travel in the front seat if properly harnessed ie with the correct seat and belt.
And, 
B It seems that there is special provision for young babies, but I'm not sure until what age.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Or maybe it's one of those laws that has been passed by the government but isn't actually "in action" yet.


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

I do remember reading that when the new laws were published; something about it being illegal for any child under 12 or 135 cms to travel in the front passenger seat UNLESS all rear seats were occupied by other children. And of course that seems to be ridiculous but this is Spain after all...


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

thrax said:


> I do remember reading that when the new laws were published; something about it being illegal for any child under 12 or 135 cms to travel in the front passenger seat UNLESS all rear seats were occupied by other children. And of course that seems to be ridiculous but this is Spain after all...


seems totally logical to me

if the back seat is available then the child sits in the back

if you have 4 children in the car, then one can sit in the front, in a proper car seat


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

thrax said:


> I do remember reading that when the new laws were published; something about it being illegal for any child under 12 or 135 cms to travel in the front passenger seat UNLESS all rear seats were occupied by other children. And of course that seems to be ridiculous but this is Spain after all...


Yes, Spain, where people are perhaps likely to have bigger families (at least in the past) and where the back seat might already be full up of small individuals.

(I think you pointed this out before and I also wrote about it in a previous post)


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## Flavos (Mar 6, 2014)

I have a Jeep Wrangler which has 2 normal seats with headrests in the front,and a bench seat in the rear (without headrests) my 4 year old sits in a child seat in the back, as child seat offers whiplash protection if rear ended, my 4 year old sits on a booster seat in the front there are no airbags as the vehicle is some 20 years old, it is a lot safer for him to sit in the front does this mean it is illegal? Also what happens if you have a pickup with only 2 seats? can a child go in the vehicle?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Flavos said:


> I have a Jeep Wrangler which has 2 normal seats with headrests in the front,and a bench seat in the rear (without headrests) my 4 year old sits in a child seat in the back, as child seat offers whiplash protection if rear ended, my 4 year old sits on a booster seat in the front there are no airbags as the vehicle is some 20 years old, it is a lot safer for him to sit in the front does this mean it is illegal? Also what happens if you have a pickup with only 2 seats? can a child go in the vehicle?


I very much doubt that anyone on a forum can tell you the answer to this as probably not even the Guardia Civil themselves would be able to agree on what was right. 
In your position I would go to the Guardia Civil, ask them for their opinion and very nicely ask them to issue you with a document that verifies whatever they tell you as you would like to avoid future misunderstandings.
But you would also need to check with the insurance company to make sure sure you are covered in the event of an accident


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

The next car I buy is only going to have rear seats thus avoiding any issues.


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

xabiachica said:


> seems totally logical to me
> 
> if the back seat is available then the child sits in the back
> 
> if you have 4 children in the car, then one can sit in the front, in a proper car seat


But here is where the logic might break down. You have three children in the back and one if the front. All legal until you drop one off at a school and there isn't space or time to have the one in the front go to the back. So in such a happenstance (I rarely use that word) the child in the front goes from legal to criminal in a few short seconds...


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

thrax said:


> But here is where the logic might break down. You have three children in the back and one if the front. All legal until you drop one off at a school and there isn't space or time to have the one in the front go to the back. So in such a happenstance (I rarely use that word) the child in the front goes from legal to criminal in a few short seconds...


simple..... make sure the one getting out first sits in the front.............


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