# June 18 2012



## MaidenScotland

Egypt's ruling military has issued a declaration apparently granting itself sweeping powers, as the country awaits results of presidential elections.

The document by the Supreme Council of Armed Forces (Scaf) reportedly says new general elections can not be held until a permanent constitution is drawn up.

It also allegedly gives the Scaf legislative control.

Meanwhile, the Muslim Brotherhood says its candidate, Mohammed Mursi, has won Sunday's presidential election.

Mr Mursi, an Islamist, is competing against Ahmed Shafiq, who served as prime minister under former President Hosni Mubarak.

Mr Mursi's Muslim Brotherhood said he was holding a 52%-48% lead over Mr Shafiq with almost all the vote counted after Sunday's second-round run-off election.

Speaking at his party headquarters, Mr Mursi pledged to be a president for all Egyptians, adding that he would not "seek revenge or settle scores".

"Thanks be to God who has guided Egypt's people to the path of freedom and democracy, uniting the Egyptians to a better future," he said.


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## MaidenScotland

"Egyptians are tired of voting," remarked Shadi Hamid, director of research at the Brookings Centre in Doha.

After 29 days of voting over the past year, "Egyptians still haven't seen a tangible improvement in their lives," he said.


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## Bon Bon

Poor people lost in this hell


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## Sonrisa

I dont know what to say, its like the months since the revolution have been one freak circus show. But at the same time, it was clear from the beginning that military were not going to let go of power, they just needed a new puppet. 

On the other hand, since it was clear that they were never going to be such thing as free and fair elections, a pArt if me is relieved that the show its over, so maybe now they can concentrate in addressing the many economic problems and challenges for the egyptian peopld that This beautiful county is facing.


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## Whitedesert

Sonrisa said:


> I dont know what to say, its like the months since the revolution have been one freak circus show. But at the same time, it was clear from the beginning that military were not going to let go of power, they just needed a new puppet.
> 
> On the other hand, since it was clear that they were never going to be such thing as free and fair elections, a pArt if me is relieved that the show its over, so maybe now they can concentrate in addressing the many economic problems and challenges for the egyptian peopld that This beautiful county is facing.


 I find myself thinking that I agree with you! And that scares the hell out of me, because I should not!!


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## CAIRODEMON

Sonrisa said:


> I dont know what to say, its like the months since the revolution have been one freak circus show. But at the same time, it was clear from the beginning that military were not going to let go of power, they just needed a new puppet.
> 
> On the other hand, since it was clear that they were never going to be such thing as free and fair elections, a pArt if me is relieved that the show its over, so maybe now they can concentrate in addressing the many economic problems and challenges for the egyptian peopld that This beautiful county is facing.


I know for a fact that the military does not want to keep power, and therefore be blamed for the further decent into chaos which will happen. It just wants the old status quo restoring when it could run its many commercial enterprises and not have its budget scrutinised.

Also, if it did want Shawfik elected, and assuming that it could influence the Supreme Court, then it displayed lousy judgement and timing, since many swing voters were driven into the Morsi camp as a result of Thursday's ruling.


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## MaidenScotland

CAIRODEMON said:


> I know for a fact that the military does not want to keep power, and therefore be blamed for the further decent into chaos which will happen. It just wants the old status quo restoring when it could run its many commercial enterprises and not have its budget scrutinised.
> 
> Also, if it did want Shawfik elected, and assuming that it could influence the Supreme Court, then it displayed lousy judgement and timing, since many swing voters were driven into the Morsi camp as a result of Thursday's ruling.




sorry to disagree but the only fact that is fact in Egypt is... facts can be changed on a whim,


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## MaidenScotland

Egypt's generals act to negate outcome of presidential poll - Egypt's generals awarded themselves sweeping political powers in an 11th-hour constitutional declaration that tied the hands of the country's incoming president and cemented military authority over the post-Mubarak era.
Egypt's generals act to negate outcome of presidential poll | World news | guardian.co.uk
Egypt: military to hand over power on June 30th, ready or not
Masress : Egypt: military to hand over power on June 30th, ready or not
Shahin: SCAF to hand over power on June 30 in all conditions Egypt State Information Service


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## Sonrisa

CAIRODEMON said:


> Also, if it did want Shawfik elected, and assuming that it could influence the Supreme Court, then it displayed lousy judgement and timing, since many swing voters were driven into the Morsi camp as a result of Thursday's ruling.


Morsi fits the bill just as well. IF not better. After all, it will keep the islamists and various random beards happy. 
Ideal scenario. SCAF runs the show, with a "legitimate" elected islamist as its front. Perfect.
As DG would say: God bless Democracy


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## CAIRODEMON

MaidenScotland said:


> sorry to disagree but the only fact that is fact in Egypt is... facts can be changed on a whim,


It is a fact, I can't say any more since my office is within a military area and whatever I send out is sometimes monitored


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## CAIRODEMON

Sonrisa said:


> Morsi fits the bill just as well. IF not better. After all, it will keep the islamists and various random beards happy.
> Ideal scenario. SCAF runs the show, with a "legitimate" elected islamist as its front. Perfect.
> As DG would say: God bless Democracy


Yes, that's basically my point, everyone seems to think that the army wants Shawfik. Maybe they do, but they are cute enough to realize that that could make their position untenable, and that to hide behind Morsi is the more viable option. Perhaps they have cut a deal with him, I really do not know.


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## MaidenScotland

CAIRODEMON said:


> Yes, that's basically my point, everyone seems to think that the army wants Shawfik. Maybe they do, but they are cute enough to realize that that could make their position untenable, and that to hide behind Morsi is the more viable option. Perhaps they have cut a deal with him, I really do not know.





and what deal would they be cutting if they do not want power?


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## MaidenScotland

CAIRODEMON said:


> Yes, that's basically my point, everyone seems to think that the army wants Shawfik. Maybe they do, but they are cute enough to realize that that could make their position untenable, and that to hide behind Morsi is the more viable option. Perhaps they have cut a deal with him, I really do not know.




What position?

Is the armed forces not there to protect the country from outside forces?


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## CAIRODEMON

MaidenScotland said:


> and what deal would they be cutting if they do not want power?



No supervision of their budget or control over any of their many businesses. They DO want economic power, but do not want to be seen to hold political power and therefore to run the risk of being held accountable.


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## CAIRODEMON

MaidenScotland said:


> What position?
> 
> Is the armed forces not there to protect the country from outside forces?



Normally, yes.


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## MaidenScotland

Not to be seen to be holding power ... lol so they dont want to give it up they just want to hide it.. well that's not news


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## Eco-Mariner

*Monitoring*



CAIRODEMON said:


> It is a fact, I can't say any more since my office is within a military area and whatever I send out is sometimes monitored


Well there you go.

You get Big Brother SCAF watching every move or Big Muslim Brother watching us on religious grounds.

We can't win freedom either way.


Eco-Mariner.


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## CAIRODEMON

Eco-Mariner said:


> Well there you go.
> 
> You get Big Brother SCAF watching every move or Big Muslim Brother watching us on religious grounds.
> 
> We can't win freedom either way.
> 
> 
> Eco-Mariner.


Do you really think that it is so different anywhere else?


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## MaidenScotland

CAIRODEMON said:


> Do you really think that it is so different anywhere else?





Well we are not watched for religious reasons...


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## CAIRODEMON

MaidenScotland said:


> Not to be seen to be holding power ... lol so they dont want to give it up they just want to hide it.. well that's not news


No not quite. They want to transfer some power (look at the caveats that they have imposed upon the new President over the last few days) to someone whom they can control and cannot be directly linked to them, Morsi fits the bill quite well. When (not if IMHO) it all goes pear shaped they can then step in at any time which suits them, and, depending upon how bad things are, they will receive a lot of support. Most Egyptians still consider the army to be one of the more reliable institutions in the country, although that is setting the bar at a very low level.


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## CAIRODEMON

MaidenScotland said:


> Well we are not watched for religious reasons...[/QUOTE
> 
> Most likely, but given that we are being watched, do the reasons really matter?


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## MaidenScotland

CAIRODEMON said:


> No not quite. They want to transfer some power (look at the caveats that they have imposed upon the new President over the last few days) to someone whom they can control and cannot be directly linked to them, Morsi fits the bill quite well. When (not if IMHO) it all goes pear shaped they can then step in at any time which suits them, and, depending upon how bad things are, they will receive a lot of support. Most Egyptians still consider the army to be one of the more reliable institutions in the country, although that is setting the bar at a very low level.




Im sorry I am at a loss to follow you... this morning you said as fact the army do not want to hold on to power.. but everything points to a whole different scenario


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## MaidenScotland

CAIRODEMON said:


> MaidenScotland said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well we are not watched for religious reasons...[/QUOTE
> 
> Most likely, but given that we are being watched, do the reasons really matter?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Personally for me yes... I would not want to be forced to live life according to religion.
Click to expand...


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## CAIRODEMON

MaidenScotland said:


> Im sorry I am at a loss to follow you... this morning you said as fact the army do not want to hold on to power.. but everything points to a whole different scenario


What points to this scenario?


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## MaidenScotland

your words

They want to transfer some power (look at the caveats that they have imposed upon the new President over the last few days) to someone whom they can control and cannot be directly linked to them,


Power is power.. doesn't matter if you are doing it up front or behind the door..


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## CAIRODEMON

MaidenScotland said:


> your words
> 
> They want to transfer some power (look at the caveats that they have imposed upon the new President over the last few days) to someone whom they can control and cannot be directly linked to them,
> 
> 
> Power is power.. doesn't matter if you are doing it up front or behind the door..


Agreed, they want a return to how it was pre Jan 2011


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## swemuslimah

don't understand this : "Sameh Ashour, the head of council advising SCAF, told Al Jazeera: "The upcoming president will occupy the office for a short period of time, weather or not he agrees. His office term will be short despite the huge efforts exerted in the election campaigns. 

"This is simply because a new constitution will be drafted, followed by new parliamentary elections to take on the legislative power; and therefore it is not possible in any event for the president to remain in office after a new constitution comes to the light."" source: Egypt Live Blog | Al Jazeera Blogs

Do this mean that whoever wins wont be president for more than some months? and then they will have a new election? :confused2:


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## aykalam

I hope you guys realise the results are NOT official yet AND Shafiq campaign claim he is winning Egypt president runoff with 52%

http://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsCon...mpaign-claims-candidate-is-winning-Egypt.aspx

plus tomorrow a court will decide whether the MB is banned (yes you read that right).

All hell is about to break loose


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## aykalam

(duplicate post...how did that happened?)


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## MaidenScotland

aykalam said:


> I hope you guys realise the results are NOT official yet AND Shafiq campaign claim he is winning Egypt president runoff with 52%
> 
> Shafiq's campaign claims candidate is winning Egypt president runoff with 52% - Politics - Egypt - Ahram Online
> 
> plus tomorrow a court will decide whether the MB is banned (yes you read that right).
> 
> All hell is about to break loose




Yes realised the figures were not official but since when has anything had to be official to get into a good argument/debate.

MB banned? now who will be deciding that


and the Russians are on their way to Syria..


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## aykalam

MaidenScotland said:


> Yes realised the figures were not official but since when has anything had to be official to get into a good argument/debate.
> 
> MB banned? now who will be deciding that
> 
> 
> and the Russians are on their way to Syria..


actually, Mubarak appointed judges will be deciding that. Nobody expected them to be bold enough to dissolve MB majority parliament, and yet...


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## Eco-Mariner

Transfer some power ? ... You must be joking.

Food queues and street cleaning, gas bottles and transport. All the crap they don't want to deal with that not only is impossible to solve but costly to regenerate.

Then they get to keep all the profits from the Suez Canal, oil, gas, financial markets, tourism etc. and above all that, not to be made accountable for any of SCAF's participation or holding the purse.

Seems like a good deal to me.... Not !!!!!

Then SCAF get rid of who is elected every 6 weeks to keep anyone from unearthing the truth and placing evidence to the High Courts. Does that sound like democracy to you lot?


Eco-Mariner.


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## MaidenScotland

Despite the celebrations by Muslim Brotherhood supporters at the Mursi campaign headquarters and in Tahrir Square that started in the early hours, this was not a clear victory.

Just as polls closed, the ruling generals issued a new constitutional declaration that will keep their hands on the reins of power and restrict the role of the new president.

The military made themselves Egypt's lawmakers after parliament was dissolved last week. They have control over the national budget and heavy influence over who writes the new permanent constitution.

At a lengthy news conference on Monday to give more details, armed forces spokesmen insisted that their legislative power would be "restricted". Maj Gen Mohamed al-Assar said a ceremony would take place at the end of the month to hand over to the new president.

If Mr Mursi is confirmed in that role, a power struggle between the Brotherhood and the military - two of Egypt's strongest forces - could ensue.


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## MaidenScotland

copied from We are all Khaled Said


The Unelected ruling military council is turning #Egypt into a Military Dictatorship in a very fast pace. They have made 3 decisions yesterday and today including appointing the staff of the new president which he can't remove! They have also formed a national security council for Egypt in which the military has 11 representatives in addition to the elected president, prime minister and 3 other civilians. Decisions are made in this council by the majority only where the elected president has one vote.


And this is the people who dont want to hold on to power?


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## canuck2010

The MB has something more powerful than the military though, people power. Perhaps a second revolution is needed?


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## MaidenScotland

canuck2010 said:


> The MB has something more powerful than the military though, people power.





don't bank on it.... Mubarak was only ousted because the military wouldn't back him.


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## DeadGuy

Sonrisa said:


> Morsi fits the bill just as well. IF not better. After all, it will keep the islamists and various random beards happy.
> Ideal scenario. SCAF runs the show, with a "legitimate" elected islamist as its front. Perfect.
> As DG would say: God bless Democracy



The military was NEVER going to let go, that's something everyone could see, but people were just distracted by the rest of the unfortunate events that took place.......

And although the idea of having a "president" that's been really close to Husni's regime always sounded bad enough for me, but NEVER was as bad as having a president with a very obvious *NEGATIVE *IQ rate whose relationship with the whole presidential issue is being a BACK UP candidate 

Personally speaking, I was almost 110% sure that Shafik was gonna be declared a "Winner" and that the MB scumbags were gonna be sent to where they belong shortly after that according to a few signs that were obvious, and specially in the last 48 hours...........And I thought both the SCAF and Shafik were just letting the MB have their own happy hour declaring their own results then they'd just "surprise" them with the "real" results!

But when I read about the National Security Council formation declared by the SCAF I realized that I was WRONG! It seems like those scumbags were chosen already to be the SCAF's front!

So yes! God bless the bloody democracy! But also God help us all!


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## canuck2010

I read that the MB had operatives at all 13,000 polling stations and were able to compile the election results as they were reported, and then were able to communicate them over the internet to preempt SCAF efforts to 'fix' the results.


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## Eco-Mariner

Was I wrong in my predictions?


Eco-Mariner.


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## MaidenScotland

canuck2010 said:


> I read that the MB had operatives at all 13,000 polling stations and were able to compile the election results as they were reported, and then were able to communicate them over the internet to preempt SCAF efforts to 'fix' the results.




having operatives at each polling station.............. is that not illegal?


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## MaidenScotland

Helicopters flying around downtown...


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## canuck2010

MaidenScotland said:


> having operatives at each polling station.............. is that not illegal?


I gather the reasoning was that the MB wanted to beat the Mubarak people at their own game. Of course, there are still a few days left to 'fix' the results.


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