# Police take your USA Passport for minor alleged offense



## Solcebu (Nov 9, 2014)

I had the unfortunate experience of a girl who was staying with me took off with no warning. I had no idea of it happening until I found her stuff all gone.. Tried to ring her to ask WTF... anyway moved on after being completely dumped for like no reason.. We never fought, and got along so well and had fun... Anyways.. A few days later I got a call from the police.. Asked me to go into station. I thought, why not I hadn't done anything wrong maybe something happened somewhere and they just needed help with info of some sort? But then I Found out The girl literally LIED to the police station saying that I hit her even though she wasn't EVEN within 200k's of my house at the time of the alleged date. (She had sent me a text a day after she left saying sorry she left and went to NSW.. Bye) Now if that had ACTUALLY happened, why did she wait? Anyway, she basically made a false report and after speaking to the police, I have no idea WTF that came from. I was released on bail, after being "arrested" for a couple of hours.. but on conditions of bail at the bottom where it says exceptions (it was not checked) a handwritten note: must not go to an international point of departure and must give passport to Informat or I will be jailed. (I told them I was here in a Visa from the US)

WTF? Now, I don't know about you guys, but this is very WEIRD. From what I understand (correct me if I am wrong) but we are to NEVER give our passports to ANYONE to take possession of while traveling/living overseas (with the exceptions of showing ID or going through airport security)

That alone makes me feel worried that ANYONE can get anyone's passport TAKEN/ wait... STOLEN from them from a simple allegation with absolutely NO PROOF.

Now, seriously WTF? Never been charged with anything ever.... and the actual charge was considered minor according to the police and I was given a court date, which obviously I am gonna go to.

BUT isn't asking for your passport in this scenario illegal? I mean I never EVER give my passport to anyone, or reveal its whereabouts at any time. It seems a bit strange, and makes me a bit weary that something wasn't right. I told them it was locked up in a post box on the other side of town for my security so they ended up letting me go, asked me to bring it the next day. It's the middle of the night so I haven't had a chance to call any lawyers that are open.. And I can't call the US embassy because its too early in the morning.. its 4:30am... I'm stressing because something felt really wrong about that...

I am not even worried about the police "charge" I'll get it dismissed obviously. Its the passport rubbish that has me unglued.

I was planning to return home to the states in the near future... Now I will be expediting my plans, as I am uncomfortable that anyone thinks they can just threaten arrest if I don't give them my passport to take from me permanently. Something seems wrong.. about that.

What do I do?


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

Authorities can confiscate passports (whether it's an Australian passport or a foreign one, US or any country's passport) to prevent you from travel. US Law does not apply here since you are in an Australian jurisdiction.

Hopefully - if you are honest as you claim - it will work out fine and you will prevail in court.


Last but not least, you need professional legal assistance.


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

See a solicitor. You are on bail and they are quite entitled to take passports from those they class as a flight risk 

Your plan to go home is exactly why they have removed it, to stop you evading justice. If you didn't do anything you have nothing tocworry about.


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## Solcebu (Nov 9, 2014)

That's a bit crazy... I probably won't be ever returning to Australia again after this... I am definitely going to make a stink about it in the morning to the embassy/Lawyer whoever

will this help at all?

I still have my passport in the post box I locked it in. Are they likely to follow through with asking me to bring it in? And (not that I would do this, but I have more reasons then just evading justice to get home soon, I have a job...) 

Again, I have nothing to hide from, and definitely will raise a huge stink in the morning, but I simply don't have much time before I need to go home.

Could I just leave without issues at the airport while I still have it in my possession if they haven't got any ID other then my name birthday and my address?

And by the way, just IMO but I sure as heck would never imagine this would happen in America. So Australia WTF with charging someone only based on what they said, with absolutely NO evidence to prove? (yes I was told, there was no evidence but I was still charged.)


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

they can actually ask DIBP to prohibit you from departing, and if you are caught trying. this is even more evidence that you are did something wrong and this is why you are trying to run away.


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

Leave the airport, surely you realise your picture will have been circulated through the airports. 

You think the US embassy will help you jump bail :rofl: 
This happens in the USA too, how else do you think they ensure criminals are bought to justice. Otherwise they'd all just be on the next plane home. You realuse the embassy wouldnt usually provide you with a lawyer bar for charges for crimes in some countries which wouldnt be crimes in the US, ie women driving in Saudi etc. Nor is it their job to help you evade the law. 

Your claims of no evidence are hysterical. You realise they can't charge without reasonable evidence to secure a conviction. 

You know what, having had a charge for violence against a woman whilst in Australia its highly unlikely you would be allowed back once you leave.


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## Solcebu (Nov 9, 2014)

_shel said:


> Leave the airport, surely you realise your picture will have been circulated through the airports.
> 
> You think the US embassy will help you jump bail :rofl:
> This happens in the USA too, how else do you think they ensure criminals are bought to justice. Otherwise they'd all just be on the next plane home. You realuse the embassy wouldnt usually provide you with a lawyer bar for charges for crimes in some countries which wouldnt be crimes in the US, ie women driving in Saudi etc. Nor is it their job to help you evade the law.
> ...


I am telling you the truth mate. This is why I am so defensive on the matter. I am telling you they charged me on spoken allegations OVER THE PHONE.


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

Is she in another state now? 

Just looked on the embassy website, their us a lust of lawyers for each state. You should probably look through them and find one. Some other advice too re the justice process and bridging visas should it come to that. 

You need to be calm and try and cooperate with everything. If they have no evidence nothing will come of it but you have to let them prove they have no evidence. You trying to leave could make you look very guilty and be found guilty even if they have not much evidence because only guilty people run in the eyes of a jury.


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## Scattley (Jul 30, 2012)

Saying that this does not happen in the Use is ridiculous. As you are a US citizen you probably have never thought about it or noticed, but generally if someone who is not a citizen is charged with something in the US they are either refused bail or bail is 2-5x that of a citizen...and this can be for small offences like driving offences. We don't go that far but confiscating your passport is totally understandable.


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## 95995 (May 16, 2010)

The US does the exactly the same with foreigners on charges - they too can, and most frequently do, take your passport pending legal proceedings. It's absolutely normal in most countries. No point going off your rocker about it mate. In your case, you should consider yourself fortunate that they did not actually ask you for your passport. However, should the matter not be resolved at the preliminary hearing, you should expect it to be a condition of bail that you surrender your passport. 

As others have said, get a lawyer.


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## Mug (Sep 28, 2012)

this was November, what up?


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## 95995 (May 16, 2010)

Mug said:


> this was November, what up?


Maybe we should leave that to our imaginations?


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## Bellthorpe (Jun 23, 2013)

What up is that the site administrators, in their wisdom, included this old thread in their April newsletter.


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## MarcW (Jul 10, 2013)

Solcebu said:


> I am telling you the truth mate. This is why I am so defensive on the matter. I am telling you they charged me on spoken allegations OVER THE PHONE.


That's not uncommon. That you don't know what normally happens in this situation doesn't make it an issue. You were accused of a major crime (assault can be a felony, despite what the police that handled you said).

The aggressive manner your give here is likely why she snuck out, rather than warning you, and will only make it worse for you if you are as rude and demanding to the police/court as you are here.

The only choice you have is whether to push for her being charged with filing a false report. If she was provably 200 km away, then they should end up putting her in jail, not you. 

It's standard practice to take the passport from a person planning on leaving before the trial. They want to make sure you show up. That you call it "stealing" shows you don't understand what is going on. They want to make sure the hearing happens, so they can hold you in jail until then, or hold your passport to force that. Would you really rather sit in jail until then so they don't touch your passport?

It's not just Australia you shouldn't visit, but anywhere in the world. You sound like the type that spits gum on the sidewalk in Singapore, then tries to make it an international incident when they are caned for breaking the law. "They can't treat me like this, I'm an American!!"

If that's not you, then stop, count to 1000, then read your posts as if they were someone else's. Are they aggressive and angry? 

If you had asked "Hi, I was falsely accused of violence against a woman and the police demanded my passsport, is that normal?"

The answers would have been more polite and direct. Instead, your initial question and followups are what a woman-abuser would have said, coming here to get some sympathy. So forgive us if we look at your story with a little skepticism.


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## DLEGEAI (Sep 2, 2014)

*Dominique Legeai*

....all above comments seem correct to me; yes! The US holds passports in similar situations, as do most countries.....definitely do not attempt to flee if you have done no wrong....simply cooperate, be polite, remain calm and controlled, stick to your version w/o ever changing details. Anyway, who is this b---h? Why such a claim? What would she possibly gain? Good luck...DL


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## rimatt (Jul 22, 2014)

*Hold on...*

She has to prove what she said is for real. I would not have consented to anything at all and I would not even had talked to the police. No matter where you are, you have the right to remain silent and do not have to consent to anything. A lawyer will just charge you money and tell you the same thing... Police are civil servants and they do not have the right to take your property without any concrete evidence. Your passport is your property. The police could get in trouble for inconveniencing you and accepting false allegation about you from someone without any true evidence (if you are indeed innocent).


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## 95995 (May 16, 2010)

rimatt said:


> She has to prove what she said is for real. I would not have consented to anything at all and I would not even had talked to the police. No matter where you are, you have the right to remain silent and do not have to consent to anything. A lawyer will just charge you money and tell you the same thing... Police are civil servants and they do not have the right to take your property without any concrete evidence. Your passport is your property. The police could get in trouble for inconveniencing you and accepting false allegation about you from someone without any true evidence (if you are indeed innocent).


No - the matter would be decided by the magistrate (if it in fact went to court). The magistrate would chide the police if they brought a case without evidence. Not talking to the police might well lead them to believe you are guilty. It is possible to ask that the duty solicitor (or a lawyer/solicitor of your choice) be present during questioning. Should the police or the police prosecutor or the DPP decide before the hearing that there is insufficient evidence, the charge would normally be withdrawn.


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

Hi,
Interesting that everyone is commenting on a thread from last November!
The OP only posted three times - 9th November 2014 - and has not logged on since.
Maybe they cant logon to this forum from jail?
Cheers
Steve


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## Bellthorpe (Jun 23, 2013)

rimatt said:


> She has to prove what she said is for real. I would not have consented to anything at all and I would not even had talked to the police. No matter where you are, you have the right to remain silent and do not have to consent to anything. A lawyer will just charge you money and tell you the same thing... Police are civil servants and they do not have the right to take your property without any concrete evidence. Your passport is your property. The police could get in trouble for inconveniencing you and accepting false allegation about you from someone without any true evidence (if you are indeed innocent).


Your passport is not your property. It is owned by the issuing State.

Refusing to even speak with the police would have landed you in gaol. Is that what you want? If the police asked for the OP's passport, I would think they've already been before a magistrate.


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## Solcebu (Nov 9, 2014)

Just a update guys a few months later.

All Charges were thrown out, dismissed, striked out. The reason I was so afraid, is that I was innocent. Thank God the truth came out in the end.

Got my passport back. Now my gf and I split.. 

But we have baby now. Is there any visa that I can go on to, that we are no longer together, so I can be here with my son? She is deliberately trying to get me deported by calling immigration to report us not together. She is going out of her way to wreck havoc on my life, even proceeding to harassing my family on social media. I have evidence of her attempting suicide, and being manipulative and lying. I am worried about the welfare of my son, since she has ran off with him, and won't let me see him.


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

what visa were you on? (to determine your eligibility to stay)


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## Solcebu (Nov 9, 2014)

I applied for the partner visa (defacto) and currently on the bridging A. The baby came as a result of this relationship, and is an Australian Citizen. My partner intentionally took BOTH birth certificates and disappeared with the baby.


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

Solcebu said:


> I applied for the partner visa (defacto) and currently on the bridging A. The baby came as a result of this relationship, and is an Australian Citizen. My partner intentionally took BOTH birth certificates and disappeared with the baby.


You can get a duplicate BC from the RBDM in your state. You need to address the custody issues with a family law lawyer since she's taken off with the baby AND is a danger to the baby as well (suicidal, violent ...etc.)


As for immigration, you are still eligible to get your 820/801 even if the relationship breaks down (you need to inform the department ASAP using form 1022 (change of circumstances))

However to keep the application going you need to satisfy them that

1- You suffered family violence
2- You have a baby together
3- You have joint custody at least


Submit AS MUCH EVIDENCE as possible with your Form 1022


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

and, remember, BVA does not allow travel and return to Australia. Make sure you never travel unless you get a BVB first, and make sure you return within its validity period.


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## Solcebu (Nov 9, 2014)

I got hurt by her a week ago, and have a medical letter from the hospital and reported it to the police, but they wouldn't charge her with anything. She still has a limited avo on me from the original charges which were all dropped (which expires in august of 2015) We split last week. She had assaulted me a couple months ago, but I didn't report it. So technically there hasn't been family violence from her behalf. 

I have been on the Bridging for quite a while now, baby is 14 weeks old.

I can definitely get another copy of the birth certificate, and I have contacted a lawyer using an online inquiry today but haven't been replied to yet or called. Ill probably have to call around tomorrow as today I was running other errands at VICroads. Even If I can't prove family violence on her behalf, because the baby is here, do you think I will be ok visa wise?


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

Solcebu said:


> I got hurt by her a week ago, and have a medical letter from the hospital and reported it to the police, but they wouldn't charge her with anything. She still has a limited avo on me from the original charges which were all dropped (which expires in august of 2015) We split last week. She had assaulted me a couple months ago, but I didn't report it. So technically there hasn't been family violence from her behalf.
> 
> I have been on the Bridging for quite a while now, baby is 14 weeks old.
> 
> I can definitely get another copy of the birth certificate, and I have contacted a lawyer using an online inquiry today but haven't been replied to yet or called. Ill probably have to call around tomorrow as today I was running other errands at VICroads. Even If I can't prove family violence on her behalf, because the baby is here, do you think I will be ok visa wise?


yes

get professional help for this as well, it's better investment to spend money now to keep things straight rather than spend much more later on to rectify a crappy situation


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## Solcebu (Nov 9, 2014)

Thanks, I will consult a lawyer and update the thread.


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

Solcebu said:


> Thanks, I will consult a lawyer and update the thread.


and a veteran migration agent as well for your visa case


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## MarcW (Jul 10, 2013)

Solcebu said:


> Just a update guys a few months later.
> 
> All Charges were thrown out, dismissed, striked out. The reason I was so afraid, is that I was innocent. Thank God the truth came out in the end.
> 
> ...


You should fight in court to get sole guardianship because of her harm to herself (and others). If granted, then you can (presuming your child is an Australia citizen), try to apply to stay as guardian. I'm not familiar with Australia law, I'm an American in NZ, but I've seen similar happen elsewhere.

Lawyer up and fight. You are getting well outside the realm of "expat tips" and into family law (with a side of immigration law).

It won't be cheap, but you can only fight her in the courts. The first step is Family Law. Use your proof of suicide attempt to get her declared unfit, and get awarded sole custody, and you will have more options.

Remaining Relative visa (subclass 835) or possibly:
Contributory Parent (Temporary) visa (subclass 173) (requires Bridging visa A – BVA – (subclass 010) or other bridging visa)

But you really need a legal specialist to work out your options. 

Best of luck.


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## Scattley (Jul 30, 2012)

You will need substantion evidence that she is endangering the child but be aware that even in the cases of the mother having diagnosed mental disease issues the mother rarely looses custody. The suicide attempt can only be considered or even mentioned if she was hospitalised as a result. If that did not happen then nothing of what you have listed is evidence of her endangering the child. However the arrest and dropping of charges can be used against you in her application for full custody. The most you can expect to get is dual custody with limited parental visitation for the first couple of months but to get even this you will need to get a lawyer fast.


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

MarcW said:


> You should fight in court to get sole guardianship because of her harm to herself (and others). If granted, then you can (presuming your child is an Australia citizen), try to apply to stay as guardian. I'm not familiar with Australia law, I'm an American in NZ, but I've seen similar happen elsewhere.
> 
> Lawyer up and fight. You are getting well outside the realm of "expat tips" and into family law (with a side of immigration law).
> 
> ...




I agree he needs to fight tooth and nail, I concur - and I already advised - he needs a pro, but not just a family/criminal law lawyer. 

He needs a migration agent as well, and NOT A ROOKIE. He needs a well established ones. All registered agents have MARNs (Migration Agent Registration Number), with the first two digits representing the year they were first registered, so get someone who's been around for 15-25 years in the profession.

However, the two visa options presented are actually not valid, since contributory parent visa requires a 18+ child who'd sponsor him, and remaining relative requires all his relatives to be PRs/Citizens in Australia without any other close relatives outside

I checked the Migration Regulations, he CAN still get the partner visa even if the relationship broke down if he can prove EITHER having AT LEAST joint custody/access to the child OR family violence, and he needs to notify DIBP ASAP, otherwise he'll be liable, and we never know what she might tell them before he does !

So the case is twofold, the criminal/family law side, and migration case (to keep his current visa application as well as his current BV) ...... 


To the OP, spend big now on real pro help, rather than spend way bigger later on with much less chance of setting things straight


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## rabudman (Jul 25, 2010)

And consider yourself lucky you didn't/haven't yet been "detained" without warrant or reason or worse killed. All of this has been absolutely legal since the passage of the Patriot Act - regardless of citizenship or suspicion of any type of charge. You could be held indefinitely without ever being charged with any crime and assassinated. 

Hate to burst your bubble dude, but you came out VERY LUCKY on this one...assuming of course you come out of it at all. Good Luck.


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## TheExpatriate (Feb 7, 2014)

rabudman said:


> And consider yourself lucky you didn't/haven't yet been "detained" without warrant or reason or worse killed. All of this has been absolutely legal since the passage of the Patriot Act - regardless of citizenship or suspicion of any type of charge. You could be held indefinitely without ever being charged with any crime and assassinated.
> 
> Hate to burst your bubble dude, but you came out VERY LUCKY on this one...assuming of course you come out of it at all. Good Luck.


Patriot Act is a US act, he's in Australia .... I do not think (and I even looked it up) there is an Australian Patriot Act. 

Furthermore, with my little knowledge, I don't think domestic issues in the US could subject anyone to Patriot Act repercussions. This is for people who are linked to (or have suspected links to) national security concerns. Not for someone who had a fight with their GF ! Otherwise millions would've been already in deep s**t !


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## Bellthorpe (Jun 23, 2013)

rabudman said:


> And consider yourself lucky you didn't/haven't yet been "detained" without warrant or reason or worse killed. All of this has been absolutely legal since the passage of the Patriot Act - regardless of citizenship or suspicion of any type of charge. You could be held indefinitely without ever being charged with any crime and assassinated.
> 
> Hate to burst your bubble dude, but you came out VERY LUCKY on this one...assuming of course you come out of it at all. Good Luck.


Hate to burst your bubble dude, but the OP is not in the US. He's *from* the US. Please try to keep up.

Further, your reading of the *American* Patriot Act is deficient. Perhaps you should spend some more time in the library.


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## DavidByfield (Apr 4, 2015)

It is naive to think that just because you are innocent everything will turn out ok. It is often those who get in first win. Document everything go over all the details of the relationship what happen when who was there, places you would go acquaintances, friends. Find Witnesses who can verify your account of events. I think you get the idea good luck


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