# Least favorite thing about Mexico



## rohbear (Feb 28, 2017)

Hi, I'm a newbie who is going to visit Chapala/Ajijic the end of this month for the first time as a potential retirement place. The amount of internet pages gushing about how wonderful life is there is almost overwhelming, although, to be fair, I have read some cautionary posts, too. Two years ago, my partner and I experienced the same thing as we went to Ecuador, which we ultimately decided against Ecuador. But that's another story.

What I want to posit to you all is: what is your least favorite thing about living in Mexico and why?

Gracias!


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

rohbear said:


> Hi, I'm a newbie who is going to visit Chapala/Ajijic the end of this month for the first time as a potential retirement place. The amount of internet pages gushing about how wonderful life is there is almost overwhelming, although, to be fair, I have read some cautionary posts, too. Two years ago, my partner and I experienced the same thing as we went to Ecuador, which we ultimately decided against Ecuador. But that's another story.
> 
> What I want to posit to you all is: what is your least favorite thing about living in Mexico and why?
> 
> Gracias!


Can I list two least favorite things? 1) The rivers and streams are polluted, and 2) People throw trash on the ground both in cities and on hiking trails.


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## CassieM (Mar 1, 2017)

Thank you for responding TundraGreen. I agree with Rohbear you do read a lot of things but being able to get some honest feedback is so valuable!


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## joaquinx (Jul 3, 2010)

Whining Gringos!


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Cobblestones. So quaint, and so easy to break your bones when falling on. AKA clobberstones.
Traffic in high season, with death-wish drivers scaring hell out of you.

Yeah...whining gringos, too, but unlike the above, they can be avoided.


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## rohbear (Feb 28, 2017)

joaquinx said:


> Whining Gringos!


Yeah, a friend of mine is interested in Mexico, because I'm interested in Mexico and the cost of living. I strongly advised him against it, as he said he had no interest in learning to speak Spanish and doesn't much like people generally!


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

rohbear said:


> Yeah, a friend of mine is interested in Mexico, because I'm interested in Mexico and the cost of living. I strongly advised him against it, as he said he had no interest in learning to speak Spanish and doesn't much like people generally!


One can get by in Lakeside without being fluent in Spanish, but there is a large population of people. 
There is an even larger population of dogs. Gringos here are nuts for their dogs. Maybe your friend could get a couple and live in the surrounding countryside. They don't talk much.


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## TwoBlackfoot (Jul 31, 2016)

I concur with TundraGreen, although I drink directly out of a streams at times, and don't often find a lot of trash on the trails that I hike. Sometimes, I'm glad to find an empty bag of chips, since that means I'm on a human trail. I have no idea why people like the city of Queretaro. The historic district is cute, but the city is circled by a wasteland of trash. It's horrible. 

To add a different answer to this question, I can't stand all the places that sell ice cream and candy. It's unavoidable and the vendors are waiting outside of school when the kids get released.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I'll add roof dogs that bark all night without pause. It's not the dogs themselves that bug me - they're just doing what dogs do when banished from the pack. It's the owners that banish them to the roof that are at fault IMO. In any case, they make sleeping through the night a challenge. They bother me a lot more than the cohetes, which I seem to be able to sleep through OK.



TwoBlackfoot said:


> I have no idea why people like the city of Queretaro. The historic district is cute, but the city is circled by a wasteland of trash. It's horrible.


What would be a mid to large sized colonial city where this is not the case? If I could find one, I might move there instead!


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## joaquinx (Jul 3, 2010)

There is a belief among many Mexicans that throwing trash on the street provides jobs for those to clean up the trash.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

joaquinx said:


> There is a belief among many Mexicans that throwing trash on the street provides jobs for those to clean up the trash.


I am sympathetic to your viewpoint about foreigners coming to Mexico and criticizing what they find. Sometimes things are not better or worse they are just different. And I accept that even trash on the street could be viewed through two different lenses (Although I would be more sympathetic to your view, if people actually got jobs picking up trash. That seems to occur in the center of Queretaro but nowhere else that I have observed). However, I think the Original Poster's question is nevertheless a valid one. For someone who has never been here, it might be interesting to hear what people don't like as well as what people do like.

Incidentally, as a natural-born citizen of the US and a naturalized citizen of Mexico, I feel free to like and dislike aspects of both countries.


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## dwwhiteside (Apr 17, 2013)

Maybe this sounds a little weird, and maybe this is not absolutely my least favorite thing about Mexico, but one of the things that bothers me is the graffiti. At least when I first moved here it seemed like there was graffiti plastered on every visible building and fence. I guess I don't notice it as much now but, when I first moved here in 2012, it was really bothersome.


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## Bodega (Apr 20, 2016)

*A couple of things*

The things I like about Mexico outnumber by far the things I dislike, but there are a few things that can test my smile. At the top of the list is the ambiguity one might run into while engaging in any number of transactions. The information one gets from a bank teller, an INM agent, real estate agents, even attorneys, can vary greatly depending on the agent's personal interpretation of the guidelines. 
Traffic has already been mentioned, but prepare yourself for gridlock beyond whatever you are expecting. I realize there is no simple solution, the population growth has simply overwhelmed the infrastructure, but that doesn't make me like it. Also, when I experience this problem, I am part it, so I have to be careful not to become a hypocritical whiner, the worst kind  
I'm still here, loving every day, so, as I mentioned above, the dislike list pales in comparison to the like list.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I just want to qualify my previous "things I don't like" item by agreeing with Bodega that the things I like in Mexico far outweigh the things I don't like. 

Because we had to spend 3 1/2 years back in the US for family reasons, I have an interesting perspective after spending the previous 5 years in Mexico followed by those 3+ years in the US. Bottom line: I miss Mexico and I'm thrilled we're moving back!


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Bodega said:


> The things I like about Mexico outnumber by far the things I dislike, but there are a few things that can test my smile. At the top of the list is the ambiguity one might run into while engaging in any number of transactions. The information one gets from a bank teller, an INM agent, real estate agents, even attorneys, can vary greatly depending on the agent's personal interpretation of the guidelines.
> Traffic has already been mentioned, but prepare yourself for gridlock beyond whatever you are expecting. I realize there is no simple solution, the population growth has simply overwhelmed the infrastructure, but that doesn't make me like it. Also, when I experience this problem, I am part it, so I have to be careful not to become a hypocritical whiner, the worst kind
> I'm still here, loving every day, so, as I mentioned above, the dislike list pales in comparison to the like list.


Depending on one's situation, one can choose whether or not to be affected by traffic congestion. If you have young kids that need to be chauffeured to school or activities, it may be impossible to avoid. If you have a job and time constraints, it may be impossible to avoid. But if you have flexibility about where and how you live, you can easily choose environments where you rarely have to get into a vehicle. This is much easier in Mexico for two reasons: 1) Mexico has lots of little shops in neighborhoods selling all of the things needed for everyday life; and, 2) for occasional trips further afield, Mexico has functioning public transit. You may be in traffic, but you can read or sleep while someone else deals with it. Or, it can be a subway that avoids it all together, or a macrobus with dedicated lanes that avoids it partially.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Or, you can pick a time of day when there is the least congestion. Traffic on the Lake Chapala area main drag is horrendous at noon and early afternoon. When I need to shop at the supermarket, I go before 10 am or after 4 pm. Amazing difference.
Getting on and off the buses is difficult for those with mobility problems, so it doesn't work for everyone.


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## TurtleToo (Aug 23, 2013)

TundraGreen said:


> Can I list two least favorite things? 1) The rivers and streams are polluted, and 2) People throw trash on the ground both in cities and on hiking trails.


I was originally going to post a reply about tossing trash on the ground, but TG has done it for me. To that, I will add that I sometimes cringe at the casual cruelty with which people too often treat animals. 

Speaking of trash . . . I'm old enough to remember when throwing trash on the ground was commonplace in the US. As often as not, trash was just dropped on the ground, even when a trash container was only a few steps away. Driving down the road, people frequently just threw their trash out the car window. I think tHings started to change during LadyBird Johnson's anti-litter campaign in the 60's. (So even though many things seem to have gotten worse over the years in the US, some have actually improved "big league!")

Apologies for the tangent--back to Mexico! 

.


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## perropedorro (Mar 19, 2016)

People quicker than me already addressed these, but I'll second them. 1) The Todo Vale undisciplined traffic. 2) Litter, and where TG lives people tend to be more sophisticated than the hick town I call home. 3). Sugar in plain yogurt -- even if it says "sin azúcar" it still might have nutrisweet. 4) Whining gringos (kudos to Joaquín), especially the obnoxtentatious ones. Pet peeves, but always remember, if you live here on the balance it's good.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

I dislike that Mexicans will tell you whatever they think you want to hear. "You'll call if you can't make it tomorrow so I don't sit home waiting all day, right?" "Oh, of course, certainly." You wait for hours, they don't show, don't call. There is always some excuse, instead of a simple, "I'm sorry." The propane delivery guy told me 2 days ago he'd deliver me a cylinder "in an hour". I'm still waiting.
Along the same lines, no one will take responsibility- "No es mi culpa". And no one ever says "Disculpame, yo lo rompi" (Sorry, I broke it). The expression is "Se rompio", (it broke, passive tense, yeah it just jumped off the table all by itself and broke).


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

surabi said:


> I dislike that Mexicans will tell you whatever they think you want to hear. "You'll call if you can't make it tomorrow so I don't sit home waiting all day, right?" "Oh, of course, certainly." You wait for hours, they don't show, don't call. There is always some excuse, instead of a simple, "I'm sorry." The propane delivery guy told me 2 days ago he'd deliver me a cylinder "in an hour". I'm still waiting.
> Along the same lines, no one will take responsibility- "No es mi culpa". And no one ever says "Disculpame, yo lo rompi" (Sorry, I broke it). The expression is "Se rompio", (it broke, passive tense, yeah it just jumped off the table all by itself and broke).


Those are cultural differences that one learns to live with (and even like) or be perpetually frustrated. Using the passive voice for things that go wrong is much politer that language that insists on blaming someone for everything that happens. I used to stress out about being late for appointments, now I don't worry because I assume that others will be even later. I still occasionally show up for parties at the prescribed hour only to find that the hosts are still in the shower or maybe not even home yet. If I go an hour late, I am usually the first one there.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

TundraGreen said:


> Those are cultural differences that one learns to live with (and even like) or be perpetually frustrated. Using the passive voice for things that go wrong is much politer that language that insists on blaming someone for everything that happens. I used to stress out about being late for appointments, now I don't worry because I assume that others will be even later. I still occasionally show up for parties at the prescribed hour only to find that the hosts are still in the shower or maybe not even home yet. If I go an hour late, I am usually the first one there.


Well, I can't see the politeness in someone using one of my tools without permission, using it improperly, breaking it, then telling me "it broke". Wasn't talking about blaming someone else, was talking about taking responsibility for one's actions.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

I've had a lot of repairs and construction done on my property in the last eight years. Not all workers will fail to tell you they aren't going to show up. Some spent years in the U.S. and adopted U.S. work habits. If they say they're going to show up, they do. I hire that type and save myself the aggravation. How to find them? Recommendations from friends and Mexican neighbors. Life is too short to wait around for Senor Unreliable when there are plenty of Senors happy to have the work.
"It broke itself". Ah, yes. The poor thing did, didn't it?


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## scm7675 (Jun 19, 2015)

That I'm not there right now.


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

surabi said:


> I dislike that Mexicans will tell you whatever they think you want to hear. "You'll call if you can't make it tomorrow so I don't sit home waiting all day, right?" "Oh, of course, certainly." You wait for hours, they don't show, don't call. There is always some excuse, instead of a simple, "I'm sorry." The propane delivery guy told me 2 days ago he'd deliver me a cylinder "in an hour". I'm still waiting.
> Along the same lines, no one will take responsibility- "No es mi culpa". And no one ever says "Disculpame, yo lo rompi" (Sorry, I broke it). The expression is "Se rompio", (it broke, passive tense, yeah it just jumped off the table all by itself and broke).


When I was first learning Spanish 34 years ago, this use of the passive form also stood out to me. Nobody dropped anything, things just dropped "Se cayó", no one broke anything, things just broke, "Se rompió" or "Se quebró". Sometimes a "me" is thrown in, "Se me cayó" or "Se me rompió". 

Now, after speaking Spanish nearly as much as English throughout my adult life, it seems natural, and I no longer interpret it as not accepting personal responsibility. But when I think about it more, it seems to me the key is intent. If I'm angry and break something on purpose, e.g. tearing up a photo of an ex, then "La rompí". But if the breakage was not intended, then the passive is more appropriate. If I drop something on purpose, "Lo dejé caer", if it was unintentional then, "Se me cayó".


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

ojosazules11 said:


> When I was first learning Spanish 34 years ago, this use of the passive form also stood out to me. Nobody dropped anything, things just dropped "Se cayó", no one broke anything, things just broke, "Se rompió" or "Se quebró". Sometimes a "me" is thrown in, "Se me cayó" or "Se me rompió".
> 
> Now, after speaking Spanish nearly as much as English throughout my adult life, it seems natural, and I no longer interpret it as not accepting personal responsibility. But when I think about it more, it seems to me the key is intent. If I'm angry and break something on purpose, e.g. tearing up a photo of an ex, then "La rompí". But if the breakage was not intended, then the passive is more appropriate. If I drop something on purpose, "Lo dejé caer", if it was unintentional then, "Se me cayó".


I actually asked a Mexican friend of mine, who has traveled quite a bit outside of Mexico and therefore has a larger world view, about this lack of willingness to take responsibility for one's actions. I asked if it was just in the area where we live, or if it was country-wide. Did Mexican mothers yell at their kids if they accidentally broke something and therefore they learned to deny any culpability? 

Her answer was: It is countrywide and crosses all socio-economic boundaries. And I'll tell you exactly how it starts. When a Mexican baby is just learning how to walk and falls down a lot and sometimes hits its arm or head on, say, a chair, whereas parents in other places would not make a big deal of it unless the baby is really hurt, and the baby will usually just stop crying and start toddling around again, Mexican mothers will walk over to the chair, hit the chair and say "You bad chair, you hurt my baby, you're a really bad chair".

So, in fact, the baby is taught that it is the fault of an inanimate object, rather than a thing that happens because they are not yet proficient at walking. From that to "se rompio" is not a big leap.


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## izzenhood (Jun 8, 2013)

1) Dirty Toilets.


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

surabi said:


> I actually asked a Mexican friend of mine, who has traveled quite a bit outside of Mexico and therefore has a larger world view, about this lack of willingness to take responsibility for one's actions. I asked if it was just in the area where we live, or if it was country-wide. Did Mexican mothers yell at their kids if they accidentally broke something and therefore they learned to deny any culpability?
> 
> Her answer was: It is countrywide and crosses all socio-economic boundaries. And I'll tell you exactly how it starts. When a Mexican baby is just learning how to walk and falls down a lot and sometimes hits its arm or head on, say, a chair, whereas parents in other places would not make a big deal of it unless the baby is really hurt, and the baby will usually just stop crying and start toddling around again, Mexican mothers will walk over to the chair, hit the chair and say "You bad chair, you hurt my baby, you're a really bad chair".
> 
> So, in fact, the baby is taught that it is the fault of an inanimate object, rather than a thing that happens because they are not yet proficient at walking. From that to "se rompio" is not a big leap.


But the use of the passive form in this way is not uniquely Mexican, it's part of the Spanish language. If you are of the belief that not accepting personal responsibility is part of Mexican culture, then I guess the question arises if the structure of the language itself promotes this, since this use of "se rompió" was not invented by Mexicans. 

I remember in Guatemala once when a toddler fell out of a hammock, the hammock was "mala". I guess I acculturated, because I found myself saying the same thing to inanimate objects when my toddlers hurt themselves. Fortunately they've all grown into very responsible, self-aware and compassionate young people in spite of that.

I would be very annoyed if someone borrowed something without asking, then returned it broken saying "It broke." But I see that as more idiosyncratic to individuals, rather than part of the culture. My husband is Mexican and if he ever broke a borrowed tool, he would absolutely fix or replace it, and he would expect the same from anyone borrowing something from him. The same for my close friends and family members (husband's family).

In the clinic where I work in Toronto, we see people from many different countries and cultures. I have observed that in every culture, including Canadian born and bred, there are those people who try to off-load blame for anything to other people or to circumstances, never accepting personal responsibility for anything. But this does not mean it's an accepted part of that culture, as I hear from many others from that same culture who can't tolerate such behaviour.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

I don't think blaming others or circumstances is a Mexican thing, having spent most of my life in the U.S. and hearing the same song there. It's a fairly rare thing to hear someone taking responsibility for their own lives, topes and all.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I have to concur with ojosazules. I speak with people from South America, Central America, Spain and, of course, Mexico on a pretty regular basis and they all use the passive voice in this way. I noticed that in the novels I've read that have been translated into Spanish (usually a very Castilian Spanish) they also use the passive voice in these situations.

If you think about it, a young child learning the language as their native tongue will learn that construction without giving it another thought because that's how everyone around them says it. They wouldn't be aware that they are "shifting the blame" that is implied by other languages.


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## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

There are common foods that you simply can't find here, like pan sausage (or any kind of sausage other than chorizo) , pumpernickel bread, mustard or collard greens and such.

Common repair items such as carburetor kits for small engines and such can be hard to find. 

Lines at banks can be trying at times.

But as has been said, the good far outweighs the bad.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Don't know about Oaxaca, but here in the Lake Chapala area, we have a Tuesday market where at least one vendor sells collard greens and another sells homemade regular sausage. A Scandinavian bakery sells pumpernickel, among other tasty breads. Life is GOOD in this "****** enclave"!


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## xolo (May 25, 2014)

How about educational policy and the number of rats in the whole system? Google Elba Esther Gordillo "la maestra" for one example, president of SNTE while living in San Diego and owning a private jet, all from the 160 million dollars she embezzled, not to mention screwing Mexico out of its future by resisting all educational reforms. The SNTE had 10,000 teachers that had never stepped into a classroom.


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## DiverSailor123 (Sep 17, 2016)

I believe that is at best an excuse for laziness and a lack of TRUE National Pride.. Besides its then obvious that there are not enough people given jobs sweeping streets..


joaquinx said:


> There is a belief among many Mexicans that throwing trash on the street provides jobs for those to clean up the trash.


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## mattoleriver (Oct 21, 2011)

circle110 said:


> I have to concur with ojosazules. I speak with people from South America, Central America, Spain and, of course, Mexico on a pretty regular basis and they all use the passive voice in this way. I noticed that in the novels I've read that have been translated into Spanish (usually a very Castilian Spanish) they also use the passive voice in these situations.


Is there a Spanish equivalent to "It is a poor craftsman that blames his tools."?


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

DiverSailor123 said:


> I believe that is at best an excuse for laziness and a lack of TRUE National Pride.. Besides its then obvious that there are not enough people given jobs sweeping streets..


It has nothing to do with laziness or pride. It has everything to do with culture and habit. After a country gets rich enough that most people have enough to eat, and enough money to fix up their houses, and take care of other essential aspects of life, then they start to worry about things like safety and clean streets. Clean streets have not become a priority in Mexico because they have lots of other more important problems.


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## rohbear (Feb 28, 2017)

lagoloo said:


> Don't know about Oaxaca, but here in the Lake Chapala area, we have a Tuesday market where at least one vendor sells collard greens and another sells homemade regular sausage. A Scandinavian bakery sells pumpernickel, among other tasty breads. Life is GOOD in this "****** enclave"!


Hi lagoloo, that's great news. We would love to visit that Tuesday market! What is the address?


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

It's on the main road west of Ajijic in a large "evento" location on the lake side, well marked, with parking and a large number of vendors inside the building. Veggies and homemade good stuff, from breads to lasagne and quiches; spices and sushi.
Hope you get a chance to visit.


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## DiverSailor123 (Sep 17, 2016)

I guess you could be right, but I guess, I see it differently than you.. Mexico isnt poor , not really, not on a World or even a Continental standing.. There will always be the poor among us and even the hungry.. But that is no excuse for littering and being a slob.. Poor doesnt mean dirty , dirty has more to do with attitude... Tying a flag on the hood of your car 3 times a year doesn't make you Patriotic , but picking up someone else s candy bar wrapper and putting it in a waste can sure does..


TundraGreen said:


> It has nothing to do with laziness or pride. It has everything to do with culture and habit. After a country gets rich enough that most people have enough to eat, and enough money to fix up their houses, and take care of other essential aspects of life, then they start to worry about things like safety and clean streets. Clean streets have not become a priority in Mexico because they have lots of other more important problems.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

DiverSailor123 said:


> I guess you could be right, but I guess, I see it differently than you.. Mexico isnt poor , not really, not on a World or even a Continental standing.. There will always be the poor among us and even the hungry.. But that is no excuse for littering and being a slob.. Poor doesnt mean dirty , dirty has more to do with attitude... Tying a flag on the hood of your car 3 times a year doesn't make you Patriotic , but picking up someone else s candy bar wrapper and putting it in a waste can sure does..


Getting people to not throw stuff on the ground is only the last step in the process. Before you even start to do that there has to be a system in place to handle the trash. To be specific I will talk about the two places I know best: City streets in Guadalajara and trails.

City streets in Guadalajara:
Until a few years ago there were few trash receptacles anywhere. For the PanAm games in 2012, they installed a lot of bins in Centro. However they are inconsistently emptied so there is often no room to put trash in them. I have seen them bring a crew in to pick up trash in a park. They pile it all in one spot near an overflowing garbage can, but then they fail to take it away and it gradually disperses back across the park. The system for household garbage collection is for people to put plastic bags of household trash in front of their house or on the corner. Very commonly, dogs will tear the bags open and scatter the trash before the collectors come, and this is true even though the collection is daily in my neighborhood.

Trails:
On heavily used trails like the Barranca de Huentitán NE of Guadalajara or the pilgrimage route to Talpa de Allende which sees millions of walkers every Semana Santa, there is trash everywhere. There are a few cans to put trash in at least in the Barranca, but they are rarely emptied so the trash overflows on the ground around the can. There are no bathroom facilities so people go in the bushes and leave toilet paper all over.

There is no point in even starting a campaign to get people to avoid littering until there is some place to put the trash and some system for consistently emptying the receptacles. That is the part of the system that countries take time to get around to.


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## DiverSailor123 (Sep 17, 2016)

Sorry to read this.. The place where I am most experienced with, is San Miguel de Cozumel and though there is trash and rubbish and for sure the scourge of those damn plastic bags ... 90+ % of everyone , handles their household rubbish in such a way as to minimize issues.... be it cans or bags hanging on the fence or those Wrought Iron baskets on poles off the ground in front of the house.. Oh Its not paradise but lots of people make a lot of effort .. And its NOT just Gringos.. 





TundraGreen said:


> Getting people to not throw stuff on the ground is only the last step in the process. Before you even start to do that there has to be a system in place to handle the trash. To be specific I will talk about the two places I know best: City streets in Guadalajara and trails.
> 
> City streets in Guadalajara:
> Until a few years ago there were few trash receptacles anywhere. For the PanAm games in 2012, they installed a lot of bins in Centro. However they are inconsistently emptied so there is often no room to put trash in them. I have seen them bring a crew in to pick up trash in a park. They pile it all in one spot near an overflowing garbage can, but then they fail to take it away and it gradually disperses back across the park. The system for household garbage collection is for people to put plastic bags of household trash in front of their house or on the corner. Very commonly, dogs will tear the bags open and scatter the trash before the collectors come, and this is true even though the collection is daily in my neighborhood.
> ...


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## LMtortugas (Aug 23, 2013)

TundraGreen said:


> It has nothing to do with laziness or pride. It has everything to do with culture and habit. After a country gets rich enough that most people have enough to eat, and enough money to fix up their houses, and take care of other essential aspects of life, then they start to worry about things like safety and clean streets. Clean streets have not become a priority in Mexico because they have lots of other more important problems.


I agree 100%


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

I have a vacation rental room and all the renters from US or Canada have left the room and attached bathroom clean and tidy, the Mexicans have left it a total pigsty. These are Mexicans from wealthy city families. I can assure you there is a garbage receptacle in the room, but they just left their garbage all over the floor.


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## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

I have to say that a lot of what you dislike in Mexico are the same things I dislike here in FL. We have whining snowbirds who are constantly telling us how much better it is up north. My reply? "I-95 goes both ways." 

I just moved out of a neighborhood becuase of the partying and noise and barking dogs, so if I move there, I'll have to find a more quiet place, if one exists?

Traffic - hated it here when I drove, especially during snowbird season. It's amazing how badly these people drive. Where I live now, it's the students that are always on their phones while driving. Now I ride the bus. Have a bike, but not safe to ride it where I live.

Trash - I have to call the city every year when the weeds in this one area die down to have them come clean out the llitter. They do it grudgingly, then it's all back next year. What bothers me worse, as someone who walks a lot, is people who leave their dog poop all over the sides of the road where I have to walk. 

So I put up with all that stuff here now. Except for the noise, I think the good would outweigh the bad.


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## DiverSailor123 (Sep 17, 2016)

OK Now I get it. I 95 your on the East Coast..( I Live a short boat ride from my back yard private boat dock to Charlotte Harbor we are going diving and fishing out in the gulf Friday (( For The Boat Guys : ) We are using a 36' CC Yellow Fin with Triple Mercury 350's .. its a friends boat : ) ) albeit we too have snowbirds , God Bless Them All.... if it wasn't for them we would have less than half the Restaurant options we have half the number of Ace Hardware's and Home Depot's and Lowes and Every other store.. 
Either you love Mexico or you don't.. If dogs barking bother you either need to think again about Mexico or be very careful where you move to in Mexico.. Roving bands of dogs is very common in Mexico, at least everywhere I have ever stayed or visited. When was the last time you saw a Dog in the USA with Mange? Yea well its an everyday occurrence unless you live as a recluse in Mexico.. What we found and why we still contemplate the move? 
We/ You HAVE TO LOVE! The Adventure The Ambiance the Culture The Food the lousy wine but Great Margaritas or.... the real stuff, the everyday stuff will make you CRAZY! Even with Home Depot and Sams and soon Costco etc etc etc there will be items you will never purchase again.. If you see someting you want on the internet? Its not that easy.. Oh sometimes its not too bad but other times....Grrrrrrr.... 



DebInFL said:


> I have to say that a lot of what you dislike in Mexico are the same things I dislike here in FL. We have whining snowbirds who are constantly telling us how much better it is up north. My reply? "I-95 goes both ways."
> 
> I just moved out of a neighborhood because of the partying and noise and barking dogs, so if I move there, I'll have to find a more quiet place, if one exists?
> 
> ...


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

I have to say, I find the attitude of lots of expats here in Mexico that you either love Mexico or hate it, to be rather odd. I've lived many places in the world and all those places had negative and positive things about them for me. The idea that to live in Mexico you have to love it and joyfully accept all things about the culture or you shouldn't live here is black and white and the world is, in fact, many shades of many colors no matter where you choose to reside.


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## DiverSailor123 (Sep 17, 2016)

Peoples needs wants desires and there by, opinions, are often different.. and even those "can" change as we get older.. We do pretty much have to accept all things about the culture , because we are not going to change any of it.. "" _I've lived many places in the world and all those places had negative and positive things about them for me"_" How old were you at the time? Were you working to support yourself? At 65 70 80 years of age not many of us want to be picking it all up, and moving 1000 2000 3000 miles or more and starting all over a.....gain,right back where we started minus all of our things.... I am not Howard Huges I cannot afford to move all this stuff to Mexico... I too moved many times when I was younger. I was still working and I could recoup anything I had lost sold or given-away.. Once your retired , financially the world is different. It is for me anyway.. I think most, if not all of us here have multiple sources of income , but many of those sources are fixed.. Hopefully most of us have considerable amount of passive income from personal investments. Thats wonderful if you have them , but if you spend any..... of the principle for Any Reason........ that amount of monthly income is gone forever! If you have been moving around the world for much of your life you dont have a tractor trailer full of stuff to get rid of and be content in doing so.. Are you single or married that can make a huge difference as well.. Heck , just my Guitars and Amps will be a pain to move and I really hate to sell them.. so I better be real content with selling them to move and really love where I moved to because this move means giving up A LOT! The first time we had 2 homes this time we will have 1.... 


surabi said:


> I have to say, I find the attitude of lots of expats here in Mexico that you either love Mexico or hate it, to be rather odd. I've lived many places in the world and all those places had negative and positive things about them for me. The idea that to live in Mexico you have to love it and joyfully accept all things about the culture or you shouldn't live here is black and white and the world is, in fact, many shades of many colors no matter where you choose to reside.


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

Crazy moto drivers and kids leaving their bikes in the entrance to a store


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## GARYJ65 (Feb 9, 2013)

rohbear said:


> Yeah, a friend of mine is interested in Mexico, because I'm interested in Mexico and the cost of living. I strongly advised him against it, as he said he had no interest in learning to speak Spanish and doesn't much like people generally!


Hopefully you move to México and he doesn't. Most probably Mexicans wouldn't like him either


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## GARYJ65 (Feb 9, 2013)

DiverSailor123 said:


> I believe that is at best an excuse for laziness and a lack of TRUE National Pride.. Besides its then obvious that there are not enough people given jobs sweeping streets..


I am curious here, what is TRUE National Pride to you? as opposed to what Mexicans lack?
One other question; do you truly believe that Mexican, or the majority of Mexicans are lazy and need an excuse to keep being lazy?


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## DiverSailor123 (Sep 17, 2016)

Tell me how much Pride do you think it takes to use your Countries Streets Roads and Sidewalks as a garbage can? What would instill a sense of pride in you for your country and its people? 100 guys driving around drunk in 25 cars and or Trucks with a National Flag tied to the hoods with cd players on 11 or Those same 100 guys volunteering for a neighborhood sweep up or paint up and garbage pick up? Where did I use the word Majority? 


QUOTE=GARYJ65;12133441]I am curious here, what is TRUE National Pride to you? as opposed to what Mexicans lack?
One other question; do you truly believe that Mexican, or the majority of Mexicans are lazy and need an excuse to keep being lazy?[/QUOTE]


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Moderator's note:

When this thread was started I had concerns that it could easily run off the rails. But I felt that the Original Poster's interest in a discussion of things people didn't like here was a subject that is not often addressed.

I think it went along pretty well mostly, but it is no longer constructive and I have closed it.


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