# Fake EOI, Waste Invitation - Suggestive counter measures



## ParoP (Aug 11, 2019)

Opening this thread to discuss more on fake EOI & wasted invitation and how can they be stopped. Admin please feel free to delete if it is duplicate.

For last few months the sharp increase rate of 85+pointers EOI has been a point of discussion, and I think most of us believe a big chunk of those EoIs are actually fake EOI. Now with fluctuating invites from DHA is making that those 85+ pointers are getting invited only, which means out of total 2700 invited in 2019-20 , probably more than 50% will be wasted invitation and again in 2 months they will come back to system. And we original candidates will be deprived of our chances.

What is the reason for fake eois?
1. Individuals making it to ensure earlier DOE, so even if 1st invite is lost on 2nd invitation they will reach that point after nov 16?
2. Planned sabotage?
3. Agents are creating eois so that they can get more money from clients?

What can we do to stop this?
1. As suggested by NB & some other members can we suggest DHA to introduce application fee? Is there any way like petition?
2. System level integration with ACS/ EA etc to check the ref no is correct and allowing the ref no to be used only once in skill select. 
3. a humble request to all person who has multiple eoi in system - please delete your other eois once you get invitation.


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## PrettyIsotonic (Nov 30, 2016)

My personal opinion is, first you have to frame the issue to DHA in a way that is compelling enough that they are incentivised to consider taking some sort of action. So I like the language around 'planned sabotage' and framing the issue as a critical risk management issue to the migration program in general / a national security issue. 

Foremost in my mind is highlighting to DHA that the current SkillSelect system at present is likely not helping but hurting Australia in achieving its Migration Planning goals, specifically when it comes to general skilled migration visas (including the new regional migration goals and associated visas that will be rolled out soon). 

The current system is open to easy compromise, especially if a state-sponsored actor wished to disrupt the skilled migration flow to Australia via false and/or misleading EOIs with no intention of subsequently lodging a visa. 

There are some people like Abdul Rizvi - a former Deputy Secretary at DHA - who over the past months has been exceptionally candid about the current failings and flaws in the 'immigration system' - perhaps it is worth reaching out to allies like him to flag the issue and see if he has any interest in articulating the above or exploring how this issue can be elevated further. 

Here is a small example of some of his writing: https://insidestory.org.au/authors/abul-rizvi/


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## kaju (Oct 31, 2011)

PrettyIsotonic said:


> I'm sure we can have a mature conversation without having to encourage unlawful activity.
> 
> What you are suggesting is likely a crime - even if there are no known prosecutions that are being sought - see the SkillSelect login page:
> 
> ...


Penalties for providing false and misleading information, especially in an overall Immigration context, can (nominally, anyway) be quite severe, with serious prison time and/or big fines if the person is onshore. 

Although these penalties are rarely enforced, you could certainly expect to be deported, and your chances of returning after committing an offence that targets the same authority that would approve any future visa, well...


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

kaju said:


> Penalties for providing false and misleading information, especially in an overall Immigration context, can (nominally, anyway) be quite severe, with serious prison time and/or big fines if the person is onshore.
> 
> Although these penalties are rarely enforced, you could certainly expect to be deported, and your chances of returning after committing an offence that targets the same authority that would approve any future visa, well...


I am surprised that alarm bells are not ringing in the department if the figures of 30-40-50% invites wasted are correct
I would have expected to see warnings in Skillselect and press statements but there is a deafening silence as if all is well

Cheers


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## expat4aus2 (Nov 5, 2017)

ParoP said:


> Opening this thread to discuss more on fake EOI & wasted invitation and how can they be stopped. Admin please feel free to delete if it is duplicate.
> 
> For last few months the sharp increase rate of 85+pointers EOI has been a point of discussion, and I think most of us believe a big chunk of those EoIs are actually fake EOI. Now with fluctuating invites from DHA is making that those 85+ pointers are getting invited only, which means out of total 2700 invited in 2019-20 , probably more than 50% will be wasted invitation and again in 2 months they will come back to system. And we original candidates will be deprived of our chances.
> 
> ...


No one knows. There are lots of conspiracy theories like Pearson PTE, NAATI, PY companies like Navitas and so on so they can earn more money. But here's my viewpoint of what I have seen over the last 3-4 years. 

Fake EOIs doesn't stop an applicant from getting invite. It may proportionally disadvantage some occupation, but visa grant number is decided by DOHA and not on the number of Skillselect invite sent. DOHA adjusts invite based on how many they need. So, if they want to grant 10,000 people, they will send 10,000 invite and if 3000 doesn't accept due to fake, they will invite another 3000-4000 till they can fill the gap. So, overall the number of people getting grant remains at the hands of DOHA and planning of Australian government. It may cause temporary crisis but only genuine people will spend $3500+ to take the invite.

So, what is causing this sudden cry of too many fakes and stuff? Well fakes and duplicate EOIs been here all the time. But DOHA has slashed invite from 190,000 to 130-150K now and based on the numbers, we are probably looking at 140K this year which includes a lot of NZ applicant. So, that's 50,000-60,000 less visa grant and hence it has ballooned points requirements and cry among intending migrants.

One can simply see if they invite an extra 20,000 people this year, points will hit 70-65 in a jiffy as all of the 90,85,80 and 75 will be cleared. So, supply and demand is the issue and not fake EOIs. 




> What can we do to stop this?
> 1. As suggested by NB & some other members can we suggest DHA to introduce application fee? Is there any way like petition?
> 2. System level integration with ACS/ EA etc to check the ref no is correct and allowing the ref no to be used only once in skill select.
> 3. a humble request to all person who has multiple eoi in system - please delete your other eois once you get invitation.


1. That's the best option but DOHA has too much to do than fix SkillSelect.
2. That doesn't stop genuine applicant from submitting 1000 copies of the same EOI and never taking invite. So, there maybe no fake EOIs but wasted invite will still be there.
3. That's never gonna happen so no point.


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## Thuong Nguyen (Feb 10, 2019)

I think they did the same strategy with partner visa to make the processing time for 189 to 18-33 months. Who lodged fake EOIs will live in limbo forever.


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## mt3467 (Mar 6, 2019)

I’d charge a nominal amount for an EOI submission. It usually sorts out most issues.


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## sawersewer (Oct 28, 2019)

Can we start a petition to get DHA attention on this?


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## expat4aus2 (Nov 5, 2017)

sawersewer said:


> Can we start a petition to get DHA attention on this?


There has already been petition and DOHA knows. But it doesn't matter. Also if you look up one of the invitation round in late 2017 where 95% of the invite went to fake EOIs, DOHA just manually invited that round and moved on. As I posted above, fake EOIs doesn't stop people getting invite. Its DOHA who decides how much they want. 

If there were no fake invites, then lets says for 10,000 places DOHA will only invite 10,000 and not 13,000 (with 3000 wasted on fakes/unused EOIs) which means even less number of invites will be issued by DOHA. So, fake doesn't make much difference. Its DOHA who is not inviting people.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

expat4aus2 said:


> There has already been petition and DOHA knows. But it doesn't matter. Also if you look up one of the invitation round in late 2017 where 95% of the invite went to fake EOIs, DOHA just manually invited that round and moved on. As I posted above, fake EOIs doesn't stop people getting invite. Its DOHA who decides how much they want.
> 
> If there were no fake invites, then lets says for 10,000 places DOHA will only invite 10,000 and not 13,000 (with 3000 wasted on fakes/unused EOIs) which means even less number of invites will be issued by DOHA. So, fake doesn't make much difference. Its DOHA who is not inviting people.


That’s not entirely correct

There is a 60 day time lag before the department can know actually how many have applied
They just can’t invite additional applicants in the next round
2 months is a big time gap
If there was surety of no false EOIs , DHA can plan its invites in a much more orderly fashion rather then in jerks and stops

Cheers


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## expat4aus2 (Nov 5, 2017)

NB said:


> That’s not entirely correct
> 
> There is a 60 day time lag before the department can know actually how many have applied
> They just can’t invite additional applicants in the next round
> ...


2 months out of 12 months in a year is not a big hassle for DOHA considering they have so many in pipeline waiting to be invited. Grant time for 75% and 100% are now 18 months and 33 months respectively, the highest I have seen in the history of SkillSelect. 

So, yes if grant time was less than 2 months, then we have a problem. Not when DOHA already has 1.5 yrs of grant lining up. Even if they don't invite anyone for the next 1.5 years per se and first fix the processing time, they will still be fine and looks like will have enough to fill the visa grant of 2019-20.

2 months is irrational when people who got invited 1.5 years ago still haven't got the grant.


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## mt3467 (Mar 6, 2019)

Asides from charging a small fee to submit an EOI, i've always thought it should be possible to not include invites the second time around by default. 

The user's record should be suspended after the first invite and if the user didn't apply for a visa in the 60 days then their record should need the user to do something if they want it to be considered at a later date (ie unsuspend). I think this makes more sense to seek some positive affirmation from a user before considering an EOI for a second time.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

mt3467 said:


> Asides from charging a small fee to submit an EOI, i've always thought it should be possible to not include invites the second time around by default.
> 
> The user's record should be suspended after the first invite and if the user didn't apply for a visa in the 60 days then their record should need the user to do something if they want it to be considered at a later date (ie unsuspend). I think this makes more sense to seek some positive affirmation from a user before considering an EOI for a second time.


Looks like the fake EOI is not an issue at all for DHA
So they will not take any actions
A problem can only be solved if you accept in the first place that a problem exists 

Cheers


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## vyrarchz (Jul 26, 2018)

How about the guys who fake their PTE/ IELTS Cert?


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## ParoP (Aug 11, 2019)

expat4aus2 said:


> 2 months out of 12 months in a year is not a big hassle for DOHA considering they have so many in pipeline waiting to be invited. Grant time for 75% and 100% are now 18 months and 33 months respectively, the highest I have seen in the history of SkillSelect.
> 
> So, yes if grant time was less than 2 months, then we have a problem. Not when DOHA already has 1.5 yrs of grant lining up. Even if they don't invite anyone for the next 1.5 years per se and first fix the processing time, they will still be fine and looks like will have enough to fill the visa grant of 2019-20.
> 
> 2 months is irrational when people who got invited 1.5 years ago still haven't got the grant.


2 months is definitely big issue for quite few people when ACS/ English test result may expire, people might loose points over age. 

I understand DHA probably covers the wasted invitation by sending more invitations than their quota. However 2 months + 2 months are lost on each wasted invitation when some genuine candidates can be invited. A genuine candidate may lose his eligibility by aging or a perfect English score in those 4 months. ACS still can be renewed by paying , but age points cannot be back and getting a perfect score in English also not so easy to achieve.

So it's may not be an issue for DHA, but definitely a big issue for quite a few of us. and that's why requesting DHA if they can take care.


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## denominator (Sep 19, 2019)

expat4aus2 said:


> ...
> So, yes if grant time was less than 2 months, then we have a problem. Not when DOHA already has 1.5 yrs of grant lining up. Even if they don't invite anyone for the next 1.5 years per se and first fix the processing time, they will still be fine and looks like will have enough to fill the visa grant of 2019-20.
> ...


I wonder what the causes of the 189 backlog are. I'm sure the DHA carried out all the analysis during the last FY before issuing ITAs. Was there a manpower crisis in the department or a government shutdown like in the US?


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

denominator said:


> I wonder what the causes of the 189 backlog are. I'm sure the DHA carried out all the analysis during the last FY before issuing ITAs. Was there a manpower crisis in the department or a government shutdown like in the US?


Here is no manpower crisis or shutdown 

It’s just that the rules of the game changed midway
189 was getting the highest priority all these years but then suddenly 6 months back the department has moved it to the lowest priority
So the manpower allocated for 189 has been reduced to a trickle and hence the backlog 

Cheers


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## derekchasing (Oct 16, 2019)

Another very interesting fact is here: https://myimmitracker.com/en/au/trackers/consolidated-visa-tracker-sc189/analytics/visa-lodged-by-period

First of all, there is no specific reason why people starting using immitracker or stopping using it. Therefore I believe the graph reflects at least the *ratio* of visa lodge. 

Obviously, compare to last FY, the ratio of visa lodge has dropped dramatically this FY. I believe this is due to increasing number of fake EOI.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

derekchasing said:


> Another very interesting fact is here: https://myimmitracker.com/en/au/trackers/consolidated-visa-tracker-sc189/analytics/visa-lodged-by-period
> 
> First of all, there is no specific reason why people starting using immitracker or stopping using it. Therefore I believe the graph reflects at least the *ratio* of visa lodge.
> 
> Obviously, compare to last FY, the ratio of visa lodge has dropped dramatically this FY. I believe this is due to increasing number of fake EOI.


The quota for 189 couple of years back was 44,000 every year
Now it’s reduced to 18,000
So even without fake EOIs the number of visas lodged would be 2.5 times lesser

Cheers


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## expat4aus2 (Nov 5, 2017)

ParoP said:


> 2 months is definitely big issue for quite few people when ACS/ English test result may expire, people might loose points over age.
> 
> I understand DHA probably covers the wasted invitation by sending more invitations than their quota. However 2 months + 2 months are lost on each wasted invitation when some genuine candidates can be invited. A genuine candidate may lose his eligibility by aging or a perfect English score in those 4 months. ACS still can be renewed by paying , but age points cannot be back and getting a perfect score in English also not so easy to achieve.
> 
> So it's may not be an issue for DHA, but definitely a big issue for quite a few of us. and that's why requesting DHA if they can take care.


Well you answered your question. Now you know why DOHA can't be bothered or don't have the resources to tackle this issue for some people who might age out. Hence, other than some candidates who might age out, its not a major issue for most candidates.



vyrarchz said:


> How about the guys who fake their PTE/ IELTS Cert?


Do you even understand how fake EOIs works? Would you spend $3500+ to apply for fake EOIs? Or would you spend $3500+ to apply for visa with fake PTE/IELTS Cert and get 12 months or higher ban and also lose the money?


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## ParoP (Aug 11, 2019)

expat4aus2 said:


> Well you answered your question. Now you know why DOHA can't be bothered or don't have the resources to tackle this issue for some people who might age out. Hence, other than some candidates who might age out, its not a major issue for most candidates.


A first world countrie's migration system has 25-30% wasted invitation every time & no verification , validation process during data collection. That's enough reason DHA to be bothered. 

If you say aging out or losing points due to longer waiting is only concern for some candidate ( I am sure it affects quite a few candidates), why others will be bothered about then what is this forum for? People are here to help each other with guidance , share experience, discuss common problems. I have seen seniors like NB, PrettyIsotonic spending significant time here, suggesting us what to be done even if they already have their PR. Kudos to them, and we expect that kind of selfless help from this forum.




expat4aus2 said:


> Do you even understand how fake EOIs works? Would you spend $3500+ to apply for fake EOIs? Or would you spend $3500+ to apply for visa with fake PTE/IELTS Cert and get 12 months or higher ban and also lose the money?


No probably I don't. Can you please explain, so that I understand if my assumption of Fake EOI is right or wrong. also I am interested to know your view points about sudden sharp increase of 85+ pointer in skill select over last 3 month. earlier it used to be around 50-100 per month ( even in april 2019), but now it is around 1100 in around 3 months. 

No I am not going to create any fake eoi never, not because of fear of getting ban, because its against my conscience.


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## expat4aus2 (Nov 5, 2017)

ParoP said:


> A first world countrie's migration system has 25-30% wasted invitation every time & no verification , validation process during data collection. That's enough reason DHA to be bothered.


No, there is no waste. They want to grant 10,000 people visa, they are granting 10,000 people visa. So, there is no waste according to DOHA. There is verification once an applicant applies for PR visa process after submitting $3500+ fees, that is also not correct. 

Look fake/unused/multiple EOIs been there all the time. People didn't bother when they were getting 44,000 visas per year and points kept low and 30,000 invites or more were sent each year. Now suddenly you only getting 10,000 invites for 18,000 places and people started to cry foul and putting blame on fake/unused/multiple EOIs. If DOHA invites 30,000 people again, points will come down to 70 for most occupations again. Its an issue of supply and demand and nothing else.





> If you say aging out or losing points due to longer waiting is only concern for some candidate ( I am sure it affects quite a few candidates), why others will be bothered about then what is this forum for? People are here to help each other with guidance , share experience, discuss common problems. I have seen seniors like NB, PrettyIsotonic spending significant time here, suggesting us what to be done even if they already have their PR. Kudos to them, and we expect that kind of selfless help from this forum.


Have you made a poll and found out how many actually applies each year and how many of those are complaining? So, no point arguing over that. Also, I answered the query above. Its an issue of supply and demand.




> No probably I don't. Can you please explain, so that I understand if my assumption of Fake EOI is right or wrong. also I am interested to know your view points about sudden sharp increase of 85+ pointer in skill select over last 3 month. earlier it used to be around 50-100 per month ( even in april 2019), but now it is around 1100 in around 3 months.
> 
> No I am not going to create any fake eoi never, not because of fear of getting ban, because its against my conscience.


I already explained. If DOHA needs to grant 10,000 people, then they will invite 10,000 EOIs. If there are 50% fake/unused/multiple invites, then they will invite 20,000 EOIs to make up for it.

Issue is not fake/unused/multiple EOIs but the number of grants issued. Its an issue of supply and demand. No one is missing out since DOHA doesn't grant Mickey Mouse a PR visa even if Mickey Mouse submitted 1000 EOIs and got invited. Invitation doesn't mean you got the PR grant. DOHA measures their migration year based on number of grants given and not on the number of EOIs invitation sent.

75% of the people who got invited 1.5 years ago are still waiting to get grant. So, they are also not short of people whom they can give grant to, to make up their numbers and hence wasted fake/multiple/unused EOIs is not an issue also.


Edit: Let me explain in another term so you understand. You may say well DOHA invited 100 people/month in the last 3 months and lets say only 60 people applied for visa since the other 40 got wasted and 40 people missed out. If DOHA did indeed receives 100 PR application for 100 invite, there is a good chance DOHA will reduce their invite to 60/month in future since they only need 60. They invited 100/month assuming 40 of them won't apply for visa. As mentioned above, its an issue of supply and demand. I guess most people totally forgot the fact that it is DOHA who has reduced the number of invite and that is causing the whole issue.


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## EAU2452 (Jun 2, 2016)

Without any offence and with all my respect to all opinions here; I guess that there is no need of trying very hard to justify an unethical behavior on behalf of those who create fake EOIs!! "Wrong is wrong".

I personally know many people who lost their chances to get invited because of losing age points (when it comes to age, each single day matters not couple of months!!). and if the reason was the wasted invitation so it is UNFAIR.

I also didn't mention those who create multiple EOIs for 190 (different states) & 189 & 489 and don't withdraw the rest once they got invited or lodge the visa application.


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## aydenteoh (Feb 18, 2019)

I dont think migration agent will have the intention of creating fake EOIs because they can earn more money when their client gets an invitation and ask them to help, resulting in them charging a higher service fees.


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

aydenteoh said:


> I dont think migration agent will have the intention of creating fake EOIs because they can earn more money when their client gets an invitation and ask them to help, resulting in them charging a higher service fees.


Agents in Australia run PTE and Naati classes

Getting dates for Naati, Preparing for Naati is now a big thing onshore as competition is increasing

If everyone starts doing Naati, its more money for Agencies

Current rates - $1000 for Naati booking ($800 + $200) $200 for booking an earlier date which are not available on websites. What they do here is pre-book with some id, when someone comes to them to book, they release from one id and book in the applicants id and charge them $200

Naati Classes - $600 to $800

After all this if a person gets invited it is obvious he/she will go through them for application, that's more money.


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## exlipse (Oct 10, 2019)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> Agents in Australia run PTE and Naati classes
> 
> Getting dates for Naati, Preparing for Naati is now a big thing onshore as competition is increasing
> 
> ...


What you have said about NAATI theoretically can be done but it's hardly practical.
Afaik, for one ID only one exam can be booked, if they want to pre-book in 'bulk', there must be 100s of people should be working together or they must need some inside help from NAATI.

Anyhow, what about the people who create EOIs with hypothetical PTE and NAATI scores? 
They could put 90 each and NAATI score with some fake reference IDs and make 85-90 scored EOIs and update the EOI once they reach the actual score, without their DOE being effected.
Does DOHA cross-check each and every update in EOIs?


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

Duplicate post...


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

exlipse said:


> What you have said about NAATI theoretically can be done but it's hardly practical.
> Afaik, for one ID only one exam can be booked, if they want to pre-book in 'bulk', there must be 100s of people should be working together or they must need some inside help from NAATI.
> 
> Anyhow, what about the people who create EOIs with hypothetical PTE and NAATI scores?
> ...


Haha, agencies are already doing it, Each agency has at least 20-50 employees, if they want to make money, each of those employee will book a date in their name, when someone comes to them for a date in "certain month" they just release from one id, book another date on that id and at the same time book the date released into the final ID, they keep doing this. 

Currently Hindi Naati dates are not available till April 2019 and July 2019 in some cities.

Why would someone create a fake EOI and ruin their chances of getting an invite if they are at low score. They don't have any motive whereas Agencies have the motive - $$$$


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## vyrarchz (Jul 26, 2018)

expat4aus2 said:


> Well you answered your question. Now you know why DOHA can't be bothered or don't have the resources to tackle this issue for some people who might age out. Hence, other than some candidates who might age out, its not a major issue for most candidates.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you even understand how fake EOIs works? Would you spend $3500+ to apply for fake EOIs? Or would you spend $3500+ to apply for visa with fake PTE/IELTS Cert and get 12 months or higher ban and also lose the money?


Yes, I do understand how fake EOIs work - and the reason why I mentioned the fake PTE/IELTS cause it is still an unethical way to make your scores higher than genuine applications - hence, the chance of invitation is higher than others. That's similar to fake EOI anyway


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## ilovetaufu (Jan 13, 2016)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> Haha, agencies are already doing it, Each agency has at least 20-50 employees, if they want to make money, each of those employee will book a date in their name, when someone comes to them for a date in "certain month" they just release from one id, book another date on that id and at the same time book the date released into the final ID, they keep doing this.
> 
> Currently Hindi Naati dates are not available till April 2019 and July 2019 in some cities.
> 
> Why would someone create a fake EOI and ruin their chances of getting an invite if they are at low score. They don't have any motive whereas Agencies have the motive - $$$$


Does that actually work? Curious because I applied for NAATI CCL beforehand and you are required to submit an application which includes your a passport size photo of yourself and an identity document.


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## exlipse (Oct 10, 2019)

ilovetaufu said:


> Does that actually work? Curious because I applied for NAATI CCL beforehand and you are required to submit an application which includes your a passport size photo of yourself and an identity document.


No, what he meant was Agency will release their exam slot by rejecting or rescheduling to another day, so once his slot is available, the client could book on that day.


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## exlipse (Oct 10, 2019)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> Haha, agencies are already doing it, Each agency has at least 20-50 employees, if they want to make money, each of those employee will book a date in their name, when someone comes to them for a date in "certain month" they just release from one id, book another date on that id and at the same time book the date released into the final ID, they keep doing this.
> 
> Currently Hindi Naati dates are not available till April 2019 and July 2019 in some cities.
> 
> Why would someone create a fake EOI and ruin their chances of getting an invite if they are at low score. They don't have any motive whereas Agencies have the motive - $$$$


 This is a very scary situation then. Wish I could have done NAATI long before, I assumed 80 points would be more than enough to get through. Even for my native language, the latest exam date I could find is April 2020, and even that's not in my city.

No, I was talking about people who create 85-90 EOI with fake PTE, NAATI, then suspend it till they achieve the actual result.


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## ilovetaufu (Jan 13, 2016)

exlipse said:


> No, what he meant was Agency will release their exam slot by rejecting or rescheduling to another day, so once his slot is available, the client could book on that day.


Oh, but to book for a particular date(Then releasing it or reschedule), they would still have to have a separate identity document and photo, along with $800 fee for each application booked in the first place no? Just quite surprised that the agencies would have the capabilities to do so.


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

exlipse said:


> This is a very scary situation then. Wish I could have done NAATI long before, I assumed 80 points would be more than enough to get through. Even for my native language, the latest exam date I could find is April 2020, and even that's not in my city.
> 
> No, I was talking about people who create 85-90 EOI with fake PTE, NAATI, then suspend it till they achieve the actual result.


I had assumed the same that 80 points would be enough but due to lower number of 189 grants in FY 2019-2020 and fake eoi, the demand for naati is greater than ever. 

Just google urgent naati dates and you will find agencies who will book it for you for $1000 in whichever month you want


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

ilovetaufu said:


> Oh, but to book for a particular date(Then releasing it or reschedule), they would still have to have a separate identity document and photo, along with $800 fee for each application booked in the first place no? Just quite surprised that the agencies would have the capabilities to do so.


Submitting passport and photo is not hard. Once they book, yes the $800 are gone but they keep rescheduling the dates and make way more money by charging applicants $200 for the date. They keep doing this and if and when there comes a time they want to stop using that id they just cancel the exam and get $600 back for cancellation, meanwhile already making more than $200 at least via that ID, so its profit.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> Haha, agencies are already doing it, Each agency has at least 20-50 employees, if they want to make money, each of those employee will book a date in their name, when someone comes to them for a date in "certain month" they just release from one id, book another date on that id and at the same time book the date released into the final ID, they keep doing this.
> 
> Currently Hindi Naati dates are not available till April 2019 and July 2019 in some cities.
> 
> Why would someone create a fake EOI and ruin their chances of getting an invite if they are at low score. They don't have any motive whereas Agencies have the motive - $$$$


Are you allowed to edit the name, photo and passport number after you have booked ?
If not, then how would the fake booking be transferred to the actual applicant?


Cheers


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## Thuong Nguyen (Feb 10, 2019)

NB said:


> Are you allowed to edit the name, photo and passport number after you have booked ?
> If not, then how would the fake booking be transferred to the actual applicant?
> 
> 
> Cheers


they just cancel the test and ask the client immediately book to that slot. However they would be charged cancellation fee. So they may charge more than $200 fee, probably $500, or $1000, who knows?


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## ParoP (Aug 11, 2019)

ilovetaufu said:


> Does that actually work? Curious because I applied for NAATI CCL beforehand and you are required to submit an application which includes your a passport size photo of yourself and an identity document.


I didn't know that agents charge around $200 for even NAATI booking, but now I am convinced that this works. What they do is basically reschedule their own naati date to a later date, so that you get an earlier date. Similar like an air ticket rescheduling. when person B reschedules his ticket from 21st to 26th, then you get an open place on 21st & you can book that day. no one is faking identity documents there. 

Practical example: 
1. one of my friend initially got NAATi date after 11 months, but around 4 months later he got an open slot & gave the exam. He advised me keep an eye on naati date time to time, you will definitely get an open slot much before your booking date.

2. When I was booking, in morning I found there were 2 dates in Jan 15th & 23rd. In the evening when started registering found 15th already gone, 23rd fast filling. By the time I complete application 23rd also gone. But next day when naati completed verification of my application, I found both 15th & 23rd is open again.


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## ParoP (Aug 11, 2019)

exlipse said:


> This is a very scary situation then. Wish I could have done NAATI long before, I assumed 80 points would be more than enough to get through. Even for my native language, the latest exam date I could find is April 2020, and even that's not in my city.
> 
> No, I was talking about people who create 85-90 EOI with fake PTE, NAATI, then suspend it till they achieve the actual result.


Check perth dates. Initially there was no date in perth till July 2020, but around a month back they announced new dates between Jan - april 2020. I have been lucky to book in Jan, 2020. May be still there are some slots left.


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## exlipse (Oct 10, 2019)

ParoP said:


> Check perth dates. Initially there was no date in perth till July 2020, but around a month back they announced new dates between Jan - april 2020. I have been lucky to book in Jan, 2020. May be still there are some slots left.


Thanks for the tip, but even in Perth the latest is APR 2020. But I'll keep checking.

Have you been following any particular site to get updates or did you check it every day via 'Manage my tests?'


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## ParoP (Aug 11, 2019)

exlipse said:


> Thanks for the tip, but even in Perth the latest is APR 2020. But I'll keep checking.
> 
> Have you been following any particular site to get updates or did you check it every day via 'Manage my tests?'


I was just checking manually via manage my test once or twice a week.


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

For clarification I'll explain with an example

5 agency employees submit Naati application with ID's and stuff, They all book dates for April in different cities. Over next 1 month all the April dates are gone.

They advertise that they can book April dates for you for $200. 

Person 1: Gives $200 + $800 (Naati fee) to the agency. The Agency simply reschedules the employees naati date to July now. Logs into the person's account and gives him/her April date.

This keeps on going until Naati demand will decrease, which is unlikely due to limited 189 PR Grants so everyone will do Naati. So how to convince people to do Naati? Fake EOI's, create a fear that without Naati PR is impossible, oo also we can book naati dates for you for a mere $200, oo we have classes also, more competition more money

Hope this explains how this is possible


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## winterapril (Jan 15, 2019)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> For clarification I'll explain with an example
> 
> 5 agency employees submit Naati application with ID's and stuff, They all book dates for April in different cities. Over next 1 month all the April dates are gone.
> 
> ...


They should be sued. this is daylight robbery. Can't believe a first world country like Oz is letting these unscrupulous vultures run riot, that too with the tacit blessings of the govt


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

winterapril said:


> They should be sued. this is daylight robbery. Can't believe a first world country like Oz is letting these unscrupulous vultures run riot, that too with the tacit blessings of the govt


Unfortunately, there is no way to prove this, people will go to any extent in getting PR and agencies will exploit the people. 

On a totally unrelated note, I just learned from a friend of an Agent that the agent helped 5 couples get divorce in order to claim 10 points for Single


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## ParoP (Aug 11, 2019)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> On a totally unrelated note, I just learned from a friend of an Agent that the agent helped 5 couples get divorce in order to claim 10 points for Single



but 10 points is only for 'Never married' or for "divorcee' also??? Its surprising that there are people for whom migration is more important than family...


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> For clarification I'll explain with an example
> 
> 5 agency employees submit Naati application with ID's and stuff, They all book dates for April in different cities. Over next 1 month all the April dates are gone.
> 
> ...


This is possible only if the cancellation of the appointment is reflected in the system in real time
If it takes some time to show the vacancy , then the vacant slots may be snapped up by some other applicant also

Cheers


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

ParoP said:


> but 10 points is only for 'Never married' or for "divorcee' also??? Its surprising that there are people for whom migration is more important than family...


Was told by that same friend that it was useless in getting divorced as when they apply for PR they will most likely not get it as the divorce came after the announcement of points change


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## nareshramamourthy (Oct 1, 2019)

Serious fine should be placed by DHA on the fake EOIs. If they encounter any agents with more number of such fake EOIs, there licence to be cancelled and MARA membership needs to be revoked.


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

NB said:


> This is possible only if the cancellation of the appointment is reflected in the system in real time
> If it takes some time to show the vacancy , then the vacant slots may be snapped up by some other applicant also
> 
> Cheers


Yup the cancellation and showing up of the new date happens in real time


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## GandalfandBilbo (Sep 17, 2019)

Good news for Naati aspirants, they just released a whole lot of new dates yesterday and exam bookings until December 2020


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## exlipse (Oct 10, 2019)

GandalfandBilbo said:


> Good news for Naati aspirants, they just released a whole lot of new dates yesterday and exam bookings until December 2020


OMG ! I owe you a lifetime. 
I usually check this every day as it has become a daily routine of mine. But somehow I missed yesterday. 
Just checked now and was fortunate enough to reschedule my May 2020 to Feb 2020.


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## Marple1102 (Jan 7, 2019)

Thanks for the tips on rescheduling NAATI! Unfortunately, I have to keep my July 2020 date, since I'm relearning Spanish to gain complete fluency and take the exam (yes, this is how badly I want to move to Australia).

It helps in the future though, because in case I need to go take it again, I know that I could possibly get an earlier test date. Of course, it would be even better if I got an invite without having to take NAATI. Don't we all wish? 

But in getting back to DOHA not paying attention, is there any sort of FOI request that can be put in to see how many fake EOIs there are? Like if there are exact matches on IELTS IDs etc? I know it would take time, but they should be able to do a diff on certain columns in an EOI database to see if there are exact matches.


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## Xavier91 (Jul 12, 2017)

Just get more points then


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## Marple1102 (Jan 7, 2019)

Xavier91 said:


> Just get more points then


What was the purpose of this post other than to be rude? If you read the responses on this thread, and many other threads, you will see people talking about working to get more points from PTE, IELTS, and NAATI. 

Getting more points, which isn't always an easy thing to do based off of age or other factors (e.g. you can't go on a working holiday visa if you're over 32, etc) is not the answer to combating fraud in the system.

There are plenty of other countries who make people pay for their EOI and then they either refund the money if the person doesn't apply for their visa or that cost is applied toward the visa application. No one here is whining or complaining. This is a legitimate concern.


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