# Aufenthaltserlaubnis question



## dcasarrubias

Is the Aufenthaltserlaubnis renewable? Also can you work with a Aufenthaltserlaubnis? If you get a Aufenthaltserlaubnis to live with a spouse in Germany, would you be allowed to work with it.


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## Nononymous

An Aufenhaltserlaubnis is a residence permit. There are different types, and different reasons for having one. It's not the same as a work permit.

To the questions -

Is it renewable? Depends on the circumstances - why are you extending your stay, do you have the means to support yourself?

Can you work? Only if you have a work permit, which is a different beast.

Can you work if you marry a German? I believe so, yes.


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## dcasarrubias

Nononymous said:


> An Aufenhaltserlaubnis is a residence permit. There are different types, and different reasons for having one. It's not the same as a work permit.
> 
> To the questions -
> 
> Is it renewable? Depends on the circumstances - why are you extending your stay, do you have the means to support yourself?
> 
> Can you work? Only if you have a work permit, which is a different beast.
> 
> Can you work if you marry a German? I believe so, yes.


Would having a spouse in Germany be enough to extend it?


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## dcasarrubias

Nononymous said:


> An Aufenhaltserlaubnis is a residence permit. There are different types, and different reasons for having one. It's not the same as a work permit.
> 
> To the questions -
> 
> Is it renewable? Depends on the circumstances - why are you extending your stay, do you have the means to support yourself?
> 
> Can you work? Only if you have a work permit, which is a different beast.
> 
> Can you work if you marry a German? I believe so, yes.


Will they let you extend it if you have a spouse in Germany?


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## sweetginger

it depends on the nationality/residence permit of the spouse.


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## Nononymous

If your spouse is the right sort of EU national (there may still be restrictions for certain newer member states like, say, Romania) then yes, in principle you could extend your residence permit indefinitely. (There may be conditions that the spouse be able to support you, or proof required that it's not a green-card marriage, things like that.)


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## dcasarrubias

Nononymous said:


> If your spouse is the right sort of EU national (there may still be restrictions for certain newer member states like, say, Romania) then yes, in principle you could extend your residence permit indefinitely. (There may be conditions that the spouse be able to support you, or proof required that it's not a green-card marriage, things like that.)


So if your spouse is German, then you can extend your residence permit indefinitely?


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## sweetginger

yes


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## dcasarrubias

If you have a German spouse and you are awarded a temporary residency permit, will you be able to work or do you need special permission?


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## Nononymous

If you have a German spouse your residence permit would not be temporary, and you would be entitled to work.

There are probably little rules and wrinkles and technicalities here and there but basically, if you marry a German and the marriage is accepted as legitimate (i.e. it's not an obvious sham; you're not a 17-year-old girl from rural Anatolia being married to a cousin) then you can live and work in Germany.


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## beppi

The above replies contain quite a lot of conflicting half-truths.
Please take it from me, who has been in the same situation:
- If you move to Germany with your EU-national spouse, you are entitled to a (temporary)residence permit and a work permit. The formalities might take a few months after arrival, though.
- If your spouse is not EU-national (but has a residence permit him/herself), I believe you get a (temporary) residence permit but cannot work. I have not been in this situation, so take this with caution.
- The residence permit is renewed as long as you reside in Germany with your spouse. You might also have to prove German language skills and/or attend cultural integration courses. These were introduced before I wnet through this, so I don't know for sure.
- For spouse of EU citizen, you can apply for a permanent residency permit after three years. With that, you can even stay on after separating from your spouse.


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## dcasarrubias

beppi said:


> The above replies contain quite a lot of conflicting half-truths.
> Please take it from me, who has been in the same situation:
> - If you move to Germany with your EU-national spouse, you are entitled to a (temporary)residence permit and a work permit. The formalities might take a few months after arrival, though.
> - If your spouse is not EU-national (but has a residence permit him/herself), I believe you get a (temporary) residence permit but cannot work. I have not been in this situation, so take this with caution.
> - The residence permit is renewed as long as you reside in Germany with your spouse. You might also have to prove German language skills and/or attend cultural integration courses. These were introduced before I wnet through this, so I don't know for sure.
> - For spouse of EU citizen, you can apply for a permanent residency permit after three years. With that, you can even stay on after separating from your spouse.



Once you enter Germany what do you have to do. Do you have to sign in your state. Also, where do you apply for the Residence permit? Someone told me that you apply at the Ausländerbehörde, but the website of the mmigration office in Munich says you apply in the Kreisverwaltungsreferat.


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## Nononymous

Your question is not entirely intelligible. See reply to other thread.


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## ALKB

dcasarrubias said:


> So if your spouse is German, then you can extend your residence permit indefinitely?


The first residence permit issued to the spouse of a German national is usually valid for one year, free of charge and yes, the spouse of a German national has unrestricted access to the job market in Germany. There is no separate work permit, your permission to work and any restrictions will be mentioned on the residence permit.

After one year, you will have to reapply and the Ausländerbehörde will check whether your circumstances have changed. The second residence permit is usually issued for a period of two years.

After those two years you can apply for an indefinite residence permit but for this you will have to meet additional requirements such as supporting yourself without the need of public funds, German language skills, etc.

If you do not meet the requirements for indefinite, you will be issued another two year residence permit.

Alternatively, you can apply for German citizenship after the initial three years but again, you have to meet the requirements which are even more stringent than for the indefinite residence permit.

BTW, an indefinite residence permit automatically becomes invalid if you spend more than six months outside Germany unless you announce your absence to the Ausländerbehörde beforehand and they give you a letter that they authorised your stay abroad and your permit does not lose its validity. You'd have to show that letter at the German border when returning.


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## dcasarrubias

beppi said:


> The above replies contain quite a lot of conflicting half-truths.
> Please take it from me, who has been in the same situation:
> - If you move to Germany with your EU-national spouse, you are entitled to a (temporary)residence permit and a work permit. The formalities might take a few months after arrival, though.
> - If your spouse is not EU-national (but has a residence permit him/herself), I believe you get a (temporary) residence permit but cannot work. I have not been in this situation, so take this with caution.
> - The residence permit is renewed as long as you reside in Germany with your spouse. You might also have to prove German language skills and/or attend cultural integration courses. These were introduced before I wnet through this, so I don't know for sure.
> - For spouse of EU citizen, you can apply for a permanent residency permit after three years. With that, you can even stay on after separating from your spouse.



You said it might take a couple months to get the residence permit, so do they allow you to overstay the 3 month limit given to citizens of the US, while you are waiting for the permit.


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## ALKB

dcasarrubias said:


> You said it might take a couple months to get the residence permit, so do they allow you to overstay the 3 month limit given to citizens of the US, while you are waiting for the permit.


The 'couple of months' probably refers to visa nationals applying from outside Germany.

As a US citizen you can enter Germany without a visa. Just register your residence at the local municipality, collect all your documents and apply fo rthe permit directly at the Ausländerbehörde, the permit is usually issued on the spot if they are still using the sticker-in-passport system. 

I don't think they have rolled out the biometric residence card to spouses of German nationals, yet, but I could be wrong.

Printing the biometric card takes around 3 weeks, as far as I heard.


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## dcasarrubias

ALKB said:


> The 'couple of months' probably refers to visa nationals applying from outside Germany.
> 
> As a US citizen you can enter Germany without a visa. Just register your residence at the local municipality, collect all your documents and apply fo rthe permit directly at the Ausländerbehörde, the permit is usually issued on the spot if they are still using the sticker-in-passport system.
> 
> I don't think they have rolled out the biometric residence card to spouses of German nationals, yet, but I could be wrong.
> 
> Printing the biometric card takes around 3 weeks, as far as I heard.


Just on more quick question. You said to register with the municipal office when you arrive, but is that only if you are planning to apply for the residence card, or did you have to do that even when you are just entering as a tourist. Because I have entered Germany several times over the past 2 years and have not registered with any municipal office.


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## ALKB

dcasarrubias said:


> Just on more quick question. You said to register with the municipal office when you arrive, but is that only if you are planning to apply for the residence card, or did you have to do that even when you are just entering as a tourist. Because I have entered Germany several times over the past 2 years and have not registered with any municipal office.


You only have to register your residence if you are resident in Germany, it's not required for visits.

Everybody (Germans, too!) have to register a change in address within 7 days of moving.

You will receive a paper (better pay the small fee to receive a printed version rather than the free carbon copy thing) which will be your proof of address (no electricity bills for this purpose in Germany) and you have to carry it together with your passport for ID.


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## Nononymous

dcasarrubias said:


> You said it might take a couple months to get the residence permit, so do they allow you to overstay the 3 month limit given to citizens of the US, while you are waiting for the permit.


As mentioned, it's usually granted on the same day you apply - there is no processing time.

If you were to screw up and make your appointment a week before the 90 days was up and then fail to bring the correct documents, you *might* get an extension sort it out (happened to my wife 20 years ago) or you might be asked to leave.


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## Nononymous

dcasarrubias said:


> Just on more quick question. You said to register with the municipal office when you arrive, but is that only if you are planning to apply for the residence card, or did you have to do that even when you are just entering as a tourist. Because I have entered Germany several times over the past 2 years and have not registered with any municipal office.


I don't know what the exact rule is on this for tourists, but in practice you don't bother for short stays. 

However, we once stayed in a sub-let for exactly 90 days, so did not need residence permits, but needed to register the address to open a bank account, register our daughter at the local school, get a library card, etc.

Registration of address and application for residence permit are two completely different things. You must do the former before doing the latter, but doing the former does not mean you must then do the latter. Alles klar?


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