# Short of 2 year cohabitation for De-facto visa



## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

Hi All,
I wrote on here last year with the same query. My partner's currently here in the UK on a YMS, which expires 8th April 2013. Our issue is that he arrived in the UK 9th April 2010, and therefore we will be 1 day short of the required 2 year cohabitation. 

I was just wondering if anyone else has applied with a similar issue? I assume they've gotten even more strict with it since the changes in July?

I believe we have enough evidence to show our relationship, we both earn over the required £18600, and we're also engaged to be married in Oct next year (we chose not to have a quick registry marriage before April, as both our parents would've killed us!)

I read somewhere that if you overstay on your visa under a certain number of days (28 I believe?) then they won't mark it against you for future visa applications. If this is the case, would it be worth waiting until the 9th to make the application so that we have the required 2 years? Am sure this is a ridiculously stupid idea, but thought would ask anyway 

Any help would be much appreciated!

Perox


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

Hi All,
We've decided to go ahead and risk the application in March (28 days before his visa expires) We'll be making sure we have as much evidence as possible for the time he's been here, and also some from when we were apart, and we'll also be paying for a lawyer to look over the application beforehand.

We've decided to go for the same day appointment, and I was wondering, how far in advance can we book this appointment online, is it 6 weeks?


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## laurastew (Oct 15, 2012)

Hello,

I would think to apply early just make it clear in your introduction letter and any documents that confirm co-habitation (lease, bills) that these are ongoing and will cover up to and further than the 2 year date. 

Also, you might want to have your Church or Registry Office produce something confirming your wedding date/booking. 

There are mixed messages about the PEO dates available for online booking as I think they just updated the system. 6 weeks was generally the rule (with cancellations sooner also coming up for booking) but I'm not sure now. 

If you are paying a lawyer to look the application over, some can also make appointments for you so it might be a good deal for you to hire someone who can do both (save the cost/stress of booking one yourself and maybe not getting a PEO that is close to you).

Hope this helps!


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

Thank you for your reply - that helps a lot! Will make sure to make it clear that the documentation is continuing - hadn't thought of that! Will also make sure with regards to the information of the marriage details, have already got a couple of things but will ask the vicar to produce something as well!

that's what I thought about the online booking, and will make sure to mention to lawyers we talk to about them making the booking.

Thanks again, very helpful!!


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## 2farapart (Aug 18, 2011)

Let us know how you get on. I couldn't answer your original query because I have no idea just how strict UKBA will be - especially given that it's a mere 1 day. It would be a great help to know. And good luck!!


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

Thanks 2farapart, I will - it's a big risk, but we're preparing for the worst and hoping for the best! We're hoping that as it's just one day and we'll chuck all the evidence we have, no matter how insignificant it seems! Also, we'll have money to the side just in case it doesn't go through and an appeal is needed!


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## laurastew (Oct 15, 2012)

The only worry I can think of is that the co-habitation is set at 2 years to avoid people coming over on a YMS Tier 5 and using it as a "jumping board" to FLR. 

But I'm sure a qualified lawyer will be able to answer that and have precedent to rely on.


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

I can understand that, one my my friends I went travelling with to Aus also met her partner out there, and he came here on a YMS a bit before mine and succeeded, so hopefully they will ours as well!

We shall see in a few months time...!!


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## WestCoastCanadianGirl (Mar 17, 2012)

Could you not just do the registry thing and not say anything to your families? I mean what would they know beyond the fact that you're trying to get the current visa extended?

Both options (defacto spouse visa and registry office wedding) are means to a common end (extension of the visa so you can have a proper family wedding next fall) and both require the same amount of effort to get (proof of income, r'ship, application fees etc) but at least you know that the registry office wedding route is the path of least resistance and is less likely to lead to a refusal.

I read somewhere on the UKBA site that (for Citizenship applications at least) they specifically mention that they want proof that applicants have been in the UK for the specified amount of time on the date on which they receive the application... If such proof is not given, the application won't be considered. If they're going to be that strict with Citizenship applications, it would make sense that they'd be equally as strict on FLR(M) applications as well.


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## WestCoastCanadianGirl (Mar 17, 2012)

Here's the bit about how they adjudicate the residential qualifying period. 

Again, I would expect this to be SOP across all visa categories.


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

Thanks for your reply! We did consider that, but we decided that we just didn't want to get married for the sakes of a visa - we just weren't willing to do it. If we don't get the unmarried partner visa then that's just one of those things, we might be daft in that respect but it's what we decided to do!

From what I've learnt from immigration lawyers, and a friend that applied a couple of months ago, they accept you applying 28 days before your visa expires and they consider the evidence you have up until the visa expires. I understand with the link you sent that's for citizenship, so I think the requirements for that would be different to applying for a visa? Although I may very well be wrong, but that was the impression I'd been given by this forum and lawyers?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

perox123 said:


> Hi All,
> I wrote on here last year with the same query. My partner's currently here in the UK on a YMS, which expires 8th April 2013. Our issue is that he arrived in the UK 9th April 2010, and therefore we will be 1 day short of the required 2 year cohabitation.
> 
> I was just wondering if anyone else has applied with a similar issue? I assume they've gotten even more strict with it since the changes in July?
> ...


Yes, it is. Don't do is as it's the quickest way to a forced flight home. If you delay your application even by one day, you are an overstayer and lose all your rights.

I think even with just one day short, UKBA can turn you down. Have you met your partner only in UK? Haven't you had known him before he arrived? No previous co-habitation, even on a tourist visa?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

perox123 said:


> Thanks for your reply! We did consider that, but we decided that we just didn't want to get married for the sakes of a visa - we just weren't willing to do it. If we don't get the unmarried partner visa then that's just one of those things, we might be daft in that respect but it's what we decided to do!
> 
> From what I've learnt from immigration lawyers, and a friend that applied a couple of months ago, they accept you applying 28 days before your visa expires and they consider the evidence you have up until the visa expires. I understand with the link you sent that's for citizenship, so I think the requirements for that would be different to applying for a visa? Although I may very well be wrong, but that was the impression I'd been given by this forum and lawyers?


What they are saying is that while you can apply up to 28 days before visa expiry, your case will be considered on the situation obtaining on the last day of the visa validity. So if on that date you are one day short of 2 years, they are quite entitled to turn you down, as you have failed to meet one of the conditions. Yes, they are that strict.


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

Hi Joppa,
Many thanks for the reply - I knew that would be the case, but thank you for the clarification!

Yes, we knew each other before the UK - we were together for 9 months in Aus, but then were apart for a year, and we don't have any proof of living together in Aus - we did live together, but there's just no proof of it (and they wouldn't accept it as we were apart for too long)

I completely understand that there is a very good chance that they'll turn us down due to being short, we're prepared for that so we may end up appealing, or he'll go back to Aus, we'll get married in Oct as planned and I'll have to apply to go over there - far from ideal or what we hoped, but that's life!


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

perox123 said:


> Hi Joppa,
> Many thanks for the reply - I knew that would be the case, but thank you for the clarification!
> 
> Yes, we knew each other before the UK - we were together for 9 months in Aus, but then were apart for a year, and we don't have any proof of living together in Aus - we did live together, but there's just no proof of it (and they wouldn't accept it as we were apart for too long)
> ...


You won't win the appeal as you have been rightly turned down.
Another snag is you will get a black mark on your immigration record, and this may come back to haunt you for all future dealings with UKBA, even just coming as a tourist. Your application will receive even greater scrutiny, UKBA in Manila (where all Australian applications are considered) will get in touch with UKBA here to get your dossiers etc., and your case may be referred to a specialist case working section in UK. 
Getting married will eliminate almost all doubts, if as you say your other evidence is watertight.


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

Thanks Joppa, that makes sense with regards to the appeal - I'll forget about that idea then.

Completely understand about the black mark as well. 

Think I'll have to broach the idea of a quickie marriage to the other half, although I wouldn't want to say all our evidence etc. is watertight as I'm no immigration lawyer but I do believe it's strong.

Thanks again for all your help Joppa, I think we're just going to have to realise we have no other choice


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

perox123 said:


> Thanks Joppa, that makes sense with regards to the appeal - I'll forget about that idea then.
> 
> Completely understand about the black mark as well.
> 
> ...


Though they say they now ignore overstay up to 28 days, I don't think relying on discretion is a sensible idea when you don't (quite) meet the cohabitation requirement on the day your partner's visa expires, i.e. you are relying on illegal overstay in order to meet one of the conditions. You may be successful or you may not - I wouldn't want to take the gamble.

People often have a legal marriage to meet tight immigration rules. Once visa is granted, you can have a full ceremony with renewal of vows, reception and honeymoon.

If you decide to apply anyway, I strongly suggest you enclose any evidence you have of your time together in Australia, such as photos, travel tickets, any official letters received bearing the same address, even a letter from a responsible person - clergy, teachers, doctors, lawyers, politicians etc attesting to relevant facts (but not if they are relatives).


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## perox123 (Jan 30, 2012)

I won't consider using the overstay at all - as you say, it's just not worth the risk and I don't want him to have the mark of overstaying against him!

We'll definitely consider the getting married option before April, also we'll consider whether he should just go back to Aus and apply for a prospective marriage/fiance visa. Also, will talk to some immigration lawyers and see what they think about it all!

Many thanks again Joppa for all your comments


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## oneonefourone (Sep 5, 2012)

perox123 said:


> Thanks for your reply! We did consider that, but we decided that we just didn't want to get married for the sakes of a visa - we just weren't willing to do it. If we don't get the unmarried partner visa then that's just one of those things, we might be daft in that respect but it's what we decided to do!
> 
> From what I've learnt from immigration lawyers, and a friend that applied a couple of months ago, they accept you applying 28 days before your visa expires and they consider the evidence you have up until the visa expires. I understand with the link you sent that's for citizenship, so I think the requirements for that would be different to applying for a visa? Although I may very well be wrong, but that was the impression I'd been given by this forum and lawyers?





perox123 said:


> I won't consider using the overstay at all - as you say, it's just not worth the risk and I don't want him to have the mark of overstaying against him!
> 
> We'll definitely consider the getting married option before April, also we'll consider whether he should just go back to Aus and apply for a prospective marriage/fiance visa. Also, will talk to some immigration lawyers and see what they think about it all!
> 
> Many thanks again Joppa for all your comments


Everyone is obviously right to caution you and it sounds like you're leaning towards trying the more safe option with getting married. 

Just wanted to give you my two cents... I successfully applied for the unmarried partner visa under new rules via the NY processing office in October. I applied August 1, 2012. We moved in together September 1, 2010. We were therefore 1 month short, but I thought it worth the gamble as we were IN the 24th month and I had a rent receipt for that month in both our names. By the time the visa was issued in early October, obviously we were past the 24 months. Not sure if that made any difference, but time of application should have been considered August 1. We were never asked for any additional evidence and, other than waiting a long time due to the worldwide delays, seem to have sailed through. This, despite also having to explain 6 months apart during our 2 years while I had a temporary residence in another city where I was completing an MA degree. 

I had consulted a lawyer in June 2012 prior to making the application and his advice was that it depends on whether the ECO wants to be a jerk or not. Because you would technically miss the criteria they could deny you. I would think that if you meet everything else (financial, housing, relationship) with flying colours that you would stand a chance. If this is the route taken and it fails, an appeal as Joppa mentioned would not really fly. You would then be looking at having to pay for a flight home and a fresh application, leading to more cost and time apart and disruption to jobs etc. Still, thought my experience might offer an example...


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## Joey11413 (Nov 11, 2012)

I think it's quite specific about the Visa rules in that you have to leave the country to apply for another visa once you've been on the Youth Mobility Visa? I can remember something on mine that said there was no route to another visa from within the country. I know had to go home to get my first Tier 2 visa.


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## oneonefourone (Sep 5, 2012)

Joey11413 said:


> I think it's quite specific about the Visa rules in that you have to leave the country to apply for another visa once you've been on the Youth Mobility Visa? I can remember something on mine that said there was no route to another visa from within the country. I know had to go home to get my first Tier 2 visa.


You can't switch into a points-based visa or a visitor visa from a YMS, but a partner visa is not a points-based visa.


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## Joey11413 (Nov 11, 2012)

oneonefourone said:


> You can't switch into a points-based visa or a visitor visa from a YMS, but a partner visa is not a points-based visa.


Fantastic - I wasn't sure, but knew that I had to go home... *going back into my box now*


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## laurastew (Oct 15, 2012)

Joey11413 said:


> I think it's quite specific about the Visa rules in that you have to leave the country to apply for another visa once you've been on the Youth Mobility Visa? I can remember something on mine that said there was no route to another visa from within the country. I know had to go home to get my first Tier 2 visa.


You only have to leave if you are changing to a points based visa. You can apply in country to FLR.


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