# Economist Student From Europe, Moving to Dubai



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Hi all!

I have planned moving from Finland to abroad for over five years now, I have decided to move in Dubai. 

I have heard that usually western expats who are moving UAE are middle-aged guys on average and they are finding jobs that demand often work experience of 5-10 years. I am currently 20 years old and I would be moving to Dubai around in the age of 26. 

After the graduation in about 4 years, I am doing Masters Degree, I would be having experience of about 2 years in the work and one year job experience of second lieutenant in Finland's Defence forces. Work experience would be done in good listed company and I would have very good recommendation letter from people in those companies and from others as well. 

Can you guys see demand on the job-market to guy like me, moving to Dubai with mine GF/Wife and get decent job?

Thanks for your help in advance. 

Robert


----------



## twowheelsgood (Feb 21, 2013)

You have to have a job to live in Dubai so what sort of job are you planning to do as a masters with no actual experience isn't much or a discriminator ?

You don't 'decide to move to Dubai' as such but find a job in Dubai and as a consequence move here.

26 year olds with no experience are ten a penny here and unlikely (IMO) to get a high paying job in the finance sector.

I'm not sure exactly what an economist does other than make random guesses and get them wrong most of the time


----------



## QOFE (Apr 28, 2013)

You're asking for information about something that may or may not happen in SIX years time. Who knows what the situation is then.

Come back in six years time and we'll see how many of us are left here to answer your queries. Two years experience would not equal to a well paid job here.
Your best bet is to get a job with a company which has representation in Dubai too and get a transfer.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Okay... Really deep analyst indeed. 

It's maybe a policy in Suriname that your goals are few weeks ahead of you, but in Europe, and other parts of the world, some people focus goals to over ten years. 

Have you ever before heard stories when former officer goes to work for private sector, without any degree or jobexperience whats so ever, but the are reaching for very well paid jobs, because they have had very good and expensive training in the army. 

If you google "united states army rangers" you will find the type of work that I was doing in the army, as a officer. You have no idea, how much people can learn there about leading.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Let's make other type of scenario.

I am 33 years old guy with masters of financing or economics degree from the UK.

I am former ranger, got 6 years experience in listed companies in Finland and Europe. 

Now I am going to Dubai for job interview-trip for a two week. 

I have letter of recommendation from CEO's in some middle-size listed companies companies and Managers from very large listed Finnish companies like Nokia. 

Guys with my field of expertise are getting 75 000 dollar starting salary in the Europe.

Is there job for guys like me?


----------



## QOFE (Apr 28, 2013)

Perhaps you should not believe everything you read on the internet. I might not be from Suriname. 
You're talking about dreams and goals. What do you , a 20 year old boy from Finland, got to offer that would make the employers in Dubai to shower you with top job offers?

1) Finish you degree. 
2) Gain more work experience

You're demanding answers on hypothetical questions. The replies were based on your *current *situation. If your response is to get stroppy with us straight away, I don't see how you will survive that well out in the big world.
You might find that compulsory military service is not that big of a deal in a lot of jobs out there.


----------



## Fat Bhoy Tim (Feb 28, 2013)

Robert_Finland said:


> Okay... Really deep analyst indeed.
> 
> It's maybe a policy in Suriname that your goals are few weeks ahead of you, but in Europe, and other parts of the world, some people focus goals to over ten years.
> 
> ...


Cool story, bro.

Amongst other things, I recruit graduates into a consulting organisation. Based on that, you'd go on the "no" list for attitude.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Fat Bhoy Tim said:


> Cool story, bro.
> 
> Amongst other things, I recruit graduates into a consulting organisation. Based on that, you'd go on the "no" list for attitude.


Tell me that what kind of graduates are you recruiting then. Simple saying "No" is quite an unprofessional opinion. Just because you are in the company that hires people, you can't tell what kind of person is talking to you on the forum, just based on his comment. I have done the same job when recruiting new privates to Finnish guerrilla warfare unit. I know that before making decision, you should meet the guy, know his history but the meeting is still the most important part.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Damn that people on this forum are so dumb. " Fat bhoy thim" should read between lines. It's clear to me that people who are writing to this forum, are not really that good experts as they think. Yeah and I bet that average 20 years old are more childish where you are coming from. We have the same thing in Finland. Take a focus on the best 5 percent of the generation. Those guys are different than people on the average. 

I have talked about job opportunities with guys who are working in Persian golf region. I have got totally different feedback from them. While talking about future, I have mentioned working for in the UK and Scandinavia, but they have told me that they are going to need smart western guys with different skills.

You people may be pacifist and in your country army is only for the dumb people. In Finland military service is mandatory and only criminals and people with serious health issues, are forbidden to do it. 


Could you guys give honest answers, instead of trolling the thread? 

Thank you,

Robert


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

QOFE said:


> Perhaps you should not believe everything you read on the internet. I might not be from Suriname.
> You're talking about dreams and goals. What do you , a 20 year old boy from Finland, got to offer that would make the employers in Dubai to shower you with top job offers?
> 
> 1) Finish you degree.
> ...




I can see very much naive ideas on your thinking. You are defending yourself a bit too strongly. Think question on philosophical view. Isn't all situation with guys in here hypothetical until those have happened? Normal military service isn't always that a big a deal. Most veterans are not officers. I mentioned my military service only because achievements tell something to people who really know the military.


----------



## QOFE (Apr 28, 2013)

How about getting off your high horse? 
Do we have another "daddy pays case" here?

Did you familiarise yourself with the forum rules? It's apparent that you didn't bother to do that either. It might be acceptable to call people dumb in the bullying army environment. Here in Dubai you might land yourself with a prison sentence if you're not careful.

1) Finish your education
2) Get some more experience under your belt

Come back when you're in a position for some serious talk and have got rid of that teenage angst of yours.


----------



## Mr Rossi (May 16, 2009)

Have you ever had dinner with Lionel Richie?


----------



## The Rascal (Aug 6, 2014)

Robert_Finland said:


> You people may be pacifist and in your country army is only for the dumb people.


And that one sentence not only shows your naivety but also your total lack of respect for the UAE people.

You'll last days here, you certainly won't get a job (and artificial intelligence is surprisingly a growth industry in Abu Dhabi), get off your high horse and listen to people that have forgotten more than you've ever learned.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

The Rascal said:


> And that one sentence not only shows your naivety but also your total lack of respect for the UAE people.
> 
> You'll last days here, you certainly won't get a job (and artificial intelligence is surprisingly a growth industry in Abu Dhabi), get off your high horse and listen to people that have forgotten more than you've ever learned.




Sorry mate. I was using argumentative language to make my point, because people did ignore my opinion. People are calling soldiers in many countries dumb and I don't do that by myself. Other people do like that in Western Europe a lot and I wasn't talking about the people in the UAE. 

Could you tell me how did I offend UAE people? I am not bully type of guy, we just may have different way of using forums. I may be using too blunt language because I have used writing to forums in Finnish and Swedish.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Mr Rossi said:


> Have you ever had dinner with Lionel Richie?



This is the type of trolling that you guys are doing when I started the thread. In my opinion it's childish if it just continues days.


----------



## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

Robert_Finland said:


> This is the type of trolling that you guys are doing when I started the thread. In my opinion it's childish if it just continues days.


Hi,
A lot of the regular members on this forum have seen posts similar to yours from people who are dreaming of coming to the UAE to find gold and make their fortune.
99% of those people never make it to the UAE.
The older members therefore have a rather cynical view of new members sharing their dreams!
The question is - are you one of the 99% or are you one of the much rarer 1% who finds a niche and makes their dream happen?
I guess only time will tell!
Best of luck
Steve


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

QOFE said:


> How about getting off your high horse?
> Do we have another "daddy pays case" here?
> 
> Did you familiarise yourself with the forum rules? It's apparent that you didn't bother to do that either. It might be acceptable to call people dumb in the bullying army environment. Here in Dubai you might land yourself with a prison sentence if you're not careful.
> ...


I was using word dumb earlier because of feedback like this one. You have not ever seen Finnish army, me or mine working effort. You think that army is place where others are bulling. That it's true in different units, countries and by different people. I have never yelled or bullied anybody in the army. 

I see your behaviour as bulling. You can't just ignore others opinion because. I have read all your comments but not many guys are giving real feedback.


----------



## The Rascal (Aug 6, 2014)

Robert_Finland said:


> Sorry mate. I was using argumentative language to make my point, because people did ignore my opinion.


Why should people listen to your opinion? Why should we give a flying **** about it?



Robert_Finland said:


> People are calling soldiers in many countries dumb and I don't do that by myself. Other people do like that in Western Europe a lot and I wasn't talking about the people in the UAE.


But you were though, you stated "Your" Country, we live here, generally we see this little sandpit as "our" country.



Robert_Finland said:


> Could you tell me how did I offend UAE people? I am not bully type of guy, we just may have different way of using forums. I may be using too blunt language because I have used writing to forums in Finnish and Swedish.


By calling them dumb pacifists, the Military has more cash spent on them as a percentage of GDP than pretty much any other country going (possible exception is Saudi). They're taught by ex SAS and Seals, for you to call them pacifists and dumb would see you jailed here for disrespecting the uniform.


----------



## rsinner (Feb 3, 2009)

Robert_Finland said:


> need smart western guys with different skills


I am not a "smart western" guy like you but my two cents.

You asked a question - will you get hired in UAE after 6 years. Who knows? Does my (or any of my "dumb" forum mates) saying yes or no make any difference to your life choices? When you are ready to take the leap in 6 years' time, if the world still exists, you will have a shot at a job like anyone else. Who knows, your skills may be niche enough for you to get a job. The world is going to change in 6 years.

If you have a chip on your soldier (or an inferiority complex) about your station in life, don't start abusing everyone. I for sure will keep my eye out for the resume of the finish ex-soldier (trained in guerrilla warfare etc etc) who works in AI. 

And UAE does not need smart western guys - it needs smart Emiratis. In absence of well trained locals in specific areas, they go for other nationalities. This will be even truer in 6 years' time going by the local population explosion.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Stevesolar said:


> Hi,
> A lot of the regular members on this forum have seen posts similar to yours from people who are dreaming of coming to the UAE to find gold and make their fortune.
> 99% of those people never make it to the UAE.
> The older members therefore have a rather cynical view of new members sharing their dreams!
> ...


Thank you very much Steve. I haven't had real feedback at all and I couldn't get why people are so cynical. 

I know also people who are just dreaming type of people and I understand very well frustrated comments. 

The fact that "dreaming" about going to work for Dubai, isn't just idea for me. I didn't got the idea of moving there because of the skyscrapers and gold that tourist see in UAE. I spent 3 weeks few years ago with my friend from Saudi-Arabia and I know much about people living in the region and the hard working life style suites me. I don't smoke or drink and I am fine with that. I know that western guys are also second class residents there, with still much better way of living that millions of Asians people working there. 

The only reason that why I am going to move to Persian gulf region is the fact that working there is ideal situation for me. In Finland social democratic party has frustrated hard working Finns with high taxation for the companies and people (avarage of 48,5 percent taxation rate for earning 4000 euros a month) and they are not making it easy to be start a company either. Still it's not at all about money, because you are not able to live your life how you would like in many cases. My life is based on goals. First one is with this girls I have been seeing for few weeks, other is in the degree like you guys told me, third is on the jobs in Finland and Europe and other goals are in family and career. I am not focusing on money because I don't enjoy making it, I enjoy from living my life, working, having a family and friends. 

I hope that you understand that I am not here dreaming. I apologize for my comments , I didn't write my comments clearly enough for you to understand those.

I am going to leave asking a questions behind and focus on reading others opinion if the policy of the forum is that. 

Robert


----------



## QOFE (Apr 28, 2013)

Robert_Finland said:


> I was using word dumb earlier because of feedback like this one. You have not ever seen Finnish army, me or mine working effort. You think that army is place where others are bulling. That it's true in different units, countries and by different people. I have never yelled or bullied anybody in the army.
> 
> I see your behaviour as bulling. You can't just ignore others opinion because. I have read all your comments but not many guys are giving real feedback.


What do you expect? Should we dig out the crystal balls just to see what opportunities you might have in SIX, yes SIX years time? Crystal balls aren't exactly legal here either. You chose to ignore what experienced people here are trying to say to you. I guess ignorance is bliss.

Just because the Finnish army did pretty well against the Russians doesn't necessary mean that the current army is up to scratch. I see a lot of mollycoddled youngsters coming out in this world. Would you be up for the job in defending Finland if Putin suddenly got into his head to attack Finland. The WW2 men were brave men. Does that kind of bravery exist in Finland anymore?
Perhaps the "dumb" Americans come to your rescue? Who knows.

A man can have dreams but they don't always come true.


----------



## notdave (Jul 11, 2015)

Robert_Finland said:


> Damn that people on this forum are so dumb. " Fat bhoy thim" should read between lines. It's clear to me that people who are writing to this forum, are not really that good experts as they think. Yeah and I bet that average 20 years old are more childish where you are coming from. We have the same thing in Finland. Take a focus on the best 5 percent of the generation. Those guys are different than people on the average.
> 
> I have talked about job opportunities with guys who are working in Persian golf region. I have got totally different feedback from them. While talking about future, I have mentioned working for in the UK and Scandinavia, but they have told me that they are going to need smart western guys with different skills.
> 
> ...


Do hubris much? I mean... ah the best 5%... not sure which of the various bestest scales you're using... but good luck.

Many of the people on this forum have a massive amount of experience in one major area that you lack and seek advice on... which is... working & living in the region. Believe it or not... you aren't the first person to come on here with wild ideas and to be demanding instant answers to ridiculous questions. In fact you're not even the first rude pr1ck to throw anything other than "you're great, come on in, the water's lovely" back in peoples' faces with insults and some horrible rudeness.

We should, usually, use our ears and mouth in the ratio that they are allocated in... though... the internet has foiled this a bit by giving everybody 2 hands and one keyboard... allowing many people to type faster than they can actually think...

In 6 years Dubai will probably be awash with people trying to hang onto the jobs they have, or find other jobs here... assuming the region remains "calm". Expo 2020 will bring many people to the place, possibly not quite as many as being hoped for, but nevertheless, a significant number.

Perhaps in the meantime you need to take up some yoga or something? That or see if you can get your head medically extracted from the orifice it seems to be stuck in, before it is too late.

Maybe, just maybe you need to slow your approach to your life down a little and see where you are in 6 years. Who knows... you may be here, or somewhere better/nicer/different.

Between 20 and 26 years old is often as different as from 14-20... A lot of new information and experiences need to be processed. And at the end of that will be you in 6 years, probably (hopefully) a very different person that the one that you present yourself at today.

You may hate the idea of living in the desert by then. Maybe you fancy USA? Perhaps you'll end up in khatmandu finding yourself...

Chill a little young gun. If you start out with an attitude and battle plan like that for the next 20 years... the stress will kill you, that or your colleagues...


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

rsinner said:


> I am not a "smart western" guy like you but my two cents.
> 
> You asked a question - will you get hired in UAE after 6 years. Who knows? Does my (or any of my "dumb" forum mates) saying yes or no make any difference to your life choices? When you are ready to take the leap in 6 years' time, if the world still exists, you will have a shot at a job like anyone else. Who knows, your skills may be niche enough for you to get a job. The world is going to change in 6 years.
> 
> ...




I am writing too fast... By western guys I ment Finnish and Scandinavian guys. It was just easier to me to use word "western". I have heard also that the real problem is to get Emirate e´citizens interested about career life. In my opinion UAE does need all the smart people the can have. I seems that I have used too much word "western" by that I have used for synonym for high educated professionals, because expats from Europe are mostly educated professionals. I have friend from Nigeria working in Dubai and I know very well that Indians and people from other South Asian countries have significant academic workforce in UAE. 

Sorry for misunderstanding with this, I have wrote comments in hurry. We don't use in Finnish language words like please that we use Suffixs. In English language there are not that type of Suffixs so our language can bee very blunt and offending from time to time. It's a shock to me how people are commentating that I place myself above all, when in Finland I am opposite to that. We have here cultural differences and I try to make my writing more polite and make my opinion more clear.


----------



## The Rascal (Aug 6, 2014)

Robert_Finland said:


> I am writing too fast... By western guys I ment Finnish and Scandinavian guys. It was just easier to me to use word "western". I have heard also that the real problem is to get Emirate e´citizens interested about career life. In my opinion UAE does need all the smart people the can have. I seems that I have used too much word "western" by that I have used for synonym for high educated professionals, because expats from Europe are mostly educated professionals. I have friend from Nigeria working in Dubai and I know very well that Indians and people from other South Asian countries have significant academic workforce in UAE.
> 
> Sorry for misunderstanding with this, I have wrote comments in hurry. We don't use in Finnish language words like please that we use Suffixs. In English language there are not that type of Suffixs so our language can bee very blunt and offending from time to time. It's a shock to me how people are commentating that I place myself above all, when in Finland I am opposite to that. We have here cultural differences and I try to make my writing more polite and make my opinion more clear.


So you're an asylum seeker in reverse.... No welfare here you know!

And FYI, the higher echelons of Emirati society and certainly members of the Sir Banyas tribe are all educated in England or the States. 

Obviously, for the top level it's England.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

The Rascal said:


> Why should people listen to your opinion? Why should we give a flying **** about it?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Why you should hear my opinion? If you decide not to, all the things that I am going to say, sounds negative. I listen your opinions so it's common courtesy to expect that other one doing so also.

You have not understood what I wrote earlier. I didn't told that people in UAE are pacifist... I was answering to guys originally from Western Europe where people are more pacifist compared to other countries. 

I know that Saudies and UAE soldiers are getting good training. And by the way. Military isn't grate only if they are using a lot money on it. Let's have a look to Afganistan. It's not going grate even that other side has worlds largest army.


----------



## Fat Bhoy Tim (Feb 28, 2013)

Robert_Finland said:


> Tell me that what kind of graduates are you recruiting then. Simple saying "No" is quite an unprofessional opinion. Just because you are in the company that hires people, you can't tell what kind of person is talking to you on the forum, just based on his comment. I have done the same job when recruiting new privates to Finnish guerrilla warfare unit. I know that before making decision, you should meet the guy, know his history but the meeting is still the most important part.


People that argue and debate being told no, are exactly the sort of people that get told no. 

You're 20 right? Wind your neck in, get a minimum of 3 years of practical experience in your chosen field, and re-evaluate the market and roles then.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

Fat Bhoy Tim said:


> People that argue and debate being told no, are exactly the sort of people that get told no.
> 
> You're 20 right? Wind your neck in, get a minimum of 3 years of practical experience in your chosen field, and re-evaluate the market and roles then.


Thanks for your answer. I was hoping to get information like that in the first place but I didn't had one before. I applied to Finland's largest brewery that is market leader in the Baltic countries and in 2 other Eastern European countries and I am going to get good experience from that job. 

I am going to have over 3 years of experience in work of my field before moving to Persian gold Region. 

Robert


----------



## QOFE (Apr 28, 2013)

Robert_Finland said:


> Thank you very much Steve. I haven't had real feedback at all and I couldn't get why people are so cynical.
> 
> I know also people who are just dreaming type of people and I understand very well frustrated comments.
> 
> ...


1) A question for you. What do you classify as "real feed-back"?
2) Three weeks on a holiday a few years ago? As a teenager? 
3) Your classification of people into classes is absurd. Did you know how much Indian money there is in this country just to bring up one example?
4) Seeing a girl for a week, oh wow. Did you already plan the engagement, wedding, number of children etc?
5) But the Social Democratic Party is not in power now, is it? 
6) If it is a work/family/life balance you're after, this is the wrong country for you. 
Did you realise what kind of hours workers put in here? There is nothing to fall back on here. You pay for EVERYTHING yourself. Yes, companies should be paying for healthcare for their workers but a lot still don't and as they all need to do it by June this year you can imagine that the level of coverage will suffer.
7) Smoking and drinking is not an issue here. 

I think you need to do some own research rather than just relying on friends' opinions. A lot of information can be found with the right search words.


----------



## The Rascal (Aug 6, 2014)

Robert_Finland said:


> I applied to Finland's largest brewery that is market leader in the Baltic countries


Fantastic idea, we have so many breweries here and no-one to work in them as the populace is nearly all Muslim.


----------



## QOFE (Apr 28, 2013)

Robert_Finland said:


> Thanks for your answer. I was hoping to get information like that in the first place but I didn't had one before. I applied to Finland's largest brewery that is market leader in the Baltic countries and in 2 other Eastern European countries and I am going to get good experience from that job.
> 
> I am going to have over 3 years of experience in work of my field before moving to Persian gold Region.
> 
> Robert


Ok. Now you really surprised me. Brewery experience? How useful do you think that would be in this region? I'll throw you a candy if you can come up with at least five UAE breweries. What do you think would go down well here? The pale ale type or any other fancy stuff?
Still hypothetical though. One can apply to all sorts of things. It's the signed contract that matters.


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

I send you already private message about your attitude. 

Breweries in Scandinavia and Eastern Europe are focusing to beer, own brand soft drinks and licensed drinks like Pepsi and Coca-Cola. Many are also bottling mineral water. 

What Quran says about drinking mineral water. 


Edit for guy from Suriname of where he is from; In Financial sector job is mostly the same in all companies. Do you guys think that I would be working with alcohol. I'm absolutist like the population in UAE.


----------



## The Rascal (Aug 6, 2014)

Robert_Finland said:


> I send you already private message about your attitude.


scared dot com these 188cm giants petrify the life out of me.....


----------



## The Rascal (Aug 6, 2014)

QOFE said:


> Ok. Now you really surprised me. Brewery experience? How useful do you think that would be in this region? I'll throw you a candy if you can come up with at least five UAE breweries. What do you think would go down well here? The pale ale type or any other fancy stuff?
> Still hypothetical though. One can apply to all sorts of things. It's the signed contract that matters.


I know of a few small "Craft beer" breweries in the UAE, one up in Silicon Oasis.... 

They don't advertise much - on a need to know basis....


----------



## Robert_Finland (Jan 24, 2016)

QOFE said:


> Hmm. WHAT does a brewery do?
> 
> "A brewery or brewing company is a business that makes and sells beer. The place at which beer is commercially made is either called a brewery or a beerhouse, where distinct sets of brewing equipment are called plant."
> 
> ...


If there are hybrid word for brewer and beverage corporation, please tell me. If you are interested about my career choices, give your name and I will add you on Facebook so we can stay connected, because I just love our lovely talks. Now I will get back to work.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

The Rascal said:


> On a serious note, if you are looking at other options, a proper Finnish Sauna would be a great idea. There are numerous birch trees here that could be utilised too, we have real snow ski runs, we have ice bars, so it would make perfect sense.
> 
> SNIP/



*Behave!*

Jo xxx


----------



## BedouGirl (Sep 15, 2011)

jojo said:


> Behave! Jo xxx


Thank you Jo. OP, I don't think it's that people don't want to help you or give you advice, it's simply that they can't. None of us can see into the future. Anything anyone tells you on here will just be guessing and that's what they all started off trying to tell you but, somehow this has all gotten rather out of hand. Please everyone, let's take it down a notch or two.


----------

