# Buying in France, Ltd or SCI or SARL



## HarryPalmer750

Hi All, 

I’ve just joined very informative what I have read so far 

Primarily to Bev and Ian (Bloodaxe)

I read with great interest your comments on the old thread re a guy thinking about buying a French house via a SCI through a UK Ltd company. 

We too were thinking of setting up a Uk company to do the same, but it seems from your insight, that it’s not worth the hassle. 

I gleaned that to do it through an SCI is easier and cleaner. Bev you did say I think that you can rent rooms out like an Airbnb, but I read through an SCI you can only rent empty accommodation? 

Did you say buying through a SARL you can ? 

From what you both said, my next point of call would be french ( English speaking) Notaire or would you suggest an advocat?

Where would you suggest I look for that Notaire bearing in mind I’m looking in the SW. 

Internet I’m using but I wonder if there’s an official list ? 

I’ve done masses of research, but no matter how much you do, it’s clear, advice from a Notaire is essential. 

Any pointers in the right direction would be greatly appreciated. 

Thanks 

H


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## Bevdeforges

HarryPalmer750 said:


> We too were thinking of setting up a Uk company to do the same, but it seems from your insight, that it’s not worth the hassle.


as with so many things "it depends" - in this case precisely what your circumstances are and what your intentions are regarding the property you are purchasing.



> I gleaned that to do it through an SCI is easier and cleaner. Bev you did say I think that you can rent rooms out like an Airbnb, but I read through an SCI you can only rent empty accommodation?


An SCI is a type of "business entity" that exists to handle the ownership of property. It is often invoked when siblings inherit a house or other property from Mom and Dad and they want to avoid some of the hassles of the "joint and undivided ownership" situation. I'm unfamiliar with any restrictions on SCIs related to Air BnBs or other types of renting out the property, but if it's the SCI that is renting out the property, that's when you get involved in public filings of the SCI's income, expenses and tax assessments.



> Did you say buying through a SARL you can ?


An SARL is a different type of business entity - basically a small corporation, where you must have at least two "share holders" and have a business purpose registered, as well as the business being registered with the various tax authorities and social insurance agencies. An SARL can certainly own a property, but in that case, it is assumed that the property serves the business interest of the corporation. With an SARL you have an obligation to make annual reports, including holding an annual meeting to "approve" the financial statements of the corporation.



> From what you both said, my next point of call would be french ( English speaking) Notaire or would you suggest an advocat?


A notaire in France is basically a type of attorney specialized in property law. But property issues really should start off with a notaire. Best way to find one is to consult the listing of the Notaires of France: Accueil | Notaires de France (Do note the language button in the upper right corner of the screen - there is lots of useful information available on the website in both French and English. And the "Find a notaire" listing in English does indicate which of their members speak English.)



> Where would you suggest I look for that Notaire bearing in mind I’m looking in the SW.
> 
> Internet I’m using but I wonder if there’s an official list ?


I think I just answered that question - take a look at the "Find a notaire" listing on the Notaires de France site - but first read the material available on the site. It may answer quite a few of your questions.


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## HarryPalmer750

That’s fantastic information and thanks for coming back so quickly. I’m digesting all your answers and I’m going to research more. Thanks for that it’s helping me immensely on my journey to buy in France


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## eairicbloodaxe

As per my previous posts...

Buy with an SCI.

SCI rents unfurnished, long term, to a microentreprise set up by you.

ME furnishes property, arranges changeovers, and markets via AirBnB.

Result... 2 tax bills, but it's pretty much the easiest solution otherwise.

Kind regards

Ian


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## eairicbloodaxe

Other alternative is that the SCI rents unfurnished to a UK Ltd, which does the marketing/letting.

However there is a general assumption that income received from property should be taxed in the country where the property is situated. So I've no idea how that tax situation will work...

Kind regards 

Ian


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## HarryPalmer750

eairicbloodaxe said:


> As per my previous posts... Buy with an SCI. SCI rents unfurnished, long term, to a microentreprise set up by you. ME furnishes property, arranges changeovers, and markets via AirBnB. Result... 2 tax bills, but it's pretty much the easiest solution otherwise. Kind regards Ian





eairicbloodaxe said:


> As per my previous posts... Buy with an SCI. SCI rents unfurnished, long term, to a microentreprise set up by you. ME furnishes property, arranges changeovers, and markets via AirBnB. Result... 2 tax bills, but it's pretty much the easiest solution otherwise. Kind regards Ian


 is the Microenterprise a French micro?


eairicbloodaxe said:


> As per my previous posts... Buy with an SCI. SCI rents unfurnished, long term, to a microentreprise set up by you. ME furnishes property, arranges changeovers, and markets via AirBnB. Result... 2 tax bills, but it's pretty much the easiest solution otherwise. Kind regards Ian


 this sounds perfect. Would the microenterprise bd French?


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## HarryPalmer750

eairicbloodaxe said:


> As per my previous posts...
> 
> Buy with an SCI.
> 
> SCI rents unfurnished, long term, to a microentreprise set up by you.
> 
> ME furnishes property, arranges changeovers, and markets via AirBnB.
> 
> Result... 2 tax bills, but it's pretty much the easiest solution otherwise.
> 
> Kind regards
> 
> Ian


This sounds perfect. Would the microenterprise be French.?


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## BackinFrance

Not sure if you can establish an ME in France unless you have the right to work here.


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## HarryPalmer750

One last question. I don’t have an address in France which I know I need to set up an SCI. A bit of chicken and egg situation.
I can’t set up an SCI without an address and I need to buy the property through an SCI. 🤔

how do I get around this?


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## Bevdeforges

Generally speaking, if you aren't resident in France, you set up the SCI when you buy the property so it will depend on if you're buying the property to live in or to rent out or some combination of the two. 

Search on the Notaires of France website for the term SCI or take a look at this article to get you started: SCI family | Notaires de France
This article from the French Property website may also give you some understanding of how an SCI works. SCI (Societe Civile Immobiliere): French Property Company


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## HarryPalmer750

Hi Bev

Thanks again. I’ve read all the articles you gave me and it’s clear

kind regards

H


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## eairicbloodaxe

The ME is French. As Bev says you set up the SCI at the same time as buying so you use the same address.

As far as I knew you did not need to have residence permit to set up an ME... at least our French accountant never said so, and the FISC have taken the money each year without issue? Property rental is also classed as passive income, so maybe different rules apply.

BIF's comment now has me worried, though... we bought/set up pre brexit.

Kind regards


Ian


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## BackinFrance

eairicbloodaxe said:


> The ME is French. As Bev says you set up the SCI at the same time as buying so you use the same address.
> 
> As far as I knew you did not need to have residence permit to set up an ME... at least our French accountant never said so, and the FISC have taken the money each year without issue? Property rental is also classed as passive income, so maybe different rules apply.
> 
> BIF's comment now has me worried, though... we bought/set up pre brexit.
> 
> Kind regards
> 
> 
> Ian


I did some more checking re the establishment of the ME. It is not very clear, but it seems that, at least for those living outside the EU, it is the 20% VAT on holiday rentals that can cause problems. However it also seems that AirBnB handle all the VAT payments, including adjustments for cancelations etc, in which case the OP would be OK, unless he seeks to do private holiday lets or uses a platform that doesn't handle the VAT. All the official sites I looked at recommended checking with your local CCI.


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## eairicbloodaxe

Thankfully, VAT is not an issue: we don't turnover enough.









Micro-entrepreneur small businesses VAT (TVA) turnover limits registration and declaration in France


About the VAT (TVA) rules when operating a micro-entreprise business in France.




www.french-property.com





*8.2. Micro-Entrepreneur VAT Turnover Limits*

A _micro-entrepreneur_ with only a modest turnover does not charge VAT, under a system called _regime de la franchise TVA_.

As a result, they are legally obliged to make that declaration on all invoices, with the statement _'TVA non applicable, art. 293 B du CGI_.'

Neither can they recover VAT paid on purchases.

In order to quality for exemption from VAT there are basic turnover limits that apply, depending on the nature of your business, as follows (2023):

Commercial sales and classified furnished accommodation - €91,900.
Services, unclassified furnished accommodation and _professions libérales_ - €36,800.

Also more useful info here:









FBA - French Business Advice - The Micro company / Micro-entreprise


The Micro Company (micro-entreprise) is a fairly popular type of enterprise in France. It seems obvious that the micro tax system brings significant advantages, the main one being the simplicity of the system. But there are some possible negative points to be aware of and not to neglect. And to...




www.frenchbusinessadvice.com












How to become a micro-entrepreneur/freelancer in France ?


You are motivated and ambitious and you have decided to become a micro-entrepreneur. Welcome to the entrepreneurial community!




hellomybusiness.fr





But nothing that clarifies "Do I Need A Residence Permit"?

Kind regards


Ian


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