# Off Grid Living in Mexico, or semi off grid in mexico



## SirRon

with water issues and electric issues always seem to be a problem for me in mexico, I even live in a large tourist city. 3 blocks away from the beach with a semi view of the ocean from my house,

My Land has is 3 lots total, with two huts

there are banana trees, coconut tree's, mango, papaya, limes, oranges, a couple of wild mexican spices i have no clue what there names are, and couple other fruit bearing tree's i do not know the name of.

i get a lot of natural compost from the waste from all this, tons of black soil on my land, my neighbors say i should bag it up and sell it hehe

also planing on growing a vegetable and spice garden also 

tons of sun and wind, I am on top of a hill, about 15 stories high from the street, walking to my car is a pain

so I have been researching off grid living, and thinking to go the semi off grid and work my way total

any other expats doing this or considering it?


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## TundraGreen

SirRon said:


> with water issues and electric issues always seem to be a problem for me in mexico, I even live in a large tourist city. 3 blocks away from the beach with a semi view of the ocean from my house,
> 
> My Land has is 3 lots total, with two huts
> 
> there are banana trees, coconut tree's, mango, papaya, limes, oranges, a couple of wild mexican spices i have no clue what there names are, and couple other fruit bearing tree's i do not know the name of.
> 
> i get a lot of natural compost from the waste from all this, tons of black soil on my land, my neighbors say i should bag it up and sell it hehe
> 
> also planing on growing a vegetable and spice garden also
> 
> tons of sun and wind, I am on top of a hill, about 15 stories high from the street, walking to my car is a pain
> 
> so I have been researching off grid living, and thinking to go the semi off grid and work my way total
> 
> any other expats doing this or considering it?


I installed a solar hot water system a few years ago. I have considered adding solar electric, but if I did, I would still want to use CFE. I have no desire to deal with the batteries needed to be independent of CFE. 

And I am not completely clear on CFE's policies. I think they credit you if you generate more electricity than you use, so you are only billed for your net usage. But they do not pay you if your net usage is less than zero, and they still charge a minimum monthly fee. If someone understands their policies better, I would be interested in hearing about it. 

Based on my understanding, solar electric is not cost effective. I have thought about doing it anyway just to be more environmentally friendly, but haven't yet.


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## lhpdiver

It was not our intent to attempt to go "off-grid" but we do live in a community which has a well. We all contribute, based on our usage, to the operation of the well.

About 4 months back we installed a 10 panel PV system - with a bidirectional meter. When we produce we meet our own needs first then pull from CFE. When we have no consumption we send to CFE who gives us credit over a 12 month rolling period. Our last two two month periods the bills were 51 and 52 pesos. (That is merely an admin charge). We have something like 140 kwh credit balance at the moment. We were very close to entering DAC - zone 1 - only allowed 250 kwh / month. We figure the system will pay for itself in like 6 years...

We also have a plethora of trees in our yard : mango, limes, oranges, guava, bananas, peaches, avacados, blueberries, blackberries, pomegranates, pepper, red and gold grapefruit... Trouble is we have to beat the animals to the fruit.


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## TundraGreen

lhpdiver said:


> It was not our intent to attempt to go "off-grid" but we do live in a community which has a well. We all contribute, based on our usage, to the operation of the well.
> 
> About 4 months back we installed a 10 panel PV system - with a bidirectional meter. When we produce we meet our own needs first then pull from CFE. When we have no consumption we send to CFE who gives us credit over a 12 month rolling period. Our last two two month periods the bills were 51 and 52 pesos. (That is merely an admin charge). We have something like 140 kwh credit balance at the moment. We were very close to entering DAC - zone 1 - only allowed 250 kwh / month. We figure the system will pay for itself in like 6 years...
> 
> We also have a plethora of trees in our yard : mango, limes, oranges, guava, bananas, peaches, avacados, blueberries, blackberries, pomegranates, pepper, red and gold grapefruit... Trouble is we have to beat the animals to the fruit.


Thanks for the info about CFE. I didn't know about the 12 month period. My problem is the admin charge. My bi-monthly electricity bill is less than 200 pesos to start with, so with the admin fee, the most I can save is only 150 pesos/2 months or less. That is $900 pesos/year. I looked at the cost of panels and for my needs it was going to be about $28,000 pesos (2 @ $14,000 each). At that rate, it would require more than 30 years to pay for itself, ignoring maintenance and repair.

Without the admin fee it is not a whole lot different, but I object to paying CFE if I am generating electricity that they are selling to someone else.


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## lagoloo

Most agree that CFE is close to evil incarnate. The annual increases were getting to us. Two people with no pool, no abnormal usage and paying in the highest (DAC) rate. At that point we looked into solar and last year, had 7 panels installed. The bills dropped dramatically from huge to pocket money. The payback is down to four years on the cost of installation. 
IMO, it is well worth installing solar. Didn't used to be because of high cost and long payback. Things have changed. Several others we know in the Lake Chapala area have installed it within the last few years and they are all dancing a jig of joy when their CFE bills arrive.


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## lhpdiver

Before we bought our house it had sat pretty much empty for 18 months or so. We were able to 'inherit' that lack of energy usage to keep our CFE bills low. We realized we were heading towards DAC and perhaps 3000 + peso bills (minimum). First we had CFE come out and perform an 'energy audit'. At that point they pointed out that our old-fashioned mechanical meters (3) were running slow and we were really using 15-25% more energy than we were paying for. Then we REALLY would be spending some money. Shortly after our PV installation CFE came through and replaced all our neighbors mechanical meters with digital. I suspect they all have been surprised when they got their new bills.


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## SirRon

I wish I could afford the CFE solar system, as it will pay for itself in the long run

I just don't have that kind of up front money in my budget to pay the up front cost

so am skilled enough, buying 2nd hand possible damaged cells at a huge discount and built my own solar panels

one question about the CFE solar panel setup? does the setup have any battery's?


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## lhpdiver

SirRon said:


> I wish I could afford the CFE solar system, as it will pay for itself in the long run
> 
> I just don't have that kind of up front money in my budget to pay the up front cost
> 
> so am skilled enough, buying 2nd hand possible damaged cells at a huge discount and built my own solar panels
> 
> one question about the CFE solar panel setup? does the setup have any battery's?


To clarify - it is not a CFE system. It ties into their grid, but the only piece they contribute/install is the bi-directional meter. 

When we were shopping around we used 10K pesos/panel to get a rough idea as to cost. I think that number is coming down every year. There are also different types of panels (mono/poly). We went with mono - a little more efficient.

We don't have batteries. It's pretty remarkable that with all the torrential storms we had over the summer that we were only without power 1 day for a few hours while they replaced a transformer. We have little 2 minute outages often.

While I was writing this I had an interesting thought. When there is no power from CFE our inverter does not work. I wonder if there is a way to power the inverter via battery backup (no storage) so that the panels would serve the purpose of a short term generator.


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## SirRon

Question: After making your free energy, it needs to be stored.

How to get the perfect battery cheap in mexico?

golf cart batteries seem to be what everyone else is using these days, but those are expensive, there has to be a cheaper route, this is mexico !!


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## Hound Dog

I may have an amusing take on this electricity consumption discussion. 

As I have noted before.we own two homes in Mexico. One in Ajijic. Jalisco on Lake Chapala and one in the Chiapas Highlands in San Cristóbal de Las Casas. We spend about six months a year in each place. Our electricity usage was always exhorbitant at Lake Chapala so we installed a solar electrical supplemental system and in Ajijic our electricity bill went down from abour $2,500 pesos a month to about $10Pesos a month. With that electricity bill at $2,500 Pesos a month, we are certainly not what one would call conservative electricity consumers but now we get our electricity from universally available solar rays with a capital output if one has the capital.

Our electrical usage in Chiapas, where we only live part time, is minimal. We have been congratulated by CFE who subsidize that electricity we do use as they consider us héroes of electrical conservation so our electrical bill in Chiapas is peanuts. 

Ironic and amusing.


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## lhpdiver

Hound Dog said:


> I may have an amusing take on this electricity consumption discussion.
> 
> As I have noted before.we own two homes in Mexico. One in Ajijic. Jalisco on Lake Chapala and one in the Chiapas Highlands in San Cristóbal de Las Casas. We spend about six months a year in each place. Our electricity usage was always exhorbitant at Lake Chapala so we installed a solar electrical supplemental system and in Ajijic our electricity bill went down from abour $2,500 pesos a month to about $10Pesos a month. With that electricity bill at $2,500 Pesos a month, we are certainly not what one would call conservative electricity consumers but now we get our electricity from universally available solar rays with a capital output if one has the capital.
> 
> Our electrical usage in Chiapas, where we only live part time, is minimal. We have been congratulated by CFE who subsidize that electricity we do use as they consider us héroes of electrical conservation so our electrical bill in Chiapas is peanuts.
> 
> Ironic and amusing.


Had to read your post a few times - if I understand you, it is ironic and amusing that CFE is not aware that you have 2 properties in Mexico ?


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## sparks

SirRon said:


> Question: After making your free energy, it needs to be stored.
> 
> How to get the perfect battery cheap in mexico?
> 
> golf cart batteries seem to be what everyone else is using these days, but those are expensive, there has to be a cheaper route, this is mexico !!


Has to be stored if all you want is DC .... but then you have to convert everything in your house to DC. Cheaper and easier to convert DC to AC and then you might even give some back to CFE


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## Hound Dog

[_QUOTE=lhpdiver;5832161]Had to read your post a few times - if I understand you, it is ironic and amusing that CFE is not aware that you have 2 properties in Mexico ?[/QUOTE]_

That is correct, ihldiver. Ironic and amusing. If I am not mistaken, that is incompetence on the part of CFE, not I. I have never _EVER_ denied that I live in and own residential properties in both Jalisco and Chiapas nor that we use electricity in both properties some 1500 kilometers distant from each other. As it happens, we subsidize electrical production in Jalisco with expensive solar panels and actually contribute to that production but in Highland Chiapas, where the sunshine is less prolific and intense, to say the least, that is not a practical solution to mitigate the absurd costs of electircal utilities in that región - the poorest part of Mexico where most people don´t even have electricity. 

It is not informative to imply that the ownership of more that one property in Mexico is indicative of wasteful consumption or asset accumulation. For what we paid for two modest properties in Mexico we could have not have afforded a shack 80 miles out of San Francisco in an exurban slum. 

CFE doesn´t know its butt from a hole in the ground and that was my point. The same thing is true of the Alabama Power Company where I was raised, Pacific Gas & Electric in Northern Califonia where we lived for over 40 years and just about any place on the planet.

You think it´s disgraceful that CFE gave me a subsidy for using so little electricity in Chiapas while I seemingly used electricity recklessly at Lake Chapala, then you should reform CFE, an absolutely inflexible and corrupt governmental agency, not Hound Dog. 

Let´s get this straight - I invested a lot of money to provide solar energy to more than compensate for my usage of power off the grid. They actually owe me as best I can figure but they keep the books, not I. 

This is why I am amused.


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## TundraGreen

SirRon said:


> Question: After making your free energy, it needs to be stored.
> 
> How to get the perfect battery cheap in mexico?
> 
> golf cart batteries seem to be what everyone else is using these days, but those are expensive, there has to be a cheaper route, this is mexico !!


You *could* have a system with batteries to store energy, then use an inverter to turn the DC from the batteries into AC for use in your house when the sun is not shining. Inverters today are pretty efficient, around 95%. Then you can completely disconnect from CFE. However, you have to buy, maintain and replace batteries, a significant undertaking.

The alternative is to use CFE as the storage system. Then, apparently, you continue to pay a minimum bi-monthly fee even if you generate more than you use on average.


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## lhpdiver

Hound Dog said:


> [_QUOTE=lhpdiver;5832161]Had to read your post a few times - if I understand you, it is ironic and amusing that CFE is not aware that you have 2 properties in Mexico ?_




That is correct, ihldiver. Ironic and amusing. If I am not mistaken, that is incompetence on the part of CFE, not I. I have never _EVER_ denied that I live in and own residential properties in both Jalisco and Chiapas nor that we use electricity in both properties some 1500 kilometers distant from each other. As it happens, we subsidize electrical production in Jalisco with expensive solar panels and actually contribute to that production but in Highland Chiapas, where the sunshine is less prolific and intense, to say the least, that is not a practical solution to mitigate the absurd costs of electircal utilities in that región - the poorest part of Mexico where most people don´t even have electricity. 

It is not informative to imply that the ownership of more that one property in Mexico is indicative of wasteful consumption or asset accumulation. For what we paid for two modest properties in Mexico we could have not have afforded a shack 80 miles out of San Francisco in an exurban slum. 

CFE doesn´t know its butt from a hole in the ground and that was my point. The same thing is true of the Alabama Power Company where I was raised, Pacific Gas & Electric in Northern Califonia where we lived for over 40 years and just about any place on the planet.

You think it´s disgraceful that CFE gave me a subsidy for using so little electricity in Chiapas while I seemingly used electricity recklessly at Lake Chapala, then you should reform CFE, an absolutely inflexible and corrupt governmental agency, not Hound Dog. 

Let´s get this straight - I invested a lot of money to provide solar energy to more than compensate for my usage of power off the grid. They actually owe me as best I can figure but they keep the books, not I. 

This is why I am amused.[/QUOTE]

You are living in a dream world. Where can you find such an arrangement in the US.


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## SirRon

still stuck, I am not sure where to shop for the power inverter's and batteries 

solar panels I will build myself and Charge Controller already picked out 

power inverters, I am hoping to find used


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## sparks

Hard to do efficiently on a tight budget


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## SirRon

sparks said:


> Hard to do efficiently on a tight budget


correct, 

think to start, I will go small ,3000 watt inverter ( bigger if i find a amazing deal) 

hoping just enough to run fridge, lights, and some cell phone chargers 

starting off with maybe just 4 batteries

upgrading as I go 

I will save lots building the solar panels myself, and all labor installing the system will be done by me 

my start up cost will be less than 3 grand


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