# VERY dodgy estate agent! Complaintprocess advice needed.



## Speago (Jun 27, 2013)

Hi All

O.K! This might be a bit long winded, but I an hoping I can get some advice.


We viewed a property about 8 weeks ago and loved it so much we pun in an offer close to asking price within the hour.

Something didn't sit right with me. wen we viewed the property. The owner was there picking up the last of her things.

I went to have a chat with her and she gave the impression that we had already bought the house. She was extremly old (in her 90's) so we thought she might of just been a bit confused.

We waited for a reply to see if our offer had been accepted. No reply! every day we phoned the office to see if our offer had been accepted, and were given all sorts of storys as to why we hadn't had a simple yes or no.

This went on for 6 weeks. 

THEN! By chance the lady selling the house moved into a flat above my girlfriends office. We couldn't believe it! My girlfriend approached the lady (who has now become a good friend of ours). We asked if she could tell us why she was haking so long to accept or decline our offer.

She looked very confused. She said she thought we had bought the house and that she had had the deposit...

We offered €130,000 for the property. She looked astonished as she had accepted an offer of €100,000 and had not had any sort of offer of €130,000.

We done a bit more digging and found out the estate agent had put the deposit down himself and the papers were due to be signed at the end of the week. She was gobsmacked by this especially when we told her all the lies the estate agent had been telling us about her..

We loved this house so much. We offered her the €130,000 so she could give the €6000 deposit back and she would still be €24,000 better off. She was delighted by this not for the extra money but she really wanted us to have the house.

When she tried to pull out of the sale the estate agent started making threats of taking her to court if she didn't sign.

She came and discussed it with us and said she wanted to go to court to teach this cockroach a lesson, but she was 92 and just lost her husband and didn't think she could take the stress.

We fully understood and supported her decision even though we were devastated to see our dream house slip away.

The day to sign the papers came. We knew it was happening at 10 o clock.

11 o clock we had a call from the estate agent (who had no idea we had been in contact with the owner). He said the owner had got back to him and would accept €135,000 as long as we under declaired by €35,000.

My girlfriend went to town on him and he denied everything..

What is most frustrating about this is that an old lady that just lost her husband has been swindled out of a lot of money and our house search has been set back 2 months. Plus the fact that we lost out on our dream house..


I WANT TO TAKE THIS COCKROACH DOWN!!!!

I was just wondering if the complaints process will get me anywhere or will I just be wasting my time.

I know INCI are the people to complain to, but I don't the process or if it will be more hasstle than it is worth..

VERY SORRY for the long winded post, but this has been eating me up and I would really like to see this estate agent get his comeuppance before he does this to the next old lady...

Would be very grateful of any advice..

Thanks.


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

Hi,
What they have done could actually be fraud - is it worth getting the police involved.
Especially if agent has purchased house and is now trying to sell it on for a profit - but still giving the impression that it is still owned by the elderly lady.
I have seen exactly the same thing happen in the UK a few years back - agent preying on confused, elderly customer in that case, as well.
Cheers
Steve


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## Speago (Jun 27, 2013)

The call it flipping in the U.K. Not sure if it is ilegal or just frowned upon. I would class it as fraud but I don't know Protuguese law very well.


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

Did you take independent legal advice - or did you assume that in Portugal everything works in a similar fashion to home. This is not the case, making an offer on a home, you normally have a promissory contract between the buyer and the seller and the deposit is paid to the seller - not an estate agent, not a lawyer.

Presumably you paid the deposit to the estate agent, therefore on the face of things, he is the seller as far as you are concerned.

However, as far as the seller is concerned, he has not acted in her best interests and he has to account to the seller for the full purchase price - however, it is up to her if she lays a fraud charge or not, in any event he should have paid the deposit into her banking account, and you should have evidence of this.

I would refuse any 'cash on the side' this is illegal and should you subsequently sell the house, only the documented purchase price maybe used in calculating capital gains liability (and yes, there are capital gains taxes payable on homes in certain circumstances).

This is actually a 'policia judiciaria' matter rather than the estate agents board.


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## Speago (Jun 27, 2013)

We didn't pay any deposit. We only put in an offer. 

When the old lady took the deposit he bamboozeled her by making her think it was our deposit and that we had put in an offer of €100,000.

When actually our offer was €130,000.


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## Speago (Jun 27, 2013)

Forgot to mention he also bullied her into leaving the house 7 weeks before the sale went through.

It's been a complete bombardment of lies to both buyer and seller from the start.


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

If the sales contract is not through, she can still cancel the sale by refunding him his deposit plus penalty of the same as the deposit.

She can then sell the house on to you - this is before any legal steps are taken.


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## Speago (Jun 27, 2013)

Hi Tony


Too late for that. That is what we tried to do, but the estate agent said he would take her to court if she didn´complete.

We told her to speak to her solicitor who told her to go through with the sale or she will be taken to court... from what I can make out he is in cahoots with the estate agent.


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

He can take her to court but the penalty is only the value equivalent to the deposit - she can also (maybe she should) lay a fraud charge - that may scare him anyway.

Presumably he will try to on sell the property on to you, you also have the choice of not buying a property from a crook - and let him stew.


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## Speago (Jun 27, 2013)

Hi Tony

She is 92 years old so she doesn´t want the stress of going to court. She did say that if we put a complaint in she is more than happy to make a statement..

He has already tried to sell us the house for 35k more than he paid and wants us to under declair the 35K. 

Although we dearly loved this house, we had to tell him where to go.

With fees he charged the seller he will make about 40k on this deal when he sells the house.


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

The complaint has to be hers - but if he has made an offer to purchase and she has accepted, I don't think, unless there was an agency contract beforehand, in this circumstances, unlikely to be one, she will be able to prove conflict of interest/fraud/self dealing. Though, if there was no contract she does not have to pay him an agents commission either - likely though purchase is not in his own name. 

Though as I have said before, she does not have to complete the sale but merely offer to repay his deposit and the penalty.

One issue she should be extremely careful with this character is not to sign the agreement unless the full amount has been paid beforehand or a bank guaranteed cheque/or hard cash is paid at the time of signature. I have seen problems when people have signed the contract on the basis that the cash went into a 'clients bank account' and the purchase price never surfaced.


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

I'd just refuse the deal then report it to the police & leave it to them......... there's always another house out there & it'd bug me forever if I let myself & the old girl be screwed like that.

If nothing else, he's probably raised the 100k or at least some of it by a loan of some kind & by walking away, you're leaving him in the lurch.


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

If you do not buy the house from him, it will teach him a lesson not to take advantage of people


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

I'd have thought he'd also lose his estate agency licence if you complain which is exactly what needs to happen.


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## wink (Aug 23, 2011)

Awful as this story is, I would be very careful what you do or say as you could open yourself to a claim for defamation, even though what you say may be true. It will be the word of the allegedly swindled lady against the Agent and if he is in cahoots with a crooked lawyer, her chance of a satisfactory solution is probably nil. I remember the case not so long ago of a woman who complained to the Portuguese Law Society about the treatment she had received from her lawyer and he promptly sued her for defamation.


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## DREAMWEAVER1 (May 28, 2013)

You could start by naming the agent,to stop other buyers being duped too!!!!






David


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

DREAMWEAVER1 said:


> You could start by naming the agent,to stop other buyers being duped too!!!!
> David


Hi,
Not on this forum!!
Please don't name companies on the forum - otherwise you open yourself up to defamation claims.
Cheers
Steve


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