# I want to live in Thailand



## LivingInAsia

Hi all,

looking for advice. I've been to thailand several times and love it. I am 43 years old living in the US, single with about $150,000 dollars saved up and will be able to collect retirement pay at the age of 62. i would love to quit my job today and hop on a plane to thailand. when in thailand i would like to start a business to bring in some income but that does not involve me getting involved with the mafia or anything like that.......any suggestions or do you think i should not do it?

thanks for any comments or advice good or bad.


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## stednick

LivingInAsia said:


> Hi all,
> 
> looking for advice. I've been to thailand several times and love it. I am 43 years old living in the US, single with about $150,000 dollars saved up and will be able to collect retirement pay at the age of 62. i would love to quit my job today and hop on a plane to thailand. when in thailand i would like to start a business to bring in some income but that does not involve me getting involved with the mafia or anything like that.......any suggestions or do you think i should not do it?
> 
> thanks for any comments or advice good or bad.


LivinginAisa:

Do you have business experience? The majority of businesses fail. You really do need to provide a unique service and/or product for a business to succeed, and this statement is true in your home country. You desire to do this in a foreign country where, correct me if I'm wrong, you don't speak the language and don't know the business culture. In my personal opinion you will lose you $150k in a year or two, possibly less. So, *Don't Do It.*

Your best option to legally stay in Thailand is to get a long-stay "O" visa for study purposes, enroll in a school to get your TEFL certificate, and become an "English-as-a-Second-Language" instructor. You can get a Long-stay "O" business visa and work permit as an English teacher. 

Search this forum. English teacher is covered in many, many threads and posts. Use your $150k as your initial setup money and a reasonably funded "emergency" and/or bailout fund.

You will find that vacationing in Thailand is significantly different than living in Thailand. You may just find that as the luster wears off you do miss the States and want to go home. 

If you find you do want to stay, as an English Teacher you will have time to thoroughly investigate your options. 

Good luck and let us know what you decide to do.


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## cnx_bruce

Agree with Stednick. Thailand is a great place to have money but a difficult place to actually make money. Consider also that thousands of other westerners have the same idea as you.

By all means research ideas but don't be tempted to just "toss it all in and get on a plane" as for most people that's a recipe for financial and career disaster. Read the many discussion threads in this and other expat forums concerning starting a business and getting a job, but also think outside the box ... for example investments or business ideas that might create an income stream. See my e-book (link below left) and also look for two books by Phillip Wylie ... one called "Starting a business in Thailand", and the other is called (I think) "Making Money in Thailand".


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## LivingInAsia

Thanks CNX and Stednick. I will cancel my flight and research more.....lol I have actually just purchased the making money in thailand book and will give it a read. the investment thing scares me because i wont have direct control of my money and will look towards the business idea route..... i was initially on the go-go bar idea thing but that quickly went by the wayside after reading numerous posts...


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## Oneman

cnx_bruce said:


> Thailand is a great place to have money but a difficult place to actually make money. Consider also that thousands of other westerners have the same idea as you.


Consider also that millions of Thais are desperate to make more money.
They speak and read the language.
They know how "the system" works over here.
They have family and friends who can and will help them.
You don't have any of that.
Whatever business you tried, if it looked to be doing nicely, you can be sure that local people would quickly open similar business near yours.

There's another problem, too: The Thais really don't like us.
Really.
If we come for 2 week holiday, they smile and speak politely to our faces.
But when they are out of our sight, they sneer at our loud voices, bad manners, and bad body odors.
You can't do good business with people who really, really, don't like you.

The only hope is to find some sort of international business like exporting, or an on-line Internet business that generates revenue outside of Thailand.
Trying to make money in Thailand, from the Thai market, is impossible.

.


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## LivingInAsia

Thanks Oneman. After reading the book recommended by CNX the internet business sounds like the safest bet. it avoids the local bad guys and the folks you mentioned. plus by doing the internet, i could use my savings to live in thailand for many many years until the internet business takes off.


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## joseph44

There is a saying among expats in Thailand:
"In order to make a small fortune in Thailand, you need a big fortune"


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## blackduff

I have a friend (Canadian) who has been in Thailand for several years. He needed to zoom here and there to get the visas arranged. Finally he has a job working as an English teacher. He has a Canadian University degree and this managed to find a place to work inThailand. 

There's good and bad things about this job. It pays about $100 per month for the school period, plus a area to live. I have seen his "apartment" from Skype and it's a basic, basic room. The money gives him enough to live there - he has a Canadian pension but it's small. 

A bad part of this is the place where he works. It's near the top border of Thailand. I looked on the Google Earth and it's outback of beyond. I only found rice paddies where Google shown me this place. 

He can have a visa for a year now, so this was one of the good things. He's trying to get another Canadian pension and this will be better again. 

He spent two years in India and this wasn't so good. Thailand allows you to buy food instead of cooking. It's cheap and it's good. 

If you could get a TEFL before you head to Thailand but remember, my buddy isn't getting rich over there. 

Blackduff


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## LivingInAsia

The only problem is that i only have a two year college degree and not sure that i have the patience to teach english. How do most Thai expats make their money? besides of course pensions and internet? Would like a few more ideas from folks on the ground in Thailand. Of course i would love to own a go go bar but after reading numerous post i know that is a horrible/shoot me in brain plan.....so i won't do it.


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## LivingInAsia

What about opening a spa/massage/manicure pedicure tailored for tourist?


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## Mweiga

LivingInAsia said:


> What about opening a spa/massage/manicure pedicure tailored for tourist?


Your developing thought process in this thread follows an identical path to the very large number of others before you with the same plan.

As a twenty year traveller to Thailand with the last seven as an expat living here I've observed and studied how expats can and do survive here - including myself of course. As others rightly advise forget trying any business the Thais themselves can do. This covers virtually everything you can think of and many you won't have thought of - and very definitely spas , massage , etc , etc for tourists !

Apart from the last ditch teaching option , which requires enthusiasm and dedication to even make it tolerable (note you've already pretty much counted yourself out of this bracket) , the most practical option and conclusion most will arrive at is generating income from some external investment source. Concentrate on this strategy. 150 kUSD is a small start but you'll really need to double or treble this up for anything approaching a decent capital kickoff to provide a very basic livable income in the Land of Smiles.


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## Oneman

LivingInAsia said:


> What about opening a spa/massage/manicure pedicure tailored for tourist?


There's already one or two of those on every block, of every street, in every tourist area in Thailand.

I've seen some -- in the bustling city of Chiang Mai -- with big signs in the window offering message for 99 baht per hour. 
That's US$ 3.00 per hour.
How can they survive on $3.00 per hour, working perhaps 3-4 hours a day?

They can't and they don't.
Many tourist massage shops are subsidized by foreigners.
German man, Swedish man, Japanese man, or Singapore man, comes here on holiday and meets a pretty Thai lady.
He gets what he wants.
What she wants is a "shop" of her own.
It won't make any money -- she knows that.
It will actually lose money -- she doesn't care.
What she wants is the respectability of being a shop owner.
That's big status for a lower class girl from the country who has been working as a prostitute.

Problem is those shops consistently lose money.
So foreign boyfriend gets pressured in to making up the difference every month.

After a few years of this, foreign boyfriend has had enough, and he goes looking for a different lady.
Shop closes, and word gets around that it's available to rent.
Other ladies hear about it -- do their best to persuade their boyfriends to "help" them open a shop -- and the cycle repeats.

Nobody can make a living in that kind of business environment.


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## nbiaboy

LivingInAsia said:


> Thanks CNX and Stednick. I will cancel my flight and research more.....lol I have actually just purchased the making money in thailand book and will give it a read. the investment thing scares me because i wont have direct control of my money and will look towards the business idea route..... i was initially on the go-go bar idea thing but that quickly went by the wayside after reading numerous posts...


Hi Living in Asia,
We (my wife and I) lived there for over ten years. We built, owned, and ran a retreat center on Koh Phangan. I visited Thailand for extended periods of time before we started. One time we lived there for 9 months. Five years later we decided to jump in with both feet. Between my wife and I we had $7,000US in our pockets. We ran out of money three times, but with our heads and a great Thai family, we built the retreat center, a road to it, and ran this business for ten years. We had no idea of what we were doing! If we had we would never have started. If we listened to people we would never moved there. We were fortunate, lucky, and intelligent, with just enough naivety and stupidity to stick it through! In the long run it cost us our marriage, but it was the best years of both of our lives. We remained friends during the separation and divorce and are still great friends! 
You couldn't pay me enough money for this experience. 
I must point out one thing that is very very important!! We were extremely lucky (and deserving) to have met the family that we did! Almost everyone else that I know of that worked with a Thai family had horror stories to report. I am not judging the Thai, just reporting. 
I love Thailand and the Thai people! One of the best friends of my life is the Thai cook that we had for five years. She is an incredible, wise, and loving lady.
Any questions you may have, I will be happy to answer them based upon my experiences.


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## Oneman

blackduff said:


> I have a friend (Canadian) who ... has a job working as an English teacher. ... It pays about $100 per month for the school period, plus a area to live. I have seen his "apartment" from Skype and it's a basic, basic room.


Typical teaching jobs here pay US$ 1,000 per month (not $100).
While that's more than the average Thai wage, it's still not going to buy much.

That "basic, basic room" is just that, one room.
With a bed, a table and two chairs.
If he's lucky, an old, small, refrigerator.
Certainly no kitchen.
Maybe hot water in the shower, maybe not.
Older building -- no maintenance for many years.
Not quiet either -- in that price class, the locals are not quiet people.
Do you want to live that way?
.


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## LivingInAsia

Mweiga said:


> Your developing thought process in this thread follows an identical path to the very large number of others before you with the same plan.
> 
> As a twenty year traveller to Thailand with the last seven as an expat living here I've observed and studied how expats can and do survive here - including myself of course. As others rightly advise forget trying any business the Thais themselves can do. This covers virtually everything you can think of and many you won't have thought of - and very definitely spas , massage , etc , etc for tourists !
> 
> Apart from the last ditch teaching option , which requires enthusiasm and dedication to even make it tolerable (note you've already pretty much counted yourself out of this bracket) , the most practical option and conclusion most will arrive at is generating income from some external investment source. Concentrate on this strategy. 150 kUSD is a small start but you'll really need to double or treble this up for anything approaching a decent capital kickoff to provide a very basic livable income in the Land of Smiles.


Hi Mweiga, thanks for your post which does makes very good sense to me... it only requires that i continue to work in the USA until i can triple my money savings which means i will need to work until i am 55 which is another 13 years (there goes my smile...). do most expats in thailand depend on investments to survive in thailand?


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## LivingInAsia

Okay, so what i am hearing with all the excellent post is to continue working until i am 55 years old where i will have been able to triple my investments/savings and be closer to receiving my pension of at age 62 (will be able to survive on investment until i reach 62)....how depressing is that? of course with this option, i could move to Thailand at 55 with more money and not have to look to starting a business and live to enjoy life. Then when i turn 62, i can then start collecting my monthly pension until i die....again no need to start any type of business. the only problem with all this i am looking at another 13 years of working in the US and continue with the rat race.......that takes away my smile big time.


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## XxSMIL3xX

me and my wife ,bought some small studios in uk.
with your 150.000 dollars you can buy 2-3 of them.each will give you 400-450 per month.
we visited thai for some months and now we are ready to return.
from the rents in uk we will live and we will save back also.so every 5-6 years we will be able to buy one more studio.


so no worries about business in thai.
after we stay there some time,maybe 1-2 years we will see if we want to do something.


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## nbiaboy

LivingInAsia said:


> Okay, so what i am hearing with all the excellent post is to continue working until i am 55 years old where i will have been able to triple my investments/savings and be closer to receiving my pension of at age 62 (will be able to survive on investment until i reach 62)....how depressing is that? of course with this option, i could move to Thailand at 55 with more money and not have to look to starting a business and live to enjoy life. Then when i turn 62, i can then start collecting my monthly pension until i die....again no need to start any type of business. the only problem with all this i am looking at another 13 years of working in the US and continue with the rat race.......that takes away my smile big time.


Personally, I would suggest if you can take some time to just go stay there for a while. Travel around a bit, check out the possibilities and then decide. Thirteen years! That's a long time to wait.


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## Mweiga

LivingInAsia said:


> Hi Mweiga, thanks for your post which does makes very good sense to me... it only requires that i continue to work in the USA until i can triple my money savings which means i will need to work until i am 55 which is another 13 years (there goes my smile...). do most expats in thailand depend on investments to survive in thailand?


Expats living here can be broadly divided into either working or not working / retired with relevant different visas in each case. 

Not sure what % of total expat population each group comprises but the "non working / retired" group I would expect is very much the larger and live here either on a regular pension from their home country and / or income from private investments.


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## cnx_bruce

Agree with above. This paper will give you something of an answer about the ratios. Certainly the majority of expats live from pensions and/or investments. Remember that some of those that don't have work permits do in fact work ... mainly outside Thailand, eg. Fly in/fly out basis. See www.burning-bison.com/expats.htm


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## LivingInAsia

Thanks. I may actually try to visit next month for the water festival.


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## davejones

What kind of business are you interested in? Personally I make my money online. I write books for Kindle, have a few websites, and make youtube videos. Takes some work to get started, but it's a steady income. Hasn't made me rich, but that wasn't my aim. I also have money from rental properties back home. So I have a few streams of income, which means I don't need to work here.

From what I've seen, it can be tough starting a business here unless you have good business experience and have already run successful businesses. If you've never run a business in your home country, then I think it will be very tough here. You will be competing with Thais who are willing to work for much less than what you'd probably like.

If you can out together some online income while you're still in the USA, then it will give you some backup when you come here.

Do you have any plans for your $150K? You could buy a property in USA and rent it out, and then use the rent to live here. It might not be enough, but it would be a start. But if it was just one property, you run the risk of being broke if the tenant doesn't pay the rent for some reason. So always keep money aside for emergencies. 

You also need to think about where you will live. Bangkok is much more expensive than other parts. Out in the sticks is dirt cheap, but you'd probably get bored.

I've been living in Thailand for 3 years, and I love it here, especially the climate and the people.


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## carl_spencer

I will advise you come down here and spend a couple of months before you make up your mind, remember the first month is free and you do not require a Visa for that. My father was keen on opening a restaurant here, after he visited Thailand however, he quickly changed his mind seeing how businesses work here. Just get down here and start talking to people, you will find out what options you actually have.


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## Digitalwolf2017

blackduff said:


> I have a friend (Canadian) who has been in Thailand for several years.
> 
> Finally he has a job working as an English teacher.
> 
> It pays about $100 per month for the school period, plus a area to live.
> 
> Blackduff



Wow! You could probably make more money collecting aluminum cans. Is this a 40ish hour work week kinda teaching job?


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## Newforestcat

After a few short visits, if you still feel the same about Thailand then you should have a long or long-ish visit or two. I'd say each visit should last three months at least. Get a visa or do a visa run for that.

As a Thai who has lived and worked in the UK for twelve years, I will not just bring all I have to invest in Thailand. It is much safer to invest some or all of your hard-earned cash elswhere, after all who knows where life is heading in the future. The West might be doing rather poorly in general now but I trust most of their governments than the Thai government. I trust the security system in place for my investments a lot more than what I could get in Thailand. Taking the money out of Thailand is not at all easy comparing to the UK, for example.

My Brit husband and I mainly invest in the UK and will likely do the same for a long while or forever. As a Thai, I can buy some land, we will try to get some rental income in order to safeguard our livelihood--to keep us all afloat in Thailand if the Sterling weakens even more in the future. The income should keep us all well-fed enough without anything from the UK. To invest in something else in Thailand, there are ways but I neither have the time, the patience nor the appetite for the risks involved. I might dip my toes in the Thai stock market once I have learned a lot more about the companies I like but that might just be it. 

I will have my own business but it is nothing to do with a shop or a massage. LOL. I hate having to find employees in Thailand. I have seen so many people with various problems regarding staff. I see the problems everyday in my brother's business and elsewhere! We have employees/contractors in the UK and they are absolutely different. Everyone knows what are expected of them and what they promptly get in return. 

It is not easy to just pack and move and it is sometimes harder even to go back. I am not risk-averse but if I were you I would work for a while longer. I would not come before I have at least $200K in my bank account. I certainly won't bring all with me unless I am very sure that the US Govt is to steal it from me in some ways and that I cannot cross the border to Canada to open another bank account! You need, in Thailand, at least $400 a month to live slightly comfortably. In a big city, you might need $600-$1000 PM, given the current exchange rate. 

BTW, do bear in mind, inflation in Thailand is disgusting! Most things other than local food are quite expensive... maybe more expensive than in the USA! If it keeps going this way, can you imagine what might happen?


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## Lilli_0

Hmm I'm not sure about money wise, but I'm 18 and just picked up and moved here. And so far i Love it with all my heart. Even the excruciating heat lol hope this helps =]


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## blackduff

Digitalwolf2017 said:


> Wow! You could probably make more money collecting aluminum cans. Is this a 40ish hour work week kinda teaching job?


I went to my friend's email and he said he's working 8 hours per week and he gets $385 per month. He's also given accomadations but this is just a basic room. It has a value of $100 per month. Overall, with his Canadian pension, he can live okay in Thailand.

He works at a place near the top border of Thailand. Certainly it would pay better in bigger towns but he needs the visa and it doesn't worry about the place. The visa itself is worth something too.

Blackduff


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## kittung

*I agree*

It is far too difficult to run businesses in Thailand - however, it is not just the legal/business system that is different, it is the people too.

Try coordinating rosters with Thai workers... that is a challenge. That ALONE is hard enough to do, even in English.

Why not see if you can live over here a few months of the year. Can you work remotely with your current job. That is what I do - it is really very rewarding and is a lot of fun.

Another alternative is to have extended holidays - instead of 4 weeks per year, take 8.

Either way, what is the harm in asking your boss what he thinks! It may actually be beneficial for the business. Who knows?

Use that $150,000 to put into Govt Bonds - some Government-backed bonds in Australia are getting 8%-9% at the moment. However, not sure about the USA and its current economic situation.

Good luck - just find a way to live the life of your dreams!


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## johnniecarson

Hi Living in Asia,
I think thats your best bet. Im in the same boat as you. Im 47 and want to drop everything and go now But, I thought really hard on this and I'm staying to I'm 55 is the best bet for the long run. We will have plenty of good years still ahead of us (god willing) to enjoy retirement then. good luck in everything you do in life. 
johnnie


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## Ricky23B

@ Lillies _0 Hii hows it going? Im 24 years old looking to relocating to thai....... how did you move to Thai without no worries? I mean give me the details. How much money do I need to move or get there? Places? Job? Please help.


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