# ESL jobs



## annamartha

There are absolutely no jobs in Thailand posted on Dave's ESL Cafe, yet I know people teach there. What's the deal?


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## synthia

There is a lot of work in Thailand, although most schools don't sponsor for visas and there is a lot of uncertainty about the whole visa situation, crackdowns on fake diplomas used by some who do have visas, and ever-changing rules. They don't do much if any recruiting from overseas. The pay is enough to live on, if you don't go out a lot. There are occasional news articles complaining that Thailand doesn't get the same quality of teachers that other countries do, but they make visas hard to get, pay poorly, and don't recruit.


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## annamartha

I thought everybody advertised on Daves. So it really isn't common in some of the poorer countries? Is it too expensive for them or can they get enough teachers that they don't have to worry.

What's the problem with Thai visas?


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## synthia

They can't afford it, they have had problems with people not showing up, they know that they don't pay enough to attract people anyway. 

The visa rules changed in October of last years. A huge percentage of Thai ESL teachers don't have work permits. Every month they would go to the nearest border, cross, and come back in with a new 30 day stamp in their passport. there are people who did this for seven years or more. Now you are allowed only 90 days using the entry stamp in a 180 day period, then you have to leave for a country with a Thai consulate and get a tourist visa.

It has all been really unclear, inconsistently enforced, and rather fluid. And if they don't want to, even with a visa, they don't have to let you in. So some people are just getting fed up, and leaving. And some who might have stayed under the old method don't want to bother now.


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## annamartha

I reallly wanted to have something lined up before I went, but I guess that isn't going to be possible. You said the schools pay poorly. How poor is poorly?


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## synthia

Some ESL schools pay as little as 20,000 baht ($655 per month). 30,000 ($983)is probably more typical. Many require that you be there all day, even if you don't have classes.


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## Emerald

Hi Annamartha,

My name's Ian(another expat newbie).I will be in the same boat as you when I arrive on the 3rd of August.If you get any pearls of wisdom sent your way,I would appreciate it if you could let us know.


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## synthia

Useful sites:

Ajarn.com - living and teaching in Bangkok

Guide for Transition to Teaching English Overseas - EFL, ESL

And no, I have no association with them. At least one of them has an article called 'How to get an ESL job in ten days' or something like that. It's very good.


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## annamartha

I haven't been here for a while. Thanks for the links, Synthia. I've been looking into flights and all the other arrangements I need to make. I actually haven't decided what country I'm most interested in, so I've set aside some money to travel first, and at least get an idea of what each place is like. Good idea or not?


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## easylife

I was thinking about going back to Japan, where I worked before, but now I think I'll try someplace else. I'm way too old to get a job anywhere that it's easy for them to get esl teachers, so I was thinking about SouthEast Asia. Has anybody taught in both Japan and SEA, and what were the differences?


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## oddball

This may be of interest to you as long as you are not looking for 'Paradise' to live in , as long as you have a BA , you will be welcome in Cambodia as a teacher of English , should you be competent at your chosen proffesion , the rise in ranking is assured and you will be able to have at least 2 positions .I learned this from a lady from Ireland who confided in me she is not that competent but just follows the game plan . I am not aware of her income , but the way she throws money around it cannot be that bad , and that was 'Before' she got her 2cnd job at a university át $10.00 an hour , when you consider that 1,000's of Cambodians and thier extended families survive on $50/$60 a month , that ain't all bad .


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## oddball

Very good idea if you can afford to travel and check out possibilities , nothing compares with the word straight from the horses mouth and not all locations suit all people in the same way , we , or at least most of us , have different expectations and requirements to suit our particular idiocincrocies .


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## oddball

You would not find it easy to live on the bottom pay for ESL teaching, the high end would be more liveable but no real 'Extras 'in your life , i had mentioned Cambodia , but i suddenly thought of a friends son in Korea , friendly, gratefull people toward ESL teachers , pay is good and 'After hours 'mentoring pays excellently . Might pay to check out that avenue of escape from your present job .
Japan ? I just read a news flash on my motor racing site (?) they are not paying thier ESL teachers at this time , no reason given . Colin


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## synthia

Not paying teachers in Japan? The government liquidates companies when they don't pay their staff.

Korea has a good reputation in terms of being a place where you can make and save money teaching ESL, but there are a great many sleazy companies and teachers tend to have lots of problems. Some like it, some hate it.


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## djscottyis

I have retired out to Phuket from the UK the only jobs here are bar girls and for the flanges own a bar


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## jsflynn603

I've heard that getting a good certificate from a good school is invaluable, and oftentimes the school will direct you towards a job. I've decided upon SIT TESOL in Bkk or CM, it's about $1300US and runs about 4-5 weeks, and is quite intensive. When you are done you WILL know how to teach English to a non-speaker.

I have heard that some schools will work you to death, and others are quite good, so research your potential jobs. Also I've heard to "drop the American attitude" and that you are an "entertainer" first... If you have 15 students and 14 work hard and one only comes to class occasionally and doesn't even try.... give 'em all "A's" for if you don't.... you might be surprised at the outcome. 

Bottom line is that if you love to teach, and you obtain true TESOL skills (native speaking can get you a job but I fear for your sanity) you will soon find yourself in demand.

I'm gonna try it... SIT (School for International Training) has classes all over the world. The class in Thailand is about $1000 cheaper than in the US so why not do it there? They have a great reputation, but there are others with great reputations too.


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## KhwaamLap

jsflynn603 said:


> I've heard that getting a good certificate from a good school is invaluable, and oftentimes the school will direct you towards a job. I've decided upon SIT TESOL in Bkk or CM, it's about $1300US and runs about 4-5 weeks, and is quite intensive. When you are done you WILL know how to teach English to a non-speaker.
> 
> I have heard that some schools will work you to death, and others are quite good, so research your potential jobs. Also I've heard to "drop the American attitude" and that you are an "entertainer" first... If you have 15 students and 14 work hard and one only comes to class occasionally and doesn't even try.... give 'em all "A's" for if you don't.... you might be surprised at the outcome.
> 
> Bottom line is that if you love to teach, and you obtain true TESOL skills (native speaking can get you a job but I fear for your sanity) you will soon find yourself in demand.
> 
> I'm gonna try it... SIT (School for International Training) has classes all over the world. The class in Thailand is about $1000 cheaper than in the US so why not do it there? They have a great reputation, but there are others with great reputations too.


For balance, I'm doing a TEFL at the moment in CM with Siam Educational Experience (SEE) - costs $950 is fully accredited with 6 monitored lessons etc (includes some basic Thai lessons too for newbies here). My aim is not to teach for money, but to do some voluntary teaching in orphanages and temple (read: poor) schools - SEE has a program affiliated with charities here and they can get you (me) a voluteer work permit (and visa - but I don't need one) and a placement with a school that's crying out for volunteers. The TEFL can be used for paid work too of course, but you will need a WP to be legal (usually means you need a BA or BSc too).

There are lots of schools here that teach TEFL/TSOL/etc, but watch out for accreditation and make sure it includes monitored teaching experience.


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## gino

*SIT versus Cambridge and Trinity*

I am looking at a SIT class in Chicago. I’ve read a guidebook to navigating the TEFL/TESOL certificate course. The author maintains the courses validated by Cambridge and Trinity are the standard-bearers; however, these courses are not available in Chicago. I could take a course in Boston or Bangkok or some other city, but it would be considerably more expensive with travel and accommodations, although tuition might be lower. My options in Chicago are somewhat limited. There’s one SIT course, another school that has a reputation as a diploma mill and various Internet courses and weekend seminars, which seem to be regarded with general distaste. 

The author comments favorably on SIT courses, but seems to feel they lack the patina of Cambridge courses. I was favorably impressed. They seem to have a very professional operation and the application process is similar to what the author describes for Cambridge and Trinity courses. 

How are SIT courses regarded in Thailand? Are they recognized? Are they considered as good as Cambridge, nearly so or a poor substitute?


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