# Visa Question



## davross08 (Mar 26, 2014)

I am an Australian and I have been living here with my Filipino wife since 2010. We visited Australia in 2019 and when we returned at the end of April 2019 I was given a balikbayan visa for one year. After the balikbayan visa expired I started renewing my tourist visa and I have been doing that since then. My questions are:

1. Does the 12 month balikbayan visa count as part of the 36 month maximum stay rule? If it does not, will I be allowed to stay for 48 months?

2. If I am forced to leave the country after 36 months will I be allowed back in if I do not take my wife with me?

3. Since we have always traveled overseas regularly, I have never had a need for a 13A visa, but Covid has prevented us from leaving since April 2019. Would I be better off applying for a 13A and if I do how likely is it that it will be processed before my 36 months is up in April 2022?

I would greatly appreciate your advice.


----------



## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

davross08 said:


> I am an Australian and I have been living here with my Filipino wife since 2010. We visited Australia in 2019 and when we returned at the end of April 2019 I was given a balikbayan visa for one year. After the balikbayan visa expired I started renewing my tourist visa and I have been doing that since then. My questions are:
> 
> 1. Does the 12 month balikbayan visa count as part of the 36 month maximum stay rule? If it does not, will I be allowed to stay for 48 months?
> 
> ...


The twelve month Balikbayan does count towards your 36 months so you only get another 24 months on a temporary visa ( no such thing as a tourist visa).
If you leave as a spouse you could return but the hassle involved it would be worth taking your wife.
I'm not sure how long a 13a takes but likely only a month or two. One thing, you must keep your temporary visa valid during the process.


----------



## davross08 (Mar 26, 2014)

Gary D said:


> The twelve month Balikbayan does count towards your 36 months so you only get another 24 months on a temporary visa ( no such thing as a tourist visa).
> If you leave as a spouse you could return but the hassle involved it would be worth taking your wife.
> I'm not sure how long a 13a takes but likely only a month or two. One thing, you must keep your temporary visa valid during the process.


Thank you Gary. I think 13A is the way to go so that is what I will do. My temporary visa has expired because we tested positive and had to go into a government quarantine facility just before I was due to renew it. I am hoping I can just pay a penalty when we go to BI on Tuesday next week when our home quarantine is completed.


----------



## Zep (Jun 8, 2017)

You will need a PSA Marriage Certificate to apply for a 13a visa. Where you married in the PI or AU? If AU then you will need to go thru the process of having your marriage certificate approved by the dept of foreign affairs. This can take 4 months on its own.


----------



## davross08 (Mar 26, 2014)

Zep said:


> You will need a PSA Marriage Certificate to apply for a 13a visa. Where you married in the PI or AU? If AU then you will need to go thru the process of having your marriage certificate approved by the dept of foreign affairs. This can take 4 months on its own.


Hi Zep, I was married in the Philippines so hopefully we will not have a lengthy delay. We already have the PSA Marriage Certificate. Thank you for your feedback.


----------



## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Been a few years since I went thru the process but as I remember it took about 3 months from when we submitted the application till approval of the 13A Probationary which will be stamped in your passport. Then you ride on that for a year. About 3 months before that year is up, you do the whole process again and will be issued the 13A Permanent stamp in your Passport.

You have to start with that long form multi-purpose application that you should be able to pick up at any BI office.

Unless all this covid stuff has changed things, that's about as I remember it happening.

Fred


----------



## davross08 (Mar 26, 2014)

fmartin_gila said:


> Been a few years since I went thru the process but as I remember it took about 3 months from when we submitted the application till approval of the 13A Probationary which will be stamped in your passport. Then you ride on that for a year. About 3 months before that year is up, you do the whole process again and will be issued the 13A Permanent stamp in your Passport.
> 
> You have to start with that long form multi-purpose application that you should be able to pick up at any BI office.
> 
> ...


Thank you Fred. Great information.


----------



## bidrod (Mar 31, 2015)

Here is the appropriate page from BI for 13a(probationary) the application form can be printed from this page:

Conversion to Non-Quota Immigrant Visa by Marriage

Chuck


----------



## davross08 (Mar 26, 2014)

bidrod said:


> Here is the appropriate page from BI for 13a(probationary) the application form can be printed from this page:
> 
> Conversion to Non-Quota Immigrant Visa by Marriage
> 
> Chuck


Thank you Chuck - much appreciated.


----------



## art1946 (Nov 30, 2017)

Does anybody know if the length of stay in the Philippines for a foreign tourist has changed. I know when I was there before we had to leave after a certain time and come back into the country to start the process over again. Have they cracked down on that process? What is the next step for a visa to stay there now?

thanks

Art


----------



## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

Currently you are allowed 36 months assuming you are from an E304 country ( USA, Europe are you then have to leave although you can apply for a small extension, couple of months. If you leave and return with your wife you can come straight back in as a balikbayan, if you leave without your wife you need a 9a temporary visa and DFE exemption. As a tourist you leave and currently do not return.


----------



## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

What I think is sad is that expats that have lived here for years and years, contributed to family and country utilising a visa system set up by immi and obviously approved by the then and now government appear to be cast adrift. Tourist Visas.
An overlooked segment of the population, While I'm ok for another 20 months after that if this situation continues?
One of the reasons I have revisited the PRA options.

Fortunately in early days immi waived extension obligations for those living here but probably had to as they all closed down. Now? No thought to the foreigners living here with a family, condo, commitments availing the tourist visa. No exemptions, no case by case investigations which eventually leaves a lot of expats leaving the country going where? Many have no where to go because this i their home now. This issue needs to be addressed and quickly by the powers that be. 

While I'm not a lobbyist and as a guest here worry the implications of approaching this oversight with the appropriate government bodies. Compassion rings a bell but how to get that message to those that may take notice?

OMO.

Cheers, Steve.


----------



## art1946 (Nov 30, 2017)

Hey Gary,

What are the options of a visa stay with using the tourist visa and then getting another visa? If I come there on a tourist visa I can stay 36 months I think? What are the options without getting married to stay there? I would like to come back but not by getting married again.

thanks

Art


----------



## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

Steve I hear you but if you intend to stay long term the temporary vise ( there's no such thing as a tourist visa) is the wrong visa, there are other options. SRRV you are looking into, there is also a quota visa but is limited by number per country per year, 50 I think.

Art there is the quota visa but at I believe 50 per year popular countries you will struggle.

If you want to keep abreast of the current immigration situation in the Philippines watch a filipina vbogger called jenifer terri.


----------



## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Thanks Gary, had a quick look at Jennifers site and will try to absorb more down the track.
I have looked at the quota visa years ago and though I have qualifications and unique skills and experience in certain fields and could probably apply as all the other criteria is easy I felt that these type visas were for people "not" about to retire but either through employment or voluntary engagement pass on their field of expertise to this country and people.

It would be as big a lie as staying on a tourist visa. While I have gone off the SRRV I think I will have little option but to go that way and I'm fortunate enough to be in country to accomplish, let's see where Covid takes us.

A 13a would be perfect but unfortunately we don't qualify for marriage in this country but the trade off is leasing a property from my mate legally which cannot be accomplished if married, swings and merry go rounds as is life.

Cheers, Steve.


----------



## Tukaram (Dec 18, 2014)

bigpearl said:


> A 13a would be perfect but unfortunately we don't qualify for marriage in this country but the trade off is leasing a property from my mate legally which cannot be accomplished if married, swings and merry go rounds as is life.


Oh, that is rather brilliant. I had not thought of that benefit.


----------



## art1946 (Nov 30, 2017)

Hey Gary-----What you mean there is no tourist visa? I was there before on a tourist visa. I stay about a year and came back because I had some medical issues that were covered by the VA here free. I was coming back until this covid-19 came about. If I can't come there on a Tourist visa then what visa would I get? I am not married to a Filipino lady either.

thanks for the info.

art


----------



## bidrod (Mar 31, 2015)

art1946 said:


> Hey Gary-----What you mean there is no tourist visa? I was there before on a tourist visa. I stay about a year and came back because I had some medical issues that were covered by the VA here free. I was coming back until this covid-19 came about. If I can't come there on a Tourist visa then what visa would I get? I am not married to a Filipino lady either.
> 
> thanks for the info.
> 
> art


The visa is called a Temporary Visitor Visa not a Tourist Visa.

Chuck


----------



## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

art1946 said:


> Hey Gary-----What you mean there is no tourist visa? I was there before on a tourist visa. I stay about a year and came back because I had some medical issues that were covered by the VA here free. I was coming back until this covid-19 came about. If I can't come there on a Tourist visa then what visa would I get? I am not married to a Filipino lady either.
> 
> thanks for the info.
> 
> art


The 9a which everyone erroneously calls a tourist visa is officially a temporary visa. It's handed out to tourists because they are only staying temporarily. That's were the confusion comes from with foreign spouses having to acquire a 9a visa to enter the Philippines unaccompanied currently. It's a temporary visa not tour visa.


----------



## Tukaram (Dec 18, 2014)

Gary D said:


> The 9a which everyone erroneously calls a tourist visa is officially a temporary visa. It's handed out to tourists because they are only staying temporarily. That's were the confusion comes from with foreign spouses having to acquire a 9a visa to enter the Philippines unaccompanied currently. It's a temporary visa not tour visa.


That *is* true, but it really is just a semantics game. Even BI officers call the 9a a 'tourist visa'. 😎


----------



## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Tourist visa/temporary visa, call it what you like but the reality is this system is set up whether ignorantly or deliberately and favours those wishing to take advantage of this type of visa to basically live here permanently with the "leave the country every 3 years then start again policy" idea that is in reality one of the best visa types offered anywhere in the world. 2 years for some countries.

For me it works and yes I have options even in this current pandemic, Costly though. There are plenty living here on this type of visa that have family, friends, commitments and possibly investments in one form or another and for 5, 10 or 20 years have lived here, availed this visa program and have nowhere else to go and couldn't or can't afford to leave the country for an indeterminable time paying rent or imposing on relatives at the expense of their life and commitments here, sorry honey, I now have rent to pay so the children might starve. I am unable to return.

OMO but a system such as this needs to be reevaluated, not for a new visa policy but for those living here under the current obligations and systems in place and the restrictions now imposed due to C-19 limiting return to this country, their home. The financial burdens will be many fold aside from the heartache and separation from loved ones and commitment to their lives here.

Case by case evaluation?

Ain't going to happen unfortunately. Welcome to the Philippines.

Cheers, Steve.


----------



## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Gary D said:


> The 9a which everyone erroneously calls a tourist visa is officially a temporary visa. It's handed out to tourists because they are only staying temporarily. That's were the confusion comes from with foreign spouses having to acquire a 9a visa to enter the Philippines unaccompanied currently. It's a temporary visa not tour visa.


Yep it is a temporary visa, most times mistakingly called a tourist visa, all over the web.

Ad hoc.

*DEFINITION OF A FOREIGN TOURIST (TEMPORARY VISITOR)*

A "foreign tourist" is defined as a person without distinction as to race, gender, language or religion, who is proceeding o the Philippines for a legitimate, nonimmigrant purpose such as sightseeing, sports, health, family reasons, training or study (excluding enrollment in schools for the purpose of obtaining a title or degree), religious pilgrimage, business, cultural and scientific purposes.

The point I think is this visa exists and those living here using a legal accomplishment to continue their lives here have been abandoned now by an illogical system (welcome yet again to the Philippines).
Note in the description above,,,,,,, family reasons.

While I don't really consider this situation hypocrisy (maybe) I do believe that immi and government needs to address removing people legally living, "yes on a temporary visa" here to potentially never to return. Sour grapes etc.
Those individuals that need to exit the country but wish to return have no rights nor any consideration given to their commitment, family and investments here. Given the current pandemic immi needs to readdress: Firstly validity of the of the culprit they are about to remove and or secondly and more importantly, relaxing restrictions on a system legally in situ and given travel restrictions to existing temporary visitors? A hiatus needs to be implemented until this pandemic is reigned in and borders reopen, give the people that want to live here under this legal visa some leniency as long as they continue to pay their obligations to the government. 

OMO.

Cheers, Steve.


----------



## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

The tourist visa system in the Philippines is simply a money cow full stop.


----------



## Tukaram (Dec 18, 2014)

bigpearl said:


> While I don't really consider this situation hypocrisy (maybe) I do believe that immi and government needs to address removing people legally living, "yes on a temporary visa" here to potentially never to return.


I agree with you, but I have heard some immigration officials with different opinions. Pre-covid I was at BI, a foreigner was getting hassled about extending his tourist 'visa'. The BI officer looked at him and said 'you have been here over 2 years... you are not a tourist'. Then told him to get married or get an SRRV, and to quit abusing the system. He then renewed the guys stamp and told him it was his last one... (following the rules is 'abuse'?)

They recently announced automatic 6 month grace period for expired visas, because of covid, and specifically stated that tourists are not included. I am not saying it is right, but the BI really does not care about long-term tourists.


----------



## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Gary D said:


> The tourist visa system in the Philippines is simply a money cow full stop.


Same all over the world Gary. I looked at my cost for the first year for visa extensions removing the over stay fine I copped, another thread. (PHP 3K)

PHP 22,740. this includes the ACR card. Say US $ 475.00
The SRRV annual fee costs. US $ 360.00
A difference of. (saving) US $ 115.00

But If you take into account the application fee of US $ 1400.00 It will take 12 years before you break even and are on a cheaper visa.
Then there is the deposit sitting in a bank earning you 2 bob and a bottle of beer while others invest it and make money, then there is the issue of getting not only your money back but getting it out of the country if you opt to leave the system. OMO but it appears the SRRV is a bigger cash grab than the visitor visa.

Going back to the temp visitor visa (tourist visa) at month 6 I think it was, appeared a PHP 1400.00 charge entitled "Certificate of residency for temporary visitors". I googled this quickly and was rewarded with zilch.
While I'm not sure it grants extra rights or just another money grab it seems to acknowledge that you are here for a long time and perfectly acceptable.

As said it is a system that has been implemented by this government whether as a cash cow or to help stimulate the economy, probably both and given the circumstances needs to be addressed. (C-19)
Further to this, even if you had an SRRV Which is a residency visa you are in the same boat or were, not kept up with the latest goings on.

Any way only an opinion.

Cheers, Steve.


----------



## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Tukaram said:


> I agree with you, but I have heard some immigration officials with different opinions. Pre-covid I was at BI, a foreigner was getting hassled about extending his tourist 'visa'. The BI officer looked at him and said 'you have been here over 2 years... you are not a tourist'. Then told him to get married or get an SRRV, and to quit abusing the system. He then renewed the guys stamp and told him it was his last one... (following the rules is 'abuse'?)
> 
> They recently announced automatic 6 month grace period for expired visas, because of covid, and specifically stated that tourists are not included. I am not saying it is right, but the BI really does not care about long-term tourists.



Sad to here that happened, perhaps the immi officer got a knock back the previous night? My local immi office are always glad to see punters, when I sign in with the security guard I often see the previous days admissions,,,,, Previous page and never full, 10 to 20 for the day and I am always #1 a half hour after they open. Last time I was even addressed as sir Steve to go to the cashiers register. Yes they occasionally smile as well.
Honestly a far cry from my ventures with immi in Intramuros 8 and 9 years ago with hundreds of punters, scammers and vendors not to mention the, at most times curt employees having to deal with this situation. (never a smile there) Definitely not a good environment for employees let alone the punters.

Bad day at work rings a bell.

Cheers, Steve.


----------



## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

bigpearl said:


> Sad to here that happened, perhaps the immi officer got a knock back the previous night? My local immi office are always glad to see punters, when I sign in with the security guard I often see the previous days admissions,,,,, Previous page and never full, 10 to 20 for the day and I am always #1 a half hour after they open. Last time I was even addressed as sir Steve to go to the cashiers register. Yes they occasionally smile as well.
> Honestly a far cry from my ventures with immi in Intramuros 8 and 9 years ago with hundreds of punters, scammers and vendors not to mention the, at most times curt employees having to deal with this situation. (never a smile there) Definitely not a good environment for employees let alone the punters.
> 
> Bad day at work rings a bell.
> ...


I don't want to go into detail of my previous fees at the Main Branch but I renewed my ACR Card this week and things have changed for the better, no more up and down the stairs to other offices, everything is handeled ground level and the fees are as stated, the Bureau Officers are friendly, helpful and professional they also have a few floaters that help you get to the correct windows, help with photos or if you need folders, copies or paperwork they direct to that area, the fees are nominal for stock.

Sadly I noticed several fellow Expats that showed up there with zero planning, no documents, no folders and no idea what to do, they were there before me and they were there after I left. They also had several certified workers that were running paper work for many clients they all wore the same color uniform.


----------



## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

M.C.A. said:


> I don't want to go into detail of my previous fees at the Main Branch but I renewed my ACR Card this week and things have changed for the better, no more up and down the stairs to other offices, everything is handeled ground level and the fees are as stated, the Bureau Officers are friendly, helpful and professional they also have a few floaters that help you get to the correct windows, help with photos or if you need folders, copies or paperwork they direct to that area, the fees are nominal for stock.
> 
> Sadly I noticed several fellow Expats that showed up there with zero planning, no documents, no folders and no idea what to do, they were there before me and they were there after I left. They also had several certified workers that were running paper work for many clients they all wore the same color uniform.


Ah, with you now Mark, read your PM before this one, that's good news for sure. But,,,,,, Why can't you accomplish simple things like that online? perhaps every 10 years go to immi? My drivers licence in Oz expired early this year and I went online and renewed for another 5 years, 10 years max at my age for eye test. 
I remember the first time I fronted up there to extend my visa and though I followed the online requirements to the letter it wasn't good enough, had to pay for additional copies even though I arrived with triplicates of everything after bashing my way through the scammers and multitudes of people. From memory my first time there took some 4 hours to accomplish a simple visa extension and I do remember about the same amount of time when I had to get my ACR card.
More staff and an additional building wouldn't go astray.
Any way I've already done enough whinging in previous posts but as said the positives for me is an immi office here with nice staff and rarely another punter in the 10 to 15 minutes there to complete my business. 12th of August is the next visit,,,,,, shopping as I've not been out the gate since the last extension.

Cheers, Steve.


----------



## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

bigpearl said:


> Ah, with you now Mark, read your PM before this one, that's good news for sure. But,,,,,, Why can't you accomplish simple things like that online? perhaps every 10 years go to immi? My drivers licence in Oz expired early this year and I went online and renewed for another 5 years, 10 years max at my age for eye test.
> I remember the first time I fronted up there to extend my visa and though I followed the online requirements to the letter it wasn't good enough, had to pay for additional copies even though I arrived with triplicates of everything after bashing my way through the scammers and multitudes of people. From memory my first time there took some 4 hours to accomplish a simple visa extension and I do remember about the same amount of time when I had to get my ACR card.
> More staff and an additional building wouldn't go astray.
> Any way I've already done enough whinging in previous posts but as said the positives for me is an immi office here with nice staff and rarely another punter in the 10 to 15 minutes there to complete my business. 12th of August is the next visit,,,,,, shopping as I've not been out the gate since the last extension.
> ...


I renew my US Passport Manila Embassy through AIR 21 and it's all done by mail and the passport is good for 10 years.

Unsure if I explained this right, I renewed my Permanent Resident ACR 13a Card (expires every 5 years) and everything has to be accomplished at the Main Branch in Intramurous, we have a Satellite Office in Sta Rosa Laguna but they only handle tourist or shorter Visa ACR cards but I can perform my annual check in with the Sta Rosa Branch.


----------

