# Are Villa Burglaries An Issue



## StevejR1

I recently posted on another site about my intensional to move to Spain. A few worrying posts were comments about the number of villa burglaries there had been lately.

Is this a big problem? Or a growing problem? Or is it dependant on area? Or is it no more of a risk than it is in the UK?

I'm considering the Gaucin, Grazalema, Vinuela areas...but really the whole inland costa del Sol, and east of Malaga regions.

Thanks for your help


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## mrypg9

Steve.R said:


> I recently posted on another site about my intensional to move to Spain. A few worrying posts were comments about the number of villa burglaries there had been lately.
> 
> Is this a big problem? Or a growing problem? Or is it dependant on area? Or is it no more of a risk than it is in the UK?
> 
> I'm considering the Gaucin, Grazalema, Vinuela areas...but really the whole inland costa del Sol, and east of Malaga regions.
> 
> Thanks for your help


Crime certáinly has risen and it's not just 'villas' or homes of British immigrants that are targeted. But then, with unemployment at over 34% in some areas, it's only to be expected

In our supposedly affluent area every house has been broken into, including ours. 

But I lived near Norwich nine years ago and I feel much safer here than 
I ever did in the UK.

Fear of crime is often greater than the likelihood of crime.


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## extranjero

mrypg9 said:


> Crime certáinly has risen and it's not just 'villas' or homes of British immigrants that are targeted. But then, with unemployment at over 34% in some areas, it's only to be expected
> 
> In our supposedly affluent area every house has been broken into, including ours.
> 
> But I lived near Norwich nine years ago and I feel much safer here than
> I ever did in the UK.
> 
> Fear of crime is often greater than the likelihood of crime.


Our urbanisation has had a huge increase in burglaries and car theft, recently, five in one night! Some were carried out in broad daylight on houses with high walls, security grilles etc.Some were easy for opportunists-low walls doors and windows left open.Car stolen from those with drives and those too lazy to put cars in at night. Ingenious methods used, gassing, long pole with hook put through windows to get car keys, bags. Some thieves are very bold. following people to their homes and attacking them in their driveways.I wouldn't walk around here on my own late at night. I feel much more vulnerable than I did in UK-I have never heard of so many burglaries, muggings etc as I have here.


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## StevejR1

A scary statistic that all the villas in your area have been burgled! 

Ironically I presently live in Norwich!...in a good, sought after area...and although there have been burglaries in the area over the years it's certainly not an epidemic, nor a high concern.

Is the Andalucia area a higher risk area, or about the average?


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## nickbish

The chalet next to ours and the one across the road have both been broken into. In one case the doors were kicked in and in the other they used an angle grinder to cut through the security grill. Both were empty at the time of the break in.
In both cases the police were sure that it was the work of non Spanish people,but i think there is growing evidence to suggest that ,as the economic situation worsens,more Spanish nationals and indeed expats are choosing crime to make ends meet.
I still feel as safe here as i did in the UK and so long as you take the appropriate security precautions,as you would anywhere else,you should be ok


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## extranjero

nickbish said:


> The chalet next to ours and the one across the road have both been broken into. In one case the doors were kicked in and in the other they used an angle grinder to cut through the security grill. Both were empty at the time of the break in.
> In both cases the police were sure that it was the work of non Spanish people,but i think there is growing evidence to suggest that ,as the economic situation worsens,more Spanish nationals and indeed expats are choosing crime to make ends meet.
> I still feel as safe here as i did in the UK and so long as you take the appropriate security precautions,as you would anywhere else,you should be ok


That's the point-villas are broken into often have grilles, high walls, alarms, lights, window locks etc, and are not in isolated areas; what else can you do? Even dogs have been poisoned. Possibly the best deterrent is a nosy neighbour!


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## mrypg9

Steve.R said:


> A scary statistic that all the villas in your area have been burgled!
> 
> Ironically I presently live in Norwich!...in a good, sought after area...and although there have been burglaries in the area over the years it's certainly not an epidemic, nor a high concern.
> 
> Is the Andalucia area a higher risk area, or about the average?


Andalucia is a very large region. It covers wealthy towns such as Marbella and piss-poor inland villages. So it's impossible to generalise. But unemployment is very high indeed here.

We live in a small village on the coast in a street with houses which ten years ago would have changed hands for over £million. It's assumed, erroneously that the owners must all be wealthy but most people who have houses here are local Spaniards some of whom built these houses twenty years or more ago...some of them actually doing the building themselves. So it's only to be expected that we'd have our share of break-ins. We have Spanish acquaintances who live in a modest piso...they too were broken into as they slept.

In our case we really should have put a notice on our gate saying 'Bienvenido' as we went out with our 54kilo Rhodesian Ridgeback leaving the alarm off, the persilianas up and keys in the back door... Very stupid. But we disturbed the thieves and they got away with an IPod Nano -too small for my operas so I wasn't that bothered - 170 euros which did bother me and some Sainsbury's ear-rings worth all of £2.99.

All we can do is be more sensible in future and make it as difficult as possible for any thief. It certainly isn't going to scare us or put us off living here. 

But there are a lot of break-ins, that's undeniable. Street crime too but again, you just need to be alert.

Much worse in Prague where we lived for three years and where we were mugged -or should I say scumbags attempted to mug us, we fought back very successfully - five times in our first year. 
Amazing the effect a sharp jab with a knee or a car key in the testicles can have....


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## Stravinsky

Steve.R said:


> A scary statistic that all the villas in your area have been burgled!
> 
> Ironically I presently live in Norwich!...in a good, sought after area...and although there have been burglaries in the area over the years it's certainly not an epidemic, nor a high concern.
> 
> Is the Andalucia area a higher risk area, or about the average?


I think we should put this into perspective

Whilst living in the UK between 1975 and 2006, most of our houses were broken in to, the first one within a week of us moving in there

In Spain so far we have never been broken into, and I know of maybe a handful of villas in the vicinity that have been broken into over the last 6 or 7 years.

Having an alarm system will make a difference, and with an outside box it makes even more of a deterrent. The houses that have been broken into in Oliva, nearby have all been small town houses in the old area of Oliva, where balconies and roofs can be used to gain entrance.

We're not in your area, but I would say prevention in the line of Alarms, and security doors are a good idea, and whilst not very encouraging, is not much different to what I would say about the UK


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## mrypg9

extranjero said:


> Our urbanisation has had a huge increase in burglaries and car theft, recently, five in one night! Some were carried out in broad daylight on houses with high walls, security grilles etc.Some were easy for opportunists-low walls doors and windows left open.Car stolen from those with drives and those too lazy to put cars in at night. Ingenious methods used, gassing, long pole with hook put through windows to get car keys, bags. Some thieves are very bold. following people to their homes and attacking them in their driveways.I wouldn't walk around here on my own late at night. I feel much more vulnerable than I did in UK-I have never heard of so many burglaries, muggings etc as I have here.


It's sad that you feel like that. Do you have a dog? Now we have a Neapolitan Mastiff as well as our Ridgeback we feel very safe..

I don't go for that 'gassing' tale...urban myth, very often used by those who fell into bed after too much vino! 

All you can do is take every precaution possible. A lot of the burglaries in this area are a result of people watching to see any 'patterns' in owners' activities. A friend was robbed of precious family silver when she went to the UK for a few days. Another friend was robbed when he went off for his regular Tuesday golf morning. Our next-door neighbour was robbed when they all went out for dinner. We were broken into when we both went dog-walking but came back much earlier than usual to watch El Clasico...We had all obviously been under observation.

Has your urb. got a security patrol?


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## extranjero

Stravinsky said:


> I think we should put this into perspective
> 
> Whilst living in the UK between 1975 and 2006, most of our houses were broken in to, the first one within a week of us moving in there
> 
> In Spain so far we have never been broken into, and I know of maybe a handful of villas in the vicinity that have been broken into over the last 6 or 7 years.
> 
> Having an alarm system will make a difference, and with an outside box it makes even more of a deterrent. The houses that have been broken into in Oliva, nearby have all been small town houses in the old area of Oliva, where balconies and roofs can be used to gain entrance.
> 
> We're not in your area, but I would say prevention in the line of Alarms, and security doors are a good idea, and whilst not very encouraging, is not much different to what I would say about the UK


I must have been luck then , never had a break in the whole time I lived in UK.
Every house in this area has been burgled, and though in some, opportunists have only grabbed small amounts, it's the sense of someone violating your space that's hard to recover from, and it can leave you fearful, not wanting to get out and live your life.Even though statistics state that there is less crime in Spain if thieves repeatedly target your area because they perceive you to be rich, then it certainly doesn't feel like it.


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## jimenato

mrypg9 said:


> ...
> I don't go for that 'gassing' tale...urban myth, very often used by those who fell into bed after too much vino!
> ...


Absolutely a myth - and an amazingly persistent one.


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## mrypg9

extranjero said:


> I must have been luck then , never had a break in the whole time I lived in UK.
> Every house in this area has been burgled, and though in some, opportunists have only grabbed small amounts,* it's the sense of someone violating your space that's hard to recover from, and it can leave you fearful, not wanting to get out and live your life*.Even though statistics state that there is less crime in Spain if thieves repeatedly target your area because they perceive you to be rich, then it certainly doesn't feel like it.


Well, being broken into certainly didn't have that effect on me. Although having your home invaded by an uninvited 'guest' is unpleasant, no way should it spoil your life in that way. No way will I allow some petty thief or desperate unemployed person to stop me going out and living my life. I'm no youngster either but my life is not up for being spoilt because I've had stuff stolen...

I confidently expect to be broken into again but it will be when we are both out with both the dogs as no-one will get past Our Little Azor who is always in the house when we both go out together. I now make sure all persilianas are down, house alarmed when we're out with the dogs, windows closed and doors locked and I hide the only valuable things I'd not want stolen - my notebook and IPad and IPod. Trouble is, I often forget where I hid them.

So the only things of value are two flat screen tvs and tbh what are they worth nowadays....

We may live in a big house but we are no way wealthy. No silver, jewels etc.


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## Aron

Yes there has been an increase in burglaries, but then there has been in every country that is in or gone through recession. We had a lot of burglaries through the winter. Most of the properties were unoccupied or were renal properties. I think in a 6 week period we had 30 burglaries. That may sound a lot, but out of about 3000 properties, that percentage is very small.
All you can do is make it as difficult as possible for them to want to make the effort. Most thieves are opportunists and look for easy targets. No property anywhere is 100% secure, but you can make it difficult.
I still feel safe in Spain. I walk every day and in areas where few people go, just other walkers.


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## extranjero

Even villas with dogs have been broken into!It is not a guarantee.Dogs can be poisoned or attacked.
Gassing a myth? I am NOT a liar-it happened to a neighbour. I agree that it is a method not usually used in villas, more in camper vans with smaller space.
Do not underestimate the psychological lasting harm being burgled can cause-certainly more than just an unpleasant event, especially if precious sentimental things are taken and the place trashed. some have moved back to UK after the experience.
I'm surprised many are happy to walk around on their own; the number of distraction muggings is on the up too!


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## Aron

extranjero said:


> Even villas with dogs have been broken into!It is not a guarantee.Dogs can be poisoned or attacked.
> Gassing a myth? I am NOT a liar-it happened to a neighbour. I agree that it is a method not usually used in villas, more in camper vans with smaller space.
> Do not underestimate the psychological lasting harm being burgled can cause-certainly more than just an unpleasant event, especially if precious sentimental things are taken and the place trashed. some have moved back to UK after the experience.
> I'm surprised many are happy to walk around on their own; the number of distraction muggings is on the up too!


I don't disagree with you, but what you have written could just as easily be a worse scenario in the UK. Being burgled is a dreadful experience of intrusion and it has lasting affect on many, but whereas Spain may be seeing an increase in crime, it's not an explosion like other countries. You cannot live your life worrying about shadows where shadows may not exist. You just have to be more vigilant whether in Spain or the UK.


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## mrypg9

extranjero said:


> Even villas with dogs have been broken into!It is not a guarantee.Dogs can be poisoned or attacked.
> Gassing a myth? I am NOT a liar-it happened to a neighbour. I agree that it is a method not usually used in villas, more in camper vans with smaller space.
> Do not underestimate the psychological lasting harm being burgled can cause-certainly more than just an unpleasant event, especially if precious sentimental things are taken and the place trashed. some have moved back to UK after the experience.
> I'm surprised many are happy to walk around on their own; the number of distraction muggings is on the up too!


I know all about being burgled. Our business premises have been broken into numerous times in the UK. As I said, foolish people tried to mug me in Prague...more than once. Note 'tried'.

I am truly sorry for people who allow themselves to be so badly affected by having property stolen. But of my many friends and neighbours who have been burgled I know of not a single one who has given a second's thought to moving. Maybe we are made of sterner stuff... But anyone who allows such an incident to ruin their lives in Spain is a victim of two crimes, sadly...

As for the gassing myth..it is a myth no matter what your neighbour may have told you. I must say it's the first time I've heard it's more frequent in motorhomes. It's usually villas that were allegedly 'poisoned'by some mysterious gas.
How is this gas introduced? What gas is it? How come the occupants of the motorhome were affected but not the thieves? Don't tell me...they wore breathing apparatus.
Saying you were gassed sounds a better tale to dine out on than admitting you had too much to drink,left your door/window open and woke up to find you were robbed...
No doubt Jimenato can explain in more scientific terms why it's a myth.

Odd that this gassing tale is common only in Spain and amongst British immigrants, though


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## mrypg9

Found this on the net..

_Gassing is an urban myth and there has never been one proven case of gassing. It's also funny that the cylinders required would be enormous and yet none has ever been found or left at the scene of a so-called 'gassing'.

The only example of attempted gassing was in Moscow in 2002 when 40 to 50 Chechen rebels took hostages in a theatre. The state eventually tried to introduce a narcotic gas and with all the expertise of top scientists, 170 people were killed.

Just think on this: An anaesthesiologist trains for five years to acquire the skills that he has. In a closely monitored operation and with all of the finest equipment and anaesthetics at his disposal, he has to make complex calculations based on the patient's age, weight and the length of the operation and needs to constantly regulate his doses in order to keep the the patient in that very narrow band just between death and a deep trance.

And people believe that a couple of Albanian thieves can squirt something into a motorhome and put the occupants into a deep sleep without harming them! And please note, the amount of any narcotic gas needed to knock out a grown man would probably kill a child. 

But why would these thieves go to all this trouble? First source a supply of the correct anaesthetic gas, then lug it around to camp sites or where ever motorhomes park, then find a way of introducing it into a locked 'van, just enough to knock out the inhabitants but do them no permanent damage. And why, for a few quid from a motorhomer, or the odd credit card or passport? I can assure you, that if they had this technology, which they don't, they'd be after much bigger fish! And why would they go through all these complex and dangerous procedures? Surely they'd just break in and, if you woke up, stick a gun in your face? Much more simple!

The probable case is that people have a heavy day, possibly a glass of wine and then a deep sleep. They are robbed whilst they sleep and wake up, possibly feeling a bit hung over. Now if this happened at home, which it does every night in the U.K. people would just accept that they've been robbed but, because it happened in a motorhome or caravan, and because they've heard this cock and bull urban myth, they jump to the conclusion that they've been gassed. Well they haven't and it's time that this was knocked on the head once and for all.

It is appalling that many companies sell these narcotic gas detectors and play on people's fears. There is no gassing, there is no need for detectors and the whole thing is utter tosh!

LPG and carbon monoxide detectors are a different thing all together and everyone should have one, but narcotic gas detectors, save your money folks! _


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## jimenato

extranjero said:


> Even villas with dogs have been broken into!It is not a guarantee.Dogs can be poisoned or attacked.
> Gassing a myth? I am NOT a liar-it happened to a neighbour. I agree that it is a method not usually used in villas, more in camper vans with smaller space.
> Do not underestimate the psychological lasting harm being burgled can cause-certainly more than just an unpleasant event, especially if precious sentimental things are taken and the place trashed. some have moved back to UK after the experience.
> I'm surprised many are happy to walk around on their own; the number of distraction muggings is on the up too!


No one's saying you're a liar.

The legend is as full of holes as a colander. 

The Royal College of Anaesthetists has said that such gassings are impossible - no such gas exists that would allow this.

And it's strange, isn't it, that it always happens to 'a neighbour' or 'someone I know'?


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## Muddy

Has anyone found any more up to date detailed statistics on various crimes per region?
I was trying to find out if Spain has anything like the stats you can get for the UK for your local area etc?
I just found these two sites, first one is a .PDF puts things into perspective when comparing the UK to Spain if the stats are correct, data mostly based on 2006 in part and Spain looks a lot safer overall based on Intentional Homicide, rape, Assault. Burglary is showing just under half compared to the UK.
The one which is the shocker is Robbery, looks like over 8 times England and Wales. But these stats could be very out of date as it doesn't make it clear the collection date per country. http://www.civitas.org.uk/crime/crime_stats_oecdjan2012.pdf

The second site could have been more helpful but looks very out of date also. 
Burglaries statistics - countries compared - Nation Master
So as far as robbery goes this data if correct would suggest Spain had a very high instance prior to the onset of the current situation.
Just found this which should help to get a better idea of what's happening now.
http://www.murciatoday.com/burglary...though-violent-crime-has-dropped_16519-a.html


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## el pescador

whats the law on protecting yourself if an intruder does come into your property?

are the spanish police less likely to prosecute you if you went for the burglar whilst in your home?


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## StevejR1

I'd be interested in any links to where to find any up to date statistics on reginal crime, especially burglary :happy:

I'm finding it hard to get the balance in the information I'm trying to gather in perpetration for a move to Spain.

It's hard not to be daunted by some of the negative aspects sometimes. It's then hard then to know if you ignore the warnings you're not guilty of 'chasing the dream', or to take the worst scenario as fact everywhere would be just as stupid.

For instance, tonight I will travel to work with two fellas...all three of us live in a different part of the UK. But if you asked the same question "is it safe in the area that you live?" I'm sure you would get 3 totally different answers! But we're all in the UK...so which one is a balanced, factual, take on safety in the UK???

I guess if I rent for a long period of time in Spain a lot of my questions would be answered.

I have to admit that my thoughts on moving to Spain are being challenged by certain aspects of my research. Building and personal safety being high on the agenda of requirements I'd want if I was to consider moving anywhere.


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## mrypg9

el pescador said:


> whats the law on protecting yourself if an intruder does come into your property?
> 
> are the spanish police less likely to prosecute you if you went for the burglar whilst in your home?


We returned from walking our Rhodesian Ridgeback to find a burglar in the house and a getaway car waiting outside by our garden wall. 
Azor began growling so we opened the gate and he shot off down the garden in hot pursuit of the thief who did an Olympic style vault over our 2m wall with Azor snapping at his heels.

When the police came I said how fortunate it was that Azor had not caught the thief. 'No', said the policeman,'It's a pity. It's your house.'
But I don't really want my dog to kill someone...

A friend who has lived in Spain for thirty years said that a policeman once told her to keep a gun in the house and if she apprehended a thief to shoot to kill then to dispose of the corpse in the sea with weights or in the campo......

I always think that 'Nada pasa' holds good....until 'pasa'.


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## mrypg9

Steve.R said:


> I'd be interested in any links to where to find any up to date statistics on reginal crime, especially burglary :happy:
> 
> I'm finding it hard to get the balance in the information I'm trying to gather in perpetration for a move to Spain.
> 
> It's hard not to be daunted by some of the negative aspects sometimes. It's then hard then to know if you ignore the warnings you're not guilty of 'chasing the dream', or to take the worst scenario as fact everywhere would be just as stupid.
> 
> For instance, tonight I will travel to work with two fellas...all three of us live in a different part of the UK. But if you asked the same question "is it safe in the area that you live?" I'm sure you would get 3 totally different answers! But we're all in the UK...so which one is a balanced, factual, take on safety in the UK???
> 
> I guess if I rent for a long period of time in Spain a lot of my questions would be answered.
> 
> I have to admit that my thoughts on moving to Spain are being challenged by certain aspects of my research. Building and personal safety being high on the agenda of requirements I'd want if I was to consider moving anywhere.


The most important consideration in Spain at present is work. If you're not looking for a job, other issues are not insurmountable.

I have to say that if you get too hung up on crime levels in Spain or any foreign town, city or village you'd be better off staying in Norfolk. We've lived here for almost five years of sheer enjoyment and we have been burgled once. Yes, I wouldn't be surprised to find that we experience a second attempt but we've taken all possible precautions. ...alarm, rejas, persilianas, neighbours who watch and two dogs who would never accept food from a stranger and one of whom, the Ridgeback, would floor anyone who tried to tackle him. I really don't think anyone would risk using a gun to commit these types of break-ins.

Spain is a great country to live in ...if you have ample funds. I never use the phrase 'living the dream' because my dreams aim for more than a lot of sunshine - eternal youth being high on the list.

Your plan of renting is not only a good idea.. I think it's essential before committing to purchase. You need to get to know the neighbourhood and you can't do that in a couple of visits.

I'd swap Norwich for Nerja any day!


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## StevejR1

mrypg9 said:


> The most important consideration in Spain at present is work. If you're not looking for a job, other issues are not insurmountable.
> 
> I have to say that if you get too hung up on crime levels in Spain or any foreign town, city or village you'd be better off staying in Norfolk. We've lived here for almost five years of sheer enjoyment and we have been burgled once. Yes, I wouldn't be surprised to find that we experience a second attempt but we've taken all possible precautions. ...alarm, rejas, persilianas, neighbours who watch and two dogs who would never accept food from a stranger and one of whom, the Ridgeback, would floor anyone who tried to tackle him. I really don't think anyone would risk using a gun to commit these types of break-ins.
> 
> Spain is a great country to live in ...if you have ample funds. I never use the phrase 'living the dream' because my dreams aim for more than a lot of sunshine - eternal youth being high on the list.
> 
> Your plan of renting is not only a good idea.. I think it's essential before committing to purchase. You need to get to know the neighbourhood and you can't do that in a couple of visits.
> 
> I'd swap Norwich for Nerja any day!



I wouldn't need to work...I would 'commute' to the UK for 3-4 years, then retire full time 

I'm not hung up on the crime, but it is one of the many considerations you do have to consider 

One of my main concerns of burglary, is that we have 3 house cats....if someone stole my tv I really wouldn't care...but if they harmed my cats, or they escaped, then it would be like the vendetta for the next Taken 3 movie!!! 

Renting seems to be the way to go all round, despite the fact that initially I wanted to buy straight off, but I've seen the error of that logic.


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## mrypg9

Steve.R said:


> I wouldn't need to work...I would 'commute' to the UK for 3-4 years, then retire full time
> 
> I'm not hung up on the crime, but it is one of the many considerations you do have to consider
> 
> One of my main concerns of burglary, is that we have 3 house cats....if someone stole my tv I really wouldn't care...but if they harmed my cats, or they escaped, then it would be like the vendetta for the next Taken 3 movie!!!
> 
> Renting seems to be the way to go all round, despite the fact that initially I wanted to buy straight off, but I've seen the error of that logic.


We're like you....take our worldly goods but lay a finger on our dogs and you'll be sorry is our attitude too.

We sold all our properties, commercial and residential and have no desire to ever own property again. We rent a large house we could never afford to buy and have the luxury of letting someone else worry about repairs. We did keep all our furniture and other goods and chattels as imo it helps make you feel more at home in rented property.

I used to commute to the UK from Prague and did for a couple of years when we moved here. It's doable but I have to say my flights and all expenses were paid for so I travelled in Business Class comfort...the main plus point of that not being the 'free' champagne but the fact that these are flexitickets so if your flight is cancelled or your meeting goes on longer than expected you don't lose your flight and need to book and pay for another. I flew BA but I think EasyJet now offer a similar kind of ticket so it may be worth investigating.

Good luck in your researches....weather here next week will be 42C plus....Norfolk, I understand from friends living there, is cold and damp...


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## Sirtravelot

When we were in Southern Alicante for 3 weeks we saw the police visiting houses a couple of times. What it was about - I don't know.

Robberies? Maybe. There's load of houses, some empty, some seasonally empty. I can imagine that you're likely to be robbed if you're the only person in your home in a street full of empty homes. 

We also saw some cops rounding up a party of illegal immigrants hiding in the bushes.

A friend of hours has also just equipped his home with surveillance cameras in his holiday home in Cuidad Quesada. He's not there all the time, so I suppose it makes sense. He can see his camera footage from his phone all the way in Scotland - ain't technology grand?

He says that the problem are all the eastern Europeans coming in and resorting to robbing. True? Not True? Who knows, but I'm sure you can make good money down there selling surveillance cameras, I'd imagine.

If worse comes to worst invest in a baseball bat!


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## mrypg9

Sirtravelot said:


> When we were in Southern Alicante for 3 weeks we saw the police visiting houses a couple of times. What it was about - I don't know.
> 
> Robberies? Maybe. There's load of houses, some empty, some seasonally empty. I can imagine that you're likely to be robbed if you're the only person in your home in a street full of empty homes.
> 
> We also saw some cops rounding up a party of illegal immigrants hiding in the bushes.
> 
> A friend of hours has also just equipped his home with surveillance cameras in his holiday home in Cuidad Quesada. He's not there all the time, so I suppose it makes sense. He can see his camera footage from his phone all the way in Scotland - ain't technology grand?
> 
> He says that the problem are all the eastern Europeans coming in and resorting to robbing. True? Not True? Who knows, but I'm sure you can make good money down there selling surveillance cameras, I'd imagine.
> 
> If worse comes to worst invest in a baseball bat!


I don't think there's much point in these surveillance cameras, especially if you don't live in the house. Most houses round here have them but it hasn't prevented them from being robbed.

It must be very frustrating to be sitting somewhere hundreds of miles away watching someone ransacking your house....by the time the local plods turn up the thieves will be far away with the loot, having of course changed their clothes and removed the scarves they used to conceal their faces.


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## 90199

Many here do not lock their doors, cars are left with the keys in the ignition and often the engines running, crime is almost non existent. 

House alarms are not needed, few have those awful iron bars on windows and doors.

It must be really boring being a Policeman................


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## extranjero

Hepa said:


> Many here do not lock their doors, cars are left with the keys in the ignition and often the engines running, crime is almost non existent.
> 
> House alarms are not needed, few have those awful iron bars on windows and doors.
> 
> It must be really boring being a Policeman................


Makes us all feel a lot better for knowing that!


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## gus-lopez

mrypg9 said:


> A friend who has lived in Spain for thirty years said that a policeman once told her to keep a gun in the house and if she apprehended a thief to shoot to kill then to dispose of the corpse in the sea with weights or in the campo......
> 
> I always think that 'Nada pasa' holds good....until 'pasa'.


Must be the same policemen here !


----------



## mrypg9

extranjero said:


> Makes us all feel a lot better for knowing that!



Before we were robbed we often went to bed leaving the house unlocked - we even left the garden door open. We don't now.

But no way am I going to allow fear of being robbed to spoil my life here.


----------



## Guest

*In Asturias...*



Sirtravelot said:


> He says that the problem are all the eastern Europeans coming in and resorting to robbing. True? Not True? Who knows...


We live in a long broad valley filled with farms that is located about 10 kilometers outside of Gijón, a rather large city for Northern Spain. Our one lane road has 2 farmhouses on it. The last few years has seen a number of "casas rurales" (chalets) being built in the lower parts of the valley... could be for getting away from the city or rental during the Summer. And, there have been burglaries in some of these homes when unoccupied. So far, no one actually living full-time on a farm has been burglarized.

I spoke with a neighbor and he opined that it was "rumanos", not "gitanos" doing the break-ins... the gypsies are well respected around here. A few days later a car drove up our road with 4 guys, and the moment they saw me the sped away... I don't have a clue where they came from, but I do suspect they were checking things out.

We keep our doors and windows locked at night and when we're away, but when we're home we know who is in the neighborhood.

We didn't lock our front doors when I was a kid in San Francisco in the late 40's and early 50's, but that changed in the 60's. Spanish friends my age tell me it was pretty much the same here up until the late 90's.


----------



## gus-lopez

Do what my friend does when going out. Drives off in one direction & reappears a short while later from the other.  
As his property stands alone & the roads lead to nowhere else everything except the bread delivery lady & articulated lorries (cabbage/lettuce collection ) is assumed to be suspicious.


----------



## gill556

just as we were congratulating ourselves as to how few burglaries we get now compared to when we moved in approx 10 years ago, we woke up yesterday morning to find there had been 11 robberies overnight and one gentleman who disturbed them was attacked. Never get complacent and always warn new people about security, I live alone and don't even think what might happen, everywhere suffers crime, just don't make it easy for them.


----------



## smurray

mrypg9 said:


> Crime certáinly has risen and it's not just 'villas' or homes of British immigrants that are targeted. But then, with unemployment at over 34% in some areas, it's only to be expected
> 
> In our supposedly affluent area every house has been broken into, including ours.
> 
> But I lived near Norwich nine years ago and I feel much safer here than
> I ever did in the UK.
> 
> Fear of crime is often greater than the likelihood of crime.



I'm sorry but I can't understand how anyone could be so blase about the whole neighbourhood (including yourself) getting broken into, that you fully expect to get burgled again, and then go on to say you still feel safer than you did in the UK. 

If burglaries were as common as this in my part of the UK (and it's not an affluent area by any stretch of the imagination), then I may be as nonchalant as you seem, but I do wonder if you would feel so positive and upbeat were it to have happened on your street in Norwich. I get the feeling that the levels of tolerance are different for some reason. Perhaps people feel the need to justify why they left and the eaasiest way to do that is to portray the UK as a 'broken' country. Thankfully as someone currently resident in the UK, I can assure you that this has yet to happen.

Oh, and one more thing, don't underestimate the impact a burglary can have on one's life. For many (probably most) it is a traumatic experience and the feeling of having been violated lingers long after the event. I know this from the experience of a work colleague who couldn't get over the fact that a stranger's hands had rummaged through all of her personal belongings. The thought of it makes me feel quite sick too.


----------



## Lolito

Real horror stories here! 

We don't really worry about it, because to be honest, if it is going to happen, it will happen, no matter what. 

We don't have 'rejillas' or 'alarms' and yes, I suppose we do have a few 'expensive' things. If the house was ours, we'd probably have an alarm system but since we are renting, we can't be bothered, we don't even have home contents insurance. 

However, we do go to the beach and leave things opens, like windows, or doors. The village is relatively small and nothing seems to ever happens. 

Maybe one day it will happen, but we can't live worrying about 'what if'... there are about 12 little 'villas' en the street and I think we all do pretty much the same. 

For what I have heard, it is mainly 'rumanians and bulgarians' doing the 'robbing', it is always too easy to blame the 'gitanos'. 

In saying this, I have never felt threatened here in Spain, in the UK, whenever I was walking back home on my own and on seeing a group of people 'hanging out' ... I always thought the worse and I was always too scare to cross the road as I didn't want to make it too obvious. 

You can't live in fear, enjoy your life in Spain, if they 'rob' you, it is all material things whether you can replace them or not... your life is much more important than a piano and a telescope.


----------



## kalohi

I'm wondering if you're getting an unbalanced view of how things are. I think people are more likely to jump in and post about being robbed than they are to jump in and post about nothing at all happening in their neighborhood. 

For what it's worth, we have never been robbed and in 20 years in this house there have only been one or two break-in's in the area. However we don't live in a villa so I guess we don't meet the criteria to answer your question. Our house is terraced and in a comfortable middle class ungated community 6 km outside of Seville. I feel very safe here, day or night. That said, we do take normal precautions such as locking the windows and doors at night and when we go out. There are iron bars on the windows as is the custom in Andalucia. We don't have an alarm system although a few of our neighbors do.


----------



## Aron

smurray said:


> I'm sorry but I can't understand how anyone could be so blase about the whole neighbourhood (including yourself) getting broken into, that you fully expect to get burgled again, and then go on to say you still feel safer than you did in the UK.
> 
> If burglaries were as common as this in my part of the UK (and it's not an affluent area by any stretch of the imagination), then I may be as nonchalant as you seem, but I do wonder if you would feel so positive and upbeat were it to have happened on your street in Norwich. I get the feeling that the levels of tolerance are different for some reason. Perhaps people feel the need to justify why they left and the eaasiest way to do that is to portray the UK as a 'broken' country. Thankfully as someone currently resident in the UK, I can assure you that this has yet to happen.
> 
> Oh, and one more thing, don't underestimate the impact a burglary can have on one's life. For many (probably most) it is a traumatic experience and the feeling of having been violated lingers long after the event. I know this from the experience of a work colleague who couldn't get over the fact that a stranger's hands had rummaged through all of her personal belongings. The thought of it makes me feel quite sick too.


I totally agree with your sentiments about the impact of being burgled, but you will not find on any of my posts that the UK is a broken country. I find that sort of remark quite absurd. All my family live in the UK and I enjoy going back to see them. I have lived in Spain for about 9 years. Ihave other family members who have lived here for 40 years. Me and my wife came to Spain fo many reasons, not one was because Britain was a bad country. The biggest benefit is, we can live a better life financially in Spain than the UK, but in no way is it broken.
As for the robberies, yes it is a concern, but lets not get paranoid about it. It is worse in the UK, but then the population is higher and more concentrated


----------



## smurray

Aron said:


> I totally agree with your sentiments about the impact of being burgled, but you will not find on any of my posts that the UK is a broken country. I find that sort of remark quite absurd. All my family live in the UK and I enjoy going back to see them. I have lived in Spain for about 9 years. Ihave other family members who have lived here for 40 years. Me and my wife came to Spain fo many reasons, not one was because Britain was a bad country. The biggest benefit is, we can live a better life financially in Spain than the UK, but in no way is it broken.
> As for the robberies, yes it is a concern, but lets not get paranoid about it. It is worse in the UK, but then the population is higher and more concentrated


Aron, I'm sorry if you were under the impression that I was referring to you in my rant. You are clearly of the balanced view that I would like to see more of. I did comment on a couple of mrypg9's posts because they didn't seem logical or fair to me. 

However my thoughts were based on a general feeling I get sometimes, while reading through postings on various expat forums, that some expats seem overly negative towards the UK and try to run it down at any given opportunity. Once again, I'm not referring to the Spain forum in particular, just an overall impression from certain posters across various forums.

I myself am hoping to relocate to Portugal in about 5 years. It's never too soon to do research and for that purpose, I value these forums greatly. My reasons for leaving the UK are also because I'd be better off financially but also because I want to enjoy a much more outdoors lifestyle. 

In my visits to Portugal I have already forged some friendships with the locals in the area I am likely to buy/build. Learning the language is next...or at least getting a head start before I'm there!


----------



## mrypg9

smurray said:


> I'm sorry but I can't understand how anyone could be so blase about the whole neighbourhood (including yourself) getting broken into, that you fully expect to get burgled again, and then go on to say you still feel safer than you did in the UK.
> 
> If burglaries were as common as this in my part of the UK (and it's not an affluent area by any stretch of the imagination), then I may be as nonchalant as you seem, but I do wonder if you would feel so positive and upbeat were it to have happened on your street in Norwich. I get the feeling that the levels of tolerance are different for some reason. Perhaps people feel the need to justify why they left and the eaasiest way to do that is to portray the UK as a 'broken' country. Thankfully as someone currently resident in the UK, I can assure you that this has yet to happen.
> 
> Oh, and one more thing, don't underestimate the impact a burglary can have on one's life. For many (probably most) it is a traumatic experience and the feeling of having been violated lingers long after the event. I know this from the experience of a work colleague who couldn't get over the fact that a stranger's hands had rummaged through all of her personal belongings. The thought of it makes me feel quite sick too.



We've been burgled many times in the UK. I too have had my personal things rummaged through. The result was to send me out to buy some more respectable underwear, after seeing my old and tatty bras and knickers strewn over the bedroom floor.. I have also had scumbags try to mug me five times. I may be no spring chicken but I fight back. I certainly did not see myself as 'violated'. Rape is a violation, not having a few hundred euro and an IPod stolen. 
I have no intention of adding a 'ruined' life to the list of items stolen.
Neither have I any need to 'justify' my decision to leave the UK. For the record, I do think the UK is in a bad way and yes, it is broken and ineptly run, rotten from the top down. It seems every institution, whether the police, the NHS, Parliament, the banks, the BBC is either hopelessly inefficient or corrupt or both. But I also see evidence of these things in many countries and there are very many good and positive things about the UK.

If I'm going to 'feel sick' about anything it would be about starving children, mistreated people and animals, illegal and pointless wars and the incompetent bunch of politicians who are now in charge of the destinies of the UK and Spain.

Being robbed of jewelry, silverware etc. isn't good, true. But to allow the thief to rob your peace of mind...no way.


----------



## mrypg9

smurray said:


> You are clearly of the balanced view that I would like to see more of. I did comment on a couple of mrypg9's posts because they didn't seem logical or fair to me.
> 
> QUOTE]
> 
> 
> There is no balanced view in this. You either are bothered by burglaries to the point where it would send you home or prevent you coming or you are not. I'm not.
> 
> Where's the lack of logic? And you can search every post I have made on this Forum and you will not find a single one where I 'run down' the UK.
> 
> I have always been balanced and fair in my comments on the UK. No way do I wish to return but that is my personal preference. That's all.


----------



## smurray

mrypg9 said:


> We've been burgled many times in the UK. I too have had my personal things rummaged through. The result was to send me out to buy some more respectable underwear, after seeing my old and tatty bras and knickers strewn over the bedroom floor.. I have also had scumbags try to mug me five times. I may be no spring chicken but I fight back. I certainly did not see myself as 'violated'. Rape is a violation, not having a few hundred euro and an IPod stolen.
> I have no intention of adding a 'ruined' life to the list of items stolen.
> Neither have I any need to 'justify' my decision to leave the UK. For the record, I do think the UK is in a bad way and yes, it is broken and ineptly run, rotten from the top down. It seems every institution, whether the police, the NHS, Parliament, the banks, the BBC is either hopelessly inefficient or corrupt or both. But I also see evidence of these things in many countries and there are very many good and positive things about the UK.
> 
> If I'm going to 'feel sick' about anything it would be about starving children, mistreated people and animals, illegal and pointless wars and the incompetent bunch of politicians who are now in charge of the destinies of the UK and Spain.
> 
> Being robbed of jewelry, silverware etc. isn't good, true. But to allow the thief to rob your peace of mind...no way.


Well if you are able to shrug it off so easily then more power to you (and I genuinely mean this) but I guess having been burgled so many times, you will inevitably become hardened to it. Perhaps most people would, but I'm sure the first time it happens it must be devastating and not everyone has the strength of character to move on so quickly from it, especially those who live alone. By the way, I too feel sick about starving children, mistreated people and animals, corrupt politicians etc etc, but it doesn't change the fact that I would feel violated at someone invading my personal 'space' and belongings.

I didn't realise that you had been burgled many times in the UK too so I'm sorry if you mentioned that previously and I missed it. I have to be honest, my first reaction was that you are either very unlucky or not very careful (ie leaving keys in doors being a case in point). As I assumed that not all of your neighbours in Norwich had been burgled, I thought it reasonable to also assume that someone would feel safer there than in Spain where each and every one of your neighbours had been burgled. 

Although I quoted you I wasn't really singling you out as someone who had 'run the UK down'. However you have pretty much said the UK is broken anyway. These institutions that you mention are certainly inefficient, I'll give you that, and yes, of course, there is corruption, but on balance I do believe that you can find examples of inefficiency and corruption in almost every institution in every country, and in many cases far worse than the UK. 

In my personal view we take too much for granted in the UK. I have a large number of friends who have come from many different parts of the world to live and work/study in the UK and, although there are most definitely challenges, they all say that what they like most about living here is that, for the most part, things actually WORK.


----------



## mrypg9

smurray said:


> Well if you are able to shrug it off so easily then more power to you (and I genuinely mean this) but I guess having been burgled so many times, you will inevitably become hardened to it. Perhaps most people would, but I'm sure the first time it happens it must be devastating and not everyone has the strength of character to move on so quickly from it, especially those who live alone. By the way, I too feel sick about starving children, mistreated people and animals, corrupt politicians etc etc, but it doesn't change the fact that I would feel violated at someone invading my personal 'space' and belongings.
> 
> I didn't realise that you had been burgled many times in the UK too so I'm sorry if you mentioned that previously and I missed it. I have to be honest, my first reaction was that you are either very unlucky or not very careful (ie leaving keys in doors being a case in point). As I assumed that not all of your neighbours in Norwich had been burgled, I thought it reasonable to also assume that someone would feel safer there than in Spain where each and every one of your neighbours had been burgled.
> 
> Although I quoted you I wasn't really singling you out as someone who had 'run the UK down'. However you have pretty much said the UK is broken anyway. These institutions that you mention are certainly inefficient, I'll give you that, and yes, of course, there is corruption, but on balance I do believe that you can find examples of inefficiency and corruption in almost every institution in every country, and in many cases far worse than the UK.
> 
> In my personal view we take too much for granted in the UK. I have a large number of friends who have come from many different parts of the world to live and work/study in the UK and, although there are most definitely challenges, they all say that what they like most about living here is that, for the most part, things actually WORK.


Yes, that's true. I wouldn't dispute that. The only country I've spent much time in where things work better than the UK is Germany but I wouldn't like to live there full-time.
I didn't live in Norwich but know it well. The streets on a Saturday night/Sunday morning can resemble a zoo with drunken people all over the shop....There's certainly more violent street attacks in the UK than in my part of Spain. I felt safer wandering round New York after dark than in my home town in the UK.
We were first broken into when I lived in North London, in Muswell Hill. Then when we moved to East Anglia we had several break-ins in our business premises. When we lived in Prague we were targets for muggings as our clothes, hair etc. gave us away as foreigners and many Czechs seem to think all foreigners are wealthy...I wish... We always fought back and as most muggings there are non-violent we were the ones who did the damage, usually with a sharp upward movement of knee to testicles accompanied by vile Czech and English curses.

You're quite right, there's much more corruption in places such as Spain and the Czech Republic where corruption is as normal as breathing. But it seems to me that the UK is currently going through a very bad period with an almost total lack of confidence in institutions of which we were once rightly so proud.

We visited Portugal from Spain a couple of times, we stayed in a delightful village in the Alentejo, an hour across the border with Spain. The people were so friendly and the village was totally unspoilt although very poor. We went there on the recommendation of our dental nurse here in Spain who hails from those parts and we just loved it.
Where are you planning to go?


----------



## StevejR1

Trying to bring a balance back to the thread....

I think you have to take all things in perspective. For instance...

..I live in Norwich, burglaries happen, so you have to be careful...but the concern is low, but you take sensible precautions. That is not too much of a concern.

...I live in Norwich, houses around me are occasionally being burgled...I'm starting to get concerned now, increase my security, and it is beginning to worry me that I'm at risk.

...I live in Norwich, I've been burgled, the houses all around me have been burgled, and I expect to be burgled again....now this is an issue! I'm more than concerned, I'm worried, and I'm going to dread leaving my house unguarded, and I would most likely be trying to move.

I'm fortunate in that I live in scenario number one...I certainly wouldn't want to move to Spain to encounter scenario number 3!! It would negate a lot of the reasons for moving out there.
I'm not saying all of Spain is like that, or most areas, but in a way it is sad that there are any areas like that at all.

As regards the UK being broken....

I work nationwide, so see a broad scope of the UK. I also work in London a lot. The UK has undoubtably declined considerably during the world recession, it would be silly to try to dispute it.
Cut backs, overcrowding, and unemployment, has taken its toll..just like I'm sure it has in Spain.
I'm lucky in that I live in a nice place like Norwich..it has it's rough spots, it has crime, but on the whole it's a good part of the world. But I've also seen how nationwide the infrastructure is starting to decay...roads in decline, empty shops etc etc. I recently visited Hatfield, a place that was considered posh when I was a boy, and it was scary to see the decline it has gone through. I'm sure it's the same in areas of Liverpool, Birmingham, manchester, etc.

But all in all the UK is still a relatively stable country, and not under any immediate threat...yet.

Just my opinion of course 

So really my initial question was to find out about whether Andalucia was considered a low risk area for burglaries. My research had shown that burglaries were on the increase, and it concerned me. Like I've said, I wouldn't want to switch from scenario one, to scenario three...

If I lived in my villa, took reasonable precautions, and didn't leave doors open, keys in cars etc, I'd like to feel that I was living in a low risk environment. I don't think that is unreasonable?


----------



## smurray

mrypg9 said:


> Yes, that's true. I wouldn't dispute that. The only country I've spent much time in where things work better than the UK is Germany but I wouldn't like to live there full-time.
> I didn't live in Norwich but know it well. The streets on a Saturday night/Sunday morning can resemble a zoo with drunken people all over the shop....There's certainly more violent street attacks in the UK than in my part of Spain. I felt safer wandering round New York after dark than in my home town in the UK.
> We were first broken into when I lived in North London, in Muswell Hill. Then when we moved to East Anglia we had several break-ins in our business premises. When we lived in Prague we were targets for muggings as our clothes, hair etc. gave us away as foreigners and many Czechs seem to think all foreigners are wealthy...I wish... We always fought back and as most muggings there are non-violent we were the ones who did the damage, usually with a sharp upward movement of knee to testicles accompanied by vile Czech and English curses.
> 
> You're quite right, there's much more corruption in places such as Spain and the Czech Republic where corruption is as normal as breathing. But it seems to me that the UK is currently going through a very bad period with an almost total lack of confidence in institutions of which we were once rightly so proud.
> 
> We visited Portugal from Spain a couple of times, we stayed in a delightful village in the Alentejo, an hour across the border with Spain. The people were so friendly and the village was totally unspoilt although very poor. We went there on the recommendation of our dental nurse here in Spain who hails from those parts and we just loved it.
> Where are you planning to go?


I'm beginning to think that you are just downright unlucky!  

I got up very early one morning in Prague to take some pics without the crowds around and found myself challenged by a guy with nunchakus. He said I took a pic of him without his permission (even though I didn't) and so he wanted my camera to erase it. Of course, he just happened to be swinging nunchakas around at the time :boxing: I got out of that by point blank refusing and walking quickly away and he didn't bother me after that!

You hit the nail on the head with one of the major challenges that I think currently faces the youth of today in the UK and that is excessive binge-drinking on the streets. It's no surprise to learn that this is not as much of an issue in Spain (unless it's us Brits on the Costas!) because the southern Europeans simply know how to drink. They pace themselves well and remain content through the wee hours of the morning whereas here, if you're not inebriated by 10pm there's something wrong.

I quite agree that there is currently a real lack of confidence in institutions in the UK and I do share that feeling. The police in particular have recently been rocked by one scandal after another. However, I work in one of those institutions (the NHS) and although I know it leaves a lot to be desired, I still feel lucky that we have it. I can only speak for those that I work alongside in the lab (we are not front line) but I see a lot of passion and dedication there. Research is first class and so I find it hard to believe it's rotten from top to bottom. The problem, as in most cases, is poor management making poor decisions about things they know nothing about.

I'm planning on going to Central Portugal, specifically near Coja in the municipality of Arganil (Coimbra district). I already have a plot there, it's just a matter of paying off the mortgage here and building something over there. I'm working on a 5-6 year timeframe at the moment. The area is more rural and stunningly beautiful with mountains, valleys and forests. I've befriended a Portuguese family over there and stay with them whenever I'm in the area and they have been a mine of information. I have the utmost respect for those old couples who work the land as they have done their whole lives. We don't know what hard work is! 

Funnily enough, this is my dream, to get my hands dirty and live off the land. At least I know who to ask for some handy tips!!


----------



## smurray

Steve.R said:


> Trying to bring a balance back to the thread....
> 
> I think you have to take all things in perspective. For instance...
> 
> ..I live in Norwich, burglaries happen, so you have to be careful...but the concern is low, but you take sensible precautions. That is not too much of a concern.
> 
> ...I live in Norwich, houses around me are occasionally being burgled...I'm starting to get concerned now, increase my security, and it is beginning to worry me that I'm at risk.
> 
> ...I live in Norwich, I've been burgled, the houses all around me have been burgled, and I expect to be burgled again....now this is an issue! I'm more than concerned, I'm worried, and I'm going to dread leaving my house unguarded, and I would most likely be trying to move.
> 
> I'm fortunate in that I live in scenario number one...I certainly wouldn't want to move to Spain to encounter scenario number 3!! It would negate a lot of the reasons for moving out there.
> I'm not saying all of Spain is like that, or most areas, but in a way it is sad that there are any areas like that at all.
> 
> As regards the UK being broken....
> 
> I work nationwide, so see a broad scope of the UK. I also work in London a lot. The UK has undoubtably declined considerably during the world recession, it would be silly to try to dispute it.
> Cut backs, overcrowding, and unemployment, has taken its toll..just like I'm sure it has in Spain.
> I'm lucky in that I live in a nice place like Norwich..it has it's rough spots, it has crime, but on the whole it's a good part of the world. But I've also seen how nationwide the infrastructure is starting to decay...roads in decline, empty shops etc etc. I recently visited Hatfield, a place that was considered posh when I was a boy, and it was scary to see the decline it has gone through. I'm sure it's the same in areas of Liverpool, Birmingham, manchester, etc.
> 
> But all in all the UK is still a relatively stable country, and not under any immediate threat...yet.
> 
> Just my opinion of course
> 
> So really my initial question was to find out about whether Andalucia was considered a low risk area for burglaries. My research had shown that burglaries were on the increase, and it concerned me. Like I've said, I wouldn't want to switch from scenario one, to scenario three...
> 
> If I lived in my villa, took reasonable precautions, and didn't leave doors open, keys in cars etc, I'd like to feel that I was living in a low risk environment. I don't think that is unreasonable?


Agree with much of what you say. I live in a part of London that from the outside many would say was scenario 3 but from the inside I feel it's relatively safe and it's scenario 1. 

Thankfully, where I'm heading in Portugal doesn't even rank on that scale, village life where crime is minimal.


----------



## jimenato

Well I knew exactly what he meant :fingerscrossed: but just in case someone doesn't...


----------



## mrypg9

smurray said:


> I'm beginning to think that you are just downright unlucky!
> 
> I got up very early one morning in Prague to take some pics without the crowds around and found myself challenged by a guy with nunchakus. He said I took a pic of him without his permission (even though I didn't) and so he wanted my camera to erase it. Of course, he just happened to be swinging nunchakas around at the time :boxing: I got out of that by point blank refusing and walking quickly away and he didn't bother me after that!
> 
> You hit the nail on the head with one of the major challenges that I think currently faces the youth of today in the UK and that is excessive binge-drinking on the streets. It's no surprise to learn that this is not as much of an issue in Spain (unless it's us Brits on the Costas!) because the southern Europeans simply know how to drink. They pace themselves well and remain content through the wee hours of the morning whereas here, if you're not inebriated by 10pm there's something wrong.
> 
> I quite agree that there is currently a real lack of confidence in institutions in the UK and I do share that feeling. The police in particular have recently been rocked by one scandal after another. However, I work in one of those institutions (the NHS) and although I know it leaves a lot to be desired, I still feel lucky that we have it. I can only speak for those that I work alongside in the lab (we are not front line) but I see a lot of passion and dedication there. Research is first class and so I find it hard to believe it's rotten from top to bottom. The problem, as in most cases, is poor management making poor decisions about things they know nothing about.
> 
> I'm planning on going to Central Portugal, specifically near Coja in the municipality of Arganil (Coimbra district). I already have a plot there, it's just a matter of paying off the mortgage here and building something over there. I'm working on a 5-6 year timeframe at the moment. The area is more rural and stunningly beautiful with mountains, valleys and forests. I've befriended a Portuguese family over there and stay with them whenever I'm in the area and they have been a mine of information. I have the utmost respect for those old couples who work the land as they have done their whole lives. We don't know what hard work is!
> 
> Funnily enough, this is my dream, to get my hands dirty and live off the land. At least I know who to ask for some handy tips!!


No, I don't think we were that unlucky, as pickpocketing, mugging and house break-ins are quite common in the Czech Republic. I used to visit regularly when it was a 'people's republic' before the Velvet Revolution and street crime was virtually unknown. We lived there for three years and the landlord of the house we rented had a cottage which had been broken into ten times! He eventually gave up and sold it.

It's quite true that it's poor management and decisions made by people who know little if anything of the institutions they run. True also for education as well as the NHS. As for the latest NHS reforms....

Your project sounds idyllic. Good luck with it. If you get the chance, try to visit a little village called Moura...


----------



## mrypg9

Steve.R;
If I lived in my villa said:


> Ahh...well, we did leave the house more or less open, keys in back door, no alarm etc. The intruders didn't need to damage anything to get in, just give the doors to one of the upper terraces a good shove...
> 
> Our neighbours who were burgled at 8.45 p.m. one evening - we didn't hear a thing, just the anguished shrieks of Mrs. Manolo when she found her jewelry had been nicked - didn't have persilianas -metal shutters - or rejas - bars over windows and doors.
> 
> Now we've been burgled once in four years. None of my neighbours is that bothered about future break-ins. They take all possible precautions and get on with their lives. They can't ****** off to Leamington Spa or wherever....
> 
> We don't really have anything that worth stealing, tbh. We don't keep cash in the house and I hide anything small that I don't want to lose: notebook, IPad, IPod etc.
> 
> Practically every British immigrant I know has been either burgled or robbed in the street. Yesterday we were with a friend when her mobile rang, a call from a friend whose handbag had been stolen. But then, she had left it in her car with the window down because of the heat....
> 
> When you are living in a province with the highest unemployment figures in Spain, over 34%, an increase in crime is only to be expected.
> Just as crime in the UK has increased since the 1980s when Mrs. Thatcher implemented her neo-liberal policies, with no chsnge when New Labour took over and followed the same course.


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## smurray

mrypg9 said:


> No, I don't think we were that unlucky, as pickpocketing, mugging and house break-ins are quite common in the Czech Republic. I used to visit regularly when it was a 'people's republic' before the Velvet Revolution and street crime was virtually unknown. We lived there for three years and the landlord of the house we rented had a cottage which had been broken into ten times! He eventually gave up and sold it.
> 
> It's quite true that it's poor management and decisions made by people who know little if anything of the institutions they run. True also for education as well as the NHS. As for the latest NHS reforms....
> 
> Your project sounds idyllic. Good luck with it. If you get the chance, try to visit a little village called Moura...


Yes, those NHS reforms. Don't even get me started.... 

But thank you for the recommendation, I will definitely look that one up.


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## gus-lopez

jimenato said:


> Well I knew exactly what he meant :fingerscrossed: but just in case someone doesn't...


another item on the banned list in the UK.


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