# Driving to Mexico (Summer of 2013)



## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

Okay -

This is the first time in 3 or 4 years that we will be driving down into Mexico. We used to go almost every year to visit family in Tampico & Veracruz, but we became concerned about the violence along the route we would take, starting at Brownsville/Matamoros. If we could afford to fly the whole family, we would have continued going - but we've also always enjoyed the freedom & convenience of exploring with our own vehicle once down there.

To that end, I'd like some advice & observations of the current situation for traveling & driving in Mexico. Here are some of my concerns & questions:

What paperwork is best & more easily transacted at the local consulate before traveling? (We live close to the Little Rock consulate in Arkansas)

Is there a particular vehicle or color that is preferable so as not to attract undo attention or interest? We have a 99 GMC Suburban that we have driven many times down there. However, because of its make - and its *BLACK* color, I'm concerned about being wrongly perceived by BOTH the police & the carteleros. Would you recommend a change of color - and/or a complete change of vehicle?

How is the route from Brownsville, through Tampico down to Veracruz? Our concern for violence was more near the border and around Tampico. Once we got further south we saw a few military checkpoints, but there seemed to be less concern for violence. Is there a better, safer route recommended?

We plan to spend the summer in Taxco after visiting family in Queretaro & Veracruz. The Cuernavaca/Taxco area was hot in the news a couple of years ago... have things settled down there? One thing I appreciated in Taxco was a lot of security because of the silver businesses there. I hope that continues to make for a safer experience.

I understand, from all I've read, that the perception up here as shaped by the news can be extreme & misdirected. I'd rather hear from the folks actually living down there openly as Expatriots & Gringos. We hope to make our own move to Mexico in a couple of years, so we are wanting to get more attuned to who our neighbors & mentors will be.

Thanks, in advance for all of your input...


Dan


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

Ive been here next door to the state of Tampico most of the time for 4 1/2 years and my wife´s relatives visit from the City of Tampico often. We get news on the TV and radio of our neighboring states. As far as I can tell if you were there 4 years ago it is ebb and flow but basically the same today as the last time you were around. Veracruz I am guessing is a bit better than 3 years ago. 

When you go I bet you will not notice anything different except maybe they had not built the machine gun turrets entering and exiting almost every town and every city in Veracruz state and stop vehicles to check them. Military, municipal police, state police and federal police man these different checkpoints when I was there in July. 

As a matter of fact it was in every state in the Yucatan Penninsula, Tabasco and the state of Veracruz and even Chiapas had a few, where these were set up. Alan


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## FHBOY (Jun 15, 2010)

AlanMexicali said:


> Ive been here next door to the state of Tampico most of the time for 4 1/2 years and my wife´s relatives visit from the City of Tampico often. We get news on the TV and radio of our neighboring states. As far as I can tell if you were there 4 years ago it is ebb and flow but basically the same today as the last time you were around, Veracruz I am guessing is a bit better that 3 years ago.
> 
> When you go I bet you will not notice anything different except maybe they had not built the machine gun turits entering and exiting almost every town and every city in Veracruz state and stop vehicles to check them. Military, municipal police, state police and federal police man these different checkpoints when I was there in July.
> 
> As a matter of fact it was in every state in the Yucatan Penninsula, Tabasco and the state of Veracruz and even Chiapas had a few, where these were set up. Alan


THREAD HIJACK ALERT!!!!!
Hey AM: Did you know that even here in Lakeside, we now have "turrets"? They built two, together with amazing topes between Ajijic and San Juan Cosala, and are allegedly building an army barracks to go with them. How do I feel about it? Doesn't matter one way or the other, except the topes are way too high!!

:focus:


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

FHBOY said:


> THREAD HIJACK ALERT!!!!!
> Hey AM: Did you know that even here in Lakeside, we now have "turrets"? They built two, together with amazing topes between Ajijic and San Juan Cosala, and are allegedly building an army barracks to go with them. How do I feel about it? Doesn't matter one way or the other, except the topes are way too high!!
> 
> :focus:


I read they are brand new and shiny still. I see where they are following the standard style and on the highway entering and exiting your towns/villages. We see sandbag turrets in places but out trip through the Yucatan Penninsula is the first cement ones we saw both entering and exiting most populated towns and all cities. Alan


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

We never drive beween Lake Chapala and the northern border with the U.S. so cannot addess that issue but, several times a year we drive between Lake Chapala and San Cristobal de Las Casas, Chiapas, a distance of some 1500 kilometers one way and we also frequently drive from San Cristobal to Oaxaca State, the Yucatan Peninsula, Puebla State, Tabasco and, recently from Chiapas to Guatamala and Honduras and we have experienced no problems whatsoever except for some road closures due to washouts.

That does not mean that you will not experience problems as this is the luck of the draw but, then, in my native town of Mobile, Alabama, they will cut out your guts for access to your accumulated Walmart points so they can buy a kilo of jellybeans. A beautiful but nasty place. You will not get out of here alive so have some fun while you are here.


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

Hmmm... sounds encouraging so far! How about our vehicle or its color? 

Also, as a side note - last year my cuñado moved his family from Tampico to Queretaro because of concerns with the violence & peligro there. His daughter got a job there upon graduating college, loved it and sold the rest of her family on the idea of relocating. I guess we won't be making a stop in Tampico anymore!




Dan


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

I have heard the Zetas like black SUVs and the Gulf Cartel likes white ones but I would not worry about a vehicle of the 90's, a new Escalade or Benz SUVs would be more to their liking.......


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

Thanks for your reply!!



chicois8 said:


> ...but I would not worry about a vehicle of the 90's


So you think I'd be okay with my '99, even though it's a black Suburban?

I can appreciate the comment above about "the luck of the draw" but I'd like to lessen those chances where possible... hence questions about painting it, or changing vehicles altogether.


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## conklinwh (Dec 19, 2009)

Howler said:


> Thanks for your reply!!
> 
> So you think I'd be okay with my '99, even though it's a black Suburban?
> 
> I can appreciate the comment above about "the luck of the draw" but I'd like to lessen those chances where possible... hence questions about painting it, or changing vehicles altogether.


I have a 2010 black Honda Pilot which probably not the best color so I let it get real dirty before border trips. I drive the route through Tamaulipas but prefer crossing at Harlingen/Los Indios to Matamoros. This takes me through Valle Hermoso where I merge with 180 at the new Aduana stop.
I don't take the Tampico cutoff but rather continue to and around Ciudad Victoria where the new cuotas merge with hwy 57 north of San Luis Potosi. We live about halfway between SLP and Queretaro.

Will be heading north next Thursday although may go to Laredo as we might have a package of prescriptions there. We definitely will do the Harlingen/Los Indios crossing on our return, 12 May.


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

conklinwh said:


> I have a 2010 black Honda Pilot which probably not the best color so I let it get real dirty before border trips. I drive the route through Tamaulipas but prefer crossing at Harlingen/Los Indios to Matamoros. This takes me through Valle Hermoso where I merge with 180 at the new Aduana stop.
> I don't take the Tampico cutoff but rather continue to and around Ciudad Victoria where the new cuotas merge with hwy 57 north of San Luis Potosi. We live about halfway between SLP and Queretaro.
> 
> Will be heading north next Thursday although may go to Laredo as we might have a package of prescriptions there. We definitely will do the Harlingen/Los Indios crossing on our return, 12 May.


Great reply!!

I'm feeling a little more comfortable with taking the Suburban, but am still on the fence about painting it a neutral grey. 

The route you cited is the one I've been plotting for our trip to stop in Queretaro with my cuñado. Along with avoiding Tampico, I'd rather go around Cd. Victoria, too. We were just talking about crossing at Harlingen instead of Matamoros where we usually cross. I guess night time driving is out, PERIOD.

Good Luck & keep in touch...


Dan


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Howler said:


> Great reply!!
> 
> I'm feeling a little more comfortable with taking the Suburban, but am still on the fence about painting it a neutral grey.
> 
> ...


Opinions are not worth much, but if I were in your shoes I would go ahead and repaint. I would not want to drive a large, black SUV or pickup in Mexico. However, l see lots of them and I am sure most of the owners have no problem. My neighbor has one red and one black SUV, for himself and his wife. To me they just seem like they attract too much attention, occasionally of the wrong kind. The fact that it is not new helps. If it were dented and rusty that might help even more.


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## conklinwh (Dec 19, 2009)

Howler said:


> Great reply!!
> 
> I'm feeling a little more comfortable with taking the Suburban, but am still on the fence about painting it a neutral grey.
> 
> ...


Period and exclamation point! Not sure why you would need to drive at night. We try to cross by 8AM and even with normally 3 stops, we arrive Pozos 4-4:30PM. Since you would continue on 57 to QRO would only be about 45min more.


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

TundraGreen said:


> If it were dented and rusty that might help even more.


Now don't go giving my kids any ideas for "my protection"...


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

conklinwh said:


> Period and exclamation point! Not sure why you would need to drive at night. We try to cross by 8AM and even with normally 3 stops, we arrive Pozos 4-4:30PM. Since you would continue on 57 to QRO would only be about 45min more.


We haven't traveled that route before. This will be the first time to cross somewhere else besides Brownsville or Laredo. We last crossed Laredo back in '89, so Matamoros has been our main point of reference for crossing the border, aduana, restaurants, hotels & stores, etc. over the last 20+ years.

In the past we would cross at Brownsville as the last possible point for US gas & closest to Veracruz from the border; from there Tampico was always a stop for a day or two with my wife's brother. Unless we were too tired to continue, evenings/nights were less of a hassle getting through customs & I liked the clear roads for driving - especially as most of the topes disappeared & the roads improved in that area. However, I've heard the possibility of crime has picked up substantially over the past several years - especially if you're traveling in a lone vehicle. I'll miss the nights when I only had to worry about a stray vaca or burro in the road.

Another thing is that we hardly ever took cuotas because there weren't many in our areas of travel or they were expensive. I've heard they are getting better all the time & make for quick safe travel during the daylight hours (plus our travel budget is a lot better these days). We're pretty excited to drive & explore a different route that will take us through areas we haven't seen before - especially Queretaro! Hope to see you (safely) on the road!!


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

A thought:
Since your wife and child(ren) are Mexican citizens and you plan to live and travel in Mexico, why not sell that Suburban in the USA and purchase a replacement vehicle in Mexico; perhaps in DF or in a state where you are likely to settle? That would avoid the problem of the Suburban and allow you to choose a more appropriate vehicle. Of course, the Mexican plates would draw less attention from the transitos, as well. An added advantage is the avoidance of the deposit, temporary import fee and such. Once you settle in, you will probably become a Mexican citizen in a couple of years, making the ownership or even driving of a foreign plated vehicle impossible anyway.


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## conklinwh (Dec 19, 2009)

Howler said:


> We haven't traveled that route before. This will be the first time to cross somewhere else besides Brownsville or Laredo. We last crossed Laredo back in '89, so Matamoros has been our main point of reference for crossing the border, aduana, restaurants, hotels & stores, etc. over the last 20+ years.
> 
> In the past we would cross at Brownsville as the last possible point for US gas & closest to Veracruz from the border; from there Tampico was always a stop for a day or two with my wife's brother. Unless we were too tired to continue, evenings/nights were less of a hassle getting through customs & I liked the clear roads for driving - especially as most of the topes disappeared & the roads improved in that area. However, I've heard the possibility of crime has picked up substantially over the past several years - especially if you're traveling in a lone vehicle. I'll miss the nights when I only had to worry about a stray vaca or burro in the road
> 
> Another thing is that we hardly ever took cuotas because there weren't many in our areas of travel or they were expensive. I've heard they are getting better all the time & make for quick safe travel during the daylight hours (plus our travel budget is a lot better these days). We're pretty excited to drive & explore a different route that will take us through areas we haven't seen before - especially Queretaro! Hope to see you (safely) on the road!!


Harlingen/Los Indios is a lot more remote than Matamoros and more limited hours for immigration and banjercito. Believe 9-6 Mon-Fri, 9-4 Sat and closed Sunday. Border crossing much better hours.

I must admit we "cheat" a little in that we want to cross by 8AM. Therefore I cross the afternoon before and do paperwork. Then return to Harlingen for our favorite dinner place.
Yes I do know that this not quite legal and there is a risk if an accident or car stolen before we recross.

Anyway, we get cheap gas in Harlingen as well as pack sandwiches. We then drive straight to the bypass around Ciudad Victoria where we stop for banos and gas. We then head up into the mountains on the bypass. There is a place with picnic tables where we sometimes stop but next stop is south of Ciudad Victoria(Around Tula I believe) for banos and gas.
We then continue taking the new cuota extension toward San Luis Potosi.
Our last stop is the very good rest area at the toll booth on the SLP bypass. From there a little over an hour to Pozos and I expect about 2 hours to Qro.


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

RVGRINGO said:


> A thought: ...why not sell that Suburban in the USA and purchase a replacement vehicle in Mexico; perhaps in DF or in a state where you are likely to settle?


We've already considered doing that anyway when we actually move down there in a year or two. 

We're driving down this year for our first visit in several years, to check out retirement possibilities and so our daughter can take an advanced Spanish course in Taxco for some college credit. For right now, the Suburban is all we've got for long distance travel. It has also been the same vehicle to take us down & back on at least 6 or 7 other trips we've made as far south as Acapulco & Pinotepa Nacional. It will be hard to get rid of it when the time comes :sad:

BTW - Back in the day, Mexican vehicles used to be terribly built & quite expensive - hence a preference for ex-US vehicles. Has that changed? What about the importation of US vehicles - is that still permitted by the government? Used to, older vehicles were fine then it changed to a preference for trucks. Would it be against the law for an ex-pat to buy one of these imported vehicles, once settled in Mexico?

Just curious...


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

conklinwh said:


> I must admit we "cheat" a little in that we want to cross by 8AM. Therefore I cross the afternoon before and do paperwork. Then return to Harlingen for our favorite dinner place.


When we did something similar, we had a favorite hotel we've stayed at in Matamoros over the years as a way of getting a fresh start in the morning (either coming or going). Anything similar in Indios?

The reason we ended up doing it that way, is that the hotel was way cheaper on the Mexican side, was secure & closer to places to eat or shop. It also saved us from having to go through the lines or be searched again upon re-crossing the bridge.

Otherwise, it looks like you've got the rest of my trip planned for me down our first stop in Queretaro!! 


Thanks!!


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Expats cannot sell their vehicles in Mexico, nor is it practical to nationalize them. So, once you make your move, plan on buying a vehicle in Mexico and having to remove any temporarily imported vehicle from the country.
You might be surprised to find that a large percentage of American vehicles are actually built in Mexico, which is part of America, if not part of the USA. You have probably heard the phrase, ^Made right here in North America^, which many misinterpret to mean Made in the USA.
Since Mexico now exports so many vehicles, of US and Japanese brands, to the USA, the importation of US or Canadian vehicles to Mexico is no longer practical; at the moment, nearly impossible, expensive and frequently with forged documents landing the importer in jail and the vehicle confiscated. It is not worth considering, in my opinion. At the moment, we sit on the fence with one US and one Jalisco plated vehicle and a house for sale. What to do? We hit our cut-off for the US plated vehicle in two years; maybe sooner.
So, no, you should not consider buying a vehicle from an expat unless it already has Mexican plates. Even then, if once imported, it may be considered a chocolate and insurance can be difficult to get beyond basic liability.


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## conklinwh (Dec 19, 2009)

Howler said:


> When we did something similar, we had a favorite hotel we've stayed at in Matamoros over the years as a way of getting a fresh start in the morning (either coming or going). Anything similar in Indios?
> 
> The reason we ended up doing it that way, is that the hotel was way cheaper on the Mexican side, was secure & closer to places to eat or shop. It also saved us from having to go through the lines or be searched again upon re-crossing the bridge.
> 
> ...


There is nothing at Los Indios. We had friends that used to stop at a place in Valle Hermosa but even they have now started staying in Harlingen.
You can actually get places very reasonable there.


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

Wow! I thought you were allowed to keep at least one vehicle upon moving to Mexico... I'm not sure, now, if that was for living temporarily vs permanently there.



RVGRINGO said:


> You might be surprised to find that a large percentage of American vehicles are actually built in Mexico


Regarding expense & quality I was referring to the vehicles made in Mexico for Mexicans vs vehicles made for export to the US.



> We hit our cut-off for the US plated vehicle in two years; maybe sooner.


So how long are you permitted to have a US plated vehicle once you settle down there? If you can't sell it, down there - are you allowed to trade it in on a purchase of a Mexican vehicle?

Thanks for all the "food for thought" on this issue!


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

A person on a Residente Temporal must convert to Residente Permanente after 4 years, or leave the country. Once a Residente Permanente, the foreign plated vehicle must be gone from Mexico.
No, you cannot trade in a foreign plated vehicle; that would be a sale. You cannot give it away or sell it for parts. The car crushers will not take it either. It has to go.
As the spouse of a Mexican, you will probably convert to naturalized Mexicah citizenshp after only two years. I sure would!
You can drive a Mexican plated car back and forth over the border without fees, deposits or any paperwork at all. As a resident of Mexico, you can drive it in the USA for a year, as long as you do not have a US residence. But, protectionism works both ways: You cannot register it in the USA.


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

RVGRINGO said:


> As the spouse of a Mexican, you will probably convert to naturalized Mexicah citizenshp after only two years. I sure would!


Is that something I would have to wait until I'm living in Mexico to start? Or can I begin the application process in the US at a Mexican consulate?



> You can drive a Mexican plated car back and forth over the border without fees, deposits or any paperwork at all. As a resident of Mexico, you can drive it in the USA for a year, as long as you do not have a US residence. But, protectionism works both ways: You cannot register it in the USA.


That makes a case for buying Mexican!! Once we make the move, we don't plan to spend more than 6 to 8 months a year on either side of the border.

Still, back to my question about the quality & expense of Mexican-made vehicles (for Mexican consumers)...?


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

For naturalization, you would have to be living here, in Mexico, with a proper visa. It can take up to 18 months for the process, according to what I have heard.
There are some differences in cars made for each market, but not quality issuses as such. Mexico does not require as many air bags, for example. Nor do they require that warning printed on the right rear view mirror. I am sure we all read that whenever we look behind us through that mirror.
Mexico also imports many vehicle brands from Europe. Our Jalisco plated car is a Smart, made in France by Mercedes Benz and shipped to Mexico with purely European specifications. However, because of that mirror and the spedeometer in kilometers, etc., it cannot be imported to the USA, where they have to sell special Smarts, made on a special production line, etc. etc. 
So, if you want a Mercedes, Ferrari, Maserati, or other quality car, they are available here. Also note that Freightliner builds the queen of their fleet in Mexico, and Nissan has its most green plant here too.


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## Howler (Apr 22, 2013)

It's all looking better already!!


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