# query re IMI help please



## 123Lee (Aug 19, 2014)

Hi, 
Please does anyone have an answer to this - I used to live in central portugal, where I own a house. I had to return to the UK for urgent family matters and am still living in england. This year I have been in and out of hospital and have been unable to return to Portugal to pay the IMI, which was due end of february. It's only €30 a year but by now, with fines it will be about 90. 
What I want to know is how long I have before the Financas will sell my house to pay this tax? I am certain I can't leave it a full year but have to go back into hospital and this is worrying me so much.
I have tried phoning a lawyer but without success. My portuguese is ok face to face but fails me on the telephone.
Many thanks
Lee


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Depends on Financas office but from experience helping someone with same problem it takes a couple of years but when process starts *costs escalate considerably* and process moves at an extremely fast rate.
It is also expensive to stop process and clear your debt record as it's not only Financas that have to be dealt with but removing Lein from property at Conservatoria

No guarantee that it would take a couple of years I'm afraid, *ideally you need someone/anyone to visit Financas ASAP* and pay any outstanding IMI + fines on your behalf as it sounds as if any communication from Financas is going to Portugal

If you have online access to your NIF number then you should be able to get debt and a payment reference but if you don't have access then registering will send required passwords for access to your Portuguese address not your UK address


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## 123Lee (Aug 19, 2014)

Thank you very much canoeman, you have said what I feared. As you realised all correspondence will be going to my portuguese mail box. Unfortunately I don't know anyone there who could pay it for me. People I did know seem to have left the area. I was hoping the lawyer could do this for me but after sending my tax number etc to her,at her request, she since hasn't replied to any e-mail and I must have phoned 30 times. Today I was told she has gone on holiday for two weeks - and that's when I came onto this forum!!
Are you saying there is no standard rule when any Financas might decide to take over the house? That it depends entirely on each office? In other words one person might be able to get away with not paying until december but another office might decide to take action in august (in the year of the debt).
Thank you for replying


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

There probably is a standard rule or possibly a "amount" of debt or length of time communication/s ignored that trigger but if there is I'm not aware of it.

But the people I helped sort out their IMI, IS mess because a Representive that just ignored everything Financas office instigated recovery of debt by placing a Lein on property, advertising for sale at the 2 year point, and as I said extra charges high and escalated from 2,508€ to 5,754€ with further costs until settled, then extra costs to remove Lein to remove advert was 204€ and Conservatoria.

So best not to get that far, afraid you need someone to help at this end, surely someone, estate agent, bank manager


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

*Imi*

Best to start in getting your tax address sent to your home address in the UK, then request the passwords, and then obtain copies of bills on the internet and arrange for these to be paid - can be done by paypal etc


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

But as you must be aware Financas will not change an address by letter, phone or online, if 123Lee had access which he doesn't and to the best my knowledge must be done with a personal visit at any tax office.
Changing the address to UK would also mean he would need to change his status from Resident to Non Resident which might just trigger Financas starting proceeding to recover debt something he really doesn't want to risk.

123Lee as you hadn't said it also seems that you have no one who is collecting and forwarding mail can you at least rectify this? as if you can get communication from Financas it should give you this bill/debt payment reference, Financas *might* respond favourably to a letter to the local office explaining medical issues stopping your return and you've tried to get a local Solicitor to act for you and * they might* post necessary payment reference & amount owed

TonyJ1 I have never seen or heard of an option to pay via PayPal please confirm if this is possible and how, as it would be useful for some who do not have Portuguese Bank Accounts

To the best of my knowledge payments can only be made from Abroad for those without Portuguese Accounts by International Bank Transfer and to tally with bill/debt must contain the reference number for a *specific* bill/debt


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Just further to Payments from Abroad after checking translation I also believe that a* DEBT payment cannot be made* by a International Bank Transfer only Voluntary payments

não aplicável, por isso, a pagamentos em cobrança coerciva
not applicable, to enforced collection payments

123Lee if you make at least 3 more posts then you can be contacted by PM so I might be able to recommend someone who might be able to help if you have no one here who can


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## 123Lee (Aug 19, 2014)

Thank you for all your advice, I am feeling a little bemused but that is more to do with not being well than all your help! 
Canoeman, you are right sbout not changing my residential status, I think that could cause problems. 
I did have someone collecting my mail, but they have stopped doing that, so I have not seen this years IMI bill. Things have just been out of my control over here.
Reading all your advice I have come to the conclusion that somehow I simply have to get over to Portugal as soon as I am able and hopefully, that could be in about 6 weeks. I just have to hope that Financas don't start any action before that.
Considering my health I think it best to try and put house up for sale, realistically this might take years, so I shall have to find a reliable representative when I am over, so that this doesn't happen again. If anyone can recommend anyone in Abrantes/Tomar area I would be grateful.
I did ask at the Post Office about forwarding my portuguese mail to my uk address but was told this wasn't possible.
I do have a Portuguese bank account but was told that I couldn't use it to pay IMI as it had to be paid over the counter.
Canoeman, thank you for advice about more posts, I'll go and see if I can make a comment somewhere!
With thanks


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Well CTT will forward mail to any address but you probably have to arrange in person.

If you have a Portuguese Bank account with online access you can pay online, every bank has a quick link payment as does every Multibanco. If you don't have online access then it can generally be done online, help line or when you visit
But as you've gone passed the date of payment you need the bill + fine or easiest to just go to Financas and pay across counter

New regulations when listing a property with a Registered Portuguese Estate Agent you must have a valid Energy Certificate would suggest Chavetejo Imobiliaria: INCI registered estate agents with property for sale and rent in Central Portugal: Houses, Farms, Cottages, Ruins, Buildings Plots in Tomar, good enough reputation to have keys, and they would or should have some sort of a deal with a register surveyor.
Personal thing but I would not sign an exclusive contract with a Portuguese agent it stops you selling privately or listing with other agents

You really don't need a Representative at this stage unless you intend listing property with Non Registered agents, especially if you get online access to Financas, EDP, PT etc.

Would suggest once you know a date for arriving in Portugal the week before go to the Financas site https://www.portaldasfinancas.gov.pt/pt/home.action and register for online access NOVO UTILIZADOR the necessary initial password will then be at your Portuguese address within 5 days ready to complete registration

Hope your health improves rapidly


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

canoeman said:


> But as you must be aware Financas will not change an address by letter, phone or online, if 123Lee had access which he doesn't and to the best my knowledge must be done with a personal visit at any tax office.
> Changing the address to UK would also mean he would need to change his status from Resident to Non Resident which might just trigger Financas starting proceeding to recover debt something he really doesn't want to risk.
> 
> 123Lee as you hadn't said it also seems that you have no one who is collecting and forwarding mail can you at least rectify this? as if you can get communication from Financas it should give you this bill/debt payment reference, Financas *might* respond favourably to a letter to the local office explaining medical issues stopping your return and you've tried to get a local Solicitor to act for you and * they might* post necessary payment reference & amount owed
> ...


The correct forms have to be filled in - 
Go to Finanças web site and choose Apoio ao Contribuiente
Choose obrigações declarativas
Choose Modelos e Formul'arios
Choose Declarações Cadastrais
Nº Identificação Fiscal - Ficha de Actualização

Complete in duplicate and send to address on form with copy of passport / id


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Useful yes but that changes his Fiscal address not what he wants! what about PayPal?


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

canoeman said:


> Useful yes but that changes his Fiscal address not what he wants! what about PayPal?


I will have to check on it - I have never used it but will see if it can be done - but I have heard that it is an alternate payment method


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## 123Lee (Aug 19, 2014)

Thank you for all your advice, it's much appreciated. Canoeman - from what you say, it would be possible to pay by Interrnational Bank Transfer if I could telephone local Financas and pray someone will talk to me in English and who would then, hopefully give me the reference number and amount of debt?
Thank you


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Sent you a PM


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## 123Lee (Aug 19, 2014)

With regard to portuguese post office forwarding mail, 2 years ago my (then) Portuguese son-in-law went with me to local office requesting forms for this service, yes they would forward mail but only to another address in Portugal, certainly not to uk.
At the time it wasn't such an issue for me, having a Portuguese son-in-law, although he and my daughter lived in uk. However that all went pear-shaped and a divorce is in the offing, so I cannot say if regulations have changed.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

2 years ago friend returned to UK CTT posted mail to her after completing forms at local CTT no problem


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## angela59 (Oct 16, 2014)

*Imi bill*

looking FOR ADVICE ANFD INFORMATION PLEASE. I HAVE PAID MY IMI BILL IN APRIL. MY BILL IS UNDER E500. I REQUESTED I GOT MY IMI BILL SENT TO MY HO E ADDRESS IN SCOTLAND AND RECEIVED THIS OK BUT HAVE NOT RECEIVED ANOTHER ONE FOR THIS OCTOBER. I WENT ON TO THE PORTAL DAS FINANCAS WEBSITE AND ATTEMPTED TO REGISTER. HOWEVER, I HAD PROBLEMS DOING SO BECAUSE IT WOULD NOT ACCEPT MY MOBILE PHONE NUMBER. ANY ADVICE HOW TO OBTAIN MY CODE WOULD BE HELPFUL PLEASE. ANGELA


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## angela59 (Oct 16, 2014)

Tht should have read home address


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

If your IMI bill is between 250€ & 500€ you have 2 options, pay the entire amount in April or 50% April and *50% before end of November*, so if your registered address as a Non Resident is Scotland then your bill won't arrive just yet.

Entering a mobile number comes later in process.

Go to the Financas Website providing your correct Scottish address is the one registered with Financas then any correspondence will be posted to that address if it isn't then Financas only post to the address your NIF is registered too.

Nova Utilizor complete and keep a record of security questions and answers

Through post you will receive your password, activate as soon as possible, you can always change if you don't like one sent

You should make a note to access your NIF at least every 3 months so password remains active, each individual NIF requires seperate registration 

Via Email you will also receive a link and access code to get notifications via email. I always recommend having a Gmail a/c especially for any Portuguese sites you register with as it has a handy translate option so you can easily see content of email

When you have access set up and working then you can change phone numbers etc, personally I wouldn't bother with a mobile number or receiving info by text far too much hassle 

Once you are registered then you can access your IMI and see what's paid, what's outstanding and get the payment reference required to make payment should you bill not turn up


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## angela59 (Oct 16, 2014)

*IMI Bill*

Hi Canoeman, thank you very much for your reply, very helpful. I will try registering again using the information you gave me. I went to the Financas in Abuferia at the start of the year and ask them to post my IMI bill to my address in Scotland, is this the address I should put in when im attempting to register with the Financas and not my Portugal address. Angie.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Financas will only post anything to your registered address Domicilo Fiscal with them.

As a Non Resident? then this should be your Scottish address, not your Portuguese address

When registering for online access to your NIF 
The Morada Fiscal can only be the address used on your A4 Registration form under Domicilo Fiscal which hopefully is your Scottish one
Ignore entering Tel No

Record Security question & answer

Tick box Desejo receber emails
DON'T Tick box SMS

You'll receive password via post within 7 days activate immeadiatly


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