# Legalizing it.



## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

The Supreme Court issued two rulings yesterday that paved the way for the legalization of marijuana for recreational use.

One ruling granted an amparo or injunction to a complainant to allow the cultivation of marijuana for personal use while the other decision allowed a second plaintiff to consume the drug.

The two decisions followed three similar ones between 2015 and 2017, establishing a precedent that a total ban on pot is unconstitutional.

https://mexiconewsdaily.com/news/courts-must-allow-recreational-use-of-pot/


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## Stevenjb (Dec 10, 2017)

Marijuana is not much different than alcohol - though one makes a person happy and the other makes a person sad and angry. And alcohol is legal. Happy, happy, joy, joy.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

IMHO, everyone should be allowed to go to hell in his/her own way, legally. We know that strong drugs are in constant flow across the border, to the detriment of both countries. Nothing has been able to stop it and auxiliary crimes are associated with it. Since some of this stuff is indulged in by people who have the bucks to afford the best, it's probably been acquainted with the halls of business and the government. 

So, what to do? Establish treatment centers for those who want it and punish crimes committed by users, but don't bother making the drugs illegal. It has never worked. Look what happened during alcohol prohibition.


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## Huapango (Oct 7, 2018)

lagoloo said:


> IMHO, everyone should be allowed to go to hell in his/her own way, legally.


Drugs are all fun and games until someone else's drug use affects you or your family. I could go on a long rant, but not a day goes by when I don't feel the burden of these after-effects.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Huapango said:


> Drugs are all fun and games until someone else's drug use affects you or your family. I could go on a long rant, but not a day goes by when I don't feel the burden of these after-effects.


That is true. But making drugs illegal does nothing to improve that situation. In fact it makes it worse. When they are illegal there is no control over the quality.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

My point was that people who want the drugs find a way to get them, regardless of the laws, and making them illegal has only resulted in more crime in at least two countries.

Drugs affected my own family. I found that I could do nothing to change the situation. It was an ongoing tragedy and waste of a life which could have been fulfilling and productive. By the time that person decided to get clean, it was too far along in life to do much good in terms of education and opportunities.

Drugs may be "fun and games" to some, but not to me. Personally, I've stayed away from drugs and am glad I did, since many people I knew "back in the day" are now dead or not as sharp as they once were.

The most dangerous of drugs in terms of harm to the user and often to others (drunk drivers, for instance) is legal, and no one is suggesting a repeat of the Prohibition era...for good reason.


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## JRinPV (Jul 2, 2012)

The most addictive, legal drug of all, is responsible for a huge number of deaths.
It's called NICOTINE!
Pot has never killed anyone !


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## GARYJ65 (Feb 9, 2013)

It would be much easier to do as in Malaysia
Capital punishment 
That takes care of all the ranting about drugs
And whoever wants to get high, they can go somewhere else
That too is a way of legislation


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

GARYJ65 said:


> It would be much easier to do as in Malaysia
> Capital punishment
> That takes care of all the ranting about drugs
> And whoever wants to get high, they can go somewhere else
> That too is a way of legislation


Would you make the same argument if it is your child or your spouse who used or even just tried an illegal drug.


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## GARYJ65 (Feb 9, 2013)

JRinPV said:


> The most addictive, legal drug of all, is responsible for a huge number of deaths.
> It's called NICOTINE!
> Pot has never killed anyone !


Does it have to be one or another?
Why not neither one?


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## GARYJ65 (Feb 9, 2013)

TundraGreen said:


> Would you make the same argument if it is your child or your spouse who used or even just tried an illegal drug.


Of course I would


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## JRinPV (Jul 2, 2012)

GARYJ65 said:


> Does it have to be one or another?
> Why not neither one?


 As I posted - pot has never caused any deaths, by itself !

The pubic have been misguided by the government, due to the lobbyists from the Tobacco & Liquor companies.

Ignorance rules once again. Sad


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## JRinPV (Jul 2, 2012)

lagoloo said:


> IMHO, everyone should be allowed to go to hell in his/her own way, legally. We know that strong drugs are in constant flow across the border, to the detriment of both countries. Nothing has been able to stop it and auxiliary crimes are associated with it. Since some of this stuff is indulged in by people who have the bucks to afford the best, it's probably been acquainted with the halls of business and the government.
> 
> So, what to do? Establish treatment centers for those who want it and punish crimes committed by users, but don't bother making the drugs illegal. It has never worked. Look what happened during alcohol prohibition.


One of the strongest addictive drugs in the world is Nicotine! You gonna ban cigarets ?


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## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

People who have no idea of it are the loudest to scream. The war on drugs has not worked. The only reason it was ever made illegal was to try to get the Mexicans, blacks and Chinese to leave the country as it was their drug if choice over alcohol.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Site source of this fact-free claim !!!


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## GARYJ65 (Feb 9, 2013)

Zorro2017 said:


> People who have no idea of it are the loudest to scream. The war on drugs has not worked. The only reason it was ever made illegal was to try to get the Mexicans, blacks and Chinese to leave the country as it was their drug if choice over alcohol.


You didn’t say which drug and which Country.Mexicans and blacks, possibly preferred pot, Chinese, most probably opium 
I presume you are taking about the USA. Neither one of those groups left the Country.
Many “Americans “ any race, color, religion now consume many different drugs in huge quantities. Sad


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## dwwhiteside (Apr 17, 2013)

The simple fact is, prohibition has never worked. It did not work with alcohol; all it did was make criminals out of the users and millionaires out of the suppliers. And it has not worked with pot and other drugs. It has, in fact, done the exact same thing alcohol prohibition did; make the users criminals and the suppliers rich.

There is only one sensible solution, the obvious one, stop turning users into criminals and suppliers into millionaires. Let the people who want to use drugs use them. But, if they break other laws by hurting or endangering others, then arrest them; exactly like we now do with alcohol.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Money is better spent on rehab than on jails..


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## dwwhiteside (Apr 17, 2013)

citlali said:


> Money is better spent on rehab than on jails..


Exactly! A few months of rehab is MUCH less expensive than years of incarceration. Plus, drugs sold legally can be taxed and the rehab can be funded with those taxes. Less money spent enforcing laws that don't work plus new tax revenues.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

The problem with legalization and rehab programs is that thay don't work either. Taxpayers are not willing to pay for a 'revolving door' program, or the petty crime that it engenders. The only real solution is to eliminate the demand. We all know what that means, but have trouble accepting the fact that making drug use a capital offense isn't easy either. However, if the demand is eliminated, the supplieres soon vanish as the market for their product is eliminated. Tough love, anyone?


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## dwwhiteside (Apr 17, 2013)

RVGRINGO said:


> The problem with legalization and rehab programs is that thay don't work either. Taxpayers are not willing to pay for a 'revolving door' program, or the petty crime that it engenders. The only real solution is to eliminate the demand. We all know what that means, but have trouble accepting the fact that making drug use a capital offense isn't easy either. However, if the demand is eliminated, the supplieres soon vanish as the market for their product is eliminated. Tough love, anyone?


So, just kill anyone that smokes a joint? That's not tough love, that's sadism. 

Taxpayers don't get to decide how their tax money is spent. They can vote for candidates that support their positions but, once the government has your money, they will spend it as they damn well please.

Anyone paying attention already knows that you cannot and will not eliminate demand. It really doesn't matter how "tough on crime" you try to get. Even making drug use a capital offense won't eliminate demand. Sure, you can try to kill as many users as possible and maybe, MAYBE, you can reduce the demand a little. But seriously, do you really think capital punishment for simple drug use is a solution?

I hope you don't.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

No need from capitol punishment, seems to me the drug users are killing themselves already... with 72,000 overdose deaths in 2017 and going up every year they might run out of users someday.LOL
Click here▼
https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2018/8/16/17698204/opioid-epidemic-overdose-deaths-2017


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## JRinPV (Jul 2, 2012)

So how do you propose to eliminate demand for cigarettes ? Make being a nicotine addict a capital offence LOL
How about alcohol, banning that didn't workout too well!


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

RVGRINGO said:


> The problem with legalization and rehab programs is that thay don't work either. Taxpayers are not willing to pay for a 'revolving door' program, or the petty crime that it engenders. The only real solution is to eliminate the demand. We all know what that means, but have trouble accepting the fact that making drug use a capital offense isn't easy either. However, if the demand is eliminated, the supplieres soon vanish as the market for their product is eliminated. Tough love, anyone?


Are you really suggesting capital punishment for drug use? That sounds more than a little extreme to say the least.

I agree that legalization will not eliminate demand but it will take satisfying that demand out of the hands of a criminal element. When it is legal, quality standards can be imposed eliminating some of the deaths and injuries that come from contaminated street drugs. The profits from the sale of drugs can be taxed and maybe the taxes could be used for treatment programs although that may be asking too much. Taking drug distribution away from gangs and cartels will not eliminate them any more than the Mafia disappeared when prohibition was repealed, but it will take a lot of the money out of their operations and that is a start.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Every one of you read my post as a suggestion. It was not. It was an observation. However, there are places where such extreme measures do work, to some extent, but they are not places where most of us would be comfortable, for other reasons.

It is a dilemma with no easy solution. Drug users become addicted, and that leads to criminal behavior of other sorts, as they have a habit to support. That feeds into the supply chain and the vicious cycle goes on and on. Maybe the only workable policy would be a 'hands off' policy, whereby government punishes their crimes, both user and supplier, but does not support users with welfare or rehabilitation. Those trying to quit smoking or drinking sure don't get government assistance for medication or programs to help them quit, or for their eventual medical needs resulting from years of bad habits. 
I have no suggestions for solutions; just observations on what is, and what might be possible.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

When China decided to eliminate the opium addiction they gave as much as they wanted to the old folks and sent the young ones to work camps and made them quit cold turkey.. f they died in the process too bad as far as the old addicts they eliminated themselves via age and may be too much smoking.. It seems that the problem was simpler then because since then drugs have multiplied and people find new ones if they really want to so t is a totally losing battle, add to that the irresponsible pain medicine practices of some doctors and you have a real mess.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

My suggestion:
Make everything legal: sell it in the drugstore and tax it. Yes, have rehab centers for those who want it.
Drug use is its own eventual punishment. If you smoke three packs of legal cigarettes a day and then decide to quit, the withdrawal is just about as bad as with most drug withdrawal. It will also take a toll on your body, permanently, even years and years later. I know. Been there.


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## Meritorious-MasoMenos (Apr 17, 2014)

Stevenjb said:


> Marijuana is not much different than alcohol - though one makes a person happy and the other makes a person sad and angry. And alcohol is legal. Happy, happy, joy, joy.


Is this true? I haven't touched weed in decades. Just eventually saw that it took away all initiative and effort.

I read all the time that today's weed is 20-30 times stronger than marijuana of the 1970s. I have no idea, and no desire to try it. If so, it would be considerably more dangerous than alcohol. Anyone willing to admit they've tried the modern stuff?

I must say, I haven't read anything about zombie-like apocalypses in Colorado or other marijuana-legal states. Maybe that 20-30 times stronger claim is just a marketing gimmick.


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## JRinPV (Jul 2, 2012)

Meritorious-MasoMenos said:


> Is this true? I haven't touched weed in decades. Just eventually saw that it took away all initiative and effort.
> 
> I read all the time that today's weed is 20-30 times stronger than marijuana of the 1970s. I have no idea, and no desire to try it. If so, it would be considerably more dangerous than alcohol. Anyone willing to admit they've tried the modern stuff?
> 
> I must say, I haven't read anything about zombie-like apocalypses in Colorado or other marijuana-legal states. Maybe that 20-30 times stronger claim is just a marketing gimmick.


No it's not true, it's stronger, so less is used to get the effect. Ignorance is Bliss


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

RVGRINGO said:


> ....
> Those trying to quit smoking or drinking sure don't get government assistance for medication or programs to help them quit, or for their eventual medical needs resulting from years of bad habits.
> ...


Actually, in Canada they do...


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

ojosazules11 said:


> Actually, in Canada they do...


They do in France also, not every country is as backwards as the US.. Alcohol and tobacco cost a lot of money to countries that have good coverage so it makes sense to help people get off alcohol or tobacco.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

Stevenjb said:


> Marijuana is not much different than alcohol - though one makes a person happy and the other makes a person sad and angry. And alcohol is legal. Happy, happy, joy, joy.


Sorry, but not true. Different people's systems have different reactions to various drugs. Some people get super happy and are a lot of fun when they have had a drink or two, others become morose, or angry and violent. What I've observed about alcohol is that it serves to break down inhibitions. So if someone is normally withdrawn and shy, alcohol will allow them to come out of their shell and become more sociable. If someone is an angry person, but normally tries to keep that contained, having a few drinks can bring out their belligerence and violence. People who have no violent streak don't become violent because they've had a few drinks.
A glass or two of wine in the evening may help some people to sleep better. It keeps me awake.
Same with pot. It makes some happy and laid back, it makes some withdrawn and paranoid. Some people can smoke a joint and feel energetic and get going on some project, some find it just makes them want to lay around and saps their energy and motivation.
There's also a tremendous amount of disinformation around drugs. Neither marijuana nor cocaine are physically addictive drugs. When one stops doing either, cold turkey, they go through no physical withdrawal symptoms. Any addiction to those drugs is mental- they like it, they're used to it, therefore they want it. Caffeine is physically addictive- if you're a habitual coffee drinker and stop for some reason, you'll usually get a bad headache for awhile from not having it. And of course opiates are all physically addictive. As are many other prescription drugs.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

I listened to a very interesting and informative CBC radio show years ago about "the war on drugs".
It's a fact that criminalizing drug use does not lead to reduction in their use. Those who want to use one drug or another will use it, whether it's legal or not. They'll just be more circumspect about it if it's illegal. Of course, in places where they kill drug users who've committed no crimes against others, there would be a reduction in use, but I doubt there's many of us who would want to live in a country like that.
Conversely, legalizing doesn't lead to any significant increase in use, it just stops wasting taxpayer $ on police, court and prison resources and cuts down on criminal-type pushers, who are likely doing other illegal things besides selling someone a baggie of MJ.
If they legalized heroin tomorrow, how many people do you think are going to go "Awesome, I've always wanted to be a junkie, it seems so cool", and run right out to buy some and a bunch of syringes?
One of the people they interviewed on this radio show was a Dutch drug expert (and I believe he was a doctor) who said that in Holland, there are labs where teenagers (or anyone) can bring drugs they've purchased and have them tested for free. The drugs are tested, then given back to the client with a report on what was found. So a teenager who bought some Ecstasy to take at the rave that weekend can bring it in, then be told "This is pure MDMA", or "This is laced with rat poison, this, that or the other, you'll get really sick or die if you take it." This certainly cuts down on drug sellers who sell bad **** because word gets around not to buy from that person, and like the man interviewed said, "These kids are going to take drugs whether we want them to or not. We'd rather be non-judgemental and give them the facts about what they've purchased than have our children die".


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## LoggedIn (Nov 21, 2017)

Meritorious-MasoMenos said:


> Is this true? I haven't touched weed in decades. Just eventually saw that it took away all initiative and effort.
> 
> I read all the time that today's weed is 20-30 times stronger than marijuana of the 1970s. I have no idea, and no desire to try it. If so, it would be considerably more dangerous than alcohol. Anyone willing to admit they've tried the modern stuff?
> 
> I must say, I haven't read anything about zombie-like apocalypses in Colorado or other marijuana-legal states. Maybe that 20-30 times stronger claim is just a marketing gimmick.


Trust me, it's a lot stronger but it is also no big deal.


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## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

CBD candy will be available by the end of the month.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Marvelous. Now we'll be seeing more diabetic stoners.


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## JRinPV (Jul 2, 2012)

CBD doesn't get you High.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

re will be gummy bears so they could make them sugar free.. they will be available over the counter in Guadalajara Farmacia next month according to Facebook...we will see
Since I have all kinds of pain and aches I sure will buy some and check them out.

Coca candies in Peri or coca leaves had zero effect on me, let´s see about these candies, I am game.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

citlali said:


> re will be gummy bears so they could make them sugar free.. they will be available over the counter in Guadalajara Farmacia next month according to Facebook...we will see
> Since I have all kinds of pain and aches I sure will buy some and check them out.


I have some aches and pains too, citlali. Let me know how the gummy bears work for you.


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## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

JRinPV said:


> CBD doesn't get you High.


I never said it did.


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## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

JRinPV said:


> CBD doesn't get you High.


Obviously you are not familiar with isomerization. CBD can easily be converted to pure THC with an isomerizer sold on Ebay. I was doing this in the 70's. You could triple the potency of an ounce and then put it back on a half ounce or less.

Cannabis Lollipops: Isomerizer


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