# Healthcare cover, and Pensions questions...



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Hi,

I have had a look in the FAQ's but couldn't find the answers to my particular questions...which are....

1. Healthcare cover....I've been led to believe that the Spanish government has recently changed the rules regarding healthcare cover for foreign nationals (I'm not sure if this is true).

We are seriously considering moving to Spain in the next year or so, and my partner has been informed that under the current conditions even if we were residents of Spain we would not be able to receive healthcare under the Spanish system. And as a result we would have to obtain private health insurance to cover any problems we might have.

Is this true?....and if it is, what would happen if we were needing medical attention, but didn't have any cover in place?

And would anybody have any recommendations on private health insurance providers in Spain, should we have to go down that route?

2. My second question is in regards to pensions....I'm also led to believe that the UK government has plans to cease the ability to draw a pension entitlement from the UK if you are now living abroad. I think this applies to future claims, and not people already living abroad. Again, is this true?

I have a small private pension, as does my partner. And I'm not sure I would receive much of a state pension anyway, but feel I should be entitled to something after paying into the system for so long.

I'm only in my late 40's at the moment, but would like to retire at 50 if possible (mainly due to an injury). I could then draw my private pension at 55.

I feel waiting to get anything at 65 is almost not worth worrying about, but the lack of healthcare and pensions in the future is really starting to sour the idea of moving to Spain for my partner. So I'd like to know what the up to date situation for both my enquiries is, so that I can reassure her, or use the information to make an informed decision.

Thank you in advance for any advice


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Steve.R said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have had a look in the FAQ's but couldn't find the answers to my particular questions...which are....
> 
> ...


Healthcare entitlement (before retirement age) in Spain is subject to you paying the equivalent of National Insurance contributions through contracted work, or self employment. 

If you are not working and contributing, you may be entitled to healthcare for a limited period if you have been paying UK NI - contact DWP. I'm guessing from the part I've highlighted in your question that you mean your partner has enquired and is not entitled to this.

If none of the above applies, then private healthcare is the only option. I believe costs are quite reasonable in Spain, though it may be more difficult with your existing inury??

Not getting healthcare is not an option - you will have to prove you have it in order to register within 90 days of your arrival - together with showing you have sufficient income to support yourselves.

As to your question about what happens if you are ill and have no cover - well it's pretty simple. No cover - no medical assistance of any kind.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

yes, if you've paid into the UK system then you can fill out the S1 form and that will give you cover for a couple of years. After that, you either need to have some contracted employment in Spain or go private, until you are retirement age. 

I do believe that if you urgently need medical cover (life or death), they will treat you, but they will insist you take out a loan or prove beyond any doubt that you can and will pay. As Brocher say, before you can become a resident, you will need to prove healthcare cover and a livable income (I think that varies from town to town)

Jo xxx


----------



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

brocher said:


> Healthcare entitlement (before retirement age) in Spain is subject to you paying the equivalent of National Insurance contributions through contracted work, or self employment.
> 
> If you are not working and contributing, you may be entitled to healthcare for a limited period if you have been paying UK NI - contact DWP. I'm guessing from the part I've highlighted in your question that you mean your partner has enquired and is not entitled to this.
> 
> ...


Thanks Brocher,

We're just looking into the DWP...I've paid N.I for many years, plus some self employment contributions. My partner has paid for 15 years since moving from Italy.

I had planned to work until 2017 by 'commuting' to the UK, so I'd still be paying UK N.I, and so I'm assuming I'd be covered by my EH1 card for treatment. My partner would not have any cover from the outset.

We've had some quotes, from Sanitas and BUPA, that work out at about £300-380 per month. This might increase with details of my injury.

Are there any recommdations for companies for affordable cover in Spain?


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Steve.R said:


> Thanks Brocher,
> 
> We're just looking into the DWP...I've paid N.I for many years, plus some self employment contributions. My partner has paid for 15 years since moving from Italy.
> 
> ...


 The EHIC card is only for tourists and only for emergencies. Once you reside in Spain you cant use it, and definitely not for ongoing issues. 

If you become residents in spain, you'd need to get the S1 forms from DWP.

I dont know of any insurance companies, I'll have a quick search.....

Jo xxx


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...n-health-insurance-card-ehic-discussions.html


http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...how-does-work.html?highlight=health+insurance

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...lth-insurance.html?highlight=health+insurance

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...8-health-care.html?highlight=health+insurance

I found these, I'm not sure what they all say, but there may be some useful bits and pieces???

Jo xxx


----------



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

jojo said:


> yes, if you've paid into the UK system then you can fill out the S1 form and that will give you cover for a couple of years. After that, you either need to have some contracted employment in Spain or go private, until you are retirement age.
> 
> I do believe that if you urgently need medical cover (life or death), they will treat you, but they will insist you take out a loan or prove beyond any doubt that you can and will pay. As Brocher say, before you can become a resident, you will need to prove healthcare cover and a livable income (I think that varies from town to town)
> 
> Jo xxx


Thanks Jo,

I'm going to look into the DWP ...but I'm starting to think that medical cover would end up as a big drain on our resources, especially over so many years.

What would be judged as liveable income?...I would be living from my existing contracts in the UK for the first few years, but from then it would be living on savings. Would that suffice?


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Steve.R said:


> Thanks Jo,
> 
> I'm going to look into the DWP ...but I'm starting to think that medical cover would end up as a big drain on our resources, especially over so many years.
> 
> What would be judged as liveable income?...I would be living from my existing contracts in the UK for the first few years, but from then it would be living on savings. Would that suffice?


http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...n-health-insurance-card-ehic-discussions.html

The amount varies, I seem to think its around 500€ a month each?? But I could be wrong (I usually am lol) - have a read of this?? http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...-uk-other-eu-citizens-spain-april-2012-a.html

Jo xxx


----------



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

jojo said:


> http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...n-health-insurance-card-ehic-discussions.html
> 
> 
> http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...how-does-work.html?highlight=health+insurance
> ...


Thanks Jo, there's some interesting reading there, and it clears up some of the many questions I've got!


----------



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

It's been suggested before that I look at disability benefit.

As a self employed worker for most of my life I find it hard to want to claim any type of benefit. But my injury has caused me to consider it. And I think if I continue to work in the environment I'm in, with the injury I have, then by 2017 I could well be entitled, and indeed in need of it.


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

jojo said:


> http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...n-health-insurance-card-ehic-discussions.html
> 
> The amount varies, I seem to think its around 500€ a month each?? But I could be wrong (I usually am lol) - have a read of this?? http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...-uk-other-eu-citizens-spain-april-2012-a.html
> 
> Jo xxx


The amount required for residence varies from area to area, but recently seems to be around 600€ per person/month, plus possibly savings.

That doesn't mean you can live on that amount, you should assume you will need pretty much the same as you need in the UK, and remember prices are rising quickly in Spain.

I don't know if disability is payable while you live in Spain, but even if it is now, the situation could change by 2017 as the government seems to be clamping down on this at the moment.


----------



## ericban (Oct 18, 2012)

If you get a 'Long Term Disability Benefit' from the UK, then your S1 from the DWP will reflect this and you and your dependents will be entitled to Spanish Healthcare Benefits paid for by the UK in an exchange agreement between the two countries.

This was the case with us, as my War Pension counts as a long term disability benefit. I almost purchased Private Medical Cover before someone on here steered me in the right direction. I believe DLA and Incapacity Benefit both count towards this. 

If you do have an existing serious condition, it may be worth your while to have that assessed before making a move, as I believe (maybe wrongly) that you cannot be assessed once you have made the move abroad. It would be worth checking that out, as that is only what I was told in a chat and is not gospel!.

Regards
EB


----------



## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

indeed you can be assessed abroad-the DWP arrange this; it would be better to be assessed in UK unless you are fluent in Spanish.


----------



## ericban (Oct 18, 2012)

Thanks extranjero,

I wasn't sure, so good to get it clarified.

Regards
EB


----------



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Thanks for all the responses... 

My partner has had another quote in today from Axa. This is coming in at under £300 for the two of us...so at least it's getting a bit cheaper!  has anyone had any dealings with Axa for health insurance?

As regards the injury, it's not terminal, but will continue to deteriorate. It's a smashed hip socket from a cycling accident. It will eventually prevent me from working, so in 3-5 years I may well be able to be apply and get benefits for being unable to work. So that could be a route to pursue.

My quandary is how to approach the matter to the health insurance in the near future.

I really need to clarify my 'status' with my GP, and the hospital. I'm still under care of the specialist, but they've diagnosed that there's nothing they can do for me until it becomes so bad that I need a new hip.
So it's not exactly 'signed off' but it's not particularly active either, as that period of deterioration could be 1 year, 10 years, 25 years, or never!

But I think it will complicate any possible policy I get because I'm sure they will rate it as ongoing....but if it becomes so bad that I could get incapacity benefit, then I assume I would be covered for healthcare in Spain, and my reliance on the need for a healthcare policy not so great.

Unfortunately my injury has forced me to consider early retirement very early in life. And forced me to look for a circumstance that will reduce the discomfort of the injury. I'm sure the climate in Spain would greatly improve my future capabilities.

I've just got to really look into the government (DWP) and healthcare/hospital elements of making the move. It's complicated, but I'm trying to wade through the options 

Thanks for your help...it's very much appreciated


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Steve.R said:


> Thanks for all the responses...
> 
> My partner has had another quote in today from Axa. This is coming in at under £300 for the two of us...so at least it's getting a bit cheaper!  has anyone had any dealings with Axa for health insurance?
> 
> ...


Have you declared your injury for he quotes you are getting?They are worthless unless you have declared that injury and any other ailments.

Are the quotes from Spanish companies, I believe are cheaper than UK ones?

I'd be very careful of making long term plans to move to Spain, if you are relying on a benefit to do it. The government are already cutting entitlement to many benefits, and they are also making noises about paying them to those resident overseas.


----------



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

brocher said:


> Have you declared your injury for he quotes you are getting?They are worthless unless you have declared that injury and any other ailments.
> 
> Are the quotes from Spanish companies, I believe are cheaper than UK ones?
> 
> I'd be very careful of making long term plans to move to Spain, if you are relying on a benefit to do it. The government are already cutting entitlement to many benefits, and they are also making noises about paying them to those resident overseas.


I haven't declared anything to them at the moment. My partner has just made enquiries to get a rough idea of the possible costs...I realise it's going to get complicated once I raise the subject. But I do need to check with my GP/hospital for the exact details before I declare it.

She has so far got quotes from BUPA(UK), Sanitas (which I believe is the Spanish arm of BUPA?), and AXA. The policies cover Spain, and one other country (which would be the UK)...although I'm not sure if UK cover is necessary, or could/should be removed to reduce the premium???

I'm not going to be relying on benefits to enable me to move to Spain, ie to live on. I have, or hope to have, enough savings to live on and support ourselves with. What I'm hoping to achieve by the benefits is get the reassurance of access to healthcare, which I'm obviously concerned about given my circumstances. If it allowed me to stop having to have BUPA cover, that would also save me a very large financial drain on those savings over a long period.
(I'm not sure if that's what you meant by relying on benefits?)


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Steve.R said:


> I haven't declared anything to them at the moment. My partner has just made enquiries to get a rough idea of the possible costs...I realise it's going to get complicated once I raise the subject. But I do need to check with my GP/hospital for the exact details before I declare it.
> 
> She has so far got quotes from BUPA(UK), Sanitas (which I believe is the Spanish arm of BUPA?), and AXA. The policies cover Spain, and one other country (which would be the UK)...although I'm not sure if UK cover is necessary, or could/should be removed to reduce the premium???
> 
> ...


have a look at the http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...-living-spain/2725-faqs-lots-useful-info.html

you'll find online comparison websites for Spanish health insurance companies - that will give you a rough & ready idea of lots of companies, at least


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Steve.R said:


> I haven't declared anything to them at the moment. My partner has just made enquiries to get a rough idea of the possible costs...I realise it's going to get complicated once I raise the subject. But I do need to check with my GP/hospital for the exact details before I declare it.
> 
> She has so far got quotes from BUPA(UK), Sanitas (which I believe is the Spanish arm of BUPA?), and AXA. The policies cover Spain, and one other country (which would be the UK)...although I'm not sure if UK cover is necessary, or could/should be removed to reduce the premium???
> 
> ...


I see where you're coming from re. The disability benefit allowing you to be free from hefty private health cover costs. I didn't mean anything derogatory, simply that it would be very unfortunate to makesuch a big life change as moving to Spain if the move is dependant, financially, on you being successful in getting the benefit. 

I wasn't suggesting you we're trying to be a "scrounger, " for want of a better word.


----------



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

brocher said:


> I see where you're coming from re. The disability benefit allowing you to be free from hefty private health cover costs. I didn't mean anything derogatory, simply that it would be very unfortunate to makesuch a big life change as moving to Spain if the move is dependant, financially, on you being successful in getting the benefit.
> 
> I wasn't suggesting you we're trying to be a "scrounger, " for want of a better word.


Lol....no you're ok, no offence taken. 

I just wasn't sure if you meant 'don't be so foolish to risk your future on the necessity of benefit to survive' or 'the system is so bad it will fail you in what you're trying to achieve, or it's impossible to do'

Since starting to look into moving to Spain the complexity of the task can seem daunting, sometimes too daunting. Yet I'm sure...or should I say hopeful?..that the long term rewards will make it worthwhile.

But the initial impression is that the 'system' in Spain is very complicated, and quite vague. My partner is Italian, so more accustomed to this than I am as a Brit! 
I like to do my research, find out the facts, then make a decision...but I get the impression that in Spain that by the time you've found out the facts they've changed! /

That's where forums like this are invaluable....I'm sure it's very frustrating to see another newbie come on and ask the same questions all over again....but everyone has been very helpful on here, and very positive....which is something that can be lacking when asking for advice elsewhere on the Internet.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Steve.R said:


> But the initial impression is that the 'system' in Spain is very complicated, and quite vague. My partner is Italian, so more accustomed to this than I am as a Brit!
> I like to do my research, find out the facts, then make a decision..*.but I get the impression that in Spain that by the time you've found out the facts they've changed!* /


Yep!! That sums it up in Spain lol!!!!

Jo xxx


----------



## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

If you think the Health system is complicated, wait till you start on the tax.....!


----------



## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

2. My second question is in regards to pensions....I'm also led to believe that the UK government has plans to cease the ability to draw a pension entitlement from the UK if you are now living abroad. I think this applies to future claims, and not people already living abroad. Again, is this true?
Quote

Everyone in the UK who has qualified for a state pension is legally bound to receive it wherever they reside. There are exceptions to receiving a UK pension. In certain countries, there is no cost of living rise, but that doesn't apply to citizens retiring to the EU.
If you are a resident abroad and had no bank account in the UK, you have to give the DWP your bank details in your new country. If you still have a bank account in the UK, you have the choice of where to receive it. By receiving it in Spain, you get the best exchange rate available.


----------



## CapnBilly (Jun 7, 2011)

Aron said:


> . By receiving it in Spain, you get the best exchange rate available.


....on the day. However, if you choose to receive it in sterling, then you can manage your own exchange rate transaction.


----------

