# Do We All Now Need Spanish Driving Licences?



## DeeBee6961

Over the last year of so, Brits have been saying that Spain is now asking all foreigners who have spent more than six months in Spain to change their country of origin licence for a Spanish one. On any possible occasion, I have asked tráfico police if this is true and they have always said ‘no’ or that they know nothing of it. However, in June, a nice policeman told me that this is true and that the only reason I had been hearing ‘no’ was because the police didn’t have their training course until June.

Is it true? If the answer is yes, when does this new rule commence? I have also been told that if you don’t show a Spanish licence, there could be a fine of up to one thousand euros.


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## xabiaxica

DeeBee6961 said:


> Over the last year of so, Brits have been saying that Spain is now asking all foreigners who have spent more than six months in Spain to change their country of origin licence for a Spanish one. On any possible occasion, I have asked tráfico police if this is true and they have always said ‘no’ or that they know nothing of it. However, in June, a nice policeman told me that this is true and that the only reason I had been hearing ‘no’ was because the police didn’t have their training course until June.
> 
> Is it true? If the answer is yes, when does this new rule commence? I have also been told that if you don’t show a Spanish licence, there could be a fine of up to one thousand euros.


if you have an 'EU' plastic photo licence which hasn't expired (see the date on the photo) then you can legally use it in Spain until such time as it has

just as any other EU citizen with one issued in any other EU country

if you have an old paper licence without a photo & with no expiry date then yes, you do have to change it


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## The Skipper

Don´t forget that under UK law you must notify DVLA of a change of address. It is an offence not to. And they won´t accept an address outside of the UK! So, the only way around it is to get a Spanish licence. It´s a fairly simple process so why not just do it and avoid any possible hassle?


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## xabiaxica

The Skipper said:


> Don´t forget that under UK law you must notify DVLC of a change of address. It is an offence not to. And they won´t accept an address outside of the UK! So, the only way around it is to get a Spanish licence. It´s a fairly simple process so why not just do it and avoid any possible hassle?


while I agree that it's probably simpler all round to change it - you do *not *have to notify the DVLC of your address in Spain... once you are no longer resident in the UK, the UK laws no longer apply

your licence has to comply with the local laws of your country of residence - in Spain, licences don't carry an address


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## snikpoh

xabiachica said:


> if you have an 'EU' plastic photo licence which hasn't expired (see the date on the photo) then you can legally use it in Spain until such time as it has
> 
> just as any other EU citizen with one issued in any other EU country
> 
> if you have an old paper licence without a photo & with no expiry date then yes, you do have to change it


Just don't forget that even with a UK (European) licence, you need to follow Spanish law regarding medicals!




The Skipper said:


> Don´t forget that under UK law you must notify DVLA of a change of address. It is an offence not to. And they won´t accept an address outside of the UK! So, the only way around it is to get a Spanish licence. It´s a fairly simple process so why not just do it and avoid any possible hassle?


This is only true for UK residents. 

You do not need to change the address on a UK licence if you no longer live in UK - it even states this on the UK DVLC web site. A link to the appropriate section has been posted on this forum before.


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## Gareth54

DeeBee6961 said:


> Over the last year of so, Brits have been saying that Spain is now asking all foreigners who have spent more than six months in Spain to change their country of origin licence for a Spanish one. On any possible occasion, I have asked tráfico police if this is true and they have always said ‘no’ or that they know nothing of it. However, in June, a nice policeman told me that this is true and that the only reason I had been hearing ‘no’ was because the police didn’t have their training course until June.
> 
> Is it true? If the answer is yes, when does this new rule commence? I have also been told that if you don’t show a Spanish licence, there could be a fine of up to one thousand euros.


I would think that if you are driving a Spanish registered car, insured here you would also need to get a Spanish licence. Had to change mine when I lived in Holland, driving a Dutch car and insured there.


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## thrax

For the Spanish it is all about accountability. Instead of getting a Spanish licence it is possible to have a Spanish licence number stamped on your EU licence. This number is the one the police etc like to see and they really don't care if it is on a British licence. Just as long as it is there. It is a matter of minutes to have this done at Trafico.


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## snikpoh

thrax said:


> For the Spanish it is all about accountability. Instead of getting a Spanish licence it is possible to have a Spanish licence number stamped on your EU licence. This number is the one the police etc like to see and they really don't care if it is on a British licence. Just as long as it is there. It is a matter of minutes to have this done at Trafico.


... but it's not necessary nor a requirement.

In fact, around here they won't do this even if one asks!


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## The Skipper

The gov.uk web site says: “If you move abroad, check with the driving licence authorities there to find out how to get a local driving licence.” The Angloinfo web site, reporting on new EU traffic laws that came into force on January 19, 2013, says: “The licence must be renewed within two years of the first day of the driver's official residency in Spain .... foreign drivers from within the EU still need to register with the traffic authorities within six months of moving to Spain.” I assume this is accurate information but, either way, I can´t see the point of not getting a Spanish licence at the earliest opportunity.


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## xabiaxica

The Skipper said:


> The gov.uk web site says: “If you move abroad, check with the driving licence authorities there to find out how to get a local driving licence.” The Angloinfo web site, reporting on new EU traffic laws that came into force on January 19, 2013, says: “The licence must be renewed within two years of the first day of the driver's official residency in Spain .... foreign drivers from within the EU still need to register with the traffic authorities within six months of moving to Spain.” I assume this is accurate information but, either way, I can´t see the point of not getting a Spanish licence at the earliest opportunity.


Angloinfo is no more official than this site - & very often has very out of date or simply wrong information - as in this case


that said - yes you have to find out what the regulations are in your country of residency - & the regulations here, are that you can, should you choose to, drive with your UK/EU photo licence until it expires & _then_ you have to exchange for a Spanish licence - the old paper 'non-EU' licences DO have to be exchanged though, as I said on my first reply on this thread

it isn't obligatory to register your UK/EU licence here either, although you can - but as someone else posted, some local tráfico offices aren't interested 

if you look on our http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...-living-spain/2725-faqs-lots-useful-info.html there is a link to the DGT website - it's all on there


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## larryzx

Just something to think about.

In Spain one must have their DL with them when they are driving.

If you lose your DL, have it stolen, you cannot drive until you have your replacement DL. Showing a denuncia (crime/loss report) is not enough. A Spanish DL can be obtained fairly quickly. 

If you have a UK DL, then if you do not live in UK then you have a problem, where would DVLC send it ? DVLC will not send it to Spain. If DVLC would send it to your last UK address, you still have to rely on the person living there sending it to you, and the postal system in UK and Spain not letting you down. 

And of course when you reach 70 you cannot renew your UK DL as you do not live there, just an address is not sufficient. Thus you would need to have changed it for a Spanish one before it expires.

And as snikpoh says, “Just don't forget that even with a UK (European) licence, you need to follow Spanish law regarding medicals” That is if you are driving on a UK (or other EU) DL you must have the appropriate medical cert with you. That of course means renewing it every 10 / 5 / 3 years, as would a driver with a Spanish DL.

All in all, I decided to change mine for a Spanish DL several years ago. If I get stopped I have a DL which the police can see is correct without any possibility of error. 

If ever I go back to UK and want to, I can exchange my Spanish one there.


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## snikpoh

I too chose to replace mine with a Spanish one before it ever became an issue - I didn't have to, I just chose to.


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## The Skipper

I don´t want to appear to be an argumentative old codger, and I don´t want to cause offence, but I keep reading reports on various web sites all saying the same as Angloinfo: ie, that UK driving licences must be renewed within two years of the first day of the driver's official residency in Spain. They are, possibly, all wrong – and it wouldn´t be the first time that inaccurate information has gone viral! – but some of the sites I have read appear quite authoritative. I wasn´t, however, going to say any more about the subject ... until I read today´s copy of the Costa Blanca News. Graham Shelton, their motoring correspondent, writes: “It has been law since 2009 that holders of a non-Spanish driving licence need to exchange it within two years of obtaining residency. As of January 19, 2015, this requirement is to be reinforced by the issuing of denuncias and fines.” Perhaps he is wrong as well?


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## xabiaxica

The Skipper said:


> I don´t want to appear to be an argumentative old codger, and I don´t want to cause offence, but I keep reading reports on various web sites all saying the same as Angloinfo: ie, that UK driving licences must be renewed within two years of the first day of the driver's official residency in Spain. They are, possibly, all wrong – and it wouldn´t be the first time that inaccurate information has gone viral! – but some of the sites I have read appear quite authoritative. I wasn´t, however, going to say any more about the subject ... until I read today´s copy of the Costa Blanca News. Graham Shelton, their motoring correspondent, writes: “It has been law since 2009 that holders of a non-Spanish driving licence need to exchange it within two years of obtaining residency. As of January 19, 2015, this requirement is to be reinforced by the issuing of denuncias and fines.” Perhaps he is wrong as well?


yes he's wrong

this is the most recent update to the law http://www.dgt.es/Galerias/segurida.../reglamento-trafico/reglamento_trafico181.pdf

Chapter 2 Article 15 is clear that residents with driving licences *without an expiry date *must change them, but that other EU licences are accepted as valid in Spain (subject to the same conditions that holders of Spanish licences have to fulfill as far as medicals etc., are concerned) until they expire, at which time a Spanish licence must be obtained


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## The Skipper

xabiachica said:


> yes he's wrong
> 
> this is the most recent update to the law http://www.dgt.es/Galerias/segurida.../reglamento-trafico/reglamento_trafico181.pdf
> 
> Chapter 2 Article 15 is clear that residents with driving licences *without an expiry date *must change them, but that other EU licences are accepted as valid in Spain (subject to the same conditions that holders of Spanish licences have to fulfill as far as medicals etc., are concerned) until they expire, at which time a Spanish licence must be obtained


Well, that seems pretty conclusive! Thank you for taking the trouble to put me out of my misery! It´s incredible, though, that so much misinformation is circulating on this subject. It´s especially disappointing that a motoring correspondent for a supposedly reputable newspaper should get it wrong, particularly when you consider that he runs a business that helps expat motorists in their dealings with Trafico. I wouldn´t think such a thing myself, but a cynic might suggest that misinformation helps bring in a few extra clients!


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## xabiaxica

The Skipper said:


> Well, that seems pretty conclusive! Thank you for taking the trouble to put me out of my misery! It´s incredible, though, that so much misinformation is circulating on this subject. It´s especially disappointing that a motoring correspondent for a supposedly reputable newspaper should get it wrong, particularly when you consider that he runs a business that helps expat motorists in their dealings with Trafico. I wouldn´t think such a thing myself, but a cynic might suggest that misinformation helps bring in a few extra clients!


misinformation about driving licences has been circulating on forums & newspapers etc for as long as I can remember - it's possibly the most badly reported subject


I'm a cynic  One often recommended & 'well reputed' gestor in my town has also been telling people that they HAVE TO change their licence.....


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## Pesky Wesky

Info also here
https://www.gov.uk/living-in-spain#driving-licences-in-spain


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## mrypg9

xabiachica said:


> misinformation about driving licences has been circulating on forums & newspapers etc for as long as I can remember - it's possibly the most badly reported subject
> 
> 
> I'm a cynic  One often recommended & 'well reputed' gestor in my town has also been telling people that they HAVE TO change their licence.....


One of the first things an immigrant should be aware of is that there are very many well-meaning but ill-informed immigrants who, having spent a few years here, consider themselves knowledgeable about all things Spanish. People like to be helpful but aren't always....as we found out.
We are always reminded by the Mods that this Forum doesn't profess to give 100% accurate information and that it's best to find the most accurate source available...As has been pointed out, police and gestors and even abogados do not always give correct advice, as we found out when inquiring about what was needed to register our large dog.

I had driven on my UK licence for eight years since leaving the UK, perfectly legally. Whilst in Prague I drove a Czech registered car with Czech insurance on my UK-issued licence. Then in Spain I drove a Spanish registered and insured car, on the same UK licence, until two years ago when I lost my wallet with said licence and got a Spanish one quickly and without any complicated bureaucracy.

On two occasions I was asked by trafico to produce my driving licence and showed the UK one with no problem whatsoever. Someone told me that there is no longer a requirement to carry your licence with you at all times but I haven't verified that and anyway my licence is with me at all times as I use it for ID when shopping.


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## el romeral

As with most rules in Spain, there are loads of grey areas and confusion. Even the bodies or authorities who should know the score, often don't :noidea:.
I drove for 13 years on my Norwegian driving licence with no problem. It expired when I reached 100 years of age. Then 1.5 years ago I got stopped and the GC did not accept this driving licence any more. I got a 200 euro fine. Even the guy writing the ticket said that if I went to Traffico and explained then I may well not need to pay. In the end I just paid 100 euros within the 20 days or whatever ot was.
At that point I got a Spanish driving licence and (of course) have never been stopped since. Was not requested to take a medical though.


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## snikpoh

el romeral said:


> At that point I got a Spanish driving licence and (of course) have never been stopped since. Was not requested to take a medical though.


As with all things legal, the onus is on you to follow the laws of the country in which you are resident. 

And, as the saying goes, "ignorance of the law is no excuse". If you get stopped and are required to be holding a medical certificate, then don't be surprised if you are fined.


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## zx10r-Al

Could someone briefly explain the DL medical situation in Spain? When are they first and subsequently required? Are they required at different ages for bikes, cars, LGV? Does everyone need one at a particular age, or just people with certain medical conditions?


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## Pesky Wesky

zx10r-Al said:


> Could someone briefly explain the DL medical situation in Spain? When are they first and subsequently required? Are they required at different ages for bikes, cars, LGV? Does everyone need one at a particular age, or just people with certain medical conditions?


To get a driving licence to drive a car you need to get a medical.


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## Rabbitcat

Just to be clear. Are you saying that if you already have a car licence but want to exchange it to a Spanish one, a medical is required?


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## zx10r-Al

Pesky Wesky said:


> To get a driving licence to drive a car you need to get a medical. To drive a moped, you don't


Is that for people obtaining their first licence in Spain, or for those exchanging a UK licence for a Spanish one? Does it matter how old the licence holder is? What about those of us who have more than just a car licence in the UK, does the Spanish LGV licence require 5 year medicals after 45 years of age?


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## Pesky Wesky

zx10r-Al said:


> Is that for people obtaining their first licence in Spain, or for those exchanging a UK licence for a Spanish one? Does it matter how old the licence holder is? What about those of us who have more than just a car licence in the UK, does the Spanish LGV licence require 5 year medicals after 45 years of age?


I can only tell you about holders of Spanish licences. The info I gave in the previous post was for people obtaining their first licence in Spain.
Holders of a Spanish "B" licence have to renew it, and therefore have a medical, every ten years until the age of 65. After 65 it's every 5 years. People with certain medical conditions, for example diabetics, have to renew with more frequency.
Just as in other countries, holders of other categories have to renew their licence with more frequency, so taxi drivers, bus drivers etc have to renew every 5 years until 65 and then every 3.

The medical is very superficial and is an eye test, a questionnaire and a psicotécnico (computer based test to time speed of reaction). If you go to an authorised medical centre they can do everything for you ie do the test, take the photo, fill in the forms and send it off to the government department (Jefatura de Tráfico) and it's usually a lot easier to do it this way than go to Tráfico yourself.
There is some info here
https://www.gov.uk/living-in-spain#driving-licences-and-vehicles
but you could also try getting in touch with
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/members/ukinspain.html
a uk government representative who posts here


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## larryzx

Pesky Wesky said:


> The medical is very superficial and is an eye test, a questionnaire and a psicotécnico (computer based test to time speed of reaction). If you go to an authorised medical centre they can do everything for you ie do the test, take the photo, fill in the forms and send it off to the government department (Jefatura de Tráfico) and it's usually a lot easier to do it this way than go to Tráfico yourself.
> There is some info here


My medical in December 2013, was more comprehensive than any had been before. In fact since my first medical 20 + years ago the test has steadily become more comprehensive. 

The person conducting the test (doctor ? ) said that medical centres were now being heavily fined for not 'doing it correctly' and that was why the test he was making was more thorough. An additional test, was he held my hands in front of me, he then walked backward about 4 metres, I had to walk with my eyes closed, so that our hands touched again. I was an inch or two out. On the other tests he said I had done much better than the average.

I take Anti Coagulant medication. For that reason I had to get a certificate from my GP that the medication would not affect my ability to drive. (GP was amazed that I should be asked) My DL was renewed for just 2 years, as was my previous DL.

Although I was 74, I am very fit , and cycling 20 KM at an average of 24 kph, 4 days a week, have a clean licence, full no claims, and have been driving cars and big bikes (currently a 600 cc) since I was 17.


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## XTreme

Had to do the medical two years ago.....just look at some letters on the chart! Nothing more!



larryzx said:


> Although I was 74, I am very fit , and cycling 20 KM at an average of 24 kph, 4 days a week, have a clean licence, full no claims, and have been driving cars and big bikes (currently a 600 cc) since I was 17.


You sound bloody fit Larry! What you riding now?


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## Sandraw719

It is easy to change Uk license to Spanish one. We made an appointment and bring the documents and finished yesterday in Alicante. The lady took my husband's old green uk license without photo and gave him permission to drive until Apr 15. By then he should get his Spanish one. No medical test required. It costs 27.40 euros.


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## larryzx

Sandraw719 said:


> No medical test required..


Make sure your husband has a medical certificate, as that is a requirement, no matter where the D/L was issued (Spain, UK etc) * Without it the D/L is invalid, and without a valid D/L, in Spain the Insurance is invalid too.*


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## snikpoh

larryzx said:


> Make sure your husband has a medical certificate, as that is a requirement, no matter where the D/L was issued (Spain, UK etc) * Without it the D/L is invalid, and without a valid D/L, in Spain the Insurance is invalid too.*


Apart from the mandatory third party cover which can NOT be invalidated.

The Spanish authorities assume that one has a medical as one has a UK licence - there is no need to get one straight away.
Having said that, I would get one (and have done so) just to save any agro!


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## larryzx

snikpoh said:


> Apart from the mandatory third party cover which can NOT be invalidated.
> 
> The Spanish authorities assume that one has a medical as one has a UK licence - there is no need to get one straight away.
> Having said that, I would get one (and have done so) just to save any agro!


I was quoting from the writer of a couple of books on driving in Spain and from what he told me happened when he was in Court. A case was thrown out because although the injured party had a very good claim, he could not produce a medical certificate, valid for when the accident happened, and the judge ruled he was, therefore, driving without a DL and Insurance.

In an exchange with Linea Directa few years ago, their head of claims said that a person who failed a breathalyser test, was not covered even by obligatory insurance.

In these circumstance I do not understand why anyone would take even the slightest risk.

As you said, "The Spanish authorities assume that one has a medical as one has a UK licence." That being so, it would seem to imply that one is required to do so.


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## hmitchell

thanks for this info - I have often wondered what the situation is


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## Dunpleecin

I don't wish to muddy any waters here but if you do change to a Spanish licence and you're a regular visitor to the UK, and you drive there, you obviously won't be able to accept a fixed penalty notice for any offences you might commit. As there are no on the spot fines in the UK, the only other way of dealing with an offence would be by court appearance. This being the case, someone with a Spanish licence and no fixed address in the UK would almost certainly find themselves arrested for the offence and put before the first available court. This could be the day after the incident and so a night in the cells would ensue. If it was a Saturday then 2 nights. It's also highly possible that, knowing the pulava it all entails, the cops would just let you off with a warning. But it would depend on the gravity of the offence I would think. Or the zealousness of the cop for that matter.

If, on the other hand you retain your UK licence, then the fact the address isn't the one on the licence is very minor and wouldn't affect the ability to be able to accept an FPN.


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## larryzx

Dunpleecin said:


> If, on the other hand you retain your UK licence, then the fact the address isn't the one on the licence is very minor and wouldn't affect the ability to be able to accept an FPN.


The No Fixed Address would mean arrest in anything approaching seriousness, as they would not be able to serve the summons.

On the spot fines cater for that in Spain.


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## xabiaxica

larryzx said:


> The No Fixed Address would mean arrest in anything approaching seriousness, as they would not be able to serve the summons.
> 
> On the spot fines cater for that in Spain.


but you wouldn't be of 'no fixed address' - & the fact that you aren't a resident of the UK would mean that you weren't breaking any laws by having the wrong address on the licence


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## mrypg9

Dunpleecin said:


> I don't wish to muddy any waters here but if you do change to a Spanish licence and you're a regular visitor to the UK, and you drive there, you obviously won't be able to accept a fixed penalty notice for any offences you might commit. As there are no on the spot fines in the UK, the only other way of dealing with an offence would be by court appearance. This being the case, someone with a Spanish licence and no fixed address in the UK would almost certainly find themselves arrested for the offence and put before the first available court. This could be the day after the incident and so a night in the cells would ensue. If it was a Saturday then 2 nights. It's also highly possible that, knowing the pulava it all entails, the cops would just let you off with a warning. But it would depend on the gravity of the offence I would think. Or the zealousness of the cop for that matter.
> 
> If, on the other hand you retain your UK licence, then the fact the address isn't the one on the licence is very minor and wouldn't affect the ability to be able to accept an FPN.


You would be in the same position as a Spaniard on holiday in Spain driving on a Spanish licence, a German driving on a German licence and so on.
Ditto for a Brit driving on a UK licence on holiday in Spain. If the offence committed involved death or serious injury and there were reasonable grounds to believe you were driving under the influence or driving recklessly it would be a matter of course that you could be arrested and held in custody.

I think anyone looking for definitive information about what is and isn't legal here would be in a state of confusion, reading some of these threads.....Personal experiences are interesting but are merely anecdotal and tell nothing about the law itself. I've been guilty of two offences, one parking by a bus stop, the other driving without lights. In each case I was told politely to go away and not do it again. That obviously doesn't mean you can park where you like and drive without lights, it merely means that I was fortunate with the policemen I dealt with.
Plus you don't need to be in Spain for very long to learn that you will be offered a plethora of contradictory opinions about all sorts of things, with books, policemen and gestors brought forth as 'proof'.

In my first year in Prague I drove a Czech plated car but, for a few months, with a GB sticker next to the CZ one as OH wasn't too sure about driving on the right. I then had my UK licence but no Czech equivalent of the NIE so apart from my passport I had no ID. My passport bore my UK address. Whilst the GB sticker identified the car driver as a Brit we were stopped several times and given on the spot fines for offences that were very trivial. Handing your driving licence to the cops with a 200 CZK note folded round it was commonplace in Prague.But we insisted on being given receipts and paid the fines muttering Anglo-Saxon curses soto voce.
When we removed the sticker that was the end of being stopped and fined.

I have a very low opinion of the Czech police.


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## Dunpleecin

mrypg9 said:


> You would be in the same position as a Spaniard on holiday in Spain driving on a Spanish licence, a German driving on a German licence and so on.
> Ditto for a Brit driving on a UK licence on holiday in Spain. If the offence committed involved death or serious injury and there were reasonable grounds to believe you were driving under the influence or driving recklessly it would be a matter of course that you could be arrested and held in custody.
> 
> I think anyone looking for definitive information about what is and isn't legal here would be in a state of confusion, reading some of these threads.....Personal experiences are interesting but are merely anecdotal and tell nothing about the law itself. I've been guilty of two offences, one parking by a bus stop, the other driving without lights. In each case I was told politely to go away and not do it again. That obviously doesn't mean you can park where you like and drive without lights, it merely means that I was fortunate with the policemen I dealt with.
> Plus you don't need to be in Spain for very long to learn that you will be offered a plethora of contradictory opinions about all sorts of things, with books, policemen and gestors brought forth as 'proof'.
> 
> In my first year in Prague I drove a Czech plated car but, for a few months, with a GB sticker next to the CZ one as OH wasn't too sure about driving on the right. I then had my UK licence but no Czech equivalent of the NIE so apart from my passport I had no ID. My passport bore my UK address. Whilst the GB sticker identified the car driver as a Brit we were stopped several times and given on the spot fines for offences that were very trivial. Handing your driving licence to the cops with a 200 CZK note folded round it was commonplace in Prague.But we insisted on being given receipts and paid the fines muttering Anglo-Saxon curses soto voce.
> When we removed the sticker that was the end of being stopped and fined.
> 
> I have a very low opinion of the Czech police.


You missed my point buddy. I was merely pointing out that MINOR offences, which would normally attract a fixed penalty notice, in the absence of an on the spot fine option, would be dealt with by way of arrest, charge and court if the ex pat has a Spanish licence and no fixed UK address. This is the same for any foreigner of course who may be on holiday or business or whatever, but I raise the point because it could be that the ex pat considering getting a Spanish licence might well make frequent trips to the UK and drive and if they end up being caught speeding, or causing an obstruction, or something like that they wouldn't be eligible for an FPN. The foreigner being caught would most probably be let off with a warning, depending on the cop of course especially if they didn't speak the foreigners language. BUT an ex pat with a foreign licence might be seen as taking advantage of the system to said cop and may therefore not be as generous.


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## larryzx

Dunpleecin said:


> BUT an ex pat with a foreign licence might be seen as taking advantage of the system to said cop and may therefore not be as generous.


I don't see why that should be the attitude of a UK police officer.

In any case, if a person living in Spain has a UK D/L they would still have NFA (No fixed address in UK). A postal address (former address, address of a relative etc) is not a Fixed Address for the purposes of UK law. 

Thus they too would stand just the same chance of being arrested for a non-arrestable offence, as a visitor to UK.

_For clarity. In UK a person can be arrested for any offence, no matter how trivial, if they do not have a fixed address in UK or the office believes an address supplied is unsuitable for the service of a summons. 

NB This is brief explanation, more info is available at:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrestable_offence_


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## Dunpleecin

larryzx said:


> I don't see why that should be the attitude of a UK police officer.
> 
> In any case, if a person living in Spain has a UK D/L they would still have NFA (No fixed address in UK). A postal address (former address, address of a relative etc) is not a Fixed Address for the purposes of UK law.
> 
> Thus they too would stand just the same chance of being arrested for a non-arrestable offence, as a visitor to UK.
> 
> _For clarity. In UK a person can be arrested for any offence, no matter how trivial, if they do not have a fixed address in UK or the office believes an address supplied is unsuitable for the service of a summons.
> 
> NB This is brief explanation, more info is available at:- Arrestable offence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia_


There's no need to complicate things. The only point made was for someone considering changing to a Spanish licence if they were going to regularly drive in the UK and the possible pitfalls if they did.


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## xabiaxica

press release from the DGT 29th December 2014 - holders of standard 10 year photo licences only have to change when they expire - holders of some other categories _do _have to if they have been resident here for 2 years or more

Los residentes comunitarios con dos años o más de residencia en España deberán renovar su permiso de conducción


----------



## snikpoh

xabiachica said:


> press release from the DGT 29th December 2014 - holders of standard 10 year photo licences only have to change when they expire - holders of some other categories _do _have to if they have been resident here for 2 years or more
> 
> Los residentes comunitarios con dos años o más de residencia en España deberán renovar su permiso de conducción



I don't understand - that's always been the case (or has it?).


----------



## xabiaxica

snikpoh said:


> I don't understand - that's always been the case (or has it?).


yes it has - but look how many discussions there are about it, here & on other forums & on Facebook groups - & read English language newspapers & you might think otherwise 

This is the latest press release, so I thought it useful to post it

it does say that everyone exchanging a licence will need a medical - that's new I think?


----------



## CapnBilly

xabiachica said:


> yes it has - but look how many discussions there are about it, here & on other forums & on Facebook groups - & read English language newspapers & you might think otherwise
> 
> This is the latest press release, so I thought it useful to post it
> 
> it does say that everyone exchanging a licence will need a medical - that's new I think?


No, it's not new. It's because they are effectively renewing it, as opposed to exchanging it. For the former you need a medical, for the latter you don't.


----------



## xabiaxica

CapnBilly said:


> No, it's not new. It's because they are effectively renewing it, as opposed to exchanging it. For the former you need a medical, for the latter you don't.


hmmmm - so many people seem to have different experiences

I know some who changed to a Spanish licence when their UK ones expired, who didn't need a medical - & some who did

likewise some who exchanged before they needed to - some did, some didn't have to have medicals

not all pensioners either, which is what a lot of people seem to think makes the difference


of course it doesn't help that traffic police still issue fines for people with EU / UK licences. I know several it has happened to. They appealed & won on appeal, but they should never have been fined in the first place !


----------



## Williams2

mrypg9 said:


> I think anyone looking for definitive information about what is and isn't legal here would be in a state of confusion, reading some of these threads.....Personal experiences are interesting but are merely anecdotal and tell nothing about the law itself. I've been guilty of two offences, one parking by a bus stop, the other driving without lights. In each case I was told politely to go away and not do it again. That obviously doesn't mean you can park where you like and drive without lights, it merely means that I was fortunate with the policemen I dealt with.
> Plus you don't need to be in Spain for very long to learn that you will be offered a plethora of contradictory opinions about all sorts of things, with books, policemen and gestors brought forth as 'proof'.


There are 2 Parking offenses, that I frequently see many Spanish drivers make, particularly in towns and cities
where the 'white line parking' areas are fully taken up, along either side of the road.
These are parking 'in the road' but close alongside the row of cars, parked along the 'white line' curbside - 
particularly if - in doing so it's close to a shop or apartment they are going to - with little regard to the
motorist who subsequently comes back, to find their car 'boxed in'
The other favourite is parking on the curve of a street corner - lost count of the number of times
I see that happen.


----------



## larryzx

Williams2 said:


> There are 2 Parking offenses, that I frequently see many Spanish drivers make, particularly in towns and cities
> where the 'white line parking' areas are fully taken up, along either side of the road.
> These are parking 'in the road' but close alongside the row of cars, parked along the 'white line' curbside -
> particularly if - in doing so it's close to a shop or apartment they are going to - with little regard to the
> motorist who subsequently comes back, to find their car 'boxed in'
> The other favourite is parking on the curve of a street corner - lost count of the number of times
> I see that happen.


I can only assume that if it's just 2 then you either do not know the law or walk around with your eyes closed.

However, it would also seem you may not have lived in Spain that long, as most of us would not comment on such 'trivial offences' when there are so many others which are so much more serious.


----------



## xabiaxica

interestingly, after I posted the link to the press release on a local FB group, some people printed it off, to carry in their car - 'just in case'

a guy posted last night that he had just been stopped at a 'control point' & they asked for his licence - after asking how long he has been resident here - he's been here more than 2 years

that was actually their first question - nothing else

they then proceeded to tell him that his EU / UK photo licence was invalid & that he had a 200€ fine & that he has to get it changed immediately

of course there are two dates on the licence - the one at which you turn 70 & the actual expiry date on the photo

he showed the police the DGT press release & the expiry date on the photo on his licence 

they grudgingly let him go on his way


----------



## The Skipper

Dunpleecin said:


> I don't wish to muddy any waters here but if you do change to a Spanish licence and you're a regular visitor to the UK, and you drive there, you obviously won't be able to accept a fixed penalty notice for any offences you might commit. As there are no on the spot fines in the UK, the only other way of dealing with an offence would be by court appearance. This being the case, someone with a Spanish licence and no fixed address in the UK would almost certainly find themselves arrested for the offence and put before the first available court. This could be the day after the incident and so a night in the cells would ensue. If it was a Saturday then 2 nights. It's also highly possible that, knowing the pulava it all entails, the cops would just let you off with a warning. But it would depend on the gravity of the offence I would think. Or the zealousness of the cop for that matter.
> 
> If, on the other hand you retain your UK licence, then the fact the address isn't the one on the licence is very minor and wouldn't affect the ability to be able to accept an FPN.


As the holder of a Spanish driving licence, with no UK address, this information worried me a little so, over the holiday period, I asked an English policeman friend about it. He said it would never happen, except in exceptional circumstances (suspicion of causing death by dangerous driving, for example, which would probably also result in a locally- based driver being put behind bars for the night). In normal circumstances the police would simply take your Spanish address and licence details and issue the fixed penalty ticket. If you failed to pay, the case would be referred to the courts, the same as with a UK driver, and eventually an arrest warrant could be issued. Under EU law, this could be enforced in Spain through the reciprocal arrangements that now exist between police forces. Apparently these reciprocal arrangements are regularly used and work well. So, I haven´t got to worry about being locked up overnight in the UK for breaking a traffic regulation!


----------



## Dunpleecin

The Skipper said:


> As the holder of a Spanish driving licence, with no UK address, this information worried me a little so, over the holiday period, I asked an English policeman friend about it. He said it would never happen, except in exceptional circumstances (suspicion of causing death by dangerous driving, for example, which would probably also result in a locally- based driver being put behind bars for the night). In normal circumstances the police would simply take your Spanish address and licence details and issue the fixed penalty ticket. If you failed to pay, the case would be referred to the courts, the same as with a UK driver, and eventually an arrest warrant could be issued. Under EU law, this could be enforced in Spain through the reciprocal arrangements that now exist between police forces. Apparently these reciprocal arrangements are regularly used and work well. So, I haven´t got to worry about being locked up overnight in the UK for breaking a traffic regulation!


Was he a traffic officer and did he say how the DVLA would issue points on a Spanish Licence?


----------



## gus-lopez

The Skipper said:


> As the holder of a Spanish driving licence, with no UK address, this information worried me a little so, over the holiday period, I asked an English policeman friend about it. He said it would never happen, except in exceptional circumstances (suspicion of causing death by dangerous driving, for example, which would probably also result in a locally- based driver being put behind bars for the night). In normal circumstances the police would simply take your Spanish address and licence details and issue the fixed penalty ticket. If you failed to pay, the case would be referred to the courts, the same as with a UK driver, and eventually an arrest warrant could be issued. Under EU law, this could be enforced in Spain through the reciprocal arrangements that now exist between police forces. Apparently these reciprocal arrangements are regularly used and work well. So, I haven´t got to worry about being locked up overnight in the UK for breaking a traffic regulation!


Unfortunately it couldn't as Spanish road traffic offences aren't criminal & non payment of the actual fines would be attached to the spanish vehicle, same as non payment here is. Can't see that an extradition could take place for the non-payment as it isn't an offence in Spain.


----------



## The Skipper

Dunpleecin said:


> Was he a traffic officer and did he say how the DVLA would issue points on a Spanish Licence?


I didn´t question the mechanics of the system with my friend as my only concern was whether or not I could end up behind bars for a relatively minor traffic offence in the UK, being the holder of a Spanish licence and not having a UK address. On this point he assured me it just wouldn´t happen. I didn´t seek an explanation of how the various cross border agreements actually work as this wasn´t really of any interest to me. Sorry I can´t be of more assistance.


----------



## The Skipper

gus-lopez said:


> Unfortunately it couldn't as Spanish road traffic offences aren't criminal & non payment of the actual fines would be attached to the spanish vehicle, same as non payment here is. Can't see that an extradition could take place for the non-payment as it isn't an offence in Spain.


As I have explained in my reply to another post, I don´t know how it actually all works. My only concern was to find out if it was true that the holder of a Spanish driving licence (like myself) could end up behind bars if caught committing a relatively minor road traffic offence in the UK and my UK policeman friend assured me this would not happen. I just did a quick Google inquiry to see if I could find out more and this link may be of interest:
FAQ: EU Cross Border Enforcement Directive | ETSC 
In particular, this quote seems relevant: "Current co-operation agreements exist in the form of bi-lateral and multi-lateral agreements and many EU Member States already have systems in place to follow up traffic fines."


----------



## The Skipper

Dunpleecin said:


> Was he a traffic officer and did he say how the DVLA would issue points on a Spanish Licence?


Further my previous reply, I got the bit between my teeth and did some research. This Crown Prosecution Service web page gives an explanation of how foreign driving licence holders are dealt with for motoring offences in the UK, in particular see the section headed: "Fixed penalty notices for non-GB licence holders, even for endorseable offences." 
The web address is:
Road Traffic Offences: Guidance on Fixed Penalty Notices


----------



## Pussyrampion

Can a UK resident in Spain with a Spanish driving licence drive a UK registered car?


----------



## xabiaxica

Pussyrampion said:


> Can a UK resident in Spain with a Spanish driving licence drive a UK registered car?


:welcome:


do you mean drive it in Spain?

in which case no, not if it's their own car

if they have visitors with a UK plated car, they can drive that car - assuming they're insured to, of course


----------



## snikpoh

xabiachica said:


> :welcome:
> 
> 
> do you mean drive it in Spain?
> 
> in which case no, not if it's their own car
> 
> if they have visitors with a UK plated car, they can drive that car - assuming they're insured to, of course


Why not? Did you miss that they are UK residents?





Pussyrampion said:


> Can a UK resident in Spain with a Spanish driving licence drive a UK registered car?


As a UK resident, do you have plans to change your licence to a British one?


----------



## xabiaxica

snikpoh said:


> Why not? Did you miss that they are UK residents?


haha - totally

though I read it several times & came to a different understanding of the question each time!

are they from the UK & resident in Spain, or resident in the UK & visiting Spain :confused2:


it's probably the latter....... we've had so many posts stating 'citizen' instead or 'resident' that I'm getting befuddled....


snikpoh said:


> As a UK resident, do you have plans to change your licence to a British one?


I was wondering that too


----------



## gus-lopez

Pussyrampion said:


> Can a UK resident in Spain with a Spanish driving licence drive a UK registered car?


No. 
No resident of any EU state can drive a foreign registered vehicle except for, "professional drivers" & car hire workers who may be required to drive a foreign vehcile between depots in home country or back to the original country.


----------



## gus-lopez

xabiachica said:


> :welcome:
> 
> 
> do you mean drive it in Spain?
> 
> in which case no, not if it's their own car
> 
> if they have visitors with a UK plated car, they can drive that car - assuming they're insured to, of course


No , I thought that & had it out with the DVLA & The EU. A resident of any EU state cannot drive a foreign registered car whether their own or someone else's. 
Except professional drivers & car hire employee's. 


article 3 Directive 83/182 forbids for the car in question to be lent to a third party.


----------



## larryzx

I asked RACE (The Automobile Club of Spain) about this some years ago. 

I was told that a resident could only drive a non-Spanish registered vehicle in 'unusual circumstances'. Example, in an emergency, as a mechanic testing a vehicle, maybe for some one who's aged mother was arriving at the airport and needed transport and that person was unable to pick her up as he was unwell, etc.

I knew a guy who had residencia (as ¡t was in those days) who had sold up and was ready to leave Spain the next day. He bought a UK Reg car to drive back to UK but had not cancelled his residencia. A neighbour informed the police who came and confiscated the car and fined him.


----------



## snikpoh

larryzx said:


> I asked RACE (The Automobile Club of Spain) about this some years ago.
> 
> I was told that a resident could only drive a non-Spanish registered vehicle in 'unusual circumstances'. Example, in an emergency, as mechanic testing a vehicle, maybe for some one who's aged mother was arriving at the airport and needed transport and that person was unable to pick her up as he was unwell, etc
> 
> I knew a guy who had residencia (as ¡t was in those days) who had sold up and was ready to leave Spain. He bought a UK Reg car to drive back to UK but had not cancelled his residencia. A neighbour informed the police who came and confiscated the car and fined him.


The OP is UK resident - so none of this is true (surely?).


----------



## snikpoh

gus-lopez said:


> No.
> No resident of any EU state can drive a foreign registered vehicle except for, "professional drivers" & car hire workers who may be required to drive a foreign vehcile between depots in home country or back to the original country.


So, if I understand you correctly;

If I were to go back to the UK tomorrow, with a Spanish Licence, then I could NOT continue to drive my Spanish plated vehicle whilst I got it changed to UK plates.


... or, I could not drive a rented vehicle in Spain?

Doh !!!!!!!!!!


Needs more clarification I think.


----------



## larryzx

snikpoh said:


> The OP is UK resident - so none of this is true (surely?).


Sorry for not reading all the 60 odd posts, but I was following the general line and so was 'befuddled' too like xabiachica.


----------



## Relyat

UK "resident", but living in Spain (not yet received Spanish resident status)
UK licence
Spanish reg car
Spanish insurance

Am I legal?


----------



## xabiaxica

Relyat said:


> UK "resident", but living in Spain (not yet received Spanish resident status)
> UK licence
> Spanish reg car
> Spanish insurance
> 
> Am I legal?



as long as your licence hasn't expired or you need to change it in accordance with the most recent rules, then yes, you're legal

DO I HAVE TO EXCHANGE MY EU DRIVING LICENCE? | LEARN-APRENDER


----------



## larryzx

Relyat, I know this is off thread, but as you mentioned it, and also asked of you are legal.

If you are indeed living in Spain, that is not just visiting, then regardless of how long you have been here, you required to register here on the EU register. 

If you are just visiting, if you have been here 3 months permanently, then you are required to register too.


----------



## xabiaxica

larryzx said:


> Relyat, I know this is off thread, but as you mentioned it, and also asked of you are legal.
> 
> If you are indeed living in Spain, that is not just visiting, then regardless of how long you have been here, you required to register here on the EU register.
> 
> If you are just visiting, if you have been here 3 months permanently, then you are required to register too.


if you look back on some of Relyat's posts - there's a been a bit of a hitch as far as registering is concerned, beyond his control - it's not for want of trying


----------



## Guest

larryzx said:


> Relyat, I know this is off thread, but as you mentioned it, and also asked of you are legal.
> 
> If you are indeed living in Spain, that is not just visiting, then regardless of how long you have been here, you required to register here on the EU register.
> 
> If you are just visiting, if you have been here 3 months permanently, then you are required to register too.


Off topic I know, but I'm confused. What is the difference - if any - between the EU register and "residencia".


----------



## snikpoh

For EU citizens, the term 'residencia' is actually incorrect - but it's what a lot of people use, simply for ease.

You actually sign on the list of foreigners and get a 'certificate of registration'.


----------



## larryzx

meetloaf said:


> Off topic I know, but I'm confused. What is the difference - if any - between the EU register and "residencia".


You ask what is the difference?

‘EU Citizen Registration’ applies to only EU Citizens, all of whom have the right to live in Spain.

‘Residencia’’Applies to all Non EU citizens. The footwork/paperwork for which is somewhat more involved than registration and it is not a right but a privilege.

They are completely different things. 

Occasionally when a person goes to the National Police to make an application, and ask for say Residencia instead of registration, or vice versa, they can waste time by starting off incorrectly by applying for something which does not apply to them. 

An example: I have been present when a British citizen of Asian appearance asked for Residencia instead of Registration. The officer at the desk, believing he was not EU, and that knew what he was asking for, sent him off to another office, 30 kilometres away. It was only when I intervened that we discovered it was Registration which he wanted as he was of course an EU citizen.

Using the wrong terminology can cause problems, like maybe asking for a passport when you want a visa, similar but different .

I hope I have cleared up your confusion Meatloaf.


----------



## Guest

larryzx said:


> I hope I have cleared up your confusion Meatloaf.


Yes indeed. That's a very clear explanation. I think the terminology has indeed been causing some confusion.


----------



## larryzx

meetloaf said:


> * I think the terminology has indeed been causing some confusion*.



Well said Meetloaf, if only everyone would accept that one needs to use the right terminology to avoid confusion, instead of thinking that, as they know what they mean, they can use the wrong word but nevertheless everyone will understand what they really wanted to say !


----------



## VickiD

Gareth54 said:


> I would think that if you are driving a Spanish registered car, insured here you would also need to get a Spanish licence. Had to change mine when I lived in Holland, driving a Dutch car and insured there.


Interesting! I've lived in Holland for 8 years, owned three different cars for 7 years and never been required to change my licence!


----------



## snikpoh

xabiachica said:


> as long as your licence hasn't expired or you need to change it in accordance with the most recent rules, then yes, you're legal
> 
> DO I HAVE TO EXCHANGE MY EU DRIVING LICENCE? | LEARN-APRENDER


With the new directive coming in this May, the Guardia are 'insisting' that anyone who has been in Spain for more than 2 years 'has' to change to a Spanish licence. This is despite one having a vaid, in-date, European licence. It's all to do with the fact that there are minor differences between countries.


The interesting thing is that this is simply a directive and not a law. So, even though the Guardia will try and enforce this directive, they actually can't do anything else about it!


@Xabiachica - you may want to revise your document in the light of this new directive.


----------



## xabiaxica

snikpoh said:


> With the new directive coming in this May, the Guardia are 'insisting' that anyone who has been in Spain for more than 2 years 'has' to change to a Spanish licence. This is despite one having a vaid, in-date, European licence. It's all to do with the fact that there are minor differences between countries.
> 
> 
> The interesting thing is that this is simply a directive and not a law. So, even though the Guardia will try and enforce this directive, they actually can't do anything else about it!
> 
> 
> @Xabiachica - you may want to revise your document in the light of this new directive.


yes I've seen that directive


I have also looked at a lot of driving licences in the past couple of weeks - all but a few have in fact had the categories listed, which indicate the need/requirement to change them, so it _could be_ that a majority will indeed need to exchange their licences


----------



## rod panhard

How do you change the licence, is it the town hall or so the spanish have a dvla?


----------



## xabiaxica

rod panhard said:


> How do you change the licence, is it the town hall or so the spanish have a dvla?


you do it at the nearest Tráfico office - the link in snikpoh's post tells you what you need 


the Spanish version of the DVLA is the DGT - they make the rules


----------



## baldilocks

I haven't been all through this thread (eyes are bothering me today, so reading difficult) so excuse me if this has been mentioned: 

In 2013 The vehicle categories were changed so if anybody has a UK licence from before that date, the groups may be different and not accepted by the GC.

From 2013, the groups are the same throughout the EU.


----------



## xabiaxica

your licence needs to change in the following circumstances (from the link) 



> Holders of licences with no expiry date or with a life of 15 or more years.
> Holders of Group 1 licences – AM, A1, A2, A, B y BE
> Holders of Group 2 licences with an expiration date of more than 5 years – BTP, C1, C1E, C, CE D1, D1E, D, DE


many of these categories were issued as standard in the UK until not so very long ago, so it's possible that you have these categories whether or not you wanted them, or need them


----------



## anles

xabiachica said:


> your licence needs to change in the following circumstances (from the link)
> 
> 
> 
> many of these categories were issued as standard in the UK until not so very long ago, so it's possible that you have these categories whether or not you wanted them, or need them


This doesn't seem very clear because it seems that if you hold a license that is valid for 15 years or indefinite, *or *if you hold one the category B (which is the normal license for a car) you have to exchange but, in fact it is only if the license in group *1* is indefinite or valid for 15 years and group 2 if valid for 5:
_Los residentes comunitarios con residencia legal en España obtenida el 19 de enero de 2013 o anterior a esta fecha y que sean titulares de un permiso de conducción comunitario indefinido o con un plazo de vigencia superior a 15 años para permisos del Grupo 1 (AM, A1, A2, A, B y BE) o un plazo superior a 5 años para permisos del Grupo 2 (BTP, C1, C1E, C, CE D1, D1E, D, DE) deberán renovar su permiso de conducción a partir del próximo 19 de enero de 2015.
También deberán renovarlo aquellos residentes legales titulares de permisos comunitarios que tengan su permiso caducado o próximo a caducar._

This is copied from the link which was in an earlier post on this thread from the DGT.


----------



## snikpoh

anles said:


> This doesn't seem very clear because it seems that if you hold a license that is valid for 15 years or indefinite, *or *if you hold one the category B (which is the normal license for a car) you have to exchange but, in fact it is only if the license in group *1* is indefinite or valid for 15 years and group 2 if valid for 5:
> _Los residentes comunitarios con residencia legal en España obtenida el 19 de enero de 2013 o anterior a esta fecha y que sean titulares de un permiso de conducción comunitario indefinido o con un plazo de vigencia superior a 15 años para permisos del Grupo 1 (AM, A1, A2, A, B y BE) o un plazo superior a 5 años para permisos del Grupo 2 (BTP, C1, C1E, C, CE D1, D1E, D, DE) deberán renovar su permiso de conducción a partir del próximo 19 de enero de 2015.
> También deberán renovarlo aquellos residentes legales titulares de permisos comunitarios que tengan su permiso caducado o próximo a caducar._
> 
> This is copied from the link which was in an earlier post on this thread from the DGT.


But ..., I thought the plastic (UK) licence was only valid for 10 years and then it had to be updated. Which it can't be if you're resident in Spain.


So, who's licence lasts for 15 years or indefinitely?


----------



## xabiaxica

anles said:


> This doesn't seem very clear because it seems that if you hold a license that is valid for 15 years or indefinite, *or *if you hold one the category B (which is the normal license for a car) you have to exchange but, in fact it is only if the license in group *1* is indefinite or valid for 15 years and group 2 if valid for 5:
> _Los residentes comunitarios con residencia legal en España obtenida el 19 de enero de 2013 o anterior a esta fecha y que sean titulares de un permiso de conducción comunitario indefinido o con un plazo de vigencia superior a 15 años para permisos del Grupo 1 (AM, A1, A2, A, B y BE) o un plazo superior a 5 años para permisos del Grupo 2 (BTP, C1, C1E, C, CE D1, D1E, D, DE) deberán renovar su permiso de conducción a partir del próximo 19 de enero de 2015.
> También deberán renovarlo aquellos residentes legales titulares de permisos comunitarios que tengan su permiso caducado o próximo a caducar._
> 
> This is copied from the link which was in an earlier post on this thread from the DGT.


those in Group 1 would have a 15 year or indefinite validity, those in Group 2 would have 5 years

essentially, if your licence carries any of those categories, you have to change


----------



## xabiaxica

snikpoh said:


> But ..., I thought the plastic (UK) licence was only valid for 10 years and then it had to be updated. Which it can't be if you're resident in Spain.
> 
> 
> So, who's licence lasts for 15 years or indefinitely?


some people still have the old paper, pre-EU photo licences!!


but not for much longer


----------



## larryzx

Decided that as I had chosen to live in Spain there was no reason not to change my DL to a Spanish one sooner rather than later. In fact I thought that if I get stopped by the police, that I had a Spanish DL causes no problem as they understand it, and as such I am more or less just one of the crowd. 

I also knew that when I reached 70 I would not be able to renew my UK DL as I was not living in UK. 

I have not regretted my decision and would recommend doing it.


----------



## xabiaxica

larryzx said:


> Decided that as I had chosen to live in Spain there was no reason not to change my DL to a Spanish one sooner rather than later. In fact I thought that if I get stopped by the police, that I had a Spanish DL causes no problem as they understand it, and as such I am more or less just one of the crowd.
> 
> I also knew that when I reached 70 I would not be able to renew my UK DL as I was not living in UK.
> 
> I have not regretted my decision and would recommend doing it.


it's the sensible & obvious thing to do for the vast majority

but for some, the fact that they will be without a licence which can be used outside Spain for a couple of months or maybe longer, is a big problem


----------



## larryzx

xabiachica said:


> it's the sensible & obvious thing to do for the vast majority
> 
> but for some, the fact that they will be without a licence which can be used outside Spain for a couple of months or maybe longer, is a big problem


Are you saying that a UK D/L allows one to drive in some countries which a Spanish one does not ?


----------



## baldilocks

larryzx said:


> Are you saying that a UK D/L allows one to drive in some countries which a Spanish one does not ?


I think that what xabia means is they take a while to process the exchange and, in the interim, you only have a small piece of card which is not a valid driving licence and is only acceptable in Spain as proof that the authorities have your licence.


----------



## xabiaxica

baldilocks said:


> I think that what xabia means is they take a while to process the exchange and, in the interim, you only have a small piece of card which is not a valid driving licence and is only acceptable in Spain as proof that the authorities have your licence.


yes that's exactly what I meant - thanks


----------



## larryzx

My wife and a couple of friends have recently exchanged Philippines DLs. They got the temporary card and within 2 weeks the DL came in the post.

Where did the couple of months wait come from ?


----------



## xabiaxica

larryzx said:


> My wife and a couple of friends have recently exchanged Philippines DLs. They got the temporary card and within 2 weeks the DL came in the post.
> 
> Where did the couple of months wait come from ?


it's often longer than 2 ¡months in Alicante - or has been for a lot of people local to me


the DVLA always seems to get the blame


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## larryzx

xabiachica said:


> it's often longer than 2 ¡months in Alicante - or has been for a lot of people local to me
> 
> 
> the DVLA always seems to get the blame


When we did the paperwork, Trafico said it would take a month. 

Anyway, as I said, if one is not actually living in the UK they cannot re-new their DL, so if one lives long enough then it will have be exchanged at some time, so why wait.


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## xabiaxica

larryzx said:


> When we did the paperwork, Trafico said it would take a month.
> 
> Anyway, as I said, if one is not actually living in the UK they cannot re-new their DL, so if one lives long enough then it will have be exchanged at some time, so why wait.


hardly matters how long trafico says it will take - some people are waiting even longer than 2 months with a temp licence

& yes others know that they'll have to do it eventually - but they'll do it when it's convenient or when they have no option - whichever comes first 

they just can't bear the thought of being so long without a licence they can use in the UK - just in case they have to go there


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## larryzx

xabiachica said:


> hardly matters how long trafico says it will take - some people are waiting even longer than 2 months with a temp licence


As you say some people may, but the only evidence I have contradicts that. Maybe I only know lucky people or maybe Trafico is more efficient in some parts of Spain, or maybe they have become more efficient.


Maybe 10 years I ago waited more than 3 months for a DL when I re-rewed it through a gestor ( I was issued with a second temporary one) but that was I believe every exceptional. I not know how long it would be before one got a replacement if they did it direct at Trafico.


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## Maureen47

I have been reading through the thread trying to work out what we need to do , a link one of posters provided says this

Those who need to change are the following, if they have lived here since January 19th 2013 or before – & within 2 years of residency for those arriving since that date:
•Holders of licences with no expiry date or with a life of 15 or more years in Group 1 – AM, A1, A2, A, B y BE
•Holders of Group 2 licences with an expiration date of more than 5 years – BTP, C1, C1E, C, CE D1, D1E, D, DE


Both my husband and I hold Group 2 licences and therefore will need to change according to this information , my question is 

Do we retain all the categories automatically on our Spanish licence when we change ?


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## snikpoh

maureen47 said:


> I have been reading through the thread trying to work out what we need to do , a link one of posters provided says this
> 
> Those who need to change are the following, if they have lived here since January 19th 2013 or before – & within 2 years of residency for those arriving since that date:
> •Holders of licences with no expiry date or with a life of 15 or more years in Group 1 – AM, A1, A2, A, B y BE
> •Holders of Group 2 licences with an expiration date of more than 5 years – BTP, C1, C1E, C, CE D1, D1E, D, DE
> 
> 
> Both my husband and I hold Group 2 licences and therefore will need to change according to this information , my question is
> 
> Do we retain all the categories automatically on our Spanish licence when we change ?


... and the answer is - "not necessarily". The EU is trying to standardise the categories.

I lost D, D1 and D1E when I exchanged mine. It might be, though, that these are not automatic in UK anymore - just depends how old your licence is.


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## Maureen47

snikpoh said:


> ... and the answer is - "not necessarily". The EU is trying to standardise the categories.
> 
> I lost D, D1 and D1E when I exchanged mine. It might be, though, that these are not automatic in UK anymore - just depends how old your licence is.


I renewed my licence in the UK in 2013 and the categories were automatically the same as before, its not really an issue for me but may be for my husband particularly his full bike licence , he certainly wouldn't want to lose that !


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## baldilocks

snikpoh said:


> ... and the answer is - "not necessarily". The EU is trying to standardise the categories.
> 
> I lost D, D1 and D1E when I exchanged mine. It might be, though, that these are not automatic in UK anymore - just depends how old your licence is.


I think you might find that as far as the 'D's (bus licences) are concerned, you might have had to have a specific medical in force at the time. I was asked if I wanted to retain my bus licence at the time I exchanged and since I did not envisage ever driving a bus (either a mini or double decker) ever again, I declined.


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## snikpoh

maureen47 said:


> I renewed my licence in the UK in 2013 and the categories were automatically the same as before, its not really an issue for me but may be for my husband particularly his full bike licence , he certainly wouldn't want to lose that !


Originally they left off my bike categories. I complained and the licence was re-issued with them on.

Simply an oversight by them.


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## moonman

i hold an eu licence (credit card size) issued in ireland. it has an expiry date of may 2016. the irish licence has always only lasted for 10 years and then it has to be renewed. once one reaches 70years of age a licence is only issued for 3 years. if one wears glasses in the photo on the licence the applicant has to have an eye test plus over 70s need a medical form stamped by their gp. i renewed my licence on its last 10 year period in 2013 and they only issued it with a termination date of one day before my 70 th birthday. i have enquired in fuengirola police station and they have said that my licence is legal . i think what the police look for when one is stopped is the card type .


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## snikpoh

moonman said:


> i hold an eu licence (credit card size) issued in ireland. it has an expiry date of may 2016. the irish licence has always only lasted for 10 years and then it has to be renewed. once one reaches 70years of age a licence is only issued for 3 years. if one wears glasses in the photo on the licence the applicant has to have an eye test plus over 70s need a medical form stamped by their gp. i renewed my licence on its last 10 year period in 2013 and they only issued it with a termination date of one day before my 70 th birthday. i have enquired in fuengirola police station and they have said that my licence is legal . i think what the police look for when one is stopped is the card type .


The police are correct. If you have an (UK) EU licence (ping credit card sized) then this is legal until it expires when a resident of Spain will have to exchange it for a Spanish one.

There is a lot of misinformation (simply wrong!) in the press this week. I have just read three articles in the Post, the RTN and the Euro Weekly News - only the EWN has it correct.


There is NOT a new law stating that you have to change your UK licence within 2 years of being resident here! If you have and old style licence, then it will need changing, otherwise there is simply a directive (not yet in law) to ask everyone to change to a Spanish licence - but it is NOT compulsory.

If anyone wants to know the truth, look it up on the DGT website - simples!

<rant over>


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## moonman

i have been assured that if i renew my pink card licence in may 2016 with a new one in ireland it will be recognised in all ec countries. i also have been assured that the licencing procedure is the same throughout the ec, in other words there is no scope for a single country to make a seperate law for licencing purposes , apparently this was agreed between them at masstricht or one of the other conventions they have every few years.


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## baldilocks

moonman said:


> i have been assured that if i renew my pink card licence in may 2016 with a new one in ireland it will be recognised in all ec countries. i also have been assured that the licencing procedure is the same throughout the ec, in other words there is no scope for a single country to make a seperate law for licencing purposes , apparently this was agreed between them at masstricht or one of the other conventions they have every few years.


I think you are sort of blurring the issue. The commonality is in the categories and the groups of vehicles one is allowed to drive. For example the "D" licences all relate to PCVs, "A" relates to motorcycles, etc. 

See:
https://www.gov.uk/driving-licence-categories
and these categories apply throughout the EU so that your group B licence will be recognised as a Group B elsewhere and you will be able to drive the same vehicles elsewhere in the EU


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## moonman

baldilocks said:


> I think you are sort of blurring the issue. The commonality is in the categories and the groups of vehicles one is allowed to drive. For example the "D" licences all relate to PCVs, "A" relates to motorcycles, etc.
> 
> See:
> https://www.gov.uk/driving-licence-categories
> and these categories apply throughout the EU so that your group B licence will be recognised as a Group B elsewhere and you will be able to drive the same vehicles elsewhere in the EU


i am talking about my licence which is a d, and w category . most people who are discussing the licence issue are discussing d which is for a normal motor car. i have been assured by the police in fuengirola and dublin that my licence is valid in both countries and as i have said already in all of the ec countries. and according to both of them i can renew it in either country as the medical process will be the same in all areas of europe who are in the ec plus switzewland and a few others who have not joined. ireland brought in this new rule in 2013 when the above was agreed in brussels.


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## baldilocks

moonman said:


> i am talking about my licence which is a d, and w category . most people who are discussing the licence issue are discussing d which is for a normal motor car. i have been assured by the police in fuengirola and dublin that my licence is valid in both countries and as i have said already in all of the ec countries. and according to both of them i can renew it in either country as the medical process will be the same in all areas of europe who are in the ec plus switzewland and a few others who have not joined. ireland brought in this new rule in 2013 when the above was agreed in brussels.


I regret to say that you are wrong. The EU category D is NOT ordinary motor cars.


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## moonman

sorry a typing error it is a B licence..


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## Torre

*driving licence*

I have a UK driving licence. Under the laws that have just come in, do I need to change this. I have lived in Spain for 8 years


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## tonymar

Good question , I still have my Uk licence after being here 12 years ! 

To be honest I think I will change it soon as my photo card part of the licence expires next year .

Any info on how to do it welcome !

Tony Agost Alicante


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## xabiaxica

Torre said:


> I have a UK driving licence. Under the laws that have just come in, do I need to change this. I have lived in Spain for 8 years


:welcome:

I've moved your question to a current discussion on that very subject

the answer is 'maybe'

if under according to the rules issued by the DGT, it needs to be renewed, then yes, you need to renew it in Spain, as a resident of Spain

& you'll end up with a Spanish licence 

if it doesn't need to be renewed now, then you don't have to do anything until such time as it does

this explains the rules issued by the DGT 
*DO I HAVE TO EXCHANGE / RENEW MY EU DRIVING LICENCE?*


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## baldilocks

tonymar said:


> Good question , I still have my Uk licence after being here 12 years !
> 
> To be honest I think I will change it soon as my photo card part of the licence expires next year .
> 
> Any info on how to do it welcome !
> 
> Tony Agost Alicante


Aren't the photocard parts only valid for 10 years? If so, then it should have already been renewed in Spain.


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## xabiaxica

baldilocks said:


> Aren't the photocard parts only valid for 10 years? If so, then it should have already been renewed in Spain.


yes they are - so yes it should have been renewed if it is a photocard licence

a surprising number of people still only have the old paper ones though, which are valid in the UK until the holder reaches 70 (atm) - they MUST be renewed in Spain now


also, a worrying number have licences which they renewed in the UK whilst resident in Spain - they are now having problems renewing them here, because they are effectively invalid


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## tonymar

baldilocks said:


> Aren't the photocard parts only valid for 10 years? If so, then it should have already been renewed in Spain.


Yes I did renew the Uk one 9 years ago on a visit back to the UK.


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## xabiaxica

tonymar said:


> Yes I did renew the Uk one 9 years ago on a visit back to the UK.


you might have a bit of a problem then 

if you were registered as resident here at the time, or even on the padrón, the computers could throw that fact up & that would mean that your licence isn't valid, because you can't legally renew your licence in one country if you are resident in another, & Spain won't therefore renew it


this has happened to lots of people, some of whom had actually temporarily moved back to the UK & were able to prove it, having forgotten to 'unregister' in Spain - but others couldn't & have actually had to take a full driving test here


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## snikpoh

Torre said:


> The answer is 'maybe'


No it's not - the plastic part of the driving licence lasts a maximum of 10 years.





tonymar said:


> Yes I did renew the Uk one 9 years ago on a visit back to the UK.


Naughty, naughty - this is illegal as you were resident in Spain at the time.


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## tonymar

xabiachica said:


> you might have a bit of a problem then
> 
> if you were registered as resident here at the time, or even on the padrón, the computers could throw that fact up & that would mean that your licence isn't valid, because you can't legally renew your licence in one country if you are resident in another, & Spain won't therefore renew it
> 
> 
> this has happened to lots of people, some of whom had actually temporarily moved back to the UK & were able to prove it, having forgotten to 'unregister' in Spain - but others couldn't & have actually had to take a full driving test here



Oh well , nothing is easy here involving any paper work , do you find there is always one thing missing ! or your in totally the wrong office, need your passport, padron , fotocopy, dogs name , etc etc.

so frustrating -- lucky the sunshine makes up for it !


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