# Declaring UK Income



## timr (Feb 1, 2010)

Hi, I´d be grateful for any advice on the consequences of making a late declaration of UK income to the Hacienda. The amount involved is small, taxed at source in the UK and even combined with my income Spain falls well short of the Spanish threshold (of around 5000, I believe). Several years ago the gestor who prepared my first "Declaration de Renta" said because of the double taxation treaty between Britain and Spain, there was no need to include it on the tax return. Recently I became aware of the "FD9", and it looks like I might have of got it wrong. :confused2:

Has anyone else been in this position, and how do you manage to straighten it out ? I´m bit worried about being fined the Spanish taxman even though I´ve been actually been overpaying tax.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

timr said:


> Hi, I´d be grateful for any advice on the consequences of making a late declaration of UK income to the Hacienda. The amount involved is small, taxed at source in the UK and even combined with my income Spain falls well short of the Spanish threshold (of around 5000, I believe). Several years ago the gestor who prepared my first "Declaration de Renta" said because of the double taxation treaty between Britain and Spain, there was no need to include it on the tax return. Recently I became aware of the "FD9", and it looks like I might have of got it wrong. :confused2:
> 
> Has anyone else been in this position, and how do you manage to straighten it out ? I´m bit worried about being fined the Spanish taxman even though I´ve been actually been overpaying tax.


The FD9 is a document you can download here. You take a copy to the hacienda (for me it was in Valencia City) and they authorise it .. afterwards you sent it to HMRC Nottingham and they de register you for tax in the UK.

The only real exception to this will be a government pension that is still taxed in the UK

Are you saying that you think the income in UK and Spain combined for that period falls below the level you need to lodge a tax return here in Spain?


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## timr (Feb 1, 2010)

Stravinsky said:


> Are you saying that you think the income in UK and Spain combined for that period falls below the level you need to lodge a tax return here in Spain?


Thank you for your reply, I´ll get the FD9 filled in and sent off. The combined income is well below the Spanish threshold for taxation which I believe is around 5000 pa (equivalent of the UK personal allowance), so it is not a case of owing tax to Hacienda (particularly since the income has already been taxed in the UK). More about whether there is any fine, penalty for not having declared (in previous years) a small amount of "worldwide" income. I didn´t realise until recently this was required even if there is a double taxation treaty in place.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

timr said:


> Thank you for your reply, I´ll get the FD9 filled in and sent off. The combined income is well below the Spanish threshold for taxation which I believe is around 5000 pa (equivalent of the UK personal allowance), so it is not a case of owing tax to Hacienda (particularly since the income has already been taxed in the UK). More about whether there is any fine, penalty for not having declared (in previous years) a small amount of "worldwide" income. I didn´t realise until recently this was required even if there is a double taxation treaty in place.


Well, in past years my gestor has told me not to bother with a return if it is under the required income. Having said that when I first came here I submitted a nil return just to register the fact that I was in the system. There are fines for non declaration of tax for sure, but I think you are saying there is no tax due.

As you'll tell by reading some of the tax associated threads on here, the fact that there is a tax treaty doesnt mean you can just forget about worldwide income. In general, with a few exceptions, it has to be all lumped together for declaration in your country of residence


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## timr (Feb 1, 2010)

That´s it exactly - no tax due, simply didn´t realise until recently I needed to declare the income anyway. Fraid I didn´t explain it very well. Given that I´m probably not alone in this, I was trying to get an idea of what the Hacienda attitude is. I send off the FD9 and find out.

Thanks again for your reply.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

timr said:


> That´s it exactly - no tax due, simply didn´t realise until recently I needed to declare the income anyway. Fraid I didn´t explain it very well. Given that I´m probably not alone in this, I was trying to get an idea of what the Hacienda attitude is. I send off the FD9 and find out.
> 
> Thanks again for your reply.



Im afraid you have to take the FD9 in person. Four of us had to travel to Valencia to do it. You do have to declare what income you are requesting to be zero rated on the document, and take copies of passport, last tax declaration, padron


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## timr (Feb 1, 2010)

Thanks again for the info.


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## almendros (Aug 14, 2008)

You haven't said what the UK income is, but the FD9 process only covers pensions, purchased annuities, interest and royalties.


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## timr (Feb 1, 2010)

Hi, the income is interest off a saving account taxed in the UK though the "retencion". My question was really to try and find out whether there were any penalties/fines for not declaring the interest as "world wide income" to Hacienda in previous years (even though there has never been any tax liability).


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## almendros (Aug 14, 2008)

timr said:


> Hi, the income is interest off a saving account taxed in the UK though the "retencion". My question was really to try and find out whether there were any penalties/fines for not declaring the interest as "world wide income" to Hacienda in previous years (even though there has never been any tax liability).


It's very unlikely that you would have a problem - Hacienda has much bigger fish to fry than a retired Expat who doesn't owe them any tax anyway.

Just make sure you declare it for last year and then I am sure you will have no problems.

I get the impression that Hacienda are constantly surprised by the number of foreigners who go out of their way to conform with the system! You are more likely to get a Xmas card than a fine!


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## timr (Feb 1, 2010)

almendros said:


> It's very unlikely that you would have a problem - Hacienda has much bigger fish to fry than a retired Expat who doesn't owe them any tax anyway.
> 
> Just make sure you declare it for last year and then I am sure you will have no problems.
> 
> I get the impression that Hacienda are constantly surprised by the number of foreigners who go out of their way to conform with the system! You are more likely to get a Xmas card than a fine!


Again, many thanks for the replies to my query.


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