# Thoughtless parkers



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

We live on a double plot on a corner...A few hundred metres up the road to the right is an apartment complex where many Madrilenos come to spend their summer in their pisos.
We have a garage entrance in one street and a double gate marked 'Vado Permanente' on the other street. Thoughtless ******s park in front of both.
It's impossible sometines to park within a five minute walk of our house and I'm sick of it. What if we had an emergency to go to hospital or the vet? Or to the airport? Or for all they know, to work?
Any ideas as to how I can deal with this?
I've stuck polite notices on windscreens to no avail.
The police are sympathetic and say to call but there's no way they can trace owner to apartment.
This goes on all July and August.
I am considering creeping out in the night with paint stripper.....:boxing::boxing:


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## Seb* (Mar 22, 2009)

Tourists, don't you hate them? :spider:


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## Guest (Jul 24, 2011)

I thought _vado permananente_ was fair game for tow trucks. Convince the local po-lice it's revenue for the town to help you out!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

.... and there was me thinking how quiet it had been on the forum of late Mary - so glad you're still about!!!! The lady on the end of our road has/had a similar problem, so she now has some bollards and she puts them outside of her garage when she's in residence

Jo xxxx


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

jojo said:


> .... and there was me thinking how quiet it had been on the forum of late Mary - so glad you're still about!!!! The lady on the end of our road has/had a similar problem, so she now has some bollards and she puts them outside of her garage when she's in residence


And I saw some yesterday here in Lancashire: plastic cones weighed down with concrete, and chained up to the gatepost so that they cannot just be chucked or blown away. Looked quite effective!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Joppa said:


> And I saw some yesterday here in Lancashire: plastic cones weighed down with concrete, and chained up to the gatepost so that they cannot just be chucked or blown away. Looked quite effective!


I think the ones the lady down the road uses have been "borrowed" from some roadworks nearby :tape:

Jo xxx


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

jojo said:


> I think the ones the lady down the road uses have been "borrowed" from some roadworks nearby :tape:
> 
> Jo xxx


I've got one I borrowed, am now looking for more. People in the parallel street have literally built barricades in front of their gates.
What really gets to me is how selfish and thoughtless people can be. After all, what could we do in an emergency?


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Seb* said:


> Tourists, don't you hate them? :spider:


Our thoughtless parkers are a mixture of French tourists (for some reason) and snotty rich Madrilenos visiting their holiday homes.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

A friend of mine lives in a narrow alley and sometimes people parked so close to his door he couldn't get in the house! He denounced one of the main offenders, his neighbour's son, who got a €60 fine (which he paid half of because he didn't want to fall out with his neighbour!), then put out a couple of giant plant pots as a deterrent.

We pay €14 a year to the Ayuntamiento for a no parking notice on our garage. Nobody ever parks there (except us) but presumably if visitors from out of town parked there, the Policia could trace the owners through their plates?


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## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

If you have a "Licenced" Vado Permenante sign, with a number, purchased from the town hall, the Policia Local will respond to an obstruction...as I understand it! The Spanish know this so will ignore a sign if it hasn't got a licence.


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## el pavlo (Jul 4, 2011)

mrypg9 said:


> We live on a double plot on a corner...A few hundred metres up the road to the right is an apartment complex where many Madrilenos come to spend their summer in their pisos.
> We have a garage entrance in one street and a double gate marked 'Vado Permanente' on the other street. Thoughtless ******s park in front of both.
> It's impossible sometines to park within a five minute walk of our house and I'm sick of it. What if we had an emergency to go to hospital or the vet? Or to the airport? Or for all they know, to work?
> Any ideas as to how I can deal with this?
> ...



The trouble with the Spanish drivers is that they don't park their cars...........they *abandon* them.


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## DunWorkin (Sep 2, 2010)

Is your sign an official one from the Ayuntamiento? 

Our entrance is opposite the beach so it is essential. Since we had ours we find people tend not to park there. If they do, the police here have the cars towed away.

People will ignore non-official/polite no parking signs.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

DunWorkin said:


> Is your sign an official one from the Ayuntamiento?
> 
> Our entrance is opposite the beach so it is essential. Since we had ours we find people tend not to park there. If they do, the police here have the cars towed away.
> 
> People will ignore non-official/polite no parking signs.



No, I got it from our local ferreteria.
How do I go about getting an official one?


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## Guest (Jul 25, 2011)

There's the problem.

You'll need to go to city hall and ask for permission. This looks to be the appropriate website for Marbella: 

Ayuntamiento de Marbella - Petición para Vado


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## DunWorkin (Sep 2, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> No, I got it from our local ferreteria.
> How do I go about getting an official one?


You really must get an official sign. Ours was handled by our administrator and we pay an amount per year (not sure how much). 

Without that official sign anyone can park across your drive or garage and not break the law.


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## Sonrisa (Sep 2, 2010)

I find thoughtless parking equally irritating, and have made official complaints to my council on severa occasions to my local council. 
In my case, it's a matter of posing a danger to pedestrians, as they park in a way in which we have no choice but to walk into a main road.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Traffic wardens!! Thats what Spain needs. It would create jobs and bring in some revenue!!

(I cant believe I just posted that lol)

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> Traffic wardens!! Thats what Spain needs. It would create jobs and bring in some revenue!!
> 
> (I cant believe I just posted that lol)
> 
> Jo xxx


but that's what the policía local do here...............


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> but that's what the policía local do here...............



but not very well!!!!! Er........ its gone 11pm???????????

Jo xxxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> but not very well!!!!! Er........ its gone 11pm???????????
> 
> Jo xxxx


they do it really well here!


dh was leaving for the airport at 11.30 so I was up late


and I'm on my hols now - so I don't have to be up so early:clap2:


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## stevelin (Apr 25, 2009)

my OH has often said he would love to be a traffic warden in our village they would not have to pay him just give him a % of the fines. The Spanish just love to double park around here


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## sat (Jul 20, 2008)

stevelin said:


> The Spanish just love to double park around here


Double parking...thats nothing...triple parking is common...

and most of them leave their handbrakes off so people can roll the cars out of the way when needed...pretty normal in many areas of valencia city!

oh and i have seen parking on a roundabout...not just around the outside but actually in the middle of it!!

one of my pet hates it the old "lets stop in the middle of a road, hold up the traffic, for a chat erm i mean shout to my friend on the other side of the road totally oblivious of everything else beeping their horns around me"!


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## DunWorkin (Sep 2, 2010)

I use a walker/rollator and occasionally a wheelchair. The way they park on the pavements means I cannot get by. Also, there are so few dropped curbs I often have real problems. 

The worst place for this is at San Juan hospital


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

halydia said:


> There's the problem.
> 
> You'll need to go to city hall and ask for permission. This looks to be the appropriate website for Marbella:
> 
> Ayuntamiento de Marbella - Petición para Vado




Thanks


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## pladecalvo (Aug 11, 2010)

sat said:


> one of my pet hates it the old "lets stop in the middle of a road, hold up the traffic, for a chat erm i mean shout to my friend on the other side of the road totally oblivious of everything else beeping their horns around me"!


Yes.... but you dare remain stationary until the green traffic light, rather than shooting off as soon as the 'green man' goes to red on a pedestrian crossing. They almost push you out of the way.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

I think you people complaining about Spanish parking have forgotten what Southern England is like - double yellow lines for two miles in every direction out of the town centre, having to pay for a residents permit to park outside your own house, getting a ticket if your rear end (pardon me) is six inches over the line or you were literally just gone for two minutes to get a paper ..

On balance, I think I prefer the Spanish way.

I sympathise with Dunworkin and anyone with a pushchair though; parking on pavements is downright anti-social. However in our village they used Plan E money to replace all the pavements and install drop kerbs, and now they will fine you for parking on the pavement.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Alcalaina said:


> I think you people complaining about Spanish parking have forgotten what Southern England is like - double yellow lines for two miles in every direction out of the town centre, having to pay for a residents permit to park outside your own house, getting a ticket if your rear end (pardon me) is six inches over the line or you were literally just gone for two minutes to get a paper ..
> 
> On balance, I think I prefer the Spanish way.
> 
> I sympathise with Dunworkin and anyone with a pushchair though; parking on pavements is downright anti-social. However in our village they used Plan E money to replace all the pavements and install drop kerbs, and now they will fine you for parking on the pavement.


You wouldn't prefer the Spanish way if you had to pay over 100 euros to get a friend to the airport because your car was blockaded!!!! Or if you had to get to the hospital urgently...
We never had parking problems in the UK and we only have them here for six weeks in the summer. But that's bad enough.
I don't mind people stopping in front of me to chat to friends...in fact I rather like it.
After all, I'm rarely in a hurry and friendly, social human interaction is more important.
But it's the lack of consideration for others that p****s me off hugely.
Of course it isn't confined to Spain...in fact I find Spanish people very thoughtful and considerate. We lived in a country villa in the CR with a layby in front of our double gates which formed part of our property. We had constant problems with people parking right in front of our gates, often in beat-up old bangers that had died and rolled into our layby. One of the reasons I learnt foul and filthy language in Czech.
That use of Plan E money sounds very sensible. I'm going to approach our new Mayor about the problem of summer parking as if it's a problem in our small village it must be worse in other parts of his domaine.
Do you know if Plan E has now come to an end? If it hasn't yet it surely will when Rajoy's lot get in next year which would be very sad as it is an excellent scheme when applied sensibly.


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## jules 123 (Apr 26, 2011)

What is Plan E?


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

jules 123 said:


> What is Plan E?


A very practical scheme, the object of which is to put some life in local economies with funds from central government.
Schemes have to employ local jobless people and make use of local suppliers.
Examples in our village, population less than 2000, include resurfacing of roads and renewing pavements, a new infant school and cultural centre and the planting of a palm avenue on the approach road to the village.
An excellent example of Keynesian economic theory in practice.
People get jobs and pay taxes and can spend money locally, businesses get custom and the community benefits.
Whereas keeping people on paro has zero benefit to anyone.
If only the clowns running the UK economy could see the value in putting people to work on socially-useful and economically beneficial projects instead of paying out welfare benefits.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> You wouldn't prefer the Spanish way if you had to pay over 100 euros to get a friend to the airport because your car was blockaded!!!! Or if you had to get to the hospital urgently...
> We never had parking problems in the UK and we only have them here for six weeks in the summer. But that's bad enough.
> I don't mind people stopping in front of me to chat to friends...in fact I rather like it.
> After all, I'm rarely in a hurry and friendly, social human interaction is more important.
> ...


Ah, but I am only 2 minutes walk from the Jefatura de Policia and I know they would come and move the offending vehicle if necessary. 

In Oxford, just as we left, they were introducing a scheme to charge us 300 pounds a year to park outside our own house - and you still weren't guaranteed a space!

Plan E money ran out last year - most of it was borrowed on the international market I think. Still a good thing though, better than borrowing money to bail out banks.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Alcalaina said:


> Ah, but I am only 2 minutes walk from the Jefatura de Policia and I know they would come and move the offending vehicle if necessary.
> 
> In Oxford, just as we left, they were introducing a scheme to charge us 300 pounds a year to park outside our own house - and you still weren't guaranteed a space!
> 
> Plan E money ran out last year - most of it was borrowed on the international market I think. Still a good thing though, better than borrowing money to bail out banks.



£300 a year to park outside your own house
We have just had a lovely new police station built in our village. White, spacious and squeaky clean and containing one policeman....
That may have been partly Plan E funded.
The problem with not borrowing money to bail out banks is that if banks fail so will most other functions related to every-day life. Businesses will go under, wages and pensions won't get paid, cash machines won't work. The country's credit rating will descend to jumk status and the costs of borrowing will soar.
And therein lies the crux of the crisis: we've become so deeply enmeshed in the complex world of financial matters.
The indignados etc. are good at pointing to the problems but have no practical solutions.
Sadly, I've yet to hear of a viable path out of this mess.
We know where we'd like to be but we have no plan for getting there....


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> £300 a year to park outside your own house
> We have just had a lovely new police station built in our village. White, spacious and squeaky clean and containing one policeman....


So have we! But we have three or maybe four PLs plus an administrator for our metropolis of 5,600 souls. Their main job seems to be putting up no parking signs when there is a religious procession. 

The new Jefatura is just three steps from the bar where they all have breakfast, which has led to some rather pointed comments on the town blog ...


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

jojo said:


> Traffic wardens!! Thats what Spain needs. It would create jobs and bring in some revenue!!
> 
> (I cant believe I just posted that lol)
> 
> Jo xxx


They're called "Policia Local" and, apart from spying on behalf of the alcalde, do little else. Get friendly with them, it is worth it.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

sat said:


> Double parking...thats nothing...triple parking is common...
> 
> and most of them leave their handbrakes off so people can roll the cars out of the way when needed...pretty normal in many areas of valencia city!
> 
> ...


Stopping for a chat - that's just normal. Can't leave handbrakes off here, too many hills.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

DunWorkin said:


> I use a walker/rollator and occasionally a wheelchair. The way they park on the pavements means I cannot get by. Also, there are so few dropped curbs I often have real problems.
> 
> The worst place for this is at San Juan hospital


What pavements? (sidewalks for the uninformed from across the water), ours, where they exist at all, are just one tile (30cm) wide and could well be highly polished so not safe to walk on. Not being picky but I think you want "kerbs" otherwise your walking will be seriously curbed.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> A very practical scheme, the object of which is to put some life in local economies with funds from central government.
> Schemes have to employ local jobless people and make use of local suppliers.
> Examples in our village, population less than 2000, include resurfacing of roads and renewing pavements, a new infant school and cultural centre and the planting of a palm avenue on the approach road to the village.
> An excellent example of Keynesian economic theory in practice.
> ...


There was an allocation of 73k for resurfacing our road. The only parts that got a half decent resurfacing were those in the areas that supported the alcalde. All we got were the three damn great holes where they put up the huge sign to tell us about the PlanE money that was to be spent and our surface is just as rough and unsafe as before.


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## Turtles (Jan 9, 2011)

mrypg9 said:


> A very practical scheme, the object of which is to put some life in local economies with funds from central government.
> Schemes have to employ local jobless people and make use of local suppliers.
> Examples in our village, population less than 2000, include resurfacing of roads and renewing pavements, a new infant school and cultural centre and the planting of a palm avenue on the approach road to the village.
> An excellent example of Keynesian economic theory in practice.


...and didn't it work out well too!
If Zapatero hadn't wasted so much _borrowed_ money then Spain wouldn't be lumped in with Greece and Portugal by the bondmarkets. He believed (and perhaps still believes) that all Spain needed was to restart the construction boom. He was proved wrong *and* ran up a huge debt doing so.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Turtles said:


> ...and didn't it work out well too!
> If Zapatero hadn't wasted so much _borrowed_ money then Spain wouldn't be lumped in with Greece and Portugal by the bondmarkets. He believed (and perhaps still believes) that all Spain needed was to restart the construction boom. He was proved wrong *and* ran up a huge debt doing so.


But he didn't start it, did he?
I have always believed that it was a huge mistake to try to make Spain the Florida of Europe.
Most British immigrants aren't that well-off, at least not in the same league as those who retire to Tuscany, southern France or the Caribbean (spelling?)
Of course we contribute to local economies to some extent but the less beneficial effects in terms of the despoilation of much of the costas and the burst bubble of the construction boom far outweigh any advantages, as I see it anyway.


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