# RTN blunder or Repsol rip-off?



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

In this weeks RTN, they announced that (12.5kg) gas bottles had gone down yet again to 11.16€

However, Repsol are still charging 12.68€ (reduced last week from 12.76€).


Are we being ripped off or was RTN misinformed?


Does anyone have a link to an official page where we can see what the price should be?


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

This is the one I use. Butane is now 12.68€, propane 11.16€.

Gas envasado, bombona de butano - repsol.com

We always get propane, there doesn't seem to be any difference.


----------



## smitty5668 (Feb 25, 2015)

the only difference in practice is that propane has a much lower freezing point. if the temperature is -3 or 4 butane will tend to go like a gel and won't burn, where as propane will keep burning quite happily down to - 15 degrees.

propane burns slightly sootier and may require larger jets.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

smitty5668 said:


> the only difference in practice is that propane has a much lower freezing point. if the temperature is -3 or 4 butane will tend to go like a gel and won't burn, where as propane will keep burning quite happily down to - 15 degrees.
> 
> propane burns slightly sootier and may require larger jets.


Ta. My OH believes butane chucks out more moisture, which is our main reason for buying propane as it never gets that cold here. Do you know if that's the case?


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

I had a delivery today from Repsol and it was €12.70.


----------



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Alcalaina said:


> This is the one I use. Butane is now 12.68€, propane 11.16€.
> 
> Gas envasado, bombona de butano - repsol.com
> 
> We always get propane, there doesn't seem to be any difference.


Do you still get as much gas with the propane 'bottles'?


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

snikpoh said:


> Do you still get as much gas with the propane 'bottles'?


Propane is heavier than butane and does not give off as much heat for the same weight of fuel, for this reason, the regulator for propane releases more than a butane regulator for the same amount of heat. The apparent advantage of butane over propane when considering its heating capabilities is offset by the fact that below 0°C, butane is harder to convert from a liquid to gaseous state.


----------



## smitty5668 (Feb 25, 2015)

Alcalaina said:


> Ta. My OH believes butane chucks out more moisture, which is our main reason for buying propane as it never gets that cold here. Do you know if that's the case?


marginally it does, but the main reason for using it is it's lower freezing point.


----------



## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

€12.70 here from Repsol. I heard that the prices are due to reduce again early next year.


----------



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Thanks all.


So the Round Town News got it totally wrong then - there's a surprise!


----------



## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

snikpoh said:


> Do you still get as much gas with the propane 'bottles'?


No-
Butane are 12,5kgs & propane are 11kgs


----------



## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

gus-lopez said:


> No-
> Butane are 12,5kgs & propane are 11kgs


I've often wondered about the weight, so we've weighed them and if you deduct the weight of the bottle the amount of gas supplied (butane in my case) varies from 12.5 to 15ish kgs...


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

thrax said:


> I've often wondered about the weight, so we've weighed them and if you deduct the weight of the bottle the amount of gas supplied (butane in my case) varies from 12.5 to 15ish kgs...


The weight of the actual bottle (empty) should be marked on the bottle near the shoulder.


----------



## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

baldilocks said:


> The weight of the actual bottle (empty) should be marked on the bottle near the shoulder.


That's correct, what we found when weighing them. Where we get them they are usually around 14.5kg


----------



## Allay sea (Aug 22, 2014)

A standard 11.34kg yellow gas cylinder refill is currently €37.00 in Ireland. Repsol sounds a real bargain in comparison.


----------



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Allay sea said:


> A standard 11.34kg yellow gas cylinder refill is currently €37.00 in Ireland. Repsol sounds a real bargain in comparison.


It's nothing to do with Repsol, the prices are Government controlled.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Allay sea said:


> A standard 11.34kg yellow gas cylinder refill is currently €37.00 in Ireland. Repsol sounds a real bargain in comparison.


Yes, the prices charged by suppliers are controlled by the government for this size bottle (though not for the great big ones used by restaurants). They react fairly quickly to changes in the market price. The most it's ever been since we've been here was about €16 for propane, a bit more for butane.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

thrax said:


> I've often wondered about the weight, so we've weighed them and if you deduct the weight of the bottle the amount of gas supplied (butane in my case) varies from 12.5 to 15ish kgs...


Well you learn something every day! Butane and propane are both heavier than air, and butane is heavier than propane. But the cylinders are the same size and are interchangeable.



> The density of a gas is roughly proportional to its molecular weight. Air has an average molecular weight of about 29 g/mol, so any gas with a molecular weight heavier than that will be denser than air.
> 
> Propane (C3H8) and butane (C4H10) have molecular weights of 44 and 58 g/mol, respectively, so both will be heavier than air.


General Chemistry Online: FAQ: Gases: How do I predict whether a gas is heavier or lighter than air?


----------



## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Alcalaina said:


> Yes, the prices charged by suppliers are controlled by the government for this size bottle (though not for the great big ones used by restaurants). They react fairly quickly to changes in the market price. The most it's ever been since we've been here was about €16 for propane, a bit more for butane.


At the start of this year, butane was €17.50 so it has gone down quite a bit.

The prices are being revised every two months under the new system.

I've just had one delivered and was charged €12.70, as someone else said they had been, so it seems Repsol are rounding it up. I paid with a €20 note so not sure what would have happened if I'd proffered the exact €12.68 it's supposed to be! Same thing often happens in the shops, they will either knock off a few cents or add a couple on to round amounts up or down, I'm really not fussed about 1 or 2 cents.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Lynn R said:


> At the start of this year, butane was €17.50 so it has gone down quite a bit.
> 
> The prices are being revised every two months under the new system.
> 
> I've just had one delivered and was charged €12.70, as someone else said they had been, so it seems Repsol are rounding it up. I paid with a €20 note so not sure what would have happened if I'd proffered the exact €12.68 it's supposed to be! Same thing often happens in the shops, they will either knock off a few cents or add a couple on to round amounts up or down, I'm really not fussed about 1 or 2 cents.


Everybody rounds up and down though - I bought €25.03 worth of petrol at the Repsol garage yesterday and was charged €25. Swings and roundabouts!


----------



## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

Yes same at supermarkets. They often can't be bothered to give the correct change so they usually round it down. Especially near closing time (wink wink). Oh dear. Swings and roundabouts. I have a horrible feeling I've never rounded up....


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Around her they usually give you the odd coppers in change and I usually tell them to put the change into the charity box.


----------

