# Got my attention



## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

Monday's kidnapping of Australian Man in Ipil 2 hours north of Zamboanga City has put me on the back foot a bit.

Warren Rodwell age 53 seems to be like a lot of us here on this board. 

He met his wife on the internet, went to Zamboanga City to meet her. Was married in June and started a small business for his wife (store) in Ipil just north of Zamboanga City. Lives there.

This meets the profile of how many foreigners except for one detail....... He lived on the Zamboanga Peninsula. regards


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

This is how quick it took them to recognize and kidnap this Australian..

from the sunstar. Less then 6 weeks.

"Rodwell is from Sydney, Australia. He married Miraflor Gutang, a native of Naga, Zamboanga Sibugay, in June 2011. The couple settled in Ipil town since October this year." regards


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## Jester2 (Aug 24, 2011)

seram said:


> Monday's kidnapping of Australian Man in Ipil 2 hours north of Zamboanga City has put me on the back foot a bit.
> 
> Warren Rodwell age 53 seems to be like a lot of us here on this board.
> 
> ...


its amazing that people dont educate themselves a little before they try this..


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## Jester2 (Aug 24, 2011)

these guys come here and marry these girls and don’t realize they wives are killing their husbands every month ..


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## Jester2 (Aug 24, 2011)

The police say that this couple had been fighting before he disappeared.. In the past five years I have lost 3 personal friends who have been killed (via paid assassin’s) by their wives.. They all had some things in common.. None of them thought that they were in any danger.. They never saw it coming, the police had suspects in the killings and asked the women to allow them to prosecute but the widows refused to sign a complaint that would convict the killers. In the Philippines murder is not a crime against the state a person needs to sign a complaint against the accused before they can be prosecuted no matter how strong the evidence.


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

Jester, what you are saying is true.. and this post could answer a lot of questions that newbies ask when first on this board. Gene has been warning about this for a long time.

It is a not what to do.. The last picture of his house shows he has left himself open to any intruders..regards 


From the Mindanao Examiner

"Rodwell has married a Filipina, Miraflor Gutang, 27, in June this year after an “Internet love affair.”

“There have been living here the past two months. They are a simple couple. Warren is just a simple man. They are not really wealthy or rich,” he said.

Gutang has reportedly moved out of Ipil town and is living with her family in Naga after a fight with Rodwell last month.

Rodwell’s neighbors had complained also about the foreigner’s arrogance, according to a security official who read a military background report on the foreigner who once served in the Australian army.

“A background investigation by the military showed that Rodwell is not popular among his neighbors. He is perceived as arrogant,” the official said."


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

*time to think lads*



Jester2 said:


> these guys come here and marry these girls and don’t realize they wives are killing their husbands every month ..


i live in philippines and its happening alll time that had a argument before and she has filled 2 cases off mistreatment in past, shes left home, gone home and told family thay have gone stuff this and brothers and family gone took him and thay ll kill him she gets shop and house. all familys happy then get another victim,off internet we allways carry guns in zamboanga city me and my wife and assult rifles when we travel dont take any chances there we had 3 to 4 ppl trying to get us opening gates at night saying there police and such ha ha my reply was come through door and well shoot lot you lol come bk tomorrow no one did come bk next day, we have razor wire 7 ft walls and cctv on record 24/7


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

Kermit..

Guys that take an attitude to the Phils dont usually last long. They are sorted out after the Redhorse kicks in..

Seems like you were lucky when the so called cops turned up at your house.. Are u saying that was in Zamboanga City.

I will be in Zamboanga City again from late Dec. through to the 20th Jan. regards


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

Reported in the Sydney newspaper today that up to 10 men dressed as policeman entered his house.

During a struggled he was shot in the leg..regards


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

shame really that you have to risk your life for someone you think loves you


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## gregbrown (Dec 14, 2011)

*prayers for Warren*

I just hope that Warren is returned alive. I am saddened to think of his current condition. I just hope he is returned and can get on with his life. I am not a prayer, but if I thought it would help I would. Thinking of you Warren.

Here's an article from Australia on what the Australian government is doing.


_Prime Minister Julia Gillard said that a task force has been formed to deal with the kidnapping of a citizen in southern Philippines.
The task force will include a hostage negotiator who will work with Philippine authorities in securing the release of Warren Richard Rodwell, 53, of Strathfield, New South Wales, Gillard told reporters in a briefing in Canberra.

The prime minister also said the embassy staff in Manila are involved and coordinating with local police in the search for Rodwell, who was seized by six gunmen on Monday._


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

gregbrown said:


> I just hope that Warren is returned alive. I am saddened to think of his current condition. I just hope he is returned and can get on with his life. I am not a prayer, but if I thought it would help I would. Thinking of you Warren.
> 
> Here's an article from Australia on what the Australian government is doing.
> 
> ...


 //// the longer it is till someone hears somethink i think(sorry me and my pinoy wife thinks) the more chance he is dead ,that the wifes family have killed him i hope we are wrong i really do, but it even happens between pinoys , but like i said she gets a house and a little buiness , more than she could ever hope for with a pinoy in little village ,


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

Hi Greg..

Yep, lets all hope it works out well.

But, this story needs to be told and read by every newbie that joins the board looking for advice.

Everything leading up to his alleged kidnapping is the "what not to do" when falling in love and moving to the Philippines.

For an experienced Asian tourist he did everything wrong.

Fell in love on the internet and soon married.
After 4 months married she moved back with her family. 
Four weeks after the wife moved out he was kidnapped.
Bought a house in the biggest kidnapping area of South east Asia.
Started a small store business. Perceived to be rich.
Had no protection at all around the perimeter of his house.
Perceived as arrogant by the neighbors. 

Kermit, time will tell but maybe you have a point. The wife would have the lot and maybe the house in her name. He was not budging or moving out. 
That small house and business would be more comfortable then living back in the barrio in a 2 bedroom shack with 8 people...hmmmmn

Speculation..We will see...cheers


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

seram said:


> Hi Greg..
> 
> Yep, lets all hope it works out well.
> 
> ...


we /me and wife have over 3500sqr mtrs but its all walled in and has razor wire on top with cctv,c electric gate,s but im still gratefull i meet my wife i meet her on line went there for 3 days and said id be bk in week and went bk lived there for 7 yrs so it does work but maybe i been lucky  and we still carry guns in garden to be sure were ok,


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## gregbrown (Dec 14, 2011)

*recent update*

Kidnapped Australian's captors make contact

Shirley Escalante
Posted December 15, 2011 08:58:30


Philippine authorities say the captors of an Australian man kidnapped in the southern region more than a week ago have called a local governor and expressed the desire to negotiate directly with him.

A member of the crisis management council says the kidnappers of Australian Warren Richard Rodwell have made no demands in their telephone call to Zamboanga Sibugay governor Rommel Jalosjos.

But the council member says authorities were able to trace the call to two southern provinces - Zamboanga and Basilan - where kidnap groups and local terrorists like the Islamic separatist movement Abu Sayyaf operate.

A regional police director says no group has claimed responsibility for the abduction.

But police are not discounting the possibility Abu Sayyaf could be behind the abduction, as the group has kidnapped locals and foreigners in the past to collect ransom and raise funds.

At least six armed men abducted Warren Rodwell, 53, from his home in the seaside town of Ipil on Mindanao island, then fled on speedboats.

At the time of his capture, authorities said Mr Rodwell may have been injured in the abduction, as blood stains were found in the area where he was taken.


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

gregbrown said:


> Kidnapped Australian's captors make contact
> 
> Shirley Escalante
> Posted December 15, 2011 08:58:30
> ...


local ha ha governor thay often get part off money offered to get guy back  everyones on take, in philippines and i mean everyone, i still think family have somethink to do with it (sorry we think )


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## Rusty In Cebu (Sep 26, 2010)

The biggest problem is where he choose to live. I didn't see it mentioned here but there were other articles on the net saying they also found significant blood stains in his bedroom and I think the door. The police feared he had been shot.

Mindanao is trouble for a newbie. Davao is reasonably safe but mayors that don't deny they have death squads concern me. I don't know if his daughter has the same accusations but dad can't be too far away.

I have people tell me all the time, "I went to Mindanao and nothing happened." Well yeah, but if something is going to happen it is more likely to happen there. I generally avoid areas where extremist are blowing up churches, throwing grenades in the city or bombing the stores. Western Mindanao is known for this. The New Peoples Army (NPA) operates in the East but they don't usually attack civilians.

There have been two other Americans kidnapped this year but Abu Sayyaf in the Zamboanga area. One was a female, her son and a Filipino cousin. Abu Sayyaf is looking to establish itself as a threat because the Armed Forces of The Philippines kicked their but late last year and early this year. Many thought the Filipino cousin was involved in the kidnapping. Someone told me all three have been released recently. I have not been able to confirm that.

There was another woman kidnapped in the same area as Warren was. I don't remember the details for certain but I believe she was married by to a foreigner. She was rescued by the Philippine authorities a few months later. I don't recall if it was military but it likely was. One member of the rescue team was also killed during the fire fight.

Security is a matter of probability. You are far more likely to be kidnapped in Western Mindanao that other places in the Philippines. The average kidnapped for ransom gang wants nothing to do with rich Filipino nor foreigners as they draw too much heat. Terrorist are a different matter. In the rest of the Philippines, 80% of those kidnapped are Filipinos. Usually middle class that have some money to pay the ransom but they are less likely to even go the authorities as the authorities are generally not trusted even by Filipinos.

A good place to be killed is Angeles City but I don't think you're in grave danger there. This is where sex tourist go and sometimes run afoul of a bar girls boyfriend. Those kinds of environments will always increase your chance of problems. But LOTS of guys go there and are just fine. Still there is more risk.

I usually recommend Cebu to newbies until they get their feet wet and learn a bit more about the Philippines. Oh we have our problems in Cebu but there is almost no political and religious unrest in Cebu. I'm not sure if crime in general is higher in Cebu but violent crime is far below USA rates. Pick pockets and worse are here but they don't kill people here just for fun like they do in the USA. At least not yet. I feel safer any place except maybe the Sulu Region (west of Mindanao) than I did in Memphis where I can from. There I carried a gun.

Women do increase your risk of trouble too. Most will lie to you and scam you. Killing is not common at all but it does happen. I've read of several cases in Davao on that. In eastern Mindanao. That could happen any place but it really isn't likely. Scammed and lied too, robbed while you're out of the house, oh yeah, that will happen.

As soon as you move in with a woman here, day one, you are considered in a common law marriage and she is entitled to support and generally 50% of your property. The only requirement is that the relationship is exclusive. There is no time requirement involved. Now I have been unable to figure out if she is entitled to wealth before you got here or not. That law is really hard to follow. If she's married, then your property doesn't go direct to her but instead to the martial estate. Yes, that means her husband can get it. He cans also jail the both of you for adultery and extort money from you. He has to lock both of you up though, he can't lock you up without also locking up his wife.

You need to go slow with women. Some of them are really good at what they do. I've been living here for almost four years and I've been totally snowed by one just a few months ago. Wasn't someone I was interested in but a friend of mine was interested in her. Trying to warn him did me no good and cost me a friend. 

I've seen them produce hospital receipts for their dengue fever. The receipt didn't look right to me but it was well done. The guy that sent it to me sent her some money and then later checked to see where she picked it up. Wasn't were she was suppose to be. 

And don't let their sincere religious beliefs make you feel safe. I know plenty of scammers and bar girls that are very religious. I can't reconcile intentionally scamming and hurting people emotionally, physically or financially but they don't seem to have any problem. Filipinas are masters at not quite lying but leading you down the right path. Even when they lie, they often cannot believe they lied.  They really don't see it as a lie. I've been amazed by that.

Well I've run off at the fingers enough so I'm going to shut up. Stay out of Mindanao until you know your way around. Don't distrust your girl but don't trust her either until you've been with her for a long time. You also must take the time to understand their culture, that will take time but until you do it is likely you will misunderstand some of her motivations.


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

Nice post Rusty.

Some good advice but was wondering what part of Cebu you stay in..Is it a foreigner area so to speak. Cebu is now becoming my focus after some bombings and kidnappings in Zamboanga City..

The blood stain issue with Warren was mentioned a couple of times.

Your words of wisdom about the Pinay and telling lies is so close to the mark.

Reminds me of what mongers say to bar girls in Angeles. (lie) haha..

I will be in Angeles this Sunday for Hash and stay until Wednesday before I head down to Zamboanga City..This is the first time I have felt uneasy about a trip to Zambo.. regards


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## gregbrown (Dec 14, 2011)

*Update*

From Sydney Morning Herald online 16/12/11

*Officials seek negotiator for talks with kidnappers
Lindsay Murdoch, Al Jacinto In Zamboanga City December 16, 2011

AUSTRALIAN officials have told the kidnappers of Sydney adventurer Warren Rodwell they want a professional police negotiator to handle negotiations for his release, rejecting a request for them to deal directly with a provincial governor in the southern Philippines, a reliable source has told the Herald.*
The kidnappers had asked to negotiate Mr Rodwell's safe release with the Governor of Zamboanga Sibugay province, Rommel Jalosjos, a former BHP Billiton chef, the source said. During phone contact with Mr Jalosjos, the kidnappers did not make any demands, according to several sources. They had also not sent proof that Mr Rodwell was alive. Mr Jalosjos has imposed a news blackout on the kidnapping of Mr Rodwell, a former Australian soldier and prolific world traveller.
He married a Filipina, Miraflor Gutang, in the seaside town of Ipil on restive Mindanao island in June after meeting her online.
Mr Rodwell struggled violently with four gunmen posing as policemen who stormed his fortified house in a village near Ipil on December 5.
Philippine authorities have reported sightings of Mr Rodwell in the Muslim province of Basilan island, four hours by boat from Ipil. They are trying to verify information he may have been taken to the Sultan Naga Dimaporo area in northern Mindanao.
Security officials suspect the kidnappers are members of a local gang with links to the terrorist group Abu Sayyaf in Basilan.
They have also not ruled out the involvement of Barahama Ali, a commander of the country's largest Muslim rebel group, the Moro Islamic Liberation Front, or former rebel leader Waning Abdulsalam, who was disowned by the front after authorities tagged him in the spate of kidnappings of foreigners and terrorism in the restive region. The Moro front has denied the involvement of Mr Ali in the kidnapping.
Philippine troops have mounted a search to rescue the Australian, but so far have made no breakthrough to accurately pinpoint his whereabouts in the region, which is notorious for kidnappings for ransoms, bombings and gun attacks.
A Philippine government official, Bonnie Galambao, the spokesman for the Ipil crisis management council, headed by the Mayor, Eldwin Alibutdan, also confirmed that the kidnappers have escaped from the military and police operation in the town.
''As far as the crisis management council is concern, the kidnappers and their hostages are no longer in Ipil and there are efforts to locate Warren Rodwell,'' he said without elaborating further, noting the news blackout.
With Al Jacinto in Zamboanga City


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## Rusty In Cebu (Sep 26, 2010)

Thanks, no not really in an expat area. I'm in Bogo City, out in the northern part of the province. There are quite a few expats here. Mostly German or dutch I think. 

Yeah they say if a bar girls mouth is moving she's lying. I've known a few and they are not the most trust worthy women in the world. haha But I'm sure they have been lied to much as well. I've not been to AC but I'd like to visit some time.

Zamboanga is an area I've avoided. I is my perception that if you stay in the city you're okay. Any rural area in Mindanao and the risk go up. If I needed to go there, I would but I'd fly directly into the city myself. It looks like a beautiful area.

I do plan to visit a Civet coffee farm outside of Davao when I get a chance. I'll go where I need to and really looking forward to it but the risk does go up. Odds are still in my favor but they are much better in Cebu. Mandaue City, a suburb of Cebu is becoming hotter with gang activity. Robberies are higher. Most of the killings though SEEM to be business related. Competitors taking out their competition or someone did someone wrong in a deal type thing. A girl once invited me to meet her in the Lapu Lapu town plaza about 10pm one night. I told her it wasn't a good day to die. 

I feel safer tin the Philippines than I did in Memphis. 



seram said:


> Nice post Rusty.
> 
> Some good advice but was wondering what part of Cebu you stay in..Is it a foreigner area so to speak. Cebu is now becoming my focus after some bombings and kidnappings in Zamboanga City..
> 
> ...


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## gregbrown (Dec 14, 2011)

*Warren update*

SYDNEY MORNING HERALD 24/12/11

Photos 'proof' Rodwell alive
Al Jacinto In Zamboanga City
December 24, 2011

The kidnappers of Sydney man Warren Rodwell have sent ''proof of life'' pictures to his Filipino family and allowed him to call his Filipina wife, according to unconfirmed reports.

The reports have emerged as the new Philippine military chief, Jessie Dellosa, ordered security forces in the southern province of Basilan to intensify the search for Mr Rodwell, 53, from Sydney.

Lieutenant-General Dellosa flew to the largely Muslim province on Thursday and met his local commanders.

The commander of military forces in Basilan, Colonel Ricardo Visaya, said: ''Troops are searching for Rodwell who is being held captive by the Abu Sayyaf under Puruji Indama.''

Indama is a ruthless rebel commander notorious for beheading Christians.

Mr Rodwell was kidnapped on December 5 from his home near the town of Ipil on Mindanao by four gunmen posing as police.

He married Miraflor Gutang, 27, in June, after they met online.

The regional police chief, Chief Superintendent Elpidio de Asis, said he had not seen photos proving Mr Rodwell was alive.


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

Thanks for that Greg..

I am in Zamboanga City now enjoying a San Mig. Light at 35 peso in the pool bar.. The price is untouched by poriengers inflating the bill. You pay Filipina price here.

On the 26th I will be traveling to Ipil where Warren was kidnapped..I will being staying overnight and will take some pics of that area..

Here is the example of what newbies should not do when coming to the Phils...

Kidnapped case chief sacked: Sydney Morning Herald
Wednesday, December 21, 2011 10:10:28 PM	

A SOUTHERN Philippines police chief who revealed that two abuse claims had been filed against kidnapped Sydney adventurer Warren Rodwell by his Filipina wife has been sacked from his post.

Edwin Verzon, police chief of the town of Ipil, was removed from his post on December 12, a day after he told The Age that Miraflor Gutang, 27, had filed the complaints against Mr Rodwell after she married him in June. ''She filed two complaints with us and she was also planning to bring it to the attention of the Australian embassy in Manila, but we don't know if she pursued it,'' Inspector Verzon told The Age.

Inspector Verzon has been reassigned at the provincial police headquarters

Mr Rodwell, 53, a former Australian soldier and prolific world traveller, was kidnapped from his home in a village near Ipil on restive Mindanao island on December 5 by four gunmen posing as policemen. He was shot in the foot during a violent struggle.

Ms Gutang's parents later confirmed that Ms Miraflor had moved out of Mr Rodwell's house two weeks before the kidnapping. The couple had met on the internet in May. Married in June..

Zamboanga Sibugay governor Rommel Jalosjos has imposed a news blackout on the kidnapping at the request of Australia. The kidnappers have twice contacted Mr Jalosjos and asked him to negotiate Mr Rodwell's safe release. But Australian officials have insisted that a professional police negotiator handle any negotiations.

Philippine authorities said Mr Rodwell was being held by Puruji Indama, a commander of the terrorist Abu Sayyaf terrorist group who is notorious for beheading Christians.(By Lindsay Murdoch with Al Jacinto / Sydney Morning Herald, The Age)


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## gregbrown (Dec 14, 2011)

*update*

No news since 7/1/12

I think the last I heard was he had been taken to a more remote location.

*This from THE AUSTRALIAN Sydney newspaper 7/1/12.*

THE family of kidnapped Australian adventurer Warren Rodwell has made a plea for privacy as the government works to secure his safe release.

In a brief statement this morning, distributed by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, Mr Rodwell's family said they did not wish to speak in detail about his case.

"We are sure people will understand that this is a difficult time for our family and friends," the statement read.

"We do not, at this stage, wish to make any public comments, and ask that the media respects our privacy."

Yesterday a distressed-looking Mr Rodwell pleaded for his life in a ransom video.

The two-minute proof-of-life footage was sent to Mr Rodwell's Filipina wife, Miraflor Gutang, 27, just before Christmas.

The 53-year-old said his captors were demanding a $US2 million ransom.

"To my family please do whatever to raise the two million US dollars they are asking for my release as soon as possible," Mr Rodwell said in the footage.

"To the Australian embassy here in the Philippines, this is your constituent appealing for his life and safety ... If I'm given my last wish, my last wish is to please help me out of here alive please Madame Ambassador."

Last week it was reported the ransom was only $22,600 which Mr Rodwell's wife said she could not afford.

Human Services Minister Brendan O'Connor yesterday categorically ruled out any government contribution to the ransom.

"There has been a bipartisan policy of not paying ransoms for many, many years," he said.

However Mr O'Connor said the government was doing everything it could to secure Mr Rodwell's release. DFAT also said yesterday the Australian embassy in the Philippines was "working closely" with local authorities on Mr Rodwell's case with support from a Canberra taskforce.

"Our primary focus remains Mr Rodwell's welfare," a DFAT spokeswoman said.

Mr Rodwell was taken from his home in the coastal town of Ipil on Mindanao Island in the southern Philippines on December 5. Bloodstains were found near where he was taken and it was believed his hand was severely cut in the initial struggle with his kidnappers.

Up to 2000 soldiers are searching for him on the southern Philippine island of Basilan. The island is controlled by the Abu Sayyaf group led by terrorist commander Puruji Indama, who has links to Al Qa'ida. It is not believed the kidnapping was politically motivated.

Kidnappings for ransom are frequent in the embattled southern Philippines, where a Muslim separatist rebellion has been going on for more than 40 years. Foreigners are frequent targets.


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## rj.uk (Aug 30, 2008)

If you all have this kind of attitude why have Filipinas as your partners or wives? Why settle in the 'Pines at all?


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

rj.uk said:


> If you all have this kind of attitude why have Filipinas as your partners or wives? Why settle in the 'Pines at all?





Rj-UK....................What attitude mate..

Is making new people aware of the pitfalls that could await them mean we have an attitude. I wont apologize.... Ban me.

My asawa is the best thing to happen to me. The Philippines is the best country I have visited. The people are so warm and friendly. but but but.............It is easy to post the positives about any country but it would be criminal to not tell the facts and what could happen if their eyes are not open wide...cheers


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## rj.uk (Aug 30, 2008)

seram said:


> Rj-UK....................What attitude mate..
> 
> Is making new people aware of the pitfalls that could await them mean we have an attitude. I wont apologize.... Ban me.
> 
> My asawa is the best thing to happen to me. The Philippines is the best country I have visited. The people are so warm and friendly. but but but.............It is easy to post the positives about any country but it would be criminal to not tell the facts and what could happen if their eyes are not open wide...cheers


That's nice to hear that you have a happy marriage. being a Filipina expat married to a brit it galls me to keep on hearing the 'negatives' all the time. 

yes, it is good to tell people what to expect but also the positives please


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## seram (Oct 12, 2011)

rj.uk....

Thanks mate...I am looking forward to your next positive post..cheers


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

Count me in--I'm and American married to a Filipina and have lived here in paradise for nine years. There are some negative aspects like anywhere else. But the good far outweighs the bad and I/we would never leave the Philippines to live anywhere else...

Gene


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## Jester2 (Aug 24, 2011)

rj.uk said:


> If you all have this kind of attitude why have Filipinas as your partners or wives? Why settle in the 'Pines at all?


We don’t like the women from our own countries and we don’t like how they treat us so we search for other options.. I know 3 American men who have been murdered by their wives (1 did it herself and family members did the other 2) here in the Philippines but all 3 men made big mistakes that allowed this to happen. If your death will put money or property into anyone’s hands in the Philippines then you are likely to be killed. This is a violent country violence is a matter of fact and a matter of business. Your wife may not kill you but her family may do it if they think that they can move into your nice house you paid for if only you were gone. You will likely stay alive as long as there is no profit or prospective profit in your demise. Lots of guys “cheat” on their wives in this country and the women will kill you for doing it but only if the house is paid for or she stands to possess a nice chunk of money. If you need to be alive to keep the monthly money coming in then you are likely safe and cheating now and again is easily forgiven and part of life.
Murder is not a crime against the state or the people here in the PI. so someone must personally press charges against the accused murder. They don’t kill Filipino husbands as often because those men have family members who will press charges if the hubby is murdered but most expats don’t have anyone to take up the fight and press charges and the murders go unchallenged and are forgotten. Don’t be a victim don’t make your death profitable to anyone and you will likely live long here, make your death profitable to anyone and you will not likely be walking around that long.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

*Life And DeathIn The Islands*



Jester2 said:


> We don’t like the women from our own countries and we don’t like how they treat us so we search for other options.. I know 3 American men who have been murdered by their wives (1 did it herself and family members did the other 2) here in the Philippines but all 3 men made big mistakes that allowed this to happen. If your death will put money or property into anyone’s hands in the Philippines then you are likely to be killed. This is a violent country violence is a matter of fact and a matter of business. Your wife may not kill you but her family may do it if they think that they can move into your nice house you paid for if only you were gone. You will likely stay alive as long as there is no profit or prospective profit in your demise. Lots of guys “cheat” on their wives in this country and the women will kill you for doing it but only if the house is paid for or she stands to possess a nice chunk of money. If you need to be alive to keep the monthly money coming in then you are likely safe and cheating now and again is easily forgiven and part of life.
> Murder is not a crime against the state or the people here in the PI. so someone must personally press charges against the accused murder. They don’t kill Filipino husbands as often because those men have family members who will press charges if the hubby is murdered but most expats don’t have anyone to take up the fight and press charges and the murders go unchallenged and are forgotten. Don’t be a victim don’t make your death profitable to anyone and you will likely live long here, make your death profitable to anyone and you will not likely be walking around that long.


While my previous post touts the good of living here I also must agree with Jester 100%. Unless very lucky in your marriage partner it is most unwise to be worth more dead than alive here. Sound advise Jester, thanks.

Gene


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

seram said:


> Monday's kidnapping of Australian Man in Ipil 2 hours north of Zamboanga City has put me on the back foot a bit.
> 
> Warren Rodwell age 53 seems to be like a lot of us here on this board.
> 
> ...


ha ha i meet my wife on line 8 yrs ago in zamboanga city i went there for week came bk to uk sold everythink and went lived there we married after yr livein together and have lived happly in zamboanga city for over 8 yrs so dont brand every one from that area as conning ppl after one thing


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

kermit123 said:


> ha ha i meet my wife on line 8 yrs ago in zamboanga city i went there for week came bk to uk sold everythink and went lived there we married after yr livein together and have lived happly in zamboanga city for over 8 yrs so dont brand every one from that area as conning ppl after one thing


There are definitely good women out there, you just have to sift thru them to find the best one for you. I loved in zambo for 4+ years (with her and family) and can tell you that as long as you take precautions you can live there in relative safety. 

But for me, it's just too tiring to constantly have your head on a swivel and live low key to avoid most of the situations in this thread. That is why I chose to relocate to Subic. So I can live in relative comfort and truly relax. I still keep my situational awareness up, but I do not have to live packing a piece and living in a locked up self-induced compound. I also like to ride my bike which is too high profile for there along with the crap roads not being conducive for it either.


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

seram said:


> Hi Greg..
> 
> Yep, lets all hope it works out well.
> 
> ...



This should be the classic post about what not to do.....


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

seram said:


> Jester, what you are saying is true.. and this post could answer a lot of questions that newbies ask when first on this board. Gene has been warning about this for a long time.
> 
> It is a not what to do.. The last picture of his house shows he has left himself open to any intruders..regards
> 
> ...



I wouldn't trust his neighbors or the police anything they say, they are all one with this ladies family, they were probably angry because he doesn't share his wealth with them and good! Apparently the wife may have shared all kinds of things before the man arrived and when he did arrive he put a stop on the wasteful spending, that can get you killed here it really angers people when the free ride ends. 

I have had issue's with my family on this, they kept stealing our stuff and now are pretty much banned from the house and just yesterday one of the family members started an attitude with my wife and my wife don't tolerate any of that and she gave it to her good back and then the family member mentioned that they were planning on killing all of us, we went to the barangay and put them on the blotter, I think just about every family members is has been put on the blotter now.


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

kermit123 said:


> i live in philippines and its happening alll time that had a argument before and she has filled 2 cases off mistreatment in past, shes left home, gone home and told family thay have gone stuff this and brothers and family gone took him and thay ll kill him she gets shop and house. all familys happy then get another victim,off internet we allways carry guns in zamboanga city me and my wife and assult rifles when we travel dont take any chances there we had 3 to 4 ppl trying to get us opening gates at night saying there police and such ha ha my reply was come through door and well shoot lot you lol come bk tomorrow no one did come bk next day, we have razor wire 7 ft walls and cctv on record 24/7


Yea I had the fake cops also bug me here in lower Laguna area, they show a police id and are riding tandem on a moped not marked in any way they are not wearing any kind of police uniform, I didn't even talk with them locked the gate and house, over the years I upgraded the house from bamboo to block and steel doors and windows with steel bars.


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

mcalleyboy said:


> I wouldn't trust his neighbors or the police anything they say, they are all one with this ladies family, they were probably angry because he doesn't share his wealth with them and good! Apparently the wife may have shared all kinds of things before the man arrived and when he did arrive he put a stop on the wasteful spending, that can get you killed here it really angers people when the free ride ends.
> 
> I have had issue's with my family on this, they kept stealing our stuff and now are pretty much banned from the house and just yesterday one of the family members started an attitude with my wife and my wife don't tolerate any of that and she gave it to her good back and then the family member mentioned that they were planning on killing all of us, we went to the barangay and put them on the blotter, I think just about every family members is has been put on the blotter now.


Honestly, mcalleyboy, I would seriously reconsider relocating somewheres else that is just far enough for them to not come around. Like Gene and others have said in other threads, it's good to get at least a 5 hour bus ride away. This way you can focus on your lady and kids (if you have) without the external pressures/BS that you are experiencing.

I can say that by providing a place for them and me relocating has worked for me. They feel indebted to me for what I have provided and won't ask for anything. We still support them but they are very frugal. The gravy train ending scenario is definitely one to watch out for and I do not think that their is any way to wean them off. A clean cut would be very dangerous as I think that they would probably follow thru with the threat and kill the golden goose straight away!!


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

jon1 said:


> Honestly, mcalleyboy, I would seriously reconsider relocating somewheres else that is just far enough for them to not come around. Like Gene and others have said in other threads, it's good to get at least a 5 hour bus ride away. This way you can focus on your lady and kids (if you have) without the external pressures/BS that you are experiencing.
> 
> I can say that by providing a place for them and me relocating has worked for me. They feel indebted to me for what I have provided and won't ask for anything. We still support them but they are very frugal. The gravy train ending scenario is definitely one to watch out for and I do not think that their is any way to wean them off. A clean cut would be very dangerous as I think that they would probably follow thru with the threat and kill the golden goose straight away!!


Hey Jon, What's up? You and I got very lucky with the wives we have for sure. But I'll tell ya what, if I had the problems or anywhere near the problems some of these guys do, I'd be on a fast horse outa Dodge City! In-laws and wifes that want to kill a guy? That kinda stuff is okay for the movies but in real life--count me out...


gene


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

jon1 said:


> Honestly, mcalleyboy, I would seriously reconsider relocating somewheres else that is just far enough for them to not come around. Like Gene and others have said in other threads, it's good to get at least a 5 hour bus ride away. This way you can focus on your lady and kids (if you have) without the external pressures/BS that you are experiencing.
> 
> I can say that by providing a place for them and me relocating has worked for me. They feel indebted to me for what I have provided and won't ask for anything. We still support them but they are very frugal. The gravy train ending scenario is definitely one to watch out for and I do not think that their is any way to wean them off. A clean cut would be very dangerous as I think that they would probably follow thru with the threat and kill the golden goose straight away!!



My wife still talks with her brother next door and another brothers wife, so I guess it's not the entire family but they all do work together like a team. I actually like it when the wife gives it to them good, it feels very good because of the way they used us badly for over a decade I need pay back, it's not all the time but they do get it and I love it the wife is real good with the mouth they can't even come close to fighting here in public, she puts em down so deep in the toilet where they belong. 

I'm her for the long haul, my house is so huge and I've got so much money in it along with bills that I can't afford to move, pension for a retired 1st class only go so far, the many neighbors are with us and we get along real well with them so it's just a lot of drama, my daughter is already grown up with 2-year-old and no father, dang it! And so I take care of them, my son is doing very well in school and just graduated top of his class 1st grade, he speaks english, reads and writes and mathematics I tought myself, almost 3/4 of his classmates can't even read or write.

The house is built like Ft Knox, blocks, windows with bars, gates secondary gates and dogs thats just to keep them from stealing rice and coffee.


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

i must be lucky my wifes family leave us well alone thay livew 300 mtrs away and thay now i like my own space we dont see em for days at our house were allways poping into theres and thay have never asked for anythink in 8 yrs we lived there , me and my wife help family when we can but its not asked for at all


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## kermit123 (Dec 11, 2011)

mcalleyboy said:


> My wife still talks with her brother next door and another brothers wife, so I guess it's not the entire family but they all do work together like a team. I actually like it when the wife gives it to them good, it feels very good because of the way they used us badly for over a decade I need pay back, it's not all the time but they do get it and I love it the wife is real good with the mouth they can't even come close to fighting here in public, she puts em down so deep in the toilet where they belong.
> 
> I'm her for the long haul, my house is so huge and I've got so much money in it along with bills that I can't afford to move, pension for a retired 1st class only go so far, the many neighbors are with us and we get along real well with them so it's just a lot of drama, my daughter is already grown up with 2-year-old and no father, dang it! And so I take care of them, my son is doing very well in school and just graduated top of his class 1st grade, he speaks english, reads and writes and mathematics I tought myself, almost 3/4 of his classmates can't even read or write.
> 
> The house is built like Ft Knox, blocks, windows with bars, gates secondary gates and dogs thats just to keep them from stealing rice and coffee.


thats like our house 9 ft walls electric gates cctv, razar wire , 3,500 sqr mtres so its still very big garden to wonder around and i love it there so peacefull  and walls and other security doesent bother me at all


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

Gene and Viol said:


> Hey Jon, What's up? You and I got very lucky with the wives we have for sure. But I'll tell ya what, if I had the problems or anywhere near the problems some of these guys do, I'd be on a fast horse outa Dodge City! In-laws and wifes that want to kill a guy? That kinda stuff is okay for the movies but in real life--count me out...
> 
> 
> gene


Gene,

I am doing alright. And yes you and I did luck out. I warned mine in the beginning that I would not put up with any of the aforesaid drama and activities. I also told her to get the word out that the $ is mine not OURS=her + extended family. It took about 3 years but they finally got the message. The pinoys can be quite juvenile when it comes to perceived slights and solutions to dilemmas (don't mean this in a slanderous way, just to demonstrate a mindset).

The key for me was the communication with her and her family. I told her that the extended family drain was one of the most common causes for failed relationships.

Fortunately for me, she listened and as she was already the defacto Head of household, they had to listen, put up and shut up.

Jon


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## DannyRDG (Jul 26, 2011)

Why, oh why, would anyone want to build their house to resemble something like Fort Knox? Who wants to spend their life "in paradise" as so many people say on various threads, living inside a prison camp, getting a stripey suntan from behind barred windows? It does nothing more than attract attention to any would be burglar that there is something valuable inside. Not only that but it is also a hazard to yourself, if god forbid, your house catches fire and your only escape is through a window! Has anyone ever heard of camouflage and concealment? Fortresses stick out like a sore thumb, blend in with the local population and people won't even know you're there!

There is sometimes some very good advice posted on this forum about personal safety, some of which I have adopted myself when out and about in AC. I think some peoples mentality on safety goes slightly overboard though. I also think there is a massive problem with how foreigners generally treat Pinoys. I have a philosophy that you should talk and treat people the way you wish to be talked and treated to yourself. 

There is good and bad in all walks of life, it doesn't matter if your black, Asian, Christian or Muslim, we are all human beings, some are just luckier than others. I am sick to death of hearing foreigners talk to Pinoys as though they are untermensch. What gives you the right to talk to them this way? I was sat in a restaurant not so long ago opposite 2 Australian guys who constantly slated Pinoys for various reasons, in earshot of all the waitresses and other Pinoy diners. When I finished my meal and got up to leave, I went to their table and said "if you don't like it here, you can always leave and return back to your own country." They just stared at me and didn't say a word. On my next visit to the restaurant, one of the waitresses thanked me for what I had said. So many times I have seen and heard foreigners talk very rudely to street vendors or women in bars as though they were dogs! What is wrong with a simple "no thank you" and a smile? These people are only trying to make a living, to put a roof over their family's heads and a meal on the table. I, at times am ashamed to be a foreigner in this beautiful country. Is it any wonder so many foreigners are murdered. A little respect to these local people goes a very long way! Look after your neighbours and your neighbours will look after you!

I am very very lucky, my asawa lives in Canada with her parents and is set for life when we retire back to the Philippines. I get on tremendously well with both her brothers and their family's, so much so that when we do retire, we will all live on one big plot together. I have NEVER heard them ask for money to be sent to them. We send money when we feel like it or when its a special occasion. I happily sit under the mango tree playing tonghits and drinking beer every night im back visiting. My brother in law actually brings round his work colleagues for a beer and food just so we can all sit together as blokes and chat. I find every one of his friends charming and so easy to get on with!

I think people on this forum need to stop being so insular and get out meet more Pinoys! Not all of them want to murder you for your last peso!

As for many posters on here wanting to be able to legally own a weapon, this is the Philippines NOT the USA. The stars and stripes DO NOT fly on government buildings and it is NOT your right to own one! Most burglars generally DO NOT carry a gun, a baseball bat to their upper torso is enough!

I thank you!


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

kermit123 said:


> well what ever it needs to feel safe if its gun or bat respect ppl choice and if thay feel safe in fort knox then its up to them your lucky or not ( i d say ) in canada thats your choice not mine i like it here so with guns cctv and rest security ill stop here thanks and you stop there , not every one is saying that every pinoy will kill you but better not to give em chance to , even killers are charming to your face what you think a killers got a sign on his forehead im a killer pmsl , and as far as what you think well i think you can work out what i think with out me typeing it  and im not stars and strips its british flag here , it might not be your right to own gun here but it is your right to protect yourself and family and your property , and a gun poretty much sums up what i and my pinoy wife thinks is best idea  2 s&w 40 cal m&p pretty much stop most things and if thay dont the ak47 will


man kermit, you must be payin a fortune for the 40 cal ammo. I had a .45 (Colt Commander) as it was easy to get ammo dirt cheap (5p/round for reloads (hollow point and teflon) and I think 20p (ball) for new). I wanted an AK but never got round to it. You gotta have a reliable ammo source for that as the government will sometimes dole out bad ammo to help rid themselves of illegal weapons... 

You always have to appear a "hard" target or you will be taken advantage of for sure. Another tip, never stop if you get "bumped" in a minor accident. It is a common tactic for getting you out of your vehicle (to inspect for damage) and subsequently kidnapped. My plan was to keep on driving and only stop when I reached a barangay police station that I was familiar with (for me it was Divisoria or the downtown station). Then I would plead my case with them if it was a legitimate accident, acting like the dumb foreigner where in your home country you do not bother the police with on site reports but just fill out a form later on (sometimes even over the phone)...


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

DannyRDG said:


> I think people on this forum need to stop being so insular and get out meet more Pinoys! Not all of them want to murder you for your last peso!


After 6+ years, I feel that the following is true...

Until you have actually lived here for a while (not on vacation) and witness first hand the day to day antics over an extended period of time, you really do not have a clue. 

It can test the patience of Job, and granted not ALL are bad. But the few bad ones make it hard to meet the good. For me it's just being streetwise and not walking around with Rose colored glasses as the tourists and dreamers do. Most of those are taken advantage of and don't even know it.

I give respect and expect it in return. I guard myself with all people and nationalities (especially expats). Trust has to be earned and is never given freely (too many newbies place trust too soon). 

This forum is about exchanging information, pointing out common pitfulls, foolish dreams, cultural feau paxs and practices. It is also about learning the best ways TOO interact with the filipinos and be a respected GUEST in their country.


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## DannyRDG (Jul 26, 2011)

Kermit,

What the he** are you expecting at your house? World war 3 to start? Are you waiting for hordes of Pinoy burglars to scale your walls and try to enter? Why would you want an AK47? Surely a 9mm browning would suffice especially inside your house! I was less tooled up patrolling the streets of Basra! 

Jon,

It might have been a vacation but an 8 month one though! I was doing my research before finally deciding that the Philippines was the place for me to retire. Remember, the 7 p's. Prior Planning and Preparation, Prevents Piss Poor Performance!


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

DannyRDG said:


> Kermit,
> 
> What the hell are you expecting at your house? World war 3 to start? Are you waiting for hordes of Pinoy burglars to scale your walls and try to enter? Why would you want an AK47? Surely a 9mm browning would suffice especially inside your house! I was less tooled up patrolling the streets of Basra!
> 
> ...


Danny,

Noted on the P's you don't have to preach those to me.. Have lived in a contingency mode for 30+ years. I am just saying that until you take the plunge it's a whole different story. Just make sure that you don't set your expectations too high is what I am saying and be realistic about any goals.

On kermit, I can understand his position 100% as I have lived in his area. I had a strong setup too (3M wall with electrified spikes, two 80lb german shepherds, 1 watchdog, and a 45). I also traveled in highly tinted vehicles that blended in with the local crowd. There are no secrets here and especially where he lives. So a little "advertising" to some people will make them second guess about going after you (I am referring to kidnappings not robbery/burglary). The dogs alone would deter most burglars (not the ones who try to poison them). Where he lives, kidnapping is the primary security concern......


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

jon1 said:


> Gene,
> 
> I am doing alright. And yes you and I did luck out. I warned mine in the beginning that I would not put up with any of the aforesaid drama and activities. I also told her to get the word out that the $ is mine not OURS=her + extended family. It took about 3 years but they finally got the message. The pinoys can be quite juvenile when it comes to perceived slights and solutions to dilemmas (don't mean this in a slanderous way, just to demonstrate a mindset).
> 
> ...


Yep, it really is a learning experience (for both sides of the family). I like you thoughts on respect being earned and using caution with other expats. So many of the expats (especially in the Angeles area) are those that simply can't make it in their own country and like water seeking the lowest level, drift into the gutters here. Unfortunately, these are they that give ALL of us expats and vacationers a bad name.

Without any doubt, the Philippines needs a lot of improvement in many things. But in all the years of living here, I have had better luck and more enjoyment with our friendships with locals than expats

Would love to continue the discussion with ya on this for fun but I had to delete one post and close the thread.

Hey, what are you doing online on a Saturday? You're supposed to be laying around some beach with the family-Hahahaha!!



Gene


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