# Trouble in Euroland



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Some of you may interested in this BBC programme where Jonathan Charles asks if the Euro will survive, and what does it mean for Europe's dream of political integration?
BBC - BBC Radio 4 Programmes - Trouble in Euroland
I haven't listened to it yet, and no doubt will soon get lost if a discussion follows on from this, but hope you enjoy.
Dedicated to mrypg9 and co


----------



## nigele2 (Dec 25, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Some of you may interested in this BBC programme where Jonathan Charles asks if the Euro will survive, and what does it mean for Europe's dream of political integration?


Good morning Pesky. Tx I’ll have a listen this weekend. I used to enjoy Radio4 a lot but just don’t have the time these days. Real quality debate and I always enjoyed farmers today - great way to start the day  

I must admit I didn’t think the demise of the Euro would occur so quickly. Now I need to plan for a big fat pound again so quality input is great. I hope they discuss the new poundmark currency that will be upon us soon


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Some of you may interested in this BBC programme where Jonathan Charles asks if the Euro will survive, and what does it mean for Europe's dream of political integration?
> BBC - BBC Radio 4 Programmes - Trouble in Euroland
> I haven't listened to it yet, and no doubt will soon get lost if a discussion follows on from this, but hope you enjoy.
> Dedicated to mrypg9 and co


Sorry, I did start my thread "the euro, before having consulted the forum and seeing that you did start this one. Otherwise I would have included my link in your thread. Anyway here is a copy of my post:

Maybe this link could be interesting to some of you?

Maybe Milton Was Right About the Euro — The American, A Magazine of Ideas

Milton Friedman was an American economist who received the Nobel Prize in Economy 1976. Many of his writings are of great interest, because of his deep insight of the economic problems of common people and the acting of governments. There quite some of his comments on Youtube. Personally, even when I do not share all his opinions, I find it extremely interesting to read and listen to what he thinks, because it does really hits the center of the problems European countries, especially Greece, Spain and ireland are having right now. And this is what he said in 1999! Eva33 

I don't know if it is possible to delete my own thread completely. There is really no necessary to have them both on the same forum. sorry again, about this


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Eva33 said:


> Sorry, I did start my thread "the euro, before having consulted the forum and seeing that you did start this one. Otherwise I would have included my link in your thread. Anyway here is a copy of my post:
> 
> Maybe this link could be interesting to some of you?
> 
> ...


I was just about to merge them - I'll delete the other one for you


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> I was just about to merge them - I'll delete the other one for you


Thank you!


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Eva33 said:


> Sorry, I did start my thread "the euro, before having consulted the forum and seeing that you did start this one. Otherwise I would have included my link in your thread. Anyway here is a copy of my post:
> 
> Maybe this link could be interesting to some of you?
> 
> ...



Milton Friedman was also responsible via his indoctrination of his 'disciples' at Chicago University for the collapse and ruin of many economies, directly in South and Central America and indirectly by his influence on naive and inexperienced politicians in the newly-liberated former Communist bloc countries.
It could also be said that his influence on the World Bank and its Structural Adjustment Programmes condemned millions in the developing world to unnecessary poverty and destitution. So yes, he had deep insight into the experiences of 'common people', having pushed so many of them into poverty.
His unsound 'free market' theories also contributed to the recent global financial crisis, a fact recognised albeit belatedly by an erstwhile disciple, Alan Greenspan of the U.S. Federal Reserve who saw sense and recanted when the excrement hit the whirling object.
Friedman's disciples include General Pinochet, assorted South and Central American dictators, various demented Russian free marketeers,Margaret Thatcher and Vaclav Klaus.
People interested in this kind of what George Bush Snr described as 'voodoo economics' might also be interested in the writings of Friedrich Hayek and Ayn Rand (she was probably certifiably insane but never mind....).
I rest my case.

As for the euro.....economists are on the same footing as psychics and seaweed readers, imo. 
I'd put money on the euro being around for at least the next ten years.


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Eva33 said:


> Sorry, I did start my thread "the euro, before having consulted the forum and seeing that you did start this one. Otherwise I would have included my link in your thread. Anyway here is a copy of my post:
> 
> I don't know if it is possible to delete my own thread completely. There is really no necessary to have them both on the same forum. sorry again, about this


Wierd, eh? I wasn't even looking for smth on the euro, it just came up!

I'll look at it all a bit later. I am actually doing the ironing at the moment believe it or not. It's not so hot in the living room ...


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> Milton Friedman was also responsible via his indoctrination of his 'disciples' at Chicago University for the collapse and ruin of many economies, directly in South and Central America and indirectly by his influence on naive and inexperienced politicians in the newly-liberated former Communist bloc countries.
> It could also be said that his influence on the World Bank and its Structural Adjustment Programmes condemned millions in the developing world to unnecessary poverty and destitution. So yes, he had deep insight into the experiences of 'common people', having pushed so many of them into poverty.
> His unsound 'free market' theories also contributed to the recent global financial crisis, a fact recognised albeit belatedly by an erstwhile disciple, Alan Greenspan of the U.S. Federal Reserve who saw sense and recanted when the excrement hit the whirling object.
> Friedman's disciples include General Pinochet, assorted South and Central American dictators, various demented Russian free marketeers,Margaret Thatcher and Vaclav Klaus.
> ...


You seem to like this guy... 

I just wanted to indicated the link. He did predict the problems which happen now in the Euroland a long time ago.I had the same opinion from the beginning in 1999, that so different countries as Germany, Holland, Spain, Italy etc. could not be functioning well with a common currency. Right now nobody really knows what is going to happen in the next few years, but the situation is not very comfortable for Euroland and the Euro. 10 years is not a long time...

I did write in my post that I do not agree with all of Milton Friedman's opinions. Maybe I should have added especially the right wing, conservative ideas he did propagate  Eva33


----------



## nigele2 (Dec 25, 2009)

Eva33 said:


> Right now nobody really knows what is going to happen


Or what options are possible? Looking back through history one has seen currencies totally replaced. One has seen multiple currencies living side by side. But the splitting of a currency in the electronic age?

It will be fascinating to see how it (a split) would be done. How speculation would be controlled, what would happen to money in circulation when there are almost no real border controls, and how the costs of the split would be met by the poorer countries (I can't see a solution to this without Germany paying the bill but as they already are they can afford to take a long term view I guess.). 

Also thinking more of people here (Expats) what impact might it have? A Spanish currency greatly devalued with trading restrictions (taxes) would seem one possible approach for spain but that might leave Expats wanting to bail from even a worse situation than many find themselves in today. 

I guess if it lingers for some years and as a result the Euro suffers many here will be better off. Someone always wins, only the majority lose


----------



## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

JM Keynes has his followers too; Gordon Brown and Barack Obama to mention but two, and that doesn't seem to work either. Am I missing something here?


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

country boy said:


> JM Keynes has his followers too; Gordon Brown and Barack Obama to mention but two, and that doesn't seem to work either. Am I missing something here?


I don't think you are missing anything! I would make at this place another citation from Milton Friedman: "The label on the bottle does not always guaranty what is inside" I like this one


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

OK, read that, listened to that - nothing very different or interesting for the economy analysts on the forum, but quite interesting for me.
So, according to this, Spain cocked it up, and may well cock it up for the rest of Europe, is that right??

One thing I didn't understand was this quote from the article


> Indeed, without the assist to competitiveness from currency devaluation, prices and wages in these countries will need to fall by around a cumulative 20 percent over the next few years if they are to regain international competitiveness


But I thought it was recognized that we earn really low salaries in Spain. How can we earn 20% less??


----------



## nigele2 (Dec 25, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> OK, read that, listened to that - nothing very different or interesting for the economy analysts on the forum, but quite interesting for me.
> So, according to this, Spain cocked it up, and may well cock it up for the rest of Europe, is that right??
> 
> One thing I didn't understand was this quote from the article
> ...


Pesky I think that is the problem. The depth of the problems of Spain are not fully appreciated by many. People talk about recovery. It isn't going to happen. If Spain was not in the Euro it would still be in the mire. Even if they could devalue and increase their competitiveness they would still be in the dodo.

IMHO Spain needs radical change if it wants to cling to the European hierarchy or it needs to accept a new lower level in the world. My Bean saying that Spain is the 8th largest economy in the world is stupid when his people are starving 

Sorry I'll go back to the cricket. It's just so frustrating. (Spain and the cricket - bad light has stopped play).


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

nigele2 said:


> Pesky I think that is the problem. The depth of the problems of Spain are not fully appreciated by many. People talk about recovery. It isn't going to happen. If Spain was not in the Euro it would still be in the mire. Even if they could devalue and increase their competitiveness they would still be in the dodo.
> 
> IMHO Spain needs radical change if it wants to cling to the European hierarchy or it needs to accept a new lower level in the world. My Bean saying that Spain is the 8th largest economy in the world is stupid when his people are starving
> 
> Sorry I'll go back to the cricket. It's just so frustrating. (Spain and the cricket - bad light has stopped play).


Thanks for the reply nigele2
PS I think I've told you before, if you want to have time to listen to the radio, youtube, etc do the IRONING


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

country boy said:


> JM Keynes has his followers too; Gordon Brown and Barack Obama to mention but two, and that doesn't seem to work either. Am I missing something here?


Yes. You are missing the fact that Keynesian economic policies aka known as the post-war consensus provided over thirty years of stability and prosperity in the UK and most of mainland Europe. Gordon Brown was right when he said that he had presided over the longest period of sustained economic expansion since the Industrial Revolution. (The Chairman of the CBI agreed with him). They are still part of the economic strategy in a diluted form in most moderately successful economies. 
They are simply unaffordable in the current economic situation in the UK which has been brought about very largely by politicians of all Parties following a diluted version of Friedmanite 'free market' economics.
As a supporter of a social market economy on the German and Dutch model and not a market society as Friedman and his ilk propound I accept that boom and bust are endemic to a capitalist system. We all enjoy the good times and moan when the downturn inevitably follows.
The big mistake is to imagine that Friedman, Keynes, Laski, Hayek...any economist ...is a scientist. Economics is not a science and cannot therefore be used to predict. Any activity which depends on the vagaries of human behaviour and the variables they bring about cannot be subjected to scientific method.
All you can do is to note patterns in economic history.
Look at the recent market panic over Hungary...and to a certain extent Spain.
Totally irrational, especially in the case of Hungary.


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

nigele2 said:


> Pesky I think that is the problem. The depth of the problems of Spain are not fully appreciated by many. People talk about recovery. It isn't going to happen. If Spain was not in the Euro it would still be in the mire. Even if they could devalue and increase their competitiveness they would still be in the dodo.
> 
> IMHO Spain needs radical change if it wants to cling to the European hierarchy or it needs to accept a new lower level in the world. My Bean saying that Spain is the 8th largest economy in the world is stupid when his people are starving
> 
> Sorry I'll go back to the cricket. It's just so frustrating. (Spain and the cricket - bad light has stopped play).


True but spoilt by your penultimate paragraph, Nigel!!!
No-one in Spain is starving.(Just as no-one in the UK is in 'poverty'.) And Spain is the world's eighth or nineth largest economy. The USA is the world's largest economy but many parts of the country are more akin to developing countries in terms of income per capita.
People in the Sudan, Eritrea and parts of India and other developing countries are starving. Not Spaniards.


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Eva33 said:


> I don't think you are missing anything! I would make at this place another citation from Milton Friedman: "The label on the bottle does not always guaranty what is inside" I like this one



Well, I'm sorry but that vacuous quote just sums up the shallowness of his 'thought'.
He must have spent hours pacing the room with a damp towel round his head before he came up with such a profound insight.
My grandmother used to say something similar and equally trite in a different way:' Some folks will buy s*** if it's wrapped in fancy paper'. (She was a crude peasant!)
That applies to the works of Friedman imo.
As for his Nobel Prize: consider.....Henry Kissinger won the Nobel Peace Prize.
So did Obama....it was awarded before he even took office!!!!
Nobel Prizes are worthless - you only have to look at the list of recipients.


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> Yes. You are missing the fact that Keynesian economic policies aka known as the post-war consensus provided over thirty years of stability and prosperity in the UK and most of mainland Europe. Gordon Brown was right when he said that he had presided over the longest period of sustained economic expansion since the Industrial Revolution. (The Chairman of the CBI agreed with him). They are still part of the economic strategy in a diluted form in most moderately successful economies.
> They are simply unaffordable in the current economic situation in the UK which has been brought about very largely by politicians of all Parties following a diluted version of Friedmanite 'free market' economics.
> As a supporter of a social market economy on the German and Dutch model and not a market society as Friedman and his ilk propound I accept that boom and bust are endemic to a capitalist system. We all enjoy the good times and moan when the downturn inevitably follows.
> The big mistake is to imagine that Friedman, Keynes, Laski, Hayek...any economist ...is a scientist. Economics is not a science and cannot therefore be used to predict. Any activity which depends on the vagaries of human behaviour and the variables they bring about cannot be subjected to scientific method.
> ...


If I did understand you correctly (?) then I cannot agree with this. Economist or not economist, with a bit of common sense you can predict what is going to happen, at least in some areas. I did see the coming real estate bubble in Spain bursting already a few years ago and did sell my properties. And I am not even an economist.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

mrypg9 said:


> Some folks will buy s*** if it's wrapped in fancy paper'.


Brilliant!!! I'm not going to comment on the thread cos I havent read thru it properly or had time to listen to the link - but that comment has had me in stitches!!! and is soooo true, especially of the materialistic west!!!!!

Jo xxx


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> True but spoilt by your penultimate paragraph, Nigel!!!
> No-one in Spain is starving.(Just as no-one in the UK is in 'poverty'.) And Spain is the world's eighth or nineth largest economy. The USA is the world's largest economy but many parts of the country are more akin to developing countries in terms of income per capita.
> People in the Sudan, Eritrea and parts of India and other developing countries are starving. Not Spaniards.


Very, very true, and this is not an opinion, but a fact!


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> Well, I'm sorry but that vacuous quote just sums up the shallowness of his 'thought'.
> He must have spent hours pacing the room with a damp towel round his head before he came up with such a profound insight.
> My grandmother used to say something similar and equally trite in a different way:' Some folks will buy s*** if it's wrapped in fancy paper'. (She was a crude peasant!)
> That applies to the works of Friedman imo.
> ...


You may have a point with this one. But look at the political parties who are labeling themselves “socialist” and look what they sometime do. Why do you citate only the three worst Nobel prizes in history? There are others who made a very big contribution to human kind, who also got it. This is all kind of emotional writing.


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Eva33 said:


> You may have a point with this one. But look at the political parties who are labeling themselves “socialist” and look what they sometime do. Why do you citate only the three worst Nobel prizes in history? There are others who made a very big contribution to human kind, who also got it. This is all kind of emotional writing.


I am no fan of socialism and thought I'd made that clear
Nothing I have written is not based on fact. I try to base my views on reason which is why I abhor emotional faith-based millenialist philosophers like Marx and Friedman. I don't always succeed, admittedly.
And what did Nobel contribute to mankind? Didn't he invent dynamite???


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

Eva33 said:


> Why do you citate only the three worst Nobel prizes in history?


You forgot Adolf Hitler was also award the Nobel peace prize. Apparently he misread peace for piece and then proceed to take a piece of Austria, Czechoslovakia, Poland, etc.:focus:


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

mrypg9 said:


> And what did Nobel contribute to mankind? Didn't he invent dynamite???


Dynamite is nitroglycerin incorporated in an absorbent inert substance to make it safer. So Nobel only made a dangerous explosive less dangerous. Nobel also developed gelignite.


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

JBODEN said:


> You forgot Adolf Hitler was also award the Nobel peace prize. Apparently he misread peace for piece and then proceed to take a piece of Austria, Czechoslovakia, Poland, etc.:focus:


Adolf Hitler? Hmmm. Maybe you are joking? I just did consult the official list of all Nobel prizes. There is no Adolf Hitler. Could you be more precise about this information. If it is true, then I would join the "Nobel as Junk" group and even apologize, but otherwise it would be better to not write any crap on the net. By the way by consulting the list I also found some great people. One example is one of my favorite writers: Thomas Mann


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

JBODEN said:


> You forgot Adolf Hitler was also award the Nobel peace prize. Apparently he misread peace for piece and then proceed to take a piece of Austria, Czechoslovakia, Poland, etc.:focus:


Here is the list: List of Nobel laureates - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

Eva33 said:


> Adolf Hitler? Hmmm. Maybe you are joking? I just did consult the official list of all Nobel prizes. There is no Adolf Hitler. Could you be more precise about this information. If it is true, then I would join the "Nobel as Junk" group and even apologize, but otherwise it would be better to not write any crap on the net. By the way by consulting the list I also found some great people. One example is one of my favorite writers: Thomas Mann


Sorry, he was nominated in 1939 but the nomination was rejected.
Interstingly 4 USA Presidents recieved the award.


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

JBODEN said:


> Sorry, he was nominated in 1939 but the nomination was rejected.


The sad thing about this is that if I (or another member) would not have reacted, some members of the forum would have believed this and repeat it to others ad infinitum


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

Eva33 said:


> The sad thing about this is that if I (or another member) would not have reacted, some members of the forum would have believed this and repeat it to others ad infinitum


Oh dear, you are taking things seriously today (maybe the heat). We have a lot of interesting debates and I doubt that everything that is written is perfectly correct. Nevertheless thanks for pointing out my mistake.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I know I'm not everyone, but I assumed it was a joke!!!!????? But in any case, rightly or wrongly I question those who receive the nobel peace prize because it seem to have ulterior motives and means nothing to world peace in my opinion!!!!

Jo xxx


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

The recipients of the Nobel Prizes are largely those who are the political/philosophical/literary flavour of the month and are often as in the case of Kissinger and Obama awarded for 'diplomatic' reasons.
Those sorts of international prizes are rarely awarded on the grounds of merit....sadly.


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

JBODEN said:


> We have a lot of interesting debates and I doubt that everything that is written is perfectly correct..


Unless I write it!!!

Joke::

Off to skinny-dip....the heat...the heat.....

Etiquette question: should I put the pool lights on?


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

mrypg9 said:


> The recipients of the Nobel Prizes are largely those who are the political/philosophical/literary flavour of the month and are often as in the case of Kissinger and Obama awarded for 'diplomatic' reasons.
> Those sorts of international prizes are rarely awarded on the grounds of merit....sadly.


The few peace prizes I agree with are the Intl. Red Cross and the Dalai Lama.


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

jojo said:


> I know I'm not everyone, but I assumed it was a joke!!!!????? But in any case, rightly or wrongly I question those who receive the nobel peace prize because it seem to have ulterior motives and means nothing to world peace in my opinion!!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


nobel peace prize is only one of the nobels, and as you say probably the most questionable, but Physiques, Literature, medicines and chemistry are completely different things. I personally think that there are great people with those nobel prizes.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

mrypg9 said:


> Off to skinny-dip....the heat...the heat.....
> 
> Etiquette question: should I put the pool lights on?


Depends if you have neighbours with binoculars, cameras or dodgy tickers lol!!!!!

Seriously tho, its so lovely swimming at night, the pool lights make the water luminous, the stars above, the crickets chirruping, a glass of wine............ so tranquil.... I might have a dip myself!!!


Jo xxxx


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

JBODEN said:


> Oh dear, you are taking things seriously today (maybe the heat). We have a lot of interesting debates and I doubt that everything that is written is perfectly correct. Nevertheless thanks for pointing out my mistake.


You are right, I am taking things seriously,so this is just me..., but I have Air Co, so it is not the heath But don't worry: everyone one makes mistakes, even myself


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Eva33 said:


> You are right, I am taking things seriously,so this is just me..., but I have Air Co, so it is not the heath But don't worry: everyone one makes mistakes, even myself



I love your posts on here Eva, sometimes you take things seriously and sometimes so you should!!!! We're all different and we all get to know and understand our different characters!!!!!!! So dont you worry!

Jo xxxx


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2010)

jojo said:


> I love your posts on here Eva, sometimes you take things seriously and sometimes so you should!!!! We're all different and we all get to know and understand our different characters!!!!!!! So dont you worry!
> 
> Jo xxxx


Thank you jojo


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I know I'm not everyone, but I assumed it was a joke!!!!????? But in any case, rightly or wrongly I question those who receive the nobel peace prize because it seem to have ulterior motives and means nothing to world peace in my opinion!!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


I took it as a joke too

a pun on the words *peace* & _*piece*_


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> I took it as a joke too
> 
> a pun on the words *peace* & _*piece*_


Yes, it was a joke.


----------



## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

Talking of Mr Nobel, anybody see the edition of Coast a couple of weeks ago on the Beeb when they showed the site of his old explosives factory in Scotland...I had no idea that's where it was, or how revolutionary it was.
Now...
:focus:


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

xabiachica said:


> I took it as a joke too
> 
> a pun on the words *peace* & _*piece*_


Like that scene from 'THe Producers'.....
Hitler: 'All I want is peace...a piece of Poland, a piece of Czechoslovakia....'
Just love that film


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

country boy said:


> Talking of Mr Nobel, anybody see the edition of Coast a couple of weeks ago on the Beeb when they showed the site of his old explosives factory in Scotland...I had no idea that's where it was, or how revolutionary it was.
> Now...
> :focus:



Yes, those programmes are really interesting. They come up with all sorts of stuff you didn't know about, like the piece about the Nobel factory.
They did one on my part of the country, Dorset, and I saw things I had never realised existed a mile away from where I grew up!


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

mrypg9 said:


> Like that scene from 'THe Producers'.....
> Hitler: 'All I want is peace...a piece of Poland, a piece of Czechoslovakia....'
> Just love that film


or ...
Hitler was a great painter, he painted my room in 2 coats! [whilst making the 'V' sign]


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

From THe Guardian via the Office for National Statistics:

*The British economy grew at the fastest pace in more than nine years in the second quarter, higher than initially estimated, due to a pick-up in the construction industry and strong household spending.

The figures show that the recovery gathered steam in the first half but economists are concerned that it could slow again due to looming drastic government spending cuts.*


Seems that poor old Gordon wasn't such a moron after all...

But Boy George might be......
Double dip recession approaching fast, methinks.


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Eva33 said:


> nobel peace prize is only one of the nobels, and as you say probably the most questionable, but Physiques, Literature, medicines and chemistry are completely different things. I personally think that there are great people with those nobel prizes.


Looking at the list of recipients for Literature I find it an odd assortment.
It includes the likes of William Golding, Doris Lessing, Pablo Neruda....Heinrich Boell is there as well and along with Thomas Mann he is a writer whose works I enjoy.
But are these really giants of world literature?
I know nothing about chemistry, physics etc.so can't comment on those lists but I wonder what those who are qualified to do so would make of the chosen few.
I am sceptical of all such prizes. Literary prizes in the UK such as the Whitbread, Booker etc. often go to writers of dubious merit whilst ignoring others who are infintely more deserving.
But that's just my opinion and therin lies the point: all such judgments come down in the end to a mixture of subjective opinion and political considerations which renders them ultimately of little value other than that of publicity.


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

mrypg9 said:


> Looking at the list of recipients for Literature I find it an odd assortment.
> It includes the likes of William Golding, Doris Lessing, Pablo Neruda....Heinrich Boell is there as well and along with Thomas Mann he is a writer whose works I enjoy.
> But are these really giants of world literature?
> I know nothing about chemistry, physics etc.so can't comment on those lists but I wonder what those who are qualified to do so would make of the chosen few.
> ...


See Nobel Prize in Literature - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I like the idea of a prize for lifetime achievement rather than for an individual publication.
In 1924 Reymont won the prize. He was a distant relative. Unfortunately his genes seem to have bypassed us.


----------



## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

JBODEN said:


> See Nobel Prize in Literature - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> I like the idea of a prize for lifetime achievement rather than for an individual publication.
> In 1924 Reymont won the prize. He was a distant relative. Unfortunately his genes seem to have bypassed us.



Jerzy...I'm sure you have a great Polish literary soul....Sto lat!
Yes, lifetime achievement is much more sensible.


----------



## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

mrypg9 said:


> Jerzy...I'm sure you have a great Polish literary soul....Sto lat!
> Yes, lifetime achievement is much more sensible.


dziękuję


----------



## nigele2 (Dec 25, 2009)

Didn't want to start a new thread but just had to share slightly off topic good news

Steel production on Teeside once again. Lots of jobs in an area that has suffered  As good for them as any noble prize.

:focus:


----------

