# Permanent Resident



## Solomon

I just posted the article about the new Permanent Resident classification on my blog. Its really not that much new information, many people have already talked about the Permanent Resident idea on this forum.

At the end of the article I talked about the provisional articles of the law, where the transitions from the old migratory documents to the new migratory documents are explained.

@RVGringo: Please forgive me if in this article or anywhere else I referred to a "No-Inmigrante" document as an FM3, it just flows off the tongue so much better. Ef-em-three...


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## pappabee

Solomon said:


> I just posted the article about the new Permanent Resident classification on my blog. Its really not that much new information, many people have already talked about the Permanent Resident idea on this forum.
> 
> At the end of the article I talked about the provisional articles of the law, where the transitions from the old migratory documents to the new migratory documents are explained.
> 
> @RVGringo: Please forgive me if in this article or anywhere else I referred to a "No-Inmigrante" document as an FM3, it just flows off the tongue so much better. Ef-em-three...


Thank you very much for posting that. But I'm one of those very confussed people that just wants to be sure I understand things. In your document you refer to non-inmigrante and yet my card says no-inmigrante. Are they the same or is there something new coming around?:confused2:


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## Solomon

Here is the whole series:

Part I: Migratory Reforms: VISITOR

Part II: Migratory Reforms: TEMPORARY RESIDENT

Part III: Migratory Reforms: PERMANENT RESIDENT

Conclusion: Migratory Reforms

I cut the last part of the PERMANENT RESIDENT and added it in a separate post as a conclusion, I got a lot of feedback that the way that it was written before was confusing. It would be helpful to anyone to read all three articles to understand the new migratory conditions, but I will summarize:

1. In MOST CASES, if you have an FM3/No-Inmigrante document right now, you are going to be considered a VISITOR under the new law and will be asked to leave the country 180 days after your next migratory document is issued.

2. In MOST CASES, if you have an FM2/Inmigrante document now, you will be considered a TEMPORARY RESIDENT and your new migratory document will be valid for UP TO 4 years.

3. If you are currently Inmigrado or fall into a few other special categories, you will be considered a PERMANENT RESIDENT and will probably only have to go to the immigration office one more time in you life in order to get issued the PERMANENT RESIDENT card.


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## pictou

So my family and I just got our temporary residency visa from the consulate in Canada and will have it officiated in October once we arrive in Mexico...do you think we will have to renew in a year or will we be good for 4?


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## DNP

It will be what it says on the visa!



pictou said:


> So my family and I just got our temporary residency visa from the consulate in Canada and will have it officiated in October once we arrive in Mexico...do you think we will have to renew in a year or will we be good for 4?


WashDC/SMA


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## sparks

Old rules ... no inmigrante renews every year

New rules may take effect around November ... wait and see


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## pappabee

According to what was said since my wife and I have no-inmgrante status on our visas we will be considered a visitor and be forced to leave within 180 days of our next renewal.

And, also according to what was posted, there is no way that we can change our status to inmgrante. That's going to mess-up a lot of expats. 

I know, I know, wait till November. :confused2:


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## Solomon

pappabee said:


> According to what was said since my wife and I have no-inmgrante status on our visas we will be considered a visitor and be forced to leave within 180 days of our next renewal.
> 
> And, also according to what was posted, there is no way that we can change our status to inmgrante. That's going to mess-up a lot of expats.
> 
> I know, I know, wait till November. :confused2:


If you change from an No-Inmigrante to an Inmigrante right now, you won't have the hassle of leaving the country to apply for your Temporary Resident status.


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## pictou

That would be a drag. Ours is a rentiste no immigrante which is a temporary residence visa good and renewable every year from my understanding of the current rules. I sure hope any changes still allows us the title of "resident" which we need for tax purposes in our home country.


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## DNP

"wait and see" is especially BAD advice for people who are now in Mexico legally, who wish to remain in Mexico legally, and and whose visas expire between now and "some time in November", as they will be in Mexico illegally some time in November. We have no way of knowing how those people will be dealt with at that time. At worst, in my opinion, they may simply be asked to go to the end of the line, figuratively if not literally.

I do foresee a transition period taking place starting some time in November, and the system will be strained during that period for everybody involved. For that, yes, we will have to wait and see. 

Illegal aliens are a big and growing problem for Mexico, reportedly one of the reasons for the new law. I don't think that illegal expats are the reason for the new law (probably the least of their problems, actually) and, from what little I know, the new law, when implemented (sometime in November) will be a benefit to the vast majority of current and future expats. But now and in the future, it will continue to be a two-way street in the sense that non-citizens are and will continue to be guests in Mexico and, on the expat side, should behave accordingly.



sparks said:


> Old rules ... no inmigrante renews every year
> 
> New rules may take effect around November ... wait and see


WashDC/SMA


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## TundraGreen

DNP said:


> ..."wait and see" is especially BAD advice for people who are now in Mexico legally, who wish to remain in Mexico legally, and and whose visas expire between now and "some time in November", as they will be in Mexico illegally some time in November. ...


I don't think anybody is recommending that anyone let their current visa expire and then wait for November. Clearly, if your visa expires in the next few months, you should renew under the old rules and then, presumably, worry about the new rules next year.


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## DNP

Good advice.



TundraGreen said:


> ... If your visa expires in the next few months, you should renew under the old rules and then, presumably, worry about the new rules next year.


WashDC/SMA


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## sparks

What Tundra said !!


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## RVGRINGO

SOLOMON:
Please explain your interpretations, or give a reference. I am of the opinion that current 'no-inmigrantes' will become temporary residents. My present 'inmigrante' card says 'resident', with no temporary status indicated, although the INM agent said we could become 'permanent' on our next renewal, and that we would not have to renew again; as in the old 'inmigrado' status.
I would especially like to see the part of the law, or new regulations and procedures, which would require a current 'no-inmigrante' to leave withing 180 days, as though he only had an FMM permit. As I understand it now, 'no-inmigrante' and 'inmigrante' visas will be merged into a single temporary residence visa, with no need to leave to renew, and that the visa will be for 4 years instead of the present 5 year term.
Yes, it is long and tedious, but I have read the new law from May, 2011.


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## Solomon

RVGRINGO said:


> SOLOMON:
> Please explain your interpretations, or give a reference. I am of the opinion that current 'no-inmigrantes' will become temporary residents. My present 'inmigrante' card says 'resident', with no temporary status indicated, although the INM agent said we could become 'permanent' on our next renewal, and that we would not have to renew again; as in the old 'inmigrado' status.


Sixth Provisional Article (_Articulos Transitorios Sexto_)says:

_Sixth. For effects of the application of the “Ley de Migración”, the following should be taken into account:

I. The foreigners who have obtained the migratory quality of Non-Immigrant, within the characteristics of tourist, transmigrant, visitor in all its modalities except those foreigners who have obtained migratory quality of Non-Immigrant with characteristic of Local Visitor, granted to nationals of neighboring countries to visit border populations of the United Mexican States, religious leader, distinguished visitor, provisional visitor and correspondent will be considered Visitors without permission to realize remunerated activities._

An FM3/No-Inmigrante document, is actually called, according to the "_Ley General de Población"_ a "No Inmigrante Visitante" (Art. 42 Fracc. III, LGP). Therefore an FM3/No Inmigrante document is considered a Visitor.

Now, Article 53 of the "_Ley de Migración_" says:

_Article 53. Visitors, with exception of those for humanitarian reasons or those who have a bond with a Mexican or foreigner with regular residence in Mexico, cannot change migratory conditions and must exit the country at the conclusion of the authorized period of their stay._

Having a bond with a Mexican or a foreigner with regular residence in Mexico means married to, in concubinage with, parent, grandparent, grandson or son of a Mexican or somebody who is a Temporary Resident or a Permanent Resident.

Leaving the country when your VISITOR permission expires will not be a such a big deal. As I see it, when people enter Mexico from now on they will have to declare their migratory status at the border, then will have 30 days to apply for the proper documentation:

_Article 59. Temporary and Permanent Residents, with the exception of those who solicit political asylum, refugee status or designation of apatriot, will have a period of thirty days from their entrance into national territory to solicit, from the Institute, the corresponding residence card, which will be valid for the authorized period. With this card, (the foreigner) will accredit their migratory situation in national territory, while it is valid.
_


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## pappabee

So what you're saying is that I entered Mexico on a FM3 that gave me permission to live here for a year and I was able to renew it until I had been here for 5 years. At that time I was able to apply for a more permanent form of visa. That is no longer possible and when I renew again next year I will only be able to remain in Mexico for 180 days before being required to leave.

That'll mean that there will be lot of expats having to leave Mexico. I wonder what that'll do to the economy?


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## pictou

Not liking the way this seems to be going. We were planning on living in Mexico for some time. I think we will stay in short term rentals till this gets clarified. For our purposes we need "residency" temporary or otherwise. May need to look at other countries now.


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## TundraGreen

pappabee said:


> So what you're saying is that I entered Mexico on a FM3 that gave me permission to live here for a year and I was able to renew it until I had been here for 5 years. At that time I was able to apply for a more permanent form of visa. That is no longer possible and when I renew again next year I will only be able to remain in Mexico for 180 days before being required to leave.
> 
> That'll mean that there will be lot of expats having to leave Mexico. I wonder what that'll do to the economy?


Let's be calm people. Until we know how the new rules will be applied, it seems too early to be worrying about being deported. 

Regarding the old rules, my understanding was that it took five years on an FM-2 to qualify for imigrado status, not five years on an FM-3. But it is irrelevant now anyway.


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## sparks

A whole bunch of people


> except those foreigners who have obtained migratory quality of Non-Immigrant with characteristic of Local Visitor


 will be considered a Visitor

Now if someone can translate that. I see no way they will force long term FM3 holders to leave the country just to start over. Many of us are home owners, have Mexican bank accounts, etc .... don't think so


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## Solomon

By leave the country, I mean, physically exiting Mexican territory. Go home for a few days then come back. This has been a fairly accepted way to renew your migratory status here in Quintana Roo for years, I think in Central Mexico it might not be done as much because the immigration services are much more efficient (so I've heard), but its really not big deal. I am not saying you will be kicked out permanently, but you won't be allowed to change migratory status while in Mexico. 

I am pretty sure the United States and Canada are the same way, if you want to get residency you ask for it from outside the country. This is purely speculation, but the way I imagine this working is that when you cross the border (land/sea/air) you will be asked to fill out a migratory form where you declare your intentions for entering the country.


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## Solomon

What we have been recommending to all of our clients and friends with FM3's since the law came out in May was to go to immigration and do the proper paperwork NOW to have your FM3 changed to an FM2.

It costs a little bit(~3500 pesos), but it will ensure that when the new law comes into effect your document will be equivalent to Temporary Residency and not Visitor.


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## sparks

That sounds interesting enough to go check out in Manzanillo .... but each immigration office has their own rules. I've never heard you can change other than at renewal time.


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## Solomon

@Sparks: A local visitor is, according to Article 42 of the _Ley General de Población_:
_
IX.- VISITANTES LOCALES.- Las autoridades de Migración podrán autorizar a los extranjeros a que visiten puertos marítimos o ciudades fronterizas sin que su permanencia exceda de tres días._

"...foreigners who visit maritime ports or border cities whose stay does not exceed three days."


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## TundraGreen

Solomon said:


> Sixth Provisional Article (_Articulos Transitorios Sexto_)says:
> 
> _Sixth. For effects of the application of the “Ley de Migración”, the following should be taken into account:
> 
> I. The foreigners who have obtained the migratory quality of Non-Immigrant, within the characteristics of tourist, transmigrant, visitor in all its modalities except those foreigners who have obtained migratory quality of Non-Immigrant with characteristic of Local Visitor, granted to nationals of neighboring countries to visit border populations of the United Mexican States, religious leader, distinguished visitor, provisional visitor and correspondent will be considered Visitors without permission to realize remunerated activities._
> 
> An FM3/No-Inmigrante document, is actually called, according to the "_Ley General de Población"_ a "No Inmigrante Visitante" (Art. 42 Fracc. III, LGP). Therefore an FM3/No Inmigrante document is considered a Visitor.
> 
> Now, Article 53 of the "_Ley de Migración_" says:
> 
> _Article 53. Visitors, with exception of those for humanitarian reasons or those who have a bond with a Mexican or foreigner with regular residence in Mexico, cannot change migratory conditions and must exit the country at the conclusion of the authorized period of their stay._
> 
> Having a bond with a Mexican or a foreigner with regular residence in Mexico means married to, in concubinage with, parent, grandparent, grandson or son of a Mexican or somebody who is a Temporary Resident or a Permanent Resident.
> 
> Leaving the country when your VISITOR permission expires will not be a such a big deal. As I see it, when people enter Mexico from now on they will have to declare their migratory status at the border, then will have 30 days to apply for the proper documentation:
> 
> _Article 59. Temporary and Permanent Residents, with the exception of those who solicit political asylum, refugee status or designation of apatriot, will have a period of thirty days from their entrance into national territory to solicit, from the Institute, the corresponding residence card, which will be valid for the authorized period. With this card, (the foreigner) will accredit their migratory situation in national territory, while it is valid.
> _


I think this interpretation is flawed. There are three documents involved here:
Ley de Población (17-04-2009)
Ley de Población (25-05-2011)
Ley de Migración (25-05-2011)

Under the 2009 rules, a person on an FM-3 was indeed considered a visitante. However, the Ley de Poblacion 2011 rescinded those sections of the law. In particular, Art. 42 of the 2009 Ley de Población mentioned above was rescinded. Under the new 2011 rules, the former FM-3/NO IMIGRANTE status morphs into a Residente Temporal. 

My reading of the law is that the biggest change will be that you can no longer stay here indefinitely on a Residente Temporal (Former FM-3/NO IMIGRANTE). Now you will be limited to 4 years in that category. To remain after that you will have to change to a Residente Permanente.

But, as I said above, we should wait until we see how the law will be interpreted.


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## Solomon

TundraGreen said:


> I think this interpretation is flawed. There are three documents involved here:
> Ley de Población (17-04-2009)
> Ley de Población (25-05-2011)
> Ley de Migración (25-05-2011)
> 
> Under the 2009 rules, a person on an FM-3 was indeed considered a visitante. However, the Ley de Poblacion 2011 rescinded those sections of the law. In particular, Art. 42 of the 2009 Ley de Población mentioned above was rescinded. Under the new 2011 rules, the former FM-3/NO IMIGRANTE status morphs into a Residente Temporal.


You are partially right, but at the very bottom of the "Ley de Migración" you will notice the "Provisional articles to the decree that issues the _Ley de Migración_ and rescinds the _Ley General de Población, Codigo Penal Federal, etc..._" and in its second clause it states:

SECOND. The reforms to the _Ley General de Población_ will enter into effect the day following (this publication), except the derogations of fractions VII and VIII of article 3 and the articles 7 to 75, which will enter into effect when the _Reglamento de la Ley de Migración_ becomes enters into effect.

I didn't read anywhere in the law where it says that the _No Inmigrante_ becomes a _Residente Temporal_.



> But, as I said above, we should wait until we see how the law will be interpreted.


We live in interesting times.


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## sparks

Another interpretation

Instead of the old “Inmigrante” & “No Inmigrante” (FM’2 & FM3′s), there are 4 new categories:

“Visitante“: 6 Types: Non-Working Visitors (tourist), Working Visitors, and Visitors for Adoptions, Humanitarian, etc. 180 day limit. See Chapter 2, Article 52, Items I – VI of the Law for descriptions of all 6 types.

“Residente Temporal“: Covers the old “No Inmigrante” (old FM3) , 4 year limit per visa, Work Permit possible, Leave and Re-enter as many times as desired. This also seems to include the old “Inmigrante” FM2 “Rentistas” ***
See Chapter 2, Article 52, Item VII

“Residente Temporal Estudiante“: Covers Student Studies, Research, Training, including working on university degrees.
See Chapter 2, Article 52, Item VIII

“Residente Permanente“: Several types: Covers the old “Inmigrado” and a few special “No Inmigrantes” (the old FM3s for asylum seekers & refugees ), and it appears to cover working “Inmigrantes”**. It allows indefinite stays, no need to renew, and includes the right to work.
See Chapter 2, Article 52, Item IX


New Immigration Law Published for Mexico – The Article | Surviving Yucatan


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## RVGRINGO

Solomon; I hate to say this, but I think you have really stirred up a pot of sheeet without accurate knowledge of the INM system, either before recent changes and, certainly, without a good understanding of the new changes that will be coming this fall.
As such, I would suggest that all readers simply relax, ignore Solomon and his site, which might simply be fishing for business by confusing folks.
Nobody is going to have to make an unnecessary trip to the border if they have current visas.

Sparks,
You can change your status at any time; you don't have to wait until renewal time. In fact, some folks have done that for the simple expedient of moving their renewal time to a more convenient time of year, or to match that of a spouse, etc. We've done that ourselves.


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## TundraGreen

Solomon said:


> ... We live in interesting times.


Agreed. I think it was Confucius who commented. "May you live in interesting times."


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## sparks

RVGRINGO said:


> Sparks,
> You can change your status at any time; you don't have to wait until renewal time. In fact, some folks have done that for the simple expedient of moving their renewal time to a more convenient time of year, or to match that of a spouse, etc. We've done that ourselves.


That would be my reason. February (winter) is busy here on the coast when all the FM3 snowbirds come back


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## RVGRINGO

I suggest that you change your 'no inmigrante' credencial to 'inmigrante'. It will cost, but next year will avail you of the opportunity to apply for a 'tarjeta de residencia permanente' (similar to the old 'inmigrado' status.) No more visits to INM after that, plus all rights, except the vote.


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## pappabee

One of the joys (translate as pain in the butts) of living in Mexico is that there is truly no where you can get a definitive answer about almost anything regarding governmental requirements. It seems to me like the scholars trying to translate the old bible writings. You get five of them in a room and you get 15 opinions. 

I for one am going to just wait. I can't see ANY government changing the rules and requiring a large segment of their population to up root and leave the country even for a few days. It would put a serious kink in immigration and in the flow of money coming into the country. Let a lone what it would do to the existing economy. I'm going to: "make haste, slowly".


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## sparks

I think I'm off to immigration next week to check on the requirements/possibilities


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## pappabee

sparks said:


> I think I'm off to immigration next week to check on the requirements/possibilities


Good luck in getting a straight answer and then being sure that it's going to hold up in November. That's why it's so hard to grow old here. You have to keep running just to stay ahead of the changes being made, or said to being made.

I think I'm going to find a good facilitator and see what they say. At least it'll be another interpretation.

I'm getting the attitude that all I really want is for someone to tell me what to do and let me do it, But please don't change the rules while I'm doing it.


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## RVGRINGO

I did my own, starting with the online INM site, generating the proper forms and wrote the required letter. Those documents, along with proof of resources, home, etc., were presented to INM and the procedure went smoothly from 'no inmigrante' to 'inmigrante'. The only slow-down was those 'facilitators' holding up the line by processing several clients at a time with only one 'number'. If you think you are #10 in line, you may find that there are a few 'facilitators' ahead of you and you are actually the 35th file to be processed. Ugh! Facilitators should be restricted to one file at a time, then get a new number, like the rest of us.


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## pappabee

RVGRINGO said:


> I did my own, starting with the online INM site, generating the proper forms and wrote the required letter. Those documents, along with proof of resources, home, etc., were presented to INM and the procedure went smoothly from 'no inmigrante' to 'inmigrante'. The only slow-down was those 'facilitators' holding up the line by processing several clients at a time with only one 'number'. If you think you are #10 in line, you may find that there are a few 'facilitators' ahead of you and you are actually the 35th file to be processed. Ugh! Facilitators should be restricted to one file at a time, then get a new number, like the rest of us.


I understand but if you are one of the facilitator's clients, then it's a blessing. We all have to take the good with the bad.


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## Guest

RVGRINGO said:


> I did my own, starting with the online INM site, generating the proper forms and wrote the required letter. Those documents, along with proof of resources, home, etc., were presented to INM and the procedure went smoothly from 'no inmigrante' to 'inmigrante'. The only slow-down was those 'facilitators' holding up the line by processing several clients at a time with only one 'number'. If you think you are #10 in line, you may find that there are a few 'facilitators' ahead of you and you are actually the 35th file to be processed. Ugh! Facilitators should be restricted to one file at a time, then get a new number, like the rest of us.


Good thing in Queretaro is that they limit the facilitators to one specific window, and make them sign in and wait on each other. They also have one dedicated window for accepting new / renewal applications, two windows for followups, and two windows for the visa carnet issuance. If no one is holding a number for their type of task/window, they call someone from a different category to keep the flow moving.

I just finished my renewals and it took three visits instead of two because I was unable to find the bank information to make my payments before my first visit and was unwilling to pay online. First visit, 10 minutes wait. 2nd visit, no wait and straight to the window. Third visit was for issuance, and it took her about an hour to process 3 carnets. Lots different from the first time, when each visit would take 3 hours or more, and it took me about 6 trips to get it done. Little by little they are improving (and so has my understanding of the process and their strange vocabulary). 

I am highly skeptical that Migracion is going to force me take a trip out of the country when my No Inmigrante visa expires next summer, in order to switch to the Permanent Resident status. I guess that I am also hesitant to make the change now to Migrante status just before the laws are written to make the upcoming changes.


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## Solomon

RVGRINGO said:


> Solomon; I hate to say this, but I think you have really stirred up a pot of sheeet without accurate knowledge of the INM system, either before recent changes and, certainly, without a good understanding of the new changes that will be coming this fall.


Can anyone show me where it is in the law that says the "No Inmigrante" status will convert to "Residente Temporal"? If I missed that part in the law, please excuse me. What I read, and can show (LdM Transitorio 6to Fracc. I), is that the law says it is going to treat people who have obtained "No Inmigrante Visitante" status as "Visitantes".

I understand that nobody wants this kind of inconvenience in their lives and therefore the law being interpreted as I did is controversial, but I don't think that everyone should ignore my interpretation because it isn't convenient to them.

At best, when the regulations come out, maybe there will be some sort of caveat or grace period where people with an FM3/No Inmigrante can switch to Temporary Resident, but then again, maybe this is the grace period.


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## DNP

Nothing converts. When you're current visa expires, you may get a new visa, probably different than the one you have now. Nothing converts.

Come November, you may also be able to switch your visa to a new, different type, but nobody knows how that's going to work yet--not until sometime in November probably.

For the time being, sit tight, stay alert, and don't let your current visa expire.



Solomon said:


> Can anyone show me where it is in the law that says the "No Inmigrante" status will convert to "Residente Temporal"? If I missed that part in the law, please excuse me. What I read, and can show (LdM Transitorio 6to Fracc. I), is that the law says it is going to treat people who have obtained "No Inmigrante Visitante" status as "Visitantes".
> 
> I understand that nobody wants this kind of inconvenience in their lives and therefore the law being interpreted as I did is controversial, but I don't think that everyone should ignore my interpretation because it isn't convenient to them.
> 
> At best, when the regulations come out, maybe there will be some sort of caveat or grace period where people with an FM3/No Inmigrante can switch to Temporary Resident, but then again, maybe this is the grace period.


WashDC/SMA


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## sparks

RVGRINGO said:


> I suggest that you change your 'no inmigrante' credencial to 'inmigrante'. It will cost, but next year will avail you of the opportunity to apply for a 'tarjeta de residencia permanente' (similar to the old 'inmigrado' status.) No more visits to INM after that, plus all rights, except the vote.


Let me add that "all rights" don't include property ownership in the restricted zone until you have citizenship


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## RVGRINGO

Nor a passport, of course, but you can work without special permission, etc.


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## kazslo

Solomon said:


> I understand that nobody wants this kind of inconvenience in their lives and therefore the law being interpreted as I did is controversial, but I don't think that everyone should ignore my interpretation because it isn't convenient to them.


I've been watching the thread here and keeping quiet, being as I, nor any of us, has any concrete evidence on what will happen. I don't think the issue is that everyone is upset with what you are presenting, but that you are passing it off as truth with no factual basis. North of the border thinking would lead us to believe that what we read/interpret in the 'law' is the 'law'; but here in Mexico, what is written as law is often different from what is interpreted as law by the authorities which is different from what is enforced as law. The law here is not written in stone, but more like warm butter. Best to leave the interpreting to those who will be doing the enforcing in November. It will alleviate all of this guesswork and worry. At the end of the day, we will all have to do as told by INM, but so far, they haven't told anything.


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## tepetapan

kazslo said:


> I've been watching the thread here and keeping quiet, being as I, nor any of us, has any concrete evidence on what will happen. I don't think the issue is that everyone is upset with what you are presenting, but that you are passing it off as truth with no factual basis. North of the border thinking would lead us to believe that what we read/interpret in the 'law' is the 'law'; but here in Mexico, what is written as law is often different from what is interpreted as law by the authorities which is different from what is enforced as law. The law here is not written in stone, but more like warm butter. Best to leave the interpreting to those who will be doing the enforcing in November. It will alleviate all of this guesswork and worry. At the end of the day, we will all have to do as told by INM, but so far, they haven't told anything.


 I agree 100%. Way too much time and energy has been used in this and other forums worrying about the unknown. Apply for renewal 30 days or so before expiration of your visa, INM will tell you what they need. And I could not care less what mexico calls the new permits as long they don´t call me late for Happy Hour.


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## DNP

Couldn't agree more. Cheers!



tepetapan said:


> I agree 100%. Way too much time and energy has been used in this and other forums worrying about the unknown. Apply for renewal 30 days or so before the expiration of your visa, INM will tell you what they need. And I could not care less what mexico calls the new permits as long they don´t call me late for Happy Hour.


WashDC/SMA


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## TundraGreen

DNP said:


> Couldn't agree more. Cheers!
> 
> 
> 
> WashDC/SMA


Ditto


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## pappabee

G-d grant me the serenity 
to accept the things I cannot change; 
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference. 


What will be, will be.


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## Jibbarra

*more permanent resident questions*



RVGRINGO said:


> I suggest that you change your 'no inmigrante' credencial to 'inmigrante'. It will cost, but next year will avail you of the opportunity to apply for a 'tarjeta de residencia permanente' (similar to the old 'inmigrado' status.) No more visits to INM after that, plus all rights, except the vote.


Ok, I have read the posts and info. over and over. I am concerned, confused, etc..
Here is my dilemna: My husband and I both have a FM3 (no inmigrante). It will expire on the first of Nov.. We are at this moment in the US. If we obtain FM2s, each, now, won't that prevent us from getting a car permit? (Our property is in Sinaloa) And isn't there a law that states you can't have a car licensed in the US in Mexico when you have a FM2?
Is the answer to travel to Mexico before our FM3s expire, obtain a FM2, not worry about the car thing, return to immigration after Nov. 25th and change to permanent resident? We have had a FM3 for 5 years and were going to have to start over this OCT.
I understand that nobody completely understands how the new laws will be, but I sure would appreciate some advice.
Thank you all for this forum. I read it and have used it over and over.


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## RVGRINGO

You had better be in Mexico in time to renew your 'no inmigrante' visas, or you will be fined. Since you have had your visa for five years, you will be starting over with a new 'tarjeta de residencia', assuming that the new procedures are in place when you renew; you'll be right on the cusp of the timeline specified in the new law for implementation. At the time of renewal, you can decide if you want to remain 'temporary' or change to 'permanent'. If you choose the latter, I suspect that you may have to get rid of your foreign plated car before making the change. With the new fees, which you will have to pay when you return to Mexico, having a foreign car is becoming more and more of a nuisance. Owning a Mexican car, registered in the state where you live, is much simpler and also avoids the fees and stop at banjercito whenever you cross the border.


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## sparks

You can have a foriegn plated car with an FM2 or 3 (no-inmigrante or inmigrante). It's only when you go 'inmigrado' that the rules change

By the time you renew no-inmigrante and inmigrante rentista visas may be the same thing


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## RVGRINGO

Residente Permanente replaces the old 'inmigrado' status. We assume that the same rules will apply, but that is yet to be confirmed.


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