# FLR (M) Refusal? Seriously?



## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

Hello again everyone. Well as i said everything went through smoothly since getting married. I have applied for my FLR (M) went through the checklist of items they needed on the application, went over it with my husband more than once and sent it off.

I then received my biometric letter not soon after, i thought everything was going great. Sadly on Sat. a few days before my visa was to expire, i was sent my package containing what i thought was my FLR (M) visa approved, but it was not. 

I emptied the packet to find a Refusal Letter including a very harsh statement of threat of deportation and another paper stating i am able to appeal. My passport was not included in the package and only my husbands passport was returned. The Long harsh and confusing letter also included the reasons, and the only reason was that we did not send them 6 months in bank statements and a letter from his boss, but i did send them 9 months worth of ORIGINAL paychecks, and my husband has not changed jobs since a few months ago when my marriage visa was approved. What i don't understand is why didn't they just send an email or letter stating that this is all they needed to approve my visa, i would have gladly sent it to them. This whole ordeal is just horrible, i have been crying for two days now and we are desperately trying to get a legal representative to help us out in this matter. Can anyone please tell us what we should do next? we desperately need help. Our life is going to be completely destroyed and i have nowhere and noone to go back to in the States as i did'nt realize this could possibly happen, especially they let me get married in the country just a few months ago, why did they bother if they planned on doing this to us? There is no logic to it what so ever. Thank you all for your help through this horrible journey.


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

Sorry that you've been refused. It's a shame you didn't post a document checklist here as we would have told you what you were missing. They are under no obligation to contact you for missing documents. Bank statements and a letter of employment are both required documents. The bank statements prove that he was actually paid and the letter of employment confirms the details of his employment. 

Did the letter indicate that you could appeal? Or you can gather all the required documents and reapply. If you do that you should type out exactly what the refusal letter says and post a checklist before you submit.


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## Whatshouldwedo (Sep 29, 2013)

Can she remain in the UK if she decides to reapply as her visa would now have expired, or would it be better to appeal? She mentions the UKVI letter says she could appeal.


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

Hi Nyclon thank you again for your response, yes the package contained a letter which said we can appeal which we are in process of doing and all supporting documents that they required are available which we will be sending with our appeal. We have paid the 140 pounds for the verbal hearing, but you can also pay the 80pounds for a paper hearing. I will definately post what the refusal letter said and post the documents we enclosed in our application and the very simple supporting documents that can cause and has caused such a harsh outcome to our application, as to help anyone who is going through this or who is in the same boat as us, but first need to get this done. Will keep you updated on the status, please wish us luck.


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

You have 14 days from the refusal date to lodge your appeal so keep that in mind. 

Whatshouldwedo, you can apply by post up to 28 days after visa expiration but you give up your right to appeal. (Or you have limited right to appeal-not sure).


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## Whatshouldwedo (Sep 29, 2013)

nyclon said:


> You have 14 days from the refusal date to lodge your appeal so keep that in mind. Whatshouldwedo, you can apply by post up to 28 days after visa expiration but you give up your right to appeal. (Or you have limited right to appeal-not sure).


Thanks Nyclon. Mind you, if one applied by post a month before the expiration of the visa and were refused two months later( which is a reasonable time for UKVI ) the visa would have expired already. In a case like that, would the spouse have to leave the UK or could they reapply right away. I guess, if given the right of appeal, it would be better to do that?


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

You would have the right to appeal within the 14 day time period but if you wanted to reapply you would have to do so from your home country as your old visa would be expired.


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## Whatshouldwedo (Sep 29, 2013)

nyclon said:


> You would have the right to appeal within the 14 day time period but if you wanted to reapply you would have to do so from your home country as your old visa would be expired.


This just proves how important it is to get it right first time! Hope you are still assisting on this forum when my time comes!


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## TruleighZak (May 29, 2014)

I feel very sorry for you.

Again, a case of a lack of human consideration. I have never understood why they can't simply ask for the respective (simple) documents and save people time and stress. I know that they have an 'in-exhaustive' list of required documents but the UKVI website is horrendous to navigate and, in places, very misleading. Hence, how great this forum is.

I have no doubt whatsoever that you will be successful.

Best of luck and regards...


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Provided you appeal within the timeframe given- if you have in-country right of appeal, which you do with FLR(M), your existing visa/leave will be automatically extended until a decision is made. 
If you actually meet the financial requirement and only the lack of documentation led to the refusal, then you stand a good chance of the original decision being overturned at caseworking manager review stage, which always comes before any referral to the First-Tier Tribunal. Just make sure you send the complete set of required documents with your appeal.
If you miss the deadline for appeal, your case will be referred to the Border Force field office and they will start procedure to remove you from UK, with your passport handed back at departure.


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

Very very important, one simple document missing can cause this to happen. From what i have learned so far the financial part is most important you should give them as much supporting documents as possible even ones not listed on the application as i have found this is the first thing they look at.


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

Joppa said:


> Provided you appeal within the timeframe given- if you have in-country right of appeal, which you do with FLR(M), your existing visa/leave will be automatically extended until a decision is made.
> If you actually meet the financial requirement and only the lack of documentation led to the refusal, then you stand a good chance of the original decision being overturned at caseworking manager review stage, which always comes before any referral to the First-Tier Tribunal. Just make sure you send the complete set of required documents with your appeal.
> If you miss the deadline for appeal, your case will be referred to the Border Force field office and they will start procedure to remove you from UK, with your passport handed back at departure.


Thank you so much Joppa, you have definately gave us more hope. 

We have applied yesterday online for the verbal hearing and have sent off all the evidence supporting this case even included a copy of my husbands employment and a cover letter stating why we disagree with the refusal. 

The application can be very confusing not to mention the website especially if you are choosing to do it yourself instead of paying 1800 pounds for a immigration lawyer  we honestly thought that sending bank statements was only for those qualifying for the financial threshold by savings only.

Also we thought that they would not require as much supporting documents this time as it was not stated on the application checklist to send a letter from my husbands place of employment. 

This is common sense, only a few months ago i was given permission to come to this country to get married and start my life, all info should still be on file and they were given this letter from employment and bankstatements before, nothing has changed. I find it hard to understand why such a harsh decision on something that was readily available upon request? furthermore original paychecks were provided and exceeds their requirements. Surely that should'nt have granted us this painful decision.

Again i will definately be posting everything that you should include in the application and for those who are going through this hurtful experience we will provide what we did to appeal as soon as i hopefully get good news. Please wish us luck:fingerscrossed:


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

TruleighZak said:


> I feel very sorry for you.
> 
> Again, a case of a lack of human consideration. I have never understood why they can't simply ask for the respective (simple) documents and save people time and stress. I know that they have an 'in-exhaustive' list of required documents but the UKVI website is horrendous to navigate and, in places, very misleading. Hence, how great this forum is.
> 
> ...


Agree with you 100%, noone should have their life destroyed overnight over something as trivial as a supporting documentI think they need to try and find a better way of implementing their red tape. Honestly there are criminals who come into this country and they are allowed to just because of the EU. I came here legally to start a normal life with the love of my life, work, paytaxes, etc, i am not from a war torn country seeking refuge or coming to grub off the government never will and never have. To me all that has happened so far does'nt make sense :confused2: at all. Thank you so much for your support.


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

gigiwhite said:


> Very very important, one simple document missing can cause this to happen. From what i have learned so far the financial part is most important you should give them as much supporting documents as possible even ones not listed on the application as i have found this is the first thing they look at.


FM 1.7 and FM-SE explain what is needed to meet the financial requirement. These are documents that you should have consulted before applying. There is no need to send unnecessary documents but you do need to send the documents that show you meet the requirements for the financial category that you are relying upon.



gigiwhite said:


> noone should have their life destroyed overnight over something as trivial as a supporting document


Trivial? I know you're upset, but supporting documents are the proof they need to know that you meet the financial and other requirements. If you don't submit documents to support your case, how are they going to know whether you meet the requirements? They aren't going to take your word for it.



gigiwhite said:


> we thought that they would not require as much supporting documents this time as it was not stated on the application checklist to send a letter from my husbands place of employment.
> 
> This is common sense, only a few months ago i was given permission to come to this country to get married and start my life, all info should still be on file and they were given this letter from employment and bankstatements before, nothing has changed.


It's your job to supply the documents that support your application. Every time you apply it's a fresh application and you need to send *all *the required documents. In fact, you were advised of this in a previous thread:



> The requirements and documentation are essentially the same as for the fiance visa except you will include your marriage certificate, a few photos from the wedding and you'll update pay slips and bank statements.


http://www.expatforum.com/expats/britain-expat-forum-expats-living-uk/640649-married-now-what.html


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

nyclon said:


> FM 1.7 and FM-SE explain what is needed to meet the financial requirement. These are documents that you should have consulted before applying. There is no need to send unnecessary documents but you do need to send the documents that show you meet the requirements for the financial category that you are relying upon.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you for your help Nyclon, i am not disputing with what you are saying as you are 100% right, but the point i am trying to make is that PROOF was INDEED presented that we meet the financial requirement it is not like we did not present any financial proof at all, but i do not think we deserved to have such a harsh decision just because we misunderstood the application or missed on something. I do not think a couples life should be destroyed because of it. The sentence should at least fit the crime if you know what i mean.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

I take your point and you feel hard done by.
I'm afraid the modus operandi of UKVI is to play strictly by published rules and regulations (and relevant guidance), with the onus on applicants to make a full and complete application ticking all the boxes instead of their exercising discretion which takes time and introduces personal judgement, varying outcome (i.e. inconsistency). While they usually allow one missing document from a series required (like 5 instead of 6 bank statement if it doesn't affect the outcome), they cannot permit when the whole series is missing (no bank statement at all).


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

Joppa said:


> I take your point and you feel hard done by.
> I'm afraid the modus operandi of UKVI is to play strictly by published rules and regulations (and relevant guidance), with the onus on applicants to make a full and complete application ticking all the boxes instead of their exercising discretion which takes time and introduces personal judgement, varying outcome (i.e. inconsistency). While they usually allow one missing document from a series required (like 5 instead of 6 bank statement if it doesn't affect the outcome), they cannot permit when the whole series is missing (no bank statement at all).


I understand and that was our mistake, and trust me we are beating ourselves up about it, as we misunderstood the application thinking that it was only for those meeting the financial requirement through savings. We honestly thought that 9 ORIGINAL paychecks would have be enough proof of income, but my husband and I have also read that a couple got refused because they had 5 bank statements instead of six and they went through the appeal and won their visa before it even got to the First-tier Tribunal judge. Yes we are upset any couple would be, but now i am more at ease because of this forum and i know for sure if all goes good i will not do a darn thing again untill i write it all here first.lol..will keep you all updated and will make sure this does not happen to anyone ever again. Thank you for your help and understanding our pain.


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...a/file/376014/FLR_M__guidance_notes_11-14.pdf

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...exFM_Section_FM_1_7_Financial_Requirement.pdf

https://www.gov.uk/immigration-asylum-tribunal


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## gigiwhite (Jul 5, 2014)

https://immigrationappealsonline.justice.gov.uk/IACFees/


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