# Summer trial, then hopefully moving in 18 months



## Tracylo09 (Jan 10, 2012)

Hello, We are a family of 4, with a 17 year old son and an 11 year old son, who have had many holidays in Protaras and fell in love with the place as I'm sure many others have. My husband and I even got married in Derynia 6 years ago. We have decided that we really do want to relocate to this area and have given ourselves a time period of 2 1/2 years from now to save up money etc. We came over for a fortnight at Christmas to see if we still loved it as much when it is closed in winter (and we did).

However I have been reading posts regarding English children being bullied at school and not learning very much. I have also read that the locals are not very welcoming to us. I am now slightly nervous about the whole thing and actually reconsidering. I am not sure what my question is, just hoping that someone may be able to put it into some prospective for me and reassure me that it isn't all bad. I would love to hear anything that anyone has to say and look forward to commenting on other posts when I become an active member, thank you in advance.


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## Mycroft (Sep 9, 2009)

Tracylo09 said:


> Hello, We are a family of 4, with a 17 year old son and an 11 year old son, who have had many holidays in Protaras and fell in love with the place as I'm sure many others have. My husband and I even got married in Derynia 6 years ago. We have decided that we really do want to relocate to this area and have given ourselves a time period of 2 1/2 years from now to save up money etc. We came over for a fortnight at Christmas to see if we still loved it as much when it is closed in winter (and we did).
> 
> However I have been reading posts regarding English children being bullied at school and not learning very much. I have also read that the locals are not very welcoming to us. I am now slightly nervous about the whole thing and actually reconsidering. I am not sure what my question is, just hoping that someone may be able to put it into some prospective for me and reassure me that it isn't all bad. I would love to hear anything that anyone has to say and look forward to commenting on other posts when I become an active member, thank you in advance.


Good afternoon and welcome,

I think you need to come over for a longer period than two weeks, Are you hoping to find work? If you do not speak Greek Cypriot this will be very difficult as the job situation here is dire. The local schools teach in Greek, so your 11 year old will need a knowledge of the language, although some local schools do say they give language lessons I understand this is sporadic. What is your 17 year old going to do? English language schools ( private) can be expensive. 

Trying not to depress you too much there are a few things you do need to be aware of. You will need to be able to financially support yourselves independently. Healthcare is not free, and if you are not in receipt of a UK State Pension you will need to have private health insurance for the family. There is no state financial support if you have not paid into the Cypriot system. 

On the positive side, we have found nothing but kindness and a welcome from locals here ( well we do live in the mountains!!!) but everywhere is different, if you try to be part of the local community there is better acceptance usually. The expat community functions well, it is like a big village spread over the island. Cypriots are very family orientated, there is at present little crime, although I believe there are areas where this is on the rise, there does not seem to be the drunken culture that is found in a lot of UK now.

I am sure there will be a lot more responses to your post, what ever you decide good luck, just remember this is not UK in the sun

Kind regards


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

Hi Tracy, Welcome to the forum.
Its good that you are giving it plenty of time to research and not jumping in with both feet on a whim.
Before making your decision take a look at other areas of the island. 
I wouldn't recommend living full time somewhere like Protaras. Two weeks holiday is one thing but full time in the winter could get very wearing after a while. Closer to Larnaca would be better for full time living, or take a look at the Paphos area as well to see what you think of it. Its much greener than the Larnaca side and the winters are a little warmer while the summers are not as oppressively hot.
As your youngest son would be 13 or 14 by the time you come it will be difficult for him to slot into local education halfway through his high school years so he would probably have to go to private school which can be very expensive. You need to budget around 8-10K per year for his schooling.
As for jobs, do either you or your husband have any skills which would make it easy for you to find work? The job situation here is no better than the Uk and wages are less so you need to take this into account when working out whether a move here is financially viable at this time.
Please feel free to ask any questions you may have about living and working in Cyprus and we will do our best to help you. 
Remember that we are not experts so can only advise based on personal experience.

Regards
Veronica


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## Tracylo09 (Jan 10, 2012)

Thank you for your quick response & advice, we are planning a full month in the summer to get a real feel and speak to more expats & have a look at the schools etc. My husband has his own business in the UK so will be keeping that running to finance us until he gets a job out there and will still have it to come back to should things not work out, he is a tattoo artist. We are planning on spending the next couple of years learning the Greek language to help us along a bit. I know it is a tough decision and not to be taken lightly and all pros and cons will have to be considered before we 100% take the decision to make the leap. Thank you once again for taking the time to respond, its very much appreciated.


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## Cleo Shahateet (Feb 23, 2009)

Tracylo09 said:


> Thank you for your quick response & advice, we are planning a full month in the summer to get a real feel and speak to more expats & have a look at the schools etc. My husband has his own business in the UK so will be keeping that running to finance us until he gets a job out there and will still have it to come back to should things not work out, he is a tattoo artist. We are planning on spending the next couple of years learning the Greek language to help us along a bit. I know it is a tough decision and not to be taken lightly and all pros and cons will have to be considered before we 100% take the decision to make the leap. Thank you once again for taking the time to respond, its very much appreciated.



Just from experience, we have had a couple friends open tattoo shops in Paphos and both ended up closing. One female who was married to a Cypriot, she spoke Greek and English and knew a lot of people and had a shop in the tourist area and it still did not make ends meet for her. 

The other was a Cypriot male who despite real talent just did not get enough business doing tattoos alone. 

Your husband could possibly work for someone however, it won't be enough to support a family if he did find a job. 

Sorry to be a downer but we watched 2 excellent tattoo artists with support and knowledge of the area, market, language and friends go under and this was while the going was good in Cyprus.


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## Tracylo09 (Jan 10, 2012)

Thanks Cleo, I appreciate your honesty, he was hoping to work for someone else but as you say, it would seem people just aren't making ends meet and therefore wouldn't be able to take on another artist either. Thank you for taking the time to respond, much appreciated.


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

My advice is to put your plans on hold until the economic climate improves and in the meantime try to save as much as possible to give yourselves a good nest egg to support you if you do eventually make the move. Also perhaps you should wait until your youngest son leaves school as the cost of school fees can be prohibitive.
Don't give up on your dream but do plan well and maybe put it back a few years.

Regards
Veronica


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## Tracylo09 (Jan 10, 2012)

Very sensible advice Veronica, I was thinking that is what we will have to do, doesn't look like we have much choice for now unfortunately. Will just have to stick to visits for a few more years and see how things are again in 6 years when then stakes aren't so high i.e my youngest's education and happiness. Thank you again.


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## Kalimera (Oct 19, 2011)

It's all very well saying move over when things get better - things are getting worse in UK. We are stuck in a recession and have been for years and probably will be for many years to come. There is nothing to say that things will be 'better' in UK and Cyprus for 5 more years, we don't know.


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## Mycroft (Sep 9, 2009)

SWJ said:


> It's all very well saying move over when things get better - things are getting worse in UK. We are stuck in a recession and have been for years and probably will be for many years to come. There is nothing to say that things will be 'better' in UK and Cyprus for 5 more years, we don't know.



Things may be bad in UK for the foreseeable future, however for many this is the community they can relate to, things are familiar, and they have family to give moral and may be even financial support. The main concerns for people with families moving here are getting a job, as there is NO social security support if you have not paid in to the Cypriot system, no free healthcare, and, if you are not in receipt of a state pension it is a mandatory requirement for residency to have private health insurance which could be expensive, and schooling, if you want your children to be taught in English, is private and as Veronica has said can be very expensive. If this does not deter you then come over and see how it goes, just make sure you have enough finances to support you and the family, if you are unable to get a job quickly and if necessary have enough to get you back to UK should life in Cyprus not be what you hoped for.


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## americanah (Sep 26, 2010)

Tracylo09 said:


> Very sensible advice Veronica, I was thinking that is what we will have to do, doesn't look like we have much choice for now unfortunately. Will just have to stick to visits for a few more years and see how things are again in 6 years when then stakes aren't so high i.e my youngest's education and happiness. Thank you again.


I would definitely wait until your youngest is out of school. The free schools here are in Greek and they are not good generally. Private schools cost an arm and a leg. Jobs are extremely hard to come by, especially if you are not Cypriot.

I am an American and moved here with my husband 15 months ago. It was a HUGE culture shock. (we lived in the UK for 4 years before). My husband is Greek Cypriot and his family lives in our village so it wasn't as hard for him. For your kid's sake I would just wait. Let them finish out school in peace. Sorry to be a downer but I think it is only fair for the kids to wait if you can. And don't buy anything when you move here- rent first. And if you do buy- the homes built by property developers and sold cheap are not made well. 

Visiting Cyprus is so much better than living here. It can be so frustrating. Everything is so expensive here.  Also you have to jump through hoops to get anything official ever done. Cypriots govt is not organized at all. Be prepared to be frustrated even just parking at the grocery store as Cypriots tend to take up two spaces for each car and park in handicapped regularly. (this drives my husband nuts and he is Cypriot!) I am stuck here the rest of my life. I cried for months and months. Now I help rescue animals and it gives me a reason to be here. 

That is another thing, The animal welfare situation is horrible in Cyprus. So many dogs are locked in cages and never let out (cages rarely cleaned- sometimes fed once a week- especially hunting dogs) On my block alone there are at least 20 such caged dogs. Abuse and neglect runs rampant. 

It seems in the cities some people are more enlightened on such things than in the villages. The villages are stuck in 1950 when it comes to animal welfare. I live next door to and across from caged dogs and it is pitiful and sad. I talked the people next door into at least letting me walk their poor dog, a beautiful boxer. I tried to talk them into letting me find her a good home but no, she is their property. It's frustrating and sad. Many animal rescuers are threatened by hunters/neglectful owners who say they will shoot them. Most Cypriots can be nice to people but they crap on animals. And generally most Cypriots will be nice to you but will talk about how dirty English and Americans are (because a lot of Cypriots are neat freaks). And if you keep an animal in your house they will think you are extra dirty and may not even come into your house. 

Sorry for being so jaded- maybe it's village life... I am in a village 20 min from Larnaca and right next to Dhekalia.


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## PeteandSylv (Sep 24, 2008)

americanah said:


> I would definitely wait until your youngest is out of school. The free schools here are in Greek and they are not good generally. Private schools cost an arm and a leg. Jobs are extremely hard to come by, especially if you are not Cypriot.
> 
> I am an American and moved here with my husband 15 months ago. It was a HUGE culture shock. (we lived in the UK for 4 years before). My husband is Greek Cypriot and his family lives in our village so it wasn't as hard for him. For your kid's sake I would just wait. Let them finish out school in peace. Sorry to be a downer but I think it is only fair for the kids to wait if you can. And don't buy anything when you move here- rent first. And if you do buy- the homes built by property developers and sold cheap are not made well.
> 
> ...


Americanha: Oh dear, what a depressing response. While I agree with the conclusions most people have expressed with moving to Cyprus, I do think one of the worst features here is the whinging ex-pats who expect everything to be the same as their home country.

There are many categories of prices that are more expensive than the UK and many things that are much cheaper. Overall we find our cost of living to be the same as the UK.

The treatment of animals is much the same in most countries on this side of the world and the picture painted is too bleak. We have caged dogs near us who are cleaned out each day, fed twice a day and when we see them let out are perfectly happy animals. Although we would not choose to keep our dog this way, to suggest that all animals are treated badly is wrong.

The comment on parking also made me smile. If there's one thing that's easy here it's parking and very rarely with a charge. Lane discipline both on the road and in car parks tends to be poor, but who cares if a car took up 2 spaces - there's plenty of others!

Cyprus Government undoubtedly needs its procedures updating and simplifying, they are rather like the UK 50 years ago, but this will slowly happen like the recent census which was handled efficiently and informatively particularly the comprehensive web site that was set up.

I have never heard a Cypriot suggest the British and Americans are dirty and my overall experience would rate them as helpful, friendly and generous people, with the occasional exception of those stuck in the EOKA time-warp. None have refused to come in our house because of the dog, but of course we do keep him away from some of them when they express the all too common fear of dogs.

Tracylo09: My thoughts on your situation would be to think very carefully. If you were retiring here I would say go ahead but with children's education and jobs to consider you will find it a tough environment in most places of the world right now. If you do decide to come plan a fall-back position in case it doesn't work out, do travel round the island to see where you might live - we did and nothing would get me to live on the east side once I'd seen the beauty of the west and mid areas. As others have said do not buy a home, it is essential to rent right now at least until the market recovers. Above all try to take off the rose tinted glasses and enjoy Cyprus for what it is which means adopting a modified lifestyle, after all if you want to live like a Brit as if in the UK, why come here?

Good Luck,

Pete


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

Well said Pete.
I would totally agree 100% with every single word you said:clap2::clap2::clap2:


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## kimonas (Jul 19, 2008)

I must admit to feeling a little saddened by Americanah's situation as described in her post as it reminded me of the inevitable culture shock that I too experienced. Far from being a whinging ex-pat, she has come here without expectations, but to follow her heart in marrying a Cypriot national (much as I did 7 years ago). There is a difference between those that find themselves living and trying to work here because of fate and circumstance rather than from the fulfilment of a long held-dream of relocation. Hats off to Americanah for finding a niche and purpose.

On the other side of the coin, I agree with Pete's post although for balance I have come across more bigotry and hostility here than I care to mention, but that is all down to the field I work in and the topics I research - but that is always countered by the seemingly limitless hospitality to be had in the majority and the fascination this wonderful island holds. If it is any consolation, in my experience, the culture shock does wear off after about five years and those of us fortunate enough to arrive here via Cupid's arrow almost always end up falling in love with Cyprus as well as their spouse...


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## Cleo Shahateet (Feb 23, 2009)

kimonas said:


> I must admit to feeling a little saddened by Americanah's situation as described in her post as it reminded me of the inevitable culture shock that I too experienced. Far from being a whinging ex-pat, she has come here without expectations, but to follow her heart in marrying a Cypriot national (much as I did 7 years ago). There is a difference between those that find themselves living and trying to work here because of fate and circumstance rather than from the fulfilment of a long held-dream of relocation. Hats off to Americanah for finding a niche and purpose.
> 
> On the other side of the coin, I agree with Pete's post although for balance I have come across more bigotry and hostility here than I care to mention, but that is all down to the field I work in and the topics I research - but that is always countered by the seemingly limitless hospitality to be had in the majority and the fascination this wonderful island holds. If it is any consolation, in my experience, the culture shock does wear off after about five years and those of us fortunate enough to arrive here via Cupid's arrow almost always end up falling in love with Cyprus as well as their spouse...


Very, very well said Kimonas! :clap2: She needs support and understanding. I also did not see her as a "whinging expat" but someone who is disillusioned after she saw the other side. I would suggest if she has the money and time to plan trips out of the country once a year or twice if possible then do it. That always made us feel refreshed and gave us something to look forward to when island living became a little monotonous. Also, there is an American woman's group that meets (or used to meet) in Nicosia. It is just nice to meet up with other people once in awhile who know what you are talking about and totally understand you.


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## PeteandSylv (Sep 24, 2008)

Cleo Shahateet said:


> Very, very well said Kimonas! :clap2: She needs support and understanding. I also did not see her as a "whinging expat" but someone who is disillusioned after she saw the other side. I would suggest if she has the money and time to plan trips out of the country once a year or twice if possible then do it. That always made us feel refreshed and gave us something to look forward to when island living became a little monotonous. Also, there is an American woman's group that meets (or used to meet) in Nicosia. It is just nice to meet up with other people once in awhile who know what you are talking about and totally understand you.


It wasn't my intention for my comment to force the discussion to go off-topic but I do think it fair to say that if you read through Americanah's original post, virtually everything she mentions is a whinge about conditions in Cyprus. That is all I was commenting on not her circumstances, need for support or anything else. Just plain fact based on her words.

My comment was not exclusively pointed at her either. How many of you have met people who whinge on about Cypriots and Cyprus with an air of superiority as if everything in their home country, usually UK, was perfect? Typical subjects being driving, the roads, parking, price of imported food, building quality, too hot, too cold, too wet, nepotism, bribery, hunting, etc.

Support where it is needed may make an important contribution to creating a more positive attitude but the key issue is that this is Cyprus. It belongs to the Cypriots and we are the guests. We do no credit to ourselves with constant complaints.

Pete


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## americanah (Sep 26, 2010)

PeteandSylv said:


> Americanha: Oh dear, what a depressing response. While I agree with the conclusions most people have expressed with moving to Cyprus, I do think one of the worst features here is the whinging ex-pats who expect everything to be the same as their home country.
> 
> There are many categories of prices that are more expensive than the UK and many things that are much cheaper. Overall we find our cost of living to be the same as the UK.
> 
> ...


Ahhh dear Pete, i take no offense at you putting me in the whinging category because you are very naive. I am married to a Cypriot. Cypriots and Greeks in general think of Americans and Brits as dirty. They don't say it to their faces for goodness sake. And basically I had not much of a choice coming here. My husband is from here and was coming back and wouldn't move to California. Being that I know many Cypriots who will actually say what they think behind brits backs I think I have a better perspective of this than you. Also, I see all of the time that Brits get 'taken' and charged more for many things (services etc) because they are Brits and the Cypriots even say so. 

I do animal rescue work here in Cyprus so I see the many dirty secrets. The dogs in cages thing, my super Cypriot father-in-law even said it was like 90% of the dogs and people just are behind. He doesn't even like dogs and cats and he admits this. Cypriots aren't going to let you in on all of these things if you are foreign. 

I didn't come here for dream life on an island. But I did not expect so much animal abuse and neglect. I know that happens in my country too but it is on a huge scale here. As I said before, on my block ALONE there are 20 caged dogs who are never let out. Of those, at least 5 of them are fed once a WEEK. They almost all have grimy, soupy green water to drink and some are only fed pasta. And they are NEVER let out. Dog across the street lays in his pee and poo and is a huge dog in a small cage. 4 dogs outside our grocery store in cages on a field had piles and piles of poo. I've had to report them so many times. A majority of Cypriots do not care about these animals- they think of them as property and if one dies get another. A Cypriot child was abusing a kitten and my English Cypriot friend asked the parent why he let the kid do it- that the kitten would die. Guy said- it's ok we can get her another if that happens. In my rescue work we see an ENORMOUS amount of neglect and cruelty. Dogs being dumped in the mountains, puppies on the side of the road. Animals who can barely walk from being caged and starved. Even the pounds here are horrible. Dhali pound has animals starving and they mix big dogs with small and small dogs get killed by the bigger dogs. This place is a mess when it comes to animal welfare. Do you live in a place with lots of english people? Because I do not know how you do not know about all of this that goes on. 

Sorry for getting a bit worked up but this place is a hell for animals and for anyone to belittle that fact is wrong. Some of our rescuers are Cypriot and they are appalled by their countrymen's attitude towards them.


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## PeteandSylv (Sep 24, 2008)

americanah said:


> Ahhh dear Pete, i take no offense at you putting me in the whinging category because you are very naive. I am married to a Cypriot. Cypriots and Greeks in general think of Americans and Brits as dirty. They don't say it to their faces for goodness sake. And basically I had not much of a choice coming here. My husband is from here and was coming back and wouldn't move to California. Being that I know many Cypriots who will actually say what they think behind brits backs I think I have a better perspective of this than you. Also, I see all of the time that Brits get 'taken' and charged more for many things (services etc) because they are Brits and the Cypriots even say so.
> 
> I do animal rescue work here in Cyprus so I see the many dirty secrets. The dogs in cages thing, my super Cypriot father-in-law even said it was like 90% of the dogs and people just are behind. He doesn't even like dogs and cats and he admits this. Cypriots aren't going to let you in on all of these things if you are foreign.
> 
> ...


Please reread my comments. I gave an example of reasonable treatment of dogs nearby us trying to make the point that not all animals are badly treated here. You seem to live in a place where there are some particularly poor owners and wish to tar everyone with the same brush.

No we don't live in a place with lots of English people. Our village has only 1 other English person who is a recluse and we have never met. 

You have focussed on the animal issues you brought up. Can you not see that this was just a part of your original post where you made so many negative comments leading to the impression of being a whinger.

If you are not then I apologise however I keep to my general criticism of ex-pat whingers.

Finally I need to point out that in no way am I guilty of "belittling that fact". Commenting on what you said is not belittling it at all, this is a discussion forum for sharing opinions.

Pete


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## RHODES4712 (Jan 29, 2012)

well said pete. i've been reading and following several posts and threads and in the end i will make up my own mind as to what i think but in any case i do think sometimes if someone has nothing good to say then it may well be best to say nothing at all????

darren


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## Geraldine (Jan 3, 2009)

PeteandSylv said:


> It wasn't my intention for my comment to force the discussion to go off-topic but I do think it fair to say that if you read through Americanah's original post, virtually everything she mentions is a whinge about conditions in Cyprus. That is all I was commenting on not her circumstances, need for support or anything else. Just plain fact based on her words.
> 
> My comment was not exclusively pointed at her either. How many of you have met people who whinge on about Cypriots and Cyprus with an air of superiority as if everything in their home country, usually UK, was perfect? Typical subjects being driving, the roads, parking, price of imported food, building quality, too hot, too cold, too wet, nepotism, bribery, hunting, etc.
> 
> ...



My view is that if the UK was such a good place to live, as it once was, why are people wanting to jump ship?

I don't like, in the short time I have been here, the notion that Brits are trying to implement their UK habits, way of life and such like here, the way it is is what makes it so special.

In the UK ,we were the first to complain of immigrants who made specific demands to have what they had in their own country. No wonder there were cries of 'If you don't like it go home', I would suggest the same applies here.

Sorry ! :focus:


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## RHODES4712 (Jan 29, 2012)

i'm sure my missus would agree with you there!! although for the last 12 months i have had to concentrate on dealing with solicitors, union officials, company directors, and british transport police with regards to what happened to her at work, she nevertheless has been studying and learning the language to help integrate when we arrive there. and because i will be running my own business i will be doing the same, this also includes doing everything and anything that is cypriot to integrate and fit in to their way of life. both me and my missus are now ashamed to call ourselves british and will be doing all things possible to leave it where it belongs where the sun don't shine!!!


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## Tracylo09 (Jan 10, 2012)

I have read all the responses to my original post and know I have made the right decision to postpone the trip for the foreseeable future. I appreciate everybody taking their time to write a response and although everyone has a different view on the subject, the overall response has been the same, stay in the UK (for now). A few responses have certainly opened my eyes to some of the difficulties people are facing & I am very grateful for your honesty. I do hope the situation improves for you in the future. Thank you all for helping us to make the decision rather than us blindly sticking to our plans costing a lot of money and heartache, although I know ultimately the final decision lies with ourselves. We will just have to appreciate the beautiful country from a holiday makers perspective for a good few more years and reassess the situation when the youngest has finished school & college. 

Thank you all again

Tracy (and family)


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

I am sure you have made the right decision Tracy. Use the next few years to plan and to save as much as you can so that when you do make the move you have a good fund behind you to help with the transition.

good luck for the future.

Regards
Veronica


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