# Any business ideas for a foreigner in Philippines?



## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

I would like to get some ideas & advise especially from expats in Philippines for a small business that suits for a foreigner, That can be improve by time. Any current expats Business person, who have any advise? or Ideas?


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## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

anthonyluwis said:


> I would like to get some ideas & advise especially from expats in Philippines for a small business that suits for a foreigner, That can be improve by time. Any current expats Business person, who have any advise? or Ideas?


Plenty of ideas, most don't suit us or our lifestyle/needs, a Filipino partner and 6 years back and forward, living, looking and absorbing. Time tells for the individual. We found ours by spending time and lots of patience. Listening to locals, looking at the all too many opportunities etc etc. The world can be your oyster when you look and look hard, spend time and learn. Many opportunities for the brave and fool hardy, best to experience and see first hand and not rely on here say.

Cheers, Steve.


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## Maxx62 (Dec 31, 2013)

anthonyluwis said:


> I would like to get some ideas & advise especially from expats in Philippines for a small business that suits for a foreigner, That can be improve by time. Any current expats Business person, who have any advise? or Ideas?


I think that the only way you're going to be able to own a business over here is if you happen to have a Filipino wife and put everything under her name. I've seen plenty of expats running resorts and restaurants, but the problem with that is there is so much competition, and it is very very hard to get good quality employees. If I had a lot of money, and time on my hands, I might consider looking into a business that imports car parts. It is very difficult to get parts for older cars here, and there does not seem to be many suppliers who are interested in keeping a lot of inventory on hand. Usually when you visit an auto parts store here all they have is a few basic things such as batteries, belts, and motor oil. But if you're looking for a carburetor rebuild kit, or a head gasket set then you are usually out of luck. I tried importing dashboard pads a few years ago, and I shipped a few boxes of them over here without any trouble, but then suddenly the local customs people wanted a cut, so that killed me brining any more over here.


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## archcherub (Dec 26, 2016)

how about food and beverage business?

Go for casual dining! =) the middle class is exploding here


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

archcherub said:


> how about food and beverage business?
> 
> Go for casual dining! =) the middle class is exploding here


Food and beverages are cheap, no profit in them.


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

bigpearl said:


> Plenty of ideas, most don't suit us or our lifestyle/needs, a Filipino partner and 6 years back and forward, living, looking and absorbing. Time tells for the individual. We found ours by spending time and lots of patience. Listening to locals, looking at the all too many opportunities etc etc. The world can be your oyster when you look and look hard, spend time and learn. Many opportunities for the brave and fool hardy, best to experience and see first hand and not rely on here say.
> 
> Cheers, Steve.


Very true Steve, first hand experience will help us on the long run and especially as you mention moving along with the locals is a must thing to have a good business. I do believe there are good chances for expats to have a well good enough income with a business in philippines. I do have my time of experience that's why i do agree with you. 

Thank you Steve.


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

Maxx62 said:


> I think that the only way you're going to be able to own a business over here is if you happen to have a Filipino wife and put everything under her name. I've seen plenty of expats running resorts and restaurants, but the problem with that is there is so much competition, and it is very very hard to get good quality employees. If I had a lot of money, and time on my hands, I might consider looking into a business that imports car parts. It is very difficult to get parts for older cars here, and there does not seem to be many suppliers who are interested in keeping a lot of inventory on hand. Usually when you visit an auto parts store here all they have is a few basic things such as batteries, belts, and motor oil. But if you're looking for a carburetor rebuild kit, or a head gasket set then you are usually out of luck. I tried importing dashboard pads a few years ago, and I shipped a few boxes of them over here without any trouble, but then suddenly the local customs people wanted a cut, so that killed me brining any more over here.


Yes i heard how the ownership working system in Philippines. Yes as you mention there are lot of competition, But with that not all continue to have the Good Quality product or the service. It's not easy to copy and have the same quality. 

Oh i see. Hahahah I guess it's a problem with most of the customs all over the world. Once you give the cut, Game over for the profit. I'm sorry to hear that bad experience with the customs and ending your business. All the very best with your future business plans.

Thank you sharing your personal experience and advise Maxx62.


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

archcherub said:


> how about food and beverage business?
> 
> Go for casual dining! =) the middle class is exploding here


Well that's a good idea and i have that in my options. I guess it all depends on the location and the people what really needs to eat. No doubt most of the people in Philippines Loves to eat. I guess you're in an area people think about food all the time. 

Thank you for your idea.


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

Gary D said:


> Food and beverages are cheap, no profit in them.


Well that's true Gary for some distance, It's not one of those businesses that give you are sky rocket profit and you need to to work a lot, especially if you want to save the profit. It's like i need to do all the work by my own with an extra set of hands at the start.. 

Thank you Gary.


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## Maxx62 (Dec 31, 2013)

anthonyluwis said:


> ...But with that not all continue to have the Good Quality product or the service. It's not easy to copy and have the same quality...


But many of the consumers here, even expatriates, don't care very much about good quality, and the people who do put quality over price are in the minority. There was an expatriate in my area who ran a nice outdoor restaurant with some of the best food that I've ever tasted. Unfortunately he didn't have a very good location and he didn't attract the type of higher paying customers that he was hoping to get. Over time he began to experience cash flow problems, his wife started cutting back on the quality of the food, and his business went into a death spiral. Just my observation.


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## mogo51 (Jun 11, 2011)

anthonyluwis said:


> I would like to get some ideas & advise especially from expats in Philippines for a small business that suits for a foreigner, That can be improve by time. Any current expats Business person, who have any advise? or Ideas?


Yes its called retiring, very easy to learn but doesn't pay much.


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## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

mogo51 said:


> Yes its called retiring, very easy to learn but doesn't pay much.


While I like very much what you say, and I can do this very easily in PH. and upper middle class in Australia.
Moving country for retirement becomes a hobby (a serious hobby), perhaps because of our partner and loved ones? Because one cannot afford to retire in their birth country, perhaps adventure? A business venture? Stay in your own back yard unless you are smart, have ties and can negotiate gratis reciprocation to the benefit of your desired community and thugs.
Use your skills and know how, absolutely no different to your birth country or the experiences living/experiencing other countries and cultures and apply it to the country you wish to retire/live in. 

Find your niche market and invest, be well prepared to lose/gain but be vigilant and astute with your choice/s. It's dog eat dog out there and no matter where you choose to invest your money be it PH. or the Maldives; look, research and research again, feel the economy, infrastructure and people where you wish to invest.
The answers come but it takes time and energy. Retiring is so much easier but we always look out for our loved ones and plan for their future as well as our own.

Cheers, Steve.


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Maxx62 said:


> But many of the consumers here, even expatriates, don't care very much about good quality, and the people who do put quality over price are in the minority. Just my observation.


Fully agree with you on that. Quality is not a good selling point. It is ingrained here that cheap is better. Even after living in the states with me and subsequently moving back here, my Asawa has reverted back and I have such a hard time to convince her to pay a bit more for something that will last 3 times as long. She will spend all day and countless jeepney fares going to different areas of the city to save a couple Pesos on something. 

Fred


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

Maxx62 said:


> But many of the consumers here, even expatriates, don't care very much about good quality, and the people who do put quality over price are in the minority. There was an expatriate in my area who ran a nice outdoor restaurant with some of the best food that I've ever tasted. Unfortunately he didn't have a very good location and he didn't attract the type of higher paying customers that he was hoping to get. Over time he began to experience cash flow problems, his wife started cutting back on the quality of the food, and his business went into a death spiral. Just my observation.


Oh i see. 

Thanks Maxx62 for sharing valuable and personal experience.


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

mogo51 said:


> Yes its called retiring, very easy to learn but doesn't pay much.


   I'm not that lucky to have that option yet in my life. But that's best one. 

Thank you Mogo51


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

bigpearl said:


> While I like very much what you say, and I can do this very easily in PH. and upper middle class in Australia.
> Moving country for retirement becomes a hobby (a serious hobby), perhaps because of our partner and loved ones? Because one cannot afford to retire in their birth country, perhaps adventure? A business venture? Stay in your own back yard unless you are smart, have ties and can negotiate gratis reciprocation to the benefit of your desired community and thugs.
> Use your skills and know how, absolutely no different to your birth country or the experiences living/experiencing other countries and cultures and apply it to the country you wish to retire/live in.
> 
> ...


That's very true Steve. One of the best Advise to have.

Thanks Steve.


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## anthonyluwis (Nov 19, 2016)

fmartin_gila said:


> Fully agree with you on that. Quality is not a good selling point. It is ingrained here that cheap is better. Even after living in the states with me and subsequently moving back here, my Asawa has reverted back and I have such a hard time to convince her to pay a bit more for something that will last 3 times as long. She will spend all day and countless jeepney fares going to different areas of the city to save a couple Pesos on something.
> 
> Fred


Indeed. It's something i also experienced in PH. It's wonderful to know every else also have the same thoughts. 

Thanks Fred.


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

DokK said:


> A good option would be to open a small diner


 Thats the most common of what Filipinos want to have as business, so the competition is very hard so very few earn good,

Filipinos are very good at copying, but copy to close,
so I recomend starting 
someting few can/want to copy by they dont have capital or knowledge
or start production because such are much less sensitive of to close copying by most productions sale elsewhere anyway.


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## freebiefan (Nov 11, 2020)

And perhaps dont forget that their are seriously onerous terms in this country both in gaining monet ie extra capital... its a book load of forms and then super high interest rates, and if you make a product and sell it to a distributor or suchlike, the distributor may not pay you for 90 days, hence the need for extra capital.
Had a knitwear company here with my then sister in law. Sold products to Bench, Giordano etc.. and yes they witheld payment for 90 days after receiving the goods. 
I gave up, wasnt going to keep putting in more and more capital into a business that required more and more capital in order to get ahead, oh plus I found out the sister in law was saying one thing to me when I would visit to check on books and the operation...and another to everyone else in the company. Lesson learned, no more business for me here, and definitely no more sister in law. 
DMCI, a company on the PSEi makes me 8% dividend for doing absolutely nothing.


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## Montemar (Jun 18, 2013)

freebiefan said:


> DMCI, a company on the PSEi makes me 8% dividend for doing absolutely nothing.


This is something iam picturing myself, share markets, crypto digital currency, all done on your chosen device, take it with you, wherever you choose to live and play.
Are there any expats successfully doing this in retirement?


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## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Yep and no shady business dealings here, all offshore.

Cheers, Steve.


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

mogo51 said:


> Yes its called retiring, very easy to learn but doesn't pay much.


Best post of the day Mogo51, I couldn't have said it better! Enjoy that pension and LIVE and enjoy spend time with your family, life is too short. We no longer need all those luxury items we had to work so hard for over the years, there's really no need to go to work if you think about it.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

M.C.A. said:


> Best post of the day Mogo51, I couldn't have said it better! Enjoy that pension and LIVE and enjoy spend time with your family, life is too short. We no longer need all those luxury items we had to work so hard for over the years, there's really no need to go to work if you think about it.


I'm not sure where I found the time to fit work into the day, and weekends don't exist anymore.


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

freebiefan said:


> DMCI, a company on the PSEi makes me 8% dividend for doing absolutely nothing.


 The rich Filipinos live of such, which has lower taxes than from work incomes.


Montemar said:


> This is something iam picturing myself, share markets, crypto digital currency, all done on your chosen device, take it with you, wherever you choose to live and play.
> Are there any expats successfully doing this in retirement?


 Well. some earn at crypto currency trading but I recomend everyone to STAY OUT because bitcoin is paid around 3000 - 5000 times higher than what they are REALY worth. I prefer to buy investments for LESS than they are worth 


bigpearl said:


> Yep and no shady business dealings here, all offshore.


   


Gary D said:


> I'm not sure where I found the time to fit work into the day, and weekends don't exist anymore.


 my father said similar when he retired, didnt understand how he had time to work earlier  got very occupied after retirement e g perform playing music, train dogs, compeeting himself and organice compeetings in e g boule...


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## art1946 (Nov 30, 2017)

A food stall in the food court area in a mall is good money and not a lot of overhead. When I was living in the Davao area I checked into that at the mall's regional offices but the list is long for the vendors waiting to get a place. If a person is living there then they can get on the list and see what happens. 

Art


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

art1946 said:


> A food stall in the food court area in a mall is good money and not a lot of overhead. When I was living in the Davao area I checked into that at the mall's regional offices but the list is long for the vendors waiting to get a place. If a person is living there then they can get on the list and see what happens.
> 
> Art


Good money by filipino standards maybe but a westerner wouldn't get out of bed for it.


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## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Too true Gary and via the better half we looked at several business opportunities here over the last 10 years,,,, presented by the better half proffering 30 to 40% return and on the surface over the years was lots of income from the initial investment but when asked for the actual figures? Yes I gave you them, what are the profit and loss figures for this investment? What's that? He knows better now and no business offerings for many years. My scrutiny revealed the actual RIO was for different businesses 4 to 10%, the later higher risk and no accountability. Better to keep my money invested in Australia averaging 10% with no heartache.

I see the outlaws running a successful and busy Sari store but still we give hand outs and no money for hospital bills,,,,, another thread, it does keep them busy though.

OMO.

Cheers, Steve.


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## freebiefan (Nov 11, 2020)

Well im probably one, having reactivated my BPI stock trading account in July 2020. Invested US$ 10,000 in a few stocks here , DMCI AREIT Converge when it had its IPO and a few others......dividends are only interesting for a few of the stocks I hold but overall my 10,000 is now just short of US19,000. Its been fun watching it rise, and rise. 
Much more interested and invested in stocks in other countries, but the stuff I have here is just a nice pastime and theres a few friends who have done same and so its another subject of discussion for our coffee morning meetings...
Crypto.. know nothing about it so wont go near it.


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## amcan13 (Sep 28, 2021)

Provided you deal with the leagalies of having a Filipino really owning the business and your own country's tax implications, it comes down to capital in my opinion.
All the small things like food carts, restaurants or Sri Sri store are being done by too many others. What locals usually lack is land and capital for a really profitable business.
If you do a normal small business you spend all your time for a very small profit. 
I see that there is need for say an ice supply both cubed and chipped. There is a big demand but you need a location to generate the ice, store it and transport. This is investment. 
There is also a big farming demand for seafood but you need land and about 1 million PHP to get setup.
If you want to buy a few vans and hire drivers to drive people between major cities that is a common service and the van can be private rented by customers to increase profits. But as you notice you have to buy the vans.
My retirement is too important to have to worry about a job every day at the business and watch every employee to make sure I am not losing product out the door.

My wife is lucky at the slot machines, I finance her and take a cut. That is my kind of business. I get to drink while she wins. 😀


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

amcan13 said:


> My wife is lucky at the slot machines, I finance her and take a cut. That is my kind of business. I get to drink while she wins. 😀


We have a small building next to the road and for several years we had a Billard table and it actually brought in some money, you could pay for all your food needs and then some.

We sold mostly non food items like cigarettes, I can't remember what else other than it was a success as a business in our 4th class Municipality plus the In-laws couldn't eat Billard balls unlike running a sari sari store.

The flood weakend and damaged the wood and then the termites finish this awesome table so all we have left is 3 huge marble slabs, we might make them into tables, but I just might try this again with a new table.

Another success story was when I raised goats, there's no feeds just grass (the back yard area) and local goats only, not the imported. Turkey if you have the room for them to roam works also they mainly eat grass.

I'm with you amcan13 I prefer to relax and really retire.


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## amcan13 (Sep 28, 2021)

M.C.A. said:


> We have a small building next to the road and for several years we had a Billard table and it actually brought in some money, you could pay for all your food needs and then some.
> 
> We sold mostly non food items like cigarettes, I can't remember what else other than it was a success as a business in our 4th class Municipality plus the In-laws couldn't eat Billard balls unlike running a sari sari store.
> 
> ...


I had a few failures too. I tried fruit trees. the guy we hired didn't water them enough to start and they died. 
Bought cows to see about raising them. tried two females but never got but one calf in 3 years. Sold them.
Did goats. They seemed to breed well but were trouble to find enough land to eat grass. they took all grass and made mud yards. dogs got some and others got aggressive when fed food scraps. we ate most and gave some away.
So back to my drinking and watching wife gamble as best business, which returns about as much in the end as other attempts.


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

amcan13 said:


> I had a few failures too. I tried fruit trees. the guy we hired didn't water them enough to start and they died.
> Bought cows to see about raising them. tried two females but never got but one calf in 3 years. Sold them.
> Did goats. They seemed to breed well but were trouble to find enough land to eat grass. they took all grass and made mud yards. dogs got some and others got aggressive when fed food scraps. we ate most and gave some away.
> So back to my drinking and watching wife gamble as best business, which returns about as much in the end as other attempts.


I have several calamansi, grape fruit, guyabano and tamarind trees and finally they are bearing fruits.

I also found that Taro (Gabi) grows real well, it's a hearty easy to grow root.


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## Tiz (Jan 23, 2016)

My lady's sister and her husband opened a new restaurant in their home town in Mindoro just 1 month ago.
The husband was a chef's assistant in the middle east for a few years.
They decided on a Korean BBQ, "all you can eat" restaurant.
They've hired 3 staff to help, at PHP 250 per day each.
First month they said profit was PHP121K.
They work long hours 6 days a week, but that income far exceeds anything else they could earn without having to leave their home town.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

Tiz said:


> My lady's sister and her husband opened a new restaurant in their home town in Mindoro just 1 month ago.
> The husband was a chef's assistant in the middle east for a few years.
> They decided on a Korean BBQ, "all you can eat" restaurant.
> They've hired 3 staff to help, at PHP 250 per day each.
> ...


I hope they can keep the profits up once the honeymoon period is over.


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

Tiz said:


> First month they said profit was PHP121K.


 Thats very good - if its true. Its rather common Filipinos think income = profit


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## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Yep, 100% agree Lunkan as expressed in previous posts here and over the years, most Filipinos look at today, perhaps tomorrow but not always the reality.

Cheers, Steve.


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## bigpearl (Jan 24, 2016)

Tiz said:


> My lady's sister and her husband opened a new restaurant in their home town in Mindoro just 1 month ago.
> The husband was a chef's assistant in the middle east for a few years.
> They decided on a Korean BBQ, "all you can eat" restaurant.
> They've hired 3 staff to help, at PHP 250 per day each.
> ...


That's fantastic if true Tiz. Turn over and profit are very different as offered up before, the better half finding supposedly lucrative businesses ( my directive and get off your ass ) offering 25 to 30% return was shot down with reality and simple figures by me. The 30% return businesses that the better half presented ended up 8 to 10% return but very, very high risk, the 4 to 5% business (actual) were risky and the better half agreed that 50 to 60 hours a week slogging was not worth the investment nor the income received and the 1 to 2% return that his parents receive from their sari store fail to meet their daily requirements and then some. We have been topping them up for years.

I would also question P 250 per day for the workers (slave labour) as the absolute minimum wage in the Philippines legally appears to be: And then some, search and I'm sure you will but at the end of the day?

minimum wage in the philippines

And honestly? I can't get a guy or girl to dig a trench in my back yard for anything less than P400 per day and they run off to have their lunch for 2 hours so you only get 6 hours a day,,,,,, they are casual so Philheath and SS contributions don't come into it for me but in a full time situation?

As Gary D said. Time will tell. While I wish them luck, good fortune and very much hope they prosper we don't know their initial investment (ROI) nor overheads but from experience? The numbers back themselves and after a few years the proof of the pie will be in the eating.

OMO.

Cheers, Steve.


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

bigpearl said:


> That's fantastic if true Tiz. Turn over and profit are very different as offered up before, the better half finding supposedly lucrative businesses ( my directive and get off your ass ) offering 25 to 30% return was shot down with reality and simple figures by me. The 30% return businesses that the better half presented ended up 8 to 10% return but very, very high risk, the 4 to 5% business (actual) were risky and the better half agreed that 50 to 60 hours a week slogging was not worth the investment nor the income received and the 1 to 2% return that his parents receive from their sari store fail to meet their daily requirements and then some. We have been topping them up for years.
> 
> I would also question P 250 per day for the workers (slave labour) as the absolute minimum wage in the Philippines legally appears to be: And then some, search and I'm sure you will but at the end of the day?
> 
> ...


Here's what I found on the minimum wage but as Expats we always get that extra charge and expectations or like you mentioned they won't work:

The Philippines has daily minimum wage rates that vary from region to region, ranging from *PHP316 (US$6.57) to P537 (US$11.17) a day for 2021*. The wages are set by tripartite regional wage boards located in every region.4 May 2021

If the citizen works a full time job they also will be paid SSS. 

Because of that extra expectation I now do most of the work myself, I get tired of paying extra just because I'm a foreigner but when they run out of jobs they'll come to your home asking for work, don't pay too much it's called pay back for overcharging.


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

There are exceptions from these very low minimum salary law.
/Small businesses with special registration. (The government offered some benifits for small business owners to make them register their small businesses to make them stop being black market businesses.)*
/Domestic helpers. There is a special law for them. Last I looked in provinces the lowest was the benifits as e g room and food plus 2500 pesos per month.
/I doubt legal. Some employers "transform" not domestic helper jobs to "domestic helper" jobs by give the domestic helper benifits as e g a sleep place and food to the employees instead of minimum salary. I know of a few examples employee in internet cafe, some shops. But I wonder if these business owners have calculated corect, of their total cost realy become lower  because its hard to survive at a minimum salary if need to pay these benifits self.

* Inspite of this offer with big benifits to the owner if register their business - if it fullfil the demands to be counted as such type (e g NOT allowed to be franchise) - many dont register anyway. Perhaps because its a big hazzle to register, get permits and the A LOT of tax forms even many tiny businesses have to make! 
E g the type of businesses we are buying. NONE such had registered in the whole municipaly before us, although there are a lot of them to big spaced to not be seen easy! If looking  (But not much to gain by officials if check up such businesses by almost all of them are very wrong handled so most owners earn nothing or so litle so they dont need to pay income tax if registered neither.)


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## Hey_Joe (Sep 13, 2016)

Google search - entrepreneur Philippines


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

Hey_Joe said:


> Google search - entrepreneur Philippines


 I suppouse such search will show a lot of suggestions what to put in food carts


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## Tiz (Jan 23, 2016)

Lunkan said:


> Thats very good - if its true. Its rather common Filipinos think income = profit


Yeah, that was my first question as well.
From my conversations with my other half, it seems they calculated this from day to day operations,
IE: sales minus wages and daily supplies.

I don't think it takes into count any capital expenses.
They didn't need to rent, as they built their restaurant on vacant land already owned by the family.
All up building expense was approx. 400K and then additional cost of furniture etc.

They expect the lead up to Xmas will be even busier than now. It will be interesting to see how they go after the honey moon novelty period is over.


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

Tiz said:


> Yeah, that was my first question as well.
> From my conversations with my other half, it seems they calculated this from day to day operations,
> IE: sales minus wages and daily supplies.


 Thats ok for a rough calculation if they count all "not static" costs and once a week or so adjust for rough stock value at end minus start of period, and if they remember to count all costs as e g electricity, propane, transports...


Tiz said:


> I don't think it takes into count any capital expenses.
> They didn't need to rent, as they built their restaurant on vacant land already owned by the family.
> All up building expense was approx. 400K and then additional cost of furniture etc.


 Proper calculation make difference between "Not static" ("Changing" or what they call it in English) costs and "Static" costs,
Capital, building and long life equipments are counted to "Static" and such costs are SPREAD in time during expected life time for the assets. Equipment is common to count 5 years. In western countries some count 20 years in accountant praxis/law for buildings, but I suppouse shorter in Phils.

(I wrote somewhere a while ago about a farmer with pigery who earned some a bit interesting money for them when calculated as THEY did BUT then they hadnt counted the costs for the pighouse - which was close to get fallen in roof by bad built so they will need to pay for that soon but they didnt count anything for that "because its allready paid" ! )
With compleete calculation their earning was crap or even a loss...
An other farmer had missed to count the lease cost for the farm.
A shop owner hadnt counted with the HUGE interest costs she had by "5-6" financing!!! She had been a course for business owners, so I wonder what crap course...
Its common they miss to count some important costs.


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## Maxx62 (Dec 31, 2013)

anthonyluwis said:


> I would like to get some ideas & advise especially from expats in Philippines for a small business that suits for a foreigner, That can be improve by time. Any current expats Business person, who have any advise? or Ideas?


I think that one of the problems you're going to find is that most of the locals don't want to spend very much money when purchasing goods and services, and if you want to run a consistently profitable business, then you're going to have to be located in a high traffic area nearer people with money. However, if you're just looking to make a small endeavor, not much more than a hobby, then maybe computer and network repair might be a good thing to try, but don't expect to make much out of it. 

I've noticed that whenever my in-laws would have problems with their PCs, they'd call over some neighbor kid who'd charge them about 500 Php to fix their computers. Problem is, his method for fixing every computer problem was exactly the same, reformat the hard drive, and reinstall the entire operating system without trying to troubleshoot anything. Might take time, but maybe over a period of time you might be able to build a reputation.


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

Maxx62 said:


> I think that one of the problems you're going to find is that most of the locals don't want to spend very much money when purchasing goods and services, and if you want to run a consistently profitable business, then you're going to have to be located in a high traffic area nearer people with money.


 Or do as I do = Start a *production* where the things can be sold to a city, to Manila or exported if not geting ok pay localy. (I believe we will get ok pay localy but sell only a small amount localy so we will sell almost all elsewhere. Except if a trader buy all as it look it can be for our secondary product. We dont like sell work anyway so we prefer if we can sell whole production to one - few.) 
Productions can be located "anywhere" as long as there are enough raw material access, its a product which dont getg bad fast and transport costs dont become to big.

Or if you have a suiting skill or can hire people with such, nowadays many businesses work through internet, so customers can be "anywhere" even in your home country, so you can get "home country pay". (My first plan was to start two businesses one such for my own earning and an other just as aid adding jobs just aiming at break even, but when I researched alternatives suiting the later I found a few business ideas, which earn enough to solve both in one business  All good, which I have found and can be located where I want to live, are productions except one service, but the service will only be good a short while, because Filipinos are to good at copying 



Maxx62 said:


> I've noticed that whenever my in-laws would have problems with their PCs, they'd call over some neighbor kid who'd charge them about 500 Php to fix their computers. Problem is, his method for fixing every computer problem was exactly the same, reformat the hard drive, and reinstall the entire operating system without trying to troubleshoot anything. Might take time, but maybe over a period of time you might be able to build a reputation.


 A Filipino got problem by he is "to good" at computer service. When he started there were around 10 such business in that municipaly. Allready during the first year his good handled businesses had made all except 3 compertitors close. One of the remaining is owned by a local with power, so when it was time to get business permit renewed I suppouse that guy with power had made so the handler of permits came with different ridicilous demands/"reasons" so the good guy got problem to get permit extensions!*  I lost contact with the good guy, so I dont know how it ended, I guess he gave up and had to close...

Some similar problems with a Filipino who tried to start trading buying local in province and sell elsewhere as the big traders, but he got so hard resistance from the locals with power, being ONE trader there, so he gave up and moved to city where it wasnt "monopoly" as in the municipaly he came from... In such case them the trader buy from can be in situation where they dont dare or cant by having dept to the "monopoly trader" even when the new trader offer more.. Its rather common in provinces e g poor farmers have depts with condition they HAVE TO sell to the lender...
A foreigner try to get such Trader position anyway in the region where our business is located and offer 20 % more than the normal price the producers get there when selling in bulk, because he want to get much for export. Left to see if he will succeed. (Although it seem he got stucked abroad, perhaps because of covid, when he went away to get contracts with importers there, I havent heared why its delayed.)

*In the Philippines need at least 2 permits renewal EVERY YEAR even when its neither food nor something else needing to be checked of safety/environment reason!!! 
(In Sweden we get one permit valid "for ever" (as long as not making any of serious crimes which can be reason to stop it.) I have one still since I were in High School...


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## Hey_Joe (Sep 13, 2016)

Transportation business If tourist arrivals begin. Many buses and public transportation to the provinces from the airports are still not allowed to operate.


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## AlaynaBoone (7 mo ago)

The best thing is to come to the islands to look for work on your own. Or make friends who live on the islands to look for work through them. You can apply to employment agencies abroad.


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

AlaynaBoone said:


> The best thing is to come to the islands to look for work on your own. Or make friends who live on the islands to look for work through them. You can apply to employment agencies abroad.


We aren't allowed to work here and once somebody gets jealous or reports you then you'll end up incarcerated, fined, black listed and deported, this happens frequently.

You cannot work here on a tourist visa.


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

And he looked for ideas to start own business - and 5 years ago


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## amcan13 (Sep 28, 2021)

Seems like this topic is repeated every few months. So the thinking is I will just hope over to the Philippines and float around on the money I have for a bit, then I will just pick up a few tax free peso's with some easy job. 
So if this behavior is illegal in your home country why do you think the Philippines would allow it?
There should be a big sign at the airport "No you can't work here on a tourist visa, so turn around if you don't have enough money. "
If I was still inclined to work then I would get a remote job my own country and just work from home in the Philippines. The internet allows you to work from anywhere. 
If you are married to a Filipino then start a business but know that a million other people had the same idea and if you do succeed then you will get copied right away, and undercut. There are many websites with top business ideas in the Philippines. I agree with idea to come, look and see what is needed in your area. 
I have watched the small business model here and the service sector is brutal. All aspects tend to steal your profits. Labor and raw materials are not stable here. 
Investing in something that takes the least amount of effort and retains capital seems better. So either invest in the financial markets or buy land and maybe real estate. Land seemed the best since you have lots of options to generate income, you can share crop it, lease it out for a building, grow fruit and sell it whole. 
You need capital to start. You should be able to afford to be without the capital for a time while the investment starts to pay out or you lose it totally. Make money outside Philippines and avoid all legal and tax issues.


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

amcan13 said:


> Seems like this topic is repeated every few months. So the thinking is I will just hope over to the Philippines and float around on the money I have for a bit, then I will just pick up a few tax free peso's with some easy job.
> So if this behavior is illegal in your home country why do you think the Philippines would allow it?
> There should be a big sign at the airport "No you can't work here on a tourist visa, so turn around if you don't have enough money. "
> If I was still inclined to work then I would get a remote job my own country and just work from home in the Philippines. The internet allows you to work from anywhere.
> ...


The Philippines won't push rules and warnings so what happens is that you learn the hard way, several foreigners locked up for working on tourist Visas and sometimes it can take 3 year's before they review your case. Philippines: number of foreign inmates in prison facilities by nationality 2022 | Statista

I think these stats are old because almost daily the PBI has posted photos of foreigners arrested but mainly on scams and from Africa and S Korea. And working here illegally or lending money, renting apartments or running business on a tourist Visa. PBI Facebook link


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## Lunkan (Aug 28, 2020)

amcan13 said:


> If you are married to a Filipino then start a business but know that a million other people had the same idea and if you do succeed then you will get copied right away, and undercut. There are many websites with top business ideas in the Philippines.


 Well. It dont have to do much with being married to a Filipina or not - except a wife probably have the faaaaar to common typical Filipino business ideas of which business to start  If she is farmers daugter she will probably want the 4th common  =Fatening pigs. (Although thats production, which in difference from the other three have chance to earn good.) 
I suppouse no one bother who paid if its a small amount, but if the business need more start capital so its obvious for officials the foreigner paid it, then its SAME rules as for foreigners for the foreigner-Filipina COUPLE. 
(Except the wife isnt counted as foreigner concerning what work she is allowed to do. I havent found any law telling if a wife can have key position in a (not export) SEC limited company. The hints I have found contradict each other  (by 1.Foreigner isnt allowed to have majority power, 2. the couple is counted as foreigmer (in some cases not in other, not telling about this.) 3. Wife is counted as Filipina concerning work.) BUT if wife get chairman (or CEO) position, then the COUPLE get more power than allowed for foreigners...  


amcan13 said:


> I agree with idea to come, look and see what is needed in your area.


 Well. Perhaps there are exceptions, but I disagree normaly concerning local CUSTOMERS, because normaly better chance if chose something which can be sold somewhere else/export. If export there is the big advanmtage foreigner can own whole. 
But correct concerning go and look what suit to MAKE localy. Hard to make if dont have the raw material (specialy if expensive to transport) workforce - or needed electricity  
((No access to stable electricity is reason to I havent started my SECOND business, because it need that to be effective. Some thoughts though of start own electricity production for it. My allready started business is less sensitive and the power need can be solved by petrol/diesel, but that would be to expensive for the second the production price would be to expensive if using petrol/diesel generatots.))


amcan13 said:


> I have watched the small business model here and the service sector is brutal. All aspects tend to steal your profits. Labor and raw materials are not stable here.


 Yes. Thats why I say aim at something not to many will copy by
1. They dont have the *knowledge* (and it isnt to easy to copy. Thats why I skiped a much needed business, but its to easy to copy by they can see what I am doing.)
2. Or need *more capital* than Filipinos can raise - in a region/business sector the rich Filipinos dont bother about =Few rich Manila Filipinos bother about provinces  (except perhaps tourism and huge things as e g mining.)

But mainly I say go for PRODUCTION, which can be sold elsewhere. Such arent sensitive of neighbours copy - as long as it dont effect access to raw material or needed skilled workforce.
(Thats why my 2 - 3 first businesses include having enough control over the raw material production too  (But as I wrote electricity access is problem for the second if we dont start that too. ((While one of my other ideas would get raw material from contracted farmers if I ever start such because that make no need of buy big farmlands so less investment needed. And it would add money to poor farmers who have ok knowledge.))


amcan13 said:


> Investing in something that takes the least amount of effort and retains capital seems better. So either invest in the financial markets or buy land and maybe real estate. Land seemed the best since you have lots of options to generate income, you can share crop it, lease it out for a building, grow fruit and sell it whole.


 In some regions its common with "Harvest sharing". =Poor farmers have the land and workforce but need Financiere to the costs (and some need money from financiere to survive until harvest.) Common deal for rice is financiere get money back plus 25 - 33 % of the rest. 
A good harvest financiere can almost double the money in 4 months, but it can be bad years too where all is lost. It is NOT a loan, its as a "temporary partnership". 
(I know there are similar for such as tobacco and pig fatening too, but I dont know deals or results except for piglets one almost doubled the money (but with luck) and two others got bad results.)

The tricky part is finding good enough farmers with good enough soil but still in need financing.

Concerning real estate in cities I havent checked because I am not interested, but some have earned good and some seem to have bought to expensive when I believe the market was overheated. 

Concerning kind of become farmer. Well. It depend of if you have the needed skill or find someone who have. Some earn good, some earn crap.
I know of some successful LEASE land. In some region such can be extreemly cheap so no need of capital to that. 
(E g a successful veggies grower at Luzon transport the crops to Manila, and a big fruit company have long time leases at MIndanao at kimd of scam level prices, because the lease fee per year is so low so when a land owner wanted to sell he had no chance - if he dont find an idiot buyer  or sell with big loss - because not so interesting to buy land being locked 20 years geting similar to 2 % per year in lease fee...)


amcan13 said:


> You need capital to start. You should be able to afford to be without the capital for a time while the investment starts to pay out or you lose it totally.


 Yes. 
(I expect my started business will be time to "cash in" after around 5 years. (But I plan to reinvest that in buying more such excisting wrong handled and by that very cheap to buy businesses if the prices are low then still. Thats why I dont tell what it is because I dont want others to come and push up prices at these businesses  
The second I can tell as much as its a health product manufactory, probably for export after a while when being sure of stable quality.)



amcan13 said:


> avoid all legal and tax issues.


 That isnt easy  Inspite of we did whole our part, first the officials screwed up a lot in the crazy 16 steps registration process. First we got stucked at the DTI step by it was impossible to register this type of business inspite of its rather common by how the computer-internet system couldnt and the only DTI answered was "Use the online system" inspite of we had told them why it didnt function. But by me being stubborn not giving up any easy, I finaly found contact to their developer - who corrected the system very fast  That was after we had been stucked at that step long time. 
There were more mess enough to write a book about it. My very patient but a bit affraid of take fights business partner was close to give up after one of these crazy obstacles but I made him in good mood again by saying:
-This is so crazy so you will have a stoty to tell grandkids when you are retired and sit at porch and tell them how it was in start of the successful business 
(Before we started we talked about this is "for ever" aiming at our decendants will still cooperate and related businesses will be added so all decendants who want to - and have good enough attitude  - can get work in this. Now its not even of legal reasons, he has one part while I have most of an other part, but in the deal we have made so both have option to make all parts 50 - 50 in the long run between our families . But to make that possible legaly I need to get Filipino citizen kids.)
Later we got stucked at BIR without being told any reason, but when we told them:
-We cant pay tax if you dont register us...
Then it got solved fast 
We hired an acountant with good reputation localy to handle acounting and all tax forms to be sure everything would be correct - who screwed up big...  did nothing of the agreed, were suppoused to do things no later than October 2021 but had still done NOTHING in March so we got trouble with BIR  But by the acountant is friend with the local BIR, it SEEM the mess is solved now, but bad reputatiions can never recover fully. I say "It seem" because we dont know yet. 
Now we have found an other acountant. Left to see if that one will be good - if the first one ever will give us the acounting books and such back. She has never been there still when we come to get them...! 

Its allways fun in the Philippines 

BUT inspite of these troubles, I still want to start more because *the potential is so high *if chosing wize what and where to start. 

((Perhaps we will just continue exbantion plans for the allready started, thats easiest and low risk,
but it is slow to first biger earning. Thats a reason to start a second - which if it can solve electricity access and get top quality product with a rather much cheaper production method idea I have. (I have two  One can sure reach average quality but unclear if it can reach top quality withj my modification idea. The other has as far as I know never been used other than in very small scale expensive for personal use, but perhaps it can be made cheap and good quality if making a commersial size. Would need to be checked.) 
This second has even higher potential, much faster to earning, a bit over 6 months, and rather regular income if my modification functions. IF so we can even beat the lowest chinese prices !  which are around only 60 % of the lowest I have seenm in Phils, still with very good profit by my production method idea would be rather much cheaper than what the big competitors use. And that part of equipment my enginere business partner can make after my drafts, so we wouldnt need to buy the rather expensive equipment big competitors use.))


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