# Fiance or Unmarried couple - which is best option?



## Lizzyp (Apr 5, 2010)

I am a UK citizen, female aged 56. My partner is a US citizen aged 68. We have been together for 11 years but circumstances have meant that we have never been able to live together. We have lived separately in our respective countries, spoken on the phone daily and visited each other for 3 or 4 weeks about three times a year in both UK and US.

My partner who is retired (I am still working), is now able to move here but we don't necessarily have any plans to get married.

If we go for the 'unmarried couple' option - I gather we have to show we have been living together for two years. We can't show that as we have lived apart for 11 years due to our respective family circumstances.

If we go for the 'fiance' option - I gather we would have to get married within 6 months and I'm not sure we necessarily want to get married.

Any advice or guidance ??


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Lizzyp said:


> I am a UK citizen, female aged 56. My partner is a US citizen aged 68. We have been together for 11 years but circumstances have meant that we have never been able to live together. We have lived separately in our respective countries, spoken on the phone daily and visited each other for 3 or 4 weeks about three times a year in both UK and US.
> 
> My partner who is retired (I am still working), is now able to move here but we don't necessarily have any plans to get married.
> 
> ...


My immediate reation is there isn't an appropriate immigration category that your US partner can fit into that enables him to settle in UK. Under immigration rules, you are just friends, and friends can be given leave to visit each other - as you have been doing - but not to settle or live permanently in UK. The settement visa - marriage or partner - has as its basis the commitment to live together for life, which in the case of partners must have been evidenced by already living together for 2 years.
I feel that if you do intend to make this commitment, marriage is the only realistic option.
There are other visa categories that entitle him to live in UK, such as work or study, but this must be a legitimate pursuit (e.g. being sponsored for visa by a UK company or enrolling on a university course). If he has substantial capital, he may be admitted as an entrepreneur, for example. Once he is over here on another long-stay visa, you can then start living together, and after two years, switch his status to a partner of a British citizen.


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## Lizzyp (Apr 5, 2010)

*Thanks*

Thanks - if we decide to marry could we do that in the UK when he is here and then apply for a husband visa before he returns to the US or after he's gone back?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Lizzyp said:


> Thanks - if we decide to marry could we do that in the UK when he is here and then apply for a husband visa before he returns to the US or after he's gone back?


The right way to go about it is to apply for a fiancé visa while he is still in US, and get married here within 6 months of arrival. He will then have to apply for a marriage (spouse) leave to remain, valid for 2 years. At the end of the probationary period, he can apply for indefinite leave to remain. 
He should not get married while he is merely here on a visit (visa-free). It won't be possible to be married in a civil ceremony without a special visa (marriage visitor), and the presumptions are he will leave the country after the ceremony and for both of you to settle abroad. If he gets married in the Church of England (for which currently no special visa is required) and then tries to apply for settlement, it will be refused as he didn't enter UK on a fiancé visa. If he leaves UK after the ceremony, he will have to explain why he has changed his mind about settling abroad when he tries to apply for settlement visa.
You may like to take into account that if you get married in US, your US partner only needs to apply once for his settlement (spouse) visa (valid 2 years), instead of applying twice - fiancé visa in US and spouse visa in UK. As fees are so expensive - $1063 in US, £840 in UK, careful planning can save you a great deal. If you do decide to be married in US, you both have to meet all local requirements, which vary from state to state.


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## Lizzyp (Apr 5, 2010)

*Thank you again*



Joppa said:


> The right way to go about it is to apply for a fiancé visa while he is still in US, and get married here within 6 months of arrival. He will then have to apply for a marriage (spouse) leave to remain, valid for 2 years. At the end of the probationary period, he can apply for indefinite leave to remain.
> He should not get married while he is merely here on a visit (visa-free). It won't be possible to be married in a civil ceremony without a special visa (marriage visitor), and the presumptions are he will leave the country after the ceremony and for both of you to settle abroad. If he gets married in the Church of England (for which currently no special visa is required) and then tries to apply for settlement, it will be refused as he didn't enter UK on a fiancé visa. If he leaves UK after the ceremony, he will have to explain why he has changed his mind about settling abroad when he tries to apply for settlement visa.
> You may like to take into account that if you get married in US, your US partner only needs to apply once for his settlement (spouse) visa (valid 2 years), instead of applying twice - fiancé visa in US and spouse visa in UK. As fees are so expensive - $1063 in US, £840 in UK, careful planning can save you a great deal. If you do decide to be married in US, you both have to meet all local requirements, which vary from state to state.


When you speak of 'probationary period' is that the 2 years 'marriage leave to remain'?

Are you aware of any potential pitfalls for me as a UK citizen getting married while visiting the states on the 'visa waiver' scheme? If we were to do this it would most likely be in New York State.

Thanks again
Liz


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Lizzyp said:


> When you speak of 'probationary period' is that the 2 years 'marriage leave to remain'?
> 
> Are you aware of any potential pitfalls for me as a UK citizen getting married while visiting the states on the 'visa waiver' scheme? If we were to do this it would most likely be in New York State.


Yes, when you first marry, your husband cannot get indefinite leave to remain/enter straightaway, but must 'prove' that marriage is subsisting and genuine for two years. 

Provided you meet all the local US federal and state regulations re marriage, so that it will be recognised as valid by UK, there shouldn't be any pitfalls. You do need a state certificate of registration (not any paper a wedding chapel or officiant may give you), as that's the only document acceptable to British consulate for visa purpose.
There is a lot of documentation required for a settlement visa, so go to WorldBridge website (official handling agents for UK visa applications) and read the detailed requirements. You need to create a file/dossier of all required documents and evidence.


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## Lizzyp (Apr 5, 2010)

Joppa said:


> Yes, when you first marry, your husband cannot get indefinite leave to remain/enter straightaway, but must 'prove' that marriage is subsisting and genuine for two years.
> 
> Provided you meet all the local US federal and state regulations re marriage, so that it will be recognised as valid by UK, there shouldn't be any pitfalls. You do need a state certificate of registration (not any paper a wedding chapel or officiant may give you), as that's the only document acceptable to British consulate for visa purpose.
> There is a lot of documentation required for a settlement visa, so go to WorldBridge website (official handling agents for UK visa applications) and read the detailed requirements. You need to create a file/dossier of all required documents and evidence.


Thank you very much. That has been really helpful.


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## Lizzyp (Apr 5, 2010)

*Independant Means (Retirement)*



Joppa said:


> My immediate reation is there isn't an appropriate immigration category that your US partner can fit into that enables him to settle in UK. Under immigration rules, you are just friends, and friends can be given leave to visit each other - as you have been doing - but not to settle or live permanently in UK. The settement visa - marriage or partner - has as its basis the commitment to live together for life, which in the case of partners must have been evidenced by already living together for 2 years.
> I feel that if you do intend to make this commitment, marriage is the only realistic option.
> There are other visa categories that entitle him to live in UK, such as work or study, but this must be a legitimate pursuit (e.g. being sponsored for visa by a UK company or enrolling on a university course). If he has substantial capital, he may be admitted as an entrepreneur, for example. Once he is over here on another long-stay visa, you can then start living together, and after two years, switch his status to a partner of a British citizen.


If he were able to meet the requirement of £25,000 income per annum - can this be a combination of capital and income from the US?

If this was possible and he was granted the 4 year visa, would it be ok or frowned upon to apply for the unmarried couple leave to remain after 2 years?


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## Lizzyp (Apr 5, 2010)

I've done a bit more research and discovered that this category was withdrawn in 2008 !


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Lizzyp said:


> I've done a bit more research and discovered that this category was withdrawn in 2008 !


You mean retired persons of independent means? That's true, because only a handful of people have applied for it. As I've said, unless your US partner goes down fiancé/settlement route, he will have to find another visa category such as work, investor or student to get a long-stay visa and get it changed to settlement on marriage.


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## Lizzyp (Apr 5, 2010)

Joppa said:


> You mean retired persons of independent means? That's true, because only a handful of people have applied for it. As I've said, unless your US partner goes down fiancé/settlement route, he will have to find another visa category such as work, investor or student to get a long-stay visa and get it changed to settlement on marriage.


Thank you once again.


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## deeteeakl (Apr 13, 2010)

Hope you dont mind if I poke my nose into this conversation. But Joppa you seem to have some excellent knowledge on matters like this (judging by other posts). So.. I like you .. am originally from the UK and am looking to move to Spain with my partner. She is from Peru and has a 15 year old daughter. We are not married but have been together for 2 years. We are committed to each other and live together (we are currently in Peru). What do we need to do to prove that we are in a common law partnership? Is there a way to register this now and can we get people to testify for us that we have been together for two years?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

deeteeakl said:


> Hope you dont mind if I poke my nose into this conversation. But Joppa you seem to have some excellent knowledge on matters like this (judging by other posts). So.. I like you .. am originally from the UK and am looking to move to Spain with my partner. She is from Peru and has a 15 year old daughter. We are not married but have been together for 2 years. We are committed to each other and live together (we are currently in Peru). What do we need to do to prove that we are in a common law partnership? Is there a way to register this now and can we get people to testify for us that we have been together for two years?


Sorry I'm no expert on Spanish immigration law, but I think Peruvians (and others from ex-Spanish colonies) can obtain visa to live and work in Spain fairly easily, with settlement and naturalisation to follow after a couple of years. You as a British citizen (EU national) have the right to live and work in Spain, so there's no problem there. She should get in touch with the Spanish embassy in Lima to find out detailed rules for iberoamerican nationals. She must get a relevant visa before travelling to Spain.


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