# Moving to Hoedspruit, SA from USA



## toddcarson (Jun 19, 2010)

I am a US citizen hoping to move to the Hoedspruit area for my retirement. I have heard and read so many negatives about the country- but I am wondering, is if crime and other problems are mostly focused in the urban areas/cities? If I won't need to work, and will live in a more rural area, will that alleviate (not guaranteed, of course) a lot of the more common problems? I know that every persons' "standards" are different. Obvously, living or even visiting New York city can put you at risk, and one has to be careful and street-smart. But to read some threads- it often seems like things are quite miserable and getting worse! What is the reality here? I have believed that many of the things that have made S Africans want to move away have to do with finding work, schools, city traffic and crimes, but that being retired somewhere away form the cities would be fine. Is it that there are a lot of whites who just aren't happy with the changes? Or is it really a constant danger to live in SA? All honest comments appreciated!


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

toddcarson said:


> I am a US citizen hoping to move to the Hoedspruit area for my retirement. I have heard and read so many negatives about the country- but I am wondering, is if crime and other problems are mostly focused in the urban areas/cities? If I won't need to work, and will live in a more rural area, will that alleviate (not guaranteed, of course) a lot of the more common problems? I know that every persons' "standards" are different. Obvously, living or even visiting New York city can put you at risk, and one has to be careful and street-smart. But to read some threads- it often seems like things are quite miserable and getting worse! What is the reality here? I have believed that many of the things that have made S Africans want to move away have to do with finding work, schools, city traffic and crimes, but that being retired somewhere away form the cities would be fine. Is it that there are a lot of whites who just aren't happy with the changes? Or is it really a constant danger to live in SA? All honest comments appreciated!


Todd,
to answer your questions:

There is less violent crime in rural areas purely because there are less people and consequently everyone tends to know everyone else and strangers stick out.
However, a lot of the violennt crimes are "supposed" to be by illegal immigrants from Mocambique. and a popular ilegals route used to be through the Kruger Park

What makes you think that violent crime only happens to Whites?.
you can be as streetsmart as you want and that may help (as in NY and others) to save you from a mugging, but thats not the crime that has driven so many SA's of all colours out.
Its home invasions classed as aggravated robbery in the Police Stats. 
and there retired people are more at risk than younger, well armed ones.

The whites who weren't happy with the changes tended to leave before 1994 or just after.
Thats 16 years ago.
and in answer to your question, realistically, South African' s do live in a constant state of awareness, its almost subliminal.
They are used to it, have grown up with it and its second nature.
and you would need to get with the program and stay with it.

As a retired person,living near the KP on US$ would give you a pretty good lifestyle , but you also need to look at what Medical costs are should you need critical care, Govt Hospitals will kill you so you would have to go private..

It is a Beautiful Country and 90% of its people are friendly,you just need to remember that if you are seen to the weakest in the herd or someone decides you have something to offer, then you can become another Statistic.


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## toddcarson (Jun 19, 2010)

*Clarification*

Re: "What makes you think that violent crime only happens to Whites?" Just to be clear, I don't think this. I just wondered if so many of the negative comments that I read, especially those like "it's not the same SA that you left as a child" - are coming from those not happy with the change of power.

I have traveled all over the world, and not in posh hotels- I am aware of how to be on guard and not stand out. I can accept some level of risk, SA has a lot to offer for the risk. But at the same time, I don't want to move into a war zone. I have believed until recently that one could not complare SA to say, the DRC, or similar countries/situations. But in reading posts here, and elsewhere- it is really hard to get a grip on how it really is! In the US, crimes against children, unexpected slaughters in a post office or grocery store- are not unheard of. But at the same time, they don't in one's own neigborhood every week. But it is pretty common that a car is stolen, a night-time break and enter/ home invasion occurs, at least monthly if not more often. 

Perhaps we in the US are more used to it than you might think- for sure we are a paranoid group when it comes to the kids. 

Thanks for your help and reply, the more information the better!


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## JairajVi (Jun 14, 2010)

Hi Todd,

The only way you are thoroughly gonna get a more specific answer or satisfied is, by going to SA and experiencing it by yourself. Many conversations can be mis-leading and un-informative...and lots can be quite true from experiences they've had in the past...! SA is not a war zone, it's a beautiful country......they have some of the best technology in the world, a good infrastructure and very friendly people. I was born in SA and love it to bits, our move here to NZ was 70% more a strategic move and 30 % gett'n away from the crime and corruption. Although living for all our lives in SA....I can't say that we have been ever been a victim of crime. Maybe we are 10 out of a million that hasn't...but my point is...SA is livable...not some place where you cannot live and have to stay up all nite with a shotgun at hand. 

Chose wisely the area u live in, as it matters...there are some very good areas and some poor areas...but I'm sure many people with be of great help in SA is you ask around.

Cheers


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## USC (Jun 13, 2010)

toddcarson said:


> I am a US citizen hoping to move to the Hoedspruit area for my retirement. I have heard and read so many negatives about the country- but I am wondering, is if crime and other problems are mostly focused in the urban areas/cities? If I won't need to work, and will live in a more rural area, will that alleviate (not guaranteed, of course) a lot of the more common problems? I know that every persons' "standards" are different. Obvously, living or even visiting New York city can put you at risk, and one has to be careful and street-smart. But to read some threads- it often seems like things are quite miserable and getting worse! What is the reality here? I have believed that many of the things that have made S Africans want to move away have to do with finding work, schools, city traffic and crimes, but that being retired somewhere away form the cities would be fine. Is it that there are a lot of whites who just aren't happy with the changes? Or is it really a constant danger to live in SA? All honest comments appreciated!


Todd having lived in NYC most of my life and having visited SA quite a few times on holiday. Let me urge you to travel to SA as a tourist before making a final decision. The crime there is unlike anything you may have seen in the US. Just check some of the comments on this forum for further details.


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

I am also a US citizen and am also moving to Hoedspruit, already bought a house there. We will be moving there full time in a few months and can hardly wait. We did a lot of reasearch before we made the call to move and also visited the area on several occasions to make sure we were comfortable with our potential new home. Perhaps we can meet in the future to compare our experiences after living there for a while. I have no questions about why you would want to make this move but understand why others might. Good luck with the move and enjoy the people, wildlife and enviornment of the area.


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## toddcarson (Jun 19, 2010)

*Wow- Excited to hear from you!*

:clap2: Am very excited to hear from you! You are further along- I have decided to try and pay cash, since loans for international properties are hard to find. Where did you buy? We have been looking at houses within the various private reserves. Because I have dogs, and would prefer to bring them along, we have focused on Kampersrus and Ndolmvumzi. I really like the Ndolmvumzi set up, but it is quite a bit pricier than other areas. We are just at the point of planning our first visit to the area. We know we want to come to Africa, and SA seems like the most stable. How did the intl. buying process go for you? I have been speaking with Century21 there. Also, what kind of visa do you plan to obtain? I am hoping to start an NGO (I am a pediatric therapist) to provide free services in the region, and am exploring longer term entry based on that- T Carson


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## djhep (Feb 26, 2011)

Hi Todd......
No doubt there are problems in South Africa, but i think you have picked a good area for your retirement. 

I work in Nigeria on a 5 week on 5 week off rotation, and spend my time off between Southern Spain and Hoedspruit.
In fact i'm sitting outside watching a beautiful Hoedspruit sunset right this moment



Good luck with the move.....(you too Native Texan).

All the best.

Dave.

ps if you would like any more specific info on Hoedspruit area please feel free to ask.


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

Hi Dave
Small world, I first traveled to Hoedspruit while on vacation from my job teaching at the AIS in Lagos about 12 years ago. Envy you and the sunset, I can barely see the sun setting through the pollution of Chennai. Looking forward to being there in a couple of months. 
Have a good weekend,
Dave
As I said, small world.


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## Johanna (Apr 13, 2009)

Small word indeed, two Daves discussing similar experiences!

Hope all goes well with both of your plans!


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## toddcarson (Jun 19, 2010)

I am glad to hear from people- this thread has been here a while! I am very encouraged, and maybe we'll all meet up someday! I am a pediatric occupational therapist, and hope to offer free services in the area (to local schools, clinics, etc). If you make any contacts in this field (in Letaba, Phalawara, etc) please elt me know!


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## djhep (Feb 26, 2011)

Thanks for the best wishes Johanna....
Yes Todd, it would be great if we could all meet up at some point in the future.
I'll send you a pm with my mail address.

Cheers.

Dave.


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## djhep (Feb 26, 2011)

oops.....Looks like i will have to get my post count up before i can send pm's.


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## sgortnar (Sep 23, 2012)

*Experience of moving to SA*

Hi,

I have been looking for a location somewhere in South Africa to relocate from busy London. I would appreciate very much if you could let me know your experiences moving to Hoedspruit.

Thank you


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

Hello,
Moving to Hoedspruit from London would be a radical change of lifestyles. The town is very small but very well run by South African standards. The roads are in good repair and the municipality seems to be very responsive to any problems. There are only two supermarkets in town, a pick and pay and a spar. Many people drive to larger nearby (1 to 2 hours away) cities to do major shopping. We enjoy living here a great deal though we are retired and want the slower small town live in a beautiful area. It is hard to beat the scenery, and if you are the outdoor type, the huge number of available activities in and around the area. If you are a wildlife or birding enthusiast, you will be in heaven here with all the opportunities for game viewing and over 500 species of birds within a relatively small area. We wake up every day with a view of the mountains and the sound of wildlife all around us. There are a number of very good to excellent eating establishments and pubs in town as well as some fast food type places. The big change may be the fact that except for the eating places, the sidewalks roll up at around 5 to 6 pm everyday and most don't open at all on Sunday. It can be very quiet at night till you get to know some people and then you can have a little more night life if you want. There is local medical care but no chiropractor, we found that out after following the signs and asking about one recently that he had closed up shop almost a year ago. Crime is low here, low for anywhere in fact. We do live in a wildlife estate with a secure gated entrance and almost never lock our doors except when leaving for an extended lenght of time. I don't think I would do that living in town although you don't see so much


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

I don't know what happened so I will quickly finish on this post. You don't see a lot of bars on windows and high walls around homes here. We have been very happy with the life here and hope to stay for as long as possible. I hope this helps as you try and decide where to move. Have a good week. 
David


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## sgortnar (Sep 23, 2012)

*Experience of moving to SA*

Thank you for your fast and detailed reply!

I actually lived with my family in SA for a period of two years and a half, short time in Cape Town and two years in Johannesburg. It seems that crime level in Hoedspruit is very different to the one in Johannesburg. Good to know that!

Thanks again from rainy and cold London!


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## jdphoenix (Sep 22, 2012)

Hi Todd,

The best advice you got from all the replies is the one from JairajVi. Why don't your come over for a holiday first before deciding? To me the only way you know a thing will work is to get a "gut-feeling" for it. I would like to move to another country but unfortunately cannot do that now. My reasons? limited employment/business opportunities, and for all the rest of the reasons mentioned by others, but will not make like it's the greatest country to move to, whether you're white, black, brown or green. I'm also nearly at retirement age and plan to move to France sometime in the near future - not because I think I can escape crime, etc. but to get to know different lifestyles and cultures in and get to experience another country and its people.


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## lionspath (Sep 26, 2012)

*Hoedspruit*



toddcarson said:


> :clap2: Am very excited to hear from you! You are further along- I have decided to try and pay cash, since loans for international properties are hard to find. Where did you buy? We have been looking at houses within the various private reserves. Because I have dogs, and would prefer to bring them along, we have focused on Kampersrus and Ndolmvumzi. I really like the Ndolmvumzi set up, but it is quite a bit pricier than other areas. We are just at the point of planning our first visit to the area. We know we want to come to Africa, and SA seems like the most stable. How did the intl. buying process go for you? I have been speaking with Century21 there. Also, what kind of visa do you plan to obtain? I am hoping to start an NGO (I am a pediatric therapist) to provide free services in the region, and am exploring longer term entry based on that- T Carson


Have you moved yet? Just joined and saw your posts...we are 2 older women who have been to SA many times and plan on being in white River and other places for 6-12 months starting summer of 2013. Would love to keep in contact. Over the years I have put libraries in primary schools in Durban/Pietermaritzburg and would love to do some teaching, help, for small to nothing compensation. My partner is a respiratory therapist as well. We have a friend who writes childrens books and sells them to schools(cheap) at 5 rand a book and we hope to be helping her and staying with her for a few months. Reply if you are interested.
good luck .Virginia


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## Jem62 (Jul 25, 2012)

Goodness me, have you ever considered Cape Town. Most european retireds prefer CT, with its moderate climate and great lifestyle.


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## JohnPier (Oct 3, 2012)

I agree with Todd. I lived a bit in the US and now in South Africa - you should come here first on a holiday as a tourist and check it out. When I relocated to SA, I spent hours online and reading a book I bought on immigration, but it didn't come close to actually being in the country.


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## toddcarson (Jun 19, 2010)

I did buy my property back in May of this year! I am pleased to report that I am very happy- just back to the US today following my second trip to Hoedspruit this year. Love it more and more. I bought a 22 hectare property in a private reserve. Have made a great network of solid friends already (but still haven't connected with Dave from Texas!). Needed to pay cash, impossible to finance from the US or from SA. So far always feel safe, home, in town, going into the park-no worries yet! VERY rural, but I wanted that. I currently net SA as a visitor, and as My work allows me longer periods away, I will eventually apply for residency or retirement visa.


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## jdphoenix (Sep 22, 2012)

toddcarson said:


> I am a US citizen hoping to move to the Hoedspruit area for my retirement. I have heard and read so many negatives about the country- but I am wondering, is if crime and other problems are mostly focused in the urban areas/cities? If I won't need to work, and will live in a more rural area, will that alleviate (not guaranteed, of course) a lot of the more common problems? I know that every persons' "standards" are different. Obvously, living or even visiting New York city can put you at risk, and one has to be careful and street-smart. But to read some threads- it often seems like things are quite miserable and getting worse! What is the reality here? I have believed that many of the things that have made S Africans want to move away have to do with finding work, schools, city traffic and crimes, but that being retired somewhere away form the cities would be fine. Is it that there are a lot of whites who just aren't happy with the changes? Or is it really a constant danger to live in SA? All honest comments appreciated!


Hi Todd,

No, it's not only Whites who are unhappy about the situation is South Africa, but also the nation as a whole as most people (especially Blacks) feel that the government is not delivering on "promises" made years ago. And yes, most people are moving because of the reasons mentioned by you, including wanting to experience new cultures and countries (me). As for the danger issues, they are real and the police are battling to get crime statistics down. The problem is mostly with the justice system which makes the job of the police harder. For example, there is a dire need to build more prisons, but for some reason it's not happening and the amnesty system allows really hardened criminals to be let out of prison only to go back within days.
In my mind, every country has a high level of criminals, but some countries just deal with the problem better than SA. Jobs are especially hard to find, as existing companies do not have the capacity to create more jobs, and the attitude towards entrepreneurs as far as financing is concerned, is non-existent. In their efforts to stimulate and encourage entrepreneurs to set up new businesses which will be able to create much more opportunities than existing businesses, the government mostly concentrate on the youth (18 - 35), and seem to forget that the adults are the people with the expertise and the tenacity to make it work. From my experience as a volunteer at a non-profit I can tell you that most of the youth don't want to start their own businesses, but would prefer to work for someone else, as the youth of South Africa have not been trained to change their mindsets with regard to creating opportunities for themselves.
So older people will tend to look for opportunities elsewhere, where the focus is not only on youth.
As for myself, I've always wanted to make a move overseas, but have never been in a fortunate position (financially) to make it happen. However, I've discovered that there is a way, even with just enough money to get by, and I'm hoping that by the beginning of 2013, I'll be on my way!

Godspeed with your move to SA, and just focus on the positive when you're here!


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

Hi Todd,
Sorry I didn't get a chance to meet you while you were here. We are loving it here and have been hosting the kids and grandchild the past month. They will return to the USA on Thanksgiving and we will go back in mid December for a couple of weeks to share Christmas with all the family. Hoedspruit is such a nice little town, very safe compared with Houston or other large cities in the US. We are still waiting on residence visas but it has been easy to get tourist extensions and you can cross the border in a couple of hours by car and spend a day or two in Swaziland or Moz, and get a fresh 90 days on a tourist visa if you need to. E mail me when you get back to SA and we will get together. 
David


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Ok, just something to think about when retiring anywhere that is 3rd Worldish.

You are older, African Countries have a number of illnesses other than the usual Aids etc..
to some, the locals have built up some form of immunity, its all likely to be new to your Body.

I refer to Malaria and Bilharzia, as well as host of other small things that can affect your health, especially f you intend spending time in the Bush, Tick bite fever springs to mind.
The other part is what is your general health like and how likely are you to need Medical Care in say the next 10 years.
what will that cost and what is available?

at near to retirement age with no SA Medical history to speak of, Medical insurance/Medical Aid is expensive, and some of the Govt Hospitals if you cannot afford private Health Care, are deadly.
Just something to think about rationally.


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## sgortnar (Sep 23, 2012)

*Hoedspruit*

I went to see Hoedspruit last November and absolutely loved it. I visited a few wildlife estates such as Raptors View, Khaya Ndlovy and Leopard Rock to see which one would be right for me to either buy a house or build one. Unfortunately did not have time to go to Blyde Botanic Reserve which looks very nice on websites. However, am going there again ASAP to make my final decision.

Would you have any recommendations? I have received very opposing views on different estates from South Africans living there or estate agents re . Have you bought your property in a Big 4/5 country. If you did, how safe do you feel?

What about malaria?

Do you know whether there is a considerable expat community?

I thought there was a problem with access to internet. How have you resolved that?

Any suggestion re wildlife estates or pointing out any problem relevant for my decision would be appreciated.

Thank you.




toddcarson said:


> I did buy my property back in May of this year! I am pleased to report that I am very happy- just back to the US today following my second trip to Hoedspruit this year. Love it more and more. I bought a 22 hectare property in a private reserve. Have made a great network of solid friends already (but still haven't connected with Dave from Texas!). Needed to pay cash, impossible to finance from the US or from SA. So far always feel safe, home, in town, going into the park-no worries yet! VERY rural, but I wanted that. I currently net SA as a visitor, and as My work allows me longer periods away, I will eventually apply for residency or retirement visa.


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## sgortnar (Sep 23, 2012)

*Hoedspruit*

I went to see Hoedspruit last November and absolutely loved it. I visited a few wildlife estates such as Raptors View, Khaya Ndlovy and Leopard Rock to see which one would be right for me to either buy a house or build one. Unfortunately did not have time to go to Blyde Botanic Reserve which looks very nice on websites. However, am going there again ASAP to make my final decision.

Would you have any recommendations? I have received very opposing views on different estates from South Africans living there or estate agents re. different wildlife estates.

What about malaria?

Do you know whether there is a considerable expat community?

I thought there was a problem with access to internet. How have you resolved that?

Any suggestion re wildlife estates or pointing out any problem relevant for my decision would be appreciated.

Thank you.


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## jdphoenix (Sep 22, 2012)

sgortnar said:


> I went to see Hoedspruit last November and absolutely loved it. I visited a few wildlife estates such as Raptors View, Khaya Ndlovy and Leopard Rock to see which one would be right for me to either buy a house or build one. Unfortunately did not have time to go to Blyde Botanic Reserve which looks very nice on websites. However, am going there again ASAP to make my final decision.
> 
> Would you have any recommendations? I have received very opposing views on different estates from South Africans living there or estate agents re. different wildlife estates.
> 
> ...


Whether buying or building a house is still going to cost you. Buying land is expensive, and so is buying a house. Why not compare prices from different agents and get quotes from different builders first? This way you can decide for yourself what's best. 

Malaria outbreaks are usually in areas where there are no running water facilities, and where people have to get water from a communal tap or something, in rural areas mostly. Not too sure about that, as I've never had malaria before.

As for the expats there are many foreigners in the country, but you'll have to connect with them in the forums to find out where they are.

Best internet connections that I've used so far would be iBurst (desktop), CellC, 8ta, and Iburst Laptop. They are the most reasonably priced, and fast.

It's primarily up to you where you want to live. If you're looking for rural, I bet wildlife estates are good, unless you want to start farming. Close to the cities would be golf estates. These estates usually have security and will give you some peace of mind about the crime situation.

I hope you find something in my reply that might be useful, and good luck whatever your decision!


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## SadiK (Jan 10, 2013)

I've been to Hoedspruit on holiday and its a beauitful place. 
All the best.


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

I can recomend Raptors, I liked it so much I bought a house there.
Talk in the town is to avoid Moditilo and Hoedspruit Wildlife Estate as they both have some major concerns. If you visit you can decide for yourself though but be sure and ask questions. 
See what Phoenix wrote about malaria.
There are a lot of expats in Hoedspruit. I personaly know Americans, Germans, French, Norwegiens and Zimbabweans living there and I am sure there are many others.
The internet can be solved with a wireless internet stick that plugs into your computer. It is sometimes a bit slow but seems to work fine for most purposes. 
This past month we have seen both wild dog and leopard in Raptors as well as all the usual plains game. It's hard to ask for much more if you are a wildlife enthusiast.
Good luck with your search.


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## lionspath (Sep 26, 2012)

Malaria outbreaks are usually in areas where there are no running water facilities, and where people have to get water from a communal tap or something, in rural areas mostly. Not too sure about that, as I've never had malaria before.

Whoa !!! Where are you from again? Please whomever asked this question , check another source. Malaria is from a mosquito bite !!!

I think it is so important , as people on this site are asking serious questions that may definitively affect their decisions, that people not be so flip with their answers. If one is answering a question, PLEASE know your facts. Or else don't answer.
Thank you.....


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## lando10 (Dec 18, 2008)

toddcarson said:


> :clap2: Am very excited to hear from you! You are further along- I have decided to try and pay cash, since loans for international properties are hard to find. Where did you buy? We have been looking at houses within the various private reserves. Because I have dogs, and would prefer to bring them along, we have focused on Kampersrus and Ndolmvumzi. I really like the Ndolmvumzi set up, but it is quite a bit pricier than other areas. We are just at the point of planning our first visit to the area. We know we want to come to Africa, and SA seems like the most stable. How did the intl. buying process go for you? I have been speaking with Century21 there. Also, what kind of visa do you plan to obtain? I am hoping to start an NGO (I am a pediatric therapist) to provide free services in the region, and am exploring longer term entry based on that- T Carson


Hi Todd,

How did you get on with your venture and move to Hoedspruit? - Did this all go ahead and if so, how did you find the international buying process?


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## lando10 (Dec 18, 2008)

HI there!

Are there any wildlife estates apart from Hoedspruit Estate which allow domestic dogs for owners?


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## lando10 (Dec 18, 2008)

Native Texan said:


> I can recomend Raptors, I liked it so much I bought a house there.
> Talk in the town is to avoid Moditilo and Hoedspruit Wildlife Estate as they both have some major concerns. If you visit you can decide for yourself though but be sure and ask questions.
> See what Phoenix wrote about malaria.
> There are a lot of expats in Hoedspruit. I personaly know Americans, Germans, French, Norwegiens and Zimbabweans living there and I am sure there are many others.
> ...


Hi there,

Are there any wildlife estates apart from Hoedspruit Estate which allow domestic dogs for owners?


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## Panchee (Jan 7, 2015)

*Moving to Hoedspruit*

Hi All,
I know these are old posts and am hoping you will still be here

So now that it's been some years I'm hoping to get feedback from those of you that move to hoedspruit, how has it been?

Are you still happy with the decision?

My wife and I are planning to move to HOEDSPRUIt in a few months once we have found a place.

Thanks
D


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

Hi,
I have lived in Hoedspruit since 2012 and enjoy it immensely. There have been several changes in the past couple of years, a lot of new eating places, Hoedspruit wildlife estate has gotten rid of many of the problems it once faced and is now one of the best estates in the area, more retail shops have opened up in town and there are now 4 doctors and a dentist located in town. We must have more doctors per capita than any town in South Africa and most likely more than most in the USA. There is a bit more traffic and they had to put up a 4 way stop sign near the Pick n Pay center to help with traffic control. It is still a safe and friendly environment, you have more to fear from traffic than you do from criminals. There are a lot of international citizens in the area and it is not unusual to hear conversations in English, French, german, Afrikaans or one of the native dialects when in one of the grocery stores in town or at one of the restaurants. There are a lot of things to do locally and at the top of the list is the Kruger park but there are also art galleries, nature trails, several wildlife encounter type places also. We have a birding club, Rotary club and a variety of churches. There is a very international feel to the town. I would recommend the community to anyone thinking of moving to S.A. for a relaxing retirement.


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## elizadoo (Nov 12, 2014)

*Anyone still on this thread?*

Hello, all, and greetings from Sarasota, Florida. We want to move to SA, specifically, Hoedspruit. 

We are retired--hubby, 68, and me, 54. I've been to SA 3 times, did the driving all around Swazi and SA for a month last year while hubby rode shotgun. 2 years previous to that I went over with my female friend and our daughters, and again, I drove all over SA. Prior to that in 2009 hubby and I won a trip to SA, spent a few days in Kruger and then onto to Sun City--that was our intro to South Africa, and we were hooked.

We LOVE Hoesdpruit, it has a great feel to it and reminds us of the Florida Keys (where we lived for many years)--kind of an outpost feeling but still has a great influx of visitors to keep things fresh. And the people we have met in SA have been wonderful, we feel a much closer kinship to them than at our present home. 

Both of us are avid nature enthusiasts. We enjoy a simple life and are not country club, golfing, nor opera and fine dining types (though we will never turn down a good meal). We are can-do, good with our hands, innovative when it comes to fixing things. Husband was a zoology major (later earned an MS Chemistry and a JD Law) so his interests are also in the environment around him. My degree is BA Humanities with an English major and I am very much into folk arts, wildlife photography, and teaching others. Anyway, we moved from Key West to Sarasota for our young daughter (now grown), and as cultured and upscale as Sarasota is, we have a very high crime rate. For 15 years we lived in an expensive gated community (with the occasional burgularies, usually local youth). Last year we sold our big home and bought a smaller home in a moderately priced (non-gated) neighborhood of retirees, teachers, professors, small business owners, etc. But the crime here is horrific! We have had to install a triple coverage alarm system (glassbreak sensors, motion sensors, and entry door sensors) as well as post signs all over our property, lock all doors in the daytime. But we still have home invasions in daylight, even with 3 cars in the driveway and people active in their homes! 

For years we have talked about moving elsewhere. Our dissatisfaction with Sarasota--ever-increasing traffic, expansion of the highway to a 10-lane to accommodate the new mega mall, and our lack of connection with an increasingly developed, urban community--has given us the needed initiative.

Over the past 9 months I have been communicating with Real Estate agents in Hoedspruit. My first choice is Raptor's View; second would be Hoedspruit Wildlife Estate. 

Our major concern is health care: husband has Medicare, so he can always fly back to the USA, if needed. I, however, currently must pay for my own medical care, and I have Blue Cross Blue Shield for $800 a month (and I am healthy!), and that is for a $5000- annual deductible. We would consider ANY kind of plan that is comparable to my current plan to be superior, and believe that we could find joint coverage for the both of us for less than the $800 USD. Does anyone have a contact for a health scheme salesperson? 

Also, we are unsure whether to buy or rent long-term. Because I have dual citizenship in the UK (British mom) we could alternate between 6 months in Hoedspruit, then 6 months in Europe. The question of permanent residency is tough, because we don't have the $5000 USD monthly income required by SA immigration; we have assets that we draw from, as required. 

If anyone from the USA is still following this thread, can you send me a PM? Much appreciated!


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## Patriot Lady (Oct 22, 2015)

I am returning to South Africa after being out of the country for 2 years because of my husband's illness and death. We own a small townhouse in Johannesburg. His work permit expired Dec 2014 and now when I return it will be on a visitor's visa. Does anyone have experience about a retirement visa for South Africa? Thanks for any info.


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## elizadoo (Nov 12, 2014)

PatriotLady, condolences for your loss.

About a retirement visa: that I can answer, somewhat, as we have looked into it. SA does not have a retirement visa option as do so many other countries (Panama, Ecuador, Costa Rica, Nicaragua, Malaysia, etc.). In order to obtain a long-term resident visa with no employment in SA you must have proof of sufficient income, which I believe--the last time I checked a few months ago--was about $ 3600 USD per month. Also, I believe you _may_ be required to have some kind of health insurance plan, which, although pricey by SA standards, were fairly inexpensive by US standards, about $450 USD a month for a 60 year-old, and the plan was fairly comprehensive without those enormous deductibles we are used to paying. However, if you are of Medicare age in the USA you could always purcahse trip insurance on an annual basis to cover your emergency costs in SA, and return back to the USA for ongoing medical concerns or semi-annual checkups (and a chance to visit with family and friends).

I was referred by a SA realtor to a site which gives more information about retiring/moving to SA. I am not affiliated with the site nor do I endorse it; I am listing it because it is chock full of information. https://www.intergate-immigration.com/


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## elizadoo (Nov 12, 2014)

Correction: I meant to say South Africa DOES have a retirement visa option (but please note you must have a much higher income/assets than those countries listed). Also, I don't believe SA gives expat retirees on a temp 4-year visa the same benefits as other countires like Panama and Ecuador, i.e. no senior discounts of 25% on flights, movies, transportation, property taxes, go to the front of the line queue, etc.


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## Patriot Lady (Oct 22, 2015)

Thank you for your reply. I checked out the immigration sight you highlighted. I think I will just have to keep it simple with coming back and forth ion visitor's visas until I decide what I want to do. We were in RSA for 25 years on and off, mostly on. On a work permit there are a few perks like discounts to the Kruger Park etc. but mostly you just get to enjoy the sunshine and pay taxes. Thank you for your time.


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## Barbara lovesAfrica (Mar 18, 2016)

Todd, did you make the move? How has it been. I'm a fledgling. Want to retire to Hoedspruit or Cape Town. Torn between two lovers, wildlife or ocean. I will be by myself so safety is important. Hope to hear from you! Barbara


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## Barbara lovesAfrica (Mar 18, 2016)

Dave, I will ask you the same thing I asked Todd. Did you make the move? How is it? I guess I wonder are there places close that provide things like groceries, clothes, or do you have to travel far? Any insight will be appreciated. Barbara


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## Tracy Sav (Sep 20, 2016)

I would love to hear how everyone has settled into South African life. We (myself plus husband and two boys -13 and 11) visited Hoedspruit in August and fell in love with the place. We are looking at setting up a 5 year plan to move there once the boys have finished their schooling in Holland. Over the next five years we plan to buy properties to rent in Hoedspruit which will be mortgage free by the time we plan to move. We also have a business in Holland which we would run remotely/sell off shares. My main concern at the moment is the opportunities for further education. Our oldest son is a nature lover and may peruse this however our 11 year old has no idea of what type of career path he should follow. Anyone willing to share their experiences/thoughts?


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## lardino (Nov 9, 2017)

*Life in hoedspruit*



Native Texan said:


> Hi,
> I have lived in Hoedspruit since 2012 and enjoy it immensely. There have been several changes in the past couple of years, a lot of new eating places, Hoedspruit wildlife estate has gotten rid of many of the problems it once faced and is now one of the best estates in the area, more retail shops have opened up in town and there are now 4 doctors and a dentist located in town. We must have more doctors per capita than any town in South Africa and most likely more than most in the USA. There is a bit more traffic and they had to put up a 4 way stop sign near the Pick n Pay center to help with traffic control. It is still a safe and friendly environment, you have more to fear from traffic than you do from criminals. There are a lot of international citizens in the area and it is not unusual to hear conversations in English, French, german, Afrikaans or one of the native dialects when in one of the grocery stores in town or at one of the restaurants. There are a lot of things to do locally and at the top of the list is the Kruger park but there are also art galleries, nature trails, several wildlife encounter type places also. We have a birding club, Rotary club and a variety of churches. There is a very international feel to the town. I would recommend the community to anyone thinking of moving to S.A. for a relaxing retirement.


Hi , 
How are you 
Really, Hoedspruit is very nice town . 
I am french and I also visited it recently . 
I am considering buying a property here .
However , what about the possibility of floodings ? 
Often , rivers go through many of the popular wildlife estate and private reserve .
Any information on this matter ?


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## Native Texan (Apr 29, 2011)

Hi Lardino
Sorry about this late, very late,response. Flooding in Hoedspruit is a rare thing, it does happen every 10 or 12 years with any kind of severity. I have been out of the country for several months on a temporary job but will be returning in a few months time. I have a house in Raptors View and have only been flooded in once in the past 6 years. HWE does not have any flooding problems that I have heard of. One of my friends is a French lady from Reunion who has also retired there although she does some guiding work when French tourists need a native speaker for one of the tours. If flooding is your only concern, you can put that worry to sleep and not even consider it when looking for property in most of the estates.


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