# Weve just spent 6 months in Spain and have had enough!



## Billbrady

Anyone wishing to move to Spain as a family would be wise to read our story..


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## Billbrady

Billbrady said:


> Anyone wishing to move to Spain as a family would be wise to read our story..


Lets start with Dog Poo, the Spanish love the stuff, all over the pavements in whats deemed "good" areas.


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## xabiaxica

Billbrady said:


> Anyone wishing to move to Spain as a family would be wise to read our story..


welcome to the forum



would you like to tell us your story then?


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## gus-lopez

It's not coming one line at a time is it ?


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## Stravinsky

Six months just isnt long enough. You've hardly settled in.
I'm back in the UK at the moment. I could start a thread about the things that have annoyed me here to match yours if you like


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## Bevdeforges

Look, the expat life isn't for everyone. It could be instructive to some considering it to hear about someone who decided early on to go back home.

So, tell us your story....
Cheers,
Bev


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## xicoalc

Hola, hope you all had a good navidad!

Am i missing something... someone has been here for 6 months and because of dog poo are going back to the UK? 

Is dog poo a problem? not that ive noticed... well certainly not like it is walking through the average park in the UK! Me gets the feeling theres more to tell so I will wait to hear the full story!

Sorry it didnt work out for you though!


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## Alcalaina

steve_in_spain said:


> Hola, hope you all had a good navidad!
> 
> Am i missing something... someone has been here for 6 months and because of dog poo are going back to the UK?
> 
> Is dog poo a problem? not that ive noticed... well certainly not like it is walking through the average park in the UK! Me gets the feeling theres more to tell so I will wait to hear the full story!
> 
> Sorry it didnt work out for you though!


Hi Steve, felices fiestas to you too.

We think the poo may have just been the first instalment. But it´s possible that the OP´s run of misfortune includes having his internet cut off, so we may have to wait for the rest?

Seriously though, it is horrible to hear that somebody´s dream has turned into a nightmare, and we shouldn´t joke about it.


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## xicoalc

Alcalaina said:


> Hi Steve, felices fiestas to you too.
> 
> We think the poo may have just been the first instalment. But it´s possible that the OP´s run of misfortune includes having his internet cut off, so we may have to wait for the rest?
> 
> Seriously though, it is horrible to hear that somebody´s dream has turned into a nightmare, and we shouldn´t joke about it.


Feliz Fiestas a ti tambien  I hope you had a good´n...still got 31 and 6th to enjoy WOPPEEE!

Couldnt agree more... we should not laugh.. sometimes life in Spain can be "poo" for people and i eagerly await the 2nd instalment!


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## Billbrady

xabiachica said:


> welcome to the forum
> 
> 
> 
> would you like to tell us your story then?


Yes thanks, I was planning a book or magazine article but to fair weve only found out about these things that everyone else on the Costa del Sol know about, I just feel that more should speak, not to denounce the Spanish but to inform.

Were leaving because of the mould on the walls, the mould that everyone accepts even at the detriment of their health of themselves and children!

Our story starts with doing what many wanted to do, every year on holiday, Spain, Portugal, Greece etc for years we stopped and thought what if we lived here?

Im a merchant navy engineer and as such dont need work in Spain, my wife is a full time housewife with 2 girls, 4 & 12, so Schools are very important to us.

we soon discovered that many expat brits have fled the UK for various reasons, there are very few people like us that weve met, apart from retired or elderly or those who just visit for the summer, most here are living a deluded lifestyle, timeshare folks etc.

I just dont know where to start?


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## jojo

Billbrady said:


> Lets start with Dog Poo, the Spanish love the stuff, all over the pavements in whats deemed "good" areas.


But have you not noticed how quickly it dries in the heat of the sun?? Unlike the UK where it sits for weeks and stays "moist", in Spain it dries and rolls away or the ants have it withn hours of being deposited

Jo xxxx


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## Billbrady

Alcalaina said:


> Hi Steve, felices fiestas to you too.
> 
> We think the poo may have just been the first instalment. But it´s possible that the OP´s run of misfortune includes having his internet cut off, so we may have to wait for the rest?
> 
> Seriously though, it is horrible to hear that somebody´s dream has turned into a nightmare, and we shouldn´t joke about it.


Thanks all to discussing with me, hasnt been a nightmare, just get the feeling that if we stay and my wife gets sicker with the mould that I clean off daily then we will have a disaster.

To be fair weve enjoyed our 6 months, kids thrived in local spanish schhools and weve enjoyed the experience but we just feel that although we researched it well, obviously not well enough, we didntt expect some hard facts of life here that makes it not possible for a long term future here.

We certainly will visit again, La Cala de Mijas is nice in the summer but dead in winter.

We did settle and make friends both British and Spanish, it hasnt been all bad, I just wanted to promote debate about the reality of life here.

Almost everyone Ive met accepts the mould and cleans it off and keeps cleaning it off the inside of these appartments that are no more than caves, this is Golf la Noria, 700 euro a month! Not worth buying, not worth renting and not worth living in during the rainy season.


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## Billbrady

jojo said:


> But have you not noticed how quickly it dries in the heat of the sun?? Unlike the UK where it sits for weeks and stays "moist", in Spain it dries and rolls away or the ants have it withn hours of being deposited
> 
> Jo xxxx


Thats very funny, cant stop laughing, but so true. The winter in the uk hife the poo from bad dog owners then when it thaws - well you get the idea. I know, the UK also has irresponsible dog owners too, just seems the Spanish whilst living in an ostensibly nice area, the allow their dogs to crap all over the pavement, in a gate community like here in Golf Noria, La Cala, Im astounded that whilst bonzo lays a cable the spanish owner just looks indifferent.

Thats the answer, more ants! Or attach a value to poo, say 50c per kilo and all those white british expats that I see raking our bins at night can collect it and exchange it for cash at the town hall...


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## jojo

Horses for courses! There are differences between the the UK and Spain, but on the whole I much prefer the life, the climate, the adverse issues - even the dog poo in Spain to the cold, damp, cramped, stressy depressing atmosphere here in England. I've been here for christmas to be with the family and today is day 4 and I'm really struggling with it now, I'm counting the days til I return to wet and windy spain! Altho central heating is a novelty, its so dry. The carpets ae full of dust and everyones on top of each other and so miserable. The only good thing about england are the roads IMO!

Jo xxx


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## xicoalc

jojo said:


> Horses for courses! There are differences between the the UK and Spain, but on the whole I much prefer the life, the climate, the adverse issues - even the dog poo in Spain to the cold, damp, cramped, stressy depressing atmosphere here in England. I've been here for christmas to be with the family and today is day 4 and I'm really struggling with it now, I'm counting the days til I return to wet and windy spain! Altho central heating is a novelty, its so dry. The carpets ae full of dust and everyones on top of each other and so miserable. The only good thing about england are the roads IMO!
> 
> Jo xxx


Couldnt agree more Jo. Have to say though, in some respects I do prefer the roads in Spain.... its very rare to spend hours stuck in traffic (especially on the autopistas). Hurry back!


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## Billbrady

Stravinsky said:


> Six months just isnt long enough. You've hardly settled in.
> I'm back in the UK at the moment. I could start a thread about the things that have annoyed me here to match yours if you like


Ok lets start with crap schools that turn out village idiots. And as for Intl schools that charge a fortune and supply teachers that wouldnt get a disclosure in the UK. To be fair and ironic, the only school that works is private spanish schools, their kids go on to good uni's etc. Most brit kids have to do a college agreement to get into a uni back in the UK - so they can do Hospitality Management. St Anthony's boats that one kid went on to do law in the UK, outstanding!

Youre right though, the UK has annoying things but Im trying not to make this about annoying innocous things but I wish I knew how bad the local schools were and I wished I knew about the Class A Hazardous mould.

We could have stayed if we didnt have mould or when kids have left school but the forums that we read and researched for 12months before we came didnt mention anything.

When we mention it here everyone draws circles with their feet and looks away - like they dont want to admit it, like a bad holiday, we go home and tell our work mates "oh it was wonderful"...


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## jojo

Billbrady said:


> Thats very funny, cant stop laughing, but so true. The winter in the uk hife the poo from bad dog owners then when it thaws - well you get the idea. I know, the UK also has irresponsible dog owners too, just seems the Spanish whilst living in an ostensibly nice area, the allow their dogs to crap all over the pavement, in a gate community like here in Golf Noria, La Cala, Im astounded that whilst bonzo lays a cable the spanish owner just looks indifferent.
> 
> Thats the answer, more ants! Or attach a value to poo, say 50c per kilo and all those white british expats that I see raking our bins at night can collect it and exchange it for cash at the town hall...


The truble with dog poo in Spain is that there are alot of dogs that roam free. In Spain, my dogs always "enjoy" performing their toileting around our pool, so I'm a bit of an expert on the demise of it! I tend to clean it up every couple of days in the winter and its much easier to pick up when its been sunbaked lolol!!!!

Jo xxx


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## MaidenScotland

**** happens


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## MaidenScotland

Last year my daughter had mould in her daughters bedroom I looked and told her to put air vents in... this year no mould so far.


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## jojo

Billbrady said:


> Ok lets start with crap schools that turn out village idiots. And as for Intl schools that charge a fortune and supply teachers that wouldnt get a disclosure in the UK. To be fair and ironic, the only school that works is private spanish schools, their kids go on to good uni's etc. Most brit kids have to do a college agreement to get into a uni back in the UK - so they can do Hospitality Management. St Anthony's boats that one kid went on to do law in the UK, outstanding!
> 
> Youre right though, the UK has annoying things but Im trying not to make this about annoying innocous things but I wish I knew how bad the local schools were and I wished I knew about the Class A Hazardous mould.
> 
> We could have stayed if we didnt have mould or when kids have left school but the forums that we read and researched for 12months before we came didnt mention anything.
> 
> When we mention it here everyone draws circles with their feet and looks away - like they dont want to admit it, like a bad holiday, we go home and tell our work mates "oh it was wonderful"...


St Anthonys isnt the only school in your area. Sunnyview is excellent, so it "the british college" (my kids go there), both are certified by NABSS who oversee he schools curriculum and teaching staff! These schools are essentially private and infinitely cheaper than private schools in the UK. I guess we all see things differently, but the one thing that I will say is that the grass always looks greener on the other side and make sure you dont run back to the UK only to find that, hey, maybe Spain wasnt so bad afterall!!

Jo xxx


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## xicoalc

Billbrady said:


> Ok lets start with crap schools that turn out village idiots. And as for Intl schools that charge a fortune and supply teachers that wouldnt get a disclosure in the UK. To be fair and ironic, the only school that works is private spanish schools, their kids go on to good uni's etc. Most brit kids have to do a college agreement to get into a uni back in the UK - so they can do Hospitality Management. St Anthony's boats that one kid went on to do law in the UK, outstanding!
> 
> Youre right though, the UK has annoying things but Im trying not to make this about annoying innocous things but I wish I knew how bad the local schools were and I wished I knew about the Class A Hazardous mould.
> 
> We could have stayed if we didnt have mould or when kids have left school but the forums that we read and researched for 12months before we came didnt mention anything.
> 
> When we mention it here everyone draws circles with their feet and looks away - like they dont want to admit it, like a bad holiday, we go home and tell our work mates "oh it was wonderful"...


Seems a little harsh... I know many spaniards who are in good employment following on from a spanish state education. Although my knowledge is limited, the kids seem to grow up well educated and certainly (on the whole) better kids than uk kids where schools are full of trouble, drugs, and bullying. I think kids seem happier here at school. You may not be keen on your loca school but its a bit harsh to say that spanish schools churn out village idiots.

The international schools are of course going to get mixed reviews but again, a close friend of mine is a teacher in an international school and before he came to Spain was head of languages in a uk state school... very professional, good at his job and gets great results... again... I dont think that the comment about international school teachers not being able to pass a UK disclosure is a very fair one (generally).

Like anywhere in the world, i woudl advise anyone coming to spain to carefully research thins like schools, healthcare, etc before deciding where to settle, thus ensuring that they get the services that are right for them. BUT in general I think that the education system in spain at the very least equals that of the UK.


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## Billbrady

steve_in_spain said:


> Couldnt agree more Jo. Have to say though, in some respects I do prefer the roads in Spain.... its very rare to spend hours stuck in traffic (especially on the autopistas). Hurry back!


I suppose thats the difference my my life in the UK and here, weve still got a house in the UK that certainly isnt cramped, and i dont have a stressy life or job in the UK or Spain, im a chief engineer in the merchant navy, i just takes things as they come, except mould/ damp and chest infections, mouldy matressess, walls and damp clothes. when kids are involved it changes a few things..


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## casa99

Billbrady said:


> I suppose thats the difference my my life in the UK and here, weve still got a house in the UK that certainly isnt cramped, and i dont have a stressy life or job in the UK or Spain, im a chief engineer in the merchant navy, i just takes things as they come, except mould/ damp and chest infections, mouldy matressess, walls and damp clothes. when kids are involved it changes a few things..


I would have thought with a job like yours you would have tried to get a de-humidifier, houses in spain do not have insulation or damp courses and in the damp winter months most people use calor gas for heating as well as log fires and you get a lot of water from calor gas, so either you use a de-humidifier or ventilate the roomslane:lane:


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## nigele2

steve_in_spain said:


> Like anywhere in the world, i woudl advise anyone coming to spain to carefully research thins like schools, healthcare, etc before deciding where to settle,


Good advise Steve but what amounts to the necessary level of research? 

I'm surprised Bill hadn't known about dog pooh, the mold, and even the poor local education. A three week holiday in winter would have answered all three.

Bill did you believe you had researched sufficiently and has your current conclusion come as a surprise, or did you go to Spain seeing it as an experiment that might go wrong? 

Well I hope your experience will help others but I also hope that you will not judge Spain too hard based on your experiences in an area not typical of Spain.


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## xicoalc

casa99 said:


> I would have thought with a job like yours you would have tried to get a de-humidifier, houses in spain do not have insulation or damp courses and in the damp winter months most people use calor gas for heating as well as log fires and you get a lot of water from calor gas, so either you use a de-humidifier or ventilate the roomslane:lane:


we use the air con to heat, this dehumidifies at the same time, no mouldy bits here!


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## xicoalc

nigele2 said:


> Good advise Steve but what amounts to the necessary level of research?
> 
> I'm surprised Bill hadn't known about dog pooh, the mold, and even the poor local education. A three week holiday in winter would have answered all three.


exactly, come out, talk to people. I dont get the comments about education. My OH is Spanish and hasmany kids of all ages in the family. They seem to be being educated better than I was in the UK!


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## xabiaxica

Billbrady said:


> Thanks all to discussing with me, hasnt been a nightmare, just get the feeling that if we stay and my wife gets sicker with the mould that I clean off daily then we will have a disaster.
> 
> To be fair weve enjoyed our 6 months, kids thrived in local spanish schhools and weve enjoyed the experience but we just feel that although we researched it well, obviously not well enough, we didntt expect some hard facts of life here that makes it not possible for a long term future here.
> 
> We certainly will visit again, La Cala de Mijas is nice in the summer but dead in winter.
> 
> We did settle and make friends both British and Spanish, it hasnt been all bad, I just wanted to promote debate about the reality of life here.
> 
> Almost everyone Ive met accepts the mould and cleans it off and keeps cleaning it off the inside of these appartments that are no more than caves, this is Golf la Noria, 700 euro a month! Not worth buying, not worth renting and not worth living in during the rainy season.


our second winter here we were all sick because of the mouldy walls - so we just moved!!!

it wasn't enough to make us leave the country


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## jojo

Billbrady said:


> I suppose thats the difference my my life in the UK and here, weve still got a house in the UK that certainly isnt cramped, and i dont have a stressy life or job in the UK or Spain, im a chief engineer in the merchant navy, i just takes things as they come, except mould/ damp and chest infections, mouldy matressess, walls and damp clothes. when kids are involved it changes a few things..


We're all different. I still have a house in the UK and its a big 5 bedroom detached place and no, we-re not cramped physically at all. But the UK is cramped, there is no space. As for the damp in Spain, well its very damp in the UK. The air has some pretty nasty damp spores floating around, its just the houses here have damp courses. Our spanish house isnt damp, altho we had a couple of patches in our last place, but not enough to get bent out of shape over - Damp is no big deal, just heat the room and wash the black off the walls!! Actually since we've been in England my daughter has been unwell with a cold and a nasty cough which I lame on her not bringing or wearing a coat. Anyway, if you're not happy then you have to do something to change things and if that means moving back then thats what you need to do!

Jo xxx


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## Alcalaina

casa99 said:


> I would have thought with a job like yours you would have tried to get a de-humidifier, houses in spain do not have insulation or damp courses and in the damp winter months most people use calor gas for heating as well as log fires and you get a lot of water from calor gas, so either you use a de-humidifier or ventilate the roomslane:lane:


Absolutely - open the windows as soon as you get up and let the air through. Mould needs a relative humidity of over 70% to grow, and a couple of dehumidifiers will help a lot.

A lot of people when they first arrive in Spain try to heat their houses to the same level as they would have done in a centrally-heated house in the UK, and block off all the draughts. This actually encourages mould, especially if you have gas-heaters. You just have to get used to a colder house and wear lots of clothes - at least winter doesn't last so long here! 

Sometimes of course mould occurs even in well-ventilated houses. The usual treatment is to wipe it with 50/50 bleach and water, leave it for 20 minutes then wipe again with clean water. There are various cleaning fluids which also deter it growing back, like Astonish or Malvas, which you can get in any local store.

It is actually the airborne spores of black mould that cause health problems, so never try and scrape it off while dry.


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## nigele2

jojo said:


> I still have a house in the UK and its a big 5 bedroom detached place


Can't speak for Bill but is this often the problem? In the UK to run a large 5 bedroom house can cost say £x per month.

Is there an issue that people still think life in spain is cheap and the sun shines all the time and that they shouldn't need to spend anywhere near as much? 

If I used 80% of my UK 'home running' budget on my abode in Spain I certainly would have a quality living environment: mold free, well heated/cooled, luxury


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## Alcalaina

Other ways to reduce condensation (and therefore humidity):

Cook with the oven or microwave rather than boiling pans on the hob
Don't hang damp clothes to dry indoors
Have fewer showers (you can always use wet-wipes!)
Stop breathing (i.e. go out more ...)

Bowls of rock-salt apparently draw moisture out of the air, but I haven't tried this.


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## xicoalc

Alcalaina said:


> Other ways to reduce condensation (and therefore humidity):
> 
> Cook with the oven or microwave rather than boiling pans on the hob
> Don't hang damp clothes to dry indoors
> Have fewer showers (you can always use wet-wipes!)
> Stop breathing (i.e. go out more ...)
> 
> Bowls of rock-salt apparently draw moisture out of the air, but I haven't tried this.


jaja all very true

BUT if you shower less, its harder to go out more because people will not like the smell!

My bathroom here is not fitted with an extractor... you know.. i only just thought about that after reaing all this today... still, open thhe window after a shower and no problems!

Spain has MUCH lower chect problems than the UK, my ex has a SEVERE chest complaint (colapsed trachea) which caused a string of significant chest infections including intubation on ICU in the UK. Since being in Spain, not a problem, and the slightest sign o a rattle on his chest always gets fixed with a course of antibiotics.

OP...Don´t leave the UK, change to a good school (or give yours a longer chance) , move house to one with less damp (or take any of the above course of action to prevent it), and watch where you walk when you go out... maybe if you put that all into place you could give it another 6 months and see if your opinion on Spain changes!


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## Alcalaina

steve_in_spain said:


> jaja all very true
> 
> BUT if you shower less, its harder to go out more because people will not like the smell!


 I said "take fewer showers", not "stop washing altogether"!


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## xicoalc

Alcalaina said:


> I said "take fewer showers", not "stop washing altogether"!


Ah,, sorry... that´s where i was going wrong!!!


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## Stravinsky

Billbrady said:


> When we mention it here everyone draws circles with their feet and looks away - like they dont want to admit it, like a bad holiday, we go home and tell our work mates "oh it was wonderful"...


Not really. People deal with it. Have you for instance tried spraying anti fungal mould killer on the wall? That gets rid of it in most cases. The first mtr of our outside wall is covered in a waterproof coating. that gets rid of any small amounts of damp we had in the first place

Spain isnt the UK. there are different challenges and problems


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## dunmovin

dog crap is problem? Irresponsible dog owners? .... like... that doesn't happen in the uk??? Not all dog owners let there pooches crap everywhere and don't clean it up. Yes, feral and stray dogs don't have an owner to clean up after them, but it's not as though we are all wading through 6 inches of dog crap to get to the shops. 

Mould? Minor problem, easily fixed with a spray, some work and remidial measures.

Education. I'm not a parent, but after a decade and half as an expat, have learned from friends, you get what you pay for. Shove the children into a state school, where the teaching language is Spanish... what do you expect? Day one,they'll adapt? Go to a private international school, where the kids are from different nations and not all have English as their 1st language. You might want want to take into account what a teacher friend of mine said, when we lived in Hong Kong....."in the confines of the school, we can teach them basics. Very few parents understand it is their duty to expand on that" 

Cramped living space.... Hey pal, you didn't have to choose that place, that was your choice.


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## Pesky Wesky

I've been away for a few days, came back and found this thread which is, well, beyond belief really!
Reasons sited for going back to the UK -* in order!!!*


Dog poo
Quote 


> Were leaving because of the mould on the walls, the mould that everyone accepts even at the detriment of their health of themselves and children!



Standard of education
And I quote again


> there are very few people like us that weve met


 Frankly I'm not surprised
I really don't think you're made for life in another country,but if you do decide to go abroad again you might want to check out the thickness of the mould on the walls, the thickness of the dog excrement on the pavements and the thickness of the village idiots before you come...


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## xicoalc

Pesky Wesky said:


> I really don't think you're made for life in another country,but if you do decide to go abroad again you might want to check out the thickness of the mould on the walls, the thickness of the dog excrement on the pavements and the thickness of the village idiots before you come...


:clap2:

I also am in shock a little over this post. Dog poo is everywhere... MORE in the UK. Schools are as good as the UK if not better (the kids certainly grow up to be more well rounded people with respect for others, in general), and as for mould... that can be dealt with.

If you come to another country there will be pros and cons. There are many things I miss about the UK, many things I think "ooh if only we had that" but on the flip side there are so many benefits to being in spain. I really dont understand how anyone can say that their health is worse (chest wise) in Spain than in the UK. Chest conditions are so much rarer here - thats a fact according to the world health people.

Sadly many people come to Spain and are disolusioned with it, but those are usually the ones who either dont research it, come out on a whim, or perhaps the ones that struggle, or frankly dont bother to embrace Spanish life, customs, and culture. Every day people return to the UK, but those who, like me and many others on this forum, work, integrate, and try to really ebrace the country usually love it.

I with the OP well, and hope that he finds happiness on his return to the UK.


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## Pesky Wesky

One of the many things that I don't understand is the mould-on-the-walls bit. Why don't they , treat the walls, get the landlord to do smth or move, and I mean to another flat/ house - not back to the UK!!
Anyway I can't believe I even posted smth on this thread it's so silly, so time for me to:tape2::tape2::tape2:

Yeah, and everyone's saying
:flypig:!!


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## mrypg9

xabiachica said:


> our second winter here we were all sick because of the mouldy walls - so we just moved!!!
> 
> it wasn't enough to make us leave the country



Quite. It depends on the kind of house you live in. The area the OP lived in doesn't sound very salubrious.....British immigrants -sorry, expats - rummaging in bins
As for Spanish schools turning out 'village idiots'....really, Bill, you should look at the levels of (il) literacy of some British posters on this site....
We have lived here for two very happy years and plan on a few more before we move on. Next stop will be provincial France somewhere. There were things about the Czech Republic that didn't suit us ..so we moved on. But on the whole, our three years there was an interesting experience, certainly one we wouldn't have missed. 
It is rather sweeping to characterise all happy immigrants here as 'deluded', isn't it?
Like most posters on this forum, we are reasonably educated, experienced people, me a professional, my partner a businesswoman. We are not taken in by surface appearances and are capable of making informed judgments.
Incidentally, the worst examples of mould I have ever encountered were in a council block of flats in the UK. I was an elected member of the local authority and eventually managed to get the horrible edifice demolished.
Mould is not unique and indigenous to Spain.


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## mrypg9

Pesky Wesky said:


> One of the many things that I don't understand is the mould-on-the-walls bit. Why don't they , treat the walls, get the landlord to do smth or move, and I mean to another flat/ house - not back to the UK!!
> Anyway I can't believe I even posted smth on this thread it's so silly, so time for me to:tape2::tape2::tape2:
> 
> Yeah, and everyone's saying
> :flypig:!!


I wanted to post that...but the last time I was so forthright I received a load of vulgar abuse.
As you know...


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## mrypg9

steve_in_spain said:


> :clap2:
> 
> 
> Sadly many people come to Spain and are disolusioned with it, but those are usually the ones who either dont research it, come out on a whim, or perhaps the ones that struggle, or frankly dont bother to embrace Spanish life, customs, and culture. Every day people return to the UK, but those who, like me and many others on this forum, work, integrate, and try to really ebrace the country usually love it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hola Steve, que tal?  Hope you had a good Christmas.
> And you can add to your excellent list: those who see life in any country as a whole, a melange of the good, the bad and the interesting.....
Click to expand...


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## James3214

Sorry to hear it hasn't worked out for you Bill, and maybe your story can serve as a warning for others but I fear it is not an uncommon one. Do you really think you have tried enough though? Six months doesn't sound like long although probably enough time for the novelty to wear off at the same time as the weather deteriorates and the health problems due to the mould start to appear. If your kids have settled in well, wouldn't it be better just to move to a different area and give it another go? As soon as you mentioned 'gated community' I feared the worse and no way would I go and live in one. Especially, not in Spain. S. Africa maybe. Check out your options in other areas before you finally give up. Surely, that dog poo can't be everywhere.


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## xabiaxica

James3214 said:


> Sorry to hear it hasn't worked out for you Bill, and maybe your story can serve as a warning for others but I fear it is not an uncommon one. Do you really think you have tried enough though? Six months doesn't sound like long although probably enough time for the novelty to wear off at the same time as the weather deteriorates and the health problems due to the mould start to appear. If your kids have settled in well, wouldn't it be better just to move to a different area and give it another go? As soon as you mentioned 'gated community' I feared the worse and no way would I go and live in one. Especially, not in Spain. S. Africa maybe. Check out your options in other areas before you finally give up. Surely, that dog poo can't be everywhere.


ahem - I live in a 'gated community'

it's not at all what it sounds like - just an urbanisation of apartments and houses around a pool & gardens - the gates are really so that the private pools & gardens are kept private - not so much for security/safety of the residents


you're right about dog poo though - there really isn't poo everywhere - although in some areas it is worse than in others

in my town 7 years ago it was dreadful in some areas - the paved area in the port was power hosed weekly just to get rid of it. Then the new mayor passed a bye-law enabling on the spot fines & had poo bins put around town & now you rarely see any poo & any owner seen not picking up after their dog is likely to be reported

feral dogs are also caught by the dog catcher


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## Muddy

I'm not in Spain ((yet)) but every time I've been and not always in summer my chest has been great! Yeah that sounds a little funny, but I've suffered from asthma all my life and if I get a chest cold or flu you would have thought I was close to death at times in the past.
Where am I going with this!
Well I just wanted to underline whenever I've been in Spain I've not had a problem with breathing, of course that probably all depends on location and maybe elevation, when you're there etc etc..
I haven't had a problem in winter when I was there and that was for a few weeks.
In the UK from as soon as it starts getting wet and damp outside then I suffer a bit sometimes more, then again in summer with the pollen, but I feel much healthier when in Spain overall!

So I think this guy needs to move out of that overpriced mould hole and find somewhere else before moving back to the UK.

I had mould in my bathroom, probably cos I like to take very hot showers and stay in there forever lol But I got some mould killer from the supermarket and it hasn't come back!!
Plus you can get anti-mould paint. I painted my garage doors with it but didn't finish painting some new sections of wood I replaced. I can see some very small mould spots on the wood but nothing at all on the painted sections, not even the old paint actually.

I'm not in the trade but a lot of info can be found googling "damp course injection Spain" etc. Must be someone on here who knows about it and if it really works!
It might be something worth looking into if anyone has damp problems!


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## xicoalc

mrypg9 said:


> Hola Steve, que tal?  Hope you had a good Christmas.
> And you can add to your excellent list: those who see life in any country as a whole, a melange of the good, the bad and the interesting.....


¡Hola Mary!

Bien, gracias! ¿Y tu? 

Christmas was nice, thanks.. I hope yours too!

Couldnt agree more with your comments! 

Prospero año nuevo !!


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## Cat Mad

Hi billbrady,
We also lived in southern Spain and only lasted about 5 months before heading back to the UK with our tails between our legs, but we are now moving back to Spain, just inland from Murcia. 
Have you thought of moving areas rather than going back to the UK?
Some areas are a lot damper than others, hence the indoor mould. Our last house also had the same problem and even with a big de-humidifier going constantly our beds were wet when we got into them at night! It was Awful!!! BUT, we have spent a lot of time with friends who dont have this problem at all!!! Maybe you can look at some houses that are higher up? There are hundreds of properties on the rental market, I am sure you could find somewhere suitable?!
Thats my 2 pence worth anyway.....I hope you find a solution.
Best regards,
Cat Mad


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## thrax

Bill hasn't said anything for a while and I think that maybe because he hasn't recieved the sympathy vote he thought he might. We have been here for 4 months. My wife is homesick although it is getting better. We have had water rising up through the floor. We have mould in three rooms and half of the villa is currently uninhabitable. There is dog poo all over the place, but I am old enough to recall Britain when that was the norm. My wife has severe asthma but not here in Spain. It is cold at night but nothing like the weather in England right now. But we are happy and don't want to go back to everything in the UK we hated. If it doesn't work out in this villa we'll move somewhere else; that's the joy of renting. I have to say that I think Bill's problem might be down to his career. I've known many guys (and women) who have worked in either the RN or the MN and none of them have been able to settle down in one location. Doesn't mean that that is Bill's issue but I haven't read anything in his posts that would make me want to leave...


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## Pesky Wesky

thrax said:


> Bill hasn't said anything for a while and I think that maybe because he hasn't recieved the sympathy vote he thought he might. We have been here for 4 months. My wife is homesick although it is getting better. We have had water rising up through the floor. We have mould in three rooms and half of the villa is currently uninhabitable. There is dog poo all over the place, but I am old enough to recall Britain when that was the norm. My wife has severe asthma but not here in Spain. It is cold at night but nothing like the weather in England right now. But we are happy and don't want to go back to everything in the UK we hated. If it doesn't work out in this villa we'll move somewhere else; that's the joy of renting. I have to say that I think Bill's problem might be down to his career. I've known many guys (and women) who have worked in either the RN or the MN and none of them have been able to settle down in one location. Doesn't mean that that is Bill's issue but I haven't read anything in his posts that would make me want to leave...


Last time Bill checked in was 9 smth this morning but he didn't post.
I am not at all unsympathetic to people who come to Spain and encounter problems, in fact, I've just remembered when I first came I was in a house for a couple of months and then changed 'cos it was cold and damp. I don't remember ever thinking about going back to the UK. Different circumstances of course. I was working and was single with no responsibilities.
Anyway, I don't think Bill has told his story, but I don't know why as he's had plenty of time and he himself got everybody's attention by saying


> Anyone wishing to move to Spain as a family would be wise to read our story..


And I can't believe that dog poo and mould has driven them back to the UK.

Sorry to hear you're having problems thrax. Sounds like you should get out and about in the New Year and look for somewhere else, especially as you have a little one, don't you?


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## jojo

It seems to me that the winter in Spain does tend to give everyone a "wake up call"! Last winter nearly did it for me, in fact my problems then seemed to drag on until the summer. I didnt want to leave Spain, but it felt as tho "the gods" were conspiring against me. The problem is that an awful lot of people (myself included) come to Spain for the climate, summery way of life, sun, sea sand etc... and dont factor in the cold, torrential rain and damp of the winters. 

As for the original poster, well maybe he was just feeling down, fed up and having one of those days when it all seemed too much! So lets not be too harsh

Jo xxx


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## xicoalc

jojo said:


> It seems to me that the winter in Spain does tend to give everyone a "wake up call"! Last winter nearly did it for me, in fact my problems then seemed to drag on until the summer. I didnt want to leave Spain, but it felt as tho "the gods" were conspiring against me. The problem is that an awful lot of people (myself included) come to Spain for the climate, summery way of life, sun, sea sand etc... and dont factor in the cold, torrential rain and damp of the winters.
> 
> As for the original poster, well maybe he was just feeling down, fed up and having one of those days when it all seemed too much! So lets not be too harsh
> 
> Jo xxx


Oh i love the winters now.. in fact the other week i was on the roof terrace in the torrential (spello) rain in my mack ... you dont get rain like that in the UK!

Last year it dragged a lot, but this year feels milder... or is it me? Dont get me wrong it is brass monkeys but today I met the OH in Alicante and just had jaeans and a t shirt on... i was fine (after the hospital thawed me out) jaja.. seriously though...

I think us brits are a tough race, me in my t shirt and Gus has 2 t shirts, a jumper, thick jacket and a scarf and his hands were still cold.. (bloody pansy jaja). Compared to what the Uk have had recently this is bliss.. BUT after a few hot months, the winter can come fast and feels very bad.. if the OP is here for his first winter then use it as a learnin curve, and next year you will be prepared.... stock up on calor heators, little electric ones, a thick duvet, few dehumidifiers, private tutors for the kids, and an industrial stock of pooper scoopers... then sit back, enoy the wonderful people, amazing food (Jamon), and lovely life that is Spain!


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## Stravinsky

As far as the weather is concerned, yes we do tend to moan when its winter in Spain as its often not particularly nice.

However .... wake up call .... dont forget the weather you left. Since I have been here in the UK it has been very cold with lots of snow, and even now the snow is going there is a thick damp fog outside ... very depressing weather.

It reminds me that this is the kind of weather I regularly expected in the UK from December onwards for many many months.


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## xabiaxica

Stravinsky said:


> As far as the weather is concerned, yes we do tend to moan when its winter in Spain as its often not particularly nice.
> 
> However .... wake up call .... dont forget the weather you left. Since I have been here in the UK it has been very cold with lots of snow, and even now the snow is going there is a thick damp fog outside ... very depressing weather.
> 
> It reminds me that this is the kind of weather I regularly expected in the UK from December onwards for many many months.


exactly!!

it's pretty chilly here today - it crept up to 11 degrees - but it's sunny if damp & misty & Móntgo has his hat on!

the lady who does my cleaning is complaining 'que calor!' cos I have the tumble drier going to dry the bed linen

the drier heats the entire apartment!!!


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## Stravinsky

xabiachica said:


> exactly!!
> 
> it's pretty chilly here today - it crept up to 11 degrees - but it's sunny if damp & misty & Móntgo has his hat on!
> 
> the lady who does my cleaning is complaining 'que calor!' cos I have the tumble drier going to dry the bed linen
> 
> the drier heats the entire apartment!!!



I dream of 11 degrees. Unfortunately here it has been minus 11


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## Cat Mad

steve_in_spain said:


> Oh i love the winters now.. in fact the other week i was on the roof terrace in the torrential (spello) rain in my mack ... you dont get rain like that in the UK!
> 
> Last year it dragged a lot, but this year feels milder... or is it me? Dont get me wrong it is brass monkeys but today I met the OH in Alicante and just had jaeans and a t shirt on... i was fine (after the hospital thawed me out) jaja.. seriously though...
> 
> I think us brits are a tough race, me in my t shirt and Gus has 2 t shirts, a jumper, thick jacket and a scarf and his hands were still cold.. (bloody pansy jaja). Compared to what the Uk have had recently this is bliss.. BUT after a few hot months, the winter can come fast and feels very bad.. if the OP is here for his first winter then use it as a learnin curve, and next year you will be prepared.... stock up on calor heators, little electric ones, a thick duvet, few dehumidifiers, private tutors for the kids, and an industrial stock of pooper scoopers... then sit back, enoy the wonderful people, amazing food (Jamon), and lovely life that is Spain!


HERE HERE :clap2:


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## xabiaxica

Stravinsky said:


> I dream of 11 degrees. Unfortunately here it has been minus 11


I just couldn't do it!!

I guess the difference is in the carpets, so it is cosy indoors

my dad has complained of being chilly here - but then he keeps his heating in the UK set to 22/23 degrees and has thick carpets in all the rooms!!!


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## xicoalc

xabiachica said:


> I just couldn't do it!!
> 
> I guess the difference is in the carpets, so it is cosy indoors
> 
> my dad has complained of being chilly here - but then he keeps his heating in the UK set to 22/23 degrees and has thick carpets in all the rooms!!!


oh i do miss carpets.. but then again arent tiled floors so much cleaner and healthier!! I might strap bits of carpet to my slippers and have that home from home every day!


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## Stravinsky

steve_in_spain said:


> oh i do miss carpets.. but then again arent tiled floors so much cleaner and healthier!! I might strap bits of carpet to my slippers and have that home from home every day!


You have no idea how disgustingly filthy carpets are, even when they dont look it.


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## Metalmicky

It’s a shame that Spain and Portugal have not moved on with their building methods, they still produce concrete caves and masonry meat lockers without a thought of implementing any modern methods of construction. There are no damp courses, cavities or recognised insulation techniques. Sustainable construction is unheard of therefore damp, condensation and cold will always be evident in the winter, as in many cases, unbearable heat is a problem in the summer. Buyers that are used to hi-spec homes abroad should be aware that here in Spain, they are not the norm although many systems that meet UK and other EU standards are available here and in most cases much cheaper and far more efficient than Spanish buildings. The new Eurocodes became law in the EU after 20 odd years in the making, but will Spain comply...............

Please do not think that I am being critical of the Spanish people, I am not - it is the system, lack of interest and resistance from the powers that be that makes concrete and steel the preferred choice of materials in a day and age when they should no longer be even considered for building.


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## gus-lopez

Metalmicky said:


> It’s a shame that Spain and Portugal have not moved on with their building methods, they still produce concrete caves and masonry meat lockers without a thought of implementing any modern methods of construction. There are no damp courses, cavities or recognised insulation techniques. Sustainable construction is unheard of therefore damp, condensation and cold will always be evident in the winter, as in many cases, unbearable heat is a problem in the summer. Buyers that are used to hi-spec homes abroad should be aware that here in Spain, they are not the norm although many systems that meet UK and other EU standards are available here and in most cases much cheaper and far more efficient than Spanish buildings. The new Eurocodes became law in the EU after 20 odd years in the making, but will Spain comply...............
> 
> Please do not think that I am being critical of the Spanish people, I am not - it is the system, lack of interest and resistance from the powers that be that makes concrete and steel the preferred choice of materials in a day and age when they should no longer be even considered for building.



Concrete is used for one reason only here in Spain , earthquake protection, same as Greece. There are earthquakes of varying magnitudes every day all over Spain. In town here they build using cavity construction with rockwool in the cavity. Whether it's for insulation or noise reduction or both I don't know. Most houses you see being built now,not for re-sale, have sprayed insulation over the roof before screeding & tiling plus all the walls,before rendering. 
the reason there's no damp course is because the building regs. prohibit it as in the event of an earthquake it would allow the building to slide off of its foundations. You can't even use it in ornamental walls ! I fully agree that most houses that are constructed for sale are built with profit in mind, so unless you are prepared to spend extra on insisting that you have double skinned walls ,insulation, etc; You're going to be cold &hot !

Just off subject slightly, I see that the record number of boiler breakdowns in the UK is to the condensing boiler that Fat John swore by ( by making the installation of all others illegal ) & every one in the trade said was a pile of **** has come home to roost.


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## Metalmicky

gus-lopez said:


> Concrete is used for one reason only here in Spain , earthquake protection, same as Greece. There are earthquakes of varying magnitudes every day all over Spain. In town here they build using cavity construction with rockwool in the cavity. Whether it's for insulation or noise reduction or both I don't know. Most houses you see being built now,not for re-sale, have sprayed insulation over the roof before screeding & tiling plus all the walls,before rendering.
> the reason there's no damp course is because the building regs. prohibit it as in the event of an earthquake it would allow the building to slide off of its foundations. You can't even use it in ornamental walls ! I fully agree that most houses that are constructed for sale are built with profit in mind, so unless you are prepared to spend extra on insisting that you have double skinned walls ,insulation, etc; You're going to be cold &hot !
> 
> Just off subject slightly, I see that the record number of boiler breakdowns in the UK is to the condensing boiler that Fat John swore by ( by making the installation of all others illegal ) & every one in the trade said was a pile of **** has come home to roost.


A concrete construction is one of the most dangerous buildings in Earthquake. All buildings must be designed under a set of principles: Earthquake Resistant Design and concrete is very low on the scale for the following reasons that are avoided wherever possible:
1. Heavy Roof Systems
2. No flexibility of materials during earthquake
3. Unable to return to original shape after shaking.
4. Large window or door openings in buildings that are built in Stone or R.C.
5. Weak non-mechanical joints
6. Weak horizontal elements.

The devastation in Haiti was caused by poorly constructed concrete buildings and all new and replacement buildings are being constructed on timber frame principles for the reasons shown above.

Damp proof courses should always be installed and modern engineered construction makes provision for building anchor in extreme conditions so only flexing allowances would cause any movement.

The spray on espuma used provides no U value and is therefore of little use in modern buildings, and insulating (effectively blocking) an air-flow cavity is not recommended. In UK houses are now being built to Sustainable Code 4 and call for many different tested materials to be used to achieve the U values specified under that code. Elemental proof of thermal performance is not considered, as insulation has to be valued alongside the other wall/floor components to arrive at a ‘true’ performance value. It is untrue that modern building methods and materials are more expensive as they can be completed in a fraction of the time it takes a traditional building therefore a huge saving is made in labour alone - the most expensive part of most operations.


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## Donna773

Billbrady said:


> Yes thanks, I was planning a book or magazine article but to fair weve only found out about these things that everyone else on the Costa del Sol know about, I just feel that more should speak, not to denounce the Spanish but to inform.
> 
> Were leaving because of the mould on the walls, the mould that everyone accepts even at the detriment of their health of themselves and children!
> 
> Our story starts with doing what many wanted to do, every year on holiday, Spain, Portugal, Greece etc for years we stopped and thought what if we lived here?
> 
> Im a merchant navy engineer and as such dont need work in Spain, my wife is a full time housewife with 2 girls, 4 & 12, so Schools are very important to us.
> 
> we soon discovered that many expat brits have fled the UK for various reasons, there are very few people like us that weve met, apart from retired or elderly or those who just visit for the summer, most here are living a deluded lifestyle, timeshare folks etc.
> 
> I just dont know where to start?


Start at the beginning...it's more interesting than dog poo. That's a load of caca.


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## xicoalc

Donna773 said:


> Start at the beginning...it's more interesting than dog poo. That's a load of caca.


dog poo ca ca :clap2:


----------



## gus-lopez

Metalmicky said:


> A concrete construction is one of the most dangerous buildings in Earthquake. All buildings must be designed under a set of principles: Earthquake Resistant Design and concrete is very low on the scale for the following reasons that are avoided wherever possible:
> 1. Heavy Roof Systems
> 2. No flexibility of materials during earthquake
> 3. Unable to return to original shape after shaking.
> 4. Large window or door openings in buildings that are built in Stone or R.C.
> 5. Weak non-mechanical joints
> 6. Weak horizontal elements.
> 
> The devastation in Haiti was caused by poorly constructed concrete buildings and all new and replacement buildings are being constructed on timber frame principles for the reasons shown above.
> 
> Damp proof courses should always be installed and modern engineered construction makes provision for building anchor in extreme conditions so only flexing allowances would cause any movement.
> 
> The spray on espuma used provides no U value and is therefore of little use in modern buildings, and insulating (effectively blocking) an air-flow cavity is not recommended. In UK houses are now being built to Sustainable Code 4 and call for many different tested materials to be used to achieve the U values specified under that code. Elemental proof of thermal performance is not considered, as insulation has to be valued alongside the other wall/floor components to arrive at a ‘true’ performance value. It is untrue that modern building methods and materials are more expensive as they can be completed in a fraction of the time it takes a traditional building therefore a huge saving is made in labour alone - the most expensive part of most operations.


The spanish & greek concrete structures are skeletons ,designed to be infilled with types of blockwork that fall out in case of an earthquake & in the greek system each course of blockwork is actually built out from the course below to ensure that it falls outwards. The architect specified concrete is exactly the same specification, or should be, as that used in skyscrapers built in areas with high incidences of large tremors. 
I've recently helped construct a 3 story apartment on concrete foundations , steel skeleton & clad with insulated panels for walls & roof ,followed by tiles screwed straight to the roof panels. So some of the younger ones realise the benefits of insulation for summer & winter. 

I fully agree with you on the madness of the way they construct their industrial buildings in concrete panels & even my neighbour agrees that they would be far better in insulated panels & quicker & cheaper.


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## Sonrisa

Billbrady said:


> Lets start with Dog Poo, the Spanish love the stuff, all over the pavements in whats deemed "good" areas.



Lol. We don't love Dog Poo. We simply love Dogs and sadly those of us who have turned out to be village idiots -all thanks to our faulty schooling system- don't know how to clean up their excrements.


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## Alcalaina

Sonrisa said:


> Lol. We don't love Dog Poo. We simply love Dogs and sadly those of us who have turned out to be village idiots -all thanks to our faulty schooling system- don't know how to clean up their excrements.


:clap2::clap2::clap2:

I´m always wary of people who talk about "the Spanish" as if they are a single homogenous group, all with the same characteristics. There is often a sub-text implying that they should pull themselves together and be more like the British!

Silly Billy, he has missed out on a great opportunity. But people who walk round with their eyes shut must expect to tread in **** sometimes.


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## Muddy

Yeah well the dog poo is almost everywhere in the UK, if you don't look down when you're walking you will attach some to the bottom of your shoe sooner than later! So I don't think Spain is any worse that the UK. I didn't see any in the town near to where I was staying after several visits into town and the market etc. but I wasn't looking for it 
Like anywhere there will be some inconsiderate people not cleaning up after their pooches, some more than others.
Like in the UK when I ride my bike in the forest you have to watch out for dog poo and a lot of dog owners drive their muts to the forest or parks and use it as a toilet so avoiding picking up! Some even pick it up in bags and sling them into the trees and bushes, very nice of them 
I would like to see large on the spot fines and convictions for repeat offenders


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## Donna773

Muddy said:


> Yeah well the dog poo is almost everywhere in the UK, if you don't look down when you're walking you will attach some to the bottom of your shoe sooner than later! So I don't think Spain is any worse that the UK. I didn't see any in the town near to where I was staying after several visits into town and the market etc. but I wasn't looking for it
> Like anywhere there will be some inconsiderate people not cleaning up after their pooches, some more than others.
> Like in the UK when I ride my bike in the forest you have to watch out for dog poo and a lot of dog owners drive their muts to the forest or parks and use it as a toilet so avoiding picking up! Some even pick it up in bags and sling them into the trees and bushes, very nice of them
> I would like to see large on the spot fines and convictions for repeat offenders


I have a solution - a fitted plastic bag over the rear end of every dog before it goes for a walk. The problem as things are is that no one ever seems to catch the offenders. And would you take issue with an 18-stone yob and his pit bull after it poos outside your house? Give me a pussy cat any time!


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## Stravinsky

Donna773 said:


> Give me a pussy cat any time!


Yeah ......... at least the bury their own mess!!


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## Donna773

Stravinsky said:


> Yeah ......... at least the bury their own mess!!


This dog-poo theme that I've just written a tongue-in-cheek article about it! Just thought up a corny joke, too. What do you call a brown Spanish cat? Answer - a chocolate gato.


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## jojo

Donna773 said:


> This dog-poo theme that I've just written a tongue-in-cheek article about it! Just thought up a corny joke, too. What do you call a brown Spanish cat? Answer - a chocolate gato.


That is the worst joke I've ever heard Donna!!!!  

Jo xxx


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## Caz.I

Donna773 said:


> I have a solution - a fitted plastic bag over the rear end of every dog before it goes for a walk. The problem as things are is that no one ever seems to catch the offenders. And would you take issue with an 18-stone yob and his pit bull after it poos outside your house? Give me a pussy cat any time!


Yes it's a wonder no one has invented dog nappies - they would be the perfect solution, wouldnt they?


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## Alcalaina

Caz.I said:


> Yes it's a wonder no one has invented dog nappies - they would be the perfect solution, wouldnt they?


Round here they don't even bother with leads, let alone nappies ...


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## fourgotospain

> Actually since we've been in England my daughter has been unwell with a cold and a nasty cough which I lame on her not bringing or wearing a coat. Anyway, if you're not happy then you have to do something to change things and if that means moving back then thats what you need to do!


Jo - we've just got back from 4 days in the UK and my little one has a hacking cough and sore eyes (conjunctivitus); I'm sure it's air travel, central heating and freezing dry UK air to blame. A few drops of Optrex infected eyes and a couple of nights in her nice humid bedroom and she's much better!


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## Donna773

jojo said:


> That is the worst joke I've ever heard Donna!!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


That was one of the better ones, Jojo. They are usually a lot more cringeworthy than that!


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## Muddy

Donna773 said:


> I have a solution - a fitted plastic bag over the rear end of every dog before it goes for a walk. The problem as things are is that no one ever seems to catch the offenders. And would you take issue with an 18-stone yob and his pit bull after it poos outside your house? Give me a pussy cat any time!


I would go for rubbing their nose in it!! And I don't mean the dog 
Compulsory dog training me thinks! That should include they will be taught to poop in the street and not on the pavement! The dog that is 
I'm guessing guide dogs are trained this way because the guy that lives up the road from me I've seen his dog stop, go into the gutter and pee! :clap2:

I told some woman to pick up her dog poo one day in a forest car park, she used a few f_off's and said it didn't apply as it was only a car park and not the forest! Not like there was a poop bag in site lol
So when she refused to pick it up I said I would report her. Took a photo of her car and emailed to the council but not sure if they done anything about it.

I've also gone after a guy that let his dog crap right outside my gate, he claimed that he didn't know the dog had done it. He had one of them very long leads! But of course he wasn't carrying a poo bag either! I told him I knew where he lived (small lie) and would report him if it wasn't picked up within 10 mins. It was


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## Donna773

Muddy said:


> I would go for rubbing their nose in it!! And I don't mean the dog
> Compulsory dog training me thinks! That should include they will be taught to poop in the street and not on the pavement! The dog that is
> I'm guessing guide dogs are trained this way because the guy that lives up the road from me I've seen his dog stop, go into the gutter and pee! :clap2:
> 
> I told some woman to pick up her dog poo one day in a forest car park, she used a few f_off's and said it didn't apply as it was only a car park and not the forest! Not like there was a poop bag in site lol
> So when she refused to pick it up I said I would report her. Took a photo of her car and emailed to the council but not sure if they done anything about it.
> 
> I've also gone after a guy that let his dog crap right outside my gate, he claimed that he didn't know the dog had done it. He had one of them very long leads! But of course he wasn't carrying a poo bag either! I told him I knew where he lived (small lie) and would report him if it wasn't picked up within 10 mins. It was


Maybe the easiest way is to make all dogs wear incontinence bags. After all, they clearly ARE incontinent - and a bag would be far more humane and less painful than a cork!


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## jojo

maybe its just me and I'm an easy going, messy type of person, but I dont give a fig about dog poo. If I see it on the street, well, I try not to tread in it, if I accidentally do then yuk and I moan about it. So yes, certainly huge, soft piles need to be moved, but the rest???? Well on the street, then owners should at least make sure that its done in an out of the way corner, in parks and the countryside its not a problem, at least its biodegradable! For me its certainly not an issue to get bent out of shape about!

Jo xxxx


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## mrypg9

jojo said:


> maybe its just me and I'm an easy going, messy type of person, but I dont give a fig about dog poo. If I see it on the street, well, I try not to tread in it, if I accidentally do then yuk and I moan about it. So yes, certainly huge, soft piles need to be moved, but the rest???? Well on the street, then owners should at least make sure that its done in an out of the way corner, in parks and the countryside its not a problem, at least its biodegradable! For me its certainly not an issue to get bent out of shape about!
> 
> Jo xxxx



Quite. It's messy, it's smelly.....but it's dog poo. Not quicklime, sulphuric acid or even vomit (plenty of that in UK streets at weekends).
When our dog craps on the beach, we pick up. When he craps in the campo or adds his pile to the mountains of excrementos on waste ground away from dwellings, we don't.
He has been trained not to do it in the streets - we rarely walk him in the street, anyway.
He is a very big boy, as you know, Jo, and needs a lot of exercise in places where he can run freely. Luckily we have an abandoned marble quarry nearby with loads of paths and spaces where he can get the exercise he needs, as well as a large garden.
I would guess that for many dogs, a walk round the streets for ten minutes so they can pee and crap is all they will get. Not enough.
I have seen people emerging from apartment blocks with dogs of all sizes, five minutes on the street, business over, back indoors...


----------



## MaidenScotland

Our dogs are walked in the campo and they are left off the lead to run free... no we don't pick up and to be honest it would be pretty hard to do so... 3 big dogs running off in all directions to do what they need to do is difficult to track. We are lucky as it is a dirt track that runs along side the house up into the mountains so our dogs never see the road.
The two terriers are put on a lead and walked but they are so good at waiting until they come back into the garden to do their business  We can't let them run free as they would be lost in the vegetation but we have a huge garden that can run around in chasing the cats.


----------



## Donna773

MaidenScotland said:


> Our dogs are walked in the campo and they are left off the lead to run free... no we don't pick up and to be honest it would be pretty hard to do so... 3 big dogs running off in all directions to do what they need to do is difficult to track. We are lucky as it is a dirt track that runs along side the house up into the mountains so our dogs never see the road.
> The two terriers are put on a lead and walked but they are so good at waiting until they come back into the garden to do their business  We can't let them run free as they would be lost in the vegetation but we have a huge garden that can run around in chasing the cats.


Your dogs might be running free, but I'd feel like I was in jail with that sort of commitment. Looking after one dog is demanding enough for most people - but with three big 'uns romping about, how do you ever get any time to yourselves?


----------



## Caz.I

jojo said:


> maybe its just me and I'm an easy going, messy type of person, but I dont give a fig about dog poo. If I see it on the street, well, I try not to tread in it, if I accidentally do then yuk and I moan about it. So yes, certainly huge, soft piles need to be moved, but the rest???? Well on the street, then owners should at least make sure that its done in an out of the way corner, in parks and the countryside its not a problem, at least its biodegradable! For me its certainly not an issue to get bent out of shape about!
> 
> Jo xxxx


In the larger scheme of things, it isnt important of course. But when you have young children and it's literally done right outside your front gate (continuously), then it's very annoying, not to mention unhygienic, and contact with it can actually cause some nasty illnesses. When my son was 4 he started complaining about it so it must be bad! When it's on the (middle of the) pavement in a town, every couple of yards then it does get on your nerves. Strangely, some parts of town seem to be worse than others for it, and round here it is bad. It would be bearable if it was on the side of the road rather than the pavement but too many people just cant be bothered to go that extra inch!


----------



## Donna773

I'm getting browned off with the dog poo diary. I suspect that for many people it's less of a problem than incessant barking from neighbours' mutts - particularly during the night. I don't have that problem because there are no dogs in the immediate vicinity of my home. But is there any humane way of keeping a noisy dog quiet, I wonder? Apart from when the house is being burgled, that is...


----------



## Caz.I

Donna773 said:


> I'm getting browned off with the dog poo diary. I suspect that for many people it's less of a problem than incessant barking from neighbours' mutts - particularly during the night. I don't have that problem because there are no dogs in the immediate vicinity of my home. But is there any humane way of keeping a noisy dog quiet, I wonder? Apart from when the house is being burgled, that is...


Yes, but when you have the two problems together it's a nightmare - especially when said dog in question is left outside on the balcony below your bedroom (in the height of summer!) to do his business there and cry all night. I am not a dog owner but I know the dog in that case was neglected which is why it was barking incessantly. If there is no object for the dog to bark at, it must have it's reasons for doing so...?? Bad dog parenting perhaps? I dont know the answer though, maybe some of the dog owners here can offer advice? And as for the noise from the neighbours themselves...


----------



## Muddy

Caz.I said:


> In the larger scheme of things, it isnt important of course. But when you have young children and it's literally done right outside your front gate (continuously), then it's very annoying, not to mention unhygienic, and contact with it can actually cause some nasty illnesses. When my son was 4 he started complaining about it so it must be bad! When it's on the (middle of the) pavement in a town, every couple of yards then it does get on your nerves. Strangely, some parts of town seem to be worse than others for it, and round here it is bad. It would be bearable if it was on the side of the road rather than the pavement but too many people just cant be bothered to go that extra inch!


Good point. Kids are more at risk and so are anyone that enjoys the parks and forests. Loads of people have dogs so it might seem natural to leave your dog use a park open space or forest ok but it's not. When I'm out I almost never see Deer or bunny poo but what I see is dog poo everywhere, and apart from being the most unpleasant things to step in, imagine what happens when you ride through it!
Why dog owners don't just shove it into the road or off to the side of a trail is mind-boggling to me. It clearly shows lack of respect for others and no concern of possible health implications especially to kids as they are unaware of the health problems it can cause.

Added to that most people (not me) leave their shoes on when inside their home, so anything on the footpath is then on the floors in your house! 

Dog Fouling
Diseases from dogs : Health24: Parenting


----------



## jojo

Caz.I said:


> In the larger scheme of things, it isnt important of course. But when you have young children and it's literally done right outside your front gate (continuously), then it's very annoying, not to mention unhygienic, and contact with it can actually cause some nasty illnesses. When my son was 4 he started complaining about it so it must be bad! When it's on the (middle of the) pavement in a town, every couple of yards then it does get on your nerves. Strangely, some parts of town seem to be worse than others for it, and round here it is bad. It would be bearable if it was on the side of the road rather than the pavement but too many people just cant be bothered to go that extra inch!


All I'm going to say is that dog poo, when its decaying turns quite chalk like and it is possible to use it to draw pictures on walls lol!!!! As a kid that was always a fun past time, in between eating earth worms, racing slugs, catching caterpillars, making mud pies...... all that and only pretending to wash my hands before lunch. Its a wonder I'm still here!!!!

Jo xxx


----------



## Alcalaina

Caz.I said:


> Yes, but when you have the two problems together it's a nightmare - especially when said dog in question is left outside on the balcony below your bedroom (in the height of summer!) to do his business there and cry all night. I am not a dog owner but I know the dog in that case was neglected which is why it was barking incessantly. If there is no object for the dog to bark at, it must have it's reasons for doing so...?? Bad dog parenting perhaps? I dont know the answer though, maybe some of the dog owners here can offer advice? And as for the noise from the neighbours themselves...


Some friends in our village had that problem, the dog was tied up on the neighbours' roof terrace all day and only taken out when the owner went hunting on Sundays. It howled all the time and the smells were wafting up into their kitchen. They asked the owner several times to take better care of his dog and when he took no action they went to the _policia local_ and issued a _denuncia_. It worked - the owner took the dog out to live at his finca in the campo. He even came round and apologised!


----------



## Caz.I

Alcalaina said:


> Some friends in our village had that problem, the dog was tied up on the neighbours' roof terrace all day and only taken out when the owner went hunting on Sundays. It howled all the time and the smells were wafting up into their kitchen. They asked the owner several times to take better care of his dog and when he took no action they went to the _policia local_ and issued a _denuncia_. It worked - the owner took the dog out to live at his finca in the campo. He even came round and apologised!


Thats exactly what I did in the end, and it worked too, but its a pity it has to go that far before anyone does anything.


----------



## Caz.I

jojo said:


> All I'm going to say is that dog poo, when its decaying turns quite chalk like and it is possible to use it to draw pictures on walls lol!!!! As a kid that was always a fun past time, in between eating earth worms, racing slugs, catching caterpillars, making mud pies...... all that and only pretending to wash my hands before lunch. Its a wonder I'm still here!!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


Well, it is a wonder, because there are diseases from dog faeces that can cause partial blindness, aren't there? And there was a case on Spanish TV a few months ago of a little girl who became partially blind for that reason - so I doubt her parents would appreciate your sarcasm! Yes a lot of the other things I think a lot of us did as kids, in my case, not the eating worms bit tho lol. But kids playing with dog poo - as my 5 year old says, Que asco!


----------



## jojo

Caz.I said:


> Well, it is a wonder, because there are diseases from dog faeces that can cause partial blindness, aren't there? And there was a case on Spanish TV a few months ago of a little girl who became partially blind for that reason - so I doubt her parents would appreciate your sarcasm! Yes a lot of the other things I think a lot of us did as kids, in my case, not the eating worms bit tho lol. But kids playing with dog poo - as my 5 year old says, Que asco!



Sarcasm???? I wasnt using sarcasm, nor was my comment directed at this girls parents. I'm simply pointing out things I did as a child - factual things. There are risks with everything in life, I could just as easily comment that a playmate of mine was blinded in one eye by being accidentally shot with a home made bow and arrow when he was five by another friend - sadly another fact!

Jo xxx


----------



## xicoalc

jojo said:


> All I'm going to say is that dog poo, when its decaying turns quite chalk like and it is possible to use it to draw pictures on walls lol!!!! As a kid that was always a fun past time, in between eating earth worms, racing slugs, catching caterpillars, making mud pies...... all that and only pretending to wash my hands before lunch. Its a wonder I'm still here!!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


Jo... Im worried about you! Has this fascination with animal feces passed now? jaja


----------



## jojo

steve_in_spain said:


> Jo... Im worried about you! Has this fascination with animal feces passed now? jaja


Ooooh yes!! My dogs poo around my garden and the kids are despatched to pick it up every few days, but we do tend to wait til it dries a bit as its easier and doesnt leave a mess  - oh and they dont pick it up and draw with it first lol!! They use a bag!!!

Jo xxxx


----------



## Caz.I

jojo said:


> Sarcasm???? I wasnt using sarcasm, nor was my comment directed at this girls parents. I'm simply pointing out things I did as a child - factual things. There are risks with everything in life, I could just as easily comment that a playmate of mine was blinded in one eye by being accidentally shot with a home made bow and arrow when he was five by another friend - sadly another fact!
> 
> Jo xxx


Not as many people running around with bows and arrows in the street as there is dog poo though. Yes there are risks everywhere but since we are more aware these days of possible diseases than perhaps we were when we were children, it is fairly sensible to reduce the risks where possible to try to avoid causing disease in your or others' children, is it not? The last sentence of your previous post did seem a tad sarcastic, or perhaps flippant, even if it wasn't intentional - so therefore I felt it was disrespectful in that sense to anyone affected by such diseases. Anyway, hopefully the amount of rain we are having at the moment is washing all that poo clean away!


----------



## TheGent

Caz.I said:


> Yes, but when you have the two problems together it's a nightmare - especially when said dog in question is left outside on the balcony below your bedroom (in the height of summer!) to do his business there and cry all night. I am not a dog owner but I know the dog in that case was neglected which is why it was barking incessantly. If there is no object for the dog to bark at, it must have it's reasons for doing so...?? Bad dog parenting perhaps? I dont know the answer though, maybe some of the dog owners here can offer advice? And as for the noise from the neighbours themselves...


"left outside on the balcony to do his business there and cry all night" is no way to treat any dog. Dogs need to be part of the family and I suspect they would not leave their child out there all night. So you are right, bad dog parenting.

We have been breeding Boxer dogs for over 30 years and have continued over here in Spain. Luckily so far we have managed to sell our offspring to either ex pats who have owned Boxers before, or exported back to the UK, but training and vetting new owners is all part of the pre sales service.

Unfortunately, not all breeders do the same or folk take on dogs from dubious sources. We have never sold a Boxer to anybody living in a flat but perhaps smaller dogs can adapt if the owners have a lot of time to spare taking them out. The owners you talk of seem to have little regard for the well being of the dog and of their neighbours.

The only advice I can offer is to move (a joke)

Best wishes,

Peter


----------



## MacRov

I've just read through all of this and couldn't see any real reasons for leaving or have I missed something here ?
Dog mess is an issue everywhere, even in my own garden as ya cant always find the bloody stuff in the grass etc. Also someone said something along the lines of "aren't dogs incontenant anyway" surely that's a joke and the poster doesn't really think dogs walk around having absolutely no control over their doings ?
As for damp...sheesh try living in a solid stone old croft house in the north east of scotland that has no insulation, poor ventilation and terrible heating.
None of what I've read here puts me off coming to Spain and my wife and I are greatly looking forward to our house hunting mission in April.

see you all on the sunny side soon


----------



## Pesky Wesky

MacRov said:


> I've just read through all of this and couldn't see any real reasons for leaving or have I missed something here ?
> Dog mess is an issue everywhere, even in my own garden as ya cant always find the bloody stuff in the grass etc. Also someone said something along the lines of "aren't dogs incontenant anyway" surely that's a joke and the poster doesn't really think dogs walk around having absolutely no control over their doings ?
> As for damp...sheesh try living in a solid stone old croft house in the north east of scotland that has no insulation, poor ventilation and terrible heating.
> None of what I've read here puts me off coming to Spain and my wife and I are greatly looking forward to our house hunting mission in April.
> 
> see you all on the sunny side soon


No, you didn't miss anything. So far the main reason the OP has given for leaving Spain is dog poo

Glad to see you're still up for the challenge. Here are some threads that may be of some interest

Advice about coming to live in Spain
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...g-spain/56434-do-you-want-emigrate-spain.html

Info about education if you have children
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/spain-expat-forum-expats-living-spain/62551-education-spain.html

Locations on the Costa del Sol
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...5662-moving-soon-costa-del-sol-but-where.html

Northern Spain
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/spain-expat-forum-expats-living-spain/59893-northern-spain.html

Renting or buying property
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/spain-expat-forum-expats-living-spain/62560-rent-buy.html


----------



## Sonrisa

Billbrady said:


> Yes thanks, I was planning a book or magazine article.


Well if He is planning to write a book, there must be more to it than Dog Poo? He can't seriously be considering the idea of writting a book about Dog Poo in Spain?

I mean, who would read that?


----------



## Stravinsky

Sonrisa said:


> Well if He is planning to write a book, there must be more to it than Dog Poo? He can't seriously be considering the idea of writting a book about Dog Poo in Spain?
> 
> I mean, who would read that?


Dog Poo Enthusiasts maybe?


----------



## mrypg9

Sonrisa said:


> Well if He is planning to write a book, there must be more to it than Dog Poo? He can't seriously be considering the idea of writting a book about Dog Poo in Spain?
> 
> I mean, who would read that?


Not me. I think I'll stick to Proust and Shakespeare...
Somehow I do not think this tome, should it ever appear, will be a best seller.....
Keep the day job, Bill, which, incidentally, sounds like an interesting one.


----------



## Pesky Wesky

Sonrisa said:


> Well if He is planning to write a book, there must be more to it than Dog Poo? He can't seriously be considering the idea of writting a book about Dog Poo in Spain?
> 
> I mean, who would read that?


Judging by the number of forum pages that we've managed to cover on the subject, quite a few members would be queuing to have the book signed by the author!!


----------



## gus-lopez

Pesky Wesky said:


> Judging by the number of forum pages that we've managed to cover on the subject, quite a few members would be queuing to have the book signed by the author!!


Where there's muck there's money !


----------



## Sonrisa

gus-lopez said:


> Where there's muck there's money !


Jaja

So they say


----------



## nigele2

Sonrisa said:


> Jaja
> 
> So they say


"It may be mierda to you but it is my bread and butter"

Sewage worker, Torrejon, Madrid


----------



## Pesky Wesky

nigele2 said:


> "It may be mierda to you but it is my bread and butter"
> 
> Sewage worker, Torrejon, Madrid


Thanks for that nigel; made me start my day with a smile!


----------



## irenemcl

Sorry its not working out for you!! But for those of you interested, we have also spent 6 months in Spain and we are very happy!!Two of our children aged 4 and 6 are in a local spanish school and doing really well. The 6 year old is fluent in spanish already after only 4 months in school and even has an english speaking friend. The 4 year old apparently speaks spanish to his teacher(but not to us!). Life is pretty good- ups and downs same as everywhere - lots of minor annoyances and irritations but generally a good standard of living and spanish poeple LOVE children which when you have 4 like us is a big bonus!!


----------



## Trubrit

*I have just spent 60 years in the uk and i have had ernough too*



Billbrady said:


> Anyone wishing to move to Spain as a family would be wise to read our story..


I am 60 years old and on February 5th I am moving to Madrid and can't wait!! It has cost £700 to get my dog down and i have paid £10 with Ryanair lol, what a crazy world we live in.


----------



## Alcalaina

Trubrit said:


> I am 60 years old and on February 5th I am moving to Madrid and can't wait!! It has cost £700 to get my dog down and i have paid £10 with Ryanair lol, what a crazy world we live in.


Ah well, perhaps that's cos dogs can't check in their own luggage


----------



## chanel2020

*Your story*



Billbrady said:


> Yes thanks, I was planning a book or magazine article but to fair weve only found out about these things that everyone else on the Costa del Sol know about, I just feel that more should speak, not to denounce the Spanish but to inform.
> 
> Were leaving because of the mould on the walls, the mould that everyone accepts even at the detriment of their health of themselves and children!
> 
> Our story starts with doing what many wanted to do, every year on holiday, Spain, Portugal, Greece etc for years we stopped and thought what if we lived here?
> 
> Im a merchant navy engineer and as such dont need work in Spain, my wife is a full time housewife with 2 girls, 4 & 12, so Schools are very important to us.
> 
> we soon discovered that many expat brits have fled the UK for various reasons, there are very few people like us that weve met, apart from retired or elderly or those who just visit for the summer, most here are living a deluded lifestyle, timeshare folks etc.
> 
> I just dont know where to start?


 Please tell us your story. I'm sitting here in freezing England waiting for it. It's like reading a book to find out someones torn out last page!


----------



## John.malaga

I agree - 'Expat life' is not for everyone. But that's probably the problem - trying to live an expat's life. To fully appreciate and understand Spain you need to be willing to adapt. Its important to learn the language and customs....above all its important to fully integrate yourself into Spanish life....

But yes...sorry to hear it didn't work out


----------



## Stravinsky

John.malaga said:


> I agree - 'Expat life' is not for everyone. But that's probably the problem - trying to live an expat's life. To fully appreciate and understand Spain you need to be willing to adapt. Its important to learn the language and customs....above all its important to fully integrate yourself into Spanish life....


Why though? I know of people who have moved here and don't do any of these things. They are quite happy with their "expat life". It's down to the individuals I guess, and what they expect and want out of life.


----------



## jojo

Stravinsky said:


> Why though? I know of people who have moved here and don't do any of these things. They are quite happy with their "expat life". It's down to the individuals I guess, and what they expect and want out of life.


..... and where you live in Spain. I'm never too sure what it means by integrating. It seems there is such a wide variety of areas, lifestyles, cultures, types of people in Spain... as in many countries. You have to find what suits you and go for it!

Jo xxx


----------



## mrypg9

chanel2020 said:


> Please tell us your story. I'm sitting here in freezing England waiting for it. It's like reading a book to find out someones torn out last page!


Don't get too excited. It's basically a story of one man's losing battle with mould.
There are more authentic stories of immigrant life in Spain.
You'll get more pleasure out of reading 'Elle' or 'Vogue'.


----------



## casa99

mrypg9 said:


> Don't get too excited. It's basically a story of one man's losing battle with mould.
> There are more authentic stories of immigrant life in Spain.
> You'll get more pleasure out of reading 'Elle' or 'Vogue'.


We never did hear back from billbrady, is he still in spain or has he and his family moved on ?


----------



## mrypg9

casa99 said:


> We never did hear back from billbrady, is he still in spain or has he and his family moved on ?


 Hi David, que tal?
I guess he's moved on to pastures 'greener'...


----------



## casa99

mrypg9 said:


> Hi David, que tal?
> I guess he's moved on to pastures 'greener'...


Hi Mary, muy bien , I think thats right, still learning my spanish


----------



## Prioryman

*What a load of dog poo..................................*



Billbrady said:


> Anyone wishing to move to Spain as a family would be wise to read our story..


Well what a load of "bull" I thought here was a good read!! this could be good, but

You post on the: 27th December 2010, 10:10 AM 

You stop posting in the: 27th December 2010, 01:33 PM 

I'm still waiting on your story...........................

Think I'll go make a coffee


----------



## xabiaxica

Prioryman said:


> Well what a load of "bull" I thought here was a good read!! this could be good, but
> 
> You post on the: 27th December 2010, 10:10 AM
> 
> You stop posting in the: 27th December 2010, 01:33 PM
> 
> I'm still waiting on your story...........................
> 
> Think I'll go make a coffee


make a pot..................


----------



## Alcalaina

Time to close this thread too perhaps, since the mods appear to be having a tidy-up?


----------



## Prioryman

*Good idea*



Alcalaina said:


> Time to close this thread too perhaps, since the mods appear to be having a tidy-up?



Yes that would be the best here I think.


----------



## xabiaxica

Prioryman said:


> Yes that would be the best here I think.


I've been spring cleaning



even if we leave it open, if you just stop posting on it it will just disappear off the page


then maybe if the OP comes back he'll find it & tell us the rest of the story


----------



## VFR

I thought the OP (Bill) was a bit of a wag myself & a good deal more knowledgeable about Spain than first appeared.

He did though have a valid point about dog crap mind, as in most towns you have to learn how to do the dog crap shuffle & I often have to carry out neck exercises after having my eyes permanently glued to the pavement when walking in the towns. (I jest a little)
I noticed that he stayed in a gated community in Mijas where no doubt most owners have acquired a mutt in preference to installing an alarm, on the assumption that this will deter a burglar (doubtful IMO)
That being the case it pays to get at least 2/3 to increase the deterrent & of course the smaller the dog, the louder the bark (or should I say squeak) Lets face it the noise they make is like the smallest engined scooters trying to be a big bike.
I did though visit La Cala last Nov looking for work & noticed that most owners walking there pride & joys had the obligatory mercadona bag secured to the reel that allows Fido to wander off for a couple of kilometers while it takes the owner for a walk. Now the Dog Whisperer states that Fido should always be behind/at the owners side while walking & never in front (yes I know you do not want to know that)
Still at least the owners were trying to do the right thing, but I must admit I was dying to see a couple of Fido's have a scrap and seeing them ending up bound and gagged by the yards of cable as they reeled the owners in 

I am though a little puzzled (given you an opening there) as to why even the mercadona bag owners are totally indifferent to dog piss, Jesus lets face it dogs can produce gallons of the stuff & will spray it over anything that is not in constant motion


----------



## mrypg9

playamonte said:


> I noticed that he stayed in a gated community in Mijas where no doubt most owners have acquired a mutt in preference to installing an alarm, on the assumption that this will deter a burglar (doubtful IMO)
> 
> 
> Not if you are the owner of a 54 kilo Rhodesian Ridgeback or similar


----------



## dunmovin

playamonte said:


> I thought the OP (Bill) was a bit of a wag myself & a good deal more knowledgeable about Spain than first appeared.
> 
> He did though have a valid point about dog crap mind, as in most towns you have to learn how to do the dog crap shuffle & I often have to carry out neck exercises after having my eyes permanently glued to the pavement when walking in the towns. (I jest a little)
> I noticed that he stayed in a gated community in Mijas where no doubt most owners have acquired a mutt in preference to installing an alarm, on the assumption that this will deter a burglar (doubtful IMO)
> That being the case it pays to get at least 2/3 to increase the deterrent & of course the smaller the dog, the louder the bark (or should I say squeak) Lets face it the noise they make is like the smallest engined scooters trying to be a big bike.
> I did though visit La Cala last Nov looking for work & noticed that most owners walking there pride & joys had the obligatory mercadona bag secured to the reel that allows Fido to wander off for a couple of kilometers while it takes the owner for a walk. Now the Dog Whisperer states that Fido should always be behind/at the owners side while walking & never in front (yes I know you do not want to know that)
> Still at least the owners were trying to do the right thing, but I must admit I was dying to see a couple of Fido's have a scrap and seeing them ending up bound and gagged by the yards of cable as they reeled the owners in
> 
> I am though a little puzzled (given you an opening there) as to why even the mercadona bag owners are totally indifferent to dog piss, Jesus lets face it dogs can produce gallons of the stuff & will spray it over anything that is not in constant motion


Brian, the solids we can pick up and dump in a bin..... , but when she decides to have a pee on a downhill.... I draw the line at trying to clear that up


----------



## gus-lopez

playamonte said:


> I am though a little puzzled (given you an opening there) as to why even the mercadona bag owners are totally indifferent to dog piss, Jesus lets face it dogs can produce gallons of the stuff & will spray it over anything that is not in constant motion


They were probably only copying the owners that stop & relieve themselves at the roadside !


----------



## thrax

No doubt there is definitely more doggy doos here than in UK and when pushing a pram you have to especially careful not to roll over the stuff, or worse miss it with the pram and because you didn't seeit tread in it yourself. My wife has done that nearly a dozen times in 4 months. Mind you she also managed it outside the local co-op before we moved here. Reminds me of a very old joke....


----------



## eborlady

Been following the Mouldy - Poo story, lol. What does "OP" mean? referring to Billbrady?
cheers, Mags.


----------



## xabiaxica

eborlady said:


> Been following the Mouldy - Poo story, lol. What does "OP" mean? referring to Billbrady?
> cheers, Mags.


OP means Original Poster - the one who started the thread


----------



## eborlady

heheh, gracias,I feel thick now, lol!


----------



## chanel2020

*Asthma.*



steve_in_spain said:


> jaja all very true
> 
> BUT if you shower less, its harder to go out more because people will not like the smell!
> 
> My bathroom here is not fitted with an extractor... you know.. i only just thought about that after reaing all this today... still, open thhe window after a shower and no problems!
> 
> Spain has MUCH lower chect problems than the UK, my ex has a SEVERE chest complaint (colapsed trachea) which caused a string of significant chest infections including intubation on ICU in the UK. Since being in Spain, not a problem, and the slightest sign o a rattle on his chest always gets fixed with a course of antibiotics.
> 
> OP...Don´t leave the UK, change to a good school (or give yours a longer chance) , move house to one with less damp (or take any of the above course of action to prevent it), and watch where you walk when you go out... maybe if you put that all into place you could give it another 6 months and see if your opinion on Spain changes!


 I hope to move to Spain and one of the reasons is myself and my young son do not suffer with Astham in Spain. I could count on one hand the amount of times i have had it in Spain as opposed to the attacks I've had while living in London. Cheers. Chanel.


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## chanel2020

chanel2020 said:


> I hope to move to Spain and one of the reasons is myself and my young son do not suffer with Astham in Spain. I could count on one hand the amount of times i have had it in Spain as opposed to the attacks I've had while living in London. Cheers. Chanel.


 Sorry asthma! get the spelling write, I've had it all my life! Chanel.


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## chanel2020

chanel2020 said:


> Sorry asthma! get the spelling write, I've had it all my life! Chanel.


 Get the spelling 'right!' What's going on with me tonight? Must be I'm tired, having two kids is taking it out of me..zzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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## jojo

chanel2020 said:


> Get the spelling 'right!' What's going on with me tonight? Must be I'm tired, having two kids is taking it out of me..zzzzzzzzzzzzzz


Its ok, we all get like that - I can barely type at all or speak sometimes after a hard day 

Jo xxx 

zzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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## Alcalaina

chanel2020 said:


> I hope to move to Spain and one of the reasons is myself and my young son do not suffer with Astham in Spain. I could count on one hand the amount of times i have had it in Spain as opposed to the attacks I've had while living in London. Cheers. Chanel.


Nice clean air I expect! My sinuses always get blocked within about an hour of landing in the UK.


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## jojo

Alcalaina said:


> Nice clean air I expect! My sinuses always get blocked within about an hour of landing in the UK.


Actually, I find that there is much more dust here in Spain which doesnt do me any favours, altho I'm not asthmatic, but I can taste the dust in the air - well in the summer. With this rain, I'm soon gonna need an aqualung!!!

Jo xxx


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## country boy

Hijacking the thread for a moment, but on the subject of dust. A friend "cooked" his Motherboard on his 'puter last summer because of a build up of dust on his cooling fan which led to overheating (roll on summer!) The point is; beware of excess dust in Spain regarding maintenance of most things electrical that have cooling fans! 
:focus:


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## Alcalaina

country boy said:


> Hijacking the thread for a moment, but on the subject of dust. A friend "cooked" his Motherboard on his 'puter last summer because of a build up of dust on his cooling fan which led to overheating (roll on summer!) The point is; beware of excess dust in Spain regarding maintenance of most things electrical that have cooling fans!
> :focus:


And car engines too! Filters need changing more often.

I guess it´s the trade-off for all those months with no rain.


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## jojo

Alcalaina said:


> I guess it´s the trade-off for all those months with no rain.


and arent those months a dim and distant memory! 

Jo xxx


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## Pecosa

jojo said:


> St Anthonys isnt the only school in your area. Sunnyview is excellent, so it "the british college" (my kids go there), both are certified by NABSS who oversee he schools curriculum and teaching staff! These schools are essentially private and infinitely cheaper than private schools in the UK. I guess we all see things differently, but the one thing that I will say is that the grass always looks greener on the other side and make sure you dont run back to the UK only to find that, hey, maybe Spain wasnt so bad afterall!!
> 
> Jo xxx


Hi Jo,
I have been reading this thread--very entertaining! I noticed you mentioned a school called Sunnyview and I was hoping I could pick your brain a bit about that school (cost? location?) and schools in general in Spain. 
I have a 14 year old and a 6 year old and the older one is nearly fluent in French, but knows very little Spanish.
Any advice on good areas to live in Spain (for schools mostly!)?
I'd much appreciate it.
Cheers,
Beth


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## Pecosa

irenemcl said:


> Sorry its not working out for you!! But for those of you interested, we have also spent 6 months in Spain and we are very happy!!Two of our children aged 4 and 6 are in a local spanish school and doing really well. The 6 year old is fluent in spanish already after only 4 months in school and even has an english speaking friend. The 4 year old apparently speaks spanish to his teacher(but not to us!). Life is pretty good- ups and downs same as everywhere - lots of minor annoyances and irritations but generally a good standard of living and spanish poeple LOVE children which when you have 4 like us is a big bonus!!


Hi,
I just read this and was curious what area you live in in Spain? I have two kids and would love to have an "in" about good areas for schools (age 6 and 14). They don't speak Spanish, but the oldest is nearly fluent in French. I'd prefer state schools over private (unless the private is cheap and highly recommended!).
You sounded upbeat (and you didn't talk about dog poo like a good 5 pages of posts before this!) so if you have the time could you let me know about the schools in your area (PM if that's better!).
Thanks so much,
Beth


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## Pecosa

What ever happened to Bill??!!!!!


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## Alcalaina

Pecosa said:


> What ever happened to Bill??!!!!!


Nobody knows, but you might get more answers to your specific questions if you start a new thread. Most people have had enough of mouldy walls and dog poo!


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## Pecosa

I did start a new thread! Thanks
Yeah, mouldy walls for pages and pages and then seemingly endless posts about dog poo--who knew?!
Cheers,
Beth


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## chrisnation

*Back in UK*

Weather and sunshine are not the be-all and end-all, any savvy person knows that. But by 'eck, a regular dose of the old currant bun goes a long way to lift the spirit.

I attach two pix. One I took from my sitting room window in Bristol at 2pm on a day in early December and the other almost exactly a month later, to the hour, in the centre of Valencia old town.

I sent these two pix to someone and they replied that just looking at the dark one brought on a dose of S.A.D. Does anyone know if S.A.D. is a condition known to Spaniards?

I took this pic because I could barely believe it could be so dark in the middle of the day, and all day long. I promise I have not fooled around with it in Ph/shop.

I took the pic of the oranges to remind me that there is a place that has light & colour, both of which are important, certainly to me.

So, on the very fundemental level of whether it is preferable to live in the light or in the dark, I say the place with the oranges wins.


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## Pecosa

chrisnation said:


> Weather and sunshine are not the be-all and end-all, any savvy person knows that. But by 'eck, a regular dose of the old currant bun goes a long way to lift the spirit.
> 
> I attach two pix. One I took from my sitting room window in Bristol at 2pm on a day in early December and the other almost exactly a month later, to the hour, in the centre of Valencia old town.
> 
> I sent these two pix to someone and they replied that just looking at the dark one brought on a dose of S.A.D. Does anyone know if S.A.D. is a condition known to Spaniards?
> 
> I took this pic because I could barely believe it could be so dark in the middle of the day, and all day long. I promise I have not fooled around with it in Ph/shop.
> 
> I took the pic of the oranges to remind me that there is a place that has light & colour, both of which are important, certainly to me.
> 
> So, on the very fundemental level of whether it is preferable to live in the light or in the dark, I say the place with the oranges wins.


Hard to argue with photos like that looking back at me! (Although I do love Bristol)
Thanks,
Beth


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## gus-lopez

chrisnation said:


> Does anyone know if S.A.D. is a condition known to Spaniards?


Yes, sign on here ! :lol: Trastorno de ajuste estacional (SAD)


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## chrisnation

*Love Bristol?*



Pecosa said:


> Hard to argue with photos like that looking back at me! (Although I do love Bristol)
> Thanks,
> Beth


Well, Beth, one of the things I find consoling about living in Bristol is that there are people who genuinely like it. That shows me that there are all sorts of strokes for all sorts of folks. And that makes the world a more interesting place.

As for me, the view doesn't get much better than that pic, wherever you look around here. 

So, after yet another very heavy-duty scout in VLC just now, I know know not just that I want to move there asap but have worked out much pretty exactly where: not far from where those oranges are.


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## Pesky Wesky

chrisnation said:


> I attach two pix. One I took from my sitting room window in Bristol at 2pm on a day in early December and the other almost exactly a month later, to the hour, in the centre of Valencia old town.
> 
> 
> I took this pic because I could barely believe it could be so dark in the middle of the day, and all day long. I promise I have not fooled around with it in Ph/shop.


Well, imagine what it's like to be that dark and not even in Bristol, but Weston super dump, just down the road, which is where my family live now.

The clear blue skies of Madrid win hands down every time, with or without oranges!


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## Pecosa

chrisnation said:


> Well, Beth, one of the things I find consoling about living in Bristol is that there are people who genuinely like it. That shows me that there are all sorts of strokes for all sorts of folks. And that makes the world a more interesting place.
> 
> As for me, the view doesn't get much better than that pic, wherever you look around here.
> 
> So, after yet another very heavy-duty scout in VLC just now, I know know not just that I want to move there asap but have worked out much pretty exactly where: not far from where those oranges are.



Do you have school aged kids to consider? Just wondering about schools in that area
It must be nice to have that sense of clarity--I seem to be drawn to too many places all at once!
~Beth


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## thrax

A friend of ours who has lived in Spain for 6 years returned to England for five days over Christmas. Apart from being very lucky to find an airport open and get a flight, she said that the thing that depressed her the most about the UK (which she still loves) was how dreary and grey it was and it got dark at 3.30. We haven't had fantastic weather here for a few days but as soon as the sun shines and that amazing light that southern european countries are blessed with hits my eyes I then remember exactly why I love it here. I hated the snow in England especially the last two years when we were cut off several times. So what are we doing next week? We're going to the Sierra Nevada to look at the snow. Yes, we Brits can be extremely weird at times...


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## chrisnation

*Weston! Oh, woe!*



Pesky Wesky said:


> Well, imagine what it's like to be that dark and not even in Bristol, but Weston super dump, just down the road, which is where my family live now.
> 
> The clear blue skies of Madrid win hands down every time, with or without oranges!


My ma & pa lived in Weston for a spell, a holding pattern before they bought a proper house in a proper town.

The view from on high down to that gulag-like college on the seafront, all a-glow with green neon! 

And you have to walk almost to Port Talbot to dabble yer toes!

Back to the oranges.

And maybe the Spanish will bring in some laws about scooping the poop. Now that would be good.


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## thrax

chrisnation said:


> My ma & pa lived in Weston for a spell, a holding pattern before they bought a proper house in a proper town.
> 
> The view from on high down to that gulag-like college on the seafront, all a-glow with green neon!
> 
> And you have to walk almost to Port Talbot to dabble yer toes!
> 
> Back to the oranges.
> 
> And maybe the Spanish will bring in some laws about scooping the poop. Now that would be good.


They might, they might not but a lot of Spaniards where we live scoop the poop which is good and of course the Germans and the Brits do too


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## Alcalaina

chrisnation said:


> And maybe the Spanish will bring in some laws about scooping the poop. Now that would be good.


It is happening - but at local byelaw level. Our town put up posters before Christmas warning of €600 fines and "removal" of unchipped/collarless oose mutts, and there has already been a noticeable difference.

We had four grey wet days here last week and I definitely felt an attack of SAD coming on - miserable and grumpy. The first sunny bright morning I felt fine again!


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## chrisnation

*Regret to say*



thrax said:


> They might, they might not but a lot of Spaniards where we live scoop the poop which is good and of course the Germans and the Brits do too


not in Valencia. The place is poopy-trapped like nowhere I've been for many a year. I'm sure I'll find some other thing about it I don't like but so far, it's just the poop.


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## NotinUse

Mouldy walls and dog poo sounds like the ideal conditions for growing mushrooms.


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## Pesky Wesky

chrisnation said:


> My ma & pa lived in Weston for a spell, a holding pattern before they bought a proper house in a proper town.
> 
> The view from on high down to that gulag-like college on the seafront, all a-glow with green neon!
> 
> And you have to walk almost to Port Talbot to dabble yer toes!
> 
> Back to the oranges.
> 
> And maybe the Spanish will bring in some laws about scooping the poop. Now that would be good.


High down?? Could that be Brean Down?

I think they've changed the entrance now, but they used to have a long flight of steps into the College, but facing the sea front as it does, people used to get blown off them!!


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## xabiaxica

chrisnation said:


> My ma & pa lived in Weston for a spell, a holding pattern before they bought a proper house in a proper town.
> 
> The view from on high down to that gulag-like college on the seafront, all a-glow with green neon!
> 
> And you have to walk almost to Port Talbot to dabble yer toes!
> 
> Back to the oranges.
> 
> And maybe the Spanish will bring in some laws about scooping the poop. Now that would be good.


we already have those laws here -and they work


I'm sure we can't be the only town in Spain where you will be fined if you don't scoop the poop


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## gus-lopez

xabiachica said:


> we already have those laws here -and they work
> 
> 
> I'm sure we can't be the only town in Spain where you will be fined if you don't scoop the poop


Same here. Not really a problem .


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## Caz.I

xabiachica said:


> we already have those laws here -and they work
> 
> 
> I'm sure we can't be the only town in Spain where you will be fined if you don't scoop the poop


We have them too. Unfortunately, they dont seem to work here. And there are fines up to 1,000 euros too. It is the enforcing bit that is difficult, I imagine.


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## fourgotospain

I CANNOT belive this thread is back to the poo! Really....


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## Enna1

funny, you never step on dog poo in the dark - but yes, in our small town it is a problem but not as much as CATS who mark my front door every night despite putting all sorts of things down and my next door neighbour has had a cat squirt through her window onto the bed. Any ideas lol?


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## Alcalaina

Enna1 said:


> funny, you never step on dog poo in the dark - but yes, in our small town it is a problem but not as much as CATS who mark my front door every night despite putting all sorts of things down and my next door neighbour has had a cat squirt through her window onto the bed. Any ideas lol?


Get your own cat, a big fierce tom - he will scare them off!


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