# Declaring Lower Value on an iPhone (Import Tax)



## tayFR

*This is all hypothetical*

So i’m hypothetically considering having my family member in the US ship a new iPhone 14 Pro to me in France.

What would be the chances (hypothetically of course) that the customs in France will notice that i declare the value lower than the actual value i paid?

The real value of an iPhone 14 Pro is $999 USD. But i can hypothetically list the item/package description as something vague like “mobile phone” and say the value is $699 - which is the current value of an iPhone 13.

I could even hypothetically have my family remove the iphone from the brand new packaging as well and re-pack it in bubble wrap as if it was “used”.

Could this hypothetically work to pay a little less in VAT import tax when it arrives in France?


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## Bevdeforges

Be very very careful with this approach. The French Customs folks aren't stupid, and they know how to identify an iPhone (which is actually what they assume here when you say you have a mobile phone), especially the latest and greatest model. And they know what those things cost retail.

At best, you'll still pay 20% of what you declare (including the shipping costs and any insurance on the shipment). At worst, they'll open up the package (which they have every right to do) , find out you're fibbing, and slap you with the full VAT amount plus whatever penalties there are for trying to evade VAT. 

Figure that the government gets more than 50% of their revenue from VAT rather than from income tax. And the VAT auditors have a much fiercer reputation than the regular old Fisc income tax folks. But hey, it's your choice. In the words of Dirty Harry: "Do you feel lucky?"


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## Nomoss

................ and if it gets lost or damaged in transit any insurance compensation will be based only on the value you declare...............


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## Peasant

tayFR said:


> *This is all hypothetical*
> 
> So i’m hypothetically considering having my family member in the US ship a new iPhone 14 Pro to me in France.
> What would be the chances (hypothetically of course) that the customs in France will notice that i declare the value lower than the actual value i paid?
> The real value of an iPhone 14 Pro is $999 USD. But i can hypothetically list the item/package description as something vague like “mobile phone” and say the value is $699 - which is the current value of an iPhone 13.
> I could even hypothetically have my family remove the iphone from the brand new packaging as well and re-pack it in bubble wrap as if it was “used”.
> Could this hypothetically work to pay a little less in VAT import tax when it arrives in France?


Something like an iPhone 14 is so easy for French officials to get the price of that it's probably not worth it.
They might even decide that you're trying to cheat and confiscate it.
Also, bear in mind that, the US iPhone 14 is eSIM only whereas the version for the rest of the worl is eSIM and/or physical SIM.


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## Peasant

Nomoss said:


> ................ and if it gets lost or damaged in transit any insurance compensation will be based only on the value you declare...............


Perhaps not. If you say that a $1000 iPhone is only worth $700 the insurance company could say that you didn't follow the rules and disallow the entire claim.


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## EuroTrash

tayFR said:


> The real value of an iPhone 14 Pro is $999 USD.


Warning: embittered old pedant here.
999 USD is the PRICE of an iPhone 14 Pro.
As to its "real value"... apparently, so great that it's worth contemplating the risk of committing fraud for, and yet at the same time not great enough to justify paying the full price.
Not being in any way judgmental of the OP because I'm sure they are not alone in this thinking, just a sad reflection on how society is manipulated by marketing pressure that makes peeps so desperate to "own" the latest aspirational object.


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## Bevdeforges

One other bit of wisdom as imparted to me by my DH (who has spent his life working in the computer industry): Retail pricing for computers and other electronic gadgets are set once a year by most electronic gadget companies selling outside the US. Basically they try to allow for potential fluctuation of currency rates over the year and then they add the 20% or so for the VAT they'll pay on import (including a bit to cover the VAT on the shipping and other costs).

Ultimately, that iPhone you get in the US for $999 is going to cost you at least as much as what you will wind up paying if you just buy it from the corner electronic gadget shop here in France because the VAT and shipping is all figured into the price.


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## jweihl

Do you have a visit to the US scheduled soon? Maybe a visitor from the US that could bring you one? 
I often schedule a visit to the Apple Store when I visit the states. Going to get my new iPhone when I go to a wedding in November!


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## Peasant

EuroTrash said:


> 999 USD is the PRICE of an iPhone 14 Pro.
> As to its "real value"...


You're going to have a lot of fun arguing with the French tax authorities about that one.
Let us know how it turns out.


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## EuroTrash

Peasant said:


> You're going to have a lot of fun arguing with the French tax authorities about that one.
> Let us know how it turns out.


Why would I go arguing with the French tax authorities about any of this? You've lost me there...


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## Peasant

EuroTrash said:


> Why would I go arguing with the French tax authorities about any of this?


Because you're a self-admitted "embittered old pedant".


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## EuroTrash

Peasant said:


> Because you're a self-admitted "embittered old pedant".


And you think arguing philosophy with the douaniers would cheer me up??? I doubt it, somehow.


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## LFBEUSTON

jweihl said:


> Do you have a visit to the US scheduled soon? Maybe a visitor from the US that could bring you one?
> I often schedule a visit to the Apple Store when I visit the states. Going to get my new iPhone when I go to a wedding in November!


Agree completely. A cheap flight to New York from Paris is around 500$ Could have a nice couple of days in the city, buy a phone and come back. Why risk losing everything!


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## Bevdeforges

LFBEUSTON said:


> Agree completely. A cheap flight to New York from Paris is around 500$ Could have a nice couple of days in the city, buy a phone and come back. Why risk losing everything!


Just be careful and do NOT carry the receipt for your new phone with you when you return to France! You can be hit with full VAT on any purchases of new goods you bring back with you from a foreign trip like that. Someone I know made a shopping trip back to Hong Kong (in the good old days before the current, um, "political problems") and when they found all the receipts in her purse on return to France, she got walloped with full VAT on the lot. Admittedly more likely on return from a "shopping destination" than from the US - but a brand spanking new iPhone will attract a certain amount of "interest" no matter where you're coming from.


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## Clic Clac

EuroTrash said:


> Warning: embittered old pedant here.
> *999 USD is the PRICE of an iPhone 14 Pro.
> As to its "real value"... *apparently, so great that it's worth contemplating the risk of committing fraud for, and yet at the same time not great enough to justify paying the full price.
> *Not being in any way judgmental of the OP* because I'm sure they are not alone in this thinking, just a sad reflection on how society is manipulated by marketing pressure that makes peeps so desperate to "own" the latest aspirational object.





Peasant said:


> You're going to have a lot of fun arguing with the French tax authorities about that one.
> Let us know how it turns out.


Pheasy, if you hadn't cropped the post you would have seen that it was addressed to the 'OP' and other Materialistic Magpies.

Granted, there may well be customs officers who are so inclined, but others may well survive with a 150 quid mobile.


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## Befuddled

On UK TV (and radio) we are bombarded with ads for the latest Iphone. If the BS is to be believed they are the most wonderful thing the world of technology has to offer and therefore the price is justified. I tend to wonder what rubbish the earlier models were to need continuous upgrades and improvements. And they were all sold at a similar exorbitant price point. Iphones must be like heroin, hopelessly addictive.


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## LFBEUSTON

Befuddled said:


> On UK TV (and radio) we are bombarded with ads for the latest Iphone. If the BS is to be believed they are the most wonderful thing the world of technology has to offer and therefore the price is justified. I tend to wonder what rubbish the earlier models were to need continuous upgrades and improvements. And they were all sold at a similar exorbitant price point. Iphones must be like heroin, hopelessly addictive.


I think they are probably more expensive than heroin!!!! Personally I can't see the 'attraction' of the latest model, or any model come to that, but my son is perhaps an 'addict'!! He always buys the latest phone or has some sort sort of horrendous contract for one. He does use it as I use this computer and it does do things I can only wonder at, let alone understand! I'm forced to have a basic model simply for banking and buying purposes but other than for those things I wouldn't have even the basic one. hHving a mobile is like being on the end of a leash!!! still it's his money I suppose!!!


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## BarbTF

I really believe they are built with "planned obsolescence" like US auto manufacturers used to use. My iPhone is 2 years and a few months old now (and conveniently as of 2 years old fully paid for under my phone company's payment plan) and it is already starting to slow down and the battery is not holding charge as well as it did. Funny thing but my last iPhone (well, the one before last as the last one I had to hand in when I got laid off from my job as it belonged to the company, while it was only about a year old) did the same thing. If experience is a guide I expect it to continue to get worse and at some point the irritation will get me to buy a new iPhone.

Or maybe I'm just embittered and suspicious!


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## Nomoss

I still manage with this. Its obsolescence doesn't affect me


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## Bevdeforges

Just a note in all this. For whatever reason, France has always been Apple Country when it comes to electronic gadgets. When home computers first came out, "everyone" insisted on getting an Apple because it was widely considered to be "the best." And the first smartphones you saw here in France seemed to inevitably be the iPhones - again, because of the cachet surrounding Apple products. (Or possibly, just the expense of them.) Point being that, if you're trying to get a new iPhone past Customs with a lower-than-actual price attached, you're far more likely to get caught, simply because the iPhones are so popular here and I suspect most Customs agents can tell you exactly how much they cost both here in France and elsewhere in the world.


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## Befuddled

Yes. The customs guys are not fools. They can be very sharp cookies when they are in the mood and will spot the tiniest thing. Or they can be having a "couldn't care less" day and let things slide.


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