# Insurance on car not in my name?



## coldinengland (Mar 28, 2014)

Hello All

I have bought a Spanish reg car in the UK.

Its currently in the UK.

I have the papers but not a copy of the guys passport or NIE.

The car has a UK mot but its Spanish ITV has run out

Do all Spanish car insurers start to get funny if you don't prove you have got the car in your name after a certain time?

Some people say they have been driving cars in other peoples names for years and its no problem. Some people say their insurance gets arsey.

Whats the consensus here?


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

coldinengland said:


> Hello All
> 
> I have bought a Spanish reg car in the UK.
> 
> ...


I think you should go back to the people you bought it through (assuming it was a company/third party) to get things regularised. In answer to your question re the insurance - imagine you are the police/Guardia Civil, what would you think about it?


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## coldinengland (Mar 28, 2014)

I knew full well when i bought the car what its status was.

I have debts in Spain because of repossession (property so bad it has a negative value!) and it would be a dumb idea for me to register my self at the town hall full stop! Unless I was so stupid I actually wanted a bailiff bang on my door!

I know people who have got away with driving someone elses car for years after they went back to the UK. They have itv and insurance. I just wanted to know what everyone else thought as my likelihood of being OK..


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

coldinengland said:


> I knew full well when i bought the car what its status was.
> 
> I have debts in Spain because of repossession (property so bad it has a negative value!) and it would be a dumb idea for me to register my self at the town hall full stop! Unless I was so stupid I actually wanted a bailiff bang on my door!
> 
> I know people who have got away with driving someone elses car for years after they went back to the UK. They have itv and insurance. I just wanted to know what everyone else thought as my likelihood of being OK..



I dont know if I'm getting this correctly, but surely if you're planing to go to Spain and they're after you, then your passport will alert them of your arrival - and then they may well find that you're driving someone elses car??????

If I've got it wrong, then surely if you get stopped, they'll notice the name on your licence isnt the same as the name on the cars details????

Sounds dodgy to me

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I dont know if I'm getting this correctly, but surely if you're planing to go to Spain and they're after you, then your passport will alert them of your arrival - and then they may well find that you're driving someone elses car??????
> 
> If I've got it wrong, then surely if you get stopped, they'll notice the name on your licence isnt the same as the name on the cars details????
> 
> ...


the whole thing sounds dodgy

can you even get a proper UK MOT on a foreign plated car?

wouldn't the 'previous' owner still be liable for any fines coldinengland might incur as well?



I'm pretty sure I read recently that to get an ITV now, you have to prove that the car is yours, or that whoever is taking it for you has some kind of permission

& what about road tax in Spain etc??


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

coldinengland said:


> Hello All
> 
> I have bought a Spanish reg car in the UK.
> 
> ...


As I said elsewhere, I don't think you can get an MOT on a Spanish registered car.

You also can't get insurance on something that you don't have an insurable interest in.

The whole thing stinks! You should have not bought it unless you were happy to break several laws.


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## coldinengland (Mar 28, 2014)

I have a bill of sale for the car. But admittedly not from the guy in Spain who's name is on the papers.

I have all the papers.

I paid someone to look the car up in the computer to make sure it didn't have any debts on it, it cost me 30 euros or something via paypal.

I have no intention of driving it round with no itv or insurance.

I have got the UK mot i don't understand why you think this is a problem.

I don't want to drive a car that is not fit for the road.

How do you mean they are after me? All I have done is not paid my mortgage!!! Spain is littered with mortgage defaulters!!!

What would be dumb is stamping my name and NIE number into public record so the bank knows where I live! That would be a great way to loose what ever I have, surely none of you would advocate that???

People drive other peoples car all the time in Spain. Most car insurance in Spain covers any driver to drive that car over a certain age.

Families keep cars in the same name for years and hand them down cos the Spanish hate paying the transfer taxes.

I don't understand what laws I would be breaking??? Can someone quote a law? Rather than an opinion?


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## newpower (Jan 14, 2015)

You ask for opinions on something then you dont like the opinions given.
You are also asking questions then you give yourself the answers.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

coldinengland said:


> I have a bill of sale for the car. But admittedly not from the guy in Spain who's name is on the papers.
> 
> I have all the papers.
> 
> ...


If you want the laws you may be breaking officially, then you need to go to official sources, either "trafico" the guardia, or an abogado.

This is a chat/information forum and is therefore going to be full of opinions. That said, most opinions here are based on facts. My opinion of what you need to do to make sure that you are not breaking any laws is to drive a British car with all the correct insurances and certificates to Spain and then, once you are a resident of Spain, you should then either matriculate your British car or buy a Spanish car. As for the money defaulted on, well, thats a matter for the banks

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

coldinengland said:


> I have a bill of sale for the car. But admittedly not from the guy in Spain who's name is on the papers.
> 
> I have all the papers.
> 
> ...


the reason I mentioned the MOT is because you can't get an ITV on a UK plated car, at least not one that actually counts for anything - so I figured it would be the same in the UK - it was a question, to which maybe someone here will know the answer 

you'll have to give your NIE & your address for the road tax though & show that you own the car - & your NIE for the ITV & the insurance - so you'll soon be 'on the system', regardless

it's also a legal requirement to register on the padrón & to register as resident - so again, you'll be in the system


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## coldinengland (Mar 28, 2014)

I hope your not all picking on me because I defaulted on my mortgage?

I think if a few more people defaulted property prices would (quite rightly) go down even more and poor Spanish people with low wages would be able to afford a home without getting into piles of DEBT.

Homes in Spain should be like cars where as they get older they go DOWN in value (as they need new kitchens/bathrooms/other repairs etc), so then the poor can buy a family home for a reasonable amount of money like 400-500 euros a sq m. Not stupid lunacy of 1000-3000 euros a sq m!

If the property market crashed and the Spanish banks went bust this would be good for the masses of unemployed Spanish youth as how it is at the moment is not helping them!


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## coldinengland (Mar 28, 2014)

What car tax are you talking about??

I couldn't pay the car tax even if i wanted to!!

The guy with his name on the papers is the guy that is liable for the road tax...

But i think he has gone back to the UK.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

coldinengland said:


> What car tax are you talking about??
> 
> I couldn't pay the car tax even if i wanted to!!
> 
> ...


 

AFAIK, if you do transfer the car to your name, then you are eligible for all outstanding debts. If you dont, you will be driving it illegally as you wont have the owners permission??? and you havent transferred ownership

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

coldinengland said:


> I hope your not all picking on me because I defaulted on my mortgage?


absolutely not!

but unless the car is insured, taxed & ITVd - all of which you might have trouble doing if you are wanting to avoid having your presence known - you'll be driving it illegally


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

coldinengland said:


> I have a bill of sale for the car. But admittedly not from the guy in Spain who's name is on the papers.
> 
> I have all the papers.
> 
> ...


Where to start...
First of all, you have not got all the papers. You should have the vehicle's technical documents and from the previous owner a p/copy of passport, NIE and signed Solicitud to say the owner agrees with the sale. I bought a Spanish registered vehicle from a reputable dealer in the UK who made sure I had all the papers so I was able to transfer it to my name with no hassle.
Secondly, you cannot MOT a foreign-registered car. I know. We used to own a MOT testing station in the UK. If you have a certificate, it's worthless and if the cops in the UK stop you and you present it they'll be very interested in the testing station that supplied it to you. All MOT certificates are traceable of course.
It's correct that in Spain it's cars and not drivers that are insured.
I can't point you to the relevant law....but you could ask a policeman.
I think there is a great risk that if you get stopped you will have the book thrown at you but that's your choice.
I'm presuming you already have an NIE so you wouldn't be breaking any laws if you stayed longer than the allotted period.

I would advocate paying debts if you can....but I gather that's a rather quaint old-fashioned view.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

coldinengland said:


> I hope your not all picking on me because I defaulted on my mortgage?
> 
> I think if a few more people defaulted property prices would (quite rightly) go down even more and poor Spanish people with low wages would be able to afford a home without getting into piles of DEBT.
> 
> ...


I like your sense of humour.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

coldinengland said:


> I have a bill of sale for the car. B*ut admittedly not from the guy in Spain who's name is on the papers*.
> 
> I have all the papers.
> 
> I don't understand what laws I would be breaking??? Can someone quote a law? Rather than an opinion?


:confused2::confused2:

Sorry, light hearted comment but if the bill of sale is not from who is on the papers thats ... ermm... worthless :confused2::confused2:

To transfer a car in Spain you must have a contract of sale signed by the vendor and buyer. 

As others have said, any fines are the responsibility of the owner.

In the UK a log book quotes that "the registered keeper may not be the legal owner" but in Spain the permiso de circulacion is as good as law as to who owns the car. 

To take out insurance you must, if you are not the registered keeper state who the owner is (in the UK) and you cannot say you are the owner based on having the papers and a receipt signed by someone who appears on no papers and without even having copies of ID relating to the official legal owner.

The law in Spain is that you must re register a UK car in Spain within 6 months of bringing the car and I am assuming the uk law is the same. We have these laws so that silly little things can take place.... such as 


Official notices can be sent to the owner
If any accidents occur or any driving offences the owner can be notified, etc etc

If you want to insure the car in Spain then you CAN ONLY drive it in the UK for up to the limit on the car insurance which is usually 90 days.

If you remain in the UK and are not paying UK road tax you are illegal. If you are in the UK "temporarily" then who is paying the road tax in Spain if the car is not in your name? Is road tax paid anywhere in europe?

If you are staying in the UK then you must get the details of the other person, get a correct contract of sale and then approach DVLA to register it in the UK in your name. If you intend to take the car back to Spain then you need to register it in your name in Spain.

If you owe money to the bank then i do sympathise with you but there is always a solution to sort that out and pay them something even if a nominal amount. However I dont see how registering a car in your name in the UK will affect a Spanish debt for a house.


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## coldinengland (Mar 28, 2014)

*Debts in Spain*

Hello again all

I was serious by the way about how it would help Spain in the long term if it all went bust, and property prices went down to 400 euros/sq m (or less). And the Spanish defaulted on all their euro debt and went back to the Peseta.

I have said at the start, it would be a DUMB idea for me to register my self at the town hall because I have debts. 

I can't have assets in my name in Spain. I can never use my NIE number for anything. My nie number is worse than useless. No bank account, no contract mobile, no home phone, no car, nothing in my name as this would risk the bank, the ibi, the community fee people finding me. This would be a disaster and risk me feeling insecure in my own home.

I suspect the current keeper of the car has gone back to the UK.

I just want to be legitimately insured and ITV'd so I can use the car in Spain.

I don't want to drive a brit car around as that doesn't work for long.

I don't want to drive some gutless piece of crap rental car that's had xxx miles of abuse.

So, does anyone know of a car insurance company that will insure me? Not nag me to provide papers in my name and pay out for a 3rd party if I had an accident?


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Ffs man-up and pay your way in life.

We all have choices to make and RESPONSIBILITIES.

its cringeworthy reading your bleating about what you want and don't want when you have stiffed all and sundry around you by not facing your responsibilities


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

coldinengland said:


> Hello again all
> 
> I was serious by the way about how it would help Spain in the long term if it all went bust, and property prices went down to 400 euros/sq m (or less). And the Spanish defaulted on all their euro debt and went back to the Peseta.
> 
> ...




You can NOT get insurance on a car that you do not own - and you don't own it as it was never legally transferred to you.

You are driving an illegal car illegally!

YESTA!!!!!


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

coldinengland said:


> Homes in Spain should be like cars where as they get older they go DOWN in value (as they need new kitchens/bathrooms/other repairs etc), so then the poor can buy a family home for a reasonable amount of money like 400-500 euros a sq m. Not stupid lunacy of 1000-3000 euros a sq m!


We only paid 386 € per sq.m. in 2007 before the crash!

I can no longer be bothered to listen to all the OPs wails about ducking, diving and dodging his responsibilities while expecting us to help him to find ways to cheat people and the system further. I'm out of this thread.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

The words 'I (don't ) want' feature prominently in your post.
If you have debts in Spain, why not stay in the UK or wherever you are currently resident?
As you cannot legally work here without disclosing your personal details it seems fair to assume that you plan to live and work as a 'submarine'.
What I don't understand is why you are so upfront about your plans yet expecting help and understanding from posters on this Forum who are boring old law- abiding debt and tax- paying legal residents of Spain.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Good post mrypg

Whilst I for one may ( within the law ) like to explore getting full benefit of rules/regs ( 90 days, leave for a weekend etc!!) - and rightly am pulled up about it by fellow members-when it comes to the very serious stuff involving paying your way ( tax etc) in life its pretty galling to read such drivel.

If I am reading it correctly you even welched on site fees etc- dumping unfair expense on your neighbours shoulders etc- I for one wouldn't want to assist you getting around on a bicycle never mind car insurance

I am however beginning to think your post is in fact a wind up as surely in this day and age there would be few low/immature enough to duck all their responsibilities and then have the audacity to cry about looking help


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Rabbitcat said:


> I am however beginning to think your post is in fact a wind up as surely in this day and age there would be few low/immature enough to duck all their responsibilities and then have the audacity to cry about looking help


Sadly, yes, there are and a lot of these seem to head for Spain.
Which is probably why when I said we were moving from Prague to Spain, snobbish acquaintances raised their eyebrows.

It's not just the Costas either. Spain as a whole has a largely undeserved reputation as a haven for those on the run, for whatever reason.

You don't hear the same said about any other country, not to the same degree. 
That too is a burden we boring old farts have to bear.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

I think we've discussed this long enough now - it's clear that the OP has no intention of registering etc etc as is required by law, & since we don't allow the discussion of anything illegal under forum rules 

:closed_2:


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