# Intercam Bank



## Bobbyb (Mar 9, 2014)

I have been reading about expats using Intercam as their bank. I am always suspicious of Mexican banks that are not one of the Biggies. Sometimes these banks are NOT really banks. They go under and clients have no recourse. I see that Intercam is based in Puerto Rico. That does not give me good vibes. Anyone have experience with Intercam?


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

I was browsing their puerto rico site and nowhere could I find anything about account insurance (as in FDIC or a Puerto Rican version). They claim they are regulated by the "office of the Commissioner of Financial Institutions of Puerto Rico www.ocif.com.gov. " - but that link doesn't resolve to any site.

I think any FDIC-insured bank is going to have the FDIC logo on the bottom of the home page. My tentative conclusion is that this bank is completely without deposit insurance, or they'd mention what they have.

I think it's wise to be wary, at the very least.


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

At this point I do not need yet another bank in my life BUT there is an InterCam bank right next door to my CitiBanamex Patrimonial office - in a very nice little 'plaza'. It is new and looks beautiful - in a very upscale neighborhood. I was thinking of sticking my head in the door and asking them if they could maybe exchange some foreign currencies I'd like to unload. Judging from the exterior - that bank is every bit as nice as any bank I have been in in Mexico. I'll have to ask my patrimonial executive what she knows of Intercam. 

REgarding FDIC-like coverage. Here's some info I jotted down a few years ago :


https://www.gob.mx/ipab


The IPAB guarantees your bank savings up to 400 thousand UDIs. As of May 13, 2019 they are equivalent to $ 2,510,652.00 pesos.


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## Bobbyb (Mar 9, 2014)

There have been some "near" banks in Mexico that catered to expats and wealthy farmers. One of them went under and it turned out they were not insured by the Feds. Some people got a pittance of the original investment .Intercam almost sounds too good to be true. They accept foreign checks,Us cash deposits and more. Even the big banks are hard to deal with.


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

Bobbyb said:


> There have been some "near" banks in Mexico that catered to expats and wealthy farmers. One of them went under and it turned out they were not insured by the Feds. Some people got a pittance of the original investment .Intercam almost sounds too good to be true. They accept foreign checks,Us cash deposits and more. Even the big banks are hard to deal with.


Well the Intercam branch I was speaking about above ain't catering to any expats. I think most expats think the only piece of plastic an ATM accepts is a Schwab debit card. 

Now there is another bank - CiBanco - which looks interesting. I don't know if they are throughout Mexico. There was some speculation that they were in the hunt for the Banamex business Citi wants to divest. They have a card (I think debit) which holds perhaps 5 different currencies at once. I believe they are international so if you are in the US and you have some dollars in your dollar 'bucket' the funds are drawn from there etc.... (You likely earn nothing on your deposits). 

Last year when my wife discovered some unused America Express travelers checks it was CiBanco that cashed them out.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Many people in CHapala and Ajijic swear by them. I saty away from them but that is just me..


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

They have CiBanco here in Cancun, unless I'm wrong due to a similar name mixup. A couple years ago there was a long-running protest in front of one of the branches in town. A crowd blocked the street in one direction for about a week, and eventually that (main) street reopened but a tent was set up in the median that stayed there for a couple months.

Apparently that branch offered safe deposit boxes. And a federal anti-money-laundering police task force from CDMX came and raided them and seized all the contents of about 1000 safe deposit boxes and hauled it all off to CDMX to process. They were looking for un-laundered no-provenance hard wealth assets (gold, raw diamonds) that the cartels had stored, and apparently had some intelligence pointing to that particular branch. But they made everyone prove with paperwork how they owned the stuff that was in the boxes - so if you'd invested in gold and stuffed a few bars in your safe deposit box you needed paperwork to show you'd bought it legitimately in order to get your gold back. 

The cartels mainly wrote off the losses and never stepped forward, other people had trouble getting their stuff back.

I don't think any of this was particularly the fault of the bank, or should be any negative ding on their reputation. I mention it just as an off-topic warning about storing things in safe deposit boxes in Mexico. If you buy gold, keep your receipts, and copies of your receipts. I'm not sure whether its best to keep the original receipts at home and the copies with the gold or vice versa.


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## trekmanone (Sep 13, 2020)

Bobbyb said:


> I have been reading about expats using Intercam as their bank. I am always suspicious of Mexican banks that are not one of the Biggies. Sometimes these banks are NOT really banks. They go under and clients have no recourse. I see that Intercam is based in Puerto Rico. That does not give me good vibes. Anyone have experience with Intercam?


I have lived 6 years as a permanent resident in Mexico and have used Intercam Banco the entire time. They specialize in expats because they are the most bilingual of any bank I visited. You get introduced to a Banking Executive who handles your account. You can deposit wire, check or cash to your account only in USD from Canada or USA. I use a checking account with a debit card mostly. Intercam is affiliated with Scotiabank for no-fee ATM cash withdrawals. I had a 6-month CD ladder with Intercam at one point. Great rates! I predominantly use their online banking service. onlione is bilingual. Mexico doesn't seem to trust paper checks so are rare to use. I set up payments to vendors via their domestic wire service. Very cheap, $6.96 a wire (US$0.34). I have about 20 vendors set up to pay. Hope this helps.
I'm not sure what the Puerto Rico angle is as their HQ is based in Mexico City. They are a legit bank.


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## Takingiteasy (Aug 12, 2021)

That was scary when they raided the safe deposit boxes. How many people have all the receipts for things they want to save? The antique pistol from grandpa, gifts you received, rainy day money, things you lost the receipt for because you never thought you would need it.. Mexico seems a little like the wild west in some ways I just hope they don't start doing that in the states or other places. Between the thieves and the government, its getting hard to stay safe. Some say government is the big thief and the big thief hangs the little thieves. 

You can get by without an account and take from usa accounts via atm as many are doing. But, if you are going to buy a house I see no way to avoid it. You will wire funds to their account, you will have other things to pay, unless you plan to run all over to pay bills each month, you will need a local account or it will be a convenience at least. Has anyone bought a house and didn't need an account at a bank? 

A bilingual bank is nice. My spanish is good enough for business as well as day to day but legal and technical terms can pop up in a document. It might be better to have an english speaker who can explain the tough parts. Otherwise you will be looking up the words and phrases on your phone. You would not want to miss some important requirement and maybe something would cause you to go elsewhere.


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## timmy45 (Mar 22, 2021)

I have lived here for four years and have never felt any need for a MX bank account. We take cash from ATM on the occasional basis and use US debit and credit cards virtually everywhere. We purchased a house and made a wire transfer from our US bank to the attorney's account for distribution to seller, without a hitch. In fact, I asked both the attorney and notario about the need for MX account and both said it should not be necessary. CFE is the only bill that does not use credit card for payment and we just go to the nearby OXXO and pay cash....no problem. Could not be more simple, I always wonder why people have such a hard time managing their MX accounts. This works for me.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

I went 4 years while renting without a Mexican bank account, I paid rent in cash pulled from ATMs over using multiple transactions over a couple of days, and I paid CFE at OXXO - except when the bill came later than the payment deadline, and then I had a problem. Happened a couple of times in 4 years. 

But then I bought an apartment. I had to pay the maintenance fee every month instead of rent. And the office wouldn't take the payment, it had to be deposited to their bank account, then bring them the receipt. And the only way to do that was wait in line at the bank for a teller. At _their _bank, no other bank would do.

So that did it for me. I got a bank account at the same bank I owed the maintenance fee to, and now I can use my phone to transfer the funds each month. And pay CFE. And with the CFE account in my name (finally), I get the bills by email long before the paper shows up.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

A US senator, which one I've already forgotten, who I think it said was on the finance committee, just warned about fintech companies that aren't banks. They look like banks, but aren't legally banks and "all" the consumer protection laws don't apply to them. (probably the truth is that consumer protection laws specifically about banks don't apply, but ones for all businesses do). He said there had been a lot of complaints where these companies would claim a "suspicious transaction" had been detected on the account, then freeze the account, and that people were finding it impossible to get their money out. 

I have no idea if Intercam is a "bank" in terms of being subject to bank regulation in any country or not. If it's not, then if it goes bust who bails out the depositors?


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

Last week


eastwind said:


> A US senator, which one I've already forgotten, who I think it said was on the finance committee, just warned about fintech companies that aren't banks. They look like banks, but aren't legally banks and "all" the consumer protection laws don't apply to them. (probably the truth is that consumer protection laws specifically about banks don't apply, but ones for all businesses do). He said there had been a lot of complaints where these companies would claim a "suspicious transaction" had been detected on the account, then freeze the account, and that people were finding it impossible to get their money out.
> 
> I have no idea if Intercam is a "bank" in terms of being subject to bank regulation in any country or not. If it's not, then if it goes bust who bails out the depositors?


I don't understand - the US senator was commenting on Mexican banking ?
I have no relationship with Intercam but here is a link to their website :
https://www.intercam.com.mx/
All the way at the bottom of that page is a little IPAB emblem.
Here is a link to info on IPAB.
https://www.gob.mx/ipab/

At one point years ago I read all that stuff - and I'm sure there are differences - but it felt like FDIC...


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

I know there have been many expat discussions regarding the need for a Mexican bank account.
At times it really can be frustrating - and perhaps once a month or so I manage to get an account locked, but overall I am a happy customer.

Within the last two weeks I called a US brokerage and purchased some US T-bills. Yield I believe was 1.1%
Within the last two week I purchased some 1 year CETES (at CitiBanamex), Yield 8.1%

I understand risk/reward - but do you think the Bank of Mexico is going under in the short-term ?


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## Takingiteasy (Aug 12, 2021)

Timmy45, I would be afraid to wire the money to a lawyer, I've been told by a few mexicans to never trust a lawyer. In usa they can be fined or disbarred for things like stealing. I hate to think what it would be like to try to get the money back if the lawyer decided he wanted to hold it a little longer. Notarios are supposed to be better regulated. I'm glad it worked out for you. I would want the bank to hold the money until it was disbursed, If it can't go directly to the buyer then it would go to the mx bank and then them but I trust a bank a lot more than an individual

eastwind, you made my point about it being much easier to have an account than not have since you save trips standing in line. For people who don't mind it or enjoy the excuse to get out, then great. Speaking of lines, I have changed much of my usa money at a small bank and it never had a line. Ok one time I had to wait maybe a minute while someone completed their transaction, the other times no. But, will it go under some day or freeze your funds for being a grin-go? I'm glad to learn the info on which are the strongest banks


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

I like having a Mexican Bank account.. for one thing I am the titular and it will not go into probabate.. that is a plus...


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Takingiteasy said:


> Timmy45, I would be afraid to wire the money to a lawyer, I've been told by a few mexicans to never trust a lawyer. In usa they can be fined or disbarred for things like stealing. I hate to think what it would be like to try to get the money back if the lawyer decided he wanted to hold it a little longer. Notarios are supposed to be better regulated. I'm glad it worked out for you. I would want the bank to hold the money until it was disbursed, If it can't go directly to the buyer then it would go to the mx bank and then them but I trust a bank a lot more than an individual
> 
> eastwind, you made my point about it being much easier to have an account than not have since you save trips standing in line. For people who don't mind it or enjoy the excuse to get out, then great. Speaking of lines, I have changed much of my usa money at a small bank and it never had a line. Ok one time I had to wait maybe a minute while someone completed their transaction, the other times no. But, will it go under some day or freeze your funds for being a grin-go? I'm glad to learn the info on which are the strongest banks



People I know who were crooks put their house on the market and left the power of attorney with their trusted lawyer.. the house sold and the lawyer kept the mney. They had to get another lawyer who charhed them plenty to get the money back and the first lawyer went to jaill I took them a couple of years of hard work as the first lawyer was the son in law of a rich and well connected Mexican lady..

They used the fact that they were foreigner and that the lawyer never got them a translation of the power of attorney they had signed.


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## Takingiteasy (Aug 12, 2021)

MangoTango, they say free advice is worth what you paid for it. But I'd like to point out a few facts which may help someone with their investments. First of all, inflation is at a 40 year high and that is after they fiddled with the numbers to make them look as good as possible. Inflation is, imo, at around 15% in the states and I know its hitting mx too. Other parts of the world are hit also. Gasoline has about doubled, food is up ...

What that means is your 8% yield which sounds good, loses perhaps 7% a year in its buying power. The 1.1% is of course worse. For your purely investment funds, money you will not need for a long time, you need to get into an appreciating asset such as real estate, gold, bitcoin, etc. Otherwise the cash in the bank no matter what form, will gradually inflate away and have perhaps 1/2 the buying power after 10 years or less.

Cash on hand is different, don't make longer term investments with day to day funds. That sounds obvious but it bears mentioning. You need ready cash for bills and something for emergencies. Credit cards help but you need to be able to lay hands on cash when you need it. The plan to buy a condo is good, market timing might need some work. If you rent first you find out if you like it, just like they tell us when we plan to buy in mexico, rent first.


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

citlali said:


> They used the fact that they were foreigner and that the lawyer never got them a translation of the power of attorney they had signed.


My first Mexican will written about 10 years ago was never translated.
My second Mexican will written less than a month ago had TWO translators present (and mentioned in the will).

The fact that there was no translator afforded me on the first will was all by itself grounds to void it (had I chosen to do so). 

Also - on the day I re-did my will I sat at the table and was handed a stack of blank paper and a pen and instructed to write (in English and in my own handwriting) my intentions.
The translators verified it was translated to Spanish properly.


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

Takingiteasy said:


> MangoTango, they say free advice is worth what you paid for it. But I'd like to point out a few facts which may help someone with their investments. First of all, inflation is at a 40 year high and that is after they fiddled with the numbers to make them look as good as possible. Inflation is, imo, at around 15% in the states and I know its hitting mx too. Other parts of the world are hit also. Gasoline has about doubled, food is up ...
> 
> What that means is your 8% yield which sounds good, loses perhaps 7% a year in its buying power. The 1.1% is of course worse. For your purely investment funds, money you will not need for a long time, you need to get into an appreciating asset such as real estate, gold, bitcoin, etc. Otherwise the cash in the bank no matter what form, will gradually inflate away and have perhaps 1/2 the buying power after 10 years or less.
> 
> Cash on hand is different, don't make longer term investments with day to day funds. That sounds obvious but it bears mentioning. You need ready cash for bills and something for emergencies. Credit cards help but you need to be able to lay hands on cash when you need it. The plan to buy a condo is good, market timing might need some work. If you rent first you find out if you like it, just like they tell us when we plan to buy in mexico, rent first.


Well - to me inflation means different things to different people (I have to get my ew keyboard which ca eter 'n' keys).
For years - both in the US and here in Mexico - my wife kept notebooks of every penny/peso we spent.

In Mexico - I see/live inflation at Costco and HomeDepot (which I really rarely visit) - maybe Petco.
I own my house and everything in it. I already have more stuff than I want.
I own my car. My auto insurance went down this year. My homeowners ins. stayed exactly the same.
Every 6 months it costs me a little more for auto inspections (not a big hitter).
IMSS insurance goes up _substatially_ every year. (but still much less than US healthcare).
If I stay out of Costco and stick with the supermarket the food I eat hasn't really risen in price.
I really don't travel (although I should). 
I gave my gardener a raise because I know he has a growing family.
My property taxes have stayed the same, as has my well water. I have solar panels so my CFE bills are trivial.

So - I just don't feel that hit you tell me inflation is having on my investment profits.
What am I missing ?

I am the guy who never thought computers would have mice, that computers would always have 8" floppy disks etc. I went to work every morning and sat at my desk knowing that I had no mortgage, while everyone around me was leveraged to the hilt with numerous properties. I just can't buy into this crypto thing. To me it feels like tulips.


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## Takingiteasy (Aug 12, 2021)

Yes, well in mexico much of the food is locally grown. In the states it has to be trucked long distances. So we might see higher food prices here than there. The mexican government or lets say their voters, are very sensitive to food prices, more so than in the states so I think they take measures to keep it low. But gas has about doubled, depending on where you are, in parts of california its over $6

I'm the same way in paying for everything and not leveraging debt. I own everything free and clear also and have for quite a while. Even the usa government admits inflation is at least 8.9% and they always lie and claim its lower than it is. Just look at car prices or the price of almost anything you bought last year made in a factory.

I realize most people are iffy on crypto or bitcoin. I'm biased because it has paid off very well for me. It was about $5 a coin when I started playing with it and now some $41,000+. Even when making a bunch of mistakes like I did, I still did well. If I had bought and saved btc from the beginning I would be rubbing elbows with bill gates and elon. I believe btc is under priced and will cross the $100k mark within 2 years, maybe this year. I plan to buy more

My auto ins never goes down, neither does health ins, or anything really. 

The thing I'm trying to emphasize is that cash while needed is a money pit. It loses value for you every year, every time prices go up. Gold is a decent hedge against inflation, the advantage of real estate is you can rent it out or save paying rent yourself. Gold pays no dividends and safe deposit boxes cost money but I started buying gold when it was about $450 an oz which is now some 1900.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Food has gone way up in Mexico including corn which is the basic. I was choked this year when I returned to San Cristoball. I saw it first hand because there food is not sold by the kilo but ny 5 pesos 10 pesos and 20 pesos.... This year it is 10 pesos 20 pesos 30 pesos and 50 pesos.. . My friends live off corn.. they eat it, feed their animals and sell the surplus.. This year the price was so high that they had meeting all over the place on selling or keeping ot.. It was pretty interesting.. I have never seen them do that in 20 years.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

MangoTango said:


> Last week
> 
> I don't understand - the US senator was commenting on Mexican banking ?


The senator (whoever he was, Grassley maybe) was commenting about a class of businesses that have sprung up recently, called fin-techs. They provide services similar to those banks provide, but they are not banks. They often have no brick-and-mortar offices, just a web site (unlike intercam, which seemingly does have some offices). And they skirt national banking regulations by being "not a bank".

I don't know to what extent it applies to intercam specifically, it's a general warning to anyone who would use fintechs.


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

eastwind said:


> The senator (whoever he was, Grassley maybe) was commenting about a class of businesses that have sprung up recently, called fin-techs. They provide services similar to those banks provide, but they are not banks. They often have no brick-and-mortar offices, just a web site (unlike intercam, which seemingly does have some offices). And they skirt national banking regulations by being "not a bank".
> 
> I don't know to what extent it applies to intercam specifically, it's a general warning to anyone who would use fintechs.


I've put in a few minutes looking for what you are describing and I can't find any.
Even when I search on "top fintech companies" it comes up with companies which either offer add-on services to existing banks (eg mobile apps) or it comes up with bone-fide (?) (legit) banks with FDIC coverage which principally do business via online. To be honest - I (probably incorrectly) put the Intuit offerings into your fintech 'box'. In Mexico - the closest thing I have seen is/was Ixe - where it felt like a bank with a Starbucks business model.
I have to visit my Citibanamex branch one day this week and right next door is a brand spanking new Intercam branch. I'll stick my head in the door and have a look around.


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## Takingiteasy (Aug 12, 2021)

I have no idea but I've noticed a lot of stores and businesses in the states are offering bank like services. And you have oxxo in mx. You can buy money orders, pay bills, and so on. I've heard of places like loan companies doing things like that and even pawn shops if you can believe it. Imagine your only bank account is some credit at the pawn shop or loan company where you go to wheedle cash or put some on account. Yes I see it and people seem happy that way though it seems rough.

At one time there was a strict bright line between banks and s+l's now, not so much. And the difference between the check cashing, income tax refund loaning pawn shops and banks is starting to fade just a bit.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

People in the Chapala area seems to like it very much.. I would not know because in Mexico, I like to deal with banks rather than investments houses .
In Mexico the big one for the poors is Bancoppel. They even have their system linked to Western Union to receive remittanceas from abroad but they do not have a SWIFT. YOu can open an account with very little money so many of the poorer people like it.. They also do not tell you like all the banks in Chiapas do that you have to buy life insurrance for 6 months to open an account..


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

Look for a Bancodelbienestar opening near you soon.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

I don't know much more than the quote I heard from the Senator. But I went looking just now and found this article: Fintech: The Bank Disrupters | Kiplinger

It has a paragraph or two about Chime, which is exactly the problem I heard about. 

The article is US-centric. But there's nothing stopping somebody from setting up one of these in another country, and in that case they might not bother to "rent" a "bank charter" the way the US ones do. And their deposits then won't be FDIC ensured. I looked up Intercam, not its Mexican site but it's Puerto Rico site because they're supposedly based there. And I could find nothing about FDIC insurance on the accounts. 

Maybe Mexican law will prevent companies operating like banks that aren't banks as far as regulations, oversight and insurance go. I don't know, I hope so. If they don't, then eventually one or more of these things will fail, depositors will lose their money, and _then _the laws will be changed to prevent it from happening again. But you don't want to be in the position of having to send emails to get your money unfrozen and having someone on the other end answering without reading them carefully.

These banks have not been tested yet by a significant economic downturn. I prefer to let others be the ones to test how strong and reliable they are. But it's your money, feel free to write me off as a Cassandra.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

trekmanone said:


> I have lived 6 years as a permanent resident in Mexico and have used Intercam Banco the entire time. They specialize in expats because they are the most bilingual of any bank I visited. You get introduced to a Banking Executive who handles your account. You can deposit wire, check or cash to your account only in USD from Canada or USA. I use a checking account with a debit card mostly. Intercam is affiliated with Scotiabank for no-fee ATM cash withdrawals. I had a 6-month CD ladder with Intercam at one point. Great rates! I predominantly use their online banking service. onlione is bilingual. Mexico doesn't seem to trust paper checks so are rare to use. I set up payments to vendors via their domestic wire service. Very cheap, $6.96 a wire (US$0.34). I have about 20 vendors set up to pay. Hope this helps.
> I'm not sure what the Puerto Rico angle is as their HQ is based in Mexico City. They are a legit bank.


I don't remember where I heard about this, but a while ago I heard there was a "Banking Executive" for InterCam in San Miguel de Allende. All of his customers' interaction with the bank went through him and he was keeping their money, not putting it in the bank. There can be downsides to getting such personalized service that you don't actually know what is happening with your assets.


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

TundraGreen said:


> I don't remember where I heard about this, but a while ago I heard there was a "Banking Executive" for InterCam in San Miguel de Allende. All of his customers' interaction with the bank went through him and he was keeping their money, not putting it in the bank. There can be downsides to getting such personalized service that you don't actually know what is happening with your assets.


I believe you are referring to a situation which involved Monex (not Intercam).

Bank fraud in San Miguel de Allende: expats fight to regain US $40 million

A decade ago, when I was looking for the best way to move US dollars to Mexican pesos I sat down with a woman at the local Monex branch and she did offer the best deal. I didn't end up going that route, and judging from their website that branch is no longer - but throughout Mexico they look to have many branches.


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