# US IT expats -- is UAE really worth it?



## MikeATX (Jul 17, 2013)

Hi All,

I'm an Information Security Analyst located in Austin, TX for a large financial services corporation. A guy I work with is from UAE (his Dad is a National), and he's been telling me for a year now how amazing it is to work and live in UAE (AD in particular).

What I'm hoping to gleam from y'all is if it's really worth taking a job in the UAE? 

Here's my current situation status:

Non-college degreed IT professional (10 years experience, non-management)
Currently working on college degree, but will probably not be finished for a few more years
About to earn my CISSP (and Information Security industry standard certification)
I have a Canadian wife who has US PR, and two young children (3.5 and 2) who are dual Canadian/US citizens
My current income is just shy of $100k US, and I know I'm underpaid for my field

Basically what I'm wondering overall is if it's really worth the time and effort to search for a job in the UAE? Both my wife and I are open to living/working abroad (we're also considering Australia or potentially moving to Toronto where my wife is from) but I'm hesitant to uproot my family (we own our home) and move halfway around the world if I'm not going to be able to make considerably more money than I'm making now or will be in a couple of years.

Thoughts? And thanks in advance!


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## XDoodlebugger (Jan 24, 2012)

MikeATX said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I'm an Information Security Analyst located in Austin, TX for a large financial services corporation. A guy I work with is from UAE (his Dad is a National), and he's been telling me for a year now how amazing it is to work and live in UAE (AD in particular).
> 
> ...


No.

I love my job and it was a good opportunity for me but if I was in your shoes, making $100k without a degree, in Austin (which is beautiful) with a young family then I would not come. You won't even find that same job here unless it is offered from that side in my opinion.


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## fcjb1970 (Apr 30, 2010)

XDoodle****** said:


> No.
> 
> I love my job and it was a good opportunity for me but if I was in your shoes, making $100k without a degree, in Austin (which is beautiful) with a young family then I would not come. You won't even find that same job here unless it is offered from that side in my opinion.


I would agree


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## INFAMOUS (Apr 19, 2011)

NO!

I left Austin TX to come to Dubai, as great as Dubai is, the day I am offered 100k+ take home in Austin is the day I move back to the US. I have lived in many places and with what you've said you have it made my friend, the grass is not always greener (and there isn't much green grass here hahah)

Also: Without educational credentials you will never be compensated properly here (despite your experience) You may be underpaid in your field but that is most likely due to your credentials! Get those and you'll be making 150k+ there. 

With a family, the job and all that you're crazy to move. If you were single I would tell you sure you can try it for a year or two and always go back, but you have too much to risk. 

Finally, I am originally from Toronto, and unless you want cold, high cost of living and high taxes I would not go to Toronto! Especially with your Salary and you have benefits with your job it far outweighs any so called "free health care" we have in Canada. Australia is nice as I lived in the Gold Coast as well, great place but if you're over 30 it will be extremely hard to get a work visa! 

I have a Masters in I.T. (network security) and over 10 years experience in IT/Project Management and have lived in all the places you mentioned so that is my honest opinion.


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## MikeATX (Jul 17, 2013)

Thanks everyone for the quick responses, especially you, Infamous. The more and more I read about life in UAE from US and Canadian expats, the less and less appealing it becomes to me. 

I really do appreciate everyone's honesty, it's very helpful. For the record, outside of the money, I just wanted my kids to have an international experience growing up, and working abroad is the best way, IMO, for them to have that. Of course, they are dual Canadian/US citizens, so they do go to Toronto and see their family up there regularly, but I don't really consider Canada as living abroad since it's just north of the border.

However, I realize that sufficient travel, while not the same as living somewhere else, can expose my kids greatly to the world outside of the US. 

Thanks again!!


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## INFAMOUS (Apr 19, 2011)

MikeATX said:


> Thanks everyone for the quick responses, especially you, Infamous. The more and more I read about life in UAE from US and Canadian expats, the less and less appealing it becomes to me.
> 
> I really do appreciate everyone's honesty, it's very helpful. For the record, outside of the money, I just wanted my kids to have an international experience growing up, and working abroad is the best way, IMO, for them to have that. Of course, they are dual Canadian/US citizens, so they do go to Toronto and see their family up there regularly, but I don't really consider Canada as living abroad since it's just north of the border.
> 
> ...


Well you definitely have a completely different angle/reason for the possible move by mentioning the diversity and other parts of the world. Don't get me wrong I think the UAE is a great place for kids to grow up to a certain degree.

I still don't think its worth uprooting your current position of work/lifestyle though. You could always travel lots with them and maybe even consider exchange programs or sending them to post secondary schools abroad (gives you reason to travel and visit them)

Don't let these forums fool you, there is much more negative here than positive in my opinion as it is kind of a venting place for most that like to talk behind a keyboard. 

Don't rule it out, just make sure you make an educated decision!


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## MikeATX (Jul 17, 2013)

INFAMOUS said:


> Well you definitely have a completely different angle/reason for the possible move by mentioning the diversity and other parts of the world. Don't get me wrong I think the UAE is a great place for kids to grow up to a certain degree.
> 
> I still don't think its worth uprooting your current position of work/lifestyle though. You could always travel lots with them and maybe even consider exchange programs or sending them to post secondary schools abroad (gives you reason to travel and visit them)
> 
> ...


Well, much as I want them to experience life abroad, I'm not going anywhere unless it's financially worthwhile as well.


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## Tropicana (Apr 29, 2010)

Based on my experience of life in Austin, there is no way I would move if I had a 100k income there.


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## Tropicana (Apr 29, 2010)

MikeATX said:


> . Of course, they are dual Canadian/US citizens, so they do go to Toronto and see their family up there regularly, but I don't really consider Canada as living abroad since it's just north of the border.


You can always go to Quebec


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## MikeATX (Jul 17, 2013)

Tropicana said:


> Based on my experience of life in Austin, there is no way I would move if I had a 100k income there.


Admittedly roughly 100k goes pretty far in Austin, but you'd be surprised how expensive Austin has become over the last five years. The Great Recession didn't really affect Austin, and our housing market is CRAZY hot right now. Example -- in my zip code, 78737, homes sell for 98.2% of their listing price, on average. And I don't live in Austin proper! I'm just grateful we signed/built our house at what I believe was the bottom of the absolute market, spring/summer 2011. Since then, it's been crazy!!

From Trulia about Austin RE market --

"The median sales price for homes in Austin TX for Apr 13 to Jun 13 was $190,516. This represents an increase of 50.2%, or $63,697, compared to the prior quarter and an increase of 64.6% compared to the prior year. Sales prices have appreciated 63.3% over the last 5 years in Austin. *The average listing price for Austin homes for sale on Trulia was $599,524* for the week ending Jul 10, which represents an increase of 1.5%, or $9,128, compared to the prior week and an increase of 0.7%, or $4,220, compared to the week ending Jun 19. Average price per square foot for Austin TX was $111, an increase of 27.6% compared to the same period last year. Popular neighborhoods in Austin include Steiner Ranch, Downtown, West Oak Hill, South River City, Apache Shores, and Hyde Park"

I just need to be patient, finish my degree and I'll be good.  And no Montreal!! haha! Nice place to visit, but you want to talk about COLD! And snooty Quebecois are no fun either.


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## Desert_Fever (Apr 13, 2013)

MikeATX said:


> Admittedly roughly 100k goes pretty far in Austin, but you'd be surprised how expensive Austin has become over the last five years. The Great Recession didn't really affect Austin, and our housing market is CRAZY hot right now. Example -- in my zip code, 78737, homes sell for 98.2% of their listing price, on average. And I don't live in Austin proper! I'm just grateful we signed/built our house at what I believe was the bottom of the absolute market, spring/summer 2011. Since then, it's been crazy!!
> 
> From Trulia about Austin RE market --
> 
> ...


You should visit the area and make an informed decision. Dubai is actually pretty good but in our decision (which I'll be able to tell in 6 months if it was good or bad), we had to make sure a lot of basic things were being met. Most importantly, education, lifestyle, access to cultural resources.

My sense (not based on any real data but just a gut sense) is that UAE marketplace at large is significantly behind in terms of making Information Security a priority. I am sure big companies are recruiting talent (after receiving 10000 apps for 1 position) but generally it doesn't have the regulatory mandates driving InfoSec jobs like in the US. Think GLBA, HIPAA, SOC reports etc.

However, you should ask your National friend to invest in you - make your own security consulting firm in the UAE. Now that might yield some dividends and contracts


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## fcjb1970 (Apr 30, 2010)

IMO, there is no way you can compare the quality of life in Austin, TX to the quality of life here, especially when it comes to kids (I won't even mention you cannot get a decent rib or BBQ brisket in this place). 

Unless they money is silly good, it is not worth consideration.


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## Canuck_Sens (Nov 16, 2010)

MikeATX said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I'm an Information Security Analyst located in Austin, TX for a large financial services corporation. A guy I work with is from UAE (his Dad is a National), and he's been telling me for a year now how amazing it is to work and live in UAE (AD in particular).
> 
> What I'm hoping to gleam from y'all is if it's really worth taking a job in the UAE?


Well, I cannot concur with my colleagues entirely on this one. I used to live in NY and Ottawa (Ontario). I had more quality of life back in Ottawa hands down. I used to pay a ridiculous amount in taxes. It would take me decades to pay off my mortgage. A 3 bedroom house in St Laurent in Ottawa could easily buy 2.5 houses in Austin based on the prices you just shared with us.

So I tend to believe that your current income is pretty good given the living costs in Austin. I may be wrong, though. I don't know how other price items are faring there. The US has been experiencing a pretty low inflation rate so I think Austin is still affordable place that is booming as new companies are moving there from the tech sector.

There is demand in your field in the UAE, but you need a degree. You may draw more, but UAE is an unstable place employment wise in my view. Today you are good and tomorrow you are gone.

If you believe you are well employed and believe that you folks have a decent standard and quality of life I would not recommend a change at this stage really. 

Otherwise yeah come over


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## XDoodlebugger (Jan 24, 2012)

fcjb1970 said:


> you cannot get a decent rib or BBQ brisket in this place).


McGettigans has a smoker like I have back in the US, it just sits there. I'm very tempted to steal it! 

Going through *REAL* BBQ withdrawal bad.


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## Tropicana (Apr 29, 2010)

MikeATX said:


> Admittedly roughly 100k goes pretty far in Austin, but you'd be surprised how expensive Austin has become over the last five years. The Great Recession didn't really affect Austin, and our housing market is CRAZY hot right now. Example -- in my zip code, 78737, homes sell for 98.2% of their listing price, on average. And I don't live in Austin proper! I'm just grateful we signed/built our house at what I believe was the bottom of the absolute market, spring/summer 2011. Since then, it's been crazy!!
> 
> From Trulia about Austin RE market --
> 
> ...


As someone who had the opportunity to buy in Austin or the DFW Metroplex 2 yeras back but passed it over, I know all about the "hot" market there; rub, salt, wound 

Austin, or Texas as a whole did feel more expensive when I was there last month but it compares nothing to housing and education costs over here. 
The fact that you have kids, both of whom will be entering school over the next 2 years should be a big -ve if considering a move here.


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