# Toll fines declared illegal



## siobhanwf (Mar 20, 2009)

A Braga court has in recent days issued a series of rulings in which all fines levied on motorists for failing to pay electronic motorway tolls have been declared null and void. Legal experts say these rulings will set a precedent for other disputes with motorists set to be on the winning side when challenged by the taxman over these fines, which can stretch into tens of thousands of euros.

Toll fines declared illegal - The Portugal News[/url
This comes hot on the heels of admitting that the toll gantries were a big mistake


http://algarvedailynews.com/news/4481-motorway-toll-gantries-were-a-huge-mistake


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## siobhanwf (Mar 20, 2009)

*LISBON bans pre 2000 cars*

Vehicles first registered before 2000 and 1996 are to be prohibited form parts of central Lisbon after 15 January working days from 07:00 to 21:00.


Lisbon bans pre-2000 cars - The Portugal News


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

siobhanwf said:


> Vehicles first registered before 2000 and 1996 are to be prohibited form parts of central Lisbon after 15 January working days from 07:00 to 21:00.
> 
> 
> Lisbon bans pre-2000 cars - The Portugal News


Bans pre 2000 registered cars with the exception of 'historic vehicles', *Travelling-man* can drive in with that gas-guzzling jeep of his!


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## siobhanwf (Mar 20, 2009)

And it is in a very tight area too. Av. liberdade and Baixa. but where is the invisible line?


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

siobhanwf said:


> A Braga court has in recent days issued a series of rulings in which all fines levied on motorists for failing to pay electronic motorway tolls have been declared null and void. Legal experts say these rulings will set a precedent for other disputes with motorists set to be on the winning side when challenged by the taxman over these fines, which can stretch into tens of thousands of euros.
> 
> Toll fines declared illegal - The Portugal News[/url
> This comes hot on the heels of admitting that the toll gantries were a big mistake
> ...




I would be careful resorting to the above ruling, unless you have deep pockets to employ a competent lawyer every time a fine has been issued.


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

siobhanwf said:


> A Braga court has in recent days issued a series of rulings in which all fines levied on motorists for failing to pay electronic motorway tolls have been declared null and void. Legal experts say these rulings will set a precedent for other disputes with motorists set to be on the winning side when challenged by the taxman over these fines, which can stretch into tens of thousands of euros.
> 
> Toll fines declared illegal - The Portugal News[/url
> This comes hot on the heels of admitting that the toll gantries were a big mistake
> ...





A couple of weeks ago I received a bill from Ascendi in the post, telling me to pay for two journeys I made in November. I had clean forgotten/didn't even know I'd done these journeys. This is the first time they've sent me a bill by post and I could see the admin costs added, which almost doubles the bill.

I emailed them and asked them to drop the admin costs, which are high: I explained that delay in paying is always down to bad memory, and they can see from my records that I try to pay on time, even contacting them when I forget. It's not like I'm trying to avoid paying, so why the fine?

They refused.

I had also asked if there was a way of registering my car number plate with their website so that I could keep an eye on the journeys I make, and help me remember to pay for them. They included in their reply a spiel about the benefits of the Via Verde electronic identification thingy.

I wrote back for clarification that the only way of keeping an eye on the journeys made is by buying a gadget costing almost 30 euros. They didn't say yes, they didn't say no, just repeated the spiel.

I had also asked for clarification about a couple of journeys I paid for that seemed very expensive, and today they've sent me a list of all the journeys I've made since 2011 and those where I didn't pay in time have indeed all been fined at 2.21 euros each. Each!

I had no idea I was paying fines all this time!

That's a heck of a lot of money just for being human and forgetting to pay on time. Absolutely ridiculous.

Basically it seems to me that the system has been set up so that it's easy for people to forget to pay on time, and then they can charge a lot of money for nothing.

Make a journey, can't pay for two days during which you have other things to do and so you forget, then only 5 days after that to get to the Post Office and pay. If they can wait to send me a letter 4 months after a journey to ask for the money, then why can't they allow a reasonable time for people to pay before adding a fine? And why such a high cost for a fine???

This is extortion, to my mind.

I have written back to ask who I can write to in authority about the toll road payment system. I intend to explain and complain.

Has anyone else managed to get off paying the admin costs? If so, how did you manage to do it?


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

If I paid just for the journeys outstanding minus the admin fees, would they try and take me to court? What if it went that far?


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## RichardHenshall (Jul 26, 2009)

Foradarede said:


> ... the only way of keeping an eye on the journeys made is by buying a gadget costing almost 30 euros. ...


The only way of making these journeys that incur toll charges is to buy a vehicle that costs much much more than 30€.

The electronic toll system was designed to work best with a transponder fitted to the vehicle. All the other payment methods (on time or late) incur extra work for the driver as well as the toll collector and some admin charges. It sounds like you make enough journeys (and are late paying for enough of them ) that it would be in your interests to set up a ViaVerde contract, which will avoid all these admin charges and remove the need for a good memory.


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

My car is a cheap second-hand job that I've been hoping/expecting to sell at any given moment - for the last year or so! I would prefer to cycle or use public transport but these are not feasible modes of transport for me at this time. I have been homeless for much longer than I was expecting, and need to be able to haul stuff around with me that I can't carry on a bike - not during all seasons anyway.

I try to avoid using toll roads, but there's been a few times where I've ended up on a toll road due to bad signage. At least a couple of times I've paid for journeys I had no intention of making - just ended up going the wrong way and paying for it.

Hence not wanting to buy an electronic thingy. I might have bought one in the first place if I'd known they saved money, but I never expected to make as many journeys as I've ended up making. 38 journeys since 2011.


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

That's 15 journeys that I paid late.

The first 9 late ones were because I didn't even know I had to pay a toll at all.

So that's really 6 journeys paid late once I was aware of having to pay toll road fees.

That's cost me over 33 euros just in fines, so yeah, if I'd known about the electronic thingy in the first place (I only found out about them about a year ago), I might have got one.

Hindsight eh?


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## RichardHenshall (Jul 26, 2009)

Foradarede said:


> ... Hindsight eh?


Isn't that part of what these forums are about? People sharing their past experiences (mistakes?) to help others avoid the same mistakes in the future.

I'm sorry I can't offer a better answer for your current situation.


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

RichardHenshall said:


> Isn't that part of what these forums are about? People sharing their past experiences (mistakes?) to help others avoid the same mistakes in the future.


Yep, that's partly why I wrote out my experience - so that others know that ignorance is not bliss. It's expensive.

Not only do those gadgets save you from forgetting and ending up with fines, they also save on the administrative costs of using the Post Office, which is a lot less than 2.21 euros, but still adds up.

If I'd had the wit to check this forum for toll roads a couple of years ago I might well have got the gadget back then.

What's frustrating about systems like the toll roads is that unless someone tells you how they work you have no idea what you're missing out on, or what you should know. I find this happening a lot. For example, it's illegal to swear aloud in public in the UK but it's not immediately obvious because many people swear aloud with no consequences, and what about the liberal swearing on TV?

We are all making mistakes (such as the one I've been explaining here), regularly simply because we don't know that we don't know.


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