# nra stimulus check



## crisvic (Jan 25, 2020)

Good morning. U.S. citizen married to a NRA spanish lady. Wife unexpectedly got a 1200$ check in the mail. She gets spousal benefits 4500$ a year. He files separately but shows wife,s name and SS nbr on his return. She does,t file. She lived the U.s. 4 years, from 1969 to 1973 and never return... She feels uncomfortable keeping the check and wants to return it. Do you think she,s entiteled to it, based to the above?..is there any procedure to follow to return the check...where should she mail it. IRS directly...U.S. Embassy? Thanks so much


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

She's entitled to it. She is now the 4th NRA drawing US SS I know of who has received one of those checks. Cash it in good health and spend it on something that makes her happy.

Getting it cashed may be tricky. If none of the local banks will process it (for a rather steep fee), you can endorse it to a friend or family member in the US (or with a US bank account) and have them send you the proceeds (using Transferwise or a similar service). That's what we're doing with my husband's $1200 check.


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## crisvic (Jan 25, 2020)

*stimulus check*



Bevdeforges said:


> She's entitled to it. She is now the 4th NRA drawing US SS I know of who has received one of those checks. Cash it in good health and spend it on something that makes her happy.
> 
> Getting it cashed may be tricky. If none of the local banks will process it (for a rather steep fee), you can endorse it to a friend or family member in the US (or with a US bank account) and have them send you the proceeds (using Transferwise or a similar service). That's what we're doing with my husband's $1200 check.



She,s afraid that by accepting the check she might be obliged to file taxes, Fatca and so on...


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## crisvic (Jan 25, 2020)

She,s afraid that by accepting the check she might be obliged to file taxes, Fatca and so on...


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

crisvic said:


> She,s afraid that by accepting the check she might be obliged to file taxes, Fatca and so on...


No, she won't be. If she's receiving US SS, they're already withholding the 30% NRA tax rate. There is no further obligation.

I don't know why they did it this way, but they chose to distribute checks to everyone who filed taxes in 2018 or 2019 as a US tax resident AND to anyone drawing Social Security benefits who hasn't filed taxes, which includes NRAs receiving SS benefits, including those receiving "spouse benefits" even if they never lived or worked in the US.

Seriously, cash the check and spend it in good health.


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

I've seen reports this past week of Canadians who renounced citizenship back in 2013, and who presumably don't receive Social Security, receiving the stimulus benefit. Sounds like they're sending it to everyone on the books.


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Nononymous said:


> I've seen reports this past week of Canadians who renounced citizenship back in 2013, and who presumably don't receive Social Security, receiving the stimulus benefit. Sounds like they're sending it to everyone on the books.


Why do you presume that they don't receive Social Security, though? You really don't have to be a citizen to receive your SS benefits even outside the country.


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

Bevdeforges said:


> Why do you presume that they don't receive Social Security, though? You really don't have to be a citizen to receive your SS benefits even outside the country.


I could well be wrong, but I think in at least one case the person involved left the US as a child and would not be collecting SS.


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Nononymous said:


> I could well be wrong, but I think in at least one case the person involved left the US as a child and would not be collecting SS.


I know a friend of mine who left the US as a child and who has no claims on SS benefits got a check - because she "just happened" to have gone "Streamlined" a couple years ago and is maintaining her filings (despite owing nothing). 

In any event, I really don't think the folks who wrote the bill that authorized these payments have the foggiest idea who they are paying, and that's just fine by me. Cash it quick and spend it in good health. (And figure that it means those who wish to renounce or who have already renounced just got a 50% rebate on the cost of that little transaction.)


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

Bevdeforges said:


> I know a friend of mine who left the US as a child and who has no claims on SS benefits got a check - because she "just happened" to have gone "Streamlined" a couple years ago and is maintaining her filings (despite owing nothing).


This is as designed. Anyone who filed for 2018 or 2019 (even if they are dead or renounced by 2020) who meets the income criteria (AGI < $75k) receives the stimulus benefit. If dead or renounced they are encouraged to return the money. 

What would be interesting is if someone who (1) renounced a while ago and hasn't filed after in the past two years and (2) does not receive SS were to receive a cheque. That is definitely broken.


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

> If dead or renounced they are encouraged to return the money.


Who is encouraging them and by what means?


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Just found this on the IRS Q&A page regarding the stimulus payment - in response to the question about what to do if you received a payment but are no longer eligible for one:



> . No, there is no provision in the law that would require individuals who qualify for a Payment based on their 2018 or 2019 tax returns, to pay back all or part of the payment, if based on the information reported on their 2020 tax returns, they no longer qualify for that amount or would qualify for a lesser amount.


For more information take a look here https://www.irs.gov/coronavirus/economic-impact-payment-information-center

and go to Q70.


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

Q66 & Q67 describe in great detail the mechanism for returning the payments, without setting out the circumstances in which one might be expected to do so. 

Q70 seems more about what to do if one met the income or dependent criteria in 2018 or 2019 and received the payment, but no longer meets the criteria in 2020. 

I don't have a source at hand but from past reading I do believe that being dead makes one ineligible for the stimulus benefit, and there are instructions somewhere for family members of the deceased to return the money. Similarly, tax advisor types are telling former citizens who renounced after filing for 2018 or 2019 to not cash the cheque. 

Whether the US government is capable of following up to recover any ill-gotten gains is of course an open question.

PS on edit: Q11 & Q12 include detailed instructions for the deceased.


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Though I do think it's probably safe to assume that if


> there is no provision in the law that would require individuals who qualify for a Payment based on their 2018 or 2019 tax returns, to pay back all or part of the payment, if based on the information reported on their 2020 tax returns, they no longer qualify for that amount or would qualify for a lesser amount.


there is probably no provision in the law to require anyone who receives a payment for any reason to pay back "all or part of the payment." 

And, as you say,


> Whether the US government is capable of following up to recover any ill-gotten gains is of course an open question.


However, in any case, the first step might be for the IRS to contact those who weren't entitled to the payments and explain the situation. And we all know how likely that is to happen....


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