# A sign of feelings to come?



## King.Tut

I was reading another forum earlier today and came across this post from a disgruntled Egyptian.

_"First they immigrate to Egypt (especially females), then they get Egyptian boy friend/girl friend or they may even marry Egyptian man/woman.
Stay away of our Egypt...You have been taking our own deserved opportunities for years due to corrupted regime/government.
Now it is finished, finished, finished…
We have our qualified men, women, boys and girls who are not employed for years after graduation…
Can't you see, respect and recognize that our revolution was done for poor, starving, unemployed people. We are fed of corruption, and employing foreigners instead of qualified Egyptians was one of the signs of this corruption. And, foreigners at the end get married to Egyptians who consequently leave millions of Egyptian girls unmarried"_

I'm just wondering if you think this is a sign of how many Egyptians feel towards expats living and working here and those who are married to Egyptians? Is this a sign of feelings to come after the revolution? Should we be concerned? This is the first such post I have read myself but I'm wondering if this sort of opinion is going to quickly become a problem for expats?

Thoughts?


----------



## MaidenScotland

Omg dont tell me millions came here on holiday and ended up marrying a waiter.


----------



## MaidenScotland

King.Tut said:


> I was reading another forum earlier today and came across this post from a disgruntled Egyptian.
> 
> _"First they immigrate to Egypt (especially females), then they get Egyptian boy friend/girl friend or they may even marry Egyptian man/woman.
> Stay away of our Egypt...You have been taking our own deserved opportunities for years due to corrupted regime/government.
> Now it is finished, finished, finished…
> We have our qualified men, women, boys and girls who are not employed for years after graduation…
> Can't you see, respect and recognize that our revolution was done for poor, starving, unemployed people. We are fed of corruption, and employing foreigners instead of qualified Egyptians was one of the signs of this corruption. And, foreigners at the end get married to Egyptians who consequently leave millions of Egyptian girls unmarried"_
> 
> I'm just wondering if you think this is a sign of how many Egyptians feel towards expats living and working here and those who are married to Egyptians? Is this a sign of feelings to come after the revolution? Should we be concerned? This is the first such post I have read myself but I'm wondering if this sort of opinion is going to quickly become a problem for expats?
> 
> Thoughts?




On a serious not.... this is typical of people all over the world who will not take responsibility for anything and blame it on everyone else.

Unemployment... in the scale of things there are not that many expat with high flying jobs here and those that have live from contract to contract and once again Egyptians have qualifications on paper that are worth nothing and think they do not have to join a firm at entry level because they have a certificate.

It always amazes me when people say they cant afford to get married... that is not the expats fault it is the cultures fault, gold, apartments, gifts etc all to be found before the marriage.. I got married on exactly 25 pound sterling... and furnished my house bit by bit and often with second hand furniture and throw aways from other people. 

Now they are ridden of Mubarak they must find someone else to blame, but no I don't think this is how the majority thinks, it sounds to me like a girl who got dumped by her boyfriend for an expat.


----------



## King.Tut

MaidenScotland said:


> Omg dont tell me millions came here on holiday and ended up marrying a waiter.


:rofl:

Well I could show you some places here in Sharm where's there are some young Egyptians boys with their 70 year old Russian wife! Not to mention those British men who leave their wives and kids and come over looking for a young piece of skirt! :eyebrows:

I was more referring though to the persons rant about employment. Do you think working expats are likely to get a bit of backlash now with the change of power?


----------



## Horus

King.Tut said:


> :rofl:
> 
> Not to mention those British men who leave their wives and kids and come over looking for a young piece of skirt! :eyebrows:
> QUOTE]
> 
> I think the majority of Egyptian's welcome us and see us as walking ATM machines
> 
> Actually I am not British and when I least expect it the young piece of skirt clung around mutton dressed as lamb comes looking for me and most of time the skirt or lycra clings to the body in a rather unflattering and embarrassing manner...well until until I put my Sakara specs on.. :eyebrows:


----------



## MaidenScotland

King.Tut said:


> :rofl:
> 
> Well I could show you some places here in Sharm where's there are some young Egyptians boys with their 70 year old Russian wife! Not to mention those British men who leave their wives and kids and come over looking for a young piece of skirt! :eyebrows:
> 
> I was more referring though to the persons rant about employment. Do you think working expats are likely to get a bit of backlash now with the change of power?




IMO yes they will but only from a minority and that minority are the ones that can't see the wood for the trees, lets face it if a local person could do our job they would already be employed and doing it.. some just wont face up to facts.
There are expats in every country doing a job that someone thinks they should be doing.


----------



## King.Tut

Horus...that wasn't aimed at you so don't take it personally. It wasn't aimed at anyone in particular just a general observation from my time living in Sharm.


----------



## bat

King.Tut said:


> :rofl:
> 
> Well I could show you some places here in Sharm where's there are some young Egyptians boys with their 70 year old Russian wife! Not to mention those British men who leave their wives and kids and come over looking for a young piece of skirt! :eyebrows:
> 
> I was more referring though to the persons rant about employment. Do you think working expats are likely to get a bit of backlash now with the change of power?


this kind of thinking has been around for as long as ive been here ( over 20 yrs)
why do they come take our men ,our jobs, etc,
the problem now is with this new found freedom, what way are they going to use it .
before it was the odd incident,i would come across, but as i said before people were beginning to be more vocal ( before all of this kicked off)
i think there could be,and one way to contain it would be to make checks on work visas, how many here are legally entitled to work.
as much as i dont like to think about it the possibility it could be a reality.


----------



## Sonrisa

I am certain that there are also lots of foreingn companies in Egypt that would be thrilled to employ more local staff and local managment should their standards and productivity not be compromised by doing so. After all most companies are looking to cut costs these days and bringing expatriates is rather expensive.

Problem is finding reliable, accountable, results orientated local managment is almost imposible. Hence they bring the foreigners.


----------



## kevinthegulf

Very true, as an expat you are not employed by senior corporate management because of who you are, you are employed because of what you do- you get the job done. Your higher costs are repaid many times over.

If you could be replaced by a local and the same results achieved at lower cost- this would be done in a flash. 
There is no loyalty to you because you may be from the same country (just look how British companies move there operations overseas if they can to exploit cheap labour)

Simply the local content is not up to the job (in most cases) however I have found that there is a professional arrogance here (completely unjustified, but nobody here has ever made a mistake, they are all perfect, no one has ever said sorry i made a mistake), and I can well imagine that there will be a rise in resentment, the unwelcome truth is we are needed, but that will be overlooked in their minds just as any mistakes made are overlooked, its allways someone elses fault.
Kev


----------



## bat

kevinthegulf said:


> Very true, as an expat you are not employed by senior corporate management because of who you are, you are employed because of what you do- you get the job done. Your higher costs are repaid many times over.
> 
> If you could be replaced by a local and the same results achieved at lower cost- this would be done in a flash.
> There is no loyalty to you because you may be from the same country (just look how British companies move there operations overseas if they can to exploit cheap labour)
> 
> Simply the local content is not up to the job (in most cases) however I have found that there is a professional arrogance here (completely unjustified, but nobody here has ever made a mistake, they are all perfect, no one has ever said sorry i made a mistake), and I can well imagine that there will be a rise in resentment, the unwelcome truth is we are needed, but that will be overlooked in their minds just as any mistakes made are overlooked, its allways someone elses fault.
> Kev


agree with all above,
and also think its on the cards,and once the ball starts rolling in that direction im afraid theres no stoppiong it.they will make legislation and then its bye bye to the foreigners
the fact that they are important will not make a difference im afraid.


----------



## Eco-Mariner

Even if they don't need our expertise or training skills, Egypt still needs our investments and trading partners.

I'm fortunate in that Egypt will still rely on tourism. 8% of its GDP is from foreign tourists and subsidiary developments. I've never heared the word sorry in 25 years but without our promotions, any new administrations will feel sorry for not working with us in the future.

It will not be how important they are in the new mix, but how it affects their pockets in a more free market.... To most Egyptian businessmen, money is King.


----------



## wales1970

We hear the same here in the uk,"eastern europeans coming over taking our jobs"..but its usually the jobs that the people that are complaing wont do,and for under the min wage,even more so now that benifits are being cut.


King.Tut said:


> I was reading another forum earlier today and came across this post from a disgruntled Egyptian.
> 
> _"First they immigrate to Egypt (especially females), then they get Egyptian boy friend/girl friend or they may even marry Egyptian man/woman.
> Stay away of our Egypt...You have been taking our own deserved opportunities for years due to corrupted regime/government.
> Now it is finished, finished, finished…
> We have our qualified men, women, boys and girls who are not employed for years after graduation…
> Can't you see, respect and recognize that our revolution was done for poor, starving, unemployed people. We are fed of corruption, and employing foreigners instead of qualified Egyptians was one of the signs of this corruption. And, foreigners at the end get married to Egyptians who consequently leave millions of Egyptian girls unmarried"_
> 
> I'm just wondering if you think this is a sign of how many Egyptians feel towards expats living and working here and those who are married to Egyptians? Is this a sign of feelings to come after the revolution? Should we be concerned? This is the first such post I have read myself but I'm wondering if this sort of opinion is going to quickly become a problem for expats?
> 
> Thoughts?


----------



## Eco-Mariner

The tough restrictions and regulations put on new companies wanting to do business in Egypt was always the stumbling block. 

My company would love to expand, but the authorities want part of the action (under the old regime.) I now look forward to more transpancy and openness towards forign investors so I can hire the talented youth who wish to work with me... Rather than the ones forced on me by the NDP "system."


----------



## madgiz

Horus said:


> when I least expect it the young piece of skirt clung around mutton dressed as lamb comes looking for me and most of time the skirt or lycra clings to the body in a rather unflattering and embarrassing manner...well until until I put my Sakara specs on.. :eyebrows:


Hi Horus
I wonder have you considered that the world isn't quite as shallow a place as the one that you live in and that all mutton (as you say) regardless of how they are dressed are still people with feelings. TBH if you were to let your defences down you would find they probably have a lot more interesting things to talk about than the people that you appear to want to surround your self with.. I can see how you may feel out of your depth unless drunk..


----------



## marimar

I think this "bad feeling" was started from a group of dive masters and instructors who got together to try and change some of the aspects of their profession here in Sharm, unfortunately most of them have not been working too much recently and now after the recent events have found the ideal excuse for their lack of work (not the fact that they have attitude problems or are just not professional and good at their jobs!!!) they can blame the foreigners!!!!
I don't think its a majority feeling and hopefully these people will realise that blatant racism isn't going to improve their work status.


----------



## DeadGuy

King.Tut said:


> I was reading another forum earlier today and came across this post from a disgruntled Egyptian.
> 
> _"First they immigrate to Egypt (especially females), then they get Egyptian boy friend/girl friend or they may even marry Egyptian man/woman.
> Stay away of our Egypt...You have been taking our own deserved opportunities for years due to corrupted regime/government.
> Now it is finished, finished, finished…
> We have our qualified men, women, boys and girls who are not employed for years after graduation…
> Can't you see, respect and recognize that our revolution was done for poor, starving, unemployed people. We are fed of corruption, and employing foreigners instead of qualified Egyptians was one of the signs of this corruption. And, foreigners at the end get married to Egyptians who consequently leave millions of Egyptian girls unmarried"_
> 
> I'm just wondering if you think this is a sign of how many Egyptians feel towards expats living and working here and those who are married to Egyptians? Is this a sign of feelings to come after the revolution? Should we be concerned? This is the first such post I have read myself but I'm wondering if this sort of opinion is going to quickly become a problem for expats?
> 
> Thoughts?


This is what some “people” are trying to pump into the population’s mind now, it’s not about “foreigners” as you may think, you can’t see many people complaining about the Arabs in Egypt as much as they complain about “Westerners” can you?! 

This is one of the "side effects" of providing “freedom” of speech to people who don't really understand what does it mean to have the freedom of speech!!! Some people will abuse it and start throwing lies and BS, and some will abuse themselves and believe whatever [email protected] they hear


----------



## aykalam

DeadGuy said:


> This is what some “people” are trying to pump into the population’s mind now, it’s not about “foreigners” as you may think, you can’t see many people complaining about the Arabs in Egypt as much as they complain about “Westerners” can you?!
> 
> This is one of the "side effects" of providing “freedom” of speech to people who don't really understand what does it mean to have the freedom of speech!!! Some people will abuse it and start throwing lies and BS, and some will abuse themselves and believe whatever [email protected] they hear


:clap2::clap2::clap2:

A fine example of BS today

http://www.almasryalyoum.com/en/news/muslim-brotherhood-copts-and-women-unsuitable-presidency


----------



## egyptiansun

It was probably written in anger, but has a valid point regarding employments. It's not fair for me to make more than a native with same skill and training. Right?

Just Like its not fair for a foreigner to pay more for a hotel room, among other things, than a native. Right?

Expats have a responsibility to their hosts, their faith, ideals, and future.

Peace


----------



## DeadGuy

aykalam said:


> :clap2::clap2::clap2:
> 
> A fine example of BS today
> 
> http://www.almasryalyoum.com/en/news/muslim-brotherhood-copts-and-women-unsuitable-presidency





> “Political parties have the right to nominate women or Copts for the presidency,” said Muslim Brotherhood leading figure Mohsen Radi. “But we find it unsuitable. Perhaps they should be nominated only for ministerial positions.”


Yup, I saw this one yesterday when it was published, basically what he's trying to say is that anyone got the right to be nominated, but only the ones "they" think "suitable" should be nominated!! I can only wonder what kinda contradicting [email protected] was that!! 

I wonder how feels when he finds a "woman" driving a car, or a "copt" having lunch! "_They can do it, but it's not suitable, the "woman" should stay home, and the "copt" should be grateful we let him feel hungry_" I bet 

Such a "mentality" should be squashed just like an insect! It's a shame that they keep crying about "Democracy" and "how deep democracy is in the beliefs of Islam" all the bloody time but all they really mean is a "democracy" that would make ONLY them to be the "suitable" ones for everything, including telling others what's "suitable" or not!!!! Makes me wanna uke:


----------



## egyptiansun

I personally don't agree, but ever person has a right to their opinion. Democracy gives this right.

Fair voting will elect by majority. If the majority don't want a woman president they won't vote for one.

BS comes from many sources including here, but you gotta stick to your guns. Democracy.....


----------



## MaidenScotland

egyptiansun said:


> It was probably written in anger, but has a valid point regarding employments. It's not fair for me to make more than a native with same skill and training. Right?
> 
> Just Like its not fair for a foreigner to pay more for a hotel room, among other things, than a native. Right?
> 
> Expats have a responsibility to their hosts, their faith, ideals, and future.
> 
> Peace




Sorry but I dont have a responsibility to anyone's faith but my own


----------



## egyptiansun

So tempting men with a short skirt near a mosque with bosoms almost out around noon at Friday prayer is appropriate?

Or would it be better to respect your hosts faith?

No offense.


----------



## MaidenScotland

egyptiansun said:


> So tempting men with a short skirt near a mosque with bosoms almost out around noon at Friday prayer is appropriate?
> 
> Or would it be better to respect your hosts faith?
> 
> No offense.




Well you have offended me... why would you automatically assume I would wear a short skirt and have my bosoms out at any time? 

Is it because you presume I am white, western and Christian?

You didn't say respect you said responsibility..
.


----------



## egyptiansun

Respect and responsibility go hand in hand.

Especially when your a guest.

One still has a responsibility even if one doesnt respect the peoples faith, for example. Otherwise safety becomes more of a concern.


----------



## MaidenScotland

egyptiansun said:


> Respect and responsibility go hand in hand.
> 
> Especially when your a guest.
> 
> One still has a responsibility even if one doesnt respect the peoples faith, for example. Otherwise safety becomes more of a concern.





I respect everyone right to have faith, however I do not take responsibility for their faith.

I take responsibility for my actions.

Perhaps these great people of faith should also be responsible for their actions?


And as someone who lives in Egypt I can tell you that it doesn't matter what you wear here the men still grope you...


----------



## bat

egyptiansun said:


> It was probably written in anger, but has a valid point regarding employments. It's not fair for me to make more than a native with same skill and training. Right?
> 
> Just Like its not fair for a foreigner to pay more for a hotel room, among other things, than a native. Right?
> 
> Expats have a responsibility to their hosts, their faith, ideals, and future.
> 
> Peace


thats the point,egyptians dont have the the skill or the training ,as a foreigner.
they cant afford the hotel rooms at egyptian rate never mind foreign rate,resident expats have egyptian rate and all inclusive holidays are cheaper from abroad then the prices id pay as expat.
i also dont have any responsibility for any ones faith ideals or future except my own.
you will also find that most woman( though why they are singled out ive no idea)
have more respect for themselves than that when in this country.its the egyptian men who are disrespectful to woman as foreigners,what ever there age.
bat


----------



## DeadGuy

egyptiansun said:


> So *tempting *men with a short skirt *near *a mosque with bosoms almost out around noon at Friday prayer is appropriate?
> 
> Or would it be better to respect your hosts faith?
> 
> No offense.


See you made me really confused in here whoever you are, and I'd really appreciate it if you could define both "*tempting*" and "*near*" in your post, "tempting" as walking in a public street wearing something that's sold for people to wear when they're OUT?! And "near" as INSIDE the mosque?! Or "near" as in 20 miles around the mosque?! :confused2:

Oh, no offense either, I'm just confused in here


----------



## DeadGuy

egyptiansun said:


> Respect and responsibility go hand in hand.
> 
> Especially when your a guest.
> 
> One still has a responsibility even if one doesnt respect the peoples faith, for example. *Otherwise safety becomes more of a concern.*


Well both respect and responsibility need to be *MUTUAL* don't you think?! If I can't respect others, then I shouldn't expect them to "Respect" me........Or should I?! 

And the word "guest".........Those "guests" DO pay for what they get don't they?! I mean I'd never pay for the coffee a friend of mine offers me when I'm in HIS place with me being a "guest" 

And that last "comment" of yours........I won't even go there, all I'm gonna say is that I deal with such mentalities on a daily basis, so enjoy being yourself


----------



## txlstewart

egyptiansun said:


> So tempting men with a short skirt near a mosque with bosoms almost out around noon at Friday prayer is appropriate?
> 
> Or would it be better to respect your hosts faith?
> 
> No offense.


I don't dress that way anywhere, whether it be in the United States or in Egypt. I don't get harrassed anywhere but in Egypt.

I have also seen Muslim women in their 20s dress the way you describe--I wonder what would you say to them?

I also have friends who are veiled (and married) who have lived in the US before. One said it was the ONLY time in her life that she felt as if she were treated as a "human being."

(Most) Egyptian men demean all women, regardless of their attire or their faith or their nationality.


----------



## egyptiansun

You are taking this directed to you. I don't know you. It was a good example. Right?

A man who touches a woman should be arrested and tried. There is a root cause that should be tackled. Justice should be done.

Expats are citizens of Earth. Citizens have responsibilities to their fellow citizens. You cannot run from responsibilities.

Empower your fellow man with knowledge and training.

You have never dealt with someone like me. The old ways of thinking are done. The age of responsibility has begun. We, including yourself, should stamp out injustice. Injustice is the only source of extremism.


----------



## MaidenScotland

egyptiansun said:


> So tempting men with a short skirt near a mosque with bosoms almost out around noon at Friday prayer is appropriate?
> 
> Or would it be better to respect your hosts faith?
> 
> No offense.




Strange how this comment is for women but yet it is not directed at us


----------



## DeadGuy

egyptiansun said:


> You are taking this directed to you. I don't know you. It was a good example. Right?
> 
> A man who touches a woman should be arrested and tried. There is a root cause that should be tackled. Justice should be done.
> 
> Expats are citizens of Earth. Citizens have responsibilities to their fellow citizens. You cannot run from responsibilities.
> 
> Empower your fellow man with knowledge and training.
> 
> You have never dealt with someone like me. The old ways of thinking are done. The age of responsibility has begun. We, including yourself, should stamp out injustice. Injustice is the only source of extremism.


Direct to me?! Trust me I’m the last one that could put a “skirt” of any kind on! :lol:

A man who touches a woman should be arrested and “tried”?! Now when you first mentioned it you never said anything about “touching” have you?! What you said, and I’ll quote, was:


egyptiansun said:


> So tempting men with a short skirt near a mosque with bosoms almost out around noon at Friday prayer is appropriate?


?! All I said was that I was confused, asked for a clear definition for a couple of words that you said! But you just made me more confused in here  

What “responsibility” is it?! The responsibility of reading weirdos’ minds and decided what would be “Tempting” for them or not?!

Knowledge and training?! And who's gonna be the source of that great knowledge?! Or how the "training" process should be done? And by who? I'm open for any suggestions 

And the "mentalities" that connect “faith” with safety?! Trust me I deal with that on a daily basis! 

The age of responsibility has begun?! Perhaps the "person" who said that a "woman" or a "copt" shouldn't be a president should've thought about his responsibility first, or his statement was "justice" somehow?!


----------



## DeadGuy

MaidenScotland said:


> Strange how this comment is for women but yet it is not directed at us


Strange?! For you maybe........I see this "technique" of "argument" every bloody day........"_Nooooooo, it's not what you think I meant_"


----------

