# Depressives and OCD sufferers in Spain



## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

Guess I will do some "outing" here and I don't see any reason to be ashamed for it anyway... I have suffered from depressions since I was a child and have been diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder and a severe anxiety disorder/OCD (or in Spanish: trastorno obsessivo-compulsivo). These all predate my moving around, so this is not location-bound, I have had it since childhood and the fact that I am here in Spain chasing my dreams of seeing the world proves that I prefer to chase my dreams and make most of life (despite the difficulties) rather than to drown in self-pity.


Lately I have been wanting to reach out to others who have anxiety disorders and/or depressions. I experienced in one of my previous home countries that contact with other sufferers can be very enlighting: first of all a friendship can be formed in a special way because of a mutual understanding. Secondly you can learn a lot from the survival techniques of others, how they cope with it, you can learn from that and sometimes discover techniques that are handy for your own life as well. Last but not least I have been giving speeches in front of students about the subject of living with these conditions and seeing how others sometimes get some help from your own actions can give a very good feeling, you're offering one a helping hand but at the same time you're also helping out yourself as well. It can be quite therapeutic.

Note I am not looking for a self-aid group or so, just wondering if there is any way to get in touch with others who deal with depression or TOC. In some countries such societies exist that organise get-togethers, events etc. Language may be a barrier but then the odds that some folks speak some English or French are not that unrealistic


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

gerrit said:


> Guess I will do some "outing" here and I don't see any reason to be ashamed for it anyway... I have suffered from depressions since I was a child and have been diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder and a severe anxiety disorder/OCD (or in Spanish: trastorno obsessivo-compulsivo). These all predate my moving around, so this is not location-bound, I have had it since childhood and the fact that I am here in Spain chasing my dreams of seeing the world proves that I prefer to chase my dreams and make most of life (despite the difficulties) rather than to drown in self-pity.
> 
> 
> Lately I have been wanting to reach out to others who have anxiety disorders and/or depressions. I experienced in one of my previous home countries that contact with other sufferers can be very enlighting: first of all a friendship can be formed in a special way because of a mutual understanding. Secondly you can learn a lot from the survival techniques of others, how they cope with it, you can learn from that and sometimes discover techniques that are handy for your own life as well. Last but not least I have been giving speeches in front of students about the subject of living with these conditions and seeing how others sometimes get some help from your own actions can give a very good feeling, you're offering one a helping hand but at the same time you're also helping out yourself as well. It can be quite therapeutic.
> ...


Well either nobody's "outing" or nobody suffers from depression, OCD etc...
Anyway, I like your positive outlook (nothing to be ashamed of, somebody will speak English or French etc...), but don't really have any info that will be useful to you. There's this link which you've probably found for youself...
Webtoc
And my only other advice would be to get in touch with the organisations for each of the specific disorders ie autism, depression etc and write them an email saying exactly what you have said here. Or get in touch with the organisations that you know in Belgium or UK and ask if they know anything about Spain.
Hope you find smth!


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

Unfortunately I believe depression is something that is more and more prevalent these days. To be honest I also think moving to a new country with different language can have an effect as well.

In fact due to some recent research I discovered that it was around a lot even going back to the late 50's. This was quite often due to post natal depression, because they didn't have any positive way of recognising it or treating it then.

Thanks for sharing that Gerrit ... I wish I could help. I'm not sure offhand where you are, but see if you have a local HELP group nearby. These are groups of volunteers that seek to help expats re medical and other matters. I know there is one in Denia and I think Alicante, and maybe they will be able to put you in touch with such groups as you require

HELP DENIA


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## Caz.I (Mar 21, 2009)

Hi Gerrit,
Yes I think depending on where you are, you could try local expat groups - ie at the back of the Sur in English there is a list of Clubs and organisations and there is a group called Recovery International that meets up to discuss mental health issues. So if you have any English language newspapers in your area, you could try putting a classified ad in to meet up with others? Or enquire at the town hall. I may be wrong but I get the impression that in Spain it's quite a taboo subject.


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## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

Stravinsky said:


> Unfortunately I believe depression is something that is more and more prevalent these days. To be honest I also think moving to a new country with different language can have an effect as well.
> 
> In fact due to some recent research I discovered that it was around a lot even going back to the late 50's. This was quite often due to post natal depression, because they didn't have any positive way of recognising it or treating it then.
> 
> ...


I am in Catalunya. So any such organisation in Barcelona, Tarragona, Girona, Manresa ... would do. I don't mind a bit of train/bus driving 



And trust me, the taboo is everywhere, not just in Spain. I speak very openly about it but then I would consider myself an autism rights activist and one who is very motivated to raise awareness about these issues. I mean, someone has to stand on the barricades there and educate people, only then people will realise the needs of those with these disorders. The wall of taboo has to be broken until not a brick is standing ; unfortunately coming out to have a psychological problem is still a huge step for many. It also has to do with lack of awareness. Everyone knows what most physical diseases are and will be compassionate and helpful, if you however say that you have anxiety disorder or depression some will just totally not understand and stay at distance ...


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## Guest (Apr 15, 2010)

gerrit said:


> I am in Catalunya. So any such organisation in Barcelona, Tarragona, Girona, Manresa ... would do. I don't mind a bit of train/bus driving
> 
> 
> 
> And trust me, the taboo is everywhere, not just in Spain. I speak very openly about it but then I would consider myself an autism rights activist and one who is very motivated to raise awareness about these issues. I mean, someone has to stand on the barricades there and educate people, only then people will realise the needs of those with these disorders. The wall of taboo has to be broken until not a brick is standing ; unfortunately coming out to have a psychological problem is still a huge step for many. It also has to do with lack of awareness. Everyone knows what most physical diseases are and will be compassionate and helpful, if you however say that you have anxiety disorder or depression some will just totally not understand and stay at distance ...


Hi,

I would just like to wish you luck in finding what you are looking for. I have a grandson who has aspergers and various other related problems and I know how hard it is when people don't understand. I wish I lived near to you so that I could help you educate people as that is what is needed. I find that even teachers who are supposed to be trained in special needs really have no idea and expect these children to conform. My grandson who is 14 has been trained to walk away from any confrontational situations and then was recently threatened with suspension because he did just that and was accused of being rude. Sometimes you just can't win. Having said that he is doing a sponsored government science course as he is more advanced than his science teacher and gets bored with his lessons.


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## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

Thanks for the kind words. BTW you don't necessarily need to be near me to help ; if you know any university or organisation that accepts guest speakers about life with psychological disabilities, then please do tell me about it. 

Guess I will check the Webtoc ... Pity I need that dodgy Google Translator for such sites as my Spanish is still not good enough to join discussion forums without help. I thought of putting an advert about meeting other depressives and TOC sufferers via sites such as loquo.com but the amount of fake and dodgy advertisements (especially in the housing and socialising categories) tells me to better not do it ; my advert would maybe not be taken seriously or people without serious intentions may react. I'll better stick to searching via more trustworthy sources, more shielded organisations and sites where there may be less visitors but where all visitors do have a sincere connection with issues such as depression and OCD.


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## Guest (Apr 20, 2010)

Have you joined the "Think Autism" group, there are over a million members on facebook all trying to raise awareness


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

gerrit said:


> Guess I will do some "outing" here and I don't see any reason to be ashamed for it anyway... I have suffered from depressions since I was a child and have been diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder and a severe anxiety disorder/OCD (or in Spanish: trastorno obsessivo-compulsivo). These all predate my moving around, so this is not location-bound, I have had it since childhood and the fact that I am here in Spain chasing my dreams of seeing the world proves that I prefer to chase my dreams and make most of life (despite the difficulties) rather than to drown in self-pity.
> 
> 
> Lately I have been wanting to reach out to others who have anxiety disorders and/or depressions. I experienced in one of my previous home countries that contact with other sufferers can be very enlighting: first of all a friendship can be formed in a special way because of a mutual understanding. Secondly you can learn a lot from the survival techniques of others, how they cope with it, you can learn from that and sometimes discover techniques that are handy for your own life as well. Last but not least I have been giving speeches in front of students about the subject of living with these conditions and seeing how others sometimes get some help from your own actions can give a very good feeling, you're offering one a helping hand but at the same time you're also helping out yourself as well. It can be quite therapeutic.
> ...


Unfortunately, most forms of depression are met by the hopeless suggestion "Just snap out of it". I don't know if you've come across such unhelpful attitudes but we have. My wife has suffered from a form of OCD which leads to panic attacks and severe anxiety. We have dealt with it for 10 years now and for most of the time we cope well. She has found a good medication that works for her (SSRI) and also an excellent book which I will name here - I'm not advertising since I get nothing from it, of course, but if there are any silent sufferers on here then they would most definitely benefit from buying it. It's called Brain Lock, by Jeffrey M Schwartz MD ISBN 0060987111. It teaches a form of self help that is proven to work and it has been my wife's lifesaver. If you ever want to chat please feel free. I am not a sufferer (thankfully) but having lived with someone for a decade who is I have a pretty good idea how to say helpful things without ever giving reassurance (something that is an absolute no no for OCD sufferers). Excellent post. Many thanks.


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## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

I too have often come across answers such as "Depression is just a fashion", "depression is a choice of those not willing to just change their attitude" and similar answers that just expose a total lack of knowledge and meanwhile impose further stigma upon the sufferers and increase the taboo. I must say that such attitudes do motivate me to continue writing and speeching to raise awareness, I guess it is a good motivator although I wish there was no need for it and that people would be better educated about OCD, depressions etc. Unfortunately the need for raising awareness is still high as ignorance is still widespread. I try to contribute in my own way to raise that awareness.

It is somewhat odd coincidence that you say reassurance is a NO for sufferers. Only two days ago I went to register my latest writings and I had already doublechecked for eventual errors 4 times. I asked my psychologist if I should maybe make a copy so that I could later on re-read it all and be convinced there were really no mistakes. Obviously she said even more doublechecking was not very wise and she printed a paper for me saying "I have controlled and I have not made any mistakes, I don't need further controlling". I have put that paper in my wallet to re-read it whenever needed.  Although I must say my psychologist and my few close friends/relatives must have extremely well-trained nerves because I know that, like many OCD sufferers, I can be a pain in asking re-assurance all the time. I often also read stuff such as "lights switched off" on my arm so that if I'd doubt about it I can control the urge to turn around and re-enter the house to doublecheck. 

Good to hear that your wife is coping relatively well with it. I am on Seroxat and Seroquel myself, with Xanax in addition. Especially Xanax has been a lifesaver for me on many occasions.


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

gerrit said:


> I too have often come across answers such as "Depression is just a fashion", "depression is a choice of those not willing to just change their attitude" and similar answers that just expose a total lack of knowledge and meanwhile impose further stigma upon the sufferers and increase the taboo. I must say that such attitudes do motivate me to continue writing and speeching to raise awareness, I guess it is a good motivator although I wish there was no need for it and that people would be better educated about OCD, depressions etc. Unfortunately the need for raising awareness is still high as ignorance is still widespread. I try to contribute in my own way to raise that awareness.
> 
> It is somewhat odd coincidence that you say reassurance is a NO for sufferers. Only two days ago I went to register my latest writings and I had already doublechecked for eventual errors 4 times. I asked my psychologist if I should maybe make a copy so that I could later on re-read it all and be convinced there were really no mistakes. Obviously she said even more doublechecking was not very wise and she printed a paper for me saying "I have controlled and I have not made any mistakes, I don't need further controlling". I have put that paper in my wallet to re-read it whenever needed.  Although I must say my psychologist and my few close friends/relatives must have extremely well-trained nerves because I know that, like many OCD sufferers, I can be a pain in asking re-assurance all the time. I often also read stuff such as "lights switched off" on my arm so that if I'd doubt about it I can control the urge to turn around and re-enter the house to doublecheck.
> 
> Good to hear that your wife is coping relatively well with it. I am on Seroxat and Seroquel myself, with Xanax in addition. Especially Xanax has been a lifesaver for me on many occasions.


The basic idea behind not giving reassurance is that all it does is to reinforce the original Obsession or Compulsion. The sufferer will feel good about the reassurance for only a few minutes and then there is a tendency towards panic or anxiety and the questioning becomes even stronger - it has been reinforced by the reassurance. My wife was on fluoxetine for years but since the birth of our boy and her desire to breast feed, she has changed to Citalopram. This is of interest to us because a number of recent studies indicate that this drug (another SSRI) may offer a permanent 'cure' in that serotonin levels are mantained once the drug use is stopped - usually after 18 months. Someth8ing worth thinking about if your particular need is an SSRI. (And as I understand it, about 90% of depression are related to serotonin levels)


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## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

I used to have Citalopram as well until they changed it. I think I have the good meds now but even after 12 years of OCD issues it's still searching the right dosage because symptoms go away but new symptoms develop. Recently my dosage of Seroxat was multiplied by 3 hoping to control the OCD rituals better. I'm lucky to have some form of escapism by writing (although admitting that partially due to OCD and partially because perfectionist urges are wired in my character, I sometimes can get restless until I have finished my writing, unable to put my mind to something else until that point) so arts therapy is something that I think would work well for me. I am unaware if this is available here in Spain easily though.



It is interesting that your wife has OCD while you luckily haven't. I have met other sufferers now and then and some of them have gone as far as wanting their partner to be an autistic or an OCD sufferer as well because they are either afraid things would not be understood by an outsider or they think life would be easier if both have the same issue. I can see where the thought comes from, but I have mixed feelings about it. One of my biggest crushes in my life was with a girl that was very depressed, and I did feel like the fact we understood each other's suffering (even though we had totally different symptoms) added to our bond. However, I would also be somewhat afraid that if I had a girlfriend (I am single BTW) who also has OCD that maybe the burden could be even bigger if we would somewhat adopt each others rituals ... I don't know what to think about those relationships where both suffer from the same or nearly same disorder.

In terms of friendship though I am very convinced contacts with other sufferers can be very educative, like exchanging hints and tricks to cope.


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## EmmaWa (Aug 26, 2008)

Hello Gerrit

I was moved by your post and your desire to connect with others experiencing the same difficulties as yourself for mutual support. 

I suffered from a depression in my teenage years, and it is the bleakest of experiences that leaches the colour and enjoyment out of every aspect of life. I was fortunate enough to be helped by an excellent psychologist who gave me the tools to fight off that episode and any threats of recurrance since, but I understand that many people are not as lucky as I was and can require assistance from counselling and drug therapy throughout their life.

It is my gut feeling that such experiences can be heightened by life as an ex-pat - all the stresses and strains of establishing a new life in a country where you may not speak the language well, may not identify with the lifestyle and attitudes at first, may struggle to find work as a foreigner, and may lack the social network of long-term friends. I have lived outside the UK for the past 10 years and am very familiar with this on my own part as well as through observation of friends.

I can hope that you are living in Spain by choice, and as such would hope that you can dwell on the positive aspects of making such a choice, in the face of obstables that are particular to your situation, and as you noted in your first post. Well done for recognising that as the triumph it is.

It is my goal to move to Spain in the next few years, and in the long term my goal is to train as a counseller and be able to help ex-pats such as yourself that need the support of counselling in their own language, and the understanding of their experiences in the context of their life as an ex-pat.

That is several years away for me, but perhaps you can find out if there is some kind of ex-pat support group in your area, such as the Help group that I know are active in areas further south in Spain.

Conditions such as depression and OCD are far more prevalent than most people are aware or will admit, and realising this is the first step towards removing some of the stigma and sense of isolation that can accompany them.

Well done for speaking out and being unafraid - I hope that you meet some people that you can share your support and positive determined outlook with.

Best wishes
Emma


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## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

I am in Spain by choice yeah. Well, somewhat. I don't want to return to my native country, which never felt like home. I also didn't want to stay in Czech Republic where I was before as it reminded my so much of Belgium that I hardly felt like being abroad anymore. 

I lost my heart to the Middle East and most of all I'd have loved to return to Turkey (where I previously lived a while and only left because the employer messed up the working permit request) or relocation to Israel. However, in Israel finding a job with legal working permit is quite hard (Jews get automatic citizenship and don't need the permit, so companies prefer to not pay rather than hiring a non-jew who needs an expensive working permit -- understandable from their point of view as much as it's a pity) and in Turkey I found no suitable vacancies at that time. Within the EU, Spain was always a country I liked from the many visits, so when the chance came to move to Spain I figured that it was a good opportunity rather than a possibly very long wait for a job opportunity in the Middle East. So I'd even rather have been in Israel or Turkey, but let's say I do feel fine in Spain and of all alternative locations it was my prefered choice so you won't hear me complain.

The psychological problems are still somewhat of a taboo here, although I must say the local psychiatric service is quite good as they have one day a week specifically for expats with an English and French speaking psychiatrist. Psychotherapy is not free but then it wasn't in any country where I lived and prices are not that high compared to what I paid in the UK for example. I find it quite hard to trace other sufferers though, as the autism and depressives organisations I emailed either don't reply (may be the language barrier?) or they say that the majority of their members simply don't speak English well enough to really interact with foreigners on a useful level. So I'm trying to set things up myself a bit, which is quite hard but then if you're idealistic enough it will work out in the end.

I do see that autism organisations have been set up recently in countries such as Niger, India, Jordan, Nigeria, ... so I see globally that things improve bit by bit. Not as fast as it should evolve ideally, but still, there is some positive movements happening. I guess that wherever people suffer from psychological problems, there will always be people wanting to listen (family members, friends, ... of the sufferer). So I refuse to believe this taboo cannot be broken. I'm sure even the most conservative societies will eventually open up to a more open conversation about psychological issues. It may take some time, but the more people are willing to be a bit of a pioneer, the more we can assure the next generation of sufferers can grow up in a more tolerant society than the previous ones.


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## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

Things have been quite unstable lately, but luckily I managed to find motivation in it rather than fading in my despair. The idea to get in touch with other sufferers and set up something is still growing on me so maybe I indeed should give Webtoc a try. The problem is the language barrier. If I make a post in English in which I explain my idea to organise casual meet-ups for those with OCD and depression, isn't the risk quite big that either the post would be removed solely for being English language, or that the majority of folks wouldn't understand it and skip the topic? I may need some help to get at least the basic content translated into Spanish before making such a post.

Other than the OCD orientated WebTOC, is there no (online or real life) organisation for depressive residents of Spain?


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## thrax (Nov 13, 2008)

I have searched for such organisations and asked friends who live in the south of Spain if they know of any but so far I've found nothing. Having said that, my wife found some excellent help from some American forums where poeple with depression (of all kinds) talk far more openly about it than in Europe. An excellent book I am aware of is called 'Brain Lock' (google it) and offers a self help therapy which has been clinically proven to deal with OCD and related depressive illneses. My wife used it and it stays in her bedside drawer permanently. As an indication of how good it was for her, she hasn't had to look at it for years.


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## gerrit (Jul 15, 2008)

Online forums... Well, I tried one before, but it sounded like a church, when explaining a problem in detail some people literally gave as suggestion "read the Bible". I respect every religion, but I doubt reading the Bible will suddenly take the issues away... If however you know a forum where the discussions are really useful and serious, then please do share the link with me.

I hope to find something offline as well though. Take as example: i live only 1.5 hour train away from places like Girona and Tarragona and heard Girona is amazing. I just can't do it to pack my bag and take the train to Girona and back, I'd be nervous from the first second to the last, occupied by staying clean, keeping my camera clean, ... If you go with another person, that conversation distracts just enough to at least lower the impact of the issues during the trip. Going with someone who really understands what you're going through is even better because it becomes healing for both persons involved and you can exchange survival tricks and learn from each other. For sure there must be some people with psychological issues speaking a bit of English or French? Even when there maybe won't be many, it's hard to believe there would be not a single one ...

Oh well, back to work I guess. I hope I'll make it to the end of the day. I had to clean myself at the sink for so long during lunch break that my hands started hurting. I'm worried if I need to use the sink once more the next hours it may start bleeding. In a moment like this I wish I could just take a break for a few hours, distract in whatever way possible as long as not having the idea I have to perform and thus to concentrate and thus to be clean. The issue is, people can't see on your face that you're feeling anxious and depressed, it's an "invisable disease" and some won't just believe you when you express that you don't feel well. No rest for the wicked I guess ...


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