# Below the poverty line?



## morlandg (Jun 8, 2008)

I know of a family with 2 children aged 3 and 6 living in Torremolinos with the mother working and making 1100 euros per month and the father unemployed. They need a car to ferry the kids to school and their rented accommodation is 500 euros per month. I believe they get subsidised school books but nothing else. The question they are asking is - are there any other benefits that they are entitled to over here?
Where else can they seek help? They cannot afford to live. They are their wits end.


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## Caz.I (Mar 21, 2009)

morlandg said:


> I know of a family with 2 children aged 3 and 6 living in Torremolinos with the mother working and making 1100 euros per month and the father unemployed. They need a car to ferry the kids to school and their rented accommodation is 500 euros per month. I believe they get subsidised school books but nothing else. The question they are asking is - are there any other benefits that they are entitled to over here?
> Where else can they seek help? They cannot afford to live. They are their wits end.


Does the father get unemployment benefit of any sort? Has he paid into the Spanish system at all? If so, he may be able to apply for family help (ayuda familiar) at the INEM (unemployment office). If not, it will be very difficult. Re the school, if it is a state school in Andalucia there is usually some sort of bus service available for school children, so they could then cut back on the car expenses?


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## morlandg (Jun 8, 2008)

Caz.I said:


> Does the father get unemployment benefit of any sort? Has he paid into the Spanish system at all? If so, he may be able to apply for family help (ayuda familiar) at the INEM (unemployment office). If not, it will be very difficult. Re the school, if it is a state school in Andalucia there is usually some sort of bus service available for school children, so they could then cut back on the car expenses?


Thanks Caz. No he does not receive unemployment and has not paid into the state system. Things don't look good for them methinks.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

It sounds grim for them. Is there anyway they can get back to the UK (assuming thats where they come from??) I guess the only other thing is for the father to keep looking for work and not even think about who'll look after the kids during the long summer holidays coming up

Jo xxx


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## Caz.I (Mar 21, 2009)

morlandg said:


> Thanks Caz. No he does not receive unemployment and has not paid into the state system. Things don't look good for them methinks.


They could try Social Services, at least to find out about any charities that may help. I know there are some but cant remember the name. I dont think if they have 1100 e coming they will get much help, even though its not a lot. I think if someone is earning over 1000e monthly, they wont get any social welfare type benefits - not that there is much on that front anyway, as far as I know.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Have they been in Spain long??? 

Sadly, this thread is a bit of a "poster child" for all the things that we bang on about when folk want to upsticks and move to Spain with families and no plan or much money. That said I really feel for them - has the father had a look at this?? Mainly telsales and "young girls" but there maybe something??????????? http://www.myservicesdirectory.com/Category/recruitment/situations-vacant/

Jo xxx


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## Xose (Dec 10, 2008)

As a family of 4, the 1100€ does not reach the % of "salario medio interprofesional" X 4 that they would have to be on to not get certain social benefits. Some, like the "Sin recursos" measure for mediacl cover for example, are straight forward and it's simply a case of your IRF showing that you do not make that much each month, so you get free medical. Others, like the RAI, (Renta Activa de Inserción) and not to be confused with the bad debt Morosos list of the same name (RAI – Registro de Aceptaciones e Impagados), offer somewhere around 430€ per month for 11 months. This can be repeated a max of 3 times over 5 years if the individual does not get employment.
The RAI is fairly strict in that you are supposed to be actively looking for work, accepting training courses and interviews offered by the INEM etc., etc. i.e., it isn't just a benefit you get, bank and forget about.

To be honest, one of the best places to get information about benefits whilst looking for work is at the INEM, but one has to be registered there looking for work. This is in no way the same as someone on the dole (paro) as it simply means a registered "demandante de empleo". You get your card stamped every three months etc., just like someone on the paro - you simply don't get the dole bit.

Unfortunately, all of these processes require as one might expect. ID, Padron, proof of people living and relying on you (Padron conjunto), IRPF (last year's Tax Return) and everything else that someone on the looking for work registry would have.

I know this doesn't sound like much, and compared to the UK's relative ease (or is it these days in fact?) one does need to be active in searching for work to get most of the limited benefits that exist. A bit like child benefit. Doesn't exist here, but massive increases on Tax code do when you have kids, whilst the UK stays the same and a married man with kids pays the same tax as a single man. Just a different way of giving benefits but very much along the lines of pretty much all else in Spain... you don't put in, getting out is very difficult.


Edit: Sorry, just thought. A person applying for the RAI must be over 45 and unemployed for over a year I think. If he's not signing on every three months, he won't register as long term unemployed so won't be able to apply. Sorry. Still worth a visit to INEM though. You never know, they might at least point you to the riht social welfare department. One thing is clear, the household is earning below the minimum measure for most things here (% of sueldo medio interprofesional - income /4) so at least the starting point is clear.

By the way, I think the income mentioned above is something like 430 or 450 or some such. Not a lot, but times 4 means you would have to be on 1600 to 2000 to not qualify by that measure.

Xose


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## morlandg (Jun 8, 2008)

Xose said:


> As a family of 4, the 1100€ does not reach the % of "salario medio interprofesional" X 4 that they would have to be on to not get certain social benefits. Some, like the "Sin recursos" measure for mediacl cover for example, are straight forward and it's simply a case of your IRF showing that you do not make that much each month, so you get free medical. Others, like the RAI, (Renta Activa de Inserción) and not to be confused with the bad debt Morosos list of the same name (RAI – Registro de Aceptaciones e Impagados), offer somewhere around 430€ per month for 11 months. This can be repeated a max of 3 times over 5 years if the individual does not get employment.
> The RAI is fairly strict in that you are supposed to be actively looking for work, accepting training courses and interviews offered by the INEM etc., etc. i.e., it isn't just a benefit you get, bank and forget about.
> 
> To be honest, one of the best places to get information about benefits whilst looking for work is at the INEM, but one has to be registered there looking for work. This is in no way the same as someone on the dole (paro) as it simply means a registered "demandante de empleo". You get your card stamped every three months etc., just like someone on the paro - you simply don't get the dole bit.
> ...


Thanks for your suggestion Xose - I'll pass it on.
BTW Jo - yes they've looked at that.
Graham


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

morlandg said:


> Thanks for your suggestion Xose - I'll pass it on.
> BTW Jo - yes they've looked at that.
> Graham


they could try contacting Caritas

they, along with some other more local charities are doing great (& unfortunatley a lot of) work around here


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## bob_bob (Jan 5, 2011)

After rent a balance of €600 a month is not a lot, pay all your utility bills and there ain't a lot left for fun stuff...like food 

With government changes in benefit payments and who can recieve it being talked about, (in the UK) we could well end up with 'economic refugees' coming back to the UK with nout to show for their dreams and not a lot from the UK taxpayer.

When I worked in Paliative Care we had a guy come in to end his days who had lived in the Canary Islands for about 20 years and arguments ensued over whether his treatment should be funded by the NHS although the chap had lived well over half his life born and bred in the UK. The end result was that he did recieve full treatment and his estate were not pursued for payment but incidents like this should make us all think; the days of going home tail between legs and expecting support may well be numbered, its very sad.


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