# Portugal registration



## bobmurdy (Jan 10, 2009)

Hello all,

I'm currently employed around the world and intend to retire in the next few years to Portugal, where I have owned and lived in my property on and off for the past 5 years. What I'm wondering is, is it better to register as a full domiciled resident of Portugal or remain as a registered residentof UK, or doesn't it make any difference?

I'm not trying to evade any legaslation or work the system, but I want to be able to return to the UK at a later date. Are there immagration rules which dictate what I must do now we are all one big happy, or do I not have a choice? 

If I'm drawing a personal pension (not state) will this effect my decision?

We are fully commited to a life in Portugal but maybe we do not have to register anyway? 

Happy to hear any advice

Robert


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

If you are a EU Citizen then you can live, work, study or retire to any EU country. Current EU Law says you cannot be a Resident of two EU countries at one time.
There are 2 aspects to this
_A Tax Resident:_ one or more EU countries could decide you are a tax Resident and depending on where you earn your income depends on where your tax liabilities are, so you could be a Portuguese Resident but work in UK, _generally_ you would pay UK tax & NI, make a yearly tax return in Portugal *if* you had a Portuguese Tax liability then UK payments are offset.
*A Resident:* Current EU & Portuguese law says you must Register your Residence in Portugal within 30 days of 3 months of entering country or sooner.

If you intend retiring here *you must Register your Residence* here as a lot of things to be legal or entitled to that depend on that Registration.
Not drawing a "state Pension" doesn't affect anything although it does make life easier Registering with Social Services & NHS.

Registering here doesn't effect any decision on returning to UK, when you return you have to live in UK for 6 months before you are entitled to the same benefits as a UK Resident, although there is not a UK registration process, the kick start is re registering with a Surgery.


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## robc (Jul 17, 2008)

bobmurdy said:


> Hello all,
> 
> 
> I'm not trying to evade any legaslation or work the system,
> ...


Amusing/witticisms aside, it is a complex issue which needs careful thought, wrong decisions can always be unpicked after the event but there are likely to be cost implications.

Maybe a bit of advice from Accountants in UK and PT would not go amiss

Rob


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Depends on Pensions a UK Civil Service pension can only be paid and taxed in UK.
But a private or company pension can be paid in UK (taxed or tax free) or Portugal.

Equally you can also opt to pay your tax on UK income in Portugal where as your a Resident you must also file a yearly return regardless of any tax paid if applicable at source in UK.

As Rob says it's worthwhile checking with an accountant UK and here, but few except the expensive ones know both countries tax laws.


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## bobmurdy (Jan 10, 2009)

*Interesting so far*

OK so to be clear I will have a Civil Service pension, and a Russian wife with a permanent visa to reside in the UK.

If we register in Portugal how will the UK Government know we have left - big brother when we drive through customs ie clock out?

I'm not worried that my pension will be taxed at source (ie UK) and accept that probably that will be the end of the matter, at least by having it paid directly into a bank account in Portugal I will have clear visability of what I have received over the financial year.

I'm just worried that those inefficent officiados will make a cock up of everything once again and I will end up paying twice. Once the ball starts rolling in Portugal it seems to take forever to stop it and reverse the motion.

News is that Portugal is definetly going to default and have to leave the Euro along with Greece and Spain, ok so what? From my perspective I can't see that it will really effect us? Maybe the cost of living will go up but otherwise life will go on, does anyone have an opinion?

May be its a good time to hold your savings in uk?

Regards,

Robert


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

bobmurdy said:


> OK so to be clear I will have a Civil Service pension, and a Russian wife with a permanent visa to reside in the UK.
> 
> *Your UK Civil Service pension will be taxed in UK, it can then be paid anywhere you reguire. Russian wife probably when you Register here, you/she would then Register her as "Unifaction of Family" but it's something you need to check on*
> 
> ...


Good luck


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## PedroCruz (Sep 15, 2011)

Hello bobmurdy,

It's generally all being written.
As stated, a wrong paper work filling might result in the opposite of what would be best for you.
Double taxation is a reality, and sometimes the tax payers got involved in silly fights between tax-services of more than one country.
Nothing is for life, you can always become resident of another state.
Don't think any country is leaving the EU, as it would potency major problems.
Hope everything goes fine with your staying.
Cheers


Pedro Cruz


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## MrB (Jun 2, 2010)

bobmurdy said:


> News is that Portugal is definetly going to default and have to leave the Euro along with Greece and Spain, ok so what? From my perspective I can't see that it will really effect us? Maybe the cost of living will go up but otherwise life will go on, does anyone have an opinion?


If Portugal may leave the Euro, you can guess the likelihood for yourself: my guess is a 1 in 3 chance. Houses wll lose value, say around one third in £ or $ terms. But everything else should be cheaper 

If you can do the maths above , a house drop of around 10% should be in the price, which it probably is. I read in the Pt News that houses are taking 2 years to sell on average in the Algarve.

cheers MrB


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## PedroCruz (Sep 15, 2011)

Hello MrB,

The fact of any country leaves the UE is not the end of the world, but, it will cause a precedent in the EU. The USA doesn’t exclude a state, just because it doesn't follow the rules. You put pression on it. Of course prices are going down, but they will, anyway. That's one of the causes of inflation, if you don't lower the prices, you wont sell, then, everything will stabilize. The statistics in Portugal are great, they always lack for information. 2 years ago, there were already an excess of 500.000 houses to sell, this means, there were 500.000 houses more than buyers, but, as banks were lending money with little restrictions, everything was going (apparently) great. The balloon just blew. Prices will go down, don't worry.
Cheers


Pedro Cruz


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