# Spouse visa financial requirement met, but difficult to prove!



## acapriccio (Oct 15, 2012)

Hello all! 

Am new to this thread and also gutted that I have only found out now! This place is a gem thanks to everyone contributing!

I am originally from HK and my husband is British. I have been studying and working in the UK for the last 7 years and now my visa is running out so we are applying for a spouse visa FLR(M) for me. 

The financial requirement seems incredibly complicated considering most applying would have less-than-straightforward circumstances.

My husband's current job started in August and his annual salary meets the financial requirement. However because he has not been with the same employer for the past 6 months, we have to demonstrate 12 months of income - and this is the complicated part. My husband was working in South Africa before that, and although his annual salary then would have met the criteria, he did not have monthly payslip and has now closed his bank account in SA hence nothing to demonstrate his income over the full 12months other than his contract and some lump sum sent back to the UK bank account.

Meanwhile, I have been in full employment for more than 12 months with the same employer in the UK until October with annual salary meeting the financial requirement. But I have now stopped working and hence theoretically cannot be the main contributor of this complicated calculation. 

This is very difficult as we know we are way above the minimum financial requirement but yet it is not as straightforward to prove it as we hope! We are thinking of providing my husband's current employment information - contract, payslips and bank account statements; and then to prove income for the last 12 months to Point of Application, to use my last employment's information and my bank account and payslips. Does this make sense to anybody? To us it sounds like a sensible thing and it is clear we meet the criteria, but you never know how strict and inflexible UKBA is! 

Please help!


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## 2farapart (Aug 18, 2011)

As you were working, your salary would also count under Category B.

If you were to add both your husband's pay from just his new job only (because he has paper evidence for that), and your pay for the last 12 months before your job ended, would it still exceed £18,600 (and would the last 12 months of bank accounts corroborate this)? If so, given your husband continued employment in a job that still meets this criterion regardless of whether you are working or not, it's possible that you still meet the requirements under Category B.


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## BlessedVisa (Sep 27, 2012)

acapriccio said:


> Hello all!
> My husband was working in South Africa before that, and although his annual salary then would have met the criteria, he did not have monthly payslip and has now closed his bank account in SA hence nothing to demonstrate his income over the full 12months other than his contract and some lump sum sent back to the UK bank account.
> 
> Please help!


Hi Acapriccio
Not sure if this will help, but we were in similar situation - hubby ended last day June at work in ZA, then started his new job at the beginning of July, in the UK, without gathering all his ZA required documents. The payslips were easy enough - he contacted his za employer, they reprinted payslips for him , and then stamped and signed each one. I collected them, but your hubby's previous company could perhaps post them to you in the UK?
The bank account is very tricky, the banks will usually only give out statements to the account holder, and they actually get a bit silly about it, but with fraud etc. I guess it is understandable. We eventually got his branch (we pleaded and begged the branch manager), to print out twelve months of statements, which they then stamped and signed each page and I collected. We had to first contact the callcentre, who emailed the statements to hubby, he forwarded them on to the branch manager who verified they were correct with the system prior to stamping and signing. It did cost a pretty penny at the end of the day, but if your hubby has someone here in ZA, perhaps his old branch will do the same for him and allow them to be collected by someone who can identify themseleves. Our branch would not post them at any cost. Just ideas...


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## acapriccio (Oct 15, 2012)

Thank you to you both for your replies. 

We had our PEO appointment earlier this week and would like to share our (horrific!) experience:

Having previously applied for biometric permit at the Croydon PEO before, I was prepared that we would need to wait for a few hours. Appointment time was 1150; we got there well in advance to clear security check and pay. Waited 45 minutes to see the first person at the counter to check payment and type of visa etc... waited another 45 minutes for biometric details to be taken. Then waited for another 2 hours only to be called to go up to the second floor and waited for even longer. At last we were called to see a caseworker - no introduction, no name badge. Took our application form and all our supporting documents and we were told to go back to the waiting area until called again.

Then we were called again and were told because I am not currently employed, therefore we cannot use my twelve months prior to point of application to demonstrate a gross salaried income of more than £18,600. We were shocked. Nowhere in the guidance or the form mentions that you have to be currently employed to be used as the person contributing the previous 12 months of income. In fact, the legal wording of it has clearly stated it is 'the couple', 'the applicant and/or the applicant's sponsor' have to have that gross total income. They insisted that we could not use my employment and my payslips (which are much easier and more straightforward to demonstrate) and I was out of the equation. So we had to use my husband's - who has his employment contracts, month-by-month bank statements and the equivalent of P60 from South Africa. The only problem was that we did not have all his payslips from South Africa. There were three months missing. We explained that my husband was working with a charity organisation at a remote hospital in a corrupt health system that it was already remarkable to be able to get the many payslips we had in front of us. And that was exactly why we wanted to use my employment which was so much more straightforward and alone, meets the income threshold requirement anyway. They would not have any of it and insisted the visa wouldn't be granted until we get those missing three payslips, and completely ignored the South African bank statements which if they had bothered looking through, would demonstrate income going into the account every month!

We were just in disbelief that they could have gotten it so wrong. We shouldn't even need to argue about whether there were three payslips missing or not because according to the guidance and indeed the law, my employment and income would have satisfied the previous 12 months already. I have only stopped working in October and we tried to explain that the amount I earned over the last 12 months was double the financial requirement and it did not matter I did not work in the last month. But they told us it was not the amount of money we had but the paperwork. (!!!!! Isn't the whole POINT of the new rule on financial requirement the amount of money you have so you can't qualify for public funds!?!?!!) So we kept going round the circle and they spoke to their manager. They returned to us referencing information from Category A and highlighting sentences from all over the guidance notes, lifting them out of context in attempt to show us that I have to currently be employed. We corrected them that we are in Category B and that we have clearly marked it on the form and they just kept referring to the guidance notes with the wrong interpretation. Then the manager came, and said rules are rules. Meanwhile, the caseworker discovered that my husband did not work during June and July (when he was in a transit period coming back from South Africa) and said that would be a problem. I just could not believe that they could get any worse! The whole point of Category B is that there is an employment gap and if we were someone returning to the UK, a three-month grace would have been allowed anyway! I was trying so hard to make them see that it did not matter at all; even if we had worked for 10 months in a job and had two months of holiday/gardening leave/whatever, as long as we earn above the threshold in those 10 months we could have easily qualified! By now, it was past 5 and we were the last ones in the building. It was so frustrating. We told them we have run the application along with the legal wordings in the documents through with a few sources, including a friend who is an immigration lawyer and everyone was happy with it. We told them we were not leaving until we saw one of the senior case workers.

Eventually the senior case worker came up, asked us to highlight the monthly income on the South African's bank statements and granted us the permit using his discretion...... or maybe common sense? Now we just got to wait for the hard copy.

We are still in disbelief that they could have made up stuff because of ill-interpretation and misunderstanding of the legal wordings. I have now looked through the information sheet they have given me together with my grant letter - it is still printed with the old information advising I can apply for settlement in two years. Shocking!


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## 2farapart (Aug 18, 2011)

That's absolutely appalling for a PEO experience and I'm sorry to hear it. It does sound though that you finally got your visa which is something. 

I think there's definitely confusion over the different applications of Categories A and B. We've read people's experiences with lawyers' and experts' interpretations, and now UKBA seems to be confused too - yet one of the bases of the rule changes was to 'simplify' the requirements. 

The wording about whether or not you are _currently_ working is vague (or not mentioned at all). There is a clause stating that it doesn't apply under Catgeory B - but only when both partners will be returning to the UK from overseas together (bolding is mine):


> Category B operates differently where the applicant’s partner is returning with the applicant to the UK to work. *The partner does not have to be in employment at the date of application.*


And even this refers to the partner (not applicant).

Therefore, it seems for employment to count, whoever's income is being used towards the figure must still be working at point of application - even though not stated. That's a key point we need to remember - thank you for writing up your experience, because it's only through those who do this that we learn what UKBA will and won't accept. What's more worrying is that they're fussing about a gap in employment under Category B, when the stated requirement of Category B is to achieve £18,600 gross (no mention made that employment must be continuous). It's more worrying because quite a few applicants here are looking at applying under B with employment gaps and we thought that was okay. Your experience suggests it might not be okay at all.

Thanks once again for posting and I hope your hard-won visa arrives very soon.


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## Crawford (Jan 23, 2011)

You say that you stopped working in October. 

This sounds like a voluntary decision.

As you had applied for your FLR (M) under the new rules, why would you do this knowing that the financial requirements are central to you obtaining a visa? 

Your husband had been in his job only since August, and his previous job did not provide the necessary documentation to prove the necessary financial requirements.

Would it not have been more sensible to carry on working - thereby having an income plus the necessary documentation until your visa was issue?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Categort B - _'First, where the applicant’s partner and/or *the applicant *(if they are in the UK with permission to work) *is in salaried employment at the date of application*'_
So you have to be in employment now if they are to use your earnings as meeting the financial requirement. So they are right.


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## BronwynBean (Nov 20, 2012)

My hubby has an offer of employment to start in January 2013, im about to do the application, and was going to go category A - as he is still working in South Africa and not the Uk? Now im unsure. Do i have to proove that i am working too?


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

BronwynBean said:


> My hubby has an offer of employment to start in January 2013, im about to do the application, and was going to go category A - as he is still working in South Africa and not the Uk? Now im unsure. Do i have to proove that i am working too?


You are living in South Africa and you are a South African citizen, correct? Your husband is the UK sponsor for a spouse visa, correct?

It's your husband who has to have been working in South Africa before the move and it's your husband who has to have a guaranteed job offer in the UK within 3 months of arrival. Whether you are working or not in South Africa will have no impact on the application.


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## BronwynBean (Nov 20, 2012)

nyclon said:


> You are living in South Africa and you are a South African citizen, correct? Your husband is the UK sponsor for a spouse visa, correct?
> 
> It's your husband who has to have been working in South Africa before the move and it's your husband who has to have a guaranteed job offer in the UK within 3 months of arrival. Whether you are working or not in South Africa will have no impact on the application.


Okay gotcha. So adding in his 12 months bank statement from bank, as well as 12 months pay slips, signed by his MD, a Tax Clearance certificate, a Letter from his current employer this side stating how long he has been working for him and his monthly income, and the letter of employment from the Company in the UK initialed by my hubby. 

He starts work there on the 7th of Jan and leaves here on the 28 December, so we are applying saying that he has a job offer in the uk on the VAF Appendix 2.
Okay so here is my stupid question of the day. Do i have to fill in 2 of those for each of our children - aged 4 and 8, just seems odd that i have to answer questions like when did you meet the sponsor etc?

Bronwyn


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

BronwynBean said:


> Do i have to fill in 2 of those for each of our children - aged 4 and 8, just seems odd that i have to answer questions like when did you meet the sponsor etc?


Yes. There isn't a dedicated form for minor children. Answer questions as best you can. Some clearly don't apply.


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