# Order of the tramites when arriving in Spain.



## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Hello,

Just looking for a bit of help into what I need to do when I arrive in Spain with my family.

I’ll be moving to Spain at the start of August with my (non-EU) wife and 2 children. (the kids should be entering on UK passports)

We’re looking at moving to Vinarós (any information about Vinarós in general would be most welcome too!) which, in terms of places that may be useful, has an ayuntamiento, a local de seguridad social, a local police station, 

After hours of research, I think I have a fair idea what I need to do when I get here, but I’m having a problem piecing together in which order I need to do them in, so any advice would be very welcome.

Here’s the (probably wrong) order that I think I need to do them in:
1.	Find a place to rent.
2.	Register at the ayuntamiento and getting my certificado de empadronamiento
3.	Registering at the oficina de extranjeria with a cita previa, which I would ideally obtain before arriving (would the local police station in Vinarós do, or would I need to go to Castellón?)
4.	Registering as autonomo and for social security with the Censo de actividades economicos. (would this also require a trip to Castellón or Valencia?)
5.	Would I then need a Certificado de registro del ciudadano de la Unión from the Subdelegación de Castellón?

I’m self-employed and could prove (with UK bank statements) that I’ve earned an average of €1650/month since January (the average being dragged down by a couple of months I spent working part-time at the start of the year), but for the 3-4 months before we move to Spain it’d be €1,800-€2,400. Would this be enough for registering my whole family? I read somewhere they ask for €500/person to prove I can support my family.
It is in a UK account, but I’d be looking to open a Spanish bank account ASAP, as I get paid mainly in Euros, so it wouldn’t make sense to lose money on having it converted to pounds and then back again.

I’m thinking of heading out for a week 2-3 weeks before we travel. Would it make the process any quicker if I aimed to go out, find a place to rent, register as residenct/autonomo before coming back with my family? Would I feasibly be able to do that in the space of a week, assuming I make some calls about places to rent/getting a cita previa before I arrive in Spain?

Any help would be very welcome.

Pfrase


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Hello,
> 
> Just looking for a bit of help into what I need to do when I arrive in Spain with my family.
> 
> ...



sounds about right

not every town hall will allow you to register on the padrón until you're a registered resident - though they _should, _so you might find that the order you do things is a little different

some extranjerías don't issue appointments (citas previas) , so that might not happen - our local one only issues them on a Friday, in person, for the following week.

you only register as resident (Certificado de registro del ciudadano de la Unión) in one place - the nearest extranjería, which is as often as not in the National Police station. If you look at our http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...-living-spain/2725-faqs-lots-useful-info.html there are some links which will help you work out the nearest one to you

you can also, in fact, register as autónomo, before registering as resident, as long as you have a NIE number & a bank account in Spain

there really is no reason to rush around & get it all done in a week or two though! Don't panic! You'll soon realise that everything isn't cut & dried here in Spain!

here's an 'order of operations' I produced a while back for someone



Do some recce trips & if possible secure a long term rental for your arrival. If this isn’t possible, book a short term holiday let in your chosen area & house-hunt at your leisure on arrival.
During one of these trips open a non-resident bank account. This is usually possible with your passport & proof of non-Spanish address, though you might need a NIE number. Either transfer some funds into the account or start making regular transfers
Arrange for EHIC card. This can be used initially for healthcare. It’s for essential care for holidaymakers. You can ‘technically’ be considered to be on holiday for up to 90 days or until you register on the padrón, or as resident.
If you qualify for S1s, contact the DWP a couple of weeks before your move. This has to be sent to a Spanish address. If you don’t have a proper address before your arrival in Spain, this can be arranged from Spain.
Arrive
If you don’t already have a Spanish bank account, open a non-resident account & transfer funds into it
Register on the padrón
Arrange private Spanish private healthcare if you don’t qualify for an S1
Register as resident. If you don’t already have a NIE number, one will be issued at that time
Change bank account to a resident account


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Thanks a lot for the information! That's kind of what has been confusing me, it seems that I need to do one step in order to do the next, but in order to do that step I need to have done a further step that I can't do until I've done the initial step, etc.

I'm only 28 and I've been living and working in Argentina since I was 21, so I don't think I'd be eligible for S1s or even a EHIC. We’re technically still residents in Argentina. If I start paying social security straight away though, wouldn't my family and I be entitled to use the public health system, if we needed it? Is it that the process to register for social security is long so I should take out private healthcare?

I'll probably be making just one trip before we all move out, so I was hoping to get everything done on that trip. i.e. find a place to rent, register myself as a resident, register for social security and with the hacienda and open a bank account. Presumably if I did that, I could skip the step of opening the non-residents bank account and just open a resident's account? Would 1 week be too optimistic an estimate to get all this done even if I did as much as possible beforehand? 

I suppose waiting for the bank card to arrive at the Spanish address could cause a delay to this. If I did all of the above, registering for a non-resident’s bank account, would the card then arrive at my UK address? Would I need a Certificate of non-residence to open the account?

Thanks again for all your help!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Thanks a lot for the information! That's kind of what has been confusing me, it seems that I need to do one step in order to do the next, but in order to do that step I need to have done a further step that I can't do until I've done the initial step, etc.
> 
> I'm only 28 and I've been living and working in Argentina since I was 21, so I don't think I'd be eligible for S1s or even a EHIC. We’re technically still residents in Argentina. If I start paying social security straight away though, wouldn't my family and I be entitled to use the public health system, if we needed it? Is it that the process to register for social security is long so I should take out private healthcare?
> 
> ...


you're right, you won't get an S1 nor an EHIC - that was a general guide for a Brit that I had written.

You should still be able to open a non-resident account with your passport, but many banks will now want a NIE - & a UK address would be fine

you're unlikely to be able to do the registering as resident, nor as autónomo without a Spanish bank account though - & you can't register as resident until you actually _are _resident 

they way it is _meant _to happen is padrón first, then register as resident - & you do neither until you live here - so not on a visit in advance of the move

you'd be best all going together when you move over tbh


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

ooh just remembered - I've never yet had a card sent to me in Spain - I've always had to go into the branch to collect them - my bank phoned me last week to go collect my new one

I don't know if this is ALL banks though


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

You're being too ambitious trying to do all these things before you arrive!

Go over and concentrate on where you are going to live. You need to look at various properties day and night to see what the area is really like. Could be fine by day, and far too noisy at night. Try and avoid a neighbourhood that seems busy in the summer but becomes a ghost town out of season because most of the properties have been rented out to holidaymakers. Although you can usually sign a lease very quickly, it may take a day or two just to set up a viewing appointment. You also need to walk round and look for "To rent" signs on possible properties and phone the number given to set up more viewings. Take you time, you are going to have to live in the property for a year with kids, make sure it is suitable.

Check you can get good internet- assume you're going to be working online?

Set up a non resident bank account. It'll be a huge advantage because you will be able to transfer money before your big move, and you can start nap making deposits before you move in order to prove you qualify for residence.You can't get a resident bank account until you are resident, and as XAb says that will not happen before you arrive. You may have to make an appointment even to apply for the residencia, and then it could take a while to be issues. This varies in each area, some will be issued instantly, some not.

Until you're resident you can't start paying autonomo so you you'll need private healthcare. 

Everyone will have to be there in person, including kids, to register.

Although it's easier in one sense to do NI and residencia all in a oner, you could do NI on your first trip, just so you have it should a landlord or someone want it. At the same time ask what the requirements are for residence in your area- it varies from office to office, and maybe day to day!

You might need your NI no to get constants insurance, I found it really hard to get without the NI. Then you can have contents insurance in place for as soon as your belongings arrive.

During you first visit take time to work out Internet, phones providers, etc so you can get these things up and running as quickly as possible when you arrive. Find out if you will have to pay the electric company and set that up if necessary, or maybe you will pay it via your landlord. get yourself a Spanish mobile so you don't spend a fortune trying to set up proerty viewings.

Residence requirements vary as I have already mentioned but the usual requirements are:

1. Proof of sufficient income being paid regularly into a Spanish bank. This usually equates to approx 600€/ month/ person including kids. Some areas accept a lump sum instead of approx 6000€ per person! but some seem to ask for this amount in addition to the monthly sum.

2. Proof of healthcare provision.

All of this applies to you and kids as EU Citizens. The process will be different for your wife as non EU. I'm not exactly sure how this works, but I think you have to register yourself then apply for her separately. I assume you have checked out whether she needs any kind of visa to enter initially.

PS what's a cita prevai?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

cita previa - appointment


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> cita previa - appointment


Thanks! I was thinking it was some sort of official paperwork!


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Thanks xabiachica and Bacher! That's some really useful advice.

The reason I'm keen to get as much done as possible is that my wife's birth certificate and marriage certificate have already been requested from Argentina a week ago, we were going to try and bring the date we move forward , but we're now stuck waiting for the kids' passports to come through which, despite being told by the passport office that it'd take 1 week when I rang them from Argentina, now seem to be at least 6 weeks.

So, I'm worried that as we arrive on the 5th August, the marriage/birth certificates were issued on the 15th May so the 3 month validity period would expire and I'd have to go through all that process again. 

I'm also a bit concerned about the earning requirements. €2,000/month I should be able to handle, but more than that + thousands in savings would be too much. Working on the internet I will earn the same whether I live in the cheapest part of the cheapest province, or in downtown Barcelona, which is why we're looking around Vinarós and the Castellón province, as it seems cheap, yet connected and on the coast with decent internet speeds.

What would happen if we couldn't satisfy the earning requirements and they didn't register us? Would we, or my wife at least (although obviously we'd all leave if she had to), have to leave by the time the 90-day period had finished? I'd then be tied down to a long-term rental agreement, which would complicate things.

Thanks again for the helpful information and advice!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Thanks xabiachica and Bacher! That's some really useful advice.
> 
> The reason I'm keen to get as much done as possible is that my wife's birth certificate and marriage certificate have already been requested from Argentina a week ago, we were going to try and bring the date we move forward , but we're now stuck waiting for the kids' passports to come through which, despite being told by the passport office that it'd take 1 week when I rang them from Argentina, now seem to be at least 6 weeks.
> 
> ...


yes, your wife would have to leave


as said, there's no fixed amount as far as financial requirements are concerned

if you do come over & get a property, NIE & non-res bank account in advance, when you go for the NIE, tell them _exactly _what you want to do. Just say that you're considering moving here & that you want to know _exactly _what the financial requirements are in your situation _before _you make a final decision


and get it in writing


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Thinking about it, how do these earning requirements work in relation to people taking the Surinder Singh route back to Britain? 

If Spain is able to impose €24,000/year+ earning requirements for a family of 4, then surely Britain could just set the earning requirements for EU immigrants to the same as for the spouse visa or even higher, thus eliminating it as a way to get around the earning requirements?

I'm sure I'm probably missing or misunderstanding something.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Thinking about it, how do these earning requirements work in relation to people taking the Surinder Singh route back to Britain?
> 
> If Spain is able to impose €24,000/year+ earning requirements for a family of 4, then surely Britain could just set the earning requirements for EU immigrants to the same as for the spouse visa or even higher, thus eliminating it as a way to get around the earning requirements?
> 
> I'm sure I'm probably missing or misunderstanding something.


Spain hasn't in fact 'set' any financial figure at all - the legislation just says that you have to prove that you can support yourselves financially & healthcare wise

the figures _most _are asked for is around the 600€ a month &/or 6000€ in a Spanish bank

but it isn't set in stone

so were you just coming to Spain in order to move to the UK using Surinder Singh later?

I understand that that is becoming much more difficult now - they really look _very _closely for your proof that you really & truly settled in the other EU country


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Pfrase said:


> Thinking about it, how do these earning requirements work in relation to people taking the Surinder Singh route back to Britain?
> 
> If Spain is able to impose €24,000/year+ earning requirements for a family of 4, then surely Britain could just set the earning requirements for EU immigrants to the same as for the spouse visa or even higher, thus eliminating it as a way to get around the earning requirements?
> 
> I'm sure I'm probably missing or misunderstanding something.


Apparently there is a EU clause which allows a country to ensure that incomers can prove they won't be a burden on the state, which is exactly what Spain is doing by asking for proof that you have enough money to live on and healthcare provision. 

Why the UK can't do the same I have no idea, but I wish they would!


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Well, we'd be there for a year at least, maybe longer if we liked it, living permanently and not jetting back to UK every weekend or anything like that. We'd be sending our kids to a public school and all speak the language anyway, so I think we should be able to satisfy those requirements.

The Castellón province seems to be one of the cheaper areas to live in Spain, so if it varies area by area, then logically the earning requirements should be less stringent there, although if it's anything like Argentina, most things don't operate on the principle of logic!


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Pfrase said:


> Well, we'd be there for a year at least, maybe longer if we liked it, living permanently and not jetting back to UK every weekend or anything like that. We'd be sending our kids to a public school and all speak the language anyway, so I think we should be able to satisfy those requirements.
> 
> The Castellón province seems to be one of the cheaper areas to live in Spain, so if it varies area by area, then logically the earning requirements should be less stringent there, although if it's anything like Argentina, most things don't operate on the principle of logic!


Earnings requirements are not linked to the cost of living in any area, it's linked to the level of unemployment benefit in Spain (hence ability not to be a burden on the state and the EU clause mentioned previously). The only thing that varies is how this requirement is interpreted between areas and between the mood of members of staff on any given day!! 

PS don't assume any property will have good broadband- Rotherham General area might have but that does not guarantee a specific property or street will be good.


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