# Sabadell Expansion Account -Introduction of Monthly Charge



## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

I have just read elsewhere that Sabadell are to start charging a monthly fee of €5 for their Expansion Account. As I hadn't received any notification of this change I logged into my account and checked the mailbox in the Personal Area. Sure enough, there is a notification in there, dated 4/10/19 confirming this change to their conditions - but there is no heading to show what it is about, you have to click on the link to read it. The charge becomes payable from 24/12/2019 and will be applied quarterly (€15 per quarter). I'm not very happy about this but probably won't bother to switch as it would involve changing all my direct debits and once one bank does this the others are likely to follow suit anyway. I would rather keep an account at a bank with a local presence rather than an online only bank, for those occasions when it's necessary to speak to a human. I thought other Expansion Account holders who haven't seen this message might like advance warning.


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## Mforster (Mar 27, 2019)

I have also had notification from BBVA that their Terms & conditions will change as per 15th December. The account Cuenta va Contigo (which I have) and many other types of accounts will be charged 100 euros per annum if you fail to meet the requirements of the account. (requirements being a minimum amount transferred per month or per quarter). Also a charge of 1.25 euro instead of the current 0.90 cents for an immediate bank transfer.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Lynn R said:


> I have just read elsewhere that Sabadell are to start charging a monthly fee of €5 for their Expansion Account. As I hadn't received any notification of this change I logged into my account and checked the mailbox in the Personal Area. Sure enough, there is a notification in there, dated 4/10/19 confirming this change to their conditions - but there is no heading to show what it is about, you have to click on the link to read it. The charge becomes payable from 24/12/2019 and will be applied quarterly (€15 per quarter). I'm not very happy about this but probably won't bother to switch as it would involve changing all my direct debits and once one bank does this the others are likely to follow suit anyway. I would rather keep an account at a bank with a local presence rather than an online only bank, for those occasions when it's necessary to speak to a human. I thought other Expansion Account holders who haven't seen this message might like advance warning.


I've just checked all of our accounts (all 5 of us have expansion accounts) and none of us have this notification. 

I will ask in our branch tomorrow

By-the-way, ALL online accounts are completely FREE at the moment


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## xgarb (May 6, 2011)

Lynn R said:


> I have just read elsewhere that Sabadell are to start charging a monthly fee of €5 for their Expansion Account. As I hadn't received any notification of this change I logged into my account and checked the mailbox in the Personal Area. Sure enough, there is a notification in there, dated 4/10/19 confirming this change to their conditions - but there is no heading to show what it is about, you have to click on the link to read it. The charge becomes payable from 24/12/2019 and will be applied quarterly (€15 per quarter). I'm not very happy about this but probably won't bother to switch as it would involve changing all my direct debits and once one bank does this the others are likely to follow suit anyway. I would rather keep an account at a bank with a local presence rather than an online only bank, for those occasions when it's necessary to speak to a human. I thought other Expansion Account holders who haven't seen this message might like advance warning.


This is pretty normal for them. The people in the branches are great but the head office is run by people screwing their customers and stressing the branch employees to make targets.


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## xgarb (May 6, 2011)

Mforster said:


> I have also had notification from BBVA that their Terms & conditions will change as per 15th December. The account Cuenta va Contigo (which I have) and many other types of accounts will be charged 100 euros per annum if you fail to meet the requirements of the account. (requirements being a minimum amount transferred per month or per quarter). Also a charge of 1.25 euro instead of the current 0.90 cents for an immediate bank transfer.


I wonder if the banks have more trouble coming because they are all starting to make up charges for nothing. Maybe they are desperately trying to get back the money they were charging for their own mortgage services.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

What’s an expansion account!?


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

Megsmum....an expansion account is a Sabadell account whereas if you deposit an agreed amount every month (currently €700) then there will be no bank charges on your account or debit card. You also get money back if you have direct debits with them to pay your bills.

Steve


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

tebo53 said:


> Megsmum....an expansion account is a Sabadell account whereas if you deposit an agreed amount every month (currently €700) then there will be no bank charges on your account or debit card. You also get money back if you have direct debits with them to pay your bills.
> 
> Steve


Not any more were not, the money back from the direct debit of utility bills ceased in
May 2019 and with this 5 Euro's a month starting on 24th December theres little 
lor no advantage with the expansion account, as theres no avoiding a fee from 
having at least 700 Euro's or more credited to the Expansion account anymore.

Could be time to switch accounts, in the UK most banks would give you between £100
and £150 for switching bank accounts. Maybe some Spanish banks offer account 
switching sweetners as well ?


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## Phil Squares (Jan 13, 2017)

I have a Sabadell Expansion Plus Account and have not received any notification about fees. I spoke with them yesterday, and was advised they have no knowledge of fees for the Expansion Plus account. So, it might be for Expansion only. Time will tell.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Williams2 said:


> Not any more were not, the money back from the direct debit of utility bills ceased in
> May 2019 and with this 5 Euro's a month starting on 24th December theres little
> lor no advantage with the expansion account, as theres no avoiding a fee from
> having at least 700 Euro's or more credited to the Expansion account anymore.
> ...


I agree, not really any advantage to having the Expansion Account any more, apart from no other charges on top of this new one, such as separate charges for a debit card or for transfers. I did read from the source I found out about this new charge from that the new €5 charge would not apply if the accountholder had any other product with Sabadell (eg investments or savings accounts, house or car insurance, etc). Car insurance doesn't apply to me, I don't want to change my home insurance and from what I can gather insurance offered by most banks is not the most competitive re price and the claims services don't get very good reviews either. I might ask my local branch about fixed term deposits but if a large minimum deposit is required I'm not interested in those either as I don't want to tie up a large sum. I haven't seen any adverts from Spanish banks offering financial incentives for opening a new current account, only for transferring pension funds to them.

My bank in the UK (First Direct) did start charging a monthly fee for a current account a few years ago now, but waived it if customers had a savings account with them, which I do. It's instant access and the minimum balance is one pound, so that's no problem. 

I suspect it's the fact that interest rates have turned negative that is prompting all these new bank charges. We now have to pay them to hold our money. Good for people with mortgages, I suppose, but for those of us whose mortgages have been long paid off and have a bit of savings it's dire.

PS Have just read that First Direct actually scrapped the monthly fee for current accounts (it was 10 pounds per month) because in practice very few account holders paid it anyway. Paying in at least one thousand pounds a month or maintaining a minimum balance were other ways it could be avoided.


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## xgarb (May 6, 2011)

Lynn R said:


> I suspect it's the fact that interest rates have turned negative that is prompting all these new bank charges. We now have to pay them to hold our money.


I guess it depends whether the banks are lending most of it or a multiple of it to people at rates that make them a profit. For example if they lend all our money to people buying cars on credit they should be making a nice profit.

Lets see their profit announcements next year.

I have a First Direct account as well (for 30 years!) and have never been charged for anything.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Lynn R said:


> I agree, not really any advantage to having the Expansion Account any more, apart from no other charges on top of this new one, such as separate charges for a debit card or for transfers. I did read from the source I found out about this new charge from that the new €5 charge would not apply if the accountholder had any other product with Sabadell (eg investments or savings accounts, house or car insurance, etc). Car insurance doesn't apply to me, I don't want to change my home insurance and from what I can gather insurance offered by most banks is not the most competitive re price and the claims services don't get very good reviews either. I might ask my local branch about fixed term deposits but if a large minimum deposit is required I'm not interested in those either as I don't want to tie up a large sum. I haven't seen any adverts from Spanish banks offering financial incentives for opening a new current account, only for transferring pension funds to them.
> 
> My bank in the UK (First Direct) did start charging a monthly fee for a current account a few years ago now, but waived it if customers had a savings account with them, which I do. It's instant access and the minimum balance is one pound, so that's no problem.
> 
> ...


Totally agree Lynn, the Expansion account has deteriorated rapidly this year and all the benefits
that used to apply have gone and now with the introduction of a monthly maintenance fee,
one wonders whether this could be the start of other fees or charges being applied to various
transactions like ATM cash withdrawals on the Expansion account.

Naturally I've complained about this to Bank Sabadell and asked them to come back with any
answers for avioiding such fees, such as a switch to the Bank Sabadell Expansion Plus account.

The Bank Sabadell Expansion Plus account looks very attractive and if the Bank Sabadell link
on the internet is correct and still upto date, then it certainly offers all the benefits I used
to enjoy on my Bank Sabadell online Expansion account.

Anyway we will see.

Bank Sabadell - Expansion Plus account


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

xgarb said:


> I have a First Direct account as well (for 30 years!) and have never been charged for anything.


I've never been charged either - because I met their conditions for having the charge waived, as no doubt did you. But they definitely did introduce one, and later scrapped it - that decision was taken as recently as August this year.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2019/08/first-direct-to-scrap-p10-mth-account-fee/


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

@Lynn R


Just been to the bank and asked about charges.

I was told:

"Letters will be going out from our branch next week. EVERYONE will be charged unless they are under 31, have an insurance product from the bank or have over 10k invested with them."


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

snikpoh said:


> @Lynn R
> 
> 
> Just been to the bank and asked about charges.
> ...


Thank you. Guess I will be paying it then, as I don't want their insurance products or to invest 10k with them.


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## xgarb (May 6, 2011)

I saw somewhere that they have the same system here as in the UK that you can open a new account somewhere and the banks are supposed to copy all your DDs etc over so you don't have to set everything up again.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

xgarb said:


> I saw somewhere that they have the same system here as in the UK that you can open a new account somewhere and the banks are supposed to copy all your DDs etc over so you don't have to set everything up again.


They do, but it doesn't always work perfectly. Some friends of ours have just moved their account (to Sabadell, coincidentally) and are having to go to the Endesa office today because the direct debit hasn't been transferred and they are afraid of being cut off as the last two bills haven't been paid. I changed bank accounts when I moved house a couple of years ago, and I set up all the new direct debits myself with the companies concerned, just to be sure.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

xgarb said:


> I saw somewhere that they have the same system here as in the UK that you can open a new account somewhere and the banks are supposed to copy all your DDs etc over so you don't have to set everything up again.


Yes, they will do this. But mistakes are made ... so sometimes it's easier to do it yourself.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

I'm doing well with banks this week. Have just had a letter from First Direct telling me that the interest rate on my instant access savings account with them is being cut by 0.2% from mid December - and it was a paltry amount before.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Speaking of banks, I got a call from one of my banks last week saying that as per new EU laws (?) I can no longer access their online banking system by using my NIE as my ID number.

Apparently, the next time I enter I will have to use my passport number.

I'm not sure which passport number that is though, because I can't remember the last time I gave them a copy of the document, probably when I took out my mortgage with them 13 years ago, I've been through about 3 passports since then!!

Strange though how my other bank hasn't mentioned this and I can still use their online service with my NIE... I guess it's a question of interpretation of the new law. I'll try to get in one day and see what happens....


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Don't know if this is a national rule (everyone seems to be getting different letters) but our branch has today confirmed that IF you get your pension paid directly into your account, then there will continue to be zero charges,


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## Love Karma (Oct 10, 2018)

snikpoh said:


> Don't know if this is a national rule (everyone seems to be getting different letters) but our branch has today confirmed that IF you get your pension paid directly into your account, then there will continue to be zero charges,


In writing?


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

snikpoh said:


> Don't know if this is a national rule (everyone seems to be getting different letters) but our branch has today confirmed that IF you get your pension paid directly into your account, then there will continue to be zero charges,


My husband has his state pension paid directly into his Sabadell account with zero charges, but it is an Experiencia account, not an Expansion one.

https://www.bancsabadell.com/cs/Sat...a-Account---Pension-Account/6000006123078/en/

I don't think I can have one because I have to transfer my pension payments myself from my UK account - my main pension provider will only pay to UK accounts, and I don't yet receive a state pension.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Love Karma said:


> In writing?


Yes, I've seen the letter


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Lynn R said:


> My husband has his state pension paid directly into his Sabadell account with zero charges, but it is an Experiencia account, not an Expansion one.
> 
> https://www.bancsabadell.com/cs/Sat...a-Account---Pension-Account/6000006123078/en/
> 
> I don't think I can have one because I have to transfer my pension payments myself from my UK account - my main pension provider will only pay to UK accounts, and I don't yet receive a state pension.


Great thanks for that - no doubt those Expats / Immigrants that have retired to Spain and have been on the
Expansion account will be best advised to switch to the Experiencia account to avoid the upcoming charges.
I'm sure many will wonder whether eligibility for the Experiencia account is based on age or I assume you
have to be receiving a State Pension which begs the question will Sabadell recognise UK State Pension
payments instead of the usual Spanish State Pension payments for such an account ?


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Williams2 said:


> Great thanks for that - no doubt those Expats / Immigrants that have retired to Spain and have been on the
> Expansion account will be best advised to switch to the Experiencia account to avoid the upcoming charges.
> I'm sure many will wonder whether eligibility for the Experiencia account is based on age or I assume you
> have to be receiving a State Pension which begs the question will Sabadell recognise UK State Pension
> payments instead of the usual Spanish State Pension payments for such an account ?


It was our "named representative" at our Sabadell Branch who suggested my husband switch to the Experiencia account, when the fall in the value of sterling caused his UK state pension to drop below the monthly minimum amount needed to ensure no charges for his Expansion account. She arranged for the charges incurred to be cancelled and set up the new Experiencia account for him. They definitely do recognise the UK state pension payments for this type of account, because those are the only ones going into his account.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

As for those who would not qualify for an Experiencia account, the options for avoiding the
upcoming monthly charges is limited to switching to the Expansion Premier account where
there's no bank charges, so long as you satisfy the qualifying conditions for the Expansion
Premier account mentioned below:

Namely:

So long as you maintain a minimum of 700€ monthly income in your Expansion Premier account.
You must also have at least one of the following:

- to have a protection insurance with Banco Sabadell (home, life, health, dental...)
- to have a Sabadell eBolsa ( equities,) account of more than 10.000 €
- to have a investment fund from Sabadell Asset Management of more than 10.000€

I'm also told that switching to the Expansion Premier account would qualify for a free
Bank Sabadell Gold Credit card.

Or you could switch to another Spanish bank account if it offers better terms, conditions
and free banking of course.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Williams2 said:


> As for those who would not qualify for an Experiencia account, the options for avoiding the
> upcoming monthly charges is limited to switching to the Expansion Premier account where
> there's no bank charges, so long as you satisfy the qualifying conditions for the Expansion
> Premier account mentioned below:
> ...


Thanks for this. I don't want to switch my home or health insurance to Sabadell, and I don't want to put €10k into any kind of investment with them which isn't a bog standard deposit account.

When they say a "free" Banco Sabadell Gold credit card, I expect you have to make a minimum number/amount of purchases per month or year, because you do with the standard credit card if you want it to remain free. I opted not to have the one which came with my Expansion account for that reason, I just use my debit card. Personally I would not want a Gold card anyway. I had one in the UK and experienced several instances of fraud where it had been cloned, it seemed to attract scammers no doubt because of the higher credit limit. When I went back to using my ordinary card the fraudulent usage dropped off.

I'm not going to switch banks because I've been happy with the service from Sabadell (unlike my old bank, Banco Popular who were awful) and I suspect all the banks will be hiking their charges anyway so don't want to bother switching just to encounter the same problem a few months down the line.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Lynn R said:


> Thanks for this. I don't want to switch my home or health insurance to Sabadell, and I don't want to put €10k into any kind of investment with them which isn't a bog standard deposit account.
> 
> When they say a "free" Banco Sabadell Gold credit card, I expect you have to make a minimum number/amount of purchases per month or year, because you do with the standard credit card if you want it to remain free. I opted not to have the one which came with my Expansion account for that reason, I just use my debit card. Personally I would not want a Gold card anyway. I had one in the UK and experienced several instances of fraud where it had been cloned, it seemed to attract scammers no doubt because of the higher credit limit. When I went back to using my ordinary card the fraudulent usage dropped off.
> 
> I'm not going to switch banks because I've been happy with the service from Sabadell (unlike my old bank, Banco Popular who were awful) and I suspect all the banks will be hiking their charges anyway so don't want to bother switching just to encounter the same problem a few months down the line.


I've declined an extra Credit Card being added to my Expansion account already last year, as they
presented me with an extra card even though I never asked for it, so I doubt that the Gold Credit
card is compulsory if you don't want one.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

I thought that gold cards were the least attractive to fraudsters as they are more closely monitored because of high credit limits. When OH worked for De Beers he had a gold card. He travelled a lot and was contacted a few times for verification.

So many different gold cards now, some have little advantages. just hype. The limit still depends on your credit score. The platinum and black are the newest, some black cards are by invitation only. Most gold cards with the best perks have high annual fees.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Sabadell now describing the introduction of charges for savings accounts as inevitable.

https://elpais.com/economia/2019/10/25/actualidad/1571989242_407244.html


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## xgarb (May 6, 2011)

I don't really understand why negative interest rates would mean we have to pay the bank to hold our money.

They aren't paying people who have mortgages (they nearly all have a floor) and they won't be reducing car loans etc so the risk/reward is negative.

The only way I can think that they could suffer is they have lent huge amounts of money somewhere without a floor and now they are paying the borrowers interest.


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## stevesainty (Jan 7, 2011)

Reading the bank's notices online has not been possible for me for some reason, I keep getting the message that the document was not found. I discovered a workaround for this, though, by logging in as a business customer using my personal log in criteria. I will get around to querying this by visiting the branch sometime.

However I did read this,

At Banco Sabadell we provide you with prompt and transparent information concerning every aspect of your products.
The market has been changing over recent years and the circumstances of the current economic environment signify changes to the
contract of your Expansión account so as to continue offering you the associated services.
We therefore inform you that as of 24/12/2019 the specific conditions of the account indicated will be modified in accordance with the
powers provided in the contract, as follows:
1 A monthly maintenance fee of 5 euros will apply, to be paid on a quarterly basis in the account settlement (15 euros).
We wish to continue offering advantages to our preferential customers and groups of customers aged under 30 or those who have a
direct-deposited retirement pension. In your case, the account indicated below will be exempt from the maintenance fee and your
Expansión Account will pay no fees as is currently the case.
2 The issuance of transfers in euros to Spain and EEA countries in euros, Swedish krona and Romanian leus via self-service channels will
continue to be free of charge, except immediate transfers. Those performed at branch offices will have a cost of 2 euros per transfer.
The other conditions remain unaltered. Remember that you can continue to enjoy the advantages of your Expansión Account.

As my wife has her UK state pension paid direct into our Sabadell joint account we will still enjoy our free banking


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

stevesainty said:


> Reading the bank's notices online has not been possible for me for some reason, I keep getting the message that the document was not found. I discovered a workaround for this, though, by logging in as a business customer using my personal log in criteria. I will get around to querying this by visiting the branch sometime.
> 
> However I did read this,
> 
> ...


You may not have read all of the posts as it is a long thread now, but I mentioned this in post #21


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## stevesainty (Jan 7, 2011)

Sorry snikpoh, I did not see that post. My wife shares my account and I normally click on show first unread post, sometimes previous posts have been read without my noticing.


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

Can anyone give an update on the proposed bank charges. I've been checking my Sabadell expansion account daily but I've not seen any charges imposed either monthly or quarterly. 

Steve


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

tebo53 said:


> Can anyone give an update on the proposed bank charges. I've been checking my Sabadell expansion account daily but I've not seen any charges imposed either monthly or quarterly.
> 
> Steve


According to the email I had from Bank Sabadell about my expansion account, it's charged quarterly
from your Sabadell expansion account, with the first quarterly payment taken in March. 
So I assume it's taken anytime during the 31 days of March.

Suffice to say I switched accounts before these quarterly charges were imposed.


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