# Locations to look into suggestions?



## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

My wife and I are looking into the possibility of moving to Mexico for 6 months to a year. We would like some suggestions as to where to look for a place based upon these criteria:

2+ bedrooms, 1.5+ baths
walking distance or a short drive to a beach
pet friendly
furnished
<$750 a month
high speed internet available
Easy to return to the US via car (we plan on driving down)
SAFE - EXTREMELY important
Movie theater or someplace that has English films available (nice to have)
Aquarium or zoo would be nice (nice to have)
English speaking - we have limited Spanish but are willing to learn

What cities would you recommend looking into as possible places to live?


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

Sounds like either Mazatlan or Vallarta to me


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## limeyboy (Jun 10, 2013)

I agree with Sparks either Maz or PV. 
Also the area around the Bahia de Banderas in states of Jalisco and Nayarit would also check off most if not all of your needs. 
Lots of Expats and things to do and close to the Beach!


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

Well, I must say, flyboy, that you have laid out some contradictory criteria but I presume those criteria are flexible. You also do not, as I read it, point out here you live in the United States. I suggest Merida or Progreso, Yucatán. Perhaps Playa Del Carmen or vicinity, Quintana Roo.


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## Longford (May 25, 2012)

flyboynm said:


> My wife and I are looking into the possibility of moving to Mexico for 6 months to a year. We would like some suggestions as to where to look for a place based upon these criteria:
> 
> 2+ bedrooms, 1.5+ baths
> walking distance or a short drive to a beach
> ...


The "easy to return to the US via car" probably cancels-out a lot of possibilities. Is this a seasonal relocation, or are you exploring the option/planning for a change of residency to Mexico? How often do you expect to be driving back to the USA?

The high rates of crime in Mazatlan and the state of Sinaloa would cause me not to list the city on a "top ten" list of mine, personally. Puerto Vallarta is very expat-centric/friendly but it's not a quick drive to return to the USA. PV does meet much of the rest of your criteria.

I'm supposing you should list the most important things to you (and maybe what you've done is just that). Maybe you can clarify it for us. What's most important. What's least important, etc.

Safety is a relative consideration and you can ask 50 people for their opinion and few will probably agree totally. There are war zones in Mexico and flare-ups without notice in places you don't expect it. Expats aren't typically targets of the narco-terrorists but many have been caught-up in violent environments which break-out and such an experience can be very unsettling. But, generally, I think the principal concern of yours should be locating yourself in a colonia/neighborhood not known to be a center of criminal activity/crime.

And the community which will be right for you will depend upon environmental factors, also. How do you do with high temperatures and high humidity? Do you have mobility issues/concerns that the many hole-pocket sidewalks (missing manhole covers) or roadways might present to you if you walk a lot (not in all cities, but in enough to pay attention to).

There are a lot of considerations.

A first-thought of mine was one of the expat-popular communities at Lake Chapala, outside Guadalajara. GDL presents many opportunities you look for, as do the Lakeside communities ... but the drive to the beach will be more for at least an overnight visit than just a day-trip. San Miguel de Allende is another possibility I thought of. Mexico City, also. The latter two are some hours away from a beach though, but they offer a lot of attractiveness and check some of the boxes on your list.

Then again, maybe you want to try to live close to San Diego and the USA border, by locating in one of the coastal communities south of Tijuana. And, there's San Carlos and Guaymas both of which are reasonably close to Hermosillo for big market center and not a bad ride to Tucson or Phoenix in Arizona.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

That "extremely important" SAFE rules out a few otherwise desirable locations.

Baja California is probably your best bet. Beaches and easy return to the U.S. You can mouse over to get visuals of what the different places look like by checking out the real estate sites for the different towns that interest you.

Climate is a big consideration. Cooler weather in the higher inland locations like San Miguel, Lake Chapala area and others, but no quick trips from there to the beach where it gets mighty hot and humid. November-February are good beach months.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

I suppose you have done an online search to find out the requirements for a temporary residence visa right?


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## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

My wife and I are non-traditional college students - I am a 42 yr old graduate student (IT Management) and she is a 37 yr old undergraduate(Sociology). Our classes are all online. (which is why HSI is a must). We do not drink so a "party" scene is not necessary. We just like to go out and do things from time to time such as go to a movie, out to eat, site see, etc.

The reason for return via car is because it is a lot cheaper to drive across the border with 5 cats (my wife refuses to move without them) than it is to fly into a locale with them. (We have been quoted a min. $250 airfare per cat.) I don't mind driving with the constant meows and having to stop to clean their carriers to avoid that huge expense. 

Easy to return via car means that it isn't a terrible road or really complicated to get there - that there is a major roadway of some type that is traveled by many and the directions are not "at the 3rd anthill, take a left, go to the 2nd cow and make a right and then look for the bird with a feather in its bill...." Basically, is there a safe, uncomplicated way to get there? If it takes 2 days of driving to get back to the US, so be it. I don't want to be forced to travel down a 50 mile goat path to get to and from the city. Please, no zip lines across a raging river either! 

I will be taking a lot of good computer equipment with me so I am worried about crime. These systems are required because school. Is there many options when it come to personal property insurance? I know that I should make it so that the property I have is protected in some way or another. Maybe buy a safe to put our laptops in while we are out for dinner? *ponders*

Musts:

Rent needs to be <$750 USD for a furnished house/condo/townhome/apartment
Able to bring my cats (wife would rather kill me than move without her cats)
Safety (I don't want to feel like I am in Newark after dark!)
High Speed Internet
English Speaking - a must because my wife doesn't speak any Spanish 

Would like:

2+ Bedrooms/1.5+ baths
Beaches close - no more than 30 minute drive

Nice to have:
Zoo
Movie theaters

It would be nice to be somewhere that I can make a little extra doing odd computer repair/consulting jobs but it isn't a requirement. Any money I would make doing that would go into the "play" fund - monies that do not need to be watched carefully.

The plan is to be there for 6 months, travel back to the US to "reset" the tourist visa, return to Mexico, stay 6 months (wash and reuse however many times needed) and continue to do that until we are done with our studies or decide to make Mexico a permanent home.


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## cuerna1 (Mar 7, 2015)

We drove here with 4 cats about 3 years ago.

We rented here in Cuernavaca for the first year. I believe the 3/3 house we rented was 17000 pesos per month for a year lease.

Cuernavaca has excellent schools.

You won't fair well if you don't speak Spanish.

It is no-where near a short trek to the beach. Definitely an over-night affair.

There is/are pet friendly walking paths. 

Mexico City is about 1-1.5 hour bus trip where you can find incredible museums/restaurants/almost anything - but there is traffic.

We have never for a moment lived here in fear of violence - but our community does have 24x7 security.

When we rented we had fiber for internet. It screamed. Now we have very decent Telmex DSL - perfectly adequate for my wife's business.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

flyboynm said:


> ...
> It would be nice to be somewhere that I can make a little extra doing odd computer repair/consulting jobs but it isn't a requirement. Any money I would make doing that would go into the "play" fund - monies that do not need to be watched carefully.
> 
> The plan is to be there for 6 months, travel back to the US to "reset" the tourist visa, return to Mexico, stay 6 months (wash and reuse however many times needed) and continue to do that until we are done with our studies or decide to make Mexico a permanent home.


Please be advised that if you're planning to stay here on tourist visas, then you won't be able to work legally, even doing occasional part-time work.


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## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

That is perfectly fine. I am not worried about making any extra monies while there - it would be nice but isn't required. 

As for environmental factors - I am allergic to snow and ice. I prefer weather where I can walk around in shorts and a t-shirt. Air conditioning or swamp cooler would probably be needed if the weather gets up above 80.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Lake Chapala area has a nice, mild climate. No snow or ice. Good internet access. I'd say, from your words, that the beaches are so often over 80 that you'd be uncomfortable. 

Since you haven't said where you're living now, I can't say how long it would take to get here, but there is an excellent toll road system for getting around Mexico. Wide highways, well maintained.
No need to take the donkey trails.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

lagoloo said:


> . . . but there is an excellent toll road system for getting around Mexico. Wide highways, well maintained.
> No need to take the donkey trails.


Unless you're the adventurous sort of traveler!


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Someone worried about safety had better stick to the toll roads and skip the "adventure".


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## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

I am in New Mexico. My Spanish knowledge has been built up listening to it here over the last 10 years - so I know enough to get my face slapped. 

My wife and I would "prefer" to be near the beaches but will live elsewhere if we can get to the beaches sooner or later.

Yes, I know that I cannot legally work. I didn't plan on actually working. If I fixed your computer, I would only charge for the hardware cost - no labor. If you give me more, what can I say?  (Yes, I am not being serious.)


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

Longford writes:" Puerto Vallarta is very expat-centric/friendly but it's not a quick drive to return to the USA. PV does meet much of the rest of your criteria."

PV is a 2 day drive from the USA, each year I cross at Nogales AZ and spend the 1st. night in Navojoa and the 2nd night in PV...Have you driven to PV longford?


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

Hound Dog said:


> Well, I must say, flyboy, that you have laid out some contradictory criteria but I presume those criteria are flexible. You also do not, as I read it, point out here you live in the United States. I suggest Merida or Progreso, Yucatán. Perhaps Playa Del Carmen or vicinity, Quintana Roo.


Easy return to the US


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

I repeat my previous comment. The great thing about Highland Chiapas is that you are living in a splendid cool high mountan atmosphere with alpine forests and crystal clear skies but within relatively short drives you can be on the Caribbean Sea, the Gulf of Mexico or the Pacific Ocean - all about equadistant. The best place that Mexico has to offer but you´ll need some Spanish language skills.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Hound Dog said:


> I repeat my previous comment. The great thing about Highland Chiapas is that you are living in a splendid cool high mountan atmosphere with alpine forests and crystal clear skies but within relatively short drives you can be on the Caribbean Sea, the Gulf of Mexico or the Pacific Ocean - all about equadistant. The best place that Mexico has to offer but you´ll need some Spanish language skills.


You just might want to mention something about the season where the weather there causes you to drive back to the unbeautiful sump. Only fair.


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## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

Someone mentioned Ensenada and Guaymas previously to me. What are your thoughts on those places?


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## Longford (May 25, 2012)

chicois8 said:


> Longford writes:" Puerto Vallarta is very expat-centric/friendly but it's not a quick drive to return to the USA. PV does meet much of the rest of your criteria."
> 
> PV is a 2 day drive from the USA, each year I cross at Nogales AZ and spend the 1st. night in Navojoa and the 2nd night in PV...Have you driven to PV longford?


The OP hadn't yet defined what was meant by an "easy" drive, when I offered my comments. For very many people, a 2 day drive isn't easy by any means ... depending on what their intent was (was it to go to a movie, shopping, whatever?).


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

lagoloo said:


> You just might want to mention something about the season where the weather there causes you to drive back to the unbeautiful sump. Only fair.


Quite correct. lagoloo and certainly the reason we have not left Lake Chapala and moved down there full time. The Chiapas Highlands can be quite cold and often overcast in the Winter months but also subject to serious, heavy rainfall in the summer months. This is because the town in which we live is at 2,000 meters but the climate is also modified by the nearby Gulf of Mexico which brings lots of rain and fog. This is why we have not, as of yet, left Lake Chapala which may have the best all-year climate for human comfort on the planet. Keep in mind that I was responding to an inquiring poster as to the best place to be for access to seashores and , as I stated earlier, the Chiapas Highlands are close to the Caribbean, the Gulf of Mexico and the Pacific. While San Cristóbal de Las Casas is a fine colonial town some 400 years old and has a Burger King franchise, I must stay on the muddy sump much of every year.


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

chicois8 said:


> I suppose you have done an online search to find out the requirements for a temporary residence visa right?


??? 

Were you trying to preempt Longford with this question, Chicois?


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Ensenada might be OK if you don‘t mind morning fogs and damp coolness in the mornings; similar to San Diego, which is just north of the border.
For your wife: Chapala/Ajijic area would suit her desire for English being widely heard. It is also only a 4-5 hour drive for a quickie vacation at the Pacific beaches. Note that only two pets per person are allowed to be imported, so get the veterinary papers done in separate names. Sorry about cat #5, unless you are bringing a kid or a friend.
If you plan to reside in Mexico, you will want to look into a temporary residence visa. Otherwise, you will have to leave every 179 days.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

Ensenada is 66 miles from the USA....Has more expats with all you are looking for.
Guaymas is 247 miles from the USA..More a Mexican town, more Spanish needed..

Both nice towns although Ensenada would be cooler year round being right on the 
Pacific coast whereas Guaymas is on the Gulf of California where it can be very hot
and humid during the summer months.....


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

ojosazules11 said:


> ???
> 
> Were you trying to preempt Longford with this question, Chicois?



Not really, it was not until a later post the OP stated he was doing the 180 day shuffle, then I thought BM Longford would show up, LOL


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

RVGRINGO said:


> Ensenada might be OK if you don‘t mind morning fogs and damp coolness in the mornings; similar to San Diego, which is just north of the border.
> For your wife: Chapala/Ajijic area would suit her desire for English being widely heard. It is also only a 4-5 hour drive for a quickie vacation at the Pacific beaches. Note that only two pets per person are allowed to be imported, so get the veterinary papers done in separate names. Sorry about cat #5, unless you are bringing a kid or a friend.
> If you plan to reside in Mexico, you will want to look into a temporary residence visa. Otherwise, you will have to leave every 179 days.


If they cross over the border at either TJ or Mexicali with their 5 cats I doubt the Customs officer checking your trunk, if you happen to get the Red Light, will ask about the cats. This is so common there that they are immune to worrying about dogs and cats in vehicles. The "Free Zone" has millions of crossers per month and they seem to like to keep the lines moving and are looking for locals bringing in expensive ítems to charge tax and duty on. There are no INM officers at the "casetas" or really a tough routine when getting a Red Light. You pull up 40 feet to the shade and stainless steel tables. They are already back by your trunk and indicate you to pop it open, look inside, then close it then from back there wave you on and away you on, a 15 second ordeal. They don´t make eye contact or check out the vehicle very closely. They might peer into the back seat on occasion. California in TJ and California and Arizona in Mexicali plates seem to be as common as dirt. I can´t say what happens in Nogales, Mx.


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

flyboynm said:


> Someone mentioned Ensenada and Guaymas previously to me. What are your thoughts on those places?


Culture and Ex-Pats


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

sparks said:


> Culture and Ex-Pats


What about them?


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## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

Longford said:


> The OP hadn't yet defined what was meant by an "easy" drive, when I offered my comments. For very many people, a 2 day drive isn't easy by any means ... depending on what their intent was (was it to go to a movie, shopping, whatever?).


Length of drive doesn't matter - it is the "difficulty" of the drive via road types, etc.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

Both Ensenada or Guaymas are connected by high speed toll roads....


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

_


chicois8 said:



Both Ensenada or Guaymas are connected by high speed toll roads....

Click to expand...

_
The problem is that once you arrive in either Ensenada or Guaymas no matter how well constructed the roads you use to get there, you, after a day lor two in either of those dungholes , have to wonder why you left Cincinnati in the first place.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

I was just trying to answer the OP latest remark :
"Length of drive doesn't matter - it is the "difficulty" of the drive via road types, etc."

Why are you so bitter, don't be a hater............

P.S. I'm not from Cincinnati, born and raised in San Francisco........And yes everyone on this board knows you lived in SF and many other places all over the world and you live in Gringolandia,Jalisco and Chaipas, Mexico....You remind us almost every post.........LOL


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Isla Verde said:


> sparks said:
> 
> 
> > Culture and Ex-Pats
> ...


Maybe: 
Culture - too little
Expats - too many


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

chicois8 said:


> Not really, it was not until a later post the OP stated he was doing the 180 day shuffle, then I thought BM Longford would show up, LOL


I thought that the RT and RP were RV's domain, not Longford? BTW, what does the BM stand for?


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## kcowan (Jul 24, 2010)

There are some ****** enclaves north of the armpit Guaymas but I think the prices may blow your budget.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

A puzzlement: what is it with expats who seem to have an allergy to living among "too many" of their former countrymen? If there are enough of them who made the same decision to head South that we did, we are likely to find some of like mind and enjoy their company.

Some of the others can seem like real jerks (and they post on local web boards, too), but we don't have to hang out with them. 

I believe in appreciating the culture, learning the language and getting involved in new things, but the presence of other foreigners shouldn't be a bad note in our Mexican symphony. Makes no sense, for one thing. Our ancestors who came from other countries to settle in the U.S.A. or Canada deliberately sought out and lived in communities where they shared a common language, history and food preferences. So, if you moved to a community where there are many other expats, that's normal human behavior. If a Mexican moves to the States, he or she is likely to do the same thing.

You don't need to try to re-invent yourself. In any case, you brought it with you when you crossed the border. Hopefully, that self included a well developed sense of humor. Otherwise, you'll be impatient, crotchety and intolerant.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

coondawg said:


> I thought that the RT and RP were RV's domain, not Longford? BTW, what does the BM stand for?


Every time someone mentions the 180 day border run Longford chastises them and practically calls them criminals for breaking Mexican immigration law .......Which he has been challenged to prove but has been unsuccessful so far....

As far as BM goes it sounds like someones initials or old screen name,LOL


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

lagoloo said:


> A puzzlement: what is it with expats who seem to have an allergy to living among "too many" of their former countrymen? If there are enough of them who made the same decision to head South that we did, we are likely to find some of like mind and enjoy their company.
> 
> 
> You don't need to try to re-invent yourself. .


Those whom I have met that live outside "extranjero communities" seem to be a part of the Mexican community/life and actually have reinvented themselves. They speak Spanish everywhere, participate in their daily lives as if they were Mexicans, and rarely speak in English. Only once, in all my years being in Leon, have I met another person who speaks English. 
Living at Lakeside is like living NOB in many places. You are absolutely correct, "You don't need to try to re-invent yourself." Never need to experience anything vastly different from NOB. You never will understand much about the Mexican way of life, the Mexican people, nor the country of Mexico. So, why come to Mexico? To live cheaper? To impress others? To hide or run away?


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

chicois8 said:


> As far as BM goes it sounds like someones initials or old screen name,LOL


Where did you get it? What does it stand for? Is that too much to ask, if you use it you must know, no?


180 day rule ? I thought you said something about the RT. Am I wrong?


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

coondawg said:


> I thought that the RT and RP were RV's domain, not Longford? BTW, what does the BM stand for?


Might be the Bill Masterson from years ago


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

sparks said:


> Might be the Bill Masterson from years ago


I have a feeling that it might be a personal attack. Just wondered if he would "man up" to it. Guess I got my answer.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

coondawg said:


> Those whom I have met that live outside "extranjero communities" seem to be a part of the Mexican community/life and actually have reinvented themselves. They speak Spanish everywhere, participate in their daily lives as if they were Mexicans, and rarely speak in English. Only once, in all my years being in Leon, have I met another person who speaks English.
> Living at Lakeside is like living NOB in many places. You are absolutely correct, "You don't need to try to re-invent yourself." Never need to experience anything vastly different from NOB. You never will understand much about the Mexican way of life, the Mexican people, nor the country of Mexico. So, why come to Mexico? To live cheaper? To impress others?


You and I have a different notion of what "re-invent" means, and your rather intolerant comment puts a negative spin on what I was posting. 

You are who you are, no matter what language or languages you are fluent in; no matter where you live.
If you go downtown in places like Chapala or Ajijic with your eyes open, you will notice that the population in primarily Mexican and if you cannot communicate to a reasonable degree in Spanish, life will not go smoothly. Personally, I live in a mixed neighborhood and know my neighbors of both nationalities. I also know a number of foreigners.

Life here is nothing like life in the U.S.A, and living happily here is based on understanding the Mexican way of life. After living in Mexico for eleven years, it would be odd, not to.

I will grant you that there are people in this area who have managed to isolate themselves in gated compounds with attitudes indicating they might as well have stayed home. There are many kinds of expats. 

Your post is a fine example of what I was talking about: a peculiar reverse snobbery.
Your approach to life in Mexico is one way; but not the only way to be "okay".


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

sparks said:


> Culture and Ex-Pats


That is an oxymoron, isn‘t it?


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

RVGRINGO said:


> That is an oxymoron, isn‘t it?


Not for me and my (few) expat friends!


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

coondawg said:


> I thought that the RT and RP were RV's domain, not Longford? BTW, what does the BM stand for?


I said I thought that Chicois was preempting Longford, because on many threads where a poster (generally a newbie) indicates they might stay beyond 6 months, Longford has immediately jumped in asking if they are sure they will meet the requirements for residency, as he seems to have appointed himself as the only true, non-corrupt person defending Mexican Immigration laws.

Never mind that the actual law never states any prohibition against living long-term in Mexico whilst leaving and re-entering every 6 months on 180 day visitor permits. Never mind that at least 3 of us have directly asked Mexican Immigration officials if it is against the law to do so, and all 3 of us have been told it is NOT in violation of the law. (Tundra Green at a meeting with an Immigration official in Jalisco, Belize Girl when crossing back into Mexico from Belize on one of her "border runs" with her family, and myself at the airport in Mexico City). 

So when Chicois jumped in with that question early on in the thread, I thought he might be parodying Longford...


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

lagoloo said:


> You and I have a different notion of what "re-invent" means, and your rather intolerant comment puts a negative spin on what I was posting.
> 
> You are who you are, no matter what language or languages you are fluent in; no matter where you live.
> If you go downtown in places like Chapala or Ajijic with your eyes open, you will notice that the population in primarily Mexican and if you cannot communicate to a reasonable degree in Spanish, life will not go smoothly. Personally, I live in a mixed neighborhood and know my neighbors of both nationalities. I also know a number of foreigners.
> ...


I'm with Lagoloo on this one. I don't yet live in Mexico (just have a house and family there), so I tend to go for briefer stints. Until my most recent trip, I did not know any expats in Tepoztlan. There are plenty there, and I had seen them in many of the local venues. but given that we are always plenty busy with my husband's family and our Mexican friends, I had just never taken the time nor the opportunity to meet expats. This last visit I had read about a gathering of expats in Tepoztlan on a local Cuernavaca Yahoo Group, so I decided to attend. I did this because I thought it would be fun to meet other Anglo North Americans who share my love of Mexico, her people, her culture. It was fun.

I am completely fluent in Spanish and very comfortable in the culture. But increasingly I feel I want to synthesize my different worlds more, which means not avoiding expats just because (unless they are obnoxious and have a derogatory attitude towards Mexico - that I couldn't tolerate). 

Even in Toronto, about 80-90% of my social activities are with Latin Americans, but I still appreciate my Anglo friends, as well as those from other parts of the world - recently I was counting how many different countries are represented in my broader social circle - I stopped counting at 40 different countries - that's Toronto for you!


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

One more thought. If someone wants to avoid interacting with other expats, then why on earth are they participating on this Expat Forum??


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## cuerna1 (Mar 7, 2015)

ojosazules11 said:


> I'm with Lagoloo on this one. I don't yet live in Mexico (just have a house and family there), so I tend to go for briefer stints. Until my most recent trip, I did not know any expats in Tepoztlan. There are plenty there, and I had seen them in many of the local venues. but given that we are always plenty busy with my husband's family and our Mexican friends, I had just never taken the time nor the opportunity to meet expats. This last visit I had read about a gathering of expats in Tepoztlan on a local Cuernavaca Yahoo Group, so I decided to attend. I did this because I thought it would be fun to meet other Anglo North Americans who share my love of Mexico, her people, her culture. It was fun.
> 
> I am completely fluent in Spanish and very comfortable in the culture. But increasingly I feel I want to synthesize my different worlds more, which means not avoiding expats just because (unless they are obnoxious and have a derogatory attitude towards Mexico - that I couldn't tolerate).
> 
> Even in Toronto, about 80-90% of my social activities are with Latin Americans, but I still appreciate my Anglo friends, as well as those from other parts of the world - recently I was counting how many different countries are represented in my broader social circle - I stopped counting at 40 different countries - that's Toronto for you!


There is a nice little book store / cafe you should check out - if you haven't yet. 

La Sombra del Sabino


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

cuerna1 said:


> There is a nice little book store / cafe you should check out - if you haven't yet.
> 
> La Sombra del Sabino


Yes, that's on my list of things to do - has been for a while. I go by it regularly on our way to either my sister-in-law's place or the house of some close friends. But I still haven't stopped in.... Hopefully next visit! I saw they have been involved in bringing Amanda Martinez for concerts in Tepoztlan at least twice. Amanda is a Toronto-based Latin Jazz singer whose father is Mexican, and whose music I love. Both times I missed her performances by just a week!  Hopefully there will be a "next time" when I'm in town! One more way of bringing my different worlds together...


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

lagoloo said:


> You and I have a different notion of what "re-invent" means, and your rather intolerant comment puts a negative spin on what I was posting.
> 
> You are who you are, no matter what language or languages you are fluent in; no matter where you live.
> If you go downtown in places like Chapala or Ajijic with your eyes open, you will notice that the population in primarily Mexican and if you cannot communicate to a reasonable degree in Spanish, life will not go smoothly. Personally, I live in a mixed neighborhood and know my neighbors of both nationalities. I also know a number of foreigners.
> ...





coondawg said:


> Those whom I have met that live outside "extranjero communities" seem to be a part of the Mexican community/life and actually have reinvented themselves. They speak Spanish everywhere, participate in their daily lives as if they were Mexicans, and rarely speak in English. Only once, in all my years being in Leon, have I met another person who speaks English.
> Living at Lakeside is like living NOB in many places. You are absolutely correct, "You don't need to try to re-invent yourself." Never need to experience anything vastly different from NOB. You never will understand much about the Mexican way of life, the Mexican people, nor the country of Mexico. So, why come to Mexico? To live cheaper? To impress others? To hide or run away?


I tend to agree for the most part in both opinions and have manifested my opinion over the years to include a much broader view of the subject. If all personalities were similar then we would most likely all agree on what is important and what is superficial but seeing we all did in fact bring our baggage with us we will have a difference of opinion as to what is OK and what is not.


I might add to lagoloo´s comment that not only understanding the Mexican way of life but more importantly, to me, is accepting it. 

That being said I feel both understand some of the basic aspects of what it takes to be content to live here full time or part time.


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## MJD13 (Aug 11, 2014)

We live in the Sierra Madres of northern Mexico in a Pueblo Magico by the name of Alamos in the State of Sonora. Famous for its Spanish colonial architecture -- more than a few Presidents of Mexico had families from Alamos because this is where the money was for many years due to the silver mining. It's old Mexico with modern amenities. Internet is not great with 10mbps download somewhat standard. I know several people in the tech industry who telecommute from here who require decent internet and it seems to work for them. A longish but easy day drive to the border at Nogales -- around 8 hours. We are 30 minutes east of Navojoa, a medium sized town with all amenities including a multi-plex movie theater, Sam's Club, etc. About 60 minutes from the Sea of Cortez - Huatabampito - with beach restaurants. Three hours to San Carlos, a major marine center and often described as a mini Cabo, and a six hour drive to Mazatlan. An eclectic group of expats all of whom are here because of a common love of Mexico and its traditions. English is not widely spoken but, nonetheless, spoken enough to make shopping and interacting with vendors easy. One of Mexico's top small hotels is located here, the Hacienda de los Santos - check it out on Trip Advisor. There is a private small jet airport here. Bird hunting is a big draw and, during the season, hunters jet into Alamos from all over the world and stay at historic old hunting lodges or beautifully restored colonial hotels. Good luck with your search!


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Alan Mexicali: "I might add to lagoloo´s comment that not only understanding the Mexican way of life but more importantly, to me, is accepting it."

Just to nitpick a bit, "to understand" is, in my mind, to also "accept". Those who don't, tend to return NOB within the first three years....or less.

It doesn't take long to learn about and accept the fact that "time" is relative and many, many things are more important than money or promptness. People who can't adapt to this are seldom happy here. When they talk about what it is they want, it's usually to compare how much better (whatever) was back where they came from. Naturally, we learn to bite our tongues politely to avoid saying the obvious.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

lagoloo said:


> Alan Mexicali: "I might add to lagoloo´s comment that not only understanding the Mexican way of life but more importantly, to me, is accepting it."
> 
> Just to nitpick a bit, "to understand" is, in my mind, to also "accept". Those who don't, tend to return NOB within the first three years....or less.


I think of it as: for example; I completely understand USA far right wing ideology and their malicious tactics. But I do not accept it. I actually dislike it.

It is always good to add clarifiers and quantifiers when making comments as to not confuse others. IMO


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

AlanMexicali said:


> I think of it as: for example; I completely understand USA far right wing ideology and their malicious tactics. But I do not accept it. I actually dislike it.
> 
> It is always good to add clarifiers and quantifiers when making comments as to not confuse others. IMO


I don't know, personally, how I could ever understand the thought process (or lack of thought) of some who have embraced the more extreme right wing ideology and tactics. To me, it looks like those people have been brainwashed.........so I guess we disagree in our definitions. We do agree on disliking.
:juggle:


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## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

A friend of mine from boarding school who is a native of Mexico wrote this: "Lake chapala is not secure right now. Best places puerto vallarta, cabos, and playa del carmen, cancun." He lives in Mexico City but travels the country for business.


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

flyboynm said:


> A friend of mine from boarding school who is a native of Mexico wrote this: "Lake chapala is not secure right now. Best places puerto vallarta, cabos, and playa del carmen, cancun." He lives in Mexico City but travels the country for business.


Just another opinion. Did he tell you Vallarta exploded about 2 weeks ago and had more property damage than anywhere else in Jalisco


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## flyboynm (Oct 24, 2014)

LOL - no. I have been trying to get in touch with this guy for about 2 months and finally reached him. Right now, it looks like Playa Del Carmen or Puerto Vallarta for us. Which is a less expensive? Remember, we are on college student budgets of <$750 a month for housing. Which is a better bang for the buck?


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## Longford (May 25, 2012)

You will probably live less expensively in Puerto Vallarta. But, at the end of the day ... only you can say which is right for you.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

flyboynm said:


> LOL - no. I have been trying to get in touch with this guy for about 2 months and finally reached him. Right now, it looks like Playa Del Carmen or Puerto Vallarta for us. Which is a less expensive? Remember, we are on college student budgets of <$750 a month for housing. Which is a better bang for the buck?


You could probably save money by getting away from the tourist areas.


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

flyboynm said:


> LOL - no. I have been trying to get in touch with this guy for about 2 months and finally reached him. Right now, it looks like Playa Del Carmen or Puerto Vallarta for us. Which is a less expensive? Remember, we are on college student budgets of <$750 a month for housing. Which is a better bang for the buck?


This is an easy choice. The beaches and sea at Playa Del Carmen are far more beautiful than at Puerto Vallarta. Puerto Vallarta is very nice but overpriced with a churning and somewhat murky Pacific frontage. Playa Del Carmen and the Quintana Roo Coast all the way from the edge of Isla Holbox (on the border with Yucatan) to Xcalak just above the Belize border is blessed with beautiful white beaches and crystal clear coral seas with incredible diving opportunities. Playa may not be the top choice in Quintana Roo since you are on rental Budget but I am not a renter so who knows? If you reside on the western (inland) side of the highway in Quintana Roo but within an easy walk to the Caribbean beaches, rentals can be quite inexpensive.You have many choices of places to rent on that expansive coast so, why overgrown and a bit tacky Playa Del Carmen?

No contest. Go for the Gulf or the Caribbean in more rural áreas.


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