# GLS Royal Mail (UK) deliveries



## Ronnie_Yook

Hello, have you had any delivery delays/problems when expecting delivery of a parcel via Royal Mail (UK) to an address in Portugal.

There is an article in "The Portugal News" this week about this, but basically the problem is the Royal Mail have discontinued using the CTT Correios (Portuguese Post Office), and have contracted GLS, an international courier company based in Holland, to deliver the Royal Mail items here in Portugal.

The problem we have found here in Portugal, is that the Royal Mail are asking clients to contact their local post office for information about delayed Royal Mail mail/parcels, which is absurd as GLS are the company responsible for this, and you can view their website for "tracking".

In our own case a parcel was despatched on 6th April 2012 "International Signed For" by Royal Mail we have spent each day checking the Royal Mail "Track & Trace" facility on their website, phoning and visiting daily our local Correios. All of this was a complete waste of time as the Royal Mail had sent our consignment via the company GLS.

Our particular parcel has been in the UK, Germany, Spain & Portugal, the GLS delivery centre in Aveiro have returned the parcel to the sender in the UK as they could not contact us!

I would normally enclose web links to the relevant websites, but as a "newbie" on this forum I'm not allowed to post URL's till later.

I am considering contacting the British Embassy in Lisboa, as this is a serious matter for customers of Royal Mail.

Hope this is of interest
Ronnie


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## canoeman

Your complaint needs to be addressed to Royal Mail, it's* not* an Embassy matter.

How to complain – Consumer Focus


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## Ingles

My own personal opinion of GLS is :- There bloody useless !!!
RM have used them for many years for anything over 2 kilos
If there using them now for smaller weights oh hell 

In a short space of time I had 4 Large Parcels sent thru UK RM to myself 

1 - Arrived only because I started phoning them 2x a day 

3 - Where returned to UK as Address Unknown
The fact that my address was on 5 Sides of all the Parcles & Correct they where still not delivered at the first attempt

If your supplied with a Tracking Nº & it shows as landed in Lisboa get on the phone.

I know only use FedEx - UPS 7 day service


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## robc

being a bit selfish here, does anyone know who Amazon use for their deliveries as I have one "in transit"

Thanks in advance

Rob


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## canoeman

MRW A MRW empresa líder em transporte urgente até 80 kg, desde Andorra, Espanha, Gibraltar, Portugal e Venezuela, em envios nacionais e internacionais


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## robc

canoeman said:


> MRW A MRW empresa líder em transporte urgente até 80 kg, desde Andorra, Espanha, Gibraltar, Portugal e Venezuela, em envios nacionais e internacionais


Phew..............Thanks Canoe.

Rob


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## canoeman

You should be able to track, as yours is a new house could be worthwhile speaking to your MRW
distribution centre, with maybe GPS co-ordinates.


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## robc

canoeman said:


> You should be able to track, as yours is a new house could be worthwhile speaking to your MRW
> distribution centre, with maybe GPS co-ordinates.


Good Point..................I am tracking with email alerts so will be in contact with them once I know where the package is.

Thanks

Rob


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## ferragudofan

not sure this will reassure anyone - we've just posted a parcel (less than 2kg) to UK from PT - it took more than 2 weeks to arrive ... and that was with the more expensive 'tracker' system .... it took a week to get from the Algarve to Lisbon and another 4 days to arrive at Heathrow... humph!


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## canoeman

Shame we always find service Portugal to UK very good, but UK to here iffy


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## Ingles

ferragudofan said:


> not sure this will reassure anyone - we've just posted a parcel (less than 2kg) to UK from PT - it took more than 2 weeks to arrive ... and that was with the more expensive 'tracker' system .... it took a week to get from the Algarve to Lisbon and another 4 days to arrive at Heathrow... humph!


When I post to UK I take it in on Friday it's normally there by Tuesday 
If I send any other time it can take forever ?

Phoned PO/RM UK when I had my 3 Parcels returned by GLS , They did not give a damn.
The Client who sent the Samples also did the same :- Same outcome 

Hence FedEX - UPS , nothing arrives broken (Ceramics) & they drop it at my my door step


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## canoeman

Ingles said:


> Hence FedEX - UPS , nothing arrives broken (Ceramics) & they drop it at my my door step



Lucky ceramics don't arrive broken then if they drop it at your door step


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## Jonegy

Gordon Bennet - Back in UK at mo sorting 3 parcels to send back to Pt.

Best quote was for TNT - 3-day delivery.

After reading the comments above - anyone have any better suggestions ?

Help ! coming back on 27th :confused2:


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## canoeman

Bring them with you, extra case or excess probably less than send cost


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## Jonegy

canoeman said:


> Bring them with you, extra case or excess probably less than send cost


Thanks for the suggestion Canoeman but .................

..........the 'parcels' are actually ruddy great boxes about 20 kg each and traveling alone with Ryanair so the extra baggage route is a non-starter - also from north UK Ryan is our only option


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## canoeman

Thought with TNT you needed a VAT number, what about a web portal like Anyvan who invites quotes from transport companies


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## jellybean

Ingles said:


> My own personal opinion of GLS is :- There bloody useless !!!
> RM have used them for many years for anything over 2 kilos
> If there using them now for smaller weights oh hell
> 
> In a short space of time I had 4 Large Parcels sent thru UK RM to myself
> 
> 1 - Arrived only because I started phoning them 2x a day
> 
> 3 - Where returned to UK as Address Unknown
> The fact that my address was on 5 Sides of all the Parcles & Correct they where still not delivered at the first attempt
> 
> If your supplied with a Tracking Nº & it shows as landed in Lisboa get on the phone.
> 
> I know only use FedEx - UPS 7 day service


I agree with you Ingles. GLS are completely and utterly useless and I have been tearing my hair out trying to get my deliveries ever since the Royal Mail started using them for all signed for packages. 

Initially I had the same problem Ronnie mentioned that was in The Portugal News and was told by the Royal Mail to go to my local post office because the tracking info on the Royal Mail website said that they had attempted to deliver but there was an incorrect address. My local correios knew nothing of course and were completely confused. When I finally managed to get through to someone at the Royal Mail who told me it was GLS who had the package it took me ALL day to get through to GLS Portugal to arrange a redelivery. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the address, they just couldn't be bothered.

Now I am going through the same problem again with 2 packages I have ordered from the UK, both of which I have been waiting for for more than 3 weeks. Why it takes them so long when DHL & MRW can deliver in 4 days is beyond me. I have been trying to get through to GLS ALL DAY again with no luck. I'm am seriously peed off. We should all complain to the Royal Mail so they know how aggrieved we are. The response I got from them is that they have used GLS for years and have had no problems with them. MY FOOT!


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## canoeman

Maybe because GLS have such a small operation in Portugal, according to their site they only have 7 distribution centers and 150 delivery vehicles, no doubt centered around major populated areas.


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## Ingles

canoeman said:


> Maybe because GLS have such a small operation in Portugal, according to their site they only have 7 distribution centers and 150 delivery vehicles, no doubt centered around major populated areas.


That's more than enough for a country the size of Portugal 

As "jellybean" wrote they can't be bothered to do the job there contracted to do.

So why are you trying to come up with an excuse for there lousy service ?

This may help 

htpp://www.royalmail.com/customer-service/complaints-process


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## canoeman

Ingles said:


> That's more than enough for a country the size of Portugal
> 
> As "jellybean" wrote they can't be bothered to do the job there contracted to do.
> 
> So why are you trying to come up with an excuse for there lousy service ?
> 
> This may help
> 
> htpp://www.royalmail.com/customer-service/complaints-process



I'm *not *making any excuses for them, but pointing that 150 vehicles to delivery throughout Portugal, isn't enough, that's 8 per administrative region hardly thick on the ground or sufficient to give a good service, or as you seem to think 

"That's more than enough for a country the size of Portugal "


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## Jonegy

Hi Canoeman.

Listed packets on Anyvan and had first quote this morning - £30 dearer than TNT but looks like a more personal service.

A very good point for me is that in the case of sending to yourself, packets can be held in Maia ( 21 days free ) and delivered after arrival in pt.

Thanks for the tip - will see other quotes I get upto the weekend


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## jellybean

canoeman said:


> I'm *not *making any excuses for them, but pointing that 150 vehicles to delivery throughout Portugal, isn't enough, that's 8 per administrative region hardly thick on the ground or sufficient to give a good service, or as you seem to think
> 
> "That's more than enough for a country the size of Portugal "


If they dont have enough vehicles to provide an efficient service they shouldn't have taken on the contract or the Royal Mail shouldn't have offered them the contract. Aren't these things put out to tender? Seems the Royal Mail went for the cheapest option without caring about whether or not the company can deliver a decent service.

It has taken me 2 days to get through to GLS about the 2 parcels. When I asked why they had not been delivered they said that my address was 'not on their system'.

Me: But the address is on the parcels
GLS: But it is not on our system
Me: So why didn't you take the address off the parcel and put it on your system?
GLS: We do not work like that. The shipper has to call us to confirm the address so we can put it on our system.
Me: That's ridiculous! 
GLS: That is how we work
Me: What if the shipper can't get through to you? I have tried for 2 days to get through to you and noone answers the phone.
GLS: We are very busy (Note: NO APOLOGY)
Me: So when will my parcels be delivered?
GLS: They will be delivered tomorrow now that we have your address. Please give me your number in case the driver can not find your home.

So that's the latest. I can put money on them not turning up or calling to say they dont know where I live even though I live in a well populated area with door numbers and road signs (which is not always the case in some Portuguese villages) and even though they have been here before!! HUMPH!

Nothing to do with whether or not they have enough vehicles. They are simply incompetent!


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## canoeman

Or maybe Royal Mail for giving them the contract, maybe you should inform shipper who probably won't be pleased, and Royal Mail


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## jellybean

I have done both. The company I ordered from have also complained to RM and were told that they are 'monitoring' the situation with GLS. Sounds like more people have complained so perhaps the service will improve or, if not, the contract will go to someone else. I live in hope.


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## robc

Just to chuck my two pennyworth in to the discussion.
I had my delivery from Amazon, via MRW, absolutely spot on and considering they shipped it via the free super saver option, even better.

Now I have a couple of more things I wish to purchase in the UK, so I have mailed the selling companies asking if they use Royal Mail, as if they do then I will go elsewhere.

One replied and made alternate arrangements, the other said "Royal Mail or Nothing" so I told them I will take the nothing option then. (My that felt good to do that even though I have not sourced what I need elsewhere yet)

Perhaps if enough of us get through to RM via their sales operation then things will change

Rob


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## jellybean

robc said:


> Just to chuck my two pennyworth in to the discussion.
> I had my delivery from Amazon, via MRW, absolutely spot on and considering they shipped it via the free super saver option, even better.
> 
> Now I have a couple of more things I wish to purchase in the UK, so I have mailed the selling companies asking if they use Royal Mail, as if they do then I will go elsewhere.
> 
> One replied and made alternate arrangements, the other said "Royal Mail or Nothing" so I told them I will take the nothing option then. (My that felt good to do that even though I have not sourced what I need elsewhere yet)
> 
> Perhaps if enough of us get through to RM via their sales operation then things will change
> 
> Rob


Ah! Now that's a good idea Rob! I have already told one of my suppliers that I would rather pay extra and have my stuff delivered in 2 days by DHL without the hassle you get from the Royal Mail/GLS arrangement! So I agree, we all need to ensure RM get the message that we are not happy with GLS and will take our business elsewhere! Spread the word!!!! :clap2:


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## robc

jellybean said:


> Ah! Now that's a good idea Rob! I have already told one of my suppliers that I would rather pay extra and have my stuff delivered in 2 days by DHL without the hassle you get from the Royal Mail/GLS arrangement! So I agree, we all need to ensure RM get the message that we are not happy with GLS and will take our business elsewhere! Spread the word!!!! :clap2:


Hopefully it will via the good offices of web sites such as this.


Rob


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## jellybean

robc said:


> Just to chuck my two pennyworth in to the discussion.
> I had my delivery from Amazon, via MRW, absolutely spot on and considering they shipped it via the free super saver option, even better.
> 
> Now I have a couple of more things I wish to purchase in the UK, so I have mailed the selling companies asking if they use Royal Mail, as if they do then I will go elsewhere.
> 
> One replied and made alternate arrangements, the other said "Royal Mail or Nothing" so I told them I will take the nothing option then. (My that felt good to do that even though I have not sourced what I need elsewhere yet)
> 
> Perhaps if enough of us get through to RM via their sales operation then things will change
> 
> Rob


Ah! Now that's a good idea Rob! I have already told one of my suppliers that I would rather pay extra and have my stuff delivered in 2 days by DHL without the hassle you get from the Royal Mail/GLS arrangement! So I agree, we all need to ensure RM get the message that we are not happy with GLS and will take our business elsewhere! Spread the word!!!! :clap2:


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## jellybean

robc said:


> Hopefully it will via the good offices of web sites such as this.
> 
> 
> Rob


Despite telling me that it would be delivered last Friday and having waited in all day, GLS have still not delivered my parcel!  I spent the last 2 hours of Friday afternoon trying to get through to them without success. Complaining to the Royal Mail was hopeless as they just give the standard response that the SENDER has to fill in a form so they can look into the problem and you might get a response in 6 weeks if you're lucky! That doesn't get me my parcel! So I sent a letter of complaint to the GLS Head Office in Amsterdam expressing my frustration with my dealings with their operation in Portugal etc. I also spent all weekend sending GLS Portugal faxes asking where my parcel is and when would it be delivered, hoping that they would turn up on Monday morning with masses of fax msgs from me all over their office floor!

My campaigning appears to have worked as I got a message from the Head Office this morning apologising for the problems I have had with GLS in Portugal and promising to raise the matter with them. Shortly afterwards I got a call from a manager at GLS in Lisbon promising my parcel would be delivered today! So I am keeping my fingers crossed but not holding my breath.

The BAD news is that I have discovered that GLS is a subsidiary of Royal Mail so it looks like this is an arrangement we are stuck with. We can only hope that by complaining loudly, the service improves.


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## canoeman

Maybe complaints to sender if they are a business that uses Royal Mail for parcel delivery might help, hope it arrives today


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## Ingles

Ingles said:


> My own personal opinion of GLS is :- There bloody useless !!!
> RM have used them for many years for anything over 2 kilos
> If there using them now for smaller weights oh hell
> 
> In a short space of time I had 4 Large Parcels sent thru UK RM to myself
> 
> 1 - Arrived only because I started phoning them 2x a day
> 
> 3 - Where returned to UK as Address Unknown
> The fact that my address was on 5 Sides of all the Parcles & Correct they where still not delivered at the first attempt
> 
> If your supplied with a Tracking Nº & it shows as landed in Lisboa get on the phone.
> 
> I know only use FedEx - UPS 7 day service


 *GLS* :- ****** , This useless bunch off "bankers" have struck yet again .
I was waiting on a Registered Letter from a UK Goverment Office that had some very important papers in it.
GLS I learned today have returned it to UK ,they never even tried to deliver & never contacted myself in any way !!!
I have complained to RM & now going to do the same to GLS,I know this won't do any good but it will make me feel better.


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## canoeman

Yet a M&S delivery who according to their site use Royal Mail, dispatched a parcel on the 26th May received here delivered by* CTT* on the 1st June, pleasantly surprised after reading others comments on GLS as expected problems.


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## jellybean

Ingles said:


> *GLS* :- ****** , This useless bunch off "bankers" have struck yet again .
> I was waiting on a Registered Letter from a UK Goverment Office that had some very important papers in it.
> GLS I learned today have returned it to UK ,they never even tried to deliver & never contacted myself in any way !!!
> I have complained to RM & now going to do the same to GLS,I know this won't do any good but it will make me feel better.


Ingles, send your complaint by email to the GLS Head Office. The email address is [email protected] and you will receive a reply the same day. I do this now every time I have waited more than one week for something from the UK and the tracking information has 'gone cold'. They then call me promising to deliver normally the next day. It seems they just sit on items and can't be bothered to deliver them until the recipient asks where it is!! 

I've also discovered that RM are using GLS for 'Intl Signed for' items but not Airsure - which is still tracked but is delivered by CTT in about 4 days. So, if possible, I ask people to use Airsure and not RM Intl Signed for.

You're right, they are a bunch of BANKERS! :boxing:


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## jellybean

canoeman said:


> Yet a M&S delivery who according to their site use Royal Mail, dispatched a parcel on the 26th May received here delivered by* CTT* on the 1st June, pleasantly surprised after reading others comments on GLS as expected problems.


Royal Mail only use GLS to deliver International SIGNED FOR post. CTT continues to deliver ordinary airmail and Airsure items and yes, they are much more efficient.


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## canoeman

M&S deliveries are signed for, so I was as I said pleasantly surprised that CTT delivered not GLS


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## jellybean

canoeman said:


> M&S deliveries are signed for, so I was as I said pleasantly surprised that CTT delivered not GLS


There are 2 international tracked services - RM International Signed for and RM Airsure. Obviously M&S use the Airsure service. The difference being that you can track International Signed for on the RM website door to door, but Airsure can only be tracked up until the point it leaves the UK. It is slightly cheaper.


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## Ingles

I sent 2 Complaints
Royal Mail :- they replied the SENDER has to complain before they will take any action.

GLS :- read by [email protected] on 14.06 2012 
So far NO reply 

Mind you I did state that I thought there staff in Portugal where completely incompetent & how could a Registered Letter with FULL Postal Address & Post code be returned to sender marked " Address Unknown" as this was beyond my comprehension !


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## oranger

Exactly, they are only using GLS for international signed for - not Airsure or normal (unsigned-for) parcels. So that should help at least finding other options.

But this situation is slightly ridiculous. Royal Mail provide a tracking number which does not work on GLS tracking systems. You have to wait for an advice note to come through with GLS's own number on it before being able to track it - and of course it takes a lot longer to come through with GLS. The problem with parcels is, of course, that often the purchaser has no choice of courier/delivery service, which only adds to the pain and frustration. 

Here is someone waiting for a package for 2 weeks, only had an advice through eventually on Friday to say it was with GLS, and they said it would be delivered today - another whole, hot day wasted waiting in for a tiny little delivery that should have arrived two weeks ago. Talk about frustrating. Have already emailed Royal Mail to complain and already told GLS that I will never willingly use them again. 

Am sure RM (who are in financial trouble and trying to set themselves up for privatisation) went for the lowest contract bid. And I'm sure CTT (also in financial trouble and trying to set themselves up for privatisation) put their prices up which didn't help. 

Anyway, what a nightmare... Vote with your feet people (where possible).

By the way, I use Pharos Parcel (a reseller for UPS) for bigger parcels as it's only about £25 for 30kg - always reliable and easy to track. Alas, only sensible for bigger stuff though...


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## Ingles

Still NO Reply from GLS Holding in Holland.

Obviously they just "don't give a damn"


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## oranger

Ingles said:


> Still NO Reply from GLS Holding in Holland.
> 
> Obviously they just "don't give a damn"


To me either. And a very belligerent, generic response to my complaint from Royal Mail just arrived. All a bit of a farce.

Am voting with my feet and telling anyone I buy stuff from not to use the 'internation signed-for' service. Hopefully it will help.

The good news is that, finally, the parcel arrived today after the courier called me (having left my mobile number with GLS). Que sorte zzzzzzzz!! Only 3 weeks after it was sent.


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## Maggy Crawford

I ordered some breathalyser kits (compulsory for France now) from BabyMad via Amazon and paid a huge sum for P+P. It turns out that this is Royal Mail Sign For service. In light of all the posts made I wonder what my chances of receiving it are. The address is the village where we live, no street name or number (we don't have them) but they do have a contact telephone number. Any advice anyone? I ordered them on 25 June and it was despatched on 26 June.


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## oranger

Maggy Crawford said:


> I ordered some breathalyser kits (compulsory for France now) from BabyMad via Amazon and paid a huge sum for P+P. It turns out that this is Royal Mail Sign For service. In light of all the posts made I wonder what my chances of receiving it are. The address is the village where we live, no street name or number (we don't have them) but they do have a contact telephone number. Any advice anyone? I ordered them on 25 June and it was despatched on 26 June.


I suspect it will come eventually - just annoying to have the delays and uncertainty!


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## canoeman

I've just received a signed for delivery UK Post Office via GLS took 4 days to arrive here, then 5 +2 non working working days for delivery.
We neither have house number, street name, the tracking system does work though although think options/reasons shown a bit misleading.
After others posts I was surprised it did arrive and in a reasonable time ?? I'm really not surprised the service is slow our nearest depot is about 100kms away so it's very unlikely to be anything but as the sender in this case is unlikely to make a complaint, just hope now they've delivered once next one won't be as long.


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## oranger

That is interesting canoeman. I suspect a lot of my experience is due to lack of drivers in Lisbon (or perhaps problems with particular drivers). Once I had eventually managed to track it I noticed it kept saying that it was out for delivery for successive days on end, but never did they actually try to deliver it. Which implies that the driver perhaps had too much to deliver in too short a time. Perhaps just bad route management or something. Anyway... 

Good Luck Sometimes!


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## canoeman

I made the point some time back that GLS don't appear to have the infrastructure here to give an acceptable level of service and I believe that to be the case 7 depots and 150 vans is not going to give you a next day delivery, and will result in that "not delivered due to a wrong address" which is probably the best non penalized option for the driver.

Tracking If you select English option first then it's all in English as well


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## Maggy Crawford

Thank you for your somewhat reassuring replies. I continue waiting. The closest large town to us is Coimbra, I don't know if there is a depot there.


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## canoeman

Averio/Viseu will be your closest, but as you can see delivery is never going to be quick unless your on the doorstep of a depot
Facts & Figures sobre a GLS - A sua empresa de Entregas e Logística


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## Ingles

canoeman said:


> I made the point some time back that GLS don't appear to have the infrastructure here to give an acceptable level of service and I believe that to be the case 7 depots and 150 vans is not going to give you a next day delivery, and will result in that "not delivered due to a wrong address" which is probably the best non penalized option for the driver.
> 
> Tracking If you select English option first then it's all in English as well



They have the infrastructure here to do the job there paid to do 
But for some reason fail to do so !!

Next Day Delivery ??? ,where is that in the T&C's

None delivery seems to be more common & goods returned to UK because the "Address is Unknown" not "Wrong Address"

How can a "Address be Unknown" when 100% off my normal post arrives at the same address including all my bills which I would be more than happy if they where returned to sender

+ I posted about this ongoing problem on another ExPat Site & a well informed poster stated that GLS is operating in 11 European Countries & is a Royal Mail owned company.


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## siobhanwf

all you have to do is google and there they are...
GLS: Your high quality parcel service provider

Pretty well spead out across Europe.
But noticeably UK is not listed as one of the GLS companies but rather as a network partner/agent


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## canoeman

Ingles said:


> They have the infrastructure here to do the job there paid to do
> But for some reason fail to do so !!
> 
> Next Day Delivery ??? ,where is that in the T&C's
> 
> None delivery seems to be more common & goods returned to UK because the "Address is Unknown" not "Wrong Address"
> 
> How can a "Address be Unknown" when 100% off my normal post arrives at the same address including all my bills which I would be more than happy if they where returned to sender
> 
> + I posted about this ongoing problem on another ExPat Site & a well informed poster stated that GLS is operating in 11 European Countries & is a Royal Mail owned company.


What infrastructure 7 depots 150 vans hardly enough to cover Portugal effectively.

Address unknown etc I'll think you find are the options available to driver to enter on his hand held device if he's not been able to deliver, I'm still trying to work out why my letter arrived in Portugal went to Spain back to Portugal then out for delivery but it arrived


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## Ingles

canoeman said:


> What infrastructure 7 depots 150 vans hardly enough to cover Portugal effectively.
> 
> Address unknown etc I'll think you find are the options available to driver to enter on his hand held device if he's not been able to deliver, *I'm still trying to work out **why my letter arrived in Portugal went to Spain back to Portugal then out for delivery but it arrived*





As above there NBG at there job thats why !


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## siobhanwf

MRW who deliver for Amazon have 17 branches or depots throughout Portugal and are well covered.
I received a packet from Seur last week for the first time nad no porblems (the called my mobile to check on location.
UPS have never had any problem finding us but DHL well that is anothr story.


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## canoeman

MRW also operate a franchise system so they have more depots and vans, but then Amazon doesn't take 4 days to deliver item to Portugal for onward delivery!


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## Ingles

Canoeman :- Have you ever had a problem with GLS ?

Have you had to phone them several times to try get thru to get a delivery sorted ?

Have you READ "jellybeans" post's about unanswered phone calls ?

Have you had Parcels arrive 4-5 weeks late because they have been returned to UK ?

Have you ever heard off a Registered Letter not being delivered for the reason the Address was Unknown ?

I bet the answer to all the above is a resounding NO ,but you still insists they have not enough resources.:clap2::clap2::clap2:


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## canoeman

Ingles said:


> I bet the answer to all the above is a resounding NO ,but you still insists they have not enough resources.:clap2::clap2::clap2:



I've just posted the length of time a Registered letter took to arrive, so yes but thank you very much for confirming my point in your words * but you still insists they have not enough resources:clap2::clap2::clap2:*

if they did have enough resources then we wouldn't be going on about them would we, we'd be complementing them.


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## Ingles

canoeman said:


> *I've just posted the length of time a Registered letter* *took to arrive*, so yes but thank you very much for confirming my point in your words * but you still insists they have not enough resources:clap2::clap2::clap2:*
> 
> if they did have enough resources then we wouldn't be going on about them would we, we'd be complementing them.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The question was *"Have you ever heard off a Registered Letter NOT being delivered for the reason Address was Unknown ?*

Logistics & Business :- Goods sent by Air from UK to Portugal - GLS fail to deliver for reasons nobody can figure out so Goods returned to UK by Air

UK Sender therefore has the legal right to have the COST they paid out reimbursed

Facts :- 5 units sent to myself - 1 Unit arrived after 3 weeks !
4 Units returned to UK 
3 Units resent to Portugal arrived 4-5 weeks later than expected 
1 Unit never resent 
*80% *Failure Rate on 1st Delivery 

This is not a resources problem as it's obvious & basic common sense that the Management off GLS Portugal is not up to the job


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## canoeman

I can only answer from my experience of GLS, did they deliver yes and acceptable time not really, did the tracking system work yes.

If they don't have the depots or vans on the ground then it really makes little difference the quality of the management, more raises the question why Royal Mail have a contract with them whether they own them or not.


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## Maggy Crawford

The latest news. I have just got through to GLS after tracking the parcel via Spain to Viseu. The very nice young lady (Magda Cardoso) answered after the phone after only a few minutes and spoke excellent English. She told me the parcel is due for delivery tomorrow and I gave her contact telephone number, very clear instructions to our house and GPS coordinates from the weather site yr.no (as I now nothing about GPS). She repeated it all back to me perfectly. Myabe there is hope yet. Watch this space.


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## Maggy Crawford

The parcel finally arrived this afternoon (Monday) instead of Friday. I cancelled a very nice lunch date on Friday to wait in all day. I finally called GLS late Friday afternoon to be told that "due to a telematic error" delivery would be Monday. I then telephoned Royal Mail Customer Relations to be told they are not responsible for GLS. I replied but they are responsible for subcontracting them. In the end spoke with a "manager" called Richard (oops, not supposed to give his name) who again denied any liability. He also said they had never received any complaints so I referred him to this website and Portugal News to which he replied he "was not allowed to access outside websites form work and had better things to do with his spare time". I have referred the matter to Amazon and the seller BabyMad Ltd with the suggestion that they cease using the Royal Mail International Signed For Service so long as GLS are in place. I, for one, will always ensure that any goods I order are not sent via this method.


----------



## alpinehermit

*not just portugal*



jellybean said:


> Ingles, send your complaint by email to the GLS Head Office]
> 
> Thank you jellybean! I'm in France, and a package which GLS was supposed to be delivering to me from Austria did not arrive. I found a French consumer website full of criticism of GLS and one person managed to provide a list of the tel. nos. of all the depots in France. But my local one doesn't answer. Then I found this thread. So this morning I emailed the address you suggested (which I'm not allowed to quote it seems as this is my first post) - and received a reply this afternoon; they will "attempt" to deliver the package tomorrow. Have had to cancel the day's plans in order to be in to receive it, but there we are. I think it's disgusting that in order to sort out an error on the part of GLS we are expected to ring a premium rate no. Thanks to you, I've managed to avoid this - I hope.


----------



## Ingles

I hope you have better luck than I'm having !
I sent the same e-mail to GLS Holland over the "Unknown Address" Registered Letter 4 times now & never had a reply 
Real crappy service :crazy:


----------



## JohnBoy

What an interesting thread. I now understand why the tickets and visas for my recent holiday did not arrive until a week after we left.

I will make sure that my travel agent is made aware of the reason he had to pay for a motorcycle courier to deliver replacements to us at Gatwick. Hopefully they will make their displeasure known to RM.


----------



## siobhanwf

Maggy Crawford said:


> The parcel finally arrived this afternoon (Monday) instead of Friday. I cancelled a very nice lunch date on Friday to wait in all day. I finally called GLS late Friday afternoon to be told that "due to a telematic error" delivery would be Monday. I then telephoned Royal Mail Customer Relations to be told they are not responsible for GLS. I replied but they are responsible for subcontracting them. In the end spoke with a "manager" called Richard (oops, not supposed to give his name) who again denied any liability. He also said they had never received any complaints so I referred him to this website and Portugal News to which he replied he "was not allowed to access outside websites form work and had better things to do with his spare time". I have referred the matter to Amazon and the seller BabyMad Ltd with the suggestion that they cease using the Royal Mail International Signed For Service so long as GLS are in place. I, for one, will always ensure that any goods I order are not sent via this method.




Well I had an in depth conversation with a manager at Royal Mail customer service to be told that they were very aware of the problem with GLS and it was been looked into!!!!!!
I also told him that not just expats were complaining about GLS but portuguese customers too!


----------



## siobhanwf

Delivery from ROYAL MAIL vis GLS.... 7 days from supplier to reach GLS in Spain then forwarded to GLS Portugal....
Due to be delivered on Friday last....have found how to track a RM delivery with GLS online I found the item was out for delivery. By 5pm having stayed in all day I call GLS office to be told after they had checked with the driver that he could not find the address. Later checked their website to see the remark " the WRONG ADDRESS was on the packet"

Delivery rearranged for Monday.... detailed directions sent to GLS (that was a waste of time!!!!) and on monday about midday had a call from the driver to ask for directions. Eventually met him in the nearby town!!!!!!

I have told the company I bought from that until they start using other than Royal Mail I will not be shopping with them and I am a regular customer!

Have also told Lakeland the same thing as they use Royal Mail fro small items!


----------



## Ingles

siobhanwf said:


> Delivery from ROYAL MAIL vis GLS.... 7 days from supplier to reach GLS in Spain then forwarded to GLS Portugal....
> Due to be delivered on Friday last....have found how to track a RM delivery with GLS online I found the item was out for delivery. By 5pm having stayed in all day I call GLS office to be told after they had checked with the driver that he could not find the address. Later checked their website to see the remark " the WRONG ADDRESS was on the packet"
> 
> Delivery rearranged for Monday.... detailed directions sent to GLS (that was a waste of time!!!!) and on monday about midday had a call from the driver to ask for directions. Eventually met him in the nearby town!!!!!!
> 
> I have told the company I bought from that until they start using other than Royal Mail I will not be shopping with them and I am a regular customer!
> 
> Have also told Lakeland the same thing as they use Royal Mail fro small items!


Well done for getting hold off RM UK :clap2::clap2::clap2::clap2:


----------



## siobhanwf

Will dog out the number if I can backtrack and post it on here


----------



## Ingles

siobhanwf said:


> Will dog out the number if I can backtrack and post it on here


Please do: I sent RM a complaint & they replied that only the SENDER is allowed to Complain


----------



## siobhanwf

They seem to make up the rules as they go along!!!!

The number I called on is:
From within UK: 08457 740 740. International callers: +44 1752387112 
available 8am–6pm


----------



## siobhanwf

The GLS site is not easy to navigate but the page you need for tracking your ROYAL MAIL package is 

Track & Trace: GLS Parcel tracking



Pop in your ROYAL MAIL tracking number and it works it all out for you...


I have another parcel on the way so think I might send them the GPS cordinates once I have the item in the GLS tracking system


----------



## JohnBoy

siobhanwf said:


> The GLS site is not easy to navigate but the page you need for tracking your ROYAL MAIL package is
> 
> Track & Trace: GLS Parcel tracking
> 
> 
> 
> Pop in your ROYAL MAIL tracking number and it works it all out for you...
> 
> 
> I have another parcel on the way so think I might send them the GPS cordinates once I have the item in the GLS tracking system


Thanks for that Siobhan. It was very useful in providing me with evidence that I need to pursue the claim against my tour operator. It's complicated and best not to go there!

According to the GLS site I signed for the package containing my flight tickets and visas at 13:32 on 21 June in Coimbra. Actually GLS, I was supping a rather nice red at 37,000 feet over the Atlantic at that time.

Useless  doesn't begin to describe them.


----------



## Ingles

canoeman said:


> I made the point some time back that GLS don't appear to have the infrastructure here to give an acceptable level of service and I believe that to be the case 7 depots and 150 vans is not going to give you a next day delivery, and will result in that "not delivered due to a wrong address" which is probably the best non penalized option for the driver.
> 
> Tracking If you select English option first then it's all in English as well


Hi Canoeman - You seem to have lost interest now that more people are complaining about there service ??


----------



## canoeman

Not at all, I'm following thread, I've made my comments on service I received, tracking system worked etc.
As you've found out it's the sender who has to make the complaint to Royal Mail, if GLS don't answer then fill out the Complaints Book in Portugal then you must get an answer.

I'd again refer you to the quote of mine you've made, your never going to get an efficient service in Portugal from a company with that infrastructure. 

Personally I now check how things are sent from UK or EU before I decide to place any orders and if I need things sent recorded/registered endeavor to make different arrangements.


----------



## Ingles

The infrastructure problem you insist is the cause is correct to some extent , but after being in business here for many years I can soundly assure you that it's GLS staff mental infrastructure thats at fault.


----------



## canoeman

Well that's your take on GLS, insist no, pointing out yes, but nice to know I'm now correct to some extent not your first response though and as I've been in business in distribution can also soundly assure you can't give an effective service to an area the size of Portugal with 7 depots and 150 vehicles.

Anyway I understood your complaints had been made to GLS head office and often how the H/O operates reflects on it's components.

The only way end users of GLS are going to get change if Royal Mail continue to use them is to make direct complaints via Complaints Book here or by complaints, claims or canceling orders to sender in UK to take up with Royal Mail.


----------



## Ingles

I think some off you may find these 2 links interesting 

Reclamação GLS

Reclamaçâo GLS = Complaints page started up by dissatisfied Portuguese over lack off service by GLS ,all these complaints are over goods sent from UK !

GLS Portugal | Parcel

This shows that GLS have only 6 Depots , but have 250 Vehicles on the road ?
Confused ,so am I


----------



## travelling-man

FWIW, I've now had 3 separate items I've ordered from traders selling on Amazon that have been returned to the senders.

Each time, they had the correct address and there are only 2 houses in the road...... The other is owned by a local guy so I fail to understand how the PT postal service can fail to find my house!


----------



## canoeman

You need to first find out how "traders" selling on Amazon dispatched, Amazon supplied orders are delivered by MRW


----------



## robc

canoeman said:


> You need to first find out how "traders" selling on Amazon dispatched, Amazon supplied orders are delivered by MRW


The key is to look at who is actually doing the supplying, often it may be an intermediary seller and not Amazon. This is when the Amazon - MRW service can break down.

HTH

Rob


----------



## canoeman

robc said:


> The key is to look at who is actually doing the supplying, often it may be an intermediary seller and not Amazon. This is when the Amazon - MRW service can break down.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Rob


That's what I said, generally if you pay delivery then goods are supplied by an intermediary seller or trader, if this is the case and seller uses RM and probably GLS here then complain to Amazon as well, although they'll probably say your contract is with them, they won't want their reputation tarnished and therefore might bring pressure to bear in the right quarters.


----------



## travelling-man

Some of the failures I've experienced have had tracking numbers and some not so I don't really know what the answer is...... All have left the UK via Royal Mail rather than courier.


----------



## canoeman

Which probably means GLS deliver here, just enter RM tracking number on GLS site Track & Trace: GLS Portugal Parcel tracking links it to GLS number, or to find your depot Depot search: Find the GLS depot close to you


----------



## travelling-man

My latest one was an ebay order, sent by RM with a tracking number & the RM site says it left the UK 4 days ago but the GLS website says no info so I assume it was handed over to another carrier.

Time will tell if it arrives.


----------



## canoeman

My last RM delivery did take more than 4 days to reach Portugal and show on GLS site


----------



## travelling-man

I guess I'll have to be patient!


----------



## robc

travelling-man said:


> I guess I'll have to be patient!


My last RM delivery was 13 days.

Patience is a virtue but that was pushing it!!!!!

Rob


----------



## Ingles

Yesterday I took delivery from *PT Correio's* of a "small packet" from UK 
It was posted on Mon 23 :clap2:


----------



## Ingles

canoeman said:


> Maybe because GLS have such a small operation in Portugal, according to their site they only have 7 distribution centers and 150 delivery vehicles, no doubt centered around major populated areas.


But according to the GLS Web Site I posted a link too they have 250 vehicles.
Surley thats enough Van's to cover Portugal ?


----------



## canoeman

You seem to have found a different GLS site this one which states 
11 long distance trucks
150 delivery vehicles 
7 distribution centers and 1 hub 
GLS Portugal:Serviços de transporte de encomendas e logística

I've found track & trace does seem to work but using depot search says I don't have one, so I'll continue not dealing with UK suppliers who use RM & GLS


----------



## Ingles

I had a call this morning from a Sr Júlio Silva who is Project Manager at GLS.
Full off aplogise for failure to deliver the Registered Letter etc 

Just received an e-mail from GLS with a Google Map & a request to confirm this is the track I live up ??

In the the e-mail was the following 
"Please confirm us your address for future deliveries (door number or a Google Map link would be great)

Please be advised that it seems that NO aviso will be sent to the receiving Client when a Registered Letter/ Package is up for delivery ,they will just turn up at your door that's if they can find it ?

He also stated the reason for none delivery was that the driver could not find my house (he only had to stop & ask where the Ingles lived as I'm the only one in the area)
Overall impression I got :deadhorse:


----------



## siobhanwf

OMG I think I am going to KILL the lot of them!!!!


----------



## Ingles

Less than 5 hours after posting my last post (Aug 1) I got a call from friends in UK to tell me that as they had won a all singing all dancing Apple I Phone in a competition they had eairlier in the day posted off one of the 8 month old phones to myself using RM Registered & in the morning would mail me the tracking Nº

I thanked them profusely & when the call was terminated & the phone off a string of expletives I did utter the mildest of which was "******" 

RM + GLS = Stress & will it ever arrive ??

But - On getting home friday night (Aug 3) in my post box was a Aviso from *CTT* stating that a Registered Letter/Package would be ready for collection in my local PO on 06.08.2012 @ 14.00 hours :clap2::clap2::clap2:

Have GLS been kicked into touch ,has any body got any info please ?


----------



## travelling-man

My latest package left the UK within a day of my placing my order, was correctly addressed, and also with GPS location and phone number.

It took about 3 weeks to get from the UK to showing on the GLS website as being on the van for delivery and it showed being on the van for 3 days......... After 3 emails to GLS, I eventually I received a phone call from the driver who was completely lost.

Eventually I gave up trying to tell him how to get here and arranged to meet him outside the nearest Bombeiros. 

And after all that, the contents were damaged! 

They're about as much use as a one legged man at an arse kicking contest!


----------



## siobhanwf

Well not to be outdone but.... My latest package left the day it was ordered. Took 4 days to show on the GLS system and came straight to Portugal! Arriving here 5 days after being logged in in UK. after sending them the GPS coordinates it then took them 3 attempts to deliver it!! This time I refused to meet them in rio maior!! 
According to the driver the parcel was wrongly addressed!! Yet when I called GLS and first asked what address did they have on the parcel it was the correct one!! 

GLS ARE A WASTE OF SPACE,!


----------



## siobhanwf

Ingles said:


> Less than 5 hours after posting my last post (Aug 1) I got a call from friends in UK to tell me that as they had won a all singing all dancing Apple I Phone in a competition they had eairlier in the day posted off one of the 8 month old phones to myself using RM Registered & in the morning would mail me the tracking Nº
> 
> I thanked them profusely & when the call was terminated & the phone off a string of expletives I did utter the mildest of which was "******"
> 
> RM + GLS = Stress & will it ever arrive ??
> 
> But - On getting home friday night (Aug 3) in my post box was a Aviso from *CTT* stating that a Registered Letter/Package would be ready for collection in my local PO on 06.08.2012 @ 14.00 hours :clap2::clap2::clap2:
> 
> Have GLS been kicked into touch ,has any body got any info please ?


It seems that some of the smaller parcels are still coming via C T T.
Saying that the phone I received on Wednesday from GLS was a smaller packet than one I received from another source posted by RM and delivered by CTT? Two parcel received the same day.....one taking 12 days to get here, the second arrived in 48 hours.


----------



## Ingles

siobhanwf said:


> It seems that some of the smaller parcels are still coming via C T T.
> Saying that the phone I received on Wednesday from GLS was a smaller packet than one I received from another source posted by RM and delivered by CTT? Two parcel received the same day.....one taking 12 days to get here, the second arrived in 48 hours.


Yes It came thru "Airsure" everthing AOK

If any body would like the Project Manager @ GLS a Sr julió Silva -phone number - e-mail -etc I have them.


----------



## siobhanwf

Ingles said:


> Yes It came thru "Airsure" everthing AOK
> 
> If any body would like the Project Manager @ GLS a Sr julió Silva -phone number - e-mail -etc I have them.



YES PLEASE Ingles 

Got the bit between my teeeth


----------



## Ingles

[email protected]

918 794 197

219 667 100

I received a mail stating he is on holiday now


----------



## travelling-man

Every single time I've had to have stuff delivered from GLS it either fails to arrive & gets returned to sender or takes weeks & sometimes more than a month to arrive.

Every time it comes by the normal post it arrives in a matter of days.

Makes you wonder how GLS ever manage to stay in business!


----------



## Ingles

This is so worth a read & RM are turning deaf ear 

ROYALMAILCHAT • View topic - GLS delivering Royal Mail packages to Portugal

:clap2:


----------



## siobhanwf

Ingles said:


> This is so worth a read & RM are turning deaf ear
> 
> ROYALMAILCHAT • View topic - GLS delivering Royal Mail packages to Portugal
> 
> :clap2:



Well done Ingles. Now all we have to do is start posting on there with our complaints! And find out how a campaign can be started to get someone to listen!!!!


----------



## siobhanwf

Part of their general conditions of carriage:
6. Delivery 

6.1
The recipient's signature is proof of delivery of orders. 
When the GLS Portugal fail to make the delivery of the order on the recipient, for reasons not attributable to GLS Portugal will be automatically marked a new date for delivery. 6.2 If the new delivery not completed for reasons attributable to the Customer or the Recipient will be sent a communication to the client so that it gives specific instructions for delivery. When the new instructions are not feasible, or the client does not respond within five days, the goods Customer will be returned to assuming this responsibility for undeliverable. If delivery does not occur for a reason attributable to the Customer or the consignee will be charged to Customer value delivery cumulatively with the value of the second delivery or return, as appropriate. 6.3 The delivery can not be made ​​to PO. Orders are delivered to the address of the recipient as provided by the Customer, but not necessarily to the recipient whose name was indicated. When the recipient has a central reception area, the goods will be delivered in this area. The amounts billed for services given discharge conditions require the recipient normal after consideration of the issue as well. If there is a difficulty for the anomalous delivery requiring an increase of cost for GLS Portugal, the tariff may be unilaterally change the extent that this reflects an increase in costs. 04.06 If apparent defect or malfunction of the goods packaging, recipient shall, upon acceptance of the goods, make reservations accurate and complete. If the recipient receives the goods, without reservations, it is presumed that the goods were in good condition. All ancillary information relating to the delivery will be transmitted to the recipient only when it has in its power of sending the reference.


----------



## siobhanwf

This is a portuguese complaint I have found....and translated!!! SOUND FAMILIAR????

_Good afternoon, I ordered two items online store English. The two were paid and sent on time by the sellers. Even Spain, the transportation is made ​​by Royal Mail to Portugal and Spain, by GLS. It turns out that the articles are from the 9th of May in the warehouses of the GLS in Venda do Pinheiro and delivery is not made. Have asked them to clarify the situation, but I was not provided. After two exchanges of email with laconic sentences, only I was told that the order had been rescheduled for the next day, something that did not happen. In short: I have my two orders, paid from the EU, held in storage for 14 days and not get a clarification on the matter. I wonder to what entity should I file a complaint or if the premises are required to have a complaints book. But forcing me to go to Venda do Pinheiro, when the ports are already paid and not my fault ......... would be my last chance. Thank you!_


----------



## siobhanwf

A solution by a Portuguese complainer....

_ Decided to send an email to the guys ( customer.service @ gls-portugal.com ) the threat that would make them complaint with the telephone system ANACON due to them being a fraud and also threatened to contact the ASAE, due to poor service provided by them and lack of respect for the customer._

ANACOM - Lista de operadores e prestadores de serviços em atividade


----------



## travelling-man

I wonder if we're wasting our time complaining to GLS about their dreadful service & whether our complaints might be better directed at UK Royal Mail in the hope they might be persuaded to withdraw their contract & award it to a more efficient company?


----------



## canoeman

To be effective complaints need to be addressed to people, companies actually posting via RM/Parcel Force, the bigger the organization the better, RM generally won't acknowledge a complaint from the addressee, although you would like to think RM would take notice of various forum complaints if they where aware of them.

Your refund etc for non delivery would be from them, they would then have to recover from RM.


----------



## siobhanwf

Thing is GLS is General Logistics Systems (GLS) and Royal Mail Group’s continental European parcel carrier
GLS|Royal Mail Group


----------



## canoeman

You'll see following links that it's the customer (who is the sender) that needs to make the complaint or how about bombarding RM with all the adverse comments on Forums, might make them realize their perception of GLS is slightly different in reality


----------



## Ingles

canoeman said:


> You'll see following links that it's the customer (who is the sender) that needs to make the complaint or how about bombarding RM with all the adverse comments on Forums, might make them realize their perception of GLS is slightly different in reality


This info was actually posted some time back , as I complained & rec'd a generic reply that only the sender has the right to complain.

I have also posted a link to this site on a PT Site on which exactly the same complaints are being voiced by Portuguese who are waiting on "post" from UK, a lot of them are e-bay buyers


----------



## canoeman

Yes read them, and advised ages ago sender has to make complaint, why don't you forward links to RM or GLS, or to senders that's where the action needs to take place, Amazon use MRW what do you think their reaction would be if the same level of complaint was registered against MRW they'd immediately take steps to rectify or find another supplier, problem is RM own GLS and similar complaints seem to be on other countries forums so it's not just Portugal.


----------



## Ingles

I have sent links to RM & GLS 
Both had "read" replies - RM replied - GLS nowt which was not unexpected 

As to Amazon frankly I'm not interested even trying to debate it with you as it is nothing to do with present problem :confused2:

The GLS - RM problem is European wide there is even a complaint from Bulgaria !


----------



## canoeman

Well done


----------



## Ingles

In reply to RM Chat posting - I already have & am waiting on suggestions


----------



## siobhanwf

Ingles said:


> This is so worth a read & RM are turning deaf ear
> 
> ROYALMAILCHAT • View topic - GLS delivering Royal Mail packages to Portugal
> 
> :clap2:



have joined you


----------



## JohnBoy

It seems that even your home country isn't immune from the GLS cowboys Siobhan. You'll enjoy this thread with complaints about GLS dating from 2006 to the current day.


----------



## siobhanwf

JohnBoy said:


> It seems that even your home country isn't immune from the GLS cowboys Siobhan. You'll enjoy this thread with complaints about GLS dating from 2006 to the current day.



Well spotted Johnboy. It seems that anywhere that GLS delivery has major problems


----------



## Ingles

Yes very well spotted ole chap !

As to past comments over lack off infrastructure & vehicles it is now obvious that there problem is there NBG at all as very adverse comments are coming in Euro wide.


----------



## siobhanwf

All you have to do is go through the list of the countries they service and it is the same old story...

SAD state of affairs


----------



## travelling-man

FWIW, our latest Amazon order was sent with MRW and arrived today, with no hassle and 7 days from order to delivery. 

and the cream on the cake was that the driver spoke absolutely fluent English and was as friendly and polite as you could possibly imagine.


----------



## Maggy Crawford

After the disaster with GLS and the breathalyser kit I ordered printer cartrisges from 999 Inks but made sure before placing the order that they do not use RM International Signed For. They sent them 2nd class (no actual postage charge) and they arrived after 4 days with CTT. What can we do get RM to listen? My attempt was futile as all I got was a supercilious uninterested jobsworth. Now I always check the carrier and make sure it is not RM/GLS.


----------



## Ingles

Late last week I bought something on e-bay I have been looking for here for a long time, it's a very small item so I thought the post would not be a problem.

BUT :- this morning I just read the Invoice that had been sent & on is the goods have been posted using 
RM International Signed For Service 

Here we go again :boxing:

Even though I have all the contacts for GLS I intened to do nothing & not even track my goods to see if there service has improved :noidea:

I just had my morning Café today when a thought crossed my mind 

RM Complaints Site is for CUSTOMERS only, as I received a generic reply from them stating that "only the customer has the right to complain not the reipient"

If the recipient pay's for P&P the therefore they are the CUSTOMER & the sender is therefore only acting as there agent.

All e-bay puchases are P&P added unless they P&P for free

I do hope anybody who has a prob with GLS & paid for P&P will notify RM of this fact & make them do something instead of "cocking a deaf une"


----------



## siobhanwf

Ingles said:


> Late last week I bought something on e-bay I have been looking for here for a long time, it's a very small item so I thought the post would not be a problem.
> 
> BUT :- this morning I just read the Invoice that had been sent & on is the goods have been posted using
> RM International Signed For Service
> 
> Here we go again :boxing:
> 
> Even though I have all the contacts for GLS I intened to do nothing & not even track my goods to see if there service has improved :noidea:
> 
> I just had my morning Café today when a thought crossed my mind
> 
> RM Complaints Site is for CUSTOMERS only, as I received a generic reply from them stating that "only the customer has the right to complain not the reipient"
> 
> If the recipient pay's for P&P the therefore they are the CUSTOMER & the sender is therefore only acting as there agent.
> 
> All e-bay puchases are P&P added unless they P&P for free
> 
> I do hope anybody who has a prob with GLS & paid for P&P will notify RM of this fact & make them do something instead of "cocking a deaf une"



Nice one Ingles :clap2::clap2:


----------



## canoeman

"If the recipient pay's for P&P the therefore they are the CUSTOMER & the sender is therefore only acting as there agent."

Nice thought but won't work you are the customer of the seller and that is who your contract is with, the seller is the customer of whatever delivery service they use, if item wasn't delivered any claim you have is against seller, in turn any claim they had for non-delivery would be against carrier.


----------



## Ingles

The person who PAY'S is the CUSTOMER 
Check before you reply please


----------



## canoeman

Ingles said:


> The person who PAY'S is the CUSTOMER
> Check before you reply please


You just don't read do you your the *customer of the seller* not Royal Mail but if you want to continue knocking your head against a brick wall feel free, by your logic if an item was faulty then you would contact Royal Mail for a replacement or refund

You'll get results by complaints to the correct people not the incorrect ones


----------



## Ingles

I suggest you read my reply above your sarcastic one & then check how RM define CUSTOMER 

end of disscussion !
DH


----------



## canoeman

Ingles said:


> I suggest you read my reply above your sarcastic one & then check how RM define CUSTOMER
> 
> end of disscussion !
> DH


You've put your own interpretation on how RM defines a customer and lose sight of the fact that your contract is with the seller of the goods you've purchased and whatever terms & conditions you've agreed to for delivery, and not with RM, so any complaint by you to RM will be ignored, there are options for the receiver to complain but everything points to that being UK deliveries and not deliveries by third parties or EU


----------



## Ingles

canoeman said:


> You've put your own interpretation on how RM defines a customer and lose sight of the fact that your contract is with the seller of the goods you've purchased and whatever terms & conditions you've agreed to for delivery, and not with RM, so any complaint by you to RM will be ignored, there are options for the receiver to complain but everything points to that being UK deliveries and not deliveries by third parties or EU


bla -bla waffel waffel bla bla :clap2:


----------



## canoeman

Well, when I have a complaint with a company I get a result, unlike apparently you

This advice of yours 
_
"If the recipient pay's for P&P the therefore they are the CUSTOMER & the sender is therefore only acting as there agent.

All e-bay puchases are P&P added unless they P&P for free

I do hope anybody who has a prob with GLS & paid for P&P will notify RM of this fact & make them do something instead of "cocking a deaf une""
_

is the bla -bla waffel waffel bla bla 

This is the facts

_"YOUR RELATIONSHIP IS WITH THE RETAILER -
NOT THE COURIER COMPANY

From the moment you pay for your goods or service to the second it's delivered, the retailer - and *not* the courier or delivery company - is responsible, as that's who your 'contract' is with. So the retailer should always be your first port of call for any complaints.

This applies even if you've paid extra for a specific courier company via the retailer. The same rights and remedies apply if you've a contract for installation, or have arranged for a service to be carried out, and it's been breached due to a no-show."_


----------



## siobhanwf

NOW NOW guys.. .. play nice


----------



## Ingles

canoeman said:


> Well, when I have a complaint with a company I get a result, unlike apparently you
> 
> This advice of yours
> _
> "If the recipient pay's for P&P the therefore they are the CUSTOMER & the sender is therefore only acting as there agent.
> 
> All e-bay puchases are P&P added unless they P&P for free
> 
> I do hope anybody who has a prob with GLS & paid for P&P will notify RM of this fact & make them do something instead of "cocking a deaf une""
> _
> 
> is the bla -bla waffel waffel bla bla
> 
> This is the facts
> 
> _"YOUR RELATIONSHIP IS WITH THE RETAILER -
> NOT THE COURIER COMPANY
> 
> From the moment you pay for your goods or service to the second it's delivered, the retailer - and *not* the courier or delivery company - is responsible, as that's who your 'contract' is with. So the retailer should always be your first port of call for any complaints.
> 
> This applies even if you've paid extra for a specific courier company via the retailer. The same rights and remedies apply if you've a contract for installation, or have arranged for a service to be carried out, and it's been breached due to a no-show."_


mais bla - bla waffel waffel bla - bla


----------



## Maggy Crawford

Ingles, give in gracefully, Canoeman is right. 
You buy an item from a retailer, there is a contract in place between you.
Retailer consigns it to RM for delivery, there is a contract in place between them
RM outsources GLS to deliver, there is a contract between them.
Simple.
Understood now?


----------



## Ingles

Maggy Crawford said:


> Ingles, give in gracefully, Canoeman is right.
> You buy an item from a retailer, there is a contract in place between you.
> Retailer consigns it to RM for delivery, there is a contract in place between them
> RM outsources GLS to deliver, there is a contract between them.
> Simple.
> Understood now?


Sorry Maggy I will not , If you search the definition off CUSTOMER on any WS even Citizens Advice UK -I can be interpreted any way you wish !

He who Pay's is the Customer

+ On another ExPat WS a certain "poster" basically wrote that I was a lyer because this "poster"who profess's to have full knowleged of everthing Portuguese would not belive that in the past I had a document that this "poster" had never seen or heard of!
When I proved categorically that I held this said document, this "poster" then demanded that I answer their questions as to my legal status here in Portugal.

Bloody liberty in anybodies book 

The biggest mistake this "poster" makes is that they belive they are infalliable ,but I can assure you they are not as some of the info posted by this "poster"is "doggy"


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## siobhanwf

Enough is enough 

Perhaps we should go back to basics and learn what defines a customer.. Customer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You buy an item from a retailer, there is a contract in place between YOU and THEM 
THEY (the retailer) uses ROYAL MAIL for delivery
The contract is now between THE RETAILER and ROYAL MAIL 
ROYAL MAIL outsources GLS to deliver here in Portugal (and indeed other EU countries)
The contract is now between ROYAL MAIL and GLS 

Ingles mud slinging is not permitted on this forum whatever may be said elsewhere on other forums I know you use.


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## Maggy Crawford

Thank you, Siobhan, exactly what I said. In this case, the contracts are in place between two parties and those two parties only.


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## siobhanwf

As Amazon use MRW here in Portugal it is generally just items that have been bought on EBAY that post a difficulty.

Therefore I had a look at Ebay`s notes on delivery----

_It's the seller's responsibility to ship the item to the address on the eBay Order details page or the PayPal Transaction Details page. It's the buyer's responsibility to have the correct address on his or her transaction.
If you shipped the item to the address on the eBay Order details page or the PayPal Transaction details page, and it was returned, please contact the buyer to work out a solution. If the buyer still wants the item, he or she will need to reimburse you for the additional shipping costs. If you'd like, you can send the buyer a PayPal invoice for this cost. When you ship an item, be sure to use tracking and email your buyer to let her know what the tracking number is._

What to do if you have shipping problems


----------



## jerryceltner

siobhanwf said:


> As Amazon use MRW here in Portugal it is generally just items that have been bought on EBAY that post a difficulty.
> 
> Therefore I had a look at Ebay`s notes on delivery----
> 
> _It's the seller's responsibility to ship the item to the address on the eBay Order details page or the PayPal Transaction Details page. It's the buyer's responsibility to have the correct address on his or her transaction.
> If you shipped the item to the address on the eBay Order details page or the PayPal Transaction details page, and it was returned, please contact the buyer to work out a solution. If the buyer still wants the item, he or she will need to reimburse you for the additional shipping costs. If you'd like, you can send the buyer a PayPal invoice for this cost. When you ship an item, be sure to use tracking and email your buyer to let her know what the tracking number is._
> 
> What to do if you have shipping problems


Hi
I ordered a small item that fitted into an A5 jiffy bag from Ebay on the 28th Aug and it was delivered today the 31st Aug by CTT. That's what you call service or was I plain lucky.:clap2:


----------



## travelling-man

FWIW, I've lately had 4 ebay deliveries from CTT & 1 amazon delivery from MRW & all arrived without any delays at all.

The only problem we had was I called MRW to ask if my package was with them yet and whilst they were telling me they hadn't received it yet but expected it to arrive with them within a week, their driver was parked on my driveway and handing over said parcel to Susan.


----------



## bikersteve

*Gls ?*

It seems to me I should start up a delivery service for expats then ?


----------



## siobhanwf

bikersteve said:


> It seems to me I should start up a delivery service for expats then ?


Are you big enough to cover the whole of Portugal.
If this is the way you would like to go MRW who deliver for Amazon run franchises. 

MRW - Request for Franchise


----------



## bikersteve

*Parcels ?*



siobhanwf said:


> Are you big enough to cover the whole of Portugal.
> If this is the way you would like to go MRW who deliver for Amazon run franchises.
> 
> MRW - Request for Franchise


I was only joking ,buy it does seem I couldn't do any worse than what's out there ? I live right next to Bournemouth airport,with direct links to faro ?..makes me think ?


----------



## tunznath

Try living in the Açores - amazon takes 7 - 10 days
royal mail normal mail 5 - 7 days
GLS 3weeks , called them today, after not pushing 0 (zero) because thats the english language option and you are on hold forever, but pushing 2, and after chatting they said they didnt know why it was still in the warehouse, after I told them Açores they said yes thats the problem their deliveries are by truck???? and we are an island, (I told them to put a boat on their truck so they can deliver) they said monday or maybe wednesday, but didnt specify what week.


----------



## coati

Hi
I have a "failed to deliver, wrong address" from GLS - it isnt wrong and I dont believe they even tried to deliver! Can anyone give me a phone number to ring in Portugal please - all the ones weve tried dont work!!
Is their e mail customer.service @ gls-portugal.com 

thanks
Rich


----------



## canoeman

Ingles posted contact details earlier in post


----------



## coati

Got it thx plenty of fun posts lol


----------



## travelling-man

I've got to say that in recent weeks/months, their service has improved in leaps and bounds. 

We now seem to have the same driver every time and not only does he seem to know the area, he also speaks fluent English. 

Whether this situation will remain is of course a mystery! LOL


----------



## canoeman

We have one in transit at mo, mind you RM hasn't processed tracking number yet 48hrs after pick-up can't wait to see what happens when GLS get it


----------



## coati

Called them apparently it will be delivered Monday - lol
thx for all the info


----------



## coati

Well good news, got the delivery yesterday but had to go and meet them at the end of the road, nice guy though.


----------



## canoeman

Maybe just maybe now he knows where you are the next one might not be a problem


----------



## Bubbles67

*Problems with deliveries from the UK, sent via Royal Mail????*

I am intested in any recent stories from people experiencing problems with small parcel deliveries from the UK.

I need to know as much detail as possible; dates sent, weight, method of sending (Airmail, Airsure, International Signed For etc), whether delivered by CTT or GLS, are you in a town or rural, delivery post code and anything else relevant.

I am in communication with Royal Mail Customer Services (a rare thing) and I would like to report problems so that they get the chance to put things right.

We are trying to establish if it is a problem with local depots or throughout Portugal, your assistance will be appreciated by everyone who ever gets post from the UK.

Please send emails to Wendy at contact on Link below.

////snip////


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## canoeman

Most things to do with GLS is a problem, mail from RM via CTT isn't


----------



## siobhanwf

Good luck Wendy. I had lots of Correspondance and promises from RM customer services and the situation hasn't changed. 
GLS are a subsidiary of RM group http://www.royalmailgroup.com/our-businesses/gls

They are very good at saying they can't find the address, the address is incorrect or the address doesn't exist. Three excuses I have had for non delivery. I called their customer services and I gave my name, parcel number and before the conversation went any further asked could they please tell me what address they had. Well low and behold ....the correct address. I then resorted to giving the gps coordinates to the people I purchased items from...they still couldn't find our home.
All details were passed to RM and all I received was a "we are sorry " email

Also worthwhile reading... http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/community/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=45076

I will no longer buy from a supplier who uses RM "sign on delivery" as a delivery method


----------



## jellybean

siobhanwf said:


> Good luck Wendy. I had lots of Correspondance and promises from RM customer services and the situation hasn't changed.
> GLS are a subsidiary of RM group http://www.royalmailgroup.com/our-businesses/gls
> 
> They are very good at saying they can't find the address, the address is incorrect or the address doesn't exist. Three excuses I have had for non delivery. I called their customer services and I gave my name, parcel number and before the conversation went any further asked could they please tell me what address they had. Well low and behold ....the correct address. I then resorted to giving the gps coordinates to the people I purchased items from...they still couldn't find our home.
> All details were passed to RM and all I received was a "we are sorry " email
> 
> Also worthwhile reading... ROYALMAILCHAT • View topic - GLS delivering Royal Mail packages to Portugal
> 
> I will no longer buy from a supplier who uses RM "sign on delivery" as a delivery method


Sounds all too familiar. GLS are the bane of my life. I've exchanged many an angry email with them and, like you, now refuse to buy from anyone who uses RM Intl signed for to deliver items. I usually email the company's customer service dept., copy GLS, tell them their choice of delivery service is the reason they have lost my custom and include links to the myriad of complaints about the appalling GLS service!

HOWEVER, have you, or has anyone else noticed that even the usually very efficient CTT postal service seems to have gone down the pan recently? Normally items sent from the UK to Portugal take about 4 days - recently it's taking about 3 weeks! I'm not happy. A couple of expats I've spoken to on Facebook have noticed the same thing.


----------



## siobhanwf

Me too Jellybean. I have just yesterday recieved a letter (A4 size with knitting patterns) from the UK posted on January 3rd!!!!!!!! 

My guess though is that the problem is at the UK end. Perhaps they are holding mail until the have a big enoung bag to forward it....just a thought


----------



## JohnBoy

I posted recently on a similar theme Jellybean as I had been waiting four weeks for a couple of packages. The replies that I received seemed to indicate that since December normal post makes it through OK but packets coming into the country are being delayed by up to four weeks.

My initial thoughts were that the delay was caused by the current sporadic disruption by CTT workers and airport workers late in December but that is behind us now.

I am still waiting for two packages and I have a friend who knows that the package he is waiting for is being held by Customs at Lisbon. My theory now is that for some reason packages entering the country are all being delayed either by a slow down in the system through the port of entry or extra scrutiny by Customs.

It would be interesting to know is it just packets coming from the UK that are affected? I know that we have members from other European countries living here and other parts of the world so I would welcome some feedback from them as to whether they are being similarly affected or not.


----------



## jellybean

Just saw your other post John and replied. I have French neighbours so I'll ask them if their post is also affected. I think we all need to complain to CTT en masse...


----------



## jellybean

Hmm.....hadn't thought of that. Seems unlikely though as there should be enough post between UK and Portugal to make daily deliveries worthwhile. There are daily flights and I'm sure more post travels than people, if you see what I mean?


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## siobhanwf

As a standard letter I doubt if my letter's delay was due to customs  A letter in the same delivery from HONG KONG wass dated as written on January 15th probably posted next day


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## canoeman

Not sure that Lisbon is actually the point of entry for post? and Royal Mail are rather coy about how anythings actually transported, if you check post marks there definitely seems to be a delay when letters, small packages are stamped by one of the "alternative" companies who sell postage but all goes through PO.

A recent purchase from a Spanish Ebay seller was held up because Spanish Customs or maybe Spanish Post Office returned item to him to complete a Customs Form something that isn't a requirement within EU

Just so many variables that without tracking which in itself creates delay it's so difficult to isolate culprit


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## siobhanwf

Totally agree canoeman. An amazon.de 
delivery took 3 weeks!


----------



## Ronnie_Yook

It is with deep regret, and indeed astonishment, that I find my original posting has over 17,000 viewings on the excellent website of the expatforum Portugal and the invaluable response and input on the forum website from fellow expatforum Portugal members, about this particular Royal Mail / GLS Portugal postal service and their non-deliveries fiasco in Portugal...that it is still ongoing!

Along-with my original posting (below) of 9th May 2012, and an update of events, and information, I refer to the weblink, on the ExPatsForum Portugal website:-

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/po...ugal/111560-gls-royal-mail-uk-deliveries.html

9th May 2012, 11:45 AM 

GLS Royal Mail (UK) deliveries 

Hello, have you had any delivery delays/problems when expecting delivery of a parcel via Royal Mail (UK) to an address in Portugal.

There is an article in "The Portugal News" this week about this, but basically the problem is the Royal Mail have discontinued using the CTT Correios (Portuguese Post Office), and have contracted GLS, an international courier company based in Holland, to deliver the Royal Mail items here in Portugal.

The problem we have found here in Portugal, is that the Royal Mail are asking clients to contact their local post office for information about delayed Royal Mail mail/parcels, which is absurd as GLS are the company responsible for this, and you can view their website for "tracking".

In our own case a parcel was despatched on 6th April 2012 "International Signed For" by Royal Mail we have spent each day checking the Royal Mail "Track & Trace" facility on their website, phoning and visiting daily our local Correios. All of this was a complete waste of time as the Royal Mail had sent our consignment via the company GLS.

Our particular parcel has been in the UK, Germany, Spain & Portugal, the GLS delivery centre in Aveiro have returned the parcel to the sender in the UK as they could not contact us!

I would normally enclose web links to the relevant websites, but as a "newbie" on this forum I'm not allowed to post URL's till later.

I am considering contacting the British Embassy in Lisboa, as this is a serious matter for customers of Royal Mail.

Hope this is of interest
Ronnie 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6th February 2014. 

We have just found out today, that two small parcels which were dispatched from the United Kingdom (UK) about the 18th December 2013, were listed on the Track and Trace Audit Trail by the Royal Mail and it´s subsidiary GLS Portugal, as 'address unknown' on the 27th December 2013. Both of these consignments were properly addressed with address details printed in large black type on white labels, are, at the time of writing, with the original senders, receiving their well packed and addressed parcels returned to them, who are, like us, extremely irate. 

The senders contacted Royal Mail Customer Services, who offered to resend these parcels, at no charge, but, the senders have declined, as they do not wish a repeat of their non-delivery experience, and we are liaising with them as to our mutually chosen new parcel carrier.

For Personal Customers, the Royal Mail Group, has an internet “Online Complain Form”. I am using this, and I suggest this, as possibly, the most direct route for anyone who also want to register their Royal Mail / GLS Portugal complaint, and have access to the Internet. Be honest, how long will it take to enter your complaint details? And, equally importantly, if the senders of mail and parcels from the United Kingdom can also use this, then it will surely double the registration of complaints to the Royal Mail Group. 

The Royal Mail Online Complain Form is at:

https://royalmailemailform.datasquirt.co.uk/ContactUs.aspx

It is opportune to note that the Royal Mail plc is now a fully privatised company, which, on the 15th October 2013, was listed on the London Stock Exchange and in December 2013 became a FTSE100 company.

The Royal Mail Group and GLS is therefore a part of Royal Mail plc, and as a Public Limited Company (plc) are now responsible to their shareholders, in addition to their clients. 

See more at: Royal Mail Group - Who we are

This company is regulated by Ofcom Ofcom in the United Kingdom, and I am also writing to them regarding the problems we personally have experienced, and with reference to those listed in the expatforum website for Portugal. Hopefully, other expatforum members may also wish to contact this authority.

Another UK government department which is responsible for “Postal Affairs” is The Department for Business, Innovation & Skills (BIS). It is the department for economic growth. The department invests in skills and education to promote trade, boost innovation and help people to start and grow a business. BIS also protects consumers and reduces the impact of regulation.

The BIS website is at: https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/department-for-business-innovation-skills

Lastly, though I believe that postal services may not strictly be a British Embassy matter, I feel that the Consulate should be informed of an area which, as represented in the expatforum, which adversely affects British citizens who are temporarily or permanently resident here in lovely Portugal, and also those who have businesses and commercial interests with clients dependent on prompt, regular and secure postal services to and from the UK.

The British Embassy, Lisbon are holding a Consular “REACHING OUT TO THE BRITISH COMMUNITY IN POMBAL” on Wednesday, 12th March 2014, with the aim of raising awareness of consular and other services available to British nationals in the centre of Portugal.
This may be also be an excellent opportunity to personally register concerns on this particularly important postal matter. 

The event will be held at the Mini-Auditório do Teatro- Cine of the Câmara Municipal de Pombal, Leiria Region, commencing at 4.30pm and finishing at 6.30pm. Doors open at 4pm.
There are approximately 100 places available and entrance is free so please confirm your attendance by sending an email to [email protected] If you do not have internet access, please call 808 20 35 37 and ask to speak to a member of the consular team on extension 4118.

*NB:- Please bring an item of non-perishable food to donate to a local Charity.

For the benefit of us all, please do enter your Royal Mail / GLS postal experiences and information on the expatforum Portugal website.

Thank you
Ronnie_Yook


----------



## jellybean

Hi Ronnie

GLS are the bane of my life too and slow postal service adversely affects my small internet business. I dealt with it by asking my suppliers NOT to send anything by International Signed For as the local CTT service was cheaper, quicker and more reliable. However, many of us have noticed that the CTT service has gone down the pan recently too, going from 3-4 days between UK - PORTUGAL to 10-14 days! So you can't win with the Portuguese post at the moment. It's a terrible service all 'round.


----------



## siobhanwf

And GLS are all part of the BIG Royal Mail family :-(

They are as bad in every other european country as they are in Portugal sadly.


----------



## JohnBoy

I am not speaking up for GLS. Far from it as I think their service generally is appalling.

However, there was a glimmer of hope for them last week when they attempted to deliver a package to me. I was in at the time and he did ring the bell but had hopped back in his van before I managed to get downstairs to him. The noticeable change in the service was a card left in my post box informing me that it was now my responsibility to go to their local agent to collect the parcel. The agency happened to be a shoe shop on a trading estate and luckily I have a car and was able to go and fetch the parcel. Had I not been able to then, according to the card, after nine days it would have been returned to sender. There was no option to call them and ask for it to be redelivered!

Heaven help anyone without transport as the shop in question isn't readily accessible by public transport.


----------



## jellybean

I have read your article Bubbles and I think it's worth pointing out that the phone number for GLS is premium rate and, if you press the 'English' option, they will keep you hanging on the line for ages and you're unlikely to get an answer. I was charged more than €15 just trying to get through to them to find out where my parcel was on one occasion. It's a joke. I ended up searching for the details of their head office in the Netherlands and sent a complaint SNIP/. That worked! Ana Pinheiro sent me several apologetic emails and seemed to go out of her way to make sure I got my parcel the following day. After that, any time I'm waiting more than a week for a package, I send an email enquiry to Wilma Mourik AND Ana Pinheiro asking where it is! So it might be worth noting their details.

However, I still have no faith in them and dealing with them is always a headache. Thankfully I've managed to avoid any dealings with GLS in recent months. I even go as far as reading the delivery information on websites and not shopping with those who use Royal Mail International Signed For and asking eBayers to use Airsure instead, if they want to send by a trackable service. Obviously absolutely no point in complaining to Royal Mail for obvious reasons, but I do hope that they start to listen to our complaints now they have been privatised and more delivery services enter the market. We can only live in hope.


----------



## canoeman

The issue with GLS is Royal Mail UK use them because it's an owned subsidiary of Royal Mail but there seems little way of identifying what is actually passed to GLS by RM for delivery, for us as the receivers in Portugal who apart from being able to use a tracking number if available aren't able to make complaints or claim for non or late delivery is that the GLS operation, infrastructure and number of vans is totally inadequate to provide any sort of an efficient delivery service unless you live on the doorstep of a depot or are on a major route, my sympathies are with the van drivers who are expected to perform miracles for no doubt little money


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## Clive&Chris

Ronnie_Yook said:


> Another UK government department which is responsible for “Postal Affairs” is The Department for Business, Innovation & Skills (BIS). It is the department for economic growth. The department invests in skills and education to promote trade, boost innovation and help people to start and grow a business. BIS also protects consumers and reduces the impact of regulation.
> 
> Ronnie_Yook


Hi Ronnie, you might/might not be aware that this dept is run by Vince Cable who oversaw the privitisation of RM - complaining to them would be a complete waste of anyones time. Dear Vince is currently getting well deserved pelters in the UK press for flogging off RM too cheaply.

RM as an institution enjoyed by several generations of Brits is now dead. As one example 2 of the PO's I use for business used to have a counter for packaging materials and stamps that one could nip over too to beat the main counter queues - these have been replaced at Dunfermline by self-service machines and at Perth the main PO is shut and you now have to Q up at the back of WH Smith where they have 3 counters! I'm lucky to have one of the last standing sub-post offices in my village but most have gone.

It's a real shame - in the words of Joni Mitchell 'you don't know what you've got til it's gone'


----------



## Ronnie_Yook

*Update*

Update

One of the parcels which a relative sent to us here in Portugal during December 2013, using Royal Mail, but was undelivered, and returned to sender by their subsidiary GLS Portugal as “address unknown”. 

Due to the non-acceptance of liability by Royal Mail/GLS Portugal, there has now been a claim lodged with the Small Claims Court, for the original postal charge, which was over £80.

The outcome of this I shall post on the expatforum when any decision is known. :fingerscrossed:


----------



## canoeman

Check out Parcel2go in UK one of the comparative sites seem just a tad cheaper than others, Parcelforce is one of the companies that come up with a quote but I never use because it uses GLS at this end.
Print of label collected from home or business addresses 3-5 tracked delivery to Portugal but they delivery UK, EU and rest of world.

Our M&S small packet arrived eventually delivered by CTT but M&S are using one of the non RM firms in this case DPD Air Mail and in our experience any post franked from this type of company via RM takes about 3 weeks


----------



## Ronnie_Yook

canoeman said:


> Check out Parcel2go in UK one of the comparative sites seem just a tad cheaper than others, Parcelforce is one of the companies that come up with a quote but I never use because it uses GLS at this end.
> Print of label collected from home or business addresses 3-5 tracked delivery to Portugal but they delivery UK, EU and rest of world.
> 
> Our M&S small packet arrived eventually delivered by CTT but M&S are using one of the non RM firms in this case DPD Air Mail and in our experience any post franked from this type of company via RM takes about 3 weeks


Greetings canoeman, and thanks for this.

I have meant to post earlier, that in the cases we have had since December 2013, with GLS “returning to sender, address unknown” that two of our relatives re-sent their parcels, but used the UK carrier firm Yodel.

These parcels were not re-addressed, they retained the original destination address details (but removed any Royal Mail stickers) and Hey-Ho we got each of the parcels within 2 weeks without any “address unknown” difficulties.

Yodel was cheaper than Royal Mail, and they also collected from the sender's homes! 

I have not posted Yodel's UK website, as it may be considered 'advertising' on the expatforum.


----------



## canoeman

There's plenty of information about GLS that would support a Small Claims about GLS non ability to find address that everyone else can no doubt it will come down to the "fine print" & T&C Royal Mail accept parcels under, at least though Small Claims Courts seem a little more open to persuasive factual arguments especially if RM has not made those T&C apparent.

I did win once against RM because "call centre" advised it was all on website and I pointed out that not everyone had access or used websites


----------



## genialgeorge

Problem with Royal Mail is that they will only deal with customers - i.e. in Portugal, the UK sender. I have had to write off two packages that ended up with GLS. GLS refuse to admit that there is a problem so nothing is being done


----------



## Ronnie_Yook

genialgeorge said:


> Problem with Royal Mail is that they will only deal with customers - i.e. in Portugal, the UK sender. I have had to write off two packages that ended up with GLS. GLS refuse to admit that there is a problem so nothing is being done


Hi genialgeorge...and welcome to the expatforum!

Re above, does this mean that your sender accepted the total loss of contents, post and packaging?


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## BadBoy

*Royal mail / gls*

Royal Mail please change the GLS by any other company because the GLS is a waste. Everyone complaining of this company.
Never know where is home, do not make any effort to delivery, not answer the phone and not diplomatic answer to emails.
A garbage GLS company


----------



## jellybean

Sadly, 2 years on, the Royal Mail is still contracting those cowboys at GLS to deliver international signed for items and the service is still a joke.


----------



## chrisdcb

*Royal Mail/GLS*



Ronnie_Yook said:


> Hello, have you had any delivery delays/problems when expecting delivery of a parcel via Royal Mail (UK) to an address in Portugal.
> 
> There is an article in "The Portugal News" this week about this, but basically the problem is the Royal Mail have discontinued using the CTT Correios (Portuguese Post Office), and have contracted GLS, an international courier company based in Holland, to deliver the Royal Mail items here in Portugal.
> 
> /QUOTE]
> 
> We had a phone call from the GLS driver in Alcoutim yesterday. He did not want to deliver to Alamo and had dropped off my package at the Fire Station...
> 
> The package has taken five weeks to arrive and dozens of calls to GLS - 219667100 - Each call involves a wait of 30+ minutes to get connected - so don't try calling on a mobile... Seems that GLS subcontracts to an outfit called Log24 tel: 289991288 / 961391447 or email geral-at-log24-dot-pt but they ignored my emails and I never got through on the phone. Log24 is not really interested in delivering mail outside the major towns.
> 
> The CTT delivers to our house without a hitch.


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## chrisdcb

*Royal Mail/GLS*

This is the second parcel sent to me International Tracked/Signed For. As a result of the first (5 week) non-delivery we knew what to do... We scanned the GLS site every day until it came up with the complete lie that they had attempted delivery but the consignee was absent.
We called the "hotline" - only took 30 minutes to answer this time - to find out that they had left the parcel with 24H Serve (the CTT in Vila Nova de Casela) some 30 minutes drive away. When we got there the helpful postmistress found our parcel and handed it over. We struck up a conversation. Turns out that GLS dumps all the parcels for the area with her. Because they never attempt deliveries, they never leave a card stating where the parcel is so the recipients never get to know that there is a parcel waiting for them in Cacela. She has tons of parcels from GLS. She had just sent back a load of parcels dumped with her in August (now October).
When I approached Royal Mail about why they use this shower they fobbed me off with the excuse that GLS has a good tracking system. A fat lot of use if they never deliver parcels.
Royal Mail's helpful suggestion was never to use the International Tracked Signed For service - all other delivery services use the CTT (which delivers).
Not good enough Royal Mail... Either dump GLS and use the CTT or put some pressure on them to actually deliver outside the big cities.


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## JohnBoy

You were very lucky to get that much from Royal Mail. Their normal response is that they will only deal with the parcel sender.


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## smudges

A while ago I investigated the international signed for service at the (UK) post office (I'd sold something on ebay). I was told that once an item leaves blighty it can't be tracked and they assume no responsibility, so spending extra on this seems to me to be a complete waste of money and a con. This wasn't country specific, BTW.


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## JohnBoy

smudges said:


> A while ago I investigated the international signed for service at the (UK) post office (I'd sold something on ebay). I was told that once an item leaves blighty it can't be tracked and they assume no responsibility, so spending extra on this seems to me to be a complete waste of money and a con. This wasn't country specific, BTW.


There appears to be two incorrect pieces of information from your post office there Smudges. If the item is passed to GLS it can be tracked using the GLS tracker tool. Secondly, of course they have to accept responsibility for a lost item. You have a contract with Royal Mail to carry and ultimately deliver your package. They in turn have a contract with GLS. Let's not forget here that GLS is a wholly owned subsidiary of Royal Mail. Why is it, that when we have a package go missing and contact Royal Mail, they say they will only deal with the sender? If, as they say, they have no responsibility, they have no need to deal with anyone!

On a separate matter, I recently ordered from Amazon Spain and for the first time ever, the delivery was by GLS. Not the normal GLS labelled van, but a plain white one with a lovely driver. It gets better though as delivery was made a day earlier than expected. Certainly in Coimbra they seem to be getting their act together. Perhaps landing the contract with Amazon Spain has made them buck their ideas up.


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## chrisdcb

*A useful service*

Take a look at Algarve Express . I now get parcels sent to their Basildon depot. They arrive in Almancil near Faro a few days later at a very reasonable cost.


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## baldilocks

Another problem with GLS is they put a new (their own) label on the package completely obscuring the original label. Sometimes the GLS label is incorrect and blocks the correctly addressed label applied by the sender.


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## siobhanwf

One thing I have found is they ask you to confirm your address.
Well the answer to that is what address do you have?? 
That is after they say the driver couldnt find the address....am i su re it is correct....well I have been using it fo over 12 years!! I think so


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## baldilocks

Now, when I am given a choice between Parcelforce or DHL for an international delivery - I go for DHL


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## chrisdcb

*Hotline now premium rate*

And another thing... GLS hotline  number 219 667 100 has been shut down and replaced by a premium rate number 707 10 30 50. So the worse they perform, the more calls they get, and the more money they make...


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## JohnBoy

chrisdcb said:


> And another thing... GLS hotline  number 219 667 100 has been shut down and replaced by a premium rate number 707 10 30 50. So the worse they perform, the more calls they get, and the more money they make...


Rip-off upon rip-off. There is a new website in Portugal to help in these situations, but sadly this number is not covered yet. 

Anyone who is aware of saynoto0870.com in the UK will know what I mean. In Portugal the equivalent website is 707.pt. You enter the 707 number and it will offer you the geographic equivalent number. It's only as good as the information we consumers supply. To date nobody has updated the site with the relevant numbers for GLS.


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