# Planning to move within next 4 years



## Janey142 (Jul 25, 2015)

Hiya

We are from the UK looking at buying a cheap property (very small mortgage) in Spain, staying until mortgage is paid and then selling up and coming back to the UK (We would look for somewhere to do up or in a desirable area and appreciate either way that selling won't be easy)

This is the goal after we finish out degrees (Me forensic psychology, him IT and computing)

The reasons for doing this are follows

1. We want to travel
2. Get on property ladder

It would be useful to know experiences people have had moving to spain from the UK, and I understand its harder to get a job but is it worth doing?

Thanks for any advice


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Welcome to the forum. It is hard to get work in Spain, although IT professionals may find it a bit easier. I'm not sure about forensics It helps to speak Spanish tho.

Buying properties to do up isnt as straight forward as it is in the UK, I know that property buying is different in Scotland (where your flag says you are) from England, but its different again in Spain. So maybe do a few fact finding trips, or even rent for a few months to familiarise yourself with the procedures, acquiring mortgages, pitfalls and the area you might choose.

Jo xxx


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Janey142 said:


> Hiya
> 
> We are from the UK looking at buying a cheap property (very small mortgage) in Spain, staying until mortgage is paid and then selling up and coming back to the UK (We would look for somewhere to do up or in a desirable area and appreciate either way that selling won't be easy)
> 
> ...


Look at the FAQ's for information in general, but #33 for info about buying property that might have something useful in it for you. There may be opportunities for something in IT, but not sure if this would be possible in the south of Spain. As for forensic psychology I would seriously doubt it, but you won't know if you don't look. Try infojobs.net


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## Janey142 (Jul 25, 2015)

Thanks  as we are not planning to move there indefinatley, I would be happy to go where the IT jobs are and I would just take anything I could. Will have a look where you recommended


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Recruitment | Situations vacant | myservicesdirectory.com | surinenglish.com

This might help give you an idea for jobs, but there really is very high unemployment. I think there is a big IT park in Malaga, which might be worth looking into - or Gibraltar???

Jo xxx


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Janey142 said:


> Hiya
> 
> We are from the UK looking at buying a cheap property (very small mortgage) in Spain, staying until mortgage is paid and then selling up and coming back to the UK (We would look for somewhere to do up or in a desirable area and appreciate either way that selling won't be easy)
> 
> ...


Apart from the difficulty in finding jobs (do you both speak Spanish, by the way?), have you looked into the costs involved in buying and selling property? The buying costs (transfer tax, solicitor's and notary fees) will be at least 10% of the purchase price, could be more in some autonomous regions. When selling, it is common here for estate agents to charge 5% of the sale price, there is a local tax called plus valia to pay on the increase in value of the land, if you made a profit there could be capital gains tax to pay, and banks have hefty charges for handling a banker's draft which is the most usual method of payment. So, the first 17/18% of any profit you might make (and the vast majority of people, me included, think it will be a long time before property prices in Spain see any large price rises) will be wiped out by taxes and charges. There is also the question of exchange rates to consider. Nobody knows how they might change over a period of years. Currently, compared to 5 years ago they are good for anyone purchasing property in Spain and converting sterling to euros. However, for those who are selling in Spain and converting euros to sterling, it is quite the opposite, they lose substantially.


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## LDN2ESP (Jul 24, 2015)

Janey142 said:


> Hiya
> 
> We are from the UK looking at buying a cheap property (very small mortgage) in Spain, staying until mortgage is paid and then selling up and coming back to the UK (We would look for somewhere to do up or in a desirable area and appreciate either way that selling won't be easy)
> 
> ...


Buy a shoebox in London and your property will keep going up in value and you'll never be out of work.


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

Have you seen the price of a shoebox in London??!


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

Have you seen the price of a shoebox in London recently??!!!


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## LDN2ESP (Jul 24, 2015)

chica escocesa said:


> Have you seen the price of a shoebox in London recently??!!!


 I'm in 'said' capital city now and the value of my house has gone up three fold in just over ten years. If you're a youngun? Make hay while the sun shines ... It would appear untold amounts of 'techy' people are heading to London.

Make some money from that 'shoebox' and buy a house outright very quickly in Spain. Within the last six months my available spending power in Spain has increased by about 50-70k purely on the rise of the £.

The only fly in the ointment is an EU election and the possibility of the UK coming out of the EU and the knock on conditions that would cause for movement and working entitlement/ownership rules.


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

Well let's hope the UK isn't stupid enough to vote itself out of the EU!! Do you think London property prices are sustainable? I know a few guys who work in property down there and they say it's just crazy!!


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## LDN2ESP (Jul 24, 2015)

chica escocesa said:


> Well let's hope the UK isn't stupid enough to vote itself out of the EU!! Do you think London property prices are sustainable? I know a few guys who work in property down there and they say it's just crazy!!


A mixture of dirty money and investors from outside of Europe are pushing things forward. Hand on heart, if I was you and youngish, I would probably try to buy a place in North Kent, towards Dartford area. Not only are the property prices still reasonable, especially in places like Chatham, but you have fantastic connections to Europe, both by rail and ferry, when they're not being overrun (Calais) by migrants desperate to get into the UK.

The above areas also have the bonus of the proposed Paramount UK theme park being built, which will create thousands of jobs and will push up the prices of homes.

If you decide not to go to Spain at this point in time, you'll find SE London just about the only place affordable in London, which is based on the lack of tube lines. This is gradually changing with the inclusion of crossrail and much better overground and road networks. I'm 5 minutes drive from the 02 Dome in Greenwich. I can get into central London via the tube at North Greenwich within 20 mins max. As Phil and Kirsty once said 'Location, location, location. North Kent is a good place to lay your hat, until prices rocket there as well.

Are London prices sustainable? Yes. London is without doubt the capital financial city of the World and the Tech' side of things have increased massively in 10 years.

I can't wait to get away from it though ... Born & Bred, it's killing me.lane:


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## alborino (Dec 13, 2014)

chica escocesa said:


> Well let's hope the UK isn't stupid enough to vote itself out of the EU!! Do you think London property prices are sustainable? I know a few guys who work in property down there and they say it's just crazy!!


I'm not sure how you can say to vote to leave the EU is stupid when we do not know what state the EU will be in when we get to vote. Based on today I'm 60% in favour of staying but that could quickly change if the Euro goes belly up and we see the consequences of that. Despite the damage of uncertainty I'm happy we negotiate and drag it out till end of 2017.

As for London property prices they are based on a supply and demand market, the demand based in part on comparison with other opportunities. For sure there are cycles of ups and downs but the overall direction is clear. I remember 40 years ago, 30 years ago, 20 ............ people saying the FTSE will crash, the property market will burst, ........... It did happen of course but only as a temporary phenomena. Those who sat tight with diversified portfolios always came out on top


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

We're up in Scotland with a new-ish business and a 2 year old. No offence, I couldn't live down there. I could, possibly, invest though. Might have a nosy at Kent, see what the opportunities are and what initial investment would be.


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

Because I think it would be a backwards move. The UK benefits hugely from free movement of goods and people within the EU. The EU has become a scapegoat for all that is 'wrong' in English society. And I mean English, not British. The UKIP phenomenon.


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## LDN2ESP (Jul 24, 2015)

chica escocesa said:


> Because I think it would be a backwards move. The UK benefits hugely from free movement of goods and people within the EU. The EU has become a scapegoat for all that is 'wrong' in English society. And I mean English, not British. The UKIP phenomenon.


A couple of things to reply to, London is incredibly vibrant and busy city. People who don't frequent it would be genuinely surprised how manic it is almost constantly, but that is the attraction for many, many of hundreds of thousands each year. It's a city with nearly more people living there than the entire population of Scotland & Wales put together. 

It's expensive, but so are all the great world cities, that's what you pay for, convenience and an endless supply of entertainment and social resources. During the 80s/90s several of my friends decided to head to the countryside to 'get away' from the heaving metropolis. EVERY one of those people have either come back or are still trying to, the wages, the ability to get to work without high BR ticket charges has proved too much to resist. 

They all regret running to the country, it was a massive financial mistake for them, a bit like some of the Spanish horror stories of the early noughties. 

With regard to Europe, I guess I sit on the fence regarding this subject. How can people who don't experience the very real negatives of mass uncontrolled movement of economic migrants make a realistic argument for? It's not me being rude, but my kids have no chance of ever living in London as rents have been driven up by new arrivals and those available places on the social housing market disappearing due to new arrival families gaining preference over young couples. The liberal side of the media hate to talk about it, but it's factual and if you live within an area that has changed massively you see it first hand.

Whilst the UK welcomes skilled workers from overseas, we don't really need those who don't want to contribute. The 16 hour working rule is a blooming nightmare, what a massive magnet that is, you get a job, work for peanuts for at least 16 hours then you're entitled to claim numerous state benefits. There lies the problem, once you qualify the gravy train is well and truly open, at yours and my expense. This fabulous benefit doesn't exist anywhere else in the EU. Madness eh?

As for EU membership, both Norway and Switzerland have no problem whatsoever with not being members of the club, both trade easily with the EU and have no travel restrictions. So why couldn't the UK be in the same position?

Sorry to go on, but living amongst huge numbers of new arrivals into London exposes you to all the social problems associated, all these new communities need to be serviced by social services/housing etc ... Which cost many millions of £ each year for each council. 

Having said the above, for moi, the UK leaving the EU would not be beneficial, but rather than burying my head in the sand I've spoken from the coal face, the reality of the myth that all things associated with the EU are great ... Apart from the god awful currency, the mass influx of migrants from outside the EU, the Southern EU countries economies being on the floor and near to collapse and mass unemployment, everything is just rosie (sic)?

Just think who was behind the EU formation? The Germans. Engineered with the French hanging onto their lederhousen in the belief that their own economic situation would improve. German industry couldn't afford to keep an inflated 'Mark' - that would have made exports frighteningly expensive to all those outside of Germany, so the European dream needed to be maintained .... So here we are. Copyright Faithless.


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## chica escocesa (Jul 23, 2012)

Well let's leave the EU and see if all those things improve. 'Close the borders', will all those who have settled here be asked to leave? Not to mention that it will start the whole independence hoo ha again!


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## LDN2ESP (Jul 24, 2015)

chica escocesa said:


> Well let's leave the EU and see if all those things improve. 'Close the borders', will all those who have settled here be asked to leave? Not to mention that it will start the whole independence hoo ha again!


Not at all, a reasonable level of federalism, not the cleverly manipulated version we have within the EU at the moment? We love being European, we did so long before the EU existed, before the 'Common market' etc, after all, that's why we got stuck into the Axis forces during the last World War.

I'm not suggesting the legal migrants get asked to leave, but why do we pay out benefits way beyond what they would receive in their own country? It's a magnet for both good and bad economic migrants.

When I go to Spain, I will NOT be able to claim any benefits at all, if I'm self-employed I'll have to stump up 250 euros a month for the pleasure? Can you imagine how things would alter in the UK if self-employed migrants were asked to pay £200 into the coffers of HMRC each month for the privilege of living here? It certainly would change things.

One last thing, the opposing narrative is that the Brits flock to the Sun (Spain) and create their own ghettos, however, those same people either rent of purchase property, which isn't subsidised by the local councils. It's completely different and should not be used as a counter argument.

Immigration is good, but unskilled economic migrants are not needed in either the UK or Spain.


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