# China



## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

So now this mornings news, Duterte says he will cut military & Economic ties with the US and has signed numerous MOU's (Memorandum On Understanding) with China in several different areas of concern to the PH Govt. The PH Coast Guard will have joint details w/Chinese counterparts, Strengthening Trade, Economic Developement, as well as Transportation & Banking issues, among others.

Guess we will have to watch & see where this goes as far as we are concerned. Seems to be getting a bit shakey but still early.

Fred


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

fmartin_gila said:


> So now this mornings news, Duterte says he will cut military & Economic ties with the US and has signed numerous MOU's (Memorandum On Understanding) with China in several different areas of concern to the PH Govt. The PH Coast Guard will have joint details w/Chinese counterparts, Strengthening Trade, Economic Developement, as well as Transportation & Banking issues, among others.
> 
> Guess we will have to watch & see where this goes as far as we are concerned. Seems to be getting a bit shakey but still early.
> 
> Fred


Fully agree Fred,

Along those same lines, I think many are keeping a close eye on the (US) embassy website for any announcments and or advisories on travel to or remaining in the Philippines. Very fluid situation.

Jet Lag


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

*Concerns Voiced & Questions Being Asked*

Government officials are really starting to voice concern and ask questions with the changing mindset of the current government. Will this make a difference? Will the population in general have any real voice in the changes or are the educated enough to have a logical opinion?

Senator Leila de Lima questioned President Rodrigo Duterte’s Thursday announcement of enhanced ties with China after declaring his “separation” from the United States.
During a Friday forum held by women’s rights activists, De Lima cited... (Read More)
{source INQ News}


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## Ram1957 (Oct 14, 2014)

Jet Lag said:


> Government officials are really starting to voice concern and ask questions with the changing mindset of the current government. Will this make a difference? Will the population in general have any real voice in the changes or are the educated enough to have a logical opinion?
> 
> Senator Leila de Lima questioned President Rodrigo Duterte’s Thursday announcement of enhanced ties with China after declaring his “separation” from the United States.
> During a Friday forum held by women’s rights activists, De Lima cited... (Read More)
> {source INQ News}


Seem other people in the Senate aren't happy about it either. I have to laugh when the Palace has to explain Duterte's actions. Seems the right foot doesn't know what the left foot is doing. Time will tell how this all plays out.
Maintaining his independence, Gordon lambastes Duterte over US breakup | INQUIRER.net


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

Ram1957 said:


> Seem other people in the Senate aren't happy about it either. I have to laugh when the Palace has to explain Duterte's actions. Seems the right foot doesn't know what the left foot is doing. Time will tell how this all plays out.
> Maintaining his independence, Gordon lambastes Duterte over US breakup | INQUIRER.net


Yep for sure. It's like living inside of a true to life Three Stooges movie-only the actors are nothing but a bunch of 3rd graders!


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

I would have thought that Duterte could seek closer ties with China and Russia without intentionally trying to damage relations with the U.S.. 
So I do not understand his current tactic.

Has the U.S. placed some restriction on the Philippines to only use U.S. military aid to purchase U.S. military equipment? 
This might annoy Duterte when he sees lower equipment prices from other suppliers/countries.
(I am grasping to understand some of his motives.)


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

This kind of strikes me as a high school girl trying to play 2 or 3 guys to get the "best" date to the Prom but with a lot more serious consequences. He is getting quite a bit of opposition from some of his higher-ups, even to some stating he has to get approval before anything happens. Kind of irks me that he states "The US has done nothing for the Philippines" conveniently forgetting all the American Blood spilled here in the 2nd WW and all the Millions or Billions given as aid to a poor country hoping to get it into a stabilized position of the world. I really believe he is a bit out of his league playing games between the US, China, & Russia, but as I keep saying we will just have to see.

Fred


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## Ram1957 (Oct 14, 2014)

His next trip is to Japan and it should be a very interesting meeting. He will have to do some explaining on his current "new friends". Japan is the Philippines #1 trading partner and they are also giving the Philippines two navy ships.


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## Maxx62 (Dec 31, 2013)

I kinda had one eye on the television news last night when he was explaining that he was going to seek closer relationships with both China and Japan. My understanding is that China and Japan are diametrically opposed to one another over various territorial disputes in the East China Sea. Japan takes the matter so seriously that they have recently launched two wasp type aircraft carriers for the first time since WWII. I don't think that the Japanese are going to tolerate a three way courtship between the Philippines, The People's Republic of China, and Japan. I think that the Japanese are going to tell him that he has to get on one side of the fence or the other, and to try to play one side against the other simply isn't going to happen. My understanding is that Japanese diplomats are scheduled to meet with him and to ask for clarification on his realignment towards China and Russia. I imagine that the South Koreans and Taiwanese feel the same way as the Japanese.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

*U.S. Envoy reminds PH*

Outgoing United States Ambassador to the Philippines Philip Goldberg on Friday, October 21, said he cannot understand Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte's push for an "economic separation" from the United States. Goldberg said the economies of the Philippines and... (Read More)
{source: Rappler}


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Jet Lag said:


> Outgoing United States Ambassador to the Philippines Philip Goldberg on Friday, October 21, said he cannot understand Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte's push for an "economic separation" from the United States. Goldberg said the economies of the Philippines and... (Read More)
> {source: Rappler}


Clarification of such an outlandish statement needs to be forthcoming. Things could turn very nasty very quickly and we as expats could find ourselves situated in somewhat of an uncomfortable position, both Family wise and Nationality wise.

Fred


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## Nickleback99 (Aug 6, 2011)

fmartin_gila said:


> Clarification of such an outlandish statement needs to be forthcoming. Things could turn very nasty very quickly and we as expats could find ourselves situated in somewhat of an uncomfortable position, both Family wise and Nationality wise.
> 
> Fred


Americans in Philippines jittery as Duterte rails against United States



Good article on Expats in the current environment. Interesting times for sure. Y'all know "Dynamite Dicks" in Olongago?... It mentioned Richard Haulet (owner I presume) and Jack Walker of an American Vets group there.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

Nickleback99 said:


> Americans in Philippines jittery as Duterte rails against United States
> 
> 
> 
> Good article on Expats in the current environment. Interesting times for sure. Y'all know "Dynamite Dicks" in Olongago?... It mentioned Richard Haulet (owner I presume) and Jack Walker of an American Vets group there.


Lots of ex US military over there in and around the Subic area. Same with Angeles and Clark areas. Trouble is that scuttlebutt travels faster than fact. So will have to keep our main focus on the US embassy and I think it would be wise to visit often the websites and in person at your closest VFW post even if not a memberTo get :help: and answers. 

If worse comes to worse, one can (if married) just keep a low profile at or near home and suffer with being bored while the asawa does the going and doing.
Eventually all this foolishness will blow over I think and life will get back to normal---if you can call it that:der:..


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

On my newsfeed this morning, there seems to be a bit of backpedaling and some downplaying going on to slow this down somewhat.

Fred



Gene, When did you move to Snowflake, Az.? That is about 150 or so miles NorthEast of Phoenix. LOL


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

fmartin_gila said:


> On my newsfeed this morning, there seems to be a bit of backpedaling and some downplaying going on to slow this down somewhat.
> 
> Fred
> 
> ...


Morning Fred,

Just here to attend the Snowflake AZ LDS temple. Then on to St. George UT.


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Jet Lag said:


> Morning Fred,
> 
> Just here to attend the Snowflake AZ LDS temple. Then on to St. George UT.


Cige, didn't know you were traveling and thought it might be some sort of a glitch.
That was in part of my territory I covered out of Flagstaff many years ago. I was a fleet mechanic for APS and took care of all the vehicles & equipment for the northern half of the state in every settlement, subdivision, village, town, or whatever and wherever we had a crew working. Did that for about 20 years for APS in the 70s & 80s, then retired in 1990 and went to driving for a living before I decided to hang it up.

Fred


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

fmartin_gila said:


> Cige, didn't know you were traveling and thought it might be some sort of a glitch.
> That was in part of my territory I covered out of Flagstaff many years ago. I was a fleet mechanic for APS and took care of all the vehicles & equipment for the northern half of the state in every settlement, subdivision, village, town, or whatever and wherever we had a crew working. Did that for about 20 years for APS in the 70s & 80s, then retired in 1990 and went to driving for a living before I decided to hang it up.
> 
> Fred


Really a small world for sure. You covered a lot of areas there over the years. I remember going North outa Phoenix and going through "Nothing AZ" and push through Wikeiup and on to Kingman to LA.

So you were pushing the big rigs then. I drove for Arlo G. Lott out of Idaho and a lot of charter bus all over H*lls have acre over the years. Great fun and some pretty good roads. But I like being retired now and all I drive is a 155cc motor trike.


Jet


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## Nickleback99 (Aug 6, 2011)

Well fellas, the news Ain't getting any better. Pres D. is up here in Japan and announced he wants foreign (aka U.S.) troops Out within 2 yrs. And it sound like he conceded Spratleys to China before he was even elected. Wow.

Philippine leader Duterte says he wants foreign troops out

Long before he was elected president, Rodrigo Duterte let Beijing know the South China Sea was theirs


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## Ram1957 (Oct 14, 2014)

Nickleback99 said:


> Well fellas, the news Ain't getting any better. Pres D. is up here in Japan and announced he wants foreign (aka U.S.) troops Out within 2 yrs. And it sound like he conceded Spratleys to China before he was even elected. Wow.
> 
> Philippine leader Duterte says he wants foreign troops out
> 
> Long before he was elected president, Rodrigo Duterte let Beijing know the South China Sea was theirs


Well if in fact he did make a deal with the Spratleys, he soon won't be the President. The SC has already told him if he gives the Spratleys away he will be impeached. Can't give something away that doesn't belong to him.

http://www.breitbart.com/national-s...-supreme-court-justice-warns-impeach-duterte/


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## JM101 (Jan 6, 2015)

I have a good friend, an old Navy buddy, living on Long Island, NY who visits here every year with his Asawa and has many Filipino friends in the USA. He was telling me this morning how everyone back there think of Duterte as a big joke. There were MANY other derogatory comments made by those friends, but I don't think I need to list them here. 

I found myself defending him with the following:

One of the things that Duterte wants is an INFLUENCE FREE Philippines, with all outside countries out. He wants to bring Mindanao back into the fold, but having the US here stops that action. He doesn't mind visitors, but if you want to live here or do business here, then is will be under PI rules. He wants equal Immigration laws...(He is big on this and if the US doesn't change the way the Filipino can go to America, then he may change the way Americans can come to PI) He wants fair trade. etc etc 

Like others have said above, this is a wait and see situation.

My new Asawa and I will be returning to the US at the end of November, but that is a post I will make at later date as it has nothing to do with this issue.

JM101


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## Tukaram (Dec 18, 2014)

Influence free? No, he is just trading the US in for China - and they will be worse. The UN found in favor of the PIs in the Spratley fight - and he still asked permission from China for Filipino fishermen to use the waters.


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## JM101 (Jan 6, 2015)

Tukaram said:


> Influence free? No, he is just trading the US in for China - and they will be worse. The UN found in favor of the PIs in the Spratley fight - and he still asked permission from China for Filipino fishermen to use the waters.


I am in full agreement that it will end up worse...HE just THINKS it will be better.

JM101


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

I do agree with him on the part that the Drug crackdown is his manner of handling the problem and should not be that much of a concern of other world leaders, in other words MYOB, but he has taken it as a personal attack against himself and has gone somewhat past the point of just telling the world to leave him alone and has gone on the offensive. As I've said earlier, I do believe he is a bit out of his League trying to play games with the US, Russia, China & Japan. He surely is not that naive to think China will let him go his own way, when they can control the destiny once he gets settled into their system. He seems to be trying to think like a politician making speeches who will say whatever he thinks that particular audience wants to hear, but when it comes down to it, he is not that polished, seems as if he has a bit of a problem with self-control and has quite a few rough edges to run afoul of. Plus the fact that he is starting to get quite a bit of pushback from his higher-ups kind of makes one a bit nervous as to the outcome, not to mention the longevity of his Presidency. He does seem to pride himself on being controversial. 

Still in a holding pattern until we see some of the results.

Fred


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## cyberfx1024 (May 21, 2015)

What is really sad is that he is letting down alot of people who previously were very vocal supporters and voters for him. My asawa was one of these people who was a supporter of him, and now wishes he would shut his mouth or think before he speaks. She has gotten in to some pretty big fights with some friends of hers in the Philippines over him and the USA as a whole. This has only bubbled up to the surface the last month so to me it's crazy how these people are supporting him pretty much trying to stick it to the USA thinking that China will be better.
My wife has a nephew who is a very prominent journalist in Davao who is seriously a NPA sympathizer and thinks everything is the US's fault. I told him why does he think China is any better than the USA and all I heard was crickets. The he posted something this week about how Duterte won't be anyone's lapdog. So I responded that "All the while he is kissing up to China to let the fishermen fish".

So in essence it is hard being from Davao and having to take ridicule from other Pinoys here in the states because of him.


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## Danman (Mar 23, 2016)

I think everyone agrees that there should be crackdowns on drugs, I watched on TV a guy saying a lot of other countries have tried what Duterte is doing but in the long run it had little affect the reason being too many people unemployed, a family friend who turned himself in to PNP because he was a user, told me many people are deal drugs here because no work and you need money to feed your family, so I cannot see this problem going away for a long time yet. As for China the Australian Government questioned Duterte why he has stopped patroling the Spratly Islands, from what I have heard Duterte has given the Spratly Islands to China. Duterte is a lawyer not a politician I believe he is playing games with USA hoping to get a better deal but this could back fire as he is very hot tempered as he said after Ramos resigned he has his way of doing things Ramos has his, I believe Duterte does not like being told what to do as we know Duterte was a mayor in Davao for many years where his word was law and now he is President his mind set is still the same. Let us hope things will change for the better


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## Ram1957 (Oct 14, 2014)

Danman said:


> I think everyone agrees that there should be crackdowns on drugs, I watched on TV a guy saying a lot of other countries have tried what Duterte is doing but in the long run it had little affect the reason being too many people unemployed, a family friend who turned himself in to PNP because he was a user, told me many people are deal drugs here because no work and you need money to feed your family, so I cannot see this problem going away for a long time yet. As for China the Australian Government questioned Duterte why he has stopped patroling the Spratly Islands, from what I have heard Duterte has given the Spratly Islands to China. Duterte is a lawyer not a politician I believe he is playing games with USA hoping to get a better deal but this could back fire as he is very hot tempered as he said after Ramos resigned he has his way of doing things Ramos has his, I believe Duterte does not like being told what to do as we know Duterte was a mayor in Davao for many years where his word was law and now he is President his mind set is still the same. Let us hope things will change for the better


If he did in in fact give the Spratly Islands he won't be President long. The Supreme Court and members of Congress have said they will impeach him over that.


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

At times there can be quite a bit of difference between what is said and what is done.

Fred


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## Nickleback99 (Aug 6, 2011)

Tukaram said:


> Influence free? No, he is just trading the US in for China - and they will be worse. The UN found in favor of the PIs in the Spratley fight - and he still asked permission from China for Filipino fishermen to use the waters.


And Wolves will smell weakness in a heartbeat. Guaranteed China sees a weak sheep they can play with and use as they choose. Sad when leaders let their egos rule the day, but appears such are the times we now live in and find ourselves. This is one of those "Be careful what you wish for" scenarios.


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Ran across an article on MSN News this Morn "China, Duterte and the crisis in the Philippine-US Alliance" National - china - News - msn An interesting & thought provoking read and does seem to put a couple new thoughts as to what is transpiring here. We have to keep in mind that China does plan in long term thoughts(5, 10, & 20 years) whereas it seems long range plans here in the Philippines seem to be as far ahead as next month. The so-called Politicians here seem to be more concerned with the 4th grade goings on & who is trying to destroy who than to be concerned about the welfare of the country as a whole. We may not see it happening in our lifetime but China's agenda does seem to be inching along to a unavoidable ending. 

Fred


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## revenuerog (Apr 2, 2017)

So..am I to understand that now would not be an optimal time to relocate to the PI?


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

I really don't expect much of a change in daily life unless there is a Military takeover, which I doubt will occur. It seems the Chinese are gradually intermeshing themselves into the Govt workings here. As if they are trying to portray themselves as benevolent, ie big brother taking care of little brother who happen to be in this case the Philippines along with some other small countries in this part of the world. If this is the plan, then it will take quite a number of years to fully employ and will not actually change things for the average Philippine Citizen to any great extent and I doubt would change much for any of the expats here. 

As an aside My Asawa's oldest son who is 40 years old has lived and worked in China for the last 5 or 6 years and is completely happy there, he is not the normal OFW but an entrepreneur running his own business there. In his sight, China is not only alright, but a great place to be and do business.

Fred


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

revenuerog said:


> So..am I to understand that now would not be an optimal time to relocate to the PI?


If you have been planning on coming here and are aware of the political climate here, I would not do any major replanning. Keep in mind that each of us is different and in slightly different situations, and that we all have different tolerance levels as well as long term plans/goals/outlooks. 

Fred


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## hogrider (May 25, 2010)

revenuerog said:


> So..am I to understand that now would not be an optimal time to relocate to the PI?


You must do your own assessment and make your own decisions. There are conflicts all around the world. With North Korea building up their nuclear capability, some would argue that its only a matter of time before they have the ability to launch a long range strike directly on mainland USA. Should that happen, then it might well be the optimal time to leave the U.S.........


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Another article at globalbalita.com titled "Appeasing the Chinese Dragon" Dated April 3, 2017. A good read with some historical time references. The Chinese are thinking in the timeframe of 2040. Another article to reference would be "The Chinazation of Cambodia. These will help with understanding what is transpiring in this area of the world. 

Fred


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