# How low can you go



## Horlics (Sep 27, 2011)

So, in Javea we have quite a few China Bazar places. We call them, collectively, the Shanghai ****e Shops.

Then there are some which disguise themselves as boutiques but do in fact peddle the same ****e.

I've never been keen on trips with the wife when she's shopping for clothes, but visits to the nearby Todos 10 Euros has changed all that.

This week's offerings, a shirt with the brand Loyal Yachting Club (spot the mistake), and most amusingly, another emblazoned USA Polo Team underneath a Union Jack.

How bad does it have to be before it's not worth 10 Euros.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

We have one in town which is even cheaper than the rest, and they do employ a couple of Spanish staff which is unusual. I've never bought clothes there but we do buy all kinds of small articles like glasses (they get broken too easily with these tiled floors to buy expensive ones), lightbulbs, etc. Sunglasses at €1.89 are irresistible, I lose them far too often to splash out on a pair of Raybans!

I think the best logo I ever saw on one of the chino shop T-shirts was the one emblazoned with "D & C". I thought oh dear, I bet they don't know what that stands for!


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## Brangus (May 1, 2010)

A few months ago the one down the street here was selling knockoff Abercrombie & Fitch flip-flops labeled "Aberration & Feet." :laugh:


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## Lolito (Aug 25, 2012)

I buy all sorts of silly things there... that get broken within 24 hours usually. I always say 'not more, never again'... but then there I go again... and make the same mistake! 

The thing is that as some things are so cheap, you don't mind if they break, lol! I never buy anything over a few euros there, they might look exactly the same as the 'original' but somehow I seem to break everything I buy there within hours of buying them!?


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Years ago, when DIY Tshirts were very trendy, a friend of a friend decided to embroider hers with some fancy Chinese characters she copied from a Limehouse restaurant menu.

She found out later that loosely translated, the characters stood for " Cheap but delicious".

My friend swore it was a true story.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

I STILL have xmas tree lights going strong which I bought in the Chinese Bazaar xmas 2003.....


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Horlics said:


> .
> 
> This week's offerings, a shirt with the brand Loyal Yachting Club (spot the mistake), and most amusingly, another emblazoned USA Polo Team underneath a Union Jack.


This isn't new. Counterfeit designer gear was around for years before the advent of Chinese bazaars - like the "Kalvin Clein" shirt I saw at a street market in Turkey 20 years ago. I wish I'd bought it ... it might qualify as a collector's item. 

Love them or hate them, the Chinese shops meet a need for people with very little disposable income.

Why not direct your anger at "respectable" retailers who sell vastly overpriced goods on the strength of a designer label, where the price bears no relation to the cost of production?


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## Horlics (Sep 27, 2011)

I wasn't directing anger, it was intended as a light-hearted bit of fun.

For the record, we buy from them too. Only one rule though Xabiachica.... never anything that has a plug on it!




Alcalaina said:


> This isn't new. Counterfeit designer gear was around for years before the advent of Chinese bazaars - like the "Kalvin Clein" shirt I saw at a street market in Turkey 20 years ago. I wish I'd bought it ... it might qualify as a collector's item.
> 
> Love them or hate them, the Chinese shops meet a need for people with very little disposable income.
> 
> Why not direct your anger at "respectable" retailers who sell vastly overpriced goods on the strength of a designer label, where the price bears no relation to the cost of production?


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Alcalaina said:


> This isn't new. Counterfeit designer gear was around for years before the advent of Chinese bazaars - like the "Kalvin Clein" shirt I saw at a street market in Turkey 20 years ago. I wish I'd bought it ... it might qualify as a collector's item.
> 
> Love them or hate them, the Chinese shops meet a need for people with very little disposable income.
> 
> Why not direct your anger at "respectable" retailers who sell vastly overpriced goods on the strength of a designer label, where the price bears no relation to the cost of production?


Nothing not 'respectable' about that. These retailers aren't selling handbags, Tshirts etc they're selling a brand, a 'lifestyle.'. If people are willing to pay over the odds for the pleasure of wearing a label on a pair of jeans that cost a hundred times the production cost, that's not the retailer's fault. Calvin Klein, Nike, Hilfiger etc. don't actually manufacture anything. They are selling their brand which thanks to advertising persuades the old, fat and ugly that they can magically become slim, youthful and attractive by cramming themselves into a pair of CK jeans.
I once saw a tv documentary about the scent industry. It cost about £3 to manufacture scent retailing at £30. When asked why it wasn't sold for less, the answer was: women wouldn't buy it if it were 'cheap'.
People like to feel they are indulging in 'luxury'.
I'm a bit of a label queen albeit a cheap one as I buy from places like TK Maxx.

If we should point afinger at anyone, it's the Asian and South American producers not the retailers. I don't suppose the women who sew the cheap Chinese stuff get better wages and conditions.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Horlics said:


> I wasn't directing anger, it was intended as a light-hearted bit of fun.
> 
> For the record, we buy from them too. Only one rule though Xabiachica.... never anything that has a plug on it!


how do you think my xmas lights, light :confused2:


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

A friend of mine has a Chinese friend who is a superviser for several shops. She says 60% of what they sell is inferior and does not do the job. 

That said, I do buy things at our local shop and so far I have not been disappointed. The most surprising was a 11 / 12 mm spanner for 1 euro. It is made of high quality steel, well designed and very fitted for purpose. (I trained as a mechanical engineer and I know steel)

I would be reluctant to buy most electrical items such as bulbs. A 9v battery I bough last in my remote garage door opener, for almost a whole day


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Lynn R said:


> We have one in town which is even cheaper than the rest, and they do employ a couple of Spanish staff which is unusual. I've never bought clothes there but we do buy all kinds of small articles like glasses (they get broken too easily with these tiled floors to buy expensive ones), lightbulbs, etc. Sunglasses at €1.89 are irresistible, I lose them far too often to splash out on a pair of Raybans!
> 
> I think the best logo I ever saw on one of the chino shop T-shirts was the one emblazoned with "D & C". I thought oh dear, I bet they don't know what that stands for!


Dust and Clean of course - that's what we always used to call it!


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## VFR (Dec 23, 2009)

Lynn R said:


> We have one in town which is even cheaper than the rest, and they do employ a couple of Spanish staff which is unusual. I've never bought clothes there but we do buy all kinds of small articles like glasses (they get broken too easily with these tiled floors to buy expensive ones), lightbulbs, etc. Sunglasses at €1.89 are irresistible, I lose them far too often to splash out on a pair of Raybans!
> 
> I think the best logo I ever saw on one of the chino shop T-shirts was the one emblazoned with "D & C". I thought oh dear, I bet they don't know what that stands for!


It may be worth saying that your eyes will be a good deal happier if you do not buy those so called sunglasses again, in fact I know they will.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

The quality of the goods in the Chinese shops in this area has gone up considerably. It used to be all things like trays made of plastic that bent as soon as you put a cup on them, pens that dried up after a week and socks that lost their elastic after being washed. Now most of them have a selection of cups and glasses that are OK, some DIY stuff that's much better quality than it used to be and quite often some stationery that's not bad, pots for plants... There's still the dodgy stuff, but there's stuff that actually lasts a while too.
I wouldn't buy any cosmetics from them or cleaning fluids, but people do.
As for clothes, there are lots of shops in Madrid and around that are just like "normal" clothes shops, but that are owned and run by the Chinese. They used to be staffed solely by the Chinese too, but they now employ Spanish people
Okeysi









Mulaya
Mulaya

Chinese trading has been the downfall of many a Spanish textile company and shoe manufacturer, and I think it's a shame that everyone's gone for cheapo throwaway, not least of all for the impact on resources, but they found the gap and filled it.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

> "quite often some stationary that's not bad"


Obviously not a very fast mover, then. English teachers you can't get them these days!


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## amespana (Nov 10, 2009)

I seem to remember years ago that Chinese restaurants had to have at least one Spanish employee in order to get a licence.This was obviously before the Chinese government bought Spain,now they can do what they like.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> Obviously not a very fast mover, then. English teachers you can't get them these days!


Typo was being corrected as you typed Baldi


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

VFR said:


> It may be worth saying that your eyes will be a good deal happier if you do not buy those so called sunglasses again, in fact I know they will.


From what I've read, opinion is divided as to whether cheap sunglasses are always bad for one's eyes or not:-


Are cheap sunglasses safe? We asked an eye expert to analyse cut-price shades | Daily Mail Online

I always make sure I buy ones with large lenses which fit well and don't allow light in from the sides. I don't sit out in the sun for hours, either.


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## Tel Boy (Jul 1, 2014)

I don't want to sound a complete nimbie but we all, mainly the older generations think about what we buy and simply chuck away. The oceans are clogged with fleece fibres and plastic particles that are choking marine life, god knows about the colourings. If we start the younger generations might follow.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Tel Boy said:


> I don't want to sound a complete nimbie but we all, mainly the older generations think about what we buy and simply chuck away. The oceans are clogged with fleece fibres and plastic particles that are choking marine life, god knows about the colourings. If we start the younger generations might follow.


I don't 'buy and chuck away' any item that still has some use in it. All unwanted items go to charity shops or Caritas.
That's what almost everyone I know does. Larger items get put by the basura so someone can make use of them.
Throwing away stuff isn't a generation thing.


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## Tel Boy (Jul 1, 2014)

I didn't mean to offend, I just think we should think a little more before we buy cr.. then chuck it. Try walking past these shops and reuse something from the charity shops where your stuff goes. I have been guilty in the past but it makes you feel better. Small steps might lead to big change, but I feel we are far to late.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Tel Boy said:


> I didn't mean to offend, I just think we should think a little more before we buy cr.. then chuck it. Try walking past these shops and reuse something from the charity shops where your stuff goes. I have been guilty in the past but it makes you feel better. Small steps might lead to big change, but I feel we are far to late.


No offence taken. I agree with you. We work as volunteers for a charity which has a shop in Estepona that sells all kinds of good used stuff. We often buy things from there, in fact most of the pictures hanging on our walls are from there as well as a nice dinner set.
People should think more about what they buy and what théy throw awáy.
It's never too late to educate!


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## Tel Boy (Jul 1, 2014)

Fantastic, spread the word.


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

mrypg9 said:


> People should think more about what they buy and what they throw away.!


My wife is Filipino, she and her friends send anything that maybe of any use, if it fits in the shipping box, to the Philippines. They recycle just about everything there. Reminds me of UK in the 1940's


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## Brangus (May 1, 2010)

larryzx said:


> The most surprising was a 11 / 12 mm spanner for 1 euro. It is made of high quality steel, well designed and very fitted for purpose. (I trained as a mechanical engineer and I know steel)
> 
> I would be reluctant to buy most electrical items such as bulbs. A 9v battery I bough last in my remote garage door opener, for almost a whole day


Yep, it really is a mixed bag. My OH tested some batteries with a voltmeter and they were bad the moment they came out of the package.

On the other hand, the shop in our neighborhood sells nice candles made by handicapped people in Navarra. (ADISCO)


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

If it wasn't for the goods imported from China to Europe, Christmas would have to be cancelled. The biggest container ships in the world go from China to the UK choc a block with what we "need" for Christmas: trees, lights, Father Christmas suits, tinsel, alarm clocks, footballs, baking trays, ornaments, tvs, jackets, boots, glasses, gloves everything and anything almost apart from the alcohol will come from China. And what manufacured goods do we send back? Jack shi*. We send back rubbish to be recycled.
BBC News - Biggest container ship visits UK

How world's biggest ship is delivering our Christmas - all the way from China | UK news | The Guardian



> But the Emma Maersk, which has a crew of just 13 and a propeller weighing 130 tonnes, is also witness to how global manufacturing has shifted massively from Europe and the US to China as free trade has burgeoned under the auspices of the World Trade Organisation.
> While the boat is carrying around 11,000 containers and is by far the largest container ship ever built, Yentian port, where it set off from for Europe last month, now exports nearly three times that many containers every day. China is now far and away the world's biggest maker and exporter of everything from toy gorillas to steel and electronic goods.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Pesky Wesky said:


> If *. We send back rubbish to be recycled.
> BBC News - Biggest container ship visits UK
> 
> How world's biggest ship is delivering our Christmas - all the way from China | UK news | The Guardian


Probably the same unwanted used up sttuff that they sent in thefirstplace.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Tel Boy said:


> The oceans are clogged with fleece fibres and plastic particles that are choking marine life, god knows about the colourings. If we start the younger generations might follow.


By complete coincidence I have just found this (lengthy) article about some one who's trying to do something about this very problem
BBC News - The Dutch boy mopping up a sea of plastic


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Pesky Wesky said:


> If it wasn't for the goods imported from China to Europe, Christmas would have to be cancelled. The biggest container ships in the world go from China to the UK choc a block with what we "need" for Christmas: trees, lights, Father Christmas suits, tinsel, alarm clocks, footballs, baking trays, ornaments, tvs, jackets, boots, glasses, gloves everything and anything almost apart from the alcohol will come from China. And what manufacured goods do we send back? Jack shi*. We send back rubbish to be recycled.
> BBC News - Biggest container ship visits UK
> 
> How world's biggest ship is delivering our Christmas - all the way from China | UK news | The Guardian


As bona fide long standing members of the "Bah, humbug" school of thought we shan't be buying any of it, no matter how cheap. Nary a strand of tinsel, plastic tree nor fairy light shall there be in my house. I shall buy cards to send to family and friends when I go back to the UK (and post them from there, which is now not much cheaper than to send them from Spain) plus a few presents, and that's it.

There was an article in one of the Malaga papers the other day saying that the Chinese are now big buyers of Malaga sweet dessert wines, btw. They are welcome to them for me, but nice to know Spain at least is selling them something in return for all the plastic tat.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Lynn R said:


> As bona fide long standing members of the "Bah, humbug" school of thought we shan't be buying any of it, no matter how cheap. Nary a strand of tinsel, plastic tree nor fairy light shall there be in my house.
> 
> ... They are welcome to them for me, but nice to know Spain at least is selling them something in return for all the plastic tat.


It doesn't matter Lynn 'cos you'll have bought the plastic tat, sunglasses, glasses and lightbulbs, that were on the ship before!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Lynn R said:


> As bona fide long standing members of the "Bah, humbug" school of thought we shan't be buying any of it, no matter how cheap. Nary a strand of tinsel, plastic tree nor fairy light shall there be in my house. I shall buy cards to send to family and friends when I go back to the UK (and post them from there, which is now not much cheaper than to send them from Spain) plus a few presents, and that's it.
> 
> There was an article in one of the Malaga papers the other day saying that the Chinese are now big buyers of Malaga sweet dessert wines, btw. They are welcome to them for me, but nice to know Spain at least is selling them something in return for all the plastic tat.


We have ignored Christmas for many years, since my grandsons grew up and our mums died. By ignored I mean TOTALLY apart from a religious card to my very ancient and devout Auntie Nellie in Canada.
One Christmas Sandra went to her office to catch up on paperwork in peace and quiet while I stayed home and painted the kitchen and hallway whilst listening to the whole of Wagner's 'Ring' cycle over Christmas Day and Boxing Day. We usually just carry on as normal.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

I lied...our first Christmas in our big house in Prague my son, dil and grandsons spent it with us. They drove from the UK and brought all the ingredients for Christmas Dinner with them:'turkey, chipolatas, bacon, all the veg, Stilton, Port and Christmas pudding.
I must admit I enjoyed it. There was deep snow so there was the right atmosphere.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Lynn R said:


> As bona fide long standing members of the "Bah, humbug" school of thought we shan't be buying any of it, no matter how cheap. Nary a strand of tinsel, plastic tree nor fairy light shall there be in my house. I shall buy cards to send to family and friends when I go back to the UK (and post them from there, which is now not much cheaper than to send them from Spain) plus a few presents, and that's it.


We don't even bother with the cards which are probably the biggest waste of money of all (card + postage).

I was using JL.com but when I checked, the majority of recipients weren't bothering to open them so I stopped subscribing. Now it is just a festive message of some sort by e-mail.

Xmas: we go away for winter holiday in a centrally heated rented apartment. We take the Halogen oven and the slow cooker with us and cook our Christmas dinner (chicken not turkey) with all the trimmings that we particularly like such as parsley, thyme and lemon stuffing; sage and onion stuffing; marshmallow topped pineapple rings on a bed of sweet potato; roasted potatoes, onions and parsnips if we can get them. Home-made Chrissy pudding in the slow cooker. We take our own DVD player and an assortment of films either on disc or USB, a few games. Our Chrissy pressies are not only the stay-away but we take a 4x4 outing (including the dogs) into the restricted areas of a Natural park and see wildlife plus scenery that we would not normally see - we ended up on top of a mountain last year!


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## Tel Boy (Jul 1, 2014)

Sounds perfect baldilocs, xmas has been stuffed down our throats for far to long invented by the germans as a money spinner I think, it did work but the germans are far better in investing in the future than the rest of the world, ive just contradicted myself, anyway, the oceans are clogged right up to the north pole , 20 yrs time scary stuff, all the best.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> If it wasn't for the goods imported from China to Europe, Christmas would have to be cancelled.


Sounds like a good plan to me!

I'm still using tree decorations I bought in an Oxfam shop ten years ago. Authentic handmade ethnic tat from some commune in the Andes.

The lights came from the Chino though ...


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Tel Boy said:


> Sounds perfect baldilocs, xmas has been stuffed down our throats for far to long* invented by the germans as a money spinner I think*.


I thought it was Queen Victoria wanting to please her beloved Albert?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> Sounds like a good plan to me!
> 
> I'm still using tree decorations I bought in an Oxfam shop ten years ago. Authentic handmade ethnic tat from some commune in the Andes.
> 
> The lights came from the Chino though ...


I believe it now goes something like
Cards, we haven't sent cards for years, 
we give all our money to charity,
we go to the soup kitchen to help out on Christmas day,
We invite homeless people into house
We give our house to the homeless!!

Right that's done 

So now maybe we can get
:focus:


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## Nignoy (Jun 4, 2010)

There are quite afew really big cheap Chinese retailers such as Bang good ,Alibaba to name a couple who advertise cheap mass production goods most of which are excellent quality, all our electronics be it mobile phones, tablets and laptops are all from Alibaba ,we have been trading with them for over 5 years now no complaints from us, My fishing gear I buy through a retailer in Bangood,quality fishing tackle at a very economic price and postage free if sent economy!! and if the supplier has a new product he sends me a free sample to try out, my wife is a professional x stitch artist she receives most of her kits through Banggood, there are a couple of Chinese shops in San Fulgencio near where we are moving to next week ,quite handy for batteries and bucket and spades, for 1.50euros you cannot expect Guchi, in uk if you want a reliable steam iron or grill you dont go to thepound store do you??


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Chinese shops are one of the few growth areas in our town. The other seems to be muslim fruit and veg/ butcher's.
Quite a few Spanish owned shops have closed as a direct result of these shops opening; 2 gift shops, 1 stationers 1 sweet shop...
On one hand it's a shame to think that businesses that have been around for several years and which supply goods of slightly if not much better quality have closed. On the other hand the Chinese shops are successful because people buy in those shops, so they must be doing something right. I do think the town hall should restrict the number of shops though. It was the same when the property market was the business to be in. Every other shop was an estate agent's. There were too many with the result that there was always one closing down and there wasn't much variety for shoppers. Now there are lots of Chinese bazars. They don't close down, but they are half empty most of the time and more variety of shops would encourage more shoppers I think


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

I am informed by a good friend that Chinese opening businesses get a three tax holiday. My friend said she has ben trying to get this practice stopped but without success. It seems very strange to me that what she says could possibly be correct but she is an intelligent woman with many year trading experience in Spain, with fluent Spanish, so it is unlikely she has got it wrong.

That would explain why Chinese seem to opening shops at a time when other are ceasing to trade.


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

larryzx said:


> I am informed by a good friend that Chinese opening businesses get a three tax holiday. My friend said she has ben trying to get this practice stopped but without success. It seems very strange to me that what she says could possibly be correct but she is an intelligent woman with many year trading experience in Spain, with fluent Spanish, so it is unlikely she has got it wrong.
> 
> That would explain why Chinese seem to opening shops at a time when other are ceasing to trade.


Urban myth Larry...


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

larryzx said:


> I am informed by a good friend that Chinese opening businesses get a three tax holiday. My friend said she has ben trying to get this practice stopped but without success. It seems very strange to me that what she says could possibly be correct but she is an intelligent woman with many year trading experience in Spain, with fluent Spanish, so it is unlikely she has got it wrong.
> 
> That would explain why Chinese seem to opening shops at a time when other are ceasing to trade.


Yes, I've heard the same story for years and years, but have never been able to find anything to substantiate it, so it would be interesting if you can find something



jimenato said:


> Urban myth Larry...


Unfortunately the ABC doesn't really do it for me Jimenato


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Yes, I've heard the same story for years and years, but have never been able to find anything to substantiate it, so it would be interesting if you can find something
> 
> 
> Unfortunately the ABC doesn't really do it for me Jimenato


Fair enough. Better than anything else posted so far though...


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Any better?

¿Pagan los residentes chinos los mismos impuestos que el resto de españoles? - Economía - Diario digital Nueva Tribuna


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## Tel Boy (Jul 1, 2014)

Might as well turn the whole lot of them back, their is enough sh... in the world but people just don't get it. But once they have gone it wont be their problem, has the place gone mad, humans are no better than pigs in sh..


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## amespana (Nov 10, 2009)

What was that all about?Maybe something lost in translation!


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## Expatliving (Oct 21, 2013)

Am I correct in thinking that shops selling dubious (dangerous) electrical appliances are free to trade? Whereas if you so much as park a few inches outside a parking area the full weight of the law is applied?

Silly question, got to ask it though. Trading standards, mythical in Spain?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Expatliving said:


> Am I correct in thinking that shops selling dubious (dangerous) electrical appliances are free to trade? Whereas if you so much as park a few inches outside a parking area the full weight of the law is applied?
> 
> Silly question, got to ask it though. Trading standards, mythical in Spain?


yep - silly question

answered here ..... http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp.../579481-consumer-rights-warranties-spain.html


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