# Cars in France?



## bdelancy

I plan to spend at least 6 months a year at my home in France for the next 5-10 years, and am thinking about cars. Until now I have just rented a car for each stay, but I would like to consider alternatives. I could: (i) just buy a new or used car, (ii) lease a car for 3-4 years (is that a thing in France), (iii) do at 3-6 month lease buyback arrangement each time, (iv) continue doing short-term rentals (Europcar, etc.) each time, (v) ship a car here from the US, or (vi) something else I haven't considered.

I think buying a new car would be my last alternative for a number of reasons, including they seem to be very expensive right now, but I could be convinced otherwise.

Any and all suggestions greatly appreciated.


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## tardigrade

shipping the car from the US of A is not an option.. Takes too long and too much money to get it registered.


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## rynd2it

bdelancy said:


> I plan to spend at least 6 months a year at my home in France for the next 5-10 years, and am thinking about cars. Until now I have just rented a car for each stay, but I would like to consider alternatives. I could: (i) just buy a new or used car, (ii) lease a car for 3-4 years (is that a thing in France), (iii) do at 3-6 month lease buyback arrangement each time, (iv) continue doing short-term rentals (Europcar, etc.) each time, (v) ship a car here from the US, or (vi) something else I haven't considered.
> 
> I think buying a new car would be my last alternative for a number of reasons, including they seem to be very expensive right now, but I could be convinced otherwise.
> 
> Any and all suggestions greatly appreciated.


Will you be classed as resident, i.e filing taxes in France with the appropriate Avis des Impots? If not then you are not allowed to register a car in your name at your French address. If you are tax resident then you must register your car in France no matter where it came from, you can't leave it on (say) UK plates. As Tardigrade said (and I have much experience of this) don't even think of importing a US vehicle regardless of its manufacturer.

Used cars are expensive in France, look around other neighbouring EU countries such as Belgium for a better deal.


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## 255

@bdelancy -- This option has worked great for a family member: "(iii) do at 3-6 month lease buyback arrangement each time" There are quite a few French manufacturers that participate in these programs. They had the benefit of new cars, each visit. Cheers, 255


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## Crabtree

Something like this may be useful?





Key Services, a rental car for your stay in Europe







www.ttcar.com




Or this?








Peugeot Car Leasing in Europe | Peugeot Europe


Discover Europe in style with Peugeot Europe. Drive a brand new car in Europe between 14 and 175 days at a great price plus additional benefits when you book.




www.peugeoteurope.com.au









Peugeot Buy-Back Tourist Lease


If you're driving in Europe for 21 days or longer and reside outside the EU, a Peugeot Open Europe Buy-Back Lease can save you money over a car rental.



europeforvisitors.com


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## BackinFrance

rynd2it said:


> Will you be classed as resident, i.e filing taxes in France with the appropriate Avis des Impots? If not then you are not allowed to register a car in your name at your French address. If you are tax resident then you must register your car in France no matter where it came from, you can't leave it on (say) UK plates. As Tardigrade said (and I have much experience of this) don't even think of importing a US vehicle regardless of its manufacturer.
> 
> Used cars are expensive in France, look around other neighbouring EU countries such as Belgium for a better deal.


You are mistaken, you do not need to be tax resident in France to register a car here.


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## boilerman

BackinFrance said:


> You are mistaken, you do not need to be tax resident in France to register a car here.


We own a house, but don't live there, we bought a car, and left it in our garage till we visited again. No problem for us. In fact, I'd do it again, as it was cost effective, and helps the local economy


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## bdelancy

Thanks everyone for your responses. I am intrigued by the lease buyback alternative. It seems like Autoeurope is one of the bigger players in that business, and it also looks like Key Services, also mentioned above, may somehow be affiliated with them. As I understand it, the big savings is that the leases are not subject to VAT - is that correct?

Do any of you have any personal experience with those companies, and if so, can you share your experience?


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## bdelancy

boilerman said:


> We own a house, but don't live there, we bought a car, and left it in our garage till we visited again. No problem for us. In fact, I'd do it again, as it was cost effective, and helps the local economy


How long ago did you buy your car? Part of my current objection to that approach is just timing. It seems like both new and used cars are in very short supply worldwide so this may be a particularly expensive time to buy.


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## bhamham

bdelancy said:


> Thanks everyone for your responses. I am intrigued by the lease buyback alternative. It seems like Autoeurope is one of the bigger players in that business, and it also looks like Key Services, also mentioned above, may somehow be affiliated with them. As I understand it, the big savings is that the leases are not subject to VAT - is that correct?
> 
> Do any of you have any personal experience with those companies, and if so, can you share your experience?


I'm in a lease buyback car currently through AutoEurope. It's my second time to do this. The first time was through Kemwel. Both cars were brand new, the one I'm in now - a Citroen Berlingo - had done 40km when I collected it. It came with a Sat Nav/GPS but the map is a bit dated so I use Waze. I changed the location to drop the first car off and it was no problem and no extra charge. I think the cost very reasonable and am very satisfied.


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## boilerman

bdelancy said:


> How long ago did you buy your car? Part of my current objection to that approach is just timing. It seems like both new and used cars are in very short supply worldwide so this may be a particularly expensive time to buy.


Fair point, it was about 10 yrs ago, and things were different then price wise


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## bhamham

Another thing you might consider is the long-term rental from one of the big super market chains. I think I may do this after I return my lease-purchase car. They offer a lot of different type cars from the 'sans permis' to the all electric nissan leaf.

Here's SuperU's link:





La location Longue Durée







www.ulocation.com


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## bdelancy

> Another thing you might consider is the long-term rental from one of the big super market chains. I think I may do this after I return my lease-purchase car. They offer a lot of different type cars from the 'sans permis' to the all electric nissan leaf.


That seems like an interesting approach. Do you know how their prices compare? and whether the cars are relatively new (I don't need the latest and greatest, just a fairly recent model).


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## bhamham

Just a quick calculation in my mind, I think you'd save probably over a third from the lease purchase option. I haven't really study it in-depth though. The super mkt rentals are at least a 6-mo commitment and a 1000km limit/mo. .10e/1km over. I think they're new cars are relatively new - at least the ones I've seen at the SuperU parking lot are newish and very clean of course. Insurance and roadside recovery included.


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## bdelancy

The 1000km/mo limit seems very low. Sounds like that would only be realistic if the purpose of the rental is for very local use only.


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## Peasant

bdelancy said:


> Thanks everyone for your responses. I am intrigued by the lease buyback alternative. It seems like Autoeurope is one of the bigger players in that business, and it also looks like Key Services, also mentioned above, may somehow be affiliated with them. As I understand it, the big savings is that the leases are not subject to VAT - is that correct?
> Do any of you have any personal experience with those companies, and if so, can you share your experience?


Many good experiences using AutoEurope. You can use them for a short term rental or a lease/buy-back from Peugeot or Citroen for up to 183 days, with a 21 day minimum. The beauty of the lease is that you get a brand new car, full insurance (EU wide), and breakdown coverage. I've used them for at least a dozen rentals/leases but know own a car.


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## bhamham

bdelancy said:


> The 1000km/mo limit seems very low. Sounds like that would only be realistic if the purpose of the rental is for very local use only.


That limit would suit me fine. Some weeks I don't drive at all. Take the bus, train or ride my bike. Very realistic to me.


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## Peasant

bdelancy said:


> The 1000km/mo limit seems very low. Sounds like that would only be realistic if the purpose of the rental is for very local use only.


12000km/year isn't bad for normal use.
Don't forget, in the USA 100 years is old, while in Europe 100 miles is a long distance.


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## bdelancy

@Peasant You are probably right, but that is only 30km per day and I can easily use that up with a trip to the store, to the beach and maybe to someplace to hike. I would be interested in hearing if anyone has tried SuperU or an equivalent and gotten a more generous monthly allowance.


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## Bevdeforges

I know both my husband and I have car insurance policies that limit us to 8000 km per year. And I've currently got 2.5 full years' worth of extra km tucked away. (The "unused" km carry over from one year to the next.) Granted, we generally only use our cars locally - but consider, too, whether you actually use your car every day. I know we both drive much less since the pandemic, since we did get into "good habits" about combining trips for errands and such. But even well before the Plague, I always had considerable carry-over on my insurance limitations - even with occasional long-distance trips. (And consider that I make regular "Costco runs" - 20 km each way - but only once every 2 or 3 weeks.)

I note on the SuperU website they offer larger vehicles with 1500 km a month - at a slightly higher charge per day. That might better meet your needs. But I'd try tracking your actual km driven for a few weeks before you rule out the option.


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## bdelancy

Thanks as always, Bev. Sadly, my garage is fairly small, so I try to avoid larger cars, but maybe one of the 1500 km cars would squeeze in.


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## BarbTF

I've been browsing the Super U and LeClerc websites, thinking maybe this is a place to rent a car for my visit in April/May. Can anyone tell me whether what shows on my English Google translation of the LeClerc site as the "kilometers" box on the screen where you select the period of the rental etc. is for the ENTIRE rental period or a per-day distance? It just says "kilometers." https://www.location.leclerc/


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## BackinFrance

bdelancy said:


> Thanks as always, Bev. Sadly, my garage is fairly small, so I try to avoid larger cars, but maybe one of the 1500 km cars would squeeze in.


Most garages in France are just 3 mètres wide and around 5 mètres deep, but if you park your car close to the right hand) passenger) side of the garage you can à Mégane, Prius and many other moderate sized cars in and still get out on the driver's side.


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## Peasant

bdelancy said:


> @Peasant You are probably right, but that is only 30km per day and I can easily use that up with a trip to the store, to the beach and maybe to someplace to hike. I would be interested in hearing if anyone has tried SuperU or an equivalent and gotten a more generous monthly allowance.


In the US I was a 15K+ miles/year driver. As I now live in France and own a car I'm doing 8k km/year. Much less daily driving as I can use public transportation.


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## boilerman

Is there an option to "buy" more miles with any of these deals, like they do in the UK, when leasing a vehicle.

I must admit this is all alien to me as I've never rented a vehicle, I'd take a depreciation loss, when buying a car over rental cost anyday. Just my opinion


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## BackinFrance

boilerman said:


> Is there an option to "buy" more miles with any of these deals, like they do in the UK, when leasing a vehicle.
> 
> I must admit this is all alien to me as I've never rented a vehicle, I'd take a depreciation loss, when buying a car over rental cost anyday. Just my opinion


Cars don't depreciate very much in France, which is one of the reasons second hand cars seem expensive to many expatriates.


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## Clic Clac

BarbTF said:


> Can anyone tell me whether what shows on my English Google translation of the LeClerc site as the "kilometers" box on the screen where you select the period of the rental etc. is for the ENTIRE rental period or a per-day distance? It just says "kilometers."


I'd say it was the total of your hire period, so 1 day up to 30 days, which I think is the maximum, but you can immediately renew with another 30 days each time.

We rent a Twingo by the month for 120 euros + about 75 euros per 1000 kms.

* The Kms will be just a price guide for you. You pay the rental cost up front, then settle up for the kms at the end of the rental. I don't think there's a minimum or maximum kms figure.


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## bdelancy

@Clic Clac "We rent a Twingo by the month for 120 euros + about 75 euros per 1000 kms."

Wow - that is an incredibly low price. How does that work if 30 days is the maximum? 
Can you just renew online or do you have to go to the location once a month and redo the entire process? 
Is that the total monthly cost or are there other charges (insurance, etc) added on top of that?
Is there a limit on how many times you can renew or can it just run indefinitely, as long as you renew each month?
Anything else I should know about it?


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## Bevdeforges

BarbTF said:


> Is there an option to "buy" more miles with any of these deals, like they do in the UK, when leasing a vehicle.


If I'm reading the website info correctly, it's simply a matter of them checking the kilometers on the odometer when you take the car and then when you return it. If you wind up have exceeded the km for the time period (i.e. 3000 km for a 3 month rental, 6000 for a 6 month rental) then you settle up at 0,10€ per km over the limit.

I know with my 8000 km a year limit on my car insurance, they just send me a letter each year telling me the maximum reading I "should" have on my odometer on the policy anniversary date. If I have more than that, then I need to notify them (ASAP) with the strong implication that if I should have to make a claim they'll check the odometer reading at that time and if it's over then they won't pay it. (They initially asked for the odometer reading when I first insured the car.)


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## boilerman

Bevdeforges said:


> If I'm reading the website info correctly, it's simply a matter of them checking the kilometers on the odometer when you take the car and then when you return it. If you wind up have exceeded the km for the time period (i.e. 3000 km for a 3 month rental, 6000 for a 6 month rental) then you settle up at 0,10€ per km over the limit.
> 
> I know with my 8000 km a year limit on my car insurance, they just send me a letter each year telling me the maximum reading I "should" have on my odometer on the policy anniversary date. If I have more than that, then I need to notify them (ASAP) with the strong implication that if I should have to make a claim they'll check the odometer reading at that time and if it's over then they won't pay it. (They initially asked for the odometer reading when I first insured the car.)


Thats clever Bev, how did you do that quote, when it was me who asked the question🤣 Fair play to you and he answer is still the same😄


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## Bevdeforges

No idea what happened with the quote. I had been looking at the Leclerc rental site, but decided not to reply to Barb since I wasn't sure of how their contracts were set up. Either the software here tried reading my mind or maybe I forgot to clear something from the draft before I changed to responding to you.


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## Clic Clac

bdelancy said:


> Wow - that is an incredibly low price. How does that work if 30 days is the maximum?
> Can you just renew online or do you have to go to the location once a month and redo the entire process?
> Is that the total monthly cost or are there other charges (insurance, etc) added on top of that?
> Is there a limit on how many times you can renew or can it just run indefinitely, as long as you renew each month?
> Anything else I should know about it?


You have to go into the office every month. That's the total monthly cost, equivalent to buying your own with HP, insurance, servicing, tyres, MOT ...

Insurance is included, but at that price we have an excess of 1200€. They swipe your card for it but don't take the money.
Should you have a 'prang' you can pay the 1200 off in 3/4 payments, or you can pay a higher daily rate to reduce the excess.

No time limit. We've had one for over 2 years.
Just check that you can keep the same vehicle for the following month before you arrive, this will save you having to do a mega wash & hoover.


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## bdelancy

@Clic Clac Thank you so much for this info- incredibly helpful. 

Which markets have you used for this? Have you found them generally comparable, or is there one that you prefer?


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## Nunthewiser

Clic Clac said:


> Should you have a 'prang'


Well,I never knew this could be used as a noun. I have heard "I've been pronged!" as a verb. I really should be working on my French, not my English...

Anyway, for avoidance of doubt, are you talking about Leclerc with these costs?


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## Clic Clac

bdelancy said:


> Which markets have you used for this? Have you found them generally comparable, or is there one that you prefer?


Not sure what you mean by 'markets'.



Nunthewiser said:


> Anyway, for avoidance of doubt, are you talking about Leclerc with these costs?


Yes, Location Leclerc.


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## bdelancy

@Clic Clac - I was referring generally to stores like Leclerc, SuperU, Carrefour, etc.


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## bdelancy

Another question for the group - :

Because of the chip shortage, cars are generally scarcer now, which means that they may not always be available on short notice. I just spoke to Autoeurope about a 90-day lease, and they don't currently have any of the cars I would want. The earliest they would be available would be May 1.

How far in advance do you need to plan if you want to rent a car through Leclerc or someplace like that?


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## Clic Clac

bdelancy said:


> I was referring generally to stores like Leclerc, SuperU, Carrefour, etc.


Ah, ok.
Leclerc was the most convenient for us, and at a Fiver-A-Day I didn't bother looking anywhere else.



bdelancy said:


> How far in advance do you need to plan if you want to rent a car through Leclerc or someplace like that?


It will probably depend on the size of the branch and the time of year.


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## Marnée

bdelancy said:


> Another question for the group - :
> 
> Because of the chip shortage, cars are generally scarcer now, which means that they may not always be available on short notice. I just spoke to Autoeurope about a 90-day lease, and they don't currently have any of the cars I would want. The earliest they would be available would be May 1.
> 
> How far in advance do you need to plan if you want to rent a car through Leclerc or someplace like that?


My husband and I used to do the buy-back lease program through TTCar and always had excellent experiences. But when I looked into the option for our recent trip, there were no cars available as @bdelancy has found. 

So, we decided to bite the bullet and buy a car. 

We bought a new car from a dealership that we found on LeBonCoin - purchasing a floor model with all the bells and whistles (and safety features) for the price of the base model. Insurance is very reasonable compared to what we are paying in NY for our car there.


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