# Child Born in Pakistan



## Gregarious (Mar 12, 2012)

Dear Joppa,

You are really superb while giving & sharing your thoughts that makes things easy for us. Without you, this forum is futile, to be honest with you. 

About my query, I just want to clarify and confirm my point regarding Immigration Law. 

My wife is British by naturalization, First Daughter was born in Pakistan being registered and having a British Passport. And I know she will be till *first generation. *What does it mean?


My wife is pregnant second time, will the same process will go on for the second child as well if he/she born in Pakistan? Please explain this situation.

Thirdly, I was in student visa in 2009, before expiry of my student visa, I applied for the extension and got an admission in another university, my biometric was done as well, they were taking too much time, before finalizing the decision, I asked them to sent back my passport because of the death of family member. My application was cancelled by myself. 

Obviously I was overstayed for a while, is it make any difference for future visit or spouse visa?:eyebrows:


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Gregarious said:


> Dear Joppa,
> 
> You are really superb while giving & sharing your thoughts that makes things easy for us. Without you, this forum is futile, to be honest with you.
> 
> ...


Your wife is British citizen otherwise than by descent because of her naturalisation in UK. So she can transmit her nationality to any children she may have anywhere in the world, so that's why your daughter is British. But she is British by descent, and any children she may have in future outside UK won't be automatically British. She can, however, register her child as British if she spends at least three years in UK before having any children. The intetion is to allow only those with sufficiently strong links to UK to transmit citizenship to their offsprings.



> My wife is pregnant second time, will the same process will go on for the second child as well if he/she born in Pakistan? Please explain this situation.


Yes, as I have explained.



> Thirdly, I was in student visa in 2009, before expiry of my student visa, I applied for the extension and got an admission in another university, my biometric was done as well, they were taking too much time, before finalizing the decision, I asked them to sent back my passport because of the death of family member. My application was cancelled by myself.
> 
> Obviously I was overstayed for a while, is it make any difference for future visit or spouse visa?


Your stay is automatically extended while your visa extension is being considered. Provided you left UK soon after getting back your passport, no, it should be ok.


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## Gregarious (Mar 12, 2012)

> Joppa said:
> 
> 
> > Your wife is British citizen otherwise than by descent because of her naturalisation in UK. So she can transmit her nationality to any children she may have anywhere in the world, so that's why your daughter is British. But she is British by descent, and any children she may have in future outside UK won't be automatically British. She can, however, register her child as British if she spends at least three years in UK before having any children. The intetion is to allow only those with sufficiently strong links to UK to transmit citizenship to their offsprings.
> ...


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Gregarious said:


> Just want to clarify this point again, "my daughter will spent three years in UK before having any children. Am I right?


What I said was that since your daughter is British citizen by descent, she cannot automatically transmit her citizenship to children born abroad. But if she is to spend three years in UK prior to having any children, she will then be able to 'register' any children born abroad as British citizen. Registration is a much simpler procedure than naturalisation, and she will have the right to register her children. On being registered, they become British citizen by descent.
See UK Border Agency | Can I register a child aged under 18 as a British citizen? Section 3(2)

Now if the child (your grandchild) spends three years in UK with their parents prior to attaining 18, they can be registered under Section 3(5) of 1981 British Nationality Act and becomes British citizen otherwise than by descent, i.e transmissible citizenship.

This is the law as it stands, but it can be changed before these situations arise in 20-30 years from now.


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## Gregarious (Mar 12, 2012)

Thats great. Now I got it. Thank you very much. :clap2:


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## Gregarious (Mar 12, 2012)

Gregarious said:


> Thats great. Now I got it. Thank you very much. :clap2:


Need to ask you one more personal question.


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## Naza (Dec 27, 2012)

Hi, would like to know if the children born abroad would need a visa to enter the UK?, I understand that they would become British by descent and would be eligible for a British passport.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Naza said:


> Hi, would like to know if the children born abroad would need a visa to enter the UK?, I understand that they would become British by descent and would be eligible for a British passport.


The child's nationality depends on the parent's status. If mother is British otherwise than by descent, usually meaning born in UK, then the child is automatically British by descent. If the father is British otherwise than by descent, and if the child was born on or after 1st July 2006, the child is British by descent. If born before that date, he has to be married to the mother, and if the marriage takes place subsequent to the birth, the child becomes Brtish on their wedding day. If neither parent is British otherwise than by descent, then the child isn't British from birth. If either parent has lived in UK for three years prior to the birth, the child can be registered as British. And if the child, not British from birth, subsequently lives wth the parents for three years in UK prior to age 18, the child can be registered as British and becomes British otherwise than by descent, being able to hand on citizenship to any children born to them anywhere in the world. 
So if the child isn't automatically British, the child will need a visa to enter UK to live.


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## Naza (Dec 27, 2012)

Joppa said:


> The child's nationality depends on the parent's status. If mother is British otherwise than by descent, usually meaning born in UK, then the child is automatically British by descent. If the father is British otherwise than by descent, and if the child was born on or after 1st July 2006, the child is British by descent. If born before that date, he has to be married to the mother, and if the marriage takes place subsequent to the birth, the child becomes Brtish on their wedding day. If neither parent is British otherwise than by descent, then the child isn't British from birth. If either parent has lived in UK for three years prior to the birth, the child can be registered as British. And if the child, not British from birth, subsequently lives wth the parents for three years in UK prior to age 18, the child can be registered as British and becomes British otherwise than by descent, being able to hand on citizenship to any children born to them anywhere in the world.
> So if the child isn't automatically British, the child will need a visa to enter UK to live.


Hi, I may be a little confused, would a child only become automatically British if born to a mother that is British other than by descent / or the child would not become automatically British if the father was British other than by descent?!? I appreciate your previous response. 

Also the a visa to enter the UK would not be required for the child if the mother was British, but a visa would be required if the father was British?


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2012)

That depends on when the child was born and the parents marital status as Joppa has explained. What year was your child born and you married to the childs father?


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## Naza (Dec 27, 2012)

_shel said:


> That depends on when the child was born and the parents marital status as Joppa has explained. What year was your child born and you married to the childs father?


Hi, the details are:-

Mother - Pakistani national
Father - British citizen born in the UK 1980

Married March 2012 in Pakistan
Child birth - December 2012 in Pakistan 

So I understand that the child should be British by descent?!

BUT would the child need a VISA to come to the UK? (child should be eligible for a British passport) 

Kind regards


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2012)

No visa, just apply for a British passport for the child. Mother however will need a spouse visa.


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## Naza (Dec 27, 2012)

_shel said:


> No visa, just apply for a British passport for the child. Mother however will need a spouse visa.


Hi, thank you for your help, I also thought that was the case, but as I have searched on the UKBA website and filled the 'if you require a visa' section it said a visa was required if you hold a British overseas citizen passport!


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Naza said:


> Hi, thank you for your help, I also thought that was the case, but as I have searched on the UKBA website and filled the 'if you require a visa' section it said a visa was required if you hold a British overseas citizen passport!


British Overseas Citizenship is a very special kind of citizenship, and has nothing to do with British citizen living or born overseas. The child in case is British citizen by descent from his/her father, so has the right of abode in UK.


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## Naza (Dec 27, 2012)

Joppa said:


> British Overseas Citizenship is a very special kind of citizenship, and has nothing to do with British citizen living or born overseas. The child in case is British citizen by descent from his/her father, so has the right of abode in UK.


Hi, thank you very much for the information, you have been great. Hope you have a lovely new year.


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## Omeruk (Jan 28, 2014)

*Baby born abroad father British*

Hi I am
A British not from birth but I have received nationality 6 years ago. I got married last year in Pakistan . I have applied for her settlement visa for her,we been waiting almost 5 months we had no reply but our baby daughter had been born yesterday kindly anyone could help what I need to do for my daughter ? Does she gets British passport as I her father is British or do I have to get her visa also ..??
Many thanks look forward for your answer


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