# NHR - experiences in applying etc?



## ExpatNick

Could anyone who has had any good or bad experiences with applying for NHR please post their stories in response to this thread - I'd like to apply for myself and my wife asap and am after hints, suggestions, warnings, short-cuts, etc, etc.

Many thanks!!


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## johnwat

Hi, I went to the top 4 and each of them wanted to charge 3k -3k5 per person (7k couple etc) but actually I found it quite simple if you do it yourself and use the templates provided online, do a search on google for "buy / download NHR Portugal Application Forms" (theres a small charge but it works out a lot cheaper to do yourself:


hope thats useful


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## ExpatNick

Hello John,

Thanks for the info, very useful indeed. Out of curiosity, how ong did it take for your NHR to come through once you'd submitted the application documents?


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## andromi

Nick, sent you a PM.

The answer to the question - how long does an NHR application usually take? - would puzzle even the greatest scholars.


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## johnwat

still waiting, but friends waited 8 months recently got approved. I think as long as your not from Portugal you will be approved, they just like to drag their feet so people become established or treasure it more since more difficult ' appearing to obtain' or theres some other odd reason they like to delay it.Im told to postpone tax returns and pay the 200euro fines for late payment is sometimes better than filing without it.


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## johnwat

andromi, can you send me a PM too 

Hey, also i noticed looking at your messages you were from the uk, under the NHR, and into IT in Lisbon,

Can i ask, if you know, is income from outside Portugal tax free if it is that one is consulting in IT and invoicing as self employed companies in eu or elsewhere. or is that the 20% fee, in which case under what sort of case scenario does one enjoy tax 0 rate. (ie. usa company pays individual for consulting work etc.) Is there any thresholds for turnover before you have to start charging other EU entities vat, or other thresholds that once hit the 0 rate tax situation changes.


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## andromi

johnwat said:


> andromi, can you send me a PM too
> 
> Hey, also i noticed looking at your messages you were from the uk, under the NHR, and into IT in Lisbon,
> 
> Can i ask, if you know, is income from outside Portugal tax free if it is that one is consulting in IT and invoicing as self employed companies in eu or elsewhere. or is that the 20% fee, in which case under what sort of case scenario does one enjoy tax 0 rate. (ie. usa company pays individual for consulting work etc.) Is there any thresholds for turnover before you have to start charging other EU entities vat, or other thresholds that once hit the 0 rate tax situation changes.


You need some more posts before your private messaging is enabled.

The short version - its complicated.

Where are you tax resident?


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## johnwat

portugal, self employed programmer, i've applied for the nhr. still waiting for acceptance,


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## robc

johnwat said:


> still waiting, but friends waited 8 months recently got approved. I think as long as your not from Portugal you will be approved, they just like to drag their feet so people become established or treasure it more since more difficult ' appearing to obtain' or theres some other odd reason they like to delay it.Im told to postpone tax returns and pay the 200euro fines for late payment is sometimes better than filing without it.


8 months .............blimey what took so long.........We were approved in 6 weeks. 
If you are not from Portugal or you are currently in Portugal (but still qualify) do not bank on being approved, there are scores of people here on the Silver Coast who have learnt to their cost that the term "high net worth" is utterly subjective and once applied by Financas it appears irreversible. Once a decision has been made it appears, although I cannot verify this personally as we were accepted, that no appeal will be allowed. 
As you may be aware the original Decree Law 259 of September 2009 has been amended so as to comply with EU directives. The ensuing decree law has "harmonised" certain aspects of the legislation to equate with Malta and previously Beckhams Law in Spain.
It is currently up for debate as to whether this exemption continues or not but whether it does or not it is worth doing the application right first time.

HTH

Rob

p.s. I spoke today with 1 of the Big 4 you mention and I asked them what they charge now for an application and it is nowhere near the figure you quoted, by some margin so it may be worth asking again.


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## johnwat

Interesting what is the 'high net worth' aspect you are talking about, I take it you're referring to applying for the NHR based simply on having a high net worth? 

My understanding was that the application for the NHR program is independent on particular benefits one might receive and for specific reasons, that instead the program was granted on the bases that you resided in Portugal (rented or owned property, had lived in Portugal for 6 months or more) and had not ever lived in Portugal previously. Provided you met the criteria it was enough to apply for the program which should be granted if you do.

As regards time taken for acceptance I guess it depends largely upon where you are applying, but from many different sources I've heard it regularly takes more than 6 months, I think there is a common consensus on this online also.

as regards the costs of the big 4 I point out to the prices quoted on their site, also what they have told me directly what they will charge 1 month ago:

http://www.tax-effective-giving.org.uk/icon/BundledfeesNHREN.pdf
NHR application - typical cost? - British Expats

I personally went for the downloaded forms and applied myself directly (cost 100 euros). 


upon the reasons 
The high value industries aspect is specifically the aspect that 




robc said:


> 8 months .............blimey what took so long.........We were approved in 6 weeks.
> If you are not from Portugal or you are currently in Portugal (but still qualify) do not bank on being approved, there are scores of people here on the Silver Coast who have learnt to their cost that the term "high net worth" is utterly subjective and once applied by Financas it appears irreversible. Once a decision has been made it appears, although I cannot verify this personally as we were accepted, that no appeal will be allowed.
> As you may be aware the original Decree Law 259 of September 2009 has been amended so as to comply with EU directives. The ensuing decree law has "harmonised" certain aspects of the legislation to equate with Malta and previously Beckhams Law in Spain.
> It is currently up for debate as to whether this exemption continues or not but whether it does or not it is worth doing the application right first time.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Rob
> 
> p.s. I spoke today with 1 of the Big 4 you mention and I asked them what they charge now for an application and it is nowhere near the figure you quoted, by some margin so it may be worth asking again.


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## robc

johnwat said:


> Interesting what is the 'high net worth' aspect you are talking about, I take it you're referring to applying for the NHR based simply on having a high net worth?
> 
> Well no I am not
> http://info.portaldasfinancas.gov.p...-10BD-4C08-BE44-26CAB723884A/0/IRS_RNH_EN.pdf
> 
> Page 4 covers the High Added Value aspect of the scheme.
> 
> 
> 
> My understanding was that the application for the NHR program is independent on particular benefits one might receive and for specific reasons, that instead the program was granted on the bases that you resided in Portugal (rented or owned property, had lived in Portugal for 6 months or more)
> 
> Again No............The criteria are clearly laid out in the above document. Page 2 refers to not resident in the previous 5 years
> 
> 
> and had not ever lived in Portugal previously. Provided you met the criteria it was enough to apply for the program which should be granted if you do.
> 
> As regards time taken for acceptance I guess it depends largely upon where you are applying, but from many different sources I've heard it regularly takes more than 6 months, I think there is a common consensus on this online also.
> I think if you refer back to previous posts, perhaps a search on here of NHR you will find that the system is much quicker than that..............but to be fair, why should I worry we are in and have been from the outset
> 
> as regards the costs of the big 4 I point out to the prices quoted on their site, also what they have told me directly what they will charge 1 month ago:
> 
> http://www.tax-effective-giving.org.uk/icon/BundledfeesNHREN.pdf
> NHR application - typical cost? - British Expats
> 
> Fair enough, call me an old fool but I would not take the first price, and did not........
> 
> I personally went for the downloaded forms and applied myself directly (cost 100 euros).
> 
> 
> upon the reasons
> The high value industries aspect is specifically the aspect that


I hope that helps

Rob


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## johnwat

High Added Value confused with your early version high net worth


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## grammymissy

http://portugalresident.com/nhr-the-algarve-calling. Found this article that says currently, NHR processing is taking 7-8 months, because of so many applications . .


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## johnwat

I JUST got my NHR approval to the program !  it took about 9 weeks! cost £100
I used this service Non Habitual Tax Resident Status in Portugal


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## grammymissy

johnwat said:


> I JUST got my NHR approval to the program !  it took about 9 weeks! cost £100 I used this service Non Habitual Tax Resident Status in Portugal


 Wow, that was fast, even their website says 6-8 months, congrats!


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## grammymissy

Pleased to report NHR approval has been received, it did take 8 months, but is retro for our 2015 tax filing. It arrived with instructions to refile 2015 tax return noting NHR status, so very happy.


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## rubytwo

robc said:


> I hope that helps
> 
> Rob


Hi robc,

Would you be able to re post the link to information about the "High net worth" again. It doesnt seem to work and I would like to read more about this before lodging our application.

Thanks


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## rubytwo

johnwat said:


> I JUST got my NHR approval to the program !  it took about 9 weeks! cost £100
> I used this service Non Habitual Tax Resident Status in Portugal


Congrats on your successful application! We're about to start our application. Did you lodge the forms via the Financias site?


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## robc

rubytwo said:


> Hi robc,
> 
> Would you be able to re post the link to information about the "High net worth" again. It doesnt seem to work and I would like to read more about this before lodging our application.
> 
> Thanks


I am struggling as it seems that the financas portal has been rebuilt/edited.
I will hunt about and see what I can find.

Rob


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## advolex

*Rnh*



rubytwo said:


> Hi robc,
> 
> Would you be able to re post the link to information about the "High net worth" again. It doesnt seem to work and I would like to read more about this before lodging our application.
> 
> Thanks


I think it's this brochure you're after:
http://info.portaldasfinancas.gov.p...-3DA8-4B90-A1E4-FF53BD34EF95/0/IRS_RNH_EN.pdf

I see now, that the link (above) has become stale. Anyway, the link is collected from this info page:

http://info.portaldasfinancas.gov.pt/pt/docs/Conteudos_1pagina/NEWS_Portuguese_Tax_System.htm

-> Non-regular residents -> Personal Income Tax - Non-regular Tax Regime


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## rubytwo

advolex said:


> I think it's this brochure you're after:
> http://info.portaldasfinancas.gov.p...-3DA8-4B90-A1E4-FF53BD34EF95/0/IRS_RNH_EN.pdf
> 
> I see now, that the link (above) has become stale. Anyway, the link is collected from this info page:
> 
> Portal das Finanças - Notícias Portuguese Tax System
> 
> -> Non-regular residents -> Personal Income Tax - Non-regular Tax Regime


Thank you. I did manage to find that page but I can't find where or how to lodge the application via the Financias site..


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## advolex

rubytwo said:


> Thank you. I did manage to find that page but I can't find where or how to lodge the application via the Financias site..


You will have to login to find the entry point. To be able to login you need to first obtain your NIF number and then obtain your password to login.

Addition: A much better explanation can be found in this thread (similar): http://www.expatforum.com/expats/po...-nhr-fast-track-application.html#post13694250


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## david_c

robc said:


> I am struggling as it seems that the financas portal has been rebuilt/edited.
> I will hunt about and see what I can find.
> 
> Rob


Hi Rob,
If you're having trouble I suggest you find professional advice from a Lawyer. Also because although a lot of people are saying it takes 8/9 months when it is definitely not supposed to take that long. I have completed NHR procedures in less than a week. 
If you are available do message me so I could share with you the contact of a lawyer who's a good friend of mine. 
Best Regards,
David R. Custódio


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## rubytwo

johnwat said:


> High Added Value confused with your early version high net worth


Can anyone explain what either of these terms means and how they can influence the NHR application? The link provided earlier in the thread no longer works. It looks like Financias has been making some changes to their site


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## advolex

*Tax on active income*



rubytwo said:


> Can anyone explain what either of these terms means and how they can influence the NHR application? The link provided earlier in the thread no longer works. It looks like Financias has been making some changes to their site


There was a list of professions in the Portaria No. 12 / 2010, of Jan. 7. The listed professions were eligible for tax benefits on the professional's active income. The Portaria may be repealed or revised, I haven't checked lately. The professions were highly qualified and often but not always required a university degree. Politicians were not represented in the list even if it must be admitted that they may make a lot of money, nor were football players.

If you search the Internet for "Government Lists Professions Eligible For Nonhabitual Resident Tax Regime" you might find a 2010 article printed in Tax Notes International, Jan. 18, 2010, p. 239 (Vol. 57 Nr 3). The authors use the translation "qualifying high-added-value professions" to represent the following words from the Portaria: "actividades de elevado valor acrescentado".

Now you ask what that means. It's easy to say for most jobs, they don't qualify. There are some professions however where not everyone agrees on whether they qualify. And if you live on pensions, that income is not the issue here, as that is considered passive income.


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## advolex

*The Finance Minister's Order*

Portaria has also been translated with Ordinance and with Implementation Order. The authority for the Finance Minister to issue this Order (to the tax authority, AT) is given in art:s 72 and 81 of the Codigo IRS.


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## Beeton

I've been researching the Non Habitual scheme and there are definitely some benefits attached to it but can anyone identify any cons resulting from applying for the status, for example are there any financial penalties if you decide not to stay in Portugal for the full ten years?


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## robc

david_c said:


> Hi Rob,
> If you're having trouble I suggest you find professional advice from a Lawyer. Also because although a lot of people are saying it takes 8/9 months when it is definitely not supposed to take that long. I have completed NHR procedures in less than a week.
> If you are available do message me so I could share with you the contact of a lawyer who's a good friend of mine.
> Best Regards,
> David R. Custódio


hi david
Thank you for the email. I am having no trouble, we applied and were accepted way way back in 2009, on the original renewing NHR scheme.

Rob


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## advolex

*No cons here*



Beeton said:


> I've been researching the Non Habitual scheme and there are definitely some benefits attached to it but can anyone identify any cons resulting from applying for the status, for example are there any financial penalties if you decide not to stay in Portugal for the full ten years?


Maybe it's just lack of imagination, but I for one cannot envisage any "cons", apart from the unlikely event of becoming bashed as a tax refugee by one's more moralistic peers, in the wake of the Panama Papers and Paradise Papers. H t h.


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## advolex

*The PT Tax System in English*



rubytwo said:


> Hi robc,
> 
> Would you be able to re post the link to information about the "High net worth" again. It doesnt seem to work and I would like to read more about this before lodging our application.
> 
> Thanks


I still cannot access the PDF on the Financas Portal, but the dead link is still there. Last year, 2016, it could be downloaded without problem, see attachment. The summary is on p 5 (14). Beware though, that the PDF may contain outdated info!

Edit: I found a working link on Financas, so added that (below) and removed the others.


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## ViaVinho

If your average (not marginal) tax rate, or your average expected tax rate in Portugal, is more than 20 %, you will probably benefit from the NHR regime.
Be aware though, that in more rural tax jurisdictions officials may not be familiar with the regime. I have been assessed taxes for the past two years where my NHR satus as well as taxes paid abroad were simply ignored. This might eventually get sorted out, but it might take a very long time (my tax return has been "under analysis" by Financas in Lisboa for almost a year now!) and adds hassle and complications to your life as you are expected to pay the assessment and then request (reclamacao graciosa) a reassessment. In practice, this means that your average tax rate soars to about 50 % of your income which might make things financially difficult if you have no savings to ride it out. Whether you have problems with the NHR depends very much on the functionario handling it.
If your tax situation is relatively simple (for example, if you have one or two well-defined sources of income such as a single pension income), it is likely that things will proceed more smoothly. 
I am sure others have different views and different experiences with the NHR regime.


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## ViaVinho

Double post deleted.


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## dancebert

david_c said:


> If you're having trouble I suggest you find professional advice from a Lawyer. Also because although a lot of people are saying it takes 8/9 months when it is definitely not supposed to take that long. I have completed NHR procedures in less than a week.


Did you do it in less than a week on your own or with a lawyer?

In some countries governments do informal* wealth redistribution by processing quickly foreigners who pay a local lawyer/fixer/etc, while processing at a snails pace those who do it on their own.

*In the same vein, the UN calls bribes "Informal fees".


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## dancebert

johnwat said:


> ... as regards the costs of the big 4 I point out to the prices quoted on their site, also what they have told me directly what they will charge 1 month ago:
> 
> http://www.tax-effective-giving.org.uk/icon/BundledfeesNHREN.pdf


Hmm... Link is to an undated Deloitte document on a .org site not owned by Deloitte. The org domain is used mostly by non-profit organizations. Yet tax-effective-giving.org . uk is a for-profit business. Hmm... Oh well, any suspicions I had were put to rest by the 3 undated customer testimonials.


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## dancebert

david_c said:


> Hi Rob,
> If you're having trouble I suggest you find professional advice from a Lawyer. Also because although a lot of people are saying it takes 8/9 months when it is definitely not supposed to take that long. I have completed NHR procedures in less than a week.
> If you are available do message me so I could share with you the contact of a lawyer who's a good friend of mine.
> Best Regards,
> David R. Custódio


Are you @davidrcustodio on Instagram? If so, congratulations on the special occasion in this post. With the aid of Google Translate, it seems to me you earned a degree from the Faculty of Law at the University of Lisbon.


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## 1406905

Hi All.

I've applied for NHR but one thing I can not find an answer on is National Insurance. In PT this is very expensive. So if I get paid from a company say in the UK or US directly to me a) I'm assuming that it falls within NHR b) do I have to still pay National Insurance?

Any pointers on NHR and National Insurance gratefully received.

thanks.
Sean.


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