# Building Project!



## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Not for me obviously.....but for the wife! She loves doing all that stuff....so who am I to spoil her enjoyment?

Anyway....we collected two more animals yesterday....a gift from a friend.

First there's Terry....who is about 20.










Then there's Tammy....who is some sort of very rare Asian tortoise....her estimated age is around 80! She's a lot bigger (and less active) than Terry.










And the building project is to build them a run for their Summer house....in the Winter they'll go in the garage.










This is how it looks now.....but the wife has got concrete blocks, cement, and a wooden pallet. I have no idea what she's going to put together....but later on today it will look very different.

Updates to follow!


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> Not for me obviously.....but for the wife! She loves doing all that stuff....so who am I to spoil her enjoyment?
> 
> Anyway....we collected two more animals yesterday....a gift from a friend.
> 
> ...


Tery looks to me like a Testudo Graecca. He needs his diet altering as he appears to have been fed food too high in protein in the past thus giving him the humps on his shell I am sure that now he is in your care his diet will be more suitable for his species.


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Veronica said:


> Tery looks to me like a Testudo Graecca. He needs his diet altering as he appears to have been fed food too high in protein in the past thus giving him the humps on his shell I am sure that now he is in your care his diet will be more suitable for his species.


Hi Veronica! Bit of a long story with these two.....they were rescued from an unscrupulous pet shop in the UK a few years ago by a friend of ours.

He reckoned Terry hadn't had the right diet or enough sunlight for his shell to develop properly in his formative years.

He'd looked after them well for the past few years but with all the other animals he's got, and the time they take up, he let my youngest boy have them as he was quite taken with them.

I'll get a close up shot of the big one later.....apparently she's some rare Asian breed. Maybe you can clearly identify her.....very old apparently.


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> Hi Veronica! Bit of a long story with these two.....they were rescued from an unscrupulous pet shop in the UK a few years ago by a friend of ours.
> 
> He reckoned Terry hadn't had the right diet or enough sunlight for his shell to develop properly in his formative years.
> 
> ...


I am happy to advise you if I can. I used to breed testudo Graeccas. They need a very bland diet as they are adapted to feeding on spare dry vegetation. If they have food that is high in protein thier shells become deformed with humps. The problem is that the humps will also be inside and if they become too pronounced they squash the internal organs so he must not be allowed to become any more humpy.
A good picture of the other one might help to identify her. 
In all probability you may find that the two species need different diets to thrive properly. 

Veronica

Veronica


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

*tortoise trust*

take a look at this site xtreme

Tortoise Trust Web - Start Page

There is a lot of good information about the husbandry of different species of tortoises.
Most of my babies were given to the trust to put into captive breeding programmes
when I moved to Cyprus.
I just kept my male and my son has the female and the two eldest daughters. (I only bred girls )


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Veronica said:


> If they have food that is high in protein thier shells become deformed with humps.


Thanks Veronica....as I understand it, prior to our friends having him, Terry was fed with stuff like alfalfa which must have contributed to his condition.

I'll check out that site now, and get some photos of Tammy later so you can ID her!


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Here you go Veronica.....



















Quite a size difference between them....


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## littleredrooster (Aug 3, 2008)

Hope you got all your paperwork in order for such a major project.

Wouldnt be very nice if the bulldozers moved in and demolished the new extension on top of their poor little heads.


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

She could be a Manouria emys.
They are asian and looking at her shell she has large scutes (those are the seperate sections of the top carapace. This is typical of that species.
i may be wrong but that is my guess and if she is then she is special. 

Oh and my name is NOT Vanessa:tongue1:


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

just one more thing. If they have been kept together up to now and nothing sexual has happened between thats fine. But if they have not been together and you want to keep them together keep an eye onthem. If he shows signs of wanting to mate with her you must seperate them.
Breeding is a dangerous time for females and as eggs of mixed species are rarely viable it would be foolish to risk anything.

Veronica


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Veronica said:


> She could be a Manouria emys.
> They are asian and looking at her shell she has large scutes (those are the seperate sections of the top carapace. This is typical of that species.
> i may be wrong but that is my guess and if she is then she is special.
> 
> Oh and my name is NOT Vanessa:tongue1:


I did amend it Veronica! 

Asian Forest Tortoise I was told.....and when I googled it, I got Manouria emys!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Veronica said:


> just one more thing. If they have been kept together up to now and nothing sexual has happened between thats fine. But if they have not been together and you want to keep them together keep an eye onthem. If he shows signs of wanting to mate with her you must seperate them.
> Breeding is a dangerous time for females and as eggs of mixed species are rarely viable it would be foolish to risk anything.
> 
> Veronica



You spoilsport Veronica!!!!! 

Jo xxxx


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> I did amend it Veronica!
> 
> Asian Forest Tortoise I was told.....and when I googled it, I got Manouria emys!


There you go then I was right


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

jojo said:


> You spoilsport Veronica!!!!!
> 
> Jo xxxx


tut behave yourself jo


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

Veronica said:


> tut behave yourself jo


Anyway its very nosiy when they mate


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Veronica said:


> Anyway its very nosiy when they mate


OMG...... I dont wanna know............ ROFL  

Jo xx


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

I think they've been together for at least five years Veronica......so do you think it's OK for them to stay together?

Just looking at the Manouria emys site now and it says they're an endangered species....so they're that rare?

My mate reckoned she was about 70 or 80 years old.....would you think that's the case?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

XTreme said:


> My mate reckoned she was about 70 or 80 years old.....would you think that's the case?



A bit old for noisy sex then dont you think?????!!!!

Jo xx


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

jojo said:


> A bit old for noisy sex then dont you think?????!!!!
> 
> Jo xx


Bloody hell Jo.....you're obsessed with sex! 

Go and have a cold shower or something!

Or even better.....go and look at Steve Hall's photo album....you'll soon go off the boil!


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> I think they've been together for at least five years Veronica......so do you think it's OK for them to stay together?
> 
> Just looking at the Manouria emys site now and it says they're an endangered species....so they're that rare?
> 
> My mate reckoned she was about 70 or 80 years old.....would you think that's the case?


1. as long as he dosnt show signs ofwanting to mate with her then its ok to leave them together, but if he starts trailing her around and butting her with his shell take him out.

2. They are highly endangered but so are the testudo graeca which I think your little male might be. Testudo graeca are on cites A regsiter and I would think that Manouria are as well.
This is why when I bred from my pair I made sure I got all girls. It only takes one male dosnt it?

3. As for her age I really cant say how old she is but I would think a vet could probably take a good stab at it. I assume that you friend was given some sort of history which led him to believe she is that old. Dont forget that the odlest know tortoise was about 200 years and actually no one was sure how old he was when first found so he could have been older. Given the right environment they can live a very long time.

Veronica


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Thanks for the great info Veronica.....it's great to talk with an intelligent, knowlegeable lady like yourself!

I'm normally lumbered with, and abused by, the usual suspects here. Who's only specialist subject is shopping. 

I don't know if you like donkeys (who doesn't).....but this shot was taken a few minutes ago.

She's not ours.....she's one of a pair belonging to a Spaniard living here.....and it's normally us that looks out for them.


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> Thanks for the great info Veronica.....it's great to talk with an intelligent, knowlegeable lady like yourself!
> 
> I'm normally lumbered with, and abused by, the usual suspects here. Who's only specialist subject is shopping.
> 
> ...


She lovely, Mind you I went off donkeys a bit when I tried to feed one with carobs and the darn thing ran at me with its teeth gnashing. Thank god it was tied to a post and couldnt get to me:clap2:
I wont try feeding that one again but we do go to the donkey sanctuary at Vouni to see the dontekys there and feed them. They let you take them for walks on a lead


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

XTreme said:


> Thanks for the great info Veronica.....it's great to talk with an intelligent, knowlegeable lady like yourself!
> 
> I'm normally lumbered with, and abused by, the usual suspects here. Who's only specialist subject is shopping.



You've hurt my feelings!!! and I was gonna say what a lovely photo!!! 

Jo xxx


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

We have a crazy one Veronica....


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

jojo said:


> and I was gonna say what a lovely photo!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


I know I'm looking good today Jo! 

An over 50 Brit male with hair, teeth, no tattoos, and no beergut! 

I've mailed you the original image for your desktop screen like you wanted!


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Well she didn't get very far!










That chica's going to have to have a written warning!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

XTreme said:


> I know I'm looking good today Jo!
> 
> An over 50 Brit male with hair, teeth, no tattoos, and no beergut!
> 
> I've mailed you the original image for your desktop screen like you wanted!



I'm thrilled Xtreme!!!

Jo xxx


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

XTreme said:


> An over 50 Brit


Calling yourself a Brit, XT??!!! That's blasphemy, surely!!!

Tally.xx


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Latest update!



















The wife's got to build a gate next, then apply some woodstain, and then a bit of plastering!


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

SSShhhhhh , don't tell the wife or she might be upset, but torties can't fly. They dont need a lid


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Veronica said:


> SSShhhhhh , don't tell the wife or she might be upset, but torties can't fly. They dont need a lid


Just got to keep any unwanted cats etc out Veronica!

Tell you what though....these tortoises can't half climb....they were halfway up the wire fence trying to get out!


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## Suenneil (Feb 17, 2009)

XTreme said:


> Thanks for the great info Veronica.....it's great to talk with an intelligent, knowlegeable lady like yourself!
> 
> I'm normally lumbered with, and abused by, the usual suspects here. Who's only specialist subject is shopping.
> 
> ...


Im upset by this full frontal attack on your backing group Xtreme! why it was only last week you wanted us all to perform together! now you are slating us for being unintelligent and lacking in knowledge .... my god how the worm has turned !!! :hurt:


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Suenneil said:


> you wanted us all to perform together!


Perform together?


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> Just got to keep any unwanted cats etc out Veronica!
> 
> Tell you what though....these tortoises can't half climb....they were halfway up the wire fence trying to get out!


Tortoises can climb 6 ft wire fences then they will just drop over the other side.
Pen should be unclimbable or they will get out. the wall your wife has built is great they wont be ble to climb that but they must not have a wire fence or a wooden fence with horrizontal boards. They will climb that.


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## Suenneil (Feb 17, 2009)

XTreme said:


> Perform together?


Yes ... on stage! and yes, I loaded that post with so much inuendo even you would be proud !!! lol .... I cant remember the stage name we chose now! but you most definitely wanted me, jojo and tally to perform with you! ... but now we will have to cancel that possibility given your lack of respect for we ladies who like to shop !!!

:cheer2::cheer2::cheer2:


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Suenneil said:


> Yes ... on stage! and yes, I loaded that post with so much inuendo even you would be proud !!! lol .... I cant remember the stage name we chose now! but you most definitely wanted me, jojo and tally to perform with you! ... but now we will have to cancel that possibility given your lack of respect for we ladies who like to shop !!!
> 
> :cheer2::cheer2::cheer2:


Were we gonna perform for him or with him?? do I want to know the answer to that????? lol

Jo xx


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## Suenneil (Feb 17, 2009)

jojo said:


> Were we gonna perform for him or with him?? do I want to know the answer to that????? lol
> 
> Jo xx


I cant find the original bloomin post now! but it ended up with Xtreme actually being complimentary for a change and wanting to form a group with us as his backing singers! ... so performing WITH him BUT NOT in the Biblical sense !


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

I'm up for performing with you ladies any time!


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Veronica said:


> Tortoises can climb 6 ft wire fences then they will just drop over the other side.
> Pen should be unclimbable or they will get out. the wall your wife has built is great they wont be ble to climb that but they must not have a wire fence or a wooden fence with horrizontal boards. They will climb that.


Thanks for the advice Veronica.....now there's nothing within reach they can climb! Unless they can jump as well!


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> Thanks for the advice Veronica.....now there's nothing within reach they can climb! Unless they can jump as well!



Not unless you put springs on their feet


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

They've now got a front door!


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## Suenneil (Feb 17, 2009)

youre spoiling them now! you´´ll be giving them a post box and a doorbell next !


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> They've now got a front door!


There cant be many tortiees with a sphinx as a door guard


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

She's got to plaster the blocks and then woodstain the top and it's done!


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

This is Herbie, proud dad of 17 little girls in his pen.


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

He is much smaller than he should be as he got pneumonia when he was very young and we nearly lost him. I nursed him back to health but he hasnt grown since.
His wife who is back in the Uk dwarfs him.


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

You've seperated him from his wife Veronica?

He's not chasing young Euro tortoises now is he?


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> You've seperated him from his wife Veronica?
> 
> He's not chasing young Euro tortoises now is he?


I had to seperate them. He has a one track mind and it isnt good for his heart


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Latest update!

Bathtime for Terry and Tammy!

First of all....in goes Terry....










Bit of a scrub....










And out he comes looking very slick!










YoYo the duck supervises....










Then in goes Tammy.....who's a lot bigger!










Time for a makeover....










And out she comes looking like a Hollywood tortoise!










Everything look allright to you Veronica?


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

XTreme said:


> Latest update!
> 
> Bathtime for Terry and Tammy!
> 
> ...


They are gorgeous. I am sure that Terry is a Testudo Graeca andif you look at the pics of Herbie you will see how smooth Terrys shell should be. Incorrect feeding causes the humpy shell so I think in his early years he was give food too high in protein. It shouldnt get any worse t hough if he is given the correct diet from now on.
By the way I take it you are sure he is a he?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Ok then Veronica!! I have a problem. My daughter owns a tortoise - a mediteranean tortoise, he?shes's three years old! We couldnt bring it with us, cos the vet couldnt micro chip it and it didnt have any paperwork - an illegal I suspect. Anyway, he's never been able to open his eyes, the vet didnt know why as the muscles were all present and correct, she gave us drops which didnt help.... anyway, as we're in the UK, my daughter went to visit him at her friends and he still hasnt opened his eyes. My daughter wants him in Spain, but without paperwork or a micro chip how do we do that?? Is it worth the cost??


Sorry I'm rambling, but daughter is standing over me telling me what to write!!!!

Jo xxx


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Veronica said:


> By the way I take it you are sure he is a he?


Previous owner had him for ten years (he got him with the shell in that condition) and he says he's definitely a boy Veronica!


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

jojo said:


> My daughter wants him in Spain, but without paperwork or a micro chip how do we do that?? Is it worth the cost??


I have a mate (Terry and Tammy's previous owner) and he's visiting the south coast in a van in the next few weeks Jo.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

XTreme said:


> I have a mate (Terry and Tammy's previous owner) and he's visiting the south coast in a van in the next few weeks Jo.


Tell me what and how!! He's only about 3 inches diameter!

Jo xxx


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

jojo said:


> Ok then Veronica!! I have a problem. My daughter owns a tortoise - a mediteranean tortoise, he?shes's three years old! We couldnt bring it with us, cos the vet couldnt micro chip it and it didnt have any paperwork - an illegal I suspect. Anyway, he's never been able to open his eyes, the vet didnt know why as the muscles were all present and correct, she gave us drops which didnt help.... anyway, as we're in the UK, my daughter went to visit him at her friends and he still hasnt opened his eyes. My daughter wants him in Spain, but without paperwork or a micro chip how do we do that?? Is it worth the cost??
> 
> 
> Sorry I'm rambling, but daughter is standing over me telling me what to write!!!!
> ...


Jo have you taken him to a specialist exotic vet? Or maybe you could ring one for advice.
We used Matt Brash who is the one who looks after the animals at Flamingoland (The one who is in telly in Zoo vet)
Maybe you could ring him for advice on the torties eyes.
As for paperwork, you can get him legalised by writing to DEFRA who will send you forms to fill in. You will have to say how you came to own him and even if he has no papers DEFRA might give you papers for him which make it legal for you to own him but if he is used for breeding his offspring are not allowed to be sold.
As for microchipping they have to be certain size before it can be done.
As for whether it is all worth the cost that depends on how you feel about him I suppose.

Veronica


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Veronica said:


> Jo have you taken him to a specialist exotic vet? Or maybe you could ring one for advice.
> We used Matt Brash who is the one who looks after the animals at Flamingoland (The one who is in telly in Zoo vet)
> Maybe you could ring him for advice on the torties eyes.
> As for paperwork, you can get him legalised by writing to DEFRA who will send you forms to fill in. You will have to say how you came to own him and even if he has no papers DEFRA might give you papers for him which make it legal for you to own him but if he is used for breeding his offspring are not allowed to be sold.
> ...


Well I want his eyes sorted cos he cant be happy like that, altho what he doesnt know....??? It was a vet who specialises in reptiles and she couldnt work out what was going on, we could have taken it further, but he was the size of half a golf ball when we were doing all this and somehow it didnt seem worth it??? We thought he'd grow out of it and his eyes would just open one day??

The paperwork stuff is gonna be too costly and I think if memory serves we came up with this when we first moved to Spain and in the end we gave him to a friend, £100s were being talked about AAAAGGGHH!!!!. Of course now Rubys seen him again, she wants him to come back to Spain with us!!??

jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

Well thank you XT for the latest photos - they look happy, healthy and settled in their new homes. And how adorable did they look, in a bucket being scrubbed by a toothbrush?!?! Aw sweet - reminded me of my old nan's tortoise back in Croydon - Fred his name was. Lovely little fellow. Very sad that day when he escaped via a hole in the hedge. I think they're underestimated as pets - they're full of character. I don't know why, but a tortoise just makes you smile, doesn't it?!?

Tally.xx


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