# Can i get my daughter into a local school without an NIE or Residencia certificate



## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

Hi everyone. We have been here for a month now in Fuengirola and it is a total nightmare getting a Residencia certificate. Put simply as we don't speak Spanish no one will talk to us at the police station and when we go in on the days that an English speaking person is meant to be there they are either on holiday or the police station is closing early or totally closed! The Scottish guy only deals with NIE's and so he will give us no info at all.

Anyways I've read that lots of kids are in schools without their patents having registered. 

Our daughter has missed a month of school now and we don't look close to getting a Residencia, we just want her in a school (she's 6 in December) - we can't find any info anywhere that doesn't contradict other info.

Heeeelp!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

spanishbookseller said:


> Hi everyone. We have been here for a month now in Fuengirola and it is a total nightmare getting a Residencia certificate. Put simply as we don't speak Spanish no one will talk to us at the police station and when we go in on the days that an English speaking person is meant to be there they are either on holiday or the police station is closing early or totally closed! The Scottish guy only deals with NIE's and so he will give us no info at all.
> 
> Anyways I've read that lots of kids are in schools without their patents having registered.
> 
> ...


 You will need an NIE for yourselves and preferably your daughter as well as the residencia, which makes your NIE permanent. You can get an NIE on its own, but thats not permanent and only valid for 3 months without the residencia. You will need to show them proof of income and that you have healthcare arrangements. You'll also need to do this so that you can register with a GP, so that you can make large purchases such as a car, utilities etc.

the best thing you can do is to invest in a translator who can go with you and make sure that you get registered asap


Jo xxx


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## Kenwhite77 (Aug 30, 2012)

spanishbookseller said:


> Hi everyone. We have been here for a month now in Fuengirola and it is a total nightmare getting a Residencia certificate. Put simply as we don't speak Spanish no one will talk to us at the police station and when we go in on the days that an English speaking person is meant to be there they are either on holiday or the police station is closing early or totally closed! The Scottish guy only deals with NIE's and so he will give us no info at all.
> 
> Anyways I've read that lots of kids are in schools without their patents having registered.
> 
> ...


I can put you in contact with someone who lives in Fuengirola and is English and speaks fluent Spanish and am confident they can help you.

Message me and will send you contact details.

Ken


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## lynn (Sep 25, 2008)

spanishbookseller said:


> Hi everyone. We have been here for a month now in Fuengirola and it is a total nightmare getting a Residencia certificate. Put simply as we don't speak Spanish no one will talk to us at the police station and when we go in on the days that an English speaking person is meant to be there they are either on holiday or the police station is closing early or totally closed! The Scottish guy only deals with NIE's and so he will give us no info at all.
> 
> Anyways I've read that lots of kids are in schools without their patents having registered.
> 
> ...


Firstly, I wouldn't try to sort your residency out this week. It's Fuengirola feria, so everything is closed! (Actually, it's a national holiday tomorrow too)

The foreigner's office in the town hall will be able to offer advice and assistance to help you with this. You can find them here:
Ayuntamiento de Fuengirola; Concejalía de Extranjeros Residentes; Plaza de España, 1 – 4ª planta; 29.640 Fuengirola (Málaga) – España. Telephone: 952 58 94 40. Open Mon-Fri 09.00-13.00 

Good luck x


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

You will also need to have health care provision (either through state health care or private) as your children will need to have a pre-school check.


When we first arrived this check was scheduled for after they started but the mere fact that we had an appointment booked was sufficient for our children to be allowed to attend.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

lynn said:


> Firstly, I wouldn't try to sort your residency out this week. It's Fuengirola feria, so everything is closed! (Actually, it's a national holiday tomorrow too)
> 
> The foreigner's office in the town hall will be able to offer advice and assistance to help you with this. You can find them here:
> Ayuntamiento de Fuengirola; Concejalía de Extranjeros Residentes; Plaza de España, 1 – 4ª planta; 29.640 Fuengirola (Málaga) – España. Telephone: 952 58 94 40. Open Mon-Fri 09.00-13.00
> ...


I'm so glad you posted this. You know the area well and I knew you'd know what to do and where, in fact I was going to contact you and ask you where the foreigners office was etc.

Jo xxx


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## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

So many questions. When applying for the residencia do I need to do a separate e18 for my daughter or not. She's obviously not working age so doesn't need an NEI but will need to be recognised as living here.

I have been to the local police station 5 times now and I'm not getting anywhere. For example can we get our daughter in school whilst this is all going on? After all it is law that she is in school.

Also about private healthcare. I read an official release saying that after September 1st any EU national with residency qualifies for free spanish healthcare. But to get a residencia you need to get private health care cover. Surely you just cancel this after you get registered and get your SIP - which makes me wonder what's the point in having to prove healthcare provisions if once you are a resident you are entitled to it anyway?

I'll go to the Town Hall today anyway.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My daughter needed an NIE to get into school, which was a nuisance, however, my son, who went to an international school didnt, altho both schools needed to see our (the parents) NIE/residencia. As for healthcare, you need to either get private healthcare or contact Newcastle and fill out an S1 form, which will take into account your UK contributions and the reciprocal agreement between the two countries. If you dont do that, then the only way to get Spanish healthcare is to pay into the spanish system, by way of an employment contract, or paying autonomo/self employment

The rules are that to be able to go to a state school, you must be residents

Jo xxx


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## lynn (Sep 25, 2008)

spanishbookseller said:


> So many questions. When applying for the residencia do I need to do a separate e18 for my daughter or not. She's obviously not working age so doesn't need an NEI but will need to be recognised as living here.
> 
> I have been to the local police station 5 times now and I'm not getting anywhere. For example can we get our daughter in school whilst this is all going on? After all it is law that she is in school.
> 
> ...



As I posted previously, don't go to the ayuntamiento this week, it's Fuengirola feria and it will most likely be closed!

Everyone in the family needs to register as residents and you'll need this to sign on the padron.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

lynn said:


> As I posted previously, don't go to the ayuntamiento this week, it's Fuengirola feria and it will most likely be closed!
> 
> Everyone in the family needs to register as residents and you'll need this to sign on the padron.


Aaaaww, I loved that feria . Missing it all 

Its not automatic that just because you have moved to Spain that you get free healthcare, it has to be done via the reciprocal agreement and you have to do that via Newcastle, who will send you the S1 form to fill in. ~Then you will have proof and be able to use Spanish health care

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

spanishbookseller said:


> So many questions. When applying for the residencia do I need to do a separate e18 for my daughter or not. She's obviously not working age so doesn't need an NEI but will need to be recognised as living here.
> 
> I have been to the local police station 5 times now and I'm not getting anywhere. For example can we get our daughter in school whilst this is all going on? After all it is law that she is in school.
> 
> ...


yes you need an EX18 per person & your daughter does need a NIE number as well - it's an ID number, not just for fiscal purposes. The NIE will be issued at the same time as the resident cert.

Yes there was an official release about free healthcare - but as yet I don't know of anyone who has tried to get this - & in any case you wouldn't qualify because you would have to have been legally registered as resident here before April this year when the new rules came into force

as mentioned already - neither the local police nor the Ayuntamiento have anything to do with this - you need to go to the extranjería (foreigners office) which is sometimes in the same building as the National Police

you _might _be able to get your daughter into school with just a non-resident NIE - I know of a family here who have done this in the past few weeks - but it shouldn't have happened so I'm sure that was a slip-up on someone's part

you will need to register as resident anyway though - so best get the info together for proof of income & healthcare

could you not get S1 forms from the UK for healthcare - if you have enough recent NI payments there that will solve your healthcare issue

as for your daughter legally needing to be in school - yes, that's true - but until you are legally _resident _they don't have to take her


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## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

Hi Jo. Yes this is what I understood, but in July the Spanish Health minister stated that as of the 1st of September what I said would be the case. There is a translation on the embassy website. I feel that they have tightened up the resident requirements in response to this. But I have no idea really.

Also. Do children qualify for free healthcare in Spain or not?

Thanks

Rich


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

spanishbookseller said:


> Hi Jo. Yes this is what I understood, but in July the Spanish Health minister stated that as of the 1st of September what I said would be the case. There is a translation on the embassy website. I feel that they have tightened up the resident requirements in response to this. But I have no idea really.
> 
> Also. Do children qualify for free healthcare in Spain or not?
> 
> ...


do you mean me? I'm not Jo 

the tightening up happened in April - before this announcement, but I'm sure there's a link, of course

yes that _is supposed to be the case_ as far as free healthcare is concerned - but like I said, although I know a lot of people who should qualify I don't know anyone (yet) who has got it

you _wouldn't _qualify though - the stated conditions are for those already resident before the changes

& yes, children _are _supposed to get free healthcare regardless - but again - I personally don't know anyone who has managed to get this - I have 2 children & would be tempted to give up work if they got free healthcare - but I keep on working & paying my 270€ a month autónomo to make sure they get healthcare as do many of my friends

I just realised you mentioned SIPs too - they are specifically Valencia - you get a _tarjeta sanitaria _everywhere else

xabiachica


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

spanishbookseller said:


> Hi Jo. Yes this is what I understood, but in July the Spanish Health minister stated that as of the 1st of September what I said would be the case. There is a translation on the embassy website. I feel that they have tightened up the resident requirements in response to this. But I have no idea really.
> 
> Also. Do children qualify for free healthcare in Spain or not?
> 
> ...


 Only if they are residents. My son (14 at the time) tore his leg ligament and the only way they would do anything was because my husband worked and paid NI in the UK and we had filled in the S1. When I went to the hospital they refused to do anything initially because I hadnt brought the necessary paperwork/ss number. Even after that, I had to pay for his medication and crutches. Its a harsh country!

It really should be sorted before you arrive, but I'm sure you can do it now. The rules in Spain change all the time and dont forget Spain is in crisis, so they're not keen on giving un registered hand outs - you need to do the paperwork - free healthcare in Spain, yes, but only if you produce the correct documentation. So you need to make sure that you are covered for any eventuality - thats one thing I learnt from my time there. Its not like the UK. YOU have to do the running and YOU have to make sure that everything is water tight. 

Also, if you're residents in Spain, you need to pay your taxes there, so once you're settled. You need to sort that out. That will make a difference to your entitlements

Jo xxx


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

> I read an official release saying that after September 1st any EU national with residency qualifies for free spanish healthcare.


 To get residency, you need to prove that you have been paying into the UK system, so they can see that you have made contributions to the UK - to do that, you need to have filled out the S1 form. Spain is in crisis, it needs to be able to see a paper trail for those who are arriving and want to use their system

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> To get residency, you need to prove that you have been paying into the UK system, so they can see that you have made contributions to the UK - to do that, you need to have filled out the S1 form. Spain is in crisis, it needs to be able to see a paper trail for those who are arriving and want to use their system
> 
> Jo xxx


exactly - that applies to those who were resident *before *the rule changes 

you can't just jump off a plane & expect Spain to throw free healthcare at you

or education come to that - you have to prove you can support yourself & your family before you can become resident - & you can't get into the system until you are resident


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## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

Ok... I have a question. If we go back to the uk within a 3 month period though out the year, which we will do, then the rules say that we are only required to get an NEI for the 3 month stay. But then how do we get our daughter into school without being a permanent resident? After all even if we are here for 3 months we'd still want our daughter in school for that time...


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

spanishbookseller said:


> Ok... I have a question. If we go back to the uk within a 3 month period though out the year, which we will do, then the rules say that we are only required to get an NEI for the 3 month stay. But then how do we get our daughter into school without being a permanent resident? After all even if we are here for 3 months we'd still want our daughter in school for that time...


in fact you don't need a NIE to be here for less than 90 days - essentially you are just here on a long holiday


but there's no way you'll get your child into state school under those circumstances - you'll have to pay for private school


I have to admit to being confused - you asked these questions here before you came to Spain & we gave you the same info then :confused2:


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

So how are you planning to take your daughter out of school every three months??? You sound to be in a bit of a dilemma. The only way I think you could sort this is to register yourself as self employed/autonomo, pay the monthly fee of 270€ a month + spanish income tax. That way, you will be covered for health. You can also then justifiably show proof of income, healthcare and you can stay in Spain.

Cos even if you you leave every three months, your healthcare in Spain would only be on an emergency basis using the EHIC - that doesnt cover everyday health issues!

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> So how are you planning to take your daughter out of school every three months??? You sound to be in a bit of a dilemma. The only way I think you could sort this is to register yourself as self employed/autonomo, pay the monthly fee of 270€ a month + spanish income tax. That way, you will be covered for health. You can also then justifiably show proof of income, healthcare and you can stay in Spain.
> 
> Cos even if you you leave every three months, your healthcare in Spain would only be on an emergency basis using the EHIC - that doesnt cover everyday health issues!
> 
> Jo xxx


exactly............

although what about the S1 - surely if he has this business he mentioned way back before they moved here the has been paying NI in the UK? So they should be able to get S1s - even more so if he was planning to keep the business there & continue to pay tax & NI there


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> exactly............
> 
> although what about the S1 - surely if he has this business he mentioned way back before they moved here the has been paying NI in the UK? So they should be able to get S1s - even more so if he was planning to keep the business there & continue to pay tax & NI there


 True, but at least if he is autonomo, thats the healthcare declaration sorted. The business in the UK will still be liable for taxes there I would have thought????? Unless he registers it in Spain????? I dont know for sure, I'm not "up" on the rules etc. I do know that in the end, you cant evade taxes etc somewhere

Jo xxx


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## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

Healthcare is fine. We have Bupa/Sanitas cover. The situation in a nutshell is, I work in the UK for a charity and have 12 months leave but I am still employed by them. I also have an online business that will be supporting us financially over the coming year.

My partner will be here with our children and I will be going back to the uk often to attend to business matters. 

We don't want anything from the Spanish government but we would like our daughter to experience Spanish schooling whilst we are here.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> True, but at least if he is autonomo, thats the healthcare declaration sorted. The business in the UK will still be liable for taxes there I would have thought????? Unless he registers it in Spain????? I dont know for sure, I'm not "up" on the rules etc. I do know that in the end, you cant evade taxes etc somewhere
> 
> Jo xxx


well yes - you have to pay somewhere


if he's living here he has to make a declaration here - anything already paid in the UK is counted against anything owed here

but looking at his early posts he was only thinking of moving here for a year or two - and was planning on running the business from the UK & going back & forth - so in that case he might just as well not be resident here (as long as he is out of Spain enough) & just carry on with tax & NI there - so almost certainly entitling his wife & children to S1s

the children & their mother *have to register as residents *though - or no education or healthcare in Spain


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> well yes - you have to pay somewhere
> 
> 
> if he's living here he has to make a declaration here - anything already paid in the UK is counted against anything owed here
> ...


 Thats what we did. Husband was only ever a visitor in Spain

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

spanishbookseller said:


> Healthcare is fine. We have Bupa/Sanitas cover. The situation in a nutshell is, I work in the UK for a charity and have 12 months leave but I am still employed by them. I also have an online business that will be supporting us financially over the coming year.
> 
> My partner will be here with our children and I will be going back to the uk often to attend to business matters.
> 
> We don't want anything from the Spanish government but we would like our daughter to experience Spanish schooling whilst we are here.


more confused then - why didn't you mention this before?

you can prove healthcare - & presumably can prove sufficient income - if you can't then you're scuppered

if you can though, just get all your paperwork in order - download an EX18 per person & take them, photocopies of everything & the originals - find out if you need to make an appointment at the extranjería (some work on walk-in & some on an appointment system) & you'll be sorted


I still don't understand why you don't have S1s :confused2:


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## Calas felices (Nov 29, 2007)

There appears to be another confusion as although others mention husband/wife the OP only mentions partner. That sounds like dependency is required.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

To be honest, the story seems to have changed - there is now private healthcare, there is proof of income so therefore there isnt a problem is there. Just take that proof to the foreigners office at the address given by poster "Lynn" in a previous thread. Its probably not open during the feria, but will be when thats over. Once you have yours and your daughters NIE/residencia, the ayuntamiento will tell you which school your daughter can attend and you can enroll her and you can register with a doctor. However, if you yoursefl are planning to stay in spain for more than six months, you'll have to pay your taxes in spain

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Calas felices said:


> There appears to be another confusion as although others mention husband/wife the OP only mentions partner. That sounds like dependency is required.


well spotted

as long as they are his children they'd get the S1s if he has paid/is paying enough NI - if the partner isn't his wife I guess she might not - so other provision would need to be made

still - after however many posts wanting to know about free state healthcare NOW he tells us they have private cover........... so its a moot point


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## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

I'll let you know how I get on.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

spanishbookseller said:


> I'll let you know how I get on.


 yes please, we'll be interested to know. Spain is a harsh country and its in severe crisis, so it isnt an easy option to simply live there as it may have been a few years ago. Good luck with it all

Jo


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## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

We've just purchased private healthcare, seemed the easiest solution to sort that problem out. We didn't want to go down the S1 route in case my partner or the kids need to engage with the NHS in the UK at any point - major operations are not covered with private healthcare.

I forget that I am not married sometimes and call my partner my wife as saying partner all the time feels weird!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

spanishbookseller said:


> We've just purchased private healthcare, seemed the easiest solution to sort that problem out. We didn't want to go down the S1 route in case my partner or the kids need to engage with the NHS in the UK at any point - major operations are not covered with private healthcare.
> 
> I forget that I am not married sometimes and call my partner my wife as saying partner all the time feels weird!


OK - another hitch
anyone resident in Spain can't legally use the NHS in the UK except for emergency holiday cover - whether they have 'gone down the S1 route' or not

the S1s would cover them for full healthcare including major ops in Spain - & they could get the Spanish version of the EHIC to use for trips to the UK


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## spanishbookseller (May 25, 2012)

Proof of income is an issue as the income and bank statements are all in my name and what do I do just print bank statements out, my experience to date tells me that I will need more than actual proof or it will need to be on official paper etc etc...

Seems very Over the top as European law has already given us the right to live and work in a member state and our only legal obligation is to register in that country... Jeez!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

spanishbookseller said:


> Proof of income is an issue as the income and bank statements are all in my name and what do I do just print bank statements out, my experience to date tells me that I will need more than actual proof or it will need to be on official paper etc etc...
> 
> Seems very Over the top as European law has already given us the right to live and work in a member state and our only legal obligation is to register in that country... Jeez!


You have the right to live and work anywhere in europe - no visa required!!! Spain is only doing what all other european countries do - even the UK. It was lax before, but now its falling in line. They simply want to make sure that you can support yourself and that you wont end up homeless and living on their streets. Cos they dont give out council houses, healthcare or dole money as they do in the UK

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

spanishbookseller said:


> Proof of income is an issue as the income and bank statements are all in my name and what do I do just print bank statements out, my experience to date tells me that I will need more than actual proof or it will need to be on official paper etc etc...
> 
> Seems very Over the top as European law has already given us the right to live and work in a member state and our only legal obligation is to register in that country... Jeez!


we are hearing that they want the income to be into a spanish account - so maybe your OH could open one & you could transfer a good amount into that & then regular payments - every other bit of officialdom in Spain wants to see the originals & also for you to provide photocopies, so I'd be amazed if this was any different

someone on here recently had to show a balance of 5000€ - but that was just for her

it's not OTT - it's the same in a lot of European countries including the UK, Italy & France - it's an EU wide ruling - it's just that Spain has only recently decided to act upon it


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

..... It may also be worth noting that if you become a resident of spain and no longer paying NI in the UK, you wont be able to claim child allowance or any other UK allowances

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> ..... It may also be worth noting that if you become a resident of spain and no longer paying NI in the UK, you wont be able to claim child allowance or any other UK allowances
> 
> Jo xxx


true......

the right to live & work here means just that - you need to work or have another source of income - & now you have to PROVE it before they let you live here

which is only right, really


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## agua642 (May 24, 2009)

Hi, you could just try ya luck and visit school with your daughter, tell them you are in process of paper work but in Mean time could daughter start school, stress on it and smile & shake head at all the right times. You may get her in & started take passport. 
Half the stuff isn't level anyway so you should be ok . Best of luck


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

agua642 said:


> Hi, you could just try ya luck and visit school with your daughter, tell them you are in process of paper work but in Mean time could daughter start school, stress on it and smile & shake head at all the right times. You may get her in & started take passport.
> Half the stuff isn't level anyway so you should be ok . Best of luck


 I think once upon a time you could get away with doing that, but they really have tightened up on procedures now. Not to mention you then have to buy the list of school books - not much fun to spend money on book list etc to find that you're not able to stay there.

I wonder if an international school would be more lenient???? They're more used to kids coming and going.... and if the OP isnt planning on staying for the duration, international schools tend to follow the UK curriculum

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I think once upon a time you could get away with doing that, but they really have tightened up on procedures now. Not to mention you then have to buy the list of school books - not much fun to spend money on book list etc to find that you're not able to stay there.
> 
> I wonder if an international school would be more lenient???? They're more used to kids coming and going
> 
> Jo xxx


yes, I think International schools would do less checks - although I'm sure they should.....

I wouldn't think you could get into a state school now without some proof that you are resident - if you do, and then as you say something goes wrong & the child is later told they can't stay, apart from the financial issue (those books etc aren't cheap!) how would that make the child feel


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

the posts specifically about applying for residency are now here http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...-eu-citizens-spain-application-res-certs.html


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