# Newbie!!



## Mawdi42

Hi all....Just wanted to say hello, and that my wife and I are really looking forward to learning from you all, as we soon hope to make our dream a reality by moving permanently from the Uk to Italy.
We are a normally couple with moderate and realistic expectations of what we will face in the year ahead, and really wanted to tap into all the experience that is out there.
It is just the 2 of us, but we do have animals that will come with us, so hearing about the complexities of moving them too would be good.

The first thing that i would like to ask is the first step people think we should take, eg, making contact with an Italian Consulate in the UK, to seek their advise, and try and apply for residency?? 
We do have people we know in Italy after many scouting trips (although we have yet to find the right home for us) but they have either lived in Italy all their lives, or moved many years ago, so I would really value some experiences from people who have moved in the last few years, so things are still fresh, and possibly still work the same way (we have been told many times things change frequently in Italy!!) 

Any advise would be brilliant

Thanks in advance
Steve & Amanda


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## KenzoXIV

Mawdi42 said:


> Hi all....Just wanted to say hello, and that my wife and I are really looking forward to learning from you all, as we soon hope to make our dream a reality by moving permanently from the Uk to Italy.
> We are a normally couple with moderate and realistic expectations of what we will face in the year ahead, and really wanted to tap into all the experience that is out there.
> It is just the 2 of us, but we do have animals that will come with us, so hearing about the complexities of moving them too would be good.
> 
> The first thing that i would like to ask is the first step people think we should take, eg, making contact with an Italian Consulate in the UK, to seek their advise, and try and apply for residency??
> We do have people we know in Italy after many scouting trips (although we have yet to find the right home for us) but they have either lived in Italy all their lives, or moved many years ago, so I would really value some experiences from people who have moved in the last few years, so things are still fresh, and possibly still work the same way (we have been told many times things change frequently in Italy!!)
> 
> Any advise would be brilliant
> 
> Thanks in advance
> Steve & Amanda


Hi Guys,

First and foremost welcome to the forum. arty:

What sort of advice are you looking for? Really the questions need to be quite specific for us to jump in and help out. What sort of area are you looking to go to? Do you have any links to Italy? Heritage etc?

Will you be staying all year around or seasonal? I know you said permanently but if you plan to vacation out of Italy for long periods you may not need to change your residency.

Haven't moved pets myself but I am sure they will have to have their vaccinations up to date and will require a "pet passport".

With regards to residency you will need to know where you are going before applying for residency. You will need to prove you can support yourselves and have healthcare. If you have no Italian links i.e. heritage, marriage etc you will need a permesso di soggiorno before your residency.

Should be enough their to get you started 

Kenzo


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## GeordieBorn

Hi Steve & Amanda and a big welcome to your wonderful adventure. I'll go with Kenzo and add to take it slowly, do what you have started here by getting advice/information. List the big things as you go and stick notes against them on what you find e.g. residency, taxation, currency movement etc... There was a lot of good information on the web when we were looking to move a few years ago on things like "what cost are involved in buying in Italy". 
Whilst still here in the UK there is still lots you can do finding the above information, looking at houses and even viewing (kind of) by using the likes of Google street view for a virtual tour. 
What area(s) are you looking for , what life style, what is your Italian like, will you leave the UK totally, if not how do you intend to get back and forward i.e. to/from the airport etc... Lots to think of, but it's all part of the journey... and Enjoy !


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## NickZ

There isn't much the consulate can do for you. In theory you could apply for your codice fiscale at the consulate (tax number) but it'll be easier to get once you arrive here.

Residence is something you apply for in the town. Depending on how the consulate is laid out they might not even let you into some sections without an Italian passport. 

The steps I'd suggest

1) Define what you hope to do once you've moved. Work? Beach bum? Skier? Cultural fan? Homebody? World traveler? 

2) Think about which area fits that hope best. Some areas have more work. Others have better beaches or ski slopes. The cultural cities are obvious. If you intend to travel then make sure you won't find travel a pain. Better to be near an airport and major train station . A four hour drive to a major airport will be a pain. 

3) Housing budget. Both in the sense of € but also in the sense of space. You've mentioned animals. If that means large outdoor animals that's different then a tiny little purse dog. You may want to live in the centre of Rome over looking the Spanish steps but that's a different budget then mine -)

4) Start looking for a rental. Come over and spend some time as a tourist . Try to do the things you've decided on in step one.


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## panama rick

Hi guys. I'll add to the welcome to the forum and also Italy. I will speak to your pet issue as that is what we are intimately familiar with. We just moved here (US) and traveled with our dog. I will give you facts from our adventure and allow you to draw conclusions. We applied for and received citizenship through ancestry which took two years, but we didn't want to wait for approval to come here so we arrived via the tourist route. I did a tremendous amount of research regarding our dog. We received a lot of info from this forum about getting into Italy with our dog, so accurate some not so much. This is what we experienced. Left New York via Alitalia as they are one of a shrinking number of airlines that don't require a professional shipper (very expensive). There were no problems. Arrived Rome expecting to be asked to produce health docs, but no one seemed to care. A porter went to a room picked him up and we were gone. We had to leave after 3 months and ventured to the UK. Much more difficult. Stayed 4 months and back here. Got his UK passport from a UK vet. Leaving the UK was much easier as we had his passport and updated shots (rabies). Flew Alitalia again (Heathrow-Rome direct), got to Rome encountered the same situation, no one asked for anything and we were on our way. Sorry this took so many key strokes just wanted to give context. Bottom line, have current EU passport (Alitalia checked @ Heathrow). British Airways will require you to use their commercial services; expensive.


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## Mawdi42

Thanks so much for your welcome, and advise. We are planning on moving lock stock and barrel to Italy, and not go back to England very often. We are planning to fully retire and spend time at our home, raising animals and growing our own fruit and vegetables. We are wanting to be on the edge of a small town, and really be part of the local culture helping with local activities and festivals. Our Italian is coming on quite well, we have over 500 words and get by on holidays really well. We are hoping for nice mountain views, without being so close , as the weather seems to cling to them! 
Renting a property is good advise too, but we think we have time to find somewhere and get the job done before our planned move date of next Feb 2019...How long did the whole buying process take from offer to ownership? 
Hope to speak again soon 
Steve & Amanda


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## KenzoXIV

Mawdi42 said:


> Thanks so much for your welcome, and advise. We are planning on moving lock stock and barrel to Italy, and not go back to England very often. We are planning to fully retire and spend time at our home, raising animals and growing our own fruit and vegetables. We are wanting to be on the edge of a small town, and really be part of the local culture helping with local activities and festivals. Our Italian is coming on quite well, we have over 500 words and get by on holidays really well. We are hoping for nice mountain views, without being so close , as the weather seems to cling to them!
> Renting a property is good advise too, but we think we have time to find somewhere and get the job done before our planned move date of next Feb 2019...How long did the whole buying process take from offer to ownership?
> Hope to speak again soon
> Steve & Amanda


Well if Sicily interests you I would be happy to give lots of advice (Although I have already given some out on a recent thread so it would mostly be repeating myself!) 

In terms of the Mainland as far as this forum is concerned I believe there is a little concentration of posters around Abruzzo and Bologna. Have you got your heart set on anywhere in particular?

Kenzo


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## NickZ

Mawdi42 said:


> Th.How long did the whole buying process take from offer to ownership?


If it's simple. One owner selling. No mortgage to deal with. If it's simple it can be done in weeks. Or less.

BUT DON'T RUSH. Take your time. You're buying until death do you part. Make sure the house you buy is worth the commitment.


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## KenzoXIV

NickZ said:


> If it's simple. One owner selling. No mortgage to deal with. If it's simple it can be done in weeks. Or less.
> 
> BUT DON'T RUSH. Take your time. You're buying until death do you part. Make sure the house you buy is worth the commitment.


This is very true, buying a property in Italy is the easy part. Selling it will be nigh on impossible due to the economic situation of the country. Be sure you do your research and the property is up to 'code'.

Kenzo


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## Mawdi42

We would be looking to buy a home to live in until we could no longer manage it (hopefully many years into the future) so understand that we might have to move in 30 years having not sold the one we’re living in. We have factored this in to our budget, hence why we want to keep the cost of the house down below €150k. 
In terms of area , we really love Le Marche around Amandola, Sarnano and Servigliano lake Fiastra etc, but know these are in the “red zone” when it comes to potential earth quakes etc... it might sound daft but this doesn’t totally put us off moving there. Peace and quiet, nature and animals are our thing, so being close to Florence isn’t a problem, nor being an hour away from an airport worries us. We want the seasons still, but want to enjoy a much warmer/outdoors lifestyle than in the uk.
Really value your help/advise....its so helpful.

Steve & Amanda


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## NickZ

Unless you're looking for a large luxury villa your budget should have plenty of money left over. The sort of places in the country aren't that expensive usually.


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## GeordieBorn

Do not know how many similar requirements I’ve read over our time spent trawling forums, especially the one about close to a town/village and mix in with the community! In fact it is almost word for word part of what we ourselves wrote over 9 years ago now. We sometimes cringe at how naïve we were at the time, but now laugh about it as so many people go through the same. Think I’ve said how our top 20 hit list of things changed over the 2 years we were property hunting! Location, location is still everything for us, but the type of location differs these days. The view of the mountains I still totally agree with, but close to the village, well no not really, but we still would not want it to be too far to get to. Ours is about 2k and the town the same to walk to, but hey I would not want to walk that undergrowth and overgrown track to often…
I agree with others take your time and rent if you can, even if it means it’s a few thousand lost. We have seen many offers over the years on forums where fellow house owners want their property lived in over the winter, it’s worth a try. 
Your requirements match ours almost exactly and the house we have would likely be perfect. There are many like it out there, but you have to check out an awful lot of detail to make sure things are right. We look back at houses we thought were ideal and are so grateful we took our time in buying. Even so, we would reckon 50% of these minor details (if not a lot more) we were so, so lucky in finding the house had them – hindsight is a great thing. Just a couple we love; exactly where the sun is at lunch, before buying we would be looking for a terrace with full sun. No! We now know we want a bit of both, and very often in fact shade. Different places to sit outside, what views they have, sun/shade, natural wind breaks and lack of noise. A negative, access to the house. We have 2 drives up to the house. The word “up” being the negative, what’s it like to get to or from with 2m of snow or simply solid ice. A couple of times we have been stuck in there for 3-4 days, not a problem with lots of food, wood for the stove, but a slight worry if one was ill!


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## KenzoXIV

GeordieBorn said:


> Do not know how many similar requirements I’ve read over our time spent trawling forums, especially the one about close to a town/village and mix in with the community! In fact it is almost word for word part of what we ourselves wrote over 9 years ago now. We sometimes cringe at how naïve we were at the time, but now laugh about it as so many people go through the same. Think I’ve said how our top 20 hit list of things changed over the 2 years we were property hunting! Location, location is still everything for us, but the type of location differs these days. The view of the mountains I still totally agree with, but close to the village, well no not really, but we still would not want it to be too far to get to. Ours is about 2k and the town the same to walk to, but hey I would not want to walk that undergrowth and overgrown track to often…
> I agree with others take your time and rent if you can, even if it means it’s a few thousand lost. We have seen many offers over the years on forums where fellow house owners want their property lived in over the winter, it’s worth a try.
> Your requirements match ours almost exactly and the house we have would likely be perfect. There are many like it out there, but you have to check out an awful lot of detail to make sure things are right. We look back at houses we thought were ideal and are so grateful we took our time in buying. Even so, we would reckon 50% of these minor details (if not a lot more) we were so, so lucky in finding the house had them – hindsight is a great thing. Just a couple we love; exactly where the sun is at lunch, before buying we would be looking for a terrace with full sun. No! We now know we want a bit of both, and very often in fact shade. Different places to sit outside, what views they have, sun/shade, natural wind breaks and lack of noise. A negative, access to the house. We have 2 drives up to the house. The word “up” being the negative, what’s it like to get to or from with 2m of snow or simply solid ice. A couple of times we have been stuck in there for 3-4 days, not a problem with lots of food, wood for the stove, but a slight worry if one was ill!


Yeah I agree with all of this. Minor details are important and certainly when hunting the sun you can get carried away thinking you want the property as open as possible to let the sun in... the reality is you realise how much of a luxury the shade is!

I have rented my house for 12 months now, we have only just found out the entire upper level has not been earthed meaning every electrical appliance, especially our oven is now a major health hazard... the owner was 'unaware'....:blah:

The overwhelming advice you have received in this thread is probably not the one you were expecting but I will highlight it again... TAKE YOUR TIME!

Kenzo


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## GeordieBorn

Thinking more what you have said Mawdi, I had a quick look at Rightmove and found this house here
3 bedroom detached house for sale in Abruzzo, Teramo, Castilenti, Italy

(hopefully this does not infringe on forum rules, I do not know the house or have anything to do with selling houses ) it is in an area we know. It probably fits almost all requirements. But it is also on the market with another agent, very same pictures. This is the first problem with it as (and this may not be the case here) agents have been known to scrape pictures from other agents’ sites. Can be a problem if you get into a wrangle on paying the agent(s). Next the land is split by the road, very common in Italy. Not too much of a problem, but it could put many people off, as it happens I know it is a very quiet road. It does have heating looking at the pictures and seeing the rads, but it does not say what it is and if it is in working order. Storage is a problem if you need to store fuel and garden gear. They have used downstairs for living space, which may or may not be on the plans as one minor issue, but also means they need garages x2 for storage. Great, it’s got 30000 sqm (3HA) of land with 75 olive trees, we have just under 1HA and it’s a full time job to keep it under control. It would need a tractor to maintain/work. An agent will probably tell you your neighbours will do it because they love you! In reality they don’t have time to do their own and those that will do it will likely charge a fortune. I could go on, but think you will get the picture that there is a lot to consider.
That said, this house has a great deal going for it, not least the price – by the way do some research on how much you should offer. I would put my own views here, but it may ruffle too many feathers to do so.


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## KenzoXIV

GeordieBorn said:


> Thinking more what you have said Mawdi, I had a quick look at Rightmove and found this house here
> 3 bedroom detached house for sale in Abruzzo, Teramo, Castilenti, Italy
> 
> (hopefully this does not infringe on forum rules, I do not know the house or have anything to do with selling houses ) it is in an area we know. It probably fits almost all requirements. But it is also on the market with another agent, very same pictures. This is the first problem with it as (and this may not be the case here) agents have been known to scrape pictures from other agents’ sites. Can be a problem if you get into a wrangle on paying the agent(s). Next the land is split by the road, very common in Italy. Not too much of a problem, but it could put many people off, as it happens I know it is a very quiet road. It does have heating looking at the pictures and seeing the rads, but it does not say what it is and if it is in working order. Storage is a problem if you need to store fuel and garden gear. They have used downstairs for living space, which may or may not be on the plans as one minor issue, but also means they need garages x2 for storage. Great, it’s got 30000 sqm (3HA) of land with 75 olive trees, we have just under 1HA and it’s a full time job to keep it under control. It would need a tractor to maintain/work. An agent will probably tell you your neighbours will do it because they love you! In reality they don’t have time to do their own and those that will do it will likely charge a fortune. I could go on, but think you will get the picture that there is a lot to consider.
> That said, this house has a great deal going for it, not least the price – by the way do some research on how much you should offer.* I would put my own views here, but it may ruffle too many feathers to do so.*


Send via Private Message.. Probably correct not to make that sort of advice public


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## NickZ

Just pointing out that the ad violates Italian law. At the very least it needs an energy certification.


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## GeordieBorn

I'm sure you are correct Nick. Out of curiosity I looked up the actual agent who appear to be UK based, but do have an office in Pescara. Their site add state "No EPC found". At least the other agent has the rating (a "G"). What was interesting was one of the other properties on their site, it was up for sale over 9 years ago when we were looking in that area!


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## NickZ

The lack of a certificate at that price on a newly renovated home would worry me. I know it costs the seller a bit of money but you'd think they would want to show off the renovation. 

The lack of a certificate would make me wonder . 

G / no rating is fine if the house needs work. I'm looking at quite a few right now like that. But they're priced with less zeros -)


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## GeordieBorn

Nick's post reminded me of something important discussed on another forum, you should make sure any agent you use is registered/licenced. From what I recall they should have their registration details on the bottom page(s) of their websites. I did not spot one for this agent. 
I'm not that up to date on house prices, but this one without looking at it to close, does not seem too far off the mark, perhaps a little high. Then again it is very hard to tell as there seems to be one or two in a horrible, almost tear it all down state, which are being advertised for not much less!
We physically looked at more than 50 houses when buying and more than ten times that online. You need to look at quite a few just to get an idea of prices and what is a blatant rip-off .


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## NickZ

It's not just the rip offs. Many of those homes are worth more to the seller then virtually any buyer. The market for those houses are basically the people around it. It's reasonable they all looked at it and decided not to.

That means you need somebody from the outside. An Italian looking for a weekend vacation home. Or somebody even further away.

€150k today can get you a decent apartment in most Italian cities . 

All this leads to a seller who doesn't want to give it away . Even if the seller wanted to give it away buyers would be scarce. 

I'd just suggest looking at the townhomes. Even if you don't intend to buy in town. Then ask yourself why you would pay a premium for a country home that will be very hard to resell.


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## Mawdi42

Thanks so much Georgieboy for sending the house details. Looks interesting, and one we may well view on our next scouting trip. Really grateful to all that have posted. The biggest message I’m hearing is to not rush in.... we have been over to view properties a few times already and the reality is never the same as the pictures online.....so I see few more cramped Ryan air flights in my future!!!!! It’s great to know there are kind/sharing people out there that are willing to spend time reading and replying to us, who have been there......done that, and we get the benefit of your experiences. Thanks again 
Steve & Amanda


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