# Spousal Permit & the right timing



## Jujube (Sep 12, 2011)

Hello everyone...

I've been reading many threads over the last few months & I have to say that this has been very helpful in helping me finding info for my next move to SA.

Here is a little bit about myself:
- I am living in Sydney (Australia) & been in a relationship with a SA citizen for the last 5 1/2 years
- We are getting married in Cape Town by the end of the year & are relocating there at the same time
- We are then going for a 3 months honeymoon in Central America
- I do not have yet an offer for employment & am willing to look for a job when I'm back from my travelling.

The reason that I'm posting here is that I' m a little bit confused on the right moves I should take due to my circumstances:
- I was first planning to put an application for a spousal permit here in Australia but looking around it seems like embassies only issue the 'normal' relatives permit as I don't have any job offer
- It seems that even if I put an application now, once I got a job offer in South Africa I would need to re-apply for the spousal permit with right to work - so what's the advantage of getting the visa abroad in the first place?
- If I apply for the temporary visa from AU, does it make sense to also apply for the permanent here? I got a bit worried that once married, I would have to wait another 5 years to apply for it while being in a relationship for 5 1/2 years now allows me this
- The other solution for me would be to get a spousal permit with business endorsement from Australia which would allow me to work freelance in SA while I'm looking for a permanent job but I have not found much info about setting this up

Anyway, I'm just not too sure on which visa I should take & in which order.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,
Jujube


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## Saartjie (Mar 1, 2010)

Jujube said:


> Hello everyone...
> 
> I've been reading many threads over the last few months & I have to say that this has been very helpful in helping me finding info for my next move to SA.
> 
> ...


Hi there, I shall try to answer some of your questions.

In relation to your spousal permit, this is not dependent upon you obtaining employment. The spousal permit is a permit in its own right which can be endorsed for work. The reason why a lot of people try to obtain a job offer before applying is because it means less hassle. If you have a job offer you can submit this with your application for the spousal permit and get your permit with the work endorsement. You can obtain the spousal permit first, then apply separately for the work endorsement but this will mean two separate applications which means more time spent (wasted) at Home Affairs. If you can apply from OZ I would recommend this as they should issue Spousal permits and you will (probably) have less hassle. Having to do it here in SA is a nightmare (believe me, I am going through it at the moment). Also, you might have seen that the law is about to change here (no date has been given as yet) whereby you will no longer be allowed to enter SA on a tourist visa and then apply for another visa while you are here but will have to return to your own country to make the new application. As such, if you can sort it out before coming here my advise is that you should try to do so.

With regards to Permanent Residency, I am informed that you are only eligible as a spouse when you have been married for 5 years. Co-habitation is not enough. I might be wrong but I do not think so as I am in the process of applying for mine and it specifically states that you must evidence marriage of a minimum of 5 years to SA citizen. Please also note that the current waiting time for permanent residency is 24 months so you must ensure that you have temporary residence whilst waiting for your permanent one.

So in summary, try to obtain your Spousal permit before you leave OZ and then deal with the work endorsement here. At least this means that you will enter the country on the permit you intend to reside here on and then only need to make the one application at Home Affairs to get your permit endorsed once you have a job offer. Be specific when you apply at the embassy. The permit you want is a Section 11(6) permit (this is the Spousal one).

Hope the above helps. Good luck with your move. I have not regretted coming here once and love love love SA (taking Home Affairs out of that equation of course).


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## Jujube (Sep 12, 2011)

Hi Saartjie, thanks for your answers - definitely helpful. I'm very excited to move to South Africa, especially in Cape Town.

I had heard about the Immigration Act & the impact on people from overseas but have not been able to read a good article explaining it, or get the any recent updates.

In any case, it seems that I should apply from Oz anyway...In that regard, I have few more questions:

- Apparently embassies are not willing to give the spousal visa but rather the 'normal' relatives visa - would that make a difference if I get this one & then apply for the spousal visa with work endorsement 11(6)b once in South Africa?

- When I will add the work endorsement in SA, it seems like it is a complete new application, is that so? or would it be considered differently as I already have the spousal visa? I'm just worried about the time it will take to get the endorsement and start working...

- I thought that you either had to be 5 years in a relationship or 5 years married to be eligible for permanent residency - and as such I should be eligible., no? Apparently it makes sense to apply for the permanent at the same time as the temporary but I'm not sure if I could apply overseas?

- Any tips for applying for business endorsement as a sole trader? I just want to be able to contract/freelance as soon as I can, and not wait three months for my work endorsement to come through...

Once again, many thanks for your help.

Cheers,
Julien


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## ATLres (May 15, 2011)

Jujube said:


> Hi Saartjie, thanks for your answers - definitely helpful. I'm very excited to move to South Africa, especially in Cape Town.
> 
> I had heard about the Immigration Act & the impact on people from overseas but have not been able to read a good article explaining it, or get the any recent updates.
> 
> ...


Hi Julien, 

Going through the same process for my husband. I have received quite a bit of assistance from this forum and wanted to pass it on to you. 
The US embassies also only give relative visas - so you would get that in Oz and then apply for the Spouse visa on arrival. The relative visa is valid for 24 months. You can apply for the Spouse visa with work endorsement if you have a job offer or with business endorsement if you want to freelance. Not sure what you will have to show for the business endorsement, but have heard it's a smart way to go if you want to work ASAP. As far as the permanent residency, it is 5 years of marriage and not of being in a relationship, that would make it too easy. 

Hope this helps a little.


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## Saartjie (Mar 1, 2010)

Jujube said:


> Hi Saartjie, thanks for your answers - definitely helpful. I'm very excited to move to South Africa, especially in Cape Town.
> 
> I had heard about the Immigration Act & the impact on people from overseas but have not been able to read a good article explaining it, or get the any recent updates.
> 
> ...


Hi again,

I was not aware that embassies does not issue Spousal permits but that might well be the case. If you obtain a relatives permit in OZ, you can enter the country on this then make an application here to Change the Conditions of your permit, from a relatives to a spousal permit with a work endorsement. This is the way I had to do it as the permit that I received initially was a relatives permit even though I specifically asked for a spousal (I made my application here in SA at Home Affairs). 

Your best bet is to get to SA on your relatives permit. Once here, get a job offer, then go to Home Affairs and make the application I mentioned above and get the work endorsement at the same time as getting your spousal. This would save you a lot of time. It takes about 3 months or so to get your permit here (it can take much longer than that) so be prepared to have to wait to start work for at least three months when you get here.

Have checked about Permanent Residency. It is def 5 years of marriage and not cohabitation. 

I have not got any info about business endorsement sorry.


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## Jujube (Sep 12, 2011)

Hi Saartje,
I'm surprised in regards to your comments about the permanent residency. I can still see on the official website that it mentions the possibility of being 5 years in a relationships (not just married):
www dot services dot gov dot za/services/content/Home/ServicesforForeignNationals/Permanentresidence/Applicationforapermanentresidencepermitspouses/en_ZA

Can I ask where you got your information from?

In regards to business endorsement, anyone has gone this path that could explain the documents necessary to get this along with a spousal visa?

Cheers,
Julien


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## ATLres (May 15, 2011)

Jujube said:


> Hi Saartje,
> I'm surprised in regards to your comments about the permanent residency. I can still see on the official website that it mentions the possibility of being 5 years in a relationships (not just married):
> www dot services dot gov dot za/services/content/Home/ServicesforForeignNationals/Permanentresidence/Applicationforapermanentresidencepermitspouses/en_ZA
> 
> ...


Hi Julien, 

Sounds like you don't want to believe it! I don't know of any country that acknowledges a relationship regardless of the length for immigration purposes. The page you listed mentions a 5 year spousal relationship, I guess it depends what you definition is of a spouse. I always thought of it as a married partner?


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## Saartjie (Mar 1, 2010)

Jujube said:


> Hi Saartje,
> I'm surprised in regards to your comments about the permanent residency. I can still see on the official website that it mentions the possibility of being 5 years in a relationships (not just married):
> www dot services dot gov dot za/services/content/Home/ServicesforForeignNationals/Permanentresidence/Applicationforapermanentresidencepermitspouses/en_ZA
> 
> ...


I get my information from the Home Affairs office in Germiston Joburg where they have been dealing with my application. They have informed me that it is 5 years of marriage. When I arrived in SA in August 2010 my husband and I had been married for 4 years and 6 months, I was therefore informed that I was not eligible for permanent residency but had to apply for temporary which is what I did. My husband and I have been together for over 10 years and living together for 9 years, that however did not make me eligible for permanent residency. On the 18th February 2011 we had our 5 year wedding anniversary and after that I was informed by Home Affairs that I am now eligible for permanent residency.


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## Saartjie (Mar 1, 2010)

Jujube said:


> Hi Saartje,
> I'm surprised in regards to your comments about the permanent residency. I can still see on the official website that it mentions the possibility of being 5 years in a relationships (not just married):
> www dot services dot gov dot za/services/content/Home/ServicesforForeignNationals/Permanentresidence/Applicationforapermanentresidencepermitspouses/en_ZA
> 
> ...


Sorry, I should have added that you can find what you are looking for in section 26 (1) (b) of the Immigration Act 2002. It says as follows: 

_'the Director-General may issue a permanent residence permit to a foreigner who-

b) Has been the spouse of a citizen or permanent resident for five years and the Director-General is satisfied that a good faith spousal relationship exists: Provided that such permit shall lapse if at any time within two years from the issuing of that permit the good faith spousal relationship no longer subsists, save for the case of death'_

Hope this answers your question.


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## Entchen92 (Sep 18, 2011)

*many questions *

hello people  i am a german girl, in a relationship with a south african (durbanite) for 2 years now, and i want to apply for a life partner permit.
I have a million questions and hope somebody here can help me...
first information about me and my spouse that u can judge the situation.
I met him in germany, went to RSA for 10 months, then he came to germany for 6 months and at the moment im sitting in durban and i dont know where to start.
I have letters from my and my partners parents that we lived with them while we stayed with together.(theyre notarized).
i have a letter from my spouse to support me emotionally financially etc etc..
I have a bankstatement to say that i have some money..
i have my medical and radiology report.
I have my police clearence and a birth certificate..
i have 2 envelopes send to us both at the same adress.
i have a application form BI-1738 ( which is a very confusing form!!)
then i filled and notarized a from called BI-1712A) FORM12...
Then A Form that says PART 1: affidavit by life partners annexure B.(and annexure C)..

here my questions..DO I NEED SOMETHING ELSE?? we dont have a shared bank account but we swore in front of a commissioner of oaths that we support each other financially and my spouses parents swore to support us..same did my parents but its not official notarized because their in germany.. :/
All of us also swor that we lived together then and then (in germany and sa)
Is that enough? my spouse only got a job recently but as a teacher he didnt get paid yet and i have to apply because im leavin for germany on the 16th october ..
So he hasnt got proof that he earns..

Then, I have a job offer to teach ( were both teachers) ..can my employee simply write a letter to say that he offers me a job_? or does he have to fill in the last 2 pages of the Bi 1738?? does he also need reasons why a south african has not been appointed.??

Why does home affairs not have a form for applicants for a life partner permit?? i am so confused with the temporary residence permit???
and i cant afford to get an visa agency to help me...please, if anyone here can help me, i am running out of time and i would appreciate help!!


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