# Fashion industry!!!



## nicola67 (Jun 21, 2009)

My desire to move abroad is still something I long for.. albeit a fresh start, new adventure etc etc.
I have mentioned before that I been working in the public sector, for the past 10 years, good pay good pension scheme, etc etc, But my real passion is fashion!! just love anything to do with ladies apparel, and with my desire to move abroad thought my business plan may work over in Spain.
I have recently been making my own ladies fashion garments and sales are going really well, although theres only so much one can do as well as working full time, also been purchasing a few wholesale clothing... ex calalogue brands and wot not and selling them on, which is alot easier and quicker than actualy manufacturing the garments yourself! 
Ok so my question is: a possible business venture?  over there in Spain? 
Anybody run a similar type of business?
Cheers!
Nicola


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## Guest (May 31, 2010)

As I mentioned in another post, there is seemingly 100s of people reselling clothes down here at the moment. I fear you've missed the boat and it's the new "landlord", "builder", "plumber", "web designer" reason to be here!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Sadly it seems to me that there is nothing that hasnt been "done to death" here in Spain anymore. Once upon a time there were opportunities to start up new companies that hadnt been here and make a good living - But nowadays its probably harder to start a business here than it is in the UK. The red tape, rules and regulations can be horrendous, especially if you're not used to that sort of culture (Its far worse than the UK) and then of course theres the language problems. I've said before, if you have an idea, try it in the UK first and if it works there then you have a slightly easier chance of moving it to Spain.

As for making, designing and selling your own clothes??? I dont know. There are plenty of shops, stores and markets selling clothes, from the low cost stuff up to designer levels. Will you be able to break into that market enough to make a living??? I dont know????!!!! 

Jo xxx


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Hi,
this thread is vaguely connected to your subject. Might be worth trying to get in touch with the OP...
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...80-starting-baby-shop-north-costa-blanca.html


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Hi,
> this thread is vaguely connected to your subject. Might be worth trying to get in touch with the OP...
> http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...80-starting-baby-shop-north-costa-blanca.html


they've opened their shop now:clap2:


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

xabiachica said:


> they've opened their shop now:clap2:


Might be an idea to wait six months or so then get in touch?
Just a thought but a public sector job with Final Salary Pension Scheme isn't to be given up lightly.
That is of course if you are sure you will not fall a victim to Danny Alexander's cuts....
Bear in mind also that Spain is likely to be entering a lengthy period of deflation (already there) and recession (on the horizon) and has an unemployment rate of 20% (rising).


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## JBODEN (Jul 10, 2009)

mind you, with mass unemployment maybe you could set up a 'sweat shop'


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

JBODEN said:


> mind you, with mass unemployment maybe you could set up a 'sweat shop'


Never mind that, I wish someone would open up a branch of TK Max here.
I love my cheap labels


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## HARLEYAVENUE (May 27, 2010)

Nicola,i hate to see all the negativity going on around your dream.
Fact is honey,if you don't try you will never know.
What the replies say to your post are all correct but like i said if you have good designs at the right price and know how to market them you can make a good living in Spain.in fact anywhere.it would be easier and more profitable to do it in the U.K. but then you would not be able to enjoy the success you do achieve.
Fashion is just about the hardest business to succeed in but it can be done and if it is truly your passion then just go for it,better than spending your life saying i should have done.
Good luck and if you need any help let me know......Linda x


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

HARLEYAVENUE said:


> Nicola,i hate to see all the negativity going on around your dream.
> Fact is honey,if you don't try you will never know.
> What the replies say to your post are all correct but like i said if you have good designs at the right price and know how to market them you can make a good living in Spain.in fact anywhere.it would be easier and more profitable to do it in the U.K. but then you would not be able to enjoy the success you do achieve.
> Fashion is just about the hardest business to succeed in but it can be done and if it is truly your passion then just go for it,better than spending your life saying i should have done.
> Good luck and if you need any help let me know......Linda x


I totally agree. Negativity can be demoralising and dent dreams, but without the knowledge of how things really are, you could sail into a nightmare. Take it all on board so that you can make an informed decision and if you choose to go for it, then brace yourself!!!

Jo xxx


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## VFR (Dec 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I totally agree. Negativity can be demoralising and dent dreams, but without the knowledge of how things really are, you could sail into a nightmare. Take it all on board so that you can make an informed decision and if you choose to go for it, then brace yourself!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


Ain't that a fact & some good forums giving ground-root advice would have saved me a few bob before we came here.

Fashion ?
Well all you need I guess is to get some Z-List moron to wear pink Dr Martins with fluorescent laces & a dustbin liner for a skirt and you have made it (?)

On a more serious note, callots (sic) well designed, with plenty of material, in varying lengths & fabric weight/type would sell well IMO. Oh and of course ring the labels so a size 12 has a 10 label etc etc will help sales no end


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

HARLEYAVENUE said:


> Nicola,i hate to see all the negativity going on around your dream.
> Fact is honey,if you don't try you will never know.


It's not 'negativity', though, is it. It's pointing out the harsh facts.
A lot depends on your standard of living in the UK. A well-paid public sector job with a Final Salary Pension scheme is not to be given up lightly. If you enjoy good disposable income, enjoy your job and have a nice house/apartment in the UK then that it's not an easy decision to make when you consider the reality of life in Spain at this time.
You have to consider many issues: tax, health insurance, social payments in general - presumably you would be autonomo? Then there's the business plan itself. Which market would you be targetting? Spain has its own mass-market cheaply priced fashion industry. Fashion like catering is not the most secure of retail sectors as I'm sure the OP knows well.
I know hardly any Brits here but the picture I get from reading posts on this and other forums and from general observations is that most are not particularly well-off. I'm not sure about the demographic profile but I would guess that most are in the 50+ age bracket. 
You can get by here on a not very high income, I guess, but that might entail living in a not very attractive piso in a crowded urb where twenty people in the communal pool make it resemble a fish tank. Steve Hall pointed that out a few weeks ago.
As I said, it all depends what your current circumstances are compared to your future hopes. If you are single, no children, no ties, in a low-paid job or simply one you don't like....then yes, go for it. What have you got to lose?
Dreams have a nasty habit of turning into nightmares and lives can be ruined by rash decisions. Careful consideration of all the plusses and minuses involved in moving country isn't negativity, it's common sense.
I'm sure that those of us who are settled in a carefree life here put a lot of thought into their decision to relocate and I'm sure you will too.


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## geez (Apr 4, 2010)

Hi Nicola,

I don't work in the industry but have had a bit to do with business start-ups in the past. If you've done your research you'll realise Spain is potentially a goldmine for fashion entrepreneurs (Amancio Gaona, 'Mr Zara', recently made Top 10 worldwide rich list). However, I would talk to people in the industry, visit several different parts of the country, go to industry gatherings (sadly Bread 'n' Butter is no more in Barcelona... and a lot of fashion types from there are on the move to Berlin) before you make life-changing moves. Why not use your current security to build the structure around your dream? I've seen a couple of my favourite designers in Barcelona fold over the last year or two (sob), not for any want of talent, vision or business nous but simply due to a drying up of sales coupled with crippling rents imposed by the property boom. In the retail sector, the market for mid- to higher-end pieces was largely provided by tourists from other EU countries packing much fatter wallets. Massive drop-off in tourism has been devastating for a lot of fashion businesses. While folks here are very stylish, it is rare for people to be able to find the sort of money an average person in the UK regularly shells out on clothes. It's not Italy either where people are willing not forgo everything else for that right branded item. I'm now living in Bilbao and the old centre is dotted with empty shops. It's all about timing, really and now might be a great time to plan rather than act. 

But I digressed, most of this is about retail rather than online sales. Most Spanish fashion websites are pretty lousy and it seems to be difficult to buy stuff online (Loreak Mendian is probably an exception, and they manufacture here too). This could offer a market opening, or perhaps based on some genuine barriers. You are used to the best postal service in the world which is a boon for online businesses in the UK. You could not use _correos_ in a similar way (grrr, three stolen parcels in the last year).

This horrific economic period is going to provide opportunities. I read about business incubators starting up (a recognition that the bureaucracy has to be streamlined) [URL="http://http://madridemprende.esmadrid.com/node/1141"/URL]. The Canaries government has been offering tax-free holidays for start-up business employing x number of locals for the last few years. And if you decide to go that way, retail space will be widely available and much cheaper than it has been. And I would think that Spain is a wonderful place for manufacturing too with loads of local talent and position close to textile expertise Morocco and Tunisia.

Good luck with your plans, Nicola.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

geez said:


> Hi Nicola,
> 
> I don't work in the industry but have had a bit to do with business start-ups in the past. If you've done your research you'll realise Spain is potentially a goldmine for fashion entrepreneurs (Amancio Gaona, 'Mr Zara', recently made Top 10 worldwide rich list). However, I would talk to people in the industry, visit several different parts of the country, go to industry gatherings (sadly Bread 'n' Butter is no more in Barcelona... and a lot of fashion types from there are on the move to Berlin) before you make life-changing moves. Why not use your current security to build the structure around your dream? I've seen a couple of my favourite designers in Barcelona fold over the last year or two (sob), not for any want of talent, vision or business nous but simply due to a drying up of sales coupled with crippling rents imposed by the property boom. In the retail sector, the market for mid- to higher-end pieces was largely provided by tourists from other EU countries packing much fatter wallets. Massive drop-off in tourism has been devastating for a lot of fashion businesses. While folks here are very stylish, it is rare for people to be able to find the sort of money an average person in the UK regularly shells out on clothes. It's not Italy either where people are willing not forgo everything else for that right branded item. I'm now living in Bilbao and the old centre is dotted with empty shops. It's all about timing, really and now might be a great time to plan rather than act.
> 
> ...



That's very interesting and much of what you say is true. Planning rather than acting is good advice in the current situation.
The percentage of failures of business start-ups is depressingly high. I suspect that most failures are due to inadequate capitalisation resulting in short-term cash flow problems, lack of market research and sheer inexperience. When we were in business in the UK we saw off would-be competitors who crashed for those reasons.
The fact that two Spanish fashion moguls made it into the top ten lead me to draw the opposite conclusions to those you draw! Two out of the tens of thousands of hopefuls....and what other sources of business support/income involved their progress to the top?
I notice that many mass-produced textiles are now made up in cheaper Asian countries where presumably unit labour costs are cheaper than in North Africa and where Governments subsidise free-trade zones. 
Is Spain really such a wonderful place for manufacturing, in this particular case of textiles? Wage rates are higher than in traditional textile manufacturing countries and if there really were that much local talent why are they not in business here themselves?
As for empty and therefore cheap retail space.....it's cheap and empty for a reason....failure. Which doesn't mean no-one will succeed but gives considerable pause for deep thought.
You are right about Spaniards being stylish but unlike Italians in that their style involves vfm and overall affordability. In times of crisis food on the table will rate more in importance than clothes on your back.
And I'm in 100% agreement with your comments on Correos....there are some items I'd rather lug back from the UK than risk getting 'lost in the post' here.
I think that Nicola's situation is made more difficult by the fact that she has a solid job, unlike some of the would-be emigres who post here.
As you suggest it might be more sensible to keep the day job and build around it. 
That's what we did in the UK - my partner ran the businesses with the aid of Departmental Managers while I earned a steady income from other activities.
I'm not being facetious but Nicola, if you read this...have you thought of going on 'Dragon's Den'?


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## HARLEYAVENUE (May 27, 2010)

Hi Nicola,
You remember my shop in Liverpool city cente don't you.Let me bore you with a little story.
I opened the first shop in the midst of the last recession,every one said i was crazy,everything was against it succeeding.
WHAT?? the bank manager said,you want to open a shop in the city centre of one of the worst hit city's in the U.K. designing and manufacturing your own fashions,you have no experience in designing and no idea of how to run a business,you are loco.
Give me the deeds to your house and heres your money.
He was right,so was everyone else,it was a foolhardy thing to do but the one thing all those people who said i was crazy had in common was that they did not have the slightest idea what passion for fashion is,they can't grasp it and will never understand it,they can only see black and white.
The shop went on to be highly succesful and we opened more,my designs ended up being bought and sold by fashion houses all over the world and i know you bought some yourself
The above story is not a boast,what i am saying is, listen carefully to the replies,they are all giving very good advice,plan what you are going to do very carefully and never lose sight of reality.
BUT most of all don't lose your passion and never be afraid to follow your dreams,if everyone did the sensible thing all the time life would be very boring.
Linda x x x


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## geez (Apr 4, 2010)

What a lovely post, *HARLEYAVENUE*. I agree that you've got to follow your dreams and didn’t mean to imply to Nicola that starting out is impossible. I think Spain is a great place of inspiration for designers and creative people generally.

*mrypg9 *: The fact that Spain has fashion mogul or moguls doesn't mean that there aren't many, many successful small and mid-range operators. Unlike sport, business doesn't have to mean one winner. Based on the success of mega-brands like Inditex there is an international appetite and profile for Spanish fashion. The fact that Spanish _are_ in business for themselves does not mean that there aren't opportunities for talented interlopers. I've met a few who've come from places like Holland and Colombia who use local manufacturing and who are still, as far as I know, doing well enough. 

Textile, clothing and footwear is, by value of output, Spain’s largest industry the last time I looked. Spanish manufactured textiles are high quality and well suited to certain fashion niches. The better Zara and Mango pieces are manufactured locally and the quality and turnaround obviously suits their fast-fashion philosophy. There are many strong and enduring Spanish brands who have decided not to do a Primark and use 100% Chinese labour (and/or their subcontractors in SE Asia). It’s smart business. I thought I would mention it to Nicola to encourage thoughts of tapping into this manufacturing richness, to create and make up own designs rather than resell existing gear (which as, Jo-Jo I think said, and I concur, lots of people are doing). As for relative wage rates: You can crank out a lot of units for E200-300 a week which, as you would be aware, is what a lot of lower income people earn here. Rates in North Africa are lower again. BBC announced this morning Chinese wage growth of up to 20% this year (for those who get paid), can’t imagine we are going to benefit from this sort of wage growth. Anyway, none of this in untruth... just my POV.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

geez said:


> What a lovely post, *HARLEYAVENUE*. I agree that you've got to follow your dreams and didn’t mean to imply to Nicola that starting out is impossible. I think Spain is a great place of inspiration for designers and creative people generally.
> 
> *mrypg9 *: The fact that Spain has fashion mogul or moguls doesn't mean that there aren't many, many successful small and mid-range operators. Unlike sport, business doesn't have to mean one winner. Based on the success of mega-brands like Inditex there is an international appetite and profile for Spanish fashion. The fact that Spanish _are_ in business for themselves does not mean that there aren't opportunities for talented interlopers. I've met a few who've come from places like Holland and Colombia who use local manufacturing and who are still, as far as I know, doing well enough.
> 
> Textile, clothing and footwear is, by value of output, Spain’s largest industry the last time I looked. Spanish manufactured textiles are high quality and well suited to certain fashion niches. The better Zara and Mango pieces are manufactured locally and the quality and turnaround obviously suits their fast-fashion philosophy. There are many strong and enduring Spanish brands who have decided not to do a Primark and use 100% Chinese labour (and/or their subcontractors in SE Asia). It’s smart business. I thought I would mention it to Nicola to encourage thoughts of tapping into this manufacturing richness, to create and make up own designs rather than resell existing gear (which as, Jo-Jo I think said, and I concur, lots of people are doing). As for relative wage rates: You can crank out a lot of units for E200-300 a week which, as you would be aware, is what a lot of lower income people earn here. Rates in North Africa are lower again. BBC announced this morning Chinese wage growth of up to 20% this year (for those who get paid), can’t imagine we are going to benefit from this sort of wage growth. Anyway, none of this in untruth... just my POV.


Most things in business boil down eventually to your own POV!! Just as well, too, since, as you said, many people achieve success in spite of dire warnings by those who think they know what will happen next week, let alone in five years' time.
The main issues which would concern me if I were in Nicola's shoes would be the steady job she currently has (although some public sector jobs are surely due for big cuts), sufficiency of start-up capital (and banks are reluctant to lend to SMEs in spite of Government urging to do so) and the fact that over 70% of new businesses fold after a year.
But these are factors to be considered not prescriptive guides and this recession won't last forever....although I fear it has a few more years to run.
All business involves risk and risk can be calculated to some extent. Great risk often brings great rewards too...


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## nicola67 (Jun 21, 2009)

*Thank you!*

Would just like to say a big thank you to each and every ones feed back 

Yes I do have a good paying public sector job, final pension scheme, have a lovely home in a affluent part of liverpool, etc etc, but the thought of working in my current job role for the next 25 years  well ... lets just say the thought of it makes me shudder!!!! It may sound like sense to some, but my real passion is FASHION! and my desire to relocate abroad.

Yes I am single, :clap2: with a 21 year old daughter who is self sufficient... has a full time job, and a singing career ahead of her... such a (social little butterfly ) lol , so no worries on that front.

If I didnt own my own home and hold down a full time job... Id be on that first plane out of there! 

Thanks for your reply Linda... I do admire you, risking it all through the last recession when all the odds were against you, you sure proved them wrong! only wish I had your courage!
Im sure youll be just as successfull over in Spain, just like you was with RIO!

Anyway... .. I think for now one shall carry on designing and manufacturing my own garments around my full time job, and go from there! in order to pursue my goal! :eyebrows:

Thanks again!
nicola x


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