# UK Business and Spain Health care



## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

Hello,

I have a Internet business in the UK.

If I move to Spain am i required to move my business also or can i reside in Spain permanently without doing so? I would prefer to just leave it as is.

If i dont move my business I assume i will not get state health care, how do i go about getting this.

Do i need to pay into the system somehow, do i get insurance or something else.

Thanks.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

I believe if your business is in the UK and you continue to pay National Insurance contributions in the UK, you will be covered for healthcare while in Spain under the EU reciprocal agreement - I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Hybr!d said:


> Hello,
> 
> I have a Internet business in the UK.
> 
> ...


Technically and legally you should pay tax in the country in which you live for more than 182 days a year. However, theres a few people who dont. But that does mean they need an address in the UK to cover themselves and it obviously isnt strictly legal and risk getting caught, especially if they register as residents in Spain. So long the long and the short of it is that if you're not paying into the Spanish system, then you should take out private medical cover

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> I believe if your business is in the UK and you continue to pay National Insurance contributions in the UK, you will be covered for healthcare while in Spain under the EU reciprocal agreement - I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong!


yes............but if he is physically living here then he has to pay tax here, which is where things get complicated, so hopefully someone who really knows the ins & outs will be able to make it clearer


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> yes............but if he is physically living here then he has to pay tax here, which is where things get complicated, so hopefully someone who really knows the ins & outs will be able to make it clearer


Thats where the 182 day rule applies - for example, my husband commuted. He paid tax and NI in the UK and (unfortunately ) spent less than 180 days in Spain and was a resident in the UK. This meant that he and his dependants (me and the kids) were covered by the reciprocal agreement. 

Jo xxx


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

Ok, so what if i did the following. Morally i dont see this as anything wrong, but i accept you may not want to advise me to do this.

Move to spain.

Keep the business in the uk.

Dont register as a resident, (dont need to work anyway)

Use my EIHC for small doctors visits, coughs colds, the odd rash etc.

Fly home if i get really ill or have some kind of insurance as backup.

-I am registered to my parents house currently and will continue to be so.

Edit*

If after a few years i settle in Spain I would transfer everything over. But im reluctant to do so in the event i return home after 6-12-18 months or so for a number of reasons.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Hybr!d said:


> Ok, so what if i did the following. Morally i dont see this as anything wrong, but i accept you many not want to advise me to do this.
> 
> Move to spain.
> 
> ...


Some do that, but you have to have a home address in the UK, that you can be contacted at (ie, parents, relative, friend... not just an empty property) and you must make sure that any illnesses are short and sweet - if you need ongoing treatment or get something too serious to fly back with, then you're stuffed LOL! Insurance back up is a possibility, but then it works out more expensive than moving your tax responsibility to Spain. There is then also an issue with buying a car - I'm a bit hazy on that, but my husband couldnt buy one in Spain because he wasnt a resident. I had to buy it and allow him to drive it on my insurance.

Jo xxx


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

Thanks for the replys.

Im going with my sister and her boyfriend whom will be setting up a business there, so i can live with them and use their car, if you catch my drift.

I am registered at my parents in the UK and that wont change anytime soon.

I think i can use my EHIC and get 18months backpackers insureandgo cover, £9 a month just in case, you never know.

If i permanently reside in spain after that ill move everything over.

Seem a go-er?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Hybr!d said:


> Thanks for the replys.
> 
> Im going with my sister and her boyfriend whom will be setting up a business there, so i can live with them and use their car, if you catch my drift.
> 
> ...


It isnt the legal or correct way of doing things............. See if anyone else can see any objections 
Jo xxxx


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

One other thing though, surely you can become a resident without an income, be it in Spain, UK or otherwise.

So you can buy a car, get a job, get a bank account and get paid into said account etc. Everything you need to then provide the money for the tax they want


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Hybr!d said:


> One other thing though, surely you can become a resident without an income, be it in Spain, UK or otherwise.
> 
> So you can buy a car, get a job, get a bank account and get paid into said account etc. Everything you need to then provide the money for the tax they want


You can, but only if you're being deceitful! The law says that you pay taxes to the country in which you live, which is defined by living there for more than 182 days a year (6 months). 

Jo xxx


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

Thanks, i much prefer to do everything right, i just wish i had longer than 3 months to decide if i want to become a resident.

Need to have a think, i think.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Hybr!d said:


> Ok, so what if i did the following. Morally i dont see this as anything wrong, but i accept you may not want to advise me to do this.
> 
> Move to spain.
> 
> ...


_Keep the business in the uk.

you'll be here & working here, so your business will be here 

Dont register as a resident, (dont need to work anyway)

you have 90 days to register as resident, so for that long anyway, you'll be fine - if you are here 183 days out of a year (not even consecutively, you are officially tax resident in any case

Use my EIHC for small doctors visits, coughs colds, the odd rash etc.

the EHIC is for HOLIDAYS - & you'd be better off just going to a farmacia for minor stuff

Fly home if i get really ill or have some kind of insurance as backup.

yes, have insurance - you might be too ill to fly home in an emergency

-I am registered to my parents house currently and will continue to be so._


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## lynn (Sep 25, 2008)

How is the business set up? If it is a Ltd company, and you draw a salary from it, the income is taxed in the UK and you are liable to pay NI contributions in the UK. 

Under these circumstances, you are entitled to the reciprocal healthcare arrangement. Contact HMRC and complete form CA8454. If you are eligible, they will send you an S1 form to take to the INSS office in Spain. Be warned - we have just sent ours off, and have been advised that the delay in processing this is 6-8 weeks. 

If you aren't eligible, but have paid your NI up to date for the previous 3 years, you can apply for a S1 from the Department of Work and Pensions for up to 2 and a half years. This department are much quicker at processing the application, and it can be done by telephone call.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

lynn said:


> How is the business set up? If it is a Ltd company, and you draw a salary from it, the income is taxed in the UK and you are liable to pay NI contributions in the UK.
> 
> Under these circumstances, you are entitled to the reciprocal healthcare arrangement. Contact HMRC and complete form CA8454. If you are eligible, they will send you an S1 form to take to the INSS office in Spain. Be warned - we have just sent ours off, and have been advised that the delay in processing this is 6-8 weeks.
> 
> If you aren't eligible, but have paid your NI up to date for the previous 3 years, you can apply for a S1 from the Department of Work and Pensions for up to 2 and a half years. This department are much quicker at processing the application, and it can be done by telephone call.


even if he's living here full time? he still has to make a tax return here, no? 

wouldn't it simply be more straightforward to register as a business here, then he's covered as far as healthcare & everything is concerned from the get go

although admittedly if he registers as autónomo that could turn out expensive


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## lynn (Sep 25, 2008)

xabiachica said:


> even if he's living here full time? he still has to make a tax return here, no?
> 
> wouldn't it simply be more straightforward to register as a business here, then he's covered as far as healthcare & everything is concerned from the get go
> 
> although admittedly if he registers as autónomo that could turn out expensive


Yes, tax on UK salary is paid in the UK, even if resident in Spain full time. 

UK income is taxed in the UK. But yes, a Spanish tax return needs to be submitted as well as you are liable for tax on everything else you may have, but you don't pay tax twice on the salary you draw in the UK.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

lynn said:


> Yes, tax on UK salary is paid in the UK, even if resident in Spain full time.
> 
> UK income is taxed in the UK. But yes, a Spanish tax return needs to be submitted as well as you are liable for tax on everything else you may have, but you don't pay tax twice on the salary you draw in the UK.


yes, that's pretty much how I thought it worked - so there really is no point 'hiding'

I imagine that works out financially better than setting up over here, too

isn't there a time limit as to how long you can take advantage of the S1 & reciprocal agreement - 2 years or something?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I knew that they'd be people on here who could explain it better than me lol

One point about healthcare thats worth noting. I am one of those people who always thought, the kids and me are " fit, healthy and wont need to worry too much about health care" HAH!!! My son, tore the ligament in his leg and he broke his arm and I (who never does anything and rarely even gets a cold) broke my leg!!! The initial consultation on all of these incidents would have been free anyway EHIC, but NOT the follow up and on going treatment, which was quite extensive????? Nah, luckily we were covered by my husbands reciprocal arrangement with the NHS - cos he pays into the system in the UK (commutes, officially resides and pays in the UK) 


Just pointing out that the "it wont happen to me" mentality isnt reliable!!!

Jo xxx


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## lynn (Sep 25, 2008)

xabiachica said:


> yes, that's pretty much how I thought it worked - so there really is no point 'hiding'
> 
> I imagine that works out financially better than setting up over here, too
> 
> isn't there a time limit as to how long you can take advantage of the S1 & reciprocal agreement - 2 years or something?


If you aren't continuing to pay NI in the UK, the S1 is only for (up to) the first two and a half years here.... but if you are continuing to pay NI, the S1 is indefinite.... hence they are the same form but dealt with by two different departments (DWP or HMRC)


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

lynn said:


> Yes, tax on UK salary is paid in the UK, even if resident in Spain full time.
> 
> UK income is taxed in the UK. But yes, a Spanish tax return needs to be submitted as well as you are liable for tax on everything else you may have, but you don't pay tax twice on the salary you draw in the UK.


I have a UK Internet business that is a registered Ltd Company in the UK. I dont do anything deceitfully, but I havent paid any tax in the UK or in Spain on it


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

Stravinsky said:


> I have a UK Internet business that is a registered Ltd Company in the UK. I dont do anything deceitfully, but I havent paid any tax in the UK or in Spain on it


Ok, how is that possible and more so, how do you get any health care?

Cheers, Dave.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

Hybr!d said:


> Ok, how is that possible and more so, how do you get any health care?
> 
> Cheers, Dave.


I'm a Spanish resident in Valencia Prov with a wife over retirement age, so I qualify for full Spanish health care

The tax thing is possible because I have a good accountant
If you own a Limited Company, many things are possible


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

Gotcha. Thanks.


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## mikesuze (Nov 7, 2011)

EHIC is ok for emergencies & temp/short term local doctors/hospitals. But not for non life threatening operations. We have been told by hospital that we would have to pay or go back to uk to get opp on the UK NHS


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

How does it work with prescriptions?

Every now and then i need antibiotics for an abcess that reappears and creams for eczema.

I pay in the uk for my prescriptions, so i guess i do the same, regardless of if im a resident of Spain and paying into the system or not?

Thanks.


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## lynn (Sep 25, 2008)

Hybr!d said:


> How does it work with prescriptions?
> 
> Every now and then i need antibiotics for an abcess that reappears and creams for eczema.
> 
> ...


You'll be able to buy eczema creams over the counter at the farmacia. Antibiotics you'll have to get a prescription for, but can get a private prescription if you're not under the state system.


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## Hybr!d (Oct 9, 2011)

Great, thanks for you help.


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## James3214 (Jun 25, 2009)

Sorry I just spotted this thread but started another concerning this EHIC here:
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...4888-ehic-european-health-insurance-card.html

Any other good advice from you Spanish expats for a UK expat who doesn't have health insurance in Germany but only an EHIC after working for 6 months in Germany?
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/germany-expat-forum-expats-living-germany/94779-medical-advice.html


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

Hybr!d said:


> How does it work with prescriptions?
> 
> Every now and then i need antibiotics for an abcess that reappears and creams for eczema.
> 
> ...


If you are on the state system & under retirement age you only pay 40% of the cost of the prescription.


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