# Buying in Malaga campo!?



## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

Hi all, I'm new to the forum and would be grateful for any advice you might be able to offer on the idea of buying a house in the campo near Malaga...

We left the UK a few weeks ago and are renting a villa inland from Malaga at the moment, in order to get to know the place well before we commit to buying anything. We are not intending to rent it out and dont need a mortgage, we are in it for the long term so we dont intend selling it in the forseeable future, we will be living in it most of the time just going back to england for 3 to 5 months each year. So my questions are

Given our circumstances, do you think buying is a good idea at this time?
Any specific questions I should be asking the agent (the property we like is a 200yr old house in the campo near Almogia, inland from Malaga). Ive asked if its fully legal for permanent living and she assures me it is.
The agent has highly recommended a spanish lawyer called Manuel Ulbeda Castaneda from Ubeda Retana Asociados, has anyone had dealings with this firm, or can anyone recommend a good through honest lawyer??!!

Any advice very welcome, thank you!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi all, I'm new to the forum and would be grateful for any advice you might be able to offer on the idea of buying a house in the campo near Malaga...
> 
> We left the UK a few weeks ago and are renting a villa inland from Malaga at the moment, in order to get to know the place well before we commit to buying anything. We are not intending to rent it out and dont need a mortgage, we are in it for the long term so we dont intend selling it in the forseeable future, we will be living in it most of the time just going back to england for 3 to 5 months each year. So my questions are
> 
> ...


:welcome:

I'm nowhere near there so can't help specifically - & I have no idea if he's a good / honest lawyer


BUT - the usual advice is to use any lawyer *except *one recommended by the property agent.....


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Yep, he may be a great lawyer but I would still feel better in having an independent one who can do all the legal checks themselves and I would probably want to check the legality for my own eyes too.

As long as you can afford it don't need to rely on rent for the property to pay off a mortgage when you are away then why not buy if it's what you want.


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## tarot650 (Sep 30, 2007)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi all, I'm new to the forum and would be grateful for any advice you might be able to offer on the idea of buying a house in the campo near Malaga...
> 
> We left the UK a few weeks ago and are renting a villa inland from Malaga at the moment, in order to get to know the place well before we commit to buying anything. We are not intending to rent it out and dont need a mortgage, we are in it for the long term so we dont intend selling it in the forseeable future, we will be living in it most of the time just going back to england for 3 to 5 months each year. So my questions are
> 
> ...


Nice area but after living here permanently for 19years and seeing some of the mistake that people have made I certainly wouldn't go for any recomendations from estate agents.I would be getting my own independent Abogado.Also,something to consider is,is the property near a health centre just in case you had an emergency in the middle of the night,will you need one or two cars to do your weekly shop,is there a bus service for if you havn't a car for any reason.It's all these little points that make up to having an enjoyable life here.Personally I much prefer the Eastern side of Malaga although there has been a lot of devolopement it hasn't been ruined like the Western side.At the end of the day if you buy that's down to personal choice although people will tell you to rent,rent,rent but for me living in rented accommodation,I would not thank you for it.But, some people have to rent because they cannot afford to buy.Regards.SB.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

I would say;

use your own lawyer
make sure that the escritura (deeds) are 100% correct
check the cadastral details
make sure that ALL bills are paid and up-to-date
ask about the habitation licence
make sure it has water and electric - don't be fobbed off with "they are easy to get" because they aint!
If you ask the agent, they should be able to provide copies of the escritura and give you the catastral reference. Using this reference you can take a look at the details on the interweb.


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Also if internet is important then you need to check it's possible to get it in the area.


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

Very helpful, thanks for the replies. There are certainly no buses nearby, its very remote and quite high up, but we have a 4x4 and are used to living in remote spots (our house in wales is on top of a hill 10 miles to the nearest shop and the place in almogia is similar). Seeing the agent tomorrow so I will ask the agent for the escritura, proof of bills paid and cadastral ref as you suggest, I want to be 100% sure I'm not buying a lemon!! Thanks for the guidance, much appreciated.


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## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

You will not go wrong with Manuel, he is our solicitor/lawyer. A very nice person, totally honest and speaks excellent English.


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

country boy said:


> You will not go wrong with Manuel, he is our solicitor/lawyer. A very nice person, totally honest and speaks excellent English.


Thanks for your reply, thats good to know. From what the agent said he is the only lawyer worth using around here, but I was very wary, so thank you, thats a big help.


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## donz (May 5, 2010)

Spangles what area of Almogia are you going to (we are also in the Almogia campo)

As above, also check if it has MAINS water (not just water else you'll get fobbed off with well water). One of the people on the next ridge has a lovely home they bought about 5 yrs ago, were assured mains water would be no problem to get - they cannot get it.

Internet wise, you won't get ADSL in the campo, you will either need to get satellite internet if you want reliable, or a dongle 

There is a bus service if you use the old road into Almogia (MA3402) but not on the A7075 (known as the Malaga to Antequera road)

Don't know the lawyer but I would also agree don't use one recommended by your agent is a good rule of thumb.

I like living in this area, not too close to the touristy coast but close enough for civilisation & shopping plus until your Spanish gets good it helps


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

donz said:


> Spangles what area of Almogia are you going to (we are also in the Almogia campo)
> 
> As above, also check if it has MAINS water (not just water else you'll get fobbed off with well water). One of the people on the next ridge has a lovely home they bought about 5 yrs ago, were assured mains water would be no problem to get - they cannot get it.
> 
> ...


Hi, the house is in the campo about 12 mins from Almogia, somewhere between Almogia and Cartama de Estacion. The house only has well water, the agent hasn't mentioned mains water at all.... is well water a problem in this area? Regarding the internet, we currently use a sim card in our phone that gives us a portable wi-fi hotspot as long as you have mobile signal..... whats the mobile signal like up there? Yes like you we want to be away from the tourist crowds, somewhere peaceful and tranquil. Going to see the house tomorrow...fingers crossed !!:fingerscrossed:


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## donz (May 5, 2010)

ok I think it'll be likely the other way to where we are - you'll have to let me know, would be interesting to know which part 

Well water is not an issue as such but it's the same as what about when the mains is off (which happens). 

My pal has to pump her water up from the river!

Most of us in the campo have depositos to store water - if you have these you could also have water delivered (pricey but available)


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

donz said:


> ok I think it'll be likely the other way to where we are - you'll have to let me know, would be interesting to know which part
> 
> Well water is not an issue as such but it's the same as what about when the mains is off (which happens).
> 
> ...


OK thanks for the info on the water, will bear that in mind. Will let you know where it is tomorrow


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## el romeral (May 8, 2012)

We are over the other side of the Guadalhorse, not that far from Cartama, and have our own well. The biggest problem is the extremely high calcium content.
We use satellite internet and VoIP phone from Conecta4 (Eurona Telecom). Not great or cheap but adequate. Did not seem to be many other providers about? Perhaps they cover your area?


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## donz (May 5, 2010)

We use Inland Computer Services for the sat net, and our landline is via Telefonica radio jobbie with an antenna on the house - works just fine


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

OK great, seems like we will be able to get internet one way or another. 

One other question about buying here, the agent says we have to pay a 10% non refundable deposit as soon as our offer is accepted, I gather this is standard practice. What I'm a bit concerned about is what happens if something is thrown up by the lawyer showing that something is amiss, an illegal build, or it doesnt own the land is has said it does, that sort of thing, if this happened and we pulled out of the purchase as a result, is the deposit lost or is it refundable under such circumstances?? Also, who should we pay the deposit to - the lawyer or the agent? Thanks in advance.....


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Not sure about the coverage in that area but if you can get wi-max internet then jump at it over satellite.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi, the house is in the campo about 12 mins from Almogia, somewhere between Almogia and Cartama de Estacion. The house only has well water, the agent hasn't mentioned mains water at all.... is well water a problem in this area? Regarding the internet, we currently use a sim card in our phone that gives us a portable wi-fi hotspot as long as you have mobile signal..... whats the mobile signal like up there? Yes like you we want to be away from the tourist crowds, somewhere peaceful and tranquil. Going to see the house tomorrow...fingers crossed !!:fingerscrossed:


Just remember that if you want to be totally legal, then the well will need to have been registered and you will be limited on the amount of water that you can take from it.

[just for you to be aware]


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

donz said:


> ok I think it'll be likely the other way to where we are - you'll have to let me know, would be interesting to know which part
> 
> Well water is not an issue as such but it's the same as what about when the mains is off (which happens).
> 
> ...


Hi, well been to see the house today, the area is known as "Zafra"..... the well is registered and quite new (approx 6yrs old), the cortijo next to it has mains water so that might be a possibility. Tried my portable wifi hotspot up there (a sim card from Masmovil) and it worked fine..... gorgeous place, lovely area, fantastic views......Have made an offer, fingers crossed!!


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## donz (May 5, 2010)

Cool, I think that is Barranco del Zafra, that's the other side of Almogia to us more toward Campanillas way where we are more the other side toward Casabermeja side but down Malaga end (next 'bit' to Barranco Del Sol)


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## Madliz (Feb 4, 2011)

"No buses, pretty remote, but with a 4x4..."

I don't know your circumstances or ages, neither do I want to put a dampener on your hopes and dreams, but would like to add something from my own experience.

Four years ago my husband lost his 2-year battle with cancer, aged 53. He was admitted to hospital 14 times in that period, and as is the way here, a relative (me, as the only one within 700km) was expected to be present in the room with the patient to provide personal care, as nurses here only, generally, provide medical care. A spare bed/chair is provided for one to stay the night. Our hospital was a 20 minute drive away - I don't know how far away yours might be. On top of all other worries at the time, another thing to add to the panics was what would happen if I, for instance, tripped and was injured so that I couldn't drive. 

My advice to everyone now is, hope for the best, but plan for the worst. 

I hope your dreams come to fruition and your lives are wonderful. I myself wish to move to Málaga, IF I can sell my house in Madrid!


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## donz (May 5, 2010)

that would of course depend on your type of healthcare. If you use state healthcare then this is correct.

Planning for if you are on your own sure not to be sniffed at, but at the same time if we only planned for the bad things we'd never take any risks :fingerscrossed:


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

Re: the deposit. In this economic climate say you want to buy but won't put down a deposit. many people do this. Alternatively make sure your lawyer writes up a contract that if anything untoward shows up then the deposit is returned & that it is held in a client account .


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

Madliz said:


> "No buses, pretty remote, but with a 4x4..."
> 
> I don't know your circumstances or ages, neither do I want to put a dampener on your hopes and dreams, but would like to add something from my own experience.
> 
> ...


Hi, I'm so sorry to hear about your husband, that must have been a dreadful time for you. We will be about 20 mins drive from our nearest town and 50mins from Malaga, we both drive and my husband is 48 and I'm 41. I realise (sadly!) that we wont be able to live their forever, and that emergency help is a long way from us, but as Donz says, I can't live life expecting the worst, I plan to enjoy every minute and if/ when it comes crashing down around my ears and times become difficult, I wont have any regrets because I'm sure that the next few yrs in this blissful spot will be worth it! I hope your house sells soon, all the best to you


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

gus-lopez said:


> Re: the deposit. In this economic climate say you want to buy but won't put down a deposit. many people do this. Alternatively make sure your lawyer writes up a contract that if anything untoward shows up then the deposit is returned & that it is held in a client account .


Hi Gus-Lopez, thanks for the advice. I have agreed to pay a small (3,000 euro) deposit and sign a contract that says if there is ant issue with the legality of the house and we pull out as a result, then we will get the deposit back. 

We've been told it will be all done and we will have the keys in 2 weeks - amazing!!!!


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## Madliz (Feb 4, 2011)

donz said:


> that would of course depend on your type of healthcare. If you use state healthcare then this is correct.
> 
> Planning for if you are on your own sure not to be sniffed at, but at the same time if we only planned for the bad things we'd never take any risks :fingerscrossed:


This was private healthcare. ¡España es diferente! There have been discussions on the forum about this before - basically, if the patient is confined to bed and wants anything non-medical (laptop plugging in, teeth brushed, etc.,) the accompanying friend or relative assists. If not, the nurses don't do that sort of thing and the patient's life is not a happy one.

I do agree about taking risks, just being careful at the same time!


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> I would say;
> 
> use your own lawyer
> make sure that the escritura (deeds) are 100% correct
> ...


Hi, thanks for this advice. I have a copy of the escritura but of course its all in spanish and my spanish is not good enough to translate it, but it does say its a vivienda on a parcela rustica, and i have the cadastral. Whats concerning me is the habitation license, my lawyer says it wont have one as its in the campo and is 200yrs old.... is this something to be worried about? Thanks in advance :confused2:


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

I thought to have post, utilities etc you had to have a Habitation licence, but I could be confused with something else:yo:

Exciting time for you, really wish you well, we are 3 weeks behind you

xx


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

cambio said:


> I thought to have post, utilities etc you had to have a Habitation licence, but I could be confused with something else:yo:
> 
> Exciting time for you, really wish you well, we are 3 weeks behind you
> 
> xx


Post - what's that? Living in the campo, there is NO postal service. If you live in a town or on an urbanization, then you may be lucky.

For utilities (electric in your case), you would normally need a habitation licence and a boletin (proof that your wiring and installation is up-to-code). For older properties this can be a problem. I would suggest asking your lawyer and the electricity company - maybe your lawyer can ring them whilst you are with him. Sometimes in Spain, the name on the contract isn't changed because of just this problem - please take my advice and don't go down this route as it can lead to major problems later.


What you need to find out by looking at the escritura and the cadastral is whether everything is legal. As it's on rustic land, alarm bells are starting to ring. Sometimes older properties are OK but you need to make sure - the habitation licence (second not first) will show you this. 

It's quite common in Spain for a tool shed on rustic land to grow and grow until it is large enough to be used as a house. This will (should) show up on the cadastral and escritura. Sometimes extensions are simply not mentioned to anyone and only come to light when the property is sold.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

donz said:


> that would of course depend on your type of healthcare. If you use state healthcare then this is correct.
> 
> Planning for if you are on your own sure not to be sniffed at, but at the same time if we only planned for the bad things we'd never take any risks :fingerscrossed:


True. But one should always have a plan for the bad things.
For most retired couples, it is certain that at some point one will be alone. Risk taking is really not a sensible option for most retired people.
We know several couples in the seventies, property owners, living away from essential facilities such as shops, hospitals. In two cases, one partner is a non-driver. 
Nearly all wish that they had either rented, thus enabling mobility when and if needed plus cash for easy living or wish they had bought property in a less remote area.
No-one likes to dwell on these things, especiallly when starting a new life in a new country on retirement from a lifetime of work. But planning for all eventualities is the best form of insurance so that you can enjoy your well-earned retirement in the sun.
OH and I are both currently fit and healthy -well, she more than I. We enjoy our lives here. But because we want a future as free as possible from major problems when we are even older, we chose to rent and invest the money from the sale of properties.
If it were necessary -and hopefully it never will be - for one of us to be needing long term or permanent invalid care....we'd move, next door to the hospital or care home, if need be.
Risk is important in life, but risk is different from gambling. Calculating risk involves weighing up many factors before deciding on the odds, as any successful businessperson knows.


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> Post -
> 
> For utilities (electric in your case), you would normally need a habitation licence and a boletin (proof that your wiring and installation is up-to-code). For older properties this can be a problem. I would suggest asking your lawyer and the electricity company - maybe your lawyer can ring them whilst you are with him. Sometimes in Spain, the name on the contract isn't changed because of just this problem - please take my advice and don't go down this route as it can lead to major problems later.
> 
> ...


Hi, my lawyer and the vendor and I had a meeting yesterday and it was agreed that the vendor would not cancel the electric supply, he would keep it going and then we will switch over to my name upon completion, my lawyer said this would save any hassle with them asking for a habitation licence, as its just a name change not a new supply.... does this sound ok?

As I dont speak great spanish its difficult to check if the escritura etc are legal, I was thinking of seeking out a translator, or is it safe to entrust the legality of the documents to a lawyer?!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi, my lawyer and the vendor and I had a meeting yesterday and it was agreed that the vendor would not cancel the electric supply, he would keep it going and then we will switch over to my name upon completion, my lawyer said this would save any hassle with them asking for a habitation licence, as its just a name change not a new supply.... does this sound ok?
> 
> As I dont speak great spanish its difficult to check if the escritura etc are legal, I was thinking of seeking out a translator, or is it safe to entrust the legality of the documents to a lawyer?!



It sounds dodgy to me - in fact I wouldnt advise anyone to even attempt to buy in spain til they've lived there, understand how it works and know someone who can at least translate - maybe I've heard too many horror stories, but when theres such a lot of money at stake and its a known minefield.........!!

I dont know much but I thought the habitation licence was essential once the first time owner sells???? 

Jo xxx


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

jojo said:


> It sounds dodgy to me - in fact I wouldnt advise anyone to even attempt to buy in spain til they've lived there, understand how it works and know someone who can at least translate - maybe I've heard too many horror stories, but when theres such a lot of money at stake and its a known minefield.........!!
> 
> I dont know much but I thought the habitation licence was essential once the first time owner sells????
> 
> Jo xxx



The agents we are using in Extremadura have said exactly this. They have found 15 houses for us to view on top of what they already have. They are now investigating the status of each one. Condition of sale is that there is a habitation licence etc etc.

I have to agree about living there first, that is why we could have bought earlier in the year, but chose not to until we are there, it appears that most sales are fairly quick so no rush. We have our own Lawyer in the area who speaks English


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

cambio said:


> The agents we are using in Extremadura have said exactly this. They have found 15 houses for us to view on top of what they already have. They are now investigating the status of each one. Condition of sale is that there is a habitation licence etc etc.
> 
> I have to agree about living there first, that is why we could have bought earlier in the year, but chose not to until we are there, it appears that most sales are fairly quick so no rush. We have our own Lawyer in the area who speaks English



I agree too - thats why we are here, have rented a villa for 6 months to have a good look around. Truth is we have been here for a month and have found this house when we weren't really looking, certainly before we planned to, we just saw it and its perfect for us so we dont want to miss out. However if it turns out to be dodgy I will drop it like a stone! Have consulted an independent lawyer for a definative answer, will let you know what he says in case anyone finds themselves in this situation in the future.


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## donz (May 5, 2010)

Madliz said:


> This was private healthcare. ¡España es diferente! There have been discussions on the forum about this before - basically, if the patient is confined to bed and wants anything non-medical (laptop plugging in, teeth brushed, etc.,) the accompanying friend or relative assists. If not, the nurses don't do that sort of thing and the patient's life is not a happy one.


Then I must have been very lucky for the 4 days I was in Xanit hospital - I had every bit of help I needed when my other half was not about


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi, my lawyer and the vendor and I had a meeting yesterday and it was agreed that the vendor would not cancel the electric supply, he would keep it going and then we will switch over to my name upon completion, my lawyer said this would save any hassle with them asking for a habitation licence, as its just a name change not a new supply.... does this sound ok?
> 
> As I dont speak great spanish its difficult to check if the escritura etc are legal, I was thinking of seeking out a translator, or is it safe to entrust the legality of the documents to a lawyer?!



Oh dear! Your lawyer is WRONG.

To change the name, the new owner must enter into a contract with the electricity company. This requires all the documents I mentioned - the main one being the boletin.

Why not get your lawyer to call the electricity company and have them put it all in writing!

I know this from bitter experience. I bought a property to reform. Naively, I left the electricity in someone else's name and simply changed my bank details. Several years on and no building licence, I wanted to cancel the electric so that I didn't keep paying the monthly charges. I was told that I needed to get the contract owner to consent to the cancellation. It turns out that the contract owner last owned the building in the 60's!

Mentioned that I did not know who he was and in all probability he would now be dead. (strangely) I was told that I MUST get his signature! The only other way that I could do it was to get the supply into my name. This would involve providing a bolletin and the licence. As no one could live in the building in it's current condition this would be impossible. The only other way was to get a "builder's supply" - but this would only last for a short period.

Anyway, with all the hassle, given that I just wanted them to remove the meter, they told me to stop paying and I would be cut off anyway. .......


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> Oh dear! Your lawyer is WRONG.
> 
> To change the name, the new owner must enter into a contract with the electricity company. This requires all the documents I mentioned - the main one being the boletin.
> 
> ...


Hi, thanks for the information, what a minefield this is! The owner offered to leave it in his name but my lawyer said no, thats not a good idea, we'll put in in the new owners name! I am seeing my lawyer on Tuesday so will ask for confirmation of the change of name in writing before I complete on the purchase. Thanks for the advice


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

Hi everyone, I have asked my lawyer (well, the one recommended by the agent, but we have not actually appointed anyone yet) about the need for a habitation licence on the old campo house I am hoping to buy in Malaga, and he has come up with the response below..... can anyone tell me, if, based on your own knowledge and experience, they agree or not with his statement..... thanks for your help 
*"The so called “cedula de habitabilidad” disappeared in Andalucia in 1987, and was substituted by the so called “Licencia de Primera Ocupacion”, which is not applicable to rural properties, as they would not comply with the legal & technical requirements".*


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## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

Our house is 150 years old, we got electricity without a first habitation licence and none of my friends in the campo have one either. They sometimes ask for a certificate of antiquity in lieu.


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

country boy said:


> Our house is 150 years old, we got electricity without a first habitation licence and none of my friends in the campo have one either. They sometimes ask for a certificate of antiquity in lieu.


Mine is the same as yours. All I did after completion was went around electric & water companies with the previous owner & the readings, he paid up to date & then it was just changed into my name/bank details.Admittedly that was 12 years ago but I know of 2 that sold in the last 3 years where it was done in the same way.


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## donz (May 5, 2010)

me too, we are in an old finca, have not needed a licence, the water and electricity got changed into our names by my lawyer


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

Hi everyone, well our house purchase in Almogia, Anddalucia, is going through. A couple of things have cropped up that I'm being told aren't a major problem, but wanted to ask your advice before we go any further....
1. The new well at the property has not been registered - apparently we can do this when we move in, and its not a major hassle....true??!!
2. The size of the house is slightly different on the escritura (160 sq mtrs) to the cadastral (142 sq mtrs) .... because of this discrepancy the town hall in Almogia wont issue a Licence of no infraction without opening an enquiry. My lawyer has confirmed there are no demolition orders or outstanding debts on the property, its just this size difference thats causing the problem. We have measured the house and the 142sq mtrs to be accurate. Again, I'm being told these discrepancies are common and we can get the 2 figures unified at some point in the future if we wish.

I know buying a campo property it was never going to be perfect, but what I'm asking is, how big a deal are these things.....to be (concerned) or not to be??!! Thanks everyone....


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

I would say the well might be an issue, but there again, it might not. What if it is an issue and you are told to fill it in?

Regarding the discrepancy of size, we've found that the escrituras are always quite fictional! One of ours mentions all sorts of things that simply are not true - mentioned them to the notary but he wasn't in the least bit concerned. He said it was quite normal.


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> I would say the well might be an issue, but there again, it might not. What if it is an issue and you are told to fill it in?
> 
> Regarding the discrepancy of size, we've found that the escrituras are always quite fictional! One of ours mentions all sorts of things that simply are not true - mentioned them to the notary but he wasn't in the least bit concerned. He said it was quite normal.


Hi snikpoh, thanks for your reply, if we have to fill in the well we might get mains water as our neighbour has it. Is that the worst case scenario, or do they impose big fines for wells with no permission to?

I guess the sizes not matching isnt a problem until we come to sell. If we do decide to go to the town hall to get the sizes unified they will come and inspect the house, and I know the current owner has done works without permission, so I guess we could be looking at fines for that (he has had a new roof, electrics, new bathroom, new porch and external rendering). As far as I know they have never been out there, so do they just fine you for anything that looks quite new?


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi snikpoh, thanks for your reply, if we have to fill in the well we might get mains water as our neighbour has it. Is that the worst case scenario, or do they impose big fines for wells with no permission to?
> 
> I guess the sizes not matching isnt a problem until we come to sell. If we do decide to go to the town hall to get the sizes unified they will come and inspect the house, and I know the current owner has done works without permission, so I guess we could be looking at fines for that (he has had a new roof, electrics, new bathroom, new porch and external rendering). As far as I know they have never been out there, so do they just fine you for anything that looks quite new?


I would ask your water company first of all for an estimate (and likelihood) to connect you to mains. Then, if the worst happens, you know what this option will cost.

There may well (ha, ha) be fines, but I can't imagine them being too great.

Regarding the things he's done without notification of license - I think they will all be ignored with the exception (maybe) of the porch. In all likely hood, the notary will be able to change the 160 to 142 without any issue at all.

However, when you say you've measured the house, have you taken EVERYTHING into consideration - like external patios, area under or in porch? They all count.


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> I would ask your water company first of all for an estimate (and likelihood) to connect you to mains. Then, if the worst happens, you know what this option will cost.
> 
> There may well (ha, ha) be fines, but I can't imagine them being too great.
> 
> ...


Hi, just had a meeting with our lawyer, turns out the well is registered after all! 

You make a good point about the size, I hadnt taken the porch covering the patio into account, that would make it 160 sq mtrs as per the escritura. The patio and porch covering it are relatively new additions.

I now understand from my lawyer that the house is on protected land and was first registered in 2001, after the act of 1997 that protected the land, and thats what may cause us problems.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi, just had a meeting with our lawyer, turns out the well is registered after all!
> 
> You make a good point about the size, I hadnt taken the porch covering the patio into account, that would make it 160 sq mtrs as per the escritura. The patio and porch covering it are relatively new additions.
> 
> I now understand from my lawyer that the house is on protected land and was first registered in 2001, after the act of 1997 that protected the land, and thats what may cause us problems.




... sorry to say ....

Start running!


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> ... sorry to say ....
> 
> Start running!


Really?? 

Just to clarify, the house was built in 1900, the cadastral and escritura confirms that, but the registration date (when it was first registered on the land registry) is 2001. Should I still be preparing to do my Usain Bolt impression?! Thanks for the honest advice, really appreciate it


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

Hi all, just looking for any words of wisdom really, as we have to make a final decision on buying this house in Almogia tomorrow. The situation is.... 

1. It has an escritura, nota simple and is on the cadastral 
2. Built in 1900 (confirmed on escritura and cadastral)
3. It is on protected land 
4. Registered on the cadastral in 2001 (after the protected land act came in to being in 1997). 
5. The build size on the escritura is 160sq mtrs, on the cadastral is 142sq mtrs. The only new addition since the house was built is the patio/ porch covering the patio. 
5. The current owner has done some work without permission (including above patio/ porch, a new roof, external rendering, new bathroom, and electrics).

Does anyone have any knowledge of what sort of fines can be imposed for doing work on a property on protected land without permission? The house is lovely and we are prepared to take on a certain amount of future fines for this sort of thing but I have no idea how much to expect.... 

We are close to walking away from it because of the protected land thing, the size difference (the ayuntamiento wont issue a certificate of no infraction because of the size difference), and because there will be fines for work done without permission. Any ideas or comments out there very welcome.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi all, just looking for any words of wisdom really, as we have to make a final decision on buying this house in Almogia tomorrow. The situation is....
> 
> 1. It has an escritura, nota simple and is on the cadastral
> 2. Built in 1900 (confirmed on escritura and cadastral)
> ...



I have no knowledge as we are only moving in a few weeks. but if you are asking questions already about what the fines might be, alarm bells would be ringing in my head, the last thing I would want to do would to knowingly buy a house that had already had issues , no house, location or view IMHO is worth sleepless nights. However I have to repeat, we have not bought yet, so the questions you have posed may well have reasonable and straightforward answers. Good luck, its an interesting post for those of us not involved to learn, but not so good for you wish you well x


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

cambio said:


> I have no knowledge as we are only moving in a few weeks. but if you are asking questions already about what the fines might be, alarm bells would be ringing in my head, the last thing I would want to do would to knowingly buy a house that had already had issues , no house, location or view IMHO is worth sleepless nights. However I have to repeat, we have not bought yet, so the questions you have posed may well have reasonable and straightforward answers. Good luck, its an interesting post for those of us not involved to learn, but not so good for you wish you well x


Hi Cambio, I know what you are saying and before I came out here I would have said the same thing!! I am learning fast that over here, if you want a campo property its very rare that everything is 100% straight. Apparently its a minor miracle that its on the cadastral at all!! My lawyer has told me that, although not perfect, its as good as you will find in the campo. My hesitation is because, like you, I wanted it 100% perfect from a legal point of view. I guess there are lots of things that can be wrong, and we are trying to evaluate whats vital to have (escritura, cadastral, nota simple) and whats not so vital. We have negotiated a good price on the house to allow us to put some cash aside for future fines if they occur. We are complete novices at this and this whole process is a valuable learning curve. This forum is invaluable for getting advice from those who have trod this path before, so thanks to everyone for your contributions, past and future


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## Madliz (Feb 4, 2011)

It sounds like you've done as much homework as possible and have built in an amount to cover possible fines. I have no experience of these fines so have no idea how much they may be (if they catch you), but cannot imagine they'd be crippling or we would all have heard of them before! I don't know of anyone who has applied for a license to do work inside their house. How would the ayuntamiento know?

You've found the house you want, it seems to be the price you want, the house is legal so you won't face having it demolished - I would proceed and may you be very happy there. It's certainly a lovely part of the world.


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

Madliz said:


> It sounds like you've done as much homework as possible and have built in an amount to cover possible fines. I have no experience of these fines so have no idea how much they may be (if they catch you), but cannot imagine they'd be crippling or we would all have heard of them before! I don't know of anyone who has applied for a license to do work inside their house. How would the ayuntamiento know?
> 
> You've found the house you want, it seems to be the price you want, the house is legal so you won't face having it demolished - I would proceed and may you be very happy there. It's certainly a lovely part of the world.


Hi Madliz, thanks for your message and kind words. We have indeed tried to do as much research as possible as campo properties can be a nightmare and we dont want to get caught out. I guess there is always a degree of risk involved, I'm just trying to make sure its minimal!! thanks for the advice


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## tony-harrison (Feb 15, 2014)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi all, I'm new to the forum and would be grateful for any advice you might be able to offer on the idea of buying a house in the campo near Malaga...
> 
> We left the UK a few weeks ago and are renting a villa inland from Malaga at the moment, in order to get to know the place well before we commit to buying anything. We are not intending to rent it out and dont need a mortgage, we are in it for the long term so we dont intend selling it in the forseeable future, we will be living in it most of the time just going back to england for 3 to 5 months each year. So my questions are
> 
> ...





My Advice is don't buy anything in Spain unless you are 100% certain that the property you are thinking of buying fully legal, and even then be prepared to find out later that it is not legal and is worthless.

This has happened to me on boxing day this year ( 2014 ) our property of 12 years was fully legal, bought with every thing checked, we have the escritures ( deeds ) paying taxes etc. 

If I were you I would think about buying in another country.

Regards Tony Harrison.


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## Spangles 72 (Oct 30, 2013)

tony-harrison said:


> My Advice is don't buy anything in Spain unless you are 100% certain that the property you are thinking of buying fully legal, and even then be prepared to find out later that it is not legal and is worthless.
> 
> This has happened to me on boxing day this year ( 2014 ) our property of 12 years was fully legal, bought with every thing checked, we have the escritures ( deeds ) paying taxes etc.
> 
> ...


Hi Tony, thanks for your message. I'm really sorry to hear about whats happened to you. Can you give us some more details, such as location of the house, how old it is, is it on urban or rustic land. and what problems have arisen? Why are they saying its not legal and what are the implications for you?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Spangles 72 said:


> Hi Tony, thanks for your message. I'm really sorry to hear about whats happened to you. Can you give us some more details, such as location of the house, how old it is, is it on urban or rustic land. and what problems have arisen? Why are they saying its not legal and what are the implications for you?


I'm guessing it's this http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...ng-spain/299274-building-licence-revoked.html


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