# Cancel medicare ??



## surfrider

Just an open question about weather or not a U.S. citizen should cancel their medicare premium payments from their social security check? if you are never going back to the U.S. why pay for something you can not receive?


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## Isla Verde

surfrider said:


> Just an open question about weather or not a U.S. citizen should cancel their medicare premium payments from their social security check? if you are never going back to the U.S. why pay for something you can not receive?


I was already living in Mexico when I became eligible for Medicare and was given the option of opting out of Part B, which is what I did. If you are sure you're never going back to the US to live, it seems like the logical thing to do.


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## chicois8

Never say never!


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## Isla Verde

chicois8 said:


> Never say never!


Well, then, now about highly unlikely?


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## pappabee

Isla Verde said:


> I was already living in Mexico when I became eligible for Medicare and was given the option of opting out of Part B, which is what I did. If you are sure you're never going back to the US to live, it seems like the logical thing to do.


I'm sorry but I must disagree. Medicare is very good major medical coverage and at about $90 US it's very reasonable. If you can qualify for IMSS or afford independent cove rate then IMHO it's fine to drop Medicare. But if you can't get IMSS or can't afford individual coverage then it's a good major medical coverage.

At least you know that you can return to the states and get into a hospital if needed.


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## Isla Verde

pappabee said:


> I'm sorry but I must disagree. Medicare is very good major medical coverage and at about $90 US it's very reasonable. If you can qualify for IMSS or afford independent cove rate then IMHO it's fine to drop Medicare. But if you can't get IMSS or can't afford individual coverage then it's a good major medical coverage.
> 
> At least you know that you can return to the states and get into a hospital if needed.


I have private coverage here in Mexico. If I didn't, I would sign up for IMSS, of course.


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## surfrider

Isla Verde said:


> I have private coverage here in Mexico. If I didn't, I would sign up for IMSS, of course.


how do you sign up for imss and what is it?


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## Isla Verde

surfrider said:


> how do you sign up for imss and what is it?


IMSS = Instituto Mexicano del Seguro Social or the Mexican Social Security System. I believe you go to your local office to sign up once you are living in Mexico. You need to have a residence visa to be eligible, and you pay a very reasonable yearly fee. I don't have the details at my fingertips since I haven't done it myself. Perhaps someone who has will be able to offer more detailed information.


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## makaloco

surfrider said:


> Just an open question about weather or not a U.S. citizen should cancel their medicare premium payments from their social security check? if you are never going back to the U.S. why pay for something you can not receive?


Be aware before canceling Part B that if you do ever move back to the US and need to reinstate it, there may be a penalty in addition to whatever the monthly premium is by then. At least that's the case for not enrolling when one is initially eligible, so it may also apply to cancellation. Definitely worth looking into.

I haven't lived in the US for more than 30 years and have no plans to live there again, but I enrolled in Part B so as not to risk the penalty. I can better afford $100 /mo now than (say) double whatever the premium may be ten years from now. I do, of course, also have coverage for Mexico.


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## pappabee

Isla Verde said:


> IMSS = Instituto Mexicano del Seguro Social or the Mexican Social Security System. I believe you go to your local office to sign up once you are living in Mexico. You need to have a residence visa to be eligible, and you pay a very reasonable yearly fee. I don't have the details at my fingertips since I haven't done it myself. Perhaps someone who has will be able to offer more detailed information.


The problem with IMSS, at least here at Lakeside, is you can't get it if you have any health problems. At one time they would allow you to get it but with hold coverage for pre-existing conditions. Now they just will not cover you for anything. I have spoken to someone who had gout and was refused coverage. I have spoken to people who have had shingles and were refused. And don't you try if you've got diabetes, heart problems, high blood pressure or anything else. 

If you don't need it you might be able to get it.


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## TundraGreen

pappabee said:


> The problem with IMSS, at least here at Lakeside, is you can't get it if you have any health problems. At one time they would allow you to get it but with hold coverage for pre-existing conditions. Now they just will not cover you for anything. I have spoken to someone who had gout and was refused coverage. I have spoken to people who have had shingles and were refused. And don't you try if you've got diabetes, heart problems, high blood pressure or anything else.
> 
> If you don't need it you might be able to get it.


Do you mean, if you don't need it NOW, you might be able to get it? Then you have it for when you will need it. 

That is pretty much what I am doing. I am generally healthy but occasionally use IMSS for stuff and it is there for when (not if) I get into trouble. It is cheap enough that it is good insurance even if I decide to use some other source of medical care as well, like directly paying for something. Also it is all over Mexico, so carrying the booklet with me when I travel, makes it easy to know where to go if something happens when I am away from home.


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## joaquinx

pappabee said:


> The problem with IMSS, at least here at Lakeside, is you can't get it if you have any health problems. At one time they would allow you to get it but with hold coverage for pre-existing conditions. Now they just will not cover you for anything. I have spoken to someone who had gout and was refused coverage. I have spoken to people who have had shingles and were refused. And don't you try if you've got diabetes, heart problems, high blood pressure or anything else.
> 
> If you don't need it you might be able to get it.


I believe that there is a waiting period for pre-existing conditions. Insurance companies in the US won't cover pre-existing conditions, why should we expect IMSS to cover them. 

This smacks of "I'll wait until I'm sick to apply. Why pay for medical coverage if I don't need it today?"


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## pappabee

joaquinx said:


> I believe that there is a waiting period for pre-existing conditions. Insurance companies in the US won't cover pre-existing conditions, why should we expect IMSS to cover them.
> 
> This smacks of "I'll wait until I'm sick to apply. Why pay for medical coverage if I don't need it today?"


The problem is not that it will not cover pre-existing conditions. The problem is that with ANY pre-existing conditions you can not get it.


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## joaquinx

pappabee said:


> The problem is not that it will not cover pre-existing conditions. The problem is that with ANY pre-existing conditions you can not get it.


Is this from personal experience with IMSS or hearsay?


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## pappabee

joaquinx said:


> Is this from personal experience with IMSS or hearsay?


Both, I went to IMSS and told them that I was diabetic and I was told not even to apply because I would not be accepted. I have spoken to many people here at Lakeside that had the same experiences. Now this might only be the IMSS here at Chapala but since a very large number of Lakeside residents are over 50 many are finding that IMSS is not available to them.


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## joaquinx

pappabee said:


> Both, I went to IMSS and told them that I was diabetic and I was told not even to apply because I would not be accepted. I have spoken to many people here at Lakeside that had the same experiences. Now this might only be the IMSS here at Chapala but since a very large number of Lakeside residents are over 50 many are finding that IMSS is not available to them.


I wonder if this is because IMSS is in trouble for lack of complete funding. Excluding old gringos could be a way to save money in order to treat the old Mexicans. 

I have thought about joining IMSS here in Xalapa, but I like my current heart doctor and don't want to change. Even if I did, I would have to wait a year or so because of the pre-existing condition. Not trying to be smug, but I can afford a private doctor and the medication he prescribes. (700 pesos per visit every three months and 1,200 pesos per month for the medications.) A few months ago, I was hospitalized for a kidney problem and the difference in hospitalization in the US and Mexico is baffling at times. The care was excellent and the cost was low (12,000 pesos for four days). They won't let you out until the bill is paid. Hospital medications are purchased outside the hospital at a local pharmacy by a friend or relative.


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## mickisue1

joaquinx said:


> I wonder if this is because IMSS is in trouble for lack of complete funding. Excluding old gringos could be a way to save money in order to treat the old Mexicans.
> 
> I have thought about joining IMSS here in Xalapa, but I like my current heart doctor and don't want to change. Even if I did, I would have to wait a year or so because of the pre-existing condition. Not trying to be smug, but I can afford a private doctor and the medication he prescribes. (700 pesos per visit every three months and 1,200 pesos per month for the medications.) A few months ago, I was hospitalized for a kidney problem and the difference in hospitalization in the US and Mexico is baffling at times. The care was excellent and the cost was low (12,000 pesos for four days). They won't let you out until the bill is paid. Hospital medications are purchased outside the hospital at a local pharmacy by a friend or relative.


Baffling is putting it mildly.

But this isn't the Bash the US healthcare forum, so I'll leave it at that.

I will say, though, that for me, moving to another country WILL be for good.

I will return to the US for visits, but not to live. Because of that, and the horrendous cost of healthcare in the US, I will, at least as I currently plan it, NOT buy into Medicare part B, but have some sort of temporary Out of Country plan when I'm visiting the US.


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## edgeee

At least i now know i can not count on using IMSS.

I'm pretty sure the comment by pappabee,
"If you don't need it you might be able to get it"
is a direct reflection of the real world.

Just like the banks tell you,
you can easily get a loan if you really don't need the money.
But if you do need it, forget it.


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## TundraGreen

edgeee said:


> At least i now know i can not count on using IMSS.
> 
> I'm pretty sure the comment by pappabee,
> "If you don't need it you might be able to get it"
> is a direct reflection of the real world.
> 
> Just like the banks tell you,
> you can easily get a loan if you really don't need the money.
> But if you do need it, forget it.


The only qualification I would add is that Pappabee is in Ajijic where, apparently, the large population of aging Estadounidenses and Canadians is impacting IMSS heavily. In other areas, the situation may be different.

Also this idea that you only pay for medical coverage when you need it is strange. That is fine if you are on a "pay as you go for your own expenses", but it makes no sense at all for a shared expense system like IMSS. Hopefully, lots of people who don't need it NOW are subscribing. And like Micki Sue, I will skip the analogous discussion for the US.


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## surfrider

I think that you are right - think that the lakeside people have really put a dent into the "Mexican" society here not only in medical requirements but traffic - housing etc. Not too sure that the Mexicans here like the change either. On the out side they say "Ya its great - it gives money and jobs to the community BUT in private I do not hear them saying like the changes that have taken place. We even had one lady go and shut off the loud speaker system at the church cause she did not like to hear mass every day. Boy was that Priest ticked off. I do not think that the Priest would agree that this lady should be on their medical system.


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## pappabee

TundraGreen said:


> The only qualification I would add is that Pappabee is in Ajijic where, apparently, the large population of aging Estadounidenses and Canadians is impacting IMSS heavily. In other areas, the situation may be different.
> 
> Also this idea that you only pay for medical coverage when you need it is strange. That is fine if you are on a "pay as you go for your own expenses", but it makes no sense at all for a shared expense system like IMSS. Hopefully, lots of people who don't need it NOW are subscribing. And like Micki Sue, I will skip the analogous discussion for the US.


Also like most Mexican Government Operations the decision to yes or no is up to the local manager. That person in Chapala (the local office for Lakeside) is running a very hard line. I heard of one man who was denied coverage due to his broken leg. He was told that after the leg was completely mended he could re apply.


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## surfrider

that is silly. that is not about the medical program but something else entirelly


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## Detailman

pappabee said:


> The problem with IMSS, at least here at Lakeside, is you can't get it if you have any health problems. At one time they would allow you to get it but with hold coverage for pre-existing conditions. Now they just will not cover you for anything. I have spoken to someone who had gout and was refused coverage. I have spoken to people who have had shingles and were refused. And don't you try if you've got diabetes, heart problems, high blood pressure or anything else.
> 
> If you don't need it you might be able to get it.


Works just like the banks, doesn't it? If you don't need the money they want to give it to you along with LOC's, credit cards, OD protection, and anything else they can think of. Along with their fees of course.

But if you really do need money, everything changes. WHO ARE YOU AGAIN??


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## Detailman

edgeee said:


> At least i now know i can not count on using IMSS.
> 
> I'm pretty sure the comment by pappabee,
> "If you don't need it you might be able to get it"
> is a direct reflection of the real world.
> 
> Just like the banks tell you,
> you can easily get a loan if you really don't need the money.
> But if you do need it, forget it.


I hadn't read as far as your post when I made a similar one based on Papabees comment. That's how it works!


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## pappabee

surfrider said:


> I think that you are right - think that the lakeside people have really put a dent into the "Mexican" society here not only in medical requirements but traffic - housing etc. Not too sure that the Mexicans here like the change either. On the out side they say "Ya its great - it gives money and jobs to the community BUT in private I do not hear them saying like the changes that have taken place. *First of all a statement like this is just like asking "do you still beat your wife" There is no proof or validity. How many Mexicans do you hear talking in private? * We even had one lady go and shut off the loud speaker system at the church cause she did not like to hear mass every day. *This statement makes me wonder because the vast majority of Mexicans are Catholic and therefor Mass is very important to them. And why bring it up anyway it has not purpose in this post. * Boy was that Priest ticked off. I do not think that the Priest would agree that this lady should be on their medical system.


No one is completely sure why the Chapala office is so strict but it is. There have been complaints filed and the manager was, at one time, under investigation. I don't know if that is still on going. 

Something that you might consider is that all over the world in areas where expats (of any country) live the cost of living has gone up. Not just in Mexico.


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## pappabee

surfrider said:


> that is silly. that is not about the medical program but something else entirelly


What is it then???????????


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## TundraGreen

surfrider said:


> that is silly. that is not about the medical program but something else entirelly


I am getting lost in this conversation. What is silly?


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## TundraGreen

pappabee said:


> ...
> Something that you might consider is that all over the world in areas where expats (of any country) live the cost of living has gone up. Not just in Mexico.


Yup. I hear Seattleites complaining about Californians. If that is important to you, the solution is to go somewhere that others don't. Lots of us on this board live in areas where foreigners like us are few and far between.


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## pappabee

TundraGreen said:


> Yup. I hear Seattleites complaining about Californians. If that is important to you, the solution is to go somewhere that others don't. Lots of us on this board live in areas where foreigners like us are few and far between.


Yep, and a lot of us live in expat communities. It's one of the beauties of Mexico that you can live as native or as part of an expat area, what ever tickles your funny bone.


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## edgeee

sorry if i'm picking a nit, but Will, couldn't you just say 'American'
so i wouldn't have to google 
Estadounidenses?
just wondering.


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## Detailman

edgeee said:


> sorry if i'm picking a nit, but Will, couldn't you just say 'American'
> so i wouldn't have to google
> Estadounidenses?
> just wondering.


But you always say that you want to learn new things?? Did you change your mind?  

I looked it up and despite the fact that I will probably never use it myself I will now recognize its meaning when I see it used. Wonderful!


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## edgeee

Detailman said:


> But you always say that you want to learn new things?? Did you change your mind?
> 
> I looked it up and despite the fact that I will probably never use it myself I will now recognize its meaning when I see it used. Wonderful!


You are correct sir.
I withdraw my complaint, tho i wasn't really complaining.
However, i wonder when i will ever see the word again outside this context.


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## Detailman

edgeee said:


> You are correct sir.
> I withdraw my complaint, tho i wasn't really complaining.
> However, i wonder when i will ever see the word again outside this context.


I really don't know but if it happens both of us will say "haha" - I know what that means.


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## TundraGreen

edgeee said:


> sorry if i'm picking a nit, but Will, couldn't you just say 'American'
> so i wouldn't have to google
> Estadounidenses?
> just wondering.


For those who didn't look it up, and don't know some Spanish, "estadounidense" is Spanish for someone from the Estados Unidos, or the US. 

The problem is that English doesn't have a word for someone from the US. "American" is very commonly used, but in reality everyone from any of the countries in North, South and Central America is American. And many of the residents of those other countries resent the fact that the US has appropriated that term. 

I am uncomfortable using the word American to mean people from the US, hence my use of the unfamiliar term.


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## joaquinx

TundraGreen said:


> The problem is that English doesn't have a word for someone from the US. "American" is very commonly used, but in reality everyone from any of the countries in North, South and Central America is American. And many of the residents of those other countries resent the fact that the US has appropriated that term.


It seems that everyone in the world calls us Americans except for those who speak Spanish.


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## surfrider

pappabee said:


> Also like most Mexican Government Operations the decision to yes or no is up to the local manager. That person in Chapala (the local office for Lakeside) is running a very hard line.
> First of all a statement like this is just like asking "do you still beat your wife"Th ere is no proof or validity.
> I heard of one man who was denied coverage due to his broken leg. He was told that after the leg was completely mended he could re apply.


There is no proof or validity.

Now is there anything else that I wrote that makes you mad? Anything else you wish to throw?:boxing:


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## cuylers5746

*Imss*



surfrider said:


> how do you sign up for imss and what is it?


Hi Surfrider;

If you're over 60 the IMSS rate this year is about $3300.00 pesos/ year. It goes up each year a little with inflation rate. I've been on it for over 12 years, since my 50's. It's pretty incredibly $0 Deductible, $0 Co-payment, $0 for Drugs, $0 for all Lab Tests. In 12 years, my out of pocket costs with IMSS has been $0.00!

I highly recommend it for anyone who travels a lot or visits Mexico a lot of lives here, even if you rarely use it. If you get caught in some accident in some major city like D.F. or T.J. you could run up a bill in a hospital about 50-70% of what it might cost in USA. OUCH! I suggest people to get on it immediately after moving here - as now they are doing exclusions for major problems. Don't wait until you get re-occuring medical problems. Get in early.

If first got on it as like a Travel/Accident Medical Policy - that's how I used it. I only paid like $170.00 USD equivalent for that age bracket in my 50's back then. It was cheaper than any private travel policy. That's why I got it.

It covers you anywhere in Mexico, even out of the way places like Mulege, Baja Sur, where they have a little clinic. They at least in the most out of the villages in Mexico have a recent Medical School Graduate manning the clinic. Mexico Medical Delivery is so far Superior to the USA it's not even in the same league. Doctor's in Mexico are not issued their final Medical License until they've put in one year of free service to the Govt. = IMSS or ISSTE.

Now, I use it regularly in our mid 60's. Only thing that kind of bugs me, is that you HAVE to go in each month to see your Doctor. He/she will take your vital signs, in our case spend about 30 minutes with the two of us making sure we're in top health, weight correct and asking about any problems. Then you get your "free Generic Medicines". We've found some excellent Doctors, I love our Doctorcita! Very sharp. Like in the USA, if you don't like the Doctor they assign to you, you can change - like we did.

IMSS regularly employs some of the top local "Specialists". In Capital cities, where they have a Medical School, like in Tepic they have a dirth of Doctors. Even top Specialists work part of the day for IMSS while maintaining their private practice. My wife had to visit a Otho Specialist on the outside for a very specific Speciality. We had to pay $800 pesos for the consultation. She later got an appointment with the same Doctor for $0.00 co-payment, $0 Deductible at IMSS! But, like HMO's in USA if you don't have an Emergency you could be waiting 6-9 weeks to see your Specialist.

In hospital Nursing treatment is not as good as USA. You need an avocate there, like your spouse or loved one spending the night by bedside, as they don't staff enough nurses like in the USA. I heard of one fellow that had to bring is own pillow after a operation. But, everyone that I know who was hospitalized or had surgery at IMSS was very satisfied by the outcomes and Medical treatment.

IMSS has one of the latest up todate Heart Specialist Hospitals in Guadalajara now.

You have to learn the system, like anywhere and get it working to your advantage.


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## surfrider

cuylers5746 said:


> Hi Surfrider;
> 
> If you're over 60 the IMSS rate this year is about $3300.00 pesos/ year. It goes up each year a little with inflation rate. I've been on it for over 12 years, since my 50's. It's pretty incredibly $0 Deductible, $0 Co-payment, $0 for Drugs, $0 for all Lab Tests. In 12 years, my out of pocket costs with IMSS has been $0.00!
> 
> I highly recommend it for anyone who travels a lot or visits Mexico a lot of lives here, even if you rarely use it. If you get caught in some accident in some major city like D.F. or T.J. you could run up a bill in a hospital about 50-70% of what it might cost in USA. OUCH! I suggest people to get on it immediately after moving here - as now they are doing exclusions for major problems. Don't wait until you get re-occuring medical problems. Get in early.
> 
> If first got on it as like a Travel/Accident Medical Policy - that's how I used it. I only paid like $170.00 USD equivalent for that age bracket in my 50's back then. It was cheaper than any private travel policy. That's why I got it.
> 
> 
> It covers you anywhere in Mexico, even out of the way places like Mulege, Baja Sur, where they have a little clinic. They at least in the most out of the villages in Mexico have a recent Medical School Graduate manning the clinic. Mexico Medical Delivery is so far Superior to the USA it's not even in the same league. Doctor's in Mexico are not issued their final Medical License until they've put in one year of free service to the Govt. = IMSS or ISSTE.
> 
> Now, I use it regularly in our mid 60's. Only thing that kind of bugs me, is that you HAVE to go in each month to see your Doctor. He/she will take your vital signs, in our case spend about 30 minutes with the two of us making sure we're in top health, weight correct and asking about any problems. Then you get your "free Generic Medicines". We've found some excellent Doctors, I love our Doctorcita! Very sharp. Like in the USA, if you don't like the Doctor they assign to you, you can change - like we did.
> 
> IMSS regularly employs some of the top local "Specialists". In Capital cities, where they have a Medical School, like in Tepic they have a dirth of Doctors. Even top Specialists work part of the day for IMSS while maintaining their private practice. My wife had to visit a Otho Specialist on the outside for a very specific Speciality. We had to pay $800 pesos for the consultation. She later got an appointment with the same Doctor for $0.00 co-payment, $0 Deductible at IMSS! But, like HMO's in USA if you don't have an Emergency you could be waiting 6-9 weeks to see your Specialist.
> 
> In hospital Nursing treatment is not as good as USA. You need an avocate there, like your spouse or loved one spending the night by bedside, as they don't staff enough nurses like in the USA. I heard of one fellow that had to bring is own pillow after a operation. But, everyone that I know who was hospitalized or had surgery at IMSS was very satisfied by the outcomes and Medical treatment.
> 
> IMSS has one of the latest up todate Heart Specialist Hospitals in Guadalajara now.
> 
> You have to learn the system, like anywhere and get it working to your advantage.



WOW - what great information and you wrote in such a kind manner. Some of the people could take lessons from you. All the information you shared is very useful and lots of us will I am sure learn from it. THANK YOU. surfrider. :clap2:


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## Isla Verde

joaquinx said:


> It seems that everyone in the world calls us Americans except for those who speak Spanish.


I've had Mexicans ask me if I were "americana".


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## edgeee

TundraGreen said:


> For those who didn't look it up, and don't know some Spanish, "estadounidense" is Spanish for someone from the Estados Unidos, or the US.
> 
> The problem is that English doesn't have a word for someone from the US. "American" is very commonly used, but in reality everyone from any of the countries in North, South and Central America is American. And many of the residents of those other countries resent the fact that the US has appropriated that term.
> 
> I am uncomfortable using the word American to mean people from the US, hence my use of the unfamiliar term.


an excellent explanation.
i had not considered that perspective.
thanks for the education.


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## TundraGreen

joaquinx said:


> It seems that everyone in the world calls us Americans except for those who speak Spanish.


Could that be because nearly all the Spanish speakers also live in the Americas? No slight intended to the few that live in Spain, but they have been a minority of the Spanish speaking world for quite a while now.

A funny true story. During the PanAm Games held in Guadalajara last year, the official languages of the Games were English and Spanish. The slogan for the Games in Spanish was "Fiesta de las Americas", referring to all the countries sending teams to the Games. The official translation that was used was "America's Party". I volunteered to help with translation and interpretation for the Games. The head of the translation and interpretation group, a Mexican who grew up in New York City, was very upset with the English version of the subtitle. But the subtitle had been cast in concrete before any of the translators saw it to tell them they had blown the translation. "America's Party" is very different from "Party of the Americas".


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## Isla Verde

TundraGreen said:


> A funny true story. During the PanAm Games held in Guadalajara last year, the official languages of the Games were English and Spanish. The slogan for the Games in Spanish was "Fiesta de las Americas", referring to all the countries sending teams to the Games. The official translation that was used was "America's Party". I volunteered to help with translation and interpretation for the Games. The head of the translation and interpretation group, a Mexican who grew up in New York City, was very upset with the English version of the subtitle. But the subtitle had been cast in concrete before any of the translators saw it to tell them they had blown the translation. "America's Party" is very different from "Party of the Americas".


An excellent example of how difficult it can be to render translations that are accurate both linguistically and culturally.


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## mickisue1

pappabee said:


> No one is completely sure why the Chapala office is so strict but it is. There have been complaints filed and the manager was, at one time, under investigation. I don't know if that is still on going.
> 
> Something that you might consider is that all over the world in areas where expats (of any country) live the cost of living has gone up. Not just in Mexico.


The post you were responding to was a bit confusing, but I think surfrider was referring to a gringa who complained about the mass on loudspeaker.

I would be willing to bet that the priest wouldn't want her benefiting from the society that she disdains, as well.


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## Bajaceresa

I've had the opposite experience with IMSS. I understand there are at least two types of IMSS insurance. One is for all Mexicans and the other, the one I have, is for workers. I am not Mexican but I do have a working visa. I had a brain tumor removed in the States and was saddled with $200K in debt when my private US insurer declared the tumor to be a pre-existing condition. Beware this type of insurance company - but that's another story. I signed up for IMSS a year after my surgery. The process took about a month here in Los Cabos from start to finish. I had to have a blood test (at no charge) and a brief interview with a doctor who asked me a few questions, none of them relating to past health history, all of them answered honestly. He saw the blood test results showing high cholesterol. My application was approved. I am 59 years old and paid around 2600 pesos, or $240 for the annual premium. Once my insurance became effective, I was told to have a consultation with a doctor who did ask about my health history. The doctor wrote a prescription to treat the high cholesterol. I picked up the medication at the hospital pharmacy, again at no charge. The doctor also referred me to a specialist to followup on the tumor surgery. He is scheduling the requisite tests at an IMSS hospital in La Paz, about 120 miles from here because CAT scans are not available at local IMSS facilities. I will probably elect to pay the $100/mo. Medicare premium when I am eligible, but my partner who is 69 years old has elected not to pay for Medicare and instead purchases private Mexican insurance.


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## surfrider

If I am reading through this site picking out the topic of do you drop medicare and what to do about insurance in Mexico for health, I think that it looks like WHERE and HOW you apply for the IMSS Mexican ins. is a real determining factor in really getting coverage. Also it may have something to do with the WHEN (as in what year - current or 10 years ago).

I went into the old county general hospital in Guadalajara at 10AM one morning. I sat in the emergency room and was looked at here and there. During this time I talked with this lady about her child and being an expat in Mexico = she had lived here for several years but was from the US.
I told her that I really did not have a bunch of cash for an operation and she told me to give her my paperwork. I stayed with her daughter in the emergency room while she took my papers from ER and when she came back she told me that I would not have to pay anything.
At 10PM that night, I went in for emergency surgery (after waiting 12 hours..) The surgery was fine and after I went into a room with several other people and spent the next day there. My complete bill for everything was Fourteen US Dollars. 14.00 not 1,400 or 14,000. I have no idea what that lady did or how she did it but I was very glad that she did. I have no health insurance, I lost it when I came to Mexico. I do have medicare - but only the free medicare part for hospital care.

I am lakeside in Chapala and what I have to look at is getting some kind of coverage here. I also have my son with me and between the two of us our monthly prescriptions are 600.00 USD. My son is disabled so he has some expensive drugs. I am quite sure that IMSS would not cover him but at least I am going to try to get it to cover MY drugs. 

Any suggestions on how to get his drugs at a reduced cost? I have tried about every pharmacy around. He does pay medicare for a special medicare coverage. . . which he does not use here but they still deduct it fro his social security check.


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## kazslo

I never even considered signing up for IMSS - anytime I hear insurance I think big $$$. But these posts made me look into it further, and wow, I can't believe the cost (at least on the surface it seems CHEAP). This page gives a pretty good summary: El IMSS da una opción para los no asegurados | Libertad de Palabra

Age...Yearly Cost

0-19 $1371.25
20-39 $1602.60
40-59 $2395.40
60+ $3604.70

Cost is in pesos, per year, and each year it changes. The site also lists pre-existing issues which make you ineligable. My wife's kids have imss through their dad, and we've always had a good experience when they need to see a doctor...$0 out of pocket, $0 for the medicine. I'm not even close to medicare age yet, so I can't chime in my opinion, but for anyone looking for health insurance in Mexico and without the pre-existing conditions this looks to be a great option.


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## TundraGreen

Bajaceresa said:


> I've had the opposite experience with IMSS. I understand there are at least two types of IMSS insurance. One is for all Mexicans and the other, the one I have, is for workers. ...


Just one point of clarification...
There are not two types of IMSS. There is just one IMSS. Most of the subscribers are people who get it through their work as Bajaceresa says. Then there is a separate system called Seguro Popular that covers people not getting IMSS. There is also ISSSTE which covers government employees.

In contrast to most stories told here, I did not have any physical exam prior to getting IMSS coverage. I just had to answer questions on a medical history. I was able to truthfully, and fortunately, check no to all the questions. That was the only investigation they required before enrolling in IMSS. I am over 60 incidentally.


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## kazslo

TundraGreen said:


> Just one point of clarification...
> There are not two types of IMSS. There is just one IMSS. Most of the subscribers are people who get it through their work as Bajaceresa says. Then there is a separate system called Seguro Popular that covers people not getting IMSS. There is also ISSSTE which covers government employees.


Is that correct? On the imss website they list two types: obligatorio and voluntario - the first for employees of a Mexican company and the second for anyone who wants to pay in. For those who pay in, your coverage depends on your job type. Seguro Popular for people who don't have the financial means to pay for healthcare/insurance. ISSSTE for gov't. At least I think thats how it works.

Incorporación al IMSS


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## Isla Verde

kazslo said:


> Is that correct? On the imss website they list two types: obligatorio and voluntario - the first for employees of a Mexican company and the second for anyone who wants to pay in. For those who pay in, your coverage depends on your job type. Seguro Popular for people who don't have the financial means to pay for healthcare/insurance. ISSSTE for gov't. At least I think thats how it works.
> 
> Incorporación al IMSS


I don't understand the point that those who choose to pay in to the system get coverage according to their "job type". What about expat retirees who join IMSS?


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## TundraGreen

kazslo said:


> Is that correct? On the imss website they list two types: obligatorio and voluntario - the first for employees of a Mexican company and the second for anyone who wants to pay in. For those who pay in, your coverage depends on your job type. Seguro Popular for people who don't have the financial means to pay for healthcare/insurance. ISSSTE for gov't. At least I think thats how it works.
> 
> Incorporación al IMSS


Okay. I thought you were confusing IMSS and Seguro Popular. But I agree that you can either get IMSS through your work or by paying for it directly.


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## johnmex

BTW,

If you get IMSS through your job there are no silly "pre-exsisting condition" exclusions.


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## surfrider

Didn't someone post that their wife had medical ins. through a company in Mexico? If that is the case, what are we talking about with the payments. I have looked into a couple of ins. companies but they were international and they were (I thought) very high. -


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## chapala1

I canceled mine about 3 years ago


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## mickisue1

TundraGreen said:


> Just one point of clarification...
> There are not two types of IMSS. There is just one IMSS. Most of the subscribers are people who get it through their work as Bajaceresa says. Then there is a separate system called Seguro Popular that covers people not getting IMSS. There is also ISSSTE which covers government employees.
> 
> In contrast to most stories told here, I did not have any physical exam prior to getting IMSS coverage. I just had to answer questions on a medical history. I was able to truthfully, and fortunately, check no to all the questions. That was the only investigation they required before enrolling in IMSS. I am over 60 incidentally.


Can I assume that, whether through one's employment or registering as a resident, the coverages are the same?

Also, just what pre-exisiting conditions would make you ineligible? I've been diagnosed as hypothyroid for 8 years now, but really, all it involves is very inexpensive thyroid supplementation and getting my T4 checked yearly.

By "very inexpensive" I mean that the cost has gone up significantly, recently, and even in the US, I pay about $35 for a three month's supply.


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## TundraGreen

mickisue1 said:


> Can I assume that, whether through one's employment or registering as a resident, the coverages are the same?
> 
> Also, just what pre-exisiting conditions would make you ineligible? I've been diagnosed as hypothyroid for 8 years now, but really, all it involves is very inexpensive thyroid supplementation and getting my T4 checked yearly.
> 
> By "very inexpensive" I mean that the cost has gone up significantly, recently, and even in the US, I pay about $35 for a three month's supply.


The application I was given has a section on "Habitos Personales" and a section on "Historia de Enfermedades". The translated version of them follows:

Personal Habits:
Do you exercise regularly?
Do you drink? If yes, how much per week and for how long?
Do you smoke? If yes, how much and for how long?
Do you take medication?
Height - weight

History (Mark yes if have or suffer from):
Allergy or asthma
Chronic blood disease
Cancer or tumors
Diabetes with some sub categories (renal, retino, neuro, circulation)
Heart problems
Liver problems
Nervous system or psychiatric problems
High blood pressure
Rheumatism or arthritis
Tuberculosis
Ulcers
AIDs
VIH Positive
Congenital illness
Chronic bronchitis
Vascular accidents or embolisms
Deformation or limitations on movement due to accident or sickness
Alcoholism
Drug addiction

The only one that would appear to apply to you would be the question about medication. Also, remember that the process is probably not consistent in different IMSS offices. This comes from the main IMSS office on Camacho in Guadalajara.

Incidentally, the protein requirements you mentioned earlier sound very high to me, but I haven't had time to investigate and find any counter arguments. (I just realized that was a different thread. Oh well.)


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## mickisue1

TundraGreen said:


> The application for I was given has a section on "Habitos Personales" and a section on "Historia de Enfermedades". The translated version of them follows:
> 
> Personal Habits:
> Do you exercise regularly?
> Do you drink? If yes, how much per week and for how long?
> Do you smoke? If yes, how much and for how long?
> Do you take medication?
> Height - weight
> 
> History (Mark yes if have or suffer from):
> Allergy or asthma
> Chronic blood disease
> Cancer or tumors
> Diabetes with some sub categories (renal, retino, neuro, circulation)
> Heart problems
> Liver problems
> Nervous system or psychiatric problems
> High blood pressure
> Rheumatism or arthritis
> Tuberculosis
> Ulcers
> AIDs
> VIH Positive
> Congenital illness
> Chronic bronchitis
> Vascular accidents or embolisms
> Deformation or limitations on movement due to accident or sickness
> Alcoholism
> Drug addiction
> 
> The only one that would appear to apply to you would be the question about medication. Also, remember that the process is probably not consistent in different IMSS offices. This comes from the main IMSS office on Camacho in Guadalajara.
> 
> Incidentally, the protein requirements you mentioned earlier sound very high to me, but I haven't had time to investigate and find any counter arguments. (I just realized that was a different thread. Oh well.)


Thanks, Will. Strictly speaking, Armour Thyroid is not medication; it's desiccated thyroid from pigs. Better for me than the synthetic stuff, most common form is Synthroid.


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## surfrider

I have been on thyroid for well since I was 12 year old. You have to be careful with the pig stuff cause it is often difficult for them to regulate the exact amount of thyroid you get per dose. Also something I have learned about thyroid is that you should not have any dairy product within a 3 hour period before and after even with the real stuff.


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## mickisue1

surfrider said:


> I have been on thyroid for well since I was 12 year old. You have to be careful with the pig stuff cause it is often difficult for them to regulate the exact amount of thyroid you get per dose. Also something I have learned about thyroid is that you should not have any dairy product within a 3 hour period before and after even with the real stuff.


Actually, the idea that the pig thyroid is less accurate was a lie put out by Big Pharma 

That's my surprised face.

Synthroid, in third party tests, has more inaccuracies in dosage than Armour Thyroid.

I rarely, if ever, drink milk, so it's not an issue for me. Modified cow pus. YUM.


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## surfrider

chapala1 said:


> I canceled mine about 3 years ago


do you care to share WHY you canceled?


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## cuylers5746

*Different take of Canceling Medicare*



surfrider said:


> Just an open question about weather or not a U.S. citizen should cancel their medicare premium payments from their social security check? if you are never going back to the U.S. why pay for something you can not receive?



Hi Surfrider;

I've got a different take on rather you should cancel your Part B on Medicare, because you're living in Mexico.

I'd keep it, and have done so myself. Why?

Well after having lived off and on in Florida for over 24 years (the other, although be it past Meca for retirees), I learned a lot about the Medical System there. I feel it applies to Mexico too.

Advice in Florida over many years was; if you get drastically infirm contracting something really complicated, or rare - you're probably going to find the best treatment might be at one of the renouned Medical Centers like "Cleveland Clinic", "Houston Medical Center", or the "Mayo clinic in Minnesota? The Cleveland Clinic now even has good branches in places closer like Tucson and Florida.

Yes, I know they have some excellent hospitals in D.F. and many of those Doctors work in Houston part of the year too, learning the latest procedures, and I have full faith and confifdance in them. BUT, if you have something new, really rare (not Tropical related), your best bet might be to hop a plane to ole USA to the finest Hospitals/Clinics and get the latest best treatment?

For instance, after working at the Cleveland Clinic on a project for TRW and working literally in every one of their 42 buildings for over a year on that Cleveland Campus. I witnessed over 1500 Nurses, Surgeons, Anethesiasts, etc. at shift change in the Surgical Wing. Having been "bunny suited up" and working in Surgery, I saw they had over 8 "theaters" full time constantly doing By-Pass Surgery. They have rooms of back up Surgeons and Nurses in case some one get's too tired or feels ill. I mean it's the "McDonalds" pipeline of Heart Surgery. I've told my wife since then, If I need Heart Surgery, "...just throw me on a plane to Cleveland..". 

So, for around $100.00 bucks (currently) extra a month - you leave all your options open.

All the other comments, that I read were really valid also. I just have a different read on it. All my life, I've learned it's better to keep doors open, instead of closing them.


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## mickisue1

cuylers5746 said:


> Hi Surfrider;
> 
> I've got a different take on rather you should cancel your Part B on Medicare, because you're living in Mexico.
> 
> I'd keep it, and have done so myself. Why?
> 
> Well after having lived off and on in Florida for over 24 years (the other, although be it past Meca for retirees), I learned a lot about the Medical System there. I feel it applies to Mexico too.
> 
> Advice in Florida over many years was; if you get drastically infirm contracting something really complicated, or rare - you're probably going to find the best treatment might be at one of the renouned Medical Centers like "Cleveland Clinic", "Houston Medical Center", or the "Mayo clinic in Minnesota? The Cleveland Clinic now even has good branches in places closer like Tucson and Florida.
> 
> Yes, I know they have some excellent hospitals in D.F. and many of those Doctors work in Houston part of the year too, learning the latest procedures, and I have full faith and confifdance in them. BUT, if you have something new, really rare (not Tropical related), your best bet might be to hop a plane to ole USA to the finest Hospitals/Clinics and get the latest best treatment?
> 
> For instance, after working at the Cleveland Clinic on a project for TRW and working literally in every one of their 42 buildings for over a year on that Cleveland Campus. I witnessed over 1500 Nurses, Surgeons, Anethesiasts, etc. at shift change in the Surgical Wing. Having been "bunny suited up" and working in Surgery, I saw they had over 8 "theaters" full time constantly doing By-Pass Surgery. They have rooms of back up Surgeons and Nurses in case some one get's too tired or feels ill. I mean it's the "McDonalds" pipeline of Heart Surgery. I've told my wife since then, If I need Heart Surgery, "...just throw me on a plane to Cleveland..".
> 
> So, for around $100.00 bucks (currently) extra a month - you leave all your options open.
> 
> All the other comments, that I read were really valid also. I just have a different read on it. All my life, I've learned it's better to keep doors open, instead of closing them.


Please understand that I'm approaching this from the jaded POV of a nurse.

But big clinics like the Mayo (in my state and in AZ) and Cleveland Clinic, etc are much more about being more expensive than about being absolutely better than other places.

There are so many excellent places to get medical care, not just in the US or Mexico, but all over the world, that I can't picture myself clinging to the idea of some place or places in the US being "the best."


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## Granitebay

*Never Say Never!*

Ok so you are never coming "Home" ? that well be all and good, how ever things change, you change. America is your home, your "Roots" are here,or at least a few branches. So bite the bullet, pay the freight of $104 or so for your Medicare part B and keep on trucking!So that when you do need it, and unless your are financially independent, its not a matter of "if" it is "When you are going to need it....it will be here for you...


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## Hound Dog

Medicare Part B is a terrible ripoff if you are a retiree living in Mexico or anywhere else outside of the United States. If you are foolishly going to subscribe to it you had better sign up and pay for supplemental coverage to cover the cost of medical care not covered under Plan B which constitutes a major deductible you must othewise pay out of pocket.

If you subscribe to Medicare Part B with its attendant costs while residing in Mexico as a retiree, you are an idiot.-


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## mickisue1

Granitebay said:


> Ok so you are never coming "Home" ? that well be all and good, how ever things change, you change. America is your home, your "Roots" are here,or at least a few branches. So bite the bullet, pay the freight of $104 or so for your Medicare part B and keep on trucking!So that when you do need it, and unless your are financially independent, its not a matter of "if" it is "When you are going to need it....it will be here for you...


You know, I had a follow up appointment for my thyroid about a month ago, and was discussing health insurance with the nurse. My husband's employer carries coverage, but it has, while getting a little more expensive every year, gotten significantly worse in coverage, at the same time.

She commented that I should be well versed in Medicare and the cost of COBRA (continued coverage when the employment ends) in case something would happen to him. I told her that I would move out of the country, if that happened, to a place where they understand that decent healthcare, at a reasonable cost, is a right, not a privilege.

She was shocked, but intrigued. I think we who are still in the US get so set on the bad or worse choices that we are offered, whether as employees or retirees, that we find it hard to understand the freedom from fear of not being able to afford medical care that those in the civilized world enjoy.

Too bad the US has chosen, over and over, not to join that world. A sin and a shame.

Medicare Part B? Once I leave, I'll be back to visit, as I have kids in the US, and I'll have travel insurance. It's less expensive and better coverage than Medicare, anyway.


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## Granitebay

Well thats a "Healthy" observation thar Hound dog. Just make a note that 2 out of three baby boomers over 75 years of age in 10 years will need some kind of inhansed medical care. Perhaps rather that a costly medical care supplement to origional medicare care Part A and B, "Advantage Care" which is where a a private carrier (HMO) takes over medicare parts A and B (hostipal and doctor) from the goverment and provides the health care solution with medical, hospital and drug coverage in one plan. An example would be Kaiser. United Health care, Health net, Blue Shield all HMO's (Health Maintenance Organization) where in many areas in the US based on ones state side zip code the montly premium is ZERO. You just have to maintain medicare care part B to qualifiy. And by the way thar Hound Dog, Learning makes the wise wiser and the idiot more foolish. Bend and ear to "Surf Rider" down below and hedge your bet. $100 bucks a month for part B may be a cheap date in the long run. All's good Dog...


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## Hound Dog

I must admit, Granitebay, that the language I used when referring to those who choose Medicare B was unfortunate. I should have said that one should carefully consider the options available before electing to pay or not pay for Medicare B and choose the path best suited for their circumstances. My apologies for what I, in retrospect, consider to be rude and inappropriate language and also my failure to have taken into consideration the circumstances of other retirees lliving full or part time in Mexico.

I initially paid for Medicare B for several months before cancelling it. My decision was based on the fact that my wife and I are full time residents of Mexico and have no property, address or physician anywhere in the U.S. We also carry major medical insurance with a reputable international insurance company providing us with unlimited coverage for catastrophic illness but with a substantial deductible of $35,000 Pesos which makes our annual premium cost more reasonable. We carry this insurance, which includes emergency coverage when we are out of Mexico up to $50,000USD anywhere in the world. For routine medical care we pay out of pocket up to the $35,000MXN deductible. It is important to note that we have carried these health insurance policies since I was 60 and my wife was 55. We are now 71 and 66 respectively and I doubt we could qualify for this coverage if we tried to sign up initially today at our ages. Clearly, everyone does not qualify for major medical insurance so my blanket statement that Medicare B is a foolish option was out of line. One must consider the circumstances one is experiencing to decide if full Medicare coverage including supplemental insurance makes sense.

I first questioned the efficacy of full Medicare coverage in our circumstances when I read that someone had been financially wiped out just paying the deductible after a major illness because medical costs in the U.S. are so outrageous. That made me consider just what our seeking medical care in the U.S. during an emergency would entail. We would have to identify a physician and hospital somewhere in the U.S. that would take on new Medicare patients, establish a residence in the community in which the physician and hospital do business, arrange expensive transportation to that community from Mexico and transportation while there and join the queue with God knows who else awaiting our turn whenever that might occur.

This was all further brought home to me when I had to have an emergency gall bladder operation in 2008 while we were in residence at our home in the Chiapas Highlands where the hospitals are generally pretty dreadful and physician talent limited. The major medical we carry provides emergency flight evacuation anywhere in Mexico and they offered me emergency flights to a city and hospital of my choice and recommended Mexico City, Guadalajara or Monterrey. I realized then that, as I was in dire condition and in no shape to fly anywhere, I needed to opt for immediate emergency surgery here in San Cristobal in a filthy local hospital with the only gastrointestinal surgeon then available over the Christmas holidays. The surgery was successful fortunately but this incident made me realize the absurdity of my even flying on an emergency basis in Mexico much less, in my condition, identifying a physician and hospital in the U.S. who would take me under Medicare. establishing an address there and flying on my own dime to the U.S. when I could hardly make it across town to the hospital here. 

On the other hand, I know someone at Lake Chapala who takes full Medicare coverage and is moving back to the U.S. to treat his long term chronic illness under Medicare as that long term care over years in Mexico paid for out of his own pocket is too expensive over time. 

Upon refelection, I realize what is good for us under our circumstances is not good for all and I retract the comment I made in my previous post.,


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## RVGRINGO

With BCBS coverage included in my retirement, I must maintain Part B or lose that coverage, even though Medicare does not pay in Mexico. I have had 8 eye surgeries and, just recently, an emergency colectomy in Guadalahara. Now, I am approaching the limits of my out of country BCBS coverage, which could force me to go to the USA in anything but an emergency situation. Unfortunately, all of these procedures have been emergencies and had to be done in Guadalajara. 
My wife has just opted to take Part B, and has no other coverage anywhere. We are too old and cannot afford additional premiums here, or elsewhere.
So, we are being forced to list our home and downsize to a rental, with the prospect of moving north, where I have BCBS and VA coverage, and my wife will have Medicare A&B. As I approach 76, my dream and plan to live in Chapala forever may be untenable, as I am also losing my sight and can no longer drive. 
So, what to do next? Another major medical problem could wiipe us out in either country but there is no safety net in Mexico and the one in the USA is dirty and full of holes.


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## DennyDaddy

RV....

Look into Rocky Point! Its close to US ...58 miles and easy drive to VA in Tuscon. 

Not like down south, but still can have a life in Mexico.

The red cross here will deliver you to border 24/7 and a paddy wagon will meet the Mex one at border in an energency.

Life is great here for us, even tho its a tourest place. We live way away from that area and its still Mexico for us.

Doc's and dentists are still great prices.

Due to tourest downsize cause of US ecom prices to buy are great now.

Its fits us fine here, have to go to VA at least once a month.

Something to think about,, if someone wants to live in Mexico, good area, cheap doc's, in free zone and 58 miles to US,and a great fish market area on the sea.

DS


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## mickisue1

RV, I'm so sorry!

If the Medicare administrators have any common sense, they'll start to do what some private insurers do, and encourage people to go to other countries for elective, but necessary, surgeries. They'll also look at the cost savings from covering someone like you, who has serious medical issues, but even with that, can get care at a much lower price in the country where they live, i.e., Mexico.


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## TundraGreen

RVGRINGO said:


> With BCBS coverage included in my retirement, I must maintain Part B or lose that coverage, even though Medicare does not pay in Mexico. I have had 8 eye surgeries and, just recently, an emergency colectomy in Guadalahara. Now, I am approaching the limits of my out of country BCBS coverage, which could force me to go to the USA in anything but an emergency situation. Unfortunately, all of these procedures have been emergencies and had to be done in Guadalajara.
> My wife has just opted to take Part B, and has no other coverage anywhere. We are too old and cannot afford additional premiums here, or elsewhere.
> So, we are being forced to list our home and downsize to a rental, with the prospect of moving north, where I have BCBS and VA coverage, and my wife will have Medicare A&B. As I approach 76, my dream and plan to live in Chapala forever may be untenable, as I am also losing my sight and can no longer drive.
> So, what to do next? Another major medical problem could wiipe us out in either country but there is no safety net in Mexico and the one in the USA is dirty and full of holes.


I am sorry to hear this RV. It is a sad commentary on the state of medicare in the world in general and the US and Mexico in particular.


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## surfrider

Granitebay said:


> Ok so you are never coming "Home" ? that well be all and good, how ever things change, you change. America is your home, your "Roots" are here,or at least a few branches. So bite the bullet, pay the freight of $104 or so for your Medicare part B and keep on trucking!So that when you do need it, and unless your are financially independent, its not a matter of "if" it is "When you are going to need it....it will be here for you...


I was the administrator of Good Samaritan Hospital in Los Angeles California and I do not even think that I would go back to the states for any medical reasons at all. Medicare just is not worth it because they do not cover enough thing. The entire medical insurance and medical care system within the states has changed and not for the better. There really is better medical care in other places in the word than in the states. Yes it is my roots - but it is my health.


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