# Defaulting tenant - me



## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

This is a little complicated so please bear with me. I have a court appearance in April because I have been unable to pay my rent for several months. I signed a 5 year contract in Oct 2011. As I had no work contract, I had to pay nearly 5,000 deposit, plus 990 pm, which was fine. This is my first apartment in Spain and everything is totally different to what I’m used to in Australia. I hoped to operate the apartment as a B and Breakfast, the design is perfect. Ten days after signing and moving in, a technician came to service the caldera, which was working perfectly and presented me with a factura for 174 euros. I didn’t understand why he had come, I didn’t request or invite him, and my Spanish wasn’t good enough to understand his explanation. And he wanted another technician to come and see why the heating wasn’t working. Why should I pay 174 when I had just spent 6000 to move in? The day after his visit the caldera stopped working, the other technician poked around with the thermostat then gave me another factura for 540 this time. I contacted my landlady, explained what had happened and she told me I must pay first, then be reinbursed. The cost of moving in had left me a little short of cash, and I was having trouble accessing my own funds in Australia, so this was not possible. I was without hot water and heat for 4 1/2 months, through winter, until I could pay for a new caldera and someone to fit it, while still paying 990 pm. I could not offer potential guests accommodation without hot water. I completely missed the tourist season and months of potential income due to a total lack of flexibility, concern and consideration by the owner. I have spent 1,000′s on decorating, replacing beds etc. paying others to help me make the place look quality. Since last August there have been constant renovations, above, below and both sides. The kitchen is falling apart, cupboard doors are no longer attached, there is a large gap between the wall and the stove, which never worked properly, the lights and electricity, don’t work in an almost fully electric kitchen. Even as a shared flat, I cannot ask full price for my rooms, to cover my expenses. I was able to pay my rent until September. I have never owed anyone money except a bank mortgage and find the situation unbelievable. On the street I am dead. I am 56 yrs old, my children live with their father in Australia, my parents are dead. I have nowhere else to go nor the means to do so. Any advice will be most welcome as I know not whom to approach. The legal system especially in Spain is alien to me and I don’t know if I have any redress. Thank you in advance. Marian.


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## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

Sorry to hear of the difficulties you now find yourself in.

My first port of call I think would be to the Australian Embassy (or British if you're a British national) in Spain and speak to someone there about what your options might be. But it does sound like you need to get yourself a lawyer and see what they say.

Good luck with getting it all sorted out.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Embassies are useless, they wouldn't help when my Australian bank was being incredibly tardy and incompetent, replacing a piece of plastic and a PIN that worked took 6 months and 11 days - more time without access to my own money. I'm checking out free legal advice cos can't afford a lawyer, but surely this is wrong. Not one query from the owner re the caldera, is it fixed? or any offer to pay. Her only interest appears to be my rent. I'll not return to Australia, even if I could afford it and I've not been back to England since age 11 bar Heathrow. Spain is stuck with me.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marian warren said:


> Embassies are useless, they wouldn't help when my Australian bank was being incredibly tardy and incompetent, replacing a piece of plastic and a PIN that worked took 6 months and 11 days - more time without access to my own money. I'm checking out free legal advice cos can't afford a lawyer, but surely this is wrong. Not one query from the owner re the caldera, is it fixed? or any offer to pay. Her only interest appears to be my rent. I'll not return to Australia, even if I could afford it and I've not been back to England since age 11 bar Heathrow. Spain is stuck with me.


no, the consulates won't help

according to the LAU (rental law) a property has to be 'fit for purpose' & yours clearly wasn't if there was no hot water or heating when or just after you moved in - & it's the landlord's responsibility to ensure that it IS 'fit for purpose'.

a property not being 'fit for purpose' is pretty much the only legitimate reason for the with-holding of rent, so it's a shame that you didn't deal with that at the time

OMIC might help in these circumstances, but I suspect that it might be too late

just one point - you _do_ have it written into your contract that you can run the property as a B&B??


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I dont mean this to sound unkind, but you do seem to be a "poster child" for how things can go wrong without forward planning and a plan "B"

However, dialogue maybe your only financially viable option right now. Do you know someone who speaks both languages who can perhaps discuss this with the owner?? Write a list of issues and questions you need answers to and then hear the owners side of what has happened????? and take it from there - It might help to build an understanding of each other, which could help??

Jo xxx


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

The bottom line for a Court will be that you are in arrears and they will judge accordingly. 

The landlord's sole interest will be in receiving the rent due as per contract. S/he will have no interest in the progress of your business. This may sound harsh but having been both landlord in the past and now a tenant here in Spain I can see both sides.

The important point is whether or not your contract allows you to engage in business activities from your rented premises. Does your landlord know that you do this?

If not my advice would be not to mention it when you go before the Court. Claim it's your sole place of residence and that you have nowhere to go.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Most probably not. It states 'commerce, industry, or even manual or office or professional office' but technically this is no different than if I had flatmates. A single, mature women, without a job, in a large 3 bed and paying 990 pm! 50,000 in 5 yrs. Many others I know are doing the same, and it keeps the economy moving, albeit on a local scale, building community. I only wanted to cover my expenses and a little to live on. I love Barcelona, like people and this was a way of sharing 'my' town and home with others, from different countries. What is OMIC please? So many acronyms - so little time. Thanks for your advice.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

marian warren said:


> Most probably not. It states 'commerce, industry, or even manual or office or professional office' but technically this is no different than if I had flatmates. A single, mature women, without a job, in a large 3 bed and paying 990 pm! 50,000 in 5 yrs. Many others I know are doing the same, and it keeps the economy moving, albeit on a local scale, building community. I only wanted to cover my expenses and a little to live on. I love Barcelona, like people and this was a way of sharing 'my' town and home with others, from different countries. What is OMIC please? So many acronyms - so little time. Thanks for your advice.


 NO!! Its illegal, the people you planned to rent to wouldnt be flat mates, at best they'd be subletting. But what about insurances, taxes (business and personal), autonomo payments??? Just because other do it, doesnt mean its right. What about your healthcare if you need it?? It sounds like you were trying to run an illegal business and therefore its best not to mention it. If you were to move to Spain now, the rules have changed and you wouldnt even be able to become a resident without proof of an income and healthcare. I dont know what your options are, apart from facing the consequences of your actions??

Jo xxx


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Thank you Jo and Mr...9. As I haven't made a centimo as a business, and losing money as a shared apartment, while living on my savings - I will hardly claim myself a commercial business person, out to fleece the system. It is my sole place of residence, and I do not have anywhere else to go. I have been fighting for my life, I know many homeless, and I won't last long on the streets. I have been trying to access advice, govt sites etc. I'm happy I stumbled across this forum cos kept finding dead ends.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

marian warren said:


> Thank you Jo and Mr...9. As I haven't made a centimo as a business, and losing money as a shared apartment, while living on my savings - I will hardly claim myself a commercial business person, out to fleece the system. It is my sole place of residence, and I do not have anywhere else to go. I have been fighting for my life, I know many homeless, and I won't last long on the streets. I have been trying to access advice, govt sites etc. I'm happy I stumbled across this forum cos kept finding dead ends.



Your intentions were to make money without adhering to the correct permits or getting the right permissions. You've lost money and sadly thats one of the risks of setting up a business in a country where you dont know the rules or the language.

I dont know how spanish courts work. I do know there is no legal aid, no social benefit system, no housing benefits or social housing.

Your only recourse is as my co mod says - is to claim the property isnt fit for habitation. But whether they'll let you off paying what the owner is claiming for - I dont know. I still think some form of dialogue with said owner, may help for you to both understand each other

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marian warren said:


> Most probably not. It states 'commerce, industry, or even manual or office or professional office' but technically this is no different than if I had flatmates. A single, mature women, without a job, in a large 3 bed and paying 990 pm! 50,000 in 5 yrs. Many others I know are doing the same, and it keeps the economy moving, albeit on a local scale, building community. I only wanted to cover my expenses and a little to live on. I love Barcelona, like people and this was a way of sharing 'my' town and home with others, from different countries. What is OMIC please? So many acronyms - so little time. Thanks for your advice.


it's very simple - unless you have express written permission from the landlord you can't sublet/have flatmates/run any kind of business


OMIC is the Oficina Municipal de Consumidores - sort of like an official Citizen's Advice Bureau .... they deal with the kind of complaint you have against your landlord regarding the boiler - though it should have been dealt with at the time, but it might buy YOU some time

much as I sympathise - I don't think there's much to be done - you are behind with your rent & it sounds like you couldn't afford it in the first place unless you ran a business there without permission - essentially 'illegally' & a court will almost certainly find for the landlord

have you registered as autónomo for your earnings from this business btw?


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## mickbcn (Feb 4, 2013)

Pity..sorry.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

I accept your point it is illegal but it must be a moot point seeing as my first attempt at crime failed abysmally. I have spent 80,000 in 2 years. Another 25,000 in 2010 when I was studying at UB for 1 year. I feel that is some contribution to the state and economy. I have little faith in the medical profession and have not applied for a healthcare card nor will I. The 'consequences of my actions' is I appear to be naive, in a foreign country, far from all familiar, with a language [2] I wasn't proficient in, with very different customs and laws. Shoot me - I'm not on the street, exploiting, stealing and conning tourists.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marian warren said:


> I accept your point it is illegal but it must be a moot point seeing as my first attempt at crime failed abysmally. I have spent 80,000 in 2 years. Another 25,000 in 2010 when I was studying at UB for 1 year. I feel that is some contribution to the state and economy. I have little faith in the medical profession and have not applied for a healthcare card nor will I. The 'consequences of my actions' is I appear to be naive, in a foreign country, far from all familiar, with a language [2] I wasn't proficient in, with very different customs and laws. Shoot me - I'm not on the street, exploiting, stealing and conning tourists.


all of which is also moot 

the judge will simply see that you haven't paid your rent - it's between you & the property owner

as I said, the boiler issue might muddy the water a bit but in the end won't make a difference

if you don't pay your rent you will be evicted


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

When I found the flat there was no intent to use it as a business, merely as a share, but 'others' told me what they were doing. It is what it is. I too, am merely trying to survive, while the world falls apart around me. Anyway this could go on forever and pointless. I was mistaken.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marian warren said:


> When I found the flat there was no intent to use it as a business, merely as a share, but 'others' told me what they were doing. It is what it is. I too, am merely trying to survive, while the world falls apart around me. Anyway this could go on forever and pointless. I was mistaken.


we all are trying to survive

I'm not sure what you were wanting from a forum tbh - you need legal advice as you said yourself in your first post

is it too late for dialogue with the owner? - maybe an agreement could be reached?


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## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

Joe your wrong on the legal aid point there his but the poster has to go to her main court house and apply for it they will then text her with a yes or no answer but your right she would be better shutting up about the illegal activities or she will have more than eviction on her plate hacienda as well


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

tonyinspain said:


> *Joe your wrong on the legal aid point there his but the poster has to go to her main court house and apply for it they will then text her with a yes or no answer* but your right she would be better shutting up about the illegal activities or she will have more than eviction on her plate hacienda as well



In that case, I bow to your knowledge lol!!! I thought that the legal aid in spain was only available to those who had SS numbers etc and even then had to be paid back??? 

Jo xxx


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

jojo said:


> I dont mean this to sound unkind, but you do seem to be a "poster child" for how things can go wrong without forward planning and a plan "B"
> 
> However, dialogue maybe your only financially viable option right now. Do you know someone who speaks both languages who can perhaps discuss this with the owner?? Write a list of issues and questions you need answers to and then hear the owners side of what has happened????? and take it from there - It might help to build an understanding of each other, which could help??
> 
> Jo xxx


If you did not mean to sound unkind, why did you say it? If moderators have feelings, what about those who are obviously in distress and desperate, blindly reaching out for sound advice, because they are out of their depth. Can you imagine how many nights I've spent awake, having panic attacks, cold sweats, almost paralysed with fear for the last 6 months? I was looking for a business to invest in here, food, with me cooking cos I am great cook. Legally. I had plan B and C and D but my money evaporated because I'm subsidising the difference between the rent and the amount I can charge to share. Yep dipso poster child - that's me!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> In that case, I bow to your knowledge lol!!! I thought that the legal aid in spain was only available to those who had SS numbers etc and even then had to be paid back???
> 
> Jo xxx


yes, you do have to be a legal registered resident - but it is available then


I'm not sure about for civil cases though, which is what this is


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

marian warren said:


> If you did not mean to sound unkind, why did you say it? If moderators have feelings, what about those who are obviously in distress and desperate, blindly reaching out for sound advice, because they are out of their depth. Can you imagine how many nights I've spent awake, having panic attacks, cold sweats, almost paralysed with fear for the last 6 months? I was looking for a business to invest in here, food, with me cooking cos I am great cook. Legally. I had plan B and C and D but my money evaporated because I'm subsidising the difference between the rent and the amount I can charge to share. Yep dipso poster child - that's me!



I said it because on the forum, we always recommend that before starting/investing in anything in a foreign country you need to do plenty of research, to understand how things work, especially with the crisis in Spain. I do understand your feelings and I most certainly didnt say it to be unkind! I've made mistakes too - altho I do practice what I preach and the mistakes I made werent quite as costly. Its not easy to offer advice after the event and Spain is a harsh country.

I am sorry and sad for you tho 

Jo xxx


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

tonyinspain said:


> Joe your wrong on the legal aid point there his but the poster has to go to her main court house and apply for it they will then text her with a yes or no answer but your right she would be better shutting up about the illegal activities or she will have more than eviction on her plate hacienda as well


Thanks Tony. Obviously I will not be admitting my former intention, I don't want to look even more incompetent, than I appear to be now. What would I be applying for in Spanish please? I assume the main courthouse is SAC-CIVIL. Cuitat de la Justicia de Barcelona.


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## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

marian warren said:


> If you did not mean to sound unkind, why did you say it? If moderators have feelings, what about those who are obviously in distress and desperate, blindly reaching out for sound advice, because they are out of their depth. Can you imagine how many nights I've spent awake, having panic attacks, cold sweats, almost paralysed with fear for the last 6 months? I was looking for a business to invest in here, food, with me cooking cos I am great cook. Legally. I had plan B and C and D but my money evaporated because I'm subsidising the difference between the rent and the amount I can charge to share. Yep dipso poster child - that's me!


Marian the op is not unsypathetic with your plight. But to be honest what was you thinking 
Would you have done this in Australia which is even more strickter in what you can and cannot do
You spent over 100,000 euros on what 
I came here with very little knowledge with half that in for penny in for pound and bought my first home outright 
Then bought a bar i had no experience but got a gestoria and he sorted my autonamo it was hard still is but i went the way i would have done in my own country
You on the other hand have come to spain without any idea what so ever and from getting off the plane have made mistake after mistake and even 5 months later you seem oblivious to the fact that your in the wrong 
We on the otherhand are trying to advise you on the best course of action and that is your landlord is in her/ his right to want his/ her rent FACT
You are not allowed to sublet or run a business without it written into a contract FACT
So the only thing you can do is 
1 talk to your landlord and discuss the rent arrears with her on a payment plan she may or may not agree
2 go to your local law court and apply for legal aid they will text you with a yes or no if yes the text will also have a phone number and name of a legal aid solicitor ( may or maynot speak english) ring him and make an appointment 
Take with you photos documents from the court and any relevent information for him to help you
DONT mention sublet business from address or you will open a can of worns with Hacienda that you dont want
Ill be honest i would have a word with the Australian embassy and they will get in touch with either family or friend to pay for a return ticket to Australia thats what i would do as here there is no benefits at all and rather than be homeless and starving get the hell back as soon as possible you must know someone over there that would put up your fare to return 
I really feel for you i have quite a few friends that have had to return to the uk as the crisis has hit them hard and even commited suicide with the stress so calm down and try the options above
Good luck x


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

marian warren said:


> Most probably not. It states 'commerce, industry, or even manual or office or professional office' but technically this is no different than if I had flatmates. A single, mature women, without a job, in a large 3 bed and paying 990 pm! 50,000 in 5 yrs. Many others I know are doing the same, and it keeps the economy moving, albeit on a local scale, building community. I only wanted to cover my expenses and a little to live on. I love Barcelona, like people and this was a way of sharing 'my' town and home with others, from different countries. What is OMIC please? So many acronyms - so little time. Thanks for your advice.


Do you have a NIE and are you registered on the Padron of your area? Although if you are I doubt you would receive legal aid for what is a straightforward application for eviction due to non-payment of rent. But I may be wrong, it's worth a try.

Whatever you do, do not mention your plans to run a business from this apartment. It is seemingly against the tenancy agreement you signed and as you are not registered autonomo it is also illegal as you would have avoided paying tax due.

The fact that you are in financial difficulties and a lone, mature female does not make a wrong right. Neither does the fact that 'others are doing it' legitimate a bad practice. Many desperate hard-up people break into houses - doesn't make it right, though,does it....

Whilst being sorry for your plight you really have brought this on yourself by not thinking your course of action through at the beginning and obviously not acquiring enough local knowledge. At one point we were all naive trusting newcomers...some of us exercised more due diligence than others. We made costly mistakes when we left the UK, both in Prague where we previously lived and here in Spain. Luckily none of these mistakes had serious consequences and they provided good learning material.

Frankly, I'm not surprised your Embassy wouldn't help with your cash problems. It's not their job. They won't help in this case either.
Now you are no doubt thinking I am a cold, heartless person. That may well be true to some extent. But I think what you need is practical advice, not sympathy.

I can't see how you can avoid being evicted but I'm no expert on the Spanish system so I could be wrong. If I were you I would play up the 'this is my only home, I'll be on the streets' angle. Throw yourself on the mercy of the Court.

But bear in mind that day after day hundreds of Spanish families are being thrown on the streets because the breadwinners have lost their legitimate employment and they can't pay the mortgage.


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## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> yes, you do have to be a legal registered resident - but it is available then
> 
> I'm not sure about for civil cases though, which is what this is


Its from what im aware for anything if the person has no funds but again i live in catalunya and as we all know different regions have different laws


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> yes, you do have to be a legal registered resident - but it is available then
> 
> 
> I'm not sure about for civil cases though, which is what this is


I have my NIE, empadronemente? and a UK passport. I know I've been slack, I loath officialdom and like to stay under the radar - maybe to my detriment. But I am in the system, somewhere.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marian warren said:


> I have my NIE, empadronemente? and a UK passport. I know I've been slack, I loath officialdom and like to stay under the radar - maybe to my detriment. But I am in the system, somewhere.


green resident certificate/card?

that will be the deciding factor as to whether or not you are legally registered as resident


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

marian warren said:


> I have my NIE, empadronemente? and a UK passport. I know I've been slack, I loath officialdom and like to stay under the radar - maybe to my detriment. But I am in the system, somewhere.


There will be a British Consulate in Barcelona. Go and see if they can help or advise. They should have a legal advisor there.
You didn't say you had a UK Passport....

'Staying under the radar'.... why? You are legal, you have complied with the rules. You have registerred for NIE and Padron.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

mrypg9 said:


> There will be a British Consulate in Barcelona. Go and see if they can help.
> You didn't say you had a UK Passport....


that won't make any difference

the UK consulate won't help any more than the Aus one

the most they would do is recommend an English speaking lawyer, or if the OP wanted to return to the UK, they would contact someone there on her behalf (family/friends) to put up the funds for the fare if the OP couldn't find the money herself

they won't get involved in any legal issues directly


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Nuh - failed again. It took me 3 weeks, 17 hours and 3 attempts to get my NIE, without any Spanish or Catala, and needed to go back to Balmes, again, 1 month later. An hour in a queue, at the bank to pay my landlord, whom I lived with, my monthly rent. I failed bureaucracy in school and haven't improved, despite many attempts.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

marian warren said:


> Nuh - failed again. It took me 3 weeks, 17 hours and 3 attempts to get my NIE, without any Spanish or Catala, and needed to go back to Balmes, again, 1 month later. An hour in a queue, at the bank to pay my landlord, whom I lived with, my monthly rent. I failed bureaucracy in school and haven't improved, despite many attempts.


That's bad luck. I gave up going through the 'proper channels' in Prague and resorted to paying an agency to get me legal there.
Dealing with bureaucracy is an essential survival skill and easily acquired. Spanish bureaucracy is child's play compared to Czech.
As for not speaking any form of Spanish.......how would a non English speaker manage in a Uk DHSS Office?

I think my advice is the best.....throw yourself on the mercy of the Court, ask for time to pay back arrears.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

tonyinspain said:


> Marian the op is not unsypathetic with your plight. But to be honest what was you thinking
> Would you have done this in Australia which is even more strickter in what you can and cannot do
> You spent over 100,000 euros on what
> I came here with very little knowledge with half that in for penny in for pound and bought my first home outright
> ...


Tony, I appreciate your advice and sharing your experience with me BUT Brits are used to Europe, especially el cheapo Spain and Portugal, as most spent many holidays, school trips, stag do's, hen nights, here, there, blah, blah, and a European system is not as strange to you as alien to me. There is no correlation between your experiences and mine. I've visited over 40 countries and this is the first I've chosen to live in. I made my choices, I burned my bridges. I am alone, because a mother should not depend on her children for support, and as students they have none to offer, and it's going to be hard enough for them already. My ex hates my guts for rejecting him for Barca. Fight or flight is my only option and I have nowhere to flee to. I'm not suicidal, just realistic - a selfish, greedy, uncaring world is doing me in quickly enough.


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## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

mrypg9 said:


> ....how would a non English speaker manage in a Uk DHSS Office?


Probably a hell of a lot better than a non Spanish speaking person in Spain going on the sheer number of languages the leaflets are written in.

For some weird reason the UK bends over backwards for non-English speakers and I haven't got the faintest idea why. The last thing I heard was that Surrey CC were organising free coffee mornings for non-English speaking Hindus. 

If you're in Spain and you don't speak Spanish - tough luck, because no-one will help you.



mrypg9 said:


> I think my advice is the best.....throw yourself on the mercy of the Court, ask for time to pay back arrears.


I agree.

This person seems to have got themselves into a right pickle. The whys and wherefores of what's gone on in the past is just history, they need to focus on the here and now and somehow find a way out of this situation. Speaking to the landlord and finding a way forward without recourse to the courts is by far the vest option, but if that won't work, plead the case in court but you'll probably have to offer something to the landlord.

And for goodness sake don't mention anything about trying to run a business in the flat, that will get you nowhere.

I know nothing of the Spanish rental laws, but I'd also try and negotoiate a lower future rent too if possible.


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## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

marian warren said:


> I'm not suicidal, just realistic - a selfish, greedy, uncaring world is doing me in quickly enough.


Sadly so. It's getting worse too.

There's plenty of dialogue on this forum about how many innocent people are suffering the ravages and stupidity of greedy bankers and politicians who have effectively caused this current crisis.

They're the ones who don't care about anyone but themselves.

If things don't work out you may just have to switch to plan E, flee back to the UK and throw yourself at the mercy of the UK Welfare system. One more won't make any difference, most of Europe and many parts of the world are doing the same thing.

At least that way you'll survive, you won't survive in Spain in the current economic situation.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Bet the non-english speaker in a DHSS, wouldn't have as many probs as a purely english speaker in Catalunya. I have vastly improved in 2 years, despite years of trying to learn Spanish in Oz - a totally blancmange society, where Japanese, Indonesian and Mandarin reign higher than any European language.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

The UK system is as foreign to me as the Cataluyna/Spanish, and far more harsh. I've not worked, paid tax - bar a few quid at the airport. Can't see them hanging out with welcome home banners. I know no-one in the UK. Que sera, sera!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

I think it depends on where you are in the UK. It's true that in many areas leaflets are printed in a variety of languages...but that doesn't mean you'll find clerks at the DWP or DHSS able to speak them.

In our part of the UK we had a huge number of Polish immigrants and because I could speak a little Polish I often had to go from school to school translating for parents....There was no help then from the LEA and from what I hear there is very little now.

I'm not so sure Marian would get much help from the UK were she to return. There's little mercy or fellow-feeling for UK residents who have fallen on hard times, let alone returnees. 
The Daily Mail in particular seems to love salting the wounds of those reurning from Spain in dire circumstances.

This won't be of much comfort to Marian but as Jo said in her post others may learn from her experiences and mistakes.

We agree, Zen...throw yourself on the mercy of the Court. They may have sympathy for a mature, respectable Englishwoman with no other home.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

Ahhh, theres nothing like an ex pat forum for a sympathetic ear


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Stravinsky said:


> Ahhh, theres nothing like an ex pat forum for a sympathetic ear


Unfortunately for me, in hindsight, I would not normally utilise an ex-pat forum. Most [in my experience especially Brits] have moved, wanting and expecting the UK with sun, unable to converse in castellano after years here, and expecting a fry up 3 times a day, whilst chugging cheap pints and chuffing cheap ****. I came to throw myself in head first and have been accepted. I mangle castellano y catala painfully, but I try. As soon as you can start cracking jokes - even catalan jokes [they know their reputation well] you're in!
Anyway folks - thanks for all the advice. I appreciate you making the effort to respond. Chau por ahora.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

marian warren said:


> Unfortunately for me, in hindsight, I would not *normally utilise an ex-pat forum. Most [in my experience especially Brits] have moved, wanting and expecting the UK with sun,* unable to converse in castellano after years here, and expecting a fry up 3 times a day, whilst chugging cheap pints and chuffing cheap ****. I came to throw myself in head first and have been accepted. I mangle castellano y catala painfully, but I try. As soon as you can start cracking jokes - even catalan jokes [they know their reputation well] you're in!
> Anyway folks - thanks for all the advice. I appreciate you making the effort to respond. Chau por ahora.


Well, its not the kind of brits I know ... but there you go 

Ive been sitting here trying to think of some useful advice I could give you but have come up with zilch extra apart from what's been said.

I think you will have to do your best at court, but maybe take a good speaker along with you to put your case well.


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

It's already been mentioned but talk to the landlord.

The joke of not wanting to start from here comes to mind . Depending on how little conversation you've had with the landlord they might not be that willing to trust you. If you haven't so upset the landlord use the state of the economy to your advantage. Offer a plan. Offer to pay a lower amount. Maybe offering a lump sum next year.

The landlord likely knows that between court costs,cleanup and months/years of not having a replacement tenant they'll be better off taking something from you.

This will only work if you TALK to the landlord. If you can't remain cool,polite and sell the landlord on your offer get somebody else to make the offer for you.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

marian warren said:


> Unfortunately for me, in hindsight, I would not normally utilise an ex-pat forum*. Most [in my experience especially Brits] have moved, wanting and expecting the UK with sun, unable to converse in castellano after years here, and expecting a fry up 3 times a day, whilst chugging cheap pints and chuffing cheap ****. I came to throw myself in head first and have been accepted. I mangle castellano y catala painfully, but I try*. As soon as you can start cracking jokes - even catalan jokes [they know their reputation well] you're in!
> Anyway folks - thanks for all the advice. I appreciate you making the effort to respond. Chau por ahora.


Speak for yourself! Like Strav, I know no Brits of the kind you describe. Few immigrants of any kind live in our village and one has to learn Spanish to survive. I thought you said earlier you didn't speak Spanish of any kind?

As you have been 'accepted' - haven't most of us - won't your friends help you?
Most of my Spanish friends are very sympathetic and always willing to help anyone in need.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

I agree with you. I'm resigned to moving out, just hoping for enough time to sort myself, downsize and try to find some kids to teach English to, to rent a room. My flatmates too. Just finished my TEFL. I know many ex pats that don't fit that stereotype and I know many more that do - or maybe they are more apparent? I've heard horrible comments from people living voluntarily in anothers country and culture. I'm embarrassed at times.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

marian warren said:


> I agree with you. I'm resigned to moving out, just hoping for enough time to sort myself, downsize and try to find some kids to teach English to, to rent a room. My flatmates too. Just finished my TEFL. I know many ex pats that don't fit that stereotype and I know many more that do - or maybe they are more apparent? I've heard horrible comments from people living voluntarily in anothers country and culture. I'm embarrassed at times.


I prefer to refer to us as 'immigrants'.

I'm confused...you say you have flatmates...so presumably they are offsetting some of the rent? If you are evicted, won't they be evicted too? Surely they won't want that to happen and might help you pay off the arrears?


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Please don't take offense. I live in the centre of Barcelona, my experience is limited. There seems to be 2 camps - those who extend themselves and those who don't. Had I not lived rurally for last 30 years, I would love to live in a village, now I need the energy of a city. It is easier to not assimilate here, not to speak Spanish, eat familiar food, watch futbol in English - maybe I am exposed to more of them. But times are tough, tourists are down and people have less to be generous with. I read La Vanguardia and listen to others talking, I'm not in a bubble. I am 90% fluent in Castellano and working on my Catala.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

I'm helping out 'friends', was short term emergency that has dragged on. I'm paid a pittance cos they have little money either, not enough to fix this, but while I'm here that's better than nowt. In all honesty, there is no way I could rent out the rooms normally, given the state of the kitchen. Sandwiches are standard fair.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

marian warren said:


> Please don't take offense. I live in the centre of Barcelona, my experience is limited. There seems to be 2 camps - those who extend themselves and those who don't. Had I not lived rurally for last 30 years, I would love to live in a village, now I need the energy of a city. It is easier to not assimilate here, not to speak Spanish, eat familiar food, watch futbol in English - maybe I am exposed to more of them. But times are tough, tourists are down and people have less to be generous with. I read La Vanguardia and listen to others talking, I'm not in a bubble. I am 90% fluent in Castellano and working on my Catala.



Sorry, Marian, but I'm still confused. You said earlier:

* I appear to be naive, in a foreign country, far from all familiar, with a language [2] I wasn't proficient in, with very different customs and laws.*

So you speak Spanish, you are not alone,have flatmates that presumably will be evicted with you and you imply you have been living in Spain for quite a long time...Sorry if I've got that wrong...Were you living in Spain or Australia for thirty years? 

It seems you know quite a lot about how things work here.

If you are 90% fluent in Castellano you will surely be able to put up a good case in court.

Don't worry about causing offence....I rarely get offended although I seem occasionally to inadvertantly give offence


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

My Spanish took a steep learning curve about a year ago and the penny dropped. I thought I was stupid, seriously trying so hard to learn, to 'get' it and hadn't after 15 months. Took me 6 mths to realise I was mainly listening to Catala while I'm taking intensive classes in Castellano for 10 weeks. I lived in Australia for 47 years, 30 yrs in hippiesville where we didn't lock doors and people didn't steal. Would I be in this much trouble if I'd been living here for 30 years? I hope not.


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## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

marian warren said:


> Please don't take offense. I live in the centre of Barcelona, my experience is limited. There seems to be 2 camps - those who extend themselves and those who don't. Had I not lived rurally for last 30 years, I would love to live in a village, now I need the energy of a city. It is easier to not assimilate here, not to speak Spanish, eat familiar food, watch futbol in English - maybe I am exposed to more of them. But times are tough, tourists are down and people have less to be generous with. I read La Vanguardia and listen to others talking, I'm not in a bubble. I am 90% fluent in Castellano and working on my Catala.


Im sorry marian you have totally confused me in one post you say you don't speak the language a nd above over 90% Castellano so you can communicate 
Also you have no one to help you but you are subletting with mates in your apartment
Are they going to get evicted with you 
Whats their status 
Are you collecting rent from them and not paying it to your landlord hence the eviction order
Totally confused


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

It is confusing. I keep trusting people who don't keep their word whereas my word is my bond. My 'mates' are useless, some mothers should be shot, sending out adults so poorly prepared. They will be evicted too, they are paying me enough to keep me afloat. If I had the means to pay the landlord I would. I have never owed money or asked for money I've not earned. I have ethics.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

marian warren said:


> It is confusing. I keep trusting people who don't keep their word whereas my word is my bond. My 'mates' are useless, some mothers should be shot, sending out adults so poorly prepared. They will be evicted too, they are paying me enough to keep me afloat. If I had the means to pay the landlord I would. I have never owed money or asked for money I've not earned. I have ethics.


But your ethics don't cover being 'above the radar' and payiing taxes due.
As an immigrant here it's ethical in my view to conform to the rules and laws.

I guess you have now realised that 'hippieville'and daily life in the 'real' world don't match, sadly. In everyday life people make few allowances for error...

Anyway,good luck with your Court hearing.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Theres not much more to be said. It does appear that the circumstances building up to your problem have changed??? and theres little advice we can give you. I'm sorry you've lost money and I wish you well with the court case

Jo xxxx


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Hey it's only money and you don't see hearses with luggage racks to quote Don Henley. We all pay for our education in some shape or form. I've learned a lot. Thank you for the well wishes. Kind regards Marian


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

marian warren said:


> This is a little complicated so please bear with me. I have a court appearance in April because I have been unable to pay my rent for several months. I signed a 5 year contract in Oct 2011. As I had no work contract, I had to pay nearly 5,000 deposit, plus 990 pm, which was fine. This is my first apartment in Spain and everything is totally different to what I’m used to in Australia. I hoped to operate the apartment as a B and Breakfast, the design is perfect. Ten days after signing and moving in, a technician came to service the caldera, which was working perfectly and presented me with a factura for 174 euros. I didn’t understand why he had come, I didn’t request or invite him, and my Spanish wasn’t good enough to understand his explanation. And he wanted another technician to come and see why the heating wasn’t working. Why should I pay 174 when I had just spent 6000 to move in? The day after his visit the caldera stopped working, the other technician poked around with the thermostat then gave me another factura for 540 this time. I contacted my landlady, explained what had happened and she told me I must pay first, then be reinbursed. The cost of moving in had left me a little short of cash, and I was having trouble accessing my own funds in Australia, so this was not possible. I was without hot water and heat for 4 1/2 months, through winter, until I could pay for a new caldera and someone to fit it, while still paying 990 pm. I could not offer potential guests accommodation without hot water. I completely missed the tourist season and months of potential income due to a total lack of flexibility, concern and consideration by the owner. I have spent 1,000′s on decorating, replacing beds etc. paying others to help me make the place look quality. Since last August there have been constant renovations, above, below and both sides. The kitchen is falling apart, cupboard doors are no longer attached, there is a large gap between the wall and the stove, which never worked properly, the lights and electricity, don’t work in an almost fully electric kitchen. Even as a shared flat, I cannot ask full price for my rooms, to cover my expenses. I was able to pay my rent until September. I have never owed anyone money except a bank mortgage and find the situation unbelievable. On the street I am dead. I am 56 yrs old, my children live with their father in Australia, my parents are dead. I have nowhere else to go nor the means to do so. Any advice will be most welcome as I know not whom to approach. The legal system especially in Spain is alien to me and I don’t know if I have any redress. Thank you in advance. Marian.


Have only just lighted on this thread and have looked at a few of the posts at the beginning. You will get absolutely nowhere with the caldera because you have been ripped off by a bogus gasman. The caldera is defective because he set it so that it would be defective. Note for the future, if you haven't asked somebody to call, then the caller is probably bogus - deny access and don't answer any questions.

As others have said, you were trying to be there and operate illegally, so you will have little recourse to any help. Sorry.


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

This has been a fascinating read. How do you say "train wreck" in Spanish?


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Tren naufragio. Where would we be without schadenfreude? At least I was game to jump on the train.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

marian warren said:


> Tony, I appreciate your advice and sharing your experience with me BUT Brits are used to Europe, especially el cheapo Spain and Portugal....


That Brits may be more used to Spain because it's european may possibly be true, but you must have known you were coming to a european country where the language and customs are different to your own. You said in another post that you had visited 40 countries. It's surprising to me that you have travelled so much but seemed to be totally unprepared for life in a different country


> I made my choices, I burned my bridges. I am alone,


Yes, you have and yes you did! Your situation is not good, but you have also said that you've learnt a lot. You seem like a strong person, you say you're realistic so you're going to have to pick yourself up and turn things around. Do you have any thoughts about how to do this? Is there any organisation that will be able to help you? Will you try to stay in Spain?


> Fight or flight is my only option and I have nowhere to flee to. I'm not suicidal, just realistic - a selfish, greedy, uncaring world is doing me in quickly enough.


....
Here I have to disagree inasmuch as yes, the world is selfish and greedy and uncaring in many ways, but your lack of understanding of the situation and preparation for what you wanted to do in your life left you open to a full blown attack from that world.
Hope you get back on track!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

marian warren said:


> Nuh - failed again. It took me 3 weeks, 17 hours and 3 attempts to get my NIE, without any Spanish or Catala, and needed to go back to Balmes, again, 1 month later. An hour in a queue, at the bank to pay my landlord, whom I lived with, my monthly rent. I failed bureaucracy in school and haven't improved, despite many attempts.


Were you living with him when the boiler man went to the flat?!


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Sorry, two different apartments, situations and lifetimes. No such thing as failure - only unexpected results.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

geeez i am confused


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Join the club. Do you want a life that can be described in 25 words or less? And I'm living this post-doctoral dissertation on life, though it seems to be cheering some folk up. 'Regard each triumph as a funeral' Lao Tzu 400 BCE


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## Navas (Sep 2, 2012)

marian warren said:


> Join the club. Do you want a life that can be described in 25 words or less? And I'm living this post-doctoral dissertation on life, though it seems to be cheering some folk up. 'Regard each triumph as a funeral' Lao Tzu 400 BCE


I have an idea. Never mind a post-doctoral dissertation, have you ever thought of writing your autobiography or turning your experiences into a work of fiction? It certainly sounds like your life has been an interesting one and you might make a few pennies if it sells


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Thank you for the suggestion. Last November I wrote 28,000 words on my life in 30 days, 'The Rambling Ravings of a Man-Made Monster - Barcode 9914556'. I wish Uni had been so easy. Unfortunately I write as I speak - hard to describe lotsa swearing and hand movements, not available to me on this forum ... I call it Globish - the new lingua franca. One publisher reject ... and frankly I'm a hard pill to swallow. I threaten established value systems, reflect back - and most folk don't like looking in the mirror and accepting they too are man-made monsters. Bertrand Russell said 'The problem with teaching philosophy is I'm always upsetting people'. That's me in a nutshell and I care deeply. It's not hard to be kind.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

marian warren said:


> Thank you for the suggestion. Last November I wrote 28,000 words on my life in 30 days, 'The Rambling Ravings of a Man-Made Monster - Barcode 9914556'. I wish Uni had been so easy. Unfortunately I write as I speak - hard to describe lotsa swearing and hand movements, not available to me on this forum ... I call it Globish - the new lingua franca. One publisher reject ... and frankly I'm a hard pill to swallow. I threaten established value systems, reflect back - and most folk don't like looking in the mirror and accepting they too are man-made monsters. Bertrand Russell said 'The problem with teaching philosophy is I'm always upsetting people'. That's me in a nutshell and I care deeply. It's not hard to be kind.


 We're just folk who live in a modern society and get on as best we can. That society, however unfair or difficult is what keeps us safe and enables us to have material things, mod cons etc - man made, yes, monsters no, just people conforming because thats the easy, fair and right thing to do.

We do seem to have strayed off topic!!

Jo


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

marian warren said:


> Thank you for the suggestion. Last November I wrote 28,000 words on my life in 30 days, 'The Rambling Ravings of a Man-Made Monster - Barcode 9914556'. I wish Uni had been so easy. Unfortunately I write as I speak - hard to describe lotsa swearing and hand movements, not available to me on this forum ... I call it Globish - the new lingua franca. One publisher reject ... and frankly I'm a hard pill to swallow. I threaten established value systems, reflect back - and most folk don't like looking in the mirror and accepting they too are man-made monsters. Bertrand Russell said 'The problem with teaching philosophy is I'm always upsetting people'. That's me in a nutshell and I care deeply. It's not hard to be kind.


Now's not the time, as you have more pressing issues but are you aware that you can self-publish, I believe that books can be printed in short runs almost to order.

Self-publishing | Books | The Guardian

Self-published authors hit by Amazon online royalties cut - Telegraph


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

I find it interesting that my comments are riddled with 'I' statements because I am the only one qualified to talk on my behalf - assertive speak. Whereas this response is riddled with passive/aggressive 'You' statements by another who has not tried on my shoes ... let alone take a single step! How dare you. You sad person. Find another to dump your inner angst on!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

marian warren said:


> I find it interesting that my comments are riddled with 'I' statements because I am the only one qualified to talk on my behalf - assertive speak. Whereas this response is riddled with passive/aggressive 'You' statements by another who has not tried on my shoes ... let alone take a single step! How dare you. You sad person. Find another to dump your inner angst on!


Reply with quote - we don't know who you're insulting!!


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Conforming is not fair OR right - only easy. Sheep are easy to govern and no-one notices if a few go missing. If I may suggest, if you have the time, to watch Alan Watts 'What if money was no object' Youtube. Only short and worth showing young folk - nuh take that back ... they might turn out like me! Thanks, methinks we won't need to speak again, travel well.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Reply with quote - we don't know who you're insulting!!


You certainly do - or you would have not been so quick to respond. When were you bequeathed the royal 'we'? Under Victoria!


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## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

marian warren said:


> Conforming is not fair OR right - only easy. Sheep are easy to govern and no-one notices if a few go missing. If I may suggest, if you have the time, to watch Alan Watts 'What if money was no object' Youtube. Only short and worth showing young folk - nuh take that back ... they might turn out like me! Thanks, methinks we won't need to speak again, travel well.


Sorry I'm even more confused I'm totally lost 
Were we not talking about a upcoming eviction how in hells name did we get onto writing our life's story
Marian you speak the language have a word with your landlord ( you have lived with him/her) and try and come to some sort of arrangement before it goes too far 
Really do wish you the best


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

marian warren said:


> You certainly do - or you would have not been so quick to respond. When were you bequeathed the royal 'we'? Under Victoria!


Actually I had no idea you were directing that post at me as many other people have posted here.
I don't understand half of your posts especially one of the last ones about the use of I and you. If you are talking about yourself, of course you're going to use I. If I am talking about you, of course I'm going to talk about you:lol: :dizzy: , aren't I??
Anyway, from what I can make out you've got yourself into a mess because you're not a sheep. As long as you don't bring anyone else down with you it is of course your own affair. You said you'd learnt from this experience and I hope you have although you didn't from the other 40 countries you went to.
Perhaps you need a bit more grass in your diet


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

oronero said:


> Now's not the time, as you have more pressing issues but are you aware that you can self-publish, I believe that books can be printed in short runs almost to order.
> 
> Self-publishing | Books | The Guardian
> 
> Self-published authors hit by Amazon online royalties cut - Telegraph


Most charge for the ego in print. See no-one gets it! I don't care about money - it's destroying us. The King Midas touch. We kill ourselves for shiny stuff we can't eat and lose the good stuff.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Actually I had no idea you were directing that post at me as many other people have posted here.
> I don't understand half of your posts especially one of the last ones about the use of I and you. If you are talking about yourself, of course you're going to use I. If I am talking about you, of course I'm going to talk about you:lol: :dizzy: , aren't I??
> Anyway, from what I can make out you've got yourself into a mess because you're not a sheep. As long as you don't bring anyone else down with you it is of course your own affair. You said you'd learnt from this experience and I hope you have although you didn't from the other 40 countries you went to.
> Perhaps you need a bit more grass in your diet


Maybe a tad less self righteous arseholism might work for you too. I asked for advice, not judgement and criticism. Dinosaur go home!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

marian warren said:


> Maybe a tad less self righteous arseholism might work for you too. I asked for advice, not judgement and criticism. Dinosaur go home!


I'm surprised your book didn't get snapped up by a publisher with writing like that!
I'm off to bed.
In my home.
Here, in Spain.
Hope you get the chance to do the same one day.


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## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

marian warren said:


> ...and frankly I'm a hard pill to swallow. I threaten established value systems, reflect back - and most folk don't like looking in the mirror and accepting they too are man-made monsters. Bertrand Russell said 'The problem with teaching philosophy is I'm always upsetting people'. That's me in a nutshell and I care deeply. It's not hard to be kind.


I have to say Madam, I do like the cut of your jib. It's so unusual to find a like minded soul with similar thoughts and ideals.

You are a Libertarian, as I am.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

tonyinspain said:


> Sorry I'm even more confused I'm totally lost
> Were we not talking about a upcoming eviction how in hells name did we get onto writing our life's story
> Marian you speak the language have a word with your landlord ( you have lived with him/her) and try and come to some sort of arrangement before it goes too far
> Really do wish you the best


Marian and her life has never been easy or simple. I have made many people very confused trying to explain one small thread of my life, forget the weft and warp of the rest. I have never lived with this landlady. I met her once at the contract signing. This situation is past redemption. An experiment that produced unexpected results. I've had many ... some good, some not so ... but all rewarding. I have lived, I am still living.


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

I can't find the off switch for this thread. Maybe this will lay it to rest with a few kind words. Thanks to all to those with positive advice, much appreciated, clarity rules. I've met some interesting folk on here, contact me privately if you wish - love discussion ... duh! To the others ... 'Words are a mirror on one's soul'. Ain't looking good for some! Remember, the arrow of time only points in one direction ------->


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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

zenkarma said:


> I have to say Madam, I do like the cut of your jib. It's so unusual to find a like minded soul with similar thoughts and ideals.
> 
> You are a Libertarian, as I am.


I consider myself an equalist - note the small e. Yep it's so unusual they like to call me nutso, cos if it ain't them, it's gotta be someone else ... and I'm kinda prominent and easy to point the finger at, cos I won't conform to any stereotype. I call myself the 'Human Screensaver' ... it keeps a few peeps entertained. Talk to me privately if you wish. The longer I'm here baring all, the more open I am to criticism by those less brave. Fear rules the globe. Lao Tzu [I love him} stated, 'Westerners are not natural addicts of a strenuous life'. I am.


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)




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## marian warren (Mar 25, 2013)

Nononymous said:


>


I hope so, because it has taken me much, time, effort and resources to be where I am. The world is speeding up and I'd like an easier life for others ... and that might be short changing them. But horse to water - can't make them drink. I feel you are a half glass empty peep - please let me be, in my half glass full, delusional state.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marian warren said:


> I can't find the off switch for this thread. Maybe this will lay it to rest with a few kind words. Thanks to all to those with positive advice, much appreciated, clarity rules. I've met some interesting folk on here, contact me privately if you wish - love discussion ... duh! To the others ... 'Words are a mirror on one's soul'. Ain't looking good for some! Remember, the arrow of time only points in one direction ------->


I'm switching it off for you

you asked what you could do in your situation - you have been told - talk to the landlord 

you initially said that you don't speak the language but then you say you speak '90%' - that's more than enough


if you don't get anywhere with that then you'll just have to take your chances in court


I'm sorry you didn't get the sympathy & support you seem to have wanted, but stories which change as the thread goes on & when that story includes 'living below the radar' you'll get little sympathy on this forum from those of us who pay our way in the country we chose to make our home - even if it means a daily financial struggle

the vast majority of us here live by the rules - being a free spirit is one thing - breaking the law something entirely different 



rant over 


I hope you do get this sorted & don't end up on the street - I wouldn't wish that on anyone - but the question is asked & answered so 

:closed_2:


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