# egyptian women....



## marenostrum

aren't they complicated.....
I know no talk of ones love life here but let me say how complicated these ladies are and I am talking about the westernised ones, you don't know what to believe when they talk to you....

Maybe it is just me but i just don't get it.....

Sorry for the rant.


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## MensEtManus

all women are complicated and nothing makes sense.... 

c'est la vie.


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## marenostrum

MensEtManus said:


> all women are complicated and nothing makes sense....
> 
> c'est la vie.


I would agree in general terms but I would put the egyptian ones top place for being complicated. I am not saying this in a derogatory way, lovely people, but very complicated.......


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## Emz000

In what way?? can you expand.. seems a random statement and Im curious ?????


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## Horus

I am not getting overly involved in this thread before a ton of hot coals fall on my head 

Women are the same the world over and so are men they can both be complicated because often they do not know what they want themselves.

We cannot turn this into a *"love lives" advice thread* and indeed we are all adults and I am not seeking advice or input, however I have met a westernised Arabic lady who is also educated.

She is the most witty, charming, classy, sexy, sensual,exotic lady who is also kind and caring and she brings sunshine into my life every minute of the day and I no longer feel like a tourist but like this is my home.

She is not in the least complicated and last night we were talking from around 9pm until 6.30am about random things like the meaning of life and the universe and she is my rock and we have been talking about long term non complicated plans.

If it was not for Ex Pat forum and members here behind the scenes (Sam, Hendra, and Maiden who I tried with my gems) who have provided support, help and advice...none of this including me being here and having accommodation would have been possible and I am forever grateful :clap2:

So no in answer to your question as a man my lady would never hurt me and is straight forward and *NOT* complicated in the least and that's a generalisation but she can't cook but I love to....!

PS my partying days are over :eyebrows:


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## marenostrum

Emz000 said:


> In what way?? can you expand.. seems a random statement and Im curious ?????


We have been told we cannot discuss this sort of thing here so i can't say much as it would refer to my experiences which is not allowed. 

But if you live in Egypt I can tell you that you'll find that relationships here are even more complicated than in our home countries, especially if mixed relationships (ie european guy and egyptian woman even if she is from the upper classes).


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## Emz000

marenostrum said:


> We have been told we cannot discuss this sort of thing here so i can't say much as it would refer to my experiences which is not allowed.
> 
> But if you live in Egypt I can tell you that you'll find that relationships here are even more complicated than in our home countries, especially if mixed relationships (ie european guy and egyptian woman even if she is from the upper classes).


oh ok i think i get it.. just seemed a really strange comment to come out with but im guessing you are involved with an Egyptian lady and she is keeping you on your toes?

as for not discussing it, its a shame as the interesting posts seem to get banned and not sure why as relationships are all part of the world of expats.. 

anyway, i would love to know more about Egyptian women and their lives as all my times being in egypt I hardly came across any and would love to have an insight! 

BTW women and complicated go hand in hand haha we are complex creatures


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## MaidenScotland

Emz000 said:


> oh ok i think i get it.. just seemed a really strange comment to come out with but im guessing you are involved with an Egyptian lady and she is keeping you on your toes?
> 
> as for not discussing it, its a shame as the interesting posts seem to get banned and not sure why as relationships are all part of the world of expats..
> 
> anyway, i would love to know more about Egyptian women and their lives as all my times being in egypt I hardly came across any and would love to have an insight!
> 
> BTW women and complicated go hand in hand haha we are complex creatures




When I have allowed these posts they just get out of hand


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## marenostrum

MaidenScotland said:


> When I have allowed these posts they just get out of hand


It depends on who is contributing to the discussion. We are all adults here I don't think there would be a problem discussing this issue here. I think it is part of expat life and an interesting subject that involves another culture different from ours. 

But i am not the moderator so it is not up to me to allow or not allow this discussion but I would say that plenty has been said about egyptian men on here in many threads, I think the world of egyptian women should be discussed too.


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## marenostrum

Emz000 said:


> oh ok i think i get it.. just seemed a really strange comment to come out with but im guessing you are involved with an Egyptian lady and she is keeping you on your toes?
> 
> as for not discussing it, its a shame as the interesting posts seem to get banned and not sure why as relationships are all part of the world of expats..
> 
> anyway, i would love to know more about Egyptian women and their lives as all my times being in egypt I hardly came across any and would love to have an insight!
> 
> BTW women and complicated go hand in hand haha we are complex creatures


keeping on toes is an understatement.......

anyhow there are several books on this sort of thing written by famous egyptian and arabic authors.

i find it strange you have not met egyptian women. Are you in Cairo?


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## MaidenScotland

marenostrum said:


> It depends on who is contributing to the discussion. We are all adults here I don't think there would be a problem discussing this issue here. I think it is part of expat life and an interesting subject that involves another culture different from ours.
> 
> But i am not the moderator so it is not up to me to allow or not allow this discussion but I would say that plenty has been said about egyptian men on here in many threads, I think the world of egyptian women should be discussed too.



I said there would be no more love stories on here..


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## Horus

I think the reason they got banned here is we had threads of the usual holiday romance and people and the mods grew weary of them and nobody is in the position to give advice and there are different opinions and scenarios it's not the sun newspaper advice column.

In some of the threads I made sweeping statements, unflattering derogatory remarks and I had my knuckles wrapped because people have different views which I accept so that probably was one of the reasons as well.

It has no bearing on her as a person and behind the scenes she is very accepting and patient person

So if Maiden says no more than no more we have to accept that and not question it or her finger starts hovering over the nuke button 

Sometimes when I play her up I have visions of a little blue vein on the forehead starts throbbing so I try to leave the lady alone.


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## Widget

Blimey Horus, you've been tamed!!!


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## Horus

Widget said:


> Blimey Horus, you've been tamed!!!


Yes I have no more womanising or partying and I am saddened that the only teddy bears I can find are a selection of plush camels in varying sizes with slogans that say "welcome to Egypt" and get handed over in a thick blue plastic bag that has the mask of tutankamun on it or little snow globes with pyramids in them

I am going to have to start taking photos of some of the crap I find here 

Everytime I see one of those glow in the dark key chains with a beetle entombed in it I have visions of Egyptians turning over stones and screaming in Arabic how they found something and one comes running over smiling with a plastic jug he found in the ditch and can of pyrosol


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## Widget

Horus said:


> Yes I have no more womanising or partying and I am saddened that the only teddy bears I can find are a selection of plush camels in varying sizes with slogans that say "welcome to Egypt" and get handed over in a thick blue plastic bag that has the mask of tutankamun on it or little snow globes with pyramids in them


Have you looked in Old Market, there's a little shop which sells all sorts, near where the boys clean the cars, I was bought a nice teddy from there. Failing that I have one spare I can bring you in April if you really feel the need!


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## Horus

Widget said:


> Have you looked in Old Market, there's a little shop which sells all sorts, near where the boys clean the cars, I was bought a nice teddy from there. Failing that I have one spare I can bring you in April if you really feel the need!


HEY THANKS 

Worthwhile gettting on the blue and white bus Old Sharm it is!!!

I would crawl on fours there if I had to


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## Widget

Horus said:


> HEY THANKS
> 
> Worthwhile gettting on the blue and white bus Old Sharm it is!!!
> 
> I would crawl on fours there if I had to


Don't get too excited they're not your Forever Friends or anything like that but a bear's a bear in my eyes.

Anyhoo :focus:


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## bat

marenostrum said:


> keeping on toes is an understatement.......
> 
> anyhow there are several books on this sort of thing written by famous egyptian and arabic authors.
> 
> i find it strange you have not met egyptian women. Are you in Cairo?


Was not going to answer to this thread but really , 
First of all Egyptian men are the ones who control womans day to day lives , so asking them is not your first option.
Second, the culture for Egyptian woman very restrictive on who they meet were they go, so not surprised you don't or have not met many.
There must be Egyptian woman on this forum who can explain the mind field that can be there lives especially un married living , brought up in Egypt.
Bat


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## marenostrum

bat said:


> Was not going to answer to this thread but really ,
> First of all Egyptian men are the ones who control womans day to day lives , so asking them is not your first option.
> Second, the culture for Egyptian woman very restrictive on who they meet were they go, so not surprised you don't or have not met many.
> There must be Egyptian woman on this forum who can explain the mind field that can be there lives especially un married living , brought up in Egypt.
> Bat


I don't agree entirely with this. It all depends on their social class. I have met girls here that can go out when they want with whom they want. They were from the "rich" upper class.

Obviously if you look at the lower classes they are nuch more restricted. I hate using this term lower class but you know how things work here.

All i am saying is that these girls don't have a very high opinion of egyptian men in general and they like to date foreign guys. But when it is about making up something more serious in the long term they don't want to know. 
They may be free to go out and stuff like that but 9 times out of 10 they end up marrying an egyptyian even if for years they have hated the idea of doing this.

Also here behind close doors everything goes on but lets leave this bit out.


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## bat

marenostrum said:


> I don't agree entirely with this. It all depends on their social class. I have met girls here that can go out when they want with whom they want. They were from the "rich" upper class.
> 
> Obviously if you look at the lower classes they are nuch more restricted. I hate using this term lower class but you know how things work here.
> 
> All i am saying is that these girls don't have a very high opinion of egyptian men in general and they like to date foreign guys. But when it is about making up something more serious in the long term they don't want to know.
> They may be free to go out and stuff like that but 9 times out of 10 they end up marrying an egyptyian even if for years they have hated the idea of doing this.
> 
> Also here behind close doors everything goes on but lets leave this bit out.


Yes, again agree, but do you think there parents have any idea what there up tp high or low class, of course not the mothers know, what there doing but most of the fathers absolutely no idea and when these girls are caught, they know what kind of punishment there in for!!
And yes they eventually will marry someone suitable for them, they can't do anything else. Bat


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## Emz000

marenostrum said:


> keeping on toes is an understatement.......
> 
> anyhow there are several books on this sort of thing written by famous egyptian and arabic authors.
> 
> i find it strange you have not met egyptian women. Are you in Cairo?


do you know the names of any? I read Playing Cards in Cairo and loved it. Enjoy getting a bit of of insight into a world that is closed off to the the rest of us. 

No Im not in Cairo, I am trying to find some decent work over there though, but still looking. I go back and forth to Hurghada and I see few Egyptian ladies but they are usually with their husband and unapproacable. Not that id approach them anyway lol but you know what I mean.. 

In response to the last couple of posts, what i want to know is are these women happy? I understand what goes on behind closed doors and that the marriage is a different ballgame to what we have in UK, but do they fall in love and get married or do they not usually love their husbands?
Also, when they are controlled so much, are they all secretly miserable or are they happy with this as they dont know any different? 

I looked at some photos of a childs birthday party, was my boyfriends friends child and the women all looked so unhappy. either not smiling or smiles never met their eyes. i was shocked and thought poor women but i could be totally wrong..


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## marenostrum

Emz000 said:


> do you know the names of any? I read Playing Cards in Cairo and loved it. Enjoy getting a bit of of insight into a world that is closed off to the the rest of us.
> 
> No Im not in Cairo, I am trying to find some decent work over there though, but still looking. I go back and forth to Hurghada and I see few Egyptian ladies but they are usually with their husband and unapproacable. Not that id approach them anyway lol but you know what I mean..
> 
> In response to the last couple of posts, what i want to know is are these women happy? I understand what goes on behind closed doors and that the marriage is a different ballgame to what we have in UK, but do they fall in love and get married or do they not usually love their husbands?
> Also, when they are controlled so much, are they all secretly miserable or are they happy with this as they dont know any different?
> 
> I looked at some photos of a childs birthday party, was my boyfriends friends child and the women all looked so unhappy. either not smiling or smiles never met their eyes. i was shocked and thought poor women but i could be totally wrong..


Hi, I am not sure if this thread is locked or not yet but on my browser the reply buttons still appears so I'll have a go at answering some of your questions.

In answer to your question i think that generally from what i have witnessed the egypitan youth have a very strange relationship with the world of "love". I have seen so many contradictions in people here over this subject.

It is as if they are afraid to love someone 100%, I mean their songs always go on about undying love and all that but the reality is quite different.

This is why some of the women like to have "illicit" relationships with foreign men. By illicit i don't necessarily mean anything sexual but just that for their society a relationship between an egyptian woman and a foreign man is "illicit" if you know what i mean. I think they feel controlled by the egyptian man in general, they may like someone but other factors always play into it such as the father, the money, the flat that needs to be bought before the marriage etc etc. Basically there are too many factors for them to appreciate a healthy and loving relationship with someone regardless of their race. They never, 99% of the time, marry a foreign bloke. Plenty of egyptian men marry foreign girls...

Some of these girls are sexually liberated too but at the end of the day when it comes to the crunch ie. settling down, the familiy especially the father still plays a crucial role no matter how westernised they are in their behaviour.
Also egyptian men place certain expectation on the women that they themselves are not willing to abide by, total hypocrisy.....then we have the whole subject of the orfi marriage which is an absolute farse and a disgrace but here i digress.
I don't think they have a very good opinion of egyptian men in general as they feel they have to abide by a lengthy code of conduct whilst the guys can get pretty much away with whatever they want.


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## bat

marenostrum said:


> Hi, I am not sure if this thread is locked or not yet but on my browser the reply buttons still appears so I'll have a go at answering some of your questions.
> 
> In answer to your question i think that generally from what i have witnessed the egypitan youth have a very strange relationship with the world of "love". I have seen so many contradictions in people here over this subject.
> 
> It is as if they are afraid to love someone 100%, I mean their songs always go on about undying love and all that but the reality is quite different.
> 
> This is why some of the women like to have "illicit" relationships with foreign men. By illicit i don't necessarily mean anything sexual but just that for their society a relationship between an egyptian woman and a foreign man is "illicit" if you know what i mean. I think they feel controlled by the egyptian man in general, they may like someone but other factors always play into it such as the father, the money, the flat that needs to be bought before the marriage etc etc. Basically there are too many
> factors for them to appreciate a healthy and loving relationship with someone
> regardless of their race. They never, 99% of the time, marry a foreign bloke. Plenty
> of egyptian men marry foreign girls..
> 
> Some of these girls are sexually liberated too but at the end of the day when it comes to the crunch ie. settling down, the familiy especially the father still plays a crucial role no matter how westernised they are in their behaviour.
> Also egyptian men place certain expectation on the women that they themselves are
> 
> not willing to abide by, total hypocrisy.....then we have the whole subject of the
> marriage which is an absolute farse and a disgrace but here i digress.
> 
> 
> I don't think they have a very good opinion of egyptian men in general as they feel they have to abide by a lengthy code of conduct whilst the guys can get pretty much away with whatever they want.


Not just foreign men but any men,is off limits unless they are with a brother or cousin.


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## Horus

marenostrum said:


> I don't agree entirely with this. It all depends on their social class. I have met girls here that can go out when they want with whom they want. They were from the "rich" upper class.
> 
> Obviously if you look at the lower classes they are nuch more restricted. I hate using this term lower class but you know how things work here.
> 
> All i am saying is that these girls don't have a very high opinion of egyptian men in general and they like to date foreign guys. But when it is about making up something more serious in the long term they don't want to know.
> They may be free to go out and stuff like that but 9 times out of 10 they end up marrying an egyptyian even if for years they have hated the idea of doing this.
> 
> Also here behind close doors everything goes on but lets leave this bit out.


Actually we are making long term plans so there is an exception to every rule she finds it different not to be controlled and to have a man who cooks, cleans and irons plus leaves candles around the bath and treats her like a princess except she needs to get used to me chasing her around with spiders and telling her some are in her hair 

I am not making this into an Egyptian man bashing thread we know what some of them but not all can be like they want a second mother not a wife.

I need to see how it goes sort out a few things and file for divorce as I have property in the UK

In theory I could get remarried just as a piece of paper as I was married in the UK I am not English and my marriage was never registered at my embassy as you need a letter from your embassy to see you either have never been married or are divorced however it would not be legal but a piece of paper so my embassy would say I was single.

Then when that is all done and dusted I will ask her mother's permission out of respect as she said don't ask her dad (it was my idea) and propose on one knee somewhere romantic


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## marenostrum

bat said:


> Not just foreign men but any men,is off limits unless they are with a brother or cousin.


i don't think this is the case for many.
Upper class girls do date men on their own, even foreign ones.
But when it comes to the family knowing and accepting a long term relationship, then no chance.


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## Horus

marenostrum said:


> i don't think this is the case for many.
> Upper class girls do date men on their own, even foreign ones.
> But when it comes to the family knowing and accepting a long term relationship, then no chance.


I don't really care if am accepted it or not I will see her mum's body langauge when I meet her - this is 2011


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## txlstewart

Really, Horus--talking marriage so soon? And while still married? Have you ever thought that taking some time to get used to being solo AFTER your divorce is final would not be a good thing? I have friends, both female and male, who cannot go for any length of time without a steady boyfriend or girlfriend. It's not healthy! One must be at ease when all alone before launching a new relationship! (Living apart whilst still married does not count!)

While it has been entertaining (at times) to read of your exploits, we really just want you to be happy (and out of jail)....


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## jojo

txlstewart said:


> Really, Horus--talking marriage so soon? And while still married? Have you ever thought that taking some time to get used to being solo AFTER your divorce is final would not be a good thing? I have friends, both female and male, who cannot go for any length of time without a steady boyfriend or girlfriend. It's not healthy! One must be at ease when all alone before launching a new relationship! (Living apart whilst still married does not count!)
> 
> While it has been entertaining (at times) to read of your exploits, we really just want you to be happy (and out of jail)....


To be honest, having gleaned thru some of Horus's exploits, if he really is considering settling down with someone already, then he deserves all he gets! You cannot know someone well enough in such a short space of time to talk "forever" Stop being so Needy and desperate Horus hun!!!

Jo xxx


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## marenostrum

horus please you know i like your posts but don't tell us your private stuff or the thread will be closed. This is an interesting topic and it would be a shame if it got shut down.


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## Emz000

as interesting as horus's love life is... back to Egyptian Women, can anyone who knows ladies in Egypt tell me what do they do for fun, obviously the upper class ladies I imagine do similar to us in going for lunch, spas, shopping etc but your average working class ladies, do they go out for lunch when the kids are at school or go to their friends house and gossip as mates do, or do they watch television in the house etc what do they actually get up to??

also, when Im in Egypt with my Egyptian boyf, they will look and what are they thinking?? do they pity me and any other tourist / foreigner for having such an apparently frivoulous, 'god-less' life or are they envious that we have a much easier free life?


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## marenostrum

Emz000 said:


> as interesting as horus's love life is... back to Egyptian Women, can anyone who knows ladies in Egypt tell me what do they do for fun, obviously the upper class ladies I imagine do similar to us in going for lunch, spas, shopping etc but your average working class ladies, do they go out for lunch when the kids are at school or go to their friends house and gossip as mates do, or do they watch television in the house etc what do they actually get up to??
> 
> also, when Im in Egypt with my Egyptian boyf, they will look and what are they thinking?? do they pity me and any other tourist / foreigner for having such an apparently frivoulous, 'god-less' life or are they envious that we have a much easier free life?


I can only answer for the upper classes ones. They live like we do in the West, clothes, shopping, ipod, disco, retaurants, holidays, fast cars, jobs, dating etc etc.
They like to act as princesses as well. Family is not as invasive as for women of other classes UNTIL marriage talk happens then it is a whole different situation...

For the working class ones i am not sure cause i have not met any in my time here but i would say that they tend to spend a lot of their time with family, parents and the like. If they are married the husband is likely to place certain restrictions on who they go out with etc etc.

I would not worry about being judged by the ones looking at you. I don't think rich egyptians are startled by us westerners as the poor are.

To be honest here as i said before behind closed doors everything goes with some of these youth especially the richer ones so i would not bother if they are judging you for how you behave, if they do then they are hypocrites....


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## bat

marenostrum said:


> I can only answer for the upper classes ones. They live like we do in the West, clothes, shopping, ipod, disco, retaurants, holidays, fast cars, jobs, dating etc etc.
> They like to act as princesses as well. Family is not as invasive as for women of other classes UNTIL marriage talk happens then it is a whole different situation...
> 
> For the working class ones i am not sure cause i have not met any in my time here but i would say that they tend to spend a lot of their time with family, parents and the like. If they are married the husband is likely to place certain restrictions on who they go out with etc etc.
> 
> I would not worry about being judged by the ones looking at you. I don't think rich egyptians are startled by us westerners as the poor are.
> 
> To be honest here as i said before behind closed doors everything goes with some of these youth especially the richer ones so i would not bother if they are judging you for how you behave, if they do then they are hypocrites....


Think that's about it in a nut shell!


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## bat

bat said:


> Think that's about it in a nut shell!


I have my daughter down on my mobile as the queen, before that she was the princess!!


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## MaidenScotland

bat said:


> I have my daughter down on my mobile as the queen, before that she was the princess!!




Amir and Amira.... used to make me smile when I heard the name lol


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## marenostrum

Emz000 said:


> do you know the names of any?


I would suggest you read books written by an author called naghouib mafouz. These are very interesting even though a little bit dated.
I would also read articles written by this guy, I think he used to write for Al Ahram english weekly not sure if he does now. He did a few years back.


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## stefnova

marenostrum said:


> I would suggest you read books written by an author called naghouib mafouz. These are very interesting even though a little bit dated.
> I would also read articles written by this guy, I think he used to write for Al Ahram english weekly not sure if he does now. He did a few years back.


No he died in August 2006.


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## stefnova

Emz000 said:


> as interesting as horus's love life is... back to Egyptian Women, can anyone who knows ladies in Egypt tell me what do they do for fun, obviously the upper class ladies I imagine do similar to us in going for lunch, spas, shopping etc but your average working class ladies, do they go out for lunch when the kids are at school or go to their friends house and gossip as mates do, or do they watch television in the house etc what do they actually get up to??
> 
> also, when Im in Egypt with my Egyptian boyf, they will look and what are they thinking?? do they pity me and any other tourist / foreigner for having such an apparently frivoulous, 'god-less' life or are they envious that we have a much easier free life?


Depending on how much money they have, Egyptian women who have children their lives will revolve around their children and household duites. 

they'll cook, clean, take care of the kids, mingle with their neighbours, gossip, have round family and friends, go round thier houses unanounced, drink tea, eat loads. Husband generally has to know where they are all the time.


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## bat

marenostrum said:


> I would suggest you read books written by an author called naghouib mafouz. These are very interesting even though a little bit dated.
> I would also read articles written by this guy, I think he used to write for Al Ahram english weekly not sure if he does now. He did a few years back.


Yes did do many years back and can't see what all the fuss is about. Very overrated.
Bat


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## marenostrum

bat said:


> Yes did do many years back and can't see what all the fuss is about. Very overrated.
> Bat


I did not know he had died, shows how ignorant i am!!

I used to like his books but there again i was 17 18 when i read them, maybe now that i am a little older i would probably not like them too much.


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## MaidenScotland

marenostrum said:


> I did not know he had died, shows how ignorant i am!!
> 
> I used to like his books but there again i was 17 18 when i read them, maybe now that i am a little older i would probably not like them too much.




I personally don't like his style of writing... but it may be because it is lost in translation. 

Yes he died a few years ago, he lived up the road from me and there is a wall dedicated to him under the 6th October bridge.

Maiden


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## Horus

stefnova said:


> Depending on how much money they have, Egyptian women who have children their lives will revolve around their children and household duites.
> 
> they'll cook, clean, take care of the kids, mingle with their neighbours, gossip, have round family and friends, go round thier houses unanounced, drink tea, eat loads. Husband generally has to know where they are all the time.


Mine must be the exception to the rule, she goes out with her friends, swimming and I can assure does not eat loads, and only likes cold hibiscus tea when she has a flu

She cooked her first meal yesterday

..she can't do the Arabic dance however I suppose you can't have everything

2 weeks I get to meet the family I was already told to take no notice of her father I will report back on my misadventure, if I don't you know I have been rolled up in a Persian rug beaten, and thrown in the desert for the camels to be eaten


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## stefnova

Horus said:


> Mine must be the exception to the rule, she goes out with her friends, swimming and I can assure does not eat loads, has a body you would die for and only likes cold hibiscus tea when she has a flu
> 
> She cooked her first meal yesterday
> 
> ..she can't do the Arabic dance however I suppose you can't have everything
> 
> 2 weeks I get to meet the family I was already told to take no notice of her father I will report back on my misadventure, if I don't you know I have been rolled up in a Persian rug beaten, and thrown in the desert for the camels to be eaten


Yes but yours is not married to an Egyptian with kids, I was purly basing mine on the people that live round our area, who are all from a varity of classes. These are just your typical lower class families.


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## bat

stefnova said:


> Yes but yours is not married to an Egyptian with kids, I was purly basing mine on the people that live round our area, who are all from a varity of classes. These are just your typical lower class families.


Not sure were you live , but rest assured they will not be considering themselves low class, the places were they live are what would be your worst nightmare.
Places didn't know existed for years, eye opener.


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## Emz000

marenostrum said:


> I would suggest you read books written by an author called naghouib mafouz. These are very interesting even though a little bit dated.
> I would also read articles written by this guy, I think he used to write for Al Ahram english weekly not sure if he does now. He did a few years back.


Thanks, Ive just googled him and seems like the kind of thing Im looking for. 

It amazes me that we are all the same species living on the same planet and just depending on pot luck where we are born, our lives are soooo different. When in Egypt, I look at the Egyptian women, (not sure but id guess they are more lower class than rich due to neighbourhood) and I switch between thinking how lucky I am to be born who and where I am and then I think maybe they are the lucky ones compared to us in Uk trying to juggle families, careers, relationships and burning ourselves out. They may be controlled and have little luxuries but at least they know what expected of them and their lives seem fairly straightforward, rather than having to constantly make decisions and juggle a million plates at once. 
I dont know who's better off to be honest...


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## stefnova

bat said:


> Not sure were you live , but rest assured they will not be considering themselves low class, the places were they live are what would be your worst nightmare.
> Places didn't know existed for years, eye opener.


And how do you know I haven't been to these places? What I was saying was based on a general outlook of typical egyptian wives not girls you'll find working in sharm as I was trying to explain to Horus. I did mean working class not lower class as I stated before.


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## bat

stefnova said:


> And how do you know I haven't been to these places? What I was saying was based on a general outlook of typical egyptian wives not girls you'll find working in sharm as I was trying to explain to Horus. I did mean working class not lower class as I stated before.


No I've no idea maybe you have, but those places, most Egyptians don't know about them because they don't exist and have no names.as for girls working in sharm I always get the impression that not very many,
But then in sharm I'm chief cook and bottle washer, so when there all going out, I'm going to bed shattered.bat


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## stefnova

bat said:


> No I've no idea maybe you have, but those places, most Egyptians don't know about them because they don't exist and have no names.as for girls working in sharm I always get the impression that not very many,
> But then in sharm I'm chief cook and bottle washer, so when there all going out, I'm going to bed shattered.bat


correct me if I'm wrong then i'd assume that these places are not low class but are people living in poverty?!? 

I'd always hear people saying that the market sellers in sog al obour who give the impression they are poor but actually have more money than most working class families but still choose to live very poor because they don't know any other way to live


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## MaidenScotland

stefnova said:


> correct me if I'm wrong then i'd assume that these places are not low class but are people living in poverty?!?
> 
> I'd always hear people saying that the market sellers in sog al obour who give the impression they are poor but actually have more money than most working class families but still choose to live very poor because they don't know any other way to live[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> ... they may choose to live in a poor area that houses their family, friends and old neighbours because it suits them, not because they don't know any other way to live....you will be saying the money is wasted on them next.
> .


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## bat

stefnova said:


> correct me if I'm wrong then i'd assume that these places are not low class but are people living in poverty?!?
> 
> I'd always hear people saying that the market sellers in sog al obour who give the impression they are poor but actually have more money than most working class families but still choose to live very poor because they don't know any other way to live


Are we talking about abour veg market,some not all have more money then some so called rich who live in katameya heights, they choose to spend it differently, and they don't live poor by Egyptian standards, only by western standers.
There are many fabulously wealthy Egyptians who live in popular areas, because they like it,these are the same people who are in front of you in the bank with 1 million le to be counted when your in a hurry. The problem in Egypt is the high class and low class, are not necessarily the rich and the poor.
Yes these places are people in poverty, but they consider homeless worse then them. Who am I to tell them otherwise.
Bat


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## stefnova

MaidenScotland said:


> stefnova said:
> 
> 
> 
> correct me if I'm wrong then i'd assume that these places are not low class but are people living in poverty?!?
> 
> I'd always hear people saying that the market sellers in sog al obour who give the impression they are poor but actually have more money than most working class families but still choose to live very poor because they don't know any other way to live[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> ... they may choose to live in a poor area that houses their family, friends and old neighbours because it suits them, not because they don't know any other way to live....you will be saying the money is wasted on them next.
> .
> 
> 
> 
> probably didn't translate it right as i was translating it from how i was told in arabic,
> 
> im curious to know why i gave you the impression i'd be saying the money id be saying the money is wasted on them next, why?
Click to expand...


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## bat

stefnova said:


> MaidenScotland said:
> 
> 
> 
> probably didn't translate it right as i was translating it from how i was told in arabic,
> 
> im curious to know why i gave you the impression i'd be saying the money id be saying the money is wasted on them next, why?
> 
> 
> 
> Quite a few high class poor Egyptians ,feel that way about people they regard as lower standard with money.
> I'm not saying that you do but it's a comment that I have heard( not on this forum either) bat
Click to expand...


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## MaidenScotland

stefnova said:


> MaidenScotland said:
> 
> 
> 
> probably didn't translate it right as i was translating it from how i was told in arabic,
> 
> im curious to know why i gave you the impression i'd be saying the money id be saying the money is wasted on them next, why?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the reason I said it..
> 
> > families but still choose to live very poor because they don't know any other way to live
Click to expand...


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