# Residencia



## 90199 (Mar 21, 2010)

I was asked on another forum, "What happens if I do not apply for residency within 90days"?

Well I have searched but cannot find any thing that tells me of the penalties for not applying for residencia.

There are quite a few who have lived for years in the Canary Isles and quite deliberately not bothered applying for residencia, and a few who think that it is the choice of the individual and not mandatory.

Anyone know the penalties?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Hepa said:


> I was asked on another forum, "What happens if I do not apply for residency within 90days"?
> 
> Well I have searched but cannot find any thing that tells me of the penalties for not applying for residencia.
> 
> ...


as far as I understand it, EU citizens won't/can't be deported, but they can be fined

it's definitely not a matter of choice though - this says it's obligatory 

Art.7.1



> . Los ciudadanos de un Estado miembro de la Unión Europea o de otro Estado parte en el Acuerdo sobre el
> Espacio Económico Europeo tienen derecho a residir en
> territorio español por un período superior a tres meses.
> *Los interesados estarán obligados* a solicitar personal-
> ...



taken from http://www.boe.es/boe/dias/2007/02/28/pdfs/A08558-08566.pdf

I don't have time to read the entire thing, but there might be something there about penalties

of course, anyone not registered as resident is more than likely not on the padrón nor submitting tax returns or 720 declarations - I'd be more worried about the tax office catching up with me


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## 90199 (Mar 21, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> as far as I understand it, EU citizens won't/can't be deported, but they can be fined
> 
> it's definitely not a matter of choice though - this says it's obligatory
> 
> ...


A sort of relative, lived and worked for years on one of the larger islands, never registered with any of the authorities, was self employed, cash only. He told me that this was quite common if not the norm.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Hepa said:


> A sort of relative, lived and worked for years on one of the larger islands, never registered with any of the authorities, was self employed, cash only. He told me that this was quite common if not the norm.


it certainly used to be the 'norm' - here too

but the authorities are getting much better at catching up with people than they used to be - & people are starting to refuse to use those who are working on the black - in my area, anyway - & even reporting them to hacienda

I don't mean the guy scraping around doing a pool or garden here & there for peanuts - illegal as that is

I mean those who are clearly earning a fortune, who have websites & advertise openly (even on the radio!) & they are even 'employing' others!


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## 90199 (Mar 21, 2010)

I think I have found the answer here 

P?gina oficial de la DGP-Documentaci?n

and if my interpretation of the regulation is correct, being found to be a resident and not having registered carries a fine of €301 to a maximum of E6000


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## damnit (Jul 11, 2013)

As a EU citizen you won't have to request any residency visa or something like that. But that "Registro central de extranjeros" is good even for you to do it. Doesn't mean anything but your country to know where you are! That's all I think, everybody living abroad should do it, definitely.


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## damnit (Jul 11, 2013)

Hepa said:


> I think I have found the answer here
> 
> P?gina oficial de la DGP-Documentaci?n
> 
> and if my interpretation of the regulation is correct, being found to be a resident and not having registered carries a fine of €301 to a maximum of E6000


that doesn't exactly apply to you, as you are not considered "Extranjero" (foreigner). That link you've posted applies to "no comunitarios", as is, people not belonging to the EU.

But again, would be a great idea if you register in the Padrón or Registro Central de Extranjeros


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

damnit said:


> As a EU citizen you won't have to request any residency visa or something like that. But that "Registro central de extranjeros" is good even for you to do it. Doesn't mean anything but your country to know where you are! That's all I think, everybody living abroad should do it, definitely.


Are you saying that the law, as quoted in post #2, does not apply?

It looks pretty clear cut to me that we MUST register.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> Are you saying that the law, as quoted in post #2, does not apply?
> 
> It looks pretty clear cut to me that we MUST register.


it _is_ clear cut - we are 'obliged' to register

the bit about the fines doesn't 'appear' to apply to EU citizens, because it's under the 'extranjeros' subheading

but if we're not extranjeros, why do we have a Número de Indentidad de Extranjero??


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## Glasgow Billy (Apr 21, 2014)

snikpoh said:


> Are you saying that the law, as quoted in post #2, does not apply?
> 
> It looks pretty clear cut to me that we MUST register.


I am new to the forums on spain and read recently elsewhere that registration counts towards the population, which enables local authority to apply for more money from central Government. It would make sense to me if you dont register and get a fine, because in reality you are preventing them from applying for a bigger budget. If (random number) people done this it could be a reasonable amount the lose out on.

I will be living there soon as a non resident, but will still go register with the authorities just to be on the safe side.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Glasgow Billy said:


> I am new to the forums on spain and read recently elsewhere that registration counts towards the population, which enables local authority to apply for more money from central governement. It would make sense to me if you dont register in reality you are preventing them from applying for a bigger budget.
> 
> I will be living there soon as a non resident, but will still go register with the authorities just to be on the safe side.


that's the padrón - totally different to 'registering as resident'

both are obligatory for residents though


http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...ering-padr-n-voting-2015-local-elections.html


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## 90199 (Mar 21, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> it _is_ clear cut - we are 'obliged' to register
> 
> the bit about the fines doesn't 'appear' to apply to EU citizens, because it's under the 'extranjeros' subheading
> 
> but if we're not extranjeros, why do we have a Número de Indentidad de Extranjero??


Somewhere there must be a penalty for citizens of the E.U. who do not register, but I have yet to find it.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Hepa said:


> Somewhere there must be a penalty for citizens of the E.U. who do not register, but I have yet to find it.


it's gotta be there somewhere!!

I'm still feeling like I was hit by a bus & can't concentrate properly, so I'm not ploughing through Spanish laws today!


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Hepa said:


> Somewhere there must be a penalty for citizens of the E.U. who do not register, but I have yet to find it.


The main penalty is that one finds out when one wishes to do something and one is told "Sorry, no you can't because you aren't on the register." Somebody near here wanted to change his car and took his white NIE form along (because he hasn't registered and got his green form) and was told that he can't buy the car on which he has paid €1,000 as a deposit.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> The main penalty is that one finds out when one wishes to do something and one is told "Sorry, no you can't because you aren't on the register." Somebody near here wanted to change his car and took his white NIE form along (because he hasn't registered and got his green form) and was told that he can't buy the car on which he has paid €1,000 as a deposit.


ahhh - but legally non-residents can buy a car - so all they should need is his NIE & escritura

of course if he's resident he _should _be registered as such & also on the padrón - but he needs neither to buy a car


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> ahhh - but legally non-residents can buy a car - so all they should need is his NIE & escritura
> 
> of course if he's resident he _should _be registered as such & also on the padrón - but he needs neither to buy a car


But officially he needs to have a Spanish address and legal proof of it because of the vehicle taxation which will be raised by the Ayuntamiento of where the vehicle is registered.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> But officially he needs to have a Spanish address and legal proof of it because of the vehicle taxation which will be raised by the Ayuntamiento of where the vehicle is registered.


so what is his escritura?? that has his address on it

& it would have the same name as his NIE & his passport

& the res cert isn't proof of ID so he'd need his passport anyway


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## Heli Annika (Apr 17, 2014)

Does a NIE number connect to being a resident somehow?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Heli Annika said:


> Does a NIE number connect to being a resident somehow?


no - non-residents can get a NIE

you don't even have to come to Spain to get one


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## 90199 (Mar 21, 2010)

Here it is,

El incumplimiento de la obligación de solicitar la tarjeta de residencia o del certificado de registro conllevará la aplicación de las sanciones pecuniarias que, en idénticos términos y para supuestos similares, se establezca para los ciudadanos españoles en relación con el Documento Nacional de Identidad.

Hidden away in this link 
P?gina oficial de la DGP-Documentaci?n

Translation says, failure to apply for residencia will incur the same penalties, that apply to a Spanish National that would be imposed, for failure to apply for national identity documents.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Hepa said:


> Here it is,
> 
> El incumplimiento de la obligación de solicitar la tarjeta de residencia o del certificado de registro conllevará la aplicación de las sanciones pecuniarias que, en idénticos términos y para supuestos similares, se establezca para los ciudadanos españoles en relación con el Documento Nacional de Identidad.
> 
> ...


yay!!


now we just need to know what the penalties are for Spanish Nationals who don't apply for their DNI


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> it _is_ clear cut - we are 'obliged' to register
> 
> the bit about the fines doesn't 'appear' to apply to EU citizens, because it's under the 'extranjeros' subheading
> 
> but if we're not extranjeros, why do we have a Número de Indentidad de Extranjero??


... of course we are! and that's how we are officially pigeon-holed.


However, the Spanish (generally speaking) don't see us like that. I had quite an argument with a Spanish friend who was absolutely adamant that we were NOT extranjeros!


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