# Antibiotics



## spanish_nomad (Sep 12, 2016)

Hi

We are going to La Zenia for 7 weeks.

Is it possible to buy antibiotics over the counter. I have read that the law does not allow over the counter sales of antibiotics. But I know in many countries pharmacies flaunt these laws.

May thanks for your help.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

spanish_nomad said:


> Hi
> 
> We are going to La Zenia for 7 weeks.
> 
> ...


If you have a prescription from your GP in the UK for antibiotocs, ask for a Cross-border prescription, which will be accepted in Spain.


Yes it's illegal to sell antibiotics without a prescription in Spain, although some pharmacists still do it - at the risk of losing their licence.


----------



## spanish_nomad (Sep 12, 2016)

Thanks


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

xabiaxica said:


> Yes it's illegal to sell antibiotics without a prescription in Spain, although some pharmacists still do it - at the risk of losing their licence.


I believe in Andalucia they can sell you antibiotics if you have a condition that they decide needs them - but with strict instructions to go to the doctor if it' hasn't cleared up after a week.


----------



## Love Karma (Oct 10, 2018)

Alcalaina said:


> I believe in Andalucia they can sell you antibiotics if you have a condition that they decide needs them - but with strict instructions to go to the doctor if it' hasn't cleared up after a week.


Never had a problem buying them OTC here in Andalucia.


----------



## kalohi (May 6, 2012)

I'm in Andalucia, and now the pharmacies in my area won't even sell paracetamol 650 without a prescription. They started refusing to sell antibiotics without a prescription years ago. 

So obviously it's hit or miss, depending on the area.


----------



## Love Karma (Oct 10, 2018)

kalohi said:


> I'm in Andalucia, and now the pharmacies in my area won't even sell paracetamol 650 without a prescription. They started refusing to sell antibiotics without a prescription years ago.
> 
> So obviously it's hit or miss, depending on the area.


Can still by Paracetamol 1g and Clamoxyl 1g in a variety of farmacias in my area. Yes as with many things dependant on area


----------



## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

You do not say where you are from but if you have an EHIC then if you have a condition for which you need them, you can see a ‘National Health’ doctor and get a prescription. 

You have to pay the full price for medicines but if you are from U.K., you can recover the cost from DWP, although I understand it takes paperwork and a substantial period of time.


----------



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Is it any wonder the world is in such a state regarding antibiotics when Joe public self-prescribe.

How can anyone know if they actually need them without going to a doctor.

If you have genuinely run out (highly unlikely) then go to a doctor.


----------



## Love Karma (Oct 10, 2018)

snikpoh said:


> Is it any wonder the world is in such a state regarding antibiotics when Joe public self-prescribe.
> 
> *How can anyone know if they actually need them without going to a doctor.*
> 
> If you have genuinely run out (highly unlikely) then go to a doctor.


What a condescending remark. Anyone who suffers from recurrent tooth abscess's or chest infections knows when they need a course of antibiotics.


----------



## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

spanish_nomad said:


> Hi
> 
> We are going to La Zenia for 7 weeks.
> 
> ...


If you need antibiotics, then your U.K. GP will prescribe you the amount required. 

If you suffer from a reoccurring issue that requires antibiotics again your GP will supply you. Alternatively, if it occurs when you are here, whatever it is, your EHIC or travel insurance will kick in.

Regarding patients know when they need antibiotics, thirty years of nursing experience tells me this is not the case. People think antibiotics are a cure all, people don’t finish courses, they want antibiotics for conditions that don’t require antibiotics. Antibiotics are not paracetamol to be taken because you “ feel” you need them 

Snikpoh is correct, it’s the overuse and disregard for their use that has led to infections that can’t be controlled.


----------



## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

“ it’s the overuse and disregard for their use that has led to infections that can’t be controlled “

I thought I read that was a problem largely caused by doctor over prescribing and prescribing when not required. 

Of course wrongly self prescribing is also a potential problem but again that would not be possible if pharmacies did not sell over the counter, probably in contravention of the law.


----------



## blondebob (Aug 16, 2019)

Yes indeed I was under the impression the resistance was caused by the medics themselves with Gp's dishing them out like smarties in the U.K. Not patients self diagnosing and you can't but them over the counter in the U.K anyway.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

blondebob said:


> Yes indeed I was under the impression the resistance was caused by the medics themselves with Gp's dishing them out like smarties in the U.K. Not patients self diagnosing and you can't but them over the counter in the U.K anyway.


Not just in the UK, but across the world. And not just in humans - the routine use of antibiotics given to factory-farmed animals raised in unhygienic conditions to stop them getting infections is a major contributor to bacteria becoming resistant to antibiotics.


----------



## blondebob (Aug 16, 2019)

Alcalaina said:


> Not just in the UK, but across the world. And not just in humans -* the routine use of antibiotics given to factory-farmed animals raised* in unhygienic conditions to stop them getting infections is a major contributor to bacteria becoming resistant to antibiotics.


Good point and after Brexit the risk will rise exponentially when the flood gates open and American reared produce is imported to the U.K.


----------



## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

blondebob said:


> Yes indeed I was under the impression the resistance was caused by the medics themselves with Gp's dishing them out like smarties in the U.K. Not patients self diagnosing and you can't but them over the counter in the U.K anyway.


Correct BUT I was referring to the OP post and the comment people know....

GPS have over prescribed in the past, patients also don’t finish courses given mainly because they “feelL better after a few days. That does not take away the fact that patients feel any condition requires antibiotics and I have seen patients complain bitterly that GPs and Hospital Drs are failing them because they no longer prescribe antibiotics as a matter of course. Over subscription is a thing of the past, in my own trust, routine antibiotics were abandoned for surgery over 12 years ago.


----------



## blondebob (Aug 16, 2019)

Megsmum said:


> Correct BUT I was referring to the OP post and the comment people know....
> 
> GPS have over prescribed in the past, patients also don’t finish courses given mainly because they “feelL better after a few days. That does not take away the fact that patients feel any condition requires antibiotics and I have seen patients complain bitterly that GPs and Hospital Drs are failing them because they no longer prescribe antibiotics as a matter of course. Over subscription is a thing of the past, in my own trust, routine antibiotics were abandoned for surgery over 12 years ago.


Anyway, the entire thing is a mockery as you can buy every antibiotic online.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

blondebob said:


> Good point and after Brexit the risk will rise exponentially when the flood gates open and American reared produce is imported to the U.K.


An even bigger risk is that UK meat producers will start using them more, when they are no regulated by the EU.


----------



## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

blondebob said:


> Anyway, the entire thing is a mockery as you can buy every antibiotic online.


Can’t disagree with that and animal food products full of god knows what


----------



## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

_"An even bigger risk is that UK meat producers will start using them more, when they are no regulated by the EU. "_

Maybe I am wrong but I cannot see any reason why UK would abandon any rules or practices which are sensible. I suspect only remainers would even suggest that. 

Leaving the EU will not mean UK abandons it brains. 

I do not know specifically, but there is every reason to believe that at least some of the good practices of the EU were as a result of UK input


----------



## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Juan C said:


> Maybe I am wrong but I cannot see any reason why UK would abandon any rules or practices which are sensible. Only remainers would even suggest that.
> 
> Leaving the EU will not mean UK abandons it brains.
> 
> I do not know specifically but there is every reason to believe that at least some of the good practices of the EU were as a result of UK input


I refer you to chlorinated chicken. Chickens processed in chlorine because the animal husbandry is so awful that the chickens are full of bacteria hence banned in the EU but miraculously now approved by the chef medical whatever officer post Brexit. Please stop all this crap about only remainers would say that, one could retort with only Brexit supporters would say that but really, three years past the vote and we are still in name calling territory it’s so bloody tiresome.


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> Correct BUT I was referring to the OP post and the comment people know....
> 
> GPS have over prescribed in the past, patients also don’t finish courses given mainly because they “feelL better after a few days. That does not take away the fact that patients feel any condition requires antibiotics and I have seen patients complain bitterly that GPs and Hospital Drs are failing them because they no longer prescribe antibiotics as a matter of course. Over subscription is a thing of the past, in my own trust, routine antibiotics were abandoned for surgery over 12 years ago.


Just what I was going to say. Medicine is a dynamic field and what was known as usual in the 90's for example is no longer true.
Get with it people and update!!


----------



## blondebob (Aug 16, 2019)

Juan C said:


> *Maybe I am wrong but I cannot see any reason why UK would abandon any rules or practices which are sensible.* Only remainers would even suggest that.
> 
> Leaving the EU will not mean UK abandons it brains.
> 
> I do not know specifically but there is every reason to believe that at least some of the good practices of the EU were as a result of UK input


After Brexit and we do the "hugely and very biggly" trade deal with Trumps U.S.A there is a very high possibility that the U.K would be open to importing American livestock products and as is common knowledge and well documented their regulations lag far behind the E.U when it comes to pumping their animals with antibiotics (illegally) and hormones.


----------



## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

Megsmum said:


> I refer you to chlorinated chicken. Chickens processed in chlorine because the animal husbandry is so awful that the chickens are full of bacteria hence banned in the EU but miraculously now approved by the chef medical whatever officer post Brexit. Please stop all this crap about only remainers would say that, one could retort with only Brexit supporters would say that but really, three years past the vote and we are still in name calling territory it’s so bloody tiresome.



Well there may be a chance the Chief Medical Officer is right and the chicken from US A is safe. Or have I missed the reports of millions of Americans who have eaten that stuff years who have died or even been ill. May be the EU ban it to elimínate the competition and protect EU farmers. 

PS Just to clarify. I have an Irish Passport, British one expired and not going to renew it, and I did not have a vote in the referendum. I have two sons, both accountants in UK, both probably better informed not only on the financial side as one would expect, but also on the political side too. Each argues persuasively on opposite sides. I remain neutral. Therefore I should be grateful if others would avoid (the name calling territory it’s so bloody tiresome) putting me in one box or the other when I post something which I unbiasedly believe


----------



## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Juan C said:


> _"An even bigger risk is that UK meat producers will start using them more, when they are no regulated by the EU. "_
> 
> Maybe I am wrong but I cannot see any reason why UK would abandon any rules or practices which are sensible. *I suspect only remainers would even suggest that.
> *
> ...





Juan C said:


> Well there may be a chance the Chief Medical Officer is right and the chicken from US A is safe. Or have I missed the reports of millions of Americans who have eaten that stuff years who have died or even been ill. May be the EU ban it to elimínate the competition and protect EU farmers.
> 
> PS Just to clarify. I have an Irish Passport, British one expired and not going to renew it, and I did not have a vote in the referendum. I have two sons, both accountants in UK, both probably better informed not only on the financial side as one would expect, but also on the political side too. Each argues persuasively on opposite sides. I remain neutral. *Therefore I should be grateful if others would avoid (the name calling territory it’s so bloody tiresome) putting me in one box or the other when I post something which I unbiasedly believe*


*
*


And yet you assume anyone who has a different opinion to you is a remainers? Maybe you should practice what you preach basically you said that Only remainers are worried about food industry standards after Brexit. The relevance of you having an Irish Passport or your sons having different opinions on the issue is TBH irrelevant. I too have an Irish Passport, I too have family on both sides, doesn’t matter if you voted leave or remain, I have concerns about post Brexit and equally I can see certain benefits for some.


----------



## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

I will not make any further comment, and hopefully if I have posted anything which was mistakenly thought to be controversially supporting one side or the other in the Brexit debate, it will be ignored


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Juan C said:


> _"An even bigger risk is that UK meat producers will start using them more, when they are no regulated by the EU. "_
> 
> Maybe I am wrong but I cannot see any reason why UK would abandon any rules or practices which are sensible. I suspect only remainers would even suggest that.
> 
> ...


It depends on what sort of trade deal Trump & Johnson come up with. One of the conditions is likely to be deregulation of exactly this sort of thing. Trump has already said this - he detests any sort of regulation which can affect profitability.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Juan C said:


> Well there may be a chance the Chief Medical Officer is right and the chicken from US A is safe. Or have I missed the reports of millions of Americans who have eaten that stuff years who have died or even been ill. May be the EU ban it to elimínate the competition and protect EU farmers.


Chlorinated chicken may well be safe for humans to eat. But it's the reason they need to use it in the first place which bothers me. These factory hens are kept in such disgusting conditions that they have to be washed with disinfectant! EU has fairly strict animal welfare laws, not so the US.

Think I'll stick to the occasional free-range gallina from the local butcher. I know exactly what their life is like, I can hear them clucking.


----------



## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

Sorry to continue off thread but I remembered a program on U.K. tv which showed the conditions in which chicken were farmed in U.K. 

They all appeared pretty awful and not what anyone would think of as ethical, barn raised, free range etc 

There is a lot on google depicting the lies; this is just one example from The Guardian newspaper 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....sfree/2017/jan/30/free-range-eggs-con-ethical

Extract 😕. “Of all their cons, the “free range” egg is perhaps the most audacious. You’d need Disney-level imagination to believe the UK can produce more than 10bn eggs each year without inconveniencing any chickens. But by slapping “free range” on the label, and perhaps a nice pastoral scene with a few chickens roaming free, most consumers never realise how the eggs came to be in the box.”


----------



## Simply Simon (Jan 18, 2019)

Juan C said:


> _"An even bigger risk is that UK meat producers will start using them more, when they are no regulated by the EU. "_
> 
> Maybe I am wrong but I cannot see any reason why UK would abandon any rules or practices which are sensible. I suspect only remainers would even suggest that.
> 
> ...


You really believe that? Personally I believe that the UK HAS abandoned its brains and the tub of lard so-called PM will accept any so-called standards the even bigger tub of lard so-called President tells him to. leaving the UK means the UK will not only have abandoned it's brains but its international credibility, influence and prestige - add that to the selling off of the NHS and the reduced living standards for everyone except the wealthy and the job losses.

Yeah only a Remainer would suggest that. REMAIN! It's the only sensible option, anything else is a stark raving mental act of self harm and just to cheer up the Brexit loonies - the EU will be harmed as well so those hated foreigners will get a taste of the pain as well.


----------



## Simply Simon (Jan 18, 2019)

Alcalaina said:


> Chlorinated chicken may well be safe for humans to eat. But it's the reason they need to use it in the first place which bothers me. These factory hens are kept in such disgusting conditions that they have to be washed with disinfectant! EU has fairly strict animal welfare laws, not so the US.
> 
> Think I'll stick to the occasional free-range gallina from the local butcher. I know exactly what their life is like, I can hear them clucking.


You could drink out of your pool if you wanted to. It doesn't seem to be that effective in the US as they have far higher levels of food poisoning than we do in our nice safe , regulated EU.

The US of A like to tell use they lead the world but I will never have anything to do with a country that still has capital punishment, bangs on about how great they are and allows their people to go round shooting children and does feck all about it and basically just really get right on my thrupnies.


----------



## Simply Simon (Jan 18, 2019)

Juan C said:


> Well there may be a chance the Chief Medical Officer is right and the chicken from US A is safe. Or have I missed the reports of millions of Americans who have eaten that stuff years who have died or even been ill. May be the EU ban it to elimínate the competition and protect EU farmers.
> 
> PS Just to clarify. I have an Irish Passport, British one expired and not going to renew it, and I did not have a vote in the referendum. I have two sons, both accountants in UK, both probably better informed not only on the financial side as one would expect, but also on the political side too. Each argues persuasively on opposite sides. I remain neutral. Therefore I should be grateful if others would avoid (the name calling territory it’s so bloody tiresome) putting me in one box or the other when I post something which I unbiasedly believe


What the heck have your two sons got to with the price of fish? You are obviously implying that your sons are much better informed than anybody here. 

Your comments are irritating beyond belief - " May be the EU ban it to elimínate the competition and protect EU farmers. " what utter tripe and how very un-neutral. Remaining neutral on the biggest issue to affect the whole of Europe since 1939 is ridiculous, but I don't think you are neutral are you? 

Please not that I am not name calling and i haven't noticed anybody else doing that either, I am pointing out that I think you are talking nonsense when you proclaim yourself to unbiased.


----------



## VFR (Dec 23, 2009)

Juan C said:


> Sorry to continue off thread but I remembered a program on U.K. tv which showed the conditions in which chicken were farmed in U.K.
> 
> They all appeared pretty awful and not what anyone would think of as ethical, barn raised, free range etc
> 
> ...


Not to mention all those animal block houses throughout Spain where you never see an animal outside & all the buildings look filthy to me.


----------



## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Juan C said:


> Sorry to continue off thread but I remembered a program on U.K. tv which showed the conditions in which chicken were farmed in U.K.
> 
> They all appeared pretty awful and not what anyone would think of as ethical, barn raised, free range etc
> 
> ...





VFR said:


> Not to mention all those animal block houses throughout Spain where you never see an animal outside & all the buildings look filthy to me.


Clearly never set foot on a farm.. animal houses tend not to look homes and gardens, farms are dirty places, grown up around farms all my life.

Ah well, that’s okay then... let’s add to animal suffering by bringing in food crap from the USA. I suspect your families will be able to afford the nice chicken but what the heck let the poor eat the crap 

Like others, I won’t be lectured by a country that is turning out to be the biggest ****hole in the world , a country where 12 children have been killed in St louis since April, where 27 Six year olds are shot dead at school and within three months are Forgotten, where people die because they don’t have health insurance, where the prat in charge, I can’t say President because that’s an honorable title and that man is no more than a ****, incites hatred, right wing rhetoric and even now his favoured outlet Fox News is starting to separate themselves. 

No, this is t a thread about him but as it stands he sums up the good old USA at the moment like it or not it’s his decisions that will frame the so called bigleist trade deal ever I the biggest world blah blah blah 

every country has issues within abattoirs Spain, U.K. all over the EU the BIG difference is they dont actually Legislate to say ... yep, keep you animals in absolute **** and don’t worry about the bacteria, just wash it off at the end..BIG difference between dodgy places not complying with regulations. 

Neutral my£&432


----------



## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

VFR said:


> Not to mention all those animal block houses throughout Spain where you never see an animal outside & all the buildings look filthy to me.


Yes been lots of publicity about chicken farms in Spain.. Also the Polish chicken farms and seen horrific stuff on TV with Polish animals unfit to walk being dragged off to slaughter. EU laws are totally ignored.

Seems ok. for Europe to put chlorine in salads and vegetables.


----------



## VFR (Dec 23, 2009)

Isobella said:


> Yes been lots of publicity about chicken farms in Spain.. Also the Polish chicken farms and seen horrific stuff on TV with Polish animals unfit to walk being dragged off to slaughter. EU laws are totally ignored.
> 
> Seems ok. for Europe to put chlorine in salads and vegetables.


True but lets get back to Trump.


----------



## MataMata (Nov 30, 2008)

Juan C said:


> Leaving the EU will not mean UK abandons it brains.


Many might argue that that's the very definition of UK leaving the EU !

Regarding chlorinated chicken I wonder how many pontificating on the subject have taken the trouble to acquaint themselves with facts and why the EU currently refuses to allow it's import?

https://fullfact.org/europe/does-eu-say-its-safe-eat-chicken-rinsed-chlorine/


Come to think of it NOT acquainting with facts is the reason we're in this whole sorry mess but then with so many "FACTS" turning out to be fantasy, BS, or out and out lies, who can blame folk.


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

MataMata said:


> Many might argue that that's the very definition of UK leaving the EU !
> 
> Regarding chlorinated chicken I wonder how many pontificating on the subject have taken the trouble to acquaint themselves with facts and why the EU currently refuses to allow it's import?
> 
> ...


What a load of old rubbish the EU has come with then, regarding chlorinated chicken!!!
QUOTE There are no safety concerns
QUOTE This practice might not be sufficient for maintaining good hygiene standards.
Pardon?


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

BTW, buying/ getting antibiotics in Spain??
The summary seems to be
Get a cross borders prescription from your UK doctor if needed
Taking antibiotics without a prescription puts your health at risk and possibly the health of others.
Drs in the UK no longer prescribe antibiotics without good reason
Ditto pharmacists in Spain if they follow the law
Getting antibiotics otc in Spain is not guaranteed.

Anything else?


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

VFR said:


> Not to mention all those animal block houses throughout Spain where you never see an animal outside & all the buildings look filthy to me.


And in UK and France, and Poland, and Italy etc


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

VFR said:


> True but lets get back to Trump.


Let's not


----------



## MataMata (Nov 30, 2008)

Pesky Wesky said:


> What a load of old rubbish the EU has come with then, regarding chlorinated chicken!!!
> QUOTE There are no safety concerns
> QUOTE This practice might not be sufficient for maintaining good hygiene standards.
> Pardon?


I suggest you read the whole piece and not dismiss it by selective quoting.


----------



## Ovaldo (Aug 12, 2019)

Megsmum said:


> Clearly never set foot on a farm.. animal houses tend not to look homes and gardens, farms are dirty places, grown up around farms all my life.
> 
> Ah well, that’s okay then... let’s add to animal suffering by bringing in food crap from the USA. I suspect your families will be able to afford the nice chicken but what the heck let the poor eat the crap
> 
> ...


So what did you eat when you visited the USA? Did you order Tesco or bring your own food?


----------



## 95995 (May 16, 2010)

Just to be clear, the EU to date supports industrial farming.

If you are interested in EU organic regulations, there is a full list here https://www.ifoam-eu.org/en/organic-regulations/list-eu-organic-regulations, or you can search for individual items such as eggs. Or you can search regulations for the country in which you live. Thus I can buy organic eggs in France that are labelled and stamped according to the conditions in which the hens are raised, i.e. not just on the basis of what they are fed.

You should be able to do the same in relation to all organic farm produce.

That said, EU organic regulations are quite surprisingly less strict that in Australia, but in essence that is because it is well nigh impossible to reach the same standards in Europe given pre-existing contamination and the problems finding agricultural land that is not impacted by adjacent activities.


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

MataMata said:


> I suggest you read the whole piece and not dismiss it by selective quoting.


 It's from the page you linked to. The quotes come straight from the conclusions that fullfact.org themselves have made. (I actually posted info about this site on the Brexit thread and think it's about as unbaised as you can get)


----------

