# Property sales rising in Spain



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Sales are up 3% since August 2011 (mainly new homes, with people buying before tax increases come into effect, but the fall in sales of secondhand homes seems to have stabilised).










La compra de viviendas aumenta en agosto tras 17 meses de caídas | Economía | EL PAÍS


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## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!

Does this mean house prices may be going up?


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## Lolito (Aug 25, 2012)

House prices will keep going down at least until 2014 or 2016... it is still too high, and they need to go back to what they were about 20 years ago.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Any UK citizen retiring with a Final Salary Scheme Pension from local government, education, the police, the NHS...all Government services.....and who has planned to retire to Spain is in a great position to pick up a bargain at current exchange rates.

These lucky holders of FSSs receive not only a pension of up to half of their pre-retirement salary but also a one-off lump tax-free sum of three times the amount of their annual pension.

So...a couple of teachers - they tend to marry within the profession - retiring after the maximum years of service could receive an annual pension of at least £25k each and each would receive a lump sum of £75k. 

If they sell their UK house and even if they rent it, they are well-placed to take advantage of falling property prices here in Spain.

I know this is all true. After a career of over thirty years in education, I am in receipt of a FSS.
But I never want to own property again so prefer to rent a property I could never afford to buy.


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## Cazzy (Nov 23, 2008)

We have 6 sales going through at the moment!!


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## Leper (May 12, 2010)

My Personal Opinion why sales might be on the increase at the moment:- Six years ago somebody would pay €250,000 for a property and thought (a) property prices wont fall (b) for this to be a bad investment economies throughout europe would have to collapse and this cannot happen. 

Wrong on both counts. The golden rule is a property is worth only what people are willing to pay at a given time. Even I forgot this golden rule conveniently. I would guess that the €250,000 invested would now realise €170,000. This is happening because the person who paid €250,000 probably has neighbours who some years previously spent €100,000 purchasing identical property. Therefore, these lucky people can sell @ €170,00 and still make a tidy profit and the purchaser bought into what he thought to be a good bargain i.e. win/win situation. This probably explains the 3% increase in property sales.

. . . and I dont have to explain that the person who paid €250,000 is in negative equity and will be forever.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Its not about worth right now, its about sales - the two things dont go hand in hand in this sort of a market. I think there are many who will just be glad to get rid of their properties and they'll be others who will be glad that they are able to buy at current prices

Jo xxx


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## Cazzy (Nov 23, 2008)

jojo said:


> Its not about worth right now, its about sales - the two things dont go hand in hand in this sort of a market. I think there are many who will just be glad to get rid of their properties and they'll be others who will be glad that they are able to buy at current prices
> 
> Jo xxx


You're right there Jo!!! If you are lucky enough to get an offer really consider it as it may be the only one for a few years!! All of the properties we are selling are already greatly reduced and at the moment people are asking 25% below asking price. The thing is if one person won't accept your offer go to the next and the next and someone will!!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Cazzy said:


> You're right there Jo!!! If you are lucky enough to get an offer really consider it as it may be the only one for a few years!! All of the properties we are selling are already greatly reduced and at the moment people are asking 25% below asking price. The thing is if one person won't accept your offer go to the next and the next and someone will!!



Any movement, is good right now for the economy - price rises probably arent, so lets hope the trend continues

Jo xxx


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

Not to be a downer but if I'm understanding that graph last August sales were down some 40%. Bouncing back 3% isn't even a bounce. 

The number of total sales can't go below zero so of course they can't keep going down.

A better indicator would be prices. Plus actual selling prices versus asking. But real estate is so local even this doesn't mean much.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Also need to factor in the previous artificially high prices talked up by many estate agents (often Brits - "I can get you 20k more for your house").

It matters little whether prices are rising or falling unless you want to sell (or buy). If, for example, you bought your house for €85k, as we did, it doesn't matter a dam (correct - not a typo) if it would only fetch €65k now if you are content with where you are and don't wish/have to sell.


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## Lolito (Aug 25, 2012)

When we rented our actual house, the owner said it was up for sale for 215,000 euros, which I thought was far too much, now, 8 months later, he is selling it for 170,000 euros, and I still think it is too much, the right price for this villa should be not more than 140,000 euros, so I am hoping it will go down a bit more, not sure we´ll buy it anyway, as we have seen nicer things for much less.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Back to the original post - it isn't prices that are going up, just the number of sales. Prices are still falling, and will fall further as banks are desperate to get rid of all those repo's.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

mrypg9 said:


> Any UK citizen retiring with a Final Salary Scheme Pension from local government, education, the police, the NHS...all Government services.....and who has planned to retire to Spain is in a great position to pick up a bargain at current exchange rates.
> 
> These lucky holders of FSSs receive not only a pension of up to half of their pre-retirement salary but also a one-off lump tax-free sum of three times the amount of their annual pension.
> 
> ...


yep

end if 2013 i am taking my FSS pension with lump sum before the ******s change there minds again.........this and the downturn in spain is what is giving us the opportunity to move over. x


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

cambio said:


> yep
> 
> end if 2013 i am taking my FSS pension with lump sum before the ******s change there minds again.........this and the downturn in spain is what is giving us the opportunity to move over. x


I would hazard a guess that many of these sales are to people in your position.
We chose not to buy here, we sold all properties in the UK and as I said use my FSS income to rent a large property we couldn't afford and wouldn't want to buy.

Of course we mustn't forget that not evrry teacher /nurse/policeman/civil servant etc. retires on an income of £40k plus - the avarage FSS pension is apparently less than £5k per annum -but very many do.

I think it's inevitable that FSS will be phased out. It's already happening in the private sector and gradually public sector FSS are being eroded.

As I see it it's not a political issue but a demographic/economic one. We are an ageing population and there will be insufficient people of working age to fund grandiose public pension schemes.

But I think you're safe for a few years yet..


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## 3RGJ (Oct 10, 2012)

This page has been most helpful with a decision my wife and I are making at the moment with regards to buying in Spain. Will property continue to drop in value over the next two years? If so, then it may well be worth taking the leap. Ken.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Kenneth McNish said:


> This page has been most helpful with a decision my wife and I are making at the moment with regards to buying in Spain. Will property continue to drop in value over the next two years? If so, then it may well be worth taking the leap. Ken.



Welcome to the forum! Will property continue to drop????? possibly, probably, there are still many unsold properties, still many repossessed properties owned by the banks................. but who knows!!???? I'm sure there will always be desirable properties that will sell and those that wont....

Jo xxx


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## 3RGJ (Oct 10, 2012)

jojo said:


> Welcome to the forum! Will property continue to drop????? possibly, probably, there are still many unsold properties, still many repossessed properties owned by the banks................. but who knows!!???? I'm sure there will always be desirable properties that will sell and those that wont....
> 
> Jo xxx


Thanks for replying Jo, still coming to terms with this new technology (iPad). Do you have any idea if expats are beginning to LET rooms out at the moment to help with the bills? K.


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## 3RGJ (Oct 10, 2012)

jojo said:


> Welcome to the forum! Will property continue to drop????? possibly, probably, there are still many unsold properties, still many repossessed properties owned by the banks................. but who knows!!???? I'm sure there will always be desirable properties that will sell and those that wont....
> 
> Jo xxx


Ta for replying Jo. Ken.


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

jojo said:


> I'm sure there will always be desirable properties that will sell and those that wont....


+1

Property isn't like a tin of beans . If prices go down but the perfect home you wanted sold two years ago what good is it?

You need to ask yourself if you're speculating on home prices or living in the home. 

A low priced home you hate isn't a a deal


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## 3RGJ (Oct 10, 2012)

All received and understood. Ken.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Kenneth McNish said:


> Thanks for replying Jo, still coming to terms with this new technology (iPad). Do you have any idea if expats are beginning to LET rooms out at the moment to help with the bills? K.


I'm sure some do - just like they do in the UK. But its down to finding the right person and if you're happy to share your home with a stranger

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I'm sure some do - just like they do in the UK. But its down to finding the right person and if you're happy to share your home with a stranger
> 
> Jo xxx


yes I agree - I'm sure a lot do now - if they rent themselves though it's usually in the rental agreement that they can't sublet


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Kenneth McNish said:


> Thanks for replying Jo, still coming to terms with this new technology (iPad). Do you have any idea if expats are beginning to LET rooms out at the moment to help with the bills? K.


I bought an IPad two weeks ago, have put it in a drawer....

Idon't think most of us have reached the 'letting out spare rooms' stage yet, Krenneth... Bills are getting paid.

But who knows what the future may bring?


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

jojo said:


> I'm sure some do - just like they do in the UK. But its down to finding the right person and if you're happy to share your home with a stranger
> 
> Jo xxx



Do you think so?

Coming to Spain only to find you are in such reduced circumstances that you have to share your home with a complete strsnger is more of a Spanish nightmare than a Spanish dream....


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

mrypg9 said:


> Do you think so?
> 
> Coming to Spain only to find you are in such reduced circumstances that you have to share your home with a complete strsnger is more of a Spanish nightmare than a Spanish dream....


I dont know really. I guess if someone has bought a property in the "good old days" and is now struggling.......??? I have friends in the UK who rent out rooms to help pay the bills. Its not ideal, but in these troubled time.......

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I dont know really. I guess if someone has bought a property in the "good old days" and is now struggling.......??? I have friends in the UK who rent out rooms to help pay the bills. Its not ideal, but in these troubled time.......
> 
> Jo xxx


I know some in my town who let rooms - room only, no use of facilities at all (well, I dare say they get to use a bathroom....)


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

jojo said:


> I dont know really. I guess if someone has bought a property in the "good old days" and is now struggling.......??? I have friends in the UK who rent out rooms to help pay the bills. Its not ideal, but in these troubled time.......
> 
> Jo xxx


I wouldn't inflict my presence on anyone
I'd have to play the proverbial violin in the brothel rather than that!


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> I wouldn't inflict my presence on anyone
> I'd have to play the proverbial violin in the brothel rather than that!


I was tempted to add my comment but decided I value your friendship more so decided otherwise. :kiss:


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

baldilocks said:


> I was tempted to add my comment but decided I value your friendship more so decided otherwise. :kiss:


Oh Baldy....it could have been cause for a good laugh, as are most of your bon mots.

Seriously, though, and thinking of your posts from last week....I think you can exaggerate the* extent* of poverty here in Spain.

Of course there are more people on the margins of existence now than in less tumultuous times. We know that there are millions without work and very many homeless.

Many British and other immigrants face financial hardship....some through sheer bad luck, others through bad judgment and lack of foresight, others through simply living beyond their means.

But the majority of Spanish people of working age have work and most people still live comfortably. The plain fact is that the standard of living and level of wages rose at an unsustainable rate and was buoyed up by cheap credit.

Now the air is filled with the flapping wings of home-coming chicken, as they say.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> Seriously, though, and thinking of your posts from last week....I think you can exaggerate the* extent* of poverty here in Spain.
> 
> Of course there are more people on the margins of existence now than in less tumultuous times. We know that there are millions without work and very many homeless.
> 
> ...


I have NEVER exaggerated the extent of poverty in Spain - before, during and after the Republic, during The earlier parts of the Franco era there was very real poverty among country folk in particular where landowners not only had the right to all that was produced on their own land, they would take much of what came off the piece of land that was leased/loaned to the peasant for his own food. If the peasants of Britain had much to complain about in the Middle Ages, then the peasants in Spain right up to the middle of the last century had much, much more and provided added fuel for the flames in the Civil War.

Fortunately, nowadays, there aren't many families, at least in Andalucia, that haven't husbanded their resources and can't cope with other generations falling back on them.

AS far as immigrants are concerned, many of those who are claiming they are facing hardship aren't YET! but merely complaining because they can't afford to maintain the profligate and wasteful lifestyles that they think they have the right to enjoy. We could have been in similar boat but realised that if we were going to enjoy life here without a sackful of worries, epecially about money, we would have to cut our expenditure to suit our pocket. Today, for example we had stuffed tomatoes and boiled rice for lunch. The tomatoes were overripe and past their best almost ready for the compost heap, the stuffing was minced up pork and chicken left-overs with minced carrot and onion plus a few herbs and spices. Inexpensive, nutritious and delicious. AND we still have the makings for shepherd's pie tomorrow!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

baldilocks said:


> I have NEVER exaggerated the extent of poverty in Spain - before, during and after the Republic, during The earlier parts of the Franco era there was very real poverty among country folk in particular where landowners not only had the right to all that was produced on their own land, they would take much of what came off the piece of land that was leased/loaned to the peasant for his own food. If the peasants of Britain had much to complain about in the Middle Ages, then the peasants in Spain right up to the middle of the last century had much, much more and provided added fuel for the flames in the Civil War.
> 
> Fortunately, nowadays, there aren't many families, at least in Andalucia, that haven't husbanded their resources and can't cope with other generations falling back on them.
> 
> AS far as immigrants are concerned, many of those who are claiming they are facing hardship aren't YET! but merely complaining because they can't afford to maintain the profligate and wasteful lifestyles that they think they have the right to enjoy. We could have been in similar boat but realised that if we were going to enjoy life here without a sackful of worries, epecially about money, we would have to cut our expenditure to suit our pocket. Today, for example we had stuffed tomatoes and boiled rice for lunch. The tomatoes were overripe and past their best almost ready for the compost heap, the stuffing was minced up pork and chicken left-overs with minced carrot and onion plus a few herbs and spices. Inexpensive, nutritious and delicious. AND we still have the makings for shepherd's pie tomorrow!


You have always seen things in perspective...

People tend to play up or down hardship if they have political axes to grind.

We usually eat like you...healthily, simply and enjoyably as the kind of meals you describe are more often than not the tastiest!


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## 3RGJ (Oct 10, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> I have NEVER exaggerated the extent of poverty in Spain - before, during and after the Republic, during The earlier parts of the Franco era there was very real poverty among country folk in particular where landowners not only had the right to all that was produced on their own land, they would take much of what came off the piece of land that was leased/loaned to the peasant for his own food. If the peasants of Britain had much to complain about in the Middle Ages, then the peasants in Spain right up to the middle of the last century had much, much more and provided added fuel for the flames in the Civil War.
> 
> Fortunately, nowadays, there aren't many families, at least in Andalucia, that haven't husbanded their resources and can't cope with other generations falling back on them.
> 
> AS far as immigrants are concerned, many of those who are claiming they are facing hardship aren't YET! but merely complaining because they can't afford to maintain the profligate and wasteful lifestyles that they think they have the right to enjoy. We could have been in similar boat but realised that if we were going to enjoy life here without a sackful of worries, epecially about money, we would have to cut our expenditure to suit our pocket. Today, for example we had stuffed tomatoes and boiled rice for lunch. The tomatoes were overripe and past their best almost ready for the compost heap, the stuffing was minced up pork and chicken left-overs with minced carrot and onion plus a few herbs and spices. Inexpensive, nutritious and delicious. AND we still have the makings for shepherd's pie tomorrow!


Re your above comment - "the right to enjoy" Thank goodness their is someone who sums up what individuals might need to do to enjoy a different lifestyle but are willing to make the changes necessary. Nice One Sir.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Kenneth McNish said:


> Re your above comment - "the right to enjoy" Thank goodness their is someone who sums up what individuals might need to do to enjoy a different lifestyle but are willing to make the changes necessary. Nice One Sir.


could not agree more

we dont want to go out, travel etc etc no not interested in latest dvd/camera/tv etc
we eat well and simply tonight we had ( here in the uk) a plate of roasted veg. A chicken on a sunday can last 3 days usually ending up in soup. 
We are not poor, we have a roof over our heads, food on the table, clothes on our back, but neither do we have money to spare. But feel life rich and cash poor. its all about expectations if what you think you need.
anyways i am rambling again:focus:
xx


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

cambio said:


> could not agree more
> 
> we dont want to go out, travel etc etc no not interested in latest dvd/camera/tv etc
> we eat well and simply tonight we had ( here in the uk) a plate of roasted veg. A chicken on a sunday can last 3 days usually ending up in soup.
> ...


Rambling? - Not at all. It is often the musings of others that strike a chord which leads, in the normal way of things, to either a solution to a problem, a new approach or a realisation that what you were worrying about was trivial anyway.

Many of we "old-timers" ramble and muse on here (irritates the sh*t out of the younger-uns) but we often come up with a more suitable solution to our problems and theirs far more cheaply and simply because we take the time to think and not just throw money at it. Now you have me rambling so :focus: if I can only remember what the hell it is!  Never mind as they demonstrated in Life of Brian: Monty Python - Always Look on the Bright Side of Life - YouTube


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> Never mind as they demonstrated in Life of Brian: Monty Python - Always Look on the Bright Side of Life - YouTube



we had that played at my husband's funeral as we left the service............. I could see most of the family trying VERY hard not to dance their way out - some didn't quite manage it


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> rambling? - not at all. It is often the musings of others that strike a chord which leads, in the normal way of things, to either a solution to a problem, a new approach or a realisation that what you were worrying about was trivial anyway.
> 
> Many of we "old-timers" ramble and muse on here (irritates the sh*t out of the younger-uns) but we often come up with a more suitable solution to our problems and theirs far more cheaply and simply because we take the time to think and not just throw money at it. Now you have me rambling so :focus: If i can only remember what the hell it is! :d:d never mind as they demonstrated in life of brian: monty python - always look on the bright side of life - youtube


lol


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

What's that line from the Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam...


Here with a Loaf of Bread beneath the bough
A Flask of Wine, a Book of Verse -and Thou
Beside me singing in the wilderness-
And Wilderness is Paradise enow.


Sums up how I feel, almost...

I have had a good dinner, have the flask of wine -well, a 3 euro bottle of Rioja from Mercadona....
have the Book of Verse
But Sandra isn't singing beside me in the salon....
She's complaining that my shoes have left mud on her clean floor...


Ah well....you can't have everything. I've got three out of the four.

Guess I'm a lucky sod


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