# Insurance broker bad experience



## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

I've been waiting a full month for my car policy after paying full price up front! 

It's been a very stressful experience. That added with the lockdown as many will have experienced, not able to get appointments for various things, its put me very behind.

They keep making mistakes on the policy when it's returned.
I'm not sure what mistakes the broker is making and what mistakes the underwriter is making or both.

I keep gong over all the documents carefully and explaining carefully what's wrong (many times) sometimes by phone also.
In the beginning they got the car model wrong, finally this seemed to be corrected when I got an independent car club to write a letter and very carefully confirming the car model name.
That was over a month ago, now a few days ago they make the same mistake in the policy again and the insurance value was also reduced but I seem to be getting the blame for this!

From the policy they last sent me I think if I needed (and hope I never do) make a claim I doubt they would pay out on it as the car model is wrong and they reduced the value mistakenly by several thousand.
The car model is correct in the log book, car club, online etc.

I had to waste many hours over the last month keep checking documents that are not exact to their own form that I filled in.
I keep quoting their forms I have filled in.

To add to this the manager phoned with a lot of attitude one day, I let it go but it was very unprofessional. I have several policies with this company but you wouldn’t have thought that if you were listening into that call.

My cover note expires this morning!!!
Is this normal for Spain? This is the first time I’ve not had a car or motorcycle insured correctly since I was 16.

What steps should I take if I don’t get the policy today?
I just want my policy, I don’t want to complain about them, I also get on well with one member of staff I mostly speak with, but I’m exhausted not getting simple results from them and for what I paid for.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Forgive me if I am making assumptions here but your situation does not seem to be a "standard" situation.

Normally the make and model of the vehicle is simply selected from drop down lists provided by the underwriting company to the brokers (who are just resellers). Maybe your vehicle is not in that list because it is a non-standard model or classic vehicle?

Also, a fixed valuation is also not normal in a policy. Normally the policy wording refers only to the "valor venal" or sometimes a "fair market rate", in reality of course you will never get back the actual value of the vehicle unless it is a policy on a new vehicle where within the first 12 months they replace it with a new one.

If you are trying to get a fixed value policy on an unusual vehicle, I suggest you look for specialist brokers. I can recommend the one I use if it is of any use.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Overandout said:


> Forgive me if I am making assumptions here but your situation does not seem to be a "standard" situation.
> 
> Normally the make and model of the vehicle is simply selected from drop down lists provided by the underwriting company to the brokers (who are just resellers). Maybe your vehicle is not in that list because it is a non-standard model or classic vehicle?
> 
> ...


 Hi Overandout
Thanks for the reply.

Yes I didn't want to go into all the details as I'm still hoping the broker will come through and I can get on with more pressing matters, although this is very important to me.

My situation isn't standard perhaps, but the car is standard.
It's a UK car, still on UK plates, I was 50/50 on keeping here or taking it back, but as it got stuck here during coving-19 I didn't feel good about driving and staying overnight in hotels at that time, I still don't.

I had just before the virus outbreak taken to a garage and they said it would pass an ITV with nothing to do. (not so sure about that)!

The broker said market value, that's what I was told, although this was then contradicted by the manager or not explained as clear as it could have been. It's called market value, but in reality it's insured value even if that's not how it works in Spain. I would get the amount the car has been independently valued and agreed by the broker which they did, at least that's what I was told. That amount is currently incorrect and doesn't match their own forms I submitted over a month ago.

My cover note has now run out and they yet again have not been in touch, more chasing. So after a month my car isn't insured as agreed over the phone and in writing. 

I've asked them to confirm is the car insured correctly again and no reply.
I'm not happy at all with them.

You are correct, it's a classic, but not a really old classic, so it should like you say simply be a drop-down option, and it is! The issue is the underwriters have or had the name wrong. More than one broker didn't want to except this when I told them, they just wanted to charge me more for changing the model!!
I spoke directly with the underwriter who were happy to chat with me about old cars lol and importantly confirm they had the model name slightly wrong.
I think this call to the underwriter and another is why the broker manager spoke to me with so much disrespect on the phone. 

The way I was spoken to was disgusting.

They were not excepting my or the clubs letter as proof of model so I fixed that with a quick phone call to the underwriter.
The amount of information I had to hand over to the broker was a lot, and I verified that independently, but the broker still gets it wrong.

Just to clarify, the manager over the phone when I asked him very specifically about how much a payout would be in a claim, he said the amount it was insured for.

One thing that worries me, in the policy it doesn't state it's a classic policy, or the insured value. Is this normal in Spain? It is on the statement of fact with the policy number referenced.

I would appreciate if you could send me the name of the broker you use?

I'm not sure how it's going to work out with my broker. Communication is not easy like when I was starting out with them.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

My classic policy is very clear that it is a classic policy, with the restrictions and benefits that it brings.
Sounds like you are being given the runaround by people who don't know what they are doing honestly.

I use a specialist broker called Zalba - Caldu. The car club I belong to now has a discount program with them which makes it even cheaper than before (I have been using them for many years). I have never had to make a claim thankfully, but I have never had any issues with their admin, pricing, policies etc. and I would recommend them to anyone. Unlike many other classic policies, the policies issued through Zalba Caldu do not restrict your annual mileage (kilometerage?)


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Many thanks for the info.
Sadly they have all my money up front, and now too late to get my money back.
I really want a company I can pay monthly in future.

So that's really worrying me now, the policy I have makes no mention of it being a classic car policy!
I don't see my NCB is fully protected either as agreed with them on the phone.
The excess is high, but they wouldn't lower it when I asked. 

Yes it seems I am indeed been given the runaround. Once they have your money up front that seems the end of the good customer service.


If I was in the UK I would dump this company now, but starting out in a new country you just want things to work. But I will check out the company you mentioned. I'm just looking at the exclusions now of my current broker, maybe most brokers will have wording that looks the same, but some if doesn't read well, and some you can't read at all, you would need a lawyer.
No mention of a classic policy anywhere at all.



I like the idea of not having limited KM's, 5000km is not enough. I don't use it much at all but it feels like a rip-off paying double or more of the premium as the UK with this restriction.


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## fortrose52 (Nov 29, 2018)

Could someone at the Spanish equivelant of DVLA help you with this?


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

If it's still on UK plates I don't think you can use it anyway.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Did you pay by credit card? If so contact them for a refund.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> If it's still on UK plates I don't think you can use it anyway.


Good point.

Residents of Spain can't legally drive a foreign plated vehicle (which they own) in Spain.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

xabiaxica said:


> Good point.
> 
> Residents of Spain can't legally drive a foreign plated vehicle (which they own) in Spain.


Hi everyone, thanks for the replies.


Hi. The car was going to go back to the UK but with the lockdown I couldn't do that when I needed to so decided to keep it here. I've not actually used it, just to go to the local garage to give it a once over to see if it would pass an ITV.
I'm not resident yet, and I'm looking at getting the car on Spanish plates asap. Impossible to get appointments by the person doing that for me for several months but hopefully that will now not be an issue.

Still no reply from the broker, even a one line email would have been something. 
I'll look into making a complaint or contacting a governing body if there is one asap, just so busy with other things. Best way of course is just walk away and find a company who knows how to speak and communicate better and doesn't keep making mistakes.




> Isobella. Did you pay by credit card? If so contact them for a refund.


I paid by debit card BTW.
I'm actually waiting for a refund back on that card from another company, around 20 days past the refund date they told me! What is it with insurance companies here.




> baldilocks.


Well I had the car under UK policy and planned to drive it back well before time was up, but then covid-19 came along. Then they extended policy so again it was correctly covered. The MOT is now extended to next year also, tax fully paid up.. I assume now that you can drive and move around they wouldn't expect everyone delayed retuning to the UK at the same time, never a good thing to assume though. Sadly I'm not using the car at all now, worried about getting stopped on UK plates etc.
It's now (I hope) insured correctly here. I just found something else. They increased the excess without telling me. Not what I was quoted for, but the bill was exactly the same.

The policy states I can drive it the UK for 90 days also. They know how long the car has been here exactly. Broker has not said anything on this, I've told them clearly how long the car has been here, they know because I sent them photos!
There was a good bit of form filling so they know everything about the car and myself.





> fortrose52.


All this is new to me, so I'm going to get someone to handle getting the car onto Spanish plates, I guess DVLA will need to be informed during that process.

I'm going to try to get the car tested at an ITV garage before switching the car over, but the garage who said they would do that for me haven't got back to me. If they say for any stupid reason it can't pass then I'll have to take it back to the UK and maybe sell it, would like to avoid doing that.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

It maybe that you have a dodgy broker, a lot of them about. There is a defensor del Asuregados


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

I think you could be on the money with that comment.
They are not a small business, that in theory should have meant everything went well, but it really has gone bad and just isn’t improving.

*(( I really could do with some advice on how to handle this company please? ))*

They've just sent me the policy documents (again) I've been waiting for a very long time (again) (I’ve lost count how many times how many sets of documents over the last month and into the 2nd month) I can't believe they after all this time have yet again sent me documents with the wrong model name.

I feel now I can't trust this insurance company (broker). How can any company keep getting some basic details wrong. Is it a slapdash way of doing things, incompetence or don't they want my business.

This is the first time I've not had a vehicle insured or insured correctly (ever) and this is my pride and joy car, it worries and stresses me a lot, I'm not a car collector, it would hurt a lot losing it, and even worse not getting a penny from an insurance company to replace it if that happened. And would they pay a penny out with the wrong model name on the policy!! I think I know the answer to that!

They have had all the correct details of the car, most details several months ago, it has been verified by a classic car club, the log book shows the correct model as well as DVLA and other sites etc.
A 10 year old could do this, that’s what worries me about this company now, it’s a simple thing to do.
They’ve also increased the policy excess after the price they quoted and I paid for.

Would you take your car out on the road if an insurance company keeps getting the model name mixed up with a different model car? This isn’t just a mistake by writing the model name incorrectly it could be confused with a different model! And I know the underwriters had mixed up the car but it would be corrected.

Can I get my money back from this company now 5 weeks after the start date of the policy?

I’ve not used the car in months, I really needed to take it out over the last month and start getting it looked at to know for sure what if any changes I might need to make, like head lights, but I was told they would be ok, but I need to be sure I do what I can so it passes first time without having to revisit the ITV.
I have lost over a month of the policy because I won’t risk using the car with the wrong car model stated in the policy, this is now seriously delaying me, and a lot of time has already been lost due to covid-19.

This company has given me so much aggravation over this, so much wasted time.

Can I cancel the policy now and get my money back after 5 weeks because they didn’t give me a correct policy?

Have they failed delivering the insurance contract and therefore that means I should get my money back?

Can I complain to the insurance ombudsman? Will it help right now?

Should I consider making this a more serious complaint? Is this an option. ““Oficina Municipal de Informacion al Consumidor””


I really feel I need to move away from this company now, it’s been a terrible and time wasting experience.


Thank you for any advice.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Ask the insurers for a complaints form, fill it in and send it to the OMIC office at your Provincial government headquarters.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

baldilocks said:


> Ask the insurers for a complaints form, fill it in and send it to the OMIC office at your Provincial government headquarters.


 Thanks for the quick reply.


I found something online saying the form or book is in triplicate on company premises, I keep two copies etc.
Do they have to send a paper form in triplicate as businesses seem to have on site or is there an electronic version?


In the mean time I can't use the car and I really need to get on with things.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Muddy said:


> Thanks for the quick reply.
> 
> 
> I found something online saying the form or book is in triplicate on company premises, I keep two copies etc.
> ...


 As you're doing this online I'm not sure of the procedure. You could write/ phone the company directly saying you want the complaint forms (Hoja de reclamación), but I'm not sure how that would go. You could get in touch with your local OMIC offices and ask them. Look here
https://acude.org/omic-en-espana/
Another alternative would be to get in touch with another company, tell them the sorry tale and see if they can help you.
I don't know how your Spanish is, but here's some info from RACE that might help you.
https://www.race.es/seguro-coche-clasico
I remember you said the car wasn't very old. Is it more than 25 years old?


In this article it says that RACE can act as a broker for the insurance so it might be an idea to enlist their help. There's a link at the bottom of the article "servicio de correduría"


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> As you're doing this online I'm not sure of the procedure. You could write/ phone the company directly saying you want the complaint forms (Hoja de reclamación), but I'm not sure how that would go. You could get in touch with your local OMIC offices and ask them. Look here
> https://acude.org/omic-en-espana/
> Another alternative would be to get in touch with another company, tell them the sorry tale and see if they can help you.
> I don't know how your Spanish is, but here's some info from RACE that might help you.
> ...


 Thank you for the reply Pesky Wesky

It's hard to know how best to move forward.
I get on well with the agent dealing with me, but I just want my car covered and it should only take a few hours maybe, not 5 weeks or more.

If I can get my money back now after 5 weeks of this ongoing nightmare I would do just that. Do you know if this is at all possible?

I think they will just keep telling me they will correct it, but as far as I see it I've lost over a months use of that policy and doubt the car is covered correctly right now. Maybe on their word but that's worthless, it's the policy contract that counts.

I don't speak Spanish so this reduces my options for sure.

Yes the car is over 25 years old. This is suppose to be a classic policy, but it doesn't state that anywhere in the cover note, schedule and any other document apart from the form I filled in before getting the quote.

What about going down this route?
https://www.citizensadvice.org.es/faq/how-to-contact-insurance-ombudsman/

Although I see a possible issue with this option.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Muddy said:


> Thank you for the reply Pesky Wesky
> 
> It's hard to know how best to move forward.
> I get on well with the agent dealing with me, but I just want my car covered and it should only take a few hours maybe, not 5 weeks or more.
> ...


 You could, but be aware that this organization actually has nothing to do with the CAB organization in the UK, they have just ripped off the name. 

I would go with RACE if they have English speakers which they may well do. At least explain to them and ask their advice
I asked about the 25 yrs as it's the first thing that they mention in the RACE article...


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> You could, but be aware that this organization actually has nothing to do with the CAB organization in the UK, they have just ripped off the name.
> 
> I would go with RACE if they have English speakers which they may well do. At least explain to them and ask their advice
> I asked about the 25 yrs as it's the first thing that they mention in the RACE article...


 I did get through a very nice person on the phone, her English was perfect which made it easy for me luckily, she did confirm they can arrange insurance as a broker but she couldn't put me through to anyone but did give me an email address to ask my questions. 
Perhaps I called at not the best time.

I really need to speak with someone and get advice on how to handle my current broker, so I guess I hit a bit of a dead-end right now but I'll be I'll revisit this company in future for sure.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

You keep being told: Ask for a complaint form and refer the matter to OMIC - now which part of that sentence do you not understand?


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

baldilocks said:


> You keep being told: Ask for a complaint form and refer the matter to OMIC - now which part of that sentence do you not understand?


 That's a rather negative way to respond IMO. I have rather a lot going on, getting the issue solved with less problems and time spent on it right now would be best, (but you can be assured this company has burnt its last bridge with myself) but I may give them one last chance to get this policy in order before escalating in that direction and then take my business elsewhere when each policy comes up for renewal.

That said it's looking more to be the only option.
I did ask here if there was a possibility I could get my money back after a month of paying for the policy, if I could I'll see the back of them on this policy right now and be done with them.



But just to be clear with you, advice given and not taken here shouldn't be taken personally in any way or a reflection on that advice not being correct or the only option.
To spend time on other important concurrent issues I may have to make a decision I myself wouldn't normally choose.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

baldilocks said:


> You keep being told: Ask for a complaint form and refer the matter to OMIC - now which part of that sentence do you not understand?


 That's a rather negative way to respond IMO. I have rather a lot going on, getting the issue solved with less problems and time spent on it right now would be best, (but you can be assured this company has burnt its last bridge with myself) but I may give them one last chance to get this policy in order before escalating in that direction and then take my business elsewhere when each policy comes up for renewal.

That said it's looking more to be the only option.
I did ask here if there was a possibility I could get my money back after a month of paying for the policy, if I could I'll see the back of them on this policy right now and be done with them.



But just to be clear with you, advice given and not taken here shouldn't be taken personally in any way or a reflection on that advice not being correct or the only option.
To spend time on other important concurrent issues I may have to make a decision I myself wouldn't normally choose.


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