# UK pensions - has anybody actual experience of getting it tax free



## Bazoo (Apr 25, 2015)

As per the title, has anybody from the UK got experience of getting their pension tax free?

Can you provide a step-by-step guide of what you had to do and if there were any obstacles that had to overcome?

Thanks in advance.


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## dstump (Apr 26, 2010)

Hi Bazoo, welcome. 

It would be worth taking a look on the forum under the search heading of:

Non Habitual Residency
or
NHR
or
NHTR

Or go through 'STICKY' number 4 on the forum - "Expat tax"
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/portugal-expat-forum-expats-living-portugal/100154-expat-tax.html

You should find all your questions answered within these many column inches.

Hope this helps.


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## robc (Jul 17, 2008)

I have overtyped my answers below.

I hope this helps.



Bazoo said:


> As per the title, has anybody from the UK got experience of getting their pension tax free?Yes. We arranged our pensions in 2009/10 at the outset of the HNR process under Decree Law No 259 dated September 2009
> 
> Can you provide a step-by-step guide of what you had to do
> 
> ...


I hope that helps, I would suggest all potential "NHR benefitters"to seek professional advice as you only get one chance at it.

Rob


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## zakooo (Jan 2, 2015)

Bazoo said:


> As per the title, has anybody from the UK got experience of getting their pension tax free?
> 
> Can you provide a step-by-step guide of what you had to do and if there were any obstacles that had to overcome?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


if you mean the state pension,then its paid tax free because you have a £10,600 tax allowance before you pay any tax.if you mean a private pension you will pay tax on it over £10,600 per year.i have a large private pension and have just taken some advice from both the uk tax office and a very clued up md from a large pension firm.it does not matter one jot that i am a resident of portugal or not,i have the 10 year tax holiday from portugal but if you go over the £10,600 tax limit in the uk you will pay uk tax and will not be able to reclaim it.i have read a lot of untrue crap on ex pat web sites about being able to take all of your pension tax free from the uk,its just not true and anyone who does will find it an expensive lesson.you can like me take 25% free of tax but thats it.


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## robc (Jul 17, 2008)

zakooo said:


> i have read a lot of untrue crap on ex pat web sites about being able to take all of your pension tax free from the uk,its just not true and anyone who does will find it an expensive lesson.you can like me take 25% free of tax but thats it.


Hmmmmm

OK so without getting into a slanging match may I suggest reading the following.

https://www.blevinsfranks.com/News/...aven-for-you?gclid=CKaj25Od78UCFdPKtAod31oAgw Section Pension Income.

or

http://www.pwc.pt/pt/fiscalidade/imagens/pwc_europe_best_kept_secret.pdf

Page 5 and 6

OR straight from the horses mouth so to speak

http://info.portaldasfinancas.gov.p...-10BD-4C08-BE44-26CAB723884A/0/IRS_RNH_EN.pdf
A good read especially Section 3 page 8.
The key is not if the monies are taxed or not in the host country it is based around the taxation treatment of the contributions that have made up the pension........etc.

As always this a is a complex area of tax planning, anyone thinking of applying should seek professional advice and not just ask the UK tax office or a businessman.

Finally, and again I really do not want to get in to an argument, your statement of taking 25% tax free is just plain wrong, you take no account of such factors as 
1. Is the pension a s226 where a maximum of 33% can be taken
2. You make no mention of specific employment types which are afforded different rules (example Professional Footballers)
3. Is the pension a defined contribution employers scheme predating the ICTA of 1988

and so on......................

HTH

Rob


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

zakooo said:


> if you mean the state pension,then its paid tax free because you have a £10,600 tax allowance before you pay any tax.if you mean a private pension you will pay tax on it over £10,600 per year.i have a large private pension and have just taken some advice from both the uk tax office and a very clued up md from a large pension firm.it does not matter one jot that i am a resident of portugal or not,i have the 10 year tax holiday from portugal but if you go over the £10,600 tax limit in the uk you will pay uk tax and will not be able to reclaim it.i have read a lot of untrue crap on ex pat web sites about being able to take all of your pension tax free from the uk,its just not true and anyone who does will find it an expensive lesson.you can like me take 25% free of tax but thats it.


You should be able to get your pension gross from the UK. You normally have to provide fiscal residency certificates from the Portuguese authorities certifying that you are a portuguese resident - this is in terms of the Portugal UK double tax treaty. Normally you are able to recover tax withheld in the UK


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## zakooo (Jan 2, 2015)

TonyJ1 said:


> You should be able to get your pension gross from the UK. You normally have to provide fiscal residency certificates from the Portuguese authorities certifying that you are a portuguese resident - this is in terms of the Portugal UK double tax treaty. Normally you are able to recover tax withheld in the UK


well believe me you cannot.i have been trying since april to do that.my pension holder is one of the biggest and they say they have to apply paye,that they have no choice in the matter.in fact i say i should be able to withdraw 10,600 a year tax free as per my tax allowance.no chance they say the first payment i have to send a p45 for the current tax year with my tax code on it.i said i have been self-employed all my life and have never had a p45.in that case they say you will be taxed at 40% and have to reclaim it back off the tax man.living in portugal and having residency makes no difference at all they say.when i sold my business last year my accountant closed my tax account so how do i claim it back.luckly i am in a position where i don't need my pension to live on day to day but I'mam going to go to war with these muppets big time.i retired to portugal for the 10 year tax free break which i have for all the good it his doing me at the moment.


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## robc (Jul 17, 2008)

pension ombudsman maybe worth pursuing


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

zakooo said:


> well believe me you cannot.i have been trying since april to do that.my pension holder is one of the biggest and they say they have to apply paye,that they have no choice in the matter.in fact i say i should be able to withdraw 10,600 a year tax free as per my tax allowance.no chance they say the first payment i have to send a p45 for the current tax year with my tax code on it.i said i have been self-employed all my life and have never had a p45.in that case they say you will be taxed at 40% and have to reclaim it back off the tax man.living in portugal and having residency makes no difference at all they say.when i sold my business last year my accountant closed my tax account so how do i claim it back.luckly i am in a position where i don't need my pension to live on day to day but I'mam going to go to war with these muppets big time.i retired to portugal for the 10 year tax free break which i have for all the good it his doing me at the moment.


gobelelydoook


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## zakooo (Jan 2, 2015)

TonyJ1 said:


> gobelelydoook


if that is all you can say, i would say you should keep your gob well and truly shut.


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

zakooo said:


> if that is all you can say, i would say you should keep your gob well and truly shut.


Apologies - I had a post that was the only way to delete


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

zakooo said:


> if you mean the state pension,then its paid tax free because you have a £10,600 tax allowance before you pay any tax.


Regrettably your OAP is not paid "tax- free" it is paid without deduction of tax - there is a big difference. If you have any other income/pensions you will find that the amount of your OAP is deducted from your tax allowance leaving a very much reduced amount on your tax code which is then applied against your other income so, effectively, your OAP gets taxed that way.


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## robc (Jul 17, 2008)

I am sorry but I must take issue with what you say in your post



baldilocks said:


> Regrettably your OAP is not paid "tax- free" it is paid without deduction of tax - there is a big difference.
> 
> 
> Absolutely agree
> ...


HTH


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## TonyJ1 (May 20, 2014)

You may not 'elect' to pay tax in your home country - if you are liable to the tax rules of the country where you are resident, whether they are more or less favourable. Usually there are agreements between countries to smooth out any disadvantages


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## robc (Jul 17, 2008)

TonyJ1 said:


> You may not 'elect' to pay tax in your home country - if you are liable to the tax rules of the country where you are resident, whether they are more or less favourable. Usually there are agreements between countries to smooth out any disadvantages



Elect not a good choice of words.......point taken

Rob


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