# Suggestions, where to retire



## CAchicana (Mar 27, 2015)

I have not been researching places to retire for two years. still thinking Mexico--- has anything changes in two years. Was considering Patzcuaro, San Miguel de Allende, Guadalajara, d.f, ...... want someplace centrally located, with things to do (culture, people, beauty, arts, movies, maybe theatre). Just nice people, some stimulation, not too far from beach (very important to be able to go away for few days to the beach). Maybe place where I can take up hobbies.... I love photography, hiking, walking, good food, music, people. My husband would like to be able to volunteer and teach kids martial arts (Aikido).
some of you will remember my old name--- SF Chicana/


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## 863218 (May 3, 2015)

Hi CA chicana,
I too have been looking at Mexico for some time. Two places stand out to me, Mazatlan and San Jose del Cabo. Mazatlan because it has so everything that a mid sized US city has but. it is still Mexican away from the tourist area. A good sized expat community and is pretty inexpensive. San Jose del Cabo because it is a smaller town, but near Cabo San Lucas for services and is much less expensive than the latter. We are visiting Mazatlan in mid October will post something then. I will look for your post, and may get a lead on a new town to look at.


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

Sincé you have a desire to be near beaches, how about this. We live in San Cristóbal de Las Casas in the Chiapas Highlands. The town of about 200,000 people is at 2000 meters so it tends to be a bit cool but there are other towns near there where it tends to be really hot or less cool. The fun thing about acces to braches frm the Chiapas Highlands is that you can easily reach Gulf beaches in Northern Yucatán, Caribbean beaches in Quintana Roo or Pacific beaches in Chiapas or Oaxaca. All of these fun beach áreas are within a few hours drive and the variety of beaches from the crystal clear Caribbean to the lovely beaches and calm sease and aquamarine waters of Northern Yucatán to the magnificent beaches and wild seas of the Pacific are all within easy driving distance yet you can get back home where it´s always cool and pleasant in just a few hours. Not centarlly located but Chiapss may be the most beautiful state in Mexico. To each his own.


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## perezl (Nov 16, 2012)

COSENS,
Thanks for the tip. I would love to hear what you think of Mazatlan. My mom (mexicana) once told me that she liked Mazatlan (she ha travelled to all the Mexican resort cities). This is the only resort city I have not been to. I will post my report on my travels (or with write you directly). I am excited. I have been to Cabo and I definitely liked San jose del Cabo better. It just felt too removed from the rest of Mexico. (desert, have to import everything, etc). I also hear things about living in Puerto Vallarta. I have enjoyed it several times for vacation. Let's stay in touch. Where do you live now? I am in Bay Area and have alot of family in Sacramento and Bay Area, CA (and in Mexico City we have family.) Want to be able to travel there easily...


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## perezl (Nov 16, 2012)

Hound Dog,
We have communicated before (2 years ago) and your suggestions are very interesting. Have not been to chiapas in 30 years and it near YUCATAN where my husband has a daughter and some relatives... so its something to look at (even living there for a year!!). We have a friend in Tulum who is trying to recruit us there. Chiapas is cool (different from Merida). Looks like we have our next research trip ... to look at. (Chiapas). much as gracias for the tip. Leticia CA Chicana


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

perezl said:


> Hound Dog,
> We have communicated before (2 years ago) and your suggestions are very interesting. Have not been to chiapas in 30 years and it near YUCATAN where my husband has a daughter and some relatives... so its something to look at (even living there for a year!!). We have a friend in Tulum who is trying to recruit us there. Chiapas is cool (different from Merida). Looks like we have our next research trip ... to look at. (Chiapas). much as gracias for the tip. Leticia CA Chicana


Leticia:

We have a lot in common. My wife and I lived in Oakland just above the lake for several years and actually preferred it to San Francisco since, in our opinions, Oakland had perhaps the best climate of any city in the U.S. and great residential áreas. I believe that the northern coast of the Yucatán from Progreso to Dzilam de Bravo with that coast´s beautiful white beaches and aquamarine Gulf waters would be a great place to live and much less expensive than the Caribbean but Tulum is also a nice choice although I would personally avoid the Playa Del Carmen and Cancun áreas if I were you. 

Good luck in your new home search, We have lived in Mexico for 15 years and love it here.


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## Fugawibill (Nov 11, 2010)

I've lived in Mazatlán for the past 4 years, and after checking out other locations, both coastal and inland, I wouldn't live anywhere else. I still have a RV, so during the hot summer months, I head for elevation above 7,000 feet, normally San Miguel de Allende. Send me a PM, so I can answer specific questions. In full disclosure, I do volunteer work with the tourist bureau, so I "might" be a little prejudiced.


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## Anonimo (Apr 8, 2012)

*We'll take Pátzcuaro*



CAchicana said:


> I have not been researching places to retire for two years. still thinking Mexico--- has anything changes in two years. Was considering Patzcuaro, San Miguel de Allende, Guadalajara, d.f, ...... want someplace centrally located, with things to do (culture, people, beauty, arts, movies, maybe theatre). Just nice people, some stimulation, not too far from beach (very important to be able to go away for few days to the beach). Maybe place where I can take up hobbies.... I love photography, hiking, walking, good food, music, people. My husband would like to be able to volunteer and teach kids martial arts (Aikido).
> some of you will remember my old name--- SF Chicana/


We've lived in the Pátzcuaro area for nearly 10 years now, and don't regret it at all. It's a relatively small city, with its own special charm. The mountain and lake scenery is beautiful. There are arts, artesanías and culture for those who wish them, and especially in Morelia, the capital of Michoacán, a 40 minute drive from Pátzcuaro. There are plenty of volunteer opportunities.

There are some negatives. Winters can be cold, especially at night, with temperatures down to freezing. But it usually warms up during the day to a tolerable warmth. Many local expats as well as Mexicanos escape the cold with a 3 + hours' drive to the Pacific coast, Zihuatanejo for example, where they soak up some sun, seafood and warmth. Morelia is somewhat warmer, Uruapan, 40 minutes to the southwest, even more so.

Some would be exPatz could not tolerate the altitude, of around 7000 feet ASL, and left, for health reasons.

There is a dearth of above average restaurants in Pátzcuaro. Most restaurant fare is the comida típica of the region. It's not bad, but it gets monotonous for those of us who wish some variety. International fare in restaurants here usually falls far short of international standard. There have been some garish food combinations in an "international" restaurant, reported by friends (who liked it!). Morelia has much more to offer in its better restaurants. Pátzcuaro does have some tasty street food, but you may have to be bold to try anything more than corundas or tamales. Tacos de cabeza and birria seem to dominate the street food offerings.

On the other hand, the Pátzcuaro Mercado Municipal is one of my favorites in all of Mexico. I like it because it hasn't been prettied up, Disneyfied, or particularly modernized. We shop there, mostly for vegetables and fruits, occasionally for meat, at least once a week.

There are also a few, bland, modern supermarkets which we selectively patronize. They have much more convenient parking than the mercado. 

We chose Pátzcuaro over Morelia, for the former's relative tranquility and manageable traffic. Traffic in Morelia can often be a nightmare. Much of the traffic problem is exacerbated by demonstrators, for whom the state capital is a publicity magnet. Such stoppages are infrequent in Pátzcuaro. From time to time, the combi drivers or taxistas do a work stoppage and block key arterial points. But it's a minor nuisance, and with a little familiarity of the streets, such blockages can be bypassed.

Patzcuarense drivers are generally courteous, and will not run you over when you cross the street.

We sought tranquility, and found it by moving to a small village about a 20 minute drive from Pátzcuaro Centro. Besides the relative peacefulness and quiet, costs are lower outside the city, both for rent for a simple but comfortable house, and apparently for electricity. Or maybe we just got lucky. We also have friendly neighbors.


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

That was a good description of living in the Patzcuaro área Anonimo.

In 2006 when we were looking to escape the Lake Chapala área, Pátzcuaro was a place we seriously considered and we still think it is an atttractive place to live although living out in the country in that área may not be for everyone. Somehow, we ended up in San Cristóbal de Las Casas and still live in Ajijic on the lake years later. This is a long 19 hour drive between these two places and, looking back on the decisión to live in such far-flung regions, I question our sanity but the variety is a lot of fun for us.

San Cristóbal, like Pátzcuaro, is not a great restaurant town for either Mexican or international cuisine but. what the hell, we live within two blocks of the huge indigenous market there where we find an excellent selection of vegetables grown on milpas in the surrounding mountains so we normally dine at home on some very good food as I am sure is the case with you as well. Interestingly, there are very few expats living in San Cristóbal from NOB. However, there are quite a few Europeans and Central Americans. Quite a large number of Italians so we have a great Italian restaurant nearby (don´t tell Brigitte, who is French that I said that) with very good pizza so when we have had our fill of turnip greens and collards brought down from the nearby hills by our Maya cousins, we can cross the El Cerrillo Plazuela a two minute walk away and pig out on some very good pizza. 

One problem with San Cristóbal is that it, as Pátzcuaro, is at 7,000 feet and also subject to cold rains and fogs from the nearby Gulf of Mexico while the state capital of Tuxtla Gutiérrez, some 40 kilometers away down the escarpment and at 1,300 feet is hot as hell most of the time. People who come to live in Mexico need to be aware of these climate differences which, even within 40 kilometers, can be quite significant based on altitude variations. We have become highland fanatics in our old ages both in Jalisco and Chiapas after being beach fanatics on the Gulf Coast of the United States in my case and the beaches of France in Brigitte´s case when we were kids. When one gets older, sand accumulating in one´s posterior is less desirable than it once was plus there is no Billy Bob sex on the beach in one´s 70s - well, maybe for some overly zealous types but that is another thread.


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## 863218 (May 3, 2015)

Hi FUGAWIBILL and thanks for responding. I have pretty well decided to make Mazatlan our home base, but have also been looking at higher elevations to avoid the coastal heat. I will check out the other town you mentioned (on line) and see how it looks. While I don't have a camper, within 2 years if all looks good, we want to be in MX full time.

You offered to answer a couple of questions so here goes. 

With a 4 year visitor visa, 
can we travel freely between the US and Mx:
can we buy in to the mexican insurance program;
There are more questions, just can't think of them right now.
I will make a list and get back to you...

I have checked out so many mexican cities and mazatlan always comes out as the best, We are coming for a short visit in Oct. or Nov. so looking forward to it.

dave


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

COSENS said:


> You offered to answer a couple of questions so here goes.
> 
> With a 4 year visitor visa,
> can we travel freely between the US and Mx:
> ...


The four-year visa you speak of is a residence visa, not a visitor visa, and, yes, once you have it, you can travel freely between the US and Mexico.

What sort of insurance are you referring to?

Keep the questions coming . . .


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Yes, to both of your questions.
October will be the ‘shoulder season‘ but still fairly hot. Try it again in July-September, then again in December-February, and not in a fully air conditioned hotel; rent a normal home that may only have AC in one bedroom. Electricity is very expensive in Mexico.


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

COSENS said:


> Hi FUGAWIBILL and thanks for responding. I have pretty well decided to make Mazatlan our home base, but have also been looking at higher elevations to avoid the coastal heat. I will check out the other town you mentioned (on line) and see how it looks. While I don't have a camper, within 2 years if all looks good, we want to be in MX full time.
> 
> You offered to answer a couple of questions so here goes.
> 
> ...



OK, Dave, I´ll try to help but you may need to make your inqiries moer specific:

I may be ignorant of some of these issues but we have resided in Mexico for som 15 years and own two himes here in far different places. 

We have and have had for about 15 years mexican major, unlimted medical and I mean "unlimited" health insurance but as you get older, they annot cancel you if you pick the right insurance conmpany and this means *NO * group plans wahtsoever. If you wany major medocal from a Mexican or international insurance company you should contract for it as soon as you gt here. Later in life they may reject you. Te oler you get the higher the anual haltttalking seriosi mone hh
insurance anual prmium. Tey bwill not cancel you but we are talking money hee in the thousands of Pesos. Thdere are Mexican programs available all over the country for employe people andt the poor but I can not get into that now and, quite franky if you área truyl poor, do not come here. 

More later..


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## Fugawibill (Nov 11, 2010)

The posters above make a good case for their choice of places to live. Myself, I've found Patzcuaro and Chiapas too isolated, and Cabo only has one road in and out, which would give me peninsulaitis. Another choice would be the Lake Chapala area, but I've found the people to be a little on the snooty side, and I couldn't live in a place where they rolled the sidewalks up at 10:00PM. As somewhere different, and not mentioned, take a look at Cuernavaca, "land of the eternal spring".

There are two types of visas you would be interested in, which must be applied for at a Mexican consulate in your home state. Residential temporal has lower income requirements, and annual payments. You may also keep your foreign plated vehicle, and at the end of 4 years, apply for Residente Permanente. The permanente has a one time payment, and you're good to go. No foreign plated vehicles.

Insurance wise, Seguro Popular is free for all Mexicans, and those with a residential temporal and above. The program is not solvent, and the care suffers. A step up is IMSS, which is solvent, and adequate. The first two years have some coverage limitations, but after that, you're all in, but anything major, you may need to wait 6 months. The policy cost is around $350US per year. There are always private plans available at higher cost, but then Phoenix is about 780 miles for medicare, and you can purchase evacuation insurance.

Keep the questions coming.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

Fugawibill said:


> The posters above make a good case for their choice of places to live. Myself, I've found Patzcuaro and Chiapas too isolated, and Cabo only has one road in and out, which would give me peninsulaitis. Another choice would be the Lake Chapala area, but I've found the people to be a little on the snooty side, and I couldn't live in a place where they rolled the sidewalks up at 10:00PM. As somewhere different, and not mentioned, take a look at Cuernavaca, "land of the eternal spring".
> 
> There are two types of visas you would be interested in, which must be applied for at a Mexican consulate in your home state. Residential temporal has lower income requirements, and annual payments. You may also keep your foreign plated vehicle, and at the end of 4 years, apply for Residente Permanente. The permanente has a one time payment, and you're good to go. No foreign plated vehicles.
> 
> ...



Actually in Mazatlán and Culiacan there is good Seguro Popular funding and 4 new hospitals are going to being built.


Google Translation:

"Although lack of money Malova plans to build new Civil Hospital in Culiacan"

"CULIACAN.- October 30, 2015.- The Sinaloa government has repeatedly complained of the lack of funds to meet its financial obligations, ranging from social assistance to the construction works.

Civil society also feels it because the money does not circulate as originally occurred after any past election periods.

Despite these two aggravating, the government of Sinaloa, through the Seretaria de Salud is announcing a specific project to build three hospitals of great importance to Culiacan and the state: two Civil hospitals and one Pediatric.

"General Hospital of Culiacan was begun over 50 years ago, I had nothing 90 beds and a solarium area, so that the sick could sunbathe," said Ernesto Echeverría, Secretaria de Salud.

If the terms are equal the Civil Hospital of Mazatlan would also be replaced.

Only the approximate cost of the property would fluctuate between one thousand and one thousand 500 million pesos.

With regard to the location of new hospital in Culiacan, including the pediatric hospital would find, these would be in the departure area of ​​the city, on the road The Costerita.

"It would be an easily accessible, many truck routes Hirian over there so transportation is not an issue."

Construction projects of these health centers would be added to the UAS gave a week ago on the construction of a new university campus.

The Seretaria de Salud also ruled that the federal health agencies such as the IMSS, also made revisions to their properties to take the decision to build new hospitals, more functional and less attached to medical requirements last.

The unit also ruled that Sinaloa becomes nationally considered as a new mecca in terms of health, made the construction of these hospitals."


We have 2 new Seguro Popular hospitals here in San Luis Potosi and state of the art.

Their system is definately solvent and their projection into the future is very aggressive.

You will be getting a new Civil hospital [Seguro Popular] in Mazatlán also according to the article.

Pese a falta de dinero Malova pretende construir nuevo Hospital Civil en Culiacán


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## 863218 (May 3, 2015)

Thanks,

Your response answered a lot of questions about the insurane. We have been planning an a temporal resident visa, and hoping that it would be enough to get coverage. So we are on track. We are coming for a visit to Mazatlan in Oct. or Nov to check things out. we are planning to visit the consulate and get the right visa. 

We do have a concern about nark activity in Mexico, and have just ordered a book "El Narco" by one of the authors of the "Peoples Guide to Mexico"`and the snippets Amazon allowed us to read raised some concerns. Yet I have been in contact with FUG... and he/she drives a camper from Mazatlan to higher, cooler regions for the hot months so that doesn't sound too bad us. We know that one can fly into Mazatlan with security, but would like to be able to travel around some, your views would be helpful.

I am a little confused. Am I talking to Fug...or to another blogger. In any case is your point of refence Mazatlan?

Thanks for your great answer.

dave


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## Fugawibill (Nov 11, 2010)

Sorry about the confusion, but I normally don't quote a previous message, as it makes the thread much longer. I am a he, and also single, so may have a different outlook on some things.

There are obviously some narco problems in Mexico, mostly a turf war about control of drug routes to the US, and mainly in the border areas. Puerto Vallarta has been placed on the watch list, and three cruise lines cancelled their visit this week. The state of Guerero has continual problems, and it is the only one that I have been asked to leave by the Federales. 

I have lived in Mazatlán for 7 years, and never heard a gun shot. The ****** who was shot a couple years ago, didn't pay his drug dealer when they came to collect. Falling, due to poor sidewalks, is the leading cause of hospital visits here in Mazatlán.

The hospitals here are always overwhelmed, but there are always plans for further construction. Those that can, go to Guadalajara or Culiacan. Their hospitals are superb, and not crowded.


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## Fugawibill (Nov 11, 2010)

Here is a nice article about retiring to Mexico:

Retirement in Mexico Deserves a Fresh Look


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

Fugawibill said:


> Sorry about the confusion, but I normally don't quote a previous message, as it makes the thread much longer. . . .


When appropriate, I suggest quoting the message you are referring to. In the end, it will make the thread much easier to understand.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Isla Verde said:


> When appropriate, I suggest quoting the message you are referring to. In the end, it will make the thread much easier to understand.


I agree. When it is a long message that I am quoting, I often edit it, leaving only the part I am responding to, and replacing other parts with "…" or some similar indication that it was excerpted.


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## Rich S (Mar 21, 2011)

Anonimo said:


> We've lived in the Pátzcuaro area for nearly 10 years now, and don't regret it at all.


I've been lurking here for a couple of years and finally decided to make my move.

Looking to move from near Chapala to a cooler clime.
Could you suggest where to stay for a week or 2 to discover the area? 
My needs are simple and my Spanish conversational level after 12 years in Mexico.

Was looking at the Hostal Casa del Sol which had good reviews, is very inexpensive and a little off the beaten track.

Perhaps somewhere closer to Lupitas or other meeting spots would be better?

Any info you could supply about where to find rentals, places to eat or a trustworthy person to act as a guide would be appreciated.

OR if you prefer.
Since LADA is now free I can call you or you me if either is convenient.

Thank you in advance.


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## 1torrente (May 30, 2015)

Hey, Houndog, I'm a new guy in this block. You seem to be well versed in all things Mexico and I would appreciate any input you may want to give me on Puerto Vallarta. Spanish is my first language so living immersed in Mexican culture wouldn't be a problem, I think. Have you lived there? Do you know anyone who does that I could contact? How well can I live in PV on 1500 dollars a month? I'm single and older, but in good health. Thanks for your two cents worth, if you see this. jt


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

1torrente said:


> Hey, Houndog, I'm a new guy in this block. You seem to be well versed in all things Mexico and I would appreciate any input you may want to give me on Puerto Vallarta. Spanish is my first language so living immersed in Mexican culture wouldn't be a problem, I think. Have you lived there? Do you know anyone who does that I could contact? How well can I live in PV on 1500 dollars a month? I'm single and older, but in good health. Thanks for your two cents worth, if you see this. jt


Itorrent:

I like Puerto Vallarta as a place to visit - nice restaurants and beaches - but I´m afraid that I´m the wrong person to whom to ask this question since we haven´t been there in years since moviing much of the year to Chiapas in 2006 where we normally visit the Quintana Roo (Caribbean) , Yucatán (Gulf) and Chiapas/Oaxaca Coasts (Pacific). I don´´t really know what Puerto Vallarta costs today for residency rentals nor do I know anyone who lives there. I do remember many smaller beach towns around Puerto Vallarta which can be very nice but haven´been to any of them in years. Good luck in your search. Maybe someone else Reading this thread can help you. 

We tend to be Highland people in both Jalisco and Chiapas visiting the Southern Coasts in wintertime when the weather is pleasant but that´s just a personal preference and your experience may differ. We are from the Alabama Gulf Coast and do not seek out hot and humid beach communities except seasonally - been there, done that.


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## Hound Dog (Jan 18, 2009)

Ittorent:

I should add another comment on living in beach cities such as Puerto Vallarta. You asked about what would be a reasonable rent in that city and, I forgot to point out as a native to the Alabama Gulf Coast that, from my experience, location is everything. My experience tells me to warn you that you have two options in these hot and humid beach towns and my answer has a lot to do with your cost of living as you might have imagined:
- If you want to live in comfort with natural sea breezes, you need to find a residence _immediately _upon the beach - not a block back behind a beach front residence but right on the beach. Being right on the beach will raise your rent or purchase price significantly in a place such as Puerto Vallarta. Sea breezes are very important in these types of towns. 

- Compromise and find a residence with air condioning back from the beach. No breeze likely but nicely cooled artificial air. 

I don´t think I need to point out to you that being right on the beach will raise your costs - probably significantly. If air conditioning doesn´t bother you and you don´t mind being back from the sea- go for it.

I have no idea what $1,500 USD with buy you in Puerto Vallarta these days but you can always move back into the woods and that city is surrounded by beautiful jungles.


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## 1torrente (May 30, 2015)

Funny you mention Gulf Shores, my younger daughter was born in Mobile, at the USA Medical Center where I was doing my internship at the time, long time ago. I have fond memories of Mobile. Thank you for your input, jt


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## Anonimo (Apr 8, 2012)

*Belated reply*



Rich S said:


> I've been lurking here for a couple of years and finally decided to make my move.
> 
> Looking to move from near Chapala to a cooler clime.
> Could you suggest where to stay for a week or 2 to discover the area?
> ...


Sorry, RichS, I only now saw your post.

First, for better accommodations advice than I can offer, I suggest that you join the Yahoo Group called Michoacan_Net. (I am not allowed, I think, to post the URL here.) M_N has plenty of helpful information on practical aspects of living in Michoacán as well as notices for cultural events and some of the usual forum silliness.

When we moved here in 2005, we hadn't a clue as to where we were going to stay, other temporarily than at the Morelia home of a friend. But I saw a post for a 2 bdr, fully furnished cabin up in the pine clad heights south of town, and we leased it for 6 months. It was convenient but very uncomfortably cold, so when our lease expired, we moved on.

In your situation, I might suggest renting a unit at Villas Pátzcuaro, which is on the north edge of the city, close to a major avenue and transportation hub. We have not stayed there, but friends did several years ago, and it looked pretty nice. It's set back in a park like area so you shouldn't get much street noise. It's probably a 5-10 minute drive into Centro, depending on traffic, but it would probably be more convenient to catch one of the very frequent combi vans that ply the streets. For that matter, you could walk to Centro in about 30 minutes. It's mostly gently uphill.

Services and shopping are not limited to Centro. The area known as "La Estacíon", near the now closed train station, and more prominently. "CREFAL", or "Centro de Educacíon Regional para Adultos en América Latina y el Caribe" has many small shops, inexpensive eating places, and a small mercado, especially at the intersection of Avenida Saltillo (the libre highway to Uruapan) and the smaller cross street of Calle Tampico

I am not familiar with the Hostal del Sol, although I may have heard of it.

As to a guide, I can't help. Sorry. Maybe someone on Mich_Net can suggest someone. I would be happy to meet with you, but health issues preclude me doing any guiding.

Hope that the above helps some.

Saludos,
Anonimo

PS:
I looked up Hostal del Sol, and I now know where it is. It's close to one of our favorite restaurants, Mariscos La Güera, the office of our Internet provider, and an excellent, modern medical facility, Consultorios Médicos Especializados*Pátzcuaro. Plus, it's right on the edge of Centro, and about a 10 minute walk to the Plaza Grande. So that Hostal might be a good choice for your stay (if you haven't already come and gone.)

PM me if you would like to meet.

Saludos,
Anonimo/Mike


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