# Born to American Mother, filing US taxes looking at 10k



## koonz99435

Hello all, I just realized that I am supposed to be filing to the IRS. I have never lived or worked in the US but have dual citizenship by virtue of being born to an American mother. I have always filed my canadian taxes on time and was looking into getting my American taxes done and I've been quoted between 7500-10000k to get them done for the last 5 years. This is something I can't afford to do and was wondering what everyone else is doing because I can assume that most can't afford to be thrown a 7500$ bill to get your taxes in line with a country you dont live in or have never worked in. The only documentation I have saying I'm an American citizen born abroad is some piece of paper 30 years old. What does one do? I have family in the US and would like to visit at some point but have heard of being arrested at the border for tax evasion. Thanks


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## Guest

koonz99435 said:


> Hello all, I just realized that I am supposed to be filing to the IRS. I have never lived or worked in the US but have dual citizenship by virtue of being born to an American mother. I have always filed my canadian taxes on time and was looking into getting my American taxes done and I've been quoted between 7500-10000k to get them done for the last 5 years. This is something I can't afford to do and was wondering what everyone else is doing because I can assume that most can't afford to be thrown a 7500$ bill to get your taxes in line with a country you dont live in or have never worked in. The only documentation I have saying I'm an American citizen born abroad is some piece of paper 30 years old. What does one do? I have family in the US and would like to visit at some point but have heard of being arrested at the border for tax evasion. Thanks


Welcome! There's lots of really good information here - you might spend some time with the thread "US taxes for dual citizens - consequences" as well as
"Renunciation" for starters.

I am presuming you have something along the lines of Report of Birth Abroad and that you do not have a Social Security Number nor a US passport....Chances are they are _not_ aware of you. I have lived here nearly30 years, have a SSN, a passport and so far, they are not aware of me. There are lots of stories about people being stopped, questioned, arrested at the border. I don't know how many of them are true or not. I crossed a couple of weeks ago with my US passport (I'm dual-US/CDN) and it wasn't a problem. I was taking my son to get a Social Security number, he was with me and what else would we be doing in Ogdensburg NY?  But, I feel differently about going down for a family wedding on Thanksgiving weekend so am trying to get an EDL. And even with that, I am leary. Hopefully you don't need to go soon....

I don't know yet, what my accountant is charging me but I would be shocked at the range you've stated. If you have a simple financial situation, I can't imagine a return that costs $1500-$2000 a year. Perhaps you could try getting a few more quotes...What many of us are doing is getting the returns prepared as well as the FBARS while we start the renunciation process.


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## 416

That quote sounds outrageous. I had four years done for $780 (there was a friends-and-family-rate aspect to it, and she's not taking new clients - if I wasn't renouncing, she'd be guiding me toward doing them myself). 

You might ask for a quote if you do the FBARs yourself - I've heard that can lower the price.


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## Vangrrl

Are you born in Canada?

If you are, personally I wouldn't do anything. The IRS has no idea who you are and there are many MANY more people that they can pursue far more readily than you. When FATCA comes into place, you should be prepared to check off the box saying "no" to the question "Are you a US citizen?".

I can't speak for anyone else, but the only reason I chose to back file at this point is that I have a US birthplace and SSN and a US passport. Despite this fact, the IRS still doesn't appear to know who I am. I have only filed 3 US tax returns in my entire life (the only 3 years I lived in the US) and that was 12 years ago. Still its much more reasonable to assume that they might find me one day.

In any case, I used "Greenbacks Expat" tax services to do my returns for 2007-2011 at $270ish a return. I'll use them until I have filed my requisite 6 returns to be in compliance and then I will probably venture forward filing on my own. 

Like others have mentioned - check out the other BIG thread on the topic.


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## Guest

[/QUOTE] I have family in the US and would like to visit at some point but have heard of being arrested at the border for tax evasion. Thanks[/QUOTE]


FWIW:

Americans in Canada: Q and A | News | Financial Post

5. Can troubles with the IRS affect people’s travel to the United States?
CP: Currently, there is no stated plan of cooperation between IRS and DHS, meaning that tax non-compliance should not, at this point, affect your ability to cross the border. Many people have been stopped and questioned for travelling to the U.S. on a Canadian passport which lists a U.S. birthplace. This occurs because a U.S. person must enter the U.S. on U.S. documents.

As 416 mentioned, doing the FBARS yourself would probably help. I did mine, it was time-consuming but not difficult. My accountant will not do FBARS. I'll let you know what she charges once I get the bill...


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## Bevdeforges

koonz99435 said:


> Hello all, I just realized that I am supposed to be filing to the IRS. I have never lived or worked in the US but have dual citizenship by virtue of being born to an American mother. I have always filed my canadian taxes on time and was looking into getting my American taxes done and I've been quoted between 7500-10000k to get them done for the last 5 years. This is something I can't afford to do and was wondering what everyone else is doing because I can assume that most can't afford to be thrown a 7500$ bill to get your taxes in line with a country you dont live in or have never worked in. The only documentation I have saying I'm an American citizen born abroad is some piece of paper 30 years old. What does one do? I have family in the US and would like to visit at some point but have heard of being arrested at the border for tax evasion. Thanks


Unless you have some financial exposure back in the US (bank accounts, or investment accounts), I'd just lay low for the time being. In order to file, you need a US social security number and that will take a while to get, if you're determined to do your filings. Chances are, you don't owe any back taxes and "they" have no real way to find "accidental Americans" like you unless you've stashed vast sums of ill gotten gains in offshore accounts somewhere.

That quote for doing your back taxes is outrageous - unless you have very complicated financial dealings (with US exposure) you should be able to get away with using a tax software or online filing site. (Again, if you're determined to file.)
Cheers,
Bev


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## Mona Lisa76

koonz99435 said:


> Hello all, I just realized that I am supposed to be filing to the IRS. I have never lived or worked in the US but have dual citizenship by virtue of being born to an American mother. I have always filed my canadian taxes on time and was looking into getting my American taxes done and I've been quoted between 7500-10000k to get them done for the last 5 years. This is something I can't afford to do and was wondering what everyone else is doing because I can assume that most can't afford to be thrown a 7500$ bill to get your taxes in line with a country you dont live in or have never worked in. The only documentation I have saying I'm an American citizen born abroad is some piece of paper 30 years old. What does one do? I have family in the US and would like to visit at some point but have heard of being arrested at the border for tax evasion. Thanks


I had to pay about $10,000 to amend 2007-2009 and file 2010 correctly but my returns were complex because I had almost 50 pfic's with numerous reinvested dividends which involved complicsted computation due to the obscure 8621s. I probably could have found someone less expensive but there was a sense of urgency due to the possibility of having to consider entering into the 2011 OVDI before the deadline.

I'll never know if I could have gotten away with using someone much cheaper such as Greenback because of the lack of time I was made to believe I had. I'd been given the impression that it would be far too risky to simply file correctly going forward, especially due to the six year statute of limitations for FBAR. As I understood things, I had to have already filed my amended returns and earlier delinquent fbars before submitting this year's Fbar. So I felt completely stuck and felt I had no choice but to stick with this accountant. 

I also felt railroaded into a complete disclosure due to the upcoming fatca 8938 form which will also have to be retroactively filed from 2011 onwards, even if not released for several years. This will also, by default, extend the SOL's for any return that requires the 8938 subsequently attached...so if the finalized form doesn't come out till, say, 2015 it would by default extend 2011's SOL's to six years since they wouldn't start running until the pertaining 8938 was attached for those earlier years. It's a stealthy way for the IRS to extend its SOLs.

Because each tax year's return is over 150 pages long (will have totaled around 800 pages!!)once 2011 is also included, I will want to stick with this accountant so she can represent me in the event of an audit...and let's face it, my stack of returns can't but help to raise red flags, lol.

I will thus have to use her till at least 2016 and possibly up to 2018, though she has reassured me that my returns for 2012 onwards should be a lot less expensive as I will no longer have the complicating pfic's. It will mainly be a case of reporting everything correctly and should hopefully no longer owe any more US tax. She decided my tax bill was low enough to put me through a quiet disclosure since it will also have been obvious I hadn't done this intentionally. Greenback on the other hand would have probably pushed me into ovdi which would have cost me about $150,000 with all it draconian penalties. I will have owed about $13,000 in total which, while high, is at least not a life-changing amount. I'm guessing that with anomalous UK taxation on gains on my US mutual funds which is also going to probably set me back by another $10,000 in total (which won't be able to be offset, unfirtunately), plus all the accounting and financial advuce fees will have pribably set mebackbyaround $50,000 in total. But I blame myself for not having got the proper tax planning in the first place, thus my stupidity.


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