# Best language learning program?



## dred pirate (Mar 2, 2016)

So looking at retiring to Spain - still 10 years away so obviously things can change. I have a very basic knowledge of Spanish- and want to improve. I honestly would probably be best starting with a program for a novice with only a rudimentary grasp of the language. I am looking for something I can do while at the gym on my phone, mixed with computer work. What program would you all recommend? 

thanks


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## stevie.whitts (12 mo ago)

I've been using Duolingo for the past 256 days and had 0 grasp of spanish before that (apart from Hola, adios, de nada and Cerveza). On the few occasions that i've been to Spain since starting Duolingo, i can read text, understand and also speak a little. But if it's for the gym etc, perhaps Duolingo isn't the best as it is quite interactive


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## Joey Testa (Jan 5, 2021)

busuu is quite good


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## Joey Testa (Jan 5, 2021)

There is also a good YouTube channel called Easy Spanish


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

I also agree with duolingo and give the Rosetta Stone program a try, but it's also interactive. 

Steve


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## rspltd (Jul 5, 2016)

As with most things these days, the answer is not simple. Firstly you must question why you want to learn Spanish. Do you want to read road signs, shop signs, simple instructions: do you want to converse with Spanish people; do you want to read newspapers, listen to videos, tv or interprete official papers. All require a different level of competence. Recognising the danger of talking in generalisations, most Spanish learning programmes have an intent of reaching a standard or a qualification and usually have a teacher at the bottom of them. But are they relevant? Do you really want to learn how to book a plane ticket or ask for vegetables in a supermarket?
Young children do not learn this way and it is only when they begin school that rigid formality enters the scene.. If you are not used to learning or have not actively learnt for a long time. it will be a hard slog and you will probably end up learning tenses that not even the average Spaniard uses frequently. I regularly converse with a Spanish friend in Madrid, one in Barcelona and one in Peru - all speak a different Spaniish although the basics are the same and I am able to make myself understood by them (and them by me). Is my Spanish fluent - of course not and I suspect will never be so - but I am confident enough to speak to any Spaniard about anything (perhaps not nuclear physics) and will be understood. I use *Language Transfer* which has a different concept and involves no writing ( a win in my book). It was the first programme that finally explained the subjunctive to me and convinced me that I would never ever need it in my life - and it appears neither do a lot of Spanish folk. Will you be able to read a newspaper - no but that may be a good thing, but can you folow televsion, videos etc, without a doubt! Try it it's free!!.


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## Joey Testa (Jan 5, 2021)

The subjunctive is very common in Spanish and it is essential to be able to use it if you want to reach a good standard of spoken Spanish.


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## rspltd (Jul 5, 2016)

I can only speak as I find.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Joey Testa said:


> The subjunctive is very common in Spanish and it is essential to be able to use it if you want to reach a good standard of spoken Spanish.





rspltd said:


> I can only speak as I find.



It is also used extensively in English!


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

I don't know if Duolingo teaches American or European Spanish, but there are many differences in vocabulary, grammar and pronunciation, so something to be aware of if you're planning to move to Spain. Babbel is also supposed to be good.









How Is Spanish In Spain Different From Spanish In Latin America?


We consulted native Spanish speakers from six countries to find out the main differences between Spain Spanish and Latin American Spanish.




www.babbel.com





One tip - start by getting a thorough grasp of the pronunciation, then if you are talking to people using something translated on your phone, they'll be more likely to understand you. It's much easier than English as it's completely regular - only five vowel sounds (12 in English) and none of this nonsense with plough, through, cough etc.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> I don't know if Duolingo teaches American or European Spanish, but there are many differences in vocabulary, grammar and pronunciation, so something to be aware of if you're planning to move to Spain.


Duolingo is definitely S. American Spanish.

As a teacher of 'Spanish' Spanish, believe me, it can cause huge problems here in Spain if your only Spanish is via any app, since the vast majority are S. American Spanish.

I was once told of one which was 'Spanish' Spanish, but there were so many errors it would have been worse than using an app which taught S. American Spanish.


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## kaipa (Aug 3, 2013)

There are many ways of learning Spanish. The Apps are fine if you are a complete beginner and just want to get a very basic taste of the language but they wont really work if you intend to use Spanish when you live in the country. What is essential is that you are interacting with the language in real situations in real time. This is obviously difficult if you dont really get access to native speakers but it is the key to getting the language. For many retired people in spain the fact that they dont work or are forced into situations where they can't rely on English means they wont interact enough for the language to really cement. So no problem with duolingo to start with but you will need to be prepared to jump into the deep end to really start learning. And remember there is usually a small 2 or 3 year period at the beginning where you are suitably animated and uncomfortable to learn after that most people become complacent and give up.


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## Barriej (Jul 23, 2012)

kaipa said:


> For many retired people in spain the fact that they dont work or are forced into situations where they can't rely on English means they wont interact enough for the language to really cement. And remember there is usually a small 2 or 3 year period at the beginning where you are suitably animated and uncomfortable to learn after that most people become complacent and give up.


Sorry for cutting your comment but I totally agree with the above. I took early retirement from a completely practical based learnt trade, Ive never been any good academically. My language learning skills come down to ordering food and drink, I can ask basic questions, BUT as soon as I do this a complete torrent of language comes back. I then find i have to ask them to slow down and even then I get severely confused.
I am also very introverted and don't enjoy talking to people I don't know, this makes me more nervous and I tend to forget what I mean to say.
When I need something I will type the question into Google translate and I will also write down and try to learn a couple of the expected answers so I can respond depending on the answer. Other than that I have no conversation ability in Spanish outside of those parameters.
I can respond to the how are you with the usual Im ok and I can return the gesture. If they then launch into details etc Im lost again.



rspltd said:


> As with most things these days, the answer is not simple.
> Recognising the danger of talking in generalisations, most Spanish learning programmes have an intent of reaching a standard or a qualification and usually have a teacher at the bottom of them. But are they relevant? Do you really want to learn how to book a plane ticket or ask for vegetables in a supermarket?
> Will you be able to read a newspaper - no but that may be a good thing, but can you folow televsion, videos etc, without a doubt! Try it it's free!!.


Agree with the first part but I don't with the rest.
And yes I would like to book a hotel, plane ticket etc and ask for veg or visit a museum as its the sort of thing I would do on a regular basis.
I doubt very many on here would understand the intricacies of balancing the 400KG ring in a pallet wrapper held up by 6 nylon wheels and the fact that there are no wired connecting but 4 motors and a host of sensors are powered, but I can explain it and you would look at me with a glazed expression. And I had no written or spoken training I just know how this stuff works.

I work the same with spoken training systems. Language just doesn't seem to stick. (I used to travel to Italy for training on the mew machines in a class room, but they instead used to take me to the machine so I could actually do the job, the others stayed in the class)

As to reading a newspaper I find the written Spanish actually easier than the spoken as I can take my time and work out what is happening. I know enough single words (but can't string them together) and lots of words are similar or spelt the same as in English. And I've found that I am actually better at the flash cards bit and the written word games on Babbel etc.

Some people can learn, others cannot no matter what system they use. You have to find whatever method works for you.
The hardest thing others who speak Spanish have said, is that you have to stop thinking in English to speak and understand Spanish (or any other language for that matter), but once you can its easy..


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## tomwins (Dec 27, 2014)

For the gym, try COFFEE BREAK SPANISH podcast. They present the Spain pronunciation and give the Mexican as an alternative. The episodes go for 30 minutes or so and focus on practical situations: going to the market, at a restaurant, arriving at the airport... I never get all the information the first time so listen to them over and over - the real value of using a podcast.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

I have to ask, why do people think that new tech is the best way to learn?

I never used an App or audio medium for learning Spanish, I signed up to evening classes with a real teacher. It made me go, physically and pay attention and learn. By the time I came to Spain I had done two years and had a GCSE and an AS level (sorry to the US posters to whom these will mean little), and although it was nowhere near close to what I needed to live and work in Spain, it was a really good starting point.
Once in Spain I did a one month full time immersion course, again with a teacher in a college. Money better spent than on Apps, programs and media courses as far as I was concerned.


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## dred pirate (Mar 2, 2016)

Thanks all - so I get the difference between American Spanish and Spain Spanish - and it does present a little bit of a quandry - as far as what I may use in "Real life" - I live in the US - and travel to Mexico and the Caribbean -so that is where I will likely get the most real world use, but I would like to be able to consider living in Spain - so I probably would focus on which ever program helps teach me the most - then adjust accordingly?

I am not going to ever be an expert without being immersed, I get that. I would like to be able to do "survival spanish" - be able to order food, go to the market, get directions, etc. I am not as concerned about reading other than basic street signs, menus, etc. I do know if I choose to live in Spain, I will have to learn more, and be able to take a drivers license test in Spanish - but I will cross that bridge later as it is still 10 years away.


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## kaipa (Aug 3, 2013)

Overandout said:


> I have to ask, why do people think that new tech is the best way to learn?
> 
> I never used an App or audio medium for learning Spanish, I signed up to evening classes with a real teacher. It made me go, physically and pay attention and learn. By the time I came to Spain I had done two years and had a GCSE and an AS level (sorry to the US posters to whom these will mean little), and although it was nowhere near close to what I needed to live and work in Spain, it was a really good starting point.
> Once in Spain I did a one month full time immersion course, again with a teacher in a college. Money better spent than on Apps, programs and media courses as far as I was concerned.



I did an intensive course with a teacher every day for a month when I first arrived. A few years later I did another to get the EOI A2 exam. Then I had enough to start interacting with people in a way that was real and necessary and that's when you start to really progress fast but you need a couple of years of real study first.


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## Barriej (Jul 23, 2012)

dred pirate said:


> Thanks all - so I get the difference between American Spanish and Spain Spanish - and it does present a little bit of a quandry - as far as what I may use in "Real life" - I live in the US - and travel to Mexico and the Caribbean -so that is where I will likely get the most real world use, but I would like to be able to consider living in Spain - so I probably would focus on which ever program helps teach me the most - then adjust accordingly?
> 
> I am not going to ever be an expert without being immersed, I get that. I would like to be able to do "survival spanish" - be able to order food, go to the market, get directions, etc. I am not as concerned about reading other than basic street signs, menus, etc. I do know if I choose to live in Spain, I will have to learn more, and be able to take a drivers license test in Spanish - but I will cross that bridge later as it is still 10 years away.



Depending which area of Spain you end up in South American Spanish may not be a problem, we have loads of Argentines around here and a few from Columbia and Ecuador. 

My favourite bar in our town is owned and run by an Argentinean couple and they reckon they speak the 'proper Spanish' not the European muck.. 
And rather weirdly they speak slower than the Spanish and I can usually pick up about 25% more of the conversation and they are now adding English words into it as they want to improve their English. 
I told them that my bad West London accent would not really help...


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## kaipa (Aug 3, 2013)

As a beginner it matters nothing whether the speaker is south American or Spanish. You wont notice anything. I learnt alot because my mother in law was South American but the basic grammar is the same. It is the similar to American English and British English. Sure there are some words that are different but ar low level they are negligible. Car is probably the most common at beginner level or Que rico, for saying food is good or diminishing nouns with -ito ( Carlito). As for accent: again it is negligible for a learner, you wont start pronouncing like an Argentine just by practicing with them ( adults dont acquire accents when language learning only young children before puberty show this). In fact in the beginning you wont really notice anything- or to put it another way you will probably think Spanish speak faster than South Americans but it is really an illusion caused by different intonation patterns. Spanish students do the same often saying that they understand English but that on TV or radio people speak faster than on the street but it is basically nothing to do with speed but a mix of unknown vocab and unfamiliar contexts.( most interchange are transactional in the street)


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

kaipa said:


> As a beginner it matters nothing whether the speaker is south American or Spanish. You wont notice anything.


The learner won't notice... & that's the problem. 

I know someone who wanted to buy a car...the car dealer tried to send them to a ferretería.


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## timwip (Feb 27, 2017)

xabiaxica said:


> The learner won't notice... & that's the problem.
> 
> I know someone who wanted to buy a car...the car dealer tried to send them to a ferretería.


I do not necessarily agree with this statement. There are literally thousands of Ecuadorians, Colombians, Cubans, etc in Spain and they are not being sent in circles because of their pronunciation. I would be willing to bet that the person that you cited who was sent to the ferretería had this done because they did not speak Spanish well, regardless of their pronunciation.

I was educated at the University of the Andes in Bogotá, live in Spain and work in Mexico. I have never had anyone not understand me because of my pronunciation.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

timwip said:


> I do not necessarily agree with this statement. There are literally thousands of Ecuadorians, Colombians, Cubans, etc in Spain and they are not being sent in circles because of their pronunciation. I would be willing to bet that the person that you cited who was sent to the ferretería had this done because they did not speak Spanish well, regardless of their pronunciation.
> 
> I was educated at the University of the Andes in Bogotá, live in Spain and work in Mexico. I have never had anyone not understand me because of my pronunciation.


It isn't pronunciation.

It was a different word - possibly in addition to the iffy pronunciation of an absolute beginner.

i know many Colombians & Venezuelans. We've had chats about the different vocab, & they essentially have to learn the local vocab.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

xabiaxica said:


> It isn't pronunciation.
> 
> It was a different word - possibly in addition to the iffy pronunciation of an absolute beginner.
> 
> i know many Colombians & Venezuelans. We've had chats about the different vocab, & they essentially have to learn the local vocab.


Exactly. The word for car is carro in the Americas, coche in Europe. Carro in Spain means a trolley or wheelbarrow. No wonder that dealer sent him to the ferreteria...


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## timwip (Feb 27, 2017)

xabiaxica said:


> It isn't pronunciation.
> 
> It was a different word - possibly in addition to the iffy pronunciation of an absolute beginner.
> 
> i know many Colombians & Venezuelans. We've had chats about the different vocab, & they essentially have to learn the local vocab.





Alcalaina said:


> Exactly. The word for car is carro in the Americas, coche in Europe. Carro in Spain means a trolley or wheelbarrow. No wonder that dealer sent him to the ferreteria...


But even in Spain there are differences in terminology:

In the Canary Islands, they say guagua for autobus
In Asturias, they say me presta for me gusta

I think thiis thread is placing too much importance on pronunciation and occasional differences in terminology. Educated Spanish is pretty uniform throughout the world more so than English. In summary, I believe that it is not pronunciation nor terminology that causes expats to be not understood. These are just easy excuses. The reason they are not understood is basic Spanish language skills. Too many people think you can learn Spanish listening to recordings. You need to study grammar, read newspapers and books and have conversations.


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## manuka (May 26, 2014)

kaipa said:


> I did an intensive course with a teacher every day for a month when I first arrived. A few years later I did another to get the EOI A2 exam. Then I had enough to start interacting with people in a way that was real and necessary and that's when you start to really progress fast but you need a couple of years of real study first.


Where would you look for such a course, one that is tried and tested? I had a false start with a tutor; a university lecturer; I put hours of work in in consolidation every day for 2 months to try to absorb all the learning, but was too much ... it wasn't working for me - and was hard to finish gracefully without hurting any feelings. Now I am using _Speakly_


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## kaipa (Aug 3, 2013)

manuka said:


> Where would you look for such a course, one that is tried and tested? I had a false start with a tutor; a university lecturer; I put hours of work in in consolidation every day for 2 months to try to absorb all the learning, but was too much ... it wasn't working for me - and was hard to finish gracefully without hurting any feelings. Now I am using _Speakly_


I went to the escuela oficial de idiomas EOI. These are government funded language schools present in many towns in Spain. They are very cheap and the courses run for an academic year. They are popular so you often have to enrol by the end of June for September start. However, if there are places you can try beginning of September. They are closed July and August. They are good as they have trained language teachers who get paid well so they get very professional folk. One slight problem might be that some dont offer classes for complete beginners so you need to have learned to an elementary level A1. Otherwise I really recommend them


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## manuka (May 26, 2014)

Thank you. I need to practice! I wonder if there's an online portal where one can test/ find out one's language level?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

manuka said:


> Thank you. I need to practice! I wonder if there's an online portal where one can test/ find out one's language level?


Try this one. It uses the official DELE levels. The level you reach is the level at which you should be studying, not your current level.





__





Spanish level Test free - Test your Spanish level online


Spanish Profiency Test. Spanish level Test free, Test your Spanish level with the Spanish Profiency Test by Cervantes Escuela Internacional.




www.cervantes.to





That means if you 'pass' A2, you should be studying at that level, not that you would currently pass an A2 exam.


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## manuka (May 26, 2014)

Thankyou


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