# Is life in Dubai all it is cracked up to be?



## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

I have had an offer of a role in Dubai. I have enjoyed the two occasions we have been there on holiday and I am under no illusion that holiday and work are entirely different. 

The first offer on the table is less than expected and I've asked them to up it. They have offered 45,000 dirham when I expected it to be closer to 65,000 dirham. The salary quoted is an "all in" figure with no additional allowances. There is a further 5,000 dirham per month bonus that is paid quarterly.

The other parts of the package they are offering are:-

* Private Health insurance for me, my wife and baby
* 12,000 dirham at the end of 12 months for a return flight
* 8-10 public holidays
* 22 working days per annum annual leave

I would be interested to hear from others what they think of this package. The biggest issue I have is the 22 days holiday. In my current UK role I get 30 days plus I "buy" a further 5 thanks to a flexible benefits package. They tell me 22 days is standard across the whole organisation and cannot be negotiated. How does this stack up with other organisations in Dubai.

Another think that has come as a bit of a shock is the cost of renting a property and the fact it must be paid in either 1 or 2 instalments. We currently live in a 4 bedroom detached house in a very nice area in Poole. We had hoped to rent something similar but it seems the cheapest villa is around 250,000 dirham. That gets a small 2/3 bed unfurnished villa. I've spoken to a couple of agents who say this is about right.

The cost of rent seems to bear no resemblance to the price of property. With some very limited research it looks as though it may be better to purchase somewhere as the thought of paying out £40k per annum with nothing to show for it at the end does not sit well with me. Even if the market stagnates and there is no value growth, the cost of a mortgage over 2 or 3 years is likely to be less than rent.

And finally, the biggest worry for me is my wife and 11 month old baby. I will be at work all day but they will be stuck at "home" (whatever that turns out to be). How easy will it be for her to break in to the expat community of yummy-mummy's? It would make life an awful lot easier if she had the company of others with children of a similar age.


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

Gaza said:


> I have had an offer of a role in Dubai. I have enjoyed the two occasions we have been there on holiday and I am under no illusion that holiday and work are entirely different.
> 
> The first offer on the table is less than expected and I've asked them to up it. They have offered 45,000 dirham when I expected it to be closer to 65,000 dirham. The salary quoted is an "all in" figure with no additional allowances. There is a further 5,000 dirham per month bonus that is paid quarterly.
> 
> ...


I can't comment on you package because i don't know what industry you are in, and I don't know how it compares with your peers. 

I can comment on a few of your questions, though.

The labour law states that employees are entitled to 30 days leave. This is quite ambiguous though, as some companies count weekends taken in the middle of two or more weeks leave. DH's company told him that they were going to start doing this and he nearly died laughing. He said he would turn off his phone and laptop every Thursday evening and turn it back on on Sunday morning. That was the last we heard of that.  So, 22 days may be about right, IF they don't count weekends as annual leave.

Your salary would enable you to live quite comfortably only because you don't have children to educate, but it depends on what you want. Are you coming to save a fortune? Do you want a house similar to what you live in now? If so, you're looking at around AED400,000 a year, upfront. Are you happy to move into a 2 bedroom apartment to save money? Are your company willing to pay your rent for you? Either as an allowance or a loan? Is the wage you are offered now significantly higher than you are getting now? Is it a great career move? If not, you would really have to question what the attraction is for you?

As for your wife, there are many playgroups etc in Dubai that she could join. Does she drive? If not, she may find it very isolating. If so, she might love it. As most people she will come across will also be expats, she will have something in common with them immediately. My kids are older than yours (7 and 11) and I must admit it was extremely hard at first because I missed the support network I had with my family. However, at least with a child your age, you're not having to cope with the child's homesickness and missing old school and friends etc.

Just do your sums, then do them again. Personally, unless you are going to be significantly better of, I wouldn't bother. I say this because you seem quite happy where you are.


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## Maz25 (Jul 6, 2008)

The labour law states that you are entitled to *30 calendar days*. In practice, it works out at 22 working days as the 30 days is inclusive of weekends as well. It all depends on the company though - there is nothing stopping them from offering more. A lot of employers actually offer 30 working days, including mine!

I would advise that you study the market before committing to buying a property! It would be advisable to rent for a few months and get to know the area and the property rules before you commit to buying. Bear in mind that you would need a deposit of typically 10 - 25% depending on the lender!

Without knowing which industry you will be working in and how experienced you are, it's impossible to comment on your package.

As stated by Flossie, your wife will have no problem making friends here. There are loads of mum and toddler groups and coffee mornings that she can attend to meet other mums!


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

flossie - Thanks for the quick response. The attraction of the role is two-fold: (1) it is a totally different market sector for me (I am currently Head of Customer Service in a financial services company) and will broaden my experience and (2) I am being made redundant at the end of the year!

The total package will be higher than I am currently on and if I look at it objectively to earn the same (taxed) salary in the UK I doubt I would earn that sort of money.

My wife does drive and I will encourage her to join the playgroups. She is a primary school teacher in the UK and has said that in the future she may look for a part-time job in Dubai.


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## greatexpectations (Aug 5, 2008)

seems quite tight for a family: you quality of life will be worse than poole.

you are right to ask for 650k.


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## Mrman (Jul 14, 2008)

is that 65k or 650k?

big difference obviously.


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## sgilli3 (Mar 23, 2008)

Mrman said:


> is that 65k or 650k?
> 
> big difference obviously.


Think it is 65,000 dhs a MONTH


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

sgilli3 said:


> Think it is 65,000 dhs a MONTH


Correct. Following the advice give in one of the stickies I quoted the monthly salary that I am being offered (50K) and also the one I'm looking for them to pay.

The more I look at this the less financially attractive it becomes. The purpose of our move is not specifically to save money. We had hoped to be able to enjoy a nice lifestyle and live in a nice property while being able to put aside more than we do in the UK. Sitting last night working out our costs and making an allowance for investing in a pension the sums did not add up.

We had envisaged ourselves living in a house/villa with a small garden to allow our infant to play in. The cost of realising that dream seems prohibitive.


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## Maz25 (Jul 6, 2008)

What industry do you work in? Salaries vary from industry to industry. Sometimes it all comes down to the number of years of experience you have and the industry that you work in!


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## mazdaRX8 (Jul 13, 2008)

I don't know about you guys, but I fail to see how a 600,000 dhs yearly salary is not enough for 2 people and an infant...


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

Maz25 said:


> What industry do you work in? Salaries vary from industry to industry. Sometimes it all comes down to the number of years of experience you have and the industry that you work in!


I currently work in Financial Services but the new role will be in the property sector. I have more than 25 years work experience so that can't be an issue. 

It is not looking likely they will up the offer so the move may well be off.


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

mazdaRX8 said:


> I don't know about you guys, but I fail to see how a 600,000 dhs yearly salary is not enough for 2 people and an infant...


That's not really the point. I enjoy a certain standard of living at the moment and to enjoy a comparable standard of living in Dubai the salary currently on offer will not enable that. 

We live in a 4 bed detached house in a very nice area and would like something similar in Dubai. My wife wants a garden for our little boy and, if we bring him, the dog. The rental costs for villas in Dubai are exorbitant. For the sort of money being quoted I could rent a superb property on Sandbanks, and that is supposedly the 4th most expensive real estate in the world behind Mayfair, Kowloon and Manhattan!

There are many things that we take for granted in a UK package such as pension, life insurance and compnay car/allowance that when factored in significantly increase the overall value. Replacing these "hidden benefits" costs real ££££.


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## Maz25 (Jul 6, 2008)

Gaza said:


> That's not really the point. I enjoy a certain standard of living at the moment and to enjoy a comparable standard of living in Dubai the salary currently on offer will not enable that.
> 
> We live in a 4 bed detached house in a very nice area and would like something similar in Dubai. My wife wants a garden for our little boy and, if we bring him, the dog. The rental costs for villas in Dubai are exorbitant. For the sort of money being quoted I could rent a superb property on Sandbanks, and that is supposedly the 4th most expensive real estate in the world behind Mayfair, Kowloon and Manhattan!
> 
> There are many things that we take for granted in a UK package such as pension, life insurance and compnay car/allowance that when factored in significantly increase the overall value. Replacing these "hidden benefits" costs real ££££.


I understand where you are coming from! A lot of people fall in this trap where they just look at the overall package and fail to factor in the cost of living properly. You can survive on your package but it all depends on your lifestyle. What are your motivations for moving? Are you after a flashy lifestyle? If so, you can have it but you'll go home skint! Do you want to save and have enough to enjoy a nice comfortable life in the UK in a few years? Again, you can have it but you will have to make some sacrifices and cut down on the things you are used to! I've heard of so many people coming out here and going on a spending spree and buying all the things that they couldn't afford in the UK - they don't need them but they just have to have them! My friend wanted a Range Rover but I think after sitting down and thinking about it, he saw sense and realised that he wanted such a big car because he normally wouldn't be able to afford it - he doesn't need the car though!!

There are some nice apartments in Dubai and even nicer parks that you would find in the UK! I think you need to find the right balance and decide whether a garden is a must-have. In this case, unfortunately, your housing costs will be high! You can always compromise and drive to the park or the beach and just live in an apartment. Most of the areas in Dubai have really nice places where you can walk and considering the fact that there is so much to see and do in Dubai, what is the likelihood that you will spend a long time in the garden. In regards to your dog, some landlords allow you to keep pets in your apartment so you could still bring him. It's so hot out here that it's unlikely that the dog or yourself and your family will spend much time in the garden!

To be honest, your basic salary will not be much higher than it is in the Uk! It is the housing, transport and education allowance that pushes up the value of your package! I personally feel that you can live on your current package quite comfortably but ultimately only you will know what you need in your day to day life and the lifestyle that you want. Why don't you come out here for a visit and have a look around before you decide what you want to do? It might just erase some of your concerns and let you have an idea what you can expect if you decde to make the move.


Best of luck with the decision!


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

Gaza said:


> That's not really the point. I enjoy a certain standard of living at the moment and to enjoy a comparable standard of living in Dubai the salary currently on offer will not enable that.
> 
> We live in a 4 bed detached house in a very nice area and would like something similar in Dubai. My wife wants a garden for our little boy and, if we bring him, the dog. The rental costs for villas in Dubai are exorbitant. For the sort of money being quoted I could rent a superb property on Sandbanks, and that is supposedly the 4th most expensive real estate in the world behind Mayfair, Kowloon and Manhattan!
> 
> There are many things that we take for granted in a UK package such as pension, life insurance and compnay car/allowance that when factored in significantly increase the overall value. Replacing these "hidden benefits" costs real ££££.


I absolutely understand what you're sayiing and agree with you 100%. When my husband was first offered a job in Dubai, the package offered would not give us a comparable lifestyle to what we had in Australia. They kept nagging him for a year to come (he already worked elsewhere for the same company). He told them if they wanted him, they had to give us enough so our standard of living didn't drop. They came to the party, so we came to Dubai. Otherwise we would have stayed where we were. As I said before, you cannot understimate how hard it is to lose the support of your family when you have a young child.


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

Gaza said:


> That's not really the point. I enjoy a certain standard of living at the moment and to enjoy a comparable standard of living in Dubai the salary currently on offer will not enable that.
> 
> We live in a 4 bed detached house in a very nice area and would like something similar in Dubai. My wife wants a garden for our little boy and, if we bring him, the dog. The rental costs for villas in Dubai are exorbitant. For the sort of money being quoted I could rent a superb property on Sandbanks, and that is supposedly the 4th most expensive real estate in the world behind Mayfair, Kowloon and Manhattan!
> 
> There are many things that we take for granted in a UK package such as pension, life insurance and compnay car/allowance that when factored in significantly increase the overall value. Replacing these "hidden benefits" costs real ££££.


I absolutely understand what you're sayiing and agree with you 100%. When my husband was first offered a job in Dubai, the package offered would not give us a comparable lifestyle to what we had in Australia. They kept nagging him for a year to come (he already worked elsewhere for the same company). He told them if they wanted him, they had to give us enough so our standard of living didn't drop. They came to the party, so we came to Dubai. Otherwise we would have stayed where we were. As I said before, you cannot understimate how hard it is to lose the support of your family when you have a young child. 

Also, regarding the dog. Our cat is quite happy to laze around outside under a tree, on a nice damp, cool patch of soil. For 8 months of the year, the weather is gorgeous and your dog would quite like it outside.


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

This must be the most difficult decision we have ever had to make in our lives. 

The company have upped their offer by AED 10K per month but we are still AED 5K short of where we would accpt and AED 10K from where we would ideally be. In saying all that, with the state of the UK economy at the moment we may not have much of a choice but to accept. Thankfully a nice redundancy package from my current employer will cushion the impact.



flossie said:


> As I said before, you cannot understimate how hard it is to lose the support of your family when you have a young child.


That is less of an issue for us as we already live 480 miles from our families!  The biggest issue is we won't be able to pop-up to see Grandma and Grandad and they won't be able to pop down to see us as often as they do at the moment.

Do any of you regret your decison to relocate?

If you were offered a good position back in your home country would you take it?


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## crazymazy1980 (Aug 2, 2008)

Gaza said:


> If you were offered a good position back in your home country would you take it?


Had I found something that offered me the same quality of life back in the UK then I would have most definitely took it. I love the UK and even though the situation is grim economically, it's still the best country in the world for me.

The situation in the UK at the moment meant there wasn't. I don't regret relocating though. Dubai has a lot of things going for it and it's an experience that I may not have the opportunity to take later on in my life when other things take more of a precedence.


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## FlyingDodo (Aug 26, 2008)

crazymazy1980 said:


> Had I found something that offered me the same quality of life back in the UK then I would have most definitely took it. I love the UK and even though the situation is grim economically, it's still the best country in the world for me.
> 
> The situation in the UK at the moment meant there wasn't. I don't regret relocating though. Dubai has a lot of things going for it and it's an experience that I may not have the opportunity to take later on in my life when other things take more of a precedence.


That is exactly my reasoning. In 5 years time, if I chose not to move to Dubai for the experience, I think I would regret it. That was the main question I asked myself before deciding that I would take the plunge.


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

If I was single I would have no hesitation in accepting the offer. However, I have a wife and baby to think about. When we moved from Scotland to Dorset 5 years ago it was hard for my wife. She left family and friends and had to build a network again. Today she has a good network in place and now I'm proposing to yank her away from it all and she will have to start all over again. That is the hardest part of the decision making process.

I'd be really interested to hear from non-working spouses about their experiences and how they coped. I'd also be interested to hear from the working spouse about how they managed the situation!


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

Gaza said:


> This must be the most difficult decision we have ever had to make in our lives.
> 
> The company have upped their offer by AED 10K per month but we are still AED 5K short of where we would accpt and AED 10K from where we would ideally be. In saying all that, with the state of the UK economy at the moment we may not have much of a choice but to accept. Thankfully a nice redundancy package from my current employer will cushion the impact.
> 
> ...


If hubby was offered a position that meant we were financially no worse of back in Australia, we would take it in a heartbeat. That said, Aussies have to stay here for a minimum of two years to be regarded as non-resident for tax purposes. Coincidentally, I think two to three years is just about enough for Aussies in Dubai. We all miss it back home too much. Don't take this personally, but Brits seem to like Dubai more than Aussies on the whole. I think it has to do with the weather, perhaps. Hubby was offered a job back in Australia last year and we didn't take it. That was more to do with the fact that it wasn't as financially attractive, and that we had hauled the kids here and they had only just settled in.

As for your other question, it was bloody hard when we first moved here. Really, really hard. I got very, very sick about 3 months in and it was a blessing in disguise. People really rallied around me and my little family with school runs and meals, etc and it made me less homesick because I realised there were people around who would be there if I needed them. (And vice versa). I am lucky that my kids are at school so it was easy to meet other mums, but with toddler groups etc, your wife will meet people too.

If you have no option of a good job in the UK, and think you could live comfortably in Dubai, why not give it a whirl? For us to get home, it's an 11 hour flight. As someone pointed out to me, if we lived in Outback Australia and I needed to get to family, I could be driving for alot longer than that. To get from here to the UK, it's a doddle.


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## crazymazy1980 (Aug 2, 2008)

Gaza said:


> If I was single I would have no hesitation in accepting the offer. However, I have a wife and baby to think about. When we moved from Scotland to Dorset 5 years ago it was hard for my wife. She left family and friends and had to build a network again. Today she has a good network in place and now I'm proposing to yank her away from it all and she will have to start all over again. That is the hardest part of the decision making process.
> 
> I'd be really interested to hear from non-working spouses about their experiences and how they coped. I'd also be interested to hear from the working spouse about how they managed the situation!


Believe Macca is a non-working spouse...?


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

crazymazy1980 said:


> Believe Macca is a non-working spouse...?



Oi!! No such thing if you have kids!!


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## crazymazy1980 (Aug 2, 2008)

flossie said:


> Oi!! No such thing if you have kids!!


VERY True!!! 

My brother and his missus has 2 little'uns and I spend a lot of time there so I know how hard it is to raise kids properly.

Hope I didn't offend


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

crazymazy1980 said:


> VERY True!!!
> 
> My brother and his missus has 2 little'uns and I spend a lot of time there so I know how hard it is to raise kids properly.
> 
> Hope I didn't offend



Oh God, no. I'm an Aussie. Takes alot to offend me. I'm more offensive than offended.

Question to Gaza: Is it possible for you to come for a look see? Not unheard of for companies to do this.


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

flossie said:


> Question to Gaza: Is it possible for you to come for a look see? Not unheard of for companies to do this.


It is something we are considering. The problem is my wife teaches part time and getting time off is a nightmare. Her school don't know that she might be leaving and until it is more of a sure thing she is reluctant to tell them. We could wait until the half-term holiday at the end of October but by then it could be a bit late.


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## Maz25 (Jul 6, 2008)

FlyingDodo said:


> That is exactly my reasoning. In 5 years time, if I chose not to move to Dubai for the experience, I think I would regret it. That was the main question I asked myself before deciding that I would take the plunge.


True! Do it whilst you have the chance. Dubai has so many great things to offer and unless you try it, you won't really know whether it's for you or not! Home will always be there and will always welcome you with open arms if things do not work out!

Sometimes, it's good to get out of your comfort zone and try something new. Dubai could only ever be what you make of it! I'm a bit of a traveller so maybe I tend to see things from a different perspective!


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

The company have now sent me my contract. There are a couple of points I'd like help with before I go back to them.

They are saying that the cost of private heath care is split 75% (company)/ 25% (me). This works out at AED450 a month. Is this normal?

Notice period: 1 month on each side. I've been used to at least 3 months notice. Is 1 month standard policy in Dubai (I'm going in at VP level) or can I try for longer?


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

I don't know what is standard. I can only speak for ourselves and a few others I know. Does health cover include your dependants? In our experience, it's 100% company (including dependants). And my husband has 3 months notice period on both sides.

Elphaba might be able to help you on the health insurance. I THINK, by law they have to cover YOU 100%. I know some people have to pay for their dependants. Again, Elphaba will probably know.


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## Elphaba (Jan 24, 2008)

AED 450 pm for health insurance is very little, even for one person. I'd check what it actually covers if I were you. Ideally, you want a plan that allows you to go to the majority of hospitals and clients.

Dubai companies do not yet have to provide health insurance for employees, but they have announced changes that will come into effect in the bext few years. They are talking about a national health scheme funded by contributions from employers and individuals, but there are no real details or timeframes yet.

Everyone should have the best private cover that they can afford.

_


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

The AED450 a month is my 25% contribution. They have told me the cover is for me, my wife and baby.


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## Elphaba (Jan 24, 2008)

That's better. It was not clear from your earlier post. That ought to be enough to provide comprehensive cover for all of you.

-


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

*One step nearer*

Well things have moved on since my last post on this thread. A new life in Dubai edges ever closer. The value of the package has not changed but the UK economy has slipped further down the toilet and does not look like improving any time soon.

The company have now sent me a copy of my employment visa and are in the process of reference checking. There was a slight delay in the process due to some postal issues but things moved quickly thereafter.

We have revaluated our timelines and are slowing things down at the UK end. Our initial thoughts of getting the house on the sale/rental market have subsided and we are going to delay things a few months to ensure everything works out. No point in renting out our house, shipping our furniture and signing a 12 month lease only to find out the life/job is not for us.

I am still baulking at the cost of renting a villa. Since we started looking the prices seem to have risen even further. Are there really that many people moving to or already in Dubai who can afford to pay AED350,000 per annum for a decent villa?

One question I have is about buying a car. After being out for a few weeks I'll be returning to the UK for Christmas and New year. I am going to try to survive by using taxis to/from the office and hotel or apartment. When I return in January it will be a different matter and my wife and baby will join me a few weeks later. I'm not sure whether to try to buy then or rent for a couple of months. Taxis won;t be an option as I don't fancy hauling a car seat around with us everythime we go out!


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## Syndicate47 (Nov 3, 2008)

Gaz

I'm considering the same plunge at the moment and im struggling to make the numbers add up too. I'm sure I'll survive money wise, and hopefully might save a little too, I'm just thinking the experience might be worth the move??

Would like to talk to you direct about something of the things you're thinking about? All these Forums are really helpful and I bet we both have stuff to share. Can you message direct on this site?


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

Syndicate47 said:


> Can you message direct on this site?


You can but you need a minimum number of posts (6 I think) before the feature is activated.


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## Syndicate47 (Nov 3, 2008)

Gaza said:


> You can but you need a minimum number of posts (6 I think) before the feature is activated.


This looks like we have a private thread going here? Just looked, no we havent!

Anyway, how did it all work out? Or are you still thinking things through?


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

Syndicate47 said:


> This looks like we have a private thread going here? Just looked, no we havent!
> 
> Anyway, how did it all work out? Or are you still thinking things through?


I only posted the update yesterday so nothing has really changed. I am on course for arriving in Dubai on 30th November to start work on 1st December. Will be in company provided hotel/apartment for the first three weeks.

I am in doubt Dubai has a lot to offer but there are a number of negatives: property rental prices and suicidal drivers being two major concerns I have.


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## Syndicate47 (Nov 3, 2008)

Gaza said:


> I only posted the update yesterday so nothing has really changed. I am on course for arriving in Dubai on 30th November to start work on 1st December. Will be in company provided hotel/apartment for the first three weeks.
> 
> I am in doubt Dubai has a lot to offer but there are a number of negatives: property rental prices and suicidal drivers being two major concerns I have.


Same views as me really. I'm trying to get my company to increase their offer to sweeten the package. If not there are other places in the world I'd rather go!

Anyway, I hope it works out. Post any advice or progress!!

Good Luck.


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## ghandi2485 (Nov 18, 2008)

Hey guys are you two still using this thread? Mind if I ask a couple of questions too...?


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## Gaza (Sep 22, 2008)

*The Dream is over*

Just over a week before I was due to leave the UK I've just had a phone call withdrawing my offer. It seems the global slowdown has finally hit Dubai and the company has put a freeze on all recruitment and has made 200 people redundant. 

Thankfully I have not gone down the route of renting out my UK property so I do not have that to worry about. The biggest issue is I turned down a job in the UK a couple of weeks ago as Dubai was looking much more attractive.  With the current situation in the UK finding a good position will be very tough.

Let this be a warning for anyone considering quiting their job and taking one in Dubai. I was being made redundant anyway so had nothing to lose. If I had quit for the job in Dubai I'd be seriously pissed off.


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## flossie (Jun 9, 2008)

Sorry, Gaza. Hope another opportunity comes your way. Sadly, this is a story I keep hearing more often. 

Anyway, remember the answer to your original question: No, Dubai isn't all it's cracked up to be.


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## DesertStranded (Oct 9, 2008)

flossie said:


> Sadly, this is a story I keep hearing more often.
> 
> Anyway, remember the answer to your original question: No, Dubai isn't all it's cracked up to be.


Unfortunately, I can second that sentiment.


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