# Working / Living in Japan Refusing to speak / learn Japanese



## s1rr10n

This may sound like a stupid question,


but is it possible to work / live in japan without knowing (or rather refusing to know) Japanese language at all?

Thanks


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## larabell

Yes... it's possible. You might have some trouble getting around or buying food and supplies but a lot of people make do with very little Japanese when they first come over and they pick it up as they go.

Whether you can find a *job* with no Japanese is a different story. Most people that do so manage to get sent over by their home-country employer. Some find jobs teaching English (the one job where Japanese fluency is kinda moot). As one example, there's a program called "Jet" where you can get hired to teach English in public schools without having to come to Japan first. However, teaching jobs are harder to come by these days than a couple decades ago. There are probably other ways to find a job that doesn't require Japanese but keep in mind that you'll be competing against local job seekers who: (a) already speak Japanese, and (b) don't need their new employer to jump through hoops to sponsor their visa. Having a skill that's in short supply here... or finding a company in your home country that can send you here to work in their Japan office are usually easier methods than just looking for a job yourself. Also, for most working visas you'll need a college degree (unless you're an entertainer or a sumo wrestler).

That said... assuming you find an employer who is willing to sponsor your visa, you don't need to be able to speak Japanese in order to get by. But it sure helps.


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## shamar

I think its a very difficult place to live with zero Japanese, but if it doesn't interest you at all you certainly can survive with just the basics.

Sorry I am talking about greater Tokyo here. Not sure about elsewhere.

Of course if you don't speak Japanese with any proficiency you will be a bit overly dependent on your aquaintances to assist you at times.


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## s1rr10n

VISA is not a problem here.

I am holding a dependent resident card as a spouse of Japanese national. Basically i can start working at any times without any problems with the visa, so long as the employer is willing to employ someone who has completely ZERO Japanese skill and has no means or willingness to improve it at all.

Let's make it clear here that i have really no interest to learn Japanese. So i will not want to pick up anything along the way, maintaining that i will speak and communicate 100% in english at all times and not even the basics.


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## larabell

The only people I know of who live and work in Japan and don't use any Japanese at all are in the US Military and never leave the base. If your goal is to avoid using Japanese at all costs, you shouldn't live here. For one thing, it's pretty hard to find products like soap, shampoo, etc that have any sort of English on them at all. I know that from personal experience. You won't be able to use buses or taxis (if you never leave Tokyo, you can probably get around OK on the trains with no knowledge of Japanese). Don't even think of eating in a restaurant or stopping in a bar for a quick drink.

You'd have to be pretty dense to live here and not pick up any Japanese at all. It doesn't matter whether you're interested in learning... you'll hear it spoken around you every waking hour. I can't imagine how anyone could manage not to pick up at least a few common words and phrases.

Still, I've met people who have been here for years and can't construct a sentence to save their lives. So what the hell... give it a shot. It's your life, not mine.


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## s1rr10n

I never actually have any interest living in Japan where the society is so closed and so ANTI-foreigner and i have had personal experience dealing with Japanese customers in my line of work, and not once (but many times!) they looked down on Gaijin like me.

If i do not do this and sacrifice my life and career then i will not be able to see my son anymore as my wife will divorce me and take custody of the boy to live in japan. I basically have no choice, but that doesn't mean that i like it.

I am quite an international person myself, as my line of work require me to travel around APAC region. However, i have never seen any other countries in asia with such a low english-speaking society as Japan. Also the personal- bad experience i had dealing with Japanese customers definitely didn't help at all.

That is my situation now. I am just looking for alternatives and possibilities. Writing something like "you should not come here at all" certainly doesn't help anyone and will only cause negativity and prejudice to build up even more!

Thank you


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## since1990

s1rr10n said:


> I never actually have any interest living in Japan where the society is so closed and so ANTI-foreigner and i have had personal experience dealing with Japanese customers in my line of work, and not once (but many times!) they looked down on Gaijin like me.


It would be practically impossible not to pick up any Japanese at all whilst living here. Sorry.

Judging an entire race of people on a few bad personal experiences is also closed-minded. You should open your mind and utilize the opportunities around you. If you learn Japanese whilst living here, you will get to learn more about Japanese people, the good and the bad. You will also learn more about your own culture, and how other Asians behave here in Japan.


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## s1rr10n

since1990 said:


> It would be practically impossible not to pick up any Japanese at all whilst living here. Sorry.
> 
> Judging an entire race of people on a few bad personal experiences is also closed-minded. You should open your mind and utilize the opportunities around you. If you learn Japanese whilst living here, you will get to learn more about Japanese people, the good and the bad. You will also learn more about your own culture, and how other Asians behave here in Japan.


I guess the only option for me is to divorce and never see my son again.


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## since1990

s1rr10n said:


> I guess the only option for me is to divorce and never see my son again.


Nah, it's a much better idea to learn to forgive others. Maybe that's something a lot of Asian cultures lack...


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## s1rr10n

since1990 said:


> Nah, it's a much better idea to learn to forgive others. Maybe that's something a lot of Asian cultures lack...


Its probably going to take a lifetime for me to learn to forgive. 

I do not think there is time for that.


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## Raffish_Chapish

I work as a headhunter recruiting expats in the banking industry and I don't need any at all. I'm not learning Japanese but I've picked up: 

Thank you very much 
Good morning 
Good evening 
Yes 

Mainly because I was brought up to be polite.

I also rented an apartment, opened a bank account, got a phone contract and metro card. Plus I get around Tokyo just fine using train and taxis and have been pretty much anywhere I have wanted to go in terms of nights out etc.

All with no Japanese apart from the above 4 

You could work behind the bar at any Hobgoblin English theme pub if that appeals to you?


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## s1rr10n

Raffish_Chapish said:


> I work as a headhunter recruiting expats in the banking industry and I don't need any at all. I'm not learning Japanese but I've picked up:
> 
> Thank you very much
> Good morning
> Good evening
> Yes
> 
> Mainly because I was brought up to be polite.
> 
> I also rented an apartment, opened a bank account, got a phone contract and metro card. Plus I get around Tokyo just fine using train and taxis and have been pretty much anywhere I have wanted to go in terms of nights out etc.
> 
> All with no Japanese apart from the above 4
> 
> You could work behind the bar at any Hobgoblin English theme pub if that appeals to you?


That sounds good. At least more constructive advice rather than some other people post here.

A headhunter agent once told me me that even though I had 20 years experience, all i know and learn and have are useless just because i cannot speak Japanese. This is the one that flip me up and make me angry. Such a closed minded culture with no appreciation on talent. Arrogantly think that the language and culture are the best in the world. But enough ranting i guess.

Would be great if you can link me up to your firm for such job. I am in the IT / Telco industry and can do the similar function like what you're doing, but targetting different group of people.


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## Raffish_Chapish

Yes but don't be angry because they want you to speak Japanese, it's not closed minded - it's a sound business decision, surely you can see that.

If I was Greek, and ran a shipping business - and I wanted to hire a manager, would I want one with 10 years experience who could communicate with others in my country, or one with 10 years experience who could not communicate at all..

Fairly easy decision.


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## s1rr10n

Raffish_Chapish said:


> Yes but don't be angry because they want you to speak Japanese, it's not closed minded - it's a sound business decision, surely you can see that.
> 
> If I was Greek, and ran a shipping business - and I wanted to hire a manager, would I want one with 10 years experience who could communicate with others in my country, or one with 10 years experience who could not communicate at all..
> 
> Fairly easy decision.


I beg to differ, that's not a fair comparison.

I've been traveling throughout Asia for the last 20 years of my career. 

I have seen foreigners in countries like Thailand, Vietnam, Indonesia, India, Maldives, Korea, even China. None of the countries I mentioned using English as their primary language.

But the difference here is that they accept, and they open. It is OK and fine not to be able to speak Chinese in china, and you still can work. I've known an Indian chap working for a China firm in Shenzen, and he's doing all OK without knowing a single Chinese. I've known another Scottish guy working in Mumbai, India without speaking a single Tamil.

But Japan is different. It Is always different. They chose to seclude themselves in a sea of arrogance and selfishness to think that the culture is the best in the known universe and thus they feel like they do not need to learn, speak or accept any other language other than Japanese. :noidea: That's just language problem to start with.

I've also learnt that Japanese working environment, makes no room for negotiation, reasoning. It's more top down where the subordinate must listen and do what the superior has to say, just like the old days when life is still feudal. I've had this against me many many times when supporting Japanese customers and/or business partner.

Yes, maybe it's the fault in my side. I shouldn't have married a Japanese wife. I shouldn't have even consider to have anything to do with Japan. But now I only care about my son. He's not 100% Japanese. It's not fair if he has to be secluded and living like a turtle in a shell like most 99.9999% Japanese are.

To Raffish_chapish: I am not directing this against you. This is purely my rant against Japanese culture and people.


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## larabell

Language and cultural issues aside, since your wife is Japanese and apparently willing to divorce you in order to move to Japan (as you said in a previous post), my guess is that she's going to raise him as Japanese whether you go along with the plan or not. That's just a guess -- I don't know any more about your situation than what you've already posted.

If that's a fair assessment, there's one more thing you might want know about Japan. Joint custody doesn't exist here. It's not even paid lip-service. If you and your wife divorce in Japan, there's a near-zero chance you'll be involved in your son's life at all. If you think you can keep the relationship together, you might want to reconsider learning Japanese so at least you can communicate with your son, his teachers, and his friends as he gets older. Otherwise, you might consider filing for divorce yourself before she can take him to Japan -- and get an order from the court preventing her from removing him from the country where you're currently living without your permission.

I'm not saying this to criticize... I just wonder if you're thinking about this move from a long-term prospective.


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## karenmin

I think you have to learn a bit Japanese if you still wanna live or in this country. Learning Japanese is not a bad thing, why don't you just try from now on


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## jrwelker

Keeping all of the advice above in mind regarding jobs (and especially divorce/custody rights—do research that verrrrry carefully before allowing your son out of whatever country you're living in!!), I do encourage you to not take your anger out on Japan as a whole. It's far more diverse and less monolithic than it might seem if you're only looking at the surface. If you come here expecting it to be full of people who have universally "chose[n] to seclude themselves in a sea of arrogance and selfishness to think that the culture is the best in the known universe and thus they feel like they do not need to learn, speak or accept any other language other than Japanese" and will never negotiate about anything, and everything is completely top-down, that's what you're going to see. 

There's a long and complex history behind why Japan's English-language education is so appalling, but the idea that all (or even most or many) people don't accept any other language besides Japanese is not one of the reasons for the horrid language education system. And it's the failures of English-language education here that are the reason most people can't communicate in English. On the other hand, some major local companies who who want to put on a more global face have English-only communication policies—Rakuten being the most well-known—even though the majority of employees are Japanese. 

The hierarchy of Japanese society itself has very deep roots, but it too is not monolithic. (Yes, there are arrogant *******s at the tops of organizations or divisions, but not everyone with seniority is a jerk.) In many ways, there is a lot of effort toward egalitarianism here—flawed as that may be as well. 

But beyond the truth or falsity of your assumptions, you are going to be very unhappy if you live in a culture where you see everyone around you except your son as "arrogant," "selfish," etc. I hope that after this initial understandable anger at your situation settles down a little, you'll be able to open your mind to all the positive things about Japan. And if your own happiness isn't sufficient justification, consider how your feelings about Japan will affect your son, for whom Japan represents half his heritage.


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