# Should I really fear the death of Nelson Mandela???



## Tonyj (Sep 25, 2011)

Hi,

I am considering ( with passion) of moving ( forever) to Durban in the next few years from London. This would involve me and my partner ( whos family are there), initially renting in Durban waterfall then if all goes well ( employment, happiness etc) selling my house in London and buying property out there.

I ve heard and researched all perceivable pitfall and balancing everything up we re still in the position of wanting to go!

However,I have recently become aware of a urban myth that is apparently rather strong and widespread throughout SA.....The Death of Nelson Mandela and the aftermath that will ensue! Properties being stolen form the white population and a bloodbath. Not such enchanting tales! After reading, many blogs and the hugely differing story reaching from the "Its not going to happen for the sake of SA" to, Its a definite and everyone should leave while they can".

Generally if something is threatened so much, it never eventually happen( laws os society) however, its not the best news to hear considering my intention to move there!!

I d be very grateful for anyone who could shed some light on the subject, and hear rational explanation of what could really happen rather than the "fear" ( which is all that threats are usually meant to evoke ) - But still scary stuff man!

Cheers...........


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## fromthe hood (Aug 22, 2011)

Tonyj said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am considering ( with passion) of moving ( forever) to Durban in the next few years from London. This would involve me and my partner ( whos family are there), initially renting in Durban waterfall then if all goes well ( employment, happiness etc) selling my house in London and buying property out there.
> 
> ...







Listen, some on here are gonna try and scare you that way. But use your head on this one. When the neo nazis were forced to give up their racist regime and mandela and the ANC took over dont you remember ALL the White people that said they were leaving, never to return, the country would be in ruins?? Well, they went NOWHERE! The country is now part of a serious strategic trade alliance, and continues to grow. When my Baba does have safe passage it will do nothing. This myth was beased partly on the fact that many whites tend to think that when the tables are turned that Black people will do then the same way. Just ignore such myths.


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## Tonyj (Sep 25, 2011)

Hi,

Thanks for the reply, I really appreciate it. The most horrid thing is that my question had to mention the unmentionable - That being of the death of someone so great - Nelson Mandela. The man I perceive to have fought to maintain for the sake of SA the equilibrium. When his path could have well and truly have taken ( considering!!) a totally opposite direction. Realising a strong infrastructure was already there and utilising this to build a new SA with greater socialist values to look after the poor ( The UK did this in the 1940's with the public health service to help reduce terrible poverty and disease sections of British society) This takes TIME...Years! Even when this is finished there will still ALWAYS be a group of wealthy elite ( be Black or White) 

My only other concern about my relocating to KZN Durban is that I m also hearing tattle and yet again based on fear, about the sub division of the ANC - the youth devision? We have radical political group here in England also ( Nazi type groups - ashamedly) however, they are so small that they are nothing to fear. I ve heard that this rather strong ( in numbers) and have very radical views of SA and particularly hate speeches and barbaric views of a modern free equal society

Whats the possible outcome if they were the ruling party?

Cheers.................


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## savannah77 (Sep 28, 2011)

You know the type of people who believe the world is run my a New world order of lizard people who eat our children ? These are the same type of people who think there will be a mass murder after Mandela dies. Make out of that what you wish. 

The South African extreme right are a paranoid bunch of loonies. It's obvious to any thinking person they project onto black people the same intentions they had when they were in power. South Africa has a generation who had race rhetoric and propaganda pumped into their veins about how blacks wanted to kill them. How else do you think they could be prepared to stand on a border with a gun (mandatory) ? 

So while it's easy for us to understand these people and what drives them, it's also wise to perhaps take them with a large pinch of salt.


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

What SA needs is another 20 years of Madiba but it ain't gonna get it...... Should you fear events immediately after his death? ....... Yes. I think you should but not half as much as you should fear Julius Malema and his ilk.......


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## savannah77 (Sep 28, 2011)

travelling-man said:


> What SA needs is another 20 years of Madiba but it ain't gonna get it...... Should you fear events immediately after his death? ....... Yes. I think you should but not half as much as you should fear Julius Malema and his ilk.......


Please qualify why we should fear events after his death ? If you can come up with any sort of evidence to back that fearmongering up I would be rather surprised to say the least.


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

Once Madiba goes so will the forgiveness he's been advocating and in his place will be people like Malema who will preach the opposite and my guess is the Afrikaans won't be prepared to take it.

I have immense respect for Mandela but after he goes, I reckon there could well be trouble ahead.... I could of course be wrong and I hope I am but I've kicked around about 6 or 7 African countries for 30 odd years so do have a bit of experience of the dark continent.


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## savannah77 (Sep 28, 2011)

travelling-man said:


> Once Madiba goes so will the forgiveness he's been advocating and in his place will be people like Malema who will preach the opposite and my guess is the Afrikaans won't be prepared to take it.
> 
> I have immense respect for Mandela but after he goes, I reckon there could well be trouble ahead.... I could of course be wrong and I hope I am but I've kicked around about 6 or 7 African countries for 30 odd years so do have a bit of experience of the dark continent.


Yeah well you're wrong. When Madiba dies the whole country will unify to show respect for he grat man. It will likely be a wonderful moment of unity rather than division. I'd bet my house on this.


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

Good to hear you're so confident...... My guess is that when he does croak, the country will mourn and I doubt the rumours of things like the blacks will attack the whites in a night of the long knives etc.......... but I do think that after he's gone, things will get a lot worse very quickly.

I'd expect more companies forced into BEE, more corruption, more ineffeciency and more crime..... to say nothing of the larger issues such as nationalisation and land grabs if/when Malema or someone like him ever gets to be President....... and if that happens, I'd also bet there will be other civil unrest becauseI doubt the Afrikaaners will roll over as easily as the white Rhodesians did. 

I might of course be wrong and I sincerely hope I am wrong but I suspect I won't be.


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## stormgal (Sep 30, 2009)

Maybe you should pm the expat who started this thread:

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/america-expat-forum-expats-living-america/89824-farming-usa.html


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## savannah77 (Sep 28, 2011)

travelling-man said:


> Good to hear you're so confident...... My guess is that when he does croak, the country will mourn and I doubt the rumours of things like the blacks will attack the whites in a night of the long knives etc.......... but I do think that after he's gone, things will get a lot worse very quickly.
> 
> I'd expect more companies forced into BEE, more corruption, more ineffeciency and more crime..... to say nothing of the larger issues such as nationalisation and land grabs if/when Malema or someone like him ever gets to be President....... and if that happens, I'd also bet there will be other civil unrest becauseI doubt the Afrikaaners will roll over as easily as the white Rhodesians did.
> 
> I might of course be wrong and I sincerely hope I am wrong but I suspect I won't be.


Malema popularity decreased in the past year and a half from 21% to 17%. That's less than one in five people supporting him. He's never going to be president despite the media attempt to constantly report on his every action. Malema can't fart without it making a headline. Stupid alarmist journalists. 

News - Malema support down 

Also nobody is forced into BEE, incentives are given. Violent crime has also decreased almost every single year since 1994 by over 50%.


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## savannah77 (Sep 28, 2011)

stormgal said:


> Maybe you should pm the expat who started this thread:
> 
> http://www.expatforum.com/expats/america-expat-forum-expats-living-america/89824-farming-usa.html


I won't bother. I can tell I already know everything I need to know about that person and his ***** claims.


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Tonyj,I am one of the naysayers on here, the urban myth about Madiba's demise and the aftermath is just that, myth, its propaganda by a small minority of right wing loonies.

That SA will decline is, however, my belief and I posted my dispassionate reasons in the Shebeen section.
Durban area is quieter iro of crime and I dont foresee that suburban property owners will ever be disposessed, they will however be taxed punitively for services.

I also figure it will be at least 10 years before Juju becomes a pres, unless he and Winnie set up a rival Political Party or stage a coup.

At that point I think the Flights will be full.


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## johamburger (Oct 3, 2011)

Daxk said:


> Tonyj,I am one of the naysayers on here, the urban myth about Madiba's demise and the aftermath is just that, myth, its propaganda by a small minority of right wing loonies.


Certainly loonies and a small group but very vocal on the internet. 



> That SA will decline is, however, my belief and I posted my dispassionate reasons in the Shebeen section.
> 
> .


You're welcome to your belief. I did not read your views. Did you counter balance them with the upcoming African economic miracle about to blossom from which we are bound to benefit from ?



> Durban area is quieter iro of crime and I dont foresee that suburban property owners will ever be disposessed, they will however be taxed punitively for services.


Have you recently visited Durban ? Glad to hear crime is more under control there too. What do you make of the new developments in the city and beach front etc ?


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

johamburger said:


> Certainly loonies and a small group but very vocal on the internet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, they pulled out all the stops to refurbish the beachfront,at one time I thought there were more Police in evidence than visitors. very Impressive, lots of new clean sand and Buildings.
but two blocks back from the beach it stopped.

The drop in Crime rate is welcome,across the board.
I just wish the Police knew what it was that they did differently in the rest of SA?
because they dont have a clue as to what caused it.


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## Madig (Jul 11, 2008)

South Africa has been bumped up to a 6 on the UN's Genocide Watch List. Enough said.


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

I personally think the high level of attacks on Farmers is opportunity based.
They are mostly isolated homes and by the nature of their work Farmers are vulnerable.

The attacks mostly started when the new Democratic regime started getting loose bowels at the thought of a bunch of highly trained soldiers with Radio Communication and armed with semi auto weapons would be protecting themselves, and disbanded the Farmers Citizen Force Commando system.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Daxk said:


> I personally think the high level of attacks on Farmers is opportunity based.
> They are mostly isolated homes and by the nature of their work Farmers are vulnerable.
> .


Perhaps but please explain the brutality


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Its power based, the Justice system has failed,they know there is little chance of being punished for it, and is there really much difference to the brutality and gratuitous violence that happens in a suburban Home under the same circumstances?
The Rapes, torture and executions happen there too.
The Difference is that on a farm they tend to have more time.

On a different thread a study I was involved in during the 80's found that Black people under the age of thirty had high levels of PTSD behaviour.
They are now the parents of the most common age of perpetrator.


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Halo said:


> Perhaps but please explain the brutality


Dont get me wrong, I think there is a very high level of Black on white hatred.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Daxk said:


> Dont get me wrong, I think there is a very high level of Black on white hatred.


Agreed but why the mutilation / rape etc... I don't get it.


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Power and subjugation.
They are suddenly placed in a position of absolute power, from a Phsychology basis you can write reams on it but it all boils down to frustration which leads to anger, its an emotional high and once it starts it difficult to stop.
you can see the same thing under Battle Conditions, fear and adrenalin and action combine and suddenly a line is crossed in the mind and there is no thought for the consequences or empathy.
Wits Criminal Phsychology Project in combinatio with NICRO interviewed a couple of hundred hard core criminals and aprt from an incredibly low percentage of pure Phsychopaths( cant remember the percentage) virtually all had started with a low self esteem basis and the acts gave them a measure of self esteem.
especially since less than 10% of all murder cases that go to court get a conviction and less than 9 percent of all rape cases are convicted,and of the convictions 7/10 knew the perpetrator.ie the easiest cases to solve.
so of every 100 rapes where the Police are able to arrest someone, only 9 are convicted.
and less than 10% of all Rape cases reported ever go to Court.

The above figures come from the SA Law Society, btw.
The reason given is that most rapes are solved through Forensic Medicine, and the SAPS Forensic Labs are two years behind as they are totally understaffed as they cannot hire because of AA .
Wits School of Medicine offered, it was turned down.


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## Stevan (Jun 30, 2009)

> On a different thread a study I was involved in during the 80's found that Black people under the age of thirty had high levels of PTSD behaviour.
> They are now the parents of the most common age of perpetrator


Daxk

At the risk of seeming even more stupid than my wife thinks i am. What is PTSD behaviour. 


Steve


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## Stevan (Jun 30, 2009)

As an aside. I had heard these rumours so asked a couple of older guys that work for me about it. One just laughed and the other with a cheeky grin just says " just proves you whites are as stupid as i thought you were if you believe rubish like that"


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Stevan said:


> Daxk
> 
> At the risk of seeming even more stupid than my wife thinks i am. What is PTSD behaviour.
> 
> ...


Post Traumatic Stress Disorder


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Daxk : Yup but I still don't get it...........


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Halo, the problem with the PTSD or suffering from Aprtheid as an excuse is difficult as the majority of Incidents are by people to young to have been affected.
Their parents may have been, and in bad parenting, carried some of that across.
the problem also is not poverty as in my 54 years in SA I never saw anyone starve to death as I did in the other African Countries.

Stevan, ask your young friends what the African term for whites is, (Umhlunghu) and ask them for its meaning. (White Scum on the Sea)
I'll bet they will look uncomfortable.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Africa is just a mess - Perhaps its a little better that 500 years ago but its still a mess...... Tribal hatred and magic ju-ju beads..... Hell, thank the good Lord I am no longer there.


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

I love Africa and have seen a fair bit of it over the years and that includes living in the bush for months on end but the problem with Africa is that it's wasted on and spoiled by the Africans who have a different mentality to the rest of the world.


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## Mike_P (Oct 8, 2011)

Not much hope when people fall for this type of rubbish :



> I KNOW YOU MUST HAVE GOTEN MY EMAIL FROM ONE OF THE PEOPLE I HAVE HELPED IN THE PAST. I HAVE BEEN HELPING PEOPLE WITH SPELLS FOR YEARS AND I HAVE NOT HAD NO SINGLE REGRET.
> * I WILL NEED YOUR FULL NAMES AND DATE OF BIRTH AND THAT OF YOUR HUSBAND TO PROCEED TO CASTING THE SPELL.. WHERE DO YOU LIVE? GET BACK SOON AS YOU CAN
> 
> I JUST DID A READING TO IT AND FOUND OUT THAT A SECRET ADMIRER OF YOUR FRIEND HAS USED A SPELL ON HIM TO WIN HIM AWAY FROM YOU AND THAT IS WHY HE HAS ABADONED YOU THERE.. THIS LADY IS EVIL AND HAS USED A VERY POWERFULL SPELL ON HIM.
> ...


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Tonyj said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am considering ( with passion) of moving ( forever) to Durban in the next few years from London. This would involve me and my partner ( whos family are there), initially renting in Durban waterfall then if all goes well ( employment, happiness etc) selling my house in London and buying property out there.
> 
> ...


Tony, as you can see the only one who has to fear the death of Nelson, is Nelson, especially if you believe in Judgement in the afterlife. lol:evil:


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## Mike_P (Oct 8, 2011)

The ANC have ensured that Nelson Mandela is out of the public eye and off the political scene. He did wonders for South Africa and is rightly revered and respected by most of us. When he passes, I don't think this is going to have much effect on events in the country as he has become less relevant with the passage of time and events.


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## Stevan (Jun 30, 2009)

Daxk said:


> Halo, the problem with the PTSD or suffering from Aprtheid as an excuse is difficult as the majority of Incidents are by people to young to have been affected.
> Their parents may have been, and in bad parenting, carried some of that across.
> the problem also is not poverty as in my 54 years in SA I never saw anyone starve to death as I did in the other African Countries.
> 
> ...


Daxk

Ask some of your white friends some of the names they use for blacks. Ill bet none of them look uncomfortable.


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## Mike_P (Oct 8, 2011)

Ah yes, the old 'previously disadvantaged' rubbish. Nobody born in SA since about 1990 is disadvantaged, it's the other way round now. But it will used as the excuse for the next 5 generations as black Africans have blamed 'colonialism' for everything for the last 50 years or so.


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## Mike_P (Oct 8, 2011)

CORRECTED as I missed out a vital word!

Ah yes, the old 'previously disadvantaged' rubbish. Nobody *non-white* born in SA since about 1990 is disadvantaged, it's the other way round now. But it will used as the excuse for the next 5 generations as black Africans have blamed 'colonialism' for everything for the last 50 years or so.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Thats not entirely true due to the history... etc... But yes, the blame game will continue (just look at old mad Bob)

Also, The Brits need to think back about all the laws they passed in South Africa.... Their own problem then and now before they pass judgement.


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## korriem (Oct 20, 2011)

Back to the original topic, I have been working with many South Africans over the past few years here in America(white, colored, and black) and all of them agree with "myth" of Mandela's death. And after deciding to move to South Africa I got a lot of warnings and questions about those same "myths" from Americans who have never met any South Africans. So if these really are just myths, then why is everyone backing them, and why do Americans who have no knowledge of most of the history there know about them?


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

korriem said:


> Back to the original topic, I have been working with many South Africans over the past few years here in America(white, colored, and black) and all of them agree with "myth" of Mandela's death. And after deciding to move to South Africa I got a lot of warnings and questions about those same "myths" from Americans who have never met any South Africans. So if these really are just myths, then why is everyone backing them, and why do Americans who have no knowledge of most of the history there know about them?


Grassy Knoll?


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

I care more about the reality of crime...... Mandela is a relic from the past.


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## Stevan (Jun 30, 2009)

korriem said:


> Back to the original topic, I have been working with many South Africans over the past few years here in America(white, colored, and black) and all of them agree with "myth" of Mandela's death. And after deciding to move to South Africa I got a lot of warnings and questions about those same "myths" from Americans who have never met any South Africans. So if these really are just myths, then why is everyone backing them, and why do Americans who have no knowledge of most of the history there know about them?


myths like lies tavel faster,farther and wider than truths


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## Stevan (Jun 30, 2009)

one of the "myths" or "rumours" or "facts" (feel free to decide which one you like) that i have read .

The day mandela dies 100000 taxies are organised to transport armed men to the center of joburgh and pretoria.

lets assume that you can organise that many taxies to be at one place at one time, this i doubt but come on lets play along.

ok 90% of the drivers will be drunk. the other 10% will demand money from the passengers to get drunk.

60% will breakdown before they get within 50km of their destination.
39.9% will crash whilst racing on the highway.
.8% will get lost on the way.

one taxi with twenty drunks carrying sticks will arrive in joburgh city center.


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Stevan said:


> one of the "myths" or "rumours" or "facts" (feel free to decide which one you like) that i have read .
> 
> The day mandela dies 100000 taxies are organised to transport armed men to the center of joburgh and pretoria.
> 
> ...


That is so funny!!!!!


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Unfortunately, History in Africa has shown many enough incidents to raise the fear of it.
Mob rule can flash anytime anywhere if people think they can get away with it.
SA's darkest hour in the 60's, Sharpeville, was preceded by 5 policemen getting hacked to death with pangas in a Policestation at Cato manor the month before by a crowd of 200.
does not excuse what happened but explains the fear.


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## Moyes (Nov 3, 2011)

Mandela was a great leader who I have plenty of respect for! I have to admit though, having been a victim of crime on our farm and my father who got murdered during the process over a decade ago, crime is definitely out of control on farms and when I was there(farm) we constantly live in fear and every noise we hear we get up with guns loaded flashing our flashlights all over the farm etc I personally think that nothing has improved ever since Mandela left the office. Fortunately the farming area which is in the Eastern Cape hasnt had a murder in the area this year, but has had a few attempted murders and robberies. The cops our completely usless there. They have been seen boozing with the locals in uniform and doing doughnuts at the shebeen and take ages to show up if you call them. Then you wonder why the cop cars are always ******ed! I know this because I use to speak to the locals in Xhosa as im fluent in it so I heard about all the 'whispers' in the town.We were even told by an ex cop that if a person decided to break into the house and was armed, just shoot and fire a warning shot afterwards etc 

I dont think South Africa will spiral out of control in the next 3 or 4 years, but I do think that if/when Julius Malema becomes president then I will seriously be worried as he is a loose canon who is ready to embrace Robert Mugabe ideas about land reform and 'dubula ibhulu!'

Also, I recently saw an article and also looked it up to make sure it was true and saw South Africa has been increased to level 6 on Genocide Watch which is the level before it actually happens. They explainend why they increased it etc and if you would like to read it just google Genocide Watch South Africa . Im surprised it hasnt been on the news....

Anyways, I will be going back to SA next year with my wife to be closer to family and shall take it year by year...and see what happens. Cheers


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## Thunderball (Oct 27, 2011)

Moyes said:


> Mandela was a great leader who I have plenty of respect for! I have to admit though, having been a victim of crime on our farm and my father who got murdered during the process over a decade ago, crime is definitely out of control on farms and when I was there(farm) we constantly live in fear and every noise we hear we get up with guns loaded flashing our flashlights all over the farm etc I personally think that nothing has improved ever since Mandela left the office. Fortunately the farming area which is in the Eastern Cape hasnt had a murder in the area this year, but has had a few attempted murders and robberies. The cops our completely usless there. They have been seen boozing with the locals in uniform and doing doughnuts at the shebeen and take ages to show up if you call them. Then you wonder why the cop cars are always ******ed! I know this because I use to speak to the locals in Xhosa as im fluent in it so I heard about all the 'whispers' in the town.We were even told by an ex cop that if a person decided to break into the house and was armed, just shoot and fire a warning shot afterwards etc
> 
> I dont think South Africa will spiral out of control in the next 3 or 4 years, but I do think that if/when Julius Malema becomes president then I will seriously be worried as he is a loose canon who is ready to embrace Robert Mugabe ideas about land reform and 'dubula ibhulu!'
> 
> ...


I agree that nothing has improved since Mandela left the office. As for Julius Malema, he is suppose to be the Youth leader but the example that he sets for the youth is terrible and they seem to be crazy over him. It is sad to see what South Africa is becoming.


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## DonoZA (Jan 10, 2012)

I think the "night of the long knives" (as this myth is also known) is silly  I doubt very much that anything like that will ever happen. I think that Mandela's death may even unite the country a little bit (even across race barriers). Unfortunately there are other well known problems in the country and you may be better off looking elsewhere for a future.


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## Charles III (Jan 15, 2012)

Yes, forget about such "Uhuru" / "Night of the long knives" garbage. If you want to escape the armpit of Europe that is the UK, by all means, if you have the resources and the opportunity - do it. The UK is in serious financial difficulty. The Debt to GDP ratio is off the charts.

Not sure what visa you would come here on, but if you get that sorted, maybe wait a little longer, the Rand will continue to slide, and you'll get more bang for your quid. Also, I hope you are "African" at heart, because you are moving to a country that is moving away from identifying with Europe, and toward an African way of thinking. Also, SA will be allied with China, Venezuela, Iran etc in the new world order. It's traditional allies of the UK, Israel, Oz etc will fall by the wayside. That won't happen for another 10 years or so yet. Good place to be if there's a WW3 though, kinda out of it down here. 

Anyway, if I was you, yes, I'd get out of the UK. Personally I'd go to Oz, but if you like SA, it's still a better choice than blighty. Just leave some money in a foreign currency, very important!


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Charles III said:


> Anyway, if I was you, yes, I'd get out of the UK. Personally I'd go to Oz, but if you like SA, it's still a better choice than blighty. Just leave some money in a foreign currency, very important!


Not if you have skills...... England may not be what it was 10 years ago but its a far safer bet than SA and you become portable.... Cost of living / earnings are still more favorable and remember folks.... Its about the long term.


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

FWIW, there are also other options in Europe. We reluctantly left RSA a few months ago and moved to central Portugal. 

The Govt are keen to see new investors and immigrants, prices, esp property prices are lower than RSA and after RSA, it's incredibly effecient, honest and crime free here.

Language is a bit of a problem but not insurmountable, the people are friendly and welcoming and although neither of us wanted to leave Africa, neither of us would go back......

As for Malema, I reckon either he or another of his ilk will one day be President and when that happens, the country will become another Zimbabwe.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Correction = It will become another Nigeria.


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## Tonyj (Sep 25, 2011)

Could people Just lay off slagging South Africa off at every opportunity. Mainly people that have left for there own reasons....There is still a lot of life left in SA. Sorry you had to move but that was your choice. There are MANY very happy people that live in SA and dont want to move...So just enjoy where you moved to and stop looking back.


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Tonyj said:


> Could people Just lay off slagging South Africa off at every opportunity. Mainly people that have left for there own reasons....There is still a lot of life left in SA. Sorry you had to move but that was your choice. There are MANY very happy people that live in SA and dont want to move...So just enjoy where you moved to and stop looking back.


why? does my CRITICISING corruption and failures of the Govt of MY Country where I still pay taxes impact on your decision to move there?

it was your choice,if you for any reason criticised the Govt of the UK which you have left, would I have the right to tell you to stop?
because you had left there?


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## Tonyj (Sep 25, 2011)

Hi, its nothing personal I can assure you....just could it not be slightly more constructive, and focus on the positives of SA. everything you say is true, but the sun still shines and the country is beautiful.

I could seriously criticise the UK government...I just dont know realistically know how far that would get me?
Have a nice day.


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## Daxk (Jan 20, 2008)

Tonyj said:


> Hi, its nothing personal I can assure you....just could it not be slightly more constructive, and focus on the positives of SA. everything you say is true, but the sun still shines and the country is beautiful.
> 
> I could seriously criticise the UK government...I just dont know realistically know how far that would get me?
> Have a nice day.


I did not take it personally neither were my remarks a personal criticism.

and yes the sun shines and it has beautiful scenery and great game parks and the Indian ocean is warm and the people are friendly and passionate.....etc.

Its been like that for my 60 plus years.
but the injustice and corruption of the Apartheid Gvt did nt change because they woke up morning and said, hang on, this is wrong.


It changed because people who were not in the Country criticised what they were doing.
and made other people sit up and take notice.

because like the present Govt, you could not vote the previous Govt out because they pulled a fast one as soon as they came into power.

they gerrymandered the electoral districts so that 1000 white farmers would have the same voting effect as a suburb of 100,000.
and then gave the farmers subsidies.

and that only changed because someone told someone who wrote an article who made more people sit up and say hang on... and they spoke to people they COULD vote ut and said I dont think we should support... etc..
simplistic and I dnt mean to patronise you.
African Continental History since the 50's has proved that you dont pat a naughty child on the head and say Good Boy!! well done!!if you want him to change what he is doing.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Tonyj said:


> Could people Just lay off slagging South Africa off at every opportunity. Mainly people that have left for there own reasons....There is still a lot of life left in SA. Sorry you had to move but that was your choice. There are MANY very happy people that live in SA and dont want to move...So just enjoy where you moved to and stop looking back.


No can do...... Each country has its issues. SA is on another road. Enjoy the ride.


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

Africa is truly wonderful but as politically incorrect as it is to say so, the problem with it is that it's wasted on


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## Folcwigga (Feb 16, 2016)

Given the ANC have now said they are going to start taking land and property from whites, and that other elected politicians in SA are openly talking about killing all the whites in SA, i wonder what the OP thinks of the situation now?


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## terryZW (Jun 26, 2017)

Folcwigga said:


> Given the ANC have now said they are going to start taking land and property from whites, and that other elected politicians in SA are openly talking about killing all the whites in SA, i wonder what the OP thinks of the situation now?


Oh.. cmon. It's just unnecessary panic. I'm pretty sure even when the whites took the land before all this there were those who said it was the end of the world but look where we are today. Like will still get back to normal after taking it back.


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