# Form of personal identification Barcelona



## mermer (May 27, 2014)

Can anyone please verify the form of personal ID it is required one carry in Barcelona of recent. I heard rumors that one must now carry their passport rather than an ID card, but I cannot find such information at bcn.cat. Other sources suggest a copy of passport is sufficient. Thank you for any guidance.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

mermer said:


> Can anyone please verify the form of personal ID it is required one carry in Barcelona of recent. I heard rumors that one must now carry their passport rather than an ID card, but I cannot find such information at bcn.cat. Other sources suggest a copy of passport is sufficient. Thank you for any guidance.


everyone is supposed to carry a form of legal photo ID


as a non-EU citizen I imagine you have a tarjeta de residencia? - that is fine

us EU citizens don't get those, & us poor Brits are supposed to carry our passports - though a Spanish driving licence is generally accepted

those from other EU countries would usually have a national photo ID card

in some areas a notarised copy of the photo ID is accepted

Spanish nationals have to carry their national ID card - the original - at all times -so essentially it's the same for foreigners, too


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> everyone is supposed to carry a form of legal photo ID
> 
> 
> as a non-EU citizen I imagine you have a tarjeta de residencia? - that is fine
> ...


I dont know how legal it is, but we used to carry small (credit card sized) photocopies of our passports, with our NIE numbers on the back. It was accepted whenever we were asked to show ID

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I dont know how legal it is, but we used to carry small (credit card sized) photocopies of our passports, with our NIE numbers on the back. It was accepted whenever we were asked to show ID
> 
> Jo xxx


that will often be accepted - but if you get a jobsworth Guardia officer you'd be in trouble

there are reports of fines atm for not carrying proper ID


(says she who is grateful to be well known locally & refuses to carry her passport on the grounds that it's too ·"·$*¨^ expensive to replace if it gets lost)


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## mermer (May 27, 2014)

Thank you.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> everyone is supposed to carry a form of legal photo ID
> 
> as a non-EU citizen I imagine you have a tarjeta de residencia? - that is fine
> 
> ...


Generally your British Photo Card Driving License is welcome ( as id ) at most
checkout counters across Spain when paying by Debit or Credit Card.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Williams2 said:


> Generally your British Photo Card Driving License is welcome ( as id ) at most
> checkout counters across Spain when paying by Debit or Credit Card.


And I produce my SIP card whenever a store or delivery driver wants my NIE. But that isn't official ID either


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> And I produce my SIP card whenever a store or delivery driver wants my NIE. But that isn't official ID either


Of course it's not official but there again it gets you by in most situations
in Spain without being encumbered by a Passport.


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## 90199 (Mar 21, 2010)

I was once asked why don't the British have identity cards, I replied," Sabemos lo que somos," We know who we are, great hilarity followed…… Here I have never carried any form of I.D. card, except when traveling, but everybody knows almost everybody, so there really is no point.


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

I have been using my Residencia, which expired in 2007, as ID, however, I accept that would not be accepted by any person in an “official position” of authority, police officer, notario, judge etc. On those occasions I of course take either of my original passports, which as a Brit and Irish national are the only legal forms of ID available to me.

(If I wanted to use a certified copy of one of my passports, then it could only be one certified by the relevant Consulate, not a solicitor, notary, town hall etc, ).

On a practical, day to day, level those not in a position of authority who may require proof of ID, shop assistants, garages, restaurants, etc. would probably accept a ‘used bus ticket’ as of course they would have no knowledge of the legal requirements. But the fact that such people might accept something is no argument that such instruments are legal ID.

The law does require that everyone carries legal ID, so don’t get on your high horse if a `person in authority’ will not accept anything but that declared as legal ID by the law.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

larryzx said:


> I have been using my Residencia, which expired in 2007, as ID, however, I accept that would not be accepted by any person in an “official position” of authority, police officer, notario, judge etc.
> 
> ...


I'll probably wish I hadn't asked but;

"why did your 'residencia' expire??"


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> I'll probably wish I hadn't asked but;
> 
> "why did your 'residencia' expire??"


he probably means the old cards which you were supposed to hand in when they expired & you registered under the new rules....


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

snikpoh said:


> I'll probably wish I hadn't asked but;
> 
> "why did your 'residencia' expire??"



(here we go again ! )


Because that was when (April 2007) they abolished 'Residencia' for EU citizens and replaced it with the 'EU Citizen's Registration Certificate' (aka worthless piece of green paper)

Reg Cert only needs renewing if there is a change in circumstances, for example: nationality (I just changed my registration nationality to Irish as I am not renewing my UK passport). It is also needed when changing address.

However when we had the 'Residencia' it needed renewing, I believe every 5 years. My wife is Non EU so has *Residencia* which needs renewing every 10 years.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

larryzx said:


> (here we go again ! )
> 
> 
> Because that was when (April 2007) they abolished 'Residencia' for EU citizens and replaced it with the 'EU Citizen's Registration Certificate' (aka worthless piece of green paper)
> ...


& those cards were valid until they expired - they weren't suddenly no longer valid when the rules changed


& on expiry you were supposed to hand over the old card when you registered under the new rules........

so how are you still using it as ID??


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

_& those cards were valid until they expired - they weren't suddenly no longer valid when the rules changed_

Sorry that I did not spell it out word for word. The Residencias were no longer issued to EU Citizen, as from I believe 2nd April 2007. My Residencia expired on the 10th April 2007.

_on expiry you were supposed to hand over the old card when you registered under the new rules........
_

I was not asked for the old card. Maybe as the system had only just come into effect, or because I work there. In any case I still would have kept it, and as I said, it is still very useful. Naughty me !


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## anles (Feb 11, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> & those cards were valid until they expired - they weren't suddenly no longer valid when the rules changed
> 
> 
> & on expiry you were supposed to hand over the old card when you registered under the new rules........
> ...


Here in Galicia there was no need to hand it in, they did cut the corner off in some cases like they do with bank books, but most people had theirs handed back and we still use them to identify ourselves although for anything official you do have to provide the green card and passport, however the writing on my green card has become illegible even though I keep it in a plastic case a rarely take it out.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

anles said:


> Here in Galicia there was no need to hand it in, they did cut the corner off in some cases like they do with bank books, but most people had theirs handed back and we still use them to identify ourselves although for anything official you do have to provide the green card and passport, however the writing on my green card has become illegible even though I keep it in a plastic case a rarely take it out.


they were wanting them back around here ....


I got my registration certificate before they started issuing the little 'push out' cards, so it stays at home in a file unless I know I need it for something official - rarely, thankfully


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

xabiachica said:


> they were wanting them back around here ....
> 
> 
> I got my registration certificate before they started issuing the little 'push out' cards, so it stays at home in a file unless I know I need it for something official - rarely, thankfully


I reduced the size of my A4 one, and on the back printed all the important numbers, addresses etc which it is useful to carry.

With the new one I have copied it, and copied my passport reduced to same size, and plasticized it as a card. So I have my copy PP and green card as one very unofficial 'ID card' . ( NB It is illegal to plasticize the original).

PS I am sure everyone is aware they can renew their Green Card / A4 at any time. It just costs 10.50 Euros, at present.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> I'll probably wish I hadn't asked but;
> 
> "why did your 'residencia' expire??"


Really snikpoh??

Because he's talking about residencia, not registration!

I've still got mine too. Was never asked for it. Can't see why they'd ask for it back really.

I did read somewhere that it can still be used in some cases although it doesn't make sense to me...


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

When I renewed my EU Reg Cert, they took the original A4 certificate from me.

As it was, in my opinion always a 'worthless piece of paper' I was not concerned.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

How do you guys carry around your official ID so that it doesn't get pickpocketed?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> How do you guys carry around your official ID so that it doesn't get pickpocketed?


you just take normal precautions, as you should anywhere

in some areas, such as where there is a crush of fast moving people, such as the metro, maybe, or on busy city streets, you are extra careful

Barcelona does have a reputation for having lots of pickpockets, so you'd be extra extra careful there


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

AllHeart said:


> How do you guys carry around your official ID so that it doesn't get pickpocketed?


I take care when in situations where I might be at risk. In 74 years, 27 of those in Spain, I have never been the victim of a pickpocket. 

Most women who are victims have their property stolen from a hand/shoulder bag. Most men lost their wallets from the back pocket of their trousers, ot more recently the 'thigh pocket' on their long shorts.

In answer to the question : Take reasonable care, don't carry your wallet in those places, and don't make yourself an easy target.


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## elisa31bcn (Jan 23, 2013)

Absolutely in agreement about taking precautions. But also I never take my passport with me as a daily routine. Even before I had a tarjeta. I just carried a color
copy, and a picture ID. In 12 years, I have never been asked randomly for ID, and even so, I would rather risk a fine than have to go through the incredible hassle of getting a new passport. Even my nephew who is a policeman in Madrid counsels tourists to leave their passport in their hotel.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

elisa31bcn said:


> Absolutely in agreement about taking precautions. But also I never take my passport with me as a daily routine. Even before I had a tarjeta. I just carried a color
> copy, and a picture ID. In 12 years, I have never been asked randomly for ID, and even so, I would rather risk a fine than have to go through the incredible hassle of getting a new passport. Even my nephew who is a policeman in Madrid counsels tourists to leave their passport in their hotel.


In 28 years I've only been asked to produce ID once. It was on a night train from Madrid to Tarragona 26 years ago. I only had a photocopy of my passport and the policeman yelled at me for being stupid enough to travel around Spain on a photocopy (I think he thought I was a tourist and wasn't living there) but I didn't get a fine or anything. 
Now I carry my driving licence (Spanish) which although officially isn't, usually serves as enough ID for those concerned, and agree entirely with elisa31bcn - rather a fine than go through the hassle of getting another passport!


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

I like the idea of a photocopy. Are ***** packs totally out of fashion there? They are where I live. But that's something I'm thinking of using in Spain, since I find ***** packs to be the safest way of carrying around valuables.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> I like the idea of a photocopy. Are ***** packs totally out of fashion there? They are where I live. But that's something I'm thinking of using in Spain, since I find ***** packs to be the safest way of carrying around valuables.


lol - the sweary filter didn't like that


in Europe that's a swear word.....

we call them bumbags....not sure if the seary filter will allow that actually!!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> I like the idea of a photocopy. Are ***** packs totally out of fashion there? They are where I live. But that's something I'm thinking of using in Spain, since I find ***** packs to be the safest way of carrying around valuables.


I'm not sure they're any safer than a hand bag to be honest. Just don't think about it as being any less or more important than your bank cards, health card or money. You keep them safe, don't you? Do the same with your ID, and do the same as you would in a big city in Canada.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> lol - the sweary filter didn't like that
> 
> 
> in Europe that's a swear word.....
> ...


OMG a swear word for real?! I'm sorry for swearing. It certainly isn't a swear word here. If that's a swear word, I'm in big trouble in Spain with my potty mouth.  I love the word 'bumbag.' It's so cute! Word of the day.



Pesky Wesky said:


> I'm not sure they're any safer than a hand bag to be honest. Just don't think about it as being any less or more important than your bank cards, health card or money. You keep them safe, don't you? Do the same with your ID, and do the same as you would in a big city in Canada.


I use my bumbag in new places in Canada and other countries when not feeling too safe, even though it's not in fashion. Like you say, that's where I put my money and other important ID too. I do find it safer than a purse, because it can't be taken off me since I wear it with the pouch in front of me. The only way someone could take it off me is if they forced me to take it off - which of course could happen. I also have a tiny pouch with a shoulder strap on it that can be worn under my clothes.

So are bumbags out of fashion in Spain?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> OMG a swear word for real?! I'm sorry for swearing. It certainly isn't a swear word here. If that's a swear word, I'm in big trouble in Spain with my potty mouth.  I love the word 'bumbag.' It's so cute! Word of the day.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


All Heart, if they really want it they'll cut it off in one surreptitious move with a knife and you won't even realise it's gone. However, if it makes you feel more confident you'll move more confidently and that will help put thieves off.

Bum bags are not in fashion anywhere to my knowledge, but they can be useful


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> All Heart, if they really want it they'll cut it off in one surreptitious move with a knife and you won't even realise it's gone. However, if it makes you feel more confident you'll move more confidently and that will help put thieves off.
> 
> Bum bags are not in fashion anywhere to my knowledge, but they can be useful


Wow, I never even thought of cutting it off with a knife. So other than exuding confidence and avoiding areas well known for pickpocketing, is there any other way to protect oneself from pickpocketing? I can't imagine anything else, but you guys have stretched my imagination many times before, including now. 

Also, I didn't want to say, but I may as well come right out and say that I've heard that Spain has a high incidence of pickpocketing. Is this true?


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

Pesky Wesky said:


> All Heart, if they really want it they'll cut it off in one surreptitious move with a knife and you won't even realise it's gone..


Completely with you on that Pesky. I should have put that in my post when said how is the best way to lose your possessions. 

I mean, if you carry a bag (any sort) where are your valuables going to be ? In the bag. Steal that and you got the lot. And as you said, a knife to cut the strap, or if it's the type that has a snap fastener, just a good pull does the job.

A money belt (I use one when travelling) is best but inconvenient.

AllHeart _I've heard that Spain has a high incidence of pickpocketing. Is this true?]_

I have got tired of posting how low the crime rate is in Spain. So NO it is not true.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> Also, I didn't want to say, but I may as well come right out and say that I've heard that Spain has a high incidence of pickpocketing. Is this true?


Well, in some areas, yes. Las Ramblas de Barcelona has a certain fame as does the area around the Prado/ Thyssen/ Reina Sofia museums in Madrid. The Rastro in Madrid, Sol in Madrid... These are places with big concentrations of people and probably a large number of tourists much like Oxford street in London.

I have once found someone with their hand in my bag outside one of those places and another time someone walking suspiciously close. I also found a hand in my bag in the Rastro in Madrid, and have twice seen people pick pocketing in Sol. However the only place I was actually robbed was on a bus in Colombia. When I realised a short way into my journey I also realised the robber was probably still on the bus and maybe others had seen the robbery. I panicked and got off the bus which was really stupid as there I was, not at my destination with no money or ID on me! Thank god I was going to a get together in the city and some friends of mine going to the same place were behind the bus in their car. They saw me get off the bus and picked me up - I was soooo lucky! So DON'T do that!

I really wouldn't worry unduly about it. Don't look worried and the odds are you won't be worried by others!
If in doubt read this advice by a fellow country man of yours and if you get robbed, put it down to experience.
Pickpockets - Forewarned is Forearmed! Travel tops on The Worldwide Traveler


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## elisa31bcn (Jan 23, 2013)

Don't get crazy worrying. Just be sensible. I've been in Barrio Gotico, the center of pickpocket land for years, never a problem. I also come home at night late, since I work as a musician. The best advice I can give is carry a small purse diagonally across your body, and keep it in front of you. The thieves are looking for easy marks. Don't be one, and you're fine. 
I rejoice at the low level of crime here, since if you eliminate the petty thieves who don't get violent, it is amazingly safe. I appreciate , as a woman, being able to walk the streets without paranoia.


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## goingtobcn (Sep 9, 2012)

I've just been told off by a TMB lady who needed to replace my ticket as the machine broke it. I have a T-Mes, for which you need to add your DNI, or NIE in my case. In our almost two years living here, I've never had any problems showing my green residencia card, along with driving licence as photo ID, when tickets have been checked. She told me, very rudely, that the number on the T-Mes should be on the same document as the photo, so the only option for me is to use my passport. She said a photocopy would be fine (she repeated this several times when I told her I'd never had any issues and was really rude about it) but I'm not convinced! At the moment I don't carry a photocopy round with me - if that got lost/stolen, I'd want to replace the passport anyway. I think next time my T-Mes runs out, I'll clarify with a different (and hopefully friendlier) member of the TMB staff!


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

larryzx said:


> Completely with you on that Pesky. I should have put that in my post when said how is the best way to lose your possessions.
> 
> I mean, if you carry a bag (any sort) where are your valuables going to be ? In the bag. Steal that and you got the lot. And as you said, a knife to cut the strap, or if it's the type that has a snap fastener, just a good pull does the job.
> 
> ...


I like the idea of a money belt. It's certainly more convenient than the pouch I have for under my clothes.

It's good to hear that pickpocketing isn't such a problem, other than what Pesky Wesky says in Madrid and Barcelona. I plan to live in Malaga Capital, so I'm good there.



Pesky Wesky said:


> Well, in some areas, yes. Las Ramblas de Barcelona has a certain fame as does the area around the Prado/ Thyssen/ Reina Sofia museums in Madrid. The Rastro in Madrid, Sol in Madrid... These are places with big concentrations of people and probably a large number of tourists much like Oxford street in London.
> 
> I have once found someone with their hand in my bag outside one of those places and another time someone walking suspiciously close. I also found a hand in my bag in the Rastro in Madrid, and have twice seen people pick pocketing in Sol. However the only place I was actually robbed was on a bus in Colombia. When I realised a short way into my journey I also realised the robber was probably still on the bus and maybe others had seen the robbery. I panicked and got off the bus which was really stupid as there I was, not at my destination with no money or ID on me! Thank god I was going to a get together in the city and some friends of mine going to the same place were behind the bus in their car. They saw me get off the bus and picked me up - I was soooo lucky! So DON'T do that!
> 
> ...


What a story in Columbia. I'm glad to hear it worked in the end. We often do the 'wrong thing' in a state of panic - me included.

Your article is most helpful. Thank you. I googled tips myself, and came across another good one here: How to Prevent Being Pickpocketed: 13 Steps (with Pictures)



elisa31bcn said:


> Don't get crazy worrying. Just be sensible. I've been in Barrio Gotico, the center of pickpocket land for years, never a problem. I also come home at night late, since I work as a musician. The best advice I can give is carry a small purse diagonally across your body, and keep it in front of you. The thieves are looking for easy marks. Don't be one, and you're fine.
> I rejoice at the low level of crime here, since if you eliminate the petty thieves who don't get violent, it is amazingly safe. I appreciate , as a woman, being able to walk the streets without paranoia.


That's good advice. No, I'm not given to paranoia about this. It's just a matter of getting informed and being cautious. I don't have the time or energy to get too worked up about this. Those are great tips. Thank you.



goingtobcn said:


> I've just been told off by a TMB lady who needed to replace my ticket as the machine broke it. I have a T-Mes, for which you need to add your DNI, or NIE in my case. In our almost two years living here, I've never had any problems showing my green residencia card, along with driving licence as photo ID, when tickets have been checked. She told me, very rudely, that the number on the T-Mes should be on the same document as the photo, so the only option for me is to use my passport. She said a photocopy would be fine (she repeated this several times when I told her I'd never had any issues and was really rude about it) but I'm not convinced! At the moment I don't carry a photocopy round with me - if that got lost/stolen, I'd want to replace the passport anyway. I think next time my T-Mes runs out, I'll clarify with a different (and hopefully friendlier) member of the TMB staff!


I don't understand your story because the acronyms. What's T-mes and TBM? I do understand the gist of the story - that you were reamed out for not carrying proper ID.


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## goingtobcn (Sep 9, 2012)

AllHeart said:


> I don't understand your story because the acronyms. What's T-mes and TBM? I do understand the gist of the story - that you were reamed out for not carrying proper ID.


Sorry, TMB is Transports Metropolitans de Barcelona, the transport company here, and a T-Mes is a monthly unlimited ticket. Was quite irate when I wrote it! I've never heard of being "reamed out" but also get the gist  The thing is that I've had my ticket checked so many times before and photo driving licence along with the card with NIE on has never been a problem. I feel like if I use a photocopy of my passport, the next ticket checker might tell me off for not having the original, but there's no way I'm carrying the original around with me as others have said above!


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

I've been to Barcelona twice, to Madrid and Sevilla every year for the past 5 years, and never been the victim of pickpockets in any of them - but I did have my purse stolen from my handbag during the scrum to board a bus in Nerja. Really it was largely my own fault, I had a bag which didn't have a very secure fastening (I choose more carefully now) and I just relaxed too much when in a situation when it was very easy to be distracted and surrounded by a group of people.

As for Malaga capital, my OH was once tapped on the shoulder by a lady in the queue behind him at the bus station - he'd dropped his wallet without realising it and she was handing it back (there was over €400 in it at the time so it would have been a real blow to lose it). Last year we were waiting for a bus at the Port bus stop when there was a bit of a commotion nearby. A young Spanish woman had seen a man lift a wallet from the back pocket of a man in front of her (he turned out to be a German tourist), she snatched it back from the thief, shouted an earful of abuse at him (he ran off double quick) and handed the wallet back to it's owner who'd not even missed it. And she refused the small cash reward the man offered her.

Just this morning we were leaving the Ataranzas market in Malaga when a man tapped my OH on the shoulder - he'd dropped his reading glasses in a pouch and he was handing them back.

There may well be pickpockets around, but there are also an awful lot of honest and decent people.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

goingtobcn said:


> Sorry, TMB is Transports Metropolitans de Barcelona, the transport company here, and a T-Mes is a monthly unlimited ticket. Was quite irate when I wrote it! I've never heard of being "reamed out" but also get the gist  The thing is that I've had my ticket checked so many times before and photo driving licence along with the card with NIE on has never been a problem. I feel like if I use a photocopy of my passport, the next ticket checker might tell me off for not having the original, but there's no way I'm carrying the original around with me as others have said above!


Thanks for explaining the acronyms. I get it now. Reamed out = bawled out = taken to task harshly. Yes, I too would be worried about my photocopy being stolen, and I would apply for a replacement also. But at least I would have the original to get me through while the replacement came through.

When I met the Consulate General of Spain in Toronto to sign my Spanish citizenship papers, he told me that I have to be careful about my ID as a Spanish citizen because I don't speak Spanish well. So he said that looks very suspicious for when I get asked ID. So I've been thinking on this in this thread, and have decided that I will also carry a copy of my Canadian citizenship. The added problem is that I have a different name in Canada than in Spain, since I did a name change here. So I've decided that I will also carry a copy of my official document from the Canadian government for my name change. I think that solves the potential problem as best as I can.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Lynn R said:


> I've been to Barcelona twice, to Madrid and Sevilla every year for the past 5 years, and never been the victim of pickpockets in any of them - but I did have my purse stolen from my handbag during the scrum to board a bus in Nerja. Really it was largely my own fault, I had a bag which didn't have a very secure fastening (I choose more carefully now) and I just relaxed too much when in a situation when it was very easy to be distracted and surrounded by a group of people.
> 
> As for Malaga capital, my OH was once tapped on the shoulder by a lady in the queue behind him at the bus station - he'd dropped his wallet without realising it and she was handing it back (there was over €400 in it at the time so it would have been a real blow to lose it). Last year we were waiting for a bus at the Port bus stop when there was a bit of a commotion nearby. A young Spanish woman had seen a man lift a wallet from the back pocket of a man in front of her (he turned out to be a German tourist), she snatched it back from the thief, shouted an earful of abuse at him (he ran off double quick) and handed the wallet back to it's owner who'd not even missed it. And she refused the small cash reward the man offered her.
> 
> ...


As always, I love your stories, Lynn. Thank you for putting a huge smile on my face again.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Bum bags are not in fashion anywhere to my knowledge


I forgot to comment on that. That's from farther up in the thread... That's really funny.


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## kalohi (May 6, 2012)

AllHeart said:


> When I met the Consulate General of Spain in Toronto to sign my Spanish citizenship papers, he told me that I have to be careful about my ID as a Spanish citizen because I don't speak Spanish well. So he said that looks very suspicious for when I get asked ID. So I've been thinking on this in this thread, and have decided that I will also carry a copy of my Canadian citizenship. The added problem is that I have a different name in Canada than in Spain, since I did a name change here. So I've decided that I will also carry a copy of my official document from the Canadian government for my name change. I think that solves the potential problem as best as I can.


I wouldn't do that if I were you. Spain does not recognize dual nationality with most countries, including the United States and Canada. Of course it happens, but you don't want to let any Spanish official know about your dual nationality status. I found this out when I went to the Spanish police station to get my kids (who have a Spanish father) their Spanish passports for the first time. I was chatting a bit with the police officer and I mentioned that up until then I had used the kids' US passports to travel with. The police office dropped everything he was doing and barked out, "US passports? These children are SPANISH and ONLY Spanish. If they hold US passorts they have to turn them in." I just stood there mute and a bit in shock, and finally he continued and issued the Spanish passports. Phew! But I definitely learned not to inform the police that my kids are dual nationals. They might know it, but I shouldn't tell them!

Personally I think you are overthinking this. Carry your DNI and you'll be fine. I have an American friend here who took on Spanish nationality a few years ago, and she speaks very poor Spanish. But she's never been asked why she has a DNI. Besides, I've been here for 29 years and I've never once been stopped by an official and asked for ID. Yet my son (in his early 20's) has been stopped several times, each time in the middle of the night while he was out living it up. There's definitely profiling going on, and IMO a woman 'of a certain age', out and about during normal hours, is highly unlikely to be stopped. 

And about pickpocketing - it is _rampant_ in Seville. I could tell countless stories of near misses. But take precautions, stay alert, and you'll be fine. The pickpockets run off if you catch them in the act - they aren't violent. What I do is I wear a small purse worn across my body and I walk keeping my hand on the purse.


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

As shown in the last post (kolohi) Spain in general will not permit it's nationals to hold dual nationality. Exceptions are their former colonies, so for example one can have Spanish and Filipino. The reason is that one swears allegiance to the King "you cannot serve two masters"

Of course other nationals can have dual nationality I am British and Irish. I just changed my nationality on my EU Reg Cert from British to Irish. No problem.

AllHeart. I changed my birth name some years ago when in UK, but I have ensured that both my passports and all other paperwork have the same name. Having two or more names, albeit, not necessarily illegal, could lead to problems/questions, .


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

kalohi said:


> I wouldn't do that if I were you. Spain does not recognize dual nationality with most countries, including the United States and Canada. Of course it happens, but you don't want to let any Spanish official know about your dual nationality status. I found this out when I went to the Spanish police station to get my kids (who have a Spanish father) their Spanish passports for the first time. I was chatting a bit with the police officer and I mentioned that up until then I had used the kids' US passports to travel with. The police office dropped everything he was doing and barked out, "US passports? These children are SPANISH and ONLY Spanish. If they hold US passorts they have to turn them in." I just stood there mute and a bit in shock, and finally he continued and issued the Spanish passports. Phew! But I definitely learned not to inform the police that my kids are dual nationals. They might know it, but I shouldn't tell them!
> 
> Personally I think you are overthinking this. Carry your DNI and you'll be fine. I have an American friend here who took on Spanish nationality a few years ago, and she speaks very poor Spanish. But she's never been asked why she has a DNI. Besides, I've been here for 29 years and I've never once been stopped by an official and asked for ID. Yet my son (in his early 20's) has been stopped several times, each time in the middle of the night while he was out living it up. There's definitely profiling going on, and IMO a woman 'of a certain age', out and about during normal hours, is highly unlikely to be stopped.
> 
> And about pickpocketing - it is _rampant_ in Seville. I could tell countless stories of near misses. But take precautions, stay alert, and you'll be fine. The pickpockets run off if you catch them in the act - they aren't violent. What I do is I wear a small purse worn across my body and I walk keeping my hand on the purse.


You're right, that I'm not considered a dual citizen. I'm considered a Canadian citizen in Canada and a Spanish citizen in Spain. It's like a complete divorce - also typical because they only want to know about each other when it comes to money.  

What great pieces of advice, Kalohi. Thank you. I don't know that I'm overthinking this - just thinking about it. But I've thought about it a bit more, and because my Canadian name and Spanish name are different, I think it will raise more eyebrows by carrying my Canadian ID. So I'll just carry my Spanish ID. Also on rethinking this conversation with the Consulate General, I think he was more referring to travelling within the EU as opposed to travelling around Spain. He didn't come across as the dramatic type, so I think his caution was a valid one. 

We don't have laws to carry around ID here in Canada. You need certain ID for certain things like health card for healthcare, driving licence while driving, social insurance number to get a job, work ID to work in some places, etc. But it's not law to have to carry around ID at all times. So this is really weird for me. I was also really, really surprised that my fingerprints had to be taken to get my Spanish citizenship. I've never had my fingerprints taken. Here, only criminals get fingerprints taken. Perhaps in high-profile or high-security jobs it's required too, but I don't know since I've never had such a job.

I've also decided to buy a money belt like Larynx advised, and I'll put the original ID in there, because I don't want to get reamed out for not following the law. So I'll take my Spanish passport until my DNI comes in.



larryzx said:


> As shown in the last post (kolohi) Spain in general will not permit it's nationals to hold dual nationality. Exceptions are their former colonies, so for example one can have Spanish and Filipino. The reason is that one swears allegiance to the King "you cannot serve two masters"
> 
> Of course other nationals can have dual nationality I am British and Irish. I just changed my nationality on my EU Reg Cert from British to Irish. No problem.
> 
> AllHeart. I changed my birth name some years ago when in UK, but I have ensured that both my passports and all other paperwork have the same name. Having two or more names, albeit, not necessarily illegal, could lead to problems/questions, .


Great advice, Larryzx. Your advice helped me decide above. Thank you.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

I forgot to ask an important question in this discussion: What is the penalty by law for not carrying your original documents, but carrying a photocopy instead? Does anyone know?


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

AllHeart said:


> I forgot to ask an important question in this discussion: What is the penalty by law for not carrying your original documents, but carrying a photocopy instead? Does anyone know?


I don't know but I have never heard first hand of anyone being fined, although it does happen from time to time that only the legal ID is acceptable, meaning that someone must return home and get it. So they might be inconvenienced.

But for a non EU citizen with residencia it probably not a problem as one would normally carry their residencia card (which is legal ID) whereas the EU registration certificate is not. I do not think that many in the latter category carry their original passport (legal ID) as common practice.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

larryzx said:


> I don't know but I have never heard first hand of anyone being fined, although it does happen from time to time that only the legal ID is acceptable, meaning that someone must return home and get it. So they might be inconvenienced.
> 
> But for a non EU citizen with residencia it probably not a problem as one would normally carry their residencia card (which is legal ID) whereas the EU registration certificate is not. I do not think that many in the latter category carry their original passport (legal ID) as common practice.


 Thanks for your guidance, Larrynx. That's the answer I was hoping for, that even though it's law to carry it around, it's not typically enforced. So I'll carry around a copy of my passport, like most of you guys advised in this thread. I have a Spanish passport (I'm not sure if you know that). So for when I do business like registering for my padron and opening a bank account, then I'll bring my original.

Thanks again.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> Thanks for your guidance, Larrynx. That's the answer I was hoping for, that even though it's law to carry it around, it's not typically enforced. So I'll carry around a copy of my passport, like most of you guys advised in this thread. I have a Spanish passport (I'm not sure if you know that). So for when I do business like registering for my padron and opening a bank account, then I'll bring my original.
> 
> Thanks again.


you'll only need to carry your DNI - & I don't know anyone who doesn't carry the original.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> you'll only need to carry your DNI - & I don't know anyone who doesn't carry the original.


Hi Xabiachica. I don't know when I'll be able to get my DNI because there's been a change in plans. My health has gotten even worse, so last week I put in an application for Canada Pension Plan Disability. It can take up to six months before I know whether or not I'm approved for the pension. In the meantime, even if I have my own apartment and therefore can get my padron, I can't get registered with Social Security since I'm not working. I don't think it's possible to register with them until I am approved for pension. Once I get my Social Security #, then I can apply for the DNI. So it could be a long time before I have my DNI. Until I get my DNI, my only ID is my passport. Does that make sense?


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

AllHeart said:


> Thanks for your guidance, Larrynx. That's the answer I was hoping for, that even though it's law to carry it around, it's not typically enforced. So I'll carry around a copy of my passport, like most of you guys advised in this thread. I have a Spanish passport (I'm not sure if you know that). So for when I do business like registering for my padron and opening a bank account, then I'll bring my original.
> 
> Thanks again.


It's not a common question so I do not know for sure, but if you have a Spanish PP then you should also have/be entitled to a DNI (Documento nacional de identidad) in which case that would be your ID and I believe you are more likely to be required to have that at all times.


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## kalohi (May 6, 2012)

larryzx said:


> It's not a common question so I do not know for sure, but if you have a Spanish PP then you should also have/be entitled to a DNI (Documento nacional de identidad) in which case that would be your ID and I believe you are more likely to be required to have that at all times.


I also think this is true. All Spaniards are required to have a DNI at the latest at age 14. Not having a social security number should have nothing to do with it. I think you should get yourself to a DNI office ASAP and sort this out.


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

larryzx said:


> It's not a common question so I do not know for sure, but if you have a Spanish PP then you should also have/be entitled to a DNI (Documento nacional de identidad) in which case that would be your ID and I believe you are more likely to be required to have that at all times.





kalohi said:


> I also think this is true. All Spaniards are required to have a DNI at the latest at age 14. Not having a social security number should have nothing to do with it. I think you should get yourself to a DNI office ASAP and sort this out.


 Thanks for your help, Larryzx & Kalohi. I just checked my notes, and you're right in that I don't need my SS # to get my DNI. I just need my padron and passport. Then I use the padron and DNI to get my SS#. But I think in order to get my SS# I need to have a job or a pension. I'm eager to get my SS# because with my SS# I am able to get public healthcare.

Thanks for letting me know that I need to carry the original DNI instead of a copy. I didn't understand that. Thanks also for setting me straight on the steps for a DNI. My head is just spinning right now, so it's good to have you guys to keep me on track.


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## 213979 (Apr 11, 2013)

AllHeart said:


> OMG a swear word for real?! I'm sorry for swearing. It certainly isn't a swear word here. If that's a swear word, I'm in big trouble in Spain with my potty mouth.  I love the word 'bumbag.' It's so cute! Word of the day.
> 
> I use my bumbag in new places in Canada and other countries when not feeling too safe, even though it's not in fashion. Like you say, that's where I put my money and other important ID too. I do find it safer than a purse, because it can't be taken off me since I wear it with the pouch in front of me. The only way someone could take it off me is if they forced me to take it off - which of course could happen. I also have a tiny pouch with a shoulder strap on it that can be worn under my clothes.
> 
> So are bumbags out of fashion in Spain?


Hahahahahahahahahaha allheart, the word you used is.... "the front side of a lady" in BrE, not the backside like it is for us. 











BTW, I am fairly sure ***** packs are only popular among young potheads up here. My first year in Spain a guy wearing ***** pack tried to pick me up at the club. The ***** pack was decisive in the "sorry, man, I have got to go."


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

elenetxu said:


> Hahahahahahahahahaha allheart, the word you used is.... "the front side of a lady" in BrE, not the backside like it is for us.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Are you serious?! I just thought they were saying it is a swear word but meant the same thing. OMG! LOL! Yeah, the more you know....

Love the bar story! I'll have you know that I decided to bring my precious leather bumbag to Spain. Major faux pas, eh? :shocked: :der:

So what do you think of man purses, as in the movie The Hangover?  Would you ditch a guy for wearing one?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> Are you serious?! I just thought they were saying it is a swear word but meant the same thing. OMG! LOL! Yeah, the more you know....
> 
> Love the bar story! I'll have you know that I decided to bring my precious leather bumbag to Spain. Major faux pas, eh? :shocked: :der:
> 
> So what do you think of man purses, as in the movie The Hangover?  Would you ditch a guy for wearing one?


you're coming to Europe, remember - it's common for men to carry bags here - not so much the younger guys, though I have seen under 20s with them - putting the monedero in the bolsillo ruins the lines doncha know  

oh - & a purse is where you keep your money - a monedero

a handbag is what you call a purse - a bolso


a bolsillo is a pocket


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## 213979 (Apr 11, 2013)

I think some men here pull them off quite well. My poor husband got more than a ribbing the first time he met my parents. He was terribly nervous about losing his passport and whatnot, given that it was his first trip abroad. He brought a man purse and carried it everywhere. I still love him 

The "***** pack = no" was more about the fact that the rat tail and ***** pack were big "druggie" warning signs for me. He sure danced well, though...


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> you're coming to Europe, remember - it's common for men to carry bags here - not so much the younger guys, though I have seen under 20s with them - putting the monedero in the bolsillo ruins the lines doncha know
> 
> oh - & a purse is where you keep your money - a monedero
> 
> ...


 Thanks for the lesson, Xabiachica. I didn't know those words, other than bolso. 

My Canadian English is once again a little different than British English. A purse is the same as a handbag. Handbag is an older term; most people say purse, rather than handbag.

A wallet is where you keep your money.

I hadn't noticed yet that men are wearing man purses. So is bolso the same word for men and women? Are the men secure enough in their masculinity here that they use the same word?


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

elenetxu said:


> I think some men here pull them off quite well. My poor husband got more than a ribbing the first time he met my parents. He was terribly nervous about losing his passport and whatnot, given that it was his first trip abroad. He brought a man purse and carried it everywhere. I still love him
> 
> The "***** pack = no" was more about the fact that the rat tail and ***** pack were big "druggie" warning signs for me. He sure danced well, though...


 Oh, I see what you mean now about the guy in the bar - not that he wasn't cool enough, but that he came across as a druggie (I'd do the same). A rat tail? I haven't seen one of those since the 80s when they were the rave. 

I just locked myself out of the apartment going for a smoke. I had planned on only using my bumbag inside for talking on the phone and listening to my iPod, but practicality calls upon my bumbag, and I've decided to put my keys, smokes and lighter in there to go for smokes from now on. Ah, to age and just not give a damn as to what people think of my fashion sense. 

I love how your parents ribbed your hubby. Nothing like a warm welcome into the family. Love is blind to such things.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

I carry a "man purse" - we had to in Germany due to having to carry 'everything' with us and am quite secure in my masculinity (I think).


The children didn't like me carrying it but I think they're used to it by now.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> Thanks for the lesson, Xabiachica. I didn't know those words, other than bolso.
> 
> My Canadian English is once again a little different than British English. A purse is the same as a handbag. Handbag is an older term; most people say purse, rather than handbag.
> 
> ...


oh I forgot - men use wallets in BrE too

I don't _think _that there's a separate word in Spanish for a manbag.....


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> I carry a "man purse" - we had to in Germany due to having to carry 'everything' with us and am quite secure in my masculinity (I think).






xabiachica said:


> oh I forgot - men use wallets in BrE too
> 
> I don't _think _that there's a separate word in Spanish for a manbag.....


Again, it's a little different in Canadian English, where men and women both carry a wallet. I didn't know that in British English a man puts his money in a wallet, whereas a woman puts her money in a purse. 

Sometimes women refer to their purse as a bag, probably short for handbag. But typically a bag refers to something practical to carry stuff in, like a retail bag, e.g. grocery bag. 

Manbag.... Well, that insinuates the other use for the word bag in Canadian English. Put it this way: This is not the appropriate forum to discuss manbags.


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## director1 (Dec 28, 2013)

AllHeart said:


> Again, it's a little different in Canadian English, where men and women both carry a wallet. I didn't know that in British English a man puts his money in a wallet, whereas a woman puts her money in a purse.
> 
> Sometimes women refer to their purse as a bag, probably short for handbag. But typically a bag refers to something practical to carry stuff in, like a retail bag, e.g. grocery bag.
> 
> Manbag.... Well, that insinuates the other use for the word bag in Canadian English. Put it this way: This is not the appropriate forum to discuss manbags.


Manbag? I think murse is the more accepted term these days.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

director1 said:


> Manbag? I think murse is the more accepted term these days.


maybe that's AmE?

because that implies a purse rather than a bag ..... & in BrE it's a bag


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## 213979 (Apr 11, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> maybe that's AmE?
> 
> because that implies a purse rather than a bag ..... & in BrE it's a bag


Director1 nailed it. I had forgotten about murse.


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## larryzx (Jul 2, 2014)

I used to used a handbag with a shoulder strap, but of course a thief would suspect (reasonably so) that everything of value was in the bag. That would make it too, so I have revered to pockets, which in my shorts at least, my wife has put zippers on the side pockets,


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Murse? Sounds like a male nurse to me. LOL! Canada's a big country with lots of dialects, so of course I can't speak for all of Canada, but I've never heard that word.

But then there is another word in the movie The Hangover that was given in defense of the man purse - a satchel. Here's one of the many scenes about the man purse. I love how Fat Jesus gently tosses his hair in this scene.


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## Helenameva (Aug 15, 2014)

The strap on my manbag lift and separate my manboobs. I fully expect to be wolf-whistled every time I go out but alas nay.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Helenameva said:


> The strap on my manbag lift and separate my manboobs. I fully expect to be wolf-whistled every time I go out but alas nay.


Hahahaha, That's funny


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

AllHeart said:


> Murse? Sounds like a male nurse to me. LOL! Canada's a big country with lots of dialects, so of course I can't speak for all of Canada, but I've never heard that word.
> 
> But then there is another word in the movie The Hangover that was given in defense of the man purse - a satchel. Here's one of the many scenes about the man purse. I love how Fat Jesus gently tosses his hair in this scene.
> 
> The Hangover - Man purse scene - YouTube


What's this film The Hangover???


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## 213979 (Apr 11, 2013)

Helenameva said:


> The strap on my manbag lift and separate my manboobs. I fully expect to be wolf-whistled every time I go out but alas nay.


You just need to walk past these guys:


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

elenetxu said:


> You just need to walk past these guys: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2vKW5LHzRvs


 I barely understood a word, but I absolutely love this! The energy....


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> What's this film The Hangover???


It's a raunchy, positively hilarious American movie about four guys who go for their bachelor party to Vegas. Here's a great site for info on American movies - IMDB. IMDb - Movies, TV and Celebrities Here's the one for The Hangover - The Hangover (2009) - IMDb

BTW, the last couple of days on my walks, I've noticed men wearing purses/handbags/satchels. LOL!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> All Heart, if they really want it they'll cut it off in one surreptitious move with a knife and you won't even realise it's gone. However, if it makes you feel more confident you'll move more confidently and that will help put thieves off.
> 
> Bum bags are not in fashion anywhere to my knowledge, but they can be useful


AllHeart, Guess what my daughter has just come home with??
Yes, a BUM BAG!!
Would you credit it? I hang my head in shame, apparently they are all the rage!!!!! We are in fiestas now (well OH and I stoically ignore them, the dog is too terrified to go out and my daughter laps it all up - day and night) and apparently the best buy of the fiesta market stalls are BUM BAGS!!!
I don't know why nobody else pointed this out as these stalls go all around Spain travelling from fiesta to fiesta.
However, the trendy way to wear them apparently is diagonally across the torso, so don't get caught out on that fashion faux pas of putting it around your waist...


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## AllHeart (Nov 22, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> AllHeart, Guess what my daughter has just come home with??
> Yes, a BUM BAG!!
> Would you credit it? I hang my head in shame, apparently they are all the rage!!!!! We are in fiestas now (well OH and I stoically ignore them, the dog is too terrified to go out and my daughter laps it all up - day and night) and apparently the best buy of the fiesta market stalls are BUM BAGS!!!
> I don't know why nobody else pointed this out as these stalls go all around Spain travelling from fiesta to fiesta.
> However, the trendy way to wear them apparently is diagonally across the torso, so don't get caught out on that fashion faux pas of putting it around your waist...


For real?! OMG that's got to be a first - a Canadian ahead of fashion. LOL!

Point taken, that I am to wear my bumbag diagonally. Thank you. 

I also learned this week on my shopping excursions that the Spaniards have a word for what we Canadians call 'bags' (for shopping and just throwing stuff in) - "bolsa."


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