# FLR(M) Extension-Not enough living together evidence



## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Hi there,

May I plz ask experts advise. 

I have been granted my first FLR(M) back in summer of 2016. 
Right after getting visa I got a job offer that required me to relocate to Cambridge. As the City is very expensive we both didn't move together. My wife decided to stay back and continue her job and started living with her parents, while I moved down here to check if I like this new city and job. We both kept visiting each other on an average once a month. Unfortunately in order to save rent money we both couldn't maintain a permanent home together as in that way we would have had to pay 2 rents one in my wife's hometown one in here at Cambridge.

Its only early 2018 my wife moved in here with me as we managed bit of saving. Obviously I would keep all the living together proof from now onwards. My visa expires in Dec 2018. Now I am stuck with living together proofs for whole 2017. Could somebody plz shed some light what should I do about that gap period . How could I explain this situation to visa officer.?

I look forward to your help.

Thanks very much in advance.


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## Crawford (Jan 23, 2011)

When applying you write a detailed letter explaining the 18 month separation. 

You include details of your jobs, positions and salaries and why you could not get a job in Scotland and had to move to Cambridge and why your wife decided that she would not accompany you and get a job in Cambridge but remain in Scotland.

I don't understand you explanation of how you could not afford 2 rental places, as it would appear your wife was renting with her sister and mother in a 4 bedroom apartment when you first arrived in the UK, and since she was staying in Glasgow with her job that could have continued, and you, with your job in Cambridge, was able to rent accommodation also.

If you only met once month, then I hope you have plenty of proof of Skype, messaging, telephone calls etc for communication and proof that you spent your vacations, Christmas and public holidays together.

While there are considerations for times of separation due to job situations, being apart for 18 months at start of marriage is somewhat unusual.


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## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Dear Crawford,

Thanks very much for replying. I agree my case sounds really strange. 

Its just she wasn't ready to relocate and I didn't want to let go this dream job in most prestigious university. 
Also initial plan was that I would only live here for one year project then move back.

We did have our house together for initial few months, then when I moved down here I was provided temporary on-site accommodation as finding accommodation in Cambridge is in itself an achievement and she decided to move back to her pre- marriage parents house as it wdn't make much sense living alone in same city as ur parents live. As culturally we are more inclined to live with parents or in-laws. In this way she saved her rental money, and I payed less by living alone in shared house so we could save in order to get mortgage soon. 

But over the time I decided that this option is better for career so we finally gave up and decided that she moves in and we live here for few more years as its better for career.

I've never abused any visa rules or overstayed and I've been in this country for nearly 10 years. All my previous visas were issued without any problem.

We do have all our chat and phone history, flight tickets of me going up there and she coming down here.

I am really worried what to do and how to explain. 
Regards
Thanks


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

The point of getting married to your UK spouse is that you live with your spouse. You've lived apart for more than half of your visa period because your wife didn't feel like moving with you. 

Having chat records isn't adequate.


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## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Dear Nyclon,

Thanks for your time and reply . I know case is unbelievable and strange.

May I plz ask if in your experience at this forum you can remember any case that was rejected/approved on basis of not enough proof of living together.?

Do you think writing a letter explaining the situation would help or they don't entertain cases like this.

Would I need lawyer to defend this.? 

It would be great help.

Thanks
Kind Regards


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## John__Q (Apr 21, 2012)

As others have said it's really strange, but you will have to write a letter explaining the situation and prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that it is a genuine marriage. 

I hope you have solid evidence of almost daily communication (phone calls, skype, emails, whatsapp etc). Even with that though it's not looking good.

Every application is taken on a case by case basis but look at it from the officers point of view. You got married and are not even living with your wife. Also you don't have a house together and your wife then moved in with her parents. 

Unfortunately imo I think this will raise red flags.


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## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Dear Nylon and Crawford. 

I would be grateful of you if you could take time to read. 
I've actually done some research and found something that could be interesting to my case . May I please ask your opinion if you this provision is applicable in my case: I found 2 judgements:

One

_” You have failed to demonstrate that your marriage is subsisting by not providing six items of correspondence addressed to you and your partner at the same address as evidence that you have been living together during the past two years”._

_The UT noted that requirement to provide six items of correspondence of a certain type was not an instruction found in primary or secondary legislation nor a requirement contained anywhere in the Rules. This was a requirement to be found in the pro-forma FLR(M) Application Form. The court considered the decision of the Supreme Court in R (Alvi) v Secretary of State for the Home Department [2012] UKSC 33 which held that any requirement in immigration guidance or codes of practice which, if not satisfied by the migrant, would result in an application for leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom being refused was tantamount to a “rule” within the meaning of Section 3(2) of the 1971 statute. Accordingly, if not laid before Parliament, it did not have the quality of law.
The UT found that nowhere in either primary of secondary legislation was this requirement stated. Rather, it was found in the FLR(M) application and as such it could not be a determinative factor when considering an application._

Two

_The Applicant made her application on form FLR (M). That form required, and still requires, an applicant to provide:

“six items of correspondence addressed to you and your partner at the same address as evidence that you have been living together during the past two years.” Notes within the form then specified more requirements for this evidence.

The Tribunal held that “the Secretary of State cannot lawfully augment or modify any particular regime or compartment within the Immigration Rules by the purported introduction of a requirement of the grant of leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom via the mechanism of an application form. The fundamental reason for this is that it lacks the necessary parliamentary scrutiny required”.

In other words, the Home Office cannot impose requirements in an application form that, if not met, will lead to a refusal. This is because such a requirement constitutes a rule and must be laid before Parliament for its approval. If it has not been laid before Parliament it cannot have the quality of law: R (Alvi) v Secretary of State for the Home Department [2012] UKSC 33. If the Home Office had wanted those specific requirements to be provided they could have inserted such a requirement into the Immigration Rules: Ishtiaq v Secretary of State for the Home Department [2007] EWCA Civ 386.

Therefore, if an applicant cannot provide the six items of correspondence their application should not necessarily fail, providing that they can show alternative evidence that they meet the requirements of the Immigration Rules._


Regards
Thanks


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## clever-octopus (May 17, 2015)

Even with "alternative evidence" the fact is that you did not actually live together, you cannot realistically prove what did not happen... At very least, you should have had all of your bills and correspondence going to one address. You both declared your intention to live together permanently in the UK and you're expected to live up to that, you may not be aware of it but you have actually breached the terms of your visa. Showing chat history/visits/etc. doesn't prove that you've lived together for this time, and "she didn't feel ready to relocate" isn't a good enough reason to be separate for a year and a half.

There are a couple of things which stand out to me:

1. You say you have been living in the UK for nearly 10 years - Were these 10 years contiguous? When will you have been resident 10 years? Is it possible you could apply under the 10 year route?

2. If your visa expires in December 2018, why did you apply for an extension now?


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## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Dear Cleve-octopus,

Thanks for your reply. I totally agree with your doubts. I am actually feeling so bad for not paying attention to this and kept on ignoring, and taking it as not that important thing.

1) Yes I've been in UK for 10 year, but I have two 9-months breaks where I went to my home country for work. So its not 10 years in one stretch.

2) I am not applying now I would be applying in Dec 2018, but just started to get all proofs ready and be prepared in advance.

Do you see it as a clear rejection.? We do have proofs for 2016 duration and would have for whole 2018.

Thanks


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## clever-octopus (May 17, 2015)

Clear rejection, no, but it's possible. I have seen a married couple refused for this in the past. They will almost certainly come back to you and ask for evidence covering mid-2016 through the end of 2017. They may accept your reason for needing time to sort out your work situations, but the fact is that they expect you to put your marriage first, rather than pursuing employment which would force you to separate, and you were separated for quite a long time. It really comes down to the mercy of the person deciding your application. Yes you can still submit evidence that you kept in touch, to show that you still at least maintained a relationship, but you would fail to meet the correspondence requirement.


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## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Dear Clever-Octopus,

Thanks for replying. Under these circumstances would you recommend applying through priority service or by post.?

I mean I always preferred priority service but due to nature of my complicated case this time would they accept my application or even if they do; would the rejection chances be more at PSC than Post as at PSC they are required to give decision in an hr or two and may not consider everything and would give decision hastily.

Thanks


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## Crawford (Jan 23, 2011)

Haneez said:


> Dear Clever-Octopus,
> 
> Thanks for replying. Under these circumstances would you recommend applying through priority service or by post.?
> 
> ...


You keep asking questions to which there is no definitive answer. Priority service or post, lawyer or no lawyer, will my application success or won't it etc etc. ? Who knows?

You have been told to write a letter explaining your circumstances and provide lots of evidence of communications during the separation. Then you make your application and hope that it is accepted.


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## clever-octopus (May 17, 2015)

I agree with Crawford that the means of application doesn't determine the likelihood of success (the requirements are no different between a postal and PSC application) and it's impossible to say for sure - But I don't think I would ever recommend paying an extra £500 for a PSC in-person appointment unless you are absolutely confident you meet every requirement, because you won't get the application/PSC fees back if you're refused. IMHO it is not worth applying in person unless your situation is very straightforward and you have everything they've asked for.


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## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Thanks for your help. I am sorry about it. 
I shall do that. I would go for PSC and would post explanation letter here to check when time comes.

Regards


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## Haneez (Jan 27, 2016)

Dear All,

I know I've already stretched this thread too much. But just a quick question. What would be my options incase I get FLR(M) Extension rejection.

I understand I can appeal which I doubt I would, and I would have to leave this country which I would.

But since I would still be married to my wife and would intend to live together permanently. Moreover would've been living together whole 2018. Would I still be eligible to apply for a Spouse Visa from my home country to join my wife in UK.? Provided we keep meeting other requirements such as financial and accommodation.

Thanks in advance. I appreciate your help.


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## Crawford (Jan 23, 2011)

Goodness, we are continuing down the route of 'what if's' and theoretical outcomes.

However, it's a quiet morning here so I'll take a guess at what might happen.

*If* you were refused FLR(M) it would _probably_ be because the authorities did not believe that you had a genuine relationship.

If you returned to your home country and re-applied for another spouse visa, why would the authorities grant you another visa when they have already come to the conclusion that your marriage is not genuine and refused you an extention to your initial visa?

That's my take on it anyway..........


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