# Moving to Pattaya



## terrytynski (Jan 25, 2014)

Hi to all.
I am looking for as much advice as possible from ex-pats who moved from UK to Thailand. I am planning to move to Pattaya in about three years when I retire and I want to know as much as possible before I take that massive step. My plan is to rent for at least a year, to give me time to learn about property laws and local customs before I risk buying, but I am beginning to think that I should only ship personal items and stuff that can't be replaced and just sell off the rest before I leave the UK.

One problem I have is my collection of World War 2 memorabilia. It is very varied, but includes replica and deactivated firearms, and bladed daggers and swords. I imagine these would present a customs nightmare, so it would probably be best to sell before I leave. Any advice appreciated.

Thank you. lane:


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## dhream (Jan 30, 2012)

Well you can buy anything from knuckledusters to flick knives to pepper spray and even swords and replica guns at any Thai tourist markets in BKK, but it may be another thing entirely to import them.

If the Thais consider your collection to be 'personal effects' you will be charged duty at the very least. 

Sorry I can't help more than that, I'm here to ask questions myself, and that's what I've learned so far... I think you may have to approach the Thai Gov. directly to get the skinny on this particular query. Unless a collector has gone before you and happens to be lurking here.


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## terrytynski (Jan 25, 2014)

Thanks for that. I think the Thai Gov. may be worth a visit. However, I feel that perhaps this sort of collection would be of little interest to new friends I met in Thailand, although it is of interest in the UK.
My instincts are telling me just to sell nearer the time of my move.


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## dhream (Jan 30, 2012)

terrytynski said:


> Thanks for that. I think the Thai Gov. may be worth a visit. However, I feel that perhaps this sort of collection would be of little interest to new friends I met in Thailand, although it is of interest in the UK.
> My instincts are telling me just to sell nearer the time of my move.


As someone who left the UK for Portugal last year, (and sold a lot of my Dads and my own personal militaria on eBay -I was in the Rhodesian Security Forces back in the day) I can honestly say I wish I'd sold almost ALL my personal effects in the UK.

Here are my reasons: Most of the stuff I dragged down here has not even been looked at let alone used since I unpacked. Clothes included.
eBay in the UK was easy to use as a native Brit. Much easier than the local version 'OLX' here in Portugal, ditto the postal system, not to mention UK residents are way more cashed up, and prices you command will be premium. 
Also the cost of postage insurance etc from Portugal and in your case Thailand will be punishing, on top of all that eBay has a policy of not even dealing with individuals based in certain countries, I'm not saying Thailand is one of them, and I'm not casting aspersions on that locality either, I'm just pointing out that it MAY be an issue for buyers on eBay if not eBay admin itself. (Or whatever specialist site you might go through to sell).

Also, now I have the stress of simply finding homes for all this crap, or dumping it knowing i could have made at least some beer money in the UK! Because I'm not paying freight and duty just to have to hump it all to Thailand and ignore it again!

Finally, my odyssey began in Sydney nearly three years ago... that's right still not settled!  And I waited until it was far too late to get the best prices on my stuff I sold there, in fact i had to give a fair bit away on the eve of my last day, and not even to good mates, just lucky but rather ho-hum neighbours...

Don't be tardy, start offloading now! eBay is fun as you watch the money roll in, but if you have significant inventory it can literally be a full-time job just photographing, listing, pricing, packing posting and courier-ing it all... if you have a day job and even if your move is a year or two off, get started asap!

One other thing about Thailand is they may -in fact they will- consider a retiree selling items from within Thailand itself as a 'job' if someone rats on you, you'll be deported, this is no exaggeration, google it! One retiree was booted out for working on his hobby boat in his own backyard, crazy, but true!

Finally, if you have not already done so, you'll also be surprised just how spiritually rewarding it can be selling your stuff to collectors you know will treasure it as much as you once did, at least that was the pleasant surprise that awaited me when I sold our family militaria, after all, when i'm gone, there is not even a disinterested nephew to hand it down to... these blokes really took a deep interest, so much so that I even ended up giving them my Dads army pay book and records to go with the gongs, and I knew I'd done the right thing! 

Hope this helps! And good luck in LOS!


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## terrytynski (Jan 25, 2014)

Yeah, I think your advice is sound, but I don't want to start selling too early for a number of reasons. The main reason is that I love my collection and if it was at all possible, I would keep it. Also, if I sell too early, the money raised would probably get used for something other than my move abroad.
It could be a difficult balancing act though,as I work full time. As you point out, I will need to give myself enough time to sell them through proper military collectors' sites.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

terrytynski said:


> Hi to all.
> I am looking for as much advice as possible from ex-pats who moved from UK to Thailand. I am planning to move to Pattaya in about three years when I retire and I want to know as much as possible before I take that massive step. My plan is to rent for at least a year, to give me time to learn about property laws and local customs before I risk buying, but I am beginning to think that I should only ship personal items and stuff that can't be replaced and just sell off the rest before I leave the UK.
> 
> One problem I have is my collection of World War 2 memorabilia. It is very varied, but includes replica and deactivated firearms, and bladed daggers and swords. I imagine these would present a customs nightmare, so it would probably be best to sell before I leave. Any advice appreciated.
> ...


Moving to a foreign country and living in a new and very different culture can for some, end up being a nightmare.
For that reason, I would suggest putting valuable items that can not be replaced into storage for at least two years rather than selling right away. If for ANY reason you later decide foreign living was a wrong choice you will not have lost these items.
Returning home happens to a good percentage of expats and having something to go back to can be a big help.



Regards

Jet Lag


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## terrytynski (Jan 25, 2014)

Yeah, thanks a lot Jet Lag. I can see the wisdom of your advice. The problem would be if (as I expect and hope) I decide to stay there, I wouldn't have access to the items to sell them.
I understand that moving to Thailand will be a massive gamble, but if I think negatively before I go, there is a greater chance of failure I suspect. If I decide it's not been a good move after a year or two, I'll have lost a lot more than my collection of militaria and books.
I do however value your advice, and it is something else to consider.

Cheers,

Terry.


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## stednick (Oct 16, 2011)

Terry:

Keep your collectibles. You sound attached to them so why get rid of them (unless you need the money). Without knowing, I suspect the shipping costs will be minimal. On a retirement visa you have a six month window to ship belongings without import tax. 

As far as weapons - have the deactivation certified and speak to your local Royal Thai Embassy or Consulate. 

Yes, retiring to Thailand is a BIG gamble. Many, many, many have arrived, and subsequently left, disappointed, sometimes disgusted. Living in a hot and humid tropical climate can be significantly different from vacationing in a tropical paradise. It is a matter of perceptions and expectations. 

Good luck.


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## terrytynski (Jan 25, 2014)

Thank you Stednick. I would be reluctant to sell them and am not desperate for the money they would fetch. I will certainly make enquiries to the Thai Embassy before I make a decision. That is the beauty of a forum such as this. I can feed off the people with more experience while I have the luxury of time to come to a decision.
Thanks again, all contributions are valued.


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## dhream (Jan 30, 2012)

It's evolving into an interesting thread, and I just spent two hours pouring out my story here about how my attitude to 'stuff' has changed as my almost three year search for a place to call home has evolved, but it got wiped as this site annoyingly logs me out arbitrarily. 

Maybe its just as well, but it was good for me to write it even though nobody will ever read it.

And the end I concluded, that, one does not necessarily need to go 'back' if what is ahead does not work out, meaning there may be other options going 'forward' or 'onward', and also that 'stuff' means less and less to me the more of it I ditch, even things I consider emotionally priceless, are not really indispensable at all. It's only thinking that makes it so. And thoughts can be changed.

We arrived here with nothing, and we will take nothing away but memories and our souls, maybe a bit deep for an expat site, but it is this that comforts me tonight!


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## dhream (Jan 30, 2012)

stednick said:


> Terry:
> 
> Keep your collectibles. You sound attached to them so why get rid of them (unless you need the money). Without knowing, I suspect the shipping costs will be minimal. On a retirement visa you have a six month window to ship belongings without import tax.


stednick, thank you for your thoughtful PM regarding my questions to you earlier.

It might pay to check on the above comment, I understand from the Siam Legal website that the Government recently removed the 'duty free' concession on personal effects. I am certain that 'duty' and 'import tax' amount to the same impost. But as I say, it may pay to seek clarfication on that point. 

Airfrieght can be quite cost effective if you are willing to call around but you need to speak to actual industrial frieght companies, not the 'we do it all removalists' they are outrageously dear. research then buy the correct size pallets (nylon, never wood) pack the goods, and load the pallets in your garage, strap down (two ratchet type truck straps per pallet is fine) and wrap them yourself, slap the lables on that they email with the invoice, complete the online customs forms then simply have the shipper collect from your home, and you pick up at the other end, or in the case of Thailand hire a truck to pick up for you, with the assistance of a local agent, the forwarder at your end will usually recommend a partner overseas to clear customs on your behalf. I've shipped two pallets from SYD to SIN and then up to GLA (UK) six months later, it was not hard at all -apart from wrapping the pallets with plastic wrap! A killer job, pay some neighbours kid to do it, but supervise closely, that wrap has to hold the thing together, use the entire roll!  also it's essential the pallets are not loaded too high to fit in the hold, about 180cm 5'10'' is the limit IIRC. You need a pallet jack and tailgate lift truck at the departure end, but simply break down the pallet on the bed of the truck at the destination, and unload the stuff one by one, a doddle!


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## stednick (Oct 16, 2011)

I don't know how up-to-date this information is,

However, from; http://www.customs.go.th/

IMPORTING USED / SECONDHAND HOUSEHOLD EFFECTS 
Returning Thai residents who have been abroad for one year or longer, for the purposes other than touring are eligible to bring in household effects acquired abroad free of taxes and duties. In addition, nonresidents changing their residence to Thailand may import the household effects subject to the conditions stated below without payment of import taxes duties.
The term “household effects” includes all goods which are normally necessary to equip a self-contained home e.g. furniture, carpets, books, musical instruments, paintings, tableware, stereos, linens, and similar household furnishings, etc. To be eligible for tax and duty free allowance, the importers are required to have owned, possessed, and used the household effects before they return to Thailand to resume residence. It is important that the importers meet the three requirements of ownership, possession, and use. For example, if they owned and possessed the goods without using them, the goods would be subject to regular taxes and duties. Personal effects accompanied with the owner traveling into or out of Thailand, including any goods used or will be used commercially are not eligible as household effects and cannot brought in tax and duty free as the household effects. NOTE: Motor vehicles, alcoholic beverages and tobacco are excluded from this relief. 

REQUIREMENTS FOR DUTY FREE ALLOWANCE
*Both Thai and non-Thai residents changing residence into Thailand are eligible to bring used/secondhand household effects into Thailand, in reasonable quantities, free of taxes and duties. *It is also required that the imported used/ secondhand household effects have been owned, possessed, and used in the country where the importers resided before returning to Thailand to resume residence. 
In case where the household effects are electrical appliances e.g. radios, televisions, refrigerators, microwaves, ovens, air conditioners, etc., only ONE unit each of such items is eligible for tax and duty free allowance. However, if it is the family change of residence, TWO units each of the items will be allowed to bring in tax and duty free. Any excess unit shall be subject to regular taxes and duties, and Customs will place the items that have the lowest rate of duty under tax and duty exemption. 
It is important that the used/secondhand household effects must be imported not earlier than one month before or not later than six months after the arrival of the importers. Under exceptional circumstances, Customs may extend the time limits for the importers. 
REQUIREMENTS FOR CHANGING OF RESIDENCE
Nonresidents: Nonresidents may import the used/secondhand household effects acquired abroad tax and duty free if such household effects accompanied them in the change of residence and they are qualified under the criteria listed below: 
Nonresidents resuming residents in Thailand must be granted a non-immigrant quota as shown in a passport or a Nonresident Identification Card; or 
Nonresidents granted to work in Thailand are regarded as resuming residents in Thailand provided they have a one-year non-immigrant visa issued by the Immigration Department. In case where the non-immigrant visa has not yet been granted, either of the following documents may be accepted: 
The letter from the Immigration Department certifying that the nonresidents shall be granted an annual temporary stay in Thailand; or 
The work permit from the Department of Labor to work in Thailand for at least one year. 
Nonresidents entering Thailand as an expert, specialist, or under a contract of government agencies are required to present the letter from relevant agencies certifying that such nonresidents are granted a non-immigrant visa issued by the Immigration Department and shall work in Thailand not less than one year. 
Accompanying spouses of the nonresidents in (2) and (3) are regarded as resuming residence in Thailand provided the spouses have non-immigrant visas issued by the Immigration Department to stay in Thailand for the first 90 days.
Thai Residents: Thai residents may import the secondhand/used household effects acquired abroad duty-free if such household effects are accompanied them in the change of residence and they are qualified under the criteria listed below: 
Thai residents or government officials work or carry out a working visit abroad for at least one year. In case where the Thai residents/government officials must return to Thailand before one year, evidence showing that the return is caused by the termination of contracts, reshuffle of positions, or early termination of working visits, is required. 
Thai residents working abroad under other reasons than those indicated in (1) are required to undertake a commitment that they shall return to Thailand to resume residence. 
Thai students, government officials study abroad for at least one year. 
Documents 
An Import Declaration (Customs Form No. 99/1); 
A passport; 
Nonresidents are required to submit the following documents: 
The letter issued by the Immigration Department confirming that an annual temporary stay is granted; 
A one-year (or more) work permit issued by the Department of Labor; 
The letter from a relevant government agency confirming that a non-immigrant visa from the Immigration Department is granted and that working period in Thailand is not less than 1 year, for those entering Thailand as an expert, specialist, or under government contracts; 
Thai Residents are required to submit an evidence of changing residence e.g. a transcript, reshuffle of positions, termination of employment contract, etc.; 
A Bill of Lading or air waybill; 
An invoice (if any); 
A Delivery Order; 
A packing list or sale documents (if any); 
A permit in case of restricted goods; 
An application for taxes and duty free allowance; and 
Other documents e.g. a letter of authorization (if any). 
Clearance Procedures
When the importers arrive in Thailand, they have to contact the Customs office at the port of entry to clear the household effects from the Customs custody. They will need to prepare all documents as required by Customs to claim tax and duty free importation of the household effects and follow the processes listed below: 
The importer/agent submits an Application for Tax and Duty Free Allowance, Import Declaration, and all supporting documents to the Customs office at the port of entry; 
Customs verifies the documents and the Application for Tax and Duty Free Allowance and charges taxes and duties on any household effects not eligible for tax and duty free allowance; 
The importer/agent pays taxes and duties (if any) at the Cashier Division, and then contact the Customs to release goods; and 
Customs inspects the imported household effects against the Declaration. If there is no discrepancy between the Declaration made and the goods inspected, all goods will be released. 
For further inquiry and information, you may contact the Customs Call Center at Tel. 1164 or the Customs Clinic at Tel. 02-667-7880-4, Fax. 02-667-7885, e-mail: [email protected]. Additional information may also be obtained from Customs ports of entry/exit.


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## dhream (Jan 30, 2012)

Terry,

My advice to sell early was not necessarily referring to your collection, but if you do sell it, then based on my experience, it really should be the first to go because of the unique and specialised market you'll be selling into. The thing about moving is that time is really the most valuable commodity, and often we realise this only after we have procrastinated for too long, and that's all about the psych. of letting go, which is hard, no matter how exciting the future may seem...

you'll find that most successful expats on here say that there is little they needed to bring apart from, perhaps a very obscure well-loved food, or other coveted personal items. In many cases, the Villa Markets chain in BKK have even more US/UK/AUS/NZ/CAN consumables than I've seen in Portugal! Certainly you''l find marmite, weetbix lea & perrins, branstons and all that jazz, albeit a little pricey, and there are gastropubs and companies in BKK that do outstanding British pies fish & chips and the like. I hear Chiang Mai is improving and Pattaya has everything BKK has anyway. Everyone dreams of eating pad Thai morning noon and night before arriving, but there ARE times when you'll crave the foods of home, its only natural! (I have just spent a trial month in the Kingdom, and I was well up for British treats, although that may have been because they're so scarce in rural Portugal where I've been since May 2013!) 

The very difficult trick with selling your household goods is that you need a great deal of them right up to the final day, but if you plan ahead, and get rid of things like Freezers TVs and the like early, you will be less stressed as the day arrives...


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## terrytynski (Jan 25, 2014)

I understand what you are saying and I wonder how important my collection will be in Thailand. For example, I have collected a lot of genuine SS items ranging from letters and unit currency to items of uniform and tableware. These are of interest to almost everyone who visits my home in the UK, but I doubt anyone in Thailand would show the same interest in nazi memorabilia.
My main enjoyment is showing the items to others, so I wonder how much value I would place on them if nobody was interested. I also think that I will be 95% sure that I will be improving my quality of living before I take that final step..........I have a lot of homework to do over the next two years.


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## dhream (Jan 30, 2012)

terrytynski said:


> I understand what you are saying and I wonder how important my collection will be in Thailand. For example, I have collected a lot of genuine SS items ranging from letters and unit currency to items of uniform and tableware. These are of interest to almost everyone who visits my home in the UK, but I doubt anyone in Thailand would show the same interest in nazi memorabilia.
> My main enjoyment is showing the items to others, so I wonder how much value I would place on them if nobody was interested. I also think that I will be 95% sure that I will be improving my quality of living before I take that final step..........I have a lot of homework to do over the next two years.


Ah yes, the SS and Adolf, our fascination with them knows no bounds, as bad as they were, and that's probably the reason! As the greater Pattaya area holds (or held) a significant UK expat population, I'm sure an 'audience' would be no problem, in fact, your collection might be even more popular than ever, so far from Europe...

I for one, would be interested to see it.  It bears repeating however, that if you did expatriate it with you, and then at some point decided to sell, the fact that you were based in Thailand (famous for knock-offs of just about everything known to humanity!) might make convincing western-based collectors you were for real. I have seen SS emblazoned helmets in Pattaya itself a few years ago, it was either at a 'Harley' stall, or a 'weapons' stall, at any rate, they looked brand spanking new. 

As an aside, you may be aware Malaysia is quite anti-Israel, and red T-shirts with the classic Nazi white encircled swastika on the chest can be had at markets there... what DID surprise me was that I spotted several ethnic Malay lads sporting these in rule-bound Singapore. It's illegal in SIN to incite hatred, as it is more or less everywhere that's civilised. But the whole Holocaust thing is pretty much off the radar in modern SIN, even though you can find local Chinese families whose elders can recount japanese atrocities by the dozen. Funny old world.

Finally, I'm not a big fan of Pattaya, but then again I've only been three times. Each time it seemed to be more OTT than the last. Think of the more naff bits of Spain, only in asia. The sex industry can be a bit in your face there, fine on holiday, but maybe not 365 days a year. There are also cheaper expat centres worth your consideration. However, in fairness, many people living there don't actually go anywhere near the tourist centre, and seem quite happy with their choice, and they are the people you'd want to ask about Pattaya, not me! :brick:


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## terrytynski (Jan 25, 2014)

Actually, I am quite prepared to consider anything with regard to my possessions, and I feel that I will need to think about more important considerations before I move. I know what you mean about Pattaya, and the difference between settling there and occasional two week holidays. Apart from a few days in Bangkok, it is the only part of Thailand I have seen and I have made several friends there, so it would make sense to base myself there initially in rented accommodation while I see what the rest of the country has to offer. I am not committed to making Pattaya my permanent home.


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