# So, Obviously rents have come down ...



## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

Hi guys (1st post!)

all help is very appreciated

I will be moving to Dubai on Sept 1 and starting work on the 14th, great offer, very happy with it, with a company i have been working with in Canada for 4 years, so not very worried about being made redundant upon arrival


Here is my question, obviously rents are down, 40% apparently (and apparently the population will decrease 17% in 2009), but if I was a landlord I would still post my rents at the what I would like to get for it price, not the what i would be willing to take price,

but in reality, I should be in a great position to bargain no? so, can you bargain rents, can I go view a place lets say listed at 120K per year, and say sorry, would be willing to pay 75K for it and see where it goes?

I also understand that agents are very common even for rentals (where in Canada using an agent for a rental would be the exception not the rule) can i save the 5% agent fee if I deal directly with landlords? or will the landlord just throw it in anyways and keep it? If its the latter you may as well use an agent so they can work for you. 

Finally, will agents be unlikely to promote bargaining as a) it will piss off their clients - i.e. landlords and b) they have no vested interest in you getting a good deal because it brings down their 5% and it makes it harder to put you in a flat whcih makes it harder for them to get 5%?

any help much appreciated, i know the economy has been tough in Dubai, but personally I am excited at the decreases in property values and what it means to my potential increase in accomodation


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## SFarrell (Jun 13, 2008)

Guess what its now the time of the tennant!! Greedy Landlord and Useless Agents have had their day in the sun..........and its coming back to bite them in the bum. 

I say take them for all you can, agents and landlords alike are desperate to get properties rented out, theres a glut of properties adevrtised on Dubizzle everyday, add to that: a load of new properties coming on line this year as well, then the poulation drop in the summer most likely. It's a tennants market!!!

Yes you are right to bargain with them, if they are not prepared to play ball then more fool them, their properties will be empty for a long time.

Roll on September when i renew my lease 




newbiedubai said:


> Hi guys (1st post!)
> 
> all help is very appreciated
> 
> ...


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

Great, that is what I assumed, so do you know the answer, if you go directly to a landlord will they slap on the 5% agent fee anyways? This is the way it works for buying properties in Canada, if you buy through a private sale it is common for the agents fee to go directly to the seller, but definetly not when renting.


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## sgilli3 (Mar 23, 2008)

newbiedubai said:


> Great, that is what I assumed, so do you know the answer, if you go directly to a landlord will they slap on the 5% agent fee anyways? This is the way it works for buying properties in Canada, if you buy through a private sale it is common for the agents fee to go directly to the seller, but definetly not when renting.


We rented directly through the LL.
He didnt add 5% on, in fact, as we were paying with 1 cheque, we were able to negotiate a little more on the price.( and we will do again, when lease is up for renewal in August)


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

^^ awesome thanks, directly with landlords it is! i mean i may use an agent to show me places the first couple of days on the ground and then just go directly to landlords


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## scp (Apr 27, 2009)

*is there a strategy to do this efficiently?*



newbiedubai said:


> ^^ awesome thanks, directly with landlords it is! i mean i may use an agent to show me places the first couple of days on the ground and then just go directly to landlords


On dubizzle, it doesn't list the agent, so I was wondering if there's anyway to find out if there's an agent that lists several of the properties. Also, aside from Dubizzle, are there any other websites for rental properties? 

Are there any reputable agents out there? Also, do you tell the agent upfront that you have a list of properties that you'll be seeing on your own so that you don't have to pay an agency fee or are all properties that are listed by the landlord exempt from having to pay agency fees?


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## klaus3974 (Dec 8, 2008)

newbiedubai said:


> ^^ awesome thanks, directly with landlords it is! i mean i may use an agent to show me places the first couple of days on the ground and then just go directly to landlords


And how would you go to the LL directly? Do you think the agent will give you his name and phone number?
Some ads are directly from landlord and driving around you may find some houses with rent signs directly from landlord... but it is not always easy to get to them as most of them have several properties and other business to take care of.
I do agree with anyone else... do bargain hard... it is not like there are not other properties in the market (there are thousand of them!).


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

^^^ hmm yeah i was thinking of focusing on the adds directly by landlords, going to see one property and asking what else they have in their portfolio (if they seem like they are desperate and willing to bargain)


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## scp (Apr 27, 2009)

Where are you finding these ads/listings by the landlord?


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

occasionally on dubizzle some are listed as being posted directly by the landlord


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## Helios (Oct 22, 2008)

See also GNAds4U.com - Properties


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## calypsocooler (May 7, 2009)

We got a 20% lower price than advertised.
And that was in February. I would go higher than 60 - 70 % of the listed price.


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

^^ thanks for the info mate, i plan at starting around 50% of asking if I really like the place, if I don't really care for it I'll go in even lower just to guage the reaction!


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## bubble_boy (May 28, 2008)

I think you will find it's not all that easy... We are in the process of looking for an apartment, and have been offering around 7% less than advertised, we have not had one landlord accept yet. All I am saying is that you shouldn't think that you are entitled to a huge discount on the advertised price. And 50% is huge.


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

^^ interesting, are you going through agents? maybe agents don't get there fee under a certain amount of asking so they just tell you that the landlord refused it because there's no money for them in it


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

as some have said to, september is a good time, a lot of expats may leave this summer


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## Kerry13 (Apr 30, 2009)

I'm an agent and please don't judge everyone the same. 

I am one of the very few that is fair and looks after my clients (but who's to trust what i say) reputation and recommendation is more important to me. 
I am actually very honest (prob why i am not driving a range rover) and believe me it works both ways as someone has already mentioned. 

Yes, i am on no salary and yes it isnt an easy job and yes i work till 10pm or later in the evenings... so when i take a client around for hours and days and on my weekends, for them to go straight to the owner and deal with... how do u think i feel.

But this is Dubai and nothing is done fairly... 
I can't give you all the tricks of the trade to find property as i will be jobless... but dubizzle is great and you can deal direct with owners like everyone is saying. 

I don't understand the 5% concept - when u say that the owner will add it in... the owner wants as much as he can at the end of the day so 5 or 10% who cares, he doesn't think about the commission. 

Just because the rents have come down a lot, doesn't mean it's a tenants market. There is still a market value. also when you are fighting to get the same apartment as someone else which you love..what do you do then? ok go spend another week or two looking!! villas you dont have so much trouble as in certain areas you have a choice.

If you have the time,,, get on the internet, get a car and go view..

Good Luck!!!


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## newbiedubai (Apr 28, 2009)

^^ i totally here your frustration, i used to work on commission (not in real estate) but still,

i guess my question is, as an agent are you willing to negotiate for your clients on asking? if so, maybe i'll hire you, if you can get me 10% better than i can 5% makes sense


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## Kerry13 (Apr 30, 2009)

I have good patience ... which is why i'm still here. 

For me, as a rental resident as well ... i like to look after the client. So I'm glad things have changed.. This one cheque business has been a load of crock and prices have been stupid... 

However, i do need to play fair as well as i need sellers and owners, i am not going to offer stupidly low. 

no offence...but
After your suggestion of using agents??? sorry, i'm nice but not that nice... time is money


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## bubble_boy (May 28, 2008)

newbiedubai said:


> ^^ interesting, are you going through agents? maybe agents don't get there fee under a certain amount of asking so they just tell you that the landlord refused it because there's no money for them in it


Yes. Going through agents. I don't have the time nor patience to deal with landlords and Dewa. I still feel some agents do not deserve commission, but I have to say I have met a few who truly deserve it. 

I don't see why the agent will not still get his fee if the price gets negotiated, I am after all paying the fee, not the landlord.

I am actually quite glad that I am not an agent who has to deal with you. It seems you have no qualms using people for personal gain, and you seem to expect everyone to bow at your feet. 

Good luck.


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## Elphaba (Jan 24, 2008)

Kerry13 said:


> I have good patience ... which is why i'm still here.
> 
> For me, as a rental resident as well ... i like to look after the client. So I'm glad things have changed.. This one cheque business has been a load of crock and prices have been stupid...
> 
> ...



Well said Kerry13. 

Not all agents are sharks. There are indeed many good ones, but as in many areas of business a few bad apples have given the business a bad name. Hopefully a tougher market will have chased many of those away and the situation will improve for everyone.

I have to say that I think it is very unfair, not to say immoral, to use the time and expertise of any agent and then try and cut them out. How would people feel if they were treated the same way?


-


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## Kerry13 (Apr 30, 2009)

Thanks Elphaba, as you said, i wouldn't like it done to me, so why do it to others.

It has been swamped with rogue agents and they are still out there. Probably even more now that fewer people are looking, times are tough.
It is a difficult business as you can spend so much time with people but if you haven't got the property they will go elsewhere (but you have to accept that as an agent as well). 

Also, I can speak to an owner who will offer you one price, turn up to the apartment or villa to view and find another agent there who has been offered a different price. 

To be honest, i've had close colleagues that i thought i cud trust and found out i couldn't. 
Few people you can trust: as a client you will get to know the rates in that area, so put in an offer lower than what you can afford and if you think it's worth it and your happy take it.. unfortunately u will not know if you've been cheated or not :-( 



I stay be the moto 'what comes around goes around'.


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## r_showell (Jan 9, 2009)

I've recently moved to Dubai and just (yesterday) signed up to a lease so thought you maybe interested to hear my experience on agents and prices.

There is a huge variation in the quality of agents but you can very quickly tell who is worth dealing with. I was amazed at how many agents I would call who would just tell me to go on my own and collect the key from reception. However, there were some really helpful ones and one guy in particular spent a long time driving me round various areas and then searching for the best deal when I had made my mind up where I wanted to live. He personally saved me loads of time and I therefore had no qualms about paying him a fee when I found the place I wanted.

As for what you should offer against the advertised price, it depends very much on the area and type of property but I would say that the advertised prices have started to come down in line with market value. I would personally be amazed if you could offer 50% of an asking price and get accepted. However, again it depends on what advert you are looking at - I've seen the same property advertised by different agents with almost a 20% price differential.

Good luck with it all though. I think Dubai is a fantastic place and I'm very happy to be here. I'm sure you will love it.


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## marc (Mar 10, 2008)

A lot of agents forget who they are actually working for, I do my best for the person who pays me - the tenant, no exceptions, you should always have their interests put first.

Theres a lot of crap you have to sift through but you get there eventually, I find it disgusting that people send you to reception to pick up a key, without the DEWA turned on e.t.c lol. But some clients like viewing it by themselves.... 

I think getting someone to show you properties then try to snake them and go straight to a landlord is wrong but fair play if your desperate to save money. but you will find in most cases you do want to negotiate directly with the landlord, or have any contact with him/her unless there is a problem.. after you have moved in.

Im not defending agents, as I have found most of them are useless trash but Im an agent and I work damn hard for fees. 

It not just showing a property and collecting money. I dont know what others do, but I do as much as I can to push it through.

Negotiating, DEWA, unsolved maintenance issues, running around everywhere to get it done, its very fun, but still a lot of work.

So please do not judge everyone (its very easy to judge because 99% are sh**) but there's 1% who are actually great at what they do.


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## Joe_90 (May 13, 2009)

Interesting thread. As someone who is about to roll up in August looking for housing for the family, a very useful one too.

To be honest, I would have no problem with a commission for the agent. I probably won't have that much spare time when I turn up to be investigating areas, driving around on my own, getting keys etc. I would hope I find a reputable agent to help me with all that.

I think letting an agent sort that out, then going direct to the landlord is a bit off in my opinion.

See how I feel when I am out there!!


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## carlos carlos (Dec 29, 2008)

bubbles said:


> I think you will find it's not all that easy... We are in the process of looking for an apartment, and have been offering around 7% less than advertised, we have not had one landlord accept yet. All I am saying is that you shouldn't think that you are entitled to a huge discount on the advertised price. And 50% is huge.


We are seriously considering to leave Dubai around Aug / Sept, we just rented a fantastic 3 bedroom apartment in Dubai Marina with a very resonable rent. Let me know if any of you interested to take over my apartment.


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## Lenochka (Apr 19, 2008)

where is it exactly, how big....and what is reasonable these days ?


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## carlos carlos (Dec 29, 2008)

it is Trident Marinascape, the apartment is on high floor 2300sqft in size, all rooms has breathtaking view of marina, sea/city and balcony. High quality of facility for residents i.e. squash court, infinity pool, gym, sauna, steam and jacuzzi.
we shopped around for quite some time and found this is the best offer in the area for its quality, location and view for the price of 190,000 a year.
surely, whoever interested to take over, I will make arrangement and link up your contact with my landlord who is very reasonable gentlemen. 
need not mentioned, no commission required when deal direct with landlord.



Lenochka said:


> where is it exactly, how big....and what is reasonable these days ?


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## Ray-a-sunshine (Mar 31, 2009)

So my husband arrived yesterday, has his first day of work today and is given hotel accom for one month and then we have to find our own.

I am not sure when he will have time to look but he should find out more today. Could people with good agents or if you are a good agent PM some contact details to forward on to him.

We have 3 kids ages 15, 6, and 2! No pets (except the 3 ferrel children). 

We are not at all interested in living in the Midriff area and we are open to both apt and villas. We are still looking at schools and haven't found one of those yet either. Kind of hoping this mass exodus that is rumoured may help us out there. So all in all we need everything and know nothing! Not much help but just to talk to someone and get some ideas etc would be a great start.

Thanks in advance.


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## manaj (Jun 7, 2009)

Ray-a-sunshine said:


> So my husband arrived yesterday, has his first day of work today and is given hotel accom for one month and then we have to find our own.
> 
> I am not sure when he will have time to look but he should find out more today. Could people with good agents or if you are a good agent PM some contact details to forward on to him.
> 
> ...


Hi Ray-a-sunshine and welcome!
'Sunshine', now that's one thing that is reliable and unchanging here from day to day, as for everything else....

We've just been through the same (gauntlet!) as you - schools, accommodation etc.

School was sorted first and (eventually!) accommodation. Glad to say we were recommended a good agent who took us around unfailingly and patiently without any pressure for almost two weeks, saw countless apartments/villas around the the springs/DG/Marina/JLT until we settled on JLT purely for value/convenience to SZR. It definitely is a 'tenants' market now and you can easily get spoilt for choice. Anyway, hope I'm not breaking site rules by giving you his name/number - Mr. Hamir Asher 0505517804.

All the best


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