# It's been a while, but..... (Move to Andalucia)



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Hi all, 

It has been a while since I last visited the forum, but quite a lot has happened in that time.....

The idea of moving to Andalucia first started about 18 months ago. What started as an idea, soon moved into a plan, and then onto what just feels the right thing to do.

In that 18 months we have done our research, learned, and listened, and also taken on board the views and experiences of the many helpful and learned members on here.

We have viewed many houses in our search, in order to get a good idea what we want from a home in Spain, and what we don't. We have visited most of the areas of Andalucia, from East to West, and at most of the months of a year in that 18 month period, to get a true feel of how the climates and temperatures alter during the seasons, and how it effects homes in different areas.
I think we have also ridden the roller coaster ride of 'what if' lows, and 'yea but..' highs, and come out the other side feeling that it just feels right for us, and something we really want to do, and want to do very soon.

I'd like to think we have approached things in the best way we could have. With our eyes wide open, and not ignoring what we didn't want to hear, or thinking what we wanted to believe. We have experienced the very helpful estate agents, and the..how do you I say..not so helpful estate agents. It has been a learning curve, but it has been a worthwhile experience that has grown into less a dream, and more a destiny.

Unfortunately we had to completely take a back seat during last summer, as the difficulty in selling our house meant that it became far too frustrating looking in Spain when we couldn't move on anything. And ultimately couldn't really know exactly what our budget would be in order to know hat we could offer. Selling houses in the uk is not as the media would have you believe!.....

......then out of the blue before the Christmas period we had a second viewing from a couple who had come months previously..and that led to an offer! And after a bit of negotiation, a further offer was accepted!

We then returned for two visits to Andalucia, for some second viewings, and a few new properties....

....we had really only ever found one property that ticked most of our boxes before, but it was on one of these trips that we saw two further properties that really inspired us, one of which I think we have fallen for, as it offers everything we have been looking for....sometimes things come along at the right time.

So as we enter into the New Year, our move seems very imminent, and we are filled with excitement. There is still a way to go, but we hope to start the 'business end' of our moving to Spain very soon!

I would just like to thank everyone for a lot of the invaluable advice that they have given us in the past...and to warn you of the many (..probably inane!!..) questions that I am going to ask over the coming months!!!

Happy New Year everyone


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Great post, very nice.

What town in the end did you go for?


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

The 18 months delay will have saved you some money with the falling prices in Spain and increases in UK.


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## alborino (Dec 13, 2014)

And also the rising pound. 

But Steve can you give us a bit more on which region you chose and why you rejected others? And what your main criteria were?

We're looking at Malaga and Cadiz regions but not the towns themselves. But between the two there is the climate fundamentals, more for your money in Cadiz, better transport in Malaga (for us, each has different requirements).

Anything would help.

But appreciate that now you a full stream ahead you are in for exciting times so all the very best and hope you will return here every now and then to let us know how it is going.

good luck


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Thanks for the positive replies 

We haven't actually picked one property as yet, although there is a very firm favourite!  There are three in total, one in the Jimena De La Frontera area, and the other two are near Iznajar. So two very different areas, with very different appeals.

I think the rising prices in the uk are very hugely exaggerated Isobella...I'm led to believe that the asking prices are rising in the UK, but selling prices are actually falling. I think this is because estate agents are over-valuing properties to get people to go on the market, and then getting them to reduce the asking prices once they realise they will have to if they want to actually sell them.....this has happened to three people I know, myself included!

Thank you Alborino...you are completely right about the rising pound, this has really helped in cushioning the blow of the decrease in budget caused by getting less for our house...but we were being realistic that a sale is better than holding on for months to obtain a price that could take forever, if at all.

Our areas we were, and still are considering, are the same as yours...the Malaga and Cadiz regions  We did look further to the east and west too, but the flat terrain to the West was just too flat for me, although we loved the Moroccan influence. Towards the East I was advised that in places it could be too hot in places.

I love the mountainous terrain around Casares, Ronda, Zahara and Grazalema, and that is a big draw to me. I'm not at all bothered about being on the coast, although would like it to be close enough for day trips.
We were reluctant to go too far inland, but looked at many villages and properties just inland from the Malaga coast. And we found that that's where the type of properties we really liked were to be found, and it started to win us over.
I really like the terrain there, and the views can be stunning. And the road network makes everything very accessible. We also find the large cities inland very interesting..Granada, Cordoba etc and in the end we found a house that we love that was the furthest inland region that we realistically looked in.

The climate being cooler inland really didn't bother us, in fact it is a bonus to my partner. The only thing is that you have to be more aware of the heating available to the properties that you view..it can get very cold in the mornings and evenings inland...but it can just in from the coast too.

I think each property search is an individual one...we quickly found out we didn't really want a home down a bad track. We also didn't want anything too remote, despite the fact the idea of it we loved. And that although I love townhouses, I didn't want to actually live in one. It is a learning curve, and quite fun going through it, but also quite frustrating....then one day, finally(!!!), we found a house which had everything that we had been searching for! ....and I will admit that we were on the verge of giving up on finding something as close to the ideal that we were hoping for!....so please hang on in there, be patient, there are a lot of properties out there, one of them will be perfect for you 

In 18 months, and it has been fun/frustrating/annoying/confusing/exciting/enlightening/and many other emotions!....but it has also given us time to fall for Andalucia even more, and felt more and more at home each time we went, and more sure that it was definitely what we wanted to do  It also gave us time to research everything, and make sure the sums worked out!! 

Good luck on your journey Alborino, it is a great feeling when you finally find what you are looking for


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## alborino (Dec 13, 2014)

Steve many many thanks for that. Very interesting.

Interesting you are like me in the sense I want a half way house. Walkable to the shops, village life, health centre, bars, etc. but I want a garden so edge of a village - not one thing, not the other. 

My position is slightly different in that my wife is from Seville so we have very strong Spanish links and even family in the south (possibly a double edged sword ). And we love the theatre (especially when my MIL is with us).

But my business will stay UK based so I need an airport and Malaga is much better than Cadiz in that regard. But Cadiz offers more for money and better beaches (we want for walking/not sunbathing). Yup we have experienced already all the adjectives you used .

Have insects in any way influenced your liking for somewhere or not. My wife has concerns about cockroaches, mozzies, flies, etc. I have never found it a major issue in Southern Spain providing you avoid being too close to stagnant water. Doesn't help that my step daughter in Tenerife is currently being plagued with clouds of cock roaches 

On house prices we are seeing real increases through the land registry (actual prices paid) and are being offered more than we asked for, but we are in a country village in Hampshire but with central London 1 hour 40 mins away. Guess depends where you are (or for you 'were'). Bet that feels good.

Well all the very best and as I say do keep us all informed. Cheers


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## Maureen47 (Mar 27, 2014)

Great news Steve and we can relate to a lot of the things you have said , it probably has taken us the same length of time to find the right house too , and as you say sometimes things come along at the right time and are meant to be , Good Luck with the rest of your planning and like us 2015 is the year to make it happen ;-)


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Yes the land registry and Zoopla are accurate. Some areas have suffered, Bury lost 5% this year, don't know what's wrong with the place as have never been. Doncaster fell too, although there are only a few areas that didn't do well.

I don't think you can go wrong around Ronda or Jimena. I also like Cadiz area.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Isobella said:


> Yes the land registry and Zoopla are accurate. Some areas have suffered, Bury lost 5% this year, don't know what's wrong with the place as have never been. Doncaster fell too, although there are only a few areas that didn't do well.
> 
> I don't think you can go wrong around Ronda or Jimena. I also like Cadiz area.



I saw that reported about Bury, it's actually not that bad a place and there are some nice villages in lovely settings just a few miles out of the centre, like Tottington or Walshaw. The areas of old terraced housing closest to the centre are a bit grotty but like almost all other places there are good areas and not good ones. The transport links to Manchester for work are good too, as it has the Metrolink tram system plus a railway station. Much better than other towns nearby like Oldham or Rochdale, so why Bury prices should have fallen when it doesn't say they have, I have no idea.


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

alborino said:


> Steve many many thanks for that. Very interesting.
> 
> Interesting you are like me in the sense I want a half way house. Walkable to the shops, village life, health centre, bars, etc. but I want a garden so edge of a village - not one thing, not the other.
> 
> ...


It seems our situations are very similar...I will also commute to the UK for the first couple of years, and then retire early when it feels right, so like you the access to an airport is very important, and in all honesty Malaga is the only real option for regular, and cheap, flights. There are other options, but it seems whenever we look elsewhere we still end up flying in and out of Malaga because of cost or convenience of flight times.
In that respect centrally inland is a much better proposition for access to the airport, as opposed to the Estepona/Marbella/Jimena areas, as you are talking a couple of hours instead of just an hour, or less.

I already commute every two weeks to where I work now, and live away from home in that time. All the things are in place already, so commuting to Spain will not make any real difference to our circumstances in that respect, it won't be something we need to adjust to as we are already doing it,and have for many years....I think the biggest problem will be a mental one of just not wanting to come away from Spain to work anymore!! 

Funnily enough my other half has got a terrible snake phobia!!!....and despite practically everyone saying that it is not something she needs to worry about in practically any area, and that they are more scared of her than she is of them, and that most residents have rarely, if at all, seen a snake, she continues to worry about it! 

But as regards insects etc, I haven't encountered any problems wherever we have viewed, or stayed. Even when staying in rental accommodation that was quite remote we never experienced any problems. There seems to be a lot geckos about, but I find them quite cute to be honest 
The only time I have ever noticed any insects bothering me, is a couple of times when viewing homes in very much farming communities, that there were a lot of flies about, which were annoying and did put me off a bit. But they were cattle farming communities, and the houses were quite close to the farms, and would say it was more of an isolated experience rather than the norm. So overall, my personal experience is it really isn't a problem you will have to worry about....but residents in some areas might tell us different?


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Not sure about inland being closer, Marbella is only around 35 mins to Málaga and the roads are good. If I were commuting I think I would choose to be close to the airport. Are there still flights going into Jerez and Seville?

we have seen quite a lot of snakes over the years, in and around the swimming pool and often when walking in the hills. Never seen a cockroach indoors, that would freak me out.


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## alborino (Dec 13, 2014)

steve tx again. Yes the flights are trickier from Cadiz although in truth I'm talking about once every 6 weeks if that and am not tied to fixed timescales as visiting clients so I'm probably making too much of it.

And Cadiz is great for a boat to tenerife where my step daughter is (she works for me as well) and I love boat trips

Just a bit worried I'm trying to persuade myself Cadiz is better than Malaga, although ultimately the right village and house location is much more important.

Tx for the insect help. I'll try and get my wife to read what you have said. 

As for our lizard friends yup they are great and in any case I expect we will end up with a dog (possible one of Mary's) and four cats. So lizards beware 

For sure seen plenty of snakes but all squashed on the autopista.

Isobella surprised you've avoided cockcroaches indoors. If we didn't have the flat in Madrid defumagated every now and then we would be infested. And my step daughter only two days ago in Tenerife saw a cloud of them flying in. And that's new so I think they are expanding their territory, although tenerife is quite far away of course.

Reminds me my first time in Hong Kong when I asked why the ground floor of the flats had just a lift and emergency stair entry. They pointed to the sign on the lift wall "Please kill all cockroaches before proceeding into the building". And some where as big as terepins .

And yes there are flights out of Seville (easyjet) and Jerez(Ryanair) to London but not much choice of time and other UK destinations. But dirt cheap in the coming months


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## Leper (May 12, 2010)

Steve, Can I ask what age are you? I know you are running a business in the UK. Is it enough to sustain your existence in Spain? Do you need separate employment to augment your lifestyle?

You are probably wondering about my questions and that's OK. But, before I give my opinion on your situation I need to know answers on my questions.

Regards
Lep


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## Justina (Jan 25, 2013)

Why don't you rent a place in Malaga for a couple of years since you are thinking of retiring, it would make sense as it would give you time to explore more. Even within a province there is so much to choose from, but you want to get it right.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Leper said:


> Steve, Can I ask what age are you? I know you are running a business in the UK. Is it enough to sustain your existence in Spain? Do you need separate employment to augment your lifestyle?
> 
> You are probably wondering about my questions and that's OK. But, before I give my opinion on your situation I need to know answers on my questions.
> 
> ...


Where did you glean the information from to frame those questions? This is how the OP described his situation and intentions in a previous post in this thread, so they don't seem relevant to me.


"I will also commute to the UK for the first couple of years, and then retire early when it feels right, so like you the access to an airport is very important, and in all honesty Malaga is the only real option for regular, and cheap, flights. There are other options, but it seems whenever we look elsewhere we still end up flying in and out of Malaga because of cost or convenience of flight times.
In that respect centrally inland is a much better proposition for access to the airport, as opposed to the Estepona/Marbella/Jimena areas, as you are talking a couple of hours instead of just an hour, or less.

I already commute every two weeks to where I work now, and live away from home in that time. All the things are in place already, so commuting to Spain will not make any real difference to our circumstances in that respect, it won't be something we need to adjust to as we are already doing it,and have for many years....I think the biggest problem will be a mental one of just not wanting to come away from Spain to work anymore!!"


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

alborino said:


> Just a bit worried I'm trying to persuade myself Cadiz is better than Malaga, although ultimately the right village and house location is much more important.


...I'll be honest, after we had done many viewings, in many areas, and really only found one property we liked in the area we liked the most. We then tried to find other houses we liked in the same area, and could not find anything.....

But then we realised we didn't really want the wrong house, in the right area, but would rather consider the right house, in another area. Obviously that is all within reason..the right house in an area we didn't like wouldn't work..we've seen a few houses we really liked, but the location just didn't work for us. But we found that the right house would make us look into the area it was in in more depth, to consider the attraction it would have.

Obviously there are other factors to consider...like the closeness to the airport or ferries etc...but we found once we found the right house it made us much more flexible


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Leper said:


> Steve, Can I ask what age are you? I know you are running a business in the UK. Is it enough to sustain your existence in Spain? Do you need separate employment to augment your lifestyle?
> 
> You are probably wondering about my questions and that's OK. But, before I give my opinion on your situation I need to know answers on my questions.
> 
> ...


Lep,

I'm 48 years old...it's a bit complicated, but long story short, 3 years I had a really big cycling accident which resulted in me smashing my hip socket to bits! It will always give me trouble, and I will struggle to sustain working in my current job for many more years. In Andalucia however my standard of life seems almost unaffected, as the heat seems to have an amazing effect. This was the main reason behind considering retiring so early in Spain.

I will continue to commute to my current work until I feel it financially unnecessary to do so, or until I feel the time is right because of physical reasons.
We do not need to work when in Spain...if we did I realise it is an almost impossible thing to consider. Our savings will sustain us for many years, well into old age, and the next few years while I'm commuting will cement our security.....we have done our sums, and if there was any risk I wouldn't make the move!

We have, and still are, considering properties with rental potential in order to give us a source of an income. But we have our reservations....bookings are not guaranteed, and we know people who have done it, and they have said that the damage costs and aggravation make it limited in its financial benefit. Also the possibility of changing legislation towards home rentals concerns us, and also we have heard that rental income could be heavily taxed in the near future. In short, I think I'd rather have the money in the bank to live off, rather than have to rely on waiting for rental money.

I'm not a gambling man, and we've done our sums, and tried to be objective with all aspects of the potential move....if we thought it doesn't work, or the risk too great, then we would have to regrettably drop the idea of moving to Spain...but as it stands it looks the best thing we could do


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Snakes seem to pop up everywhere, even in densely populated urban areas. A friend who lives in Marbella saw a large snake sunning itself in the middle of the road near her house. Her husband removed it from harm's way to the pavement. It wasn't poisonous.
I've only ever seen two snakes in our garden, both rather small, skinny specimens. Our gardener found a baby one once, I wasn't sure what kind so,suggested he kill it. He, a pious Muslim, said indignantly 'No, ees leeving theeng' , lifted it in his gloved hand, carried it over to a piece of campo opposite our house and tenderly laid it down.
So it can grow up to be a big snake and frighten the life out of someone..
In six years here I've seen one cockroach, outside the house on the terrace by the pool. But apparently loads of them were disturbed by workmen laying pipes a few hundred metres up the road.
Our semi- rural area is plagued with rats, though. Our neighbour has chickens and she has seen rats clinging to the rejas of her kitchen window. I found two large dead rats on our lawn, probably died of fright when they encountered our two big dogs and the feral cats that OH feeds and has built a shelter for in our garden.
Jimena is lovely, btw.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

mrypg9 said:


> Snakes seem to pop up everywhere, even in densely populated urban areas. A friend who lives in Marbella saw a large snake sunning itself in the middle of the road near her house. Her husband removed it from harm's way to the pavement. It wasn't poisonous.
> I've only ever seen two snakes in our garden, both rather small, skinny specimens. Our gardener found a baby one once, I wasn't sure what kind so,suggested he kill it. He, a pious Muslim, said indignantly 'No, ees leeving theeng' , lifted it in his gloved hand, carried it over to a piece of campo opposite our house and tenderly laid it down.
> So it can grow up to be a big snake and frighten the life out of someone..
> In six years here I've seen one cockroach, outside the house on the terrace by the pool. But apparently loads of them were disturbed by workmen laying pipes a few hundred metres up the road.
> ...


I've never seen a live snake here, in our town setting, but when we were having some work done on our patio the skin of one was discovered inside a wall so they must be around.

We tend to see maybe 4 or 5 cockroaches a year (one at a time not all at once, thank goodness) inside the house, I think they fly in from outside. We buy a spray from Mercadona which kills them in seconds (I have no scruples about that!).

The only time we ever had a problem with rats was when all the streets and sewers outside were being dug up to be renewed, which as you mentioned with the cockroaches, disturbs them and they go looking for somewhere else to live. My OH saw one on top of a water tank in our patio and we put poison down after that - a couple of days later he found one obviously dying so scooped it up in a container and got rid of it, have never seen another one since.

We have hardly any mosquitos here either, I think I was bitten twice this year, both times just after the weather turned very warm as summer was beginning.


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

Steve can you still cycle after your accident? I won't let my good wife see the stuff about, snakes, rats and cockroaches.................

Roy


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Roy C said:


> Steve can you still cycle after your accident? I won't let my good wife see the stuff about, snakes, rats and cockroaches.................
> 
> Roy


Ditto about the snakes and bugs Roy!!!.....she's ok with bugs to be honest, but snakes are a different matter! 

I loved cycling Roy  I was doing about 20 miles a day before the accident (...the third, and worst, of three big ones...). Ironically cycling is one of the best therapies for my hip! 

I really miss cycling, and would love to get back on the road, and I'm often very very tempted......unfortunately the flashback of the accident soon dissuades me!...a second accident on the hip and I would be in serious trouble. Plus my whole family have banned me from cycling!!!  so now unfortunately the only cycling I do is when it is firmly bolted to a gym floor! 

....but maybe when I get to Spain????......


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