# How to get the hell out of Egypt!



## Davideg

Hi,
I'm an Egyptian citizen, me and my family need to get out of this country, simply cause it sucks, nothing changes and as Christians we feel threat every day, yesterday my car tires were full of nails just because i have a cross hanging from the inside mirror of my car.

We tried everything, Canada: no reply, Australia: our qualifications can't get us there, USA: lottery not granted, New Zealand: not accepted cause they wanted us to be working in a multinational company for 3 years, i only had 1.5

i considered applying as a refugee for Australia, but guess what!! i didn't get it.

i have experience working in advertising, media and social work, however i don't have a qualification for social work and they don't accept volunteer work to be reconginzed to grant a visa :s

So what should i do? i applied for maaaaany jobs in australia, canada, uk, usa, all with the reply: you're good, you're so good, but we don't sponsor overseas emplyeed!!

So am i stuck here forever or what?????? can anyone help me? just tell me what to do?

here are some details about me

age: 30
ielts: 6.5
french education
BA in accounting - Ain Shams university
Work experience: 2 years in media, 3 years in advertising and production, 14 years in social work (volunteeraly work: scouts and youth development programs)
i currently work in social work field as a project manager for youth initiatives, still on my 3rd month
Christian (if that helps in anyway, since the government and people here treat us like minority)

appreciate annyyy help, we're fed up
thanks


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## Gounie

Sorry I don't know how to help you get out of Egypt. Could you consider moving to a different part of Egypt like El Gouna? It is a safe, private town with a church and mosque. There are big hotels here like Moevenpick, Sheraton, Steigenberger or working for a company like Orascom. We also have a branch of the American University of Cairo here and a new Berlin Technical Insitute opening soon? Sorry I don't have any contacts but they are easy to find on the internet or El Gouna Red Sea Egypt's Best Holiday Destination and Beach Resort Town .


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## canuck2010

I have an Egyptian colleague who is about to emigrate to Canada with his family. It's possible, but the process took them years and many resources. The only advice I have is to visit the individual embassies directly and find out what the process is. Goodluck!

- another idea, try applying for jobs in other MENA countries where the economic situation is better, such as UAE, Qatar, ect...


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## expatagogo

Davideg said:


> Hi,
> I'm an Egyptian citizen, me and my family need to get out of this country, simply cause it sucks, nothing changes and as Christians we feel threat every day, yesterday my car tires were full of nails just because i have a cross hanging from the inside mirror of my car.
> 
> We tried everything, Canada: no reply, Australia: our qualifications can't get us there, USA: lottery not granted, New Zealand: not accepted cause they wanted us to be working in a multinational company for 3 years, i only had 1.5
> 
> i considered applying as a refugee for Australia, but guess what!! i didn't get it.
> 
> i have experience working in advertising, media and social work, however i don't have a qualification for social work and they don't accept volunteer work to be reconginzed to grant a visa :s
> 
> So what should i do? i applied for maaaaany jobs in australia, canada, uk, usa, all with the reply: you're good, you're so good, but we don't sponsor overseas emplyeed!!
> 
> So am i stuck here forever or what?????? can anyone help me? just tell me what to do?
> 
> here are some details about me
> 
> age: 30
> ielts: 6.5
> french education
> BA in accounting - Ain Shams university
> Work experience: 2 years in media, 3 years in advertising and production, 14 years in social work (volunteeraly work: scouts and youth development programs)
> i currently work in social work field as a project manager for youth initiatives, still on my 3rd month
> Christian (if that helps in anyway, since the government and people here treat us like minority)
> 
> appreciate annyyy help, we're fed up
> thanks


Talk to your church and see if they can help you.

Did you make a police report? I hope so, if for no other reason than to have the crime documented.


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## Davideg

Gounie said:


> Sorry I don't know how to help you get out of Egypt. Could you consider moving to a different part of Egypt like El Gouna? It is a safe, private town with a church and mosque. There are big hotels here like Moevenpick, Sheraton, Steigenberger or working for a company like Orascom.  We also have a branch of the American University of Cairo here and a new Berlin Technical Insitute opening soon? Sorry I don't have any contacts but they are easy to find on the internet or El Gouna Red Sea Egypt's Best Holiday Destination and Beach Resort Town .


Thanks for your reply, i considered relocating to another part of Egypt, but relocation is not as easy as in Australia or Canada, prices here compared to what Egyptians earn are waaay too high to live in a decent apartment, also, other fancy places in Egypt like Gouna or Sharm are all about tourism, they are seasonal, and you can't get a job unless you are willing to work in tourism. and with this country's tourism and economic conditions it will be hard to move your life to these places.
Thanks though


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## Davideg

canuck2010 said:


> I have an Egyptian colleague who is about to emigrate to Canada with his family. It's possible, but the process took them years and many resources. The only advice I have is to visit the individual embassies directly and find out what the process is. Goodluck!
> 
> - another idea, try applying for jobs in other MENA countries where the economic situation is better, such as UAE, Qatar, ect...


thanks for your reply, i visited the embassies and they all refer me to their website, noone there is willing to give a hint or tip cause "everything is on the website"

When i made the refugee application, i got an interview in the Australian embassy in Cairo, they refused my application, i asked what to do, they told me you can apply again if you want :s

Moving to other countries in ME is not an option for me, i want to resettle, i'm not looking for a job with high earnings, get a ferrari and enjoy the 12 months hot weather, anyhow, i applied in many jobs in Dubai, i have some contacts there as well whom i met in my training there, but they told me frankly that they are focusing on hiring british people for high end earnings, or asians for low end earnings, Egyptians are not likely to be hired especially in my fields.


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## Davideg

expatagogo said:


> Talk to your church and see if they can help you.
> 
> Did you make a police report? I hope so, if for no other reason than to have the crime documented.


The church is not encouraging immigration

About police reports, you're right, i should do so, however, when i have been chased in the streets on the 9th of October (Maspiro christians massacre) , i went to the police station and they refused to make a report about it, they kicked me out of the station and told me that they can arrest me, i don't walk into the police station again since then. i don't dare.


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## DeadGuy

The details you gave about yourself made me stop wondering why has it never worked when I tried :lol:

Seriously though, and no offense! But don't you think this is the wrong forum for such a topic?

As for your car..........Someone I know had the same, windshield smashed too.........Just get yourself a gun, and learn how to use it........It did work for some people......

Best of luck dude!


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## DeadGuy

expatagogo said:


> Talk to your church and see if they can help you.
> 
> Did you make a police report? I hope so, if for no other reason than to have the crime documented.


Ehm, Church my arse, sorry!

Even if he did make a police report, apparently embassies' staff members are only looking for a police report that will clearly state that a Copt was KILLED due to secular events, other than that, it would be wasting the embassies' folks' time, and yours


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## PaulAshton

Sorry to hear about your plight, as you have accounting experience explore banks that have branches in an area that shows more tolerance

My best friend is Coptic so I have an idea of the crap you are facing.

The crime you have faced is of religious origin, remember the hadeeth indicates that if the Prophet saw a cross on something, he would not leave it without blotting it out, or cutting it out if it was still visible after blotting it out, because the cross is something that is worshipped instead of Allah, and its presence is something objectionable (munkar) to them which must be changed.

On the other side of the coin Muslims are now faced with aggression in the West– which may reach the point of killing – shots being fired at mosques, women, assaults against Muslim students in schools and universities and persecution of some Muslim employees in their workplaces, you will find that running away might not solve your problem as simple minded people can still perceive an Egyptian as "an Arab"just based on origin or the way you look and and speak and have never heard of Copts.


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## Davideg

DeadGuy said:


> The details you gave about yourself made me stop wondering why has it never worked when I tried :lol:
> 
> Seriously though, and no offense! But don't you think this is the wrong forum for such a topic?
> 
> As for your car..........Someone I know had the same, windshield smashed too.........Just get yourself a gun, and learn how to use it........It did work for some people......
> 
> Best of luck dude!


Where do u think is better to open such a topic? if you have a better place please guide me  i'll be thankful

Violence is not an option for me, i will never buy a gun, nor shoot someone


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## DeadGuy

Davideg said:


> Where do u think is better to open such a topic? if you have a better place please guide me  i'll be thankful
> 
> Violence is not an option for me, i will never buy a gun, nor shoot someone


Well I only tried the "embassies" scenario couple times AGES ago, and once I came to the conclusion that it will never work unless I put EVERYONE I know in a really tight spot, I decided not to waste my time on a lost cause, so I can't help much with your situation I'm afraid.

However I can only suggest you to try and contact any of the American Egyptian lawyers that are involved in such cases, or offices that would offer help, and there are PLENTY of those, but this is a forum for expats, not immigration, so I believe this forum could be helpful if you're already in a foreign country, but you're not........So........

As for violence, I never said you'd NEED to use the gun to shoot anyone if you don't want to! You are an Egyptian, so you know how anyone would react if you just shot a couple shots "in the air", they'd just p!ss off and never come back again.........Personally I would shoot anyone trying to cause me or my close ones any harm, consider me a violent person, an arse, whatever, but sh!t happens, and you gotta deal with it somehow.....

Good luck buddy!


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## DeadGuy

A friend of mine got the cross hanging from his mirror too by the way, but since all the _Ruin the Copts' cars_ campaign started, he decided to get a Mus-haff from a Muslim friend of ours and put it in his car too :lol:

His car is totally fine, so far anyway


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## jojo

Top tip: Dont hang a cross from your rearview mirror!

Jo xxx


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## DeadGuy

jojo said:


> Top tip: Dont hang a cross from your rearview mirror!
> 
> Jo xxx


And if you got the cross tattoo on your wrist, cut your wrist off........

If your mom/sister/wife/daughter is not covering her hair, start covering her hair......

If you go to a church to pray, make sure no one sees you, or start going to a mosque to pray.......

Sorry if I sound too sarcastic, but even if I had a car, I wouldn't just take the cross off my bloody mirror........Not without a fight anyway!


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## jojo

DeadGuy said:


> And if you got the cross tattoo on your wrist, cut your wrist off........
> 
> If your mom/sister/wife/daughter is not covering her hair, start covering her hair......
> 
> If you go to a church to pray, make sure no one sees you, or start going to a mosque to pray.......
> 
> Sorry if I sound too sarcastic, but even if I had a car, I wouldn't just take the cross off my bloody mirror........Not without a fight anyway!


Religions dont do themselves any favours do they - none of them!

Jo xxx


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## DeadGuy

jojo said:


> Religions dont do themselves any favours do they - none of them!
> 
> Jo xxx


No they don't, no.........

But pretending to be someone that you're not won't do you any favors either........


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## jojo

DeadGuy said:


> No they don't, no.........
> 
> But pretending to be someone that you're not won't do you any favors either........



Its not pretending, its simply keeping your beliefs to yourself and not "waving the banner"!!! Especially if you're in a country where it seems to matter!??

Jo xxx


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## MaidenScotland

jojo said:


> Its not pretending, its simply keeping your beliefs to yourself and not "waving the banner"!!! Especially if you're in a country where it seems to matter!??
> 
> Jo xxx




It's not that simple Jo.. in this country you are one of two things..1 you are a Muslim 2 your not a Muslim.. nothing else matters. 
You are identified by your name... say a name to someone and they will say.. that's a Christian name... 
You are identified by what you eat/
You are identified by what you wear
You are identified by what school you go to.

It is hard for for those that have never lived in a religiously divided country to imagine what is is really like and how we can easily identify each other.
I am sure you all know that I am Irish/Scottish Catholic. I have family in Belfast who can tell someones religion just by looking, when I questioned this they said.. you just can.

I for one feel you shouldn't remove your cross...doing so would just be another nail in the cross pardon the pun for Copts in this country.


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## canuck2010

The winds of change are only blowing in one direction in Egypt. It's probably a good idea to keep a low profile no matter what religion one follows.


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## jojo

MaidenScotland said:


> It's not that simple Jo.. in this country you are one of two things..1 you are a Muslim 2 your not a Muslim.. nothing else matters.
> You are identified by your name... say a name to someone and they will say.. that's a Christian name...
> You are identified by what you eat/
> You are identified by what you wear
> You are identified by what school you go to.
> 
> It is hard for for those that have never lived in a religiously divided country to imagine what is is really like and how we can easily identify each other.
> I am sure you all know that I am Irish/Scottish Catholic. I have family in Belfast who can tell someones religion just by looking, when I questioned this they said.. you just can.
> 
> I for one feel you shouldn't remove your cross...doing so would just be another nail in the cross pardon the pun for Copts in this country.


I'll bow to your better knowledge maiden. Not living in that sort of environment means I obviously dont have the full picture. I certainly find it frightening that religion can have such a hold on peoples emotions!

Jo xxxx


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## DeadGuy

jojo said:


> Its not pretending, its simply keeping your beliefs to yourself and not "waving the banner"!!! Especially if you're in a country where it seems to matter!??
> 
> Jo xxx


I'm NOT a religious person, this friend of mine who put the Islamic Holy book in his car along with the Christian cross is not a religious guy either, so is the Muslim friend of ours that gave him the book, he's not a religious guy either, for this friend of mine, our Muslim friend, and myself, none of us care about anyone's religion, but there are MANY who do care about what someone's religion is, and there are PLENTY of those, and that's mainly why the OP's car, and many others' was/were "attacked".

Like Maiden said, if it's not the cross in your car, it will be your name, your school, your family, your this, your that, but there will be something that identifies you and tells of what your religion is.

I'm not a religious Christian that's for sure, but sure as Hell I ain't a Muslim either, and if hanging a cross from a mirror in a car, or having it hung on your wall on your living room will cause a problem, then so be it, cause it's not the cross in the car that's the problem for those idiots, it's YOU not being a Muslim is what's causing the problem.


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## DeadGuy

canuck2010 said:


> The winds of change are only blowing in one direction in Egypt. It's probably a good idea to keep a low profile no matter what religion one follows.


Any suggestions on how can anyone keep a low profile on that? :confused2:


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## PaulAshton

It's not complicated for a Muslim to spot a Copt but almost impossible for Arabs to spot the population of Ashkenazic (German/Eastern European) Jews in the Red Sea but they can sometimes spot each other, call it 6th sense. :ranger:

Suppose it will give them something to keep them busy, the Egyptian version of "wheres waldo" :eyebrows:


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## Davideg

i really do appreciate all your replies, but i wish this won't turn into a religious debate/conversation, 
i appreciate any help i can get, any info, any tips on how to get the hell out of here. 

thanks


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## expatagogo

David, I think someone already told you how to do it.

Your refugee/asylum applications were denied, quite likely because you're still in country and the idea is that a person can't go back to their home country. It's much easier for an Egyptian to get a visa into another Gulf country than to the west. From there, reapply for refugee admission into a third, more tolerant, country. Whether that application is approved or not isn't something forseeable, of course, however being outside of the country would improve your chances - and get you (and your family) out of Egypt.


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## expatagogo

jojo said:


> I'll bow to your better knowledge maiden. Not living in that sort of environment means I obviously dont have the full picture. I certainly find it frightening that religion can have such a hold on peoples emotions!
> 
> Jo xxxx


It comes from a lifetime of government (yes, government) brainwashing. Egyptian Muslims are taught that every other religion wants nothing more than to kill them, Jews in particular, and every occupant of Israel (doesn't matter which religion a person living in Israel happens to be, only that it's Israel) is hell-bent on their slaughter. They're also taught that all Christians worship three Gods because, according to government brainwashing techniques, there is only one type of Christian, and they all believe in the trinity, therefore three Gods.

If there's one thing that I truly hope comes from this revolution, it's that Egyptians learn how badly they've been lied to.


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## marimar

Davideg said:


> Where do u think is better to open such a topic? if you have a better place please guide me  i'll be thankful



Instead of asking on the Egypt ex pat section of this website you could try logging on to another country from the Expat Country Forums tab at the top of the page and asking people there how they got from Egypt to the UK or wherever. I'm sure they will have more helpful advice for you.
Hope you get the help you need.


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## ArabianNights

Sorry.... I am trying to get my head around this. You want to immigrate from Egypt, because some dimwats decided to place pins into your tyre? I am a Muslim, non Egyptian one at that - and I have also been discriminated against. I don't think its a good enough reason, to uproot and move to another land...maybe try and make things better for yourself where you are, by moving maybe as someone suggested to another area.


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## MaidenScotland

ArabianNights said:


> Sorry.... I am trying to get my head around this. You want to immigrate from Egypt, because some dimwats decided to place pins into your tyre? I am a Muslim, non Egyptian one at that - and I have also been discriminated against. I don't think its a good enough reason, to uproot and move to another land...maybe try and make things better for yourself where you are, by moving maybe as someone suggested to another area.




I think you will find that it is not because some dimwats decided to place pins in his tyres. It are a host of reasons but the main one being that if you are not a Muslim you are constantly discriminated against at every turn. Sorry but being a Copt is a whole other world and I don't really think that anyone who has not lived it could possibly understand.


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## ArabianNights

I think that its quite disturbing that Coptic Christians - who are in fact, if you look at the history of this country - are the 'original' Egyptians. Those that are Muslims here now are converts from Christianity and Islam was not the 'original' religion of this country... it only came with the various conquests into Egypt. The fact that Egyptians, regardless of what their religion is, are being forced out of their homeland is disgusting. If anything, religion, any religion, teaches tolerance of others.... and when there is no tolerance, then blame on religion shouldnt be placed.


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## MaidenScotland

ArabianNights said:


> I think that its quite disturbing that Coptic Christians - who are in fact, if you look at the history of this country - are the 'original' Egyptians. Those that are Muslims here now are converts from Christianity and Islam was not the 'original' religion of this country... it only came with the various conquests into Egypt. The fact that Egyptians, regardless of what their religion is, are being forced out of their homeland is disgusting. If anything, religion, any religion, teaches tolerance of others.... and when there is no tolerance, then blame on religion shouldnt be placed.




Actually all Egyptians are Coptic.. it is just the old word for Egyptian.


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