# Tourist immigration law confusion



## im_rad (Aug 28, 2010)

Hello, I am currently in Mexico and very confused about tourist immigration rules. If anyone can help me understand, I would very much appreciate it! Here's my situation:

I arrived in Mexico May 19, 2010, went back to the US July 10, 2010 and came back to Mexico July 16. I was given 180 days when I arrived May 19, and I was given 180 days again when I arrived July 16. I am planning on returning to the US December 22, 2010 and coming back to Mexico January 10, 2011. (Oaxaca to be exact and traveling by plane)

Now my doubt is whether or not the 180 days I am given is within a calendar year, within any time period of 365 days, or if it's just 180 days and it doesn't matter how many times I come and go within a year. I've been reading all of the new updated immigration policies, but it is not clear on this. So in other words, when I try to return to the US in December, will immigration give me trouble since I originally arrived May 19 (which is more than 180 days from December) or will it be okay since I was given 180 days in July? Also, when I come back in January, will I run into trouble? Or will the new year have started and therefore no problem, or does it not matter anyway?

And what if it is a problem and when I arrive in January they tell me I can't enter because I already stayed 180 days in a year period, where would I do? Would I just have to buy the next flight back to the US? 

Finally, is it 180 days INCLUDING the day I arrive, or 180 days with day 1 starting the following day? I ask because I am planning on staying from January 10, 2011 until July 9, 2011. However, 180 days from January 10 (including that day) is July 8. If I leave July 9, is that a problem? Basically I'm just worried about immigration not liking my being in Mexico as a tourist for so long and banning me from entering for some period of time. Does that happen?

I already went to the US consulate here in Oaxaca and they told me I could enter and leave Mexico as many times as I want, but I don't want to rely on them because they when I mentioned the changes in immigration laws that took effect May 1, they had no idea what I was talking about.

Oh, and if you're curious I am in Mexico living with my boyfriend and truly just being a tourist for now. I realize it would be a whole lot easier to just get married, but that's not something we're ready for, and it would definitely be a heck of a lot more difficult to get him a visa to visit the US. Also I already tried getting a work visa to teach English, but immigration told me my Bachelor's Degree does not qualify me to teach English and I would need to get certified to teach English even though I told them I already did have a job offer from an English school, which is true- I was offered a job because the school saw me as competent to teach. I have experience teaching English, just not an official certification! Very frustrating.

If you need me to explain more clearly, just let me know. Thank you!


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

The new FMM is good for 180 days from the date of entry into Mexico. It cannot be extended.
The FMM must be surrendered when you depart Mexico.
On re-entry, you will get a new FMM.

If you plan to stay longer in Mexico, you must apply for a 'no inmigrante credencial' or an 'inmigrante credencial' within 30 days of arriving in Mexico with an FMM. There are financial qualifications that you must meet. This is the procedure you should use.

The 180 days will include the day of entry; so I wouldn't push the issue and get fined or attract attention. Leave on July 8th this time.

INM can refuse you entry when they discover that you are actually misusing the FMM to live in Mexico. Actually, they can refuse you entry without cause.

To get a 'credencial' to work, the school would have had to provide support to sponsor you, including specific details of your employment, their own tax records, etc, etc. Had you used that approach, it might have been possible. You would have to make the application for a 'no inmigrante credencial' within 30 days of entry on an FMM.


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## grndy85 (May 10, 2010)

Hey im_rad...I am pretty much in the same boat as you are. I am moving to Mexico with my partner (who is a Mexican citizen) on October 4th on just a "FMM" or Tourist Visa and will have to just stay for the 180 days period, go to the border and then come back on a new Tourist Visa until I can obtain a VISA. I am pretty sure that each time you leave and then return, you are given a new 180 day VISA. 

I also will be job hunting for a job teaching English, whether it is at a school, for a company wanting to teach their employees, or even privately for a family, etc. I also have a bachelor's degree but not in teaching (in Sociology). Let me know how everything goes for you. 

(MODERATOR'S NOTE: Please, discontinue the term 'FM3' as it no longer exists. You will need a 'no inmigrante credencial', a visa, at the very least, plus working permission from INM, which is getting harder to get).


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## conklinwh (Dec 19, 2009)

RV ******, I suspect that you are right that immigration could deny access via FMM. I sort of doubt that since seems arrival will be by air that it would happen at the airport but then this is Mexico and everything is possible.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

They can pretty much do whatever they wish. This last month, there have been several instances of folks having their pets held at airports; in spite of having all the required health documentation. They've had to wait for hours, pets held separately, until a veterinarian could come to the airport to inspect the pets. Of course, they had to pay 1000 pesos per pet and got no receipts. That is spreading from airport to airport and I see no justification for it. It looks like a 'get it while you can' situation.
Granted, the FMM seems pretty 'loose' and such 'tourists' aren't monitored well, especially if they have no car. However, high frequency tourists might be noticed & refused without warning if an INM agent was having a bad day. The poster is, obviously, misusing the system; which would give them cause. If it happens, there should be no complaints. We all have to realize that there is probably some 'backlash reaction' to US immigration policies as more and more unhappy folks are forced to return to Mexico without jobs and even without families. This appears to be one of those situations.


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## im_rad (Aug 28, 2010)

Thanks for your replies. RVGRINGO, do you know if I find out more information about the 'no inmigrante credencial' and 'inmigrante credencial' online?

grndy85, I will keep updating about how things go with the work visa. I may take a month long TEFL course online to get certified just to make everything easier.

Has anyone even spoken to an immigration lawyer or know of a lawyer/firm in Oaxaca that could help me out with answering my questions and giving advice?


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

The INM site is linked in the Updated Immigration thread, at the top of the list of threads.
You will find a video there, in English, that may be helpful.
Every bit of the information you need is thoroughly discussed on this site. That said, a Mexican lawyer will be glad to take your pesos even if he knows nothing of the immigration system and its new requirements. There are lots of cases of delays and real fumbles when using 'facilitators'. The new system is designed so that you can do it yourself with no more than a bit of help from a Spanish speaking friend to complete the online process. You can take the payment form to any bank and pay the fees without speaking a word, then go to INMs office to present your documents. You will find that they have INM agents who speak English, but the process can often be accomplished without the need to converse much at all.


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## im_rad (Aug 28, 2010)

RVGRINGO- Thanks again. By the way, the link for INM in the updated immigration thread for the english version with the video is not a working link. I think the INM website may have recently been changed because after visiting inm.gob.mx, it looks a whole lot different than the last time I checked it. If you can find the English video, please post it! Thanks!

Also, you say to apply for a 'no inmigrante credencial' or an 'inmigrante credencial', I must do so within 30 days of arriving in Mexico with an FMM. Do you know what would happen if I applied now, as I have been in Mexico longer than 30 days now. Would they tell me to leave Mexico and come back to start the process or would I just pay a fine and still be able to apply?


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

If you read the fourth paragraph under "instructions for filling out" on the back side of your part of the FMM it should answer your question.......


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

im_rad said:


> RVGRINGO- Thanks again. By the way, the link for INM in the updated immigration thread for the english version with the video is not a working link. I think the INM website may have recently been changed because after visiting inm.gob.mx, it looks a whole lot different than the last time I checked it. If you can find the English video, please post it! Thanks!
> 
> Also, you say to apply for a 'no inmigrante credencial' or an 'inmigrante credencial', I must do so within 30 days of arriving in Mexico with an FMM. Do you know what would happen if I applied now, as I have been in Mexico longer than 30 days now. Would they tell me to leave Mexico and come back to start the process or would I just pay a fine and still be able to apply?


You are right; it seems the website with the video has vanished. We'll have to explore the new one in Spanish.
I don't know the answer to your second question. I suggest you apply and see what happens. Let us know.


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## Guest (Sep 14, 2010)

grndy85 said:


> Hey im_rad...I am pretty much in the same boat as you are. I am moving to Mexico with my partner (who is a Mexican citizen) on October 4th on just a "FMM" or Tourist Visa and will have to just stay for the 180 days period, go to the border and then come back on a new Tourist Visa until I can obtain a VISA. I am pretty sure that each time you leave and then return, you are given a new 180 day VISA.
> 
> I also will be job hunting for a job teaching English, whether it is at a school, for a company wanting to teach their employees, or even privately for a family, etc. I also have a bachelor's degree but not in teaching (in Sociology). Let me know how everything goes for you.
> 
> (MODERATOR'S NOTE: Please, discontinue the term 'FM3' as it no longer exists. You will need a 'no inmigrante credencial', a visa, at the very least, plus working permission from INM, which is getting harder to get).



hi rad and others 
I did the same thing. My fiance got deported to mexico :/ and I decided to come and see this country out of curiorsity. I figured well he's free here, maybe this could work, he happens to have lots of fam and im sure they will help haha! I came here and first stayed with his sister in mexico city waiting for his return. A month later he comes right on schedule and we go south to his hometown, Guerrero. I went to schools all kinds and they said that I needed a teaching degree plus I dont speak spanish. I think that you can take an English Grammar exam, I took an exam for a english grammar job and didnt do so well. If I were you I would study and review first. Then out of nowhere a friend of his family happened to have a daughter who needed someone to help her prepare for her exam to graduate school of language. I have been doing that acouple months only getting paid 50 pesos 5.00 a day, which helps me eat and browse on be on computer. My fiance only makes 100 a week building a 100,000 house. Now I am pregnant and because of this I have to return to usa, one it will cost out of pocket and two registering a bby to be an usa citizen is very complicated. 
But with only being on a tourist visa, I really dont have a choice. I hope all goes well with you. hopefully this is just an experience for you and your partner and not permanant.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Without the permission of INM, it is illegal for you to work in Mexico. You shouldn't put yourself in danger of being excluded from being able to return to Mexico.
Many others have come to Mexico thinking that they could teach English, simply because they could speak it. That is seldom the case, as you discovered, and the ability to explain English in Spanish is almost imperative. There are courses offered in TEFL, for example, which would provide some minimum 'credentials' for prospective teaching jobs, but degreed teaching certification with prior experience would be what you would need to find a decent position. Many others are very low paying and often only for a few hours per day; certainly not a 'living wage'.


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## Guest (Sep 14, 2010)

RVGRINGO said:


> Without the permission of INM, it is illegal for you to work in Mexico. You shouldn't put yourself in danger of being excluded from being able to return to Mexico.
> Many others have come to Mexico thinking that they could teach English, simply because they could speak it. That is seldom the case, as you discovered, and the ability to explain English in Spanish is almost imperative. There are courses offered in TEFL, for example, which would provide some minimum 'credentials' for prospective teaching jobs, but degreed teaching certification with prior experience would be what you would need to find a decent position. Many others are very low paying and often only for a few hours per day; certainly not a 'living wage'.


thank U. U are right.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

(MODERATOR'S NOTE: Please, discontinue the term 'FM3' as it no longer exists. You will need a 'no inmigrante credencial', a visa, at the very least, plus working permission from INM, which is getting harder to get).

Dear moderator, I do not want to argue with you but I would like to point out that if the term 
FM3 no longer exists why does it state on the new FMM form that you have to have a FMM in order to start the process for an FM2 or FM3...suerte y paz

I know the Immigration Officer in Lukeville AZ. and he speaks fluent English, I have a whole list of questions and different scenarios to ask him to hopefully clear some of this confusion concerning the new FMM form...


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Sometime, one hand isn't quite sure what the other is doing. You have noticed one of those occurrences. I'm told by the INM folks in Guadalajara that the old terms are being phased out. I also note that on the new cards, there is no mention of the old FM3 or FM2 designations. So, it seems that the old terminology is habit; an easy one, at that. But using the new 'no inmigrante' or 'inmigrante' terminology helps us to differentiate between the old and new systems.


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## tcreek (Sep 13, 2010)

I still got my FMM 180 day card from this past May, it mentions FM2 and FM3 numerous times and says you can get an FM3.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

You are missing the point: What you will actually get will not be identified as an 'FM3', but as a 'no inmigrante credencial'.


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## pappabee (Jun 22, 2010)

*use a local assistant*



RVGRINGO said:


> The INM site is linked in the Updated Immigration thread, at the top of the list of threads.
> You will find a video there, in English, that may be helpful.
> Every bit of the information you need is thoroughly discussed on this site. That said, a Mexican lawyer will be glad to take your pesos even if he knows nothing of the immigration system and its new requirements. There are lots of cases of delays and real fumbles when using 'facilitators'. The new system is designed so that you can do it yourself with no more than a bit of help from a Spanish speaking friend to complete the online process. You can take the payment form to any bank and pay the fees without speaking a word, then go to INMs office to present your documents. You will find that they have INM agents who speak English, but the process can often be accomplished without the need to converse much at all.


We got our FM3 at the consul in Austin, Texas in April but entered the country on May 3. That was the problem. We were supposed to register upon entering but no one knew how or what to do. The people at the border were great but even they didn't understand what the new rules were or what forms to use.

We found a lady here in Ajijic who took all our info, drove it to Guad and handled everything for us. Came back with our signed and stamped FM3's and the total cost was only about $40.00 per person. Very cheap considering everything. She also helps with National Health when we're ready.


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