# Buying used LHD Spanish registered car in UK



## walker07

Hi
I'm hoping someone may be able to help with my query. I would like to buy a Spanish registered lhd car from a dealer in the UK at the end of this month for travelling down to Spain at the end of July. Originally I was going to use my UK rhd car to drive down in the hope of selling/trading in once there, but I've only had it a month and dealers in Spain have said they wouldn't be keen on buying/px it from me. So, I'm looking at 2 lhd's here in the UK; one that's 4 years old and the other, 2 years old so technically 'used' but I personally won't have owned it for the usual 6 months requirement. Both cars have a current ITV, signed documentation, NIE and copy of passport from previous owner, and have had all the Trafico checks done....apparently. I have my NIE number but I'm not on the padron yet, but will apply for fiscal residency when I arrive in Spain in July. Can I legally buy one of these cars without being on the padron? How will the car be registered/plated i.e. Spanish or UK? Should I encounter problems when I arrive in Spain? Sorry for so many questions, but I've asked the same question on another forum and still don't really know the answer! It's all so complicated and confusing, I was hoping someone who has been through a similar experience could share their knowledge with me. Thanks in anticipation.


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## xabiaxica

walker07 said:


> Hi
> I'm hoping someone may be able to help with my query. I would like to buy a Spanish registered lhd car from a dealer in the UK at the end of this month for travelling down to Spain at the end of July. Originally I was going to use my UK rhd car to drive down in the hope of selling/trading in once there, but I've only had it a month and dealers in Spain have said they wouldn't be keen on buying/px it from me. So, I'm looking at 2 lhd's here in the UK; one that's 4 years old and the other, 2 years old so technically 'used' but I personally won't have owned it for the usual 6 months requirement. Both cars have a current ITV, signed documentation, NIE and copy of passport from previous owner, and have had all the Trafico checks done....apparently. I have my NIE number but I'm not on the padron yet, but will apply for fiscal residency when I arrive in Spain in July. Can I legally buy one of these cars without being on the padron? How will the car be registered/plated i.e. Spanish or UK? Should I encounter problems when I arrive in Spain? Sorry for so many questions, but I've asked the same question on another forum and still don't really know the answer! It's all so complicated and confusing, I was hoping someone who has been through a similar experience could share their knowledge with me. Thanks in anticipation.



mrypg bought a spanish plated lhd car in the UK from a dealer there - maybe she can tell you who that was


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## mrypg9

walker07 said:


> Hi
> I'm hoping someone may be able to help with my query. I would like to buy a Spanish registered lhd car from a dealer in the UK at the end of this month for travelling down to Spain at the end of July. Originally I was going to use my UK rhd car to drive down in the hope of selling/trading in once there, but I've only had it a month and dealers in Spain have said they wouldn't be keen on buying/px it from me. So, I'm looking at 2 lhd's here in the UK; one that's 4 years old and the other, 2 years old so technically 'used' but I personally won't have owned it for the usual 6 months requirement. Both cars have a current ITV, signed documentation, NIE and copy of passport from previous owner, and have had all the Trafico checks done....apparently. I have my NIE number but I'm not on the padron yet, but will apply for fiscal residency when I arrive in Spain in July. Can I legally buy one of these cars without being on the padron? How will the car be registered/plated i.e. Spanish or UK? Should I encounter problems when I arrive in Spain? Sorry for so many questions, but I've asked the same question on another forum and still don't really know the answer! It's all so complicated and confusing, I was hoping someone who has been through a similar experience could share their knowledge with me. Thanks in anticipation.


It is in no way complicated or confusing. I bought a two year-old LandRover Discovery from a very reputable LHD specialist in Basingstoke whilst living in Prague. The company delivered it to me in Prague in October and at the end of November I drove it to Spain. At that time I had neither NIE nor was I on the Padron.
The car was on Spanish plates and had all the necessary documents to enable me to transfer it to my ownership. For change of ownership you need a Solicitud signed by the previous owner which the company selling the vehicle should be able to supply - or at least should contact the previous owner for you.
You should also check via the internet that there are no outstanding fines on any vehicle you purchase as you, the new owner, will be liable for them.
When in Spain, take all the required documentation to a gestor who will charge around 200 euros -it is a set fee - for transferring the vehicle into your ownership.
Couldn't be simpler.
You do however need to be wary when buying your LHD vehicle in the UK. There are one or two firms with less than A1 reputations but I'm not allowed to name them here.
I highly recommend the Basingstoke company though.


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## walker07

Thank you very much mrypg9 this is precisely the answer I was hoping for! I just couldn't seem to make contact with anyone who had actually been through the process so thank you for shring this with me. I too am looking at dealing with a dealer in Basingstoke so possibly the same one?!! The other is in London though, near a very large airport! Not sure if I'm allowed to mention names so won't just in case. I know that I'll only have a short time in which to transfer the vehicle over to my ownership once in Spain but I plan to get this done asap and not waste any time. So the car would be registered with Spanish plates and be legal to drive in the UK until I make the journey down 2 months later? Thank you for your help, it's much appreciated.


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## Seb*

walker07 said:


> Hi
> I'm hoping someone may be able to help with my query. I would like to buy a Spanish registered lhd car from a dealer in the UK at the end of this month for travelling down to Spain at the end of July. Originally I was going to use my UK rhd car to drive down in the hope of selling/trading in once there, but I've only had it a month and dealers in Spain have said they wouldn't be keen on buying/px it from me. So, I'm looking at 2 lhd's here in the UK; one that's 4 years old and the other, 2 years old so technically 'used' but I personally won't have owned it for the usual 6 months requirement. Both cars have a current ITV, signed documentation, NIE and copy of passport from previous owner, and have had all the Trafico checks done....apparently. I have my NIE number but I'm not on the padron yet, but will apply for fiscal residency when I arrive in Spain in July. Can I legally buy one of these cars without being on the padron? How will the car be registered/plated i.e. Spanish or UK? Should I encounter problems when I arrive in Spain? Sorry for so many questions, but I've asked the same question on another forum and still don't really know the answer! It's all so complicated and confusing, I was hoping someone who has been through a similar experience could share their knowledge with me. Thanks in anticipation.


You will hand over all documents to a gestoria in Spain. They will do the transfer of ownership in your name, this will take between 2 weeks and 3 months. You will have to pay a fee, which can be anything from 200 EUR up (we usually have paid 250-350 EUR) (depending on value of car etc.). You will need the last road tax receipt as well. A copy of your padrón is not needed if you can supply other proof of residence like property deads or a rental contract.

Make sure you are buying it from a reputable dealer, cause as the new owner you are liable for all unpaid taxes and fines, which in some cases can quickly go up into the hundrets or thousands of EUR payable on ownership transfer. The car will keep its Spanish numberplates and registration, it will just be tranferred into your name. Make sure you get the car insured before you come down! Spanish insurance is bound to the car and not the driver.

EDIT: Since you are still resident in the UK it is not legal for you to drive a foreign registered car within the UK, so striclty speaking the DVLA does not want you to drive it as long as you are still in the UK. If you can't prove that you are resident in Spain police can impound the car. So to be safe I would not recommend to drive the car too much around, if you do not have prove of Spanish residence yet. In any case the car will need to be insured from the moment you drive it on to the street. I would suggest a Spanish insurer, you can do this before the car is transferred to you and with some insurers like Linea directa you can do it over the internet (if you know your Spanish adress already).


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## xabiaxica

walker07 said:


> Thank you very much mrypg9 this is precisely the answer I was hoping for! I just couldn't seem to make contact with anyone who had actually been through the process so thank you for shring this with me. I too am looking at dealing with a dealer in Basingstoke so possibly the same one?!! The other is in London though, near a very large airport! Not sure if I'm allowed to mention names so won't just in case. I know that I'll only have a short time in which to transfer the vehicle over to my ownership once in Spain but I plan to get this done asap and not waste any time. So the car would be registered with Spanish plates and be legal to drive in the UK until I make the journey down 2 months later? Thank you for your help, it's much appreciated.


actually no - if you are a UK resident you can't drive it in the UK on Spanish plates long term..............

Driving in the UK with non-UK number plates : Directgov - Motoring

although you'd probably be OK driving it to the ferry 



> UK residents driving non-UK cars in the UK
> 
> UK residents are not allowed to use non-UK registered vehicles on UK roads. The only exceptions are:
> 
> if you work in another EU member state and use an EU-registered company car temporarily in the UK for business and private purposes
> if you lease an EU-registered car and use this temporarily in the UK


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## walker07

So do you think I'd be ok driving back up from Basingstoke to Scotland with the vehicle once I purchased it, then driving back down to the ferry 2 months later? I could hold on to my UK reg car to use while still here until it was time to leave.


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## Seb*

walker07 said:


> So do you think I'd be ok driving back up from Basingstoke to Scotland with the vehicle once I purchased it, then driving back down to the ferry 2 months later? I could hold on to my UK reg car to use while still here until it was time to leave.


Well up to Scotland it would not be legal. On leaving the UK you can explain the situation and show your ferry ticket as prove. I would be surprised if a police officer would stop you leaving the country.

Personally I would risk it, what is the chance that you get stopped by the police? But I would recommend that you have insurance for the car, when you drive it up to Scotland. On top of that I would carry as much prove/documentation as possible to explain, that you are planning to move to Spain (NIE number, maybe even a pre-booked ferry ticket etc.). Police officers are humans and usually very understanding if presented with the right explanation (with proof) in a friendly manner.


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## xabiaxica

walker07 said:


> So do you think I'd be ok driving back up from Basingstoke to Scotland with the vehicle once I purchased it, then driving back down to the ferry 2 months later? I could hold on to my UK reg car to use while still here until it was time to leave.


I suspect you'd _probably_ be OK driving it around - but if it was for 2 months the local police _might _start asking questions if they noticed


I dare say if you were stopped & were just moving it from one place to another that shouldn't be a problem


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## walker07

Thank you all for the advice and taking time to reply. We might have to rethink how we do things as don't want to get on the wrong side of the law! I'll also check with our local village constabulary as to how things stand although I'm pretty sure they'll tell me it is illegal to drive on foreign plates in what is still our current place of residence. I will definitely organise the insurance through a conact in Spain so at least we will be legal as soon as we set foot on Spanish soil! Thanks to all for your help.


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## mrypg9

walker07 said:


> Thank you all for the advice and taking time to reply. We might have to rethink how we do things as don't want to get on the wrong side of the law! I'll also check with our local village constabulary as to how things stand although I'm pretty sure they'll tell me it is illegal to drive on foreign plates in what is still our current place of residence. I will definitely organise the insurance through a conact in Spain so at least we will be legal as soon as we set foot on Spanish soil! Thanks to all for your help.


If your vehicle is insured you will have no problem whatsoever driving it in the UK.
I think the police have many more urgent matters to deal with. When did you last read or hear about a UK resident who intends to move shortly to another country to reside being fined for driving a foreign-plated car in the UK?
My son had a LandRover bought from a friend on French plates. He used it for trips to Switzerland, France and Spain but kept it in the UK. It was insured and had all the tests and documents required in France. He had the vehicle for eighteen months with no problems.
The police are reasonable, in my experience and once a situation is politely explained are very understanding. That goes for almost all the countries I have lived in. You are not a teenage tearaway (are you?)
If you find problems insuring the vehicle on Spanish plates in the UK, I can put you in touch with a reputable broker in Swansea who specialises in insurance for people living outside the UK.

I used him to get cover for a Mercedes I bought from Mercedes Nuremberg, also delivered to me in Prague. Stupidly I had it put on British plates and although I drove it happily around Prague I realised it would cost a fortune to have it transferred to Spanish plates.

You can make too much out of what is a simple business transaction. What would be the case with someone who has residences in Spain and the UK? Would a policeman really ask you to prove which was your main residence? We are talking the UK here, not the GDR underb the Stasi.

I;m not allowed to directly recommend a specific UK company but I personally would buy from Basingstoke should I require another LHD vehicle...most definately..


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## walker07

mrypg9, I don't suppose you can give me a recommendation on the car dealer in Basingstoke you bought from? Does it have 'place' in it's name? Being so far North of the Border it is difficult for me to know if I'm dealing with a reputable dealer or not so would be grateful for any personal recommendations. Thanks.


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## mrypg9

walker07 said:


> mrypg9, I don't suppose you can give me a recommendation on the car dealer in Basingstoke you bought from? Does it have 'place' in it's name? Being so far North of the Border it is difficult for me to know if I'm dealing with a reputable dealer or not so would be grateful for any personal recommendations. Thanks.


I'll pm you in five minutes with phone number.
When you speak to Colin tell him Mary from Prague recommended you.
I am not his Mum so am 100% objective.


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## walker07

Thank you Mary, I had a chuckle at your last reply.....teenage tearaway.....I wish!!! With one of us closer to 50 than 40, and the other beyond 50 but still a wee bit away from the next milestone I think we're way beyond our tearaway days but would love to have the energy to try again!! Is there any chance you could give me the details also of the insurance broker in Swansea just in case I come up against further problems. Many thanks


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## gus-lopez

walker07 said:


> Thank you Mary, I had a chuckle at your last reply.....teenage tearaway.....I wish!!! With one of us closer to 50 than 40, and the other beyond 50 but still a wee bit away from the next milestone I think we're way beyond our tearaway days but would love to have the energy to try again!! Is there any chance you could give me the details also of the insurance broker in Swansea just in case I come up against further problems. Many thanks


You shouldn't have any problems with a spanish insurer. They'll insure on a chassis number only if needed , or on foreign plates or export plates. You've an nie number , You'll just need an address to register it too. Maybe the friend could be used ?


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## walker07

Thanks Gus-lopez, I'll ask the dealer for the chassis number so I can start pricing up the insurance with various brokers/companies. I'm hoping it will be a straightforward process but knowing insurance companies I should expect a few hurdles along the way!


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## malagaman2005

This may help you with the process of transferring vehicle ownership 
Buying & Selling a Car in Spain - AngloINFO Costa Blanca (Spain)

Bear in mind the transfer includes a government 'tax' of 4% of the Haciendas value of the vehicle (not necessarily any resemblance to what you actually pay for it) so for a vehicle valued at !0,000 euros you would pay 400 euros on top of the trafico and Gestors fee. This percentage may have changed since I last bought a vehicle, as things often do in Spain, so apologies if incorrect.


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## xabiaxica

malagaman2005 said:


> This may help you with the process of transferring vehicle ownership
> Buying & Selling a Car in Spain - AngloINFO Costa Blanca (Spain)
> 
> Bear in mind the transfer includes a government 'tax' of 4% of the Haciendas value of the vehicle (not necessarily any resemblance to what you actually pay for it) so for a vehicle valued at !0,000 euros you would pay 400 euros on top of the trafico and Gestors fee. This percentage may have changed since I last bought a vehicle, as things often do in Spain, so apologies if incorrect.


that info isn't quite up to date I think 


there have been reports from various areas that you can no longer buy a car without a resident registration cert.


it seems that owning property as a non-resident is no longer enough


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## dolphcot

mrypg9 said:


> It is in no way complicated or confusing. I bought a two year-old LandRover Discovery from a very reputable LHD specialist in Basingstoke whilst living in Prague. The company delivered it to me in Prague in October and at the end of November I drove it to Spain. At that time I had neither NIE nor was I on the Padron.
> The car was on Spanish plates and had all the necessary documents to enable me to transfer it to my ownership. For change of ownership you need a Solicitud signed by the previous owner which the company selling the vehicle should be able to supply - or at least should contact the previous owner for you.
> You should also check via the internet that there are no outstanding fines on any vehicle you purchase as you, the new owner, will be liable for them.
> When in Spain, take all the required documentation to a gestor who will charge around 200 euros -it is a set fee - for transferring the vehicle into your ownership.
> Couldn't be simpler.
> You do however need to be wary when buying your LHD vehicle in the UK. There are one or two firms with less than A1 reputations but I'm not allowed to name them here.
> I highly recommend the Basingstoke company though.


Hi there I wonder if you are able to message me privately with the names of the unreliable dealers here in the UK? I am just about to buy a LHD car here in order to drive it to Spain and as I dont have much time I dont want to fall into the hands of sharks. Thanks so much. yours kate


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## mrypg9

dolphcot said:


> Hi there I wonder if you are able to message me privately with the names of the unreliable dealers here in the UK? I am just about to buy a LHD car here in order to drive it to Spain and as I dont have much time I dont want to fall into the hands of sharks. Thanks so much. yours kate


I can't really do that as my experiences may not be those of others but I can recommend the company in Basingstoke.


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## dolphcot

These messages are very useful and informative - thanks for all who contributed. It is incredible how the law manages to make it feel difficult and almost illegal to live in two countried (for me Spain and the UK) and to drive between them. I cant keep my own van long term in Spain because of the limited time scale of UK insurance and also the Spanish law about re registering the vehicle but neither can I come home to the UK and drive a LHD Spanish plated car. My partner is Spanish and we need a vehicle we can use in both countries, that we both can drive legally and that we can potentially keep on the road for 6 monthes in either place. This is something that only affects British people as someone from France or Germany has much more freedom to roam.

Has anyone else found a legal solution to living and driving in two countries?


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## dolphcot

hello i am hoping for some reassurance here as i went ahead and bought a LHD Seat Spanish reg from the reputable dealer in Basingstoke and on return to Spain have today found that I cant change the name of the ownerr as easily as I expected. This is because The registered owner is or was director of a Mallorcan company and the car is in the name of the (now defunct) company. All the documents I was given are in the names of individuals and there is no way to show that the Mallorcan company sold the car to me, because it didn't! To buy from a company requires different paperwork from when you buy from individuals. For example you need a Factura/Bill from the old registered owner (in this case the Mallorcan business) and not from a UK dealer who is not named on the car documents.

so today we went to the Jefatura in Sabadell and were told this bad news. What my question here is, has anyone had experience of getting help from LHD car dealers, especially in Basingstoke, after the sale has gone through. Obviously I shall be calling them but I must admit I am nervous of finding that they are unwilling to help. Any suggestions?

We are kicking ourselves that we didnt see this coming but of course trusted that the required paperwork was there

Thanks, in anxiety, Kate


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## Stravinsky

dolphcot said:


> hello i am hoping for some reassurance here as i went ahead and bought a LHD Seat Spanish reg from the reputable dealer in Basingstoke and on return to Spain have today found that I cant change the name of the ownerr as easily as I expected. This is because The registered owner is or was director of a Mallorcan company and the car is in the name of the (now defunct) company. All the documents I was given are in the names of individuals and there is no way to show that the Mallorcan company sold the car to me, because it didn't! To buy from a company requires different paperwork from when you buy from individuals. For example you need a Factura/Bill from the old registered owner (in this case the Mallorcan business) and not from a UK dealer who is not named on the car documents.
> 
> so today we went to the Jefatura in Sabadell and were told this bad news. What my question here is, has anyone had experience of getting help from LHD car dealers, especially in Basingstoke, after the sale has gone through. Obviously I shall be calling them but I must admit I am nervous of finding that they are unwilling to help. Any suggestions?
> 
> We are kicking ourselves that we didnt see this coming but of course trusted that the required paperwork was there
> 
> Thanks, in anxiety, Kate


I'm guessing the car was not permanently exported. Maybe the car dealer has a bill of sale from the company ... the trouble is also though that you will be liable for any charges due on the car also. Outstanding fines, car tax etc. I think your first port of call will have to be the car dealer, for as you say ... the Mallorcan company didnt sell it to you. I assume also it's still registered in their name. Have you spoken to them at all?


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## mrypg9

dolphcot said:


> hello i am hoping for some reassurance here as i went ahead and bought a LHD Seat Spanish reg from the reputable dealer in Basingstoke and on return to Spain have today found that I cant change the name of the ownerr as easily as I expected. This is because The registered owner is or was director of a Mallorcan company and the car is in the name of the (now defunct) company. All the documents I was given are in the names of individuals and there is no way to show that the Mallorcan company sold the car to me, because it didn't! To buy from a company requires different paperwork from when you buy from individuals. For example you need a Factura/Bill from the old registered owner (in this case the Mallorcan business) and not from a UK dealer who is not named on the car documents.
> 
> so today we went to the Jefatura in Sabadell and were told this bad news. What my question here is, has anyone had experience of getting help from LHD car dealers, especially in Basingstoke, after the sale has gone through. Obviously I shall be calling them but I must admit I am nervous of finding that they are unwilling to help. Any suggestions?
> 
> We are kicking ourselves that we didnt see this coming but of course trusted that the required paperwork was there
> 
> Thanks, in anxiety, Kate




Sorry to hear all this, Kate, but nil desperandum!
I was in a similar position in that the original owner of the car I bought now resident in the UK had to sign a Solicitud saying she was the owner and was transferring the car to me. LHD Basingstoke got me every document needed...they contacted the original owner, got p/copies of her NIE, passport and got her to sign and return the Solicitud I sent. They couldn't have been more helpful and I'm sure they will do all they can to help you.
Remember, no problem is insoluble, even in Spain and there are always legalways to resolve issues like yours. A friend bought a car from an owner who could not be traced so no NIE, DNI, nothing....a gestor solved the problem, the car is now hers.

My LandRover hadn't been permanently exported either....that's why transferring to my ownership was so easy.

I would have no hesitation in contacting Colin or Maggie at LHD, they are lovely people and will do all they can to help. After all, their reputation is a sound one and they will want to keep it so!


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## dolphcot

*problems importing LHD*



Stravinsky said:


> I'm guessing the car was not permanently exported. Maybe the car dealer has a bill of sale from the company ... the trouble is also though that you will be liable for any charges due on the car also. Outstanding fines, car tax etc. I think your first port of call will have to be the car dealer, for as you say ... the Mallorcan company didnt sell it to you. I assume also it's still registered in their name. Have you spoken to them at all?


Thanks for reading my tale of woe. 
The car was not exported and is still in the name of the Mallorcan company although the LHD dealer owned it. Even if they gave me a bill of sale it would make no differen e as the documents of the car are not in their name. When you get to the Jefetura here all they care about is the legal owner of the car on their computer.
If it was another individual then the contract to sell would be enough. The problem is that when it is a business that sells then you need a bill from THAT business.

Yes there are debts on the car. One was paid off by the LHD dealer and we have a record of that BUT the debt still appears on the Trafico sustem.
The other is two years of Road tax. The LHD people told us there was one year and we were prepared to pay for that but it feels bad that they lied and actually there are two years. That is all and the car itself is great.

I will ring them today but first we need to make several calls to Mallorca about the debts and then I will call the UK dealers. My question though is that I wonder if anyone here has had experience of how they deal with post sale problems? I know a lot of people here have vought cars in the UK to bring to Spain and oth countries.
Anyone have advise about how this because in the end I have bought a car that Is not accompanied y the necessary papers to make it legally mine. 

going to start our calls now. Kate


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## Stravinsky

Have you read mrypg's post above which seems to give you an answer


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## snikpoh

I do feel sorry for you.

However, this just goes to show that what I (we) have been saying all along is true.

An that is, be VERY, VERY careful when buying a LHD car in UK especially if it is still on Spanish plates.

Personally I can't see the benefit other than if you need to drive down with it and can't fly down.


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## crookesey

snikpoh said:


> I do feel sorry for you.
> 
> However, this just goes to show that what I (we) have been saying all along is true.
> 
> An that is, be VERY, VERY careful when buying a LHD car in UK especially if it is still on Spanish plates.
> 
> *Personally I can't see the benefit other than if you need to drive down with it and can't fly down.*


*
*

Exactly what I was thinking, is there anything equivalent to a UK hpi check in Spain?


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## mrypg9

snikpoh said:


> I do feel sorry for you.
> 
> However, this just goes to show that what I (we) have been saying all along is true.
> 
> An that is, be VERY, VERY careful when buying a LHD car in UK especially if it is still on Spanish plates.
> 
> Personally I can't see the benefit other than if you need to drive down with it and can't fly down.


Yes, caveat emptor. But if you are careful and use a reputable dealer with experience of selling to the Spanish market you will find the process simple.


Reasons for buying LHD in the UK? Well, as you said, driving down, which we did from Prague. We also bought a new LHD Merc via a UK company, from Mercedes Nuremberg. Again, no problem.
Some non- Spanish speakers may feel more comfortable buying in sterling in the UK.

Any sensible person would of course check online that there were no multas or anything else outstanding in the former owner's name.

That's how I bought my Landrover five years ago, delivered to me in Prague as was the Merc. No problems whatsoever with reregistration and no problems with the Disco.
It would be interesting to hear from anyone else who has bought from the UK as those warning against it don't seem to have had personal experience, whether good or bad.


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## mrypg9

dolphcot said:


> Thanks for reading my tale of woe.
> The car was not exported and is still in the name of the Mallorcan company although the LHD dealer owned it. Even if they gave me a bill of sale it would make no differen e as the documents of the car are not in their name. When you get to the Jefetura here all they care about is the legal owner of the car on their computer.
> If it was another individual then the contract to sell would be enough. The problem is that when it is a business that sells then you need a bill from THAT business.
> 
> Yes there are debts on the car. One was paid off by the LHD dealer and we have a record of that BUT the debt still appears on the Trafico sustem.
> The other is two years of Road tax. The LHD people told us there was one year and we were prepared to pay for that but it feels bad that they lied and actually there are two years. That is all and the car itself is great.
> 
> I will ring them today but first we need to make several calls to Mallorca about the debts and then I will call the UK dealers. My question though is that I wonder if anyone here has had experience of how they deal with post sale problems? I know a lot of people here have vought cars in the UK to bring to Spain and oth countries.
> Anyone have advise about how this because in the end I have bought a car that Is not accompanied y the necessary papers to make it legally mine.
> 
> going to start our calls now. Kate


I don't think they lied. They were probably unaware that another year had been racked up. The system here is not like that in the UK.

I and several others have found their sales and after sales service excellent. That is the reason I recommend them so I would expect them to give you all the help you ned.

Seems there's something odd about all this, though. The company concerned must be in liquidation..


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## malagaman2005

crookesey said:


> [/B]
> 
> Exactly what I was thinking, is there anything equivalent to a UK hpi check in Spain?



Tráfico-Informes.es and worth every centimo !!!


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## mrypg9

malagaman2005 said:


> Tráfico-Informes.es and worth every centimo !!!


Sensible people make sure they subscribe and look up their records regularly.. You never know when you may have committed an 'offence'and have 'earned' a multa!


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## dolphcot

hello and thank you for the replies.It does help me feel less alone and Mrypg9 you really helped me this morning get a grip on my panic! I rang the company and Jason was helpful and asked me to send a list of what is needed. I do however feel concerned that the previous owners may not be so willing to do a lot of paperwork .....the requirements in Spain are so much more demanding than in the UK. Obviously my worried brain considers the possibility that there will be no reply from the previous owners. As mrypg9 commenta, there is something strange about the Mallorcan business. I am pretty sure they have liquidated and so it may be hard to get paperwork from that source. If a gestor can deal with all of it then I am happy to take that route but it made sense to me that I first tried to deal with the UK end.

It seems that the Owners really didnt have the right to sell the vehicle ...although the company was theirs, Spanish businesses MUST charge IVA/VAT on sales of company goods. And the sale MUST be done in euros. So how come they sold in sterling to a UK firm. Probably they should have first changed the name on the car to their own names but of course this would have opened up the same can of worms that I am now finding.....the unpaid road tax and the remaining debt on the car. (i believe this was paid by the lhd people but unfortunately the paperwork wasnt completed)

In answer to why we bought a lhd in the UK, we also had to return to Spain by car and we decided not to take my UK van back because of all the problems of circulation with a UK plated vehicle. I thought I was doing the best and most law abiding thing and so am pretty upset to find myself in this mess. We have a dog so we needed to drive....even the Santander boat wont take you with a dog as a foot passenger! I looked into many ways to get home and this appeared to be the best option.

Anyway, I will continue to update you as it is always useful to get the oopinions of this group. At the moment I am waiting for the previous owner to reply but I think I need to find out what happens between me and the dealer if we hear nothing. As it is the car is not going to be possible for me to drive around for much longer. 

Thanks so much for your help

kate


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## gus-lopez

Why not ? It is not illegal. You have the vehicle insured & the lack of road tax is a civil offence & down to the original owner. You can ITV it , if required.
A decent (?) gestoria will soon come up with original owners complete details , necessary to change it into your name , from the DGT site. 
If you read the thread " Certificate of Destruction " you will see that it is possible to change into your name without ever dealing with the nemed owner.


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## dolphcot

that is very cheering! thanks. the owners are in the UK, address unknown, but I think it is time to turn this over to a gestor...I am feeling rather too stressed for comfort. If we can do the ITV at the end of the month with my name still not on the log book then I will feel much better.


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## gus-lopez

The itv shouldn't be a problem. Here no one actually asks who the person presenting the vehicle is.


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## mrypg9

Don't worry, Kate, all will work out for you in the end. It's the Spanish way. As Gus said, a gestor will sort it out.
Am I correct in assuming the owners were Brits? If so, and if they are willing to help, that might make things easier.

All problems are capable of resolution in Spain, it just takes a little longerand the process is more tortuous. After a while you get used to it.

It's interesting for me to observe my son's attitude to this laid-back approach to life. He is here now in his Spanish property and has been helping me organise a Flamenco Night I'm putting on to benefit an animal charity I help run. Today we went to collect tables, chairs, sound system...and because things weren't done in his accustomed precise, punctual, methodical order, he got quite agitated. He is an IT contractor working in the City so is used to things being done in a totally different way. 
When I explained that by the time the show starts tonight everything will be ready - this I know from experience - he launched into a tirade about it being no wonder the Spanish economy is in such a state and so on and so forth...

Poor boy, it probably will take years off his life....

Like you, we drove from Prague because of our dog. No way would we fly him..and no way could we have found a company willing to fly a 54 kilo Rhodesian Ridgeback if we'd wanted to.

Try to relax, all will work out well in the end!


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## dolphcot

Thank you so much for this. Yes the Spanish way and it is hard to get used to....I've even been thinking if I can't cope with this then I should go back to cornwall! The previous owners are not British - one Dutch and the other a South African with an Irish passport! The dealers in the UK seem to only have an email address for them and have forwarded my list of what is needed. If I have faith in human nature I would hope for a response but I must admit I am sceptical. And then what? Who knows.

But I will contact a gestor - perhaps through the RACC as I am a member - and see what they say about sorting it out even if we get no joy from the ex directors of a now defunct business which is the legal owner of the car!

I can't thank you enough for commenting. I am one of those people who want to get things sorted out and legal and it feels hard to be in this no mans land. Also my partner who is local doesn't like getting someone else to do what he can do himself but I assume gestors have ways and means not available to ordinary people.

Good luck with the show! I too am getting involved with animal shelters here and hope to do more once my current motor and home problems are resolved. K


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## dolphcot

hello i thought i would update on what is happening in case anyone is following the story.
i have sent off a detailed list of what papers are needed to the car dealer. they replied saying they had emailled them on to the previous owner. Brief email, no apologies for the mess!
Aftere a few days I sent another email asking for an update and expressing disappointment in the lack of information.The dealers replied saying they had now spoken on the phone to the previous owners (why not before?) who would now open the email and get back to the dealer once they had read it. 
Pause to give time. Nothing happened. so I rang Consumer Advice in the UK who think They may be in breach of contract as I bought something not as described. 
Now I am going to call the dealers again, to give benefit of the doubt and see if anything at all is being done. I am not good at this type of thing but we all have to learn i suppose and I still have a faint hope that it will be sorted out without a fight. I definitely have the impression the dealers dont want to take on responsibility for the problem. I havent yet spoken with the owners, only the guy who sold to me.

Will let you know what happens. I am writing here as It helps to feel some support even in the guise of an internet group. Thanks


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## zenkarma

dolphcot said:


> hello i thought i would update on what is happening in case anyone is following the story.


Yes, I'm following it although I have nothing to add to help you, I'm curious to know how you get the situation resolved. So please continue your updates to conclusion.

Understanding this and how it is resolved and potentially how to avoid a similar situation in the future will I'm sure be of enormous benefit for future forum users.

Good luck!


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## dolphcot

I am sorry it has taken me so long to give the final update on my LHD problem. One of the other reasons I ended up buying this Spanish registered car in the UK was that I injured my ankle driving my van and as we couldn't insure my Spanish partner to share the driving, I ended up leaving the UK van in my garage in Cornwall. We bought the LHD car because we were able to insure it for him and then drive back home to Catalunya with my dog. Then for months I was laid up with the ankle problem as well as the car problem and forgot to get back on here.
Life as lived between two countries seems to throw up these sort of issues fairly regularly!

So, after much angst and many sleepless nights and several tense phone calls with the UK dealer, we got together the required paperwork. The problem which was complicated to resolve was that I needed to prove I had bought the car from the Mallorcan company when in fact I had bought it from the UK dealer. We did manage to shuffle around this issue and when we went to the Trafico for the second time, grasping piles of paperwork, we were finally allowed to change the legal ownership to my name. 

If I were to buy again a LHD in the UK I would :-
- check and double check the papers from the previous owners. The ones we were given were out of date and we were lucky that one NIE was current, but only just!
- never ever buy a car that was previously owned by a company. This is much more complicated than buying from an individual when all you need is a transfer document.
- check for fines and unpaid purchase loans before paying the dealer. I still think they slipped a few things past us hoping we wouldn't notice but in the end I insisted on getting a small refund on the extra years unpaid tax and for some of the fees we faced from the bank loan.
- check and double check the papers for repayments of loans. The UK dealer had repaid the outstanding loan on the car and given us a receipt but not until we got back to Spain did we find that this payment had not been totally processed and so still appeared on the computer records at the Trafico. We had to apply to the bank for confirmation, pay an extra fee, and persuade them to send the papers to us rather than the ex-owners of the car. 

The owners had sold the car to the UK dealer but this was not recognised by the Spanish Trafico. They had not applied for export licence, not paid VAT on sale and the car was still officially belonging to the Mallorcan company (now defunct)

I had the benefit of a Spanish person with me to help check the papers as well as go to Trafico with me but it was still a bit of a nightmare. I was helped by advice from this group, and legal advice from the Consumer Council who felt I could ask for a refund if necessary as the car was not as described in the adverts. I did get help from the UK dealer but I have to say that they were slow to respond to me and never apologised or offered more than the bare minimum of reassurance. 
I didn't deal with the owners who have helped others in this group but they knew of the situation. Noone at the dealers seemed too bothered by my situation until I mentioned I had been in touch with the Consumer Council. 
The dealership says they check all their cars with a Spanish legal representative but when pressed they were quite unwilling to seek legal advice and were surprised by the legalities that we faced. They said they had never had this problem before. I approached several gestors in Spain asking for help and they all said it would be hard to resolve which it was.

Anyway, it ended well and I love my car and it is now legally mine and free from debts so my advisors in this group were quite right in the end. Thank you for your support!

I would advise not buying a Spanish LHD in the UK unless you really need to do it ( as I did) and have time to check and double check all paperwork and outstanding fines and debts. Don't expect that it will all have been done for you....you must know the rules and be prepared to deal with unexpected problems.

Sorry this is long but it was complicated and I hope it may help someone else avoid a similar problem. 

If anyone knows how to get insurance for a Spanish national to drive a UK vehicle then do let me know.

By the way we had no problem insuring my Spanish car after I bought it and before changing the name. We just rang a spanish insurer and it was sorted immediately for our return journey. 

that's it for me. All the best everyone


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## mrypg9

dolphcot said:


> I am sorry it has taken me so long to give the final update on my LHD problem. One of the other reasons I ended up buying this Spanish registered car in the UK was that I injured my ankle driving my van and as we couldn't insure my Spanish partner to share the driving, I ended up leaving the UK van in my garage in Cornwall. We bought the LHD car because we were able to insure it for him and then drive back home to Catalunya with my dog. Then for months I was laid up with the ankle problem as well as the car problem and forgot to get back on here.
> Life as lived between two countries seems to throw up these sort of issues fairly regularly!
> 
> So, after much angst and many sleepless nights and several tense phone calls with the UK dealer, we got together the required paperwork. The problem which was complicated to resolve was that I needed to prove I had bought the car from the Mallorcan company when in fact I had bought it from the UK dealer. We did manage to shuffle around this issue and when we went to the Trafico for the second time, grasping piles of paperwork, we were finally allowed to change the legal ownership to my name.
> 
> If I were to buy again a LHD in the UK I would :-
> - check and double check the papers from the previous owners. The ones we were given were out of date and we were lucky that one NIE was current, but only just!
> - never ever buy a car that was previously owned by a company. This is much more complicated than buying from an individual when all you need is a transfer document.
> - check for fines and unpaid purchase loans before paying the dealer. I still think they slipped a few things past us hoping we wouldn't notice but in the end I insisted on getting a small refund on the extra years unpaid tax and for some of the fees we faced from the bank loan.
> - check and double check the papers for repayments of loans. The UK dealer had repaid the outstanding loan on the car and given us a receipt but not until we got back to Spain did we find that this payment had not been totally processed and so still appeared on the computer records at the Trafico. We had to apply to the bank for confirmation, pay an extra fee, and persuade them to send the papers to us rather than the ex-owners of the car.
> 
> The owners had sold the car to the UK dealer but this was not recognised by the Spanish Trafico. They had not applied for export licence, not paid VAT on sale and the car was still officially belonging to the Mallorcan company (now defunct)
> 
> I had the benefit of a Spanish person with me to help check the papers as well as go to Trafico with me but it was still a bit of a nightmare. I was helped by advice from this group, and legal advice from the Consumer Council who felt I could ask for a refund if necessary as the car was not as described in the adverts. I did get help from the UK dealer but I have to say that they were slow to respond to me and never apologised or offered more than the bare minimum of reassurance.
> I didn't deal with the owners who have helped others in this group but they knew of the situation. Noone at the dealers seemed too bothered by my situation until I mentioned I had been in touch with the Consumer Council.
> The dealership says they check all their cars with a Spanish legal representative but when pressed they were quite unwilling to seek legal advice and were surprised by the legalities that we faced. They said they had never had this problem before. I approached several gestors in Spain asking for help and they all said it would be hard to resolve which it was.
> 
> Anyway, it ended well and I love my car and it is now legally mine and free from debts so my advisors in this group were quite right in the end. Thank you for your support!
> 
> I would advise not buying a Spanish LHD in the UK unless you really need to do it ( as I did) and have time to check and double check all paperwork and outstanding fines and debts. Don't expect that it will all have been done for you....you must know the rules and be prepared to deal with unexpected problems.
> 
> Sorry this is long but it was complicated and I hope it may help someone else avoid a similar problem.
> 
> If anyone knows how to get insurance for a Spanish national to drive a UK vehicle then do let me know.
> 
> By the way we had no problem insuring my Spanish car after I bought it and before changing the name. We just rang a spanish insurer and it was sorted immediately for our return journey.
> 
> that's it for me. All the best everyone



I think you were unlucky....my experience of buying a Spanish LHD car from a reputable UK firm was totally problem- free and I would do it again- in fact it's an option I'm considering.
I think your problem was due to the fact that the vehicle was a company car. Checking that the papers are present and correct and not out of date is not a difficult task, really. Ditto checking for fines.
Forbthe insurance..try Stuart Collins, Swansea.


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## dolphcot

Thank you Mrypg9 and I know you are right I was unlucky and it seemed the reputable company hadn't faced this problem before. 
They did resolve it and alls well that ends well but if I am honest I have to say that they didnt help me feel reassured by their manner of dealing with me which was quite casual and often slow. I had to do a lot of nudging and it was after I wrote an official letter as recommended by the Consumer Council that they got it together more. There never was that feeling of customer service apologising for the problem and promising it would be sorted. I did mention they were recommended on this web site and even this didn't change the attitude. I am sure when they have previous contact they can be very helpful but I had the distinct feeling that I was not a very important name on their list of things to do.

However, I see the positives..... the car is fine, the paperwork got sorted ( with a bit of tweaking and a Lot of help from my Spanish support system) and I got a small refund on the unpaid taxes. I would not say to anyone ' don't do it' but from my experience I would say to be very careful even using 'experts'

Thanks for the insurance name- I'll give them a try as it drives us crazy that I can drive our cars in Spain but my partner cant drive my camper in the UK.

thank you especially for all the past encouragement...it helped keep me calm 

Kate





unluOTE=mrypg9;4480882]I think you were unlucky....my experience of buying a Spanish LHD car from a reputable UK firm was totally problem- free and I would do it again- in fact it's an option I'm considering.
I think your problem was due to the fact that the vehicle was a company car. Checking that the papers are present and correct and not out of date is not a difficult task, really. Ditto checking for fines.
Forbthe insurance..try Stuart Collins, Swansea.[/QUOTE]


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## mrypg9

dolphcot said:


> Thank you Mrypg9 and I know you are right I was unlucky and it seemed the reputable company hadn't faced this problem before.
> They did resolve it and alls well that ends well but if I am honest I have to say that they didnt help me feel reassured by their manner of dealing with me which was quite casual and often slow. I had to do a lot of nudging and it was after I wrote an official letter as recommended by the Consumer Council that they got it together more. There never was that feeling of customer service apologising for the problem and promising it would be sorted. I did mention they were recommended on this web site and even this didn't change the attitude. I am sure when they have previous contact they can be very helpful but I had the distinct feeling that I was not a very important name on their list of things to do.
> 
> However, I see the positives..... the car is fine, the paperwork got sorted ( with a bit of tweaking and a Lot of help from my Spanish support system) and I got a small refund on the unpaid taxes. I would not say to anyone ' don't do it' but from my experience I would say to be very careful even using 'experts'
> 
> Thanks for the insurance name- I'll give them a try as it drives us crazy that I can drive our cars in Spain but my partner cant drive my camper in the UK.
> 
> thank you especially for all the past encouragement...it helped keep me calm
> 
> Kate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> unluOTE=mrypg9;4480882]I think you were unlucky....my experience of buying a Spanish LHD car from a reputable UK firm was totally problem- free and I would do it again- in fact it's an option I'm considering.
> I think your problem was due to the fact that the vehicle was a company car. Checking that the papers are present and correct and not out of date is not a difficult task, really. Ditto checking for fines.
> Forbthe insurance..try Stuart Collins, Swansea.


[/QUOTE]

It's the same with most commercial transactions,Kate..some companies don't want to know once they havegotyour money!
I'm wondering if we used the same UK company...theone I used was in Basingstoke and they were very helpful..and I didn't set foot in the UK once during the process!
I do hope Stuart can help. He specialises in 'odd' insurance cases.
If you can't find him online, pm me, I still have his number somewhere.


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