# Broadband



## meonline (Jan 1, 2009)

Hi, sorry if this is a little off subject. I live in Mijas costa and i'm looking for a cheap reliable wifi internet provider. Has anybody here used mercury internet or vip-hotspot? I am currently using Y-internet and they are expensive and very unreliable! Also they have blocked people on their network from veiwing the websites of their competitors, I'm not sure that is even legal. So on top of their extortionate prices i will have to go to an internet cafe to look at other options! help please!


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## EllieC (May 19, 2008)

What about good ol' telefonica? My service was always good and fast and for 40 euros you got the free national calls as well. Also for a laptop Vodafone was a good option with their WIFI card. They always seem to have deals.




meonline said:


> Hi, sorry if this is a little off subject. I live in Mijas costa and i'm looking for a cheap reliable wifi internet provider. Has anybody here used mercury internet or vip-hotspot? I am currently using Y-internet and they are expensive and very unreliable! Also they have blocked people on their network from veiwing the websites of their competitors, I'm not sure that is even legal. So on top of their extortionate prices i will have to go to an internet cafe to look at other options! help please!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

EllieC said:


> What about good ol' telefonica? My service was always good and fast and for 40 euros you got the free national calls as well. Also for a laptop Vodafone was a good option with their WIFI card. They always seem to have deals.



AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

Jo x


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

"What about good ol' telefonica? My service was always good and fast and for 40 euros you got the free national calls as well. Also for a laptop Vodafone was a good option with their WIFI card. They always seem to have deals."

Was that meant to be funny? If so you have got me in stitches

Telefónica .- a national disgrace. 40 euros? We start at 9 euros including free European calls.

What Telefónica get away with in terms of (1) customer support (2) lack of services (3) is a national disgrace. What do you mean by fast? I mean 6MB+ which I can get in the sticks in Sweden or 12+ in Belgium where we have to upload videos from. 

I have been in telecom for 30 years and have never seen such a shambles!


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## meonline (Jan 1, 2009)

Thanks for the imput but Telephonica......lolol .Also they are not a wifi provider. I can't get a land line due to my falling out with Telefonica. Previous owner of apartment didn't pay bills and Telefonica are too stupid to understand. Wifi please


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Mercury 951 055 676


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Telefónica .- a national disgrace. 40 euros? We start at 9 euros including free European calls.


Problem is Steve - ime - that Telefonica owns a HUGE proportion of the twisted pair circuits. Especially rural "España Profunda" - and there's OFTEN no alternative. 

I've seen cases where problems were exacerbated due to finger pointing twixt TF and others - and as often as not it's actually NOT Telefonicas' problem - but everybody wants it to be.

Yes they're expensive - but ime if I have an issue it gets fixed fast. ADSL of 3Mb is more than enough for MY use - but then I am a dinosaur and still think the wireless is an invention of the devil. Well OK maybe not QUITE that old - but I've lived through the "liberalisation" process in the IT industry - and imo the costs are pretty still much the same overall - just distributed differently. The risks of problems though have increased.

BUT 9 Euros incl Euro calls - I'd appreciate more info. If only for the Euro calls via second line!


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Problem is Steve - ime - that Telefonica owns a HUGE proportion of the twisted pair circuits. Especially rural "España Profunda" - and there's OFTEN no alternative. 

**Indeed ......because they have not invested in their infrastructure! I have spent 30 years in telecom and have dealt with most of the ex monopolies and without any shadow of a doubt Telefónica are the worst I have ever ever had the misfortune of dealing with. They are light years behind the product offers available throughout Northern Europe and their customer service drives me to absolute distraction. 

I've seen cases where problems were exacerbated due to finger pointing twixt TF and others - and as often as not it's actually NOT Telefonicas' problem - but everybody wants it to be.

** I am not trying to defend the likes of Ono and others (I wouldn't!) but Telefónica have not got into their head that landline is dead and the future is VOIP. I work only as a switchless reseller so have no connectivity issues with Telefónica. We run off their lines - only more efficiently and at lower costs. 

Yes they're expensive - but ime if I have an issue it gets fixed fast. ADSL of 3Mb is more than enough for MY use - but then I am a dinosaur and still think the wireless is an invention of the devil. 

**That surprises me knowing what you do for a living!! 

Well OK maybe not QUITE that old - but I've lived through the "liberalisation" process in the IT industry - and imo the costs are pretty still much the same overall - just distributed differently. The risks of problems though have increased.

** On that I would not necessarily disagree surprsingly. Some appaling confusion marketing from the likes of Spantel, Ono, SolNet etc added to some wholesale mis-selling has meant that Spain has NOT enjoyed the benefits of the break-up of the monopoly that have been widely enjoyed in Northern Europe. Telefónica is STILL expensive, 3 MB is a waste of time (even if one could get it!) , their range of products is limited and their customer services are monumentally appalling! 

BUT 9 Euros incl Euro calls - I'd appreciate more info. If only for the Euro calls via second line!

** I'll PM you this afternoon


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> - but then I am a dinosaur and still think the wireless is an invention of the devil.
> 
> **That surprises me knowing what you do for a living!!


Well - you're not alone. 

Simply I am pretty well gifted when it comes to technology. Yet to find anything technical I cant understand or manipulate. But I'm not always THAT convinced it actually improves (my) life.

BUT I have had (maybe too much) experience of seeing technologies that simply do not integrate well with Analogue Computers (brains). Especially folk that have SEVERE issues understanding it. 

Look forward to the PM.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Just done a ping - 1700 dload !! That on a CABLED line. 

My partner is in the absolute middle of nowhere and when it goes below 6MB she *****es like hell.


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Just done a ping - 1700 dload !! That on a CABLED line.


Try a traceroute to somewhere you use and see whether the SERVER yo access is as lucky. 

Just done some ONLINE shopping in NZ - was fine - but some US servers - Oh jeez!!

Just debugged a slow line at work. Madrid-Madrid via Calcutta


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## EllieC (May 19, 2008)

OK so we didn't have 6MBS but for the rural connection I had it was pretty good at 3. for Spain. And yes, telefonica is a WIFI provider, I had WIFI for more than 3 years. Oddly enough, in the past 6 months telefoncia has seemed to be getting their act together. Reminiscent of Belgacom about 8 years ago.....remember? The service has been pleasant (albeit still lacking efficiency...but in English and pleasant) and a great improvement over the previous hang ups whenever you had a problem. They still charge for calls to an ADSL technico which I think is outrageous. All the other providers my friends have used have been useless when it comes to service at least telefonica ain't going anywhere. No I am not a fan of telefonica but, I have seen a dramatic improvement in their service and the rapidity with which they have refunded when I have been overcharged. They have a long way to go to get the public on board but they will always be an option. On another note....Vodafone sucks! After 6 years of service with them the only thing they have going is English speakers to assist. But try getting a bill sorted out or a choke.%$& gag....refund. Was charged 85euros for a call to Australia that the bill said was 50 minutes. We had set the timer for 10 minutes and hung up then! They refused to cooperate with me! But they do have that WIFI card and sometimes offer it for free or really discounted.



meonline said:


> Thanks for the imput but Telephonica......lolol .Also they are not a wifi provider. I can't get a land line due to my falling out with Telefonica. Previous owner of apartment didn't pay bills and Telefonica are too stupid to understand. Wifi please


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Amazing - I have been with Vodafone for 6 years as a high-user business user and I have found them superb. A shining example of what customer service SHOULD be. 

Lo que cura ........


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

chris(madrid) said:


> Try a traceroute to somewhere you use and see whether the SERVER yo access is as lucky.
> 
> **I do not think that in these days a consistent 3MB (even if I pay for 8 is too much to answer for) LOL
> 
> Just debugged a slow line at work. Madrid-Madrid via Calcutta


** That's the world we are in and having worked in India and seen one exchange well "slow" is almost a luxury !


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## EllieC (May 19, 2008)

Just goes to show!! I spent more than 15k euros with Vodafone in 6 years and agree the service people are usually good (many times hang ups too when they weren't able to give the answer I wanted!) but often had 2 or 3 days with no service after a storm - never a refund. And this happened often - say 7 or 8 times per year! Lucky you! But considering the alternatives - Movistar or Orange....the devil you know.....




SteveHall said:


> Amazing - I have been with Vodafone for 6 years as a high-user business user and I have found them superb. A shining example of what customer service SHOULD be.
> 
> Lo que cura ........


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## dosprompt (Nov 8, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Amazing - I have been with Vodafone for 6 years as a high-user business user and I have found them superb. A shining example of what customer service SHOULD be.
> 
> Lo que cura ........


So Steve (Happy New Year) am I right that you said that there is cable for BB where you are in Torrevieja? and who with (Vodaphone?), when we do get out there I will be working in UK during the week and will need a good line for the wife while I'm away!!!


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

No, there are areas in Tvj where there is no Telefónica and you will have to use satellite ot wifi. 

My best fried lives in a very Spanish area no more than 2 kms from the centre and three years later STILL no landlines 

Sad!

Telefónica a national disgrace ..... I may have mentioned that!


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## dosprompt (Nov 8, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> No, there are areas in Tvj where there is no Telefónica and you will have to use satellite ot wifi.
> 
> My best fried lives in a very Spanish area no more than 2 kms from the centre and three years later STILL no landlines
> 
> ...


Thanks, your making me so Sad, with the weather out there, the BB ect, still its must be a + on UK with only 3.5 yrs till end of work the move still looks good, just the sale of UK home will hold things up this end.


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Telefónica a national disgrace ..... I may have mentioned that!


But face it - it's not an individual case!


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## mycal44 (Dec 27, 2008)

*toll costs*



Stravinsky said:


> As time goes on I will add costs of stuff in Spain here for info, so you can build some kind of idea of the cost of living here in Spain. Bear in mind I am in a rural area, 6 kms from the sea in Northern Costa Blanca. CDS, and the cities will be more costly.
> 
> Hope this helps


Hello again as we are driving to Mijas from Faro i intend to use the expressway do you know what the cost of the tolls are as it very difficult to get info for my inquire . Michael


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Michelin group: Tires, car tire maker, guide michelin, michelin map and sustainable mobility will give you the answers


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## davidbfc (Aug 31, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> Problem is Steve - ime - that Telefonica owns a HUGE proportion of the twisted pair circuits. Especially rural "España Profunda" - and there's OFTEN no alternative.
> 
> **Indeed ......because they have not invested in their infrastructure! I have spent 30 years in telecom and have dealt with most of the ex monopolies and without any shadow of a doubt Telefónica are the worst I have ever ever had the misfortune of dealing with. They are light years behind the product offers available throughout Northern Europe and their customer service drives me to absolute distraction.
> 
> ...


It's not just Telefonica that are useless --- Orange are as bad, or worse.

A lady who is a Spanish Nationalspoke with Orange on my behalf, so it is not down to my ropy Spanish that the following occurred:

On 30/9/08 Orange offered me 6Mb broadband, free wifi and 1000 minutes International calls on a 1 year contract but option to cancell in first month, all for 36 euros per month plus line rental. I ordered couple of weeks later.

After umpteen phone calls to chase (and check it was wifi), the router arrived 11 weeks later, on 29/12/08 but it wasn't wifi.

After 2 more weeks of phone calls they said the contract had started on 6 Jan (so I must cancel before 5 Feb if I want to), demanded 39euros for the "free" wifi and said it would be a further 15 days delivery (they must still use pack horses). 

More phone calls of protest brought no improvement so now I'm trying to cancel under the 1st month cancellation clause but guess what --- having accepted this lady talking to them on my behalf for the last 3 and a half months, they insist I speak to them, in Spanish, and confirm my cancellation in writing with full details of my dissatisfaction so that they can decide if the cancellation is justified.

Words fail me --- and by the way, Orange UK's price (to me as an Orange mobile user) for the same service is £15 or one third of Orange Spains price.

You can get in touch with me too, Steve!!!!!!!!!!


Davidbfc


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## crookesey (May 22, 2008)

jojo said:


> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!
> 
> Jo x


Technically speaking.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

davidbfc said:


> It's not just Telefonica that are useless --- Orange are as bad, or worse.
> 
> Words fail me --- and by the way, Orange UK's price (to me as an Orange mobile user) for the same service is £15 or one third of Orange Spains price.
> 
> ...



Just shout /PM if you think I can help 

Steve


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## knixon (Sep 16, 2008)

Telefónica .- a national disgrace. 40 euros? We start at 9 euros including free European calls.

First time ever on forum - where can I get 9 euro's + on the costa del sol ? please !!!


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

knixon said:


> Telefónica .- a national disgrace. 40 euros? We start at 9 euros including free European calls.
> 
> First time ever on forum - where can I get 9 euro's + on the costa del sol ? please !!!


Why are Telefonica a national disgrace? I know some posters have had problems with them, but thats always going to be the case with an organisation of its size.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Hi, 30 years in telecom and I have dealt with almost all the Western European (ex-)monopolies and many of the new contenders. Today with France Telecom (Orange in Spain), Telenor/Ludo 2 (Norway) and Tele2 Sweden 

My BIGGEST complaints against Telefónica 

1) Telefónica abused their monopoly position to keep prices artifically high. Even when they were fined (heavily) by Brussels they refused to deregulate. When the got fined again and were threatened with the full force of EU law, they allowed one competitor and, in effect, created a duopoly. Who was the competitor? Retevision. Who owned Retevision? You guessed, Telefónica. (Board members all ex Telefónica executives) Who had the higher prices? Yes, you guessed, Retevision!When EU found out about this they fined Telefónica AGAIN and made it abundantly clear that licensed operators MUST be allowed to enter a fully deregulated market. 

I was involved in all of this 1998/2001. DT were difficult but efficient, Telecom Italia did not seem to care. "One less client for us, one less piece of hassle." (We took 1,7 million clients from Telecom Italia to Infostrada in 2 years) BT had their moments but normally at least played clean. 

2) Once you had been through THEIR approval process (as well as the Telecom Control Council´s) they then made it almost impossible to deal with them as a tier one licensed reseller. Uni2 were made to jump through hoops and then again to deal with even the most simple process that were fully automated elsewhere. The effect was that customers to the new carriers were getting a 2nd class service as the carrier was not able to provision, bill or give a quality customer service! 

3) Some 12 years later they have some of the very highest wholesale prices in Europe (in fact Western World) and thus keep carries costs high, The result? Some of the highest retail CPM charges in Europe. Figures can be made to prove anything (ask Telefónica) but whether you measure the call charge as a percentage of average income, against the retail price index or the number of grains of sand on the beach Spain is ALWAYS at/near the top of telecom charges. 


4) Technically (ironically!) they are very competent and have a good reputation throughout Europe. The obscenity is that some of this technology is deliberately held back. Their TRAC service is an insult to a post-industrialised society and their constant prevarication and procrastination another insult to their clients. Movistar is one of the most advanced networks in Europe but again Telefónica, as owners, seem more intent on profit than popularity. 

5) Their marketing is based on ¨confusion marketing¨techniques when a huge percentage of their customers have no idea what they are paying for. I have unlimited examples of customers being charged for dial-up accounts AND 24/7 ADSL accounts on the same line. 
Their claw-back techniques are at best dubious and at worst illegal (So they get fined, again!) 
It´s no wonder that they have one of the highest retention rates of all the ex-monopolies. Nobody knows how to leave them and when they try the Telefónica juggernaut kicks in. The customer service which before was "poor" to be will now do most anything to keep the client and/or make it nigh on impossible to leave. "Yes, you can leave us today but you have a Friends and Family option that has x months to run on it ....and you will still be liable for payment." 

6) In short, the entire culture of Telefónica compared with, say, Telia or Telenor disgusts me. 
Why is there this culture? How many ex-presidents of BT have ended in jail in the last 20 years? NIL. How many of the last 4 presidents of Telefónica have? (The jury is out on the incumbent!) 

I would LOVE to have the success in Spain that we have had in Scandinavia, UK, France and Italy but with Telefónica making it so difficult you can see why I (and so many other operators) concentrate elesewhere. I "thought" we had a real chance last year but sadly the whole experience left me a bad taste in the mouth. 

I am always talking to potential operators but even the might of Tele2 (12 million customers in Sweden, with a population of just 9 million) have not broken the monolith that is Telefónica. Yes, we will be announcing something soon (although not here with its no advertising rule!) but I don´t expect to have a client base of 130% of the population within 10 years! Sad.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> Hi, 30 years in telecom and I have dealt with almost all the Western European (ex-)monopolies and many of the new contenders. Today with France Telecom (Orange in Spain), Telenor/Ludo 2 (Norway) and Tele2 Sweden
> 
> My BIGGEST complaints against Telefónica
> 
> ...



....... so in a nutshell????????? lol

Jo xxx


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> Hi, 30 years in telecom and I have dealt with almost all the Western European (ex-)monopolies and many of the new contenders. Today with France Telecom (Orange in Spain), Telenor/Ludo 2 (Norway) and Tele2 Sweden
> 
> My BIGGEST complaints against Telefónica
> 
> ...


Every country you go to you will get people complaining about their "national" phone company. After all, BT never abused their monopoly did they 

In general I have never had a problem with them at the ground level. Yes, they arent cheap ..... but I dont compare them with BT or other countries because .. well .. this is Spain and those are the pricing structures that exist here


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Stravinsky said:


> Every country you go to you will get people complaining about their "national" phone company. After all, BT never abused their monopoly did they
> 
> In general I have never had a problem with them at the ground level. Yes, they arent cheap ..... but I dont compare them with BT or other countries because .. well .. this is Spain and those are the pricing structures that exist here


I had nothing but trouble with telefonica. Since I've moved to the campo I dont have it, I have a wifi thing now and by comparison its wonderful, efficient and much cheaper!

That said, my UK house used to have BT and that was as bad! I guess we all have to have a national "pet hate"

Jo xxx


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Strav, yes people moan everywhere. You would think that Telenor and Telia were two anti-christs if you listened to a lot of my friends in Scandinavia mona about them ........and then I mention their prices/services compared to Telefónica and they usually calm down. 

Look what you can get in the Netherlands for a fraction of the price here and KPN are/were always a GREAT company to deal with. 

The Telefónica rate/service ratio is awful. Punto, final.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

BT absuing their monopoly? Yes, but not in any way as badly as Telefónica. 

I could sit on committees with BT guys without wanting to put them through windows. I sit on my hands when I speak to anybody from Telefónica 

Good job really as most meetings were on about the 8th floor ,,,,and that I have hands-free! 

How many people waited YEARS in Spain for a Telefónica landline? I do not know ANYBODY who can´t/couldn´t get a BT line.


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## Hombre (Sep 10, 2009)

SteveHall said:


> BT absuing their monopoly? Yes, but not in any way as badly as Telefónica.
> 
> I could sit on committees with BT guys without wanting to put them through windows. I sit on my hands when I speak to anybody from Telefónica
> 
> ...


Hear hear !
When we arrived here we had to wait 14 months for a line . We lived in a residential area and all of our neighbours were linked up.
After 6 monthes a guy called and measured the distance from our house to the nearest sub station....told me we would be linked up the next day....never saw him again !
Once , when I rang and complained that it was not the Third World but Western Europe we were living in, the reply was "change your attitude or your request goes to the bottom of the pile." And I thought my request was at the bottom !
One of my neighbours works there and she tells me they are dreadful employers.
A truly awful company and a source of great embarrassment to most Spaniards.


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## nigelsmalley (Dec 31, 2009)

Hi We have a house on the campo so no land line or mobile so we use a satellite system from a company called tariam Not cheap but fast and it works.


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## nigelsmalley (Dec 31, 2009)

we have a house on the campo so no land line or mobile so we use a satellite system from tariam . Not cheap but it is fast and it works.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

nigelsmalley said:


> we have a house on the campo so no land line or mobile so we use a satellite system from tariam . Not cheap but it is fast and it works.



Have you looked into this new "wifi" thing??? We're in the campo too and we looked at all our options (there werent many!!) and found that by far and away the cheapest option was "wifi" - I even have a uk phone number which means cheap uk calls. I can now spend hours chatting to my daughters over there!!



Jo xxx


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## nigelsmalley (Dec 31, 2009)

jojo said:


> Have you looked into this new "wifi" thing??? We're in the campo too and we looked at all our options (there werent many!!) and found that by far and away the cheapest option was "wifi" - I even have a uk phone number which means cheap uk calls. I can now spend hours chatting to my daughters over there!!
> 
> 
> 
> Jo xxx


No wifi as too far from aerials. The maps from tele companies show a big blank area where we live 7kms from tarmac road!!!!!!!!


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## mickcarol (Dec 1, 2009)

meonline said:


> Hi, sorry if this is a little off subject. I live in Mijas costa and i'm looking for a cheap reliable wifi internet provider. Has anybody here used mercury internet or vip-hotspot? I am currently using Y-internet and they are expensive and very unreliable! Also they have blocked people on their network from veiwing the websites of their competitors, I'm not sure that is even legal. So on top of their extortionate prices i will have to go to an internet cafe to look at other options! help please!


I live in Vera (Almeria) and have been using Telefonica ADSL for the past 5 years.
I know it is a bit expensive at €40 per month for 3Mb, but although you hear of
many bad comments about Telefonica, I personally can only give them praise.
It is including Wifi, and if I do ever have a problem, their engineer is here within
a flash to sort it out. In this 5 years, I have not been without a connection, so, I
think it is worth the €40 to have trouble free internet. Also, if I go on vacation for
a couple of months, they suspend the charges for that period, so for me it´s a
win, win situation.:clap2:


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

SteveHall said:


> The Telefónica rate/service ratio is awful. Punto, final.


Hi Steve,
Yes, but compared to what??? another country/market? what's the point in that if they don't have the minerals to come to Spain and make the market theirs?

We have had some experience of "change over" and in my opinion Telefonica are "excellent".. quoting my OH. Yes, they are absolute thieves and robbers, but that's because the competition suck. Not one of them has grasped the fact that if they only come in with great customer service they would have the market on a plate.

At the moment, it's the other way around and TF are loving it. They are lambs to the slaughter. Their commercial guys are blindly fumbling on selling product that their technical teams can't impliment. They don't even check what TF can offer with the current infrustructure. A service which is freely available on the web to any surfer wanting to check max speed available to them on their particular local infrustructure. Then, when the headaches start, TF have 1004 (Free) the competition, in our experience, 902 numbers (cost - and costa bundle from mobiles). Their Helpdesk (in the loosest possible way - never heard of ITIL or any form of service orientation) is helpless and simply quote the book... or, call TF, even though you've been with them for over a week).

OH yes, TF are masters of this. They don't have you because they've passed you on to the company of your choice. So no help from them. The company of your choice don't have you because although the phone calls are now through them, the router's not arrived yet because they've mis-sold you the coupler's capacity and can't actually give you what they contracted.... which TF knew about obviously, but what do they care. They've rented the line, what the other company do with it is now their headache. "They can't supply the 10Mb link????? oh dear) 
"Well, you know, you can always come back to us if you'd like to".

Oh, they are good, make no mistake. In business competition handling terms, they have a VERY easy job.

...and last but not least. Competition... one and a half months, nothing right up to the end with "Can't help you actually" - TF, 2 weeks up and running. Costs? - the same, just a slower... factual and real service as opposed to the 6Mb that never arrived in any case.

Tally. xx
P.S. If you are setting up something in Spain, for goodnes sake, forget the quick buck and make sure the help line number is free. At least that's a proper even stevens start!!!


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

I agree with just about every single world you say, Taliban 

Why is the competition so bad? Because Telefónica make it so difficult for them to play on a level playing field. 

It discourages other operators to work in this country so offer excellent products, quality service and cutting prices elsewhere. 

Prime example Tele2 with 12 million customers in Sweden (pop 9 million), 600,000 in Norway (4,7 million) and not scratched the scratch in Spain (43 million) and have weak offers and average pricing. 


When/if we open here it will be with legendary Scandinavian service levels. Woe betide them if they fall foul of the regulators there! I "thought" we had a runner last year but they proved to be every bit as useless as the rest and I would not put my name to it. Pathetic service


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## Machiavelli (Nov 2, 2008)

You guys have me scared. I'm moving to either Santa Cruz de Tenerife environs or to Los Llanos de Aridane on La Palma. I need reliable internet basically as soon as I arrive or I'll starve. Price is not an issue. I'll pay an unreasonable price for reliability (I pay too much where I am now anyway.) I spoke to a guy who lives on Gran Canaria and he said it shouldn't be a problem getting a land line and broadband pretty quickly. But I'm so afraid of some nightmare scenario that I think I will just find a place that already has internet. 

1) Does that seem wise or is that an overreaction? 
2) Also, any thoughts about broadband in either of those locations? 
3) And when people rent apartments that have internet, how does that work? Is it in the landlord's name? 

Thanks


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