# Racism in Australia



## JulianK (Jun 17, 2007)

Hi, I hope I am not putting a damper on anything by raising this question, but I have four children and have dealt with racism quite a bit in the US. I am curious how the "white" population deals with blacks there. I mean, are Aussies superficial like that (like many white Americans)? I want them to experience what I believe is an awesome country, but if it is going to be worse for them- I don't want to put them through anything like that.


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## newlife33 (Aug 1, 2007)

Unfortunately, I think racism is a problem no matter where you go. Luckily, I do not think Australia is as bad as the USA, because people here are not as scared as everyone in the USA is of each other.

The only thing you can do is teach your children how to make good friends and avoid racist situations.


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## april (Jul 22, 2007)

A few years back I asked my Pacific-Islander friends if they have trouble with racism, and they said no. I guess Aborigines would though. 

When my Japanese boyfriend was in Australia for a holiday (this is before he met me - a white Aussie woman living in Japan), he commented to his middle-eastern-looking taxi driver that Australia seems like a great place to live, and the taxi driver told him it wasn't because Aussies are really racist. 
I guess it's all relative though. From what I know about America's situation through media (which I take with a grain of salt) and some discussions with Americans over here in Japan, the Australian situation is very different to America. People aren't as sensitive and uptight about the topic of race.

As an aside, some of my black friends here in Japan constantly roll their eyes because Japanese people keep asking them about hip hop! Actually, many immigrants from Ghana and Nigeria have made a good living from the stereotype by opening hiphop clothing stores and posing as American rappers!


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## Hazel (May 30, 2007)

I really think it depends on the individual. I live in a gated complex and my white neighbour has two adorable little kids of colour (her husband is black) and they are very popular and totally accepted by all of us. I think some of the other kids are enchanted by them because they look so exotic and interesting


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## synthia (Apr 18, 2007)

In the US it pretty much depends on the situation you are in, too. I can go to a shopping mall where I live in Florida and see mixed race couples and groups of friends, and they all get along well. But when I went to work, the black people all ate lunch together. I did have a couple of black friends at work who thought that was dumb, and didn't join in.

I've always thought it was a function of numbers. I used to meet a lot of Europeans who just couldn't understand why we couldn't solve our race problems. Of course, they came from countries that had a homogeneous racial and cultural population. Now that has changed in a lot of these countries, and they are having problems.

Australians don't have a great reputation in this area, but then our reputation is, I think, worse than reality. Some people would assume that every time you walked out the door you would be called names, and maybe have a gun drawn on you!

There's a thread on here called, I think, 'looking for another point of view' and an American and Australian kind of got into it. You might want to look at that.


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## kendra (Aug 4, 2007)

*Racism in Oz*

Gday Julian
I honestly think very few Aussies are racist. The main problem is as I saw on another thread, that among your average Aussies, it is sort of a sign of affection to insult or "stir" each other.Politeness indicates reserve or standoffishness.
For example, if someone had just met me, I would be addressed as Kendra (first names only used here). After a couple of months of friendship the same person if I didnt see them at first might call out "oi ya snobby fat bugga".
To express their happiness at seeing me!
I live in a small country town. The community varies from 85 year old millionaires to average working people. All addressed by their first names.
also Italian friends "Gday ya wog *******s have a beer"
or our gay friends "so how ya going ya lezzos" Fat friends "geez still on a good paddock mate" 
I think you get the idea!I think the best example is when my son was 7 years old and had a chinese classmate. He came home and said "Mum, Peter is different to the other kids" I was about to go into my 'people of all colours are the same' lecture when he said" he's fat. But his folks own a restaurant so that explains it" 
Come to Oz, mate. You'll love it.


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## newtoOZ (May 24, 2007)

Someone warns you not to do that when you leave, right?


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## kendra (Aug 4, 2007)

*Racism in oz*

Yeah, were not actually neanderthals. Its just that its hard to describe the oz way of insulting each other in a friendly fashion without some examples.
Maybe a better description of oz attitude can be seen at sporting events where people of all colours sit together - actually wearing opposing team scarves and hats without arguing and certainly with no need for fences.
Also, religious differences are ignored.In oz, youre free to select the deity of your choice and no-one cares. Like venereal disease, its seen as your own business as long as you keep it to yourself and dont try to pass it on!


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## newtoOZ (May 24, 2007)

Well, we don't have to fence off people from different sides in the US either. Soccer hooligans are pretty much a British specialty, I think. And we've always had religious freedom. But we had a ton of racism, and still do, though it is a lot better.

But even before the era of 'politically correct', name-calling was not supposed to be something that well-brought-up people did.


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## apple (Jun 8, 2007)

I would say, the further you are away from city, the nicer the people are. I was at Manly 2 weeks ago and the people there are so nice.


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## Penguins_Pet_Pumpkin (Jul 16, 2007)

I'm sort of surprised no one has pointed this out yet: America and Australia are both very big places. You can't say "Americans are..." or "Australians are..." well, anything. It depends upon where you are. And even then it various from one individual to another.

I grew up in Seattle and the only racial tension I ever witnessed in my entire life was when they were busing children to schools out of their own areas to try to force them to learn tolerance. The racial tension consisted of the black children beating up the white children because they weren't happy being bused, and that was how they displayed their displeasure.

Again, that's not all of them. That was a select few, who made everyone else look bad.

The busing actually worked very well for me personally, as I met one of my best friends when she was bused to my school. Obviously, she wasn't beating anyone up. 

By the way, isn't saying, "all (insert any nationality here) are..." the way prejudice gets going in the first place?


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## kendra (Aug 4, 2007)

A very good point. I Suppose there probably are some racist Aussies, but racists are quite rightly viewed as obnoxious scum by 99 percent of Aussies.
In fact our history celebrates the Eureka stockade rebellion against unfair working conditions as the pure Aussie spirit. The rebels were poor miners ,European, Asian, white and African Americans who banded together for a fair go for all workers. So anyone being racist is in fact un-Australian.


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## pookie (Dec 28, 2008)

*Complicated issue*

I was born in Australia to an English family. Growing up I had friends from various countries, many from south east asia. I never really thought about race growing up but looking back people did separate into there own ethnic groups the older they became. I think that Kendra over simplifies the issue of race relations in Australia and I can assure readers that we are not all the stereo typical okka, crude or vulgar. I have lived in both america and london and the issue of race is certainly more prominant in those places, so much so it inspired me to take a degree in sociology. What seems to be the problem in todays western society is not simply race or skin colour but culture and religion. The problem isn't looking different but acting different. This is usally where problems start to surface, particularly when minority groups demand specifc treatment/services ect. It is fine for Kendra to say we welcome all as long as they don't interfere with "us" or "our" way of life but differences will ultimately surface, I have seen it in both the uk and america. So to answer your question some people are very nice in Australia some people are ******s, just like everywhere else. The grass isn't always greener.......... in fact in australia it's more likely to be brown.


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi:

Been here five years and haven't encountered racism. I live in Sydney and in the Northern Beaches and they're laid back people up here (as befits beach side suburbs). You will be noticed for sure as there are not many 'black' people, sure lots of tan white people (and some tan darker than some 'black' people). But most of the attention will be of the friendly sort. I've found generally if you're friendly to Aussies they're more than friendly in return. 

I am sure racism exists here, but just not that prevalent and not in large concentrated groups.

I grew up in the US (New York) and probably encountered more there than here, but I also spent more than 25 yrs there and so far only 5 here. Do I expect more racism here, not really, just somehow Australia has got this rep and I think it's historical because they did treat their indigenous peoples very badly in the past.

I don't think it will be worse for them if you move here. It's just too wonderful a place for that.

Good luck 



JulianK said:


> Hi, I hope I am not putting a damper on anything by raising this question, but I have four children and have dealt with racism quite a bit in the US. I am curious how the "white" population deals with blacks there. I mean, are Aussies superficial like that (like many white Americans)? I want them to experience what I believe is an awesome country, but if it is going to be worse for them- I don't want to put them through anything like that.


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## aussieland (Oct 14, 2008)

Hi All,

I am from INDIA and was there in Melbourne for around 3 months on 457 VISA and personally feeling even I had alot of apprehensions before going to OZ.
But I can happily say from my experience that all my apprehensions were proved wrong.
I didn’t face any racial stuff over there and I am very delighted to say that my prejudices were proved wrong.
I know I was there for short time but that experience was good enough for me to build that faith in me.

Thanks
Pankaj


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

JulianK said:


> Hi, I hope I am not putting a damper on anything by raising this question, but I have four children and have dealt with racism quite a bit in the US. I am curious how the "white" population deals with blacks there. I mean, are Aussies superficial like that (like many white Americans)? I want them to experience what I believe is an awesome country, but if it is going to be worse for them- I don't want to put them through anything like that.


Honest answer time : Australians are ware of any culture/people that don't subscribe to theirs. Its a PLU society (people like us) and if you watch AFL and love the lifestyle you're in no matter what colour or creed.

There are however problems (cultural related) of Africans who live outside these premises that just don't integrate - this causes problems and resentment. (not dissimilar to the problems Black people have in the United Kingdom)

PS I use the term Black to indicate people of African Origin, NOT mixed race people.


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

We don't understand AFL and worst of all we don't really drink (alcohol that is) and we're still okay 

Attitude is everything - people who move here as well as Aussies. 

Karen.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

And you live in SA......ouch.... You're not one Jim Jone's minions, are you?

I think Attitude is the WRONG word.


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

Halo said:


> And you live in SA......ouch.... You're not one Jim Jone's minions, are you?
> 
> I think Attitude is the WRONG word.


We love Mount Gambier, SA - we could have lived anywhere but chose here. 

No definitely not one of Jim Jone's minions - we love life far to much 

What is the right word if it's not attitude...?

Karen.

P.S I'm mixed race (part Jamaican, part English with some Indian too).


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm

LOL, I'll take your word for it....... No beer with your tacho's while watching AFL - tsk tsk

Not sure, perhaps "acceptance" of the country you have adopted.... When I am in Dubai I don't walk the street with a VB in my hand..... kind thing.

Karl

PS We are all mixed race in some shape or form, its our culture that define who we are.... that and intelligence.


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## velder (Apr 14, 2008)

There's racism everywhere. I am an Australian citizen and have been since I was 6y/o (24 years ago). I am currently living in Asia and have lived in three Asian countries over the recent years. In all three I have encountered racism more than in Oz and I am Asian! It's not so much 'racism' but more so that I am a foreigner here and just different culturally - I say this because the hubby is 'white' and it just boils down to being or acting different. In Oz I'd say a handful of times I'd encountered racism but all have been 'mild'. For me (since it's 'mild') it's down to attitude...who cares what the ****** think! I understand though your concern about your kids. I guess like any place you may chose to settle in, you've got to be comfortable in the area. If I were in your position (I have two kids), I would not hesitate to ask the schools how they would deal with cultural difference/racism/bullying. Good luck!

I have to say, I am counting down the days until my next Oz visit in just over two week! It's been a year and a half since I've been back and miss it terribly, especially the summer. I just want to relax and say what I want and do what I like to do. I love the Australian lifestyle which I absolutely miss!!!!!!!!!!


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## jockopaul (Aug 30, 2008)

I think the whole world is of the opinion that black people are the only people in the world to be subject to racism,,, its global,, if you were in a predominatly black area in the uk or in the US you would be as much a target for racism for being white, or anywere else in the world were there are a prodomenant evil dangerous elemant who disguise themselves as opressed by indifference,, no offence but loose the chip and get involved in your comunity ive lived in tottenam in london were there were black clubs and mixed clubs make of that what you will,, racism is not reserved for black skins,, its ignorance and an excuse for communities to be segregated..


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Correct, try and marry into a Jamaican family (my mate did) and you'lll see it up close. Its all about education and culture - People need more of the former and less of the latter.


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

Halo said:


> Correct, try and marry into a Jamaican family (my mate did) and you'lll see it up close. Its all about education and culture - People need more of the former and less of the latter.


Not all Jamaican families are the same  Again is depends on education.....


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

kaz101 said:


> Not all Jamaican families are the same  Again is depends on education.....


Exactly, I was merely pointing out that racism is not a one way street......... I'm just sick of if I tell one of my employee's, who are of a different colour/religion than myself, off for not doing their job properly I don't want the race card thrown in my face thank you.


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## velder (Apr 14, 2008)

Perhaps you took my comment too seriously. There's no chip here


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## IrishAngel (Mar 12, 2008)

i have met some lovely aussies here and because we are irish and obviously white, they tell us how they love to see the Irish, english, scottish etc coming here cos "anything is better than the asians" couldnt believe it when i heard it, we are living in a lovely area where everyone is quite well off and well educated - completely intolerent, wont make friends with people of colour cos they dont want their kids in mixed marriages etc, but despite all the racial comments i still love the oul aussie friends we have made... if we were coloured they just wouldnt tell us their views, but i'm sure they would still be NICE to us.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Racism is alive and well ALL around the world (just take a look at Israel circa 2009).... We just need to find places where we don't have to be exposed to it on a daily basis. Melbourne is pretty progressive BUT ship 100000 of group X and watch sparks fly.


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## jockopaul (Aug 30, 2008)

velder said:


> Perhaps you took my comment too seriously. There's no chip here


Im sure your childrens welfare is a very serious consideration for any parent, your comments were not taken lightly as a result of this,, and because of so much distruction caused by racial hatred at present globaly,, and mabey its even me thats got the chip,, my reaction was to make the point that there is as much racial discord around the world justified for all sorts of religious and cultural reasoning,, when the plain truth of the matter is that the devil wears many disguises,, and evil is alive and well in many places were race and cultural difference is worn as a mask for hatred.. and a lot of the time people forget that white people with some or no particular attachment to a specific religion or culture have as much of a hard time with being racially abused as others for having there own opinion and attitudes,, as in the case of many children in the UK now are not allowed to sing baba black sheep in school for instance and all sorts of christian and pagan religious festivals our children have enjoyed over the years are being erased from school for example easter, halloween, guy fawkes, and Christmas, not to mention all the regional festivals that our children have enjoyed also are being banned were there are a high number of muslim or asian children enrolled in British schools and why?? so as not to offend the ethnic children,, and there is a lot of other political correct nonsense which has no bearing on cultural or racial ignorance, and only serves to deny my children there own cultural and religous heritage, and for this i feel that my and my childrens right to free think and speak is being taken from us.. there are however schools who maintain all cultural and religious festivals who include all faiths,, with the option for children to opt out of these activities if they wish,, so there can be a balanced attitude to all races,, but im sure these schools are not attended by a high number of ethnic children.. Il give you an example of another contradiction..we do not have white music awards,, why??,,well what is white music?? and of course that would be unthinkable and considered racist,, so why do we have black music awards?? and what is black music,, does music have a colour?? once apon a time i thought music was just music and it could be all colours ,, untill there were no more baba black sheep taught to children in school. young people are very aware of the music industry and can also make distinctions.. so you can understand my confusion at these double standards even if you do not see my point.. can i also mention that my father is Swedish and at one time was an outsider and migrant to the UK who gave us all very Swedish names for the 1960,s... we had a lot of hard times with teasing and bullying at school when we were children we were at times culturally different..but I however do not see myself now nor then as an outsider or different and do not feel we were racially abused,, although thats exactly what it was,, but we werent black,, so it was never established as racial prejudice ,, and im so glad it wasnt,, and your children will probibly be able to do the same if they get involved in the neighbourhood as we did and be part of the community there will always be children who dont like other children for no particular reason cultures who dont like the ideals of other cultures, religious indifference its how we percieve this and how we choose to intergrate and engage that matters the most .. i do however wish you well and hope that your move to Ausrtalia is as good as it can be.. as you surely would not be considering a move to Australia if you were seriously worried about recism in a big way there... 
good luck helena


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

jockopaul said:


> Il give you an example we do not have white music awards,, why??,,well what is white music?? and of course that would be unthinkable and considered racist,, so why do we have black music awards?? and what is black music,, does music have a colour?? once apon a time i thought music was just music and it could be all colours ,, untill there were no more baba black sheep taught to children in school.. so you can understand my confusion at these double standards even if you do not see my point.. i do however wish you well and hope that your move to Ausrtalia is as good as it can be..
> good luck helena


My opinion is that there are no white music awards because being white in the UK was the norm. I remember when I used to get annoyed when on the news it would says that two men committed a crime and one was black. It was assumed that you knew that the other was white. Things have changed now. 

People who stop the Christmas festivities are usually only doing it because of how they think the minority religions feel. My parents live in Luton and when I was last there at Christmas shops had been told that they could only have 'Happy Holidays' on the windows and there are was no red any where (since I believe that can offend Muslims). The interesting thing there is that it's not Muslims or other religions that actually care - someone else has decided it on their behalf! 

In Australia we still celebrate all the festivals - even Christmas  Okay we don't have Guy Fawkes but that's because it'd have no real meaning here. 

Regards,
Karen


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## Waz (Dec 15, 2008)

Spot on Kaz, as person on enthnic minority it annoys the hell out me when I hear a local council or some people have banned Christmas festivities because it may offend a minority religion. The truth is we have never requested or want anything like this happening. I live in north of England and I can tell you we enjoy Christmas festivities and want it to carry on. 



kaz101 said:


> My opinion is that there are no white music awards because being white in the UK was the norm. I remember when I used to get annoyed when on the news it would says that two men committed a crime and one was black. It was assumed that you knew that the other was white. Things have changed now.
> 
> People who stop the Christmas festivities are usually only doing it because of how they think the minority religions feel. My parents live in Luton and when I was last there at Christmas shops had been told that they could only have 'Happy Holidays' on the windows and there are was no red any where (since I believe that can offend Muslims). The interesting thing there is that it's not Muslims or other religions that actually care - someone else has decided it on their behalf!
> 
> ...


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## snorkeprincess (Jan 5, 2009)

JulianK said:


> Hi, I hope I am not putting a damper on anything by raising this question, but I have four children and have dealt with racism quite a bit in the US. I am curious how the "white" population deals with blacks there. I mean, are Aussies superficial like that (like many white Americans)? I want them to experience what I believe is an awesome country, but if it is going to be worse for them- I don't want to put them through anything like that.


Hi Julian,
sad to say that racism exists everywhere and i doubt it'll ever go away.
BUT that should not prevent you from coming to Australia. This is a wonderful country. I am asian and have been in Sydney since Aug 08 and have been fortunate to only have met really nice and friendly aussies  in fact, it's so multicultural here that sometimes i forget that i'm not back in Singapore! 

p/s you'd just have to get accustomed to some loudmouths


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## velder (Apr 14, 2008)

Halo said:


> Exactly, I was merely pointing out that racism is not a one way street......... I'm just sick of if I tell one of my employee's, who are of a different colour/religion than myself, off for not doing their job properly I don't want the race card thrown in my face thank you.


I was not and am not advocating that racism is a one-way street. I was merely giving my personal experience as an asian ofcourse. I made mention of the hubby being caucasian because we have both experienced some form of racism or cultural barrier. That was my point, _it does not matter what race you are._

I could go on writing (actually I don't have time) but I hope you get the tone of my voice by this


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## manish1980 (Nov 8, 2008)

Indian student been racism argeted

Four Indian students assaulted in Melbourne-News-Videos-The Times of India


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## cintai (Feb 10, 2009)

Yah Manish even I was shocked to see this news. Was about to post the same. It is really horrible. All guys are from Andhra pradhesh.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

cintai said:


> Yah Manish even I was shocked to see this news. Was about to post the same. It is really horrible. All guys are from Andhra pradhesh.



Its an undeniable truth folks that asians esp Indians are the victims of the most daunting racist attacks in Australia. And such hate crimes have surged in past two years and will increase more as more and more Indian people are pouring in Australia. I always follow Australian news very closely and read about hundreds of such incidents in past 2 years.

Whats worst is nobody saves you and people will just watch and stay quiet instead of stopping the hooligans. Even the police and medical agencies discrminate against Indians..My friends told me, when they followed up why emergency is not arriving, after their colleague was critical injured by Aussies, the operator told him "Learn to wait, he hasn't died yet.."


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

But it never makes the news when people live in peace and harmony does it?

I had family that used to live in Brixton (South London, UK) and going back some years (over 20 in fact!) there were riots there. It was all over the newspapers, radio, tv etc. the fact that for the rest of the time everyone of all nationalities were getting along peacefully was never reported. 

It only takes a few bad apples to make the headlines - it doesn't mean that everyone thinks like that or behaves like that. 

We have family (Asian) living in Sydney and Brisbane and they love Australia. 

Regards,
Karen


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

mpgrewal said:


> Whats worst is nobody saves you and people will just watch and stay quiet instead of stopping the hooligans. Even the police and medical agencies discrminate against Indians..My friends told me, when they followed up why emergency is not arriving, after their colleague was critical injured by Aussies, the operator told him "Learn to wait, he hasn't died yet.."


If you really believe that then do you mind me asking why you are moving here? That's not asked in a nasty tone but purely out of curiosity.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

kaz101 said:


> If you really believe that then do you mind me asking why you are moving here? That's not asked in a nasty tone but purely out of curiosity.


So that I can bring some change. You have to be in the system to change the system. Similary you have to be in the country to change the country


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

these attacks are not just australia but everywhere in the world and I guess Karen is right, no one boasts about peace and happiness but one bad incident make headlines.


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## Mingo (Mar 20, 2009)

mpgrewal said:


> Whats worst is nobody saves you and people will just watch and stay quiet instead of stopping the hooligans.


There's been two good samaritans killed in Australia in the past couple of years (that I know of). I dunno about anyone else, but that would sure as hell be in the back of my head if a group of people were attacking one person. Ring the police sure, help out if there's a group of other people helping out sure, but otherwise there'd be doubts in my mind, dunno about anyone else.


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## weelee (Sep 15, 2008)

mpgrewal said:


> So that I can bring some change. You have to be in the system to change the system. Similary you have to be in the country to change the country


what do you mean bring some change, I dont want to seem negative as I believe everyone is entitled to an opinion but to go to another country with the idea of making changes is in my opinion bordering on arrogant and could lead to resentment. Please forgive me if I have picked up on this wrong. Live and let live is what I have always believed in. Remember a stranger is a friend you have not made yet

weelee


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

I think I know what mpgrewal meant (and don't forgot the smiling icons either) but I know that if I really thought that Australia was inherently racist I wouldn't have moved here. 

That doesn't mean that there aren't racists here (as in other countries) and that there aren't ignorant people here (as in other countries), but I don't think it's inherently racist. 

Maybe I have a slightly different perspective  because I've received racism from black people and white people (which was back in the UK) because I'm mixed race.

Regards,
Karen


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

kaz101 said:


> I think I know what mpgrewal meant (and don't forgot the smiling icons either) but I know that if I really thought that Australia was inherently racist I wouldn't have moved here.
> 
> That doesn't mean that there aren't racists here (as in other countries) and that there aren't ignorant people here (as in other countries), but I don't think it's inherently racist.
> 
> ...


The amount of racism you face in any country depends on your ethnicity, looks and accent. Sadly Indians in Australia have been the biggest soft target of majority of racist attacks because they are gullible, vulnerable and non-violent(they don't resist just tolerate) . 

I agree most you of white and mixed race might never have seem as much racism as a poor Indian student who is being slurred jibes and thrown punches when he crosses past a herd of proud Oz blokes. I am in contact with my fellows who tell their plight that how they are discriminated everywhere in Australia.

We prospect migrants have big expectations from Australia as they proclaim themselves to be a multi-cultural, tolerant and developed nation. With this level of racist mentality (where they think every Indian to be a job snatcher, smelly and inferior) I don't see any difference between between India and Australia.

Its not about a lazy statement "If you think Australia is bad, don't come here", but its about a active change "Yes, we Australians will show you that we treat everybody equal and will severely punish all Australians who perpeterate racist crime". The latter is yet to be started. That's a CHANGE which is reqd.


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Sorry, can't agree with you there. I've been here 6 years and am not light skinned or mixed-race. I work with Indians here in my office and proud Oz blokes as well. Nobody's throwing punches, I go to the mall with them, and nobody is throwing punches. You can make a big thing about all the 'racism' in Australia, but I've yet to see it towards me or my Indian co-workers. 

These are young men, in their 20s and 30s and they all seem to be quite happy here. These guys came here as immigrants, found their jobs, and are living safe and happy lives. 

Now if any one of them was being bashed or discriminated against I would be hearing about it from them, but it's not. So where are you getting your info from? 



mpgrewal said:


> The amount of racism you face in any country depends on your ethnicity, looks and accent. Sadly Indians in Australia have been the biggest soft target of majority of racist attacks because they are gullible, vulnerable and non-violent(they don't resist just tolerate) .
> 
> I agree most you of white and mixed race might never have seem as much racism as a poor Indian student who is being slurred jibes and thrown punches when he crosses past a herd of proud Oz blokes. I am in contact with my fellows who tell their plight that how they are discriminated everywhere in Australia.
> 
> ...


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

amaslam said:


> Sorry, can't agree with you there. I've been here 6 years and am not light skinned or mixed-race. I work with Indians here in my office and proud Oz blokes as well. Nobody's throwing punches, I go to the mall with them, and nobody is throwing punches. You can make a big thing about all the 'racism' in Australia, but I've yet to see it towards me or my Indian co-workers.
> 
> These are young men, in their 20s and 30s and they all seem to be quite happy here. These guys came here as immigrants, found their jobs, and are living safe and happy lives.
> 
> Now if any one of them was being bashed or discriminated against I would be hearing about it from them, but it's not. So where are you getting your info from?


How many of your Indian friends are students studying in Univ these days? Do you know by how much percentage have these incidents increased in past one year? If you see the stats, majority of physical manhandling crimes are done by students. I understand people in corporates get mature. Then diplomatic racism starts like keeping locals ahead when it comes to promotions, etc. As I said earlier, many people never face it and won't agree but that doesn't hide the fact. 

My agenda is not to disparage Oz as a whole (because I know there are lot of good and helping people like you and other fellow forumers) but to shed light on less known brutalities on migrants. I am too optimistic that things will change or improve to some extent before I/we land there.


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

why are just a couple of incidents making Indians so insecure? I dont understand this.
I am sure people might have read the news of rapes murders etc by Indian living abroad, I am posting the links below
Indian student charged with raping teenager in Australia - Indians Abroad - World - The Times of India
'Dr Death' Patel to face trial - Indians Abroad - World - The Times of India
Seven Indian illegal immigrants arrested in UK - Indians Abroad - World - The Times of India

these are three different incidents where Indians are not being targeted but they are a part of misdeeds, now I dont hear people saying, Oh all Indians are rapists or murderers or illegal immigrants.

Its easy to generalise and call the entire race bad or racist but end of the day, remember, its a couple of them who give a bad name to the entire race of millions.

I have more thn two dozen friends living all over AU and another handful in US, not once have I heard of them or anyone around them being abused or attacked.


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

mp, did u read the newspaper a couple of months ago, a teenager (Kachroo was his name), studying in medical school in Himachal was murdered. Every second month there is something about a kid being raped/murdered/ragged/tortured.. I can give you so many examples. It happens everywhere.

One has his life in his hands, you can boast and be a target or u can act sensibly and make friends and keep urself safe.

I know atleast 15-20 students, studying in AU and are safe, dont complain, happy and never heard of racist discrimination. and these are very close friends not just acquaintances.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

mpgrewal said:


> As I said earlier, many people never face it and won't agree but that doesn't hide the fact.


:tongue: 
OK lets end this.. I have made my point.


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

i dont believe this, one person out of 10 million get attacked because of his own stupidity by two people and u say all ten million are at risk. and u blame the other 10 million for those 2 peoples actions.

it is not about not accepting it, its about being practical. Blame game doesnt take anyone anywhere. 

anyway, to each his own. Can anyone control anyone's thoughts?  no one can.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

mpgrewal said:


> My agenda is not to disparage Oz as a whole (because I know there are lot of good and helping people like you and other fellow forumers)


:tongue:

So my agenda is to blame everybody..wow.. you need to quit reading between the lines


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

mp, are u a libran by any chance? i mean ur sun sign


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

anj1976 said:


> mp, are u a libran by any chance? i mean ur sun sign


No Cancerian.. born fighter  .. I love debates, arguments...pumps up my adrenaline.


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

haha.. great


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## aussieland (Oct 14, 2008)

Hi,
i can see what MP is trying to say...there have been incidents...specially yesterdays one in melbourne...i can say that i m scrared abit....

but having said that...i agree with anj over here that its some of the incidents...which can happen anywhere else also...INDIA also.....

wat i can say with my personal exp that aussieland is gr8 country with very rich n diversfied culture:clap2:...n i didnt see anythign of this sort....but again very sad about these incidents...

hoping that all comes down....with no more of these incidents...


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Lets not mention the class system in India then.

Look people, don't get all sensitive about this issue... People have real concerns. Jobs, are only part of the issue.... People feel threatened by other cultures. One only has to get into a cab to experience the "diversity" Bangra tunes while the cabbie chats away all gobbledygook to his mate... One would think its down town Delhi  - Jokes aside, most Aussies and Brits etc don't mind migration, what the majority don't want are people that come over and don't seem to want to integrate (hence the problem in Adelaide with the Somali community) or "seem" not to. When in Rome and all that.

Compared to most countries Australia is heaven for the migrant
FIFO people - remember there are plenty of other countries you can apply to move to.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

Alas! Another student is racially stabbed today
Another Indian student stabbed

To all those fellow forumers who thought that I blew the issue out of propotion, and it were just 2 or 3 attacks on Indians so far.. 

Now I come equipped with statistics and truthful facts. You can view them and decide yourself that was my concern that Aussie is about to top #1 racist country list is right or wrong.
500 racist attacks on Indian Students in past six months
Amaslam and Anj, now you should know where this information is coming from. 
Indian Students facing hell


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## april (Jul 22, 2007)

mpgrewal said:


> Alas! Another student is racially stabbed today
> Another Indian student stabbed
> 
> To all those fellow forumers who thought that I blew the issue out of propotion, and it were just 2 or 3 attacks on Indians so far..
> ...



Who are attacking the students? I vaguely remember reading somewhere and saw a statistic on the internet that it was other Indian and international students. Apparently some are very strapped for cash and can't find jobs because they only had enough money for tuition and the Australian government let them come here to study even though their English ability is very poor.


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

OK, here are my truthful facts:
Assault statistics

Assaults are 840/100,000 population

And
Indian students are making a beeline to study Down Under | WYSTC Blog

As of Mar 2009 there are 75,000 Indian students in AU learning institutions. 


Even then the AU government is not ignoring the problem:
Helpline thrown to Indian students | theage.com.au

And if the AU people really didn't want Indian students to come to AU they certainly wouldn't be spending millions of $AU to attract them to universities here.

***
You've still got a long way to go before you prove your "#1 most racist" country allegation. 

***
Large immigration from China and India is the current trend and that is not reducing. If racism was a major problem then I would expect both groups to drastically reduce their immigration levels and go elsewhere. That's not happening.





mpgrewal said:


> Alas! Another student is racially stabbed today
> Another Indian student stabbed
> 
> To all those fellow forumers who thought that I blew the issue out of propotion, and it were just 2 or 3 attacks on Indians so far..
> ...


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

I dont understand, what r u trying to prove mp..

If you really want to prove, AU isnt the place to be for Indians then u shudnt hv been planning ur move. If u r trying to gain attention, that my friend is exactly what gets these people into situations that they are in. When u get attention, not always its by good fellows.

And do u think India is safe? do u read newspapers about what happens to those visiting India. The scarlett rape/murder in Goa. What did everyone say about her that time. remember? if a woman is out at 3 am all drunk/doped, wearing hardly anything, what else do u expect. Its easy to point fingers but when it comes to yourself, u say something like what else do u expect. That time there were hoards of people putting allegations on India being unsafe for women and we were defending, why, because it is India they are talking about and how can we let some westerner show us down. But truth remains, India is not safe for women. Go out wearing a bikini and trust me, u will come back ripped.

Why do u think "while in Rome, Do as the Romans Do" came up? It means when u r not where u belong and are in another nation, someone elses house, not your territory, do as those belonging there do. One has to get rid of the "wherever I go, I wont change but people will have to change for me" attitude.

Everytime I go out I am scared, which place would be the next TAJ. remember those 59 hours attack at the Taj. Just that I am careful. 

You think AU is the #1 racist country? dont get me started on India please, Not exactly a place where I would want to show my country down.

Anyway, I too can argue and fight mp (Yes, thats me, I have never lost an argument) but why?? I really fail to understand. I dont want to argue here. I am here to seek help and extend a hand to those who need assistance and not fight over a silly issue of which place is safe and which race is safe.

Here we are, trying to find ways of moving out for a better life, and the number one reason for me leaving India or wanting to leave is the terror and insecurity that I have been living with since the first serial bomb explosion (unlike 80% who leave India for Money). Remember the Diwali blast 4 yrs back in Delhi, I was 20 meters away, I turned my car last moment, just when I did, there was a blast, behind me.


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

:grouphug:



anj1976 said:


> I dont understand, what r u trying to prove mp..
> 
> If you really want to prove, AU isnt the place to be for Indians then u shudnt hv been planning ur move. If u r trying to gain attention, that my friend is exactly what gets these people into situations that they are in. When u get attention, not always its by good fellows.
> 
> ...


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

amaslam said:


> :grouphug:


:focus: neahhhhh hehehehehe


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## manish1980 (Nov 8, 2008)

And the good news.

Aus police arrrest 1 in 'racist' attack case- TIMESNOW.tv - Latest Breaking News, Big News Stories, News Videos


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## Aussiejock (May 26, 2007)

manish1980 said:


> And the good news.
> Aus police arrrest 1 in 'racist' attack case- TIMESNOW.tv - Latest Breaking News, Big News Stories, News Videos


The police have also stated that they do not consider these attacks to be racially motivated, ie not racist. In the same circumstances this could happen to anyone. If you have any commonsense, you do not travel alone at night. 
Why do people always introduce the racist card when someone, other than a caucasian, has someting unpleasant happen to them?


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## manish1980 (Nov 8, 2008)

Aussiejock said:


> The police have also stated that they do not consider these attacks to be racially motivated, ie not racist. In the same circumstances this could happen to anyone. If you have any commonsense, you do not travel alone at night.
> Why do people always introduce the racist card when someone, other than a caucasian, has someting unpleasant happen to them?



Aussiejock.

There were 2 different attacks






1. 4 Indian students were assaulted in house party

2. 1 guy travelling alone in train was assaulted.

So your comment about not travelling alone in that night is entriely correct for 1st incident.


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## aussieland (Oct 14, 2008)

Aussiejock said:


> The police have also stated that they do not consider these attacks to be racially motivated, ie not racist. In the same circumstances this could happen to anyone. If you have any commonsense, you do not travel alone at night.
> Why do people always introduce the racist card when someone, other than a caucasian, has someting unpleasant happen to them?


I totally agree with "Aussiejock" over this issue that these r attacks meant for theft n not racist attacks...
but then again it makes me scared....


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## Aussiejock (May 26, 2007)

PankajNamdeo said:


> I totally agree with "Aussiejock" over this issue that these r attacks meant for theft n not racist attacks...
> but then again it makes me scared....


Thanks for that. I should just like to add that you get ignorant thugs everywhere that will attack anyone anywhere, be it in the street, at home or at a party etc. Nothing to do with race, just to give some idiot their kicks. Don't be scared just use your commonsense. The vast majority of people don't act that way. I know what I would do with the idiots who do!


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

PankajNamdeo said:


> I totally agree with "Aussiejock" over this issue that these r attacks meant for theft n not racist attacks...
> but then again it makes me scared....


I wouldn't be.........


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## aussieland (Oct 14, 2008)

PankajNamdeo said:


> I totally agree with "Aussiejock" over this issue that these r attacks meant for theft n not racist attacks...
> but then again it makes me scared....


having said that I am also following these news closely and no where its mentioned that it was RACISTS attack(correct me if i m wrong)

but then again this doent mean thats its not wrong...govt should track these kind of people and ensure safety for all the people(including INDAINS)...as these things can happen to anybody again in future(including INDAINS)


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

PankajNamdeo said:


> having said that I am also following these news closely and no where its mentioned that it was RACISTS attack(correct me if i m wrong)
> 
> but then again this doent mean thats its not wrong...govt should track these kind of people and ensure safety for all the people(including INDAINS)...as these things can happen to anybody again in future(including INDAINS)


As they should in ALL parts of the world.... Australia is one of the most tolerant countries I have ever visited/lived in WRT immigrants of all persuasions.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

anj1976 said:


> I dont understand, what r u trying to prove mp..
> QUOTE]
> 
> I don;t want to prove anything or convince anybody. I respect everybody's opinion and choice to move or settle anywhere. I just want to inform my fellow brothers and sisters from India that track is not smooth for you. Racism has peaked in Australia. Come out of your dreams and see the reality, so that you should be well prepared before landing there..
> ...


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

thanks for sharing MP


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Are you kidding.... MP's post IMHO is incitement and media driven to stir up (fill in the blank here). I think people should look to their own shore before looking at Australia... How about all the crap in Vienna which has spilled over..... 

Bottom line, before you point fingers look closer to home.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

Halo said:


> Are you kidding.... MP's post IMHO is incitement and media driven to stir up (fill in the blank here). I think people should look to their own shore before looking at Australia... How about all the crap in Vienna which has spilled over.....
> 
> Bottom line, before you point fingers look closer to home.


We understand our own home very well. We never compare it with Oz as Oz standard is much higher despite recent racist surge. 

What I expect from people of Australia is first ACCEPT that racism exists and ACCEPT that Indians are being picked and targetted. A problem can't be solved unless it is identified. One thing I have learnt of Ozies is they will keep on denying things in 100 different ways...
1. ' then don't come here'
2. ' look into your own home first'
3. ' no its not racism, its just an opportunistic crime'
4. ' No. I never saw anyone being assaulated. How can you say people are being assualted daily?'
5. Police says ' why were you travelling alone when you were assualted. Should have brought your mom with you?'
6. ' Why didn't you learn self defence'

100 excuses to avoid work. How many more casualities you want to see before you finally blabber "Yes, I think racism thing is getting out of control. Lets start doing something on it."

We have high hopes from our prospective land. So want these 'comparatively less crap' cleared.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

vas said:


> REMOVED - Forum rule violation AUP 3.3.2
> VAS


Agreed I'm learning kickboxing, knivery and chain-swinging to make myself well-prepared for Oz hospitality. May I request the moderators to add these arts and other self-defence techniques to "Must do before emigrating" sticky list


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Great attitude chaps, you'll fit in well


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

mpgrewal said:


> What I expect from people of Australia is first ACCEPT that racism exists and ACCEPT that Indians are being picked and targetted. A problem can't be solved unless it is identified. One thing I have learnt of Ozies is they will keep on denying things in 100 different ways...



1. ' then don't come here' But why are people still coming here if they think it's so racist? Not everyone wants to change it...
2. ' look into your own home first'That can be said of any country
3. ' no its not racism, its just an opportunistic crime'Why isn't it just that? There are other reasons for crime be it opportunistic drugs etc... If everyone attacked was blue eyed would you be saying that blue eyed people are being attacked? A question was asked earlier that wasn't answered - how does anyone know that these are racially motivated? 
4. ' No. I never saw anyone being assaulated. How can you say people are being assualted daily?'I think that's trying to add balance. If anyone has had anything to do with the media then they know that the reporting isn't always accurate. Bad news always hits headlines - good news doesn't.
5. Police says ' why were you travelling alone when you were assualted. Should have brought your mom with you?' In some areas that's valid. Even where I used to live in the UK I wouldn't travel alone at night for safety reasons. In a lot of countries there are opportunistic crimes it's because the victim didn't take reasonable precautions
6. ' Why didn't you learn self defence'Not something I would do for safety reasons. I am doing belly dancing classes - maybe they could laugh so much that it would give me time to run off?  



mpgrewal said:


> 100 excuses to avoid work.


 Excuses to avoid what work? Change will not happen over night and I don't believe in positive discrimination. If you force change on the any race then there will be a lash back from the existing population. If you don't think so look at some areas in the UK.

I'm enjoying this discussion and the fact that this hasn't degenerated into anything personal. Please be careful of generalisations of the kind 'all of [insert race here]' since obviously that does not apply to all people. 

As a moderator I'd like to thank all participants for that and say to keep it up! 

Also notice when smilies are being used because don't forget that not everything comes over in written text. 

Regards,
Karen


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

mpgrewal said:


> What I expect from people of Australia is first ACCEPT that racism exists and ACCEPT that Indians are being picked and targetted.


No thanks..... Not interested in your rhetoric.


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## weelee (Sep 15, 2008)

Halo said:


> No thanks..... Not interested in your rhetoric.


well said it is what it is and people should realise that crime exists everywhere and is not always racially motivated there was a couple killed in queensland recently they were expats from uk dont know reasons dont know if anyone caught it wont stop me fulfilling my dream of moving and meeting new friends from all over the world hopefully on the beach. just a quick note off topic it was scorching in uk today a sign of things to come. keep up this discussion it is interesting hopefully there is an answer out there. I still believe the answer lies with everyone and that is acceptance of your surroundings and having a good attitude. leave your problems in the past where they belong.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

*What annoys me about conversations like this is the inability for people to see all sides of a situation..... *

Quick Story: Talking to a cab back from the airport the Lebanese cabbie and I started chatting; I was gobsmack to hear how he firmly believed that American soldiers were planting bombs in cars Iraq to kill innocent civilians. (been living in OZ for over 15 years)

Why the story? He only saw it from his point of view...... from what he had heard... there are always those that incite and it’s usually about control in some form or other. (There is rarely any proof to substantiate their points of view)
_
I’ve just put my tin-foil hat on as I don’t want those 's invading my mind_


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## Aussiejock (May 26, 2007)

mpgrewal said:


> We understand our own home very well. We never compare it with Oz as Oz standard is much higher despite recent racist surge.
> 
> What I expect from people of Australia is first ACCEPT that racism exists and ACCEPT that Indians are being picked and targetted. A problem can't be solved unless it is identified. One thing I have learnt of Ozies is they will keep on denying things in 100 different ways...
> 1. ' then don't come here'
> ...



Friends of mine were very happy living in the home they had. They had been there for a number of years. An Indian family moved in next door. From that point they were harassed, insulted and the man even threatened to kill the wife. My friends went to the anti discrimination board and detailed what was happening and asked if these people could be charged. The answer was no because as my friends were caucasian they were not covered by the act. The upshot was my friends sold the home they loved just to get away from these people.
So you see Indians, and other races, are also capable of racist behaviour, so please stop insisting that it is something that only Australians do. No one is out to get you! You will be judged on what you are as a person,NOT on where you come from.


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## manish1980 (Nov 8, 2008)

Very interesting story.

I would like to know from which part of India these people were? 

Normally Indians are less aggressive and subdued..These days Australia police call Indian students as 'Soft Target' because they are not aggressive and strong and carry expensive items like laptop and ipods


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## april (Jul 22, 2007)

Aussiejock said:


> Friends of mine were very happy living in the home they had. They had been there for a number of years. An Indian family moved in next door. From that point they were harassed, insulted and the man even threatened to kill the wife. My friends went to the anti discrimination board and detailed what was happening and asked if these people could be charged. The answer was no because as my friends were caucasian they were not covered by the act. The upshot was my friends sold the home they loved just to get away from these people.
> So you see Indians, and other races, are also capable of racist behaviour, so please stop insisting that it is something that only Australians do. No one is out to get you! You will be judged on what you are as a person,NOT on where you come from.


Wow that is interesting! We also looked into the anti discrimination act when we had trouble with an abusive neighbour (my husband is Asian). Because the threats from the neighbour were loud enough to be heard on the street and witnessed, we had enough to go after him. And also because they were violent threats (he said he was going to shoot my husband in the head) which were also heard by other neighbours, the police said we had enough to charge him.

The police suggested that the best action to take is to go to the magistrate court and file a peace and good behaviour order against him. If all the neighbours lodged it together there is a good chance that we would win. (all of the neighbours have been putting up with him for years before we came on the scene)

We didn't do anything because apparently this racist old codger next door was all bark and no bite and me telling him off was enough for him to shut up. And he just moved out today because he got evicted, yay!


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## april (Jul 22, 2007)

manish1980 said:


> Very interesting story.
> 
> I would like to know from which part of India these people were?
> 
> Normally Indians are less aggressive and subdued..These days Australia police call Indian students as 'Soft Target' because they are not aggressive and strong and carry expensive items like laptop and ipods


I hardly think anybody would say to someone hurling abuse at them "Oh by the way - which part of India are you from? Okay thank you - carry on!"

I think a more natural discourse would be: "Hey! Watch your mouth! Keep that up and I will call the police!"


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## Mingo (Mar 20, 2009)

Indian anger boils over

Violent protests do not help...


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## april (Jul 22, 2007)

Isn't it ironic that the typical off-the-cuff remark by a narrow-minded Australian, is the same as what some in the Indian community are saying:
:
:

From the above quoted article:

"My advice to every Indian student now who wants to come to Australia is, 'Please don't come'."

:
:
:
I personally don't care if Indian students come to Australia or not (although it would be easier for me to find rental accommodation if they didn't  ) but I thought it was interesting that people from polar opposite; people that probably hate each other - are saying the same thing.


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

i dont understand, there was a rally in melbourne yesterday. why are only Indian students attacked, if at all they are. why not Indian migrants attacked? if at all they are against Indians then they should not spare migrants/PR holders as well...
this is sad


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## manish1980 (Nov 8, 2008)

For the record, education is Australia's third largest export industry. It generated $15.5 billion last year, with 4,30,000 international students visiting Australia. Of these, an estimated 96,739 last year were Indian, a 54 per cent increase on 2007

Clearly, Australia cannot afford to be seen as a hostile country to foreigners if it wants to continue attracting talent, and money, from outside its shores. To be honest, Australia has been punching way above its weight in the global ring so far. Perhaps aware of the limits of its influence, Canberra is seeking better ties in the Asian region, with Beijing, Tokyo and New Delhi. There is much that India and Australia can achieve together. But such ugly incidents are simply unacceptable, mates.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

anj1976 said:


> i dont understand, there was a rally in melbourne yesterday. why are only Indian students attacked, if at all they are. why not Indian migrants attacked? if at all they are against Indians then they should not spare migrants/PR holders as well...
> this is sad


How will an attacker know whether you are student or PR. There have been 500 reported assualts against Indians in past 6 months..(I doubt at least the same number will be unreported where students don't even have time to go and report to the police, or police refused to register complaint for some reason)

May be out of all these assaults 30% are on PRs also. We never know, only thing which is coming clear is if you are Indian-looking and you are alone (at some wrong time)... you are in trouble. I reckon, with all this menace and mud-slinging this risk is going to get compounded in coming times..


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## Aussiejock (May 26, 2007)

april said:


> Isn't it ironic that the typical off-the-cuff remark by a [CO]narrow-minded Australian, is the same as what some in the Indian community are saying:
> :
> :
> 
> ...


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## april (Jul 22, 2007)

Aussiejock said:


> april said:
> 
> 
> > Isn't it ironic that the typical off-the-cuff remark by a [CO]narrow-minded Australian, is the same as what some in the Indian community are saying:
> ...


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

*But the sit-in was called off about 5.15am (AEST) this morning when police detained 18 students for breaching the peace.*

Why do they have to break crap.......? 
Protest - Fine but all that happens is that people that once had sympathy now turn their backs and mutter "damn foreigners" 

One's approach needs to be tempered, controlled and organised.


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## Aussiejock (May 26, 2007)

Yes it was made by an Indian - the man who was attacked with a screwdriver.

But my point was that racist Australians say the same thing as some Indian people (or well, at least, a couple).

To make things clear - I was quoting an Indian person from the article that was linked from an above post.[/QUOTE]

I don't consider myself a racist and I would give exactly the same advice to anyone who believed that things were as bad as some make out. Why would you put yourself in danger? 
I don't live in Melbourne so my knowledge is only that which I read in newspapers or hear on news casts. However, I find it very difficult to believe that Australians are targeting any nationality to the extent that is being reported. I've lived here for a very long time and have never known Australians to behave like this. Ofcourse you get some racists in every country, but in general Australians are definitly not racist.


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## anj1976 (Apr 24, 2008)

it might not be as bad but it became big because of the media. give it a couple of weeks, it will be fine and forgotten and the students who came back to India claiming they are scared and will never go back, will be packing again to go back to AU.


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## manish1980 (Nov 8, 2008)

On contrary, I believe Indian media is doing a great job in keeping up pressure on Indian Government to ensure our students are safe by pushing their Australian counterparts diplomatically.

Personally, I am not clear if these are racist attacks or Indian students have been target because they are soft targets (as described by Victorian police) but if you look at past 6 months data it pretty clear Indians have been target of some unlawful elements more than any other race.

I hope Australian police will work to ensure the culprits are punished and security for all people living in Australia is upto the level expected from a developed country.

I also pray for victims of these incident and hope speedy recovery for them.

Manish


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## SHU (Aug 19, 2008)

I have personally meet few Australian who is racist in my workplace here at Perth.
Normally, during drinkings or normal conversation, you won't feel the racist as they wont show it so obviously, as they just want to maintain the polite...but in actual most Australian born are having "racist" thinking. Sorry to say this as i concluded this after staying here for about 1 year plus, no offending, but just personal experience.

I am quite surprised that as a professional at workplace, he just spoke that " i don't understand why company employed so many expatriate from XXXX country ". The way he expressed his "racist" thinking is so apparent in the meeting. Though my indian boss from India also can not do anything about him.From what i observed, only those who are few Australian local born are super racist. Those became Australian through migrant won't have such deep "racist" thinking...


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## april (Jul 22, 2007)

SHU said:


> I have personally meet few Australian who is racist in my workplace here at Perth.
> Normally, during drinkings or normal conversation, you won't feel the racist as they wont show it so obviously, as they just want to maintain the polite...but in actual most Australian born are having "racist" thinking. Sorry to say this as i concluded this after staying here for about 1 year plus, no offending, but just personal experience.
> 
> I am quite surprised that as a professional at workplace, he just spoke that " i don't understand why company employed so many expatriate from XXXX country ". The way he expressed his "racist" thinking is so apparent in the meeting. Though my indian boss from India also can not do anything about him.From what i observed, only those who are few Australian local born are super racist. Those became Australian through migrant won't have such deep "racist" thinking...


You can't seriously claim to know what people think.

To say that Australian local born are super racist makes yourself racist! Sorry but that is how it sounds.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Its those narrowminded opinions that make mountains out of molehills.


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

april said:


> You can't seriously claim to know what people think.
> 
> To say that Australian local born are super racist makes yourself racist! Sorry but that is how it sounds.


Assumed generations are always lethal. Thats why I changed my signature as below. She may mean "only few Australian born are super racist"... but readers by mistake generalized it for everybody..it is not the first time that it has happened in this thread


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## manish1980 (Nov 8, 2008)

Now another incident being reported.

Another Indian student attacked in Australia- Politics/Nation-News-The Economic Times


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

mpgrewal said:


> Assumed generations are always lethal. Thats why I changed my signature as below. She may mean "only few Australian born are super racist"... but readers by mistake generalized it for everybody..it is not the first time that it has happened in this thread


Just as "only a few Indians Born are super Racist" But then again, it all depends what caste you're from.


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## darrenpauli (May 12, 2009)

Mate, how can you claim that someone born in Australia is a racist - or "super racist". You goose.

There are plenty of overt racists in Australia, as there are in other countries.

The Aussie vernacular is often tinged with racism, but I personally don't subscribed to the suggestion that someone who jibes a group in jest is in the same category as those that are overtly racist.

Don't get the two confused. An Aussie can take a joke as good as give one. But I'm not covering for racists - I think overt racism is disgusting, but moreover stupid. Few Aussies are bi-lingual and many experience different cultures through immigration, rather than travel. Then it becomes a case of 'us and them'.


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## SHU (Aug 19, 2008)

Yes, MPGrewal, you catch my pointing out. I did mention " few" local born australian are super racist, and i am so lucky to meet them during my stay here though i don't know how many percent are they


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Now it seems like its the Pesky Lebanese that are the culprits! - Oi Yey


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## Taz_ (Jun 10, 2009)

Australia isn't any more racist a country than any other. It's quite 'tolerant' and thrived on the hard work of the early immigrants such as the asian (as in S/E asia not what the Brits call 'asian'), italian and greek communities.

During that time the Greeks and Italians were seen as the wogs, and taking honest hard working Aussies jobs. But soon the ignorance melted away and another cultural group took their place in being marginalised such as the Asians (from China, Vietnnam, Laos etc) then the Middle Eastern and Lebanese. Regardless of country small minded people fear/hate that which they do not understand and this ignorance breeds contempt or racism to some degree. In saying this Australia is not inherently racist, but racism exists. It's like anything in any country, unsavoury types are always around.

I grew up in Australia from the age of 2, i'm from an Indian background and don't obviously look anything like the blond haired blue eyed average 'Aussie'. Sure I faced a bit of racism for the colour or my skin or that I wasn't born here when I was in school but nothing an intellectual response or retort didn't sort out. 

I am now living in the UK and you wouldn't know it from looking at me, but once the locals hear the accent I am unmistakenly Aussie. I call myself Australian, it's what is says on my passport and i'm probably more of an Aussie overseas than I would be at home since i've proud of my country.

There has been some exhchanges in there regarding the 'Indian student' issue with some having been targeted or attacked, sure incidents did happen but i've personally never been targeted or beaten myself. So I would not go so far as some people who are currently living in India labelling Australia as RACIST or unfriendly towards migrants or Indians. 

I'm from Sydney and have been to Melbourne and had to do a double take since yes there are plenty of Indians there, many whom are students. But I didn't see anything untowards going on either.

There is a media issue, what is newsworthy gets reported. Indians can be a lively bunch so when they caught wind of it it became a bigger issue (without diminishing the senseless violence and slander involved in the incidents) than it was, lets be honest this happens all over the world. Bushfires in Oz, everyone in the UK I meet asks me if my family is ok. There's some bikie shootings, people think the place turned into Mad Max and bikies are ruling the land...

The Indian govt. are in 'dialogue' with the Australian govt. regarding this since they are obviously concerned about their citizens welfare. But once again, it's only when you hear something about your fellow countrymen and women in a foreign land that it sparks a greater interest than the normal news.

FYI
The odd thing is Indians like any other racial group can be racist or ignorant/judgemental also, even to their own kind. So many people i've come across through extended family can judge other Indians desirability/attractiveness or the like based on how 'dark' or fair skinned they are such as at a wedding. Oh look how fair the girl is (positively)...or how dark (negative) the boy is.... Or how 'Fresh off the Boat" they are. Not in an overtly judgemental way, but it's there. I've never been to India myself, but my mum has and she said the whole Caste thing is pretty horrid and they treat the lower castes and lower employees poorly like in a shop for example. I am not going to now blacklist India from my list of places to travel, despite my better judgement I am travelling there this year on holiday as a matter of fact to see what it's like.

My wifes boss is Indian (he came to Oz much later in life so though this would be a different example from mine) and he's got many friends still living in India who asked him if the place was racist or if it's a big 'problem' that Indians are getting targeted since they heard the news reports etc.. He replied frankly that yes there were some instances but no it's not a commonplace occurance and he's never been subjected to anything like it.

So being an Aussie and having spent 27 years of my life there while having an Indian 'racial' background I believe I can at least speak for myself in saying NO, Australia isn't an inherently racist country.

Yes there are bogans and the like, youth with nothing better to do and ignorance in their hearts, but I am sure you'll find them in any country.

Murders, violent crime and theft/robbery, guns and illegal drugs are a more serious issue IMHO, and incidents are quite low in Australia compared to many other western countries.

So to the original poster, I think you've got nothing much to worry about. Enjoy your fish and chips minus the mushy peas or baked beans!


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## eva-usa (May 14, 2009)

Sorry for jump in between ....

But I havent seen a single case where people doing ofice jobs are attacked. Only Indian students were attacked becuase they snatched jobs of locals. jobs in shops, coffee shops & other ordinary labour. 

Now look at from the prospective of the local people who have no skills other then doing jobs as shop keepers or cab drivers etc. If you snatch those jobs from the locals then they have no other option left other then sucide or attack on the job snatchers. If you go to Ausi for studies then why are you doing job there????


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

I think you should also look at who the people are committing these crimes.......


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

eva-usa said:


> Now look at from the prospective of the local people who have no skills other then doing jobs as shop keepers or cab drivers etc. If you snatch those jobs from the locals then they have no other option left other then sucide or attack on the job snatchers. If you go to Ausi for studies then why are you doing job there????


Do you really believe that people have no option other than attack others who supposedly 'took' their jobs? If so then I don't want to live in your world. There are always non-violent options if people chose to look for them.


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

I don't think 'taking their jobs' was the main motive for these attacks. To me most of these attacks involved some form of theft as well (phones, ipods, cash). Only very recently have there been the types of attacks that didn't have a robbery/theft component. Also AU currently has an unemployment rate around 6%, that means 94% of employable people are employed. 

I also think those who consider such attacks are not the sort who could hold any proper employment so resort to crime.



eva-usa said:


> Sorry for jump in between ....
> 
> But I havent seen a single case where people doing ofice jobs are attacked. Only Indian students were attacked becuase they snatched jobs of locals. jobs in shops, coffee shops & other ordinary labour.
> 
> Now look at from the prospective of the local people who have no skills other then doing jobs as shop keepers or cab drivers etc. If you snatch those jobs from the locals then they have no other option left other then sucide or attack on the job snatchers. If you go to Ausi for studies then why are you doing job there????


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

I wish everyone would just give it a rest..... All together now... Indians are NOT being targeted because they are Indian - They are targeted due to easy pickings. Its absurd to say Australians are racist. But if groups carry on like idiots -> that could always change.

Good read: Brutal truth about attacks - National Comment - The Advocate


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

Halo said:


> I wish everyone would just give it a rest..... All together now... Indians are NOT being targeted because they are Indian - They are targeted due to easy pickings. Its absurd to say Australians are racist. But if groups carry on like idiots -> that could always change.
> 
> Good read: Brutal truth about attacks - National Comment - The Advocate


1. Police needs to up its level and strength.
2. Laws need to be amended which treat bashing as a petty crime.


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## Aussiejock (May 26, 2007)

Halo said:


> I wish everyone would just give it a rest..... All together now... Indians are NOT being targeted because they are Indian - They are targeted due to easy pickings. Its absurd to say Australians are racist. But if groups carry on like idiots -> that could always change.
> 
> Good read: Brutal truth about attacks - National Comment - The Advocate


So true! I can't believe that this thread is still going! How many times do the same things have to be said on a thread? This one is going round in circles! Time to finish it I think.


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

I've closed this thread as all viewpoints have been explored.


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