# Got a job in Melbourne, Please help me decide if the switch to Oz is worth it



## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

Hello Folks,

I've been a lurker on these forums here for quite a while, and I really thank a lot of you guys for providing a lot of info. everyday. Anyways, here is my situation. I currently live in the US and have worked here for about 4 years. I always wanted to move to Aus. coz of the more relaxed immigration rules there, and also because it would be good to gain some international exposure w.r.t work.

So I decided to apply to a consulting co. for work there, and finally this week they made me an offer . They offered me a salary of $71,500 AUD with a few bonuses if I qualify for them. However, in the US I used to make around $90,000 USD. The position I was offered is based in Melbourne. Does anyone know if $71k is a good enough salary for Australian/Melbourne living standards? I am single, so I don't really have to take care of a whole lot of dependents and stuff. Can anyone break down or point me to a thread which would have the living expenses in Melbourne, and if 71K is a good salary to live there? Also, 71k in Aus is like 60k in the US (hence I'm thinking twice before I accept the offer, as it is a large drop from my salary if I compare the two countries)

Also, the employer said that they would sponsor the 457 work visa. I understand that it is temporary for 4 years? Does anyone know how soon I can apply for a PR once I land in Australia. I've read a lot of forums and all of them have varying information from 6 months to 2 years time frame. I would obviously like to start applying for this ASAP once I move there. Also, If I am to apply for a PR, would I fall under the Employer sponsored PR since I'm already working there? Or If the employer says he cannot sponsor me for a PR application - What PR category would I fall under?

Also, with the 457 visa, If I my employer terminates my employment, could I still stay in the country for the remaining 4 years? Or is there a time frame by which I need to leave before the visa becomes invalid?

I have loads of other questions, but I don't wanna burden people here with everything in my first post . I would greatly appreciate any help and info I can get from you guys.

Cheers!


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## matjones (Jan 30, 2009)

sanjeev555 said:


> Hello Folks,
> 
> I've been a lurker on these forums here for quite a while, and I really thank a lot of you guys for providing a lot of info. everyday. Anyways, here is my situation. I currently live in the US and have worked here for about 4 years. I always wanted to move to Aus. coz of the more relaxed immigration rules there, and also because it would be good to gain some international exposure w.r.t work.
> 
> ...


As a single person in Melbourne with 71K you should be fine. Where in the US are you currently living? If NY, or SF, then the cost of living in Melbourne would be cheaper for you. Also are you a US citizen? Greencard holder?

Regarding the visa itself, here are your obligations:

Temporary Business (Long Stay) – Standard Business Sponsorship (Subclass 457)

"If the sponsor ceases your employment, you must do one of the following:

* find another employer who is willing to nominate you
* apply for another type of substantive visa; or
* leave Australia within 28 days unless your visa expires before that time, in which case you must leave Australia prior to visa expiry.
"

Personally I would rather take a dip in pay to live the Australian dream. I'm becoming disillusioned with the American Dream.


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

matjones said:


> As a single person in Melbourne with 71K you should be fine. Where in the US are you currently living? If NY, or SF, then the cost of living in Melbourne would be cheaper for you. Also are you a US citizen? Greencard holder?
> 
> Regarding the visa itself, here are your obligations:
> 
> ...


Thanks for your reply. Do you live in Aus now? Would you know what is the average monthly rent I can expect to pay in a decent neighborhood of Melbourne? If you do live in Aus., how would you compare the standards of living between the US and Oz? 

I am a work visa holder in the US. So considering that it would take me 6 or 7 years to get a Green card, I think Aus. is way better in that regard. Also, I've lived almost everywhere in the US (SF, NY, Chicago), but most recently have been living in Houston where the rent is really cheap compared to the other cities. Do you have any idea about how long I have to wait before I can apply for a PR, after moving to Oz?


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## royen (Mar 21, 2009)

Regarding the salary, please go through the Hays salary survey which gives very comprehensive trends.

Hays Salary Survey

How many years of experience do you have? What is your occupation? 

Your salary would depend on that.

If you want to stay in Melbourne CBD then weekly rent would be around 350$+. There is a sticky thread for cost of living which has a comprehensive list of sites. 

BTW, CONGRATULATIONS !! for the job.


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## matjones (Jan 30, 2009)

sanjeev555 said:


> Thanks for your reply. Do you live in Aus now? Would you know what is the average monthly rent I can expect to pay in a decent neighborhood of Melbourne? If you do live in Aus., how would you compare the standards of living between the US and Oz?
> 
> I am a work visa holder in the US. So considering that it would take me 6 or 7 years to get a Green card, I think Aus. is way better in that regard. Also, I've lived almost everywhere in the US (SF, NY, Chicago), but most recently have been living in Houston where the rent is really cheap compared to the other cities. Do you have any idea about how long I have to wait before I can apply for a PR, after moving to Oz?


Hi,

I am currently in the US too, waiting for my visa to be approved. You will probably find things more expensive than Houston. I advise taking a look at websites such as realestate.com.au to check out rental prices. 

After 2 years on a 457 I think you can apply for Employer Nomination Scheme (Subclass 121/856) that will be a pathway to PR if you have certain skills. You should research the requirements for that on the DIAC website.

Mat


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## EE-India (May 16, 2009)

sanjeev555 said:


> Hello Folks,
> 
> I've been a lurker on these forums here for quite a while, and I really thank a lot of you guys for providing a lot of info. everyday. Anyways, here is my situation. I currently live in the US and have worked here for about 4 years. I always wanted to move to Aus. coz of the more relaxed immigration rules there, and also because it would be good to gain some international exposure w.r.t work.
> 
> ...


"_*You have been employed in Australia in your nominated occupation or a closely related skilled occupation for a total of 12 months in the 48 months immediately before lodging your application*_"

If you satisfied above recruitment then you are eligible to get 10 points when you apply PR, this is the only benefit of working in Australia , to apply PR. so after working in Aus for minimum 12 months , then you need to apply PR which will take another 12 months .If you are eligible to get 120 points based on latest point system then this option becomes meaningless. Hope you aware of latest changes in Aus immigration, if your occupation is in CSL+MODL then you will get the visa within 12 months , if you are able to get any state sponsorship then still you can reduce this to 9 months or even less. 

Moreover , you are getting 90K USD which is equivalent to 120 AUD , but you agreed for 75K AUD which is 45% less than your current salary. Why you need to compromise this much !! you are not living in 3rd world country like Indian or Pakistan to scarifies all for better option , Houston is one of the best city to compare with any part of this world 

If i am not wrong you should be able to get 1BHK flat in Houston for 800 USD/ Month, whereas in Melbourne it is going to be 1200 to 1500 AUD / months which is more or less same . Hope it is helps you


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## kaz101 (Nov 29, 2007)

Hi Sanjeev55, 

To work out your costs....

Take a look at the 'Cost of living' thread since that has most costs on it.....

Check out the real estate links in the 'PLEASE READ....' thread since your biggest expense is usually rent / mortgage. You can get a feel for what you like and what you can afford. 

Enter your salary in the ATO tax calculator (Comprehensive tax calculator) to see what your take home pay will be. 

After that you should have pretty good idea whether A$71K is enough for you. 

Personally money isn't everything and lifestyle means much more to me which is why we moved from the UK to Australia - to get out of the rat race. 

Regards,
Karen


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

Thanks for all your replies guys...Much appreciated 

Karen, would you know how long I have to wait before I apply for PR after moving to Oz? I've heard varying info. from a lot of people, with some saying I can start applying immediately, some saying I need to live there from 6months - 2years before I apply. I'm confused.

I'll check out to the links you sent me too. Thanks again!


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi Sanjeev:

You can apply the day you arrive and it's just like applying for an independent visa as if you were overseas (all of the requirements). As for the 2 yrs, if you can wait that long some of the requirements are waived and with an Employee Sponsorship (which many employers would give at that time) you get the highest priority for processing. 

I have done the 457 --> wait 2 yrs --> 856 Employer Sponsorship route and it was not difficult at all.

As for cost of living there is a large difference between Houston and Melbourne in costs. I would compare Melbourne to Boston in the US (or Chicago city). 

Your main cost will be rent following by food and car expenses.

As for salary I consider it low if you were on 90K previously. However you can't expect 120k AUD because the market rate is not likely to be that high in AU.

I would try negoitiating the salary up (90K if you're lucky, but I think it'll be somewhere in the 80s). Do your research on the job websites in AU to find out some salary levels for the type of job you are doing.



sanjeev555 said:


> Thanks for all your replies guys...Much appreciated
> 
> Karen, would you know how long I have to wait before I apply for PR after moving to Oz? I've heard varying info. from a lot of people, with some saying I can start applying immediately, some saying I need to live there from 6months - 2years before I apply. I'm confused.
> 
> I'll check out to the links you sent me too. Thanks again!


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

Thanks amaslam. Since you are already in Aus, could you help me with some info. on private medical insurance.

Since I'm on a 457 visa, I won't qualify for medicare and my employer says its mandatory to have private insurance. I went to this site called Private Health Insurance Australia - iSelect, and there are a bunch of options from private insurers there. Could you advise me on which insurance companies are most popular there with the people and also cost wise, which plan would be a good one? How much can i expect to pay per month for a good plan that would provide basic coverages?

In the US, its usually the employers that give subsidized rates on Medical insurance and I end up paying around $50-60 a month for a good medical, dental and vision insurance plan.

Also if I don't qualify for medicare, would it still be deducted from my paycheck every month? And can I claim for exemptions for it later?


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi Sanjeev:

You can't buy most of the insurance in AU as you are not a PR when you are on a 457. You need to get the pricier Overseas Visitor Cover (a 457 is considered a 'visit' for business purposes as you are not PR). There are only 5-6 companies that sell it and it's usually $250 a month (even for a single). Many people go with Medibank Private but here's a link at Immi which shows which companies provide 

Overseas Visitor Cover:
Overseas Visitors & Overseas Students

Also read this FAQ page at Immi:
Subclass 457 - Health Insurance

****
There is one item for Medicare on your paycheck, it's the Medicare Levy and is 1.5% of your income. Many companies automatically deduct this (even for 457), however as a 457 you are not required to pay the 457 Medicare Levy Surcharge (MLS). 

There is a form at ato.gov.au which exempts you from paying this surcharge, start at this page:
Medicare levy variation declaration

Good Luck 


sanjeev555 said:


> Thanks amaslam. Since you are already in Aus, could you help me with some info. on private medical insurance.
> 
> Since I'm on a 457 visa, I won't qualify for medicare and my employer says its mandatory to have private insurance. I went to this site called Private Health Insurance Australia - iSelect, and there are a bunch of options from private insurers there. Could you advise me on which insurance companies are most popular there with the people and also cost wise, which plan would be a good one? How much can i expect to pay per month for a good plan that would provide basic coverages?
> 
> ...


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

WOW, $250 a month sounds like a lot for health insurance alone. Did you personally pay that much for 2 years, until you applied for your PR?

Is there a way to get cheaper insurance, like from an outside country? Or does the law require me to only take the Overseas Visitor cover from an Australian Medical Insurer?

If I end up paying around $2500 for medical insurance alone in a year, along with my slightly lower salary, I have to really think hard about moving to Oz. 


amaslam said:


> Hi Sanjeev:
> 
> You can't buy most of the insurance in AU as you are not a PR when you are on a 457. You need to get the pricier Overseas Visitor Cover (a 457 is considered a 'visit' for business purposes as you are not PR). There are only 5-6 companies that sell it and it's usually $250 a month (even for a single). Many people go with Medibank Private but here's a link at Immi which shows which companies provide
> 
> ...


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi Sanjeev:

I did pay that, but it can be pre-tax from your paycheck, so reduces your taxable income a bit. Also you can be eligible for a LAFHA (Living Away from Home Allowance), check that with your company as that means you can also have your rent paid pre-tax as long as you are a 457 visa holder. Note the 250 a month covered my doctors visits, dental, and hospital if needed. 

No you cannot have overseas insurance as there won't be any doctors or hospitals that will accept it in AU.



sanjeev555 said:


> WOW, $250 a month sounds like a lot for health insurance alone. Did you personally pay that much for 2 years, until you applied for your PR?
> 
> Is there a way to get cheaper insurance, like from an outside country? Or does the law require me to only take the Overseas Visitor cover from an Australian Medical Insurer?
> 
> If I end up paying around $2500 for medical insurance alone in a year, along with my slightly lower salary, I have to really think hard about moving to Oz.


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

Thanks a lot for your prompt replies. Sorry to burden you with one more qn., but are both Hospital cover and Extra cover reqd. when I take the Overseas Health cover insurance. Or can I make do with just the Hospital cover option? 

Not sure where I can find the minimum requirements for level of insurance needed for the 457 visa? Also, can I file for the MLS exemption at any time during the year, or is it usually done along with the annual tax filings?

Thanks again for your help!


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

I think you just need Hospital Cover. Extras are always optional. 

I think the minimum requirement is cover that would have hospitalization and ambulance within,. 

You can apply for MLS at anytime (even in future tax years), but it's best to apply at the start of a job and keep doing that each year. Then you file as needed with the ATO.



sanjeev555 said:


> Thanks a lot for your prompt replies. Sorry to burden you with one more qn., but are both Hospital cover and Extra cover reqd. when I take the Overseas Health cover insurance. Or can I make do with just the Hospital cover option?
> 
> Not sure where I can find the minimum requirements for level of insurance needed for the 457 visa? Also, can I file for the MLS exemption at any time during the year, or is it usually done along with the annual tax filings?
> 
> Thanks again for your help!


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## Shankar (Dec 19, 2008)

Hey Sanjeev,

How could you able to get the job in Oz? Need your help in that regard. I am Oz PR holder and looking for a job in Oz. I don t want to take a risk of quitting my current job in India and start job hunt from the scratch in Oz. Please let me know the process you followed to obtain an offer in Oz. you could mail me personally as well to [email protected]

Thans,
-Shankar


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

Hi Shankar,

Thanks for your reply. I got my job mostly through applying online. Not sure which field you are in? But I work in IT (SAP), and I had a fair amount of experience in the US with a large consulting firm here. I just applied online directly on the website of a large consulting company in Oz. And I was lucky enough to get calls and interviewed through the phone and selected. I am trying to decide between moving to Oz. or staying back in the US right now.

If you don't have a job yet, and already have a job in India..I would recommend you search online first and try and get some interviews going..Its always good to go into a new country with something in hand, rather than go there empty handed and start all over again. But whatever you decide, I hope it works the best for you. 

Let me know if i can provide you with more info.



Shankar said:


> Hey Sanjeev,
> 
> How could you able to get the job in Oz? Need your help in that regard. I am Oz PR holder and looking for a job in Oz. I don t want to take a risk of quitting my current job in India and start job hunt from the scratch in Oz. Please let me know the process you followed to obtain an offer in Oz. you could mail me personally as well to [email protected]
> 
> ...


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

sanjeev555 said:


> Hi Shankar,
> 
> Thanks for your reply. I got my job mostly through applying online. Not sure which field you are in? But I work in IT (SAP), and I had a fair amount of experience in the US with a large consulting firm here. I just applied online directly on the website of a large consulting company in Oz. And I was lucky enough to get calls and interviewed through the phone and selected. I am trying to decide between moving to Oz. or staying back in the US right now.
> 
> ...


Hi Sanjeev,
I hope you know that Australia govt deducts much more tax than US govt which will even reduce your total salary. Also daily usage items and electronics are much more expensive in Australia as everything is shipped from US and Asian countries. 

I suggest you get you assessment done first because there are some occupations which DIAC has put on hold till Dec 2012. Means if you fall in that list then your PR may be much-much delayed. Australia govt immigration rules are changing a lot these days, so make sure you understand every detail before you take you decision. Personally I would never go for 40% less salary and may be 50% less savings unless I hate my job / corruption in my country.


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## Shankar (Dec 19, 2008)

Hi Sanjeev,

Thanks for the advice. Even I am thinking on the same lines as I would like to apply online and try to get some calls as I have comfortable time in my hand before I make a move. 

I am in IT and I have fair amount of experience in QA. I think I need to re-craft my resume suitable for Australian market. Could you provide me some details of sample CV for Australia.

Thanks,
-Shiva



sanjeev555 said:


> Hi Shankar,
> 
> Thanks for your reply. I got my job mostly through applying online. Not sure which field you are in? But I work in IT (SAP), and I had a fair amount of experience in the US with a large consulting firm here. I just applied online directly on the website of a large consulting company in Oz. And I was lucky enough to get calls and interviewed through the phone and selected. I am trying to decide between moving to Oz. or staying back in the US right now.
> 
> ...


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi Shankar:

If you look a the job ads you need to basically tailor your CV to show how you fit those requirements. So if it's for a manager position you want to emphasise all the manager roles you did (i.e. team lead, backed up manager, etc.) and if it's for DB Support you'd then emphasise those skills instead. You don't just use (1) CV, but instead you tailor it to each ad. That way you will get the most response.

QA is not a big field in AU as most of those jobs have been off-shored to India, but programming, high level support, legacy systems (i.e. COBOL, CICS), data warehousing, these are all fields that need people in AU.



Shankar said:


> Hi Sanjeev,
> 
> Thanks for the advice. Even I am thinking on the same lines as I would like to apply online and try to get some calls as I have comfortable time in my hand before I make a move.
> 
> ...


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## mpgrewal (Feb 22, 2009)

amaslam said:


> Hi Shankar:
> 
> If you look a the job ads you need to basically tailor your CV to show how you fit those requirements. So if it's for a manager position you want to emphasise all the manager roles you did (i.e. team lead, backed up manager, etc.) and if it's for DB Support you'd then emphasise those skills instead. You don't just use (1) CV, but instead you tailor it to each ad. That way you will get the most response.
> 
> QA is not a big field in AU as most of those jobs have been off-shored to India, but programming, high level support, legacy systems (i.e. COBOL, CICS), data warehousing, these are all fields that need people in AU.


Correct. Shankar -
Firstly you need to 'Australianise' your resume. Search on net for that. Then as Ama said you need to tune it according to the job. For every job you should have a different resume, that's what many people do... Remember you are competeing with hundreds of equally-capable more-preferred natives for a single rarely-seen potentially-fake job ad.

It is nearly impossible to even get a interview call if you are sitting in India and trying for Australian job. Bitter but truth.


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## Shankar (Dec 19, 2008)

Thanks for the replies guys.

Yeah.....it's true that it's difficult (rarely possible) to get a job in Oz sitting in India. But I am just throwing stones in the darkness by applying jobs in job portals, as I have 8 more months of time to make my first entry. And meanwhile I would like to upgrade my skills to match Australian market demands and by the time I fly I carry multiple skills with me.

Thanks,
-Shankar


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

Hi Amaslam and others: I had a particular 'noob' question and would appreciate your response on this.

On the 457 visa Validity period, on the Immi gov. website(http://www.immi.gov.au/skilled/skilled-workers/sbs/how-the-visa-works.htm#c), it says:
What does this visa let me do?

With this visa you can employ overseas workers for a period of between one day and four years.

With this visa those people you employ from overseas can:

* work in Australia for a period of between one day and four (4) years

But in the 'How this visa works' section for the same visa, it says:
Validity periods

The validity period of the:

* sponsorship is three years
* nomination is 12 months
* visa is between one day and four years.

So my questions is 1) What is the difference between sponsorship of 1-3 years and visa validity of 1-4 years? Why cant the sponsorship be 1-4 years similar to the length of the visa validity?
2) What does 'nomination' for 12 months really mean? I don't understand that sentence.


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi Sanjeev:

It's a bit of specific language but it makes sense if you look at the new part of 457 which didn't exist before.

Validity periods

The validity period of the:

* sponsorship is three years
* nomination is 12 months
* visa is between one day and four years.

Applying for a new visa or changing employer

If you have an employee who wants to apply for a new visa (where their current visa is about to expire), the employee must lodge a new visa application.

From 14 September 2009, 457 visa holders who wish to change employer or position (within the validity of their current visa) will not be required to apply for a new Subclass 457 visa.

1. A nomination means 'I want to sponsor this person', so the nomination must be valid for 12 months at least.
2. Sponsorship means "I will fulfill all the obligations of sponsorship for 3 yrs"
3. Visa is between 1 day and four years. Before 14 Sep 2009 you needed to get a new 457 if you changed employers, now you don't. So that means if your visa is valid for 4 yrs you could change employers within that period. 

***
Hope it's a bit clearer, but in practicality you'll be with one employer for at least 1 year (and usually longer), just that the employer now has to pay more attention to the obligations of a 457. 



sanjeev555 said:


> Hi Amaslam and others: I had a particular 'noob' question and would appreciate your response on this.
> 
> On the 457 visa Validity period, on the Immi gov. website(Temporary Business (Long Stay) - Standard Business Sponsorship (Subclass 457)), it says:
> What does this visa let me do?
> ...


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## LoveOz (Aug 12, 2008)

amaslam said:


> QA is not a big field in AU as most of those jobs have been off-shored to India, but programming, high level support, *legacy systems (i.e. COBOL, CICS), *data warehousing, these are all fields that need people in AU.


COBOL, DB2, JCL, CICS, VSAM, TSO - I have spent all my life doing this stuff. I am glad they are in demand. 

Do you know any companies specifically looking for these skills ?


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Look at the traditional users: Banks, Insurance, Government (as a PR you could probably find State Goverment work, but most Federal work requires Citizenship).

Look at the Mainframe jobs, might be easier to get into an org that way since not that many people exposed to those technologies anymore.



LoveOz said:


> COBOL, DB2, JCL, CICS, VSAM, TSO - I have spent all my life doing this stuff. I am glad they are in demand.
> 
> Do you know any companies specifically looking for these skills ?


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## sanjeev555 (Jul 14, 2009)

amaslam said:


> Hi Sanjeev:
> 
> It's a bit of specific language but it makes sense if you look at the new part of 457 which didn't exist before.
> 
> ...



Thanks Amaslam. So when you said in the Nomination sentence - The employer will sponsor me for 12 months atleast, does that impose any restrictions on me to change employers within 12 month nomination period?

In Sponsorship - When you meant "I will fulfill all the obligations of sponsorship for 3 years", does that mean the Employer or the Employee? What happens in the 4th year of the visa? Are there no obligations to fulfill then? I'm confused there. 

I guess the most likely scenario would be, me applying for a PR after 2 years of working on a 457 visa, since it is the highest priority in processing times like you mentioned earlier. So hopefully I won't have to worry about the differences between a 3 year sponsorship and 4 year visa


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## amaslam (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi Sanjeev:

1. It does not impose a restriction, but many employers will expect re-imbursement of the fees they paid to get you to AU (i.e. application fees, agent fees) if you leave before 12 months.
2. The obligations are more on the employer

Apply for PR after two years and then this whole discussion becomes moot.



sanjeev555 said:


> Thanks Amaslam. So when you said in the Nomination sentence - The employer will sponsor me for 12 months atleast, does that impose any restrictions on me to change employers within 12 month nomination period?
> 
> In Sponsorship - When you meant "I will fulfill all the obligations of sponsorship for 3 years", does that mean the Employer or the Employee? What happens in the 4th year of the visa? Are there no obligations to fulfill then? I'm confused there.
> 
> I guess the most likely scenario would be, me applying for a PR after 2 years of working on a 457 visa, since it is the highest priority in processing times like you mentioned earlier. So hopefully I won't have to worry about the differences between a 3 year sponsorship and 4 year visa


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