# Irish passport and citizenship!



## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

I’m just about to request application form for Irish passport.
Are there any pro’s and con’s I should be reading up on? I don’t want to lose anything in relation to British status at least without knowing about it first!
One of my parents is Irish, I’m English, so it now seems a logical thing to do on the face of it, re brexit! Travel will be easier I assume, (for now at least) unless Schengen is suspended across the EU, very likely I feel, but are there any down sides I need to be aware of?
i.e. Will this change the status of my will when I get around to making one?
Will it affect inheritance tax, money or property I leave, or left to my self in future comparing UK to Spanish EU tax law ?

I’m still in the UK, something always seems to have stopped or delayed me for one reason or another but trying hard now get on the move!
I’ve thought about moving to Spain for such a long time it’s more than a little annoying (embarrassing) Sitting here on a summers day a few days back with enough rain to sink a battleship, but I’m close to putting my place up for sale now.
Brexit has of course complicated things, no change right now but who knows what further down the road will bring.
So the key points I can think of right now are;
What changes will an Irish passport make to my British status if any in Spain and UK? As far as I’ve read so far no difference in the UK!
I did find these threads which made for interesting reading;
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...ng-spain/1224553-irish-passport-benefits.html
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...iving-spain/1168785-irish-uk-citizenship.html

Under the Embassy of Ireland, Great Britain - Passport Queries it seems very clear. “Only Irish citizens are entitled to hold an Irish passport” so under that context I’m already an Irish citizen! Just without the paperwork to prove it!
I can see from the following link there is a statement about “Dual citizenship” and Foreign citizenship”
Can someone tell me how Spain interprets these 2 options, that’s even if there is an actual option as far as from a Spanish or EU perspective?
Is this even relevant as I’ll be applying for an Irish passport to just prove Irish citizenship? And I’m not apparently doing anything to change my British citizenship? Referencing; https://www.gov.uk/dual-citizenship
Reference this in regards to the EU; Getting an Irish Passport in the UK - Irish Links
“Any person who holds the nationality of an EU country is automatically also an EU citizen. EU citizenship is additional to UK citizenship and does not replace it.”

Any other advantages will an Irish/EU passport give me in Spain? It must make things easier in future! Are there lower taxes in relation to property in any way, or having a 2nd home as a rental? Able to work in Spain I know. I’m basing my reasoning around Brits being treated as non EU citizens in future.

Apart from possibly giving me a green light at passport control when landing in Spain and whizzing through while watching the majority of Brits being poked and prodded in long queues (kidding)..!
Any suggestions on a good area to rent while I’m looking for a place to buy? Any good websites for renting and buying would be appreciated?

I’m feeling home could be somewhere between Alicante and Almeria, so somewhere central for house hunting might be a good idea with around an hour from nearest airport.
Sorry about the rambling post, been away from looking at Spain for such a long time, feels like I’m starting from scratch again in some ways.
Thanx for any thoughts and insights.


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## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

My partner has an Irish passport as well as her British one. From what I can see she just gets the best of both worlds as and when it suits her. She's British but born on the island of Ireland so qualifies for one.


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## Michael Kelly (May 30, 2017)

Muddy said:


> I’m just about to request application form for Irish passport.
> Are there any pro’s and con’s I should be reading up on? I don’t want to lose anything in relation to British status at least without knowing about it first!
> One of my parents is Irish, I’m English, so it now seems a logical thing to do on the face of it, re brexit! Travel will be easier I assume, (for now at least) unless Schengen is suspended across the EU, very likely I feel, but are there any down sides I need to be aware of?
> i.e. Will this change the status of my will when I get around to making one?
> ...


I think having an irish passport will just give you the same rights in Spain as UK passport holders currently have. You will be able to continue to use the EU passport queue when travelling to and from the UK. 
You may even be able to use the same queue as UK passport holders if you wish to travel to the UK on an irish passport (although I am not sure about that).


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## Henthree (Sep 14, 2015)

Hello there. You don't say whether you're working or a pensioner. If a UK state pensioner your Spanish state healthcare costs will be borne by the UK government at least until Brexit, and, per my post below, probably/possibly after.

There has been no mention as yet as to what the position will be for UK pensioners who want to move to an EU country _after_ Brexit.

So at the moment for Spanish state healthcare purposes it is the country where you paid the most NI contributions that matters, not your nationality.

If however you intend to work in Spain your Spanish NI contributions will cover your healthcare. Likewise you'll be OK with private healthcare insurance. If either applies to you, Irish citizenship would probably make life a bit less complicated for you.

Good luck!


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Dunpleecin said:


> My partner has an Irish passport as well as her British one. From what I can see she just gets the best of both worlds as and when it suits her. She's British but born on the island of Ireland so qualifies for one.


Seems pretty straight forward to apply, just the wait may take a while.
Never thought of having to do this, but post brexit will make things easier.
And as I renewed my current passport just before the latest version of the Biometric addition, who knows if that will make a difference to some travel destinations!



Michael Kelly said:


> I think having an irish passport will just give you the same rights in Spain as UK passport holders currently have. You will be able to continue to use the EU passport queue when travelling to and from the UK.
> You may even be able to use the same queue as UK passport holders if you wish to travel to the UK on an irish passport (although I am not sure about that).


Well on the funny side I guess I can take both passports and queue hop to the shortest line! :bounce:



Henthree said:


> Hello there. You don't say whether you're working or a pensioner. If a UK state pensioner your Spanish state healthcare costs will be borne by the UK government at least until Brexit, and, per my post below, probably/possibly after.
> 
> There has been no mention as yet as to what the position will be for UK pensioners who want to move to an EU country _after_ Brexit.
> 
> ...


I'll be working but not to start with possibly until I purchase a place and settle in, so I'll be needing private medical cover to start with at least. This may complicate things so I'll have to see if this is realistic and change my plans if not.

Thanx for the replies


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## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

I was born in London. My mother was born in N. Ireland so UK. However, in 2010, I discovered that I had been Irish from birth as a result of my mother being born in the island of Ireland. I applied for my Irish PP which was issued free, as at that time PPs were free to those over 65. I allowed my UK PP to lapse and had my EU Citizen Registartion in Spain amended. 

Not a single problem encountered-

My son, born in UK, is in the process of applying for an Irish PP based on the fact that his grandmother was born in Ulster. That is considerably more complcated than my application was


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Have now hit my Irish passport, easy and those in passport department very efficient and helpful 

Use it on this trip to the U.K., straight through no issues

Daughters applying for their passports a tad more complicated but not insurmountable 

One my U.K. Passport lapses I'll not renew it


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## BobfromFrance (Aug 21, 2017)

Megsmum said:


> Have now hit my Irish passport, easy and those in passport department very efficient and helpful


I just hit my French passport and for the smile - my US of A passport also.

As to the original poster - it will be much easier for you to go to the US of A when the time arrives with an Irish passport.


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## moonman (Oct 1, 2012)

Juan C said:


> I was born in London. My mother was born in N. Ireland so UK. However, in 2010, I discovered that I had been Irish from birth as a result of my mother being born in the island of Ireland. I applied for my Irish PP which was issued free, as at that time PPs were free to those over 65. I allowed my UK PP to lapse and had my EU Citizen Registartion in Spain amended.
> 
> Not a single problem encountered-
> 
> My son, born in UK, is in the process of applying for an Irish PP based on the fact that his grandmother was born in Ulster. That is considerably more complcated than my application was


The passports are now 80 euros for all adults there are no more free passports for, o,a,p,s. It is valid for 10 years.


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## siobhanwf (Mar 20, 2009)

My hubby`s Irish passport comes from his Dad who was born in Belfast before 1922. 

Interestingly enough I am entitled to dual nationality as I was born in the republic of IrelaND BEFORE 1948.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Juan C said:


> I allowed my UK PP to lapse and had my EU Citizen Registartion in Spain amended.


Hi and thanx for reply.
Was there a specific reason you let your UK PP lapse, or was it simply you didn't need it anymore as the Irish PP does the job?

On doing some reading it does seem my application will be pretty straight forward, applied online for the form and now waiting for it to drop through the letterbox.

The website isn't great, you don't get an email or even on screen message confirming they received your request!




Megsmum said:


> Have now hit my Irish passport, easy and those in passport department very efficient and helpful
> 
> Use it on this trip to the U.K., straight through no issues
> 
> ...


Hi Megsmum
I remember years ago my mother and I being stopped with her Irish PP coming back from France to UK after a day trip, all our bags searched and generally unfriendly staff. Being singled out was not the best experience.
Why are you letting your UK PP laps?
I'm thinking it can't hurt to have a backup.
A friend recently had his PP in his rucksack and his sweat ruined it and had to replace it. 



BobfromFrance said:


> I just hit my French passport and for the smile - my US of A passport also.
> 
> As to the original poster - it will be much easier for you to go to the US of A when the time arrives with an Irish passport.


Good to know it will be easier, but why? I know the US has a soft spot for Ireland but wasn't aware it was easier to travel!
Have a friend in the US now, so good to know it will be a bit easier to travel!




siobhanwf said:


> My hubby`s Irish passport comes from his Dad who was born in Belfast before 1922.
> 
> Interestingly enough I am entitled to dual nationality as I was born in the republic of IrelaND BEFORE 1948.


Hi siobhanwf
I'm still not 100% clear on dual nationality or dual citizenship as far as from what I've read on the UK gov websites! It just says "EU citizenship is additional to UK citizenship and does not replace it.”

Interesting about your dual "dual nationality" my mum was born before 1948 but I've never heard her talk about that option when talking about passports with her! I'll have to read up on that.


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## Henthree (Sep 14, 2015)

I'm not sure about UK law as regards dual nationality but I do know that the Good Friday Agreement established the principle that people born in Northern Ireland could have Irish or British nationality, or both (and, presumably, or none).

Persons born in the Northern Ireland jurisdiction have always been eligible for Irish passports both before and after the Irish constitutional clause claiming the six counties as part of Ireland was dropped.

I was born and brought up in N Ireland and opted for Irish citizenship for my first trip abroad in 1969. In those days you got the Irish passport in half the time and at half the price of the British one, hard backed too and in a gorgeous shade of green. In the event of problems with Johnny Foreigner we were advised that, in the absence of Irish consular services, the Brits would look after us. Best of both worlds, really.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Muddy said:


> Hi and thanx for reply.
> Was there a specific reason you let your UK PP lapse, or was it simply you didn't need it anymore as the Irish PP does the job?
> 
> On doing some reading it does seem my application will be pretty straight forward, applied online for the form and now waiting for it to drop through the letterbox.
> ...


you are allow d duel nationality Irish/British. If that changes post Brexit the U.K. side will definitely go. I have just used my Irish passport for the first time it made no difference entering the U.K. Whatsoever


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

If a mod wants to tidy up that mess in the previous post feel free


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## ccm47 (Oct 15, 2013)

I got my Irish passport almost a year ago. Since I have only driven across Europe since then I haven't really needed it for travel purposes but everytime anyone such as bank, revenue, or health official asks for ID I produce that one now. I do not want anybody to be able to say to me in a couple of years time " You're British so you need to do x, y and z now" 

Do I feel Irish? Of course not, I was born in London and have only ever been to Ireland for a weekend! However, I am very grateful that they have provided me with a means of continuing to live my expat lifestyle after Brexit and hopefully I will be alllowed to keep my purebred English OH with me as my dependent! 

I probably won't need to renew my UK passport.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Megsmum said:


> If a mod wants to tidy up that mess in the previous post feel free


*What mess?*
Thanx for the replies to specific points 
BTW. I was referring to the PP website regarding requesting a form, not after I send it back! I really hope it doesn't take 6 months, I aim on being out of here by then!
The webform also has a bug and failed the first time and also incorrectly counts the 250 limit on text in one section. Easy to think you've sent a passport form request when in fact you may not have.
Site of that type really should send email confirmation IMO.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

ccm47 said:


> I got my Irish passport almost a year ago. Since I have only driven across Europe since then I haven't really needed it for travel purposes but everytime anyone such as bank, revenue, or health official asks for ID I produce that one now. I do not want anybody to be able to say to me in a couple of years time " You're British so you need to do x, y and z now"
> 
> Do I feel Irish? Of course not, I was born in London and have only ever been to Ireland for a weekend! However, I am very grateful that they have provided me with a means of continuing to live my expat lifestyle after Brexit and hopefully I will be alllowed to keep my purebred English OH with me as my dependent!
> 
> I probably won't need to renew my UK passport.


Yeah I think I'll being doing the same as far as producing my future Irish PP for anything official!
I'm also born in London, but have lived in Ireland for several years as a child. I also don't feel Irish, but never really felt English either, maybe as I was made feel very unwelcome when returning the UK with an Irish accent. 

Well I hope you and others don't have any issues with their OH staying in the EU after brexit, I'm sure it will not make things easier.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Muddy said:


> Yeah I think I'll being doing the same as far as producing my future Irish PP for anything official!
> I'm also born in London, but have lived in Ireland for several years as a child. I also don't feel Irish, but never really felt English either, maybe as I was made feel very unwelcome when returning the UK with an Irish accent.
> 
> Well I hope you and others don't have any issues with their OH staying in the EU after brexit, I'm sure it will not make things easier.


I have always been more Irish than English because that's where my genes come from, both parents Irish, the only persons born in England were myself and my brother. 

I do not foresee any issues,


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

Megsmum said:


> If a mod wants to tidy up that mess in the previous post feel free



Megsmum
How long did it take for your Irish PP, my daughter now wants one, she will use me as her connection and get it in London.


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

As far as the place or date if you were born in Ireland it is irrelevant, as when it comes to Irish PP's the border is not recognised. So long as you are born on the island of Ireland you have Irish citizenship and are entitled to the PP. Also children etc. My wife is not entitled to one as she has never lived in Ireland. I think you have to have lived there for two years to get a spouses PP.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Roy C said:


> As far as the place or date if you were born in Ireland it is irrelevant, as when it comes to Irish PP's the border is not recognised. So long as you are born on the island of Ireland you have Irish citizenship and are entitled to the PP. Also children etc. My wife is not entitled to one as she has never lived in Ireland. I think you have to have lived there for two years to get a spouses PP.


All correct

Process took 6 months.........I had to apply via Madrid Embassy.... there was a huge backlog as there is only one girl dealing with the sudden rush.


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## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

Roy _As far as the place or date if you were born in Ireland it is irrelevant_

I understand that persons born in Ireland before 31st December 1948 are entitled to UK Nationality.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Juan C said:


> Roy _As far as the place or date if you were born in Ireland it is irrelevant_
> 
> I understand that persons born in Ireland before 31st December 1948 are entitled to UK Nationality.


Yes and no, following on from the Good Friday agreement anyone born on the Island of Ireland before January 1st 2005 is by birthright entitled to be an Irish citizen... so by default before 1948!

Irish citizenship through birth or descent



Having re rad the information, my grandson can also claim citizenship. this link is the official link. There is also an online tool link where you answer questions and it tells you what you as an individual has to do


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## Juan C (Sep 4, 2017)

Megsmum

What I posted was "I understand that persons born in Ireland (Republic) before 31st December *1948 are entitled to UK Nationality.*


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Juan C said:


> Megsmum
> 
> What I posted was "I understand that persons born in Ireland (Republic) before 31st December *1948 are entitled to UK Nationality.*


Apologies. I misread the post 

My understanding is anyone who had been a citizen of the Republic of Ireland on 31 December 1948 and must have made a claim to remain a British subject


But


If you didn’t make a claim to remain a British subject you can apply to the Home Secretary to become a British subject if either:

you’ve been in Crown service for the UK government
you’re associated with the UK or a British overseas territory by descent, residence or another way


So not automatic, in so far as I understand the wording .... but I read your post wrong so who knows :yo:


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## siobhanwf (Mar 20, 2009)

I was born in Ireland before 1948 (just) 
I held an Irish passport until I was 22 and when I joined BOAC as a stewardess in 1968 I applied for and got (without any problems) a British passport. It is however marked BRITISH SUBJECT and not of the UNITED KINGDOM and Northern Ireland.

I currently hold dual nationality


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

siobhanwf said:


> I was born in Ireland before 1948 (just)
> I held an Irish passport until I was 22 and when I joined BOAC as a stewardess in 1968 I applied for and got (withoutre there's any problems) a British passport. It is however marked BRITISH SUBJECT and not of the UNITED KINGDOM and Northern Ireland.
> 
> I currently hold dual nationality


Yes I'm pretty sure there's a difference between subject and citizen... do you still have it?


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## angkag (Oct 29, 2013)

For sure, wish I had an Irish passport or claims to one.....

(visions of a Trumpian wall to keep the British refugees out of Ireland in the future and refugee boats crossing the channel)


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

Juan C said:


> Roy _As far as the place or date if you were born in Ireland it is irrelevant_
> 
> I understand that persons born in Ireland before 31st December 1948 are entitled to UK Nationality.


I hear what you're saying, however I don't think that is relevant as this thread is about Irish Passport and Citizenship, is it not?


Also, I was born in Dublin in 1958 and moved to Belfast in 1960 I can have either passport. In fact I needed a passport in a hurry once (last minute .com) and when I couldn't get my Irish one issued on time I got a British one on the production of my Irish birth certificate, form filling and the usual reference. I also use to sign peoples photographs and form in my old job for their British Passport application.


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## siobhanwf (Mar 20, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> Yes I'm pretty sure there's a difference between subject and citizen... do you still have it?



Yes I do. Will take a photo tomorrow


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Roy C said:


> I hear what you're saying, however I don't think that is relevant as this thread is about Irish Passport and Citizenship, is it not?
> 
> 
> Also, I was born in Dublin in 1958 and moved to Belfast in 1960 I can have either passport. In fact I needed a passport in a hurry once (last minute .com) and when I couldn't get my Irish one issued on time I got a British one on the production of my Irish birth certificate, form filling and the usual reference. I also use to sign peoples photographs and form in my old job for their British Passport application.


I did actually ask a followup question about the 1948 dual nationality info posted by siobhanwf earlier in the thread so that's my fault . My mother wasn't aware of the fact so was good that it was mentioned for me at least.

On another followup to my post, I'm still awaiting the application form, that will be 11 days tomorrow. Seems a long time to wait for a form but I'm sure they're very busy.
Maybe I'll have to make a trip there to collect one if it doesn't turn up soon! With no email confirmation you can never be sure those webforms have delivered your request!


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