# Permanent Residency in Japan



## larabell

Hi,

As of noon (or so) yesterday, I now have a visa stamp in my passport which bears no expiration date. Having accomplished this feat allows me to debunk a couple of the stranger myths about Japanese permanent residency that I've picked up along the way.

First, you obviously don't have to be a famous celebrity or a sumo wrestler. I'm neither.

Second, you don't have to have a Japanese spouse (although, from what I hear, that can make the application more of a formality than a hurdle).

And, lastly, you don't have to fit the apparent high standards suggested by the examples presented on the MOFA website.

You probably *do* have to be able to show some committment to living in Japan (there are no written rules but I've been here over 10 years now). You probably also have to show some reason why you want to live here forever, other than simply enjoying the parties in Roppongi. We have two kids who were born here but, because Japanese citizenship only transmits by parentage, they're both US citizens. They played a large part in the "reasons" essay I wrote as part of the application. It's not certain which of the reasons I gave turned out to be the winner -- they don't return the paperwork with grades on each point. But you can bet they at least considered the reasons before granting the visa.

The point is that if you're patient, stable, and have good intentions, you *can* obtain permanent residency in Japan -- even if you're just a working stiff like the rest of us.

I hope this information helps encourage others who may be thinking of applying. If anyone is in that position and has questions as to my personal process, contact me either privately or on this thread.


----------



## Chester Banks

Thanks for that


----------



## chamel

*Permanent Visa*



larabell said:


> Hi,
> 
> As of noon (or so) yesterday, I now have a visa stamp in my passport which bears no expiration date. Having accomplished this feat allows me to debunk a couple of the stranger myths about Japanese permanent residency that I've picked up along the way.


First off let me say congratulations on your permanent resident status. It's something that I really want also.

Let me give you some background on me and then ask my question, since you seem to have more knowledge on this subject.

I have been married to a Japanese national for 19 years and have 2 elementary school boys. We have lived in Hokkaido since March 2008 and are on a 3 year spouse visa.

We are planning on starting the paperwork to renew our visa's at the end of 2010 which will give us 3-4 months before the current visa expires. I am sure our next visa will be either 3-5 years in length.

Our 2 sons are in Japanese public elementary school, and I have a full time job teaching English.

Now for the question: What are my chances of getting permanent residence on the next renewal period? Someone told me you have to be in country for 5 consecutive years before they will consider permanent, but with my status I am thinking this might can be done sooner.

Thanks for your advice.


----------



## larabell

chamel said:


> Now for the question: What are my chances of getting permanent residence on the next renewal period? Someone told me you have to be in country for 5 consecutive years before they will consider permanent, but with my status I am thinking this might can be done sooner.


I've heard after 10 years and I've heard after 3 consecutive 3-year terms. I've never seen any written rule and, when I asked, I was told that's because there *is* no written rule. My guess is that, like so many other things in Japan, it's decided on a case-by-case basis.

I'd kinda be surprised if you were granted permanent status after only 3 years. But you've been married for 19 years which clearly shows the marriage is not for the purpose of obtaining a visa. I'm sure that's one concern of the Immigration guys. But the "feel" of the application process seems to also be about showing a commitment to live in Japan permanently... which isn't so clearly demonstrated after only 3 years.

You could try. I was told that a rejection doesn't prevent you from applying again. I was also told by the paralegal working for the attorney that handled my first couple of renewals that their usual trick was to apply for PR right after receiving the 2nd 3-year extension (which would be after 6 years with the new expiration date being 9 years after your original entry into Japan). So... you *could* try that trick after receiving your 1st 3-year renewal, on the assumption that by the time you'd have to renew again, you'd already be past the (mostly arbitrary) 5-year mark. Your marital status should help -- at least when it comes to the essay on *why* you want to live in Japan permanently.

You also have to write an essay about your "contributions" to Japan during your stay. I imagine that would be easier to do after 2 or 3 renewal cycles -- and you certainly don't have to worry about your interim extensions being rejected, given your marital status.

But the bottom line is that there isn't much knowledge in this area to be had. The Immigration website paints a fairly bleak picture but folks who have done it (and some who have helped others do it, like the aforementioned paralegal) claim that it's not all that difficult to get a PR visa. The truth lies somewhere between those two extremes and, quite possibly, more related to the whim of the official who processes your paperwork than any hard-and-fast rule. (Maybe the application process is the true test and anyone who actually submits everything they ask for is an automatic shoe-in -- that's certainly possible... they ask for a *lot* of stuff.)

This is probably the best time to try, though, while Japanese officials are officially worried about the declining population. If you have a job and pay your taxes, that's a huge point in your favor right now. If you have any sort of technical skill, they'll probably put your application on the top of the stack... maybe...

One question, though... other than not having to go to through the whole extension process every three years, is there really any need to rush in your case (as line as you intend to stay married, that is)? You already have about the best guarantee of continued extension you could get and, if memory serves me, a spousal visa gives you complete freedom over what you can do while you're here. I'd rather wait and not risk having to go through the process twice.

If you still want to give it a try, though, 3-4 months isn't enough lead time. The girl at the window said "6 months" when I submitted my application, the web site says "6 months", and my postcard arrived almost exactly 6 months later. Same for my wife. Same for another friend of mine when he applied. It's almost like the approval cards get stuffed in a tickler file and mailed out exactly 6 months after the application, even if the approval process is finished sooner than that. So either apply 6 1/2 months before your expiration, or right after you get your next extension, or submit two applications (which is what I did, based on my attorney's recommendation -- I had only two months to go on my current visa when I applied).

Sorry I don't have an exact answer. Possibly nobody does. I hope that at least helps some.

BTW... as far as I know, Immigration doesn't give 5-year visas. Only 1-year, 3-years, and permanent. A translated version of the current Immigration Law is online somewhere but I forget exactly where. Even my kids, who now hold "Spouse or Child of Permanent Resident" status, only got 3 years.


----------



## Maiyim

*Maintaining permanent residency*

Looks like it's been a while since any activity on this thread, but am hoping for some quick and simple answers here - may be too much to hope for?

Are there requirements for Americans with ei-jyuu-ken to spend a certain amount of time in Japan?
The US requires people with US "green card" to spend MORE than 1/2 the year in the US. Does Japan have some reciprocal requirement?

I am in the US right now, post earthquake, and having a hard time finding out.
My ei-jyuu-ken was just approved and I must go back to Japan to get it, but unsure what I will need to do to keep it, if anything. I know that if out of Japan, one must always return to Japan before re-entry permit expires.

Anything else? anyone have answers? you can also respond to 
MaiyimBaron at JapaneseInterpreter dot com
Please HELP - as this is a vital question for my future plans!
Sincerely,
Maiyim


----------



## djrajn

10yrs!! Real hard!!
Congrats!!


----------



## Febjanza

*Retaining Permanent Residency*

I've been living in Fukushima-ken, Japan for 15 years (exactly, from today) and got permanent residency about 4 years ago. My wife and daughter have now also got permanent residency (they are not Japanese, of course), but will return to Australia permanently next February. Maybe I too, will return to Australia in August 2012. I am just wondering if it is possible to retain permanent residency assuming I come back to Japan before the re-entry permit expires even if I have no fixed address in Japan, and have an Alien Registration Card which may not have expired but will have an incorrect address on it (where I no longer live)?


----------



## Joppa

Febjanza said:


> I've been living in Fukushima-ken, Japan for 15 years (exactly, from today) and got permanent residency about 4 years ago. My wife and daughter have now also got permanent residency (they are not Japanese, of course), but will return to Australia permanently next February. Maybe I too, will return to Australia in August 2012. I am just wondering if it is possible to retain permanent residency assuming I come back to Japan before the re-entry permit expires even if I have no fixed address in Japan, and have an Alien Registration Card which may not have expired but will have an incorrect address on it (where I no longer live)?


Well, the minimum you should do is to return to Japan before the expiry of re-entry permit (currently 3 years) and take out another re-entry permit. You should be an ordinary resident of Japan so you should be paying compulsory health and pension levies. Your alien registration card requires renewal every 7 years, needing another trip (beware renewal window is only 30 days). Not having a proper local address will be an issue, though.

Even then, if your stay in Japan is considered too short, the immigration bureau may cast doubt over your resident status and can cancel your permanent residence permit. This can happen when you try to re-enter Japan.

In short, it's quite difficult to retain your PR status unless you are a genuine resident.


----------



## Febjanza

Joppa said:


> In short, it's quite difficult to retain your PR status unless you are a genuine resident.


Thanks for your reply. I knew that not having a place of residence in Japan would be a problem, but never considered tax and pensions etc. Surely there would be some permanent residents who are out of work from time to time, I would have thought.


----------



## Glenski

Supposedly, beginning in 2012, PR holders will be able to leave the country for 1 year without a reentry permit, but after that they will need one. The whole reentry permit system is changing then. So are alien registration cards.
Bye-bye to the gaijin card, welcome to the Juki Net in '12 | The Japan Times Online

If you can't stay in Japan (or any country where you have PR or a green card) and hold a residence, how can you justify having permanent resident status? Sounds like you want your cake and be able to eat it, too.


----------



## Febjanza

Glenski said:


> Supposedly, beginning in 2012, PR holders will be able to leave the country for 1 year without a reentry permit, but after that they will need one. The whole reentry permit system is changing then. So are alien registration cards.
> 
> If you can't stay in Japan (or any country where you have PR or a green card) and hold a residence, how can you justify having permanent resident status? Sounds like you want your cake and be able to eat it, too.


Thanks for the link. It seems a pity that immigration may take over responsibility for all this. Their office is a little far away for me, and city hall staff know me reasonably well. 

I definitely want my cake and be able to eat it, too, as long as it's legal.


----------



## jcsag

*Permanent schmermanent*

I have had permanent residency since March of 2007.

I was reading over changes in residency procedures that go into effect July of 2012. The tract I read states that "permanent" residents will now have to go into immigration to "renew" their "permanent" residency status every 7 years. What is permanent about this?

Also, it states that people with employment visas and spouse visas will now in most cases get renewed every 5 years instead of 3.

So, by and large, by going through the time and effort to get my permanent residency it will soon mean I only get two more years than regular visa holders to "renew" my residency. 

Yes, I realize they are other advantages to permanent residency such as my "activities" in Japan not being limited etc. But as far as I know, maybe I have to bring paperwork proving gainful employment etc. for whatever this "renewal" process entails. And that would mean it is no different from a visa.

Anyone else read about this or have other comments or insights?


PS: Must also reply to a comment above:
"Supposedly, beginning in 2012, PR holders will be able to leave the country for 1 year without a reentry permit, but after that they will need one. The whole reentry permit system is changing then. So are alien registration cards"

Sorry, all long term visa holders and permanent residency holders get the 1 year no-entry permit treatment. No special treatment for permanent residents there.


----------



## larabell

I read the stuff a while back and didn't see anything about having to renew a PR visa. The alien registration card that used to be handled by your local ward office will now be handled by Immigration. The old ones have an expiration already (5 years, if I remember right) and the new ones will probably have an expiration as well, though I don't recall the brochure saying anything about that. In any case, that's just the ID card you carry -- I didn't see anything about having to renew PR visas.

The seven year thing applies to "Special Permanent Residents", which is another status altogether (you'd have to be pretty old to hold that status, from what I've read).

Overall, I think the move is going to be beneficial for most people. You can still change your address simply by visiting your local ward office. Changes in visa status require a trip to Immigration anyway so this just eliminates the second trip to the ward office. And not having to renew one's re-entry permit every three years also means fewer visits to Immigration.

On the earlier topic, there is a longer brochure on soumu.go.jp that says "When moving overseas, even if you have a Re-Entry Permit, you will need to submit a 'notification of moving out' but, as far as I can tell, that's something you submit to the local municipality when you move elsewhere (and something the Japanese apparently have to file as well) so that probably has more to do with the Juki system than visas.


----------



## jcsag

The paperwork is in front of me and both permanent residents and special permanent residents have to go into the immigration bureau to renew their cards. Before, yes, I had to go to my local municipality to renew my "gaijin card", a process that rarely took more than 20 minutes if I went at a time that was not so busy. Now, you and I will have to truck all the way over to the immigration bureau and take a number to wait and wait. The reason I became a PR was to avoid this. There is no information yet about what paperwork we will need, but it had better be less paperwork than a visa or what is the point?


----------



## jcsag

I can't seem to link the PDF, but put this into google and click on the first link for the PDF:

NewResidencyManagementSystem-(EN)

If you get time to read it, we don't have to do anything about it until our July 8th, 2015, unless our "gaijin cards" expire before then. This is better than nothing, but it is the principle of the matter.


----------



## larabell

I found something that may indirectly answer the question... more-or-less:

===
Q: Do I need to immediately replace my current Alien Registration Certificate with a Residence Card or Special Permanent Resident
Certificate?
A: No. You are not required to replace it immediately after the start of the new residency management system (although you may do
so if you so wish). The Alien Registration Certificate that mid-to long-term residents currently possess will be deemed equivalent to a
Resident Card or Special Permanent Resident Certificate for a certain period from the enforcement date of the amended act. Mid-to
long-term residents (except Permanent Residents) will be asked to exchange their Alien Registration Certificates for Resident Cards
when they apply for an extension of the Period of Stay, or anything else at a Regional Immigration Office. Those who are permanent
residents need to apply for an exchange of Resident Cards at a Regional Immigration Office, and Special Permanent Residents will
exchange for the new Special Permanent Resident Certificates at the municipality office where they live. Details regarding the
exchange procedure will be communicated later.
===

The separate references to Permanent Residents and Special Permanent Residents confirms my suspicion that these seven-year guys are in a different category. The fact that it says Permanent Residents will not be asked to change their Alien Registration Certificates for Resident Cards seems to imply that the ARCs may be effective... what... forever?

I don't much care whether it's every seven years in Shinagawa or every five years in Nakano -- it's a pain either way. But since it appears to be just a renewal of registration, I can't imagine it would be as big a deal as renewing a visa. For those living farther out, it's probably more of a pain -- assuming the new cards actually expire (which we haven't yet established). You know, part of the point of the new system is to reduce paperwork and I would imagine that handling these renewals is probably as much of a pain for Immigration as it is for us. If you're worried about it, you should call them up -- the brochures that I've seen all contain phone numbers where you can ask questions.

I don't see this as a big deal. But... this being Japan... I'm not willing to put any money on that.


----------



## jcsag

That PDF did not have all the pertinent information. Here is more. I have bolded the areas of interest for PR holders

Major Changes
1	A residence card will be issued, replacing the current Alien Registration Certificate. (A Special Permanent Resident Certificate will be issued to special permanent residents.)
2	The current alien registration system will be abolished once the new system starts. A residence record will be compiled for foreign residents eligible under the new system, in the same manner as for Japanese residents.
3	The new system will be applied only to those with a legal status of residence and whose period of stay is over 3 months. The new system will not be applied to those with no status of residence or whose status of residence is “Temporary Visitor.”
1	*The Immigration Bureau will deal with all of the following item*s: changes in status of residence, extension of period of stay, *renewal of residence cards*, and changes in name and nationality. These procedures no longer need to be performed at the office of a city, ward, town or village.
2	City, ward, town and village offices will continue to deal with the following items: change of address and national health insurance.
*1	The effective period of the residence card is 7 years for permanent residents*. The effective period for foreigners with other statuses of residence will be the same as their period of stay. For foreigners other than permanent residents, a new residence card will be issued every time they extend their period of stay.
2	There are fewer items to be listed on the residence card compared with the Alien Registration Certificate. For example, name of the householder, place of birth, passport number or alias are not listed.
3	The name in full to be listed on your residence card should be written in the Roman alphabet in principal, as written in your passport. Foreigners whose names are written in kanji (Chinese characters) in their Alien Registration Certificate, such as Chinese and Koreans, can have their kanji alongside their name in the Roman alphabet.
4	The current Alien Registration Certificate will remain valid for a period of time after the introduction of the new system. For details on how long your card will be valid for, please make an inquiry.


----------



## larabell

Correction... the PDF brochure at the other end of the google search you suggested clearly states that the new Resident Card expires in seven years so that part's settled. But the first page also says the new law doesn't apply to "Special Permanent Residents", as if that mattered.

So we all get to see the inside of an Immigration office once every seven years. I was already going at least every three years for re-entry permits, which I don't have to do any more. But my kids are both "Child of Permanent Resident" so I had to visit there every three years anyway.


----------



## jcsag

Yes, I assume the process will be simpler to renew permanent residency with the news, but for information about that all sites I found advised me to call the immigration bureau - this has likely not been fully decided yet.

I also learned that no one should have to go twice to get their visas/cards renewed, but my understanding is that is both PRs and visa holders.

One of the reasons I got my PR was to avoid that trek to the Shinagawa office (not that I am assuming that is where you have to go) and sit for too much of the day waiting on the paperwork. And again, it is the principle of the matter.


----------



## Glenski

jcsag said:


> I have had permanent residency since March of 2007.
> 
> I was reading over changes in residency procedures that go into effect July of 2012. The tract I read states that "permanent" residents will now have to go into immigration to "renew" their "permanent" residency status every 7 years. What is permanent about this?


You didn't read it right. You always had to renew your ALIEN REGISTRATION CARD. We permanent residents got a bit of a break in how long we were required to do this.

That has not changed. We still renew the card every 7 years. You have not lost your PR status if you forget to do that.



> Also, it states that people with employment visas and spouse visas will now in most cases get renewed every 5 years instead of 3.


I believe this is the MAXIMUM for work visa holders, not a regular thing.




> PS: Must also reply to a comment above:
> "Supposedly, beginning in 2012, PR holders will be able to leave the country for 1 year without a reentry permit, but after that they will need one. The whole reentry permit system is changing then. So are alien registration cards"
> 
> Sorry, all long term visa holders and permanent residency holders get the 1 year no-entry permit treatment. No special treatment for permanent residents there.


Yes, no special treatment if your stay is only one year. Big deal. Why do you care?


----------



## jcsag

Yes, I suppose I was overreacting some. I am a diehard pessimist.

I realize that in the end the place I will have to go to get my "gaikokujin torooku shomeisho" which is now a "zairyu card" is the big scary immigration burea instead of the nice people at my local office. I just have bad images of being asked for more than just my passport and a photo to get my card renewed.

I only replied to the re-entry permit post because it said this was something for permanent residents when it was now clear it applied to all longer term residents of Japan - this had not yet been clarified here.

And somewhere the paperwork I read said that "in practice" the visa renewal period had been extended to five years. That is what the large majority of people will get.


----------



## larabell

jcsag said:


> ... is the big scary immigration burea instead of the nice people at my local office.


Yeah... and some people who live out in the boonies will have to travel to the big city once in a while but at least it's only once in seven years. I've never had any trouble with Immigration that wasn't of my own doing. I even forgot to bring my kids' alien registrations once when picking up their visa stamps and the lady behind the counter said: "just a second" and went in the back and looked it up online (and gave me a bit of a stern warning about 'next time' ).



> And somewhere the paperwork I read said that "in practice" the visa renewal period had been extended to five years. That is what the large majority of people will get.


Actually, I hadn't even seen that until I was looking over the PDF you recommended. That's good news for me because it means my two kids should get 5 years next time and I won't have to visit on their behalf so many times. But... since US passports for children are only good for 5 years (and, because of the multiple 3-year visas, the expiration dates are not in sync), I doubt I'll soon forget my way around the Shinagawa Immigration office. Before I got my PR, I was down there at least once a year for some reason or another.


----------



## jcsag

My first trip to Shinagawa, I dealt with a few very "officious" even snobbish people, and it has colored my feelings about the place ever since. When I lived in the countryside, I had to travel pretty far to get the visa renewal (and that was once every year) but they were very nice.

Anyway, I understand the good reasons behind the changes. It will certainly help to keep better track of people, and I can finally be listed as "head of household" if I wanted to.

I guess I had thought I had escaped ever having to see the inside of that massive Shinagawa building when I heard they were effectively getting rid of re-entry permits.

It sounds like the changes will suit your needs well with your kids visas to arrange. I only have one child, and he has dual citizenship.


----------



## Rube

I think I had to go there once. If it's the same place it had some of the nastiest people working there. I was on a flight that day and I forgot my re-entry which was silly of course but the lady tried to close for lunch on me even after I told her it would be too late and she didn't care. So I let into her and told what a nasty person I thought she was. The mannager came over and took the 2 seconds to stamp my visa. 

Some people just like to be nasty to gaijins when they are put in a position of power over us, be it for driving licenses or visas or what not. Same kind of people who become cops to screw with kids. Total power trip.


----------



## Febjanza

larabell said:


> On the earlier topic, there is a longer brochure on soumu.go.jp that says "When moving overseas, even if you have a Re-Entry Permit, you will need to submit a 'notification of moving out' but, as far as I can tell, that's something you submit to the local municipality when you move elsewhere (and something the Japanese apparently have to file as well) so that probably has more to do with the Juki system than visas.


Sorry, maybe I missed it, but what is the link for this brochure?


----------



## Patch66

not sure why you waited but for sure you can secure PR after 5 consecutive years, anyhow congrats.


----------



## larabell

Patch66 said:


> not sure why you waited but for sure you can secure PR after 5 consecutive years, anyhow congrats.


It's not "for sure" unless you happen to be married to a Japanese national (even then it's not "for sure" but I've never heard of a spouse being turned down for PR). The rule-of-thumb, according to what little information you can get from Immigration, is 10 years. One visa agent that my company hired when I first got here said that their rule was to file sometime after having received one's third 3-year visa (that is, the second 3-year extension after the initial visa). But PR is not based on how long you've been here but on whether it's likely you're actually planning to live in Japan permanently and whether Japan is likely to benefit from your long-term presence. In general, there's no way for them to know that if you've only been here a few years.
If you marry a Japanese the criteria is different because, presumably, you have a very good reason to live here permanently.


----------



## 4msailor

Thanks for this info , especially for clearing my doubts regarding the marriage part . I always thought that it was a necessity to settle there . I always wanted to settle here for the anime , games , cosplayers and especially to meet ulzzangs and cute japanese girls .


----------



## Miaka

May I know what is the difference between a PR and a Citizenship in Japan? What are the extra privileges of being a citizen compared to PR?


----------



## larabell

Miaka said:


> What are the extra privileges of being a citizen compared to PR?


Well... for one thing a citizen can vote in elections but a non-citizen cannot (I'd be willing to bet a non-citizen can't run for public office, either... but I've never tried so I don't know). A citizen can leave the country for as long as he wants without having to ask permission to come back. On the downside, a non-citizen probably can't be conscripted into the military -- but in the case of Japan that's not an issue because Japan isn't (and doesn't seem likely to start) conscripting its citizens into military service.

As a citizen, you also can't be deported... no matter what you do. Of course, for some things deportation is probably preferable to spending the rest of your life in a Japanese prison.

Permanent residency is simply a status -- it doesn't make you Japanese. Citizenship does.


----------

