# Visa decisions



## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

My plans have changed and I'm a little unclear on my best course of action. 

Here's my situation:
I am here on an FMM (I have been on FMMs for my 2.5 years living here) -- my current one is good until May 5, 2012.
I will be married to a Mexican national in six weeks (March 17th).

My original plan was to return to the US to do some work in April, thus receiving a new FMM upon my return in early May. Then I would apply for a "residente-temporal" visa under the new regulations that were supposed to be in effect last November (but who knows when in reality). In two years, I'd be good for a residente-permanente as a spouse of a national and all would be good.

But...

The work in the US fell through and so I have no need to leave the country outside of getting a new FMM. Plus, INM still hasn't implemented the new visa system and I can't bank on them doing so any time soon.

So, it looks like I should instead get my "no-inmigante" visa under the current system... or will my marriage make me eligible for the "inmigrante" visa?

However, as I understand it, you have to apply for your "no-inmigante" or "inmigante" visa within 30 days of receiving your FMM. If that's the case, then my time has passed and I will still need to leave the country to get a new FMM so I can apply for a visa.

So, as I see it, my best (only?) option is to leave Mexico, get a new FMM and apply for whatever visa is available to me at the time of my return: inmigrante, no-inmigrante or residente-temporal (if INM gets its act together).

Am I thinking correctly here?

Thanks!


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

I won't try to explain all the misconceptions you have, so it will just be simpler if you go to the INM website and start your application now. Apply for 'Inmigrante' and in two years you will be eligible for naturalization as a Mexican citizen/spouse of a Mexican national.
"Piece of Cake", or as you'll discover, "Pan Comido".
Once you have saved and printed the online forms, and gathered your FMM, Passport & other document copies, go to INM and they'll check the forms & give you a receipt with a web address to check the progress.


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

The only 30 day limit might be 30 days before your FMM expires. I would definitely apply for the new visa after you are married or you may have to do it all again. You would at least have to inform immigration of your change of status


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

RVGRINGO said:


> I won't try to explain all the misconceptions you have, so it will just be simpler if you go to the INM website and start your application now. Apply for 'Inmigrante' and in two years you will be eligible for naturalization as a Mexican citizen/spouse of a Mexican national.
> "Piece of Cake", or as you'll discover, "Pan Comido".
> Once you have saved and printed the online forms, and gathered your FMM, Passport & other document copies, go to INM and they'll check the forms & give you a receipt with a web address to check the progress.


I think RV is saying you don't need to worry about the "30 days of receiving your FMM [sic]" or leaving the country. Just apply for an inmigrante visa.


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## conklinwh (Dec 19, 2009)

Inmigrante is a good decision but a word of caution. Do you have a US plated vehicle?
We had friend here that lawyer did the inmigrante but filed under a category that didn't allow US plated car. Interesting discussion at police checkpoint.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Inmigrante is OK with a US plated car if you are NOT working. In any case, a Mexican car is all you can drive, once naturalized, or if working as an 'Inmigrante'.


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## conklinwh (Dec 19, 2009)

There must be other categories that have an issue as this person not working. Something about track to permanent resident.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I had hoped to never have to deal with the current law and only deal with the new law. It appears that the new law won't take effect in time, so....

I read the whole current law (the one from 2010) as it is on the books here: http://www.dof.gob.mx/nota_detalle.php?codigo=5129775&fecha=29/01/2010
Interestingly enough, in it they use the terms FM2 and FM3 in many places intermixed with the terms "inmigrante" and "no-inmigrante". I'll use FM2/3 here when talking about the 2010 law to save typing. What a nasty mess of a law it is.

First - the 30 days issue. Under each category of FM2 or FM3 it states:
"Plazo máximo para resolver el trámite: 30 días naturales."
My lawyer friend agree that it is very unclear and could be interpreted to mean you have to get your visa within 30 days of entering with an FMM but, in fact, it probably is only a mandate for INM to not take longer than 30 to process your visa after you apply.
So, yes, it appears that I was mistaken about the 30 days but even a lawyer agrees that it is badly written in the law and very confusing. Mea culpa.

I read every category of FM2 and I only would fit the "Familiar" and "Rentista" categories.
According to what is written, for "familiar" my wife would have to show sufficient income to support me (earlier in the document it states that she is the "solicitante", not me, because she is "sponsoring" me as a cunjugal family member.)
"e) Acreditar en forma fehaciente la solvencia económica del solicitante, la cual deberá ser suficiente, a juicio del INM, para atender las necesidades de su cónyuge o familiar."

I support us, not her.

For the "rentista" type I would need to show 400X the minimum salary instead of 250X. I can show 250X, 400 is not going to happen.

I am not seeing a category of FM2 that I would fit into. 

In the new law everything is very clear. In the current one it is opaque.
Under the new law I would get my "residente-temporal" and in two years I could convert to "residente-permanente" (not citizenship as rvgringo states) as a spouse of a national and in two more years I could apply for citizenship (4 years total).


Under the current law what are the advantages of "inmigrante" over "no-inmigrante"? Once the new law takes effect, won't they be moot?


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

circle110 said:


> ... Under the current law what are the advantages of "inmigrante" over "no-inmigrante"? Once the new law takes effect, won't they be moot?


Under pre May law, after 5 years as an inmigrante, you can convert to an inmigrado. Then you no longer have to mess with Migracion every year; it is permanent. Once the new law takes effect, it will indeed be moot.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

sparks said:


> The only 30 day limit might be 30 days before your FMM expires. I would definitely apply for the new visa after you are married or you may have to do it all again. You would at least have to inform immigration of your change of status



Honest guys, I am not trying to start an argument but when there are rules written down in black and white on an official form issued by the Mexican Government that tourists sign listing certain regulations someone always turns things around and tells people go ahead do it, this is what this means or it Mexico,you can get away with it............

This is what is written on the back of your FMM in the 3rd paragraph from the top:

For foreigners holding a Mexican visa that enables them to obtain an FM3 or FM2 this
FMM vouches for his legal stay just for thirty days as of entry. IT IS VERY IMPORTANT
that you exchange this FMM for an FM2 or FM3 immigration form within this period of time at the Regional Delegation of the INM closest to your residence. Otherwise you will be in an irregular situation and will be subject to the sanctions provided by law..............

Is it any any doubt or confusion as to what it states?


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

chicois8 said:


> Honest guys, I am not trying to start an argument but when there are rules written down in black and white on an official form issued by the Mexican Government that tourists sign listing certain regulations someone always turns things around and tells people go ahead do it, this is what this means or it Mexico,you can get away with it............
> 
> This is what is written on the back of your FMM in the 3rd paragraph from the top:
> 
> ...


Yes, there is doubt. As I read the law this is what I understood: If you get what I suppose can be called a "pre-FM2/3" at the Mexican consulate in the US, you still enter Mexico with an FMM. If you are in that status you have 30 days to convert your "pre-FM2/3" it into a regular FM2/3. An FMM is not a visa so that cannot be what they are referring to. It appears to refer to that kind of "pre-visa" from the foreign Mex consulate that is "a Mexican visa that enables them to obtain an FM3 or FM2".

That probably is what has caused my, and perhaps your confusion, chicois8.
Seriously, that pre-May law is clearly what we referred to in the IT field as a kluster-f^&&*.
Bring on the new law, por favor!


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## makaloco (Mar 26, 2009)

chicois8 said:


> Is it any any doubt or confusion as to what it states?


Yes, with this part:
"For foreigners holding a Mexican visa that enables them to obtain an FM3 or FM2…"
I believe the "visa" referred to is the one issued by Mexican consulates when people do the initial residence paperwork there before coming to Mexico. We don't have any indication that the OP has such a visa, and if not, then the 30 day limitation on the FMM may not apply. If it did, why would they issue the FMM for 180 days?


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

makaloco said:


> Yes, with this part:
> "For foreigners holding a Mexican visa that enables them to obtain an FM3 or FM2…"
> I believe the "visa" referred to is the one issued by Mexican consulates when people do the initial residence paperwork there before coming to Mexico. We don't have any indication that the OP has such a visa, and if not, then the 30 day limitation on the FMM may not apply. If it did, why would they issue the FMM for 180 days?


Wouldn't it make more sense to see the Spanish and talk about that. This is probably a translation issue.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

TundraGreen said:


> Wouldn't it make more sense to see the Spanish and talk about that. This is probably a translation issue.


I agree and I would post the Spanish but the web page has been removed from the gob.mx website as of 9:30 tonight. It used to be here:
http://www.dof.gob.mx/nota_detalle.php?codigo=5129775&fecha=29/01/2010

but as of about 9:30 tonight it disappeared. I am hoping that that indicates that the new law will be taking effect but who knows what it really means.

In any case, I think that Makaloco has the right idea.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

circle110 said:


> I agree and I would post the Spanish but the web page has been removed from the gob.mx website as of 9:30 tonight. It used to be here:
> http://www.dof.gob.mx/nota_detalle.php?codigo=5129775&fecha=29/01/2010
> 
> but as of about 9:30 tonight it disappeared. I am hoping that that indicates that the new law will be taking effect but who knows what it really means.
> ...


Interesting. My visa expires in 30 days. I am just about to start the application process. Maybe it will be the new version. We will see.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

That 30 day thing on the FMM is for those who got a temporary Mexican visa at a consulate. They must 'register' their presence within 30 days and convert the temporary visa & FMM to a inmigrante or no inmigrante visa; the new terminology.
Please realize that what is printed, on forms or on line, is usually not up to date with the latest rules, laws and procedures.

So, I recommend that you get the 'Inmigrante' visa applying 30 days before your FMM expires, whether or not you are married yet. A change of status, when you marry, is easy.
After two years married, as 'Inmigrante', you will have the opportunity of becoming a naturalized citizen. If not married, you may choose to become 'residente permanente' after four years as an 'Inmigrante', which will become 'residente temporal' on your next renewal; assuming that the new rules aren't in effect when you get your visa in the immediate future.
If this sounds confusing; just go with the flow and it will all work out.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I doubt they will hand me an inmigrante visa just because I'm a nice guy. If I'm not yet married I don't qualify for the "familial" category and for the "rentista" I would have to show 400x the minimum salary instead of 250x for "no-imnigrante" and that may not be possible.

I will be married more than 30 days before my FMM expires so it may behoove me to wait. I could start the process online now and not show up at the INM office until I have that marriage license document in hand.

I have to go to San Miguel de Allende next week to purchase the document that gives me permission to marry a Mexican citizen. While I'm there I will ask INM (SMA is the local office for Guanajuato) and see what they think. Although I put little stock in INM officials' word, they are the folks who will be issuing the visa so I guess have to put a certain amount of faith in what they say.

BTW, the current law is back online this morning so we may still be awaiting the new law's implementation.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Ok, do it whatever way makes you happy. I was just trying to set you up for the most expeditious method. INM will issue whatever you apply for, assuming you qualify. The funny thing is; you could go online and apply for every conceivable status and take the packages to INM, one at a time, until one was approved. Of course, it might not be the one that is most advantageous to you and your particular circumstances. In your case, 'Inmigrante' has advantages with the impending changes; saving you time and expense at 'the other end'.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

This is also written on the top of the pink section, could someone translate:

USO OFICIAL / OFICAL USE

El agente migratorio marcara la opcion correspondiente conforme
a la VISA


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

chicois8 said:


> Honest guys, I am not trying to start an argument but when there are rules written down in black and white on an official form issued by the Mexican Government that tourists sign listing certain regulations someone always turns things around and tells people go ahead do it, this is what this means or it Mexico,you can get away with it............


Jumping to conclusions. I assumed he was coming in on a normal 180 day FMM ... which certainly allows you to apply anytime with in that period for a yearly visa (first 5 months anyway). Much more sensible to do it that way as it gives you time to get settled, proof of residence, etc


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## sparks (Jun 17, 2007)

chicois8 said:


> El agente migratorio marcara la opcion correspondiente conforme a la VISA


Assuming there is a box to mark or write in ... the agent will do it. No idea what the options are


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

sparks said:


> Assuming there is a box to mark or write in ... the agent will do it. No idea what the options are


The immigration officer just scrawls the type of visa you have on the form. They don't put it in a box. They also continue to use the outdated FM2/3 designations. In my case they write FM2 Tec(nico) on the form somewhere.


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