# SSA won't give me a social security number, can't file taxes



## LitttleRoo (Jul 8, 2016)

I left the US as a small child. I've never had a social security number, as far as I know. Now, 50 years of a wasted dropout life later, living in many countries, I have made enough money that I need to declare and pay (a little) US tax. But when I applied for a social security number, they refused to give me one! They said that I had to provide evidence that I had lived in all the countries I said I lived in. This is impossible. Even in the countries where I was working, I have long disposed of the documentary evidence, just to save space. I move to another country, and want to cut down on clutter. This goes back decades.

The CPAs I have talked to all said that I need to get a social security number before I can file. The IRS website says I need to give a social security number when I file. But they also say that not having a social security number does not absolve me of the legal responsibility to pay taxes. 

Can I be fined, sued, and jailed for not doing something that is bureaucratically physically impossible to do?

I don't need the US passport any longer. But I can't get rid of it without paying the taxes they won't let me pay. What do I do now?


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Throw yourself on the mercy of whatever social security office there is in your local US Consulate. They should be able to tell you what you need to apply for a SS number at this stage in your life. And if you've tossed the various paperwork, they may be able to suggest what alternative documents you can use or obtain to cover the various periods in your adult life.

But, if you've not filed up until now and you don't owe anything (or very much) in taxes, the chances are extremely slim that the IRS is going to have the time or the resources to come after you.
Cheers,
Bev


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## LitttleRoo (Jul 8, 2016)

Hi Bev - thanks for the support: it's an encouraging thought that I am very small fry for them. What I've done is more or less what you've suggested. But it's the "alternative paperwork" I'm stuck on now. They haven't accepted official letters to my old addresses, even from the US embassy in the country concerned. I regret now a big cleanout I had a few years ago, to save moving costs - assuming that anything over a decade old would just be a waste of space.


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## BBCWatcher (Dec 28, 2012)

To file a U.S. tax return without a Social Security Number (SSN) in circumstances when you are required to have a SSN, here's one approach. First, you'll need to file a return by postal mail, not electronically. Second, in the space where you normally place your Social Security Number put "See Statement 1." Then attach a piece of paper labeled "Statement 1" at the top. Include your name at the top (except as it appears on your tax return). Then provide an explanation for why you do not have a SSN yet. If you have a case number, reference number, or some other number from the Social Security Administration, be sure to mention that. If you don't, include as much detail as you can about your SSN case so that if somebody wants to look it up that person could.

Obviously if you have other statements to attach then you'd number them 2, 3, etc. It's rare that you need to attach a statement (and that the instructions tell you to do so), so you're probably not going to attach any other statements. There are no instructions describing what I just did in the previous paragraph, but it's the best you can do in the circumstances if you want/need to file now.


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

I'll chime in with my standard advice. Unless your US birthplace is causing problems with banking services etc. in the country where you live, and for this reason you need to renounce US citizenship, why would you bother reporting and paying US tax at this point in your life? If the country can't even manage to give you an SSN, it can't really expect money from you, can it?


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## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

LitttleRoo said:


> I don't need the US passport any longer. But I can't get rid of it without paying the taxes they won't let me pay. What do I do now?


The process of renunciation is completely separate from the exit tax procedure. The fact that you owe US taxes does not mean you cannot renounce. If you want to get rid of the passport and can afford $2350 to do so, get rid of the passport. Then assess whether there's any downside to your not bothering with tax compliance. 

Once you renounce, the State Department will send your name to the IRS. Whether the IRS then does anything with it is an open question. Depending on where you live and what citizenship you have, the US may have zero ability to collect fines or taxes owed.


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## BBCWatcher (Dec 28, 2012)

Nononymous said:


> Depending on where you live and what citizenship you have, the US may have zero ability to collect fines or taxes owed.


Perhaps, but the United States clearly has tremendous law enforcement coverage within its borders. Some people want to attempt to enter the United States, even if only in transit -- or at least not be too "inconvenienced" if a plane has to stop there. It is a pretty big chunk of the globe.

In any event, it is possible for a citizen to file a tax return without a SSN. I just described how. It's not common and not "orthodox," but it works.


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## BBCWatcher (Dec 28, 2012)

For those unfamiliar with obtaining a U.S. Social Security Number, there are a couple Web sites that provide excellent background information:

American Citizens Abroad: Obtaining/Reclaiming Your Social Security Number
U.S. Social Security Administration: Learn What Documents You Need to Get a Social Security Number

I'm assuming LittleRoo has already checked to determine whether he/she was already issued a U.S. SSN. (LittleRoo, if you haven't done that, please do! Check with the Social Security Administration or the Federal Benefits Unit at a U.S. embassy or consulate. They can tell you whether you were issued a SSN about 50 years ago -- they can check to see if an individual matching your date of birth, name, etc. was issued a SSN. They cannot tell you what the number is. To get that number you would file Form SS-5 and apply for a replacement Social Security card, as the first Web site explains. In fact, if you want, you can just file a replacement card SS-5 application directly and see if you get a SSN card back, assuming you haven't already done that. It's possible an adult obtained a SSN for you about 50 years ago. Parents/mothers were encouraged to do that, at least. In recent decades it's more automatic, but it was common for babies and young children to get SSNs back when you were born. Not universal, but common.)

Failing that, if you're over 12 years of age the Social Security Administration needs to determine (with high confidence) that you aren't trying to get a second SSN. (If you manage to get multiple SSNs then you could, hypothetically, obtain multiple Social Security benefits -- and that would be bad for the government and the public at large. Plus create some other mischief. So they do have an interest in trying to prevent such problems.) To help SSA in their determination they require a significant amount of paperwork, and it's not fun to assemble that paperwork(*) -- but it should be _possible_, with effort. Even if you haven't maintained records, governments and other organizations usually do.

In the meantime, as mentioned, you can file a U.S. tax return without a SSN. You simply have to attach an explanation, and you must file a paper return. FinCEN Form 114 is filed electronically, but the form does support filing without a SSN (if you genuinely don't have a SSN yet).

(*) A major reason why I do not favor and do not recommend that parents fail to document their children's legally entitled citizenships, all of them, including obtaining social insurance numbers.


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