# Indian citizen wishing to marry Italian citizen



## nik1611

Hi guys.
I need some information. I am from India and my girlfriend is Italian. She is working in Italy and I am working in India. We wish to get married this year in India. After that I want to legalize the marriage in Italy also. Can you guide me on how I can do that? Further, we plan to stay in Italy. I know that I need to get a Permesso di Soggiorno for that. But once I am on a dependent visa, am I free to work/travel anywhere in EU or am I restricted only to Italy?


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## BBCWatcher

There's a long thread discussing this subject here. One difference is that an Italian needs a visa to enter India, and an Indian needs a visa to enter Italy. So you'll both need to get that done. However, the process of recording a foreign marriage in Italy is well explained.

Your EU status depends on your wife, so you can only work where you live together. If you both want to live in another EU country, that's fine, but she gets the final decision and you would follow. You have to operate as a single household, in other words.


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## nik1611

Thanks for the prompt reply. I will definitely read into the other topic. Also, could you suggest some countries where laws are a bit more relaxed than in Italy and India and the processes can be simpler. My bet is Dubai.


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## BBCWatcher

This person recommends Denmark. You'll still need a visa, and there's still some paperwork, but supposedly it's one of the easier places to get legally married in Europe (and without residency).

As another example, it's quite easy for two nonresident foreigners to get married in Hawaii (and probably also in other parts of the U.S. -- probably Nevada for example). Again, you'll need a visa for the U.S. -- an ordinary tourist visa does nicely -- but Italian citizens only need ESTA permission which is easy.

Your wife has to get any marriage outside Italy recorded in Italy, and the other post explains how to do that. The advantage with Denmark is that the international version of their marriage certificate should be valid in Italy for immigration purposes even before the marriage is recorded in Italy (which still needs to be done), and you'd only need one visa (for Schengen) rather than two (one for the U.S. then another for Schengen).

So I'd investigate a Danish wedding, maybe a honeymoon in Paris, and then head over to Italy (with Danish marriage certificate in hand) to settle in your new home with your new wife.

On edit: Supposedly Gibraltar is another relatively easy option.


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## BBCWatcher

Upon further checking, yes, indeed, Denmark is the "Las Vegas of Europe" in terms of weddings. There are numerous companies that do nothing but help foreigners get married in Denmark if you want somebody to handle the details for you (for a fee, of course). Yes, one of those companies is GetMarriedinDenmark.com. Amazing.


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## nik1611

Wow! Thanks for the reply BBC. USA is out of question because it's very far and also because of the Visa problems. I hope you can understand that it's difficult for Indians to get a USA visa. Schengen visa shouldn't be a problem because I have been there before. Now Denmark seems a good option but the only hassle is that I should find out whether the certificate issued in Denmark will be valid in India or not. If it is valid, that would be perfect. If it is not valid, there might be some (maybe a lot of) bureaucracy involved to get it converted to be valid in India.

Please consider the following scenario and let me know what you think:
We get married in India and have the Indian Marriage Certificate with the Appostile and everything. We try to validate the Marriage Certificate in Italy. If Italy doesn't create any problems, perfect. But, Italy creates some problem in accepting the marriage, we could go to Denmark with the Indian Marriage Certificate and get married there on the basis of this certificate, so that the Danish certificate would be valid across EU (thus in Italy too I assume) without further localizing it. Would it work that way?


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## BBCWatcher

Yes, you can get married in India. At least one of you -- I assume you -- will need to be a resident of India because you need 60+ days before you can get married (at least 30 days of residency followed by 30 days of notice).

Once you get the Indian marriage certificate (with certifications, apostille, and translation), your wife should send that to the Italian consulate in India along with the required form and other documents requested. There are three consulates: New Delhi, Mumbai, and Kolkata. Use the one closest to where you get married. They all have the necessary form on their Web sites which will be called something like "Richiesta trascrizione certificato di matrimonio." More complete instructions are in that other thread I referenced, and there are some instructions on the form indicating which authorities in India need to be involved. (It's a bit bureaucratic, as you can imagine.) She can also contact the proper Italian consulate if any of the information is unclear or if she otherwise needs some help.

That should work fine, although it will take some time to get the marriage finally recorded in Italy. Probably several months. But it will happen if you just follow the process to its conclusion and keep careful track of every step.

If you're in a hurry to move to Italy, just get married in Denmark (or Gibraltar). You can then get your Danish wedding recorded in India (if necessary) and also in Italy, although a Danish marriage certificate will be valid right away in Italy for immigration purposes since it's from another EU/EEA state. A Danish wedding organizer would be able to handle the details for you if you wish. This is quite a common thing, with an EU citizen marrying a foreigner quickly in Denmark, so they should be very familiar with your requirements.

So, to simplify, if you want to live in Italy as soon as possible, marry in Denmark. If you (and your wife) want to live in India, getting married in India should work fine.

As long as you're marrying the same person you can get married in two or more places (e.g. Denmark and Italy). Some couples do that, mostly to satisfy both family and immigration reasons. More often they have a simple legal marriage at a government office (in Denmark, for example) and then a big family celebration/religious wedding somewhere else (but not requiring the legal papers since they're already married). In other words, you can separate the legal paper signing from the celebration/ceremony if you wish -- those things can be held in different places at different times -- and many couples do that.


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## nik1611

Brilliant. So our tentative plan is like this.
Get married in India this August 2013. Then she will go back to Italy and I will stay in India with my job. Then we will have a formal ceremony in India in June 2014 or something. That is the time when I will move to EU, mostly Italy. So from Aug 2013 to June 2014 we will have enough time to process all the paperwork, get an X visa for her (which we will later convert into a PIO card). Although I just hope that they don't need the both of us to be physically present in the consulate for any reason whatsoever, because that might be a bit difficult.
I found out that getting married in India is pretty much a cakewalk due to the presence of some agents that do the paperwork for you. So the only hassle that remains is to get the marriage registered in Italy. I stay in a city close to Mumbai so I can personally visit the Italian embassy to find out more details. If there will be too much bureaucracy, and it takes too much time, then probably we will think of taking all documents and go to Denmark to do the procedures, which should cut out the bureaucracy. I am going to mail one of the agencies in Denmark to find out about the same. Keeping my fingers crossed.
I don't know how to thank you for all the information that you promptly provided!! But I think I might have to trouble you a few times more in the coming months to seek some valuable info! 
Ciao.


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## BBCWatcher

I'm a little confused by your post, but I would expect no problems getting an Indian marriage (to an Italian citizen) that occurs in August, 2013, registered in Italy by June, 2014. That should be enough time, assuming India is not significantly worse than I think. Your wife should be the primary person that interacts with the consulate (since she will be the person who officially submits it, by mail perhaps), but you can be her "agent" on the Indian side, making sure the marriage certificate is properly prepared and ready for submission.

Triple check everything, and get any errors corrected.

When you're ready to move to Italy you would get the Italian copy of your marriage certificate from your wife's commune in Italy. (She can help you get one.) Submit that Italian record to the Italian consulate with your visa application.

If things are going too slow and you don't have a marriage record from Italy in time for your visa application, yes, you can get married (again) in Denmark. But you wouldn't need any special paperwork for that -- it's relatively easy to get married there. See how things are going around March or April next year (2014). If you've got a copy of your marriage record back from Italy by then, you're all set.

Best wishes.


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## nik1611

Hello BBCWatcher!

I finally got married to my Italian girlfriend. Thanks a lot to you for all the help. We had no hassles getting the marriage registered in India. The marriage registration for Italy is already under process and should be done soon I hope!
This brings me to ask you some more questions.
I know for a fact that if I have to move to Italy with my wife, I will have to get a Nulla Osta, and then a Permesso di Soggiorno etc.
I also know for a fact that I will be able to work in whichever EU country that my wife works in, and that we will have to operate as a single household till I get a citizenship. However I want to know how.
Let's say my wife decides to move to Denmark, and start working there. In this case do I need Permesso di Soggiorno? Do I process my documents through Italy? Or do I get in touch with Denmark embassy? I basically want to know what do I have to do if my wife wants to move to another country.
Kindly share your thoughts.

Thanks a lot!!!!!


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## BBCWatcher

I'll summarize how it works in reasonable detail, but you'll have to do some more research about particular countries since they vary a bit.

OK, you've got two basic steps when you want to move to an EU/EEA country. The first step is legal entry. Since you're a citizen of India you need a visa to travel to any of the EU/EEA countries, so that's what you'd do first. For example, if you are moving to Denmark with your wife, you'd apply at the Danish embassy or consulate for an entry visa on the basis of marriage to an EU/EEA citizen. You'd of course need to provide proof of your marriage. An official copy of your marriage certificate from Italy works nicely (especially one in "international format"). You may also have a couple other bits of paperwork to provide, but the procedure should be common at least across the Schengen Area countries.

With the visa in hand you then travel with your wife (or travel to join your wife) in the particular EU/EEA country where you're both settling. Then comes the second step: registering as a resident. Typically that involves showing the local authorities your passport, the entry stamp in your passport, your marriage certificate (again), and a copy of your wife's residence registration. (Which means she gets to register as a resident first.) And you usually have to apply within 90 days of arrival, though don't wait that long if you can avoid it.

That's it, really. You have to stay married and living with your spouse in the same home, but once you've got the residence registration in hand you can start working, vacation in other EU/EEA countries, travel back and forth between your EU/EEA country and India without further visas, etc. You might need to periodically renew your residence registration. You cannot become a burden to the state -- you should remain economically self-sufficient (as a household anyway, except perhaps in Italy) -- but in many countries you can enroll in the public health system (perhaps for a fee).

Once you've lived in that EU/EEA country with your wife for at least 12 months you maintain the right to stay if (God forbid) she should predecease you, as long as you remain a resident of that country, as long as you were married and not legally separated when she predeceased you, and as long as you had nothing to do with her death.

If the EU/EEA country is the country of your wife's citizenship then that country is permitted to impose some extra rules on foreign spouses of its own citizens. The U.K. is one such country, but most countries don't, including Italy. (Your wife is Italian, so you don't have any such issues.)

After 5 years of legal residence in that EU/EEA country you can apply for an "EC Long Term Residence Permit" which is essentially permanent residency. Almost all EU/EEA countries provide that type of permit, but Denmark is one of the few exceptions. As an EC Long Term Resident you can move around the EU/EEA (establishing residence) without your spouse except for Denmark, Ireland, and maybe one or two other countries. (And of course with your spouse per normal since she has a qualified treaty right to stay in any EU/EEA country.)

After some number of years of continuous residence in a particular EU/EEA country you have the option to naturalize as a citizen of that country. Each country varies in its naturalization requirements. You also have the option to apply for naturalizaton as a citizen of Italy after 3 years of marriage (sometimes less in particular circumstances) no matter where you live, as long as you remain married to your Italian spouse (and not legally separated) through the entire process. Acquisition of another citizenship may affect your Indian citizenship, but that's up to India.

That about covers it, I think. Hope that helps.


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## nik1611

Bang on. Exactly what I needed mate. Thanks a lot for all the information! I will update this thread as and when.


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## BBCWatcher

A couple bits of elaboration:

1. If you've already got a valid visa (e.g. an unexpired multi-entry visa for tourism) no problem, you can use that. That allows you to satisfy the legal entry requirement.

2. It's possible to acquire Italian citizenship through marriage (regardless of place of residence) and another European citizenship on the basis of long-term residence. They are not mutually exclusive.

3. Acquisition of Italian citizenship via marriage typically takes about 5 years: apply after 3 years of marriage (2 if living in Italy, or half those waiting times if you have a child together) and then a 2 year waiting period after application.

4. India decides who are its citizens. However, the Indian government can only do that based on the knowledge it has.


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## nik1611

Hi.
Marriage. Check.
Marriage registration in Italy. Check. Thanks BBCWatcher.
I seek some new information.
As far as I'm aware for my Italian wife to get PIO, she can apply for PIO after 1 year of marriage.
But on the Indian consulate website of Milan, they have written 2 years.
I'm confused!
A PIO card will be extremely useful for her to be able to invest in India. 
Kindly provide some information.


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## GJD

Oh, good heavens. We both are in same boat brother. My girl is from Italy too. we are planning to get married this year. Someone told me that, she can come to India on tourist VISA and then marry and then legalize the marriage in Indian register office, and they will send to Italy for verification. After that within 2 months, our marriage will be legalized. I am not sure if I am correctly informed. Your thread is highly useful for me. If nothing works, we both shall go to the Dutch and get married and then legalize in India and Europe. I regret why our planet has boundaries


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## nik1611

GJD said:


> Oh, good heavens. We both are in same boat brother. My girl is from Italy too. we are planning to get married this year. Someone told me that, she can come to India on tourist VISA and then marry and then legalize the marriage in Indian register office, and they will send to Italy for verification. After that within 2 months, our marriage will be legalized. I am not sure if I am correctly informed. Your thread is highly useful for me. If nothing works, we both shall go to the Dutch and get married and then legalize in India and Europe. I regret why our planet has boundaries


Oh that's fantastic. You do have correct information. Feel free to PM me about any information that you might need. I have done all the procedures successfully till now. If you want, I can also direct you to agents who can help you save time.


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## GJD

nik1611 said:


> Oh that's fantastic. You do have correct information. Feel free to PM me about any information that you might need. I have done all the procedures successfully till now. If you want, I can also direct you to agents who can help you save time.


Oh, thanks bro. I would be thankful to you if you could provide me the information about the agents and people whom I should meet. I am very happy to find your posts here. It saved so much time of mine. You can provide me information here; if its confidential then you can write me private message dear. Wishing you all the best. My doubt is; if my girlfriend comes to India on Tourist VISA and get married, then can she remain in India? or else should she go back to Italy until the procedures are legalized! Thank you so much


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## GJD

nice information dear...


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## GJD

I am glad, I ran into a right post... Thanks dear


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## nik1611

GJD said:


> Oh, thanks bro. I would be thankful to you if you could provide me the information about the agents and people whom I should meet. I am very happy to find your posts here. It saved so much time of mine. You can provide me information here; if its confidential then you can write me private message dear. Wishing you all the best. My doubt is; if my girlfriend comes to India on Tourist VISA and get married, then can she remain in India? or else should she go back to Italy until the procedures are legalized! Thank you so much


Please read up all the posts above in this thread and everything should be pretty clear.
Well yes, your girlfriend can come to India on a tourist visa (6 months) and get married to you. To stay for a longer period she just needs to convert her tourist visa into an X visa. She will also need to go to register in FRRO if she is staying more than 180 days in India.


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## GJD

me too


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## avkamath1212

*Need Help asap !*

Hello,

I have the same query too. My name is Ashwin and I am an Indian Citizen. My girlfriend is from Viterbo Region in Italy. I am Hindu and she obviously is Chrstian. Both of us work for Travel Industry. We wish to marry each other and then settle in Italy. I have travelled a lot and usually get a yearly schengen visa and have a valid UK visa. This year I have got a Belgium Tourist Visa. 

A) If we wish to marry in Italy...
a) Need to know how to go about if we intend to marry in Italy. 
b) If so then can I marry on a Tourist Visa?
c) Heard that India doesnt give Nulla Osta, so then what are the documents I will require?

B) If we wish to marry in India...
a) I believe my girlfriend will have to get a document from her side to marry in India, but after marriage as mentioned by the gentleman earlier, how do I get Permesso di Soggiorno? 
b) After marriage can I apply for an Italian Visa in Mumbai or is there a wait involved?
c) If I do get a Visa then will I be able to work in Italy or any part of Europe?

I would highly appreciate if anyone can guide me on the above asap as me and my girlfriend intend to marry this year. It has been a long wait of almost 3 yrs now. Thankyou.

Regards,
Ashwin



nik1611 said:


> Hi guys.
> I need some information. I am from India and my girlfriend is Italian. She is working in Italy and I am working in India. We wish to get married this year in India. After that I want to legalize the marriage in Italy also. Can you guide me on how I can do that? Further, we plan to stay in Italy. I know that I need to get a Permesso di Soggiorno for that. But once I am on a dependent visa, am I free to work/travel anywhere in EU or am I restricted only to Italy?


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## nik1611

Hello,

I have the same query too. My name is Ashwin and I am an Indian Citizen. My girlfriend is from Viterbo Region in Italy. I am Hindu and she obviously is Chrstian. Both of us work for Travel Industry. We wish to marry each other and then settle in Italy. I have travelled a lot and usually get a yearly schengen visa and have a valid UK visa. This year I have got a Belgium Tourist Visa. 

A) If we wish to marry in Italy...
a) Need to know how to go about if we intend to marry in Italy. 
_You will most probably have to get converted to Christianity to be able to marry in a church_
b) If so then can I marry on a Tourist Visa?
_Yes, you can get married on a tourist visa_
c) Heard that India doesnt give Nulla Osta, so then what are the documents I will require?
_The Questura in Italy told us that nulla osta is not needed and that post marriage you can directly enter Italy with a tourist visa and get your Permesso di Soggiorno_

B) If we wish to marry in India...
a) I believe my girlfriend will have to get a document from her side to marry in India, but after marriage as mentioned by the gentleman earlier, how do I get Permesso di Soggiorno? 
_Your girlfriend will have to get her civil status certificate showing that she is not married. This certificate will be in Italian, so please get it translated to English_
b) After marriage can I apply for an Italian Visa in Mumbai or is there a wait involved?
_Yes, you can immediately apply for a visa in Mumbai, however I strongly recommend you to get the marriage registered in Italy as well. This marriage registration can be done through the Consulate in Mumbai itslef_
c) If I do get a Visa then will I be able to work in Italy or any part of Europe?
_Once you get the visa, you will need to go to Italy and register yourself as a local there. After that you are free to work in Italy without a work permit (considering that your wife is also in Italy). If you wish to work in any other EU country I believe you will need a work permit (I myself am not sure on this part and I am looking for more information on this)_

_There are a lot of agents in India who will get a lot of things done for you, including marriage registration as well as getting an Apostille (which you will need in order to get the marriage registered in Italy as well)
_
I would highly appreciate if anyone can guide me on the above asap as me and my girlfriend intend to marry this year. It has been a long wait of almost 3 yrs now. Thankyou.

Regards,
Ashwin


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## avkamath1212

Thanks a lot Nik. All Done, We are marrying this September in Italy


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## Polska

*agent details*



nik1611 said:


> Brilliant. So our tentative plan is like this.
> Get married in India this August 2013. Then she will go back to Italy and I will stay in India with my job. Then we will have a formal ceremony in India in June 2014 or something. That is the time when I will move to EU, mostly Italy. So from Aug 2013 to June 2014 we will have enough time to process all the paperwork, get an X visa for her (which we will later convert into a PIO card). Although I just hope that they don't need the both of us to be physically present in the consulate for any reason whatsoever, because that might be a bit difficult.
> I found out that getting married in India is pretty much a cakewalk due to the presence of some agents that do the paperwork for you. So the only hassle that remains is to get the marriage registered in Italy. I stay in a city close to Mumbai so I can personally visit the Italian embassy to find out more details. If there will be too much bureaucracy, and it takes too much time, then probably we will think of taking all documents and go to Denmark to do the procedures, which should cut out the bureaucracy. I am going to mail one of the agencies in Denmark to find out about the same. Keeping my fingers crossed.
> I don't know how to thank you for all the information that you promptly provided!! But I think I might have to trouble you a few times more in the coming months to seek some valuable info!
> Ciao.



Hi Nik,

Could you please share me the details about the agent to do the documents work in India. I am also planning to marry an European..
thanks..


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## abbatha

*Marrying my Indian BF*

Hi! I would like to know if your Italian girlfriend had to be in India for any part of the 60 day period of applying for the marriage and then waiting for objections, or whether it was fine that you were the only one living in India. 

Much appreciated!


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## nik1611

abbatha said:


> Hi! I would like to know if your Italian girlfriend had to be in India for any part of the 60 day period of applying for the marriage and then waiting for objections, or whether it was fine that you were the only one living in India.
> 
> Much appreciated!


Hello Abbatha,

No need for you to be in India for any duration of the 30 days of notice, or the 60 days that you get to get married later. Only your fiancee needs to be there. You can arrive in India and get married right away without further ado. Please PM me if you need any further information.


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## meenal67

Hello i am indian and my husband he is italian .we married in india 6 December 2013 .after that i apostile my marriage certificate from new delhi india . Jun 2015 i went indian embassy roma to certified and translate my marriage certificate .i have done everything . Now I want to register my marriage in mascali catania sicilly . I went to comune and they are not accepting my marriage certificate accrding to them indian embassy of roma have to sent some pax to comune.i went again indian embassy in roma they are telling that they are not sending anything .they verified and stamp the cetificate that is all to registerd certificate . I try to explain the people in mascali in comune that every country have little bit different rules and they still want pax from embassy. Now please suggest me what i have to do. I don't have permesso di soggornio . I am here with turist visa .Please give me some suggestions because I don't know what should I do and where i have to go . Thanks


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## BBCWatcher

Your husband is the one with an obligation to register his marriage in Italy. What is he doing (or not doing)?

What is "pax"?

That marriage certificate should be going through the Italian embassy in New Delhi, and again it's your husband's obligation. The embassy has a registration form here. Your husband would fill out that registration form and send it and an official, long-form copy of his Indian marriage certificate (with apostille) to the Italian embassy in New Delhi (and otherwise follow that form's instructions). That embassy forwards the certificate to his commune for recording. (Nowadays they do that electronically.) Then you can obtain an official Italian copy of the marriage record once it's recorded in Italy.

That's the flow, via the Italian embassy in New Delhi (where the marriage occurred).


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## meenal67

Thanks for your reply . I went italian embassy in new delhi and there no body explain me about this form .my marriage certificate apostile from new delhi and from roma verified and stamp . We did marriage in Raipur India .


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## BBCWatcher

OK, so now it's your husband's job to register the marriage via the Italian embassy in New Delhi. He can do that by postal mail (preferably registered mail) using the registration form and the official marriage certificate that you prepared so well. He should follow that form's instructions, and if he has any questions he can contact the Italian embassy.

This is his legal _obligation_ with his government, not something he should be delegating to you.


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## Mohit4008

I am from India , living in Kolkata .My girl friend lives in Germany but he had a citizenship of Italy , and we are planning to get married in this March 2016 , so what is the procedure for this and what sort of documents will be recquired from her side to get legalize marriage in India and how much time it takes for this procedure of marriage in India ?


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## Mohit4008

Inspite of "she" I had written "he" , sorry for the grammatical mistake


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## romahm

This was a very informative thread for my question. I am Indian living in Mumbai and intend to marry my Italian fiancé who lives and works in Naples, Italy. We've been running back and forth to understand how it can be done. From what I read in this thread, here's a step-layout of what I understood 
1. I issue a notice under the Special Marriage Act in Mumbai, 30+ days prior to his visit to India. 
2.He comes to India on a tourist visa for 10-15 days, say in December and we register our marriage at the court in bandra/fort Mumbai. (Does he need any documents from Italy apart from passport and birth certificate?) 
3. He returns to Italy and I wait to receive the marriage certificate (does it take 30+ days too?) 
4. After receiving the certificate, I need to get it translated and apostille. He has to contact the Consulate of Italy in Mumbai and send a form via email with this certificate. (or we involve the embassy guys from day 1?)
5. I travel to Italy in March 2017 and we go to the comunne of Naples where the embassy has sent the document? Do I travel on a tourist visa? 
6. We complete the procedure at Comunne and I apply for the permesso di soggiorno. How does my visa get moved to a spouse visa? I'm unclear on the part. 
P. S - I wish to migrate and live with him in Naples for the moment.


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