# Not sure how we stand.



## Glassowl

Hi folks looking for a bit of guidance,
We recently purchased a property in Molise it was advertised as having 3+ hectares of land when we first viewed the place we realised that the land was not one parcel surrounding the property but made up individual parcels of land dotted about the community, apparently its made up of woodland, olive groves , vine yard , and arable land. We were told that we would be shown the land once we purchased and the geographical map showing what we owned had been made up . On the day of purchase at the Notaires office we were given after signing all of our documents including a set of maps all sectioned and numbered and another separate list with corresponding numbers which indicated amongst all the other numbered parcels of land the pieces we owned,,, to be honest it meant nothing to us we don't know where this land is and how far away from the property it is to be some of it seems to be patches of land within a bigger piece of land thats owned by someone else, we questioned our immobliare who said we need a surveyor to mark it out which to us sounded ok but then we were told that we would have to pay for this privilege and the estimated cost is not far off 10,000 euros is this normal procedure as our immobliare insists it is surely they have a duty to show us all the land we purchased ??


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## Amblepup

Oh dear, visit your commune they will give you a map and identify who owns the surrounding land. It is I am sorry to say a common thing that what land you are thinking you are buying turns out to be much less! If you find the original advert stating what land goes with your house, and see if it differs. An independent geometra could do this all for you for a fee. Also check the date on the map as a new one may have been submitted after the sale.


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## pudd 2

Glassowl said:


> Hi folks looking for a bit of guidance,
> We recently purchased a property in Molise it was advertised as having 3+ hectares of land when we first viewed the place we realised that the land was not one parcel surrounding the property but made up individual parcels of land dotted about the community, apparently its made up of woodland, olive groves , vine yard , and arable land. We were told that we would be shown the land once we purchased and the geographical map showing what we owned had been made up . On the day of purchase at the Notaires office we were given after signing all of our documents including a set of maps all sectioned and numbered and another separate list with corresponding numbers which indicated amongst all the other numbered parcels of land the pieces we owned,,, to be honest it meant nothing to us we don't know where this land is and how far away from the property it is to be some of it seems to be patches of land within a bigger piece of land thats owned by someone else, we questioned our immobliare who said we need a surveyor to mark it out which to us sounded ok but then we were told that we would have to pay for this privilege and the estimated cost is not far off 10,000 euros is this normal procedure as our immobliare insists it is surely they have a duty to show us all the land we purchased ??


 what a sad story the agents should have made it clear where your land was and you as the buyer should have made sure as well 
this does not give a good name to estate agents here in italy as for 10 ,000 eros on your bike mr agent 
the damage is done now find you self a idipendent gerometer who has nothing to do with the agent to do serches on the partitchel nos of rthe plots good luck 
if it had been in abruzzo i couold have helped you


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## Arturo.c

It always irks me when I hear about cases like yours, when a buyer's good faith is exploited by an unscrupulous real estate agent. You should have insisted to see the "mappa catastale" before the sale was finalized, and not afterwards when the damage was already done.

As for the request of an € 10.000 fee for the "geometra", that's ridiculous. Any decent surveyor would have agreed to do the job for one tenth of that sum.

The age-old Latin saying _"Caveat emptor"_ (buyer beware) should always be heeded. Never be afraid to ask too many questions, and always demand to be shown what you're buying, particularly when it comes to property purchases.


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## Amblepup

Also, when a home is advertised at a certain size, it is normally stated when being advertised in the description, a geometra would cost around 3-500 euro for a full survey. I am so sorry this has happened to you, when you find the truth you can then set about asking them to rectify their 'mistake' if you have it in writing about the 10.000 price to sort this, the guardia Di finance would be very interested, but I bet it was verbal. The mistake we Brits make is believing what we are told be estate agents, as in the uk we know that the consumer law protects us, but here it is very different. Not a very good advert for Italy and estate agents here, and the sad thing is a lot of English people work in these agencies now, and they are just as bad. Get this investigated, take your evidence to the agents give them a chance to correct this error, if that fails you need to find a legal route to the notery who acted at the sale. Try not to let this distress you too much, once these things are ironed out you can then enjoy your home.


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## The-cat

Glassowl said:


> Hi folks looking for a bit of guidance,
> We recently purchased a property in Molise it was advertised as having 3+ hectares of land when we first viewed the place we realised that the land was not one parcel surrounding the property but made up individual parcels of land dotted about the community, apparently its made up of woodland, olive groves , vine yard , and arable land. We were told that we would be shown the land once we purchased and the geographical map showing what we owned had been made up . On the day of purchase at the Notaires office we were given after signing all of our documents including a set of maps all sectioned and numbered and another separate list with corresponding numbers which indicated amongst all the other numbered parcels of land the pieces we owned,,, to be honest it meant nothing to us we don't know where this land is and how far away from the property it is to be some of it seems to be patches of land within a bigger piece of land thats owned by someone else, we questioned our immobliare who said we need a surveyor to mark it out which to us sounded ok but then we were told that we would have to pay for this privilege and the estimated cost is not far off 10,000 euros is this normal procedure as our immobliare insists it is surely they have a duty to show us all the land we purchased ??



the normal procedure is to know and see what it is about to buy, before you pay for. Now there is no standard piocedure, but ask 10,000-euro only for know where is yr's property , closely resembles a scam


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## Amblepup

It is easy to be wise after the event, most of us living here in Italy have become wise to scams etc., some were very careful when buying to ensure everything was correct before buying, but hands up, and be honest, how many of us put too much trust in the agents, maybe because they were English, maybe because our hearts rules our heads and some had trust in the system as this type of scam would be rare or indeed not heard of in the UK. I think perhaps now they 'get it'


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## Arturo.c

Amblepup said:


> It is easy to be wise after the event, most of us living here in Italy have become wise to scams etc.


Oh yes. About 30 years ago, when I was young and naive, I lost 500,000 of my hard-earned Lire which I gave as head payment for a small storage room in the basement of a building near the one I lived by a fast-talking "agent", who actually had duped the owner of the building into signing what he believed was an estate management contract when in fact it was a broad power of attorney to sell the various portions of the building.

When the owner realized that the agent was selling off his property and pocketing the proceedings he finally sued him, but not before he had scammed almost all the tenants of their savings, promising them to sell the homes they had been renting for a very convenient price.

After the scam came to light, I was asked by the other victims if I wanted to join them as plaintiff in a lawsuit against the rogue agent (who disappeared leaving behind months of unpaid rent and utility bills for his own office as well), but I decided instead to write it off as a lesson learned, and move on with my life. Lawsuits in Italy could take decades to end with a ruling, and by then the defendant could claim that he can't pay because he doesn't have any property to his name.


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## Molisenicola

My husband and I bought a property in Molise 3 years ago and the repercussions of the less than reputable agency are still hitting us financially. Fortunately we have made some fantastic Italian English speaking locals who have helped us through it all. I ended up contacting the mayor of our village who has been amazing and we are now buying a second property without an agent which has been a completely different experience. 
It's such a shame that these agents spoil it as the locals are more than happy to help if they can. 
We recently got talking to another English couple on the beach who also has a terrible time with the same agent.....


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## andrew13

Molisenicola said:


> My husband and I bought a property in Molise 3 years ago and the repercussions of the less than reputable agency are still hitting us financially. Fortunately we have made some fantastic Italian English speaking locals who have helped us through it all. I ended up contacting the mayor of our village who has been amazing and we are now buying a second property without an agent which has been a completely different experience.
> It's such a shame that these agents spoil it as the locals are more than happy to help if they can.
> We recently got talking to another English couple on the beach who also has a terrible time with the same agent.....


hi,can i ask which agent you used ?


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## NickZ

I don't think that person has posted in years.


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## caerfilly

andrew13 said:


> hi,can i ask which agent you used ?





Molisenicola said:


> My husband and I bought a property in Molise 3 years ago and the repercussions of the less than reputable agency are still hitting us financially. Fortunately we have made some fantastic Italian English speaking locals who have helped us through it all. I ended up contacting the mayor of our village who has been amazing and we are now buying a second property without an agent which has been a completely different experience.
> It's such a shame that these agents spoil it as the locals are more than happy to help if they can.
> We recently got talking to another English couple on the beach who also has a terrible time with the same agent.....


Ciao, I am wondering if you are currently living in Molise? I am purchasing a property just north of Campobasso, and the Notaio wants to suddenly finalize next week. I am looking for someone that could sign for me (POA), that knows both Italian and English. Do you have any recommendations? I'm not sure how to find someone local to help? Which agency did you use, so I can steer clear?


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## NickZ

Are you really risking giving power of attorney to a total stranger? Even a limited power of attorney?


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## modicasa

The notary doesnt want to finalise, it will be the sellers pushing for it, and it depends whether you have signed a preliminary with a due date. If you are in the the US and you need to get a POA signed and sent to Italy, translated and sworn in a week, you have no hope. If you are already in Molise, you will need a POA holder, a translator and a witness. To do everything you need in a week, even if you have the people lined up is pushing it, unless you know the system.


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## NickZ

They would likely need to go to the consulate to sign everything unless maybe a local patronate is offering the service.


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## GeordieBorn

I think the replies you have say it all. Even if it could be done, it would cost a fortune (cheaper to fly out) and the risks are high. Modi's question asking if you have signed anything is an important factor. There is an American (native Italian speaker) in Pescara, but like I say costs could be high and time is against you.


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## NickZ

Pescara wouldn't be much closer than me. I'm almost an eight hour R/T drive. With a car that sips fuel it would be at least €50 in fuel plus 20 more in tolls. 

Being of Molisian descent I'm curious why you picked the region? It doesn't sound like you have family there.


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## caerfilly

modicasa said:


> The notary doesnt want to finalise, it will be the sellers pushing for it, and it depends whether you have signed a preliminary with a due date. If you are in the the US and you need to get a POA signed and sent to Italy, translated and sworn in a week, you have no hope. If you are already in Molise, you will need a POA holder, a translator and a witness. To do everything you need in a week, even if you have the people lined up is pushing it, unless you know the system.


Oh, good to know! Yes, I signed a Contratto Preliminaire in January, and it was finally registered last week. This is why I was surprised to get a closing date so quickly. The date on the CP is the end of this month (April), but I was told it would probably be delayed "but no worries!"


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> Pescara wouldn't be much closer than me. I'm almost an eight hour R/T drive. With a car that sips fuel it would be at least €50 in fuel plus 20 more in tolls.
> 
> Being of Molisian descent I'm curious why you picked the region? It doesn't sound like you have family there.


Nick, thank you so much for your answers! The deed I believe will be signed in San Salvo, where the Notaio is located. I see what you mean about the process for signing a PoA here, having it notarized, then the Apostille, then sent to Vasto, etc. will take at least a week! You are saying it is easier for me to fly there? What happens if we sign the deed after the date on the PC?


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> Pescara wouldn't be much closer than me. I'm almost an eight hour R/T drive. With a car that sips fuel it would be at least €50 in fuel plus 20 more in tolls.
> 
> Being of Molisian descent I'm curious why you picked the region? It doesn't sound like you have family there.


Good question! No, we don't have family there. I've wanted to move it Italy for ages, and finally took the leap to at least purchase a vacation home there. Molise has many amazing qualities, and is close enough to the beaches and cities to be comfortable yet quiet and relaxed. What part of Italia are you in? What are your thoughts on Molise?


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## caerfilly

GeordieBorn said:


> I think the replies you have say it all. Even if it could be done, it would cost a fortune (cheaper to fly out) and the risks are high. Modi's question asking if you have signed anything is an important factor. There is an American (native Italian speaker) in Pescara, but like I say costs could be high and time is against you.


Thank you for your reply, all very good information. It is a risk, yes, but was feeling the time crunch. I will ask for a later date, and try to fly out. What are the penalties for signing the deed on a property AFTER the finalization date listed on the Contratto Preliminaire? I wasn't expecting it to take over 3 months to register the CP, then be asked to fly out only a week later. Is this pretty normal in your experience?


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## NickZ

I'm just outside of Rome. Technically metro Rome. 

It depends on what you want. Molise isn't some place you travel around Europe or even Italy from. You move there to spend time in Molise.

The other issue for a non resident is you really really need a car. Of course outside of the coastal areas it can get pretty cold and snowy in the winter. 

It really depends on what you want.


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> I'm just outside of Rome. Technically metro Rome.
> 
> It depends on what you want. Molise isn't some place you travel around Europe or even Italy from. You move there to spend time in Molise.
> 
> The other issue for a non resident is you really really need a car. Of course outside of the coastal areas it can get pretty cold and snowy in the winter.
> 
> It really depends on what you want.


A non-resident can't buy a car though, right? Is the bus/train system not a good option?


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## NickZ

Which town is this?

For the most part you need a car. Campobasso the city and Termoli have train stations and buses going around the country but you need a car to go to the mall or run other errands. Unless you are in walking distance.


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> Which town is this?
> 
> For the most part you need a car. Campobasso the city and Termoli have train stations and buses going around the country but you need a car to go to the mall or run other errands. Unless you are in walking distance.


Okay, thank you! I did decide to go ahead and fly out for the signing. Any words of wisdom? I am curious, the Notaio wants 7,000 euro in notary fees/stamps/taxes, 1,000 of it in cash. Does this sound right?


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## NickZ

Most of those fees are value based. Not necessarily selling price. If the selling price is lower than the official selling price in the government books you pay on the higher amount.

The cash part is so he can likely avoid the taxes on his income.


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## modicasa

The compromesso had to be registered within 20 days of it being signed. Assuming you have an agent, they sound a bit 'vague'. It also has no bearing on the completion date. A delay of a couple of weeks is here nor there. People say that you will lose your caparra confermatoria if you dont sign by the due date, but its not true. Ask the notary specifically and why he wants 1000 euro in cash, you are not obliged to do so - and to be sure the money goes where it is meant to you can use the notaio's dedicated account for the payments. Its impossible to say without knowing more about the property whether the notary's fee and taxes are correct.


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## GeordieBorn

Do a search for "cost of buying a property in italy" there are a number out there with good information (hopefully you have already looked at Modi's signature link). The 1000 in cash is a "welcome to Italy" sign! Very annoying as you are already being pulled into a murky situation....


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## caerfilly

modicasa said:


> The compromesso had to be registered within 20 days of it being signed. Assuming you have an agent, they sound a bit 'vague'. It also has no bearing on the completion date. A delay of a couple of weeks is here nor there. People say that you will lose your caparra confermatoria if you dont sign by the due date, but its not true. Ask the notary specifically and why he wants 1000 euro in cash, you are not obliged to do so - and to be sure the money goes where it is meant to you can use the notaio's dedicated account for the payments. Its impossible to say without knowing more about the property whether the notary's fee and taxes are correct.


Grazie! Yes, I have an agent and they specifically asked me not to date the CP, they dated it right before they registered it, but I guess that is neither here nor there at this point. I'm glad a delay would be okay, and closing early seems to be okay. I have asked for a breakdown of fees by the notary, and proceed with caution. I am curious about the notaio's dedicated account...can you explain more please? The agent asked me to deposit the balance owed for the property into the seller's bank account and the 6,000 euro (+1000 cash) into the notaio's account prior to leaving the USA. I feel like such a nube, but I have to ask if this is normal? Could I instead deposit both funds into what you called the notaio's dedicated account? Grazie mille for your patience and wisdom! { I fly out in 4 days, so I'm trying to get my ducks in a row quickly  }


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## NickZ

No that's not normal. You hand the money to the Notaio. They disburse it to the owner. 

If you hand money to the seller before anything is signed are you sure you'll get anything?


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## caerfilly

GeordieBorn said:


> Do a search for "cost of buying a property in italy" there are a number out there with good information (hopefully you have already looked at Modi's signature link). The 1000 in cash is a "welcome to Italy" sign! Very annoying as you are already being pulled into a murky situation....


Ah, good to know about the "welcome to Italy" . I have researched until my eyes have nearly popped out, but unfortunately there is no way for a foreigner to tell exactly how much the cadastral value and/or taxes are. I am only paying 15.000 euro for the property, but I can't tell it's cadastral value of course. *Question only an Italian can answer:* I will sign the deed next week, and pay all of the taxes/stamps on purchase, but will I still owe taxes in May? If so, how do I pay those? (Yes, I've researched, but it's all a bit vague when you are 5,000 miles away. Should I open an Italian bank account at the post office while I am there to pay the taxes and utilities in the future? Many thanks!!


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> No that's not normal. You hand the money to the Notaio. They disburse it to the owner.
> 
> If you hand money to the seller before anything is signed are you sure you'll get anything?


Right?? That's what I'm worried about. Seems it would be more rational to transfer while signing, or beforehand into the notaio's account to be dispursed.


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## GeordieBorn

Modi will know what currently applies as I believe he is an agent? I suspect your agent should have already told you what the cadastral value and taxes are. We had a bankers draft (cheque) when we bought, but had a transfer on the day to our account when we sold. It will be more awkward paying your house tax without an Italian bank account, but not impossible. The problem is getting the details of the amount to pay. You can calculate this on a web site, but you need to know quite a bit of information, I found it okay, but most other I know that tried struggled. Our Comune were very good and the Ragioneria (?) would answer emails and confirm I had the amount correct. I do know of others in different Comune where they sent out details to them. It's probably one of those things you have to wait and see, there are fines for paying late, but initially they are very small. IIRC it is your responsibility to calculate your house tax (no bill), but for the rubbish tax you get a bill.


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## NickZ

15k you're I think just over the legal minimums. 

Unless the book value is so much higher you're basically paying notaio fees.









Rogito seconda casa: le tasse e i costi previsti | Immobiliare.it


Per avere un’idea delle spese che si dovranno affrontare, bisogna calcolare con attenzione non solo l’onorario richiesto dal notaio, ma anche le tasse previste, ben diverse da quelle per la prima abitazione.



www.immobiliare.it




.

Does the 6K include the agency fee?


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> 15k you're I think just over the legal minimums.
> 
> Unless the book value is so much higher you're basically paying notaio fees.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rogito seconda casa: le tasse e i costi previsti | Immobiliare.it
> 
> 
> Per avere un’idea delle spese che si dovranno affrontare, bisogna calcolare con attenzione non solo l’onorario richiesto dal notaio, ma anche le tasse previste, ben diverse da quelle per la prima abitazione.
> 
> 
> 
> www.immobiliare.it
> 
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> .
> 
> Does the 6K include the agency fee?


No, I already paid the agency fee of 3.7k. The Notaio wants 6k + another 1k cash for notary fees/taxes/stamps. The original estimate was 4.5k, which still seemed high but more reasonable. The agent said it's because the property is considered 2 properties (2 separate entrances, 1 house). The agent is also insisting on 500 euro cash for POA at signing, although I will be signing in person. What would the POA be fore? I am just not sure if this is all usual?


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## caerfilly

GeordieBorn said:


> Modi will know what currently applies as I believe he is an agent? I suspect your agent should have already told you what the cadastral value and taxes are. We had a bankers draft (cheque) when we bought, but had a transfer on the day to our account when we sold. It will be more awkward paying your house tax without an Italian bank account, but not impossible. The problem is getting the details of the amount to pay. You can calculate this on a web site, but you need to know quite a bit of information, I found it okay, but most other I know that tried struggled. Our Comune were very good and the Ragioneria (?) would answer emails and confirm I had the amount correct. I do know of others in different Comune where they sent out details to them. It's probably one of those things you have to wait and see, there are fines for paying late, but initially they are very small. IIRC it is your responsibility to calculate your house tax (no bill), but for the rubbish tax you get a bill.


I've tried repeatedly to find out what the cadastral value and taxes are per year, but get "we won't know until the signing of the deed." The agent chose the Notaio. I also wanted to hook up the utilities while I am there in person next week, but the agent said it will take 10 days so there is no point doing it now? Will it really take 10 days for electric and gas and water when I return in the summer?

I am worried about the setting up the monthly/yearly payments for automatic withdrawals, and figuring out the taxes. Will they let me open an Italian bank account at the post office while I am there (with an address and passport), and set up monthly utility payments at least? Can I have utilities hooked up remotely with payments? I'm so sorry, I have so many questions but I'm just not getting answers that I need from the agent.


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## NickZ

The problem with two low value properties is you're paying at least the minimum taxes for both. Still sees high to me.

Are you fluent in Italian? If not the notaio will require a translator. That's likely what the POA is for.

Are the utilities currently on or not? If they are it's usually pretty quick . Electricity just needs the paperwork filed for the change. Same thing with water.

If you don't have utilities it depends on what state things are. It also depends on how much effort you're willing to put into chasing the utility company. Ten days would be safe but if you find a friendly person to deal with water could be turned on much quicker.


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## modicasa

You are in the agent black hole of Molise. You are paying an agent 3000 euros on a 15000 euro purchase. Which is frankly obscene - but it seems the agents there have clubbed together to agree a minimum payment. Your agent is behaving badly. Firstly, a compromesso without a due date is null. Secondly, it is a total lie to say you cannot know the cadastral value. It is public information and of course you can know it. Your agent has a duty to tell you if you ask. Of course you can get utilities switched into your name, or at least start the reactivation while you are there. You should never pay the seller before the sale. Tell the notary you want to use his dedicated account and see what happens. In that way you pay the notary the balance and he then pays the sellers once the act is transcribed. There are minimum taxes, as they work in bands. Have you seen your compromesso - it will have the cadastral values in it. If not, it is null. 
You cant open a non resident account at the PO - the only option would be a prepaid card with an IBAN called Evolution, but I doubt you can put bills on direct debit on it . You will probably have to open a non res account at Unicredit, Banca Intesa or one of the other big banks. 
You are not signing in person - you are not fluent in Italian and your act would be null if you sign something that you dont understand. You must have an interpreter a witness and a POA holder. That could cost 500 euros. 
If you have a copy of your compromesso, send it to me. Unfortunately you are the latest in a long line of people who have been stung by agents in Molise/Abruzzo.


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## modicasa

The notary's dedicated account is a state run account which is separate to a notary's personal account. If one or the parties (seller or buyer) wishes to use the account the notary is obliged to do so. It is basically an escrow account, so the money goes in there, and then when the act is transcribed and all legal, the notary then pays what is owed. You can also pay all the notary fees into the notary's personal account. I dont see why he wants 1000 euros cash unless he is giving a backhander to the agent. Ask for invoices and receipts from the notary and the agent, as there is something odd going on.


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## GeordieBorn

It's a worrying time when buying a house, more so abroad. It's also a time to step back and think common-sense. You are right to be concerned and reading what's been said here I would be. How many times have you seen this house? Do you know for sure it has access to electric and water? Gas and/or heating is another matter. I would take up Modi's offer, I've read his posts on here and many other forums for years now - always been superb!


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## caerfilly

modicasa said:


> You are in the agent black hole of Molise. You are paying an agent 3000 euros on a 15000 euro purchase. Which is frankly obscene - but it seems the agents there have clubbed together to agree a minimum payment. Your agent is behaving badly. Firstly, a compromesso without a due date is null. Secondly, it is a total lie to say you cannot know the cadastral value. It is public information and of course you can know it. Your agent has a duty to tell you if you ask. Of course you can get utilities switched into your name, or at least start the reactivation while you are there. You should never pay the seller before the sale. Tell the notary you want to use his dedicated account and see what happens. In that way you pay the notary the balance and he then pays the sellers once the act is transcribed. There are minimum taxes, as they work in bands. Have you seen your compromesso - it will have the cadastral values in it. If not, it is null.
> You cant open a non resident account at the PO - the only option would be a prepaid card with an IBAN called Evolution, but I doubt you can put bills on direct debit on it . You will probably have to open a non res account at Unicredit, Banca Intesa or one of the other big banks.
> You are not signing in person - you are not fluent in Italian and your act would be null if you sign something that you dont understand. You must have an interpreter a witness and a POA holder. That could cost 500 euros.
> If you have a copy of your compromesso, send it to me. Unfortunately you are the latest in a long line of people who have been stung by agents in Molise/Abruzzo.


Thank you so much for all of your information! If by "Compromesso" you mean final contract, I have not seen one. I do have the Contratto Preliminaire, but it does not have cadastral value in it. I am happy to send that to you if it will help? Do you know whether I should have received a compromesso by now, or only when I sign? 

I will tell the Notaio that I will deposit only in his dedicated account (and not separately into the seller's account and his bank account directly), and wait until signing to do so, correct? I'm thinking I will be stuck with the full fees at this point, but at least I have asked for a breakdown.

Now I understand the purpose of the PoA, thank you!! You're right, I am not fluent in Italian. Makes a lot of sense on the utilities as well, as far as I know they are not currently connected, so I would need to start from scratch on them. I will wait until summer to go through the process, as well as look into a non-resident account at the banks mentioned. 

Please let me know if you want to see the PC, it's all I have at this point, but I will ask for a compromesso and see what happens.


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## NickZ

Is the home in town or out in the countryside? In town connections are usually easy. Out of town it can get interesting.


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## caerfilly

It is in town, but a small village, Torella del Sannio. Here is the link to the property: Nice property for sale near ski resort, Molise Italy Molise Campobasso Torella del Sannio

As far as I can tell, utilities would need to be reconnected.


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## caerfilly

caerfilly said:


> It is in town, but a small village, Torella del Sannio. Here is the link to the property: Nice property for sale near ski resort, Molise Italy Molise Campobasso Torella del Sannio
> 
> As far as I can tell, utilities would need to be reconnected.


But I'd love to know why it is still being advertised...


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## caerfilly

caerfilly said:


> Thank you so much for all of your information! If by "Compromesso" you mean final contract, I have not seen one. I do have the Contratto Preliminaire, but it does not have cadastral value in it. I am happy to send that to you if it will help? Do you know whether I should have received a compromesso by now, or only when I sign?
> 
> I will tell the Notaio that I will deposit only in his dedicated account (and not separately into the seller's account and his bank account directly), and wait until signing to do so, correct? I'm thinking I will be stuck with the full fees at this point, but at least I have asked for a breakdown.
> 
> Now I understand the purpose of the PoA, thank you!! You're right, I am not fluent in Italian. Makes a lot of sense on the utilities as well, as far as I know they are not currently connected, so I would need to start from scratch on them. I will wait until summer to go through the process, as well as look into a non-resident account at the banks mentioned.
> 
> Please let me know if you want to see the PC, it's all I have at this point, but I will ask for a compromesso and see what happens.


Modi, after re-reading your post, I think you mean the Preliminary Contract, right? I'm more than happy to send it to you if that would help? How would I send that to you privately? Also, I posted the link to the house, if that helps as well.


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## NickZ

They'll keep it up at least until the deal closes and likely even later. It's rare you'll find an agent so tech savvy to take things down but the other thing it's still potentially bringing business to the agent. He'll just say oh no it's sold but I have this other property.

You only seem to have water and electric. Both are usually fairly quick if you push it.

Make sure the Notaio hands you the ownership paperwork needed for the utilities. He might not know you're in a rush so push him on that. You need the form from the Notaio or the utilities won't get connected.

Are you good at chopping wood? -) If not you might want to think about a log splitter. Oh and the local have the weird idea green wood is good to burn .


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## caerfilly

Oh, that makes sense (on keeping the ad up). That's great news on only electric and water! It is supposed to be sold "furnished" so I shouldn't have to worry about the kitchen being left as is, thankfully (I'll update at a later date).

Thank you so much on the advice about the ownership paperwork for the utilities!! I would not have known to ask for that, and would have ended up in tears trying to get the utilities on. Nope, not good at chopping wood...I'll leave that for when I can stay there permanently, until then only summers . Still shaking my head over the green wood ;-).

So in your opinion, is there any chance at all of having the utilities hooked up on the one day I'm there after I sign? I sign at 17:30 next Thursday, and will leave Saturday evening. Or is it best to fight that battle when I have more time? I'd love to actually be able to stay in the house in summer, vs. a B&B for the first week or two...you know what I mean?

Thank you so much Nick!


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## GeordieBorn

The ad says it is 3 apartments, but it looks like a town house (or house/shop) with the cellar joined (it will likely be damp). At 837m ASL it will be cold Oct-Mar min, and I mean cold. No heating in the place apart from the fire would be okay in summer, but not in the stated above period. Electrics like most places there looks very old. Looking around on Google Street view it looks a typical high up village apart from seeming to have quite a few shops etc for a small population. Have you located the property on Street view to see if there is an older view there? Might be worth it to see what it was like. The steel girder in one of the rooms and new roof would make me wonder. Again looking at Google, getting there from Pescara (not looked at others) seems possible by bus, but almost 5 hours. A train down the coast is an option, but you still have to go in land by bus. Driving it says just under 2 hours, but that might be Italian driving in the mountains. Don't be put off, it would not suit us, but it is a lovely area. I would be a lot more worried if it was out of town by any distance.


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## NickZ

If you have only one or two days it's not worth dealing with the utilities. You can actually get the electric hooked up without being there if you have all the paperwork and a bank account.





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## NickZ

I forgot to mention but you need to get the meter number off the electrical meter. Just push the button until you see the long POD number. Write it down.


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> I forgot to mention but you need to get the meter number off the electrical meter. Just push the button until you see the long POD number. Write it down.


Ohhh, very good to know! Is the meter generally outside or inside? How long do you think it realistically takes for water hookup? Is it safe to hook up the electric without water (water heaters?)?


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## caerfilly

GeordieBorn said:


> The ad says it is 3 apartments, but it looks like a town house (or house/shop) with the cellar joined (it will likely be damp). At 837m ASL it will be cold Oct-Mar min, and I mean cold. No heating in the place apart from the fire would be okay in summer, but not in the stated above period. Electrics like most places there looks very old. Looking around on Google Street view it looks a typical high up village apart from seeming to have quite a few shops etc for a small population. Have you located the property on Street view to see if there is an older view there? Might be worth it to see what it was like. The steel girder in one of the rooms and new roof would make me wonder. Again looking at Google, getting there from Pescara (not looked at others) seems possible by bus, but almost 5 hours. A train down the coast is an option, but you still have to go in land by bus. Driving it says just under 2 hours, but that might be Italian driving in the mountains. Don't be put off, it would not suit us, but it is a lovely area. I would be a lot more worried if it was out of town by any distance.


Yes, it is a townhouse. The ad says 3, but "one" is just a single room in the raw state, no facilities or flooring. The very bottom two levels are 1 apartment, and the next level is the second apartment. The very top level is the one unfinished room. I have google mapped it, but they don't have a street view of that street. (This will be the first time I have seen it in person, yes I know, probably not a great idea.) 

I will be flying into Pescara, and it does look like a 2 hour drive by hired car, guess I'll find out . Anyway, I will try to search out older pictures, I've been very curious what the building once was. Possibly stable / wine making on lowest two floors with the arches, then an apartment or store on the top? I've been hoping I can find more info on it in person, from locals. Very, very good to note on the heating. I will have to look into central heating options, and have the electric checked as well.

Thank you again for all of your time and assistance!! I am feeling much better about it now, but will definitely have to consider the "cons" of the heating and electric later on.


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## NickZ

caerfilly said:


> Ohhh, very good to know! Is the meter generally outside or inside? How long do you think it realistically takes for water hookup? Is it safe to hook up the electric without water (water heaters?)?



The heater should have it's own switch. Turn it off. But many people when they aren't using a seasonal home just flip the main breaker. It would be strange if the water tank was totally empty. 

Meter tends to be accessible. It might be outside it might inside.


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## NickZ

Is there a reason for flying into Pescara instead of Rome? It'll be easier to rent a car in Rome and not much further really.


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> Is there a reason for flying into Pescara instead of Rome? It'll be easier to rent a car in Rome and not much further really.


I've never flown into Pescara before, but it seemed logical this time because the Notaio is in San Salvo (next to Vasto), only an hour from the airport. And.....I absolutely hate driving in Roma. It's pure madness!

I must confess, I do love Fiumiccino though, the town (although the airport is one of my favourites). Not a large town, but a very relaxing, beautiful area, and the locals are quite friendly. I originally wanted to buy there...you said you are in the Roma area?


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## modicasa

Yes the compromesso is the preliminare. You can send it to me by email. info (at) modicasa.com. Did the agent give you a translation of the preliminare when you signed? Obviously if he didnt you have no idea what you signed and so it is null, by the way -


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## NickZ

caerfilly said:


> I've never flown into Pescara before, but it seemed logical this time because the Notaio is in San Salvo (next to Vasto), only an hour from the airport. And.....I absolutely hate driving in Roma. It's pure madness!
> 
> I must confess, I do love Fiumiccino though, the town (although the airport is one of my favourites). Not a large town, but a very relaxing, beautiful area, and the locals are quite friendly. I originally wanted to buy there...you said you are in the Roma area?


You don't need to drive in Rome. Pickup at the airport and just head to your destination.

Ya I'm not that far south of the airport but because of the way things were laid out by mother nature it's actually a longish drive. Or at least longer than you expect.


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## GeordieBorn

Your meter will be in the grey box on the wall half way up the stairs, it does not look like it has a lock on it, but they can be. I think most of them work the same, but if you have never faced one it can be tricky to work out. One of the buttons cycles around through the menu items, but it times out after a little while and you have to go through it again if you lose your place.
Rome is definitely another option but would not be our choice. One of the main problems with electric there is most are limited to a 3kw max, but it can/could be less. You can have this increased at a cost both for installation and ongoing. As a non-resident your electric will cost you a little more per kw and even when not there there will be a network charge.


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## caerfilly

modicasa said:


> Yes the compromesso is the preliminare. You can send it to me by email. info (at) modicasa.com. Did the agent give you a translation of the preliminare when you signed? Obviously if he didnt you have no idea what you signed and so it is null, by the way -


Ciao, I just emailed you to confirm the email addy. Yes, the CP is also in English.


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## caerfilly

GeordieBorn said:


> Your meter will be in the grey box on the wall half way up the stairs, it does not look like it has a lock on it, but they can be. I think most of them work the same, but if you have never faced one it can be tricky to work out. One of the buttons cycles around through the menu items, but it times out after a little while and you have to go through it again if you lose your place.
> Rome is definitely another option but would not be our choice. One of the main problems with electric there is most are limited to a 3kw max, but it can/could be less. You can have this increased at a cost both for installation and ongoing. As a non-resident your electric will cost you a little more per kw and even when not there there will be a network charge.


Ah, thank you!! Such great information, I really appreciate it 😁!


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> You don't need to drive in Rome. Pickup at the airport and just head to your destination.
> 
> Ya I'm not that far south of the airport but because of the way things were laid out by mother nature it's actually a longish drive. Or at least longer than you expect.


Sounds like you live in a beautiful area! I didn't realize you could avoid the city centre. The last time I hired a car in Roma, all I remember is the loooooooong walk (with luggage!) up the Spanish Steps to the car hire place, then significantly regretting my choices when driving through the city. The only other thing I remember about the car hire place is that they told me I HAD to take the insurance, because at some point in my trip, my car WOULD be stolen. No ifs ands of buts, it would just not be there anymore at some point. Crazy as it may be, it was always there 🙃.


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## NickZ

If you're flying into FCO picking up in the city doesn't make much sense -)


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## caerfilly

NickZ said:


> If you're flying into FCO picking up in the city doesn't make much sense -)


Yeah, I'm thinking that experience was most likely after staying in the city for a week or so first, then heading out. Only reason I can think of that I didn't hire a car at the airport.


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