# Married or Not to be married??



## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

Hey there.. some interesting reading on here to say the least, but there's something thats cropped up in my own personal story that i need some clarification on, (my dads official person is taking his sweet time in getting back to us...)

We're moving over to the USA next july and my dad (who has had a GC for 5 years,) and my step-mom (USC) are going to sponsor me and my partner and kids for our own GC's and permits etc.. we're also going to go for dual nationality too once we have them but thats for another post....

The question i have is that at the moment myself and my partner aren't married, but we have 2 kids together and have been together for 10 years.. In the UK this constitutes common-law husband and wife, but i'm not sure if we would have to be married for the purposes of the sponsorship?? can anyone shed any light on this for us?

Thanks.. Jonno


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

JustJonno said:


> The question i have is that at the moment myself and my partner aren't married, but we have 2 kids together and have been together for 10 years.. In the UK this constitutes common-law husband and wife, but i'm not sure if we would have to be married for the purposes of the sponsorship?? can anyone shed any light on this for us?


I was wondering about that when I saw your other post. As "partners" your partner has no rights whatsoever when it comes to sponsorship for the US. If you're hoping to live in the US, you'll have to make and honest woman of her. 

Seriously, the Americans are real sticklers about this. While there are rumored to be a few states that still recognize "common law" spouses, for immigration purposes it doesn't matter how long you've been together or how many kids you have. You have to do the deed to have the relationship recognized.
Cheers,
Bev


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

Has anyone filed a petition for you, yet? If so who and in what category?


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

Bevdeforges said:


> I was wondering about that when I saw your other post. As "partners" your partner has no rights whatsoever when it comes to sponsorship for the US. If you're hoping to live in the US, you'll have to make and honest woman of her.
> 
> Seriously, the Americans are real sticklers about this. While there are rumored to be a few states that still recognize "common law" spouses, for immigration purposes it doesn't matter how long you've been together or how many kids you have. You have to do the deed to have the relationship recognized.
> Cheers,
> Bev


If it's an F2B petition by his father, it will end with marriage. Rock and a hard place!


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## twostep (Apr 3, 2008)

First your father has to have his citizenship. As GC holder he cannot sponsor you. 

You have to get married. Common law is recognized but not for immigration purposes.


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

twostep said:


> First your father has to have his citizenship. As GC holder he cannot sponsor you.


As a PR, he can sponsor his *unmarried* son. As soon as the son marries, the petition dies.


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## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

Fatbrit said:


> As a PR, he can sponsor his *unmarried* son. As soon as the son marries, the petition dies.


So if we were to go over unmarried he could petition for me and not here as the mother of my children, and if we married he couldn't sponsor us at all????

you've got me kinda worried now.

Jonno


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## lambstew (Feb 18, 2009)

woah americans require you to be married before you can have a resident visa based on partnership??? this *rule* just adds to their divorce rate. i guess they do this so their divorce lawyers can make money and bring $$ to their pathetic economy  

cheers!


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## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

The question i have is that at the moment myself and my partner aren't married, but we have 2 kids together and have been together for 10 years.. In the UK this constitutes common-law husband and wife, but i'm not sure if we would have to be married for the purposes of the sponsorship?? can anyone shed any light on this for us?

Thanks.. Jonno[/QUOTE


There is no such thing as common law husband and wife in the Uk despite what many people seem to think.
If you are not married she is not classed as your next of kin and if anything were to happen her LEGAL next of kin would take presidence over you.
Although you can do as much as possbile to safeguard each others interests common-law partnerships are not recognised by law.

http://www.politics.co.uk/news/children-and-family/-no-such-thing-as-common-law-marriage--$1236545.htm


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## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

Thanks for clearing that up Veronica, but i did say "constitutes" not Legally.. i'm fully aware that there's no such thing and there never has been such a thing as common-law marriage, its a myth. I used the term as most others do, as a way to describe the length of time together with my partner..
I'm still at a loss as to just what this means on our sponsorship though now, i'm more confused now than i was when we started.. lol


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## twostep (Apr 3, 2008)

JustJonno said:


> Thanks for clearing that up Veronica, but i did say "constitutes" not Legally.. i'm fully aware that there's no such thing and there never has been such a thing as common-law marriage, its a myth. I used the term as most others do, as a way to describe the length of time together with my partner..
> I'm still at a loss as to just what this means on our sponsorship though now, i'm more confused now than i was when we started.. lol


No reason to be confused. There is common-law marriage in the US.

The easiest way - your father applies for citizenship asap which takes between three and nine months and 675US$ right now. In the meantime you get married and he sponsors you as soon as he has his naturalization certificate in hand.


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## omgirl03 (Feb 19, 2009)

Hi there,
There are several states which recognize Common Law marriage, however, the requirements are usually--1 or more years residency in that state. Also, you would need proof of joint financial responsibility (Joint bank accounts), and would have to have paid (Usually!! but not in every case!) state taxes in that state. And then have filed jointly. Most states have laws protecting your rights--especially if you have filed a joint tax return. In Colorado all you have to do is go to the Dept. of Motor Vehicles and declare you are man and wife--you are then legally married in that state. I hope this info helped. It should be as easy as checking the laws for the state in which you intend to reside.
If you file for joint citizenship, I believe you can do so jointly, but for that--you have to be married and produce a US Marriage certificate. You can file separately, but this would not benefit your children. Cheers!


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

Guys: Don't bother going on with the marriage issue as it's a red herring and the least of the Jonno's problems.

Jonno: You are not going to manage sponsorship through your father for the whole family by next July. If all the ducks were in a row now (i.e. he'd naturalized and you'd married), I'd guesstimate around a *decade* to you arriving on an immigrant visa under current legislation (F3 is currently processing from 2000). Nothing to stop you living here meantime using another route, of course.


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## twostep (Apr 3, 2008)

Just for me - Fat can you please give a link which shows GC holder sponsorship for children as you mentioned? Thank you you


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

twostep said:


> Just for me - Fat can you please give a link which shows GC holder sponsorship for children as you mentioned? Thank you you


Sure. The visa bulletin is published monthly by DOS and shows the processing dates for visas with numerical limits.

Here are the categories for family- sponsored ones.



> FAMILY-SPONSORED PREFERENCES
> 
> "First: Unmarried Sons and Daughters of Citizens: 23,400 plus any numbers not required for fourth preference.
> 
> ...


So if his father as a PR sponsors him as a PR, he's category F2B whereas if his father sponsors the whole family as a USC, they're category F3. If you scroll down to the tables, you can see the current processing dates.

The only family categories missing from the bulletin are spouse and parents of a USC since there is no numerical limit in this category.


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## theresoon (Apr 11, 2008)

Processing times also vary state. Go somewhere with minimal applications and you'll finish a couple of years earlier. Go to New York, California, Florida and some other states and then you'll wait forever and it will be very frustrating every time you go in that office with all the people waiting. I know people who lived in Indiana, while working in Chicago, so they could get their GCs faster and then moved to New York, which is where they wanted to be in the first place.


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

theresoon said:


> Processing times also vary state. Go somewhere with minimal applications and you'll finish a couple of years earlier. Go to New York, California, Florida and some other states and then you'll wait forever and it will be very frustrating every time you go in that office with all the people waiting. I know people who lived in Indiana, while working in Chicago, so they could get their GCs faster and then moved to New York, which is where they wanted to be in the first place.


You're talking about processing time, which does indeed vary from office to office. But the main wait is for a visa number to become available. All family categories except spouse or parents of a USC are numerically limited -- and this is where he joins the line and waits a decade or so.


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## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

Ok.. so.. having established that i'm gonna be waiting till 2020 to get my GC, the next thing to ask is about the work permits and entry visas...

Can we go over on the visa waiver scheme and then do the application to get our status changed? or will we have to go over on something else??? 
Also, how does this effect the chances of getting a temporary work permit?? When my dad went through his in Ohio, he got a working permit 3 months after starting the whole process and could work, then got his GC after 12 months from the application date... what difference would there be with us?

JJ

PS: also wanted to say thanks for all the help you guys have given so far.. it really is good to talk to people that have been through all this themselves..


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## twostep (Apr 3, 2008)

Slow down JJ:>)
It sounds like your father went through the green card process as spouse of a US citizen. Pretty standard.

You have several options - lottery (if qualified), marriage (probably out of the running), investment, US employer or transfer through UK employer, family reunion through your father.

What is your professional background?


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## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

my professional background is IT and more specifically Internet/networks and programming, only problem is i don't have a degree and i'm 32.. so that puts me out the Gen X that they are recruiting atm.. lol
i think that its gonna be door A or door E in your list.. the others are definatly out atm.
JJ


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

JustJonno said:


> Ok.. so.. having established that i'm gonna be waiting till 2020 to get my GC, the next thing to ask is about the work permits and entry visas...
> 
> Can we go over on the visa waiver scheme and then do the application to get our status changed? or will we have to go over on something else???
> Also, how does this effect the chances of getting a temporary work permit?? When my dad went through his in Ohio, he got a working permit 3 months after starting the whole process and could work, then got his GC after 12 months from the application date... what difference would there be with us?
> ...


Okay so your overall plan for GC runs: you marry, your old man naturalizes, he files an F3 for the whole family to get you in the line. It's impossible to tell how long the line is and how fast it'll move. Also it's impossible to tell whether Congress will increase the numbers, reduce the numbers, or cut the path off altogether. But you can't win if you're not in the line.

You can't "live" here on the VWP. But you could "live" here on plenty of other visas while waiting for your F3 to process.

Your old man was lucky if the adjusted status from a VWP entry. This route has just become very dangerous due to a recent ruling out of the 9th Circuit. Regardless, you can only adjust from a VWP if there is a number immediately available for you, i.e. spouses and parents of USCs.


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## twostep (Apr 3, 2008)

JustJonno said:


> my professional background is IT and more specifically Internet/networks and programming, only problem is i don't have a degree and i'm 32.. so that puts me out the Gen X that they are recruiting atm.. lol
> i think that its gonna be door A or door E in your list.. the others are definatly out atm.
> JJ


Next question - you realize the IT field here is not rosy for degreed IT geeks; not to mention non-degreed. How do you plan to make a living?


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## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

Fatbrit said:


> Okay so your overall plan for GC runs: you marry, your old man naturalizes, he files an F3 for the whole family to get you in the line. It's impossible to tell how long the line is and how fast it'll move. Also it's impossible to tell whether Congress will increase the numbers, reduce the numbers, or cut the path off altogether. But you can't win if you're not in the line.
> 
> You can't "live" here on the VWP. But you could "live" here on plenty of other visas while waiting for your F3 to process.


ok, so any chance of pointers or ideas? or would it be best to just start the ball rolling now and live in the UK for the next 10 years till the F3 comes through??



twostep said:


> Next question - you realize the IT field here is not rosy for degreed IT geeks; not to mention non-degreed. How do you plan to make a living?


The IT field in and around Ohio is pretty good at the moment, failing that though i have other avenues i can enquire down provided i get the permit to work first...


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

JustJonno said:


> ok, so any chance of pointers or ideas? or would it be best to just start the ball rolling now and live in the UK for the next 10 years till the F3 comes through??


You want ot live in the Us, get the ball rolling. First job is old man's naturalization and your marriage. If he needs help with the former, he can ask for help here.

Beyond that, how about an E2 to keep you here till your number comes up? Sell everything and buy a Subway.


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

JustJonno said:


> The IT field in and around Ohio is pretty good at the moment, failing that though i have other avenues i can enquire down provided i get the permit to work first...


Problem being you need the job first, in order to get the work permit.
Cheers,
Bev


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## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

oki.. after talking it over with the OH, there's one thing we want to ask..
Can we start the F3 process here in the UK and visit the USA on holidays till we get the all clear?? or would we have to be in and stay in the USA in order for us to get it?
Basically I read somewhere that if you leave the USA while your GC application is being processed you void the application, so i'm kinda worried about holidays over there if we do the whole process while we tough it out in the UK.
Sorry to be a pain with all the questions, but as you all know its a big thing to do and we want to make sure its all legal, above board and know all the facts about what we're getting into first..

Thanks for your help all.. its been invaluable so far!
JJ


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## Davis1 (Feb 20, 2009)

JustJonno said:


> Ok.. so.. having established that i'm gonna be waiting till 2020 to get my GC, the next thing to ask is about the work permits and entry visas...
> Can we go over on the visa waiver scheme and then do the application to get our status changed? or will we have to go over on something else???
> ..


If you go through the process and arrive in 2020 as 
Fatbrit described you will get your visa and green card straight away and can work anywhere.. no permit needed.

Is alll up to when your Father files, you do not file anything... nor 
can you change status on the visa waiver anyway


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## Fatbrit (May 8, 2008)

JustJonno said:


> oki.. after talking it over with the OH, there's one thing we want to ask..
> Can we start the F3 process here in the UK and visit the USA on holidays till we get the all clear?? or would we have to be in and stay in the USA in order for us to get it?
> Basically I read somewhere that if you leave the USA while your GC application is being processed you void the application, so i'm kinda worried about holidays over there if we do the whole process while we tough it out in the UK.
> Sorry to be a pain with all the questions, but as you all know its a big thing to do and we want to make sure its all legal, above board and know all the facts about what we're getting into first..
> ...


There are two ways of getting the green card: being issued an immigrant visa at a US consulate and then entering, or adjusting status when already here. But only the latter sometimes requires that you do no leave in the middle of the process, e.g. when your father adjusted status from VWP entry to permanent resident.

You can vacation here while waiting for your number to come up.

As Davies1 said, you don't apply for anything until your number comes up/ It's your father's petition, or rather will be once he naturalizes.


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## JustJonno (Feb 17, 2009)

Been talking to my father about all this and he's going ahead with the USC application as soon as. We're also talking to my dads immigration lawyer as well when we go over in May for a holiday to find out what he needs us to do and from us to get it all going. As soon as we've been over and had a F2F with the lawyer and know whats going on, I'll update here with precise info for people.

Thanks all

JJ


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## synthia (Apr 18, 2007)

Thanks for the promise of the update. I would love to know what has happened to some of the people who have posted here, and what their status is now.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

*Marriage and immigration to the US*

After growing up in America I can tell you for sure that there are many and also ever changing laws on immigration.
To make sure all requirements are met and nothing overlooked, I would suggest that you have someone in the states visit an immigration INS office. Be sure they get not only all information for you but also the fees and any and all needed paperwork.
One mistake, one document missing and the petition will be denyed...


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## Davis1 (Feb 20, 2009)

Gene and Viol said:


> After growing up in America I can tell you for sure that there are many and also ever changing laws on immigration.
> To make sure all requirements are met and nothing overlooked, I would suggest that you have someone in the states visit an immigration INS office. Be sure they get not only all information for you but also the fees and any and all needed paperwork.
> One mistake, one document missing and the petition will be denyed...


Its not been the INS for many years ...

You dont just visit the USCIS offices .. you have to make specific appointment via the infopass system... the USCIS are not an information service ..they do have a helpline ..which is manned by contractors who will probably know less than you 
If you need information use sites such as this ..the USCIS web site ...or a Aila Lawyer


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

Amazing!


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