# Thinking of moving to Costa Del Sol



## Samhealey30 (Sep 2, 2015)

Hi all,

New to the forum and this is my first post so please be kind. 

My girlfriend and I have just returned from Benalmadena and we fell in love with the place. The people, the environment and the lifestyle. 

Suffice to say, we are now thinking of moving over to the area. We are planning on having a trial period of about 4 weeks over there next year to see if we do like it outside of the holiday mindset and I was wondering how easy it is to get work? I work in IT and my girlfriend is a train driver. Which recruitment websites are the best out in Spain? Is IT as saturated out there as it is here? 

If anyone has any good reading material (good or bad) I'd be very appreciative.

Many thanks,

Sam


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Samhealey30 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> New to the forum and this is my first post so please be kind.
> 
> ...



Since there is very high unemployment in Spain, there arent many recruitment agencies. Your best bet would be to google and send out your CV. There is an IT industrial type estate in Malaga, which may be worth a look - I dont know about train driving. A good command of Spanish would be vital for that I'd have thought and for IT??

Jo xxx


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Recruitment | Situations vacant | myservicesdirectory.com | surinenglish.com This may help??? - or not lol

Jo xxx


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## stefig (Jul 14, 2015)

It's not at all easy to find work in Spain - unemployment is incredibly high. Most of the British people I know there are working as English teachers (which is fine, but most of them are highly educated and experienced in other areas). Are you fluent in Spanish?


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## Samhealey30 (Sep 2, 2015)

jojo said:


> Since there is very high unemployment in Spain, there arent many recruitment agencies. Your best bet would be to google and send out your CV. There is an IT industrial type estate in Malaga, which may be worth a look - I dont know about train driving. A good command of Spanish would be vital for that I'd have thought and for IT??
> 
> Jo xxx


Thank you for that, Jo. I'll have a bit of a google for that estate you mentioned. I had thought about starting my own business out there but I doubt it's viable. 

Do you have any other advice? I'm just wanting to make sure I have as much information as possible.

Many thanks,

Sam


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## Samhealey30 (Sep 2, 2015)

stefig said:


> It's not at all easy to find work in Spain - unemployment is incredibly high. Most of the British people I know there are working as English teachers (which is fine, but most of them are highly educated and experienced in other areas). Are you fluent in Spanish?


Hi stefig,

Thank you for the info. I'm not....yet. We have enrolled in Spanish classes over here. My girlfriend knows a bit but I know nothing. But I will....:fingerscrossed:


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Samhealey30 said:


> Thank you for that, Jo. I'll have a bit of a google for that estate you mentioned. I had thought about starting my own business out there but I doubt it's viable.
> 
> Do you have any other advice? I'm just wanting to make sure I have as much information as possible.
> 
> ...


See what others say, but I'm afraid my advice would be that if you have good jobs in the UK, then for the time being staying put is your best bet. What about saving a bit and having a 6 week sabbatical/long holiday and rent somewhere in Benal in the winter. That way, you get to see the non tourist side of things, you could also go to that industrial estate and have a look around and get a general feel for how things are in Spain???

Jo xxx


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## Samhealey30 (Sep 2, 2015)

jojo said:


> See what others say, but I'm afraid my advice would be that if you have good jobs in the UK, then for the time being staying put is your best bet. What about saving a bit and having a 6 week sabbatical/long holiday and rent somewhere in Benal in the winter. That way, you get to see the non tourist side of things, you could also go to that industrial estate and have a look around and get a general feel for how things are in Spain???
> 
> Jo xxx



Very good advice. We have a bit of a 3 year plan anyway but I hadn't given the sabbatical idea any thought. I'm so fed up of the British lifestyle. Looking out of my office window at the dreary weather and the utter distain we hold for each other over here. I was poorly whilst on my holiday and the Spanish people couldn't do enough for me! That's what swung it for us really. I know I'm looking at it through rose tinted glasses right now hence why I want to get to know the 'real Spain'.

Thanks again.

Sam


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Samhealey30 said:


> Very good advice. We have a bit of a 3 year plan anyway but I hadn't given the sabbatical idea any thought. I'm so fed up of the British lifestyle. Looking out of my office window at the dreary weather and the utter distain we hold for each other over here. I was poorly whilst on my holiday and the Spanish people couldn't do enough for me! That's what swung it for us really. I know I'm looking at it through rose tinted glasses right now hence why I want to get to know the 'real Spain'.
> 
> Thanks again.
> 
> Sam



I'm back in the UK now and I know exactly what you mean. Having spent 5 years in Spain, it was wonderful, but once the novelty wears off, it is a very harsh country. Yes the Spanish are friendly and laid back, but when you're there day to day, it wears off. There is a lot of poverty due to the job shortage, the benefit system isnt as comprehensive as it is in the UK and its alot more difficult to live in a country where you dont speak the language or understand the rules.

But you have to try it - I suggested the winter because the winters are cold, wet and central heating is rare. You will also see Spain - not the tourist Spain, but the ordinary spain - its still lovely, but you'll have to take those rose tinted specs off lol

Jo xxx


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## Samhealey30 (Sep 2, 2015)

jojo said:


> I'm back in the UK now and I know exactly what you mean. Having spent 5 years in Spain, it was wonderful, but once the novelty wears off, it is a very harsh country. Yes the Spanish are friendly and laid back, but when you're there day to day, it wears off. There is a lot of poverty due to the job shortage, the benefit system isnt as comprehensive as it is in the UK and its alot more difficult to live in a country where you dont speak the language or understand the rules.
> 
> But you have to try it - I suggested the winter because the winters are cold, wet and central heating is rare. You will also see Spain - not the tourist Spain, but the ordinary spain - its still lovely, but you'll have to take those rose tinted specs off lol
> 
> Jo xxx


Did you move back because of the aforementioned if you don't mind my asking? Also, which part of Spain were you staying? I'm a nosey sod lol Sorry for all the questions! 

I'll definitely make sure I leave my glasses at home 

Thanks,

Sam


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Samhealey30 said:


> Did you move back because of the aforementioned if you don't mind my asking? Also, which part of Spain were you staying? I'm a nosey sod lol Sorry for all the questions!
> 
> I'll definitely make sure I leave my glasses at home
> 
> ...


 We moved back for a few reasons, mainly because my husband commuted to run his business in the UK - something we thought would be temporary, but after 5 years we realised it wouldnt be. Anyway, he got fed up with it. My son at 16 wanted to go to college in the UK and wanted a part time job - no work in Spain and my daughter hated Spain from the minute we arrived (too hot, too dusty, scared of insects, gekkos and didnt like the Spanish - she was a teenager). We kept our UK house, so we decided it would be better to simply go back.

But we were in Benalmadena - well Torre Muelle, which is a private estate just west of Benal and it was lovely. I loved it there and I'm hoping that when/if we sell our UK house, we'll get something smaller here and maybe an apartment in Spain and flit between the two???

Jo xxx


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## Samhealey30 (Sep 2, 2015)

jojo said:


> We moved back for a few reasons, mainly because my husband commuted to run his business in the UK - something we thought would be temporary, but after 5 years we realised it wouldnt be. Anyway, he got fed up with it. My son at 16 wanted to go to college in the UK and wanted a part time job - no work in Spain and my daughter hated Spain from the minute we arrived (too hot, too dusty, scared of insects, gekkos and didnt like the Spanish - she was a teenager). We kept our UK house, so we decided it would be better to simply go back.
> 
> But we were in Benalmadena - well Torre Muelle, which is a private estate just west of Benal and it was lovely. I loved it there and I'm hoping that when/if we sell our UK house, we'll get something smaller here and maybe an apartment in Spain and flit between the two???
> 
> Jo xxx



So less to do with Spain itself then which is good to hear although my girlfriend is now worried about finding work.

We stayed not far from torre mulle in benalmadena costa, la perla. Absolutely stunning!

I'm sure I'll have more questions but thank you so much for your time and valuable advice. 

Many thanks,

Sam


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Our mistake, although we didn't know it at the time was that we moved just as the recession started. My husband had a successful business in the uk and a friend already living in Spain who had a similar business. They were going to join forces and had made long term plans. But the recession meant they had to put things on hold. My husband commuted back to the UK to keep his business there afloat. Fortunately his business in the uk is still doing well. Our friend in Spain had to diversify and in retrospect we made the right decision financially. 

I don't know how easy it is to start a business in Spain these days, but I know that to be self employed you have to become autonomo, which involves paying a fixed monthly fee which escalates to around 250€ . But that (or an employment contract) would allow you access to Spanish healthcare. 

Jo xxx

Sent from my D5803 using Expat Forum


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## LuGo (Aug 31, 2015)

Hi Sam and JoJo!

Great thread! We are in the same position as you Sam as we're in the 'planning to move stage', still here in Blighty and like you, we're beginning to learn Spanish and trying to get ourselves as prepared as possible to move in the future. We are looking to buy in Galicia or Asturias. 

Your insight into things JoJo is really useful for newbies like me, thank you  I'm interested to know where the best official site is, to find most up to date information in English about Autonomo and in particular I wondered if as part of a couple one persons Autonomo contributions cover their spouse / partners right to residence and medical?

Thanks for your help 

Lu & Lorna


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

The "industrial estate" Jojo was referring to is the Parque Tecnologico de Andalucia in Malaga, and over 15,000 people are now employed there by various companies. This link gives details of current vacancies:-


Empleos De Parque Tecnologico Malaga | Mitula Trabajo


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

As a general rule of thumb because of the current appalling unemployment situation if you do not have a job lined up or an independent income - Spain is not the place to move to


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## Helenameva (Aug 15, 2014)

Rabbitcat said:


> As a general rule of thumb because of the current appalling unemployment situation if you do not have a job lined up or an independent income - Spain is not the place to move to


I wouldn't agree with this. There are so many determining factors (occupation, preferred location, lifestyle choices, family situation i.e. number of dependents, motivation for wanting to come) that a 'rule of thumb' can't be applied / advised.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Well we can disagree.

With sky high unemployment , no free healthcare etc its unquestionably a tough environment for those with either no work or income


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Unemployment went up again in August too which surprised me. If Spaniards can't get jobs how can anyone without good language skills walk into a job even if qualified, they couldn't even cope with an interview.


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## bob_bob (Jan 5, 2011)

Samhealey30 said:


> Thank you for that, Jo. I'll have a bit of a google for that estate you mentioned. I had thought about starting my own business out there but I doubt it's viable.
> 
> Do you have any other advice? I'm just wanting to make sure I have as much information as possible.
> 
> ...


Don't burn your bridges back to the UK, don't sell your property, take as much money as you can and only go when you have contracted employment. Work on living on your pay as I can't see a non fluent in Spanish getting work driving trains.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Samhealey30 said:


> Very good advice. We have a bit of a 3 year plan anyway but I hadn't given the sabbatical idea any thought. I'm so fed up of the British lifestyle. Looking out of my office window at the dreary weather and the utter distain we hold for each other over here. I was poorly whilst on my holiday and the Spanish people couldn't do enough for me! That's what swung it for us really. I know I'm looking at it through rose tinted glasses right now hence why I want to get to know the 'real Spain'.
> 
> Thanks again.
> 
> Sam


Sam, you really do have a very rose tinted view of Spain, I'm afraid. Spending a holiday somewhere gives you absolutely no idea of what life is like. I visited Prague for long periods for over thirty years. Ten years ago I went to live there. Nothing whatsoever like a holiday. 
Please do not run down the UK. It is a much kinder, gentler place than Spain. Of course there are kind people in Spain - as there are in any country. But there are also men who beat and kill their wives, people who are cruel to animals, thieves, rapists and there s a huge amount of corruption.
Unemployment here runs at 22% nationally. Malaga Province in which Benalmadena is situated has a rate of over 30%. Unless you have a good command of Spanish you will struggle to find work. That kind of the command of the language won't come with lessons. You need to spend a few years in Spain listening to Spanish speakers.
I don't know about IT work but it's almost impossible that your girlfriend will find work driving trains. It's not impossible to find a job but it is in the present economic climate very hard, even for Spaniards.
You need much more time here to get a true picture. If you have a job in the UK it would be very unwise to give it up. More holidays are needed and at all times of the year as Spain has dreary weather too.
By the way, there is no 'real' Spain. Ask yourself: is there a 'real' England? There are many different Spains, just as there are many different Frances, Americas, Portugals and Englands.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

LuGo said:


> Hi Sam and JoJo!
> 
> Great thread! We are in the same position as you Sam as we're in the 'planning to move stage', still here in Blighty and like you, we're beginning to learn Spanish and trying to get ourselves as prepared as possible to move in the future. We are looking to buy in Galicia or Asturias.
> 
> ...


you won't find any official sites in English - all govt sites are in Spanish, of course

we do all we can to keep up date here for pretty much everything - & for specific tax info this is a good site - they are lawyers & accountants & I've never yet known them to wrong Spanish law tax and more | Spain lawyers accountants in English | ADVOCO


for healthcare as autónomo or working with a contract, husband or wife & dependent children would be covered as well as the worker


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## Samhealey30 (Sep 2, 2015)

Thank you to everyone for your replies, your insight and information is like gold to us! 

It seems that in our utter ignorance we had not considered the unemployment crisis out in Spain, having said that, we are still determined to at least give it a shot based simply on 'what have we got to lose?' We had no plans on selling our UK home and certainly not burning any bridges. 

I think our first real cross to bear is the language which we will be making a concerted effort to learn and hopefully, by the time we are ready to move (about 3 years) the unemployment issue may have started to heal itself and things will be a bit easier on the Spanish and in turn expats. 

LuGo, good luck with everything your end!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Samhealey30 said:


> Thank you to everyone for your replies, your insight and information is like gold to us!
> 
> It seems that in our utter ignorance we had not considered the unemployment crisis out in Spain, having said that, we are still determined to at least give it a shot based simply on 'what have we got to lose?' We had no plans on selling our UK home and certainly not burning any bridges.
> 
> ...


If you have no dependent children and you keep your UK home then yes, you have nothing to lose and even if you don't find work you will have had an interesting experience.
Bear in mind that to become a Spanish resident you have to show an income of 600 euros a month into a Spanish bank account plus substantial savings and also have comprehensive private health insurance.
You'll need to spend several holidays here in order to hear Spanish spoken fluently and rapidly by Spaniards. Lessons don't really prepare you for that, I'm afraid.
Whether the employment situation will improve in three years, who knows? Jobs have to be found for five million Spaniards. High unemployment isn't something you hear about on holiday....
Keep up with what's going on in Spain as well as learning Spanish. That's helpful too.


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## stefig (Jul 14, 2015)

mrypg9 said:


> Sam, you really do have a very rose tinted view of Spain, I'm afraid. Spending a holiday somewhere gives you absolutely no idea of what life is like. I visited Prague for long periods for over thirty years. Ten years ago I went to live there. Nothing whatsoever like a holiday.
> Please do not run down the UK. It is a much kinder, gentler place than Spain. Of course there are kind people in Spain - as there are in any country. But there are also men who beat and kill their wives, people who are cruel to animals, thieves, rapists and there s a huge amount of corruption.
> Unemployment here runs at 22% nationally. Malaga Province in which Benalmadena is situated has a rate of over 30%. Unless you have a good command of Spanish you will struggle to find work. That kind of the command of the language won't come with lessons. You need to spend a few years in Spain listening to Spanish speakers.
> I don't know about IT work but it's almost impossible that your girlfriend will find work driving trains. It's not impossible to find a job but it is in the present economic climate very hard, even for Spaniards.
> ...


Even if you do speak fluent Spanish, it's still extremely difficult to find work. I have been learning it for over 15 years and I highly doubt I could get anything other than work which requires a native English speaker, such as teaching or translation. The last time I lived in Spain, I STILL got a lot of attitude and negativity ("you're coming over here and taking our jobs" mentality) from both civil servants and the general public, until I gave them an explanation they were satisfied with (that I was working as a teacher to help Spanish kids to improve their English - a job your average Spaniard simply cannot do). And even if you 'only' want to work in one of the academias, you still need to have proper TEFL qualifications and the relevant experience (generally a minimum of 2 years). You can't just turn up and be given a job just because you're a native speaker, with the exception of perhaps the tiniest pueblos where there is no competition at all. 

I am fully intending to go back to live in Spain, for some time at least, but I'm a freelancer with a client base outside Spain (I work with agencies in other EU countries). and a fully qualified English teacher with 8 years of experience. It is definitely not impossible to move to Spain and work, but it requires careful planning and knowing what you're dealing with. 

I actually disagree with you, mrypg9, that the UK is a kinder and gentler place than Spain. I live in the South East and I also find it pretty grim and miserable.
I have a rotten commute and spend 3/4 of my salary on living costs and commuting. I'm always much happier living in Spain and feel more at home there. But the UK definitely has its positive points, such as the welfare benefits (if you're entitled to any - I never have been) and central heating (Spanish houses are COLD in winter), to name but a few.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

stefig;8115898I said:


> am fully intending to go back to live in Spain, for some time at least, but I'm a freelancer with a client base outside Spain (I work with agencies in other EU countries). and a fully qualified English teacher with 8 years of experience. It is definitely not impossible to move to Spain and work, but it requires careful planning and knowing what you're dealing with.
> 
> I actually disagree with you, mrypg9, that the UK is a kinder and gentler place than Spain. I live in the South East and I also find it pretty grim and miserable.
> I have a rotten commute and spend 3/4 of my salary on living costs and commuting. I'm always much happier living in Spain and feel more at home there. But the UK definitely has its positive points, such as the welfare benefits (if you're entitled to any - I never have been) and central heating (Spanish houses are COLD in winter), to name but a few.


There's no doubt that the UK is fast losing its sense of community and social cohesion. The climate is often dreary and grey and our towns and cities are imo ugly thanks to sixties and seventies 'planners;'.
But....the UK welfare state with its Child Benefit, Working Family Tax Credit, Housing Benefit, Pension Credit etc. provide a safety net that isn't there in Spain.
Spain has many laws relating to fair treatment at work and rights for minorities but these exist chiefly on paper. There are no mechanisms for swift recourse to justice if these rights are flouted or ignored.
In the UK, a policeman can't fine me on the spot for an offence I may or may not have committed. I can have my day in court, even for a minor traffic offence. 
In the UK, planning laws are in 99% of cases universally and impartially applied. A current case in Estepona is a seventy-year old Finnish woman who has been ordered to demolish an extension identical to that of her Spanish neighbours and for which she has the relevant paperwork in order. She has been given a hefty fine which she must pay this week. All attempts to discuss the matter with the Town Hall have been rebuffed.
Over twenty-five women in Spain have died this year, victims of gender violence...
The UK is no way perfect but in many ways relating to civil liberties it is more advanced than Spain.
Things are improving though with the election of PSOE led Councils. Many Aytos in Malaga are now adopting LGBTI 'charters'.


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## stefig (Jul 14, 2015)

mrypg9 said:


> There's no doubt that the UK is fast losing its sense of community and social cohesion. The climate is often dreary and grey and our towns and cities are imo ugly thanks to sixties and seventies 'planners;'.
> But....the UK welfare state with its Child Benefit, Working Family Tax Credit, Housing Benefit, Pension Credit etc. provide a safety net that isn't there in Spain.
> Spain has many laws relating to fair treatment at work and rights for minorities but these exist chiefly on paper. There are no mechanisms for swift recourse to justice if these rights are flouted or ignored.
> In the UK, a policeman can't fine me on the spot for an offence I may or may not have committed. I can have my day in court, even for a minor traffic offence.
> ...


I totally agree about the welfare system. The thing for me personally is that I'm not actually eligible for anything, so I'm working incredibly hard for not much money and never get any kind of break. I pay my tax and national insurance every month, but the medical care I get at my GP is so substandard that I often end up going private. So I might as well scrape by in Spain and have the sun, the great food and the beach on my doorstep  

I agree with you about on-the-spot fines and planning laws. Not sure I agree about gender violence - there is plenty of that in the UK. There have been several stories in the press this week *alone* about women who were battered or almost battered to death by their partners. It just doesn't get reported here as extensively as it does in Spain because there are so many other crimes and issues. In my opinion, anyway.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

stefig said:


> I totally agree about the welfare system. The thing for me personally is that I'm not actually eligible for anything, so I'm working incredibly hard for not much money and never get any kind of break. I pay my tax and national insurance every month, but the medical care I get at my GP is so substandard that I often end up going private. So I might as well scrape by in Spain and have the sun, the great food and the beach on my doorstep
> 
> I agree with you about on-the-spot fines and planning laws. Not sure I agree about gender violence - there is plenty of that in the UK. There have been several stories in the press this week *alone* about women who were battered or almost battered to death by their partners. It just doesn't get reported here as extensively as it does in Spain because there are so many other crimes and issues. In my opinion, anyway.


I think that there may be more advanced attitudes towards gender equality in the UK? Last year I spoke to a group of women trades unionists at an Equality Seminar in Huelva and when afterwards I asked what their biggest problem was they said with one voice 'Men!'. So whilst you may be right, although I doubt the homicide figure is as high, machismo is still a huge problem here. In fact, I'm off to meet with a Spanish friend to discuss setting up a group Contra Violencia Machista...
I agree 100% about health care in Spain, although I was healthy in the UK and rarely needed a doctor. It's great here, at least where I am.
I once rang our local surgery and was given an appointment just over an hour later....I can always get an appointment the same day if I ring before nine.
No dispute about the weather


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## stefig (Jul 14, 2015)

mrypg9 said:


> I think that there may be more advanced attitudes towards gender equality in the UK? Last year I spoke to a group of women trades unionists at an Equality Seminar in Huelva and when afterwards I asked what their biggest problem was they said with one voice 'Men!'. So whilst you may be right, although I doubt the homicide figure is as high, machismo is still a huge problem here. In fact, I'm off to meet with a Spanish friend to discuss setting up a group Contra Violencia Machista...
> I agree 100% about health care in Spain, although I was healthy in the UK and rarely needed a doctor. It's great here, at least where I am.
> I once rang our local surgery and was given an appointment just over an hour later....I can always get an appointment the same day if I ring before nine.
> No dispute about the weather


I think it's getting MORE misogynistic in the UK, not less. This has been well documented in the newspapers recently, and I have had experience of it too. I think the number is actually far higher in the UK. The link below says that on average 2 women a WEEK are killed by a current or former partner.

Statistics

This one says 150 women died at the hands of men in 2014.

2014 | Karen Ingala Smith

This was in the paper a couple of weeks ago. 

Ex boyfriend Anthony Riley 'plotted Lowestoft acid attack' - BBC News

I think the problem is every bit as bad as in Spain, if not worse. It just usually doesn't get reported.


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