# 457 Visas replaced by 482 TSS visas



## IndigoKKing (Jul 31, 2014)

Malcolm Turnbull announced this on his FB page. More details to follow..


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## IndigoKKing (Jul 31, 2014)

Here's a summary of the announcement


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## IndigoKKing (Jul 31, 2014)

- Current 457 visa holders will be 'grand fathered'. Won't be affected

- No permanent residency afterwards

- 200 fewer sectors eligible for work visas


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

Any information about those whose applications have already been submitted and are under process ?

Will those applications still be processed or they all stand cancelled ?

Cheers


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## IndigoKKing (Jul 31, 2014)

They should go ahead. There'll be a sunset date for the current category and new rules


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## rockyroad (Apr 18, 2017)

along with the 457 ban he did mention about putting Australians First, does this in anyway affect the current applications for residency ?


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## IndigoKKing (Jul 31, 2014)

rockyroad said:


> along with the 457 ban he did mention about putting Australians First, does this in anyway affect the current applications for residency ?


Nothing mentioned in today's announcement but that seems to be the general direction. There will be changes to that too in coming months


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## Rahul_UK183 (Mar 30, 2017)

*457 Axed !!*

Any worry for 189 / 190 aspirants ? 

Apologies I have no knowledge of 457.


Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk


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## sultan_azam (Sep 9, 2015)

IndigoKKing said:


> - Current 457 visa holders will be 'grand fathered'. Won't be affected
> 
> - No permanent residency afterwards
> 
> - 200 fewer sectors eligible for work visas



*- No permanent residency afterwards* what does this means ???


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## shets (May 18, 2016)

Worrisome trend indeed! Another instance of Australians walking on the road laid by Americans. It was Trump who first proposed Americans first. Now it their turn to say Australians first.

On the surface these are all populist measures to pacify public sentiments which is against foreign workers/immigration on the whole. 

Hope this doesn't affect people like us who have been patiently waiting in the queue.:fingerscrossed:


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## shets (May 18, 2016)

sultan_azam said:


> *- No permanent residency afterwards* what does this means ???




Me too have the same queries. I did not get the last two lines.

- No permanent residency afterwards

- 200 fewer sectors eligible for work visas


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## ibbz87 (Jun 30, 2016)

rahagarw said:


> Any worry for 189 / 190 aspirants ?
> 
> Apologies I have no knowledge of 457.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk


although it sounds a bit selfish but i think axing 457 would have positive impact on job prospects for PR holders.
reason being many companies are employing workers from overseas when they have abundance of skilled pr holders.
loads of 457 visas are acquired using fake contracts where onshore companies charge massive amounts to sponsor foriegn workers.

Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

sultan_azam said:


> *- No permanent residency afterwards* what does this means ???


There was a transition pathway for 457 visa holders with lesser requirements after working on 457 for 2 years as compared to the usual 189/190 applicants.


DIBP has already clarified that the new TSS will require 3 years working instead of 2 for applying for PR and those on the shorter 2 year TSS visa will not be eligible to apply at all for PR
Only the medium 4 year TSS visa holders will be eligible to apply for PR

https://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Work/457-abolition-replacement

200 existing ANZSCO Code list for which 457 visas can be issued will be removed and the list shortened to those occupations only which are in genuine shortage.
This change will take effect from 19th April
So,tonight you can expect so see a curtailed list of job classifications under which you can be sponsored for 457 visa.

Cheers


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## audrayyeng (Oct 12, 2016)

If anyone have news regarding on-going applications, please update..

I lodged on 6th April 2017 and my current visa will expire on 8th May 2017.

Hopefully they will continue to process the current queue..


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## sultan_azam (Sep 9, 2015)

ibbz87 said:


> although it sounds a bit selfish but i think axing 457 would have positive impact on job prospects for PR holders.
> reason being many companies are employing workers from overseas when they have abundance of skilled pr holders.
> loads of 457 visas are acquired using fake contracts where onshore companies charge massive amounts to sponsor foriegn workers.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk


i wish the job prospects for Australian Citizens and PRs improve with this initiative, however it will take some time to see those impacts


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## shets (May 18, 2016)

newbienz said:


> There was a transition pathway for 457 visa holders with lesser requirements after working on 457 for 2 years as compared to the usual 189/190 applicants.
> 
> 
> DIBP has already clarified that the new TSS will require 3 years working instead of 2 for applying for PR and those on the shorter 2 year TSS visa will not be eligible to apply at all for PR
> ...





Dude, thanks a ton for the info! Hope this doesn't affect already submitted applications. What about Engineering Technologist being in the list? :fingerscrossed:


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## sultan_azam (Sep 9, 2015)

newbienz said:


> There was a transition pathway for 457 visa holders with lesser requirements after working on 457 for 2 years as compared to the usual 189/190 applicants.
> 
> 
> DIBP has already clarified that the new TSS will require 3 years working instead of 2 for applying for PR and those on the shorter 2 year TSS visa will not be eligible to apply at all for PR
> ...


thanks for explaining


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## shets (May 18, 2016)

ibbz87 said:


> although it sounds a bit selfish but i think axing 457 would have positive impact on job prospects for PR holders.
> reason being many companies are employing workers from overseas when they have abundance of skilled pr holders.
> loads of 457 visas are acquired using fake contracts where onshore companies charge massive amounts to sponsor foriegn workers.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk




Yes guys! it would definitely have an impact on the existing PR & citizens of Australia. Up to what extent only time will tell. They will now be forced to change their strategy and opt for residency instead of the usual 457.


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## FFacs (Jul 6, 2016)

sultan_azam said:


> i wish the job prospects for Australian Citizens and PRs improve with this initiative, however it will take some time to see those impacts


This will have a massive impact on sectors like ICT. The 457 visas have been abused terribly by some companies, bringing in low paid resources to work onshore in Australia for a couple of years with the promise of sponsorship for PR. If the replacement for 457 is no longer a route to staff ICT, demand for ICT skills should increase for those on PR and for Australians.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

The latest global processing time for 457 visa has now been reduced from 86 days to 51 days for 75% application 

So those of us in the queue can expect faster decisions 

Cheers


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

List of 180 jobs to be axed from tonight for 457 visa which were eligible earlier 

https://mobile.twitter.com/rharris3...s.com.au/news/visa-changes-announced/3167923/



Cheers


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## audrayyeng (Oct 12, 2016)

The new lists of occupation is now up on immigration website. 

https://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Work...sessing-authorities/skilled-occupations-lists


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## ashishjain (Oct 18, 2016)

*Australia abolished Visa 457*

*What is Visa-457*
The 457 visa is the most commonly used program for Australian or overseas employers to sponsor skilled overseas workers to work in Australia temporarily. The 457 visa provides 2 main alternatives, Business sponsorship and self-sponsorship. The full title of this subclass of visa was Temporary Business (Long Stay) and was introduced soon after John Howard became Prime Minister in 1996. The title of the visa was changed to Temporary Work (Skilled) (Subclass 457) visa on 24 November 2012.

*Benefits of Visa 457*
- Holders of this visa may be employed for a period of up to four years and may bring any eligible family members, including same-sex partners, who have unrestricted work and study rights in Australia. "If your sponsor is a start-up business or has traded in Australia for less than 12 months, then the visa will be granted for 18 months." Holders of the subclass 457 visa have no limit on the number of times they travel in and out of Australia.

- The Australian Government has reviewed the 457 skilled immigrant visa and has made some provisions to quicken the transition to permanent residency starting on 1 July 2012. Starting that date, non-resident workers on the 457 skilled immigration visa are able to transition to permanent residency if they have two years with the employer who has sponsored them and if the employer provides a full-time position in the 457 visa holder's nominated occupation.

- Furthermore, the Australian government has recognized that 457 visas deserve priority in review as they are highly responsive to the needs of the market. Overseas workers will be able to work in Australia on a six-month short term work visa before they apply for a 457 visa.

*What is Bridging Visa used by Visa-457 holders*
While on Visa-457, many applicants plan to file Permanent Residnecy through 189 or 190 and they are given a Bridging visa A (BVA). BVA is a temporary visa which allows you to stay in Australia after your current substantive visa ceases and while your substantive visa application is being processed. It can be granted if you lodge an application in Australia for a substantive visa while you still hold a substantive visa. A BVA does not allow you to return to Australia if you leave.

*What Malcolm Turnbull said:*
"_We are an immigration nation, but the fact remains: Australian workers must have priority for Australian jobs, so we are abolishing the 457 visa, the visa that brings temporary foreign workers into our country,_" said Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull.

*Why this step:-*
- As of September 30, there were 95,757 workers in Australia on primary 457 visa programme.
- The new programme will ensure that foreign workers are brought into Australia in order to fill critical skill gaps and not brought in because an employer finds it easier to recruit a foreign worker than go to the trouble of hiring an Australian.
- An audit by the Fair Work Ombudsman conducted between Sept 2013 and June 2014 found that 40% of 457 visa holders were no longer employed by a sponsor or were being paid well below the statutory minimum wage of $53,900.
- Let's not forget that politics of Australia and UK are highly driven by US (They all are allies). Turnbull mentioned the term - 'Australians First' today.

*What will happen now:-*
"_It is important businesses still get access to the skills they need to grow and invest, so the 457 visa will be replaced by a new temporary visa, specifically designed to recruit the best and brightest in the national interest_," Turnbull said.
- Existing applications lodged already and visa holders won't be affected in any way.

*What are its implications for Skilled Independent Visa Holders :-*
- There will be a wider market of jobs and increased chances of obtaining job from home country. 
- Faster visa processing as there will be far less applications and far less visa quota for new categories in the replaced visa system to 457. 75% applications were processed in 51 days as compared to 120 days for Skilled Independent 189 & 190. Now, one may easily calculate the benefits of this move as DIBP will certainly be unburdened with some work.


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## FFacs (Jul 6, 2016)

ashishjain said:


> *What is Visa-457*
> The 457 visa is the most commonly used program for Australian or overseas employers to sponsor skilled overseas workers to work in Australia temporarily. The 457 visa provides 2 main alternatives, Business sponsorship and self-sponsorship. The full title of this subclass of visa was Temporary Business (Long Stay) and was introduced soon after John Howard became Prime Minister in 1996. The title of the visa was changed to Temporary Work (Skilled) (Subclass 457) visa on 24 November 2012.
> 
> *Benefits of Visa 457*
> ...




Worryingly this is included at the bottom of the skills list page by removed skills:

These changes will only apply to new applications lodged on, or after, 19 April 2017 for:
Employer Nominated Scheme (subclass 186) – Direct Entry Stream
Skilled Nominated visa (subclass 190)
Skilled Regional (Provisional) visa (subclass 489) - if nominated by a State or Territory Government
Training visa (subclass 407)​​​​
However, for the subclass 457 programme for any of these removed occupations on, or after, 19 April 2017:
no visa applications can be granted
no nomination applications can be approved.

That would appear to indicate that all applications in progress that are for removed skills will be cancelled..... not sure.


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## jayptl (Dec 13, 2012)

thats gud news may be for current new PR holders for finding job...

but definitely worst news of thousands migrants who came on Student or TR visa.... just think about their huge shock in life as one applicant preparing spending 2 to 8 years to choose in Auz... and Suddenly govt abolished this visa...Especially who came on Student visa and Govt suddenly changed the SOL.. and This govt lured to students from Asian countries to give PR...after finishing study.

Anyway people only affecting this rules have huge impact in their life,, while other may sleep tonight under d fan...


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## Riash (Mar 9, 2017)

List of removed jobs is there in this link

https://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Work...occupations-lists/removed-skilled-occupations


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## sultan_azam (Sep 9, 2015)

FFacs said:


> Worryingly this is included at the bottom of the skills list page by removed skills:
> 
> These changes will only apply to new applications lodged on, or after, 19 April 2017 for:
> Employer Nominated Scheme (subclass 186) – Direct Entry Stream
> ...


i think the ongoing applications will be considered, let us see


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## jayptl (Dec 13, 2012)

what about current applicant who are on 457?? now?? does he apply 187 ENS


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## sreejithkm (Oct 4, 2016)

Australia abolishes visa programme popular with Indians - Times of India


https://www.theguardian.com/austral...t-abolish-457-temporary-work-visa?CMP=soc_567


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## chamomilesix (Jan 11, 2017)

I don't see any changes in SOL? Which is good news for everyone

I think the changes affect sponsored visas the most (190,489,457)


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## lqs_aus (Dec 22, 2016)

chamomilesix said:


> I don't see any changes in SOL? Which is good news for everyone
> 
> I think the changes affect sponsored visas the most (190,489,457)



Will it affect the State sponsored-190 for certain occupations or all the occupations?


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## theveed (Mar 7, 2016)

lqs_aus said:


> Will it affect the State sponsored-190 for certain occupations or all the occupations?


Verbatim from the fact sheet document.

"While the changes mainly impact the ENS and RSMS, existing and prospective applicants for the Skilled
Nominated (subclass 190) visa, the Skilled Independent (subclass 189) visa, and the Skilled Regional
(Provisional) (subclass 489) visa will also be affected by some changes to the occupations lists."


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## pest (Sep 2, 2016)

sultan_azam said:


> i think the ongoing applications will be considered, let us see





> 457 visa applicants that had lodged their application on or before 18 April 2017, and whose application had
> not yet been decided, with an occupation that has been removed from the STSOL, may be eligible for a
> refund of their visa application fee.


cannot add a link
google for abolition-replacement-457.pdf 

Looks like if your occupation is out - you're out as well


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## Punekar (Jul 10, 2013)

It is also not clear what will happen to the 457 holders currently out of Australia, will such people be allowed to travel to Australia on 457?


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## Egyman (Dec 16, 2015)

pest said:


> cannot add a link
> google for abolition-replacement-457.pdf
> 
> Looks like if your occupation is out - you're out as well


https://www.border.gov.au/WorkinginAustralia/Documents/abolition-replacement-457.pdf


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## leo2575 (Dec 20, 2013)

I second that. I know many people who are working in Australia through Infy and TCS on 457 visa. Their communication skills are extremely poor , cant even draft an email and are not strong technically. Indian companies have blatantly misused this visa like (H1/L1 in US) getting in low wage workers. I think this will have a positive effect on the market as a whole specially for PR holders. Salary disparity if any will also get addressed.


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## ammuammu (Dec 23, 2016)

anyone know about farming? it is out in list? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mnmedipa (Sep 9, 2016)

new sol hasn't come out yet for 17-18...It will be coming before 1 July 17...189 is largely unaffected unless occupations are removed from new SOL...


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## zaback21 (Jan 18, 2017)

mnmedipa said:


> new sol hasn't come out yet for 17-18...It will be coming before 1 July 17...189 is largely unaffected unless occupations are removed from new SOL...


New MLTSSL already replaces the current SOL from 19 April 2017 effective immediately.

And you will still get another updated MLTSSL from July 2017 when Department of Education and Training releases the updates MLTSSL 2017-18 for next year.


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## zaback21 (Jan 18, 2017)

ammuammu said:


> anyone know about farming? it is out in list?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Some are there and some are removed. 

Combined list of eligible skilled occupations


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## mykmallett (Apr 18, 2017)

Does this mean that if you're currently on a 457, you can no longer transition onto a 186 and get PR?


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## zaback21 (Jan 18, 2017)

mykmallett said:


> Does this mean that if you're currently on a 457, you can no longer transition onto a 186 and get PR?


You can read the conditions here: http://www.border.gov.au/WorkinginA...nt-employer-sponsored-migration-programme.pdf

http://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Work/457-abolition-replacement


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

zaback21 said:


> You can read the conditions here: http://www.border.gov.au/WorkinginA...nt-employer-sponsored-migration-programme.pdf
> 
> Abolition and replacement of the 457 visa – Government reforms to employer sponsored skilled migration visas


I am still having some doubts

If I am on a short term stream visa I am not eligible to apply for permanent residency visa under pathway. That is clear.

Am I barred from making an application under 189 also ?

Any thoughts ?


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## zaback21 (Jan 18, 2017)

newbienz said:


> I am still having some doubts
> 
> If I am on a short term stream visa I am not eligible to apply for permanent residency visa under pathway. That is clear.
> 
> ...


I don't think so. I think you are not allowed for 186/187 visa or something. 189/190/489 are separate things.


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## bhat8893 (Mar 29, 2017)

Will the existing 457s be converted into 2years TSS or 4years TSS by March 2018? What'd be the criteria?

If they are treated as or converted into 4years TSS, do they have to acquire 3 years of Australian experience or 3 years of overall work experience to apply for 189 PR?


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

An Irish newspaper has published this clarification on 457 application which are under process :

What about applicants and those who were planning to apply for a 457 visa?

The DIPB says: "Current 457 visa applicants and holders, prospective applicants, businesses sponsoring skilled migrants and
industry.

"457 visa applicants that had lodged their application on or before 18 April 2017, and whose application had not yet been decided, with an occupation that has been removed from the STSOL, may be eligible for a refund of their visa application fee.

"Nominating businesses for these applications may also be eligible for a refund of related fees."


Explainer: Australia is set to scrap the popular 457 visa programme: here's what it means for the Irish - Independent.ie


If this is true then all applications which had the 200 ANZSCO code which have been axed stand rejected enmasse and the rest will be considered as usual 

Cheers


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## bhat8893 (Mar 29, 2017)

bhat8893 said:


> Will the existing 457s be converted into 2years TSS or 4years TSS by March 2018? What'd be the criteria?
> 
> If they are treated as or converted into 4years TSS, do they have to acquire 3 years of Australian experience or 3 years of overall work experience to apply for 189 PR?


Reference:
https://www.border.gov.au/WorkinginAustralia/Documents/abolition-replacement-457.pdf
Still looking for the answers.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

bhat8893 said:


> Will the existing 457s be converted into 2years TSS or 4years TSS by March 2018? What'd be the criteria?
> 
> If they are treated as or converted into 4years TSS, do they have to acquire 3 years of Australian experience or 3 years of overall work experience to apply for 189 PR?



If your existing 457 visa is under MTSOL ANZSCO code, you will get 4 years visa with an option to apply for PR under the pathway route after 3 years of working on the 457 

If your 457 visa is under STSOL ANZSCO code, then you get only 2 year visa and no option of pathway to PR

The 3 year rule is for an easier route to PR separate from 189 called transition from 457 to PR

You are free to apply for PR under 189 at any point of time and your 457 visa is not an hindrance as clarified by Zaback in another question 

Cheers


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## satban (Apr 19, 2016)

This is the right thing to happen. The same happened with US L1B Visas about 4-5 years ago. The underlying cause being Z-class Indian IT companies bringing in absolute low wage employees to fill local roles.

Result being poor client impression and overall negative impression of the IT services industry. 

I see this in the positive light where finally people working with self initiative are recognised and rich students no longer can purchase an automatic ticket to local jobs and citizenship.

Life is a the greatest leveller.


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## zaback21 (Jan 18, 2017)

satban said:


> This is the right thing to happen. The same happened with US L1B Visas about 4-5 years ago. The underlying cause being Z-class Indian IT companies bringing in absolute low wage employees to fill local roles.
> 
> Result being poor client impression and overall negative impression of the IT services industry.
> 
> ...


This will also help 189/190 PR Visa as PR Visa gets a lot of backlash as PR taking Aussie jobs which will reduce with the number of 457 now getting scrapped. I mean fast food industry jobs, chefs, cooks and hairdresser doesn't need 457.

Engineering, Auditors, Actuaries, and other high skilled tech and ICT jobs can now get more places and less backlash.


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## IndigoKKing (Jul 31, 2014)

People on 457 visas are just 0.84% of the total workforce. I don't think the impact of this is significant in that sense. As such, the number of 457 visa holders has been on the decline since its peak 4-5 years ago.

What it means though is that there is a shift in attitudes towards immigration. Public mood and right wing push is towards anti-immigration policies. And that may trickle down to PR quotas too. English proficiency is going to be a big filter. More documentation may be asked for.

Current PR holders will also have some impact. Dutton has already been talking about tougher Citizenship tests for example, including proofs of assimilation and adherence to Australian values. That may mean, not just tougher written tests, but citizen sponsors or references/ testimonies etc.

Interesting turn of events, to say the least.


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## bhat8893 (Mar 29, 2017)

newbienz said:


> bhat8893 said:
> 
> 
> > Will the existing 457s be converted into 2years TSS or 4years TSS by March 2018? What'd be the criteria?
> ...


Thanks a lot newbienz. That certainly clarifies my doubts.


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## audrayyeng (Oct 12, 2016)

Hi all,

I wish someone could advise me on the new changes. I have called the immigration dept but the consultant that answered seems confused with the changes too!

I have a pending application lodged in 6th April 2017 under Developer Programmer. The occupation is still in the MTSOL List. My question for the consultant was, whether the minimum 2 years work experience requirement has taken effect as I currently do not fulfill that, until August 2017 and what happens in March 2018.

She mentioned that the current changes are updated skill list and english requirement (??), and I will be affected due to the work experience requirement. She also mentioned that in March 2018, I will have to re-apply for the new visa if my 457 is approved.

This makes me confused as it is not aligned to the timeline posted..


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## vucaps (Apr 19, 2017)

Will current 457 visa holder be able to apply subclass 186 (ENS - Employee Nomination Scheme). What is the future of Marketing Specialist holding 457 visa? Would he be able to apply 186 after 2 years ?


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## zaback21 (Jan 18, 2017)

IndigoKKing said:


> People on 457 visas are just 0.84% of the total workforce. I don't think the impact of this is significant in that sense. As such, the number of 457 visa holders has been on the decline since its peak 4-5 years ago.
> 
> What it means though is that there is a shift in attitudes towards immigration. Public mood and right wing push is towards anti-immigration policies. And that may trickle down to PR quotas too. English proficiency is going to be a big filter. More documentation may be asked for.
> 
> ...


0.84% of a total country's workforce is a huge number when considering local Aus and pr can't get jobs. If you are using them to fill up some extremely rare high tech jobs, then it fine. But if it is being used to exploit workers and driving the average salary down for the benefit of company then not.

Scrapping of 457 has helped PR in a long way. If 457 went out of hand, it would have taken PR visa with it too. There's no reason for temporary workers when skilled Aus citizens and PR's can't get a job or overlooked for cheaper 457 guys.

Beauty Salon manager, cooks, hairdresser doesn't needs to be imported. You can train the local workforce and give them that job. Heck I worked in McDonalds for 3 months and already learned how to manage the store (was already promoted to crew trainer while doing part time) If you want space engineers, some high skilled doctors, scientists, etc, then use 457 which can't be locally filled.

I hardly doubt a beauty salon manager's job is harder than managing a fast paced McDonalds store which I managed or anyone can manage with minimalistic on the job training.


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## Maggie-May24 (May 19, 2015)

bhat8893 said:


> Will the existing 457s be converted into 2years TSS or 4years TSS by March 2018? What'd be the criteria?
> 
> If they are treated as or converted into 4years TSS, do they have to acquire 3 years of Australian experience or 3 years of overall work experience to apply for 189 PR?


If you currently hold a 457 visa, then you will continue to hold a 457 visa. They will not "convert" 457 visas into a new visa. However, if you want to apply for a 186/187 visa in future, you would need to meet the criteria for those visas at that time. Some of the criteria for a 186/187 is also changing.


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## josem (Sep 7, 2016)

This is taken from here:

border.gov.au/WorkinginAustralia/Documents/reforms-australia-permanent-employer-sponsored-migration-programme.pdf

Changes from March 2018
*From March 2018, for ENS and RSMS:
- For the ENS and RSMS visa: The MLTSSL will now apply, with additional occupations available to
support regional employers for the RSMS.*
- Minimum market salary rate: Employers must pay the Australian market salary rate and meet the
Temporary Skilled Migration Income Threshold. 1
- Residency: The permanent residence eligibility period will be extended from two to three years.
- Work experience: At least three years’ relevant work experience.
- Age: All applicants must be under the maximum age requirement of 45 at the time of application.
- Training requirement: a strengthened training requirement for employers to contribute towards training
Australian workers.

It says that for the 186 and 187, the new MLTSSL applies, so I guess that for people who got the 457 just now, they wont be able to apply for the PR like in the past after March 2018, those applying for PR before that date, are still under the old rules.


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## Sapien (Oct 30, 2016)

I was just wondering if someone is already on 457 visa currently and that person wants to switch to PR so how easy would it be for him or her?


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## sultan_azam (Sep 9, 2015)

Sapien said:


> I was just wondering if someone is already on 457 visa currently and that person wants to switch to PR so how easy would it be for him or her?


i think it wont be easy now, considering the changes in skilled occupation list


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## Sapien (Oct 30, 2016)

sultan_azam said:


> i think it wont be easy now, considering the changes in skilled occupation list


How? Would you like to elaborate?


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## sultan_azam (Sep 9, 2015)

Sapien said:


> How? Would you like to elaborate?


i knew this will be the next question, well let us wait and watch for a month, things will get clear

suppose a guy was working on xyz occupation on 457 which is valid till Jan 2018, now if xyz is removed from "combined list of eligible skilled occupations"(CLESo)then his employer can not go ahead for 186 visa, secondly that person cant even go for 189/190 if xyz occupation is not there in the CLESo or MTSSL


just my opinion, lets see what happens actually


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## Maggie-May24 (May 19, 2015)

Sapien said:


> I was just wondering if someone is already on 457 visa currently and that person wants to switch to PR so how easy would it be for him or her?


It would depend on their occupation and how long they've been on the 457 visa. If they'll have worked on their 457 for 2 years before April 2018, then they can still apply under the TRT stream, otherwise they could look at the DE stream or wait until they've worked 3 years. Depending on their occupation, the DE stream may be their best option.


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## Coolgirl78 (Jan 4, 2016)

newbienz said:


> List of 180 jobs to be axed from tonight for 457 visa which were eligible earlier
> 
> https://mobile.twitter.com/rharris3...s.com.au/news/visa-changes-announced/3167923/
> 
> ...


Is this the list for 2017-18 ?


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## Sapien (Oct 30, 2016)

Maggie-May24 said:


> It would depend on their occupation and how long they've been on the 457 visa. If they'll have worked on their 457 for 2 years before April 2018, then they can still apply under the TRT stream, otherwise they could look at the DE stream or wait until they've worked 3 years. Depending on their occupation, the DE stream may be their best option.


What is TRT system and DE stream? :/

How DE stream may be the best option?


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

Coolgirl78 said:


> Is this the list for 2017-18 ?


No 

This is just a temporary ad-hoc list issued on 18th April 2017

A new list will be issued before 1st July which will be the list for 2017-18


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

Sapien said:


> What is TRT system and DE stream? :/
> 
> How DE stream may be the best option?


If you have completed 2years on 457 visa, then you can apply immediately for 457 visa. (TRT System)

If not, then you have to wait till you complete 3 years now, instead of 2 years


However, if you employer is willing to sponsor you, then you can apply directly for PR through Direct stream immediately (DE stream)

DE Stream is best because you can apply immediately and you are not affected by rules which are fast changing

Cheers


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## ygj07 (Apr 23, 2017)

Hello,

Hope you can clarify this for me. I have been on visa 457 with my employer since August 2013. I have worked with them full time for more than 6 years now, since January 2011 while I was on my visa 485, then transitioned to 457. I have done some reading and it looks like ENS subclass 186 - Temporary Residence Transition is my next best step to applying PR. My employer agreed to nominate me for this visa. We actually touched base with a migration agent mid April 2017 to start the application. 

However, the immigration law for 457 literally changed overnight on April 18 2017. I am concerned my chances to apply 186 TRT is affected. Firstly, I only have 4 months left on my 457 (expires August 2017). Secondly, my nominated occupation ANZCSO 133311 that I used for my 457 is no longer in any of the new lists. From my understanding, only Direct Stream requires occupation list and TRT is not required because I have worked for my employer for more than 6 years. Can you confirm this is correct? Will the new change affect the TRT part of ENS? I looked at the Immigration website, it only mentioned Direct Entry but no mention of TRT anywhere, which concerns me.

Currently my migration agent just mentioned that my occupation is not longer on the list and they are current researching whether I can still apply PR any other way. I was wondering if you could provide an answer for all my questions above.

Obviously, with the sudden tightening of the migration law, for someone like me who has been in Australia since 2006, from studying uni to working full time making it more than 10 years living here, it is a blow to the face that after so long, there is a possibility I might not be able to stay here any longer. I hope immigration will be fair to me as i have been doing everything here legitimately, contributing a fair amount as a former foreign student and now a taxpayer.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

ygj07 said:


> Hello,
> 
> Hope you can clarify this for me. I have been on visa 457 with my employer since August 2013. I have worked with them full time for more than 6 years now, since January 2011 while I was on my visa 485, then transitioned to 457. I have done some reading and it looks like ENS subclass 186 - Temporary Residence Transition is my next best step to applying PR. My employer agreed to nominate me for this visa. We actually touched base with a migration agent mid April 2017 to start the application.
> 
> ...


As far as I know, no more work or permanent visas can be issued or renewed for the 200 axed jobs irrespective of the years you have worked studied or stayed in Australia 
ANZSCO code 133311 is unfortunately one of them

You can try and see if your education and job experience allows you to qualify under another ANZSCO code which is still available 
There are many ANZSCO codes which have overlapping educational and work experience requirements. While 1 code may be deleted from the list, the other may still be available 
If you have no option of qualifying under another available ANZSCO code, then this pretty much looks like the end of the road for you as far as working in Australia is concerned 
In the past 10 years you had several opportunities to convert your visa to PR, but you have missed them.

You still have 4 months in hand and the government is going to review the list and maybe they will restore the visa grant for this code in future 
Laws are never fair and you have to live with them

Cheers


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## kaju (Oct 31, 2011)

ygj07 said:


> Hello,
> 
> Hope you can clarify this for me. I have been on visa 457 with my employer since August 2013. I have worked with them full time for more than 6 years now, since January 2011 while I was on my visa 485, then transitioned to 457. I have done some reading and it looks like ENS subclass 186 - Temporary Residence Transition is my next best step to applying PR. My employer agreed to nominate me for this visa. We actually touched base with a migration agent mid April 2017 to start the application.
> 
> ...


The TRT stream doesn't seem to require your occupation to be in the list of skilled eligible positions - that does indeed only seem to be a requirement for the Direct Entry Scheme. 

I assume the TRT stream is based on the fact that you are already employed here, so your position was in demand, and since your employer supports your further application, no further employment needs evidence is required. See here: Employer Nomination Scheme (subclass 186) under the "Visa Applicants" tab, then expand the dropdown "Who could get this visa", and look at the difference between the TRT and DE stream requirements.

The TRT stream states "Your skills do not need to be assessed because you have already worked for your nominating employer for two years in Australia"

The DE stream states "You must ... have a positive valid skills assessment in your nominated occupation (the skill assessment must be conducted by the relevant assessing authority listed in the list of eligible skilled occupations."


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

:clock:


kaju said:


> The TRT stream doesn't seem to require your occupation to be in the list of skilled eleigible positions - that does indeed only seem to be a requirement for the Direct Entry Scheme.
> 
> I assume the TRT stream is based on the fact that you are already employed here, so your position was in demand, and since your employer supports your further application, no further employment needs evidence is required. See here: Employer Nomination Scheme (subclass 186) under the "Visa Applicants" tab, then look at the difference between the TRT and DE stream requirements.


Are you sure ?

I think no visas can be issued for the 200 ANZSCO code which have been axed.
That was the main message in the ministers speech that these 200 jobs can be done by Australians so we don't need any foreigners 

133311 is one of them

They are refunding the application fees for both the applicant and the employer of even those whose applications had been accepted by the department so how would they still grant PR In that category 

Moreover, although skills assessment is not required, the nomination has to be approved by them.
I don't think they will approve any fresh nominations for jobs in the axed list

Cheers


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## kaju (Oct 31, 2011)

newbienz said:


> :clock:
> 
> Are you sure ?
> 
> ...


Remember we're talking about a 186 visa, not a new 457. 

For the new 457, yes, the occupations have been removed. 

For the DE stream of the 186 visa, the occupations have also been removed. 

But for those transitioning under the TRT, they have already worked for 2 years in Australia, and the employer is vouching for the need for them. 

For those applying under the TRT stream, there is no mention that occupations for this stream must be on the new list, and in fact, there is effectively even an explanation why that is so - employment skills and occupations are not a criterion for the TRT stream as the applicant has already worked for the nominating employer in Australia for 2 years. Which is why there is no mention of the list of eligible occupations under the TRT requirements, and there is for the DE stream. 

Have a look at my last post again, and at the differences on the page I linked to. 

ygj07 should be able to get his Migration Agent to confirm this anyway.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

kaju said:


> Remember we're talking about a 186 visa, not a new 457.
> 
> For the new 457, yes, the occupations have been removed.
> 
> ...


I have seen it

The one caveat which remains unfulfilled is the approval of the nominations 

The department still has to approve the nomination even if the applicant has worked and the employer is willing to nominate him.

"worked for two years in the same position your employer nominated you for while you held your subclass 457 visa as the primary visa holder, your employer has nominated you for a permanent position under this stream, and the nomination has been approved."

I don't think the department would defeat the spirit of the ministers speech and approve a nomination in the category that has been removed for issue of future visas

Anyways unless DIBP come up with an FAQ, there are several Grey areas which everyone will interpret differently 

I have very little knowledge of specific immigration laws and all my opinions are based on my own reasoning and interpretation of the circular issued by DIBP

Cheers


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## kaju (Oct 31, 2011)

newbienz said:


> I have seen it
> The one caveat which remains unfulfilled is the approval of the nominations
> The department still has to approve the nomination even if the applicant has worked and the employer is willing to nominate him.
> 
> ...


It's not a matter of interpreting it differently. If the requirement is not there for the TRT stream (assuming the website has been correctly updated) then it's not required. The statements made in the TRT section clearly support this. 

It's also not a matter of the Department trying to defeat the spirit of the changes - those were directed at new 457 visa applicants, not those in the country already who have proven their skills, and where the need for them (as evidenced by the employer's new nomination) is proven, and can meet the TRT stream requirements. That actually completely fits in with the spirit of the changes.

I probably have a bit more experience reading DIBP information than many, and I would be very surprised if I was wrong. But it never hurts to check, of course.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

As the OP was already in touch with a MARA Agent prior to 18th April, has he asked them what are the prospects of his getting a PR in view of these developments?

Cheers


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## ygj07 (Apr 23, 2017)

newbienz said:


> As the OP was already in touch with a MARA Agent prior to 18th April, has he asked them what are the prospects of his getting a PR in view of these developments?
> 
> Cheers


As the changes are very recent, migration agents I corresponded with including the one my company and I nominated to use said the situation is currently chaotic and that they are still wrapping their heads around it and cannot confirm anything yet. Hopefully in the next week or so we get further clarity in regards to my situation. 

I did get some conflicting information about TRT - my nominated agent says my occupation is removed from the list which we all already know. I wrote back to clarify that I am applying for TRT not Direct Entry, mentioning the lack of skill assessment requirement for TRT but she has not come back to me on that yet. The others said that I should not be affected but obviously they stopped short of confirmation until further assessment.

I have read the immigration website and it does look like it explicitly mentioned that the new rules apply to ENS 186 however Direct Entry is only mentioned. There is no mention of TRT being affected. This is of course if the website is updated correctly. I hope that is the case.


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## loneranger (Dec 17, 2015)

For accountants,
Are there any changes in 189 and 190 visa streams under the newly announced changes ?
And what be the impact of current changes for immi applicnts overall ?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


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## zaback21 (Jan 18, 2017)

loneranger said:


> For accountants,
> Are there any changes in 189 and 190 visa streams under the newly announced changes ?
> And what be the impact of current changes for immi applicnts overall ?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


No and nothing.


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## shunamite (Jan 28, 2017)

Dear All,

I am new here appreciate if you'll could please advise. 

My husband found a job and the employer was getting ready to sponsor him 457 visa.
When the announced was made that it will be abolished.

He has already turned 40 and cannot get enough points ( also -ve assessment from vetassess) , 
so 457 was the only other option.

What is the new visa type the Employer can sponsor him?
The Employer has contacted the immi lawyer, 
but unfortunately the lawyer cannot help, as he is waiting to get info from immi dept.


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## thewrightsinoz (May 24, 2017)

No permanent residency afterwards... the temporary residency position cannot go on perpetually, so they will what, deport people who reach the natural end to their 457 visa lifecycle?

Not been very well thought out this has it? The skills gap that is currently filled by international skilled visitors can't be closed in two years.


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## kaju (Oct 31, 2011)

thewrightsinoz said:


> No permanent residency afterwards... the temporary residency position cannot go on perpetually, so they will what, deport people who reach the natural end to their 457 visa lifecycle?
> 
> Not been very well thought out this has it? The skills gap that is currently filled by international skilled visitors can't be closed in two years.


Temporary working visas are for the temporary needs of employers. 

The 457 Visa will be replaced by the Temporary Skill Shortage Visa in March 2018 - this will have 2 and 4 year visa streams, and be similar to 457 visas, although having more requirements and slightly fewer occupations.

As with 457 visas, if the employer wishes to renew these visas, they can. 

When a visa holder comes to the end of their temporary visa, they can either seek to renew that visa through their employer, find a new employer to sponsor them, or leave Australia. 

If a visa holder does not leave Australia after their visa ceases, (and remember, the visa considerations are very clear, and visa holders are again informed of their status just before their visa expires) then they would become unlawful non-citizens, and be subject to removal from Australia.

The purpose of these visas (which is made very clear to both sponsoring employees and applicants) is to meet temporary needs within the Australian labour market, not to provide permanent work or a pathway to permanent migration to Australia. 

If someone wants to migrate to Australia permanently, they should consider applying for a Skilled Migration visa, or some other permanent visa. 

https://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Visa-1


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

continuing where Kaju left off :
The 2 years validity 457 Visas issued after 18th April 2017 can only be renewed once
so the Maximum stay can be 4 years only and no PR Rights
The applicant then has to leave the country.

Once he has left the country, I think the employer can again sponsor him for a fresh 457 Visa.
The main criteria for the responsorship is that the applicant has to be off shore when the application is submitted by the employer

(I think I read this somewhere. Please do recheck)

Cheers


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## Raj_68 (Jun 7, 2017)

shunamite said:


> Dear All,
> 
> I am new here appreciate if you'll could please advise.
> 
> ...


Hi,
If your husband's occupation is in the new MLTSSL/STSOL, his employer can still apply for 457 visa until April 2018. Occupations under MLTSS are currently eligible for a 4-year 457 visa, but under STSOL are only for a 2-year 457 visa.


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## Raj_68 (Jun 7, 2017)

jayptl said:


> what about current applicant who are on 457?? now?? does he apply 187 ENS


Hi, 
The 457 to 187 transition applicants will not be affected.


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## Raj_68 (Jun 7, 2017)

mykmallett said:


> Does this mean that if you're currently on a 457, you can no longer transition onto a 186 and get PR?


Hi , only direct entry stream of the 186 is affected. That means if your already on 457 and opting for a 186 under the transition stream, you will have no problem.


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## Raj_68 (Jun 7, 2017)

Sapien said:


> What is TRT system and DE stream? :/
> 
> How DE stream may be the best option?


Hi,
Hi TRT is the Transition stream for the 457 visa holders who have completed 2 years (will be 3 years after 2018) of work under their sponsoring employer.

DE is the Direct entry stream, for the prospective employers to recruit employees directly from overseas.

Both 186 & 187 visas have TRT & DE streams.

If you are already on 457 visa. TRT is the best option, provided your employer is willing to sponsor you for the 186/187 visa.

TRT stream does not require skills assessment, and has a relaxed English language requirement. However, DE stream has similar requirements as of 189/190 for the skills assessment & English language.


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## shunamite (Jan 28, 2017)

Raj_68 said:


> Hi,
> If your husband's occupation is in the new MLTSSL/STSOL, his employer can still apply for 457 visa until April 2018. Occupations under MLTSS are currently eligible for a 4-year 457 visa, but under STSOL are only for a 2-year 457 visa.


Thankyou for your kind reply.
Employer has come back asking for VETASSESS Positive assessement , which my husband failed ( both assessement and reassessment) due to the mistake of the agent, who chose the wrong occupation.

I heard the 3rd stream called the agreement stream under 186 ENS does not require VETASSESS assessment , but needs an agreement to be made.

Anyone can share any info on the same? Really appreciate.


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## LMM 6363 (Aug 22, 2016)

*ENS 186 - TRT Visa*

Hi Guys, 

I need some advice on ENS 186 Visa.

I am working for XYZ Company and was on 457 Visa (Role: Organisation and Methods Analyst) in Australia from May 2013. 
Recently (on 07.03.2017) my 457 was expired and an extension was filed on 02.03.2017 with a change in role - “Call contact center manager”. The role was removed due to recent 457 Visa changes and I had to withdraw my extension application and left Australia on 02.06.2017. 

Question: Will I \ my employer be eligible to apply for ENS 186 under Transition Scheme for the old role (Organisation and Methods Analyst). Will this still take 6-8 Months time? i have a PTE score of 68+ in each section. 

Reason for Role change: Wanted to try out on new opportunities, which was a BIG mistake of my life.

Appreciate your valuable response ☺


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

LMM 6363 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I need some advice on ENS 186 Visa.
> 
> ...


You have 2 options under 186
Transition and Direct Entry

Transition requires that you hold a current 457 visa when applying you do not hold a current 457 Visa, so you are not eligible

Direct Entry requires that you should have never or only briefly worked in Australia.
You have worked for nearly 4 years so I am not sure if that would qualify as brief

I dont think 186 is the route to go and you should explore other options

Cheers


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## ajay_ghale (Feb 22, 2018)

*457 VISA abolished...Impact on 189/190?*

Hi Guys,

I am not aware about details of 457 VISA (i think it is similar to L1 in US...i could be wrong) but now that Australia have abolished it today, What impact you guys see on 189/190 because of this? and is this a pre-cursor to any coming migration rules changes in coming months?

News source - 457 Abolished

Regards.


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## ajay_ghale (Feb 22, 2018)

There is a another thread going on with the same discussion, please follow that - breaking-457-visas-abolished


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## evangelist (Oct 5, 2014)

You may be aware that 457 has been replaced with Temporary Skill Shortage (TSS) visas of 2 and 4 year duration. These visa categories may be somewhat restricted to specific occupations compared to 457, and will not translate into a PR. It only means that DIBP wants potential immigrants to come through the appropriate PR visa channel rather than through 457 which serves as a back channel.

I do not see any changes in the immigration rules due to this, as 457 was never meant to be a route to immigration. 

In the short term , the job market for 189/190 visa holders will be better. In the mid term, there will be more 189/190 applicants.


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## Maggie-May24 (May 19, 2015)

ajay_ghale said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I am not aware about details of 457 VISA (i think it is similar to L1 in US...i could be wrong) but now that Australia have abolished it today, What impact you guys see on 189/190 because of this? and is this a pre-cursor to any coming migration rules changes in coming months?
> 
> ...


The 457 (replaced by 482) is a temporary employer-sponsored visa. The 189 and 190 are permanent skilled visas. The two are completely unrelated.


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## Dharm1984 (Jul 3, 2018)

*482 TSS and its implication on PR under 189/190 scheme*

Dear All,

Request assistance with understanding difference between 482 TSS application and PR application under 189/190.

Currently I have filed EoI on 27 Feb with 65 points under 189 and 70 points under 190 for VIC and NSW.

But seems like the waiting period is longer nowadays.

Meanwhile my current employer is planning to apply work visa under 482 TSS.

I have "heard" that people applying 482 work permit are not eligibile for PR and other rumour is those who are on 482 TSS 4 years long term can apply for PR but those who are 2 years of 482 short or medium term ar not eligible.

Can any one please share more light on any such implication, looking forward to assistance from experts.

Thanks.


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## NB (Mar 29, 2017)

Dharm1984 said:


> Dear All,
> 
> Request assistance with understanding difference between 482 TSS application and PR application under 189/190.
> 
> ...


If you get a TSS which is under Anzsco code which is of MLTSSL, you will have a PR pathway 
If you get a TSS which is under Anzsco code of STSOL, you will not be eligible for PR

So the key is the Anzsco code and it’s under which list 

Cheers


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## bankimshikari (Apr 21, 2018)

Does 489 need job offer to apply?


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## Maggie-May24 (May 19, 2015)

bankimshikari said:


> Does 489 need job offer to apply?


I assume you mean a 482 visa (topic of this thread) and yes you do need a job offer.


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## sajboy (Mar 1, 2017)

Hi friends, is skill assesment is mandatory for mechanical engineers to apply for 482 ? i heard that some of the occupations doesnt need skill assesment for 482.


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