# Beware if you own property and decide you want to go back to the UK!



## kreisler1730 (Aug 20, 2012)

Hi everyone,

Earlier this year my Chinese wife and I decided that it might be a good idea for me to return to the UK prior to her retirement to set-up home.

Sounds good doesn't it?

I eventually arrived at my sisters home mid-July where I was to remain until my return to China on the 26th/27th September completely exhausted and humiliated.

Naturally I had to find work in the UK so my first job was to sign-on as a job seeker.
This I did and then started busily looking for work which ultimately didn't seem to exist, well at least not for older applicants.
Finally after almost three months I was told by the Department of Employment that I had failed the *'Habitual Residency Test'!*
This was because, and I quote: 'You have property overseas, and we think you have come back to the UK to claim benefit and then take this money back overseas'!!!

To say that I saw 'Red' is an understatement, but I tried to keep my cool.

So to any fellow Brits. that own property in China I suggest you just stay put, because the UK is not the country it used to be.

Now it just caters for down and outs, people of non-UK ethnicity, slackers, drug addicts and the like!

The only slightly worrying thing is that now I have started to worry about being able to remain in China with my wife. In the past there used to be a lot more flexibility with non-working visas, but China's bid to clean up it's act has made this (I believe) much less flexible.
Many people are saying that the introduction of the Q visa for family reunion will make this more clear.
I am not so sure and feel that what they actually mean is that it will further control the amount of foreigners living in China.
As someone that has already been here for ten years, and worked for eight of those ten I just want to live here quietly as a retired person.
I have owned my property since 2005, have savings and am part of a large Chinese family.
I do not cause trouble, or effect the economy of the country in any way, other than the money I spend here and pay to the PSB every year for my visa, therefore only positive things, so why doesn't the Chinese government make it much easier for people like me to live here permanently in peace and quiet, no hassles?


Hope you enjoy my little story and moan!


Regards

Paul


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## bkmulder (Sep 25, 2013)

Paul, 

I read your story but don't understand your point of it. 

1. You failed the 'habitual residency test' that is possible, but that don't mean you can not live in UK with your Chinese wife, it is only a test to get certain benefits. I guess you older than me, even maybe close to retirement age but I think personally this rule you knew before you went to China. Same in every other country, I am living more than 10 years outside of the Netherlands and when I go back, I get 10 years * 2% less social security the moment I will retire and if I show certain saving amount than probably I don't get anything. I think it is even fair rule, but I don't complain because I get a higher paycheck now and save that surplus for later to fill that gap. Or buy a house in UK with your savings and for sure you can live peaceful too.

2. You think it is easy for a Chinese 66 years old to live peaceful in UK, my guess it is even a bigger hassle than you apply for family visa. 

What I don't understand and sorry Paul this is a general comment, why lot of expatriates are complaining about China Visa policy while in your or others home country it is even a bigger hassle.

Just a general advice, lot of expatriates planning before they go to foreign country but no often they planning in the years while they expats, for their return. 

As last, hope for you it will sort out in your view and happiness. Happy weekend!


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## kreisler1730 (Aug 20, 2012)

*Yes I can live in the UK but...*

Hi,

Of course I know that I can live in the UK, but on what.....fresh air whilst I look for employment?
Failing the 'habitual Residency test' means, 'no jobseeker allowance'!
So how on Gods green earth am I surposed to survive whilst seeking a job?

My serious grumble was that when I was back there for almost three months I would often meet other job seekers whilst signing on who where I guess from eastern Europe. Funny how they qualify and I don't, born and bred Englishman.
Now I am sorry but there has to be something seriously wrong with the rules when this occurs!

Anyway changing the subject to Chinese visas I was querious about your comment.
I have not worked here for a few years so my wife has been getting me a family visa. Under the pre 1st July 2013 update this was called an 'L' visa.
Now we have the Q1 & Q2 but I know little about how they function and how somebody like myself qualifies for one or other.
What are your experiences of these visa, or are you a working gentleman with a Z visa and work permit?

Let me know your thoughts please.

Regards

Paul


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## bkmulder (Sep 25, 2013)

You wrote you have savings, might you can use it for the time being? 
I mean I see that often too here now in China, jobseekers out of southern part of Europe because employment is incredible high and come on tourist visa and hope to find a job in three months, I think the once in UK out of eastern europe also do it that way, so they 'invest' in themselves to find a job. 
So I would say, you really wanna go back to UK, use your savings and find it out for few months. 

Just curious what you expected? You really thought governments happy to give money to people for free? Eastern europeans for sure they don't get any allowance too.

Yes I am self employed, Z visa and work permit, residence almost 8 years. 
Yes I know few things about those family visas, because many of my clients also married with Chinese. 

Q1 is generally issued with a single entry and 30 days, and the holders must apply for Temporary Residence Permit within 30 days after entry. The residence permit can be granted for a minimum of 90 days and a maximum of 5 years. So, holders can exit and reenter freely during the validity of the residence permit. Q2 is flexible from 30 to 180 days, allows single, double, or multiple entries, and the holders can stay in China within the duration period as indicated on visa.

In my view is you wanna apply for Q1 visa and than hoping you get one for many years. I am not a visa agency so don't know what the qualifications are in detail but this is what I know. 

In my view very generous because those Q2 also possible for your parents if they wanna visit you. That is very rare for in other countries.


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## kreisler1730 (Aug 20, 2012)

*What do you think I lived on?*

Hi,

You mentioned that I could have used my saving! What do you think I lived on for nearly three months,......savings, but I was not able to find a job in this time frame!
Finding jobs in the UK is real difficult these days and three months just is not long enough. But with my saving running out fast I had to cut and run back to my home in China. Had I stayed much longer I would not have had enough for my ticket back to my wife and home in Guangdong.

By the way what the hell were you talking about when you said 'getting money for free?
The UK is one of the most highly taxed in the world and I was part of that tax paying society for almost 50 years, so please do not say I did not pay into the system.
Believe me when I tell you that lots of non-UK born people are screwing the government benefit system to the detriment of everyone else.
This is why I have decided not to bother trying to return in the future. I will just be content with my life in Guangdong for the foreseeable future.

Regards

Paul


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