# Southern Cyprus, My Partner is Turkish...Problem?



## CliveO (Oct 28, 2011)

I am considering moving to Southern Cyprus with my partner and our little boy. My main concern is that because she is Turkish it may present problems. She didn't invade Cyprus her government did plus it was before she was born so I was wondering if there are Turkish people living in the south and how they are treated by Greek Cypriots. It would be nice to hear from someone who is Turkish and get their perspective.


----------



## zin (Oct 28, 2010)

Is she fully Turkish with a Turkish passport? If so I'm not entirely sure if she would be able to get a visa. Having lived most of my life in Cyprus I have to say I've only heard of a couple of occasions where a Turkish person lived openly in the country and to be honest I hadn't heard of them leading a great trouble-free life there. The hatred some people have towards Turks is quite strong. 

To be honest why would you want to risk it? Especially with a little boy? Aside from the people who would look to cause her trouble she would have a nightmare getting a job and there would be a stigma around your son when he goes to school. 

If you really are keen then she can't be open about being Turkish, if that's ok with her then by all means give it a go.


----------



## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

Your best bet would be to move to Northern Cyprus not the South where your partner would have a hard time.


----------



## CliveO (Oct 28, 2011)

She was born in Istanbul but is also a UK Citizen. I stupidly thought that because the troubles in Cyprus were 1976 that if would all just be history and people would have put it all behind them by now. It's hard to believe there would still be such bad feeling after 35 years!

As for my little boy are you serious about him having trouble at school? What kind of people would take it out on a child?

My partner wouldn't be working, she would stay home and look after our son but I take your point, she may want to work in the future.

How about if we came on holiday to Cyprus, would she still get mistreated by the Cypriots as a holidaymaker?

It just seems incomprehensible that there is such bad feeling after so long, it's like me hating Germans because we were at war with them in the 1940s...just mad!

Thanks very very much for all the info, it's very interesting and you may very well have averted a complete disaster. 

Clive




zin said:


> Is she fully Turkish with a Turkish passport? If so I'm not entirely sure if she would be able to get a visa. Having lived most of my life in Cyprus I have to say I've only heard of a couple of occasions where a Turkish person lived openly in the country and to be honest I hadn't heard of them leading a great trouble-free life there. The hatred some people have towards Turks is quite strong.
> 
> To be honest why would you want to risk it? Especially with a little boy? Aside from the people who would look to cause her trouble she would have a nightmare getting a job and there would be a stigma around your son when he goes to school.
> 
> If you really are keen then she can't be open about being Turkish, if that's ok with her then by all means give it a go.


----------



## rifleman (Jun 24, 2011)

CliveO said:


> She was born in Istanbul but is also a UK Citizen. I stupidly thought that because the troubles in Cyprus were 1976 that if would all just be history and people would have put it all behind them by now. It's hard to believe there would still be such bad feeling after 35 years


The conflict between Greeks and Turks goes back much longer than that. Greece was ruled by the Turks as part of the ottoman empire. And if your wife was s Greek considering living in a Turkish dominated area you would get similar advice.


----------



## Palm Tree (Apr 5, 2011)

Hi Clive

I can't post a private message yet because you are a new member but I just wanted to let you know that I am flying from Dubai to Cyprus this week to check out a possible move and will be happy to keep in touch with you.

Hope to be able to link up with you soon.

Best wishes


----------



## CliveO (Oct 28, 2011)

Interesting that you are moving from Dubai, that was another one of our options. Why are you looking to leave the Emirate? Any info on Dubai would also be useful.

Thanx
Clive


----------



## zin (Oct 28, 2010)

Clive, with the greatest respect. The war, which was in 1974, affected hundreds of thousands of people who were uprooted and lost all their possessions, property and some lost their loved ones. These people are not dead, they are still very much alive, those who were old enough to remember are still only in their 40s and it still very much hurts them. Many fought in the war, have the scars and lost friends.

Cyprus is still occupied after 37 years, so comparing this with WWII is silly. That said I am fairly sure there are many Jewish and non-Jewish families who will never forgive the Germans for what they did, why should they?

Your attitude of Cypriots should let bygones be bygones just so you can come live there trouble-free is probably a good reason for you not to live there.


----------



## positive pam (Aug 24, 2011)

zin said:


> Clive, with the greatest respect. The war, which was in 1974, affected hundreds of thousands of people who were uprooted and lost all their possessions, property and some lost their loved ones. These people are not dead, they are still very much alive, those who were old enough to remember are still only in their 40s and it still very much hurts them. Many fought in the war, have the scars and lost friends.
> 
> Cyprus is still occupied after 37 years, so comparing this with WWII is silly. That said I am fairly sure there are many Jewish and non-Jewish families who will never forgive the Germans for what they did, why should they?
> 
> Your attitude of Cypriots should let bygones be bygones just so you can come live there trouble-free is probably a good reason for you not to live there.


Hi, I have to say, that I totaly agree with Zin this all happened in the not too distant past and was an awful time for Greek Cypriots and is still ongoing as there are many Greek Cypriots that have still not had their land returned to them. I wonder if perhaps your partners parents might not have knowledge of the recent past? And as someone else mentioned perhaps the north of Cyprus would be a more viable proposition?
I wish you well with whatever decision you make.
Pam.


----------



## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

This is the problem. Turkey still illegally occupies one third of the island and thinks nothing of stealing Greek Cypriot land and issuing fraudulent title deeds to dupe foreigners into buying properties which have been built on it.
The troubles with Turkey are not over and until there is a settlement the Cypriots wil not willingly welcome Turkish citizens to the South of the island.
Turkish Cypriots are thought of in a totally different light and some have returned to claim their lands and homes in the South. They were also losers in the splitting of the island, having to flee from their homes in the South to to the North where they have now become a minority agaisnt the large number of illegal Turkish settlers.
I am sorry to say Clive that if your partner is Turkish you should forget about moving to the South and go to the Turkish occupied area instead.

Veronica


----------



## Cleo Shahateet (Feb 23, 2009)

I agree with what everyone is saying of course, but if she is a UK citizen and was only born in Istanbul then moved to the UK I don't see a huge problem. If you really want to move to Southern Cyprus I just wouldn't tell anyone she is Turkish. I wouldn't recommend it though as she would have to deal with negative comments she would inevitably hear and that would not be a positive environment for her or your son.


----------



## zin (Oct 28, 2010)

Just to touch on what Veronica said, Turkish-Cypriots and Greek-Cypriots get along, check out this ethnographic prior to the war, we all lived next to each other and in mixed communities quite happily.

File:Ethnographic-1.jpg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

I lived in Limassol for 3 years just before the 1974 split and had both Greek and Turkish Cypriot neighbours. They seemed to get on very well with each other. 
We never saw any sign of animosity between them and were invited to social occassions where there were both ethnicities mixing very well. 
Even to this day I still hear the expression 'there are no Greek Cypriots or Turkish Cypriots, just Cypriots'. Some Greek Cypriots that we know still have Turkish Cypriot friends that they keep in touch with even after all this time.
To my mind the best thing that could happen to Cyprus would be if Turkey pulled out and all illegal Turkish immigrants went back to Turkey leaving the true Cypriots of both Ethnicities to get back to how they were before the invasion.


----------



## zin (Oct 28, 2010)

Unrealistic unfortunately.

Even if Cyprus was re-united, human rights would naturally block Cyprus from kicking out the Turkish settlers. Unfortunately our best chance of solving the Cyprus problem in some form went with the Annan plan being voted against in 2004.


----------



## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

zin said:


> Unrealistic unfortunately.
> 
> Even if Cyprus was re-united, human rights would naturally block Cyprus from kicking out the Turkish settlers. Unfortunately our best chance of solving the Cyprus problem in some form went with the Annan plan being voted against in 2004.


I agree but its a shame that it would not be workable. The Turks were warned by the international community not to flood the North with Turkish settlers but went ahead and did it anyway. Turkish Cypriots are now outnumbered many times by illegal Turkish settlers. Turkey is a huge country with vast tracts of uninhabited areas so why did they find it necessary to flood this little island with their people.


----------



## kimonas (Jul 19, 2008)

Getting back to the OP question, I'd have to agree with the majority of posters that advise that there are real issues of animosity in the south towards those of Turkish origin. The demographic issues of overwhelming Turkification in the so-called TRNC have added to the problem in the intervening years since the 1974 climax to the intercommunal conflict. I am still mildly surprised to hear comments that there were friendly and cooperative relations between the Greek and Turkish speaking Cypriots prior to 1974. That may have been the case with individual families in certain locations, but on a national scale, the constitution which was practically unworkable had collapsed by 1963 and there was absolutely no cooperation on a political and socio-economic level between the Greek and Turkish speaking Cypriots. The UN peace keeping force arrived in 1964 only four years into independence to keep the warring sides apart and many Turkish speaking Cypriots were enclaved and living in appalling conditions as the conflict worsened (despite the UNCYP peacekeepers) for examples in 1967 and the run up to 1974. This is a very complex issue which has unfortunately become vastly propagandised (from all directions) - unfortunately the school curriculum has done nothing (until recently) to foster reconciliation which is why the animosities are being passed onto the next generation (and Zin rightly points out that the majority of the current adult population, many of whom are in positions of influence, lived through the conflict as children and adolescents, and for them it is still a very painful and personal conflict).


----------



## CliveO (Oct 28, 2011)

No, her parents know nothing of the conflict in Cyprus and neither did she, I had to inform her that Turkey invaded in 74, she had no idea. It's governments that invade countries not individuals and in this case she wasn't even born.

She is now a British citizen with a British passport, she didn't choose to be born in Turkey, yet here she is being ostrasized because of where she was born. I find that unacceptable.



positive pam said:


> Hi, I have to say, that I totaly agree with Zin this all happened in the not too distant past and was an awful time for Greek Cypriots and is still ongoing as there are many Greek Cypriots that have still not had their land returned to them. I wonder if perhaps your partners parents might not have knowledge of the recent past? And as someone else mentioned perhaps the north of Cyprus would be a more viable proposition?
> I wish you well with whatever decision you make.
> Pam.


----------



## CrowdedHouse (Feb 22, 2011)

To be honest I don't think you'll have as much of a problem as you may think. 

Consider a couple of things:
- Who will know whether she is Turkish, Turkish Cypriot, or Turkish born, UK bred? It's not like there is a stamp on your forehead. And I'm assuming she and your child have your (non-Turkish) last name as well.

- Is she heavily nationalistic towards Turkey? Will that impede her ability to deal with Cypriots socially? (ie proclaiming that Turkey was in its rights, TRNC should be sovereign power, etc).

- Maybe not a major concern, but if her parents are Turkish nationals and (maybe) have problems entering Cyprus...then family visits will be limited. Are you OK w/ that for your child and wife?

Anyways, just some things to think about. I think people tend to be over cautious when it comes to this type of situation but Cypriots on both sides are just sick of this political tug of war.


----------



## CliveO (Oct 28, 2011)

No, like I said she didn't even know about the invasion so she definitely doesn't have strong feelings about Turkey's rights to be there. She has her own issues with the Turkish government and even her mum participates in the anti-government protests that have been in the news.

I can't exactly criticize the Turkish tho being British, how hypocritical would I be, no nation has invaded more countries than Britain, for god sake we were laying claim to the Falkland Islands, how stupid is that? As I said tho, it's governments that cause all these problems, look at Afghanistan. My government invaded Afghanistan without asking my opinion, I didn't elect t them, I didn't agree with the invasion but they still went ahead. Just because I am a British citizen, should I be held responsible for their decision?

Sorry, going off point a little. Anyway, I have been offered a job with a company in Cyprus and I asked my new boss, who incidentally is a Greek-Cypriot, about whether we would have a problem and he said that it is "blown out of proportion" and that it's "not anything like as bad as some people make out"

As for Family visits, would they not be able to fly in to Ercan and then cross the border now the border is open? Failing that she can go see them or they can spend time on the occupied side.

Turkey wants into the EU and that just isn't going to happen whilst they still occupy Cyprus. I personally think Turkey's days in Cyprus are numbered.

IMHO, war should be outlawed. Why can't we all just live together in peace?



CrowdedHouse said:


> To be honest I don't think you'll have as much of a problem as you may think.
> 
> Consider a couple of things:
> - Who will know whether she is Turkish, Turkish Cypriot, or Turkish born, UK bred? It's not like there is a stamp on your forehead. And I'm assuming she and your child have your (non-Turkish) last name as well.
> ...


----------



## positive pam (Aug 24, 2011)

Hi Cliveo- I have to say that I agree with crowdedhouse, I didn't realise your wife had a british passport and as quoted you dont have anything stamped on your head. It is also true the problems may be with relatives visiting as previously said. You may just have to try it and see and hopefully for all it will turn out well. I totally agree with what you have said about the British, who are we to talk ay? It is a real shame that the young sometimes have to pay for the indiscretions of the older generations and I am not trying to say this is a mere indiscretion but I hope you understand what I mean. I really wish you well and that it all works out for you and please keep us posted on what is happening. 

Best Wishes Pam.


----------



## Veronica (Apr 5, 2008)

CliveO said:


> .
> 
> IMHO, war should be outlawed. Why can't we all just live together in peace?


Well said:clap2::clap2:


----------



## positive pam (Aug 24, 2011)

Veronica said:


> Well said:clap2::clap2:


Absolutley Veronica well said !! :clap2:
Pam


----------



## yiannis75 (Oct 9, 2011)

Veronica said:


> I agree but its a shame that it would not be workable. The Turks were warned by the international community not to flood the North with Turkish settlers but went ahead and did it anyway. Turkish Cypriots are now outnumbered many times by illegal Turkish settlers. Turkey is a huge country with vast tracts of uninhabited areas so why did they find it necessary to flood this little island with their people.


Mainly to change the demographic of Cyprus. If they can argue Cyprus is full of native Turks to the point where they outnumber the Greeks, it makes their position stronger when talks take place. That's why many Cypriots want the mainland Turks to be sent back and for ALL Cypriots, Greek and Turkish to live in harmony like they used to.


----------

