# Lost in tax returns



## clic_usa (Feb 11, 2014)

Hello,

I've moved from France to the USA this year, and have to fill in for the first time a tax return form, as an American resident. I've tried to do some research on my own, but always somehow ended back on these forums, which is the reason why I'm posting today.

I am completely at a loss concerning bank accounts that I have in France, whether they are taxable (such as Livret or PEL) or non-taxable (Livret A, Assurance Vie, etc.). I have a bit of everything, and filing everything is turning into a nightmare; whereas filing taxable accounts makes sense, since I can also file how much I was already taxed, filing non-taxable accounts seems to be a bit more tricky (should I put the interests, assuming I know what they are, should I say that I already paid some taxes somehow?).

Also, the FBAR process is not that clear to me. I believe I should report investment accounts with more than $10,000 at one point during the year. However, what falls under this category? (mainly thinking about assurance vie here)

I'm not planning to do anything with these accounts, just leave them be for a few years until I go back to France (no assurance vie withdrawals and arising complexities).

Any help is most welcome, thanks a lot in advance!


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

If you are in the States, look around (most likely at a public library in your area) for a VITA tax service. This is a volunteer tax assistance program that will help walk you through your tax situation.

OK, the bad news is that you are expected to report interest from any and all "tax free" bank accounts (Livret A, Developpement Durable, etc.). Also, the US doesn't allow you to deduct any "social insurances" from your salary - you are supposed to report the gross amount.

You may want to take a look here: Accords fiscaux entre la France et les Etats-Unis - France in the United States/ Embassy of France in Washington The French Embassy in Washington has thoughtfully provided information for French people living in the US about US taxes and the tax treaty items.

For the FBAR process, you need to report all your foreign bank accounts if the combined total of them exceeded $10,000 at any time during last year. This is probably the most coherent information about what you have to report: Comparison of Form 8938 and FBAR Requirements
Cheers,
Bev


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## clic_usa (Feb 11, 2014)

Thanks a lot for the reply and for those links Bev!

As you said this is rather bad news, and I guess that I'm going to have quite some fun declaring all my bank accounts in France. By the way, would you know under what category would assurance vies fall? I'm not very reassured about some of the things I've read around the fact that those could be PFICs...

Also, you are talking about 'social insurances' (CSG?) regarding the salary I had earned in France. Does the same thing also apply to interests?

Thanks again!


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

No, "social insurance" includes everything - cotisations, etc. CSG is a strange beast - they call it "cotisations" here, but it's actually neither income tax nor a true cotisation. For US taxes, they want you to declare everything gross - before any deductions for anything.

On the assurance vie question, you may want to hop over to our Expat Tax section and ask the question. It can depend on the type of assurance vie you have, and honestly I have no experience of the whole PFIC thing. Expat Tax - Expat Forum For People Moving Overseas And Living Abroad
Cheers,
bev


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## clic_usa (Feb 11, 2014)

Thanks for the reply Bev, I'll go dig around in the Expat Tax forum then !


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