# Spouse visa refused, appeal logged



## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Hi everyone, my wife's British spouse visa has been refused for financial reasons even though my annual salary is £19240, all my weekly pay slips show that i earn £370(gross figure) , however she has been refused a visa. 
I have logged an appeal on the justice.gov.uk website. 
I have no idea why it's been refused, could it be a mistake from their side? 
I just wanted to know how long the whole process takes?


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

Type out exactly what the refusal letter says.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

It says, the application is been refused because your sponsor's salary is £17800 and the minimum requirement is £18600.
I have no idea how they came to that figure because my pay slips show £370 every week. 
To be honest there was one week where the finance department made a mistake and did not process my salary, however the following week they paid me double £370 x2......i explained that in the application. 
Could that be the reason for refusal ?


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

You need to type out exactly what the refusal letter says.


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## ithinkin (Jan 30, 2015)

nyclon said:


> You need to type out exactly what the refusal letter says.



I love your patience


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

ithinkin said:


> I love your patience


 One needs patience when posters think we can pull answers out of thin air without them providing any information of value.


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## Crawford (Jan 23, 2011)

This is the second time your application has been refused due to you not meeting the financial requirements.

You need to provide the forum with full details of what the refusal letter said.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

By the way, my son was born 4 months ago and now holds a British passport


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Also, my pay slips show that i earn £370 a week, however only £305 gets deposited into my bank account, is that the problem?


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## ithinkin (Jan 30, 2015)

lfc85 said:


> Also, my pay slips show that i earn £370 a week, however only £305 gets deposited into my bank account, is that the problem?




How much you earn before tax?


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

£370 each week before tax and national insurance


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

lfc85 said:


> Also, my pay slips show that i earn £370 a week, however only £305 gets deposited into my bank account, is that the problem?


 Yes indeed that is the problem. If it wasn't banked it wasnt received as far as they consider.


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

lfc85 said:


> £370 each week before tax and national insurance


 So you get what you should after tax & no or are there other deductions?


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## manel (Jul 20, 2014)

If u get paid cash in hand 370 pounds and deposited only 305into your bank account they Will count only 305pounds .


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

That's a copy of my pay slip. I really do not get what the problem is. My wages are paid into my account. £370 is what i make every week, and obviously tax and ni gets deducted before the final figure goes into my account???!!


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

What category did you apply under and what evidence did you provide?


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## Crawford (Jan 23, 2011)

The official has taken the gross weekly earnings of 370.00 multiplied by 4 and then by 12.

This equals 17,760. 

The OP has taken his weekly earnings of 370.00 and multiplied by 52 

This equals 19,240. Hence the refusal.

What documentation apart from your payslips did you provide. What about a P60?


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Well category A as i was relying on my salary. £370 is what i make every week before ni and tax x 52 weeks = £19240 ????!


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Well i provided a copy of my p60 too


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

If you applied under Category A then you provided 26 weeks of pay slips along with 6 months of bank statements showing each of those 26 pay slips being deposited?


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Surely they made a mistake???? They can't multiply & 370 by 4 weeks because not every month carries 4*weeks. It's 370 x 52 weeks?


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

370 x 4 x 12 = £17760 

So you're in a salaried job, same wages each month regardless? Except when they dont pay you by mistake! Was that in the 6 months prior to applying? 

Nyclon whats the odd calculations they use to work out income?


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

Ok, more questions. Are you salaried or unsalaried?

_shel, if he is paid weekly I think they should be adding 26 pay slips and then multiplying by 2. Will see what I can find in FM 1.7.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Every week i get & 370, however one week the finance department made a processing mistake and I did not get paid. However they paid me £370 x2 the following week. 
How on earth can they be using this calculation? 
If we multiply 370 by 4 and then by 12 then that's 48 weeks in a year and not 52?


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

How many pay slips did you provide? 

Are you salaried or non-salaried?


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Salaried. I sent them 27 pay slips


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

They use whatever is laid out within the migration regulations ie the Law. Which they provide for you to use whilst preparing your application. If you choose to ignore the way the Law says it must be calculated even though it appears you are right you will be rejected because only the Law counts. 

They can also discount the week you were not paid even though you got it later.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

So I have no chance of winning this appeal?


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

I think you can try to ask for an administrative review and lay out with a spreadsheet how you meet the requirement for Category A over 6 months.  As Crawford and _shel have calculated, they took your weekly pay slip times 4 then time 12 which doesn't seem right. It's not your fault that you are paid weekly although it's probably non-standard for a salaried position. I think they should have added 26 pay slips and divided by 6 and then multiplied by 2. However, I can't find anything which indicates how they will calculate when using weekly pay slips for a salaried position.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

I just can't believe this is happening


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## Whatshouldwedo (Sep 29, 2013)

lfc85 said:


> I just can't believe this is happening


I am in no way as knowledgable as our moderators but I agree you should ask for a review.


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## ashkevron (May 1, 2012)

nyclon said:


> I think you can try to ask for an administrative review and lay out with a spreadsheet how you meet the requirement for Category A over 6 months. As Crawford and _shel have calculated, they took your weekly pay slip times 4 then time 12 which doesn't seem right. It's not your fault that you are paid weekly although it's probably non-standard for a salaried position. I think they should have added 26 pay slips and divided by 6 and then multiplied by 2. However, I can't find anything which indicates how they will calculate when using weekly pay slips for a salaried position.


I think this is very good advice and the one you should follow. From other posters on the forum, administrative review is quick and they should be able to spot their mistake and change their decision.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Ok, thanks for your advice. I have already logged an appeal and I am awaiting their response


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## ashkevron (May 1, 2012)

What I don't know and would like to know is if you get the administrative review by logging the appeal or by logging a complaint...


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

You can do either but for a simple error, it's much easier just to make a complaint through UKVI, when it will be sent to the visa office that processed your application for their response. 

I'm not sure if there has been an error. What they do with salaried employment paid weekly is that they group together payslips from the same month, and under Cat A, it means from the last six months. Then they take the lowest pay and multiply by 12. So in your case, a month with four payslips showing £370 each will produce 370 x 4 x 12 = £17,760, which is less than £18,600 required. If you were in unsalaried job, they would have taken an average so you would exceed the requirement, as would be the case had you been monthly-paid. Had you applied under Cat B, it would probably have been alright.


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## nyclon (Apr 3, 2011)

Thank you for clarifying, Joppa. That makes sense.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Thanks joppa.... How do i go about making this complaint? 
Should i write an email to the embassy?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Well, a simple complaint may not achieve anything as it appears, under the category you applied under, you were correctly turned down. Probably reapplication under Cat B will be better.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Ok thanks very much for your advice. 
All of this seems very unfair! 
What difference does it make if i applied under Z category, surely they can see that my salary is above £18600.


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

The catagory is very important because they have different requirements and require different evidence. 

You specify which catagory and that is what they asses you against.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

So what difference would it have made if i applied under category b, from my understanding category b is salaried employment from overseas?


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

Read Joppas reply here, ignore the 'your partner' bit because your partner is not in the UK so it is reliant on you. Its the fluctuations bit that matters...

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/britain-expat-forum-expats-living-uk/138506-category-b-spouse-visa-explain-please.html


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

My salary does not fluctuate, it's always the same, that's why i used category A


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Also, how should i know which category my salary belongs to? Does it really matter if it's cat A or B, surely they should put me into whichever category i am most suitable for. 
It seems to me they are looking for smallest mistakes just to reject people. 
Why?


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

No you choose the catagory because each requires different evidence. If they were to assess you how you say you would need to provide all the evidence from every catagory.

You know from the guidance provided which you should be using.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Employment letter, p60, bank statements and pay slips....... What else is there?


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

Some catagories require accounts, self assessment, proof of NI payments and all sorts which you wouldn't have as an employee. 

Anyway lets focus on a review and/or a new application.


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## lizard0924 (Jan 8, 2015)

_shel said:


> Read Joppas reply here, ignore the 'your partner' bit because your partner is not in the UK so it is reliant on you. Its the fluctuations bit that matters...
> 
> http://www.expatforum.com/expats/britain-expat-forum-expats-living-uk/138506-category-b-spouse-visa-explain-please.html


But surely UKVI can't consider a salaried position to "fluctuate" by the mere fact that the employee receives 52 paychecks vs. 12. If proof is submitted that definitively shows a gross annual salary of £18,600 or more, and the provided paychecks, employment contract, employer letter and bank statements support the weekly receipt of the annual salary/52, it would be absurd to penalize the sponsor because of the frequency of his/her pay.

Under the formula provided in this thread, no salaried employee who is paid more than once per month would ever be credited with his/her full annual salary for financial requirement purposes. it simply would not be possible, as weekly x 4 will always result in the loss of 4 weeks of income. 

To suggest that salaried employees who are paid more often than 1x per month must meet a different set of criteria (e.g. needing to submit 12 months of info rather than the 6 months their monthly-paid colleagues need show), is unconscionable.

That seems grossly out of line and not in keeping with the intent of the annual £18,600 requirement. Not to mention that it discriminates against those sponsors paid more often than once per month. Surely such discrimination is illegal in the UK?!


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

I've submitted the appeal via the justice.gov.uk Web site, is that enough or should i get a lawyer?


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## ashkevron (May 1, 2012)

lfc85 said:


> I've submitted the appeal via the justice.gov.uk Web site, is that enough or should i get a lawyer?


Unfair as it is and I do think these categories are maybe unnecessarily complicated, they have been know to refuse people for ticking the wrong boxes. If they refuse the complaint, they are likely to refuse the appeal as well, and appeals can take a long time.

Maybe file a complaint (there was a post a few weeks ago about how it's done but I can't find it, the moderators may give you the link to where you file the complaint), you should get a response and see if they'll change the decision in a month or so and then if the decision is not changed, just apply again and make sure you tick the right category. It's a hassle cause you'll have to update your documents but at least you are in the fortunate situation of being able to fulfil the financial requirement. 

It is expensive, but it's still better than putting your life on hold for over a year and possibly still losing the appeal over the wrong box ticked.

Edit: I think this may have been the post of someone who went the complaint route and the decision was changed, it may help (though as far as I understand, they ticked the right boxes so you situation is a bit more complex) http://www.expatforum.com/expats/br...iance-visa-refused-fiance-relationship-4.html


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Ok, thanks very much for this. 
I'll send an email in the morning to the complaints department


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## Simone_esp (Feb 8, 2015)

Earnings are usually before tax, it s worth mentioning pensions etc..


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## _shel (Mar 2, 2014)

Simone_esp said:


> Earnings are usually before tax, it s worth mentioning pensions etc..


 They state the gross earning in the refusal. Gross = before deductions.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

Decision has been overturned after they reviewed it again.
Thanks everyone!!!!!


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## ithinkin (Jan 30, 2015)

Congrats dude. You owe a big thanks to the mods.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

I know i do!!!!!!!!!! 
Thanks again


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## Zobair23 (Jun 4, 2014)

lfc85 said:


> I know i do!!!!!!!!!!
> Thanks again


how long did it take for the appeal to be overturned? and how were you notified about it? email, phone or a letter?

thanks


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## chiefteaofficer (May 27, 2014)

I think it's true that they are looking for every opportunity to turn people down. Not blaming necessarily every individual ECO, but that's the entire administration's MO right now - trying to cut down on immigration by any means possible. 

When my lawyer read my refusal letters from a few years ago (for tourist visas) she thought the ECO was looking for basically any reason to refuse me entry to the UK. She said they were sloppily written reasons and didn't really make much sense. It's such a shocking thing to receive a refusal letter when you haven't made mistakes on an application. And it truly affects your entire life when it's keeping you separated from your family, and preventing you from moving forward with your life in the way you had planned. The whole "let's cut down immigration in every way possible" is wrong on so many levels, but the keeping apart of families upsets me the most.


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## lfc85 (Dec 16, 2013)

It took about 10 days, i logged a proper appeal via an asylum tribunal however i also sent an email to home office which was more of a complaint and i think they acted upon that


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## phaara (Oct 16, 2014)

Hello all please guide
Is it necessary for respondant (ECO) to send appeal bundle to appelant or their solicitor wth no later then 5 days bfore hearing???
As in our hearing it was written
Tht the way appelant should sent file to judge n HO respondant the same way respondant should sent too bfore hearing


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Ask your lawyer. That's what you are paying for. Don't rely on advice here over legal procedure.


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## phaara (Oct 16, 2014)

We or Our lawyer no one get it


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Then change your lawyer!


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