# Free state health care for all???



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

All EU citizens legally resident in Spain and earning less than €100,000 a year will qualify for free healthcare from 1 September 2012. 

All residents earning less than 100,000 euros a year will qualify for free healthcare

EU citizens applying for residency in Spain may be required to produce evidence of sufficient financial means to support themselves (and dependants). Applicants may also be asked for proof of private or public healthcare insurance.

Entry & residence requirements

Am I missing something?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Alcalaina said:


> All EU citizens legally resident in Spain and earning less than €100,000 a year will qualify for free healthcare from 1 September 2012.
> 
> All residents earning less than 100,000 euros a year will qualify for free healthcare
> 
> ...


I havent read all your links, but I'm guessing the bit that you are missing is that Spain cant afford it anymore and can no longer honour its promises???

Jo xxx


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

I'm not sure what you think you're missing but read what states.

Legally resident. To be resident you have to have health care. They're giving you something you already have. Unless you're making over 100K in which case I guess you lose health care


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## Solwriter (Jan 10, 2012)

Alcalaina said:


> All EU citizens legally resident in Spain and earning less than €100,000 a year will qualify for free healthcare from 1 September 2012.
> 
> All residents earning less than 100,000 euros a year will qualify for free healthcare
> 
> ...


What is missing is how it can be proved that you earn _less_ than €100,000 a year.
Which can only be applied if you are a fiscal resident.
So everyone needs to make sure they are registered for tax even if they have nothing to declare.

But this part of the second link from the British Embassy website appears to be completely muddled:


> If you have a Spanish bank account but do not live in Spain, you must register with the Spanish authorities. *Residencia (registration as a non-resident)* needs to be renewed regularly.


Residencia as a _non-resident_?
What exactly does that mean? 
And does it mean that non-residents (or those with non-resident residencia )will no longer get the ongoing white NIE and instead have to keep on registering for one, despite it carrying the same number?

And if you are a non-resident not living in Spain, how regularly do they expect you to register?
All very confusing.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Solwriter said:


> What is missing is how it can be proved that you earn _less_ than €100,000 a year.
> Which can only be applied if you are a fiscal resident.
> So everyone needs to make sure they are registered for tax even if they have nothing to declare.
> 
> ...


I do know that people with non-resident bank accounts are periodically (annually) asked by the bank to declare non-residency & get a non-resident certificate of some kind........I'm a bit hazy on it cos I'm resident!


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

Unfortunately it all appears to be getting mixed up , even by the people who are supposed to be implementing it . The two articles are in no way linked.

All Spaniards ,& registered foreign residents ,are entitled to full healthcare as from the 1st September .

The new rules regarding health cover aren't really new as they always existed but were never enforced. 
The 'new' rules do not apply to anyone who is already a legally registered permanent resident. This is were there are some problems as some of the officials seem to think that the 'new' rules apply to legal foreign residents , they don't. 

If you are a permanent resident then you are ," A Spaniard with everything a Spaniard is entitled too, except a Spanish passport". This is the official EU reply , to me , recently in answer to some questions.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Nothing in life is 'free', including health care.

It's paid for from our taxes and taxes from business or by state borrowing.

And when those sources of income dry up, provision will be affected.


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## Madliz (Feb 4, 2011)

How about this lure for British property buyers: Move to Spain and get free healthcare! | Rightmove Overseas Property 

How is one to know what to believe? I have a friend, a long-time Spanish resident, who is currently without healthcare after losing company entitlement after a job change. He is wary of signing up for (a year minimum?) private healthcare this week, with certain pre-existing conditions not covered, if he could get free state cover next month with everything covered. Nobody seems to know - how DOES one get cover 'from 1st September'? As in all things bureaucratic here, nobody who should know gets told!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Madliz said:


> How about this lure for British property buyers: Move to Spain and get free healthcare! | Rightmove Overseas Property
> 
> How is one to know what to believe? I have a friend, a long-time Spanish resident, who is currently without healthcare after losing company entitlement after a job change. He is wary of signing up for (a year minimum?) private healthcare this week, with certain pre-existing conditions not covered, if he could get free state cover next month with everything covered. Nobody seems to know - how DOES one get cover 'from 1st September'? As in all things bureaucratic here, nobody who should know gets told!


I have tried to leave a comment - this one


> what this article fails to mention is that in order to register as resident in the first place you have to show proof of income (proof of property ownership MIGHT count) - but you also have to show proof that you already have healthcare provision in place - either in the form of a reciprocal agreement from another country (such as the S1 ) or private healthcare - so this isn't quite what it seems, & you certainly can't move to Spain & expect to get free healthcare.
> It simply doesn't work like that - this article is completely misleading.


but the ·$%&/() captcha thingy is defeating me - although on my last attempt it claimed I had already said it............. but I can't see it!

as for your friend - if he is now registered as unemployed then he should be fine under these new rules - he should go to INEM or whatever they call it now & ask them


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## Solwriter (Jan 10, 2012)

xabiachica said:


> I do know that people with non-resident bank accounts are periodically (annually) asked by the bank to declare non-residency & get a non-resident certificate of some kind........I'm a bit hazy on it cos I'm resident!


So am I. That's why I asked.
And the people I know who are non-residents with NIEs and non-res bank accounts never seem to have to do anything about re-registering anywhere.

I didn't even know there was a _non-residents_ residencia certificate. That bit reads like nonsense to me.
Perhaps they mean the Padron, or perhaps new rules mean that the non-resident NIE doesn't last indefinitely. I don't know, but I'm curious. :confused2:


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Solwriter said:


> So am I. That's why I asked.
> And the people I know who are non-residents with NIEs and non-res bank accounts never seem to have to do anything about re-registering anywhere.
> 
> I didn't even know there was a _non-residents_ residencia certificate. That bit reads like nonsense to me.
> Perhaps they mean the Padron, or perhaps new rules mean that the non-resident NIE doesn't last indefinitely. I don't know, but I'm curious. :confused2:


I know there's some sort of certificate/declaration that you get for (maybe from :confused2 the bank

it can't be anything to do with the padrón cos you don't sign on that unless you're resident


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Madliz said:


> How about this lure for British property buyers: Move to Spain and get free healthcare! | Rightmove Overseas Property
> 
> How is one to know what to believe? I have a friend, a long-time Spanish resident, who is currently without healthcare after losing company entitlement after a job change. He is wary of signing up for (a year minimum?) private healthcare this week, with certain pre-existing conditions not covered, if he could get free state cover next month with everything covered. Nobody seems to know - how DOES one get cover 'from 1st September'? As in all things bureaucratic here, nobody who should know gets told!


hmmmmmm the article seems to have disappeared.........

or maybe they just blocked me after my comments


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> it can't be anything to do with the padrón cos you don't sign on that unless you're resident


Er ... sorry, but yes you can!

Here they only ask for NIE and a utility bill or house deeds with your address, not a certificado de resdencia. I know several non-residents who are on the padrón.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> hmmmmmm the article seems to have disappeared.........
> 
> or maybe they just blocked me after my comments


It seems to have caused quite a stir on Spanish forums too!


"¡múdate a españa y consigue sanidad gratuita!" | Mediavida


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> Er ... sorry, but yes you can!


yu might be _able to_ -& I know that in soem areas they have even ecouraged it in the past

but you're not _supposed to_ - it's a list of local _residents_

here, now, they want to see your resident cert before you can register for the first time - they even asked me for mine when I went to get a copy recently - I did have it with me cos I'd needed it for somethinmg else that day, but I had the impression that since I'm such an 'oldie' in the system they would have given (sold) me the copy anyway


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## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

Solwriter said:


> So am I. That's why I asked.
> And the people I know who are non-residents with NIEs and non-res bank accounts never seem to have to do anything about re-registering anywhere.
> 
> I didn't even know there was a _non-residents_ residencia certificate. That bit reads like nonsense to me.
> Perhaps they mean the Padron, or perhaps new rules mean that the non-resident NIE doesn't last indefinitely. I don't know, but I'm curious. :confused2:


There isn't a non-residents residencía certificate. It is a 'certificate of non-residence' & is required to be renewed by a bank every two years .Although it has been allowed to lapse for many years they are cracking down on it again.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

gus-lopez said:


> There isn't a non-residents residencía certificate. It is a 'certificate of non-residence' & is required to be renewed by a bank every two years .Although it has been allowed to lapse for many years they are cracking down on it again.


They are also cracking down on non-resident property owners, who are supposed to pay a tax based on the potential rental income of their property. 

*Income tax for non-residents who do not rent out their property *

Spanish name:	Impuesto de la renta de no residentes, declaración ordinaria (IRNR)

Description: You pay this version of income tax in Spain if the following conditions apply: 1) You do not reside in Spain, 2) You own property in Spain, 3) The property is exclusively for personal use and you do not rent it out, 4) You have no other source of taxable income in Spain. Although you do not earn an income from the property, in the eyes of the Spanish tax authorities you still derive a benefit from owning a property in Spain and therefore have to pay an imputed income tax.

Tax base: 2% of the cadastral value of the property (found on the IBI receipt), or 1.1% if the cadastral value has been revised since 1st January 1994.

Tax rate: 24% (25% for 2006 and before)

Property taxes for Non-residents in Spain | Spanish Property Insight Blog


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## Guest (Aug 1, 2012)

from an American...nothing is free...somebody has to pay for it...and you get what you pay for...


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## Nonnamags (Jan 10, 2013)

*free health cover*



gus-lopez said:


> Unfortunately it all appears to be getting mixed up , even by the people who are supposed to be implementing it . The two articles are in no way linked.
> 
> All Spaniards ,& registered foreign residents ,are entitled to full healthcare as from the 1st September .
> 
> ...


Well confusing! we have been in Spain for over 9 years, worked the first bit so paid agricultural Social Sec payments and received health care whilst in progress. When we could no longer work and too young (!) for state pension we didnt think we could recieve any kind of healthcare from the state? 

so, as registered under old terms of residency, we do have a social security number, can we now waltz into our backwater health centre and request to register? 
Im even going down the autonomo route, thus providing health cover through my own contributions. does anyone know if I can claim these SS contributions back through expenses byw?

scary being a grown up..............................:juggle:


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

y


Nonnamags said:


> Well confusing! we have been in Spain for over 9 years, worked the first bit so paid agricultural Social Sec payments and received health care whilst in progress. When we could no longer work and too young (!) for state pension we didnt think we could recieve any kind of healthcare from the state?
> 
> so, as registered under old terms of residency, we do have a social security number, can we now waltz into our backwater health centre and request to register?
> Im even going down the autonomo route, thus providing health cover through my own contributions. does anyone know if I can claim these SS contributions back through expenses byw?
> ...



it's not quite that simple - but if you've been doing tax returns every year & have a resident registration cert from before April 2012, then yes you can - well, you need to go to the INSS first


I don't know if autónomo payments are claimable as expenses - my gestor does my paperwork, but I'd be surprised if you can claim what is essentially NI contributions

I'd be happy to be wrong though, considering how much I pay out every month


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## Nonnamags (Jan 10, 2013)

xabiachica said:


> y
> 
> 
> it's not quite that simple - but if you've been doing tax returns every year & have a resident registration cert from before April 2012, then yes you can - well, you need to go to the INSS first
> ...


Regrettably we never completed a tax return. Govt pension paid in UK, I've been back and forth working in UK, now given up and staying in Spain as autonomo. Guess I'll have to pay a Gestor / assessor (what's the difference) which sickens me as I only expect to earn 300-600 euros max a month, and that's before Ipay the 250 social security and tax. As always though we want to be legal, and I would prefer to do it for free considering how little we have!!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Nonnamags said:


> Regrettably we never completed a tax return. Govt pension paid in UK, I've been back and forth working in UK, now given up and staying in Spain as autonomo. Guess I'll have to pay a Gestor / assessor (what's the difference) which sickens me as I only expect to earn 300-600 euros max a month, and that's before Ipay the 250 social security and tax. As always though we want to be legal, and I would prefer to do it for free considering how little we have!!


most gestores will tell you that if you're earning less than about 600€ a month then not to bother registering as autónomo - it's not 'official', but sort of accepted

if you've been registered as resident, even though you haven't done tax returns (as so many were advised not to bother ) it might be worth contacting the DWP in Newcastle for a 'Legislation Letter' which basically says that you aren't entitled to healthcare in the UK & take that to the INSS - you never know, it might help


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## Nonnamags (Jan 10, 2013)

Cheers for this post, I've already registered as I really do want to be legal. Will try the DSS route though as not sure how long my work will last. Will visit a Gestor for info too I think. Grateful thanks, you've been ever so helpful. : )


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