# Questions before we move



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

Did you purchase umbrella insurance when you moved to Germany?

Do you have automobile and health insurance recommendations?

Are there any concerns regarding inheritance laws if you or your spouse should die?

Should we hire a German attorney to ask advise about potential legal land mines?


----------



## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Quite a bit depends on where you're from (and what nationality/ies) you hold, why you are moving to Germany, where you're moving in Germany and if you're there for the long haul or just for a few years for some specific purpose. Obviously you don't have to reveal anything you don't want made public, but it would help to have a bit of background about your move.


----------



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

Thank you for responding. We are moving from the United States and are US citizens. We are moving for my wife’s essential oil’s business which she kick started in Stuttgart last April when we were there for three months. We are hoping to move there for at least six months to a year if not longer. Thanks again for any helpful tips.


----------



## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

If your wife has started a business in Germany, then she should be registered with all the appropriate agencies (for taxes, social insurances, etc.), and I would guess that those would involve enrollment in the various insurances (both for the business and for your personal situation).

If that's not the case then your first step needs to be to find legal and/or accounting help to get through all the necessary registrations. That adviser can be valuable in helping you get your personal situation in order (wills and inheritances, banking arrangements, personal and professional insurance needs, etc.).


----------



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

Thank you! Actually she didn’t set up anything. She only enrolled a few people from a US airforce base in Stuttgart that we’re American citizens. It was then we decided to try to come back to Germany for her to do her business full time.
Therefore we would need an adviser as you suggested. Should this be an adviser from Germany? Do you have any recommendations?
You’ve been very helpful.


----------



## ALKB (Jan 20, 2012)

Geekboy said:


> Thank you for responding. We are moving from the United States and are US citizens. We are moving for my wife’s essential oil’s business which she kick started in Stuttgart last April when we were there for three months. We are hoping to move there for at least six months to a year if not longer. Thanks again for any helpful tips.


What kind of visa will you be on?

To be very honest, I don't think an essential oil business qualifies for a self-employment visa.

"_Prerequisites for the residence permit are:

You satisfy the passport and visa obligation.
With respect to the passport obligation, it is sufficient if you possess an alternative identity document.
Your subsistence is assured without having to claim public funds.
Your subsistence is held to be assured if you generate
Income equal to the standard social assistance rate plus
The costs of accommodation and heating plus
Any health insurance contributions.
There are no grounds for your expulsion.
Your stay does not endanger or prejudice the interests of the Federal Republic of Germany.
If you are over the age of 45, you must have an adequate pension provision.
the following economic prerequisites:
There is a commercial interest in or a regional requirement for your activity.
Your activity can be expected to have a positive economic effect.
The financing of the business is secured either through personal capital or a loan undertaking.

If this does not apply to your project, the authority will obtain opinions from competent offices. These will clarify whether the planned activity is viable.

Note: In the following cases, you do not have to satisfy the economic prerequisites for self-employment:

You wish to become self-employed as a freelancer.
You require
the necessary permits to pursue the freelance activity or
at least, confirmation that the permits will be granted.
You have completed your studies at a state or state-recognised higher education institute or comparable educational establishment in Germany.
The self-employed activity must be related to the knowledge and skills you obtained in the course of your studies.
As a researcher or a scientist, you have a residence permit for the purpose of employment or for the purpose of research.
The planned self-employed activity, however, must be related to your scientific activity or your research activity._"

Source:

https://www.service-bw.de/en/web/gu..._p_lifecycle=0&p_p_state=normal&p_p_mode=view


----------



## ALKB (Jan 20, 2012)

Geekboy said:


> Thank you! Actually she didn’t set up anything. She only enrolled a few people from a US airforce base in Stuttgart that we’re American citizens. It was then we decided to try to come back to Germany for her to do her business full time.
> Therefore we would need an adviser as you suggested. Should this be an adviser from Germany? Do you have any recommendations?
> You’ve been very helpful.


*squints* Is this an MLM?


----------



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

Thank you. The oil business may not qualify. We would have to check. We were looking at a freelance visa possibly. 
We are both retired. I’m 67 and my wife is 60. We have ample funds where we would not ever require any assistance. 
If the oils don’t qualify would we be able to reside in Germany for six months to a year as a retired couple?


----------



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

ALKB said:


> *squints* Is this an MLM?


Sorry, what is a MLM?


----------



## ALKB (Jan 20, 2012)

Geekboy said:


> Sorry, what is a MLM?


Multi Level Marketing scheme.

You are a business associate/partner, enroll people to buy your stuff and encourage them to also become associates/partners. Then they sell the stuff too, and encourage the people they enroll/recruit to also start selling.

If it's a business model like that, it will certainly not qualify for a visa.


----------



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

Sadly, that’s what it is.
What kind of visa would we need if we wanted to come live for six months or a year as a retired couple?
We have ample funds and would never need any government assistance.


----------



## ALKB (Jan 20, 2012)

Geekboy said:


> Thank you. The oil business may not qualify. We would have to check. We were looking at a freelance visa possibly.
> We are both retired. I’m 67 and my wife is 60. We have ample funds where we would not ever require any assistance.
> If the oils don’t qualify would we be able to reside in Germany for six months to a year as a retired couple?



Freelance visa for which profession? Freelance visas are tied to a specific activity, like teaching English. Other economic activity would not be allowed.

There is no retirement visa in Germany. You can apply outside the rules but that's completely up to the discretion of the case worker/the immigration authority.

If you are not employed, health insurance may be very expensive.

If it's just a year you're after, I think France is a bit more flexible on long stay visitors. You could set up base in Strasbourg or Haguenau and visit frequently?

Anyway, more info on self-employment residence permits in Germany:

https://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/visa/kinds-of-visa/self-employment/


----------



## ALKB (Jan 20, 2012)

Geekboy said:


> Sadly, that’s what it is.
> What kind of visa would we need if we wanted to come live for six months or a year as a retired couple?
> We have ample funds and would never need any government assistance.


You might be able to get a visa for language studies. You'd need to enroll in a language course that's at least 20 hours a week or more, so basically Monday to Friday.

Not sure if your age would be a factor and how health insurance would work.


----------



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

You’ve been very helpful. Thank you!


----------



## Geekboy (Dec 8, 2019)

One last question. Is there an inheritance issue for US citizens who live in Germany over 6 months? Can Germany take any portion of inheritance from a non citizen that lives in Germany for over a certain period of time if a spouse passes away while living there?


----------



## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Geekboy said:


> One last question. Is there an inheritance issue for US citizens who live in Germany over 6 months? Can Germany take any portion of inheritance from a non citizen that lives in Germany for over a certain period of time if a spouse passes away while living there?


There is a European directive that allows someone living in the EU to invoke the inheritance laws of their home country (or to incorporate the provisions of their home country wills) for inheritance purposes. This is often used by expats who retire to the EU. The only "catch" is that, the home country rules apply only to the division and distribution of property. What is distributed from the estate is still subject to tax at the local (i.e. German) tax rates - which are usually considerably higher than the US rates.


----------



## Nononymous (Jul 12, 2011)

Geekboy said:


> One last question. Is there an inheritance issue for US citizens who live in Germany over 6 months? Can Germany take any portion of inheritance from a non citizen that lives in Germany for over a certain period of time if a spouse passes away while living there?


I expect it would depend on the circumstances of your visit. If you were to obtain a 6- or 12-month visa but were not working and planned to leave again, you would not be fully resident in Germany. You would not be in the German tax system, nor would you be using German public health care. 

If one of you were to die while in Germany, you'd presumably pack up and head back to the US and deal with all estate matters there. I doubt very much that German customs would impound the body so that the Finanzamt could launch an international investigation into the value of the estate, and so on. And you would have no German property to deal with.

As you have probably figured out by now, staying beyond 3 months is going to be a challenge. Germany only offers residence permits for study or work, and selling the 2020 equivalent of Amway on the side is not what they mean by work. A lot of these immigration decisions are quite decentralized and particular to an individual bureaucrat, so your best bet is to arrive at whatever location you have chosen then go see the local Ausländerbehörde and plead your case. Tell them that you're researching a novel, or painting watercolours of all four seasons. You would need to demonstrate savings to cover living expenses, intention to return, and proof of health insurance is very important. You will also need to have registered your accommodation, but you might not want to sign a year's lease without knowing that you can stay, so bit of a catch-22 there. You would not be allowed to work, so don't mention (or even engage in) any sales activity.


----------

