# Weird Streamline situation and weirder CPA. Ideas?



## boat (May 17, 2014)

I have this wired situation going I am hoping someone on the forum might have an idea on. 

In May I was trying to get my paperwork sorted to file for the Streamline, but due to a closed bank account I could not get the records for 2010. While waiting for the records June 16th passed so I was pushed into the next tax year. 

That was a few days back and thus I was then ready to file for 2011-2013 when a CPA that thought she was helping me filed an extension for 2013 for me, and my wife. 

I had never signed a Power Of Attorney, or any other IRS forms giving her authority to do anything on my behalf nor did I ever ask her to file anything for me. In fact I am shocked she took it upon herself to take action as she did.

Now this CPA just went into labor and I am left with all my tax records ready to file, but no CPA. 

When I look at the new Streamline it states over and over just like this (properly filed for extension). This term is in front of ever place the date of filing is mentioned. Maybe six times in the new Streamline blurb.

My question is if I should have my new CPA (that I have not found yet) simply file for 2011-2013. If the IRS comes back saying 2013 is not "delinquent" I then say my extension was not "Properly filed" because of the lack of authority by the CPA and see what happens. 

Or would I be better off filing for 2010 also even though I don't have the records from that year and so much of it would just be guess work.

Crazy I know. I am amazed that such a simple procedure can be made so complicated, but it is and I need some suggestions. 

Thanks again


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## BBCWatcher (Dec 28, 2012)

You always do the best you can in the circumstances. First of all, I'm not sure why a _closed_ bank account uniquely has irretrievable records. (If it's too old, sure, but closed v. not closed shouldn't matter in terms of the existence of the records.) Surely the bank has the records, and surely there's a process to recover them -- most likely for a fee paid to the bank.

That said, if the records truly are irretrievable, take your best, most educated guesses based on the evidence you have. That's all you can do, and that's all that's expected. Document in your personal files the path you followed to arrive at your estimates.


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

Just file it. If the IRS comes back at all, it probably won't have anything to do with whether or not an extension was filed for your 2013 returns. (That's actually the beauty of the streamlined process - you file, and if you never hear anything back, that's a good thing.)

You don't actually "need" to have the bank records for 2010. As BBC says, make a good faith estimate and get on with it. You should not be sending in any bank records with your filings, anyhow.
Cheers,
Bev


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## boat (May 17, 2014)

Thank you for the help.

The issue with the bank is it is a Chase bank, that has gained control over Washington Mutural that went bankrupt. With WAMU we had paper statements, not electric and thus in the change over of banks and computer systems they say all they can do is go back and find the old statements and print them and send them to my address on record. No fee, just a long delay, and once they are in the mail they have to be forwarded to me, who is working on a boat so my mail just collects till I can have it sent, and the next time that will happen in late July. I did not want to get into such a complicated story, but since you asked I guess I will make it clear.

Then the wages I was paid in 2010 was not simply straight pay, but additional wages if we had guests, more again if we were underway, etc. Going back and trying to figure what we were paid can be done, but it takes a lot of going through old emails etc. 

Now I know I have to file, but my question is what would you do- File 2011-2013 or 2010-2013. 

It seems that 2010 is not required by Streamline so why file it? On the other hand with the extension filed it might be required. Thus why I am considering the options and seeking the forums guidance. 

I know its a strange question but is anything ever easy?

Boat


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## BBCWatcher (Dec 28, 2012)

Go ahead and request those statements from Chase. It can't hurt.

In the meantime, as Bev and I are both suggesting, do the best you can in the circumstances. Those bank statements may arrive well after you file, in which case you simply keep them in your personal files in case the IRS makes further inquiries. (Unlikely.)

There are cases where a small business owner's entire business burns to the ground with all records lost. When that happens, the small business owner is not relieved of his/her tax filing obligations. But the records are lost. So, the owner does all she can do: make good faith estimates. Just do the same. Take a reasonable guess about the number of guests you had and the number of days you were away, perhaps based on your diary/calendar from 2010. No, don't spend 200 hours trying to figure this out -- take a reasonable, educated, best guess, and write down for your personal files how you arrived at that guess. Take a look at 2011, for example, and use that as a basis for comparison if you were similarly situated. If 2010 was a better or worse year, make those adjustments, again with your best, reasonable guesses.


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## boat (May 17, 2014)

Thank you for the thoughts. 

What would you think about not even filing 2010 since it is not required by the Streamline going back three years (except for this crazy extension that I did not file?)

That is the real question I am trying to get an idea on.


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## BBCWatcher (Dec 28, 2012)

Well, according to the program rules it seems you have to wait some more months to be eligible for skipping tax year 2010. That's some more months when you're not tax compliant. Maybe that's a problem.

I don't really understand what your angst is here with estimating your income for 2010. That's exactly what the IRS would have you do. If you don't have complete records, you do the best you can, that's all. But if you feel uncomfortable following the IRS's guidance, you can...be _selective_ in following the IRS's guidance?

....OK, see how that doesn't make any sense? 

What exactly is the problem here? Were you smuggling cocaine to Miami during taxi year 2010 and gave that up as your 2011 New Year's resolution?  I'm clearly missing the source of your concern here. It's only a tax return. It's neither microscopic neurosurgery nor nuclear plant operations. "Close enough" and "best you can" are plenty good enough.

Also, some months ago you mentioned you don't have bank records for 2010. If they're free to order, why didn't you just go order them months ago? Water under the bridge, but why wouldn't you order them now at least? They're free. Why not? Were you trafficking in underage sex workers on that boat, and you'd prefer to forget that year?


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## boat (May 17, 2014)

BBCWatcher said:


> Well, according to the program rules it seems you have to wait some more months to be eligible for skipping tax year 2010. That's some more months when you're not tax compliant. Maybe that's a problem.
> 
> I don't really understand what your angst is here with estimating your income for 2010. That's exactly what the IRS would have you do. If you don't have complete records, you do the best you can, that's all. But if you feel uncomfortable following the IRS's guidance, you can...be _selective_ in following the IRS's guidance?
> 
> ...


You are funny. No, 2010 was just a normal year, living in Tonga, doing charters and not keeping much in the line of records. 

I should mention how tense it is filing in the US system after a life time of being in another country then hearing from the slew of lawyers, wagging a finger at us, how much trouble we are in. Its like that old story of the frog in the slow cooker or just dropping him in hot water, and he jumps right out. You know in NZ we have about a three page return. The US one I saw is about 40 pages per year? How can that be? 

Now that I am on my third CPA maybe someone should do a post on how to pick a CPA. My first CPA, (claiming to be an expert on expats) filled everything out and told us we were ready to file. When I looked she had only used one FEIE for a joint return and told us we had to pay about 7K in taxes and to file into the Streamline. Even I could see how wrong that was.

My second, well that story has been up on this form for a few days now. She seemed so good, but has added much tension to my world.

I still don't know about my third yet. I do know that we might file this week, and if so we will be one of the first in the New Streamline and thus I will report back what we hear. 

boat


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