# IVA- on its way up!



## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

Just read article in CBN which seems to say the possibility of iva going up is getting closer, only this time some things which are rated at 10% now eg contact lenses will be at the higher rate.
This will come as good news to those who have indicated that they don't mind at all paying an increased rate!


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

Nobody I know likes increased taxes. There was a lot of shouting about in the UK when VAT went up, but we are all in it together as Cameron famously said, referring to the deficit. Life is not easy these days, but it will still be cheaper living in Spain than the UK. I watch that program on UK TV. It's called, Rip off Britain. We are quite happy to be here. Having said that, I do feel sorry for the locals who are really struggling!


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

Looking at all the wide ranging things will be affected by a rise in the cost of living(and dying) do you think it will still be that much cheaper here?Electricity bills are going through the roof, and iva on top of that?


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

extranjero said:


> Looking at all the wide ranging things will be affected by a rise in the cost of living(and dying) do you think it will still be that much cheaper here?Electricity bills are going through the roof, and iva on top of that?


I don't disagree about the electricity, but the rates went up two years ago by 10% approximately and seriously, compared to the UK, is it anywhere near, no it isn't. I live much better here in Spain than I could ever do in the UK financially. Spain is no different to other countries in Europe, they all have taxes by stealth, even those that deny the fact. The people who always are affected by rising costs and taxes are those that can't afford them, the poor within society. I do not consider the slight rise this will occur, will affect most expats. We all made the decision to come here for a better life. I can only speak for myself, but saying that, most of our friends and relatives who live here agree about our lives in Spain.


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

Why are you thinking most prices will go up?

How many new shops do you see opening? How many closing? Are shops full? Or are they hurting for business?

Bet prices don't go up that much. Instead some shops will close. Some will cut staff. 

Shop owners can't hike prices with an empty shop.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

NickZ said:


> Why are you thinking most prices will go up?
> 
> How many new shops do you see opening? How many closing? Are shops full? Or are they hurting for business?
> 
> ...


I know that after the last increase, when many things were moved into the highest category of IVA, a lot of businesses absorbed the increase rather than pass it on to customers, my hairdresser and my health club for example.

I have read about the possible increases, and they are only possible at this stage (apparently there is dissent within the Government as to whether IVA should be raised or not). I also read the report of Rajoy's "state of the nation" speech a few weeks ago, when he signalled that as part of the tax review, anyone with an income of €12,000 or less would be taken out of paying tax altogether. In other words, an increase in personal allowances, similar to the one announced this week in the UK budget. That could help offset any rise in IVA for those people who pay tax on their pensions, for example.

We will just have to wait and see what the whole package consists of before forming an opinion about it.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Some evidence here from today's El Pais that an increase in IVA is by no means a done deal:-
Montoro rechaza subir el IVA de ningún producto contra la idea de los expertos | EconomÃ­a | EL PAÃ�S

Whilst we're on the subject of what might or might not be in the reform of the fiscal system, there was a report in today's Sur in English saying that the committee of "experts" was putting forward proposals that Spain should bring it's taxation of foreign non-doms into line with Portugal, in that they should be exempted from tax on income generated abroad (including pensions) for a number of years. Seemingly that would not affect those of us who are already habitual residents, but it's interesting they are thinking along those lines.

I've also read in recent days that the Government has more room for manoeuvre in the fiscal reform than had been thought, because of the steady fall in Government borrowing costs.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> Just read article in CBN which seems to say the possibility of iva going up is getting closer, only this time some things which are rated at 10% now eg contact lenses will be at the higher rate.
> This will come as good news to those who have indicated that they don't mind at all paying an increased rate!


I don't mind at all if it means that by so doing, help is given to the unemployed.

I try not to base my opinions of economic policies on my personal economic wellbeing.

You seem to think that Spain is the only country on the planet that changes its tax requirements!!

Never mind, go back to the UK and you can turn your pension pot into a Lamborghini, thanks to our wonderful Chancellor...
Or drink cheaper beer and keep more of your Bingo winnings, as is your taste


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

mrypg9 said:


> I don't mind at all if it means that by so doing, help is given to the unemployed.
> 
> I try not to base my opinions of economic policies on my personal economic wellbeing.
> 
> ...


If only I had that sort of a pension pot!
Of course I don't think Spain is the only country that changes its tax requirements-at least the UK tries to encourage investment, whereas Spain is trying to do everything possible to discourage it!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> If only I had that sort of a pension pot!
> Of course I don't think Spain is the only country that changes its tax requirements-at least the UK tries to encourage investment, whereas Spain is trying to do everything possible to discourage it!


The average UK pension pot is apparently £25k....that will at current rates return around £100 a month.

Spain is trying to encourage investment...but it depends on your definition of investment. A Brit pensioner buying a piso at a knock- down price isn't my definition of investment andI doubt it is that of the Spanish Government!


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

mrypg9 said:


> The average UK pension pot is apparently £25k....that will at current rates return around £100 a month.


And under the new rules, if anyone chooses to take the whole of their pension pot in cash, they will have to pay tax on all but 25% of it, thus reducing it still further.
Those Lamborghinis might have to be swapped for something a bit more economical!


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Lynn R said:


> And under the new rules, if anyone chooses to take the whole of their pension pot in cash, they will have to pay tax on all but 25% of it, thus reducing it still further.
> Those Lamborghinis might have to be swapped for something a bit more economical!


Oh, and any cash lump sum of more than 25% will be treated as income, meaning that some people could be pushed into the higher rate tax bracket for the year they take it. Never mind though, Osborne said last week that people are happy to pay 40% tax as it makes them feel they're a success.

So there you are, there's nothing strange at all about those of us who say we'd accept paying a bit more in Spain if it benefitted the unemployed!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

And wouldn't it be nice if, instead of coming over on Ryanair looking to snap up a cheap Spanish 'dream home', some Brit with real money came along and started up a business giving employment to some of those Spaniards who've been without work for years ..because of the collapse of the largely Brit-fuelled property boom....

Now_ that's_ what I call investment...


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

mrypg9 said:


> And wouldn't it be nice if, instead of coming over on Ryanair looking to snap up a cheap Spanish 'dream home', some Brit with real money came along and started up a business giving employment to some of those Spaniards who've been without work for years ..because of the collapse of the largely Brit-fuelled property boom....
> 
> Now_ that's_ what I call investment...


Yes, agreed, but don't forget that person flying in on Ryanair,buying his dream home, is contributing to the Spanish economy, buying and furnishing a property, services, utilities, everyday living etc,


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> Yes, agreed, but don't forget that person flying in on Ryanair,buying his dream home, is contributing to the Spanish economy, buying and furnishing a property, services, utilities, everyday living etc,


Not necessarily. Many Brits here spend their cash in British- run businesses and buy houses from Brits. Of course these businesses will pay taxes...hopefully.
Spain won't get out of crisis by relying on the relatively insignificant amount Brits and other foreigners contribute to the economy as a whole. 
And do Spaniards really want their country to be God's waiting- room for elderly guiris


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

mrypg9 said:


> Not necessarily. Many Brits here spend their cash in British- run businesses and buy houses from Brits. Of course these businesses will pay taxes...hopefully.
> Spain won't get out of crisis by relying on the relatively insignificant amount Brits and other foreigners contribute to the economy as a whole.
> And do Spaniards really want their country to be God's waiting- room for elderly guiris


It's already been mentioned how Spain got itself into a mess, and it could help itself get out, with clamp downs on black money, more efficient collection of taxes etc.I don't think the input of ex pats' money could be termed as relatively insignificant. Huge amounts of money ARE spent in Spanish businesses.
As for Brit fuelled building boom, what about greedy Spanish developers and estate agents.
Spain hasn't done badly out of God's waiting room so far!


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

extranjero said:


> It's already been mentioned how Spain got itself into a mess, and it could help itself get out, with clamp downs on black money, more efficient collection of taxes etc.I don't think the input of ex pats' money could be termed as relatively insignificant. Huge amounts of money ARE spent in Spanish businesses.
> As for Brit fuelled building boom, what about greedy Spanish developers and estate agents.
> Spain hasn't done badly out of God's waiting room so far!


You may be right, but please bear in mind, Spain is a relatively new democracy. It was less than 40 years since Spain was a dictatorship. Many people I know remember how things worked in those days. Life today is so much different, but getting rid of the old ways of black money and backhanders will take time. I came to Spain in the 70's often as I had family out here. When we came 10 years ago to live, the system had changed little. Most Brits came to Spain because it was cheap, loads of good weather and a better life. Many had no idea what this country was like and now they have found out, for many it is too late. Everybody wanted to live the Spanish dream. Some have found it, many haven't. I for one came to integrate. I complain about nobody. This is not my country, I still feel like a guest, but I like my local neighbours, they are really lovely people. I have always believed, if you want good neighbours, you have to be one yourself.
The system in Spain is changing. Cultures take generations to change. The UK has had a democratic system in place for centuries, and even there, nothing is perfect.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> It's already been mentioned how Spain got itself into a mess, and it could help itself get out, with clamp downs on black money, more efficient collection of taxes etc.I don't think the input of ex pats' money could be termed as relatively insignificant. Huge amounts of money ARE spent in Spanish businesses.
> As for Brit fuelled building boom, what about greedy Spanish developers and estate agents.
> Spain hasn't done badly out of God's waiting room so far!


The misguided policy of turning Spain into God's waiting room is the root cause of the problem, which is structural and will not be resolved by importing more lower to middle income immigrants from Northern Europe buying repossessed properties, many from said immigrants who overestimated their resources.

You have two themes which are mutually contradictory: one, that 'wealthy' immigrants help keep Spain's economy afloat and two, that immigrants are suffering from tax increases and only the few you see as 'wealthy' (that category presumably including me!) can afford to live here!


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

extranjero said:


> It's already been mentioned how Spain got itself into a mess, and it could help itself get out, with clamp downs on black money, more efficient collection of taxes etc.


And the Modelo 720 declaration, which you and some other foreign residents complain so bitterly about, is a part of the Spanish Government trying to do just that.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

And thinking of black money and inefficient tax collecting....two points.

Firstly, that many British immigrants are involved in the black economy and there are those who avoid due taxes of many kinds, from vehicle tax to failure to declare rental income from properties in the UK and here in Spain.

Secondly, inefficiencies in collecting tax due aren't limited to Spain, are they....HMRC hasn't been that assiduous in collecting taxes from the likes of amazon and Starbucks and the Government is slow in plugging those little gaps that allow the wealthy to make use of to minimise their share of the tax burden.
The black economy is also rife in the UK, not as prominent as in Spain, admittedly but perhaps with less excuse as we like to pride ourselves on our honesty and sense of 'fair play'.

And just as in Spain, there seems to be no sector of British public life which isuntouched by scandal and corruption..the police, the judiciary, Parliament, the Monarchy...

At least there is a comparatively refreshing openness and lack of hypocrisy in face of these problems here in Spain.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Lynn R said:


> And the Modelo 720 declaration, which you and some other foreign residents complain so bitterly about, is a part of the Spanish Government trying to do just that.


For some reason I can't ' like' this post...when that little button reappears, I most certainly will!


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

Lynn R said:


> And the Modelo 720 declaration, which you and some other foreign residents complain so bitterly about, is a part of the Spanish Government trying to do just that.


The fact that only about 5% of the population submitted the 720 shows how successful that was! Potential Disproportionate fines and great confusion even amongst accountants about what and how to declare worried people to the extent that they ended up not doing it at all, taking the risk of not being found out.
There are people living in Spain who would maybe like to legalise their tax situation, but facing massive fines for past declarations they haven't made, or undeclared assets, they most certainly won't do so now.
Some people refuse to pay taxes or declare assets here, so they deserve everything they get, but others have been given bad advice from "experts" or have been confused , and buried their heads in the sand about the subject. Obviously that is not an excuse, but if they want to put their tax matters straight now, it is very much a stick and not a carrot approach from the tax office.
IBI collection is a disorganised mess where I live, and the council must be missing out on many thousands of euros, from those who have escrituras and have never paid IBI. Some have even gone to the Town Hall and offered to pay it, yet were turned away, so in some areas Spain is not helping itself at all.
I don't think I'm being contradictory.
All expats wealthy or not are helping to keep Spain afloat. It is getting harder financially to live here, although those who are wealthy will hardly notice it, and absorb it.
Aron, I was interested to see you write that Spain is not your country. People often write about how they are a guest in Spain, and don't feel they should criticise their host country-well, if they are living here, paying out, and doing as they should, they should regard themselves as a tax paying resident, like any Spaniard, and feel free to say what they like.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> The fact that only about 5% of the population submitted the 720 shows how successful that was! Potential Disproportionate fines and great confusion even amongst accountants about what and how to declare worried people to the extent that they ended up not doing it at all, taking the risk of not being found out.
> There are people living in Spain who would maybe like to legalise their tax situation, but facing massive fines for past declarations they haven't made, or undeclared assets, they most certainly won't do so now.
> Some people refuse to pay taxes or declare assets here, so they deserve everything they get, but others have been given bad advice from "experts" or have been confused , and buried their heads in the sand about the subject. Obviously that is not an excuse, but if they want to put their tax matters straight now, it is very much a stick and not a carrot approach from the tax office.
> IBI collection is a disorganised mess where I live, and the council must be missing out on many thousands of euros, from those who have escrituras and have never paid IBI. Some have even gone to the Town Hall and offered to pay it, yet were turned away, so in some areas Spain is not helping itself at all.
> ...


Do you have evidence of these draconian fines you mention so often, though? I suspect that the reason so few immigrants report as they should is down to reluctance to pay tax due, not fear of fines.
I'd be interested too in your definition of 'wealth'. On the whole Brits here are not that wealthy. But there are people who came on a wing and a prayer, bought property they couldn't afford and burnt their bridges by selling up,in the UK....then came to live in a country they didn't really know with a language many don't speak.

As for immigrants 'keeping Spain afloat' ....Andalucia, the region with perhapsthe greatest number of immigrants has extremely high rates of joblessness, evictions and people living in poverty.

Our rubbish collection in the UK was crap too...much better in our village here.


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## el pescador (Mar 14, 2013)

A "FATCA" system will be in place soon (if not already) between a whole group of countries.
Spain and the UK included on the list.
So i think at some point if Spain do decide to clamp down hard there will be lots of 10k fines handed out.
So 1,900,000 x 10k.
Even if half left without paying thats a lot of money.


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

mrypg9 said:


> Do you have evidence of these draconian fines you mention so often, though? I suspect that the reason so few immigrants report as they should is down to reluctance to pay tax due, not fear of fines.
> I'd be interested too in your definition of 'wealth'. On the whole Brits here are not that wealthy. But there are people who came on a wing and a prayer, bought property they couldn't afford and burnt their bridges by selling up,in the UK....then came to live in a country they didn't really know with a language many don't speak.
> 
> As for immigrants 'keeping Spain afloat' ....Andalucia, the region with perhapsthe greatest number of immigrants has extremely high rates of joblessness, evictions and people living in poverty.
> ...


No evidence of draconian fines....yet, though someone wrote in the CBN that they received a fine for an undeclared post office account-it wasn't 10,000 euros as publicised though. You must have read about the fines that will be applied in certain circumstances? Are hey tmore than just a threat? 
Wealthy to me is having more than enough money either in savings or regular income, so that unexpected expenses can be met with no problem you, can buy luxuries without having to budget, you know there will always be enough to keep you comfortably, however much prices go up,whatever you choose to do or wherever you go will be affordable;some might call it comfortable, others would call it wealthy


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> No evidence of draconian fines....yet, though someone wrote in the CBN that they received a fine for an undeclared post office account-it wasn't 10,000 euros as publicised though. You must have read about the fines that will be applied in certain circumstances? Are hey tmore than just a threat?
> Wealthy to me is having more than enough money either in savings or regular income, so that unexpected expenses can be met with no problem you, can buy luxuries without having to budget, you know there will always be enough to keep you comfortably, however much prices go up,whatever you choose to do or wherever you go will be affordable;some might call it comfortable, others would call it wealthy


No, I have not read of fines...only of fears of fines.

And anyone who doesn't fit into your definition of 'wealth' really shouldn't be living out of their comfort zone and certainly not in a foreign country.
That isn't wealth, it's living within your means to suit your lifestyle.
A 'luxury' is what you consider it to be. My 'luxuries' are a regular supply of second- hand books from amazon.uk. Last week I treated myself to a boxed set of the complete series of 'Allo ' Allo....cost me €35 p and p included! That was a luxury to me.

Seriously, though, if I didn't have sufficient income to live in Spain at least as well as I did in the UK, if I had tobudget, if I didn't have enough money to keep up with prices or cope with unexpected events....there is NO WAY that I would have given a moment's thought to living in Spain or anywhere outside the UK. 
You don't need to be a millionaire to fit into those categories, do you...


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

el pescador said:


> A "FATCA" system will be in place soon (if not already) between a whole group of countries.
> Spain and the UK included on the list.
> So i think at some point if Spain do decide to clamp down hard there will be lots of 10k fines handed out.
> So 1,900,000 x 10k.
> Even if half left without paying thats a lot of money.


Yes, it is due to begin operating in 2015. That is when, IMO, the 720 declaration will come into its own. Really, in introducing it the Spanish Government has just been laying the groundwork. One automatic exchange of information begins, they will be able to identify those people with overseas assets who have not declared them, and then the "fun" will really start. Anyone who has chosen not to declare (and in the majority of cases, I believe that is because they have not been declaring all their worldwide income of whatever kind on their tax returns, as they should have been doing all along, that is nothing new) will only have themselves to blame.

Who knows, there may even be cross border arrangements in place to pursue those who leave without paying.

Spain, of course, is only one of many countries to have introduced similar reporting requirements, and some of them are even stricter than Spain's.


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

Lynn R said:


> Who knows, there may even be cross border arrangements in place to pursue those who leave without paying.


With in the EU I think they can already chase you down.

Plus if there is a court judgement most other countries will enforce it normally.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

NickZ said:


> With in the EU I think they can already chase you down.
> 
> Plus if there is a court judgement most other countries will enforce it normally.


Good, thanks for that!

I did see this week that HMRC have now been granted powers to take money for unpaid tax bills directly from people's bank accounts, if they have ignored other requests for payment.


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

extranjero said:


> The fact that only about 5% of the population submitted the 720 shows how successful that was! Potential Disproportionate fines and great confusion even amongst accountants about what and how to declare worried people to the extent that they ended up not doing it at all, taking the risk of not being found out.
> There are people living in Spain who would maybe like to legalise their tax situation, but facing massive fines for past declarations they haven't made, or undeclared assets, they most certainly won't do so now.
> Some people refuse to pay taxes or declare assets here, so they deserve everything they get, but others have been given bad advice from "experts" or have been confused , and buried their heads in the sand about the subject. Obviously that is not an excuse, but if they want to put their tax matters straight now, it is very much a stick and not a carrot approach from the tax office.
> IBI collection is a disorganised mess where I live, and the council must be missing out on many thousands of euros, from those who have escrituras and have never paid IBI. Some have even gone to the Town Hall and offered to pay it, yet were turned away, so in some areas Spain is not helping itself at all.
> ...


I was referring to my Spanish neighbours and the local people. We have English neighbours who complain about every little thing the locals do. Something's I don't likely either, but I don't moan about things people have done all their lives. Of course I have my say on government and the way people are treated. Before we left the UK, it was just before the general election. A very good friend of mine, who was an Asian immigrant, he said Britain had to change, it had never had true democracy. At that time I felt annoyed that he could just walk in and tell us what we could do. I won't do that, I am a guest in this country. I do pay my way because I benefit from living here
You mentioned a point on an earlier post, being wealthy means you have more than enough to live on, but how do you work that out. Wealth is not guaranteed to last if you have longevity. Inflation may be low, but it's higher than politicians make out. Money doesn't last forever. I can pay my way comfortably now, but will that still be the case in 20 years time, nobody knows if they have enough money.
Life in Spain for me is great. I know quite a few Brits who do nothing but gripe about their lives here. If I felt like that I'd just go home. Life is too short especially as you are getting older. I'm just going to see my doctor now. The surgery will be full of noisy people, but once you get used to it, there is a certain ambience of being able to converse with local people. Yes, some are poor, but I never hear them complain.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Anyone who doesn't enjoy their life in Spain or cannot afford to live here did not think carefully enough before they decided to settle here.

If you are unhappy here for whatever reason: go home, wherever that may be. Life is too short to be unhappy in a situation you are able to get out of.

Waiting around to get the price you want for your house might mean an awful long wait. Houses have no intrinsic value. The 'right' price for a house is what a buyer will pay for it. It's unlikely house prices will rise for years, if at all, as their value was ridiculously inflated.

We were unhappy in Prague. We left. But then we didn't tie ourselves down with property. We knew within two years we weren't there to stay. Yet some people buy property in Spain when they may never have spent longer than two or three weeks of holidays there and really know very little if anything of the country's language, history or customs.


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## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

Both my wife and I come from Military families. We were both moved around as children and never grew roots or cultivated long term friendships. I was at Boarding School from 5 to 16 years of age.
For us, this is the longest time we have ever stayed anywhere. Life is never perfect and you have to "make do" with a lot of stuff which you may prefer did not happen. Life IS a compromise and for us this country will do nicely for the foreseeable future. We often say ..What would we dodifferent if we won the lottery? One of the things we wouldn't do is give up our happy life in Spain ( even tho' we do struggle with the language...for those posters elsewhere on this forum ).


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## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

There was another line to my posting above but it has not appeared and the "Edit" facility seems to have gone too, so here is the last line again"

We are Tax resident in Spain, we have an Accountant who earns his keep and does all our returns. We do not worry about forms and new legislations. We sleep well and know that our affairs are in good hands...where's the problem?"


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

country boy said:


> There was another line to my posting above but it has not appeared and the "Edit" facility seems to have gone too, so here is the last line again"
> 
> We are Tax resident in Spain, we have an Accountant who earns his keep and does all our returns. We do not worry about forms and new legislations. We sleep well and know that our affairs are in good hands...where's the problem?"


Don't be too complacent. I looked at a copy of my 720 submission and it was full of errors, 2 major ones. I knew that I had given accurate information. As you are held responsible for what your accountant submits, it pays to check!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> Don't be too complacent. I looked at a copy of my 720 submission and it was full of errors, 2 major ones. I knew that I had given accurate information. As you are held responsible for what your accountant submits, it pays to check!


So you narrowly escaped being lined up and shot...or at the very least sitting in prison for ten years...

I'm sure Countryboy does all that needs to be done so he can enjoy a worry-free life here in Spain, like the rest of us/

HMRC are claimimg I owe tax but it's not so...and entirely due to an error on their part.
I have written three letters pointing this out but they have been ignored and the fine I have had imposed is steadily mounting.
And I'm not losing a wink of sleep....


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

extranjero said:


> Don't be too complacent. I looked at a copy of my 720 submission and it was full of errors, 2 major ones. I knew that I had given accurate information. As you are held responsible for what your accountant submits, it pays to check!


The reason they want accuracy is because you are doing all the work for their data base. Nobody is inputting your information, you are doing everything necessary to update the data base. Everything your gestor does or you through the Internet is to give the tax man a point of reference to check anything if they feel that is necessary.. They haven't the staff or the time to check every little detail. All you can do is your best, they know that. How many human beings do you know who get everything right 100%, not many as I recall!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> Don't be too complacent. I looked at a copy of my 720 submission and it was full of errors, 2 major ones. I knew that I had given accurate information. As you are held responsible for what your accountant submits, it pays to check!


I know that not everybody here in Spain is as content as the majority of us are. Sometimes the unhappiness is due to mischance, more often than not I suspect is down to poor planning and 'dreams' beyond the means of accomplishing them.

You've said you would be happy to leave if you could dispose of your property at a price you would be able to accept. I understand that must be an unsatisfactory position to be in.

I'm sure I'm wrong but judging by your posts you seem bent on spreading your unhappiness around to peoplewhose situation is entirely other than yours.

I repeat: most of us are very content with our lives here. We do not trouble ourselves with worries and fears about hacienda, rising prices, modelo 720, poor rubbish collection and so on. We are happily enjoying the culture, climate and human warmth of this lovely country I for one am thankful to be able to spend the rest of my days in.

My partner and I are not wealthy although certainly not poor....we can afford to live here without watching every euro, without worries about unexpected events or the rising cost of living. But that's how we lived in the UK....and if we hadn't lived like that in the UK we wouldn't have moved to Prague, Spain or anywhere as we didn't move to downsize. We moved for a different style of life, not a cheaper one.

If I had property here and was that unhappy I'd cut my losses, take the first offer and go somewhere I felt comfortable. Life is far too short to spend it where you don't want to be.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

mrypg9 said:


> I'm sure I'm wrong but judging by your posts you seem bent on spreading your unhappiness around to people whose situation is entirely other than yours.


I've noticed that too, it does get a bit wearing.

People need to be aware of the issues that might affect them, but it's not such a minefield really, and for most people the positive aspects of living in Spain far outweigh the negative ones.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Alcalaina said:


> I've noticed that too, it does get a bit wearing.
> 
> People need to be aware of the issues that might affect them, but it's not such a minefield really, and for most people the positive aspects of living in Spain far outweigh the negative ones.


Indeed! 

And if anyone is under the illusion that bureaucracy is so much better 'back home'.....
In early December I wrote to the Overseas Pension Department of the DWP in Newcastle querying the amount of SRP I was receiving. Both OH and I get the basic rate but hers differs from mine.
As I had not received a reply by the beginning of March I sent an e-mail - we are told that a reply will be received within ten days.
Again no reply. 
One more e-mail sent, reply came asking for 'more information' although I had given this in my letter ad previous e-mail.
Almost three weeks later and no reply I rang this afternoon. It took eight minutes before I was put through..not bad, I suppose.
Anyway, to cut a long story short, it seems I may be owed over £800, perhaps more, going back over six years. The Pensions Service is dealing with a backlog of queries dating back to December....and it seems I am unlikely to receive payment owed until June at the earliest.
*This is the result of the Con-Dem cuts to public services.*
I'm lucky. I have other income. I haven't and won't starve. But not everyone is so fortunate. Some people, not only OAPs, live from week to week, day to day even.
That's one glimpse into the reality of today's Britain and how just one public service has been affected by the cuts.
I'm sure that education, care for the elderly,the NHS and other services are suffering too.
Very short-sighted policies, if I may say so. Cutting jobs, putting people on the dole and providing poor quality public services.
Pathetic.


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