# Melbourne December 2014….The story so far



## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

Hi all,

As I received a lot of help from this forum, when I was applying for my visa, especially _Shel. I thought I would share my experiences so far since I arrived on 1st December 2014


To MARA agent or not to MARA agent


Personally I did it myself rather than go through an agent. I spoke to a couple of people at the IELTS who had paid an agent, and ended up wishing they hadn’t.

If you have a ‘straight’ forward application then personally I would say do it yourself. The Australian points system, should make it easy to tell if you meet the requirements for PR or not, it’s not like the US where it’s a big vague and there isn’t a definite set of criteria.

From what I’ve been told, even with a MARA agent, you still have to do all the form filling yourself, as obviously they won’t know your family history.

Also going back to when I originally applied, one of the biggest issues I found with the people using a MARA agent was the fact that they themselves were not in control. As an example, I could check the status of my application whenever I felt like it, I didn’t have to wait for someone else to check it for me.

Having said all that, if you are not sure if you meet the criteria, are in a bit of grey area, or have a complicated medical history then a MARA agent may well be the way to go.


Accommodation 


I booked a serviced apartment for two weeks for when arrived; since I arrived I have found out that booking something through airbnb would have probably been just as good and cheaper.

The one piece of advice I can give, is don’t book anything long term from overseas….Almost every place I looked at was nothing like the photos.

The other thing to be wary of is that I assumed that all places came with internet, they don’t and obviously it’s quite important for job hunting.


Job Hunting


Job hunting tends to the area that concerns most people, and understandably so.
First off, I’ll say I work in IT as a .NET developer, so if you are from another discipline then this may not be relevant to you. 

If you are working in IT then having a decent laptop loaded with all the things you need and any development tools ready to go is must! Every interview I’ve had has started off with some form of technical test; Either a do this application type test or an online technical test.

The single most import thing I have found, is on your resume clearly state what kind of visa you are on for example on mine straight after my name and contact details I put ‘Permanent Resident Visa (Subclass 189)’

A couple of recruitment agents didn’t bother to contact me, until I updated my resume with this information. If they do contact you, it’s the first question they will ask.

I actually started my job hunting back in March, when I had originally planned to move over but I didn’t.

Until you’ve actually got a firm date for you to move over, you can’t really job hunt but you can start introducing yourself to recruiters.

Look for available jobs in your line of work, in the details you will find a couple of things, at the very least the name of the recruiter, and the recruitment company.
From this and either through good guess work or via LinkedIn, you can normally work out the person’s email address or if you are really lucky some will clearly state their email address in the job details.

Send them an email introducing yourself, stating what visa you have got, your line of work, and your anticipated arrival date etc.

From those you get a reply from (I got about a 50% - 70% success rate) offer to give them a call and have a general chat (I used skype and it worked out extremely cheap)

Once you’ve got your actual arrival date, send them another email including to those who didn’t original reply (I’ve always replied to my original email or to their reply, so they have an instant trace of the conversation)

Finally do the same again, about a month before you are due to arrive, including an updated resume.

Again for those who reply, offer to phone them and go through any roles that they may have available.

Through this approach, I’d have two interviews lined up before I’d even landed in the country. 

General Job Hunting Tips


Do not sound desperate as if you’ll take any job that is offered, the recruiter and the company want to know that you are interested in their job and their company, not just because it’s a job.

Don’t hound the recruiter for follow up information; in my experience it’s the company rather than the recruitment agent that is slow respond.

However if you are desperate for any information, you can just send them an email to let them know you have an interview elsewhere, though obviously you can’t do this too often.

Unless you definitively know what your salary should be, be honest and say you don’t know, which I suspect will be the case for most of us coming from a different country. A recruitment agent’s commission is based on your salary, so it’s in their interest to get you the best salary possible.

I found that this approach also works quite well, when talking to direct recruits….For the most part they are aware that if they don’t pay you the market rate, then you will find out soon enough and look to leave at that point.

Don’t panic if an interview does not go well…I completely and utterly messed up my first interview when I got here. When you get back from the interview, go through what you’ve written down and what you can remember. Anything you know you messed up…have a google. I spent the week after my first interview going through stuff I’d learnt from that interview.

And the final thing I will say, is….I start my first job tomorrow 

Apologies for typos, or missed out words, this has turned into a bit of an essay, but hopefully it will help someone, somewhere.

Cheers

James


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## thunderbird350 (Apr 23, 2014)

Thanks James
Congrats and Wish you success in your new job.
One query : Did they ask for local reference during your job hunt.

Me and my wife are moving to Sydney in mid March.
We are planning to start our job hunt from Sydney.
Both are from IT and in Oracle, pl/sql.


Thanks
Sanjay


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## echkay (Sep 23, 2012)

Thanks for the informative post. Good luck for the new job!


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## louisam (Apr 20, 2012)

Congrats James..
Glad that you posted your experience. I am sure it is a moral booster for many migrants who are out there searching for job...


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## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

thunderbird350 said:


> Thanks James
> Congrats and Wish you success in your new job.
> One query : Did they ask for local reference during your job hunt.
> 
> ...


Hi Sanjay,

No they didn't. 
I made it perfectly clear that I had no local experience, which wasn't a problem....or at least not in my case. 

Come to think of it, they didn't ask for any references. If they do I suspect the references for the ACS should be enough.

Cheers

James


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

jpspringall said:


> Hi all,
> 
> As I received a lot of help from this forum, when I was applying for my visa, especially _Shel. I thought I would share my experiences so far since I arrived on 1st December 2014
> 
> ...


Could you please elaborate a bit on the technical interview? I'm a .NET developer too, and until now I have been hearing a LOT of people say that most companies in Australia don't focus too much on technical aspects, and prefer to conduct interviews which judge interpersonal and behavioral skills. What kind of app were you asked to develop, and how much time were you given? And what was the difficulty level of these technical tests?

Kindly go into a bit of detail about these aspects. Planning to move within a couple of months at the most, so your inputs would be greatly appreciated.


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## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

Hi all,

I really don't want this to come over as negative, but I also want to give a true reflection of how i'm findings things over here.

Basically the job that I got that I mentioned earlier wasn't what it was supposed to be. I'm not going to mention any names, but there are certain companies that will take advantage that we are 'Fresh of the boat' and relatively naive, and possibly badly in need of a job and therefore take advantage of the fact. So if something doesn't feel right in the interview beware.

Having said all that, I've now got a job where I look forward to going to work in the morning 

Cheers

James


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## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

Hi Funky,

I've attached two of the technical tests that I did, so you can see for yourself.

There was no actual time limit, but they generally said between 2 & 4 hours.

They weren't actually bothered about seeing the final solution working, more your thought process, and how you structured your solution.

With regards to judge interpersonal and behavioural skills, yes they are important. Generally speaking lots of people can do the technical tests, but for example can't communicate effectively and it makes no difference how good you are technically, if you do understand what is being asked of you, or you can't explain yourself clearly.

It also depends on what level role you are going for. If you are a mid level developer then interpersonal skills are probably less important if you are going for a senior role.

If you are mid level, then it's likely you will just be told what to do, whereas if you are more senior, you may well be expected to interact with the business etc, where obviously interpersonal skills are far more important.

Cheers

James


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

jpspringall said:


> Hi Funky,
> 
> I've attached two of the technical tests that I did, so you can see for yourself.
> 
> ...


Thank you so much! You have no idea how much you have helped me! Please do clarify a couple more queries, if possible.
1) So were these tests online? That is, you had to develop the solutions and email it to them? 
2) What was your level of expertise and experience while you initially applied for jobs? I currently have around 4 years and 9 months of professional experience, so I guess I can be considered 'mid-level'.


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## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

funkyzoom said:


> Thank you so much! You have no idea how much you have helped me! Please do clarify a couple more queries, if possible.
> 1) So were these tests online? That is, you had to develop the solutions and email it to them?
> 2) What was your level of expertise and experience while you initially applied for jobs? I currently have around 4 years and 9 months of professional experience, so I guess I can be considered 'mid-level'.


No, the tests that I sent you were off line tests, in that you did the 'work' on your computer, and the emailed them your project complete with explanation.

I did do a couple of on line tests, but these were more multiple choice questions rather than actual coding.

I would say that with ~ 4.5 years experience you are probably mid-level, but it all depends on what the Job Spec says (or Position Description (PD) as it's called over here)

I guess to work out where you are on the scale, ask yourself the following question:

If someone presented you with a solution to code, and you thought it was wrong, would you feel comfortable explaining why you thought it was it wrong and what may be a better solution?

When and were are you moving to? If you're moving to Melbourne I may be to help with some recruitment contacts. I doubt my place of work will have much to offer unless you have sitecore experience?

Cheers

James


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## siva19 (Jan 21, 2014)

jpspringall said:


> No, the tests that I sent you were off line tests, in that you did the 'work' on your computer, and the emailed them your project complete with explanation.
> 
> I did do a couple of on line tests, but these were more multiple choice questions rather than actual coding.
> 
> ...


Hi jpspringall,

Any idea about networking support job field. (What level / depth of knowledge they will expect , etc ?)

Thanks,
Sivaraj R


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## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

Sorry mate,

That's not my area of expertise and I wouldn't want to give any false advices or guesses.

Cheers

James


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## nicemathan (May 29, 2013)

Any insights on IT Service Management roles aligned to ITIL. More into service design and service transition.

Does relevant certifications (Like ITIL Expert; ACP; PMP) in this area helps, along with experience.


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## skksundar (Apr 29, 2014)

nicemathan said:


> Any insights on IT Service Management roles aligned to ITIL. More into service design and service transition.
> 
> Does relevant certifications (Like ITIL Expert; ACP; PMP) in this area helps, along with experience.


Mathan,
Theses certifications do help if you have gained related experience after giving them! If you are planning to undergo, suggest you to first 
check and see for yourself how much employers respond once you apply using linkedin.

All the very best!!


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## tom_arg (Apr 6, 2015)

jpspringall said:


> When and were are you moving to? If you're moving to Melbourne I may be to help with some recruitment contacts. I doubt my place of work will have much to offer unless you have sitecore experience?


Hi James,

I'm new to the forum. Your posts regarding your experience were very helpful .

I am moving to Australia with my wife around June 2015, and we are waiting for our 189 visa grant (should be in the next weeks). I have experience as Software engineer and .Net software developer and we are planning to live in Melbourne.

I'd appreciate if you could send some recruitment contacts in order to start my job hunt.

Thanks,

Tom


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

jpspringall said:


> No, the tests that I sent you were off line tests, in that you did the 'work' on your computer, and the emailed them your project complete with explanation.
> 
> I did do a couple of on line tests, but these were more multiple choice questions rather than actual coding.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the detailed post!

I'm almost certain to be moving around the second week of May, but I'm still undecided between Melbourne and Sydney. My first choice would be Melbourne, but the job opportunities seem to be much better in Sydney. But of course I'd definitely appreciate it if you could help me out with some recruitment contacts. 

As for your question...I suppose I can latch on to most mistakes in code, except for really subtle ones. I haven't worked on sitecore at all. My profile is quite strange, though. I have worked on a wide array of .NET technologies, and currently hold 12 Microsoft certifications (which are all active). But I work in a start-up, so almost all the projects I have been involved in, are small or mid-szie. My areas of expertise are Web applications (ASP.NET, MVC) and Windows Applications (WPF, Windows Forms) but I have also worked on Silverlight, Azure and Windows Phone projects. 

Considering these aspects, what do you suppose are my chances of landing a job in Melbourne? I have no preferences at all regarding the nature of the job (such as permanent, contract etc.) or the pay, for my first job.


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## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

funkyzoom said:


> Thanks for the detailed post!
> 
> I'm almost certain to be moving around the second week of May, but I'm still undecided between Melbourne and Sydney. My first choice would be Melbourne, but the job opportunities seem to be much better in Sydney. But of course I'd definitely appreciate it if you could help me out with some recruitment contacts.
> 
> ...


Hi,

I can't really comment on the job market in Sydney, but i haven't found it too difficult to find a job in Melbourne, though i know some people have struggled. I guess it's luck of the draw!

So personally I would go for the city you would most prefer.

Cheers

James


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## Ben-HH (Jan 8, 2015)

jpspringall said:


> Job Hunting
> 
> 
> Job hunting tends to the area that concerns most people, and understandably so.
> ...


Hi James

Many thanks for your insight to the Aussie Job market. Quick question... How did you do your job hunt? 
I understood you contacted recruiters. Did you also apply for jobs at Seek? I hear so many mixed things about Seek and I am trying to get my head around whethe rit is worth the time and effort to apply for these jobs. Ther are quite a few jobs ads for my field but some sound to good to be true and others a bit strange.

I just started Job hunt a few days ago and so far only using my existing network but I am sure that I have to expand my hunt soon.

Cheers mate.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

jpspringall said:


> Hi,
> 
> I can't really comment on the job market in Sydney, but i haven't found it too difficult to find a job in Melbourne, though i know some people have struggled. I guess it's luck of the draw!
> 
> ...


Thanks a lot! So I suppose I'll zero in on Melbourne, after having one final discussion about it with my friend in Melbourne.


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## nicemathan (May 29, 2013)

Hey buddy welcome to the Melbourne heading Tribe 

FYI - I didnt get my grant yet 



funkyzoom said:


> Thanks a lot! So I suppose I'll zero in on Melbourne, after having one final discussion about it with my friend in Melbourne.


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## funkyzoom (Nov 4, 2014)

nicemathan said:


> Hey buddy welcome to the Melbourne heading Tribe
> 
> FYI - I didnt get my grant yet


Don't worry! Some people who have lodged their applications on Feb 13th too haven't got grants yet.


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## rameshkd (Aug 26, 2011)

nicemathan said:


> Hey buddy welcome to the Melbourne heading Tribe
> 
> FYI - I didnt get my grant yet


Count me in. Melbourne it is just waiting for the grant to start planning.


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## sendtokkk (Jan 5, 2015)

U hav ny idea abt job prospects for Finance professionals(Equity research,Wealth Management,Portfolio Management)? (Not Accounting)


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## sanjaynair (Jun 8, 2014)

Congrats James. Good luck with the new job


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## anil1176 (Mar 4, 2015)

jpspringall said:


> Hi all,
> 
> As I received a lot of help from this forum, when I was applying for my visa, especially _Shel. I thought I would share my experiences so far since I arrived on 1st December 2014
> 
> ...


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## nicemathan (May 29, 2013)

Yeah thats correct.



funkyzoom said:


> Don't worry! Some people who have lodged their applications on Feb 13th too haven't got grants yet.


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## nicemathan (May 29, 2013)

Welcome aboard !



rameshkd said:


> Count me in. Melbourne it is just waiting for the grant to start planning.


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## skksundar (Apr 29, 2014)

Guys,

I am kicking off from Chennai to Melbourne on 1st of June 2015. Not bringing the family and planning to stay at my Brother's place for initial times and will move once I find a job which am hoping to get even before I start!! All the very best, meet you all up there.

Thanks.


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## nicemathan (May 29, 2013)

All the very best Sundar. 

Do keep us posted on airlines and further experiences from Oz.

Most people stay till they get grant and vanish. Its better start networking from here itself.

You are from TN



skksundar said:


> Guys,
> 
> I am kicking off from Chennai to Melbourne on 1st of June 2015. Not bringing the family and planning to stay at my Brother's place for initial times and will move once I find a job which am hoping to get even before I start!! All the very best, meet you all up there.
> 
> Thanks.


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## amber1993 (Sep 25, 2016)

Hi james, thanks for such useful tips. i have arrived in Melbourne and looking for a job right now. i have a query regarding the job hunting process.

1) Did you call up recruiters when you arrived here or emails were your main form of communication? also, how did you approach recruiters through email? can you email me a sample please, if possible? I have been trying to contact recruiters through calls , LinkedIn and emails both but have not got any positive reply yet. thanks



jpspringall said:


> No, the tests that I sent you were off line tests, in that you did the 'work' on your computer, and the emailed them your project complete with explanation.
> 
> I did do a couple of on line tests, but these were more multiple choice questions rather than actual coding.
> 
> ...


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## jpspringall (Dec 19, 2013)

Hi,

Most of initial communication was through email.

I have just tried to send a sample letter, however I don't think you can receive private messages yet.

Cheers

James


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