# Relo steps before Brexit



## robertodominicus (Jul 10, 2020)

Hi folks,

Firstly, thanks for such a great forum - I've learned a lot from all your contributions!!

Like many first posters, I'm trying to get my head around the steps to relocate from the UK and understand what needs to be done first to make it all work (or work best).

I'm planning to relocate and apply for residency before 31 Dec. I will have a Spanish work contract, and from previously living in Spain I already have an NIE (which I'm hoping is still valid - it was donkey's years ago). What I'm trying to resolve is the catch 22 scenarios around opening bank accounts, rental contracts, and residency!

To apply for a residential bank account you need an address, but what do you need to get a 12-month rental agreement? Do you typically need you to do a credit check, provide bank statements or show proof of income?

And on the residential bank account, I would like to open a "cheap/free" nomina account (thanks for the threads on those), but most appear to need a passport, NIE, work contract, and rental agreement (see the catch 22). I like the look of ING, but they need the EU residence certificate, which based on the possible length of the TIE process could take a while (and will be a TIE).

I had the EX18 application process down, then TIE for Brits came along! But now I think I've got the TIE process all figured out (step 1 make extranjeria application with EX20 etc, step 2 get success notification, step 3 get card from police with EX23)

When I did it twenty years ago I just bowled up, but then I didn't have a job so didn't need a bank account to get paid into!

Thanks in advance.

Best

Roberto D


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

Hi,

I'll give you some short answers to most of your queries:

Your NIE will still be valid as it lasts forever.

You can't open a residential bank account until you are a resident! You need to open a non residents bank account first.

You don't need to prove that you have an income to get a rental contract nor provide bank statements. A landlord may require you to pay your rent and utility bills through a Spanish bank and need your bank account details.

When you have a rental contract, a bank account with 3 months of income to satisfy the authorities that you won't become a burden on the state and prove you have full healthcare you then apply for residency. 

When you achieve residency you can then change your non residents bank account into a resident account.

Steve


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## yevlondon (Jul 8, 2020)

hi tebo. this is the part i never understood - about 3 months of bank statements. if an EU, or UK person plans to live in Spain for more than 3 months they must register. i assume before the 3 months are over. that is my understanding. how would i have 3 months of bank account statements if i need to get TIE before 3 months is over?

where did this 3 months of bank statements come from at all? any idea? i couldnt find any official justification for this.


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## yevlondon (Jul 8, 2020)

here is from Gov.uk Living in Spain page:

"As an EU citizen you must register as a resident *if you plan on living in Spain for more than 3 months."*

so if you PLAN to live more than 3 months you must register. 
to me this sounds like you can (and probably should) register within 3 months from arrival. but then you will not have 3 months of bank statements.


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

It's all down to pre-planning. Before I moved here 6 years ago (it still had the same rules then) i opened a non residents bank account 6 months before while I was on holiday. I then put regular monthly income amounts into that bank and named the income as "pension" and that was acceptable to the authorities. After I got residency I changed the account to residents bank account and used the saved money to settle here.

Steve


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## yevlondon (Jul 8, 2020)

thanks for the response but still.... the 3 months bank statements rule just seems illogical to me and does not agree with "if you plan to stay for more than 3 months you must register".


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Some extranjerias accept money in foreign banks, with sworn translation. This is the case in Málaga.


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

yevlondon said:


> thanks for the response but still.... the 3 months bank statements rule just seems illogical to me and does not agree with "if you plan to stay for more than 3 months you must register".


That is the requirements, like it or not.

Steve


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## yevlondon (Jul 8, 2020)

can you link to anything that says so? that would be very helpful


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## yevlondon (Jul 8, 2020)

Joppa said:


> Some extranjerias accept money in foreign banks, with sworn translation. This is the case in Málaga.


i was planning to open account in SPain and put 7,000eur there. that requirement i saw and it is clear. it's the 3-months part that seems strange to me.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Requirements vary hugely between provinces and individual offices (some say even among the staff). All you can do is to contact the office you are applying at by email (in Spanish) or get in touch with a local gestor (advice is usually free).


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

yevlondon said:


> can you link to anything that says so? that would be very helpful


https://www.healthplanspain.com/blog/expat-tips/115-residencia-applying-for-residency-in-spain.html

Look at the section "proof of income"

https://www.spanishsolutions.net/blog/legal-issues-in-spain/how-to-get-a-spanish-residency-card

Plenty of information here to in the working in Spain section 

You will also need proof of full healthcare for your application. 

After living in Spain for 183 days you will automatically become tax resident and be expected to pay taxes to the Spanish tax office. 

You will be required to fill in Modelo 720 and declare all your income, bank account details and balances and any property owned and value.

You need to do more research. 

Steve


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

www.spanishsolutions.net 

on the FAQ:
in answer to income requirements :

For the purpose of residencia, you will need a Spanish bank account, the Foreign Office will ask for 3 months bank statements, in your name to prove you live in Spain.

Steve


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

tebo53 said:


> www.spanishsolutions.net
> 
> on the FAQ:
> in answer to income requirements :
> ...


This isn't so at every extranjeria. Some accept statement of bank account outside Spain, such as sterling account in UK with translation.


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

Joppa said:


> This isn't so at every extranjeria. Some accept statement of bank account outside Spain, such as sterling account in UK with translation.


That maybe the case with some but they will need translation and stamping by a gestor at considerable cost and then might not be accepted. Is it worth that risk.

The OP needs to contact the extranjera to ask them the requirements. He does not want to believe the explanation I've given to his queries. 

Steve


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## yevlondon (Jul 8, 2020)

tebo53 said:


> https://www.healthplanspain.com/blog/expat-tips/115-residencia-applying-for-residency-in-spain.html
> 
> Look at the section "proof of income"
> 
> ...


thank you for the links. although i do not understand the aggression.
this IS my research. and i have been reading stuff online for months now. i am well aware of health insurance requirement. but this particular bit (3 months) struck me as strange and i am asking you - people who went through this - about it. there is really no need to get testy.

and even reading links you posted - some say "you MAY need" 3 months of statements. comparing with other forums info and with replies from Joppa it seems that 3 months rule is a common (but not universal) interpretation of the rules by spanish bureaucrats, but may depend on locality. 

seems like a catch 22 though - must register within 3 months but have to show 3 months of statements. that was all i was saying.


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## MataMata (Nov 30, 2008)

yevlondon said:


> hi tebo. this is the part i never understood - about 3 months of bank statements. if an EU, or UK person plans to live in Spain for more than 3 months they must register. i assume before the 3 months are over. that is my understanding. how would i have 3 months of bank account statements if i need to get TIE before 3 months is over?
> 
> where did this 3 months of bank statements come from at all? any idea? i couldnt find any official justification for this.


I have a theory on that. 

Pre Brex****e it it was easy (too easy!) to stay for 3 months and more before applying for residence giving you time to establish a satisfactory pattern of income. 

It's only now with time running out that it's starting to become an issue and I think that's why they are looking for 3 months income OR savings, variously quoted as either €7 or €8000, a figure loosely based on the Spanish minimum income (IPREM) which for 2020 is approximately €7500/pa which in turn broadly equates to an income of €700/mth. 

As a footnote the post Dec 31st.income requirements are based on IPREM but then it becomes 4x IPREM for the first person and 1x IPREM for each additional family member which for a couple results in a figure of around €37,000.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

It isn't a REQUIREMENT that the money is in a Spanish bank acount at all - though that makes things easier. 
Neither is it a REQUIREMENT that said money is in the account for three months before you register - though some extranjerías will ask for that & again, it can make everything easier..

tebo53 I'd be interested to see some official - meaning Spanish government - links, stating those requirements - not just blogs or comapnies selling services.


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

I cannot supply official links to any Spanish authorities to back up my statements. But this is what generally happens at ground level:

The information I've passed on to the OP tends to be the "norm" (in the Valencia region) and that he is more likely to be asked for (and be able to supply) bank statements with 3 months income of an amount necessary to suit the officer dealing with the residency application. 

From past experience of myself and others on applying for residency, in my case 6 years ago I was asked for and had to supply 3 months bank statements which had to be stamped and signed by the bank, which needed to show a regular income. Also an official letter from the same bank to confirm that the statements were in fact true.

When I applied for permanent residency after living here for 5 years I had to again get statements from the bank but this time covering 3 YEARS of income and again a letter from a bank official.

With time running short to make residency applications the OP doesn't want to be in a position where required paperwork (As maybe expected by a particular office, or clerk) isn't available and therefore another appointment be necessary. 

Oh yes, and make loads of photocopies of everything!!

Steve


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

MataMata said:


> As a footnote the post Dec 31st.income requirements are based on IPREM but then it becomes 4x IPREM for the first person and 1x IPREM for each additional family member which for a couple results in a figure of around €37,000.


A few days ago you said in another thread that the figure was around €36,000.

The current figures for 2020 are actually €32,270 for a couple (€25,816 for a single applicant and €6,454 for each additional family member).


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## robertodominicus (Jul 10, 2020)

Many thanks for the info folks!


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## trotter58 (Feb 8, 2017)

tebo53 said:


> www.spanishsolutions.net
> 
> on the FAQ:
> in answer to income requirements :
> ...


Steve, are you sure you need 3 months statements? It's not clear from the blog on the same site which suggests that you need 3 months statements only if you have no lump some and need to show a regular income from your state pension .....

*If you are not retired or not EU worker*
If you are not re*tired or you are not work*ing in the EU you will need:

health insurance policy with FULL cover
*Proof that you have 8,000€ per person in a Spanish bank account*
Photograph Passport size
Passport
Padron less than 3 months old.

However, 
*If you are retired or EU worker*
If you are re*tired or you work in the EU you will need:

Form S1 (for UK), E121 (for Belgian clients and some other countries) or E106 stamped by the authorities in their country (this is for contracted workers abroad): original plus a copy.
Pension letter
*Last 3 month of Bank Statement that the pension is paid
If the pension is paid in Spain, a bank statement with proof of payment*

https://www.spanishsolutions.net/blog/legal-paperwork/spanish-residency/how-to-get-a-spanish-residency-card/

***Edit - sorry, just seen other comments. Would be good to get official links rather than a blog from a company keen to do business.***


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

trotter58 said:


> Steve, are you sure you need 3 months statements? It's not clear from the blog on the same site which suggests that you need 3 months statements only if you have no lump some and need to show a regular income from your state pension .....
> 
> *If you are not retired or not EU worker*
> If you are not re*tired or you are not work*ing in the EU you will need:
> ...




I can only reiterate my comments at #19....

I had a very large lump sum in my Barclays bank account in the UK (Proceeds from the house sale, 2 cars, 1 motorbike and monies from house clearance and savings) when I came to live in Spain with a suitcase and nothing else. But I'd got a Spanish non residents bank account which is been transferring money to every month for 6 months for the very reason of gaining residency. (I'd done my homework and was told the process regarding proof of income)

The Official dealing with the residency application wasn't interested in the Barclays bank account in the UK no matter how much was in there. My solicitor also argued the point to no avail. 

My final arguments here on this subject is as I've laid out on post #19. You make your own choice of how you present your paperwork but if residency is denied because of the proof of income requirements is not to their liking you only have yourself to blame. 

Steve


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## yevlondon (Jul 8, 2020)

trotter58 said:


> Steve, are you sure you need 3 months statements? It's not clear from the blog on the same site which suggests that you need 3 months statements only if you have no lump some and need to show a regular income from your state pension .....
> 
> *If you are not retired or not EU worker*
> If you are not re*tired or you are not work*ing in the EU you will need:
> ...


hi there. i asked a friend who did applied for EU residency card 2 years ago in Barcelona (on basis of sufficient funds). he said he only needed to show enough BALANCE. not for 3 months. screenshot of official document is below.
i do realise other local administrators may interpret the rules differently, and they may have changed since 2018. but at least this one is official guidance used in an actual case i could find.


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## robertodominicus (Jul 10, 2020)

My understanding of the BOE text, is that it outlines four scenarios and requirements:

3. a) UK citizen has an EU residence card, but has been in Spain for less than 5 years:

Application for TIE at local police
Complete EX23 form - passport, address, contacts, residence/work status
Provide a valid passport
Submit payment for the procedure with form 790, code 012. Note this form does not check if your bank account has sufficient funds. It is a form for the application itself.
A photo

b) Has residence card and has been in Spain for more than 5 years:

Same as 3a

c) Has permanent residence:

Same as 3a

d) UK citizen is not registered in Spain. The BOE says for UK citizens registering after 6 July 2020, this should be done within 3 months of arriving in Spain

FIRST STEP, application for residence at the local Extraneria office, in the province where they live, or intend to live
Complete EX20 form
Provide a valid passport
Approved/supporting documentation - it is not clear what is required here*
Documentation as per the EU residency. This is described below** 
SECOND STEP, once the first step is approved, application for TIE at local police
Complete EX23 form
Provide a valid passport
Submit payment for the procedure with form 790, code 012. Note this form does not check if your bank account has sufficient funds. It is a form for the application itself.
A photo

*The documentation for this requirement is not specified, and the wording is quite vague.

**The documentation for EU residency is as per before. If a person is:

Working for a company, they need a contract, and/or to show registration in Social Security system
Self employed, they need to show registration as such, and/or to show registration in Social Security system
Not work, must show they have sufficient funds for themselves and family, plus healthcare cover (either private or via S1). Here you need to provide proof of funds.

For scenario d), it doesn't seem feasible to have three months proof of salary or bank statements, if you have to apply WITHIN three months of arrival.

However, this might be needed in scenarios a), b) and c), and would seem reasonable if you are not working.


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## Keithtoon (May 7, 2015)

tebo53 said:


> I can only reiterate my comments at #19....
> 
> I had a
> """"very large lump sum in my Barclays bank account in the UK (Proceeds from the house sale"""""
> ...


Hi Tebo.

"very large lump sum in my Barclays bank account in the UK (Proceeds from the house sale"

My efforts at the moment is to get residency before 31DEC. A 3/6 month rental contract, also full Health Insurance. To then come back to UK to sell house. In the ideal world we would have a balance of £300000. I believe I can use this money, the bulk to buy a property in Spain and not incur CGT?
On the proceeds of your House sale did you get hit with CGT?
Hope I am ok to ask these personnel questions! TIA Keith


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Keithtoon said:


> My efforts at the moment is to get residency before 31DEC. A 3/6 month rental contract, also full Health Insurance. To then come back to UK to sell house. In the ideal world we would have a balance of £300000. I believe I can use this money, the bulk to buy a property in Spain and not incur CGT?
> On the proceeds of your House sale did you get hit with CGT?


You have two years after the sale to spend on a Spanish property to mitigate the effect of CGT.


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## Keithtoon (May 7, 2015)

Joppa said:


> You have two years after the sale to spend on a Spanish property to mitigate the effect of CGT.


thank you Joppa,
Just spoke to a Gestor he has also hit me with the news you MUST have a 12 month rental contract, to apply for Residency. Was under the idea 3/6 months would give us Residency! Grrrrrrr bloody BrexiT!


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Keithtoon said:


> Just spoke to a Gestor he has also hit me with the news you MUST have a 12 month rental contract, to apply for Residency. Was under the idea 3/6 months would give us Residency!


The rules haven't changed since the Royal Decree of 2012, and nowhere does it state how long your rental contract should be. Longer the better, yes, but nothing is laid down about the minimum duration. Your gestor may be talking from his own experience at a particular extranjería or police station, but it's not a nationally enforced rule.


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