# Sat Nav question



## lovethesun (Oct 19, 2010)

I have just read this online, it was a newspaper article dated 2009 but what happened, it is still legal to use one isn't it? 
Spain’s Congress of Deputies last Wednesday gave approval to a measure that makes it a crime to use a GPS (a.k.a. satellite navigation) device while behind the wheel.

Anyway presuming it is legal I need some advise, I have done a search first on here but can't find what I need to know. I want to buy a sat nav and was deciding between TomTom and Garmin, I then read that what works fine in UK, the other european maps can struggle sometimes. So thought it best to ask those who actually live here and use one. Which model do you have? what age is it? and how reliable is it? and last but not least where is the best place to buy one here? I want one with free update included in price. Thanks in advance


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

They are legal, though you aren't supposed to use the programs which warn you of speed cameras.

We have used a TomTom Europe One for five years, and use it in both the UK and Spain. As long as you download the map updates every month or so you shouldn't have a problem, although in parts of Spain where there are lots of new roads being built it does sometimes appear as if you are driving across a field.

Amazon is probably the best place to buy it, they do free delivery to Spain for orders over £25.


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

We have a Garmin and it's OK, we've used it to drive from southern Spain to England. You've always got to use common sense as well coz they ain't perfect.

I believe they have to be mounted where the driver can't see the screen.


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## littleredrooster (Aug 3, 2008)

Don't know how true it is, but I was told that it's illegal to have the screen in view of the driver when moving.

I prefer not to use the screen anyway whilst driving, so I lie it face down and find the voice instructions to be quite adequate.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

littleredrooster said:


> Don't know how true it is, but I was told that it's illegal to have the screen in view of the driver when moving.
> 
> I prefer not to use the screen anyway whilst driving, so I lie it face down and find the voice instructions to be quite adequate.


No, you're not allowed to program them while driving but you don't have to hide them (unless they have built-in speed camera/radar detectors which you can't turn off).

Programar el GPS mientras se conduce será infracción grave dentro de una semana · ELPAÍS.com


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## lovethesun (Oct 19, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> No, you're not allowed to program them while driving but you don't have to hide them (unless they have built-in speed camera/radar detectors which you can't turn off).
> 
> Programar el GPS mientras se conduce será infracción grave dentro de una semana · ELPAÍS.com


I have read the link and although it says no mechanism that blocks radar or interferes with it. I can not see that this means sat navs are not allowed, as they neither block nor interfere do they?


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

lovethesun said:


> I have read the link and although it says no mechanism that blocks radar or interferes with it. I can not see that this means sat navs are not allowed, as they neither block nor interfere do they?


Sorry, did I post the wrong link? 

Sat navs ARE allowed. Just don't twiddle them while you're driving.


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## littleredrooster (Aug 3, 2008)

Alcalaina said:


> Sorry, did I post the wrong link?
> 
> Sat navs ARE allowed. Just don't twiddle them while you're driving.


I would have thought the main risk would be to study the screens while driving, as not everything can be picked up with a quick glance.

It only needs 2 or 3 seconds with the eyes off the road to end up upside down in a farmers field.
Almost as silly as trying to watch TV whilst driving.

I always set it face down so I am never tempted and find the voice instuctions quite adequate on the occasions the thing knows the road better than me.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

littleredrooster said:


> I would have thought the main risk would be to study the screens while driving, as not everything can be picked up with a quick glance.
> 
> It only needs 2 or 3 seconds with the eyes off the road to end up upside down in a farmers field.
> Almost as silly as trying to watch TV whilst driving.
> ...


Me too. As Navigator in Chief I occupy the passenger seat with TomTom on my lap, and let my assistant Mrs TomTom instruct the Chauffeur. That way he shouts at her if the directions are wrong, not at me.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

I think the law is Spain is very similar to the one in France. The use of GPS is allowed, also the one that warns you about fixed camera locations using existing database. What you cannot use is a device that detects police laser/radar used in speed enforcement, or the one that jams their beams so that their speed gun fails to lock onto your car.

I have successfully used Garmin 1370T in Spain with no major problems. I've bought lifetime map update for under £60 which enables me to download updated maps several times a year for the lifetime of my unit.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

lovethesun said:


> I have read the link and although it says no mechanism that blocks radar or interferes with it. I can not see that this means sat navs are not allowed, as they neither block nor interfere do they?


I think the headline says it all, doesn't it?

*Programar el GPS mientras se conduce será infracción grave *

You can have one, but you can't programme it whilst you're driving.

As Alcalaina says - no twiddling knobs whilst driving


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

*Sat Nav in Europe*

I've hacked all over the place in my time as a tour guide. The last company that I worked for, the guides had to drive the 16-seater mini coaches as well. Couldn't have done without satnav. Finding some 'corner of a foreign field that will be forever England' on WW1 battlefield tours was right up satnav's street.

I had Joanna Lumley as my co-pilot. When approaching journey's end she would breath, "you have reached your destination, daaaarling." The punters always cracked up. One Italian said "At least-a you know is-a _someone_ gonna call you darlin' "

I've tried a variety of these devices, including various models of T/Tom, a Navman 60i [the one with a camera that will log the position of the place where you take a photo], and Garmin. 

The gizmo of choice, for me, is TomTom's Navigator 6 [Europe] software for PDA/Smartphone installed in a Nokia 61 phone. These phones, which are about the same size and do pretty much all that a Blackberry will do, can be picked up on ebay for £25-30. The screen is big enough for a clear view of the mapping. The battery will run Nav 6 for _6 hrs_ without 12 volt feed - as opposed to the 20 mins of the Navman and less than an hr for the T/Tom stand-alones. If you have a nugget-sized sat receiver [£10-15 on ebay], you can drop that in yr shirt pocket and use the Nokia for hours whilst on foot. And of course it's a full-blown smartphone as well.

Navigator is available now in V7, but TomTom are being very tardy in developing the phones with which it will work. Despite 45% of world sales of mobs being Nokia, over twice as many as the next best seller, they have not adapted it to work with Symbian o/s.

So my Nokias + Nav 6 [I have two, now - belt and braces] are running mapping last updated in Feb 05. I can assure you that UK, France, Holland, Belgium, NYC & upstate NY and the city of Valencia are much the same now as they were then - as near as makes no difference if you exercise navigational common sense.

By the way, check that your chosen model will allow you to pre-plan routes from B to C whilst you are still at A. The Navman and some T/T base models will only allow you to route from your present position. Seriously dumb and useless for anybody needing to use these things for work.


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

*Knob Twiddling*



Pesky Wesky said:


> I think the headline says it all, doesn't it?
> 
> *Programar el GPS mientras se conduce será infracción grave *
> 
> ...


Couldn't agree more. I'm also dead agin drivers who scrabble amongst their pockets, cubbyholes, dashboard etc for their smokes and lighter. When I was driver/guiding for a tour company I refused even to have a bluetooth headset, let alone answer the phone whilst en route.

But a quick glance at a satnav screen is OK. It's no more distracting than looking in the mirrors, esp in a RHD bus in europe, where a look into the left side mirror before pulling out means actually turning ones head to look away 90 degrees. 

In my experience, the widescreen GPS sets are simply a marketing gimmick to 'add value' - that is they cost more - for no practical advantage whatsoever. I've had 4.5", 3.5" and my Nokia phone has 3" screen. The 3" screen is perfect. The big screens use more juice, so run down really quickly once on internal battery and offer no more useful info.

By the way, with ref to T/T Nav 6 as in my earlier post, I was astonished to find that within a couple of minutes of pulling out of a Hertz mid-town garage in NYC, I had a perfect signal at the bottom of all those concrete canyons. Same in up-state NY - even amongst heavily wooded valley, I never lost the signal. The same cannot be said in Valencia, where leafy avenues cut the signal out, as happened also in bosky Devon. I think the Pentagon is really keen that their boys do not get lost in The Big Apple. Me, I've done with the place. In the words of the great B.B. King, "They way that I used to love you, baby - that's the way I hate you now." My copy of T/T Nav 6 USA anyone? pm me.


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## el pavlo (Jul 4, 2011)

Many new cars now have Sat Navs built into the dashboard, so should it be illegal to look at the screen as an aid to knowing where you are supposed to be going ? 
Obviously when on the move, glances at the screen are kept as brief as possible, as they are to the rear view mirrors, radio, speedo or anything else within view on the dashboard.
I think as long as you are not using it to spot speed cameras it should be legal.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

el pavlo said:


> Many new cars now have Sat Navs built into the dashboard, so *should it be illegal to look at the screen as an aid to knowing where you are supposed to be going* ?
> Obviously when on the move, glances at the screen are kept as brief as possible, as they are to the rear view mirrors, radio, speedo or anything else within view on the dashboard.
> I think as long as you are not using it to spot speed cameras it should be legal.


As said several times above, it isn't illegal to have sat nav in your car, or to look at the screen - only to adjust it while driving.


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

chrisnation said:


> Couldn't agree more. I'm also dead agin drivers who scrabble amongst their pockets, cubbyholes, dashboard etc for their smokes and lighter.


I find it unbelievable that it is permitted to smoke while driving. You can't eat or drink (in the UK anyway) while driving. Smoking is much more dangerous. Ever dropped a lighted ciggy into your lap?


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## el pavlo (Jul 4, 2011)

It's an accident just waiting to happen.........ouch


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

*Ciggies dropped in ther danger zone*



jimenato said:


> I find it unbelievable that it is permitted to smoke while driving. You can't eat or drink (in the UK anyway) while driving. Smoking is much more dangerous. Ever dropped a lighted ciggy into your lap?


Perhaps it's a very cunning population control ploy. Anyone stupid enough to a] smoke at all b] drop lighted snout into the Y-front zone whilst driving is clearly not deserving of contributing to the continuation of the species. Thoroughly Darwinian, that.


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