# Applying for EU spouse residence visa from UK on 6-month UK tourist stamp.



## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Hello,

Long-time listener, first-time caller……

I am a UK citizen, I’m married to an Argentine woman and we have two children (their British passports are currently being processed)

We arrived in England in February after 6.5 years living in Argentina (my wife and children entered on the six-month tourist stamp which expires in almost exactly about 3 months). 

We plan on moving to Spain on 5th August. I spoke to the immigrations office in Valencia, and as far as they were concerned, she doesn’t need a visa to enter the country and once in Spain, and can register for her residency card with the appropriate documentation. However, on the way over Iberia made us buy her a return flight before they would check it in and an immigration solicitor in Valencia said that it’s safest to get a visa in London beforehand.

We have 3 months left on her visa in UK, so do have time, I read on the VFSglobal Spain website that is she is not applying in her country of residence may cause it to be delayed or rejected. 

We came here on a one-way ticket, my understanding being that as long as we had the tickets on to Spain, we were able to come in one-way, but Iberia weren’t budging in Buenos Aires and made us buy a flights back to Argentina before checking us in.

With this is mind, I’m not sure whether to apply for the residence visa, despite my wife being a non-UK resident, or whether to go and risk having to buy her a ticket back to Argentina at the airport, or having problems once we enter Spain. Or, just try travelling and risk having to buy her a ticket back to Argentina at the airport (would a ticket for her to Ireland satisfy border control, or would that just arouse further suspicions?). If we did apply for a visa and there was any problem, would this be flagged up when we tried to get into Spain?

I can’t seem to find much information about getting a visa for a Non-EU spouse (married to an EU national) from a country that isn’t her country of residence who doesn’t technically (in theory, if not in practice) need a visa for the country anyway.

I’ve got a pretty clear idea of what we need to do once we get there, but it’s just getting over the first hurdle of getting into the country.

If it makes a difference, I’m a self-employed translator, with clients in Spain, so I would be working/earning as normal during the move. (I’m currently in talks with one about working in-house, would that make the move any easier?)

Any advice would be most welcome.

Thanks in advance,

Pfrase


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Should also add:

An alternative travel route could be, as my wife has a sister living in the North of France, married to a French guy with two French kids, heading over to see them on Eurostar or ferry and travelling down to Spain by land. Would this make anything easier/more difficult/no difference whatsoever? Would getting a schengen visa from the French embassy/passing through immigration control be any easier/more difficult/no difference whatsoever?

The plan is for our children to be travelling on UK passports, and my wife would look after them while I work. We're planning on eventually coming back to UK surinder singhing, but we might stay in Spain for a while. We'd be on a long-term rent (renewed yearly) and all speak the language anyway, my kids would be going to public primary schools, etc, etc so we should meet the move of the centre of life rule. But we just need to get there first!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

:welcome:

your wife can enter Spain with a Schengen visa - it doesn't make any difference if she flies/drives or enters by train

you & your children can register as resident as EU citizens & at the same time your wife can apply for residency as 'exercising treaty rights as the spouse of an EU citizen'

she can stay here while it is being processed even if it takes longer than the 90 days allowed on the Schengen visa


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

xabiachica said:


> :welcome:
> 
> your wife can enter Spain with a Schengen visa - it doesn't make any difference if she flies/drives or enters by train
> 
> ...


I thought people from Argentina had automatic right of residency in Spain - certainly people from Cuba do.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> I thought people from Argentina had automatic right of residency in Spain - certainly people from Cuba do.


sort of - but she has to get in first & can then apply for _nationality _by way of the Law of Historical Memory (2007) 

that might be something to consider in fact - it might be easier than going the Surinder Singh route to the UK 

it can be very long winded though - I helped some Argentinians a few years ago to getpapers together - their employers were English & didn't speak Spanish so didn't understand what was required

they had to show that they could support themselves with proper work contracts etc ( a bit like we all do now!) & iirc that was just for residency papers, not to change nationality

I'm trying to remember if it was before or after 2007 - I'm pretty sure it was after though


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

It is same as my situation.

I believe your wife need to go back her own country to get a schengen visa and come to Spain. She cannot get in Uk since she is not a resident in Uk.

The main thing is the translated marriage certificate has to be less than 90 days when she apply. So I would suggest you come to Spain to open a bank account.Then your wife gets all the document ready and apply as soon as she arrive in Spain.

I got the docs ready on Feb 6 and arrived Spain on Feb 16. Then I made an appointment on Mar 5 and applied the residency on Mar 18 and was approved on Apr 22. 

You need 3 month bank certificate and private health insurance to get residency even though you are European citizen. Your kids need birth certificates and will get depending on you.


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

It costs more for your wife to go back to apply but it is fast and it is the right way!

I was here in Dec and my visa is running out ( 6 days left). Somebody suggested me to overstay and he said there are mass of illegal Chinese in Spain. But I did not do that. I went back to China and got my visa in 1 day and came back.

If I overstayed, I am sure I had to pay a lot to the lawyer to deal with my case. In fact, we did everything ourselves and did not pay one penny to any lawyer and it is pretty fast.


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Hello,

Thanks for your replies. Whilst she doesn't get automatic residency, she will be able to apply for citizenship after two years of legal residence, but an immigration solicitor told me:

"Una vez que se cumplen esos 2 años, se puede solicitar la nacionalidad española, que viene a tardar en tramitarse, de media, unos dos (2) años más (siempre que toda la documentación esté bien y no surja ningún problema, porque le puedo contar casos de obtener la nacionalidad en 8 meses y otros en 5 años)."

Certainly something to consider though. 

My main concern at the moment is actually getting into the country. We are in plenty of time to get a visa from UK, but as she's in the UK on a tourist stamp, she's not technically under the jurisdiction of the Spanish embassy in London and it says it is then referred to the embassy in her country of residence, so may cause delays and/or to be rejected.

As an Argentine national, she is able to enter Spain without a visa for up to 90 days, but it just means that we may need to get her an onward flight to get through immigration control in Spain. We are getting all the paperwork together for the residence card before travelling, and would be aiming to start the ball rolling with the residency cards straight away, so we should be able to sort it out within the initial 90 days that she's allowed.


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

Pfrase said:


> Hello,
> 
> Thanks for your replies. Whilst she doesn't get automatic residency, she will be able to apply for citizenship after two years of legal residence, but an immigration solicitor told me:
> 
> ...


So just come and apply in Spain since she does not need a visa.

The worse result is she has to leave Spain and come back if you cannot sort it out in 90 days! It is slow to do everything in Spain and you need endless appointment to deal with the government! If she can manage to apply in 90 days,everything will be fine!


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Hi Sandraw719, thanks for the reply.

That's rather what I'm trying to find out about, the getting into Spain part. Specifically, whether I can avoid having to buy her a return ticket home which would ultimately not be used, or whether a cheap ticket to Ireland, for example, would suffice, or whether the Spanish embassy in London would be able to help with a travel visa, even though she is only on a UK tourist stamp.

When I was getting my residency for Argentina, my 90-day visa had expired before they had processed the residency, but I was able to stay on the basis that my wife and son were Argentine and it was _en tramite_. We have 3 months left in UK to gather all documents (although we're trying to time it right so the documents don't expire) and we're going to get a local immigration lawyer to check them through before travelling, but if there were any delay on their part/for any other reason, surely it wouldn't be a case of her being deported while the residence card was being processed? 

Her visa-free period of 90 days is the same duration as the residence visa would be anyway, so I'd assume that the period of 90 days would be sufficient to get the residence card sorted out.

Thanks!

Pfrase


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

Pfrase said:


> Hi Sandraw719, thanks for the reply.
> 
> That's rather what I'm trying to find out about, the getting into Spain part. Specifically, whether I can avoid having to buy her a return ticket home which would ultimately not be used, or whether a cheap ticket to Ireland, for example, would suffice, or whether the Spanish embassy in London would be able to help with a travel visa, even though she is only on a UK tourist stamp.
> 
> ...


I do not think it is any problem to get in Spain. She just need to show her passport! I was asked by the immigration lady in Madrid airport about the return ticket and I said I did not have one. But she let me in! As a spouse of Eu citizen, she has the right to travel with you without showing the booked hotel and ticket! 

Spanish Embassy in London won't be able to help if she just has a short visa in Uk.


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

That's reassuring! Presumably you were entering on a tourist visa that you had obtained in China in advance? My main worry is them asking for a return flight and/or proof of funds to support herself for 90 days (it said calculated at just over €64/day, working out at about €5760+ for 90 days). That said, I'm aiming to go with at least half of that in savings and, being self-employed, I will be getting paid more than that into my bank account during that same 90-day period.

It's all into a UK account though. I was planning to just keep that account and use it for their time there. I had an Argentine account which I closed upon leaving, but that was mainly due to the heavy restrictions on Argentine companies paying into foreign bank accounts. 

I've been getting paid from clients in Spain and Italy into my UK bank account (without residing in either country) so would I really need to open a Spanish bank account if I'm actively using a bank account from another EU country?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Hi Sandraw719, thanks for the reply.
> 
> That's rather what I'm trying to find out about, the getting into Spain part. Specifically, whether I can avoid having to buy her a return ticket home which would ultimately not be used, or whether a cheap ticket to Ireland, for example, would suffice, or whether the Spanish embassy in London would be able to help with a travel visa, even though she is only on a UK tourist stamp.
> 
> ...


a cheap return ticket would probably be the easiest way

once she has applied for residency as your spouse, she can legitimately stay past the 90 days while the residency is being processed - she won't be deported unless she does something dreadful !


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

Pfrase said:


> Hi Sandraw719, thanks for the reply.
> 
> That's rather what I'm trying to find out about, the getting into Spain part. Specifically, whether I can avoid having to buy her a return ticket home which would ultimately not be used, or whether a cheap ticket to Ireland, for example, would suffice, or whether the Spanish embassy in London would be able to help with a travel visa, even though she is only on a UK tourist stamp.
> 
> ...


I would suggest you and your wife come to Spain to open a bank account now and put money in every month. Then it is 3 months in Aug. 

If you come here withou job, you need to show you have money to support your family. The Spanish government does not care about your money in other country,only care about the money in Spain!

Your wife can speak to immigration dept.and you do not need any lawyer!


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Xabiachica: Would it be best to get the cheap return ticket before going to the airport, or to just get it if asked at the airport? Would a flight to Ireland suffice, as it's out of Schengen area and not back to UK, where she'd have stayed for 6 months?

Sandraw719: I would be going with a job, I'm a self-employed translator, I'd have bank statements/invoices/project orders to back that up. Is a Spanish bank account 100% necessary though? I spoke to the oficina de extranjeria and they didn't mention that I need a Spanish bank account.

I sent a few emails to some local lawyers too, mainly to see what sort of free information I could get from them, they didn't seem to mention a Spanish bank either. They said for the self-employed:

"o Trabajador por cuenta propia podrá aportar cualquiera de los siguientes documentos:

§ Inscripción en el Censo de Actividades económicas.

§ Justificación de su establecimiento mediante Inscripción en el Registro Mercantil.

§ Documento de alta o situación asimilada al alta en el régimen correspondiente de Seguridad Social, o consentimiento de la comprobación de los datos en los ficheros de la Tesorería General de la Seguridad Social o de la Agencia Tributaria."

Would my wife and kids be covered for public health through my social security contributions, or can I add them to it for a price?

I do have a job offer in Barcelona for 15-20 hours a week working in-house which I'm mulling over. However, Barcelona looks pretty pricey, so I'm starting to think of moving to a smaller area between Valencia and Barcelona, where you seem to be able to get a similar place for half the price, and just carrying on freelancing working at home. I'd set up as autonomo and start paying social security as soon as I get there, anyway.

Thanks you both for your responses!


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

Pfrase said:


> Xabiachica: Would it be best to get the cheap return ticket before going to the airport, or to just get it if asked at the airport? Would a flight to Ireland suffice, as it's out of Schengen area and not back to UK, where she'd have stayed for 6 months?
> 
> Sandraw719: I would be going with a job, I'm a self-employed translator, I'd have bank statements/invoices/project orders to back that up. Is a Spanish bank account 100% necessary though? I spoke to the oficina de extranjeria and they didn't mention that I need a Spanish bank account.
> 
> ...


I do not know about self-employed since we came here without jobs. For us,the Spanish bank account is very important and it is what they really cared! 

But I am sure it takes a long time to get the self-employed license and documents too. If you can come to Spain with your wife for a short time and visit the immigration dept.,they will give you a list of the documents they need.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Xabiachica: Would it be best to get the cheap return ticket before going to the airport, or to just get it if asked at the airport? Would a flight to Ireland suffice, as it's out of Schengen area and not back to UK, where she'd have stayed for 6 months?
> 
> Sandraw719: I would be going with a job, I'm a self-employed translator, I'd have bank statements/invoices/project orders to back that up. Is a Spanish bank account 100% necessary though? I spoke to the oficina de extranjeria and they didn't mention that I need a Spanish bank account.
> 
> ...


your children for sure would be covered on your SS contributions - not 100% sure about your wife before she got her residency though :confused2:

you can set up as self-employed in no time at all - mine was done by my gestor in a matter of minutes


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Thanks for that info, I may get a gestor too to set-up too. I see that you provide translation services, do you have to register for VAT for your invoices? Is there a threshold above which you have to register?

Sorry to bombard you with questions and thanks for the information so far!


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Also, I just found this to answer to my own question about whether my wife would be covered (she wouldn't be working, well, she will be mainly taking care of our two young children, so will be working harder than me!)

Social security FAQ


So it would seem that my wife and kids would be covered by my contributions in our situation.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Thanks for that info, I may get a gestor too to set-up too. I see that you provide translation services, do you have to register for VAT for your invoices? Is there a threshold above which you have to register?
> 
> Sorry to bombard you with questions and thanks for the information so far!


yes for translation you have to register for IVA - it's 21%

there's no threshold - you have to charge IVA from the very first invoice


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pfrase said:


> Also, I just found this to answer to my own question about whether my wife would be covered (she wouldn't be working, well, she will be mainly taking care of our two young children, so will be working harder than me!)
> 
> Social security FAQ
> 
> ...


I know your kids will be, & that your wife will be once she has her residency card - I'm still not 100% sure that she would be _before _her application was approved


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## melissa20001 (Jan 15, 2013)

There is no law about holding onward travel to pass through immigration. That was a policy invented by the airlines which they choose to enforce whenever the fancy strikes them.


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## Pfrase (May 11, 2014)

Thanks Melissa. To check-in in Buenos Aires, they did actually make me buy a flight back from Madrid to Argentina for my wife and kids (although my kids at least should be entering Spain on UK passports). I did cancel the bookings, but I still have the last minute booking confirmations, etc.

We are flying from London to Valencia on easyjet, and these flights are/were Turkish Airlines from Madrid to Valencia, so I've been wondering whether to just print out the cancelled tickets and show them if asked. I'm a bit reluctant to do that considering that I'll be travelling with two young kids, and my wife already feels that Europe doesn't want her here!


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

Pfrase said:


> Thanks Melissa. To check-in in Buenos Aires, they did actually make me buy a flight back from Madrid to Argentina for my wife and kids (although my kids at least should be entering Spain on UK passports). I did cancel the bookings, but I still have the last minute booking confirmations, etc.
> 
> We are flying from London to Valencia on easyjet, and these flights are/were Turkish Airlines from Madrid to Valencia, so I've been wondering whether to just print out the cancelled tickets and show them if asked. I'm a bit reluctant to do that considering that I'll be travelling with two young kids, and my wife already feels that Europe doesn't want her here!


At least all the residency here costs nothing except a few weeks waiting.But the UK spouse visa costs more than 1000 pounds.

My husband planned to stay in UK for a year and we prepared enough savings to meet the requirement. I passed the stupid English exam.But I was not happy and did not want to pay an expensive visa and only stayed one year in UK. So we used the savings to buy some property for investment in UK and came to Spain after 6 months in UK.

I found Spanish people are more friendly with kids and our boy is happier here.


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## Sandraw719 (Jul 19, 2013)

Pfrase said:


> Thanks Melissa. To check-in in Buenos Aires, they did actually make me buy a flight back from Madrid to Argentina for my wife and kids (although my kids at least should be entering Spain on UK passports). I did cancel the bookings, but I still have the last minute booking confirmations, etc.
> 
> We are flying from London to Valencia on easyjet, and these flights are/were Turkish Airlines from Madrid to Valencia, so I've been wondering whether to just print out the cancelled tickets and show them if asked. I'm a bit reluctant to do that considering that I'll be travelling with two young kids, and my wife already feels that Europe doesn't want her here!


 Do not worry about the ticket. I was forced to buy a return ticket in Hk airport by the airline but I refused. They asked me to sign a paper saying I will pay a return ticket if I was refused by Spain. 

It is your wife's right to travel with EU husband and Easyjet won't ask you anything!


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## melissa20001 (Jan 15, 2013)

Sandraw719 said:


> Do not worry about the ticket. I was forced to buy a return ticket in Hk airport by the airline but I refused. They asked me to sign a paper saying I will pay a return ticket if I was refused by Spain.
> 
> It is your wife's right to travel with EU husband and Easyjet won't ask you anything!


Exactly. Many people erroneously believe that it is immigration border control who require you to hold a return ticket. In fact it is purely an _airline_ policy, and one which they do not apply consistently. It is not law and don't be fooled by the airline trying to tell you that it is. You can refuse to buy a return ticket and sign a waiver instead.


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