# Best place to live for family in costa del sol



## markbrin1984

Hi

Me my wife and 2 children are relocating to Spain in October 2013. My children will be 5 years old and 6 months old I will be 29 years old and my wife will be 28 years old, I won't be looking for a job as I work for a major oil and gas company and they fly me to work from the nearest airport, we are looking to rent for a year then hopefully buy, 
Obviously we will want to be near international schools for the children, at the minute we are learning Spanish with private tuition lesson's. 
We have been looking a lot at 3/4 bedroom town houses in communal areas, we really want to make this work and are doing as much research as we can before we move, including a few visits, 
Could anybody please recommend family orientated areas in the costa del sol 

Regards

Mark


----------



## Pesky Wesky

markbrin1984 said:


> Hi
> 
> Me my wife and 2 children are relocating to Spain in October 2013. My children will be 5 years old and 6 months old I will be 29 years old and my wife will be 28 years old, I won't be looking for a job as I work for a major oil and gas company and they fly me to work from the nearest airport, we are looking to rent for a year then hopefully buy,
> Obviously we will want to be near international schools for the children, at the minute we are learning Spanish with private tuition lesson's.
> We have been looking a lot at 3/4 bedroom town houses in communal areas, we really want to make this work and are doing as much research as we can before we move, including a few visits,
> Could anybody please recommend family orientated areas in the costa del sol
> 
> Regards
> 
> Mark


Can't help you with a place , but was just wondering why you say


> Obviously we will want to be near international schools for the children,


At five years old your oldest child is at an ideal age to go to a state school and soak up Spanish and having another language under your belt is always an advantage.


----------



## Leper

I'm with Pesywesky here inasmuch your five year old needs an international school like I need the flu. The fact that your child will attend a state school indicates that you will have contact with Spanish parents + some expat parents also. You child will learn Spanish 100% of the time in school and will make Spanish friends. You and your wife will speak more Spanish also.

But, I would not confine myself to the Costa del Sol. Temperatures and lack of rainfall along hundreds of miles of coast from Alicante to Gibraltar are excellent. You also have a great choice of airports Alicante, Murcia, Almeria, Málaga, and a few inland airports.

It appears money is not a problem for you; so what are you waiting around for? Go on your recce visits and hire a car at the airport. Ask questions, keep your eyes open - remember you have got to pick a location and then an area within that location and accommodation in the location.

You are in a position that is the envy of many - Go for it!


----------



## jojo

I'm more in favour of international schools than most on here, for two reasons: 1. If you ever go back to the UK, they will fit back into the education system there a lot easier as most international schools teach the UK curriculum and 2. IME they learn just as much Spanish, if not more at international (They're taught it and they will have spanish friends there). These schools are no longer the bastions of british expats and tend to be mainly wealthy spanish kids, russian, french, german, danish...... Both my children were in classes where the minority of pupils were british and therefore integrated with other nationalities and the advantage was that international schools teach Spanish and are geared to helping "foreign" pupils with the language issues. Altho my daughter was older than yours (10), she learnt little spanish at state school, but became fluent once we sent her to an international..... and then theres the homework, which you'll have to help with - in Spanish AAAAGGGHHH!!!!

You children are young enough to adapt, so its a matter of maybe trying out a state school/international school first - theres also the situation where Spanish state schools are struggling due to the recession and therefore maybe dont need more children using their resources right now???

But like I say, I'm swimming against most opinions on the forum with this subject lol!

Jo xxxx


----------



## markbrin1984

Hello

And thanks for all of the reply's from everyone, once we find a property within walking distance to a school I will let you all no

Regards

Mark


----------



## markbrin1984

Thanks for that jojo me and my wife are definitely leaning towards a international school, 
Could you recommend any schools ?, we're hoping to move within walking distance of one.

Regards

Mark


----------



## jojo

markbrin1984 said:


> Thanks for that jojo me and my wife are definitely leaning towards a international school,
> Could you recommend any schools ?, we're hoping to move within walking distance of one.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Mark


Well mine went to "The Brtish College" in Torremuelle, Benalmadena, not to be confused with "The Benalmadena College" and we lived on the urbanizacion of Torremuelle. That suited us perfectly. Walking distance to the school, the beach, bars and restaurants, a train station with a direct route to the airport....

I'd say the best school in that area tho would be Sunnyview in Torremolinos. Have a look at the governing body, that way you know the schools which are "proper" !!! Schools in Spain | Nabss

Jo xxx


----------



## Pesky Wesky

jojo said:


> I'm more in favour of international schools than most on here, for two reasons: 1. If you ever go back to the UK, they will fit back into the education system there a lot easier as most international schools teach the UK curriculum and 2. IME they learn just as much Spanish, if not more at international (They're taught it and they will have spanish friends there). These schools are no longer the bastions of british expats and tend to be mainly wealthy spanish kids, russian, french, german, danish...... Both my children were in classes where the minority of pupils were british and therefore integrated with other nationalities and the advantage was that international schools teach Spanish and are geared to helping "foreign" pupils with the language issues. Altho my daughter was older than yours (10), she learnt little spanish at state school, but became fluent once we sent her to an international..... and then theres the homework, which you'll have to help with - in Spanish AAAAGGGHHH!!!!
> 
> You children are young enough to adapt, so its a matter of maybe trying out a state school/international school first - theres also the situation where Spanish state schools are struggling due to the recession and therefore maybe dont need more children using their resources right now???
> 
> But like I say, I'm swimming against most opinions on the forum with this subject lol!
> 
> Jo xxxx


I'm not against International Schools as such, especially after reading your posts. I just think that some people think it's the only option they have, and for young children it really isn't.
What I've got against International schools is that they are expensive and that they are run as businesses and _sometimes_ that is to the detriment of the child. Also, you're right, there are a lot of Spanish kids in international schools, at least round here, but for some families it's a statement of wealth, not the standard of education.
What you do have to do, as you do when you are choosing any school for your children, is get as much info as possible and really research the standards that they have, so the OP needs to go into that site that you recommended!


----------



## Calas felices

*International or state*

It's an interesting dilemma. Of course children who go to a Spanish school will become fluent in Spanish but will they have learnt it. Possibly not and then only what they hear - will they have the grammar, theory necessary to learn the language well? Also how will they learn English? Well they will pick it up from you but again will they learn grammar etc - I suppose it depends on how well you can explain it to them. Unfortunately there are a number of children who have gone through state school and now have the distinction of being able to speak two languages badly. Of course on the other hand there are others who don't. You may thinkthat their chances are enhanced if they receive some sort of formality in their learning.


----------



## Pesky Wesky

Calas felices said:


> It's an interesting dilemma. Of course children who go to a Spanish school will become fluent in Spanish but will they have learnt it. Possibly not and then only what they hear - will they have the grammar, theory necessary to learn the language well? Also how will they learn English? Well they will pick it up from you but again will they learn grammar etc - I suppose it depends on how well you can explain it to them. Unfortunately there are a number of children who have gone through state school and now have the distinction of being able to speak two languages badly. Of course on the other hand there are others who don't. You may thinkthat their chances are enhanced if they receive some sort of formality in their learning.


Hmm, my take on this speaking as a teacher and mother of a bilingual child...
Just as a Spanish 6 year old doesn't learn their language by studying grammar, neither does the English speaking child learning Spanish. Only older people need the language (maybe) to be divided into grammar, vocabulary, listening, reading comprehension etc. Young children just "learn the language". To learn 2 or more languages well what is needed is exposure to all skills ie writing, listening, speaking and reading. Then the grammar, vocabulary, functions etc look after themselves.


----------



## xabiaxica

Calas felices said:


> It's an interesting dilemma. Of course children who go to a Spanish school will become fluent in Spanish but will they have learnt it. Possibly not and then only what they hear - will they have the grammar, theory necessary to learn the language well? Also how will they learn English? Well they will pick it up from you but again will they learn grammar etc - I suppose it depends on how well you can explain it to them. Unfortunately there are a number of children who have gone through state school and now have the distinction of being able to speak two languages badly. Of course on the other hand there are others who don't. You may thinkthat their chances are enhanced if they receive some sort of formality in their learning.


yes - while it's true that some English children go through Spanish school & don't succeed with either language, I believe that it's highly likely that they wouldn't have succeeded even in just one language in the UK

however - the majority who start in the Spanish system young enough WILL become completely bilingual - & in my experience will learn more about English grammar than any child going through the education system in the UK 

language teaching in Spain is almost exclusively focussed upon grammar - not ideal for Spanish children studying English - but certainly not an issue for English children who will also be able to SPEAK the language - & certainly all children in the Spanish system will be taught Spanish grammar in much greater depth than any of us ever studied English grammar


----------



## snikpoh

xabiachica said:


> yes - while it's true that some English children go through Spanish school & don't succeed with either language, I believe that it's highly likely that they wouldn't have succeeded even in just one language in the UK
> 
> however - the majority who start in the Spanish system young enough WILL become completely bilingual - & in my experience will learn more about English grammar than any child going through the education system in the UK
> 
> language teaching in Spain is almost exclusively focussed upon grammar - not ideal for Spanish children studying English - but certainly not an issue for English children who will also be able to SPEAK the language - & certainly all children in the Spanish system will be taught Spanish grammar in much greater depth than any of us ever studied English grammar


I agree with you. I'm not sure what point "calas felices" is trying to make but I certainly don't agree that they will NOT learn Spanish grammar.

My 3 children have now been in Spanish state schools for 6 years and are fluent in 3 languages. This is not simply my view but that of Spanish friends and their teachers. I guess we are lucky in that my wife can help them with the language and I can help with their understanding of the grammar. (Something I enjoy from learning English in England, German whilst working there and Dutch whilst living there).

I suppose it is all down to what level of support they get at home and how the integrate with Spanish children.


----------



## xabiaxica

snikpoh said:


> I agree with you. I'm not sure what point "calas felices" is trying to make but I certainly don't agree that they will NOT learn Spanish grammar.
> 
> My 3 children have now been in Spanish state schools for 6 years and are fluent in 3 languages. This is not simply my view but that of Spanish friends and their teachers. I guess we are lucky in that my wife can help them with the language and I can help with their understanding of the grammar. (Something I enjoy from learning English in England, German whilst working there and Dutch whilst living there).
> 
> I suppose it is all down to what level of support they get at home and how the integrate with Spanish children.


yes exactly - your children and mine are perfect examples of how being English & growing up in Spain can be a huge advantage educationally - my daughters' teachers also agree that they are trilingual - the parents of some of my daughters' friends didn't realise that they aren't Spanish until they actually met them!


----------



## agua642

Ok my opinion on this : my daughter went to Spanish state school from age of 3, both her parents are English, she is 109% bilingual and I think she will know more about English grammar as English is a studied subject in state school. If she had gone to International private school she may not be a bilingual as she is and possibly not have studied English grammar in the same way, I'm not sure!
I think state school system is the way to go for any child under the age of 9-10 and fluent English in the home environment it works I've proven it..& proud of what language skills my daughter has & really without to much effort..


----------



## lalafilip

*In the same boat*

Hi Mark

We're more or less in the same boat. We're coming over in June 2013 with our 4 year old daughter and we're also busy scouting out where to aim for first, and what school. We've traveled much of Spain already and will be moving our business over there with us (from South Africa) but we're still undecided as to where to settle. 

I really enjoyed all the input so far about Spanish state schools or private, it certainly provided us with a lot of food for thought so thanks all for their contributions.

We'll be scouting again for the first few months but the same as Mark, we would really appreciate some input from others already there as to areas they have successfully transitioned into with young kids that are close to schools and amenities etc, it would be most helpful. 

See you all soon! 

Lauren, Ondrej and Lylah


----------



## Tilley

xabiachica said:


> yes - while it's true that some English children go through Spanish school & don't succeed with either language, I believe that it's highly likely that they wouldn't have succeeded even in just one language in the UK
> 
> however - the majority who start in the Spanish system young enough WILL become completely bilingual - & in my experience will learn more about English grammar than any child going through the education system in the UK


Hi Xabiachica, but how many children to you actually know who have been through the British Education system in the last ten or so years to comment personally on their knowledge of English or are you just basing this on Daily Mail propaganda of how rubbish the schools are in the UK ?

It's just that I know many, many kids who have recently been through the system in the UK and to be honest I would say that provided English is there mother tounge and like mine stayed in one school from 4 to 11 and another from 11 to 18 so their education wasn't dispupted in anway, their levels of English are pretty high.

Certainly high enough to allow them to operate in any decent office job that comes there way or with the appropriate A Levels give them the necessary skills to cope with your average BA or BSc course, all of which regardless of subject tend to need high literacy skills in terms of reading, comprehending and analysling and reporting back on complex material.


----------



## xabiaxica

Tilley said:


> Hi Xabiachica, but how many children to you actually know who have been through the British Education system in the last ten or so years to comment personally on their knowledge of English or are you just basing this on Daily Mail propaganda of how rubbish the schools are in the UK ?
> 
> It's just that I know many, many kids who have recently been through the system in the UK and to be honest I would say that provided English is there mother tounge and like mine stayed in one school from 4 to 11 and another from 11 to 18 so their education wasn't dispupted in anway, their levels of English are pretty high.
> 
> Certainly high enough to allow them to operate in any decent office job that comes there way or with the appropriate A Levels give them the necessary skills to cope with your average BA or BSc course, all of which regardless of subject tend to need high literacy skills in terms of reading, comprehending and analysling and reporting back on complex material.


I don't read the Daily Mail - or any English newspapers...


I'm still in touch with people in the UK, we still have family there

I have seen the standard of written English of many, & the spoken English - & no, it's not dreadful on the whole, and in some cases it's fine - but it's certainly no better & in some cases far far worse than my childrens' standard of English

I also do 'exam cramming' for IGCSE English with teenagers here, so I know _exactly_ what knowledge of grammar & what standards are required............. a much less in-depth knowledge of grammar, certainly, than Spanish children need to pass English here


----------



## Tilley

Is IGCSE English the same as GCSE English is here ? I dont understand why you would need a higher standard of grammar for one than the other if they are in effect the same qualification, my best friends a head in secondary school and I am just trying to have an understanding of it really as she is pretty confident in the levels of English being attained, plus i have two kids of my own who have taken both GCSE English Literature and GCSE English Language in the very recent past, who have extremely high levels of English with DD then attaining an A* at A2.

Do your relatives in the UK currently have kids doing GCSE English at school who are having really awful experiences with it and subsequently can't attain good results ?

I read on here how bad English Language & Literature teaching is in the UK and how brilliant it is in Spain, and kids arriving there are behind etc so I'm curious that is all. I wonder what that is based on. Obvioulsy I understand that if children have been uprouted from their education many times, such as moving about due to family jobs or family wanderlust and then finally end up in Spain they may not be at the appropriate level of English for their age, but there could be any number of factors contributing to that (ie lack of parental support) and not necessarily the main culprit being the English Education system.


----------



## Pesky Wesky

xabiachica said:


> yes - while it's true that some English children go through Spanish school & don't succeed with either language, I believe that it's highly likely that they wouldn't have succeeded even in just one language in the UK
> 
> however - the majority who start in the Spanish system young enough WILL become completely bilingual - & in my experience will learn more about English grammar than any child going through the education system in the UK
> 
> language teaching in Spain is almost exclusively focussed upon grammar - not ideal for Spanish children studying English - but certainly not an issue for English children who will also be able to SPEAK the language - & certainly all children in the Spanish system will be taught Spanish grammar in much greater depth than any of us ever studied English grammar


I took this comment to mean that the children who fail in Spanish schools would have quite possibly failed in British schools anyway. There are quite a lot of families who leave the UK because they're not doing very well. The kids have problems, the parents may be partial to too many nights out on the town, they may have unstable work... I'm not saying that's the typical British immigrant, I'm saying that this type of person exists, just like they do anywhere. Children in this kind of environment will likely fail wherever they are. That's what I thought xabia was talking about, but maybe not.

As for the other parts to her post, yes, that's the way it is.


----------



## Pesky Wesky

Tilley said:


> Is IGCSE English the same as GCSE English is here ? I dont understand why you would need a higher standard of grammar for one than the other if they are in effect the same qualification, my best friends a head in secondary school and I am just trying to have an understanding of it really as she is pretty confident in the levels of English being attained, plus i have two kids of my own who have taken both GCSE English Literature and GCSE English Language in the very recent past, who have extremely high levels of English with DD then attaining an A* at A2.
> 
> Do your relatives in the UK currently have kids doing GCSE English at school who are having really awful experiences with it and subsequently can't attain good results ?
> 
> I read on here how bad English Language & Literature teaching is in the UK and how brilliant it is in Spain, and kids arriving there are behind etc so I'm curious that is all. I wonder what that is based on. Obvioulsy I understand that if children have been uprouted from their education many times, such as moving about due to family jobs or family wanderlust and then finally end up in Spain they may not be at the appropriate level of English for their age, but there could be any number of factors contributing to that (ie lack of parental support) and not necessarily the main culprit being the English Education system.


More info on gcse and igcse
GCSE English and IGCSE English - what's the difference? | Oxford Open Learning
They do seem to be quite different actually.

Where did you read that about how _bad English Language & Literature teaching is in the UK and how brilliant it is in Spain_? I don't remember that thread. People generally say that English teaching in state schools is not of a high standard and as far as I know Eng Lit isn't taught in state schools.

I have 4 nephews in the UK and they have one gcse between them. They'd be the typical child who'd be lost in the state system here not gaining anything in English nor in Spanish.


----------



## jojo

Tilley said:


> Is IGCSE English the same as GCSE English is here ? I dont understand why you would need a higher standard of grammar for one than the other if they are in effect the same qualification, my best friends a head in secondary school and I am just trying to have an understanding of it really as she is pretty confident in the levels of English being attained, plus i have two kids of my own who have taken both GCSE English Literature and GCSE English Language in the very recent past, who have extremely high levels of English with DD then attaining an A* at A2.
> 
> Do your relatives in the UK currently have kids doing GCSE English at school who are having really awful experiences with it and subsequently can't attain good results ?
> 
> I read on here how bad English Language & Literature teaching is in the UK and how brilliant it is in Spain, and kids arriving there are behind etc so I'm curious that is all. I wonder what that is based on. Obvioulsy I understand that if children have been uprouted from their education many times, such as moving about due to family jobs or family wanderlust and then finally end up in Spain they may not be at the appropriate level of English for their age, but there could be any number of factors contributing to that (ie lack of parental support) and not necessarily the main culprit being the English Education system.


My daughter was set to achieve greatness according to her teachers in her International school. She was put forward for 11 IGCSEs. The international school pushed her hard, the were strict and there was no escape - the work would be done and passes would be made. Sadly, we took my daughter back to the UK when she was 14. She went to the local state high school. They didnt push her, they believe that "young people" find their own level. They refused to even hear the word "detention", preferring to call it "voluntary catch up". Anyway, my "oh so bright" daughter decided that if she didnt work then no one was going to chase her up and she could simply not bother. Her predicted GCSE results are shocking.

BTW, the difference between IGCSEs and GCSEs is that the use of language in the questions is different and the "I"/International is geared for those who dont use English as their first language. Many people will say that they are more difficult and who knows?? and does it matter anyway lol!!!


Jo xxx


----------



## thrax

I teach maths and sciences as well as English (to Spanish kids and adults) and the level of the IGCSE depends on which board they are sitting (AQA Edexcel etc). I have two daughters in UK both of whom went through the state system. Their English when the left school was shocking and their understanding of grammar was zero as they were never taught the subject. When I last worked in UK, I was sometimes responsible for interviewing young people for jobs and they could barely write. It was frightening. This not to say that all schools are turning out badly educated kids: clearly that isn't the case. The teaching levels in Spain vary widely from dreadful to excellent. But when children here learn English they are taught grammar.


----------



## xabiaxica

Tilley said:


> Is IGCSE English the same as GCSE English is here ? I dont understand why you would need a higher standard of grammar for one than the other if they are in effect the same qualification, my best friends a head in secondary school and I am just trying to have an understanding of it really as she is pretty confident in the levels of English being attained, plus i have two kids of my own who have taken both GCSE English Literature and GCSE English Language in the very recent past, who have extremely high levels of English with DD then attaining an A* at A2.
> 
> Do your relatives in the UK currently have kids doing GCSE English at school who are having really awful experiences with it and subsequently can't attain good results ?
> 
> I read on here how bad English Language & Literature teaching is in the UK and how brilliant it is in Spain, and kids arriving there are behind etc so I'm curious that is all. I wonder what that is based on. Obvioulsy I understand that if children have been uprouted from their education many times, such as moving about due to family jobs or family wanderlust and then finally end up in Spain they may not be at the appropriate level of English for their age, but there could be any number of factors contributing to that (ie lack of parental support) and not necessarily the main culprit being the English Education system.


No - that's not what I'm saying at all

IGCSE English is the 'International' version of the GCSE - the one that students in International Schools all over the world study - & it's pretty much the same as GCSE, just with slightly different subject matter - geared less to a 'British' lifestyle (ie no mention of Eastenders etc., in the 'media' section of the curriculum) - but the level of grammar required is about the same - both GCSE & IGCSE past papers are used for exam practice

what I mean is - *students studying English as a foreign language* in Spanish state schools need a more in depth knowledge of English grammar to pass their English exams than a GCSE student does for English language (first language)............sadly it doesn't mean the Spanish kids can actually _speak _English - imo the grammar is _over-_emphasised at the expense of speaking


----------



## xabiaxica

Pesky Wesky said:


> I took this comment to mean that the children who fail in Spanish schools would have quite possibly failed in British schools anyway. There are quite a lot of families who leave the UK because they're not doing very well. The kids have problems, the parents may be partial to too many nights out on the town, they may have unstable work... I'm not saying that's the typical British immigrant, I'm saying that this type of person exists, just like they do anywhere. Children in this kind of environment will likely fail wherever they are. That's what I thought xabia was talking about, but maybe not.
> 
> As for the other parts to her post, yes, that's the way it is.


yes that's what I meant exactly


----------



## xabiaxica

Pesky Wesky said:


> More info on gcse and igcse
> GCSE English and IGCSE English - what's the difference? | Oxford Open Learning
> They do seem to be quite different actually.
> 
> Where did you read that about how _bad English Language & Literature teaching is in the UK and how brilliant it is in Spain_? I don't remember that thread. People generally say that English teaching in state schools is not of a high standard and as far as I know Eng Lit isn't taught in state schools.
> 
> I have 4 nephews in the UK and they have one gcse between them. They'd be the typical child who'd be lost in the state system here not gaining anything in English nor in Spanish.



this bit was interesting -


> Both GCSE and IGCSE require you to write in a variety of different styles, for different purposes and different media. Texts for comprehension may be more demanding in the IGCSE. *To gain the top marks in IGCSE English, accurate spelling, grammar and syntax are vital, as well as strong essay-construction skills. These are also important in the GCSE but fewer marks depend on them*.


so possibly a higher level of grammar etc is required for the IGCSE - it's certainly more important, anyway


----------



## Pesky Wesky

xabiachica said:


> yes that's what I meant exactly


Good.
I was beginning to doubt my "razor sharp" brain :happy: :rofl: :happy:


----------



## HarryB

Hi. We moved to CDS in 2010 with 2 girls. however we returned to Scotland from CDS. My 2 girls were both at Spanish State School. The youngest was 4 and the eldest 11. My youngest struggled at first with the language obviously, but the teachers were understanding and helped as best they could. She says that she didn't enjoy school in Spain, but she did join in and made friends, both Spanish and British. The amount of Spanish words she learnt was amazing for the short time she was in school. Obviously she could not converse, but she had quite an understanding when someone spoke to her in Spanish, and she has actually retained this very well, even when living back in Scotland. My eldest went to Spanish High School! What an experience that was for her! She was in a class of mostly British kids, many of whom had been in Spain for years, but who could hardly be called bilingual! The discipline was non existent, children were always been excluded and teachers just didn't turn up for classes. My daughter was taught Spanish very well and even went to lessons after school. She thoroughly enjoyed learning Spanish, however the standard of education was far from adequate in other subjects. Hardly any of the British children immersed themselves into the Spanish culture and neither did the Spanish mix with them. Many parents I met were actually very concerned about their child's education as the children who were fluent in Spanish had actually lost the ability to learn in English to the level of a child in the UK. We, as a family, made the decision to return to the UK mainly due to the education in Spain. My eldest is a very bright young lady who is in all the top sets at her High School, and she is actually continuing with learning Spanish and hoping to eventually study this at university. My children learnt much during their time in Spain, especially regarding culture and language. However we were greatly concerned with the education system and with the way in which the local ex pat community integrated. We felt it was the right move to make back to the UK. We are in Scotland and our education system is very good. My daughter's high school has very high expectations of their pupils and push them towards the best they can perform. I keep reading posts from people who are heading out to a new life in Spain who feel everything will be much better than the UK. Spain is a wonderful country, but they are in the grip of economic ruin and I don't feel it is the right thing to do for immigrants to turn up in their Country and demands health care, education etc. I would love to return to Spain one day, but that will be when I am retired and able to give to the economy rather than expect Spain to give to me.


----------



## mrypg9

HarryB said:


> . I keep reading posts from people who are heading out to a new life in Spain who feel everything will be much better than the UK. Spain is a wonderful country, but they are in the grip of economic ruin and I don't feel it is the right thing to do for immigrants to turn up in their Country and demands health care, education etc. I would love to return to Spain one day, but that will be when I am retired and able to give to the economy rather than expect Spain to give to me.


My sentiments exactly.


----------



## Pesky Wesky

HarryB said:


> Hi. We moved to CDS in 2010 with 2 girls. however we returned to Scotland from CDS. My 2 girls were both at Spanish State School. The youngest was 4 and the eldest 11. My youngest struggled at first with the language obviously, but the teachers were understanding and helped as best they could. She says that she didn't enjoy school in Spain, but she did join in and made friends, both Spanish and British. The amount of Spanish words she learnt was amazing for the short time she was in school. Obviously she could not converse, but she had quite an understanding when someone spoke to her in Spanish, and she has actually retained this very well, even when living back in Scotland. My eldest went to Spanish High School! What an experience that was for her! She was in a class of mostly British kids, many of whom had been in Spain for years, but who could hardly be called bilingual! The discipline was non existent, children were always been excluded and teachers just didn't turn up for classes. My daughter was taught Spanish very well and even went to lessons after school. She thoroughly enjoyed learning Spanish, however the standard of education was far from adequate in other subjects. Hardly any of the British children immersed themselves into the Spanish culture and neither did the Spanish mix with them. Many parents I met were actually very concerned about their child's education as the children who were fluent in Spanish had actually lost the ability to learn in English to the level of a child in the UK. We, as a family, made the decision to return to the UK mainly due to the education in Spain. My eldest is a very bright young lady who is in all the top sets at her High School, and she is actually continuing with learning Spanish and hoping to eventually study this at university. My children learnt much during their time in Spain, especially regarding culture and language. However we were greatly concerned with the education system and with the way in which the local ex pat community integrated. We felt it was the right move to make back to the UK. We are in Scotland and our education system is very good. My daughter's high school has very high expectations of their pupils and push them towards the best they can perform. I keep reading posts from people who are heading out to a new life in Spain who feel everything will be much better than the UK. Spain is a wonderful country, but they are in the grip of economic ruin and I don't feel it is the right thing to do for immigrants to turn up in their Country and demands health care, education etc. I would love to return to Spain one day, but that will be when I am retired and able to give to the economy rather than expect Spain to give to me.


Some interesting observations there that I'm sure Jojo and Xabiachica will comment on when they have time.
I'm surprised when you say that teachers didn't turn up and wonder if this is an interpretation of the problems that there are in some Spanish schools with getting subs, as talked about in another thread today. Teachers may see things in a different way to British teachers or British parents, but just not turning up is, of course illegal.
I think the key to the problems you describe is, as others have suggested in previous threads, the refusal in certain areas in the south of Spain of a great number of people from the UK to fit in to the Spanish system. This makes it incredibly difficult for those who do want to be part of that system to get ahead and every one seems to get caught up in this great hamster wheel going round and round, but not making progress. There is little teachers can do in this kind of environment I feel, or perhaps we need to call in LuAnne as portrayed by Michelle Pfeiffer in Dangerous Minds...


----------



## HarryB

I don't actually blame the teachers alone in the school. Many of the British children had no interest in learning at all and often just pleaded inability to understand. Often the teachers own English was not enough for them to fully understand the extent of the indiscipline in the classroom. My daughter wanted to learn, but the lessons were disrupted so often that I think many of the teachers just gave up. My daughter was commended for her hard work in learning Spanish, but she found school so disruptive that we had no choice but to return to Scotland as we feel education to be of such high importance. We do not regret our time in Spain, but felt it was not for us.


----------



## jojo

HarryB said:


> Hi. We moved to CDS in 2010 with 2 girls. however we returned to Scotland from CDS. My 2 girls were both at Spanish State School. The youngest was 4 and the eldest 11. My youngest struggled at first with the language obviously, but the teachers were understanding and helped as best they could. She says that she didn't enjoy school in Spain, but she did join in and made friends, both Spanish and British. The amount of Spanish words she learnt was amazing for the short time she was in school. Obviously she could not converse, but she had quite an understanding when someone spoke to her in Spanish, and she has actually retained this very well, even when living back in Scotland. My eldest went to Spanish High School! What an experience that was for her! She was in a class of mostly British kids, many of whom had been in Spain for years, but who could hardly be called bilingual! The discipline was non existent, children were always been excluded and teachers just didn't turn up for classes. My daughter was taught Spanish very well and even went to lessons after school. She thoroughly enjoyed learning Spanish, however the standard of education was far from adequate in other subjects. Hardly any of the British children immersed themselves into the Spanish culture and neither did the Spanish mix with them. Many parents I met were actually very concerned about their child's education as the children who were fluent in Spanish had actually lost the ability to learn in English to the level of a child in the UK. We, as a family, made the decision to return to the UK mainly due to the education in Spain. My eldest is a very bright young lady who is in all the top sets at her High School, and she is actually continuing with learning Spanish and hoping to eventually study this at university. My children learnt much during their time in Spain, especially regarding culture and language. However we were greatly concerned with the education system and with the way in which the local ex pat community integrated. We felt it was the right move to make back to the UK. We are in Scotland and our education system is very good. My daughter's high school has very high expectations of their pupils and push them towards the best they can perform. I keep reading posts from people who are heading out to a new life in Spain who feel everything will be much better than the UK. Spain is a wonderful country, but they are in the grip of economic ruin and I don't feel it is the right thing to do for immigrants to turn up in their Country and demands health care, education etc. I would love to return to Spain one day, but that will be when I am retired and able to give to the economy rather than expect Spain to give to me.



The section I've highlighted in red........... I totally and completely agree with!!!!!

As for the education, yes, I found with my daughters first school (she was 10), she was in a class with several British kids, who seemed to only be there because it was good for baby sitting. The kids didnt want to learn or to integrate and the teacher didnt bother to try. The spanish kids didnt like the Brits and vice versa - sadly neither group of them liked my daughter cos they said she was snobby!!?

So we sent her to a different spanish school - ESO, where she did better. She was the only British in her class and the spanish kids rallied round and made her feel welcome. But by then, hormones had arrived. My daughter decided she didnt like Spain, the Spanish, the language, the work and therefore didnt try and ended up skiving! 

So we then sent her to an international school, where she flourished. She had friends of all nationalities and really did well. Sadly, we then returned to the UK and she settled into a soft, easy school who didnt push or discipline, so she's about to fail her GCSEs !

Jo xxx


----------



## HarryB

That's such a shame Jojo. We heard mixed reports on Infernational schools. We were in La Cala de Mijas and the nearest were quite a distance so we opted for village schools. I did hear, from Spanish friends we made that the Spanish private schools are very good, but obviously Spanish has to be spoken perfectly for that. Our schools in Fife in Scotland are very good. Both my kids are thriving back here and loving school. However I think we left part of us back in Spain and will probably always miss it.


----------



## markbrin1984

Hi there 

Having just been on a 1 week visit to Spain. We really like the area of Elviria and it is on great bus routes for all the international schools which is perfect for us.


----------



## Pesky Wesky

HarryB said:


> My daughter was commended for her hard work in learning Spanish, but she found school so disruptive that we had no choice but to return to Scotland as we feel education to be of such high importance. We do not regret our time in Spain, but felt it was not for us.


Or go to a different part of Spain.
I'm no expert, but I've only heard of this kind of British immigrant grouping together in such large numbers as to affect the education system, in the _South_ of Spain, and not in all parts of the south...


----------

