# EEA family permit questions PLEASE HELP ME!



## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

I am so utterly confused and so incredibly frustrated at how hard it is for me to find information on everything I need, because everything I read contradicts itself. 
my husband is a citizen of greece.
First of all, I'm an american citizen. could i go to england on the visa waiver program and apply for the residence card there? since it akes a long time, would they give me a paper saying that i am awaiting my card so i can live and work in england (so i dont have to wait without working or leave the uk for 6 months).

or do you need the eea family permit as some sort of pre requisite to the residence card?

if i do need the eea family permit, can someone please tell me what i exactly need to bring to the visa centre when i apply.
i have no bank accounts, no job, and neither does my husband. we were living with his mother and her boyfriend for 9 months out of our 11 month marriage. (its a long story but we would have enough money to move to england). 
so don't include the financial extras people bring.

this is where i get confused. i've read that you don't need any of these things (relating to money, jobs, apartments, bank accounts). however on the application guideline it asks for a letter from employer. 
is that extra?

on the application should i say i'm unemployed or that my spouses family supports me ?

so if someone could make a list of all the essentials, please that would help me so much.

application
fingerprints
passport colored photo
photos of me and my husband together
my passport
his greek passport (or a copy? which one do i need?)
our marriage certificate (does it have to be translated and notorized to english? it was in greek).
we have our names in the newspaper..should we bring that?
would it have to be translated and notorized..? 

what else would we have to bring?
to prove we were living together, could we have my husband's mother's boyfriend write a letter that we were living with him from this date to that date?


thank you!


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

You should try to apply for EEA family permit prior to arriving in UK. While you can arrive as visitor and then apply for residence card in UK, you may face hassle and delay at UK border as that's not the normal way of doing things. 

To apply for EEA family permit, just answer no to questions that don't apply, such as relating to jobs. All you need to supply are:
Your US passport (original) and copy of your husband's Greek passport, certified as genuine by the Greek embassy/consulate.
Your marriage certificate professionally translated into English.
As you haven't been married long, some evidence of a genuine and enduring relationship, such as trips taken together, photos of engagement and wedding etc.
A letter by your husband stating that he is going to UK to look for work and requesting that an EEA family permit be issued to you for you to accompany him.
Some evidence of funds, like savings account statement, but this isn't essential.
Your photo.


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## Jrge (Mar 22, 2011)

Hi,


swiftmarriana said:


> I am so utterly confused and so incredibly frustrated at how hard it is for me to find information on everything I need, because everything I read contradicts itself.
> my husband is a citizen of greece.
> First of all, I'm an american citizen. could i go to england on the visa waiver program and apply for the residence card there? since it akes a long time, would they give me a paper saying that i am awaiting my card so i can live and work in england (so i dont have to wait without working or leave the uk for 6 months).
> 
> ...


Further to what Joppa has laid out, we always recommend to print the VAF5 form and mock it. It will prepare you to fill out the on-line form (mind they are significant differences in both, but it's an excellent guideline)

Another important recommendation is in regards of funding. Whilst you do not need to disclose your finances, I encourage Expats to have at least 3 months of "survival" savings.

Animo
(Cheers)


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

why would i have trouble at the borders? i want to get the family permit however my husband's family thinks it would be too much trouble, financially, and within the time limit until we have to leave russia. 
if i would apply for the residence permit in the UK without the family permit, could i still live and work there (i assume they give you a paper saying that i can while i await my card).
or is this too risky..? i notice a lot of american's getting family permits, but to be honest i'm still unsure of the benefit i could just go there without it. 

i could get his passport certified in the greek consulate in russia, correct?

since we haven't been together long, and he hates taking photos, we haven't amassed that many photos together. maybe 8..10..12..14 photos?
i'm assuming i can only send one photo out of 3-4 we took all at the same time (we were sitting on a bench and we have like 10 photos of us just trying not to laugh as we take a picture..but im assuming only one photo from that group will count. ..or should i send all of them?).

we have no accounts, only cash. could i mention our savings in our cover letter?

and again, could i have his mother's boyfriend write a letter saying that we were living with him during this time?


as you see, to be honest i feel like because of our financial situation (we had a civil wedding..in normal clothing.. doesn't look like wedding photos) and i guess our lack of photos (unless 10 photos all on different occasions are enough), i really feel like they'll deny us!

two last questions i promise!!
fingerprints and face scans will be done at the visa centre when i go to apply?

do you know any sites (or do you know yourselves) on a cover letter guideline, and letter from my husband guideline ?

thank you both so much!
i actually got an account here hoping that at least one of you two would answer since i saw how informative and great your answers were to others on this forum!


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## Guest (Jul 16, 2013)

If they are going to refuse you for not believing you are in a genuine relationship due to lack of evidence they are just as likely to do that if you apply in the UK or from where you are. Only difference is you will be asked to leave the UK rather than just a refusal.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

First, EEA family permit is issued free. Any expense is for travelling, getting supporting documents etc. 
Home Office would rather that you applied for family permit first, rather than chance it at UK border, where they don't have time nor facilities to conduct in-depth checks. You are afraid of a refusal for family permit, but provided you have evidence of marriage and reasonable proof of genuine relationship, there is little that can go wrong. It's when you come to apply for residence card that extensive checks will be carried out to make sure you meet all the requirements, including your sponsor exercising treaty rights in UK. As for lack of jobs etc, that's not a reson for denying you family permit, but as Jrge says, include what evidence you have of funds to show you won't be penniless on arrival.
Sponsorship letter can literally be a couple of lines, such as 'Dear Entry Clearance Officer, I am the EEA spouse of AB and will be travelling to UK to look for work, and I request that EEA family permit be issued to my wife to enable her to accompany me.'


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

yes, i'm aware it's free. it's just russia is so big, so if i have to include a copy of his I.D., i'd have to spend maybe a 100 euro just to go to moscow just to go to the greek embassy. 
the visa centre is 9 hours away! it's such a hassle. 
that being said, can i just include his greek I.D.? do we have to get a certified copy? it would be such a hassle to do that. 

if we don't have bank accounts, how should we do this? we are planning on opening one in the U.K. (since i don't know how to do this in russia).

all i have to prove our relationship is about (now that i counted) 40 pictures of us, some on the same day, some at other locations, some travelling. 
our marriage certificate
our names in the newspaper
a letter from his mother's boyfriend saying we lived with him for 9 months in greece.

do you think that is enough?

thank you!


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

You can send Greek national ID instead.
If you don't have bank account, I suppose you can't show evidence of funds. Opening an offshore account may be one way - try some UK financial institutions.
You have to attend in person at visa application centre located in Moscow, St Petersburg, Ekaterinburg, Novosibirsk or Rostov-on-Don for biometrics and submitting supporting documents. They will be returned to you by courier so you only have one journey to make. Any help?
UK Border Agency | Russian Federation

Your supporting evidence should be enough, unless they have reasons to believe your marriage is one of convenience.
Finally, you can apply for EEA family permit anywhere outside UK, so if you are back in Greece on holiday, you can apply there and then.


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

thank you so much! you've really helped ease my mind (..at least a bit).

i have a permanent residence card in greece. should i give that as well? can i give it just like that, or would i need a copy of it/ translated/ etc (although i think they have english written on it, i can't remember).

so i can just give his I.D. card without a copy! nice (i hope that's what you meant).

also when i get things translated, should they be notarized as well? or just with a stamp of the people who translated it (i don't remember how that works). 

yes i was looking at some offshore banking today. although all of them want such large deposits in them, unless i'm just reading it wrong. i will look more into it though, thank you. 

i want to apply for it in greece, but my spouse's family doesn't want to pay to go to greece first. 
by the way, if you know, what if my temporary visa runs out while my eea family permit is still processing ? i don't think that will happen, but if you know the answer that would be good to know. i read somewhere someone else can pick it up, but wouldn't my passport still be there?

sorry for so many questions!


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

"If someone else is paying for your trip, you should explain why they are paying and include their original financial documents."
(on the site of the link you gave me)

oh no! does that mean i can't apply ?????
in russia, his mother is taking loans from her sister (who gets paid from the insurance of her deceased husband) and her mother (who gets money from her retirement) !! 
my husband and his brother will help, however they work at a factory and get paid by cash (its sort of an 'avoiding the army' job).
also my parents will help a bit, but not too much. they'll send money thru western union. 

what do i do ?? can i not apply anymore??


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Your Greece PR card isn't necessary.
Send a plain photocopy and original of Greek national ID.
Just certified translation with the translator's details attached.
Nationwide has instant access account from £1. See Sterling offshore savings accounts at a glace - Nationwide International
Only you need to go to Greece and stay long enough to get the permit (allow up to about a month). As an American, you can stay up to 90-in-180 days. If you need to return to Russia, I suggest you get it first extended before you go or apply afresh in Greece (though being without your passport will make it difficult).

Don't worry about someone else paying for the trip. EEA family permit is free and this doesn't apply to those moving under EU regulations.


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

WOW thank you so much. seriously i would be so lost. i tried calling the visa centre today that said they would answer questions...however then they told me they don't answer questions and i can email only!
so you have been the biggest help.

to be honest i don't want to end this thread in case i have another question!

if i have anymore, is there any way of me being able to contact you? or should i just post a new thread and hope you're there!

every night i have been on the verge of tears because all of this is stressing me out so much (and being in a country where i don't speak the language makes it so much more confusing), but finally i feel a bit more calm and not so lost!

again THANK YOU so much!


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

...sorry i do actually have a few quick questions.

can my husband's letter and my cover letter be hand written? or should it be typed and printed out?
does it matter what kind of paper we use? can it be just normal paper, or just a blank white page, etc? i assume we can only use blue or black ink.

and also:
my husband's mother's boyfriend is willing to write a letter saying we lived at his apartment for 9 months (we didnt pay rent or anything). 
how should he write his letter? (if he can)? since he lives in greece, can he write it on the computer and email it to us, we can print it out and then have in translated to english?
and how should he go about writing this letter?

if you could answer these last questions, i would be so grateful.. !


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

jeez sorry i can't stop thinking of new questions!
about the cover letter i will write, 
i heard the template is:

First Paragraph: A brief introduction of the EEA National and a description of their non-EEA spouse/patner. Details such as, length of marriage and details of their trips are very important.

Second Paragraph: Kindly and respectfully ask for the Family Permit to be issued, as indicated on DIRECTIVE 2004/38C, for which you are submitting supporting documents. Those documents need to be listed.

Third Paragraph: Kindly assure the information provided is true, and should they have the need to contact you, they can do it by email (make sure you put it down) or telephone (make sure to include international access codes)


but what kind of brief introduction do they want for us?
My spouse's name is _____. He is __ years old. He obtained citizenship in Greece in may 2012. (should i mention he was in the greek army? he was there for 9 months, HOWEVER, he was an evzones, so we saw each other almost everyday (that includes nights) (obviously i would rather not mention it because they might not know what an evzones is and think i didnt see him at all for 9 months, which is NOT the case... we were very lucky). My name is ____. im _____ years old. i am an american citizen. I moved to greece on june __ 2012 to live with my now spouse. on ___ we got married, and on ___ i obtained a permanent residence card in greece. (details on our relationship before and after marriage, including trips we took, where we travelled etc.)

2nd paragraph: i just repeat what was written and include a list

3rd: i just write what was written, correct?

sorry, i feel really awkward saying thank you and then submitting three more long questions. but i really want this to go perfectly and smoothly and you're my only source of information (that is tailored for my situation) !

i hope you don't mind!


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

my passport still has my old last name. 
on my cover letter, should i write my name with my old last name? i technically got it changed when we got married, so in my cover letter should i write my name with my husband's last name, or since my passport has my maiden name, should i write my maiden name down.
should i explain in the cover letter that i never changed my passport because i didn't think it was necessary and i would need it to be changed?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

You are overthinking!
The letter can be very simple, just a couple of lines.
Best to type out or word process than write by hand to make it easier to read.
No such letter is needed from your mother's boyfriend.
Your passport issue is immaterial. They will know it's yours if it's still in your maiden name or married name.


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## Jrge (Mar 22, 2011)

Hi,

Please use this:

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/924696-post23.html

Animo
(Cheers)


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

thank you again, joppa! (and jrge).
i'm just so incredibly worried about getting denied because we don't have bank accounts or real wedding photos (since we had a civil marriage, we just sort of dressed 'nicely'..considering how hot it was in greece).

now for the hardest part...trying to find a professional translator in russia that translates from greek to english...............
i'm just going to put this out here:
i know it has to be professionally translated, but.. is it possible to have my husband translate it? and then get it some official stamp saying it is a good translation?
or does it HAVE to be translated only by a third party, someone whose job is translations?


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

now that i think about it, i assume it's a no. how would he even translate it, on a piece of paper? hah.


can i write in my cover letter if our lack of bank statements proving our funds not to be an issue, for my spouse's family doesn't have bank accounts. but we plan on opening a joint bank account upon arrival in the UK?

is that weird to mention?

by the way, our translated marriage certificate, should we provide the original or just a photocopy of the original ?


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

How to make certified translations of official documents

hmmm do you think my husband could actually be able to make his translation certified like this?
(im getting desperate after too many failed attempts finding any person who translates from greek to english...in russia).


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## Jrge (Mar 22, 2011)

Hi,

Joppa has suggested to stop over thinking.

*I AM *telling you the following:

1) Do not worry about ANY bank account(s). *PERIOD*...

2) If he is competent and capable to accurately translate your marriage certificate to English, then have him doing that. You must include an original document no copies. *PERIOD*...

3) Whilst it isn't mandatory to include pictures of any nature, and you claim to have had a simple civil ceremony, then only include -for whatever reason that might be- one (1) or (2). UKBA does NOT care if you were wearing jeans or shorts, or if your spouse smiles or not. *PERIOD*....

Obtaining a Family Permit under EU regulations it's the easiest thing a non-EU national can get.

Animo
(Cheers)


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

alright i won't mention bank accounts in the cover letter!

he can translate it ?! THANK GOD!!
i think that means i can actually apply for it now!

i remember us having 3 photos all in the same place, position. i can't find them anymore...
i do have a photo of me alone (he took) and him alone ( i took) in the exact same place.
i realize that probably won't count though.

hopefully my 40 other photos will be enough... i would include our years of skype/msn but i read that it is pretty useless.

i guess im over-thinking, you're right. i keep reading terrible denial stories from people who had even more than us so that's why im so stressed i think.

hopefully i won't have anymore questions but that didn't really turn out well the last time i said that!

thank you. i still would feel more confident if joppa gave a second opinion on my husband translating the marriage certificate...

but either way, we'll get started. THANK YOU!


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

_Pace_ Jrge, I still think professional translation is better. Or for a fee, you can deposit marriage details with the General Register Office through UK consulate (when living abroad) or Foreign Office (in London). This way, you can get your marriage certificate, in English, from GRO, and you can even apply online and they will post it to you anywhere in the world. You have to enclose original marriage certificate and certified English translation.
See https://www.gov.uk/deposit-foreign-marriage


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

thank joppa. i am checking out the site now. 
i see, so i have to deposit the marriage certificate, they send it back, then i can order an english translation of it then?

i can see why official things always look better, but if my husband is fully capable, what would be the problem with it? are they more likely to deny a FP?
or are they really strict with translations and if one word isn't up to the standards, they deny it ?


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

found this under the translation section in ukba (at least in the russian one)

If you send us a translation of an overseas qualification or award certificate, we will not consider it as a direct translation of the academic level of that award. We will always use UK NARIC to assess the equivalency of overseas qualifications.

i really don't understand what that means?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

Doesn't apply to things like marriage certificate, only academic certificate or diploma when you are trying to prove something like you have a degree taught in English to be exempt from having to take an English test. 

As for professional translation, it must be verifiable so they insist on professional translator whose capability they can check out. The advantage of depositing marriage certificate is you can get an official English certificate at any time, instead of having to provide an official translation each time.


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

so since it's my husband would they deny it? or does it just make it a strong chance of being denied.
obviously i would like to go this route unless its 99.9% chance of being denied because depositing it, getting it back, then buying an english translation would cost a lot of money. roubli is in very bad condition, so the pound requires a lot more than it seems.

but if it's just something they'd prefer and not something they would deny, i would obviously much rather have my husband do it. since we don't need a letter from his mother's boyfriend, it'd only be one document anyway.
i mean, at least on the russian site, it says it just needs confirmation from the translator. 
i'm assuming if he'd translate it, and we would get it notarized, it would be sufficient?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

It will have to be by third-party professional translator, as they may want to speak to them about the translation (hence the need to provide their address). Translation done by the applicant or relative will not be accepted.

This is what Home Office says about documents:

"If your document is not in English or Welsh, the original *must be sent with a fully certified translation by a professional translator*. This translation must include information about translator and *their work as a translator*, and their confirmation that it is an accurate translation of the original document. The translator must sign and date the document."


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

wow! how misleading. the russian ukba site says:
"If you send us a document that is not in English or Welsh, it must be accompanied by a full translation that can be independently verified by us. Each translated document must contain:

confirmation from the translator that it is an accurate translation of the original document;
the date of the translation;
the translator's full name and signature; and
the translator's contact details."

anyway,
the site you referred me to, i don't think i can get?
it says this is for UK residents. also i downloaded the application and the checklist involved having one british passport?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

I don't know the different versions of translation requirement circulating, but I know Home Office requires translation to be independently verifiable, i.e. not done by the applicant or partner but by someone who has professional certification or endorsement (regulations vary among countries). Some country pages have a list of approved translators.


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## swiftmarriana (Jul 15, 2013)

hm, that's incredibly disheartening.
i really don't know what to do now. my spouse and my spouse's family seem to refuse to help me in anyway despite they're the ones that speak russian.
kind of weird, i didn't expect a translation to be the thing that will probably cause us to lose 4-5 months and set us back hundreds in funding, since we both have to leave russia in september (so i guess we'd go to greece).

i guess i don't really have any questions because i doubt i will be able to apply.
if i do, well you'll see me around i guess

thank you for all your help!


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## Jrge (Mar 22, 2011)

Hi


Joppa said:


> _Pace_ Jrge......


Cheers.

That morning someone smashed my X6, lost my connecting flight to Chicago, one of my takeovers went into a poison pill and....I more importantly, hadn't had my coffee yet.

But, I'm back in business..

Animo
(Cheers)


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## Criss (Sep 24, 2013)

Hi,

Thank you for this information.

I am in a similar situation where I am a non-EEA citizen married to a EEA citizen currently staying outside of the UK and we are planning to move to the UK by applying for the EEA family permit.

I spoke to a VISA agency and they advised me to apply for a "temporary EEA permit" that will allow me to stay in the UK for an initial period of 6 months. Once we are in the UK, I should then do an additional application for a full 5 year EEA Family Permit extension as this only done within the UK. (extension known as Residence card) 

I have been searching this forum and has not seen anything about applying for a 6 month permit first and then for a 5 year extension once we are in the UK.

This makes me think that the agency might be trying to make additional money from me by assisting me to do 2 applications.

Can you please confirm the period of the EEA family permit that is made from outside of the UK? 
Do I need to do an additional application for a full 5 year EEA Family Permit extension once in the UK?

Your assistance is appreciated.


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

We don't offer second opinion to those who are being advised professionally.
The agency is basically correct, though some of their terminology isn't.
There is only one kind of EEA family permit, valid 6 months, and it cannot be extended. Instead, after moving to UK and once your spouse starts working or otherwise exercising treaty rights, you apply for residence card on form EEA2 valid 5 years.
You should be able to make both applications without professional help.
Details you require are in 
UK Border Agency | EEA family permits
UK Border Agency | Residence documents for non-EEA family members of EEA nationals


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