# Visa visiteur online renewal



## mem1476

Hi all,
I am an American currently on a visa long sejour visiteur that expires January 28, 2022. I am trying to renew my visa through the new online system. I am hoping to travel to the US for the month of January, leaving around Christmas and returning back after my current visa is expired. I am also likely moving departments at this time (I am currently in l’Aude but when I return from the US will likely be elsewhere-TBD). I am wondering the following questions:
1) if I haven’t received my new visa prior to departure to the US, Will I be able to get back into France?
2) If I receive notice that my visa is ready for pick up while I am in the US, can my French partner go pick it up for me at the prefecture? Then send it to me if I will need it to renter?
3) Could I reenter on a tourist visa? And then pick it up after?
4) For anyone who has been through the process through the new online system, about how long did it take you from submittal to receipt?
5) do they give you any kind of récépissé in the meantime that can serve to help me renter France before I have my official card?
Any advice or insight is much appreciated! Thanks.
M


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## Bevdeforges

It may depend a little bit on what sort of visa/carte de séjour you are on - primarily for how long your renewal may or may not take. But if you are traveling on a US passport, you shouldn't have any problem re-entering France. Chances are, they'll just stamp your passport like you were a regular tourist and that will be the end of it all. More important is whether or not you have the necessary pandemic documents (vaccination proof, negative Covid test, whatever it is at the time).

But aren't you also trying to process a change of status at the same time? (To vie privée et familiale from something else?) That may preclude you using the online system. Hopefully someone here will have some experience that will be useful.


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## mem1476

Hey Bev, thanks for the response as always! Yes, I was initially planning a status change, but it’s looking more complicated than I thought. The main factor is that I will very likely be moving out of my current department (Aude) around Christmas time, but I don’t know where to yet… (my partner is waiting to hear back from multiple potential job offers). The appointment slot they gave me at the Aude prefecture was for Jan 7 when 1) I likely won’t live there anymore and 2) I will ideally be traveling in the US from then until the end of my current visa (jan 28). I’ve had so much trouble getting answers from the prefectures that I’ve resigned myself to probably just renewing my visitor VLS-TS online and keep visitor status for now 
All that said, if I do go the visitor visa online renewal route, do you have any insight as to how long it would take and if I’d have any temporary proof to show that it’s processing in the meantime that would help me re-enter if they gave me any trouble?
If I just try to enter as a tourist after my visa has expired and before my new one is approved, wouldn’t they deny me as I would have already been in France more than 90 days within the last 180?
Thanks for your insight!
M


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## BackinFrance

If you are currently in France on a visa or titre de séjour, that time does not count as 90/180. Only time that you spend in France once it has expired counts.


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## mem1476

Oh great! Thanks for the info. Do you have a link or website where this info is stated to back me up just in case?


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## BackinFrance

No I don't, do your own research on the 90/180 rule.


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## Bevdeforges

mem1476 said:


> Oh great! Thanks for the info. Do you have a link or website where this info is stated to back me up just in case?


I don't think there is a handy dandy link you can use for this. The fact of the matter is that the 90/180 rule pertains to "tourist" or short-stay visas, whereas long-stay visas and residence permits (i.e. cartes de séjour) fall under a different category in the law. Though that's why they won't worry about your entering the country after your original long stay visa/residence permit expires. That starts a new clock.

However - do be certain that your current visitor visa is a renewable one. If your "renewal" is denied (because your visa wasn't the renewable kind) you'll wind up having to go back and start over again with a new visa. (Including a return back "home" to the US). In a sense, that's one reason to go for the change in status now (which probably means you'd have to go through the prefecture and not the online procedure) because if your visitor visa isn't renewable, you'll probably find out about that pretty quickly (i.e. because they won't accept your dossier). If needs be, you could apply for another visa while you're back in the US.


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## mem1476

Thanks so much for the info Bev. This is helpful. Do you know how I would know for sure that my current visitor visa is renewable? It was a one year visa from Jan 28 2021 until Jan 22 2022. Is there a quick way to determine that you’re aware of?


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## Bevdeforges

Basically, on the form you filled in to apply for the visa there are apparently two different spaces - under the question about how long you intend to stay in France. One is for "one year" and the other is for "one year +" though I don't know what the actual wording is on the forms. We have a couple of forum members who got tripped up by this. Let's see if we can flag them down here to find out what information they have to share on this question.


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## mem1476

Oh dear. I just looked at my original app form and I checked the box "6 mos to 1 year" (which was my plan at the time - times have changed...). 
Do you know if this factor also would affect my ability to change status to a vie privee et familiale, if I'm able to make that work out instead? 
I'll go digging for others in the forum who have been hung up on this issue. If you find any related threads, I'd love to see!

Thanks for your help.
M


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## Bevdeforges

That's kind of what I was afraid of. Though, if you're headed back to the States at the end of the year anyhow, you could book an appointment at the VFS agency to process a new visa application for while you are there (preferably early in your stay) and just get a new visa. I would think that perhaps the visa agency would be a bit more in the know about how easy or difficult it might be to apply for a vie privee et familiale in your situation - or you could go the visiteur visa route again, just being sure to tick the "1 year +" box this time.


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## bhamham

For LSV-TS the number on the visa just below 'Visiteur' 311-3 5° is the visa that is renewable yearly. 

See this thread: Steps to take once in France on LSV-Visiteur


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## mem1476

Oh! Great! That is what my visa says. Thanks, very reassuring. I heard rumors that to renew you need to have proof of your medical visit done with OFII as well as proof of health insurance specifically through a French company and that proof of funds need to be in a French account... Do you happen to know anything about this?
Thanks!


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## Bevdeforges

Exactly which proofs of what you need to renew a titre de séjour depends quite a bit on what sort of residence permit you are on. As a "visiteur" you probably only had to get the OFII medical visit and that very well may be required. Proof of health insurance can be either a private policy or the fact that you are registered with CPAM for the French national system. And the proof of funds/financial resources is based on the same thing that you provided initially for your visa application. (If you can show that you have a French bank account with regular deposits - whether "income" or regular transfers from "back home" - that should do as well.) 

Basically to renew your visa/authorization to remain in France, you have to be able to show that the same conditions that got you your visa are still valid.


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## mem1476

Got it, thanks Bev. I have all the same docs available and same funds, insurance, etc. It's just that my insurance is through a private US based travel insurance company, and my funds (although adequate amount) are in USD through a US bank account (this is what I used as proof of funds originally). I wasn't sure if those would get me hung up in the renewal process...

Regarding OFII, when I call them to ask they tell me to ask the prefecture and when I ask the prefecture they tell me to ask OFII  I'm still waiting for my convocation for my medical appt as I moved departments which I think delayed my dossier. I don't know what else to do there besides hope that explaining the situation is enough for the visa renewal...


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## BackinFrance

When you don't get called in for an appointment with OFii, I believe it is usually because you don't have a renewable visa/TDS.


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## mem1476

I did get called, but I was called by OFII Marseille right after I moved out of Bouches du Rhone to another department. I told them I moved and they said it was fine and they would transfer my dossier to my new department. They said I will receive a call from OFII Montpellier instead, but I still haven't received that one... I've called back to verify that it was transferred properly and they said yes and I'll just need to wait.


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## BackinFrance

You were very brave asking for your file to be transferred in the middle of a pandemic when Marseille wasn'tarso aff and you had not moved far away. If anyou asked OFii in Marseille to transfer your file to Montpellier, they are the people you will need to follow through with. Or perhaps they can give you a new appointment in Marseille, you haveyou never know your luck. 

I assume this is the reason you have not joined the French health system.


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## mem1476

I didn’t directly ask them to transfer my file, I just mentioned that I needed to update my address and they said they would have to transfer my file as I had moved. They said it’s common and not a big deal and they went ahead with it without me having much say in the matter… I’ve called OFII marseille back several times and they just say “keep waiting” every time…

i also have my dossier into CPAM for secu but haven’t heard a response yet.


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## Bevdeforges

It's the prefecture that handles any renewal of your TDS - check their website to see what documents they "normally" require. I'm not sure if the medical exam is among them - but these days you never know. You'll have to deal with the OFII to get the medical exam scheduled and taken care of.


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## mem1476

Thanks Bev.


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## mem1476

Hey Bev - I have two quick questions that I'm guessing you know the quick answers to 

1) do you know if the changement de statut (specifically from visiteur to vie privee et familiale) can happen at any time or does it need to be during the renewal period at the end of my titre de sejour validity?
2) all paperwork seems to say that for a renewal of a visitor titre de sejour, the dossier needs to be submitted "deux mois avant l'expiration du titre actuel." I had assumed this to mean prior to the 2 month before mark (e.g. if my visa expires jan 28, I would need to submit PRIOR to nov 28). I'm now wondering if I misinterpreted this and it needs to be submitted WITHIN the two months (i.e. BETWEEN nov 28 - jan 28). Any insight here?

Thanks again for all your help, and happy Tuesday.
M


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## Bevdeforges

OK - though you may not be wild about the answers here:
1) As far as I know, you can only get a change of statut when applying for "renewal" of your current TDS. Someone else here may have different information or experience - and there is also the possibility that this might vary by departement (i.e. by prefecture).

2) Again as far as I know, they usually say that you can't submit your dossier more than two months in advance. (Though it used to be "two to three" months.) Again, check the website for your local prefecture to see what they say about renewing titres de séjour to be sure. Paperwork is fine, but these things have been ever-changing and generally speaking, the prefecture's website is (or should be) the most up to date source.


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## mem1476

Thanks Bev. Here's what the Aix en Provence sous-prefecture says (where I will likely be moving to shortly and what I will use as my address in the dossier):

Les formulaires de demande de renouvellement doivent être téléchargés sur le site internet de la préfecture et transmis par voie postale, *2 mois avant l’expiration des titres*. La procédure est identique pour les demandes de changement de statut.

Les retraits de dossiers ne sont plus effectués en préfecture et sous-préfectures.

*ATTENTION* : Le renouvellement d'un titre de séjour demandé après l'expiration du délai requis pour le dépôt de la demande donne lieu, sauf cas de force majeure ou présentation d'un visa en cours de validité, à l'acquittement d'un *droit de visa de régularisation de 180 €* (article L436-5 du CESEDA)

I'm having trouble interpreting this... Do you think this means I must submit the dossier by post no later than 2 months before my expiration, or no earlier than the 2 month prior mark??

Thanks,
M


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## Bevdeforges

I'd shoot for submitting your dossier right around the 2 month mark - a couple days either side shouldn't matter. But if you submit it too early (say, 3 months ahead of time) you run the risk of them returning it to you as being too early.


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## mem1476

Got it, thanks Bev.

A follow up question around proof of health insurance for the visitor TDS renewal online: It says to show proof for the duration of your visa (1 year). My health insurance company is on a quarterly basis, so I renew my health insurance every 3 months and get a new policy attestation each time. Do you think it would be enough to prove 3 months of insurance only and then explain in the extra notes that this is why? Have you heard of people getting denied for this?

Thank you!!


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## Bevdeforges

Have you had this health insurance for the first year that you've been living here? Because after 3 months of residence in France, you're supposed to be able to apply for the French CPAM cover, which is actually the ideal one to produce for a TDS renewal. If you're going for a change in status to vie privée et familiale, it may be possible to qualify for the national plan under your partner's program - but you'd have to ask CPAM about that. 

It might be sufficient to show that you did, indeed, hold the quarterly policy throughout your first year, and that you have renewed for the current quarter, with the intention to continue the same policy until you are registered with CPAM.


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## Glolil

mem1476 said:


> Hi all,
> I am an American currently on a visa long sejour visiteur that expires January 28, 2022. I am trying to renew my visa through the new online system. I am hoping to travel to the US for the month of January, leaving around Christmas and returning back after my current visa is expired. I am also likely moving departments at this time (I am currently in l’Aude but when I return from the US will likely be elsewhere-TBD). I am wondering the following questions:
> 1) if I haven’t received my new visa prior to departure to the US, Will I be able to get back into France?
> 2) If I receive notice that my visa is ready for pick up while I am in the US, can my French partner go pick it up for me at the prefecture? Then send it to me if I will need it to renter?
> 3) Could I reenter on a tourist visa? And then pick it up after?
> 4) For anyone who has been through the process through the new online system, about how long did it take you from submittal to receipt?
> 5) do they give you any kind of récépissé in the meantime that can serve to help me renter France before I have my official card?
> Any advice or insight is much appreciated! Thanks.
> M


Hi. My answer applies only to the time it took for them to accept my renewal application. I have Carte De Sejour Temporaire which expires Nov 22, 2021. I submitted my application for renewal online on Sep 23, 2021. I received notification yesterday Nov 2, 2021 that my application was accepted, my card is being processed and that I will receive another notification to pick it up from the prefecture. This will be my third Carte De Sejour. It was renewed for 1 year. And it's "Visiteur" since I am here as a retiree.


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## mem1476

Hi Bev and Glolil,

Thank you both for your insight. I have applied for CPAM, but just a few weeks ago as I was originally told I couldn't apply for it on a visitor visa (ugh). I only learned that it was in fact possible several weeks ago, and they've said I should expect it to take several months. I asked for a justificatif showing that I applied, hoping that will help with the TDS renewal, and they said they will "try to send one by post" but I have little faith that will actually come through in any reasonable timeline... 
On the otherhand, I can prove that I was covered under the same private company the full duration of my past 8 months in France, and can show a three month booking for the following period as well. I hope this will be enough...


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## gpstar

Hello, not sure if this helps.

I went through 3 years on a carte de séjour temporaire "visiteur" (2 renewals + initial visa de long séjour), I got on CPAM etc no problem. Last year I switched to a carte de séjour "vie privée et familiale" after my longterm girlfriend and I Pac's and it became time for renewal on my visiteur titre de séjour. Each time on my renewals and even switching over to "vie privée et familiale", I would receive my new card within 6 weeks after dropping off my dossier at the préfecture. It was the usual, make appointment online with the préfecture and go in and drop off my dossier. Now for this year, I did the same (remember the vie privée et familiale is valid for 1 year on the first time, then becomes valid for 2 years the next time), but it appears at around the time I dropped off my dossier, everything was about to be switching over to online which apparently started around the 13th of September. I have been waiting for 18 weeks now and counting.


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## mem1476

gpstar said:


> Hello, not sure if this helps.
> 
> I went through 3 years on a carte de séjour temporaire "visiteur" (2 renewals + initial visa de long séjour), I got on CPAM etc no problem. Last year I switched to a carte de séjour "vie privée et familiale" after my longterm girlfriend and I Pac's and it became time for renewal on my visiteur titre de séjour. Each time on my renewals and even switching over to "vie privée et familiale", I would receive my new card within 6 weeks after dropping off my dossier at the préfecture. It was the usual, make appointment online with the préfecture and go in and drop off my dossier. Now for this year, I did the same (remember the vie privée et familiale is valid for 1 year on the first time, then becomes valid for 2 years the next time), but it appears at around the time I dropped off my dossier, everything was about to be switching over to online which apparently started around the 13th of September. I have been waiting for 18 weeks now and counting.


Thanks for sharing your experience! Helpful to hear. When you first renewed your visitor TDS after your first year on the visitor visa, had you already received CPAM coverage at the time that you applied for the renewal?


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## gpstar

mem1476 said:


> Thanks for sharing your experience! Helpful to hear. When you first renewed your visitor TDS after your first year on the visitor visa, had you already received CPAM coverage at the time that you applied for the renewal?


No, I didn't apply for the CPAM until after my first renewal. During my first renewal, I just showed them my travel health insurance coverage that I purchased in Canada to cover myself here.


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## mem1476

Ah great! What company did you use? And did you purchase the full year of health insurance to cover the entire TDS valid period? I’m expecting my CPAM app to go through likely early into my renewal, but after I need to provide proof of health insurance. So I’m hesitating because I don’t want to pay a full year of private insurance if my CPAM goes through shortly after… I’m trying to find a plan that meets the visa requirements AND will let me cancel once CPAM goes through. Any tips appreciated


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## gpstar

mem1476 said:


> Ah great! What company did you use? And did you purchase the full year of health insurance to cover the entire TDS valid period? I’m expecting my CPAM app to go through likely early into my renewal, but after I need to provide proof of health insurance. So I’m hesitating because I don’t want to pay a full year of private insurance if my CPAM goes through shortly after… I’m trying to find a plan that meets the visa requirements AND will let me cancel once CPAM goes through. Any tips appreciated


I purchased EXPATRIÉS CANADIENS Option de luxe (Canadian expat insurance) from Allianz for the entire full year (12 months), it did not cost much, around $500 Canadian dollars at the time, the deluxe option covers you up to 2million. It covers you in the entire world except the United States and Mexico (though the booklet says it covers you for up to 5 days in the US and Mexico). If you choose to be covered in the US, the price is crazy high for obvious reasons.

I am hoping this is going to be my last time doing renewals, I will be at 5 years next year, then I will apply for nationalité.


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## mem1476

Great, thanks for the tips. Congratulations on moving towards nationalite too... sounds lovely to not have to deal with renewals! 

Best of luck,
M


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## Glolil

Glolil said:


> Hi. My answer applies only to the time it took for them to accept my renewal application. I have Carte De Sejour Temporaire which expires Nov 22, 2021. I submitted my application for renewal online on Sep 23, 2021. I received notification yesterday Nov 2, 2021 that my application was accepted, my card is being processed and that I will receive another notification to pick it up from the prefecture. This will be my third Carte De Sejour. It was renewed for 1 year. And it's "Visiteur" since I am here as a retiree.


This is an update. I received a text message from my prefecture on February 25, 2022 that my CDS was ready. I made an appointment online for March 15, 2022 (the earliest online). Picked up my CDS. It took less than 5 minutes.

The difference in the timeline for me in using the online submission is that I have my CDS in my hands 1 month earlier.


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## Masha123

hello , i am working remotely for a company in USA , i would like to apply for long stay visitor visa , since i am not eligible for the entrepreneur visa ( i work only for one company ) . my question is about the taxes , i am not an USA citizen or resident i only work for a usa based comapny . what and how much taxes i need to pay in France ? since the visitor status is not a pathaway for citeznship . and is paying tax related to the renewal ?
hope someone will answer my questions thank you so muchhh


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## Bevdeforges

On a visitor visa for France, you must swear that you will not work while in France. If you will be relying on the earnings from your remote job as proof of "adequate financial resources" you may very well find that your visa application is rejected. They will sometimes "overlook" remote working on the part of an accompanying spouse where the spouse is employed in France - at least for a limited period of time (one or two years). But if you will be doing work in France - no matter where your "employer" or their "customers" are located - you are considered to be working in France and you will be expected to declare your income and pay into the French "cotisation" system (basically, social insurances). 

And actually, it is quite possible to take French nationality after 5 or more years in France on a "visiteur" visa. You may want to take a look at the French government site on long-stay visas here: France-visas.gouv.fr | The official website for visa application to France


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## Masha123

Bevdeforges said:


> On a visitor visa for France, you must swear that you will not work while in France. If you will be relying on the earnings from your remote job as proof of "adequate financial resources" you may very well find that your visa application is rejected. They will sometimes "overlook" remote working on the part of an accompanying spouse where the spouse is employed in France - at least for a limited period of time (one or two years). But if you will be doing work in France - no matter where your "employer" or their "customers" are located - you are considered to be working in France and you will be expected to declare your income and pay into the French "cotisation" system (basically, social insurances).
> 
> And actually, it is quite possible to take French nationality after 5 or more years in France on a "visiteur" visa. You may want to take a look at the French government site on long-stay visas here: France-visas.gouv.fr | The official website for visa application to France


i am couting for my cash resources only ( 19.000 euros) my remonte job its just a proof of my social-economy status . but once i am in france i need to declare my income from my remonte job ? or no ? and if i do so do i need to pay taxes ? and how much ,
many many thx in advance


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## Bevdeforges

Masha123 said:


> but once i am in france i need to declare my income from my remonte job ? or no ? and if i do so do i need to pay taxes ? and how much ,


Yup - once you are resident in France, you declare your worldwide income from all sources each year. How much tax you pay depends on a variety of factors - but if you are working in France (i.e. doing work for which you are being paid by anyone anywhere) you must be registered for taxes and social insurances and you must at least pay into the social insurances system. On a visiteur visa you do not have the right to work in France (or to work from France as you seem to be planning on).


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