# Question about countersignature on UK passport renewal



## 1questxx

With immediate travelling plans in mind, I would like to renew my UK passport in Spain, I have everything ready, the C1 form, the 2 photographs and the expired passport and the aprox. €200 fee, but someone of a professional standing who has known me for +2 years has to countersign the photographs certifying it is me.

The only person able to do that is Spanish and he does not speak any English, I am wondering if this could be a problem when someone calls them from the UK to verify if they really exist, unless they speak with them over the phone in Spanish my friend isn't going to understand anything and won't be able to confirm his identity.

There is also a problem with the person I am going to ask to countersign the photograph as he is currently unemployed, he holds a professional qualification (architect) but is currently unemployed. I don't want to make any mistake during the renewal process because I would like to travel very soon.

I was wondering if anybody here knows how likely is it that the UK passport authorities will call the counter signer or refuse it. I have not been living in Spain for long since I came back from the UK and it is not easy for me to find someone meeting the needed counter signer requirements, I only know of one person who can do that right now. 

Ideas for a legal work around or easy way to find a valid photo counter signer, would be great.


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## jojo

1questxx said:


> With immediate travelling plans in mind, I would like to renew my UK passport in Spain, I have everything ready, the C1 form, the 2 photographs and the expired passport and the aprox. €200 fee, but someone of a professional standing who has known me for +2 years has to countersign the photographs certifying it is me.
> 
> The only person able to do that is Spanish and he does not speak any English, I am wondering if this could be a problem when someone calls them from the UK to verify if they really exist, unless they speak with them over the phone in Spanish my friend isn't going to understand anything and won't be able to confirm his identity.
> 
> There is also a problem with the person I am going to ask to countersign the photograph as he is currently unemployed, he holds a professional qualification (architect) but is currently unemployed. I don't want to make any mistake during the renewal process because I would like to travel very soon.
> 
> I was wondering if anybody here knows how likely is it that the UK passport authorities will call the counter signer or refuse it. I have not been living in Spain for long since I came back from the UK and it is not easy for me to find someone meeting the needed counter signer requirements, I only know of one person who can do that right now.
> 
> Ideas for a legal work around or easy way to find a valid photo counter signer, would be great.


I dont think it matters that your countersigner doesnt speak English. If they write in Spanish, then its obvious that they're not english and as far as I know, the form doesnt states the need for a particular nationality 

All that said, its unlikely that they'll chase it up anyway, especially if you're sending in your old passport - which I assume will have a similar (slightly younger version) photo of you!!??

Jo xxx


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## Pesky Wesky

The person who countersigns your passport should live in the UK, and be British

_
*Who you can ask to be your countersignatory*_ _

Your countersignatory should:_ 

_have known you for at least two years_
_live in the UK_
_Your countersignatory should not:
_ 

_be related to you by birth or marriage_
_be in a personal relationship with you_
_live at the same address as you_
_work for the Identity and Passport Service_
And also..._

*What the countersignatory has to do*_ _ * Avoid delays *

_ _ IPS may need to contact your countersignatory, so make sure they'll be available and won't be away on holiday


Your countersignatory must sign the form at section 10 to confirm that:

_ 

_they have known you for more than two years_
_you are who you claim to be_
_If the form is for a child passport, the countersignatory should know the person who signs the declaration at section 9 rather than the child.__
The application form asks the countersignatory to enter their current British passport number (Irish passport numbers are also acceptable). This is so the Identity and Passport Service (IPS) can check their identity._ 
From this government site
Who can countersign your application? : Directgov - Travel and transport


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## jojo

Pesky Wesky said:


> The person who countersigns your passport should live in the UK, and be British
> 
> _
> *Who you can ask to be your countersignatory*_ _
> 
> Your countersignatory should:_
> 
> _have known you for at least two years_
> _live in the UK_


 There! That shows what I know:confused2:. i guess the only other way is to send your photos to an appropriate friend in the UK???????????? - better still, wait til someone else answers who has a clue LOL!!!

Jo xxx


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## 1questxx

@Pesky

That is not correct, the link you posted is to renew the passport in the UK, there is a different procedure to renew your passport abroad, I have the C1 form with me and the countersigner can be any British, European Union or Commonwealth national.

- ukinspain.fco.gov.uk/en/help-for-british-nationals/passports/how-to-apply/spain

@jojo

The counter signer doesn't write anything in Spanish, he only signs the photograph and enters his name, qualifications and phone number in the form.


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## Pesky Wesky

1questxx said:


> @Pesky
> 
> That is not correct, the link you posted is to renew the passport in the UK, there is a different procedure to renew your passport abroad, I have the C1 form with me and the countersigner can be any British, EU or Commonwealth citizen.
> 
> - ukinspain.fco.gov.uk/en/help-for-british-nationals/passports/how-to-apply/spain


Good, because I got mine done a few weeks ago and the counter signature wasn't done by someone in the UK!!
Sorry about that, but it was a link from the UK in Spain site, so it wasn't really my fault, I think


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## CapnBilly

It also says that if it is an adult passport renewal they may not need counter signing

"Photographs submitted with an adult renewal application accompanied by a previous passport may be accepted without a countersignature, if identity can be satisfactorily established by comparison of photographs."


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## 1questxx

@CapnBilly

I have the guidance notes with me as well and I failed to spot that, could you please let me know where did you read it? I downloaded all of the needed documents from the British Embassy in Madrid website.


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## jojo

> The counter signer doesn't write anything in Spanish, he only signs the photograph and enters his name, qualifications and phone number in the form.


 No, but what he does have to write will be fairly obviously Spanish. If memory serves, my daughters boyfriend (he had the right profession) had to write on several photos and some pieces of paper

Jo xxxx


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## xabiaxica

the architect friend can sign both the photos & the form

it doesn't matter that he is unemployed, all that matters is that he has the professional qual & that he has known you for the required amount of time

the fact that he doesn't speak English won't be an issue - he can copy the wording - in fact iirc I actually wrote on ours & our friend just signed them

the bit about 'may not need countersigning' - _*may not*_......to be on the safe side I'd have it done personally


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## mrypg9

I renewed my passport in 2009 and was not required to provide a countersignature.
Just an updated photograph.


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## CapnBilly

1questxx said:


> @CapnBilly
> 
> I have the guidance notes with me as well and I failed to spot that, could you please let me know where did you read it? I downloaded all of the needed documents from the British Embassy in Madrid website.


I got the exact wording from a link, but this is from the UKinspain website, about halfway down

_Tips for completing the C1 form

Countersignature of the form and photographs is not necessary for those people over 16 renewing a passport, unless your appearance has changed significantly since your previous passport was issued.
Ensure that you have indicated whether you require a 32 or 48 page passport (on the front of the form).
_


Seems pretty clear to me.


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## youngagepensioner

mrypg9 said:


> I renewed my passport in 2009 and was not required to provide a countersignature.
> Just an updated photograph.


 Same when my husband renewed his in 2007. He just sent in his old passport and updated photos.

Also when I renewed mine in the UK in 2010, I did not need a countersignatory.

To the OP, I'm sure your architect will be a suitable person and as someone else suggests, all you need is his signature, you can write anything else for him that is necessary.


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## mrypg9

youngagepensioner said:


> Same when my husband renewed his in 2007. He just sent in his old passport.
> 
> To the OP, I'm sure your architect will be a suitable person and as someone else suggests, all you need is his signature, you can write anything else for him that is necessary.


I don't think it cost 200 euros then either. Can't remember how much I paid but the fact that OH doesn't remember me raving through the house waving a sheet of paper and cursing leads me to believe it was around £100 or less.
Still a lot, though.


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## CapnBilly

youngagepensioner said:


> Same when my husband renewed his in 2007. He just sent in his old passport and updated photos.
> .


Exactly, as long as you can see its the same person in the photo, its no problem.



youngagepensioner said:


> To the OP, I'm sure your architect will be a suitable person and as someone else suggests, all you need is his signature, you can write anything else for him that is necessary.


Not that the OP needs to (unless their photo is different) the notes are quite clear that a professionally qualified EU national can sign the form. If this is the case , I personally would not write anything on the form. I would get them to write in their own words, and then possibly include a translation and explanation on a separate piece of paper, but, lets remember here, its being sent to the Embassy in Madrd - There will be someone who can speak Spanish, so they will be able to read and call if they want.


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## Pesky Wesky

CapnBilly said:


> Exactly, as long as you can see its the same person in the photo, its no problem.
> 
> 
> 
> Not that the OP needs to (unless their photo is different) the notes are quite clear that a professionally qualified EU national can sign the form. If this is the case , I personally would not write anything on the form. I would get them to write in their own words, and then possibly include a translation and explanation on a separate piece of paper, but, lets remember here, its being sent to the Embassy in Madrd - There will be someone who can speak Spanish, so they will be able to read and call if they want.


But passports are no longer processed in Madrid, they are sent on to the UK. You are told what to write on the back of the photo anyway and you have to copy that wording. It is in English so if you write in Spanish it may well be sent back to you.
BUT as I was not correct on my previous post, even though I did this only weeks ago, I'll shut up:tape2:!!


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## Pesky Wesky

1questxx said:


> With immediate travelling plans in mind, I would like to renew my UK passport in Spain, I have everything ready, the C1 form, the 2 photographs and the expired passport and the aprox. €200 fee, but someone of a professional standing who has known me for +2 years has to countersign the photographs certifying it is me.
> 
> The only person able to do that is Spanish and he does not speak any English, I am wondering if this could be a problem when someone calls them from the UK to verify if they really exist, unless they speak with them over the phone in Spanish my friend isn't going to understand anything and won't be able to confirm his identity.
> 
> There is also a problem with the person I am going to ask to countersign the photograph as he is currently unemployed, he holds a professional qualification (architect) but is currently unemployed. I don't want to make any mistake during the renewal process because I would like to travel very soon.
> 
> I was wondering if anybody here knows how likely is it that the UK passport authorities will call the counter signer or refuse it. I have not been living in Spain for long since I came back from the UK and it is not easy for me to find someone meeting the needed counter signer requirements, I only know of one person who can do that right now.
> 
> Ideas for a legal work around or easy way to find a valid photo counter signer, would be great.


Are you from Spain and living in the UK as the flags suggest?


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## Alcalaina

My husband renewed his from Spain earlier this year and it was about €180 including the courier (which you have to pay).

One of the photos and the form itself had to be signed, by a British professional as detailed above. It doesn't matter if they are retired.

I've never heard of anyone being called for verification. Might be different if you are wanted by Interpol I guess ...


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## Pesky Wesky

Alcalaina said:


> My husband renewed his from Spain earlier this year and it was about €180 including the courier (which you have to pay).
> 
> One of the photos and the form itself had to be signed, by a British professional as detailed above. It doesn't matter if they are retired.
> 
> I've never heard of anyone being called for verification. Might be different if you are wanted by Interpol I guess ...


Exactly. I live near enough to Madrid for it to be cheaper for me to hand it in and pick up myself, but they don't allow it.


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## CapnBilly

Pesky Wesky said:


> But passports are no longer processed in Madrid, they are sent on to the UK. You are told what to write on the back of the photo anyway and you have to copy that wording. It is in English so if you write in Spanish it may well be sent back to you.


I didn't know they were now being processed in the UK, as I've never used the service so I wasn't really interested. However I notice further down on the link I posted that it says documents in Spanish don't need translation anyway, although you're right about the wording.


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## Alcalaina

Found this on the FCO website:

*Note 9 - Section 9 – Countersignature*
When you have completed the form, someone who
has known you personally for at least two years
should complete and sign Section 9. That person
should be a British citizen, EU citizen, other British
national or Commonwealth citizen who is a Member
of Parliament, Justice of the Peace, Minister of
Religion, Bank Officer, Established Civil Servant, or
professionally qualified person, eg Lawyer,
Engineer, Doctor, School Teacher, Police Officer or
a person of similar standing. Procedures include a
check on the authenticity of countersignatories.

lf you do not know a British national, EU citizen, or
other Commonwealth citizen locally with these
qualifications, a citizen of the country in which you
are residing may complete and sign the form,
provided he/she has a similar standing in that
country has known you for two years and the
Consul considers his/her signature to be
acceptable. A member of your family should not
countersign. (See also Note 11, ‘Photographs’).
In certain cases you may be asked to produce
further documentary evidence of identity.

http://ukinspain.fco.gov.uk/en/help-for-british-nationals/passports/how-to-apply/spain


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## CapnBilly

Alcalaina said:


> Found this on the FCO website:


I posted a link to that information this morning.



CapnBilly said:


> Not that the OP needs to (unless their photo is different) the notes are quite clear that a professionally qualified EU national can sign the form.


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## 1questxx

Pesky Wesky said:


> Are you from Spain and living in the UK as the flags suggest?


I was, but I am back in Spain now although I do not think it will be for too long, depending on circumstances I might move outside the EU and the UK passport is best for that.


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