# Provisional driving license question.



## Moscovespa

Hi, I'm new to the forum. Thanks for being there! I am a British national who has been living in Russia for 6 years. I want to relocate to live with my British girlfriend in Malaga, Spain. 

First I must return to the UK to do my full motorbike license as I wish to be mobile in Spain and buy a Vespa scooter when I get there.

The first step is to apply in the UK for a Provisional driving license.

Can someone tell me please, it seems to say on the UK driving license website that I need to provide proof of addresses for the past three years. Does this mean I have to provide UK addresses and to have been resident in the UK for the past 3 years?

It will be very difficult for me to get proof of my Moscow addresses for the past three years as I have moved several times and lost all contact with previous landlords.

Hope someone can help.

Cheers

Joe.


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## Alcalaina

Well, I think the best thing you can do is talk to someone at the DVLC in the UK. This is a bit off track for a forum about life in Spain.

Best of luck!


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## xicoalc

Hi

The only crietria to apply for a UK driving licence is that you are resident in the UK at the time of applying. I trained countless learner drivers who were new to the UK. You may require proof of your current UK address, you will certainly need to provide identity documents and things such as a photograph certified by a professional (such as your doctor).

It does not ask for proof of addresses, just details of where you have lived. So even if you arrive today in the UK to become resident and can provide details of where you've been for the last 3 years you will be ok.

I think the professional person signing your photo is supposed to have known you for a certain period of time, but in some cases this is just not possible. I would imaging that providing your doctor (or lawyer, or whoever) has seen adequate ID to satisfy them of your identity the DVLA will be happy with this, but check with DVLA as Alcalaina just said!


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## Alcalaina

steve_in_spain said:


> Hi
> 
> The only crietria to apply for a UK driving licence is that you are resident in the UK at the time of applying. I trained countless learner drivers who were new to the UK. You may require proof of your current UK address, you will certainly need to provide identity documents and things such as a photograph certified by a professional (such as your doctor).
> 
> It does not ask for proof of addresses, just details of where you have lived. So even if you arrive today in the UK to become resident and can provide details of where you've been for the last 3 years you will be ok.
> 
> I think the professional person signing your photo is supposed to have known you for a certain period of time, but in some cases this is just not possible. I would imaging that providing your doctor (or lawyer, or whoever) has seen adequate ID to satisfy them of your identity the DVLA will be happy with this, but check with DVLA as Alcalaina just said!


Ah, I forgot we had an ex driving instructor on the forum!

Wanna come down here and teach me how to reverse park uphill, Steve?


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## xicoalc

Alcalaina said:


> Ah, I forgot we had an ex driving instructor on the forum!
> 
> Wanna come down here and teach me how to reverse park uphill, Steve?


Anyday! No es dificil! - Just buy a SMALL automatic and park in BIG spaces


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## Moscovespa

Thank you very much , I have no problem getting the Professional referee and the fact you say they don't ask for proofs of previous addresses is great news for me. However, I guess the online application is out of the question for me, as I am not currently resident in the UK? Thanks again!


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## xicoalc

Moscovespa said:


> Thank you very much , I have no problem getting the Professional referee and the fact you say they don't ask for proofs of previous addresses is great news for me. However, I guess the online application is out of the question for me, as I am not currently resident in the UK? Thanks again!


I've been out of that profession for some time now and when I was in the game there was no online application, so I am not 100% sure how that works. I can only assume that once the online application is done you still have to post in your ID etc.

As I said earlier, call DVLA to check!


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## MaidenScotland

Moscovespa said:


> Hi, I'm new to the forum. Thanks for being there! I am a British national who has been living in Russia for 6 years. I want to relocate to live with my British girlfriend in Malaga, Spain.
> 
> First I must return to the UK to do my full motorbike license as I wish to be mobile in Spain and buy a Vespa scooter when I get there.
> 
> The first step is to apply in the UK for a Provisional driving license.
> 
> Can someone tell me please, it seems to say on the UK driving license website that I need to provide proof of addresses for the past three years. Does this mean I have to provide UK addresses and to have been resident in the UK for the past 3 years?
> 
> It will be very difficult for me to get proof of my Moscow addresses for the past three years as I have moved several times and lost all contact with previous landlords.
> 
> Hope someone can help.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Joe.



As someone who has just changed their address on line for their UK driving licence.

They are asking for proof of your UK address if you have not lived at the address you are putting on your licence for the last 3 years.. and they do check. I presume they check the voting roll and they write to that address within 5 working days for more information.
If you have a biometric passport you do not need to send in a photograph you just give them permission to access it and they take the details, photo from there. You also have to send in your old licence which is cut in two.

However a provisional licence may be another matter.
And if you have a biometric licence you have proof you have not lived in the UK in recent years,

Why do it in the U.K why not wait until you get to Spain and apply for a Spanish licence?




maiden


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## Moscovespa

steve_in_spain said:


> I've been out of that profession for some time now and when I was in the game there was no online application, so I am not 100% sure how that works. I can only assume that once the online application is done you still have to post in your ID etc.
> 
> As I said earlier, call DVLA to check!


Thanks again Steve! Will call them on Monday.


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## xicoalc

MaidenScotland said:


> As someone who has just changed their address on line for their UK driving licence.
> 
> They are asking for proof of your UK address if you have not lived at the address you are putting on your licence for the last 3 years.. and they do check. I presume they check the voting roll and they write to that address within 5 working days for more information.
> 
> maiden


Good idea about the spanish one, but perhaps the language may be an issue? Although I have heard that in some areas you can take the test in English. I will say though that the process (and cost) of learning to drive in the UK is far more favourable than in spain, althought the test criteria is much stricter (sometimes you wonder thought!!)

Regarding the driving licence and address, just tell you my recent experience. I still have my UK licence (not got round to changing it, it's NEXT on my list!), but the photo expired so needed renewing.

I simply sent it back (from Spain - so Spanih post mark etc), with the application form (which I got a family member to send to me), and I enclosed a covering letter saying that "as I spend a lot of time in and out of the UK, can they please use a relatives address for my renewal". This was as per the advice of a surprisingly helpful young man at DVLA.

After a couple of weeks the new licence arrived at the nominated UK address and was duly forwarded to me.

The DVLA are obviously very concerned and strict over identity (passport and proof that you are who you claim to be), but the address is merely a communication address so I wouldn't worry too much on addresses.


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## MaidenScotland

steve_in_spain said:


> Good idea about the spanish one, but perhaps the language may be an issue? Although I have heard that in some areas you can take the test in English. I will say though that the process (and cost) of learning to drive in the UK is far more favourable than in spain, althought the test criteria is much stricter (sometimes you wonder thought!!)
> 
> Regarding the driving licence and address, just tell you my recent experience. I still have my UK licence (not got round to changing it, it's NEXT on my list!), but the photo expired so needed renewing.
> 
> I simply sent it back (from Spain - so Spanih post mark etc), with the application form (which I got a family member to send to me), and I enclosed a covering letter saying that "as I spend a lot of time in and out of the UK, can they please use a relatives address for my renewal". This was as per the advice of a surprisingly helpful young man at DVLA.
> 
> After a couple of weeks the new licence arrived at the nominated UK address and was duly forwarded to me.
> 
> The DVLA are obviously very concerned and strict over identity (passport and proof that you are who you claim to be), but the address is merely a communication address so I wouldn't worry too much on addresses.




Do you need to pass a test in Spain to ride a Vespa?
Perhaps just a provisional licence would suffice.


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## xicoalc

MaidenScotland said:


> Do you need to pass a test in Spain to ride a Vespa?
> Perhaps just a provisional licence would suffice.


The Spanish "provisional" differs greatly from the UK one. For example, in the UK, a car provisional entitles you to ride a 50cc with L plates (providing you have completed a Compulsory Basic Training (CBT) course) - which is an absolute sham, 30 minutes in a classroom, ride round some cones, and a quick blast on the open road - pretty much impossible to fail - pay your money and take your course with no test and conducted by traning companies, NOT by the DSA).

A provisional also entitles you to drive a car providing you are supervised by someone who has held a driving licence for at least 3 years.

In Spain you can only drive a car with a professional instructor until you pass. As for the bikes up to 50cc, the same applies as in the UK, you have to take a training course/test (which I believe is also a one day thing), and you are then given a permit to ride up to 50cc (which basically means anything with a yellow number plate instead of the normal white ones).


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## Alcalaina

steve_in_spain said:


> Anyday! No es dificil! - Just buy a SMALL automatic and park in BIG spaces


Unfortunately I am stuck with a nearly new RHD Opel Meriva with a manual gearbox and I live on a very steep, narrow cobbled street ! There are no big spaces ...

Think I'll trade it in for a mule.


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## xicoalc

Alcalaina said:


> Unfortunately I am stuck with a nearly new RHD Opel Meriva with a manual gearbox and I live on a very steep, narrow cobbled street ! There are no big spaces ...
> 
> Think I'll trade it in for a mule.


 With the price of fuel you will savea fortune - bag of carrots and you are away!

Take a look at these websites, they show the "idiots" way (watch the video clips in 2nd link) that many ADI's in the Uk teach learners. The techniques are not fool proof because every car varies and every space varies but play with it, get your confidence up...obvioulsy vids are in english and wrong side of road. If you can kind of get confident in bigger spaces with these techniques you can polish it up in your own way and find what works for you to get into the tight ones!

Parallel Parking - Reverse Parking
Parallel Parking Video Tutorial. How To Reverse Parallel Park

Try this also... (i have swapped english to spanish road rides, so this is parking on the RIGHT, if you park on the left swap lefts for rights, or you will end up saying hello to every car on the road!)

Pull up next to the car you want to park around (about 2-3 feet away and slightly forward of the car)
Reverse back in a straight line until your back wheels (usually the back of your rear seat) is level with the far end of the subject car
Turn the wheel one full turn to the right (360 degrees)
Let the car swing out until you are pointing to about a 10 o clock position
Turn the wheel one turn to the right (so your wheels are straight and your car is coming in at a 45 degree angle)
When your right mirror is level with the corner of the subject car, put full lock to the left
When the car is paralel to the curb straighten up

Being up a hill is a ball ache but just remember, get your clutch so the car is CREEPING - Do not rev and DO not race! Go Slow!

OR.. better still, park DOWN the hill and keep a crawl with your brake (remembering to keep car in reverse so your reverse lights are on to warn others of your attempted mission!)

If that doesnt work I have another one for you! & If that doesnt work its holidays to see me I think!!!


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## Alcalaina

steve_in_spain said:


> With the price of fuel you will savea fortune - bag of carrots and you are away!
> 
> Take a look at these websites, they show the "idiots" way (watch the video clips in 2nd link) that many ADI's in the Uk teach learners. The techniques are not fool proof because every car varies and every space varies but play with it, get your confidence up...obvioulsy vids are in english and wrong side of road. If you can kind of get confident in bigger spaces with these techniques you can polish it up in your own way and find what works for you to get into the tight ones!
> 
> Parallel Parking - Reverse Parking
> Parallel Parking Video Tutorial. How To Reverse Parallel Park
> 
> Try this also... (i have swapped english to spanish road rides, so this is parking on the RIGHT, if you park on the left swap lefts for rights, or you will end up saying hello to every car on the road!)
> 
> Pull up next to the car you want to park around (about 2-3 feet away and slightly forward of the car)
> Reverse back in a straight line until your back wheels (usually the back of your rear seat) is level with the far end of the subject car
> Turn the wheel one full turn to the right (360 degrees)
> Let the car swing out until you are pointing to about a 10 o clock position
> Turn the wheel one turn to the right (so your wheels are straight and your car is coming in at a 45 degree angle)
> When your right mirror is level with the corner of the subject car, put full lock to the left
> When the car is paralel to the curb straighten up
> 
> Being up a hill is a ball ache but just remember, get your clutch so the car is CREEPING - Do not rev and DO not race! Go Slow!
> 
> OR.. better still, park DOWN the hill and keep a crawl with your brake (remembering to keep car in reverse so your reverse lights are on to warn others of your attempted mission!)
> 
> If that doesnt work I have another one for you! & If that doesnt work its holidays to see me I think!!!


You are a sweetie - thank you! I can do it fine on the flat but this hill is a killer, and there are usually impatient farmers in 4x4s waiting to get by while I am stalling and cursing all over the place.

I will get up early one Sunday morning and practice when no-one's around.


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## xicoalc

Alcalaina said:


> You are a sweetie - thank you! I can do it fine on the flat but this hill is a killer, and there are usually impatient farmers in 4x4s waiting to get by while I am stalling and cursing all over the place.
> 
> I will get up early one Sunday morning and practice when no-one's around.


Jeje, 1) Stuff the farmer - take your time! How many times have you been held up in a town when a spaniard just stops in the middle of the road to drop someone off of have a chat? Just relax!

2) It may be worth practicing just creping slowly up the hill (at an old mans walking pace) and perfecting that so you are confident with your clutch. If you can park on the flat you can park on the hill, it is just the worry of stalling panicing you.

Remember - it's all in the clutch! Practice finding the "biting" point, and then releaseing the handbrake and holding the car stationary just by keeping the clutch at the bite and a smidgen of gas if you need it.

Once you can do this raise the cluth about the thickness of a pound coin and hold it. The car should "creep", if not then raise it the same again. If it stalls you need a touch more gass. 

Next, (if it is safe) press the clutch so the car starts to roll back and then WITHOUT using the brake practice raising the clutch to that bite to stop it rolling (catch it). Then once its stopped creep forward.

Once you can do all this confidently and every time, the parking will be a doddle!

Good luck - let me know how you get on!


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## Moscovespa

MaidenScotland said:


> As someone who has just changed their address on line for their UK driving licence.
> 
> They are asking for proof of your UK address if you have not lived at the address you are putting on your licence for the last 3 years.. and they do check. I presume they check the voting roll and they write to that address within 5 working days for more information.
> If you have a biometric passport you do not need to send in a photograph you just give them permission to access it and they take the details, photo from there. You also have to send in your old licence which is cut in two.
> 
> However a provisional licence may be another matter.
> And if you have a biometric licence you have proof you have not lived in the UK in recent years,
> 
> Why do it in the U.K why not wait until you get to Spain and apply for a Spanish licence?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maiden



Thank you Maiden, 

The language would be an obstacle for me in Spain, I've got the hang of Russian while here but it will all be new to me. I want to get my provisional and do an intensive DAS Motorbike course in the UK, which should hopefully take a week to ten days.

I just pray to God that the fact I have had no UK address for the past 6 years won't stand against me. It will be very hard to provide all my old Russian addresses as I've moved around a lot and anyway my landlords don't speak English, so I can't see any checks being successful.

If there are really English language driving schools in or around Malaga / Alcajeisa / Gibraltar, I'd be very grateful if anyone knows any.

I guess my call to the DVLA tomorrow will clear any questions up about addresses etc. 

Does anyone know if the online license application is possible only if you have a biometric passport? I don't , so that would stump me.


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## Moscovespa

steve_in_spain said:


> Good idea about the spanish one, but perhaps the language may be an issue? Although I have heard that in some areas you can take the test in English. I will say though that the process (and cost) of learning to drive in the UK is far more favourable than in spain, althought the test criteria is much stricter (sometimes you wonder thought!!)
> 
> Regarding the driving licence and address, just tell you my recent experience. I still have my UK licence (not got round to changing it, it's NEXT on my list!), but the photo expired so needed renewing.
> 
> I simply sent it back (from Spain - so Spanih post mark etc), with the application form (which I got a family member to send to me), and I enclosed a covering letter saying that "as I spend a lot of time in and out of the UK, can they please use a relatives address for my renewal". This was as per the advice of a surprisingly helpful young man at DVLA.
> 
> After a couple of weeks the new licence arrived at the nominated UK address and was duly forwarded to me.
> 
> The DVLA are obviously very concerned and strict over identity (passport and proof that you are who you claim to be), but the address is merely a communication address so I wouldn't worry too much on addresses.


Really useful Steve , thank you. Will report back in the next couple of days what the DVLA tells me. 

I suppose the fact I am a UK national with a UK passport will at least mean my identity can be verified, which like you say is all they are really after I suppose.


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## xicoalc

Moscovespa said:


> Really useful Steve , thank you. Will report back in the next couple of days what the DVLA tells me.
> 
> I suppose the fact I am a UK national with a UK passport will at least mean my identity can be verified, which like you say is all they are really after I suppose.


Exactly, providing you can give them a UK address, even if it is that of a friend or family member you shoudl have no problems.


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## Moscovespa

MaidenScotland said:


> Do you need to pass a test in Spain to ride a Vespa?
> Perhaps just a provisional licence would suffice.


Yes, we checked all this. Whereas you need a license and plates for anything over 50 cc in Britain, I have a 150cc Vespa here in Moscow which is allowed to ride without plates or license. This is not technically true under the "law" (whatever that word means here) it is just that all scooter clubs and riders know that the police ( usually OPPRESSIVLEY strict and on the make for any money they can take off motorists) ignore them completely and they are never even noticed. It maybe similar to the Russian view that beer isn't really alcohol and is seen more of a soft drink, they see scooters as not really motorbikes, which is crazy as there are very big powerful scooters now on the roads here up to 400 cc which don't even need plates! The irony is i tried to ask about doing a test here for my Vespa, but was laughed at and told to let sleeping dogs lie. As long as the police turn a blind eye, why put yourself through a bureaucratic and costly nightmare? Everyone knows that most people PAY for their car licenses here anyway, and very few actually have lessons, which explains the carnage and mess on the roads. All I can say is I have learnt to drive well here based on sheer survival instinct, call it the 'school of hard knocks'. This won't wash in Spain though, obviously. I will need a full DAS license to ride any bike over 50 cc.


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