# Music (Instrumental) Teaching In Spain



## malumovis (Jul 27, 2015)

Hello there.

Myself and OH are both currently employed as instrumental tutors for LEAs in the UK, and are looking to move to Spain within the next year or so - partly to (hopefully) discover that there is a great deal more respect for education in Spain compared to the ever-dwindling state of affairs here in the UK.

Would I be right in thinking that Spain does not operate a school-based peripatetic system like here in the UK? And that instrumental (and other extra-curricular activities) take place after the end of the school day? We both teach privately in addition to within schools through the LEA, so would this be a viable option for employment in Spain? Whilst I don't have QTS (not a necessary qualification for instrumental teaching), I have post-graduate qualifications in music, and 15 years of teaching experience, and have a part-time career as a professional classical musician (clarinet, sax and flute). I have been on the look-out for any openings in orchestras, but there is nothing at present unfortunately.

OH is a guitarist - mainly classical but also teaches the rock/pop syllabi and performs in wedding/function bands. Obviously, we're aware that the guitar is probably the most popular instrument in Spain, so whether this means that teaching/performing in this area is saturated or that there are always opportunities I don't know!

Our initial plan was to contact some schools (international/British ones) to start with, once the school year begins in September, and make some enquiries. We're planning on a holiday in Spain at the end of this summer (we've visited several times in the past) where we're also hoping to chat with some locals (Girona area is the plan, although this could chance as we're hoping to get the train there, and fly back, and may leave the exact destinations until last-minute).

The back-up plan is to take a TEFL course, either here in the UK or in Spain, and try to get work teaching this first, whilst perhaps advertising for music students in times around this (if possible).

Frankly, the idea of relocating abroad is pretty terrifying to us at present! Although not as terrifying as staying in the UK of course ... We're trying to approach it in a level-headed and sensible manner, but also without being too fearful. I dread looking back in twenty years and wondering 'what if' and 'if only'. We have no debt (although no savings as yet either ...), our own property with a small mortgage here (which we could hopefully easily rent out), and nothing to lose I guess!

We're both almost 40 and just want to live a better life, and Spain seems like the place to try for this. I look forward to your responses. Many thanks for your time!


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

malumovis said:


> Hello there.
> 
> Myself and OH are both currently employed as instrumental tutors for LEAs in the UK, and are looking to move to Spain within the next year or so - partly to (hopefully) discover that there is a great deal more respect for education in Spain compared to the ever-dwindling state of affairs here in the UK.
> 
> ...



I sense you need to do a lot more research before taking a decision to give up a well paid job in the UK.

Even fully qualified UK teaching qualifications aren't recognised for state school- other regular posters know more about this.

International schools tend to look for fully qualified teachers, and they do their recruitment from January/ February ( advertising on the TES website) for the following September. Teachers are paid a lot less than in the UK, so even if you got lucky, your pay would probably be even lower as you are not fully qualified.

English language teaching tends to be very low paid, with part time, antisocial hours.

Private lessons could be a possibility but then again, you are likely to be earning low hourly rates and will have to register as autonomo, which is very expensive once you pass the current low start offers.

Don't know how much income you could expect from your UK proerty, but do bear in mind you will have have to pay a more expensive landlord mortgage, extra insurance, maintenance costs, letting/ management costs...

Are you familiar with the requirements you have to meet to register as resident in Spain- proof of income and healthcare provision?


----------



## malumovis (Jul 27, 2015)

Thanks for replying.

Instrumental teaching is not a well-paid job particularly. Top salary rate for instructors is currently £25,520, and I work around 75%. 

I have a few friends who have taken instrumental teaching jobs in international schools (none in Spain, unfortunately), and the requirements are valid experience and qualifications in the instrument that they would be teaching. Just to clarify - I wouldn't be considering class-teaching, only instrumental teaching, whether one-on-one or taking ensembles/groups.

The pay is really not an issue for us, as we're not in this to make money, just to seek a better life. We don't own a TV, and spend as much time as possible out walking when weather allows, hence the desire to move to a place more conducive to this. Anti-social hours are pretty much what we both work at the moment too! We're both often out gigging several nights a week, in addition to being at school all day, and have no problem with this (we're both fit, active and healthy - at the moment at least!).

Our mortgage is low (£200 per month), and similar properties in our street are rented for £500. As it's a period cottage near a very popular cycle trail/mountain range, we also have the option of renting is as a 'holiday let'. We have friends nearby who would be happy to manage the property to start with for us, and our mortgage allows for one year of being let out before requiring a change of mortgage.

I am aware that we'll need to show proof that we can finance ourselves, but am unclear as to roughly how much this would be exactly. I'm also aware of the healthcare proof required.

This post is just the start of our proper research into Spain, rest assured I won't be doing anything without all information! Our initial enquiries are just regarding the situation regarding instrumental music tuition, as I'm unable to find out much information online.


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

.


malumovis said:


> Thanks for replying.
> 
> Instrumental teaching is not a well-paid job particularly. Top salary rate for instructors is currently £25,520, and I work around 75%.
> 
> ...



Best place to start would be to look for adverts on TES from around February for jobs the following September.

There isn't a pay scale in International Schools in Spain- that is you don't automatically climb the scale according to experience. All teachers (in a school) earn the same regardless of experience and most fully qualified International schoolteachers in Spain earn far less than £25k, so an instructor would probably be offered less.

£25k is considered a very good salary by many!!

Residence - approx 600€ per month and / or 6000€ savings - all per person and being paid into a Spanish bank. Healthcare- private or covered by having contracted employment or autonomo. Have a read of the FAQ thread and you will find lots of useful info on this and many other essential info to consider.


----------



## malumovis (Jul 27, 2015)

I have alerts set up on all teaching websites (E-Teach, TES etc.) and also orchestral audition sites. I'm still looking for information from people who have first-hand experience of instrumental tuition though. There must be some sort of demand for it, as there are several funded symphony orchestras throughout Spain (and many music conservatoires) who appear to contain mostly Spanish nationals.

I have no interest in climbing a scale, just in enjoying doing my job and being respected for it (which doesn't happen largely in this country where education is taken for granted). The cost of living is markedly lower in Spain, so I understand entirely that the pay would be less - most countries pay their teachers less than the UK in fact, but they differ in having great respect for education.

In the UK, £25k is obviously far from a good salary (it's below the current average) especially factoring in the cost of living in cities (thankfully, I live in the country). I've seen several websites that suggest that the average teaching salary (for a school teacher, that is) in Spain is c.€1800 per month, some say even higher. Are there any teachers currently working in Spain on this forum who could provide further info?

€6000 savings will be easily found as we have many items to sell (musical instruments, cars etc.). I'll be sure to read the FAQ over the next few weeks (it's the summer holidays, so I have far more time to research). What I really could do with is some names of music schools in Spain to contact for first-hand advice. There's a clarinet course in Amposta in the first week of September that I may try to visit for some further research, as we'll still be in Spain at that point too.


----------



## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

malumovis said:


> Hello there.
> 
> Myself and OH are both currently employed as instrumental tutors for LEAs in the UK, and are looking to move to Spain within the next year or so - partly to (hopefully) discover that there is a great deal more respect for education in Spain compared to the ever-dwindling state of affairs here in the UK.
> 
> ...


Hi,
I can give you some information about teaching, my husband having been a teacher in the state system for over 15 years now, but it's not very good news. There have been some posts expressing concern over the fact that some members, myself included, don't always give happy information, and talk about the problems that Spain is experiencing at present, so unless you specifically ask for good and bad news I feel cautious about writing about it.


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

malumovis said:


> I have alerts set up on all teaching websites (E-Teach, TES etc.) and also orchestral audition sites. I'm still looking for information from people who have first-hand experience of instrumental tuition though. There must be some sort of demand for it, as there are several funded symphony orchestras throughout Spain (and many music conservatoires) who appear to contain mostly Spanish nationals.
> 
> I have no interest in climbing a scale, just in enjoying doing my job and being respected for it (which doesn't happen largely in this country where education is taken for granted). The cost of living is markedly lower in Spain, so I understand entirely that the pay would be less - most countries pay their teachers less than the UK in fact, but they differ in having great respect for education.
> 
> ...


My daughter is a fully qualified teacher and Honours degree qualified, experienced instrumentalist and music teacher, who taught in Spain. I've given you info but you don't seem to accept it, so there is, perhaps, no point in enlarging on it.

I'll just add that- 
- it is highly debatable to say that the cost of living is much cheaper in Spain.
- gigging is highly unlikely to earn you much, if anything.
- private lessons ( English or music) are likely to take time to build up, just as in the UK, and unless you plan to do them illegally, you should read up on the cost of self employment ( autonomo) - same with gigging.
- two of you need €1200 regular income/ month for residence - that is considered to be the amount of "dole," not what you can actually live on. In addition you may also be asked for €12000 savings for the two of you. Don't know whether you are married, but if not the other wouldn't qualify for healthcare, should only one of you secure permanent employment, then you have to factor in the cost of private healthcare.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

malumovis said:


> I have alerts set up on all teaching websites (E-Teach, TES etc.) and also orchestral audition sites. I'm still looking for information from people who have first-hand experience of instrumental tuition though. There must be some sort of demand for it, as there are several funded symphony orchestras throughout Spain (and many music conservatoires) who appear to contain mostly Spanish nationals.
> 
> I have no interest in climbing a scale, just in enjoying doing my job and being respected for it (which doesn't happen largely in this country where education is taken for granted). The cost of living is markedly lower in Spain, so I understand entirely that the pay would be less - most countries pay their teachers less than the UK in fact, but they differ in having great respect for education.
> 
> ...


The _conservatorios _aren't just for Spanish nationals, but you would obviously need to speak Spanish, and the positions afaik aren't full time. I know someone who was the director of our local one for some years & he is also a secondary school teacher. 

Teachers of music in the state secondary schools have to have a masters degree & also go through _oposiciones. _For that you'd need fluent Spanish, of course. I don't know if the requirements are the same in the _conservatorios _but I wouldn't be surprised, since they are state run

Your best bet might be the International schools, but you're almost certainly too late for this year


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

In this village, most Music (instrumental) teaching is carried out by the bandmasters (we have two bands) in the evenings. One of our bands is more orchestral and the other is more of a marching (although both are used in processions) 'toot and thump' type of band.




 from about 7mins onwards


----------



## malumovis (Jul 27, 2015)

brocher said:


> My daughter is a fully qualified teacher and Honours degree qualified, experienced instrumentalist and music teacher, who taught in Spain. I've given you info but you don't seem to accept it, so there is, perhaps, no point in enlarging on it.


Apologies, you hadn't mentioned that up to this point, and as you hadn't answered my initial question (which was how instrumental tuition is delivered in Spain) I had assumed you had no knowledge in that area. Could you perhaps give me some more information on instrumental teaching as I asked? As with the UK (and many other countries around the world) PGCE-style teaching qualifications are not necessary nor required to teach instrumentally, which is why neither myself or my partner have them. As I mentioned, I have friends and colleagues who teach/have taught in International School, and the qualifications required to teach instrumental music are at least a degree in Music, with performing/teaching experience on that instrument. At no point have I mentioned wanting to teach classroom music, so perhaps you have your wires crossed a little. 

To clarify again, I have 15 years of instrumental teaching experience, and a BA Hons in Music, an advanced performance diploma, and an MA in music performance from a conservatoire. I have a private instrumental teaching practise here, as well as teaching part-time for an LEA (peripatetically, I teach instrumental lessons in around 10 schools per week - no classroom teaching, just individual/small group/ensemble teaching). I also have experience of teaching at conservatoire level, although I'm not doing this at present as it was proving difficult to fit in. So, I'm more than qualified to teach instrumentally. I don't have any desire to teach music as part of the curriculum in a classroom, nor am I currently professionally qualified to do so, not having a PGCE.



> I'll just add that-
> - it is highly debatable to say that the cost of living is much cheaper in Spain.


Everything I've read so far has suggested that the cost of living in Spain is approximately 10% less than the UK. We wouldn't be looking at living in the centre of a tourist area, nor do we have an urgency to have a pool/be near the beach - just somewhere adequate for two people. I see that utility costs (electricity and gas particularly) are higher than the UK, but this is offset by cheaper rents, food, public transport etc.



> - gigging is highly unlikely to earn you much, if anything.


I am aware that our successful freelance performing work won't translate to Spain, unless of course the lucrative UK wedding-music market translates well over there! I mentioned our gigging experience to provide some background, and also to point out that we're more than accustomed to working anti-social hours. I am more than qualified to audition for a position in one of the orchestras in Spain (I currently perform in various UK orchestras as a freelancer), but there are no positions currently available. Plus, as with many foreign orchestras, the jobs frequently go to locals.



> - private lessons ( English or music) are likely to take time to build up, just as in the UK, and unless you plan to do them illegally, you should read up on the cost of self employment ( autonomo) - same with gigging.


Our intention was to take a TEFL course, and apply for a job within a school/academy, not to go freelance. Why would you think I intend to work illegally? What a bizarre supposition to make. I will absolutely look up self-employment, just the same as I have self-employed status here. I see that there is a flat social security rate of €265 per month, although one can apply for a discount (ranging from 80% down to 30% for 15 months). 



> - two of you need €1200 regular income/ month for residence - that is considered to be the amount of "dole," not what you can actually live on. In addition you may also be asked for €12000 savings for the two of you. Don't know whether you are married, but if not the other wouldn't qualify for healthcare, should only one of you secure permanent employment, then you have to factor in the cost of private healthcare.


This is why I suspected the TEFL route would be the easiest entry point, we could then assess the possibilities of branching out into instrumental tuition whilst working there. The earliest date we'd be moving out to Spain would be next summer, by which point I would hope to have released around £10k in savings (my partner perhaps slightly less). Our potential income (after expenses) for renting our property would be somewhere in the region of £200+ per month (I have experience of renting property, so there is no need to tell me to factor in extra costs, as I'm already aware of this).

My original post was to seek help and information, and I was careful to state that I wouldn't be entering into anything blindly, so I'm somewhat baffled by your rather negative responses, especially given that there appear to be some people on this forum who post expecting to just hop off a plane.


----------



## malumovis (Jul 27, 2015)

xabiachica said:


> The _conservatorios _aren't just for Spanish nationals, but you would obviously need to speak Spanish, and the positions afaik aren't full time. I know someone who was the director of our local one for some years & he is also a secondary school teacher.
> 
> Teachers of music in the state secondary schools have to have a masters degree & also go through _oposiciones. _For that you'd need fluent Spanish, of course. I don't know if the requirements are the same in the _conservatorios _but I wouldn't be surprised, since they are state run
> 
> Your best bet might be the International schools, but you're almost certainly too late for this year


I was thinking more of pre-conservatoire instrumental teaching - my fault for not being clear about this! Starting students off on the instrument, taking them up to the standard of applying for conservatoires. My Spanish is only basic conversational at present, but we would hope to be more fluent by the time we move out.


----------



## malumovis (Jul 27, 2015)

baldilocks said:


> In this village, most Music (instrumental) teaching is carried out by the bandmasters (we have two bands) in the evenings. One of our bands is more orchestral and the other is more of a marching (although both are used in processions) 'toot and thump' type of band.


This sort of thing is why we want to move out to Spain! Music seems to be more at the heart of communities than it is here. I'm in the South Wales valleys, where brass-banding was the life-blood of communities for years, but sadly, they've all but disappeared (Cory, BTM, Tredeger etc are still going strong of course, but they're semi-professional these days rater than being community driven).

Do you happen to know how instruments are provided for learning? Are they hired, or bought outright, or loaned from the band? Perhaps I could contact the band directly and make enquiries, for research purposes. I am hoping to write an article for a music magazine here on Spanish wind music, if I'm able to research it well enough.


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

malumovis said:


> This sort of thing is why we want to move out to Spain! Music seems to be more at the heart of communities than it is here. I'm in the South Wales valleys, where brass-banding was the life-blood of communities for years, but sadly, they've all but disappeared (Cory, BTM, Tredeger etc are still going strong of course, but they're semi-professional these days rater than being community driven).
> 
> Do you happen to know how instruments are provided for learning? Are they hired, or bought outright, or loaned from the band? Perhaps I could contact the band directly and make enquiries, for research purposes. I am hoping to write an article for a music magazine here on Spanish wind music, if I'm able to research it well enough.


AFAIK many of the instruments are owned by the player having been bought secondhand - bear in mind this is a village in a rural environment not on the outskirts of a metropolitan area.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

malumovis said:


> I was thinking more of pre-conservatoire instrumental teaching - my fault for not being clear about this! Starting students off on the instrument, taking them up to the standard of applying for conservatoires. My Spanish is only basic conversational at present, but we would hope to be more fluent by the time we move out.


I think the conservatorios take the children from age 4



certainly you see tiny kids going in

there are marching bands as well - drum, wind & brass & ***** - not sure what that is in English - think bagpipes without the bag - drone???


----------

