# Time Change



## tardigrade (May 23, 2021)

Is Spain "falling" back this autumn or are we sticking with summer time?


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## tebo53 (Sep 18, 2014)

tardigrade said:


> Is Spain "falling" back this autumn or are we sticking with summer time?


I don't know if this is true or not but I have on my phone planner that 31st October 2021 is "the final time" Spain is altering the clocks. Where I got that from I do not know so I'd also like to know the answer!!

Steve


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## tardigrade (May 23, 2021)

I knew we were going to stick with summertime time but not if it was this year or next.


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## timwip (Feb 27, 2017)

Spain does fall back on 31 october 2021. The EU has been discussing the elimination of daylight savings time since 2018; however, nothing has been decided.


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## tardigrade (May 23, 2021)

timwip said:


> Spain does fall back on 31 october 2021. The EU has been discussing the elimination of daylight savings time since 2018; however, nothing has been decided.


If i remember correctly it was left up to the countries and Spain decided to ditch "winter" time.


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## timwip (Feb 27, 2017)

tardigrade said:


> If i remember correctly it was left up to the countries and Spain decided to ditch "winter" time.


Not according to this article









Horario de invierno: qué día se hace el cambio de hora de octubre


Durante la noche del sábado 30 al domingo 31 de octubre habrá que retrasar los relojos una hora



www.abc.es


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## tardigrade (May 23, 2021)

The year delay was for the countries to prepare...


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

timwip said:


> Not according to this article
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I agree with you, the change in October will not be the final one as the EU has not yet decided whether to go ahead with abandoning this practice. Here's another article which confirms that:-









Todo sobre el cambio de hora de octubre de 2022 en España: Así entramos en el horario de invierno


Los relojes se atrasarán una hora a las tres, para mejorar la eficiencia energética y aprovechar más las horas de sol




www.elperiodico.com


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## ksjazzguitar (Dec 22, 2010)

And if we can just get Spain in the correct time zone... (And France, Belgium, and the Netherlands, while we're at it.)


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## timwip (Feb 27, 2017)

ksjazzguitar said:


> And if we can just get Spain in the correct time zone... (And France, Belgium, and the Netherlands, while we're at it.)


You are correct. Spain has been in the wrong time zone since 1940 when franco aligned it with berlin.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

ksjazzguitar said:


> And if we can just get Spain in the correct time zone... (And France, Belgium, and the Netherlands, while we're at it.)


Mainland Spain should be on GMT along with Portugal and the Canaries. It's obvious if you look at a map. But France etc, what's the problem there? 😕


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Alcalaina said:


> Mainland Spain should be on GMT along with Portugal and the Canaries. It's obvious if you look at a map. But France etc, what's the problem there? 😕


Portugal is, which is very annoying when you live near the border and cross regularly as our phones jump to Portuguese time 🤭😂 Are the islands on GMT time??


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> Portugal is, which is very annoying when you live near the border and cross regularly as our phones jump to Portuguese time 🤭😂 Are the islands on GMT time??


The Canaries are on GMT, (+1 atm as in the UK), but the Balearics are on the same time as the mainland.


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

...or the UK could go to CET.


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## ksjazzguitar (Dec 22, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> ... But France etc, what's the problem there? 😕


It's just math. The natural GMT range is -7.5 to 7.5 degrees - the 15 degrees surrounding the prime meridian. The vast, vast majority of continental France is in that range. CET would be 7.5 to 22.5 degrees. Only a few tiny sliver of France falls in that range. Mathematically, the natural TZ for France is GMT. What TZ it really is is a political decision, as it always is. It got changed by the occupying Germans in WWII to match Berlin's TZ and it never got changed back, not that different from Spain. Both Belgium and the Netherlands are completely within the natural GMT range but were forced into the the CET by the occupying Germans. They did this in all the countries they occupied.

Basically most of Western Europe is in the wrong TZ as a leftover effect of WW2. That they _should_ be in a different timezone is a mathematical and geographic fact based on how timezones are defined. The actual TZ they get is a political decision. The TZ skew is worst in Spain (especially Galicia) but we are not the only ones.

A map like this might help to visualize it.

I'm not trying to start a movement here. I just wish this would get corrected. But that's a political decision.


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## lard_ascending (Sep 16, 2020)

ksjazzguitar said:


> It's just math. The natural GMT range is -7.5 to 7.5 degrees - the 15 degrees surrounding the prime meridian. The vast, vast majority of continental France is in that range. CET would be 7.5 to 22.5 degrees. Only a few tiny sliver of France falls in that range. Mathematically, the natural TZ for France is GMT. What TZ it really is is a political decision, as it always is. It got changed by the occupying Germans in WWII to match Berlin's TZ and it never got changed back, not that different from Spain. Both Belgium and the Netherlands are completely within the natural GMT range but were forced into the the CET by the occupying Germans. They did this in all the countries they occupied.
> 
> Basically most of Western Europe is in the wrong TZ as a leftover effect of WW2. That they _should_ be in a different timezone is a mathematical and geographic fact based on how timezones are defined. The actual TZ they get is a political decision. The TZ skew is worst in Spain (especially Galicia) but we are not the only ones.
> 
> ...


That's really interesting. Thanks for the map


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