# Solar power



## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

I've dabbled with small solar panels in the US, but here in the Philippines it seems like it could really be cost savings due to all the sun. I've searched on the internet a few companies here that have grid-tie and off-grid systems, but I really haven't seen any in actual use. Does anyone have any experience here with solar power or know of someone that does? thanks in advance.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

the private owned power suppliers who finance the politicians election war chest see no incentive in popularizing solar / wind power .... and ensure no undue benefit is sought,... so no tax breaks / duty free privilege ...whilie the Filipino tree Huggers cry on BBC / CNN ... about global warming etc.,. while back home the firmly entrenched business families while funding the tree huggers also fund politicians so nothing happens ...

I recently enquired about micro wind turbines and solar panels for a hospital, .. the replies detailing the number of paperwork and legal red tape to clear made sure I lost interest

it is a no go unless the power generation companies do it for you ..


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## cvgtpc1 (Jul 28, 2012)

This link was posted last year on the board. I've wondered the same thing. I think I emailed them for more info but didn't get a response.

Bandasolar | Make it happen


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## cvgtpc1 (Jul 28, 2012)

ecureilx said:


> I recently enquired about micro wind turbines and solar panels for a hospital, .. the replies detailing the number of paperwork and legal red tape to clear made sure I lost interest
> 
> it is a no go unless the power generation companies do it for you ..


Is that maybe because it was a big project that got attention?

Would think a private homeowner could order some stuff and install it without all the drama?


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

I notice that there was a solar energy shop/outlet in Dinilupihan Bataan. I also recall there was a law passed around Christmas time allowing the excess solar power generated electricity to be returned to the grid.


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

I have seen the solar street lights in Palawan. I quickly determined that Ecotourism = no infrastructure but we want your money just the same. 

I have also seen a couple of hotels using solar water heaters (Camayan Beach Resort and Wild Orchid Baloy). They work quite well. For me the cost savings is not enough. My tap water is 84-86 degrees routinely and I doubt that my water heater is hardly working to maintain the water hotter.

Bandasolar has a shop in the Subic Freeport across from the main police station. The have flyers all over the Freeport.

If was not where I am now and living in a remote area this would be a definite part of the tool kit. I am sure that maintaining a backup generator is costly. 

I was just up in Illocos Norte for a brief respite. We revisited the wind turbine farm at Bangui. It looks to me that they are more than doubling the numbers that we saw a year and a half ago and I saw them building towers for carrying the electricity to the grid. It still wasn't operational. I can't imagine how much $ the politicians with a vested interest in that project are making for themselves.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

jon1 said:


> I have seen the solar street lights in Palawan. I quickly determined that Ecotourism = no infrastructure but we want your money just the same.
> 
> I have also seen a couple of hotels using solar water heaters (Camayan Beach Resort and Wild Orchid Baloy). They work quite well. For me the cost savings is not enough. My tap water is 84-86 degrees routinely and I doubt that my water heater is hardly working to maintain the water hotter.
> 
> ...


Jon, If that shop in Subic that sells solar equipment has a website--please post it here.



Thanks

Jet Lag..


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## jon1 (Mar 18, 2012)

Gene,

It's the Bandasolar site that cvgtpc1 posted


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

I found a a few Solar company web spots:

Products | Bandasolar

Solar Systems Philippines



Solar Power Installations Philippines, Commercial Solar, Solar Inverters, Solar Panels, Solar Energy | Century Solar Power 

CDR King sells some of these products on a smaller scale, sure would be nice to have your own electrical grid system, there's companies that also sell the windmills.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

Although I'm a fan of solar energy, I have a 12 panel system on my house in the UK. The biggest problem in the Philippines is that you will likely need to run it off-grid with batteries as your storage. My Uk system back feeds the grid so I basically use the solar panels to top up what I take from the grid. On average the solar panels supply about 60% of my electricity. Anyway getting back to the Philippines, there are two problems both to do with heat. Solar panel output is apart from the amount of sun falling on them is also reliant of the heat of the panels. The hotter they get the less efficient they get, and the same with the batteries, the hotter they get the shorter their life. At 25 deg C a given battery may have a life expectancy of say 10 year. Increase the temperature by 8 degrees and you will half its life. So the same battery at 33 deg C will have a life expectancy of only 5 years. Hotter still and you see where I'm going. Finally you can't use car batteries for solar power as you need deep discharge batteries and they are much more expensive than car batteries. You don't want to be changing your shed full of batteries every few years.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

jon1 said:


> Gene,
> 
> It's the Bandasolar site that cvgtpc1 posted


Thanks Jon, I'll find it. I'd love to disconnect from the power company for the most part. I've had enough of paying these outrageous pwr rates!


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## cvgtpc1 (Jul 28, 2012)

Gary D said:


> Although I'm a fan of solar energy, I have a 12 panel system on my house in the UK. The biggest problem in the Philippines is that you will likely need to run it off-grid with batteries as your storage. My Uk system back feeds the grid so I basically use the solar panels to top up what I take from the grid. On average the solar panels supply about 60% of my electricity. Anyway getting back to the Philippines, there are two problems both to do with heat. Solar panel output is apart from the amount of sun falling on them is also reliant of the heat of the panels. The hotter they get the less efficient they get, and the same with the batteries, the hotter they get the shorter their life. At 25 deg C a given battery may have a life expectancy of say 10 year. Increase the temperature by 8 degrees and you will half its life. So the same battery at 33 deg C will have a life expectancy of only 5 years. Hotter still and you see where I'm going. Finally you can't use car batteries for solar power as you need deep discharge batteries and they are much more expensive than car batteries. You don't want to be changing your shed full of batteries every few years.


Very good info as I know nothing about solar, but would start the research if serious about it lol.

To power the higher energy using devices like AC, fridge, electric oven if you have one, I'm sure the solar setup is more extensive and costs alot more. And seeing how lights and TV are probably a small percentage of the electric bill, is the solar setup price worth it to just run that part of the house? A buck's a buck, but if it takes 5 yrs to recoup and then you're changing batteries at 5 years what's the point?


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

cvgtpc1 said:


> Very good info as I know nothing about solar, but would start the research if serious about it lol.
> 
> To power the higher energy using devices like AC, fridge, electric oven if you have one, I'm sure the solar setup is more extensive and costs alot more. And seeing how lights and TV are probably a small percentage of the electric bill, is the solar setup price worth it to just run that part of the house? A buck's a buck, but if it takes 5 yrs to recoup and then you're changing batteries at 5 years what's the point?


For me it's not just the cost of the electric power that is the concern. For whatever reason, most anywhere in the Philippines, the power service is horrible at best. Someone even sneezes in the wrong direction and the power goes out for several hours. Not to mention the ridicules all day (sometimes 12 hours or more) outages for repairs. For just these reasons alone the solar pwr option is worth the investment.


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## cvgtpc1 (Jul 28, 2012)

Jet Lag said:


> For me it's not just the cost of the electric power that is the concern. For whatever reason, most anywhere in the Philippines, the power service is horrible at best. Someone even sneezes in the wrong direction and the power goes out for several hours. Not to mention the ridicules all day (sometimes 12 hours or more) outages for repairs. For just these reasons alone the solar pwr option is worth the investment.


Great point!


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## Walker Talker (May 1, 2014)

*I know solar stuff*



cvgtpc1 said:


> Is that maybe because it was a big project that got attention?
> 
> Would think a private homeowner could order some stuff and install it without all the drama?


I work in sustainable building products here in the US. Go to China and buy several 200 watt panels and an inverter. The prices in Philippines for solar panels looks our rageous. Its easy to set them up, off grid- will run a smal ref, a small aircon and lights for free. Heck with this Miralco!


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## cvgtpc1 (Jul 28, 2012)

Walker Talker said:


> I work in sustainable building products here in the US. Go to China and buy several 200 watt panels and an inverter. The prices in Philippines for solar panels looks our rageous. Its easy to set them up, off grid- will run a smal ref, a small aircon and lights for free. Heck with this Miralco!


Is this stuff small enough to send in a balikbayan box?


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

cvgtpc1 said:


> Is this stuff small enough to send in a balikbayan box?


You can send just about anything Balikbayan, it's not just those small cardboard boxes you see. Solar panels come in various sizes but about 3'x4' seems about average. I have 12 180-200W panels and in the UK sun can hit about 1.9Kw. During the longer summer day I produce more than I use but you will need to store this exess if you can't back feed the grid. There are also different technologies depending on the climate. As I said earlier solar panels suffer in the heat, even in the cold UK the panels are spaced off of my roof by a couple of inches to allow air flow behind them. When I was first looking into it there were two main types of solar panel construction, one that worked better when cooler and the other that could withstand higher temperatures. I think the latest systems use both technologies to get a better performance range where they lay one type of material on top of the other, I think it's called multijunction cells and was originally developed for satellites. So what I'm trying to say is you need the correct cell for the country you are going to use them in. If I shipped my system from the UK it probably wouldn't work very well.


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## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and experiences. I live in the southern province of Cebu and in the last few months, there has only been a few short brownouts, and 1 long outage. Even though I might just break even over the years, just the reliability of electricity "when" I need it would be my reason to go with solar. The batteries certainly would be my greatest concern. In my search, the solar products here in the Philippines really do seem high....but how difficult is it to import solar products from China?


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

George6020 said:


> Thanks everyone for your thoughts and experiences. I live in the southern province of Cebu and in the last few months, there has only been a few short brownouts, and 1 long outage. Even though I might just break even over the years, just the reliability of electricity "when" I need it would be my reason to go with solar. The batteries certainly would be my greatest concern. In my search, the solar products here in the Philippines really do seem high....but how difficult is it to import solar products from China?


I think solar is still at the stage of you use it if you have no other option. In somewhere like the Philippines payback should not even be considdered.

I know this doesn't apply to the Philippines but my nominally 2kw system including installation but no batteries, we run on grid, costs about $15,000. I get from the government about $0.70 for every kwH I produce and about $0.09 from the electricity company for every kwH I feed onto the grid. Payback is about 8-11 years.


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## Walker Talker (May 1, 2014)

cvgtpc1 said:


> Is this stuff small enough to send in a balikbayan box?


sure- but pad and protect as the boxes get thrown around like ragdolls


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## M.C.A. (Feb 24, 2013)

*Heat a concern, maybe not*



George6020 said:


> Thanks everyone for your thoughts and experiences. I live in the southern province of Cebu and in the last few months, there has only been a few short brownouts, and 1 long outage. Even though I might just break even over the years, just the reliability of electricity "when" I need it would be my reason to go with solar. The batteries certainly would be my greatest concern. In my search, the solar products here in the Philippines really do seem high....but how difficult is it to import solar products from China?


Since I have planted tree's all around our house and property the heat factor has gone way down, tree's can make a huge difference on how hot your house gets, or if no house location is everything.


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## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

I'm still hoping to get some info about getting solar products from China. I could take a trip there, buy a bunch of panels and accessories, then bring back on the plane, for additional baggage fees. BUT, since they would only be for personal use, would they be subject to Customs and VAT? 
If I just order online, I was told I need to hire a Customs agent, pay for processing numerous documents, pay VAT, plus possibly port officials.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

George6020 said:


> I'm still hoping to get some info about getting solar products from China. I could take a trip there, buy a bunch of panels and accessories, then bring back on the plane, for additional baggage fees. BUT, since they would only be for personal use, would they be subject to Customs and VAT?
> If I just order online, I was told I need to hire a Customs agent, pay for processing numerous documents, pay VAT, plus possibly port officials.


The average size of a solar panel is about 16 sq feet. You will need 10-12 of them. Shipping them is not going to be cheap.


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## yakc130 (Apr 27, 2012)

It's amazing how simple things can become difficult in the Islands.


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## pcarlos (Jun 10, 2014)

I met some people like a month ago whos starting up a solar power business. They're just fixing the documents to start the business but as he said they would be offering it to households in the near future but for now their gona meet with office buildings and other business establishments. I'll get an update on how its doing now


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## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

I just did research on Solar products from Hong Kong. Since going to mainland China is such a hassle for Americans, I might try visiting HK to check out their Solar Energy products.


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## pcarlos (Jun 10, 2014)

Theres a trade show at Hong Kong that is held every year. They feature lighting products and some solar panels and products. Mostly suppliers and manufacturers so its by bulk order


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## highspeedlowprofile (Jun 11, 2014)

Gentlemen,

Go to CDR-King. They are nationwide and have a wide range of low cost china made solar panels and accessories. 

Just make sure you do a good google search and get familiar with your project before you buy.

Speaking of OFF GRID, anyone know where I can get a Gasul or Solane (LP GAS) freezer? I prefer to make my own ice instead of buying it 30 kilometers away....

Ingat!

david


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## Glen48 (Jul 6, 2012)

You can now buy. 12volt freezers,fridges, air con. ceiling fans with remotes, washing machines.TV's, dvd players etc.
or buy tv's with inbuilt dvd pvr players.


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## geandc (Jul 27, 2014)

Jet Lag said:


> For me it's not just the cost of the electric power that is the concern. For whatever reason, most anywhere in the Philippines, the power service is horrible at best. Someone even sneezes in the wrong direction and the power goes out for several hours. Not to mention the ridicules all day (sometimes 12 hours or more) outages for repairs. For just these reasons alone the solar pwr option is worth the investment.



This sounds good, but from what I've read the solar power systems still need some source of external electrical power to run, so if you're home power goes out (brownout) then your solar power system goes out as well.


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## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

Most people have batteries that store energy........that's the whole reason for having solar, so you don't have to depend on the power company. you have your own power, independent of exterior source, for as long as your batteries last. Of course, if you are tied to the power grid with NO batteries, then the energy you generate from solar will just lower your consumption during the day, while at night you continue consumption through local power company.


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## geandc (Jul 27, 2014)

George6020 said:


> Most people have batteries that store energy........that's the whole reason for having solar, so you don't have to depend on the power company. you have your own power, independent of exterior source, for as long as your batteries last. Of course, if you are tied to the power grid with NO batteries, then the energy you generate from solar will just lower your consumption during the day, while at night you continue consumption through local power company.


The companies (one was Matec) I've spoken with in Manila all only have or push the grid type (no batteries) solar energy systems. From what I'm told when there is a brownout, the grid shuts down and to protect their workers, so will your inverter, thus no solar power available. Also, can anyone with solar energy confirm they've received credit for their excess energy from Meralco?


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## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

geandc said:


> The companies (one was Matec) I've spoken with in Manila all only have or push the grid type (no batteries) solar energy systems. From what I'm told when there is a brownout, the grid shuts down and to protect their workers, so will your inverter, thus no solar power available. Also, can anyone with solar energy confirm they've received credit for their excess energy from Meralco?


If that's they way their system is connected, then its connected incorrectly, because the inverter is powered by the DC generated by the solar panels. Proper connections will include a Disconnect also, possibly automatic...........thus to protect ANY back feed on Meralco lines.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

George6020 said:


> If that's they way their system is connected, then its connected incorrectly, because the inverter is powered by the DC generated by the solar panels. Proper connections will include a Disconnect also, possibly automatic...........thus to protect ANY back feed on Meralco lines.


As far as I'm aware all systems that back feed the grid do not have batteries and turn off if the grid goes down for safety and to protect the inverter. I know mine does this.


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## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

It appears systems like these/yours ONLY lower the consumption during the day, and ONLY operate when the grid is energized. These systems don't give you the best savings for your investment. Its much better to have the option of using your solar power even during brownouts. Even better is to have deep cycle batteries. 
Peak loads are during the daytime for power companies, which could be the reason your system would function only during the daytime. Many small businesses also operate during daytime hours, which makes this design popular too. 
Unfortunately, you won't get maximum savings from your investment, nor will you have emergency power during brownouts or at night.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

George6020 said:


> It appears systems like these/yours ONLY lower the consumption during the day, and ONLY operate when the grid is energized. These systems don't give you the best savings for your investment. Its much better to have the option of using your solar power even during brownouts. Even better is to have deep cycle batteries.
> Peak loads are during the daytime for power companies, which could be the reason your system would function only during the daytime. Many small businesses also operate during daytime hours, which makes this design popular too.
> Unfortunately, you won't get maximum savings from your investment, nor will you have emergency power during brownouts or at night.


I use the grid as my battery, put excess power back on to the grid which winds my meter in reverse and pull it back when the sun goes in. It means I don't have to pay for a system to cover peaks and not be used most of the time.


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## George6020 (Apr 18, 2014)

Gary D said:


> I use the grid as my battery, put excess power back on to the grid which winds my meter in reverse and pull it back when the sun goes in. It means I don't have to pay for a system to cover peaks and not be used most of the time.


If you have an agreement with the power company to feed back excess power from your solar panels, that's a nice benefit, but I've not heard of anyone in the Philippines having that agreement.

Philippines has 1 of the highest kwh rates in ALL of Asia, called price gouging in the US. I doubt the government can do anything about it either. 

Next year, I plan to install a solar power system for my house, but I will include the options for continuous power during brownouts and nighttime. 

Solar power systems are still expensive and take 15-20 years to recap your investment, depending on your load. But for me, I just want the convenience of having power when I need it.


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## Manitoba (Jun 25, 2014)

geandc said:


> This sounds good, but from what I've read the solar power systems still need some source of external electrical power to run, so if you're home power goes out (brownout) then your solar power system goes out as well.


Solar systems can be completely self contained.


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