# Retiring to Mexico with chronic health issues



## beckster

My husband and I would like to retire from U.S.A. to Mexico, perhaps Chapala area in the next year or two. We are concerned about health care after the move since we both have health conditions that I believe would make us ineligible for health insurance coverage there. We won't be eligible for Medicare for a few years. Has anyone had experience trying to bridge that gap with pre-existing conditions?


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## Isla Verde

beckster said:


> My husband and I would like to retire from U.S.A. to Mexico, perhaps Chapala area in the next year or two. We are concerned about health care after the move since we both have health conditions that I believe would make us ineligible for health insurance coverage there. We won't be eligible for Medicare for a few years. Has anyone had experience trying to bridge that gap with pre-existing conditions?


Even without insurance, health care in Mexico is much more affordable than it is in the US. When you become eligible for Medicare in the US, that won't do you any good if you're living permanently in Mexico unless you want to leave the country every time you need to see the doctor.


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## sunnyvmx

Here in Catemaco an American resident of Tepetapan fell and split open his forehead. The small hospital in town stitched him up and didn't charge him a peso. For more extensive hospital care, be prepared to pay in cash before leaving.


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## cuylers5746

*Health Issues in Mexico*

I would suggest that you pick a city to move to that's a Capital City of that State that has it's own Medical School(s). Why? You will have the best Medical Care and an over abundance of Doctor's to choose from. This helps to keep their charges down (demand/supply). Guadalajara has a very famous Medical School there.

First off, you're Medical Insurance from USA will probably be accepted in some Major Hospitals? There's (3) in Guadalajara that advertise that accept it. It all depends on which insurer you have. I have a friend that has a plan from State of Penslyvania for retirement, that is insanely hard to get reimbursed for his medicines here. Their process for the USA Medical Insurer would only pay if the medicine had the USA Medical number on it???? Been a real struggle for him.

Unless you're getting Medical Insurance through your employer, then you're paying through the nose. It huge factor for us in deciding to retire early in Mexico. To get an HMO in California back in 2007 with a $500.00 deductible each and then $30.00 co-pay to see a Doctor they wanted to charge us $900.00 per month for the both of us. That's $11,800.00 per year and then having to pay deductibles! I looked at my wife and said - hell with that we can live comfortably in Mexico for that. And, that's what we did. We fixed up a home that my wife was given in an Estate from her aunt.

So, I suggest you fly down to Guadalajara with lists of what you've been charged for common Medical Procedures for you and your husband at your USA Hospital and go into I think it's the Americana Hospital and ask them to write down their charges. Then ask them what a General Practicioner and Specialists charge for visit. Then you will have your answers and depending on what you hear - good to go, or time to stay home in USA. Go take your prescriptions over to Fenix Pharmacy and ask them what they would cost. 

There are some downsides to Mexican Medical care though?
1. You'll get a Doctor that will spend more than 3 minutes with you and actually listen and be concerned about your care. Novel idea eh?
2. When you're really ill and can't leave home - you'll be able to find a Doctor that will make house calls in an emergency.
3. Your Doctor has so many more options to prescribe you drugs. You will be able to take Drugs
from Europe, that haven't been through the 12 year approval process of the USA FDA. Some of them superior drugs.
4. You actually might get well if you explore other forms of Medical Care that are available in Mexico. Modern Medicine, which in my mind is neither of those words only treat "your symptoms"
and not cure you. Pretty poor loosing idea if you think about it? You want to get yourself cured maybe you should explore a Naturopathy Doctor or even Homepathy Doctors of which there are some excellent ones here in Mexico.
5. Less stress from living in the USA some of your symptoms might just go away naturally.

I was take a Statin Drug and Medicine to lower my Blood Pressure. After six months in living in the "last Century" down here and a lot more stress free environment - I got off both of those medicines. So, think hard before you come. Could you live with these downsides?

I think it will definitely be worth the visit, and it's a whole lot warmer here this time of year.


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## johnmex

At this time, a specialist charges between 600-1200 pesos in Guadalajara. It depends on the specialty and how hungry the doctor is....


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## Isla Verde

johnmex said:


> At this time, a specialist charges between 600-1200 pesos in Guadalajara. It depends on the specialty and how hungry the doctor is....


Wow, that's a bit high. I've never paid more than $600 to see a specialist in Mexico City.


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## cuylers5746

*Costs for a Medical Specialist*

Wow, I agree to that that is way high to pay for a Specialist!

Here in Tepic it's around $500.00 up to a max. we have ever seen $800.00 pesos.
Still there's a great Internist here, old guy still charging only $250.00 pesos.

You'd be suprised at times what good care you can get from some of the Doctor's that
practice out of the "Similares" Pharmacys for like $25.00 pesos - really.


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## dongringo

beckster said:


> My husband and I would like to retire from U.S.A. to Mexico, perhaps Chapala area in the next year or two. We are concerned about health care after the move since we both have health conditions that I believe would make us ineligible for health insurance coverage there. We won't be eligible for Medicare for a few years. Has anyone had experience trying to bridge that gap with pre-existing conditions?


DON'T !
Unless you speak Spanish, carry cash, and are content to mostly not know your doctor's credentials. 
There are some excellent doctors and hospitals in Mexico. Health insurance, even with pre-existing conditions, though probably excluded from coverage for a few years. Your best bet is to find someone living in Chapala who may have some local insights.


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## beckster

*Thanks for input*

Thanks to all for your input and insights. My husband has not been able to work for a couple of years, but has not qualified for SS disability/Medicare. I am still employed part-time in U.S. and we are both insured through my employer, but that would disappear if i resigned (except for potential for 18 months expensive COBRA coverage). 

We both have conditions which are progressive and incurable and would ultimately probably require a return to the U.S. for management of complications. I may require an organ transplant in the future. I am not sure that is a realistic possibility in a developing country with no health insurance, but would be covered by Medicare in U.S. (assuming I am eligible for the coverage AND the treatment at the time). But for now, both of our conditions are 'managed' and we could have a reasonable quality of everyday life for quite a long while before needing huge outlays if all goes well. But I guess you just never know what tomorrow will bring...hard to plan for every possibility! 

Our U.S. out-of-pocket health care costs the past couple of years have been around $7k/year WITH health insurance. We could self-insure for the basic ongoing care in Mexico, but having no coverage for the BIG stuff is scary. We are both at risk for cardiovascular emergencies, which worries my husband when we consider living in Mexico.

I don't discount cuylers' comments about alternative treatments, or the potential positive health effects of decreased stress and more relaxed lifestyle if I could retire early (an impossible luxury for us living in the U.S.) 

My mother retired at 55 to a small rural (read: affordable) U.S. community and had several years of relaxed lifestyle enjoying her hobbies after having worked hard all her life. She sacrificed coverage for routine medical care because it just didn't fit the retirement budget. After several years of apparent good health, she had a sudden cardiac event at an early age and died before the nearest emergency services (30 minutes away) could respond. Should she have deferred retirement to stay in the big city and continue working to provide health insurance for annual physicals that MIGHT have identified her emerging cardiac problem and allowed life-sparing treatment? Should she have kept working so she could afford to live closer to emergency services if they were needed? Or should we be thankful that she took the leap, retired early and allowed herself a few years of rest and relaxation before the end? I guess it's really a matter of perspective. Survival of a heart attack outside a U.S. hospital is only about 7 1/2 % on average - worse with a slow EMS system (New York < 2% survival) and better with excellent EMS (Seattle ~ 30%). If you can manage to be IN the hospital when it happens, lucky you! good care and health insurance could make all the difference.

We are looking into making an investigative trip to Guadalajara and the surrounding area. My husband's condition makes him very heat intolerant, so I think we need to check it out at the hottest season. I'm thinking May? We have had to crank our ac down the past two years for him (another big expense here!) or he gets nauseated. I suspect we would need some AC even in Chapala - is it even available in hotels, etc? Are there cities very temperate but still a bit cooler than Chapala area?

Thanks again for all the input!


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## chicois8

You just don't retire to Mexico without meeting income requirements.

May and June are the hottest months at Chapala, last year during those months the max. temps reached 102 degrees.

A/C and electric costs in Mexico can cost an arm and a leg...I think it is called DAC, if you go over a certain amount you end up paying this high usage rate for many months to come.

And remember Chapala is high altitude at 5000 feet, I don't know about heart conditions and high altitude problems...

good luck


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## beckster

chicois8 said:


> You just don't retire to Mexico without meeting income requirements.
> 
> May and June are the hottest months at Chapala, last year during those months the max. temps reached 102 degrees.


Income requirements should be ok, but 102 degrees without a/c is scary. I wonder if a portable AC unit could be used in a single room for those exceptional days without driving up the electrical cost too much. Whatever it is, it is probably better than the $300+ monthly that AC costs us here in summer ($239/month year round payment plan).


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## chicois8

Only you and your husband know which ailments/ heart diseases each of you have, it appears from Google some problems benefit from a higher altitude while others do not, you both have difficult decisions to make,suerte...


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## cuylers5746

*Heart & Heat sensitive cities*

It would be hard to beat Guadalajara after hearing all your medical related problems and heat sensitivity of your husband. Guadalajara is at 4500 ft. elevation.

While in Guadalajara you might go over to the IMSS new Heart Center. The most modern in all Latin America. You won't qualify to become a member with your ailment history, but you could enquire what would be charges per day and per procedure being a non IMSS member? They might treat you?

My good surfing budy has some serious heart complications and had to be forwarded from Tepic in an ambulance to Guadalajara, and his wife was very pleased at how modern and competent all the staff was at the new IMSS Heart Treatment Center. 

Zacatecas, Zacatecas is a cold climate. It's up at 8700 ft. elevation south of Monterrey. One of local Mexican's favorite cities to visit, but I know nothing about it's Medical Care and especially it's Heart Specialists.

But at around 4500 ft. elevation I think Guadalajara might fit the bill for you all around. Mexico City has some great hospitals, but the stress of living there, the traffic, smog, etc. is not condusive to good health. My brother-in-law is working there and they live 6 miles away from his work and it takes 1-1.5 hours in commute time each way. You'd be dead in the ambulance before you might reach a hospital. Ah, but you could rent a "Departamento" in the next block?


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## chicois8

Yea, no traffic or smog in Guadalajara...LOL

I believe Guadalajara is listed at 5225feet above sea level...


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## cuylers5746

Infinitely less than D.F. for sure


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## beckster

chicois8 said:


> Yea, no traffic or smog in Guadalajara...LOL
> 
> I believe Guadalajara is listed at 5225feet above sea level...


5000 ft or higher sounds fabulous to me! we are currently at about 2500 ft. I'm not sure if moving to that altitude would be an issue for my husband's condition or not...I guess further research is in order. I do like quiet and fresh air though :juggle:


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## cuylers5746

*A/C in Mexico*

I don't know why no one answered you on this question directly?

It's not widely used but there is an excellent variety of A/C wall units available. There are from the top Asian Manufacturers. Some very quite and efficient. You could put them in the most used rooms of your prospective rented house.

While in Guadalajara stop in one of their several malls and go into a;

Liverpool
Fabrica de Francia
Coppel
Walymart

Stores and check them out. Most are in the $4000+ - $6000+ pesos range for a good one.

When looking for a house. The older one's with adobe walls and high ceilings are the most comfortable. They retain the heat and radiate out the heat in the winter and insulate your interior
from the heat in the summer. The Spanish were really smart; where they built their cities (for the most part) and how they built their buildings. 

You'll probably if you find the right situation for all of your needs you might be able to save 50% on your Meds. and 75% on your electrical bill with CFE. Here in Tepic for a 2250 sq. ft. house last month's CFE bill was $393.00 pesos = $73.07 USD at todays exchange rate. Oh, and they just bill every two months, so that was really only $36.00 USD per month. But in our town the electric bill is 80% subsidized by the Federal Government ( as it's their oil that they sell to CFE to produce most of the electricity). Maybe someone that lives in Guadalajara can comment on rather the CFE bills are subsidized or not?

Where we live in the adobe walled house we have only used a small radiator type portable heater about 6 times since we've lived here in our bedroom. With this Global Warming things are getting warmer and your artic storms you send us get down further south each year. But here where we live we only have to use our ceiling fans about 6-10 afternoons a year in the summer.


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## mickisue1

cuylers5746 said:


> I don't know why no one answered you on this question directly?
> 
> It's not widely used but there is an excellent variety of A/C wall units available. There are from the top Asian Manufacturers. Some very quite and efficient. You could put them in the most used rooms of your prospective rented house.
> 
> While in Guadalajara stop in one of their several malls and go into a;
> 
> Liverpool
> Fabrica de Francia
> Coppel
> Walymart
> 
> Stores and check them out. Most are in the $4000+ - $6000+ pesos range for a good one.
> 
> When looking for a house. The older one's with adobe walls and high ceilings are the most comfortable. They retain the heat and radiate out the heat in the winter and insulate your interior
> from the heat in the summer. The Spanish were really smart; where they built their cities (for the most part) and how they built their buildings.
> 
> You'll probably if you find the right situation for all of your needs you might be able to save 50% on your Meds. and 75% on your electrical bill with CFE. Here in Tepic for a 2250 sq. ft. house last month's CFE bill was $393.00 pesos = $73.07 USD at todays exchange rate. Oh, and they just bill every two months, so that was really only $36.00 USD per month. But in our town the electric bill is 80% subsidized by the Federal Government ( as it's their oil that they sell to CFE to produce most of the electricity). Maybe someone that lives in Guadalajara can comment on rather the CFE bills are subsidized or not?
> 
> Where we live in the adobe walled house we have only used a small radiator type portable heater about 6 times since we've lived here in our bedroom. With this Global Warming things are getting warmer and your artic storms you send us get down further south each year. But here where we live we only have to use our ceiling fans about 6-10 afternoons a year in the summer.


Did you mean $37.07 USD? I just checked on xe.com and it showed $393 as $30.83 USD.

My rule of thumb that I use to convert pesos to dollars is about $8 USD to $100 pesos. It's usually a little less, but I'd rather think it costs more, and have it cost less!


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## arturo_b

beckster said:


> We both have conditions which are progressive and incurable and would ultimately probably require a return to the U.S. for management of complications.


There is a stem-cell clinic here in Tijuana that has had a great deal of success with many degenerative conditions. The main drawback is that US insurance doesn't cover stem-cell therapy yet, so you'd be out of pocket for about $17K per person. PM me if you're interested and I'll hunt up their details.

We're also expecting to see Medicare come to Mexico sometime soon. Not sure when ... a guy in Colorado began suggesting it as a cost-cutting strategy three years ago or so. I haven't heard anything about him for a year now.


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## beckster

cuylers5746 said:


> I don't know why no one answered you on this question directly?
> 
> It's not widely used but there is an excellent variety of A/C wall units available. There are from the top Asian Manufacturers. Some very quite and efficient. You could put them in the most used rooms of your prospective rented house.
> 
> While in Guadalajara stop in one of their several malls and go into a;
> 
> Liverpool
> Fabrica de Francia
> Coppel
> Walymart
> 
> Stores and check them out. Most are in the $4000+ - $6000+ pesos range for a good one.
> 
> When looking for a house. The older one's with adobe walls and high ceilings are the most comfortable. They retain the heat and radiate out the heat in the winter and insulate your interior
> from the heat in the summer. The Spanish were really smart; where they built their cities (for the most part) and how they built their buildings.
> 
> You'll probably if you find the right situation for all of your needs you might be able to save 50% on your Meds. and 75% on your electrical bill with CFE. Here in Tepic for a 2250 sq. ft. house last month's CFE bill was $393.00 pesos = $73.07 USD at todays exchange rate. Oh, and they just bill every two months, so that was really only $36.00 USD per month. But in our town the electric bill is 80% subsidized by the Federal Government ( as it's their oil that they sell to CFE to produce most of the electricity). Maybe someone that lives in Guadalajara can comment on rather the CFE bills are subsidized or not?
> 
> Where we live in the adobe walled house we have only used a small radiator type portable heater about 6 times since we've lived here in our bedroom. With this Global Warming things are getting warmer and your artic storms you send us get down further south each year. But here where we live we only have to use our ceiling fans about 6-10 afternoons a year in the summer.


Thanks for the feedback about the a/c. My parents built a modern rammed earth home without heat or a/c at an elevation of about 5,000 ft. I am also familiar with adobe. I'm inclined to believe I could do just fine with occasional portable heat/ac in that climate. Your home is exactly the same sq ft as mine and your electric is 15% of what mine costs.


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## beckster

cuylers5746 said:


> Zacatecas, Zacatecas is a cold climate. It's up at 8700 ft. elevation south of Monterrey. One of local Mexican's favorite cities to visit, but I know nothing about it's Medical Care and especially it's Heart Specialists.


Zacatecas climate sounds great! A quick Google search brings up a beautiful you-tube video of the city as well as the story of 12 shot there in drug-related gun battle last week.


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## Longford

My recollection is that the killings, the recent dozen, were not in the city of Zacatecas or adjacent, but, rather, an hour or more north of the city in a zone where there has been conflict.


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## AlanMexicali

Longford said:


> My recollection is that the killings, the recent dozen, were not in the city of Zacatecas or adjacent, but, rather, an hour or more north of the city in a zone where there has been conflict.


That is correct. The one thing you didn´t mention to her was that in many central Mexican states the state capital [or the old state capital] has the same name as the state itself, so when reading about a story, as this one, if it was in a suburb of the city of Zacatecas, for example, and names a place where it happened or in the city of Zacatecas itself the news article would have printed, Zacatecas, Zacatecas [meaning the city of Zacatecas in the state of Zacatecas]. For convience most refer to the city of Zacatecas as Cuidad de Zacatecas so there is no confusion. 

Also a quick Google Map seach will ususlly bring up the city, town or suburb so you can actually see where things actually happened. 

When posters talk of Guanajuato I don´t know if they are talking about being in the state of Guanajuato somewhere or the city of Guanajuato but have to presume they are refering to the Cuidad de Guanajuato. Alan


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## cuylers5746

*Tijuana Health Clinics*

Arturo_b makes some good points and brings up some other questions in the back ground.

Many American's that live farther away from the border are not aware of some of the advanced Medicine being practiced in Tijuana. The Doctor's are in close proximity to millions of prospective clients and bring some of the latest techniques and technology from Europe. Don't expect the politicized and bought off by big Pharma FDA to save your life!

There's clinics there that have been treating and killing cancer only cells for years with a machine technology that raises the heat level of only the cancer cells and kills them. They've been doing this for years. There's even a new one that can track the vibration of the cancer cells in specific organs and then send that same frequency back to those specific cells and kill them. 

Other's are treating cancer sucessfully with extreme diet concoctions that do work too. Steve McQueen it was believed died from cancer in Baja from experimental technology, but when the truth comes out years later it became known it might have been because he left the clinic's regimine after being convinced by his relatives to quit the therapy.

Heart advances with stem cell technology seems great too. Does your Doctor have you on Krill Omega-3, very absorbent CoQ10, and Hawthorne Berry extract for your Heart. The heart it turns out is probably one of the organs in the body that is the most susceptable to regeneration in the body. Since taking my supplements withing 6 months I found my chest hairs started turning from grey and silver back to dark black again. I know what that means - rejuvination of my heart. You see I had a great fishing buddy that was on his death bed in Virginia when he received a heart flown in from a 19 year old male. Within a year afterwards the hair on his chest turned black again, his libido was up and he was thinking youthful thoughts ("not his own").

If your Doctor doesn't have you on this these natural supplements besides the medicine ask him "why not"? Some medicines depleat your natural manufacturing of CoQ10 by your heart. Not all Doctor's in the USA are 100% sold out to big Pharma yet. Maybe your Doctor in Seattle when you come back from T.J. will explore and work in conjunction with the Doctors in T.J. as he can't put you on those treatments in the USA due to FDA constraints?

So, you haven't been thinking about it. But maybe you should stop in T.J. on the way down to Guadalajara and start exploring the Clinics that maybe Arturo_b can dig up for you to examine?
Renting a place between Rosarito Beach and Tijuana Beach would be a nice and comfortable climate for you. Often times the warm Japanese current in the Ocean heads offshore before it get's to Baja leaving really cold water along the northern Baja Coast and acts as a radiator cooling the coast greatly. Even fog in the summer time at times. You might just love it and have both worlds. The USA at your door step and Baja Mexico in your front yard. The cost of living in Baja Norte is more expensive than Guadalajara though - about 25% more expensive and about 25% less expensive than living in San Diego. But you can offset some of those cost differentials by being able to readily cross back over into USA and buy those things that are better and cheaper in the USA than in Mexico - like wash & ware clothes for instance.

Arturo_b might be onto something for you there. Remember in your searches you're responsible for your self and your own decisions in Mexico. It's like the society Ronald Reagan envisioned, where people are self reliant.


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## cuylers5746

Yes mickisue1 you were right. It was a typo.

It is $30.847723 $USD as of yesterdays fix.


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## Longford

cuylers5746 said:


> Remember in your searches you're responsible for your self and your own decisions in Mexico. It's like the society Ronald Reagan envisioned, where people are self reliant.


If I didn't think you were serious in making the remark I quoted I'd say it was funny. People in Mexico are "self reliant" because, probably for most, they've no other alternative. Little to no safety net. Poor quality healthcare services, nationally. These are my observations.


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## cuylers5746

*Refreshing not Funny*

No to me it's not funny, but refreshing.

It reminds me of the time some house wife from Southern California was visiting T.J. She tripped on an uneven sidewalk (no we don't have any of these SOB do we?) and broke her arm. It's not funny that she broke her arm, what was funny was the reply from the Judge in T.J. when she tried to sue the City. The Judge admonished her that here in Mexico you're responsible for yourself not others or some Insurance Company. Lady you need to watch where you walk. The whole court room broke out in laughter as the Judge laughed and dismissed the case.


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## cuylers5746

*Safety Nets and at what price?*

Sir your observations are dead wrong.

Mexico has a far superior "Medical Delivery System" for the people than the USA. I sure would prefer to be here in Mexico during a terrorist attack that effected millions of people than the pathetic Medical Delivery System in the USA that has left 47 Million people uninsured (and still counting). 

Public Health System. I remember when a little kid in USA we had such a thing. Yes, it may be some of the most advanced Medicine and procedures in the World, but worth nothing to those not insured, or their policy doesn't cove those procedures or some idiot behind a desk at the Insurance Company is making the decisions who get's what and when.

I had to stop and think for a moment and will only list a few simple examples why I'll take the Mexican system over the USA Social Institutions any day. Why? Mexico can always do it "quicker, simplar, cheaper and faster" than the USA. But, both countries are caught deep in the Socialism Mire. I kind of think of the USA today as the United States of Corporations or Farms. They're so deeply dependent on Government handouts, their poor management could not exist in a true Capitalist Environment anymore, that is the majority of Corporate America.

Here's one example for you. Here in Mexico instead of employing hundreds of thousands of employees in Employment Development Departments in each State to give out Unemployment Benefits, they make the employers give out 3 months in wages if an employee leaves or get's fired from his job after being there for a year. Total elimination of an Unemployment Department. Now, was that quicker, cheaper, simplar, cheaper than the USA version. The employee get's his severance which is the equivalent of 6 months unemployment in the USA immediately in one payment. Oh, and if the employer doesn't pay immediately, the Labor Dept. will come down on his head like a ton of bricks with big fine.

But to compare the USA and Mexico Socialism and safety nets is an effort in futility. Both are so deeply sunk in Socialism it would be a great subject for a Social Scientist to write about. It would probably take 500-800 pages to cover the subject. Only after reading that would I feel 100% qualified to comment fully on the subject. Very complex. Oh, and after that some Zapatista would rear his head and tell us we ******'s are all wet.

So, if you think the USA has a better safety net. Then maybe you should explore living in some decaying state such as New Jersey, California or New York. I have a friend living in Syracuse on a nice lake side house that's worth $5,000.00 per year in Property Taxes for those Safety Nets you talk about. Oh and as the lady quoted about the survival rate to get a patient under cardiac arest to the hospital and survive <2%. I've done my Cost/Benefit Analysis and it tells me to stick with my $55.00 USD equivalent property taxes and find my own Medical Insurance.


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## beckster

My head is spinning trying to consider all the different factors. It would be great to have both time and money to explore several locations in Mexico and south America. Unfortunately, as long as i have a job i don't have time to do that and if i quit working i won't have money to explore.


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## mickisue1

Here's the good news.

You can work to find a job that you can do remotely, before leaving, so that WHERE you are only matters insofar as having a reliable internet connection.

Then, plan to spend at least 6 months renting in the place that seems best to you. If you love it, you're home.

If not, go to the next and the next. Remote work only requires, usually, that you complete the tasks that you are assigned, whether simple or complex, and you can do them at your own pace. My daughther, who lives in Italy, earned quite a bit of money, that she'll be paid in Feb and Mar, while she was here for the past three weeks. She translates business documents into English for a variety of employers and agencies who hire translators for smaller companies. All she needed to do was have the discipline to get a certain number of words translated each day for the assignments she was sent.

If the job that you now do part time, or a similar one, can translate into one that you can do from home, well, with the internet, working from home can be anywhere in the world, can't it?


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## Longford

cuylers5746 said:


> Mexico has a far superior "Medical Delivery System" for the people than the USA.


One of the funniest, and most of the wall comments about medical care in Mexico I've read in a very long time. My suggestion? Move to Mexico. Live in Mexico. Experience the medical system for yourself. Don't believe everything the tourism promoters feed youl :juggle:


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## beckster

I would very much like to 'try before I buy' in Mexico. I know once i let go of my job with my employer of 20 years, neither my husband or I will ever be eligible for health insurance again in the U.S. until we reach Medicare eligibility. There is certainly the possibility that medical expenses could bankrupt our retirement savings very quickly if we couldn't get insured at least with a high deductible or catastrophic coverage.


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## mickisue1

beckster said:


> I would very much like to 'try before I buy' in Mexico. I know once i let go of my job with my employer of 20 years, neither my husband or I will ever be eligible for health insurance again in the U.S. until we reach Medicare eligibility. There is certainly the possibility that medical expenses could bankrupt our retirement savings very quickly if we couldn't get insured at least with a high deductible or catastrophic coverage.


You are, thankfully, NOT accurate in your comments about eligibility. Obamacare has made the practice of cherrypicking customers illegal in the US. I won't deny that your costs may be higher, but you MUST, once the full bill becomes law, be able to obtain insurance.


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## mickisue1

Even better. I was wrong about the cost. Read the section on guaranteed issue: Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## RVGRINGO

No matter how you slice it, costs are lower in Mexico.
It costs less to get better and, if that doesn:t work, its costs a lot less for cremation.


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## mickisue1

RVGRINGO said:


> No matter how you slice it, costs are lower in Mexico.
> It costs less to get better and, if that doesn:t work, its costs a lot less for cremation.


Absolutely, RV. My point was that it's no longer an economic disaster to leave a less than satisfactory job where one has stayed because of the benefits. 

Enjoying life AND having a much lower cost of living is so much better than merely avoiding economic disaster, no?


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## gudgrief

I have several chronic conditions and had bypass surgery in the US in July of 2011. I have a US residence and do qualify for Medicare. I live close enough to the border that going to the US for care in not too much of a burden, between 2 and 3 times a year.

Thinking that I might need immediate care ssometime, I looked into both IMSS which is about $300/yr and Seguro Popular which is cost free unless you are very, very rich. Seguro Popular is not concerned with pre-existing conditions but there is a catalog of services to which it is limited. How limited is hard to say. IMSS lists pre-existing conditions it doesn't cover and some very common alilments are not covered. I signed up for Seguro Popular 3 months ago and have since seen the doctor assigned to me twice, had a complete lab workup and an ultrasound for kidney function and prostatitis wihout question because I have been taking statins for many years and I'm at an age where getting up at night is very common.

I'm pretty impressed with the competence or apparent competence of my doc. Maybe he's a bit too cautious because he has me scheduled for a urologic procedure to confirm the validity of PSA tests. There has been no indication of cancer ever and if this procedure in March is a biopsy, they damn well better put me to sleep. Since there's time, some appointments with specialists have to be scheduled way in advance like urology, others like the ultrasound took pace in the same week, I can question my doc the next time I see him. You don't really need an appointment to see you doc. You can just show up around 9 or 10 AM and may have to wait an hour or so till he clears his appointments. Having an appointment may not reduce the wait much but you do have an absolutely earliest time to appear.

I am taking two medicines prescribed by my USD docs that are not available through Seguro Popular and there is no reasonable alternative through Seguro Popular. They both get me into the donut hole within 6 months. I can buy them at a Mexican pharmacy for only a little more than the copay under Part D. I take 3 other medicines that cost around $10/mo. here so there's not much savings signing up for Part D. and having to make more frequrnt trips to the US. A trip by bus, satying overnight 1 night costs me about $200, so if it coincides with doctors appointments, maybe getting 3 mo. supplies of the $10/mo. scripts and getting 1 or 2 month supplies of the other 2 may make me break even over just paying full price for all 5 in Mexico.

Seguro Popular is worth looking into if you are going to have a resident or rentista visa, a tourst card/visa is enough to qualify. It will all depende on you conditions. Even though the costs are a lot lower than the US, private medical care is not cheap. For angioplasty, they wanted $4000-5000 cash up front, no telling what bypass surgery would have cost. That caused me to sign up for Medicare and see a cardiologist in the US. It turned out ti was too late for angioplasty and I went into a US hospital for the surgery. My share was less than the full cost in Mexico. And, most Mexican government hospitals are neither heated nor air conditioned.

I hopes this helps and gives you a slightly different slant on the situation.


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## gudgrief

cuylers5746 said:


> Zacatecas, Zacatecas is a cold climate. It's up at 8700 ft. elevation south of Monterrey. One of local Mexican's favorite cities to visit, but I know nothing about it's Medical Care and especially it's Heart Specialists.


I live in zacatecas at about 8000' and have had experience with local medical care which I wrote up earlier on the last page of this thread.

Good luck!


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## robeal

beckster said:


> My husband and I would like to retire from U.S.A. to Mexico, perhaps Chapala area in the next year or two. We are concerned about health care after the move since we both have health conditions that I believe would make us ineligible for health insurance coverage there. We won't be eligible for Medicare for a few years. Has anyone had experience trying to bridge that gap with pre-existing conditions?


I am a Mexican woman living in the States, and my husband and I have been planning to retire to mexico. It is my understanding that once you get your FM2 or FM3 residency card in Mexico, you can apply to the government Instituto Mexicano de Seguro Social (IMSS) for medical insurance. It is not the best system, but it is great for emergencies and for hospitalizations and stuff that you don't want to spend lots of money (hospital, doctors and meds are free of charge). The cost is around $350.00 per year (not a typo), and it's the system most of the Mexican population uses for their health benefits. 

I know many people touts the private medical insurance, but I believe that if your income is very limited, you can get by with this insurance, and paying out of pocket if you have the money to pay for a private doctor for things that you can afford. 

Once you qualify for medicare, you can just travel to the States to check on major issues that the governments insurance doesn't cover. 

I think it pays to get a Social Security Card (for health insurance) from the government plan, its a good way to avoid catastrofic expenses in case of an accident, a stroke or heart attack. On another note, most of my relatives in Mexico uses this system, and it's not that bad, and in some locations, the service is pretty good. 

I hope this helps.

Good luck.


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## gudgrief

robeal said:


> It is my understanding that once you get your FM2 or FM3 residency card in Mexico, you can apply to the government Instituto Mexicano de Seguro Social (IMSS) for medical insurance. It is not the best system, but it is great for emergencies and for hospitalizations and stuff that you don't want to spend lots of money (hospital, doctors and meds are free of charge). The cost is around $350.00 per year (not a typo), and it's the system most of the Mexican population uses for their health benefits.
> 
> I know many people touts the private medical insurance, but I believe that if your income is very limited, you can get by with this insurance, and paying out of pocket if you have the money to pay for a private doctor for things that you can afford.
> 
> Once you qualify for medicare, you can just travel to the States to check on major issues that the governments insurance doesn't cover.
> 
> Good luck.


This is pretty much true, but there a couple considerations.

Technically, you are eligible for Medicare only if you are a US resident. Many people, like me, maintain a home in the US and go to the US for care when it makes sense. With the INAPAM card, you get a 50% discount on bus fares. My round trip costs about $50 and takes about 10 hours from Zacatecas to Reynosa/McAllen. I take a night bus that gets me to McAllen by 9AM.

IMSS and the Seguro Popular which I talked about earlier have a reputation for not stocking a lot of medicines and running out of the medicines they do stock. You may have to buy some relatively expensesive medicines from local pharmacies. On the whole, prescription meds cost little more than the cost of US Medicare Part D. premium plus copay.

You mentioned that one of you may need an organ transplant. Who knows with Obamacare if us seniors will actually be eligible? They do organ transplants in the biggest regional hiospitals but I don't have an information as to outcomes.

The IMSS website is  Portal IMSS para tí

The Seguro Popular website is Comisión Nacional de Protección Social en Salud - Seguro Popular

Both have accurate information as far as it goes. Unfortunately, you won't know exactly what you can expect until you actually sign up and maybe not until you need a specific treatment and it's either given or denied.

IMSS has a long list of pre-existing conditions that are excluded, not just for a year or two, but forever.


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## cuylers5746

Hi GudGrief;

What is it about Zacatecas that you like living there? What made you decide to settle in there?

I say this I have never met an Expat that's from there. I know it's a favorite of a lot of Mexicanos and
we very much enjoyed visiting this very unusual city.


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## gudgrief

cuylers5746 said:


> Hi GudGrief;
> 
> What is it about Zacatecas that you like living there? What made you decide to settle in there?
> 
> I say this I have never met an Expat that's from there. I know it's a favorite of a lot of Mexicanos and
> we very much enjoyed visiting this very unusual city.


Yup, there are maybe 10 native English speaking expats in Zacatecas including 1 Brit.

I hate the heat and humidity. Temp rarely gets over 85 in summer and there's almost always a breeze that keeps you comfortable on the hottest days.

I don't like cold weather much, but a couple of space heaters do the job in winter.

Zacatecas' historic center is packed with cultural and historical points of interest and both the city and state offer cultural events throughout the year.

"Downtown" is small enough I can walk everywhere, even 4km to Walmart and Sam's.

Just walking the backstreets and schmoozing with the locals still gives me a kick. The place is small enough that people you do business know you and greet you on the street. I renewed my "FM3" last September. Two weeks later a beautiful young lady passes me on the street with a smiling "Adios." It took me about 10 steps to realize that it was the yung lady from INM who helped me with my "FM3" paperwork.

On the other hand, it's big enough, along with it siamese twin neighbor Guadalupe and the commercial and residential zone in between that it offers almost all the conveniences of a much larger city.

I don't own a car or need to. Because of the narrow winding streets, congestion at times rivals NYC ot LA. My house is about four blocks up the hill from "el Centro Historico. I walk down and usually take a taxi back for 20 to 25 pesos. A bus to anywhere I want to go in Zacatecas, Guadalupe or in between is 3 pesos. If I'm loaded down with purchases, I take a taxi back. The highest fare I ever paid was 60 pesos for a trip that was close to 5 miles by the one way routes the taxi had to take.

So, even though it's not perfect, it's a combination of weather, the people, architecture, history, culture, logistics and economics.

I have a lot of the photos and videos I've taken in Mexico, Zacatecas and other countries on my website, Barry Griefers Home Page. About half way down the homepage, there's a link to my Zacatecas Page. Check it out if you like.

I do have a pretty good command of Spanish so language rarely gets in the way. Several Mexican friends are bilingual to help me out if I get stuck and a surprising number of locals understand enough English to help me avoid making a complete fool of myself when my Spanish just won't do.


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## gudgrief

gudgrief said:


> a tourst card/visa is enough to qualifyQUOTE]
> 
> I just noticed the error. You must have permanent resident or longterm (yearly) visitor "visitante rentista" status. A Tourist Card is NOT enough for Seguro Popular. I don't know about IMSS.
> 
> One more additional note. If you qualify for IMSS, e.g., worked in Mexico long enough to have retirement benefits, you technically can't sign up for Seguro Popular.


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## PVMikey

My spouse and I are retired and have lived in Mexico (Puerto Vallarta) for two years now. We both have excellent US health insurance (Blue Cross) that we were fortunately able to carry into our retirement. Our insurance "works" anywhere in the world, so we are fortunate in that respect also. That being said, even though medical care here in Puerto Vallarta is very good, due primarily to its proximity to Guadalajara, it does not, in our experience, compare to the quality of medical care that was available to us when we lived in the United States (Southern California). We both have chronic medical issues, and my spouse is several years post-bypass. He returns regularly to Southern California for checkups by his Cardiologist there and to obtain supplies of his heart-related meds, once of which is not even available here in Mexico at this time. Although we enjoy very much living here, after having experienced the quality of medical care available here for two years now, we are under no illusion that it compares to the medical care available to us in California.


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## Merida Yucatan

The web site of the government of Mexico health insurance discusses the various chronic issues that either disqualify a person from joining, or cause them to have a waiting period before they can receive government treatment for that particular chronic health issue. 

The government health program is extremely cost effective, though the service isn´t always as convenient to use as private doctors. 

Private GPs here in Merida charge about 300 pesos for a consultation, specialists about 500. Some pharmacies offer free or very low cost medical consultations for the public.


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## gudgrief

PVMikey said:


> My spouse and I are retired and have lived in Mexico (Puerto Vallarta) for two years now. We both have excellent US health insurance (Blue Cross) that we were fortunately able to carry into our retirement. Our insurance "works" anywhere in the world, so we are fortunate in that respect also. That being said, even though medical care here in Puerto Vallarta is very good, due primarily to its proximity to Guadalajara, it does not, in our experience, compare to the quality of medical care that was available to us when we lived in the United States (Southern California). We both have chronic medical issues, and my spouse is several years post-bypass. He returns regularly to Southern California for checkups by his Cardiologist there and to obtain supplies of his heart-related meds, once of which is not even available here in Mexico at this time. Although we enjoy very much living here, after having experienced the quality of medical care available here for two years now, we are under no illusion that it compares to the medical care available to us in California.


Multaq is the only post bypass med I couldn't get here.
Pradaxa wasn't available in the 150mg dose 18 months ago, it is now and based on my US cardiologist's opinion and exam results, it's as effective as the US brand. I only see him 2 times a year now and my insurance will only let me get 2 months at a time. I'm better off buying it here.

Just in case either one was what you were referring to.


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## gudgrief

Merida Yucatan said:


> The web site of the government of Mexico health insurance discusses the various chronic issues that either disqualify a person from joining, or cause them to have a waiting period before they can receive government treatment for that particular chronic health issue.
> 
> The government health program is extremely cost effective, though the service isn´t always as convenient to use as private doctors.
> 
> Private GPs here in Merida charge about 300 pesos for a consultation, specialists about 500. Some pharmacies offer free or very low cost medical consultations for the public.


Merida is a very beautiful city and I enjoyed my visit there a couple of years ago.

People are going to have different needs and different solutions.
Here in Zacatecas. GP's get between 300 and 450, specialists 650 and up.
The docs at the pharmacies like Farmacias Similares seem to be OK for non-critical issues and services like taking blood pressure and glucose if you only have to do it once a week or so. 30 pesos isn't much for a consultation. Even if they see 30 patients a day and don't have to pay rent, that's only 18,000 a month. Not bad as salaries go, but still quite low for MD's.

Interestingly, Farmacias Similares offers lab tests in Zacatecas. You have to go to a special branch. Turnaround time is afternoon of the next day. They do all the blood tests, urine and some others. They throw in an EKG in the package.

My US internist asked me to have the labs done in Mexico and bring the results with me, saving him and me a followup call or visit, i.e., another roundtrip. Farmacias Similares saved me about 30% over what other local labs and hospitals charged. I have Seguro Popular now at no cost and all needed labs are included.


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## AlanMexicali

gudgrief said:


> Merida is a very beautiful city and I enjoyed my visit there a couple of years ago.
> 
> People are going to have different needs and different solutions.
> Here in Zacatecas. GP's get between 300 and 450, specialists 650 and up.
> The docs at the pharmacies like Farmacias Similares seem to be OK for non-critical issues and services like taking blood pressure and glucose if you only have to do it once a week or so. 30 pesos isn't much for a consultation. Even if they see 30 patients a day and don't have to pay rent, that's only 18,000 a month. Not bad as salaries go, but still quite low for MD's.
> 
> Interestingly, Farmacias Similares offers lab tests in Zacatecas. You have to go to a special branch. Turnaround time is afternoon of the next day. They do all the blood tests, urine and some others. They throw in an EKG in the package.
> 
> My US internist asked me to have the labs done in Mexico and bring the results with me, saving him and me a followup call or visit, i.e., another roundtrip. Farmacias Similares saved me about 30% over what other local labs and hospitals charged. I have Seguro Popular now at no cost and all needed labs are included.


The Dr.s at Similares etc. get a commision on their filled perscriptions I was told many years ago by a pharmacy tech. friend of mine in TJ and so do the pharmacy techs. That is their main salary so watch out for them trying to sell you bogus stuff you don´t need and especially at Similares in their "natural remedies" selection which usually doesn´t work. IMO


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## gudgrief

AlanMexicali said:


> The Dr.s at Similares etc. get a commision on their filled perscriptions I was told many years ago by a pharmacy tech. friend of mine in TJ and so do the pharmacy techs. That is their main salary so watch out for them trying to sell you bogus stuff you don´t need and especially at Similares in their "natural remedies" selection which usually doesn´t work. IMO


"Natural Remedies" are all over the place. Street vendors, vendors who accost you in reataurants and cafes, restaurants and cafes that sell them and stores dedicated to them, even most legitimate pharmacies. The greatest concentration in Zacatecas is in and around the public market.

Natural doesn't mean safe or effective, it just means natural.

The one natural product that does work for me is glucosamine-chondroitin. It doesn't work for eceryone, but it does seem safe. I get it in the US when Walgreens or CVS has a two for one sale which may be a thing of the past, now it's only half off the second one. It's godawful expensive at GNC here which is the only place I've seen it here in Zacatecas.


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## AlanMexicali

gudgrief said:


> "Natural Remedies" are all over the place. Street vendors, vendors who accost you in reataurants and cafes, restaurants and cafes that sell them and stores dedicated to them, even most legitimate pharmacies. The greatest concentration in Zacatecas is in and around the public market.
> 
> Natural doesn't mean safe or effective, it just means natural.
> 
> The one natural product that does work for me is glucosamine-chondroitin. It doesn't work for eceryone, but it does seem safe. I get it in the US when Walgreens or CVS has a two for one sale which may be a thing of the past, now it's only half off the second one. It's godawful expensive at GNC here which is the only place I've seen it here in Zacatecas.


I know exactly what you mean. The same here. My stroke victim mother in law was taking Omega 3 and when my wife had her at the Dr´s one day mentioned this. She takes colesterol meds. blood thinners , diabetes meds. etc. He said no wonder her blood tests/glucose/blood pressure show some of her meds needing dosage adjustment so often. DON¨T give her anymore Omega 3 and the other Herbalife crap anymore PLEASE! After that he had to readjust everything so they started working better and this took a couple of weeks and a few more blood panels and tests.


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## mickisue1

AlanMexicali said:


> I know exactly what you mean. The same here. My stroke victim mother in law was taking Omega 3 and when my wife had her at the Dr´s one day mentioned this. She takes colesterol meds. blood thinners , diabetes meds. etc. He said no wonder her blood tests/glucose/blood pressure show some of her meds needing dosage adjustment so often. DON¨T give her anymore Omega 3 and the other Herbalife crap anymore PLEASE! After that he had to readjust everything so they started working better and this took a couple of weeks and a few more blood panels and tests.


Most of the docs that are actually familiar with omega 3s like them, because they're a heck of a lot safer than prescription blood thinners, and also function as anti-inflammatories.

That said, if I have a customer who's going to be going into surgery in the near future, I recommend that they stop taking the Herbalifeline (our omega 3 product) for a couple weeks before, and ask their doctor when to restart after. The idea is not for doctors and those who offer nutritional supplements to be at odds, but for both sides to be better informed about the uses and side effects that can result.

IME, I usually know a lot more about side effects of RXs than the docs who prescribe them, and they know little or nothing about nutrition in general, much less ANY of the more cutting edge research.


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## AlanMexicali

mickisue1 said:


> Most of the docs that are actually familiar with omega 3s like them, because they're a heck of a lot safer than prescription blood thinners, and also function as anti-inflammatories.
> 
> That said, if I have a customer who's going to be going into surgery in the near future, I recommend that they stop taking the Herbalifeline (our omega 3 product) for a couple weeks before, and ask their doctor when to restart after. The idea is not for doctors and those who offer nutritional supplements to be at odds, but for both sides to be better informed about the uses and side effects that can result.
> 
> IME, I usually know a lot more about side effects of RXs than the docs who prescribe them, and they know little or nothing about nutrition in general, much less ANY of the more cutting edge research.


Yes, I read up on Omega 3 but in her case with very high cholesterol, high blood pressure, and diabetes the Omega 3 was interfering with not only the blood thinner but her diabetes meds as well. It was causing it to dilute and fluxuate in strenght according to her Dr. I forgot what daily Herbalife supplement she was on, but did see the bottle there recently and will write down the name. I bet it is for high cholesterol though.

She, last Feb., had vascular surgery to remove a 90% plague cloat from her cardioid artery in her neck a year after her major stroke. She is an invalid, right side paralized and cannot talk, except the odd word.


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## BryansRose

I haven't read through all the pages here, so maybe this has been mentioned already. Have you looked into the government-run health care, IMSS for short? Seguro Social. I have had chronic health problems for over 20 years, and no insurer in the US would touch me. My research told me that IMSS would not cover pre-existing conditions, but I wanted it for accidents, emergencies, and the "big stuff" as you call it. The premium age 60-65 is about $280-$300 per year. 

From day one, I had a monthly appt. and my assigned clinic and got all my meds for free at the IMSS pharmacy. I made no secret of the pre-existing conditions, but the dr. gave me all the drugs anyway. I figure I'm saving between $300-500 a month with that alone. Twice this past fall, I had to go to "Urgencias" and was kept overnight. Numerous tests, a CAT scan, an ultrasound, and all cost me nothing. Spartan conditions, but clean and the attention from drs. and nurses was better than in the US.

I also have seen private specialists. Often they charge 600 pesos the first visit, then 300 pesos after. It all depends on the Dr. I guess. Any prescriptions from them I take to my IMMS appt. and if available through IMSS, the dr. adds it to my growing list of meds. 

I'm on a limited budget, and I've found that this combo of IMMS and private when necessary works well. 

Also, may I suggest San Luis Potosi as a place to settle? We're 7000 ft. altitude, and no need for a/c. Even in the hottest few weeks, ceiling fans and a large floor fan have worked well for me. Also, we have a Medical School at the University here, and medical care in SLP in reputed to be excellent. 

So, my 2 cents.  Good luck!


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## beckster

Looking at the links posted by some of you, it appears both of us would be disqualified completely from the IMSS insurance. I am not sure about the other government health care that has been mentioned. Obamacare is supposed to make insurance available to U.S. folks with pre-existing conditions in 2014, though it is not clear what they will actually cover with those policies or what that will cost the consumer. Some states currently have insurance for people with pre-existing conditions. Our state is one that does have have such a program. You must be without any type of coverage for 6 months before you can apply. You must reside in the U.S. Cost for a couple our age is about $800/mo. Deductible is 2k per person per year and the patient is responsible for coinsurance of 30%. Generic medications available by mail-order. I suspect the 2014 Obamacare policies may look something like that but don't really know. This seems pretty expensive, especially if it causes you to keep a U.S. residence to qualify, however Medicare would/will also require a U.S. home. I don't see how we could maintain two residences. 


I wish we could keep our insurance through my employer even if we paid the employer's portion as well, but that's not in the cards.


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## mickisue1

AlanMexicali said:


> Yes, I read up on Omega 3 but in her case with very high cholesterol, high blood pressure, and diabetes the Omega 3 was interfering with not only the blood thinner but her diabetes meds as well. It was causing it to dilute and fluxuate in strenght according to her Dr. I forgot what daily Herbalife supplement she was on, but did see the bottle there recently and will write down the name. I bet it is for high cholesterol though.
> 
> She, last Feb., had vascular surgery to remove a 90% plague cloat from her cardioid artery in her neck a year after her major stroke. She is an invalid, right side paralized and cannot talk, except the odd word.


Is she using Core Complex? It has been clinically proven to be of use with cholesterol--contains plant sterols. The biggest problem with cholesterol lowering drugs, aside from the frequent side effect of muscle pain and weakness, is that, over time, it destroys the liver.

But for your MIL, with her complex issues, she may not be using them long enough for that to happen, sadly.

If she were my mom, and she's not, I would ask the doctor to do what could be done that gives her the best quality of life, not necessarily the longest, but feeling miserable. I'm sorry to hear that she's doing so poorly.


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## BryansRose

Beckster, you wouldn't be disqualified from IMSS. They just may not cover certain conditions (although they have for me). And it would be there for anything new, and for hospital stays, or emergencies. etc. And remember, anything from the US (like ObamaCare, Medicare, COBRA, other private or state insurance) doesn't cover anything outside the US, so it would be useless here in Mexico. You would have to travel back to the US for all your medical care. 

Keep in mind that here, you can purchase almost any "prescription" drugs at any pharmacy without prescription. They are not particularly cheap compared to the US, but you would not have to see a doctor just to get refills on on-going prescriptions. You have to use common sense, though, about when to see a doctor, and when not. Antibiotics and things like sleeping pills, you need a dr's prescription for.


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## AlanMexicali

BryansRose said:


> Beckster, you wouldn't be disqualified from IMSS. They just may not cover certain conditions (although they have for me). And it would be there for anything new, and for hospital stays, or emergencies. etc. And remember, anything from the US (like ObamaCare, Medicare, COBRA, other private or state insurance) doesn't cover anything outside the US, so it would be useless here in Mexico. You would have to travel back to the US for all your medical care.
> 
> Keep in mind that here, you can purchase almost any "prescription" drugs at any pharmacy without prescription. They are not particularly cheap compared to the US, but you would not have to see a doctor just to get refills on on-going prescriptions. You have to use common sense, though, about when to see a doctor, and when not. Antibiotics and things like sleeping pills, you need a dr's prescription for.


I have to go to my ISSSTE clinic every 30 days and so does my wife to get a 30 day supply of meds and have a fast checkup. It costs nothing, but 2 years ago it was normal for the Dra. to give 60 day prescriptions. I wonder if they are now doing that at the IMSS? It takes about a month to get in to see a specialist for us here at the ISSSTE. Before it could be a bit longer, depending on what area of expertise. 

My friends in Canada say it is similar up there for appointments for a specialists and sometimes a minor surgery can take up to a year. 

My friend´s brother in law needs heart surgery and goes to the Seguro Popular here in SLP and has been bumped twice the day before going in and it has been 4 months since his heart attack and the first scheduled time was a few days before Christmas. He is due to go in again next week.


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## TundraGreen

AlanMexicali said:


> I have to go to my ISSSTE clinic every 30 days and so does my wife to get a 30 day supply of meds and have a fast checkup. It costs nothing, but 2 years ago it was normal for the Dra. to give 60 day prescriptions. I wonder if they are now doing that at the IMSS? It takes about a month to get in to see a specialist for us here at the ISSSTE. Before it could be a bit longer, depending on what area of expertise.
> 
> My friends in Canada say it is similar up there for appointments for a specialists and sometimes a minor surgery can take up to a year.
> 
> My friend´s brother in law needs heart surgery and goes to the Seguro Popular here in SLP and has been bumped twice the day before going in and it has been 4 months since his heart attack and the first scheduled time was a few days before Christmas. He is due to go in again next week.


I am having similar experiences with IMSS. They prescribed some vitamins for me and the pharmacy was out. They tell me to try again next week. I am trying to get an appointment with a specialist to look at a shoulder that is bothering me. They said the first opening is June or July, but I can go back next week and see if there is an opening sooner.


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## AlanMexicali

TundraGreen said:


> I am having similar experiences with IMSS. They prescribed some vitamins for me and the pharmacy was out. They tell me to try again next week. I am trying to get an appointment with a specialist to look at a shoulder that is bothering me. They said the first opening is June or July, but I can go back next week and see if there is an opening sooner.


Wow. I have an appointment with a ORTHOPEDIC because my shoulder is bothering me for 7 or 8 weeks now. It is 1 month waiting time, not 5 months. I got the "solicitud" last week, lazy to pick it up sooner, for the 22nd of this month after my Dra. put in the request 15 days ago. I changed it yesterday to Feb. 5th because we will be in SD/Mexicali for 2 weeks and return on the 3rd. Not too bad service.


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## AlexPerrault

Hey!!! usually the health insurance here is private, so just take a look at GNP insurance policies!


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## mickisue1

AlexPerrault said:


> Hey!!! usually the health insurance here is private, so just take a look at GNP insurance policies!


Usually private for whom? Most Mexicans are covered under one or the other of the government plans--and a good number of expats, as well.


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## TundraGreen

AlexPerrault said:


> Hey!!! usually the health insurance here is private, so just take a look at GNP insurance policies!


You aren't by any chance an agent for GNP are you?


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## arturo_b

gudgrief said:


> You must have permanent resident or longterm (yearly) visitor "visitante rentista" status. A Tourist Card is NOT enough for Seguro Popular. I don't know about IMSS. * * * If you qualify for IMSS, e.g., worked in Mexico long enough to have retirement benefits, you technically can't sign up for Seguro Popular.


IMSS was intended to cover privately employed Mexican citizens and their immediate families. In other words, a general national-health service. According to what a number of ****** retirees along the Baja Gold Coast have told me, IMSS also allows them coverage so long as they pay their premiums. I believe they also have to comply with immigration laws with some sort of residency visa.

Seguro Popular is (among other things) an attempt to cover people who live in Mexico who for some reason or other don't qualify for IMSS. The word "popular", in Mexico, means "poor people". The greatest number of people in SP come from private-sector employers who aren't large enough to fall under IMSS. Also widows and orphans and the ever-popular single mothers. Consider this to be coverage of last resort, especially if you're not even Mexican.



AlanMexicali said:


> The Dr.s at Similares etc. get a commision on their filled perscriptions I was told many years ago by a pharmacy tech. friend of mine in TJ and so do the pharmacy techs. That is their main salary so watch out for them trying to sell you bogus stuff you don´t need and especially at Similares in their "natural remedies" selection which usually doesn´t work. IMO


Yes, the doctors in the Farmacias Similares get commissions on their prescriptions so long as those prescriptions are filled at their particular pharmacy. (For that matter, some Farmacias Similares doctors own the pharmacy they work at.) Commission is also paid to the white-coated attendants at the pharmacy. As well as at pretty much at every other pharmacy you might walk into, so it's not fair to single out Farmacias Similares.

It all comes down to finding people you can trust. When a doctor at a Farmacias Similares gives you a prescription for something his pharmacy can't fill, you know you have an honest doctor.

Other pharmacies are now following the FS model in offering doctors on site. In a way, this brings us back full circle to the medieval apothecary shop. 

As to the natural remedies, which don't really deserve quotation marks, again FS is not alone in promoting them. The best doctors in Tijuana prescribe gordolobo for coughs and gingerroot for bronchial infection. Not everyone is in the pay of Big Pharma yet.


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## arturo_b

TundraGreen said:


> You aren't by any chance an agent for GNP are you?


That does look suspicious, doesn't it?

Here in Tijuana, GNP has made itself very evident by its aggressive marketing. They have an agency in the ground floor of Hospital Ángeles, the most expensive hospital in town. Nice people, but...

We also have SIMNSA, which seems to be positioning itself to attract Obamacare refugees living north of our border.

And there are also a number of other groups that look like insurance but are really discount clubs. For doctors used to capitation payments, these groups are no different than traditional insurance. But for patients, it's all pay-as-you-go albeit that you're now paying close to the rates that insurance companies are used to paying.


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## BryansRose

AlanMexicali said:


> I have to go to my ISSSTE clinic every 30 days and so does my wife to get a 30 day supply of meds and have a fast checkup. It costs nothing, but 2 years ago it was normal for the Dra. to give 60 day prescriptions. I wonder if they are now doing that at the IMSS? It takes about a month to get in to see a specialist for us here at the ISSSTE. Before it could be a bit longer, depending on what area of expertise.
> 
> My friends in Canada say it is similar up there for appointments for a specialists and sometimes a minor surgery can take up to a year.
> 
> My friend´s brother in law needs heart surgery and goes to the Seguro Popular here in SLP and has been bumped twice the day before going in and it has been 4 months since his heart attack and the first scheduled time was a few days before Christmas. He is due to go in again next week.


IMSS (Seguro Popular) only does 30 day prescriptions, but my appts. are only every 2 months. So after 30 days, I have to go at 8 a.m. and they will give me another 30 days of meds. It's a wait, both for the new prescriptions and then in the line at the farmacia. Usually it's a 3-hour projeect from the time I leave my home till the time I return. 

I've been referred to two different specialists in the system. I got first appts. for both that was only a wait of 3-4 weeks. Then, and this was in October, they would not give me another appt. They said to come back at the end of Dec. since they weren't making any more appts, until then. And the tests that were ordered can't be done -- they won't make a test appt. until you have the dr's appt. 

So it's obviously not a perfect system. It was better until a few months ago when the govt. created the "Seguro Popular" where people who could not afford the yearly premium were allowed into the system. So they took in tens of thousands of new patients without any increase in staffing. So the once-a-month appts because once every two months, and waits for tests and specialists, and I suppose surgeries too became much longer. It's a good idea for those people to have medical care, but they need to fund it and increase staffing and facilities. *sigh*

But both times I've been in Urgencias, there has been no waiting and tests done immediately. It was overcrowded, but there were plenty of staff and care was excellent. 

The ISSTE is a little different. It's my understanding that it's for govt. employees. I have a friend who is in it because her husband had a govt. job. 

I hope your friend's relative gets his surgery soon.


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## Gatita

beckster said:


> My husband and I would like to retire from U.S.A. to Mexico, perhaps Chapala area in the next year or two. We are concerned about health care after the move since we both have health conditions that I believe would make us ineligible for health insurance coverage there. We won't be eligible for Medicare for a few years. Has anyone had experience trying to bridge that gap with pre-existing conditions?


I live in Chapala and came here before Medicare. The weather is great. Medical and dental care is pretty good. There are several insurance policies offered with a 2 yr. pre-existing wait I think. I do remember that one was $94USD mo. I was going to attach specifics of one but can't find it. Two others are [email protected] or   Alcoholics Anonymous Lake Chapala - Home. These are major med because day to day is pretty cheap. I pay $340 yr. for unlimited visits, 2 home visits, 1 dental check, etc. for that. I do have to pay for incidentals, labs, xrays, etc. Some people get medicare for major medical or couple the policies here which often have medievac to US with medicare. Hope that helps. Hey, you could buy my house. I want to move to the beach. It is imposibly hot and humid but I want to see the sea.


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## Gatita

oops, looking at the wrong part of the ad. Second insurance is [email protected].


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## GARYJ65

*Suggestion*

You may also consider Queretaro, It has very very nice waether, Hospitals, well communicated, and it´s the second safest city in Mexico, Yucatan is the 1st one,

If you need any information, I´ve been living here for the last 15 yrs



beckster said:


> Thanks to all for your input and insights. My husband has not been able to work for a couple of years, but has not qualified for SS disability/Medicare. I am still employed part-time in U.S. and we are both insured through my employer, but that would disappear if i resigned (except for potential for 18 months expensive COBRA coverage).
> 
> We both have conditions which are progressive and incurable and would ultimately probably require a return to the U.S. for management of complications. I may require an organ transplant in the future. I am not sure that is a realistic possibility in a developing country with no health insurance, but would be covered by Medicare in U.S. (assuming I am eligible for the coverage AND the treatment at the time). But for now, both of our conditions are 'managed' and we could have a reasonable quality of everyday life for quite a long while before needing huge outlays if all goes well. But I guess you just never know what tomorrow will bring...hard to plan for every possibility!
> 
> Our U.S. out-of-pocket health care costs the past couple of years have been around $7k/year WITH health insurance. We could self-insure for the basic ongoing care in Mexico, but having no coverage for the BIG stuff is scary. We are both at risk for cardiovascular emergencies, which worries my husband when we consider living in Mexico.
> 
> I don't discount cuylers' comments about alternative treatments, or the potential positive health effects of decreased stress and more relaxed lifestyle if I could retire early (an impossible luxury for us living in the U.S.)
> 
> My mother retired at 55 to a small rural (read: affordable) U.S. community and had several years of relaxed lifestyle enjoying her hobbies after having worked hard all her life. She sacrificed coverage for routine medical care because it just didn't fit the retirement budget. After several years of apparent good health, she had a sudden cardiac event at an early age and died before the nearest emergency services (30 minutes away) could respond. Should she have deferred retirement to stay in the big city and continue working to provide health insurance for annual physicals that MIGHT have identified her emerging cardiac problem and allowed life-sparing treatment? Should she have kept working so she could afford to live closer to emergency services if they were needed? Or should we be thankful that she took the leap, retired early and allowed herself a few years of rest and relaxation before the end? I guess it's really a matter of perspective. Survival of a heart attack outside a U.S. hospital is only about 7 1/2 % on average - worse with a slow EMS system (New York < 2% survival) and better with excellent EMS (Seattle ~ 30%). If you can manage to be IN the hospital when it happens, lucky you! good care and health insurance could make all the difference.
> 
> We are looking into making an investigative trip to Guadalajara and the surrounding area. My husband's condition makes him very heat intolerant, so I think we need to check it out at the hottest season. I'm thinking May? We have had to crank our ac down the past two years for him (another big expense here!) or he gets nauseated. I suspect we would need some AC even in Chapala - is it even available in hotels, etc? Are there cities very temperate but still a bit cooler than Chapala area?
> 
> Thanks again for all the input!


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## Isla Verde

GARYJ65 said:


> You may also consider Queretaro, It has very very nice waether, Hospitals, well communicated, and it´s the second safest city in Mexico, Yucatan is the 1st one,


A slight correction: Yucatan is a peninsula and a state but not a city.


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## GARYJ65

*You are right!*

It is my undestanding that Mérida, in the state of Yucatán is the safest city in Mexico.
Queretaro is very safe and nice State and City

Regards


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## BryansRose

I think the ISSTE is a bit more responsive than IMSS. I get 30 days of meds now, and see the Dr. every two months. After one month, I go just to get another month of meds. Between the bus ride there and back, and the waiting, it's about a 3-hour ordeal. But it's worth it, since I have a lot of medications. 
Last fall, I'd seen a couple specialists at IMSS after a stay in Urgencias, and they both said to make another appt, but when I tried to, I was told that they weren't even making any appts. till the end of Dec. and to come back then. In the meantime, I saw a private dr, and things got better, so I skipped the new appts. with the specialists. 
As far as Urgencias, though, I was there twice last fall, and both times there was virtually no wait, since I was so sick, and the care and attention was excellent. Better nursing care than in the US, imo.


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## Isla Verde

BryansRose said:


> I think the ISSTE is a bit more responsive than IMSS.


I'm sure that's true since ISSTE is a plan for only those who work for the government. It's much better funded than IMSS, which has to cover anyone who has a "real" job plus us expats who pay a small annual fee.


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## circle110

Unfortunately, most of us aren't eligible for ISSTE and have to seek other options for health care.

My wife's mother and sister both work for the government so they get to use ISSTE but, sadly, we can't find a way to get into the system since my wife's coverage under her mother's plan ended when she reached a certain age. Oh well.


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## AlanMexicali

BryansRose said:


> I think the ISSTE is a bit more responsive than IMSS. I get 30 days of meds now, and see the Dr. every two months. After one month, I go just to get another month of meds. Between the bus ride there and back, and the waiting, it's about a 3-hour ordeal. But it's worth it, since I have a lot of medications.
> Last fall, I'd seen a couple specialists at IMSS after a stay in Urgencias, and they both said to make another appt, but when I tried to, I was told that they weren't even making any appts. till the end of Dec. and to come back then. In the meantime, I saw a private dr, and things got better, so I skipped the new appts. with the specialists.
> As far as Urgencias, though, I was there twice last fall, and both times there was virtually no wait, since I was so sick, and the care and attention was excellent. Better nursing care than in the US, imo.


I have ISSSTE here in San Luis Potosi and get an appointment by phone once a month to see the Dra. and a renewal of 2 perscritions and the few times I went to a specialist the appointments took exactly 1 month. My daily meds would cost cash about $1500.00 pesos per month, I think. Before a couple years ago they gave out 2 months supply of meds, but not now.

I never wait more than 30 minutes to see the Dra. but found out to come early or the person behind you will get in first if they call names on the list and you are not there yet. Also if my wife preceeds me I have ISSSTE for life. The care is very good and thorough. IMO. Alan


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## Longford

circle110 said:


> Unfortunately, most of us aren't eligible for ISSTE and have to seek other options for health care.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but my impression has been that to qualify for ISSTE one has to have been a government employee, or somehow grandfathered in as a relative of a government employee and that it's not a program expats who don't qualify under those terms are intended to be afforded the benefits. Though, I have purchased medications and food supplies at ISSTE stores in Mexico City without question.


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## AlanMexicali

Isla Verde said:


> I'm sure that's true since ISSTE is a plan for only those who work for the government. It's much better funded than IMSS, which has to cover anyone who has a "real" job plus us expats who pay a small annual fee.


"real" job  ... you forgot the smiley face. 

Not "all" gov´t. employess are killing the day here, only some.


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## AlanMexicali

Longford said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong, but my impression has been that to qualify for ISSTE one has to have been a government employee, or somehow grandfathered in as a relative of a government employee and that it's not a program expats who don't qualify under those terms are intended to be afforded the benefits. Though, I have purchased medications and food supplies at ISSTE stores in Mexico City without question.


Correct and correct. The ISSSTE store in Cancun was much cheaper than the small supermarkets in the tourist zone in el centro, comida chatarras I meant.  :confused2:


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## circle110

Longford said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong, but my impression has been that to qualify for ISSTE one has to have been a government employee, or somehow grandfathered in as a relative of a government employee and that it's not a program expats who don't qualify under those terms are intended to be afforded the benefits. Though, I have purchased medications and food supplies at ISSTE stores in Mexico City without question.


Yes, that is exactly what I was saying - most of us don't qualify due to it being a program for govt. employees, but some expats who are married to govt. employees do qualify (like AlanMexicali and BryansRose in this forum). In my case I am one familial relation too far removed to qualify.


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## TundraGreen

AlanMexicali said:


> Correct and correct. The ISSSTE store in Cancun was much cheaper than the small supermarkets in the tourist zone in el centro, comida chatarras I meant.  :confused2:


The ISSSTE stores are open to the public. At one time they were restricted to members of ISSSTE, but no longer. The ISSSTE medical system is restricted.


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## Isla Verde

AlanMexicali said:


> "real" job  ... you forgot the smiley face.
> 
> Not "all" gov´t. employess are killing the day here, only some.


I wasn't referring to government employees when I wrote "real" job. I meant those with formal job contracts rather than those many, many Mexican who work under the table and whose jobs are not registered with the government. They don't receive any benefits including IMSS health coverage.


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## AlanMexicali

TundraGreen said:


> The ISSSTE stores are open to the public. At one time they were restricted to members of ISSSTE, but no longer. The ISSSTE medical system is restricted.


The ISSSTE stores never asks me for my ISSSTE card so yes they sell to anyone in that case. They were not open to the public at one time I was told but seems long ago. Their prices are good on some items and regualr priced on others. They seem to have a huge selection of junk food for some reason, cookies, chips, and candy. The large one block ISSSTE complex I go to has a clinic, a store with a farmacia, besides the farmacia inside the clinic where you get the Dr´s perscriptions and a 4 story large apartment building, I´m guessing for disabled employees of the gov´t. which is old but well kept up. It is in a good colonia with mostly very large older houses around there. They also have IMSS stores for IMSS employees in some places. Alan


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