# HELP! - Dealing with Problem Neighbors



## Hesse2323 (May 28, 2019)

Hi everyone,

I moved to Spain with my Spanish spouse two years ago now. We live in a sixth floor flat underneath a family who routinely throw things off of their terrace and onto ours... When I say things, I mean outright filth, everything from the dust off of dirty carpets to pieces of food, the hair plucked out of hairbrushes, chicken bones, toenail clippings, to now, since yesterday, a whole flood of beer that I suspect might have been vomit. I have complained to them in person several times over the past year, but they deny everything, despite my having caught them in the act several times. I've just about reached the end of my rope, and I wonder if anyone on here might have dealt with a similar problem or know where I should turn for help. My spouse claims that the local police will, "laugh in my face" if I try to complain to them. Am I doomed to mop up after these people until we move house or they do? Should I go straight to a lawyer?

Cheers,
Hesse


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Have you complained to the community president?


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## Hesse2323 (May 28, 2019)

Thanks for replying!

Yes, I sent her a letter as my conversational Spanish skills are still a bit lacking. She ignored it.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

I would start by making documentary evidence of what is happening. A diary of events with photos and descriptions of the happenings.

Then, after a while, send the records of one month, for example, in a letter requesting that they stop causing you this nuisance. Send the letter by Burofax, (with certification of the content) and copy the community president and administrators.

Do this for as long as it takes for them to realise that you are building up evidence for a legal case against them.

It make work if they think you're being serious.

On the other hand, they may not give two hoots and carry on regardless, but at least you will then be able to choose to report them and will have a dossier of evidence.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Overandout said:


> I would start by making documentary evidence of what is happening. A diary of events with photos and descriptions of the happenings.
> 
> Then, after a while, send the records of one month, for example, in a letter requesting that they stop causing you this nuisance. Send the letter by Burofax, (with certification of the content) and copy the community president and administrators.
> 
> ...


 But you'll have to be able to prove that it came from them which I think is difficult to do by photos...
Maybe post photos ad nauseam in the entrance to your flats with a note along the lines of "This is what I found on my balcony (third floor flat 3) this week. Isn't it disgusting?"


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## Hesse2323 (May 28, 2019)

Thank you, yes, I should start collecting hard evidence instead of my usual reaction, which is to shriek in disgust and get out the cleaning supplies!

Perhaps the appearance of building a legal case will be enough of a deterrent. I can only hope!


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## Hesse2323 (May 28, 2019)

Pesky Wesky said:


> But you'll have to be able to prove that it came from them which I think is difficult to do by photos...
> Maybe post photos ad nauseam in the entrance to your flats with a note along the lines of "This is what I found on my balcony (third floor flat 3) this week. Isn't it disgusting?"


Thank you! Yes, I'm afraid my upstairs neighbors may be relying on the fact that it is difficult to prove where all this filth is coming from. Tenants are not allowed to post notices in the public areas, but I suppose I can try sending photos on to the community president.


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## tarot650 (Sep 30, 2007)

Hesse2323 said:


> Thank you! Yes, I'm afraid my upstairs neighbors may be relying on the fact that it is difficult to prove where all this filth is coming from. Tenants are not allowed to post notices in the public areas, but I suppose I can try sending photos on to the community president.


Just a thought,first feel sorry for you as there is nothing worse than bad neighbours.Suggestion,have you thought about installing a very small CCTV on you balcony? as these now can be picked up for very little money.Just a thought. A greeting.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

tarot650 said:


> Just a thought,first feel sorry for you as there is nothing worse than bad neighbours.Suggestion,have you thought about installing a very small CCTV on you balcony? as these now can be picked up for very little money.Just a thought. A greeting.


Yes, but you cannot use CCTV footage taken without Data Protection compliance as evidence in any formal procedure. In fact, if the OP starts recording without complying with the law, it will be the OP who has a bigger problem than the neighbours upstairs....


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## tarot650 (Sep 30, 2007)

Overandout said:


> Yes, but you cannot use CCTV footage taken without Data Protection compliance as evidence in any formal procedure. In fact, if the OP starts recording without complying with the law, it will be the OP who has a bigger problem than the neighbours upstairs....


Well put a dummy one up.¨LOL.


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## Nomoss (Nov 25, 2016)

We had a similar problem with next door neighbours when we lived in Teheran.

They, well probably their maid, threw all sorts of rubbish, mainly from the kitchen, over the wall into our back yard.

After this happened several times, my wife collected it in a bucket for a few days, then rang on their doorbell.

She was let in through the front gate, and when she reached the house she emptied the bucket on their front terrace, saying "I think this is yours", then turned and walked away. We only spoke some basic Farsi, but she checked her pronunciation of the phrase was correct.

It never happened again.


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## Hesse2323 (May 28, 2019)

tarot650 said:


> Just a thought,first feel sorry for you as there is nothing worse than bad neighbours.Suggestion,have you thought about installing a very small CCTV on you balcony? as these now can be picked up for very little money.Just a thought. A greeting.


CCTV? Oh, now _there's_ a dastardly thought! I'm sure it would catch them in the act of shaking their rugs out over my terrace, at the very least, though I wonder if it would be able to pick up on all the icky details of human detritus (hair and nail clippings and such) that fall off those rugs. Definitely can't hurt to take a look. Thank you!


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## tarot650 (Sep 30, 2007)

Hesse2323 said:


> CCTV? Oh, now _there's_ a dastardly thought! I'm sure it would catch them in the act of shaking their rugs out over my terrace, at the very least, though I wonder if it would be able to pick up on all the icky details of human detritus (hair and nail clippings and such) that fall off those rugs. Definitely can't hurt to take a look. Thank you!


Like I said it was just a thought.Or even a dummy one where it can be seen.Don't know the ins and outs of them so it might be worth checking with the proper authorities although we do seem to have one expert on here.Mind you you will always get one!! Hope you get this sorted sooner than later as it must be an unpleasant experience.Best of luck.a greeting.


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## Hesse2323 (May 28, 2019)

Nomoss said:


> We had a similar problem with next door neighbours when we lived in Teheran.
> 
> They, well probably their maid, threw all sorts of rubbish, mainly from the kitchen, over the wall into our back yard.
> 
> ...


Sorry you went through that, but I'm glad you found the perfect way to reciprocate! I've tried pulling a similar move with my neighbors, but alas, they don't seem to have as much shame about it, they just deny deny deny...

I've noticed that shaking out rugs and cloths and sheets through windows is a pretty common practice here in Spain. My understanding is that it's illegal to do it but the rule is completely unenforced.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Hesse2323 said:


> Sorry you went through that, but I'm glad you found the perfect way to reciprocate! I've tried pulling a similar move with my neighbors, but alas, they don't seem to have as much shame about it, they just deny deny deny...
> 
> I've noticed that shaking out rugs and cloths and sheets through windows is a pretty common practice here in Spain. My understanding is that it's illegal to do it but the rule is completely unenforced.


I must admit, when I saw that as part of your complaint I did think that would be a bit difficult to do anything about as it is, as you say, the way it is done.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Yes, it's a delicate situation really.

I also live in a apartment, and our neighbours downstairs have complained at 3 pm on a Sunday afternoon because we have had children visiting who "step too hard" on the floor and that "people were moving chairs around".

Well yes, we had people around for lunch who have kids, we tend not to tie them to the chairs and make everyone sit still for the entire duration...

They then went on to complain that we apparently use the vacuum cleaner when we shouldn't too. According to them, we shouldn't vacuum at the weekend, we should do it during working hours in the week.... Yeah right, just when we are both working... 

Living in an apartment takes a degree of tolerance that is difficult to delimit. But on the other hand, we didn't deny the accusations, we just explained that this was normal life and that if they wanted silence, they should go to live in a chalet in the country, not live in a city centre apartment....

Not suggesting that the OP is being unreasonable, but what is a nuisance for some, is seen as inevitable consequences of life for others.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

tarot650 said:


> Like I said it was just a thought.Or even a dummy one where it can be seen.Don't know the ins and outs of them so it might be worth checking with the proper authorities although we do seem to have one expert on here.Mind you you will always get one!! .


I'm not so much of an expert in CCTV, just someone with some basic enough legal knowledge to know that what you suggest is illegal. 
Luckily there are some experts about many topics raised on here, I don't see that as a negative thing, whether people take the advice or not is up to them.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Overandout said:


> I'm not so much of an expert in CCTV, just someone with some basic enough legal knowledge to know that what you suggest is illegal.
> Luckily there are some experts about many topics raised on here, I don't see that as a negative thing, whether people take the advice or not is up to them.


 I'm no expert either, but you can't put CCTV just where you fancy. Also, anything that goes on the outside of the building has to be approved by the "comunidad", and I'm guessing that the neighbours won't be voting for that installment!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Pesky Wesky said:


> I'm no expert either, but you can't put CCTV just where you fancy. Also, anything that goes on the outside of the building has to be approved by the "comunidad", and I'm guessing that the neighbours won't be voting for that installment!


We’ve installed cctv at the kennels and this obviously means that our employees and volunteer kennel cleaners are filmed. 
I consulted my mate the local CCOO guy who advised me to state in writing that this was now happening and get everyone to sign that they had been so advised and were aware.

We caught them yesterday on camera closing up five minutes before official closing time.. Not a cause for concern for us.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

mrypg9 said:


> We’ve installed cctv at the kennels and this obviously means that our employees and volunteer kennel cleaners are filmed.
> I consulted my mate the local CCOO guy who advised me to state in writing that this was now happening and get everyone to sign that they had been so advised and were aware.
> 
> We caught them yesterday on camera closing up five minutes before official closing time.. Not a cause for concern for us.


Exactly, you can't put one up in order to spy on someone. You have to state that in this area you are going to be filmed. Even in the street by local authorities signs are put up. If it's not declared, evidence has no legal power as the person filming is also committing an illegal action, as has already been pointed out on this thread


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## Nomoss (Nov 25, 2016)

The obvious answer is to pay someone to sit on your balcony and watch.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Is your apartment rented? If so it would be quicker to move, also if you take further action the problems may escalate and the law works slowly.


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## Nomoss (Nov 25, 2016)

Or move into an apartment above them?


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## Brooksdoc (Aug 27, 2018)

I suggest you buy a mini camera with night vision, the cost is about 70 Euros on Amazon. Put it on your balcony and record their balcony as well. Then, show them the tape of garbage being thrown on your property.


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## Beach buddy (Jul 7, 2018)

I really feel for you. We have lived in our terraced house for 15 years and have lovely Spanish neighbours. Never had any problems, just give and take. But, cant imagine if it were any other way.


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## angkag (Oct 29, 2013)

Hesse2323 said:


> CCTV? Oh, now _there's_ a dastardly thought! I'm sure it would catch them in the act of shaking their rugs out over my terrace, at the very least, though I wonder if it would be able to pick up on all the icky details of human detritus (hair and nail clippings and such) that fall off those rugs. Definitely can't hurt to take a look. Thank you!


This should fix it:


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