# quandry



## dunmovin (Dec 19, 2008)

one of my relatives (one I actually like) is planning to come visit me in Spain. Many years ago she was a victim of a very serious assault, which left her with middle ear damage and as a result of that the internal cbin pressure of an airliner (8,000ft above sea level) can cause her excruiating pain.

However that was many years ago and today, doctors can't be certain the condition still exists. What worries me is if the airliner has to make an unscheduled landing due to a medical emergency,would she be liable for the cost (I'm not being mercenary here, whilst the condition is unbearably painful, it is not life threatening or has lasting damage).

any thoughts on the matter?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

dunmovin said:


> one of my relatives (one I actually like) is planning to come visit me in Spain. Many years ago she was a victim of a very serious assault, which left her with middle ear damage and as a result of that the internal cbin pressure of an airliner (8,000ft above sea level) can cause her excruiating pain.
> 
> However that was many years ago and today, doctors can't be certain the condition still exists. What worries me is if the airliner has to make an unscheduled landing due to a medical emergency,would she be liable for the cost (I'm not being mercenary here, whilst the condition is unbearably painful, it is not life threatening or has lasting damage).
> 
> any thoughts on the matter?


Isn't there any kind of test that can be done to find out?
I guess not otherwise you wouldn't be asking this. I suppose you'd have to ask an airline, a doctor, an insurance agent ...


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## dunmovin (Dec 19, 2008)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Isn't there any kind of test that can be done to find out?
> I guess not otherwise you wouldn't be asking this. I suppose you'd have to ask an airline, a doctor, an insurance agent ...


no test, short of putting her in hyperbaric chamber and reducing the air pressure,doctors can't say, the airline she is planning on using is Ryanair, ergo as helpful as a cobra in a kids cot and asking insurance people would "flag" her as an insurance risk, possibly affecting her life/mortage/car insurance


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## VFR (Dec 23, 2009)

dunmovin said:


> no test, short of putting her in hyperbaric chamber and reducing the air pressure,doctors can't say, the airline she is planning on using is Ryanair, ergo as helpful as a cobra in a kids cot and asking insurance people would "flag" her as an insurance risk, possibly affecting her life/mortage/car insurance


Willie can she not have a flight with a local Aero Club in the UK where the pilot can easily pop back down to should she feel pain (should not cost much)


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## dunmovin (Dec 19, 2008)

playamonte said:


> Willie can she not have a flight with a local Aero Club in the UK where the pilot can easily pop back down to should she feel pain (should not cost much)


that would be a good idea, but can light aircraft get above the 8,000-10,000 ft level, without a pressurized cabin? will suggest it to her and conact a mate in the Glasgow flying club to try to sort something out

BTW he was chuffed to bits when I gave him the almonds and walnuts meant for disha, after you left... next time we may get a freebie


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

dunmovin said:


> that would be a good idea, but can light aircraft get above the 8,000-10,000 ft level, without a pressurized cabin? will suggest it to her and conact a mate in the Glasgow flying club to try to sort something out
> 
> BTW he was chuffed to bits when I gave him the almonds and walnuts meant for disha, after you left... next time we may get a freebie


This wikipedia entry is interesting

Airliner cabins are pressurised at 8000 ft so I don't see why an unpressurised light aircraft shouldn't be able to get there...


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## nigele2 (Dec 25, 2009)

dunmovin said:


> that would be a good idea, but can light aircraft get above the 8,000-10,000 ft level, without a pressurized cabin? will suggest it to her and conact a mate in the Glasgow flying club to try to sort something out
> 
> BTW he was chuffed to bits when I gave him the almonds and walnuts meant for disha, after you left... next time we may get a freebie


Not sure the small plane experience is relevant. Divers who have ear pressure problems can be fine dive after dive and then suddenly  And if you are down at 24 meters you cannot go up too rapidly (the dreaded bends). That said a small aircraft flight I'm sure would be great fun 

She could visit a doctor with dive interest (local Scuba clubs or BSAC will help find one). They are very conscious of ear pressure related problems. When I go for my dive med they are always very helpful.

But if I was your friend I'd want a short flight first or if not the banana boat.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Willie, if your relative (I know what you mean about the "one I like") lives not too far from one of the deep-sea diving ports (mostly east coast, e.g. Aberdeen) they have hyperbaric chambers and may be able to help or even offer a suggestion.


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## Muddy (Jan 14, 2010)

Don't know if this is of any help but a couple of links on the problem and how to reduce pain i.e. by not sleeping on decent to land etc!
Painful Ears When Flying Aeroplane Ear | Health | Patient UK
Barotrauma during air travel - Ear, nose, + throat disorders - Clinical Evidence

I remember seeing a documentary a long while ago on diving. A guy had a perforated ear drum but was able to dive to a considerable depth by simply covering his ear inside the normal head gear he was wearing!
I assume tho water pressure and air pressure will throw up different problems. Keeping water out of the ear might let someone dive with ear probs but preventing air entering your ear and the resulting pressure difference will be hard to achieve I think!
Seems by a little reading even an healthy person with an infection or blockage could damage their ears on a flight!

Maybe tell her to try special type of ear plugs and try a as suggested a local flight or maybe the diving option and see if they work!

From what I've found here air tight ear plugs could be a bad option, if they drop out during flight or if you yawn and pressure is released suddenly.
There seems to be a special type of ear plug available but I would check with a GP or someone in the know before trying them!
Read this; Discover Hyperbaric - Research, History, Education, Training

I was coming back from Ireland some years back after catching flu there. I was in so much pain on the flight, it felt like my ear was going to explode so I know how painful this sort of thong can be.

Hope some of that helps..


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## dunmovin (Dec 19, 2008)

Thanks for all the suggestions. I have just sent her a mail with all the suggestions/links. She can decide for herself which will suit her best


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## nigele2 (Dec 25, 2009)

In general the problem is to maintain equal pressure on both sides of the eardrum (outside in relation to the inside: the inner cavities, the Eustachian tubes and sinus). This is achieved in diving by opening the tubes between the ear and the mouth (equalising). Some people can do this automatically, some by jaw movements, while others (including me) use techniques like holding the nose and increasing pressure within the mouth (very gently) until the tubes open. 

On a plane the problem is not as extreme as for divers (who being an impatient lot normally want to get deep quickly) and generally do not have the benefit of pressurisation. But if a diver gets pain he/she simply stops descending, goes up a bit, equilises ear pressure, and then goes down more slowly. Now whether the pilot will oblige I'm not sure 

If you have an infection the tubes/sinus can get blocked and thus equilisation is difficult (painful) or impossible (potentially even more painful). 

I would advise against all blocking earplugs. The potential for damage is high and success I would have thought unlikely. As for diving with an ear infection the word 'insanity' comes to mind but then divers die every year due to largely IMHO stupidity. 

A simple experiment will demonstrate if Dunmovin's friend can equilise (talk to a qualified diver) and they can practise their chosen technique (the one that works for them ) but it will need medical advice to say if this is indeed the problem that potentially exists. But if they are going to risk it being able to equilise would be useful to have in the armoury .

HTH


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## Claire la richarde (Jul 6, 2009)

If she really can't fly, what about the train?

The Man in Seat 61 The Man in Seat Sixty-One... is brilliant for every detail of train travel in Europe.


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## Cazzy (Nov 23, 2008)

I guess Ryan-air is the worst airline to use, Easy-Jet all the time for me, much more pleasant airline!!!


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