# Mexico Highlands



## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

I plan to spend time in the Mexico Highlands in early 2016. What are the best places to visit...and live...esp. those places with few expats.


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## Anonimo (Apr 8, 2012)

A very broad topic. Can you give us some boundaries or a more specific definition for "the Mexico Highlands"?


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## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

Querétaro State, Guanajuato State, San Miguel de Allende Area, Aguascalientes State, San Luis Potosí State, Zacatecas State.


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

In Guanajuato State, you will probably want to visit SMA, Dolores Hidalgo, Guanajuato City, and maybe Leon (leather Capital of Mexico). SMA will have a good amount of extranjeros, but the others, no. I live in Leon, but only because my wife's family is here. I would probably live in the Patzcuaro/Morelia area now (if I had the choice), after Chapala lost its charm for my wife and I. Not sure what you like in a pueblo or weather, the more you tell us, the more specific we can be with our experiences.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

I have fond memories of visits to the cities of Zacatecas and Guanajuato.


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## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

Cooler weather is definitely a priority for me as my Pekingese dog and I don't tolerate the heat very well. One reason I am leaving Baja is that it has just become too hot with no rain and way too many expats and little Mexican culture. I plan to visit all the areas mentioned and hopefully stay in each area a month at a time (I'm a nomad and don't like to stay in one place too long). How is the weather in Leon as I thought it was more on the warm side?


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

mes1952 said:


> Cooler weather is definitely a priority for me as my Pekingese dog and I don't tolerate the heat very well. One reason I am leaving Baja is that it has just become too hot with no rain and way too many expats and little Mexican culture. I plan to visit all the areas mentioned and hopefully stay in each area a month at a time (I'm a nomad and don't like to stay in one place too long). How is the weather in Leon as I thought it was more on the warm side?


Actually, I have been monitoring the weather for 2 months in Leon vs. Chapala and almost daily the weather in Leon has been 1-2 degrees cooler in the day and 1-2 cooler in the night (except this week, when Chapala is 3-4 degrees cooler in the day). However, if you are looking for cooler with rain, I still believe that Patzcuaro/Morelia would be an excellent choice to check out (also Zacatecas). Guanajuato City is a decent choice. There are some extranjeros in all 3 areas, but not many and they pretty much mind their own business and go their own way (live and let live). Bargains on housing are to be found, but you need to spend time walking, asking, and making offers. Much is negotiable, but not all.
Culture is probably better, IMHO, around Lake Patzcuaro/Morelia. Everyone seems to have their own "interpretation" of culture. Anonimo lives in that area and can answer questions if you write or PM him.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

If you like cool you may like San Cristobal de las Casas. I know I love it.


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## Waller52 (Jun 17, 2015)

mes1952 said:


> I plan to spend time in the Mexico Highlands in early 2016. What are the best places to visit...and live...esp. those places with few expats.


What has the # of expats got to do with it? I live in a 99% MX/LAm town presently, we are the only all-white Americans  within ten full blocks. If I don't desire to mingle, I ignore them.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

Waller52 said:


> What has the # of expats got to do with it? I live in a 99% MX/LAm town presently, we are the only all-white Americans  within ten full blocks. If I don't desire to mingle, I ignore them.


Maybe mes1952 wants to spend time in places with few expats because she wants to practice her Spanish.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

I marvel at the posts by people who want to escape the presence of their own countrymen, especially since Mexicans, Chinese and other groups actively seek out the settlements containing their former countrymen. Someday, maybe I'll figure this out, but at present, it's a MYSTERY.

Or, maybe someone will explain it to me in some kind of logical way. Me, I lived in a Mexican barrio in one town with rare expat sightings. Now, I live in a mixed neighborhood with a little of everybody. In fact, there are so many expats in the Lake Chapala area that they form clubs of the like minded...which is convenient because I can easily figure out which whole groups to ignore. (chuckle)

What is this crotchety woman doing in this place? Easy. Weather, convenience, easy travel world wide and friendly people. Mexico City would be even more interesting, but its a bit out of my price range for a roomy house. Why a roomy house? Space-taking avocation.


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## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

One of my reasons for living in Mexico is to experience a different culture and meet new people. If I wanted to be around a lot of gringos I could stay in the U.S.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

It's impossible to move *anywhere* in Mexico without meeting new people and bumping into the culture at every turn. The U.S. is now a different universe, but we all see things from a different perspective. Enjoy your time wherever you land.


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## Waller52 (Jun 17, 2015)

mes1952 said:


> One of my reasons for living in Mexico is to experience a different culture and meet new people. If I wanted to be around a lot of gringos I could stay in the U.S.


There's your answer! Stay in the US in places where there are lots of immigrants, few Americans, you know, like Chinatown. rofl


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## Anonimo (Apr 8, 2012)

mes1952 said:


> Querétaro State, Guanajuato State, San Miguel de Allende Area, Aguascalientes State, San Luis Potosí State, Zacatecas State.


I note the prominent absence of Michoacán. Any reason?


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

Anonimo said:


> I note the prominent absence of Michoacán. Any reason?


I have a feeling she will try that area. She probably has heard so much "bad" about the cartels and is hesitant.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

lagoloo said:


> What is this crotchety woman doing in this place? Easy. Weather, convenience, easy travel world wide and friendly people. Mexico City would be even more interesting, but its a bit out of my price range for a roomy house. Why a roomy house? Space-taking avocation.


No doubt some of the younger neighbors in my very small apartment building think I'm crotchety too, especially when I (gently) complain about noisy parties or dogs barking loudly in the middle of the night. We could start a crotchety expat support group or at least have custom tee shirts printed up and wear them proudly!

If you ever come to Mexico City for a visit, please look me up. I'd love to show you around my neighborhood and other areas of interest.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

Isla Verde said:


> No doubt some of the younger neighbors in my very small apartment building think I'm crotchety too, especially when I (gently) complain about noisy parties or dogs barking loudly in the middle of the night. We could start a crotchety expat support group or at least have custom tee shirts printed up and wear them proudly!
> 
> If you ever come to Mexico City for a visit, please look me up. I'd love to show you around my neighborhood and other areas of interest.


I like the idea of the support group and the T Shirt proudly proclaiming status as Crotchety. Maybe it could say: Beware, Crotchety Woman? I'll definitely get in touch if we make it to Mexico city.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

lagoloo said:


> I like the idea of the support group and the T Shirt proudly proclaiming status as Crotchety. Maybe it could say: Beware, Crotchety Woman? I'll definitely get in touch if we make it to Mexico city.


Actually, I do have a sort of support group with the new friends I have made since moving to Mexico, most of whom are younger than me and don't seem to find me crotchety at all. I wonder how you would say "crotchety" in Spanish . . . 

I do hope to see you and your husband here in La Gran Manzana Mexicana one day soon.


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## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

I'm hesitant to go anywhere in Mexico that is know for above-average violence. An entire family from California was attacked while visiting there recently so that makes me even more apprehensive about going to that area esp. traveling alone. I'm probably more adventurous than the average person but when I read recent news like that it reminds me there are plenty of places in Mexico with less violence involving tourists.
Oxnard Family Ambushed and Shot While Vacationing in Mexico | News - KEYT


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## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

The problem here in Baja esp. Baja Norte that it is becoming oversaturated with American expats and many of them are not the type I want as acquaintances, i.e., what I call the "Ugly American". It will be interesting when I travel to the mainland to discover if expats there are the same as in Baja.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

mes1952 said:


> I'm hesitant to go anywhere in Mexico that is know for above-average violence. An entire family from California was attacked while visiting there recently so that makes me even more apprehensive about going to that area esp. traveling alone. I'm probably more adventurous than the average person but when I read recent news like that it reminds me there are plenty of places in Mexico with less violence involving tourists.
> Oxnard Family Ambushed and Shot While Vacationing in Mexico | News - KEYT


That is indeed a scary and tragic tale. But the article doesn't say where in Michoacán the attack happened, whether in the dangerous Tierra Caliente or on the outskirts of Morelia. It just says that they were "driving down a road in the state of Michoacan".


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

mes1952 said:


> I'm hesitant to go anywhere in Mexico that is know for above-average violence. An entire family from California was attacked while visiting there recently so that makes me even more apprehensive about going to that area esp. traveling alone. I'm probably more adventurous than the average person but when I read recent news like that it reminds me there are plenty of places in Mexico with less violence involving tourists.
> Oxnard Family Ambushed and Shot While Vacationing in Mexico | News - KEYT


I found another article about that incident. There is speculation that it was a case of mistaken identity. One of the victims shares a name and appearance with a former border control agent who was convicted for shooting a drug smuggler.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Isla Verde said:


> That is indeed a scary and tragic tale. But the article doesn't say where in Michoacán the attack happened, whether in the dangerous Tierra Caliente or on the outskirts of Morelia. It just says that they were "driving down a road in the state of Michoacan".


Apparently, it was in Periban, Michoacan. There are two Peribans in western Michoacan, one near the Jalisco border and the other near Uruapan. Coincidentally, the full name of one of them is Periban de Ramos. Ramos is the name of the family that was attacked and also the name of a border control agent that may have been the target.


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## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

If I were to travel in any of those questionable areas I would definitely stay on the main highways esp. if traveling solo.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

It can happen but it is unusual for a tourist to be gunned down like these people were.


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

Isla Verde said:


> I wonder how you would say "crotchety" in Spanish . . .


_La gruñoncita _ (or _gruñona_) is what they call me at my house when I'm being crotchety.


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## mes1952 (Dec 11, 2012)

I read additional info on Borderland Beat and it mentioned they were traveling on a dirt road at night with an SUV full of males. Sorry but that scenario is asking for trouble in those "hot zones" and could easily be mistaken for cartel members.


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## coondawg (May 1, 2014)

mes1952 said:


> I read additional info on Borderland Beat and it mentioned they were traveling on a dirt road at night with an SUV full of males. Sorry but that scenario is asking for trouble in those "hot zones" and could easily be mistaken for cartel members.


A person that has some "common sense" and knows when and where not to venture rarely has difficulty in Mexico, or anywhere else, unless they happen to get caught in the wrong place at the wrong time.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Travelling at night on a dirt road in a SUV sound like a good recipe for getting shot if this is correct.


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## Meritorious-MasoMenos (Apr 17, 2014)

citlali said:


> Travelling at night on a dirt road in a SUV sound like a good recipe for getting shot if this is correct.


Not Baja, but Mexican police say they arested gang leader for the killing of that American motorcyclist who was transversing Mexico last year on his way to Brazil for the World Cup. That was a nasty case. Back when I lived in Mexico in the 80s, drug dealers killed a few Americans they thought were U.S. agents, and an actual U.S. agent as well. 

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/201...ap-lt-mexico-us-motorcyclist-killed.html?_r=0

MEXICO CITY — Mexican authorities said Tuesday they have arrested an alleged drug gang leader they believe was responsible for the 2014 killing of a New York man who vanished while heading on his motorcycle to Brazil for the World Cup.

A federal official, who was not authorized to be quoted by name under the agency's rules, said Reyes Cadena's gang apparently thought motorcyclist Harry Devert was a U.S. agent.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Maybe not Baja but I would not do it on back some backroads, in Jalisco or Michoacan or Chiapas.


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