# Instructing A Solicitor...Questions We Need To Ask?



## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Hi All,

Things are moving along with the purchase, and we have now decided on a solicitor ( subject to a meet) and a structural surveyor for the structural survey.

We fly out to Spain next week, to get NIE's, open bank accounts etc, and to meet with the surveyor at the property, where he will do a full structural survey, and to give us some advice on a couple of changes we would like to make...all the reports will be translated into English.

We also are going to meet with a solicitor. They come recommended, and we are also going to see how we feel about them when we meet face to face.

I'm led to believe that sometimes a solicitor in Spain will only do what you ask them?...they don't have a standard conveyancing 'routine', or checklist, as they do in the UK? This may be untrue of the more efficient practices, but I don't want to be finding out too late that we employed one of the inefficient ones!!

So we would rather hit him with as many questions and requests, so that he is sure of what we expect.......but my question to the knowledgable gathering of this excellent forum...is what exactly MUST I ask him, or instruct him to do?

We've done our research, and we've come up with a list of this so far....

1. All documentation translated with both copies signed off by the abagado/solicitor. 
2. Clarify that the escritura corresponds with the property details, and the land corresponds with what is described, and to get the land boundaries walked out to you.
3. Clarify that all the living areas are stated as such. Not with converted buildings still shown as out buildings.
4. Check that the cadastro value does not exceed the purchase price.
5. Check that the correct permissions have been granted for the pool.
6. All 'historical' issues associated with the property and land must be highlighted and clarified. 
7. Any previous applications for building permissions to be declared, whether they were successful or not. These must also be dated. 
8. Any claims against the vendor, these being land disputes/services etc must be conveyed. 
9. The usual searches with regard to building permission prior to erection of the property, or extensions on it.
10. Any outstanding debts on the property, if any? 
11. Check the state and effectiveness of the well, and survey.
12. Check the access to the property, and get written agreements if necessary.
13. Check the supplier of the mains electricity, and their responsibility boundary. Is the supply maintained by them?
14. Are there any plans for any developments around, or near, the property.

Have we missed anything important?

All advice VERY gratefully received 

Many thanks,

Steve


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

I would also double check to see if any community fees are applicable and if so to see what your responsibilities are in the community.
Check for any future developments in the area whether it be the plot of land next door or a golf course down the road, check that no highways or train lines are being built in the area or worse through your land.
If you are close to an existing train line, highway or power lines check to see what implications that will have on your property.
Make sure all buildings ie: garages etc... sit within the assigned boundaries and not too close to a neighbour.

I don't know what area you are looking in but if it's in Valencia check to make sure that the LOTUP law is adhered too, if applicable.

I think most importantly though is don't sign a thing and hand over any deposit unless your solicitor has written the pre-sale/holding contract. This should include clauses that the sale will not go ahead if after a certain date all the corrections to the cadastral, escurita, declared meters etc.. have not been made prior to sale. Also check for an Fuera de Ordenacion and make sure that is not in place or removed before sale or even if it is possible to get it removed. Have it all in the contract.

You may have to work with the seller to get all this done though, it's up to you how to proceed here.

Our lawyer is first class and none of this had to be instructed to her but it is always good to say these things out aloud.

Good luck with it all as this is the part when it generally falls through for us.


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Thank you for that 

I will add those issues to our list, and do some research on some of the points.

I think it is a big concern, that after spending nearly two years to find this perfect property, that it should fall through at the the legality stage...but :fingerscrossed:

Thanks,

Steve


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## Maureen47 (Mar 27, 2014)

A couple of other things , you can have a topography done to confirm the land boundaries if this is not clear on the docs already , it costs a bit of money but I am informed it then legally sets the boundaries if there is any chance of a discrepancy and is recorded on the house registration.

Checking the debts , you should get copies of the last paid bills for electricity etc.

If there is anything extra included in the sale e.g. furniture , outside items , get an inventory written up that you agree with the seller if this was part of the negotiation , we had an issue with this , it was used to negotiate the price and then it was changing as the pre sale agreements were going on.

We also had it written into the contract that the property would be in the same condition as when we viewed it , it was very good and we expected it to be the same. We worked with the seller and lawyer and got this sorted so both parties were clear on what they were signing up to.

One last thing , maybe think about the currency and where you will make payments , this came up for us too , but the contract gave us the option of paying in euros or sterling to a UK or a Spanish bank.

Good Luck


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

I think it is easy to take a hardline stance and accept nothing less than a perfectly legal house, unfortunately that would rule out 90% of them so in the end if there are problems they are normally fixable but it comes down to how you go about fixing them.
Some sellers will accept your offer but when it comes to covering the costs of regularizacion wont pay for it and expect you to pay on top of the agreed sum, some may need your deposit money to do so or you may agree to pay half of it.
It just depends on what you find acceptable. Also depending on the problems it could take months to sort out and you need to assess the time frame too.
To be honest we haven't been able to buy a property here yet, but each time throws up a different set of problems so I can say what to stay clear of and what the problems are because there is always something.

Anyway, just be careful, if you have a good property it should be straight forward and most of the above wont apply.


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

maureen47 said:


> A couple of other things , you can have a topography done to confirm the land boundaries if this is not clear on the docs already , it costs a bit of money but I am informed it then legally sets the boundaries if there is any chance of a discrepancy and is recorded on the house registration.
> 
> Checking the debts , you should get copies of the last paid bills for electricity etc.
> 
> ...


Some very good points there Maureen, thank you 

I will certainly look into the topography.

We have already thought about the money payment. The property is owned by a British couple, as a holiday home...so we are hoping that the money can be all transferred within the uk. This would obviously mean we wouldn't get charged any undue costs, or loss of the interest rate by using the money transfer companies  we hope to find out if this is an acceptable method next week when we fly out to Spain


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## Maureen47 (Mar 27, 2014)

Pazcat said:


> I think it is easy to take a hardline stance and accept nothing less than a perfectly legal house, unfortunately that would rule out 90% of them so in the end if there are problems they are normally fixable but it comes down to how you go about fixing them.
> Some sellers will accept your offer but when it comes to covering the costs of regularizacion wont pay for it and expect you to pay on top of the agreed sum, some may need your deposit money to do so or you may agree to pay half of it.
> It just depends on what you find acceptable. Also depending on the problems it could take months to sort out and you need to assess the time frame too.
> To be honest we haven't been able to buy a property here yet, but each time throws up a different set of problems so I can say what to stay clear of and what the problems are because there is always something.
> ...


I agree with being able to fix things , every house we found was not legally registered but had the potential to be , but some had extra outbuildings that made them over the allowed number of buildings for the size of the land so could have been instructed to get rid of them , it is a compromise but you can get what you need , our sellers agreed in the contract to get the legalisation done , they paid for lawyer and the required process at the town hall with the architect prior to us signing , it also was condition in the pre -contract. There are many houses available but you really need your wits about you to make sure you are not buying a whole series of issues at a time when for us we want to leave the rat race and have a chilled life , for me the pre-work is more than worth it to know what you are getting into. Don't they always say house buying is one real stressful thing , probably even more so in a foreign country but all worth it in the end


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

Pazcat said:


> I think it is easy to take a hardline stance and accept nothing less than a perfectly legal house, unfortunately that would rule out 90% of them so in the end if there are problems they are normally fixable but it comes down to how you go about fixing them.
> Some sellers will accept your offer but when it comes to covering the costs of regularizacion wont pay for it and expect you to pay on top of the agreed sum, some may need your deposit money to do so or you may agree to pay half of it.
> It just depends on what you find acceptable. Also depending on the problems it could take months to sort out and you need to assess the time frame too.
> To be honest we haven't been able to buy a property here yet, but each time throws up a different set of problems so I can say what to stay clear of and what the problems are because there is always something.
> ...



I'm hoping ours will be relatively straight forward...hopefully :fingerscrossed:

It is an old property, so hopefully that is at least in its favour...but it has a pool!....the next few weeks will tell I guess, and we can only push for everything to be searched so that it is all revealed I guess. I just hope we have made a right choice with the solicitor....


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

You will be very lucky if you get "searches" done and also a "survey". Those concepts here are very different from what you may be used to in UK. Be wary of professionals (solicitors, etc) whose main qualification is that they 'speak English'. Use professionals who are good at what you are expecting them to do e.g. checking the deeds and doing the conveyancing, etc. if it is the abogado, then use a good translator/interpreter to handle the English side. Too many have been caught out by the "English speaking lawyer" who was a very poor or even corrupt lawyer but, at least could **** inglish after a fashion. Get a good translator/interpreter and it will be worth your while to retain the services of that person when it comes to dealing with other matters such as making a Spanish Will, hospital visits etc. because she/he will develop an understanding of your personal situation and may be able to flag up issues, you hadn't thought of.


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

StevejR1 said:


> Some very good points there Maureen, thank you
> 
> I will certainly look into the topography.
> 
> We have already thought about the money payment. The property is owned by a British couple, as a holiday home...so we are hoping that the money can be all transferred within the uk. This would obviously mean we wouldn't get charged any undue costs, or loss of the interest rate by using the money transfer companies  we hope to find out if this is an acceptable method next week when we fly out to Spain


Are there really any advantages for the proceeds to go into the UK bank? 
What do you mean by undue cost? 
The money transfer companies don't charge to transfer money to another country at least the one I will be using doesn't


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## 90199 (Mar 21, 2010)

Different here, people don't seem to use solicitors when buying and selling properties.


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## ddrysdale99 (Apr 3, 2014)

What will you do if the cadastro value *does *exceed the purchase price? Is that a common occurrence?


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

I would think that it is , as many properties are practically given away.
When my neighbour sold last year, it was for only 10,000 euros above the catastral value


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

extranjero said:


> Are there really any advantages for the proceeds to go into the UK bank?
> What do you mean by undue cost?
> The money transfer companies don't charge to transfer money to another country at least the one I will be using doesn't


Sorry I probably wasn't very clear there 

...the cost I meant, are if you transfer the funds to a Spanish bank.

Like most I would use one of the money transfer companies...but then they give you a reduced interest rate when calculating the transaction, as compared with calculating what the asking price in Euros is, then using the current interest rate to calculate what you then need to transfer between British banks......if that makes sense??? So no charge, and no reduction in interest rate....or have I got it wrong?


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

I understand that if I sold in Spain, the money is transferred to my UK account when I instructed them to do so, at a rate that is favourable to me( which it most definitely isn't at the moment)


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

ddrysdale99 said:


> What will you do if the cadastro value *does *exceed the purchase price? Is that a common occurrence?


I have been told...rightly or wrongly...that it is unlikely to be under the cadastro value because it is in the campo, and the problem tends to be more common in the urban areas.....time will tell if that is true or not.

We do know of someone who got caught out by this problem...bought a rundown townhouse for €50,000, spent €50,000 doing it up...then a year later got a fine, as the cadastro value was €100,000, for the tax that should have been paid on the missing €50,000. He appealed, and he won...as technically the house is worth €100,000, but not in the state he bought it.

I'm not sure what I would do if the cadastro value exceeds what we paid?...I would take legal advice first, then decide what to do.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

StevejR1 said:


> I have been told...rightly or wrongly...that it is unlikely to be under the cadastro value because it is in the campo, and the problem tends to be more common in the urban areas.....time will tell if that is true or not.
> 
> We do know of someone who got caught out by this problem...bought a rundown townhouse for €50,000, spent €50,000 doing it up...then a year later got a fine, as the cadastro value was €100,000, for the tax that should have been paid on the missing €50,000. He appealed, and he won...as technically the house is worth €100,000, but not in the state he bought it.
> 
> I'm not sure what I would do if the cadastro value exceeds what we paid?...I would take legal advice first, then decide what to do.


This can be one of the problems arising from the brown-envelope transactions. At one time, it could be got away with quite easily, but nowadays with computers and the internet Hacienda are much more on top of the situation and are cracking down on underpayment of taxes caused by undervaluing.


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

I think we will have a quite substantial list of questions to ask to, and of the lawyer, when we see him next week...we are hoping his responses to those questions will instill in us some confidence.

......I think picking a lawyer in ANY country is very hard. Even in the uk you mostly assume that they are competent when you first instruct them...it is only their performance that determines if you use them again. But if they are not as good as you hoped they can cause you a lot of grief!...in Spain the stakes are higher risk, and a level of competence not assured.

I'm hoping all will go well.......


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

StevejR1 said:


> I think we will have a quite substantial list of questions to ask to, and of the lawyer, when we see him next week...we are hoping his responses to those questions will instill in us some confidence.
> 
> ......I think picking a lawyer in ANY country is very hard. Even in the uk you mostly assume that they are competent when you first instruct them...it is only their performance that determines if you use them again. But if they are not as good as you hoped they can cause you a lot of grief!...in Spain the stakes are higher risk, and a level of competence not assured.
> 
> I'm hoping all will go well.......


As previously stated, you don't need a good solicitor, you need someone who is great at conveyancing - and they are not necessarily the same person!

I'm not sure the stakes are any higher in Spain, it's just that the 'rules' are different.

If I had my time again, would I buy in Spain - I'm not so sure. The biggest issue for me is "what happens after myself and my wife die - will the children want the property in this area or even in this country? Will they be able to sell it?".


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## StevejR1 (May 21, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> As previously stated, you don't need a good solicitor, you need someone who is great at conveyancing - and they are not necessarily the same person!
> 
> I'm not sure the stakes are any higher in Spain, it's just that the 'rules' are different.
> 
> If I had my time again, would I buy in Spain - I'm not so sure. The biggest issue for me is "what happens after myself and my wife die - will the children want the property in this area or even in this country? Will they be able to sell it?".


*"I'm not sure the stakes are any higher in Spain, it's just that the 'rules' are different." *......probably a better way of putting it 

As regards the inheritance...and the tax. The tax is a worry, but I think we are shielded in the UK, because apart from France we are the only country that has the spouse exemption, but it does concern us....but we don't have any children, so inheritance isn't an issue...and to be honest I don't think I would base what I bought, or did, on what the kids would do with it after we were dead.


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