# Distribution of expats in Mexico



## ptrichmondmike

Something I've been wondering about is whether Americans from different parts of the U.S. tend to cluster in specific Mexican locations. For example, do people from the West Coast (all "blue states") group in some towns, while folks from the South and Midwest (the "red states") choose to live elsewhere? Looking at another angle, do the artsy culture vultures live elsewhere than the beer and RV crowd? (Not that one can't be both, lol...)


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## TundraGreen

Interesting question. Where are you in Mexico? I will start a response.
Single arrow (->) means full time in Mexico.
Double arrow (<->) means time split between US and Mexico.

San Francisco -> Guadalajara


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## ptrichmondmike

I'm still in the US -- but my choices will be SMA/Guanajuato, Oaxaca, Patzcuaro. I wouldn't consider Baja, Chapala, a major city like DF, Puebla or Guadalajara, or anywhere tropical. Wish I knew more about places like Taxco, San Cristobal de las Casas. I'm curious as to whether you will find more Californians in one, and more Texans (let's say) in another. Do Floridians cluster in Yucatan? (I know Baja has many thousands of Californians.)


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## Tr0phy_Scars

I lived in 3 cities in the state of Sonora, and there you would find alot of United State citizens. Mainly because people from California thru Texas own homes in Sonora.

While in Nayarit had a mixture of people from the Northern states and Jaliasco & Oaxaca had mostly Californians.


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## HolyMole

ptrichmondmike said:


> Something I've been wondering about is whether Americans from different parts of the U.S. tend to cluster in specific Mexican locations. For example, do people from the West Coast (all "blue states") group in some towns, while folks from the South and Midwest (the "red states") choose to live elsewhere? Looking at another angle, do the artsy culture vultures live elsewhere than the beer and RV crowd? (Not that one can't be both, lol...)


We're still in Canada, which, by US standards, is probably a very dark blue. And we can enjoy a beer with the vultures or the RVers. 
Had we our druthers, we'd be full-time in Zihuatanejo, Guerrero.


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## Flora Loveday

I am a full timer here, from Canada, and have been here for more than a year and a half.

In DF we have it all, and THEN some. People from all over the world live here. I see all types of Americans and Canadians when out and about. I think the majority of American expats live in DF. I know the US govt put that statistical info out there somewhere...

I have also lived on Cozumel island and in Leon GTO. I prefer DF over both. 

Leon, to me, is a very dirty and run down city, and has really nothing as far as fun extracurricular activities, with the exception of salsa dancing! Cozumel, when it is not subjected to the rainy season, can be beautiful (but always salty, sticky and hot).

As for Canadians in Mexico, I would be curious to know more about how many and where they are.


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## La Paz

ptrichmondmike said:


> I'm still in the US -- but my choices will be SMA/Guanajuato, Oaxaca, Patzcuaro. I wouldn't consider Baja, Chapala, a major city like DF, Puebla or Guadalajara, or anywhere tropical. Wish I knew more about places like Taxco, San Cristobal de las Casas. I'm curious as to whether you will find more Californians in one, and more Texans (let's say) in another. Do Floridians cluster in Yucatan? (I know Baja has many thousands of Californians.)


Hey!! No Baja bashing!:boxing: _ *"Baja has many thousands of Californians."*_ *It does? WHERE?* Baja is approximately 1,000 miles long & I know that there's a heavier concentrations of expats within 100 +/- miles of the northern border, but further south there's less concentrated populations in smaller towns & ex-pats from all over the globe. Thankfully not every location speaks to everyone's heart!! Cabo (or ANY "tourist destination") simply wasn't an option for me personally. La Paz is a great fit for me & there are residents here from Australia, Canada, Egypt, Germany, Italy among others & possibly all 50 states of the USA, yes, even Hawaii & Washington, DC.

Originally from the Pacific Northwest & firmly entrenched just outside of ->La Paz....but I had to drive through CA:sorry: to get here!


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## ptrichmondmike

La Paz said:


> Hey!! No Baja bashing!:boxing: _ *"Baja has many thousands of Californians."*_ *It does? WHERE?* Baja is approximately 1,000 miles long & I know that there's a heavier concentrations of expats within 100 +/- miles of the northern border, but further south there's less concentrated populations in smaller towns & ex-pats from all over the globe. Thankfully not every location speaks to everyone's heart!! Cabo (or ANY "tourist destination") simply wasn't an option for me personally. La Paz is a great fit for me & there are residents here from Australia, Canada, Egypt, Germany, Italy among others & possibly all 50 states of the USA, yes, even Hawaii & Washington, DC.
> 
> Originally from the Pacific Northwest & firmly entrenched just outside of ->La Paz....but I had to drive through CA:sorry: to get here!


Lol...yes, Baja is very nice in many ways, and I am not knocking it, but it just doesn't have the cultural amenities and attractions I desire. I'm the opposite of a beach person -- I loathe them, give me mountains! If I had my druthers, I'd really prefer to move to the Andes (Ecuador, specifically), but I'm afraid to retire so far from family and friends. My son and his family live in Austin, so that is a very compelling argument for Mexico.

I'm quite familiar with much of Baja Norte, and it is seems that Ensenada, Rosarito, San Felipe are packed to the gills with retired Californians. I'm glad to hear it's more diverse in Baja Sur, which I haven't visited.

Fell free to knock California, though...my happiest moment will be seeing it in the rearview mirror.


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## RVGRINGO

We're full time in Chapala, and have been for a decade. We've traveled in other parts of Mexico, but live here, where we intend to stay. We haven't been out of Mexico in many years; no need.
I have an Ecuadorian son-in-law and he and my daughter have no desire to live in Quito. Ugh!
Baja ? No thanks; I'm much too old to be a 'surfer dude' and we like having the cultural amenities of Guadalajara nearby and the Pacific beaches just four hours away. We have the lake and the mountains in a delightful micro-climate.
There are enough expats here so that imported products aren't hard to find for that occasional 'special taste treat from home' or 'holiday fixin's'.


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## ptrichmondmike

RVGRINGO said:


> We're full time in Chapala, and have been for a decade. We've traveled in other parts of Mexico, but live here, where we intend to stay. We haven't been out of Mexico in many years; no need.
> I have an Ecuadorian son-in-law and he and my daughter have no desire to live in Quito. Ugh!
> Baja ? No thanks; I'm much too old to be a 'surfer dude' and we like having the cultural amenities of Guadalajara nearby and the Pacific beaches just four hours away. We have the lake and the mountains in a delightful micro-climate.
> There are enough expats here so that imported products aren't hard to find for that occasional 'special taste treat from home' or 'holiday fixin's'.


Quito, no...Cuenca, yes. But Mexico has better food from my POV. For me, Chapala is too much like still being in California, and perhaps SMA as well. I think I'd prefer a place with a smaller expat population -- which will probably also be cheaper?

Who knows Taxco? Never been there, but it sure looks gorgeous in the photos.


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## maryellen1952

*The weather is a major influence*

Most expats living on the West Coast are not going to tolerate the heat and humidity of parts of Mexico as those from areas such as the South where the A/C runs 24/7 during the summer.
I'm originally from the South and lived on the West Coast for years. 
One reason so many expats (including Californians) are on the Baja side is because the proximity to the U.S. Remember that Tijuana is the busiest border crossing in the world.
I live in Tijuana simply because I am one of those thousands of UNretired Americans who can't afford to live in the U.S. anymore and now that I am in Mexico have NO desire to return to live in the U.S. Working there is all I care to do knowing I can return back to Mexico at the end of the day. When I come to a point that I can retire (if that every does happen) I plan to move to the Guadalajara area.


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## RVGRINGO

Ptrichmoncmike,
We live in Chapala, not Ajijic. There is a great difference in ambiance and lifestyle. We did live in Ajijic for four years, but sold and bought in Chapala in 2004. We prefer it here and we're not overwhelmed by boutiques and those who patronize them. That said, the presence of the 'Ajijic lifestyle' makes all those imported products available, along with a lot of good restaurants, all within five miles.


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## Hound Dog

Well, we live in both Ajijic, Jalisco on Lake Chapala which is a delegación of the municipality of Chapala and in San Cristóbal de Las Casas, Chiapas in Los Altos de Chiapas. There is a large group of expats living in the municipality of Chapala. Most are Americans or Canadians from hick towns in the U.S. midwest or the frozen tundra in Canada. Californians are not highly represented. Generally speaking, more affluent expats are attracted to Ajijic and less affluent expats, expecially retired military types, are attracted to central Chapala township . That is not to say that there are not numerous exceptions to this general migratory trend and both Chapala and its delegacion Ajijic which includes pleasant, leafy La Floresta, present nice places to live at fairly reasonable prices. For many expat retirees that whole of "Lakeside from the Poncitlan border on the east to Jocotepec is a nice place to live with many homebuying opportunities and lots of mediocre restaurants appealing mainly to midwestern types. An additional appeal is the large number of locals in the area who speak English which is damn helpful if you don´t speak any or much Spanish. 

San Cristóbal, on the other hand, has few expats relative to the total population of about 130,000 people and a large percentage of lacals are of indigenous Maya heritage. Those expats that do live there are mostly of European heritage with some Americans and Canadians. Most of the expats whether of North American or European heritage speak decent to fluent Spanish or some native languages and blend well into the local population unlike the foreign population at Lake Chapala. They are an entirely doffernt breed from the types of expats one would find at "Lakeside". You decide which type of expat you wish to be associated with but do not move to Chiapas if you do not have at least a decent command of Spanish. 

There are lots of options in Mexico from hot, often humid seacoasts to cool, moderate highlands. Do not underestimate the difficulty of mastering Spanish in your quest which is way different from Englich as you will discover so, if you only speak English, Lakeside or San Miguel or Los Cabos may be where you wish to start. You can move on to more "Mexican" places later after picking up some Spanish.


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## TundraGreen

Hound Dog said:


> ... You can move on to more "Mexican" places later after picking up some Spanish.


With all do respect to Hound Dog, I would suggest that the best way to pick up some more Spanish is to live somewhere where it is necessary. Don't wait.


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## Hound Dog

TundraGreen said:


> With all do respect to Hound Dog, I would suggest that the best way to pick up some more Spanish is to live somewhere where it is necessary. Don't wait.


With all due respect, TG, that is one of the reasons among many we moved to Chiapas in 2006. As you can discern, we did not wait for your advice. 

Since we live in Chiapas for six months a year and Lake Chapala for the other six months, we know very well that it is much easier to learn to speak Spanish in Chiapas where vitually no one speaks English than it is at Lake Chapala in the communities with heavy English speaking expat and local populations. In fact, my Spanish speaking friends at Lake Chapala always comment to me about how my Spanish has improved every time I return from San Cristóbal. Then it goes to hell in short order.

We also visit Paris often and stay with family there and I find my French improves while there.

Any more words of wisdom? Don´t wait.

By the way, we haven´t left "Lakeside" and moved to San Cristóbal de Las Casas full time because of what we consider to be unfavorable housing market conditions at the present time. For the right price, we could sell to you. Make an offer.


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## ptrichmondmike

*Great input from you all -- thanks.*

I expect to pick on on Spanish again fairly quickly -- I studied it for many years and was semi-fluent once. In the meantime I watch some Spanish language TV regularly, and read Mexican newspapers online.

I'm retiring poor -- SS income of only $17K/year...assuming it survives. So affordability is crucial, and the expat meccas, even Oaxaca, are likely overpriced for my budget. What I'm really looking for is relative peace and quiet in a beautiful place with temperate weather. Nightlife is unimportant, but internet is essential. Access to decent doctors if necessary...and public transportation. I really spend very little money, even here, working part-time at a non-profit. Perhaps a suburb of one of the nicer colonial cities?

My plan is to check out a number of different possibilities for a month or so each, narrow the list, spend longer at the final choices and go from there. I won't attempt to put down any serious roots unless I'm sure.

So no one knows Taxco?


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## conklinwh

What I( know of Taxco is 2nd hand from jewelry store owner here that goes to Taxco 3-4 times a year to meet with her designers. She says a great place, a little upscale as very popular a weekend getaway from Mexico City.
I think we have a great situation but the public transportation would be problematic as really need a car or multiple bus changes to almost anywhere.
I've raised the option before of San Miguel as an option that can be very reasonable. We know a number of people that live well on less than $17K.
However you really need to spend time there to find a reasonable rental but they are certainly there. San Miguel would score very high on the rest of your list and bring a lot of very interesting things as well.


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## TundraGreen

Public transportation will be easier in the big cities. Guadalajara and Mexico City both have excellent local bus systems. Queretaro less so. Other places I am less familiar with. However, in both big and small cities, you can find places to live where it is possible to walk to most things you need. And taxis are generally a lot cheaper here than in comparable US cities. Intercity bus service is great throughout the country.


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## johnmex

Back on topic…

Chicago suburbs (see _Edward Scissorhands_) to the Guadalajara suburbs.


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## RVGRINGO

Taxco? Don't take a car there; at least not bigger than a Smart or an old 'vocho'. The streets in centro are very narrow single lane, parking is almost non-existent and it is very hilly and steep. It is a tourist trap town for silver jewelry buyers, retail and wholesale. A fine place to visit, shop and have lunch; but its 'charm' will fade fast for easy living.


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## HolyMole

RVGRINGO said:


> Taxco? Don't take a car there; at least not bigger than a Smart or an old 'vocho'. The streets in centro are very narrow single lane, parking is almost non-existent and it is very hilly and steep. It is a tourist trap town for silver jewelry buyers, retail and wholesale. A fine place to visit, shop and have lunch; but its 'charm' will fade fast for easy living.


Yup, those Taxco hills are a killer for anyone who isn't in top shape. My car even had a hard time getting up some of them.

That's the 2nd time in two weeks I've seen the term "vocho" - but had never heard it before. Is it a contraction of "volkswagen" and "choque"? (I think choque is slang for a car, right?)


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## AlanMexicali

*Coche*



HolyMole said:


> Yup, those Taxco hills are a killer for anyone who isn't in top shape. My car even had a hard time getting up some of them.
> 
> That's the 2nd time in two weeks I've seen the term "vocho" - but had never heard it before. Is it a contraction of "volkswagen" and "choque"? (I think choque is slang for a car, right?)


Coche is the word for car in most of Mexico, not the slang word. Cochera is the word for garage. In the northern states of Mexico they use the word carro for car but still use cochera for garage. Whether you use carro or coche they understand you mean car.

The slang word for a Volkswagen beetle is pulga or pulgita and that means flea or baby flea in Spanish. I don't know if they still say that anymore.


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## RVGRINGO

I don't know the origin of 'vocho', but it is what the old style 'beetle' is called here. What we called the VW 'Thing' in the USA, is a 'Safari' in Mexico.
Vochomania: vochomania - Buscar con Google
They even have their own web: .:www.vochoweb.com:. .: La Pagina Oficial de los Vochos en Mexico! :.


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## joelpb

*baja is great*

I just got back from ensenada baja and it was great. The only thing I do not like is how bad the roads are. I did not notice a large population of americans. They are not running all over the place. Most live to gather in certain areas and stay there most of the time. So you usualy never see them. The good thing is that you have the opion to live how and where you want to. You can live native or not. The weather is great and so is the food. Sea food is great. The prices vary depending on how you much you want to pay. You have many choices of places to live. You can be in town or up in the vallies such as the wine region. There are plenty of small towns to live in at different levels of elavation and still only a couple of hours from the USA. Baja is a big state and it offers every different type of living and different climates. I must agree it helps to have a mexican wife plus the fact she a very loving and a beautiful women. She is from mexacli but has family all over mexico. But in the end she would prefer to live in the USA. She has a very good job in mexicali and her parants and most of her 11 brothers and sisters still live there. A couple of them live in CA. The question is why mexican americans do not move to mexico after they retire? Some do but not very many. 








QUOTE=ptrichmondmike;551697]Quito, no...Cuenca, yes. But Mexico has better food from my POV. For me, Chapala is too much like still being in California, and perhaps SMA as well. I think I'd prefer a place with a smaller expat population -- which will probably also be cheaper?

Who knows Taxco? Never been there, but it sure looks gorgeous in the photos.[/QUOTE]


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## AlanMexicali

*Vocho*



RVGRINGO said:


> I don't know the origin of 'vocho', but it is what the old style 'beetle' is called here. What we called the VW 'Thing' in the USA, is a 'Safari' in Mexico.
> Vochomania: vochomania - Buscar con Google
> They even have their own web: .:www.vochoweb.com:. .: La Pagina Oficial de los Vochos en Mexico! :.



Spending more time in Central Mexico I am finding many normal and slang words that are used on the border differ from the ones used there.

They Americanize many words on the border it seems. Ex: a pickup is pickup, a truck is camion or trucke on the border.

In Cenrtal Mexico they use almorzar [to lunch] on the border they often say lunche and in Central Mexico they do not use this but have cafeterias called Loncharias and lunche [lunch] is in the dictionary. Etc.


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## RVGRINGO

That's true. Mexicans we know here think that the border areas and the 'free zones' are really strange places, where Spanish is spoken very poorly and there is little culture. 
Mexicans do retire back to Mexico, many doing so to our area; including our next door neighbor.


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## DNP

HolyMole said:


> Yup, those Taxco hills are a killer for anyone who isn't in top shape. My car even had a hard time getting up some of them.
> 
> That's the 2nd time in two weeks I've seen the term "vocho" - but had never heard it before. Is it a contraction of "volkswagen" and "choque"? (I think choque is slang for a car, right?)


No, choque is slang for a crash.


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## HolyMole

DNP said:


> No, choque is slang for a crash.


I get it. You wouldn't want to be in a Vocho in a choque.


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## AlanMexicali

*Border region*



RVGRINGO said:


> That's true. Mexicans we know here think that the border areas and the 'free zones' are really strange places, where Spanish is spoken very poorly and there is little culture.
> Mexicans do retire back to Mexico, many doing so to our area; including our next door neighbor.


Yes some Mexicans living their whole lives in the interior do say things to me when I tell them I live in Mexicali most of the time. Number one is the border regions are very liberal because of the California influence. Number two is the Spanish spoken there is corrupted. Number three is that border cities are full of desperate people trying to jump the fence. That there in no real culture there. That everything is too expense. That the Narcos ruin everything and is dangerous. That it is inhumanly hot and dusty there. 

That the men from Sinaloa come there to live that many are pistoleros, Mexicali life time residents complain about this continually. Of course when Mexico City residents move there the locals can tell them apart because they lean on their car horns for nothing and wear stupid black or dark blue suits and long sleeve white shirts when it is 110 degrees.


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## ptrichmondmike

RVGRINGO said:


> Taxco? Don't take a car there; at least not bigger than a Smart or an old 'vocho'. The streets in centro are very narrow single lane, parking is almost non-existent and it is very hilly and steep. It is a tourist trap town for silver jewelry buyers, retail and wholesale. A fine place to visit, shop and have lunch; but its 'charm' will fade fast for easy living.


Thanks RV -- I guess I suspected something was not that great about Taxco. One never hears it mentioned as a place to live. And if I'm walking, those hills could be a killer. "Nice place to visit."


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## expat1111

*Puerto Vallarta*

Puerto Vallarta has lots of Canadians








Flora Loveday said:


> I am a full timer here, from Canada, and have been here for more than a year and a half.
> 
> In DF we have it all, and THEN some. People from all over the world live here. I see all types of Americans and Canadians when out and about. I think the majority of American expats live in DF. I know the US govt put that statistical info out there somewhere...
> 
> I have also lived on Cozumel island and in Leon GTO. I prefer DF over both.
> 
> Leon, to me, is a very dirty and run down city, and has really nothing as far as fun extracurricular activities, with the exception of salsa dancing! Cozumel, when it is not subjected to the rainy season, can be beautiful (but always salty, sticky and hot).
> 
> As for Canadians in Mexico, I would be curious to know more about how many and where they are.


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## ptrichmondmike

Joel, I like Ensenada too -- but it's just not the "Mexico" I'm looking for. It's basically a remote suburb of San Diego. 




joelpb said:


> I just got back from ensenada baja and it was great. The only thing I do not like is how bad the roads are. I did not notice a large population of americans. They are not running all over the place. Most live to gather in certain areas and stay there most of the time. So you usualy never see them. The good thing is that you have the opion to live how and where you want to. You can live native or not. The weather is great and so is the food. Sea food is great. The prices vary depending on how you much you want to pay. You have many choices of places to live. You can be in town or up in the vallies such as the wine region. There are plenty of small towns to live in at different levels of elavation and still only a couple of hours from the USA. Baja is a big state and it offers every different type of living and different climates. I must agree it helps to have a mexican wife plus the fact she a very loving and a beautiful women. She is from mexacli but has family all over mexico. But in the end she would prefer to live in the USA. She has a very good job in mexicali and her parants and most of her 11 brothers and sisters still live there. A couple of them live in CA. The question is why mexican americans do not move to mexico after they retire? Some do but not very many.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> QUOTE=ptrichmondmike;551697]Quito, no...Cuenca, yes. But Mexico has better food from my POV. For me, Chapala is too much like still being in California, and perhaps SMA as well. I think I'd prefer a place with a smaller expat population -- which will probably also be cheaper?
> 
> Who knows Taxco? Never been there, but it sure looks gorgeous in the photos.


[/QUOTE]


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## TundraGreen

Lot of the little towns on the west coast of Mexico seem to have a lot of Canadians: Melaque, Barra de Navidad, Sayulitos, etc.


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## conklinwh

Returning to the base question of where are people from.
I will try to cover for our small town.
Full time:
We have two guys from Dallas that run a Gallery/B&B
A woman from Sweden via California that has Jewelry store and soon rental units
A family from St Paul MN that has boutique and bake goods
A painter that came from Santa Fe area but that not where from
A web designer that not sure of home base
A couple from San Antonio area where she is from Lubbock and he from eastern TN
A guy from Arkansas
A couple from Dallas
A woman from CA
A woman from NM via FL and Santa Fe
A woman from Houston
A couple from Houston
Another couple from Houston that have boutique hotel, clothing jewelry store and soon a SPA
Woman from England via CA
We are from NC, my wife is from Durham, I was born in St. Louis but have moved 30+ times
Part Time with property/houses:
Couple from Kansas City
Woman from NYC
Family from FL
Couple from WI
Couple from NM
Family from IL
Four women from Houston
Two women from Asheville NC
Woman from Arkansas
Couple from VA
Woman from CA
More but not sure of residence
All in all, we are a pretty eclectic bunch but that makes for very interesting get togethers.


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## ptrichmondmike

Mineral de Pozos looks intriguing. I love ruins. It is tiny, though...are there rentals? Is there any kind of bus transportation, such as chicken buses? Markets? And, if Yahoo isn't lying to me, it is also quite hot right now -- daytime temps in the 90s for the next ten days. But, yes, it does look rather quiet and peaceful.



conklinwh said:


> Returning to the base question of where are people from.
> I will try to cover for our small town.
> Full time:
> We have two guys from Dallas that run a Gallery/B&B
> A woman from Sweden via California that has Jewelry store and soon rental units
> A family from St Paul MN that has boutique and bake goods
> A painter that came from Santa Fe area but that not where from
> A web designer that not sure of home base
> A couple from San Antonio area where she is from Lubbock and he from eastern TN
> A guy from Arkansas
> A couple from Dallas
> A woman from CA
> A woman from NM via FL and Santa Fe
> A woman from Houston
> A couple from Houston
> Another couple from Houston that have boutique hotel, clothing jewelry store and soon a SPA
> Woman from England via CA
> We are from NC, my wife is from Durham, I was born in St. Louis but have moved 30+ times
> Part Time with property/houses:
> Couple from Kansas City
> Woman from NYC
> Family from FL
> Couple from WI
> Couple from NM
> Family from IL
> Four women from Houston
> Two women from Asheville NC
> Woman from Arkansas
> Couple from VA
> Woman from CA
> More but not sure of residence
> All in all, we are a pretty eclectic bunch but that makes for very interesting get togethers.


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## maryellen1952

I have lived in Tijuana in a lower middle class Mexican neighborhood, i.e., no enclosed compound, no security guards and an entrance gate that are usually unlocked 24/7 and not had any problems as well as other residents who have been there 3 years plus. I encounter more weirdos when I have to use the San Diego Trolley. I'm a 50-something single female and have driven from Tijuana to Ensenada alone and had no problems including driving back across the border at 12:00 midnight after a job in the U.S.
Yes Tijuana does not have much culture as with other border towns but the weather is definitely better than any of the other borders. The Americans I've encountered who live in TJ don't seem to be doing any better than if they were in the U.S. other than they are not homeless. This is definitely not the real Mexico but, for me, is preferable to living in the intense heat of most of the border towns that are far from the coast. Even though I still commute across the border, I am always ready to leave the U.S. at the end of the day. 
I think many Americans who live in Mexico forget how much crime is in the U.S. and let the U.S. news media influence their perceptions of crime in Mexico.


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## expat1111

*Full time for 5 years*

Full time Puerto Vallarta from Key West Florida




TundraGreen said:


> Interesting question. Where are you in Mexico? I will start a response.
> Single arrow (->) means full time in Mexico.
> Double arrow (<->) means time split between US and Mexico.
> 
> San Francisco -> Guadalajara


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## conklinwh

1st, yahoo must have a great sense of humor. We get into the 80's in the hottest month which is May and this year early June till the summer weather rolled in. We have been high in the 70's with occasional 60's and low of low 60/high 50 for over a week and that the 5 day. We have had a couple good rains and some sprinkles and is starting to green up but we need more based on my discussion with the farmers. Problem with getting weather forecast for Pozos is that everything really extrapolated to San Luis de la Paz(5 miles away) and then to Pozos so all over the lot.
I actually left out some 1/2 dozen people. Yes, we have a few rentals. Pozos is on the bus route between San Jose Iturbide(about 18mi) and San Luis de la Paz. Modest people that don't want to drive take buses from San Luis. San Luis now has two large supermarkets(Chedraui & Aurera Bodega) but there are a lot of local markets to get fresh stuff.


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## expat1111

*Where are you*

What town, sounds interesting



conklinwh said:


> Returning to the base question of where are people from.
> I will try to cover for our small town.
> Full time:
> We have two guys from Dallas that run a Gallery/B&B
> A woman from Sweden via California that has Jewelry store and soon rental units
> A family from St Paul MN that has boutique and bake goods
> A painter that came from Santa Fe area but that not where from
> A web designer that not sure of home base
> A couple from San Antonio area where she is from Lubbock and he from eastern TN
> A guy from Arkansas
> A couple from Dallas
> A woman from CA
> A woman from NM via FL and Santa Fe
> A woman from Houston
> A couple from Houston
> Another couple from Houston that have boutique hotel, clothing jewelry store and soon a SPA
> Woman from England via CA
> We are from NC, my wife is from Durham, I was born in St. Louis but have moved 30+ times
> Part Time with property/houses:
> Couple from Kansas City
> Woman from NYC
> Family from FL
> Couple from WI
> Couple from NM
> Family from IL
> Four women from Houston
> Two women from Asheville NC
> Woman from Arkansas
> Couple from VA
> Woman from CA
> More but not sure of residence
> All in all, we are a pretty eclectic bunch but that makes for very interesting get togethers.


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## conklinwh

Town is Mineral de Pozos which is a mining town about 7500ft up in the Sierra Gordas that was one of the richest towns in Mexico in 1910 but almost disappeared after the Cristeros war. It has the ruins of some 300 mines and 50-70K people with a present population of about 4000.


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## expat1111

*Love Pozos*

Stopped in Pozos to visit a friend who lives there, I stayed with them a couple of days and then at the small hotel right downtown, i can not remember the name but really enjoyed it. Did the art walk and met the locals which were wonderful. I almost bought a place there but knew I had to be by the ocean. Look forward to visiting again. Great memories and a great town in Mexico







conklinwh said:


> 1st, yahoo must have a great sense of humor. We get into the 80's in the hottest month which is May and this year early June till the summer weather rolled in. We have been high in the 70's with occasional 60's and low of low 60/high 50 for over a week and that the 5 day. We have had a couple good rains and some sprinkles and is starting to green up but we need more based on my discussion with the farmers. Problem with getting weather forecast for Pozos is that everything really extrapolated to San Luis de la Paz(5 miles away) and then to Pozos so all over the lot.
> I actually left out some 1/2 dozen people. Yes, we have a few rentals. Pozos is on the bus route between San Jose Iturbide(about 18mi) and San Luis de la Paz. Modest people that don't want to drive take buses from San Luis. San Luis now has two large supermarkets(Chedraui & Aurera Bodega) but there are a lot of local markets to get fresh stuff.


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## ptrichmondmike

You may be onto something about Yahoo. I have a friend up here who has been trying to interest me in retiring to Alamos, over in Sonora. So last year I tracked the daily weather on Yahoo. Every single day between May and October, it claimed the daytime temp was between 92 and 107, dropping into the 80s at night -- so naturally I eliminated Alamos as a possibility. Now I'm thinking maybe Yahoo was incorrect? NO! Who can you believe anymore? Anyway, the climate you describe is MUCH more doable.

Found your informative article "Mineral de Pozos: Magical Tranquility" on the Our Mexico site, and also Bill Lieberman's site. Yes, I am intrigued. I'll be researching...



conklinwh said:


> 1st, yahoo must have a great sense of humor. We get into the 80's in the hottest month which is May and this year early June till the summer weather rolled in.


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## conklinwh

Couple things:
-Expat1111-Not sure whom your friend is but depending on when it could have been Casa Montana, Casa Mexicana or Posado de las Minas as on or within block of Jardin Principal. Casa Montana has now been replaced by El Secreto.
-Mike, the issue with Pozos may be the name as since means wells, there are lots of towns with Pozos in the name. Best for us is to look up San Luis de la Paz and then drop a few degrees. Even then, the weather station could be Queretaro or the Leon/Guanajuato airport where extrapolating to San Luis.
-If you have interest in visiting, this Saturday has two gallery openings 1-5 including one juried exhibit. Also, Pozos has it's Summer Mine Tour 9 July where we will be touring two complexes. One of them is typical of the 1870s/1880s and the other is representative of Pozos highpoint of 1890-1910. Tour starts downtown at 11AM for 100p. There is bus from San Miguel that leaves at 10AM for 150p round trip.
See you in Pozos!


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## Salto_jorge

USA: Rocky Mountains / Foot Hills Ecosystem

Mexico: MgDeKino - Family
Mexico: Guadalajara - University Town and near Employers Local Office


Both of these locations are on the warm side for me.
I can take the 90-100 degree temps for about two weeks.

I found some excellent places in the mountains of Durango, but the current danger level is very high.

Some like it warm, some like it cool !
Sonora is just as warm as Arizona, its neighbor to the north.


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## expat1111

*Pozos*

The town I am speaking of is Mineral de Pozos, Our friends are Alex and Roxanne and they have a ranch just above the town. They are from Texas and the hotel was Casa Montana and the owner was Susan. It was December 2006 and then Back again at the end of January. We had a wonderful time there. We picked up a great book about the history of that area by writer and photographer David Spear. We hope to get back again for a visit. Thanks for the info. 




conklinwh said:


> Couple things:
> -Expat1111-Not sure whom your friend is but depending on when it could have been Casa Montana, Casa Mexicana or Posado de las Minas as on or within block of Jardin Principal. Casa Montana has now been replaced by El Secreto.
> -Mike, the issue with Pozos may be the name as since means wells, there are lots of towns with Pozos in the name. Best for us is to look up San Luis de la Paz and then drop a few degrees. Even then, the weather station could be Queretaro or the Leon/Guanajuato airport where extrapolating to San Luis.
> -If you have interest in visiting, this Saturday has two gallery openings 1-5 including one juried exhibit. Also, Pozos has it's Summer Mine Tour 9 July where we will be touring two complexes. One of them is typical of the 1870s/1880s and the other is representative of Pozos highpoint of 1890-1910. Tour starts downtown at 11AM for 100p. There is bus from San Miguel that leaves at 10AM for 150p round trip.
> See you in Pozos!


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## conklinwh

That's the place! Roxanne & Alex are friends as is Susan. Susan has sold her hotel and spends half year in Zihua and half in Pozos.
We live on the other side of town on the old mine road. Expect that we will see Roxanne/Alex this weekend as their neighbor, Susan;'s cousin, is having holiday party.


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## expat1111

*Roxanne and Alex*

Tell them that Dave and Lori say hello from Puerto Vallarta, we stayed at their ranch Christmas of 2006 and went back with my Aunt and uncle "Clinton" a jazz singer that Alex had a blast singing with. I really love those guys although we have not spoken in a while. We all get wrapped up in our lives. Send our love to them and Susan.
Nice to meet you and hopefully we will get there sometome in the no so distant future. Small world.


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## conklinwh

Talked with Alex last night and he certainly remembered and said to give you his best as well. Since you know Alex, you won't be surprised that he is starting a few more businesses.
You' all come see us!


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## ajijicartist

*where to live in Mexico*



ptrichmondmike said:


> Something I've been wondering about is whether Americans from different parts of the U.S. tend to cluster in specific Mexican locations. For example, do people from the West Coast (all "blue states") group in some towns, while folks from the South and Midwest (the "red states") choose to live elsewhere? Looking at another angle, do the artsy culture vultures live elsewhere than the beer and RV crowd? (Not that one can't be both, lol...)


My husband and I have been living in Ajijic for 6 years having come here from N. California. For the past few years we have been doing a lot of traveling around Mexico. Although I love living in Ajijic where there are many many democrats and the majority of the Americans are quite liberal there are other places we love. Mainly San Cristobal holds my heart, but there are negatives to consider. The weather is not great, quite cold in October to February. Consider that the houses have no heating systems other than a fireplace and therefore are very cold. The summer has a heavy and long rainy season with little sun. Another rather large negative are the lack of native English speakers. It is hard to get the exact number, but most estimate less than 200. There is not much of a social community in English and therefore not amenities like theatre in English. Your Spanish better be good to live there or you need to be a loner type. For now we just spend 2-3 months there a year.

Although I love Patzcuaro I would never consider it now. The drug situation in the state of Michoacan is very scary. We were driving near Patzcuaro in December and we were stopped by the narcos who wanted to burn our car. They shot m16's over our car to get out attention. They got it. Then for some reason unknown to us they let us go although we couldn't go far since the roads were full of burning cars. We had to find a hotel for the night. The US consulate sends out Warden's messages tell you to stay out of Michoacan.

San Miguel is nice, but also quite chilly in the winter since it is so high. I could live there for many reasons. For now though we are quite happy in Chapala(Ajijic) as a home base where we have a life full of friends and good weather. Despite the scare in December I am sure we will continue to drive around Mexico and exploe


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## DNP

ajijicartist said:


> My husband and I have been living in Ajijic for 6 years having come here from N. California. For the past few years we have been doing a lot of traveling around Mexico. Although I love living in Ajijic where there are many many democrats and the majority of the Americans are quite liberal there are other places we love. Mainly San Cristobal holds my heart, but there are negatives to consider. The weather is not great, quite cold in October to February. Consider that the houses have no heating systems other than a fireplace and therefore are very cold. The summer has a heavy and long rainy season with little sun. Another rather large negative are the lack of native English speakers. It is hard to get the exact number, but most estimate less than 200. There is not much of a social community in English and therefore not amenities like theatre in English. Your Spanish better be good to live there or you need to be a loner type. For now we just spend 2-3 months there a year.
> 
> Although I love Patzcuaro I would never consider it now. The drug situation in the state of Michoacan is very scary. We were driving near Patzcuaro in December and we were stopped by the narcos who wanted to burn our car. They shot m16's over our car to get out attention. They got it. Then for some reason unknown to us they let us go although we couldn't go far since the roads were full of burning cars. We had to find a hotel for the night. The US consulate sends out Warden's messages tell you to stay out of Michoacan.
> 
> San Miguel is nice, but also quite chilly in the winter since it is so high. I could live there for many reasons. For now though we are quite happy in Chapala(Ajijic) as a home base where we have a life full of friends and good weather. Despite the scare in December I am sure we will continue to drive around Mexico and exploe


Which 2-3 months do you spend in San Cristobal? Thanks.


----------



## ajijicartist

DNP said:


> Which 2-3 months do you spend in San Cristobal? Thanks.


We have been going in the fall, but since October has been so cold we are going to try going next spring.


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## Mexstan

Permanently in Queretaro for 10 years now. Used to live in Ajijic which is OK(if you like gringos ), but prefer it here.


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## conklinwh

Are you in centro, Jurica, Juriquilla or other?


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## Guest

Hello! Are you still interested in Taxco? My husband, children and I just moved here five months ago. SS is our only income as well so we could give you information on cost of living etc. We love it here. We aren't into the silver market but surprisingly that has little effect on everyday life. Our neighbors are fantastic and the area is beautiful. We live just outside of town in the trees and mountains. yet we can still walk to town! It's a great place to live but as far as I know it does not have an expat community. We haven't met any gringos in the five months we've lived here. All of our friends are Mexican and we really enjoy it that way. In your bio you mentioned that cooking is an interest of yours. It is a passion for me and that has been a source of a bit of frustration. It's difficult finding a wide variety of ingrediants. I'm sure in Cuernavaca (way too large of a city for us) I could find anything I need for my mole sauces etc but here in Taxco it is limited. It's also frustrating because I have made my own whole wheat bread for years, which is now impossible with the summer wheat (no vital wheat gluten ANYWHERE) in Mexico. I still make half whole wheat and half white but it is crumbly and lacks the softness that a higher glutten bread would have. On the whole, finding the ingrediants to do the level of cooking that I enjoy doing, has been basically the only frustration that we've had. Of course we've dealt with our share of little things but of course moving to another culture that is to be expected. All in all though we love the small town colonial feel of Taxco. If you move to Taxco all you have to do is ignore the tourists and you'll really enjoy the life of the local people. Let us know if you have any further questions. 
Blessings
Rachel and Gary


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## Hound Dog

ajijicartist said:


> We have been going in the fall, but since October has been so cold we are going to try going next spring.


Sometimes it gets warm between mid March and mid May but nothing is ever for sure down there. Two years ago we had some nice warm weather, this year was cold and rainy. It rained so much on Easter that the processon had to stop as they could not walk the streets once they got to Santo Domingo in El Cerrillo.
We live there from December to May but the cold weather does not bother us as we have heaters in the house. The locals live in frigid houses and very few of them have fireplaces.
There is a large variety of nationalities among the expat population but there is also a large turn over of expats. 
I know people from California, the Midwest and the South as well as people from Australia, New Zealand, Israel, France Germany, Italy and Canada.
There are not many retirees. Many expats are teachers, Human Right Observers, missionaries, anthropologists, artists, and so on. 
The expat population is younger than in Ajijic as a rule and many of the young people are married to Mexicans.
Some of the Anglo expats can be met at Los Amigos de San Cristobal charity events but they are very few full time American or Canadian expats down there.

If you do not speak Spanish it could be very lonely.


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## MJB5293

TundraGreen said:


> Interesting question. Where are you in Mexico? I will start a response.
> Single arrow (->) means full time in Mexico.
> Double arrow (<->) means time split between US and Mexico.
> 
> San Francisco -> Guadalajara


columbus ohio ->juriqulla queretaro


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## FHBOY

*This Is Great!*

I see from many responses that ****** diversity is more dependent on life style than the political and social factors we think of in the US. My happiest day will also be when I can see Maryland in my rear view, or from 15,000 feet. lane:

We, being originally from La Gran Manzana, with artsy, hippie roots and a love of things cultural, being spoiled by living in the suburbs of other big cities and, having moved many times in our 38 year relationship, are all about finding a small community that we can be part of, where people are friendly and that is still not too far away from cultural stuff we grew up with.

Based on those factors and wanting not to have to shovel snow or swelter in 90+ degree, 60+% humidity we have chose Ajijic to live in, The proximity to GDL is another factor, but the main reason is the social aspect. It appears everyone lives within 20 minutes of each other, the demographic (we're early 60's) is good and the prices for housing is not too bad. While we realize the ligua franca can be English, we both want to learn Spanish so we can travel out of Ajijic, and visit the places y'all are writing about. 

Actually, after stalking blogs, :ranger: using my computer to "talk" to people, I will be glad to be able to sit down next to a live person who may not share my views and have a civilized discussion...I so miss that.

So, for what it's worth, that is my ****** Destination. I am looking forward to meeting RV when get there, and hope that people there think a lot like me.


----------



## El Toro Furioso

We live 8 months a year on the Tenacatita Bay 200 km south of Puerto Vallarta in La Manzanilla del Mar, a small fishing village. For those 8 months it is paradise. We live the other 4 months a year on Lake Chapala in San Antonio Tlayacapan. The rain is coming down amidst rayos y truenos (lightning and thunder) as I write this. It is delightfully cool and the air is crisp. Tomorrow morning it will probably be sunny and the humidity will once again be comfortably low. I will venture out to my rain gauge in the back lawn and check out the night's bounty. Why would anyone try to get judgemental about any of these beautiful and paradisacal locations?


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## conklinwh

Maybe it is just me but I find the following extraction an interesting juxtaposition of thought.
One of the things that I really like about being an "expat" is meeting interesting people.
This was especially true in Asia but not as much as I would like in Mexico. It is interesting to me that so many people have come to Mexico to "get away" from perceived oppression and other injustices in the US but rather than have an open mind in discussions, by the way two of my favorite discussions are religion and politics, they bring everything with them and basically search out like views. Go figure!

"Actually, after stalking blogs, using my computer to "talk" to people, I will be glad to be able to sit down next to a live person who may not share my views and have a civilized discussion...I so miss that.

So, for what it's worth, that is my ****** Destination. I am looking forward to meeting RV when get there, and hope that people there think a lot like me."


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## FHBOY

By "a lot like me" I was not speaking of a particular political, social, etc POV, rather I was speaking about having people to have civilized discussions with. Truly, live people, to have coffee or a drink with, and respectfully agree or disagree, and then to see them tomorrow and say "hi!". That is what I was speaking about.


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## conklinwh

OK! Sorry about that. To say the least, you hit a sore point. Wish you the best and hope that differences of view not a problem as there are some seriously biased folk here!


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## FHBOY

Conklinwish:
No problem.  I think that maybe I am being too Mary Poppins to think that I will like everyone I meet no matter where I go. It is just that the US has gotten so polarized that discussion, the art of discussion, seems to have disappeared. 

Do I think I will like everyone I meet when I move? Of course not. Will some people be so not open to discussion that I will not try to speak with them? Of course there will be. But, as posted earlier, when we all have gotten our basic needs under control, have less pressure from factors we can't control, am out of the 24/7 stream of partisanship in the media, perhaps we can go back to the days when we talked to each other, and more importantly listened to each other with respect, because, when we were young, our talk did not always mean as much, and now that we've chosen to retire and have found the peace we are looking for, we do not have to convince everyone around us that we are right and they are wrong, because in the end, what we discuss about the US or Canada in Mexico, we will not affect it and our self chosen insulation of ex-patriothood gives us a luxury those still living in NOB do not have. [a very long run-on sentence - sorry.]


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## theladygeorge

FHBOY said:


> I see from many responses that ****** diversity is more dependent on life style than the political and social factors we think of in the US. My happiest day will also be when I can see Maryland in my rear view, or from 15,000 feet. lane:
> 
> We, being originally from La Gran Manzana, with artsy, hippie roots and a love of things cultural, being spoiled by living in the suburbs of other big cities and, having moved many times in our 38 year relationship, are all about finding a small community that we can be part of, where people are friendly and that is still not too far away from cultural stuff we grew up with.
> 
> Based on those factors and wanting not to have to shovel snow or swelter in 90+ degree, 60+% humidity we have chose Ajijic to live in, The proximity to GDL is another factor, but the main reason is the social aspect. It appears everyone lives within 20 minutes of each other, the demographic (we're early 60's) is good and the prices for housing is not too bad. While we realize the ligua franca can be English, we both want to learn Spanish so we can travel out of Ajijic, and visit the places y'all are writing about.
> 
> Actually, after stalking blogs, :ranger: using my computer to "talk" to people, I will be glad to be able to sit down next to a live person who may not share my views and have a civilized discussion...I so miss that.
> 
> So, for what it's worth, that is my ****** Destination. I am looking forward to meeting RV when get there, and hope that people there think a lot like me.


We seem to have very simiular interest (You got me at 'hippie', artsy & seeing the US city in my rearview) and I hope to meet you and many others I've 'talked to' in person so we can throw back a couple, watch the sunset and do whatever our hearts desire ............ahh yes :clap2:


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## casamaya

*Expat enclaves*



ptrichmondmike said:


> Something I've been wondering about is whether Americans from different parts of the U.S. tend to cluster in specific Mexican locations. For example, do people from the West Coast (all "blue states") group in some towns, while folks from the South and Midwest (the "red states") choose to live elsewhere? Looking at another angle, do the artsy culture vultures live elsewhere than the beer and RV crowd? (Not that one can't be both, lol...)



Hi, I've found there are a lot of Canadians almost everywhere. And a lot of Californians
on west coast and Baja. We're in Puerto Morelos, Quintana Roo, (now Riviera Maya) and there
are a lot of people from Minnesota, Pennsylvania, New York. Think the coasts tend to
gravitate often to the closest spot from where they are up north. jk


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## travelinhobo

*Huh??*

Strange. I lived in DF for almost 2 years and didn't see many foreigners. DF does not have any considerable foreign quantity, nor tourists. Yeah, a few in the center, and hanging out in Rosa, but for a city of 20 million, there was nothing. I think that one city block called "Chinatown" can attest to that. 

In DF we have it all, and THEN some. People from all over the world live here. I see all types of Americans and Canadians when out and about. I think the majority of American expats live in DF. I know the US govt put that statistical info out there somewhere...


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## RVGRINGO

Actually, the majority of American and Canadian expats, at least the retired ones, live around Lake Chapala.


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## maryellen1952

Interestingly, most of the Americans I've met since living in Tijuana for the past 9 months seem to have a common characteristic...they are on some form of government assistance such as SS, SSI, California welfare, unemployment, etc. and are not faring much better here than the U.S. Most don't own an automobile and don't seem to be interested in going across the border to San Diego to work. Our 2 apartment buildings comprise the majority of the above mentioned. Funny but the Mexican nationals who live in our buildings all have jobs either in TJ or the U.S. and they have vehicles. It seems that this group of people (many Afro-Americans) settle in TJ and can't go farther south due to economics. And they don't speak any Spanish and use the convenience stores rather than going to regular grocery stores just as they do in the U.S. As the U.S. economy continues in a downward spiral I think you will see more  of these Americans "forced" to move across the border.


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## cesar&jody

Flora Loveday said:


> As for Canadians in Mexico, I would be curious to know more about how many and where they are.




I am fulltime in San Jose del Cabo in BCS and I am origionally from Saskatchewan and im 26years old. In Cabo San Lucas, there are more americans, while in San jose del cabo, its more retired canadians. However, in the area i live in, its only locals, i am the only non mexican and its really refreshing! In fact, all im hearing at this moment, 9:40 am on tuesday and all im hearing is the caligas truck with its silly theme song on the loud speaker driving by! Its a nice sound!


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## abscissa

Merritt, BC <-> San Crisanto, Yucatan 6 and 6

It's a small fishing village and summer vacation town for the Merida mexicans ... around 20 expats from fall to spring and maybe 200 fultime mexicans.. summer month .. acouple of thousand mexicans.
Pretty well split between yanks and canucks on the expats and it's a mix of all east west north south. I find the yanks more tolerant (easier going) than those I know in the US .. but I guess Mexico does that to all of us.


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## conklinwh

RV ******, if the number I've seen on this site of 20K for Lake Chapala, 12K by the way for San Miguel, is true, that a small part of the 1M part/full time expats that I also see quoted this site.


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## RVGRINGO

True, but the rest are scattered about. Here, we have the greatest concentration in any one place in the world. Heck, we even have an American Legion and a Canadian Legion has just been announced. Of course, that concentration has both good and bad attributes.


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## JeffS

The Yucatan has both Canadians and American expats yet not overrun by them. Great weather and culture. Check out Yucatan-Life dot com.


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## JoParsons

All over US -> Uruapan (will be) Western Central Highlands Few expats but lots of stuff going on.


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## conklinwh

After 4 years in San Miguel, I found that 12K was about 11K too many. Not sure that I could start to deal with 20K. I vote for scattered about!


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## PinkChili2

From Vancouver Island, BC, Canada...currently living in Puebla, Puebla, BUT, it is just my home base while I studied spanish and now while I travel around looking for where I will eventually live.

I love Puebla, but the altitude does not agree with me.


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## TundraGreen

conklinwh said:


> After 4 years in San Miguel, I found that 12K was about 11K too many. Not sure that I could start to deal with 20K. I vote for scattered about!


I am with you on that. 

I have no idea how many expats there are in Guadalajara, but with 5 million locals, the only non-Mexicans I see are the young Europeans and Asians in my Spanish class.


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## Mexicodrifter

I live outside of D.F. but one would not know it. From the center of D.F. to my house is nearly 28 kilometros on the way to Puebla and every klick is covered with business and homes. I can drive to Puebla centro faster than I can drive to D.F. centro. This is just fact not a complaint- I hardly go to centro. 
I am the only U.S.A. citizen living in Ixpataluca, that I know of. I have never seen or met another USA person. I hear that all the americans live on the west side of D.F. in Coyocan or Zona Rosa.
I never get over there to meet anyone.
Mexico City area is not an easy place to live. The locals are all busy working and chasing a peso so that they can live. Can´t blame them for that. I used to do the same in the states when I worked for a living. But it also makes finding friends harder. I have run across a couple of guys with simialar I find interest as mine so life gets better. I find that being married to Mexican citizen makes life a lot more ¨Facil¨easy. If I had to choose where to live, I would live in one of the outer states like Queretaro, Morelos, or Michoacán, I lived in Zihuatqnejo for 5 years before coming to D.F. to be with my wife. The only reason I live in the valley of Mexico City is to be with her. 
I loved my time in Zihuatanejo. It is a smaller, tranquil town of about 125,000 with an influx of Americans and Canadians for the winter months for the great climate. Not a lot of cultural events but enough to keep from being bored.
Living in Mexico is not fer everyone but for those that like it there is no place better to be.


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## JeffS

Check out the Yucatan! There is a fairly large expat community and Yucatecos love interacting with you! They are very open and accepting. Check out Yucatan dash Life dot com for useful info on living in the Yucatan.


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## conklinwh

The Yucatan is a great place to visit but we can't take the heat & humidity. Don't see how to get away from it easily short of Chiapas highlands.
Better for us to live in the highlands and to visit one of the many great beaches.


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## Secutor

*800,000 US Expats in Mexico*

Three years ago an organization I was affiliated with commissioned a study of the number of US expats in Mexico. They came up with 800,000. This includes retirees, busness people, and any others. I think this is probably the best number available although it included a lot of guesswork.

I live in Ajijic on Lake Chapala. The estimates I've heard for the local expat population center around 6000 including Americans and Canadians (and, of course, some others). I believe the greatest number is Canadian although it depends on what time of year you're talking about. We have sunbirds in summer and snowbirds in winter that greatly change the number of expats here.


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## conklinwh

I don't doubt your 800K+/- total expat population but would be very surprised if the 6K is even close. The published figures that the mayor of San Miguel uses is 12K for San Miguel and would think that the Lake Chapala area somewhere around 50% higher. Be that as it may, San Miguel & Lake Chapala together are some 18-32K out of 800K so a lot of people(770-780K) "scattered about". Which I think gets to the basic point, namely that a lot of wonderful places to live in Mexico that offer almost an unlimited set of differing opportunities that expats customize to fit their goals. Not surprising that when the basic question "Where do I live in Mexico" comes up that so many different opinions appear.
Critical is that wonderful really in the eye of the beholder and that nobody should precommit before actually living in one or more places for an extended period of time.


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## La Osita

(->) Village of El Sauz near Tequisquiapan, Queretaro from North Carolina. 

Very few expats (I'm guessing only a handful as I have only crossed paths with two expats in six months. Tequisquiapan is a lovely historical town... mountains, river, agricultural and vineyards. Only 35-40 minute drive to the capital city of Queretaro and 25 minutes to the international airport. 

Only down side I've experienced is the bit of pollution we deal with from the nearby city of San Juan Del Rio (Kimberly Clark, Walmart, CocaCola and unfortunately other US and international corporations).


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## RPBHaas

-> Dallas, Texas to southern Jalisco. Currently Autlan de Navarro


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## PieGrande

Some years ago, I read a book which talked about Mexico City in the 50's, and the word lonche for lunch was used. So this is not new at all.

I can tell you why many Mexicans do not retire back to their Mexican homes. I have many women friends, and cooking and such things tend to be from scratch. Women in Mexico have to work much harder, even retired women, and you can be sure most Mexican men do not expect to cook nor wash clothes. So, women tend to try to avoid returning to live in Mexico. This is not my opinion, it is what women tell me.

As soon as one mentions Guadalajara, most people move on to Chapala or Ajijic. Those are not bad choices, of course. But, when we went to GDL to see if we wanted to live there, over ten years ago, we looked at ordinary middle class areas in the city. At that time, you could still buy a two bedroom Mexican style house, nice, for around $30,000 USD. In good, quiet neighborhoods. Public transport, little food stores and markets within walking distance. I have no idea of current prices, of course.

If I had ended up in GDL, I would have lived in one of those neighborhoods, or even in one of the small 'native' villages outside the city. As many have stated, there are as many options as people. In my Third World village, I am the only expat in a 750 square mile area, and I like it like that, except it would be nice if the couple who limit my turf to 750 would move, heh, heh.


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## TundraGreen

PieGrande said:


> ... As soon as one mentions Guadalajara, most people move on to Chapala or Ajijic. Those are not bad choices, of course. But, when we went to GDL to see if we wanted to live there, over ten years ago, we looked at ordinary middle class areas in the city. At that time, you could still buy a two bedroom Mexican style house, nice, for around $30,000 USD. In good, quiet neighborhoods. Public transport, little food stores and markets within walking distance. I have no idea of current prices, of course. ...


When I was looking for a house about 2 years ago, the price for a house of that description (2 bdrm, public transit, markets, shopping in walking distance) was around $80,000 usd in Guadalajara Centro. Probably it would be less in other neighborhoods. In some of the new fraccionamientos you can get a 2 bdrm for the equivalent of about $15,000. But it won't be in walking distance to anything.


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## ensenadafan

We are organizing a mega mixer for expats from any nation on March 15, 2012, in Ensenada, Baja California. There is no charge and will be held at the Riviera del Pacifico social center. It is meant to be an event that orients residents to what the comunity has to offer, answer questions on who to see for help on living, social life, clubs, etc. Please respond to RVSP.


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## PieGrande

TundraGreen said:


> When I was looking for a house about 2 years ago, the price for a house of that description (2 bdrm, public transit, markets, shopping in walking distance) was around $80,000 usd in Guadalajara Centro. Probably it would be less in other neighborhoods. In some of the new fraccionamientos you can get a 2 bdrm for the equivalent of about $15,000. But it won't be in walking distance to anything.


Absolutely the price I gave for ten years ago was a bus/kombi ride out. It was not near the centro, and neither my wife nor I would have wanted to live near the centro. I forget which sector it was, a taxi driver took us out on a day price, and we paid extra to see Chapala and Ajijic. He took us to his personal favorite part of the city, and we liked it. It was an ordinary Mexican neighborhood with ordinary houses as Mexicans themselves live in, far different from the Chapala neighborhood he showed us.

The shopping within walking distance in that area would have been the typical small food markets and small stores, not the big stores.

Places to live are definitely a personal judgement. I am the only North American (not counting unknown kids who were born in the US) in a 750 square mile area, and I know who the couple is, just outside the area. So, where I am as happy as a bug in a rug, few NA would want to live.

Another poster made it clear he liked SM so well he believes it is a disservice to even suggest any other place. Personal preference which is as it should be.


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## TundraGreen

PieGrande said:


> Places to live are definitely a personal judgement. I am the only North American (not counting unknown kids who were born in the US) in a 750 square mile area, and I know who the couple is, just outside the area. So, where I am as happy as a bug in a rug, few NA would want to live.


Just to nitpick... Mexico is part of North America. 
I am also "happy as a bug in rug" where I live. I never see any non-Mexicans in my neighborhood. It is not 750 sq miles in area, but it might contain as many people as your 750 sq mile area does.


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## johnmex

My gated community doesn't have any other Americans, although we have a Canadian and we had an Italian.


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## PieGrande

This thing on North America is very common on boards. Ask an educated Mexican if he is North American and he will tell you, no, he is not. He is Mexican. Some are even offended. Been there; done that.

The term North America as usually used is a term of geographers. They as most occupations develop their own language and terms. Each nation makes its own political decision what to call itself.

Mexicans use the term norte americano to describe people from the USA and Canada. I guarantee you a high percentage of Mexicans I know are very offended if someone calls them Central Americans, based on the geographers' terms.

Also, at times, people insist we should not call ourselves Americans because from the Bering Strait to Tierre del Fuego is all America. Same issue. But in the end, only the USA has the word America in its official name.

It all goes back to confusing geographer names with self-chosen political names.

You are right about low population. I estimate there are only 20,000 people in that 750 square miles. Nice!


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## TundraGreen

PieGrande said:


> ... You are right about low population. I estimate there are only 20,000 people in that 750 square miles. Nice!


I won't argue with you about the confusing use of "America" and "North America".

About population...
According to wikipedia, the population density in Guadalajara itself (the municipio, not the metropolitan area) is around 8,000/sq km. By my calculation that means 1 square mile will have about the same number of people, 20,000, as your 750 square miles.


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## theladygeorge

PieGrande said:


> This thing on North America is very common on boards. Ask an educated Mexican if he is North American and he will tell you, no, he is not. He is Mexican. Some are even offended. Been there; done that.
> 
> The term North America as usually used is a term of geographers. They as most occupations develop their own language and terms. Each nation makes its own political decision what to call itself.
> 
> Mexicans use the term norte americano to describe people from the USA and Canada. I guarantee you a high percentage of Mexicans I know are very offended if someone calls them Central Americans, based on the geographers' terms.Also, at times, people insist we should not call ourselves Americans because from the Bering Strait to Tierre del Fuego is all America. Same issue. But in the end, only the USA has the word America in its official name.
> 
> It all goes back to confusing geographer names with self-chosen political names.
> 
> You are right about low population. I estimate there are only 20,000 people in that 750 square miles. Nice!


Agree! We (I am Latina) love our nick names of each country and do not like being 'confused' with each other. Which of course is too much ask of others that are not Latino and could be frustrating for people who do not mean any harm.


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## FHBOY

PieGrande said:


> This thing on North America is very common on boards. ...I estimate there are only 20,000 people in that 750 square miles. Nice!


Quoth the Bard: A rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

Yep, for as long as there has been a USA, we have called ourselves "real Americans", it is a convention of chauvinism that disturbs and causes us not small amount of grief. Heck, I went to the Museum of the American Indian in DC, and their definition of American Indians includes peoples from Tierra del Fuego to the Alaskan/Canadian northern border - they got it right!


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## PieGrande

>>for as long as there has been a USA, we have called ourselves "real Americans", 

And, so we should. "United States of America." The only nation in the world with the word America in it, as far as I can tell.

However, I do not dispute that a high percentage of Americans (people from the US of America) are very nationalistic and think there be dragons... Which is a different matter from our chosen political name.

There is a good reason for the expression Ugly American and it has nothing to do with the chosen political name of the USA. I remember before my mother died, she was furious when I told her I planned to retire and live in Mexico. But, that was calm compared to her reaction when I told her I did not expect to have my body brought back to the States after I died.

When a person is living some place he does not want to be buried, I think he needs to re-think his reasons for living there. That is my opinion, and obviously there are people who have some personal reason they want their body moved after death. My best friend in the States says he thinks everyone should be buried in his native town with his ancestors no matter where he has lived. I want to be buried near my loved ones, and there are so many of them in this village.


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## theladygeorge

PieGrande said:


> >>for as long as there has been a USA, we have called ourselves "real Americans",
> 
> And, so we should. "United States of America." The only nation in the world with the word America in it, as far as I can tell.
> 
> However, I do not dispute that a high percentage of Americans (people from the US of America) are very nationalistic and think there be dragons... Which is a different matter from our chosen political name.
> 
> There is a good reason for the expression Ugly American and it has nothing to do with the chosen political name of the USA. I remember before my mother died, she was furious when I told her I planned to retire and live in Mexico. But, that was calm compared to her reaction when I told her I did not expect to have my body brought back to the States after I died.
> 
> When a person is living some place he does not want to be buried, I think he needs to re-think his reasons for living there. That is my opinion, and obviously there are people who have some personal reason they want their body moved after death. My best friend in the States says he thinks everyone should be buried in his native town with his ancestors no matter where he has lived. I want to be buried near my loved ones, and there are so many of them in this village.


It is an interesting decision to make where you want your remains to go. I am a baby boomer from San Francisco but have not lived there for 20+ yrs. yet my wish is to toss my ashes in the San Francisco bay. That's where I call 'home'. Sad I can not live there for my retirment... too expensive. Oh well Chapala is beautiful and quirky too. God said there would many places that are beautiful. :whoo:


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## FHBOY

theladygeorge said:


> It is an interesting decision to make where you want your remains to go.... God said there would many places that are beautiful. :whoo:


I was born and raised in NYC, but have not lived there since 1978 (I'm a boomer also) - my parents and my maternal grandparents are interred there. Even tho I have lived in many other cities, most recently 20 years in Baltimore, it is my stated desire in my will to be interred in the came cemetery as my family. So your notion is correct. It does not mean Baltimore or Mexico is/will not be my home, and, really, why should I care where my bones rot, I'll be dead. 

Thinking about and doing Living is much more important than thinking about Death.

Great Morbid Thoughts for a Thursday.


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## Isla Verde

FHBOY said:


> Great Morbid Thoughts for a Thursday.


Thanks for getting my day off to a great start!


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## RVGRINGO

I've already got my 'burning permit' and will just go up in smoke, adding a tiny bit to the smog over Guadalajara.


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## kcowan

My smoke will be over the bay in PV. But where to spread the ashes is another story yet to be told. My brother had his urn buried with our parents in a cemetary north of Toronto.


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## FHBOY

kcowan said:


> My smoke will be over the bay in PV. But where to spread the ashes is another story yet to be told. My brother had his urn buried with our parents in a cemetary north of Toronto.


OY! - another problem! Just recycle it, it will make a lovely planter!


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## Mr Wahoo

*DF*



ptrichmondmike said:


> I'm still in the US -- but my choices will be SMA/Guanajuato, Oaxaca, Patzcuaro. I wouldn't consider Baja, Chapala, a major city like DF, Puebla or Guadalajara, or anywhere tropical. Wish I knew more about places like Taxco, San Cristobal de las Casas. I'm curious as to whether you will find more Californians in one, and more Texans (let's say) in another. Do Floridians cluster in Yucatan? (I know Baja has many thousands of Californians.)


Pardon me for my stupidity. But what does DF stand for?


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## Isla Verde

Mr Wahoo said:


> Pardon me for my stupidity. But what does DF stand for?


It's short for *D*istrito *F*ederal, the capital of the country.


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## Mr Wahoo

*DF*



Isla Verde said:


> It's short for *D*istrito *F*ederal, the capital of the country.


Thank You, Verde.


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## PieGrande

In actual use among the people I know, and I am well aware local usage varies around Mexico, the names used for the Valley of Mexico are interesting.

Technically, the Federal District is part of the State of Mexico. If you take a taxi out of the Federal District, the charge doubles at the line, because they have to go back empty.

Yet, people refer informally to the entire valley as Mexico City (Cd, de Mexico). And, sometimes as DF, even though this is not correct legally.

And, in many cases, they simply say Mexico, which takes some getting used to.

This is another example of a difference between actual usage, and technically correct usage.


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## Isla Verde

Mr Wahoo said:


> Thank You, Verde.


Actually, my friends call me Isla  .


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## bougainvillea

ptrichmondmike said:


> Quito, no...Cuenca, yes. But Mexico has better food from my POV. For me, Chapala is too much like still being in California, and perhaps SMA as well. I think I'd prefer a place with a smaller expat population -- which will probably also be cheaper?
> 
> Who knows Taxco? Never been there, but it sure looks gorgeous in the photos.


Taxco IS gorgeous. You will probably find a smaller proportion of expats there than the other towns that you have mentioned, but it is undeniably gorgeous. I am considering Taxco myself when I retire in Mexico in December or 2012. Fabulous climate, beautiful beyond words, though quite small......you will not find the cultural activities there that you would find in San Miguel or Cuernavaca. And finding a place to live could be more difficult. Google "real estate in Taxco" or "rentals in Taxco" to get an idea. 

I've been all over Mexico and have never found that there's any particular concentration of people from any given states in any given location, except for retirees across the border from San Diego. Cabo San Lucas and San Jose del Cabo are the whole point of Baja.......but it IS about the ocean, fishing, surfing and the beach. Yes, it is Americanized to a certain degree.....you can even pay for things in dollars. But it's very much Mexico. Todos Santos is a great little town about an hour up the beach from Cabo San Lucas and is said to be the "new Santa Fe," i.e.....an artists' enclave. It's tiny, but quite charming.


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## bougainvillea

What is most interesting about this whole discussion is that EVERYONE feels compelled to put in their two cents worth on where they planned to be buried. Or burned up, or whatever. It's a weird but universal preoccupation, for some reason. Guess what, you won't care. You'll be dead. Funerals are for the living, so if you want to do something special for your family....get your bones shipped someplace where they can all come and give you a great party, which is what funerals are about. If not, plant yourself in a place you love.


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## 146028

PieGrande said:


> This thing on North America is very common on boards. *Ask an educated Mexican if he is North American and he will tell you, no, he is not.* He is Mexican. Some are even offended. Been there; done that. offended if someone calls them Central Americans, based on the geographers' terms.


Every kid in elementary school is taught that Mexico is part of "América del Norte" which is a region in America.

This is a digital copy of a textbook given to Mexicans in sixth grade:

http://basica.sep.gob.mx/reformaintegral/sitio/librosdetexto/2010-2011/geografia6.pdf

Go to page 123 to see a map of North America in relation to the rest of the world. As far as I know, they use the same textbook in the whole country.

Edit: I just remembered they don't use the same textbook in private schools, but I really don't think that would be an issue. If they started changing definitions around, their textbooks wouldn't get approve by the board of education.


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## bougainvillea

Mr Wahoo said:


> Pardon me for my stupidity. But what does DF stand for?


Kind of like insiders say "DC" when talking about Washington DC, or just "Washington." And it's always pronounced in Spanish, even by expats conversing in English, at least in my experience. You say "el DF," meaning "the Federal District," i.e.: EL DAY-EHFAY.


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## tepetapan

bougainvillea said:


> Kind of like insiders say "DC" when talking about Washington DC, or just "Washington." And it's always pronounced in Spanish, even by expats conversing in English, at least in my experience. You say "el DF," meaning "the Federal District," i.e.: EL DAY-EHFAY.


If you ask someone in Mexico where they are from and the answer"Mexico" that usually means the state of Mexico. If the answer "DF" I say...Oh, your a chilango!"
Whereas if they say monterray I say "Oh, you´re codo" while rubbing my elbow with the palm of my hand. just saying.


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## FHBOY

tepetapan said:


> If you ask someone in Mexico where they are from and the answer"Mexico" that usually means the state of Mexico. If the answer "DF" I say...Oh, your a chilango!"
> Whereas if they say monterray I say "Oh, you´re codo" while rubbing my elbow with the palm of my hand. just saying.


Remind me again of the elbow-hand thing meaning?


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## DNP

FHBOY said:


> Remind me again of the elbow-hand thing meaning?


It's gesture signifying that someone is a cheapskate.

DNP


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## Isla Verde

DNP said:


> It's gesture signifying that someone is a cheapskate.
> 
> DNP


And that's because _codo_, the word for elbow in Spanish, is slang for stingy.


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## FHBOY

Thank you.


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## Aa111111

*DF?*

What is df?



la paz said:


> hey!! No baja bashing!:boxing: _ *"baja has many thousands of californians."*_ *it does? Where?* baja is approximately 1,000 miles long & i know that there's a heavier concentrations of expats within 100 +/- miles of the northern border, but further south there's less concentrated populations in smaller towns & ex-pats from all over the globe. Thankfully not every location speaks to everyone's heart!! Cabo (or any "tourist destination") simply wasn't an option for me personally. La paz is a great fit for me & there are residents here from australia, canada, egypt, germany, italy among others & possibly all 50 states of the usa, yes, even hawaii & washington, dc.
> 
> Originally from the pacific northwest & firmly entrenched just outside of ->la paz....but i had to drive through ca:sorry: To get here!:d


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## johnmex

D.F. = Distrito Federal. The capital of Mexico.

It is the same as DC in the USA.


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## MJB5293

hi all 
i live in juriqulla queretaro i love it been here almost 4 years never had a problem, It was voted the cleanest city in mexico. i can find anything here i want but no in and out burger, so that makes the trip home wonderful. 

check it out you will love it


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## RVGRINGO

Oops! Somebody stole the shift keys from that computer!


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## AlanMexicali

RVGRINGO said:


> Oops! Somebody stole the shift keys from that computer!


That was a "trendy" way to type on the internet a decade or more ago, but like flipping your baseball cap backwords has lost it´s gestalt for many years now. Just like white Nikes has in Southern Calif.


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## MJB5293

RVGRINGO said:


> Oops! Somebody stole the shift keys from that computer!


sorry i only have one useable hand


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## RVGRINGO

And, my eyes don't work well enough to read. So, I use the voice option on my computer. When people type in strange ways, especially hitting return to make narrower text arrangements, or use symbols, it really upsets the machine voice and makes the postings difficult to understand by ear.
I guess we're both still making as much lemonade as we can. Fortunately, I learned to touch-type some 60 years ago. You can get at least half of the capitals by using the shift key with your little finger, if that helps. The others would just be a slower process, I guess. Anyway, keep on posting, however you do it.


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## conklinwh

MJB5293 said:


> hi all
> i live in juriqulla queretaro i love it been here almost 4 years never had a problem, It was voted the cleanest city in mexico. i can find anything here i want but no in and out burger, so that makes the trip home wonderful.
> 
> check it out you will love it


Four years ago it must have been you and the Torres Landes.
We like the food at Plaza Nautica and the new Superama but Juruquilla is way too much like a US retirement suburb.
I think great for temporary expat families as expect a very easy move. Did likewise when on assignment in Beijing but not now and not in Mexico.


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