# Guardia civil and traffico rip offs



## beckyspain (Sep 9, 2010)

Hi, Something should be done regarding the guardia civil. I need some help as I do not know what to do and do not speak spanish.

My husband and my son were going out in the morning to get a newspaper. On our urbanisation there is a very bad bend and the road was wet. The car lost control and ended up sideways across the road. The guardia, not from our area, came and issued him a ticket ...wait for this.....for doing a handbrake turn!!!!!

My husband refused to sign the ticket and we took it straight up to our local police. The guardia had said it happened on the main road, which is untrue. The local police said they drove passed and saw guardia with us...and they saw it was NOT on the main road, and also that the guardia should have informed them as it was not there 'patch', which they did not.

We then recieved a letter from traffico saying we have been fined 500 euros!!! I am so angry about this. We took this to local police who kindly wrote a letter for us to traffico. Traffico then replied saying we still owe the 500. We have a witness from someone who had just passed us on the corner just befoe it happened, who again has stated the road was wet and the corner is dangerous, and that this happens many times on this corner. The local policeman has said they will attend court. The problem is...after contacting a solicitor, we have to pay 400 up front, then more for the hearing, and they state that taking guardia to court couldbe a losing battle!

How can they get away with this? They think becauswe we are english and cannot speak the language that we will roll over and pay...well I will not.

Has anyone any suggestions, i contacted british consulate who were no help at all and just said get a lawyer.

Please help

Thanks

Mark


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

What rotten luck. All I can suggest is to try a different lawyer - maybe someone in the Ayuntamiento or local police can recommend someone a bit more reasonable?


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## country boy (Mar 10, 2010)

You have two choices: Either swallow it and pay up (my recommendation!)_ You will __sleep better and live longer_. or...Hire a good Spanish Lawyer and sue the [email protected]@ers. It will take forever and you might not win but you might enjoy the chase!! This is Spain and the Guardia are just a tad above the Law unfortunately.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

country boy said:


> You have two choices: Either swallow it and pay up (my recommendation!)_ You will __sleep better and live longer_. or...Hire a good Spanish Lawyer and sue the [email protected]@ers. It will take forever and you might not win but you might enjoy the chase!! This is Spain and the Guardia are just a tad above the Law unfortunately.


And if you do win .... well ....... do you think you will be flavour of the month with the Guardia? You might have some difficult times ahead


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## zilly (Mar 9, 2010)

Same sort of thing happened to me over a parking offence--I just paid up and reckoned it wasn't worth the time or money or stress of complaining............


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## malagaman2005 (Apr 23, 2008)

Check your car insurance, many companies offer legal assistance with fines etc, (Linea Directa offer this) I have also heard that it's worth fighting these 'phantom' offences as more often than not the Guardia will not fight it in court as they rely on, as you so eloquently put, people just rolling over and taking it. Good luck


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2012)

We have been stopped twice by the Guardia Civil. On both occasions we were at fault. We had a 70€ fine for one offence and on the second time, the officer looked at all details and told us not to do it again. We paid the 70€ fine on time and it was reduced to 49€.

Because of the economic climate, motoring fines are increasing. In your case you were just unfortunate, but the police are under pressure from their junta to take a tough stance.


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2012)

Furthermore, if the police ask you to do something, such as signing a ticket, it may be best to do so and then see a lawyer. Refusing to sign the ticket may have made the situation worse. 

In Spain in certain circumstances, it is a crime to not comply with the wishes of public servants doing their duty. Just accept it, then later get a good lawyer.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

A friend of mine was fined €100 for leaving her car on the square overnight (there were no free spaces in the street). She appealed because there were no yellow lines or no-parking notices on the square. She was told "you live here, you should know!" and had to pay up.


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2012)

Alcalaina said:


> A friend of mine was fined €100 for leaving her car on the square overnight (there were no free spaces in the street). She appealed because there were no yellow lines or no-parking notices on the square. She was told "you live here, you should know!" and had to pay up.


Yes, we've heard all of the situations where people get tickets. I guess the rest of us are just lucky. 

We had a situation years ago where a car was parked by the kerb. Later that morning there was a yellow line painted along the street. The car was later booked for parking on a yellow line!


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## MaidenScotland (Jun 6, 2009)

I have a friend who lives in the campo but has no address.. just a post office box number but of course they have electric, strangely enough no water other than agriculture. They all have cars, registered at the doctors. Police have been to the house on a few occasions for various legal issues. 
Said friend has just had a notice of a fine of 60eurous or something that was issued 4 years ago but the police said they couldn't find them until now... the fine with interest is now up in the 700 plus bracket.


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## Beachcomber (May 10, 2009)

If you have a problem receiving your mail it may be best to register to receive notifications by email and/or SMS via the Dirección Electrónica Vial service of DGT as they will not accept a Post Office box as a valid address for registration of a vehicle:

https://sede.dgt.gob.es/sede/faces/paginas/dev/suscripcion.xhtml

This can save a fortune in fines and surcharges imposed for not responding to a written communication.


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## danny mills (Jul 25, 2013)

*and here we go!*



beckyspain said:


> Hi, Something should be done regarding the guardia civil. I need some help as I do not know what to do and do not speak spanish.
> 
> Hi there,
> unfortunately this has escalated almost out of control; many months have past since your incident.
> ...


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

I am amazed that people who have been unjustly targeted by the police are often given the advice to just pay up-often a large amount of money;the only other choice is to find" a good lawyer" meaning that you will pay far more than the original fine in costs.The lawyer will be the only one who is happy. Is there no one to whom victims can go to for free advice and help. The British Consul appears to offer no help at all.There must be some kind of ombudsman . The targeting of foreign ex pats both by the police and the tax man is disgusting, but there seems a core of ex pats here who are only too willing to accept it, still bleating that they "love Spain."
Would they have tolerated this treatment in UK?What is it that makes these people so keen to stay here in the face of blatant discrimination?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

extranjero said:


> I am amazed that people who have been unjustly targeted by the police are often given the advice to just pay up-often a large amount of money;the only other choice is to find" a good lawyer" meaning that you will pay far more than the original fine in costs.The lawyer will be the only one who is happy. Is there no one to whom victims can go to for free advice and help. The British Consul appears to offer no help at all.There must be some kind of ombudsman . The targeting of foreign ex pats both by the police and the tax man is disgusting, but there seems a core of ex pats here who are only too willing to accept it, still bleating that they "love Spain."
> Would they have tolerated this treatment in UK?What is it that makes these people so keen to stay here in the face of blatant discrimination?


Personally I haven't come across any of what's being described here, but there is something in the thread that I don't understand referring to the OP's situation - The Police saw the incident, say that the OP is right and the Guardia Civil are still going after the fine?
That just doesn't make sense. If it came to court the Police would be testifying against the GC?


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

Tejeda said:


> Furthermore, if the police ask you to do something, such as signing a ticket, it may be best to do so and then see a lawyer. Refusing to sign the ticket may have made the situation worse.
> 
> In Spain in certain circumstances, it is a crime to not comply with the wishes of public servants doing their duty. Just accept it, then later get a good lawyer.


To add to that, if you have a grievance with receiving a denuncia from the police, let your insurance company deal with it for you.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

danny mills said:


> ...
> 
> The law in Spain is very clear; Visitors to Spain may drive here on any European licence but once you have taken residency in Spain it is your legal obligation to "register" or "change" your driving licence to a Spanish one in some traffic departments they stamp a code on the licence and in others they replace it with a Spanish one all together.
> 
> ...



Where did you get this Danny - it's simply wrong. Can you please provide a link to the appropriate law as I believe it doesn't exist!

The stamping of licences was stopped many years ago - provided you have a plastic licence, it is in date and you have the necessary medicals, then you are legally able to drive in Spain as a resident!

However, it is so much easier to drive with a Spanish licence for all sorts of reasons - see previous threads on this topic rather than duplicating the discussion here.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> Where did you get this Danny - it's simply wrong. Can you please provide a link to the appropriate law as I believe it doesn't exist!
> 
> The stamping of licences was stopped many years ago - provided you have a plastic licence, it is in date and you have the necessary medicals, then you are legally able to drive in Spain as a resident!
> 
> However, it is so much easier to drive with a Spanish licence for all sorts of reasons - see previous threads on this topic rather than duplicating the discussion here.


it IS till possible to get your UK licence 'registered' (stamped?) - & of course, as you say, it can be easier to simply get it changed

however, until such time as the licence expires, both are, as I know you know (though new readers might not) purely voluntary actions


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## danny mills (Jul 25, 2013)

snikpoh said:


> Where did you get this Danny - it's simply wrong. Can you please provide a link to the appropriate law as I believe it doesn't exist!
> 
> The stamping of licences was stopped many years ago - provided you have a plastic licence, it is in date and you have the necessary medicals, then you are legally able to drive in Spain as a resident!
> 
> However, it is so much easier to drive with a Spanish licence for all sorts of reasons - see previous threads on this topic rather than duplicating the discussion here.


I was advised by my insurance broker with Liberty seguros. indeed he personally handled my application.
seemingly even the new plastic one too has to be registered even if it has the eu logo on it and they emboss a code on the back with a heat stamp. I may be miss informed... but i'm not wrong..


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> I am amazed that people who have been unjustly targeted by the police are often given the advice to just pay up-often a large amount of money;the only other choice is to find" a good lawyer" meaning that you will pay far more than the original fine in costs.The lawyer will be the only one who is happy. Is there no one to whom victims can go to for free advice and help. The British Consul appears to offer no help at all.There must be some kind of ombudsman . The targeting of foreign ex pats both by the police and the tax man is disgusting, but there seems a core of ex pats here who are only too willing to accept it, still bleating that they "love Spain."
> *Would they have tolerated this treatment in UK?What is it that makes these people so keen to stay here in the face of blatant discrimination*?


First you moan about new laws 'targeting expats/immigrants. 
Then you complain about the cost of living and tell us that only 'rich' immigrants will be living here.
Now you are suggestion there is 'blatant discrimination' presumably against foreign immigrants.
You are clearly unhappy in Spain so why not go home?

Btw, I have twice been stopped by the police here for doing something illegal. Each time I was politely told what I had done wrong and wished a safe journey. No fine.


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

MaidenScotland said:


> I have a friend who lives in the campo but has no address.. just a post office box number but of course they have electric, strangely enough no water other than agriculture. They all have cars, registered at the doctors. Police have been to the house on a few occasions for various legal issues.
> Said friend has just had a notice of a fine of 60eurous or something that was issued 4 years ago but the police said they couldn't find them until now... the fine with interest is now up in the 700 plus bracket.


I have been told there is a website you can go to, to see if you have any outstanding fines. As yet I have not found it. Perhaps there is, perhaps there isn't.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Aron said:


> I have been told there is a website you can go to, to see if you have any outstanding fines. As yet I have not found it. Perhaps there is, perhaps there isn't.


this one?

buscamultas.com, Buscador de multas independiente


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## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

I find these stories of incidents with the GC astonishing. It's like one of those one horse towns in the USA where they make up these trumped up charges.

If it happened in the UK, firstly, the cops usually find foreign nationals and foreign vehicles too difficult to deal with so they tend not to prosecute. If they do though, the offender always has access to a translator through language line at the roadside, or a translator at the police station. This should be the case anywhere in the EU and perhaps this is something that should be campaigned for? In this day and age we surely can't have cops making up charges in a language you don't understand and assume you will just pay because it makes life easier.

Thus far I haven't felt the wrath of the GC although the local cops appear friendly enough. I'd dread the day something went wrong though.


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## Aron (Apr 30, 2013)

Dunpleecin said:


> I find these stories of incidents with the GC astonishing. It's like one of those one horse towns in the USA where they make up these trumped up charges.
> 
> If it happened in the UK, firstly, the cops usually find foreign nationals and foreign vehicles too difficult to deal with so they tend not to prosecute. If they do though, the offender always has access to a translator through language line at the roadside, or a translator at the police station. This should be the case anywhere in the EU and perhaps this is something that should be campaigned for? In this day and age we surely can't have cops making up charges in a language you don't understand and assume you will just pay because it makes life easier.
> 
> Thus far I haven't felt the wrath of the GC although the local cops appear friendly enough. I'd dread the day something went wrong though.


We've been stopped 4 times and fined once for having fog lights on when they should have been off. I had another denuncia which was later cancelled. Each time we have been stopped, we've been polite and that was reciprocated by the GC


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

mrypg9 said:


> First you moan about new laws 'targeting expats/immigrants.
> Then you complain about the cost of living and tell us that only 'rich' immigrants will be living here.
> Now you are suggestion there is 'blatant discrimination' presumably against foreign immigrants.
> You are clearly unhappy in Spain so why not go home?
> ...


Nothing to do with being happy or not. This is the situation in Spain, and it's wrong.Are you saying these things did not happen?If you had experienced what some of these posters have written about, you might change your tone. Others have obviously not experienced the politeness of the CG. even though they may have been polite to them. It is a matter of unfair treatment.


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## danny mills (Jul 25, 2013)

danny mills said:


> I was advised by my insurance broker with Liberty seguros. indeed he personally handled my application.
> seemingly even the new plastic one too has to be registered even if it has the eu logo on it and they emboss a code on the back with a heat stamp. I may be miss informed... but i'm not wrong..


Hello again.
OK. On Monday at 12:45 I arrived at traffico Cartegena; I produced my British driving licence to the inquiries desk and asked if it was OK to drive here in Spain on it.
He asked if I was resident and I gave him my residencia paper.
No! was the answer; once residencia has been granted you are obligated to change your licence to a Spanish one within 6 months.
the cost is 27.20e. Including the payment slip there are 4 forms of a quarter page in size to fill in. you need a black and white copy of your passport, residencia, padron as well as the originals, passport photo (Spanish regulation size) all of which my liberty insurance broker had prepared for me.

All I have to do now is wait till they call me to collect the new one; it was so quick and easy.
Regards to all.:clap2:


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

danny mills said:


> Hello again.
> OK. On Monday at 12:45 I arrived at traffico Cartegena; I produced my British driving licence to the inquiries desk and asked if it was OK to drive here in Spain on it.
> He asked if I was resident and I gave him my residencia paper.
> No! was the answer; once residencia has been granted you are obligated to change your licence to a Spanish one within 6 months.
> ...


maybe trafico in Cartagena would like to update the DGT website then.......... that still says it's voluntary..............


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

extranjero said:


> Nothing to do with being happy or not. This is the situation in Spain, and it's wrong.Are you saying these things did not happen?If you had experienced what some of these posters have written about, you might change your tone. Others have obviously not experienced the politeness of the CG. even though they may have been polite to them. It is a matter of unfair treatment.


No, I'm not saying they don't happen. I'm saying they happen infrequently. When you consider the number of foreign immigrants and tourists in Spain and the total number of car journeys each person makes, the number of incidents like this is insignificant.
Certainly not enough to add to your other gripes about Spain.
I'm sure these things happen to Spanish drivers too.

Now....the way the police treat immigrant drivers in the Czech Republic gives cause for serious complaint. Our first year in Prague we had a Czech-plated car but as my partner hadn't driven abroad very often then I put a GB sticker on the rear.
Bad mistake....
I was also stopped four times for ridiculous non-offences and fined quite large amounts of money. I was stopped for going through an amber turning red light which was fair enough and anyway they had the video to prove it.
As soon as I took the sticker off, no more stopping by the police.
Now there's cause for complaint...but complaining rarely gets you anywhere in the Czech Republic as Czechs seem happy with their rather dreary lives.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

extranjero said:


> I am amazed that people who have been unjustly targeted by the police are often given the advice to just pay up-often a large amount of money;the only other choice is to find" a good lawyer" meaning that you will pay far more than the original fine in costs.The lawyer will be the only one who is happy. Is there no one to whom victims can go to for free advice and help. The British Consul appears to offer no help at all.There must be some kind of ombudsman . The targeting of foreign ex pats both by the police and the tax man is disgusting, but there seems a core of ex pats here who are only too willing to accept it, still bleating that they "love Spain."
> Would they have tolerated this treatment in UK?What is it that makes these people so keen to stay here in the face of blatant discrimination?


Sounds like a "if you don't like the heat, get out of the kitchen" job. We have no problems. We occasionally get flagged down when the GC are on the look-out for somebody (usually drug smugglers taking the quieter route through our way en-route to the CdS, the Southeast and the Costa Blanca) but then we a flagged on, often before we have stopped


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## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> Sounds like a "if you don't like the heat, get out of the kitchen" job. We have no problems. We occasionally get flagged down when the GC are on the look-out for somebody (usually drug smugglers taking the quieter route through our way en-route to the CdS, the Southeast and the Costa Blanca) but then we a flagged on, often before we have stopped


The answer is NOT to "get out of the kitchen"
I've had no problems with the CG either, but many seem to have been treated unjustly;Why should they roll over and pay up?
Some of these responses are a bit"I'm all right Jack"


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## CapnBilly (Jun 7, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> maybe trafico in Cartagena would like to update the DGT website then.......... that still says it's voluntary..............


As does the law ley 818/2009.


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