# Aggression



## Johanna (Apr 13, 2009)

I do not want to start another disagreement, all I want to know is why people seem to be so aggressive ?
No one can please all the people all of the time, so if you do not agree with another person's opinion and have a valid, decent reason to contradict such person, can it not be done decently.... after all, we are supposed to be civilized, not so?
We all make choices in our lives and have to live with it, if we can't , we are free to change our minds ( what is the sense in having a mind if you can't change it?)


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I'm kind of glad you've brought this up!! I am disgusted and embarrassed by the childish nature of the recent posts on the SA forum!! It is just like listening/reading my 13yo daughter and15yo son arguing over their favourite pop group!

There is no point trying to change someones view with agression or anger and there is certainly no point in throwing insults to try to make the other person "see sense" who the heck has ever changed their mind when someone on a forum calls their ideas stupid???? Tantrums dont work!

So in future simply state your view politely and clearly and accept that others may not agree with you! A nice civilised debate is good, but it seems that the posters on here arent capable of that yet!

Jo xxx


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

jojo said:


> I'm kind of glad you've brought this up!! I am disgusted and embarrassed by the childish nature of the recent posts on the SA forum!! It is just like listening/reading my 13yo daughter and15yo son arguing over their favourite pop group!
> 
> There is no point trying to change someones view and there is certainly no point in throwing insults to try to make the other person "see sense" who the heck has ever changed their mind when someone on a forum calls their ideas stupid???? Tantrums dont work!
> 
> ...


and as I've told a couple of the posters - if someone insults you, just use the 'report' button & let the mods deal with it

no point getting into insult contests


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## Johanna (Apr 13, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> and as I've told a couple of the posters - if someone insults you, just use the 'report' button & let the mods deal with it
> 
> no point getting into insult contests


Thanks Jojo and xabiachica
I am one of those people who "dared" to come back to SA after living in the UK --- always said we were not staying there permanently, lived there for almost 11 years.

Coming back was our decision, I started posting here for advice on bringing back a motorcar ---- received some good replies, but as always on all Saffer sites, there is this childish aggression. 
I will reserve my opinion as to why people post such personal and often negative posts!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I've an idea. Those of you who wish to argue, please use the private message facility and then you can carry on with each other and not take up space on the main forum where the rantings are of no interest to anyone!

Thanks

Jo xxx


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## Jason1 (Jun 23, 2009)

When I first joined this website the SA expat forum was pretty uneventful. Now it's full of passion:fencing:


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Jason1 said:


> When I first joined this website the SA expat forum was pretty uneventful. Now it's full of passion:fencing:



yeah, I like a bit of passion LOL!! But there's passion and there's name calling and playground stuff. Its getting the balance right thats the hard bit Jason!!! The forum also has to provide information and advise to those who are planning to move to SA or who need answers to questions and they actually dont need or want to plough thru loads of "insulting each other" posts 

Jo xxx


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## vegasboy (Apr 28, 2010)

jojo said:


> yeah, I like a bit of passion LOL!! But there's passion and there's name calling and playground stuff. Its getting the balance right thats the hard bit Jason!!! The forum also has to provide information and advise to those who are planning to move to SA or who need answers to questions and they actually dont need or want to plough thru loads of "insulting each other" posts
> 
> Jo xxx


 LOL, I agree with both of you. When I was doing serious research on a similar US Forum some years ago to buy property there, I found it frustrating when locals were rude, negative and insulting. The locals were trying to discourage me by telling me what a bad place it was, that the real estate market was NEVER going to recover, and some of them still feel that way. They were bias, because in many ways they were stuck in their circumstances.

This forum is somewhat different. Those who are "negative" HAVE made the move, well, most of them against their will. Circumstances forced them from their country, regardless of what those circumstances were or whether we agree with it or not. They were forced to do so through extreme and cruel circumstances being traumatized by brutal murder, rape, hijacking, even BEE etc, and they feel the necessity and responsibility to forewarn others in the strongest possible terms, nothing wrong with that. 

Most of those known to me will agree that South Africa is the most beautiful place on earth, especially if you were born here.

Also remember the different personality types: The forward thinker visionary type will be more prone to being wary of the future, taking facts and stats into consideration, looking at what is happening in places like Zimbabwe etc. The phlegmatic type is not analytical and will only see the current “good” they are experiencing.

I feel strong about the fact that everyone should be able to view their opinion in the most passionate way they wish. And we have to respect that without making derogative statements that they need to get over it, get counselling, move on, cannot stand the black government etc. 

Their (maybe) overstated views based on personal experience can be balanced out, not by attacking or REACTING to other's views & posts, but by RESPONDING in a mature way by posting positive balanced information with references attached to it about South Africa (and there are LOTS of positives about this country); by relaying their personal positive experiences so the readers can come to their own informed conclusion.

Lastly, when I'm in the US, I don't really care about all the fine details of their politics, their health system etc. as they do. I don't want to hear how the US is going down the drain, because I have a stake in the future of my newly found country, it has become my new (future) home. For me, my home there almost becomes some sort of Utopia. The same goes for expats moving to or living in South Africa. And I think THIS is where much of the conflict creeps in.

Let’s keep on posting our views without disrespecting that of the others. Bless you guys!!:clap2:


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

And stick to the facts


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Halo said:


> And stick to the facts


Hhhhmmmm, the trouble is that you can find conflicting facts depending who you listen to and what you read! Stick to what you know is possibly a safer bet. But whatever, just as long as it doesnt get nasty with name calling, insults and tantrums

Jo xxx


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

jojo said:


> Hhhhmmmm, the trouble is that you can find conflicting facts depending who you listen to and what you read! Stick to what you know is possibly a safer bet. But whatever, just as long as it doesnt get nasty with name calling, insults and tantrums
> 
> Jo xxx


Not really.... If 1000 people get mugged in city X and 10 in city Y - City Y is "in the mean" safer. YOu ca play with numbers all you like but facts are still facts.

Never seen the latter - its healthy debating SA style. :tongue1:


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Halo said:


> Not really.... If 1000 people get mugged in city X and 10 in city Y - City Y is "in the mean" safer. YOu ca play with numbers all you like but facts are still facts.
> 
> Never seen the latter - its healthy debating SA style. :tongue1:


but not *this forum* style


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Halo said:


> Not really.... If 1000 people get mugged in city X and 10 in city Y - City Y is "in the mean" safer. YOu ca play with numbers all you like but facts are still facts.
> 
> Never seen the latter - its healthy debating SA style. :tongue1:


Well without getting into a debate - which I wont. If city x has a population of 100,000,000 people and city y has a population of only 10.........!!! Or if city x reported all their muggings and city y didnt cos they were all too shy...... You see there is always an argument to be had, so theres no point! And this forum isnt political, its for information and advise about relocating!

I used to work for an independent company that was responsible for collating study information, facts, figures and surveys for the pharmaceutical industry and trust me, you can make any figures say what you want them to with a little "massaging" and if a particular company were paying us, then their product came out top!

Jo xxx


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## Gigi 1974 (Aug 17, 2010)

Totally agreed, as I hate it too when views are thrown around with no prior knowledgde or proof. Every one loves their country of origin, or like I should rather say.

No use painting a bad picture for every one else, as most of us have families back home, whom we love and no use pretending when we are their just to get back to your new country of residence to spoil your memory of what is your beautiful country. Tolerance and respect goes along way, we should all try that some time. 

An the name calling, lets leave that for the play ground!


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

Ive been on SA forums for years and discussions often do get a bit heated, mainly because of the differing points of views about quite important issues.

People just need to remember that getting aggressive on a forum really doesn't get you anywhere .... best just to debate in a friendly fashion


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

Sure, but moderators need to understand the background before getting their knickers in a knot over something they don't understand.


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

jojo said:


> Well without getting into a debate - which I wont. If city x has a population of 100,000,000 people and city y has a population of only 10.........!!! Or if city x reported all their muggings and city y didnt cos they were all too shy...... You see there is always an argument to be had, so theres no point! And this forum isnt political, its for information and advise about relocating!
> Jo xxx


Lets not be silly now


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## dizzyizzy (Mar 30, 2008)

Halo said:


> Sure, but moderators need to understand the background before getting their knickers in a knot over something they don't understand.


I don't see how that has anything to do with insults and name calling? One doesn't need to have lived in South Africa to "moderate" that - what forum users are allowed and not allowed to do is in the forum rules, simple as that. 

Anyways, now you have your own SA mod so no excuses to behave now


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

dizzyizzy said:


> I don't see how that has anything to do with insults and name calling? One doesn't need to have lived in South Africa to "moderate" that - what forum users are allowed and not allowed to do is in the forum rules, simple as that.
> 
> Anyways, now you have your own SA mod so no excuses to behave now


hear hear:clap2:


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## mman (Nov 15, 2009)

Halo said:


> And stick to the facts


Haha Halo, i just needed to read that line and without even seeing who posted it i knew it was you


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## Halo (May 8, 2008)

dizzyizzy said:


> I don't see how that has anything to do with insults and name calling? One doesn't need to have lived in South Africa to "moderate" that - what forum users are allowed and not allowed to do is in the forum rules, simple as that.
> 
> Anyways, now you have your own SA mod so no excuses to behave now


Still would love to see where I was part of that.


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## Stravinsky (Aug 12, 2007)

Halo said:


> Sure, but moderators need to understand the background before getting their knickers in a knot over something they don't understand.


I understand the background. I've been reading posts and moderating a SA forum for many many years. Ive heard the stories and I've seen the disbelievers and the rose tinted glasses brigade

But that doesnt mean you have to get arsey with people when you are having a discussion


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