# Getting my first RT



## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

I went through the process of applying for an RT last week (the first time, "canje" of my visa to RT) last week, and thought I'd tell the story in some detail for the benefit of other first-timers.

Here in Cancun they have a little internet cafe right across the street from INM which exists pretty much solely to help people complete INM paperwork. They can even take the pictures you need there. They have two computers but don't seem to charge for their use, they charge for copies and pictures. They had a sign with prices, including 500 pesos for visa, but that didn't seem to apply to my case, I was on the ala cart plan paying about 2 pesos per page printed or copied.

I started on a Monday morning. There was a huge line at INM, with people sitting down inside in some kind of order on the chairs that didn't make much sense, and seems to vary depending on the day. You had to ask "who is last" and find out who you were following. Then people sort of slid around on the chairs as people were helped. People left and came back and reinserted themselves in the line. Very chaotic. A pregnant woman was told to jump the queue. The power went out while I was there putting everything on hold for half an hour.

In the end, it turned out this was all just to talk to the person under the "information" sign. She explained to me, in English, what I needed and gave me a form, in Spanish, with the requirements which she annotated by putting a check mark by all the bullets and adding some notes, such as "original and two copies" beside the part listing the payment. She circled the payment amount for 1 year. She gave me a preprinted form for the bank showing the INM CLAVE number (back account number) and Cadena de la Dependencia numbers.

She also gave to me a form letter to help with the "letter" part of the requirement. She wrote in the blank "como retirado, viviendo de mis recursos provenientes de Estados Unidos", so I had exactly what I needed to type in the letter. 

So then it was off to the internet cafe to fill out the form.

The printed instructions said to go to www.gob.mex/tramites "que se encuentra en la seccion Migracion visa y passporte -> Condiciones y estancia en Mexico."

The website uses scripting and cookies I think. It has cascading menus that might be blocked by pop-up blockers, too, so that might be another reason it wouldn't work for some people. 

What the instructions didn't say was that after getting to the "condiciones y estancia en Mexico" level there was yet another level ("Destacados") with 20 or so choices, and I had to guess which one was correct with my zero spanish assisted by iTranslate on my phone, "Expedicion de documento migratorio por canje". 

I didn't have my apartment's address with me, which was required by that form, so I was done for the day. I wrote down the names on the fields in the form, so I could get help with how to express the address: Codico Postal, Estado, Municipio o Alcaldia, Colonia, Calle, Numero exterior, Nuermo interior, Lada, and Telfono fijo. 

I paid 100 pesos and got the "infantile" sized pictures I needed, though it turns out that I didn't need to do that so soon. Since I hadn't printed anything, if I hadn't gotten this done I wouldn't have given them any money at all for their help that day.

I came back on Wednesday morning. 

I started with the bank, paying the 3596 pesos. There's a Banjercito next door to the INM, but I was arriving from the other direction, so I used the Scotiabank that's a little further away, around the corner on Av. Tulum. That was a good choice, it had no line.

From there I went to the internet cafe across the street (across Av. Carlos Nader) to get two copies made of the bank receipt, to fill out the website form, and to write up and print the letter, and get copies made of the picture page and the visa page of my passport.

One thing I didn't understand when I was doing the form is that although you fill this form out on the web, the result isn't transmitted to INM, you have to hit buttons to print the info that you entered as a 3-page printout. Or maybe it is transmitted, but they need the printout to find the record, I don't know.

After the cafe, I went to INM, waited through the line for the "information" person (much shorter than on Monday), where she checked what I had. She sent me back to the internet cafe to do the web form again and print out the 3-page form.

Then I went back to INM and waited through the information line again. This time it was only a couple people long, and I just stood in line. It's not clear to me whether I was actually cutting ahead of the people sitting down or if they were waiting in a different line, but I'd waited once, already, so I was sort of ahead of them anyway.

She looked at my paperwork, and gave me a little card with a number on it! Then I had to wait in a different set of seats for my number to be called.

When I got up to that person, she looked at everything I had and discovered the other way I had messed up. It was in paying my fee to the bank. When I had filled out the form to give to the bank that had their CLAVE and Cadena de la Dependencia numbers on it, I didn't include my middle name. Because the name on the receipt didn't *exactly* match the names on my passport, INM sent me back to the bank to get the transaction reversed and redone with my middle name included. 

Again, Scociabank didn't have a line, but I had to wait 5 minutes for the bank manager who was the only one who could (or would) speak English with me to explain the problem. Fortunately the same teller that helped me before was still on duty, that seemed somehow important, because they wanted to know which teller I'd used before, as if only he could reverse the transaction. 

While that teller was redoing the transaction, I punched "even my Mother doesn't use that name" into my translation app and showed it to the teller and got a laugh out of him. 

So with that done and a new receipt it was back to the internet cafe to make 2 more copies of it, then back to INM. She had told me I didn't need to wait in line again, so I just waited until that same INM agent was done with her current customer and jumped in before she could call another number. She finished up my application, gave me a one page printout with a "Pieza numero" and a "Numero Unico de Tramite (NUT)" and sent me home. They said 20 days, maybe 15, and they will contact me by email. 

She did not ask for the infantile pictures, apparently those aren't needed until I go back. I think she kept the FMM form. At least I hope so, because I don't seem to have it anymore. She returned my passport though. 

It's not clear at this point whether the processing time is supposed to be 20 working days or 20 calendar days. The NUT says what to do if you don't hear from them, I plan to wait 20 working days before I worry about that.

When I looked up the INM location on google maps, it says there that their hours are 9am to 1 pm M-F. By my experience, Monday's are busy days, mid week is not so busy, and I suspect that Fridays will be as bad as Mondays if not worse. I was never there at 1:00, so I don't know what happens if you are waiting in line at that time. It was close on Wednesday, by the time I got back from the bank and cafe with my corrected payment receipts it was after 12:00 even though I'd begun the day at the bank around 9:30 am.


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## usamex2017 (Oct 1, 2016)

Wow, what an experience! You are to be commended for your persistence in the face of many obstacles!


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Well, thanks, but I assumed all this was pretty standard for Mexico.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

eastwind said:


> Well, thanks, but I assumed all this was pretty standard for Mexico.


+1 (e.g. I agree). It sounded pretty standard for dealing with any bureaucracy in Mexico. If anyone would like to read about the process I went through to become a citizen, I have a write up of it on the web The long road to citizenship. It took about 15 months and maybe 20 or more trips to the Secretaria de Relaciones Exteriores.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Yes it is pretty standard and always count on working days taking allowing for holidays as well..


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Last wed, oct 19th, exactly 3 calendar weeks from the day I got my "canje" request forms in, I got an email saying the request was granted, and summoning me to appear in person at INM within 3 days. At least I think that's what it said, I was using translation software.

So Thursday the 20th I got to INM. There was only a short line to the "information" person, I had to wait less than 5 minutes. She looked up my NUT (Numero Unico de Tramite) and said "I'm making you an appointment on Nov 3 at 9:10. Be here at least 10 minutes early."

I applied a frozen smile, thanked her and quickly left before it melted. I had to find someone else to rant at about the stupidity of the process. Why did I need to appear in person to receive an appointment that was dictated to me? They didn't ask if that time was ok or anything, they just told me to come back in two weeks. They emailed me the status, why couldn't they email me the appointment?

I'm just really glad they have an office in Cancun and that I didn't have to ride 4 hours to Merida only to be told to come back in two weeks. I told my Mom the bureaucracy in Mexico is as bad as the bureaucracy in the US, minus the need to hire lawyers.

Anyhow, for anyone following this as preparation for their first time through the process, plan on having to appear at INM on a minimum of 3 different days a couple weeks apart. When choosing where to live in Mexico, you might want to consider how easy it is to visit INM unless you just plan to do tourist visas.

Was this 2-week callback expected and typical? I thought I was going to get my TR that day. Am I going to get it on Nov 3 or are there more hoops in store?


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

I read this thread quickly and may have missed some points.

For starters it has been four years now so I don't remember all the details, and mine was a RP and not an RT.

In reading your posts - you still have not handed over your photos ? And I had my browser search on the word fingerprint which doesn't appear on this thread ? There is a website you can visit where, given your NUT, you can see where you are in the process. There are also posts on sites such as this where people have posted the status messages to help you determine if you are in the right 'flow'.

Finally - it was at the point where I had been approved and asked to come back. The real purpose of that trip was to confirm that I am who I said I am. I got in trouble during the interview because when the girl asked me where I was from I said 'South Florida' with a smile. She was not happy because she was looking for the name of my last hometown. That interview only went downhill from there - when she had completed whatever form she had been working on and asked me to sign it. Well at some point after receiving my last US passport I broke my right wrist. Except for the scars/holes left from the external fixator the arm looks and functions fine - but my signature has changed from that on the passport. Well that really sent her over the top. She had to reprint her form. And while she was walking to the printer she handed me a blank piece of paper, my passport and a pen and told me to practice my signature until it matched.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Right, I have my photos but they haven't asked for them, nor have I been fingerprinted or had the signature matching exercise. It sounds like the meeting you describe, where the ask where I'm from, is what's next for me, on Nov 3.


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

I don't know if, as an RT, you are allowed to get a CURP. A lot of people seem to get that number on their credentials at INM. Our RP's did not have our CURPs and it did take a while to figure out we needed to get that from INM as well. Anyway - you might ask about that on your next visit to INM (perhaps near the end of the conversation). Otherwise - perhaps two visits out when you pick up your card. I _think_ we needed a CURP to get INAPAM, perhaps IMSS and at the bank. In any event - when we show our CURPs people always seem a little more relaxed.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

The form they gave me that gives "informacion importante favor de leer detenidamente" lists one of the requirements to bring as:

*CURP ( en caso de residentes permanentes es obligatorio presentario) si usted ya ha presentado anteriormente un CURP para algun tramite en esta oficine ( es necesario que lo presente en su cita ) Si no lo tiene lo puede solicitar en esta oficina con 3 DIAS de de anterioridad a su cite, solo presente copia del pasaporte y su residencia, si no la tiene por estar en tramite puede presentar copia del NUT, una vez que haya dejado estas copias en la oficina, despues de tres dias, acceso a consultas.curp.org.mx e imprima su CURP este documento es indispensable que lo presente en su cita)

I'm not sure whether to interpret the first phrase as meaning that I don't need one for an RT, or not. I suppose if no one knows for certain, I should go and try to get one more than 3 days before my appointment, to see if I can. The underlined sentence seems to say I need to have one at the meeting.

I tried to go to http://consultas.curp.org.mx/, just to see if I already had one, and I get server not found :<

I looked at rollybrook's page CURP and RFC and he has a link to eCurp but that page redirects to https://consultas.curp.gob.mx/CurpSP/ . 

There I can try to look up my curp using my name etc, and it says "No se encuentra en la Base de Datos Nacional de la CURP."

It has a button named "Imprimir certificado de no existencia". It's not clear to me whether that's what you need to apply for one, or only for if it is lost from the database somehow. In any event, that button trys to open a pdf file that won't open because it's "damaged". Inspecting the html and manually constructing the url and downloading the pdf file also results in a 0 byte pdf, so I'm stymied there.


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

As I said - we received our RP credentials without ever having a CURP - and there was no CURP on the card itself. When people later started asking for our CURPs we were really steered in the wrong direction a lot. Many people said - only citizens can get a CURP (that was very wrong). The algorithm to determine your CURP is rather trivial and I _think_ that a lot of the sites you may find are only going to ask you some values and calculate what your CURP should be. It is truly INM which needs to enter your CURP into their system. Getting our CURPs from INM - after having our RP cards - required about 5 minutes (with appointment). I'm pretty sure the guy would not have issued the CURP if we didn't have our RP cards. In our INM office - the CURP guy was even on a different, much much less busy, floor. I'll bet you could call INM and ask for the "CURP guy" and ask him/her what to do. I doubt it would have any impact on your RT processing.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

I think that INM may provide you with a CURP along with your new Residente Temporal visa. If so, the number will show on the visa card, and you can then look it up and print your copy of your own CURP.


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

RVGRINGO said:


> I think that INM may provide you with a CURP along with your new Residente Temporal visa. If so, the number will show on the visa card, and you can then look it up and print your copy of your own CURP.


I think you are correct. IF INM creates and records a CURP for you at the time your credentials are generated, you can later simply print off your own CURP piece of paper (and laminate it later) yourself. Problem for us was - it became a two step process because they didn't. Probably another one of those office specific details you encounter all the time in Mexico.


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

Regarding RFCs - I believe that is a road you don't want to go down unless you are going to have Mexican generated income - like a job for a Mexican company, or you are the owner of a Mexican company. Perhaps if you live in one of those coastal regions where simple foreign ownership of property is not possible you may need one - but I have no idea on that.

Banks etc will generate a 'dummy' RFC which has worked across numerous banks etc for us. The dummy RFC will be shorter than a 'real' RFC.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Thanks to you both. I do hope they issue a CURP for me with the card, as it sounds like it's a good thing to have. Rollybrook's page I linked above has the construction formula, the only part that isn't well defined is the last two digits to make it unique. I can guess that they start with 01 and count up, but constructing one's own CURP when it hasn't been officially issued and isn't in the database seems like a bad idea.

Nothing so far from INM has mentioned an RFC, I think the only reason Rollybrook combined his info on RFCs with his page on CURPs is you apparently need a CURP to get an RFC. So one can only hope that they don't also require an RFC to get a CURP


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

eastwind said:


> Thanks to you both. I do hope they issue a CURP for me with the card, as it sounds like it's a good thing to have. Rollybrook's page I linked above has the construction formula, the only part that isn't well defined is the last two digits to make it unique. I can guess that they start with 01 and count up, but constructing one's own CURP when it hasn't been officially issued and isn't in the database seems like a bad idea.
> 
> Nothing so far from INM has mentioned an RFC, I think the only reason Rollybrook combined his info on RFCs with his page on CURPs is you apparently need a CURP to get an RFC. So one can only hope that they don't also require an RFC to get a CURP


CURPs are issued by INEGI (the statistics and demographics agency), but you can probably get one a lot of places. They don't seem to be essential for much but are easy to get so why not. When I got a driver's license they wanted a copy of the official printout with my CURP on it. The RFC is a tax ID number. It is essential if you are making money in Mexico and paying Mexican taxes on the income. When you make purchases, you give them your RFC number and receive a factura instead of or in addition to a receipt. Then you can claim the expenses on your Mexican taxes and get back some of the IVA tax that you pay. Otherwise, you probably don't need an RFC.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

Foreigners since 2014 have only been able to get CURPs from INM with a legal RT or RP, no more at municipal offices, only citizens can. They are required as part of the legal system in many federal and state institutions, even banks usually require them, as do Notarias, SAT, IMSS, ISSSTE, INAPAM, Seguro Popular etc.. Without a CURP you cannot register vehicals or get divers licences in most if not all states. It is the second most used and important document required in Mexico next to the INE/IFE card.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

eastwind said:


> Last wed, oct 19th, exactly 3 calendar weeks from the day I got my "canje" request forms in, I got an email saying the request was granted, and summoning me to appear in person at INM within 3 days. At least I think that's what it said, I was using translation software.
> 
> So Thursday the 20th I got to INM. There was only a short line to the "information" person, I had to wait less than 5 minutes. She looked up my NUT (Numero Unico de Tramite) and said "I'm making you an appointment on Nov 3 at 9:10. Be here at least 10 minutes early."
> 
> ...


Your Nov. 3rd appointment will be fingerprints, payment if you haven´t already gone to a bank with the INM form they give you for about $4800.00 pesos. photos left and and then they will tell you when to come back for your 1 year RT card. Here in SLP it is 3 working days to come back for the RT or RP cards. Keep the form with the NUT number and use it as your temporary immigration document because they sometime take longer than the 3 weeks and you will have proof of being legally in Mexico if you have a problem.


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

AlanMexicali said:


> Foreigners since 2014 have only been able to get CURPs from INM with a legal RT or RP, no more at municipal offices, only citizens can. They are required as part of the legal system in many federal and state institutions, even banks usually require them, as do Notarias, SAT, IMSS, ISSSTE, INAPAM, Seguro Popular etc.. Without a CURP you cannot register vehicals or get divers licences in most if not all states. It is the second most used and important document required in Mexico next to the INE/IFE card.


That has been our experience.

The only bit of advice to eastwind (whose - sex I don't know) those photos you are going to hand over to INM - they can't in ANY way hide your forehead. They turned my wife away and she had to put gel on her hair and pin it back to keep them happy. A little silly since she looks like a zombie in the photo and it bears 0% similarity to her in real life...


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

AlanMexicali said:


> Foreigners since 2014 have only been able to get CURPs from INM with a legal RT or RP, no more at municipal offices, only citizens can. They are required as part of the legal system in many federal and state institutions, even banks usually require them, as do Notarias, SAT, IMSS, ISSSTE, INAPAM, Seguro Popular etc.. Without a CURP you cannot register vehicals or get divers licences in most if not all states. It is the second most used and important document required in Mexico next to the INE/IFE card.


You are a nice level headed, intelligent resource. You should frequent this forum more often.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Thanks to all for the info. I'm glad it's not going to be a lot longer than another 2 weeks. 

Here in Cancun they required me to pay at the bank and get copies of the receipt and turn them in along with the application, so I paid before I was given a NUT. It was 3596 pesos for a 1 year RT. A RP would have been 4383. I hope there's not another fee on top of that. 

I had the pictures taken at the little internet cafe place across the street from INM when I was applying for the NUT, but so far they haven't asked for them, so worst case they send me back across the street for a redo I suppose. I think they only charged 20 pesos or something, it wasn't like in the US where it costs $20 for passport fotos. 

The hair-on-the-brow requirement sounds like another one of those requirements that varies by location and the mood of the bureaucrat.


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## UKMX (Jul 28, 2016)

I'm currently embarking upon a direct to RP application as my daughter was just born in Mexico to my Mexican wife. I'm on an FMM right now and have until 1st December when I fly away for two weeks, to get to the INM and wade through the bureaucracy.

But I have found a few things by googling around and with a mix of reading what Spanish I can and deciphering the results of Google Translate for the rest, I've worked out how to fill in many of the forms online, and even how to pay the derechos online. I figure if I have as much of the process complete before I turn up at the INM this week, the process will be at least easier if not faster.

One thing that helped was being willing to wait for them to answer the phone. My wife called and asked in Spanish what I would need to do, and with this advice combined with Rollybrook's website, I've been able to fill out all the [apparently] necessary paperwork and even generate the payment reference for payment of fees, without leaving the house.

It was good to note that getting a CURP may be an extra step, I'll need that and an RFC for my purposes. The UK and Mexico have a dual taxation avoidance treaty so I haven't figured out which is going to be best for me as yet. For the moment we've got debts to pay in GBP so it makes sense for our income to be there and then transfer what we need into MXN via TransferWise (highly recommended by the way).

Perhaps I'll also share my journey as Eastwind has.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Your schedule is very tight. They took 3 weeks after my application was complete to approve it, and then scheduled the interview appointment a further 2 weeks out, and I don't expect it to be final at the appointment this Thursday.

Someone has said that you can request documentation to travel during the waiting period, but whether you get that or not is going to be up to the whim of the official you're dealing with, and their individual understanding of the rules.

Congratulations on your new daughter.


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## UKMX (Jul 28, 2016)

UKMX said:


> Perhaps I'll also share my journey as Eastwind has.


http://www.expatforum.com/expats/mexico-expat-forum-expats-living-mexico/1166249-my-journey-permanent-residency.html


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

I went back today for my appointment. It was supposed to be for 9:10, but they also had someone scheduled for 9:00, and they opened at 9:00 and took a little while to get going, so it was maybe 9:15 when they called my name. First name only, I was sitting right in front of the desk and barely understood that they had called my name. In fact I'm not 100% certain that they did, they called something after the previous person was done, so I stood up and handed them my appointment slip and asked if they'd called my name. She proceeded to help me. Took my passport and infantile pictures and eventually had me sign and give fingerprints. All 10 fingers. 

The person who helped me wasn't speaking English. She was sitting next to the two women that handle the "information" line, and got the one near her to translate (that one speaks fluent English). "Your card will be ready in 2 weeks". Ugh. So much for 3 days. I asked about a CURP, and she said get a copy of your passport main page and your NUT form and come back, so I went across the street to the copy/internet store, paid two pesos for the copies and came back. That time I waited through the information line, and when I got to the front I got the other of the two women, whose English is passable, and said I'd asked about a CURP. She took my two copies, handed them to the other woman, got a slip of paper in exchange and gave it to me and told me to go online in 5 working days and print out my CURP form.

The slip of paper just repeats the instructions that a CURP is required for an RP, and you must apply for one 3 days before your appointment. It says to go to the consultasl.curp.org.mx site and enter your particulars and it will search for the CURP. 

So I guess I've "applied" for a CURP, but it apparently wasn't automatic as part of the RT process, or else they wouldn't have needed another pair of copies of passport & NUT. Maybe by having applied today it will be on the card when I get it, maybe not.

Timeline so far:
(I've already forgotten the dates of the first two visits to the consulate in the US)
9/9 Had appointment with consulate, got visa.
9/22 entered country on 'canje' visa
9/26 first visit to INM after arriving in Mexico. Got printed instructions.
9/28 second visit, completed application, got a form with a NUT and told to wait 15-20 days for an email. They took my FMM along with the application
10/19 got the email, exactly 15 working days from 9/28, summoned me to appear within 3 days
10/20 third visit, appeared in person as summoned. Gave me an appointment to return 11/3.
11/3 fourth visit, gave photos and fingerprints and signed the form, told card will be ready in 2 weeks, also applied for CURP
11/17 fifth visit scheduled, supposed to get the RT card then and be done for 10-12 months (depending on the effective date they start my one year RT on)


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Went back today and got my green card! I had to wait in line 45 minutes to be given a number to wait some more. I never heard them call the number, the screaming baby next to me and all the people that wanted to create a human wall between the person who might have called my number and the chair I was supposed to wait in made it impossible. After another 45 minutes the original line was down to nothing so I went back and asked which desk it was that I was supposed to be waiting on. She pointed at an empty chair and looked around. So I stood in front of that desk until the person came back. She said something to me I didn't understand with the word "mucho" in it, but had me sign two pieces of paper and gave me the card.


The expiration date on the card is 21/09/2017 - september 21, which is one year from the day I entered the country on the "canje" visa. 

It does not have a CURP on it. They took papers two weeks ago that were supposed to result in me getting a CURP, and gave me a little slip of paper with instructions to go online to retrieve it after 5 days. I've been to the web site many times and it always says there's no CURP found for my info. So I'll have to go back another day to try to get that, I didn't have time to try again today.
Maybe I don't understand what I'm supposed to do on that site - there's a button to print a certificate of non-existance, I figured that's what I use if I actually needed a CURP right now and don't have one, rather than an application for getting one in the first place. Is that correct?


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## Gatos (Aug 16, 2016)

With green card in hand - getting a CURP was a 5/10 minute thing - and most of that involved talking about the concert that the guy went to the night before. He printed it and we took it to OfficeMax for lamination.


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