# Our daughter is a dual citizen - does she qualify for nat'l healthcare?



## ktmarie (May 11, 2014)

We are both US citizens. Our daughter was recently born here in Mexico and is a dual-citizen. Does she qualify for national healthcare? Has anyone else dealt with this question, particularly for children when the parents are not Mexican citizens themselves?

Thanks for any advice/help anyone can provide!


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## Cristobal (Nov 25, 2014)

What national healthcare?


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## ktmarie (May 11, 2014)

Fair enough. I guess I am curious if there are any options that exist for her (that don't exist for us) given her citizenship. I thought Mexico's health insurance wasn't totally privatized. And if so, how does one go about applying, etc.?


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## Cristobal (Nov 25, 2014)

There is no universal healthcare system In Mexico.


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## maesonna (Jun 10, 2008)

If you mean IMSS or Seguro Popular, even non-nationals are eligible if they are residents of Mexico with a resident visa.


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## LMtortugas (Aug 23, 2013)

Cristobal said:


> There is no universal healthcare system In Mexico.


My understanding is that both universal enrollment and access to basic health care through citizenship alone is ensured through Seguro Popular, a principal component of the SSPH legislation passed shortly after the turn of the century.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

LMtortugas said:


> My understanding is that both universal enrollment and access to basic health care through citizenship alone is ensured through Seguro Popular, a principal component of the SSPH legislation passed shortly after the turn of the century.


My understanding is that the care provided by Seguro Popular is intended for very needy Mexicans and provides pretty bare-bones coverage.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

Registra a tus hijos a los beneficios que otorga el IMSS

To enroll in the IMSS:

Google Translation:

"The documents you need are:


• A document that your Social Security number appears in original, issued by the IMSS, INFONAVIT and AFORE

• Official pensioner (a) Identification of the insured (a) or, as can be: • Voting Card IFE card

• Valid passport

• National Military Service

• Professional certificate

• Matricula Consular

• In case of foreigners: Card / Certificate / Identity Card ; FM2 [Residente Temporal] or FM3 [Residentete Permanente] immigration visa/card issued by the National Institute of Migration

• Credential ADIMSS

• One of the following documents: • Birth certificate of your child (a) consanguineous

• Certified copy of adoption. Keep in mind that for adoption takes effect should be made enforceable by judicial decision, which must be transcribed in the certified copy of the decision to be lifted by the civil registry as required by local law (or in the terms thereof)

• for newborns that do not have a birth certificate, you must present a birth certificate, which only covers you for up to 40 calendar days after birth in the Mandatory Regime and 30 calendar days if it for IMSS Family Health plan

• CURP"

IMSS and Seguro Popular, which are both all inclusive health care insurance plans, require you enroll as a family unit now.

I feel you all will need the above documents to enroll in the IMSS.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

Isla Verde said:


> My understanding is that the care provided by Seguro Popular is intended for very needy Mexicans and provides pretty bare-bones coverage.


That might have been true 15 years ago but SP has evolved into a 49 million citizen enrollment health care plan comparable to IMSS in services, technology and has more coverage in rural areas than IMSS. IMSS has about 59 million citizens enrolled as of 2013. They allow enrollment of any non members of IMSS or other gov´t. health plan, citizens and legal residents with no restriction to prior chronic medical issues. IMSS has some restrictions.


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## Cristobal (Nov 25, 2014)

LMtortugas said:


> My understanding is that both universal enrollment and access to basic health care through citizenship alone is ensured through Seguro Popular, a principal component of the SSPH legislation passed shortly after the turn of the century.


Theoretically. But EPN proposed the Sistema de Seguridad Social Universal that supposedly would guarantee everyone access to the health care system. I believe that was put on hold due to cost.


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## Bobbyb (Mar 9, 2014)

I would never use the words technology and Seguro Popular or IMSS in the same sentence. In most cases it is 3rd world medical care. Mexico has some excellent PRIVATE health care and there is lots of private health insurance available.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Bobbyb said:


> I would never use the words technology and Seguro Popular or IMSS in the same sentence. In most cases it is 3rd world medical care. Mexico has some excellent PRIVATE health care and there is lots of private health insurance available.


Maybe you are exaggerating for effect. If not, I would disagree with your assessment of IMSS. I have no experience with Seguro Popular, but have used IMSS somewhat. The principal problem I have found with IMSS is a long wait to see specialists for non-emergency care. The actual care provided as been competent. Fortunately, I have not used it a lot, so my experience is limited, but what experience I have had contradicts your statement.


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## Bobbyb (Mar 9, 2014)

I do admit that in some areas the care is acceptable. But in Sonora, especially Hermosillo and the surrounding cities the health care is not even 3 rd world. Drs. who either do not care or are just so overworked they cannot function. IMSS pharmacies that run out of popular meds by the middle of the month. However a "tip" magically gets you what is needed. My wife has female friends that underwent Caesarian operations and the scar looks like someone was slashed from top to bottom. Not unusual for patients to be released and have to return due to infections . I have seen the equipment and some of the common stuff is probably 50 years old. Dirty and rusty. The General Hospital is filthy. If you are lucky they will send you to Obregon where there are real Drs. and better equipment. We have friends who have government jobs and they have a separate health system. ISSTE for Federal and ISSTESON for state and municipal. Good Drs. BTW: In the IMSS hospital/clinic that is close to us they do not make appointments for any specific time. You are told to be there @ 8 am and the wait can be 4 or more hours. Or at 2 PM you are told to return the next day! Many of the nurses are very Catholic and single mothers are often turned away. The Triki Indians are denied coverage! I am told by farm workers that the care in Oaxaca is also second class. We go to the CIMA hospital in HMO and it is top notch. But by Mexican standards it is expensive. Worth the price .


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

In Chiapas I have heard from people in indigenas communities that Seguro Popular and IMSS are basically the same and people who can pay their own doctors do not go there. They perform a service to people who otherwise would have no health care but if I had a baby I sure would not take him or her there.
There were demonstrations last uear in San Cristobal for the poor care a Chamula woman received in the hospital of the Women where she died after a c seccion.

I think the level of the various hospital vary greatly according to areas.

My neighbors have a private clinic next door that is not cheap and it is packed with indigenous women from Zinacantan and some from Chamula who pay to have their babies delivered there rather than go to Seguro Popular or IMSS in town,


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

It does depend a lot on where you live in Mexico. A Mexican friend recently had a hysterectomy here in Mexico City at an IMSS hospital specializing in women's health problem. She received excellent care and is now back to her usual busy routine. We should keep in mind that many physicians work for SP and IMSS also have private practices, and I'm sure give the same care to their public and private patients, at least, I would hope that that is the case.


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## Cristobal (Nov 25, 2014)

Many of the specialists that work in IMSS hospitals also have very competent and succesful private practices. As has already been said, the quality of service varies according to location. To criticize all IMSS with a blanket condemnation is ridiculous. Especially the comment about technology and IMSS in the same sentence. Some IMSS installations in the DF have some of the most advanced technology and equipment in Latin America, including the top private hospitals.

One example:

http://www.jornada.unam.mx/2014/11/22/sociedad/038n2soc


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## Bobbyb (Mar 9, 2014)

My comments are based on my visual experiences. Maybe in Mexico City things are different. What I see in Sonora is exactly like I stated. Do a Google and you will see the problems Mexico faces with a public health system that s underfunded. Often some cities with political connections will get help while the poorer areas get nada. Here is a cut and paste on the subject. BTW: I wonder how many posters actually use IMSS as their only provider????? Or is it do as I say not as I do?

In Mexico’s poorer states and among its most destitute, that quality is still lacking. A study by Mexico’s National Institute for Public Health questioned how well the plan was being carried out at the state and local levels, saying their contributions and lack of transparency “leave much to be desired.” 

This month, Mexico’s health minister, José Ángel Córdova, acknowledged the gaps, noting that 8 percent of the country’s municipalities still lacked any kind of health facility. “There is still first-, second- and third-class medicine,” he said in a speech. 

While the undertaking is relatively young, the Health Ministry’s own statistics show that it is behind its own targets in reducing infant and maternal mortality — key health indicators — in the poorest states.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

Bobbyb said:


> My comments are based on my visual experiences. Maybe in Mexico City things are different. What I see in Sonora is exactly like I stated. . .


I don't doubt for a minute that things are as bad in Sonora as you have written. And my comments are based on what my friend told me about her experience in an IMSS hospital. Other friends here have told me positive things about their experiences with IMSS. So it's not "maybe" things are different here, they are in fact "different".


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## Bobbyb (Mar 9, 2014)

I apologize for that wording. There is another problem that IMSS must face. Being Canadian I am quite familiar with the costs associated with today's technology. IMSS can buy an MRI but what good is this machine if there is a need that far exceeds the $$ needed to run the equipment. So if 5000 people need an MRI this month but there is only enough $$ to do 3000 what happens. I know what happens in Canada. It is a long wait list. Our Provincial Health Minister recently announced that the # of knee and Hip replacements in 2015 will be reduced due to budget constraints. Wait times can be over a year. I wonder how Mexico handles these problems? If your IMSS Dr. needs to do heart surgery will you get urgent service or wait a long time. How many patients will be sent to the private hospitals with the bill being covered by IMSS? This is a problem that all public health systems face and the US citizens on this forum may not be used to being told you may wait until it is too late. I call this metered medicine. Some bureaucrat decides how many procedures will be done this year. And the wait lists just grow.


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## Cristobal (Nov 25, 2014)

My experience comes through providing IMSS coverage for quite a number of employees over several decades. And having them and their families recieve treatment for broken bones to child birth to heart disease to cleft palates. Plus having several doctors in the family, one in particular that did many reconstructive surgeries in IMSS hospitals while also maintaining his private practice and teaching at med school. The same fellow needed specialized medical attention that was provided at an IMSS hospital in Mexico City. It was the only place in Mexico that that particular treatment was offered.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

Bobbyb said:


> My comments are based on my visual experiences. Maybe in Mexico City things are different. What I see in Sonora is exactly like I stated. Do a Google and you will see the problems Mexico faces with a public health system that s underfunded. Often some cities with political connections will get help while the poorer areas get nada. Here is a cut and paste on the subject. BTW: I wonder how many posters actually use IMSS as their only provider????? Or is it do as I say not as I do?
> 
> In Mexico’s poorer states and among its most destitute, that quality is still lacking. A study by Mexico’s National Institute for Public Health questioned how well the plan was being carried out at the state and local levels, saying their contributions and lack of transparency “leave much to be desired.”
> 
> ...



Google Translation:

"Gradually, the hospital, one of the most modern in the country, will integrate the rest of attention. Billion $ investment. It will employ 1,560 workers. 60% of it is ready.

Hermosillo, Sonora

Friday 15 March 2013

On Tuesday March 19, 2013 the new modern General Hospital no. 16 IMSS, located in Hermosillo, start caring for tens of thousands of beneficiaries and depressurizing the service of other facilities.

This afternoon, the delegate of the IMSS in Sonora, Ariel Leyva Almeida; Chief Medical Care, Marco Antonio Hernández Carrillo; as well as other managers and builders, led a tour of the facilities which have a 96% advance accompanied by media directors and journalists from the state capital."

:: KIOSCO MAYOR ::

Seems Sonora caught up almost 2 years ago in IMSS technology and health care quality.

I seem to see things changing faster in Mexico than many people and some seem to be stuck "back in time" with their stories and experiences.


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## maesonna (Jun 10, 2008)

The discussion drifted into other interesting territory, so I wanted *ktmarie* to be clear on the answer to her original question;


> if there are any options that exist for her (that don't exist for us) given her citizenship,


 the answer is “no” because all of the options that exist for her will exist for you, too, as legal residents of Mexico. You will be eligible to enroll in IMSS or Seguro Popular.


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## LMtortugas (Aug 23, 2013)

maesonna said:


> The discussion drifted into other interesting territory, so I wanted *ktmarie* to be clear on the answer to her original question; the answer is “no” because all of the options that exist for her will exist for you, too, as legal residents of Mexico. You will be eligible to enroll in IMSS or Seguro Popular.


Very well summarized.


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## Cristobal (Nov 25, 2014)

maesonna said:


> The discussion drifted into other interesting territory, so I wanted *ktmarie* to be clear on the answer to her original question; the answer is “no” because all of the options that exist for her will exist for you, too, as legal residents of Mexico. You will be eligible to enroll in IMSS or Seguro Popular.


I don't believe the OP mentioned their immigration status. They could possibly be here on a tourist pass.


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## maesonna (Jun 10, 2008)

Yes, that’s why I mentioned that these health plan options are open to residents of Mexico. I should clarify that means foreigners who reside in Mexico on a resident visa, whether _temporal_ or _permanente_.


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