# standard of living as a primary teacher



## marv1 (Apr 14, 2014)

Hi 
I'm considering a move to Spain next August and wanted to know if a primary teacher can make a good living there?
I have a PGCE, and by next August will have completed my NQT (induction) year. I also have 3 years TEFL teaching, and a high level of Spanish. So I'll be aiming to work in an international school, but in my (limited) research I've seen mixed reports on how far an international school teacher salary will go...is there anyone on the ground who could shed some light? I used to live in Mexico and international school teachers there enjoyed a comfortable lifestyle - central and spacious apartments, regular dining out, regular traveling etc etc - and am wondering if I could get something similar in Spain (and be closer to home - UK) 
I'm pretty open to location, although Valencia is probably top of the list.
I'm single with no dependents, I would require my own apartment - no sharing.
Thanks for reading, any thoughts would be much appreciated!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marv1 said:


> Hi
> I'm considering a move to Spain next August and wanted to know if a primary teacher can make a good living there?
> I have a PGCE, and by next August will have completed my NQT (induction) year. I also have 3 years TEFL teaching, and a high level of Spanish. So I'll be aiming to work in an international school, but in my (limited) research I've seen mixed reports on how far an international school teacher salary will go...is there anyone on the ground who could shed some light? I used to live in Mexico and international school teachers there enjoyed a comfortable lifestyle - central and spacious apartments, regular dining out, regular traveling etc etc - and am wondering if I could get something similar in Spain (and be closer to home - UK)
> I'm pretty open to location, although Valencia is probably top of the list.
> ...


I don't know what primary teachers in International schools earn

but I do know a head of 6th in one, who supplements his income by being an exam marker for A levels & also giving private tuition....


I doubt he'd work full time & do private work as well unless he needed to

he's married - all his kids are grown with their own families though, so just two of them to support


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

The OP would probably do better to find out the salaries herself and then ask about how far that amount of money would go in whichever area she is interested in. I know a few primary school teachers at international schools in Madrid and they seem to do OK. If you can earn anything above €20k then you can probably get the lifetsyle you specify (possibly with a pool and gym thrown in as well). In fact Madrid is worth considering because it must have at least 20 international schools to choose from, and for a capital city it is relatively cheap to live in.


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## Madliz (Feb 4, 2011)

I know someone earning around €2,000 a month as an English primary teacher in an international school in Madrid.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Madliz said:


> I know someone earning around €2,000 a month as an English primary teacher in an international school in Madrid.


is that a full year or term-time only contract?


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## Madliz (Feb 4, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> is that a full year or term-time only contract?


It's a permanent contract. 12 monthly payments.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Madliz said:


> It's a permanent contract. 12 monthly payments.


so lucky

lots of schools still pull the term time only deal


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## 213979 (Apr 11, 2013)

Madliz said:


> It's a permanent contract. 12 monthly payments.


Sounds about right. Public primary teachers up here earn 1,800€ in 14 payments.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I had a friend who was a secondary teacher in an international school and she supported herself and her husband, altho he was also in receipt of a military pension. They had a nice two bedroom villa and a car, and managed fine. I dont know how much she earned, but she did say it was nowhere near what she could have earned in the UK - but that didnt matter

Jo xxx


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Standard of living will depend on the area you live but Spanish International schools aren't known for high pay, and some actually treat their teachers quite badly. Beware the 10 month contract already mentioned and schools who also expect you to teach at summer school with no extra payment. 

Around 2000€ at the better schools sounds about right. Depending on where you live, you could pay rent of 300 or 400€ per month for a decent house, or about 600€ for a one bed. I suspect pay might mirror the cost of living in the area though. Most of the teachers I knew had a nice enough lifestyle- able to have a few nights out, etc, but they had to budget. Few had cars, especially if living alone.


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## marv1 (Apr 14, 2014)

Thanks everyone for their responses, very helpful.
The jobs I've seen so far pay between EUR 18k and 24k, I assume this is before tax and over 12 months.
This seemed really low compared to a teacher's pay in the UK, but I know it depends on local cost of living. I'm hoping to get out to Valencia this summer to get an idea of how far that money will go there. I guess Madrid and Barcelona would be more expensive (?)

Brocher - could you add any more info about when you said some of the schools treat their teachers badly?

Thanks again for the replies, your advice is much appreciated. If anyone has any more info regarding how far that salary will go, or what it's like working for those schools, please add!


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

marv1 said:


> Thanks everyone for their responses, very helpful.
> The jobs I've seen so far pay between EUR 18k and 24k, I assume this is before tax and over 12 months.
> This seemed really low compared to a teacher's pay in the UK, but I know it depends on local cost of living. I'm hoping to get out to Valencia this summer to get an idea of how far that money will go there. I guess Madrid and Barcelona would be more expensive (?)
> 
> ...



Hi marv,it's really hard to say how far salary will go, so much depends on area and it's not just cities that can be more expensive. Often the tourist coastal towns can be expensive I.e a one bed half decent flat in Marbella area is likely to be about 600€ . month. Other than that, the general rule of thumb is usually, what you need in pounds, is what you'll need in euros. Of. Purse, you then have to add the cost of setting up in a new country, either shipping your belongings or buying essentials when you arrive- furnished flats often lack a lot of things!

I'm not sure you can be too fussy about which area you get a job in if you have only just qualified, as there is plenty competition for posts and many expect a few years experience.

What you need to remember is that many of these international schools are businesses run to make maximum profit, so they may have good reputations with pupils and parents, but attempt to get the maximum from staff at minimum cost! Don't assume anything about salary and conditions. I have read stories of teachers arriving before finding out that their contract conditions are pretty awful. You should spend a bit of time reading the TES forums- it can take a bit of time to work out which schools are being referred to as they can't be named directly.

The main problems about treating teachers badly have already been mentioned- 9 or 10 month contract, so no pay all summer, being expected to teach summer school or Saturday mornings with no extra pay. I've even read of some teachers who were expected to teach at other schools in the group but in different cities with no pay at summer school - meaning that they had to pay for extra accommodation.

there are plenty reputable schools too, though!

PS recruitment usually begins about January/ February for the following September.


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## Madliz (Feb 4, 2011)

Marv1 states in the first post that he/she has a high level of Spanish. Just as a warning to anyone else reading this thread who doesn't, one does have to converse with Spanish parents about their child's progress! I have, as a parent, been called over to act as translator between the newly arrived teachers and parents when neither could communicate with the other.


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

You can get a +50m2 central apartment in central Madrid for €500/month these days and transport will cost you €50/month. Probably not as cheap as Valencia but that's where the main saving is compared to the UK. Also council tax is very low and going out is cheaper as well - depending on what you drink and provided you avoid the tourist traps, you can easily stick to say a €20 budget for the night. If you consider most other stuff costs about the same as the UK then that should give an idea of where the savings are.

However things like flights home, and other one-off expenses like changing a mattress, fixing a washing machine, etc can soon ruin even the best planned budgets.

Another thing to bear in mind is that many British International schools follow the UK system of half terms and shorter summer holidays, but others have longer summer holidays and no half terms. Shorter summer holidays means less time to earn extra cash at summer camps, etc.


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## Turtles (Jan 9, 2011)

My wife teaches at an international school and the salary figure quoted on her contract includes the two months of dole that she has to apply for every June. She finds that pretty humiliating, although she enjoys the holiday.


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## 213979 (Apr 11, 2013)

Turtles said:


> My wife teaches at an international school and the salary figure quoted on her contract includes the two months of dole that she has to apply for every June. She finds that pretty humiliating, although she enjoys the holiday.


They put the amount she earns on _paro_ *in* the contract!?!?!?!!!! 

How is that even legal?


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## Turtles (Jan 9, 2011)

Welcome to the fantasy world of Spanish private education.


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Turtles said:


> My wife teaches at an international school and the salary figure quoted on her contract includes the two months of dole that she has to apply for every June. She finds that pretty humiliating, although she enjoys the holiday.


Just the kind of job I was warning against!

Putting paro in contract, surely that must be illegal! If she pays tax and NI on her whole salary, then that means she'd be paying deductions on her dole money, too.

I hope your wife is looking round for another job.


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## Turtles (Jan 9, 2011)

It's all legit - just disappointing. Everything is declared and taxed as income, whether it comes as salary or dole money. You could say it's the Social Security system that should really feel cheated, although perhaps this is a kind of colegio concertado, with 90% of the costs being met by the parents and only 10% odd coming from the state. In some ways it's more honest than some concertados whose staff are effectively buying and selling public sector jobs among themselves.


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

Turtles said:


> It's all legit - just disappointing. Everything is declared and taxed as income, whether it comes as salary or dole money. You could say it's the Social Security system that should really feel cheated, although perhaps this is a kind of colegio concertado, with 90% of the costs being met by the parents and only 10% odd coming from the state. In some ways it's more honest than some concertados whose staff are effectively buying and selling public sector jobs among themselves.


Sorry but I'm getting confused by your posts. I honestly don't think that paro can be included in a contract. Maybe they included it in the salary when they advertised the job, but that's different. Also concertados are mainly state subsidised. AFAIK the parents pay a voluntary contribution of up to €100/month tops, and that usually does cover genuine expenses like assistants to welcome the children at the gates. Also teachers at concertados are not employed by the state. The school is funded by the state but the teachers are not state employees like they are at public schools. Furthermore concertados have to follow the Spanish curriculum and other rules in order to receive state funding, but you said your wife teaches at an International school. An International school almost by definition does not follow the Spanish curriculum and therefore cannot be a concertado.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Turtles said:


> It's all legit - just disappointing. Everything is declared and taxed as income, whether it comes as salary or dole money. You could say it's the Social Security system that should really feel cheated, although perhaps this is a kind of colegio concertado, with 90% of the costs being met by the parents and only 10% odd coming from the state. In some ways it's more honest than some concertados whose staff are effectively buying and selling public sector jobs among themselves.


It is not legit to include unemployment benefit payment in the salary of any job.

Yes, tax is payable on unemployment benefit


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

marv1 said:


> Thanks everyone for their responses, very helpful.
> The jobs I've seen so far pay between EUR 18k and 24k, I assume this is before tax and over 12 months.
> This seemed really low compared to a teacher's pay in the UK, but I know it depends on local cost of living. I'm hoping to get out to Valencia this summer to get an idea of how far that money will go there. I guess Madrid and Barcelona would be more expensive (?)
> 
> ...


Salaries are lower than UK salaries, but I couldn't tell you exactly what the average salary is. I don't know if it's been mentioned here but sometimes there are 14 salary payments in a year, so that may need to looked into.
I know someone who recently did a few months in an international school and was appalled at having to use chalk and a blackboard so if you're equating private with better facilities, maybe I should warn you now that that's not usually the case here. The main thing parents are interested in atm is honing their children's language skills so native teachers are more important than cutting edge technology


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## Turtles (Jan 9, 2011)

In order to get the salary listed on the contract she needs to claim paro for July and August. It's not what a professional wants, but it's what she gets.
Concertados are often staffed by shareholders, but unlike shareholder employees in real private companies these ones have a guaranteed source of state funds to pay their salaries. By buying a share in a concertado you are effectively putting yourself on the civil service payroll without having to spend years studying for oposiciones. 
My wife's school is obviously not a concertado, but I'm making the point that the state is still subsidising it by paying for the staff's dole every summer. You could argue that this is a good deal for the state as it gets a few kids educated at lower cost to itself than with concertados or fully public schools. You could also argue that my wife's employer is taking the mick.


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

Turtles said:


> In order to get the salary listed on the contract she needs to claim paro for July and August. It's not what a professional wants, but it's what she gets.
> Concertados are often staffed by shareholders, but unlike shareholder employees in real private companies these ones have a guaranteed source of state funds to pay their salaries. By buying a share in a concertado you are effectively putting yourself on the civil service payroll without having to spend years studying for oposiciones.
> My wife's school is obviously not a concertado, but I'm making the point that the state is still subsidising it by paying for the staff's dole every summer. You could argue that this is a good deal for the state as it gets a few kids educated at lower cost to itself than with concertados or fully public schools. You could also argue that my wife's employer is taking the mick.


OK that's clearer now. However I'm certain your wife could take her employer to court if the employer is not paying what is on the contract.

Yes there are many problems with concertados. The teachers, being partners, are basically unsackable so they can get away with anything, at the tax payer's expense. On top of that most concertados are very catholic, so the tax payer is subsidising the teaching of a specific doctrine.

As you suggest, the deal with paro probably doesn't cost the state much more, and I guess the alternative would be the school paying your wife less for 12 months. So maybe your wife gets a better deal out of it as well. And don't forget, your wife does pay taxes, so she is basically getting some of her tax money back via the paro. 

Also it is the norm for teaching academies to do say 10 month contracts each year, so it doesn't surprise me that some international schools do the same. It's just the fact that your wike's school includes the paro in the contracted salary that surprises me. Part of the problem is that making your wife a full time employee on an indefinido contract brings in a whole load of additional liabilities and expenses for the employer, so they try to avoid it. The problem has a lot to do with Spanish labour laws as well.


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## marv1 (Apr 14, 2014)

Thanks everyone for the informative responses. There are some terms used which I'm not familiar with so will have to do a little research, but its been an eye opener to see that some schools don't pay over the summer - definitely something I'll need to check any contract for. 
It sounds like there are big differences in the pay, conditions and facilities of different international schools there...if anyone has names of any reputable schools or ones to avoid, I'd be grateful if you could pass them on, either on the forum or PM.
Thanks again!!


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

marv1 said:


> Thanks everyone for the informative responses. There are some terms used which I'm not familiar with so will have to do a little research, but its been an eye opener to see that some schools don't pay over the summer - definitely something I'll need to check any contract for.
> It sounds like there are big differences in the pay, conditions and facilities of different international schools there...if anyone has names of any reputable schools or ones to avoid, I'd be grateful if you could pass them on, either on the forum or PM.
> Thanks again!!


You can look at TES website forum for schools to avoid. No one here would have the knowledge to give advice on the many, many International Schools in Spain. On TES, the schools can't be named but you may find references like the " school named after a big white bird." You just have to read as much as you can on that website for schools to avoid,/ seek out.

I guess the terms you don't understand are "concertado' (sp?) etc. You don't need to worry about that, they have nothing to do with International Schools where you'd be eligible to work, or which you'll see advertised on TES. They were just mentioned here as a slight digression!

If you're quoted an annual salary then I guess it doesn't matter how many payments it's spread over. just make sure they don't quote a monthly salary and forget to say that it's only paid for 10mths!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

brocher said:


> If you're quoted an annual salary then I guess it doesn't matter how many payments it's spread over. just make sure they don't quote a monthly salary and forget to say that it's only paid for 10mths!


It might because you might not be getting the amount of money you thought you were getting on the date you thought you were getting it!


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Pesky Wesky said:


> It might because you might not be getting the amount of money you thought you were getting on the date you thought you were getting it!


Well, you should be getting all tej money you thought you were getting unless they include paro which I'm sure must be illegal!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

brocher said:


> Well, you should be getting all tej money you thought you were getting unless they include paro which I'm sure must be illegal!


Of course. I'm just trying to say that the distribution of the money may be different to what you expect and that can sometimes cause problems when you are expecting money in your account to do x,y,z.
Including unemployment benefit as part of your salary is the weirdest, most ridiculous thing I've heard of. How can it possibly be described as salary if it's not paid by the school? If the school is doing this to the staff, I dread to think of all the ways they are ripping off the parents and the kids. 
Still it sounds as if Turtle's wife knew about this from the start so other malpractises shouldn't be a surprise!


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## marge777 (Jun 28, 2014)

I've been offered a part-time job teaching English at a private academy (18-20 hours a week). Salary is around 450-500 EUR, I think that's extremely low, am I right?


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

marge777 said:


> I've been offered a part-time job teaching English at a private academy (18-20 hours a week). Salary is around 450-500 EUR, I think that's extremely low, am I right?


Less than extremely low!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Chopera said:


> Less than extremely low!


unless that's weekly salary.....


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## marge777 (Jun 28, 2014)

No, it's a monthly salary... I guess for 10-12 hours a week would've been OK but 18-20 is a different story.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

marge777 said:


> No, it's a monthly salary... I guess for 10-12 hours a week would've been OK but 18-20 is a different story.


ridiculously low then

not even great for 10-12 hours a week


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## castaway06 (Jul 25, 2014)

As a living wage 500-600 is impossible (though maybe someone should tell the government that as they think you can survive on 450!)

I have worked for an academy, and now work in an international school. For academies here expect to take home about 12-15 euros an hour. So on that basis the 500 euro monthly quoted is about right.

The legal minimum for academy work is actually about 5.60 an hour, and what most of them do is put that number on your nominia (official payslip) and pay the rest in cash in an envelope.


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

castaway06 said:


> As a living wage 500-600 is impossible (though maybe someone should tell the government that as they think you can survive on 450!)
> 
> I have worked for an academy, and now work in an international school. For academies here expect to take home about 12-15 euros an hour. So on that basis the 500 euro monthly quoted is about right.
> 
> The legal minimum for academy work is actually about 5.60 an hour, and what most of them do is put that number on your nominia (official payslip) and pay the rest in cash in an envelope.


For 18-20 hours/week a salary of €450-500/month works out at between €5.20/hr and €6.40/hr.


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## castaway06 (Jul 25, 2014)

Chopera said:


> For 18-20 hours/week a salary of €450-500/month works out at between €5.20/hr and €6.40/hr.


Sorry my mistake I was getting mixed up between the official rate and the envelope rate.

As per the relevant convenio (agreement between unions and government) the official rate is about 5.40 and hour and in my experience this is what you will see on your nomina (official payslip) as it minimises the huge amount of tax and social security the academy has to pay for employing you . The difference between that amount and the agreed amount, comes once a month in an envelope.

So the take home would be about 900 for a 20 hour week.


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## marge777 (Jun 28, 2014)

900 would be great for a 20-hour work week! I worked 35 hours weekly for 850. I'm so disappointed right now.


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