# HELP Adivce Urgently Needed



## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Really sorry to seem to be like all the others but I really need some advice. 
My family and I are due to move to Spain within the next couple of months but my wife is getting cold feet due to the economic situation.

It is not something that we have taken lightly but as of the rest of the world we seem to have been caught up in the financial crisis.
We actually started our plans over a year ago and while we have enough money to cover us for 6 to 12 months we were wondering what the expats thought about our chances of survival. 
As I have already explained we think we have enough cash to live on for at least six months but were wondering if you all think we should stay put here or give it a bash. While my wife is not to sure of the language my children and I know enough to get by and worst case scenario with our savings to support us I am open to any sort of work from fruit picking, bar work to anything really.

Muchas gracias.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I dont know what your chances are, the work situation here is very bad, its not what you know its who you know and you´ll not only be up against spaniards, but also other desperate expats for ANY work, however humble it may be. 

If you really want to do this tho, what I will say is this: Treat it as an experiment! Tell yourselves, family and friends that you are simply giving it a try for one year. DONT BURN YOUR UK BRIDGES, maybe even make some loose plans to return?! If things work out then great, if they dont then you´ve had a year in the sun and tried. Seriously, thinking like this will take some of the fear away and make it seem less daunting. 

Jo x


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

BLUNT answer - do not come. 

That's the Reader's Digest but if you want more info just read back through almost every thread. 

Fruit picking - zero chance. (see previous thread) 
Bar work - join the queues. Almost zero chance 

Survival - I wish you well but I did not come on to this planet to survive and what you are looking at looks like survival at best and hell at worse.


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## Xose (Dec 10, 2008)

DH1875 said:


> Really sorry to seem to be like all the others but I really need some advice.
> My family and I are due to move to Spain within the next couple of months but my wife is getting cold feet due to the economic situation.
> 
> It is not something that we have taken lightly but as of the rest of the world we seem to have been caught up in the financial crisis.
> ...


A lot depends on your current situaion back home. If you're not working bacause you've lost your job, then JoJo's spot on in my humble opinion. Come over for say 6 months (best six months of the year anyway with summer jobs - few as they will be and with 500% resources to cover them) but at least it's a better shot than post season.

Then of course there's the kids ages. If they are early primary, then it's a wonderful experience opportunity for them, even only 6 months - and at a certain age (8 and under) they'll go back to the UK if you decide that, with a new language learnt. If they are half way through secondary, it could be a very bad move as it will split their education - the UK system is very different to the baccalaureat type system in Spain. OK if you were staying, but breaking the UK system for 6 months at a certain age could be very harmful.

All that said and if you decide to give it a go in any case, after the 6 months, if nothing works out, go back and get on the tredmill again.

All of these things are very individualistic so it's difficult to give anything but a personal opinion. But as I've said in tha past and got shot for it, if you're in hell there, then why not see what hell is like here rather than forever wonder what if - since comming to Galicia I've met a lot of people who went to the UK for 6 months and came back 20+ years later. Likewise for English and American people here who saw the life options and opted for quality of life rather than the corporate climbing greasy pole. Like I said, depends entirely on your circumstances... but all that said, having the ability to go back, even if you never do, is the key to being less stressed simply beacuse if all else fails... etc.

Good luck in whatever you decide.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Xose said:


> All that said and if you decide to give it a go in any case, after the 6 months, if nothing works out, go back and get on the tredmill again.
> 
> All of these things are very individualistic so it's difficult to give anything but a personal opinion. But as I've said in tha past and got shot for it, if you're in hell there, then why not see what hell is like here rather than forever wonder what if - since comming to Galicia I've met a lot of people who went to the UK for 6 months and came back 20+ years later. Likewise for English and American people here who saw the life options and opted for quality of life rather than the corporate climbing greasy pole. Like I said, depends entirely on your circumstances... but all that said, having the ability to go back, even if you never do, is the key to being less stressed simply beacuse if all else fails... etc.
> 
> Good luck in whatever you decide.



You also have to remember that if its hell for you in the UK at least its hell with money(UB), NHS, family, friends, familiar surroundings, first language..... Ok, in Spain you have the weather (only in the summer), the views, the beaches, BUT with no income and no money its hell!



Jo


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## Xose (Dec 10, 2008)

jojo said:


> You also have to remember that if its hell for you in the UK at least its hell with money(UB), NHS, family, friends, familiar surroundings, first language..... Ok, in Spain you have the weather (only in the summer), the views, the beaches, BUT with no income and no money its hell!
> 
> 
> 
> Jo


Agree, however, UB? OK, but shouldn't stop you having a go at something you really want to do. Sign on now or in six months isn't exactly a gamble given the quantities involved and also given that once you're on, you're in and leaving it for a few months isn't proceduraly easy.
NHS, they will have E111 cover as they will effectively be on holiday for the "Test" period.
Family and Friends - absolutely, but then, if it's only for a few months and it doesn't work out, they'll be there when they return to the UK.

Bottom line, it's try it or not. But what it might not ever be is, go on the dole first, then, if you can't get a job in the UK and your money's run out (God forbid, get repossesed or whatever) then try it. No money to back you up for even 3 or 6 months, the "try it" option is gone.

I guess at the end of the day, the question as always is, just how much do you want to try it?

He who dares rodders - may we may we

Sorry, I know it's a serious matter and one shouldn't take such a move lightly, however, the fact remains that if you don't try you'll never know. If it's no biggie, don't try it!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Xose said:


> Agree, however, UB? OK, but shouldn't stop you having a go at something you really want to do. Sign on now or in six months isn't exactly a gamble given the quantities involved and also given that once you're on, you're in and leaving it for a few months isn't proceduraly easy.
> NHS, they will have E111 cover as they will effectively be on holiday for the "Test" period.
> Family and Friends - absolutely, but then, if it's only for a few months and it doesn't work out, they'll be there when they return to the UK.
> 
> ...



I totally agree! Thats why I always say, dont burn your bridges! I worry for the people with kids who sell up, give up good jobs etc and come here with rose tinted specs on!

Jo


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## Cazzy (Nov 23, 2008)

We moved over for a trial period 4 years ago! We put our 14 year old son in boarding school in the UK as we didn't want to mess his education up. We have stayed in Spain, but work is becoming scarcer as nobody has any money. It worked out well as regards to my son who loved boarding school, and is now at uni in Brighton. My daughter's partner is losing his job in April and they are coming over with a young baby to give it a try, as they have nothing to loose, but only for a couple of months to see if they can get work. If not they are going back. Try it but don't imagine it will be easy!


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

DH1875 said:


> As I have already explained we think we have enough cash to live on for at least six months but were wondering if you all think we should stay put here or give it a bash. While my wife is not to sure of the language my children and I know enough to get by and worst case scenario with our savings to support us I am open to any sort of work from fruit picking, bar work to anything really.


Frankly I think you'll struggle to find CASUAL work. I'd strongly advise you do not come UNLESS you have work lined up.

For years the Spanish did not want to casual stuff - so "immigrants" covered the "shortfall". There is now a visible return by the Spanish to return to agriculture because there is NOTHING ELSE for the unskilled. More people fighting for the same jobs. As a result many non-eu immigrants are accepting the goverment help of a ticket "home". The worse your Spanish is - the lower down the list you'll be for finding work.

The issue is can you live on what the wages will be? - This sort of work will be payin MIN WAGE (600€/month). You will not be eligable for much (if anything) in the way of SocSecurity, child support etc.


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

*Thanks Jo*

Thanks for that Jo.
I realize that finding work is probably going to be the hardest thing but in a way i am lucky as in i will not be in need of a job the minute we arrive, although that wont stop me looking.
Like i said my Soanish is not the greatest but I think I could get by and hopefully it will improve a lot if I am using it more.
We also have a plan of return if things don't work out but I don't know if its a good thing or not as it could be to easy to come back if thinks start to get hard.

Thanks Again.



jojo said:


> I dont know what your chances are, the work situation here is very bad, its not what you know its who you know and you´ll not only be up against spaniards, but also other desperate expats for ANY work, however humble it may be.
> 
> If you really want to do this tho, what I will say is this: Treat it as an experiment! Tell yourselves, family and friends that you are simply giving it a try for one year. DONT BURN YOUR UK BRIDGES, maybe even make some loose plans to return?! If things work out then great, if they dont then you´ve had a year in the sun and tried. Seriously, thinking like this will take some of the fear away and make it seem less daunting.
> 
> Jo x


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Hi everyone,

Thanks for the great advice. Like I said to Jo we are not daft and realize that work is going to be the difficulty.
We have the back up plan in place if it all goes wrong in the first six months but having the plan in place makes me worry that it could be to easy to back out when things get hard.

To be honest with you and you probably wont all agree but we think that if we both find work for €600 euros a month each then we could easily do it. We aren't coming out there to make money and have a wild time, and are quite well aware that even if things work out we will lose most of our savings but we are young enough to start again here if need be.
We are looking to send the children to state school so we wont have to worry about the cost of a private school.
Also we didn't think we would be intitled to any benefit in Spain so it is not something we have looked into so if anyone has any info.

You are all stars.


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

DH1875 said:


> To be honest with you and you probably wont all agree but we think that if we both find work for €600 euros a month each then we could easily do it.


I think (depending on what accomdation you find) you'd be better to aim for a total of 2000/month as a sensible minimum.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

I think 1200 would be very tight. 

I have said this sooooooooooooooooo many times. People forget there will be extras that nobody could have forseen. 

Examples: I locked myself out of the car 150 euro taxi fare
The locksmith for the apartment 85 euros 
I had a laptop stolen - 900 euros replacement
Friends came unexpectedly - they expected tours of Málaga, Granada, Marbella, meals out etc - 1,000 euros I had not budgeted for that week? 
How about emergency medical expenses, the fair comes to town, kids need school books/uniform @ 300 euros each per annum (you pay here!) etc? 
One of you ends up in hospital - 100 euros per day/week etc transport to viist. Car blows up - x hundred euros. a couple of police fines for parking or because it's Monday, electricity packs up and you have to buy a couple of gas heaters etc. 

What about the month only one of you has work? That's another 600 you have to find.

Have you left meat on the bone for these TYPE of eventualities? For four people to even survive on 1200 seems very tight 




Good Luck


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Hi Steve,

Of course 1200 would be tight but if we stay long term we would hopefully be making more than that and, that is what our savings are for. Like I said before we are well aware that we will lose them, even if things work out.
Although we are looking for work we will have enough to get by for at least a few months easy.

To be honest I am quite a hard guy and family and freinds know that if they turned up at my door looking for a free holiday they would be told were to go. If they want to go anywhere then they can pay for it themselves.
The school we have enquired about does not have a uniform and is only a three minute walk away.
As for the car situation, we are not going to buy a car over there until we know for sure that we are staying. Not even sure if we need one as everything we will need is within walking distance and again if we really need to get anywhere we can hire for the day (don't worry we have already budgeted for it).

Would the E111 not cover us for most emerginces for a couple of months?

Cheers.





SteveHall said:


> I think 1200 would be very tight.
> 
> I have said this sooooooooooooooooo many times. People forget there will be extras that nobody could have forseen.
> 
> ...


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Looks like you have thought things through - the examples I were giving were just that - "examples". There could be a million and one neither of us could even think of. 

Living without a car ? Tough with 4 of you ...I have done it for 3 years and struggle to think I'd ever want one again. I am sure a LOT of expats could improve their finances massively without a car but it does seem it's the absolute last thing most will let go of. 

Good Luck - happy to meet up when you make it over here. Keep practicar, practicar, practicar, repitir, repitir, repitir 
Sounds like you have the right atttitude.


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

DH1875 said:


> Would the E111 not cover us for most emerginces for a couple of months?


AFAIK - The E111 is only a hols thing. As soon as you're registerred as resident here I believe it loses its validity. 

Problem is you have a very finate time period to register in (if) and it's ambigous your intention is to reside here - iirc reading here 30 days. Where's Stavinsky when you need him?

I cant imagine living where I am without a car (plus a backup) - I admire your resolve.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

..but you have chose to live in el **** del campo. I am a city boy and still think that milk comes from Eroski and coffee beans from Mercadona


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> ..but you have chose to live in el **** del campo. I am a city boy and still think that milk comes from Eroski and coffee beans from Mercadona


Silly boy - Milk comes from Mercadona and coffee from LIDL. I thought everybody knew that. Even for those of us out here surrounded by Osos, Lobos y Jabaliés. And they're 10 road miles away. 

But was hit by the OUTSTANDING news at the weekend that we're to get a Mercadona in our village. Could ALMOST walk there then. Might require a slight dietry adjustment. 

I have lived in a city. Madrid. It was enough to cure me of ever attempting it again, for life.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

¿Hay osos? Pues...... 

Mercadona is not the end of civilisation as we know it but 

Carrefour is in my language "The ¨C¨word"


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Carrefour is in my language "The ¨C¨word"


Yup cant remember the last time we went - but was almost certainly for about 10packs of their cheapest dog-chews - which our doggies seem to rate WAY above anything fancy.


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Hi Steve,
Thanks for that, If I ever make it to TORREVIEJA I will let you know.
Can I take it that your opinion has started to change because the first time you got in contact you advised that we should not come.
Cheers.



SteveHall said:


> Looks like you have thought things through - the examples I were giving were just that - "examples". There could be a million and one neither of us could even think of.
> 
> Living without a car ? Tough with 4 of you ...I have done it for 3 years and struggle to think I'd ever want one again. I am sure a LOT of expats could improve their finances massively without a car but it does seem it's the absolute last thing most will let go of.
> 
> ...


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

I still don't think you should come but you seem determined and you seem to have the gumption to make a fist of it. I wish you every success. BTW I am on the Costa del Sol indefinitely although I still have my house in Torrevieja.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

DH1875 said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Thanks for the great advice. Like I said to Jo we are not daft and realize that work is going to be the difficulty.
> We have the back up plan in place if it all goes wrong in the first six months but having the plan in place makes me worry that it could be to easy to back out when things get hard.
> ...



I´d love to find a job that pays €600 a month, so if you find one let me know!!!! I could do with it to help to pay my latest electricity bill (AAAAGGGGHHH!!! There are some strange goings on with the electricity here at the mo, another topic!!)

One other "nasty" you need to know is that state schools expect you to buy all the kids books, stationary and paper (they provide you with a list of every item your child must have), its only an initial sum at the beginning of the school year, but it cost me €550 and even now, my daughter comes home every now and again needing yet another book for €15 or whatever - really annoying!



Jo x


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## DROOBY (Aug 5, 2008)

DH1875 said:


> Hi Steve,
> Thanks for that, If I ever make it to TORREVIEJA I will let you know.
> Can I take it that your opinion has started to change because the first time you got in contact you advised that we should not come.
> Cheers.


Alrighty Matey.

Really enjoyed reading this thread.
Nice to hear your resolve to things not being great out here for newbies. Sounded like myself last year before we came out this January. 
We came out with our children 3 & 5 and like yourselves moved to a house 5 minutes from village school to save on the school run and i can also say the settled within the first day and absolutly love it.

I don't find the cost of living that much cheaper anymore (good old exchange rate) but we also find were not spending no way near as much back home due to things like, Doing things with the kids is alot cheaper beaches, Park and walking with picnics costs nothing.
I also use the weekly market here and buy veg and fruit off the guy who grows locally its about 10-14euros for 3 carrier bags worth.
Free tapas!!!
Electricty we've found very exspensive. We brought over our gas fires and just changed the regulators and a great life saver is to take the kids out walking collecting cones and branches. Keeps them occupied for hours and gives us free fuel.

My wife is due to start new job next week which will be great as my first job fell through due to restaurant lease holder falling out with owner. we also brought enough money to last at least a year which i do think is a must if only for peace of mind. 
To cut a long comment short. We've been here six weeks (still babies) but we did do alot of visits to the area and research and so made it quite an easy move and we love it so far. Things are not easy and i don't think they will be for a long time but if you live by your means and tighten the belt you'll love it. Resedential certificate, Schools, Registering with town hall and car matriculation were all a peace of cake for us and we don't speak alot of spanish but don't expect it done in a hurry
In fact don't expect anything in a hurry


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## chris(madrid) (Mar 23, 2008)

jojo said:


> One other "nasty" you need to know is that state schools expect you to buy all the kids books, stationary and paper (they provide you with a list of every item your child must have), its only an initial sum at the beginning of the school year, but it cost me €550 and even now, my daughter comes home every now and again needing yet another book for €15 or whatever - really annoying!


Jo - ask the councillor for Education or the local Social Services folk whether YOUR town hall or region offers assistance in this area. iirc the TownHall I work in offered €100/student. Was a regional (Madrid) thing. Ask fast - the Window end often is start March.


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## Cazzy (Nov 23, 2008)

jojo said:


> I´d love to find a job that pays €600 a month, so if you find one let me know!!!! I could do with it to help to pay my latest electricity bill (AAAAGGGGHHH!!! There are some strange goings on with the electricity here at the mo, another topic!!)
> 
> One other "nasty" you need to know is that state schools expect you to buy all the kids books, stationary and paper (they provide you with a list of every item your child must have), its only an initial sum at the beginning of the school year, but it cost me €550 and even now, my daughter comes home every now and again needing yet another book for €15 or whatever - really annoying!
> 
> ...


Apparently the electric went up in January, but Endesa have charged the new rate from december, we are all going to get a refund (ha ha) It is the equivilent to a pound a unit now with the exchange rate!!!


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

[Hi Jo I am sure if have read all about your electricity bill on another thread.
Hope you get it sorted out.
Thanks for the info but I already knew this as we looked into it all when we were looking at schools in the area. As I have said before this is not just a whim we have had and were actually planning it before the world decided to go loco. Things are just going to be harder than we had first planned.

We have thought about staying put, but it could be a case of now or never as we don't want to move the kids when they are older.

We are going to take the 6 month option and if things work out great. If not we will have had a holiday to remember.

Cheers. 

QUOTE=jojo;110700]I´d love to find a job that pays €600 a month, so if you find one let me know!!!! I could do with it to help to pay my latest electricity bill (AAAAGGGGHHH!!! There are some strange goings on with the electricity here at the mo, another topic!!)

One other "nasty" you need to know is that state schools expect you to buy all the kids books, stationary and paper (they provide you with a list of every item your child must have), its only an initial sum at the beginning of the school year, but it cost me €550 and even now, my daughter comes home every now and again needing yet another book for €15 or whatever - really annoying!



Jo x[/QUOTE]


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Hi Drooby,

Glad everything seems to be working out for you. Thats a shame about your job but good luck to your wife.

We actually looked into Frigiliana when we were looking at areas to move to but thought it would be hard to get work in that area and that there wouldn't be much happening in the winter. To be honest we thought it was more of a tourist town for summer holidays. How do you find it, are we right or wrong?

I see that you are Scottish, so hopefully you more than anyone can understand us wanting to get away.

All the best from a cold and really wet Glasgow.



DROOBY said:


> Alrighty Matey.
> 
> Really enjoyed reading this thread.
> Nice to hear your resolve to things not being great out here for newbies. Sounded like myself last year before we came out this January.
> ...


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## DROOBY (Aug 5, 2008)

DH1875 said:


> Hi Drooby,
> 
> Glad everything seems to be working out for you. Thats a shame about your job but good luck to your wife.
> 
> ...


Hi DH

We went for Frigiliana because we know the area and the school has a really good reputation for international kids.
It's been an easy place to settle because it has quite a big percentage of expats but they all seem to interact with the locals and it makes for a good night out here. I've been down to nerja a few times and there is much more of a feeling of community here. I've yet to see it quiet there is always something going on.
With regards to work Nerja, Almunecar, Torrox costa etc. are all within easy scooter distance. this suits me as i like to be set back from where i work makes a day off feel like a day off if you know what i mean.

Yep i can understand you wanting to get away. I've spent alot of time working abroad and everytime i go back to perthshire It's not long before i'm planning another venture.
This one is more is more permanent because i don't want to mess the kids arond with there schooling and the wifes job is permanent with good money (and her parents are the boss) which is a bonus.

Which area are you planning on moving to?


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

DROOBY said:


> Hi DH
> 
> We went for Frigiliana because we know the area and the school has a really good reputation for international kids.
> It's been an easy place to settle because it has quite a big percentage of expats but they all seem to interact with the locals and it makes for a good night out here. I've been down to nerja a few times and there is much more of a feeling of community here. I've yet to see it quiet there is always something going on.
> ...


Evening Drooby,

How is Frigiliana this fine day?
I can take it we were wrong then, like I said the only things that put us off was that we thought it was only really a holiday town for summer holidays and so work would be hard to come by. When we were looking for property on kyero there were a lot for sale and loads to rent.
Does the wifes family live out there to? If so I imagine it makes life a whole lot easier. If you struggle to get work will they not be able to help you find any, or better yet offer you a job to.

Take care.


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## DROOBY (Aug 5, 2008)

DH1875 said:


> Evening Drooby,
> 
> How is Frigiliana this fine day?
> I can take it we were wrong then, like I said the only things that put us off was that we thought it was only really a holiday town for summer holidays and so work would be hard to come by. When we were looking for property on kyero there were a lot for sale and loads to rent.
> ...


Its Raining Never mind give me a feeling of home for the Scotland aly game

Was chating to The chap at town hall Kevin (he is english but has lived here a long time and does all the town hall stuff for the expats very helpful). He was saying few years ago it was that sort of place but has changed alot due to alot more permanent residents. There are quite afew british kids at the school which has helped ours with the transition.
Yep loads to rent on kyero, villasol and nerjarealty.
No wifes parents still live in jockland but own property here. Just so happens not long after we moved here they were needing a manager and handy person so Boabs yer Aunties Maw!
There are few jobs starting to appear in windows around bout I'm just looking for something to get a little experiance for the season before i do my own thing next year.


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

You want a nice website you do drooby!


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Know anybody who could help him, XTreme?


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Know anybody who could help him, XTreme?


Most definitely Steve! And.....no coffee scrounging on my watch either! 

You pulled any sub 30 Espanolas yet....or do you need me to come down there and show you how it's done?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

DROOBY said:


> Its Raining Never mind give me a feeling of home for the Scotland aly game
> 
> Was chating to The chap at town hall Kevin (he is english but has lived here a long time and does all the town hall stuff for the expats very helpful). He was saying few years ago it was that sort of place but has changed alot due to alot more permanent residents. There are quite afew british kids at the school which has helped ours with the transition.




Out of interest is Kevin a rather large chap with a birmingham accent??


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## DROOBY (Aug 5, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Know anybody who could help him, XTreme?


MMMMM! I Wonder!


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## DROOBY (Aug 5, 2008)

jojo said:


> Out of interest is Kevin a rather large chap with a birmingham accent??



He is quite tall but would'nt say he is from Birmingham further south i think.
He is the foreign office person for frigiliana town hall very helpful chap for settling in.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

DROOBY said:


> He is quite tall but would'nt say he is from Birmingham further south i think.
> He is the foreign office person for frigiliana town hall very helpful chap for settling in.



Nope, not the same one!
Jo


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

DROOBY said:


> Its Raining Never mind give me a feeling of home for the Scotland aly game
> 
> Was chating to The chap at town hall Kevin (he is english but has lived here a long time and does all the town hall stuff for the expats very helpful). He was saying few years ago it was that sort of place but has changed alot due to alot more permanent residents. There are quite afew british kids at the school which has helped ours with the transition.
> Yep loads to rent on kyero, villasol and nerjarealty.
> ...


AHH Drooby your not a rugby fan are you.
Believe it or not my oldest daughter plays for the school team.
Thought this was your last aventura for a while cos of the kids. Only joken, good for you but keep in mind if it works out I know a hard working Scot who can speak some Spanish and is up for any challenge.
Been thinking about what you were saying about community spirit and begining to think Frigiliana wouldn't have been such a bad idea after all.
Was looking out my window tonight and there was police ever where. Turns our there was a large gang fight in the area. Nothing new I here you say coming from Glasgow but the frightening thing is it was two GIRL GANGS. I love Scotland and always will but I sometimes think that because we a part of the UK no one really understands how bad it has got here. If you actually look at the life expectancy, murder rate even unemployment rate it is the worst in Western Europe. The sooner we get out the better, would rather struggle in Spain than get buy here comfortably.
Forgot how close you were to Nerja so hopefully if all else fails you will be able to find work for the summer there.

Have one for me,

Salud!


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Sorry everyone but just looking for some more advice.

If I were earning €18,000 per year in Spain before tax how much would I roughly walk away with once the Spanish government took their share?

Thanks.


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

DH1875 said:


> Sorry everyone but just looking for some more advice.
> 
> If I were earning €18,000 per year in Spain before tax how much would I roughly walk away with once the Spanish government took their share?
> 
> Thanks.



Ok I have had a look into this and think it works out at around €13000 a year once every think has been deducted. Can anyone confirm if this is correct or is this way off.


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## Chica (Mar 23, 2009)

*My thoughts*

I may have missed it in the thread somewhere but what part of Spain are you thinking of trying out? I ask this question because andalucia spanish is very difficult to understand  They chop off the ends of their words and totally miss out the middle of some words. They will understand you, but will you understand them  It's just a thought!

In my area, there are very few jobs. There may be cleaning work in the height of the season but it is horrible work, and I mean horrrrrible. August is the time for lazing around the pool under a shady tree. To clean apartments etc is very, very hot work. And pays very little unless you can get some private cleaning. 

In my opinion, I think it a bit risky when there are children to consider. It would take time for them to settle and adjust and be accepted by the other school children which is not always easy. It would be such a shame if they settled in and you would have to return to the UK because it didn't work out.

I know most of us sound negative but that's the way it is over here at the moment. We live on my husbands pension. I have just lost my job and we have to consider severe cutbacks. The cost of living in Spain is also not cheap, especialy if you are renting. If you own your own place and don't need a mortgage, then all is great. 

Anyway, I am sure we will be interested knowing which way you have chosen to go and how you get on and where you end up lol.

Best of luck. xxx


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Chica said:


> I may have missed it in the thread somewhere but what part of Spain are you thinking of trying out? I ask this question because andalucia spanish is very difficult to understand  They chop off the ends of their words and totally miss out the middle of some words. They will understand you, but will you understand them  It's just a thought!
> 
> In my area, there are very few jobs. There may be cleaning work in the height of the season but it is horrible work, and I mean horrrrrible. August is the time for lazing around the pool under a shady tree. To clean apartments etc is very, very hot work. And pays very little unless you can get some private cleaning.
> 
> ...


Hi Chica, thank you for the advice it is much appreciated. Believe me when I say that it is not something that we have taken lightly. We just feel that at this moment in time we have nothing to lose and that it would be better to go with the kids just now before they get any older.
I understand what you are saying about the language but is that not going to be the case what ever part of Spain you relocate to. I think I know enough to get by and I hope that by using it every day it can only get better. It will be hard at first and I will make a lot of mistakes but you learn from them. Like I said the kids are learning as well and I think that by going to a Spanish school and having Spanish freinds they will pick it up in no time.
The school here that they go to is closing down in the summer so either way they will have to go to a new school.
Totally see where you are coming from regarding work but again it is the same every where. I have recently lost my job (again nothing to lose) and there is nothing here. The reason I have asked about the €18,000 per year is that I have been busy looking for work and have actually got a few interviews lined up for when we come over. I might not get any of them but I have a chance which is more than you can say for a lot of people who arrive. Worse case scenario there is always the tele-sales option.
At the end of the day we have enough money to get by for 6 months at least, easy. If one of us finds a job in that time great, if we both find work then we are laughing. AND if it all goes wrong then we can come back here knowing that at least we tried and we will always have our time in Spain.

Will keep in touch and let you know how we get on.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

DH1875 I like your attiitude. I think you are wrong but I will defend your right to the death to be wrong! It's YOUR life and YOUR dream and YOUR decision. 

If you make it to the Costa del Sol I will always interview you.

I think the comments about Andalucian Spanish were OTT. If you listen to educated people down here they speak castellano albeit with an accent and albeit without the letter "s"!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> DH1875 I like your attiitude. I think you are wrong but I will defend your right to the death to be wrong! It's YOUR life and YOUR dream and YOUR decision.
> 
> If you make it to the Costa del Sol I will always interview you.
> 
> I think the comments about Andalucian Spanish were OTT. If you listen to educated people down here they speak castellano albeit with an accent and albeit without the letter "s"!


STEVE I WANNA JOB!! Why wont you interview me LOL!!! 


Andalucian Spanish is a bit different, this is gonna sound really snobby, but I liken it to the difference between the queens english and working class english - common (I dont mean that to sound derogatory!). They dont finish the ends of their words and shorten things at every oportunity. When they get started, its impossible to understand any of it.....!!!!

Jo


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Chica said:


> I may have missed it in the thread somewhere but what part of Spain are you thinking of trying out? I ask this question because andalucia spanish is very difficult to understand  They chop off the ends of their words and totally miss out the middle of some words. They will understand you, but will you understand them  It's just a thought!
> 
> In my area, there are very few jobs. There may be cleaning work in the height of the season but it is horrible work, and I mean horrrrrible. August is the time for lazing around the pool under a shady tree. To clean apartments etc is very, very hot work. And pays very little unless you can get some private cleaning.
> 
> ...


Chica has got some very valid points tho. Especially with the kids. My son has settled fairly well after a year, BUT he is at an international school, with british kis, british teachers and a british curriculum. Its no secret on here that my daughter is at a state school and hates it, she is very unhappy and begs me to go back to the UK. We´ve just had her school report in and it was appalling, its not that she´s a Brit, its that she wont try, wont intergrate, wont do any work either at school or her homework and spends her time day dreaming. I cant tell you how guilty she makes me feel. What am I doing to her life, her education and her future???? The only thing keeping her going here is that she goes horse riding once a week!! 

Sorry, I´m not meaning to saound negative, but there are sooooo many things to consider and I just wanna make sure that you´ve got as many potential problems covered as possible. My son is 14yo and my daughter is 11yo

Jo xx


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

You can have an interview any time you like Jojo. You know that. 

Sadly I cnnot grant time off for you to play nude beach volleyball 

It's not like me to be more diplomatic than others - as I said Educated people speak castellano - albeit with an accent. The better your Spanish the easier it will be for you to understand it but if you speak little/no Spanish it won't matter! They may as well be speaking Polish LOL I think Chaves, Sergio Ramos, David Bisbal and Sergio Garcia "get by" en castellano LOL


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

OMG I forgot Málaga's favorite son Antonio Banderas who is in town this week for the Semana Santa


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> You can have an interview any time you like Jojo. You know that.
> 
> Sadly I cnnot grant time off for you to play nude beach volleyball


Oh ppppppppllllllllllleeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaase!!!??????????

Jo xxxxx


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> Chica has got some very valid points tho. Especially with the kids. My son has settled fairly well after a year, BUT he is at an international school, with british kis, british teachers and a british curriculum. Its no secret on here that my daughter is at a state school and hates it, she is very unhappy and begs me to go back to the UK. We´ve just had her school report in and it was appalling, its not that she´s a Brit, its that she wont try, wont intergrate, wont do any work either at school or her homework and spends her time day dreaming. I cant tell you how guilty she makes me feel. What am I doing to her life, her education and her future???? The only thing keeping her going here is that she goes horse riding once a week!!
> 
> Sorry, I´m not meaning to saound negative, but there are sooooo many things to consider and I just wanna make sure that you´ve got as many potential problems covered as possible. My son is 14yo and my daughter is 11yo
> 
> Jo xx


The OP - who was that??? doesn't mention the kids ages - but I really have to be positive about the state school system in our case - ok we were lucky and brought the kids out at 6 and nearly 8 which appears to be the magic time for really being able to pick up the language quickly (well, 2 in our case : Castellano and Gallego). They settled really well and are flourishing and were fluent in literally a few months. 

Jojo : re your daughter - are there no apoyo teachers there at the state school who can set aside a couple of lessons per week for some one-on-one time with her to increase her language skills and confidence? Have a chat to the director/directora who may be able to help. Has she been able to make any friends locally/take part in after school activities....it's a difficult age, I know, but don't give up hon!!

Tallulah.xx


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Jojo : re your daughter - are there no apoyo teachers there at the state school who can set aside a couple of lessons per week for some one-on-one time with her to increase her language skills and confidence? Have a chat to the director/directora who may be able to help. Has she been able to make any friends locally/take part in after school activities....it's a difficult age, I know, but don't give up hon!!
> 
> Tallulah.xx


Thanks hun, I actually pay a private Spanish teacher to come to our house twice a week, this teacher also says that Ruby is putting up a "wall" and doesnt want to learn, and refuses to speak in spanish apart from single word answers!

I think its her age more than anything else - nearly 12 and is just about hitting puberty !!! She´s also a stubborn little madam and may have a distorted idea that if she keeps this up we´ll go back. But then that makes me wonder why, if she was happy here she would want to??? ´

Interestingly tho, as you know, we have visitors this week and she´s really "showing off" by speaking spanish in front of them. My jaw dropped to the ground last night when she had a fairly long conversation with the waitress!!?

Jo


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Grandchildren! Nature's reward for 21 years of parenthood. 

Ask PasaNada. She has enough of them and over many many years - she´ll tell you that they make the hard yards worthwhile.


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> Thanks hun, I actually pay a private Spanish teacher to come to our house twice a week, this teacher also says that Ruby is putting up a "wall" and doesnt want to learn, and refuses to speak in spanish apart from single word answers!
> 
> I think its her age more than anything else - nearly 12 and is just about hitting puberty !!! She´s also a stubborn little madam and may have a distorted idea that if she keeps this up we´ll go back. But then that makes me wonder why, if she was happy here she would want to??? ´
> 
> ...


You know what, she's taken a lot more on board than anyone thinks, I reckon. Don't give in - it's probably just a confidence thing and her age - and change her private teacher if you can - they really have to try and "capture their audience" and it sounds like she's being a bit negative - Ruby's gonna pick up on this. Really encourage socialising with some (Spanish) friends from school as well - have them over to play/tea - it'll do you the world of good as well and will give you a chance to brush up on your Spanish too with the parents! She'll enjoy correcting your Spanish during conversations with them - mine did! 

Tallulah.x


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

I agree 100% Taliban. That's exactly the way I see it.


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

SteveHall said:


> I agree 100% Taliban. That's exactly the way I see it.



Steve - that karaoke session must have mellowed you  You're not usually in such an agreeable mood!!!

*TALLULAH*.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Steve - that karaoke session must have mellowed you  You're not usually in such an agreeable mood!!!
> 
> *TALLULAH*.


Oh god, dfont remind him, he might start singing again!!!!

Jo


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> Grandchildren! Nature's reward for 21 years of parenthood.
> 
> Ask PasaNada. She has enough of them and over many many years - she´ll tell you that they make the hard yards worthwhile.


I´m too young to be a granny!!!!!!!

Jo


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

jojo said:


> I´m too young to be a granny!!!!!!!
> 
> Jo


You'll love it. You'll get a whole new lease of life - just look at GG. Over the past 20 years her zimmerframe has travelled the world. She's seen Afghanistan and Orihuela Costa (know which I'd prefer!) and has really taken every benefit of the Saga offers.


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

Just an aside....who's modding at the moment? Just pm-ed Strav on a question and he's not in. Anyone know?

Tallulah.x


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

SteveHall said:


> You'll love it. You'll get a whole new lease of life - just look at GG. Over the past 20 years her zimmerframe has travelled the world. She's seen Afghanistan and Orihuela Costa (know which I'd prefer!) and has really taken every benefit of the Saga offers.



That silver tongue is gonna get you in trouble one of these days


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

jojo said:


> Oh god, dfont remind him, he might start singing again!!!!
> 
> Jo



A winter's day
In a deep and dark December;
I am alone,
Gazing from my window to the streets below
On a freshly fallen silent shroud of snow.
I am a rock,
I am an island.

I've built walls,
A fortress deep and mighty,
That none may penetrate.
I have no need of friendship; friendship causes pain.
It's laughter and it's loving I disdain.
I am a rock,
I am an island.

Don't talk of love,
But I've heard the words before;
It's sleeping in my memory.
I won't disturb the slumber of feelings that have died.
If I never loved I never would have cried.
I am a rock,
I am an island.

I have my books
And my poetry to protect me;
I am shielded in my armor,
Hiding in my room, safe within my womb.
I touch no one and no one touches me.
I am a rock,
I am an island.

And a rock feels no pain;
And an island never cries.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> A winter's day
> In a deep and dark December;
> I am alone,
> Gazing from my window to the streets below
> ...


You need a Bridge over troubled water 

Jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Just an aside....who's modding at the moment? Just pm-ed Strav on a question and he's not in. Anyone know?
> 
> Tallulah.x



Anyone? Anyone at all? Helloooooo??????


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Anyone? Anyone at all? Helloooooo??????



Sorry, hun, I think one of the other mods "pop" in from time to time to make sure we´re behaving. Bev... someone seems to be here quite often. I´m dying to know why you need a mod, but its none of my business!! 

Jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> Sorry, hun, I think one of the other mods "pop" in from time to time to make sure we´re behaving. Bev... someone seems to be here quite often. I´m dying to know why you need a mod, but its none of my business!!
> 
> Jo


Oh it's nothing interesting promise! Just loook like an idiot otherwise as don't do "technical" stuff!


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

One of the best things about this group is that we all behave and don't need to be treated like naughty kids all the times. ¡Viva Strav!


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

SteveHall said:


> One of the best things about this group is that we all behave and don't need to be treated like naughty kids all the times. ¡Viva Strav!


Tell me about it....the Lounge used to be a pretty good laugh but that quickly turned sour....everyone's in trouble and getting banned it seems. I'd be careful with your singing if I were you!!!


Tallulah.x


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

jojo said:


> You need a Bridge over troubled water
> 
> Jo



You volunteering? 

Adiós Norma Jean
Aunque nunca te conocí
Tenias la gracia de sostenerte a ti misma
Mientras aquellos arrastrados alrededor de ti
Se arrastraban fuera de la carpintería
Y susurraban en tu cabeza
Ellos te ataron a la rutina
Y te hicieron cambiar el nombre

Y me parece que viviste tu vida
Como una vela en el viento
Sin saber a quien aferrarse
Cuando la lluvia empieza
Y me hubiera gustado haberte conocido
Pero era solo un niño
Tu vela se apago antes de tiempo
Tu leyenda nunca morirá

La soledad fue dura
El más duro papel que te toco interpretar
Hollywood creo una super estrella
Y doloroso fue el precio que pagaste
Incluso cuando moriste
Oh la prensa aún te acosa
Todos los diarios han dicho
Que Marilyn fue encontrada desnuda

Adiós Norma Jean
Para el hombre joven de la fila 22
Quién te vio como algo más que un símbolo sexual
Más que solo Marilyn Monroe


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Tell me about it....the Lounge used to be a pretty good laugh but that quickly turned sour....everyone's in trouble and getting banned it seems. I'd be careful with your singing if I were you!!!
> 
> 
> Tallulah.x


Who´s been banned???

Jo


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

You, did you not know?


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

I could tell you but then I'd have to kill you. Ssshhhhh.....they're listening. It's quite scary really! oooooooooohhhhhh (ghosty noises).


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> You, did you not know?


But I´m still here arent I??

Jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> But I´m still here arent I??
> 
> Jo



You think it's you....but it's not. I think you're astral travelling.


Steve'll ask you to post the latest pic of you in a bikini just to prove it. Just you wait!!!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> You think it's you....but it's not. I think you're astral travelling.
> 
> 
> Steve'll ask you to post the latest pic of you in a bikini just to prove it. Just you wait!!!


haha, he doesnt have any !!

Jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> haha, he doesnt have any !!
> 
> Jo



Any what?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Any what?


me in a bikini photos (altho now you mention it??), I so wish I hadnt put that on here!! 

jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> me in a bikini photos (altho now you mention it??), I so wish I hadnt put that on here!!
> 
> jo



Hon - erm, two words : public forum! There's photos on your home page!!!!


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

You want photos of me in a bikini!!! OMG you know my secrets - I guess the truth will out so you had better have your few moments of fun Torrevieja Football Club - Torry Army - Home


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> You want photos of me in a bikini!!! OMG you know my secrets - I guess the truth will out so you had better have your few moments of fun Torrevieja Football Club - Torry Army - Home



Which bit, I cant see you


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Hon - erm, two words : public forum! There's photos on your home page!!!!


 forgot that... its not there now!!

Jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> forgot that... its not there now!!
> 
> Jo


And you being such a charitable girl and all! I thought you were into "Help the Aged" - just think of all the Aged you have helped - Steve and Xtreme to name but two!!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> And you being such a charitable girl and all! I thought you were into "Help the Aged" - just think of all the Aged you have helped - Steve and Xtreme to name but two!!


Nah, those sort of photos arent good for them at their age... the shock you know.....!!!

Jo


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

jojo said:


> Nah, those sort of photos arent good for them at their age... the shock you know.....!!!
> 
> Jo


Steve - a song for you :

"I got chills, they're multiplying
And I'm losing control
Cos the power you're supplying
It's electrifying!!!"


I think his pacemaker's packed up.


Tallulah.x


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

SteveHall said:


> DH1875 I like your attiitude. I think you are wrong but I will defend your right to the death to be wrong! It's YOUR life and YOUR dream and YOUR decision.
> 
> If you make it to the Costa del Sol I will always interview you.
> 
> I think the comments about Andalucian Spanish were OTT. If you listen to educated people down here they speak castellano albeit with an accent and albeit without the letter "s"!



Hi Steve,

Thanks for that. You are probably right but where is the harm in trying. I am open to anything you have to offer so an interview would always be welcomed.

Thanks Again,

DH.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all - give us a shout if you make it down here.


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

jojo said:


> Chica has got some very valid points tho. Especially with the kids. My son has settled fairly well after a year, BUT he is at an international school, with british kis, british teachers and a british curriculum. Its no secret on here that my daughter is at a state school and hates it, she is very unhappy and begs me to go back to the UK. We´ve just had her school report in and it was appalling, its not that she´s a Brit, its that she wont try, wont intergrate, wont do any work either at school or her homework and spends her time day dreaming. I cant tell you how guilty she makes me feel. What am I doing to her life, her education and her future???? The only thing keeping her going here is that she goes horse riding once a week!!
> 
> Sorry, I´m not meaning to saound negative, but there are sooooo many things to consider and I just wanna make sure that you´ve got as many potential problems covered as possible. My son is 14yo and my daughter is 11yo
> 
> Jo xx


Hi Jo,

That is a shame that your daughter has not settled. It is always a risk moving children but we are sure they will cope. We have two girls and they will be aged 5 and 9 by the time they start school. They get on quite well and will have each other to keep company. Our youngest is doing great with her Spanish and loves showing of to all our freinds and family. She will probably be fluent before any of us. Our oldest is not doing so well but she is really looking forward to coming. She is aware that it will be hard but she has had a look at her school on the internet and can't wait. She has already made freinds with some of the kids through email so she should be fine.
Anyway I am off to bed now. Take care.

DH.


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## jkchawner (Dec 21, 2008)

SteveHall said:


> Better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all - give us a shout if you make it down here.



never lost the old lovers always keep in touch myself


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## jkchawner (Dec 21, 2008)

My_Name_is_Tallulah said:


> Steve - a song for you :
> 
> "I got chills, they're multiplying
> And I'm losing control
> ...


ha ha your green lights off now who,s a light weight


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## jkchawner (Dec 21, 2008)

jojo said:


> forgot that... its not there now!!
> 
> Jo



right click of the old mouse jo right click of the old mouse
its under save picture  bet your all over spain now 
your in my bad book bad girl


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## Chica (Mar 23, 2009)

*Frigliana?*

Hi DH1875,

have you decided to settle in Frigliana? Have tried to follow thru' the thread and I think I am correct in saying that 

Anyway, it sounds like you have decided to take the plunge. Good for you!! . See, I am not sooo bad 

It's about 6 miles from me  but a nice place to live. Nerja is quite a lively town with lots going on in the summer time. Have you been to this area before? Sorry, the memory is going and I can't remember if you said anything about this b4. Sometimes I get threads mixed up too 

If it is Frigliana you will settle in you must take the kiddlies to the donkey sanctuary which is on the Nerja- Torrox coast road just outside Nerja. They will enjoy that. There is a wort hog that wonders around freely and is quite a friendly little chappie. There are loads of donkeys too which I am sure someone on this forum would be interested in..lol!!

When are you planning to come over? Have you got definate work sorted out yet? Do you intend to have a car? Sorry, nosie aren't I but I am interested.

Kind regards

Chica.x


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## DH1875 (Feb 21, 2009)

Chica said:


> Hi DH1875,
> 
> have you decided to settle in Frigliana? Have tried to follow thru' the thread and I think I am correct in saying that
> 
> ...


Hi Chica,

We have been in the area a few times and love it. Looked at both Frigiliana and Torrox but thought that they were a little to quiet for us so went for the Nerja option. Without trying to sound cheeky my wife and I seem to be a little bit younger than a lot of people that use the forum . The kids know all about the 
donkey sanctuary and it is already on the list of things to do.
We don't have definate work sorted but have a few interviews lined up .
Not looking to have a car until we know if we are going to be staying for def or not.

Will let you know how we get on.


----------

