# Looking for tips to find a house or apartment in Oaxaca



## ninagris (12 mo ago)

Hola! My husband and I moved to Oaxaca a few days ago, staying in an airbnb till we find a permanent residence. I'm looking on Facebook Marketplace, another Facebook group for apartments and general online searches. 
Are there any tricks to this? I'm looking at local websites that cater to locals, and worried that once I contact someone, my very American name is going to double the price of anything I want to consider. Luckily my husband's family is _oaxaqueño_, but I don't want to burden them with this task too much. 

Also there doesn't seem to be a ton in our price range. Everything is either a room in a shared apartment or a huge house with more room than we need. 

Anyone with experience here? 
Gracias!


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

My advice is generic, and applies mostly to apartments. Particularly furnished apartments in higher-rent areas like beach towns, since that's where I looked and rented. As for Oaxaca, Ain't never been there, they tell me its nice. As the song goes.

Online is not worth much, as most rentals aren't advertised beyond hanging out a sign. I suspect half or more of rentals are just word of mouth without even a sign. 

Explore the town, find buildings you would like to stay in, and ask. If there are security guards, ask them, they will refer you to people renting in the building (they get a tip from the renter for the referral). If there is nothing and no one to prevent you from just wandering in, then I'd look elsewhere. You may get hooked up with an agent that has a handful of places to rent - but remember those aren't the only options, and that agent knows about other places too. He can get a (big) one-time bonus for referring you another agent who has a place you like. You'll have to see and reject all of his places before he decides to try to get something for giving you away to another agent.

Personally, I would not want to rent long-term in a building that allowed AirBnB - too many noisy neighbors. But if that's ok with you, start with your own building. If it allows AirBnB then undoubtedly there are apartments for long term rent as well, probably at rates much lower than AirBnB, since airBnb places are vacant a lot. If you don't want to live with AirBnB renters, then find nice buildings you like and see if there are apartments in them offered on AirBnB - if yes, scratch it off the list. If not, then ask at the gate for rentals and you might find the building has rules against short term rentals - that makes it ideal IMHO.

Assume that there are apartments for rent in any and every building, but that no one agent can rent all of them. If a building has 80 apartments, there are probably 8 for rent divided up among 4 or more agents. You have to break through the system of agents only showing you their properties to get the apartment you like. If you want to be on a high floor and they're only showing you low floors, let them know you aren't interested in a low floor but like the building and you might get handed off to another agent.

You can bargain down what they are asking. Don't be afraid to go for something that ticks all your boxes even if it looks too expensive, see the place, then say it's nice but you can't afford it. Chances are they'll ask "how much can you afford" - don't tell them the truth, say lower, it's just bargaining, you need some room to increase. Point out you're nice people and will take good care of the place and not tear it up and have very good credit blah blah. You should be able to get them down at least 10% from their original asking price, if not 20%.

Don't rush the bargaining. If you actually like the place, spend an hour there "trying to decide". If there are two of you, one should be as negative as possible, find everything you can that's wrong and point it out. Be super picky. The other one of you acts as a mediator between the picky one and the agents. At the very least, you can extract a bunch of promises to fix things before you move in, which you'll have a hard time getting honored, but it gives you leverage.

A 2-month security deposit is pretty standard for furnished places. 

My best line when looking turned out to be, with a sigh, "well, it just looks like I can't afford my dream." That was what got me referred to the agent that had what I wanted at a price I liked by the agent who was driving me around.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

eastwind said:


> Personally, I would not want to rent long-term in a building that allowed AirBnB - too many noisy neighbors.


Is this from your personal experience, or just some misguided perception you have about what an Airbnb is?

For sure there are some Airbnbs with hosts who are only in it for the money and don't care how their listing affects the neighbors.

There are plenty of Airbnbs that don't disturb anyone. I list a private room in my home for 1 guest. My neighbor across the street has 2 casitas she Airbnbs. No one would ever even know the guests were there. No one is noisy or disruptive in any way.

Airbnbs aren't some generic thing. There are 5.6 million Airbnb listings worldwide. Everything from treehouses in the forest and houseboats, to farm stays, to oceanfront villas, to city apartments.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

surabi said:


> For sure there are some Airbnbs with hosts who are only in it for the money and don't care how their listing affects the neighbors.


For someone who accuses me of being misguided you do a pretty good job of supporting my point. 

It's based on direct information from a number of friends whose lives have been seriously disrupted and whose equity in their apartment building significantly damaged due to other apartments that are rented out on AirBnB by completely inconsiderate landlords who do nothing to keep their deplorable clients from being drunk and unruly and destroying common areas.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

Ii did a pretty good job of proving your point? By acknowledgiing that there are indeed Airrbnbs that are disruptive to neighbors?

My point, which you obviously chose to ignore, is that there is no such thing as "an Airbnb", as if they are all the same, and all disruptive and disrespectful of the neighbors. That is just a totally false representation, based upon nothing but your friends' experiences. 

There's an enormous difference between Airbnb listings that are owned by people who live far away and use some property manager to run the place, which is the type of thing that your friends were likely subjected to, and on-site host listings like mine, and hands-on hosts who are good neighbors hate that there are Airbnbs that disturb the community, because they give Airbnb a bad name, which affects all of us, just as your perception proves.

My private room home-share has housed solo travelers from Prague, France, New Zealand, Mexico, Brazil, Canada, and Japan. We have chatted over coffee or a bottle of wine, shared meals, and made wonderful connections that were enriching for both of us. I still keep in touch with some of my past guests.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

If the apartment building has a bunch of airbnb rented apartments in it, I wouldn't want to live in that building. Period. You can have a different opinion, but you can't argue that my personal choice is invalid. Your house has nothing to do with my recommendation to the OP, or their case. Oaxaca might not have as many problems as a beach town with people coming in for a wild party vacation and renting an AirBnB in order to have someplace to party when the bars close, but I wouldn't risk it, nor would I advise anyone else looking for a home too risk it. There's a reason that prices for apartments dropped in my friend's buildings, it's called bad neighbors. There are enough people that feel as I do for there to be a substantial movement to ban AirBnB in many places.

I'd also not want to risk ending up staying with someone that always argued with everything I say. You've made me less likely to ever stay at an AirBnB, if that is possible.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

And I certainly wouldn't want someone as a guest who stubbornly refuses to acknowledge what another is saying nor make any attempt to understand.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

No, you're the one that is steadfastly refusing to get the point: it doesn't matter that some AirBnB renters are not obnoxious. It doesn't matter that you're an AirBnB renter. It doesn't matter whether you're obnoxious or not. What matters is that enough AirBnB renters are obnoxious, and so if you don't want to regularly have to deal with obnoxious neighbors, you avoid AirBnb-dominated properties.

It was obviously my opinion from the very start, as I said it was up to the OP whether they wanted to use that as a filter. Why do you feel obligated to try to contend with every post of mine instead of trying to help the people who ask questions? 

The percentage of obnoxious AirBnB renters varies from location to location. It's might be low in Oaxaca. How would you or I know? In a place like Cancun, where I live, there are a high number of AirBnB renters who show up to party, loudly, at all hours, for a week. They don't give a damn what anyone else thinks, or if they leave the public areas of the property trashed, they are here for a vacation and want to consume as much alcohol and whatever else in the short time they are here as they can. The building next door to mine allows them, mine doesn't, and it's obvious what difference it makes to anyone who's not an utter idiot.


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## AnneLM (Aug 16, 2016)

The OP is asking about Oaxaca. Have you ever been to Oaxaca? There are no high rise apartment buildings in the tourist area.
Oaxaca is totally different from Cancun. There is very little overlap between travelers to Cancun and travelers to Oaxaca. The reasons for choosing these destinations and choosing to stay in Airbnbs or to rent Airbnbs are totally different. Noise issues in Oaxaca are most likely to arise from the streets, not inside Airbnbs, at least not any more than inside a hotel. The OP should explore to identify quieter areas.


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## MangoTango (Feb 8, 2020)

I'm jumping into this discussion a little late but if a particular property is listed on AirBnB (or Vrbo) really doesn't matter - at least in my little world. I live in a "horizontal condo". That is just some legal label placed on our community of some 50 or so single family homes each probably on an average acre lot. There are big (huge) houses and tiny (my) houses. Currently there is a 'battle' going on between the 3-5 owners who wish to list their houses on AirBnB-like sites and the rest of the community. It has gone to the lawyers. Of the 50 houses only perhaps 5-8 are actually lived in on a daily basis. Some owners only come to visit one weekend a month. Some never come here. But when the owners DO come here they come to party. LARGE. Tents are erected. Trucks with tables and chairs are delivered. Bands show up. (There have been some truly incredible performances over the years).

So getting to my point - overall the AirBnB houses are rather tame. Personally my biggest problem with short-term rentals is the security issues. There really is no vetting done on the visitors. I didn't mention that taxis are not allowed to enter the community. It is feared by some that they will case out the place and return later to rob the vacant houses. (For some reason ubers are allowed - I don't see the difference). 

Over the years - by far the largest problems I have had living here are with a) the totally entitled/inconsiderate owners who throw large parties until daylight b) the staff of those owners who live in the houses while the owners are away and treat the houses as their own on weekends/holidays and c) the teenage owners/relatives of the owners who treat the houses as their own.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

Eastwind- What part of me agreeing that there are horrible Airbnbs that have remote hosts who don't give a damn if they have guests who are loud and disturb the neighbors did you not understand? What part of good, responsible, hosts who care about the community and are part of it, hating that there are Airbnbs like this, did you not understand? They are exactly what leads to areas banning "Airbnbs", pointlessly destroying the business of small-time, responsible hosts whose guests disturb no one. 

There are plenty of those kind of awful Airbnbs in my town, too. One right next to the home of a friend of mine's. And when she complained to a noisy group, the one guy's response was, "It's an Airbnb!", as if that means anything goes and is some license for screaming drunkenly in the pool with blasting techno music at 3 am. (His friend, to his credit, looked embarrassed by that response and said that he would talk to everyone and make sure it didn't happen again)

My point was that "an Airbnb" is not some generic term that describes all the many different types of listings and hosts that are out there. Like retired grandma and grandpa who list a private room in their suburban home for 2 guests and make their guests a nice breakfast and chat over coffee.

Of course no one wants nor should have to suffer a "party house" in their neighborhood. And not all of those are Airbnbs either. There are several listing platforms- VRBO, Homeaway, Booking.com, Expedia, etc.

Airbnb has become some generic term, carrying an incorrect perception. An Airbnb apartment in Cancun, owned by an "investor" is a totally different ballgame from an Airbnb cottage in the backwoods of Maine whose owner lives down the block and cares deeply how their guests behave.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

MangoTango said:


> There really is no vetting done on the visitors.


Responsible hosts do try. The biggest problem is that Airbnb, as a company, is only concerned with their bottom line- facilitating bookings rolling in as fast and furiously as possible, so they can collect their service fees. 

So they make it super easy for guests to book, and to present themselves anonymously. Guests can book using whatever name they choose (they do have to upload some form of official ID to the site, but hosts don't get to see that. Their real name could be John Smith, but their Airbnb handle could be Mountain Goat), and Airbnb pushes hosts to use Instant Book, where guests are not required to communicate with a host before booking, they just hit "Book Now". 

And it takes some pretty egregious behavior for Airbnb to ban a guest from the platform. All most hosts can do if they get a bad guest is boot them out, which Airbnb will usually penalize the host for, or just leave an honest review to warn other hosts not to accept that guest.

If a host does not use Instant Book, and requires guests to send a request for the host to accept or decline, giving the host an opportunity to check a guest's prior reviews, if they even have any, and exchange messages with guests, asking vetting questions, etc, that leads to getting better guests and weeding out the red flags. That's how I operate.

But Airbnb penalizes hosts who won't use IB by putting their listings way down in search rankings. 

Some guests are consumate, savvy liars who can manage to trick even the most careful of hosts. 
"It's just going to be a little gathering for me, my sister, mom and grandma to celebrate Grandma's 70th birthday. She's so excited that we are doing this."

Next thing the host sees on their outdoor camera is 50 yelling, drunken 20-somethings going in and out and vomiting in the bushes.

That's why I would never list an entire home where I didn't live, at least next door. It's easy for me to vet my solo traveler guests and I've never had a bad guest. And guests can't get away with those horror show scenarios when the host lives right there.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Well here we are a dozen posts in and no one but I have given the OP anything useful. I trust that they are adults and can make up their own minds whether they want to risk renting in a building or area with a large number of airbnb's for rent. The warning has now been over-amplified. 

Another tip: When it comes to checking for noise, try to visit your target area late on a saturday night. That will give you at least one data point on the noise and/or whether the area feels unsafe. If you have a car, park along the street and just sit in the car for 15 minutes and get an idea of the traffic level on the street. If you feel in danger doing that, then that's useful information.


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## ninagris (12 mo ago)

Thanks eastwind and everyone else... I guess? I didn't want to spark a debate about airbnbs necessarily. 

We were lucky to find an apartment right across the street from our family, for a great price. Of course whether or not the building will withstand the sismos that is another question, but I think we'll be ok. 

It's funny to read all this about the airbnbs, because I have come to believe that they are generally evil. I know they can be a great way for some people to make extra money or meet travelers, but I personally feel it's gentrification on a global scale. My husband and I were driving through the US for 6 months before we landed in Oaxaca, and it was our first time staying in airbnbs. Most were fine, but all were contributing to rising housing costs that are making it impossible for many people to continue to live in areas where they have friends, family, feel safe or have services. Rental housing is already difficult to come by, and then properties are being bought up all over the US by "investors" -- many of whom are foreign investors or private equity firms who do not care the least about the areas they are buying in. Not only that, but the prices (maybe because of people traveling intra-nationally in the US with the ongoing pandemic) are OUTRAGEOUS. Hotels are now much cheaper and easier, in my opinion. 

The house where we are staying now in Oaxaca is ok. It has 2 floors and a small yard, but it's a little on the ratty side. The neighborhood is ok, but not great. I asked the landlady if she would rent to us, and she wanted $15,000MXN a month, for a house that should be priced at half that. Because she knows she can get more from the tourists. My husband's cousin cleans for a couple that rents out a house in El Centro on airbnb. They rent the house themselves for a low price, then rent it out on airbnb for 3x what they are paying (then have the audacity to pay her the measliest of wages because she is Oaxaquena). I guess like everything else, if you have the means you can get richer and richer, and let the poor fend for themselves. Anyways, that's my 2 cents. 

Thanks for the advice!


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

ninagris said:


> It's funny to read all this about the airbnbs, because I have come to believe that they are generally evil.


It's really a shame that "Airbnb" has come to have this false connotation in people's minds. I assume you read through all the comments. 

Unfortunately, Airbnb got greedy and moved away from its original home-sharing model, but I can assure you there are still plenty of Airbnbs like that.

Those of us who are small-time Airbnb hosts also abhor all these "investors", buying up entire homes and apartments purely for the purpose of using them for vacation rentals, taking affordable housing off the market for locals, as you say.

I just rent out a private room/private bath in my home and guests share my kitchen and outdoor living space. I haven't taken any housing off the market, as I would never rent it out full time to a local- I'm not interested in having a permanent roommate. It was just my small guest room that sat empty most of the year unless I had friends or family visiting. So I figured I'd put it to good use, while still being able to block off dates to bookings when my own folks are visiting.

My guests are more like having a friend visiting, and I have met really cool people from all over the world, some of whom I keep in touch with. 

Single female travelers like staying here- they feel safe, they instantly have interaction, advice on how to get around here, etc, from a local.

There are many Airbnbs like mine- some are run by retired people, or single moms hosting a room in their home for some much needed extra income, some are little cottages the host has created by renovating a garage or shed on their property, some are stays on a working farm where guests's kids get to pet the animals and learn and participate in farm chores, those sorts of things.

The entire house rentals owned by investors, run by property managers, are a whole different ballgame. I can tell you that small time, hands-on Airbnb hosts would love to see those listings get shut down, or at least make a clear separation between "real" Airbnbs- the home-sharing model, and these corporate-run vacation rentals, so guests could easily see and choose what they wanted to support.


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## AnneLM (Aug 16, 2016)

Slightly off topic, but it's not just Airbnbs. Unfortunately all kinds of housing in the US (and I suspect other countries as well) are being bought up by investors who then rent or resell them for inflated prices. I overheard a young student of my daughter's commenting wistfully "Remember when just regular people lived in that house?" about a gussied up house across the street from his elementary school.


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## ninagris (12 mo ago)

AnneLM said:


> Unfortunately all kinds of housing in the US... are being bought up by investors who then rent or resell them for inflated prices.


This, so much.


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## ninagris (12 mo ago)

I think if airbnb operated in the true "bed and breakfast" or "hostel" sense that it was meant to, it would be much better for everyone. Unfortunately, it's not that simple anymore.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

walking the neighborhoods and asking around is the best way to find a place. Word to mouth is everything. If your husband is Oaxaqueño you should have him to tthe price asking and negociations. You will never get it as cheap if you are a foreigner. I deal mostly with indigenous and always let them do the bargaining for me.. they always get a better price.I know what things go for to them but theywill never give me the same price.. 
Just my 2 cents


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## Jalatlaco (10 mo ago)

ninagris said:


> Hola! My husband and I moved to Oaxaca a few days ago, staying in an airbnb till we find a permanent residence. I'm looking on Facebook Marketplace, another Facebook group for apartments and general online searches.
> Are there any tricks to this? I'm looking at local websites that cater to locals, and worried that once I contact someone, my very American name is going to double the price of anything I want to consider. Luckily my husband's family is _oaxaqueño_, but I don't want to burden them with this task too much.
> 
> Also there doesn't seem to be a ton in our price range. Everything is either a room in a shared apartment or a huge house with more room than we need.
> ...


I've had good luck with Vivanuncios: #1 en Bienes Raíces en Mexico on occasion. 
You could also ask at Spanish Magic (language school north of Santo Domingo) because the owner has lots of local info and runs a fantastic Spanish school. At one time she was co-ordinating the intercambio sessions at the Oaxaca Lending Library (Oaxacans with English speakers-it's a lot of fun), So surely she would hear about apts for rent from students of hers or the intercambio participants. 
Also if you walk to the Oaxaca Lending Library (Pino Suarez) they had a notebook of available apartments. 

If you would consider living in San Felipe there are bungalows there-some on Primero de Mayo and some on the main street going into SF on the right side (I believe near the church but not sure). You can ask at either place. The ones on Primero de Mayo are nice-I stayed there for about 5 months. 
There are some apartments directly across from Sto. Domingo church-behind a big wood door. Hard to find, not in great shape but fantastic location. I know there is a complex on the south east side of the city and they were listed on vivanuncios recently. They look like really nice apartments. 
It is my personal opinion that I don't feel right about bargaining with people in Mexico or Guatemala. I feel like the small amount I could save doesn't mean that much to me, but might mean everything to them. Did I get the ****** price sometimes? I'm sure I did but since I can't even recall any specific times, then it didn't really affect me. I'm sure if your husband makes contact the price will be fair. 
I hope some of this helps.


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## Jalatlaco (10 mo ago)

Jalatlaco said:


> I've had good luck with Vivanuncios: #1 en Bienes Raíces en Mexico on occasion.
> You could also ask at Spanish Magic (language school north of Santo Domingo) because the owner has lots of local info and runs a fantastic Spanish school. At one time she was co-ordinating the intercambio sessions at the Oaxaca Lending Library (Oaxacans with English speakers-it's a lot of fun), So surely she would hear about apts for rent from students of hers or the intercambio participants.
> Also if you walk to the Oaxaca Lending Library (Pino Suarez) they had a notebook of available apartments.
> 
> ...


Oddly the word g ringo was ** as if it's some kind of curse word!


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