# Do I need and NIF



## redbourn

Hi,

I've read that everyone moving to Portugal needs an NIF number.

But I also see that it's for taxes.

I will be living there on my pensions and won't be working.

I'll need to rent an apartment and sign up for the Internet and a phone etc.

Do I need to get an NIF?

Thanks,

Michael


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## canoeman

Yes you need a Tax number or NIF whether your working or not, without one you will find it impossible to do anything, open a bank account, telephone, internet etc, etc
It should be done in person at any tax office when you visit, initially register as a non Resident, then when you move register new address at your local Finance office and change status to Resident, you need Passport, proof of UK address and 7€ 

Re Pension new tax rules from 2012 as a Resident if your pension, earnings are + 293€ pm you must file a tax return, this doesn't mean you'd be taxed but could well be fined for not making the return


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## siobhanwf

Spent only 15 minutes at the tax office yesterday with a friend, we were the only ones in the office! All they asked for was his passport and didn`t even ask for the €7!!!!

Nice one

This was fllowed by a half an hour vist to Santander Totta to open a bank account and hey presto...ALL DONE!


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## redbourn

siobhanwf said:


> Spent only 15 minutes at the tax office yesterday with a friend, we were the only ones in the office! All they asked for was his passport and didn't even ask for the €7!!!!
> 
> Nice one
> 
> This was followed by a half an hour visit to Santander Totta to open a bank account and hey presto...ALL DONE!


Glad to hear that!

I have a UK passport and UK driver's license so all should be OK

Michael


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## canoeman

Best if you bring a utility bill like electricity, not a requirement for a NIF but better safe than sorry, you never know quite what the staff are like


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## redbourn

canoeman said:


> Best if you bring a utility bill like electricity, not a requirement for a NIF but better safe than sorry, you never know quite what the staff are like


Thanks.

Please take a look at the attachment. 










The green part is the customs declaration for goods shipped from here.

Not much room to write anything. 

What to do about the 1-3, 2-3, 3-3 requirement?

Michael

HS Code and Customs Tariff Number - Search and find I don't see anything for a PC


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## canoeman

You need to add separate labels clearly showing it's 1 consignment 1 of 3 etc, EMS must have labels available for multi box consignments.

If these are personal goods then you need to contact Portuguese Consulate for export/import paperwork, if your moving from a Non EU country to a EU country regardless of your EU Citizen status you are only allowed 1 shipment of personal goods without paying import tax, I don't believe a simple customs form declaration is sufficient.

Don't know the value of your PC but it could be cheaper to either remove H/D or copy, sell in Isreal and replace here


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## redbourn

canoeman said:


> Don't know the value of your PC but it could be cheaper to either remove H/D or copy, sell in Isreal and replace here


Thanks for the info. 

PC is very high powered and was very expensive.

Hi-tech stuff is cheaper in Israel than in most places, but it cost me 1300 euros about 18 months ago and if I sold it I'd most likely get around 150-200 euros; unless I could find somebody looking for a used one with very hi-specs.

I weighed it and checked at the post office and it will cost about 74 euros to ship it airmail. The Israeli post office is very good and not expensive.

I got this packing for it ..


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## canoeman

Please checkout out export/import with consulate, if you *don't do it correctly* then your cheap postage could cost you a lot in import duty, computers etc must have serial numbers stated as an example


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## redbourn

canoeman said:


> Please checkout out export/import with consulate, if you *don't do it correctly* then your cheap postage could cost you a lot in import duty, computers etc must have serial numbers stated as an example


Thanks.

Wow they seem to make a huge deal about shipping things.

Not talking about my pc or my situation, but what happens if someone has a friend in Portugal and they send him a cd player for his birthday?

Just an off the cuff example.

Michael


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## canoeman

Depends on value, if its EU to EU import duty doesn't apply providing VAT paid at source but non EU to EU import duties do apply, no doubt Israel has similar import restrictions otherwise we'd all just buy from the cheapest country and our economies would go even more to pot


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## redbourn

P.S. Just checked with Swissair and taking the pc excess baggage sounds like it would cost 250 euros, about half the price of my two way ticket!


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## redbourn

canoeman said:


> Please checkout out export/import with consulate, if you *don't do it correctly* then your cheap postage could cost you a lot in import duty, computers etc must have serial numbers stated as an example


Following your advice, I just emailed the consulate.

-----

Oi,

I am British and have been living in Israel.

My intention is to visit Portugal in early September with a view to moving there.

I will have given up my apartment here in Israel and prepared 3-4 boxes to send to me in Portugal if I decide that it's a good place for me to retire.

A friend will ship them to me.

One box will have my used computer and the other boxes will contain personal items.

Please tell me what I have to do about having the boxes sent to me; I can complete the attached customs declaration, but will that be enough?

* 13 years ago I spent a year in Belém and my Portuguese was very good; hardly anybody there spoke English ;-)

Thank you for your help.

0547 44 XX XX

-- 
Michael Redbourn


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## canoeman

If that was the e-mail you sent to Consulate doubt very much you'll receive a reply, personal contact is really the only way, you need to ask them directly

I am an EU Citizen intending to re-locate to Portugal. What forms customs declaration do I need to complete to ship some personal goods to Portugal free of import duty



As a UK National that gives you the right to work, study, live, retire in any EU country with certain proofs

You can spend 3 months in a EU country before having to formally Register your Residence in that country.

*If *your intention is to register or re-locate to Portugal or any other EU country, then that's where the 1 shipment from a Non EU country free of any import duty comes into force, whether you decide on Portugal or not it's still important to get your personal effects into EU import free as once here you and they can move freely around EU


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## pintarroxo

About a year ago I had to find out about shipping personal effects from a non EU country, and I can confirm everything that canoeman says. Additionally, there was a fee involved in filing the paperwork, and a declaration had to be made that the items were personally owned for a minimum of one year.

p.s. Please tell me you wrote "Exmos. Senhores" and were only joking about the "Oi"


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## redbourn

pintarroxo said:


> About a year ago I had to find out about shipping personal effects from a non EU country, and I can confirm everything that canoeman says. Additionally, there was a fee involved in filing the paperwork, and a declaration had to be made that the items were personally owned for a minimum of one year.
> 
> p.s. Please tell me you wrote "Exmos. Senhores" and were only joking about the "Oi"


I speak Brazilian Portuguese and "Oi" means "Hi". 

I wanted to get off on an informal basis ;-)

Thanks for the reply,

Michael


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## redbourn

canoeman said:


> If that was the e-mail you sent to Consulate doubt very much you'll receive a reply, personal contact is really the only way, you need to ask them directly
> 
> I am an EU Citizen intending to re-locate to Portugal. What forms customs declaration do I need to complete to ship some personal goods to Portugal free of import duty
> 
> 
> 
> As a UK National that gives you the right to work, study, live, retire in any EU country with certain proofs
> 
> You can spend 3 months in a EU country before having to formally Register your Residence in that country.
> 
> *If *your intention is to register or re-locate to Portugal or any other EU country, then that's where the 1 shipment from a Non EU country free of any import duty comes into force, whether you decide on Portugal or not it's still important to get your personal effects into EU import free as once here you and they can move freely around EU


Thanks. 

What if I just pay excess baggage and take my pc and a couple of other boxes with me on the plane?

Michael


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## canoeman

Informal with bureaucrats? they prefer a bit of kowtow

If you add in extra cost of documentation from Consulate which I think is around 75€ then overall it could be cheaper but I honestly don't know specifically about Portugal, travelling on a UK Passport is obviously an advantage. Looking at UK Customs information below then it could well be the case that if your personal effects are below 4000€ in value then the same Customs forms would apply to Portugal for unaccompanied effects and you could use the carriers, check with the Consulate 

Thanks to the EU and harmonization I believe that UK Customs regulations are common to any EU countries as points of entry to EU and state that a UK/EU National/Citizen returning to UK from a Non EU country can bring in personal effects to the value of 4000€ import duty free + normal duty free allowances on tobacco, alcohol etc if they accompany, Green channel should be used.
or
"if your goods arrive before or after you and will be declared on your behalf, for example by a fast parcel operator, freight forwarder or other agent, you must ensure you have advised them you are claiming TI relief. To clear their inventory they may need to use Form C21. If this is necessary, Form C21 should quote customs procedure code (CPC) 00 00 40. This identifies that goods are eligible for TI relief and, if under 4,000 euros in value (except pets and firearms), that they can be released without any further customs documents."

HM Revenue & Customs: Tax on personal items when moving to the UK follow link "Go to notice 3 'Bringing your belongings and private motor vehicle to the UK from outside the EC in Notice 3"


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