# Adios a la "i griega" (goodbye to the "Y")



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

The Real Academia Española are tidying up the Spanish language. One of the changes is that the Spanish word for the letter Y, _i griega_, will be replaced by _ye_.

I'm not sure why, but I shall be sorry to see it go ... It will make spelling out my name in Spanish a little less exotic!

Apparently the _griega_ (Greek) was originally used to distinguish Y from I, which was once called _i latina_.

Limpia, fija... y jubila letras y acentos · ELPAÍS.com


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## jimenato (Nov 21, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> The Real Academia Española are tidying up the Spanish language.


Wish someone would do that with English


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> Apparently the _griega_ (Greek) was originally used to distinguish Y from I, which was once called _i latina_.
> 
> Limpia, fija... y jubila letras y acentos · ELPAÍS.com


Was once called, and still is.

TBH I can't see this making any difference or at least for a generation or two. If you've spent your life saying_ y griega_ I can't imagine the Real Academia changing it, especially if it's use isn't fined!!


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## Tallulah (Feb 16, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Was once called, and still is.
> 
> TBH I can't see this making any difference or at least for a generation or two. If you've spent your life saying_ y griega_ I can't imagine the Real Academia changing it, especially if it's use isn't fined!!


I think you're absolutely right  especially as some of the older generation refer to pricing in pesetas on a daily basis.

As if this country hasn't got enough to deal with at the moment.....


Did you notice the spelling change of Iraq to Irak as well?! Apparently grammatically the Q should not be there. Whatever next *sigh*.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Tallulah said:


> I think you're absolutely right  especially as some of the older generation refer to pricing in pesetas on a daily basis.
> 
> As if this country hasn't got enough to deal with at the moment.....
> 
> ...


But you must admit, all these rules for the standardisation of pronunciation and spelling do make it easier for us to learn Spanish!

I feel sorry for Spaniards trying to learn English though, having to plough through rough troughs.


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## Sonrisa (Sep 2, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> !
> 
> I feel sorry for Spaniards trying to learn English though, having to plough through rough troughs.


I've tried to read that aloud about five times, Can't do it.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Dizzie Izzie said:


> I've tried to read that aloud about five times, Can't do it.


try it this way

plow throo ruff troffs


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## Sonrisa (Sep 2, 2010)

They are also called Y gruiega and I latina in French, Italian and Portuguese, arent' they. It just seem very unlikely that this will change.


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## Sonrisa (Sep 2, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> try it this way
> 
> plow throo ruff troffs


Now that's working. But now I don't even know what it means?!?!


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2010)

YES! They also standardized the "w" - boy, I was confused when I got here. 

Regarding the fact they'll take generations to disappear: What about the cases of "ch" and "ll"? Were they still being used in Spain eleven years ago? I very definitely learned the Spanish alphabet with the "ch" and "ll" included, but have never heard a Spaniard spell something and use "ch" or "ll" instead of "c, h", etc.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

halydia said:


> YES! They also standardized the "w" - boy, I was confused when I got here.
> 
> Regarding the fact they'll take generations to disappear: What about the cases of "ch" and "ll"? Were they still being used in Spain eleven years ago? I very definitely learned the Spanish alphabet with the "ch" and "ll" included, but have never heard a Spaniard spell something and use "ch" or "ll" instead of "c, h", etc.


I learned it with both - about 7 years ago

when I spell though I use c, h - but ll is _elye_ to me!!


so _uve doble_ is now _doble uve_

it does make sense, but I'm used to it the other way


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## Sonrisa (Sep 2, 2010)

halydia said:


> YES! They also standardized the "w" - boy, I was confused when I got here.
> 
> Regarding the fact they'll take generations to disappear: What about the cases of "ch" and "ll"? Were they still being used in Spain eleven years ago? I very definitely learned the Spanish alphabet with the "ch" and "ll" included, but have never heard a Spaniard spell something and use "ch" or "ll" instead of "c, h", etc.


ah yes, I remeber when ch and ll were taken off the alphabet. Must have been at least 25 years ago, I was in primary and suddenlty remebering the alphabet and spelling got a little easier, and I don't think anyone use them anymore at all.


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2010)

Dizzie Izzie said:


> ah yes, I remeber when ch and ll were taken off the alphabet. Must have been at least 25 years ago, I was in primary and suddenlty remebering the alphabet and spelling got a little easier, and I don't think anyone use them anymore at all.


Ah, I wasn't aware that they got rid of the ch and ll here in Spain so long ago! 

My "problem" is that I learned Central and South American Spanish, and occasionally I still get mixed up. Then again, it could be that my teacher didn't know about the removal of ch/ll and taught us anyway...


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> so _uve doble_ is now _doble uve_
> 
> it does make sense, but I'm used to it the other way


It's far easier to say, especially when you're spelling out a URL... Give it a try


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## Sonrisa (Sep 2, 2010)

halydia said:


> Ah, I wasn't aware that they got rid of the ch and ll here in Spain so long ago!
> 
> My "problem" is that I learned Central and South American Spanish, and occasionally I still get mixed up. Then again, it could be that my teacher didn't know about the removal of ch/ll and taught us anyway...


I don't know when they were officially removed from the alphabet, but I very clearly remeber my primary teacher telling us that "from now on, we dont say ch or ll when reciting the alphabet".


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

halydia said:


> It's far easier to say, especially when you're spelling out a URL... Give it a try


actually _uvedobleuvedobleuvedobletelefonicapuntocom _was one of the first things I learned to say really fast!!!


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> actually _uvedobleuvedobleuvedobletelefonicapuntocom _was one of the first things I learned to say really fast!!!


hahahaha, well then I lose


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

halydia said:


> hahahaha, well then I lose


my Spanish teacher used to give us odd things to practise

that had all the vowels in so was good pronunciation practice & we had to say it faster and faster................


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> my Spanish teacher used to give us odd things to practise
> 
> that had all the vowels in so was good pronunciation practice & we had to say it faster and faster................


That's a neat idea!


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Dizzie Izzie said:


> I don't know when they were officially removed from the alphabet, but I very clearly remeber my primary teacher telling us that "from now on, we dont say ch or ll when reciting the alphabet".


They were officially removed in 1994, according to Wikipedia.es.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> actually _uvedobleuvedobleuvedobletelefonicapuntocom _was one of the first things I learned to say really fast!!!


My teacher told us that people said "triple uve doble" but I´ve never heard that actually used.

Someone offered me a "biki" at a party last year; I wondered why they were eating biscuits but it turned out to be the Andalusian proniunciation of whisky.


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## Sonrisa (Sep 2, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> They were officially removed in 1994, according to Wikipedia.es.


That's right, I just had a look in wikipedia, couldn't believe it! 

THat's bizarre, my school must have been a decade ahead in time. Mind you, it was a pretty good school.


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2010)

Ay, ladies, wikipedia? 

According to the very same article in El País: 
"_- Ch y ll ya no son letras. Desde el siglo XIX, las combinaciones de letras ch y ll eran consideradas letras, pero ya en la Ortografía de 1999 pasaron a considerarse dígrafos, es decir, "signos ortográficos de dos letras". Sin embargo, tanto ch como ll permanecieron en la tabla del alfabeto. La nueva edición los suprime "formalmente". _"

(Ch and ll are no longer letters. Since the 19th centry, the combined letters of ch and ll were considered to be letters, but in the Spelling of 1999 they became to be considered diagraphs, or "spelling signals(?) formed by two letters". Nevertheless, both the ch and ll remained in the alphabet. The new edition "formally" gets rid of them. )


As for the _triple uve doble _, I hear that up here a lot.


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