# Sailing in Portugal



## ChrisMcNab (Apr 29, 2012)

I have searched the forum for an answer so please forgive me if I've missed a topic on this.

My plans were (possibly still are) to retire to Spain and indulge my hobby of sailing (yacht/sailboat not power). However, I have found a massive problem...

In précis, if you become resident in Spain (which you must do after living there for 183 days) you can no longer skipper a UK registered boat and must re-take all your sailing qualifications. The Spanish qualification is called the _Patron de Yate_ and involves a theoretical and a practical exam which is conducted only in Spanish. It is generally considered that a high level of literacy in the language is required. 

The _Patron de Yate_ for a 9 metre boat with a 30 miles range, for example, requires the learning of a glossary of 600 Spanish sailing terms and the passing of a 200-question multiple-choice written paper.

I’m qualified to Coastal Skipper level (not Yachtmaster) and hold an ICC (International Certificate of Competency). I have chartered in Greece, Turkey, Croatia, the Caribbean and UK waters and must show my qualifications whenever required to by the harbour authorities and have never had a problem. If I could re-take my examinations in English I could (after some serious revision!) pass them again but surely the insistence that the exam is taken in Spanish is grossly unfair to somebody who can sail but is poor at learning a foreign language to the depth required.

Are there any sailors out there who can tell me whether this Catch-22 situation exists in Portugal or, like Greece, are the authorities more relaxed?


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## jerryceltner (May 15, 2012)

I have no answer for you apart from getting an interpretor when you sit your exam .
I had a problem similar to yourself in the respect that I have a 10 metre twin engined motor cruiser and wanted to bring it over and put it on the Castelo do Bode lake which is 66 km long.
Plenty of water to explore I felt. The problem is the powers that be only allow 7 metre boats although restaurant ships go along the water course every day.
I contacted the harbour master at Peniche for more info and was told that a licence and I think a test but not sure was needed. My only option was to put her on the sea and as my wife gets sea sick then no chance so we go back to the UK for several weeks a year and stay on her but the next step I feel will be to sell her which I don't really want to do.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Your ok here
"Sailing Licences issued by another European Union country are automatically valid and accepted in Portugal. Non-EU licences may be recognised and accepted in Portugal if their requisites meet European Union standards. Documents may have to be translated into Portuguese or English"

As a Non resident you can stay in Portuguese waters for 6 months after you register with port authority and Customs.
As a Resident you must register your boat, very similar to registering car ownership (NOT matriculation) there is an annual boat tax similar to road tax.


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## ChrisMcNab (Apr 29, 2012)

First, thanks to jeryceltner and canoeman for the help - it's much appreciated. Canoeman's explanation is clear & it seems my qualifications are accepted (wonder why Spain are out on a limb over this??). I was torn between Spain & Portugal as a retirement destination (although I understand that some prices in Portugal are much higher) but this may well sway my decision. Again, many thanks.


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## Waterdog (Oct 24, 2011)

Hi Chris,

Welcome to the site.

Why are you asking these questions on a Portuguese site when you plan to cruise in Spain?

That said, are you planning to sail your boat out there, where are you now & when are you planning to 'ship out'?

The reason I ask is because I have a number of friends who sail both here in the UK, Continental Europe (including Portugal & Spain), The Offshore Islands & the Med who may be able to help.

They consider that you are on the wrong site & suggest you try the same question on the Yachting & Boating World Forum (www.ybw.com) Portuguese & Spanish forums, where you should find people who know what they are talking about.

Believe Canoeman posts on this site?

If you are thinking about Portugal you may find www.lagosnavigators.net useful. As the name suggests, this site is primarily for visitors & live-aboards in Lagos Marina & is a mine of good information both maritime & general. However, whilst this site is very active during the winter (Sep-Jun) it goes quiet Jul, Aug & early Sep when the contributors are on their annual big adventures.

Hope this is of some use & best of luck with your venture.


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## ChrisMcNab (Apr 29, 2012)

Thanks for the info Waterdog - I'll definitely look at those sites. I'm not thinking of live-aboard (my wife is uncomfortable with sea states more than 5) but I intend to have something ashore and the odd short (couple of days) cruise. Doing the typical 'look through rose tinted glasses' I NEVER thought for a moment that my sailing qualifications wouldn't be accepted in Spain but now I know I really have to think again. I'm 67 and the idea of becoming sufficiently fluent in Spanish to pass the exams fills me with dread. No it doesn't - I KNOW I couldn't achieve it. The fact that I don't need to re-take the qualifications puts a big tick next to Portugal.


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## Waterdog (Oct 24, 2011)

ChrisMcNab said:


> Thanks for the info Waterdog - I'll definitely look at those sites. I'm not thinking of live-aboard (my wife is uncomfortable with sea states more than 5) but I intend to have something ashore and the odd short (couple of days) cruise. Doing the typical 'look through rose tinted glasses' I NEVER thought for a moment that my sailing qualifications wouldn't be accepted in Spain but now I know I really have to think again. I'm 67 and the idea of becoming sufficiently fluent in Spanish to pass the exams fills me with dread. No it doesn't - I KNOW I couldn't achieve it. The fact that I don't need to re-take the qualifications puts a big tick next to Portugal.


Since I last post I have just had a long conversation with a sailing friend, who is of the opinion that your ICC will be all that is necessary.

He agrees, come up on the ybw site & all of your fears will be resolved & an awful lot of expats are limited to headline stuff in the language of their host country..

He also suggested that before putting down permanent roots, rent for a few months in the country of your dreams - (best in winter) & see if the dream becomes a nightmare!


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## Abyss-Rover (Mar 17, 2012)

Hi ChrisMcNab,

Have a look here, should be no problems.

SPANISH LAWS FOR BOATS


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## siobhanwf (Mar 20, 2009)

My husband's Hong Kong qualifications are accepted in Portugal.


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## ChrisMcNab (Apr 29, 2012)

Abyss-Rover said:


> Hi ChrisMcNab,
> 
> Have a look here, should be no problems.
> 
> SPANISH LAWS FOR BOATS


Many thanks for that - it's excellent and seems to resolve all my problems.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Just be aware that the Non Residence bits are and have changed both in Spain 2007 and Portugal 2012 Residence Registration is required in both countries if you stay* more than 3 months* which rather alters scope of information plus it's not dated that I can see.

_"If you are land based or living in your boat in Spain, for more than 180 days in any 12 month period, then the Spanish Authorities will consider you to be resident in Spain. (You will remain domicile in your country of origin (e.g. UK) but for Spanish legal and tax purposes you are considered to be a resident of Spain. "_

Can't comment on Spain but author says this applies to Portugal and info is incorrect.

Portugal would consider you a Resident if you spend more than 183 days cumulative or not in any 12 month period
or
If you own property here at 31st Dec and tax authorities consider it your* Primary* home they would consider you a Tax Resident *even* if you spent *less* than 183 days.

More difficult for boat owners as they have to register with Customs on port entry, whereas rarely any checks on land border crossings.


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## Abyss-Rover (Mar 17, 2012)

Hi ChrisMcNab,

I emailed [email protected] and those facts were confirmed (dated Mon 06/08/2012 09:54)

I'm not sure if they cover Portugal but if not, they might put you in touch with someone who knows the facts.

Sometimes, although I think that they mean well, listening to what others *believe* could end with expensive fines or confiscation of your boat.


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## ChrisMcNab (Apr 29, 2012)

Thank you to everybody for the help. I must say it is more involved than I first thought, but at least now I have a chance of getting it right.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Information for Portugal holiday or Residence here Registration certificates also here Portuguese Ministry responsible for Residence of all nationalities Portal SEF
and here, the EU law which all countries follow with allow some local differences on actual registration http://www.sef.pt/portal/V10/EN/aspx/apoiocliente/detalheApoio.aspx?fromIndex=0&id_Linha=4351

Portuguese definition who is a Resident for tax and scope of personal taxation Page 50 to 52 here Portal SEF


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