# Curious About Retiring in Italy



## Heinz57 (Sep 10, 2018)

About 9 months ago I started to inquire about France on their forum, now I'm over here to inquire on Italy. I'm an American living in a Dallas suburb, planning to retire in 4-5 years. Does anyone live in Northern Italy around the lakes (Como, Iseo, Garda, Maggiore, etc.)? Lombardy and Piedmont are certainly not promoted as the most economical regions to live in Italy, but they offer a lot of promise in my desirability view.

The current average, recommended pension in the US for a retired couple is about 4,000 Euros per month to live comfortably. How far will that go to cover essential costs to live in Piedmont or Lombardy if the housing cost is 800 Euros? (800 Euros is calculated on the 370,000 Euro purchase of a property with a 200,000 down payment, mortgaged on a 30-year loan at current rates, equaling 20% of the budget.) Assuming no extravagance or abnormal recurring expenses, can a retired couple live on that budget to cover health, home and vehicle insurance, plus basic necessities with moderate entertainment costs?

Thank you for your responses.


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

You're looking at the wrong questions.

Plenty of people manage on a fraction of that. The budget isn't a huge issue. But Unless you're an EU national you'll need a visa. I'm not sure 4K for two will get you one.

Second problem. I hope that's an US mortgage. If not you might have trouble getting an Italian one. Plus there are age limits. You'd have to be in your forties to get an Italian thirty year.

Final point. While many manage on less than half that you may not. You need to make up a fairly fleshed out budget. Start with the housing expense then tack on everything else you can think of. None of us can know if your idea of entertainment is watching free TV or something far more expensive. Same thing with food. If you're happy with local Italian foods your budget will go much further than if you want imported peanut butter.


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## Heinz57 (Sep 10, 2018)

NickZ said:


> You're looking at the wrong questions.
> 
> Plenty of people manage on a fraction of that. The budget isn't a huge issue. But Unless you're an EU national you'll need a visa. I'm not sure 4K for two will get you one.
> 
> ...


Thank you Nick, for the response. Clearly, I've much due diligence to do.

I read on one web site earlier today which stated each adult had to prove 9.970 Euros of income to immigrate or get a residency visa. That's very small. Even the French standard of approximately 30K Euros (their median income) is modest. And it also said to establish permanent residency and be accepted (vested?) into the healthcare system, it takes 5 years and during that period one must maintain private health insurance. What you said about purchasing property and taking on a mortgage is an eye opener. I have just under 200k Euros in equity in my home and with the market as it is now in the Dallas metro, in 4 years that may very likely be a conservatavely low figure. 200K does not go far to purchase a dwelling around those lakes. So, I guess I'll need to investigate how lengthy a loan I'd be permitted at 67yo, if any at all.

Thanks for the wake-up! BTW: Is there a problem with eating Italian peanut butter?:biggrin1:


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

The Italian and French Visa amounts will be similar if not exactly the same. But 30K per person ends up at almost 6K a month for a couple.

Residency only happens after you've received your visa. You'll be able to buy into the health system almost right away. I don't know what the current numbers are and I'm not home but maybe a search on the forum will bring up the percentage you'll need to pay.

Honestly I wouldn't suggest buying unless you're REALLY 100% sure you want to spend forever there. Better to look at a rental or even a different area.

I don't know what type of property you're looking at but if you're older you'll want something with easy access to town. For everything from shopping to health care. In addition most Expats want to travel a bit. Being in the countryside can make that a bit more challenging.

Plus those country homes are often harder and more expensive to keep warm. 

Even if you're 110% sure understand it can be difficult to sell a property. I would be careful tieing up too much capital just in case you have a need.

I think a small jar of Skippy is currently €4. Often covered in dust -)


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

5K a month. Heat is getting to me


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