# East or West: Advice needed for relocation!



## Prince Sho (Jan 11, 2017)

Hey gang my name is Sho. I'm 37, own my own business and thinking of relocating to either Puerto Vallarta, or Playa Del Carmen but am open to advice on other areas that are great for young families, for raising children, for starting and growing business, and are authentically Mexican while still popular with ex-pats. 

I'll be making the move with my wife. We both speak no Spanish whatsoever. We recently had our first child and want to finally take the leap and move. 

We are currently in Vancouver, Canada. We enjoy moderate hiking and cycling, road trips, fine art and music, socializing regularly, and spending time with family whenever possible. 

We really love Sayulita but sometimes feel it may be too loud and "spring break" vibe for us. We also like Playa Del Carmen but worry that it's too "club kid" or commercial for us. Tulum seems a bit too new age boho hippy. And so on.. 

Wondering if anyone on the board has any insight on Sayulita and surrounding areas. Lo De Marcos, even south to Yelapa, Puerto Vallarta or elsewhere on the pacific coast or perhaps in the eastern provinces, Tulum, Playa DC, Merida, etc that is conducive to raising a family. 

Only criteria is, the location must be close to an airport with direct flights to Canada. Not be too rural. And it must be either right on the coast or within a very short drive of the ocean. 

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
Thanks. ???


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Prince Sho said:


> Hey gang my name is Sho. I'm 37, own my own business and thinking of relocating to either Puerto Vallarta, or Playa Del Carmen but am open to advice on other areas that are great for young families, for raising children, for starting and growing business, and are authentically Mexican while still popular with ex-pats.
> 
> I'll be making the move with my wife. We both speak no Spanish whatsoever. We recently had our first child and want to finally take the leap and move.
> 
> ...


:welcome:


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Welcome. I picked Cancun because I had very similar criteria, except I wanted non-stop flights to Washington DC. You don't say where in Canada you want to fly to, is it Vancouver or somewhere else? That will make a difference, I suspect. For Vancouver you can probably fly to the Mexican west coast easier than the east coast, and probably the Mexican east coast will be easier for Toronto/Montreal/Quebec.

Either way, I think most of the flights you're going to find are going to stop somewhere in the US like LA, Houston or Atlanta, but you can probably book something pretty easily that includes a change of planes but not having to go through US immigration or customs (just an international transfer from one plane to another at a single US airport).


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## Prince Sho (Jan 11, 2017)

We will be frequently flying to Vancouver for business and to visit our friends and family, though we will try and drag them out to us as soon as we are settled  

I know that there are direct flights to Puerto Vallarta and Cancun; I have visited both areas. 

We are currently leaning towards the west coast for several reasons (though again, we are open to other options) ..

1) shorter flights. 
2) more dynamic topography and landscape
3) cooler seas, or so it felt 
4) proximity to other areas of interest: California, Guadalajara, Mexico City, Sea of Cortez etc. 

We would really like to stay away from areas like Cancun or Nuevo Vallarta that felt like they have been blanketed with mega resorts and American corporate fast food and box stores. 

That being said, Puerto Vallarta itself is not completely off the table because it DOES have areas that still hold alot of metropolitan charm. 

We would also like to settle where the property values, for rent and later purchase, are not already at outrageous highs. Which again steers us out of places like PV or Cancun and into surrounding towns. 

A town on or close to water with real Mexican charm, cheap real estate, close to other larger cities, options for dining out, good school(s), some infrastructure in place (fast internet, good cell reception, water, electricity, gas) and with potential for growth and prosperity would be just perfect.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

eastwind said:


> Welcome. I picked Cancun because I had very similar criteria, except I wanted non-stop flights to Washington DC. You don't say where in Canada you want to fly to, is it Vancouver or somewhere else? That will make a difference, I suspect. For Vancouver you can probably fly to the Mexican west coast easier than the east coast, and probably the Mexican east coast will be easier for Toronto/Montreal/Quebec.
> 
> Either way, I think most of the flights you're going to find are going to stop somewhere in the US like LA, Houston or Atlanta, but you can probably book something pretty easily that includes a change of planes but not having to go through US immigration or customs (just an international transfer from one plane to another at a single US airport).


Not trying to hijack this thread (but maybe this will anyway), but does a transfer in the US without clearing customs work. I know you can do that in other countries, but I thought in order to change planes in the US, you needed a visa or US passport because you have to clear immigration and customs when you get off the plane. That has certainly been my experience flying from Mexico, changing planes in the US, then continuing to a non-US destination. I have changed in Dallas-Ft Worth, Houston, Atlanta, Miami, Newark and maybe a few others and I always have to clear immigration and customs in the US before proceeding to the connecting flight.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

I remember doing it once in the 90's, but I am a US citizen, and times are different now. Based on this: Avoiding a transit of the United States - Wikitravel the US does not (or not anymore) permit "sterile transit". The page notes that special rules apply for Canadian citizens, but that wasn't what I was referring to in my post. Once can see why a non-stop flight from Canada to PV that doesn't touch down in the US would be preferable, even though the OP is Canadian.


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## RPBHaas (Dec 21, 2011)

All travelers arriving to the USA must pass through immigration and customs prior to transferring to another flight.
Based on the stated aspects of a place to live by the OP, it appears to me that Puerto Vallarta is the only choice as the Cancun area is almost exclusively an area for tourists and famous for "the party". PV has access to mountains and a top 20 North American metropolitan area in Guadalajara. Also, PV is close to the costa allegre beach area which allows for the occasional small beach, more isolated, weekend getaway. (still with surrounding mountains)


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## Prince Sho (Jan 11, 2017)

Yes, I've also noticed the east coast, especially Cancun, is basically developed solely for the enjoyment of tourists. I thought someone more familiar with the area could open my eyes to other prospective communities in that region that might still feel Mexican and have what we are looking for. 

Also, I agree that PV, based on our aforementioned criteria, is a top choice. Direct flights almost daily to Vancouver and Los Angeles, great art and music scene, world class restaurants, some Mexican charm still felt within its modern development, and great infrastructure in place. 

We were just hoping to hear more about which PV neighbourhoods are "up and coming" and still within reach for us, and also get more insight on life in other communities up and down the coast in that area. 

Our monthly budget is roughly $1500usd and our comfortable home purchase budget is around $200usd or less. 

We are open to travel some good distance north or south from PVR if there is great value in living in the more remote towns. 

Based on your recommendations my wife and I will do some traveling again this spring to get more acquainted with the recommended towns or neighbourhoods and narrow the list down!


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

Several things on your checklist, you are not going to find in the same place. For instance, you speak no Spanish, yet want to settle somewhere that the property is inexpensive, by the ocean, and has good schools. The places where the property is inexpensive will be mostly Spanish speaking and Mexican public schools are not known for high quality of education. As you are probably aware, Sayulita has an international school, but not only is Sayulita expensive (as is the school), as you stated, it is too loud and spring-breakish for you (altho there are quiet areas on the outskirts, though still in Sayulita, i.e. a 7 minute drive from the centro which it doesn't sound like you checked out). San Pancho is quieter and cleaner and has a Montessori school, but property values would be about the same. Lo de Marcos is a sweet little town, my friends from Canada stay there every winter and love it, but not much goes on there and schooling would be Mex. public school unless you wanted to drive your kids to San Pancho or Sayulita. 
Are you only considering mainland Mex? I ask because Todos Santos in Baja Calif. Sur is a lovely town, but of course the landscape is desert rather than tropical, although Todos Santos is an oasis with underground springs, so it's greener than a lot of Baja. Montessori school which goes to grade 5 or 6, then there is the private Sierra School for older kids. But again, property values there are not cheap. Direct flights to Vancouver from Cabo, which is about an hour and a half drive.
Hope this helps, these are the areas I am familiar with.


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## gringotim (Jan 5, 2011)

Prince Sho said:


> Hey gang my name is Sho. I'm 37, own my own business and thinking of relocating to either Puerto Vallarta, or Playa Del Carmen.........


That's like comparing apples and oranges, they are two completely different types of places. Our choice was Puerto Vallarta, one small reason being the closeness to BC. but like we are having, the only problem would be deciding what area of PV to live. :yo:


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## Orfin (Sep 26, 2016)

Seems like all the ideal criteria listed for the west coast is putting your best option at Puerto Vallarta.
You Have Mazatlan to the north as the nearest big coastal city
but Puerto Vallarta has all that Mazatlan has except maybe Puerto Vallarta may be better in a number of ways.
Puerto Vallarta has a few nice out laying rural areas other than Sayulita. So there is room to feel and explore. PV is close to Tepic city inland but not much offered in Tepic compared to PV. South of PV has the nearest coastal City at Manzanillo which is ok but puts you closer to the Michoacan troublef areas. Any farther south and it gets farther away from your Criteria.
PV seems to be the best option. I think over time, the criteria will have to adjust but PV area is so nice that any regrets to have about decisions in Mexico, are easier to live with there in PV area. Guadalajara is also not so far and thats not too far from Mexico city.

I like rural myself and close enough to a small city for occasional extravaganza of things not found in the rural towns.


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## Prince Sho (Jan 11, 2017)

Thank you. Very informative. One question.. "Michoacan trouble areas"? Please elaborate. And are there other trouble areas to avoid?


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## Prince Sho (Jan 11, 2017)

I know all signs point to PV but my heart sometimes yearns for a place like Yelapa. At this point I would just love to hear more first hand info on all possible options from people who have lived or spent some time. I've only visited the Nayarit and Jalisco coast a few times and have very limited knowledge of the real way of life in all of its seaside communities. 

I do plan to learn Spanish quickly and make local friends to integrate and get the best out of life in Mexico. Definitely not looking to be completely surrounded by expats all the time. 

Also I'm hoping to be in an area with friendly open minded locals, lots of great food vendors, and room for business growth and development.


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## Prince Sho (Jan 11, 2017)

Speaking of heart yearning for little seaside towns .. Can anyone describe in detail, or give comparison to, the following towns?

-San Blas
-Lo De Marcos
-Yelapa


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Locals do tend to be open and friendly, but true “integration“ is a pipe dream. Other expats are often very helpful and you will make friends with them also; probably first. Tourists; not so much interest in locals; expat or local....just margaritas & entertainment, as they are on vacation.

You said, “Also, I agree that PV, based on our aforementioned criteria, is a top choice. Direct flights almost daily to Vancouver and Los Angeles, great art and music scene, world class restaurants, some Mexican charm still felt within its modern development, and great infrastructure in place.“, which indicates that you have really chosen your destination. I suggest that you find an economical place to use as a temporary base, like an economical hotel or hostel, from which to explore PV in detail; preferably in centro, old town, and on foot, climbing the hills, looking for signs and things that attract you to various neighborhoods. You will find a home. Buena suerte.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Prince Sho said:


> Speaking of heart yearning for little seaside towns .. Can anyone describe in detail, or give comparison to, the following towns?
> 
> -San Blas
> -Lo De Marcos
> -Yelapa


I don't know Lo de Marcos, but have been to San Blas several times and Yelapa once.

Yelapa is quite small, one main street a few blocks long and some cabañas stretched along the beach to the north. I believe it is primarily accessible by boat. I am not sure as I have never taken it, but my impression is that the road into Yelapa is primitive, maybe four wheel drive only. I don't believe there is a very large contingent of foreigners there.

San Blas is quite a bit bigger, though still a small village. There is an estuary in San Blas that is a wonderful boat ride, lots of crocodiles, birds and mangroves. San Blas is famous for its banana bread, I am not sure how that started. The mosquitoes or no-see-ums on the beach at night are terrible. I camped on the beach once and was forced to close the tent up completely. Another time I spent a night on turtle watch. There is a group that patrols the beach when the turtles are laying their eggs to protect them from poachers. The mosquitoes that night were really bad. There are some foreigners living there but I don't know how many or anything about them.


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## gringotim (Jan 5, 2011)

Prince Sho said:


> We will be frequently flying to Vancouver...


I'm sure you've looked into it, but if not, there are non stop flights with Air Canada and WestJet between YVR and PVR, if not year round, then at least a good part of the year. Maybe also try Sunwing or Air Transit. We have not found a time of year when there weren't any, but of course haven't checked every month of the year, and schedules always change. Flights are usually 4.5 to 5 hrs depending on the plane used and winds. With WestJet you may have to sometimes go via Calgary. You may even find flights out of Abbotsford. As is always the case flying in/out of Canada, the tax and fee's are brutal compared to the U.S, especially when its a seat sale, you sometimes pay more in tax etc than the actual airfare. Then theres always the option of Seattle, but then you pay the $$$ exchange, so not always worth the extra travel hassle. <script id=


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## Prince Sho (Jan 11, 2017)

Thank you everyone for your helpful advice. Now that we have narrowed it down to the west coast, namely Vallarta region, we have to figure out what neighbourhood in PV or what town close to PV would be the right fit for us. 

I'm planning on a visit to PV next month and another family trip planned for late March to Lo De Marcos/Sayulita/Bucerias .. 

I'll continue researching until then and if you have any advice again please do share your personal experiences and stories. 

Thanks a mil.


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