# lost and stressed move



## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

My wife and I are in a different kind of situation. My wife is a Mexican National and is having to go back to Mexico by the end of this year. We are moving the family down to be with her. Just yesterday I got my temporary visa and menaje de casa paperwork all set up and stamped for approval. 

Here's what's stressing us out. Our car is a 2016 KIA. My wife spoke to the Audante (spelling?) and they said the fees we would have to pay on the car and trailer I would be pulling across would not be worth it. They were talking a percentage of the original value of the car (since it's not part of NAFTA), and roughly 50% of trailer value.

We live in Kentucky and are heading to Chiapas.

So my questions to the community are these:

Would it be better for me to pack the stuff in a rental truck and haul to let's say Texas and hire a company to take it the rest of the way across the border and down to where we will be living?

Are there companies around (let's say again) Laredo that do the full transportation to the state of Chiapas or do you have to hire a Mexican based company on the Mexican side of the border to finish the hauling? Recommendations on a trustworthy company that does this?

-or-

Could I drive the rental to the border and have a Mexican based company meet and move the goods to Chiapas? Company recommendation and how you set it up?

Would it be easier to just pay the fees on the car and trailer and forgo companies altogether?

Anyone who has recently made this type of transition that would be willing to share what their cost was using moving companies and who would be trustworthy recommendations to use?

Thanks in advance for advice and input.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

It depends on how much stuff you have to move. I'm not clear from your post on whether you are trying to move everything in the KIA or you're talking about towing the KIA behind a big moving van full of stuff or something in between.


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## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

We would have a 6x12 trailer filled. Washer/dryer, kids toys and books, personal paperwork, one bedroom set, tools, bicycles, clothes, and electronics.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

A couple other questions - is the KIA titled in your name or your wife's name? Do you already own the trailer? Is your visa set up as a canje to residente temporale (RT) or residente permanente (RP)?

RT gives you more options in this case.


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## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

The KIA is in my name. We would be getting a new trailer just before we close on the house. My Visa would be temporary to begin with and not transfer to permanent until a 3 year period they tell me.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

Can a KIA pull a 6 X 12 loaded trailer to Chiapis ? Would it be the same car when it got there ?

It might be a better idea to find a lightly used trailer rather than a new one. We came to Mexico with a 5 X 8 trailer that was about a month old - the previous owner found it too small. If you do drive a trailer to Mexico - get locking lug nuts, get a couple of those wheel locks that prohibit the trailer moving, get a locking 'pin' - the gizmo that attaches ball to the car.


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## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

Yes, the 2016 KIA Sorent AWD has a tow capacity of 5K lbs. Main reason I got it. Space for the kids to grow and not torment each other and the towing I knew I would need. Not sure now if it is the best option.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Since you'll be on a RT, you are eligible to get a Temporary Import Permit for any car that you drive in. This option allows you to decouple your two problems - you need to move, and you can't permanently import the KIA because it's not a NAFTA car. 

What you'd do is bring the KIA into mexico on a TIP. As long as you stay on a RT you can keep moving the TIP over to the new RT when the old RT expires, for up to 4 years. At the end of 4 years you must change from RT to RP (residente permanente). At that point, you're no longer allowed to have a car on a TIP. So before 4 years is up, you'd need to drive the KIA back to the US and sell it.

That gives you plenty of time to shop for and buy a replacement Mexican-plated car after your move. When you are ready to take the KIA back to the US you would drive it back and sell it, either in Texas or if you want to make it a visit back to Kentucky that's fine too, and then fly back to Mexico. 

I'm a little unclear on the details of how the trailer works, some of the others here know better, but it's not really a big part of the problem. Just make sure that the titles for the KIA and the trailer are in your name (since you're the one on the RT) and that the names match exactly including your middle name(s) and you'll be able to get the TIP.

Doing it this way is more driving, but at least you'll be driving your own car and you won't have to unload/reload all your stuff, and it's by far the cheapest option. You'll lose money on the KIA vs being able to keep it for 10 years and drive it into the ground, but that's a lost cause or sunk cost at this point, it just wasn't the right car to buy in the first place if you had a move to Mexico in your future. Such is life. 

If you stay on the RT for the full 4 years you can get quite a bit of good out of the KIA before selling it anyway.

Edit: clarification: the names on the car and trailer titles must match your name on your passport exactly, including middle names.


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## lagoloo (Apr 12, 2011)

My advice: sell the KIA. You won't be able to keep a foreign plated car once you become Permanente.
Have a moving company bring your goods. There's SEYMI, based in Guadalajara, that I used, had my stuff crated beforehand at a moving and storage place in the U.S., and everything arrived in one piece. Since cost is based on weight, consider each item. Fly on down with the family, maybe rent a car until you find one that suits you and can handle the potholed roads. Stress could be reduced with that route.
Good luck and welcome!


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## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

Thank you eastwind


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## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

thank you too lagoloo


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

ceashreve2 said:


> Yes, the 2016 KIA Sorent AWD has a tow capacity of 5K lbs. Main reason I got it. Space for the kids to grow and not torment each other and the towing I knew I would need. Not sure now if it is the best option.


We have a very similar Japanese vehicle. I would not want to have driven that here pulling the trailer we pulled.

I just threw "2016 KIA Sorent AWD" at google and it says the towing capacity is 3,500 lbs. I wonder if that is on level ground or mountainous terrain ? I have this image of that old Chevy Chase 'vacation' movie 

More advice - get a new spare for the trailer. Have them install clips on the inside walls of the trailer so you can tie off sections, get a wheel which attaches to the 'joist' so you can wheel the trailer around by hand, and watch how you load the trailer. Our first night out I had to unload/reload the contents because it was not driving very well. One last thing... we set out on day one only to learn that none of the lights were working on the trailer. Turns out they had given us a bad adapter for the car-to-trailer connection (even though it was brand new). 

Just my 2 cents.


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## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

thank you too lagoloo


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Note that the car and trailer, when temporarily imported into Mexico, become a single unit. The car may not leave Mexico without the trailer. Finding a place to store a trailer can be a problem too.
Best to sell, or otherwise dispose of all you can and keep the move as simple as possible. Maybe even just leave your stuff in storage in the USA, until you have flown or taken a bus to your new Mexican location, rented or bought a place and installed basic furnishings. Then, with the proper Mexican documentation of your status, residency, CURP, RFC, etc., you will be able to buy and register a vehicle in your new state. Then, with or without a trailer, you might pick up your stuff in the USA at your convenience......There are options. Crossing the border with a Mexican plated vehicle is much simpler than with a US plated vehicle.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

I know this is not the company line (yet potentially SO important) - are my wife and I the ONLY people who have successfully nationalized a car (and trailer) within Mexico while on RP ? Or are we the only people who didn't mind the expense (seeing as we were very familiar with the vehicles) ?


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

lagoloo said:


> My advice: sell the KIA. You won't be able to keep a foreign plated car once you become Permanente.
> Have a moving company bring your goods. There's SEYMI, based in Guadalajara, that I used, had my stuff crated beforehand at a moving and storage place in the U.S., and everything arrived in one piece. Since cost is based on weight, consider each item. Fly on down with the family, maybe rent a car until you find one that suits you and can handle the potholed roads. Stress could be reduced with that route.
> Good luck and welcome!


Yeah, it depends on how tight finances are. This is a much less troublesome and much more expensive route. If in doubt, get an estimate for the cost of the move and a bid from a dealer on the KIA to see how much you'll lose there - if it's 1 year old and you have a loan on it you're probably under water on the loan so selling the KIA will cost you on top of the move. 

Consider also whether you're going to be able to get service and spare parts for a KIA in Mexico.


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## ceashreve2 (Sep 15, 2017)

The 4 cyl. Sorento only has 3.5k towing. We have the 6 cyl. with tow package, hill assist, and trans cooler. I did a ton of research before buying, but I totally understand the concern. (Didn't mean to turn this into a car forum..hehe) We were planning on getting at least two spare tires for the trailer, and 2 gas cans to fill up after crossing the border so we wouldn't end up needing gas at a less than desireable area if this is the route we end up taking.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

eastwind said:


> Consider also whether you're going to be able to get service and spare parts for a KIA in Mexico.


There are possibly more KIA's in our area than Nissan Tsuru's.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

Gas is cheaper in Texas than Mexico now.


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

horseshoe846 said:


> There are possibly more KIA's in our area than Nissan Tsuru's.


Good, I had no idea, that's why I just said "consider". I thought if it wasn't a NAFTA car there might be issues.

Horseshoe: If he brings the KIA in on a TIP, can he begin the nationalization process here without having to drive it back? 

If he did the nationalization as a part of the move, would that mean a multi-day or multi-week holdup at the border while the importer does their thing?


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

eastwind said:


> Good, I had no idea, that's why I just said "consider". I thought if it wasn't a NAFTA car there might be issues.
> 
> Horseshoe: If he brings the KIA in on a TIP, can he begin the nationalization process here without having to drive it back?
> 
> If he did the nationalization as a part of the move, would that mean a multi-day or multi-week holdup at the border while the importer does their thing?


We drove into Mexico with our pre-approval RPs - pulling a trailer with (what was left of) all our (physical) worldly goods. In value terms mostly computers and other electronics.

The car we drove in was definitely an (oldish) NAFTA car. Yet the new car we purchased here is certainly not a NAFTA car. Not sure why they make that distinction.

Our 'oldish' SUV was imported into Mexico here in the interior without ever returning to the border (and not any sort of ampro etc). 

In hindsight - if I would have been pre-informed about all the hurdles (if they even existed when we came South) - I would have imported the car into Mexico at the border - but half of me says that might not have worked at that time. 

I guess - if I were sitting in Florida at the moment - planning the trip - I would call a very professional/ very respected (Mexican) import/export agent for advice. Which is who helped us achieve our goals.


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## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

I have left Mexico in my truck and turned in my TIP leaving the trailer in Mexico, it will never leave even when the TIP expires in 7 more years. I have no need to tow it out and they don't seem to care.

Gas stations are so common here now that you need not be concerned with bringing gas cans. I brought three spares for the trailer as the tires were old when we left, one blew ten miles from home. 

The route along the coast which follows 180 is great, I made the mistake of going through Tuxpan
the first time, now at Naranjos I go through Cerro Azul and Alamo on 127 then catch 180 south again below Tihuatlan.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I wrestled with the dilemma of buying a trailer vs. hiring someone to move us. We wound up moving ~350 cubic feet of stuff from Chicago to Texas for about $1500. We hired a trucking company and then paid a pair of mover guys at each end to load and unload.

Then we put it all in storage in Texas and now have a company out of San Miguel contracted to bring it on down to Queretaro for $2500. The lowest quote we got for a door to door move was $6500 so this saved us a couple thousand.

This isn't a full house move - we have no furniture, just boxes of books, musical instruments and recording studio equipment and some household odds and ends that we decided to bring along since it didn't increase the cost any due to the total size and weight still staying under their minimum load.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I'll add to my previous post that we sold our vehicle in Texas and bought a Toyota RAV4 here in Mexico. It really was the easier way to go, rather than trying to get a trailer down here. Plus, since I am now RP, the car had to go anyway and that helped make the decision.


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## ElPocho (Aug 25, 2017)

IMHO- Nowdays appliances are junk. They last 3-10 years before they start breaking. You are better off buying appliances in Mexico because repairs require parts. Pretend you got the crappy fridge we got here in the USA, when the guy fixed it the second time around here in the USA, we had to fork out 350 USD for a circuit board, he got it in a couple of days. If I would of had that same refrigerator fixed in Mexico, the repair guy may not be familiar with that model and then had to special order the part from the USA. Figure I'd pay about $450-600 for the part in Mexico.

Take books, tools, electronics, pots and pans.
Transportation is not free so minimize the stuff you take. IMHO...





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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Zorro2017 said:


> I have left Mexico in my truck and turned in my TIP leaving the trailer in Mexico, it will never leave even when the TIP expires in 7 more years. I have no need to tow it out and they don't seem to care.
> 
> Gas stations are so common here now that you need not be concerned with bringing gas cans. I brought three spares for the trailer as the tires were old when we left, one blew ten miles from home.
> 
> ...


One must note that your “trailer“ was not a cargo trailer, but obviously a camper with a ten year Importada. That is not what this thread is about......I think.


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## Zorro2017 (Jan 9, 2017)

RVGRINGO said:


> One must note that your “trailer“ was not a cargo trailer, but obviously a camper with a ten year Importada. That is not what this thread is about......I think.


Actually in my case it was used as one as it was packed to the ceiling and was a toy hauler. A toy hauler is a good choice for moving as you can still sleep in it or just take it back and sell it. Once you raise the back bed it has an immense storage area that can hold a motorcycle. There aren't a lot of RV parks in Mexico, we saw a few along the coast but they are rare.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

ElPocho said:


> IMHO- Nowdays appliances are junk.
> 
> Take books, tools, electronics, pots and pans.
> Transportation is not free so minimize the stuff you take. IMHO...


+1. I don't understand why anyone would drag appliances to MX.

But books? Really? Join the 21st century! Go digital.

And pots and pans ... are they really so hard to find in MX? Plus eating out is rather cheap in most of MX, and you don't heat up your home in the hot months (which is more than half the calendar year in the places expats tend to land). Of course some people love to cook, or live in smaller towns, they should pack accordingly.

Electronics, tools, and I agree with these items. Which generally fit in a car or normal pickup (no trailer required).

For my upcoming move (compact car, no trailer), I am focusing on bringing a solid core of clothing and shoes. I am larger in size than most locals in Mexico - not fat just bigger. For my shoulders, waist size, foot size, the local stores don't generally have a lot for me. What they do have, often pricey and of dubious quality/style. I'll admit though, it might be I just don't know where to shop.


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## ElPocho (Aug 25, 2017)

UrbanMan said:


> +1. I don't understand why anyone would drag appliances to MX.
> 
> But books? Really? Join the 21st century! Go digital.
> 
> ...


I love my books, there is something about books. Plus i highlight and make notes, not really a fiction reader. I do have a Kindle DX, which are no longer made, I've had to ride the screen twice. 
I guess you are right about pots and pans, though I like my cast iron stuff. I'm taking my Japanese cooking knives, and stones. 
I'm also copying my friend movie collection and taking computers and some other electronics.

I wish I could take my guns, but that is out of the question.



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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

ElPocho said:


> I love my books, there is something about books. Plus i highlight and make notes, not really a fiction reader. I do have a Kindle DX, which are no longer made, I've had to ride the screen twice.
> I guess you are right about pots and pans, though I like my cast iron stuff. I'm taking my Japanese cooking knives, and stones.
> I'm also copying my friend movie collection and taking computers and some other electronics.


I also love my books. It's not a matter of joining the 21st century, I'm not a Luddite. But holding an actual book, turning the pages, rather than a piece of plastic with a digital screen is like apples to oranges. 
And yeah, I brought my cast iron pans as well. I have recently seem them for sale in Mexico, but only one place, and they don't have them anymore. A Mexican woman was examining one in the store, and obviously had never seen such a thing. As I passed by with my shopping cart, I told her- those are great and will last you the rest of your life. She said Really? I confirmed and she put it in her cart.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

Everybody has their tastes and attachments. A case can be made to say "yes" to bringing 10,000 items with you. Some people I think would rent an entire cargo plane if they could. The overriding goal imho is to find reasons to say "no" as much as you can.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

I agree. Personally I am a minimalist. I figure if I haven't used it or worn it in a year, it's time to chuck it. Excepting personal mementos, family photo albums, etc., and IMO most folks keep way too much of that as well. Like do I really need to keep ALL the drawings my kids did in preschool of clowns and balloons, or would one good sample suffice. I always feel good about taking things to the dump or to donate.
Humans are the only creatures on earth that need all this "stuff".


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## Anonimo (Apr 8, 2012)

I recently saw a set of cast iron pans for sale in the Morelia Costco. (I think!) But I didn't buy them, as I don't need them.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

Every year around Christmastime, I go through my clothes and anything that is getting shabby but is still wearable, I donate to charity. This makes me feel good and leaves more room in my closet for a few new things.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

We have a cast iron frying pan, a gem pan and a dutch oven. All three were wedding gifts to my paternal grandmother & we use them regularly. I suppose they are well over 100 years old now.


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## ElPocho (Aug 25, 2017)

to keep or to part with....

I come from a long line of Hoarders.

I'm going through a divorce and having to let go of everything. Even my life here in the USA. Sometimes you just have to let go. Easier said than done..
things are part of the monkey trap 

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/nov/14/how-to-avoid-monkey-trap-oliver-burkeman


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

ElPocho said:


> to keep or to part with....
> 
> I come from a long line of Hoarders.
> 
> ...


My father was a hoarder, my mother was not. She even threw away greeting cards unless they were from my father, my sister or me. Thank god I mostly take after my mom, or I would never have been able to part from most of my stuff before making the final move to Mexico!


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

You never know when you're going to need a bent nail!


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

eastwind said:


> You never know when you're going to need a bent nail!


That's something my father might have said!


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

We have BOXES of bent nails. To think we moved here five years ago with our stuff in a 5 X 8 trailer. Now we would need at least a 20' container to move our stuff.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

ElPocho said:


> things are part of the monkey trap
> 
> https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/nov/14/how-to-avoid-monkey-trap-oliver-burkeman


Excellent article.


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## ElPocho (Aug 25, 2017)

UrbanMan said:


> Excellent article.


The book is even better, it's a work of art  

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## ElPocho (Aug 25, 2017)

surabi said:


> Humans are the only creatures on earth that need all this "stuff".


Ok I'm going off the deep end...

Which brings up, why the need for stuff.
To adapt.
The first stone tools, painstakingly made, kept for generations and set with love in our ansestral​ graves. I find those stone axes mesmerizing in thier beauty.
We are the most adaptable creature on the face of this Earth. 

That's what you guys/gals are doing now, adapting to a new culture. For whatever reason you are adapting. Objects are tools. Tools are no longer just tangible objects. This forum the internet your tool.

Sorry for the rant. I overthink chit


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

ElPocho said:


> Ok I'm going off the deep end...
> 
> Which brings up, why the need for stuff.
> To adapt.
> ...


Doesn't read like a rant to me, but a thoughtful (as in thinking, as opposed to being polite) post. For sure, and that distinguishes us from other animals, although it is now documented that other animals do fashion tools for some tasks. They don't stash them in a tool box, though 

Some objects are tools. But hanging on to clothes one hasn't worn for years, or having cupboards full of enough dishes to serve a wedding party, when one in fact never has more than 6 other people over for dinner, or keeping containers full of bent nails is just hoarding. 

My experience with folks who keep everything because it might be useful some day, is that they have so much stuff around that when they actually could use that thing they know they have somewhere, they can't find it and end up having to go out and buy it anyway.


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