# Residency requirement for PR



## NumberSix (Dec 22, 2021)

I'm a British resident in Spain under the terms on Brexit Working Agreement. These terms, if I understand correctly, require me to be in Spain for 183 days per year for the first 5 years in order to get permanent residence.

Does anyone have any experience of what checks are made on this and what evidence I should retain to present in order to satisfy this condition?


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## MataMata (Nov 30, 2008)

Did you get residency be virtue of being here prior to Dec 31st 2020 or after?

PS. It's the Withdrawal Agreement not Working.


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## Mark427 (Dec 22, 2020)

You actually need to be in spain a lot more than 183 days per year as there is a requirement that you cannot have been outwith Spain for more than 10 months total in those 5 years.


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## NumberSix (Dec 22, 2021)

MataMata said:


> Did you get residency be virtue of being here prior to Dec 31st 2020 or after?


Before. (Does that make a difference?)


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## NumberSix (Dec 22, 2021)

Mark427 said:


> You actually need to be in spain a lot more than 183 days per year as there is a requirement that you cannot have been outwith Spain for more than 10 months total in those 5 years.


Not, I believe, under the terms of the WA:



> For residents who are beneficiaries of the Withdrawal Agreement.
> From the Spanish TIE BOE A-2020-7276.
> Those persons who have reached the five years of legal residence in Spain may convert it to permanent residence (as provided for in Article 15 of the WA) before the issued residence document expires, and upon requesting a new residence document at the authorised police units and, after verifying the duration of residence, they will issue it. This new residence document will then be valid for 10 years and in the field corresponding to the Type of Permit the word 'Permanent' shall appear.
> Article 15 of the WA. Right of permanent residence says...
> ...


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## vianina (Feb 25, 2020)

Mark427 said:


> You actually need to be in spain a lot more than 183 days per year as there is a requirement that you cannot have been outwith Spain for more than 10 months total in those 5 years.


That's for D7, isn't it, not for WA beneficiaries?


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

vianina said:


> That's for D7, isn't it, not for WA beneficiaries?


Correct. This is one of a few advantages of residency under the WA compared to rules applicable generally to third country nationals. One of the disadvantages of residency under the WA is you cannot transfer your permanent residency to another EU state other than Denmark.


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## NumberSix (Dec 22, 2021)

Joppa said:


> One of the disadvantages of residency under the WA is you cannot transfer your permanent residency to another EU state other than Denmark.


Super sucky.

(No offence intended to Denmark, I'm sure it's a very lovely country )


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## Joppa (Sep 7, 2009)

NumberSix said:


> Super sucky.
> 
> (No offence intended to Denmark, I'm sure it's a very lovely country )


What I meant to say was that transferrable permanent residency for normal third country national doesn't work in Denmark, which has an opt-out. Ireland has an opt-out too (but UK citizens can still move there without a visa because of common travel area, and UK used to have opt-out too when it was in EU).


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## Mark427 (Dec 22, 2020)

Joppa said:


> Correct. This is one of a few advantages of residency under the WA compared to rules applicable generally to third country nationals. One of the disadvantages of residency under the WA is you cannot transfer your permanent residency to another EU state other than Denmark.


just to nit pick thats not quite correct. D7 is for Portugal. The Spanish version is the NLV.


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## vianina (Feb 25, 2020)

Mark427 said:


> just to nit pick thats not quite correct. D7 is for Portugal. The Spanish version is the NLV.


Yes, that’s my bad, I’m not actually based in Spain, just hang out here because there’s more company


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

NumberSix said:


> I'm a British resident in Spain under the terms on Brexit Working Agreement. These terms, if I understand correctly, require me to be in Spain for 183 days per year for the first 5 years in order to get permanent residence.
> 
> Does anyone have any experience of what checks are made on this and what evidence I should retain to present in order to satisfy this condition?


Do you mean under the *Withdrawal Agreement*?

If so, then yes, then you do indeed need to spend at least 6 months ayear in Spain for the first 5 years. 

Checks might or might not be made. 

However it would be prudent to keep any travel documents if you are a frequent traveller & if you feel that your absences might be questioned. 

If you're living here though, it's a simple matter for them to check that you've been submitting resident tax returns, for example.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Mark427 said:


> You actually need to be in spain a lot more than 183 days per year as there is a requirement that you cannot have been outwith Spain for more than 10 months total in those 5 years.


That's for anyone who has obtained residency NOT under the Withdrawal Agreement.


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## Mark427 (Dec 22, 2020)

xabiaxica said:


> That's for anyone who has obtained residency NOT under the Withdrawal Agreement.


Yes my bad. I have more reading to do apparantly.
Doesnt help that i'm also considering Portugal so tend to get them mixed up like Vianina


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## NumberSix (Dec 22, 2021)

xabiaxica said:


> Do you mean under the *Withdrawal Agreement*?
> 
> If so, then yes, then you do indeed need to spend at least 6 months ayear in Spain for the first 5 years.
> 
> ...


I do mean the Withdrawal Agreement, yes. Can't edit and correct the original, sorry.

I'm spending six months in Spain and six outside at the moment with my family, who have been unable to join me yet for health and personal reasons.

I'll be submitting my first tax return in the next few months and intend to carry on so doing. Though my income is from trading and investing shares so it's not something that ties me definitively to Spain, so that's not proof of anything.

I can certainly keep copies of plane tickets in and out of Spain: that's something that's very easy for them to verify anyway with flight data sharing across the EU.

What's more difficult to prove though is the negative: that I'm not out of Spain during the time I say I'm here. How do I prove I haven't snuck over to Portugal for those 6 months? 

I'd be interested in the experiences of anyone who's applied for permanent residency and any challenges they've faced.


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## proud.to.be.EUROPEAN (Feb 14, 2020)

NumberSix said:


> I do mean the Withdrawal Agreement, yes. Can't edit and correct the original, sorry.
> 
> I'm spending six months in Spain and six outside at the moment with my family, who have been unable to join me yet for health and personal reasons.
> 
> ...


Its for you to prove you're for 6 months in ES, and it's up to "them" to check if you "sneaked out".
Simples.


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## vianina (Feb 25, 2020)

proud.to.be.EUROPEAN said:


> Its for you to prove you're for 6 months in ES, and it's up to "them" to check if you "sneaked out".
> Simples.


I think the OP was asking for constructive input on how that operates in practice.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

vianina said:


> I think the OP was asking for constructive input on how that operates in practice.


That is constructive advice. 

It falls on the individual to prove they were here not elsewhere.

Receipts
Bank withdrawals
Credit card transactions

Etc


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## trotter58 (Feb 8, 2017)

NumberSix said:


> I do mean the Withdrawal Agreement, yes. Can't edit and correct the original, sorry.
> 
> I'm spending six months in Spain and six outside at the moment with my family, who have been unable to join me yet for health and personal reasons.
> 
> ...


Submission of your income tax to Spain for the next 4 years should be enough to get you permanent residency.

I've not yet applied for permanent residency myself but would suspect that you'll be required to sign a declaration that you have maintained legal residency in Spain for the last 5 years and tax receipts would be very easy to check. I can't really imagine that they would be bothered to check if you've been away from Spain a little longer than allowed, as long as you're paying your residents income tax.


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## kaipa (Aug 3, 2013)

Technically after 5 years your status is automatically made permanent. I doubt they check although the TIE cards are only for 5 years ( or earlier depending on when you registered). You probably need to provide proof when you go to renew your card although uk nats who recently changed their green cards to TIEs which were marked permanent dont appear to have been required to show anything. I'm going to change mine in January for a permanent so I guess I will find out what they require.


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## NumberSix (Dec 22, 2021)

kaipa said:


> Technically after 5 years your status is automatically made permanent. I doubt they check although the TIE cards are only for 5 years ( or earlier depending on when you registered). You probably need to provide proof when you go to renew your card although uk nats who recently changed their green cards to TIEs which were marked permanent dont appear to have been required to show anything. I'm going to change mine in January for a permanent so I guess I will find out what they require.


That's encouraging! Though I've been told it isn't an automatic process. Would be very interested to hear your experience after you're done, if you don't mind?


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