# Retiring in Valencia



## nwstein (Nov 8, 2009)

Hi,

My Mother is looking to retire or maybe work part-time in Valencia in the next 6 months.

I know that the property prices, in general, are down in Spain but not in the City center of Valencia. I think that she would be looking to live near the beach or in the center if possible.

I would like help on the following things:


Property prices
is Rusafa a good place for someone to retire
any tips on a good real estate agent (my Mother speaks fluent spanish so they don't need to speak English)
property tax
coucil tax (if it exists and how much it is)
general cost of living information, compared to London
tips on things to avoid and things to look into as well.

Thanks for the help,

Nick


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Hi,
Can't give you much information except that there is property tax called IBI (impuesto sobre bienes inmuebles) but the cost depends on where you live etc.
As for things to look out for, the same things as when you make a move anywhere. People have warned several times against using British workmen to do alterations, installing tv arials etc. You might want to look at threads about that...
Good luck. 
I'm sure others will have more useful nuggets of wisdom to pass on!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

PS Make sure the place your mother gets has central heating. Many properties which are originally built as holiday homes don't have any, are then bought by foreigners who live all year round and find that it DOES get cold in Spain!!


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## nwstein (Nov 8, 2009)

Thanks for those bits of info. I have lived in Valencia in the winter and understand that it does get a little colder than people think.

What about property prices in Valencia, have they gone down at all?


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

*Property Prices - Valencia*



nwstein said:


> Thanks for those bits of info. I have lived in Valencia in the winter and understand that it does get a little colder than people think.
> 
> What about property prices in Valencia, have they gone down at all?


A certain property expert on Valencia, whose name I will not mention for fear of being ticked off/accused of payola again, has just "called the bottom of the market" for Madrid & Barcelona, as well as Vlc. 

Anybody agree with this?


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

No, I see the prices continue to fall here.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

If you're buying with sterling, I think the pound/Euro thing needs to be watched as well as the asking prices of properties

Jo xxx


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## littleredrooster (Aug 3, 2008)

City centre and beachside,mucho dinero just for a basic flat.
Detached weekend homes about 20km plus inland, with more than adequate shops and services close by are much better value in IMHO.


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

Graham Hunt who comes on here regularly is your man. I was in Montserrat this week and was impressed with that town. I had not been there for 18/20 years and it had definitely *moved on*


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> Graham Hunt who comes on here regularly is your man. I was in Montserrat this week and was impressed with that town. I had not been there for 18/20 years and it had definitely *moved on*



Alot of estate agents tend to be saying that the market has bottomed out

Jo xxxx


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

The agents can say what they like. It's the people who are selling (or not!) whose opinions I usually value. I can't say there are more than a dozen or so agents in the whole of expatshire who I would trust. As far as the Costa Blanca is concerned the prices are still dropping. All very worrying.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> The agents can say what they like. It's the people who are selling (or not!) whose opinions I usually value. I can't say there are more than a dozen or so agents in the whole of expatshire who I would trust. As far as the Costa Blanca is concerned the prices are still dropping. All very worrying.


Read post 5 on here LOL!!!!

Jo xxx


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

*Spill de beanz*



SteveHall said:


> The agents can say what they like. It's the people who are selling (or not!) whose opinions I usually value. I can't say there are more than a dozen or so agents in the whole of expatshire who I would trust. As far as the Costa Blanca is concerned the prices are still dropping. All very worrying.


Steve, I'm only going to get one shot at buying a place in Vlc city. If it goes right, I can hack the rest - broadly covered by making a living and settling in. But if it goes wrong, that's me done for.

So are you in a position/willing to say who these trustworthy operators are? Three or four would be a fair spread, to avoid accusations of payola and give them all a fighting chance. 

I was ticked of by a mod for mentioning GH repeatedly and told that he was not the only fish in this particular sea. I was even told of the brother of a best friend's husband - or somesuch - who had been an agent of repute and probity for Vlc for 20 years now. My query for details has dribbled into the sand, it seems.

Word from our man is that, although he has called the bottom of the market, there will be little by way of price _increases_ for city properties for a year or so.

If my experience in London is a sound model, this should be correct. The dynamics are the same. Flats in the blocks where I'd sold one could be had for about what I sold for, for about 2 1/2 - 3 years [recession of 89-93]. Once the market actually turned upward, the prices rocketed insanely.

My plan is to sell my UK house in the spring. I'd like to get sorted by around this time next year.

So, who's who?
So how about it?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

chrisnation said:


> Steve, I'm only going to get one shot at buying a place in Vlc city. If it goes right, I can hack the rest - broadly covered by making a living and settling in. But if it goes wrong, that's me done for.
> 
> So are you in a position/willing to say who these trustworthy operators are? Three or four would be a fair spread, to avoid accusations of payola and give them all a fighting chance.
> 
> ...


Sorry I havent got back to you about my friends sister, TBH, I think we discussed it at the time when we were having domestic issues and I think the last thing we wanted to talk about was people buying property in Spain. However, Steve is a friend of Graham Hunts, and eventho Steve reckons that property is still falling in Spain (and I tend to agree with him ), the agents think its bottomed out and that now is the time to buy!! (vested interest or fact????)? Who knows who's right - Steve or the estate agents?????? . However, more importantly, if the pound picks up early next year, that will effect dramatically what you will pay, whether they drop in spain or not!!!

But you need to get in touch with all the agents in the area, if only cos you'll find that unlike the UK, agents in Spain have different comission levels and different ways of funding that - some agents load their comission on to the asking price, some do 50/50 and some simply deduct it from a lower asking price and of course, each one may charge a different ammount. So you very often will see the same property on with several different agents and several different prices!!! Hense, I wouldnt begin to liken house buying/selling to anything seen in the UK or London - both systems are poles apart

My point is that its always worth looking round and taking nothing at face value!!

As for poor old Graham hunt, well I dunno where he stands on any of this, he's an agent, I'm sure he's a nice chap and if you like him and trust him, then thats half the battle isnt it!!!! Just look around

Jo


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

Ah! JoJo! 'Twas you, was it? Hope the domestics are back in the sunlit uplands of married life/plumbing/teenage angst/w.h.y.

Although the processes may be poles apart in the buying and selling, the basic dynamics of any city's property market will be the same. And the reason why inner city prices do move in such similar ways is simply that supply is infinitely more restricted in an inner city. The existing stock is pretty much all there is to play with, excluding pulling something down and sticking up something new, as they are about to do with La Mestalla.

You can't just free up another few orange groves [Valencia] or brown-field sites [London/Leeds/Bristol etc] and bung up another 200 houses here and another urbanizasion there.

So I'm very much aware that as soon as the graph turns upward, it will be very steep and go like smoke, in Valencia as anywhere.

No need for sympathy for 'poor old GH'. He's just had a manic 3 weeks with punters from Spain, UK and even eastern Europe - and closed deals. This is either dead-cat bounce or the beginning of the end of the end. I've got my beady minces swinging in all directions.

And look forward to anybody's suggestions for contacts they would trust with their last-chance-saloon capital.

Bring 'em on


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

You also need to remember that the prices in Spain shot up artificially a few years ago because estate agents were charging up to 25% comission on properties and were laughing all the way to the bank - even now some are still trying to charge 5 - 10%, then you have to add another 10% on for the lawyers etc. Cos again unlike the UK, they dont charge a flat rate for cvonveyancing, they take a percentage - So no way can I see any resemblance to prices in UK. If they're rising there it could be due to the poor pound, the ensuing inflation, very limited supply - but at least there, house buying/selling is regulated!

The only slight similarity is that when property prices rise in the UK, it tends to encourage folk to look to buying abroad - in Spain!?? Yes, there are alot of other foriegn buyers over here, but they're not dealing in pounds and I dont believe they're contributing to any kind of rise in spain, afterall most of them are looking for villas and investments. And mortgages are extreemly difficult to obtain in spain, almost impossible if you're a foriegner and that affects everything

I see the market in spain falling more yet, if only cos the Spanish actually want it to be lower so that their kids can afford to buy, some even blame the Brits for artificially raising it in the past!!??

All that said, I'm a firm believer in if you want something, can afford it, then why wait - go for it!! Property should be seen as a home, not an investment!!!

Jo xxx


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

"All that said, I'm a firm believer in if you want something, can afford it, then why wait - go for it!!"

Exactly! I agree entirely! And I intend to.

But, in another thread, when I quoted GH saying precisely that, I got "but he's an agent - he would say that!" shot back at me! 

Maybe it was "stick it to GH" week.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

chrisnation said:


> "All that said, I'm a firm believer in if you want something, can afford it, then why wait - go for it!!"
> 
> Exactly! I agree entirely! And I intend to.
> 
> ...


No, it was "he is not the only estate agent in Valencia" week!!!!, See what the others have to offer and stop advertising him LOL!! Home or investment, its always worth looking around to make sure you have the best deal!! Heck, thats all I'm trying to say LOL!!!!!! 

Jo xxx


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

jojo said:


> No, it was "he is not the only estate agent in Valencia" week!!!!, See what the others have to offer and stop advertising him LOL!! Home or investment, its always worth looking around to make sure you have the best deal!! Heck, thats all I'm trying to say LOL!!!!!!
> 
> Jo xxx


But JoJo, not for want of asking, but not single suggestion has come down pointing me towards any other agents! 

Not from you, not Steve Hall [though I only asked him this afternoon]. Nobody. Nothing. They are out there. You even know one personally. Others must. Every owner bought from somebody, no?

And the point was that it was _not_ "the only agent ...." thing but that he had said, as you just did, "I'm a firm believer in if you want something, can afford it, then why wait - go for it!!" and got the Mandy Rice-Davis retort! So that's you me 'n him - all agreeing!

I've said it before and I'll say it again - bring 'em on. The more the merrier.

Your time starts ..................... now!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

google "estate agents in Valencia" there are loads! I promise I'll try and get my friends website for you and post it on here, but again, she's simply one of loads. In the meantime have a good look at what they have to offer. I dont think we have any people on the forum who live in Valencia who can recommend. Steve Hall, I believe only knows these people socially or as advertisers??????

Jo xxx


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## XTreme (May 17, 2008)

Why Valencia Chris? It's gonna be full of dumb Brits and land grabs!

Granada is where it's at!


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

jojo said:


> google "estate agents in Valencia" there are loads! I promise I'll try and get my friends website for you and post it on here, but again, she's simply one of loads. In the meantime have a good look at what they have to offer. I dont think we have any people on the forum who live in Valencia who can recommend. Steve Hall, I believe only knows these people socially or as advertisers??????
> 
> Jo xxx


Thanks JoJo. 

But the trick is to rub up against the "dozen or so agents" that someone like Steve Hall reckons are trustworthy. Only personal recommendation will do that. 

If Google or Yell had been around in those days, one might have stuck in "doctors/Holloway" and one of the entries to appear would have been Dr. Crippen! Ditto "projectionist/North Kensington" - result, John Christie!i

I'm sure most agents in Vlc don't deserve the drop but there's heaven and earth between the angels and the devils


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

er...... The companies that used to do this (and you know who they are!!) are no longer in business but YES, 25%!!!!! We were actually were brought over to look at properties Free of charge too - (how kind was that!!!) by a company who said if we gave them a deposit there and then the property would be ours - however, we didnt, cos we're not stupid and my OH looked around and found the same property on the market for 15% less with a couple of independant British agents and 25% a Spanish estate agent!!!

That was what encouraged the stupid price hikes in Spain at the beginning of the 90s, crazy, greedy estate agents who simply told the sellers what they would get and then loaded that selling price as much as they could get away with!! Everyone was happy, the seller got what he wanted, the buyer got a property in the sun and the estate agent got rich!!! - until the crunch!!!

Jo xxx


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

..... and yes the weak pound is a major factor in the killing of property prices here, well for those buying from sterling! I watch the money market closely and altho the changes appear small, they make one heck of a difference. When we moved here it was 1.30€ to 1 pound, so its more or less dropped by 30% thats alot of money on 100,000 pounds! So then turn that around the other way and those selling in Spain and returning to the UK can afford to drop their prices and alot are desperate - that means the trend is going to be downwards, however, as you say it does seem to be trying to creep up a bit. All we need is for mortgages to become a little easier to obtain and there could be a stop in the downturn!!??? and that donesnt take into account the squillions of empty, half built properties, apartments, urbanizations, villas, townhouses still here and the ones that are still being built - supply and demand comes into effect!??

Jo xxxx


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

..... oh dear, looks like I'm on a role - BTW Graham I've nothing against you at all! I've not met you, but Steve says you're a nice guy and you always sound nice!! I dont know what you're business dealings are like but I've no reason to suspect you're anything but ethical!! You've got a family to support and a living to make so good on you. All I've ever said is look around at all the agents in the area - an informed choice is a good choice!!!!!

I'll shut up now LOL

Jo xxx


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## SteveHall (Oct 17, 2008)

snip/

Graham lives just outside Valencia, speaks fluent Spanish, has brought up family there and goes 1000% further than most agents I know. I respect his opinions on house prices and most things re Valencia city and immediate but I still maintain that in the Costa Blanca that prices are continuing to fall. Remember that the Costa Blanca is IN the Valencia province but where I am just now (Orihuela Costa) we are 2 hours plus away from the city and four hours plus away from the Catalan border. In any case, we are only talking OPINIONS and one of my strongest-felt opinions is that you can get either totally stripped in the current crisis market or pick up a real bargain. 

If I were buying in Valencia or its immediate area he is the first I would turn to - he has written extensively about buying in Spain/expatshire/Valencia and that alone would set him apart from 100s of agents who have no real knowledge of the area, don't speak Spanish and whose claim to being an agent is a self-duplicating web-site, two mobiles and two filofaxes. That does not mean I'd buy from him - only that he'd be on my list. Surely, that is all an agent can expect?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

SteveHall said:


> If I were buying in Valencia or its immediate area he is the first I would turn to - he has written extensively about buying in Spain/expatshire/Valencia and that alone would set him apart from 100s of agents who have no real knowledge of the area, don't speak Spanish and whose claim to being an agent is a self-duplicating web-site, two mobiles and two filofaxes. That does not mean I'd buy from him - only that he'd be on my list. Surely, that is all an agent can expect?




Just like all of us expats on here, you're opinions are simply that!, but please have respect for those that you dont know about or have bought properties from. There are, I'm sure many other good estate agents in Valencia who simply havent written extensively about the area, that doesnt mean they're no good or that the dont know their stuff!!!

Jo xxx


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## grahunt (Jan 22, 2009)

*Hi Again Peeps*

Thanks for the kind words Steve. And there was i thinking I had turned you into a buyer by showing you Santa Barbara and the yummy mummies. 

Jojo. The biggest commission i ever heard was the now defunct Trampolin Hills as they were offering 18%. Ridiculous. I went to see the development in its early stages with the idea of offering 15% discount to buyers payable on commission payment because I charge 3% (always have done). However, when I asked for all of the permits etc they sort of turned white and said they would have them next week. I told them that when they get them they should get back to me. I am still waiting of course as is everybody else.

I have never done inspection trips because as you suggest they are total rip offs and i couldn't even contenance charging someone that sort of commission even when they didn't know they were paying it (This is probably why i am not rich). However the properties you saw on inspection trips generally were not available at lower prices. The builder set the price and set the commission, generally 15% which again is outrageous. This allowed companies to offer free inspection trips because after filtering out people who wouldn't buy their sale rate was around 33-50%. ie up to 1 in 2 bought!!!

I think one of the things Steve said is quite important. He is looking at further price falls in places like Orihuela. I won't argue with that because anecdotally all I see is everything for sale and in that situation the most desperate seller sets the price. Also there are thousands of similar properties for sale. However as a caveat I don't know the area. 

I am based around and in Valencia the third biggest city in Spain of course. It is not second home city or expatshire and therefore over 90% of the market is Spanish. The Spanish are returning to the market. Look at Google trends for terms such as "Pisos Baratos" etc... to find that out. Searches are hugely up. You could say that is no sign of increased activity but when you ally that to searches such as "hipotecas" and then talk to the employees of banks you deal with (Or rather I deal with here) you can see a huge upturn in mortgage applications and offers being made on properties. Of the 4 sales I have made in the past two weeks three have been to Spanish people. That is more sales than I made last year!!


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I'm closing this thread because it seems to becomoning too biased. Too much opportunistic "back scratching" going on!


Jo xxx


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