# Card Fraud risk?!!



## NewAndConfused (Jul 22, 2013)

Hi everyone, 

I tried to look for a thread about card frauds in the forum but couldn't find one. 
I'm in Dubai at the moment for a visit before moving definitely end of April. I'm with hsbc uk bank for my debit card . I noticed that in restaurants, waiters take the card leave WITH the card and disappear for at least 5 min before coming back w the machine. At first , I had doubts until tonight at bateel restaurant at DIFC where my husband showed his card and the guy took it to go to the counter to get the machine. I was just telling my husband that the same has happened to me at lunch time at the same place and that I find it very strange , when I noticed a very strange behaviour from the waiter , his manager at the counter and another waiter . they seemed doing something behind the counter with the card and seemed very agitated when I looked and was fixed at them from our table . I then walked towards them asking for the card and a fourth waiter came towards me to apologise saying that his colleague will be coming back soon. I didn't say anything further after that as my husband thought I was exaggerating until we came back and googled it... Did you noticed anything like this? Do you leave your card to the waiters to take it w him?? I'm very concerned now and want to call our bank to stop our cards , both are debit C.. Thank you


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## DubaiTom (Nov 3, 2010)

Normal procedure here, never had any issues in the past 3 1/2 years. If you are scared they might copy your card just ask them to bring the reader to the table. Should be no problem.


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## Budw (Oct 14, 2013)

NewAndConfused said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I tried to look for a thread about card frauds in the forum but couldn't find one.
> I'm in Dubai at the moment for a visit before moving definitely end of April. I'm with hsbc uk bank for my debit card . I noticed that in restaurants, waiters take the card leave WITH the card and disappear for at least 5 min before coming back w the machine. At first , I had doubts until tonight at bateel restaurant at DIFC where my husband showed his card and the guy took it to go to the counter to get the machine. I was just telling my husband that the same has happened to me at lunch time at the same place and that I find it very strange , when I noticed a very strange behaviour from the waiter , his manager at the counter and another waiter . they seemed doing something behind the counter with the card and seemed very agitated when I looked and was fixed at them from our table . I then walked towards them asking for the card and a fourth waiter came towards me to apologise saying that his colleague will be coming back soon. I didn't say anything further after that as my husband thought I was exaggerating until we came back and googled it... Did you noticed anything like this? Do you leave your card to the waiters to take it w him?? I'm very concerned now and want to call our bank to stop our cards , both are debit C.. Thank you



If this at all was fraud, I think they cannot do much with debit card details; its pin protected, and the 16 digits account number typically cannot be used for purchases. HSBC debit card has also the chip, so they are relative safe. But, I know that "credit cards" are very sensitive for this type of fraud; never loose the card out of your eyes. They could copy the card including the security number and do online purchases.


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## PolarBear (Jul 12, 2010)

*Fraud*

Most likely you are fine.. but I will say I never had as much fraudulent activity on my cards as when I lived in Dubai. Fortunately the banks have such good fraud detection that they called me before I even noticed. Your best bet is to use a credit card (not debit) so that your account isn't deducted if you do happen to run into fraud.

In this case though, it's unlikely that so many people would be involved in fraud so I think you're okay.


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## rsinner (Feb 3, 2009)

Its usual practice in Dubai. In a lot of countries people would freak out if the card is taken away from sight, but this is done almost always here.
Agree that it is unsafe (but less so with the newer chip cards).


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

Hi,
It also depends on whether the card in UK or UAE issued - local banks tend to text customers when card is used - so it is easier to check amount (in case waiter adds big tip to bill) or if extra transactions occur.
Overseas cards would be more risky - because of automatic authorisation limits and the delay between transaction occuring and it showing up on your account or being detected by the bank's anti-fraud software.
Cheers
Steve


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## NewAndConfused (Jul 22, 2013)

Thank you everyone, relieved now because it's a common practice but yes I will always ask to get the reader to the table, I guess it's safer . I don't have personal credit card, only the company one which I rarely use. Thank you again.. And btw I'm so pleased w my short trip, this was my first time in Dubai before the April move and I loved it.


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## BedouGirl (Sep 15, 2011)

I really like the text system we have here and it works when we travel too. It surprises me that it's not available globally.


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## Chocoholic (Oct 29, 2012)

Just because it's PIN protected and a debit card means nothing! Most debit cards are used as ATM cash withdrawl cards as well. I've had several cards skimmed here. I've been sat at a bar and suddenyl started receiving sms's from my bank about cash withdrawls in Cyprus! Cleaned my account out, in 3 minutes flat!

Also had my credit card used to by flights! Please don't say it doesn't happen - it does and frequently.

We get used to people wandering off with our cards to run transactions through. If they have a remote machine, they should bring it to you - no exceptions.


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## Mr Rossi (May 16, 2009)

This is the country where companies keep photocopies of your card on file and use that in lieu of direct debit. 

The waiter going off with your card is the least of anyone's worries.


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## arabianhorse (Nov 13, 2013)

One to insert the card, another to enter the Bill amount and the third to print the receipt.
It's a security feature. No one person can do all 3. 
Only an accountant would know that. We are good at math and fraud prevention unlike Pamela and some other wannabes on here.


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## Malbec (Jan 2, 2014)

I have also not had any issues after many visits to Dubai whenever my card disappeared. In case OP would decide to travel to Singapore, it is the same practice here.

I understand OP concerns though coming from UK... On my last 3-day business trip to London I just let my card disappear once, it was copied and used for internet transactions later on.


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## arabianhorse (Nov 13, 2013)

Malbec said:


> I have also not had any issues after many visits to Dubai whenever my card disappeared. In case OP would decide to travel to Singapore, it is the same practice here.
> 
> I understand OP concerns though coming from UK... On my last 3-day business trip to London I just let my card disappear once, it was copied and used for internet transactions later on.


You can't trust the British. They sent all their crooks to Oz in the 19 th century. It's not allowed anymore, so they are all sent to Dubai!


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## xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxStewartC (Mar 3, 2012)

I have had two cases of my local HSBC card being used fraudulently (in two years). On both occasions, I received a text that a sum had been charged, so I immediately called the bank who cancelled the charges and the cards. They delivered a new card on the next working day. One of the things that work better here than at home.


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## Budw (Oct 14, 2013)

Chocoholic said:


> Just because it's PIN protected and a debit card means nothing! Most debit cards are used as ATM cash withdrawl cards as well. I've had several cards skimmed here. I've been sat at a bar and suddenyl started receiving sms's from my bank about cash withdrawls in Cyprus! Cleaned my account out, in 3 minutes flat!
> 
> Also had my credit card used to by flights! Please don't say it doesn't happen - it does and frequently.
> 
> We get used to people wandering off with our cards to run transactions through. If they have a remote machine, they should bring it to you - no exceptions.


I am a bit surprised you say you have several cards skimmed here. I actually thought skimming was not such wide spread problem here. Do you know if the skimming happened in the bar that time? I assume you talk about skimming of your debit card, correct? Because if it was your was a credit-card, there may not have been card skimming; your name, the account number, and security code copied from the back onto a piece of paper are enough to make transactions online by a fraudulent person.

We never had issues with our debit cards here. Both myself and my wife use HSBC debit card for all possible transactions, never pay cash if we can. That means for us 1000's of transactions a year... and not a single problem we faced.


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## saraswat (Apr 28, 2012)

Another rather nice security measure that the banks employ here is to do with online purchases. Whenever I've had a large/out of the norm transaction posted, there is an immediate call from the bank verifying the amount of the transaction and if I did in fact mean to process it. 

p.s: it usually is for the larger ticket items ...


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## BedouGirl (Sep 15, 2011)

saraswat said:


> Another rather nice security measure that the banks employ here is to do with online purchases. Whenever I've had a large/out of the norm transaction posted, there is an immediate call from the bank verifying the amount of the transaction and if I did in fact mean to process it. p.s: it usually is for the larger ticket items ...


I have a special password I have to use when I make on line purchases. I also have the card you are supposed to use but I haven't used it.


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## twowheelsgood (Feb 21, 2013)

Malbec said:


> I understand OP concerns though coming from UK... On my last 3-day business trip to London I just let my card disappear once, it was copied and used for internet transactions later on.


Unfortunately what folks forget is that one event does not make a trend. I was in London for the last 48 hours, used my CC about four or five times and nothing bad happened. So what does that suggest about your experience ?

Everyone has a bad story, but in the volume of transactions, they are utterly meaningless and do not signify a trend of any description. Yes its clearly a good idea to keep your card in sight but posts like your suggesting that because it happened to you once, that its somehow going to happen to others is fatuous at best (no offence intended)

I really wish folks wouldn't troll out their fairy stories and try and suggest that they are anything but that. Look up correlation and causation for starters .....


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## londonmandan (Jul 23, 2013)

If it happens it happens if it doesn't it doesn't, no point in worrying about it really.


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## Malbec (Jan 2, 2014)

twowheelsgood said:


> Unfortunately what folks forget is that one event does not make a trend. I was in London for the last 48 hours, used my CC about four or five times and nothing bad happened. So what does that suggest about your experience ?
> 
> Everyone has a bad story, but in the volume of transactions, they are utterly meaningless and do not signify a trend of any description. Yes its clearly a good idea to keep your card in sight but posts like your suggesting that because it happened to you once, that its somehow going to happen to others is fatuous at best (no offence intended)
> 
> I really wish folks wouldn't troll out their fairy stories and try and suggest that they are anything but that. Look up correlation and causation for starters .....


What I meant is that based on my experience in UK I will NEVER let my card disappear again in UK, period. If that would happen to me in UAE, Singapore or elsewhere, I would simply stop trusting establishments in these countries as well and demand using payment terminal in front of my eyes.

Also whoever did it in UK was not the smartest person, he paid utility bill on thameswater.co.uk and.... paid through internet for tickets to London zoo :crazy: I think that criminals in UK are in a desparate need of some training 

Anyway, my suggestion to all concerned is to simply withdraw from ATM and pay cash wherever possible. I do that most of the while overseas and have no issues.


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