# Question for residents of La Paz and BCS



## guittarzzan (Apr 13, 2017)

Hi,

Please only answer this if you live, have lived or have some other credible insight into crime and violent crime in the La Paz area.
For those of you who live or have lived in La Paz for at least 6 months or more, what are your thoughts on burglaries, robberies, violent assaults and murders in the area?
Do you feel safe in your day to day lives going into town?
Do you feel that violent crimes and murders are getting worse, staying the same or improving in the La Paz area? 
From what you see in the area, do you feel that La Paz will be a safe place for a family to live 5 years from now?

It's very hard to get accurate and detailed info on crime in Mexico so I'm very interested in hearing from those of you who live in the La Paz area and describe your experience with first hand knowledge.

thank you very much,
Steve


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## guittarzzan (Apr 13, 2017)

Yikes! Are there no expats in La Paz? I don't want to be the only ****** in town.
Anyone?


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

guittarzzan said:


> Yikes! Are there no expats in La Paz? I don't want to be the only ****** in town.
> Anyone?


There are expats there. I know at least one who runs a sail shop. La Paz is a popular stopping point for sail boats going north or south. There is a club house (Crucero Club) in the Marina at the left end of the malecon where people from the boats hang out in the morning. I am sure there are lots of other North-of-the-border types in town, but maybe none of them are reading the forum now.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

Try bajanomad.com They have a forum there. Warning- they are a bit of a strange bunch on that forum- lots of personal sniping and sarcasm, but you will definitely get a lot of replies to your questions.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

surabi said:


> Try bajanomad.com They have a forum there. Warning- they are a bit of a strange bunch on that forum- lots of personal sniping and sarcasm, but you will definitely get a lot of replies to your questions.


I wonder why they're so unpleasant. It doesn't sound like a bunch of people I would want to hang out with, even on line!


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

guittarzzan you wrote:

" Please only answer this if you live, have lived or have some other credible insight into crime and violent crime in the La Paz area."

So your are surprised you did not get responses...


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## guittarzzan (Apr 13, 2017)

chicois8 said:


> guittarzzan you wrote:
> 
> " Please only answer this if you live, have lived or have some other credible insight into crime and violent crime in the La Paz area."
> 
> So your are surprised you did not get responses...



Well, yes actually. With a population of well over 300k, I thought there would be more people here who live in that area, but maybe not or maybe they're just away from the forum.

Are you offended that I only wanted information from people who actually have first hand knowledge/experience of the subject from living there? Trying to narrow it down to La Paz because baja is a big place and I didn't want to get feedback from people living in Tijuana etc because it's not that relevant to the info I was asking for. Seems reasonable to me.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

Guitarzzan, I think your request was perfectly reasonable. However, among the regular posters here I don't think anyone lives in La Paz so I doubt you will get any useful responses. Most (but not all) of us live inland so we have no 1st hand experience with safety specifically in La Paz.

On the other hand, you never know when a new poster who does live in La Paz will show up and chime in with exactly the info being sought, so no harm in asking!


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## guittarzzan (Apr 13, 2017)

circle110 said:


> Guitarzzan, I think your request was perfectly reasonable. However, among the regular posters here I don't think anyone lives in La Paz so I doubt you will get any useful responses. Most (but not all) of us live inland so we have no 1st hand experience with safety specifically in La Paz.
> 
> On the other hand, you never know when a new poster who does live in La Paz will show up and chime in with exactly the info being sought, so no harm in asking!


No worries. I'm new here and don't know where any of you live so I thought I'd just put it out there and see if anyone from LP chimed in. 

thx


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

The bulk of expats, as well as the bulk of Mexicans, tend to live in the areas around the major cities with more livable climates and agriculture. The coastal areas and desert regions were not heavily populated and are more recently developed; sort of like Florida after the advent of air conditioning and mosquito control. Of course, there are a few old fishing ports and commercial shipping ports on the coasts, with populations that have adapted to the hot and humid climes. Baja California is a strange and different world to most of us, and is even somewhat remote in its government and history. As such, most of us know little of it and many think of it as a touristy extension of ........well; you know. It is really not very connected to the rest of Mexico. That said, I find La Paz interesting, as I am an old blue-water sailor, but too old to go and investigate....or I would.


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## surabi (Jan 1, 2017)

Isla Verde said:


> I wonder why they're so unpleasant. It doesn't sound like a bunch of people I would want to hang out with, even on line!


Seems like the demographic of ex-pats there, while this is a generalization, as I'm sure they're not all like that, is much more "*******" than those on the mainland. Lots of fishin' and 4x4ing. Plus I get the impression a lot of them are just bored.


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## gringotim (Jan 5, 2011)

guittarzzan said:


> .... I thought there would be more people here who live in that area, but maybe not or maybe they're just away from the forum..


I bet a lack of replies is more because most expats don't look at this or any other "expat forum", and also, depending on where they live, if there is a high crime rate, they don't want to complain about it because then everyone might ask, "then why do you still there when theres so many other places in Mexico to live?


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

Some news articles from the last 14 months:

Borderland Beat: Search results for bcs 2016 crime


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## frogwash (Jun 9, 2017)

*Wow...*

chicois8... Quite a link to what appears to be a long drawn out battle on BCS. Ruthless. We visited LA Paz a few years ago but also did research before we went. That whole area had not yet been infected by these cartels. It was one of the safest places in Mexico to visit. My daughter was working on a cruise ship out of La Paz (very small cruise ship... ~180 footer) and traveled up ino the Sea of Cortez. She never saw or heard anything like what you read in that article. Loreto?? Really!? It's a real shame. Was a real fun area to visit at that time... And even Los Cabos? We were down there 2 times earlier this year too. Looks like that article answers the original question of safety in BCS.


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## guittarzzan (Apr 13, 2017)

frogwash said:


> chicois8... Quite a link to what appears to be a long drawn out battle on BCS. Ruthless. We visited LA Paz a few years ago but also did research before we went. That whole area had not yet been infected by these cartels. It was one of the safest places in Mexico to visit. My daughter was working on a cruise ship out of La Paz (very small cruise ship... ~180 footer) and traveled up ino the Sea of Cortez. She never saw or heard anything like what you read in that article. Loreto?? Really!? It's a real shame. Was a real fun area to visit at that time... And even Los Cabos? We were down there 2 times earlier this year too. Looks like that article answers the original question of safety in BCS.


Yes, La Paz checks almost every box that is on my list for retirement....except for safety. I would very much like to build the house of my dreams looking over the Sea of Cortez and make La Paz my home in 5 years when I retire, but unless the government/police are able to get the enormous problem of the cartels and all of the many criminal side effects that come with them under control, I don't think I can take that gamble. It's a real shame because the natural beauty is amazing and the Mexican people are great in general.
My girlfriend is a court reporter and last week, she did a deposition with two Mexicans who said that they have to be very secretive in Mexico about working in the US because if members of some of the cartels find out, they will extort money from their families back home. Apparently, the cartel members know that the family in Mexico is receiving some money from their relative working in the states and so they are often targeted. I've never heard of this happening before, but it's pretty tragic because we know that they aren't making a lot of money up here to begin with and after living expenses, probably aren't able to send a lot back home. If we could just get people in the US and Canada to stop using drugs, maybe the cartels would just go away...or maybe that's just naive of me. Just makes me sad to think that so much natural beauty exists in a place that is ruined by gangs, drugs and violence. Maybe by the time I retire it will be better. Will see.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

You have a good attitude guitarzzan and I hope you find you dream spot, but your drug-free hope is indeed naive. Humans have been using mind altering substances for hundreds of thousands of years so rest assured our species won't change that behavior in the next 5. What is relatively new is the criminalization aspect, which is what creates the huge profit potential.

Legalization would be literally an overnight fix and could theoretically happen in the next 5 years but the US illegal drug industry is so entrenched and has bought off the political system to such a level that hoping for that resolution is equally naive.

Really, the damage is already done no matter what changes are made regarding drugs and laws. There are now many thousands of people who earn their living off the drug trade. If the cartels went away tomorrow for whatever reason, those thousands of now unemployed armed folks are not going to go get a job bagging groceries at La Comercial. They will start their own mini crime groups to do burglary, hold-ups, kidnapping and car jackings. This is already happening in many places across the country. 

Nope, no matter what happens to the cartels, it will be some time before things become truly tranquil nationwide in Mexico.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

circle110 said:


> You have a good attitude guitarzzan and I hope you find you dream spot, but your drug-free hope is indeed naive. Humans have been using mind altering substances for hundreds of thousands of years so rest assured our species won't change that behavior in the next 5. What is relatively new is the criminalization aspect, which is what creates the huge profit potential.
> 
> Legalization would be literally an overnight fix and could theoretically happen in the next 5 years but the US illegal drug industry is so entrenched and has bought off the political system to such a level that hoping for that resolution is equally naive.
> 
> ...


We live near a somewhat affluent Mexican city. As I understand it at some point - before we got here - the drug king-pins had their tranquil 'weekend' places here. They kept the peace. Then there was a crack-down on the king-pins and they were removed - only to be replaced by their 'lieutenants' and such (a lower class of people) who have been fighting for turf ever since. Many wish for the old days.


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## frogwash (Jun 9, 2017)

horseshoe846 said:


> We live near a somewhat affluent Mexican city. As I understand it at some point - before we got here - the drug king-pins had their tranquil 'weekend' places here. They kept the peace. Then there was a crack-down on the king-pins and they were removed - only to be replaced by their 'lieutenants' and such (a lower class of people) who have been fighting for turf ever since. Many wish for the old days.


That is very similar to what we understood at that time, Jan. 2014. That was before the crackdown obviously. It really is a shame because La Paz has great restaurants, people, shopping and bars. We lived in Seattle for 29 years and La Paz had what I thought was even better seafood. Maybe is was the Mexican influence in ingredients. Or... maybe it was the margaritas.... Another place that I really do like but pretty remote is Todo Santos. It is on the Pacific side but still small and quaint. Been there a couple times and love it. I have been kicking around the idea of moving to Mexico for the last few years... difficult to get my wife on board. She loves Mexico also but not ready to pull the plug here in the U.S like I am. We usually go to the Gulf side... Riviera Maya, Tulum, Akumal, Cozumel. That's where I would go if I ever get the opportunity to re-locate in Mexico. Gotta love that water! We have been to Mexico many times up and down the west coast and many times in the Yucatan Peninsula. We by far love that side over the Pacific Coast.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

horseshoe846 said:


> We live near a somewhat affluent Mexican city. As I understand it at some point - before we got here - the drug king-pins had their tranquil 'weekend' places here. They kept the peace. Then there was a crack-down on the king-pins and they were removed - only to be replaced by their 'lieutenants' and such (a lower class of people) who have been fighting for turf ever since. Many wish for the old days.


Yes, exactly! You can't just eliminate something that grew naturally over a long period and expect the result to not have its problems too. 
It reminds me of kudzu in the US -- erosion is bad so let's eliminate it by putting in kudzu to stop it. Ooops.

The solution to the drugs/cartels/crime is not going to be something simple and it won't happen in any hurry. If/when it ever goes away it will happen over time and be for some set of socio-economic reasons, not due to an externally forced removal.


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## Chinnistangl (Jul 21, 2016)

Like any city, you have to be knowledgeable about your physical environment. We lived in la Paz for six months, from 9/2016 to 5/2017. It is an amazing place, if you choose the right location. We started out in El Centenario in a beautiful house but unfortunately we were broken into three times and lost over $6,000. This happened because the owner of the house had neither exterior nor interior security. Unfortunately, in any third world country where there is such a discrepancy between the "haves" & the "have-nots" you need to have a large exterior wall or impenetrable fence so you are not exposed to the roving eye. Petty theft is very common wether right in the city or outside in a more remote area like El Centenario. So, we moved right into the city, two blocks from the Malecon and had just the most amazing time. The restaurants are fantastic. There is an organic market every Tuesday and Saturday to die for. People are honest and friendly. There is live entertainment all over the city that is second to none. We were fortunate to live across the street from the La Morante Bar and they have exceptional entertainment like the Grammy award winner Terry Towson who plays a mean trumpet, Damiana Conte whose voice will blow you away, Daniel Sosa whose musical compositions of of BB King; and then for some home entertainment you can get Sergio, who sings beautiful songs in English and Spanish in your backyard if you choose, for a mere 500 pesos! 
The staff at la Morante are so amazing, you will fall in love with them. The owner Alejandra is a beautiful person. She only speaks Spanish but loves to communicate in the universal language of big hugs everytime you go there. 
We were walking distance from some of the best restaurants in the North Americas. And, of course, the Malecon is a great place to walk around at anytime time of the day to experience the great Mexican culture and family life. And, don't forget to have the ice cream!

We loved walking around this city, day time or night time but, as I said, you have to be smart as to where you go.... like any city any where in the world, New York, Toronto, Chicago, Los Angeles, etc. 
The Sea of Cortez is the most beautiful body of water with its extensive sea life. Snorkling will blow your mind; swimming next to the majestic Whale Sharks, watching the playful behavior of the Sea Lions, the bobbing head of sea turtles, the mind boggling air dance of the mantra rays and of course the spotting of the hump back whale! Balanda Beach is something to behold; warm, shallow crystal clear waters surrounded by mountains. This experience is spectacular in itself. There are many beaches to explore; some accessible by land and others by boat.
So, to your original question about crime, just be smart! AND, don't spend too much time in Cabo!
Just as an aside, Todos Santos is fine to visit bit not live if you like having a real life. I lived there for three months and that is about as long as I could stand the sleepy little tourist trap. Very expensive and not much to do. Ciao.


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## Chinnistangl (Jul 21, 2016)

Forgot to mention it in my earlier post, the only reason we left La Paz is because my husband has a business op in Guadalajara. Which, so far seems like an amazing city!


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## FoxIslander (Jun 10, 2014)

I also love La Paz and for a time considered it a possible future home. I have visited 3 times. La Paz attracts sailors from all over the world. Bahia Balandra is stunningly beautiful...truly where the desert meets the sea. The security situation has forced me to remove La Paz from my list of possible locations to live. Such a shame, it truly is a beautiful place.


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## Johnbott (Oct 20, 2012)

*La Paz is a truly amazing place*

We have lived here for just over 4 years, moving from San Francisco, CA. I have to say that La Paz is a wonderful and amazing place to live. We live in el Centro just off of the malecon in the center of the city. We are surrounded by great restaurants, shops and services. There is really nothing that we need that we cannot get. The people are incredibly friendly and helpful. From the amazing beaches, water activity to the tranquility of the desert.
So agreeing with the post of Chinnistang, you have to be aware of your surroundings and be smart. 
Yes there is some cartel activity, but unless you are apart of their activity, you most likely will not be in any danger. Most of their activity is kept to themselves and those involved in drugs and distribution. 
You might have to think out of the box sometimes, but moving here was not a difficult.
We feel that it is not for everybody, but it works for us and we couldn't be happier.


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