# Continue Renting or Buy?



## kodel (Jul 15, 2014)

Hi,

We are currently renting and have recently completed on the sale of our UK House. Now the original plan was to find a property we could afford to buy outright and have no mortgage, But as we have changed area's and its a bit more expensive, we are thinking of using our funds to invest (either here or back in the UK) to create further income to pay our rental expenses which enable us to live where ever. As a couple with no dependencies (Kids All grown up) and we are not yet at retirement age, we still need an income to live off, no pensions just yet. We both work online so can be anywhere, which is why we were able to moved out here in the first place.

So my question is really, would you rather have a lump sum of money you can use start a business or invest in property to create an income or buy a property out right (albeit probably not in your ideal area due to cost).??

Who is renting long term rather than buying outright?

Love to hear your thoughts / stories on this.

Thanks.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

kodel said:


> Hi,
> 
> We are currently renting and have recently completed on the sale of our UK House. Now the original plan was to find a property we could afford to buy outright and have no mortgage, But as we have changed area's and its a bit more expensive, we are thinking of using our funds to invest (either here or back in the UK) to create further income to pay our rental expenses which enable us to live where ever. As a couple with no dependencies (Kids All grown up) and we are not yet at retirement age, we still need an income to live off, no pensions just yet. We both work online so can be anywhere, which is why we were able to moved out here in the first place.
> 
> ...


We left the UK in 2005 and lived in Prague until 2008 when we moved to Andalucia. We sold business premises, rental properties and the house we lived in and moved all our furniture and other goods and chattels with us. We rented in Prague and rent here. We had a large house and gardens with inground covered pool in Prague and rent a similar house with pool and also large garden/field here. When we first moved here we lived in a flat for four months and hated it and the neighbourhood. So we moved....no hassle.
We have lived in the same property since early 2009 and intend to stay here for a few more years. We'll then probably move into a nearby smaller house my son and wife own but don't use much. We invested the proceeds of the property sales and hope to spend as much as we can before we die - anything left goes to Dogs Trust as son and dil don't need our money, they work in the City.
The sense of freedom is wonderful. Our landlord is very good, no worries about repairs, he lives in Austria and visits occasionally to check everything is OK. He usually takes me out to lunch or dinner. We have great neighbours and feel part of our local community. 
People will say that renting means handing over money to a landlord. Well, yes, but you get something in return. It doesn't seem to occur to some people that if they buy as most do via a mortgage they are handing over more than the price of the property in interest.
If you do as we did in the UK, buy cash, there's the issue of market value. If the UK votes Out next week property prices here could drop even lower, so will sterling which could affect your income.
We live mainly off my sterling income but f the £ does drop the investment portfolio will help if we need more cash to enjoy our lifestyle. No way would we even consider starting a business here in Spain. We came to relax and enjoy life..
We've had properties all our lives, have been landlords in Canada and the UK. Not having property is like having a weight taken away.
But that's our story. Others will have different views.
When we first moved here we lived in a flat for four months and hated it and the neighbourhood. So we moved....no hassle.


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## The Skipper (Nov 26, 2014)

kodel said:


> Hi,
> 
> We are currently renting and have recently completed on the sale of our UK House. Now the original plan was to find a property we could afford to buy outright and have no mortgage, But as we have changed area's and its a bit more expensive, we are thinking of using our funds to invest (either here or back in the UK) to create further income to pay our rental expenses which enable us to live where ever. As a couple with no dependencies (Kids All grown up) and we are not yet at retirement age, we still need an income to live off, no pensions just yet. We both work online so can be anywhere, which is why we were able to moved out here in the first place.
> 
> ...


In the current world market I think you will struggle to find any "safe" investment that will give you a good enough income to pay the rent on a house and cash to live on. Some bonds are now offering negative returns and stock markets around the world are in turmoil. If I were in your shoes I wouldn't make any big decisions until well after the Brexit vote. If the UK votes to leave both the pound and euro will crash against other currencies but the pound will quickly recover. Several forecasts I have read from currency experts predict €1.50 to the pound by the year-end. If the UK votes to stay in the EU the pound will soar rapidly to €1.40. That's the time to transfer your money to Spain and buy a house here, while the prices are still low (and don't forget that in this buyer's market you can negotiate a huge discount on asking prices, especially if you are offering a quick sale for cash).


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## CharlieMCFC (Jan 27, 2016)

I too rent long term. May I ask - if something breaks in your house, for example the hot water system, 1) who organises the repair and 2) who pays for it? In my case, it's me, and that's making me think that buying might be a better option, since I have all the repair hassle and costs anyway.


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

mrypg9 said:


> We left the UK in 2005 and lived in Prague until 2008 when we moved to Andalucia. We sold business premises, rental properties and the house we lived in and moved all our furniture and other goods and chattels with us. We rented in Prague and rent here. We had a large house and gardens with inground covered pool in Prague and rent a similar house with pool and also large garden/field here. When we first moved here we lived in a flat for four months and hated it and the neighbourhood. So we moved....no hassle.
> We have lived in the same property since early 2009 and intend to stay here for a few more years. We'll then probably move into a nearby smaller house my son and wife own but don't use much. We invested the proceeds of the property sales and hope to spend as much as we can before we die - anything left goes to Dogs Trust as son and dil don't need our money, they work in the City.
> The sense of freedom is wonderful. Our landlord is very good, no worries about repairs, he lives in Austria and visits occasionally to check everything is OK. He usually takes me out to lunch or dinner. We have great neighbours and feel part of our local community.
> People will say that renting means handing over money to a landlord. Well, yes, but you get something in return. It doesn't seem to occur to some people that if they buy as most do via a mortgage they are handing over more than the price of the property in interest.
> ...


That was an interesting post Mary. Our intention is to spend a month in Spain from the 27th in 10 days and was looking at buying during that time as we've visited a lot an done our homework. Then looking at the brexit thing (I'm a remain voter) I'm starting to think this could go the wrong way and we could be out, so I thought £ plummets and property will become so much more expensive. But you think the price of property will also fall in Spain if we brexit, now that is interesting. I had started to look at long term rentals as if the £ does drop we would rent and maybe consider buying if things improve. I know obviously the cost of living will be greater but who knows if property falls in price not really a big problem. Anyway what ever happens we're moving, we've seen so little sun here i had to take a pic when it came out ( see avatar) and we have done so much research and visiting there is no way brexit will ruin our plans especially as I am now one week into early retirement. You do make the renting sound attractive and if we did go down that road we wouldn't be bothered either way buy or rent.


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## Justina (Jan 25, 2013)

*Renting*



CharlieMCFC said:


> I too rent long term. May I ask - if something breaks in your house, for example the hot water system, 1) who organises the repair and 2) who pays for it? In my case, it's me, and that's making me think that buying might be a better option, since I have all the repair hassle and costs anyway.


I find that odd although it could be the contract that you signed.
I have rented three places and so far any probs have been solved by the owners and very quickly.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

kodel said:


> Hi,
> 
> We are currently renting and have recently completed on the sale of our UK House. Now the original plan was to find a property we could afford to buy outright and have no mortgage, But as we have changed area's and its a bit more expensive, we are thinking of using our funds to invest (either here or back in the UK) to create further income to pay our rental expenses which enable us to live where ever. As a couple with no dependencies (Kids All grown up) and we are not yet at retirement age, we still need an income to live off, no pensions just yet. We both work online so can be anywhere, which is why we were able to moved out here in the first place.
> 
> ...


Our story is a little different, but I'll tell it anyway! Feel free to ignore
In our mid 30's, having got married and having a very young daughter, OH was made redundant, but this was a time when you could negotiate your redundancy package. He managed to get a handsome sum which he used to pay off the house, so we only had a mortgage for a couple of years. 
Personally I think it's one of the best decisions he ever made. Over the years, NOT having that mortgage payment hanging over us has been wonderful. It's given us a lot more freedom making decisions and has allowed us to have brief periods without work without stressing over the dreaded monthly payment.
We did know the area we had bought the house in well previously however, and had already lived in the property for a while before paying off the mortgage. I mean we were sure that this was the house we wanted to buy.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

We have done well out of the property market and I would be uncomfortable not having a base somewhere, even if it were rented out. We rented our house whilst in Singapore for 3 years and not only did the rental pay our mortgage it built up a nice little sum. Then the fact that property price increase had added 25% in value. 

My problem with renting is security. Ok there are laws to protect the tenant but there are other factors. The owner could decide to sell, die etc. I have a friend who has rented in Spain for the past 5 years and she prefers it as there are no maintenance costs for repairs or IBI to pay. The rent she has paid is lower than the money she would have lost on the property crash. There is no quick exit in Spain if you have to sell.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

kodel said:


> Hi,
> 
> We are currently renting and have recently completed on the sale of our UK House. Now the original plan was to find a property we could afford to buy outright and have no mortgage, But as we have changed area's and its a bit more expensive, we are thinking of using our funds to invest (either here or back in the UK) to create further income to pay our rental expenses which enable us to live where ever. As a couple with no dependencies (Kids All grown up) and we are not yet at retirement age, we still need an income to live off, no pensions just yet. We both work online so can be anywhere, which is why we were able to moved out here in the first place.
> 
> ...


If you don't mind me asking - where in Spain are you currently renting but would consider buying ? 
As the choice of whether to continue renting or taking the plunge and buying your own property in Spain.
Could be easily summed by whether your currently living in a 'sort after area' in Spain, particularly ones which
are attractive to fellow Expats.

Of course all areas of Spain were hit by the property prices crash of 2008 but the tourist areas and des res
sought after areas of Spain for Expats - will no doubt recover quicker than others.

Also as mentioned above - the Brexit period will be a major headache for those Expats who sold their house
in the UK and want to exchange into Euro's whatever the final result of the British referendum will be.
I would expect some wild currency fluctuations until things settle down.


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## Brangus (May 1, 2010)

CharlieMCFC said:


> I too rent long term. May I ask - if something breaks in your house, for example the hot water system, 1) who organises the repair and 2) who pays for it? In my case, it's me, and that's making me think that buying might be a better option, since I have all the repair hassle and costs anyway.


Same situation over here. We should have read our contract more carefully, obviously.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

When we negotiated over a couple of years a drop in what we paid in rent of a massive 1300 euros a month we agreed to do 'small' repairs. It seems only fair as we are now paying in rent for a large house on two large plots with pool what some round here are paying for a townhouse. We've been here seven years now and our landlord is happy for us to stay forever if that's what we want. The comparatively low rent is worth it to him for peace of mind, I guess.
So far we have paid to have the interior painted and a few minor repairs to the swimming pool set-up, also two pairs of lamps on the front gates which are 'nicer' than the ones that were there before. The house is unfurnished and we bought new dishwasher and washing machine. It has been our home for seven years and will be for a few more yet. Then we'll move into our son's house which is smaller. It seems only right that we should do these repairs.
It's essential imo to agree about things like that as a previously good landlord/tenant relationship can sour if there is a dispute over who does what.


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## Relyat (Sep 29, 2013)

kodel said:


> Hi,
> 
> We are currently renting and have recently completed on the sale of our UK House. Now the original plan was to find a property we could afford to buy outright and have no mortgage, But as we have changed area's and its a bit more expensive, we are thinking of using our funds to invest (either here or back in the UK) to create further income to pay our rental expenses which enable us to live where ever. As a couple with no dependencies (Kids All grown up) and we are not yet at retirement age, we still need an income to live off, no pensions just yet. We both work online so can be anywhere, which is why we were able to moved out here in the first place.
> 
> ...


You both work online - thus I take it that you are still working and do not need to set up a business. However, if you do, does the cost of setting up an online business outweigh the capital that you were going to use to buy a house?


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## Leper (May 12, 2010)

I didn't read all the posts on this thread. The core of the enquiry is the usual Rent or Buy. For years I have been advocating renting because of the risks involved e.g. falling property prices, the availability of a favourable retreat if things go pear shape, inexpensive rent, etc.

Things are changing in Spain and the rate of change appears to be gathering some momentum although property prices are still relatively low. I reckon if you have survived your first year in Spain, now is the time to buy instead of renting. 

For those coming to Spain or those just there a few weeks my advice is to continue to rent for a few months more, at least.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

It is indeed the age old debate rent v buy with both having advantages/disadvantages.

One tip in this dilemma which I never fully agree with is- always keep a place back home so if things don't work out you can return. What's wrong with selling back home and banking the money ( assuming you don't need it for your Spanish property) The sale proceeds in the bank give you the same flexibility to return home if required


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

Rabbitcat said:


> It is indeed the age old debate rent v buy with both having advantages/disadvantages.
> 
> One tip in this dilemma which I never fully agree with is- always keep a place back home so if things don't work out you can return. What's wrong with selling back home and banking the money ( assuming you don't need it for your Spanish property) The sale proceeds in the bank give you the same flexibility to return home if required


If you keep it and need to return you have something to come back to. If you sell and bank the money it probably won't make as much to keep up with the rise of property prices which means you'll either have to buy smaller or maybe rent. Well that's the way it would work here. How is the property moving in Belfast I have a part ownership in a place there?


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

It has finally started to pick up quite well- though still well below ore crash prices

At its peak our house was valued at 260, fell to 120, now sitting at 170


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

I don't intend to return to the UK ever and I can think of not one single circumstance that would require me to.
In fact, I don't intend to visit the UK again. 
Not that I have any strong feelings of antipathy towards the place I was born, it's just that I'm settled here.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Roy C said:


> If you keep it and need to return you have something to come back to. If you sell and bank the money it probably won't make as much to keep up with the rise of property prices which means you'll either have to buy smaller or maybe rent. Well that's the way it would work here. How is the property moving in Belfast I have a part ownership in a place there?


What area in Belfast?


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## Chopera (Apr 22, 2013)

kodel said:


> Hi,
> 
> We are currently renting and have recently completed on the sale of our UK House. Now the original plan was to find a property we could afford to buy outright and have no mortgage, But as we have changed area's and its a bit more expensive, we are thinking of using our funds to invest (either here or back in the UK) to create further income to pay our rental expenses which enable us to live where ever. As a couple with no dependencies (Kids All grown up) and we are not yet at retirement age, we still need an income to live off, no pensions just yet. *We both work online so can be anywhere, which is why we were able to moved out here in the first place.*
> 
> ...


Are you already resident in Spain?

If so then you may find yourselves subject to CGT on the UK house sale if you don't buy another property within a couple of years (I can't remenber the exact limit). Also you'll find it hard to get a mortgage for buying a UK property (if that was one of the options you were considering).


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

That's a good point Chopera. A bit of careful timing ( if not already tax resident) is needed to get around the CGT


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Rabbitcat said:


> It has finally started to pick up quite well- though still well below ore crash prices
> 
> At its peak our house was valued at 260, fell to 120, now sitting at 170


How do you know those values?

Is it because you're on an urbanisation and that's what similar houses are achieving? Or is that what they are on the market for? 

It's so hard to know (1) what a house ACTUALLY sells for in Spain and (2) what a house is worth unless you live in an area where they're all identical!


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## C.G. (Jan 6, 2016)

mrypg9 said:


> When we negotiated over a couple of years a drop in what we paid in rent of a massive 1300 euros a month we agreed to do 'small' repairs. It seems only fair as we are now paying in rent for a large house on two large plots with pool what some round here are paying for a townhouse. We've been here seven years now and our landlord is happy for us to stay forever if that's what we want. The comparatively low rent is worth it to him for peace of mind, I guess.
> So far we have paid to have the interior painted and a few minor repairs to the swimming pool set-up, also two pairs of lamps on the front gates which are 'nicer' than the ones that were there before. The house is unfurnished and we bought new dishwasher and washing machine. It has been our home for seven years and will be for a few more yet. Then we'll move into our son's house which is smaller. It seems only right that we should do these repairs.
> It's essential imo to agree about things like that as a previously good landlord/tenant relationship can sour if there is a dispute over who does what.


I also like to rent, as it gives me the freedom to move if the roof falls down, I mean, If the roof does not hit me first. I don`t need the sense of owning a place to feel a secure base, my sense of security is more in people than in places.
The trouble for me is to find what you did in your landlord, and so far I have not succeeded, I`m still in the process of trying, failing, but I`m sure I will get there in time.
Where I live now, I love my neighborhood, and the people in it, but they are a little too close, 
as I work creatively and need to concentrate, so nice but not perfect.
And the landlord situation, well, it`s ok, but only ok, and only because I pick my fights carefully, and do smaller repairs, but not big ones.
Besides, it is not a single rental I had that doesn`t look better after I left, than before I came, but that doesn`t bother me much, as I like it nice around me where I am, even when I know I will move.
My landlady is very good at putting expenses on repairs on me. 
More rent, can`t do that? oh more expensive luz then. 
And I let her, as it is not that much money, and she is the kind of old sweet but cheeky lady suddenly standing in front of you in Mercadona, thinking, where the **** did she come from??
So I let her, and we go along fine, but I never know what her next move will be, then again, I have the freedom to move along, and maybe find the perfect landlady/tenant relationship.
One thing is for sure, there is nothing as energy-consuming as falling out with neighbors/ landlord, and the neighborhood would be a huge thing for me if thinking of buying.
But those issues you do not know anything about, until you lived there for a while.

(btw Mary, did you get my mail this time?)

Have a great day!


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

snikpoh said:


> How do you know those values?
> 
> Is it because you're on an urbanisation and that's what similar houses are achieving? Or is that what they are on the market for?
> 
> It's so hard to know (1) what a house ACTUALLY sells for in Spain and (2) what a house is worth unless you live in an area where they're all identical!


House prices are for Belfast where I have lived for 53 years


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## Roy C (Sep 29, 2012)

Rabbitcat said:


> What area in Belfast?


Blacks Road area........


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Not far from me


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