# Another health insurance and Residencia question



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

Hi guys, I hope you can help me out with this one.

My mother has health insurance which she is paying in Germany. She's also registered in Germany.

If she's to move to Spain, would she get residencia if she shows that she's got that health insurance in Germany along with monthly income?

Thank you.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Sirtravelot said:


> Hi guys, I hope you can help me out with this one.
> 
> My mother has health insurance which she is paying in Germany. She's also registered in Germany.
> 
> ...


no - she'd need health insurance in/from Spain


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> no - she'd need health insurance in/from Spain


Is that certain? She's got government insurance which she has kept up in Germany even though we've been in the UK.

Unfortunately, my mother has a condition that makes it difficult to get private insurance in Spain.

Now, stop me if this logic is whack.

She's not of retirement age yet. If she were to register as an autonomo and pay the fee each month, would that give her health insurance in Spain?

Otherwise, we need to see if the German insurance can do a transfer to Spain.


----------



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Sirtravelot said:


> Is that certain? She's got government insurance which she has kept up in Germany even though we've been in the UK.
> 
> Unfortunately, my mother has a condition that makes it difficult to get private insurance in Spain.
> 
> ...



So what work would she be doing? You can NOT just pay the autonomo SS payments to get free health care. Also, you would have to do quarterly tax returns, IVA returns etc.

I tried to register my property rentals as a 'business' so that I could pay SS and get health care - hacienda stated that this was not a valid business and denied me!!!!!!


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

snikpoh said:


> So what work would she be doing? You can NOT just pay the autonomo SS payments to get free health care. Also, you would have to do quarterly tax returns, IVA returns etc.
> 
> I tried to register my property rentals as a 'business' so that I could pay SS and get health care - hacienda stated that this was not a valid business and denied me!!!!!!


Hmm, ok. Thanks, thought as much.


----------



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Sirtravelot said:


> Is that certain? She's got government insurance which she has kept up in Germany even though we've been in the UK.
> 
> Unfortunately, my mother has a condition that makes it difficult to get private insurance in Spain.
> 
> ...


If the German insurance covered her in the UK, surely it would cover her in Spain too?


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

snikpoh said:


> So what work would she be doing? You can NOT just pay the autonomo SS payments to get free health care. Also, you would have to do quarterly tax returns, IVA returns etc.
> 
> I tried to register my property rentals as a 'business' so that I could pay SS and get health care - hacienda stated that this was not a valid business and denied me!!!!!!


Sorry, I got to ask something.

These property rentals you speak of which the haciendia denied as a valid businesses, are they in the UK or Spain?


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

Alcalaina said:


> If the German insurance covered her in the UK, surely it would cover her in Spain too?


It's a different system because of the NHS (indirect). 

In Germany EVERYONE has to pay insurance (direct), unless they are on social security.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> If the German insurance covered her in the UK, surely it would cover her in Spain too?


the question really is whether Spain would accept it - or even if it would usable (is that a word??) here

insurance here tends to be linked to specific clinics & hospitals doesn't it?

I don't know if the German ins would work here - or whether you'd pay upfront & claim it back from wherever

but I think the bottom line is whether the extranjería would accept or understand it, even if it was usable


----------



## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Sirtravelot said:


> Is that certain? She's got government insurance which she has kept up in Germany even though we've been in the UK.
> 
> Unfortunately, my mother has a condition that makes it difficult to get private insurance in Spain.
> 
> ...


It seems unlikely that German state health care would cover her if she is not resident in that country but the only way you can be sure is to check directly with the German authorities. I'm sure they must have websites similar to UK DWP and NHS you can look up.

Any private insurance is generally only valid while you are resident in the country that it originates, thus the responses here saying that she will probably need to take out private insurance in Spain.


----------



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Sirtravelot said:


> Sorry, I got to ask something.
> 
> These property rentals you speak of which the haciendia denied as a valid businesses, are they in the UK or Spain?


They are here in Spain - holiday lets and long-term lets.


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

snikpoh said:


> They are here in Spain - holiday lets and long-term lets.



Ok thank you for the answer.

We'll have to ask the German health insurance, it seems.


----------



## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

After 1 year of residence she could pay into the Spanish Health Service.
The problem is, ias she already has an existing condition,which an insurer won't cover, that first year will be a worry, she'll have to pay for any treatment out of her own money


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

extranjero said:


> After 1 year of residence she could pay into the Spanish Health Service.
> The problem is, ias she already has an existing condition,which an insurer won't cover, that first year will be a worry, she'll have to pay for any treatment out of her own money



One year of residence? Meaning one year of having residencia? Isn't that a chicken or the egg situation?

Also, that's the convenio especial, is that correct? Can anyone pay into it, regardless of health history?

If that worked, yes it would be one year of worry, but worst case scenario she could get treated in Germany. Not ideal, but possible.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Sirtravelot said:


> One year of residence? Meaning one year of having residencia? Isn't that a chicken or the egg situation?
> 
> Also, that's the convenio especial, is that correct? Can anyone pay into it, regardless of health history?
> 
> If that worked, yes it would be one year of worry, but worst case scenario she could get treated in Germany. Not ideal, but possible.


yes that's right - the convenio especial - not yet available everywhere, but planned to be

it _is _a bit chicken & egg, since she'd need health insurance to register as resident - but only for a year - you have to be a registered resident for 12 months before you can sign up for it 

& yes, all pre-existing conditions are covered


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> yes that's right - the convenio especial - not yet available everywhere, but planned to be
> 
> it _is _a bit chicken & egg, since she'd need health insurance to register as resident - but only for a year - you have to be a registered resident for 12 months before you can sign up for it
> 
> & yes, all pre-existing conditions are covered



Christ. There's _gotta_ be a way around it.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Sirtravelot said:


> Christ. There's _gotta_ be a way around it.


you say your mother?

is she anywhere near getting a state pension?


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> you say your mother?
> 
> is she anywhere near getting a state pension?


She is, 4 years away from German retirement age and she could theoretically apply for early retirement, but you need to be nearly "half-dead" in the disability department.

Could she live in Spain until reaching her retirement age in Spain without applying for residencia? Are there any negative implications of this?


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

What about Travel insurances who insure you for longer stays in another country? Could Spain accept that for Residencia? Or could we pay into the convenio especial after a year with travel insurance?

Trying to brainstorm here.


----------



## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Sirtravelot said:


> What about Travel insurances who insure you for longer stays in another country? Could Spain accept that for Residencia? Or could we pay into the convenio especial after a year with travel insurance?
> 
> Trying to brainstorm here.


Could she obtain private health insurance but with the pre-existing condition(s) excluded? Obviously she'd have to pay upfront for any treatment required for the excluded conditions, for the first year, but would the health insurance policy be accepted by the Spanish authorities for the purposes of registering as resident, I wonder?


----------



## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

Sirtravelot said:


> She is, 4 years away from German retirement age and she could theoretically apply for early retirement, but you need to be nearly "half-dead" in the disability department.
> 
> Could she live in Spain until reaching her retirement age in Spain without applying for residencia? Are there any negative implications of this?


She has to apply for residencia after living in Spain for 90 days. She would have to provide evidence of health cover, which wouldn't cover her existing condition, though you could negotiate this with perhaps increased premiums.
Travel insurance is not for someone residing in a country, it is not the same as health cover. Although you can get annual insurance, I think the terms and conditions would rule out living for a year in Spain
Also, travel insurance may be tricky with your mothers existing health condition
Wouldn't it just be easier to wait till she 's a state pensioner?


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Sirtravelot said:


> What about Travel insurances who insure you for longer stays in another country? Could Spain accept that for Residencia? Or could we pay into the convenio especial after a year with travel insurance?
> 
> Trying to brainstorm here.



she could get health insurance here - have you looked at the comparison site link for quotes - it might be cheaper than you think



she _could _live here for 4 years without registering as resident - many people do

but if caught there's a fine - & it's getting harder & harder to do anything without the registration cert/card


----------



## Sirtravelot (Jul 20, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> she could get health insurance here - have you looked at the comparison site link for quotes - it might be cheaper than you think
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Could you link me reliable comparison websites for Spain please? Still, I don't know if they would with her pre-existing condition.

How likely is she to be caught though? And how hefty are the fines? For getting things done, I can help her out, I should get residencia without a problem.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Sirtravelot said:


> Could you link me reliable comparison websites for Spain please? Still, I don't know if they would with her pre-existing condition.
> 
> How likely is she to be caught though? And how hefty are the fines? For getting things done, I can help her out, I should get residencia without a problem.


there are some here
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp.../2725-faqs-lots-useful-info-2.html#post597217 



from our http://www.expatforum.com/expats/sp...-living-spain/2725-faqs-lots-useful-info.html


----------



## extranjero (Nov 16, 2012)

Sirtravelot said:


> Could you link me reliable comparison websites for Spain please? Still, I don't know if they would with her pre-existing condition.
> 
> How likely is she to be caught though? And how hefty are the fines? For getting things done, I can help her out, I should get residencia without a problem.


Would be awful to have to live with the fear of being caught.

What if she were taken Ill,she would end up with an enormous bill!
Why not just google insurers?
I doubt if there is a comparison site for health cover?


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

extranjero said:


> Would be awful to have to live with the fear of being caught.
> 
> What if she were taken Ill,she would end up with an enormous bill!
> Why not just google insurers?
> *I doubt if there is a comparison site for health cover*?


there is - see my post above yours


----------

