# what happens to independent visa japan when you leave Japan?



## helloworld232

I'm leaving Japan permanently, but my wife&son will want stay in japan for another month or two, do they also surrender their independent visa at the same time when I surrender mine at the airport when i leave japan?


----------



## myrrh

helloworld232 said:


> I'm leaving Japan permanently, but my wife&son will want stay in japan for another month or two, do they also surrender their independent visa at the same time when I surrender mine at the airport when i leave japan?


It's called a _dependent_ visa, and as the name implies, their right to stay in Japan is _dependent _on you.

If you leave Japan with more than two months left on your current visa _and_ don't announce you're leaving permanently, then the most likely scenario is that they would be okay for those two months. After all, your (and therefore their) current visa would still be good...in theory.

That said, if you let slip at the airport that you're not coming back, or in the unlikely scenario that your company tells Immigration you've left Japan permanently, things can go wrong.


----------



## larabell

I don't know about dependent visas but the general rule for a working visa is that it's valid until it expires, even if you lose or quit your job. Of course, that might not be a good example. Students on a student visa must leave within 30 days of the time they quit school or graduate. If you want a definitive answer, you should talk to Immigration. Why risk your family's future on answers you get off the Internet?


----------



## myrrh

larabell said:


> I don't know about dependent visas but the general rule for a working visa is that it's valid until it expires, even if you lose or quit your job. Of course, that might not be a good example. Students on a student visa must leave within 30 days of the time they quit school or graduate. If you want a definitive answer, you should talk to Immigration. Why risk your family's future on answers you get off the Internet?


The OP is talking about a dependent visa (家族滞在ビザ), which is a visa whereby a foreign spouse with the right to live/work in Japan then becomes the guarantor for his/her foreign spouse and foreign children. I.e., assuming you believe the various posts, everybody involved here is non-Japanese. These dependent visas are tied to their foreign guarantors and do not exceed them in length. In other words, when the guarantor's visa expires, the dependent visa expires.

As I noted too, the work visa would normally not be cut off just because somebody quit/was fired. However, in posts here and elsewhere, this poster has made it clear numerous times that he plans to give up his visa at the airport. In other words, and possibly with the purpose of avoiding any potential questions about possible tax liability, he plans to tell immigration (presumably when they inform him about the impending expiration of his work visa and/or give him the now standard みなし再入国許可 warnings) that he is not planning to return to Japan...and give up his resident card (在留カード)...and give up his right to work (visa). 

This can be done. I've personally watched this happen with a guy directly in front of me at Narita Airport. He handed over his resident card, they entered something in the computer about it, and he was off. No worries, right?

The problem is what happens when the dependent wife and child show up at the airport and try to leave 1-2 months after their guarantor not just left the country permanently but returned his resident card and gave up his visa. Good luck with that.

Just in case somebody comes later with a serious inquiry about this, one way to avoid problems would be going to the local immigration office, explaining the situation, and applying beforehand (i.e., _before_ the guarantor gives up his card/visa) for a change of visa status for his wife and child. Depending on the reasons (and one's country of origin of course), they can sometimes accommodate you.


----------



## larabell

Yeah... I know what a dependent visa is and it's fairly obvious from the original post that the family in question aren't Japanese nationals. The question comes down to whether a dependent's status of residence is revoked immediately when the person they're dependent upon leaves the country. And that's not clear from any official sources I've seen (if you've seen something to the contrary, feel free to post a link).

You may recall that one's visa and one's status of residence are actually two different things when it comes to Japanese Immigration. Leaving Japan and turning in your resident's card terminates your status of residence but, at least in come cases, your visa remains valid. I know that because when I came back to Japan (as a tourist) about a year after I returned from my first expat stay in Japan, the incoming Immigration officer asked if I wouldn't prefer to enter on my existing, and still valid, working visa.

Moreover, the expiration data on a dependent visa isn't necessarily tied to the visa expiration data of the person who is their guatantor. I know that because both of my sons, back when they were still living on a dependent visa, received extensions with expiration dates over a year after the expiration data on my working visa.

So there's no concrete evidence that the expiration data on a dependent visa is accelerated if the guarantor leaves Japan or, if it does, what the grace period (if any) might be. I suspect that may be because it's fairly unusual for a non-Japanese dependent spouse and/or family to remain in Japan after the working family member leaves but that doesn't necessarily make it impossible.

As far as the family showing up to *leave* Japan, I seriously doubt the Immigration guy is going to prevent them from leaving just because of what could easily be a mistaken procedure on their part. I'd be more worried that something serious might happen before then that would call their status of residence into question and force them to leave earlier than they had planned. But on the way out? What would be the point.

Of course, this all assumes that the family will be following the OP shortly. If it's all a pseudo-clever scan to return to Japan having avoided a year's worth of tax, that's a whole different matter.

I agree that the best bet is to contact Immigration directly.


----------



## myrrh

larabell said:


> Yeah... I know what a dependent visa is and it's fairly obvious from the original post that the family in question aren't Japanese nationals. The question comes down to whether a dependent's status of residence is revoked immediately when the person they're dependent upon leaves the country. And that's not clear from any official sources I've seen (if you've seen something to the contrary, feel free to post a link).


Here you go. These FAQ links (provided by legal offices specializing in immigration issues for foreigners) agree with me:

å®¶æ—�æ»žåœ¨ãƒ“ã‚¶æ‰¶é¤Šè€…ã�Œå¸°å›½ã�—ã�Ÿå ´å�ˆã�«ã�¯ã€�å®¶æ—�æ»žåœ¨ãƒ“ã‚¶ã�§åœ¨ç•™ã�—ã�¦ã�„ã‚‹ç§�ã‚‚å¸°å›½ã�—ã�ªã�‘ã‚Œã�°ã�ªã‚Šã�¾ã�›ã‚“ã�‹ï¼Ÿï½œå¤–å›½äººé›‡ç”¨æ‰‹ç¶šãƒ»å°±åŠ´ãƒ“ã‚¶ã�ªã‚‰ã�Šä»»ã�› å¤–å›½äººé›‡ç”¨æ‰‹ç¶šãƒ»å°±åŠ´ãƒ“ã‚¶ãƒ–ãƒ­ã‚°

Read the full text.

‰Æ‘°‘Ø�ÝƒrƒU

See answer to Question 9

åœ¨ç•™è³‡æ ¼ã€Œå®¶æ—�æ»žåœ¨ã€� - VISAã�®ã‚¢ã‚ªãƒ¤ã‚®è¡Œæ”¿æ›¸å£«äº‹å‹™æ‰€

See answer to Question 8

This is so rare (unheard f?) that the main Immigration pages do not cover it. However, if you're on a spousal visa and get a divorce, you lose that status (regardless of whether you still have time on your visa) and need to turn in your card/leave the country or apply to change your visa status...or else (see below). These links are examples:

???????????????2012?7?9?????????????????????
???????????????2012?7?9?????????????????????

The point again is that resident status by marriage/being dependent is different from work, making it dangerous to equate the two even as an example.



larabell said:


> As far as the family showing up to *leave* Japan, I seriously doubt the Immigration guy is going to prevent them from leaving just because of what could easily be a mistaken procedure on their part. I'd be more worried that something serious might happen before then that would call their status of residence into question and force them to leave earlier than they had planned. But on the way out? What would be the point.


The point is that laws enacted over the last few years mean that they could be fined and/or forced to do the things listed here in order to leave:

??????????????????????????????
????????????????:?????????????????????????-???????????????

Would they? Doubt it...but I wouldn't want my family to have to risk it.

As for your own personal experiences, depending on when they happened, they underline the amount of leeway immigration officers have when making these decisions. E.g., I was told in Miyazaki 15 years ago that what you seem to have done with your sons wasn't possible. (I was also told once that I couldn't even apply for permanent residency by the office in one prefecture, then successfully applied--after moving to another prefecture for a job--later that same year.)

Basically, immigration officers in all countries can be as nice or as mean as they want to you...which is why I try never to give them specific cause for the latter.


----------



## myrrh

Double post.


----------

