# Havent filed, need advice



## palmerpat

Hi. I became US national in 2005, all taxes till then paid fully (11yrs). I moved back to the UK in 2006 and have lived there ever since. Fool that I am, didnt know I had to file each year in the US. This only came to light last week when I found I have to go the USA in 2 weeks/ Passing through on way to Canada to visit sick relative. I know I have to go the US on my US passport. I am PETRIFIED that at the airport somehting bad will happen as I havent filed for 6 yrs. I of course want to make things right.

1st Qustion, is there anyone I can talk to about this. IRS? Looking at what I now know I dont believe I will owe any taxes as I have only income in the 20s. I have no savings in the UK. I own a house, well a mortage.

2nd I notice there is a Streamline procedure. It says that you have to have been in the UK since 2009. Ive been here longer. Am I still eligible on that point?

Any advice much appreciated. I am travelling with elderly man and dont want grief which Im sure some of you will say deserved. Just want to make right what I genuinely didnt know.

Thank you


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## PeteC

I will simply give my opinion here, maybe some might disagree

-contacting the IRS can be a good idea, you can email them and let them know that you intend to file. I did that when I found out that I needed to file back taxes. I asked for the information and the email answer was useful. I had emailed:

[email protected]

I would be shocked if something happened at the border. I went in and out of the US many times while not knowing about this and it was never even discussed. I would think those are 2 completely different departments. That being said, having a copy of the email to and from the IRS could always be useful.

2-Unfortunately, not really. The IRS will give you some indications but in the end, my situation was particular which ended up leading me to call a cross-border accountant after trying unsuccesssfully to deal with the IRS.. But you might have better luck


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## palmerpat

Thank you for your quick reply. I may contact the IRS tomorrow and let them know of my intention to file. Although with slight aprehension letting them know Im about to travel to the US.Then need to figure the best method of filing the late returns. In relation to being suitable for the Streamlined process, I asked as I noticed other posts where people hadnt filed for 20 yrs then used that. 

Still very scared to travel. Wondering has anyone else from UK travelled through the US with the same issue. 
Annoyed with myself for not knowing. Mind you, the folks from social security know my address as I requested some details years ago. Never have received anything looking for filed reports.


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## Nononymous

DO NOT PANIC. 

Do you have a valid US passport? If yes, just ignore this and travel, there will be no tax questions at the border.

Do you have a UK (or other) passport with a non-US birthplace? If yes, you can also travel on this passport (though technically you should use the US passport) and none will be the wiser.

The border folks do not ask about taxes. Period. They barely care about the US passport. 

I live in Canada, am a dual US-Canadian citizen with a US birthplace, and I cross with my Canadian passport all the time. It was an issue once in December, I had a polite chat and promised to renew my expired US passport "next time" (I did not, and it wasn't an issue the next time I came down). It's enough of a risk for business travel that I will renew my US passport, but I'm not going to bother filing taxes, I don't think they actually check. 

If you are living in the UK, plan to stay in the UK, and do not have a US birthplace, I would think you have zero risk of detection and could safely ignore this, unless you had US assets or expected a US inheritance.


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## palmerpat

Thank you for the reply. Yes I have valid US passport and my original UK passport. I think though I have to get temporary Visa to use that. Also I entered the USA on that passport years ago and left on the US one I had acquired after becoming citizen. Both valid though. Prob best to use my US one as thats meant to be the law.


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## Phil Hogan

Nononymous said:


> DO NOT PANIC.
> 
> 
> If you are living in the UK, plan to stay in the UK, and do not have a US birthplace, I would think you have zero risk of detection and could safely ignore this, unless you had US assets or expected a US inheritance.


I don't mean to be rude, but that's very risky advice. The IRS has a great reputation for being reasonable with those that file voluntarily, however if they have to ask for your late returns it could get nasty.

Get some proper advice on filing your late US tax returns and renounce your US citizenship if you no longer want to be a Citizen.


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## Bevdeforges

If you are a US citizen, you can get in really serious trouble if you try to enter the US on anything other than your US passport. And secondly, the folks at the border will NOT have any information available as to whether or not you have or haven't filed your tax returns recently. (The departments involved are not allowed to share that kind of information.)

Go to the US as planned. As far as anyone in the US knows at this point, you haven't had sufficient income to have to file a tax return. (There are LOTS of folks who don't have to file - both in the US and overseas - generally because they have insufficient income.)

On your return, you should definitely look into getting straight with the IRS, because even if you do decide to renounce, you'll have to get your tax situation sorted before you do. 

This new "streamlined" procedure is a good option - though it's not that much different from what they've been advocating for years: basically, file the current year plus the three prior years. If that shows that you owe little or nothing in back taxes, you're pretty much in the clear and you can simply stay up to date going forward. The FBAR forms are supposed to be filed for 6 years in arrears - but again, as long as those don't reveal any massive hiding of assets that would be subject to US tax, it's one of those things that you just have to do and get it done with.

I have yet to hear of anyone being harassed, stopped at the border or penalized when backfiling from overseas - particularly if the backfilings showed little or nothing due. The IRS has something of a scare campaign going in Canada to try to terrorize the folks there into compliance - but I still have yet to hear of anyone being pursued for back taxes or failure to file.
Cheers,
Bev


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## Nononymous

Phil Hogan said:


> I don't mean to be rude, but that's very risky advice. The IRS has a great reputation for being reasonable with those that file voluntarily, however if they have to ask for your late returns it could get nasty.
> 
> Get some proper advice on filing your late US tax returns and renounce your US citizenship if you no longer want to be a Citizen.


Fair enough. I speak of the Canadian experience, where our government (which I don't particularly love, but am pleased with on this score) seems to be doing the right thing in terms of telling the IRS to take a hike - refusing to collect against dual citizens, lots of stalling on FATCA. So if you're one of the X thousands who are dual, particularly without a US birthplace to betray you on a passport, I can't imagine why you'd want to open a can of worms with the IRS. That is however my soapbox.

Passports. The renewal form now asks for your SSN only, no longer requires the little "oath" about being up to date on taxes (on penalty of the $500 perjury fine, which when amortized over ten years of passport validity is a hell of a good deal). And yes while the letter of the law is US citizens must enter on a US passport, I've crossed pretty regularly with a Canadian, showing US birthplace, and declared dual citizenship when asked, and it's only been an issue once, the second-to-last time I went down for work. (I plan to renew my US passport when I'm living in Europe later this year, so that I'm not technically lying about my country of residence, but also not revealing any link to Canada.) 

PS I would owe the IRS nothing or next to nothing, but as I didn't ask for and don't want US citizenship, I'm being stubborn. If I didn't have to travel down for work occasionally, I would pay this no attention whatsoever.


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## BBCWatcher

The IRS has posted information on their streamlined compliance procedure here.

I agree with Bev (and the U.S. State Department): if you are a U.S. citizen, do not use a foreign passport to enter the U.S. Do not apply for ESTA or a U.S. visa for your non-U.S. passport. The fact some people get away with it is not a reason to ignore this requirement. This particular stunt can really land you in hot water.


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## palmerpat

Thank you all for your advice. Since I have to travel in about a weeks time, I will not have time to deal with the full backlog or deal with any consequences of renouncing citizenship which I dont really want to do anyway. I will try not to worry about what happens at the border although this is very hard for me at a stressful time. I can only answer truthfully any question that comes up. I truly did not know I had to do this, while some say I should have known, I didnt.
I will travel on my US passport as is required. I just dont to be in a position where Im 'held' mid journey for non filing of tax forms that will be for no taxes.


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## Bevdeforges

The chances of the issue of your tax filing status even being raised while you're in the US are very slim to none. If they were concerned about it, you would have gotten some sort of notification from the IRS long before this. (Despite their "image" they still have to play by the rules and first step would be to notify you that they have reason to believe that you should have been filing but haven't done so.)
Cheers,
Bev


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## Nononymous

palmerpat said:


> Thank you all for your advice. Since I have to travel in about a weeks time, I will not have time to deal with the full backlog or deal with any consequences of renouncing citizenship which I dont really want to do anyway. I will try not to worry about what happens at the border although this is very hard for me at a stressful time. I can only answer truthfully any question that comes up. I truly did not know I had to do this, while some say I should have known, I didnt.
> I will travel on my US passport as is required. I just dont to be in a position where Im 'held' mid journey for non filing of tax forms that will be for no taxes.


There is absolutely no reason to be paranoid/worried/concerned. You are flying to the US with a valid US passport. End of story. 

The customs & immigration folks have no access to tax data and no interest in your tax status or authority to ask tax questions. Period. It's not an issue.


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## palmerpat

Nononymous said:


> There is absolutely no reason to be paranoid/worried/concerned. You are flying to the US with a valid US passport. End of story.
> 
> The customs & immigration folks have no access to tax data and no interest in your tax status or authority to ask tax questions. Period. It's not an issue.


Thank you for all your help. Ill just take my trip next week and try not to worry about it. Put it perspective. Will post on return, and Im sure then seek help on getting up to date. Thank you.


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