# Setting up a a freelancer in spain



## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

When i resign from my uk job to come live in spain i have a feeling my IT company will ask if i want to work as a freelancer for them from home in Spain. But how easy or not is this to set up in Spain? What's the tax position? Is is better to wait until i apply for resedencia before setting up as freelance?


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## KG5 (Mar 21, 2016)

andyviola said:


> When i resign from my uk job to come live in spain i have a feeling my IT company will ask if i want to work as a freelancer for them from home in Spain. But how easy or not is this to set up in Spain? What's the tax position? Is is better to wait until i apply for resedencia before setting up as freelance?


Hi Andy - this is similar to my position

I have been here over a year and am still paid by my UK entity. I travel a lot but in truth I should be registered here.

Your options are

- company sets up here and pays you from here (highly unlikely they will want to do that due to cost/complexity/tax position here unless there is a long term stable business opportunity in Spain for them)
- set up as autonomo...if you earn up to about 50k pa that's the best apparently
- set up at a limited company.(SL) more tax efficient if you earn over 50k apparently


Spain is not an attractive place to set up as a digital nomad from a tax perspective but IMO the price is worth paying because of what you get in terms of quality of life

I have to sort my stuff out soon...I have spoken to 3 different gestors/advisors who have given me 3 different answers. Honestly...I don't know who to trust with this...and it's important


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## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

Thanks so much! Keep me posted here on your progress. As we are buying the home of my dreams outright with no mortgage i reckon less than 50k is just fine so will start googling autonomo!

By the way why can't uk companies just continue to pay into uk account? I know that means double taxed uk and spain but i googled that the double tax agreement means the uk tax can be claimed back. Or is there some other complication i am missing?


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

andyviola said:


> Thanks so much! Keep me posted here on your progress. As we are buying the home of my dreams outright with no mortgage i reckon less than 50k is just fine so will start googling autonomo!
> 
> By the way why can't uk companies just continue to pay into uk account? I know that means double taxed uk and spain but i googled that the double tax agreement means the uk tax can be claimed back. Or is there some other complication i am missing?


But if you live here and work here (even if for a UK company) then you must pay tax and SS (NI) here.

Where will you get medical cover?


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## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

we have just been informed by lawyer of Agent that in place we will be living - Calafell in Catalonia - we will qualify for free healthcare when present NIE and home address. so we will just walk try in at local "surgery" and see - nothing ventured....

I resigned today !!! and boss of department was all over me like a rash saying he confident I can work from home 

being somewhat overtaxed is not a killer....basically without rent or mortgage I just need enough to cover basic living costs and my daughter at cheap (accom anyways) Dutch university for next 3 years.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

andyviola said:


> we have just been informed by lawyer of Agent that in place we will be living - Calafell in Catalonia - we will qualify for free healthcare when present NIE and home address. so we will just walk try in at local "surgery" and see - nothing ventured....
> 
> I resigned today !!! and boss of department was all over me like a rash saying he confident I can work from home
> 
> being somewhat overtaxed is not a killer....basically without rent or mortgage I just need enough to cover basic living costs and my daughter at cheap (accom anyways) Dutch university for next 3 years.


Don't blame you taking permanent residency ( while still an EU citizen ) in Spain and Catalonia.
Contracting's great when your young or youngish & wanted while your skillset's are the bees knees.
I think most Contractors plan to retire at 50 before their skillsets are deemed old hat or they
burn out trying to keep pace with the ever greater demand & faster pace of technological change.


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## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

Williams2 said:


> Don't blame you taking permanent residency ( while still an EU citizen ) in Spain and Catalonia.
> Contracting's great when your young or youngish & wanted while your skillset's are the bees knees.
> I think most Contractors plan to retire at 50 before their skillsets are deemed old hat or they
> burn out trying to keep pace with the ever greater demand & faster pace of technological change.


thanks!

I have hard-brexit fallback as wife is EU citizen on basis of being Polish - doubt Polish coming out any time soon 

Agreed. I do find it getting tougher but the old (51) dog still has a few tricks....and was flattering the boss straight on to me to ask me to work from home. I don't have the necessary "soft skills" to be a manager so yes sticking with the same old b*stards is best if it comes off


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

andyviola said:


> thanks!
> 
> I have hard-brexit fallback as wife is EU citizen on basis of being Polish - doubt Polish coming out any time soon
> 
> Agreed. I do find it getting tougher but the old (51) dog still has a few tricks....and was flattering the boss straight on to me to ask me to work from home. I don't have the necessary "soft skills" to be a manager so yes sticking with the same old b*stards is best if it comes off


Unfortunately there's still ageism in the British workplace and the 'cannot teach the old dog new tricks
mentality' which usually starts once they see you starting to wear glasses. I've come across countless ex Contractors who returned to Permanent work, as they started getting dismissed or failing to win
the contract - not because they were not good enough but they were perceived as likely to be slow
or other excuses, on account of their age and lose the contract to a younger guy as a result of it.

Anyway good luck on your new venture.


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## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

yes you are a realist not a fluffy PC nonsense talker ! I have always been a permanent member of staff apart from 9 months freelancer between jobs when the IR35 stuff was all too weird for me  hoping dept manager can wangle things to continue that trend...


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

andyviola said:


> yes you are a realist not a fluffy PC nonsense talker ! I have always been a permanent member of staff apart from 9 months freelancer between jobs when the IR35 stuff was all too weird for me


Yes you are doing it the other way round to what most Contractors do - namely get into Contracting 
early while they are still young and then return to the safety net of permanent work when they
start getting health problems ( or face age discrimination ) when they can fall back on the
perceived safe guards of permanent employment.


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## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

Williams2 said:


> Yes you are doing it the other way round to what most Contractors do - namely get into Contracting
> early while they are still young and then return to the safety net of permanent work when they
> start getting health problems ( or face age discrimination ) when they can fall back on the
> perceived safe guards of permanent employment.


sounds very familiar! saw it happen to a guy I thought was a lifer contractor!

Yes today things moved on from my position on OP - looks like company more willing to offer working from home as a permie than they used too (company changed handsw from those days)


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Williams2 said:


> Unfortunately there's still ageism in the British workplace and the 'cannot teach the old dog new tricks
> mentality' which usually starts once they see you starting to wear glasses.


Ageism is very much alive in Spain. A 50 year old looking for work is a dead duck here, and if you're a 50 year old woman you're a dodo!


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## samthemainman (Aug 15, 2012)

OK - so you have two options here (maybe only 1) if you are to continue working for the UK company, as both tax and social security need to be paid in Spain. It's not about health cover so much, but about everything else social security is for - pensions, sickness etc. 

1 - Autonomo - You can't just be a regular autonomo either to my knowledge if your old employer is going to be your sole customer - but you need to have a T.R.A.D.E. contract. I'm no expert on that but look it up - Spain has similar restrictions as in the UK (like IR35 rules for HMRC) which prevent freelancers having single clients or at least prevents them from benefiting from cheaper tax rates. These time of self-employed people are sometimes considered 'fake' freelancers who are too convenient for employers wanting to escape paying employers social security/NI contributions. In Spain, employers contribute a lot more than UK employers contribute for NI for example - but that's why the Spanish State Pension in % of final salary terms is far higher than in the UK. The T.R.A.D.E. option may be your only option unless...

2- Your employer has an office in Spain prepared to take you onto their payroll (and recharge the costs), or is prepared to pay the overhead of setting up an entity and/or a shadow payroll for you - as the Spanish equivalent of PAYE (tax retention) is always necessary and employer/employee deductions for social security need to be made. Shadow payroll is costly but companies like PwC, Ernst & Young as well as lots of smaller companies can set it up for your company. 

You will also need to consider (or have assessed) the 'permanent establishment' risk you may present to the UK company. I.e. if you have a sales type role, or are financial incentivised on company performance (e.g. financial performance related bonuses, signing of contracts etc) - you may also attract a corporate tax risk for the UK company by the Spanish authorities.

Working in Spain for a company in another country is a lot more complicated than many people think, so I definitely recommend you get proper tax advice from an expert, vs. a regular gestor. 

Good luck, whatever you decide!


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## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

Thanks for that. Can you give me a term to Google for T.R.A.D.E please as Google just searches for the word trade despite me including the dots and enclosing in double quotes.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Maybe this?
Autónomo económicamente dependiente o TRADE 
I don't know if you meant that you were looking for something in English. This is in Spanish and looks at the advantages and disadvantages although I must say that I m none the wiser after having read it. I think that for teachers it's not applicabe because we don't pay IVA, and have different holiday and timetables...
I searched for autonoma trade 2019


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## andyviola (Aug 11, 2018)

Thanks alot. (Sorry i cant find the button for thanking a post in one click on android app)


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