# US citizen born abroad, have never filed with the IRS - where do I begin?



## anincog84

Hi.

I'm a dual US/Norwegian citizen in my mid-twenties, and I have lived all my life in Norway. Only recently I learned that I need to file with the IRS every year. I'm quite confident that after deductions I owe nothing in back taxes, but the stories of harsh penalties scare me. I'm also in a bit of a hurry, as I will be living (temporarily) in the US for the first time in early 2013, and really want to get this sorted before then. I have absolutely no idea where to begin, nor do I know the answer to basic questions (How many years do I file for? Every since I turned 18? What about savings, mortgages, student loans?)

Any pointers regarding where to begin would be greatly appreciated.


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## Bevdeforges

For tax returns, they generally recommend filing current year and three prior years (i.e. 4 years in total). That gets you past the statute of limitations and if you owe nothing (or very little) over that period of time all should be well.

The FATCA regulations that require you to file information about overseas investments or Financial accounts are said to require 6 years of back filing. But, for the FATCA forms that go with your income tax returns, you don't have to file anything unless your financial assets total $200,000 or more at the end of the filing year (or $300,000 at any point during the tax year).

The FBAR filing is a separate filing each year where you report your overseas (non US) bank accounts if the total of those is over $10,000 at any time during the year.

But the first thing you have to do before you get into any of this is to get yourself a social security number. Check with your local US consulate to get yourself started on that. The IRS won't accept the tax returns without a social security number.

However, as long as you have a US passport, you should still be able to go to the US as planned, whether or not your social security number has come through. In fact, it might be easier to apply for a social security number to start the process rolling when you're in the US. And it will definitely be easier for you to get help with the tax forms over there.
Cheers,
Bev


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## anincog84

Bevdeforges said:


> For tax returns, they generally recommend filing current year and three prior years (i.e. 4 years in total). That gets you past the statute of limitations and if you owe nothing (or very little) over that period of time all should be well.
> 
> The FATCA regulations that require you to file information about overseas investments or Financial accounts are said to require 6 years of back filing. But, for the FATCA forms that go with your income tax returns, you don't have to file anything unless your financial assets total $200,000 or more at the end of the filing year (or $300,000 at any point during the tax year).


Thanks, this is very helpful.



Bevdeforges said:


> The FBAR filing is a separate filing each year where you report your overseas (non US) bank accounts if the total of those is over $10,000 at any time during the year.


Yeah, I've been looking at that, but can't seem to figure out how the amount is counted. Suppose I have a mortgage of $X and a bank account with $Y in it. If X>Y and Y>10k, does this still count as an account with more than 10k, as far as you know?



Bevdeforges said:


> But the first thing you have to do before you get into any of this is to get yourself a social security number. Check with your local US consulate to get yourself started on that. The IRS won't accept the tax returns without a social security number.


I have one. I was given one at birth, apparently.



Bevdeforges said:


> However, as long as you have a US passport, you should still be able to go to the US as planned, whether or not your social security number has come through. In fact, it might be easier to apply for a social security number to start the process rolling when you're in the US. And it will definitely be easier for you to get help with the tax forms over there.


Thanks. This has been most clarifying.

I'll follow up with one more question now that I have you here, if that's OK with you: 

In the terms of the 2555, I seem qualify for FEI exclusions every "missing" year. Do you however know what kind of a duration of a stay in the US typically "violates" the tax home test or the bona fide residence test in the 2555? This is relevant next year, as I will stay in the US for about half a year, but for certain return to my home in Norway after that. All income will be from my Norwegian employer, and taxed in Norway. The wordings of the two tests confuse me as to whether or not this will cause a problem for me.


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## anincog84

Oh and, I'll add a few more questions in case anybody can help:


Do I use the 2011 forms for all of the backlogs, or do I need to use the actual forms for the years in question?
Do I simply send in the returns as one would normally do, or do I add a special form or letter explaining the situation?


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## Bevdeforges

anincog84 said:


> Yeah, I've been looking at that, but can't seem to figure out how the amount is counted. Suppose I have a mortgage of $X and a bank account with $Y in it. If X>Y and Y>10k, does this still count as an account with more than 10k, as far as you know?


For the FBAR report, the mortgage doesn't count at all (it's debt, not a bank account). If Y>10K then you have to report ALL your foreign bank accounts because the combined total is > 10K.



> I have one. I was given one at birth, apparently.


Thank your parents. It's a real pain in the butt to get a social security number as an adult!



> I'll follow up with one more question now that I have you here, if that's OK with you:
> 
> In the terms of the 2555, I seem qualify for FEI exclusions every "missing" year. Do you however know what kind of a duration of a stay in the US typically "violates" the tax home test or the bona fide residence test in the 2555? This is relevant next year, as I will stay in the US for about half a year, but for certain return to my home in Norway after that. All income will be from my Norwegian employer, and taxed in Norway. The wordings of the two tests confuse me as to whether or not this will cause a problem for me.


This is tricky. If you were using the physical presence test, you would not be able to claim the exclusion for the time you spend in the US. It doesn't matter where your pay is coming from. They expect you to report how many days you spent in the US "on business" and to reduce your exclusion by the proportional amount. Under the physical presence test, too, you'd have to re-start your physical presence on your return to Norway in order to exclude your income again on your return.

Under the bona fide resident test, you might have an argument that you are still a bona fide resident of Norway, even during your time spent in the US and could potentially still exclude the income earned while physically in the US. If you're maintaining your residence in Norway while you're in the US (and especially if you're paying all your Norwegian taxes and social insurances), I'd be tempted to go that route and see if it flies.
Cheers,
Bev


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## Bevdeforges

anincog84 said:


> Oh and, I'll add a few more questions in case anybody can help:
> 
> 
> Do I use the 2011 forms for all of the backlogs, or do I need to use the actual forms for the years in question?
> Do I simply send in the returns as one would normally do, or do I add a special form or letter explaining the situation?


You need to use the proper year's forms. Available here: Forms & Pubs Click on "Prior year forms and publications" for the various years.

Probably best to send in the prior year forms with a cover letter explaining why they are late. Be sure, too, to check each year's instructions for where to send the forms. They changed the address for forms from overseas a year or two ago, and I think they expect the older forms to go to the old address.
Cheers,
Bev


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## anincog84

Thank you so much, Bevdeforges! You've helped me so much, and I really appreciate it.


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