# Getting Residency after 2020, thoughts?



## MikeItMo (Mar 3, 2018)

Being a Brit, I'm weighing up the idea of moving to Portugal pre- or post-Brexit (transition period)
At the moment it seems fairly straightforward while the UK is in this transition period till the end of the year.
However, it might be more realistic for me to move around spring 2021 and this seems much more likely.

Just wondering what people's thoughts are as to the changes and extra obstacles one could encounter after this year...? I realise too that things can change in this transition period. But as things stand at the moment...?


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## proud.to.be.EUROPEAN (Feb 14, 2020)

Pointless question, no offence.

Asking people to throw random thoughts, hoping some will match yours?

Like everyone else, you'll have to wait until end of this year to find out.
None here has crystal ball.


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## Ryan Karan (Mar 8, 2020)

I am in a very similar situation and read somewhere that is very likely if you wish take residency and have sufficient funding to buy property and set yourself up then there you are more than probably still welcome.
Can't remember exactly where I read it while going around in circles.
If I come across it again I will copy the link.


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## Pgmills (Jan 19, 2015)

It is all covered on the SEF.pt website under residency for non eu citizens.


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## suiko (Dec 7, 2015)

Another one in the same position.

Surely the major issue is that after 31 Dec the only option beyond a 90 day stay will be the D7 retirement visa, which will obviously not allow you to work?


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## RichardHenshall (Jul 26, 2009)

https://imigrante.sef.pt/en/solicitar/trabalhar/


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## suiko (Dec 7, 2015)

Muito obrigado, Richard!

Doesn't say anything anywhere, though, about the granting of work visas for non EU citizens. As far as I know, in all EU countries such visas are only ever granted if proof can be provided that no EU citizen is available to do the job. Which, in practical terms, means that no employer will be prepared to undergo the bureaucracy.

I would be working as an EFL teacher, btw.


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## RichardHenshall (Jul 26, 2009)

EU citizens don't require a visa, so if a visa exists it must be for a non-EU citizen.


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## dancebert (Jun 4, 2015)

D7 visa allows you to work remotely for a company not registered in Portugal


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## MikeItMo (Mar 3, 2018)

I'm kind of hoping Brexit will be delayed by a few months.


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## suiko (Dec 7, 2015)

Looking far more like the whole withdrawal agreement will be null and void, rather than any chance of an extension. We're not in a democratic (or indeed rational) situation :-(

Taxation question.... I would be living in Portugal mostly on income from rental in the UK. What rate would this be taxed at in Portugal?


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## Pgmills (Jan 19, 2015)

suiko said:


> Looking far more like the whole withdrawal agreement will be null and void, rather than any chance of an extension. We're not in a democratic (or indeed rational) situation :-(
> 
> Taxation question.... I would be living in Portugal mostly on income from rental in the UK. What rate would this be taxed at in Portugal?


How have you come to that conclusion? Why would the WA become void?

As for your tax question the answer is dependant upon the level of your income and ranges from 14.5% to 48% less an allowance for any tax deducted at source in the UK.


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## suiko (Dec 7, 2015)

Certainly looks like Johnson is running down the time in the hope of a no-deal Brexit, no? Which is of course what most of his party wanted all along.

Thanks for the tax info. Under the double tax convention it seems that rental income is taxable in the country where it's earned - so presumably no tax liability in Portugal?


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## Pgmills (Jan 19, 2015)

suiko said:


> Certainly looks like Johnson is running down the time in the hope of a no-deal Brexit, no? Which is of course what most of his party wanted all along.
> 
> Thanks for the tax info. Under the double tax convention it seems that rental income is taxable in the country where it's earned - so presumably no tax liability in Portugal?


Ah, I thought so. A common mistake to confuse “no deal” with “no withdrawal agreement”. The WA is in place and remains so even if a trade deal is not agreed.

Regarding tax: Your prime liability is to PT for your tax. The DT agreement simply allows you to reduce your PT liability to the extent of any tax suffered in the UK.. Thus if the PT calculation gives you a liability less than the UK tax deducted then you have no PT liability (and indeed no refund claimable from the UK), if the PT calculation gives a higher amount of tax due than you have paid in the UK then you must pay PT the top up amount.


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## RichardHenshall (Jul 26, 2009)

suiko said:


> ... I would be living in Portugal mostly on income from rental in the UK. What rate would this be taxed at in Portugal?


As stated this would be taxable by the UK first, though actual tax paid will be reduced by any personal tax allowance.

Signing up to the NHR scheme as a new resident may reduce or eliminate your liability to Portuguese tax on certain forms of income.

Marginal rates in both countries depend on the amount of income.


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## suiko (Dec 7, 2015)

Pgmills said:


> Ah, I thought so. A common mistake to confuse “no deal” with “no withdrawal agreement”. The WA is in place and remains so even if a trade deal is not agreed.


OK. I was under the impression that the WA would not apply unless some kind of deal is signed. In that case why is there still total uncertainty about the status of UK citizens in EU countries?

Richard - sorry, what's NHR?


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## RichardHenshall (Jul 26, 2009)

http://info.portaldasfinancas.gov.p...olhetos_informativos/Documents/IRS_RNH_PT.pdf

I understand that there have been changes to the rates of tax as a result of this year's state budget that may not be reflected in the above document which is dated December 2019.


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## Pgmills (Jan 19, 2015)

UK media are confusing a lot of people on this by using the expression “no deal”. The WA has been enacted in both the UK and EU. The citizens rights therein are secure but there are some extant rights, such as freedom of movement from your host country to another EU country, that will fall away. 
Much as I have issues with some of their campaigning tactics, BritsinEurope.org have a pretty good summary of WA rights and responsibilities.


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## suiko (Dec 7, 2015)

Thanks for the explanation. Strangely, searching for "BritsinEurope" the first match seems to be an Indonesian online gambling site - strangely appropriate, perhaps 

In your opinion, does it actually make a lot of difference if one moves to Portugal this year or afterwards on a D7 visa?

I think as far as the further freedom of movement issue goes that's probably dead in the water.


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## Pgmills (Jan 19, 2015)

There are some really significant differences between moving to a EU country as a UK citizen before and after 31-12-2020. Not least Of these are the requirements to renew a D7 visa every 2 years after the first year renewal plus of course the income requirements.


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## suiko (Dec 7, 2015)

Thanks. What are the main other ones?


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## Pgmills (Jan 19, 2015)

suiko said:


> Thanks. What are the main other ones?


Cost
Process
Length of time permitted out of the country whilst still retaining rights

A simple internet search will give you a full compare and contrast I suspect.


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## MikeItMo (Mar 3, 2018)

A question occurred to me re. times of moving and registering- 
Is/would one be within the residency qualifying period only if one satisfies the 3 months before the 31 Dec 2020, ie submitting documents on or before that date, (so having a rental contract dated no later than 31 September? 
Or would one qualify if got a rental contract (say) on 15 November (say), and then registered for residency three months hence - 15 February?


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## Pgmills (Jan 19, 2015)

You just have to be legally resident by 31 December,


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