# Rogue Plumbers and leaking taps: any laws to deal with unsatisfied client?



## Mac Anthony123 (Oct 21, 2013)

(To start with, my Spanish isn't that great. I probably speak intermediate level and never bother to conjugate. I feel the plumber capitalized on this. Read on)

I had a plumber over to fix a leaking tap. To get it done, there is a number I call and they source for plumber around, who are available (and willing) to fix it at said time. My flat had two leaking taps that needed changing along with two radiators leaking at the knob, and a leaking knob next to the cistern. All in all the plumber rate was 400 euros (to purchase the parts and fix the items). I remember him clearly saying the cost of the two taps was around 290 Euros. I felt it was too much, but my landlord (who actually accepted the cost) said we should just accept it.

Besides some dispute about what he should or should not have fixed, the plumber left the place in a mess (something that most technicians seem to do these days.. a topic for another day, is that normal in Spain?). 

While trying to clean up the mess, I noticed one of the boxes still had the price tag on 35 Euros and he had charged me 120 Euros for that (I still paid service charge)!!!!

I intend to call the company that sourced for the plumber for me to complain...but I feel they will not do anything unless there is somewhere I can take them up to. Are there any bodies in Spain one can call to complain? 

This feels like daylight robbery.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

There is a well organised complaints system in Spain. Just go to the local authority's OMIC office and complain.


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## Mac Anthony123 (Oct 21, 2013)

baldilocks said:


> There is a well organised complaints system in Spain. Just go to the local authority's OMIC office and complain.


Thanks. But do they do anything? I complained some months ago about some 3rd party service deducting money from my account and they are yet to revert.


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## kaipa (Aug 3, 2013)

Not sure how you can be intermediate level and not conjugate verbs!!.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

I suspect that if you use any kind of intermediary company to source a tradesman to do work for you, it is likely to cost substantially more than finding a trustworthy local tradesman (which we have always done by asking neighbours for recommendations) and dealing with them directly. The intermediary company has to make their profit, on top of whatever the tradesman charges. You are paying for the convenience of being able to go to one place to find whatever kind of tradesman you need, and that costs.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Lynn R said:


> I suspect that if you use any kind of intermediary company to source a tradesman to do work for you, it is likely to cost substantially more than finding a trustworthy local tradesman (which we have always done by asking neighbours for recommendations) and dealing with them directly. The intermediary company has to make their profit, on top of whatever the tradesman charges. You are paying for the convenience of being able to go to one place to find whatever kind of tradesman you need, and that costs.


No difference in U.K. most of these intermediary companies are nothing more than advertising sites.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Megsmum said:


> No difference in U.K. most of these intermediary companies are nothing more than advertising sites.


Yes - and if the client does not pay a fee up front to the intermediary company, then the company will charge a fee to the tradesman to be registered with them - which, of course, gets passed on to the client.


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## tarot650 (Sep 30, 2007)

Lynn R said:


> I suspect that if you use any kind of intermediary company to source a tradesman to do work for you, it is likely to cost substantially more than finding a trustworthy local tradesman (which we have always done by asking neighbours for recommendations) and dealing with them directly. The intermediary company has to make their profit, on top of whatever the tradesman charges. You are paying for the convenience of being able to go to one place to find whatever kind of tradesman you need, and that costs.


Oh that's wonderful advice Lynn girl.For those of us who own our own home but what about those who live in rented accomodation,catch 22 situation for them.The OP said the landlord had accepted it so I woud put it down to a learning curve of lving in Spain.I am certain it's not the first time people have been caught out and it certainly won't be the last.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

tarot650 said:


> Oh that's wonderful advice Lynn girl.For those of us who own our own home but what about those who live in rented accomodation,catch 22 situation for them.The OP said the landlord had accepted it so I woud put it down to a learning curve of lving in Spain.I am certain it's not the first time people have been caught out and it certainly won't be the last.


Don't people who live in rented accommodation have neighbours, then?


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Mac Anthony123 said:


> Thanks. But do they do anything? I complained some months ago about some 3rd party service deducting money from my account and they are yet to revert.


I have only been to the OMIC once about a problem with my phone and they said it was going to take about 3 months...
The firm that you dealt with should have a way of dealing with complaints... It is difficult if you don't speak Spanish. On the other hand, if the landlord is going to pay and isn't prepared to make the complaint maybe you should just leave it.


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## tarot650 (Sep 30, 2007)

Lynn R said:


> Don't people who live in rented accommodation have neighbours, then?


Don't be silly of course they do.LOL But what happens if they give you a reccommendation and the LL doesn't accept it you are back to square one to find another quote.In all honesty I am surprised the landlord didn't sort this out .We know people here who have had reccommendations for jobs only to find that the people reccommended are related to them.


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## tarot650 (Sep 30, 2007)

Pesky Wesky said:


> I have only been to the OMIC once about a problem with my phone and they said it was going to take about 3 months...
> The firm that you dealt with should have a way of dealing with complaints... It is difficult if you don't speak Spanish. On the other hand, if the landlord is going to pay and isn't prepared to make the complaint maybe you should just leave it.


When we bought the bar all those years ago we went through with the owner about the licenses and everything and he showed us the complaints book which we duly asked about and he said if anybody is not happy with anything they put it in this book .In shear panic asked when they check them and he replied,they never check them it's just something you have to have which I found strange but true.


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## Mac Anthony123 (Oct 21, 2013)

..but the key word is "Never bother to conjugate". It just doesnt roll of the tongue naturally although it is something under pressure, I think, I do.


kaipa said:


> Not sure how you can be intermediate level and not conjugate verbs!!.


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## Mac Anthony123 (Oct 21, 2013)

I actually use them often and their rates are similar to that of the local tradesman.



Lynn R said:


> I suspect that if you use any kind of intermediary company to source a tradesman to do work for you, it is likely to cost substantially more than finding a trustworthy local tradesman (which we have always done by asking neighbours for recommendations) and dealing with them directly. The intermediary company has to make their profit, on top of whatever the tradesman charges. You are paying for the convenience of being able to go to one place to find whatever kind of tradesman you need, and that costs.


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## Mac Anthony123 (Oct 21, 2013)

For us, we do...but haven't had any conversations with any beyond chit-chats about the weather. Partly to do with their age, and also the language barrier. We do say hi on the elevator though. 


Lynn R said:


> Don't people who live in rented accommodation have neighbours, then?


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## Mac Anthony123 (Oct 21, 2013)

I am lucky in that my landlord is quite well to do, owning a large travel agency. He always tells me to fix things and he deducts from the running balance of my rent and bills. Works quite well, but this leaves me susceptible to unscrupulous characters.



tarot650 said:


> Don't be silly of course they do.LOL But what happens if they give you a reccommendation and the LL doesn't accept it you are back to square one to find another quote.In all honesty I am surprised the landlord didn't sort this out .We know people here who have had reccommendations for jobs only to find that the people reccommended are related to them.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

We've built up a network of local tradesmen through personal recommendation and become friends on Facebook. Now all we have to do is send them a Whatsapp and they'll come round, often the same day. When we needed a new kitchen tap, we bought it ourselves and Super-Juan fitted it for €5.

It helps living in a small town where everyone knows each other. If someone did a bad job or ripped off a customer, word would get round in no time.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Lynn R said:


> Don't people who live in rented accommodation have neighbours, then?


Yes, Spanish neighbours even, and some are old women with big dogs..

We've lived in our rented house for close to ten years now and as our rent is roughly a third of the local going rate and our landlord has become a friend we consider it fair to do most repairs ourselves. We wouldn't do big structural repairs but we see to plumbing and electrical repairs and replace white goods. Last year we paid for a new swimming pool pump.

When we first arrived in Spain we vowed we'd never make the same mistakes as in Prague and of course we did. We were badly ripped off in the first few months. But as we got more settled, spoke -and understood - reasonable Spanish and got to know people in the village we acquired contacts for whatever we needed doing, all with sound local reputations and reasonable prices. Most of these tradesmen seem to think it beneath their dignity to rip off an old guiri.

It was having these contacts that helped me recently in a difficult situation (that some of you know about) and helped make what could have been a bureaucratic nightmare into a smooth and simple experience.

Getting 'enchufada' takes time but most of us get there in the end after in my case an initial few rough months.


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

mrypg9 said:


> Yes, Spanish neighbours even, and some are old women with big dogs..
> 
> We've lived in our rented house for close to ten years now and as our rent is roughly a third of the local going rate and our landlord has become a friend we consider it fair to do most repairs ourselves. We wouldn't do big structural repairs but we see to plumbing and electrical repairs and replace white goods. Last year we paid for a new swimming pool pump.
> 
> ...


So did we get ripped off after we first arrived - by the classic British self-styled "builder" who went all out to "befriend" us when of course they just regard us as an easy mark. Asking neighbours for recommendations proved much more reliable and a great deal cheaper - and I am well aware that if not actually related, then those recommended are highly likely to be at least friends, members of the same cofradio, etc. of the person providing the recommendation. That has never proved a problem, and it seems to me that if the tradesman has been recommended by a relative or friend who knows us, they are anxious not to let down the person who provided the recommendation by doing a poor job or over-charging. We have gone on to recommend them to other British people who ask us if we know a good electrician, painter, etc. so they know they are likely to get other work that way. Word of mouth is the best advertising.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

€5 seems like slave labour, the poor guy must be desperate. I would have given him more but perhaps should be in tipping.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Isobella said:


> €5 seems like slave labour, the poor guy must be desperate. I would have given him more but perhaps should be in tipping.


I agree and I did offer him more, but he wouldn't take it as it only took him 15 minutes. So I get a tin of Cadbury's chocolates for his family when I go to Gibraltar, they like that.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Lynn R said:


> I suspect that if you use any kind of intermediary company to source a tradesman to do work for you, it is likely to cost substantially more than finding a trustworthy local tradesman (which we have always done by asking neighbours for recommendations) and dealing with them directly. The intermediary company has to make their profit, on top of whatever the tradesman charges. You are paying for the convenience of being able to go to one place to find whatever kind of tradesman you need, and that costs.


Very true. We had a plumbing incident last week, water coming through ceiling. Rang two local plumbers and despite having an emergency tel no. Neither got back to me when I left a message. Tried 3 others but none could come the same day. Found one who serviçes the whole of West Sussex who could come within a few hours. Cost £79+VAT which included an hours work. He came but told me he wouldn't be doing any work as the fuel tank had fallen off when he drove over a speed bump in our lane!! Two fire engines came as diesel running along lane, closed off to traffic for two hours. Was then after 6pm and he said office would call at 8am. They didn't. Cancelled and called British Gas and they came within an hour.

We did once have some roof tiles replaced free from a golfing friend. Was an insurance job as apple tree fell on the corner. Was quoted £525 by a company but we had £250 excess. As we needed two quotes asked friend and he said get the tiles and I will do it. He wouldn't take anything so bought him some golf balls, cost £20


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## Lynn R (Feb 21, 2014)

Isobella said:


> Very true. We had a plumbing incident last week, water coming through ceiling. Rang two local plumbers and despite having an emergency tel no. Neither got back to me when I left a message. Tried 3 others but none could come the same day. Found one who serviçes the whole of West Sussex who could come within a few hours. Cost £79+VAT which included an hours work. He came but told me he wouldn't be doing any work as the fuel tank had fallen off when he drove over a speed bump in our lane!! Two fire engines came as diesel running along lane, closed off to traffic for two hours. Was then after 6pm and he said office would call at 8am. They didn't. Cancelled and called British Gas and they came within an hour.
> 
> We did once have some roof tiles replaced free from a golfing friend. Was an insurance job as apple tree fell on the corner. Was quoted £525 by a company but we had £250 excess. As we needed two quotes asked friend and he said get the tiles and I will do it. He wouldn't take anything so bought him some golf balls, cost £20


What a nightmare. Getting a friend to do the job is often the best way, if you're lucky enough to have one with the right skills. 

We have made a couple of insurance claims here and after reporting it to the company they have sent someone to do the repair, without us having to obtain quotes, and the people they sent have done a good job. The policy didn't have any excess. Do UK insurance companies offer this service?


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Lynn R said:


> What a nightmare. Getting a friend to do the job is often the best way, if you're lucky enough to have one with the right skills.
> 
> We have made a couple of insurance claims here and after reporting it to the company they have sent someone to do the repair, without us having to obtain quotes, and the people they sent have done a good job. The policy didn't have any excess. Do UK insurance companies offer this service?


Yes the home insurance has been very good up to now. We were given a choice so after the experience with plumbers decided to use their in house service, they are going to replace the whole ceiling and it is 7x7.5 metres.. The carpet will be replaced too but this is different, we have had to supply one quote and the money will be transfered to us, :fingerscrossed:


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

tarot650 said:


> When we bought the bar all those years ago we went through with the owner about the licenses and everything and he showed us the complaints book which we duly asked about and he said if anybody is not happy with anything they put it in this book .In shear panic asked when they check them and he replied,they never check them it's just something you have to have which I found strange but true.


It is different now, not really a book, consists of A4 sized forms and called la hoja de reclamaciones. There are three copies, one for the business, one for you and one for the dept. de consumidores. I had my car serviced at a garage in Fuengirola perfect when it went in wouldn't start when I got it back (no battery problem) I went back to garage and they said it wasn't their fault so I asked for la hoja. The owner was very nasty but two days later he rang up and said to bring it in. All sorted.

Here is a link to forms, note it is in English too

http://www.madrid.org/cs/Satellite?...goBlobs&blobwhere=1352957545892&ssbinary=true


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