# Leaving and re-entering Spain without a Schengen visa or residence card



## redhowe (Aug 19, 2012)

Hi all,

Difficult to express this effectively in the title but, in summary:

- I'm British with a NIE
- My wife was recently denied a residence card so we've asked the 'subdelegacion ..." to provide us with a better decision
- We've soon been in Spain 6 months, my wife entering on a 3-month tourist visa
- The residence card was denied, frankly, because they were lazy - I work for a small UK company and get paid into a UK bank account (because the company is small they find the cost of paying salaries abroad prohibitive). As we're not a typical case they appeared not to know what more documentation to ask for that would satisfy new "income requirements" (everything they requested I gave them)

We're confident the residence card will come through eventually but, in the meantime, would like to travel to the UK to visit my mother. Can we get an exit and re-entry permit if we demonstrate that we've submitted documentation and are awaiting a revised decision?

Thanks!
Rob


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

redhowe said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Difficult to express this effectively in the title but, in summary:
> 
> ...


have YOU registered as resident?

if not, then your wife can't exercise her treaty rights as spouse of a resident

for income requirements they want to see payments into a Spanish bank account, not unreasonably imo, so setting up a regular bank transfer would solve that problem


as to whether you can get ''an exit and re-entry permit'', I have no idea if such a thing exists - you really need to talk to an abogado who knows about immigration issues

is your case subject to an appeal of some kind atm?


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

redhowe said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Difficult to express this effectively in the title but, in summary:
> 
> ...


It is my understanding that, as a EU citizen, you can come and go as you wish as long as you don't stay beyond the time for which you are required to become resident (3 months). However a non-EU citizen may need visas, entry permits, etc. Why the question? Is your wife a non-EU citizen?


----------



## redhowe (Aug 19, 2012)

xabiachica said:


> have YOU registered as resident?
> 
> if not, then your wife can't exercise her treaty rights as spouse of a resident
> 
> ...


Yes, I am registered and have a NIE, we both have empadronamiento and a joint bank account. Savings isn't an issue as we transferred savings into our Spanish bank account.

Thanks for the suggestion regarding a regular bank transfer - I'll ensure I transfer all my further salary as soon as it's paid into my UK bank account - great idea.

We have the help of an abogado (friend of a friend) and he's said that it's not at the appeal stage, more a request for a revised decision.

Thanks,
Rob


----------



## redhowe (Aug 19, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> It is my understanding that, as a EU citizen, you can come and go as you wish as long as you don't stay beyond the time for which you are required to become resident (3 months). However a non-EU citizen may need visas, entry permits, etc. Why the question? Is your wife a non-EU citizen?


I appreciate that I can come-and-go as I please - which I've had to do for work - but I would like my wife to join me (my wife is non-EU) and she's still waiting for an 'improved' decision on a residence card application.

Thanks,
Rob


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> It is my understanding that, as a EU citizen, you can come and go as you wish as long as you don't stay beyond the time for which you are required to become resident (3 months). However a non-EU citizen may need visas, entry permits, etc. Why the question? Is your wife a non-EU citizen?


yes, from the OP's earlier posts, his wife isn't an EU citizen


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> yes, from the OP's earlier posts, his wife isn't an EU citizen


Sorry, it doesn't say that on this thread and I wasn't aware of the earlier posts. This is one of the points raised on another thread of insufficiant info being given resulting in an OP getting unsatisfactory responses.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

baldilocks said:


> Sorry, it doesn't say that on this thread and I wasn't aware of the earlier posts. This is one of the points raised on another thread of insufficiant info being given resulting in an OP getting unsatisfactory responses.


fairynuff

I didn't look back on the old posts until you mentioned it - it was the '3 month tourist visa' comment which gave me the clue


----------



## redhowe (Aug 19, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> Sorry, it doesn't say that on this thread and I wasn't aware of the earlier posts. This is one of the points raised on another thread of insufficiant info being given resulting in an OP getting unsatisfactory responses.


Yes, I'm sorry about that - my wife is Vietnamese and we've been married for over 2 years.

Where is the other thread by the way?

Thanks,
Rob


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

redhowe said:


> Yes, I'm sorry about that - my wife is Vietnamese and we've been married for over 2 years.
> 
> Where is the other thread by the way?
> 
> ...


It was a long thread on the French forum where the OP got upset about some responses she got when she had not declared certain information that was highly relevant to the question she asked. The thread has now closed.

There are some of we old hands on here who do switch between country forums because similar questions arise on different forums and we gain information from one country's forums that may be relevant to another.


----------



## redhowe (Aug 19, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> It was a long thread on the French forum where the OP got upset about some responses she got when she had not declared certain information that was highly relevant to the question she asked. The thread has now closed.
> 
> There are some of we old hands on here who do switch between country forums because similar questions arise on different forums and we gain information from one country's forums that may be relevant to another.


I appreciate any help I can get - the other reply here suggested periodic payments which I'll implement straight away. My annoyance with the denied residence card is that they had an opportunity to request further information from me but nothing... just a denied/declined letter. I had previously written to the EU (Europa) website and they said the evidence I'd provided was sufficient. I'm about to get SOLVIT involved if necessary.

Thanks again,
Rob


----------



## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> for income requirements they want to see payments into a Spanish bank account, not unreasonably imo,?


I can't imagine that requirement wouldn't violate the EU rules. The EU has been trying to create an Euro wide banking system for years. Stuff like this would be a step backwards.

There shouldn't be a real difference between any Eurozone banks. The point of things like the Single Euro Payment Area was to make it easier for people to avoid needing local bank accounts.


----------



## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

NickZ said:


> I can't imagine that requirement wouldn't violate the EU rules. The EU has been trying to create an Euro wide banking system for years. Stuff like this would be a step backwards.
> 
> There shouldn't be a real difference between any Eurozone banks. The point of things like the Single Euro Payment Area was to make it easier for people to avoid needing local bank accounts.


This wouldn't help the OP, of course, as UK is NOT in the eurozone!


----------



## redhowe (Aug 19, 2012)

NickZ said:


> I can't imagine that requirement wouldn't violate the EU rules. The EU has been trying to create an Euro wide banking system for years. Stuff like this would be a step backwards.
> 
> There shouldn't be a real difference between any Eurozone banks. The point of things like the Single Euro Payment Area was to make it easier for people to avoid needing local bank accounts.


Precisely my reason for getting SOLVIT involved to be honest - my abogado provides advice but I think SOLVIT get involved in order to resolve issues where necessary.

Rob


----------



## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> This wouldn't help the OP, of course, as UK is NOT in the eurozone!


But it's still in both the Euro payment area and the EU.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

NickZ said:


> I can't imagine that requirement wouldn't violate the EU rules. The EU has been trying to create an Euro wide banking system for years. Stuff like this would be a step backwards.
> 
> There shouldn't be a real difference between any Eurozone banks. The point of things like the Single Euro Payment Area was to make it easier for people to avoid needing local bank accounts.


possibly it would violate some rule or other

but if you're living in a country why wouldn't you have a bank account there?

& it's not as if they ask for megabucks to be in the account


----------



## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

xabiachica said:


> but if you're living in a country why wouldn't you have a bank account there?
> 
> t


It's no different then any other product. If you find it better/cheaper/more convenient to buy the product from elsewhere in the EU you should be able to. 

Change the question. Imagine if the government told people to only buy cars built in Spain?


----------



## redhowe (Aug 19, 2012)

xabiachica said:


> possibly it would violate some rule or other
> 
> but if you're living in a country why wouldn't you have a bank account there?
> 
> & it's not as if they ask for megabucks to be in the account


I think the interesting thing here is that they recognise assets, by way of savings, stored in a non-Spanish account for tax purposes but they don't recognise deposits made into that same account for the purpose of demonstrating an income :-(.


----------



## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

redhowe said:


> I think the interesting thing here is that they recognise assets, by way of savings, stored in a non-Spanish account for tax purposes but they don't recognise deposits made into that same account for the purpose of demonstrating an income :-(.


Correct , always the argument I use. You can't have it both ways.


----------

