# Married in Italy



## miyoung

Hello everyone!

I am a US citizen that recently married an Italian citizen in Italy. At the end of the ceremony we received a booklet called "Libretto di Famiglia Internazionale." It is written in 3 languages but unfortunately none of them are English. I have two question.

1. Is this booklet a sort of family registry similar to the Koseki in Japan? 
Definition of Koseki (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koseki)
2. Will the booklet still be valid if I write English translations in it?

I also have a few questions about the marriage certificate.
We also received a document that I first thought was our marriage certificate but was not. (It was title "celebrazione di martrimonio"). 
1. Does anyone know how long it takes to receive the actual marriage certificate? (They didn't tell us)
2. I know I have to get a apostille before I can register the marriage with the US embassy. Does anyone know if I have to get the apostille directly on the original, or will a copy be good enough? (I really don't like the thought of adding anything to the certificate itself)

Thank you for reading my questions and for any answers I receive.

:wave:


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## Bevdeforges

I suspect the Libretto di Familglia is roughly the same as the Livret de Famille we have here in France. And basically, it is your "proof of marriage" - you should not be the one to fill in anything on the booklet. When you have children, it's the local town hall or other government office that adds the information to the booklet. (Obviously, if things are done differently in Italy, someone will pipe in here.) But for your purposes, this IS your marriage certificate. Hang onto it carefully and don't write anything in it yourself.

You don't need to register your marriage with the US Embassy (or Consulate) at all. The Italian officials may or may not have notified the Consulate of your marriage, but if they didn't, there's nothing in particular you have to do. No apostille or anything. Marriages overseas do not have to be registered. Only births to an American parent should be - though even that isn't necessary. (It only simplifies things later for the child involved.)
Cheers,
Bev


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## accbgb

At least some of your questions might be answered here: Getting Married in Italy | United States Diplomatic Mission to Italy


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## miyoung

Thank you for your reply. I actually have been using that page since I got engaged. Unfortunately, none of my questions are answered there. For example, they talk about registering your marriage but they never say much about getting the apostille directly on the original or on a copy. They also do not mention anything about the booklet. I will try to contact them about changing my name and I think in that, they will give me some of the information I need (since it all overlaps).


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## miyoung

Bevdeforges said:


> I suspect the Libretto di Familglia is roughly the same as the Livret de Famille we have here in France. And basically, it is your "proof of marriage" - you should not be the one to fill in anything on the booklet. When you have children, it's the local town hall or other government office that adds the information to the booklet. (Obviously, if things are done differently in Italy, someone will pipe in here.) But for your purposes, this IS your marriage certificate. Hang onto it carefully and don't write anything in it yourself.
> 
> You don't need to register your marriage with the US Embassy (or Consulate) at all. The Italian officials may or may not have notified the Consulate of your marriage, but if they didn't, there's nothing in particular you have to do. No apostille or anything. Marriages overseas do not have to be registered. Only births to an American parent should be - though even that isn't necessary. (It only simplifies things later for the child involved.)
> Cheers,
> Bev


Thank you for your reply! This is good to know. I checked the cover of the booklet and it is, indeed, the same as the one in France. It has French translations of the entries, which is the only reason I can verify this. 
Now I know not to write in it. I do wish they had English though. Since I am studying Italian I can understand some of it, but not all and that is frustrating.

It would be a great help if town hall does, in fact, contact my embassy for me. I would like to change my name and I think I have to do it there. I think I will look on their website for more information about this process.


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## Bevdeforges

For US purposes, you don't have to do much of anything to change your name. Next time your passport comes up for renewal, just ask for the name change (and I believe you need to send a copy of your marriage certificate). 

But the apostille is only for those cases where you need to produce a "validated" marriage certificate. I suppose one example might be if you were going to apply to sponsor your Italian spouse for a visa for the US. 

But see the US Embassy pages on name changes in passports: Name Changes | United States Diplomatic Mission to Italy There is nothing about getting the marriage documents apostilled.
Cheers,
Bev


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## miyoung

Bevdeforges said:


> For US purposes, you don't have to do much of anything to change your name. Next time your passport comes up for renewal, just ask for the name change (and I believe you need to send a copy of your marriage certificate).
> 
> But the apostille is only for those cases where you need to produce a "validated" marriage certificate. I suppose one example might be if you were going to apply to sponsor your Italian spouse for a visa for the US.
> 
> But see the US Embassy pages on name changes in passports: Name Changes | United States Diplomatic Mission to Italy There is nothing about getting the marriage documents apostilled.
> Cheers,
> Bev


Thank you for your help. I thought the process was closer to when you want to legally change your first name. Now I see it's actually a little easier.


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## accbgb

Italy does not have a process for legal name change after marriage; your legal name in Italy is the name you were born with, and remains as such until the day you die. It is the name which appears on your driver's license, your passport, your health card, etc.


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## miyoung

accbgb said:


> Italy does not have a process for legal name change after marriage; your legal name in Italy is the name you were born with, and remains as such until the day you die. It is the name which appears on your driver's license, your passport, your health card, etc.


Thank you again for your reply. 

To be honest I am talking about changing my name under US law, not under Italian law. But just to address your statement, my husband told me that there _is_ a process to change your last name in Italy and that anyone can do it, even him. He also said that after the feminism movement here that all of the women stopped changing their last names and now it is the norm. 


BTW, thank you for giving my first opportunity to say "my husband"


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## BBCWatcher

If the "feminism movement" is to blame it's a very old movement.

No, not "anyone can do it." An Italian judge needs to order a name change, in a competent court. Changing one's name requires some justification for cause. Is your current surname "shameful," for example?

You're welcome to have a different legal name in a different country. I wouldn't recommend it. It can get complicated very quickly.


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## miyoung

BBCWatcher said:


> If the "feminism movement" is to blame it's a very old movement.
> 
> No, not "anyone can do it." An Italian judge needs to order a name change, in a competent court. Changing one's name requires some justification for cause. Is your current surname "shameful," for example?
> 
> You're welcome to have a different legal name in a different country. I wouldn't recommend it. It can get complicated very quickly.


I must write an apology to accbgb. After I wrote my response to your post about legally changing you name in Italy I questioned my husband further. He "thought" that anyone can change their name because he had some friends that changed their last name because it was a curse word (similar to what BBCWatcher jyst wrote). I let him know that those are two different things. 

So you are right, you cannot change your name for marriage. I did research and found out that if a US citizen gets married overseas, they have to follow the process of changing their name on their social security card first, before they can change it anywhere else. So I will begin there. 

Thank you both for all of your helpful answers. This is all so new to me.


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## accbgb

LOL; no need to apologize.

Before you jump into changing your name in the US, please consider BBCWatcher's comment that, "I wouldn't recommend it. It can get complicated very quickly."

I don't want to put words in his mouth, but there is much to think about here. Do you and your husband intend to remain in Italy for an extended period, perhaps many years? Do you intend to work in Italy? Do you intend to become an Italian citizen soon after the law permits (I think after two years of marriage if residing in Italy)?

In any of these cases (and many others too numerous to mention), you will find life far simpler if your US documents such as passport, driver's license, social security records, all show the same name as your legal name in Italy - which as already mentioned, will always be your birth name.

You can always change your US name if and when you decide to move permanently to the US; until then, I wouldn't bother.

BTW, although your name for legal purposes (in Italy) will always be your birth name, there are different mores for social situations. It is commonplace, for example, when Jane Smith weds John Jones for the woman to refer to herself as Jane Smith _in_ Jones and for her to be addressed as La Signora Jones.


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## miyoung

accbgb said:


> LOL; no need to apologize.
> 
> Before you jump into changing your name in the US, please consider BBCWatcher's comment that, "I wouldn't recommend it. It can get complicated very quickly."
> 
> I don't want to put words in his mouth, but there is much to think about here. Do you and your husband intend to remain in Italy for an extended period, perhaps many years? Do you intend to work in Italy? Do you intend to become an Italian citizen soon after the law permits (I think after two years of marriage if residing in Italy)?
> 
> In any of these cases (and many others too numerous to mention), you will find life far simpler if your US documents such as passport, driver's license, social security records, all show the same name as your legal name in Italy - which as already mentioned, will always be your birth name.
> 
> You can always change your US name if and when you decide to move permanently to the US; until then, I wouldn't bother.
> 
> BTW, although your name for legal purposes (in Italy) will always be your birth name, there are different mores for social situations. It is commonplace, for example, when Jane Smith weds John Jones for the woman to refer to herself as Jane Smith _in_ Jones and for her to be addressed as La Signora Jones.


Thank you for the advice. Many, many people have told me the exact same thing but I was willing to go through the drama. I figured that if it must take time and a lot of paperwork than so be it.

Now (after being discouraged even from the US embassy) I have decided to just keep my birth name until the day that we move to the US permanently. Plus, I don't think we ever will move back to the US permanently so I might as well stick to cultural norms here. 

Thank you both for all of your advice!


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## NickZ

miyoung said:


> 1. Does anyone know how long it takes to receive the actual marriage certificate? (They didn't tell us)
> 2. I know I have to get a apostille before I can register the marriage with the US embassy. Does anyone know if I have to get the apostille directly on the original, or will a copy be good enough? (I really don't like the thought of adding anything to the certificate itself)


The rules changed a few years back.

A simple certificate without the official town stamp is around €1. Unless it's gone up. The one with the stamp is more. I can't remember how much but I think less then 20. You should be able to get a simple one in the time it takes to stand in line. Unless it needs the mayors signature then you'll have to go back to pick it up.

Either way it should just be a matter of going to the office and paying the fee. No reason to wait.


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