# Residence permit



## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

I know there are many people writing about this; I also know nothing is clear from the authorities' point of view, be it national or regional. However, I'd like to get opinions.
I'm a British citizen, like the vast majority of others on this forum I think. I came to the Malaga region after a contract in Sri Lanka a few weeks ago and am renting property. I suppose I'm unemployed: an academic is unlikely to get another job at the age of 63, despite all the age discrimination laws in the world. I have one question relating to the preceding and one relating to the next statement:
1: for a residencia, do I have to provide proof of medical health insurance, despite the fact that I should be entitled to NHS healthcare in the UK?
2: my partner is Sri Lankan. She is coming over with her son in a month's time on a tourist visa. We want them to stay in the country. I recognise it would be easier if we were married, but what proof can we give that we actually are long-term partners rather than just opportunistic, which will persuade the authorities? We've lived together for a couple of years but I can't provide any proof of that, other than bank statements to the address we shared (a house she owns in Sri Lanka; no, it's not valued the equivalent of the minimum requirement here). I would be happy to marry, as would she; but is it strictly necessary? And if we marry, what's ourmstatus in Spanish and UK law? 
Many thanks for your feedback.


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

hello and welcome!

In answer to your first question. I'm a little out of the loop on these things but I'm sure that one of the experts on here will correct me if I am wrong. You can – or could – pertain form from the UK government – DWP which entitled you if you were before retirement age to Spanish health care paid for by the UK government for a period of time of up to a maximum of two years dependent on your National Insurance contributions. I am not sure if this in itself would be enough to convince the authorities that you have the appropriate medical cover, however in your case if you are aged 63 then in the event that the UK gave you the full two years entitlement this would take you up until the age of 65 which would then put you in the pension category and I believe you can then obtain the S1 form in order to satisfy the requirements.

With regard to the marriage situation I know that when I stopped being self-employed I already had residency and I was able to retain my healthcare due to the fact that I had previously paid into the Spanish system. However, I was told by the British Consulate and also by the Social Security office here in Spain that if that hadn't been the case I would have been able to class myself as a dependent of my partner who is working despite the fact that we are not married. For this we would have to show that we lived together by means of padron and shared financial interests such as a joint bank account. I am not sure as to how long we would have had to prove we have been together in order to satisfy this requirement and obviously I have the added advantage of being the European who already has residency which I believe cannot be revoked.

Sorry I can't be of any more help but I'm sure that over the coming hours many more people will give you better advice.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

steve_in_spain said:


> hello and welcome!
> 
> In answer to your first question. I'm a little out of the loop on these things but I'm sure that one of the experts on here will correct me if I am wrong. You can – or could – pertain form from the UK government – DWP which entitled you if you were before retirement age to Spanish health care paid for by the UK government for a period of time of up to a maximum of two years dependent on your National Insurance contributions. I am not sure if this in itself would be enough to convince the authorities that you have the appropriate medical cover, however in your case if you are aged 63 then in the event that the UK gave you the full two years entitlement this would take you up until the age of 65 which would then put you in the pension category and I believe you can then obtain the S1 form in order to satisfy the requirements.
> 
> ...


That's great news on both counts - thank you! Perhaps as you say, others will fill in gaps. However, it's encouraging


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## fergie (Oct 4, 2010)

Whether you get the S1 would depend on how long you have been out of UK, I was in a similar situation when I moved to Spain last year Septmber. I had left Uk in 2007 to live in Hong Kong while my husband was working there, as I had been out of UK for more than two years before coming here to Spain, I was not entitled to an S1 form.So, from my arrival here I was covered only with private medical insurance.
This year I was able to claim my state pension, I finally got an S1 form with the pension confirmation,and written on the enclosed letter was to take out some form of private insurance as well, that was from the DWP in Newcastle. We have private health insurance as it happens. 
According to some new rule, that if you buy a Spanish property 160.000 or more then you should be entitled to residencia. That is a very new rule, so it might be worth going to a local gestor, who can help you get residencia, also ask them their advice on the best way for your partner to get permanent residency, as Spain has some strict and complicated rules and red tape. Also to an insurance agent to take out some form of medical insurance for yourself and your partner plus child.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

yes, as Fergie says, you would have to contact the DWP to be sure, but you would have to have recent NI contributions in the UK in order to qualify for an S1 - if you don't you will need private healthcare

as far as the S1 you get upon retirement - that is directly linked to receipt of your UK state pension - so whenever you get qualify for that you will be sent one - it's not linked to age, so if for example you don't get your pension until age 66 for example (it seems to be less cut & dried than it used to be) then you won't get an S1 until then

you will also need to show that you can support yourself financially - I can't say how much that is, since the ruling is new & it seems to vary in different areas


for your partner to be able to register as your dependant I believe you need to show a relationship of two years - the extranjería would be able to tell you for sure though

you will also need to show that you have healthcare provision in place for her & her son & of course that you can financially support them

the announcement a couple of weeks ago about the purchase of property hasn't as yet been ratified & isn't yet clear - though that might be an avenue to explore


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

:-( Not good news anywhere then! It seems I shall have to take out private health insurance for the remainder of my time before actual retirement and also for my partner and step son. As far as the rights connected with buying a house - well, I won't have those either as I'm renting, not buying. I had a financial disaster a few years ago so can't afford to buy.
Thank you everyone for your words of wisdom, though.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

And to add more info: I left the UK for most of the 80's; was there again until 2009; had one year abroad; and was again out for 2 years until now. I didn't pay NI during any of these periods out. Complicated enough for DWP to work it out, but basically it cuts my state pension.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Nomad_uk said:


> :-( Not good news anywhere then! It seems I shall have to take out private health insurance for the remainder of my time before actual retirement and also for my partner and step son. As far as the rights connected with buying a house - well, I won't have those either as I'm renting, not buying. I had a financial disaster a few years ago so can't afford to buy.
> Thank you everyone for your words of wisdom, though.


let us know how you get on - & feel free to ask any more questions


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Nomad_uk said:


> And to add more info: I left the UK for most of the 80's; was there again until 2009; had one year abroad; and was again out for 2 years until now. I didn't pay NI during any of these periods out. Complicated enough for DWP to work it out, but basically it cuts my state pension.


You can buy years that you may have missed (up to 6 I think) get onto DWP at Tyne Valley park, e-mail:
[email protected]


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Thanks again!


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Nomad_uk said:


> And to add more info: I left the UK for most of the 80's; was there again until 2009; had one year abroad; and was again out for 2 years until now. I didn't pay NI during any of these periods out. Complicated enough for DWP to work it out, but basically it cuts my state pension.


 I'm not 100% sure of how they do the calculations regarding your entitlement to take healthcare overseas prior to the age of retirement but I do know that it is not necessarily calculated on your lifetime National Insurance contributions but also on your contributions in recent years.

If you contact the DWP they will be able to give you the definitive answer and I think in this situation there is nobody here that can give you a precise and correct answer but do let us know what they say - good luck!


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

I suppose I was very naive to assume that because we're all members of the E.U, there would be no problem moving anywhere within it. 'Freedom of movement' - isn't that one of its central tenets? If I could afford it, I'd start some sort of appeal to the Commission - but I guess many people have either thought or done that already. I've contacted DWP as suggested, thank you, and will feed back what information I get, particularly if it helps anyone else.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Nomad_uk said:


> I suppose I was very naive to assume that because we're all members of the E.U, there would be no problem moving anywhere within it. 'Freedom of movement' - isn't that one of its central tenets? If I could afford it, I'd start some sort of appeal to the Commission - but I guess many people have either thought or done that already. I've contacted DWP as suggested, thank you, and will feed back what information I get, particularly if it helps anyone else.


freedom of movement yes, but not freedom of residency

the different countries within the EU still have different local rules - in the UK healthcare is residence based & in Spain it's a contribution based system (although that seems to be changing as of last Sept. 1st - all legally registered residents prior to April are now entitled to healthcare)

also - the rules for registering as resident in the UK for other EU citizens are pretty much the same as here in Spain

so there would be no real point to an appeal - you are being treated equally


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Nomad_uk said:


> I suppose I was very naive to assume that because we're all members of the E.U, there would be no problem moving anywhere within it. 'Freedom of movement' - isn't that one of its central tenets? If I could afford it, I'd start some sort of appeal to the Commission - but I guess many people have either thought or done that already. I've contacted DWP as suggested, thank you, and will feed back what information I get, particularly if it helps anyone else.


"The road to hell is paved with good intentions" The intentions of the EU were good but as has become painfully obvious, freedom for the inhabitants of some countries that offer little in the way of support, financial and other, to the unemployed and destitute to move to countries that do, without some form of financial balancing act between those countries results in a situation where the richer country starts on the road to "broke" as is happening in the UK and many other countries.

In the current financial climate countries that are receiving migrants have said that the incomer has to be able to support him/herself and his/her dependants both for living and healthcare or be supported from their home country. Unfortunately the authorities in Spain are finding that many incomers who are supposed to be supported by their home country (e.g. pensioners) are placing an unreasonable burden on those authorities because the incomers' home country either isn't paying or pays too little or is tardy in paying up.

The problem isn't helped by the cheaters, for example those who although they are here full-time aren't registered as residents, or those who illegally drive around in illegal vehicles, or are living here but using an EHIC for healthcare for which the UK refuses to reimburse the Spanish authorities who have been mistakenly accepting the EHIC in good faith with the result that persons who are trying to use the EHIC legally are refused.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Not sure I agree with that. I may be prevented from obtaining residence by a local regulation which says that I have to have private medical insurance, which I can't afford. Whether or not locals or anyone else have to have that, I wouldn't have to have that in the UK. The freedom to transfer anywhere in the E.U should mean that my healthcare from the UK is interchangeable with Spanish healthcare, at no cost. Does a Spaniard have to pay for NHS treatment in the UK? I ask that as a genuine question, not a rhetorical one, as I don't know the answer. However, it is I suppose simply a debating point as I shall find out when I do go for the residencia. By the way, is there any appeal to a higher authority than the municipality - to the provincial or state governments?


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Sorry Baldilocks, your post came in as I was writing my reply so it seems I'm being argumentative - I'm not!


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Nomad_uk said:


> Not sure I agree with that. I may be prevented from obtaining residence by a local regulation which says that I have to have private medical insurance, which I can't afford. Whether or not locals or anyone else have to have that, I wouldn't have to have that in the UK. The freedom to transfer anywhere in the E.U should mean that my healthcare from the UK is interchangeable with Spanish healthcare, at no cost. Does a Spaniard have to pay for NHS treatment in the UK? I ask that as a genuine question, not a rhetorical one, as I don't know the answer. However, it is I suppose simply a debating point as I shall find out when I do go for the residencia. By the way, is there any appeal to a higher authority than the municipality - to the provincial or state governments?


as I said - it's not the freedom to LIVE in any country - it never was - it's the freedom to MOVE BETWEEN those countries

no - there's no appeal - that's what you have to do in order to register as resident - they simply won't register you without

it's a national ruling


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Nomad_uk said:


> Not sure I agree with that. I may be prevented from obtaining residence by a local regulation which says that I have to have private medical insurance, which I can't afford. Whether or not locals or anyone else have to have that, I wouldn't have to have that in the UK. The freedom to transfer anywhere in the E.U should mean that my healthcare from the UK is interchangeable with Spanish healthcare, at no cost. Does a Spaniard have to pay for NHS treatment in the UK? I ask that as a genuine question, not a rhetorical one, as I don't know the answer. However, it is I suppose simply a debating point as I shall find out when I do go for the residencia. By the way, is there any appeal to a higher authority than the municipality - to the provincial or state governments?


The difference is dependent upon the State you are going to and its healthcare system. The UK has a residence based system (if you are permitted to reside there, then you are in the UK healthcare system) but Spain and many other countries have a contribution based system - if you don't pay in or haven't paid in for long enough, you aren't covered and have to make your own arrangements (private insurance).

If however, you are a UK pensioner, then the UK will pay the Spanish authorities for you to be treated the same as a Spanish pensioner which is not necesarily the same as you would get in the UK.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Thanks everyone. My main concern was over the price of the health insurance, and I've had an online quote from a UK company - asking no questions about current health, background or anything - of €290. On another thread, I've just seen premiums of €55 quoted and these are far more realistic. I feel I can breathe more easily now!


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Nomad_uk said:


> Thanks everyone. My main concern was over the price of the health insurance, and I've had an online quote from a UK company - asking no questions about current health, background or anything - of €290. On another thread, I've just seen premiums of €55 quoted and these are far more realistic. I feel I can breathe more easily now!


 it was me that quoted the premiums around about €55 but do bear in mind that if you have any pre-existing medical conditions they will not be covered. I would always avoid UK based insurance companies for health insurance in Spain. When I first came here I have one of these type of policies and after being bitten by a dog I needed urgent care – it was an immediate hospital job yet my insurance company could not confirm because it was not during normal working hours whether or not I was covered and they advised me to go to the hospital and pay and then later submit a claim. My advice to anybody when it comes to health insurance is to use a Spanish system where the hospitals have a good working relationship with the insurer rather than a foreign company where you have to pay in advance. Nevertheless, if you have pre-existing conditions they are likely to inflate the premium like any insurance company. 

The Problem with insurance companies that are based out of Spain is that they usually work on the basis of reimbursing you after the event. Spanish insurers either issue you with vouchers or a card which is simply present when you need any treatment. With a foreign company you need to take the gamble that they will pay after you have initially coughed up the money. In the event of needing something big you have the inconvenience of them having to liaise with the hospital or doctors in order to authorise things and because there are so many foreign companies many of the hospitals are not familiar with how each of the companies work. I know that with my current insurers as they are one of the biggest in Spain they have an enormous network of medical professionals and even if I was to arrive at the hospital in the middle of the night they are able to obtain instantaneous authorisation for anything that I need which means that I do not have the worry of ensuring I take payment with me when I go to the hospital – I should say if I go to the hospital.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Thanks Steve, I saw your name but didn't feel I should quote it in a different thread. Your system sounds exactly the same as in Sri Lanka (I had a card to present), except that there I wasn't covered for outpatient treatment at all - including x-rays - and only for inpatient treatment lasting more than 6 hours. I never used the insurance!


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## xicoalc (Apr 20, 2010)

Nomad_uk said:


> Thanks Steve, I saw your name but didn't feel I should quote it in a different thread. Your system sounds exactly the same as in Sri Lanka (I had a card to present), except that there I wasn't covered for outpatient treatment at all - including x-rays - and only for inpatient treatment lasting more than 6 hours. I never used the insurance!


6 hours? crikey this is spain - you are in for 6 hours for an x ray lol

here its pretty comprehensive – I have unlimited general Dr, doctor in the home if I am unable to travel, private ambulances, unlimited hospitalisation including all of the tests such as x-rays – MRI scans – and the more advanced diagnostic imaging, and if I am unfortunate enough to need intensive care they will pay for it for as long as the doctor believes that there is a realistic chance of me pulling through.

I'm not one to claim anyway – just like you, I'm fairly healthy apart from the usual ailments which you tend to get as you end your 20s and move into the pension age of 30s but it is nice to know that the cover is there. My mother-in-law who is Spanish and relies on the state healthcare system was recently referred for an MRI scan of her brain after suffering many months of intense headaches. This was not just a general doctor that referred her – it was a neurologist but after a month of waiting she received a letter from the radiography department to say that they have no money and therefore are only giving these scams to the most important of cases and they did not believe her is to be an important case – if the neurologist says you need a scan then you need a bloody scan! Anyway, it took another month of arguing and a second opinion from another neurologist before they finally agreed to do that scan but that's what the state healthcare system is coming to here in Spain – certainly in this area so I wouldn't personally be without my private cover.


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## puertouk (Aug 22, 2010)

*big problem*

If I were you I would return to the UK. Spain is a minefield of red tape and most have no idea on what´s going on themselves. You have no funds, so you have no chance of getting a residencia. Your partner and her son will have also no chance of getting one either. You may even struggle to get her into the UK as well, as you are not married. Tell you partner to stay in Sri Lanka and save on the airfare. Return to the UK and ask the authorities there how you stand bringing your partner and her son to the UK. They may well turn you down, especially as the child is not yours.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Thank you, but I am not in the enviable position of being able to return to the UK. I shall stay here and fight it out, marrying my partner.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Nomad_uk said:


> Thank you, but I am not in the enviable position of being able to return to the UK. I shall stay here and fight it out, marrying my partner.


if you marry, provided you reach financial requirements (which I believe are lower here than in the UK) you will find it easier to achieve residency for your then wife & her child here


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

so prefers private care.


Nomad_uk said:


> Thanks everyone. My main concern was over the price of the health insurance, and I've had an online quote from a UK company - asking no questions about current health, background or anything - of €290. On another thread, I've just seen premiums of €55 quoted and these are far more realistic. I feel I can breathe more easily now!


You need to determine what you will receive for your 55 euros a month. My guess is ...very little.
We pay slightly less than that for private medical insurance although we are both entitled to full Spanish health care. Our private insurance covers home visits, consultation with a GP and ambulance transfers to hospital. For everything else you pay...Most GP visits result in a recommendation to consult a specialist...minimum fee 100 euros plus prescription charges.
We pay this private insurance since, to be brutally frank, it enables us, for a fee of course, to get Xrays and scans sometimes on the same day as recommended. My partner required treatment for melanomas - a real hazard of life under the Spanish sun - which cost several 000 euros. I don't mind looking up the appropriate medical terms in the dictionary to be able to explain my ailments to a doctor but she does so prefers private treatment by English-speaking consultants.

On your other point: the Single European Act did indeed stipulate free movement of goods, capital and people...but as has been pointed out 'movement' means just that...not stability as in residence. Free movement of labour hasn't existed either EU wide as many member states have imposed quotas for work-seeking migrants from the former socialist-bloc countries.

In addition to that, there are further 'opt-out' clauses relating to various aspects of working and personal life: for example, the UK has an opt-out from the Working Hours Directive and is able to lawfully discriminate against same-sex couples in Civil Partnerships in relation to survivor pension benefits for government and local government pensions by invoking the 'marriage clause'.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Nomad_uk said:


> Thank you, but I am not in the enviable position of being able to return to the UK. I shall stay here and fight it out, marrying my partner.


Not sure but I think that in order to qualify for residencia which you need to stay legally in Spain you will need to prove an income of around 6000 euros per annum per person...so in your case 18k euros plus proof of medical cover.

Others can correct me on this...

Spain is not the only EU member state which requires proof you can support yourself and your family. I had to show proof of income and bank balance before getting temporary Czech residence when I lived in Prague.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Thank you! I do intend to marry, although the intention was to do this a month or so beyond the three months which seems to be imposed on us, so that family could attend. We'll just bring that forward now.
I have looked at a health insurance policy from ASSSA which gives pretty comprehensive cover even on its basic premium of €83.
I have certainly seen a figure of 12,000€ income quoted officially - somewhere. Somewhere! Locating it again is proving difficult, but I'm sure my gestor will be able to help. He has already offered to accompany me when I apply for residence. As my future wife also has a small income from rental of the house she owns in Sri Lanka, and the boy's father has committed to pay 50% of his expenses, I'm confident of being able to get over this hurdle. As an early retiree from academia, I should be able to get some private tuition, although this of course couldn't be proven for the future.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Nomad_uk said:


> Thank you! I do intend to marry, although the intention was to do this a month or so beyond the three months which seems to be imposed on us, so that family could attend. We'll just bring that forward now.
> I have looked at a health insurance policy from ASSSA which gives pretty comprehensive cover even on its basic premium of €83.
> I have certainly seen a figure of 12,000€ income quoted officially - somewhere. Somewhere! Locating it again is proving difficult, but I'm sure my gestor will be able to help. He has already offered to accompany me when I apply for residence. As my future wife also has a small income from rental of the house she owns in Sri Lanka, and the boy's father has committed to pay 50% of his expenses, I'm confident of being able to get over this hurdle. *As an early retiree from academia, I should be able to get some private tuition, although this of course couldn't be proven for the future*.


bear in mind, then, that if you _do _get private tuition work, that you'll have to register as _autónomo _(self-employed) & pay upwards of 260€ a month NI contributions - & then tax on top

the upside is that you would have access to state healthcare for you & your dependants


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Hmmm. That's a lot of money to pay when it's probably all I shall be earning. Thanks for that. Not something to declare until I actually earn it then (and I'm not saying I'll work without declaring it, just that there's no point in claiming it as possible income for residence).


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Nomad_uk said:


> Hmmm. That's a lot of money to pay when it's probably all I shall be earning. Thanks for that. Not something to declare until I actually earn it then (and I'm not saying I'll work without declaring it, just that there's no point in claiming it as possible income for residence).


The autonomo system is ridiculous which is why so many people work illegally - but the authorities are cracking down on this and rightly so. As Baldy correctly and very often points out, we are in Spain and it is incumbent on us to obey the laws, whatever we think of them. Most Brits have a poor view of immigrants who disregard our UK laws.

I think that if there are three of you you will need to prove income of around 18k euros - children are expensive!

You can't claim income from work in Spain as proof of residence unless you have a legal contract. It's possible you'll get work but not enough to live on and you'll have to pay autonomo whether you earn 100 euros or 10000 euros a month. I've been asked to give English lessons and I've agreed but I won't accept payment - I don't need the money and the odd gift of wine or help with Spanish bureaucracy will be more than enough. It seems to be the case that you get offered work when you don't want it...it was the same in Prague.

Not sure if you need to pay a gestor to get NIE etc. The procedure is very simple and you may find the person you deal with at the Police Dept. speaks English. We went to register our first week here and I then knew little Spanish so was quite relieved to find an official who spoke excellent English. With or without gestor you'll have to present yourself in person and stand in line along with the gestor-less....


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Thanks. I've got through N.I.E and Padron without gestor, only used one at the Hacienda. I shall take one along for the residencia though. You've perhaps been lucky - none of the officials I've had to deal with has spoken English; but then, why should they? Google translate, either on my mobile phone or on their computer, has worked well!


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Nomad_uk said:


> Thanks. I've got through N.I.E and Padron without gestor, only used one at the Hacienda. I shall take one along for the residencia though. *You've perhaps been lucky - none of the officials I've had to deal with has spoken English; but then, why should they*? Google translate, either on my mobile phone or on their computer, has worked well!




Quite right...when clerks at DWP offices in Barnsley or Bexhill can deal with Spanish clients in Castellano perfeto we Brits can complain about non-English speakers in Spain.

It doesn't take long really before you can speak Spanish fluently although in my case ungrammatically -pero me defiendo - if you are willing to mingle, listen and speak..


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

I agree completely about clerks etc not needing to speak English (how many millions speak Spanish around the world, particularly of course in South America?). I think however that a lot of posts on this forum give the misleading impression to newcomers - like me - that all town halls will have someone who does speak English. My experience has certainly been that in none of the two halls or comisarios does anyone speak English. It's a real test of learning the language to be able to communicate, and it's all of frightening, challenging and enjoyable (to me). I've found that my fluency in French, plus a large dollop of Italian and German from having been a musician, helps the reading of Spanish a great deal; but it's taking my ear far too long to become attuned to the spoken word :-(


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## chrisnation (Mar 2, 2009)

"to register as autónomo (self-employed) & pay upwards of 260€ a month NI contributions"

Nomad should google 'Autonomo - The Movie' and watch it. This little 2 min video is funny and a heartbreak. It's one good reason why Spain is in the mess it's in, with so much activity in the 'black' economy.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

chrisnation said:


> "to register as autónomo (self-employed) & pay upwards of 260€ a month NI contributions"
> 
> Nomad should google 'Autonomo - The Movie' and watch it. This little 2 min video is funny and a heartbreak. It's one good reason why Spain is in the mess it's in, with so much activity in the 'black' economy.


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## Nomad_uk (Oct 23, 2012)

Thank you, I eventually found the clip and laughed aloud watching it. I'm sure the reality is every bit as tough as the pretence. 
Perhaps some kind company will employ me so I don't have to deal with that :tongue-in-cheek: !


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## Matarredonda Tony (Jul 25, 2011)

Nomad_uk said:


> And to add more info: I left the UK for most of the 80's; was there again until 2009; had one year abroad; and was again out for 2 years until now. I didn't pay NI during any of these periods out. Complicated enough for DWP to work it out, but basically it cuts my state pension.


If you have paid NI contributions in the UK for 30 year's since age of 19 you will get full basic state pension. Go on the DWP website and you can input your details and they will tell you what your pension will be at today's rates and when you will receive.


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## Calas felices (Nov 29, 2007)

_"Quite right...when clerks at DWP offices in Barnsley or Bexhill can deal with Spanish clients in Castellano perfeto we Brits can complain about non-English speakers in Spain"_

Not quite the same argument. The British are the highest number of people who emigrate to and visit Spain and it is therefore right that the Spanish should respond to this. I suspect you could count the Spanish who visit Barnsley or emigrate to Bexhill on the fingers of one hand.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Calas felices said:


> _"Quite right...when clerks at DWP offices in Barnsley or Bexhill can deal with Spanish clients in Castellano perfeto we Brits can complain about non-English speakers in Spain"_
> 
> Not quite the same argument. The British are the highest number of people who emigrate to and visit Spain and it is therefore right that the Spanish should respond to this. I suspect you could count the Spanish who visit Barnsley or emigrate to Bexhill on the fingers of one hand.


Not quite - the Spanish didn't ask the Brits to come. It is the choice of the expat to move to Spain AND to moan about the fact that it is not like "home" AND moan that the locals all speak some foreign language AND that the shops close at 2 in the afternoon and reopen later just when THEY want to go shopping AND moan that all the labels on the products are in Spanish AND moan that there aren't branches of their favourite Brit shops in every town AND moan that the whole country is full of foreigners, especially the Spanish - they're everywhere, etc

Anglophones are the worst in the world for learning and speaking other languages. I have only one thing to say - if you want to go and live in a foreign country, there is a basic price to pay - learn the Bl**dy language!


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## Katiebelle2882 (Dec 17, 2012)

I beg to differ Baldi-Americans are the worst


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Katiebelle2882 said:


> I beg to differ Baldi-Americans are the worst


Americans are included in Anglophones!


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## Katiebelle2882 (Dec 17, 2012)

Ha I did not actually know that! Well, must be something with the English language!


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Katiebelle2882 said:


> Ha I did not actually know that! Well, must be something with the English language!


Yep Anglophone is somebody who speaks English, just as a Francophone is somebody who speaks French.


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## Katiebelle2882 (Dec 17, 2012)

No I meant, it must be something about the English language that makes us like that! lol. And you know, when I read it quickly I mistakingly thought "Anglophile". duh to me! long week at work!


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Katiebelle2882 said:


> No I meant, it must be something about the English language that makes us like that! lol. And you know, when I read it quickly I mistakingly thought "Anglophile". duh to me! long week at work!


We mistakeny think that English is the most common language in the world when, in fact, after Mandarin, Spanish is the second most common followed by English.


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## Katiebelle2882 (Dec 17, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> We mistakeny think that English is the most common language in the world when, in fact, after Mandarin, Spanish is the second most common followed by English.[/QUOT
> 
> My favorite thing is when Americans have a problem with people who don't speak English here but then do the same when they move overseas. Although to be fair, Americans leave America less frequently then the Brits leave England. Here people just retire to Florida or South Carolina, moving to europe is too far from the grandchildren and the like.
> 
> Perhaps my view is colored by what happens here. Immigrants from Latin American countries come here and do not learn the language, even after decades. They rely on others their entire life to communicate with English speakers and get benefits from this country. They have their children here so their kids have a better life, so they cannot be kicked out, use our healthcare (but never pay for it) etc etc. I find this so distasteful and disrespectful that I would never even think of moving to another country and not learn the language. I am making someone else's country my HOME and I owe it to them to learn the language and the culture since I will be benefitting from both!


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Katiebelle2882 said:


> baldilocks said:
> 
> 
> > We mistakeny think that English is the most common language in the world when, in fact, after Mandarin, Spanish is the second most common followed by English.[/QUOT
> ...


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