# Mortgages in Spain



## Deb1234 (Feb 13, 2013)

Can anybody help me. I am looking at buying a house in Spain and the estate agent has put me in touch with their solicitor who has explained that if you buy a new property in Spain that you have to pay 10% stamp duty and 8% for a second hand property. He also said that we will have to pay interest on the whole mortgage amount upfront. Is this correct?


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Deb1234 said:


> Can anybody help me. I am looking at buying a house in Spain and the estate agent has put me in touch with their solicitor who has explained that if you buy a new property in Spain that you have to pay 10% stamp duty and 8% for a second hand property. He also said that we will have to pay interest on the whole mortgage amount upfront. Is this correct?


:welcome:

I don't know about the interest upfront, but the tax sounds about right


one word of caution - it's usually recommended that you use any solicitor BUT the one recommended by the estate agent


----------



## Deb1234 (Feb 13, 2013)

Yeh I thought that. He seems to think that the total cost of buying a property out there will be about 14% which I thought seemed a lot. I wonder how much of this goes straight to him. Thanks for your quick response.


----------



## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

If it's anything like mine, I'm currently looking at a small mortgage. I've not been informed about any interest up front and transfer taxes recently went up I believe from 4% to 10% on a new property (by new I mean not lived in, it could have been built some time back but be unsold) A resale property is 8%. With regard to other fees the solicitor charges 1% plus disbursements.

With the bank, it will depend on a few factors. Firstly, if you are taking out a mortgage with a new bank, you will be charged mortgage tax which I think is about 0.5% of the loan or it might be a fixed fee depending on the loan. However, if the place is currently under a mortgage and you take it over with the same bank, you don't pay that fee, so you could save a fair bit in fees. There will be a doubling of fees however, such as notary fees and land registry fees because the bank will have a charge on the property so they get their own set of documents. Or something like that anyway. You will probably also have to pay house insurance through that bank I think.

Be careful with the transfer tax because that 8% might not be on the sale value of the property. It will be re assessed for tax and if it is assessed as higher than what you buy for, you pay 8% of the value, not 8% of the purchase price. However, if it's valued at less, you pay for the tax on the purchase price. (got you by the short and curlies there!)

This is my experience anyway, if anyone has cause to believe that this is inaccurate I will bow to your superior knowledge.


----------



## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Like many things in Spain it varies from place to place.

In the case of Madrid region the tax alone would be 10% of the price for a new build and 7% for a "previously enjoyed" home.

Then you have to pay a tax on the lodging of the deeds which can be up to 1%.

You also have to pay the cost of the solicitor who completes the transaction and lodges the deeds and the official cost of registering the deeds with the local authority.

You will also have to pay for a fomal valuation (obligatory for a mortgaged property), the cost of which can vary wildly, expect to pay between 250 and 1000€.

In total the up fornt cost of buying should be approx 10-12% of the purchase price. 14% sound a bit too much but I would investigate the local taxes applicable to the purchase which are the largest chunk of this amount.

I have never heard of having to pay all the interest on a mortgage up front, that could amount to many thousands of Euros and this were the case no-one would have bought in Spain between 2000 and 2006.
Banks front-load the repayments so that in the beginning your repayments are initially almost all interest and no capital, but that is standard financial practice (unless you chosse a different model of mortgage).


----------



## Deb1234 (Feb 13, 2013)

Wow, thank you that's so helpful!!


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

You don't say whether this is to be your sole property. If you are keeping a property in UK and the Spanish property is a second home, it can often be worth looking at extending a mortgage in the UK where interest rates are peanuts and mortgages are much more transparent so that you are in a position to pay cash in Spain.


----------



## Deb1234 (Feb 13, 2013)

Yeh i did look into expanding my mortgage in the UK but the exchange rate isn't the best.





baldilocks said:


> You don't say whether this is to be your sole property. If you are keeping a property in UK and the Spanish property is a second home, it can often be worth looking at extending a mortgage in the UK where interest rates are peanuts and mortgages are much more transparent so that you are in a position to pay cash in Spain.


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

xabiachica said:


> :welcome:
> 
> I don't know about the interest upfront, but the tax sounds about right
> 
> one word of caution - it's usually recommended that you use any solicitor BUT the one recommended by the estate agent


Very good sound advice


----------



## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> You don't say whether this is to be your sole property. If you are keeping a property in UK and the Spanish property is a second home, it can often be worth looking at extending a mortgage in the UK where interest rates are peanuts and mortgages are much more transparent so that you are in a position to pay cash in Spain.


I looked into that with my British bank but they wouldn't lend on an overseas property.


----------



## Navas (Sep 2, 2012)

Dunpleecin said:


> I looked into that with my British bank but they wouldn't lend on an overseas property.


That's interesting because my bank weren't bothered what I spent the money on as I just would have been remortgaging my property!


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Dunpleecin said:


> I looked into that with my British bank but they wouldn't lend on an overseas property.


But you could take out a remortgage on your UK property and buy the Spanish one with the cash. Renting first maybe a good way of gaining knowledge of both property purchases and areas!!??

Make sure you know what you're doing tho, research and investigate everything, dont trust anyone and wherever you get a mortgage, if you dont make the repayments, they'll find you!!

Sorry, thats my scary and "mother knows best" lecture over with lol!!!

Jo xxx


----------



## Calas felices (Nov 29, 2007)

_one word of caution - it's usually recommended that you use any solicitor BUT the one recommended by the estate agent_

Just for the avoidance of doubt I'm sure xabiachica's means any estate agent other than the one recommended by the estate agent.


----------



## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Calas felices said:


> _one word of caution - it's usually recommended that you use any solicitor BUT the one recommended by the estate agent_
> 
> Just for the avoidance of doubt I'm sure xabiachica's means any estate agent other than the one recommended by the estate agent.


:confused2:


----------



## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

jojo said:


> But you could take out a remortgage on your UK property and buy the Spanish one with the cash. Renting first maybe a good way of gaining knowledge of both property purchases and areas!!??
> 
> Make sure you know what you're doing tho, research and investigate everything, dont trust anyone and wherever you get a mortgage, if you dont make the repayments, they'll find you!!
> 
> ...


I don't have a property in the UK as I sold it. I thought I might be able to use about half the capital I have on a place in Spain and have a UK mortgage for the rest but that's not possible. So it's a case of much smaller mortgage in Spain and using most of the capital, which I'm not too bothered about as I will have a decent income to live on over there. I'm probably a bit further down the line than perhaps you think.


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

Dunpleecin said:


> I don't have a property in the UK as I sold it. I thought I might be able to use about half the capital I have on a place in Spain and have a UK mortgage for the rest but that's not possible. So it's a case of much smaller mortgage in Spain and using most of the capital, which I'm not too bothered about as I will have a decent income to live on over there. I'm probably a bit further down the line than perhaps you think.


I personaly would rent first and leave your money in the bank until your really sure its what you want as once commited theres no turning back


----------



## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

tonyinspain said:


> I personaly would rent first and leave your money in the bank until your really sure its what you want as once commited theres no turning back


I never understand this "Rent first" stuff. So I rent somewhere for 6 months and therefore lose around £2-3k. Then I decide I don't like the area. What then? Throw another £2-3k into someone elses back pocket somewhere else while I search for that perfect place? And how much interest do I earn in that time by keeping the money in the bank? Certainly won't cover the rent, that's for sure. Renting is dead money for me and it might suit some people, perhaps people who want to move around a lot or maybe don't have enough to buy. Apart from those two scenarios, I never understand people's thinking behind it. I would only rent if I absolutely had no choice. 

I've been to Spain enough times over the years to A) know I want to retire there and B) know the area I want to live so if I've found somewhere suitable, I can't see any reason not to take the plunge really.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Dunpleecin said:


> I never understand this "Rent first" stuff. So I rent somewhere for 6 months and therefore lose around £2-3k. Then I decide I don't like the area. What then? Throw another £2-3k into someone elses back pocket somewhere else while I search for that perfect place? And how much interest do I earn in that time by keeping the money in the bank? Certainly won't cover the rent, that's for sure. Renting is dead money for me and it might suit some people, perhaps people who want to move around a lot or maybe don't have enough to buy. Apart from those two scenarios, I never understand people's thinking behind it. I would only rent if I absolutely had no choice.
> 
> I've been to Spain enough times over the years to A) know I want to retire there and B) know the area I want to live so if I've found somewhere suitable, I can't see any reason not to take the plunge really.


rent for a year and you'll find the property prices would have dropped by much much more than you paid out in rent - WITHOUT A DOUBT! Prices are falling and will continue to do so for a long time yet. It also gives you a chance to understand the strange rules and regs regarding living and buying in Spain, its nothing like the UK. And dont forget, what you think you want from your property/area in Spain from the comfort of your armchair, is nothing like what you'll want when you live here! 

Jo xxx


----------



## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

jojo said:


> rent for a year and you'll find the property prices would have dropped by much much more than you paid out in rent - WITHOUT A DOUBT! Prices are falling and will continue to do so for a long time yet. It also gives you a chance to understand the strange rules and regs regarding living and buying in Spain, its nothing like the UK. And dont forget, what you think you want from your property/area in Spain from the comfort of your armchair, is nothing like what you'll want when you live here!
> 
> Jo xxx


Thanks for your advice.


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Dunpleecin said:


> I never understand this "Rent first" stuff. So I rent somewhere for 6 months and therefore lose around £2-3k. Then I decide I don't like the area. What then? Throw another £2-3k into someone elses back pocket somewhere else while I search for that perfect place? And how much interest do I earn in that time by keeping the money in the bank? Certainly won't cover the rent, that's for sure. Renting is dead money for me and it might suit some people, perhaps people who want to move around a lot or maybe don't have enough to buy. Apart from those two scenarios, I never understand people's thinking behind it. I would only rent if I absolutely had no choice.
> 
> I've been to Spain enough times over the years to A) know I want to retire there and B) know the area I want to live so if I've found somewhere suitable, I can't see any reason not to take the plunge really.


So many advocate "Rent First" but I don't. Do all your research thoroughly so that you know all the disadvantages and pitfalls of the places you are looking at as well as the advantages and the pluses.

We spent several years researching and then took a couple of visits looking at areas and properties. Decided on the house we wanted (it also wanted us!), made an offer, paid our deposit, got the money together over the following 12 months (partially with an extension to our UK mortgage). Sold our flat in UK and moved with a self-drive van. We have been here going on for 4½ years and it was the best thing we have ever done.

So What if prices drop another couple of thousand. Are you moving here to make a killing in a weak housing market or are you moving here to a more relaxed and peaceful retirement? It's your choice!


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

jojo said:


> rent for a year and you'll find the property prices would have dropped by much much more than you paid out in rent - WITHOUT A DOUBT! Prices are falling and will continue to do so for a long time yet. It also gives you a chance to understand the strange rules and regs regarding living and buying in Spain, its nothing like the UK. And dont forget, what you think you want from your property/area in Spain from the comfort of your armchair, is nothing like what you'll want when you live here!
> 
> Jo xxx


well said jo jo


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

Dunpleecin said:


> I never understand this "Rent first" stuff. So I rent somewhere for 6 months and therefore lose around £2-3k. Then I decide I don't like the area. What then? Throw another £2-3k into someone elses back pocket somewhere else while I search for that perfect place? And how much interest do I earn in that time by keeping the money in the bank? Certainly won't cover the rent, that's for sure. Renting is dead money for me and it might suit some people, perhaps people who want to move around a lot or maybe don't have enough to buy. Apart from those two scenarios, I never understand people's thinking behind it. I would only rent if I absolutely had no choice.
> 
> I've been to Spain enough times over the years to A) know I want to retire there and B) know the area I want to live so if I've found somewhere suitable, I can't see any reason not to take the plunge really.


Sorry i spoke not being a mind reader thought you was a newbie but as you have visited spain and researched everything and know all there is to know about spain
But i still advocate renting before buying as jo jo says 
Good luck


----------



## gus-lopez (Jan 4, 2010)

A Spanish mortgage is unlike a UK one. It is basically like a UK H.P. agreement.The property really has nothing to do with it as it is you that is personally liable. If you cannot pay not only will you lose the property but foreclosure will also immediately add all the penalties, interest , collection fees, court costs, which are all written into the mortgage agreement, & will be added instantly. It is not unknown for the debt owed to rise initially by 50% . In addition any loss on the property will be added to this amount & remember that they have little interest in obtaining the best price as you are paying. 
They will then chase you for the outstanding amount forever.


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

So as you say gus its not a decision to be made lightly as plenty of people have found out
Some get it right but theres a lot get it wrong and they are paying for it now


----------



## Dunpleecin (Dec 20, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> So many advocate "Rent First" but I don't. Do all your research thoroughly so that you know all the disadvantages and pitfalls of the places you are looking at as well as the advantages and the pluses.
> 
> We spent several years researching and then took a couple of visits looking at areas and properties. Decided on the house we wanted (it also wanted us!), made an offer, paid our deposit, got the money together over the following 12 months (partially with an extension to our UK mortgage). Sold our flat in UK and moved with a self-drive van. We have been here going on for 4½ years and it was the best thing we have ever done.
> 
> So What if prices drop another couple of thousand. Are you moving here to make a killing in a weak housing market or are you moving here to a more relaxed and peaceful retirement? It's your choice!


Halle-bloody-luya

Why are people so upset that we don't want to rent because we know what we want? No, Tony in Spain, I don't know everything there is to know, so there's no need for the smart alec comments.

Some of you lot have serious issues. People come here for a bit of advice not to be bombarded with insults just because they don't want to do what you suggest. I know people like you, they're really friendly, but actually, if you don't follow their advice, they're really put out and throw their toys out of the pram. I'm getting that vibe here. Might just sod off actually.


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

Dunpleecin said:


> Halle-bloody-luya
> 
> Why are people so upset that we don't want to rent because we know what we want? No, Tony in Spain, I don't know everything there is to know, so there's no need for the smart alec comments.
> 
> Some of you lot have serious issues. People come here for a bit of advice not to be bombarded with insults just because they don't want to do what you suggest. I know people like you, they're really friendly, but actually, if you don't follow their advice, they're really put out and throw their toys out of the pram. I'm getting that vibe here. Might just sod off actually.


Sorry you feel that way but like i daid you posted for advice and thats the best advice in my experience i could give you as you didnt like the advice which was given in good faith you then tried to rant about it 
Well sorry but like i said we are not mind readers and you certInly didnt mention you had been here in your post and buying is a very expensive mistake if it goes tits up 
.........


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Dunpleecin said:


> Halle-bloody-luya
> 
> Why are people so upset that we don't want to rent because we know what we want? No, Tony in Spain, I don't know everything there is to know, so there's no need for the smart alec comments.
> 
> Some of you lot have serious issues. People come here for a bit of advice not to be bombarded with insults just because they don't want to do what you suggest. I know people like you, they're really friendly, but actually, if you don't follow their advice, they're really put out and throw their toys out of the pram. I'm getting that vibe here. Might just sod off actually.


You have choices, but make sure they're informed. I havent seen that you've been bombarded with insults, just advice, which is what the forum is about. It matters not to anyone on the forum whether you know what you want or take the advice. My advice as is everyone elses, is based on our own experience and mistakes. I know when we moved to Spain and rented our "perfect" dream house, we loved it for the first two weeks - then I realised it had damp in the basement meaning the two bedrooms down there were smelly and unpleasant), it was too far to walk to the shop, the neighbour used to kill his chickens under our bedroom window every week for the market, he used to also like to stare over the fence at us, the sun was blocked by the mountains all winter, drafty windows, it needed a new roof...... Interestingly, when we rented it, the owner offered to sell it to us for the bargain price of 350,000€. Its still on the market 6 years later - its now 160,000€ and the road outside needs to be repaired and thats down to the owners and will cost 140,000€ between three owners and must be done before they can sell it apparently???? MMy point is that it doesnt matter if you know the area, it matters that you get the property right, that you understand to rules, problems and get it right, cos you wont be able to re sell it quickly or easily and therefore you shouldnt buy quickly - especially when house prices are tumbling and you're a guiri!

Thats my story and heres my advice, take it or leave it - its your choice. I've rented several places in Spain and we constantly pat ourselves on the back that we didnt buy, eventho we really wanted to when we first moved here. But I know so many people who have bought and are trapped here now or worse. Theres also talk of the Spanish government putting a tax on expats who own here??!!? So really, whats the big fear of renting for a few months??

At this moment in time, buying is the risky option - simple and thats not advice thats fact! So over to you - your knowledge and research will help you decide, we just say it as it is!

Jo xxx


----------



## Navas (Sep 2, 2012)

I have to say, that despite the advice in this thread and others, I would only rent if I couldn't afford to buy the house I wanted at the time that I wanted to move or there wasn't a house I liked in the area that I wanted to live in at the right time. Renting, for us, would be a temporary measure of last resort.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Navas said:


> I have to say, that despite the advice in this thread and others, I would only rent if I couldn't afford to buy the house I wanted at the time that I wanted to move or there wasn't a house I liked in the area that I wanted to live in at the right time. Renting, for us, would be a temporary measure of last resort.


I dont disagree. The only reason we rented initially was because we couldnt sel our UK house, After we'd been n spain a few months it was apparent that house prices were falling, but we then met some friends who we were going to do a house swap with - they were deperate to move back to the UK and couldnt sell their Spanish house. So we started the procedure, but then it became apparent that it wasnt cheap to buy in Spain and that while the price of their house in Spain was falling, ours in the UK was rising and when we had them both officially valued - there was an evergrowing short fall, they then couldnt get a mortgage in the UK.... so it fell thru!

It is nice to own your own home tho and a waste of time to wait for the market to finish falling - It could been decades lol!!. We're seriously toying with the idea of buying a cheap "bolthole" type place in Spain and having it as a second home... we've looked around and.....well maybe???!! I have to say, that I wouldnt dream of doing it if we hadnt lived here and experienced just how difficult and different buying properties are compared with the UK!

Jo xxx


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

*Research*

As I keep telling people, *RESEARCH* and do it properly. If all your research is based on watching some TV programme or just reading some glowing tale in a magazine, then stay where you are (those programmes and magazines are about making money for the shareholders/owners etc by selling advertising not about purveying unbiased advice)

Researching for your new life in Spain or elsewhere is not about going onto a forum and asking questions of those who are already there or wannabes. WE can only fill in the bits that are difficult to find out elsewhere. There are those of us who advocate renting first or like myself who advocate researching what you want and how to achieve it then buying. My argument is if you research properly, you find out thet there are unsociable neighbours, the pigswill lorries go past the door, the goatherder goes past and leaves goat sh*t all over your front step, or the mules goes past and leaves fertiliser for your roses, there is no water pressure from the taps between 6pm and 5am the next morning because it is being used for irrigation, the bar opposite stays open until 6 in the morning and you can't sleep, etc. 

While you are renting at some €1000 per month, that is €12,000 p.a. and if you find you don't like the place/area, you are no further forward and move to the next place (moving expenses) and try there - by the end of five years you've paid out over €60,000+ and are still homeless! Research thoroughly and you will find your house and make a successful purchase.


----------



## Navas (Sep 2, 2012)

baldilocks said:


> As I keep telling people, *RESEARCH* and do it properly. If all your research is based on watching some TV programme or just reading some glowing tale in a magazine, then stay where you are (those programmes and magazines are about making money for the shareholders/owners etc by selling advertising not about purveying unbiased advice)
> 
> Researching for your new life in Spain or elsewhere is not about going onto a forum and asking questions of those who are already there or wannabes. WE can only fill in the bits that are difficult to find out elsewhere. There are those of us who advocate renting first or like myself who advocate researching what you want and how to achieve it then buying. My argument is if you research properly, you find out thet there are unsociable neighbours, the pigswill lorries go past the door, the goatherder goes past and leaves goat sh*t all over your front step, or the mules goes past and leaves fertiliser for your roses, there is no water pressure from the taps between 6pm and 5am the next morning because it is being used for irrigation, the bar opposite stays open until 6 in the morning and you can't sleep, etc.
> 
> While you are renting at some €1000 per month, that is €12,000 p.a. and if you find you don't like the place/area, you are no further forward and move to the next place (moving expenses) and try there - by the end of five years you've paid out over €60,000+ and are still homeless! Research thoroughly and you will find your house and make a successful purchase.



How can I give a "triple-like" to this post baldi? :clap2::amen::clap2:


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

baldilocks said:


> As I keep telling people, RESEARCH and do it properly. If all your research is based on watching some TV programme or just reading some glowing tale in a magazine, then stay where you are (those programmes and magazines are about making money for the shareholders/owners etc by selling advertising not about purveying unbiased advice)
> 
> Researching for your new life in Spain or elsewhere is not about going onto a forum and asking questions of those who are already there or wannabes. WE can only fill in the bits that are difficult to find out elsewhere. There are those of us who advocate renting first or like myself who advocate researching what you want and how to achieve it then buying. My argument is if you research properly, you find out thet there are unsociable neighbours, the pigswill lorries go past the door, the goatherder goes past and leaves goat sh*t all over your front step, or the mules goes past and leaves fertiliser for your roses, there is no water pressure from the taps between 6pm and 5am the next morning because it is being used for irrigation, the bar opposite stays open until 6 in the morning and you can't sleep, etc.
> 
> While you are renting at some &#128;1000 per month, that is &#128;12,000 p.a. and if you find you don't like the place/area, you are no further forward and move to the next place (moving expenses) and try there - by the end of five years you've paid out over &#128;60,000+ and are still homeless! Research thoroughly and you will find your house and make a successful purchase.


Very good post baldy but you cant research everything from your armchair and once you bought your in for the long haul and i certainly wouldnt advocate renting for years at a time only a few months just to get a FEEL for the place and people i used a caravan and traveled different to different areas cost 150€
And not all rents are in 1000€+ mark i pay 350 per month so its not as expensive as spending 100,000.00+ for house next to the local sewage works etc etc or your home is nice and warm in the summer but misersbly cold in the winter
Yes buy but only when you like you said 
It feels right 
I would also use local campsites to explore the are at little cost


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

tonyinspain said:


> Very good post baldy but you cant research everything from your armchair and once you bought your in for the long haul and i certainly wouldnt advocate renting for years at a time only a few months just to get a FEEL for the place and people i used a caravan and traveled different to different areas cost 150€
> And not all rents are in 1000€+ mark i pay 350 per month so its not as expensive as spending 100,000.00+ for house next to the local sewage works etc etc or your home is nice and warm in the summer but misersbly cold in the winter
> Yes buy but only when you like you said
> It feels right
> I would also use local campsites to explore the are at little cost


I'm not suggesting researching everything from home but you can get a pretty good idea about many things such as climate, etc. As for the paying astronomical rents, so many of the dumbos will pay something like that because they are are shorter than two thick planks and eventually buy a place for all the wrong reasons, spend a couple of years moaning about the Spanish, Spain and everything else they find isn't just as they imagined it to be simply because they did what little research they bothered with by looking through rose-coloured spectacles. "there's such a nice bar right opposite so Pete can just tumble out of bead in the morning and have a few drinks before having a shower in the morning and I can be on the beach in two minutes" omitting the fact there are no carparks nearby so in the summer they can't get the car out because visitors have blocked the entrance to their garage. "The house is so quaint that none of the doors fit properly" overlooking the fact that the frames are all distorted because the house is slipping towards the adjacent dry (until the next thunderstorm) arroyo. They also didn't find out that the electricity infrastructure is so poor that power outages lasting several hours or even days are not uncommon nor that the water supply is so hard that even a water softener has difficulty coping and the neighbours go up into the hills with a mule and large bottles where there is a spring with soft water, there's no ADSL nor satellite signal to enable them to watch Coronation Street which, would you believe, comes on an hour later ("why can't they just show it at the same time? it's so inconsiderate of the Spanish") etc, etc 

And if they didn't notice that the house they bought was next to the sewage works .... my point exactly!

Then they go "back home"


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

Yes i see your point but it is surprising how many people that have bought say if i knew this i wouldnt have come here and yes they are the ones that jump in first and repent later but all im saying is get to know the area before commiting to a vast amount of money to only end up in a lot of cases out of pocket
When i came here houses cost as little as 12000€ 
The same house 9 yrs later never sold 90000€
and most brits thought the was going to be property tycoons well thats not happened a lot have had to return to the uk penniless 
Yes some people do buy immediatly and very things fine they are happy 
But there is a lot more that utopia has slipped by and they are now wishing they stayed where they orginated from


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

tonyinspain said:


> *Yes i see your point but it is surprising how many people that have bought say if i knew this i wouldnt have come here and yes they are the ones that jump in first and repent later but all im saying is get to know the area before commiting to a vast amount of money to only end up in a lot of cases out of pocket*
> When i came here houses cost as little as 12000€
> The same house 9 yrs later never sold 90000€
> and most brits thought the was going to be property tycoons well thats not happened a lot have had to return to the uk penniless
> ...


But they blame their own failings on Spain and the Spanish.

With regard to "they are now wishing they stayed where they orginated from" we wish they'd stayed there, too!

BTW our house (4 floors + basement patio) cost us €85k and we have spent about another €15k on getting it to the way we want. We are extremely content with where we are and couldn't, in our opinion, have found better.


----------



## Deb1234 (Feb 13, 2013)

If I bought somewhere not to move in to but to use as a holiday let and to use ourselves for weekends away and family holidays, is it quite easy to let a place out to holiday makers, whether it's families or golfers, if I have the right area. 
I will have a mortgage on it and I'd need the income from renting it out to pay this mortgage. I'd like to keep the property long term and maybe spend a lot more time there once it's paid off and we've retired. Is this a crazy idea?


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

baldilocks said:


> But they blame their own failings on Spain and the Spanish.
> 
> With regard to "they are now wishing they stayed where they orginated from" we wish they'd stayed there, too!
> 
> BTW our house (4 floors + basement patio) cost us &#128;85k and we have spent about another &#128;15k on getting it to the way we want. We are extremely content with where we are and couldn't, in our opinion, have found better.


Totally agree with you but all im saying people are different and what you may say as research is completlely different as to what joe bloggs researches and im a firm believer of recce first pay later or as you like to say ppps piss poor prep
Its a total different scenario where people and im not saying anything against pensioners but they have a income and hopefully are financally sound alot of people sell up and move here impulse buy and then realise they have 
MAde a mistake and i stil believe its important if they are new to spain to explore first 
Most brits buy cause they had a wonderfull 2 wk vacation its totally different living here and working here
And thats the thing there isnt any


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Deb1234 said:


> If I bought somewhere not to move in to but to use as a holiday let and to use ourselves for weekends away and family holidays, is it quite easy to let a place out to holiday makers, whether it's families or golfers, if I have the right area.
> I will have a mortgage on it and I'd need the income from renting it out to pay this mortgage. I'd like to keep the property long term and maybe spend a lot more time there once it's paid off and we've retired. Is this a crazy idea?


We did think of doing something similar, but personally I'd say its one of those situations at the moment whereby, only do it if you can pay for it without the rent or without the mortgage. Its incredibly risky and oif you dont keep up the mortgage repayments, they can take your UK property to cover the costs. First of all if you tried to get a mortgage on the strength of rental - I'm not sure that you'd be granted one, would you be able to guarantee you could pay the mortgage if you didnt rent it - there are an awful lot of people trying to rent as you are suggesting - especially in the winter. I'm in Nerja at the moment and the number of rentals around is astounding, every other apartment is either for sale or rent - all empty. In fact next year if we rent for the winter, I think we'd be safe to simply arrive and knock on an agents door and offer them "silly money" to put us in an apartment straight away for a few months!!??


Jo xxx


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

baldilocks said:


> But they blame their own failings on Spain and the Spanish.
> 
> With regard to "they are now wishing they stayed where they orginated from" we wish they'd stayed there, too!
> 
> BTW our house (4 floors + basement patio) cost us &#128;85k and we have spent about another &#128;15k on getting it to the way we want. We are extremely content with where we are and couldn't, in our opinion, have found better.


Yes you seem to have dropped on your feet baldy nice to see everythings rosy
And yes i could say the same but no some of those unfortunates were my friends and you like sayings houses glass stones come to mind from someone who i have enjoyed reading your posts from time to time your very im alright jack attitude doesnt do you credit ho for a perfect world


----------



## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

tonyinspain said:


> Yes you seem to have dropped on your feet baldy nice to see everythings rosy
> And yes i could say the same but no some of those unfortunates were my friends and you like sayings houses glass stones come to mind from someone who i have enjoyed reading your posts from time to time your very im alright jack attitude doesnt do you credit ho for a perfect world


But I always tell how I did it - research - get the basics right, know what you are looking for, where and why. So many just come and think that their two weeks holiday in the sun can be multiplied by 26 and they can live like that all year round. The realities are very different. It CAN and DOES get cold in winter. Their favourite bar/restaurant/other socialising location doesn't have much trade in the winter and may well close out of season, etc, etc. But they never think beyond the end of their next pint and whose turn it is to buy the next round.

I feel sorry for the kids they trail around and then drag back "home" - it is bad enough disrupting their education and breaking up their friendships once but the to do it a second time.

I'm not the only one who has landed on his feet, most of us long-term residents have done so and we provide the mainstay source of advice on how to do things and how not to, what you can do and what is illegal, what is safe and what to beware of.


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

baldilocks said:


> But I always tell how I did it - research - get the basics right, know what you are looking for, where and why. So many just come and think that their two weeks holiday in the sun can be multiplied by 26 and they can live like that all year round. The realities are very different. It CAN and DOES get cold in winter. Their favourite bar/restaurant/other socialising location doesn't have much trade in the winter and may well close out of season, etc, etc. But they never think beyond the end of their next pint and whose turn it is to buy the next round.
> 
> I feel sorry for the kids they trail around and then drag back "home" - it is bad enough disrupting their education and breaking up their friendships once but the to do it a second time.
> 
> I'm not the only one who has landed on his feet, most of us long-term residents have done so and we provide the mainstay source of advice on how to do things and how not to, what you can do and what is illegal, what is safe and what to beware of.


Yes i agree with you when you put it that way but i think like you sometimes saying the same stuff for the umteenth time does get boring and we then become complacent on how we say things i agree but every poster is different and not every poster has pensions or invalidity benefits or potts of money to make life a little easier they come here with a dream of a better life than the uk
A better standard and they are a great asset to the community they have joined but the people that have been hit the hardest is not the POOR pensioner but the young couple with kids that tried to make a go of it and if this crisis hadnt hit would proberbly have been successful but the crisis did hit and it hit hard 
And some of them i knew and liked and yes it is upsetting seeing them lose everything 
Anyhow baldy keep posting cause regardless i do value your imeasurable experience and sometimes funny posts
Regards
Tony


----------



## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

jojo said:


> rent for a year and you'll find the property prices would have dropped by much much more than you paid out in rent - WITHOUT A DOUBT! Prices are falling and will continue to do so for a long time yet


No, I don't agree with this.

Property prices in Spain have pretty much reached a plateau, they're neither falling nor rising, they've reached their natural level and I don't see them falling much more for the near future.

That's not to say by any means that you should be paying what prices people are asking. If I were buying a property there right now (I'm not I already have one) I'd be looking to knock anything from between 25-50% off the asking price, perhaps even more depending on who the seller was and how desperate they were to sell. Private sellers still have deluded ideas of what their properties are worth whereas bank repossessed ones are much closer to the real value but even then you can still get money off. To get a good idea of a property value in this market at the moment, find a similar bank repossessed property and knock about 10-20% off.

A property (or anything really) is only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it, no exceptions. Given the sheer amount of property on the market and the scarcity of buyers for that property, it's very much a buyers market. That means you should be pushing to buy at the correct value, and to take into consideration any possible future falls in the market by understanding what the correct value of that property currently is.

To suggest renting rather than buying on the basis that the market will continue to fall so by waiting to buy you can recoup your rental costs is very misleading and doesn't really show a particularly good grasp of the current state of the Spanish property market in my opinion.

The advice to rent is a good one, particularly if you don't know the area you want to be in, or know how weird and wonderful Spain's customs and laws can be but it is indeed 'dead money' and you have to weigh up the benefits of doing so against the downsides of the cost of doing it.

Dunpleecin has stated quite clearly that 1/ He/she wants to retire to Spain and 2/ knows the area He/she wants to be in, and sounds very much like plenty of the research has already been done. To continue to suggest to rent therefore becomes a bit daft in my opinion.


----------



## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

A house is something you buy for a HOME not an investment. It is somewhere to live life, to make memories.

If i was moving to lets say Wales = no one would say oh you must rent for a year.

We are researching and researching at some point we have to make a decision and then live with that decision, Renting long term is not for us, it does not mean it is wrong for others but wrong for us


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

I agree at the moment buying is a great way of saving money but to be honest a lot of people on here are not sure what they are doing and the advice i tend to tell people is try before you buy
As once they do either pay cash or mortgage a prop it might look loverly in the summer but totally different when your freezing cold so to those people rentings best but buying as some of you have said is definatly the way forward providing as baldy says research reasearch and research again but one very real denominator that no one seems to mention is having to repair and upkeep a bought house at least the landlord has that worry sorted and certainly i would not say rent for years that would be crazy


----------



## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

zenkarma said:


> No, I don't agree with this.
> 
> Property prices in Spain have pretty much reached a plateau, they're neither falling nor rising, they've reached their natural level and I don't see them falling much more for the near future.
> 
> To suggest renting rather than buying on the basis that the market will continue to fall so by waiting to buy you can recoup your rental costs is very misleading and doesn't really show a particularly good grasp of the current state of the Spanish property market in my opinion.


You could be right... But if were a betting man I'd be backing Jojos vision of the near future over yours.


----------



## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

tonyinspain said:


> ...but to be honest a lot of people on here are not sure what they are doing...


Can you teach stupid people not to be stupid? If they're stupid, will they take any notice of the oft used advice - research, research, research and if necessary rent before you buy?

I don't think you can.

What people do need to know however is that Spain works in a completely different way to the way that England does and it can be and is unbelievably frustrating when you've been used to English ways of doing things. 

They have two speeds - slow and stop. They're always in a perpetual state of manaña, they never hurry, no matter how urgent something might be. They have archaic and bizarre rules and laws that even the local Spanish people don't understand, what hope have we got? Sorting problems out can take 100 times longer than you think it should, and that's if you can get hold of the right person.

It's important for anyone planning on relocating to Spain to fully understand that it just doesn't work in the same way as the UK does.

And that's not even mentioning the language difference.


----------



## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

Overandout said:


> But if were a betting man I'd be backing Jojos vision of the near future over yours.


Based on what?

I've been watching and analysing the property market in Spain for a long time. I've had a property there for about 15 years, I've seen the market go up and I've seen it come down. I've seen the value of my flat almost triple in value and then fall by half. My biggest concern isn't the value of it, but the continual and rising cost of running it.

I also follow the UK and EU economy fairly closely. Spanish banks are writing down and writing off a huge amount of Spanish property debts in their accounts.

That doesn't automatically mean I'm right and you're wrong, but it does mean that I'm speaking from a basis of knowledge and understanding. I can't see it going down very much from where it is at the moment, because there's not much further it can go, they're not going to start giving them away with a packet of cornflakes and the banks will always want a return on the underlying value even if they take some losses.

One of biggest problems with the Spanish property market are the private owners, who want to sell but won't drop their price to the right level. They still have deluded ideas of how much their 3 bed villa and swimming pool is worth despite the fact that it's halved in value from what they bought it for, because they bought it at the wrong time, at the height of the market.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

zenkarma said:


> No, I don't agree with this.
> 
> Property prices in Spain have pretty much reached a plateau, they're neither falling nor rising, they've reached their natural level and I don't see them falling much more for the near future.
> 
> ...


 According to a couple of friends of mine who are agents and will kill me for writing this, but I also heard it from a totally different source, but one I trust. At the moment the banks have released only a tiny percentage of their stock of distressed/repossessions (a rapidly increasing stock at that!) and then only giving the good ones to Spanish friends, acquaintances. The so called rubbish, they give to foreigners - allegedly! One day, they are going to have to flood the market with all these properties and of course deal with the properties that have been half built, the new and substandard builds, of which there are many - thats when you'll see the market crash!!..... allegedly!! 

Jo xxx


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

However, on a positive note, the weather has been good in Spain today and is forecast to hold out til Tuesday and then I fear rain!!!! lol

Seriously tho, we all have to take our chances. Its no good waiting 10 years til the market has bottomed out if you wanna own a place in Spain before then. But weigh up the options and ideas - and remember, if you ask for advice, you maybe lucky enough to get well meaning, experienced people offer it to you, but you dont have to take it or feel offended by it. We all have choices and in the end..........well another, even bigger meteor could come along and that'll be that!

Jo xxx


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

zenkarma said:


> Can you teach stupid people not to be stupid? If they're stupid, will they take any notice of the oft used advice - research, research, research and if necessary rent before you buy?
> 
> I don't think you can.
> 
> ...


Well said zem


----------



## Guest (Feb 15, 2013)

Deb1234 said:


> If I bought somewhere not to move in to but to use as a holiday let and to use ourselves for weekends away and family holidays, is it quite easy to let a place out to holiday makers, whether it's families or golfers, if I have the right area.
> I will have a mortgage on it and I'd need the income from renting it out to pay this mortgage. I'd like to keep the property long term and maybe spend a lot more time there once it's paid off and we've retired. Is this a crazy idea?


Hi Deb, I doubt that's a good idea, as I've seen so many people who've tried and either can't let the house or do let it and the tenants break everything and/or refuse to leave and it's a disaster. You coud consider having anice, but not expensive, caravan on a campsite, where it'd be safe and would cost you very little; you pay a retainer and then a bit extra when you're using it, but it works out very cheap compared with a house or flat.


----------



## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

zenkarma said:


> Based on what?
> 
> I've been watching and analysing the property market in Spain for a long time. I've had a property there for about 15 years
> 
> ...


I don't want to start a "mines bigger than yours argument", but firstly you admit that you neither live in Spain, nor speak Spanish. 
I have lived full time in Spain since 2004, speak fluent Spanish, have had my UK degree recognised by the ministerio de la vivienda to practice arqitectura tecnica in Spain, and have worked in the Spanish construction industry since 2005.
I hope you think I am worthy of countering your informed opinion?


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

desti said:


> Hi Deb, I doubt that's a good idea, as I've seen so many people who've tried and either can't let the house or do let it and the tenants break everything and/or refuse to leave and it's a disaster. You coud consider having anice, but not expensive, caravan on a campsite, where it'd be safe and would cost you very little; you pay a retainer and then a bit extra when you're using it, but it works out very cheap compared with a house or flat.


Very true desti there is three apartments here that the tenants all spanish have trashed even though they are only a year old its such a risk one the tenants stole the whole kitchen cooker work tops cabinets the whole shebang and the landlord can not do a thing about it its a real risk


----------



## zenkarma (Feb 15, 2013)

Overandout said:


> I hope you think I am worthy of countering your informed opinion?


Absolutely!

Which is why I asked, what are you basing you opinion on? In other words what's your reasoning behind holding it. I think I expressed why I hold the opinion I do, I'm merely asking you for the reason for why you hold yours.

The Spanish banks are writing off a lot of these property debts (underwritten by the Spanish government) which is one of the reasons I don't believe the market will fall much further. Once they're written off, any resale value they can recoup is going to be a plus in their books - that's not a big incentive for them to reduce them any further. 

And yes, my Spanish isn't good! But I'm working on it


----------



## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Fair point.
The debt associated with defaulted loans is one thing, it is probably the principal reason for Spain's woefully slow economic performance.
However that is the national macro economy. When it comes to the housing market (or commercial and industrial property markets), things are simpler. Regardless of debt or initial outlay, the holders of assets will eventually all want a return on them. Now the asset holder may be the banco malo or whoever but the fact remains that there is a huge supply out there waiting to be released. 
What has been sold so far, or is currently on the market falls into two categories; the real bargains, nice places that you and I could never have bought because they were sold to bank executives, their friends and families behind closed doors, or utter rubbish that most people wouldn't live in. This has been released first as it will hardly ever revalue to a decent level given the high stock levels of good properties. These good "normal" properties will find their way onto the market in coming years, and I don't think it is realistic to expect this release to be controlled enough to stop a further drop in prices at first.


----------



## Guest (Feb 16, 2013)

Overandout said:


> Fair point.
> What has been sold so far, or is currently on the market falls into two categories; the real bargains, nice places that you and I could never have bought because they were sold to bank executives, their friends and families behind closed doors, or utter rubbish that most people wouldn't live in.


What makes you say that? Is it a rumour or a proven fact?

There are some really nice houses being offered by banks - I've seen a few nice older ones, as well as small new developments on a "rent with option to buy" contract - I know people who are buying them and have been in several and they're nice. Ialso think that can be a good option for people who are almost sure and do have the money, but want to try the place first - sure, you lose a bit if you then decide not to buy, but it's a small loss and you've had a year in your own home; if you do buy at the end of the year, then everything you've paid is deudcted. I think that may only apply to new properties in developments, though - not sure. (They all belong to Spanish people, so one can't claim they're being foisted off on expats!)


----------



## Guest (Feb 16, 2013)

And it's an alternative to a mortgage, but only at first and only partly.


----------



## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

desti said:


> What makes you say that? Is it a rumour or a proven fact?


 I've heard this recently from three different sources - two of whom are estate agents. I guess it stands to reason. The number of repossessions doesnt equal to the number of repossessed properties being marketed. My agent friends reckon that the good properties are given to "friends" of the banks first and quoted me a few examples - one property was one they sold to a friend of theres a couple of years ago. He did it up, got into a mess and it was repossessed. The agent friend desperately wanted it, but it was sold to the daughter of the local branch manager of said Bank!


I cant see how, with all of the millions of newly built, half built apartment blocks, town house complexes that are littering the costas and campos, that prices can rise or even stay the same?! There will always be the nice villas that will sort of hold their price percentage wise, but even they will be dragged down by everything else.

However, like I keep saying, if you have the money and want to do it, then you cant wait forever - lifes too short. But IMO renting for even just a few months gives you much more of an insite into your needs and the type of area you want to be in. I'm a classic example of that and changed my views completely after living here for a couple of months! And I dont mean the overall area, I mean the type of property, the type of street, the location, the way it faced, the size.....!!!! 

Heres a couple of silly, but interesting examples - I thought it was daft to have south facing windows cos of the heat - however, in reality, in the height of the summer, the sun is too high to shine into the rooms and there are shutters anyway - in the winter, it warms them up beautifully! I wanted "big", but I didnt when it came to sweeping, cleaning and heating!

Jo xxx


----------



## Guest (Feb 16, 2013)

jojo said:


> I've heard this recently from three different sources - two of whom are estate agents. I guess it stands to reason. The number of repossessions doesnt equal to the number of repossessed properties being marketed... ..I cant see how, with all of the millions of newly built, half built apartment blocks, town house complexes that are littering the costas and campos, that prices can rise or even stay the same?! There will always be the nice villas that will sort of hold their price percentage wise, but even they will be dragged down by everything else.


Oh, if one assumes that people want to live on or are referring to the costas, then yes; however, there are also repossessions, sadly, inland. Some are older houses, perfectly habitable; others are in small new developments on the edge of existing small towns and villages. 

Of course bank employees are likely to have first pick, just as any estate agent will give his or her family and friends first refusal on a good place (in any country, at any time) but that's always the case - I expect I'd give my friends fisrt refusal on a place if I were an estate agent - it's not like fraud or something! But it isn't just rubbish that's being resold by banks inland - check the websites. I'vemet several Spanish families and single people who have bought or are buying new houses or flats from banks on the rent-with-option scheme and they're happy. The houses I saw yesterday are five years old, but I'd have guessed newer, so not jerry-built. In fact, I know three of the builders who've worked on said schemes and one of the road contractors - he never got paid and had to accept two unsaleable houses in lieu, because the development was built with holiday people in mind, in an area where there'll never be enough locals to fill it.


----------



## Guest (Feb 16, 2013)

jojo said:


> However, like I keep saying, if you have the money and want to do it, then you cant wait forever - lifes too short. But IMO renting for even just a few months gives you much more of an insite into your needs and the type of area you want to be in. I'm a classic example of that and changed my views completely after living here for a couple of months! And I dont mean the overall area, I mean the type of property, the type of street, the location, the way it faced, the size.....!!!!
> 
> Heres a couple of silly, but interesting examples - I thought it was daft to have south facing windows cos of the heat - however, in reality, in the height of the summer, the sun is too high to shine into the rooms and there are shutters anyway - in the winter, it warms them up beautifully! I wanted "big", but I didnt when it came to sweeping, cleaning and heating!
> 
> Jo xxx


I agree about renting for a short time if you don't already know the country or the area and that's a really good point about things like south-facing windows and other details that aren't obvious at first. (I do hate renting, though - I never feel at home.)

We're so lucky to have home at all. I do think we should remember that, every day. Could've been born in Ethiopa or in a shanty town in Romania.


----------



## tonyinspain (Jul 18, 2011)

desti said:


> Oh, if one assumes that people want to live on or are referring to the costas, then yes; however, there are also repossessions, sadly, inland. Some are older houses, perfectly habitable; others are in small new developments on the edge of existing small towns and villages.
> 
> Of course bank employees are likely to have first pick, just as any estate agent will give his or her family and friends first refusal on a good place (in any country, at any time) but that's always the case - I expect I'd give my friends fisrt refusal on a place if I were an estate agent - it's not like fraud or something! But it isn't just rubbish that's being resold by banks inland - check the websites. I'vemet several Spanish families and single people who have bought or are buying new houses or flats from banks on the rent-with-option scheme and they're happy. The houses I saw yesterday are five years old, but I'd have guessed newer, so not jerry-built. In fact, I know three of the builders who've worked on said schemes and one of the road contractors - he never got paid and had to accept two unsaleable houses in lieu, because the development was built with holiday people in mind, in an area where there'll never be enough locals to fill it.


Funny enough this apartment i have is optioned like that the rent i pay is deducted from the purchase price if i choose to buy 
I wont as i love being on the farm that i own and 9 yrs of campo has changed me i love the campo here i feel like im in a chicken coop i have been in here since christmas so rent before you buy all the way


----------



## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

desti said:


> What makes you say that? Is it a rumour or a proven fact?
> 
> There are some really nice houses being offered by banks - I've seen a few nice older ones, as well as small new developments on a "rent with option to buy" contract - I know people who are buying them and have been in several and they're nice. Ialso think that can be a good option for people who are almost sure and do have the money, but want to try the place first - sure, you lose a bit if you then decide not to buy, but it's a small loss and you've had a year in your own home; if you do buy at the end of the year, then everything you've paid is deudcted. I think that may only apply to new properties in developments, though - not sure. (They all belong to Spanish people, so one can't claim they're being foisted off on expats!)


A few things here:

Obviously I cannot prove what properties are sat in asset lists waiting to be released ont the market in the future, but I do know, like others have stated, of freinds and families of bankers getting some great deals at a time when there was nothing worth buying on the bank's repo lists.

This makes commercial sense; the banks were under pressure to revlaue their assets as they had been including the repossesed homes at their original mortgage value, that pressure induced them to start to liquidate the lower value homes, with little prospect of giving an improved return.

If, as you say, some nicer homes are finding their way onto the market now, that may well be the case (in fact I expect that by the end of the year quite a few properties will come up for sale) but the fact is that prices are still falling. I can see nothing to suggest that an increase in supply of higher quality homes will stop the decrease.

We must take into acount also that whereas in the expat communities "an old quaint village propert" may be attractive, this is not the case for 90% of sales in Spain to nationals who live in city centre flats. An anecdotal case of " i know a guy who bought a cottage in Miramierda de la Sierra for 5o grand and it only needed a new roof" does not represent the national housing market's trends.


----------



## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Another thing that I forgot to add:

I am not doubting those that say that they have a "rent to buy" type of contract, but in Spain these contracts usually carry a large premium.

This is in consideration of the fact that the seller takes a certain risk (either that revenue which is initially rent can be converted into a capital payment or that the sales price is fixed in anticipation, depending on the type of agreement).

The initial down payment for the rental usually includes a large non-refundable "deposit" made in concept of this consideration. If the tenant agrres to buy, this amount is deducted from the final price (along with the agreed proportion of the rental payments) but if the tenenat leaves this amount is NOT refunded. It can be a large sum of money, so be careful with big "deposits" on rent to buy deals because it may be that you will lose this "deposit" unless you later buy.


----------

