# Amazon Prime 80% price increase



## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Amazon is raising the price of an annual subscription to Prime in Spain from €19,95 to €36.

https://elpais.com/tecnologia/2018/08/31/actualidad/1535701198_771977.html

Here's one customer they will be losing...


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## Simon22 (May 22, 2015)

Alcalaina said:


> Amazon is raising the price of an annual subscription to Prime in Spain from €19,95 to €36.
> 
> https://elpais.com/tecnologia/2018/08/31/actualidad/1535701198_771977.html
> 
> Here's one customer they will be losing...


Thanks for that, I have just set a three day reminder so I can cancel in October.


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

They are sneaky ******s. I wonder how many people don't intend to sign up to Prime but end up doing so when purchasing from amazon. They got my mum like that and last month I ordered a product that was only available via Prime so I ended up with the trial period, didn't seem so bad at 20 euro but now to get that email today is a bit crap.

Aside from watching shows I'm not even sure what other benefits of Prime are, next day delivery is often not next day delivery so that isn't a bonus.
Think I will finish watching Seinfeld and cancel it too.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Pazcat said:


> They are sneaky ******s. I wonder how many people don't intend to sign up to Prime but end up doing so when purchasing from amazon. They got my mum like that and last month I ordered a product that was only available via Prime so I ended up with the trial period, didn't seem so bad at 20 euro but now to get that email today is a bit crap.
> 
> Aside from watching shows I'm not even sure what other benefits of Prime are, next day delivery is often not next day delivery so that isn't a bonus.
> Think I will finish watching Seinfeld and cancel it too.


We order quite a lot of stuff via Amazon because we are 45 km from the nearest big shopping centres, so €20 a year for free delivery was good value. But not €36, especially as other suppliers are increasingly offering free delivery as well. 

I've never bothered with Prime video because we already have Netflix and HBO which are heaps better.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

I still think amazon prime at €36 a year is a good deal. We use amazon prime video. Still loads cheaper than UK. We order a lot from them.


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> We order quite a lot of stuff via Amazon because we are 45 km from the nearest big shopping centres, so €20 a year for free delivery was good value. But not €36, especially as other suppliers are increasingly offering free delivery as well.
> 
> I've never bothered with Prime video because we already have Netflix and HBO which are heaps better.


Same, we order quite often from them so in theory the free delivery should be a good deal but unless I'm missing something it only counts for orders from .es. 
We order from all the countries amazon stores and once I paid more for delivery than a sausage from France cost me.

I don't mind the video service but as it is new to me I haven't found much yet, good content for the kids but mainly stuff that is on Netflix, HBO or something you always say "Maybe later". The platform is stable though, I have no issues streaming stuff, HBO has better content but still runs outdated flash based streaming so it is very buffery for me.


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## Hepa (Apr 2, 2018)

You people live on a different planet to me, I have never heard of Prime, free delivery, most firms throughout Europe will not deliver to the Canary Islands.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Pazcat said:


> Same, we order quite often from them so in theory the free delivery should be a good deal but unless I'm missing something it only counts for orders from .es.
> We order from all the countries amazon stores and once I paid more for delivery than a sausage from France cost me.
> 
> I don't mind the video service but as it is new to me I haven't found much yet, good content for the kids but mainly stuff that is on Netflix, HBO or something you always say "Maybe later". The platform is stable though, I have no issues streaming stuff, HBO has better content but still runs outdated flash based streaming so it is very buffery for me.


I run HBO on an iPad connected to the TV with an HDMI cable, it's fine.

Only problem is you have to get off the sofa to pause it...


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Alcalaina said:


> I run HBO on an iPad connected to the TV with an HDMI cable, it's fine.
> 
> Only problem is you have to get off the sofa to pause it...


Do you guys pay for Netflix and HBO?

What cable from iPAD?

:confused2:


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Alcalaina said:


> I run HBO on an iPad connected to the TV with an HDMI cable, it's fine.
> 
> Only problem is you have to get off the sofa to pause it...


I think it is more internet dependent really, we don't have fibreoptic so are on a wimax system which to be fair is more than enough for everything to stream just HBO use a really outdated app. No issues with Netflix or Prime.
We watch it through a PS4 which is real handy.



> Do you guys pay for Netflix and HBO?
> 
> What cable from iPAD?


I pay 10.99 for Netflix and 7.99 for HBO.
The first month is free and if you don't want to pay for it you can cancel it before payment is taken.
This is why Amazons price hike is rather extreme, honestly I hope they lose enough customers to realise it was a poor move, don't want the other platforms catching on. lol.

Even at 20 a month I was skeptical of Amazons value for money now I know it's not worth it at 36. Their content is no match for Netflix and HBO and unless they have started offering free shipping across all countries shops then I can't see the point continuing with them.

No idea about the ipad though, as I said I watch it via the app on PS4. I'm fairly sure most smart tvs get the app too.


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## MaryHinge (Jul 13, 2018)

Pazcat said:


> I pay 10.99 for Netflix and 7.99 for HBO.
> The first month is free and if you don't want to pay for it you can cancel it before payment is taken.
> This is why Amazons price hike is rather extreme, honestly I hope they lose enough customers to realise it was a poor move, don't want the other platforms catching on. lol.
> 
> ...


It's €36 per annum NOT per month


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Pazcat said:


> I think it is more internet dependent really, we don't have fibreoptic so are on a wimax system which to be fair is more than enough for everything to stream just HBO use a really outdated app. No issues with Netflix or Prime.
> We watch it through a PS4 which is real handy.
> 
> 
> ...


A MONTH. I’ll stick to amazon at €36 a year including my deliveries. Don’t watch enough TV to justify €227 a year


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

lol, so it is.
Well that is better but still don't see the value for it.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Hepa said:


> You people live on a different planet to me, I have never heard of Prime, free delivery, most firms throughout Europe will not deliver to the Canary Islands.


No, we're all on the same planet, just different parts of it!
I know exactly what Amazon Prime is, but choose not to use it. I use Amazon, but try to use other sites when possible because I don't like the way Amazon is dominating the marketplace, or the way that Amazon constantly "guides" me to products and offers I don't want, but they think I should want. Other people like Amazon for that exact reason, because they are leaders in so many fields and because shopping with them is easy. Can't please all of the people all of the time...
PS Bet Amazon delivers to the Canaries, and many others too, no prob. Just have to pay for it


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Pazcat said:


> lol, so it is.
> Well that is better but still don't see the value for it.


We will have to differ on Value. 

We watch two hours of TV a day maximum. We have a mobdro box purchased for €40 for sports which is husbands football covered.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Megsmum said:


> Do you guys pay for Netflix and HBO?
> 
> What cable from iPAD?
> 
> :confused2:


We pay the same as Pazcat. Pretty good value considering what some people pay for UK TV, VPNs etc. How much is a TV licence or DVD box set? Some really good content especially HBO. We watch it for two or three hours most nights. You can always cancel the subscription for a few months and reactivate it when there's some new stuff available.

We use a standard HDMI cable that goes into the TV HDMI socket. You need an adapter for your standard Apple fitting at the other end (mine is Lightning). It was quite expensive, but all Apple accessories are.


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## Desiato (Jun 1, 2015)

The content on the Spanish Prime Video has been increasing steadily over the last year so this price hike is not a complete shock. If you look at the cost to other European countries and the USA it is just the first step before it goes to €49, €59, €69 etc over the coming years. I don't have Netflix or HBO but I do get my UK TV from a private tracker and my films from Popcorntime so for €36 a year it fills in my TV gaps and includes fastish delivery so, it's still not a bad deal.

https://ebookfriendly.com/amazon-prime-membership-price-comparison/


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Megsmum said:


> We will have to differ on Value.
> 
> We watch two hours of TV a day maximum. We have a mobdro box purchased for €40 for sports which is husbands football covered.


Well considering most things from .es have free delivery anyway then it is just down to the tv content which is ok but not as good as the other two. I also did not like not having an option to order without signing up for the trial period which funnily enough ended 3 days ago and then all of the sudden they announce the price rise. But seeing as it is already paid for this year then I'll stick with it for the year and re-evaluate.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Alcalaina said:


> Amazon is raising the price of an annual subscription to Prime in Spain from €19,95 to €36.
> 
> https://elpais.com/tecnologia/2018/08/31/actualidad/1535701198_771977.html
> 
> Here's one customer they will be losing...


Still cheaper than the Amazon Prime subscription in the UK of £79.00 both in 2017 and this year.


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## cermignano (Feb 9, 2017)

I only use Amazon for my kindle books. There is a big argument here about how little tax they pay in UK.
Also now and then I get what looks like 'genuine' Amazon emails telling me that my Prime will be renewed unless I contact them. I have never had Prime so I forward the emails to the support/phishing department at Amazon.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Desiato said:


> The content on the Spanish Prime Video has been increasing steadily over the last year so this price hike is not a complete shock. If you look at the cost to other European countries and the USA it is just the first step before it goes to €49, €59, €69 etc over the coming years. I don't have Netflix or HBO but I do get my UK TV from a private tracker and my films from Popcorntime so for €36 a year it fills in my TV gaps and includes fastish delivery so, it's still not a bad deal.
> 
> https://ebookfriendly.com/amazon-prime-membership-price-comparison/


To tell you the truth I get more entertainment from a Trump Summit with Vladimir Putin in Helsinki,
than I do from 'pay to view' TV.

:lol:


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## 1632578 (Feb 21, 2018)

I got email from Amazon says, “El precio de la suscripción anual de Amazon Prime ha incrementado de 19,95€ a 36,00€ el 31 de agosto de 2018.”

But we’ve been in Spain less than 3 months and just started our Amazon subscription so the email also says, “Cuando termine tu periodo de prueba de 30 días gratis el 14 de septiembre de 2018, pasarás a una suscripción de pago y te cobraremos 19,95€ por un año de ventajas Amazon Prime. Las siguientes renovaciones de tu suscripción se realizarán al nuevo precio de 36,00€.“

We have been AmazonPrime customers for several years. The price in U.S was $79 annually when we first started using it. Some time later it went up to $99 and this July just as we were preparing to come to Spain the price jumped to $129. My family and most friends who use Prime renewed even at the new price.

I'll figure out if *Amazon.es* is worth its cost. In US it certainly is worth it, if you use it. Browser apps can tell if any product is really cheaper on Amazon and/or with the Prime delivery or if the product is cheaper somewhere else. For us, about 60% of the time the Prime would be cheaper but even when it wasn't, the convenience of shopping online then not having to make another stop on my way home was worth the difference in price. PrimeMusic especially was good since it let us drop other music services. Having the PrimeVideo in addition to Netflix and local channels gave us all video we needed. With the household account we streamed music/video into almost every room of our old house with everyone listening to or watching different things. We routinely ordered variations of things to compare then returned those we didn't want; for several years we ordered 3-5 different pairs of shoes, wore them around the house a day or two and send back the ones that didn't fit. You might think that's crazy but with both of us working more than 8 hour days, commute back and forth to work, taking care of family and other commitments it made sense to spend 30min online to order the shoes, 5 min per pair a couple times over the week, then maybe 20 min to repack the returns and request the pickup. At most 2hrs spent in the comfort of our own home at our convenience. Of course not all orders and returns worked out so smoothly but most did and it makes the cost worth it. Last year our old city (Austin, TX) became a PrimeNow distributor so we had just started into ordering groceries through AmazonPrime and didn't see how well that works but most of their groceries are from WholeFoods which has fantastic organic selections.

We don't know our way around yet and without a car, transporting stuff is a pain. One of the things we needed for our new apartment here in Bilbao was chairs for the patio. After searching nearby local stores, we went to Barrakaldo Ikea in August. Ikea has a great, inexpensive selection of almost anything anyone could want for home except patio chairs. Their least expensive were pressed tin, ugly, flimsy chairs. Thinking this was the best we're getting we bought 2 at 19.99euros. Trying to get them back to Bilbao was an issue. The bus driver wouldn't let us on the bus with the chairs so we decided to call a taxi. Unfortunately that was the day taxis in our area were on sympathy strike against Uber in Madrid. So we asked Ikea about shipping them to our apartment. That was going to take 8 days and cost 49euro.... 9euro more than the cost of the cheap chairs. So we returned the chairs (after 68 minutes waiting). The next day I accepted the AmazonPrime offer and ordered two strong, heavy duty, ergonomic, resin chairs for 24.99euro each. Three days later two big boxes were delivered to my 11th floor apartment and even carried out to the patio. Since then we've ordered shoes, electronic stuff and even pillows.

I'm hoping *Amazon.es* continues to be worth its cost. Certainly at 19.99 its already a deal!!


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

pcgatx said:


> I'm hoping *Amazon.es* continues to be worth its cost. Certainly at 19.99 its already a deal!!


There's no doubt Amazon.es is incredibly useful and I will continue to use it for online shopping.

But the only advantages of Prime, for me, were free delivery within 48 hours. Over the last few months I have routinely received emails from Amazon apologising for the fact that the delivery would take much longer due to problems in their supply chain or suchlike. I'm still waiting for a pressure cooker valve I ordered last Monday, which had "guaranteed" next day delivery!

Many other non-Prime suppliers offer free delivery now, and if I have to pay €2.95 postage every couple of months that's still cheaper than €36 a year.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Alcalaina said:


> There's no doubt Amazon.es is incredibly useful and I will continue to use it for online shopping.
> 
> But the only advantages of Prime, for me, were free delivery within 48 hours. Over the last few months I have routinely received emails from Amazon apologising for the fact that the delivery would take much longer due to problems in their supply chain or suchlike. I'm still waiting for a pressure cooker valve I ordered last Monday, which had "guaranteed" next day delivery!
> 
> Many other non-Prime suppliers offer free delivery now, and if I have to pay €2.95 postage every couple of months that's still cheaper than €36 a year.


Next day delivery or even 48 hour delivery promises have always been a problem in Spain; it's still not
like the UK in that respect but so long as it arrives, it doesn't bother me much.


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## Simon22 (May 22, 2015)

Williams2 said:


> Next day delivery or even 48 hour delivery promises have always been a problem in Spain; it's still not
> like the UK in that respect but so long as it arrives, it doesn't bother me much.


It used to be Prime delivery meant tomorrow, now not so much. I am happy to wait a few days for the odd thing and Prime video cannot be downloaded to another device so I end up getting them elsewhere anyway.


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## Brangus (May 1, 2010)

maureensco said:


> Also now and then I get what looks like 'genuine' Amazon emails telling me that my Prime will be renewed unless I contact them. I have never had Prime so I forward the emails to the support/phishing department at Amazon.


Voice of experience here: Log in to your Amazon account and make sure you aren't subscribed to Prime. Apparently we somehow signed up by accident and didn't even realize it until I received the email the other day informing me of the price increase. I, too, thought for a moment it was phishing, but decided to check.

Canceling Prime involved clicking in three dialog boxes on three successive screens, along the lines of:
Screen 1: "Cancel Prime?" OK.
Screen 2: "Are you sure you really want to cancel?" YES.
Screen 3: "Are you absolutely certain?" OH, FOR GOD'S SAKE!

No doubt it took only one mindless click to enroll!


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Williams2 said:


> Next day delivery or even 48 hour delivery promises have always been a problem in Spain; it's still not
> like the UK in that respect but so long as it arrives, it doesn't bother me much.


It bothers me when I've waited in all day for nothing. I'd rather they didn't make promises they can't keep.

Some delivery companies, naming no names, actually email you to say nobody was at home when they tried to deliver. And you haven't left the house!


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Brangus said:


> Voice of experience here: Log in to your Amazon account and make sure you aren't subscribed to Prime. *Apparently we somehow signed up by accident and didn't even realize it* until I received the email the other day informing me of the price increase. I, too, thought for a moment it was phishing, but decided to check.
> 
> Canceling Prime involved clicking in three dialog boxes on three successive screens, along the lines of:
> Screen 1: "Cancel Prime?" OK.
> ...


Now a lot of Amazon users have complained about that - namely that when ordering an item from
Amazon, the sneaky website panels and options also signed them up to Amazon Prime; using the
same Credit card details without the Amazon customer even realizing it, until it was too late.

And yes the Second biggest complaint was the difficulties encountered in cancelling their Amazon
Prime subscription, as you detailed above. With many having to resort to phoning Amazon
customer services; that's if you can find the phone number for Amazon customer services in the
first place; as Contact address and phone numbers tend to be hidden away in the labyrinth of
clicks you have to make, in order to drill down to their Customer Services number.

Again another sneaky way of thwarting customers on anything that's been up for a hard sell,
over the internet.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Alcalaina said:


> It bothers me when I've waited in all day for nothing. I'd rather they didn't make promises they can't keep.
> 
> Some delivery companies, naming no names, actually email you to say nobody was at home when they tried to deliver. And you haven't left the house!


Chill out - this is Spain, the land of the Afternoon Siestas. :lol:

Of course I know what you mean, although these days they send you an email with a link to how
far your package has reached before finally arriving on your doorstep.
You mentioned it above - although never had an occasion when it's promised to arrive that
day and it didn't; except on one occasion when the delivery address was slightly wrong and
I corrected the address on the delivery firms link page.

For me, if the package is 'out for delivery' when you click on it ( after getting up in the morning )
you can be sure that your time is not wasted, waiting at home for delivery that day.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

We live 8KM from nearest living person. Our deliveries always go to the petrol station. I do order a fair bit from Amazon es. and even in our neck of the woods next day delivery is usually the day after next day, but I’m not bothered. Most of what I order has a track on it and I can see exactly where the goods are in the process. I find Amazon customer service to be very good and on one occasion when I waited five days for a next day delivery I got a credit:clap2:


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## 1632578 (Feb 21, 2018)

We have most of our purchases delivered to the Amazon Locker. There are at least 3 lockers within 10 min walk from my apartment. The one we use the most is the Ociomania across the street from my apartment building. They're open from 9am - 11pm (except that damn siesta). The packages get delivered there and we pick them up at our convenience.

We thought the Ociomania was just some kind of snack shop so had not been there. When we picked up our first package I saw they do have the biggest selection of corn chips, potato chips, candy and drinks of any place we have been. But they also sell essentials like bread eggs and milk. And they rent dvd movies and video games.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

pcgatx said:


> We have most of our purchases delivered to the Amazon Locker. There are at least 3 lockers within 10 min walk from my apartment. The one we use the most is the Ociomania across the street from my apartment building. They're open from 9am - 11pm (except that damn siesta). The packages get delivered there and we pick them up at our convenience.
> 
> We thought the Ociomania was just some kind of snack shop so had not been there. When we picked up our first package I saw they do have the biggest selection of corn chips, potato chips, candy and drinks of any place we have been. But they also sell essentials like bread eggs and milk. And they rent dvd movies and video games.


Which brings us back to my post.... If Amazon continues to grow and people continue to ignore local shops, there will soon not *be* any local shops, but perhaps that's the society that people want. This debate has been going on forever in the UK as more and more high shops close down for various reasons (Woolworths, British Home Stores, a huge number of Marks and Sparks are being closed at this moment) and out of town shopping is built and more recently online shopping takes over. Weston Super Mare is Charity Shop paradise, many of the "normal" shops having packed up and left and back in Spain even the local shopping centres (malls) struggle if there are under 50 shops. Many of the clothes shops have styles or sizes only available on line. 
Online is great in many ways, but like Airbnb or Uber it's making huge changes in the social make up of our towns and cities and it's a challenge!!
Oh, and in Spain at least, working conditions in the logistics centres in Amazon are much maligned. Not sure what working conditions are like in shops and offices.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Which brings us back to my post.... If Amazon continues to grow and people continue to ignore local shops, there will soon not *be* any local shops, but perhaps that's the society that people want. This debate has been going on forever in the UK as more and more high shops close down for various reasons (Woolworths, British Home Stores, a huge number of Marks and Sparks are being closed at this moment) and out of town shopping is built and more recently online shopping takes over. Weston Super Mare is Charity Shop paradise, many of the "normal" shops having packed up and left and back in Spain even the local shopping centres (malls) struggle if there are under 50 shops. Many of the clothes shops have styles or sizes only available on line.
> Online is great in many ways, but like Airbnb or Uber it's making huge changes in the social make up of our towns and cities and it's a challenge!!
> Oh, and in Spain at least, working conditions in the logistics centres in Amazon are much maligned. Not sure what working conditions are like in shops and offices.



I agree with everything you have said. I believe the government should ensure that high street business don’t fall away due to online business. They could develop a tax that equates to the ridiculous business rates that night street stores pay, it is the job of governto ensure that workers rights are upheld and a decent wage is paid to the workers etc etc 

However, the fabric of society is always changing, in the UK there are very few high street bakers, greengrocers, butchers or fishmongers, they have all mainly fallen foul of the supermarket chains. Who actually goes to a travel agent to book a flight, who uses a broker service for insurances, we all, in the main, use the internet for these services, which have equally shutdown businesses. I no longer use local wool shops ( even when in the UK) I use online woolshops as they offer me a wider range of choices at a competitive price, because they don’t have to payout business rates have a store front that is much more expensive than an online store. I could list many businesses that you don’t find on the high street anymore. 
Even here in my village, shops that were once here no longer are because everyone shops forty minutes away in supermarkets. 

I think that it’s a generation thing, the youth don’t remember or shop in any of the shops we have mentioned so their loss means nothing, they are an internet generation, but as I said, the biggest issue is the unfair costs involved in online v bricks and mortar and the tax avoidance issues surrounding overseas owned businesses


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Very interesting thread.

I am in two minds on both issues.

With regards to the ethics question, I tend to agree with Megsmum. If high street shops can't compete, then capitalism will select the strongest provider as the survivor. Sad for those that lose out, but in 10 years a successor may come along with a better business model which threatens Amazon. WHat will happen then? Will there be threads on here about how we must save Amazon?
The problem I see however is the situation of the employees, especially the delivery staff. This is where the government needs to step in and control contracts of employment to ensure fair wages and conditions. I did stop using Amazon during the recent strikes and I will do so again if need be.
With regards to the price, I can't believe that anyone really thought that Amazon would continue to provide Prime services for less than 2€ / month, when media competitors like Netflix and HBO are charging 5 or 6 times that. And that is ignoring the supposed benefits of delivery charges and times. I personally find the Prime video offering to be quite good. The Electric Dreams short films series made by Channel 4 films in conjunction with Amazon was, in my opinion, worth 20€ on its own, but of course that is subjective. 

I will not cancel my subscription, but I will measure my use of their services based on their reaction to their corporate responsibility.


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## Isobella (Oct 16, 2014)

Megsmum said:


> I agree with everything you have said. I believe the government should ensure that high street business don’t fall away due to online business. They could develop a tax that equates to the ridiculous business rates that night street stores pay, it is the job of governto ensure that workers rights are upheld and a decent wage is paid to the workers etc etc
> 
> However, the fabric of society is always changing, in the UK there are very few high street bakers, greengrocers, butchers or fishmongers, they have all mainly fallen foul of the supermarket chains. Who actually goes to a travel agent to book a flight, who uses a broker service for insurances, we all, in the main, use the internet for these services, which have equally shutdown businesses.


Exactly, I buy on internet a lot, more choice, easy returns etc. The local travel agent closed down a few years ago although I never used it.

Around here high St butchers, fishmongers etc. do very well by selling good quality local produce. People want a little bit more these days re. quality. They are more expensive though and for those on low incomes they prefer Tesco. Local Butcher in Arundel even prepares his own dog meat brand.
The little shop closest to me in Spain had great fruit and veg if you were lucky enough to buy when it came in but they carried on selling things until products nearly walked out of the shop

Shop close to me which is thriving.

https://www.thesussexproducecompany.co.uk/shop


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Nothing is stopping bricks and mortar shops going online too, in fact if they are not then they probably shouldn't be complaining about those that are. Granted not all businesses are made for online shopping but a visible presence would be a good start.

I see it a lot in Spain especially, word of mouth isn't an appropriate business plan. Neither is facebook and whatsapp. If I can't find any info on you I will use a company which I can before I seek you out. If you are not open because you want a mid afternoon break or not open again to 7pm then I will find someone who is open and use them. If you deliver food to my town but don't include it in your online booking system I will drive down the hill and pick up dinner from your competitors instead of pick up the phone. 

Everything changes, mom and pop stores can still compete to a degree and they can even operate inside of the large tech giants like amazon.


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## 1632578 (Feb 21, 2018)

I agree this may be a societal or generational change. I grew up in mid-70's- early 80's, in West Texas. There was a penny store (TG&Y I think) within walking distance that sold a few basic things but that was it. So at least once a week we would pile in to my dad's pickup and drive to the stores. We shopped in KMarts, Sears and Montgomery Wards department stores and large groceries like Safeway. I'm sure we occasionally went to mom&pop stores but I don't remember any specifics, so I have no attachments to that type of shopping.

I do believe cities should give tax breaks to small businesses for helping them stay where they are. The tax breaks should at least be in proportion to tax breaks given to lure larger businesses to the city. Currently my old city, Austin TX, passed a resolution to give a 20 acre parcel of land, tax free!!! for 20 years, to a developer to build a soccer stadium. The other taxing authorities there are going to fight it, so this may never happen. But if a city can give away 20 years worth of tax revenue for a facility that will sit empty and unused most of the time, why not give small businesses some love too. Think about that.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

pcgatx said:


> I agree this may be a societal or generational change. I grew up in mid-70's- early 80's, in West Texas. There was a penny store (TG&Y I think) within walking distance that sold a few basic things but that was it. So at least once a week we would pile in to my dad's pickup and drive to the stores. We shopped in KMarts, Sears and Montgomery Wards department stores and large groceries like Safeway. I'm sure we occasionally went to mom&pop stores but I don't remember any specifics, so I have no attachments to that type of shopping.
> 
> I do believe cities should give tax breaks to small businesses for helping them stay where they are. The tax breaks should at least be in proportion to tax breaks given to lure larger businesses to the city. Currently my old city, Austin TX, passed a resolution to give a 20 acre parcel of land, tax free!!! for 20 years, to a developer to build a soccer stadium. The other taxing authorities there are going to fight it, so this may never happen. But if a city can give away 20 years worth of tax revenue for a facility that will sit empty and unused most of the time, why not give small businesses some love too. Think about that.


I talked specifically about the UK and Spain because I think many areas of the US have had a car culture for far longer than the UK and Spain. I was in Edgewater, Maryland in 1981 and tried to walk to the nearest shop which was perfectly doable, just that nobody did it. People were practically falling out of their cars to see me walking alongside the road. Nobody had walke din that area for probably decades.


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

The worst part of any of these online subscription services, is what seems to be the default setting of automatic
annual resubscription with many of them.
Of course you can turn the feature off but it always annoys me that the majority of them have automatic 
annual resubscription as the defualt setting, and to switch it OFF, you have to go through page after page
of clicks, sometimes to drill down to the webpage where you can switch automatic resubscription OFF.


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Isobella said:


> Exactly, I buy on internet a lot, more choice, easy returns etc. The local travel agent closed down a few years ago although I never used it.
> 
> Around here high St butchers, fishmongers etc. do very well by selling good quality local produce. People want a little bit more these days re. quality. They are more expensive though and for those on low incomes they prefer Tesco. Local Butcher in Arundel even prepares his own dog meat brand.
> The little shop closest to me in Spain had great fruit and veg if you were lucky enough to buy when it came in but they carried on selling things until products nearly walked out of the shop
> ...


There's a Sussex Produce shop in Steyning where my brother lives. Lovely though it is, you have to be pretty well-heeled to shop there. I used to go in occasionally just to look round; over two quid for a small aubergine  Nice Harveys beer though and if you get the meat pies half-price on their sell-by date they are good value.

It would be nice if everyone could afford the quality they want, but the world isn't like that. I'm fortunate to live in a village where many people grow their own produce and provided you can adjust to living on what's in season, you can live well on a budget. Little purple and white stripey aubergines just arrived, €1,50 for a kilo...; green figs from a neighbour's tree bursting with flavour waiting to be roasted with honey and rosemary and topped with a dob of goat's cheese.

So I feel I get the best of both worlds. As well as excellent fruit and veg we have traditional artisanal food producers in walking distance selling organic cheeses, loaves and pastries baked in wood-fired ovens, free range meats and game at affordable prices. Then if you need something you can't get locally, there is always Amazon. Or Morrisons in Gibraltar for English teabags!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Pazcat said:


> Nothing is stopping bricks and mortar shops going online too, in fact if they are not then they probably shouldn't be complaining about those that are. Granted not all businesses are made for online shopping but a visible presence would be a good start.
> 
> I see it a lot in Spain especially, word of mouth isn't an appropriate business plan. Neither is facebook and whatsapp. If I can't find any info on you I will use a company which I can before I seek you out. If you are not open because you want a mid afternoon break or not open again to 7pm then I will find someone who is open and use them. If you deliver food to my town but don't include it in your online booking system I will drive down the hill and pick up dinner from your competitors instead of pick up the phone.
> 
> Everything changes, mom and pop stores can still compete to a degree and they can even operate inside of the large tech giants like amazon.


First of all yes, everything changes; it's useless to deny that and I would even say that changes are necessary to reflect the needs of the people who make up any given society.
However, I think it's high time people became more aware of the consequences of their actions, or more to the point governments need to be looking at long term effects not the cash in the pocket short term effect of changes in society. Plastics is the latest thing, the latest trendy thing to become informed about and I'm all behind it, but I do not think it should be necessary to wait until islands of plastic (today I found out there are 5 sizable islands of waste plastic in the oceans, not just 1!) have formed before action is taken against the manufacture of useless plastic objects (for example in beauty products used for exfoliating many manufacturers use mini mini plastic beads. What is the sense in that??) IMO governments should be looking at what is manufactured and legislating wisely. Disposable razors, pens, plastic cups... all useful in determined circumstances, but not for everyday use again in my opinion.
The same goes for out of town shopping as it is known in the UK. If the big players move out of town many of the consumers will too which creates multiple new situations - more traffic, more roads, more pollution, more loss of land, empty high streets, possibly more employment, possibly more spending... Those empty high streets could be an opportunity (make them residential areas, entertainment areas, schools, universities, job centres...) but there has be a PLAN and there so rarely is. What there is, is dingy run down areas and shops struggling to make it.
Politics nowadays is run on 4/5 year personal publicity plans, there's no long term vision for the nation, county or town and that's a big mistake!


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## Williams2 (Sep 15, 2013)

Pesky Wesky said:


> First of all yes, everything changes; it's useless to deny that and I would even say that changes are necessary to reflect the needs of the people who make up any given society.
> However, I think it's high time people became more aware of the consequences of their actions, or more to the point governments need to be looking at long term effects not the cash in the pocket short term effect of changes in society. Plastics is the latest thing, the latest trendy thing to become informed about and I'm all behind it, but I do not think it should be necessary to wait until islands of plastic (today I found out there are 5 sizable islands of waste plastic in the oceans, not just 1!) have formed before action is taken against the manufacture of useless plastic objects (for example in beauty products used for exfoliating many manufacturers use mini mini plastic beads. What is the sense in that??) IMO governments should be looking at what is manufactured and legislating wisely. Disposable razors, pens, plastic cups... all useful in determined circumstances, but not for everyday use again in my opinion.
> The same goes for out of town shopping as it is known in the UK. If the big players move out of town many of the consumers will too which creates multiple new situations - more traffic, more roads, more pollution, more loss of land, empty high streets, possibly more employment, possibly more spending... Those empty high streets could be an opportunity (make them residential areas, entertainment areas, schools, universities, job centres...) but there has be a PLAN and there so rarely is. What there is, is dingy run down areas and shops struggling to make it.
> Politics nowadays is run on 4/5 year personal publicity plans, there's no long term vision for the nation, county or town and that's a big mistake!



Sad to say but the War on Plastic is going the same way as the War on Drugs - out of control !!


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## Ifn (Jan 29, 2017)

Williams2 said:


> Sad to say but the War on Plastic is going the same way as the War on Drugs - out of control !!


I do try not to buy a plastic bag.....but I’ve been wondering about something. I live in Madrid. My building uses bins for trash. When there are no bags how will trash be thrown out? And what about cat people? They need those bags. One of my sisters lives in San Francisco where they have strict recycling and composting. She wraps her trash in newspapers. But I read my papers online. 
As for Amazon I was addicted to it in New York but here I do try to balance buying some stuff from them and other things from smaller OLD shops. And there are things to watch on prime video if you’re juvenile of mind like I am. I loved The Man In The High Castle. But yeah, not as much as Netflix. I don’t use my television at all. I watch everything on my tablet.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Ifn said:


> I do try not to buy a plastic bag.....but I’ve been wondering about something. I live in Madrid. My building uses bins for trash. When there are no bags how will trash be thrown out?


You buy rubbish bags in the supermarket or Chinese shop or from a herbolario type shop where you might get ones made from recycled plastic. You can get ones that decompost, but I don't recommend the ones from Carrefour


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## stevesainty (Jan 7, 2011)

If you want to use Amazon Prime to watch the video content, without lots of messing about, you need 2 things.

1 to be in the country where you take out the subscription, or use some software to disguise your IP/DNS
2 to have your registered address and the address of your preferred payment method in the country where your subscription is.

If you want to watch amazon.co.uk whilst you do not have the 2 things above you receive a message "not available in your region"

Similarly with amazon.com

If you have a Spanish address you can only watch the video content of amazon.es


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Ifn said:


> I do try not to buy a plastic bag.....but I’ve been wondering about something. I live in Madrid. My building uses bins for trash. When there are no bags how will trash be thrown out? And what about cat people? They need those bags.


Repair, re-use, recycle!

If loose fruit wasn't sold in think plastic bags, I would have to buy them for the cat litter tray.

If the trash wasn't put in plastic bags before going into the bins, all the feral cats, dogs and rats would have a field day. It's bad enough already.

But we are never going to have a plastic-free world. The answer is to develop materials that are 100% recyclable, and not use it when there is a viable alternative.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

On the news last night, Amazon valued at one trillion dollars
https://www.theguardian.com/technol...ond-1tn-company?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_WhatsApp
Posted by a politician

Amazon has just become the second ever $1 trillion company after tripling its UK profits. But it paid £2.8 million less tax in the UK this year compared to last year. Does that sound right to you?


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## alpinist (Feb 8, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> I still think amazon prime at €36 a year is a good deal. We use amazon prime video. Still loads cheaper than UK. We order a lot from them.


Totally agree, don't forget Amazon Music too. Replaced Spotify and Netflix for me. If you (or your kids) like gaming, there's Twitch as well. I couldn't believe they were doing it all for 20€ a year. 

Last year we got a Firestick here but it's obviously the HD1080 only, non-voice activated one, so inferior to the UK version. Last month our smart TV had a firmware update waiting though, and after doing it the Prime Video app appeared and this plays at 4K when available, still in the same annual subscription price!


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

_Si_ said:


> Totally agree, don't forget Amazon Music too. Replaced Spotify and Netflix for me. If you (or your kids) like gaming, there's Twitch as well. I couldn't believe they were doing it all for 20€ a year.
> 
> Last year we got a Firestick here but it's obviously the HD1080 only, non-voice activated one, so inferior to the UK version. Last month our smart TV had a firmware update waiting though, and after doing it the Prime Video app appeared and this plays at 4K when available, still in the same annual subscription price!


I'd never looked at the Music app before. It seems to mirror Spotify - I even found my own band on there! Thanks for the tip.

What make is your smart TV? Ours is Philips and had Netflix pre-installed. It wouldn't let me add the HBO app so I'm wondering about Prime.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

A few days ago I had a mail from Amazon. I didn't open it at first because when I'm on the kindle I can't hover over and see the address of the sender. When I finally opened it on Friday night. It said that on Friday I would be charged 36€ for Prime. I never wanted Prime in the first place, but thought I had inadvertently signed up for it at some stage. I was desperately looking at how to cancel the subscription before midnight and managed to do it. I was surprised to get an email to say that not only was I no longer signed up for Prime but also my initial 19.90€ would be refunded as I had not used it!


> Hemos cancelado tu suscripción a Amazon Prime como nos has pedido.
> Dado que no te has beneficiado de las ventajas de tu suscripción a Amazon Prime, vamos a proceder al reembolso de EUR 19,95, que corresponde a la cuota de suscripción, incluyendo las tasas e impuestos respectivos. El reembolso debería tramitarse en los siguientes 5 a 7 días laborables y aparecerá como crédito en tu siguiente extracto bancario


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## cermignano (Feb 9, 2017)

Pesky Wesky. I get a lot of those spam emails. I forward them to Amazon. the email is something like [email protected]


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

maureensco said:


> Pesky Wesky. I get a lot of those spam emails. I forward them to Amazon. the email is something like [email protected]


But, how do you forward them without opening them?


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## growurown (Sep 3, 2018)

Pesky Wesky said:


> But, how do you forward them without opening them?


you can hover over the sender in your email client and see the address it originated from - if it is not from a verified amazon address then you check the box and forward it without opening it.


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## alpinist (Feb 8, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> I'd never looked at the Music app before. It seems to mirror Spotify - I even found my own band on there! Thanks for the tip.
> 
> What make is your smart TV? Ours is Philips and had Netflix pre-installed. It wouldn't let me add the HBO app so I'm wondering about Prime.


The TV is a 2016 Panasonic, great screen but it runs some weird Firefox OS which has since been abandoned by Mozilla. When we got it (here in Spain) I was aware it didn't have the Amazon app but the UK version of it did, and others. That annoyed me so I was trying to find ways to install UK firmware to get Amazon, iPlayer etc, but in the end never managed and then Amazon released the Firestick Basic here anyway. It's possible the Amazon app appearing was nothing to do with the firmware update, it's not like we actually use any of the apps (except for the odd month of free Netflix), but I had a look after the update and there it was. 

Re the music app: If I look for more 'obscure' stuff it tells me I need to upgrade my subscription so your band must be pretty big!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

growurown said:


> you can hover over the sender in your email client and see the address it originated from - if it is not from a verified amazon address then you check the box and forward it without opening it.


Ahhh, I never knew you could forward without opening. I will try. Thanks!!


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

_Si_ said:


> The TV is a 2016 Panasonic, great screen but it runs some weird Firefox OS which has since been abandoned by Mozilla. When we got it (here in Spain) I was aware it didn't have the Amazon app but the UK version of it did, and others. That annoyed me so I was trying to find ways to install UK firmware to get Amazon, iPlayer etc, but in the end never managed and then Amazon released the Firestick Basic here anyway. It's possible the Amazon app appearing was nothing to do with the firmware update, it's not like we actually use any of the apps (except for the odd month of free Netflix), but I had a look after the update and there it was.
> 
> Re the music app: If I look for more 'obscure' stuff it tells me I need to upgrade my subscription so your band must be pretty big!


Thanks. Ours is a Phillips Android TV and it won't accept the Prime app, so I'll continue with the HDMI cable/iPad solution which I have to use for HBO. I'm only watching Bosch anyway.

My old band was VERY obscure and not at all big, so the record company must have had some sort of bulk deal for the whole catalogue. I knew it was on Spotify, never saw any royalties though!


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## Chancerz (Feb 12, 2017)

Amazon Prime in Spain - Wow! 

Didn't know that... 

Bonus!


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## cermignano (Feb 9, 2017)

Pesky Wesky. You don't need to open. Just go to reply, then drop-down and click 'forward'


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

maureensco said:


> Pesky Wesky. You don't need to open. Just go to reply, then drop-down and click 'forward'


Can't do that on Yahoo...


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

growurown said:


> you can hover over the sender in your email client and see the address it originated from - if it is not from a verified amazon address then you check the box and forward it without opening it.


 That's what I do now, but what I can't do is send it on to Amazon without opening it. I use Yahoo. Yep completely untrendy. I have gmail too, but barely use it.

When using Kindle Fire however, you can't hover and see the address.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Pesky Wesky said:


> That's what I do now, but what I can't do is send it on to Amazon without opening it. I use Yahoo. Yep completely untrendy. I have gmail too, but barely use it.
> 
> When using Kindle Fire however, you can't hover and see the address.


Can you forward to a friend who can then forward it. .


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> Can you forward to a friend who can then forward it. .


I can't forward any mail without opening it


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Pesky Wesky said:


> I can't forward any mail without opening it


It doesn't matter if you open it. Just don't click on any links within the email, or open any attachments.

https://www.howtogeek.com/135546/ht...ed-just-by-opening-an-email-and-when-you-can/


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## elaineyr (Sep 13, 2018)

Forgive the ignorance -- does Prime in Spain operate the same way as in U.S.? We are from the US, moving to Spain in a month, and use it quite a lot at home. Would be good to know what to do/expect.
Thanks!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Alcalaina said:


> It doesn't matter if you open it. Just don't click on any links within the email, or open any attachments.
> 
> https://www.howtogeek.com/135546/ht...ed-just-by-opening-an-email-and-when-you-can/


Thanks for that Alca; I had no idea


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

elaineyr said:


> Forgive the ignorance -- does Prime in Spain operate the same way as in U.S.? We are from the US, moving to Spain in a month, and use it quite a lot at home. Would be good to know what to do/expect.
> Thanks!


I'm not sure exactly how it works in the US, but in Spain the music availability with Prime is limited (supposedly around 2 million songs). If you want "unlimited" music (which I think is what you get in the US with Prime, you need to spend an additional 10€ / month.

I think the video content is "tailored" also, so you may not get all the video content of the US site.

But of course, all the mainstream US stuff comes to Spanish Amazon. (I'm currently trying to not stay up all night watching successive episodes of Preacher!!).


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Overandout said:


> But of course, all the mainstream US stuff comes to Spanish Amazon. (I'm currently trying to not stay up all night watching successive episodes of Preacher!!).


Thanks for that. Came across Preacher on HBO España last night. Three episodes in and we are totally hooked (not to mention sleep-deprived!)


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Alcalaina said:


> Thanks for that. Came across Preacher on HBO España last night. Three episodes in and we are totally hooked (not to mention sleep-deprived!)


Yes, it's far better than I expected it to be! 

I just got to the end of Series 1. Only to find that Prime doesn't include Series 2 yet .

I don't think I can justify signing up to HBO just to see one program, fingers crossed it arrives to Prime soon.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Pesky Wesky said:


> I can't forward any mail without opening it


Oh DOH. In my defense I’m watching rolling Sky news


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## Alcalaina (Aug 6, 2010)

Overandout said:


> Yes, it's far better than I expected it to be!
> 
> I just got to the end of Series 1. Only to find that Prime doesn't include Series 2 yet .
> 
> I don't think I can justify signing up to HBO just to see one program, fingers crossed it arrives to Prime soon.


You can get HBO on a month's free trial, plenty of time to watch S2 and S3.


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## Overandout (Nov 10, 2012)

Alcalaina said:


> You can get HBO on a month's free trial, plenty of time to watch S2 and S3.


We already had the month's trial, and we even signed up for several months, but then we cancelled it (we already have Movistar, Prime, Netflix...).

I suppose we could use another email address for another month free, but 22 episodes in a month is not realistic for me I'm afraid!!

What I find odd is that Amazon have such a strange marketing strategy. They have got me hooked on a show with 3 seasons, but only allow me to view the first, which kind of forces me to go the competition... strange.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

Overandout said:


> We already had the month's trial, and we even signed up for several months, but then we cancelled it (we already have Movistar, Prime, Netflix...).
> 
> I suppose we could use another email address for another month free, but 22 episodes in a month is not realistic for me I'm afraid!!
> 
> What I find odd is that Amazon have such a strange marketing strategy. They have got me hooked on a show with 3 seasons, but only allow me to view the first, which kind of forces me to go the competition... strange.


I agree. I watched “this is us” season one. No season two but season three!! I’m pretty certain season two was there but not now.:confused2:


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> I agree. I watched “this is us” season one. No season two but season three!! I’m pretty certain season two was there but not now.:confused2:


Great series!!!


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