# Possible to move to Netherlands from USA?



## itstomcat (Dec 21, 2015)

Hey everyone,

I'm interested in moving to the Netherlands from New York City after several recent trips there and am seeking your advice.

I'm currently 25, no college education but 7 years experience working for a Fire Alarm and Security Systems company. I work as a consultant and build relationships with building managers, homeowners, businesses small and large to fortune 500 companies to make sure that we are able to protect their homes, businesses and the buildings itself that have residents or employees in them. 

I've read that moving to Netherlands without a college education makes it hard to find a job because companies love applicants with a degree. Which brings me to my questions:

- If I'll have a hard time finding a job in the Netherlands, would it be best I enroll into a university and get an education in the Netherlands? I assume this process must be easier than moving there and seeking a job. Perhaps not?

- Are there any main branded security systems or fire alarm companies there some of you are aware of? I tried searching on google but cant seem to find much.

- Is it easier to move there going as a student than to move and seek for a job? Unless a job is willing to sponsor me?

I'm looking to come to the Netherlands and make a positive impact by continuing what I do as a career in protecting peoples lives from fires and intrusions but if I am required to have a degree then so be it.

I understand that moving to the Netherlands without speaking Dutch makes this a another hard thing to do which most employees want, which is why I have enrolled myself into a Dutch language classes here in New York City. 


All the best,
and Happy Holidays,
Tommy


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## Bevdeforges (Nov 16, 2007)

You may want to take a look at this page from the Dutch government on working in the Netherlands: https://ind.nl/en/work/working_in_the_Netherlands Be sure to click on the "Show more" button to reveal a rather large array of various types of work.

Generally speaking, it goes much easier if you can get your employer to transfer you to the Netherlands (or any other country) because they will have to obtain the work authorization for you. Once that is done, a visa is pretty much just a matter of process. But getting work authorization for a foreigner can be difficult. The employer-to-be needs to show that the foreigner is not going to be doing a job that someone already in the country could do - so it usually involves some sort of "unique" skills or training or experience that may not be available in the area.

And everything I have heard is that the Dutch are very insistent that new arrivals must learn the language. Dutch isn't an easy language to learn (though it's a bit easier if you know German or a similar language already). On the page I referred you to, click on Study in the top menu bar for information about studying at a Dutch university.
Cheers,
Bev


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## expat16 (Jun 11, 2016)

I'd say it would be very hard to crack that industry in NL. One of the things I disliked about the NL and one of the reasons I left is the extreme greed. I don't know how to explain it, but it was nothing like anything I experienced before dealing with landlords.

What I mean is that the people in building and associated industries, from what I know, are rather inescrupulous and it's still very Dutch. In other industries, such as knowledge economy there's pleny of expats. But I doubt you'd be able to find a job, not speaking fluent Dutch, and also because you might need some certifications.

I hated the Nethlerands, I think it is a depressing hellhole. Most expats that move here are too busy with kids to realize what a horrible place it is. Most Americans I know don't like it. Americans that have come to visit me just for a few days like it because they've been lucky with the weather. But it's a completely different thing to coming to live here.

The weather is awful, most of the time a flat dull grey sky. NL has some of the highest suicide rates for both men and women in Western Europe. It also has extremely high euthanasia rates compared to Switzerland - which is the other country perhaps along with Belgium that also has euthanasia law.

Despite what surveys may say, the people in NL are not generally happy. A better way to put it is the definition of happiness varies by culture and their idea of happiness is very different from idea of happiness in US, Spain and UK (which are more similar to each other and the one that resonates with me).

To me they are like robots. I would recommend Germany instead. I think it is horrible to live in NL, with the bad weather, extremely poor service in restaurants and poor customer service in general, rather poor food quality and choices compared to other countries, loud crowded trains where people will do things like paint their nails and talk loudly on the phone next to you. A general sense of superiority and arrogance (If it ain't Dutch, it ain't much - they say). I could go on and on with the many negatives this place has.


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## itstomcat (Dec 21, 2015)

expat16 said:


> I'd say it would be very hard to crack that industry in NL. One of the things I disliked about the NL and one of the reasons I left is the extreme greed. I don't know how to explain it, but it was nothing like anything I experienced before dealing with landlords.
> 
> What I mean is that the people in building and associated industries, from what I know, are rather inescrupulous and it's still very Dutch. In other industries, such as knowledge economy there's pleny of expats. But I doubt you'd be able to find a job, not speaking fluent Dutch, and also because you might need some certifications.
> 
> ...


What part of the US are you originally from? I saw your earlier posts and sounds like you had a horrible time. Although I've met many people here in NYC who have lived there and had the complete opposite experience. Different strokes for different folks?


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## BraveHorse (Jan 22, 2018)

I doubt your work experience would be of any value in Europe, since regulations are different. And to add to the previous poster, I can confirm NL isn't a very fun place to live for a foreigner. Amsterdam is awful. There are some nice places on the East, though, near the German border. Everything is very clean, the people are very polite, but you've got to be a local to enjoy life there.


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## expat16 (Jun 11, 2016)

itstomcat said:


> What part of the US are you originally from? I saw your earlier posts and sounds like you had a horrible time. Although I've met many people here in NYC who have lived there and had the complete opposite experience. Different strokes for different folks?


Without getting too specific  I am originally from New England, but have also lived in Florida and the Caribbean. Growing up my family moved A LOT, so growing up I was exposed to different lifestyles and thus from young already knew which lifestyle/places I preferred. I also lived in Spain (and fell in love with it, about 10 years ago). I have also lived in the UK. Now going back to live in Spain.

I agree with you, partly depends where you come from whether you like NL or not. I think normally people who are used to sun will not like it. But I think it's an 'ignorance is bliss' kind of thing  I think that once you see how richer life is in a place with great weather (my opinion I know) it's hard to tolerate places with bad weather which offer what I consider a lesser life.

Personally, people I have met from California did not like it. Other people I know say they love it, but were only in NL for a few days at a time.

I know someone from Midwest, place with weather worse than NL, and she tolerates it, she says she will go back once her 30% ruling expires, if not sooner. She has children though, and has said NL is really convenient when you have kids.

I have to say I did enjoy most of it it for the first couple of years, but I think that's pretty normal as it was still an adventure and I was too preoccupied figuring everything out. 

But after first 3 years I became more and more bitter once I realized e.g. that there is no such thing as 'we had a bad summer' (it's always bad!), and that I really couldn't deal with the crowds and reduced personal space, and lack of peripheral vision (and cutting in line), and other stuff, and the general boredom of everyday life compared to a place like Spain. 

I will still visit for holiday but it's a place I won't live in again. To me it feels like life is less there. 

Yes, I can survive there but I'm sure my life won't be as colorful and rich. It seems like a very simple life revolving around having children (fine if that's your thing) and a sort of infantilized culture (that's how I can best describe it). I'm more of a spontaneous, don't mind strangers talking to me (considered odd in NL), want to stay up to see the sunrise discussing life's mysteries kind of person. I want to explore life, not just follow a lifescript. These things don't have a place in the NL collective psyche!

I could go on and on


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## cschrd2 (Oct 31, 2011)

Moving is a big step and totally different from visiting and you have to step into it with a positive attitude or you end up like Expat 2016. We moved early last year from SF (after living in China, JP for quite many years) to Amsterdam area. My wife had never lived there and she loved it right up until November when the gloomy days step in. Winters are dark and the weather is very unpredictable. Now she's much more enthusiastic again. Compared to SF everything is cheap (except branded textiles and cars). As far as the language, you can get very well by with English, however to understand whats happening in the community some Dutch is always helpful. There are lots of openings for skilled laborers as long as a company sponsors you, which in your area is more complicated as they can also use east Europeans without that hurdle. Getting in via a study is much easier and there are full English spoken studies at all universities or colleges.
a pretty good view of Dutch habits/culture (although exaggerated in extremes you can find in the book The Undutchables (Colin White, Laurie Boucke). As far as the happiness factor, most are pretty happy but due to the very well organized social systems people start to complain immediately if they loose a right and it over runs all other things (you still hear some people complain about the Euro/Guilder exchange rate......). 
Good luck.


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