# Too good to be true?



## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

I'm on the Costa del Sol and am looking for a good second hand car. I saw one advertised on a general second hand car site and despite the claim of Malaga, it seems that many of the cars are elsewhere in Spain, even northern Spain.

I saw one I really wanted. It turned out to be in France but the owner has included shipping cost to Spain in the price. I have priced up the car and even allowing that it has Spanish plates (not seen) in France, it is still very cheap.

I don't pay for the car till it arrives but meanwhile I have to pay the €600 shipping, etc costs to get it to me here in Spain. By Western Union. And it was not to a company but a person.

The car delivery company is Inter Euroservices. I have searched for them on the internet and so far cannot find any trace of them.

If this is a scam to just to get "shipping costs", the guy takes the €600 I sent and I never hear from them again.

So, anyone ever heard of this company?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Cyberia said:


> I'm on the Costa del Sol and am looking for a good second hand car. I saw one advertised on a general second hand car site and despite the claim of Malaga, it seems that many of the cars are elsewhere in Spain, even northern Spain.
> 
> I saw one I really wanted. It turned out to be in France but the owner has included shipping cost to Spain in the price. I have priced up the car and even allowing that it has Spanish plates (not seen) in France, it is still very cheap.
> 
> ...


Sounds very dodgy to me. Even if a car does arrive, what if its a wreck?? Its second hand, not from a dealer and you havent seen it?! Also, that shipping cost (from France??) seems quite excessive to me????

See what the others say

Jo xxx


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

I have seen photos but they could for all I know have been of a friend's car or taken from somewhere.

Shipping from northern France to southern Spain is expensive and there were a few other expenses thrown in too.

The guy said the car had "Controle Techniques", the French equivalent of ITV's, and I know from my time in France that they have no problem with foreign number plates, nor do the insurance companies either, unlike in Spain where they try and rob as much money as possible off of you at every chance with cars.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Cyberia said:


> I have seen photos but they could for all I know have been of a friend's car or taken from somewhere.
> 
> Shipping from northern France to southern Spain is expensive and there were a few other expenses thrown in too.
> 
> The guy said the car had "Controle Techniques", the French equivalent of ITV's, and I know from my time in France that they have no problem with foreign number plates, nor do the insurance companies either, unlike in Spain where they try and rob as much money as possible off of you at every chance with cars.



Well I personally wouldnt touch it - especially if I hadnt seen it! Why not offer to visit and view it first, then if you like it you can drive it back - that would be an interesting conversation I'll bet lol

Jo xxx


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

The guy knows where I am. All he has to do if phoney is say it is somewhere well away from any airport or main town in central or northern France and am I going to spend hundreds of euros checking on it?

I have driven across France and Spain a number of times and the road tolls cost a fortune, then there is fuel and a hotel for a night. It is very expensive. The car itself, if there does 30 mpg on the motorway so an expensive trip.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Cyberia said:


> The guy knows where I am. All he has to do if phoney is say it is somewhere well away from any airport or main town in central or northern France and am I going to spend hundreds of euros checking on it?
> 
> I have driven across France and Spain a number of times and the road tolls cost a fortune, then there is fuel and a hotel for a night. It is very expensive. The car itself, if there does 30 mpg on the motorway so an expensive trip.


You seem decided. I personally wouldnt touch it and find something nearer with more security. See what some of the other posters say.

If you do go with this, it would be nice if you come back and tell us what happened

Jo xxx


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Cyberia said:


> The guy knows where I am. All he has to do if phoney is say it is somewhere well away from any airport or main town in central or northern France and am I going to spend hundreds of euros checking on it?
> 
> I have driven across France and Spain a number of times and the road tolls cost a fortune, then there is fuel and a hotel for a night. It is very expensive. The car itself, if there does 30 mpg on the motorway so an expensive trip.


Surely the journey wouldn't cost more than 600€ though would it and you'd have peace of mind.

Personally, I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole..... France to Spain via Nigeria, I'd say.


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

I really want this car, and it is just possible that it is genuine. But am I willing to gamble €600 if it isn't? If I don't, I know what I can afford will be inferior and I will always wonder about it.

Any time now I am due €600 compensation for a 24 hours delayed long haul flight I took with Air France so I could look on it as money I never had.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

The facts:

A car you've only seen a picture of.

A delivery company that isnt traceable. 

Money exchange thru Western Union, known for being capable of some dodgy deals !!!!!!

And what about the cars history - what about searching for any debts that the car may have on it. Have you checked its registration with trafico? Has it been stolen?? Is it a ringer, is it a write off even??

You stand to lose 600€ that you could put towards the same car that you could go and view without the uncertainty or risk. You also must know that buying a car in Spain isnt straight forward on a good day, buying one from France..............??????!

Jo xxx


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## VFR (Dec 23, 2009)

Cyberia said:


> I really want this car, and it is just possible that it is genuine. But am I willing to gamble €600 if it isn't? If I don't, I know what I can afford will be inferior and I will always wonder about it.
> 
> Any time now I am due €600 compensation for a 24 hours delayed long haul flight I took with Air France so I could look on it as money I never had.


Wake up its a *scam !*


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Cyberia said:


> I really want this car, and it is just possible that it is genuine. But am I willing to gamble €600 if it isn't? If I don't, I know what I can afford will be inferior and I will always wonder about it.
> 
> Any time now I am due €600 compensation for a 24 hours delayed long haul flight I took with Air France so I could look on it as money I never had.


So this car is for a sale at a bargain price - bargains do exist, maybe the owner needs a quick sale for some genuine reason- but if it is such a good bargain, it will be snapped up locally quickly. 

Why the *<Snip>* would the owner go to the hassle of spending 600€ to send it to Spain, and then potentially have to pay another 600€ to get it back to France if you decide against it......

No chance.


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## Phil-H (Feb 9, 2015)

This sounds exactly the same scam for a car that was being advertised on UK AutoTrader last year.

Strangely enough the car was also in Spain, although when the owner of the car from the registration number on the picture was contacted he apparently knew nothing about his car being sold, so it looks like someone had just taken a photograph at random of a car that was then supposed to be the car being sold.

Payment was being asked to cover the shipping cost from Spain to the UK when the car would then be available.

Anyone who parts with any money 'up-front' can only be classed as being a person who has more money than sense.


Much the same as people who agree to meet sellers halfway down a motorway supposedly to pay for a car, most of the time I believe they just end up getting mugged for the thousands of pounds or euros they are carrying with them.


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## bandit1250 (Aug 5, 2014)

just reading your post has got the hairs on the back of my neck raised, just walk away, there are car lots all over spain, thats not to say there aren't any Spanish Arthur dayleys out there.


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## Bellthorpe (Jun 23, 2013)

Walk away.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I've just re-read your initial post. It screams SCAM! 
Dont do it!!

Jo xxx

Sent from my D5803 using Expat Forum


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## Trubrit (Nov 24, 2010)

If you do not wish to take the advice of some very savvy people on this site then please do not waste our time.


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

We'll I think its a great idea and you should go for it

Ps I have some magic beans for sale


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Even if it were not a scam, it would be foolish to buy a car from photos. There could be numerous mechanical and electrical problems and the bodywork could be shot through with rust.


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

It is a Range Rover so good quality metal. My 1994 Rover is virtually rust free after being outside almost all that time. A diesel, and they are pretty trustworthy. It was said to have Controle Technique certificates (the French MOT/ITV) and they are tough on such things.

The car itself is not paid for till it is delivered.

Yes, probably a scam but I have asked for the car to be delivered by a well known company (that I can trust). If I do not hear from him again, I will know it was a scam.

It would be a real bargain if true. Many Spanish cars are badly overpriced compared to say, Britain, so I did not just dismiss it out of hand as a scam.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Cyberia said:


> It is a Range Rover so good quality metal. My 1994 Rover is virtually rust free after being outside almost all that time. A diesel, and they are pretty trustworthy. It was said to have Controle Technique certificates (the French MOT/ITV) and they are tough on such things.
> 
> The car itself is not paid for till it is delivered.
> 
> ...



If its a "real bargain", then it wont be there for long will it. I doubt you'd be the only one who would want it................ which tells a tale. A classic scam. Price it cheap and they'll get lots of 600€s

Just dont part with any money, you may have enough to throw away, but no one likes to see scammers making money 



Jo xxx


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

Even if genuine, would you buy a car from another country and without seeing and test driving it first? That is a reason it would be cheaper than normal. It was Spanish plates in France so no rush to buy it there.

It was on a site I found which may not have many visiting it. Some cars seemed to be spread all over Spain while others have Malaga area locations.

I was previously interested in a Mercedes on the site and that did sell.


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## brocher (Mar 21, 2011)

Cyberia said:


> It is a Range Rover so good quality metal. My 1994 Rover is virtually rust free after being outside almost all that time. A diesel, and they are pretty trustworthy. It was said to have Controle Technique certificates (the French MOT/ITV) and they are tough on such things.
> 
> The car itself is not paid for till it is delivered.
> 
> ...



Well we are obviously wasting our time here but - 

They will agree to your trusted delivery company, you pay your 600€ .......and that will be the last you'll ever hear.

Even if the car exists, how do you know it isn't stolen, doesn't have outstanding finance, doesn't have mechanical problems......

Have you thought about my previous post? Assuming it exists - is the seller really going to finance the 600€ required to take it back to Spain if you don't buy it? Don't think so. If the car is such a good deal it will sell easily locally in France.

Either you are really, really naive ..... or a troll...... I'm beginning to wonder.


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## Trubrit (Nov 24, 2010)

The old saying, If something seems too good to be true, then it probably is.


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

Brocher. What I am not is a hard bitten cynic like you. The world is not out to scam you.


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## Trubrit (Nov 24, 2010)

oh yes it is !!!!!!


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

Trubit. Yes, I keep that in mind, but I have over the years had some bargains because I was willing to believe the best of people (with reservations).


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Cyberia said:


> Brocher. What I am not is a hard bitten cynic like you. The world is not out to scam you.


lol!!! Whether Brocher is a cynic or not, from everything you've said, that is a classic scam - nearly as bad as the e-mails from Nigeria offering you millions of pounds 

Jo xxx


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

TOP TIP: Find out the registration number first and get it checked out with trafico

Jo xxx


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Cyberia said:


> It is a Range Rover so good quality metal. My 1994 Rover is virtually rust free after being outside almost all that time. A diesel, and they are pretty trustworthy. It was said to have Controle Technique certificates (the French MOT/ITV) and they are tough on such things.
> 
> The car itself is not paid for till it is delivered.
> 
> ...



I have had a Range Rover in the UK and now have a Freelander and a Discovery, neither new, so I agree, they do go on forever.
However....we were in the (respectable) motor trade in the UK, had a couple of repairing garages and even LRs develop faults. It all depends on how they were treated in the past.
What you say about Spanish cars is also true. More expensive than in the UK. So when I lived in Prague, I bought a LR Disco on Spanish plates from a reputable LHD company in the UK and had it delivered to me in Prague for a cost of £250. This included fuel, driver time and his flight back to the UK. I inspected the vehicle on arrival having paid the delivery fee in advance and as I reckoned that it must be sound as it had been driven across Europe, settled the invoice. The vehicle was two years old when I bought it seven years ago and it is still sound and reliable. 
As I was given all the documents needed I was able to transfer the car into my name with no problems.

France is one of the two centres, Belgium being another, where cars of a dubious nature are bought and sold wholesale to sales lots in Eastern and Central Europe where they are sold to eager but largely undiscerning buyers keen to get their hands on flash 'Western' cars. When I was in Prague I bought a Peugeot 206 convertible, nice-looking little car, just what I wanted for a cheap runaround. It too came originally from France. It transpired that the car had been damaged quite badly in an accident and had been badly repaired. Within a couple of months the paint peeled and I had problems raising and lowering the roof.
The adage 'Caveat Emptor' applies very much so when buying abroad.


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

Hi,
The easiest way to resolve all this is to ask the seller to send you a photo of the front of the car holding up today's newspaper right in front of the numberplate.
Call their bluff and say that you have a friend who is currently visiting their area of France and is willing to inspect, pay for and collect the car in person.
The amount of excuses that will come from the seller as to why they cant do either of the above will show you clearly whether it is a scam.
I suspect their camera will have broken, they are visiting Outer Mongolia on business until mid September, their dog just died etc. etc.
Best of luck
Steve


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

mrypg9. Most people selling a car will be getting rid of it for some bad reason.

I bought a car off a "reputable" second hand and new dealer in the UK years ago and everything about it seemed good, except the steering was heavy. It turned out that it had been in a smash and though generally well repaired, the steering always remained fairly tough (I did get used to it).

One of the best cars I ever bought was an Escort van many years ago for £245, and that off of someone who bullied me in my younger days. Apart from a few minor faults, it did well for several years.

I suppose I am looking for another car now.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Keep going everyone! This thread is giving me the giggles.
I vote it should be moved to the "You couldn't make it up" thread


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

jojo. On long stays I take a little telescope with me. It's professional quality but only 70x70 so not very good but takes up little room in my car. On eBay I saw a "USB Telescope Digital Camera Eyepiece" which are normally fairly expensive as they have electronics and CCD's in them. Cost was £8.69 which included free postage from China.

It sounded like a scam but WTH. 

I sent the money and two weeks later it came in the post. I plugged it in to my laptop and the lens end into my telescope and suddenly there was a clear image over 200x magnification on my laptop without any loss of light and with a digital zoom of over three times that if I want it, with movable targeting area. One click and I can use it for filming or taking photos.

This is something most people would have been happy to pay £40 or £50 for and I got it for under £9.


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Keep going everyone! This thread is giving me the giggles.
> I vote it should be moved to the "You couldn't make it up" thread


I just finished reading Richard Littlejohn's book "To Hell in a Handcart" (3 for €1 locally). A great read.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Cyberia said:


> jojo. On long stays I take a little telescope with me. It's professional quality but only 70x70 so not very good but takes up little room in my car. On eBay I saw a "USB Telescope Digital Camera Eyepiece" which are normally fairly expensive as they have electronics and CCD's in them. Cost was £8.69 which included free postage from China.
> 
> It sounded like a scam but WTH.
> 
> ...



you know best

Jo xxx


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## Rabbitcat (Aug 31, 2014)

Pah, that's nothing!!!

I bought a sweeping brush in 1974 for 3 shillings and with only replacing five heads and three handles it still as good as new to this day.

There are indeed bargains out there


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

Cyberia said:


> jojo. On long stays I take a little telescope with me. It's professional quality but only 70x70 so not very good but takes up little room in my car. On eBay I saw a "USB Telescope Digital Camera Eyepiece" which are normally fairly expensive as they have electronics and CCD's in them. Cost was £8.69 which included free postage from China.
> 
> It sounded like a scam but WTH.
> 
> ...


Hi,
Of course - there is a huge similarity between a £9 telescope and a 3 tonne, four wheel drive car!
Your posts are becoming more ridiculous at each turn.
Trolling is against forum rules - and you are appearing to be one of the bigger trollls that i have encountered this week!
Cheers
Steve


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

I dont care, according to my spam in box today, I've won a lottery of some sort lol


> Dear Lucky winner,
> 
> We wish to inform you that you have won (One Million British Pound Sterling)
> in the Microsoft Online Monthly Lottery held this month of April with
> ...


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

jojo said:


> I dont care, according to my spam in box today, I've won a lottery of some sort lol


Hi,
Sorry - you cant of won that lottery - i have the winning ticket!
Cheers
Steve


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

Stevesolar. What made you so cynical?


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

Stevesolar said:


> Hi,
> Of course - there is a huge similarity between a £9 telescope and a 3 tonne, four wheel drive car!
> Your posts are becoming more ridiculous at each turn.
> Trolling is against forum rules - and you are appearing to be one of the bigger trollls that i have encountered this week!
> ...


It does seem odd that someone asking a question, getting very negative answers then defends the question. But thats human nature - the defiant streak lol

I'm sure he must know its a scam really

Jo xxx


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## Stevesolar (Dec 21, 2012)

Cyberia said:


> Stevesolar. What made you so cynical?


Life!
I am probably a bit older and worldy wise than you.


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## littlecritterz (Nov 29, 2012)

This is a scam, they do similar things with pedigree dogs and other expensive items. the fact it is western union shows it is a scam, as it is untraceable and once you send your money it is the last you will see of it. here is a link to a facebook page that sells cars all over spain, quite a lot from Malaga. https://www.facebook.com/groups/372740282847165/ Also check out the other buy and sell facebook pages for your area as people often sell their cars on them.


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## Pazcat (Mar 24, 2010)

Why on Earth anyone would risk using western union for anything these days that you don't know the seller personally is beyond me.
It's simple enough to use paypal or better yet a bank transfer and both methods offer you protection so if the seller wants money then that would be the only way I would part with it. I bet however he wont accept that.

Now if you all don't mind popping some of your gold in an envelope and sending it on to me I will get back to you mañana.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Cyberia said:


> mrypg9. Most people selling a car will be getting rid of it for some bad reason.
> 
> I bought a car off a "reputable" second hand and new dealer in the UK years ago and everything about it seemed good, except the steering was heavy. It turned out that it had been in a smash and though generally well repaired, the steering always remained fairly tough (I did get used to it).
> 
> ...



First sentence: rubbish. When we left the UK we sold three perfectly good vehicles. We didn't want to take them with us, that's all.
Ditto when we left Prague. We sold a Ford Maverick 4x4 and a nearly new Mercedes cabrio. Neither on Spanish plates.

I think you should go ahead and buy that car. You seem to have made up your mind.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Stevesolar said:


> Life!
> I am probably a bit older and worldy wise than you.


I'm with you on that, Steve.
People who ask questions then argue against the answers they receive obviously need something better to do with their time.


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Cyberia said:


> Brocher. What I am not is a hard bitten cynic like you. The world is not out to scam you.


You're partly right. The world may try - in vain -to scam worldly-wise old cynics like me and Brocher but it's sure as hell out to take cash off naïve people like you, sadly.

Go ahead, splash your cash. Not my money you're probably handing over to some Nigerian or Romanian fraudster.


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## VFR (Dec 23, 2009)

Apart from that its a Range Rover & they are known to rust like there is no tomorrow & for being unreliable


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## Cyberia (Apr 10, 2015)

Some people here certainly hate anyone who dares to have a different view from them, with name calling and various ways of saying they are idiots.

I just came here for other people's views on something that did not look kosher.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Cyberia said:


> Some people here certainly hate anyone who dares to have a different view from them, with name calling and various ways of saying they are idiots.
> 
> I just came here for other people's views on something that did not look kosher.


Well you asked if others thought it was too good to be true. 
Everyone seems to that it is.....


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## mrypg9 (Apr 26, 2008)

Cyberia said:


> Some people here certainly hate anyone who dares to have a different view from them, with name calling and various ways of saying they are idiots.
> 
> I just came here for other people's views on something that did not look kosher.


I have a sufficiently sound view of my own judgment, based on experience and common sense, not to have to solicit the opinions of others on matters such as buying a car sight unseen. In other areas I may welcome advice.
You obviously haven't or you wouldn't have asked our views.
You were told.
Many times.


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

:deadhorse:

I'm closing this - its pointless to continue 

Jo xxx


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