# Ehic?



## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

My wife and I are UK passport holders and have now moved to Portugal after living in South Africa for about ten years.

We now want to register with a local doctor etc.

First question is: Are we entitled to free or freeish medical care here in portugal and if so, do we need to get our EHIC cards first?

Second question is: If we do need to get the cards, how do we get them? - When we look online it tells us we need to have a UK address to get the cards.......


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## jojo (Sep 20, 2007)

travelling-man said:


> My wife and I are UK passport holders and have now moved to Portugal after living in South Africa for about ten years.
> 
> We now want to register with a local doctor etc.
> 
> ...


I think you need to have a NI number, a UK GP and a UK address to apply for a EHIC

See if this gives you any clues or help???

How do I get an EHIC? - Health questions - NHS Choices

Jo xxx


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

You don't say if you are OAPs or not. 

If you are not, the EHIC is no use for registering with a local GP, you need to be part of the Portuguese system, i.e. paying in.

If you are OAP, you need the proper forms filled in from the UK (TVP International - google it) to get into the local healthcare system. TVP will also issue your EHIC for which you need either your NI or NHS numbers.

The EHIC is only for emergency treatment when you are on holiday/staying in a foreign country not for residential purposes.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

As you are* not* UK Residents you are *not* entitled to a UK issued EHIC card. Being a UK passport holder makes no difference, it's Residency that counts.

As you're not UK Pensioners? your in a slightly grey area, you might be entitled to 2.5 years paid Social Security but I think your 10 year absence from UK stops that.
I would suggest telephoning Newcastle on 0191 218 1999 and asking.

In the meantime, I would go to your local Health Centre and try to register, different areas, different centres seem to apply rules differently.
In theory the Health Service is universal so anyone living here is entitled to treatment, in practice this doesn't happen.

It will certainly be easier if you have Registered your Residence first.


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## Maggy Crawford (Sep 18, 2010)

There was a very good article in Hey Portugal recently about the problems some foreigners were having in certain health areas of Leiria, mainly due to a misinterpretation of the new rules by some civil servants. The main point of the article is that entitlement is residence based. See if you can google and find it, it was very instructive.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

canoeman said:


> As you are* not* UK Residents you are *not* entitled to a UK issued EHIC card. Being a UK passport holder makes no difference, it's Residency that counts.


WRONG. That was the situation prior to May 2010. If you are OAP and your health care is paid for by the UK, it is the UK which issues your EHIC!



canoeman said:


> In theory the Health Service is universal so anyone living here is entitled to treatment, in practice this doesn't happen.
> 
> It will certainly be easier if you have Registered your Residence first.


WRONG AGAIN. The health service is not universal. In UK residency is what counts but elsewhere (Spain, Portugal and other EU countries) it is contributions based (if you don't contribute, then you are not entitled) unless you are just *visiting*, in which case your EHIC will cover you for *emergency treatment * but NOT if you are a resident.


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## Maggy Crawford (Sep 18, 2010)

I notice you are in Spain where I believe the system is different and more stringent. See my previous posting re the Hey Portugal article wich gave the contact details for the British Embassy which is taking calls from people with difficulties. Yes for OAPs we now have EHIC cards from the UK you are right there.


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## baldilocks (Mar 7, 2010)

Maggy Crawford said:


> I notice you are in Spain where I believe the system is different and more stringent. See my previous posting re the Hey Portugal article wich gave the contact details for the British Embassy which is taking calls from people with difficulties. Yes for OAPs we now have EHIC cards from the UK you are right there.


It is getting even more stringent because the UK are starting to refuse to reimburse claims from elsewhere for non-emergency treatment and some health authorities (e.g. Valencia) are already refusing to treat people with EHICs, so even if Portugal is not as yet as strict, they will be. What is an even bigger shock for those whose treatment has not been paid for, is they are going to be billed retrospectively and any future treatment refused. It all comes down to playing fair. There are too many expats here in Spain and, no doubt, also in Portugal who try to cheat the systems like running around in illegal UK registered and untaxed/no MoT vehicles, etc.....


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## Maggy Crawford (Sep 18, 2010)

So far here we have always had excellent treatment. I was diagnosed with bladder cancer last year and chose to pay privately for the operation to remove part of it. I then had many months of chemotherapy and radiotherapy for which I paid nothing or the concomitant drugs. No doubt there are "dodgy Brits" in Spain as well as in Portugal. However, I cannot imagine how many Portuguese live and work in UK (Bedfordshire is a prime example) who receive free treatment on the NHS. Many thousands.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Travelling man is not a UK Pensioner as far as I know, so I think I am correct, rather than WRONG *if* he was then as you say he would register with the Portuguese Social Services with form S1, then register with Health Service, and would be issued with an EHIC card by UK that would be valid for use in EU but not Portugal, once completed S1 forms where returned by Social Services.

Maybe it's different in Spain, Portugal's health service is universal, this is a statement by the British Embassy 
_"The Portuguese Health System is universal and based on being resident in Portugal. For this reason, British people are entitled to receive state healthcare in Portugal by registering as a resident and then with their local health centre. "_

I'm not saying that travelling man will not have to pay Social Security, but that he is entitled to Register and also that the registration could be easy or extremely difficult depending on area and centre.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

It's the Expats who use the EHIC incorrectly that is causing the problems, *if you are not a UK resident* you are not entitled to use a UK EHIC for treatment within EU and it is deemed fraudulent by the UK. 
Which is why those caught are and will be billed for treatment.

The exception are those State Pensioners who have registered correctly and under a change to EU rules are now supplied EHIC's by UK.


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## robc (Jul 17, 2008)

The "tightening up" in the UK is being driven by HMRC.
There is a genuine desire within Govt. departments to put the squeeze on all TaxPayers, whether in the UK or Overseas. 

One of the ways to do that is to "force" people to make a final and binding decision with regards to residency, their view is you are either in the UK or out. 
There is no half measure, witness the new points system being introduced to determine Tax Domicility and Residenct status.

This is going to continue, they are keen to get as many £'s in Tax receipts as possible.

Come the revolution....................

Rob


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## travelling-man (Jun 17, 2011)

We're not drawing a UK Govt pension and have our own company income with tax currently being paid in the UK.

We do however plan to live in Portugal permanently so does that mean we get our resedencia documents and then just register with a doctor here?


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## notlongnow (May 21, 2009)

"The Portuguese Health System is universal and based on being resident in Portugal. For this reason, British people are entitled to receive state healthcare in Portugal by registering as a resident and then with their local health centre."

I can offer you our personal experience of this:

(long post coming up!)

My wife and I are both in our thirties, we have lived in Portugal 2 years, have residency, and pay all our income tax here.

I am self employed. I have a Ltd company in the UK still, from which I draw a small salary, but I am also registered as self employed (green receipts) in Portugal and therefore have a social security number. I have been able to register for healthcare at our Centro do Saude.

My wife is employed by a UK company. She is payrolled there and they do not deduct any UK income tax. They DO still deduct UK NI, basically because no mechanism exists for her to pay Portuguese social security...she is neither self employed, nor employed by a Portuguese company. The seguranca social have confirmed that there is no way, in her situation, that she can pay SS here.

The problem? SHE CANNOT register for healthcare here, because she has no social security number. Nor is she able to register with the doctor because as my spouse, which would generally be possible for a couple when only one party works. This is despite getting a lawyer to help us argue the point. Basically the official line is: no social security, no contributions, no healthcare.

She SHOULD be able to get a "workers S1" from the UK as she pays NI there, and therefore claim her right to care under an EU reciprocal arrangement, but that involves Portugal contacting the UK to confirm. That's what we are trying to do now, but, well, 2 years on we have still not got there. It doesn't help that HMRC take 2 months to reply to each letter.

In the meantime, we have taken out private cover.

As with everything in Portugal, your experience will differ depending on area, specific town, and mood of each official on the day. Proceed with caution, and stoicism.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Travelling-man, I would advise trying first, Registering Residence, then registering with your local Health Centre, both of these things as I've said can be extremely easy or difficult so much depends on the Camra and Health Centre where your living.
Residence is doubly important to you as you need it to start the import and matriculation for your car.

Your first step should be a visit to your Junta de Freguesia for an Astestado, signed proof of your address in Portugal.
Then try to Register with fingers crossed.
Then you have time to sort out Social Security etc, rather than have to do it before you can register.

As your situation is similar to notlong now i.e your income is derived from UK and you pay UK tax & NI then you need HMRC Form *Application for health care cover in the European Economic Area*
from
Department for Work and Pensions
The Pension Service
International Pension Centre
Tyneview Park
Newcastle upon Tyne
NE98 1BA
England +44 (0) 191 225 4811.

Once you get the S1 form, providing you register it correctly with the right person at your *Regional* Social Security Office (not local) processing is generally done within a fortnight.


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## Dennis (Sep 29, 2008)

travelling-man said:


> My wife and I are UK passport holders and have now moved to Portugal after living in South Africa for about ten years.
> 
> We now want to register with a local doctor etc.
> 
> ...


Went to our local (Miranda) Centro de Saude two days ago to find out.........was told not to register just pop in when I need a doctor and ask for a consultaion and pay the taxa moderadora.
The charges for different services within the health system are listed <HERE> I haven`t had the time to translate all of it so i don`t don`t know the criteria for using the service.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Dennis if your living here as a Resident you need to register, otherwise you might not receive discounted prescriptions or treatment and would not be able to get treatment elsewhere in Portugal.

If they treat you via your UK EHIC you run the risks as boldilocks described.

If your a UK State Pensioner then the procedure is straightforward and also makes you fully legal here, which will become more important as the austerity measures start impacting more.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Looking at fees you've posted they are only the costs to see a Doctor, if you don't have a Patient Number and are not registered you would not be entitled to the these prices or any of the discounted prescription, blood tests, x-rays, that the majority of patients pay here.
For example one of my drugs costs €18.98 with NHS Registration discount €5.88.


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