# Cleanest most sanitary cities/regions in Mexico?



## TropicalSky

I was curious if any cities or regions in Mexico are cleaner and more sanitary then others. In terms of air quality, pollution, sewage treatment, trash on ground, etc....

I have read about some coastal towns sewage makes into into the ocean/beach areas. And I have seen random piles of trash and smelled bad air. Just wondering if there are regions or cities that are known to be cleaner and more sanitary then others?


----------



## lat19n

TropicalSky said:


> I was curious if any cities or regions in Mexico are cleaner and more sanitary then others. In terms of air quality, pollution, sewage treatment, trash on ground, etc....
> 
> I have read about some coastal towns sewage makes into into the ocean/beach areas. And I have seen random piles of trash and smelled bad air. Just wondering if there are regions or cities that are known to be cleaner and more sanitary then others?


For perspective...

South Florida dumps partially treated human waste offshore, but it&apos;s cleaning up its act - Sun Sentinel

The pipes actually make nice dive sites - very rich in life - but you want to avoid them when there is a flush.


----------



## surabi

Well, it's a terrible thing to say, but Mexicans just throw their trash everywhere. Some communities work to try to mitigate this, but by and large, there is garbage everywhere in Mexico. Every highway pull-out has large pile of garbage (people just think that it's perfectly acceptable to clean out their cars and dump it on the side of the road).

Air quality and sewage treatment is a different story and one just has to research different areas to learn about that. Obviously big cities and areas where there is heavy industry are going to have are going to have poorer air quality, just like anywhere in the world. 

Tropical rural areas will have cleaner air as there is lots of vegetation giving off oxygen, and not a lot of traffic. But even there, your Mexican neighbors will likely do their Sunday yard clean-up, which involves raking up all the leaves and chip bags and plastic bottles the family has just dropped there all week and lighting it on fire.

Desert regions will be really dusty outside of rainy season and that dust is full of powdered dog poop, spit, etc. That's why you see Mexicans out watering down the road in front of their homes.

Last Semana Santa Semarnat, the Mexican Environmental Protection agency, tested the ocean water at various tourist beaches around Mexico. Sayulita (where I live) came in as second most polluted at 118 PPM (Ensenada was the worst at over 200), due to the poorly functioning sewahge treatment plant RIGHT ON THE BEACH, whereas San Pancho, just 10 minutes north of here, came in at 10, as did Bucerias and Puerto Vallarta.

If you're looking for someplace clean, try Singapore. Never been there, but someone who has been told me it's immaculate.


----------



## Stevenjb

surabi said:


> If you're looking for someplace clean, try Singapore. Never been there, but someone who has been told me it's immaculate.


Just, don't chew gum in public.


Sent from my KFFOWI using Tapatalk


----------



## chicois8

Here is the latest results for the municipality of Banderas Bay:

http://apps1.semarnat.gob.mx/dgeia/gob-mx/playas/imagenes/2017/dic2017/t_bahiadebanderas.png


----------



## lat19n

On our quick trip into Mexico City today I noticed two white cars, in two different locations, with green lettering on the side which read something like Vigilantes ambiente. They had taxis pulled over and it looked like they were doing on the spot emissions testing. 

I searched the internet but found nothing. Anyone know more ?


----------



## TropicalSky

Thanks for the information. 

I tried to post some links that I found but I have to have 5 posts here on this site before it will let me post links.

I just googled cleanest beaches in Mexico and found an article. Seems that Sayulita and some beaches around Tijuana and Veracruz were towards the bottom. Oaxaca beaches, Baja Sur, PV were towards the top.


----------



## AlanMexicali

lat19n said:


> On our quick trip into Mexico City today I noticed two white cars, in two different locations, with green lettering on the side which read something like Vigilantes ambiente. They had taxis pulled over and it looked like they were doing on the spot emissions testing.
> 
> I searched the internet but found nothing. Anyone know more ?



Secretaría de Medio Ambiente y Recursos Naturales (SEMARNAT)
Secretary of Environment and Natural Resources

Procuraduría Federal de Protección al Ambiente [PROFEPA]
Federal Attorney for Environmental Protection

"The Federal Office of Environmental Protection is a decentralized administrative body of the Ministry of Environment and Natural Resources (SEMARNAT) with technical and operational autonomy. The main task of PROFEPA is to increase the levels of observance of environmental regulations."

https://www.sintesis.mx/Hgo/2017/07...tegrantes-de-comites-de-vigilancia-ambiental/

"7 jul. 2017 - La delegación Hidalgo de la Procuraduría Federal de Protección al Ambiente acreditó a 30 personas como miembros de tres Comités de Vigilancia Ambiental Participativa, pertenecientes a los ejidos de La Estanzuela y El Puente, en el municipio de Mineral del Chico; así como del ejido de Pueblo Nuevo,

Jul 7 2017 - The Hidalgo delegation of the Federal Procurator for Environmental Protection accredited 30 people as members of three Participatory Environmental Monitoring Committees, belonging to the ejidos of La Estanzuela and El Puente, in the municipality of Mineral del Chico; as well as the ejido of Pueblo Nuevo, ..."


----------



## lat19n

AlanMexicali said:


> Secretaría de Medio Ambiente y Recursos Naturales (SEMARNAT)
> Secretary of Environment and Natural Resources
> 
> Procuraduría Federal de Protección al Ambiente [PROFEPA]
> Federal Attorney for Environmental Protection
> 
> "The Federal Office of Environmental Protection is a decentralized administrative body of the Ministry of Environment and Natural Resources (SEMARNAT) with technical and operational autonomy. The main task of PROFEPA is to increase the levels of observance of environmental regulations."
> 
> https://www.sintesis.mx/Hgo/2017/07...tegrantes-de-comites-de-vigilancia-ambiental/
> 
> "7 jul. 2017 - La delegación Hidalgo de la Procuraduría Federal de Protección al Ambiente acreditó a 30 personas como miembros de tres Comités de Vigilancia Ambiental Participativa, pertenecientes a los ejidos de La Estanzuela y El Puente, en el municipio de Mineral del Chico; así como del ejido de Pueblo Nuevo,
> 
> Jul 7 2017 - The Hidalgo delegation of the Federal Procurator for Environmental Protection accredited 30 people as members of three Participatory Environmental Monitoring Committees, belonging to the ejidos of La Estanzuela and El Puente, in the municipality of Mineral del Chico; as well as the ejido of Pueblo Nuevo, ..."


Sorry - I do not see the relevance to the link you posted. Seems to have nothing to do with what I mentioned. But thanks for the response...


----------



## citlali

Yes SIngapore it very clean and you can go to jail for littering.. I do not remember if there was penalty about spitting all over the place like many people do in other countries in Asia but I do not remember people spitting in Singapore so they must have penalties for that too..


----------



## ojosazules11

lat19n said:


> On our quick trip into Mexico City today I noticed two white cars, in two different locations, with green lettering on the side which read something like Vigilantes ambiente. They had taxis pulled over and it looked like they were doing on the spot emissions testing.
> 
> I searched the internet but found nothing. Anyone know more ?


I searched under “Vigilancia Ambiental CDMX” and came up with several articles.

This one seems the most comprehensive at explaining the role of these “ecopatrols”:

CdMx refuerza vigilancia ambiental con 54 ecopatrullas - Grupo Milenio

And this article states these ecopatrols can now impose fines on those not in compliance with emissions regulations:

A partir de hoy las patrullas ambientales podrán imponer multas - Denuncia Leaks


----------



## lat19n

ojosazules11 said:


> I searched under “Vigilancia Ambiental CDMX” and came up with several articles.
> 
> This one seems the most comprehensive at explaining the role of these “ecopatrols”:
> 
> CdMx refuerza vigilancia ambiental con 54 ecopatrullas - Grupo Milenio
> 
> And this article states these ecopatrols can now impose fines on those not in compliance with emissions regulations:
> 
> A partir de hoy las patrullas ambientales podrán imponer multas - Denuncia Leaks


Thanks for that. I suppose that is a good thing. At least the two cars I noticed were operating on very very wide roads - off to the right. But personally (selfishly) I'd rather see someone do something about the field fires which fill the sky with smoke and if the wind is blowing right - your house.

We took our car to the inspection station this week. We had to make an appointment. When we got there we were sent home to get the factura for our car. Turns out that is a new requirement for all 2016 or newer vehicles. Can't imagine why. It is also getting a little pricey at 497 pesos every 6 months.


----------



## ojosazules11

lat19n said:


> Thanks for that. I suppose that is a good thing. At least the two cars I noticed were operating on very very wide roads - off to the right. But personally (selfishly) I'd rather see someone do something about the field fires which fill the sky with smoke and if the wind is blowing right - your house.
> 
> We took our car to the inspection station this week. We had to make an appointment. When we got there we were sent home to get the factura for our car. Turns out that is a new requirement for all 2016 or newer vehicles. Can't imagine why. It is also getting a little pricey at 497 pesos every 6 months.


I don’t know what the regulations are in your neck of the woods, but around Tepoztlán (the town) burning the fields is prohibited, given the proximity to the forest of the Parque Nacional El Tepozteco. I’m sure you are very aware of some of the awful forest fires around Tepoztlán over the years. Old traditions are hard to eradicate, and in spite of knowing the risk and damage they can cause, there are still farmers who burn their fields in the dry season.

The other risk is from careless visitors in the woods, lighting fires, dropping cigarettes, setting off fireworks, etc. With Carnaval this weekend and the tens of thousands of visitors descending on Tepoztlán over the next four days, the risk of someone carelessly starting a fire that spreads to the forest goes up. In 2014 two young volunteer firefighters from Tepoztlán died fighting a blaze that was believed to be intentionally set during Carnaval. I know they detained several young men believed to have been involved in starting that fire (by throwing a lit cigarette into the dry bush) but I never heard the final outcome.


----------



## lat19n

ojosazules11 said:


> I don’t know what the regulations are in your neck of the woods, but around Tepoztlán (the town) burning the fields is prohibited, given the proximity to the forest of the Parque Nacional El Tepozteco. I’m sure you are very aware of some of the awful forest fires around Tepoztlán over the years. Old traditions are hard to eradicate, and in spite of knowing the risk and damage they can cause, there are still farmers who burn their fields in the dry season.


About an hour ago I had to shut the windows to the South because smoke was coming into the house and it smelt more like plastic/rubber than wood. I just checked and the winds have shifted and that smoke is now heading right in the direction of Tepoztlan. So - the nice folk in Tepoztlan can impose local regulations but unfortunately they can not control the winds. 

Yes - Forestal no longer allows our community to burn yard trash - and we now have it collected once a week - but no one seems to be policing the burning of trash just a few kms from the forest.


----------



## surabi

citlali said:


> Yes SIngapore it very clean and you can go to jail for littering.. I do not remember if there was penalty about spitting all over the place like many people do in other countries in Asia but I do not remember people spitting in Singapore so they must have penalties for that too..


I've never been able to figure out why people need to spit all the time. Mexican men, among others, do it a lot. I've never felt the need to spit on the street.


----------



## citlali

It is nothing here ike in Asia.. I used to hate the sound of people spitting men and women and always wonder where the stuff would land.. Here it is othig like Asia. where you hear people spitting in restaurants..I cannot figure it out unless they are chewing tobacco or othre type of stuff..like the red stuff in India.


----------



## TropicalSky

In terms of beach areas, the Environmental and Natural Resources Ministry (SEMARNAT) does some testing for enterococcus per 100 milliliters of water. In other words testing how much raw sewage is in the water. I don't know how often they do this or how reliable it is. Anything over 200 enterococcus per 100 milliliters of water they are supposed to close the beach. In the US I think the standard is 35 enterococcus per 100 milliliters of water for a beach to be closed, so stricter standards then Mexico.

Here are some quotes from a Greenpeace guy who studied Mexican oceans:

"We ask for monitoring that includes more substances, particularly persistent toxins. It is good that enterococcus is analyzed, but it is only one of hundreds of elements that are in the rivers and flow to the beaches,"

"Many of these substances are carcinogens and we do not know how much end up on the beaches as they are not monitored. This is only the tip of the iceberg; there is much more in the water,"

In Mexico, he said, only 46 per cent of sewage is treated and the authorities do little to increase the amount of treated sewage.

Veracruz, he pointed out, is the coastal state with the largest volume of untreated sewage dumped into the ocean, with more than 4,000 gallons per second.

"Of the 154 coastal municipalities of Mexico, less than one-half have sewage treatment plants. Of the 77 municipalities that have a sewage treatment infrastructure, half of them are not functioning at 100 per cent and another half have a capacity below what is necessary," he said.

......so with all that said. If I lived in a Mexican beach community and liked to swim, I might want to check to see if they dump raw sewage into the rivers feeding the ocean, bays or ocean.

Anyone with more info on the state of sewage treatment in Mexico?


----------



## lat19n

TropicalSky said:


> In terms of beach areas, the Environmental and Natural Resources Ministry (SEMARNAT) does some testing for enterococcus per 100 milliliters of water. In other words testing how much raw sewage is in the water. I don't know how often they do this or how reliable it is. Anything over 200 enterococcus per 100 milliliters of water they are supposed to close the beach. In the US I think the standard is 35 enterococcus per 100 milliliters of water for a beach to be closed, so stricter standards then Mexico.
> 
> Here are some quotes from a Greenpeace guy who studied Mexican oceans:
> 
> "We ask for monitoring that includes more substances, particularly persistent toxins. It is good that enterococcus is analyzed, but it is only one of hundreds of elements that are in the rivers and flow to the beaches,"
> 
> "Many of these substances are carcinogens and we do not know how much end up on the beaches as they are not monitored. This is only the tip of the iceberg; there is much more in the water,"
> 
> In Mexico, he said, only 46 per cent of sewage is treated and the authorities do little to increase the amount of treated sewage.
> 
> Veracruz, he pointed out, is the coastal state with the largest volume of untreated sewage dumped into the ocean, with more than 4,000 gallons per second.
> 
> "Of the 154 coastal municipalities of Mexico, less than one-half have sewage treatment plants. Of the 77 municipalities that have a sewage treatment infrastructure, half of them are not functioning at 100 per cent and another half have a capacity below what is necessary," he said.
> 
> ......so with all that said. If I lived in a Mexican beach community and liked to swim, I might want to check to see if they dump raw sewage into the rivers feeding the ocean, bays or ocean.
> 
> Anyone with more info on the state of sewage treatment in Mexico?


My but you seem to have a lot of interest in this topic. Let me guess, dissertation ? Perhaps job related research ? doesn't feel like the sort of normal interest an expat might have...


----------



## TropicalSky

lat19n said:


> My but you seem to have a lot of interest in this topic. Let me guess, dissertation ? Perhaps job related research ? doesn't feel like the sort of normal interest an expat might have...


I am just interested in the topic as a person that would live in Mexico part time and likes to swim in the ocean. I can't see how pollution levels would not be a topic of interest for any expat in researching a place they might choose to live?


----------



## lat19n

TropicalSky said:


> I am just interested in the topic as a person that would live in Mexico part time and likes to swim in the ocean. I can't see how pollution levels would not be a topic of interest for any expat in researching a place they might choose to live?


For at least 25 years we spent almost all day (weather permitting) in the water on the weekends in the US. We never consulted the water quality. Here is the info for a local beach area from where we came from. Apparently 60-95% of the time the water quality passes testing. And that water is tested every other week. And in an area where there can be swift currents that does not say much.

https://www.theswimguide.org/beach/1437?set_language=en

We live nowhere near the ocean in Mexico - but I can tell you that the local water company has a budget and when the budget runs out - no more chemicals are added to the water. (Fortunately - we are on community well water - which NEVER has any chemicals applied and which is only tested every 6 months). But we do have a RO system.


----------



## lagoloo

Where I came from in coastal California, the ocean was not fit to swim in, but people did it anyway and as far as I know, the death toll was infinitesimal. No comfort to the OP, I'd guess, but I imagine the ocean isn't fit to swim in either, in most of the well populated beach areas in Mexico. What to do? I'd suggest that the health conscious use a well tended pool and just enjoy the beaches for the sight and sounds of the sea.


----------



## citlali

If I remember correctly the beaches the most polluted are the ones where rivers go in.. like the Mismaloya beach which is very poluted or the Boca de Tomatlan one.. I think Yelapa is better and Nuevo Vallarta is also better .. That is what I remember from years ago.. now I do not check and do not go in the water so that takes care of the problem.


----------



## chicois8

Right next to Nuevo Vallarta is the outflow of the huge Ameca River........


----------



## TropicalSky

lat19n said:


> For at least 25 years we spent almost all day (weather permitting) in the water on the weekends in the US. We never consulted the water quality. H.


Thanks for the link and info. In terms of checking the water in the US.... the US has adequate sewage treatment infrastructure everywhere, and likely tighter environmental regulations and enforced building codes. There may be other things that get in the water, but I don't think any coastal municipalities in the US dump raw sewage into their rivers, bays, or oceans. Mexico though does not always have adequate sewage infrastructure, that's why I'd be a little more interested in checking it out.


----------



## TropicalSky

lagoloo said:


> Where I came from in coastal California, the ocean was not fit to swim in, but people did it anyway and as far as I know, the death toll was infinitesimal. No comfort to the OP, I'd guess, but I imagine the ocean isn't fit to swim in either, in most of the well populated beach areas in Mexico. What to do? I'd suggest that the health conscious use a well tended pool and just enjoy the beaches for the sight and sounds of the sea.


What made you think the ocean water was not fit to swim in CA? Were there tests done on the water to show it was bad? I know surfers used to tell me they wouldn't surf the south San Diego beaches because of stuff that would make its way up from Tijuana beaches. I think one difference between Mexico and the USA as I have said is the US has adequate sewage treatment infrastructure everywhere, and I don't think raw sewage gets into the waterways in the USA. This is not always the case in Mexico. 

I don't want to make to huge of a deal out of it though. Was just curious about the issue. It just doesn't make the beach quite as appetizing for a swim if you know whats going into it I still really like Mexico regardless

No doubt its sad what we have done to our lakes, rivers, streams and bays all over the world


----------



## TropicalSky

citlali said:


> If I remember correctly the beaches the most polluted are the ones where rivers go in.. like the Mismaloya beach which is very poluted or the Boca de Tomatlan one.. I think Yelapa is better and Nuevo Vallarta is also better .. That is what I remember from years ago.. now I do not check and do not go in the water so that takes care of the problem.


I think you are right about that. Los Muertos beach has tested high for sewage in the past and its not far from where the Rio Cuale empties. So has Mismaloya and Boca de Tomatlan. I know Sayulita has had issues. I was just in the small hamlet of Boca de Tomatlan not long ago. I was dismayed as I waited for the bus just looking behind me at all the garbage and waste just thrown into a little woods area behind where I stood. Kind of a rough and tumble little village there.


----------



## lagoloo

TropicalSky said:


> What made you think the ocean water was not fit to swim in CA? Were there tests done on the water to show it was bad? I know surfers used to tell me they wouldn't surf the south San Diego beaches because of stuff that would make its way up from Tijuana beaches. I think one difference between Mexico and the USA as I have said is the US has adequate sewage treatment infrastructure everywhere, and I don't think raw sewage gets into the waterways in the USA. This is not always the case in Mexico.
> 
> I don't want to make to huge of a deal out of it though. Was just curious about the issue. It just doesn't make the beach quite as appetizing for a swim if you know whats going into it I still really like Mexico regardless
> 
> No doubt its sad what we have done to our lakes, rivers, streams and bays all over the world


One of many entries from a Google search on pollution by the sea in the U.S.:
https://www.nrdc.org/media/2013/130626


----------



## citlali

and of course it all depends where the currents take the stuff.. oh well..live by the sword die by the sword..or swim in a pool..


----------



## TundraGreen

TropicalSky said:


> What made you think the ocean water was not fit to swim in CA? Were there tests done on the water to show it was bad? I know surfers used to tell me they wouldn't surf the south San Diego beaches because of stuff that would make its way up from Tijuana beaches. I think one difference between Mexico and the USA as I have said is the US has adequate sewage treatment infrastructure everywhere, and I don't think raw sewage gets into the waterways in the USA. This is not always the case in Mexico.
> 
> I don't want to make to huge of a deal out of it though. Was just curious about the issue. It just doesn't make the beach quite as appetizing for a swim if you know whats going into it I still really like Mexico regardless
> 
> No doubt its sad what we have done to our lakes, rivers, streams and bays all over the world


Years ago, when I lived in San Francisco, there was a sewage treatment plant with an outlet into the ocean near the zoo. Because San Francisco has one drainage system that handles both sewer and runoff, the treatment plants could be overwhelmed by the volume during winter storms. If I recall correctly, under those conditions outflow from the treatment pipe could be pretty bad.


----------



## ojosazules11

TundraGreen said:


> Years ago, when I lived in San Francisco, there was a sewage treatment plant with an outlet into the ocean near the zoo. Because San Francisco has one drainage system that handles both sewer and runoff, the treatment plants could be overwhelmed by the volume during winter storms. If I recall correctly, under those conditions outflow from the treatment pipe could be pretty bad.


We have a similar situation in Toronto, with the sewage treatment plant next to Lake Ontario. The beaches in Toronto (yes, we have beaches on the lake) are regularly monitored for e. coliforms. Most of the summer they are fine, but sometimes they are closed due to a high count. I guess the important thing is they ARE monitored so you know what you are getting into, literally.


----------



## beachseeker

I would say Merida Yucatan state. Very clean city, especially the north end where I live. New and modern


----------

