# Where in Portugal is it hot yet with plenty of spring water please?



## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

Happy New Year!

I want to grow my own wholegrain rice here in Portugal.

I am hoping someone on this forum might know of the perfect place?

The conditions my rice would need would be in an area where the summer nighttime temperatures do not fall below 21 degrees Celsius for at least 40 continuous days.

Rice was originally found growing in dry conditions and can successfully be grown without having to use a paddy field, but I would like the option of flooding the rice for a couple of weeks during the growing season, for which I will need water. I am also aiming to live off-grid, so good-quality and free spring water for drinking that is plentiful throughout the whole year is pretty essential too.

I have traveled through most of Portugal and I like those areas that are green, fresh and with plenty of natural water sources, and which are a little less populated (such as the northern part of the district of Viseu). Unfortunately, my rice demands to be somewhere more consistently warmer in summer.

Any chance there is somewhere that would please us both? I have thought of buying two small quintas in different areas but would much prefer to just have the one place.

Many thank-you's for any sensible replies.

Warmest,
Foradarede


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## paramonte (Sep 9, 2007)

Comporta zone in the Setubal area, is a rice production zone. Also Mondego river area (Central PT, close to the sea) is a rice prodution area. Potrugal has the rice highest production volume and consumption in Europe.


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

Hi paramonte

Thanks for your reply. The areas you mention are quite built-up though, aren't they? I am not looking to set up a large farm for commercial purposes. I just want to grow a small field of rice for personal consumption, and am looking to be in the right area climatically but still be fairly rural and private. Do the areas you mention give me this?

Thanks


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Not to that degree, plenty of rural areas, look at the rice areas along Mondego on Google Earth etc very easy to see, but I would say that the land you'd need by nature of the volume of water reguired is already under cultivation and would be extremely difficult to purchase and get necessary water rights


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## paramonte (Sep 9, 2007)

Hummm Comporta area is not built up, is however an ever growing holiday spot, due to close by beatifull beaches, but quite rural. You will find there the extensive rice fields.

The Mondego area close to Coimbra westwards also producing rice, quite rural. 

These rice fields get the water from Mondego and Sado River, I believe


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## del Pereira (Jul 20, 2012)

Aveiro area (Canelas, Salreu) were great rice areas, some still grown there plenty of rice pattie land around.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Possibly an easier area to purchase or rent something suitable to grow rice as property is not generally built in close proximity a consideration


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## BodgieMcBodge (Mar 8, 2013)

Hi,

What size paddy are you looking for? 
What production p/a do you expect?
Will you be growing every season?




Foradarede said:


> Hi paramonte
> 
> Thanks for your reply. The areas you mention are quite built-up though, aren't they? I am not looking to set up a large farm for commercial purposes. I just want to grow a small field of rice for personal consumption, and am looking to be in the right area climatically but still be fairly rural and private. Do the areas you mention give me this?
> 
> Thanks


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## Liesbetje (Aug 12, 2011)

If you go a bit South from Comporta, e.g. Melides, you'll find rice paddies over there as well. Maybe this area would suit you?


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## Centralbound (Aug 16, 2013)

Have you condidered moving somewhere where rice is produced and renting space on an existing paddy? I know the Mondego area is having some kind of factional war at the moment over water rights so it could be tricky for a foreigner to buy well there.


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## dian (Jan 6, 2014)

Aveiro area is a very good place


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

Thank you for all your replies - very much appreciated.

del Pereira, when you mentioned Aveiro I was reminded that there are people in the North-West of the US who are experimenting with rice growing, and so I am doing a little research into the possibility of finding a cold-hardy variety of rice. It seems that people are experimenting in various ways, including not flooding at all. I have more research to do, but all the replies here are very useful to me, so thank you. I was not aware of many of these places and they sound interesting.

I anticipate the consumption of around 1kg of rice per week for personal use, which would apparently take around 105m2 of growing space, although might be slightly more if I don't flood as apparently the rice would need more space between plants. Still, that's a small area for what could potentially give me my staple food for a year, every year.


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

Foradarede said:


> Thank you for all your replies - very much appreciated.
> 
> 
> I anticipate the consumption of around 1kg of rice per week for personal use, which would apparently take around 105m2 of growing space, although might be slightly more if I don't flood as apparently the rice would need more space between plants. Still, that's a small area for what could potentially give me my staple food for a year, every year.


1kg of rice can be bought in a UK supermarket for less than 50p, that is for the stores 'own brand' long-grain rice.

At the rate that you require being 52kgs per year that equates to £26 per annum ... now either rice is very expensive in Portugal or you love to work for very little! 

I can understand growing rice on a large scale to sell any surplus but quite frankly I can think of better ways to spend my time to save that amount of expenditure...anyway 'each to their own' and good luck with your venture.


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## canoeman (Mar 3, 2011)

Averio grows a strain of rice suited to area, last I read they where trying to get recognized, regardless of area your end up water would be your major issue especially if you have to buy it, rice expensive here not by any means a good Basmati is cheaper than Tesco own label


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

I am aiming to be 100% self-sufficient in food, and as I eat a macrobiotic diet I want good quality foods that I have grown myself without chemicals. Organic wholegrain rice sells at over 3 euros (long-grain) and 4 euros (short-grain) per kilo (I don't remember the exact costs right now), in the health food shops I shop at, and if I do things right eventually I won't be paying cash for any of my food.

By growing my own rice I will also save on buying other rice products, including rice syrup, rice milk, rice bran (used for making pickles), amazake (made from sweet brown rice), rice vinegar etc. These products are not particularly cheap to buy.

I prefer to work directly for myself doing things that make sense to me, rather than going to work for someone else doing something I don't believe in in order to take home some paper to use in exchange for foods of dubious quality. But that's just me.


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

Foradarede said:


> I am aiming to be 100% self-sufficient in food, and as I eat a macrobiotic diet I want good quality foods that I have grown myself without chemicals. Organic wholegrain rice sells at over 3 euros (long-grain) and 4 euros (short-grain) per kilo (I don't remember the exact costs right now), in the health food shops I shop at, and if I do things right eventually I won't be paying cash for any of my food.
> 
> By growing my own rice I will also save on buying other rice products, including rice syrup, rice milk, rice bran (used for making pickles), amazake (made from sweet brown rice), rice vinegar etc. These products are not particularly cheap to buy.
> 
> I prefer to work directly for myself doing things that make sense to me, rather than going to work for someone else doing something I don't believe in in order to take home some paper to use in exchange for foods of dubious quality. But that's just me.


As I said each to their own, I'm self-employed hand manufacturing things that I want to make, I enjoy my work making things, I enjoy growing things, eating my own produce and those of other individuals but I am not as die hard as you. 

Perhaps I am lucky in what I manufacture as it allows me time to do what I want time-wise and to have the purchasing power to buy what I want to eat.

Working for the sole purpose of money or toiling for sustenance are as bad as each other, there is more to life than working to live, whichever way you do it.

I guess the secret to a happy life is a balance...being totally dependent upon your crop for you means of food can be stressful, if your crop fails for whatever reason. Principles do not keep hunger at bay.


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## paramonte (Sep 9, 2007)

Incidentally yesterday I had to discard two kilos of Basmati Rice bought at Lidl, the brand is Sun Valey (or something to that effect). The smell of pesticide was so strong...and I asked someone else to confirm. I was very surprised, a first time to me.


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

Oh dear, Paramonte, that's crazy. Maybe you would prefer trying organic? Wholegrain organic rice is delicious, filling, makes you feel calm and satisifed. Although if you eat meat wholegrain rice may feel a bit heavy. It's possible to buy organic basmati too (white or brown).

Oronero - My main influence is the techniques developed out of the observations of Masanobu Fukuoka, a Japanese farmer who achieved success in growing foods by working with Nature and not by trying to control Her.

I am well aware that crops fail, and my security against this is to grow a very wide range of different food crops. Good for me, good for the planet.

I know it sounds like it will be a lot of work to grow all my own foods, and there is no doubt that it will take up a lot of my time and focus, at least for the first few years. But this is exactly the kind of work I genuinely enjoy, and as long as I enjoy it, it is not work. I will also have help for the more physical tasks. There will be many days during the year when I won't have to do a thing! I will probably have more weeks off a year than most people working a full-time job, yet the work I do will be good exercise, as well as really interesting, as what I will be doing is marvelling at Nature and how she does things.

So please don't worry about me and the life I have chosen. I just wanted to get some advice about the areas I might consider setting up in, is all.

Thank you.


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

Foradarede said:


> Oronero - My main influence is the techniques developed out of the observations of Masanobu Fukuoka, a Japanese farmer who achieved success in growing foods by working with Nature and not by trying to control Her.
> 
> 
> I know it sounds like it will be a lot of work to grow all my own foods, and there is no doubt that it will take up a lot of my time and focus, at least for the first few years. But this is exactly the kind of work I genuinely enjoy, and as long as I enjoy it, it is not work. I will also have help for the more physical tasks. There will be many days during the year when I won't have to do a thing! I will probably have more weeks off a year than most people working a full-time job, yet the work I do will be good exercise, as well as really interesting, as what I will be doing is marvelling at Nature and how she does things.
> ...


Well good luck with your venture, if you enjoy what you do then you have the best job in the world!

My Grandfather brought up eight children working the land in Portugal, it was tough but he lived into his mid 90's. If others have done it in the past there is nothing to stop you doing a similar thing in the future.

Don't forget to earn some cash though, it's always handy!


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## Foradarede (Aug 25, 2013)

Your grandfather is an inspiration to people like me. Yes, I hope to follow in the footsteps of those who had healthy lives growing their own foods. I can't wait!

I am sure I will still receive an income in the future, but it is a personal goal of mine to see just how well I can live without, ahem, spending a penny, if possible.

Thank you for your kind words. I wish you luck with your choices too.


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

Foradarede said:


> Your grandfather is an inspiration to people like me. Yes, I hope to follow in the footsteps of those who had healthy lives growing their own foods. I can't wait!
> 
> I am sure I will still receive an income in the future, but it is a personal goal of mine to see just how well I can live without, ahem, spending a penny, if possible.
> 
> Thank you for your kind words. I wish you luck with your choices too.


Please bear in mind that my grandfather was feeding a total of ten mouths, so the economics of food production against earning a living from conventional methods and doing the same for one or two mouths is different.

Furthermore it was common back then for families to have a number of different fields/ orchards spread around the local surrounding countryside each growing different things, possibly dependent upon soil conditions and the topography of locations.

Land availability, costs and running costs associated with modern living were very different to what it is now, it maybe much harder to replicate that sort of thing now in modern society...as I have already said, best of luck to you.


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## maidentales (Mar 29, 2010)

*Rice growing*

As I travel down towards Lisbon, there are areas where rice is already grown on the outskirts where I believe the Tejo floods.


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## maidentales (Mar 29, 2010)

It looks as if there's some website information available:

http://om.ciheam.org/om/pdf/c15-3/CI011012.pdf

Rice production in Portugal | Novarroz

Rice Fields

Tractor in rice fields near Aveiro, Portugal - Pixdaus

The latter is simply a picture although Aveiro is not far from where I have the house and it's a lovely area.


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