# Kidnap & Ransom Insurance



## thinkering (Apr 24, 2013)

Does anyone have experience with kidnap & ransom insurance?

I'm wondering what the overall thought is on if this is a good investment for international business owners in D.F., or overkill.

I believe any ransom would still have to be paid independently first, and then the insurance company would reimburse. Some insurance policy providers do include negotiation/release/recovery services from expert companies (independently run) and crisis support, which seems attractive.

I imagine if there is a kidnap everything happens very fast, it would definitely give some peace of mind to have access to an experienced kidnap negotiator 24-7 and be reimbursed for the cost of the ransom. Some policies I was looking at today cover the individual, their families, as well as their clients, visitors, and guests.

Not sure what an average policy would cost, and if anyone here has experience with such insurance.


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## Cochinito (Dec 4, 2010)

How often do you think such kidnappings happen, and on what basis?

This reminds me of when a friend came to give a talk at a conference in Condesa, without knowing that I was living just blocks away and thus without talking to me beforehand. And he hired a full-time bodyguard*. :fear::doh:

*Apparently that can work out very romantically in some cases. But not in his.


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## thinkering (Apr 24, 2013)

I think it is unlikely to happen - I'm not a naive foreigner who believes the news accurately reflects safety in Mexico.

Our business would deal exclusively with high net-worth Mexican families (starting at several million dollars). I would also need to travel to less stable parts of Mexico city on a bi-weekly basis for family reasons. (and yes, I will use the most dented, dusty, ugliest car that I can find).

So two minor concerns, first a powerful (accidental) unhappy client and second word getting out in the wrong neighborhood about ties to Canada and the business activity. (Yes, I know so many Caucasians live in Mexico, etc - but not in this part of the city). 

My extended Mexican family there has already experienced kidnap, rape and robberies and there are regular murders for cash at the local convenience store. My goal is to get them out of that area but this may take a year.

I have no concerns about strangers, gangs, corrupt police, or organized crime in D.F. 

Please note I posted this re: insurance policy, and am not suggesting that Mexico City is more dangerous than any other city home 20 million plus people.


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## PanamaJack (Apr 1, 2013)

thinkering said:


> Does anyone have experience with kidnap & ransom insurance?
> 
> I'm wondering what the overall thought is on if this is a good investment for international business owners in D.F., or overkill.
> 
> ...


As an expat who has lived here for over 40 years and whose father was a U.S. career diplomat, I find this thread to be quite amusing. My dad insisted I have a bodyguard whenever I left the house here in D.F. until I was 18 and left for the U.S. to study. When I returned he insisted again and I told him there was no way I would ever have a bodyguard again. That was 30 years ago and I remain true to my word. This sort of problem with kidnapping is almost non-existent in Mexico. Yes, there are kidappings but the majority happen to be the drug gangs either kidnapping other gang members, or using a kidnapping as a way of extorsion to get their way with the local, state or federal government or to get quick money.

If I were an expat and worried about kidnapping in Mexico, I might have my wife's family checked out. I am not saying that in a negative way, but one never knows and many kidnappings are carried out by acquaintances, distant family members and disgruntled employees. You said you have to go to terrible neighborhoods and will be riding in a beat up car, I hope you hide your face, because as soon as they see a blond haired foreigner the car disguise will be useless going forward. 

I believe very wealthy people, diplomats, congresspeople, the president, his cabinet and influencial people in the public and private sector should be protected with bodyguards as it is a fact of life that at times things happen. 

However, I have known many businessmen and women from Europe, the United States and other places that were very very successful and many would not bother with bodyguards and those that did were worried about being assaulted or robbed but not kidnapped. 

Most kidnappings are carried out by inexperienced crooks. They are not like the ones you see in movies such as "Proof of Life" with Russell Crowe and Meg Ryan. They are less sophisticated and usually are trying to get smaller sums of money as quickly as possible with little or no negotiation. Just my opinion.


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## thinkering (Apr 24, 2013)

Thank you PanamaJack!

Your thorough response is helpful and glad to be a source of amusement. My kidnap inquiry is closed.

I trust my in-laws and family, but not the people some of them romance with. Also not the expensive SUV parked nearby in the middle of a semi-slum. It doesn't help staying inside the house to hide my blue eyes when new dates are brought in for beers. I'll figure something out.

The feedback here has put me at ease about doing business in and living in D.F. and am looking forward to packing the bags for some Mexican culture .


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

If it makes you more comfortable then buy the insurance......


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## Longford (May 25, 2012)

You can't afford the insurance. None of us could, unless we were senior corporate executives or super wealthy, IMO.


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## michmex (Jul 15, 2012)

The large multi-national company I previously worked for in Mexico City let it be known throughout the world that they do not pay any ransoms under any conditions. A bit uncomforting for us employes but it did serve to minimize the risk for us all.

The company did provide evasive driving classes for all of us international service employes. It was disappointing to me that the classes were not offered to everyone. This was back in the 1995-1997 time frame when the D. F. was a a much different place than it is today. Express kidnappings and carjackings occurred with regularity.

I would not want it to be known that I carried ransom insurance. It seems to me an open invitation for a kidnapping, express or otherwise. I believe the best protection is to be aware of your surroundings and do not flaunt your wealth.


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## gringorojo (Apr 29, 2013)

PanamaJack said:


> As an expat who has lived here for over 40 years and whose father was a U.S. career diplomat, I find this thread to be quite amusing. My dad insisted I have a bodyguard whenever I left the house here in D.F. until I was 18 and left for the U.S. to study. When I returned he insisted again and I told him there was no way I would ever have a bodyguard again. That was 30 years ago and I remain true to my word. This sort of problem with kidnapping is almost non-existent in Mexico. Yes, there are kidappings but the majority happen to be the drug gangs either kidnapping other gang members, or using a kidnapping as a way of extorsion to get their way with the local, state or federal government or to get quick money.
> 
> If I were an expat and worried about kidnapping in Mexico, I might have my wife's family checked out. I am not saying that in a negative way, but one never knows and many kidnappings are carried out by acquaintances, distant family members and disgruntled employees. You said you have to go to terrible neighborhoods and will be riding in a beat up car, I hope you hide your face, because as soon as they see a blond haired foreigner the car disguise will be useless going forward.
> 
> ...


While the majority of kidnappings for ransom in Mexico do not target foreigners, there definitely are sophisticated, experienced and professional kidnapping gangs operating throughout the country, including the DF. 

Odds are you or your family will not be kidnapped, but if you are just buying a personal policy to cover you and your family, you can find very affordable policies depending on the coverage limit and included benefits such as retained K&R consultants (negotiators), crisis management planning and immediate response. The policies also cover threat extortions, which are more likely to affect you or your family. Quotes can be obtained very quickly and easily. I can point you in a direction if you'd like.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

gringorojo said:


> While the majority of kidnappings for ransom in Mexico do not target foreigners, there definitely are sophisticated, experienced and professional kidnapping gangs operating throughout the country, including the DF.
> 
> Odds are you or your family will not be kidnapped, but if you are just buying a personal policy to cover you and your family, you can find very affordable policies depending on the coverage limit and included benefits such as retained K&R consultants (negotiators), crisis management planning and immediate response. The policies also cover threat extortions, which are more likely to affect you or your family. Quotes can be obtained very quickly and easily. I can point you in a direction if you'd like.


Gringorojo, since you are an expat in Peru located at the moment in Miami, how have you acquired your expertise in kidnappings in Mexico?


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## PanamaJack (Apr 1, 2013)

Isla Verde said:


> Gringorojo, since you are an expat in Peru located at the moment in Miami, how have you acquired your expertise in kidnappings in Mexico?


Chances are he sells those types of policies and no matter what he say, the sophistication in Mexico is not what it is in many other countries. I would love to see his figures and have him back it up with some substance. All I can say is I took by information from data from the U.S. Embassy... they might know a thing or two don't you think gringorojo?


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

PanamaJack said:


> Chances are he sells those types of policies and no matter what he say, the sophistication in Mexico is not what it is in many other countries. I would love to see his figures and have him back it up with some substance. All I can say is I took by information from data from the U.S. Embassy... they might know a thing or two don't you think gringorojo?


I was also thinking that he was trying to make an indirect sales pitch, which is not allowed on this forum. Time to take care of Moderator business  .


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