# IRS wants 53%, time to move



## Ant in Portugal (Jan 30, 2013)

Hello,
I'm really hoping someone can give me a link to a tax specialist in Spain. I work offshore, all over the world on a seismic survey boat. I now live in Portugal where my tax bill will go to 53% this year. I have swallowed 38% for the last few years but now, I am not prepared to pay this increase. So, my son and partner will stay in Portugal, I am looking to move somewhere either tax free (UK yes) or with a low rate of tax if nearer. I need a specialist tax consultant dealing with Spainsh laws. Spain is my logical choice BUT I do not know the full status for tax and offshore workers/natural resource workeres/scientific vessels/mariners status etc. In essence I will buy/rent a property and spend a portion of my leave at my address (in Spain ??), then travel to Portugal to spend my remaining time with my family.
I have read a few threads already and I fancy a lot of people have been "lucky" to avoid a tax bill in Spain. I want to be legal, somewhere and either not pay tax (as in UK) or pay a small amount. I understand fiscal residency as opposed to residency, I realise I am separating my family technically to pay lower taxes but it seems my only logical choice. I/we will naturally have to file separate IRS returns.
Any pointers, advice, links, recommendations, truly appreciated.
Cheers, Ant


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## Pablo91 (Jan 30, 2013)

If you have the possibility to pay their taxes in the UK I advise you, Spain is also not very well economically and fiscal stability is not assured. With the crisis is natural that Spain has to harden their tax burden.

Since that point now in Portugal are you?

I hope I was a help.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

- a very well known & repescted


Ant in Portugal said:


> Hello,
> I'm really hoping someone can give me a link to a tax specialist in Spain. I work offshore, all over the world on a seismic survey boat. I now live in Portugal where my tax bill will go to 53% this year. I have swallowed 38% for the last few years but now, I am not prepared to pay this increase. So, my son and partner will stay in Portugal, I am looking to move somewhere either tax free (UK yes) or with a low rate of tax if nearer. I need a specialist tax consultant dealing with Spainsh laws. Spain is my logical choice BUT I do not know the full status for tax and offshore workers/natural resource workeres/scientific vessels/mariners status etc. In essence I will buy/rent a property and spend a portion of my leave at my address (in Spain ??), then travel to Portugal to spend my remaining time with my family.
> I have read a few threads already and I fancy a lot of people have been "lucky" to avoid a tax bill in Spain. I want to be legal, somewhere and either not pay tax (as in UK) or pay a small amount. I understand fiscal residency as opposed to residency, I realise I am separating my family technically to pay lower taxes but it seems my only logical choice. I/we will naturally have to file separate IRS returns.
> Any pointers, advice, links, recommendations, truly appreciated.
> Cheers, Ant


I don't know what percentage tax you'd have to pay but you _would _have to declare worldwide income & pay tax on it if you become tax resident here

I'd check out the rules in Portugal more carefully - in Spain even if you don't live here but are financially supporting a family which _does _live here, you are considered to be tax resident - I'd be surprised if it wasn't a similar situation in Portugal, so simply buying property in Spain wouldn't help

this company is well-respected

http://www.advoco.es/hot-topics/102-spanish-income-tax-rates.html


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## Ant in Portugal (Jan 30, 2013)

*Thanks for advice*

Hi there,
I followed up on advoco, it says online they are not taking on more clients. I have now employed 3 tax accountants, Portuguese, English and Deloitte. Looking at as many angles as possible. I think in essence, my result will be move back to UK. At least there I know there is tax free status available. Maybe, my family will follow. Thanks for pointers. Ciao, Antlane:


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

David Searl knows everything about legal issues in Spain. He has several books on the market.


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## neddie (Jun 11, 2012)

...just as a shot in the dark you may want to look into Andorra, Isle of Man or even Malta.


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## kombikneelo (Jan 25, 2013)

Ant in Portugal said:


> Hi there,
> I followed up on advoco, it says online they are not taking on more clients. I have now employed 3 tax accountants, Portuguese, English and Deloitte. Looking at as many angles as possible. I think in essence, my result will be move back to UK. At least there I know there is tax free status available. Maybe, my family will follow. Thanks for pointers. Ciao, Antlane:


All the best in following up from all angles. Please accept this reply to your post in an open-minded way - the following quote may not apply to your situation at all - but we recently read an article that interviewed children / teenagers and the effect it had on those whose parents left them for money reasons. The stories varied but many had a common thread, the family suffered emotionally when a parent departed or a spouse left his/her mate. "Be wise enough not to wear yourself out trying to get rich. Your money can be gone in a flash, as if it had grown wings and flown away like an eagle" - ancient proverb

Gave us pause so just thought we'd pass it on.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

kombikneelo said:


> All the best in following up from all angles. Please accept this reply to your post in an open-minded way - the following quote may not apply to your situation at all - but we recently read an article that interviewed children / teenagers and the effect it had on those whose parents left them for money reasons. The stories varied but many had a common thread, the family suffered emotionally when a parent departed or a spouse left his/her mate. "Be wise enough not to wear yourself out trying to get rich. Your money can be gone in a flash, as if it had grown wings and flown away like an eagle" - ancient proverb
> 
> Gave us pause so just thought we'd pass it on.


I'm pretty certain from the post that he isn't actually planning to leave in a physical sense - just on paper, so that he doesn't have to pay tax....


as I said in my previous post though - that probably won't make any difference if Portugal's tax laws are anything like Spain's


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## NickZ (Jun 26, 2009)

Virtually all the OECD uses the same rules for tax residency. They have to because the standard OECD tax treaty includes a section dealing with tax residency. Any country wanting to do things differently would have to negotiate with each of the OECD countries. Not worth it when basically everybody shares the same view on residency.

The only different thing I see with Spanish law is that it's far clearer then other countries. 

To the OP to change tax residency you need to make what is called a definitive break.

This starts with getting rid of any home you have access to. So sell the family home or cancel the lease. But if you have wife and kids living in a country you'll have trouble .

Even selling the house isn't really enough. close bank accounts. Cancel club memberships. Exchange your drivers license for the new country. Establish a home in a new country.

In other words to move you really need to move.


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