# Need help for EOI and submission - 189 or 190, experience related confusion.



## harishsidhartha (Jan 2, 2014)

Dear Friends, 

I have done my ACS and IELTS (7+ each) and is about to go for EOI. I have following queries. 

1)	My ACS assessment was done in April 2014 and as per my assessment result, experience after April 2004 till 2014-Jan is valid (the dates mentioned in my reference letter from my present employer). My experience from April 1998 till May 2004 was not counted/validated by ACS. As I am planning to go for EOI now, can I show the experience after Jan 2014 (which is with the same employer) also?

2)	As per my assessment result, 

a.	My Bachelor of Science in Computer Science completed in January 2010 has been assessed as comparable to an AQF Bachelor Degree with a major in computing

b.	My Cisco Certified Design Professional from Cisco completed August 2004 has been assessed as comparable to an AQF Diploma with a major in computing

c.	Your Cisco Certified Network Professional from Cisco completed October 2003 has been assessed as comparable to an AQF Diploma with a major in computing

Lot of people in this forum has mentioned that only the experience after bachelor’s degree will be counted. In my case, I have 2 diploma equivalent certificates (one taken in 2003 and another in 2004) and a Bachelor’s degree taken in 2010. As per the ACS assessment, my experience after April 2004 is valid which will give me 10+ years’ experience. 

Will there be any complication regarding my experience, as my bachelor’s degree was taken only in 2010?

3)	Even though I am getting 65 points now (25 for age, 10 for IELTS, 15 for degree and 15 for experience), Is it wise to apply for 190 rather than 189 to avoid any complications related to experience.

Please help me on this so that I can go a head with my EOI.

Thanks and regards,
Harish S


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## espresso (Nov 2, 2012)

1) If you are still with the same employer then you only need an *updated reference letter*, confirming that you've continued to work for them in the same role (with the same or only slightly advanced tasks/responsibilities) since January 2014. No ACS re-assessment is required in that case. 

2) You can claim for your *highest qualification* that has been assessed as equivalent to an Australian qualification, even if it is unrelated to your nominated occupation. So you can definitely claim points for your BSc. ACS deemed you skilled prior to your bachelor graduation due to your extensive work experience and vendor qualifications. As long as you only *claim points from the "deemed skilled" date* in the ACS letter onwards and have *proof of your salary* for these periods, you will be fine. 

3) No, if I were you I'd go for the 189 visa since it allows you to live anywhere in Australia.


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## harishsidhartha (Jan 2, 2014)

Dear Espresso,

Please go through the below given link posted by ann121 where her visa request got rejected after CO asked her to do a reassessment. After reassessment, her experience was reduced as her experience was counted only after her highest qualification. 

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/au...ats-living-australia/510961-189-rejected.html

Just want to be doubly sure before I go for my EOI. 

Please confirm..

Thanks and regards,
Harish S


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## espresso (Nov 2, 2012)

Hi Harish, 

the reason for _Ann121_'s rejection was that she claimed points for her entire work experience, based on an ACS result letter that did not include the "skilled after" clause. She applied after the ACS rules were changed, so the CO was correct to ask for a re-assessment according to the new rules. 

In your case, the assessor deducted 6 years (April 1998 till May 2004), applying the rule "ICT Diploma, not closely related to your nominated occupation". To quote from the ACS Summary of Criteria (second orange row), that indicates a deduction of: 



> 6 years relevant work experience *completed anytime in past work history*


Your work experience after April 2004 is "skilled". The bachelor degree was not necessary for a positive assessment (since you were already sufficiently skilled before you went back to uni) but you can claim points for it.


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## harishsidhartha (Jan 2, 2014)

Thank you Espresso....

So should I claim points for my Bachelors degree? Will the CO say that I cannot claim experience and education at the same time (3 years which I did my degree during my employment). 

Regards,
Harish S


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## espresso (Nov 2, 2012)

Sure, you can definitely claim points for your bachelor degree. It does not matter if it was a full-time or part-time program as long as ACS recognised it. Regarding work experience: If you worked 20+hrs/week during your studies, ACS (and DIBP) will consider it as "full-time" work experience.


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## patel_bapu (Jan 22, 2015)

espresso said:


> Sure, you can definitely claim points for your bachelor degree. It does not matter if it was a full-time or part-time program as long as ACS recognised it. Regarding work experience: If you worked 20+hrs/week during your studies, ACS (and DIBP) will consider it as "full-time" work experience.


I am also in networking field I have similar case like this I need little advice 

I had Cisco ccie vendor certificate and ccna , I started working when I failed in my college academics although I have completed but as I am working full time I am not able to complete course (full time)on time it took me 5 years to complete 3 year course , till I finished my bsc computer sci I had 3 years of exp right now its my 4 th year (3 year +1 year two different companies experience)how should I proceed now? Also one more thing the company I m working is small company i worked for 3 years I HV salary sleeps but not transactions in bank account as I am getting salary by cash , which documents I need to submit as part of verification process to prove my experience ? Thanks all for help


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## espresso (Nov 2, 2012)

Hi patel_bapu,

_Cisco Certified Internetworking Expert (CCIE)_ is deemed equivalent to an AQF diploma (see Summary of Criteria). If it is still valid, you'll 5-6 years of work experience to be deemed "skilled", depending on whether the CCIE is closely related to your nominated occupation or not. Since you mentioned that you only have a total of 4 years of work experience you'll need to work at least another year. 

The other option is bachelor degree + two years of experience post-graduation. In that case you'll need another year as well, since you only graduated a year ago. In cases like yours where you have multiple qualifications, the earliest date will be used from the various calculations (e.g. diploma + 5 OR BSc + 2) but I think in your case that amounts to the same thing...


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## patel_bapu (Jan 22, 2015)

espresso said:


> Hi patel_bapu,




Tanks a lot for your time and advice , 

i read in booklet but not able to understand now its making sense  
one more thing what if i have one more CCIE ? which is also related closely to my field of work (which i am currently Preparing) . how many years experience i need to show then .

Also if i am planning to go with Bsc + 2 year exp 
- do i need to show them earlier experience or not 
- do i need to clarify that i had ccie certifications at any point of time ? 
- what my understanding is show everything but don't demand points 
- how one extra ccie Certification(1+1) will going to graded 

thank you guys you are Best :juggle:


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## espresso (Nov 2, 2012)

Hi patel_bapu, 

you only receive education points for the highest qualification you have. Unfortunately, an extra CCIE certification won't help. 

However, due to the complexity of the assessment (ICT major/minor, closely related versus or not) it's usually best to send in all your qualifications plus work experience and let the assessor figure out the most advantageous way to calculate your points.


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## patel_bapu (Jan 22, 2015)

espresso said:


> Hi patel_bapu,
> 
> you only receive education points for the highest qualification you have. Unfortunately, an extra CCIE certification won't help.
> 
> However, due to the complexity of the assessment (ICT major/minor, closely related versus or not) it's usually best to send in all your qualifications plus work experience and let the assessor figure out the most advantageous way to calculate your points.



Thanks for tip Also can you tell me which documents they ask for work exp as I am following this forum since week people are saying they need to submit documents and some letter not any bank records in my case I am not getting salary directly in to bank


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## harishsidhartha (Jan 2, 2014)

espresso said:


> 1) If you are still with the same employer then you only need an *updated reference letter*, confirming that you've continued to work for them in the same role (with the same or only slightly advanced tasks/responsibilities) since January 2014. No ACS re-assessment is required in that case.
> 
> 2) You can claim for your *highest qualification* that has been assessed as equivalent to an Australian qualification, even if it is unrelated to your nominated occupation. So you can definitely claim points for your BSc. ACS deemed you skilled prior to your bachelor graduation due to your extensive work experience and vendor qualifications. As long as you only *claim points from the "deemed skilled" date* in the ACS letter onwards and have *proof of your salary* for these periods, you will be fine.
> 
> 3) No, if I were you I'd go for the 189 visa since it allows you to live anywhere in Australia.



Dear Expresso,

I got the invitation on Feb 13th for 189 and is about to apply for the Visa. Lot of people are saying that DIBP will consider only experience after my highest degree (In my case it is Bachelors degree taken in 2010). Please see another link which talks about similar issue. 

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/au...3-experience-counted-after-qualification.html

Can you please confirm whether I can go ahead with Visa application.

Thanks and regards,
Harish Sidhartha


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## sameer84in (May 31, 2015)

harishsidhartha said:


> Dear Expresso,
> 
> I got the invitation on Feb 13th for 189 and is about to apply for the Visa. Lot of people are saying that DIBP will consider only experience after my highest degree (In my case it is Bachelors degree taken in 2010). Please see another link which talks about similar issue.
> 
> ...


Hi Harish,

I am into similar situation as yours. Could you please tell me did you claim all your points or only after completion of Bachelors? Here is my details.


BE(IT) Full time 2002 to 2005
Started working as Software Engineer - Nov'2005
Masters in Information Management(Part time) from University of Mumbai - 2008 to 2011

ACS assessment done in April'15
Masters in Information Management completed in 2011 comparable to an AQF Master degree with a major in computing
B.E in IT comparable with AQF bachelor degree with a major in computing
Skilled date: Nov'2007 (Deducted 2 years of Exp)

Can claim points for my experience from Nov'2007? I am bit confused after reading few posts here. 
I have statutory declaration from my manager about full time experience, pay slips, tax returns etc.

Please help.


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## harishsidhartha (Jan 2, 2014)

sameer84in said:


> Hi Harish,
> 
> I am into similar situation as yours. Could you please tell me did you claim all your points or only after completion of Bachelors? Here is my details.
> 
> ...



Hi,

You can claim experience from the date ACS validated it (Nov 2007). DIBP will consider this even though it is before your Masters degree. I have claimed point for the experience before my Bachelors degree.

Regards,
Harish S


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## sameer84in (May 31, 2015)

harishsidhartha said:


> Hi,
> 
> You can claim experience from the date ACS validated it (Nov 2007). DIBP will consider this even though it is before your Masters degree. I have claimed point for the experience before my Bachelors degree.
> 
> ...


Thanks Harish. Did you get your visa? I see your last status is that you have paid second installment. Does that mean that case office is ok with everything you provided?
I would appreciate if you can clarify couple of more questions.

1. Which all documents have you submitted to show that you were working full time during your part time studies? While submitting EOI it doesn't have any option to say that whether studies were part time or full time. Moreover, my degree or transcripts doesn't mention that it was part time education. However, my statutory declaration does mention that I was full time employee.

2. How can we inform DIBP that my first two years of experience is not relevant? As I need to claim points only from 2007, how do I records this in system while submitting EOI?

3. I am also claiming partner's qualification points. Do I need to submit all her salary slips or tax receipts? 

Any other important thing which you experienced and want to share here?

Thanks.


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## harishsidhartha (Jan 2, 2014)

sameer84in said:


> Thanks Harish. Did you get your visa? I see your last status is that you have paid second installment. Does that mean that case office is ok with everything you provided?
> I would appreciate if you can clarify couple of more questions.
> 
> 1. Which all documents have you submitted to show that you were working full time during your part time studies? While submitting EOI it doesn't have any option to say that whether studies were part time or full time. Moreover, my degree or transcripts doesn't mention that it was part time education. However, my statutory declaration does mention that I was full time employee.
> ...



1. I submitted all relevant documents such as experience certificate, resignation letter, pay slips, appreciation letters, bank statement etc. 

2. While submitting EOI, you will be asked whether this employment is relevant to your occupation code.. Just select NO for any employment which is not validated by ACS. In-case there is an overlapping period, then you need to split your experience. 

3. I really don't know about this. I think you just need to get the ACS assessment done for her education. 

Regards,
Harish S


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## sameer84in (May 31, 2015)

harishsidhartha said:


> 1. I submitted all relevant documents such as experience certificate, resignation letter, pay slips, appreciation letters, bank statement etc.
> 
> 2. While submitting EOI, you will be asked whether this employment is relevant to your occupation code.. Just select NO for any employment which is not validated by ACS. In-case there is an overlapping period, then you need to split your experience.
> 
> ...


Thanks Harish. Sorry forgot to mention that I have done ACS assessment for my wife and it is positive. She has also scored at least 6 in each section of IELTS.

Re salary slips and Form16, how many salary slips have you submitted? Also I do not have salary slips of my previous company, however, I have experience certificate and stat declaration. Would it be enough to prove my experience?


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## Jeeten#80 (Mar 26, 2015)

People were able to get GRANT without being asked for Salary Slip/Form 16.


Also FEW people submitted 1 Payslip per Quarter AND few submitted 2 payslips per year JAN and DEC for their employments.


So IF your documents are genuine THEN there wouldn't be any issues. 






sameer84in said:


> Thanks Harish. Sorry forgot to mention that I have done ACS assessment for my wife and it is positive. She has also scored at least 6 in each section of IELTS.
> 
> Re salary slips and Form16, how many salary slips have you submitted? Also I do not have salary slips of my previous company, however, I have experience certificate and stat declaration. Would it be enough to prove my experience?


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## sameer84in (May 31, 2015)

Jeeten#80 said:


> People were able to get GRANT without being asked for Salary Slip/Form 16.
> 
> 
> Also FEW people submitted 1 Payslip per Quarter AND few submitted 2 payslips per year JAN and DEC for their employments.
> ...


Congrats Harish for the grant lane:

Thanks Jiten.

I am submitting EOI and I have one more question if you can help. Here is my case.

I have done my Masters in Information Management which is recognized by ACS
as AQF Master Degree with a major in computing.

Which option should I choose while submitting education history?
Master Degree (Others) or Masters Degree in Science, Business or Technology?

I have done Bachelor of Engineering in Information Technology which is assessed by ACS as comparable to an AQF Bachelor Degree with a major in computing.

Again which option should I choose while submitting education history?
Bachelor Degree (Others) or Bachelor Degree in Science, Business or Technology

I have done Diploma in Computer Technology but I have not assessed it from ACS as it doesn't make any difference to my score.

Should I include this as well? If yes, which option should be selected from the drop down? Other - Non AQF accreditation? 

Please note that choosing either of the option above is not making any difference to my points which is 75 at the moment. It is just that I want to choose the right option.

Would appreciate your quick help.


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## Jeeten#80 (Mar 26, 2015)

*...IMO...*


Masters Degree in Science, Business or Technology

Bachelor Degree in Science, Business or Technology

Other - Non AQF accreditation


IF you are claiming work experience points THEN ensure that you aren't over claiming points.

REFER to my following post to understand HOW TO update your EOI as per ACS letter to *AVOID Over-claiming points AND DIRECT VISA REFUSAL and NO REFUND*.


*EOI Update to Avoid Over-claiming of Points*







sameer84in said:


> Congrats Harish for the grant lane:
> 
> Thanks Jiten.
> 
> ...


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## sameer84in (May 31, 2015)

Jeeten#80 said:


> *...IMO...*
> 
> 
> Masters Degree in Science, Business or Technology
> ...


Thakns Jeetendra.

Thanks for the link. It is very helpful. You guys are awesome. 
I have gone through the link before and have updated my EOI based on the ACS result. I am getting points what I have calculated manually so should not be a problem.

However I would appreciate if you can comment on the manual point calculation. Let me know if I am incorrect at any point. Better to be safe than sorry  

1. ACS: 
Positive outcome for Master completed in 2011(part time from 2008 to 2011) and Bachelor degree completed in 2005. Skilled experience considered after Nov'2007 (ACS deducted 2 years)
Points: 
15 points (for master degree)

2. Experience:
Nov'2005 to Nov'2007 - Not relevant as per ACS so cannot claim point.
Dec'2007 to Oct'2013 - Overseas experience
Oct'2013 to till date - Australian experience 
Points: 
10 points for overseas experience (at least 5 years outside Australia)
5 points for Australian experience (at least 1 year in Australia)

Total so far = 30

3. Partner's points: 
Successful ACS assessment in the same SOL and IELTS completed with 6 and above in all the section.
Points: 5 points

Total so far = 35

4. English ability:
Successful PTE with 65 and above
Points: 10

Total points so far = 45

5. Age:
31 years old
Points: 30

Total points = 75


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## Jeeten#80 (Mar 26, 2015)

You have calculated your points correctly.






sameer84in said:


> Thakns Jeetendra.
> 
> Thanks for the link. It is very helpful. You guys are awesome.
> I have gone through the link before and have updated my EOI based on the ACS result. I am getting points what I have calculated manually so should not be a problem.
> ...


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## sameer84in (May 31, 2015)

Jeeten#80 said:


> You have calculated your points correctly.


Thanks Jeetendra for the confirmation. Feeling bit confident of filling EOI.

Anyways since I am planning to file EOI in 189 it would not make much difference if I file it now or in first week of July as all the invitation for Software Engineer in 189 is closed for the current financial year.


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## Jeeten#80 (Mar 26, 2015)

In your case IT won't make any difference as you have 75 points *AND *would be invited in the very first Invitation round of July (PROVIDED no IMMI rule / process changes).


BUT EOI submission date matters for people who have less points.



> *Invitation process and cut offs*
> 
> The highest ranked clients by points score are invited to apply for the relevant visa. For clients who have equal points scores, the time at which they reached their points score for that subclass (referred to as the visa date of effect) determines their order of invitation. Expressions of Interest with earlier dates of effect are invited before later dates.






sameer84in said:


> Thanks Jeetendra for the confirmation. Feeling bit confident of filling EOI.
> 
> Anyways since I am planning to file EOI in 189 it would not make much difference if I file it now or in first week of July as all the invitation for Software Engineer in 189 is closed for the current financial year.


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## sameer84in (May 31, 2015)

Jeeten#80 said:


> In your case IT won't make any difference as you have 75 points *AND *would be invited in the very first Invitation round of July (PROVIDED no IMMI rule / process changes).
> 
> 
> BUT EOI submission date matters for people who have less points.


Thanks Jeetendra.


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