# NIE Number should I really get one?



## paul44 (May 19, 2009)

I live in Benalmadena between January and the end of June but I always ensure i don't overstay the 182 days rule for tax purposes.
I don't own i have a short term let 6 months and don't need an NIE for that but I normally do around 175 days each year

my question is even though i only spend just shy of 6 months here am I considered a resident and should I get an NIE?

I do not want to have any dealings with the tax system in Spain but if I get the NIE will I have to do any reporting??? 

my normal home is the Irish Republic

Thanks


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

paul44 said:


> I live in Benalmadena between January and the end of June but I always ensure i don't overstay the 182 days rule for tax purposes.
> I don't own i have a short term let 6 months and don't need an NIE for that but I normally do around 175 days each year
> 
> my question is even though i only spend just shy of 6 months here am I considered a resident and should I get an NIE?
> ...


Officially you are considered resident after 90 days whether you give your details in or not. However, what the real ramifications are in your case I'm not sure...


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

Bumping this so that there are more replies


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

If you are here, or plan to be here, 90 consecutive days or more, you are required by the Spanish government to register as resident & a NIE will be issued then.

It has nothing to do with tax residency.


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## Blanco53 (Mar 6, 2017)

A couple of observations.

As others have already commented that all EU citizens planning to reside in Spain for more than 3 months should register in person at the Oficina de Extranjeros in their province of residence or at designated Police stations. You will be issued a credit card size Residence Certificate stating your name, address, nationality, NIE number.

If you drive a car, you then have 2 years to exchange your UK License to the Spanish version.

Things are more than likely to change in March 2019, and I would suggest that it is in your own 
interests to make sure your paperwork is in order.


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Blanco53 said:


> If you drive a car, you then have 2 years to exchange your UK License to the Spanish version.


Can I just point out that this is not completely true.

"*Unless *you have a licence with no expiry date or if the date is more than 15 years in the future there is *no requirement* to exchange your licence."

You can confirm this on any of the official sites like DGT.es or N332.es


However, I would strongly recommend that everyone does exchange their licence as there are no downsides to doing it and it can remove potential unpleasantness when stopped by one of the many uninformed or misinformed Guardia.


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

snikpoh said:


> Can I just point out that this is not completely true.
> 
> "Unless you have a licence with no expiry date or if the date is more than 15 years in the future there is no requirement to exchange your licence."
> 
> ...


Agreed BUT it was made clear to us when we registered three years ago we HAD to change to a Spanish license within two years This was reinforced when we went two years later..... the DGT.es in our regional office told us exactly the same. It's a prime example of what the law says but the autonomous regions/ towns/ villages actually enforce


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> Agreed BUT it was made clear to us when we registered three years ago we HAD to change to a Spanish license within two years This was reinforced when we went two years later..... the DGT.es in our regional office told us exactly the same. It's a prime example of what the law says but the autonomous regions/ towns/ villages actually enforce


It depends on the codes on your licence though, & the expiry dates for those codes.

I was shown two licences last week - students of mine wanting to know if they had to 'change' them.

One had over a 15 year expiry on some of the codes (up to 2045 iirc), & therefore needed to be renewed immediately under Spanish rules. The other had much shorter expiry dates. That licence doesn't need renewing until it reaches the expiry dates in a couple of years.

I confirmed with a gestor friend who deals with driving licences every day.


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

snikpoh said:


> "Unless you have a licence with no expiry date or if the date is more than 15 years in the future there is no requirement to exchange your licence."





xabiachica said:


> I was shown two licences last week - students of mine wanting to know if they had to 'change' them.
> 
> One had over a 15 year expiry on some of the codes (up to 2045 iirc), & therefore needed to be renewed immediately under Spanish rules. The other had much shorter expiry dates. That licence doesn't need renewing until it reaches the expiry dates in a couple of years.


As far as I understand you have said the opposite.
Which one is true, please?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> As far as I understand you have said the opposite.
> Which one is true, please?


me  



> 1. *¿Quiénes deben renovar su permiso de conducción?*
> a) Los titulares de los permisos de conducción comunitarios que hayan caducado o próximos a caducar.
> b) *Los titulares de los permisos de conducción comunitarios indefinidos o con un plazo de vigencia superior a 15 años para permisos del Grupo 1* ( AM,A1,A2, A, B y BE) o un plazo superior a 5 años parapermisos del Grupo 2 (BTP,C1, C1E,C, CE,D1,D1E,D,DE), siempre y cuando, tengan la residencia legal en España transcurridos dos años desdeel 19 de enero de 2013, fecha de entrada en vigor de la Directiva 2006/126/CE.


https://sede.dgt.gob.es/es/tramites-y-multas/permiso-de-conduccion/Renovacion-de-permisos-de-conduccion-comunitarios/


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## Megsmum (Sep 9, 2012)

I do think, regardeless of the different opinions and interpretations of various regions. To exchange a license is very straightforward and if living here why not?


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Megsmum said:


> I do think, regardeless of the different opinions and interpretations of various regions. To exchange a license is very straightforward and if living here why not?


I agree  It is, or should be, straightforward.

And not even expensive!

However there shouldn't be any regional 'interpretation' - at least not by tráfico. Police don't always get it right though, as we know.

tbh how can they possibly be expected to know every driving licence from every country!


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## Blanco53 (Mar 6, 2017)

Ignore all the "well meaning advice", and ACT NOW.

If you live in Spain and have residencia exchange your UK Driving License NOW. 

Firstly, it will make any conversations with the police / guardia rather more comfortable should you be stopped.
Secondly, exchanging your driving license now is a relatively painless process and is very easy. Leave it until after March 2019, and the process may become rather more difficult. If no reciprocal agreement is in place, we could end up like some US expats who, depending upon the State that issued their license, are forced to take a new driving test (including a written theory test in Spanish).

The solution.....DO IT NOW!!!


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## Pesky Wesky (May 10, 2009)

paul44 said:


> I live in Benalmadena between January and the end of June but I always ensure i don't overstay the 182 days rule for tax purposes.
> I don't own i have a short term let 6 months and don't need an NIE for that but I normally do around 175 days each year
> 
> my question is even though i only spend just shy of 6 months here am I considered a resident and should I get an NIE?
> ...


Just thought it might be an idea to go back to the original request which has got nothing to do with driving licences.
This is some info about residency and NIE which can be found here
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/residency-requirements-in-spain


> From 28 March 2007, Royal Decree 240/07 requires that all EU citizens planning to reside in Spain for more than 3 months should register in person at the Oficina de Extranjeros in their province of residence or at designated Police stations. You will be issued a credit card size Residence Certificate stating your name, address, nationality, NIE number (Número de Identificación Extranjero) and date of registration. After five years residence registration you are entitled to apply for a certificate of permanent residence in Spain.


A lot of people who are in Spain for more than 90 days, but less than 180 don't register and which is llegal, but on the other hand ...
More info about lots of thing about living in Spain can be found here
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/living-in-spain


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Blanco53 said:


> Ignore all the "well meaning advice", and ACT NOW.
> 
> If you live in Spain and have residencia exchange your UK Driving License NOW.
> 
> ...


That's a whole other matter though - & yes I'd agree that even if your licence doesn't _have to _ be changed yet, if you intend to stay in Spain it would be better to do so before the B thing .......


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## snikpoh (Nov 19, 2007)

Pesky Wesky said:


> As far as I understand you have said the opposite.
> Which one is true, please?


Please read mine again, they are NOT contradictory - perhaps mine could have been worded better.




xabiachica said:


> me
> 
> 
> https://sede.dgt.gob.es/es/tramites-y-multas/permiso-de-conduccion/Renovacion-de-permisos-de-conduccion-comunitarios/


Actually, we are both correct - read mine again.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

Pesky Wesky said:


> Just thought it might be an idea to go back to the original request which has got nothing to do with driving licences.
> This is some info about residency and NIE which can be found here
> https://www.gov.uk/guidance/residency-requirements-in-spain
> 
> ...


The 90 day rule/guideline is the same across the EU. Some countries are stricter than others at enforcing it.

I wonder what people do in other countries like France & Italy?

In theory you should register & then 'unregister' (is that a word  ) if you come & go a lot.


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## 95995 (May 16, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> The 90 day rule/guideline is the same across the EU. Some countries are stricter than others at enforcing it.
> 
> I wonder what people do in other countries like France & Italy?
> 
> In theory you should register & then 'unregister' (is that a word  ) if you come & go a lot.


I live in France. The only registration here would be for a Carte de Sejour, however it's not actually essential to do so (indeed some Prefectures are reluctant to issue one). I doubt that EU citizens spending less than 6 months per year here would request a CDS. Of course, it is possible that British citizens post Brexit will need a visa, most likely if they intend to stay more than 90 days (I can't see why the UK would not immediately enter into the 90 day stay regime with the various EU member states - after all, they have done so with other countries) whenever real Brexit actually takes place. I suspect Spain is a little unusual in its requirements.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

EverHopeful said:


> I live in France. The only registration here would be for a Carte de Sejour, however it's not actually essential to do so (indeed some Prefectures are reluctant to issue one). I doubt that EU citizens spending less than 6 months per year here would request a CDS. Of course, it is possible that British citizens post Brexit will need a visa, most likely if they intend to stay more than 90 days (I can't see why the UK would not immediately enter into the 90 day stay regime with the various EU member states - after all, they have done so with other countries) whenever real Brexit actually takes place. I suspect Spain is a little unusual in its requirements.


In reality, although it's a requirement, it isn't really enforced. 

If you're here 100 days & don't register, then nothing will happen unless you come to the attention of the authorities for some reason.

There are people who have been here for years without registering. 

However - if at any point you need to prove your residency, the only officially accepted proof is the resident registration cert / card. So for anyone intending to stay, it's actually in their interests to register.


I do know people who have had a knock on the door from the police who have perhaps been registered on the padrón (local authority census) but not registered as resident - or vice versa - & they have been given 2 weeks to get their paperwork in order. Quite what would have happened if they hadn't done so I don't know. British people btw - but long before the referendum, before anyone gets any ideas that it was in some way connected to that. 

There is the added 'complication' now that in many areas the 'new' rule is adhered to & EU citizens must have the resident registration cert before being able to register on the padrón. It's been the rule for a couple of years now.

Without being on the padrón you can't get your children into school, nor register for healthcare, for example. So things are tightening up a bit.


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## 95995 (May 16, 2010)

xabiachica said:


> In reality, although it's a requirement, it isn't really enforced.
> 
> If you're here 100 days & don't register, then nothing will happen unless you come to the attention of the authorities for some reason.
> 
> ...


Many Brits in France are now trying to get their carte de sejour - but that is for actual *residents*, anyway. I think they are going to be in for a long wait, though, because I heard on the radio this morning that, instead of a few days, it's now taking several months for French people to get/renew a passport and I had already heard of people having to wait for months just to get an appointment to submit their application for a CDS. But France actually uses other documentation as standard proof of residence. I suspect, though, that Brits living under the radar here would run into difficulties if they haven't been declaring taxes.

It seems to me that things are already comparatively very tight in Spain - but I suspect that's may be for historical reasons and that date back to prior to Spain joining the EU.

Oh, and at law France cannot deny children the right to attend school - we have human rights embedded in the Constitution, but also the EU (including Spain) has signed up to the right of the child, so I don't think that Spain can refuse to educate children either, even if it might try to do so.


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## xabiaxica (Jun 23, 2009)

EverHopeful said:


> Many Brits in France are now trying to get their carte de sejour - but that is for actual *residents*, anyway. I think they are going to be in for a long wait, though, because I heard on the radio this morning that, instead of a few days, it's now taking several months for French people to get/renew a passport and I had already heard of people having to wait for months just to get an appointment to submit their application for a CDS. But France actually uses other documentation as standard proof of residence. I suspect, though, that Brits living under the radar here would run into difficulties if they haven't been declaring taxes.
> 
> It seems to me that things are already comparatively very tight in Spain - but I suspect that's may be for historical reasons and that date back to prior to Spain joining the EU.
> 
> Oh, and at law France cannot deny children the right to attend school - we have human rights embedded in the Constitution, but also the EU (including Spain) has signed up to the right of the child, so I don't think that Spain can refuse to educate children either, even if it might try to do so.


It's the same in Spain regarding school.......but you need the padrón to prove your address.......


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