# Mail Order from China?



## bom dia lisbon (Aug 8, 2013)

Has anyone ordered online from China, for example ebay, miniinthebox, alibaba, etc? I'm wondering if there are any problems with import taxes and/or delivery times when shipping to Portugal (small consumer merchandise). Thanks


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## kent peterson (May 28, 2013)

No I have not imported anything from China...but I just got nailed 50per cent on something (vitamins) I had ordered from America. Totally outrageous!! In France and Spain Ihad never had this issue and received my vitamins always in a timely manner. I imagine the same thing will happen if you order from China.


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

For those that think that Portugal is unique in charging for imports from outside of the UK then take a look at what the process is for those in the UK...
https://www.gov.uk/starting-to-import/importing-from-noneu-countries

Any personal purchases with a value of greater than £15, this includes the item and the carriage costs, will incur some form of charge. See the following link...
https://www.gov.uk/goods-sent-from-abroad/tax-and-duty

Stop trying to make Portugal sound more bureaucratic than it actually is, other places within the EU can be similar! 

Things in the UK have seemed to have become stricter in the last few years since the global recession took place, I guess Governments are trying to get as much revenue as possible and are 'tightening their belts'.


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## bom dia lisbon (Aug 8, 2013)

Vitamins are one of the few things that I load up on when I visit the US, or have my visitors bring them. I've ordered other types of nutritional supplements from the UK with extra fast shipping and no extra charges.

Still would like to hear of experiences in ordering from miniinthebox, alibaba express, etc...


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## oronero (Aug 24, 2012)

bom dia lisbon said:


> Vitamins are one of the few things that I load up on when I visit the US, or have my visitors bring them. * I've ordered other types of nutritional supplements from the UK with extra fast shipping and no extra charges.*
> 
> Still would like to hear of experiences in ordering from miniinthebox, alibaba express, etc...


I would expect that there are no additional import fees when buying from the UK as it is currently a Member State of the EU. All purchases from outside of the EU are subject to import charges and taxation when they arrive within the EU. 

So purchasing from 'Alibaba Express' will incur charges if the goods originate from outside the EU, I believe that many of the advertisers on 'Alibaba' are from Asia which is outside of the EU.


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## JohnBoy (Oct 25, 2009)

I've ordered batteries from Banggood in Hong Kong and the small package arrived promptly and without any charges.

At the same time a friend ordered a remote controlled toy from the same company and it was held in customs in Lisbon for close on three months. He was also charged over 33% in various duties. They charged duty on the value of the goods, the packaging and the carriage charge. That was totalled up and the whole lot subjected to IVA at 23%. Banggood probably thought they were helping out by seriously under declaring the value of the item, but customs would not release the package until they had sight of the original invoice.

Hope that helps.


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## bom dia lisbon (Aug 8, 2013)

Thanks JohnBoy, I may just take my chances that I'll have your luck and not that of your friend!


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## Mattskii (Oct 28, 2009)

I got stung with massive charges including VAT bringing stuff in from Australia. Had to drive to Lisbon to collect and pay. Warning: The address on the letter they send you is not the address you have to go to. I get there and was redirected to a post office in Lisbon, which was a pain. What with petrol and tolls to get there, it ended up a very expensive purchase. Totally not worth while at all. 

PS - Alibaba - isn't that the place the sells ****loads of counterfeit items and fakes? I seem to remember them flooding the market with counterfeit 1 ounce silver coins recently? Fake Chinese panda coins are causing a lot of anger and problems amongst collectors. I wouldn't give them my money. Crooks, the lot of them!


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## Tryon (Jul 17, 2015)

*Alibaba*

Like Bom dia Lisbon I'd also like informed comment about, in my case, satisfied users of Alibaba. Questions ... questions ! 

Import taxes into the EU cannot be avoided but - as with Golden Visas - are some EU countries import taxes, depending on the item, cheaper than Portugal's ? And/Or does Madeira still have a Free Trade Zone ? Or could a Chinese importer already operating in Portugal help out by bundling your delivery into his container? Is there an import / export website that we can go to to check these things ?

Alibaba has got a US stock market listing and is already bigger than Amazon and ebay so it must mostly deliver what the customer wants - not just fake panda coins. 

A glance at its website shows 4 categories of re-assurance - two involving 3rd party verifiers. So you can filter out the more risky, untried suppliers.


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## Mattskii (Oct 28, 2009)

Tryon said:


> Like Bom dia Lisbon I'd also like informed comment about, in my case, satisfied users of Alibaba. Questions ... questions !
> 
> Import taxes into the EU cannot be avoided but - as with Golden Visas - are some EU countries import taxes, depending on the item, cheaper than Portugal's ? And/Or does Madeira still have a Free Trade Zone ? Or could a Chinese importer already operating in Portugal help out by bundling your delivery into his container? Is there an import / export website that we can go to to check these things ?
> 
> ...


The problem with supporting a company like this is that a massive amount, not just Pandas, but a massive amount of fake silver products, amongst other fake and counterfeit product, is shipped to the west from this single source. And there are many other like it.

Personally, I find it unethical to support this, just to save a few Euros which most of us on here can afford to spend, in order not to support these business practices. 

If you do want to purchase a few hundred 'replica' €2 coins though, they are available there at about 40c US each. Along with fake Silver Eagles, fake Pandas, fake Australian Kookaburras, fake gold coins,fake everything. In fact you would be lucky find something there that isn't a fake.

But even if you did, and even if it was a bargain, are you really happy to give you money to a company like that? :confused2:


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## Tryon (Jul 17, 2015)

*Alibaba*

Alibaba sell many thousands of products to the west ... hundreds of billions worth. Much successful trade originating from Alibaba. 

But struggling to get my head round your problem.  Surely no one in their right mind would be buying precious metal / coins direct from the seller over the internet? Without an intermediary at the source verifying that the item is genuine? 

How / Where do you normally buy from ? From a coin dealer with a reputation to protect?


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## Mattskii (Oct 28, 2009)

Tryon said:


> Alibaba sell many thousands of products to the west ... hundreds of billions worth. Much successful trade originating from Alibaba.
> 
> But struggling to get my head round your problem.  Surely no one in their right mind would be buying precious metal / coins direct from the seller over the internet? Without an intermediary at the source verifying that the item is genuine?
> 
> How / Where do you normally buy from ? From a coin dealer with a reputation to protect?


The best practice is to buy direct from the producer - IE the mint. Failing that buy from a dealer.

The only people who buy from Alibaba are crooks who want to introduce those fakes into the system for profit. Everyone else knows to avoid Alibaba. No body gets ripped off buying from them thinking they are buying real silver at that price - it is the supplier of choice for your internet scamers. 

Most collectors purchase from dealers, or from other collectors via online forums. Some will use trusted sources on eBay.

The problem here is that those making their first steps into collecting very often get ripped off with fakes. And sometimes, no matter how much effort you put into making sure your source is reputable, these fakes can still find their way in to the chain. I myself have 2 fake coins and a fake 1 ounce Sunshine Mint silver bar. Not only do these fakes find their way to those newbies, and also the one off purchasers - which make up a huge percentage of sales, but they also reduce confidence in the second hand market. Trying to sell coins other than to a dealer (Who will never give you their true value) is becoming harder all the time. I don't know a single collector (And I know rather a lot as I was a moderator on the UKs largest silver collectors forum for a while) who has not been affected by fake coins at some point. 

And then there is Joe Public. Want to buy a nice silver coin whist prices are low, as a gift, or for someone's 20th anniversary. You have a high chance that eBay will provide a fake. And not being an expert, you'd never know you have been ripped off, or that you are giving a fake as a gift!

And it isn't just coins. It is pretty much anything else of value which is copyable. 

I would go as far as to say that Alibaba is the internets biggest source of fake goods entering the West. 

Regardless of any other product sold, or how much business they do, I would never support them.


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## beatle nut (Aug 20, 2015)

*Chinese merchandise aint so bad.*

To date I have purhased loads of Chinese manufactured stuff via eBay.co.uk etc & for the price I can not complain. I am not interested in the politics of the deal, I just shop & do the best deal I can & to date ALL has gone well. Stuff ocasionaly gets held up in Customs, I write them a curtious eMail pleading for relearse ASAP & SOON ENOUGH a request for Invoice arrives, I SCAN & Email it to the address below whom I keep on file & bingo! the merchandise arrives & I pay the delivery person.
I want my merchandise & figure what will get it to ASAP from Customs & as you well know, they are a power unto themselves, so it pays to be very humble, curtious & respectfull, above all be cool because the aim is to get the merchandise, nothing else.

hope this gets you by, I had posted up an eMail address of the Customs, but had to remove it because I am a new memeber & am not permited till I 5 OR greater post count. Any who need this eMail address, you can eMail me.


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## advolex (Mar 8, 2015)

*What is "Alibaba"?*



Mattskii said:


> The only people who buy from Alibaba are crooks who want to introduce those fakes into the system for profit. Everyone else knows to avoid Alibaba. No body gets ripped off buying from them thinking they are buying real silver at that price - it is the supplier of choice for your internet scamers.
> 
> And it isn't just coins. It is pretty much anything else of value which is copyable.
> 
> ...


It's not that I'm allergic to generalisations. No, I mostly find them entertaining. And I've also heard that quite a few computer industry lay-offs repeat that "the chinese" are to blame. But what I really would enjoy reading here is something new, about the same that the Original Poster was hoping for, namely personal experiences from someone who has traded with the far east market places like "Ali Baba". Maybe with a little less rhetoric. If that's not too much to ask.

I certainly don't seek to defend "Alibaba". He who knows should speak. Freely. I would. And maybe there are other market places someone might recommend, chinese or not?


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## grandwazoo (Apr 12, 2011)

I've bought from China, both via eBay and aliexpress. Small items - pens, small electric components etc. - I've never had a problem with, but the one fairly expensive item (around 80 euro) was intercepted by customs and I had to pay an extra 40 at the post office to get it released. My experience in the UK, buying from China & the USA, has been much the same.


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## advolex (Mar 8, 2015)

*What is "Alibaba"?*



grandwazoo said:


> I've bought from China, both via eBay and aliexpress. Small items - pens, small electric components etc. - I've never had a problem with, but the one fairly expensive item (around 80 euro) was intercepted by customs and I had to pay an extra 40 at the post office to get it released. My experience in the UK, buying from China & the USA, has been much the same.


Thank you! I will now order an electronic item -a scanner - from aliexpress.com for $ 135 and would probably have to pay some $ 70 on top of that for customs. That's good to know, when you're used to inner market shopping. I hope the moral issue someone raised here is only related to silver coins, which I won't buy in a near future anyway.


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## grandwazoo (Apr 12, 2011)

Personally I've never had any real problem with the goods supplied. One item - a power supply for a computer - arrived with a part damaged, possibly in transit. I contacted the supplier, they offered to pay half the cost of sending it back (around $3.50 each) and posted a replacement as soon as I emailed them a scan of the post office receipt. This was better than I expected to be honest.


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## Strontium (Sep 16, 2015)

We get loads of stuff from China but they tend to be electronic components so are, almost, standard and we rarely have any issues. I'd not bother buying bigger stuff because then I like to see the item before paying.


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