# Moving to Mexico (finally)



## roadapple (Mar 31, 2014)

My wife (a Mexican national) and I have finally decided to move from Tampa, FL to Mexico. We've got family all over, and of course, all of their cities are "the best" places to live.
Merida, Campeche, Villahermosa, Cancun, Mexico City, Cuernavaca, Cardenas, Playa del Carmen were on our first list of "towns" to move to.

We've repeatedly visited Mexico and checked out all the towns listed above, spending days in each one. We had lots of guidance from family on security concerns, etc.

Our final choices are Cuernavaca or Playa del Carmen (Villahermosa a distant 3rd), radically different culturally and weather wise. Cuernavaca being very good weather year round basically with Playa del Carmen being hot, humid, tropical climate year round, and hot there is HOT. I just got back from Yucatan / Quintana Roo a couple of weeks ago. Daily temps of 100+ is not unusual with 80% or more humidity.

Questions: In Cuernavaca, is there a viable America expat community? 

Is the security situation better than it was a few years ago?

As I'm a musician (now retiring) I still want to play some in Mexico. Might there be any venues or events in Cuernavaca that might use American rock/blues played by mix of Mexicans / Americans? In Playa del Carmen I played with people a month ago, and there are opportunities to play, club, concerts, performing arts, etc.

I see online some housing in Cuernavaca that is unbelievably inexpensive, huge houses, palatial gardens, etc... Very cheap... Ex narco houses maybe? We're visiting again in September and spending a week there looking for a house. If you know a good realtor or someone selling a home, please let us know.

Thanks in advance,

S & T


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

There is a Yahoo Group (Cuernads) you might want to check out. There is a church (St Michael's) which has a small attached library. There are some very nice people there who might help you get acclimated. 

Cuernavaca has several different climates and many different neighborhoods. The Southern side of town (Temixco) can get HOT. The Northern side of town (Del Bosque) can get COLD. There are parts of town which can be scary and extremely congested (Civac). There is a region of town called Vista Hermosa which is very large/convenient/centrally located. Housing there might be some of the most expensive and traffic on weekends can be ridiculous. 

I highly recommend renting your first year, find a realtor you can trust (look for a large franchised outfit) and look at a lot of houses. Some places are the most tranquil places on earth during daylight hours but 'come alive' at night. You need to be careful of that.

For crime - there is an online newspaper (elsoldecuernavaca). You should check out their Police page.


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## chicois8 (Aug 8, 2009)

Don't you think there is a reason to find large beautiful housing in a city having a climate described as "eternal spring" at an unbelievably inexpensive price? Take the above posters last sentance advice.......


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

I am curious why would anyone move to Villahermosa, unless it was for family reason r a jobs? The place is not hermosa, the traffic is awful. the weather is awful. The best part is that it has an airport that is small and so it is easy to get out of there. Cardenas is worst and both places have high corruption.


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## roadapple (Mar 31, 2014)

Cardenas is the pits. Villahermosa is a little better. The weather sucks, but we have lots of family there, and in Quintana Roo, Yucatan, Tabasco, Mexico City, etc..


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

I totally agree Cardenas is the pits and as it is a smaller town the justice system is really crooked..
Actually most of Tabasco is the pits.. I think it is one of my least favorite state in Mexico. I like Campeche and Yucatan but do not care for the climate and hate living with A/C so those are out for me.. The Peninsula is pretty safe compare to some other states so that is a plus for the Yucatan..

I have lots of relatives in Marseilles in France and that does not mean I would live there.. actually it pretty much insure I would nt live there´despite the nice climate and the cheaper housing....


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## roadapple (Mar 31, 2014)

Ah but I like my family... We're pretty much leaning towards Cuernavaca... If not Playa del Carmen. Don't mind A/C, don't mind heat and humidity if there are other benefits to go along with it.


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## travelingrae (Dec 9, 2016)

citlali;12615522Marseilles in France and that does not mean I would live there.. actually it pretty much insure I would nt live there´despite the nice climate and the cheaper housing....[/QUOTE said:


> Are you saying Marseilles has cheaper housing than where you live in Mexico?!


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

No I am saying that just because you have family in a city that does not make that city a pleasant place to live in.. Marseilles has a nice climate cheap housing and is plenty dangerous not unlike some cities in Mexico...Marseilles has some places that are very cheap in comparaison to the rest of the big cities on the coast.. I have not bothered comparing the prices with Mexico because I have zero interest to move there.. 
That is what came to my mind talking about Vilahermosa and Cardenas..


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## travelingrae (Dec 9, 2016)

citlali said:


> No I am saying


Ah, okay, you're comparing to the rest of France. I feel exactly the same way about Quebec, where my family is.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

Off topic : if I (we) were to live in France we would first consider Clermont-Ferrand.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

off topic.. sorry give me Marseille any day.. ha ha at least you are on the Mediterranean and have a nice climate!


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

roadapple said:


> Ah but I like my family... We're pretty much leaning towards Cuernavaca... If not Playa del Carmen. Don't mind A/C, don't mind heat and humidity if there are other benefits to go along with it.


Of all the places you mentioned, Cuernavaca is the one I would most consider. It is reasonably attractive and the weather is temperate. In my opinion it is more famous a destination than it deserves to be and it's weather is overrated in the sense that there are a number of other locations with comparable weather that are much more appealing. Every time I go to Cuernavaca I think, "well, this place is not bad", but it doesn't grab me like so many other places in Mexico. It's basically the non-beach weekend getaway locale for Mexico City's middle and upper classes.

I like beach communities just fine to visit, but not to live full-time. I totally understand the family thing and if that is the principal driving force, you could make a great life in any of the places you mentioned, no matter what. It's all in the attitude you have going in!


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

I would go for Cuernavaca over a beach community. There is something that really bothers me about the beach communities in QR.
Friends of ours let us have their condo in Akumal for a month : it is a very nice apartment right on the beach.. What I realized is that many of the condos are rented out or used for parties..we kept getting new people who came to party, it was not a real community just a revolving door for drunk Americans and noisy Mexican families.. I hated every minute of it and it made me realize that may people do not live at the beach they go there to have fun and that was way too much fun for me..Also I did not care for the contrast between the village inland where workers and service people live and the condos where the well off people lived or rented.. Again to me it did not feel like a community I wanted to be part of.

I would pick Cuernavaca or a small town around there in a minute over Playa del Carmen.. or anywhere in Tabasco.


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

roadapple said:


> My wife (a Mexican national) and I have finally decided to move from Tampa, FL to Mexico. We've got family all over, and of course, all of their cities are "the best" places to live.
> Merida, Campeche, Villahermosa, Cancun, Mexico City, Cuernavaca, Cardenas, Playa del Carmen were on our first list of "towns" to move to.
> 
> We've repeatedly visited Mexico and checked out all the towns listed above, spending days in each one. We had lots of guidance from family on security concerns, etc.
> ...


Our home is in Tepoztlán, about 20 Minutes from Cuernavaca. It's a _Pueblo Mágico_, with lots of weekend tourists from CDMX. There are many venues with live music, and I've seen ads for at least one Tepoz-based blues band made up of both expats and Mexicans (Steve Brandick y Los Carnivoros). 

I'm still only occasionally in Tepoz (still working in Toronto). Because my husband is Mexican and lived in Tepoztlán long before I met him, our social circle is made up of Mexican family and friends, so I've only met a few expats, but there definitely are plenty of US and Canadian expats in both Tepoztlán and Cuernavaca (as well as from Europe and other countries in Latin America). If you're in Tepoztlán, just go to one of the cafes on Calle Revolución, right across from the zócalo, such as Café Tepoz or Café Revolución, and you'll find expats. Also, as horseshoe mentioned you can join the Yahoo group "Cuernads", which is an information sharing group aimed at expats in Cuernavaca and Tepoztlán.

Personally, I love Tepoztlán. It's vibrant, quirky, with a mix of both the rootedness of the Tepoztecos whose ancestors have inhabited this land since time immemorial and the esoteric, New Age, hippie :hippie: vibe it's also known for. (Not to mention  - it's a UFO sighting hotspot.) The air is clean, surrounded by the Tepozteco mountains and national park. It's close to both Cuernavaca and Mexico City. 

Good luck with your move, wherever you end up!


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

Yes, Tepoztlán! It's got a lot more character than nearby Cuernavaca.

I totally forgot to mention music in my previous post. Since Cuernavaca is a tourist destination there is some degree of live music performance, essentially cover bands. 

I'm a professional musician, so on my early trips to Cuernavaca I investigated the music happenings there, but the creative music scene in town is basically non-existent and since that's my area of endeavors, it held little interest for me. If you are up for playing in something like an old-school bar band, cover band or tribute band you'll be able to find things to do because the tourism creates a certain number of venues for that. I'm sure that if you put together a blues band, you'd find places to play. You being the "****** blues guy" would give you automatic marketing power. That would be true anywhere in Mexico.

Because it is much smaller, Tepoz has less music venues but they do have a couple of music festivals each year that bring in artists from around the country.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

ojosazules11 said:


> Our home is in Tepoztlán, about 20 Minutes from Cuernavaca. It's a _Pueblo Mágico_, with lots of weekend tourists from CDMX. There are many venues with live music, and I've seen ads for at least one Tepoz-based blues band made up of both expats and Mexicans (Steve Brandick y Los Carnivoros).
> 
> I'm still only occasionally in Tepoz (still working in Toronto). Because my husband is Mexican and lived in Tepoztlán long before I met him, our social circle is made up of Mexican family and friends, so I've only met a few expats, but there definitely are plenty of US and Canadian expats in both Tepoztlán and Cuernavaca (as well as from Europe and other countries in Latin America). If you're in Tepoztlán, just go to one of the cafes on Calle Revolución, right across from the zócalo, such as Café Tepoz or Café Revolución, and you'll find expats. Also, as horseshoe mentioned you can join the Yahoo group "Cuernads", which is an information sharing group aimed at expats in Cuernavaca and Tepoztlán.
> 
> ...


Don't get mad at me but I'm going to comment a little on your post. We enjoy going to Tepoz but it is 20+ minutes from there to Ocotpec (depending). From there it is perhaps another 15-20 minutes to Costco or the Pullman terminal and another 10 minutes to el centro. My point is - living in Tepoz is not convenient. Yes there are a lot of tiendas for groceries and such, and there is a very nice market - but for a lot of other things you will need to go into Cuernavaca (or Cuatla). Generally - on a Sunday when we go to Tepoz - we try to get there around 9AM and try to get out of there by 11AM. Otherwise the traffic will kill you.

A person can spend a ton (relative) of money on a house in Tepoz. We have been in some incredible houses - and met some really 'eclectic' people.

I think an expat in Tepoz should visit La Sombra del Sabino. It is a 'book store' which has a cafe. When we have been there (which isn't that often) perhaps 3/4 of the people there were expats. From time to time they have exhibits and the food is good and affordable. They have a website and the owner emails monthly bulletins. For me - it kind of feels like the town of Woodstock in NY.

We no longer frequent bars - in fact we are normally in bed by 7PM. The only music we have encountered around here is a solo (Mexican) guitarist walking tables or sitting at the door of a restaurant during Sunday brunch. I have seen some postings on Cuernads where expats are hawking their performances in Tepoz...


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## ojosazules11 (Nov 3, 2013)

horseshoe846 said:


> Don't get mad at me but I'm going to comment a little on your post. We enjoy going to Tepoz but it is 20+ minutes from there to Ocotpec (depending). From there it is perhaps another 15-20 minutes to Costco or the Pullman terminal and another 10 minutes to el centro. My point is - living in Tepoz is not convenient. Yes there are a lot of tiendas for groceries and such, and there is a very nice market - but for a lot of other things you will need to go into Cuernavaca (or Cuatla). Generally - on a Sunday when we go to Tepoz - we try to get there around 9AM and try to get out of there by 11AM. Otherwise the traffic will kill you.
> 
> A person can spend a ton (relative) of money on a house in Tepoz. We have been in some incredible houses - and met some really 'eclectic' people.
> 
> ...


In terms of how long it takes to get to Cuernavaca from Tepoz, it depends on which route you take. We usually take the _cuota_, and unless traffic is bad, can get from our house to the Walmart on Domingo Diez in about 20 minutes. It should take about 30 mins to Casino de la Selva (Terminal Pullman), although we have been known to make it in just over 20 minutes once when I made us late for the bus to the airport... Always too many things to do and people to say bye to when I head back to Canada...  If we go through Ocotepec / Santa Catarina via the old Carretera Federal, we expect it to take double the time as the _cuota_. Sometimes we do that, as there may be places along the way we want to pick some things up, or eat tacos (in Santa Catarina), or just to take the scenic route if we're not in a hurry. 

Also, from Tepoz it's about 25 minutes to Yautepec, where we also go for shopping (and it's where our _herrero_ has his shop). But honestly, most daily needs can be purchased in Tepoz, and going once a week or a couple of times a month to a larger centre is not really inconvenient. I'm not a Costco shopper, but if I were, here in the middle of Toronto I would need to drive at least 30 minutes to the nearest Costco, so driving that far from Tepoz to the Costco or Sam's Club in Cuerna is reasonable (and a prettier drive, to boot).

I love the market in Tepoz, where you can get whatever you need in terms of fruits and vegetables, meat, flowers, fresh hand-made tortillas :cheer2: , sundries, etc., but it is more expensive for produce than in Cuernavaca or Yautepec, so when we are in either place, we'll often pick up fruits and veggies. The local _tiendas_ are actually quite well stocked, including items expats might want. For instance, I was surprised to find Kikkoman Soy Sauce. 

We avoid driving through central Tepoztlan on the weekends/holidays, unless on our _moto_. Traffic is crazy with all the tourists. But the rest of the week, it's fine. And of course, Tepoz is very walkable, if you don't mind hilly streets. The views are amazing. We're part way up the mountain, so it's an easy walk down to the centre of town. Often I walk back up for the exercise, but it's also easy enough to grab a taxi ($30-35 pesos).

In terms of access to Mexico City, Tepoztlan is closer than Cuernavaca. There are frequent buses throughout the day, MXN$119, 1 hour from Tepoz to Taxqueña (and from there easy access to the Mexico City Metro). It's 1 hr 20 mins from Cuernavaca to Taxqueña.

You're right about La Sombra del Sabino being an expat "hub", and an organic market is held there every Friday. As I mentioned before, our social circle in Tepoz is made of Mexican family and friends, so I really haven't had much interaction with the expat community, but I imagine when the day comes that I actually retire and spend more time there, I'll start getting to know more expats.


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## alvaradojg (Jun 8, 2017)

*Moving scenario Mexico*

I am a US citizen and my wife is a dual citizen (US and Mexico). We have decided to live in her home town of Durango Mexico. We are just taking books (15 boxes Library used) and clothes (some sleeping blankets and towels). We are getting a Menaje for my wife as a Mexican citizen. Do we actually need a menaje for this?
We are taking our Saturn Vue with a small trailer 6X4 with our menaje. I will be requesting (at the Santa Teresa - El Paso Tx crossing) a Tourist visa so we can drive our american car and trailer into Mexico. She will enter as a Mexican citizen. In Durango we will rent a home after which we will them try to import and get local Durango plates for our Saturn Vue 6 cyl. 2003 SUV and trailer. We will then go to the local Durango INM office and change my Tourist visa for a FM2 permanent resident visa. 
Do you see any problems with this? This looks logical and lawful to me.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

alvaradojg said:


> I am a US citizen and my wife is a dual citizen (US and Mexico). We have decided to live in her home town of Durango Mexico. We are just taking books (15 boxes Library used) and clothes (some sleeping blankets and towels). We are getting a Menaje for my wife as a Mexican citizen. Do we actually need a menaje for this?
> We are taking our Saturn Vue with a small trailer 6X4 with our menaje. I will be requesting (at the Santa Teresa - El Paso Tx crossing) a Tourist visa so we can drive our american car and trailer into Mexico. She will enter as a Mexican citizen. In Durango we will rent a home after which we will them try to import and get local Durango plates for our Saturn Vue 6 cyl. 2003 SUV and trailer. We will then go to the local Durango INM office and change my Tourist visa for a FM2 permanent resident visa.
> Do you see any problems with this? This looks logical and lawful to me.


Your plans raise a couple of red flags that you might want to check on.
1) Importing a vehicle and getting Mexican plates is only possible with some makes and some years. I don't know about Saturn. And even if it is possible, it might not be worth the time, effort and cost.
2) You cannot change from a tourist permit to a residence visa while in Mexico. You have to apply for the visa at a consulate outside of Mexico first. Maybe different rules apply since your wife is a Mexican citizen, but if not your plan will need revision.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

So this morning we dropped off our 2001 nationalized vehicle at the mechanics shop for routine 6 month service. On the taxi ride back we had a particularly chatty driver. His 2009 VW was in impeccable condition. I complemented him on what good care he takes of his car. Anyway - along the way he mentioned that starting this year (next January I guess) - taxis older than 2006 will no longer be given 'permission to circulate'. (I can foresee some demonstrations...).


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

TundraGreen said:


> Your plans raise a couple of red flags that you might want to check on.
> 1) Importing a vehicle and getting Mexican plates is only possible with some makes and some years. I don't know about Saturn. And even if it is possible, it might not be worth the time, effort and cost.
> 2) You cannot change from a tourist permit to a residence visa while in Mexico. You have to apply for the visa at a consulate outside of Mexico first. Maybe different rules apply since your wife is a Mexican citizen, but if not your plan will need revision.


He is married to a Mexican National and can use the "vinculo familiar" law to apply for a 2 year RT visa/card at his local INM office without proof of financial solvency and after 2 years apply for a RP card. I did. All you need is a valid FMM 180 day tourist card and other documents they require.

2003 vehicles don´t qualify for permanent importation into Duango state etc. but maybe into Baja. I think now it is only 2009 or 2010 vehicles are allowed with the proper VIN number etc.


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## alvaradojg (Jun 8, 2017)

AlanMexicali said:


> He is married to a Mexican National and can use the "vinculo familiar" law to apply for a 2 year RT visa/card at his local INM office without proof of financial solvency and after 2 years apply for a RP card. I did. All you need is a valid FMM 180 day tourist card and other documents they require.
> 
> 2003 vehicles don´t qualify for permanent importation into Duango state etc. but maybe into Baja. I think now it is only 2009 or 2010 vehicles are allowed with the proper VIN number etc.


Thank you Tundragreen and AlanMexicali for your reply.

Yes I thought that I could get a FM2 or FM3 in Durango. I hear what you say about an 2003 Saturn Vue and I think you may be right of not being able to import it.
My plan will still be of getting a FMM tourist visa and haul my wife's (and I) Books (many boxes!) and some clothes in the trailer. This will save much money of a moving company charges. If it is that we cannot import the vehicle then we will come back to El Paso returning the Saturn Vue and Trailer for a friend to sell. I will then get an FM2 visa at our local El Paso Mexican consulate The Man in charge of Visas at the consulate Knows us well and will give me a visa the same day. My wife and I will then take a bus back to Durango. Thank you for your advice.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

That sounds like a very good plan, except you should be aware of one thing:

>>The Man in charge of Visas at the consulate Knows us well and will give me a visa the same day. 

The consulate can only give a temporary visa/canje to get you into the country as a potential candidate for residency. That visa/canje is not the same as your residente permanente residency, which you will have to visit the nearest INM office in Durango to continue the process.

By the way, the names FM2 and FM3 were dropped about 10 years ago. It is "residente temporal" and "residente permanente" now.


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## alvaradojg (Jun 8, 2017)

circle110 said:


> That sounds like a very good plan, except you should be aware of one thing:
> 
> >>The Man in charge of Visas at the consulate Knows us well and will give me a visa the same day.
> 
> ...


Yes, the consulate will give me a visa for RP with a charge of $37 dollars (if I remember correctly) and I am to go to the Durango INM to put in for a RP "Green Card" for $400 dollars. They informed me that it could take a month for my "Green Card" (which is actually green) to be received. Thank You.
I am not sure if you can open a bank account until you receive your "green card"?


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

The consulate will put a full-page visa in your passport. When you enter Mexico, you have to be sure that the agent checks the "canje" box on the form. If that is missed you're completely messed up and will have to go back to the US and start over. The agent should tell you that you have a certain number of days to report to INM. If he doesn't mention that, he might not have checked "canje" either. It's not very many days, I forget how many: 7, 10 or 15, something like that. Anyway, get there the next business day after you get to Mexico to get the ball rolling.

How long it takes depends on the particular INM office. Some will be less busy and faster than a month, some might take even longer than a month, Cancun took 7 weeks for my RT. During that time it's possible but problematic to leave the country. You have to get a special letter from INM if you have an emergency and have to go back to the US. Don't plan on it, but if you can't help it, there is a way.

I don't know about bank accounts. At the end of the RP process, you should get a CURP number. You may need that to open the bank account, especially if it bears interest. It may be possible to open a bank account before that, but I'd just wait I had an RP, a CURP, a lease and a utility bill to show them to make it all go smoother.


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## AlanMexicali (Jun 1, 2011)

alvaradojg said:


> Thank you Tundragreen and AlanMexicali for your reply.
> 
> Yes I thought that I could get a FM2 or FM3 in Durango. I hear what you say about an 2003 Saturn Vue and I think you may be right of not being able to import it.
> My plan will still be of getting a FMM tourist visa and haul my wife's (and I) Books (many boxes!) and some clothes in the trailer. This will save much money of a moving company charges. If it is that we cannot import the vehicle then we will come back to El Paso returning the Saturn Vue and Trailer for a friend to sell. I will then get an FM2 visa at our local El Paso Mexican consulate The Man in charge of Visas at the consulate Knows us well and will give me a visa the same day. My wife and I will then take a bus back to Durango. Thank you for your advice.


You can´t get your RP card in Durango under the "vinculo familiar" law only a 2 year RT visa/card then when it expires a RP card. At the Mexican Consulate to get a RP visa/card pre-approval you will need to show proof of finanacial solvency in the tune of $2000.00+ or¨- USD deposits per month into bank account for 6 to 12 months or an investment account of about $100,000 USD balance for 12 months. Then you can continue with step 2 in Durango, not before doing step 1 in the USA.

Only if you apply for a 1, 2, 3, or 4 year RT visa/card inside Mexico at your local INM office or at a Mexican Consulate under the "vinculo familiar" law do you not have to show proof of financial solvency. In this case they might ask for 3 to 6 months of bank statemnts only to see how you will pay your bills but there is no financial solvency mínimum balance required


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## eastwind (Jun 18, 2016)

I'm getting confused. Too many very similar threads and similar posters asking similar questions and taking over each other's threads. There's one NY person asking who was born in Merida, and so will start out as RP, and someone else who's married to a Mexicana. Or is this it all the same guy?


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

alvaradojg said:


> Yes, the consulate will give me a visa for RP with a charge of $37 dollars (if I remember correctly) and I am to go to the Durango INM to put in for a RP "Green Card" for $400 dollars. They informed me that it could take a month for my "Green Card" (which is actually green) to be received. Thank You.
> I am not sure if you can open a bank account until you receive your "green card"?


The information you have is not correct. 

That visa you'd get from your friend is for a one time entry to Mexico and is valid for only 30 days after entry. Once in Mexico you have 30 days to first obtain an address and then go to the INM office nearest to that address to continue the "trámites" to obtain your "residente permanante", which is not a visa but a migratory document. The visa your friend gives you is only valid to cross into Mexico once and after 30 days it expires. The "green card" as you call it -- it is actually called "residente permanente" -- is what is important and if you don't get to INM within 30 days of crossing the border to continue the process of applying for that green card, you will lose the original visa and have to start over from scratch.

Consulates tend to be pretty poorly informed about the details of the immigration process. I recommend you call INM (or read their web site) to get the proper information.


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## alvaradojg (Jun 8, 2017)

Thanks to all. I have a better idea of what to do now.
I am a veteran of the USMC unfortunately no veterans medical in Mexico! 
My wife was a teacher for the Federal Government in Mexico so will be covered by ISSSTE which is very fortunate! Can always make trips to the VA in El Paso for meds.
Again thank you all.


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## Haskins (May 21, 2017)

alvaradojg said:


> Thanks to all. I have a better idea of what to do now.
> I am a veteran of the USMC unfortunately no veterans medical in Mexico!...


Thank you for your service, alvaradojg. 
You might consider looking into buying Mexico's National health insurance (Seguro Popular?). I'm sure there are others much more qualified to discuss this topic here than me. But if you don't mind going to the VA in El Paso, you can't beat that! Meds are rather inexpensive in Mexico though. Good luck!


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Haskins said:


> Thank you for your service, alvaradojg.
> You might consider looking into buying Mexico's National health insurance (Seguro Popular?). I'm sure there are others much more qualified to discuss this topic here than me. But if you don't mind going to the VA in El Paso, you can't beat that! Meds are rather inexpensive in Mexico though. Good luck!


You can buy into IMSS (Instituto Mexicano Seguro Social). I am not sure about Seguro Popular. Seguro Social is the better funded system mostly used by people who get the premiums paid by their employers. Seguro Popular is used more by people with less resources. With both systems, non-emergency treatment entails long waits for an appointment. Mexico requires one year of service from new doctors and that may be where Seguro Popular gets a lot of its doctors, but I am not sure about that.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

So it appears that the software used to serve up this website must have a limitation of 3 'stickies' - if not this site needs a healthcare sticky. These same questions are asked and re-asked...

- I believe that there is an effort to make the best use of resources across SP / IMSS / other government resources. You may 'subscribe' to SP and be sent to an IMSS facility.

- For an expat - IMSS has an annual fee. I think for the two of us this year we paid something like $800 USD. SP is means tested (it is not free).

- With IMSS - unfortunately - the quality of service depends on the luck of the draw with which GP you are assigned. Our current GP is a bulldog. If she wants something to happen she will get up from her desk, walk to the administrator's office and come back with a set appointment etc. At the same time - we have spent the better part of a day (starting at 7AM) waiting. My one and only surgery (under anesthesia) at IMSS - I sat in a chair - in nothing but a hospital gown - outside the operating room for an hour waiting my turn. Then I walked in on my own two feet and laid down on the table where I was put under. A little different that the US - but hey - I lived 

- With IMSS - they kind of ease you into the system. You don't get all the benefits on day one.

- Last comment - IMSS processes a ton of people. On a morning when you go to have lab work done you might wait in line for an hour. You are herded into various rooms where people spend perhaps a minute each patient to draw blood. In the last couple months IMSS tested my glucose. The first reading was 130 the second 110. So I went to an excellent external lab (could rival anything in the US) and for 249 pesos had them run an A1C (?) test. They came back and said I am fine. Guess it always pays to get a second opinion.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Moderator Note:



horseshoe846 said:


> So it appears that the software used to serve up this website must have a limitation of 3 'stickies' - if not this site needs a healthcare sticky. These same questions are asked and re-asked...


There is no limit on the number of stickies, but I like to keep it small. They push all the current conversations down the page and maybe out of the window for some people. A long time ago I put together an FAQ with links to a few informative threads. It is long out of date now, and I would be happy to update it if someone wanted to take the time to redo it.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

If you do re-do it, I'd like to request that special attention be paid to the following:

1) Make sure it addresses what buying health care looks like for ex-pats of various ages (ie. do not assume everyone is over the age 60/65 ?? cut off which I believe exists for at least some of the programs).

2) Make sure it addresses what differences exist for those in TR versus PR status.

My 3 cents, thanks.


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## RickS (Aug 6, 2009)

Tundra Green said: _"With both systems, non-emergency treatment entails long waits for an appointment."_

TG, I believe this can and does vary from location to location. There is a new SP facility in the Lake Chapala area (Jocotopec) and this is not necessarily the case there. Folks are Posting good things about the facility.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

RickS said:


> Tundra Green said: _"With both systems, non-emergency treatment entails long waits for an appointment."_
> 
> TG, I believe this can and does vary from location to location. There is a new SP facility in the Lake Chapala area (Jocotopec) and this is not necessarily the case there. Folks are Posting good things about the facility.


The Lake Chapala area is not what I would call a typical part of Mexico. Perhaps the fact that it has a large expat community has something to do with the high quality of the SP facility in Jocotopec. 

I thought that Seguro Popular was for people of modest financial means. Can just anyone use the facility even if they afford to pay medical expenses out of pocket?


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## RickS (Aug 6, 2009)

_"Can just anyone use the facility even if they afford to pay medical expenses out of pocket? "_

Short answer is 'yes'.....

I truly doubt it has anything to do with the number of gringos there.... although there are many, they still constitute a tiny portion of the population and the service is surely directed towards Nationals.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

RickS said:


> _"Can just anyone use the facility even if they afford to pay medical expenses out of pocket? "_
> 
> Short answer is 'yes'.....


Something doesn't sit well with me when I see people who are not in need of help using a government service meant mainly to serve the poor, of which there are so many in Mexico!


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## RickS (Aug 6, 2009)

I should add that I do not know the financial circumstances of gringos using the Jocotopec SP facilities. Maybe they do not have means. The gringos that I do know about there that do have means usually avail themselves/cover their medical with a combination of 'out of pocket' and Mexican insurance.... either straight or catastrophic.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

Seguro Popular is open to all legal residents of Mexico. There is a resource scale that may create eligibility to receive a bill, but service and treatment are not restricted. Service will vary, depending upon the facilities available in your area, but SP can, and will send patients to other facilities whenever deemed necessary to achieve the treatment required. It is for those without other Mexican medical insurance coverage. At our age, for example, it would be our only option; even though we might use the private system for routine care, or purchase our own medicines just to avoid long waits, etc. In case of an emergency or catastrophic illness, SP would be there and would prevent the bankruptcy of the rest of the family.


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