# Advice Needed - Having a child/marriage



## ILoveAFilipina (Dec 21, 2012)

Hi folks,

It's been quite a long time since I popped on here last but need some advice from some of the more experience Expats in the Philippines.

*The Background*

I first met my Filipina GF (briefly) way back Dec 2011 during a visit to the Phils as part of a round the world trip. She was friends of friends - we got introduced and exchanged emails and then we stayed in contact as I continued my travels and when I got back to the UK - gradually getting closer and closer.

Anyway, during my travels I got offered a job in Malaysia, which I started in Oct 2012. I took this opportunity to visit my GF (and her family) on a monthly basis before I was able to get a 'dependent' visa for my GF in Malaysia (after getting a Common Law Wife certificate from the British High Comm here) and she has been living with me in Malaysia since March 2013. 

Seven very happy months later I popped the question and my GF suddenly became my fiance. We did not have immediate plans to get married (primarily because I wanted to save some more money first in order to do it properly).

However, life has now thrown us a curveball in the shape of a pregnancy. We are both delighted about this (although the other half is now suffering through a variety of pregnancy related issues - and a craving for Dinuguan - which is almost impossible to buy in (Muslim) Malaysia  ). 

*The Current Situation*

Anyway, the situation I now find myself in is this. My Fiance is due in Feb 2015.

She wants to have the baby back in the Philippines - as it's her first and she wants to be close to her family - particularly her mother. I have no problems with that although it does mean she has to go home by Mid-November as there are problems with getting flights after 7-months pregnancy. I will obviously miss her - but cannot take so much time off work - and I want her to be wherever she is most comfortable. Sadly she cannot work here on a dependent visa and that does mean that she is at home alone a lot when I am at work - as such I think it may also be better if she has the company of her family in the final few months.

However, what I would like advice upon is the issue of marriage, illegitimacy, surnames, registrations, travel documents etc.

With regard marriage we had intended to get married anyway - but it would probably have been on a longer timescale. As I am Catholic too (British of Irish descent) we were going to get married in a church in the Philippines - but my intention was to save up enough cash to do it properly.

We are now contemplating the possibility of doing a civil service instead prior to the birth - possibly in December or early-Jan. 

I understand that I have to get a Certificate from the British Consulate in Manila showing that there is no impediment to the marriage (it costs about 5k pesos) and I understand my fiance needs to get a similar document from her Barangay authorities. 

From what I have read the British Embassy will not issue the document for at least 21 days after I visit them in person - which probably means at least two trips to the Phils in advance of any marriage - as well as trips over at Christmas/New Year and then again around the due date.

I then assume that once we both have these documents we can do a civil service in my fiance's home town? Are there any other costs I need to account for? 

This whole process - especially the trips back and forth - will be quite expensive and my priority at the moment is more on ensuring I have the cash for health checkups/hospital for my fiance and the baby - and as such we are considering whether we actually need to get married prior to the birth.

Obviously there is/was a social stigma attached to having an illegitimate baby - but I am not sure how strong that still is? My fiance is insisting that she is happy either way - but wondered what you fellas with experience in the Philippines think?

Also, my fiance is quite happy for the baby to have my surname - however I am not sure if the baby can have my surname if it is classed as illegitimate. I have read elsewhere that as long as I am present at the birth and sign the birth certificate then this is not a problem - but wondered if anyone could confirm this is the case in the Philippines?

Finally, is it possible to get travel documents for the child so he/she can come back to Malaysia a mont (or so) after the birth if the baby is illegitimate? Or is it straightforward if the birth certificate is signed in both our names? Someone told us that the baby would need to be baptised before it traveled in order to obtain the necessary Filipino documentation - but I am not sure that is the case. Can anyone confirm/deny?

With regard baptism - is this even possible if we are not married (but both Catholic). I read recently that Pope Francis has baptised kids of parents who are not married - but am not sure if that practice is common in all parts of the Catholic church as I got the impression some of the more 'conservative' elements of the church refuse baptism unless the parents are already married. Does anyone have any first hand experience of this in the Philippines?

Anyway, sorry for the long post.

Am interested in your thoughts.


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## JimnNila143 (Jul 23, 2013)

*Marriage in the Philippines*



ILoveAFilipina said:


> Hi folks,
> 
> It's been quite a long time since I popped on here last but need some advice from some of the more experience Expats in the Philippines.
> 
> ...


This is a situation that takes place a number of times, especially with ExPats. First, it is best that your fiancée travel to the Philippines before her 3rd Trimester begins. It takes time to get married in the Philippines as you have to go through certain requirements to do so. You will each need certification that you are free and clear to wed, You have to go to the UK Embassy and obtain an affidavit that you are free and clear to marry. Your fiancée has to go to the SFO Office and obtain one there. You will need full and complete birth certificates, 3 sets each, and you also must attend a Marriage Seminar put on by the Marriage License Bureau. Once the marriage license/contract is obtained, you have 4 months to use it or you start all over again. There is no problem with you having a Civil Ceremony. You can have a church wedding later if you wish. If you marry before her due date, there should be no problem as far as putting your name on the child's birth certificate. By doing so you might be able to avoid doing DNA proof that you are the child's father, which can be expensive. Once the baby arrives, he or she will automatically become a UK Citizen. He/She will also be a Philippine Citizen as well. 

There should not be a problem with the Christening of your child and if the Pope approves of this, any other priest should be able to follow along as well. 

If you are not able to return with your fiancée to the Philippines, she, herself, will return with a Balikbayan Status Visa. With the Balikbayan Status, she is able to stay in the Philippines for up to 2 years. You will also need to obtain permission for her and the baby to travel/return to Malaysia, but I would wait until the baby is a bit older. One month of age is a little young to travel on an aircraft.

If there are any doubts about the legitimacy of your child's birth, you can always have the DNA test performed and it has to be done at St. Luke's in Manila. As far as cost, it is probably more than 50,000 Pesos.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

I would have thought you could get you CNI going at the British Embassy in Malaysia. You would then exchange it for the Philippine document in Manila before the wedding. Note, it is a legal requirement that you must be in the Philippine at least 10 day before the wedding can go ahead.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

if you marry in PH law the process is painful

plan B, marry in Malaysia, civil marriage, notify PH embassy, get your NSO copy, and then baby is delivered ...

after christening him you can have a Philippine church wedding

I dunno your gf/fiance's family but it can cost a bit here ..

by the way you are catholic, if not the church will Baptiste your baby as child of unmarried couple, until church wedding is completed ...


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

ecureilx said:


> if you marry in PH law the process is painful
> 
> plan B, marry in Malaysia, civil marriage, notify PH embassy, get your NSO copy, and then baby is delivered ...
> 
> ...


Cost to the gf/fiance's family shouldn't be a factor as it's traditional in the Philippines for the groom to pay for the wedding.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

Gary D said:


> Cost to the gf/fiance's family shouldn't be a factor as it's traditional in the Philippines for the groom to pay for the wedding.


I may throw a curve ball there ..

it is tradition for 'foreign' groom to pay.... 

I attended few weddings in mountain province and Bicol, all costs were shared except one in Bontoc where the girl's family shouldered most of the costs ...

maybe Mountain province people are different


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## ILoveAFilipina (Dec 21, 2012)

Thanks for all the feedback.

I think it has helped sharpen up my thinking.

We will probably get married here in Malaysia in a Civic Service and register it with the Philippines and UK Embassies here - as it seems like a more straightforward process to go through than in the Philippines. 

The fact that I would have to wait 21 days for the CNI from the British High Comm in Manila - plus the need to be in the Phils at least 10 days before the wedding - would probably use up all my vacation time - and I want to use that to be with the other half pre and post the birth - so it makes more sense to do it here.

We will do a proper 'church' wedding back in the Phils at a later stage.

I am visiting the Phils next week with my fiance - and will also do some investigations of my own while I am there.

My fiance is from Pampanga - quite close to Angeles. She wants to have the baby back in the Phils so she will probably return home in mid-November (just before she hits 7 months) and I will go join her closer to the delivery date.

A couple of questions.

1) Does anyone have any recommendation on a good 'maternity' hospital in Angeles? My fiance has suggested the Angeles Medical Centre - but am open to other suggestions if anyone has had any good/bad experiences with childbirth in the Angeles area.

2) My fiance is talking about paying a whole bunch of 'advance' premiums to Phil Health when she visits this time. She says that by signing up to Phil Health the hospital fees will be a lot lower. Is this true? Do private hospitals also accept Phil Health or would we be wasting money to sign my fiance up to Phil Health now?


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

I beleive private hospitals accept Phil Heath, definitely worth having if you are living in the Philippines. Phil Heath only gives discounts on certain items so it's not a blanket discount across your whole bill. I thought there was a waiting period before it becomes valid so I'm not sure you are in time to get help with the upcoming birth. Worth checking.


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## HondaGuy (Aug 6, 2012)

Just to clarify a little, with regards to the 10 day waiting period, I believe people are referring to the minimum time required from when you apply for the marriage license and when you can actually have the ceremony performed.

I dont think anybody is going to look at stamps in your passport to make sure you've been in the country for 10 days before they perform the wedding.

I applied for my marriage license this past May, then immediately flew back to Bahrain, flew back a month later and got married 5-6 days after entering the country.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

HondaGuy said:


> .
> 
> I applied for my marriage license this past May, then immediately flew back to Bahrain, flew back a month later and got married 5-6 days after entering the country.


did you attend the orientation seminar etc? nothing is so simple in Philippines in my humble opinion ... 

back to OP, I know philhealth covers part of maternity ...

now as Gary D said, I don't know the wait period to be eligible

non complicated delivery in Baguio Pines City Private hospital is around 30,000 to 40,000


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

HondaGuy said:


> Just to clarify a little, with regards to the 10 day waiting period, I believe people are referring to the minimum time required from when you apply for the marriage license and when you can actually have the ceremony performed.
> 
> I dont think anybody is going to look at stamps in your passport to make sure you've been in the country for 10 days before they perform the wedding.
> 
> I applied for my marriage license this past May, then immediately flew back to Bahrain, flew back a month later and got married 5-6 days after entering the country.


The 10 day waiting period is from the application of the liecense to the issuing of the liecense. The liecence is then valid for 120 days after which it expires.


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## HondaGuy (Aug 6, 2012)

ecureilx said:


> did you attend the orientation seminar etc? nothing is so simple in Philippines in my humble opinion ...


Nope. When we went to the QC City Hall, instead of going to the civil registrar, we went to the office where they schedule the "family planning" seminar and talked to the office manager there.

We explained that since Im over 40 and we already have kids, we didnt think we needed to attend and she agreed, so she waived it for us.

I should probably type up my entire marriage process and post it separately.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

HondaGuy said:


> Nope. When we went to the QC City Hall, instead of going to the civil registrar, we went to the office where they schedule the "family planning" seminar and talked to the office manager there.
> 
> We explained that since Im over 40 and we already have kids, we didnt think we needed to attend and she agreed, so she waived it for us.
> 
> I should probably type up my entire marriage process and post it separately.


Everyones milage will be different. We avoided it for 100 peso. Still had to do the other one thought as we married in a church.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

enough of my friends including one who was marrying a widow with a kid, had to attend the seminars ....

interesting to know you were waived ...

the church interview is fine ...


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## Taswegian (Dec 2, 2011)

Hi all,

Everyone will have a different experience.
Mine - I flew into Manila went straight to Aussie embassy and got my CNI within 1 hour, the next day we travelled to her province and received clearance for my wife, the third day we went to the province city hall and receive a waiver for seminars and then two days after that we had the wedding (5 days total). After the wedding we had to wait 2 weeks before we could pickup our marriage cert. we had the local Mayor at our wedding so not sure if he greased any wheels for us..lol...but everything was extremely easy and fast.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

Taswegian said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Everyone will have a different experience.
> Mine - I flew into Manila went straight to Aussie embassy and got my CNI within 1 hour, the next day we travelled to her province and received clearance for my wife, the third day we went to the province city hall and receive a waiver for seminars and then two days after that we had the wedding (5 days total). After the wedding we had to wait 2 weeks before we could pickup our marriage cert. we had the local Mayor at our wedding so not sure if he greased any wheels for us..lol...but everything was extremely easy and fast.


Just as an aside, when I was going through all this 18 years ago now we were always warned not to short cut the 10 days. To do so would guarentee a visa rejection at the British Embassy.


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## PogiBaby (Apr 2, 2014)

As a side note to your comment about social stigma... My understanding here in the PI is that if you were not wed when your child was born then the schools will not accept them. My step-daughter who was adopted by her grandparents at birth and had to get a forged birth certificate saying that her grandparents were actually her birth parents.. and when she applies to school she has to show her birth certificate along with her parents marriage license to prove she was not illegitimate... even though everyone, including all the nuns, know. It doesn't seem like this will be an issue for y'all as you said you will have a civil wedding first. Congratulations, by the way!


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

PogiBaby said:


> As a side note to your comment about social stigma... My understanding here in the PI is that if you were not wed when your child was born then the schools will not accept them. My step-daughter who was adopted by her grandparents at birth and had to get a forged birth certificate saying that her grandparents were actually her birth parents.. and when she applies to school she has to show her birth certificate along with her parents marriage license to prove she was not illegitimate... even though everyone, including all the nuns, know. It doesn't seem like this will be an issue for y'all as you said you will have a civil wedding first. Congratulations, by the way!


We have relations that have families who are not married and all the children have been and are going to school. I suspect it is just an old wives tail.


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## ILoveAFilipina (Dec 21, 2012)

Thanks to everyone who responded - the advice has actually been helpful - even the contradictory stuff 

Will keep you updated on how it goes...

Cheers


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## alen054 (Jul 10, 2014)

JimnNila143 - I wonder how sure your details are or either I should question my situation. 

ILoveAFilipina - Please do update us on the thread with how things were with you later on as I also want to be educated with dos and dont. 

If it will help I am on the same boat and my partner is british not by descent. We have a son but not yet married and he was able to sign and acknowledge my son on his birth certificate, applied as late registry, this was allowed by law since 2012 as advised by my midwife. You mentioned about your son instantly obtaining your baby's UK citizenship, well that I am not too sure how it can be done because on the internet it is saying that UK honors citizenship by land, meaning if your gf delivers in the UK she will automatically be UK citizen but if abroad you will have to register and it will varry if you are british by descent or not by descent, we are at the stage of understanding that so please let me know if you ever get into this stage as at first I thought it was easy but as for the information we've gathered it is tricky so the first move we did was to apply visiting UK on a temporary visa (me and my son) (being the fastest and cheapest) while in Hongkong but was refused because my partner opted that I quit my job in Dubai as an advertising executive which means I wasn't working the moment we applied for the visa. 

In terms of where to deliver, in the Philippines is comfy having family around for your wife and if you will invite her to come to you in Malaysia under your visa it is possible as you have a son together so it should be ok, we've done it many times when we went to vietnam and dubai, and we are able to travel together in singapore, macau, and hongkong, without any hassle. 

I advise take the option of obtaining Malaysian citizenship at the worst as its very difficult to hold a Philippine passport getting places in the world.


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## ILoveAFilipina (Dec 21, 2012)

Getting Malaysian citizenship is impossible for expats - even if you have a child here. The best you can get is a long term permanent residency such as Malaysia My 2nd Home

In many case they do not even allow refugee orphan kids who are adopted by Malaysian families to get Malaysian citizenship, particularly if the adoptees are not Malay Muslims. 

(Malaysia is 60% Malay Muslim, 25% Chinese of various religions and about 15% others and the ruling party is trying to increase the Muslim population for political/electoral reasons)


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## alen054 (Jul 10, 2014)

i think i wasnt clear with my answers as i wrote on a quick post. my partner signed my sons birth certificate and so my son acquired my partners surname. 

And to add, the visa we applied for is a fiance visa and had registered to UK municipality but yet refused for the reason I mentioned (fyi we applied in hongkong but as I am filipina our docs were still sent back to Philippine british embassy). We also tried to marry in the Philippines but before you can get that letter saying you are single you will still need to make an appointment with the british embassy in the Philippines and have to go through a long process and I dont know how truthful it is but I was told that marriage outside UK are not recognized by the UK law? ... You will still need to get married in the UK for some reason... 

Interesting info about Malaysia.. I wish to see that place on my next travel.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

alen054 said:


> i think i wasnt clear with my answers as i wrote on a quick post. my partner signed my sons birth certificate and so my son acquired my partners surname.
> 
> And to add, the visa we applied for is a fiance visa and had registered to UK municipality but yet refused for the reason I mentioned (fyi we applied in hongkong but as I am filipina our docs were still sent back to Philippine british embassy). We also tried to marry in the Philippines but before you can get that letter saying you are single you will still need to make an appointment with the british embassy in the Philippines and have to go through a long process and I dont know how truthful it is but I was told that marriage outside UK are not recognized by the UK law? ... You will still need to get married in the UK for some reason...
> 
> Interesting info about Malaysia.. I wish to see that place on my next travel.


alen054, a marriage in the Philippines is 100% recognised in the UK. I don't know how old your child is and I don't know if it makes a difference but as your partner is a UK citizen you must register your child as a British Citizen at the British Embassy. It should be fairly straight forward for your partner to do. If you are not married they may ask for a DNA test but this shouldn't be anything to worry about. Once you child is a British Citizen it should be much easier for you to go to the UK, spouse visa would be preferable. As a British Citizen your child will have the right to reside in the UK and it would be against human rights law for your child to travel without it's mother.


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## alen054 (Jul 10, 2014)

Thank you gary, my son is 2 1/2 years btw. Ive made a bit of research and seen that as my partner is a naturalized british then my son should automatically acquire that citizenship and you are right that we should register but as we are on this since I had my son it has affected us too much emotionally and yes I question that thing about him being straight forward to doing it but we tried to be together and spent a lot trying and that includes applying for a visa that got denied, which eventually turned frustratingly that I'd have to leave my son for 2 months and work back in Dubai, lucky to find a good job in the same industry that I left off but couldn't continue it coz we agreed that there will be options but not this way so I went back and quit my job again, My son is holding me back, and to be with him is a dream for me. He seemed confuse and afraid to loose more money and so cautious of making a move if it weren't sure which makes me want to do it all for us coz its starting to affect me not being able to be together when my son is suppose to be enjoying him and him enjoying my son, and us together, he's got background of depression and am afraid its whats holding him to make a move... my question is... do u think I can do it for us? the marriage thing we've tried registering and doing it but because of the distance and inability to make things happen it is weakening our relationship basically from my side as I have my son with me (amazing and lonely without a father) I need him to be with us but as we have spent so much and just recently was left with the situation apart. 

How do you think I can help fix our situation and how much should I save to start with so as not to give him so much stress and what advise should I tell him to better our status. 

IloveaFilipina, I can be a learning experience for you in the future


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

Here is a link to the UK government website regarding registering births aboard. All I can suggest is to read it thought. Just do a dummy run filling in the information that is asked for. It looks like it is you that registers the birth.
https://www.gov.uk/register-a-birth


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## alen054 (Jul 10, 2014)

Thank you gary Im glad to learn from u.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

alen054 said:


> J.
> 
> I advise take the option of obtaining Malaysian citizenship at the worst as its very difficult to hold a Philippine passport getting places in the world.


as updated getting Malaysian citizenship is next to impossible even if you deliver / 
live there ...

PS, Singapore too balances the racial mix... like Malaysia


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## ILoveAFilipina (Dec 21, 2012)

So a quick update:

Me and my mahal are now officially married 

After much back and forth and paperwork that needed all sorts of authentications, notarizations and stamps from the various Embassies (which in turn required a variety of docs that need to be notarised and authenticated by the DFA in the Philippines) and various Malaysian Gov't departments (Immigration, Foreign Affairs and the National Registry office to name a few), we finally got the approval to go ahead and tied the knot in a small civil ceremony a few weeks back - followed by a short honeymoon in Bali. 

After getting back to Malaysia we had to start another bureaucratic process, to register the marriage with the Philippines Embassy here - which required a whole variety of documents (multiple copies) - but everything has been submitted now (phew).

Anyway my wife (still feels weird saying that) is now 7-months along in her pregnancy and everything is going well so far. The monthly scan and checkup reveals our son-to-be is slightly 'longer' than average, but other than that completely healthy so far - and I pray that it stays that way. He is kicking my wife like crazy and her belly looks so huge I am kind of scared that he is going to pop out early - so am glad that we have got the wedding out of the way.

The child will be dual nationality - Filipino and either British or Irish (as I am dual nationality myself). Am leaning towards Irish as the UK may vote itself out of the European Union in the next few years and would prefer my son to have a passport that gives access to the rest of Europe - plus everyone (almost) loves the Irish ;-)

We have also obtained a three-month visa (extendable to six-months) from the Malaysian Embassy in the Philippines for my mother-in-law, who will be coming to visit us in January in order to help my wife through the pre and post-birth period - which will be interesting culture shock for her (she has never been out of the Phils before).

I just want to add on one other thing. As some of you know from my first few posts I am 41 (but I feel a lot younger) and my wife is 21 (about to turn 22). 

I know that there has been some debate here (on this forum) about the wisdom of getting involved in a relationship with too much of an age gap - and I completely understand that and know that it is based on (sad) experience in many cases. However, I just want to say that from my perspective things are going okay so far.

We have now lived together in Malaysia for two years and all I can say is that I love her more and more every day and (unless she is a better liar/actor than Satan himself) I know that she feels the same way about me - despite the age difference. We share the same interests, the same sense of humour, the same attitudes to (and understanding of) other people. We have pretty similar tastes in music and movies (i.e. we both hate scary/horror flicks) and share a love of food  S I am not sure if this means that I am just a child at heart or whether she is just a lot more mature than most women her age - personally I think it is a bit of both 

I have no idea if things will continue to go well for us and am aware of all the various horror stories, but so far I am extremely optimistic. Yes, I share some of the frustrations that many of you on this site share with regard the extended family and their work ethic/needs, but this seems like a minor irritant when compared with the joy that my mahal makes me feel every single day.

When I first joined this site back in 2013 I created a username which described how I felt at the time and it is just as relevant - if not more so today. I Love a Filipina and I truly hope that will always be the case. No regrets so far.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

Good luck and happy to hear it is working out !!


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## esv1226 (Mar 13, 2014)

Congratulations and I'm so happy for you.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

Wow---Congratulations!!! The two (almost 3) of you are off to a great start together. Age should not make a difference and likely will not.

Just a hint; When a family member of hers comes to visit from here in the Philippines; be sure they do *NOT* fly out of Clark/Angeles.

Reason for this is that At times, the officers working for Immigration at that airport will deny boarding of a citizen *even if their passport and visa* is in order and legal.
They seem to have unquestioned authority along with little or no accountability for their decisions or actions.
To negate/eliminate problems of this nature it is best to fly out of the main airport in Manila.


Again, from all of us at Expat Forum; congratulations and Happy Holidays..


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## ILoveAFilipina (Dec 21, 2012)

Jet Lag said:


> Wow---Congratulations!!! The two (almost 3) of you are off to a great start together. Age should not make a difference and likely will not.
> 
> Just a hint; When a family member of hers comes to visit from here in the Philippines; be sure they do *NOT* fly out of Clark/Angeles.
> 
> ...


Thanks.

Actually have experienced the Clark issue already. In fact the first time I was meant to meet my mahal outside the Philippines we had arranged to meet in Singapore - along with her sister who was going to act as a chaperone. I was in Malaysia for a meeting and had planned to meet them both at Changi Airport in Singapore.

Despite having return tickets, confirmation of the hotel booking and a letter from me, the immigration officers at Angeles denied them access to the flight - and indeed went so far as to suggest to my GF and her sis that I was a people trafficker who would steal their passports, rape them and sell them into prostitution. 

Not impressed with this I flew to Clark to meet my GF in the Phils instead - but the whole process cost me a couple of return airline tickets, my own return ticket to Singapore and a lost hotel booking (paid in advance).

Anyway, as a result of this I did more research and discovered that I had to obtain a 'Letter of Invitation' from the Philippines Embassy and (more importantly) it was suggested that I actually travel with my GF. 

Anyway, the first time my GF came to Malaysia via Clark they stopped us (even with the letter of invitation stamped by the Phils Embassy in Malaysia) and interviewed her - and then me - separately and then compared the answers. As everything was in order (and it was clear that we had had a relationship for sometime and I was clearly not a people trafficker) they had to let my GF travel. 

After my GF got exit/entry stamps in her passport the Immigration Officers at Clark just let her through now and she has been back and forth many times.

Her sister has been out to visit us in Malaysia also a couple of times. The first time we did get the letter from the Embassy again and after interviewing her (and her demonstrating that her sister was living in Malaysia with a Malaysian visa) they let her through. Again - after that first trip they did not stop her again once they saw the previous exit/entry stamps in her passport - so it seems as if the Immigration Officers at Clark are primarily targeting first time travelers.

Her mum (my mother-in-law) is coming in Jan and has the Malaysian visa already. She will be travelling with the daughter who has been her 2x so we think there will be no need for the Embassy Invitation letter for the mum as they primarily seem to stop younger girls as part of their anti-trafficking measures. One of my wife's Titas and a Cousin are coming as well and we did get the Invitation Letter for them (just in case). 

Am hoping that there will be no more issues at Clark in the future as the family now has a track record of leaving (and returning) to the Phils with no issues.


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## Nickleback99 (Aug 6, 2011)

CONGRATULATIONS! ...Both on your marriage and the soon to be little one. I agree with Jet on the age thing. Yours is not extreme and it really comes down to the two people involved and compatibility, which sounds like you have that no doubt. My asawa and, like you all in age split and have been together 7 yrs, married 4 yrs...tied knot in PI just 2 days before I headed off to Afghanistan for fun n games. We also just had our first child last month, a boy, and our compatibility has been even more evident through that whole process. It is a life changer, But a wonderful one. You all will be fine...Love knows no boundaries. I tell others just Never forget what made you truly love that other person in the first place and never take him or her for granted. So, enjoy the journey and enjoy every moment. Wishing you two (soon 3) All the Best!...Glad it all worked out.


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## gmarlatt (Dec 22, 2014)

When my wife and I joined Phil Health we where told there is a ninety day waiting period


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## cvgtpc1 (Jul 28, 2012)

ILoveAFilipina said:


> Her mum (my mother-in-law) is coming in Jan and has the Malaysian visa already. She will be travelling with the daughter who has been her 2x so we think there will be no need for the Embassy Invitation letter for the mum as they primarily seem to stop younger girls as part of their anti-trafficking measures. One of my wife's Titas and a Cousin are coming as well and we did get the Invitation Letter for them (just in case).


If getting the invitation letter for everyone why not her mom? Murphy's Law....

If it's easy enough to get that you're getting it for aunts and cousins I'd get one for mom too. In fact mom would be who'd I'd get it for beyond all others!


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## Manitoba (Jun 25, 2014)

My friend you have found what I am looking for.

Does your wife have a sister by any chance?:fingerscrossed: 

Congradulations and best wishes for you and youjr family


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## vagabond54 (Sep 11, 2014)

My fiancé (she's Catholic) says your baby can be baptized out of wedlock, but some priests are very strict and might not be willing. But it is possible. You can give the baby your surname even if not married. I am a USA citizen and it cost me P2250 for my "affidavit for legal capacity to marry," and only took 30 minutes to get it. We had problems with the judge in Mandaue accepting it, but in Cebu City it was no problem. It cost P300 for the judge to marry us. Hope this helps.


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## lkarlovsky (Jan 4, 2013)

gmarlatt said:


> When my wife and I joined Phil Health we where told there is a ninety day waiting period


Like all things here that is confusing. What I think the intention is would be for locals who can pay monthly. They want to see a track record of three payments. I believe all "foreigners" must pay by the year so no problem. But again like most things here it may depend who is manning the desk that day. But do not judge I have gotten the same result in the USA many times at the Customer Service desk. LOL


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

lkarlovsky said:


> Like all things here that is confusing. What I think the intention is would be for locals who can pay monthly. They want to see a track record of three payments. I believe all "foreigners" must pay by the year so no problem. But again like most things here it may depend who is manning the desk that day. But do not judge I have gotten the same result in the USA many times at the Customer Service desk. LOL


It is true on the 90 day waiting period before PhilHealth can be used after joining. No idea why but that's the way it is.
My wife works for the local water company and anytime there is any person signing up for the insurance they must wait the 90 days before it can be used.


Jet Lag


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## esv1226 (Mar 13, 2014)

Re PhilHealth - I used it the day after joining.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

esv1226 said:


> Re PhilHealth - I used it the day after joining.


Unless you are a senior citizen with PhilHealth of your own *under the new law*, it should not be accepted anywhere for the first 90 days of membership or being on anothers membership.


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## pakawala (Sep 10, 2014)

Benefits | PhilHealth

Inpatient Benefits

Availment condition: Member must have at least three (3) months’ premium contributions within the immediate six (6) months prior to the month of availment

Outpatient Benefits

Availment condition: Member must have at least three (3) months’ premium contributions within the immediate six (6) months prior to the month of availment


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

I wrote a long response, regarding my experiences of having a child in Malaysia before marrying the Filipina mother.
Then I read the date of the original post as being in July 2014 and decided that most of what I had written was no longer helpful.
Ooops!


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## esv1226 (Mar 13, 2014)

pakawala said:


> Benefits | PhilHealth
> 
> Inpatient Benefits
> 
> ...


What about those who are not required to pay premiums, seniors?


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

esv1226 said:


> What about those who are not required to pay premiums, seniors?


For Seniors signing up for PhilHealth, there is no waiting period. So if a senior that does not already have the insurance and for example has an emergency trip to the hospital, it is signed up for there and is usable right then and there.


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

Jet Lag said:


> So if a senior that does not already have the insurance and for example has an emergency trip to the hospital, it is signed up for there and is usable right then and there.


as much as there are many gripes about Philippines, there are also few extremely silly laws, which do give a moment of happiness. Above is one example

The other is the Senior Citizen discount in even Jeepneys.

And the other-outlandish but good one - you can get refund for bus tickets, if you miss the bus

It is Fun in the Philippines, true !


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

simonsays said:


> as much as there are many gripes about Philippines, there are also few extremely silly laws, which do give a moment of happiness. Above is one example
> 
> The other is the Senior Citizen discount in even Jeepneys.
> 
> ...


That actually happened to me. I had been on my wife's PhilHealth for years. Went to the hospital several months ago and was admitted. 
This time because I am now 63yrs old, they created a PhilHealth membership for me and used it as normal. Worked just fine--pretty cool I thought.

I'm one of those guys that immerses myself into the local culture and activities to enjoy life. As such, I/we get tired of driving all the time. I love taking the jeepneys anywhere, any time. Even on the hottest days and they cram us in like sardines in a can. 
To me, it's fun and most enjoyable to just be out riding and not have to watch traffic as I drive.
In jeepneys I always ask for and get the senior discount---just for fun.

It truly is (or can be) more fun in the Philippines...


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## cvgtpc1 (Jul 28, 2012)

Jet Lag said:


> In jeepneys I always ask for and get the senior discount---just for fun.


Does that knock it down to P7.50 from P8? lol


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

HondaGuy said:


> Nope. When we went to the QC City Hall, instead of going to the civil registrar, we went to the office where they schedule the "family planning" seminar and talked to the office manager there.
> 
> We explained that since Im over 40 and we already have kids, we didnt think we needed to attend and she agreed, so she waived it for us.
> 
> I should probably type up my entire marriage process and post it separately.


To interject some humor here. At the time my Wife & I got Married, she was 63 & I was 73. She has 4 boys & 1 girl from 20 to 37, I have 2, both in their 50s. She was Widowed some years back, I have been Divorced once & Widowed twice. She had a Hysterectomy about 20 years ago, I had a Vasectomy about 35 years ago. After all this, the Catholic Church required that we attend Family Planning Counseling. Hard to believe they would not grant her a waiver in order to marry me(Non-Catholic).

Fred


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

cvgtpc1 said:


> Does that knock it down to P7.50 from P8? lol


Depends mainly on how far you ride or go-unless it's an express jeepney going non-stop to one place only.
Local corner to corner jeeps such as we usually take I get maybe a 2 or 3 peso discount. Not worth messing with if the driver is busy but what the heck..


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## simonsays (Feb 11, 2009)

fmartin_gila said:


> Hard to believe they would not grant her a waiver in order to marry me(Non-Catholic).
> 
> Fred


Some folks, not just the Philippines Catholic church, derive immense pleasure in imposing meaningless procedures on others, so they can pretend to be worth their pay / time 

I also know of a guy who was asked to attend the financial literacy training, and he just asked the trainer how much the trainer was drawing - the trainer said he gets 20,000 per month, My friend said that's not even one twentieth of his own pay, and asked how the trainer is going to teach the Australian how to manage his money

Silence, then next question, how much is your house worth, reply, 500,000.

The Trainer had said oh, so 500,000 peso .. the Aussie had replied, no, 500,000 A$. Again Silence

You gotta give it to the massive number of government servants, who still insist on following the process, when the situation doesn't fit.


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

simonsays said:


> You gotta give it to the massive number of government servants, who still insist on following the process, when the situation doesn't fit.


That's because some people need to recite the entire alphabet in order to get from A to Z:confused2:.


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Got somewhat of a pleasant surprise yesterday. As previously mentioned, My Asawa and I are well past the age of being considered as Senior's here in the Phils. She has a Senior Card and is automaticly enrolled in the Phil-Health system with no premium to pay. They don't pay a lot, but some is better than none. She recently had a 2 day hospital stay as a result of extreme high blood pressure, and as we discussed this, we decided I should also try to get Phil-Health. We went to the Phil-Health office to find out how to go about doing this. I had previously heard that a Foreigner could be enrolled at some premium. They did enroll me into the system as her dependent and there is no premium to pay. I was really surprised at this development as mostly we foreigners are treated as second class.

Fred


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

fmartin_gila said:


> Got somewhat of a pleasant surprise yesterday. As previously mentioned, My Asawa and I are well past the age of being considered as Senior's here in the Phils. She has a Senior Card and is automaticly enrolled in the Phil-Health system with no premium to pay. They don't pay a lot, but some is better than none. She recently had a 2 day hospital stay as a result of extreme high blood pressure, and as we discussed this, we decided I should also try to get Phil-Health. We went to the Phil-Health office to find out how to go about doing this. I had previously heard that a Foreigner could be enrolled at some premium. They did enroll me into the system as her dependent and there is no premium to pay. I was really surprised at this development as mostly we foreigners are treated as second class.
> 
> Fred


Fred,

Hope your wife is doing and feeling better. That high BP is nothing to fool with.
Yep, that is a good benefit with the insurance. It seems I read or heard somewhere that as a senior on PhilHealth, one can not use the coverage more than once for the same ailment. Nothing would surprise me but it doesn't sound right to me. If you hear anything on this, please post an update.


Jet Lag


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Jet Lag said:


> Fred,
> 
> Hope your wife is doing and feeling better. That high BP is nothing to fool with.
> Yep, that is a good benefit with the insurance. It seems I read or heard somewhere that as a senior on PhilHealth, one can not use the coverage more than once for the same ailment. Nothing would surprise me but it doesn't sound right to me. If you hear anything on this, please post an update.
> ...


She is doing well again now. This same thing happened in the states before we moved here. Severe High Blood Pressure spike for no apparent reason. While living there, we carried no insurance, and her hospital stay cost me a bit over USD 15,000. Here, with the Phil-health and the Senior Discount kicked in, the PHP 17,000 bill became a bit less than PHP 7,000 = Approx $160(including the Doctor's charges and Medication charges). Can't complain about that, and I gladly paid that amount. As far as covering the same ailment, I guess we will eventually find out as that seems to be her only problem and may happen again. In actuality, I have absolutely no medical problems and take no medications for anything, but we felt that it would facilitate things if/when I ever have to have some medical attention. As we found out on her being admitted to the Hospital, with the Phil-Health coverage, there was no demand for advance payment that I have heard about and was prepared with cash in hand. They required no payment until I checked her out and they computed the final tally.

Fred


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

fmartin_gila said:


> She is doing well again now. This same thing happened in the states before we moved here. Severe High Blood Pressure spike for no apparent reason. While living there, we carried no insurance, and her hospital stay cost me a bit over USD 15,000. Here, with the Phil-health and the Senior Discount kicked in, the PHP 17,000 bill became a bit less than PHP 7,000 = Approx $160(including the Doctor's charges and Medication charges). Can't complain about that, and I gladly paid that amount. As far as covering the same ailment, I guess we will eventually find out as that seems to be her only problem and may happen again. In actuality, I have absolutely no medical problems and take no medications for anything, but we felt that it would facilitate things if/when I ever have to have some medical attention. As we found out on her being admitted to the Hospital, with the Phil-Health coverage, there was no demand for advance payment that I have heard about and was prepared with cash in hand. They required no payment until I checked her out and they computed the final tally.
> 
> Fred


It's good that you were able to get it taken care of for her and glad she's doing okay. That discount really helps on top of living here where things are lower cost to begin with.

Yea, most of the hospitals are following the law now and will treat people without the demand for payment. Many do require an amount to be paid by the end of the first 24 hours and for here that is understandable.
Hope all goes well not and no further need for doctors.



Jet..


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## esv1226 (Mar 13, 2014)

Re Phil Health - We are seniors; I am the member and my husband is the dependent. We used PhilHealth twice in the same month for the same health problem. He does not have a Senior's Card, so we did not avail of the discount for seniors. No complaints!


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

esv1226 said:


> Re Phil Health - We are seniors; I am the member and my husband is the dependent. We used PhilHealth twice in the same month for the same health problem. He does not have a Senior's Card, so we did not avail of the discount for seniors. No complaints!


Thank You. Good to know it won't be restricted. Kind of strange for me to be listed as a dependent, but as long a it works it's Cige with me. I understand that I will not receive the Senior Discount and am fine with that, my main concern was to facilitate my treatment if ever needed.

Fred


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## Asian Spirit (Mar 1, 2010)

fmartin_gila said:


> Thank You. Good to know it won't be restricted. Kind of strange for me to be listed as a dependent, but as long a it works it's Cige with me. I understand that I will not receive the Senior Discount and am fine with that, my main concern was to facilitate my treatment if ever needed.
> 
> Fred


Fred, you might be surprised if or when you are an in patient at the hospital. They automatically give me the senior discount. Every penny counts so works good.


Jet


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## fmartin_gila (May 15, 2011)

Jet Lag said:


> Fred, you might be surprised if or when you are an in patient at the hospital. They automatically give me the senior discount. Every penny counts so works good.
> 
> 
> Jet


Yeah, that 20% could add up to quite a bit. At least at this point, I am not planning to find out.

Fred


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## ILoveAFilipina (Dec 21, 2012)

EuroBob said:


> I wrote a long response, regarding my experiences of having a child in Malaysia before marrying the Filipina mother.
> Then I read the date of the original post as being in July 2014 and decided that most of what I had written was no longer helpful.
> Ooops!


It is the thought that counts 

Anyway, a few things I wanted to update.

My little one is now five and a half months old - and extremely 'pogi'. He has already started crawling around and even started making 'mamamama' sounds when he is trying to attract mum's attention - so I think I have a little half-Filipino Einstein on my hands (or maybe just proud-daddy goggles on my eyes).

We opted for an Irish passport first (I am dual nationality) which took about 4 months to sort out because I needed all sorts of documents demonstrating that both my parents (now deceased) were born there (as I was born in the UK).

The passport eventually came and then we started the process of getting his dependent visa in Malaysia - as he (which also meant we) could not leave the country without it. 

Apparently some other expats who had their kids in Malaysia didn't know this requirement and then got stopped at the airport by Malaysian immigration demanding the baby's 'entry' visa - I guess no one could stamp it in the maternity ward  Anyway, that bureaucratic obstacle was also overcome this week.

Now that we can actually leave Malaysia as a family we are planning to go to the Phils in the next few weeks for a Christening.

After doing some reading online it seems some parishes have various requirements that including pre-Christening seminars, baptism certificates and proof that you are actively practicing. Like my mahal I am Catholic - but pretty much lapsed and she is not very observant either. My Filipino family assure me that the requirements differ from parish to parish and that some are not so 'strict' on the requirements - but was wondering what your own experiences of Christening in the Phils are?

I have been informed that we need a lot of God Parents (I only had two) and get the impression that an entourage of God Parents is a common practice in the Phils? Is that correct?

Changing the subject completely I see some discussion on PhilHealth and wanted to share a little experience we had. My wife has been a Phil Health member for around a year. However, we had the baby in Malaysia in a private hospital. Despite my scepticism my wife (through her family back home) made an application for some repayment for our hospital expenses here - and PhilHealth have apparently approved at least some of it. They haven't told us what they will pay yet and we have had to jump through a number of hoops to get to this point in the first place but I was still pleasantly surprised that we would qualify for anything at all.


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## JimnNila143 (Jul 23, 2013)

*Ninong/ninang*



ILoveAFilipina said:


> It is the thought that counts
> 
> Anyway, a few things I wanted to update.
> 
> ...


Having a Christening is a very joyful thing and I do believe the number of Ninongs and Ninangs can vary from parish to parish. It would be best to talk with the Priest at the church where you plan to have the event. The Christening ceremony should be relatively inexpensive, but the reception cost will depend on number of guests to attend, food costs, rental of videoke machine, etc., and how long the reception will last in time. In a lot of cases, the women usually prepare the food and your wife will know about that. It is Philippine tradition to have a lot of God Parents, same as in a Philippine church wedding, which can have up to 11 sets of them. By the way, congrats on your wedding and the birth of your son. We wish you much joy and blessings.


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

HondaGuy said:


> Just to clarify a little, with regards to the 10 day waiting period, I believe people are referring to the minimum time required from when you apply for the marriage license and when you can actually have the ceremony performed.
> 
> I dont think anybody is going to look at stamps in your passport to make sure you've been in the country for 10 days before they perform the wedding.
> 
> I applied for my marriage license this past May, then immediately flew back to Bahrain, flew back a month later and got married 5-6 days after entering the country.


It is required that you be in the Philippines for 10 days before you marry. 
I think you just slipped thru the system. 
So, apparently they did not look at your passport stamps, as you said, but if they had, I think you would suffered a delay in your wedding plans.


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

(side note)I presume that the baby's mother has already been through her CFO course, but if not, she needs to attend.

You have to have a civil wedding before you can have a church wedding.
I believe the civil wedding fee is around 250 pesos. It is less than 1000 pesos.

In regards to births in the Philippines, the child can have your last name, even if you are not married, as long as you sign forms to claim the child when registering the child's birth with the Philippine government. 

In Malaysia, if you are not married, the child can also still receive your last name, but the birth certificate will indicate that the child is illegitimate.

The child will need a passport to travel. 
So if the child is born in the Philippines, I suggest you begin as soon as possible after the birth to get the passport.

Does the order of which passport you get first matter to the UK? 
Do you need to get the UK passport and then get the Philippine passport? 
The order is not considered an issue when dealing with the U.S..

There is not a legal requirement for the child to be baptized before receiving documents which allow the child to travel.
But as a Catholic, I am sure you understand that love ones may have strong feelings on this matter.

If you are in Kuala Lumpur, all the ingredients can be found for making for Dinuguan. 
The pork can found several places (grocery stores), but the blood needs to be obtained at a wet market, such as Pudu Market.
You should also know about the mall which is run by Filipinos. 
The mall is located near Chinatown and is named "Kota Raya".
It has a Filipino dry goods grocery store.
The mall contains a shipping agency which can be of assistance when shipping items to the Philippines.
Haircuts there can be found for 10 RM.

Baby strollers and equipment is expensive in Malaysia, so check the prices and consider buying them in the Philippines.


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

EuroBob said:


> (side note)I presume that the baby's mother has already been through her CFO course, but if not, she needs to attend.
> 
> You have to have a civil wedding before you can have a church wedding.
> I believe the civil wedding fee is around 250 pesos. It is less than 1000 pesos.
> ...


DOHH!!!! 
I should have read the end of the thread before I responded.
Oh well, I hope the information about Kuala Lumpur can be of some help.


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## HondaGuy (Aug 6, 2012)

EuroBob said:


> It is required that you be in the Philippines for 10 days before you marry.
> I think you just slipped thru the system.
> So, apparently they did not look at your passport stamps, as you said, but if they had, I think you would suffered a delay in your wedding plans.


I know most people will be staying in the Philippines during the 10 day waiting period but I dont think there is a specific requirement that the foreigner be there for those 10 days. Do you have a link showing that requirement?

The US Embassy website says: "Philippine law prescribes a ten-day waiting period from the filing of the application to the issuance of the marriage license." It doesnt say you have to actually be there for the 10 days.

I specifically asked both the pastor performing our ceremony and the Civil Registrar office at the Quezon City Hall before we got applied for our marriage license and they both said we only had to wait the 10 days for the marriage license. I explained to both that I would be going back to Bahrain and returning just before the ceremony and they said it would not be a problem.

Could it be a requirement? Sure, but I never found a link specifically saying the foreigner had to be in the Philippines for 10 days before getting married. If you have a link, Im sure it would help the other foreigners who are thinking of getting married in the Philippines.


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

EuroBob said:


> (side note)I presume that the baby's mother has already been through her CFO course, but if not, she needs to attend.
> 
> You have to have a civil wedding before you can have a church wedding.
> I believe the civil wedding fee is around 250 pesos. It is less than 1000 pesos.
> ...


"Need to have a civil wedding before yiu have a church wedding"

Where did that one come from. Is it a new requirement. Definitely wasn't a requirement when I had my church wedding, it was a while ago though.


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

HondaGuy said:


> I know most people will be staying in the Philippines during the 10 day waiting period but I dont think there is a specific requirement that the foreigner be there for those 10 days. Do you have a link showing that requirement?
> 
> The US Embassy website says: "Philippine law prescribes a ten-day waiting period from the filing of the application to the issuance of the marriage license." It doesnt say you have to actually be there for the 10 days.
> 
> ...


?? I do not have anything to cite.
You do have information from an authority.
I apparently just believed this without checking it out.
I concede the point.
My mistake.


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

Gary D said:


> "Need to have a civil wedding before yiu have a church wedding"
> 
> Where did that one come from. Is it a new requirement. Definitely wasn't a requirement when I had my church wedding, it was a while ago though.


Grin- uhhhh --- my wife.....isn't that authority enough ?
;-) I will have to search to see if she is correct.
But, in support of this belief when my wife and I were registering to get married by the Catholic priest, the secretary did ask for our civil marriage certificate.

The following link supports your position, not mine.
http://purplelue.com/how-to-list/catholic-church-wedding-requirements/


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

EuroBob said:


> Grin- uhhhh --- my wife.....isn't that authority enough ?
> ;-) I will have to search to see if she is correct.
> But, in support of this belief when my wife and I were registering to get married by the Catholic priest, the secretary did ask for our civil marriage certificate.
> 
> ...


Here is another good cite, but it also supports the point that one may have a License to Marry before having a church wedding or you can be married by civil authorities before being married by the church.
How to Get Married in the Philippines - An Ultimate Guide


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## Gary D (Oct 28, 2013)

EuroBob said:


> Here is another good cite, but it also supports the point that one may have a License to Marry before having a church wedding or you can be married by civil authorities before being married by the church.
> How to Get Married in the Philippines - An Ultimate Guide


The licence to marry is what you get after the 10 waiting period. Once you have that you can then go and get married, after which you get the marriage license.


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## JimnNila143 (Jul 23, 2013)

*Marriage ceremonies.*

As much as Nila and I want a traditional church wedding we will have to be satisfied with our civil wedding ceremony. And as long s the Philippines and the USA accepts this we are OK. Looking at my condition, I would be looking like Jabba the Hutt or Buddha and Nila would be fantastic in her $1,500 gown.


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## HondaGuy (Aug 6, 2012)

Eurobob, no problem! I wasnt trying to poke you in the eye; I thought maybe you had read something somewhere that addressed the topic and I didn't want to give out bad information.


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## esv1226 (Mar 13, 2014)

EuroBob said:


> (side note)
> 
> You have to have a civil wedding before you can have a church wedding.
> I believe the civil wedding fee is around 250 pesos. It is less than 1000 pesos.


Is this something new? Aren't the Catholic priests/pastors licensed to perform weddings? Now I am confused.


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## bidrod (Mar 31, 2015)

You do not need a Civil Wedding first. You need to get your marriage license first then you can get a Civil Ceremony or Church Ceremony or both. After the wedding in our case about 2 weeks we received the Wedding Certificate from NSO.


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## EuroBob (Feb 23, 2015)

HondaGuy said:


> Eurobob, no problem! I wasnt trying to poke you in the eye; I thought maybe you had read something somewhere that addressed the topic and I didn't want to give out bad information.


No worries. 
If anything, I "poked myself in the eye" by giving incorrect information.
(I am only annoyed with myself.)

I think it is good for this site that people/members asked me to clarify or cite a reference for my information because by doing so we were able to identify the mistaken information and make sure the site was providing better quality advice.


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