# Question about highway safety for a single woman



## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

I'm not going to be moving to Mexico as originally planned, but I am going to be living in my camper van in the U.S. I know that's probably not safe to do in Mexico, but I still want to visit.

How safe is it for a woman alone to drive from the U.S. (Texas) to Guadalajara? I'd be planning my trip in advance, obviously, and would be staying at hotels along the way. I'd like to use Guadalajara as a base to find a place to rent somewhere outside the city for a few months and travel around the area. 

I read that the federal highways (cuoto) are safe enough, although expensive because of tolls, but I'd like to know how safe it would be to go off the main highways to smaller villages as a tourist. 

I know all about how to register my car, but would also like to know about what happens to tourists in case of an accident, and how to handle possible breakdowns.

TIA


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

DebInFL said:


> I read that the federal highways (cuoto) are safe enough, although expensive because of tolls, but I'd like to know how safe it would be to go off the main highways to smaller villages as a tourist.
> 
> TIA


I will be doing a drive similar to what you described, but coming down the west coast (entering Mexico from Arizona, then driving along the Pacific coast). Let me share some of my research outcomes:

1) Check this link out. It lists warnings, by Mexico state, of what is dangerous. I recommend you figure out what states you plan to drive in, and see what the warnings are. Now some say the US Department of State goes too far in an attempt to scare people. What I believe is they are not making up the fact that there are some very dangerous areas. 

https://travel.state.gov/content/passports/en/alertswarnings/mexico-travel-warning.html

2) Going off the main roads, except in states where there are absolutely no warnings, is not something I will do. Your nice American car is a bulls eye to criminals. But everybody has to make their own decision. I'll also say this ... if you've visited one Mexican town of just a few thousand people, with no expat presence, you've visited them all. Unless there is an ocean or large lake nearby, they are all about the same.

3) It is important to know many lesser traveled roads in Mexico are very poorly maintained. So if you do venture off a main road, in addition to the possibility of criminals, you might encounter potholes etc that could damage your vehicle.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

I have driven all over Mexico, gotten off the cuotas and visited small towns etc. and not had any problems.

That said, I wouldn't suggest doing any of that on a first visit. I had spent long periods of time in Mexico before I moved here and started doing road trips. I also speak fluent Spanish and was travelling with my wife, who is Mexican.

I would stay on the cuotas for driving from place to place. Guadalajara is only a two day trip from the Texas border so you will only need one night in a hotel to get there. Once you get to Gdl., you could take some side trips in the daytime to neighboring towns. I don't completely agree with UrbanMan that all Mexican pueblos are the same (the people in each town are quite unique if you sit and talk to them), but there is some truth to what he says.

What all places did you want to explore?


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

I can tell you my experiences. Other's judgement of risk may be different than mine.

I have spent lots of time on back roads in Mexico, both the "Libres" that are major highways, and on smaller mountain roads. Some of my trips have been with a friend in an old beatup pickup (with US plates however). The rest have been alone on my Mexico plated motorcycle. Sometimes the smaller roads are not well maintained. I once traveled one section of a major highway in Sonora or Chihuahua that was so filled with potholes that I could barely avoid them in a two-wheeled vehicle. I think they would have been impossible to avoid in a car or RV. However, the upside is that you get to see some beautiful country that is mostly avoided by the cuotas. Regarding the Texas-Guadalajara route. I just did this last month. Going north I took the cuota Gdl-Aguascalientes-Zacatecas-Saltillo-Monterrey-Nuevo Laredo etc. Coming home the last day, I went directly from Zacatecas to Guadalajara on the old Highway 54. It is a beautiful ride. There are a couple of small towns and, of course, some topes, but the road is in good condition. On this same route a few years ago, we had to stop once and wait because a truck overloaded with flattened plastic bottles had overturned on one of the curves and was blocking the road.

If your goal is to get somewhere in a hurry and minimize risk then the cuotas are the best way to accomplish it. But there are a lot of interesting roads and places off the cuotas.


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## perropedorro (Mar 19, 2016)

DebInFL said:


> I read that the federal highways (cuoto) are safe enough, although expensive because of tolls, but I'd like to know how safe it would be to go off the main highways to smaller villages as a tourist.


I drive from Guadalajara to Nogales or Mexicali often and usually take the libre for the southern half of that trip, up to Mochis or so. Not at night, certainly, and it takes longer but the savings from avoidance of the cuota pays two or three more nights in a decent hotel. Just be aware and pay attention to the traffic. You find yourself behind a truck moving at a good pace or a group of cars that have "regular" people in them, travel with the pack. Always plan to be somewhere safe by sundown. Three months ago, I failed to do so, foiled by slow traffic, roadwork, and hotels with no vacancy-- so I decided to get a big cup of coffee and drive through the night the entire length of Sinaloa on the cuota as if I were on a U.S. interstate and 25 years old again. Mistake. Despite the exhorbitant toll, there's very poor lighting. Around 11 pm traffic started to dwindle as I got past Mazatlán, then nearly disappear two hours later as one skirts around Culiacán. North there's a 120 km stretch through the heart of Chapo country with nothing alongside the cuota except for one Pemex/Oxxo where the Federales patrolled and declared a Zona Segura. Dozens of bigrigs were parked in the relative safety, waiting for daybreak. I joined them, letting my pulse return to normal.


> I know all about how to register my car, but would also like to know about what happens to tourists in case of an accident, and how to handle possible breakdowns.


 What happens in case of an accident depends on whether you have Mexican insurance. Like in the U.S., a paint-scraper might not be worth the trouble, but if it's more serious and a cop arrives show him the policy and call your insurer. In the unfortunate circumstance that you *don't* have insurance, you'll be detained until the accident is thoroughly investigated. Even if the evidence is rather obvious that you're not at fault, let's say you get hit by a drunk going the wrong way making an illegal turn on a red light, it'll still be investigated.... unless the cop happens to be your _compadre_, which is unlikely if you're a tourist, but may well be the case for the local good ol' boy that hit you. Get insurance.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

In the States we had a GPS/Nav system (and side imaging sonar ) on our open fisherman but never had a car with a Nav system. In Mexico we make a lot of use of the Here app on our android phone. We pre-downloaded the entire map of Mexico (all free) - so we can use it off-line - and for the most part we have had nothing but success - and we have traveled to some very out of the way places (on unimproved roads).

The one and only time we left Texas for destinations South we stayed on the Cuotas and made a left at San Luis Potosi rather than a right. I think we were stopped perhaps three times by the Federales along the way. I mention it because we never had an ounce of trouble from them - they were just trying to be helpful - but it can be a little intimidating...


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

TundraGreen said:


> I can tell you my experiences. Other's judgement of risk may be different than mine.
> 
> I have spent lots of time on back roads in Mexico, both the "Libres" that are major highways, and on smaller mountain roads. Some of my trips have been with a friend in an old beatup pickup (with US plates however). The rest have been alone on my Mexico plated motorcycle. Sometimes the smaller roads are not well maintained. I once traveled one section of a major highway in Sonora or Chihuahua that was so filled with potholes that I could barely avoid them in a two-wheeled vehicle. I think they would have been impossible to avoid in a car or RV. However, the upside is that you get to see some beautiful country that is mostly avoided by the cuotas. Regarding the Texas-Guadalajara route. I just did this last month. Going north I took the cuota Gdl-Aguascalientes-Zacatecas-Saltillo-Monterrey-Nuevo Laredo etc. Coming home the last day, I went directly from Zacatecas to Guadalajara on the old Highway 54. It is a beautiful ride. There are a couple of small towns and, of course, some topes, but the road is in good condition. On this same route a few years ago, we had to stop once and wait because a truck overloaded with flattened plastic bottles had overturned on one of the curves and was blocking the road.
> 
> If your goal is to get somewhere in a hurry and minimize risk then the cuotas are the best way to accomplish it. But there are a lot of interesting roads and places off the cuotas.


Would you recommend that a woman traveling alone get off the cuotas from time to time explore the country on her own?


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

Regarding insurance - when we left the States (for good) we had AAA auto insurance and we purchased a Mexican auto policy from them (under-written by GNP I believe). We did that before leaving home. I think a 365 day policy was just a little more than a 30 day policy - but there was no such thing as a refund for unused time.

In the States we were always members of AAA - and it came in handy from time to time. Mexico has a similar 'club' - I believe it is called AMA and it is very affordable. We had it the first year we were here. Since then that sort of benefit is incorporated into our Mexican AXA auto insurance.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

Isla Verde said:


> Would you recommend that a woman traveling alone get off the cuotas from time to time explore the country on her own?


At _some_ point a woman travelling alone is going to _have_ to get off the cuota.

Edit : actually - as a 6'2" 210 lb male I am actually more comfortable, by myself, in remote rural areas than in some barrios in some of the cities we have visited.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

Isla Verde said:


> Would you recommend that a woman traveling alone get off the cuotas from time to time explore the country on her own?


I try to refrain from telling women, or anyone else for that matter, what they should do. I have not lived in their shoes. I don't know what makes them uncomfortable.

All, I can say is that I have spent lots of time in rural Mexico, driving, riding, walking and hitchhiking, and I have never been in a situation where anything threatening happened.



> actually - as a 6'2" 210 lb male I am actually more comfortable, by myself, in remote rural areas than in some barrios in some of the cities we have visited.


Edit: I am a grey-haired, 5'10", 135 pound male. I don't intimidate anyone.


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## Meritorious-MasoMenos (Apr 17, 2014)

Most Mexicans are gracious and warm and will go well out of their way to assist foreigners ,,, however, foreigners traveling alone off highways have run into dangerous situations when they stumble into drug gangs whose first reaction is to eliminate anyone suspicious. I believe that's what happened to that young man who was trying to motorcycle from NYC to World Cup in Brazil in 2014 and got killed in northern Mexico.

Mexican gang members who watch too many movies (And as we saw with El Chapo, Hollywood does influence their actions, even dreams) who see a swashbuckling American (as this kid apparently was. I applaud him for living an adventurous life.) come roaring into a drug zone on a power bike would automatically be suspicious of a DEA cowboy agent, though DEA usually employs Mexican Americans for underground assignments. Even that is dangerous, "Kiki" Camarena in 1985. I believe that was same year two young American tourists innocently wandered into a Guadalajara bar that was unofficial headquarters for one of the drug lords that ordered Camarena tortured and killed. They were dragged from the bar and killed "just to be safe."

A single American woman PROBABLY wouldn't be suspected, though that Mexican actress who took Sean Penn in to interview El Chapo did make her name, and win El Chappo's affection, by starring as a sympathetic female drug boss in a popular telenovela. So, who knows. 

Do your research. Open drug war underway now in Mazatlan and surrounding region, with 19 drug gunmen allegedly killed in running gun battle that started on streets of tourist center Mazatlan -- though I'm always slightly suspicious of alleged huge gun battles when dozens of bad guys die without a cop or soldier getting a pinky scraped, (well, five wounded tho non critical).

19 killed in clashes near city of Mazatlan, Mexico - LA Times

Travel in day time in non-drug zones should be okay.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

I travel alone on highways a lot , I think it is pretty safe but you can run into situation like breaking down and I would not want to be alone on the side of the road waiting for help especially if I did not speak Spanish.

I only felt in danger one in the last 17 years and it was in a place I am familiar with , not on a highway..


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## sunnyvmx (Mar 14, 2010)

I have traveled many many miles in Mexico. By motorcycle with a small group, in a large motorhome with husband and in a small camper by myself. I've run out of gas and broke down several times, but was always helped by caring people and sent on my way. By far the best trip was by bus through central Mexico for 18 days stopping in cities and staying in hostels. The bus drivers and taxis never got lost and I could afford private rooms in the hostels with all their amenities and interesting people. They were located in the historic downtowns for easy exploring and wonderful restaurants. I got on the city buses and just rode or took inexpensive day tours when I wasn't walking around.

The best part was being able to enjoy the passing scenery while riding in the comfort and security of the luxury busses. I arrived rested and eager to explore instead of exhausted both physically and mentally. I now prefer to travel with tour companies, but I wouldn't hesitate to again get on a bus and see Mexico.


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## GARYJ65 (Feb 9, 2013)

My 5 cents
Don't drive at night
Have fun
Send me a PM, I give you my phone number and if you have some issue (e.g.. policemen) you have someone who can help


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

GARYJ65 said:


> My 5 cents
> Don't drive at night
> Have fun
> Send me a PM, I give you my phone number and if you have some issue (e.g.. policemen) you have someone who can help


Good advice. We have the number for the US Embassy, a lawyer and some friends in the glove compartment. I also believe our auto insurance provides some sort of legal assistance.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

I haven't seen anyone mention the Green Angels (Angeles Verdes) yet in this thread. They provide emergency road service and can be reached by dialing 078. Has anyone used them?

Ángeles Verdes: atención al turista en México | Secretaría de Turismo | Gobierno | gob.mx (In Spanish)


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Yes we have used the Green Angels twice... When using a cuota always keep the receipts , once our car got damaged by a piece of metal a truck had dropped and the CAPUFE insurrance paid for the repairs, meanwhile we waited for the green angels and the insurrance agents for several hours in the boiling sun .. We were in the middle of nowhere about anhour and a half from Minamitlan and the adjuster´s car broke down.. It was a good thing it was not at night... frankly I do not know what we would have done if we could not speak Spanish or if it had been at night.. 
That time we called the Green Angels who took for ever to come, another time they just stopped to help. They are great guys but both time they did not speak English.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Yes always take the legal aid part of the insurrance. We have AXA and legal aid... be aware that the lawyers work for the insurrance company and not for you. After I had to use the lawyers I found out that the lawyers they use on accidents are not the brightest and at least the one we deal with have terrible manners...Ours did not introduce himself to s when I went to jail, did not communicate with me or my husband unless we called him, did not keep his appointments , did not call back.. it was the worst I met.. I called our agent to tell him that the lawyer was the worst I had encountered, I was told that those lawyers are not the brightest and that is an understatement..
If you are in an accident where someone is hurt be aware that all the drivers go to jail until the Ministerio Publico figures it out. The law is that you have to be available to the MP for 3 days as they are doing their investigation. I was told that because of the Reform many MP take it that you have to be detained up to 3 days so you can be easily contacted it used to be you could post bail but no more according to my last experience... meanwhile you are in a filthy jail with unsavory characters, some one has to bring you food , there is a toilet in the cell that you share with others, no privacy and so on it is a nasty experience. 
I am a naturalized Mexican citizen so I could not call the French consulte so I do not know if they could have gotten me released but it is nasty..
Have your agent´s name, your insurrance company ´s name , a friend´s phone number who can help you .. I was travelling with an indigenous friend who was illiterate but had the good sense to call a very good friend who came out an help.. I do not know what I woud have done if I had been alone.. You have the right to call from the MP ..but my husband was not around and then after they took me to the cell I asked to make a phone call and that was not allowed although the MP told me it was my right to call someone...ince you get in the gulag all bets are off..

I second Gary , do not drive at night or close to dusk in a place where you could be stranded.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

GARYJ65 said:


> My 5 cents
> Don't drive at night
> Have fun
> Send me a PM, I give you my phone number and if you have some issue (e.g.. policemen) you have someone who can help


Good advice, Gary, along with a generous offer to a forum member! ¡Eres buena gente!


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

horseshoe846 said:


> Regarding insurance - when we left the States (for good) we had AAA auto insurance and we purchased a Mexican auto policy from them (under-written by GNP I believe). We did that before leaving home. I think a 365 day policy was just a little more than a 30 day policy - but there was no such thing as a refund for unused time.
> 
> In the States we were always members of AAA - and it came in handy from time to time. Mexico has a similar 'club' - I believe it is called AMA and it is very affordable. We had it the first year we were here. Since then that sort of benefit is incorporated into our Mexican AXA auto insurance.


I'm surprised to hear that a Mexico auto policy would be offfered by AAA. Does anyone know if it is common for US-based insurers to offer Mexican auto insurance? 

Does anyone currently have a Mexico auto policy issued by a US-based insurer? 

I'd appreciate recommendations and insights, as I will have to buy a policy a couple of months from now. I was thinking I'd have to buy a quickie online policy at a rather high price - maybe there is a better way?


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

UrbanMan said:


> I'm surprised to hear that a Mexico auto policy would be offfered by AAA. Does anyone know if it is common for US-based insurers to offer Mexican auto insurance?
> 
> Does anyone currently have a Mexico auto policy issued by a US-based insurer?
> 
> I'd appreciate recommendations and insights, as I will have to buy a policy a couple of months from now. I was thinking I'd have to buy a quickie online policy at a rather high price - maybe there is a better way?


Buying a Mexican policy is very easy. I would always call the day before I entered Mexico (sometimes even the same day) and would get a short term policy that took effect that day I entered Mexico.

I used ANA through San Xavier Insurance and just called them when I needed a short term policy (at first I was travelling back and forth and spending quite a bit of time on the US). Once I was living here full-time, I just paid by the year for an annual policy. It was easy and fast and all done over telephone and/or internet. Their pricing was quite competitive with other quotes I got.

I never had to make a claim (**sound of knocking on wood**) so I can't comment as to their handling of claims but everything else was professional and efficient.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

As I recall - there is a firm distinction between a Mexican auto insurance policy written for a 'tourist' and that written for a 'resident'. I believe the tourist policy is voided when you are no longer a tourist. (But it has been a while...)


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

horseshoe846 said:


> As I recall - there is a firm distinction between a Mexican auto insurance policy written for a 'tourist' and that written for a 'resident'. I believe the tourist policy is voided when you are no longer a tourist. (But it has been a while...)


That was not the case for me. I changed from FMM to RT and it didn't affect my insurance in any way -- because it was the same TIP I was still using.

Now, I am sure there are huge differences between policies for cars on a TIP and Mexican cars.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

circle110 said:


> That was not the case for me. I changed from FMM to RT and it didn't affect my insurance in any way -- because it was the same TIP I was still using.
> 
> Now, I am sure there are huge differences between policies for cars on a TIP and Mexican cars.


Hmm - when I picked up the phone and purchased Mexican insurance in Florida (which I had to do because the web interface did not allow for more than one driver) - well before ever getting in the car and heading to Mexico - I had no TIP (yet). 

I don't doubt what you are saying but if someone purchases a policy in the US (in our case from GNP) they might want to raise the question (to be safe).


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

horseshoe846 said:


> Hmm - when I picked up the phone and purchased Mexican insurance in Florida (which I had to do because the web interface did not allow for more than one driver) - well before ever getting in the car and heading to Mexico - I had no TIP (yet).


That's kind of my point - your residency status doesn't matter to the insurer as long as it is a US car. Changing from one status to another is irrelevant to them. I did the same thing.



horseshoe846 said:


> I don't doubt what you are saying but if someone purchases a policy in the US (in our case from GNP) they might want to raise the question (to be safe).


Agreed. Always better to ask and be sure.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

Re: auto insurance, one thing I need to be sure of is that my insurer not demand that I keep my USA registration current. Once in MX, my car is not going to see the USA for awhile, maybe never (it runs very well, but its already over 10 years old, I'm realistic). Where I live the county registration is rather pricey, as they have piled on all sorts of extra fees to pay for large scale transportation improvements ... I don't feel at all obligated to pay for these given I'll be residing in MX.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

Technically your car should be registered - for both your TIP and insurance. Will they catch you if your registration lapses? Probably not, but...

What I did was register my car in Clay County, South Dakota. It's easy, pretty cheap, no emissions tests and keeps you legit. They don't require that you live there - not even that have ever set foot in South Dakota. Lots and lots of expats do this in good ole' Clay County.

I have heard that now all counties in SD are doing this, but Clay County has been doing it for a long time and they are really nice and have it down to a science.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

UrbanMan said:


> Re: auto insurance, one thing I need to be sure of is that my insurer not demand that I keep my USA registration current. Once in MX, my car is not going to see the USA for awhile, maybe never (it runs very well, but its already over 10 years old, I'm realistic). Where I live the county registration is rather pricey, as they have piled on all sorts of extra fees to pay for large scale transportation improvements ... I don't feel at all obligated to pay for these given I'll be residing in MX.


We are an oddity in that we nationalized our US car in Mexico - yes it was not cheap. It was over 10 years old at that time and it is still a great car and has many years left. We never renewed our TIP - in fact we lost the deposit during the import process. But - I think the real answer to your questions has to do with TIP renewal. If you search on "my registration (we have" you will find a comment from Jan. 2016 where they were required to present a valid registration to renew their TIP. But there must be a lot of people here who have renewed their TIPs on this forum and I'm sure they will speak up.

While I think about it - we came from a US state which had no vehicle inspections which caused us issues in Mexico who would only inspect a car with Mexican plates and in order to get Mexican plates we needed an inspection. Maybe consider having your car inspected before bringing it into Mexico. I _think_ you can have any car inspected in Texas.

Finally - in Mexico we live in a state where vehicle inspection is mandatory. I would find it hard to believe they would allow a US car to drive around for 4 years with a TIP on the windshield and forego inspections. Just a thought - I have no idea.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

circle110 said:


> Technically your car should be registered - for both your TIP and insurance. Will they catch you if your registration lapses? Probably not, but...
> 
> What I did was register my car in Clay County, South Dakota. It's easy, pretty cheap, no emissions tests and keeps you legit. They don't require that you live there - not even that have ever set foot in South Dakota. Lots and lots of expats do this in good ole' Clay County.
> 
> I have heard that now all counties in SD are doing this, but Clay County has been doing it for a long time and they are really nice and have it down to a science.


So in Mexico your car has SD plates ? Did you get those while still in the US or did you set that all up from Mexico ? I don't see many US plated cars here - perhaps a couple a year - but I have never seen one from SD - although I have read others who have done what you did.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

horseshow846 said:


> we nationalized our US car in Mexico - yes it was not cheap


My car was built in Japan (serial number indicates this), so unless there is a dramatic change in regulations, importing will never be an option.



horseshoe846 said:


> If you search on "my registration (we have" you will find a comment from Jan. 2016 where they were required to present a valid registration to renew their TIP.


This is different than what I have read in many places ... namely, that TIP follows your RT status. In other words, you renew your RT status, TIP is considered extended. You just have to notify Aduana to protect your deposit. If anyone feels this is wrong, please post! 

The rules changed in November 2014 or thereabouts (what I have read on the net), so whatever experiences people had before this date are not necessarily good as examples to follow now.


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## RVGRINGO (May 16, 2007)

You can telephone the Clay County, SD Treasurer and give them the details on your car. They will give you a quote and tell you what documents to send. You will need a US address and SS#. We did it from Mexico many years ago & they are very nice folks to deal with. New plates arrive quickly, with the new title taking a couple of weeks longer. It might be easier to do while still in the USA. We renewed for many years, until we moved back to the USA and traded cars.

Yes. Any car in Mexico on an Importada Temporal MUST be registered and *legal to drive in its home jurisdiction*. You will find that language in the state transit regulations, if you care to read through hundreds of pages of Spanish. It is also true that failure to have current registration and/or a current renewed importation document will void most insurance policies. Check your fine pring, if you doubt it. Whenever you renew or change your immigration status, you must notify Aduana and request, in writing, extension of your Importada Temporal to match your new document. The Catch-22 is the timing of this requirement is often exceeded by the time it takes for the INM Tramite and issuance of a new visa card. It can be managed, but it is not easy & you may need help. I suggest Chapala Law for that process.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

RVGRINGO said:


> Whenever you renew or change your immigration status, you must notify Aduana and request, in writing, extension of your Importada Temporal to match your new document. The Catch-22 is the timing of this requirement is often exceeded by the time it takes for the INM Tramite and issuance of a new visa card. It can be managed, but it is not easy & you may need help.


We came in on a 30 day TIP and it took us perhaps 2-3 months to wrap things up at INM. On day 29 we walked into the local Aduana office (which was empty but for employees), explained our situation and they issued us an extension on the spot. (My wife's Spanish is very good).


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

RVGRINGO said:


> Yes. Any car in Mexico on an Importada Temporal MUST be registered and *legal to drive in its home jurisdiction*.


I have heard this is true for driving in the Baja Peninsula (no TIP), but your the first person who has ever said this is true elsewhere in MX. Now maybe it is an obscure rule buried deep in the regs that no MX authorities ever care to enforce?

I am interested to hear other viewpoints.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

horseshoe846 said:


> So in Mexico your car has SD plates ? Did you get those while still in the US or did you set that all up from Mexico ? I don't see many US plated cars here - perhaps a couple a year - but I have never seen one from SD - although I have read others who have done what you did.


Yes, I did it all from Mexico, which is what most folks do. I happened to be driving to visit my brother in San Antonio soon after so I had them ship the plates and registration card there and I picked them up when I went, but many people get them shipped to Mexico and Clay County is experienced with that. I did have to send my Illinois title to them via DHL.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

UrbanMan said:


> I have heard this is true for driving in the Baja Peninsula (no TIP), but your the first person who has ever said this is true elsewhere in MX. Now maybe it is an obscure rule buried deep in the regs that no MX authorities ever care to enforce?
> 
> I am interested to hear other viewpoints.


It only makes sense that it would be that way - why would an insurance company cover a car that is out of registration?

You would find out for sure if you cause an accident and your insurance company has to pay out. They'll dig for every loophole possible and if you give them that one, I'll bet they'll take it. As much as I dislike insurance companies, I never try to get away with anything when taking out insurance, because they will find it later if they are supposed to pay out.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

circle110 said:


> It only makes sense that it would be that way - why would an insurance company cover a car that is out of registration?
> 
> You would find out for sure if you cause an accident and your insurance company has to pay out. They'll dig for every loophole possible and if you give them that one, I'll bet they'll take it. As much as I dislike insurance companies, I never try to get away with anything when taking out insurance, because they will find it later if they are supposed to pay out.


Yes - Mexico is no longer a second rate third world country. The even have computers !

Our state has had vehicle inspections for a long time. But it was very easy to 'pass' even if your car was in terrible condition. (Perhaps the probe was never inserted into the exhaust properly ). The powers that be realized what was going on so they closed the stations for close to a year, installed new computer systems which now send - in real time - the encrypted test data to Mexico City, where the results are analyzed and pass/fail given. Kind of takes the human aspect out of the equation.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

circle110 said:


> It only makes sense that it would be that way - why would an insurance company cover a car that is out of registration?


I've read a lot of blogs, seems some insurance companies do care, some do not. Is an insurance company operating in Mexico beholden to USA State laws? The thinking seems to be .. Insurance companies like to make money. If some of them realize there is a market to offer insurance to vehicles with expired (USA/Canada) plates, some of them are going to do it.

I've read (no exaggeration) over 100 blog posts describing where people with expired plates were pulled over and even were involved in accidents, and the police did not care at all. They reviewed only the TIP documentation (and only sometimes), and verified the validity of insurance in case of an accident. How many Mexican police officers do you think could even look at an English language US state registration document and understand it?



horseshoe846 said:


> Yes - Mexico is no longer a second rate third world country. The even have computers !


Computers are not used in Mexico anywhere near to how they are used in Canada/USA. At least 20 years behind. As most of you have experienced, and I am experiencing, its still lots of pieces of paper, and showing up in person and standing in a line. Given Mexico is a poor country, forward progress will remain slow.

.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

UrbanMan said:


> I've read a lot of blogs, seems some insurance companies do care, some do not. Is an insurance company operating in Mexico beholden to USA State laws? The thinking seems to be .. Insurance companies like to make money. If some of them realize there is a market to offer insurance to vehicles with expired (USA/Canada) plates, some of them are going to do it.
> 
> I've read (no exaggeration) over 100 blog posts describing where people with expired plates were pulled over and even were involved in accidents, and the police did not care at all. They reviewed only the TIP documentation (and only sometimes), and verified the validity of insurance in case of an accident. How many Mexican police officers do you think could even look at an English language US state registration document and understand it?
> 
> ...


[digression]
It is interesting that even when they implement digital systems, they sometimes retain the paper system in parallel. When I applied for a Mexican passport last year (after becoming a citizen), I had to fill out both a paper application and an online application and provide a hard copy photo. The photo was attached to the handwritten application and filed somewhere. They had a camera that took the photo that actually appears on the passport.
[/digression]


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

Hey, man - go for it. Save yourself the $50 a year, leave your car without US registration, and see what does or doesn't happen. For me, paying $50 a year for the peace of mind is worth it; apparently for you it isn't. 

BTW - the police not caring (and they don't) and your insurance company not caring are universes apart. I still say, what happens if you, for example, total someone's Mercedes in an accident here in Mexico and your insurance has to buy that person a brand new Mercedes. If there is some fine print they can use to escape that expenditure, they will.


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## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

Thanks for all the responses. I learned a lot. This all sounds way too dangerous and complicated to me, especially the part about having someone bring you food in jail. I don't want to have to bring anyone with me, and I don't think I'd be comfortable traveling alone. So strange, because I plan to travel all over the U.S. alone and have never once thought that I would be afraid. I'm used to traveling alone, even with a kid and late at night, and never felt afraid, even on back roads. Mexico is another world, for sure. 

I think I'll just fly in from TX and take buses everywhere, or if I can afford it a the time, rent a car there.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

Do the buses for sure, don't rent a car. That's another thing that is different in Mexico.

Since it will be your first visit, do things the easy way and you will enjoy your trip a lot more. Fly in and then use buses for inter-city travel and taxis for intra-city trips. I did that for a almost a decade and wound up falling in love with the country and also learning the ropes a bit before I wound up moving here and bringing a car.


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## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

circle110 said:


> Do the buses for sure, don't rent a car. That's another thing that is different in Mexico.
> 
> Since it will be your first visit, do things the easy way and you will enjoy your trip a lot more. Fly in and then use buses for inter-city travel and taxis for intra-city trips. I did that for a almost a decade and wound up falling in love with the country and also learning the ropes a bit before I wound up moving here and bringing a car.


That sounds like a plan. I don't think I'll ever move down for good, but I will probably visit more than once. I'd like to stay a few months on my first trip, but the problem is, I have to find a place to leave my vehicle. Vehicle storage is expensive here, and most airport lots only allow you to stay for a few weeks, not a few months, and long-term parking is also expensive and unsafe. 

I'm sure I'll work it out.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

DebInFL said:


> I think I'll just fly in from TX and take buses everywhere, or if I can afford it a the time, rent a car there.


I suggest "executive buses" - or (radio) taxis (when you can) - the kind that you call have have them come for you (depending on where you are - alone that is).


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## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

horseshoe846 said:


> I suggest "executive buses" - or (radio) taxis (when you can) - the kind that you call have have them come for you (depending on where you are - alone that is).


Thanks. I guess those are safer? Are they expensive (I know, nothing is expensive in MX, right?). I'll need to plan for expenses, since I'll also be paying to have somewhere to park my vehicle in the states, although that may be offset by not having to pay TIP and MX insurance.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

circle110 said:


> Hey, man - go for it. Save yourself the $50 a year, leave your car without US registration, and see what does or doesn't happen. For me, paying $50 a year for the peace of mind is worth it; apparently for you it isn't.


I've read about the SD License plates deal on other sites. It sounds like such a scam, possibly something that will eventually attract government attention ... all these people pretending they are in SD, but are not ... like the IRS possibly? The IRS might think, if they are lying about their car, what else are they lying about?

Note, I'm not a cheat, but I still don't want the attention. So for me, its not the $50.

Note, my car will have valid USA registration for several months after my planned MX arrival date. So at least to begin with, I'll be 100% fine, and I'll have some time to investigate in person.

I appreciate the thoughts, circle110. Hearing varying points of view is something I value.


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## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

UrbanMan said:


> I've read about the SD License plates deal on other sites. It sounds like such a scam, possibly something that will eventually attract government attention ... all these people pretending they are in SD, but are not ... like the IRS possibly? The IRS might think, if they are lying about their car, what else are they lying about?
> 
> Note, I'm not a cheat, but I still don't want the attention. So for me, its not the $50.
> 
> ...


SD caters to the nomad crowd by allowing people to set up permanent residence there very easily. There are services that will do this. Once you have permanent residency, you buy your plates from SD. Simple as that. FL is another state where you can do this. I live in FL now, and will register my vehicle here, then use a drop box to get a permanent address to keep my residency. If FL catches me, I'll do it in SD, but no one I know has had a problem yet. FL & SD are preferable due to no inspections and no state income tax.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

DebInFL said:


> Thanks. I guess those are safer? Are they expensive (I know, nothing is expensive in MX, right?). I'll need to plan for expenses, since I'll also be paying to have somewhere to park my vehicle in the states, although that may be offset by not having to pay TIP and MX insurance.


The luxury buses are more expensive, but they are really comfortable. The difference between the regular first class buses and the luxury buses is around 10-15%. Both are pretty comfortable. Buses in the US would be second class buses in Mexico and only used for short trips. All of the intercity buses in Mexico are more spacious and comfortable than any bus in the US. Well, maybe the commuter buses running in Silicon Valley compare, but the regular inter-city buses in the US are miserable and way worse than Mexico.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

Since you are planning to take buses , here are some tips:

The long buses usually travel at night so you do not see a whole lot and the discount airlines can be the same price and sometimes cheaper that the buses if you plan ahead of time.
Some bus lines will also give you a discount sometimes if you do not buy at the last minute..
The beauty of the buses are their flexibility, you get to the station check out the various companies and pick the ones that fit what you want, no need to reserve..they also take you to a part of town where it is easy to grab a cab or combi or a bus, airports are often a ways from town and do not always have cheap transporation to town.

I think that if you chose public transportation you will learn the ropes and will feel more comfortable for the day you want to drive. It is not that dangerous once you know people who can help you but the first time you may want to try the public transports.

The discount airlines are vivaaerobus, Interjet and Volaris.. they are others but those are the main ones.. Be aware that the prices are sometimes quoted without taxes and all the extras so you can usually double those prices to arrive at what you will pay.. it is the case of Vivaaerobus, Volaris us a little closer to what you will pay , You ca buy tickets for vivaaerobus on the internet and pay at OXXO if your foreign card is not accepted. Once you reserve you have 24 hours to pay for your ticket at OXXO the equivalent of 7/11

In some areas the vans and taxis are called combis and other names and you share the ride, they leave when the car has 4 passenger and around 10 or 13 people in the vans. The vans with timeschedule are usually a little more but not always.


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## circle110 (Jul 20, 2009)

UrbanMan said:


> I appreciate the thoughts, circle110. Hearing varying points of view is something I value.


Thanks UrbanMan. I'm glad we can discuss and somewhat disagree and keep it very civil. Sometimes that just doesn't happen on forums (including this one occasionally) and I appreciate it when it does happen. A lot of times that is when the best information gets exchanged. Best of luck to you on you upcoming move!

By the way, the South Dakota registration thing is completely legal, it isn't a scam of any kind. All government agencies are fully aware of it and as long as it stays on the books in SD law, all those who take advantage of it are on the AOK side of the law.

It's a moot point for me now since I sold my US car back in TX a couple months ago and am buying a Mexican vehicle next week, but the SD thing is fully legitimate.


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## UrbanMan (Jun 18, 2015)

DebInFL said:


> Thanks. I guess those are safer? Are they expensive (I know, nothing is expensive in MX, right?). I'll need to plan for expenses, since I'll also be paying to have somewhere to park my vehicle in the states, although that may be offset by not having to pay TIP and MX insurance.


Re: bus travel, you might want to check these out. They could be a little dated [note1], so you may not want to rely too heavily on any exact details listed, but I agree with the descriptions, they match what I have experienced in my past travels. 

One thing not mentioned in the links is that Mexican people are not known to be quiet - if you have a wish to take a nap or sleep, or just don't like ongoing noise, earplugs or at least ipod earbuds to block noise, is something I would advise.

[note1] But there are links within the mexperience links, and they will take you to websites that are current.

https://www.mexperience.com/lifestyle/transport/bus-travel-in-mexico/

https://www.mexperience.com/executive-class-bus-travel/


.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

DebInFL said:


> Thanks. I guess those are safer? Are they expensive (I know, nothing is expensive in MX, right?). I'll need to plan for expenses, since I'll also be paying to have somewhere to park my vehicle in the states, although that may be offset by not having to pay TIP and MX insurance.


We live perhaps 1-1.5 hours from Mexico City. With our INAPAM discount (senior discount 50%) the executive bus costs us $3.50 USD each one way. As a tourist you would not be able to get an INAPAM card unfortunately. 

The only other comment on buses I'll make is that the seating can be a little tight. They certainly were not planning for someone 6'2". And with my luck - the person in front of me sits down and reclines their seat as far as it will go. If I were a dentist I could work on their teeth... When possible we try to get the front seats on the bus.


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## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

Oh my! Bus riding sounds like an adventure! I think I would survive it, though. I think by the time I get back home, I will be well acquainted with the bus lines. I just want to do short stays, maybe 2-3 days at a time. I'd like to see a little bit more of Mexico than just Guadalajara, although I'm sure it's a great place to start.


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

horseshoe846 said:


> We live perhaps 1-1.5 hours from Mexico City. With our INAPAM discount (senior discount 50%) the executive bus costs us $3.50 USD each one way. As a tourist you would not be able to get an INAPAM card unfortunately.
> 
> The only other comment on buses I'll make is that the seating can be a little tight. They certainly were not planning for someone 6'2". And with my luck - the person in front of me sits down and reclines their seat as far as it will go. If I were a dentist I could work on their teeth... When possible we try to get the front seats on the bus.


I've never had leg room problems on Mexican inter-city buses, but then I'm only 5'1" (and slowly shrinking). In fact, one of the nice things about buses in this country is that I have lots of room to stretch out and wriggle around in my seat while trying to get into a comfortable position to take a siesta.


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## horseshoe846 (Feb 8, 2017)

Isla Verde said:


> I've never had leg room problems on Mexican inter-city buses, but then I'm only 5'1" (and slowly shrinking). In fact, one of the nice things about buses in this country is that I have lots of room to stretch out and wriggle around in my seat while trying to get into a comfortable position to take a siesta.


Yes and you probably enjoy flying as well 

You just reminded me of a business flight I had coming home to Miami from Detroit - and this was back in the day when flying could be fun. The flight was packed and I got stuck in the middle seat and the short, slight guy in the aisle seat sat there with his feet dangling above the floor. Several times during that flight he actually said to me "Gosh you don't look comfortable at all" - with a big smile on his face. (Obviously it made a lasting impression).

Have you seen this ?
https://www.yahoo.com/news/colombian-airline-wants-passengers-stand-095900457.html


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## Isla Verde (Oct 19, 2011)

horseshoe846 said:


> Yes and you probably enjoy flying as well


Not as much as I used to, especially when the person in front of me pushes his seat back into my space. I have room for my legs, but just barely.


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## citlali (Mar 4, 2013)

you do not get INAPAM or INSEN discounts if you are a tourist..


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## DebInFL (Dec 1, 2016)

Since I have my answers, I'm unsubscribing from this thread. Thanks for all your help!


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## sunnyvmx (Mar 14, 2010)

As previously stated, the buses in Mexico were luxury compared to Greyhound in the States. Here are a few tips I learned along the way. 

Seats may be arranged two on one side and one on the other. On one leg of the trip, my seat companion was very talkative and it was a struggle to converse in my limited Spanish. I didn't see much of the countryside and I arrived worn out with a headache. 

When arriving at my destination, I would immediately go to the ticket counter and purchase my next ticket. This insured that I got the time and seat I desired for travel to the next city. I planned one day to arrive and two days visit then leave again.

Travel light, hostels have laundry facilities. Take music and ear buds as the buses play a movie in Spanish and keep a light jacket handy as they can be sometimes very chilly.

On travel day, I kept my fluid intake low with only sips of water. Using the bathroom in the rear of a moving bus isn't as easy as it is in an airplane. If you do leave the bus during the trip for snacks or a bathroom, make it quick as it will leave without you. Better yet, stay on the bus.

Don't expect your bus to be announced in English. Go out to the loading platform and show your ticket to someone who looks official and they will tell you where your bus will be and then get comfortable and watch the time. I always traveled during the day and loved it.


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## TundraGreen (Jul 15, 2010)

sunnyvmx said:


> As previously stated, the buses in Mexico were luxury compared to Greyhound in the States. Here are a few tips I learned along the way.
> 
> Seats may be arranged two on one side and one on the other. On one leg of the trip, my seat companion was very talkative and it was a struggle to converse in my limited Spanish. I didn't see much of the countryside and I arrived worn out with a headache.
> 
> ...


All really good advice. I would only add a few things:

On long trips you will want to get off the bus to use the bathroom, maybe buy some food, or just stretch. When you do, make a note of the bus number, they all look alike and it is easy to lose track of which bus you were on. Also take note of who the other passengers are since it can make it easier to find the right bus and know which bus is yours.

When you get off, make a point of asking the driver how long the stop is. He will announce it but sometimes it is hard to hear, and also speaking to the driver will make him aware that you got off, and maybe he will notice if you have not come back. Mostly, foreigners are rare on the buses, so people will remember you and notice if you are not on when it starts to leave.

There are a lot of double decker buses now. If you sit in the first row on the top deck, you have an amazing panoramic view of the scenery ahead and on both sides.

The bus stations or stops often have a small restaurant where they make real (Mexican) food that is freshly made. It is not all the chain fast food places. During the stops, people will come on the bus selling food as well.


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